Pod Insights Heart Starts Pounding: Horrors, Hauntings and Mysteries 106. Staying In The Most Haunted Airbnb in Salem (Feat. Two Girls One Ghost) About this episode In part one of our series, I chat with Corinne and Sabrina from the Two Girls One Ghost podcast from inside the most haunted Airbnb in Salem, Massachusetts, The Henry Derby House. We talk about the dark history of the house, how it was involved in the Salem Witch Trials, and the entities people have reported seeing inside.
Check out part two, where we spend the night ghost hunting in the house! Available on the Two Girls One Ghost Feed
https://youtu.be/ayCVZpJdGxE
Other Places to Listen:
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Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Kaelyn Moore? Welcome back to Heart Starts Pounding. I'm your host, Kayla Moore, and today I have a very special episode for you all. So last November, I spent one of, if not the most terrifying nights of my life inside of the most haunted Airbnb in Salem, Massachusetts with Corinne and Sabrina from the Two Girls One Ghost Podcast. I'm sharing part one of our two-part series today, where we go over the dark history of the Henry Derby House, where we stayed, its connections to the infamous witch trials and executions. And in this episode, we also chat about the entities people have encountered inside. That will set the stage for part two, where we do an overnight ghost hunt inside of the house. And you guys,
0:44 Kaelyn Moore? it gets wild. That's going to be shared on the Two Girls One Ghost feed tomorrow, February 25th, and I'll include links to listen in the description as soon as that's live. And I will just add here that not only did we contact something in the house, but I think we may have completed some unfinished business for a ghost. And I'm not even kidding. I'm so excited for you to see it. It was one of the craziest experiences of my life, and I'm actually still getting goosebumps as I tell you about it. So here's what I want from you guys. If you catch anything in these episodes, maybe you heard something or saw something, if you're watching on YouTube, that we didn't notice. Or maybe there's something about the history of the house that helps make
1:26 Kaelyn Moore? the ghost hunt make more sense. Please let me know. And if you are a regular Two Girls One Ghosts listener, visiting us today, welcome. Our community for the Darkly Curious gathers here in the study of the Rogue Detecting Society every Wednesday, and we love guests as much as we love ghosts. So please make yourself at home. Just watch out for our cursed monkey, Gordy. But for now, please enjoy part one.
1:54 Kaelyn Moore? We're sitting here in the Henry Derby House. Yes. I will say, this is the first time I've ever recorded in a haunted house. Like I've been. In Salem, Massachusetts, no less. It's the perfect place for like my first time. Yeah. You know?
2:06 Speaker 01 I think it's the first time we're recording a full episode in a haunted.
2:10 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, wait, you're right.
2:11 Speaker 01 We've recorded from a haunted hotel before.
2:14 Kaelyn Moore? Oh, which one?
2:15 Speaker 01 Actually, in Austin, the Driscoll.
2:16 Kaelyn Moore? The Driscoll. Okay, let's, let's go over what we're gonna be doing here, so everyone knows. So we're in this haunted Airbnb because we're gonna stay here tonight and we're gonna try to contact stuff. Ghosts. Yeah. Stuff. Stuff. I mean, ghosts, whatever's here, it could be demonic, I don't know. Like, so we'll get into it, but I know there's like stuff here that's maybe not ghosts. Um, I've never done a full blown ghost hunt with all the equipment and everything, so I'm so glad you guys brought stuff. I'm scared that by talking about it, we're gonna start conjuring things. That's what happens. In the room, which is like usually how it goes, right? Yeah. Yeah. So after we do our ghost hunt, I am staying the night in this Airbnb with my mother. And Kryn and I are like, bye. We're like, we're driving home to our, our own beds.
3:00 Kaelyn Moore? My house is haunted though, too. So is mine. Oh. You're going to your own ghosts. Oh, yeah, we all have ghosts at home. Yeah. Yeah. These ones are. These ones are new, so we're, we don't know what we're getting into, but basically, we're gonna do this ghost hunt. The whole ghost hunt is gonna be available on your YouTube channel or in your, your podcast as well. Two Girls, One Ghost. I mean, do you wanna give a little overview? I know a lot of my listeners listen to your show, but do you wanna give a little bit of an overview of the show for people who don't know? Sure. It's called Two Girls, One Ghost because we do cover a lot of ghost stories, but we really cover anything in the macabre and weird. So we love Bigfoot, alien abductions, all of that kind of weird and fun and spooky sort of vibe. And that's how we became friends in college.
3:44 Kaelyn Moore? We met, I shared a fun fact about myself in Intro to Theater, which I shouldn't have shared. Like, it's not a way to make friends, but apparently it worked. But it worked. My fun fact was, I grew up in a haunted house. That's so fun. Yeah, Sabrina was like, oh my God. She attracted the right type or wrong type, I don't know. It's worked out. I felt like I grew up in a haunted house. Also, so I think I would have also. Yeah, you would have. Yeah, we would have been a trio then. Yeah. So on your show, you cover lots of ghosts and the whole ghost hunt is gonna live on your feed. And today on Heartland's Pounding, what we're gonna do is I want to talk about the history of this house. Yeah. Because I think it's gonna scare us even more being here. You guys are gonna talk a little bit about like the ghost sightings that people have had in the house.
4:26 Kaelyn Moore? And then for the full experience, they can go over to your feed. So I'm excited. We'll put together a good sizzle reel. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
4:34 Speaker 02 And just to also clarify for your listeners, so our, our typical episodes, we have two episodes that come out every single week. One is filled with stories that listeners submit of their own haunting tales. And the other one is researched. So we research a place like this and talk about the history, the mystery of the hauntings. And then we have more recently started dabbling and actually like doing in-person ghost hunts. So we have a few kind of special, different.
5:00 Kaelyn Moore? Is there one that people should go to first if they want to get like a good vibe of the show?
5:05 Speaker 02 Well, if you'd like to listen on YouTube, there is an episode we covered about, I can't remember the specific number, but we covered objects in the Greg and Dana Newkirk Haunted Objects Museum.
5:18 Kaelyn Moore? Oh, yeah.
5:19 Speaker 02 That haunted us and a lot of our listeners.
