REVIEW: Love Story

The finale of Ryan Murphy's cult historical fiction 'Love Story' was divisive and jam packed from the explosive scenes between Caroline & Ann Bessette to that plane scene! In this episode, we unpack the finale plus my thoughts on the series as a whole, while looking at the ethics of fictionalised historical dramas like 'Love Story' to try and answer the question on everyone's lips: how long after someone's dead is it okay to profit from the tragedy? If you're wanting more Hot History content you can follow along on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.instagram.com/hothistoryclub/?hl=en, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TikTok⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.tiktok.com/@hot.history?lang=en and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.youtube.com/@hot.history and of course, right here! Ainslie x

• 0:15Speaker 00

  Hi guys and welcome back to Hot History, the podcast covering all the things in history that you probably should know but don't. I'm Ainslie Harvey, your hot historian, and I am so keen, guys, to finally chat to you all about Love Story, Ryan Murphy's brand new TV series covering the relationship between JFK Junior and Carolyn Basette Kennedy. Now, guys, unless you've been living under a rock, which is okay, this is the pod for things you probably should know but don't, there has been a lot of chat about this show. There's been op-eds, there's been sit-down interviews, a huge resurgence in archive footage, and outcries from both the Basette and Kennedy camps. So I wanted to break it

• 0:57Speaker 00

  down for you guys and share my personal thoughts now that the whole season is out. Firstly, though, I do want to preface, this will obviously include spoilers, so keep that in mind before continuing if you haven't finished or started this series. So, guys, I'm here in my jammies, it's a lovely Sunday morning, I'm in full glam, but we'll move past that. Change of setting to my living room, this is exactly where I watch Love Story, so I thought, let's start right here with my ranking, guys. I am going to give the show three and a half stars. And my overarching thought here is that the first three episodes carry a lot of that, as does the soundtrack visuals and styling.

• 1:39Speaker 00

  It is undeniably beautiful to watch and listen to. It genuinely makes the 90s feel like a golden age, you know, the Belle epoch for chain smokers and people in print magazines. More than that, though, I thought it was an outstanding performance by Sarah Pigeon, who plays Carolyn, but it is riddled with historical inaccuracies, which, like, whatever, you know, I'm, I'm never going to be the person who sits on my house and be like, that's not correct. But I think that where you can take liberties with timelines and headlines... There were things that, you know, for me, were just like really inaccurate with character, in particular Carolyn, towards the end, which really bothered me. And we'll break that all down. Now JFK Junior, played by Paul Anthony Kelly, did lack a lot of John's real character and depth.

• 2:23Speaker 00

  And I think that was actually deliberate by Ryan Murphy and the team. Because I feel, for me anyway, Carolyn is the main character in this series. But the impact of the inaccuracies on him are nowhere near as damaging as I believe they are for Carolyn. In fact, they really do just continue to flame a lot of the Camelot mythology that is granted to the Kennedy men. Anyway, again, guys, I want to preface, this is all just my own opinion. If you guys loved it, love that for you. I'm never going to yuck your yum. These are just my thoughts. All in all, my top line feelings around Love Story was I really wanted to love it. And I came so close so many times in those early few episodes. But I couldn't quite get there because I was like waiting constantly for the inevitable tragedy of the end.

• 3:08Speaker 00

  It's like any historical drama already telling guys, like I know what's going to happen. So you're just constantly waiting for that other shoe to drop. And the further the series went on, in my opinion, the worse that feeling got. Like the pit in my stomach just kept opening up. Episodes one to three, guys, I was there. I binged them back to back on my phone till 2am. That's how into it I was. But after that, it did kind of lose me. And that's largely because all I really cared about, and I will admit this bias, was Carolyn. And I did think her treatment throughout the back half of the series was not only inaccurate, but like it actually played into a lot of the misogyny which plagued her in the media at the time. So let's start there, guys. We're going to break it down.

