Pod Insights The GaryVee Audio Experience Why AI is the Greatest Equalizer Since the Internet About this episode In this episode of the GaryVee Audio Experience, I sit down on the Prakhar Gupta Podcast to discuss the biggest shift in technology since the advent of the web: Artificial Intelligence. I encourage you to do your 50 hours of homework to understand how AI will create wealth for the long tail of the population. I also discuss the importance of self-esteem, the flaws in modern parenting, and why you need to stop living for other people's judgment. You’ll learn about:How to Take Control of Your Social Media AlgorithmsThe Exploding Value of "Analog Access"How to Overcome the Fear of RegretThe Relationship Between Self-Esteem and Accountability
Transcript 10,578 words · 6 speakers
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0:29 Speaker 05 For an ambitious 27-year-old in India, what's your number one piece of advice?
0:32 Speaker 03 My number one advice by far is to be pot-committed to getting educated on what's happening with AI. That opportunity that technology creates is extraordinary. AI is more internet than it is social media. I just can't believe that if I'm a 27-year-old listening in India, which is likely because of how many of them listen to you, that I can sit down and put in 15 hours, 50 hours of homework, research, research, research, and actually build something for real that can, you know, change the economic and emotional framework of my life. This is the Gary Vee Audio Experience.
1:08 Speaker 05 I want to start you off by asking, and I've actually wanted to ask this question for three years. I was 27 when I wrote this question down, I'm 30 now. But for an ambitious 27-year-old in India, what's your number one piece of advice?
1:20 Speaker 03 Well, it's definitely different than three years ago.
1:22 Speaker 05 Yeah.
1:23 Speaker 03 My number one advice by far is to be pot-committed to getting educated on what's happening with AI. Because if you're 27, and you're asking in India, right? And obviously, India has, just like the US or other large countries with big populations, you have a broad spectrum of people on the wealth scale or opportunity scale. Technology has always been the great equalizer, and then, once we went into the advent of the internet, that equalizer became even greater. It allowed really anyone. You know, I sit here today in front of you as a very well-known person. That is stunning to me because you're of the age right now when I started my first wine video. You know, and you're grown now.
2:07 Speaker 03 It didn't even cross my mind, at the age that you're at right now, that anyone would ever know me outside of the business world, of the wine business, and I kind of sensed I would do other things. So, that opportunity that technology creates is extraordinary. AI, no question, in my opinion, is the closest thing to the internet itself, even more than social media at some level. Social media isn't built on top of the internet. No internet, no social media. AI is more internet than it is social media. And, I just can't believe that if I'm a 27-year-old listening in India, which is likely because of how many of them listen to you, that I can sit down and put in 15 hours, 50 hours of homework,
2:51 Speaker 03 research, research, research, research, research, and actually build something, for real, that can, you know, change the economic and emotional framework of my life.
3:01 Speaker 05 Yeah, I mean, that's what I would think now, that artificial intelligence is the great leverage, is the great equalizer. There is so much one can do purely from playing around with that as a tool, and it's going to shape the future in so many ways we have no concept of. But I sometimes do worry as to how overwhelming that can be. Because I feel like, and this is a thing I've spoken to people who work in AI. They're like, as soon as we get a hang of a tool, something new comes up, and the old thing is completely...
3:27 Speaker 03 That's right.
3:28 Speaker 05 Right? The cascade is so heavy, it's so strong.
3:30 Speaker 03 That's tough for someone who's a well-funded startup that's trying to sell their thing for a trillion dollars. That has nothing to do with the average 27-year-old in India. That's the actual advantage of the average 27-year-old in India. I, as an investor, am very hesitant to invest in anything in AI because it can get outflanked the next day by a superscaler or another competitor. So it's dangerous for the people that have historically had advantage.
3:56 Speaker 05 Sure, yeah, right.
3:58 Speaker 03 But what you just said is the great opportunity of the 27-year-old that does not have an advantage.
4:04 Speaker 05 Right. So in a personal sense, there is alpha, and just getting to know artificial intelligence is very useful.
4:10 Speaker 03 Yes.
4:10 Speaker 05 As a company, there might not be, because you might get outflanked tomorrow in the way that developments happen.
4:15 Speaker 03 What the internet did that I understood, and that AI is doing that I also understand, is outside of a small percentage, these technologies are more of a Robin Hood game.
4:28 Speaker 03 It's advantage for the poor, not the rich. The internet, sure, there were some big companies that took advantage of it. But we are now sitting here 25 years later. You know, 20, 30 years later of the beginning of what really is the consumer web. The consumer web created way more fortunes for the ones that would have never had a chance. Me included. Because I would have been successful, but I would have 17 liquor stores right now on the east coast. And that would have been awesome. But this allowed me to really flex. AI is going to create incredible wealth for Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, blah blah blah. And everyone's paying attention to that.
5:12 Speaker 03 What I think they're missing is the long tail. That AI is going to create for the average 27-year-old in rural India. Who's now going to make $40,000 a month. Because of AI and would have never been remotely close to that. Is a profound view that I have, that I'm aware is in the minority. Because at this current second, the majority has decided to focus extraordinary amounts of energy on the downside of AI. And it will be like any other technology, there will be upside and downside. But I think it is far more balanced than the current temperament of the conversation.
5:55 Speaker 05 You think that that is true for some of the entrepreneurial ones? And because there is a serious concern of job loss, particularly in a country like India where we do a lot of IT services. And that accounts for a lot of the GDP we have, where we're coding software or we're providing software services. One of the fears that people have is what if that gets wiped out?
6:12 Speaker 03 That's a proper fear.
6:14 Speaker 05 What do you mean by that?
6:15 Speaker 03 That is correct. I would be scared of that.
6:17 Speaker 05 Yeah, you would be.
6:18 Speaker 03 But no one in India right now is crying for Pittsburgh in America. But as we went away from the Industrial Revolution, Pittsburgh and Columbus, Ohio got fucked.
6:31 Speaker 03 I'm sorry that you were born at a time where you as a 26-year-old engineer might have walked into a time period where technology decided to do something. On the flip side, I have met, because I grew up in Edison, New Jersey, and have been in tech, unlimited rural-city Indian kids from the 80s, 90s, and 2000s, who their dreams came true because they were engineers, and their timing for their skill was good. I remind the kid that's listening right now and thinks that they're getting fucked, that you used your natural DNA skills to deploy it against engineering, and if that is no longer your best option,
7:15 Speaker 03 you will take your natural brilliant mathematical engineering skills and deploy it against something else.
7:24 Speaker 05 So is the idea that the anxiety that this AI wave is creating, the solution is just patience? Is that what you're saying?
7:29 Speaker 03 I would say, I would say, action, and lack of ideology, and the elimination of crying about something you don't control. And by the way, if you're an entrepreneur, we're not talking, you said entrepreneurs and their employees is one thing. But if you're an entrepreneur, and you're crying about the current state of the market, you're not an entrepreneur.
7:52 Speaker 05 Well, for sure.
7:52 Speaker 03 For sure, for sure. If you're an employee, respect. But if you're an entrepreneur and you're crying about AI, I have good news for you. You exposed a truth that I'm glad you learned early on. You are not an entrepreneur. You're a two-cent wannabe entrepreneur.
8:12 Speaker 05 You've got something small figured in, if you're worried.
8:15 Speaker 03 Brother, I'm cooking, we're exploding. I'm at the prime of, I've been building for 15 years, we finally fucking won, and every day I have to think about what AI commoditizes in my company, which is plenty.