5:22 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, listening to the episode, a lot of people started to experience something of their own, which happens a lot. We won't know what episode will start to trigger things, but there'll be a specific episode we'll put out. And within that week, we'll just get flooded with emails being like, I listened to this episode and all of this happened.
5:37 Speaker 02 Peggy the Doll episodes.
5:38 Kaelyn Moore? That's another really haunted one.
5:40 Speaker 02 That if you want to get haunted, highly recommend those.
5:44 Kaelyn Moore? And the Smurl Possession, that's another one that really got people haunted. Possession?
5:47 Speaker 02 The Smurl Possession.
5:48 Kaelyn Moore? Oh, you should look into that. Oh, my God. Is that one gonna haunt me if I listen to it?
5:53 Speaker 02 Um, I don't know.
5:54 Kaelyn Moore? Fingers crossed if I'm lucky.
5:57 Speaker 02 But if you want to check out just the audio, um, our most haunted episode is episode 12. It's called Dominus.
6:04 Kaelyn Moore? And it was early days of podcasting, so.
6:08 Speaker 02 Like, give us a break.
6:10 Speaker 01 Be patient. It's the listener's story specifically at the end of the episode. We highly recommend not driving while listening. That's all we'll say.
6:18 Kaelyn Moore? Whoa, okay. Wow. Some of my listeners can't listen to my show while they drive because I included like sirens and car crashes as sound effects in a lot of the earlier episodes. And people were like, hey, can you stop doing that? And I was like, I did not even think about that.
6:31 Speaker 02 That one Rihanna song that has the sirens in the background.
6:34 Kaelyn Moore? I think all the time. It's on the radio and you're like, oh my God, what's happening?
6:38 Speaker 01 Am I getting pulled over?
6:39 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. Okay. So let's get into the history a little bit of this place before we dive into the haunts. So we're in the Henry Derby House, which is situated in Salem, directly across the street from the Broad Street Cemetery. And this house was built in 1838, which was 150 years after the Salem witch trials that Salem is known for. And though it was built so long afterwards, the history of the house is still incredibly intertwined in the witch trials. Like, there's a, there's a lot of overlap, which I'm going to get into.
7:15 Speaker 01 Well, sorry.
7:17 Kaelyn Moore? Just, no, no, no. Yeah.
7:18 Speaker 01 You and I walked through the Broad Street Cemetery before this and you mentioned, one, that there's so many unmarked graves.
7:25 Kaelyn Moore? Yes.
7:25 Speaker 01 And two, that people today still, while walking, will fall into graves. Like, literally the ground will cave through, cave in, and people will fall.
7:35 Kaelyn Moore? So that's like a big part of Broad Street Cemetery is it's the most dangerous cemetery in Salem right now. Because there's so many underground tombs and there's not really walking paths. So they're actually afraid that people are going to start falling through the ground into the tombs. So it'll probably be closed within the next, what'd they say, like 10, 15 years?
7:54 Speaker 01 Isn't that terrifying?
7:55 Speaker 02 Truly something I didn't think would be a problem, walking through a cemetery. I never thought. You know, like you go over super greats and you wonder if it's just going to be a little too loose and you're going to drop.
8:05 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
8:05 Speaker 02 But now. Never thought about like falling into some old geezer's casket.
8:10 Speaker 01 Yeah.
8:10 Speaker 02 Jeez.
8:11 Speaker 01 But it makes me wonder if there were any like unmarked graves on the land that this house now stands on.
8:18 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, there. Definitely are. I might talk about it a little more in the research, but back in the day, it was very common to be buried on your property. And so a lot of like the witches, why they don't know where the witches were, or the women who were accused of witchcraft, exactly where they're buried is a lot of their bodies were most likely taken back to their homes. And so that's basically made all of Salem a big graveyard because everyone has bones on their land of the people that lived there.
8:45 Speaker 01 I want to bring that back.
8:47 Kaelyn Moore? Me too, kind of. I love the idea of like, uh, like on the land, family cemetery.
8:51 Speaker 01 Yeah, me too.
8:52 Kaelyn Moore? I actually love what they do in New Orleans, where they just put the whole family in one big tomb. And then it's so hot, it kind of like cooks everyone down.
9:00 Speaker 01 You get melded together.
9:01 Kaelyn Moore? You make like a big family stew.
9:02 Speaker 01 Family stew.
9:03 Kaelyn Moore? Melded together.
9:04 Speaker 01 Your bones get like mixed up.
9:05 Kaelyn Moore? Good soup. There's something romantic about like that.
9:07 Speaker 01 Family soup.
9:08 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. So who was Henry who lived in this house? Henry was, um, maybe you've seen like around that everything's named Derby. There's Derby Square, Derby Street. There's like a Derby.
9:20 Speaker 01 The Derby.
9:21 Kaelyn Moore? The Derby is a restaurant. Well, that's actually Henry's uncle. Henry's uncle was Elias Derby, who was a ship merchant and like the first millionaire in America, which I, how cool. I had no idea. Also back then.
9:35 Speaker 01 Yeah.
9:35 Kaelyn Moore? Which is like a billionaire now.
9:37 Speaker 01 Jesus.
9:37 Kaelyn Moore? I mean, I don't know math, but probably a lot of money.
9:41 Speaker 01 Into shippery.
9:42 Kaelyn Moore? And we should have lived back then.
9:44 Speaker 01 Oh, my gosh.
9:44 Kaelyn Moore? If you got into shippery back then, you would be rich for generations, as is evidenced by this house, because they were rich for generations. Um, fun fact, but his biggest ship, Elias Derby's biggest ship is actually the ship that's on the Old Spice. It's logo.
9:59 Speaker 01 No way.
10:00 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
10:01 Speaker 01 That is so cool.
10:02 Kaelyn Moore? That is so. So that's a Salem ship. So you can tell everyone.
10:05 Speaker 01 Wow. Every time we walk through CVS, fun fact.
10:08 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. Everyone's gonna love that you bring that up all the time, as I've been doing since I've been here. So, okay, so Henry had this house built because he was a little bit of an nepo baby. He came from a really rich family. Um, but he himself was a tailor, so he like made his own money too. But I will say, when he had this house built, he probably didn't know exactly like the cursed nature of this area that he was building the house on. And that's because this house is built on something called the Judges Line. Have you heard of this before?
10:39 Speaker 01 No.
