Ibn Fadlan: An Arab Among Vikings

**This podcast contains descriptions of sexual violence, enslavement and human sacrifice** "I have never seen more perfect physical specimens, tall as date palms, blond and ruddy. Each man were tattooed with dark-green figures from fingernails to neck." These are the first observations of Vikings from the Arab traveler and diplomat Ibn Fadlan. Dr. Eleanor Janega is joined by Dr. Thorir Jonsson Hraundal to explore Ibn Fadlan's extraordinary observations of a Viking ship burial during his journey to the Volga Bulgars in 921 CE. From the initial preparation of the body to the final emotionally and culturally charged moments of cremation, Ibn Fadlan provides a rare and vivid description that offers unparalleled insights into Viking funerary practices. This riveting account paints a picture of ritual, belief, and cultural intersection. The Rise of the Vikings https://open.spotify.com/episode/0MNLrJxc5ri920VjZ2mqKv The Viking Age: New Discoveries https://open.spotify.com/episode/0aChBL6wP2qPpSz5al8tp2 Gone Medieval is presented by Dr. Eleanor Janega. It was edited by Amy Haddow, the producer is Rob Weinberg. The senior producer is Anne-Marie Luff. All music used is courtesy of Epidemic Sounds. Gone Medieval is a History Hit podcast. Sign up to History Hit for hundreds of hours of original documentaries, with a new release every week and ad-free podcasts. Sign up at https://www.historyhit.com/subscribe. You can take part in our listener survey here: https://insights.historyhit.com/history-hit-podcast-always-on Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Matt Lewis?

  From long-lost Viking ships and kings buried in unexpected places, to tales of murder, power, faith, and the lives of ordinary people across medieval Europe and beyond. Join me, Matt Lewis, Dr. Eleanor Yarnagger, and some of the world's leading historians as we bring history's most fascinating stories to life, only on History Hit. With your subscription, you'll unlock hundreds of hours of exclusive documentaries with a brand new release every week, exploring everything from the ancient world to World War II. Just visit historyhit.com/subscribe.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  Hey, it's Adam Grant from TED's Rethinking Podcast. As businesses scale, success depends on how well knowledge is captured, shared, and kept up to date. Camtasia Pro turns teams' expertise into engaging training, onboarding, and documentation. No professional editing experience required. With the industry's best screen recording, video editing, and AI-powered workflows, you can train faster and boost operational efficiency. Get over $100 off your first year at camtasiapro.com and start building a smarter way to educate customers, onboard employees, and ensure valuable expertise is shared across teams.

• 1:16Speaker 02

  This is Steve Covino from Covino and Rich. Quick trivia, fellas. Every guy listening is a contestant. Answer honestly to yourself. You got a belly and a little chest? Gassed by the afternoon, no drive left in the tank? You lack that confidence and mental edge? Those are classic signs that your testosterone's been sliding. And nothing drags it down faster than extra weight. So why not take matters into your own hands? Strip off the weight that tanks your testosterone with Bioma GLP-1 Booster. Every serving is packed with science-backed ingredients that crank up your natural GLP-1 production. Visit bioma.health/GLP1 and use code CRSHOW for 15% off your first order.

• 1:55Speaker 03

  Get under a blanket and get comfy. This message is sponsored by ADT. It's back to school, back to work, back to cozy nights at home season. And ADT is here for every moment of it. They handle your home security so you can focus on spending time with the people who matter. They make it easy with professionally installed systems you can access right from the ADT Plus app. If you need help, their reps are on call 24/7 at the most company-operated monitoring centers in the industry. You deserve some cozy back-to-home time. ADT will keep an eye out. When every second counts, count on ADT. Visit ADT.com today.

• 2:39Eleanor Janega?

  Hello, I'm Dr. Eleanor Yanaga, and welcome to Gone Medieval from History Hit, the podcast that delves into the greatest millennium in human history. We uncover the greatest mysteries, the gob-smacking details, and the latest groundbreaking research from the Vikings to the Normans, from kings to popes, to the Crusades. We delve into the rebellions, plots, and murders that tell us who we really were.

• 3:08Eleanor Janega?

  And how we got here.

• 3:13Eleanor Janega?

  Please be aware that this episode contains graphic descriptions of sexual violence, enslavement, and human sacrifice.

• 3:24Eleanor Janega?

  In the depths of the winter of 921 CE, on the banks of the Volga River, an exotic figure surveys the scene before him in wonder and horror. His breath hangs in the frigid air as a Viking longship is set ablaze, flames licking hungrily at its wooden hull. Atop the pyre lies a fallen chieftain and a sacrificed slave girl, surrounded by weapons and treasures arrayed to accompany him on his journey to Valhalla.

• 4:04Eleanor Janega?

  The visitor bearing witness is Ahmad Ibn Fadlan, Arab traveler, diplomat, and writer, whose account, or risala, of his journey from Baghdad to the Volga Bulgars would bequeath to all time extraordinary insights into cultures, customs, and peoples of Eastern Europe and Central Asia during the early medieval period. As an envoy from the Adesid Caliphate, Ibn Fadlan has been tasked with a mission to the Volga Bulgars. But along his route, he has encountered an array of tribes and cultures that have made a lasting impression on him.

• 4:42Eleanor Janega?

  Among the most memorable are the Rus, or Vikings, traveling along the Volga.

• 4:51Matt Lewis?

  I have seen the Rus as they came on their merchant journeys and encamped by the Volga. I've never seen more perfect physical specimens, tall as date palms, blond and ruddy. They wear neither tunics nor kaftans, but the men wear a garment which covers one side of the body and leaves a hand free. Each man has an axe, a sword, and a knife, and keeps each by him at all times. The swords are broad and grooved, of Frankish sort. Every man is tattooed from fingernails to neck with dark green or green or blue-black trees and figures.

• 5:37Matt Lewis?

  They are the filthiest of God's creatures. They have no modesty in defecation and urination, nor do they wash after pollution from orgasm, nor do they wash their hands after eating. Thus, they are like wild asses. When they have come from their land and anchored on or tied up at the shore of the Volga, which is a great river, they build big houses of wood on the shore, each holding 10 to 20 persons, more or less.

• 6:09Eleanor Janega?