8:28 Speaker 05 Does it commoditize content and personality in social media?
8:31 Speaker 03 Yes, it will, it will over time. It will, maybe not this nanosecond, but it commoditize, it will commoditize much. It might commoditize my greatest asset, which is, I've been a very good thinker.
8:43 Speaker 05 And it might commoditize that?
8:45 Speaker 03 It might, I mean, I've put out a, surely I've put out enough public content that you could put all of it into an LLM and ask to predict what I'll think about things going forward in perpetuity? It might.
8:56 Speaker 03 So then I'll become an electrician, I don't know. Like, I'm being dead serious, I know everyone just giggled, like, if I have to become a plumber, I don't think that I am too fancy
9:09 Speaker 03 to not become a plumber.
9:10 Speaker 05 I see what you mean.
9:10 Speaker 03 If I've signed up for entrepreneurship, I must be prepared for entrepreneurship to kill me. Hey everybody, I hope you're enjoying the podcast right now. Make sure you follow the podcast, that's why I'm interrupting. Let's keep going on this show, but follow the podcast. It'll make my mom super happy.
9:27 Speaker 05 That's hardcore.
9:28 Speaker 03 I think so.
9:29 Speaker 05 Yeah.
9:30 Speaker 03 But I truly believe that every real entrepreneur, when they just heard that sentence, were like, "Fuck, yes." Because you can't be in love with a game for what it gave you,
9:42 Speaker 03 and then change how you feel about that game if it might hurt you.
9:46 Speaker 05 Then you were never in love with the game.
9:48 Speaker 03 Correct. You were in love with the things you thought you could get out of the game.
9:51 Speaker 05 Right.
9:51 Speaker 03 Or you were lesser of a version of a player in that game than you thought you were, your timing was good for your skillset.
10:01 Speaker 05 Do you have a speculation on what might exist outside AI? In that, like, one of the bets I'm making is that personality itself as a, say, my content is personal. It's a moat, right?
10:14 Speaker 03 I agree.
10:15 Speaker 05 And I think the moat will only broaden, because a lot of the other stuff, information can be commoditized, but personality and sort of that kind of thing is not commoditized.
10:22 Speaker 03 Correct. I think over time, I do think it'll be interesting to see what happens with AI and virtual, and like, do we even care if a person's real or not? I'm gonna make a statement right now, I don't think we care.
10:33 Speaker 05 I don't think so either.
10:33 Speaker 03 Well, then that starts to create issue for us, because then there's a supply and demand issue. If you can create 7,000 derivatives of my personality trait, and they might be more attractive, and they might be even more clever, like, what then starts to happen? What I will say is, the right, you and I are very fortunate. I do believe that AI does have, this is gonna counter what I said earlier, because it's, they're both true. I do think AI hurts the middle the most.
11:03 Speaker 03 And that the 27-year-old with nothing to lose, putting in the work, really gets upside. And I actually think people like you and I, who put in the work, also get the upside. Because we already have awareness and affinity towards us. And I think the rise of access is about to be very significant. I believe analog access, as I've been calling it in my head recently. I asked to buy the URL or AJ or someone, but it wasn't, it was AJ, it wasn't available. I tried to register analogaccess.com, because I think this is a term. Analog access. The real world and getting access to me and you, the human, I think is about to explode in value.
11:40 Speaker 05 Right.
11:42 Speaker 03 I, for example, can lose everything and probably can survive by just charging people for a one-hour meeting with me, one-on-one, for the rest of my life. I prefer not, it's not how I want to monetize. But if all else failed, if AI ate up everything, I agree with you that being a personality has value, and I think the monetization is going to happen outside of the extreme digital environment in decades to come.
12:10 Speaker 05 So you mean a lot of these events and these meetups and that kind of stuff?
12:13 Speaker 03 That's right. And it's people like me who can build frameworks of extreme digital output
12:21 Speaker 03 and have humility and the personality trait to want to be with people in analog that are going to have tremendous upside in the generation we're coming to.
12:34 Speaker 05 It must, however, still get you a little... Like, I just, I still don't imagine a world where you can be as optimistic as you tend to be about things, that you are not a little scared about how this is happening, because it's just so...
12:44 Speaker 03 Please don't confuse optimism with naivete.
12:47 Speaker 05 Sure.
12:48 Speaker 03 There's nothing I've ever thought about that I thought were 100% going to be great.
12:52 Speaker 05 Right.
12:55 Speaker 03 You know, like, uh, the internet, MySpace. I see Friendster, and then I see MySpace quickly, I'm like, "Oh my god." And then very quickly, I'm like, "Uh, like, kids are on this, like, you could get kidnapped." Like, that was the year of that. Like, I've never looked at anything... I am not naive. I'm not delusional. I am practically optimistic. And humans have given me that benefit. Our human behavior has given me that. People are coming with opinions based on their own fear.
13:30 Speaker 03 Do you know why most people hate AI? Because they're scared it's gonna cost them money.
13:35 Speaker 05 Fundamentally.
13:36 Speaker 03 Period in the story.
13:36 Speaker 05 Yeah.
13:37 Speaker 03 There's nothing else to say. Almost every opinion I'm hearing is completely predicated on that person's point of view on how it's going to affect them financially. They will then disguise it as a noble venture of humanity.
13:53 Speaker 03 But I know them too well.
13:55 Speaker 05 Yeah.
13:56 Speaker 03 Right?
13:56 Speaker 05 Right, 100%.
13:57 Speaker 03 And by the way, I'm empathetic about that. People have bills to pay.
14:00 Speaker 05 Alright.
14:01 Speaker 03 People have responsibilities.
14:05 Speaker 03 Tough shit. Like, nobody in 1930 wanted... Nobody who was born... let's do this one. Nobody who was born in 1900 signed up for two fucking world wars before they turned 45.
14:19 Speaker 05 Yeah.
14:20 Speaker 03 And if you lived in America, two world wars, a Great Depression, like... Like, what's happened is, all of this is happening. Let's say all of this. We have AI, which is massive, and will reset the deck. And geopolitical unrest at a scale that we're not accustomed to. On the back of 30 to 40 years of global prosperity.
14:45 Speaker 05 Right.
14:47 Speaker 05 That's fair, that's so right.
14:49 Speaker 03 So it's not confusing why everyone's crying about shit, but it doesn't mean that entitlement has not seeped into society at a scale that does not make us prepared emotionally and mentally for adversity.
15:04 Speaker 03 Collectively, unlimited people listening have had unlimited adversities, but collectively, 8 billion people deep. This has been a very remarkable 40 years of prosperity. Economically, everything is better.
15:18 Speaker 05 Right.
15:19 Speaker 03 And so I understand why everyone's anxious.
15:22 Speaker 05 If anyone's born in the 90s, 80s, and they've only ever experienced that era of prosperity, I mean, I sometimes find it so strange what's happened to the world since Covid. Like, I think that was an important sort of bookmark.
15:34 Speaker 03 Yeah, I think you're right. I think people will point to it, but I think, and I can see how good of a thinker you are, then people will, like, the next level intellect will point to the pieces were put in place already.
15:49 Speaker 05 How do you mean that?
15:50 Speaker 03 Well, the world acts very differently when there's one superpower versus when there's two.
15:55 Speaker 05 Right.
15:56 Speaker 03 So, the US and the Soviet Union fighting created a lot of dynamics. Then you had a period where the Soviet Union fell, and the US was the only superpower.
16:06 Speaker 03 So, China's rise and different points of view and those things, with Putin's rise of his level of, you know, leadership and what he wants to accomplish to bring back the Soviet energy, like, you know, no Covid, I don't think things are as different as maybe people will think.