10:40 Kaelyn Moore? This is really interesting. I found this from a tour guide in Salem who talked about it. And then I looked it up and there were like a few other people online that were talking about it. But the judge's line is one of the scariest things I've ever heard of.
10:53 Speaker 01 Oh, my God.
10:54 Kaelyn Moore? And it's basically, you can draw a line on a map through Salem and hit most of the points that were involved in the Salem witch trials.
11:05 Speaker 01 How very astro cartography.
11:06 Kaelyn Moore? Yes. And it gets like really bizarre, because if you draw a straight line, you start at the home of Alice Parker, who was accused of witchcraft, and she was hanged in the trials. And then it continues through where Thomas Beadle's Tavern was, which is where some of the witch trial inquests happened.
11:24 Speaker 01 Yeah.
11:24 Kaelyn Moore? And then it hits the witch house, the like famous witch house of Salem, which is where Judge Corwin lived, who was the man who sentenced the accused witches to death. And then it goes through his nephew's home, which was George Corwin, who was another nepo baby of, he was the nephew of the judge. But he was the one who signed all the arrests. I mean, you guys have come to Salem so much. I'm sorry I'm mansplaining this to you, but
11:49 Speaker 01 No, we love it.
11:49 Kaelyn Moore? My audience is gonna wanna know.
11:52 Speaker 01 A good refresher.
11:53 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, just a little refresher.
11:54 Speaker 02 It's been so long since we've done a tour or even researched it.
11:57 Speaker 01 Yeah.
11:58 Speaker 02 This is great.
11:59 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. Okay, so you know, the Joshua Ward House, which is where George Corwin lived. So the line goes through there. And then it comes down through Essex Street, which is where all the witches, all the women accused of witchcraft were carted down towards the gallows. And then it hits Proctor's Ledge, which is where the executions happened.
12:17 Speaker 01 Whoa.
12:18 Speaker 02 I hate this because it feels like it was predetermined, all of these people's fates or involvement.
12:24 Kaelyn Moore? That idea that it was kind of like written out, like written in the stars.
12:27 Speaker 01 What is fate?
12:28 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. Yeah, that you can, like, one of the first people accused in the witch trials, and it ends at the gallows, is really...
12:35 Speaker 01 Yeah, that's so unsettling.
12:38 Kaelyn Moore? Really eerie. And so some people who are more inclined to believe in like the spooky supernatural, think it's a ley line, like there's some sort of energy that runs through this area that is very bad and negative and dark. And we are right on like the cusp of that line that runs through the town. So this land that we're on is part of that procession.
12:59 Speaker 01 Well, so far, I haven't felt anything weird.
13:01 Speaker 02 No.
13:01 Speaker 01 The third floor is creepy, but yeah.
13:04 Speaker 02 When you first came out here, Sabrina, and you were spending time in Marblehead and getting to know the area, the second you crossed over the line into Salem, you felt
13:12 Speaker 01 Night and day.
13:13 Speaker 02 That, and that was closer to where Proctor's ledge is.
13:16 Speaker 01 So I live in Marblehead, and which you and your mom visited, but I was there for like Little Writer's Retreat by myself, and truly, it was like so magical, and I walked the path that goes from Marblehead to Salem. And I didn't even notice that the sign that says "Welcome to Salem" was right there, because I instantly like felt a shift, and it was different. And I noticed the sign was right there, and I was like, wow, that's weird. And then every time I've gone back and forth, you do kind of feel a difference.
13:44 Speaker 02 Yeah, there's a lot of pockets of energy buzzing throughout this town.
13:48 Kaelyn Moore? I mean, there must have been a reason that it happened in Salem, instead of like happening all over the country, like all these witch trials, like there is something specific to Salem.
13:57 Speaker 02 Yeah.
13:57 Kaelyn Moore? Which is why it all happened here, which is really spooky. And so I have here that maybe our guy, Henry, didn't know that that's what was going on with the land when he built the house. But what he probably did know, may have known, was that during the witch trials, this land that we're on now was Corwin land, belonging to the two most evil people involved in the witch trials that I just brought up. And so how do we know this is Corwin land? Well, their houses are two blocks away, and their bodies are across the street in the Broad Street Cemetery. And back in the day, like I said, it was more common to be buried on your property. So the cemetery across the street actually like butts up right onto Corwin land. So when they died, it made sense that they were just buried, like basically on the edge of their property.
14:40 Speaker 02 And it also makes sense that two rich people would kind of shake hands and be like, yeah, sure, you can purchase some of my property off of me.
14:45 Speaker 01 Yeah. I want to be very honest, the second you mentioned and said the Corwin were like the two evil people, or the evil people involved, I got lightheaded.
14:58 Speaker 02 Like it almost felt like instantly like a, don't talk about me that way.
15:01 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
15:02 Speaker 02 Sabrina's psychic abilities are starting to unlock.
15:04 Kaelyn Moore? Really?
15:05 Speaker 02 It came out in her aura photo, too.
15:07 Speaker 01 I have been opening myself up a lot more. I don't like, I wouldn't say I'm a psychic at all, but like,
15:12 Kaelyn Moore? Well, you don't know yet.
15:14 Speaker 01 That's true. I don't know.
15:16 Kaelyn Moore? You could get your first download here.
15:17 Speaker 01 I'm gonna have my that's so Raven moment on this episode.
15:20 Kaelyn Moore? Oh, my God, the vision. Is that something that you are in tune with?
15:27 Speaker 01 I mean, I've definitely, I feel like I've always picked up on energies and I have had experiences before. But ever since like moving here and living in my own haunted house, I've just been trying to connect a lot more.
15:43 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. What does that look like?
15:46 Speaker 01 Oracle cards. I have a pendulum that a listener sent us and I brought, I brought him. His name's Daniel. There's a spirit attached to it.
15:54 Kaelyn Moore? The pendulum isn't Daniel, but the spirit attached to the pendulum is Daniel.
15:57 Speaker 01 And I brought him. We'll talk to him tonight. And then kind of just like a lot of connecting to my ancestors.
16:05 Kaelyn Moore? Wow.
16:06 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:06 Kaelyn Moore? That's really interesting. Okay. So, and you're getting a read on Corwin?
