TBT: Kail Lowry

Throwback Thursday Get ready for an unfiltered conversation as Bunnie welcomes the unstoppable force of content creation, Kail Lowry. Kail opens up about her unexpected start on Teen Mom at just 16, dealing with the harsh realities of fame, and the challenges of navigating toxic relationships and divorce. She shares her raw and honest journey of growth, resilience, and embracing motherhood, and maybe a little sneak peek of what's coming up in her world next. Kail doesn't hold back on discussing her battles with mental illness, the transformative power of embracing her truth, and even her thoughts on plastic surgery. You'll understand why Bunnie loves and vibes with her! Kail Lowry: https://www.kaillowry.com/ Watch Full Episodes & More: www.dumbblondeunrated.com

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Bunnie XO?

  What's up, guys? Don't forget to sub to Patreon so that you can see the visuals, because not only do we have episodes of the podcast, we have exclusive content that nobody else sees on any other apps, behind the scenes, photo shoots, and we're dropping a whole bunch of surprising stuff this year. So if you guys don't want to miss out and you want to be the first to know, go over to our Patreon, www.dumbblondeunrated.com. Love ya. Is this thing on?

• 0:29Speaker 01

  All right, gentlemen, coming to main stage next. This is Bunny. Get up there. She's got a tornado of titties coming your way. Get those dollar bills ready. She's got an ass that shakes like Michael J. Fox. So get up there and throw, throw, throw them dollars.

• 0:42Bunnie XO?

  Dude, that is fucking iconic. What's up, you sexy motherfuckers? Welcome to another episode of Dumb Blonde. Today, we have a social media and reality TV star. How's that for an intro?

• 0:54Speaker 02

  That's an intro. That's an intro.

• 0:56Bunnie XO?

  Kail Lowry, how you doing, baby?

• 0:58Speaker 02

  I'm good. How are you?

• 0:59Bunnie XO?

  Dude, I'm good. So she walked in, she's wearing a Metallica shirt. And for those of you who can't see, I'm wearing a Metallica shirt myself also. So I was like, as soon as she walked in, I was like, fucking soul sister. I was like, yeah. So what are you doing out here?

• 1:13Speaker 02

  Uh, so I have three podcasts and we did-

• 1:15Bunnie XO?

  Hold on, stop right there. Are you a psychopath?

• 1:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18Bunnie XO?

  Okay, three fucking podcasts? Like, I have one and it, I'm tired of it. Like, literally, I don't know how you're doing three.

• 1:26Speaker 02

  They're so different that I feel like I have, like, um, I don't know, I don't know how to just, how to describe it. So one of my podcast co-hosts lives in Atlanta. So we met in Nashville for content. Um, and it's hard because my co-hosts aren't, they're all over. I have one in Delaware, one by myself, and then one with one in Atlanta.

• 1:43Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 1:44Speaker 02

  So it's just a mess.

• 1:45Bunnie XO?

  I don't know how you keep up with all the content, because I'm working my ass off and I couldn't imagine having to put out three podcasts, all the social media content you do, being a mom, fucking, I mean, take, like, how do you do this?

• 2:00Speaker 02

  Kristen.

• 2:01Bunnie XO?

  Is that your assistant?

• 2:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:04Bunnie XO?

  Does she run your socia's or do you pretty much tell her what to put?

• 2:07Speaker 02

  We do, we, it's, we tag team. Like if I can't get to it, or she knows that I have an appointment, or I'm doing something else, she'll post. But um, like she doesn't read my DMs or anything.

• 2:15Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 2:16Speaker 02

  Like I'll do that.

• 2:17Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, no, it's definitely, I know I run all my shit too, and Mimi helps me with mine. And there's some days that I'm just like, I don't want to fucking post.

• 2:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, that's me right now. I'm like, can you just do my stories? Cause I don't want to do them. Like I just don't feel like it.

• 2:29Bunnie XO?

  You just, let's, let's touch on that really quick. Cause you just got back from Thailand, right? I saw that trip. It looked amazing. I love that you have been so open with your mental, mental illness battle. Because I'm very open about it too.

• 2:42Speaker 02

  It's so hard.

• 2:43Bunnie XO?

  Talk to me about it.

• 2:44Speaker 02

  So last year, I around, I would say around this time, maybe March, I, I just broke down. I was super suicidal and between Kristen and one of my other girlfriends, they were like, we have to get you into the doctor. Like this, this can't go any further. And um, we made an appointment. Um, my girlfriend Natalie came with me and they put me on antidepressants and they were like, you gotta try this. Um, and I, you know, when the first one didn't work, I had to be open for the next one. And it's been really hard because I never thought that it would get to a point where it would be unmanageable. Cause I was kind of just handling it myself and like going through the ebbs and flows with it.

• 3:21Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 3:21Speaker 02

  Um, and then, once I got on a medication, I'm on Lexapro now and it started working. I just felt like myself again. And it was so crazy because I never thought that I would feel like myself again.

• 3:33Bunnie XO?

  I completely 100% relate to that. I went sober in 2017 off pills, sober off alcohol in 2018.

• 3:39Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 3:40Bunnie XO?

  Had my first bout of suicidal depression in 2020. And when you, I say that you feel like your soul is tired.

• 3:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:47Bunnie XO?

  Like you don't want to be here anymore.

• 3:49Speaker 02

  It's a tired that sleep can't fix.

• 3:51Bunnie XO?

  At all.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  Like, and

• 3:53Bunnie XO?

  It's a scary tired.

• 3:54Speaker 02

  It's so scary because you know, before I went through it, I was just kind of like, I guess I looked at, uh, you know, suicide and things like that. Like it I I couldn't understand it.

• 4:05Speaker 02

  Yes, and it didn't make sense to me. So when I finally went through it and then I came out of it, I was like, wow, that is a different type of tired. Um, and you can't, you can't fix it by yourself sometimes.

• 4:16Bunnie XO?

  Do you feel like it might have been postpartum for you?

• 4:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, um, cause my fourth pregnancy with, you know, an ex of mine was very, very traumatic and the pregnancy alone wasn't planned and it was just a lot. And I think that was like the onset of it. So then when after I had him, I think the postpartum kind of went untreated for some time and developed into some other things. So it was really difficult, but I'm, I'm happy that I was able to make it through.

• 4:42Bunnie XO?

  I love that. So when you were going out to Thailand, you look like you were just living your best life. Yeah. Well, how was that? Cause I've always wanted to go to Thailand.

• 4:50Speaker 02

  First of all, you have to go.

• 4:51Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 4:52Speaker 02

  You have to go. If, if you, if it's on your bucket list, go.

• 4:55Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 4:55Speaker 02

  Um, I canceled the trip that I was supposed to go on the year prior because of depression. So when I finally got there, the entire time I just kept saying, I can't believe I'm here. Like I cannot believe I was here. Um, and it was the most, I did so much. I think every single day I had multiple excursions because I was like, I need to make the best of this trip. Like I have to do this.

• 5:15Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 5:16Speaker 02

  Um, and it was really cool. And I took, I took Natalie with me and, um, she's also my nanny for my kids. So we don't get to do trips together or anything. And it was nice to have her, you know, we had a trip together without the kids.

• 5:27Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. No, I, I mean, you've got four.

• 5:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:30Bunnie XO?

  So I'm sure that was much. Um, I, I love that you say that you can't, I, I don't love it, but you saying that you canceled a trip because of depression. Like I think people need to hear that because I literally live my life around my anxiety. Like even sitting right here, I'm like having trouble breathing. Like, you know, people don't realize when you're battling mental illness, it is a battle every single day to even get out of bed, to work, to do your makeup, to like do anything. So I think when people get to see women like you who are so strong, so resilient, been through so much shit, be able to say, hey, you know what? I canceled a trip this year, but I went the next year and be able to see that. Like, I think that's what women need as role models nowadays, especially, you know?

• 6:15Speaker 02

  I canceled it literally the day before I was supposed to leave.

• 6:17Bunnie XO?

  That's, that's not what I would do. Literally, I try to cancel podcasts all the time. Maybe he's like, no, you're not doing it.

• 6:23Speaker 02

  And it was, it wasn't because I didn't want to go. It was, it was the depression, right? Because I, I'm obsessed with travel. Like, that's like my thing and people know me for traveling. And I just couldn't. I was like this, I, I cannot go. I cannot physically pack my bag and get on a plane and go. I just wasn't into it. So, but we made it happen.

• 6:41Bunnie XO?

  I love that you were able to go and get through that. So let's rewind it back. Um, speaking of trauma, let's talk about your relationship with your mom. I think I saw some things online that you guys just really, uh, uh, there was a lot of similarities between my mom and your mom.

• 6:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:55Bunnie XO?

  That just kind of triggered me a little bit. Like, can we talk about it?

• 6:59Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, I haven't talked to my mom in years. I haven't seen her since 2016. Um, I don't know where she lives. I don't know what she does. I don't know anything. So, and then she doesn't know where I am. I don't think.

• 7:12Bunnie XO?

  Was she, when you were a child growing up, like what was your guys' relationship like?

• 7:16Speaker 02

  Um, I didn't always live with her. I kind of bounced around a lot. I was with like family members, my grandparents, friends. Um, and she, she's really struggled with addiction my whole life. And so it was one of those things where as a child, I longed for my mom. I wanted my mom to be there. I wanted her to be sober. I wanted her to be present, but she, she couldn't.

• 7:34Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 7:34Speaker 02

  So, um, when I got pregnant at sixteen, seventeen with Isaac, that was kind of her out. And she was like, you know, I'm wiping my hands clean of this. And, you know, she never really was trying to be a mother to me ever again.

• 7:50Bunnie XO?

  Where was dad?

• 7:51Speaker 02

  I met him on sixteen and pregnant in 2010. So I, that was the first and only time I ever met him.

• 7:56Bunnie XO?

  Wow. And he never came back around after that?

• 7:58Speaker 02

  I mean, he actually emailed me while I was in Thailand and said, happy birthday. And I, I opened it and I was like, what in the fuck is this?

• 8:06Bunnie XO?

  You're like, surprise, shorty. It's dad.

• 8:09Speaker 02

  He was like, love you dad. And I was like, you're not my dad. I don't know you.

• 8:14Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 8:14Speaker 02

  Like, I have no idea who you are.

• 8:16Bunnie XO?