16:24 Speaker 05 Yeah, yeah, I don't think Covid per se has a lot of consequence in this, but that was 2019, towards the end is when the world started changing in a way, like, the world was very different before.
16:34 Speaker 03 No question, I'm a global pandemic, I mean, just everybody being capable of having Zoom meetings changed the world.
16:40 Speaker 05 Yeah, right.
16:41 Speaker 03 Just that, just that. That is no question, just that. It changed where people live, which changes how geopolitics play. No, no question, but there's a lot, I mean, you know...
16:58 Speaker 03 Leaders of the 10 most important countries in the world are always an incredible variable of how the world works. Just like a company, like a family. The personality traits of a mother and father dictate exactly what's gonna happen with a family, right? The CEO of a... You said something so interesting, I don't think on the podcast, right before we started. My office is literally a representation of me.
17:23 Speaker 05 I can hear your voice when they're...
17:24 Speaker 03 You know? So, yeah, I mean, America is a representation of two terms of Donald Trump. You know, Russia is a representation of 20 years of Putin. China is a representation of what communism is. The UAE is a representation of a monarchy. Monarchies are beautiful when the CEO is good.
17:47 Speaker 05 Yeah.
17:48 Speaker 03 What happens when it's sixth generation not good? There's a reason monarchies always... And by the way, democracy is a modern experiment.
18:00 Speaker 05 Yeah, in the way that it's shaped today, it started only 1, 2, 50, 300 years ago.
18:03 Speaker 03 It's crazy.
18:04 Speaker 05 Yeah.
18:05 Speaker 03 When you think...
18:05 Speaker 05 300, that's it.
18:06 Speaker 03 It's absurdly fascinating.
18:08 Speaker 05 It's also fascinating that people are suddenly having that broader conversation because about 7, 8 years ago, democracy was a taboo you didn't touch and discuss beyond just how good it is. Particularly in America, when I was a student here. It's one of those cornerstones you don't touch.
18:21 Speaker 03 Yeah, blind.
18:21 Speaker 05 But now, suddenly, you hear all these conversations about entertaining other formats of government also. And I don't wanna get bogged down in geopolitics quite a lot. I think the AI angle is much more interesting.
18:31 Speaker 03 Well, the reason I'm actually talking geopolitics, which I also don't like talking about, is because I think the AI conversation is intertwined.
18:39 Speaker 05 Yeah, I agree.
18:39 Speaker 03 Like, when everyone's... Back to optimism. People paint me as optimistic. I paint myself as practical. I mean this with an ounce of optimism. And let me explain why. When I'm in dinner meetings where this conversation, you get around successful and intellectual people, inevitably, late-night meetings are really fun because you get into real shit, right? When I am countered, and sometimes because of my practical with a ting of optimism, in a world of cynicism and fear. I tend to be on my own island sometimes. I was in a dinner the other day with incredibly successful, incredibly thoughtful individuals, and it was four-on-one, four against me. And their collective take was, "This is going to be... This is it, the end."
19:23 Speaker 03 And I asked them very simply... Have you heard of governments?
19:30 Speaker 05 Right.
19:31 Speaker 03 At what place does India, China, America, and Russia allow for 30-40% unemployment?
19:39 Speaker 05 It's just not gonna happen.
19:39 Speaker 03 It's not gonna happen!
19:41 Speaker 05 Regulations gonna hit hard, yep. There is a competing force, it's not just one way.
19:45 Speaker 03 There's not one... I'm just a little bit decent at social studies and history, and I'm aware that when you start getting into double digits, by the way, Covid?
19:57 Speaker 03 Look what happened during Covid. The US printed unlimited money, gave it to everybody, and everybody bought fucking Louis Vuittons and Nikes and Don Perignon.
20:05 Speaker 05 Right.
20:06 Speaker 03 So people talk about bullshit, and then their actions are double bullshit. If all these companies are gonna ruin the world, they're gonna be stopped by the government. I argue, final point on this,
20:18 Speaker 03 that we might be seeing the beginning of extreme capitalism, which creates a variant of socialism.
20:26 Speaker 05 Say more.
20:27 Speaker 03 Sure. If you're a capitalist and a free market guy, which I am, if the 17 companies, the super scalers, are gonna win because of AI, I'm like, "Good."
20:40 Speaker 03 Good!
20:41 Speaker 05 Okay.
20:41 Speaker 03 If you believe in free market, you believe in like, "Let merit reign", like, "Good."
20:48 Speaker 05 Sure.
20:49 Speaker 03 Tesla, Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Anthropic, like, "Okay, you were the best." And you put Adobe and IBM and GE and VaynerMedia out of business. Mazel tov, you won! If that's true, and that happened, and now you have 18, 43, 97, 16 companies that got all the economics, the governments are going to tax those people so much that the masses...
21:19 Speaker 03 of society are gonna only have to work 2, 3 days a week and get subsidized with the checks from those tax so that there's not social unrest because we will not have 20, 30, 40% unemployment because when you have 20, 30, 40% unemployment, you have coup d'etat.
21:36 Speaker 05 Yeah, you have political chaos, you have riots in the streets, it's just not gonna happen.
21:41 Speaker 03 So what are we talking about?
21:42 Speaker 05 Right, yeah, I think the second order thinking people are not doing with sort of the fear because the first wave will hit and a lot of people will lose their jobs and it's happening.
21:48 Speaker 03 It's happening right now.
21:49 Speaker 05 Right, but eventually when it gets too much, regulation will be the counter force.
21:53 Speaker 03 That's right. Now, all my big thinking here doesn't help someone that just got laid off by Oracle yesterday.
21:59 Speaker 05 Right.
22:00 Speaker 03 What, that's why I don't spend a lot of time talking about what I just talked about. What I spend a lot of time on is make content for LinkedIn. Because if you got fired from Oracle yesterday, if you've been listening to me, you got hired today by Adobe or Google.
22:13 Speaker 05 Right. It's a weird world where talent is short, you're looking for great talent everywhere and great talent is being laid off at the same time. I think it's a matching problem.
22:22 Speaker 03 I could not agree more.
22:23 Speaker 05 Yeah.
22:24 Speaker 03 The problem is, you can't be discovered if you're not making content.
22:27 Speaker 05 That's, that's, it's such a new thing. I mean, it was about brand building initially, but now it's just about being seen. Or you're just left out.
22:34 Speaker 03 This has been something that I'm incredibly gonna be proud of being as historical correct as I was for 20 years. In some different variant, I have said attention is the asset.
22:46 Speaker 05 I have a question.
22:47 Speaker 03 Please.
22:49 Speaker 05 Do you think the way, and so let me start you off by this. You've been talking about how social media is dead and social media is dead in the way that now it's interest media.
22:57 Speaker 03 Yes.
22:58 Speaker 05 Algorithms define a lot of how people consume and it's no longer about who you follow.
23:01 Speaker 03 The algorithms do not define what people consume. It's very important. The algorithms will follow you to make sure you stay on.
23:09 Speaker 05 Say more.
23:10 Speaker 03 This is the great misunderstanding in society right now. The algorithms don't give a fuck. The algorithms care about one thing.
23:17 Speaker 05 Consumption.
23:18 Speaker 03 You staying on. That's right.
23:20 Speaker 05 Right, retention, right.
23:21 Speaker 03 Ready?
23:22 Speaker 05 Yeah.