  Who is this Ahmad Ibn Fadlan? How did his epic journeys come about? And why has his account of his travels made such an enduring impact on our understanding of the Vikings and other peoples?

• 6:24Eleanor Janega?

  To answer these questions and many more, I'm delighted to be joined today by Dr. Thorir Jonsson-Harundal, founder and director of Middle Eastern Studies at the University of Iceland.

• 6:40Eleanor Janega?

  Welcome to Gone Medieval, Thorir.

• 6:42Speaker 05

  Thank you. Thank you for having me.

• 6:44Eleanor Janega?

  I am very excited to have you on today. Can we start by finding out a bit more about Ibn Fadlan? Because I think this is one of these names where when you're a medieval historian, this is a household name. We all know who this is. Our ears all prick up and we get very excited. But I think for the average person, it's a little more esoteric. So I guess we have to kind of start with the basics. And I have to ask when and where he was born.

• 7:11Speaker 05

  Yeah, that's absolutely correct. Ibn Fadlan is one of those, yeah, well, almost household names for medieval historians. And a lot of people have heard of him, not least in connection with the Viking Age. And as it is, we know very little about the man. We know his name and that he is living in or departing from Baghdad when he's starting his travelogue. But apart from that, we know next to nothing about him, except what comes across in the text and what we can infer. So questions such as when and where he was born is not something that we can answer with any certainty.

• 7:48Eleanor Janega?

  And do we have an idea of what may have been happening, I suppose, more particularly in the Middle East at the time? I think there is some sort of speculation that he's born under the rule of the Abbasid Caliphate at the very least, you know. But sometimes I've heard him attributed to Baghdad, but I think that's maybe a little far-fetched.

• 8:11Speaker 05

  Well, absolutely. This is the period of the Abbasids. The Abbasids took over from the Umayyads in 750, and they had their so-called Golden Age during the 9th century. By the time Ibn Fadlan takes on his journey, his now famous journey into Central Asia and beyond, the Abbasids are declining somewhat. He is writing in the Caliphate of Al Muqtadir, who is actually mentioned in the text. And around that time, 920s, 930s, the Abbasids are literally in dire straits. They are, they've emptied their budgets and it's not far, we're not far from a period of time which we sometimes refer to as the Persian interlude, when Persian dynasties actually take over

• 8:57Speaker 05

  de facto rule in Baghdad and the caliph becomes a kind of a puppet of there. So it's kind of difficult times in the caliphate. And one of the possible reasons behind Ibn Fadlan's journey so far northwards is to cement ties with Farof peoples and then spreading Islam and so on.

• 9:15Eleanor Janega?

  I suppose I have to also ask you, one of the questions that comes up a lot in discussions about Ibn Fadlan is, are we certain even at all if he is of Arab descent? Because there has been some speculation, if I am not too far off the map, that his writing style indicates that he may not be a native Arabic speaker.

• 9:40Speaker 05

  Right, there have been some speculations. There was the one that theorized that he was of Greek origin or something like that, but it has proved impossible to prove. At one point in the text, when he is talking to the king of the Volga Bulgars, the king actually mentions his ethnicity, states him to be an Arab as opposed to his travelling companions and therefore he trusts him over them and so on. So we have in the text at least an indication. But as I say, there are so many things about them that we can't really be sure of. People can learn languages and, you know.

• 10:19Eleanor Janega?

  I think that that's a really important point, actually, because it is possible for people to become multilingual. I know that oftentimes, especially in the Anglophone sphere, that seems as though it is magical or something, but people pick up languages all the time.

• 10:34Speaker 05

  All the time, at all times. And from, yes, exactly.

• 10:37Eleanor Janega?

  What was Ibn Fadlan's actual profession? Because, I mean, he certainly has at least some standing at the Abbasid court based on what he ends up doing, or am I just, you know, wishing things on to him?

• 10:53Speaker 05

  So again, we can't be sure. During the mission to the king of the Volga Bulgars, he does have some responsibilities. He is entrusted with bringing money. He is supposed to read the official letters from the caliph and so on. So he seems to be some kind of, well, almost like a diplomat or some kind of diplomat or a political envoy of some sorts. Ibn Fadlan is also entrusted with directing the Volga Bulgars in how to practice the Islamic faith, how they should call to prayer and so on. So he seems to have a lot of different obligations or duties in the journey.

• 11:36Speaker 05

  But we don't know what his profession was in Baghdad or wherever he came from.

• 11:42Eleanor Janega?

  Can you tell us a little bit more about the mission itself? Because here we have Ibn Fadlan certainly sent off about 9:21 or so, I think we believe the date is. Is this just a religious quest? Is there, what is the caliph trying to get out of it?

• 12:02Speaker 05

  There are several objectives connected to this journey. And Ibn Fadlan is nice enough to actually explain at the beginning of his writing, why the journey is made. So there are people called the Volga Bulgars, some thousands of kilometers north of the caliphate, living in where today we have Tatarstan in Russia.

• 12:25Speaker 05

  And these Volga Bulgars had embraced Islam at some point, probably around 900. And before Ibn Fadlan makes his journey, they had sent an envoy to the caliph in Baghdad, asking him for help, to send someone who could instruct them in the ways of Islam.

• 12:46Speaker 05

  Send him money so he could build a force to protect himself against his enemies and so on. So there are these explicit reasons for the for the journey.

• 12:56Eleanor Janega?

  Do we know exactly how the Volga Bulgars converted to Islam in the first place? Because they seem a little bit off piece from what our general understanding of the Islamic world is at the time.

• 13:08Speaker 05

  Exactly. We don't know exactly, but it's probably around 900 or shortly before that. So the history of the Volga Bulgars is a little bit complicated and we need to go back a couple of centuries because around the 5th and 6th century, the Bulgare actually were one group of people living north of the Black Sea. In the early 7th century, they split into two different peoples. One often goes westwards to what we now know as Bulgaria, the Balkan Bulgaria, and the other actually went eastwards and northwards to the mid-Volga region. And those who did retain their original Turkic language and their Turkic customs

• 13:52Speaker 05

  and at some point embraced Islam.

• 13:54Eleanor Janega?

  So did they retain of any of their old customs and practices when they did this? You know, is this a kind of amalgamation of cultures? Or are they really hoping to import some of the culture from the Caliphate?

