NEIL PATRICK HARRIS on How I Met Your Mother, Coming Out & Why Fatherhood is His Greatest Job

Neil Patrick Harris is an Emmy and Tony award-winning actor, and for many of us, he’ll forever be the LEGEND-wait for it-DARY Barney Stinson from How I Met Your Mother. Born in New Mexico to parents who were both lawyers, Neil was the first in his family to go into showbiz. At just 12, he got his breakthrough role in Clara's Heart alongside Whoopi Goldberg. From there, the rest is history… In this episode, Neil shares: Why he never thought he’d become a dad How he was forced to come outWhat it was really like to host the Oscars in 2015 How much of Barney Stinson is him and what HIMYM taught him Neil is a reminder that you never stop learning throughout your career. There is always something new to discover… and how incredible is that? Neil Patrick Harris is Great Company. Neil’s latest film, Sunny Dancer, is out on the 14th August #sunnydancermovie If you enjoyed the show, you can also follow us: Instagram - @greatcompanypodcast TikTok - @greatcompanypodcast Jamie - @jamielaing And if you've got thoughts, questions and comments, you can email us at: [email protected] THE CREDITS Producer: Helen Burke Assistant Producer: Issy Weeks-Hankins Video: Josh Bennett Senior Social Media Manager: Laura Coughlan Audio: Rafi Amsili Geovannetti Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  When you were shooting How I Met Your Mother, you filmed over 200 episodes.

• 0:02Speaker 01

  It was kind of a dream job.

• 0:07Speaker 00

  No, unacceptable. I'm so not Raven. How much of Barney is you, would you say? Can you just once be cool? Oh, no. What'd you fight about? Gotcha. Nice.

• 0:22Speaker 01

  Oh, I think.

• 0:27Speaker 01

  Hi, I'm Neil Patrick Harris, and I'm in Great Company.

• 0:34Speaker 01

  Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome.

• 0:36Speaker 00

  If I push you, could you cry on cue?

• 0:37Speaker 01

  And I'm sorry, it's happening right now.

• 0:40Speaker 00

  It's okay.

• 0:41Speaker 01

  He embarrassed me, and it made me feel really uncomfortable.

• 0:48Speaker 00

  Actually getting teary.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  Is it good?

• 0:49Speaker 00

  Yeah, that was nice.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  Thanks. I'm not a great crier. I've cried more in the last three or four years than I've ever cried in my whole life. Because of being a father. They're teenagers now, and they're cunts.

• 1:04Speaker 01

  I knew that I was gay when I was, you know, in my early teens. And so I never really imagined that as like the probable outcome, being a parent.

• 1:14Speaker 00

  Being how famous you were, and then coming out as gay. Was it hard for you at the time?

• 1:20Speaker 01

  I was a little bit offended that more people weren't surprised. I expected a little more, wait, what? Him? He's so mask.

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• 4:41Speaker 00

  Guys, welcome back to Great Company. I'm beyond excited today because we have Neil Patrick Harris. I'm gonna say it again, Neil Patrick Harris on Great Company. I mean, we talk about so many amazing things. Get ready for this episode because it goes all over the place. Now, before we start, I would just like to ask one thing, which is if you can subscribe to our show. It takes one second, it's completely free, and it makes us keep getting the guests that you want and keep making a better show for you. So join the amazing community that already subscribed already. All right, here we go. Enjoy this wild episode of Great Company with Neil Patrick Harris.

• 5:15Speaker 00

  Okay, team, tell me when.

• 5:17Speaker 01

  How many of these do you do? Every day?

• 5:20Speaker 00

  Not every day. I would do it every day, but I do it like two, three a week.

• 5:24Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 5:24Speaker 00

  But we just have.

• 5:25Speaker 01

  Do they come out weekly?

• 5:26Speaker 00

  They come out weekly, every week. So this one is coming out next week.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 5:29Speaker 00

  So let's make it a good one.

• 5:32Speaker 00

  If you can, if you could cry at some point, that's great for clips.

• 5:36Speaker 01

  What are you doing with my crying voice?

• 5:38Speaker 00

  You have a crying voice?

• 5:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:39Speaker 00

  What is your crying voice?

• 5:41Speaker 01

  When I was younger, I remember, I was at my Episcopal church, which is where, in small town New Mexico where we grew up. And I'm sorry, it's happening right now.

• 5:55Speaker 00

  It's okay.

• 5:57Speaker 01

  My pastor, he embarrassed me, and it made me feel really uncomfortable.

• 6:06Speaker 00

  Actually getting teary.

• 6:07Speaker 01

  Is it good?

• 6:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, that was nice.

• 6:08Speaker 01

  Thanks.

• 6:11Speaker 00

  Can you, do you, if I push you, could you cry on cue? If I, if I had, if I, you can't do that.

• 6:16Speaker 01

  I'm not a great crier, which is when I was younger and I was acting was a real triggering, like, block. Because sometimes you'd audition for a job, you'd get a job, and then you'd be on set, and you knew that one of these days they're gonna film the scene where you have to cry. And when there's a big fucking camera that is like pointing at your face for the close-up, and it's like, this is the time to cry. Go, do it. It's hard. There's a lot of pressure on that, I put it myself. So that was really challenging. And I don't, I can't do the, I don't, I don't do the stoic-faced, one tear.

• 6:56Speaker 00

  You can't do that.

• 6:57Speaker 01

  Just dripping.

• 6:58Speaker 00

  Like the Denzel Washington, that, that.

• 7:00Speaker 01

  Good God, that's impressive. My, my, my face contorts like I'm passing a stone. I change color. It's really not great.

• 7:12Speaker 00

  So you, so you really, because if we were gonna do some improv now with each other, I couldn't make you cry.

• 7:18Speaker 01

  I, I've cried more in the last three or four years than I've ever cried in my whole life. Because of being a father and having kids. Because they're teenagers now, and they're cunts.

• 7:40Speaker 01

  I can say that. I'm in the UK, right? That's a good, that's a, that's a positive thing.

• 7:44Speaker 00

  That's a positive.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  That's a positive thing. They know exactly what to say that will be the most damaging emotionally to themselves, to their siblings, to each other, and to us. And so I find myself like, like overwhelmed and rattled by just, by myself, you know?

• 8:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:08Speaker 01

  Like after conflicts that I thought would be effective that then ended in very not effective ways, and just sitting like, what? How did that go so wrong?

• 8:20Speaker 00

  I, I've just become a dad.

• 8:21Speaker 01

  Congratulations.

• 8:22Speaker 00

  Thank you so much, man. My baby is coming out to eight months old.

• 8:26Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 8:27Speaker 00

  It's like you're in, swimming in a lake, and the scenery is like so beautiful, and you're, it's like amazing, you're having the best time, everything's great. But you're waiting for the boat to come back, and the boat never comes back. And so, and you look across at my wife, and she's like, you better fucking be enjoying this. I'm like, I'm loving it. It's really fun, but I'm a little bit tired here, and I feel like I'm drowning. And my emotions now?

• 8:50Speaker 01

  That's sleep deprivation, though, isn't it?

• 8:53Speaker 00

  I was just with my buddy a second ago, right? And he's a dad, he's a dad too, and we were talking about it. And I said, I said, I'm in this stage now where if I have a conversation which is too deep about being a father, being a parent, it starts to bubble up a little bit. And I don't know why that happens.

