Dumb Blonde Podcast: Jacoby Shaddix

Bunnie sits down with Papa Roach frontman Jacoby Shaddix for a raw, unfiltered deep dive into addiction, faith, fame, and fighting to stay alive in the music industry. From childhood trauma and getting sober to breaking the one-hit-wonder curse and selling millions of records, Jacoby shares the real story behind the chaos. They talk mental health, marriage, fatherhood, band evolution, and how “Scars” went from being rejected by a producer to becoming one of the biggest rock crossovers ever. Plus, the Ozzfest moment that humbled him, the gratitude that keeps him grounded, and why he’s still hungry after all these years. Jacoby Shaddix: Website https://paparoachmerch.com Watch Full Episodes & More: YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@Dumbblondepod

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Bunnie XO?

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• 0:41Bunnie XO?

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• 1:07Bunnie XO?

  Is this thing on? What's up you sexy motherfuckers? Welcome to another episode of Dumb Blonde. Today we have the ultimate rock star, Jacoby Shaddix is in the house, baby.

• 1:18Speaker 01

  What's up? What's up? What's good?

• 1:19Bunnie XO?

  Dude, I've been trying to get you on here forever.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  I know, it's been a minute.

• 1:22Bunnie XO?

  What the hell?

• 1:23Speaker 01

  I'm glad we finally made it happen. I'm super stoked.

• 1:26Bunnie XO?

  Dude, me too. I was like, I was watching you do everybody else's podcast and I was like, why is he not coming on my podcast? I know. I'm like, dude, put our name in the hat. I want Jacoby on. And the one reason why I wanted you on so badly is because I honestly feel like you are the true definition of a rock star. Because you take accountability, your vulnerability, and your self-awareness is top tier.

• 1:50Speaker 01

  I mean, sometimes I feel like I'm like too, too self-aware. You know what I mean? I'm like critiquing everything that's going through my mind, every thought, every decision, every move. But I think also like, that's been one of my gifts as well as to like, really take accountability, to be self-aware. And I think that's really how I've grown and it's given me an opportunity to have a career. I think if I just kept rolling like a bull in a china shop, like I was when I first came in the business, I don't think it would have ended well. And so I think just kind of having some of that clarity. Has given me, you know, a shot to keep doing this thing. And I'm, I mean, I'm so grateful. I've been in the games. We started the band in 93. So it's like, I've been in it, doing it for a long time.

• 2:33Speaker 01

  And, you know, I'm just grateful that I could still be doing this and still be making an impact and still be touching people's lives through this music. And, you know, for you to say like, this cat's a rock star. It's like you married to one of the best. You know what I mean? So it means a lot.

• 2:47Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, no, I mean, real recognize real. And that's why my husband loves you so much too, because you are just who you are. But do you think that, um, you know, the growth and evolving is what has kept you in the game as long as you've been?

• 3:01Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 3:02Bunnie XO?

  Sincerely, if you, I, I went through my party stages too, back in the day. Hold on, here's my husband. We have to take this call. We have to take this call.

• 3:11Speaker 01

  Right quick.

• 3:12Bunnie XO?

  Okay, I love you. Bye bye.

• 3:15Bunnie XO?

  Okay, bye.

• 3:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, I watched, uh, I watched his, uh, his Rogan podcast. And he was talking about his whole journey and I was, I was so impressed.

• 3:24Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 3:24Speaker 01

  I just, it's so awesome to see that, just that miraculous change in him. And, you know, I'll be straight, like, he was one of the guys I was like, is he gonna make it through?

• 3:35Bunnie XO?

  Worried about him. As his wife, I was worried about him.

• 3:38Speaker 01

  Even like Marilyn Manson for a while, when I heard like he had like, switched things up and he was another one of those guys. I was like, is he gonna make it out, you know? And it's just so cool to like, see that transformation in people, you know, I've experienced that in my own life and I get, I get the struggle. I get that just feeling like you're just stuck in this, like this, this prison inside of ourselves. And I think for me, I mean, mine was like drinking, you know, and it was, it, it, it evolved into the pills and, and some of that. But I just, it was, I just felt enslaved, like truly in bondage to it. And so, you know, to see people go through that transformation, it's so powerful.

• 4:20Speaker 01

  And it's like, what we can do with our lives, once we like shed the, that old shell of ourselves, it's like,

• 4:30Speaker 01

  I mean, that's another reason why I'm still in the game. It's like the sky's the limit. It's like it gives me, it gave me another shot at life. It gave me, you know, like a renewed, like, passion.

• 4:42Bunnie XO?

  Sense of purpose.

• 4:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, just it gave, it just gave me so much. It helped me like, restore relationships, you know, rebuild relationships, rebuild a relationship with myself, you know, like, looking in the mirror and like, just for years, just going, fuck you, you know, and that like, just that raw feeling of like, just kind of self hate. And to just not be in that place anymore. It's like, God's freedom.