• 3:50Speaker 00

  In particular, I want to focus on the very first opening shot where Carolyn's getting her nails done. So the pap throughout the front, guys, she's got a straight blonde hair. She's getting red nail polish before interrupting and saying like, no, I need to change it. You know, kind of it won't go down well where I'm going. Obviously, I'm paraphrasing here. We then see her get in the car and arrive at the airport where John Junior says, "You're late, the flight instructor couldn't make it. If, you know, we're gonna miss the welcome drinks." Then John, Carolyn and her sister Lauren all fly off. The plane is going up into the air, like screen rewinding to, I think it was like seven years ago or whatever it said. Now, again, we don't see the crash in that episode and don't you worry, guys. We will get to it later on. So much contention. Go to my comment section to see more.

• 4:35Speaker 00

  But we all know it did come after this. And for me, this being the opening shot, the way it's filmed, the way it's written, really pissed me off because it largely gives credence to a very spacious claim within both the media and the Kennedy family at the time, which Carolyn's mum addresses in the finale episode and we'll get to that. That John would never have crashed the plane if his shallow, superficial, vain, glorious wife didn't change her nail color. Now again, Ryan Murthy did call this out and rather venomously in that scene between Caroline and Anne the Set at the end. So he gained some ground there for sure. But for me, having the opening scene of this series be that shot and really feeding into this narrative and then

• 5:19Speaker 00

  having almost six weeks until it was called out in the finale felt wild. And I am not the only one who thought this, guys. Maureen Callahan, host of The Nerve with Maureen Callahan, said, "This is so misogynistic and it is straight out of the Kennedy male playbook, which is blame the women. And if you can't make them mentally ill, and if you can't make them crazy, and if you can't kill them, you know, just make up something." This show does a good enough job at calling out that specific claim. Like I said, that scene where Anne, but Anne the Set says it is venomous. And what it doesn't do, on the flip side of that, is really bring attention to the fact it was unfortunately John's fault.

• 6:01Speaker 00

  You know, it's a terrible, terrible tragedy and I really do not think that assigning blame to anyone helps. But Jeff Gazetti, a National Transport Safety Bureau investigator, told friends and his assistant that John was not ready for flight that evening. Because he didn't have the right qualifications to navigate at night, he was only certified to fly under visual flight rules. There was even an instructor on hand who could fly them that evening and John refused. Even one of his friends, guys, a man by the name of Steve Gillan, described John's actions as reckless, stating, "There's no such thing as a Kennedy curse, they simply take risks that most other people would not take." He was reckless, he had been reckless his whole life.

• 6:42Speaker 00

  Again, even at the time of the crash, John had just gotten a, um, a cast off, so he was wearing like a brace on his left ankle due to a paragliding accident at the time. So this isn't really a man who takes caution and plays it safe. Now, again, I want to reiterate, this is obviously a tragedy. But for the media and for this opening shot of Love Story itself to make the implication of Carolyn, because she's so frivolous for fussing over her nails while glazing over John, was just disappointing for me. And I don't know if this show was maybe all meant to come out at once, so you didn't have such a big break between that opening and then being called out by Amber Sett. And I think if it had dropped in full and you could have like binged it and watched

• 7:27Speaker 00

  it, I probably would feel differently about it. But for me, it just felt a little misogynistic and really plays into the media and the Kennedy narrative around Carolyn at the time of the crash. But guys, by the end of episode one, I was leaning back in because of how beautifully Carolyn was portrayed. Like the first three episodes dropped, I said, I binged them all. I was so excited because the Carolyn that we know today, her media legacy, right? Is a product of the headlines and tabloids and made up bullshit, stalking of paparazzi at the time, who portrayed her as cold and frivolous and like a bit of a social climber.

• 8:10Speaker 00

  Really someone who cared too much about was on her head rather than in it. And that could not be further from the truth. So what is the truth, guys? Well, I want to read, you guys, some of the descriptions by Carolyn's actual friends and colleagues who knew her. Because I think they sum her up beautifully. And I did really see this in the early few episodes. I was ecstatic. So, "In school, her classmates voted her the ultimate beautiful person." Paul Wilmot, head of PR at Calvin Klein, said, "She had this wonderful diplomatic warm way with people." Describing her as deeply maternal. Calvin Klein's president at the time that Carolyn worked there, Susan S. Cole, said, "Carolyn fit the bill perfectly. She was absolutely charming. She was totally refreshing.

