Pod Insights Great Company with Jamie Laing VIVIAN TU: Your Rich BFF Shares Money Advice You Need To Hear | FOUNDERS FRIDAY About this episode Vivian Tu is the founder and CEO of Your Rich BFF, a multi-media company on a mission to make money advice accessible to young people.
Vivian started her career on Wall Street before leaving to set up Your Rich BFF, where she now shares bite-sized lessons on personal finance with millions of people around the world. She's grown a community of more than 8 million people helping each other get rich and stay rich.
In this conversation, Vivian shares:
Why we’re all so uncomfortable talking about moneyHow to navigate finances in relationshipsThe biggest money mistakes people makeHow to ask for a pay rise... and actually get it
Vivian reminds us that financial freedom isn’t about earning the most money. It’s about making smarter choices with what you have and learning how to make your money work harder for you.
Vivian Tu is Great Company.
Check out Vivian’s podcast Networth & Chill HERE https://open.spotify.com/show/651Wo289D5DpX6RG8Pv7px?si=675d72c5b4844b49
If you enjoyed the show, you can also follow us:
Instagram – @greatcompanypodcast
TikTok – @greatcompanypodcast
Jamie – @jamielaing
And if you’ve got thoughts, questions and comments, you can email us at:
[email protected] mailto:[email protected]
THE CREDITS
Producers: Helen Burke
Assistant Producer: Issy Weeks-Hankins
Video: Josh Bennett & Harry Sawkins
Senior Social Media Manager: Laura Coughlan
Audio: Rafi Amsili Geovannetti
Executive Producer: Ewan Newbigging-Lister
Great Company is an original podcast from JamPot.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.
Transcript 12,041 words · 8 speakers
0:00 Speaker 00 How do you have an open conversation about finances with your partner?
0:03 Speaker 01 Ninety nine percent of domestic violence cases include financial abuse.
0:07 Speaker 00 How do you negotiate a higher salary?
0:09 Speaker 01 Unbelievably, they just gave me a raise of this. I'm like, great, that's great information for me to have because guess what I'm asking for next year?
0:17 Speaker 00 Explain the link between birth rates falling and people's finances.
0:20 Speaker 01 Families that otherwise would have had four kids are now having two. Families that were having two are now having one.
0:25 Speaker 00 Okay, one thing people waste money on without realising.
0:28 Speaker 01 You are allowed to want to spend money, but it better spark joy. Don't make mindless purchases just because of convenience, just because you think you should have it, just because you want to pass the time.
0:39 Speaker 00 Hey guys, welcome back to Founders Friday. Now today, I'm joined by the brilliant Vivian Too, better known to Millions Online as Your Rich BFF. Okay, so Vivian started her career on Wall Street before turning her financial expertise into one of the most followed personal finance platforms in the world. Okay, she hosts the Net Worth and Chill podcast, is the author of the bestselling book, Rich AF, and her mission is simple, to make money advice accessible to young people. So if you're a young person, this is for you, to anyone dreaming of leaving their corporate career behind and building a business of their own. And she shared so much great advice, from what we should stop wasting our money on, what she calls the dollar dribble, to how to confidently ask for a pay rise and actually get it.
1:25 Speaker 00 Okay, and why having open conversations about money with our partners, friends and colleagues can change our lives. So here it is, it's enough from me, you're gonna love this one, it's Founders Friday with Vivian Too.
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3:15 Speaker 00 Viv, thank you for coming on the podcast.
3:16 Speaker 01 Of course.
3:17 Speaker 00 I'm super excited for this because I think so many of our audience are going to be, I mean, the team here today are so excited. They have so many questions they farted in. But before we get into that, I want to understand who you are.
3:27 Speaker 01 Yeah.
3:27 Speaker 00 Because I think we're going to talk about a lot of things that need a lot of trust, right? And when it comes to finances, you kind of have to trust the person you're talking to or speaking to about it. So can you explain to me and the audience who you are?
3:39 Speaker 01 Yeah. Hello, everybody. My name is Vivian Tu, otherwise known online as Your Rich BFF. I teach the next generation how to better budget, save, spend, and invest their money. My ethos is that I believe everybody should feel confident about their finances and that it's not information that should be gate-kept behind a paywall or behind the walls of a university.
4:03 Speaker 00 That is a perfect answer. That is a perfect answer. And also, Times awarded you 100, you're in the 100 Times Top Creators, right?
4:13 Speaker 01 Yeah.
4:14 Speaker 00 Which is...
4:15 Speaker 01 I mean, no big deal. By the way...
4:17 Speaker 00 When that comes to you, is it like an email? How does it come to you?
4:20 Speaker 01 Yeah. Actually, funny enough, it was an email.
4:23 Speaker 00 Yeah.
4:24 Speaker 01 But it came, like, they contacted my PR team.
4:28 Speaker 00 Yeah.
4:28 Speaker 01 And my PR team was like, "Hey, Viv, like, give us a quick call." And I was like, "Hey, can't call you. On set, busy, what's up?" And they're like, "We'll just send the email." And so I think my team wanted to like, be like, congratulations. And I was like, hey, can't talk right now.
4:43 Speaker 00 I'm busy to say.
4:44 Speaker 01 Yeah, um, so they sent the email, obviously. So exciting. It's such an honor. And I went to the event, like the kickoff event that they had for it. And it's so funny because I'm there, like jaw on the floor, looking at all of these other people that I admire. And for them to be able to come up to me and be like, oh, I love your content. I'm like, you know who I am.
5:04 Speaker 00 Yeah, but your content is so, so accessible and you make something which is unaccessible accessible. And you open doors for people and you change lives.
5:11 Speaker 01 Thank you.
5:11 Speaker 00 You really do, honestly. And I think money is so important. It's the, it's probably the fundamentally the most important thing in life, really.
5:19 Speaker 01 Yeah.
5:20 Speaker 00 It is. But it's the last thing we think about.
5:23 Speaker 01 Money isn't everything, but everything is money.
5:25 Speaker 00 Yeah.
5:26 Speaker 01 Because if you want to have a happy life, unfortunately, unless you've got the, you've got the resources to live off the grid and make your own food and do all that, you need money.
5:37 Speaker 00 Hundred percent, hundred percent. Why, why do we, why do we lack so much knowledge around finances?
5:43 Speaker 01 Can I give you my like tinfoil hat, like conspiracy theorist?
5:47 Speaker 00 Give it to me all.
5:48 Speaker 01 Explanation? Because you need people to do the dirty jobs.
5:52 Speaker 00 You really think that's what it is?
5:54 Speaker 01 I do. Just hear me out, okay? So if you knew better, if you understood how money worked, if you understood financial systems, would you consider taking a job that pays you very little? That provides you with very few benefits, very few hours off to actually spend with your family to enjoy of your own? Would you continue to work paycheck to paycheck? Would you continue to spend your money in a consumerism cycle so that you can never get ahead? Of course not. Nobody wants that. Think about every rich person on earth, right? They're investing. They are making certain decisions with their money. The folks who are making poor decisions, well, they don't stay rich for very long. We've seen celebrities go bankrupt, right? We've seen it.