• 9:11Speaker 01

  Well, I think, I think you're not quite so myopic and selfish, right? There's, there's repercussions and like other lives at stake, literally. You know, before you have kids, you could say, ah, fuck it, I won't do that tonight. Or let's change the plan. But you can't really change big plans. Don't you think too that you were, that you have to look at things in larger arcs now that you're a parent?

• 9:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, totally. And everything changes, your whole mindset changes towards everything. Did you always want to be a dad?

• 9:45Speaker 01

  Um, I always thought I'd be a good dad. But I I knew that I was gay when I was, you know, in my early teens.

• 9:55Speaker 00

  Uh huh.

• 9:55Speaker 01

  And so I never really imagined. That is like the probable outcome being a parent. I never even, I didn't date till super late, so I didn't. So the whole idea of like coupling up enough to then have kids seemed so far away from this story that I was currently telling. That I just never imagined it would happen.

• 10:16Speaker 00

  What do you mean you didn't, you didn't date anyone?

• 10:18Speaker 01

  Not really, no, not for a while.

• 10:21Speaker 00

  Well, because you were working so much, because.

• 10:23Speaker 01

  I was working, I dated some girls. But I was working a lot and I was, I grew up in a time in Los Angeles where. I think L A is also an interesting place to grow up because it's. Los Angeles is filled with these little pockets of.

• 10:41Speaker 01

  Of like the entertainment industry.

• 10:43Speaker 00

  Mm hmm.

• 10:43Speaker 01

  You get in your car and you drive to a place and then you're with other people and then you all drive to another place. So you're, you're often alone and sort of isolated in this bubble of your car or your house.

• 10:52Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's a lonely place.

• 10:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, so it's not conducive to uh.

• 10:59Speaker 01

  Just wandering and meeting someone or like catching eyes with someone or going into a bar and like. Shooting the shit with someone and flirting. It's not a very flirty town.

• 11:13Speaker 00

  Is it not?

• 11:14Speaker 01

  No, and in the gay world back then was like, there was one strip called West Hollywood, which is like Santa Monica Boulevard. But that was like everyone who was there was very out and loud and proud. And I was very uh uncertain at that time of like how to stand tall with who I was. So to go to the Abbey or to go to Rage and just like belly up to the bar. It's like a first place to go is would have just been was was terrifying to me at the time. When I moved to New York or when I got to go to New York to do plays and to hang out there.

• 11:55Speaker 01

  Very different experience because there's so many places to go and people really don't care. Cause everyone's.

• 12:03Speaker 00

  Just doing it and.

• 12:03Speaker 01

  Hooking and doing their own thing and, you know, in their own world and. Most people come to New York because they wanna live life with a capital L, you know? So then when you're there and you're feeling weird, oh my god, I'm on a date. Is anyone looking at me? I don't know what's happening.

• 12:20Speaker 00

  Really?

• 12:21Speaker 01

  Oh, like, wow, no one cares at all.

• 12:22Speaker 00

  No one cares. But in, but in L A, they do care.

• 12:26Speaker 01

  Uh, in my mind, they did. I don't know if they actually did, but maybe they actually did because when I was. Times are so different now, you know?

• 12:34Speaker 00

  Can I ask you a personal question and feel free not to answer? I'm sure you've been asked it a lot of times, being in the industry that you were and being how famous you were. And then how, coming out as gay, was it a tough moment?

• 12:48Speaker 01

  Um, no, it was an inevitability at the time. I had started dating David, who's now my husband, David Burtka. Um, well before I auditioned for How I Met Your Mother. And when I got the job, everyone on that show knew David, knew that we were a couple. Um, but that was at a time when there were bloggers on uh, on the internet. Uh, and that you would go to to like read the salacious, you know, try to guess who this actor is that's gay and in the closet kind of comment, right? And so there was a. A fear that I would be like the next target on that.

• 13:33Speaker 01

  And David and I would go to movie premieres together, but. Like I would walk the carpet and he would go around the other side of the photographers. Because we weren't a couple, we could justify it and and say. That's our private life, which it was, and we don't need to sort of parade. Stuff around and ask too many questions. I'm here for work. I have a career, so does he, which was all very true. Um, but intrinsically makes David potentially feel less than. If I'm getting to walk a carpet while he's like skulking behind, right?

• 14:12Speaker 01

  Um, and then sure enough, the the target came towards me in a very weird way. Uh, um. A comment had come out that. Uh, that I had said that I wasn't of that persuasion, which was the quoted phrase. Like someone asked a publicist.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  About my sexuality and the publicist said I was not of that persuasion. That turned into a, that's weird for him to say. Because we know that he's gay and he's like, what a weird, why is he doing that? And so then it became, I, you, I'm gonna have to say something, I've gotta get ahead of the story.

• 14:53Speaker 00

  You have to control that.

• 14:53Speaker 01

  Cause I don't wanna be coming out in in reaction to. Um, if anyone has any information on.

• 15:01Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 15:02Speaker 01

  Neil Patrick Harris and have you ever slept with him? Please come forward, right? You don't want those stories. And so we, like I crafted uh, with the help of my then agent Bo Schut. And my publicist, like we worked really hard to make a statement that was authentic to me. Um, and that was really truthful. And so we released that statement. Then I, I think at that point I was a little scared that, like what would come from that? Like what kind of stigma would come from that? At that time. There were people that would go and and plant, you know, God hates fags signs on lawns of people, right?

• 15:43Speaker 01

  So it was a potential to be like a bad week. Um, and none of that transpired. There was uh indifference at best. Um, there were a lot of people before my coming out that had a much harder time. And that allowed, I I guess paved the way for me to be able to come out in a way. I was, I I I'm a little bit offended that more people weren't surprised.

• 16:20Speaker 01

  I expected a little more, wait, what? Him? He's so mask.

• 16:28Speaker 01

  So the little indifference to me was a little, oh, come on, really?

• 16:34Speaker 01

  You didn't imagine me. On a private island with Jennifer Love Hewitt? No, that wasn't your image about me.

• 16:44Speaker 00

  Ah.

• 16:45Speaker 01

  But I think, you know. Now that we live in much different times and.

• 16:50Speaker 00

  Totally.

• 16:50Speaker 01

  Whoever you're thinking about when you're jerking off, like that's who you should be proud to try and attract.

• 16:58Speaker 00

  Damn, straight.

• 17:02Speaker 00

  Who in your life throughout your career has really been one of your mentors?

• 17:06Speaker 01

  Hmm. When I was younger, uh, there was a man named Stephen Bocchko. He uh was a very prolific uh television producer and writer. He wrote a show called Hill Street Blues, he wrote a show called L A Law. Um, and he wrote uh Doogie Howser M D. And he was massively successful. And uh, and he gave me a lot of lessons really early on as someone who had never been in the industry at all. And sort of, you know, kept tabs on me and checked in. He had great things to say.

• 17:44Speaker 00

  Um, is he sitting around?

• 17:47Speaker 01

  He's not, he passed um, a few years back. He was really smart. He said one great thing that I've said before, but I I find it a good lesson. He said, the industry of entertainment is a bit like surfing.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  Because you have to want to surf and get on a uh, a surfboard and like paddle out and paddle out. And paddle out and paddle out and then be with a bunch of other surfers. And then you just like sit there for ages, waiting until a wave comes. And then you try and you get and you go as fast and you kick and you kick and you try and you miss the wave. And then fuck, and you have to turn around and paddle back and wait. And you do this over and over and eventually you'll catch a wave. And the wave is amazing and exhilarating and you take it as far as you can, you know? And you eventually the wave ends and you wipe out or not. And then you have to sort of turn around, much like fame or the industry. And then you have to, fuck, fuck, and you're right back in it.