• 8:55Speaker 00

  She was completely outgoing." George Carr, brother of Calvin Klein's creative director, said, "This is one of my favorite quotes about her." "She entered the fashion world like Venus coming out of the ocean. Calvin saw it immediately. Everyone was obsessed with her." Now, cultural critic Camille Pablier has my favorite, favorite way to describe Carolyn. And she said that she looked like a romping lioness with her free spirit and sense of fun filling the room. So, guys, everyone who knew Carolyn said she also had this amazing sense of humor and energy that filled every room. You know, this innate ability to make those around her feel at ease. And it's that which made her the cool it girl.

• 9:37Speaker 00

  Not the Prada coats, or the headbands, or the bang up Hermes bags. Her innate aura. And I thought Sarah Pigeon and Ryan Murphy's writing really nailed this. Sarah played Carolyn as carefree but still hardworking. Intimately personal but still discreet. Stylish but in basic layers. Put together but her hair all over the place. And she's funny, but she is still incredibly smart. And that was Carolyn Berset Kennedy in real life.

• 10:10Speaker 00

  Vogue 2 felt that Sarah pulled CBK off to a T saying, "When she didn't give him her number, I wanted to throw tomatoes at my TV screen. I experienced the same indignation soon after when he asked to see her again after their first date and she simply said, 'Goodnight.' Then, to my fury, she pulled it off once more when he leaned his face towards hers after a late night walk and she simply just smiled and walked away." I fucking love that, guys. And it's so true. I find myself, when I was watching this, thinking the exact same thing. Like, I could never be that cool and mysterious and like, nonchalant,

• 10:47Speaker 00

  that like, alluring it girl. But that was Carolyn. And with a media legacy that is so centered around either John, like, as a man, and what clothes she wore, it was so refreshing to see a genuine, certified 4D woman who knows what she wants, has fun, is stupidly loyal, and, as Camille Paliya described, "looks and acts like a romping lioness." In fact, one of the scenes which really stood out to me, and I saw a lot of commentary online about this as well, was when Carolyn goes to meet John's friends and he says, "No, stay for dinner." And she says, "No, no, you told me it was drinks, so I made other plans." And they try to get her to stay, she says no, she gets up without fuss or second thought and shows up for those other plans.

• 11:32Speaker 00

  I saw so many comparisons and it is so true. To this scene and Carrie Bradshaw, who constantly blew off her friends to hang out with big. Carolyn could not have been more different, guys. She was loyal and loved with a group of friends from many different creative fields, not just fashion, all the Kennedy's social circles. So I really loved these opening episodes and I felt like if I were her friend or family member, you know, putting, putting like, their point of view, I would have watched those episodes and felt maybe vindicated, like my friend had finally been seen. And I imagine that that would be deeply cathartic for a woman whose legacy is reduced today largely to her hair and clothing and husband.

• 12:15Speaker 00

  Both of which, guys, the hair and the clothing, Elise, we still, of course, have to address. Now, this show is fucking gorgeous. Nothing will change that. The hair, incredible, genuinely gorgeous. The makeup, stunning. The clothes, breathtaking. And I felt really energized by the accuracy of it, guys. I know there were those initial screen test images which faced so much backlash and like, I'm so glad they make those changes. Sometimes the internet is right, you know? And I really appreciated as well that the wardrobe team in particular took great pains to source pieces that Carolyn actually wore herself or owned.

• 12:58Speaker 00

  And if they couldn't find the exact object she'd worn, they tried to find the same one from like, collection. I know the Battery Park scene, for example, where she's wearing that Nike windbreaker. Um, the wardrobe department searched for hours before tracking it down on eBay in Asia somewhere. So I really appreciated those details. And again, when we talk about it being beautiful to watch and feeling very nostalgic, a large part of that world building is being as authentic as possible. And I thought they did an incredible job here. Also, the soundtrack, guys, elite. And actually, hot tip, the playlist is on Spotify. So if you guys want to continue to immerse yourself in 90s New York, then you can go right ahead.

