Roasting Met Gala, Last of Us goes Gay, & F1 is IS America

YERRR – no guest this week, just the boys cookin’ on everything from HBO's greatness to red carpet chaos. We’re talkin’ Last of Us theories, F1 races (and why it might be the best live event ever), recent Padel problems, Met Gala madness, and then Professor Gagnon breaks down Burkina Faso at the end. All that and way more on this week’s episode of FLAGRANT. INDULGE. 00:00 Intro + Mark v Vala rivalry 5:01 The Last of Us's New Love Story & Film industry trends in general 14:52 Who does Anime represent? 19:35 Last of Us Love Scene Problems 24:11 Portnoy defends restaurant & wants to send people to Auschwitz 26:03 Mark's tour 28:44 Is that really Seal’s kid? 32:49 F1 is the greatest live sport 46:43 Jelly Roll is incredible + Schulz hanging with celebs 50:53 Judging the Met Gala looks 1:05:32 Black people conspiracies + Elmo’s Black 1:12:53 Burkina Faso Coup + Shackles of Colonialism 1:26:20 Bukele + Latina America getting their get back 1:35:10 Authoritarianism, Bukele’s Snow + Looking after Homebase 1:45:56 Trump is blatant with his + No more curtains 1:50:49 Vietnam tore down the curtain 1:54:23 Rat experiment + Sperm epigenetics 2:02:18 Counter-points to the rat experiment Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

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• 1:28Mark Gagnon?

  That play with Mark the other day. Paddle? Yeah. Sanchez?

• 1:33Speaker 04

  Pure ass.

• 1:34Speaker 05

  What's interesting is Al might not have been the weakest link.

• 1:35Mark Gagnon?

  Vola wasn't bad.

• 1:36Speaker 05

  So Vola's still the worst? No, Vola plays every day. There's no way. Oh, God. Oh, God.

• 1:43Mark Gagnon?

  I know, he's gonna watch this and be crushed.

• 1:46Speaker 05

  He's been working so hard.

• 1:47Mark Gagnon?

  I know.

• 1:48Speaker 05

  He plays all the time. You saw in group chats, he's developing like paddle culture stuff, like... And you have a baby, you take seven months off and you wipe the floor with him. There's nerve damage to one of his legs. Is that present at all, what he has planned?

• 2:00Speaker 04

  It's both.

• 2:01Speaker 05

  And he's not even here.

• 2:03Speaker 04

  I wish he was, can we call him?

• 2:04Speaker 05

  Saw, dude, yo, Mark is talking shit. He said he busted your ass in paddle. Stop, stop. No, no, he's full of shit. First of all, I won with everyone I played with. So I don't know what to say.

• 2:16Mark Gagnon?

  He played with Al and they got bagels.

• 2:17Speaker 05

  No, no, he lost 6-2 because it was Al I said he was. Mark said he came on the pod and he goes, "I think Vola has nerve damage in both legs." That's what he said. I did not say that, Val. That's fucked up. And he knew you weren't gonna be here, so he knew you could talk shit without you doing your act outs.

• 2:39Speaker 05

  Alright dude, we'll set it up. We love you, bye. Bye, Val. Damn, you and Val got like an interesting rivalry. What's that about, you think? I think...

• 2:53Speaker 05

  Shifty is not allowed to have joy today. Shifty, we're being sad and bitter today. Yes, that's true. Shifty's about to have the youngest hip and leg transplant in history, something Val should have done two decades ago. And today is our bitter sad day, and then once we process all this bitter and sadness, we move on. But if you find Shifty laughing throughout the episode, we have to stop the pilot and acknowledge it. Yo, but do it after the summertime, don't do it now. Wait, what do you mean? What do you mean? He's in pain, he's in chronic pain every day. He's in chronic pain. Walk it off for a couple of months. He's been walking it off for a year, he got hit by a car twice, this fucking idiot.

• 3:24Speaker 05

  The insurance company's denying defending the podium. He's about to shoot Brian Thompson again. Yeah, 100%. He's about to go at him, bro, I'm telling you. Shifty, no more joy! Can we get a cam on Shifty? Can we get a joy cam on Shifty? He's in a... He does have a Luigi vibe, doesn't he? Shifty's got super Luigi-coded energy. Oh shit, I see it. He does kinda look like him. Okay, Shifty, can you tell us why you were giggling when I said that Vala and Mark have a little rivalry? Can you tell us that, please? In the most sad, sardonic way possible.

• 3:55Speaker 06

  Mark, you remember when you crushed Vala's sushi in front of them?

• 3:57Speaker 05

  Wait, what happened?

• 3:58Speaker 06

  We were filming that video for the Toronto promo, and we're all eating out there, and Vala said something smart to you, and you didn't have a slick comeback or anything, so you just took your thumb, and he was eating sushi, and he was all happy, and you mushed his sushi.

• 4:16Speaker 06

  And Vala went from laughing like, "Ha ha ha," to truly serious, so mad. And then Mark...

• 4:23Speaker 05

  Where did I learn that from?

• 4:29Speaker 05

  Yo, sometimes you don't need a slick comeback, sometimes you need to put your paw in somebody's sushi platter, and it works just as good. Oh no, Mark. Yeah. You've become a tyrant. No. Vala always starts it. I don't like this idea that I'm bullying Vala, okay? Yo, Vala! Vala, Mark said, Mark said he mushed your sushi one day, you didn't do shit.

• 4:57Speaker 05

  Mark said he walked up to your sushi platter and he put his thumb in your spicy tuna roll and mushed it and you did nothing. You sat there and took it.

• 5:07Speaker 07

  No, no, no. I've been waiting for him to have a kid so I can push his thumb.

• 5:11Speaker 05

  Damn, bro. You didn't have to go full pocket stuff on it.

• 5:15Mark Gagnon?

  I know, so.

• 5:18Mark Gagnon?

  He just gossied your kid.

• 5:20Speaker 05

  Damn, bro. Why you going after the kid? Damn, this is, I gotta hang up before this shit gets too serious. Jesus, we were just having fun. This guy went nuclear. You can't, hey, listen, free Kashmir, bro. I get it now, Hindustan. I get it now, Hindustan.

• 5:36Mark Gagnon?

  Damn.

• 5:37Speaker 05

  Damn, bro, what the fuck?

• 5:38Mark Gagnon?

  He's a wild dude.

• 5:39Speaker 05

  He's still upset about that sushi mush. Yeah.

• 5:43Mark Gagnon?

  Love 40, bro. That's, that's me and all his whole relationship.

• 5:46Speaker 05

  You had him love 40?

• 5:47Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, just in life, you know what I mean? It's just love 40. I'm just a point away from decimating him.

• 5:54Mark Gagnon?

  It's just love 40.

• 5:55Speaker 05

  That is so fucked. I was not even here.

• 5:58Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, man, that is a bar, though. I am gonna use that.

• 6:02Speaker 05

  I think it's 40 love, though. You're serving, right?

• 6:04Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 6:05Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 6:06Mark Gagnon?

  It's okay.

• 6:07Speaker 05

  I mean, love 40 doesn't, it sounds like he's losing.

• 6:10Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, but it was still fucked.

• 6:11Speaker 05

  We got it. We got it. We got it. But obviously now that everybody listens to the podcast is a, is a, you know, paddle aficionado.

• 6:20Speaker 05

  They might be confused about that. Oh, guys. Okay, so, um, what was gayer last night? Last of Us or the Met Gala? What do you want to talk about?

• 6:29Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, well, can you explain Last of Us?

• 6:32Speaker 05

  Yo, can I tell you something about this? So the, the video game was gay. They had like a lesbian thing in it.

• 6:38Mark Gagnon?

  And you had to do the mission gay?

• 6:39Speaker 05

  You have to do it. You gay. Yo, that's really funny. They don't, Shifty, you're laughing and feeling joyful again. I don't like you laughing and feeling joyful up there.

• 6:48Mark Gagnon?

  Are you upset that the TV show is aggregate to the game and they include the gay shit?

• 6:51Speaker 05

  I'm upset.

• 6:52Mark Gagnon?

  Why is it the first thing you break up? What was more gay? The Met Gala or the show?

• 6:56Speaker 05

  But I mean, it might be positive. Look how gay the world is.

• 6:58Mark Gagnon?

  Yes, finally.

• 6:59Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 7:00Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 7:00Speaker 05

  Look at how gay he's sitting. Yeah, look at me. You think I'm gonna be upset at gay shit? 40 love, suck it.

• 7:06Speaker 05

  40 minutes on the

• 7:10Speaker 05

  No, like, okay, so I hadn't thought about while I'm watching The Last of Us, because I played the video game. It was obviously very traumatic for me when the little lesbian girl started making out and having sex. Because I've known Ellie, the character, since she was a teenager. I don't want to watch this girl. It's like a daughter to me practically. You know, now she's a fully grown lesbian and she's just fingering somebody dirty, out on horseback for four days, no shower. There's a lot of things going on. Also, they didn't need to show the fingering scene. That was a little much. I know I'm becoming an old man. See? She's not even a seasoned lesbian, like, doesn't even unbuckle her belt. What does she do? She's like pulling at the jeans, trying to stop. The hand underneath, wrist is all caught. It's crazy.

• 7:48Mark Gagnon?

  Like a puppet?

• 7:49Speaker 05

  Yeah. That's what it is.

• 7:53Speaker 05

  Anyway, so yeah, so I was watching and I'm curious what you guys thought of it. Okay. You know how like Hollywood, okay, Hollywood wants to make money. We understand. This is the point of Hollywood, right? And then like, sometimes there's virtuous people caught up in every industry and they start like putting justifications on their actions, like we all do, that make them seem a little bit like more benevolent. Right? Fair enough. So, but in my experience, Hollywood is very reactive. Like, a movie about ice skating does really well, there'll be five more ice skating movies. Right? Horror movies do well, they go, okay, horror is it. R-rated comedy does well, okay, let's make R-rated comedy. So, what I think is happening with like the, you call DI, or you know, like trans stories or gay stories, whatever it is.

• 8:35Speaker 05

  Like, what I think has happened is, there was some very brave filmmakers, like Brokeback Mountain. That could have been a huge fucking flop. Right? You put this movie out, they're like, hold on, gay cowboys? Like, who's gonna go watch this? And despite the fact that it could have been a huge flop, the actors in it were brave for doing it. It's not like there's like all this reward for doing a gay scene. At the time, like, you could look at those characters and be like, ah, they're gay now, I don't want to see them in action.

• 9:00Mark Gagnon?

  You might lose your role in Hollywood.

• 9:01Speaker 05

  It's courageous.

• 9:02Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 9:03Speaker 05

  The movie, just as a theory, movie does really well because it's a good movie, but it's also like brave and courageous. Right? The Hollywood industry reacts and goes, "Oh, that makes money. Let's do the gay shit." Okay. And then the executives, lower level, start going, "We have to share these marginalized stories, we have to do it." And they might actually believe that shit. But at the top, they're just reacting to whatever's successful. Once the top is forcing in stories that they don't actually really care about, they're just doing it to make money, the people see it as forced. If it's an authentic, pure story, doesn't matter if it's gay or not, or it's DEI or

• 9:47Speaker 05

  not, like Jordan Poole's shit isn't DEI, we just like it because it's cool. Jordan Peele. Uh, Jordan Peele, right? Poole, sorry. Jordan, yeah, my bad, my bad, Jordan. Uh, one of them is, one of them is really good. So Jordan, Jordan Peele's stories really work because they're like authentic, right? And the, and the crowd reacts to it because they're authentic, it doesn't feel forced. When the forced shit happens, we go, "Ah, this is stupid." And then we find reasons, we justify the blame, why it sucks. We're like, "Oh, this is DEI, this is the other shit." No, no, it's just inauthentic. It's late. And it's no longer rebellious, it's no longer shocking, it's no longer different, it just feels like they're cashing in on this idea. Here's the problem. When the tech industry wants to like cure cancer, they do it for money and they're very open about it. They're like, "We think we can make money curing cancer."

• 10:32Speaker 05

  Like this drug might help it, or whatever it is. We can use AI to like locate it early and then remove it, whatever. If it can't make money, they're like, "All right, we can't deploy cash towards that." Hollywood has already made their bed with, "We're doing this because it's important to share marginalized stories." Once those stories stop making money, the execs at the top are like, "Damn, we, we already told everybody we're doing this because it's beneficial to the world." When in reality, we're just doing it to make money. So now we can't exactly pivot off of it too fast. Because then it's gonna expose the lie that we were doing this for some benevolent reason in the first place.

• 11:09Mark Gagnon?

  Mm-hmm, okay.

• 11:10Speaker 05

  Thoughts?

• 11:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, Bezos has a quote where he, it went viral on Twitter recently, where he was like, "In order to get outsized gains, you have to bat against conventional wisdom."

• 11:19Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 11:19Speaker 04

  So like, if you go against the grain, you're gonna strike out nine times, but if you hit it, you have potentially a thousand X reward. And so I think that happens in the film industry, where going against conventional wisdom, let's make a gay cowboy movie, it goes crazy, and then of course, everyone chases. I think that happens in every industry.

• 11:33Mark Gagnon?

  To bring that up now, though, this is the game. They're being accurate to the game.

• 11:37Speaker 05

  No, I'm actually saying the game is not a good example.

• 11:40Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 11:40Speaker 05

  But it gave me, it just gave me like, an idea about the industry in general.

• 11:45Mark Gagnon?

  Okay, but you're not saying that this episode of Last of Us felt forced?

• 11:49Speaker 05

  No, no, no, no. When I first played the game, I'm sure we can look back at it, and I probably have a completely different opinion than I have right now. It's me. Yes, apocrates, yeah. But like, when I played the game, I was like, is this forced? Are they trying to be progressive? Has it always been a kind of progressive pushing show? Like, was the video game industry very scrutinized? Like, what was happening at the time when it came out, Shifty? Do you remember?

• 12:11Speaker 06

  Like, with the reaction of it?

• 12:12Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 12:13Speaker 06

  I mean, it hadn't really happened to have like, a character, like, a main woman character be gay like that in a video game.

• 12:19Speaker 05

  Because I remember, kind of like, around this time, remember there was this big thing in video games where they were super sexist, and this was like, tangentially related to Me Too, and like, they were over-sexualized, etc.

• 12:30Speaker 06

  Yeah, so it was the complete opposite.

• 12:32Speaker 04

  But also, the dudes-

• 12:33Speaker 05

  So it was rebellious, you could make-

• 12:34Speaker 04

  The dudes were gay before that, though, right?

• 12:36Speaker 05

  Who?

• 12:36Speaker 04

  In Last of Us.

• 12:38Speaker 05

  Oh, they had the gay dudes, but in Last of Us, it wasn't that big a deal.

• 12:41Speaker 04

  Right, it was like, kinda subtle.

• 12:42Speaker 05

  It was barely even mentioned. And then the episode they made out of it was fucking incredible.

• 12:46Speaker 04

  Right.

• 12:47Speaker 05

  And I think that was also transformative. They just made a dope episode.

• 12:50Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 12:51Speaker 05

  And we all liked it, and it felt authentic, it didn't feel forced. So here's the unfortunate thing. You do something that's no longer rebellious, it becomes the norm and it feels inauthentic. And then there are people that are creating authentic stories that are like that. But unfortunately, because everything around it feels so inauthentic, it gets jumbled into it.

• 13:13Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 13:14Speaker 05

  So while this was a rebellious story to tell in video games, the five years ago or seven years ago, whenever they started writing it, now because of like the trend around forced diversity, it can get looped in on it.

• 13:27Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 13:27Speaker 05

  Into that, which is like, it's unfair to that because it's authentic to the game.

• 13:30Speaker 04

  Yeah. I think it happens, like you mentioned the medical industry. I think they also sometimes couch stuff in like flowery language to make it seem like.

• 13:38Speaker 05

  Like what?

• 13:38Speaker 04

  Like, oh, like our mission is, you know, someone in my family had cancer and so we're doing cancer research, da, da, da.

• 13:44Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:44Speaker 04

  And it's like, okay, it might be that also. Again, it's hard to like judge people's internal intentions, but there's also the financial component, obviously.

• 13:50Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 13:51Speaker 04

  So I think every industry, like their motivation is ultimately financial, but they will kind of frame stuff and like, oh, our brand statement is, you know, make people fit or make people smarter. But it's like, okay, it's that plus money.

• 14:03Speaker 05

  I wonder if they were honest about it from the jump, like they are about different genres of film. Like if R rated comedies are popping and then a bunch of other R rated comedies come out, it's like, they're like, yeah, yeah, this is really successful right now. So we're trying to do that. And then when they pivot away from it, we're not upset because they're not going, it is important for us to promote comedy at an R rated level and dirty words are good and all these other virtues things.

• 14:25Mark Gagnon?

  Really undercut whatever thing they're putting out if they're like, oh, we're doing this, we're telling you in advance, we're only doing this because it's worth.

• 14:31Speaker 05

  You're right. They have to give us a little bit of a lie.

• 14:33Speaker 04

  I also don't think that these studios are like ideologically like consolidated. Well, there's one ideology. I think that they, I think they're bringing in different people. So like you'll have these, like the executives and the, and you know, the finance people, the number of people that are obviously, okay, we want to make money, make sure it's profitable. But then they're like, okay, let's bring in some creatives that are living in a car, you know, that are just making these beautiful movies, da, da, da. And they probably don't give a shit. And then they're amalgamating this group of people that all have different strengths.

• 14:59Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 14:59Speaker 04

  So I think that, you know, obviously stratifying it, you can, you have people that just care about the money. But then you have people that are like, no, I care about only the. Mission and then they butt heads and then hopefully they make a good product.

• 15:09Speaker 05

  Yeah, or you start like finding people that can execute the types of stories that you think are profitable.

• 15:16Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's what they're doing.

• 15:17Speaker 05

  Right.

• 15:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 15:17Speaker 05

  But and you're but you're specifically choosing them.

• 15:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, exactly. But then those people.

• 15:21Speaker 05

  But those people are authentic about the way that they.

• 15:23Speaker 04

  Exactly. They're not, I guess, you know, lying when they're out there being like, no, I we need to make this story because this is important to me in my life.

• 15:30Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 15:30Speaker 04

  They were just picked because that is what their mission is.

• 15:33Speaker 05

  Right.

• 15:34Speaker 04

  And then the studio brings them in and says, okay, let's make a film.

• 15:36Speaker 05

  Yeah. Yeah, it's just an interesting way that like, you know, once a trend starts, you see everything that's created through that lens. Like, we talked about it a lot, even with like the Disney shit back in the day, like, none of us thought about diversity and Disney was wildly diverse back in the day. Like Aladdin, the first thing that we're watching is there's no white people. And none of us were like, where do white people? I thought they were white.

• 15:59Speaker 05

  Someone had to tell them. Akash was like, I really related to Aladdin because it was the first brown person. I was like, who was brown in Aladdin?

• 16:06Speaker 05

  I was like, Aladdin was like me, wasn't it? The genie? Like, I had no clue who was brown in that movie.

• 16:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:12Speaker 05

  But Mulan didn't feel like, I know it was Asian, but it didn't feel like, oh, we need to give you an Asian story so that the Chinese market will buy it and we can make billions of dollars. Kids are also so aware.