23:22 Speaker 03 If you do not like your algorithm and you think your algorithm controls you, you go into the search bar and you type in soccer and football and UFC and rainbows and it will change like this and if you then like and comment and zoom in and engage with that content, your algorithm the next day will be about UFC and Mo Salah.
23:43 Speaker 05 Yeah, true.
23:44 Speaker 03 So, the algorithm does not control shit. Facebook does not make you consume porn, or surfing, or coffee, or Gary Vee.
23:53 Speaker 05 Right.
23:54 Speaker 03 You, and your actions. The fact that society has not figured out, in one second, they can go to the search bar, and completely change their algorithm?
24:03 Speaker 05 It's hilarious.
24:04 Speaker 03 Is more about the people, not the platforms.
24:06 Speaker 05 Right. Having said that, however, as a producer, as somebody who scaled in the last two years, we went from practically less than a million views a month, to, what, a hundred million views a month? And, like, having done all of this, there is a secret law of doing content that is dictated by the algorithm in a certain way. My title thumbnails have to be shaped a certain way, I have to front-load my content in a
24:27 Speaker 03 Yes, but that evolves, and by the way, so did the printing press and television. The fuck is a 23-minute video?
24:34 Speaker 05 Right, sure.
24:35 Speaker 03 Every television show is based on the fact that networks need to run seven minutes of commercials every 30 minutes.
24:44 Speaker 03 Is a proper story supposed to be told in 23 minutes? Is a proper story supposed to have a cliffhanger before a commercial, so that you don't change the channel, and you stay on that show? That's how the world has always worked.
24:56 Speaker 05 I agree. But does it not shape the way...
24:59 Speaker 03 Do you know that, I'm sorry to interrupt, this is important.
25:01 Speaker 05 Yes.
25:01 Speaker 03 Do you know that people deemed art that were on canvases not art? When canvas was first invented, that art was only when it was done on buildings.
25:12 Speaker 05 Interesting.
25:13 Speaker 03 The distribution has always been the restrictor.
25:18 Speaker 05 So...
25:18 Speaker 03 And by the way, if I may, because now I'm rolling.
25:20 Speaker 05 Right.
25:21 Speaker 03 We're doing a podcast.
25:22 Speaker 05 Right.
25:22 Speaker 03 There's also video. There's also Substack and Beehive. You can write, if you do not want to do video. There is unlimited optionality. There's AI animation now. Your form factor of communication and content, you have so much optionality. You're just talking about best practices of the current second on social media platforms. And as you know, because you guys have scaled, there are also nuances within that.
25:49 Speaker 03 Seven words, with no pictures or video, are over-indexing for me on Facebook.
26:11 Speaker 05 I see what you mean. Right. And so there is best practices in the current moment.
26:15 Speaker 03 Right, and I would argue social media is more merit-based than the old world. It's changing constantly. Whereas the old world was stock and stop. Why are movies two hours? I want to watch nine-hour movies. I want to watch nine hours of Star Wars. Netflix proved it. When Wednesday Addams came out, I watched all eight episodes with my kids. That was an eight-hour movie I watched.
26:38 Speaker 05 Sure.
26:39 Speaker 03 What I'm saying is that we have created rules, and more importantly, we have created judgment on social media that we do not deploy to every other aspect of the world.
26:51 Speaker 03 Why are we not mad at alcohol right now? Do you know if you drink tons and tons of alcohol every day, you will be in trouble?
26:57 Speaker 05 Yeah.
26:58 Speaker 03 Okay.
27:00 Speaker 05 Yeah, I'm not angry at it. That's a solid point.
27:02 Speaker 03 Correct. So if you're fucking mad at TikTok, which is banned in your country, if you're mad at Instagram or YouTube, get off the device.
27:13 Speaker 05 Turn off the wifi.
27:14 Speaker 03 Where is human discipline part of the equation? I am addicted to processed sugared.
27:22 Speaker 03 I, Gary Vaynerchuk, am addicted to processed sugar. When I walk by Hudson News at the airport yesterday and I see a Hershey's bar, my chemicals bounce.
27:36 Speaker 03 Is that Hershey's fault? Is that America's USDA laws fault? Or is it my fault? You can say all three, that's fine. But you know what's happened? We decided to leave the last part out.
27:49 Speaker 05 Our sins.
27:50 Speaker 03 Yes, sir.
27:52 Speaker 03 And that is the great pandemic, and that is the great crisis of our society right now. And that is why we're listening to political leaders and to influencers peddling dumb shit. Because we have lost our own self-regulation and our own self-esteem and discipline and capacity.
28:14 Speaker 05 Sure, I follow all of that, I'm in agreement with all of it, but you know...
28:18 Speaker 03 If you're in agreement with all of it, if you're in agreement with all of what I just said, even bringing up the word "but" starts to change the variable.
28:26 Speaker 05 Okay, so I'm 90% in agreement with what you said.
28:28 Speaker 03 Keep going.
28:28 Speaker 05 Let me give you 10%. I do think that there is a subtle incentivization in content production that leans on the side of needless polarization.
28:37 Speaker 03 But, by the way, I agree with that, but that's something everybody has to, who makes that content, I agree with that 90, 10%. But that's a, but a couple things. I don't have any interest in doing that.
28:50 Speaker 05 Sure.
28:51 Speaker 03 I don't do that.
28:52 Speaker 05 Right.
28:53 Speaker 03 Right?
28:53 Speaker 05 Right.
28:53 Speaker 03 You, we agree, right?
28:54 Speaker 05 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
28:55 Speaker 03 So that's how I want to sleep at night. Like, if somebody wants to sleep at night, like, we have, like, again, two things on that equation. The person that makes that content to create polarization for their own self-interest, that person has to sleep at night. But I have no interest to judge that man or woman. Because if you sell sugar, processed sugar, I'm not gonna judge you either. Or alcohol. In fact, my father does sell alcohol.
29:22 Speaker 05 Right. Who sold alcohol?
29:24 Speaker 03 You know, like, like, so, correct. So, and I believe in selling alcohol. It's legal. And I can't control someone's consumption of that. Right? If I was in control of the world, everybody would go to a therapist all the time until they have actual self-esteem. That would be the, no school. From 6 to 18, no school. 100% therapy around self-esteem and insecurity. I would solve the world. No school. Fuck Saturn and the periodic table.
29:57 Speaker 03 Which mean absolutely nothing. 12 years, from 6 to 18, of true human development.
30:05 Speaker 05 Self-reflection.
30:06 Speaker 03 Self-esteem, self-esteem, self-esteem, self-esteem, kindness, empathy, compassion, work ethic, accountability. What I'm doing with V Friends. So, you know, I don't know, like, you know, so I agree with you, like, like, do I believe that people peddle shit that is detrimental to humans for their own self-interest? What revelation do you think you're talking about? This is the story as old as time. The fuck you think the first books were? There were religious institutions that control people. What are we talking about here?
30:40 Speaker 05 Right, sure.
30:40 Speaker 03 As much as things change, nothing changes.
30:43 Speaker 05 Right, right, right. Uh, it's very interesting you bring up, uh, self-esteem. I'm curious, would you, what is hurting this self-esteem? Like, what is the reason why all young ones have to be in self-esteem training? What is the?
30:55 Speaker 03 Modern parenting.
30:56 Speaker 05 You think modern parenting is, by process of it, hurting self-esteem?
31:01 Speaker 03 Yes, sir.
31:01 Speaker 05 How? By competition and all those things, or is there something else there?
31:04 Speaker 03 Modern parenting, on the back of 50 years of prosperity, have started to focus on things that are silly.