• 5:06Bunnie XO?

  It's amazing.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, it is.

• 5:07Bunnie XO?

  I saw a viral clip of you actually talking about your faith and about how you got saved. And it actually made me tear up because, you know, I'm on my own journey with God too. And so is my husband and um, just seeing somebody who has um, an ear on the youth, the way that you do, because I mean, you can sit behind a pulpit and preach all day long.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:29Bunnie XO?

  But you have one hit song and that you're going to reach, reach millions and millions of people who need to hear that. And so to hear that coming from you, standing on the stage, like that's, that was really fucking awesome.

• 5:40Speaker 01

  I, I'd, I'll tell you this, like, my faith walk has been, it's been a, like a wrestling match, you know, and it was, it started with my sobriety.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  I started going to meetings and, and going to recovering, recovery houses and stuff like that. And, you know, they're like, you need to find, find God or a God, a God of your understanding. And it was a journey for me for years. And I'll tell you, like, the, the two thing, like the, the two things I never wanted to be in my life was sober and a Christian.

• 6:12Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 6:13Speaker 01

  And like, and here I am now, you know what I'm saying? Like,

• 6:16Bunnie XO?

  So powerful.

• 6:17Speaker 01

  A sober guy and uh, my, but it was a rocky path, you know, to find that and a lot of failure. And a lot of questioning and, you know, turning my will over to God and following, and then taking it all back and then living my way and then, you know, repeatedly finding myself like, just in that deep, dark hole. And, you know, when I finally put the bottle down and really like, is that like that foxhole prayer, you know, where I'm just like, God, like, Do you just hear me? Can you hear me like I need a miraculous change? I need something like beyond what I can do because I kept trying to like control the change in my life.

• 6:58Speaker 01

  And it just, the walls fell, you know? And I had a fella that I was real close with that kind of walked my faith journey out with me. And, you know, I was like very skeptical and very like, ah, these church people are weird, you know? And, and then when I saw like this faith walk like alive in front of me and somebody like talking the talk and walking the walk. And I saw the transformation, it became alive to me and that it became, I was less fearful of, all right, I'll, I'll try to believe, you know? And then it became like, I'm a, I'm a full blown believer. Now it's like, I'm doing a Bible study with a buddy of mine and like, it's like, it is, it's tripping me out because it's like,

• 7:41Speaker 01

  I'm starting to experience like different levels of, of freedom, of bondage of self. And like things that maybe I once thought were acceptable in my life. Now I'm like, ah, man, that ain't serving you, man. It's not like, it's not working for you anymore. It's like, it's hindering your growth. It's messing up relationships. This is a little secret that you're keeping back tucked away over here. You know what I mean? And like the more that I like purge these things and turn it over and just walk in the light. It's just, I, I feel like it's the way, it's the path, you know? And because I've tried the other way, you know what I mean? And it's like, I, you know, the whole rock and roll.

• 8:20Speaker 01

  And I was, I was kind of very, I didn't want to share it with people because I felt that it wasn't edgy and it wasn't rock and roll. And I'm like, again, like, I'm not here to prove like that I'm like edgy and rock and roll like I'm. I think you've already proven that. Yeah, I done lived it and I saw where it like was taking me. And I'm like, and then you, I watched the VH1 specials of like, for instance, like bands like say Aerosmith, right? And it's just like, you hear this like downward spiral and this just wreckage and the family's falling apart. And I'm like, I ain't try, I'm trying to like break that chain. You know what I mean? Like I'm here trying to break that chain.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  I ain't trying to like repeat because the Shaddix family, like where I'm from, my people like come from a long line of, of alcoholics, cheaters, broken people, murderers, that type of.

• 9:15Speaker 01

  Lineage. And so I'm like, I'm not, that's not, that's not who I am. That's not like why I'm here. It's not, that's not me, you know?

• 9:21Bunnie XO?

  Jacoby, that's beautiful. And I feel like that's what people need to hear, especially from somebody like you. And I'm so proud of you.

• 9:28Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 9:28Bunnie XO?

  Because to say what you just said, all of that, like, and I want to clip that because it was just so beautiful is just, you're bringing people to faith and letting them know that it's cool.

• 9:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know?

• 9:39Bunnie XO?

  We're making God cool again.

• 9:41Speaker 01

  I'm telling, well, even like, you know, watching you and Jelly, y'all's, your life and the arc of you guys from afar. It's like, I see the same in you guys. And it's like Jelly, you know, when he's talking about God on stage, like, I love that. That, that inspires me. It makes me go, okay, it's, I can get up here and talk about this. And, you know, the more and more I open up about it, the more and more I realize like, I'm not in this rock and roll family and in this rock and roll world, like, there's more believers than I realized, you know? I was like, I was out on a, what was it? We did Whiskey Jam the other night.

• 10:12Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, congratulations on that.

• 10:14Speaker 01

  It was dope. It was dope.