• 16:22Mark Gagnon?

  Anime, are the characters white or is that what Asians think they look like?

• 16:26Speaker 05

  The eyes are too big to be like. No, no, no. You're making a good point because the eyes are cartoonishly big.

• 16:35Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 16:35Speaker 05

  Which is not what they're known for.

• 16:37Mark Gagnon?

  And so why would all their characters not represent them?

• 16:41Speaker 05

  Look at those eyes. It feels like they're making fun of white people.

• 16:46Speaker 05

  Doesn't it?

• 16:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, these round-eyed motherfuckers.

• 16:48Speaker 05

  Right. And then maybe they think we have superpowers because of the nukes or something.

• 16:53Speaker 04

  That's possible. Hold on, let's.

• 16:54Speaker 05

  But it is. It is odd that a lot of their fucking characters in animes are fucking. Well, there is that that colorism shit. Right? In Asian culture, but which I don't even think. You can be the fair-skinned Asians. But, oh, you think that they look white even outside of? Yeah. I got you. Okay. In Street Fighter, was Ryu white to you? Yeah. Right? And his brother was white. Ken is obviously white, but was Ryu white?

• 17:22Mark Gagnon?

  I in my head, yes, but I think his origin story was he was half white.

• 17:26Speaker 04

  Which was Ryu?

• 17:28Mark Gagnon?

  The main one.

• 17:28Speaker 04

  The guy.

• 17:29Speaker 05

  That guy?

• 17:30Mark Gagnon?

  Jesus Christ, what the fuck was your childhood?

• 17:32Speaker 04

  No, they missed it.

• 17:34Speaker 05

  Ours, you have to understand, Street Fighter for us.

• 17:37Mark Gagnon?

  The fuck?

• 17:38Speaker 04

  I was playing Mortal Kombat.

• 17:40Speaker 05

  So that's the thing, like, and I'm surprised even you weren't more Mortal Kombat.

• 17:44Mark Gagnon?

  No, I had cousins.

• 17:47Speaker 05

  Oh, so you were playing, yeah, Street Fighter was like the OG game. Mortal Kombat introduced blood.

• 17:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 17:52Speaker 05

  And blood was like so badass. That was like the rebellious thing.

• 17:56Speaker 04

  But you had to have the code.

• 17:57Speaker 05

  Yeah. And like, low key, you know who did that too? Um, the NHL video game. You could make their head bleed.

• 18:06Speaker 04

  Oh, really? If you drop mitts, you could fight?

• 18:07Speaker 05

  Yeah, you fought and then you could make some, there was that scene in Swingers, like, make him bleed, make his head bleed. What's wrong with us? Even as kids, we're like, I want to play the game where you get to murder the person in the goriest way possible.

• 18:19Speaker 07

  Do you remember NFL Blitz?

• 18:20Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah.

• 18:21Speaker 07

  You could break legs and shit. It was like.

• 18:23Speaker 04

  Oh, didn't they do the x-ray thing where like?

• 18:24Speaker 07

  Yeah, if you got a big enough pit, it would slow down, show an x-ray and the leg would fucking snap.

• 18:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, what's wrong with us?

• 18:31Speaker 04

  Remember that TV show Scarred?

• 18:33Speaker 05

  Oh, I couldn't watch that.

• 18:35Speaker 04

  Nah, I couldn't watch that. The whole show was just people breaking their bones.

• 18:38Speaker 07

  Nah, it was bad. Show.

• 18:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, nah. It was just like, what's up, guys? Welcome back to Scarred. And then a guy would like hit a 10 step, like, you know, rail grind and then snap his leg, bone sticks out.

• 18:46Speaker 05

  You know what it was? It was the closest thing to a TikTok scroll.

• 18:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:52Mark Gagnon?

  Oh.

• 18:53Speaker 05

  Like, that was a TikTok scroll for that time.

• 18:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:57Speaker 05

  Where it was like 30 second video, something horrible happens, next one. 30 second video, something horrible happens. That's what America's Funniest Home Videos is too, when you think about it.

• 19:06Speaker 04

  That's TikTok, 100%.

• 19:07Speaker 07

  Is that what the soup was for him?

• 19:09Mark Gagnon?

  Whatever it is.

• 19:10Speaker 05

  The soup, yeah.

• 19:11Speaker 07

  Sorta.

• 19:12Speaker 05

  It was like reality show or it was, I think, talk show back in the day.

• 19:15Speaker 07

  Yeah, and he would just sort of go over the news like quickly.

• 19:18Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 19:19Speaker 07

  That's interesting.

• 19:19Speaker 05

  There was just more, like, he would react to it a little bit more, but yeah. It is funny, we're watching the same content we did back in the day.

• 19:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, it never changes.

• 19:28Speaker 05

  Never.

• 19:29Speaker 04

  There's a gay character in Mortal Kombat, I think. Can you pull a Valdo? I think that was his name. Did you ever play Mortal Kombat? Yeah, but I don't remember there's Valdo. Bro, there was one. He was like a BDSM guy. I've been homophobic for quite a while.

• 19:42Speaker 04

  Bro, I swear to God.

• 19:43Speaker 05

  Make him bleed that way.

• 19:44Speaker 04

  Bro, me and my dad used to play this and I would pick him. My dad would be like, "Why'd you pick him?" That's crazy.

• 19:49Speaker 05

  I don't even remember this guy. I never saw that.

• 19:52Speaker 04

  I remember being embarrassed because I picked him and my dad was like, "Why?" You would pick him. I don't know. I thought, "His hands are cool. He's got good attack."

• 19:59Speaker 05

  Valdo. No. It was Scorpion, Rappier.

• 20:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:03Speaker 05

  There was, uh, what was the other guy? Fuck, who was the other guy?

• 20:06Speaker 04

  Siegfried was one of them.

• 20:08Speaker 05

  No.

• 20:08Speaker 04

  What? What? With the giant sword.

• 20:22Speaker 04

  Bro, some dude crushed me in the meeting room.

• 20:24Speaker 05

  I still kinda wanna know what that one is. The comments, tell it.

• 20:30Speaker 04

  No, some guy was like, "Bro, on the pod, y'all gotta talk about Putin." I was like, "What? Putin?"

• 20:33Speaker 05

  Yeah. Son, I got Charlemagne with the Justin Theroux one. Because that's a real guy.

• 20:39Speaker 04

  That's a great one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wait, who's this? Oh, these are all the guys.

• 20:44Speaker 05

  I don't even think you played Mortal Kombat.

• 20:46Speaker 04

  But...

• 20:47Speaker 05

  You just asked, "Who's this?"

• 20:48Speaker 04

  Oh, no, no, no. Soul Calibur. I was playing Soul Calibur, too.

• 20:51Speaker 05

  No, Mark, stop it.

• 20:53Speaker 04

  I've been on fighting games more than y'all, is what I'm saying.

• 20:55Speaker 05

  No, you haven't.

• 20:56Speaker 04

  Yes, I have, dude.

• 20:56Speaker 05

  You did like pillow fights since you were a nice guy.

• 21:00Speaker 05

  She a fucking homeschooled ass. I don't wanna listen to her talking about video games. Trying to talk about lesbians getting after The Last of Us and not taking off the belt before you finger a girl. What kinda insane thing is that?

• 21:11Speaker 04

  Really? That's what you're...

• 21:12Speaker 05

  Son, how you... Son, son, son, son, son, son. A parallel finger.

• 21:18Speaker 04

  Go do it, do it.

• 21:18Speaker 05

  Okay, li- literally, this is exactly... She goes from on top of him, I'm gonna do it lefty. She could just take off the belt, right?

• 21:25Speaker 04

  Hey, this is serious.

• 21:28Speaker 05

  What? Guys, this is workplace harassment. Listen, I'm trying to teach, I'm trying to teach Ally how to finger a bad bitch, okay? You dress just like Dina. You got the same outfit on. You dress for the apocalypse, though.

• 21:40Speaker 04

  We need a pillow fight immediately, bro. Son, man, you took your belt off really quickly and you ain't even budge, too. You was gonna let him go.

• 21:47Speaker 05

  You saw me do that one-handed, right?

• 21:48Speaker 04

  I know, that was... Come on, smooth.

• 21:52Speaker 04

  If I move, it's gay. That means I'm scared, you know what I mean?

• 21:54Speaker 05

  Let me pull your underwear to the side.

• 21:58Speaker 05

  Let your fucking meat fall out.

• 22:02Speaker 05

  Do you think, can you see that? Is grab the boxers from here and scoop up and just let the meat fall out?

• 22:08Speaker 04

  Oh, that'd be sick. That's kinda smart.

• 22:09Speaker 05

  Hell, what do you think? Why do we switch the Bluetooth lights?

• 22:14Speaker 04

  No, this is a rainbow light.

• 22:17Speaker 08

  Got it, got it, got it, got it, got it. Also, guys, tour date, June 19th and through 21st, I'm gonna be in Salt Lake City at Wise Guys. All those dates and plenty more at akashsing.com. Now, let's get back to the show.

• 22:28Speaker 04

  Hold on a second. Don't skip forward, guys, because it's the world's fastest ad read. My name's Mark. I'm coming to America. We got Raleigh, North Carolina, Poughkeepsie, Portland, Fort Worth, Austin, Stanford, Philly, Levittown, Chandler, and San Diego. More dates to come. You can get it at my website, markgagnonlive.com.

• 22:43Speaker 05

  Anyway, Last of Us, best show on fucking TV. It's incredible. Yo, HBO on a run right now. They just announced Squid Game's coming back, uh, June 27th.

• 22:50Speaker 04

  HBO?

• 22:51Mark Gagnon?

  HBO, that's Netflix.

• 22:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, whatever. It's all the same.

• 22:56Speaker 04

  Yo, HBO's on a run.

• 22:59Speaker 05

  They already put out this movie. Sinners the other day.

• 23:03Speaker 04

  Joe says the TV is HBO.

• 23:06Speaker 05

  Honestly, if it's scripted, it's HBO. If it's scripted, it's HBO.

• 23:10Mark Gagnon?

  It's like I was watching the Knicks game on HBO last night.

• 23:13Speaker 05

  What? It's crazy.

• 23:14Mark Gagnon?

  Did you see the story on connection?

• 23:17Speaker 04

  It was insane.

• 23:18Speaker 05

  That was an epic fail right there, man.

• 23:23Speaker 05

  God damn, did I get that one wrong. And I really wanted to give credit to HBO. I was like, they're back. Y'all are doing nothing besides lesbian finger scenes for no reason in the middle of a Last of Us episode.

• 23:33Speaker 04

  If it was a dude and she was giving a handy.

• 23:35Speaker 05

  Son, son, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. She just announced she's pregnant, right? She goes, "I'm pregnant." They start fucking and she's immediately trying to abort that fucking thing. Nobody, look at that. Look at, she got the rhinestone belt on.

• 23:48Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 23:50Speaker 05

  Don't she look too young? They're too young looking.

• 23:52Mark Gagnon?

  Come on. Why you gotta just say stuff?

• 23:54Speaker 05

  Oh, wait, my bad. She did unbuckle it. My bad.

• 23:56Mark Gagnon?

  Look at you. Look at you.

• 23:58Speaker 05

  Hey, my bad. Oh, she got her arch and everything. You barely got two digits in there. Get out of here, bro. Get the fuck out of here.

• 24:05Mark Gagnon?

  That's all you need to do.

• 24:06Speaker 05

  Come on, it's the apocalypse. You fighting through bush. There's no way.

• 24:10Speaker 04

  Yeah, she got a UTI for sure.

• 24:11Speaker 05

  100.

• 24:12Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah, that's crazy.

• 24:15Mark Gagnon?

  You know, I was just mourning of Burning Man right there. Fucking dirty shit.

• 24:20Speaker 05

  Look at this. Look at this. And then they go for it. Wait a minute, immediately, she's like, "Finger me."

• 24:27Speaker 05

  I don't think she unbuckles that belt. I don't see any unbuckling.

• 24:31Mark Gagnon?

  Nah.

• 24:31Speaker 05

  No, the belt's not unbuckled.

• 24:33Mark Gagnon?

  You just hate it because she did it so smooth. You ain't catching.

• 24:35Speaker 05

  The belt has not been off.

• 24:36Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, she hit it herself.

• 24:38Speaker 05

  Look at that.

• 24:38Mark Gagnon?

  She hit it herself.

• 24:39Speaker 05

  What fucking show were you watching?

• 24:41Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, bro.

• 24:42Speaker 05

  I'm not gonna leave, bro.

• 24:43Mark Gagnon?

  He was on TikTok.

• 24:44Speaker 05

  I'm off. Hey, I'm off. Hey, I'm washed. I just wanted to let you know I'm washed. I thought I knew something and I don't.

• 24:51Mark Gagnon?

  Your whole fucking anger was because you ain't unbuckling the belt. In the video game, she undoes the belt. I hit double X for belt. I was spamming X to get the belt off.

• 25:02Speaker 05

  I got nothing. I got nothing. I'm wrong.

• 25:05Mark Gagnon?

  Not a cuddle at the end was crazy, you know, like, you ain't even getting your shit off.

• 25:09Speaker 04

  Oh, this is the video game version? Oh, hell yeah.

• 25:13Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, look at the most watched. Go to most watched.

• 25:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, that big one.

• 25:18Speaker 05

  Yup. Look at this.

• 25:21Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, they made the Spanish chick ugly in the game.

• 25:24Speaker 04

  She had gay energy the whole time, though. It's like not shocking that she's gay.

• 25:27Speaker 05

  Which one, Ellie or Dina?

• 25:29Speaker 04

  I don't know about Dina. I haven't seen the show.

• 25:31Speaker 05

  Man, shut up.

• 25:35Speaker 05

  Tell us about Burkina Faso or some shit, man.

• 25:39Speaker 04

  They did a video game about that. That shit is crazy.

• 25:41Speaker 05

  I'm gonna tell Dave Portnoy to send you to Auschwitz, too, bro. Yo, Dave Portnoy's sending people to Auschwitz.

• 25:47Speaker 04

  Go now, go now, okay.

• 25:47Speaker 05

  He's sending people to Auschwitz, bro.

• 25:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. True. Of all the times to go, now is probably the better time.

• 25:52Speaker 05

  Do you get to, can you extend? Like, could you stay and then like just chill in Warsaw for a minute?

• 25:57Speaker 04

  Get a B and B.

• 25:58Speaker 05

  And smoke poles?

• 26:00Speaker 04

  That'd be sick.

• 26:01Speaker 05

  I mean, because apparently Warsaw is like a good, fun time.

• 26:04Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. I saw a girl on some TikTok. She's from Poland.

• 26:07Speaker 05

  I've seen the same one. I've seen the same one. I've seen the exact same one. We're on the same algorithm.

• 26:11Speaker 04

  The hottest one you've ever seen.

• 26:12Speaker 05

  I'm a six in Poland. And she's like, I'm a ten in the United States, I'm a six in Poland. I was like, you're what in Poland?

• 26:18Mark Gagnon?

  Wait, because you gotta pull this up.

• 26:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:20Mark Gagnon?

  Is she more six or more a ten? Which one?

• 26:22Speaker 05

  No, she's a legit ten that calls herself a six in Poland. You know all about this. Stop acting like you.

• 26:30Speaker 05

  Look at Al.

• 26:31Mark Gagnon?

  Can I front alone?

• 26:32Speaker 05

  Look at Al, try to hack.

• 26:34Mark Gagnon?

  What is Poland?

• 26:35Speaker 05

  A little bit, oh my god, damn.

• 26:37Mark Gagnon?

  There's white women in Poland?

• 26:39Speaker 05

  Shit, bro.

• 26:42Mark Gagnon?

  You're dumber than a polo.

• 26:44Speaker 05

  I was a six in America, a ten in Poland.

• 26:51Speaker 05

  That was mean.

• 26:52Mark Gagnon?

  I know, I know.

• 26:54Speaker 05

  This guy's a mean guy. He just called you dumb. You just called Al dumb.

• 26:57Speaker 04

  Yeah, because he's pretending he doesn't. What?

• 26:59Speaker 05

  We were just talking about looks, like in him being a handsome black man in Poland, which they don't have. They're very proud of Noah.

• 27:05Mark Gagnon?

  Whoa.

• 27:06Speaker 04

  Whoa.

• 27:07Mark Gagnon?

  Don't do this.

• 27:08Speaker 04

  No, son.

• 27:09Mark Gagnon?

  I'm thinking about you doing this.

• 27:11Speaker 04

  He's a little bitter. He went to Atlanta.

• 27:14Speaker 05

  I called you handsome and he went, what?

• 27:16Speaker 04

  No, I'm reacting because we're not doing this right now.

• 27:19Speaker 05

  What?

• 27:20Speaker 04

  I was making fun of him for being dumb.

• 27:21Speaker 05

  You made fun of Vol for having no legs.

• 27:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, I know.

• 27:24Speaker 05

  You made fun of Al for not being good looking.

• 27:25Speaker 04

  I'm the nicest guy and everyone's trying to make me a bully.

• 27:27Speaker 05

  No, you're a piece of shit.

• 27:29Mark Gagnon?

  Whenever you have to say it, the nicest guy.

• 27:30Speaker 05

  What happened this weekend, bro? What happened, bro?

• 27:32Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, he's bitter. Something happened.

• 27:33Speaker 05

  Something happened. Where was the show?

• 27:35Speaker 04

  Charleston and Atlanta.

• 27:37Speaker 05

  Charleston, South Carolina?

• 27:38Speaker 04

  Charleston, South Carolina on Thursday.

• 27:39Speaker 05

  And then Atlanta.

• 27:40Mark Gagnon?

  Isn't that where Vol is from?

• 27:42Speaker 04

  Nope.

• 27:42Speaker 05

  No.

• 27:43Speaker 04

  Where is he from? Pakistan.

• 27:44Speaker 05

  Pakistan.

• 27:46Speaker 04

  He's from Virginia.

• 27:48Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, Virginia, yeah. Okay, all right, go.

• 27:50Speaker 04

  It was great. Shows were wonderful. No issues at all.

• 27:52Mark Gagnon?

  What black guy hurt you?

• 27:54Speaker 05

  Did a black guy hurt you?

• 27:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:56Speaker 05

  Um, no.

• 27:57Mark Gagnon?

  You got heckled or something?

• 27:58Speaker 04

  No, they were wonderful. It was technically in Alpharetta, which is not Atlanta, apparently.

• 28:02Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 28:02Speaker 04

  I told many people Atlanta and it was just, I lied.

• 28:04Speaker 05

  Yeah, I mean, it's close and it's all, that's Atlanta is like, how big is Atlanta?

• 28:09Speaker 04

  Extremely.

• 28:09Mark Gagnon?

  You can go a little outside of Atlanta and it's a way different town.

• 28:13Speaker 05

  No, of course. I'm just saying like, it's, you would say that you're in greater Atlanta.

• 28:18Speaker 04

  No, of course.

• 28:19Speaker 05

  It's freezing. What is the goal? Have we spent too little on air conditioning this month? Is that the goal? Do we have a quota that we have to set?

• 28:28Speaker 04

  Yeah, because if we don't spend it, we don't get it back.

• 28:30Speaker 05

  Miles has a full hoodie on. Imagine what we're feeling like. We're getting blasted by the AC.