31:10 Speaker 05 Like?
31:12 Speaker 03 The thing they always did, keeping up with the Joneses. Materialism, some of the downs. I love, I love entrepreneurship. What are the downside? Materialism. Wanting to buy a BMW. Wanting to, you know, everything, like, humans, he's wearing a Harvard hoodie.
31:28 Speaker 05 Right.
31:28 Speaker 03 Why?
31:30 Speaker 05 Let's ask him, why?
31:32 Speaker 03 I know why, and I respect it, but it is how humans work. We communicate.
31:37 Speaker 05 Right.
31:38 Speaker 03 Why am I 50, dressed young and casual? I'm, uh, no different than his, my cap is his Harvard hoodie. And somebody else's watch, and somebody else's BMW. Um, modern parenting has kept up with the Joneses and become more materialistic. Modern parenting is less communal.
31:58 Speaker 03 In the 50s and 60s, 70s, there was my, when I was growing up in the 80s in New Jersey, 20 minutes away, my three best friends, their mothers were my mother.
32:06 Speaker 05 Right.
32:07 Speaker 03 If I did something at Robbie Ternick's house that was wrong, Eleanor Ternick smacked me. And no one was like, "I'm gonna sue you" and all that, right?
32:14 Speaker 05 Right.
32:15 Speaker 03 In fact, my mother said, "Thank you."
32:17 Speaker 05 Right.
32:17 Speaker 03 Could you imagine today if somebody's friend's parents smacked a child?
32:23 Speaker 05 I think it's still very real in India. I think I've been smacked by my friends' parents.
32:26 Speaker 03 In, in certain parts of India, and you're 30 now.
32:29 Speaker 05 Yeah, right.
32:29 Speaker 03 So now we're 20 years removed.
32:30 Speaker 05 20 years away.
32:31 Speaker 03 Correct. And I don't know where you grew up and all that stuff, right?
32:33 Speaker 05 Right, right, right, right, right.
32:34 Speaker 03 But in the upper echelons of, of financial superpowers 20 years ago, in Mumbai, I, less than in the rural parts.
32:43 Speaker 05 Right.
32:43 Speaker 03 Right? We just know prosperity leads to softness.
32:48 Speaker 05 It does. Good, good times create weak men, weak men create bad times, that kind of stuff.
32:52 Speaker 03 Such a fucking good sentence, and it's so goddamn real, and it's no one's fault, and I have no judgment, it just is. And so, modern parenting does, values different things. I'll give you another one. Back to smacking and grounding. Children, by most part today, have less, less circumstances where they are paying the price, or being held accountable, or dealing with the consequences of bad behavior.
33:22 Speaker 05 So they're getting away with more?
33:23 Speaker 03 Correct.
33:23 Speaker 05 Yes.
33:24 Speaker 03 Because parents today have overreacted to the generation of their parents, and they want to be friends with their children, instead of being friendly.
33:32 Speaker 05 Yeah. That's spot on, dude. That's spot on.
33:35 Speaker 03 I see it, and I see it because, not because of focus group of one or seven parents I know, because I get 10 to 25,000 DMs a week, a day, a year, you know, like I get ungodly amounts of feedback. And because of what I talk about, I get it, and I read a lot of it randomly. And now I have AI to be able to sum up what I'm getting, like, you know, with Manus? Do you know how insane Manus is?
33:56 Speaker 05 You mean Manis as in the condom?
33:58 Speaker 03 No, I mean Manus, M-A-N-U-S.
34:00 Speaker 05 Oh, okay, okay, okay.
34:01 Speaker 03 Sorry for my accent.
34:02 Speaker 05 Right, no, no, it's okay.
34:04 Speaker 03 Meta's AI, layered on all that data within Instagram and Facebook, is insanity.
34:12 Speaker 03 I've been dangerous for the last 15 years because I really pay attention. Now I have a tool that allows me to pay attention at a level that no human brain could have ever paid attention to. This is a human weaponizing or using AI. I'm accelerating what I'm great at. Now, it's also commoditized. All of you, I was willing to put in the work and actually be on a flight for three hours and read everything. The fact that you can now get a summary of your DMs, like, that commoditizes my work ethic. I'm gonna have to put my work somewhere else.
34:46 Speaker 03 However, I'm very good at processing the information that I consume. So even if you and I look at the same report, will we both have the same observation? I don't think so.
34:59 Speaker 03 AI can't take away everything, but it will take out away a lot.
35:04 Speaker 05 On the issue of parents and kids, you know, one of the more classic problems, and I think Sid will relate to this. Where I come from is that a lot of parents spend their entire lifetime getting out of poverty. They sacrifice everything they have to make sure their kids get a good education. And some of them end up like Sid and myself, and we find good education and good opportunities and so on and so forth. But then, very often, this trade-off occurs where a kid's, they want to pursue their passion. They've listened to you. They've listened to the fact that you have to go all in on a game that you love.
35:31 Speaker 03 Yes, on the record, unlimited Indian parents have sent me very scathing DMs because I've changed the course of their child from being an engineer and a doctor, and now they're trying to do a rock band video game. And so I apologize to all 1 billion people. Good news, everyone in India, I am from the Soviet Union, and Russian parents don't like me either, and nor do Asian parents, and nor do any parent that is so insecure
35:59 Speaker 03 that they want their children's accomplishment to reflect on them amongst their circles.
36:08 Speaker 05 Well, that is one form of concern. The other one in areas where opportunities are restricted is actually like I I'll give you an example, he's a rock band. I met a guy who was trying to start a rock band in India in 2021.
36:18 Speaker 03 Okay.
36:19 Speaker 05 I was like, bro, you're forty years behind. There is no way you are able to run a maybe you are that one band that's going to make money doing rock music in a country that has very little to do with rock music. But I think it's a shot. Like, I think you'd be better off having enough money so you can feed your family.
36:35 Speaker 03 Would he be better off? Or when he's eighty-seven, him going through those thirty-seven months of failure, allowing him to never regret in his seventies, eighties and nineties that he should have tried to follow his passion? Is it better than having twenty to thirty years of your late years be grounded in the occasional, if not often, thoughts of, "I should have"?
37:00 Speaker 05 Follow, but what about all the way until those late years? I have regret for the fact that I just do not have sufficient means to put my kids through the right education or to buy the stuff that I want to buy. I think it counterbalances, no?
37:12 Speaker 03 I think, no, I don't think so.
37:14 Speaker 05 No?
37:14 Speaker 03 I think both the things you brought up are dog shit.
37:16 Speaker 05 Okay. Uh. That's keeping up with the Joneses, you think? That kind of stuff?
37:20 Speaker 03 I do.
37:21 Speaker 05 Okay.
37:21 Speaker 03 I, I think most, I think everyone can live within their means in the world. Because they do. Most people that don't have a home have a mental health issue, not a financial issue. And everybody else lives within the home that they can afford with their financial status. And let me remind you, and this is what's so great about so many Indian immigrants, especially from rural places. There's unlimited, I'll just go very narrow to your world, but this is true for any group, South America, Asia. There is unlimited third world countries or third world-like country, parts of countries. We have it in America too. There's parts of this country that are incredibly poor that know people who have very little financial capabilities, who have happy lives.
38:10 Speaker 03 I have a funny feeling that somebody in your great uncles or great grandparents had very little by the standards we're defining money, who were joyous and happy and wonderful people.
38:21 Speaker 05 Dirt poor.
38:22 Speaker 03 Dirt poor.
38:23 Speaker 05 Dirt poor.