16:10 Speaker 01 Yeah. I like my, I've felt, I've felt lightheaded and like heavy. It's like, it, it's, this is weird for me. Like simultaneously, I feel like lightheaded and my energy is lifting, but then I feel heaviness on my shoulders.
16:27 Kaelyn Moore? Interesting. That's so, that's kind of weird you say that because I felt that a little bit earlier today and I was actually wondering if I was having a migraine. Because it was like this weird, not out of body, but do you ever get like,
16:38 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:38 Kaelyn Moore? I get weird migraines where I kind of feel like I'm outside my body, but like my limbs get heavy.
16:42 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:42 Kaelyn Moore? So I was like worried that I was having a migraine. So it's actually kind of strange to hear you like bring up that.
16:46 Speaker 01 That's like an exact, yeah, that's exactly what I'm feeling.
16:49 Kaelyn Moore? Whoa.
16:50 Speaker 01 And it's getting like worse and worse right now.
16:52 Kaelyn Moore? And I made you go to, go to the grave. Did you feel anything when I brought you over to the?
16:55 Speaker 01 Feel anything in the grave?
16:56 Kaelyn Moore? Huh.
16:58 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, when we weren't really talking about him.
16:59 Speaker 02 But I was really focusing on how to use that camera.
17:02 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. You're like, I have to get good photos or good images.
17:05 Speaker 02 And not falling into it.
17:06 Kaelyn Moore? Pain's gonna be bad.
17:07 Speaker 02 Not falling in. Yeah.
17:08 Kaelyn Moore? That's, okay, well, that's really interesting. Well, so it's interesting to note, if you need me to stop talking about them too, I will absolutely shut up.
17:15 Speaker 02 You can talk about them.
17:17 Kaelyn Moore? I'll just like, you'll just see me like, I'm relaxing. You're like astral projecting outside your body because I brought it up so much.
17:26 Kaelyn Moore? That'd be kind of cool to cat talk camera. Okay, I'll keep talking about it. So one of the Corwins, George, when he died, so he died when he was 30. And this was a few years after the trials. He was like 25 during the witch trials. He was the most hated man in Salem because it seems like the the public opinion on the witch trials really soured after they happened and people here were like pretty upset that that occurred in Salem.
17:52 Speaker 02 Yeah, which is so interesting too, because the witch trials kind of like trickled many decades after with certain people's beliefs and different hangings happening outside of Salem. But I'm glad that most people didn't agree with that.
18:08 Kaelyn Moore? Maybe it was just like a counter movement that was upset, but there was enough people that were so mad at George Corwin that when he died, when he was 30, they thought that a mob was going to come steal his body and like rip it apart. So they hid him in the Joshua Ward house, which is right around the corner, in the basement for years. And then like under the cover of night, on a night just like this, they brought him across the street and they buried him with his uncle in that grave.
18:32 Speaker 02 I did not know that at the time.
18:34 Kaelyn Moore? So that's also very spooky. And so I say all of that to say that the area that this house was built on has a very dark past. And that's why so many of the ghost stories we hear about, like this area in this house tend to be related to the witch trials. I'm guessing that that's why so many people have experiences in this house. It's potentially on a cursed ley line. It's surrounded on all sides by the bad guys from the witch trials, but that's on the outside, right? We don't have any evidence that anything from the witch trials happened in the house. The house itself was built 150 years after the witch trials, so it shouldn't really have any ties to it. You would think, but you would think wrong.
19:16 Kaelyn Moore? Because even though this house was built in 1838, by 1842, it had exchanged hands and was sold to Ebenezer Putnam.
19:28 Kaelyn Moore? And does the name Putnam ring any bells?
19:30 Speaker 01 Like Sarah Putnam?
19:32 Kaelyn Moore? Anne Putnam. Anna Putnam. That's it. Yeah, Anne Putnam.
19:36 Speaker 01 I feel like there's a Sarah Putnam in Marblehead. Maybe that's what it is.
19:39 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
19:39 Speaker 02 Anne Putnam was one of the accused witches, right?
19:41 Kaelyn Moore? Accusers.
19:43 Speaker 02 Oh, she was the accuser?
19:44 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. So outside of the Corwins, probably the most evil family involved in the witch trials were the Putnams. And they were a big family with a huge legacy in Salem. And they, I mean, were so prevalent that even in the 1830s and 1840s, like Ebenezer was buying this mansion in town because he had a lot of money. So people may recognize the name Anne Putnam because she was the 12-year-old girl that was one of the primary accusers in the Salem witch trials. She pointed her finger at 62 people and claimed that they were witches. And she accused 18 of the 20 people who were executed.
20:25 Kaelyn Moore? She is the biggest reason that people.
20:27 Speaker 01 She's a sociopath.
20:28 Kaelyn Moore? A sociopath. And it's funny because I actually have a note from my friend Megan, who helped me research this episode. And Megan goes, okay, okay, before we vilify this girl, keep in mind that she was 12 when she pointed fingers and sent a bunch of people to their deaths. She was rich and she was very privileged. But research also suggests that she was maybe being abused by her parents.
20:48 Speaker 01 Also, weren't they Puritan? And I feel like a lot of the things you hear about the Salem witch trials and when people try to theorize like what caused such hysteria is this idea of like the Puritan lifestyle was very,
21:02 Speaker 01 like for children, there was not much exploration and.
21:06 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, it was very cold.
21:07 Speaker 01 Yes, that's a good way to put it. Like, they didn't have any other outlets of where to channel that creative energy.
21:14 Kaelyn Moore? And like imagination, maybe. That makes a lot of sense, actually. Because a lot of what they were experiencing was kind of like imagination. They were seeing, like Anne kept accusing women of being, like she would see people on their brooms at night, flying across the sky, like really classic witch stuff. Or she would see apparitions.
21:31 Speaker 01 Yeah.
21:32 Kaelyn Moore? And that was, for whatever reason, during the witch trials, like that was admissible in court, was like.
21:37 Speaker 01 Which is wild.
21:37 Kaelyn Moore? Visions that you had of these people.
21:39 Speaker 01 Yeah.