  So who, growing up, who was like your parental figure? Who did you look up to?

• 8:21Speaker 02

  There was so much, like, I, I spent a lot of time with my grandparents. Um, and then, you know, as they get older, they couldn't keep up as much. So I really bounced around with friends. Like their, their families took me in. Um, and I spent a lot of time with friends and, and my mom would drop me off and leave me for days, weeks on end. And never even so much as call. Um, and now I look at it back and I'm just kind of like, she, she couldn't. Where before I would be mad, you know, I would be really upset and not understand. But as an adult, I mean, she's just battling her own stuff.

• 8:52Bunnie XO?

  And she just never got it together. I hate that.

• 8:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:55Bunnie XO?

  That's terrible.

• 8:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:57Bunnie XO?

  So, growing up, you had, you know, you were at multiple family houses, you know, you're back and forth. How were you doing in school? Like, were you always a studious, you know, kid? Or were you like more of just like rebellious, like fuck this, I'm just gonna do my own thing?

• 9:10Speaker 02

  A little bit of both. So there was a little, like, I remember specifically in fourth grade, like, being at school was what I looked forward to because it was kind of taking me out of being at home. Um, and I really, fourth grade, I was like, I'm getting this perfect attendance award. Like, I have to do this. Um, but then as I got older, I started to rebel a lot. You know, I got kicked out of high school, so I had to go to another school. Uh, my foster family at that point was like,

• 9:35Bunnie XO?

  Were you doing drugs and drinking?

• 9:36Speaker 02

  I smoked a lot of weed, but I never drank because that was my mom's, like, first, like, alcohol was her drug of choice. And then she dabbled in other things. So I, I have always really stayed away from alcohol.

• 9:48Bunnie XO?

  When, okay, so you were on Teen Mom when you were sixteen?

• 9:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:53Bunnie XO?

  How did that come about? I just want to touch base on it. I kind of want people to know your story, but that's such a big part of your story, you know?

• 10:00Speaker 02

  Yeah. So whenever I was pregnant with my oldest son, I saw the first season of Sixteen and Pregnant on MTV. And at the time, I was living in this, like, two-bedroom apartment with my mom in the middle of Pennsylvania. And, um,

• 10:18Speaker 02

  I went on MTV.com and it was like casting and I was like, well, this is weird. So I just clicked on it and I put in my story that like my mom's never around and I'm pregnant and I'm here. Um, they called me about two weeks later and they picked me and I was just like, I didn't really say anything. So like, what is the basis? But I guess they were interested. So.

• 10:38Bunnie XO?

  It's like divine intervention.

• 10:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:40Bunnie XO?

  Literally.

• 10:40Speaker 02

  So weird.

• 10:41Bunnie XO?

  The childhood that you had led you on this path of

• 10:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:46Bunnie XO?

  Just like beginning your entire journey in front of the world.

• 10:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:50Bunnie XO?

  Like, that's fucking crazy. So take me, go ahead.

• 10:53Speaker 02

  I was gonna say, like, just to think about signing these contracts when I was seventeen years old.

• 10:58Bunnie XO?

  With no parental guidance?

• 10:59Speaker 02

  No parental guidance, no lawyers. I think like sane people would have lawyers look over their contracts.

• 11:05Bunnie XO?

  How did, how was that approved by MTV if?

• 11:08Speaker 02

  They just said if my mom, if my mom signed off for me, it was fine.

• 11:12Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 11:13Speaker 02

  And so my mom signed off on that and was like, I'm also done with custody and signed it off.

• 11:18Bunnie XO?

  To who?

• 11:19Speaker 02

  To my boyfriend's parents.

• 11:21Bunnie XO?

  Okay, gotcha.

• 11:22Speaker 02

  So then I moved in with them full time.

• 11:23Bunnie XO?

  Right. And then his mom was kind of crazy, right?

• 11:26Speaker 02

  Well, she

• 11:27Bunnie XO?

  Was that, that way, okay. So you're, you moved in with Joe's parents?

• 11:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. And they were like sane and like normal.

• 11:32Bunnie XO?

  Right. And then Javi's mom is the crazy one. Somebody's mom is crazy.

• 11:35Speaker 02

  Who's, my mom's crazy.

• 11:36Bunnie XO?

  Okay, maybe that's what it was. Somebody's mom was crazy. Like I said, I didn't follow the, um, the teen mom thing. Like that was never my jam. But I do know, I did watch like the first, I think, one or two seasons. I think after you and Javi, I kind of like fell off. I, I just was out running the streets doing drugs. Um, but yeah, so, yeah, exactly. Just doing drugs. Um, so you are seventeen, your mom signs off on custody of you, you're pregnant, you're living with your boyfriend. Take me on this journey.

• 12:05Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I, I just didn't, I didn't know what I was gonna do, right? So, um, this, at this time, I switched high schools. I got kicked out of the first one. I went to the second one. And thankfully, because of their credit system, the second high school that I went to, I needed less credits to graduate. And so I was able to graduate in January of my, of my senior year. So I was Also do in February, so it worked out perfectly. And then I got to walk with my class in June. At that time, right, like right up to leading up to my pregnancy, I was doing really well. Like that switch of high schools really turned my life around. And I mean, aside from having sex. I played lacrosse. I was getting good grades and you know, I was really starting to be on the right track.

• 12:48Speaker 02

  And then, you know, I, I think it was more so me wanting to get, seek attention from men.

• 12:54Bunnie XO?

  Right. You were trying to find love from the people that never showed you love.

• 12:57Speaker 02

  Joe's, Joe's mom did not want us together. He wanted him to, you know, focus on school, maybe go to college, do those things. And so he, she really didn't want us together, but.

• 13:06Bunnie XO?

  Joe always reminded me of an old man, even, even young. He was like a grumpy old man. You know, am I wrong?

• 13:12Speaker 02

  No.

• 13:13Bunnie XO?

  Like literally, like he just, I remember him always just being grumpy about something or looking grumpy.

• 13:18Speaker 02

  The look.

• 13:18Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, it's the look. Yeah, for sure. So you have your first baby, your mom's not there.

• 13:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:24Bunnie XO?

  She did, she didn't show up.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  She came to the birth.

• 13:26Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 13:26Speaker 02

  She did come to the birth because um, I went into labor and nobody was around. They were all working in another state. And so I was by myself. I called her, she did come. Um, and then after the birth, I don't really remember her coming around too much. Until Joe and I broke up and I had nowhere to go.

• 13:42Bunnie XO?

  How did you figure out how to be a mom? Did it just kick in?

• 13:45Speaker 02

  No, I think I went through some shit then too, because I remember sleeping on like the nursery floor. And Joe's dad came in and was like, you have to leave this room. Like you need to get up, take a shower and leave this room. But I just like was struggling.

• 13:59Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, depression.

• 14:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think so. I mean, I don't know for sure because I never got treatment back then.

• 14:04Bunnie XO?

  Baby too, so you didn't know what to look for.

• 14:06Speaker 02

  I don't even know if I had health insurance. Like, I don't even know.

• 14:09Bunnie XO?

  She's like, I'm just having kids.

• 14:10Speaker 02

  I was just having babies.

• 14:12Bunnie XO?

  That's so, isn't it crazy that we can go through like traumatic ass shit and as kids and we're just like, I don't know how I got through it, but I fucking did it. Like it's like, we're wired to survive.

• 14:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:22Bunnie XO?

  The human body is just wired to go.

• 14:24Speaker 02

  Well, it's like surviving off of, you, you survive through survival or you survive off love. And I think you and I come from just surviving.

• 14:32Bunnie XO?

  Oh yeah, absolutely.

• 14:34Speaker 02

  Pure survival.

• 14:34Bunnie XO?

  No, like I'm, I am a fighter by nature. So just everything I've been through, I automatically just want to fight. And I have an Aries moon, so I'm really fucking toxic.

• 14:44Speaker 02

  I have a Leo moon, so I'm also toxic.

• 14:46Bunnie XO?

  I love that. When is your birthday?

• 14:48Speaker 02

  March fourteenth.

• 14:49Bunnie XO?

  Okay, so you're a Pisces with a Leo moon. Ooh, spicy.

• 14:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:52Bunnie XO?

  That's crazy because water puts the fire out. So you're probably constantly at war with yourself.

• 14:56Speaker 02

  Always at war with myself, all day long.

• 14:58Bunnie XO?

  God, that's brutal.

• 14:59Speaker 02

  It's horrible.

• 14:59Bunnie XO?

  I want, I want to hug you. It's brutal, baby. So moving on, you have your baby, you're living with Joe, you're on this fucking show. What is it like doing this in front of millions of people? Did you think that all this shit was gonna come with it?

• 15:14Speaker 02

  Absolutely not.

• 15:14Bunnie XO?

  Like all the people, I mean, you guys have some crazy fucking haters.

• 15:17Speaker 02

  Oh, my God. They're cult-like haters.

• 15:19Bunnie XO?

  I had Janelle on the podcast.

• 15:21Speaker 02

  Oh, did you?

• 15:21Bunnie XO?

  Years ago, like three or four years ago. And I'm telling you, the backlash I got, it was fucking nuts. But I, I didn't care because, I mean, everybody has a story and they deserve to tell their story. But you guys have like this cult, crazed, demonic fanbase. Like, they love the shit out of you or they hate the shit. Yeah. Like, it's, and, and it's weird to me because at the time that you guys are on the show, you guys are babies, kids.

• 15:47Speaker 02

  But they're judging the fuck out of us. I remember one time I was warming up. It was my transition between breastfeeding and formula feeding. And I remember there's like a scene of me heating it up in the microwave. I got attacked like I was the world's worst person because I put it in the, I didn't know any better. I was just doing the best I fucking could. I had no fucking clue what I was doing. Nobody was helping me. Nobody told me. I mean, not, I love Joe's parents to death, but they didn't tell me you can't put formula in the microwave.

• 16:13Bunnie XO?

  I didn't know you couldn't put formula in the microwave. I just learned that right now.

• 16:17Speaker 02

  I had no idea.

• 16:19Bunnie XO?

  No fucking idea.

• 16:20Speaker 02

  So what do you want me to do? And these people are attacking me online, but you know, the thing that sold me for, you know, Teen Mom from Sixteen and Pregnant was the paycheck.