• 10:15Bunnie XO?

  And, and the viral clips of you singing, I was like, go Jacoby.

• 10:19Speaker 01

  It was cool as a dream, you know? So growing up a Johnny Cash fan, like, to be able to step, you know, on Broadway and know that I'm gonna go perform in a, in a, in a venue that, you know, maybe he had once walked through or, you know, had a drink in or whatnot, like, just to know that, like, this is his town. And to get up in there and play a song stripped down, it was just a vibe.

• 10:40Bunnie XO?

  We need to get you in the Ryman. We need to get you to do a stripped down acoustic show in the Ryman.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  Let them know.

• 10:45Bunnie XO?

  I'm telling, I'm telling them right now.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  Call your people.

• 10:48Bunnie XO?

  We're rooting for you. If anybody can make it happen, it's my husband for sure. But yeah.

• 10:52Speaker 01

  I, I really enjoyed it. We premiered a brand new song. Um, we got this song called Wake Up Calling. It's about to drop in a couple of days. Um, and this one is like,

• 11:03Speaker 01

  I'd say it's like somewhere in between, like,

• 11:07Speaker 01

  Scars Papa Roach and Leave a Light On Papa Roach. And so we started the song on an acoustic guitar, built it from there and then built it into this really emotive rock track and then did the acoustic jam and just stripped it back down to the purest form. I, as I get older and the more we write, I love that experience of just stripping the track down and just starting from the, you know, just the nuts and bolts of acoustic guitar and a vocal. And if you could build it from there, I feel like there's something special.

• 11:37Bunnie XO?

  It's just so personal too. Like whenever you can connect with your audience with just a guitar, your voice and emotion.

• 11:43Speaker 01

  I wish I could play guitar too, man. I'm terrible. I'm like, I got dicks for fingers.

• 11:47Bunnie XO?

  My husband tries to pretend that he can play guitar and I'm like, you know, one song and it's his song with MGK. Like he taught himself, he literally taught himself how to play that song and it's the cutest thing.

• 11:58Speaker 01

  Good on him.

• 11:59Bunnie XO?

  So let's circle back and just talk a little bit about your childhood because I truly believe that people's childhoods influence their decisions later on in life. And you grew up in California. Your parents split when you were younger. Can we go on that journey of where so much hurt and so much of your pain had come from? Because you write about it in your lyrics, but I don't ever really hear you talk about it.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, so my father, Richard Kent Shaddix, he was a Vietnam veteran. He grew, he was like a, I think the ninth child in his family. And he was just dealt with a pretty raw set of cards. He was drafted to Vietnam, went to Vietnam, fought a war he didn't believe in. Just trauma on trauma on trauma. And my mom, you know, she's like just a sweet girl, born in Michigan, came out to California, fell in love with this wild hippie. And when my dad came back from Nam, he was wanting to be a recluse, you know? So he was like, I'm gonna go live in the high country.

• 13:08Speaker 01

  My parents, you know, were really poor, but I think in the seventies, it was like,

• 13:13Speaker 01

  Being poor was, you know, it's not such a big thing when you're like living that hippie lifestyle. You know, they were living in a van, you know, it was like, I, I, I've lived in some very interesting places as a child. First, I mean, the first year was, uh, in a van. Next one was in somebody's screened in laundry porch, you know? And so not necessarily homeless, but we didn't have a house of our own. You guys were kind of like gypsies. Yeah, essentially. Yeah. And then, uh, we lived, we lived in a teepee for a year, like no, no lie. How old were you? This is, I was probably like two and a half, three years old. Wow.

• 13:51Speaker 01

  We did that. My dad then became a logger for a while and, uh, he was all the while, like, you know, partying and raging and disappearing for a couple of weeks here and there. And, uh, yeah, we lived in a tent for a while when he was logging. And then finally my mom kind of had enough, uh, and she was just like, we need to like live in a home. Like we need to stop being gypsies. And so we finally settled in this place called Nipponowasi, which is like NorCal, kind of by a place, a Wani up in, uh, you know, where Yosemite is. Yeah, a little bit. Is it up by like San, San Luis Obispo area? No, Central California hills. Okay. You know, just kind of tucked away from society. And so my dad was a recluse and had his own problems and his struggles.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  And I just, I idolized him. I thought he was just the salt of the earth because, you know, I mean, he loved me. He loved me to death. He really did. But he just didn't know how to be an honest family man. And, uh, when he left and it just, it broke me. It just totally broke me. And, and, and it wasn't that he was ever abusive towards me at all. It just left this like hole in my heart, you know, and. How old were you? And I was, uh, at this time I was probably like six or, I don't know, seven or eight, actually. When they finally split, it was a back and forth and back and forth. He'd come and go, and I just always was like, where's dad, you know? And he was always absent and.