• 28:35Speaker 04

  He does it sometimes. We went to a nice dinner. Had steaks the other night. He had just had a hoodie on the whole time.

• 28:38Speaker 07

  My head hurts and for some reason, wearing a hood makes it feel better. I don't know why.

• 28:42Speaker 04

  I diagnosed it.

• 28:43Speaker 05

  Because you got that vaccine for it.

• 28:46Speaker 05

  He's so bad. Shift A.

• 28:50Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, man. Oh, is this the, this the?

• 28:53Speaker 05

  Yeah, let's look at what a six in Poland looks like. Mm-hmm.

• 28:55Speaker 08

  In Poland, solid six, but in America, solid ten.

• 29:01Speaker 07

  Okay, do you think other people would agree?

• 29:04Speaker 08

  I hope.

• 29:06Speaker 05

  I mean, pause. That, if that's a six in Poland. Yeah. They're doing everything right with their immigration policies. You don't want to water that down. Yeah. Like, you got a really good thing going, and you don't want to water that down. Mm-hmm. Uh, uh, does that? How, what is that, what I just said?

• 29:23Speaker 05

  I have no idea. It's on, it's on the line. Sounds a little xenophobic. Yeah. Can you be xenophobic for the sake of the attractiveness of your people? Because you can't guarantee every immigrant coming in is going to be a 10 out of 10. Unless you vet them. If you vet them based on looks. Yeah. Then you go, okay, this is great. And so there's an app where everyone can just vet, and if you're above a 7.2, then you get to come in.

• 29:45Mark Gagnon?

  But if you mix that with a little melanin?

• 29:47Speaker 05

  If it's the right melanin. If it's the right melanin. You got a bunch of Seals coming in. No disrespect, obviously. Seal, incredibly talented singer. You know what I mean?

• 29:58Mark Gagnon?

  Speaking of Seal, he performed that fucking, uh, where were we at? Live? I'm like, damn.

• 30:03Speaker 05

  Kiss from the Rose? That shit bangs out.

• 30:05Mark Gagnon?

  It is, it is, but god damn, how can you?

• 30:08Speaker 05

  Shut it down now, right?

• 30:09Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 30:09Speaker 05

  You really need one. Mm-hmm. You need one hit. Mm-hmm. Um, he looked like he got Kiss by the Thorns.

• 30:17Speaker 05

  I can't be the first person that said that joke. I cannot be the first. He kissed the stem of that rose a few times before he made it up to the pedals.

• 30:27Mark Gagnon?

  So he was, he was there, it was his, uh, daughter's 21st birthday, and they show his daughter, and it's like, I don't think that's his daughter.

• 30:35Speaker 05

  Beautiful.

• 30:35Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, but I mean, she's, her complexion. I'm like, Seal is way too dark to come out with that.

• 30:41Speaker 05

  I think that you're making a really gross allegation right now.

• 30:46Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 30:49Speaker 05

  Thinking about it.

• 30:54Mark Gagnon?

  I'm standing on that. Nah, Seal, you need 18 years back of that money.

• 31:02Mark Gagnon?

  I got you, kid. That shit is not him.

• 31:05Speaker 05

  That's what Heidi Klum. Yo, shout out Seal. Obviously Seal were joking.

• 31:09Mark Gagnon?

  We're joking, of course.

• 31:10Speaker 05

  He had an acid attack or something, right? He had lupus. What did he have? It lupus. Oh, come on. It's a medical issue. Oh, come on.

• 31:18Mark Gagnon?

  Come on.

• 31:18Speaker 05

  Come on. Come on. An acid attack? Joey put in the notes.

• 31:23Mark Gagnon?

  Who face wrote that?

• 31:25Speaker 05

  Joey put in the notes. He put in the notes.

• 31:28Mark Gagnon?

  Jesus.

• 31:29Speaker 05

  It was not my fault. It was Joey's fault.

• 31:30Mark Gagnon?

  But look at that's his daughter.

• 31:31Speaker 05

  Joey put in the notes. What?

• 31:33Mark Gagnon?

  That's his daughter.

• 31:34Speaker 05

  Alright, we gotta look into it.

• 31:35Mark Gagnon?

  Alright, there we go. That shit don't make sense.

• 31:39Speaker 05

  No, we gotta look into it.

• 31:41Mark Gagnon?

  Her face ain't even scarred.

• 31:42Speaker 05

  Seal has discoid lupus, a form of lupus that mainly affects the skin, causing coin-shaped lesions and scarring. Don't even do it, Mark. Don't even do it. While not severe as systemic lupus, which can affect organs, discoid lupus can still have a significant impact on a person's life. Seal's openly discusses, I swear. You need to apologize to him. I'm sorry. I thought the story was he was a homeless guy and he was burned with acid.

• 32:12Speaker 05

  Was he homeless? Did I make that part up too? I think he was a sterling artist.

• 32:15Mark Gagnon?

  No, black people are poor.

• 32:19Mark Gagnon?

  I'm drunk, dude.

• 32:21Speaker 05

  No, he was homeless. He was homeless.

• 32:24Mark Gagnon?

  He thinking this is Medea or something.

• 32:25Speaker 05

  Was he homeless? Was he fucking homeless? Yes. Okay, singer Seal, born Seal Christopher Smith. Stan Bullock adopted.

• 32:32Mark Gagnon?

  Yo, if you was wrong on this one too, you would have to leave.

• 32:37Speaker 05

  Okay. He experienced homelessness during his youth. At 15, he ran away and spent time couch surfing with friends or staying in homeless hostels. Okay? Yes. Where he was later. Attacked with acid. It is AI over you attacked and he chose to live on the streets, letting his acid heal on his own.

• 32:57Speaker 04

  Look at the bottom though, it says you can watch this video and learn more about a Navy SEAL who joined the French Foreign Legion. What does that have to do with SEAL?

• 33:04Speaker 07

  Also, Al might be right.

• 33:05Speaker 05

  Okay, so.

• 33:06Speaker 07

  I might be right. Al SEAL adopted one of Heidi Klum's daughters.

• 33:11Mark Gagnon?

  Come on!

• 33:11Speaker 07

  Depending on the one you were seeing on screen.

• 33:14Mark Gagnon?

  When racism works out. Come on, man!

• 33:22Speaker 05

  He hit that shit like he was a conductor of an orchestra.

• 33:27Speaker 04

  Ronaldo.

• 33:28Mark Gagnon?

  What a great guy.

• 33:30Speaker 05

  No, I think I actually feel guilty about what I've said.

• 33:33Mark Gagnon?

  You should.

• 33:34Speaker 05

  I feel like he's a nice guy, he's a good father.

• 33:36Speaker 04

  Stay in life, you like flight his country or some shit?

• 33:39Speaker 05

  Now, now, now.

• 33:41Speaker 04

  I think.

• 33:42Speaker 05

  Now.

• 33:42Speaker 04

  Let's find out.

• 33:43Speaker 05

  You're doing.

• 33:43Speaker 04

  Now just double check.

• 33:44Speaker 05

  You're doing Squid Games.

• 33:45Speaker 04

  Ask Chad TBT.

• 33:46Speaker 05

  You're doing Squid Games. Did he flee his country? If you're mixing up with Francis Nganu, it's gonna be very.

• 33:53Speaker 07

  He was born in London.

• 33:55Speaker 04

  But where does he live now? In America, fled his country.

• 33:59Speaker 05

  Mark, take the L, Mark!

• 34:00Speaker 04

  No, he fled England.

• 34:02Speaker 05

  Mark, take the L!

• 34:03Speaker 04

  He was in England, he left.

• 34:04Speaker 05

  Mark, if you don't take the L, we'll never learn.

• 34:08Mark Gagnon?

  Well, banger of a performance, man. He killed.

• 34:13Speaker 04

  Shout out to his family.

• 34:14Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, shout out to his family, beautiful daughter, beautiful daughter.

• 34:17Speaker 05

  Yeah, um, Formula One, greatest live sporting event in existence.

• 34:24Speaker 04

  WWE two weeks ago.

• 34:26Speaker 05

  Prisoner of the month. They call me a prisoner of the month. Formula One is the greatest live sporting event in existence.

• 34:34Mark Gagnon?

  No, it's not.

• 34:35Speaker 05

  Name a better one.

• 34:37Mark Gagnon?

  Everything.

• 34:41Speaker 05

  Formula One, wait two minutes.

• 34:46Mark Gagnon?

  You can't watch the sport. You can't watch the sport.

• 34:48Speaker 05

  I could not. No, listen, we, look at this. If you want to see peak athleticism, look at this. Look at that tire change. This is in slow mo, by the way.

• 34:59Speaker 05

  I look at, oh yeah. What am I doing? What am I doing? You are such a dad. Like, how does he? Okay, now go to the next one. This, this right here is, I'll never live this down. I don't know what the fuck.

• 35:14Mark Gagnon?

  Like, it looked painful.

• 35:16Speaker 05

  There's a labor. I've watched that video a hundred times. The guy that I'm talking to has a very thick German accent. When a white guy with a thick German accent extends a hand, I'm assuming fucking handshake or he's, you know? So it's one of those two. I'm not assuming he's going for the dap at all. If you notice, at the last second, he brings his hand up. Obviously, he felt, he felt my aura. He was trying to match my aura. He's like, there's no way a guy this cool and this athletic and good at doing things he's never done before could possibly go for a tap up. Watch it one more time. I want you to focus on his hand.

• 35:51Mark Gagnon?

  Oh! There is something, there is something happening.

• 35:54Speaker 05

  You would have missed it. By a mile, by a mile, by a mile. By a mile. But you're like right there. Son, Al, I'm, I've got the glasses on. I'm feeling very excited. There's a lot of fumes. This is like jet fuel we're basically working with there.

• 36:08Speaker 05

  Now, this is the other angle, which I think shows how quick we put the tire back on and how stupid I look celebrating. Yes, what? I don't know what I did. I wish I could justify what I did. I think I was looking for people to like, high five and everybody was like, this is pretty normal. So I was just like, okay, I'll just keep on.

• 36:27Mark Gagnon?

  Doing karate. You never look more Italian. This is the most Italian thing.

• 36:30Speaker 05

  You're celebrating like you won. I beat the other guy. I beat the other guy. They feel like last. The other cars are faster. So basically stake this car, next year Audi takes over and Audi's gonna build its own engine and they hope in four years, they'll be able to be at the top. But right now they buy a Ferrari engine.

• 36:48Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 36:49Speaker 05

  And who knows what Ferrari gives them? They probably give them some fucking Fugazi shit. And there's no way to check on it. But it is probably a Fugazi from Ferrari. So, of course, if you're getting an engine that they purposely, you know how we give the shitty fighter planes to like the Middle Eastern countries? That's what Ferrari is probably doing to us.

• 37:05Mark Gagnon?

  So all the teams, like the builds of their cars are secret? Yeah.

• 37:09Speaker 05

  The secret, but then there's like certain standards that you have to uphold and you can call the other ones out for it. So there's, dude, okay.

• 37:16Mark Gagnon?

  Cause like, why don't you just copy the best cars?

• 37:19Speaker 05

  That's what they try to do, but like the tiniest little wind resistance thing can change everything.

• 37:22Mark Gagnon?

  Got it.

• 37:23Speaker 05

  So there's a game of like milliseconds. The reason why I said it was the best event that I've ever seen. Obviously we had like this unparalleled access. It's like ridiculous what we got to see. Like it's a different experience. I get it. But it brings out this like juvenile part in you that when you hear the sound of the cars.

• 37:38Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, yeah.

• 37:40Speaker 05

  Oh, okay. I don't know what, I never thought I had that in me to be like vroom. I was saying it. There was video of me like as it go by, you'd see my mouth go vroom.

• 37:52Speaker 05

  So it brings out this like childish nature in you and you're literally looking at like a rocket ship on the ground. That's what it is. Like.

• 37:58Mark Gagnon?

  Feeling that power pass, it's, it is something.

• 38:02Speaker 05

  Were you able to go to any like good turns where they would do the passing?

• 38:05Mark Gagnon?

  Not really. I was just like the paddock area.

• 38:07Speaker 05

  So that's the one thing I would, I would think that they could, they could work out better with the sport. Because when you watch them drive by you, it is fucking miraculous, especially when it's raining. They're shooting up all this rain and there's zero visibility. I was asking the driver. I was like, can you see anything? And he was like, no, not really. And I'm like, how are you driving? He goes, we kind of have the tracks memorized. So you're kind of like in like a flow state. So you're reacting, you can see like the, uh, the lights in the car in front of you. Go red for braking. So you know, it's kind of time to break. But he's like, visibility is almost zero when it's raining. And them setting each other up to do these passes. And you know, like, there's a guy who just had a kid three days ago, Max Verstappen, right? So there's a little part of you going like, oh, he's going to be a little safe today.

• 38:52Speaker 05

  And you're like, no, he's not. He's like cutting people off. He's like, it's if you want to pass me, we're both going to crash. Or you're not going to pass me.

• 38:59Mark Gagnon?

  Wow.

• 39:00Speaker 05

  You had a kid three days ago.

• 39:01Mark Gagnon?

  Do they do any like pageantry shit where like they start the engines all at the same time or like a flyover?

• 39:05Speaker 05

  The whole thing is pageantry. They had a fucking car flyover. I got to do this walk where you like walk. And I'm just, in the walk is just every, all these famous people and that kind of stuff. And everybody is submitting to the excellence of the cars. Nobody's doing the walk like, I'm the thing to see here. Everybody's doing the walk like, oh, wow, that's that machine that costs $300 million to make. That's that thing. It just. It's just pure excess. It's like everything Americans should like and nothing Europeans should like. Like this is popular in Europe.

• 39:38Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, yeah.

• 39:38Speaker 05

  But it shouldn't be. Like Europeans should revolt. They should be like, all this money spent on this, we should put it towards healthcare and like feeding the homeless and giving them housing. Like we're talking about 300 to 500 million dollars a car.

• 39:51Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, it should be just Russian shit and American shit.

• 39:55Speaker 05

  We're the only ones that actually care about. And for whatever reason, it doesn't like we have NASCAR, but NASCAR feels more working class. They're driving like police cars. Like the cars don't look fancy.

• 40:05Mark Gagnon?

  You got fake headlights on them?

• 40:06Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's like, do they really?

• 40:08Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 40:08Speaker 05

  Cause they're not driving at night. So why do you need headlights?

• 40:11Mark Gagnon?

  You got painted on headlights.

• 40:12Speaker 07

  It's all one car body in NASCAR.

• 40:14Speaker 05

  That's so funny.

• 40:15Speaker 07

  They all have the same car bodies, just stickers. You make them look different.

• 40:17Mark Gagnon?

  Stock car.

• 40:18Speaker 07

  Stock car.

• 40:19Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 40:20Speaker 05

  I mean, it was just, I'm no bullshit. And I am a prisoner of the moment. I admit it. It was the coolest thing that I've ever fucking seen live as a sport. I still don't know if the drivers do anything.

• 40:33Speaker 05

  Like there's a little part of me that's like, if you put me in the best car, I could probably beat the worst car.

• 40:40Speaker 05

  You don't think that?

• 40:42Mark Gagnon?

  I think the drivers have like psycho. Yeah, because you have to be willing to go at those speeds.

• 40:48Speaker 05

  Look at this.

• 40:49Mark Gagnon?

  And you're not gonna do that. You get to 80 and be like, oh.

• 40:56Mark Gagnon?

  Your wife drives you, bro.

• 41:00Speaker 05

  You think you're gonna do this?

• 41:01Mark Gagnon?

  He got in an F3 car and then got claustrophobia. I couldn't breathe. But that's when we were having a lot of trouble getting pregnant.

• 41:10Speaker 05

  But I had to get out and you know what? It wasn't even an F3. It was like an F4. So before we went on the race, there was a, it's so funny because you know, this is, these are big corporations. Everybody's a little bit like careful with their words, you know? So before the, the main race start, there was like a woman's F1, right? It's called like F1 special or some shit. I don't know. But they're trying to like get women into driving. Which is crazy because it's not like they have to lift anything like the car does all the driving. So you think that they could do it. Right? It's like G forces. Like what is the justification?

• 41:41Mark Gagnon?

  I don't know. As far as I'm concerned, the G doesn't exist.

• 41:46Speaker 05

  So I asked him and I was like, um, I go, you know, I'm just trying to like make stupid fucking jokes. And I'm just like, so you know, the, I'm sure the, uh, the women, there's a lot more crashes in the women's circuit. And I'm like, I'm just whatever joking. And the guy goes, um, well, um, there would probably be some good Google searches about that if you'd like to see. And I go, what do you mean by that? And off camera, he's basically, yeah, they're fucking crashing all the time.

• 42:13Mark Gagnon?

  We can't put them in the formula cars because it costs too much to fix for them after they crash.

• 42:17Speaker 04

  That's so funny.

• 42:20Speaker 04

  Is it during the race or just parking?

• 42:26Speaker 05

  But it was sexy. You didn't like it, Al?

• 42:28Mark Gagnon?

  I mean, it was cool. It's not, it's not bad. It's just not the best live sporting event. Like going to a Knicks game during playoffs is ten times better.

• 42:37Speaker 05

  I, I, the energy that you feel obviously during a Knicks game is, is really cool. I will say that that Knicks game exists for like three hours and this is like three days.

• 42:45Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, okay.

• 42:46Speaker 05

  And like, so there, and then just all the different things that you are seeing and the amount of people that just kind of like submit themselves to the awe, the experience.

• 42:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, the spectacle.

• 42:55Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 42:55Speaker 05

  And again, it's like, nobody is too cool for a fast car.

• 42:59Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 42:59Speaker 05

  It, it just kind of levels the playing fields. Like fucking Timothy Chalamet is there gawking at a car. The same car that Kirk Douglas is gawking at. All these NFL players are there just like, you just can't believe it.

• 43:11Speaker 04

  I mean, it must be the most expensive sport.

• 43:12Speaker 05

  Has to be.

• 43:13Speaker 04

  Right? Like there's nothing even remotely.

• 43:15Speaker 05

  It's like SpaceX. It's like if SpaceX was for fun.

• 43:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 43:18Speaker 05

  Like that, every one of these is a rocket ship.

• 43:20Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 43:21Speaker 05

  And every single race, something's going to break and they're going to have to rebuild it.

• 43:24Speaker 04

  Yeah. I think there's also something about it, like you can't just try it. You know what I mean? Like basketball, you like, you watch a game and then go try basketball and virtually every sport has that. Whereas F1, like you'll just never.

• 43:34Speaker 05

  Barrier to entry is insanity.

• 43:36Mark Gagnon?

  Like, we were doing, uh, go-karting and we were like, it's, it's, that's as far as we're willing to go. I'm not going fast into that.

• 43:43Speaker 04

  Like even like in Abu Dhabi, we had the access to do F4.

• 43:47Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 43:47Speaker 04

  You know what I mean? Like, so even if you wanted to, you couldn't do F1.

• 43:50Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 43:51Speaker 04

  So I think that there's also like for famous people specifically, there's like an exclusionary aspect.

• 43:55Speaker 05

  A hundred percent.