6:40 Speaker 01 But when we teach everybody how the system works, they make better decisions. And what happens when they make better decisions? There's nobody there to flip burgers. There's nobody there to, I don't know if this is a thing here, but to pump your gas. There's nobody to pick up the garbage. They don't necessarily want to do those jobs. Instead, they say, I'm gonna own the waste management company. I'm gonna own the restaurant franchise. I'm gonna own stocks and in this country, shares. I'm gonna own bonds. I'm gonna own property. Because at the end of the day, I truly believe if we know better, we make better choices.
7:25 Speaker 01 And the consumerism flywheel cannot afford for the vast majority of people to make smarter choices.
7:32 Speaker 00 Wow. I think there's truth in that because it.
7:36 Speaker 01 It's unfortunate.
7:36 Speaker 00 It is unfortunate because it definitely feels like um it it feels complicated when actually it's not that complicated. But people make it complicated because therefore then people don't want to learn about it. They feel like, okay, I don't want to do that. The the big thing in the UK, though, that I find is that in America, there feels like this great way of talking about finances. You're not scared to talk about finances, success in those places. But in Britain, we are in UK, people don't like talking about it.
8:00 Speaker 01 I think in the US, we are too. It's only recently become less taboo to do so. Think about in the nineties and the two thousands. People were so offended when Madonna came out in a very scantily clad outfit. Or, you know, we had people who would reference sex and partying and drugs in their rock and roll music. And it was so, so taboo over the years. All of those things have become less taboo. We are more comfortable talking about sex. We literally have shows like Temptation Island, Love Island, all of these things.
8:40 Speaker 01 We have, you know, pop stars, rock stars, rappers, rapping about getting money, maybe doing some illegal stuff. And like, all of this, it's all totally on the table now. It's totally fair game. But it still feels like the two areas where we get a little shy, maybe around dinner table conversation, are money and politics. And with politics, if I'm honest, that's actually getting less and less taboo now, too. People are more willing to accost their uncle. They are more willing to bring up a debate. And I think over time, money will also become a conversation that is easier, not because we are getting more comfortable with it, but out of a place of necessity.
9:25 Speaker 01 When the cost of living is what it is, this conversation will come to a head. People's ability to live their normal lives and pretend like nothing is wrong comes to a head.
9:38 Speaker 00 Why do we think it is taboo, though? Why, why is it talking about finances taboo? Because it's so important, it runs everything. Is it because it feels like a status thing?
9:46 Speaker 01 Um, yes, but also because we often tie money to our moral positioning.
9:53 Speaker 00 Yeah.
9:53 Speaker 01 So when you are very wealthy, you are successful, you're put on a pedestal of you're hardworking, you're honest, you're trustworthy. None of those things may be true, by the way. But we go ahead and ascribe those positive traits to someone who has succeeded. Whereas if you are not wealthy, you're not doing well, you are at a career that is oftentimes considered service industry or lower wage, people point fingers and say, "Look at this person, they're so irresponsible. They are putting these charges that they can't afford on a credit card." Heaven forbid a single mom wants to feed her children.
10:34 Speaker 01 The way we talk about people who have money and the way we talk about people who don't is vastly different. When people who have a lot of money borrow money, we call it leverage. We put them on the covers of magazines. And when people who... Are not very well to do borrow money. We call it debt and we shame them.
10:53 Speaker 00 I've never thought of it like that.
10:54 Speaker 01 It's just PR. It's just marketing. How you spin it.
10:57 Speaker 00 It totally is. I've never thought of it that way. What was your family situation growing up? Did you grow up wealthy?
11:02 Speaker 01 Uh-uh. We were probably lower to upper middle class and that changed as I got older.
11:11 Speaker 01 My parents arrived to America in their early twenties with very little money, two suitcases and a dream. And ultimately, they were able to build a life that they're now very proud of. I'm very proud of them for. But it's not like there was so much extra to go around as I was a little kid.
11:33 Speaker 00 Were you aware of that?
11:34 Speaker 01 I think I was aware of it because of the way that my parents spoke about money. There were not conversations of grow your power, grow your wealth, but it was like, we need to budget, we need to save. Money needs to be used on the knife's edge. My dad used to say this Chinese phrase of 走偏了用不着靠拢. And it literally translates to money needs to be used on the knife's edge.
11:56 Speaker 00 Wow.
11:56 Speaker 01 Because they were so frugal. And ultimately, that really inured to their benefit. Because we live so far below our means. I think there was a turning point. I would say end of middle school, early high school. My mom ended up getting a consulting job that took her out to California. We were living in Maryland at the time. And her pay increased by quite a lot. And even when her pay increased by quite a lot, we still lived the way we were living. But my parents started meaningfully putting money away for me to go to college or as you guys call it uni.
12:36 Speaker 01 And I am someone who has the absolute great fortune of having graduated from university with no debt.
12:43 Speaker 00 Wow.
12:43 Speaker 01 I got to start life at zero.
12:45 Speaker 00 How much is a typical person going to uni, college in the States?
12:48 Speaker 01 The college that I went to when I went was about a quarter of a million dollars.
12:52 Speaker 00 Get out of here.
12:53 Speaker 01 Yeah.
12:54 Speaker 00 Two hundred and fifty thousand dollars.
12:56 Speaker 01 Yeah.
12:57 Speaker 00 That's the debt that you come out with.
12:58 Speaker 01 Correct. If you, if, if you can't afford to pay for any of it. Now, I was also very lucky. My parents' money didn't cover everything, but I got merit scholarships. I got private scholarships. But this is all to say, their frugality, their living so far below their means, provided me that golden ticket to adulthood that most people don't get. I remember thinking there were families in the neighborhood that I grew up in, and they drove the really fancy cars, the Mercedes. They had a much bigger house than us. They, you know, the mom would always bring in snacks for like the parent, teacher, PTA, whatever. My mom could never do any of that stuff. She was working.
13:43 Speaker 01 My parents both had to work to make the numbers math. And I always felt like we were so much worse off. I remember one of my girlfriends who was, you know, in one of those situations. She drove me home one day and we were talking about college and she was like, oh, well, I can't afford to go to the school that I want to go to. And I was like, very confused by that because her family had a bigger home, a nicer car, all of these things. And she was like, yeah, but like, we're in debt up to our eyeballs. And she had to go to a school that she was less excited about because that's what they could afford. And I think that just made me acutely aware that like my family's values were different than other people's families.
14:24 Speaker 00 So you left university and you went to JP Morgan?
14:26 Speaker 01 Yes.
14:27 Speaker 00 What was that experience like for you? Because I imagine with you, Viv, and your parents, like, we're doing this so you go to a place where you can earn the most money.
14:33 Speaker 01 So I want to be very clear. As the daughter, only daughter, by the way, no pressure, of two Chinese immigrant parents, I had three job options. Okay. They were like, it's like a, you guys don't have, it's like a pre, like a, like you go to a pre and they're like, you pick two. Like you get to have two, like half a sandwich and half a soup. You pick, you had three options.