• 15:16Speaker 01

  And once they finally split, he just disappeared from my life. And that was like true. That was traumatic for me just because it was like he was my hero. That's abandonment. Yeah. Oh, it was her. It sucked. And to anybody that's gone through that, it's just, it's terrible. It's just, it's, and so I vowed to myself, I didn't want to, you know, repeat that cycle. And so I think that that was the beginning of this, like, this tra- trauma in my life that I didn't really know how to heal from. And, you know, my mom started dating and she met this guy who eventually became my stepdad. And I was a horrific stepson in the beginning. I was, I remember that we were celebrating his birthday this one time.

• 15:59Speaker 01

  And my mom got the cake and they're singing happy birthday and I like threw the cake on the floor, you know? You were hurt. Oh, yeah, I was, I was, I was, you know, I looked back on it and I'm kind of like, okay, like, it's not so bad. But then I just was that abandonment, right? And I think that I, I didn't fully recover from that until I was probably in my mid twenties. I think when I finally sought him out and, you know, had a deep conversation with him about who he was and why he left and really never turned back. And it's, you know what's so wild? Like,

• 16:42Speaker 02

  Attention all new and existing members of the W D N C. I'm Melanie Sanders and this is the We Do Not Care Club Podcast. We got to midlife and realized we just simply do not care much anymore. Now we got to help each other make sense of hot flashes, dry coochie, chin hair, trifling families, brain fog and bat wings. We are not alone and we will be heard. So come join the W D N C. Follow and listen to the We Do Not Care Club Podcast with Melanie Sanders wherever you get your podcasts.

• 17:12Speaker 01

  Once I got to know him a little bit, it was, you know, I spent a couple of days with him and we got deep. I just remember sitting on this hilltop and he was telling me the story of his life and I just, I, I just felt sorry for him, you know, I just, when I, when I found out like what he had been through and who he was. And I just asked him straight up, I'm like, what the fuck? Like, why did you like never try to like, search me out? And he's like, I thought, I just thought that you would, you just hated me. I thought you were, you would just reject me. And I'm like, ah. Quite the opposite. Like, I just wanted to like, know who you were, you know? And that was like, I was a, that was a, that was a tough, but healing moment.

• 17:55Speaker 01

  You know, and, and in the process of being a young kid and having this stepdad that, that loved me, I never really like, allowed that love to, I never knew how to accept that love. I knew he did.

• 18:09Bunnie XO?

  You didn't want to get hurt again.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, and yeah, I think that's what it was. And my mom is just the salt of the earth, an amazing, loving, compassionate woman, that, uh, just taught me so much about life. And, you know, she taught me empathy. She taught me kindness. She, uh, supported my creativity. And so, I think my mom, you know, is, as she remarried, she wanted to provide like a stable environment for me to grow up in. And my stepdad now, it's like, he's my guy. Like, Bill Roach is the man.

• 18:45Bunnie XO?

  Bill, my dad's name is Bill.

• 18:47Speaker 01

  Okay, cool. All right, shout out to Bill.

• 18:49Bunnie XO?

  We love the Bills.

• 18:50Speaker 01

  That's right. And, uh, you know, he's a, he was just, he taught me like consistency. Um, but I was, I'm just so much different than him. I have this reckless, I had this reckless spirit, and this free spirit, and this creativity in me that just needed to like, come out. And, uh, you know, my,

• 19:12Speaker 01

  he provided this place that was safe, but I always just had this like, hole in me. And I didn't know how to, to really come to terms with it until I had a bit of reconciliation with my father and understood who he was and why he made the decisions he made.

• 19:34Speaker 01

  You know, my mom always warned me, she's like, you're, you are like, she would point things out in me that reminded her of my father, good and bad.

• 19:44Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 19:44Speaker 01

  And she was always like, you know, you better be careful. Cause like, you know, this drinking thing, like your dad was, he had a bad problem with it, you know, and I think.

• 19:52Bunnie XO?

  She was trying to guide you.

• 19:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, she was trying to like warn me like, hey, and I've just, I'm that type of knucklehead. Like I gotta, I gotta go hit the wall at a hundred miles an hour myself to, to really like, to learn.

• 20:05Bunnie XO?

  When did you start drinking?

• 20:07Speaker 01

  Uh, I, I started, I think, well, my mom said when I was young, they had these raging parties and I would like go around and like sip the bottoms of the drinks.

• 20:15Bunnie XO?

  I did the same thing at my parents' parties.

• 20:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was like, I was just that young kid, you know, uh, just wanting to, you know, get out, get outside of myself and not feel like myself, I think. Um, but it wasn't till I was, uh, I think it was like 14 that I.

• 20:31Bunnie XO?

  I think that's when everybody starts experimenting with alcohol.

• 20:35Speaker 01

  And my first experiment went horrific, horrifically wrong, you know, it's like.

• 20:40Bunnie XO?

  Tell, we would like to hear.