• 16:29Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 16:30Speaker 02

  Um, we, we made $5,000 off of one episode of Sixteen and Pregnant, and that was it. $5,000. And that's before taxes.

• 16:37Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 16:38Speaker 02

  So we exploited our entire life during this teen pregnancy for $5,000.

• 16:43Bunnie XO?

  Very crucial moments of your life.

• 16:45Speaker 02

  I bought a piece of junk car just to be able to get around. I worked two jobs. I went to school. And nobody looked at that. It was just the fact that I heated up the fucking formula and may or may not have eventually cheated on whoever at the time. You know what I mean? So those were, you're a horrible person and you belong in hell.

• 17:03Bunnie XO?

  I I just peo- I can't with the internet, but I I love that you brought up the fact of cheating. Cause I do see a pattern, like when you're in relationships and it's almost like you self sabotage.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  Oh, a hundred percent.

• 17:14Bunnie XO?

  You feel like you do that? Do you think that is because of how you're, you know, your upbringing and the trauma from your mom and your dad? So it's like, I'm gonna hurt you before you can hurt me.

• 17:22Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 17:23Bunnie XO?

  Cause I was always the cheater too.

• 17:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, I've been cheated on.

• 17:26Bunnie XO?

  Oh, me too. I, well, my thing is, is I push men until they cheat on me and then I'm like, oh, I'm out of here. You know, like, oh, oh, how dare you, even though I fucking drove you to this.

• 17:35Speaker 02

  Yes, yeah, no, I'm there. I didn't cheat on Joe. Oh, I'm lying. I did cheat on Joe. I definitely cheated on Joe. Wait, was it Joe? No, Jordan. I cheated on Jordan. I cheated on Jordan. I didn't cheat on Joe.

• 17:47Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 17:48Speaker 02

  Um, but I got a lot of shit. I get a lot of shit because I do cheat, but I have cheated, but I also leave if I'm not satisfied or happy. And I think that people don't like that.

• 17:59Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 18:00Speaker 02

  People don't like that I leave. I'm not gonna stay somewhere that I'm not happy.

• 18:04Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 18:04Speaker 02

  And so it does kind of look like.

• 18:06Bunnie XO?

  As you shouldn't.

• 18:06Speaker 02

  Right. And so it does kind of look like a revolving door of men, but also I know when and when not to introduce them to my kids. I know, you know, and there's people who date all the time and they don't get shit for it.

• 18:17Bunnie XO?

  Well, has anybody ever stopped to think that maybe you, and this is just me observing, you are attracted to a certain type of man, so you're repeating cycles with each relationship that you get into. And you know, until you're old enough to really start healing and understanding the healing journey.

• 18:33Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 18:33Bunnie XO?

  You're never gonna be able to fix behaviors that you, you know, you're never gonna be able to unlearn behaviors that you learned as a child until you actually go down that road.

• 18:43Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:43Bunnie XO?

  You know, so you're getting into these relationships and it's the same dude, but a different body. And you're literally just repeating a cycle.

• 18:50Speaker 02

  A hundred percent.

• 18:51Bunnie XO?

  People don't look at it like that.

• 18:52Speaker 02

  They don't.

• 18:52Bunnie XO?

  You know?

• 18:53Speaker 02

  And I think they also are missing the childhood part because MTV never focused on that aspect.

• 18:58Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 18:58Speaker 02

  And that's really hard because in order for you to understand someone's actions today, you do kind of have to look to their past to a certain degree. I mean, you can't use that as an excuse forever. Like, I wouldn't use it as an excuse now.

• 19:09Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  But when I'm seventeen, eighteen, nineteen, of course. My childhood influenced that.

• 19:15Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, for sure. One hundred percent. So, moving on from Joe, you meet, you have Lincoln or Jordan?

• 19:23Speaker 02

  I dated, I dated Jordan after Joe.

• 19:25Bunnie XO?

  Joe's your first baby daddy, right?

• 19:27Speaker 02

  I didn't have any kids with Jordan, but that was like a big story.

• 19:29Bunnie XO?

  Gotcha.

• 19:30Speaker 02

  Um, and then I had Javi, which we got married.

• 19:32Bunnie XO?

  Okay, gotcha. So you had Lincoln with Joe.

• 19:35Speaker 02

  I had Isaac with Joe.

• 19:36Bunnie XO?

  Isaac with Joe.

• 19:37Speaker 02

  Lincoln with Javi.

• 19:38Bunnie XO?

  Sorry, I'm gonna get the kids, I'm gonna get the kids down, I promise, guys. Alright, so you had Isaac with Joe and then you dated Jordan? Why was that? Why do you think that was such a big scandal for you?

• 19:48Speaker 02

  Because I, so Jordan, I cheated on Jordan with Joe.

• 19:52Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 19:53Speaker 02

  Um, Jordan caught us, like, literally in the act. And then.

• 19:57Bunnie XO?

  Nice. So like, literally just getting banged out?

• 20:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, in the shower.

• 20:02Bunnie XO?

  Oh, no! Oh, and there wasn't a crime of passion?

• 20:09Speaker 02

  While the, it was such a big scandal because it was while the cameras were not rolling. So then, Jordan takes me back, he's over it, we move on, we're doing great. And now the cameras are like, but now we need to reenact this.

• 20:23Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 20:24Speaker 02

  So now you need to retell him on camera that you cheated on him.

• 20:28Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 20:28Speaker 02

  So when I did that, it was kind of like, yeah, I cheated on you, what's up?

• 20:32Bunnie XO?

  Right, because you guys had already gone through all the emotions.

• 20:35Speaker 02

  And so people lost their fucking minds and didn't realize that that was like a reenactment and so.

• 20:42Bunnie XO?

  And you can't say it.

• 20:43Speaker 02

  No, I couldn't. Now that I'm not under contract, I can say whatever I want. Um, and so Jordan actually got re upset and it was like this whole thing. I think we ended up being together maybe for like.

• 20:52Bunnie XO?

  Jordan got re upset?

• 20:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:55Bunnie XO?

  Even though he knew it was like acting?

• 20:58Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. He lost it again as if it just happened. And I was like.

• 21:04Speaker 02

  He is.

• 21:04Bunnie XO?

  Oh, I, how did I know? I was like, he's gotta be a water sign.

• 21:08Speaker 02

  So then, um, we ended up staying together for maybe like another eight months or so. Um, and then when we were kind of on that, um, you know when you like break up, but you're kind of talking, but you're kind of not talking? But it's just like that weird.

• 21:22Bunnie XO?

  Lingering.

• 21:23Speaker 02

  Yes, it was that, but I met Javi.

• 21:25Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 21:26Speaker 02

  So.

• 21:26Bunnie XO?

  I loved Javi. He was a sweet little nugget. No? She's like, mm mm.

• 21:32Speaker 02

  I mean, I could see why you think.

• 21:35Bunnie XO?

  I love that.

• 21:36Speaker 02

  So I meet Javi, we get married, um, very quickly, get married and pregnant. So then I'm pregnant at the wedding.

• 21:43Bunnie XO?

  You're fertile myrtle.

• 21:45Speaker 02

  Which is weird because I also have PCOS.

• 21:47Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, we'll talk about that. That's in my notes, actually. Yeah. When did you find out you had PCOS?

• 21:52Speaker 02

  Two years ago.

• 21:53Bunnie XO?

  Okay, so we'll get to that. Yeah. Okay, so you married Javi, you got pregnant right away.

• 21:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm pregnant at the wedding. Um, and it was okay for a little while, I think. But also, we were so young. I was, I think I wa- I wasn't even legal to drink at my wedding. So I don't think that we really had any business getting married that young.

• 22:12Bunnie XO?

  I just see you searching for love in all the wrong places, as cliche as that sounds.

• 22:17Speaker 02

  No, but literally.

• 22:17Bunnie XO?

  Literally just see, uh, cause you're, you're a Pisces, so you're already just a lover. I'm a Pisces Venus. I'm very passionate. I love love. I love like that exciting, chaotic feeling, you know? So I just see you like bouncing from, you know, person to person to just fill a void.

• 22:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. And that's hard because I think he was also doing the same to some degree. Um, but I, I'm very damaged. It's really hard for him when his parents are still together. He kinda has an intact family. And now you're gonna try to be with someone who, you know.

• 22:50Bunnie XO?

  Has never had that.

• 22:51Speaker 02

  Right, right. It's like, what is that song that Lindsay played yesterday?

• 22:57Speaker 02

  Broken, Broken Homes by Raylin or Broken One by Raylin. And she talks about like, um, her being broken and being with someone who, who's not broken and how hard that can be. Like, that's a real thing.

• 23:09Bunnie XO?

  Well, it's easier to pull somebody down than it is to pull somebody up.

• 23:12Speaker 02

  This is true.

• 23:12Bunnie XO?

  You know, so, and I've, I learned that because I was always super fucking toxic in relationships. It took my husband, being my twin flame, for me to wanna completely change everything around. Um, well, that's, we'll talk about that on your podcast.

• 23:26Bunnie XO?

  Um, so Javi and you get married, you guys have the baby, take me on this journey.

• 23:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, so we have Lincoln, um, and you know, things were okay. He, he was, he didn't treat me so well while I was pregnant and that was really hard for me.

• 23:41Bunnie XO?

  What did he do?

• 23:41Speaker 02

  Um, it just was kind of like, more so like I was on my own with the pregnancy, like didn't help me with like cravings or like, he wasn't like the loving husband that you would anticipate when you're pregnant. You know what I mean? It was more like I was a single mom while I was pregnant and he has addressed that, like he has apologized and things like that, but um, he was a little helpful, you know, when Lincoln first came, he would let me sleep in on the weekend so that I could, you know, just catch up on whatever. Um, but then he gets deployed, um, and I, I'm going to college to get my bachelor's degree. He gets deployed and we're-

• 24:17Bunnie XO?

  I love that you're still staying in school.

• 24:19Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 24:19Bunnie XO?

  And like you're just always on track, working towards a goal.

• 24:22Speaker 02

  Because I knew the show wasn't going to go on forever, you know, and I didn't-

• 24:26Bunnie XO?

  To be so young and already thinking that and knowing that.

• 24:29Speaker 02

  That's the one thing that my mom taught me was no matter how fucked up she was, she always worked.

• 24:34Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 24:34Speaker 02

  And I mean, she was a functioning addict. So I always, like, she would go to work fucked up, but she was going to work.