• 14:09Speaker 05

  So both, yeah, I would say. We do have instances of or insights into the old ways of these Turkic Bulgare people, Ibn Fadlan, because Ibn Fadlan is very conscientious in describing the customs of the people he sees and observes. And so he tells a lot that we know or that we assume or not customs that emerged in their or after their contact with Islam, but rather we should relate to be more original or older customs, actually, relating to inheritance issues on which Ibn Fadlan needs to correct them and inform

• 14:50Speaker 05

  them on the Islamic law and inheritance issues. And he talks about their religious views in relation to animism and tangrism. He talks about

• 15:02Speaker 05

  Punishment for for things like adultery and so on, which have nothing to do with Islam and are evidently or apparently the customs that they had themselves before being acquainted with Islam.

• 15:15Eleanor Janega?

  I love that because I find those cultures so interesting, the mix of religious customs and cultures that you get. And I think it's also indicative of how much moving around people actually did in the medieval world. You know, these people were able to convert to Islam essentially on their own. And they know enough to say, I know where to write to get a little bit more help in making sure that our theology is up to scratch. And I think that's really interesting, because I think at this point in time, we tend to sort of think of the world as a bit more cut off from different regions.

• 15:54Speaker 05

  Yeah. So we have to see the Islamization of the Volga Bulgars also in relation with what is happening in the region sort of east of the Caspian Sea, what we now today call Central Asia. There are people that are called the Semanids, who are actually very powerful in the 9th century. And it's through them probably that the Bulgars somehow come into contact with Islam. There is a lot of trade going on on the east of the Caspian Sea. A lot of it actually went northwards before 900, a lot of it went northwards west of the Caspian Sea through the realm of the Khazars. But at some point, at the end of

• 16:36Speaker 05

  the 9th century, it actually changes and the main trade routes start to lead from the Khurasan Highway in what is today northern Iran and northward east of the Caspian Sea.

• 16:47Eleanor Janega?

  You've touched on something here, though, because part of what the Volga Bulgars had indicated they were interested in receiving from the Caliphate is help with building a fortress. And this is linked to what they perceive to be a threat from the Khazars, right? So how do they see that Ibn Fadlan's mission is going to help with that?

• 17:09Speaker 05

  Right, yeah, yeah. And we actually get an indication of that in the text itself. The son of the Volga Bulgars actually been held captive by the Khazars, and they are a very present threat in the texts. But there's an interesting moment in the account, where after travelling with the king in his territory, Ibn Fadlan asks the king of the Volga Bulgars, and says something like, "You have all these lands and all this wealth, you could have built a fortress yourself." And the king of the Volga Bulgars replies that he was not only looking for money from the caliphate, but also the blessing of the caliphate. And he said something like, "The money or the wealth that the caliphate has amassed is fairly acquired."

• 17:53Speaker 05

  And he wants kind of, even if that's a subterfuge as well, but he wants at least to make it look like he's looking for a religious or a justification, and the blessing from the caliphate himself, the leader of the faithful.

• 18:06Eleanor Janega?

  That's really interesting, because it's sort of indicative that there is an understanding of ethics in the acquiring of wealth there. And I don't know, kind of maybe a little bit of an admission that perhaps whatever the Volga Bulgars were up to prior to their conversion, of that being a little, oh, I don't know, immoral, possibly.

• 18:31Speaker 05

  Well, Ibn Fadlan describes a lot of their customs, and he is not only of the Bulgars, but a lot of the peoples he meets on the way to the mid-Volga region. He's coming from Baghdad, where things like hygiene and other practices were held in high regard. Many of the customs he observed on his way appalled him.

• 18:51Eleanor Janega?

  I think that it's pretty easy to be appalled once you leave Baghdad. I mean, they have a pretty good standard of living in Baghdad. I always say that, you know, it's one of the places that I would be happy to live in if I was forced to go back in time and live in the Middle Ages. I think Baghdad is one of the ones where life's pretty alright. Does he see himself as being successful in his mission to bring on these ideas of culture and various Islamic practices? Because you mentioned that he's very instrumental in instructing them in things like who inherits, but he's also got a pretty large religious mission as well. How can one man really do all of this?

• 19:31Speaker 05

  That's a very good question. That's actually a very interesting feature of Ibn Fadlan's account. And here is where we kind of get to see a bit into his mind and to see, you know, learn a bit about him as a person and views and feelings. And it's quite unusual, because if we think about for whom this work was intended on his return to Baghdad, we can come to that later. It is quite surprising that he does not really or not continuously show himself in a very favorable light. So we have this instances where he is trying hard to correct the Muayyads' call to prayer. But when the king of the

• 20:15Speaker 05

  Walqa Bulgars is insulted or is unhappy with something Ibn Fadlan does, he tells him to do it in the wrong way. There is another instance where Ibn Fadlan is deep in conversation with the king of the Walqa Bulgars, and they are arguing about specifics of Islamic law. And the king of the Walqa Bulgars comes out victorious from that debate, and Ibn Fadlan somewhat humiliated. So that's a very unusual way that he portrays himself, and which, of course, makes this account so very engaging, and makes Ibn Fadlan so very human, I think.

• 20:48Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, I agree. I think it's such a fascinating source that we have, because ordinarily, when you get sources from the Middle Ages, especially if they are meant to be quasi-historical, they just shed the best possible light on whoever is writing them or whoever has paid the money for them. And this is a really vulnerable person who talks about his frustrations, and he's petty, and he doesn't always get things right, and he doesn't always win.

• 21:18Speaker 05

  Exactly. And then he complains and, you know, he complains of the cold in Khwaraasan, where they are crossing, it's getting really cold. And he has this description of how his beard freezes up and he's really kind of, you know, he gives out a lot of kind of, I think, original human emotion. Maybe he's not a literary person or something. He's not used to, because there's been a lot of search for tropes or topoi in his writings, and that's very little, or a few Quranic references, but that's about it.

• 21:53Eleanor Janega?

  And that's what makes this so cool. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love a bit of moralizing or, you know, a particular character arc as much as the next person. And it's what helps us understand medieval people. But I want to know about your faults, about you as a person.

• 22:10Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 22:12Eleanor Janega?