• 20:41Speaker 01

  Oh gosh. So, well, one of them was the, the first time I got caught, my parents had vodka and they kept it in the freezer and I kept drinking it. And then this wasn't the bad one, but I kept drinking it and then refilling it with water.

• 20:55Bunnie XO?

  Oh gosh.

• 20:55Speaker 01

  So then, you know, you know what I'm saying? Like you eventually drink so much, it started to freeze, right? My parents were like, Kobe, like, what are you doing? I'm like, what do you mean? That's not me. Not me. You know, well, then I was like, I got that taste for it because I, I, it made me like, have this kind of sense of ease and comfort. And, uh, I was, my stepdad had taught me about hard work, right? So I started, uh, working, I had my own business. It was jack of all trades. I had this little flyer and it was like, I, I have a wheelbarrow. I will travel. I'll pick weeds. I'll mow the lawn. I'll babysit.

• 21:30Bunnie XO?

  So you've always been a hustler?

• 21:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, totally. 100%. And so that was like 14 years old and I had my business. I went and made some money and my friend William Laney was like, dude, it's my birthday. I'm like, dude, I got like 30 bucks, dude. Let's get somebody, get some vodka for us. And the homie went, it was this guy I was friends with. He was like over 21. He went and bought me this bottle of vodka. I went to my friend's house and we drank this thing to the bottom. And he, he was like, there was this girl around the corner from his house. He wanted to profess his love to her because you know, you make all the right decisions when you're hammered.

• 22:00Bunnie XO?

  And fourteen.

• 22:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, dude, we crawled, we crawled over there and I, we were, I was puking in the road, you know, blacked out. He's trying to confess his love. They called the cops. We get detained. And, uh, yeah, the next day was like, uh, you know, walk of shame. Back, back home. My parents, you know, were like, what are you doing? Like, and I'm like, oh, I don't know. I just wanted to party. And, uh, that was like, kind of the beginning for me. And I, uh, I really started to like, you know, take my sips when I could and, you know, stand out in front of the grocery store. And when I saw somebody 21 or older, I'm like, hey, man, you go, you pick me up a couple of forties, you know, and do that.

• 22:40Bunnie XO?

  I feel like kids these days will never know those.

• 22:42Speaker 01

  Oh dude, that was that, dude, we did beer runs, man.

• 22:45Bunnie XO?

  Oh, the beer runs, dude.

• 22:47Speaker 01

  They made me feel alive. I was like, oh yeah, dude, I'm gonna, I'm like, I'd be in my little Red Ranger in the front and tell where my bass player would run in there. Grab, grab a case of beer, dude. We go out to the cuts, the barn, you know, do the bonfire and the drinking and the whole deal. And, you know, eventually, you know, started smoking. And then I remember I got my wisdom teeth pulled and they gave me a bottle of Vicodin. That's when I discovered Vicodin.

• 23:09Bunnie XO?

  Me too. It's in my book that I'm about to drop. I li, I call it getting percolated.

• 23:13Speaker 01

  Oh dude, I was, I was twerking. Man, I did not take his prescribed.

• 23:18Bunnie XO?

  At all. But the first time you take that pill and it gives you that relief that you've never had before, that's what gets you hooked. And but then you'd never get that feeling again.

• 23:28Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 23:28Bunnie XO?

  It's, it's, you get it one time. It's euphoric and you, you chase that high for the rest of your.

• 23:34Speaker 01

  It's a bottomless pit. It really is.

• 23:36Bunnie XO?

  It is.

• 23:37Speaker 01

  I mean, God, yeah. But you know, I had to touch that flame. That was like the thing. And all around this time, you know, I'm, I'm in high school, right? So.

• 23:46Bunnie XO?

  When does music enter? Have you always been musical? Where does the musical chops come from?

• 23:53Speaker 01

  So, uh, music is in the family. My grandmother was a singer. Her father was in the big bands like in the 1930s and stuff like that. So he was in the pit orchestra for the Marx Brothers and they did a lot of traveling and he played piano and clarinet, saxophone, you name it. Um, and did that life. And then my grandma sang in like the chorus lines and stuff like that. My mom wasn't really musically inclined, but had a love for music. And I just grew up loving music. Like it was just, I fell in love with, I remember Poison was like one of the first bands. I was like, dude, these guys are sick. Nothing but a good time.

• 24:27Bunnie XO?

  I love all the hair bands. I still love dudes in makeup. Like it is my, I love it.

• 24:31Speaker 01

  I was such a huge fan and uh, yeah, shout out to Bret Michaels, dude. You're fricking awesome, dude. You're the real deal. Um, but yeah, discovered music and just, I was the kid with the wiffle ball bat in the front yard, playing air guitar and setting up the trash cans upside down in the garage, you know, playing with fire, beating on drums, putting on my own pyro in the garage, like doing, you know, just like a goofball. And I just had this love for music. And then when I finally got in high school and met, uh, my OG drummer, Dave Buckner, we were playing football in high school together. And, uh, I was a drummer, he was a drummer, and we were like, dude, let's, let's, let's hook up and like, put our drum sets together to make like a real big drum set.