14:53 Speaker 00 Yeah.
14:53 Speaker 01 It was, you got to be a, an attorney.
14:56 Speaker 00 Okay.
14:57 Speaker 01 Are they called like barristers here?
14:58 Speaker 00 Yeah, like a barrister lawyer.
15:00 Speaker 01 You could be a doctor. Or you could be an engineer.
15:03 Speaker 00 Those were your three options.
15:04 Speaker 01 That was the three options.
15:05 Speaker 00 Okay.
15:05 Speaker 01 Luckily for me, finance kind of cropped up as this nice bonus fourth option, which was high prestige, high pay, and provided me, you know, the opportunity to go live in a really cool city.
15:17 Speaker 00 Wow.
15:18 Speaker 01 People are always going to need legal representation. People are always going to need somebody to fix them when they're sick. And people are always going to need people to like do the sciencey stuff, like fix stuff.
15:29 Speaker 00 And bring you to the mentality of your parents because your parents are trying to give you the best opportunity in life. Because that's their experience, right? Their experience that life is tough, life is hard. So we want to give my, our kids or you
15:39 Speaker 01 Yeah.
15:40 Speaker 00 the best opportunity and so that's what we're going to push you towards.
15:42 Speaker 01 Correct.
15:43 Speaker 00 And that's a lot of pressure.
15:45 Speaker 01 It's a lot of pressure, but you know what?
15:47 Speaker 00 You glad it happened?
15:48 Speaker 01 I am someone who thrives under pressure. I want to be entirely clear. I woke up this morning well, well before the car came to get me for this interview. I sat in bed and scrolled on phone until I knew that I was going to have to rush. And then I got up and I started my day. I started showering with like 30 minutes before the car was arriving. I just thrive under pressure. I was not
16:12 Speaker 00 I love that attitude.
16:13 Speaker 01 I like even like getting ready in my early twenties to like go meet girlfriends out for a drink. My friends came to the conclusion, they're like, actually, it doesn't take Vivian a very long time to get ready. She just chooses to get ready like 20 minutes after she should have started.
16:28 Speaker 00 Because the pressure thrills you.
16:29 Speaker 01 The pressure, it's a thrill. It is a thrill.
16:33 Speaker 00 So
16:34 Speaker 01 But I ultimately end up deciding on this job because it provides all those things. High prestige, high pay, I get to go to a cool city. Great. I think that was probably one of the proudest days of my parents' life when I told them I got that job. I like called my mom, I'm in tears. She is so happy for me. And it's not even the job, I got the internship. Okay, because you got an intern the summer prior. And the funniest thing is they hire significantly more interns than they have full-time roles for. So three young people, it was me and two, two men, joined the desk and halfway through the summer, it's clear that I'm a good culture fit and the two of them are not.
17:18 Speaker 01 So they get rotated away to Narnia. I don't even know where they sent them. And two new men from other desks get rotated in. By the end of the summer, five people sat in that seat. I was the only person to get a job. If that tells you how cutthroat that environment is. You know, it's eat or be eaten. Like, the guy sitting next to you is not your little friend. You are fighting for one seat. So it's musical chairs.
17:44 Speaker 00 Wow.
17:44 Speaker 01 How quick are you? And so I get the job. I start my life in New York City. It's glittering. It's, just kidding. No, I'm making like eighty thousand dollars a year and my rent is like eighteen hundred dollars. After taxes, I had enough. One of my paychecks every month went to rent. And then the other paycheck had to stretch me the entire month. I was also financially irresponsible. I was twenty-two. All of my money went to tequila.
18:13 Speaker 00 But eighty thousand dollars is a lot for a starting salary, right? At that age?
18:17 Speaker 01 Yeah, it is.
18:18 Speaker 00 It's a lot. What is that, fifty thousand pounds?
18:20 Speaker 01 But keep in mind, I am also living in one of the most expensive places on earth. And it's not like I can get an apartment in Bushwick, which is far, far Brooklyn. I have to be at the office at five forty-five in the morning. So I had to make sure that my apartment was close enough to the office that I wasn't eating up thirty minutes in the morning on a commute. It's so funny, they would actually cover your car into the office in the morning because I would get in before the sun would come out. And it was a legal liability for the bank, like if I got hurt or like attacked on the subway.
18:53 Speaker 00 What?
18:54 Speaker 01 So like, I am getting there before the sun comes out. And during the winter, I'm leaving after the sun has come down. So like, I had a vitamin D deficiency. I had to start taking the vitamin D pills. Um, cause I I didn't see the sun.
19:06 Speaker 00 Did you enjoy it?
19:08 Speaker 01 You know what's so crazy? After describing it like literally so badly, yeah, I did.
19:13 Speaker 00 Well, but you enjoyed the pressure of it or it was everything you you?
19:15 Speaker 01 I thrived on the pressure of it. I think there is something to be said and and there's a lot of different seats on Wall Street. Some are more well-suited for people who are slower, more cerebral thinkers. I'm not smart and I just move quickly. So I worked on the equities desk, which is what people know as stock jocks.
19:37 Speaker 01 And I I I make that joke, but it's a very different skill set. You are trying to make the best decision possible with limited information. And you get about three, three seconds to make each decision. And the faster you make it, the better, because the market is ticking. Every second that goes by, prices are changing. So if you hesitate, you've now probably messed up a trade for somebody.
20:04 Speaker 00 Can I ask, so speaking, I, because I I wanna leave, don't wanna leave that student bit there, right? Because a lot of students are gonna be listening to this and listening to you because they love you, right?
20:11 Speaker 01 Yeah.
20:11 Speaker 00 Uh, for students who don't have the luxury of scholarships, right, or savings, how can they budget and make college or uni work for them financially?
20:18 Speaker 01 Well, first and foremost, I would say you have to pick a major or a course of study that you know is gonna earn back your debt. So you don't have the luxury.
20:25 Speaker 00 That limits you.
20:27 Speaker 01 Sucks. Like, not all of us are dealt like two aces. Sometimes you're dealt a really crappy hand. And you have to make a decision of what do I want to do? To make this work. If you don't come from a financial situation that is going to provide for you long term, you are going to need to provide for yourself. And so think about careers that are actually going to pay you what you wanna get paid. I think it's really also important to talk about ownership. Owning is how you make money. Working does not make you money. Because you can only work probably max fourteen to sixteen hours a day before your body is out.
21:09 Speaker 01 You are limited by your body, you are limited by your brain, and as a human being, you are limited by the amount of sleep and rest and food that you need to consume and all of this, right? You have to go to the bathroom.
21:18 Speaker 00 Mm hmm.
21:19 Speaker 01 Fine. You only have so many hours in a day.
21:20 Speaker 00 Mm hmm.
21:21 Speaker 01 Your money. Your ownership can work for you 24/7, no lunch break, no holiday vacations. If your money is in the stock market, if your money is earning you money because you own real estate that is cash flow positive, that is earning you money. If you run a business that you own, you can make money from the actual ownership of the system that scales that doesn't require you.