• 43:55Speaker 04

  Where they're like, yeah, you're just going to watch the most expensive thing, money that I don't have to do a crazy sport that I'll never try.

• 44:01Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 44:02Speaker 04

  Yeah. It's like, I don't know. It's impossible.

• 44:04Speaker 05

  Yeah. It's just fucking, it was just really cool. I want to go to another one.

• 44:07Speaker 04

  Who was the coolest person you talked to?

• 44:09Speaker 05

  I don't know. Trying to think.

• 44:11Speaker 04

  Any interesting people you're like, oh shit, this person's here?

• 44:14Speaker 05

  To me, like, the most interesting were like the engineers and the people working on the cars.

• 44:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:18Speaker 05

  The little things that, you know, can make such massive differences, how piecemeal the cars are. Like, everything can be removed and a new thing put on within seconds. So your front wing gets fucked up, there's another front wing, boop, boop, bang. So you have a spaceship that can be completely rebuilt in a matter of seconds. Yeah, it's just the monocoque, that's really like the middle part. I mean, you could have the engine and gearbox break down, and within an hour, they have a new engine and gearbox put into a car, everything rewired, and you're racing.

• 44:49Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 44:49Speaker 05

  So if you fuck it up in the trials, or whatever it is, it's just like... Yeah, that's fascinating. That's dope. Unbelievable.

• 44:56Speaker 04

  And who are these guys? Are they like quants, kind of like socially awkward genius types?

• 45:00Speaker 05

  Some of them are maybe, and then some of them seem like they were just kind of a... Like, the guys who do like the union shit at the theaters we go to. You know, it's just like a dude who like...

• 45:12Speaker 04

  Roadie.

• 45:13Speaker 05

  Yeah, like roadies, like for musicians, like that same kind of vibe, like, I just love cars, like mechanics? Like, what would be the coolest job if you were a mechanic?

• 45:21Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 45:21Speaker 05

  You know, it's like I could fix cars in New York at a shop, or I could work on a fucking Formula One team and travel the world.

• 45:27Speaker 04

  Are any of them like former athletes?

• 45:29Speaker 05

  That's what I heard, and I looked at them, and it didn't seem that way. But I heard all of them were like, oh, Formula D1 guys, or I was like, not at all, they're all kind of small, all the drivers are really skinny.

• 45:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 45:38Speaker 05

  Like, really skinny, really lean, some of them are tiny, some of them maybe my height, but like, lean, every single one.

• 45:45Speaker 04

  Oh, that's interesting. Apparently with NASCAR it's that way, it's like all like D2 football players, the guy that got drafted and then came out, and now he's just like a pit guy.

• 45:52Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 45:52Speaker 04

  Moving, you know, gasoline around.

• 45:54Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 45:54Speaker 04

  Which like, it's kind of sick if you're a former pro athlete to go fuck around some cars.

• 45:58Speaker 05

  And same kind of, I wonder if lifestyle is more similar, it's like you're traveling every single weekend, super high stakes, you're part of this crew.

• 46:05Speaker 04

  Yeah. How much do they get paid, you think?

• 46:07Speaker 05

  I don't know, I'm trying to, I like, I was trying to crunch numbers on everything.

• 46:10Speaker 04

  Like, who gets paid the most?

• 46:12Speaker 05

  Driver. No, I think it's the principal, like, the person who is like the head of the team, who has to like hire all the different positions. I actually don't know if the drivers are that respected. Yeah, that's what I'm curious about. Are they like a jockey? That might be like a harsh thing to say, but like, I think that the leaders of the teams and like the top engineers are the more coveted people than the drivers.

• 46:36Mark Gagnon?

  Interesting.

• 46:37Speaker 05

  Cause like you could take the worst driver and put them in the best car and they would be competitive. That's what I want. Like horse racing, you know the horse's name. You know what I mean? Like, you don't know the jockey. You know Seabiscuit. I didn't know one of the guys that was driving a car for our team. I didn't know. I met him and I didn't know if he was like a guy that does the pit stop or if he was driving a car. And I didn't want to be disrespectful, but I didn't know. Yeah. Do you know him now? Nope. He didn't finish the race. I was like, you gotta finish for me to take a pit.

• 47:13Speaker 05

  What happened? The tire you changed flew off? There's crazy amount of access that you get. Like, I'm surprised. Like before, they just let everybody walk. Not everybody, but they let people walk on the grid where all the cars are set up. And it's like, you could sabotage another car. Right? I don't know how you would do it, but you could walk up, look at it, unscrew some shit. Throw some acid on someone's face? Who knows what you could do? Acid attack. I saw Seal there, actually. That's why I brought him up. Yeah, handsome, great guy, sweet. Sweet guy. I can't believe I said that joke about the thorns. That was so rude. I think Al sets a really disgusting tone. Yeah, he definitely didn't.

• 47:57Speaker 05

  He's like a bully. I was like a bully. He brings out a very mean energy. Yeah, you really do.

• 48:00Mark Gagnon?

  I was right to call out that his daughter looks very different from him.

• 48:04Speaker 05

  Oh, cause he's white?

• 48:06Mark Gagnon?

  She's...

• 48:11Speaker 05

  Anyway, it was great. Shout out to Carbone. Carbone hooked us up. Reunited with my boy, my twin, Ryan Clark, and Jelly. Also, Jelly is fucking incredible. I actually got to see him do like a full show. Yeah. He's incredible. Yeah.

• 48:26Speaker 05

  He's incredible and and I mean that in that like he understands you could tell he's done decades of shitty shows.

• 48:34Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 48:35Speaker 05

  This is this is the difference maker. The people who've done decades of shitty shows know how to really like galvanize and rile up a crowd and play a crowd like an instrument. And the people who have just like are a pop star and then they have their hit without their hit, they don't really have anything.

• 48:50Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, they're learning how to live perform after they're famous.

• 48:53Speaker 05

  Exactly. You could tell he's done the toughest hardest fucking shows because when because I was curious. I was like, what's he gonna do? Like, we're in this like at this this Carbone Beach dinner. Like, there's all these like fancy people there. They might not even know country music that much. Maybe they don't know some of his hits. I'm like, how is he gonna handle this? And within 30 seconds of bringing it up, he's like, kind of doing call and response, almost crowd work-esque stuff, really getting people excited. Banger of a song that maybe people know but didn't, but it had so much excitement that they're getting riled up.

• 49:28Mark Gagnon?

  You could even tell that he was a bit concerned because like he mentioned that a couple of times. He's like, yo, I'mma I'mma turn this shit into a honky tonk. I didn't realize all you guys like fucking country music the way.

• 49:38Speaker 05

  Here, play.

• 49:47Speaker 04

  Oh, hell yeah.

• 49:55Speaker 05

  Look how much. Pause right there. Pause right there. Go back a little second. Why were you hesitant to like put your whole hand on him? It seemed like you were doing that.

• 50:07Speaker 05

  What is wrong with? Is that not clear to you? It just it felt like you wanted to. It felt like you wanted to embrace him, but you were like a little insecure.

• 50:18Mark Gagnon?

  Years of trauma. He was holding on to the camera. I'm a little strong if I grab, you know, he's delicate.

• 50:24Speaker 05

  No, you wanted to cross that arm over his chest and just hold him. But you look at your hand. Look how uncomfortable that hand is.

• 50:33Mark Gagnon?

  It looks like not your hand.

• 50:35Speaker 05

  Tell us what's going through that moment because you you know, you obviously want to be part of this singing and you want to. Were you not drunk enough to just be yourself?

• 50:42Mark Gagnon?

  I didn't know the words.

• 50:45Mark Gagnon?

  To be honest with you, I did not know the words. If you really look close to me, I'm doing one of those things where you're just like.

• 50:54Mark Gagnon?

  And how early in his set did he play this?

• 50:56Speaker 05

  Now, this is maybe like midway.

• 50:59Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 51:00Speaker 05

  But nah, he just did, I mean, he did rap songs, he did honky tonky, did old school classic, he covers, like it was, it was truly amazing. And the next day, he went to go perform in a stadium in Las Vegas with Post Malone.

• 51:12Mark Gagnon?

  And then the next day, came back to run a 5K in Miami.

• 51:15Speaker 05

  That was crazy.

• 51:16Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, really?

• 51:17Speaker 05

  I think in Tampa, right?

• 51:18Mark Gagnon?

  Uh, some player followed him. Yeah, that's crazy.

• 51:21Speaker 05

  Nah, he's moving, he's moving different, he's moving different.

• 51:23Mark Gagnon?

  Hey, shout out to Jelly, lost some weight, getting healthy out here. Yeah, let's go, Jelly. Looking great.

• 51:28Speaker 05

  Looking great. I said, yeah.

• 51:31Mark Gagnon?

  Jelly's the man. And how was Ryan?

• 51:33Speaker 05

  Ryan was great.

• 51:34Mark Gagnon?

  Ever since y'all passed it up, everything's good?

• 51:36Speaker 05

  Everything's great. We had, we had a great conversation. We had a great conversation. It was fire. Just great. All right.

• 51:43Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, Jamie?

• 51:44Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah. Got to meet the most talented human being on the planet.

• 51:47Mark Gagnon?

  Dressed like Street Fighter, man. That shit is fire.

• 51:50Mark Gagnon?

  He looked like he's breathing.

• 51:51Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 51:54Speaker 05

  Yeah, Jamie's the fucking man. Anyway, it was cool as hell. Definitely cool. I suggest if you guys have the opportunity, go check out a Formula One and root for Team Steak. And guys, if you're gonna bet on Formula One or the NBA playoffs, obviously the Knicks, you already know what time it is. We already knew that was gonna happen. We let Boston feel like they were gonna have a chance. But if you're gonna bet on Formula One or the NBA playoffs, Steak is the leader in global betting in US social casinos. Bet on top sports, political events, and use the promo code FLAGRANT for your welcome bonus. Now, let's get back to the show. Do y'all care about the Met Gala?

• 52:25Mark Gagnon?

  Sort of in a weird way. You see like a crazy outfit, you're like, oh, that's kind of interesting. I still barely understand what it is.

• 52:30Speaker 05

  Me neither.

• 52:31Mark Gagnon?

  I barely, I barely get what's going on. What happens inside? It's a dinner, right?

• 52:35Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 52:35Mark Gagnon?

  I feel like it's just like Carbone Beach. Sit down, dinner, then everybody gets up, somebody performs. But this is a fundraiser. Same shit. This is a fundraiser.

• 52:43Speaker 05

  I think it's one of those fundraisers.

• 52:45Speaker 04

  Right, but like, that's the thing that I don't get. So like, does it start as a gala?

• 52:48Speaker 05

  A lot of these high society events, they make fundraisers as an excuse for like, rich and fancy people to celebrate themselves. So I think it's more about celebrating yourself and then you realize, oh shit, if we keep celebrating ourselves, poor people are gonna fucking shoot us in the back of the head. Alright, so let's make it a fundraiser for a cause. But I think that's after the fact. I don't think that's.

• 53:10Mark Gagnon?

  And then the clothing brand picks a celebrity. They make the outfit for them and I think they donate on their behalf. Celebrity just gets to go and.

• 53:18Speaker 05

  Right. But it's more about like a qualification. Like if you're invited to this event, then you must be like one of the most famous people. Whatever it is. So I think it's like very exciting in that regard and then.

• 53:28Speaker 04

  I get why people go. I get why brands do it. Like that part all makes sense. I'm so curious about like the fascination. Like the amount that it grips people.

• 53:37Speaker 05

  People love fashion. They love famous people. And they love.

• 53:40Speaker 04

  Fashion famous people.

• 53:42Speaker 05

  And judgment.

• 53:42Speaker 04

  Exclusivity.

• 53:44Speaker 05

  But you also get to judge, like you get to be, you know, like one of those chef shows. You get to say if the food is good or not.

• 53:51Speaker 04

  Right.

• 53:52Speaker 05

  So I think it like puts us, all of us that are not invited, that are not the famous people, that are not, you know, part of like the inside circle. Not only do we get to judge them, we get to make fun of them because a lot of them are dressed like really foolishly.

• 54:03Speaker 04

  That's a good point.

• 54:03Speaker 05

  So in a lot of ways, like it's, and I'm guilty of this, like it's easy for us to just sit back, oh, look at these fucking stupid people, but it's like, that's kind of the event's purpose, in my opinion. They're submitting themselves for judgment and there are these designers that are trying to do like the most provocative, ridiculous things. And on some level, I, I like that. Like, I like.

• 54:24Speaker 04

  I love it.

• 54:25Speaker 05

  I like it when people try. Like, what's his face bringing the piano on his back is fucking retarded. Yes. But I liked it. There's an attempt made to do something.

• 54:34Speaker 04

  He's also not doing it, right? Like it's the designer being like, this is what you're gonna wear.

• 54:37Speaker 05

  I think you could say no.

• 54:38Mark Gagnon?

  You have an idea what.

• 54:40Speaker 04

  How does it work? Like, do the designers be like, this is what we're thinking?

• 54:45Mark Gagnon?

  They collaborated, yeah.

• 54:46Speaker 04

  Ah, I didn't know that.

• 54:47Mark Gagnon?

  And I like this. He got music on his back. Like that shit, just the messaging for that, I think it's dope.

• 54:55Mark Gagnon?

  I'm surprised how easy he's walking around.

• 54:58Speaker 05

  I mean, do you think it's an actual piano?

• 55:00Mark Gagnon?

  No, I know it's not, but. I know, of course, of course it's not, but he's moving very easily around. Like, that shit's still as wide as, he's not bumping nobody, he's not knocking motherfuckers over.

• 55:12Speaker 04

  I thought it was real.

• 55:12Mark Gagnon?

  No, I can't, there's no way. He definitely unshrapened and started playing after, like, he definitely did that.

• 55:21Mark Gagnon?

  Walk yourself out of it, though.

• 55:22Speaker 05

  I thought it was a real, bro.

• 55:24Mark Gagnon?

  I was watching this on HBO last night.

• 55:27Speaker 04

  You gotta take the L, dude.

• 55:29Mark Gagnon?

  He's walking around with a grand piano.

• 55:33Mark Gagnon?

  How can you hold such weight walking up those stairs?

• 55:36Speaker 04

  I hope there's a video that comes out of him playing that shit.

• 55:40Mark Gagnon?

  I'm gonna get.

• 55:41Speaker 04

  It might be playable, but it's not a full size.

• 55:43Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah. No, if it's playable, then I won.

• 55:45Speaker 05

  No, it's not.

• 55:45Mark Gagnon?

  Yes, it is, yes, it is.

• 55:46Speaker 05

  The point is that it's heavy. You're concerned because it's heavy.

• 55:51Mark Gagnon?

  And it's wide, it's uncomfortable, he's moving around.

• 55:53Speaker 05

  When you see people walking around with like a bunch of balloons, so you're like, how are they doing that?

• 55:57Speaker 04

  They're not flying away.

• 55:58Speaker 05

  They're staying on the ground, that must take so much strength.

• 56:04Speaker 04

  Dude, I wish I could be in your head for a day and just see the world, you know what I mean?

• 56:08Speaker 05

  You wouldn't see much.

• 56:10Mark Gagnon?

  You would love it. You would just be staring down at your.

• 56:14Speaker 04

  Like, how am I holding this thing up, dude? This is such a big penis. How did you know Seal's daughter wasn't real, but the piano, the piano was?

• 56:23Mark Gagnon?

  A broken clock is right two times a day.

• 56:26Speaker 05

  Oh, Mr. Milchick.

• 56:29Mark Gagnon?

  Who's this?

• 56:30Speaker 05

  The guy from Severance?

• 56:31Mark Gagnon?

  Oh.

• 56:33Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 56:34Speaker 05

  All right.

• 56:34Mark Gagnon?

  Got swag. We have a Lisa from White Lotus.

• 56:38Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah, she's, this girl is unstoppable.

• 56:41Speaker 04

  Have you heard the whole controversy with this outfit?

• 56:43Speaker 05

  Tell me right now.

• 56:44Speaker 04

  So Rosa Parks is in her vagina?

• 56:49Speaker 04

  I saw a bunch of people on Twitter getting pissed off.

• 56:52Mark Gagnon?

  Wait, what?

• 56:52Speaker 04

  So she, again, the theme is black dandyism, so on the outfit, there's different historical black civil rights leaders.

• 57:02Speaker 04

  And one of them-

• 57:03Speaker 05

  Are we serious right now?

• 57:04Speaker 04

  Google it, bro. I mean, I might have fucking got, but I'm 99% sure. Did you see this?

• 57:09Speaker 05

  No, but I do have a joke, so keep going.

• 57:13Speaker 04

  So apparently, there's many different civil rights leaders, and Rosa Parks is over her crotch, right there.

• 57:19Speaker 05

  Oh, but there's many of them.

• 57:22Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 57:23Speaker 05

  Not just Rosa Parks.

• 57:24Speaker 04

  But to my understanding, that was the one that people were mad about.

• 57:26Mark Gagnon?

  Why would they do her like that?

• 57:28Speaker 05

  Do who, Rosa?

• 57:29Mark Gagnon?

  No, this girl, the hot Asian chick.

• 57:32Speaker 05

  I don't know if they're doing her like that in a negative way.

• 57:34Mark Gagnon?

  You know she's gonna get-

• 57:36Speaker 05

  What's, what's wrong with the vagina? I think vagina is the most respectable part of a woman's body.

• 57:46Speaker 05

  No, think about it. Like, there could be no more respectable part of a woman's body than the vagina. It's in many of our definitions, what makes a woman a woman.

• 57:54Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, but put it, like, not on a sideways one.

• 58:05Mark Gagnon?

  No, but this is-

• 58:06Speaker 05

  Al, what do you think? Do you think, with all due respect to Lisa, do you think the lips are dark? Cause then maybe they put her in the color section.

• 58:18Mark Gagnon?

  That's fucked up.

• 58:23Speaker 05

  Oh, we're going to hell.

• 58:25Mark Gagnon?

  Which would be the most disrespectful thing to do to Rosa Parks.

• 58:27Speaker 04

  That's the worst thing to do.

• 58:28Speaker 05

  You gotta put her in the white section, right?

• 58:30Speaker 04

  That's fucked up.

• 58:31Mark Gagnon?

  That was fucked.

• 58:34Speaker 04

  But all those people on Twitter are mad about being like, you shouldn't have put it there.

• 58:37Speaker 05

  Oh, stop being angry about shit.

• 58:39Speaker 04

  They're trying to tell Rosa to leave.

• 58:40Speaker 05

  All right, put it, let's, Sydney Sweeney immediately. Let's just watch it, and...

• 58:47Speaker 05

  Jesus Christ.

• 58:49Speaker 04

  Yeah. Personally, I think she ate and left no crumbs.

• 58:55Speaker 04

  Personally, her body is teething.

• 58:59Speaker 04

  My honest opinion.

• 59:00Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, that was good, bro. That was good. I thought she could've did more.

• 59:05Speaker 04

  I hate you, Adam.

• 59:08Speaker 04

  That is the most interesting critique.

• 59:10Speaker 05

  How is everybody's jaw so perfect now? Like, how does everybody have, like, this immaculate jawline?

• 59:16Mark Gagnon?

  I also have that question.

• 59:17Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 59:17Mark Gagnon?

  I would also like to get to the bottom of this.