  Well, let's talk a little bit about the journey itself, because this is an incredibly long one. And as you say, it's quite arduous at times, especially for someone who's used to living it up in Baghdad. And I think we think that it takes more or less around a year. Do we have a really good account of what the journey was like? Or does this kind of go in and out as Ibn Fadlan travels along?

• 22:40Speaker 05

  Well, his account of the journey is quite detailed. And first of all, he makes mention of the places he stops in, where he goes eastward from Baghdad and into what is today Turkmenistan and Uzbekistan, these regions. So these regions are all fairly Islamized and well-known to the Muslims. Khwaraasan, close by, was a central region, was a very important region to the Muslims and especially the Abbasids. But then he takes a turn northwards and heads to where today we find the Aral Sea or what's left of it. And there, around that region, and what's called the Usturt Plateau,

• 23:25Speaker 05

  that is what we would call kind of a frontier between the Islamic world and the steppes to the north. And that's where he starts meeting these interesting people he describes, such as the Rus and the Pajuneks and the Basgirs, most of whom are of Turkic origin and steeped in this ancient kind of Turco-Persian culture.

• 23:46Eleanor Janega?

  I love the Pajinex. They're one of my favorite groups of people.

• 23:49Speaker 05

  I love the Pajinex.

• 23:50Eleanor Janega?

  So I always love hearing more about them. They're great.

• 23:54Speaker 05

  They are.

• 23:55Eleanor Janega?

  But one of the groups of people we learn about too is in particular the Oghuz Turks. And he doesn't have very nice things to say about them. In particular, he's really down on them, even though I think they're an exciting bunch of people.

• 24:09Speaker 05

  Well, they are. The Rus or the Oghuz, as the Greeks called them, are very interesting people. And there seems to have, because Ibn Fadlan delivers a letter to At-rak, the leader of the Rus. So they seem to be part of that mission as well. The Rus, we know, later on become a very powerful people. They kind of merged with the confederation that ultimately became the Seljuks and invaded Anatolia. And so, no, the Rus actually receive a fairly long description in Ibn Fadlan's work compared to the Pajinex and the Basques, for example. And interestingly, and we can come to that later, there are some overlaps between the description of the Rus and the Rus he describes later in his work. But yeah, some of the descriptions of the Rus are not very flattering.

• 24:55Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, there's a lot of complaining about how he thinks that they are insufficiently monotheistic, right? He's like, I don't, I don't care for the way that they swear to the heavens, for example. And I find these so interesting because it makes perfect sense. You know, if you are Islamic, it does seem to be a little out of character. But for us, it's so rich and engaging that it's difficult to get mad at them in the same way that Ibn Fadlan does.

• 25:27Speaker 05

  Yeah, but then it's also so fascinating, you know, in the context of this account, there's this famous occurrence where the wife of the Rus leader actually lifts up her skirts and scratches her revolver. And Ibn Fadlan and his companions are obviously shocked and appalled by this behavior. Ibn Fadlan allows the chieftain to explain it and explains it something like, you know, it's better that you can see it and not get to it, rather than you get to it, or something like that. But I think that he actually allows him to, allows the pagan to explain himself in a logical way. I think that's very unusual. So he seems to be like a conscientious ethnographer who actually allows all the voices he hears, you know, come across.

• 26:12Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, I find that to be a really interesting point because he includes these things. You know, he's not sufficiently shocked that he doesn't include them, that he thinks that our sensibilities need to be protected from these stories at all. Does this at all change his own sensibilities? Or is this just a kind of, I don't know, a symbol of a fairly broad mind?

• 26:39Speaker 05

  I, I, yeah, that's a, that's a good point. Yeah. It doesn't seem to be on a high horse at any rate. I mean.

• 26:46Eleanor Janega?

  Let's then chat about my favorite guys, the Pechinex, because here he is, he's, he's found them. The, the people with the coolest hats in all the medieval world, in my opinion. And what does he have to say about the Pechinex?

• 27:00Speaker 05

  Well, not very much. Apparently, he allots a paragraph or so to the Pechinex. But he's not very, very fond of the Pechinex and he, he thinks they are very poor, especially compared to the Rus.

• 27:12Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, and I, I find that so interesting because for me, I, I guess that I'm like, I don't care if they're poor. I want to know what they're doing. But there does seem to be at play, especially for medieval people, almost a hierarchy of who is important to record based on who has a lot of wealth. So the Rus get a lot of time because they're wealthy, even if they are, I don't know, the, a bit uncivilized in his opinion. But the Pechinex, who I just think are really, they're just cool guys. It's like, ah, you don't need to know about that. Those are just some poor people. And I'm like, oh, but, but I want to know more about them. And then we, we just don't get the same level of detail.

• 27:53Speaker 05

  That's a, that's a great point. Actually, apparently connected to wealth. Yeah, who gets more space, more, more sentences on. Yeah, but there's a couple of places, even if that line's a counter is quite weird. Because usually it's, uh, it's, it's quite straightforward and, and, and so on. But that is in this very short description on, on the Pechinex. He talks about their sheep and how in winter, where they eat snow, they grow really fat, but in the summer, when they can eat grass, they grow very, very, very thin. So that's one of the few places where even fat land kind of inverts the world in a way. I don't know what to make of that.

• 28:29Eleanor Janega?

  Well, it just sounds like they're going on a seasonal diet to me.

• 28:34Eleanor Janega?

  It's very relatable to us now.

• 28:36Speaker 05

  He's so conscientious of being factual about, you know, a lot of other things. But this makes absolutely no sense.

• 28:54Matt Lewis?

  This time of year can easily just feel a bit off. The days get shorter, the routines change. And honestly, you might just find yourself feeling irritable, perhaps a little less motivated or a bit more tired. Just getting through things feels like more of a slog than normal. It might feel easier to just push through it or even try and ignore how you're feeling and just blame the season. But if it's starting to affect your day to day life, talking to a therapist can help you to better understand why you're feeling like this and can genuinely help. That's where Rula comes in. Rula makes it easier to find a licensed therapist who meets your needs and importantly, takes your insurance.

• 29:38Matt Lewis?