• 24:40Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 24:40Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? So like I saw that growing up. Um, and so I was like, the show's not going to last forever. I can't be working at fucking Sports Authority and the restaurant for my entire life. Like this is not going to get me by. So, um, I start going back to school and I, I realized, wow, like there's so many other people out here. Like there's so many people and he gets deployed, he has whatever he's going on over there. I had actually filed for divorce right before he left because he, we were fighting, we were going at it.

• 25:08Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 25:08Speaker 02

  And he-

• 25:10Bunnie XO?

  Nobody was cheating?

• 25:11Speaker 02

  Nobody was cheating at the time. Um, and I truly don't even think that we were cheating once I filed for divorce because even once I filed and we were kind of going back and forth with like, are we going to make this work? Are we not? It's like, I did file.

• 25:23Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 25:24Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? So I think that was like the big scandal was like, he tried to play this whole victim thing where I cheated. But you had something going on over there, you know, so.

• 25:34Bunnie XO?

  Um. Well, men always try to deflect.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  Oh, absolutely. Well, it came out in a lie detector test on marriage boot camp.

• 25:40Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 25:41Speaker 02

  So that was kind of like, why would you sit here after everything that I've been through and put it on me when this time I really didn't do shit? And, you know, we, we were doing the same thing and I had filed, so it wasn't, it canceled each other out, you know?

• 25:55Bunnie XO?

  Two to tango.

• 25:56Speaker 02

  Absolutely. But we went back, back and forth for probably a year. And then when we got back from marriage boot camp in two thousand sixteen, we had the divorce decree in the mail.

• 26:07Bunnie XO?

  So you are how old at this time?

• 26:10Speaker 02

  Twenty four.

• 26:11Bunnie XO?

  Twenty four, two babies, one divorce, two baby daddies. What you doing, Kale? What's next?

• 26:20Speaker 02

  I got, I actually ended up, I believe we, I got pregnant with, with Lux before my divorce was finalized. Um, and he, Javi had to sign a, a, a paper saying that he was not the father because we hadn't been divorced for three hundred and sixty five days.

• 26:40Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 26:40Speaker 02

  When I got pregnant.

• 26:41Bunnie XO?

  Is this a law?

• 26:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, in Delaware, like it had, he had to sign off because we were still legally married, even though we had filed for divorce and it was like under the separation. Um, and so then I was with Chris and that was by far my most tumultuous and toxic relationship.

• 26:57Bunnie XO?

  Was it domestic violence?

• 26:58Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 26:59Bunnie XO?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 27:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a lot.

• 27:01Bunnie XO?

  Can you take me on that journey? So you're already pregnant?

• 27:05Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 27:05Bunnie XO?

  You got the two babies. Do you have full custody of them?

• 27:08Speaker 02

  Um, in Delaware is fifty fifty automatic.

• 27:10Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 27:10Speaker 02

  So I have fifty fifty, I think with, with Lincoln, but I think Joe might have still, I don't think we were fifty fifty yet, but that's what we were working on.

• 27:19Bunnie XO?

  Right. Have they always stepped up, Joe and Javi?

• 27:22Speaker 02

  Always. They've always been, um, like when Joe, when we were both in Pennsylvania, he paid child support. He did what he had to do. Same for Javi, right off the bat.

• 27:29Bunnie XO?

  Good.

• 27:30Speaker 02

  Um, so when I meet Chris, it was a very different story. It started off very toxic and.

• 27:35Bunnie XO?

  When you say started off very toxic, what do you mean?

• 27:37Speaker 02

  So I would say about six months in, I had already had a miscarriage with him.

• 27:42Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 27:43Speaker 02

  And at that point, I knew, I had found out that he had two other girlfriends, full time girlfriends. These are not side chicks. Like, we were not side chicks. All three of us were the main fucking chick.

• 27:52Bunnie XO?

  Is he a pimp?

• 27:53Speaker 02

  I don't know what the fuck he is.

• 27:54Bunnie XO?

  Is he getting?

• 27:55Speaker 02

  He got a hammer and that's what that's that's what's happening right there.

• 27:58Bunnie XO?

  Is he getting money from the hoes? That's exactly where my fucking brain goes. I'm such a Vegas chick. I'm like, is he pimping? Um, okay, so he's got that sledgehammer.

• 28:05Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. So he.

• 28:07Bunnie XO?

  Do you want a drink? By the way, I'm sorry.

• 28:08Speaker 02

  I'm gonna, I have some water.

• 28:09Bunnie XO?

  We didn't even offer you anything when you walked in. We're just sit down and dry talk.

• 28:14Speaker 02

  So, yeah, he, um, I'm, I already have a miscarriage and I am learning that he has two other girlfriends. And I find out while I'm pregnant with Lux, my son.

• 28:26Bunnie XO?

  Did they know about you?

• 28:27Speaker 02

  No, none of us knew about each other.

• 28:29Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 28:30Speaker 02

  The way that it was described to me was that these are his exes. And so we were in kind of like an open book about it. And I'm believing that these are his exes, but low and behold, the entire time he is in an active relationship with them.

• 28:41Bunnie XO?

  Wow, how do men find the time?

• 28:44Speaker 02

  Well, that's what I'm saying. Like honestly, you're not, you're not that special either. So like.

• 28:48Bunnie XO?

  But I mean, like, was he living with you full time?

• 28:51Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:52Bunnie XO?

  Okay, so how was he having relationships?

• 28:55Speaker 02

  I don't know. And I, I think it started because of when we first started, I was going through the divorce, right? So he was kind of breadcrumbing me and I think that was a sign that I initially missed. So looking back, I'm like, okay, he would like essentially love bomb me for three days and then disappear for a week. And then come back and you know what I mean? Things like that.

• 29:15Bunnie XO?

  Yep, yep, yep.

• 29:15Speaker 02

  So I was just like, what in the fuck? So we go on a trip to Denver. He wanted to go to Denver. He wanted to do the weed thing, whatever. So it's me, him and his best friend. We go to Denver and he gets so smacked that I'm like, let me, I'm gonna go through his phone. His phone is going off, steady going off. I'm, I'm sleeping on the bed and his phone's going off. I pick it up and it's one of the girlfriends. So I go through the rest of it. He's got naked pictures, videos of them doing things, all kinds of shit. So I go out to dinner with my girlfriends and I'm like, what do I do?

• 29:46Bunnie XO?

  Wait a second. So you're laying in bed next to him, looking at this?

• 29:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I'm just plotting. Yeah, I'm just like, what?

• 29:52Bunnie XO?

  How did you not say anything? I would have been like, whack.

• 29:56Speaker 02

  So wait.

• 29:58Bunnie XO?

  Wake up. We got some shit to talk about.

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I go to dinner with my girlfriends who live in Denver and I, I'm like, what do I do? Like, I don't know. I don't want to like overreact or underreact. Like, I don't know. And I, they don't know I'm pregnant, so I have to tell them I'm pregnant. And I'm just like, what the fuck? So I leave the dinner. One of my girlfriends is waiting outside because she's like, I don't know what's gonna happen. So let me just like, you tell me the okay to go and I'll go.

• 30:23Speaker 02

  And I throw the phone at him and I'm like, what is this? And all hell, all hell breaks loose. Um, and that's when I put them in a group chat and I was like, hey, we're all fucking the same man. And then they're calling him, they're texting him, everything is blowing up. Um, this is where I get really toxic. I take his wallet.

• 30:45Speaker 02

  And he can't find it and he has to go to the airport by himself and he can't do anything with it and I hide the wallet and you have to go to the airport and figure it out.

• 30:55Bunnie XO?

  I don't think that's toxic. I think that's karma. I like, I'm so you're talking to the bark it up the wrong tree over here. I'd have done way worse. I've done way worse than that, actually. So you are very composed.

• 31:05Speaker 02

  And his friend doesn't leave me. His friend stays in the room and we catch our actual flight while Chris goes to the airport and tries to, I don't know if he slept there. Like, I don't know what he did.

• 31:15Bunnie XO?

  She's like, I don't give a fuck.

• 31:16Speaker 02

  I had no clue. Um, I don't even remember seeing him in the airport the next morning, but we get home and we don't talk until that was in December. We don't talk for at least a whole month, but the other girls are already back in his life. They're already, he's already fucking them. They're his girlfriends again, the whole nine. I have no idea. He gets on his knees and shows up at my house and begs for me back. I take him back like a fucking dumbass.

• 31:37Bunnie XO?

  They always want the one that puts up boundaries.

• 31:39Speaker 02

  And I have no idea that he's actually with all three of us again.

• 31:44Bunnie XO?

  No.

• 31:45Speaker 02

  And that's been going, he's still with one of them.

• 31:48Bunnie XO?

  I don't understand how girls are just okay with that.

• 31:51Speaker 02

  And she told me, she's like, I'm not going anywhere.

• 31:54Bunnie XO?

  That is so weird to me. So, so you have the baby, you have Lux. Is he a present father?

• 32:01Speaker 02

  Not really. And because it has, there's like domestic violence involved in the beginning, he only got four hour supervised visits every other week.

• 32:09Bunnie XO?

  Where did the domestic violence come in?

• 32:11Speaker 02

  Um, there was several incidents. Um,

• 32:18Speaker 02

  I compared him to his father one time while I was pregnant and he choked me up against the side of my house. Um, he choked me while holding our his, our son. Um, and several other things. He broke a window. He broke a door, like trying to get to me. There's been so many things. Um, and so I really didn't, and maybe you're familiar with this. I don't know if you've been in a domestic.

• 32:41Bunnie XO?

  Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

• 32:43Speaker 02

  I didn't really want to press charges or call on him. You know, like I wanted him to change and pick me and be with me and be good and us be great. I didn't want to do those things.

• 32:54Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 32:54Speaker 02

  And so there was even a point where I, you know, the DA called me and was like, what do you want to see from this? And I, I, I said, I don't think jail is going to help him. I said, I, he needs to go to a rehab center or some sort of therapy to help him. And that's what I was hoping. He would get the help that he needed versus going to jail.

• 33:12Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 33:13Speaker 02

  Think that was one of my mistakes, but he's also gone to jail and then called me from jail. You know what I mean? So it's like,

• 33:19Bunnie XO?

  It's like, it's not really doing anything.

• 33:21Speaker 02

  And I'm not saying that I was perfect because I've definitely probably pushed his buttons where I shouldn't have.