• 59:20Speaker 05

  Is that makeup? Like, what is giving everybody perfect jawlines?

• 59:23Speaker 04

  Ozempic, maybe? I don't know.

• 59:25Speaker 05

  But even Ozempic, I don't know if it can actually restructure your jaw.

• 59:28Speaker 04

  But I think it just, like, depletes so much of the fat and muscle in your face. It kind of, like, brings all the bones out.

• 59:33Speaker 05

  Oh, wow. But the rest of her doesn't look Ozempic.

• 59:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, true.

• 59:38Speaker 05

  It's like Halloween. Here's the thing about the Met Gala. Once we accept that we're the ones that benefit the most, because we get to make fun of and potentially humiliate the most famous, successful people on the planet.

• 59:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:52Speaker 05

  And that is, like, by design what the show is about. Whether or not they know it, but it's what it is for, like, the majority of people. It's kind of great for us.

• 1:00:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:00:02Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah. They could just be like, they're just hating because you wasn't there.

• 1:00:06Speaker 05

  Because you wasn't there. So it's kind of like, works out for everybody. And I like the designers trying to flex.

• 1:00:12Mark Gagnon?

  Why do white people went so, like, go better, go harder? This is a regular outfit.

• 1:00:18Speaker 04

  Yeah, but it's black dandyism is the theme. It's just a little bit of a, you know, got to be delicate. Can't put Rosa on your pubes and, you know, think everything's going to be just fine.

• 1:00:28Speaker 05

  Wait, did Kamala go? Whoa. What is she there?

• 1:00:32Speaker 04

  Obama. Half whack. Half whack.

• 1:00:45Speaker 05

  Oh, I didn't know that she went.

• 1:00:47Speaker 04

  That's kind of fire, dude.

• 1:00:48Speaker 05

  Is that her first time, like, is that her first public appearance since?

• 1:00:52Speaker 04

  Who's this? No, she's done, like, some speeches, I think.

• 1:00:54Speaker 05

  Is that Lisa?

• 1:00:56Speaker 04

  Uh, Jenny, another.

• 1:00:59Mark Gagnon?

  You thought she did an outfit change, bro? Like, seriously?

• 1:01:03Speaker 05

  You guys set me up for these things and you make me look so bad. It's a profile of this absolutely beautiful Asian woman at the Met Gala.

• 1:01:12Mark Gagnon?

  We just seen Lisa, though.

• 1:01:13Speaker 05

  I think that's Lisa, and there's nobody that can prove me otherwise.

• 1:01:18Speaker 05

  DNA test.

• 1:01:19Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, like, let's see the panties.

• 1:01:25Speaker 05

  We already, we already more Povich for Schultz versus Asians. Jesus, guys, stop it.

• 1:01:29Mark Gagnon?

  You are not Lisa.

• 1:01:33Speaker 05

  Yo, let me tell you something. This motherfucker's too handsome. Oh, yeah. This motherfucker is too goddamn handsome. Yeah.

• 1:01:40Mark Gagnon?

  Who is it?

• 1:01:41Speaker 05

  Dampson, what is his name? Idris.

• 1:01:43Mark Gagnon?

  Idris.

• 1:01:43Speaker 05

  Dampson Idris. I've got enough of these British Idrises. Yeah, there's something about Idris that makes you so, so cute. All right, hit that turnaround.

• 1:01:52Mark Gagnon?

  Nah, the turnaround with the little smirk, like.

• 1:01:57Speaker 05

  I'm just saying, if we gonna be real. You started.

• 1:02:02Speaker 05

  I was joking. I don't know about no turnaround with a smirk.

• 1:02:06Mark Gagnon?

  He does a smirk with a smirk.

• 1:02:08Speaker 05

  What is it with a smirk? That was like, that was the hand on the shoulder. Yeah, it was. Yo, Al, just embrace it. We're in there, pal. You're the most gay, non-gay, gay guy that we know. You can't say he's handsome? He is. Why'd you just say like Lisa? Now you're talking about charming, like he.

• 1:02:24Mark Gagnon?

  He's also that?

• 1:02:27Speaker 05

  I'm gonna choke to death on this. This session's like, I almost choked to death on this shit.

• 1:02:33Mark Gagnon?

  I saw this shit, I was like, damn, I gotta get that move down in America some.

• 1:02:39Speaker 05

  Fuck, can you try it now? You got your camera. Camera's over here, Al. Remember, your camera's over here.

• 1:02:49Mark Gagnon?

  I can't. He's too smooth. He's too smooth. Pharrell, he could've went harder. I'm surprised.

• 1:02:53Speaker 05

  Man, he designed all the shits, right? Well, he just designed the Louis, right?

• 1:02:57Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, just Louis.

• 1:02:57Speaker 05

  But, I mean, there were mad people in Louis. He did Sabrina Carpenter, he did Dochi, he did a bunch of people. I think, um, what's her face? Lisa was in Louis Vuitton. Which one was that?

• 1:03:08Speaker 05

  Which outfit was that? Lisa, Jenny, Rachel, Jessica, whatever fucking Asian girl I saw on the carpet. Fucking Mambo number five.

• 1:03:19Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:03:22Speaker 05

  Lisa's man is the heir to Louis Vuitton. Oh. Did you guys not know this?

• 1:03:28Mark Gagnon?

  I was aware.

• 1:03:28Speaker 05

  Did you guys not know this? Have you guys not researched Lisa? You're busy learning about Jenny. I'm locked in on Lisa. I know that she is gonna be the, uh, technically the heir as well, once they get married to Louis Vuitton.

• 1:03:43Speaker 05

  Did you not know this? I didn't know you were gonna be the heir of Louis. Not only Louis Vuitton, LVMH. Whoa, that's a lot of money. Arno's kid is married or fianceed up with Lisa. That's take it, huh? Yeah, lucky him. Yeah, are they married? I don't know, let's look it up.

• 1:04:01Speaker 05

  Why is, what are you guys doing right now? You're plotting on something. I know. You're scaring me a lot, dude. You're scaring me a lot. Lisa's reportedly in a relationship with Khedira Khana, the son of luxury conglomerate LVMH boss Bernard Arno, who is worth over 180 billion dollars.

• 1:04:17Speaker 07

  You gotta pull up a picture of both of them next to each other.

• 1:04:20Speaker 05

  Wait a minute, it sounds like you're making a joke. What do you know that we don't know? Come on now, come on Kenny.

• 1:04:29Speaker 05

  This guy, this stupid hood on every episode. Like a friar, right? What is he doing over there? He's accentuating a jaw.

• 1:04:38Speaker 07

  I can't do that.

• 1:04:40Speaker 05

  Oh no.

• 1:04:44Speaker 05

  Oh no, that's not fair. You're just taking a shitty picture of him. That's not fair. That's not fair. That's every picture. No, he looks better in that one.

• 1:04:57Speaker 05

  Yo, shout out to him for starting MySpace, man.

• 1:05:01Speaker 05

  Listen, Lisa, Lisa is... That is crazy. Money really gets you everything, bro. Nah. That is... Nah. He got the baddest Asian bitch in the world, right? That look, he looks good. He looks like a young Wayne Gretzky right there. That's the angle he needs. Stop hating on him with those other angles and that haircut. You need to go, this is a little better. Now we're doing a little better. So she got twin sisters? Man, Alex, you're being really insensitive. You're being really insensitive. Mark is littering. You're being insensitive. He's clearly with her girl group called Blackpink, which is another way to describe where Rosa Parks is.

• 1:05:48Speaker 05

  Yo, how do we have a podcast, man?

• 1:05:50Speaker 04

  I don't know.

• 1:05:50Speaker 05

  There's too many people to listen to this for us to be, you know, not taking things more seriously.

• 1:05:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, we need to be more mature.

• 1:05:57Speaker 05

  As Charlamagne says, you know, we're not mature enough to have this conversation and it is very true.

• 1:06:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:06:03Speaker 05

  You know, this is, this is an influential platform, you know? We decide who rules the free world on this platform here.

• 1:06:09Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, that's bad.

• 1:06:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:06:10Mark Gagnon?

  That's bad. Too much power.

• 1:06:11Speaker 04

  We owe it to the audience, bro. We gotta, we gotta step it up.

• 1:06:13Speaker 05

  What, how do we do better than that?

• 1:06:15Speaker 04

  Just try to, you know, influence elections.

• 1:06:18Speaker 05

  Here, have you ever flicked a zit at somebody?

• 1:06:22Mark Gagnon?

  Trying to use it at that.

• 1:06:25Speaker 04

  Can I have a fresh fash, though?

• 1:06:26Speaker 05

  Yes, I got you, my boy. I got you, my boy.

• 1:06:30Speaker 04

  Any other funny outfits? Like, oh, they put, what did they put Stevie Wonder in?

• 1:06:33Speaker 05

  Oh, no. Come on.

• 1:06:36Speaker 04

  I mean, every day's a mech hour for him, dude. What am I wearing now?

• 1:06:44Speaker 05

  Are you gonna let him talk about one of your heroes like that, man?

• 1:06:47Mark Gagnon?

  Stevie's lying.

• 1:06:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's lying, bro. He's not even lying.

• 1:06:49Mark Gagnon?

  Stevie's lying.

• 1:06:49Speaker 05

  So you think he's been pretending to be blind all this time?

• 1:06:51Speaker 04

  Bro, I was talking to Dune Land about this. White people and black people conspiracies are so different.

• 1:06:55Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:06:56Speaker 04

  And white people are like, 9/11, the moon. And black people are like, Stevie Wonder's lying.

• 1:07:01Speaker 05

  So, the, the, black people are getting into the, the flat earth shit, though.

• 1:07:05Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:07:05Speaker 05

  Have you been seeing? I've been seeing clips of Mark Lamont Hill on Joe Budden's podcast.

• 1:07:10Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:07:10Speaker 05

  Have you been seeing him going back and forth?

• 1:07:11Speaker 04

  I didn't.

• 1:07:12Speaker 05

  This shit is hilarious. Cause black people are just getting into the conspiracies from about like five years ago.

• 1:07:16Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:07:17Speaker 05

  Flat Earth being one of them.

• 1:07:18Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:07:18Speaker 05

  Have you seen any of this? Have you seen any of it?

• 1:07:20Mark Gagnon?

  I haven't seen it, but I'm already disappointed.

• 1:07:24Speaker 05

  Okay, why?

• 1:07:25Mark Gagnon?

  Cause, come on. Just don't do it.

• 1:07:28Speaker 04

  It depends. If you're having fun, then it's great.

• 1:07:31Mark Gagnon?

  Are they having fun or do they really believe it?

• 1:07:33Speaker 04

  Let's find out.

• 1:07:34Speaker 05

  You never know. It could be content.

• 1:07:37Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, if it's just for content, then it's fine. Cause then it's make-

• 1:07:39Speaker 04

  Wasn't Kyrie a flat earther?

• 1:07:41Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah. Sometimes shut up and dribble is real.

• 1:07:46Mark Gagnon?

  What?

• 1:07:48Speaker 04

  What?

• 1:07:48Mark Gagnon?

  Come on, guys. I don't know if Kyrie was on Flat Earth.

• 1:07:50Speaker 07

  Yeah, I think Kyrie was back in the day, remember?

• 1:07:53Mark Gagnon?

  I think so.

• 1:07:53Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:07:54Mark Gagnon?

  But he's on everything.

• 1:07:55Speaker 07

  He also said some other wild shit.

• 1:07:56Mark Gagnon?

  He's an internet kid, like whatever's popping on the moment.

• 1:07:59Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:08:00Mark Gagnon?

  You were right about that. Yeah, like some guys over there.

• 1:08:03Speaker 07

  He apologized in 2018 for his Flat Earth comments.

• 1:08:05Speaker 04

  Was he, what's the, what's the name of the, of the god and the nation of Islam that created white people? Have you seen this?

• 1:08:12Mark Gagnon?

  There's a god of the nation of Islam that created white people.

• 1:08:15Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm pretty sure I was looking into this this weekend.

• 1:08:18Speaker 07

  That was disrespectful.

• 1:08:20Speaker 04

  Yakub, bro, pull up Yakub, pull up a picture of Yakub, dude. Oh, this is awesome.

• 1:08:24Mark Gagnon?

  You got that up quick as fuck.

• 1:08:27Speaker 04

  So this is Yakub, alright?

• 1:08:28Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, Stephen A. Smith.

• 1:08:35Mark Gagnon?

  He's gonna be hosting First Take this morning if you wanna see what he gotta say. That is foul.

• 1:08:40Speaker 04

  That is, that is crazy.

• 1:08:41Mark Gagnon?

  God damn, bro.

• 1:08:43Speaker 04

  The god, like the alien god even has receding airline, that's fucked up. But yeah, apparently he like, I don't know all the details, but he's like, uh, like invented white people out there. Like, there's like a battle against black people, something like that.

• 1:08:54Mark Gagnon?

  Hmm, really?

• 1:08:55Speaker 04

  Oh yeah, I don't know the deal, someone should fact check this. I don't wanna be disrespectful to, to the nation.

• 1:09:00Mark Gagnon?

  You better watch out, man.

• 1:09:01Speaker 04

  I know.

• 1:09:02Mark Gagnon?

  They don't play. They gonna curse your wife out while you pass by.

• 1:09:06Speaker 04

  I mean, of all the Islam's to piss off, the nation of, I think is the least dangerous.

• 1:09:13Mark Gagnon?

  Nah, they get down.

• 1:09:14Speaker 04

  Really?

• 1:09:14Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah. Yeah, but not, they don't get down in the way that we're afraid of. I mean, some would say they do, they have like the militant motherfuckers. Yeah, but they're not gonna just blow up the plane. Oh, okay. That's the concern. Yeah, and the hierarchy, yeah, you're right.

• 1:09:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:31Mark Gagnon?

  I think the ones they're least afraid of are like the Kyries that they'll, they're Muslim today and then they're not.

• 1:09:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:37Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, he's Native American tomorrow and all that kinda shit.

• 1:09:40Speaker 07

  Also, Yakub created white people because he has two brains, as you saw in that image, I just looked this up. Created white people with one half of his brain and then his brain blew up and he died, so. Just wanna let you know, that's the.

• 1:09:51Speaker 04

  Yo, my bad.

• 1:09:52Speaker 07

  That's where white people come from.

• 1:09:53Speaker 04

  Yo, pour one out for the dead, dude. Shit, we put him on a t-shirt.

• 1:09:57Mark Gagnon?

  Nah, I believe that.

• 1:09:57Speaker 04

  That's what white people do, bro.

• 1:10:01Speaker 04

  Got him airbrushed on a tall tee, let's go. Have you heard the Elmo's black? No, I thought he was gay. Like in New Yorker, they're saying. Wait, what? Some girl in the show is like, no, Elmo is a black man. Like, there's a whole movement about Elmo being a black dude.

• 1:10:14Speaker 05

  Why does the character have to be black? It's a muppet.

• 1:10:18Speaker 04

  That's what I said.

• 1:10:19Speaker 05

  Is it a muppet? No, it's a sesame street.

• 1:10:21Speaker 04

  He's a sesame.

• 1:10:22Speaker 05

  He's a sesame.

• 1:10:24Speaker 04

  But the voice of Elmo is black, dude. That's why they say that. Oh. Oh, Kevin Clash. Hell, yeah. But, yeah, that's what, that's, this is what. I thought they were saying he was gay, but maybe that's Ernie. Yeah, Bert and Ernie are.

• 1:10:37Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:10:37Speaker 04

  Are they? 100P. Oh, okay. Yeah, dude.

• 1:10:40Speaker 05

  No way.

• 1:10:41Speaker 04

  A weekend in Switzerland, just Bert and Ernie? You're telling me, you're telling me he's not gay?

• 1:10:47Speaker 04

  I'm sorry. Oh, my good.

• 1:10:50Speaker 05

  Also, everybody that's wondering where Akash is, we can't tell you. We cannot tell you right now. There's a reason why we didn't bring it up early in the episode, but we cannot tell you where he is, but we hope that he comes home safe. That's all, that's all I'm gonna say.

• 1:11:02Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:11:03Speaker 05

  We want to make sure that he comes home safe. He's not in Burkina Faso. Where there has been a successful military coup that Mark will explain to us right now. He was diligently doing research before this podcast began.

• 1:11:15Speaker 04

  This is wild.

• 1:11:15Speaker 05

  Didn't even say hi to any of us as we walked into the studio.

• 1:11:18Speaker 04

  I was just, I was fucking.

• 1:11:19Speaker 05

  You were locked in.

• 1:11:20Speaker 04

  Face deep in my Mac, just getting hyped up, I'll be honest.

• 1:11:23Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:11:23Speaker 04

  Cause Ibrahim Traori. Yep. That guy.

• 1:11:27Speaker 05

  Here, come, come, come, sit here.

• 1:11:29Speaker 04

  Oh, hell yeah.

• 1:11:31Speaker 05

  Come, sit here, break it down.

• 1:11:32Speaker 04

  No, we back.

• 1:11:33Speaker 05

  Come, sit here, break it down. Come on out. Come on out. Alright, guys, stay in break for a second, okay? Let's get back to the show.

• 1:11:38Speaker 04

  And we're back. Okay, you ready to talk about Burkina Faso? Yes. And just, and just be mature about this. Okay, this is a serious issue and it's affecting a lot of people.

• 1:11:45Speaker 05

  Where is Burkina Faso?

• 1:11:46Speaker 04

  Mr. G, teach us.

• 1:11:49Speaker 05

  Let's, let's learn, but first of all, where is it?

• 1:11:51Speaker 04

  West Africa. It's near like Mali.

• 1:11:53Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:11:54Speaker 04

  And, uh, for years, they were colonized by the French.

• 1:11:58Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:11:59Speaker 04

  And the French basically colonized them and started taking all the resources. Yep.

• 1:12:02Speaker 05

  As they do.

• 1:12:03Speaker 04

  As they do.

• 1:12:04Speaker 05

  Only them.

• 1:12:05Speaker 04

  Well, they apparently have, their history of colonization is different. So like, the British sometimes would like come in and like nanny state. But the French were just coming to be like, we're taking everything. Taking it all. So then they get independence in the 60s, but the French leave, but in prop of a bunch of their backed politicians that then run the country. And just kind of siphon off all the resources to the French.

• 1:12:25Speaker 05

  Right.

• 1:12:25Speaker 04

  Also, the US kind of comes in, starts siphoning off resources. And didn't they leave military there that were able to like? Just like break up conflicts. But yeah. Like even though they were free, it was like, nah, we still gonna leave some of our military. They had a presence and then the president was, you know, backed by the French. And then they get, this guy Sankara, back in the day, he gets assassinated and he was trying to like liberate the country and nationalize the resources. Correct. And then gets assassinated. And then basically from then until like 2016, they've just been under like, kind of like French, you know, colonization, stealing all their shit. And then in 2022, this dude comes in and says, nah, fuck that. What's his name? Ibrahim Traori or Traori or something.