38:23 Speaker 03 By the way, just to remind you, I think you know this, when I came to America in 1978, I lived out there, not too far from here, in Queens, in a studio apartment roughly the size of this office, with six or seven depending on which family members were moving around, and I had unlimited joy in my childhood. We had dog shit.
38:43 Speaker 05 Yeah, it's funny like that, huh? Alright.
38:44 Speaker 03 So, you know, A, I listen carefully to what you say. Buy the things you want to buy? What? A hoodie?
38:53 Speaker 05 Yeah.
38:53 Speaker 03 A fucking video game? A Mercedes? And then send your kids to school? What school? What world are we living in? I can promise you right now, the invention of AI has created more opportunity for kids in dirt poor India than Harvard or MIT. Now we're asking our question, why? I will say that in Indian culture, in Asian culture, in Eastern European, Russian culture, three cultures I understand very well, a shocking percentage of the energy that is dictating what is coming out of parents' mouths is how their children will be viewed by society, which is a reflection on them. They use their children as tools for their own insecurities and self-esteem,
39:38 Speaker 03 and the advice they are giving does not factor in how the world turns. How about all the parents that forced their kids to be dev engineers over the last decade, who are now 18 years old? How are they feeling about the fact that my business partner, David Rodelitz, over at Flyfish Club, built an app last night that is incredibly good? He wouldn't know how to fucking build a website three years ago if I paid him a trillion dollars. So how are all the kids that were forced by their... And because their, their actual father is in the US on a work assignment at Microsoft and he went to MIT and this kid who had unbelievable creative superpowers and could have created incredible joy in art
40:22 Speaker 03 whether in the culinary, or music, or some sort of artistic execution has been suppressed for five years to learn how to fucking code so you could have a real job and achieve all those things how the fuck is that 18-year-old feeling right now?
40:37 Speaker 05 Cheated. He's getting cheated, yeah. It is true. I mean, I have nephews who are feeling cheated. You know, they're telling me they're graduating out of college and one of them said, "My dad told me all his life if I'm a good engineer, it's gonna work." And I'm like, "You're dealing with something far more existential than not getting a job right now." "You're dealing with growing up. You're realizing your parents are wrong." And that happens sometimes. And I think a lot of this has to do with kids being too afraid to admit their parents might be wrong.
41:03 Speaker 03 Yeah, I mean, and listen, there's nothing, listen, I grew up that way. Like, there's nothing more beautiful than being ideological about your parents. I love that. I'm so happy for that. And I'm empathetic for that moment where you're like, "Wait a minute." You know, like, that's a-
41:15 Speaker 05 Even they're figuring it out.
41:16 Speaker 03 Yeah, of course. But you know this, from 18, and you're still in it even. I would say from 18 to 30 is when you're like, "Wait a minute." And then from like 30 to 40, you start to become incredibly empathetic and compassionate towards your parents.
41:31 Speaker 05 I had that at 23. I remember that moment. Um, I was actually here in New-
41:35 Speaker 03 Are you a parent?
41:36 Speaker 05 No, not yet.
41:37 Speaker 03 Well, let me tell you, so, let me, congratulations. Let me tell you, brother, you have another really fun chapter coming your way.
41:44 Speaker 05 That's what my wife keeps telling me.
41:45 Speaker 03 Well, she's right, but I'm telling you, for the way you view your parents, I also was incredibly emotionally intelligent, had all sorts of feelings towards my parents, devoted the first 12 years of my, I'm Gary Vee. And I've known I've been Gary Vee since I was fucking 10 years old. I, Gary Vee, not regular chap, I devoted the first 12 years of my entire life professionally to my parents. That's how much I love them. That's how much I understood them. I was intertwined into their lives. They're only 20 years older than me.
42:17 Speaker 03 And so, I promise you, you have a great gift coming. Whatever thing you went through at 23, wait till your child is 15.
42:27 Speaker 05 Yeah, I'm super romantic about my family. All the awards I ever win go to my dad's bedroom. That's where they're supposed to be. You know, somebody asked me recently, "Did your parents contribute to your journey financially?" I said, "No money's worth the encouragement they gave me." When I told them I was doing interviews on the internet. My dad's a lawyer, he was like, "What are you doing? Are you sure about it? Okay, do it for 6 months, tell me how it goes."
42:50 Speaker 03 It's incredible. And you know this, coming from the cultures we come from, that's a rarity. That's not a common. So you become double grateful that your parents... I mean, same for me, I was a terrible student. Every Russian immigrant, all they talked about was, if you didn't get to Harvard... Like, if you went to NYU, that was a disaster.
43:11 Speaker 05 That's a failure.
43:12 Speaker 03 Right?
43:12 Speaker 05 Right.
43:12 Speaker 03 If I went to NYU, that would have been like I went to triple Harvard plus MIT. I mean, that's how bottom of the rung I was. But my mother gave me the freedom at a time with no internet, no pointing to people being successful from entrepreneurship in society. Wasn't even a conversation. Never even heard the word until my twenties.
43:35 Speaker 03 She gave me the freedom to be me, and so I know what you feel, I feel the same way.
43:39 Speaker 05 You know, what's also true for our cultures is they tend to be risk averse. And so, a lot of my peers grow up wanting to avoid losing money, then actually taking bets to make large sums of money, and money being just...
43:50 Speaker 03 I get it, I get it, I get it.
43:51 Speaker 05 What do you say to that? How does one change that mindset?
43:55 Speaker 03 It's a really fun question. It's hard. I would say that a lot of this is hard wiring.
44:02 Speaker 03 You know, there's a DNA thing, there's a culture thing. If you grow up in an environment where your natural DNA is to not be entrepreneurial or offense oriented, and then it's reinforced by your parents of like, "Get a steady job, be an engineer, you'll always have a steady job." You have deep therapy and deep emotional work to become more risk interested. I would also argue, risk interested just means you have higher capacity for massive upside.
44:30 Speaker 05 Sure.
44:32 Speaker 03 Again, I'm such a big fan of being comfortable of who you actually are versus trying to be someone you're not. I have no interest in convincing anyone to be like me, except for one thing. Be like me in that I've been truly me the whole time. And so if you're a doctor, amazing. If you're a stay-at-home father. Very taboo still in many societies, a stay-at-home father. But if your soul is a stay-at-home father, and you do that, and you deal with the judgment of your father-in-law. Imagine being a stay-at-home father in Indian culture. Yeah, I knew that would land for you, boys. You're fucking dead. You're dead!
45:12 Speaker 05 Damn dude, you're insane.
45:14 Speaker 03 But if you're listening right now and your goal in life is to be a stay-at-home father, not because you're looking for a sugar mama, but because like you have been so affected and wired by your circumstances that you want to raise your children day in and day out as a man from India, who's gonna have to deal with unlimited judgment of your contemporaries and most of all, your in-laws. And often maybe even your own wife.
45:44 Speaker 03 Well then you're me.
45:47 Speaker 03 It was not very easy to be a child of the 80s and being told you're stupid, you're the R-word. I got D's and F's.
45:56 Speaker 03 But I just knew who I was, and I was willing to deal with every ounce of collateral damage to live the life I wanted, and then I got fortunate that the world came into me. The reverse of everyone who was told to be an engineer now and getting caught.
46:12 Speaker 05 There has to be a superpower, brother.
46:14 Speaker 03 You know what's funny? It is a superpower, but it's actually an old-school superpower. I think it's a throwback superpower. Just think back with the way the world was in the 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s. You didn't know that many people. There was not that much judgment. You just kinda lived, right? Sure, in town and it felt the same way as a million people, but... You know this, it's not a superpower when it comes so natural to you.