• 18:48Speaker 01

  You have to paddle back out, get hit by waves that other people are riding and get like nailed by them. And try not to drown and then get back up and paddle back out and wait for a whole nother set of waves to come back in.

• 19:03Speaker 00

  That's such a great analogy.

• 19:04Speaker 01

  And it is a good analogy because it's really, really true, at least in the entertainment world.

• 19:08Speaker 00

  And even though you, do you still feel that sometimes?

• 19:11Speaker 01

  Oh, a hundred percent.

• 19:12Speaker 00

  You're serious? You know, weirdly, that's quite refreshing to hear in a way that someone of your caliber, someone with your experience, someone with your, you know. Like library stuff you've done, you still feel like you need a paddle and you still feel like you need a surf.

• 19:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, but of course, because I think if you feel like everything that you do is going to succeed. Um, that hubris is bad karma and it rarely winds up being that way. And there's so much of the creative algorithm that is so random. You know, you can put all these great actors into a movie and it just doesn't work.

• 19:52Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 19:52Speaker 01

  They don't get along or there's.

• 19:54Speaker 00

  Like cats, like cats.

• 19:59Speaker 01

  The CG is not where it needs to be at that point. The fingers are weird, whatever it is. But you could also find like a random thing that shouldn't be good that turns out to be great. You know what I mean? And so all you try and do is like, all I try and do is just the best work I can with any of the circumstances and hope. If you can do work that you're like, you can create work that you think is going to be exciting and it's exciting to create. Say you're writing a play.

• 20:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:31Speaker 01

  If you can have fun writing the play and then you can have fun performing the play, then you assume that the people watching it will have fun. And if not, that's sort of out of your control. So I, I try to find things that I think will be fun to do in all three of those phases.

• 20:47Speaker 00

  When you were shooting How I Met Your Mother.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 20:50Speaker 00

  And something like that becomes so successful, right? And so big, you filmed over 200 episodes.

• 20:57Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 20:57Speaker 00

  Which is wild. Is that an enjoyable time while you're doing it? Or is it a bit like struggling because you also want to do other things? Do you see what I'm trying to say?

• 21:08Speaker 01

  For sure. Uh, I think it was both. But we only filmed for half of the year, really. Cause you're only doing 22 episodes. So that's 22 weeks out of the year that you're filming. You got every fourth week off while the writers kind of kept writing and tightened things up. It was kind of the dream job.

• 21:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 21:30Speaker 01

  Monday, you'd go in for a table read where you'd sit around a table and you'd read the script. So that the network people could hear it, the writers could hear it. They'd know what was landing and wasn't. You'd go home, you'd work for one hour on Monday. Tuesday, you'd go in 10 a.m. You'd rehearse the scenes with the director and just the cast. And then at like lunchtime, 15 people would come in. You'd like put it on like a play. People would laugh, whatever, you go home. Then Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, you'd film. If you weren't in the scenes, you didn't have to be there. And we filmed it like it was a sitcom.

• 22:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 22:04Speaker 01

  So we didn't have a studio audience, but we, you know, we had the cameras as if it was a studio audience. And then you just got to play for three days. Fantastic. It was the best job. So, no, I, I mean, all, everyone wants to be doing something that they're not. So you're doing a TV show that's great. Inevitably, you like wish that you could be in a Marvel franchise or something. I don't know. Or like, I should be on Broadway, but instead I'm on television. But nah, I mean, and I, well, I say all of us. I, I was about to single myself out because Barney Stinson as a character was so, was so great to play.

• 22:43Speaker 01

  Oftentimes when you're not the protagonist on a sitcom, you are some singular archetype that sometimes is, is derogatory in some way. You're like this nerdy guy that's always nerdy and every joke is how nerdy you are, right? But Barney was just like, he was the best. He was delusional in his enthusiasm for adventure. And I was like, what a great part to play.

• 23:08Speaker 00

  But it's, it's also, we were talking about earlier, it's one of the best characters ever. Like, and that's your creation, that was you, that's, it's just.

• 23:15Speaker 01

  I liked the back and forth with the, with the writing staff. They'd write crazy shit for me to do. And I think in my dream imagination, they would write something and think, oh, I wonder what Neil's gonna do with that. And then, then I'd get to say, oh, oh, you've written this? Oh, what? Just you wait, let me show you what I could do with that.

• 23:34Speaker 00

  Just go with it.

• 23:34Speaker 01

  So I would like, yeah, level up. They'd often tell me to, you know, why don't we just do what was written on the page?

• 23:41Speaker 00

  And you were like, that's not good. I felt like that was good. They're like, no, that's wrong.

• 23:44Speaker 01

  You don't have to chew on the scenery. Like it's actual scenery.

• 23:48Speaker 00

  Eating the table.

• 23:50Speaker 01

  No, but they'd write stuff like Barney's sick and he, he has a sneezing fit unlike any sneezing fit that has ever been seen on television. So that would be like something written on the page and I would just smile and be like, I cannot wait. I cannot wait to film that. And then I'd put out my back.

• 24:11Speaker 01

  But it was worth it. So that was great.

• 24:14Speaker 00

  How, how much of, how much of Barney is you, would you say?

• 24:17Speaker 01

  Oh, like as a number? Six.

• 24:21Speaker 00

  I like that.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  Out of?

• 24:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 24:25Speaker 01

  Six out of?

• 24:26Speaker 00

  A hundred.

• 24:27Speaker 01

  That's right. Six out of six. No, um, it was a lot of me. A lot of me. But yeah, and yet also like none of me was fun. It was fun to be like this serial, uh, womanizer, straight guy. That was very sort of college frat, you know? Let's all go get a car and set something on fire. We got this victorious secret party, let's go, right? That's very much not like me.

• 25:04Speaker 01

  And yet in certain ways. Well, because there's other things that I'm super excited about.

• 25:08Speaker 00

  Yeah. So you find that and you bring it into that space, right?

• 25:11Speaker 01

  You can ask my friends how excited I get when, uh, an escape room is an option.

• 25:17Speaker 00

  Shout out, you, you like it that much?

• 25:18Speaker 01

  Oh my God. Do you not?

• 25:21Speaker 00

  I, I, I do.

• 25:23Speaker 01

  When was the last time you went to an escape room?

• 25:25Speaker 00

  I, I did it about two years ago. I took my team, maybe three years ago.

• 25:28Speaker 01

  Oh, okay. Wait, hold on, your team? What does that mean?

• 25:31Speaker 00

  I took the team from here in the building. So I took some of these guys and we were, we were working in a different office at that time. We took, and I, and I liked it, but it was a very, it was a stressful time.

• 25:39Speaker 01

  Right. You need to go with people that aren't your team.

• 25:43Speaker 00

  Oh, you go, you go solo escape rooming?

• 25:45Speaker 01

  No, no, we're like friends.

• 25:50Speaker 00

  I thought you'd just go, you hang out at a skate room and go, guys, you wanna come in?

• 25:55Speaker 01

  You guys need a sex?

• 25:58Speaker 01

  No, I think sometimes when it's team building escape rooms, there's like weird pressures that are there. Cause everyone feels obliged to perform and stuff.