• 13:44Speaker 00

  Now, where it all started to go downhill for me was after the wedding episode, guys, where Carolyn is getting swarmed by the Paps after her meeting with Ralph Lauren. I think it's episode seven. So from my point of view, again, guys, this is my opinion. You don't have to hold the same opinion. It's all good. I felt Ryan Murphy was really using Carolyn for a very specific reason, which was to demonstrate the impact of these institutions on the women within them. Whether it's Carolyn within the Kennedy machine, Diana within the royal family, and more recently, of course, Meghan Markle. This, of course, absolutely true and totally valid for him to want to explore this, and he did it really well. And I found myself

• 14:27Speaker 00

  constantly going, oh, my God, Diana, oh, my God, Meghan, when watching Carolyn struggle. Like, there's even coverage of Diana's death in episode eight and Carolyn having this realisation what could happen to her with the Paps. Like, chilling, given her death was literally an episode later. Others, of course, were more subtle and really reminded me of that interview with Meghan. Um, I think it's in South Africa and she was asked if she was okay and she said, "Not really. Thank you for asking, though. No one's really asked." So, again, Ryan did a really great job at making this point. But I just thought it was the way that he did it through Carolyn that was a bit troubling. And it started once she was married, as soon as she becomes CBK. Because at that point, she is no longer that romping lioness, but this like,

• 15:11Speaker 00

  soulless, drawn out, giving it all up, sit around the house, chain smoking cigarettes kind of person. And that's just not true. Of course, Carolyn did struggle in real life significantly as well. But she certainly didn't lie around all day feeling sorry for herself. From accounts from all of her friends and family, she helped run George, she joined charities, she was further involved in the fashion world, she was seen at galas and events, and was actually learning all about the documentary filmmaking process, hoping to spotlight underserved communities. So while I appreciate the show's desire to look at the impact of the women who come into these dynasties and, you know, established kind of media machines,

• 15:54Speaker 00

  I felt it did so at the expense of Carolyn's actual character. And audiences are smart enough to put two and two together and draw those parallels without needing to reduce her to this like, chain smoking, housebound former shell of herself. What I will say, however, is I think a large part of that, and he kind of does two things through Carolyn's struggle, and he does a great job of this and it is really important, is he looks at modern day marriages from a woman's perspective. That wedding episode where her mum says, "I see you making your life smaller," hits so close to home.

• 16:33Speaker 00

  And time and time again, I found myself screaming at my TV going, "But what's he given up?" And Carolyn is actually asked that by her mum and she says, "Oh, this whole wedding." But that's one day. And so often, even still today in modern marriages, men are congratulated and pedestalled for compromising on this one tiny, relatively insignificant thing. Because the idea of men compromising in relationships is brand spanking new anyway. In the finale, Caroline actually calls this out to John, saying, "What she's asking of you feels unreasonable because no one's ever asked it of you before." And I do think Ryan did a really good job of demonstrating this dynamic,

• 17:18Speaker 00

  especially in episode eight, the one that's like set all in the loft after the dinner party, and is J F P Junior basically running away like a coward? Because it's too much for him to see how his decisions have impacted his wife's life. The part where he says, "I set aside two days a week to have lunch with you", and Caroline turns around and goes, "That's not the same as wanting to spend time with me. That lunch is a checkbox." Chef's kiss. Ryan Murphy, that writing? Like fabulous, spot on. Honestly, I finished watching that episode, actually. And I literally felt like saying, "I hate John John Kennedy", and that is exactly what he wanted us to feel. And I know there's a lot of commentary about Paul Anthony Kelly's performance, his first acting job,

• 18:01Speaker 00

  but I thought he played that cowardly dickhead John John to a T in that episode. He was insufferable, whether he meant to be or not. So again, I loved the initial portrayal of Caroline and was so glad she had some depth, but I felt he did stretch reality in those later episodes to make a point, which while incredibly important, I felt did compromise her character. So those were my overarching personal highs and lows, both of which Caroline-centric. So let's talk about some of the specific scenes and moments throughout the show, based on the notes that I was jotting down when I was watching. I've got them written up in front of me. So firstly, I said, "CBK's hair, fucking perfection", obvi, we already spoke about that, like it was such

• 18:45Speaker 00

  a highlight again when we talk about her like leaning into that romping line as, I felt it fully. Next, I said, "What's this guy's job? He's literally just going to events and playing football."