• 33:25Bunnie XO?

  I get it. Trust me. I guess I was in a very, very abusive relationship where I literally almost lost my life.

• 33:32Speaker 02

  Same.

• 33:33Bunnie XO?

  And you, it's weird because you get, it's a trauma bond.

• 33:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:37Bunnie XO?

  You get addicted to the,

• 33:39Speaker 02

  Chaos.

• 33:40Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, to the abuse and just like the making up and the, you know, like it's just a fucking cycle that just doesn't stop. And I didn't want to call the cops on him either. I remember the cops came in our house one time and um, he had another girlfriend too, which we'll talk about that on your podcast if you want to, but um, the cops came in the house. My eye is literally swollen shut. I mean, it's like sitting out this far and he's like, do you want to press charges? And I'm like, no.

• 34:04Speaker 02

  I also, I said no, and the, the state pressed charges anyway.

• 34:08Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 34:08Speaker 02

  That was for a separate incident. That was the most recent one that I've finally pulled the plug, I guess.

• 34:14Bunnie XO?

  So you guys have two kids together? So when did you get pregnant with the second one?

• 34:19Speaker 02

  During a really abusive period.

• 34:21Bunnie XO?

  Hmm.

• 34:22Speaker 02

  Um, and so I've never really discussed the circumstances of that pregnancy.

• 34:26Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 34:26Speaker 02

  Um, but it wasn't a good, it was not a good time.

• 34:30Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 34:30Speaker 02

  Um,

• 34:31Bunnie XO?

  It just probably got worse because it never gets better.

• 34:33Speaker 02

  No, it doesn't. And you know, there was a time where I truly, like I texted someone who I later dated and I was like, he's going to kill me. Um, and then I threw my phone under my bed because I thought if he gets my phone, I won't have any way to call for help. Um, but you know, my ex that we could talk about later if you want, um. He didn't get it because it was at two in the morning. You know, Chris had showed up to my house. We had this crazy situation happen. I literally thought I was going to die and I think the only reason why I fought for my life. He literally, he put my face into the couch and was just smothering me into the couch. No, I had, I already had my first son. Um, but this was around the time that I got pregnant with my second son.

• 35:16Speaker 02

  And um, I don't know, I had never fought him before when he put his hands on me or you know, abused me.

• 35:23Bunnie XO?

  I, can we talk about that though? When you get into an abusive relationship, you literally, there is a fire that comes up out of you and you're like, motherfucker, touch me one more time and I'm gonna kill you.

• 35:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that, that night, I don't know what took over me, but that night I fought for my fucking life. And I don't know, my son was upstairs sleeping. And I just, I remember just like turning my head a cer- a certain way and being able to like gasp for air and I still, I still did not want to call the fucking police. I did, I was so just like, I want you to choose me. I want you to get better, you know, it was sick.

• 35:58Bunnie XO?

  No, it's a very, very, very sick cycle that happens with um, you know, relationships like that. And I don't think that people talk about it enough because it's one of the most fucked up mind fucks you will ever go through. I've been away from my abusive, abusive ex for seven years now and I'm still fighting, just healing and going through like emotions of having what happened to me. You know, it's, it's not easy. How long have you been out of it?

• 36:28Speaker 02

  Two.

• 36:29Bunnie XO?

  Oh, yeah.

• 36:30Speaker 02

  Two years. And what's crazy is a couple of weeks ago, he called me while we were in Texas and um, I had put him on speakerphone and he's like, and you need to get over it. Like you can't keep talking about this. What did he say, Kristen? Yeah.

• 36:46Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. My ex literally messaged me, when was it, last year? And told me, I don't want to be used as content. Because like all like-

• 36:54Speaker 02

  But this is our story.

• 36:55Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 36:55Speaker 02

  This is what happened to us.

• 36:56Bunnie XO?

  I said, we're not talking about you, we're talking about the situation. I've never even said his name publicly, so nobody even knows-

• 37:02Speaker 02

  Knows who you are.

• 37:03Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, then I've told him that. And he finally got to the point where he's like, well, just say my name. No, motherfucker, I'm never gonna give you that clout.

• 37:10Speaker 02

  No, absolutely not.

• 37:11Bunnie XO?

  It's just a very toxic thing and it's so fucked up because it's like you really want to love this person and you have kids with him. So I could only imagine how hard that is. Because it's like you want to have a family, you want that love, you know, with a unit.

• 37:26Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 37:26Bunnie XO?

  And it's just never gonna happen.

• 37:28Speaker 02

  No.

• 37:28Bunnie XO?

  Because that's who they are.

• 37:29Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 37:30Bunnie XO?

  You know, to their core, that's the type of humans that they are.

• 37:32Speaker 02

  I think that, after that night was when I started my actual hardcore therapy journey.

• 37:37Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 37:37Speaker 02

  Um, I got into with an emergency therapist and she kind of just like rocked my world. And, you know, I was with her for three and a half years, almost four years.

• 37:46Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 37:46Speaker 02

  Um, and if it wasn't for that, I would not be where I am. But I thank God, I called 11 therapists to get in for an emergency appointment. I was like, I don't know what's gonna happen to me, like, I don't even know how I'm here. She was the only one that called me back.

• 37:59Bunnie XO?

  No, I have been, I literally have been in your same position where I have felt so suicidal. I have like, I've been like, I need to talk to somebody, I need to figure this out. The mental health world is not helpful.

• 38:11Speaker 02

  No, it's not.

• 38:12Bunnie XO?

  Like, they charge an arm and a leg, they don't-

• 38:14Speaker 02

  I was paying a mortgage worth of therapy every single month.

• 38:17Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 38:18Speaker 02

  I mean, Kristen can tell you, she sees my bank account every month.

• 38:20Bunnie XO?

  No, I get it.

• 38:21Speaker 02

  I'm like, you know, there was periods of time where I had to go double, you know, two times a week.

• 38:25Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 38:25Speaker 02

  There was times where I went over an hour, there were, you know, you know what I mean? Like, just trying to get through this and for him to still say like-

• 38:31Bunnie XO?

  You gotta get over it.

• 38:32Speaker 02

  You gotta get over it, move on.

• 38:34Bunnie XO?

  That's something within him.

• 38:35Speaker 02

  And it, yeah.

• 38:36Bunnie XO?

  Because he feels guilty for what he did to you and heaven forbid, he wants to feel guilty. You know, like, it's gonna trigger him to be like, well, you need to get over it because I don't want to hear about it anymore because I don't want to feel it. Believe it or not, narcissists do have a guilty conscious when it comes to things that they do because they hate looking like the bad guy. They don't want to be made to look like the bad person. So when- You are out speaking your truth, it's making them look bad. And even if somebody, well, in your case, they do know who he is. So he really hates it because he's like, oh, my God, I'm looking bad to all these people. You know, how dare her shame me in front of all these people. You know, so it's a guilt of them not wanting to feel bad about themselves because their ego, it's all ego driven.

• 39:17Bunnie XO?

  So that night you go on your spiritual journey. When do you find out you're pregnant with your second kid? Cause you weren't pregnant at the time?

• 39:26Speaker 02

  I don't know. I didn't find out until the next month.

• 39:30Bunnie XO?

  Okay, gotcha.

• 39:30Speaker 02

  So the next month, it was on my son, my second son's birthday that I find out that I'm pregnant now with my fourth. And I was so distraught and upset. I had never been in a situation where.

• 39:46Speaker 02

  You know, I already had a child with someone with the same person and um. I wasn't in a place to have another child. I was going through so much, you know, with within myself. So I made an appointment to get an abortion. And, you know, love me or hate me for that, but that was something that I had to do for myself. And Kristen went with me. She drove me and.

• 40:09Speaker 02

  When I got there, I said, I need to look at the screen. I need to see if I'm gonna connect with this baby. Because I was at the borderline of like where you can no longer get one because I needed all this time to think. And then at that point, I was already feeling guilty because I had waited so long because I couldn't make the decision and I felt like it isn't fair for me to bring this baby into. This situation. But also.

• 40:31Bunnie XO?

  What a terrible situation.

• 40:34Speaker 02

  It just felt like it was wrong. And so I'm, you know, not really entirely sure what I should be doing. What's the right thing to do? And um, I looked at the screen and I was like, I'm not gonna go through with this abortion and I'm going to. Do the best I can and raise this baby and you know, whatever happens, it's gonna be okay.

• 40:52Bunnie XO?

  And this is Cruz?

• 40:54Speaker 02

  This is Creed.

• 40:54Bunnie XO?

  Creed, sorry.

• 40:57Bunnie XO?

  Your fans are gonna come for me.

• 40:58Speaker 02

  No, it's okay. Cruz is cute too.

• 41:01Bunnie XO?

  Creed. I swear I have all this in my notes. I'm just trying not to look at my notes while I talk to you. Um, okay, so you have, you, you know, have this epiphany while you're in the abortion clinic, which is pretty profound. I love that because I actually had an abortion when I was 16. And I told, we'll talk about this on your podcast, but it's kind of like the same situation. And mine was a little too late though, so.

• 41:26Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 41:27Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, so we'll, but we'll, we'll definitely talk about that. Um. You're pregnant with your second baby with this dude.

• 41:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:33Bunnie XO?

  What does he say?

• 41:36Speaker 02

  I really thought at some point that he was turning over a new leaf. He like wrote me a Christmas card and was like.

• 41:44Bunnie XO?

  So it's the dog.

• 41:45Speaker 02

  Oh, I was like.

• 41:47Speaker 02

  Is that a baby crying? What is happening?

• 41:48Bunnie XO?

  I know. It's the dog across the street. He always does this.

• 41:52Speaker 02

  That's so funny. I'm like, okay, he's, he's gonna turn over a new leaf. He's gonna, you know, at some point, this is going to make him realize what he wants, what he's done, how we're gonna get through this.

• 42:04Bunnie XO?

  Isn't it crazy how you've given the most chances to the most toxic man?

• 42:08Speaker 02

  Yes, and I always say that. And I loved him the most. I loved him so fucking hard.

• 42:13Bunnie XO?

  But was it really love or was it a trauma bond?

• 42:16Speaker 02

  It was absolutely a trauma bond. Absolutely.

• 42:18Bunnie XO?

  Because we crave that, that, um, you guys probably had really passionate sex.

• 42:22Speaker 02

  Absolutely. The best sex.