  You don't have to spend weeks searching or sitting on a waitlist. They partner with over 120 insurance plans and the average copay for Rula patients is just $15 a session. Rula helps you pick a therapist based on your goals, preferences and needs with appointments available as soon as tomorrow. Getting support shouldn't add another layer of stress. So let Rula lighten the mental load. If this time of year has you feeling less like yourself, talking to someone can be a good place to start. Visit rula.com-medieval to get started. That's R U L A dot com forward slash medieval.

• 30:20Matt Lewis?

  You deserve mental health care that works with you, not against your budget.

• 30:28Speaker 06

  Granger knows if you're a procurement manager at an industrial manufacturing facility, you're balancing inventory and budget while sourcing critical supplies across the operation. Too much inventory, costs climb. Too little, production slows. Granger's $2 billion in on-hand inventory helps you get what you need when you need it, so you can help keep budgets balanced and lines moving. Call 1-800-GRANGER, click Granger.com, or just stop by. Granger, for the ones who get it done.

• 30:58Speaker 07

  I've got big news. I switched to Verizon and got the new iPhone 18 Pro. Shh. I can keep my old phone and I also get the latest iPhone every year. Shh. Anything else? Verizon let me choose Apple Watch Series 12 or iPad on them. Everybody, listen up. Shh. Switch to Verizon and get the new iPhone 18 Pro now. No trade-in needed, and the latest iPhone every year with Simplicity Plan. Plus, choose Apple Watch Series 12 or iPad on us. Simplicity Plan with Simplicity Pro required. Plan and device payment purchase are separate agreements with separate terms. Service plan for Watch or iPad required. Additional terms apply for all offers.

• 31:28Speaker 01

  Hey, it's Adam Grant from TED's Rethinking Podcast. As businesses scale, success depends on how well knowledge is captured, shared, and kept up to date. Camtasia Pro turns teams' expertise into engaging training, onboarding, and documentation. No professional editing experience required. With the industry's best screen recording, video editing, and AI-powered workflows, you can train faster and boost operational efficiency. Get over $100 off your first year at camtasia pro.com and start building a smarter way to educate customers, onboard employees, and ensure valuable expertise is shared across teams.

• 32:16Eleanor Janega?

  I was just going to say, you've touched on this already, but one of the big things that he brings up over and over again is people's hygiene practices, which he finds pretty scandalous as compared to what is happening in Baghdad. And I mean, is this just, do you think, symptomatic of a really different lifestyles? You know, it's one thing to be a kind of nomadic tribe. You can't always set up a bathhouse, whereas if you have a really huge and incredible city, it's very, very easy to do so. But this almost seems to him to be... A really important, almost moral issue, the way that he writes about it.

• 32:56Speaker 05

  Yeah, I agree.

• 32:58Eleanor Janega?

  We've got this thing from, you know, the the Vashrids, when he's talking about people fishing in their robes for lice and then eating them.

• 33:06Speaker 05

  Exactly.

• 33:07Eleanor Janega?

  And for me, that's interesting because it's almost animalistic, the way that he talks about it. You know, that's how we would describe, I don't know, troops of baboons or something like that. And it seems like he's getting very close to that because he often says that people are the wickedest and the filthiest.

• 33:23Speaker 05

  Exactly.

• 33:24Eleanor Janega?

  At the same time. You know, it's like the dirt that is on them is also something about their moral failings, almost.

• 33:30Speaker 05

  Exactly. But yeah, that's very interesting. And it's also because I think you were mentioning the the possibility that Ibn Fadlan's experiences had the effect on him that he maybe got used to some of it or something like that. So this is a bit earlier on. And we can also see that, you know, when he's with the the Volka Bulgur, the communal bathing, people, men and women bathe together in the same river naked and so on. So it's it's it's quite possible to relate to Ibn Fadlan that as his journey and his experiences kind of accumulate, he gets used to more and more things, or he knows that he will have to get used to some of these things because he can't be in a perpetual state of shock. So maybe that's reflected in the text, yeah.

• 34:15Eleanor Janega?

  I think one of my favorite stories, and I will give him this, I feel like it's okay to be shocked about it. You know, he recounts this one story about the Bashkirs, where they're kissing a wooden phallus before they enter battle. And he's really not happy about that one, which, you know, I'll give him, I can understand why that's a little bit confronting. But how does he reconcile this with his own religious views? You know, when he sees behaviors like this, does he say, oh, well, all right, this is a teachable moment. I'm going to try to bring these people into the light of Islam and get them to stop behaving this way. Or does he throw his hands up and say, oof, we're just too far gone here. There's nothing I can do if we're kissing wooden phalluses.

• 35:02Speaker 05

  Yes, maybe closer to the latter one, because this is a very interesting, and of course it would be a very shocking thing to a religious Muslim, not only at that time, but at any time probably. But again, Ibn Fadlan surprises us a little bit, I think, instead of being all kind of condescending and entering teacher or religious mentor mode, he actually surprises us with a fairly good descriptions of what we should maybe assume is Tangerrism, at least animism of some sort. He starts recounting that they have lords for various natural phenomena, like the wind, a lord for trees, a lord for horses, and so on. So again, he's often like an ethnographer on site.

• 35:42Eleanor Janega?

  And, you know, really, thank God he is, because we get rather a lot out of it. So Ibn Fadlan's part encounters the Rus, and this is a group of, they're essentially Viking traders, and he meets them when they finally reach the Volga Bulgars. Can you tell us a little bit about how he describes them? Because this is one of the sections that we get a pretty graphic description of them.

• 36:09Speaker 05

  Yeah, absolutely. He encounters this group of people he calls the Rus, Rusia, when he is on his stay in Volga Bulgar, in the Volga Bulgar realm. And he actually, yeah, gives us a fairly detailed descriptions of their physique, of their hygienic practices, and so on. And he's very awestruck by their physique, and compares them to palm trees and so on. And then, you know, conversely, very unimpressed with their hygiene, and calls them on one occasions that they are like asses. So he has mixed feelings about these strange people, about these strange people he has met in Turkic lands of the Volga Bulgars.

• 36:51Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, I love this particular portrayal, because he gets so...

• 36:57Eleanor Janega?