• 25:11Bunnie XO?

  So you do play drums?

• 25:12Speaker 01

  Yes, that was my first, uh, rock instrument. I grew up playing clarinet. I played in the, I'm like a band geek. And so I played in the school band. Sorry?

• 25:20Bunnie XO?

  I, I played the viola. I was in band. Or no, I was in orchestra. I wasn't cool enough to be in-

• 25:24Speaker 01

  Shout out to the band geeks.

• 25:25Bunnie XO?

  I wasn't allowed to be in band. I was in orchestra though.

• 25:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's cool though. That's cool. That's what's up. Um, so yeah, I went to band camp, did that whole, did that whole deal. That was awesome. The band kids were wild. Honestly, like we were wild. And, uh, I did some partying with the school band as well at band camp, straight up.

• 25:43Bunnie XO?

  Was it like American Pie?

• 25:44Speaker 01

  Straight for real, for real. But yeah, band, band kids, orchestra kids, theater kids. We were like the D low crazy wild ones. But I also played school sports and that's where I met Dave, the drummer. And so we put our drum sets together. And he turned out to be a way better drummer than I did, than I was. And so I was like, all right, well dude, I want to play. Let's make music. And so I, I love Flea from the Red Hot Chili Peppers. I just thought he was the coolest. And so I was like, well, I'll buy a bass. And so bought a bass guitar. And I wasn't so good at bass. And I was, at this time, I was working at a place called Fresh Choice.

• 26:24Speaker 01

  And this is right when I, I, I met my wife, well, my, eventually would become my wife.

• 26:31Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 26:31Speaker 01

  And I met her around this time and I'm experimenting with music and I'm starting to like, who's this girl? What's up with this right here?

• 26:40Speaker 01

  So then I'm at work one night and I come out and all the windows are busted out of my truck. And I'm like, what the, oh dude, I'm like, look, go in the back of the truck and my bass is gone. And I'm like, yeah, what is like, I can't, I can't be a, I'm not the drummer because he's way better than me. And now my bass is stolen, straight broke. I'm living on my own at this time because I moved out of my house when I was like 17. You know, that typical story of like, if you don't want to live by our rules, you gotta live on your own. And I'm like, well, good thing you taught me the hard work ethic because I could just go rent a room from the homie. I'm out.

• 27:14Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. You're like, I got this. I know everything.

• 27:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I had a little side hustles, you know, selling Mexican brown weed at the time too. So I had a little extra money on the side. So I was like, cool. I could pay my rent.

• 27:25Speaker 01

  Well, I got my bass stolen and I was like, fuck, like I want to play music. And, and Dave Buckner was just like, dude, be a singer. It's free. And I was just like, all right, I'm gonna be a singer.

• 27:36Bunnie XO?

  I love the logic. That's so real though. Like how deep and so just easy.

• 27:41Speaker 01

  Yes. And, and that's what I did. I just grabbed a mic and, and started screaming on the mic in the garage.

• 27:46Bunnie XO?

  Did you ever know that you could sing? Sorry to cut you off.

• 27:49Speaker 01

  I was god awful singer when I first started. I wasn't one of those kids that was like, The kid in the back of the room that was kind of gifted and like could sing and carry a tune.

• 27:58Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Nah dude, I was just the ki- I was the kid that was like, I was friends with the stoners, the freaks, the geeks, the jocks, the popular kids.

• 28:06Bunnie XO?

  The outcasts, yeah.

• 28:06Speaker 01

  I was kind of like friends with everybody. And so I was the guy that was like the ringleader in a way and like, I knew how to like, you know, rally the people. And so I was voted most unique in my class. I guess that's like the most popular weird guy, I guess. I don't know.

• 28:21Bunnie XO?

  It's a compliment though. It's a compliment.

• 28:23Speaker 01

  Hey, I'll take it. Um, but yeah, so I guess being a singer kind of felt like it was natural. I, I grew up playing a clarinet. So I understood like breath control and stuff like that. And so I got a mic in my hand and I was, it was just off to the races.

• 28:35Bunnie XO?

  Game over.

• 28:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, straight up. And I was like, I couldn't carry a tune, but I wanted to rap and I wanted to scream.

• 28:41Bunnie XO?

  I find that so hard to believe that you couldn't carry a tune, especially listening to you now, because I think that you're one of the last of a dying breed, like one of the best rock front people. And I'm not just saying that because I'm a, I am a huge music fan. My dad was a musician, so I grew up in the industry too. And I just, you have just this presence. I've seen you perform, you know, and it's the way you command, the way you sing. Like I just find that hard to believe that you didn't have that to start with.

• 29:10Speaker 01

  If you listen to some of the early recordings, you'd be like, oh, this is him.

• 29:15Bunnie XO?