• 42:24Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 42:24Speaker 02

  The best sex.

• 42:25Bunnie XO?

  I swear, the most domestic violence relationships have the best sex. I've always said that. And it's like, you get addicted to just that person.

• 42:33Speaker 02

  Well, and I thought the sex was so good. So when I'm talking to my therapist about it, she's like, Kale, but is it? She's like, or does he deprive you of everything else in a relationship? And so you think that's the best because that's the only time you're connected. And then when I think about it, I was like, wow, like, we could be fighting, but I would have sex with him so that we could connect and really be.

• 42:54Bunnie XO?

  Get over it.

• 42:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, and, and she was right. Like, it probably wasn't that great.

• 43:00Bunnie XO?

  I need, I need your therapist. Can I have her number?

• 43:04Speaker 02

  Um, so yeah, I

• 43:05Bunnie XO?

  So you thought he turned, he turned over and

• 43:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, he writes me this Christmas card and he's, you know, he's like, I know this wasn't great, but we're gonna, we're gonna be fine. We're gonna do okay.

• 43:14Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 43:14Speaker 02

  Um, we still didn't really try to have a relationship from that point forward, but it was more so like, I felt like he was nicer to me.

• 43:25Bunnie XO?

  Well, I probably knew that he had to be.

• 43:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so there were still times where it was not great and um, I didn't think that I was gonna have him at the birth because I thought it was gonna be just traumatic and like something that I knew that I could never have is like this family.

• 43:39Bunnie XO?

  Are you still filming during this time?

• 43:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 43:41Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 43:42Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I'm trying to hide it, but also I'm so angry and upset that I'm also telling parts of it and I'm not telling the whole story and I don't know how to navigate it because I do owe the show, you know, uh, I do owe them my life. I owe them, you know, my privacy really. But I'm also trying to protect him to some degree, but also tell my story. It was very difficult. Um, and so I really started to run into problems with filming at that time. Uh, because he was pissed, don't talk about me. I don't want to be on the show, you know, the whole nine. So I tell him, I really don't want him at the birth and but ultimately I was like, you know what? I can't not have my son's father there. Like he deserves to be there for his son. Uh, maybe if he watches me give birth again, he'll wanna just make this work.

• 44:26Bunnie XO?

  Cause nothing turns a guy on like a placenta.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 44:32Speaker 02

  So I'm thinking like him being there will just change his mind and absolutely it could not be more far from the truth.

• 44:40Bunnie XO?

  Um, what happens?

• 44:41Speaker 02

  He, he comes to the birth. He was fine. Um, but then, you know, he just decides that he's just gonna kind of come and go and show up and leave as he pleases. Like I think I gave birth and he left like two hours later.

• 44:52Bunnie XO?

  Was he, is he still, he's still dating the other two girls?

• 44:54Speaker 02

  Well, no, just the one.

• 44:55Bunnie XO?

  The one, okay.

• 44:56Speaker 02

  So they have a child together now.

• 44:58Bunnie XO?

  Oh, nice.

• 44:58Speaker 02

  Um, and he ends up getting her pregnant shortly thereafter. I had, you know, our second son. And so that was like a whole other thing and um,

• 45:08Bunnie XO?

  That's gotta be crushing you.

• 45:10Speaker 02

  It would, that was hard for me. That was really hard for me to learn that, you know, he was having a baby with her. I, I had a mental breakdown that day and then I was like, you know what? Here's the thing, I don't date men with kids. And if it wasn't for that, I don't think that I would be done with him today.

• 45:25Bunnie XO?

  Sure. Wait, hold on. You don't date men with kids?

• 45:27Speaker 02

  I don't.

• 45:27Bunnie XO?

  But you want men that don't have kids to date you?

• 45:30Speaker 02

  But I understand if they won't.

• 45:31Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 45:32Speaker 02

  I like, if it's a personal preference.

• 45:34Bunnie XO?

  I love that.

• 45:34Speaker 02

  Um, but I, I come with so much baggage and so many.

• 45:37Bunnie XO?

  You're like, I don't need yours.

• 45:38Speaker 02

  I don't need yours as well. So, um, yeah, I like them without kids. And so. I don't know.

• 45:45Bunnie XO?

  For any of the men who want to slide up in Kale's DM, if you guys have any little tater tots, any crotch goblins, do not.

• 45:52Speaker 02

  So yeah, I find out shortly thereafter that he is having a child with her and I promise you, I had my mental breakdown. I called my therapist on an emergency basis. She talked me through it. I like basically blacked out. I don't even remember what the conversation was. From that point forward, I accepted that he was having this child and I never looked back. I never looked back.

• 46:11Bunnie XO?

  Trauma. I'm the same way. If I get hurt, it's like I will stonewall and literally just keep going.

• 46:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:18Bunnie XO?

  Like, I'm not looking back.

• 46:19Speaker 02

  Right. And so from there, I mean, I've never hooked up with him. We don't hang out. We don't talk. We're not friendly. Um, there's like one or two friendly times that we've tried to be cordial. Um, but it ultimately just goes to shit every time. So like, we're never on good terms.

• 46:35Bunnie XO?

  I'm proud of you.

• 46:36Speaker 02

  It's hard.

• 46:37Bunnie XO?

  I'm really proud of you. You've been through a lot of shit.

• 46:40Speaker 02

  It's been, um, I've lived a hundred lives in 30 years, I think.

• 46:44Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 46:45Speaker 02

  But you have two.

• 46:46Bunnie XO?

  I think you need, don't deflect. Accept the compliment. You really are deserving of, and I'm proud of you because coming from somebody who didn't have anybody to show them how to live, you have four beautiful babies.

• 47:00Speaker 02

  Yeah. Oh my gosh. And they're everything. Oh my God, they're everything.

• 47:03Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. I heard, so I heard you had him on a podcast and was it Isaac that said something crazy and you like, everybody came for you because, um.

• 47:11Speaker 02

  Probably.

• 47:12Bunnie XO?

  I think they said, I think the article I read said that Isaac and you were on the, they, all the kids were on the podcast and I, you said something about like, do, do the people I date bother you? And he said, well, no, not at all. And then you said something and then he said, well. Oh, I just know you for having babies with everybody or something like that. And I didn't think that was wrong.

• 47:33Speaker 02

  No, he's not, he's not wrong.

• 47:34Bunnie XO?

  But for everybody to make such a big deal about it was crazy.

• 47:37Speaker 02

  You know, they love to make something out of nothing.

• 47:39Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  But it's funny, my kids, they just fry me up on a regular basis and I love it because I'm like, I can take it. And these are, these are truths, like I have three baby dads and that's the truth. So.

• 47:50Bunnie XO?

  I love.

• 47:50Speaker 02

  Um, but no, they're so funny. My, and especially, uh, my third son, he humbles me every day in my life.

• 47:55Bunnie XO?

  When's his birthday?

• 47:56Speaker 02

  Um, he's a Leo, he's August 5th.

• 47:58Bunnie XO?

  Oh, I love that. I bet you he loves the shit out of you though.

• 48:01Speaker 02

  He's my ride or die.

• 48:02Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 48:03Speaker 02

  Through and through, like I can, I know if I was to go to jail and he's an adult, I know he would call, he would answer on the first ring. You know what I mean? Like he's my ride or die.

• 48:11Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, that's, that's, he's a mama's boy.

• 48:13Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 48:13Bunnie XO?

  I feel like Isaac kind of grew up with you.

• 48:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:16Bunnie XO?

  How's you guys' relationship?

• 48:18Speaker 02

  We struggled for a little while. We were bumping heads and, um, he's a lot like me. He's a lot of the things as a child in myself that, you know, I see qualities of him that I hated in myself as a kid. But I would say over the last like year and a half, we have become best fucking friends. And you know, I'm a parent first. I will always be a parent first and I tell him that, but I also want him to trust me. I want him to be able to tell me all the things. And so he will sit there and he'll spill the tea about all the seventh graders at school and you know, what's going on and um, you know, I just love the shit out of him and I'm, I am proud of him, but he, he's, he challenges, you know, every day, things that, you know, kids are expected to do. He will challenge them a little bit and I, I'm actually really proud of him for it

• 49:02Speaker 02

  because I feel like kids don't do that enough in a, in a respectful way.

• 49:06Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 49:07Speaker 02

  And so he'll challenge, you know, like, well, you know, why do I have to do this? Or, you know, things like that. And I just, I think that he's going to do big things.

• 49:16Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 49:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:17Bunnie XO?

  I love that. What about Lincoln? Cause he kind of grew up with you too, right?

• 49:20Speaker 02

  He did.

• 49:20Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 49:21Speaker 02

  Lincoln's a little different. Lincoln is, um, he's just like a little athlete. He's a man's man. He's always into sports. Um, that's his, that's a daddy's boy.

• 49:30Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 49:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. His, that's hobby's boy.

• 49:32Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 49:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. Which is okay. I, that's, that was a little hard on me. There was a little bit of a period where I was like. Like this really fucking sucks.

• 49:38Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 49:39Speaker 02

  Cause I feel there, there's something different about a mom and her sons versus like a mom and her daughters.

• 49:43Bunnie XO?

  And normally it's, they're not daddy's boys.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  Right. And so they're like more of like mommy's boys, but he, and so I struggled with that a little bit, but um.

• 49:51Bunnie XO?

  I think he'll become a mama's boy, the older he gets.

• 49:53Speaker 02

  Okay. Well, I'm, I'm hopeful for that.

• 49:55Bunnie XO?

  When he starts getting like girlfriends and stuff like that.

• 49:59Speaker 02

  Cause he has a little girlfriend and he'll be like, can you take us here? He won't dare ask his dad. So I'm like.

• 50:06Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. You're like, am I the cool parent?

• 50:08Speaker 02

  Am I the cool?

• 50:09Bunnie XO?

  If I do this. Well, I love that. So moving on, I read an article that you had, that you were ready to break ties with. You know, teen mom and you did not want that stigma around you anymore. What led to that?

• 50:24Speaker 02

  It was a really hard decision for me. Um, but I had been really struggling with. The fact that I went through such a public divorce and then like the stuff with Chris was so messy. Uh, my kids are getting older, you know, Isaac really didn't want to film anymore. Um, so I was just kind of feeling like maybe this is time for me to move on. Um, and it would have been cool if they kind of showed the whole picture. But they were so focused on showing the traumas with myself and my kids' dads, and that's not my whole story.