• 26:06Speaker 00

  You take your friends, it makes sense.

• 26:08Speaker 01

  You take your friends to an escape room, but I, I get equally enthusiastic. I did the traitor's live experience recently. Have you done that?

• 26:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, I did it the other day and I won, don't worry.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  I won too.

• 26:17Speaker 00

  Yeah, but I think we can probably manipulate in a good way. I'm, I, that sounds bad. I'm, it's a manipulation in a good way.

• 26:24Speaker 01

  Was everyone, uh, part of the team? There was just another team?

• 26:29Speaker 00

  It was, it was, it was still a team thing. Yeah. I promise you, I have friends.

• 26:34Speaker 01

  Was everyone at the traitor's table, someone that you knew?

• 26:37Speaker 00

  Typically, a couple of people we didn't, but I, I knew them from someone else. So we, yeah, everyone.

• 26:42Speaker 01

  We were like half and half.

• 26:44Speaker 00

  Oh, you went with, so wait.

• 26:45Speaker 01

  We went with a group, but they need to fill up the whatever 12, 16 things. So there were some people that we decidedly didn't know.

• 26:54Speaker 00

  And when they saw that Neil Patrick Harris was in there, did they freak out?

• 26:58Speaker 01

  Um, I don't know about freak out, but it was, it made it a unique playing environment.

• 27:06Speaker 00

  And they're never gonna call you out. They're never gonna say.

• 27:09Speaker 01

  No, the opposite. They called me out in the most amazing way. This one girl Natalie, who was sitting next to us, she was fantastic. And we happened to just be sitting next to each other. And at one point I look at her and, and I say, are you, under my breath, are you a traitor? And she goes, no, are you? And I was like, no. And she goes, good. And then for the rest of the time, she was like, I'm absolutely not a traitor. And I know that Neil's not either. And we're gonna, we're gonna win this whole thing. And so we went and we got down and I was totally a traitor the whole time, right? And so I was having to look at friends, my friend Emily, who gives me a look like, you can tell me like, let's cut this shit. You can tell me. She gives me a look like, are you a traitor? Like really truthfully. And I say, no, are you a traitor? And she goes, no. And I was like, good. I was totally lying to her face.

• 27:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, same.

• 27:55Speaker 01

  And at the very end, it was like four of us and Natalie was convinced. She's like, I promise everyone, I swear on everything I know, I'm not a traitor. And I know Neil's not either. And so it must be you too.

• 28:10Speaker 00

  And you're thinking Natalie, you fucking idiot.

• 28:12Speaker 01

  No, I wasn't thinking fucking idiot. I was actually thinking, oh, this is gonna, this is gonna be so tough to like, have to look her in the eyes and say I'm a traitor. And she was so gutted and mad. But that was the game. Loved traitor's live. That, I thought, I thought that was really well done.

• 28:27Speaker 00

  It's amazing. It's very good. Can, can I ask, um, did you ever worry about being typecast?

• 28:33Speaker 01

  Uh, yes. But I don't in hindsight, know what I was.

• 28:39Speaker 00

  Worried about.

• 28:40Speaker 01

  What I was tired of being typecast as, right? Because my first big job was Doogie Howser.

• 28:45Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:46Speaker 01

  Which was four years on a really like well-received, uh, medical show.

• 28:54Speaker 01

  So I guess I didn't want to be typecast as that, but that was such a weird unicorn of a, of a job. Like I don't think I would only be super smart doctors for the rest of my life, right? I wasn't worried about being typecast as that. But I was worried that, that I might only be typecast, only be thought of as that.

• 29:15Speaker 00

  Look, I think it's really natural. And I think what's so interesting is you said, is that it doesn't really matter what you're doing. You're kind of always a little bit envious of other people, what they're doing. And everyone seems to be envious because.

• 29:24Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 29:25Speaker 00

  You, you're, you're in one of the biggest TV shows in the world. But yet there's a probably feels like a sense of like dissatisfaction because you're not doing, I don't know, Avengers or whatever is it that you're doing?

• 29:36Speaker 01

  For sure. And back then, when you were on a television show, you were working super hard, but it was, at the time it felt a second tier to like the movie world. Like there were movie people and then there were television people. And so you'd be doing great, great work, but it wasn't, um, valued at the same rate. And when you're 19 and 20 years old, that kind of validation means more to you, right? And so, uh, especially back then, you were declared sort of one or the other. You couldn't really, it wasn't streaming services and stuff where you could do a limited mini series and then go do a movie and then do a play. You were kind of a TV person.

• 30:19Speaker 01

  And so, uh, I was worried about sort of being typecast as that. But that has fueled me to go and do, um, I just continued, I'm pretty voracious in wanting to just do totally different weird things.

• 30:34Speaker 00

  Yeah. And that's what's, you know, you go from doing something like that to doing like Gone Girl and all these incredible things. And you know, the big, I have something in, in life which is called a BHAG, right? Which is called a big hairy audacious girl. You can take that with you if you want.

• 30:46Speaker 01

  Hairy or?

• 30:47Speaker 00

  Big hairy.

• 30:48Speaker 01

  Audacious?

• 30:49Speaker 00

  Girl.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  Oh, girl, I just said girl.

• 30:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 30:54Speaker 00

  I'm a big hairy audacious girl.

• 30:58Speaker 01

  I think you found your drag name.

• 30:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, I got it.

• 30:59Speaker 01

  BHAG.

• 31:00Speaker 00

  BHAG. But I had this thing called a BHAG, right? Which is in life, which I think in life you kind of want to have a North Star in a way. And your North Star can kind of be anything that you want it to be. My BHAG is I want to host the Oscars.

• 31:13Speaker 00

  You've done that.

• 31:13Speaker 01

  I have.

• 31:14Speaker 00

  Firstly, what was it like? And secondly, is it as magical as I think it is or is it not?

• 31:22Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 31:26Speaker 01

  To be super honest, because I appreciate your candor and your honesty in these conversations. I think to spend any time

• 31:36Speaker 01

  talking about how it's not magical or fun seem what will be like out of context seem like I'm talking shit about something randomly, right?

• 31:49Speaker 01

  It's, I was so honored to be asked to be a part of it. It's a very masochistic endeavor. It's a, it's a nearly impossible

• 32:01Speaker 01

  job to succeed in.

• 32:05Speaker 00

  Hundred percent.

• 32:06Speaker 01

  Just because.

• 32:06Speaker 00

  It's impossible. Everyone has an opinion.

• 32:09Speaker 01

  Everyone has opinions. Most people just watch the Oscars in their sweatpants at home, hoping that someone trips on steps and they can point at them and laugh, right? Or like looking at their office pool or trying to win. You know, it's, no one's really caring about the machinations behind it. I was most interested in how it worked. Like that's when I've hosted the Tonys, a much of an easier job in a way because the Tonys is all people that are in shows together that, that are really excited that a million people are getting to watch them instead of a thousand people. And there, it's all performance based. So you're like, yay, next up, this amazing performance, next up, this amazing performance.