• 1:13:07Speaker 04

  And yeah, basically just takes back the country and starts nationalizing all the resources. So does a coup, creates a government and he's not a leader of it, he's 37 years old. Fire. And is just running the country. Was he a military guy? Yeah, he was formerly military. And then, so how did he get the loyalty of the military? Basically, he was just like, yo, this is fucked up what they're doing. That all these presidents are like Manchurian candidates, siphoning off of resources, leaving our country in squalor. Burkina Faso has like historically the lowest GDP or like of the lowest GDPs. Forty percent of the country lives below the poverty line. Everyone's struggling, but they have the fourth most gold of any African country. Just getting crushed. And they're like, what is happening? Why is this keep happening to us? And so then they do a military coup and then the guy that leads military coup ends up getting ousted by him.

• 1:13:52Speaker 04

  So it's like a coup of a coup. Oh shit. Of another coup. Like there's just like all these different coups. And so he eventually gets appointed by like the coup board. And they're basically like, yeah, Ibrahim is gonna run it. And now. Why did the first guy get kicked out? Do you know? They were unsure of his uh. Loyalty? Loyalty and then also he wasn't going hard enough on the jihadists. So there's two problems happening in Burkina Faso where the one is like the French occupation. And then the other thing is you have jihadists coming in from like Mali that are now displacing all these people in Burkina Faso. So they're coming through like 2 million people have been displaced, thousands of people have been killed by this like militant Islamist regime trying to create like an Islamic state. What's their name? They're connected to Al Qaeda and ISIS. They have like super specific like, you know, sets. Like, I don't know what the click, the specific name is.

• 1:14:36Speaker 04

  But yeah, basically he's come through and like, yo, we're nationalizing the gold. We're kicking all the jihadists out and we're gonna make Burkina Faso great again.

• 1:14:43Mark Gagnon?

  There's been like two assassination attempts on his life.

• 1:14:46Speaker 04

  Oh, yes, so far, like that we know. And they've tried to like coup him. So he got super popular recently in April because they tried to do a coup on him. And he was like, no, fuck that. And taken. So now what happens internally is that you have people within like your own regime trying to take you out. So there's other people vying for power, like people that helped you get to your position now trying to take you out.

• 1:15:05Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:05Speaker 04

  So now he's creating a system. I don't even understand how they're doing it. There's not even a ton of coverage on this. It's like hard to find and he's basically like quelling internal coups and basically appointed himself as like the leader of the country.

• 1:15:15Mark Gagnon?

  Holy shit.

• 1:15:16Speaker 04

  Kind of did away with like the the democracy hit a quote where he was like democracies never progressed a country. No country's ever developed under democracy. We need like a strong king to like rule the shit. And it seems like he's doing it. So the people of Burkina Faso are like pretty stoked on it. And now this like authoritarian kind of thing is like spreading through Africa where people are like, we need this. And every former colony state because all of Africa has been now like beholden to their colonial ancestors, their parents, rather.

• 1:15:44Speaker 05

  I imagine in the near future, um, there will be no buying of the rights to your natural resources. They'll only be partnering. Like I think recently in like Trinidad, there was this leader who sold all of the, because Trinidad has oil. So I think they like sold all the oil rights to the Chinese for like a hundred years or like Lisa for a hundred years. And like the way this thing happens is that they cut the deal so that that specific person gets super rich, you know, at the cost of the people. And this happens, I'm sure all over the world, but I imagine like as, you know, maybe one of the benefits of globalism is that there'll be these like,

• 1:16:22Speaker 05

  there'll be these like, like international policy, like laws in place that will protect the colonial countries from doing this. But at the same time, these smaller countries do need the investment for infrastructure. So if you've got all this oil and you need to find a way to get it out, but everybody's living in poverty, you need investment. So it can operate in a similar way to, I'm trying to think like, um.

• 1:16:46Speaker 04

  I mean, UAE is, in my opinion, the best example of this.

• 1:16:48Speaker 05

  Okay, give me, give me.

• 1:16:49Speaker 04

  So like their British mandate, the English control the whole. And it's not even UAE, it's all the separate Emirates. And then they find oil in the 50s. And then Sheikh Zayed brokers a deal with the British and is like, "Hey, we're gonna give you the oil." At first, they started just beginning, like, taking the raw oil. Not refining it in the country, not helping the people, just getting all the oil out of there. He goes, "No, no, no, we're gonna come together, unite all the Emirates, and then nationalize the oil and refine it all here, and then partner with BP, so you guys get rights. And then partner with the US, Exxon, all them, you guys get rights to the oil." And then that's where the Petrodaw comes from. So like, "Hey, we're all gonna trade our oil, we're gonna give you guys good deals, we're gonna partner with you guys, and we're down to play ball, but we're gonna help our people first." And was diplomatic enough to make it work.

• 1:17:32Speaker 04

  Like, he didn't get ousted or, you know, replaced.

• 1:17:36Speaker 05

  I mean, there's a way where it's actually cheaper for the colonial countries to do this. Because they're like, "Hold on, so you'll organize it, stop all the warring factions, because if there's war in the country, we can't extract the oil." If we have to worry about jihad has blown some shit up, or a coup happening, it stops the oil from coming. So there's a certain amount of, like, money that you have to pay for protection for your goods. So it's probably cheaper to have a leader that will give you access, and then that leader goes, "Okay, how much you pay to protect all this shit?" "Okay, well, you don't have to pay that anymore, because I'm gonna protect it, but I want that delta."

• 1:18:07Speaker 04

  Yeah, but historically, the cheapest thing was, let's just put our guy in who's gonna give us everything.

• 1:18:11Speaker 05

  Yes, and now it looks like-

• 1:18:12Speaker 04

  We'll make him a millionaire, and we'll just take everything.

• 1:18:15Speaker 05

  But now the people are going, they're educated enough, and maybe the internet is available enough, where people go, "Okay, this isn't fair, and we're getting fucked." And there's other examples, I guess, in Africa, or even the Middle East, where, like, there's a different system that actually benefits the people.

• 1:18:26Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, but then when you have situations like this happen, then they just take them out, like Gaddafi.

• 1:18:31Speaker 05

  That is, yeah, I mean, that happens all around the world, but now maybe there's enough security where you don't get to do that. You know, and it's also like, there's a lot of shame that goes along with that. Like, back in the day, you could take someone out, and nobody really knows about it. But like, if it's making news and somebody gets killed, you have to go, "Well, who killed him?" And then if it trickles back to France, imagine how we're gonna look at Macron, or the leadership over there, that's basically okaying the murder of a, not only the government official, but like, the leading government entity in an independent country.

• 1:19:02Mark Gagnon?

  I would say yes and no, because a lot of people-

• 1:19:05Speaker 05

  It's over there and we can just, it's like out of sight, out of

• 1:19:08Speaker 04

  And you kind of, you just fund a sort of separate military group.

• 1:19:11Speaker 05

  To don't handle all that shit.

• 1:19:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, and you fund five of them.

• 1:19:14Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:19:15Speaker 04

  And then whichever one wins, you're like, oh, great, we got a guy back.

• 1:19:17Speaker 05

  But there's a cost too for that. It's like what the mafia bosses will always say. It's like when we're all at war, we're not making money.

• 1:19:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:19:22Speaker 05

  Brings way too much attention. Yeah, I think that the best, I really think that even for the colonial powers, it works better if you just take, maybe you're making 10% less, maybe you're making 30% less, but you don't have to worry about shit. And you get to act like you're this like benevolent partner. Like, wouldn't you rather the world see you as somebody who's like lifting up these African nations instead of this like diabolical, like, um, I don't want to say like terrorists, but like colonial state.

• 1:19:48Speaker 04

  Which like they, they kind of do. So like some of the colonists are like, no, no, we have like aid programs. And we're giving you guys aid and we're helping out.

• 1:19:55Speaker 05

  But even that gets caught up by the people in charge if they're corrupt.

• 1:19:58Speaker 04

  Exactly.

• 1:19:58Speaker 05

  Right? So then the food actually reaches the people. There's that great example of, um, I think it's Botswana. If I'm not mistaken. But, uh, there's this leader who was just like, I mean, you could argue, maybe look it up right now, but like one of the greatest leaders in history. And he basically took this African nation from squalor to like the highest like GDP of any African nation, the highest levels of education. And like slowly did it piece by piece. But first was, I think nobody actually had rights to their minerals. I think they had like diamonds. You can look and see if it's Botswana. I'm not exactly sure. I forget this guy's name. I should know the name, but like, great example of this. Like you can do it. You can pull your country out of extreme poverty,

• 1:20:41Speaker 05

  but you cannot do it without the natural resources.

• 1:20:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:20:44Speaker 05

  Like the number one, like, cause without that, you just have nothing to pull from. What are you gonna do? Tourism? Nobody wants to go there. People getting shot. They think your country's full of AIDS. They think, they think, no, but like unfortunately that is the perception, right? So people aren't going for like cute little vacations over there.

• 1:20:58Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:20:58Speaker 05

  One of the reasons why we can go to the Caribbean and all this kind of stuff is because we're like, oh, it's safe.

• 1:21:01Speaker 04

  Yeah. But Burkina Faso is in a tough spot because they're landlocked. So they require and rely on all their neighboring countries for like transportation.

• 1:21:08Speaker 05

  Botswana too.

• 1:21:09Speaker 04

  Ah, interesting.

• 1:21:10Speaker 05

  So it's, it's, those are the ones that are most difficult because they're also easily invaded.

• 1:21:14Speaker 04

  Yep. You're so dependent on the people around you.

• 1:21:16Speaker 05

  Could you check to see if it is that guy?

• 1:21:19Speaker 04

  And then what's interesting is that a lot of people in Burkina Faso, now Ibrahim is kind of like partnering with the Russians a little.

• 1:21:24Speaker 05

  Oh, boy.

• 1:21:25Speaker 04

  Like trying to, you know, get some infrastructure, trying to like cozy up with them because you kind of do need.

• 1:21:30Speaker 05

  You need, you need a daddy.

• 1:21:31Speaker 04

  You need a little bit of a partner.

• 1:21:32Speaker 05

  Yep.

• 1:21:32Speaker 04

  And so now Russia's like, hey, you know, you've been screwed over by the French, the Americans, da, da, da. And the American diplomats are like, hey, this coup thing is crazy. And the Russians are kind of helping them out.

• 1:21:42Speaker 05

  Yes. What is it?

• 1:21:44Speaker 04

  Seretse Kama?

• 1:21:45Speaker 05

  Yeah, Kama. And then it was in Kama's elected as first president. And then he was just like, I mean, there's a great YouTube video I watched on it. And like some of these guys do these like really in-depth,

• 1:21:59Speaker 05

  you know, historical accounts on YouTube, like really like well researched with imagery and all this stuff. But this guy Kama, I think he's no longer in power. And I think the guy who followed him, there isn't like tons of support. But I imagine he was in power for years. I think he had like a white wife too. And that was a little bit.

• 1:22:15Speaker 04

  Snow bunnies, man.

• 1:22:15Speaker 05

  Yeah, he got snowbunnied a little bit. I think he was educated in England. If I'm not mistaken.

• 1:22:21Mark Gagnon?

  I just hope we start seeing more of this happen in Africa and the countries just get their resources back. Cause there's so much wealth in Africa and it's just being fucking.

• 1:22:31Speaker 05

  Well, that's why.

• 1:22:34Speaker 05

  But yeah, you get them, you get people partnering and like the tricky thing is you kind of need these people to be educated outside of their country. Because if they're educated within their country, they're probably part of the propaganda machine that's kept people at bay. So it's almost like you want them to go to the colonial powers so they can learn what happened to their country in the most effective way. And then like go to these like institutions like Oxford or Harvard or that kind of stuff. And like you'd like study business or geopolitics and you learn how trade actually works. And then you can start to broker these deals and build these relationships with the other countries.

• 1:23:13Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:23:13Speaker 05

  Especially right now where like everybody's terrified of the value of currency. Like I think gold is at like $3,000 a pound or something in the same price. So right now is the perfect time to own your fucking gold, right?

• 1:23:25Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:23:25Speaker 05

  You know?

• 1:23:26Speaker 04

  That's fascinating.

• 1:23:27Speaker 05

  Yeah, because that's the hedge against currency.

• 1:23:29Speaker 04

  Yeah. And he's hooking up the farmers too. He's like giving farmers free tractors. Like he's like, so far it seems like everyone likes him.

• 1:23:36Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:23:37Speaker 04

  This is since 2022.

• 1:23:38Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:23:39Speaker 04

  What he does with this sort of unchecked power, we shall see.

• 1:23:42Speaker 05

  That's the thing. You need someone who's like truly benevolent.

• 1:23:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:23:45Speaker 05

  Can you make sure that I was right about that, Butswanaga? I don't want to get that wrong.

• 1:23:48Mark Gagnon?

  And then I think there's like a movement in South Africa.

• 1:23:50Speaker 07

  There's a YouTube video called Seretse Kamala: Life and Legacy of Africa's Best President Ever.

• 1:23:55Mark Gagnon?

  So what was that?

• 1:23:55Speaker 07

  That's the one.

• 1:23:56Speaker 05

  It might be, but there's a few that have been done on it. But it's specifically like what he did, like at a certain point, there was like invasions. He's like, okay, well, oh, the first thing was after natural, I think it was investing in education. He's like, cause an educated populace is going to continue to innovate and.

• 1:24:12Speaker 07

  His wife was white, it looks like.

• 1:24:14Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like he had these, this like step to being a first world country or whatever it is. And like, he fucking knocked it out of the park, you know? But naturally having the, the resources was, is amazing. I think at one point, Batana was like part of Zimbabwe or something like that. But like there was, he had to worry about invasions. He's like, okay, now we have to invest in military. Like he just went through the process and he had enough support from the people. And it's possible. I guess that's the point is like, it is possible.

• 1:24:42Speaker 04

  He's gotta be immune to that corruption though.

• 1:24:43Speaker 05

  And that's hard.

• 1:24:44Speaker 04

  You get a seat at the table and they're like, bro.

• 1:24:46Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, I know. That's rough.

• 1:24:47Speaker 04

  Let's just give you everything you've ever wanted. Like he grew up in a town of 2,000 people in the middle of Burkina Faso, one of the most poor countries ever. And now people are going to him being like, y'all, let's do a deal. Let's work this out. You'll be a millionaire, da, da, billionaire. And you gotta be able to be like, no, I'm good. I'm gonna help my people.

• 1:25:02Mark Gagnon?

  I mean, what if you're that guy? What, you got something, Joe?

• 1:25:05Speaker 06

  Oh, that's right.

• 1:25:07Speaker 05

  So like, what if there's a, like, I think about this all the time with Bukele. I would love to have the El Salvadorian president on it, cause it's like.

• 1:25:15Mark Gagnon?

  Did you see the, I think it's him, but he just got caught selling a bunch of coke.

• 1:25:21Speaker 05

  Bukele?

• 1:25:22Mark Gagnon?

  I'm pretty sure.

• 1:25:23Speaker 05

  What? I would look that up.

• 1:25:24Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:25Speaker 05

  Before I congratulate him.

• 1:25:27Mark Gagnon?

  He, he owns some coffee business in Miami. And they just, it was a huge bust of like $30 million worth of cocaine. That was supposed to be shipped to Germany.

• 1:25:41Mark Gagnon?

  Like, these motherfuckers are crazy. But check that, just double check, but I'm pretty sure that was, it's like, Western media isn't covering it, only like Latin American news is covering it and they're trying to keep it like super hush hush.

• 1:25:52Speaker 05

  And so he's doing what the CIA did to his country, here. Nice, that's a get back. Like, or what we did in Afghanistan, where we took all the heroin fields.

• 1:26:02Speaker 07

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:26:03Speaker 05

  Yeah, don't sell it in your own country. But if Canada can sell asbestos to Thailand, then why can't El Salvador sell coke to some other countries? Like, it's what we tell people all the time, like, the issue is taking advantage of your own people, so that you can get rich. Fucking over other people, we seem to look the other way. America's done it, a bunch of other countries have done it, it seems like that's how you become a superpower in a way. Whether it's through colonization or through selling, you know, narcotics, but like, there's a market for this shit. The problem is, is when it just completely erodes the fabric of your society. Yeah. Alright, gotcha.

• 1:26:39Mark Gagnon?

  I'm pretty sure that is the bust, but apparently it was supposed to be in a shipment with this coffee that he partially owns.

• 1:26:48Speaker 05

  But we should put in allegedly right there.

• 1:26:50Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, allegedly, yeah.

• 1:26:51Speaker 05

  The point that I'm trying to make, and I'm not trying to cap firm, but it's like, I wonder if on some level, let's remove this, because I don't know what the truth is here.

• 1:27:01Speaker 05

  Okay, you've taken your country from the most dangerous country in the Western Hemisphere to the safest. Okay? You have like 85% approval from your people. Okay? We'll, we'll look into it one second, believe that up. You have, I imagine it's a democracy, so there are term limits, maybe, let's say there are.

• 1:27:23Speaker 05

  You know the next people that are going for election, you know them, you know them well. What if you see them and you're like, yo, they can't do it?

• 1:27:33Speaker 05

  Like, this guy's kind of corrupt, I've been like looking the other way about it, but I know he's easily influenced, this guy's a fucking idiot, but the people like him, but they don't realize that he just doesn't have what it takes to do this shit.

• 1:27:44Speaker 05

  I understand the impulse to tyranny. Even if it's benevolent. Now, I'm sure there's bad people that look at that same situation and they just go, I just want to keep my power. These people can't do it, but you really, you just want to keep your power. But is there ever a situation where you're like, I'm good. I don't think these guys can fucking do it. Do I let it go because that is what upholds democracy? Or do I create a tyrannical state because that's what upholds the society that is benefiting everyone?

• 1:28:14Speaker 05

  I guess what I'm trying to say is like, there is a little bit more nuance to the, the, the, the need for power. And it is possible that there are certain people who are like, I don't even want to do this shit, but it's gonna fall apart if this guy gets in power because I know him. I've seen him be corrupted already.

• 1:28:31Speaker 04

  Yeah. Well, everyone likes a good king. You know what I mean? Like if you've got a good king that's running shit well and everyone's cool, like, most people are down with that. They trust him.

• 1:28:40Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:28:40Speaker 04

  Like the wise king, you know what I mean?

• 1:28:42Speaker 07

  I mean, Saddam ran into that issue with this fucking lunatic son, Uday.

• 1:28:45Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:28:46Speaker 07

  You know, Uday?

• 1:28:47Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:28:48Speaker 07

  He was like an absolute fucking just evil motherfucker.

• 1:28:54Speaker 05

  He would have got him right there.

• 1:28:56Speaker 04

  I didn't say who.

• 1:28:56Speaker 05

  I know.

• 1:28:57Speaker 04

  I said, no, I don't know.

• 1:28:59Speaker 07

  No, Uday was his actual son and he was like an absolute fucking lunatic. He tortured people, abused people through like crazy parties would make people, he was like actually Game of Thrones king.

• 1:29:09Speaker 04

  Joffrey.

• 1:29:10Speaker 07

  A Joffrey type shit.

• 1:29:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:29:11Speaker 07

  And Saddam like to would try to like reel him in and would burn his cars. Like he owned a bunch of nice cars and he burned his cars one time to like threaten him. He put him in jail for like a night. But like Saddam couldn't really reel him in, but also.

• 1:29:27Speaker 05

  I'm gonna count to three, Uday. Torturing.

• 1:29:30Speaker 07

  But Saddam would also then name other people.