• 18:57Speaker 00

  Yeah, pretty much. Speaking of football, guys, that scene where that terrible anonymous note gets slipped into John's bag, obviously put in there by his cousin Anthony, guys. He's sitting next to it. He says, oh no, I'll set this one out, which is like the only time John's bag was unattended. And when I was watching this at first, I'm sitting there, I'm going Judas. It's giving Nellie from Wuthering Heights like troublemaker. But Carolyn and Anthony are so close in the final few episodes and he's always saying, like, you're such a good sport, da, da, da, da. Did he put that note in to protect her from like the Kennedy machine? Not John. Food for thought, people. Next, I said, holy

• 19:39Speaker 00

  shit, Jackie Kennedy's apartment was insane, followed by, how much are these people worth? Now, I will post some pics on socials for you guys, but Jackie's actual apartment looked exactly like it did in the show. It was insanely gorgeous. It's this like French-American blend, which is very Bouvier Kennedy in and of itself. It's all very meta. And to answer my own question, the Kennedy wealth was primarily held in trusts and managed by Park Agency Inc. in New York, estimated at over fifty million dollars after Jackie's death. This is all in US dollars, obviously, which John managed to double to around a hundred million by the time of his own death. Although Forbes Magazine estimated the total Kennedy family

• 20:21Speaker 00

  wealth, like including all other members and properties, came in at around eight hundred and fifty million, but like, who knows if that's true. So I guess that is also probably why John was going to parties and playing football so much. He could. Now, the next few points are all about those weird Kennedy dining traditions, guys. When John brings Carolyn to Caroline's birthday dinner without telling her, daggers. And then Carolyn gets seated at the other end of the table away from him, which happens again when they go to the Kennedy compound. And there's that god awful scene where Carolyn's got that like gorgeous cashmere shawl scarf thing on and Ethel tells her to take it off and

• 21:05Speaker 00

  then starts chatting politics at the table. Fucking nightmare fuel, guys. I don't care how good your hairline is. Nothing would make me endure that evening. And then, the following day, breakfast gate, when John doesn't sign her up for breakfast.

• 21:26Speaker 00

  Guys, I was mad I knew they ended up together because I was screaming at my shit, my screen going babe, dump that guy. I believe my exact note here was Ethel and that breakfast scene gave me hives. And I stand by that. I get that that's how like posh people do it, but not for me, honey. The other scene I wanted to call out, which made me quite emotional, was when Carolyn quit Calvin Clayton. And he pulled out that photo album with the old Paul Lorette in it and like put it on in the drawer next to the wedding dress he designed for her. That was so sad, guys. And Calvin was kind of a dick on purpose, obviously, in the early episodes, but I felt sad for him here.

• 22:05Speaker 00

  And it did feel like he and us as the audience was like saying goodbye to Carolyn Berset, who was now about to be CBK, which again, so sad. And I spoke a little bit about the idea of the like what ifs and lost potential with the Kennedys in Friday's episode. But this really felt like one of them for me. Like, what if she'd never met John? You know, what would Carolyn Berset have gone on to do? Which brings us up to the wedding episode. There's so many scenes I could call out here, but these were just the couple that I kind of had like jotted down through watching. The wedding episode, we find the elephant in the room. She was two hours late because of a fucking zipper.

• 22:47Speaker 00

  I refuse to believe that CBK, fashion guru of the nineties, had not heard of the shirt over the head trick. So when I'm looking if this was actually true, it was, she was two hours late, but not because she didn't want to ruin her hair and makeup. Because the dress wasn't right, like didn't have enough fittings. So there was these last minute alterations that had to be done. And to be honest, now that I say it out loud, I think probably the like, you know, her not wanting to mess up her hair and being late because of that is just this kind of narrative of selfish frivolous Carolyn. Yuck, not true, guys. It was because the dress needed further work done to it.

• 23:23Speaker 00

  Similar train of thought here. I actually laughed when this came up. But the scene with Anthony and Carolyn after the wedding where he says, did my mum really send you hair clips? And she said, yes. Absolute tea, guys. So Lee Radswell was Jackie's younger sister, again Anthony's mum. And she was pissed she didn't get an invite to the wedding and thought Carolyn's hair was messy. So she sent her headbands and hair clips as a wedding present. So like, it's like the classiest, most petty thing that you can do. And Lee and Carolyn actually ended up having quite a sweet relationship in real life, which is nice for Carolyn, who never got to meet Jackie. Plus, they're both iconic queens and Carolyn had a great sense of humour, so I'm sure she would have found this to be really funny. So, episode seven, after the wedding, guys.