21:51 Speaker 00 OK, so if we go to you then, so fine, when you you weren't, so you were earning $80,000, that's what you're earning your starting salary.
21:58 Speaker 01 Yeah.
21:59 Speaker 00 If you could go back to your younger self then when you were 22 years old, how would you have broken down that salary? What would you have done differently with it?
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23:37 Speaker 01 I mean.
23:39 Speaker 00 And this is related to someone, right, who's just gone into their first job?
23:41 Speaker 01 Yeah.
23:41 Speaker 00 And perhaps they've been given their first paycheck. They're like, okay, what do I do with this? I've got to pay my rent. How would you break it down?
23:47 Speaker 01 Where do we begin? So I would say I did a pretty decent job in terms of my largest expense, which was housing. That was pretty bare bones versus what some of my other peers were spending. But I will say I spent a lot of money going out.
24:04 Speaker 00 Which is not a bad thing, right?
24:05 Speaker 01 It's not a bad thing. It's not. Well, we'll see.
24:09 Speaker 01 I feel like I was just getting really drunk in the West Village. A neighborhood that I certainly could not afford to live in. But I think I spent a lot of money going out. And naturally, prior to going out, you have to make sure you look good enough to go out. And that meant I was buying a lot of stuff. Ask me if I own any of it today. It doesn't fit. The outfits don't fit. The jewelry has tarnished. The, none of it. I can't remember any of it. But I spent a whole hell of a lot of money on it. And I think I could have been smarter about prioritizing where my budget went.
24:49 Speaker 01 Because ultimately, that probably would have been better used on convenience services and experiences versus stuff. Because I was trying to buy that designer bag to impress the other cool girls.
25:05 Speaker 00 Yeah.
25:06 Speaker 01 They didn't care. But like, I was probably, you know, not spending as much as I should have on eating healthy nutritious food. It's crazy, though, because I looked great at the time. Because I was like, I would go home and I would eat a handful of pistachios and just go to sleep.
25:24 Speaker 00 Do you know that there's a, there's a great quote, which is, never as a generation we wanted so much but needed so little.
25:30 Speaker 01 Yeah.
25:31 Speaker 00 And it's so good because we do, we buy all this stuff that actually we don't need. We grow out of it. Exactly. You bought all the stuff, where is it now? You don't have it. So why am I buying all that stuff?
25:41 Speaker 01 Like, why am I worried about whether or not my credit card is going to overdraft? But I have all of this stuff and I'm eating pistachios for dinner. Like, that's, that just tells me that at the time, my priorities were so out of whack.
25:54 Speaker 00 Do you think that's the biggest mistake the younger generation make? They're spending the money in the wrong places.
25:58 Speaker 01 Yeah, hundred percent, hundred percent. I, listen, I don't want to blame the younger generation. I think we should also call out the stats. It's harder now for us and the people younger than us than it was for our parents, right?
26:10 Speaker 00 Totally.
26:11 Speaker 01 Our, like, the cost of housing skyrocketed. Cost of living, groceries, basic transportation skyrocketed. Wages stagnated. So you're telling me a job that paid, I don't know, fifty thousand pounds a year when Papa did it, and now pays fifty-three thousand, fifty-three thousand pounds a year. Oh, but have you seen the cost of a tube of toothpaste at a Sainsbury's? I would, because I went yesterday and I was shocked. Why is that toothpaste four dollars? The wages are not keeping up with the cost of living. You can no longer just have one full-time job and make ends meet comfortably for most people.
26:55 Speaker 00 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
26:56 Speaker 01 That sucks, because whether it's the American dream or the UK dream, whatever, like, the dream was always this. We were made a promise. If you work hard in school, if you do well, if you go to uni, if you get a good job, you will have enough money every year to make all your ends meet, go on one to two good vacations with your loved one, loved ones. You should be able to afford a family and the cycle continues. And at some point, you will be able to own a little piece of this earth of your own.
27:35 Speaker 01 Okay, well, young people don't feel like they can own houses. They can't afford them. They can barely feel like they can afford cars. They certainly are having children at a much lower rate. The birth rate has declined because, guess what? I would rather go on vacation than have a kid. But like, we're making people choose and then shocked when they don't make the choice that historically has been made.
27:58 Speaker 00 Explain the link between birth rates falling and people's finances.
28:02 Speaker 01 Yeah, okay. Babies are super expensive and they need specialized food for a very long time, specialized care, not to mention, before they get into the school system, you either have to watch them. So either historically, mom has to take a step back from her career, or you have to pay someone. And that's a lot of money. And so when we think about all of the ongoing costs and the fact that our world, very literally, is on fire. A lot of the next generation is saying, I don't want that burden. Yes, do I think
28:39 Speaker 01 a child will likely be a positive add to my life? Maybe. But I can barely make ends meet as it is right now for me. I can barely take care of myself. Why would I add one more cost? I understand. That's why the average family size is also shrinking. Not to say that like some people are just choosing not to have children, but like, families that otherwise would have had four kids are now having two. Families that were having two are now having one.
29:06 Speaker 00 Can I ask a personal question? And feel free not to answer, but where are you on this?
29:11 Speaker 01 So my husband and I, two years ago, actually froze embryos together because I'm thirty two now. I recognize that like, time is not particularly on my side. Like, I am very much still in the climbing phase of my career. I feel really proud of what I've built. My husband is very, very proud of the career he's built. We both like working. And if a fairy godmother came tomorrow and like, a stork dropped a baby in my arms, I don't even know what I would do. I'm traveling every week right now. And that's crazy. So I'm not at a position right now to have children. However, I did think it was important for me to get an insurance policy
29:54 Speaker 01 on potentially being able to have them because I want to have that option. But say I want to have that option at thirty eight, forty two. My body may betray me. And so I wanted to have that insurance policy. I'm very, very lucky. We were able to afford to do it when I was thirty. Meaning I got a great egg count. We ended up having a great embryo count. I, we look at the number of healthy embryos we got. And we joke like we could start a basketball team. Um, I am not tall enough for that, by the way. Um, no one would hire my children to play basketball. But it, you know, it is to say that like, I want to have the option. I think my life could be fulfilled without children.
30:36 Speaker 01 But I think that it could be meaningfully improved with them as well. And so I just want to have the option. If everything works out, I'd love to have one or two.
30:47 Speaker 00 How long have you been with your husband for?
30:49 Speaker 01 We just passed nine years together and in June, we have been married for two.
30:55 Speaker 00 Let's go.
30:56 Speaker 01 Yeah.
30:56 Speaker 00 Are you open with your finances?
30:58 Speaker 01 Oh, painfully open.
31:00 Speaker 00 Really?
31:01 Speaker 01 Painfully open because thirty days into dating this random man. Um, I actually moved from my midtown uptown apartment into a beautiful walk up like Soho apartment with my girl roommate. And the first weekend we're supposed to be in this apartment. I was actually in Chicago for an alumni weekend event. And she calls me and she goes, hey, Viv, when you get back, we have to have a conversation. I'm like, tell me now because you've just ruined my weekend. She goes, no, no, I have to talk to you in person. I'm like, okay, whatever. I get back, she sits me down, she goes, the first night I slept in this apartment alone. At midnight, I was on my phone, just scrolling, whatever. She goes, I put my phone away. I'm ready to go to bed.