• 1:29:33Speaker 05

  His successor.

• 1:29:34Speaker 07

  His successor and it would piss Uday off even more. He had his like crazy shit happen.

• 1:29:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:29:39Speaker 05

  Yeah. When you know there's no repercussions to your actions, you're gonna act out.

• 1:29:42Speaker 07

  Yeah. And he was just, he, he tortured the, the Olympic team.

• 1:29:46Speaker 04

  Yeah. He was like one of the most brutal dudes ever. Like the stuff he did is insane. There's whole documentaries on like his atrocities where his. Just like pulling people off the street, fucking murdering them.

• 1:29:56Speaker 05

  Also, like, where does he learn that shit? You don't learn that shit from the movies. Like, you're seeing that within your family dynamic, or at least you're seeing your dad use power in that way, and you think it's okay.

• 1:30:06Speaker 04

  Got his uncle shot. He did some wild stuff.

• 1:30:08Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah, or you can just step it up, like.

• 1:30:12Speaker 05

  Yeah, maybe, but maybe there's a version where he feels like stepping stepping it up is, you know, creating favor with his father.

• 1:30:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:30:19Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:20Speaker 05

  I'm not trying to say that, like, Saddam is this, like, fucking, I guess my point is he's not this, like, great guy, but his son is even worse.

• 1:30:26Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:26Speaker 05

  But I've seen kids like this on much, like, lower levels, where it's just like, you got this, like, rich kid, you guys probably grew up with them, and where, like, they never really get in trouble for every, anything they get. You went to private school, shut up.

• 1:30:37Mark Gagnon?

  No, I didn't.

• 1:30:38Speaker 05

  You went to private school?

• 1:30:39Mark Gagnon?

  No, I didn't.

• 1:30:40Speaker 05

  It was private.

• 1:30:41Mark Gagnon?

  Your bard was, you had to take a test to get in, but there was no payment for it?

• 1:30:46Speaker 05

  I thought bard is private.

• 1:30:47Mark Gagnon?

  No, it's public.

• 1:30:48Speaker 05

  Not public?

• 1:30:49Mark Gagnon?

  I mean, you have to test to get into the school, but outside of that, there's no payment for it. Swear to God. Come on, son, I'm just smart.

• 1:30:59Speaker 04

  But the tricky thing now with Ibrahim is that all these other countries want authoritarian leaders. Like, there's like a push towards authoritarianism, because he's been so great so far.

• 1:31:07Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:31:08Speaker 04

  That now, are you gonna have other countries in the region being like, where's our Ibrahim? And then are you gonna get bad actors that are like, I'll do it?

• 1:31:14Speaker 05

  I actually think he's right, though. I don't think democracy is the quickest way to progress. Like, democracy led us to civil war, let's not.

• 1:31:21Speaker 04

  Maybe not the quickest. In fairness, he said no democracy has led to prosperity, or something like.

• 1:31:26Speaker 05

  Oh, well, that's bullshit.

• 1:31:26Speaker 04

  He has a quote about democracy.

• 1:31:27Speaker 05

  The quickest way is what Singapore did.

• 1:31:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:31:31Speaker 05

  Like, fifty years, you go from a jungle to a first world country.

• 1:31:34Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:31:34Speaker 05

  Like, the quickest way is you have, like, a party in charge, and you hope to God they're benevolent, and then you ride that shit till the wheels fall off, and then maybe then, once a culture is set, you could start to create some form of democracy. But I have a hard time believing that, like, you just go, oh, yeah, we'll vote and everything will be perfect. It's like, you haven't even established what the culture is, what you guys need, what the identity is.

• 1:31:55Speaker 04

  No, you need, like, educated populace, you need people that have access to info.

• 1:31:57Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's, people are so easily manipulated, especially now with the internet. You're gonna just let democracy happen in Burkina Faso?

• 1:32:04Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:04Speaker 05

  You just hand out cell phones to these people in the, in the middle of the, in the middle of wherever the fuck they're living, and like, yeah, you're gonna see some shit get riled up. No.

• 1:32:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, no country's developed under democracy.

• 1:32:14Speaker 05

  I also don't think that people give a fuck about democracy anymore. Like, I think that was like, no, like, I mean, that's funny, but that's, but like. But no, I mean, like, like, you know how like, we used to feel like it was our, our job to spread democracy?

• 1:32:28Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, yes.

• 1:32:29Speaker 05

  Like, I don't think Americans care about spreading that shit. Like, we just want people that agree with our way of living. So if you got a dictator that agrees with it, bet. If you got a prime minister, bet.

• 1:32:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's so crazy, even like Vietnam time, how they convinced people that communism was like the existential threat.

• 1:32:46Speaker 05

  I do think that is true.

• 1:32:48Speaker 04

  But like, how did they get people to be like, yo, we gotta stop it?

• 1:32:51Speaker 05

  Well, I gotta look more into this like McCarthy shit, or like the MacArthur, MacArthur?

• 1:32:55Speaker 04

  McCarthyism, yeah.

• 1:32:56Speaker 05

  Yeah, I gotta look into those hearings, because he might have been right about that shit. Like, because I think that there is, like, I think communism is very seductive, right? Especially when it's not applied. When it's not applied, it looks like the best thing ever. Like, we have to support people, we have to help poor people have a part of the industries in which they work. So they're not just cogs in the machine, like. And if you have a populist, especially at a time like now, which just feels like jobs are hard to get, and they're slowly like, being more and more taken advantage of by the wealthy, introducing an idea like communism, call it something else, Americans would be like, really into it. This sounds great.

• 1:33:33Mark Gagnon?

  If done right, it's actually a great thing.

• 1:33:35Speaker 05

  Exactly, but never done, never done right. But like, the fact that it sounds like a great thing can easily sway an uneducated populist, or even an educated one. Matter of fact, sometimes education is even better, right? Because you'll see like, what the true benefits of these things are. So, I understand Americans at that time going, shit, this is spreading, because all these poor people around the world really want some equity in the industries that they're, you know, building up. If that continues to spread, it could easily spread over here, because why wouldn't every American want that? But that could kill, potentially could kill American prosperity, if it's not done right.

• 1:34:10Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:11Speaker 05

  So I, I get like, it as an existential threat. Us being over there in Vietnam, I don't know, I don't know why we think like, if Vietnam falls, then Kansas City does. But I do get the idea that like, uh-oh, this shit is kind of catching steam. And then, I furthermore get why the rich people in America would really not want that.

• 1:34:29Mark Gagnon?

  Yes.

• 1:34:30Speaker 05

  So it's like, it's almost like double incentivized.

• 1:34:34Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:35Speaker 05

  Do you know what I mean? Like, the rich people were like, "We definitely don't want this, it's gonna fuck our business up." And then, like, the permanent government people going, "Yeah, it hasn't really worked in any of these other places, but it's really seductive." Alright, we're in cahoots on this one. Where there might be things that the rich people really like, but the American government is like, "Nah, you got monopolistic practices, we need to break that shit up, cuz it's actually gonna fuck people over." And the rich people are like, "No, no, that's what we do, we fuck people over." And like, "Yeah, you're not gonna do it now."

• 1:35:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:35:03Speaker 05

  So when rich people in government are aligned, you're fucked.

• 1:35:07Speaker 05

  Right? When rich people in government are not aligned, there's a battle.

• 1:35:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

• 1:35:14Mark Gagnon?

  Play that out of the video? Wait, which one? The one with the...

• 1:35:19Speaker 05

  About the drugs?

• 1:35:20Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:20Speaker 08

  What's up, guys? So, pretty much Bukele owns a coffee brand called Beans of Fire, which is based in Miami, and they just got caught with thirty-one million dollars' worth of snow powder, you know what I'm talking about? Thirty-one million dollars in their shipment to Belgium. So the president personally owns, Bukele personally owns a coffee brand that's based in Miami, that's caught shipping drugs to Belgium. But for some reason, nobody's talking about it except Hispanic news sources. So Bukele responded at saying that somebody's trying to smear him. So let me get this straight. Somebody put thirty-one million dollars' worth of snow powder in a shipment just to smear a dictator wannabe? And why does he own a coffee, uh, company based in Miami? This is what I told you guys. This is what Duarte did in the Philippines.

• 1:36:04Speaker 08

  Pretty much, they took out the competition in El Salvador. He took out his drug rivals in El Salvador, and they are becoming the main providers of drugs, the main sellers, the main cartel. And that's why he's best friends with Donald Trump. So our tax dollars are going to a drug dealer in El Salvador.

• 1:36:19Speaker 05

  I'm not, yo, low-key, I'm not against this. It's fucked up.

• 1:36:24Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, go on it, go on it.

• 1:36:26Speaker 05

  It's fucked up, but the world is fucked up.

• 1:36:28Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 1:36:29Speaker 05

  So like when asbestos was banned in Canada, they were still selling it to like Vietnam or Thailand or some shit like that. Like, they already recognized that asbestos was causing cancer. So they banned it in their own country, but they were still shipping it out to their own countries where they would eventually go get cancer. And I don't know if it was as direct as asbestos. Maybe asbestos was in like the drywall or whatever the fuck they were sending, but like they knew that there was something that was banned in their country that they were sending it out to the world. I think this shit probably happens a lot. I think that there's probably chemicals that we create here that we're like, ah, this isn't good for our food, but we'll send it out to other countries.

• 1:37:02Mark Gagnon?

  But why are you okay with that?

• 1:37:03Speaker 05

  I, I, I'm okay with it. I'm not saying it's good, but what I'm saying is I don't know if this is dissimilar to, to practices that we and other like righteous first world countries do. Therefore-

• 1:37:14Mark Gagnon?

  I get it, but I'm still against it. I would say, hey-

• 1:37:17Speaker 05

  Of course, don't do it. I, I, I, the right thing is to say, don't do it. But the other thing is to be like, okay, we have all these fields, we've, we've seized the fields, we have all this cocaine, we can find ways to sell it, we can profit off it, whether we continue to do it or not is I guess up to us as a country. They get to decide whether cocaine is illegal to sell for people or for the government in their country. Canada decided it was illegal, but they still were producing it and selling it. So it's your product. If other countries want it, they can find a way to get there. Like- And listen, it's fucked up. What to me is most important is that you're prioritizing your own people. So if you're uplifting your own people through what we would deem as like

• 1:37:58Speaker 05

  nefarious acts, yeah, maybe it's like a little bit, maybe it's bad, maybe a lot of bad, but it is less bad than selling those drugs to your own people.

• 1:38:08Mark Gagnon?

  Okay.

• 1:38:09Speaker 04

  Is it possible that there's a cartel that's like, yo, we're gonna ship this stuff, we own the shipping and we're gonna throw our own product in there and then it'll get sorted out when it gets lands?

• 1:38:16Speaker 05

  I also don't, I, I, not only do I think that's possible, I also think it's possible that there is somebody trying to smear him.

• 1:38:23Speaker 04

  Perhaps.

• 1:38:23Speaker 05

  Like, I, I think it's very possible you have someone with that much power, that much support, and he's saying certain things that are disrupting-

• 1:38:32Speaker 05

  I won't say disrupting governments.

• 1:38:33Mark Gagnon?

  Thirty million dollars to smear a person?

• 1:38:36Speaker 04

  But again, these cartels make crazy money, like thirty one million dollars. It's almost tricky because it's like, it is a lot of money objectively, of course. But like, if you're a cartel with hundreds of millions, billions.

• 1:38:44Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:45Speaker 04

  It's like, oh, we can use this for political leverage. Or, yo, we're just gonna throw this in our shipment. And maybe that's the only one that got caught. You know what I mean? Like, there might have been two others that went through.

• 1:38:55Mark Gagnon?

  The cartels, and you take out all the criminals? Like, aren't they, they're supposed to be all locked up right now?

• 1:39:00Speaker 05

  That's, that's what I'm saying.

• 1:39:01Mark Gagnon?

  It's like, if this shit is still happening, you're not doing the job. Or you know what's gonna happen.

• 1:39:05Speaker 05

  Or does the government take it over? And then it's like a national resource?

• 1:39:08Mark Gagnon?

  That's, that's what seems more likely. And I'm like.

• 1:39:12Speaker 05

  If America was trading the fucking heroin in Afghanistan.

• 1:39:15Mark Gagnon?

  Hmm.

• 1:39:16Speaker 05

  Which I, I don't know, I don't have like factual evidence that we did that. I, I think at some point in time, we did take over like the poppy production. Which eventually becomes the heroin. Like, and if that was part of the GDP of Afghanistan and they recognize it, and they're like, well, we can either give them the money or we can fucking sell this shit.

• 1:39:31Mark Gagnon?

  Hmm.

• 1:39:32Speaker 05

  Are we really gonna shit on El Salvador for doing it? I guess to me, what's most important is if, if you're trying to uplift a country from poverty, destitute poverty and violence. Like, there's probably gonna be, you're gonna crack some eggs on the way.

• 1:39:45Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:45Speaker 05

  And I'm not.

• 1:39:46Mark Gagnon?

  Greater good is.

• 1:39:47Speaker 05

  Is, how are the people doing it? Now, the cost of how those people doing are how people in Belgium are snorting coke.

• 1:39:53Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:54Speaker 05

  I'm like, boo hoo. If he's selling asbestos to third world countries, so his people can be okay. It's like, okay, you're fucking over more poor people so that your poor people can get rich.

• 1:40:03Mark Gagnon?

  Hmm.

• 1:40:03Speaker 05

  I'm not saying it's okay to fuck over rich people, but like, I imagine in Belgium, you have a choice whether or not you're gonna buy fucking cocaine and snort it when you go out drinking.

• 1:40:10Speaker 04

  Hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then gatekeeping a different country doing the shit that a bunch of first world countries do.

• 1:40:17Speaker 05

  Wait, what is that? What does that mean?

• 1:40:18Speaker 04

  Like, if a bunch of first world countries do a bunch of fuck shit to get rich, and then other countries try to do it. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 1:40:23Speaker 05

  So, we did that shit, like, low key, I kinda feel like we did that shit with the industrial revolution. It's like, we were polluting the whole fucking world. Became industrial superpower, then the rest of these countries trying to do it, we're like, we have to worry about the environment.

• 1:40:36Speaker 04

  Like China, what are you doing, smog?

• 1:40:38Speaker 05

  Yeah, I'm not trying to make some pro-China argument, but it's like, what do you think our skies look like in from 1800s to 1960?

• 1:40:44Speaker 04

  But it is kinda smart though. It is kinda smart if you're like, if you're running it, if you're America, being like, yeah, you guys can't do what we did.

• 1:40:51Speaker 05

  This is what, this is what I'm saying, like, it, like, the expectations for your country are different for the expectations for the world. And I'm kind of okay with that shit. And if we can use these different levers to apply leverage, so it's more beneficial to us, I'm kind of okay with that. Like, we don't live in this utopia where every country just wants every other country to do well. We, this, this shit is a race.

• 1:41:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:41:12Speaker 05

  So we gotta treat it like a race.

• 1:41:13Speaker 04

  I wouldn't say I'm okay, but I do recognize the game.

• 1:41:15Speaker 05

  Maybe okay isn't the right word, but.

• 1:41:16Speaker 04

  I recognize game, I'm like, yeah.

• 1:41:18Speaker 05

  This is the game, and we have to play it within the confines of our ethics.

• 1:41:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:41:23Speaker 05

  And the ethics within our country are different, and we acknowledge this, than outside of our country. And we got allies, and then the ethics with our allies are like, a little bit closer to us. Like, so how we treat Great Britain is gonna be a little different than how we treat some third world country.

• 1:41:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:41:39Speaker 05

  And what we're willing to do.

• 1:41:40Speaker 04

  And I'm not pearl clutching, like, oh, this is the, these guys are the mafia, I'm like, everyone's the mafia.

• 1:41:44Speaker 05

  Everyone's the mafia.

• 1:41:45Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:41:46Mark Gagnon?

  I, I hate when we get too far into Trumps, but this stuff is like, I feel he's moving in a way that's just like, so in your face. Before, it's like, rich people just paid behind the scenes, you didn't really know who was doing this shit.

• 1:41:59Speaker 05

  Now you think it's blatant?

• 1:42:00Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:00Speaker 05

  Like, what, what are the examples of that? I'm not saying you're wrong, but like.

• 1:42:03Mark Gagnon?

  The crypto coin thing. Like, where it's like.

• 1:42:06Speaker 05

  What do you do?

• 1:42:07Mark Gagnon?

  So now it's the top 50 holders get a meeting with Trump. That's just paying for access.

• 1:42:17Speaker 05

  So he's essentially selling access.

• 1:42:19Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:21Speaker 05

  Now, I guess.

• 1:42:22Mark Gagnon?

  That shit is a little crazy.

• 1:42:23Speaker 05

  So I, I agree with what you're saying, which is like, what you're doing is you're pulling away the curtain.

• 1:42:30Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:31Speaker 05

  And like.

• 1:42:32Mark Gagnon?

  And I don't know if that's good or bad.

• 1:42:33Speaker 05

  Well, well, the thing is that we like curtains.

• 1:42:38Speaker 05

  We like curtains. Curtains help everybody. They keep your private ship private and my private ship private. And what we do behind those curtains, nobody really knows about. And if people don't know about it, we can pretend it's not happening. And the reality is the rich people always paid for access. Goldman Sachs did it with Obama. Somebody, other company did it with Trump. Some other company did it with Kamala. Like, all these countries are paying for access. There's a reason why all those billionaire corporations were lined up behind Trump during the inauguration. And they gave him the million bucks seat. Like, they paid for access. But what he's saying is, hey, guys, we do pay for access here. And I think the American people are like, why don't you just lie to us? And do it like y'all did before. We don't want to think that that's how things work.

• 1:43:20Speaker 05

  So I know it seems like I'm probably defending him. I'm not. I agree. I like to think that there is no access paid for. The problem is, is that I wonder if him and other, I wonder if his administration specifically, since he was one of those people that paid for access. I wonder if he's like, doesn't everybody know this is how it works? Now we're just letting people pay for access.

• 1:43:43Mark Gagnon?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:44Speaker 05

  Maybe.

• 1:43:44Mark Gagnon?

  Maybe, yeah.

• 1:43:45Speaker 05

  I don't know.

• 1:43:45Mark Gagnon?

  That's why I asked the question. It's like, no judgment. I was like, I don't even know if it's a good thing or a bad thing. But it's just like, it's just so different than how things have always been done.

• 1:43:52Speaker 05

  You know what it is? It's like when you're at one of these fancy events and like, you know, somebody's like, somebody's eating their food the way you would just eat your fucking food. Like, if I got a chicken tender, I'm eating with my fingers. And all these other fancy people are like, why do they, we eat this with a fork and knife? It's like, you're only doing that because everybody else here would look at you funny. But when we're all home alone, we eat with our fingers. Now, I don't know if that's, I don't think that that's a good justification, by the way. I think that there should be no pay for access. I don't think it should be transparent, or I don't think it should be.

• 1:44:24Mark Gagnon?

  Behind the curtain face.

• 1:44:25Speaker 05

  Yeah, either way. So I get that reaction you have. You're like, what the fuck is happening over here? And I guess I just wonder if like, if they're going, yeah, this is how it is. We're just telling you.