46:37 Speaker 05 Right, right.
46:37 Speaker 03 Just like all the superheroes that we all look up to, they were born like that. Or they got bit by a spider, or whatever.
46:43 Speaker 05 I know what you mean by that.
46:46 Speaker 03 Oh, you want to show the report card?
46:48 Speaker 05 I referenced it like 3 times.
46:49 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah. This is my report card from high school.
46:52 Speaker 05 Oh, let me see it.
46:52 Speaker 03 Yeah. This should help, everybody who's listening in India, this should help you. Go to the bottom, show my class rank. Bottom left.
46:59 Speaker 05 Bottom left. It says 4 years, GPA 1.67, class rank 243, class size 254.
47:07 Speaker 03 11.
47:08 Speaker 05 Yeah, you want to see it? You want to get this on the tablet?
47:09 Speaker 03 11. 11 people.
47:12 Speaker 05 Just 11 people behind you. What are they doing? Do you have any recollection?
47:15 Speaker 03 Not great stuff.
47:19 Speaker 03 Listen, I say this all the time, like, not everyone who's bad at school is gonna go on to do incredible things. They have to be, they have to be wildly entrepreneurial or wildly creative. If you don't have those things, being bad at school is a mitigator to something in the middle. Because if you're not good at school and you're not entrepreneurial, and you're not wildly creative.
47:42 Speaker 05 Correct.
47:42 Speaker 03 Correct. You need to be some different thing.
47:45 Speaker 05 Right.
47:45 Speaker 03 If you're not extremely good at those things, it of course often leads to not as much financial or professional success. It does not mean you won't be happy. I actually have a very strong point of view on this.
48:00 Speaker 05 You think these things are different?
48:02 Speaker 03 Yeah, because I think simplicity leads to enormous amounts of happiness, bro.
48:06 Speaker 05 And you don't need a lot of money or success for that?
48:08 Speaker 03 I think that's been proven. I don't think I'm saying anything profound. I don't think it's where the temperament of our society is. I'm actually looking forward to it. I actually think everything we're going through is gonna lead to a movement of simplicity.
48:19 Speaker 05 Like more offline, less comparison, less noise?
48:22 Speaker 03 And not only offline, just like, offline and looking to live within your means of $57,000 a year in rural Costa Rica. And working at the farm stand.
48:32 Speaker 05 Right.
48:33 Speaker 03 And like loving your life.
48:33 Speaker 05 Right. Right, so identifying with the quality of your life as opposed to your lifestyle?
48:38 Speaker 03 Yes, and your lifestyle for sure not being predicated on people's judgment of your lifestyle.
48:45 Speaker 05 Do you think that is the reason why people often anchor their ambition to wealth?
48:48 Speaker 03 100%. I believe the whole game is self-esteem versus insecurity. There is nothing else.
48:53 Speaker 05 Say more.
48:54 Speaker 03 I believe life is one simple game of people that are, and there's a, obviously there's, but on the extremes, pure self-esteem versus accelerated pure insecurity. And wherever you sit is how your life is. And if you have pure self-esteem, pure, you are truly confident within your own skin and people's outside opinions penetrate you little. You're not delusional. You intake people's information, but you do not internalize it as truth. You process it to make sure that you're not delusional and you use it as a normal, balanced human. That if you are there, whether you make 10 million a year or you make 10,000 a year, you are going to win.
49:35 Speaker 05 You're going to win the happiness game.
49:37 Speaker 03 What else is there?
49:40 Speaker 05 You know what I also often thought is that ambition, and maybe it's true. I sometimes reflect and I think my ambition comes from a certain injury to self-esteem. Do you think that's generally the case? Do you think there's another source for ambition?
49:53 Speaker 03 Yes. Extreme insecurity.
49:55 Speaker 05 Yeah, right. That's what I mean. So insecurity is the source for ambition.
49:58 Speaker 03 And extreme confidence.
49:59 Speaker 05 And extreme confidence also leads to ambition?
50:01 Speaker 03 Yes. I feel like I'm supposed to, in a good way, and if I don't, it's okay. But I'm, I feel like I'm a, you know, in the summer, I always look, I always bring this analogy up. You know the like flies that go into the light and get zapped?
50:16 Speaker 05 Right.
50:16 Speaker 03 I am not able to stop myself from doing what I'm doing.
50:20 Speaker 05 Right.
50:20 Speaker 03 And it is not because I want Sid to think I'm cool.
50:23 Speaker 05 Right, right.
50:23 Speaker 03 Or I'm gonna prove it to the girl that didn't like me in 4th grade, or my father, or my daughter. Like, I'm doing it because it is my destiny.
50:35 Speaker 05 My, my father would tell you, both my parents would tell me, and I think they did this beautifully. I, I hope parents around the world listen to this and think of it. They would tell me constantly that I'm special and I'm made for great things.
50:44 Speaker 03 Yes.
50:45 Speaker 05 And the way that's led to me saying yes to things that are bigger and more scaled, rather than smaller and more insecure, that has shifted massively as a function of being told consistently as a kid that you're special. I think it did wonders for my self-esteem. And I think in that you're right, confidence does lead to a lot of ambition in that.
51:01 Speaker 03 And I got it the best way and I, I'm curious, it sounds like you might have too. I'm just, but you'll let me know. Me too. My mom told me I was a star my whole life.
51:12 Speaker 03 But I had consequences for bad behavior.
51:14 Speaker 05 Oh, of course.
51:15 Speaker 03 Well, don't say that, because a lot of parents, this is modern parenting.
51:18 Speaker 05 Oh, I see what you mean.
51:19 Speaker 03 You're a star, you're a star, star, you're a crackhead, you're like doing bad things, and your parents like, "You're a star, you're a star," because they just wanna, they believe delusional self-esteem will work itself out.
51:27 Speaker 05 Oh, I see.
51:28 Speaker 03 Self-esteem building, confidence building, with consequences, is the great balance. "I'm a star, I'm a star, I got back..." By the way, those grades? I was grounded for two weeks, no television, no friends, no phone, no video games, consistently, four times a year.
51:48 Speaker 03 And never did I think my mother thought of who I was going to be because of my grades, but I had to pay the price because my job was to be a student. And when I under-delivered, I paid the consequences.
52:02 Speaker 05 I think there was benefit to being scared of my father for that reason.
52:05 Speaker 03 Yeah, you know what's funny? Man, I was scared, brother, you'll appreciate this. I was, this is back to like, this is back to the extreme of what I'm saying. I, forget about fear, how about disappointing the person you love the most in the world? Watching my mom be disappointed, I'm emotional right now. It broke my heart to upset my mom four times a year. But I was going to the light, I couldn't. There was nothing that could happen. Even for my mother, the greatest, most important thing for me, I must go to school today and sell lollipops and baseball cards, work on my marketing, work on my people skills. Nothing that's happening in the classroom has anything to do with me.
52:42 Speaker 05 And how did they relate to your success in later life? How do they see that?
52:45 Speaker 03 They, who, my parents?
52:47 Speaker 05 Yes, your parents.
52:47 Speaker 03 My parents knew it the whole way, it was too obvious.
52:49 Speaker 05 Right.
52:50 Speaker 03 What's more interesting is my teachers rewrote history.
52:53 Speaker 05 My, my relatives rewrote history?
52:55 Speaker 03 Fair.
52:56 Speaker 05 Right.
52:56 Speaker 03 Fair.