• 24:09Speaker 00

  This was all about the Paps and I had so many thoughts here. Again, the Diana comparisons and all that, but mainly Paps are scum. No wonder Chapel Rowan is always so mad at them. Again, the overarching thing here was the Diana and Carolyn comparisons, both of which being the people's princess, Diana marrying the Prince of Wales, Carolyn marrying America's prince. Um, and that scene where she's in the car and the Paps are swarming the car and like they couldn't move.

• 24:36Speaker 00

  Sickening. The photos from that actual incident are also chilling, like it's wild. Now, we already spoke about episode eight at the top, but I did want to add, I thought it was beautifully shot and, you know, give Sarah Pigeon that Emmy right now for that episode alone. Which brings us to the finale. Guys, I felt so sick watching it. Genuinely, with every single second that passed, like I felt my heart was gonna pop at such anxiety. Now, as I said, spoilers here. If you haven't watched the final episode, then please don't listen. But the plane scene, I actually felt like I was gonna vomit. Like, I could not believe they showed a second inside that cockpit.

• 25:17Speaker 00

  Genuinely, what I thought would happen, I thought they'd go back to the way the show opened, which they did, and then end it with the plane flying up, would go to black, a phone would be ringing, someone would flick a light on and, you know, it would be Caroline or Endersept. The second it went to Carolyn and Lauren reading in the back of the plane at sunset, my jaw was on the floor. Like, I cannot believe they filmed inside that plane. I just kept on saying to myself, there's no way, there's no way this is happening. I cannot imagine genuinely being a family member of John or Carolyn or Lauren or a friend and watching that.

• 25:58Speaker 00

  Like recreating someone's death, which we actually have no idea what went on inside that cabin, felt wild to me. I mean, guys, Caroline Kennedy is still alive, for God's sakes. Thank God Anne Berset is not. And I think about how much therapy and pain Caroline has been through, like all of these losses in her life and what she believed happened inside that cockpit with the available evidence and reconciling that for herself, for Ryan Murphy to turn around and put this version out into the world forever, must be so painful. Like this intimate, innate, last few moments of people's lives. And sure, guys, yes, he didn't show the death itself, but that doesn't mean it's not grotesque.

• 26:40Speaker 00

  But not all of you thought that, which again, guys, totally fine. We can all interpret things differently. It's fine. I posted my reaction to socials and there was some heated chat in the comments, which I love. I like to see different people's kind of point of view. I would say 80% of people agreed it was insensitive and unnecessary, but the other 20% liked it, calling out the fact it did happen, you know, it is fact, it's not as if Ryan made up the plane crash, which is true. And then the others saying, you know, you're too sensitive, grow up, blah, blah, blah. Now, I will be the first to say, I have spent the last two weeks ingrained in research about these two people and their families, and there is an element of parasocialism that happens as a result of that.

• 27:23Speaker 00

  And maybe if I watched it in like six months, I might feel differently, but I don't think it's an oversensitivity or a thing to grow up over if you have empathy for the families of these three people who now have this like fictionalized scene of their loved one's death to contend with. But still, that in and of itself, guys, is sticky and I'll play the devil's advocate for myself here. I imagine some of the fictionalized scenes in this can be super cathartic to those who knew John, Carolyn and Lauren as well. I said at the top, those first three episodes which give Carolyn such depth and character beyond her coats and headbands must feel justifying for those who knew her.

• 28:05Speaker 00

  Which I think really gets to the heart of Love Story, right? The big question around the ethics of making dramatized historical retellings. So let's unpack it. JFK Junior's nephew, Jack Schlossberg, was particularly vocal about just how disturbing the series was. He absolutely rinsed Ryan Murphy for profiting off of the late couple's death in a way he described as grotesque. Murphy then responded to this backlash, it's so bad, from the Kennedy clan, um, who Jack said were never consulted about this project to begin with, they didn't even know what was happening till the press knew, saying, "I thought it was an odd choice to be mad about your relatives that you don't remember."