  Detailed in his descriptions of them. And one of the things we really lack a lot of the time in medieval sources is physical descriptions of people. They'll, we get something really dull where people will just say, oh, he is handsome. She is beautiful. And we don't get to find out anything more than that. But Ibn Fadlann is like, these guys are blonde. They are tall. They, you know, they, they have ruddy cheeks. You know, he gives us all these great little details and not just about the way they look, but also their clothes and their weapons and, and even their trading practices. And it's so lively when ordinarily we don't get to hear anything about what people look like at all.

• 37:41Speaker 05

  Absolutely. We get quite a long description as well. And in fact, the account in Ibn Fadlann's on the Rus or the, the Eastern Vikings is the longest portrayal of a Viking society at any time or place in any, any source that we know of. So that's quite remarkable that actually came from, from an Arab or a Muslim traveling from Baghdad.

• 38:04Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, it's really fantastic. I think one of my very, very favorite things in it is we get this incredible description of a Rus ship burial.

• 38:17Matt Lewis?

  I have heard that at the deaths of their chief personages, they did many things, of which the least was cremation. And I was interested to learn more. At last I was told of the death of one of their outstanding men. They placed him in a grave and put a roof over it for 10 days while they cut and sewed garments for him. If the deceased is a poor man, they make a little boat which they lay him in and burn. If he is rich, they collect his goods and divide them into three parts. One for his family, another to pay for his clothing and a third for making intoxicating

• 38:57Matt Lewis?

  drink, which they drink until the day when his female slave will kill herself and be burned with her master. They stupify themselves by drinking this beer night and day. Sometimes one of them dies cup in hand. When the man of whom I have spoken died, his girl slaves were asked, "Who will die with him?" One answered, "I." She was then put in the care of two young women, who watched over her and accompanied her everywhere, to the point that they occasionally washed her feet with their own hands. Garments were being made for the deceased, and all else was being readied of which he had need.

• 39:41Matt Lewis?

  Meanwhile, the slave drinks every day and sings, giving herself over to pleasure. When the day arrived on which the man was to be cremated, I went to the river on which was his ship. I saw that they had drawn the ship on to the shore, and that they had erected four posts of birch wood and other wood, and that around the ship was made a structure, like great ships' tents, out of wood. Then, they pulled the ship up until it was on this wooden construction. Then, they began to come and go, and to speak words which I did not understand, while the man was still in his grave and had not yet been brought out.

• 40:22Matt Lewis?

  The tenth day, having drawn the ship up on to the riverbank, they guarded it. In the middle of the ship they prepared a dome, or pavilion, of wood, and covered this with various sorts of fabric. Then, they brought a couch, and put it on the ship, and covered it with a mattress of Greek brocade. Then, came an old woman whom they call "The Angel of Death", and she spread upon the couch the furnishings mentioned. It is she who has charge of the clothes-making and arranging all things, and it is she who kills the girl slave. I saw that she was a strapping old woman, fat and lowering.

• 41:05Matt Lewis?

  When they came to the grave, they removed the earth from above the wood, then the wood, and took out the dead man clad in the garments in which he had died. I saw that he had grown black from the cold of the country. They put intoxicating drink, fruit, and a stringed instrument in the grave with him. They removed all that.

• 41:29Matt Lewis?

  The dead man did not smell bad, and only his colour had changed. They dressed him in trousers, stockings, boots, a tunic and caftan of brocade with gold buttons. They put a hat of brocade and fur on him. Then they carried him into the pavilion on the ship. They seated him on the mattress and propped him up with cushions. They brought intoxicating drinks, fruits and fragrant plants which they put with him, then bread, meat and onions which they placed before him. Then they brought a dog which they cut in two and put in the ship. Then they brought his weapons and placed them by his side.

• 42:12Matt Lewis?

  Then they took two horses, ran them until they sweated, then cut them to pieces with a sword and put them in the ship. Next they killed a rooster and a hen and threw them in. The girl slave who wished to be killed went here and there and into each of their tents, and the master of each tent had sexual intercourse with her and said, "Tell your lord I have done this out of love for him." Friday afternoon they led the slave girl to a thing that they had made which resembled a door frame. She placed her feet on the palms of the men and they raised her up to overlook this frame. She spoke some words and they lowered her again.

• 42:56Matt Lewis?

  A second time they raised her up and she did again what she had done, then they lowered her. They raised her a third time and she did as she had done the two times before. Then they brought her a hen. She cut off the head which she threw away and then she took the hen and put it in the ship. I asked the interpreter what she had done. He answered, "The first time they raised her she said, 'Behold, I see my father and mother.' The second time she said, 'I see all my dead relatives seated.' The third time she said, 'I see my master seated in paradise, and paradise is beautiful and green.

• 43:39Matt Lewis?

  With him are men and boy servants. He calls to me, 'Take me to him.'" Now, they took her to the ship. She took off the two bracelets which she was wearing, and gave them both to the old woman called the Angel of Death, who was to kill her. Then, she took off the two finger rings which she was wearing, and gave them to the two girls who had served her, and were the daughters of the woman called the Angel of Death. Then, they raised her on to the ship, but they did not make her enter the pavilion. After that, the group of men who have cohabited with the slave girl make of their hands a sort of paved way

• 44:23Matt Lewis?

  whereby the girl, placing her feet on the palms of their hands, mounts on to the ship. The men came with shields and sticks. She was given a cup of intoxicating drink. She sang at taking it and drank. The interpreter told me that she, in this fashion, bade farewell to all her girl companions. Then, she was given another cup. She took it and sang for a long time, while the old woman incited her to drink up and go into the pavilion where her master lay.

• 45:05Matt Lewis?

  Then, the closest relative of the dead man, after they had placed the girl whom they have killed beside her master, came, took a piece of wood which he lighted at a fire, and walked backwards with the back of his head toward the boat, and his face turned toward the people, with one hand holding the kindled stick and the other covering his anus, being completely naked for the purpose of setting fire to the wood that had been made ready beneath the ship. Then, the people came up with tinder and other firewood, each holding a piece of wood of which he had set fire to an end and which he put into the pile of wood beneath the ship.

• 45:49Matt Lewis?

  Thereupon the flames engulfed the wood, then the ship, the pavilion, the man, the girl, and everything in the ship. A powerful, fearful wind began to blow, so that the flames became fiercer and more intense. One of the roos was at my side, and I heard him speak to the interpreter who was present. I asked the interpreter what he said. He answered. He said, "You Arabs are fools." "Why?" I asked him. He said, "You take the people who are most dear to you and whom you honor most and put them into the ground where insects and worms devour them. We burn him in a moment so that he enters paradise at once."