• 32:49Speaker 01

  With the Oscars, it was just more challenging because you're dealing with pockets of people who don't know each other, who are nominated against each other for movies that they made two years ago. They've since made another movie and they're right now filming another movie. They've gone through the gauntlet of films so much that they all know who's going to win all of these awards. So four out of the five best actress nominees are there, still have to like starve themselves, wear a dress that they can't get out of to sit there and lose once again to whomever, right? That weird energy of like,

• 33:28Speaker 01

  we almost get to go home or get to go to Gyo series after party. It'll be over soon enough. And so you're there. So that's a weird audience. And so you just do your best. And I was just trying to make it entertaining for the the crowd at home, obviously.

• 33:45Speaker 00

  But then you also have to play the room at the same time.

• 33:46Speaker 01

  But then play in the room at the same time.

• 33:47Speaker 00

  Which is a hard thing to navigate.

• 33:49Speaker 01

  I thought I was doing a really good job.

• 33:51Speaker 00

  You nailed it, man. One of my favorites. I swear to God.

• 33:53Speaker 01

  Every year, uh, when the, the Google alert for my name goes off around Oscar week, and listed as like a top worst Oscar host of all time. It's a great thing to read. See like multitudes of like top 10 worst Oscar hosts ever. And so that's like, that's, that's what it is. Yeah. Yes, you get to say that you hosted the Oscars and then you also get to deal with like.

• 34:17Speaker 00

  Aftermath. Listen, I've got, I, I got a Google alert, right? Which said, top 10 best dressed people. GQ.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 34:26Speaker 00

  Don't worry about it. I open the email.

• 34:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:30Speaker 00

  I go to the site.

• 34:30Speaker 01

  I'm guessing number seven.

• 34:32Speaker 00

  Okay, well, you, you, you, you. Top 10. It's David Beckham.

• 34:36Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 34:38Speaker 00

  Neil Patrick Harris was probably up there.

• 34:40Speaker 01

  Really?

• 34:40Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think so.

• 34:41Speaker 01

  I don't remember getting that alert.

• 34:43Speaker 00

  Harry Styles was in.

• 34:44Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 34:45Speaker 00

  I went all the way down. I was like, I'm not on the top 10 best dressed. I go to the next page. Top 10 worst dressed. I was number two.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  No. I don't know if you've. Lumped in with the best dressed.

• 35:00Speaker 00

  I don't know if you've had an emotion of pure excitement dramatically drop to pure disappointment. That emotion doesn't really happen back to back like that quickly.

• 35:10Speaker 01

  Did you agree when you saw the picture of yourself?

• 35:12Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't wear loafers that look like that with, I would think I was holding an umbrella. The whole thing was.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  I'm so sorry.

• 35:21Speaker 01

  But yes, the Oscars is great, is was great fun.

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• 38:06Speaker 00

  Looking back at your kind of like history and what you've done. It's, it's, it's like insane what you have done from like such a young age.

• 38:15Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 38:16Speaker 00

  That gets, it's crazy. And I like being a child star and becoming famous so young. And then growing up, especially in that time of Hollywood and LA where

• 38:27Speaker 00

  it was a different time. That would be hard to make friends, to date, to do anything because you were so famous. And that, especially being young, because I feel like when you gain fame from such a young age, you have to grow up quite quickly. You don't get to experience the same things that young kids get to do. You don't get, really get to go to prom or have your like, I, I don't know. Did you feel that?

• 38:48Speaker 01

  Some ways. I mean, I went to prom. I spent half of my high school year back in New Mexico, going to my public school that I went to from, you know, from when I first started. But I don't know that there's a singular

• 39:06Speaker 01

  adolescent track that everyone's supposed to follow. There's not a script that is like normal childhood, childhood, growing up, no matter where you are, right?

• 39:16Speaker 00

  But yours was.

• 39:17Speaker 01

  Mine was super.

• 39:18Speaker 00

  Super different.

• 39:19Speaker 01

  It was very different. I, I, I was required to operate in a very adult scenario. I couldn't really just fuck off and act like a kid. If I, you know, I couldn't be petulant because I was being paid to work around adults who are working. So I witnessed petulance from people and it's just a time suck and a waste of energy. So I got good at, at knowing how to not waste time. So I guess that was good and effective. And I guess in some ways I regret that there was no chapter of anonymity where I could

• 40:00Speaker 01

  be and explore random potential versions of the multiplicities of myself. You know what I mean? Because people were sort of watching.

• 40:10Speaker 00

  Watching, so you couldn't do that.

• 40:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. So like, like getting stupid drunk at a bar or deciding to wear all black and mascara and like go goth to see what that feels like. You may not be goth your whole life, but it's, it's fun to have the freedom to do it and, and live it, to try it. But I got to experience some of those things as a performer. So I don't really regret it like woe is me, I didn't get to do it.

• 40:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 40:36Speaker 01

  Cause I played roles where I got to fully, you know, live within other characters that other people didn't get to do. So I'm a big firm believer that we are kind of the aggregate of our lives. And we all have a handful of stuff that is profoundly challenging. And some is of abusive nature and some is of, of loneliness, isolation nature. And, you know, and I think our life job is to come to terms with what our stuff was and still continue to make knowingly

• 41:21Speaker 01

  good decisions when we have the opportunity.

• 41:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, you're sorry. We all have a boulder that we're pushing up a hill. Every single person has that kind of boulder that we're sort of pushing and everyone's is different, right? But we'll have our certain things. Did you always know that you wanted to go into entertainment?

• 41:36Speaker 01

  I was always unafraid to perform in front of people. But I grew up in a very small town in New Mexico, so I didn't know that I would go into entertainment because that really wasn't an option. But I was certainly drawn to singing, sang in the adult church choir in our tiny Episcopal church when I was like nine, eight, nine years old.

• 41:58Speaker 00

  And you were good.

• 42:00Speaker 01

  I could sing the Hallelujah chorus.

• 42:02Speaker 00

  Get out of here.

• 42:03Speaker 01

  Like a motherfucker.

• 42:07Speaker 00

  How does it go?

• 42:08Speaker 01

  King of kings forever and ever. Hallelujah, hallelujah. Yep. And it goes higher and higher and higher. It keeps going. But my testicles had not dropped at that point.

• 42:21Speaker 01

  So I was always kind of the kid in the small town that would, that would be asked to be in plays or to do stuff and I didn't have much, much fear about that. So if, if circumstances hadn't been what they were, I probably would have gone and studied musical theatre somewhere or been in like one of those theme park review shows, you know, where you do a bunch of costumes, do like the fifty's sock hop number and then all of a sudden you're tap dancing.

• 42:51Speaker 00

  You'd, I always think that I would have been great on a cruise.

• 42:54Speaker 01

  Cruise would have been fun.

• 42:55Speaker 00

  Man, I would have killed that. I would have murdered that and loved it.

• 42:58Speaker 01

  I always have, I always have admiration for the chorus members of shows.

• 43:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:04Speaker 01

  That do that, that are working harder than the star.

• 43:06Speaker 00

  Hundred percent.

• 43:07Speaker 01

  They, changing costumes all the time.

• 43:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:09Speaker 01

  They have, they, they, they're learning the tracks of the other people. So when someone's sick, they can take their, you know, they have to do their track. They're incredibly challenging jobs.

• 43:17Speaker 00

  But I think they're having fun because I think on those ships is everyone gets laid with each other.

• 43:23Speaker 01

  That's the dream, right?

• 43:25Speaker 00

  They're young and, they're young and being paid.

• 43:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:27Speaker 00

  They don't have to pay rent. They're just on a ship and they're just getting laid.

• 43:30Speaker 01

  Who's next?