• 50:57Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 50:58Speaker 02

  You know, there, there's a lot that goes into being a mom, being a single mom. Um, they didn't really want to cover any of the good stuff. And I think you do have to cover the good with the bad. And I understand that drama sells on TV and you want to exploit like the craziest stuff. Because that's what's going to make money.

• 51:13Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 51:14Speaker 02

  But if people don't know the whole story, who gives a fuck about that? Yeah. And so, um, I just got to a point where it just was too much. Um, you know, the cast and I, none of us were getting along. Uh, my kids didn't want to film. And so I just wanted the privacy and to kind of just move on. Um, they've asked me a couple of times to come back, but I just don't, I'm so far removed from that now that I don't, I can't see myself going back to. To that show specifically.

• 51:40Bunnie XO?

  Right. Maybe like a spinoff of your own. You got enough kids.

• 51:45Bunnie XO?

  To keep everybody interested. Did you want to talk about the lawsuit with Bree or no?

• 51:50Speaker 02

  I don't care. We can talk about it.

• 51:51Bunnie XO?

  Is that, was that one of the pivotal things that also made you leave the show?

• 51:54Speaker 02

  You know what? I, there was so much with the lawsuit. Um. For one, I really just wanted to prove a point that you're not gonna continue to fuck with me and get away with this, you know what I mean? The other thing too was that I felt like I exploited my entire life for thirteen years and MTV held no con- like they've threatened to find me for thinking that I sold this In Touch article back when I was with Jordan um in two thousand twelve, they threatened to find me, but they're not gonna threaten to find her for you know, threatening to spit on me to, you know, her sister assaulted me, nobody gets fined.

• 52:35Speaker 02

  So I just felt like it was very unfair and not like a balanced situation. It kinda turned into Bad Girls Club.

• 52:41Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 52:42Speaker 02

  And so I was just like, this is not me anymore.

• 52:46Bunnie XO?

  I've learned because I had Honey Boo Boo on, uh Alana and um Pumpkin.

• 52:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:51Bunnie XO?

  And there was so much abuse that the TV people have, you know, covered up and it's like I almost feel like in this day and age, what was happening with you is kind of like illegal, like there's a lot of domestic violence going on behind the scenes. They didn't do anything to help it and I'm sure they knew or had an inkling of something was going on, you know? They're exploiting teenagers.

• 53:16Speaker 02

  Right.

• 53:16Bunnie XO?

  Like that's really rocky waters, you know, so they don't really have your best interests at heart. So that doesn't surprise me that they wouldn't find her, but try to find you.

• 53:25Speaker 02

  It it just, I felt like it was backwards.

• 53:27Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 53:27Speaker 02

  And I I paid my dues in the industry.

• 53:29Bunnie XO?

  Oh, thirteen years, that's a long time.

• 53:31Speaker 02

  And we're talking divorce, cheating scandals, STDs, the whole nine.

• 53:35Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 53:36Speaker 02

  And you can't even say like this is unacceptable and you know, do something about it.

• 53:40Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 53:41Speaker 02

  There was no regard for or human decency, it felt like.

• 53:45Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 53:46Speaker 02

  Um, and so that was one of the turning, yeah, I would say so.

• 53:48Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 53:48Speaker 02

  That was one of the turning points.

• 53:49Bunnie XO?

  Definitely. And then you ended up, the judge ended up throwing it out, right? Or something like that?

• 53:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, I, what, was it like a throw out? Not enough evidence or?

• 53:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, basically.

• 54:00Speaker 02

  Essentially, nobody won. I had to pay her lawyer fees.

• 54:03Bunnie XO?

  You just feel helpless because it's like, nobody has your back.

• 54:06Speaker 02

  And then she sent me like a treadmill, um, and then a clown suit.

• 54:11Bunnie XO?

  Have some coof. Um, so moving on, you had mentioned earlier that you had PCOS.

• 54:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:17Bunnie XO?

  When did that, um, come into play? When did you find out that you had that?

• 54:20Speaker 02

  Two, I think two years ago. I don't know why I was, why did I get tested for that?

• 54:27Speaker 03

  Um, the weight and also just like crazy here.

• 54:31Speaker 02

  Okay, so I TMI, but I like bleed through everything. So like, I shit you not, I could put a tampon in and bleed through my entire outfit in twenty minutes.

• 54:40Bunnie XO?

  Poor baby.

• 54:41Speaker 02

  So it's just like crazy. I'm all over my mattress. Long story short, that and like the weight, the weight gain. Um, I was working out religiously and not losing anything. I was eating right, like doing what I needed to do and nothing would come off. So two years ago, I go get like the blood test and everything else like that. And it comes back that I have PCOS, which is really weird because I have no problem getting pregnant. There was a small window where I had secondary infertility. Um, and then.

• 55:07Bunnie XO?

  You infertile?

• 55:09Speaker 02

  Right? You're like, wait a minute.

• 55:10Bunnie XO?

  I mean, that's a good thing now, isn't it? No, I'm just kidding.

• 55:14Speaker 02

  So yeah, there was like a small window where I had what we thought was secondary infertility. And then, um, so I had back to back miscarriages and then randomly got pregnant with Lux Creed and you know what I mean? So it was just, it's even now, it feels weird to say that I have PCOS because I'm not like the typical like poster child for PCOS.

• 55:33Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, I think every case is different. Mimi has PCOS.

• 55:36Speaker 04

  Pregnancy can cause PCOS. So you could have not had it.

• 55:39Speaker 02

  I don't think I always had it.

• 55:41Speaker 04

  Yeah. And so one of your pregnancies could have caused it.

• 55:44Speaker 02

  Really?

• 55:45Speaker 04

  So you wouldn't have the infertility of it, that like you could kind of struggle. Like you said, you had a little bit of struggle with it. But your pregnancy could have brought on all that because, uh, saying that your PCOS isn't just like a black and white thing. It's so broad.

• 55:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, because.

• 56:00Speaker 04

  Well, yeah, your pregnancy could have caused it.

• 56:01Speaker 02

  Wow, I didn't know. See, I don't, I didn't know that.

• 56:03Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, no, Mimi knows a lot about it. That's why I was curious about it to see what your journey was because I've seen her journey.

• 56:09Speaker 02

  So I have like the crazy weight gain. I cannot lose weight for the life of me. High testosterone. I have, um, I had the crazy acne, like cystic acne. I took Accutane for five months. Um, I'm trying to think what else I have.

• 56:23Bunnie XO?

  Your skin looks fucking flawless.

• 56:25Speaker 02

  This is from Accutane. This is from Accutane.

• 56:27Bunnie XO?

  I've been looking at that skin this whole time you've been sitting there. I'm like, good lord.

• 56:30Speaker 02

  I don't even, I, I, Accutane really put me through hell, but it was worth it. Oh, yeah.

• 56:36Bunnie XO?

  Do you think that might have been what triggered your depression in twenty twenty?

• 56:40Speaker 02

  Well, cause when did I go on Accutane? Before or after Lux?

• 56:44Bunnie XO?

  Cause I've heard nothing but nightmare shit from Acc- about Accutane.

• 56:47Speaker 02

  I didn't really before. Yeah, I didn't really struggle, um, long term. Once I stopped the five month treatment. Everything went back to normal.

• 56:56Bunnie XO?

  Oh, good.

• 56:57Speaker 02

  But it was just during that time. Um, I think, you know, my mental health just kind of the ebbs and flows. I don't really like.

• 57:03Bunnie XO?

  I mean, your body's been through a lot.

• 57:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:05Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, for sure. And then coming out of a domestic violence relationship too, like that will.

• 57:09Speaker 02

  Literal hell.

• 57:09Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, totally. New York Times bestseller. Take me on this journey, boo.

• 57:16Speaker 02

  Um, okay, so I actually. Um, I didn't think that I would ever actually get to publish this book, right? So I'm, I'm writing on my laptop, my six hundred dollar Toshiba laptop that I got from fucking Best Buy when I was like twenty, right? And I'm typing on it and I'm like, it's basically like a diary, like all this shit that I've gone through, you know, my family story. And I don't know how the fuck to publish a book, right? So I'm like, what the fuck am I gonna do? Um, and I reached out to like five or six publishing houses.

• 57:46Bunnie XO?

  Which by the way, let me cut you off. They're like a cult. Cause I'm in the, yeah, I'm like in the process of trying to write a book too about my life story. They, if they don't, they will not just accept anyone.

• 57:56Speaker 02

  No, they, five publishing houses turned me down before, five or six of them turned me down before. The only reason why I actually ended up getting a book deal was because at the time MTV had a book, um, department.

• 58:08Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 58:08Speaker 02

  So MTV Books put me in touch with, um, a publisher who finally was like, all right, well, we'll take a risk here.

• 58:15Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 58:16Speaker 02

  And so I was the first or second. I think Farrah had her book out first. Has she been on the podcast yet?

• 58:22Bunnie XO?

  No, but I can't wait.

• 58:24Speaker 02

  And she's scheduled, she needs to come on.

• 58:26Bunnie XO?

  No, I want her so bad, just because she's a fucking lunatic dude. I love it though. I'm all for it.

• 58:32Speaker 02

  Um, so I get, I get the book deal and, um, you know, we did the whole book tour thing and it was really cool because that there's so much in there that I didn't get to show on the show. And so people really finally started to understand why I was so fucked up at the time and you know.

• 58:49Bunnie XO?

  What's the name of the book?

• 58:50Speaker 02

  Pride Over Pity.

• 58:51Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 58:51Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I talk about my mom's addictions. I talk about, you know, walking down the street to my uncle's house and asking for food. You know what I mean? So there's like a lot of stuff in there that I, actually, I don't even know if that's in there. Um, but there's just so much in there that the show didn't get to.

• 59:06Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 59:06Speaker 02

  So.

• 59:07Bunnie XO?

  Which I feel like the show would be way more successful if they did show all that shit dude. Cause people would actually have fucking empathy.

• 59:13Speaker 02

  Oh, a hundred percent. Because I think, and that goes for everybody on the, on the show, not just me. You know, how did Chelsea become Chelsea? She became the face of the franchise. How did she, you know, her, her dad's a doctor or dentist, like, what was that like for her? You know, did she grow up wealthy? Did she, you know what I mean? Did she have a great start? Did she have a support system?