• 28:51Speaker 00

  Excuse me?

• 28:53Speaker 00

  Are you joking? Ryan Murphy didn't even know these people, and then he's gone and made a show which includes the fictionalized final moments of their lives, which not even the people who knew them most intimately know what really happened, and he has the audacity to say that to Jack Schlossberg?

• 29:10Speaker 00

  Like astounding. Anyway, guys, whether you agree with me or not on that plane crash scene itself, Love Story, and my comment section certainly, brings up that big question, which is how long after someone's death is it okay to profit from it? Now, we find this question come up a lot as well in archaeological ethics. When can you dig up someone's remains, or belongings, and study them, or put them on display, or profit for them in any kind of way? Is it when the last family member who met that person has died? Is it okay if there are family members who are still alive, just not their own children? Should siblings or parents be included in that too? Or should there be a standard time that has to pass, like when content, you know,

• 29:56Speaker 00

  then enters and belongs to the public domain? It's a muddy, murky place, guys, which only gets stickier with the passing of time, because the history we cover is our own. The Michael Jackson movie coming out this year, for example, has had so much backlash from Michael's children, even though it stars his nephew. And you have the ever-circling Tales of a Britney Spears biopic in the air, and then, of course, the last season of The Crown, which featured a teenage Kate Middleton. Creating these historical dramas is sticky. And while Love Story definitely had one of the better disclaimers I've seen, and really appreciated that, the truth is, we don't know what really happened in these people's lives.

• 30:40Speaker 00

  And we don't know the dynamic of their relationship behind closed doors. And we don't know the intimate moments of their deaths. Which is the problem with making shows like this. It isn't reality TV, it isn't fictionalized drama, it's a retelling from one guy's point of view, which is a historical and ethical dilemma. Because it is entertaining, guys. And it does become a part of the culture, and it can do good, and it can do bad, and it brings up so much for the families involved and the media circus that surrounds it. I literally just saw a Daily Mail article about whether Carolyn was a drug addict, and she's been dead for over 25 years.

• 31:24Speaker 00

  Even the cast of Love Story got questioned about Jack's outrage, with Sarah Pigeon saying she hopes the Kennedy family will watch so they feel that we led with respect and honour for John and Carolyn. But I doubt that's how they will feel, as Jack also called out how inaccurate the series genuinely is, saying, "I just want people who do watch the show to watch it with one letter in mind, and that's a capital F for fiction." Jack wasn't the only one upset about the inaccuracies. Daryl Hannah, John's prior on-again, off-again partner, also rinsed Ryan and the show for her depiction, saying, "The actions and behaviours attributed to me are untrue. It's appalling to me that I even have to defend myself against a television show. These are not creative embellishments of personality, they are assertions about conduct,

• 32:09Speaker 00

  and they are false." Again, like, it's just such a slippery slope here, guys, because Love Story isn't documentary. It wasn't marketed at that, it doesn't try to be that, it says at the beginning of every episode. And if it were a documentary, I doubt it would have gotten the traction it did, which meant all those people wouldn't be interested, and perhaps seek to know more of the real history behind the couple. Like it's just such a double edged sword. And I'm keen to hear your thoughts. Do we think fictionalized historical retellings like Love Story are net positive or net negative? And what are the ethics around making these shows? Let me know. But let's call out a couple of other key moments in the finale, guys. It was jam packed.

• 32:53Speaker 00

  I really want to talk about Caroline and Anne Bessette in particular. Watching this, I cried like a baby. I felt so sorry for both of these women. For Caroline to have lost her father, mother, brother, uncle, two young siblings, her sister in law, and eventually as well, her daughter who only died last year, I believe. Absolutely gut wrenching. How does one person endure so much grief and suffering over their lifetime? And for it to then be public? And I thought Murphy did a great job of platforming both of these women's grief in distinct and different ways. Caroline at one point says, the less people I know, the less people I'd have to grieve,

• 33:36Speaker 00

  which, you know, has that real sense of Kennedy curse about it. And honestly, guys, like, I'm not a woo woo person as such. But you do look at the Kennedys and just how much tragedy they've endured. And it's hard not to be like, this is wild.