31:44 Speaker 01 I go to the bathroom, I flick on the lights to go. And I see a thousand little things scurry away. We had rented an apartment that was infested with German cockroaches. Why is it relevant that they're German cockroaches? Because they breed at ten X the speed as an American cockroach. So if you see one, go ahead and assume you have an infestation. And so we ended up packing overnight bags. She was dating somebody at the time. I was dating my now husband and we moved into our boyfriend's apartments. And thirty days in, I started living with this man, random stranger.
32:18 Speaker 00 Wow.
32:19 Speaker 01 And after about three weeks, I had to sit my now husband down and tell him, I don't have any money to pay you for living here. I can barely afford to pay for dinner. I don't know if I'm going to be able to afford the vacation we're currently planning. And, oh, by the way, I need to use the last of my savings to break our lease.
32:46 Speaker 00 Very honest.
32:47 Speaker 01 I was so humiliated, like, ew, the weird roach girl. Like, nobody wants to be weird cockroach girl. Like, that's so gross. He was so kind. And he said, listen, this is a classic New York thing. It happens to the best of us. Like, it's not your fault. Since you're sharing, because I told him, I was like, this is how much money I have. This is what I make. This is what I don't have. And this is what I'm about to spend to break my lease.
33:14 Speaker 00 But that is so open. That is not common in most relationships.
33:16 Speaker 01 Like, what was I supposed to do? I was homeless.
33:19 Speaker 00 Yeah.
33:19 Speaker 01 I was living at his apartment out of a weekender bag. And he was like, since you've shared that, I just want to let you know, this is what I make. This is the bonus I'm about to get. So don't worry about it.
33:33 Speaker 00 Well, so you think being open in relationships about finances is really important?
33:36 Speaker 01 Yeah, not thirty days in. I don't recommend.
33:38 Speaker 00 Not thirty days in.
33:38 Speaker 01 That was a fluke. Don't do that.
33:41 Speaker 00 I'm very open with my wife. She knows what I have. She knows what I earn. I know what she has. I know what she earns. We don't have a joint account, but we're thinking about opening a joint account because we're doing it that way. What is your take? Break it down for me. How do you have an open conversation about finances with your partner? And why should you do that?
33:57 Speaker 01 OK, I'll give you a really nasty stat. Ninety-nine percent of domestic violence cases include financial abuse. I have had women DM me and say, I want to just say thank you. Because of the content you've made, I was able to save enough money to leave. Doesn't that just break your heart?
34:16 Speaker 01 Like, what do I say to that? You can't. But I don't want any woman to ever be in that situation. And I think, by the way, men have, I don't know who your publicist is, your publicist is doing a way better job than the women's publicist. Because the women's PR team has let us get brainwashed. They're saying all these things about us in the streets. They're saying we are shopaholics. We love avocado toast. I don't even like avocados.
34:46 Speaker 01 That we spend our money on lattes every single day, that we're frivolous. All of this stuff. They've said all, they've tarnished our name in the streets. I ask you this. Do you not also drink coffee? I ask you this. Do you not also spend money on sporting events? Getting a drink at the pub? Going to soccer matches? Getting to buy the new fangled PS5 video? That's expensive. And it's way more expensive than my lip gloss. Come on. My lip gloss was $12. Like, calm down. And so, if you hear something enough times, you start to believe it. And if we've told women, you're bad with money, you're irresponsible, you're an overspender,
35:29 Speaker 01 naturally, they're going to think, ah, I'm too dumb and helpless to do this myself. So they let their fathers help them. And then it's their husbands. And one day, it'll be their sons. But I beg every woman who's listening to this. I need you to have financial autonomy. You need to have your own money. I love that you and your wife have your own bank accounts. Do I think a joint account would help make things easier to maybe pay your mortgage? Or utilities? Or groceries? Or ultimately, your kid's daycare bill? Sure. Great.
36:05 Speaker 01 But I also think that she needs to have her own bank account. And so do you. Because that's how my husband and I do it.
36:12 Speaker 00 Wow, that's interesting. Yeah, that's a better way of doing it.
36:14 Speaker 01 Because we pay our mortgage out of our joint account. We pay the utility bill. Like, you know, wifi, like, heating, all that. Joint account.
36:25 Speaker 01 But he's allowed to go for a round of golf. That's a couple hundred bucks, I think. I go and get my nails done, or my lashes done, or drinks with girlfriends. I'm not gonna tell you what that costs. That's none of your business.
36:41 Speaker 01 But I don't ever want to be told that I can't do something with money that I've earned. My money is his money, and his money is my money, and our money is our money. But I should be allowed to make decisions
36:54 Speaker 01 unbound by somebody else, because I work hard and I deserve it. And so I encourage everybody to have financial autonomy, no matter who you are. And you need to be leaned in in your financial situation. When you are going over the family finances, sit down at the table with a chair. Don't just think somebody else is gonna handle it for you. Because even in a best-case scenario, I've had people message me, "My husband of 45 years just passed away. I don't even know what the passwords to our bank account is." This woman had a thoughtful, loving, faithful husband for 45 years, and she still ended up in a financial wreck. That could be you.
37:31 Speaker 00 I think that's really important advice, that sit down, have a conversation about it, because no one's gonna do it for you.
37:36 Speaker 01 Nobody.
37:37 Speaker 00 And for some reason, we think someone is. It's gonna magically happen, and it actually doesn't. And it is an awkward conversation. But you need to talk about the mortgage, you need to talk about the bills, you need to talk about the wifi, you need to talk about, I don't know, the cleaning, whatever it is, you need to talk about how we fix that window.
37:52 Speaker 01 Yeah.
37:52 Speaker 00 And let's do it as a team together. Okay, how can you find out whether the person you're dating is good with money?
37:57 Speaker 01 Oof, you gotta ask the hard questions.
38:00 Speaker 00 Like what?
38:01 Speaker 01 But also, like, you need to look out for the red flags, okay?
38:04 Speaker 00 So what are the red flags?
38:05 Speaker 01 I think, at the end of the day, what you need to determine with your partner is, do they value a dollar the same way you do? I am a saver. My husband is a spender. But we value a dollar the same way, in that we would rather spend on big experiences, lavish vacations. We don't really spend a ton on retail. We don't really spend a ton on fancy transportation. We don't own a car. When I call an Uber, I call the regular one, not the executive one. Like, we value a dollar the same way. If you and I are married... And you are dead set on saving for a home?
38:47 Speaker 01 And I'm dead set at being at Selfridges every weekend? You are going to resent me eventually. Because I have blown our house budget on coats.
38:58 Speaker 00 What is your thoughts on buying a house?