52:56 Speaker 05 And this is what I tell people when they're betting on something. Uh, right out of college particularly, I'm like, "Listen, you have a few years to go for the moon." Right? Nobody expects nothing off of you, go hardcore.
53:05 Speaker 03 You know that's my biggest thesis.
53:06 Speaker 05 Right.
53:06 Speaker 03 High risk, high reward in your twenties.
53:08 Speaker 05 Right. And, and what happens is, every single person who once said, "Your video looks cringe," or "This idea is stupid," they will rewrite history in their own head and tell the story in a completely different way.
53:18 Speaker 03 I had a teacher at the Javits Center during a book signing, who was my English teacher, who said to my face I was stupid.
53:27 Speaker 03 While I was crowded by 50 people after a speech of my latest book, come up to me and I recognized her right away. And I thought I was gonna have this fun moment where I was like, can you believe... And I'm like, I'm so empathetic to what she was thinking. I had no resentment or anger. I thought we were gonna have a laugh of like, can you believe the... She completely rewrote it in front of everyone.
53:45 Speaker 05 Right.
53:46 Speaker 03 She's like, "I always knew." I'm like, "You..." I'm too gracious. I'm funny. I was too gracious. I bit my tongue because I didn't want... Because we were amongst 50, 60. If it was just me and her, I would've got her. But because we were amongst 50 people, I didn't need to embarrass her. I didn't need that. Back to, right? When you're insecure, you'll kill that person.
54:05 Speaker 05 Right.
54:05 Speaker 03 But I laughed and I bit my cheeks. I was probably bleeding in my mouth when I left. The way she tried to rewrite that... It's why I always give Mrs. Kennedy, Senora Kennedy, a lot of flowers. I've done that publicly for a long time. It's the one teacher. I needed to pass in that... Actually, go to that report card. This is really fun. I've never told a story with a report card. If you look at the top left, I think that's 9th grade, right?
54:27 Speaker 05 Yeah.
54:28 Speaker 03 So these were my final grades for the year.
54:30 Speaker 05 Right.
54:31 Speaker 03 Right? This is a recap report card. Do you see German?
54:34 Speaker 05 I see German, yes.
54:35 Speaker 03 What did I get?
54:36 Speaker 05 F.
54:36 Speaker 03 Okay, now go to 10th grade. This is the recap.
54:39 Speaker 05 Yep.
54:39 Speaker 03 What did I get in German?
54:40 Speaker 05 F.
54:41 Speaker 03 Okay, so I took German 1 twice. And I got, ready for this, 8 Fs. 4 report cards in a year, 8 Fs. 8 Fs in 2 years. In New Jersey, in the state of New Jersey, you have to pass a language for 2 years to graduate high school. You must pass a language for 2 years. I now go into 10th, 11th grade, as you see.
55:02 Speaker 05 Yeah, I see Spanish 1.
55:03 Speaker 03 I took Spanish 1. Because now I have to reset. What did I get?
55:07 Speaker 05 D.
55:08 Speaker 03 And then 12th grade, Spanish 2?
55:10 Speaker 05 Spanish 2 D. So you barely passed.
55:12 Speaker 03 No, no, I didn't pass.
55:13 Speaker 05 Oh, this is not bad.
55:14 Speaker 03 That is a pass. It is a pass.
55:15 Speaker 05 Okay.
55:16 Speaker 03 You ready for this?
55:17 Speaker 05 Yeah.
55:17 Speaker 03 My Ds in Spanish are worse than my Fs in German. But Mrs. Kennedy saw who I was as a human and she passed me.
55:29 Speaker 05 That means the world to a kid, man.
55:30 Speaker 03 I'm fucking 50 years old. This happened literally fucking 32 years ago. And I'm telling you this story after the way my life worked out. Can you imagine how much it means to a kid?
55:42 Speaker 05 Yeah.
55:43 Speaker 03 She called my mother, she called my mother senior year and said, "Mrs. Vaynerchuk, the only teacher to call my mom in four years of high school, because I was no academic, as you can see. "Mrs. Vaynerchuk, I just want you to know, your son will pass, but he does not know more than one word in Spanish." And that is true today. Hola. That's what I got.
56:04 Speaker 05 Just hola, no que pasa. That's it. That's crazy. Yeah. You know, one of the bigger sort of blockers for a lot of Indians is this exact idea of what the world will think. There is a famous phrase associated with it.
56:17 Speaker 03 I'm very aware. I've been touching on it the whole time.
56:19 Speaker 05 Right. And, um, a lot of advice I'm able to offer people who listen to me is that history gets rewritten.
56:25 Speaker 03 Every time.
56:26 Speaker 05 If you keep trying, history gets rewritten. And the second thing is that how you go to sleep at night is a more real feeling than almost anything else you feel in society.
56:34 Speaker 03 And I have a feeling, because I didn't have it at 30 either, I have a feeling because we see stuff so similar that you will realize how right I am about regret. Forget about even sleeping in anxiety during the day. Forget about outside judgment and validation. Brother, I'm telling you, as you start to get older, the only thing that people should fear besides health is regret.
56:57 Speaker 05 It's that powerful, huh?
56:58 Speaker 03 It's that powerful.
56:59 Speaker 05 Maybe it hasn't hit me yet.
57:00 Speaker 03 Because it shouldn't. Even I at 50, I'm like, and you know me a little bit, I think I have 50 more years to cook.
57:06 Speaker 05 Right.
57:06 Speaker 03 But I'm not an idiot. At 30, you're not thinking about mortality.
57:12 Speaker 05 No, not at all.
57:13 Speaker 03 I promise you at 80, when you're like, "How much time do I really have?"
57:17 Speaker 05 Right.
57:18 Speaker 03 You're gonna be really happy you lived your life on your terms, because I've spent enough time with people in their 80s that didn't, and it is a devastating energy.
57:28 Speaker 05 Wow.
57:28 Speaker 03 Devastating.
57:31 Speaker 05 That's a very interesting insight. You know, I honestly feel like, um, what old people have to say is sometimes so real, because their reflection is so honest. There is no way to run.
57:41 Speaker 03 I would say the biggest issue in society, one of the biggest issues, is we've we've lessened the value of old wisdom. We've put young culture at the pedestal, and I think it's hurt us.
57:52 Speaker 05 Yeah.
57:53 Speaker 03 I think to Indian culture, and to Asian culture, and to Eastern European culture, they have it better than America. In America, we completely disrespect our elders. I think in certain parts of, other parts of the world, there's still something, but I think you guys all know this. The way we put grandpa in India on a pedestal today is already different than 30 years ago, because we've been westernized.
58:14 Speaker 05 Yeah. And I think wisdom is not the same as knowledge, and wisdom, wisdom actually is knowledge over time.
58:20 Speaker 03 Correct, it's earned. It's earned.
58:22 Speaker 05 And that, you will not get it on a random article.
58:25 Speaker 03 When I was 25, I was a whiz kid entrepreneur, I was. I was great. And I thought I knew everything. And my 50-year-old self laughs at 25-year-old Gary. I would squash that kid in a business game of chess.
58:39 Speaker 05 Dude, I feel like every 2 or 3 years, I'll have a feeling where I'll be like, "Now I think I have figured it out, now I think I get it." And I have that feeling every 2 or 3 years, and I finally look at myself 2, 3 years ago and I'm like that.
58:50 Speaker 03 I know, I know. Way to it becomes decades, not years. Everybody, if you enjoyed this podcast, please go back and look at the prior episodes, they're loaded. I appreciate your attention, and thanks for being part of this journey. See you later.
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