• 43:31Speaker 00

  Let's go.

• 43:35Speaker 01

  My cruise ship experience is only on Disney cruises.

• 43:38Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 43:38Speaker 01

  Which are fantastic.

• 43:39Speaker 00

  What happens?

• 43:41Speaker 01

  Well, I'm a gigantic Disney fan.

• 43:45Speaker 01

  I like the movies. I like the princesses, fine. But the theme parks, they're so next level. They're so great, the way that they can navigate everyone's enjoyment and I love it so much. And so the cruise ship is no different. Like they have figured out how to provide entertainment for everyone, whether you're three, whether you're ninety-three. And to see the machinations and how it works, I just love it.

• 44:11Speaker 00

  I can't wait for the moment when I tell, my, my baby's called Ziggy, he's a boy. And I can't wait to have that moment where I say to him, we're going to Disneyland. And he's, and he's gonna freak out. Oh, yeah, I can't wait for it.

• 44:23Speaker 01

  I just went to Disneyland Paris.

• 44:25Speaker 00

  It's quite shit.

• 44:27Speaker 01

  Do you think so?

• 44:28Speaker 00

  A little bit.

• 44:28Speaker 01

  I love, when was the last time you went?

• 44:30Speaker 00

  I went like ten years ago.

• 44:31Speaker 01

  Oh, you gotta go back. There's a second part now.

• 44:33Speaker 00

  Really? Oh, there is?

• 44:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:37Speaker 01

  It's good, good stuff there. Phantom Manor is there.

• 44:42Speaker 00

  It's great.

• 44:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:43Speaker 00

  So getting back to the, your early career, right? When you get your first role with Whoopi Goldberg, right? And you're so young, you're thirteen years old, fifteen years old.

• 44:52Speaker 01

  Younger, twelve.

• 44:53Speaker 00

  You were twelve? That's kind of wild to be thrown into something like that from such a young age and navigating that whole experience. Like, like who's teaching you to navigate life? Who's with you? Your parents? How does it even work?

• 45:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, one of my parents, my parents were both attorneys at the time. So my dad, I think, stayed back. We filmed that in a state called Maryland in a town outside of Baltimore called Saint Michael's. And no, I, it was just like a weird field trip, you know? It didn't feel like life was changing. It was just so weird to get a movie script Fedexed to you in small town New Mexico that was from Warner Brothers, you know, that was just, felt so strange. Because we would go visit Universal Studios every year.

• 45:46Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 45:46Speaker 01

  And so that was Hollywood to us, was a tram tour and like King Kong shaking, shaking things up and being asked to be, you know, like driving in the tram past the set of a show. So it was all so removed. So suddenly to be auditioning for a thing and then all of a sudden getting it going was just all new information. It was so great. Whoopi Goldberg is.

• 46:10Speaker 00

  Oh, phenomenal, right?

• 46:11Speaker 01

  Have you ever interviewed her?

• 46:12Speaker 00

  I've never interviewed her, I've never met her, but I grew up with her films.

• 46:15Speaker 01

  She's great.

• 46:16Speaker 00

  Right?

• 46:17Speaker 01

  And the Whoopi that you see on camera is very much the same Whoopi that you see in real life. She's super authentic. She's super chill. And she was incredibly gracious with educating me about how things worked. I mean, that was a really stellar first movie to do.

• 46:37Speaker 00

  Because you have like a mentor almost, like in your, someone who, and you, you said that you were treated like an adult.

• 46:42Speaker 01

  For sure. Well, I had to be because I was, I was the lead in the movie. So everyone had to treat me very like, had, everyone made sure that I was behaving like an adult because we had a lot of work to do, right? So you had Robert Mulligan, who was the director, you know, he directed To Kill a Mockingbird. You have Freddie Francis was the director of photography, you know, he's one of the best in, he was one of the best in the whole world. And then you have Whoopi Goldberg, who is really, really talented and skilled. So I got to witness how a Dolly track worked and what marks were, under the tutelage of people who were making big movies. It felt really great.

• 47:25Speaker 01

  I know that a lot of people don't have that experience. Sometimes you work with a A-list star and you never see them and they only show up and they're always kind of cranky and, and you, you know, you, you.

• 47:35Speaker 00

  Don't say that about Chino. That's not fair.

• 47:40Speaker 01

  I've been around people who are being paid really well to do a really great project and then it seems as they're doing it that they wish that they were doing anything but the project. And that's fine because a movie's a different beast. It's an editor's medium. You film a bunch of things and you hope that the end result is good. That's how a lot of movies are made, I think. Weirdly, Sunny Dancer, the, the reason that I'm here in London talking about stuff was kind of the opposite of that experience because it was a small group of actors and a great writer-director in George Jakes that was all excited to be together. So we're making

• 48:22Speaker 01

  this movie. It was kind of the opposite of like the Hollywood movie style. And that, that I'm more drawn to now that I'm older.

• 48:30Speaker 00

  So elaborate on that. So Sunny Dancer, why, why are you drawn to, really drawn to something like this?

• 48:37Speaker 01

  Well, I'm drawn to two things, authenticity and creativity.

• 48:43Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 48:43Speaker 01

  Those are my two sort of pillars.

• 48:44Speaker 00

  And explain those two for me.

• 48:46Speaker 01

  I've always been a creative person. So the creativity sort of is something that I'm, I'm more interested in fiction books than non-fiction books. I, I didn't go to college, so I don't have a lot of education as far as business management and things like that. So I'm just more interested in the creative things. They turn me on more. So anything that's creative in its, in its base is something that I follow. Authenticity, I don't know, through lots of reason and circumstance, I guess, in life, I'm just drawn to something that seems legit, that doesn't have a lot of agenda.

• 49:27Speaker 01

  And so I'm quick to suss out if someone has an agenda or if something's inauthentic. It's sort of like why I like the Disney theme park, to go back to that, not to harp on it, but like it's super creative and it's authentic in the world that it's creating. Now, granted, super corporate, right? Like designed to have you buy the merch and watch the sequels and whatnot. But in like the theme park world of it all, it's like really authentically designed by Imagineers to make you feel like you're in a Star Wars land of Batu and everyone speaks this new language and you really feel like you're completely immersed. Immersion, I love. Punch drunk, sleep no more.

• 50:12Speaker 00

  Punch drunk is amazing.

• 50:13Speaker 01

  Unbelievable, right?

• 50:14Speaker 00

  Unbelievable.

• 50:15Speaker 01

  And what a great combination of the Venn diagram of creativity and authenticity.

• 50:20Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's so good. Going back to your film Sunny Dancer, what can people expect from the film?

• 50:26Speaker 01

  I think people can expect from Sunny Dancer, like a proper British, coming-of-age, horny, vibrant ensemble film of like the Guy Ritchie sort.

• 50:43Speaker 00

  Bella Ramsey, James Blunt, James Norton. I love James Norton.

• 50:46Speaker 01

  He's amazing.

• 50:47Speaker 00

  He is amazing.

• 50:48Speaker 01

  Jess Gunning.

• 50:49Speaker 00

  Amazing.

• 50:50Speaker 01

  Fantastic. The whole crew is great. What makes it, what makes I think Sunny Dancer unique is that the, the premise is predicated on the fact that the location is a camp for cancer survivors, for kids who are in sort of remission from cancer. They've gone year after year. And, and Bella Ramsey's character Ivy goes under duress because her parents say, you need to get out of the house, you should go to this camp. And so she goes and has no interest in hanging out with, you know, a bunch of chemo kids who are like being heartfelt. And she ends up finding her tribe and her family and falls in love.