• 46:33Matt Lewis?

  Then, he began to laugh uproariously. When I asked why he was laughing, he said, "His lord, for love of him, has sent the wind to bring him away in an hour." And actually, an hour had not passed before the ship, the wood, the girl, and her master were nothing but cinders and ashes.

• 47:15Speaker 08

  The Quarter Pounder with Cheese is made with 100% fresh beef, cooked when you order it. Add hot crispy fries and a nice cold Coke, and hopefully, a lot of napkins. All for $8. Ba-da-ba-ba-ba.

• 47:29Speaker 07

  I've got big news. I switched to Verizon and got the new iPhone 18 Pro. Shh. I can keep my old phone. And I also get the latest iPhone every year. Shh. Anything else? Verizon let me choose Apple Watch Series 12 or iPad on them. Everybody listen up! Shh. Switch to Verizon and get the new iPhone 18 Pro now. No trade in needed. And the latest iPhone every year with Simplicity Plan. Plus, choose Apple Watch Series 12 or iPad on us. Simplicity Plan with Simplicity Pro required. Plan and device payment purchase are separate agreements with separate terms. Service plan for watch or iPad required. Additional terms apply for all offers.

• 48:14Eleanor Janega?

  It's been really helpful for us as historians because he says in his description that it includes human sacrifice, which has helped us to interpret a lot of the grander Viking burials that we found archaeologically as well. It's difficult for us to tell if this is necessarily straightforward or if he is interpreting this particular ceremony through a very specific lens, which is that of Islam. And how does he respond to what he sees? You know, is this something that he attempts to break in and up?

• 48:54Eleanor Janega?

  Does he try to convert these pagans who are doing this thing that he's kind of a bit horrified by? Or is he kind of intrigued and impressed by what he sees?

• 49:06Speaker 05

  Well, again, his description is somewhat detached in a way. And there are several things that come into play here. Part of his description seems to come from a direct eyewitness observation and parts of it seems to come from gathering of information, for example, from an interpreter. So it's actually a kind of composed of those two strands. So some of it might be his initial reaction and some of it might be what he jotted down after kind of processing what he saw.

• 49:37Eleanor Janega?

  So, you know, he's obviously very fascinated by the things that he's seeing. Does this really challenge his own beliefs at all, though? Or is this just kind of a case of culture shock and then he is very happy to eventually return to where he is comfortable with religious practice as it stands?

• 50:01Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's hard to say, actually. I mean, the level of detail is kind of revealing as well. He describes the funeral ceremony in great detail. And the fact that he is so faithful to the detail, I think, reveals that he is fascinated by this. And he doesn't seem to shy away from describing it. Or it, because a lot of the things he is writing are completely unacceptable. But at the very end of the funeral, he actually has a conversation with one of the Rus, where they compare funerary rituals or funerary methods. And he actually said, "You Arabs are a lot of fools. Why is that?" "Asked Ibn Fadlan, "Because you purposely take your nearest and dearest and whom you hold in highest esteem

• 50:44Speaker 05

  and put them in the ground where they are eaten by vermin and worms." So actually, he allows this Rus voice to come across, kind of really insulting the Muslims.

• 50:53Eleanor Janega?

  Yeah, I find that so interesting and important because we get a lot of Ibn Fadlan being disgusted by other people and talking about their practices and why these things really gross him out, essentially. And it's so interesting to see an actual cultural moment, like this saying, "Oh yeah, well, I think you're weird." Which we so rarely get to see these instances in the medieval period.

• 51:20Speaker 05

  Absolutely. I think that one of the unique aspects of Ibn Fadlan's account is that the voices we hear that are not just the voices of the narrator himself or of the dominant culture that he's coming from, you know, that's the real value, I think, sometimes of Ibn Fadlan's account.

• 51:35Eleanor Janega?

  In terms of the account itself, I suppose my question is, what prompted him to write this at all? Ordinarily, as we've already mentioned, when you get pieces of work in the Middle Ages about even a trip or a chronicle, something like that, it's pretty dry. It adheres to particular toboy. You're just going to see particular things crop up over and over again. There are a bit dull, interspersed with names and dates. So why do we get an incredible document like this? Is this meant to have a documentary purpose? Or is this Ibn Fadlan trying to work out what it is he's seeing right now?

• 52:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, maybe you're right. Maybe it's kind of some kind of therapy. We don't know, first of all, we don't know if Ibn Fadlan made it back to Baghdad. We have no evidence of that. His account cuts off, actually, when he meets the Khazars. The manuscripts were found in Central Asia, in Iran and in Mashhad. We know that there was another Arabic writer in the 13th century, Ali Akut, who actually accessed or found a manuscript relating Ibn Fadlan's journey or part of his account. First of all, we don't know whether Ibn Fadlan made it back to Baghdad. His text also is very unusual for its time. There was a lot of writing going on in the Muslim world.

• 53:03Speaker 05

  We have lots of geographies and even travel accounts, but nothing that looks like this. So it's very difficult to ascertain for whom the text was intended because it does not look like a typical report to the Caliphate court and it does not really look like other contemporary geographical descriptions. So it's quite unique in all senses.

• 53:26Eleanor Janega?

  Absolutely. And, you know, as a result, I would argue it's completely invaluable because as far as I'm aware, we simply do not have any other document quite like this in the medieval period. And we certainly don't really have one for the practices of various Vikings or the Housse, more particularly, right?

• 53:48Speaker 05

  Absolutely. It's very important for our knowledge of the Central Asian steps and the Eurasian steps and the life ways of Turkic peoples. We have no other account from that period describing the customs and the beliefs of the Turkic peoples from that period.

• 54:08Eleanor Janega?

  And certainly, we learn rather a lot about things like trade routes, these very practical things where, you know, I'm very entranced by just cultural detail and the ways that various people are living. But this is the sort of stuff that helps us understand how goods flow back and forth, how people move, how viruses are exchanged, really important stuff.