• 1:44:37Mark Gagnon?

  Probably.

• 1:44:37Speaker 04

  Well, that's kind of the accelerationist thing, where it's like, there's people that don't like Trump that are like, it's good what he's doing, because he's airing it all out. And then hopefully people will see how corrupt everything is, and then we can. Fix it, but let him air it all out. Let him do all these things where they expose how corrupt everything is and what he's doing is wrong, but the next thing will be better because we can stop it.

• 1:44:56Speaker 05

  Oh, got it. So Trump is not airing it out in a way to expose other people. He's even exposing himself.

• 1:45:03Speaker 04

  Is what they would say.

• 1:45:04Speaker 05

  But through exposing himself, he is exposing the system that does exist just behind closed doors. And once we're all privy to the system that does exist.

• 1:45:12Speaker 04

  Then we could change it.

• 1:45:13Speaker 05

  Because that's what I feel like his administration does all the time. The second they do something with immigrants, they just go, oh, look how many immigrants. But I think Obama was like, I was Obama's wife, Michelle was like, uh, I was crying when I saw the deportations. And then they were like, your husband deported four million more people than he did, right? Like, and I think that's what the Republicans get a lot of wins on, is that the Democrats kind of virtue signal without reflecting on like what they've done. And then the Republicans come in and dunk. So what Mark is saying is like, the next 10 years or whatever it is could be a reflection of what both parties have done, either out in the open or behind closed doors. And then we as Americans get to go, yeah, we don't like any of that. That's ugly. You would hope we do that.

• 1:45:58Speaker 04

  Either fix it or put us more curtains.

• 1:46:01Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. Or I don't know, maybe what I'm curious what you think, like, do we just take all the curtains away? And just kind of be honest with who we are?

• 1:46:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if you can have a society function that way, though.

• 1:46:12Speaker 05

  Probably not.

• 1:46:13Speaker 04

  I have no idea. I don't know if any country has really done that where like all the curtains are off. Actually, this is the Vietnam thing. I'm watching that documentary on Netflix right now.

• 1:46:19Speaker 05

  I want to hear about that rat thing, too.

• 1:46:21Speaker 04

  Oh, my God, that shit is far.

• 1:46:22Speaker 05

  Did you get into that? Did you do the episode on it already? Okay. Does it conflict if we talk about it here?

• 1:46:28Speaker 04

  Not at all. But the Vietnam thing, like, they made an interesting point in the doc where they're like, that is the moment where America, all like the curtains started to tear. Like, that was the moment.

• 1:46:38Speaker 05

  Because right after World War II, I imagine like we are heroic, virtuous, benevolent, kind, caring. Our Americans died for other people to live, and there's nothing more beautiful than that.

• 1:46:49Speaker 04

  And then through the 50s, you got some Pacific Theater stuff, but it's like, oh, they're just patching up World War II. No one even really knows what's going on. And then Vietnam is the first moment where it's like, yes, we're gonna do it again. We're going back out and then they get out there and like, why are we, what are we doing? Why are we here? Like, what is the point of all this?

• 1:47:04Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:47:04Speaker 04

  And then you start to see like the, the tears come in, like all the conspiracy stuff comes in around that time. Like JFK, obviously the Gulf of Tonkin stuff.

• 1:47:12Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:47:12Speaker 04

  Like, what is, what is America actually?

• 1:47:14Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 1:47:15Speaker 04

  And is it good or bad? I don't know. You get like a rising conspiratorial thinking.

• 1:47:19Speaker 05

  I imagine.

• 1:47:19Speaker 04

  Or bad. I don't know.

• 1:47:21Speaker 05

  I imagine like upon learning these things, like during that time, I imagine upon like, once the, once you see terrors in that fabric, there's an extreme pendulum swing where everything becomes conspiracy, which is not dissimilar to kind of what's happening now. Which is like, whoa, we've seen some fabric terrors like big time. And then the conspiracy shit went crazy and the craziest version is flat earth like, but the fact that we could believe everything is a conspiracy. Like Bukelie said, they're smearing me and my knee jerk reaction was like, like that could happen. Like things have happened like that.

• 1:47:56Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:47:57Speaker 05

  Or he could just be selling the like.

• 1:47:59Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 1:48:01Speaker 05

  Okay. So that's, so that's Vietnam era disillusion.

• 1:48:06Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:48:08Speaker 05

  Have we ever recovered from that?

• 1:48:11Speaker 04

  I don't know. I'm, I mean, I don't, I mean, no. Like, I think the cracks are still there, but as long as everything's fine, you don't really notice.

• 1:48:18Speaker 05

  Yeah. You only notice the cracks when the, when the economy.

• 1:48:20Speaker 04

  I think we would have after nine 11, if they didn't expose the weapons of mass destruction stuff.

• 1:48:27Speaker 05

  If we, if we just went on believing it.

• 1:48:29Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:48:30Speaker 05

  The fact that there was this self-reflection going, hey, there were no weapons of mass destruction. What we did was fucked up and a bunch of these military companies got rich.

• 1:48:38Speaker 04

  Cause I've never saw the country together as one after nine 11. Everybody was like, American flags, pro America, everything, like everybody.

• 1:48:48Speaker 05

  I'm so diabolical. Now there's like a part of me that's even thinking like, the real puppet masters? Like when there's no actual bad guy for us to fight out there that's like threatening? Do we create internal bad guys?

• 1:49:02Speaker 05

  And then rebuke them as a country. Now we're united again, then a new internal bad guy. Rebuke united. So it's like weapons of mass destruction. That's bullshit. We're all coming down and we got that bad guy out of here. And now we're heroes of our own story. Without needing Hitler or without needing a Mussolini or without needing a Stalin. Was Stalin, weren't we kind of aligned though with Stalin?

• 1:49:29Speaker 04

  I mean, in World War Two, but then the Second World War ended.

• 1:49:32Speaker 05

  And now.

• 1:49:32Speaker 04

  He was the threat of communism.

• 1:49:34Speaker 05

  But I wonder if you're like doing like next level. What is that like country craft?

• 1:49:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, state craft.

• 1:49:42Speaker 05

  State craft.

• 1:49:43Speaker 04

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:49:44Speaker 05

  That's kind of scary.

• 1:49:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:49:48Speaker 05

  But that's probably the conversations they have. They're like, yeah, we got 350 million people. How do we get these people to just chill the fuck out?

• 1:49:53Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah. And then kind of like the movie, the movie studio thing, you probably have the real people that have like real honest opinions. Like we need to do this. And then you have the, you know, people at the top, maybe that are like, yeah, we just need to keep the money coming in. Keep everything moving economically. And then they kind of team up, push an ideology and they're like, yeah, we can, we can become number one with this.

• 1:50:11Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:50:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't know.

• 1:50:13Speaker 05

  Okay, tell me the rat thing.

• 1:50:14Speaker 04

  Here's the shortest version. Universe 25, you ever heard of this?

• 1:50:16Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:50:17Speaker 04

  This is an experiment that this guy did in the United States, the guy John Calhoun. And he was a researcher at the National Institute of Health. And basically he was doing these rat experiments where he was trying to see basically the effects of urbanization. So like post-World War Two, you have these cities propping up all over the country. They're like expanding. You got New York, Chicago, LA, they're becoming these massive hubs where people are living in these small, tiny little apartments. And basically he was doing these rat experiments to see if you had all your resources met. You had food, you had housing, all that stuff, just by overpopulation, would it lead to social decay? And so he takes.

• 1:50:46Speaker 05

  So real, real quick, because I think it's really important. There's enough food.

• 1:50:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:50:52Speaker 05

  There's enough shelter. Okay, so you are met with everything you need or we thought that you needed to thrive.

• 1:51:00Speaker 04

  Yeah. So he creates what he calls the rat utopia or the mouse utopia where it's 10 square feet. And they have all the food possible. They have all these compartments. It has a holding capacity of 3,000 mice. He drops eight of them. There with like robust DNA that they can procreate effectively. And for a hundred days, they just start, you know, banging, just mouse sex everywhere. They have a bunch of kids. And then slowly, things start to decline. So around like two years in, it's like a 600 day, or it's like a five year experiment.

• 1:51:29Speaker 05

  They're all helping each other. They're living great. There's like, there's, everybody's happy.

• 1:51:32Speaker 04

  And everyone's cooperating. So like the mothers take care of the kids. The, the males are like protecting their families, da da da. And then at a certain point, at like a thousand rats or a thousand mice, it starts to fall apart. Where now there's conflict and around like these high traffic zones. So like whenever the mice are coming into contact to each other, they're like hyper aggressive. And then the female mice are not protecting their young. And then they start getting into cannibalism. And the mice are actually eating each other.

• 1:51:58Speaker 05

  When they don't have to, there's enough food.

• 1:51:59Speaker 04

  There's enough food.

• 1:52:00Mark Gagnon?

  Oh, even when the population grew, they just kept the food at a level where everybody, oh.

• 1:52:04Speaker 04

  There's enough food for every mouse. So every time a new mouse is born, they inject more food, more food, more food. So everyone has enough food.

• 1:52:10Speaker 05

  But they're still fighting.

• 1:52:11Speaker 04

  And they're still fighting. And then they're creating.

• 1:52:13Speaker 05

  Tribalizing, right?

• 1:52:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. And like they have all their different compartments. They can all spread out. And then at these food centers, that if they're these like high traffic zones, they start to get aggressive. And then it goes even further. Once they get to like 2,000, the birth rate starts to drop. They stop procreating. Mothers start, stop protecting their kids. At certain parts of it, there's a 90% mortality rate of young because mothers are not protecting their kids. And so then you have hyper aggression from the males, lack of maternalism from the females. And then the most interesting part is that you get some of the mice that become socially detached. So he calls it in the experiment, the beautiful ones. And there's an interesting parallel with Japan. So the beautiful ones in the experiment are these mice that basically just checked out. They had food, they would go in their little compartments and they would just groom themselves like neurotically.

• 1:52:58Speaker 04

  And they were pristine. They were like the most beautiful mice of the whole thing. Some of them were like, you know, chewed up and eaten up and battles and stuff. These ones were just fully detached. They're like, they had nothing to do with the society. Now, there's a thing happening in Japan right now, the Hokumori, if you can look it up. And basically it's a group of people in Japan that have kind of like dubbed themselves these like detached people of society that don't really participate. They get like some assistance from the government and they just kind of like live in their houses and they don't really go out. And they are completely isolated from any type of community. And as a result, that, yeah, the, the Haikyomori.

• 1:53:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, Haikyomori.

• 1:53:31Speaker 04

  And they just leave in extreme isolation. And people pointed to this, be like, this is basically the beautiful ones of the experiment. They just kind of detached fully from society.

• 1:53:39Speaker 05

  But I would also imagine that the birth rate decline mirrors the decline of birth rates in urban centers.

• 1:53:46Speaker 04

  Right. What people have said.

• 1:53:48Speaker 05

  Yeah. The violence, it's like, it's not like, and again, I can't speak for everyone in New York, but it's not like people, like, I see fat homeless people here, you know, like, you'd be like, there's food here, there's food centers, it's not like there's starvation happening. Yes, there are people that are worried about their next meal, but it's different than in third world countries, let's put it that way. And there is access to resources if you need it here. So, but you still see this, like, reduction in birth rate, you still see the tribalism, you still see like-

• 1:54:16Speaker 04

  Hyperaggression.

• 1:54:17Speaker 05

  Hyperaggression. And it's funny that, like, it's not about resources, it could be simply about proximity and how humans interact with one another when there's too many of us in too small space. We're not just fighting over fucking gold or water or food. It's simply, we're not supposed to be around each other like this. It could literally be that.

• 1:54:38Speaker 04

  Yeah. And so the eventual conclusion of the experiment, it didn't even get to the holding capacity, it got to like 2,300, 2,400, and then the numbers started going down, they stopped reproducing, until eventually the whole society just fell out. They call it the behavioral sink. Behavioral sink is just the whole thing basically just like crashed down. And the interesting part is they took some of the mice out and put them into normal enclosures, and even the mice that they took out never adapted to the new enclosures. They continued to have aggressive tendencies or non maternalistic tendencies. And so they still had the maladaptive behavior from the original experiment. And then the kids of the mice with maladaptive behaviors continued to have hyperaggressive tendencies. And so there was like an epigenetic problem within the mice where they could prolong the, the effects.

• 1:55:18Speaker 05

  This is actually something we could, we should talk to Atiya about, with the epigenetic effects, like where you could potentially pass on trauma. This is really interesting.

• 1:55:30Speaker 05

  Uh, women are born with all the eggs that they'll have throughout their menstrual cycles. Therefore, they're less susceptible to epigenetic factors. Meaning, like, whatever's happening in your environment and how it influences you, what you pass on. Since they're born with all the eggs that they'll have, it's harder to transform those eggs and then pass on those genetic differences. What essentially is happening is all of evolution is happening through sperm. So the things that happen to the male, remember, we reproduce sperm every five days or whatever it is. Like, you bust a few loads and then you continue having. So the things that are happening to in your life, that are impacting your life, the food that you're eating,

• 1:56:11Speaker 05

  the environments you're in, the things you're experiencing, you could say it is passed through to your young through the male. Because that sperm can be manipulated by the microplastics or all these other things that are happening in the world. Kind of interesting that, like, evolution is dependent on the man.

• 1:56:28Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:56:29Speaker 05

  You know what I mean?

• 1:56:30Speaker 04

  It is happening to women just at a much slower rate.

• 1:56:33Speaker 05

  Not saying that these things aren't affecting them. They 100% are, but they're not changing the eggs in real time.

• 1:56:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:56:41Speaker 05

  Whereas, like, the sperm can be changed, like, month by month.

• 1:56:45Speaker 04

  Generation.

• 1:56:46Speaker 05

  Yeah. It's just kind of a crazy thing.

• 1:56:48Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:56:49Speaker 05

  Like, I don't know if this works, but, like, you go into war and coming back and carrying that trauma. I don't know how that affects your sperm. I don't know. But if there is some sort of societal or environmental effect on your sperm, and it could impact it, like, is there a point where you go, I think you gotta hold off five years?

• 1:57:06Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:57:07Speaker 05

  So you can work through this stuff that's in your body. Like, you were exposed to this thing in at war. It could be Agent Orange or whatever like that. That's gonna be in your sperm? Or you were addicted to heroin for X amount of years? Like, you need to flush whatever you got out before that same thing gets passed on.

• 1:57:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:57:22Speaker 05

  I don't know if the research has been done to that level, but it's kind of cool to think about.

• 1:57:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, I've even read some stuff like epigenetics. Again, this might be pseudoscience, but like...

• 1:57:31Speaker 05

  Epigenetics is environment, right? It's just like...

• 1:57:35Speaker 04

  Epigenetics, as I understood it, is like basically passing on genes and... Having traits in your young that are environmental from the parents.

• 1:57:43Speaker 05

  Right.

• 1:57:44Speaker 04

  So it's basically like if the parents experience something, it's possible to genetically pass it on.

• 1:57:48Speaker 05

  That's just what I want to clarify. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:57:49Speaker 04

  But like through like emotional shit, where like high stress environments, like high anxiety parents, having children in high anxiety times could create high anxiety children, even if they're no longer anxious or raised in a non-anxious environment. I don't know necessarily what the data is on the current science, but I've heard these.

• 1:58:04Speaker 05

  This is the coolest shit to learn about, though.

• 1:58:06Speaker 04

  Yeah, we should talk to it too about it.

• 1:58:07Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:58:08Mark Gagnon?

  Just one thing on the rat experiment. I feel like people in condensed areas tend to be a bit more open-minded and liberal towards other people because of the close conflicts.

• 1:58:22Speaker 05

  Hundred percent.

• 1:58:22Mark Gagnon?

  Isn't that like going against what happened in that experiment?

• 1:58:27Speaker 04

  Critics of the experiment would be like a few things. One, humans are mice. That's the opposite one. Like they don't have the consciousness or like the ability to like discern threat or not. They're just kind of acting on it.

• 1:58:36Speaker 05

  Probably have lower capacity to change intellectualized situations.

• 1:58:40Speaker 04

  And then additionally, people said that this is not a utopia. He called it a rat utopia. They're like, there's there's high density channels where people are bumping into each other. There's intentional conflict on these frequency corridors.

• 1:58:52Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:58:52Speaker 04

  Where, one, if you can build an urban design well enough, you can decrease that. And two, in the wild, mice, when they're experiencing a threat, are gonna run. They're not gonna fight.

• 1:59:00Speaker 05

  And if you have no place to run.

• 1:59:02Speaker 04

  Exactly. They're fighting because they're in an enclosure. Gotcha.

• 1:59:04Speaker 05

  That's, that's a good, that's a very important point.

• 1:59:06Speaker 04

  You can leave a city, you know, like you can run away from a conflict, things like that.

• 1:59:09Speaker 05

  To wrap this up, go, go. Exactly.

• 1:59:12Speaker 04

  More so.

• 1:59:12Mark Gagnon?

  Nicely ranging.

• 1:59:13Speaker 04

  But as a result, policymakers have taken the experiment and applied it to like theme park design, jails, all that kind of stuff.

• 1:59:18Speaker 05

  Smart.

• 1:59:19Speaker 04

  Where they're like, okay, in the experiment, there's only four zones where like they can get food, something like that. And now they're like, disperse it, put it all over. So like now, theme parks will have food, like tiny little like 50 person stands all over, rather than one giant spot where everyone can get food because they're trying to lower contact and.

• 1:59:36Speaker 05

  I would also say like another criticism of the, of the experiment and why you can't exactly compare it to the urban centers in America is that like, and maybe this is why the urban centers continue to thrive, is because people move here. If it was just us. It would fall apart. I genuinely believe that. And I think a lot of us end up moving out. Like, a lot of my friends that grew up in New York, like, have just moved. They went to the suburbs. They don't go too far, but they get out of it. They get out of the rat race. And, like, even, like, you know, I mean, your sister went to Philly.

• 2:00:10Speaker 04

  Yeah, but ever since she was young, she never liked being around people. Like, she was a suburban person.

• 2:00:16Speaker 05

  Right. I mean, you guys grew up in a beach community, so there is a...

• 2:00:21Speaker 05

  She's probably searching for that. But, but, but in all, in all seriousness, I think that what allows these urban centers to continue this inorganic way of living is this influx of new people hopping on to the American dream.

• 2:00:34Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:00:34Speaker 05

  And I don't know if it was just us. Like, I think about this a lot. Like, we're used to it and we're accustomed to it, but it is unnatural.

• 2:00:42Speaker 04

  Well, then you look at Japan, you're like, okay, very low immigration, very low immigration.

• 2:00:46Speaker 05

  And what's happening?

• 2:00:47Speaker 04

  And now are you experiencing societal collapse? Are they having this super low birth rate? Are they having this social detachment?

• 2:00:52Speaker 05

  And they are, right?

• 2:00:52Speaker 04

  That's what people would say. And what is the eventual fallout of that? What is the conclusion of that? According to these experiments, not great. Yeah, just send some Mexicans, man.

• 2:01:03Speaker 05

  Yeah, we love y'all. We appreciate you, man, and we're gonna see you next week.

• 2:01:07Speaker 04

  Peace.

• 2:01:09Speaker 00

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