• 51:33Speaker 01

  And, you know, they party and drink and sneak off and get in fights. And I play Patrick, who's the head of the camp, the president and founder of the camp. So.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  It's a really vibrant, really kinetic film with these young, this cast of young performers that are just really great in it, really winning. And as I spoke to before, they all hung out with each other between takes and everyone really coexisted, not in an inauthentic way.

• 52:06Speaker 00

  Inauthentic way.

• 52:07Speaker 01

  About, in a creative way, together in Scotland, in Glasgow, like making this movie, going on hikes on weekends, like everyone knew each, it was very small. Between takes, everyone would just sit and talk to each other. It was kind of amazing.

• 52:21Speaker 00

  But no, do you think you lead that because you've done theatre as well and because you love theatre, that theatre is very much like an ensemble piece, right? You, you, my experience, right, of theatre is where you basically become a family. I haven't done that many movies or films or TV, but that first, so do you bring that energy onto set with you where you're like, maybe, do you lead that subconsciously where you create this ensemble cast?

• 52:43Speaker 01

  No, I don't lead that at all. That's just alchemy. That's just randomness.

• 52:48Speaker 00

  Really?

• 52:48Speaker 01

  There's a lot of that that you just can't dictate. I mean, theatre does that, but it only does that for the performers, right? Because the people who design the sets, the costumes that are adjusting the sound and the lights, they're at the back of the theatre, they're in the wings. Like you get to know some people on, on set of the theatre, but it's hard to find a job where everyone is kind of united together. And it's really the small independent movie that does that best, right? TV shows, you can't really do that. It's, it's wonderful factory work.

• 53:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's boom, boom, boom.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  The writing staff is coming out with new scripts while you're performing the one that you're currently performing. Sometimes there's an audience, there's a crew, they come and go, there's 50 of them. When you're doing like a small independent film like Sunny Dancer, like everyone has got to be committed to what it is. And we were in, you know, Glasgow, it could rain any day, so we had backup scenes for in case it rained, we would pivot, suddenly be having umbrellas if we were supposed to. And it never rained, which I think speaks well for the film. But everyone like trusted each other, cared for each other, had each other's back. And I think it shows when you watch the movie.

• 54:00Speaker 01

  Because you're watching this group of, of kids live their best life for these two weeks of camp. And you realise whilst watching it, like, oh, wow, they, they're having to deal with, with life as a concept in a way that most people don't that are their age. So the fragility of time and the possibility of not seeing these same people next year hits really hard when you get to know and care about these characters. And, and I think George did that so well in this film. It's great to watch.

• 54:45Speaker 00

  The six films that changed your life, I'm gonna read them to you. Apparently, this is what you said. Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back?

• 54:52Speaker 01

  Sure. Love that movie.

• 54:54Speaker 00

  Ferris Bueller's Day Off?

• 54:54Speaker 01

  Oh, great movie.

• 54:55Speaker 00

  Unbelievable.

• 54:56Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 54:56Speaker 00

  Unbelievable. One of the greats.

• 54:58Speaker 01

  It made, it made adolescence seem so cool, like to be so smart and, and such a wise ass was great.

• 55:07Speaker 00

  It's a Wonderful Life?

• 55:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a Wonderful Life.

• 55:10Speaker 00

  Beautiful.

• 55:10Speaker 01

  It's a fantastic movie.

• 55:11Speaker 00

  Clue?

• 55:12Speaker 01

  Clue, one of the best movies of all time.

• 55:14Speaker 00

  I've never seen it.

• 55:15Speaker 01

  Really?

• 55:15Speaker 00

  I've never seen it.

• 55:16Speaker 01

  It's, it'll be based on Cluedo.

• 55:18Speaker 00

  I heard this, but I've never seen it.

• 55:20Speaker 01

  Oh, it's so funny.

• 55:21Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 55:21Speaker 01

  Tim Curry, Madeline Khan, it's a stacked cast, it's all super funny, rapid fire, verbal comedy, like Blazing Saddles funny.

• 55:35Speaker 00

  The Goonies?

• 55:36Speaker 01

  Goonies, fantastic movie.

• 55:37Speaker 00

  And Annie?

• 55:38Speaker 01

  Hmm, yeah, Annie. Annie, I knew every song from Annie at a very young age. Loved the Eileen Quinn movie. I would also add The Game, David Fincher's The Game.

• 55:49Speaker 00

  With, uh?

• 55:49Speaker 01

  I might swap out one of the others for that.

• 55:51Speaker 00

  With Michael Douglas.

• 55:52Speaker 01

  I love that.

• 55:53Speaker 00

  That's great. I used to have a recurring nightmare about that.

• 55:56Speaker 01

  Really?

• 55:56Speaker 00

  Yeah, that I was in a game. I wasn't.

• 55:59Speaker 01

  That's my dream. I swear.

• 56:02Speaker 00

  Skate room addicts, you just wanna be in that.

• 56:05Speaker 01

  If, if there's ever a scenario where someone can pay and you're like never sure of what, like if you're eating lunch and then all of a sudden someone hands you an envelope and then they leave and you don't know who they were.

• 56:15Speaker 00

  You would like that?

• 56:16Speaker 01

  Oh my God. And then you open up the envelope and it's like, you have to put the words together, realise like go downstairs and in the bucket will be a key. Ah, that's, I could do that forever and ever.

• 56:28Speaker 00

  Annie for me. The song, I think, I'm gonna, I'm gonna give it to you, ready?

• 56:33Speaker 01

  Okay, give it to me.

• 56:36Speaker 00

  Because this was my childhood.

• 56:37Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 56:39Speaker 00

  Tomorrow.

• 56:43Speaker 00

  Tomorrow, I love you tomorrow. You're only a gay away.

• 56:52Speaker 01

  You're doing good.

• 56:55Speaker 00

  Annie's unbelievable.

• 56:56Speaker 01

  Annie's great. That was a great movie. I remember Annie was the first musical I ever saw on stage. We were in small town New Mexico, so there wasn't really much theatre. Theatre was done at the gymnasium at the high school. But there was a town, uh, far away, Alamogordo, New Mexico, where they have this, uh, white sands and the, the space rockets take off there. And we, we drove to Alamogordo to see sort of the bus and truck tour of Annie. And I remember sitting in a stage and it was so small that when they did the musical numbers, they just pressed play on the Broadway recording and then the people lip synced with

• 57:39Speaker 01

  the orchestra. So there was no orchestra, it was just a thing. And I remember being so overwhelmed with how awesome that was. So Annie had a real, indelible mark.

• 57:49Speaker 00

  Two things, what do you still want to achieve? And what's one piece of advice that you'd wish you'd known when you were younger?

• 57:58Speaker 01

  Uh, I still want to achieve two things. I want to, um, I want to have a life both personally and professionally in London. That's, I'm a big Anglophile. I think the work here is great.

• 58:14Speaker 00

  We can go for dinner.