• 59:33Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. Like, I don't know any of you guys' backstories. I just know the children that you had.

• 59:38Speaker 02

  Right.

• 59:39Bunnie XO?

  You know, the, the arguments.

• 59:40Speaker 02

  So it would, it would have been really cool for them to, you know, at least do a couple of episodes, you know, but they just never, they never really touched on it.

• 59:48Bunnie XO?

  But you got it all out in the book.

• 59:49Speaker 02

  I did.

• 59:50Bunnie XO?

  And then you wrote another one.

• 59:51Speaker 02

  I wrote three more.

• 59:52Bunnie XO?

  Three more?

• 59:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:53Bunnie XO?

  I only saw two. Do tell.

• 59:55Speaker 02

  So I wrote, one of them's a children's book.

• 59:56Bunnie XO?

  You are busy. Good lord.

• 59:58Speaker 02

  Well, I, because I'm so afraid of being poor again. Like, I'm so afraid.

• 1:00:03Bunnie XO?

  Hello, I fucking, I literally will hold on to money like a hoarder.

• 1:00:07Speaker 02

  Literally. Well, and there was a time where I was having like shopping problem because I was like, I have the money, but now I'm back to like me trying to like just remember my roots. But I'm so afraid of being broke like I grew up, you know, like I, I don't even, I didn't have food, you know what I mean? So my mom didn't keep food in the house. Um, so I never want to go back to that and I don't want my kids to go back to that. So I write, um, three more books. One's a children's book and, um, I'm hoping to do another one. So hopefully within the next year, we'll, you know, start working on that.

• 1:00:37Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:38Speaker 02

  It's a lot harder than you think, especially now. Because everything is just like, listen to a podcast, you know, read, go on Audible or, you know, listen to a book or whatever it is and.

• 1:00:49Bunnie XO?

  I call it the microwave era.

• 1:00:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, people don't wanna, they don't wanna wait, so they just want instant.

• 1:00:54Bunnie XO?

  Yep, instant gratification always. Well, girl, I'm proud of you. Fucking three books. I only had two in here. Plastic surgery, that's the last thing we'll talk about, cause I know, listen, I get it all the time. Everybody's like, what did you have done? And like, you know, just. Even if you have fillers and shit in your face, people call you plastic. I love that you're so open with your plastic surgery, cause so am I.

• 1:01:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, I love plastic surgery.

• 1:01:15Bunnie XO?

  Me fucking too.

• 1:01:16Speaker 02

  I'm like, the, the only regret that I have is not waiting until I was done having kids.

• 1:01:21Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:22Speaker 02

  Cause I had the mommy makeover after my second son, um, but I really should have waited, cause I could definitely go for another. If anyone wants to, no, I'm just kidding.

• 1:01:31Bunnie XO?

  If anyone wants to fund it and you don't have any kids.

• 1:01:33Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:01:34Bunnie XO?

  Make sure you don't have any kids. Um, no, I love that you're very open with your journey because so am I.

• 1:01:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:39Bunnie XO?

  I'm like, dude, I can't wait to get a facelift. I'm so ready.

• 1:01:42Speaker 02

  No, I was literally, I'm like, does Chris, what does Kris Jenner have? Because I want whatever she, hers is nice and precise.

• 1:01:49Bunnie XO?

  Baby's blood is what she drinks.

• 1:01:50Speaker 02

  She has to because.

• 1:01:51Bunnie XO?

  Drina Chrome.

• 1:01:52Speaker 02

  And I was watching Game Show Network and I'm like, Leah Remi got something done somewhere. And I'm like, what?

• 1:01:58Bunnie XO?

  Her, J Lo, everybody looks so good. Everybody, Kim, Kim Kardashian looks amazing. They all look fucking great. Everybody gets nip tuck in the world. I mean, like, if you can afford it, they're getting it done.

• 1:02:08Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, or comped.

• 1:02:09Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, for promo or whatever. Yeah, no, I love that you're, you had that journey. So you had a tummy tuck and what else have you had?

• 1:02:16Speaker 02

  BBL, Lipo 360.

• 1:02:18Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:18Speaker 02

  Um, I've had lip fillers. I get Disport religiously.

• 1:02:23Bunnie XO?

  I can't live without Botox.

• 1:02:25Speaker 02

  No, I love it. I actually just missed my appointment. Yeah, I know.

• 1:02:28Bunnie XO?

  I have a really good girl at her if you ever want to use her. She's amazing.

• 1:02:31Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:02:31Bunnie XO?

  Jess at the aesthetic parlor. She's amazing. Um, I had a BBL done. It wasn't a full BBL done, but I had high def v- vaso lipo on my stomach. And then they put a little bit at the top of my ass because I was starting to get my mom's ass.

• 1:02:44Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:02:45Bunnie XO?

  I don't love the BBL trend.

• 1:02:47Speaker 02

  I don't love it. It's I want it removed kind of immediately.

• 1:02:50Bunnie XO?

  Same. I'm the same way. If I could, yeah, go ahead.

• 1:02:52Speaker 02

  Gravity is kind of pulling it down a little bit.

• 1:02:55Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:55Speaker 02

  Um.

• 1:02:56Bunnie XO?

  I think what they don't tell you whenever you're getting a BBL, and I want to make a TikTok about this, is one, it makes it harder for you to lose weight. People don't realize that. Did you know that?

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  Absolutely not.

• 1:03:07Bunnie XO?

  Girl, I battle, I work out four to five times a week and my girl Viking Barbie, who's beautiful, you can look her up. Her and I have the same nutritional coach. It took me

• 1:03:18Bunnie XO?

  probably five times more working out and longer to lose the fat on my hips and around my ass than it did her because she's never had work done to her body. And when you have lipo, fat doesn't go to that area anymore, but it spreads out and goes to other areas.

• 1:03:33Speaker 02

  Where there's fat cells.

• 1:03:34Bunnie XO?

  Yes. So it's, it doubles, it's harder to lose. Like, it's just not.

• 1:03:39Speaker 02

  So Dr. Miami did mine.

• 1:03:41Bunnie XO?

  Wow.

• 1:03:41Speaker 02

  And he said, I asked him about it and he was like, the, when you gain weight, you're going to gain weight wherever your fat cells are.

• 1:03:48Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 1:03:48Speaker 02

  Which he moved them to my butt. My butt has grown exponentially.

• 1:03:53Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:54Speaker 02

  Um, and I also had, when I did the BBL and I did the lipo three sixty, I wanted everything to match because I felt like I can't have a huge butt and then like my arms and my waist or my arm, my, my waist to be small, my arms to be big. So I had it in my arms. My butt and my arms have grown and insane, but like now what? Now I don't know what I can do about it.

• 1:04:18Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:19Speaker 02

  And the gravity pulls down your butt a little bit and it just looks crazy and I can't find jeans that fit me. It's insane. So I don't know if I would have to get lipo, but then would it be like lumpy?

• 1:04:28Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. No, there's like what that, they don't warn you about plastic surgery. Once you start getting it, the upkeep is insane. The fact that I've been able to keep my results for the past seven, like. 2015. I got it done. Yeah. So about seven years, seven or eight years, eight, eight years is insane. And I've had to really work my ass off to keep my results.

• 1:04:46Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 1:04:47Bunnie XO?

  And but my ass and my hips have widened so much from just having work done. Like it's, I don't know. It's just crazy. You're just literally always chasing it.

• 1:04:56Speaker 02

  That's so weird. Okay. So that's good to know. I um. I don't even know what I'm gonna do.

• 1:05:04Bunnie XO?

  We'll figure it out. I mean, I'm sure they'll come out with a new fucking thing, but yeah. Just before you get plastic surgery, do all your research. Everybody's body is different, but you know, just from my experience, it has been so hard for me to lose body fat. It's been crazy.

• 1:05:17Speaker 02

  I maintained it for a long time, but I got pregnant the same year that I got my, my mommy makeover.

• 1:05:23Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:23Speaker 02

  So that was my biggest mistake. I should have, you know, had all the kids I wanted to have and then got it.

• 1:05:28Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:28Speaker 02

  Because then you can maintain it for as long, at least the results would have held longer, I think for me.

• 1:05:33Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:33Speaker 02

  Um, but hopefully, you know, in the next year or so, I'll be able to get a new mommy makeover.

• 1:05:37Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, well, maybe they'll come out with a new procedure and we can all just fucking get it.

• 1:05:40Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:05:40Bunnie XO?

  Um, are you gonna have any more babies? Are you open to having more babies?

• 1:05:45Speaker 02

  I am in a relationship now and you know, I, yes.

• 1:05:50Bunnie XO?

  Are we allowed to know who you're in a relationship with?

• 1:05:52Speaker 02

  His name's Elijah.

• 1:05:53Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 1:05:53Speaker 02

  Yeah. And he is, we're gonna talk about it on my podcast, but he's younger than me.

• 1:05:58Bunnie XO?

  Uh huh.

• 1:05:58Speaker 02

  So we have that in common, I think.

• 1:06:00Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, yep.

• 1:06:01Speaker 02

  Yep. So, um, you know, he, he deserves kids of his own.

• 1:06:05Bunnie XO?

  I love that. I love that. You're just, you're just gonna make your own little fucking football team.

• 1:06:09Speaker 02

  I have to.

• 1:06:10Bunnie XO?

  You gotta have a girl, though. You need a girl.

• 1:06:13Speaker 02

  We'll see.

• 1:06:14Bunnie XO?

  It's time.

• 1:06:17Bunnie XO?

  You need two twin girls. I'm speaking it into your life.

• 1:06:20Speaker 02

  Please do that.

• 1:06:22Bunnie XO?

  Well, Kale, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. You're a real doll.

• 1:06:25Speaker 02

  I love you.

• 1:06:25Bunnie XO?

  Dude, please come back. I love you more.

• 1:06:27Speaker 02

  I absolutely will.

• 1:06:28Bunnie XO?

  All right. Shout out where everybody can find you.

• 1:06:30Speaker 02

  I am.

• 1:06:31Bunnie XO?

  If they haven't been able to find you already.

• 1:06:32Speaker 02

  If you haven't found me, you don't know who I am, at Kale Lowry on all platforms.

• 1:06:36Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, that's pretty simple.

• 1:06:38Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:06:38Bunnie XO?

  Thank you guys for tuning into another episode of Dumb Blonde. I will see you guys next week. Bye.