21:40 Kaelyn Moore? And it led to, I cannot believe it's 18 of the 20 people. And Anne's father, Thomas Putnam, was one of the primary instigators of complaints against the alleged witches in Salem. For this reason, he's been identified by several key historians, including Paul Boyer and Stephen Eisenbaum, of being a chief agitator and manipulator of the testimonies of both his daughter and his wife, Anne Putnam, Sr. Evidence indicates that many of those who were afflicted or gave testimony against the accused witches were connected to the Putnam family, either by ties of kinship or faction. So everyone that was accusing people, even if it wasn't his own daughter, like, had ties to this family, which really makes them the most evil people.
22:25 Speaker 01 And most influential.
22:27 Speaker 02 Yeah, it makes me wonder what the motivator was. You know, like, what did his daughter get as a reward or some sort of security, maybe, that she kept on accusing? And like, what did other people?
22:39 Kaelyn Moore? Or just to hear that your dad's proud of you? Like, I imagine if it was an abusive household, like, I could imagine she would do, like, anything for his praise, you know?
22:48 Speaker 01 And attention, like, the amount of attention that she got from it. And then it also triggered a bunch of other people to accuse. And then once someone else does, you kind of all just build on.
23:00 Speaker 02 And then you start to wonder, like, did I make that up? Or is this actually happening?
23:03 Kaelyn Moore? Right.
23:03 Speaker 01 Right.
23:04 Kaelyn Moore? And you start to get lost.
23:05 Speaker 01 You're not gonna say, like, oh, I made it up, and that's why all these people died. So you kind of, like, double down on it.
23:09 Speaker 02 Yeah, you try to convince yourself of what you said.
23:12 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, exactly. But that kind of got me thinking that if there were spirits around Salem that wanted to make sure nothing like the witch trials ever happened again, they would be keeping a close eye on both the Putnam's and the Corwin's, both of which have ties to this house.
23:26 Speaker 01 That's a cool, I like that as a, an idea.
23:29 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, like, this is, everyone's just kind of, like, keeping an eye to make sure, like, nothing's gonna happen again.
23:34 Speaker 01 No funny business.
23:35 Kaelyn Moore? No funny business.
23:36 Speaker 02 No mass murders.
23:38 Kaelyn Moore? No more, no more mass murders, guys. Please, for the love of God.
23:41 Speaker 01 Silly little humans.
23:43 Kaelyn Moore? It's interesting to know Ebenezer also died in this house. So there's a chance that he's still here.
23:47 Speaker 02 Right in this spot.
23:48 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, on this couch.
23:50 Speaker 02 He felt the pressure on his shoulders, his head got a little light and he drifted off.
23:55 Speaker 01 This world.
23:55 Kaelyn Moore? Never to wake again. He was like feeling something on his head.
23:58 Speaker 02 Mm hmm.
23:59 Kaelyn Moore? Unfortunately, a few of the people who lived in this house did die in this house, we found.
24:04 Speaker 01 Which was very normal for the time, you know.
24:06 Kaelyn Moore? There weren't hospitals to go to.
24:08 Speaker 02 Right.
24:08 Kaelyn Moore? You didn't go to the hospital, you just died at home.
24:10 Speaker 02 Born in their home and died in their home.
24:12 Kaelyn Moore? Yes.
24:12 Speaker 02 Mm hmm. Birthing rooms exist all over the houses in this area.
24:16 Kaelyn Moore? A birthing, like a whole room just for birthing.
24:18 Speaker 02 Yes.
24:18 Speaker 01 Mm hmm.
24:19 Speaker 02 Yeah. They were like usually these kind of small nooks off of the main living space or like off of one of the bedrooms. And different women and basically like doulas would come over and help deliver children into their home.
24:33 Speaker 01 Which also meant a lot of set because childbirth caused a lot of deaths at that time. Like either the child dying or the mother. There's probably so many deaths related to that.
24:43 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. I read that between five and 10% of women died in childbirth before like modern medicine.
24:50 Speaker 02 Yeah.
24:51 Kaelyn Moore? It was a lot. I know at one point they, if you were pregnant, they made you write a will. Like that's how common it was to die. So you had to get your affairs in order at like 21 years old.
25:01 Speaker 02 Yeah.
25:02 Kaelyn Moore? Before you had a kid.
25:03 Speaker 02 Wow.
25:04 Kaelyn Moore? Crazy.
25:05 Speaker 01 What affairs do you even have at 21?
25:07 Speaker 02 I guess back then, probably a lot.
25:09 Kaelyn Moore? Own any money.
25:09 Speaker 02 You were probably married off at like 13 back then.
25:12 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, you're like, I guess I leave my husband everything because he just gets that anyway.
25:15 Speaker 02 Yeah, it doesn't even matter.
25:16 Kaelyn Moore? Right. Yeah, none of this is mine. Okay, so I can run through, I'll just run through like a few other people who lived in this house. In case anything comes up tonight, we have some names top of mind. I like it. If we hear of anyone. So in 1899, the house was sold to the Pickering family, Sarah and Thomas. And they had three kids, Edith, Gertrude and Arthur. And then John Williams Downing lived in the residence with his wife Sarah and two children, Anna and Alice. Anna died in the house nine months later in September of 1845 of dysentery. And she was young when she died, unfortunately.
25:52 Speaker 02 Yeah. And then that kind of leads us up to where we are today, where Phil Marchand lives in, lived in this house growing up. He owns it now. He's the guy on the Airbnb that
26:03 Speaker 01 Yeah, he's great. He also is so open about his experiences.
26:07 Speaker 02 And it sounds like he's had a lot of, I mean, this can like, this is a very natural transition into the ghosty stuff going on in the house. But it sounds like Phil, ever since he, his family moved in, it's had like weird stuff going on.
26:20 Speaker 01 Yeah. And his mom opened a bed and breakfast here.
26:24 Speaker 02 Yeah. So originally his, it was his great aunt and uncle owned the home. And then his parents had purchased the home from his great aunt and uncle. And then when his parents divorced, he and his mom lived here and his sister lived here in this house. And then eventually they started like boarding people and then turned it into a bed and breakfast as like a means to be a single mom and raise a family. And so he grew up here for some time. And then he himself and his wife had their very first child in this house while living here.
26:57 Speaker 01 Oh, wow. Like in the house?
26:59 Speaker 02 Well, I don't think they delivered in the house, but like,
27:01 Speaker 01 You got me thinking about birth in rooms. I'm like, is there a nook and cranny we missed?