  I'm gonna go back and listen.

• 29:16Speaker 01

  Don't even do it, please.

• 29:17Bunnie XO?

  I'm doing it.

• 29:18Speaker 01

  It's honestly like, I've made all my creative mistakes in Papa Roach, because P. Roach is like, Papa Roach is my first band. Like I didn't start like 20 different bands and go, you know, this, that and the third. It was like.

• 29:31Bunnie XO?

  I read that you guys were originally called Kobe Dick though.

• 29:34Speaker 01

  Uh, well, I used to be called Kobe Dick. That's what they used to call me back in the day. I, uh, so that name came from, uh, my wife had, yeah, we were married at this, at this point, we were married. She was the one with the good credit.

• 29:48Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 29:48Speaker 01

  And the band, we all had terrible credit. And we needed.

• 29:52Bunnie XO?

  Shout out to wifey.

• 29:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, dude, for real. Thank you, babe.

• 29:55Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 29:55Speaker 01

  And she reminds me.

• 29:56Bunnie XO?

  Real one, dude.

• 29:57Speaker 01

  She is.

• 29:58Bunnie XO?

  Thirty years and we're gonna talk about her later, but yeah.

• 30:01Speaker 01

  So she co-signed for us to get this van and we called it Moby Dick. And all the boys called me Kobe, right? And I was like, it just stuck. They were like, I'm like, oh yeah, Kobe Dick driving Moby Dick, dude, this is my deal, you know? And it just kind of stuck. And so, yeah, man, that was my, that was my AKA back in the day. I was a big Wu-Tang fan too. So it was like Wu-Tang had all these like aliases.

• 30:23Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 30:23Speaker 01

  And so I thought, I thought that was cool, you know, but eventually I was like,

• 30:28Speaker 01

  I kept reading in like, after we became popular and the band blew up, I, in like magazines, it would be like, Dick says, and I'm like, I'm like, do I want to be known as Dick my whole life? Like, I just, my, my original name, like my, my birth name, Jacoby Dakota Shaddix is way cooler than Kobe Dick.

• 30:48Bunnie XO?

  Rock star name.

• 30:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, totally.

• 30:49Bunnie XO?

  You can't have a name like that and not become a rock star.

• 30:52Speaker 01

  I was like, I gotta, I gotta go back to the OG name, but yeah, I'm a little all over the place. But yeah, Kobe Dick was my name back in the day. Mr. Dick, if you're nasty. Dr. Dick, if you're sick.

• 31:01Bunnie XO?

  So did you rap whenever you first started or were you singing?

• 31:05Speaker 01

  I wa- I wanted to be like a cross between like Wu-Tang, you know, method. I wanted to be a cross between like Method Man and Chino from the Deftones. Those were like two of my fa- and totally like polar opposite types of artists.

• 31:20Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 31:21Speaker 01

  Um, but I just had this really like eclectic, diverse love of music. And I just, I was off to the races, you know, like once I had that mic in my hand and, you know, we started playing shows in front of people and we played all the backyard parties. You know what I mean?

• 31:35Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 31:36Speaker 01

  We play, we put on parties. We, I remember.

• 31:39Bunnie XO?

  That was like, in order to get discovered back in the day, you had to fucking put in work.

• 31:44Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 31:45Bunnie XO?

  Like nowadays you make a TikTok go viral and you're on the, on the charts. And it's like, you guys, like even, I did it with my husband. We had to grind.

• 31:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, you grinded it out.

• 31:54Bunnie XO?

  I saw him play to shows of five people.

• 31:56Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 31:57Bunnie XO?

  You know, like. And but I feel like that makes for like such great artists.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Oh, absolutely. I think that it's like, those are the moments, the proving grounds, I think, for real artists. Like, if you can thug it out through those rugged moments, right? Where I remember, like, when you were saying, like, playing in front of five people, I remember being in Denver, Colorado, at this place called The Lion's Den, and we played in front of seven people, and two of them were the bartenders.

• 32:21Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 32:21Speaker 01

  You know what I mean?

• 32:22Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 32:22Speaker 01

  And it's like-

• 32:23Bunnie XO?

  We've had nights like that.

• 32:24Speaker 01

  I remember-

• 32:24Bunnie XO?

  Totally.

• 32:25Speaker 01

  I remember playing in, like, Tucson, Arizona, and we showed up, and we're handing out our demo tapes, and then we start playing, and people start throwing our demo tapes back at us, like, at our faces.

• 32:36Bunnie XO?

  Oh, no.

• 32:37Speaker 01

  And I'm like, fuck you. You know, so we had, we, we, we had all those moments where it was just like, it, what got, you know what it was? It was what got us through those moments that were tough was the brotherhood, you know, and like, working through those moments, being poor together, and barely scraping enough money together to get enough gas to the next city.

• 32:58Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  And those, I think those moments, like, you guys have lived through yourselves, right? Where it's like, it just builds character.