• 58:15Speaker 01

  I think the, the work here is great and I think watching the long careers of people that continue to work here, um, they just work on every, on everything, comedy, Shakespeare, stage, film, and, uh, and there's a reverence and an indifference for the arts here that I think is just fantastic. I also want to direct more. I think that's kind of my, my north star would probably be directing. So, uh, film work would be great, theatre work would be great too. It was really fun to watch and to interact with George, Jake's Sunny Dancer director,

• 58:56Speaker 01

  because he wrote this thing five years ago and he has directed another movie before that and he's just young and he's a finisher. You know, some people have big dreams and they talk a lot about all the things that they want to do and what shots they want to make. And Fool just does it, makes it, films it, makes it, is the loveliest, everyone supports him, backs him, and you can see it, you know? It's palpable, it's tactile, and it was very inspiring.

• 59:25Speaker 00

  Yeah. And what piece of advice would you give to your younger self, who is still trying to figure it out?

• 59:31Speaker 01

  I think in life, we're the aggregate of the decisions that we make, of, of knowingly good and bad decisions and options all the time. I think throughout our days, hours, lives, we can opt to make good choices or bad choices. And I see at 53 now that when you, with intention, when you make better choices,

• 1:00:02Speaker 01

  with no real agenda, that it, that it pays itself back in a good way. I think that is a good way to, like, exist.

• 1:00:12Speaker 00

  I, I like.

• 1:00:12Speaker 01

  That's karma.

• 1:00:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, I love that.

• 1:00:14Speaker 01

  And also, no one really gives a shit. You work really, really hard to maintain a good attitude, a good, uh, reputation, a good thing, and then no one really cares, you know?

• 1:00:30Speaker 00

  That was my, that was kind of like my hardest lesson to learn. I think my biggest insecurity was, is that I wanted everyone, I thought, like, I want everyone to love me the whole time, but actually no one really cares. They're worrying about themselves, which is actually was kind of refreshing in a way. And suddenly I got to like major, which is in, you know, late 30s now, where I'm just like, you, you get, I don't know if you had this, you suddenly get to an age where you sort of let go. You stop worrying about stuff as much. And I'm kind of in that period now, which is, maybe that's becoming a dad, I don't know, you start to not really care about stuff as much.

• 1:00:59Speaker 01

  And I think you kind of have to have both of the things I said. Because if you just, if, if you just think nobody really cares, nobody really gives a shit, then there's not a lot of urgency to make good choices. Because if no one cares, who cares, right? But I think being a parent certainly changes that game. Like you just, you just watch people that you love and you just hope that they make a good choice instead of a bad choice.

• 1:01:28Speaker 00

  What do you think your greatest achievement is? And that can be?

• 1:01:32Speaker 01

  As a performer or in life?

• 1:01:33Speaker 00

  Life. I want you to pick life.

• 1:01:35Speaker 01

  I think being an effective father. I've never, I've never had a role that, um, that demanded so much so often that didn't just end, you know? Every job as an actor that you do finishes, you finish the run of the show and you leave, you finish 200 episodes of How I Met Your Mother and then you split. But, but being a parent to kids, uh, where the things that you learn and the mistakes that you make and the adventures that you have together, um, last, right? And so that breadth, um, and to see how amazing Harper and Giddy and our kids are,

• 1:02:21Speaker 01

  this makes me really happy and it sort of is a role that, that continues. I also have a really good OnlyFans account.

• 1:02:29Speaker 00

  I found it.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  And I can do some nasty things.

• 1:02:32Speaker 00

  And that is.

• 1:02:33Speaker 01

  I'm really proud of that.

• 1:02:34Speaker 00

  I wasn't gonna bring it up.

• 1:02:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, you were.

• 1:02:37Speaker 00

  Your PR said you can't bring that up, but I'm glad you spoke about it.

• 1:02:41Speaker 01

  Thank you. I, I didn't know sounding was so popular.

• 1:02:46Speaker 01

  But you can stick a lot of things inside your, sorry, what was your next question?

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• 1:04:31Speaker 00

  Honestly, can I just say I'm a huge fan? And I know a lot of people in the room are huge fans and you coming in and spending your time with us today, we really appreciate it.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  My pleasure.

• 1:04:39Speaker 00

  Like, you are a total gent. I know you have to wrap. I have eight quickfire questions and you just have to fire them off really quick. Are you ready for this? Here we go.

• 1:04:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:04:47Speaker 00

  Say a phrase that makes you smile or cheers you up.

• 1:04:50Speaker 01

  Rapid fire?

• 1:04:51Speaker 00

  I know.

• 1:04:52Speaker 01

  A phrase that really picks me up. You got this.

• 1:04:57Speaker 00

  Love that. Number two, best compliment anyone's ever given you?

• 1:05:00Speaker 01

  Nice dick.

• 1:05:01Speaker 00

  There we go. Love that. What scares you most about yourself?

• 1:05:05Speaker 01

  My inability to, uh, to, to, to stop myself when I'm really down on myself.

• 1:05:14Speaker 00

  When was the last time you cried?

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh, uh, three days ago.

• 1:05:19Speaker 00

  Yeah. What's something you can't let go of?

• 1:05:22Speaker 01

  When people put the toilet paper so that it's going underneath and around the back. The toilet paper goes in the front. And anyone who thinks the opposite is dumb, think about it. If you need to wipe your butt, you need to grab the toilet paper from the, from where it's, where you're looking at it.

• 1:05:40Speaker 00

  I get it, man, I get it.

• 1:05:41Speaker 01

  I don't understand why people turn it the other way. Then you, then you rolling it like a, like a cat at a, at a scratching post, trying to find the toilet paper.

• 1:05:52Speaker 00

  You know what I started doing on the toilet?

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's that? Pooping?

• 1:05:55Speaker 00

  Yeah, I poop. I, I pee sitting, sitting down at the moment.

• 1:05:58Speaker 01

  Do you?

• 1:05:58Speaker 00

  Yeah, cause I'm a little bit tired.

• 1:05:59Speaker 01

  Weird.

• 1:05:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, a little bit weird. But now what I do sometimes is I straddle it. And I, on the cistern, I have a little tea party. So I go backwards. I reverse cowgirl.

• 1:06:08Speaker 01

  You reverse cowgirl.

• 1:06:10Speaker 00

  I get a little wine. I get a little, I get a little dips and I have a great time.

• 1:06:16Speaker 01

  What are your thoughts on a bidet?

• 1:06:19Speaker 01

  Are you pro bidet?

• 1:06:19Speaker 00

  Are you kidding me? I, I want to get one in our house. My wife won't let me, but I love it.

• 1:06:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, the days are great.

• 1:06:25Speaker 00

  And it has that, that's why I like to go to Japan, cause they have that little laser.

• 1:06:28Speaker 01

  Go on.

• 1:06:29Speaker 00

  The water just hits right in that spot.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  Do you need a laser for that?

• 1:06:33Speaker 00

  My one's really small.

• 1:06:37Speaker 00

  What's your guilty pleasure?

• 1:06:41Speaker 01

  The reality show Survivor.

• 1:06:43Speaker 00

  Nice one. What's your biggest turn on?

• 1:06:47Speaker 01

  Blowjobs.

• 1:06:48Speaker 00

  Turn off? What's your biggest turn off?

• 1:06:56Speaker 01

  Halitosis.

• 1:06:58Speaker 00

  And what do you like most about yourself?

• 1:07:02Speaker 01

  I like my wit.

• 1:07:05Speaker 00

  I agree. Sunny Dancer comes out this Friday. Everyone should go and see it. Neil Patrick Harris, you are beyond great company. Thank you so much.

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:07:30Speaker 02

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