27:05 Speaker 02 Oh, my God. But yeah, they, they lived here. I think it's been in their family since the 1970s. Okay. So he's had, you know, 50 years of stories to share.
27:14 Speaker 01 Wow.
27:14 Speaker 02 And here.
27:16 Speaker 01 Yeah. I was actually going to read Phil's little message to me because I had messaged him on the Airbnb app, asking if he had had any paranormal stories. And he did share, he basically was like, I have so many stories. But basically, he said, I grew up in this house and have a lot of great memories here. I will say, I have always personally felt like the third floor is haunted. Growing up, I had a lot of crazy dreams about the third floor and always felt a supernatural presence up there. As far as guests go, I hear a lot of stories about hearing things or feeling a presence on the third floor, or something that was left in one place and then moved later. Luckily, no one has been too scared to stay there. And from most accounts, whatever spirit is there is not scary. Phil then said,
28:01 Speaker 01 personally, I love this so much because you're staying here.
28:03 Speaker 02 Yeah.
28:04 Kaelyn Moore? Phil said, me personally, I don't like to be bothered when I'm sleeping. So I'd always prefer to sleep on the second floor with a fan very close to my head in order to drown out any noise.
28:13 Speaker 02 Okay, great. Okay. I have my white noise machine, which is just an app on my phone.
28:18 Kaelyn Moore? Exactly.
28:19 Speaker 02 I'll have that going.
28:20 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. So Phil's done a lot of interviews. So I found plenty of interviews where he discussed some of the paranormal. And then we kind of dove into some of the reviews of the Airbnb.
28:29 Speaker 02 Oh, my gosh.
28:30 Kaelyn Moore? To find some more hauntings.
28:31 Speaker 02 There's also two notebooks over there that Caitlin and I found. And we were like, we should definitely, maybe over dinner, read.
28:39 Kaelyn Moore? Read through them.
28:40 Speaker 02 Oh, yeah, definitely.
28:41 Kaelyn Moore? See what other people have experienced.
28:43 Speaker 02 Yes. Okay, well, Phil, obviously, growing up here, has had a lot of experiences. Like he said, he had a lot of crazy dreams. But he would also hear footsteps and creaking in the middle of the night, which some people could argue, like, this is an old house, right? Like, this is a natural thing for these old floorboards to creak and shake and beams pop. But other people have seen stuff, ghostly stuff. So Phil has a lot of people backing him up.
29:09 Kaelyn Moore? Wow.
29:09 Speaker 02 One of the experiences that he had was in high school when a friend of his, it was his best friend, was over. The house was empty and they heard someone walking upstairs. And so Phil's friend gets up and walks up to the second floor, which is where you're sleeping.
29:24 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
29:25 Speaker 02 And comes back down and says, oh, I think I just saw your sister. And Phil's like, my sister is not home.
29:33 Kaelyn Moore? And that is basically the beginning of people starting to report, or not the beginning, but like, in this story. It's our first introduction to this woman, or really a younger, like, teenaged girl with dark hair.
29:47 Speaker 02 I was gonna say, do we know what she looks?
29:48 Kaelyn Moore? She looks like you.
29:49 Speaker 02 Did you just hear singing?
29:50 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna play that part for you again. It was really clear in the room when it happened, but the three of us heard a woman's voice sing something, like a hum coming from deep inside the house. I ended up sending that clip to my sound designer and I asked if he knew what the sound was, but even he couldn't figure it out. He said the frequencies weren't Consistent with a car driving by or with a human voice. It was this kind of other third thing that he hadn't seen before. I'm going to play it three times. The first time will be what our mics picked up. The second will be what my phone that was recording picked up. And the third will be what my sound designer isolated. Check it out.
30:36 Speaker 02 A younger, like teenaged girl with dark hair.
30:39 Speaker 01 I was gonna say, do we know what she looks?
30:40 Speaker 02 She looks like you.
30:41 Speaker 01 Did you just hear singing?
30:43 Speaker 02 Or really a younger, like teenaged girl with dark hair. She looks like you. Did you just hear singing? Or really a younger, like teenaged girl with dark hair.
31:00 Speaker 02 Maybe, maybe a car outside? That sounded like singing.
31:05 Kaelyn Moore? That was, yeah.
31:05 Speaker 02 It did, and it sounded like it was coming from over there.
31:07 Speaker 01 I heard it like this way, yeah.
31:08 Kaelyn Moore? The opposite, yeah. The road is behind us.
31:12 Speaker 02 I'm curious.
31:12 Kaelyn Moore? The depths of the house is in front of us.
31:15 Speaker 02 Yeah. Hello?
31:18 Speaker 01 And it was as we were talking about the girl.
31:20 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah.
31:23 Speaker 02 Okay, well, maybe she sings.
31:27 Kaelyn Moore? And she's a teenager.
31:28 Speaker 02 She's a teenager.
31:29 Kaelyn Moore? Okay.
31:30 Speaker 02 I'll keep that in mind.
31:33 Speaker 01 When it was previously a bed and breakfast, an employee had a dream about a spirit. And when she woke up, she swears that there was an imprint in the bed, like as if someone had just been there. Or maybe perhaps.
31:44 Kaelyn Moore? It was still.
31:44 Speaker 01 Still sitting there. So the identity of this mysterious girl and woman is a mystery.
31:51 Kaelyn Moore? Phil.
31:51 Speaker 02 Most likely a teenager, but yeah, I guess some people say woman, some people say teen.
31:55 Speaker 01 Right.
31:56 Kaelyn Moore? Young, young lady.
31:57 Speaker 01 Young lady. Phil has tried to figure out the cause of the hauntings. And a historian helped get some of the details of previous owners, which is a lot of the stuff that you detailed.
32:06 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
32:06 Speaker 01 There are a few deaths, but nothing really stood out, but. It's Salem. And we've also talked a lot about on our podcast, like even if it wasn't Salem, it could be a brand new house and there could be hauntings.
32:20 Speaker 02 Yeah.
32:20 Speaker 01 And maybe it has to do with people or like just the location. And also this house has now been turned into an Airbnb because I think it's easier and makes more money than a bed and breakfast. And I read online, like Phil has a house booked all, every October. It's fully booked. People are coming here for the haunted attractions and Salem.