• 33:52Speaker 00

  Now, the key moment between Anne Bessette and Caroline is set in John and Caroline's apartment. And my favorite line from that whole interaction was from Anne Bessette, who says of Caroline, she said, you didn't know who she'd become. And now that person will be immortalized forever. And again, we talk about the what ifs associated with the Kennedys, but the what ifs with the Bessettes are just as relevant here. Who would Caroline have become? What would Lauren have gone on to do? How would their family's lives have been? Anne also says in that scene, which I already mentioned before, was that Caroline's legacy is all she has left of her now, noting that Lauren was barely a footnote because she wasn't famous.

• 34:34Speaker 00

  Mary Marks, a church secretary who helped Anne plan the memorial service for Caroline and Lauren, said, people talk about Kennedy, Kennedy, Kennedy, but they forget that she lost two daughters. And it is so true, guys. Imagine losing two of your children on the same evening from the same tragedy.

• 34:53Speaker 00

  It is unfathomable. And I thought that Murphy did a great job of showing both of these women's grief as equally important, not just Caroline's and the famous Kennedy family, you know, who have the media expanding their grief on an international scale, but two human beings losing people they loved. The reality, of course, is that a moment like this one in the show most likely never happened, as a month after the fatal crash, Anne filed court papers to handle her daughter's estates and also requested the right to file personal injury and wrongful death lawsuits in the future against unknown people or parties. Those people and parties in the end was JFK Junior.

• 35:37Speaker 00

  And Anne pursued claims against his estate, including wrongful death and conscious pain and suffering, settling for an undisclosed amount which a New York Post report suggested could have been anywhere around 15 million US dollars. Regardless of this fact, I was really glad Murphy showed how consuming and powerful Anne's grief was and made a real effort to make the beset family's loss equal to that of the Kennedys. And while there is only a short moment talking about how the incident was John's fault, I felt the tragedy of the event really hung in the air, especially at the funeral. You know, we see a very, very sick Anthony Radswell, who passed away a month later, alongside members of the family, including Ethel, wife of the late Bobby, another kind

• 36:22Speaker 00

  of Kennedy matron who, you know, endured so much pain and suffering, and Calvin Klein too. So, a very sad and very sobering end to a series that captured culture and has placed JFK Junior, CBK and their families back in the spotlight, whether for better or for worse, or, in my opinion, probably both.

• 36:44Speaker 00

  So lastly, I wanted to leave you with this piece from Elizabeth Bella, writer for Town and Country magazine, who has spent years researching Carolyn. And I thought this was a really great summary of exactly how I felt the very best of love story made me feel personally. She says, "When I think of her now, I don't think of the mythology or the icon. I think of the woman who kept showing up with humour, who laughed until her shoulders shook, who made people feel seen in a way cameras never could, and who kept finding her way back to joy, no matter how powerful the force was pushing against her. An essence more aspirational than Ice Queen or Icon, and ultimately, a legendary woman

• 37:26Speaker 00

  who struggled, overcame, and now deserves to be known for more than her headbands and Prada coats. For all its lows and downsides, Carolyn was the hero for me in Love Story. And I felt she was captured in the way Elizabeth describes here in those early episodes. And I am so glad if Love Story, like all historical dramas and podcasts and documentaries and social posts do, inspires people to learn more about the real people and the real history behind the story." Which brings us to the end of another episode of Hot History. Guys, thank you so much for following along with me. Again, if you disagree with this take, that is totally fine. You are more than entitled to your opinion. I just wanted to share what I thought.

• 38:08Speaker 00

  Make sure that you tune in for this Friday's episode, guys, because we are talking about the last great royal ball in Europe, the 1903 Costume Ball held by the Romanoff family at the Winter Palace. It is a tale of grandeur and woe, and, you know, it is going to set us up for the week after as well. As always, guys, if you are looking for some more hot history before, then you can follow us on Instagram at Hot History Club and on TikTok at Hot dot History. It has been a pleasure, as always, getting down and dirty in time with you, and I will speak to you all on Friday. Thanks, guys. Love you. Bye.