38:59 Speaker 01 I think it can be a part of your financial picture if it's really important to you. Is it necessarily always a genius financial move? No, sometimes it is, sometimes it's not. It also depends on your lifestyle. So people ask me this question all the time. They're like, do I have to buy a house? Do I have to buy a house? Do you want a house? Because to make the closing costs and the fixed costs make sense, you have to be in that home for five to seven years. Are you expanding your family in the five, in the next five to seven years? Because that three-bedroom apartment or that three-bedroom, you know, condo may not work if you pop out twins. Because one of those bedrooms is now being used as a home office. And now you don't have enough room. So we're about to get another, another place. You're gonna just take an L on that?
39:45 Speaker 01 Or, oh, you are in your late twenties. Are you gonna buy a home in the major metro that you currently live in? Oh, but by the way, you just got an incredible job opportunity at work. And now you get to relocate to London. What are you doing with that house? That's a burden. If you have any sort of uncertainty in your life, if you have any desire to be mobile, I wouldn't buy. But if you're ready to put down roots, if things are generally pretty settled in your life, it might be time to consider.
40:15 Speaker 00 It's great advice because I think sometimes what happens is we have this narrative that we need to buy a house. So we're just stuck in what our parents were doing and our parents say to us.
40:21 Speaker 01 Yeah, houses were also $4.
40:23 Speaker 00 Correct. It's crazy, right?
40:25 Speaker 01 Yeah.
40:25 Speaker 00 And people don't like the idea of renting because they think they're wasting money. I think renting is a really smart move sometimes.
40:30 Speaker 01 Yeah, when you're renting, the apartment or wherever you're renting is someone else's problem.
40:37 Speaker 00 If I was a, if I was a young 20-year-old, right, sitting here talking to you right now?
40:41 Speaker 01 Yeah.
40:42 Speaker 00 What would you say to them about focusing on their finances? What would, advice would you give?
40:46 Speaker 01 One, I need you to just like, talk to your friends about money. Like, it is so important. I think we oftentimes hold that conversation back at fear of being judged. If the number we say is too big, it feels like we're bragging. If the number we put out is too small, it feels like, oh. Pity, pity, you know? But I've actually found that talking about numbers with your close friends is essentially a way to lift all ships. Um, at my second job at BuzzFeed, I had a girlfriend at work. She was my best friend at work. She was at my wedding, like, we were very close. And she was a couple of years older than me and we had the same job and she sat next
41:30 Speaker 01 to me. And it was right before my end of year review. And so I was just so curious. And I, I'm like, okay, Alison, come with me to the bathroom. So I drag her into the bathroom. I, I make her go into the big handicap stall with me and I'm like, hey, Alison, tell me how much money you make. And she goes, what? And I'm like, just tell me, I'm about to go in for my end of year review and I want to ask for more money, but I don't know what's realistic. Hmm. She tells me what she makes and she's like, but you didn't hear that from me. And I'm like, heard, understand. I go into my end of year review and I say, look at all of these things that I've accomplished. A raise of X, Y, Z, I said what, how much she makes would be commensurate because she was making more than me at the time. She was older than me, had more experience.
42:14 Speaker 01 I end up getting this raise. I'm like, thank you so much. I leave. I'm like, Alison, we need to go to the bathroom. I drag her into the bathroom. We go into the handicap stall. I'm like, I just want to let you know, they're, they're giving me that. I now make the same amount that you make, but you're five years older than me. So just so you know, you didn't hear it from me. We leave the bathroom. She goes in for her end of year review. She goes, these are all of my accomplishments for the year. A raise of X, Y, Z would be commensurate. And now she's asking for more money because she knows that I'm making what she's making. She gets it. She comes back to the desk, she goes, Vivian, I think we need to go to the bathroom. We've spent the entire day now in this handicap stall. We go to the bathroom and she goes, unbelievably, they just gave me a raise of this. I'm like, great.
42:57 Speaker 01 That's great information for me to have because guess what I'm asking for next year?
43:02 Speaker 01 Our ability to share information with each other allowed me to have a realistic number to ask for. So I wasn't going crazy, but it was a reasonable number for me to expect. It made us smarter and more effective negotiators. So I beg you in your twenties, talk to your friends about money. Know what they're making, know what they're paying on rent. Were they able to get some sort of subsidy because the the radiator turned off for three days or something didn't happen? Or maybe, you know, the the lock wasn't working. How did they get that money back?
43:35 Speaker 00 That is great advice. There's two things I want to pick out there, right? Which is, how do you stop comparing yourself to your friends financially first? Because you're right, it is too high, you feel like you're bragging and too low, you feel like you're feel embarrassed for some reasons. How do you stop that comparison?
43:50 Speaker 01 I think it's just being honest. If you are a analyst at a nonprofit and I'm working down with the suits and canary wharf, we're not making the same amount of money. But you might be able to take a page out of my playbook of how to negotiate effectively. I might be able to think a little bit about, oh, hey, is there an opportunity for, you know, somebody at your company to come and do a presentation at my office? By the way, that'll help you with your visibility. Like, we can help each other.
44:27 Speaker 00 Do you know what? That's such, it's honestly such great advice, being more open about those situations. You then are leveraged, you understand you have, you, you, you. You know, history is our playbook for the future, right? So once you know, know more knowledge, then you can argue your case more. Which brings me on to my next thing is when you're in a room with your boss, how do you negotiate a higher salary?
44:45 Speaker 01 You come with receipts.
44:48 Speaker 01 People think that the negotiation happens in that one meeting, in that one room. Absolutely not. That's the show. You got to prepare for the show. You got to practice, you got to rehearse. So, end of year raises and promotions happen in the summer. That's where you're going to sit your manager down and say, hey, five, six months of the year have already happened. These are the three amazing things that I've already accomplished. I am so, so excited for the rest of the year. These are my goals. In addition to these goals, what other benchmarks or milestones would I need to hit to be in a good place? To get this XYZ, whether it's a promotion, whether it's a raise, whether it's, you know, if you're in sales, more territories, more opportunities, whatever, you're gonna,
45:31 Speaker 01 whatever you're asking for, your manager's gonna tell you, you need to be doing this, you need to be doing that, you need to be doing this. Now you have a list. Take those things. Over the next six months, you crush it. By the way, like, you still have to crush it. Like, you can't do all these things and suck. If you're on a performance improvement plan, this is not for you. But you crush it. Then during the fall, you are going to set another meeting. So I'm talking like October. And then you're gonna set another meeting for like, early December. If your company, by the way, doesn't operate on like, their fiscal year is not the same calendar year, you can change the, you can change the month. But assume it's a January to December. October, you're like, hey, I'm tracking against the metrics and the goals that you shared with me.
46:13 Speaker 01 I just wanna let you know, like, I, I still am very, very much, you know, looking forward towards getting this role. Or I'm still very much looking forward towards, like, receiving a raise of XYZ. Make it very clear what you want. And then, when it comes to December, that's the grand finale. That's the actual time to put on the show. You have now aggregated all of your wins from the year. And I encourage people to make a brag book. It's just a folder in your email. Anytime someone emails you and is like, oh, we couldn't have done this without you, or you're so amazing, you're so smart, whatever, you forward all of those emails, not you looking at your employees.
46:51 Speaker 00 I know. Such great advice. It is such great advice.