32:39 Speaker 02 Look at us, we're trying to contact the dead here tonight. Like we are instigating and contributing to the energy of this home.
32:46 Speaker 01 We found a Ouija board. I thought of that. Yeah. When you said, I wonder if they closed the Ouija board correctly. It's like, yeah, who's coming in here and conjuring stuff up or summoning things and then just leaving because they don't know what to do with it.
32:58 Speaker 02 Like we're confident in our approach in terms of being really respectful because we learned how to investigate from two of the best investigators in the world.
33:07 Speaker 01 Yeah.
33:09 Speaker 02 So, but what are other people doing?
33:12 Speaker 01 Right. Yeah. You don't know. Are people like, like hail Satan?
33:15 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah.
33:16 Speaker 01 I don't know.
33:17 Speaker 02 Or just like think it's a joke. And then like to your point, they get scared once things start happening and then they just, yeah.
33:23 Speaker 01 Yes. Yeah.
33:24 Speaker 02 They don't properly say goodbye.
33:26 Speaker 01 So we'll also, when we do our episode, we'll set intentions before we actually actively communicate with the spirits, because that is something I think is important when you do approach a conversation with the other side.
33:38 Speaker 02 Boundaries are always okay to set.
33:40 Speaker 01 Especially in real life.
33:42 Speaker 02 Yeah.
33:43 Speaker 01 Not only.
33:43 Speaker 02 With the dead, but this is practice.
33:45 Speaker 01 You can do this with the living too. Yeah. I'm better at setting it with the dead.
33:49 Speaker 02 You're practicing.
33:50 Speaker 01 I'm practicing. But so most of these hauntings are like, people will feel things, see things move, objects moving on their own, and they'll see this little girl. There's full body apparitions, but
34:03 Speaker 02 Oh, wow.
34:04 Speaker 01 There's more.
34:05 Speaker 02 There is.
34:06 Speaker 01 Oh, wow.
34:07 Speaker 02 So I have no idea where, because it did not specify. But as we have noted, there are many bathrooms here and there's also many mirrors in many of the bedrooms. Apparently multiple people have seen someone appear behind them when they're looking in the mirror.
34:23 Speaker 01 That's my biggest fear.
34:25 Speaker 02 Yeah.
34:26 Speaker 01 Do they describe who the person is at all?
34:27 Speaker 02 No, but I, it's, some people had said it was the teenage girl.
34:31 Speaker 01 Okay.
34:31 Speaker 02 But there were some that just said someone appeared.
34:33 Speaker 01 Oh, my gosh.
34:33 Speaker 02 And I don't know who and how many people could be showing up in this mirror, but.
34:40 Speaker 01 There's a mirror right there.
34:41 Speaker 02 I know.
34:41 Speaker 01 They're everywhere.
34:42 Speaker 02 Be careful.
34:43 Speaker 01 Looking in there.
34:43 Speaker 02 And there's windows everywhere, too. Like, there's so many reflective surfaces in this house.
34:47 Speaker 01 Yeah. The one on the third floor is the creepiest. And like, it looks down the long hallway and there's a mirror at the end of that hallway, which I noticed when you were looking for a light switch up there. It's like, right there. And I feel like that is the prime spot and location for you to see a, a fourth figure appear in the mirror with us.
35:07 Speaker 02 In my own home, I don't even look in the mirror at night. I keep my eyes down.
35:11 Speaker 01 Yeah, I know. It's freaky.
35:13 Speaker 02 It is. But one thing that's not super freaky here is there is a little boy and he seems to be pretty playful, someone who had some mediumship powers who, uh, stayed here. She believes that this little boy is the one who was causing all of the footsteps that Phil heard when he was young, living here. And I guess as an adult as well, because he would constantly hear someone running up and down and like, running around. And this woman who stayed here made contact with the little boy and the little boy was, like, I guess, displayed kind of what he would do to show his own presence. And that's exactly what a lot of people who stay here experience. So if you tonight hear some footsteps and walking and running around on the floor above you, don't be scared. It's just the little boy playing.
35:58 Speaker 01 That's who it is. Okay, that makes me feel a little bit better.
36:01 Speaker 02 Yeah.
36:01 Speaker 01 I prefer that to whatever, there's like, the dark figure with red eyes, potentially Hat Man, Shadow Man, that's on the third floor.
36:09 Speaker 02 Yes.
36:10 Speaker 01 Cause that, I've heard whispers of this and that's the one I'm really.
36:13 Speaker 02 Terrifying.
36:14 Speaker 01 Not looking forward to. It does feel like that is like, not as common, hopefully.
36:19 Speaker 02 Okay.
36:20 Speaker 01 But there is a ghost cat.
36:22 Speaker 02 Oh, so we have some good haunting.
36:24 Speaker 01 Yeah.
36:24 Speaker 02 Yes.
36:24 Speaker 01 There's some like, fun, nice ones.
36:26 Speaker 02 There's some positive.
36:27 Speaker 01 So, the Hat Man. There is a man in a hat with glowing red eyes that torments guests. And even Phil himself has confirmed that that is the most active floor and the floor that most people have scary encounters. Some people believe that the man in the hat is Giles Corey, who was killed during the witch trials.
36:49 Speaker 02 He was pressed to death.
36:50 Speaker 01 Oh. That's the famous one more.
36:52 Speaker 02 Stone.
36:53 Kaelyn Moore? Yep.
36:53 Speaker 01 That what he said?
36:54 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
36:54 Speaker 01 Oh, he said that?
36:55 Speaker 02 Yeah, so he was the, I think he was the only one who was pressed by stone. Everyone else was hanged.
37:03 Speaker 01 Yeah.
37:03 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah.
37:03 Speaker 02 Um, and he, they kept giving him an opportunity while placing another stone on top of him to basically declare himself guilty. And he just kept saying, one more stone. Like he would not give up his innocence.
37:16 Speaker 01 Days. It took days.
37:19 Speaker 02 It was like, yeah, he was in agony and very slowly died, slowly was pressed to death.
37:25 Speaker 01 Whoa.
37:26 Kaelyn Moore? Horrible.