• 54:32Speaker 05

  Absolutely, and we have to remind ourselves that Ibn Fadlan is of course not traveling alone. He's traveling in a huge caravan, hundreds of thousands of animals and peoples on this Samanid trade road going from where today we have northern Iran to all the way to the mid Volga region. And there's a huge volume of goods, traveling millions of Arabic silver coins, the derhams, northwards in exchange for northern goods, as it first, and slaves and so on.

• 54:58Eleanor Janega?

  And I think that is such an important point, that this is a part of a network and there's these caravans that are operating because we tend to focus on Ibn Fadlan. And of course, we do because he's written us this incredible account and it's in his voice. But he's not the only person who is coming into contact with a lot of different peoples. He wouldn't be the only person who would see all of these different cultures. Granted, you know, he's come from the caliph, so he has probably got a higher stature and perhaps people are more willing to bring him in really grand situations and give him special access. But he's not going to be the only person who did this. He's the only person we've gotten account from, but that doesn't mean that it isn't happening for

• 55:43Eleanor Janega?

  thousands of people, really.

• 55:46Speaker 05

  Absolutely. And it shows very well that there was a system of diplomacy and trading conventions and because they need to kind of secure their passage, of course. And you know that there was communication, postal service and so on, and they had latters that they had to read to this particular chief to gain access to this particular region and so on. And then, you know, they encounter some problems as well as a solitary Turk who kind of forbids them to move on and apparently halts the entire caravan. So there are all kinds of, most of these things seems to be quite organized and foreseeable, but there is always the occasional surprise on the way as well.

• 56:25Eleanor Janega?

  And, you know, I love that about it because it does show that there is still this sense of adventure. There is going to be a bit of moving around and playing fast and loose, as it were, even if you are the most well-connected diplomatic guy in the world, you're still going to have to think on your feet.

• 56:43Speaker 05

  Oh, absolutely. And there are other factors such as the weather, which Ibn Fadlan describes in great detail at one point. And the weather may actually have had a hand also in the return or the lack of return, because we know that Ibn Fadlan comes to the Volga Bulgars in spring and he stays there the whole summer. Because he says that when they leave the territory of the Volga Bulgars, the night had grown longer again. So that's one option, that they simply perished in very bad weather, Siberian winds on their way back to Baghdad.

• 57:19Eleanor Janega?

  See, we have got no idea what happened to him. But how do we then have his account? We've lost the guy, but we've got the writing.

• 57:30Speaker 05

  One place that is possible that he made it back to might be Central Asia and especially the city of Bukhara, where he actually describes on his way northwards. And the manuscript I mentioned before that Yakut found in the 13th century was found in those parts. So even if he didn't make all the way back to Baghdad, he may have made it to Bukhara, or at least his writing made it to there. Maybe he'd stopped in Bukhara on his way south and decided to live there. I don't know. But Bukhara is an extremely interesting place as well because of the Jayhanis, the Jayani visiers, who actually were famous for collecting all kinds of anecdotes and had a library of all kinds of bits and pieces

• 58:15Speaker 05

  about all these northern peoples, apparently.

• 58:18Eleanor Janega?

  Well, I mean, thank God that they did, because it's so interesting because that as a proclivity is so modern, right? That's the sort of thing that we would like now. And who knows, if we didn't have someone come in and rescue this really...

• 58:35Eleanor Janega?

  Singular text, we might not know anything about these trade routes, these peoples, how they interact. And we've got this little treasure instead.

• 58:47Speaker 05

  Absolutely. So just a few years after Yakut found, I think it was in 1228 or something, he found the manuscript in Central Asia. The Mongols ravaged the whole thing and burned the libraries. But in 1923, there was a new discovery of a new manuscript of Ibn Fadlan in Mashhad in northern Iran, which is a more complete text, actually. And the modern versions are mostly based on that additions.

• 59:14Eleanor Janega?

  You know, I just absolutely love it as a piece of literature and a little snapshot of a place in time and how peoples work. And I really recommend that anyone pick it up. It's really readable. You know, it's, this isn't just one of those medieval nerd things. I've definitely given it to ordinary folks and they've enjoyed reading about it. Because ultimately, that's one of the things that I think is so special about this. Yes, it's a great piece of information. Yes, it tells us a lot about different people and different cultures, but it's also really, really fun. It's exciting, you know, it's an adventure story.

• 59:52Speaker 05

  It is, it is, it's exciting. It's funny and it's horrific and it's engaging and it's short. It's only, it's only 39 pages, actually, in the, in the Library of Arabic Literature version by James Montgomery. So yeah, everyone should read it.

• 1:00:08Eleanor Janega?

  Well, I think that that is exactly the place to read it. Because you are right, Thoreau, everyone should read it and they should stop listening to us right now.

• 1:00:15Speaker 05

  Straight to the bookstore.

• 1:00:15Eleanor Janega?

  And go do that. Thank you so much for coming on and talking to us. It's been such an absolute pleasure to dig into this with you.

• 1:00:24Speaker 05

  Thank you. It's been my pleasure.

• 1:00:33Eleanor Janega?

  Thanks once again to Dr. Thoreau Johnson-Handel for his insight. Thanks as well to my fabulous co-host Matt Lewis for his incredible job reading the sections of the Risala. And thank you for listening to Gone Medieval from History Hit. Remember, you can enjoy unlimited access to award-winning original TV documentaries, including my recent series Meet the Normans, and ad-free podcasts by signing up at historyhit.com/subscription. You can follow Gone Medieval on Spotify, where you can leave us comments and suggestions, or wherever you get your podcasts. And tell all your friends and family that you've gone medieval. Until next time.

• 1:01:40Speaker 09

  Guessing is for game shows, not your business. Workday is the enterprise AI platform for HR, finance, and IT, with AI grounded in your context to get work done and done right. It's a new workday.

• 1:01:57Speaker 10

  At Lowe's, this Veterans Day and every day, military members, veterans, and their spouses get automatic MyLowe's Rewards Silver Status Benefits. Plus, 10% off eligible purchases with no annual limit. It's one way we honor and give back to those who have served and still do. Learn more and verify now at lowe's.com/military. 10% discount can't be combined with another offer. Exclusions, terms, and conditions apply. Loyalty program subject to terms and conditions. Details at lowe's.com/terms. Subject to change.