46:56 Speaker 01 You forward all of those emails, or you take screenshots of your, you know, accomplishments, you put them into this folder. And you just do, like, brag book 2026.
47:04 Speaker 00 And the reason why I'm looking at these guys is because, honestly, that is exactly, that's, that's 100% what people should do.
47:10 Speaker 01 Yeah.
47:10 Speaker 00 And, and I think the big thing is, is that negotiation starts at the beginning of the year.
47:13 Speaker 01 Yeah.
47:14 Speaker 00 It, people think it starts when you walk into the room. It doesn't, it started before. And doing everything like that, I think the miss, uh, the mistake some people make is that, um, everyone wants pay rises, everyone wants to be paid more, and, and I, and I'm...
47:27 Speaker 01 But you have to back it up. And because when you back it up, this is what actually happens. HR, for most corporations, HR, sometime in November, December, will go to your boss and be like, alright, you've got $40,000 for the whole team. Whole team. So maybe there's like 10 people on this team. And your boss then has to decide which mouths to feed. Some managers who are bad managers will just be like, okay, well, that's easy. Everybody gets $4,000. That's how you lose your top talent. Unfortunately, if you want to retain the best talent, you've got to feed the rich and starve the poor.
48:03 Speaker 00 That's brutal.
48:04 Speaker 01 It's brutal. Your best performers need to get paid. You've got to keep them. And the people who are at the bottom 10%, it might be time to have a conversation of letting them know that they're not going to be around for much longer. It sucks, but like if you are a top performer, imagine if you and the laziest, can I say, laziest sack of shit on your team got paid the same amount? I'd be mad. Then why am I working so hard? It disincentivizes your top players.
48:30 Speaker 00 Is that, is that how you work at your company?
48:32 Speaker 01 Yeah. If I'm honest with you, like, we now have a very like higher slow fire fast motto. If, within the first two months, it's not a vibe fit, if I don't think you're going to be able to get there, you're gone. But the people who have worked for me for years, I think it would be very, very hard for another manager to steal them because I pay well above market. I don't mind paying more if you're doing more. If you are operating at a level above, you're going to get paid every year. Just go ahead and know I'm going to take care of you because I don't want you to leave. I'm going to make it so hard for you to leave because you have gotten accustomed to a much nicer lifestyle than you would have doing the same job at anywhere else.
49:14 Speaker 00 Okay, a thousand pounds lands in your account.
49:16 Speaker 01 Yep.
49:17 Speaker 00 What are you doing with it?
49:18 Speaker 01 Okay, so first and foremost, I'm setting some of it aside for my emergency fund. I want to make sure that I have three to six months of living expenses saved aside as an emergency fund. This is important because if you don't have this and then something pops up, you could end up in a worse spot than you currently are in. So I'm putting some of this into my emergency fund. I would focus on putting some of it into paying down any sort of high interest rate debt. So that's anything above what your local market typically returns on average every single year. So you can't make more. If you have a loan that charges you 12% a year and the stock market in your region only returns 8%,
50:02 Speaker 01 you can't make more investing that money, so you gotta pay the debt down first. Then if I still have money left over, I would put that money towards an investment. The vast majority of people cannot afford to retire ever if they do not invest. You will never save your way there.
50:18 Speaker 00 Okay, one thing people waste money on without realizing.
50:20 Speaker 01 I think there is value in making small purchases that bring you joy. So if getting that latte in the morning is the reason you are getting out of bed, it sparks joy, great, do it, no problem. But I see so many people who dollar dribble, who will be like, ah, yeah, like, I don't really need this little thing, but I'm going to purchase it out of convenience. So for example, you're at a Marks and Spencer and you are doing your weekly shop or whatever. And then you're like, ah, yeah, like, I don't know if I have like the fizzy pigtails at home, so I'm just gonna get one more bag. Okay, great. Then you don't eat the fizzy pigtails, they go stale, they get hard, great.
51:05 Speaker 01 The next time you're at the store, you're like, ah, okay, well, maybe I'll just get this magazine because I'll read it on the tube. Great, you didn't read the magazine. Now you've wasted what? The magazine money. Great. Now you're walking down the street, you walk by a super drug and you're like, oh, yeah, okay, cool, like, I could probably use a new blush. You get a blush. Turns out you didn't really do the research, it's not your color, looks bad on your face, you don't use it. These little purchases that did not actually spark any real joy for you are slowly just chipping away at these little things. These are very different purchases than a premeditated,
51:50 Speaker 01 let me go into the store and get this coffee that is delicious, it is better than the one I can make at home, and I am actually choosing to trade my money for this spark of joy. Don't spend mindlessly. When you purchase, I want you to love it. I want you to feel happy. You are allowed to spend money. Like, I can't believe that's a crazy thing I have to say out loud, but like, you are allowed to want to spend money. But it better spark joy. Don't make mindless purchases just because of convenience, just because you think you should have it, just because you want to pass the time.
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53:34 Speaker 00 Yeah, look after the pennies and the pounds look after themselves.
53:36 Speaker 01 Yeah.
53:36 Speaker 00 Right? 100%. What does a rich life actually mean to you?
53:40 Speaker 01 I think a rich life is not having to do anything, but getting to do things. So, I'm not there yet. I still have to do things. And if I'm honest, I would guess you are an incredibly successful person, but you still have to do some things. There will come a day where we don't have to do things. We get to do things. We only say yes to what really sparks joy. We only say yes to opportunities that add value to our lives. I have to do things because I am my parents' retirement plan. I have to do things because I haven't fully built out my family and I don't know what that's going to look like and what it's going to cost. But at some point, I will have full freedom over my time, over my life, and...
54:28 Speaker 01 Over my like calendar. And I think that's really rich.
54:33 Speaker 00 You know, it's so rich because because you're you're getting there, though, right? Having gone from JP JP Morgan and then workout now having your brand, your rich BFF.
54:41 Speaker 01 I'm getting closer, right?
54:42 Speaker 00 To this place, right?
54:43 Speaker 01 At JP Morgan, I had negative time freedom. They said, you're gonna be here at five forty five and you're gonna leave at seven. Okay. And frankly, if I had a client event, I'd have to then go to the client event and I would get to leave at like ten. I had no time freedom. At a place like my second job at BuzzFeed, I had more time freedom. I had to come in at nine, but if I wanted to go take a client out for lunch, I could then work from home for the rest of the day. I could I still had to work. But I could get it done. I get to make my own calendar now. But there are things that I do right now to learn. And there are things that I do to earn. And at some point, it won't matter. Like, I won't have to do things for money.
55:27 Speaker 01 I will just get to choose the things that I want to do. But now the money still matters.
55:32 Speaker 00 But I just want to say thank you.
55:33 Speaker 01 Of course.
55:34 Speaker 00 I know how busy you are. I know how jet lagged you are. I know all these things. I know how sought after you are, and I just appreciate a huge amount you coming here and speaking to me about this. Congratulations.
55:45 Speaker 01 No, thank you so much for having me. By the way, I only did this because I was promised free candy. No, I'm just kidding.