37:26 Speaker 02 So if you go downtown Salem, you can walk through the witch memorial, which is just like this really short loop in there. There's almost like this stone or like granite bench that says every person's name on it. Um, and how they had died.
37:42 Speaker 01 Yeah.
37:43 Speaker 02 So when you get to his, it says pressed to death.
37:45 Speaker 01 Wow.
37:46 Speaker 02 Yeah.
37:46 Speaker 01 That's horrible.
37:47 Kaelyn Moore? But they think, so they think it's Giles Corey that's upstairs. That's interesting because I, I had heard that someone who went on the third floor felt pressure in their chest. And they were thinking about Giles Corey.
37:57 Speaker 01 Oh, that's interesting.
37:59 Kaelyn Moore? Yeah, it was actually, it was the, the ghost tour guide that I heard about the witches line from. He, when he's been to this house and when he went to the third floor, he felt like pressure on his chest. And that's why he felt like it was Giles Corey upstairs.
38:12 Speaker 01 Oh, yeah, that could make sense. Well, and also because it causes sleep paralysis seeing this entity, which is it sleep paralysis or is it? If it is being like this, like residual energy of feeling what he felt.
38:25 Kaelyn Moore? Hmm. That's making me nervous because I get sleep paralysis. And when I get sleep paralysis, it feels like I'm being crushed on my chest. I think tonight, as I stay here. I, I'm gonna look out for sleep paralysis. Like I, I'm very curious to see if I have sleep paralysis here. Cause I think that'll be saying something, especially if I see my sleep paralysis demon I called Gary. But if I see Gary.
38:47 Speaker 01 Gordy and Gary.
38:48 Kaelyn Moore? Gordy and Gary. Um, that's not a good sign if Gary shows up.
38:51 Speaker 01 Geez.
38:52 Kaelyn Moore? Usually it's like a spooky, like.
38:54 Speaker 01 I mean, sleep paralysis often is unsettling and spooky. Not that I've ever had it, but like you hear, every story you hear, it's like a weird creature. Watching you sleep or something in the corner of your room.
39:05 Speaker 02 Right.
39:06 Speaker 01 Yeah.
39:07 Speaker 02 What's interesting about the hauntings here is we have kind of, from what people have shared online, we have kind of like a general idea of what is here. But no one has gone into extreme detail with what they have felt or like truly experienced.
39:21 Speaker 01 Yeah.
39:21 Speaker 02 So I'm curious to hear and see, I guess, like what, what comes tonight? Because people have heard voices as well. So like seeing.
39:31 Speaker 01 I mean, we potentially heard singing.
39:33 Speaker 02 Someone singing. Yeah, apparently some people are being hushed by spirits. So maybe if we get a little too annoying or overbearing.
39:40 Speaker 01 Whoa.
39:40 Speaker 02 We might be.
39:42 Speaker 01 Okay. I will also acknowledge that truly that feeling has gone away. I no longer feel it and I didn't notice it until you started talking about the little girl. And like when you talked about the girl and people seeing her, I consciously was like, oh, that feeling is gone.
40:00 Speaker 02 Huh, huh. Whoa. Do you feel like it's because we stopped talking about the Corwins or because she's like a good?
40:08 Speaker 01 We're gonna find out.
40:08 Speaker 02 To be determined?
40:09 Speaker 01 Whoa, okay. So the full extent of what we're gonna do tonight is gonna be on your feed. I'm really excited. This made me a little bit more spooked though, to do it, but I'm really excited.
40:19 Speaker 02 I told you this, but usually we kind of try to go in a little bit blind because I like to not have anything predetermined or like sway my experience and like.
40:34 Speaker 01 Yeah.
40:35 Speaker 02 Like, I don't want to be like, oh, this happened and it must be that because we learned about the history. Sometimes it's really cool of like not really know anything about it and have something happen and be like then learn about the history.
40:46 Speaker 01 Be like, oh, my gosh, that makes perfect sense. It's all connecting. So yeah, we try to get like, just like the bare bones usually.
40:52 Speaker 02 Yeah.
40:53 Speaker 01 And it is really interesting because every time we've done an investigation.
40:56 Speaker 02 There are very specific spirits who have appeared that align with the history, but then also the homes themselves seem to have a bit of an energy and like become its own entity as well.
41:10 Speaker 01 Also, do we all have something we're bringing in here, you know, like energy that we've brought with us? Or, you know, if you were walking around a town like Salem today, did something come with you?
41:21 Speaker 02 And I've been in like every graveyard. So probably.
41:24 Speaker 01 Yeah, I mean, they're probably curious. They're like, what are you doing tonight? Let's go.
41:28 Speaker 02 Some new entertainment.
41:29 Speaker 01 Friends at that house.
41:29 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah.
41:30 Speaker 01 Stop by. Also, someone checked out right before we checked in. So who knows how long they were here, if they communicated with anyone, if they were the ones who used the Ouija board that's tucked away in a creepy cupboard.
41:41 Speaker 02 True. Yeah.
41:42 Speaker 01 Yeah.
41:42 Speaker 02 Whoa. Okay. Well, let's get to it.
41:45 Speaker 01 Stay tuned.
41:46 Speaker 02 Stay tuned. Okay.
41:47 Speaker 01 Wish us luck.
41:50 Kaelyn Moore? Thank you, guys, for listening. And remember, if you want to listen to or watch us contact some ghosts in part two, make sure you check out Two Girls, One Ghost wherever you get your podcasts and on YouTube, starting February 25th. Part two will only be available on their feed, so please go say hi and let me know what you think. And that voice we heard humming coming from inside the house, yeah, that's not the last time we heard from her that night. She had something really important that she was trying to tell us. Okay, I will see you later this week for our regular programming where I'm going to tell you the very dark story of a recent cult. But until then, stay curious. Ooh.
42:37 Kaelyn Moore? Do you want more darkly curious stories in your life? Sign up for our Patreon for free and get access to a rotating shelf of bonus content, our weekly Rogue Detecting Society newsletter, and the HSP Book Club. Paid members also get monthly bonus episodes and archive access, which I think is more than 40 episodes at this point. You also get a cool jinx sticker after your first three months. And you can check it all out with a free seven day trial. Link in the bio or go to patreon.com backslash heartstartspounding. But whatever you do, stay curious.
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