55:51 Speaker 00 Don't worry, we've got bags of it. Listen, before you go, we have eight quickfire questions. You ready for this? What's a saying or phrase that you'd want people to come away from this interview with?
56:02 Speaker 01 You have to make sacrifices for your dream, and if you don't, the dream is what you sacrifice.
56:06 Speaker 00 Best compliment anyone's ever given you about your work?
56:09 Speaker 01 It's not necessarily about my work, but I think the best compliment I always receive is when people meet me in person. And they're like, wow, you are exactly who you are in person as you are, you know, when I watch you on my phone. And I think that's just. Such a compliment for me because I try to keep it real. And I don't ever want to pretend to be someone that I'm not.
56:29 Speaker 00 And that's how you survive.
56:30 Speaker 01 Yeah.
56:30 Speaker 00 Because as soon as you stop being who you are, that's when it becomes confusing. And I think people, especially online, try and become someone else.
56:36 Speaker 01 Yeah.
56:36 Speaker 00 And actually, being yourself is the most important thing.
56:39 Speaker 01 I also frankly, and I'm not going to name names, but I have met some people that I have developed a parasocial relationship with online. And then I meet them in person and I'm so deeply disappointed. I'm like, bro, you're boring. And I'm like, how are you so interesting on camera, but like so weird in person? And I just don't ever want to disappoint someone.
56:58 Speaker 00 It's really upsetting, isn't it?
56:59 Speaker 01 It's so upsetting.
57:01 Speaker 00 What scares you most about yourself?
57:03 Speaker 01 I think I can sometimes be blinded by ambition.
57:06 Speaker 00 Do you sacrifice friendships and family time for that?
57:10 Speaker 01 Yeah. And I think that like, if I am not careful, I could regret that eventually. Like, I wish I saw my parents more. I had lunch with one of my girlfriends who happens to be in London, literally yesterday. And she asked me, she was like, how often do you get to go out and see friends and do something fun? And I said, once a quarter.
57:30 Speaker 00 Yeah, no, no.
57:31 Speaker 01 And I did not like how that sounded coming out of my mouth.
57:33 Speaker 00 When was the last time you cried?
57:35 Speaker 01 Ooh. Oh, I, I, I remember. This is so humiliating. The season finale of The Summer I Turned Pretty. Like, I'm sorry, but I love love. I was just so excited when they announced the movie. I mean, like.
57:53 Speaker 00 This is great.
57:54 Speaker 01 I don't know, that's like kind of an embarrassing answer.
57:56 Speaker 00 No, it's not, you're giving us the best answer.
57:57 Speaker 01 I'm like in tears. My husband's like, it's not that good. I'm like, okay, well, to you.
58:04 Speaker 00 What's something you can't let go of?
58:06 Speaker 01 A grudge. I, okay, so, just, all right, hear me out. I'm not crazy, but when I have been wronged by someone.
58:17 Speaker 01 I will take it to the grave with me.
58:20 Speaker 00 You will hold it?
58:20 Speaker 01 Hell, yeah. And people are like, oh, Vivian, that poisons you from the inside. I don't care. Also, no, it doesn't. It takes no effort to hate you forever. I will hold on to that spite because you know what it is? I use it like jet fuel. Like, I remember there was this one girl who DM'd me. I knew her from high school. She DM'd me one of my own videos. And this was when I was just starting. I didn't have like a book. I didn't have a podcast. I hadn't gotten all these awards. And she sent it to me with the caption or like the comment, she's so cringe. And it was clear that she had meant that for somebody else and they were like talking about me behind my back. And I never forgot it.
59:04 Speaker 01 And I may or may not have made a deliberate effort to post about all of the wins that I've consistently had since then. Not only on my Urh BFF handle, but my secret Instagram because I need her to see it.
59:24 Speaker 01 I just, I like, I, you know what? It makes me so happy because it is not enough for me to win. I need to see my enemies fail. And you know what? No one else is gonna say that out loud, but we're all thinking it.
59:42 Speaker 00 What's your guilty pleasure?
59:43 Speaker 01 Can I be really honest with you? And I'm not just saying this to like blow smoke up your ass. Like, I love candy.
59:48 Speaker 00 Really?
59:49 Speaker 01 Like, I will go home and just demolish. Like, I love it all.
59:55 Speaker 00 What turns you off?
59:56 Speaker 01 Someone who doesn't follow through. Like, that is my nightmare. Say what you are going to do and do what you're, do what you said.
1:00:07 Speaker 00 Reliability.
1:00:07 Speaker 01 Yeah. Be someone I can count on.
1:00:10 Speaker 00 A hundred percent. What turns you on?
1:00:15 Speaker 01 People who are passionate, it doesn't necessarily have to be the same thing that I'm passionate about, but I think that's why I like was so initially attracted to my husband. Is that like, he had a vision for his life and I had a vision for mine. And we were able to make that vision work together. And he never was like, ah, like, one of us is gonna have to step back. It was never that. It was always like, we can always make this work as a team.
1:00:45 Speaker 00 Wow.
1:00:45 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:00:46 Speaker 00 What do you like most about yourself?
1:00:48 Speaker 01 What most people consider like a negative quality of being like a little flighty, a little ADHD, whatever, I consider to be one of my greatest strengths. Because I am able, like, my brain is so small. I am able to just forget. Like rejection, no's, losses. Give me 45 minutes, I'll be thinking about something else again. But I think that's made me incredibly resilient.
1:01:20 Speaker 00 Yeah.
1:01:21 Speaker 01 And I love to make these jokes about how I have a small brain and I'm dumb. But like, I think it's actually like almost protective of me and what I've built. Because if I have a bad pitch.
1:01:33 Speaker 00 Yeah.
1:01:34 Speaker 01 And I'm like, God, that was a really bad pitch. I don't say I'm bad at pitching. I just say, damn, that sucks.
1:01:42 Speaker 00 Yeah.
1:01:43 Speaker 01 All right, what are we having for lunch? I am able.
1:01:46 Speaker 00 To drop.
1:01:47 Speaker 01 Yeah, quite quickly. And I think that resilience is why I've been able to build a successful life. I don't think I'm smarter than other people. I don't think I'm, you know, better in any of those ways. What I think it is, is I've just been able to do it for longer. I have a higher pain threshold and I am able to just forget.
1:02:08 Speaker 00 Resilience is fundamentally one of the most important things we've got to have in life.
1:02:12 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:02:12 Speaker 00 And I'm the same as you. But it's interesting that you can hold a grudge, but you can drop those things.
1:02:17 Speaker 01 Yeah, but the grudge is fun.
1:02:20 Speaker 01 Because you know what? There is not one single person that has wronged me, whose life didn't get worse. And I watched it happen. I'm not praying on your downfall, I'm going to actively participate.
1:02:33 Speaker 00 Viv, you're amazing. Listen, I want everyone to go and get Rich AF. It's in the link in our show description. You're incredible. Thank you so much and you've been great company.
1:02:41 Speaker 01 Thank you so much for having me.
1:02:44 Speaker 00 That was amazing.
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