• 33:05Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 33:05Speaker 01

  You know, and it's like, that's the stuff-

• 33:07Bunnie XO?

  Humbling.

• 33:08Speaker 01

  Exactly, very humbling.

• 33:09Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 33:09Speaker 01

  But then it also, it's like, I found so much joy, like, as I look back at those moments, there was like, so much joy and so much fun-

• 33:17Bunnie XO?

  So much, yes.

• 33:17Speaker 01

  -in the discovery of, like, traveling to a new town, meeting new people, you know, we had a mailing list, oh, we got 25 names on the mailing list tonight, you know, and like, oh, we sold 30 t-shirts, and we got, you know, we got 300 bucks in the band fund, dude, we're ballin', dude.

• 33:32Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 33:33Speaker 01

  You know, it's like, we can go to IHOP tonight, you know, like, I just, I, I look back so fondly in those moments, and so grateful that we had those moments, because

• 33:44Speaker 01

  when the times got tough, after, you know, we had our success, and we kind of had an arc, and it felt like the industry was, we were done and over with, like, those were the moments that got us through-

• 33:57Speaker 01

  The dark times in our career after like big popularity. You know, we'd, we'd pick each other up and dust each other off and go like, all right, man, we got this. Like, we just keep thugging it out. Let's just keep pushing forward. And, and so it built that brotherhood strong.

• 34:13Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, and character.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure.

• 34:15Bunnie XO?

  And the trust.

• 34:16Speaker 01

  Mad character.

• 34:16Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, for sure. Nothing like being broken down on the side of the road and just having to fucking hitchhike or find a ride to the nearest gas station to change a flat tire. Yeah, I get it.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  That Moby Dick, dude, I remember where that thing died, dude. We were on our way to Vegas, dude, and we're going uphill and it's like overheating. It's like, you know, the thing dies on the side of the road. We got a call like AAA, you know, hitchhiking. We eventually got to Vegas. We were three hours late for the show. We put the show on anyways, you know, like those are the moments.

• 34:46Bunnie XO?

  They are the moments that you, I always tell Jay, like, cause we have so much going on now. And sometimes I look at him and it's just me and him and I'm like, do you ever miss when it was just us? And like, you know, 10 years ago, when it like, none of this was around. And he's like, absolutely. Like, cause it was so simple, but it was like so fulfilling at the same time. Even though we were struggling like a mofo, it was just those moments were just so cool.

• 35:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, I agree. It's like, you know, that saying, more money, more problems.

• 35:16Bunnie XO?

  For sure.

• 35:17Speaker 01

  It's real.

• 35:18Bunnie XO?

  Absolutely.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  It's just, you know, but it's like, it's also how do we navigate those, those problems now, right? It's like, and things that sometimes I think are problems, like, man, that's a champagne problem.

• 35:27Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 35:29Speaker 01

  Fuck dude, I'm going to Nashville. The flight's canceled. I got a middle seat. And I'm like, champagne problems, dude.

• 35:37Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 35:38Speaker 01

  Humble yourself, bro. You're going to Nashville to rip a new track. It, you know, stop being a little, I got this saying, my, my brother in law taught me, he's like, DBAB. I'm like, what's DBAB? He's like, don't be a bitch. I'm like. True.

• 35:53Bunnie XO?

  You're like noted, I'm gonna write that down.

• 35:55Speaker 01

  Yep, I did. I wrote, I literally have a jacket that I wear. It's this camo jacket. And on the inside of it, it says DBAB. You know, I was like, because we were doing these acoustic runs and I was just exhausted and I'm like, ah, God, I just want to do this. I'm like worn out. I look inside my jacket and I'm like, alright.

• 36:12Bunnie XO?

  You said something in a podcast that actually stuck with me when I was on the treadmill last night. You said, when I make plans, God laughs.

• 36:18Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 36:18Bunnie XO?

  And I was like, that's so real.

• 36:20Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 36:20Bunnie XO?

  And I was like, I'm stealing that. So if you ever hear me say that, I'm gonna, I will credit you.

• 36:25Speaker 01

  I probably stole it from somebody else. You know what I mean? That's just, it's just one of those sayings. It's like, yeah, when I make plans, God laughs.

• 36:32Bunnie XO?

  But it's so true.

• 36:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it is, man.

• 36:36Bunnie XO?

  So, moving forward, let's talk about when you guys, in 2000, when you guys drop your, was it your first, like, your first big album that made it big?

• 36:47Speaker 01

  That was our first major label record. Yeah, and so 2000, I mean,

• 36:52Bunnie XO?

  It was Infest, right?

• 36:53Speaker 01

  Yes, Infest is the first one. And so, at this point, right, we're, we started the band in 93. We put out a bunch of independent EPs, you know, DIY, selling them out the trunk of the car, showing up to Korn shows with a boombox and like walking the line like, what the fuck Papa Roach five bucks? What the fuck Papa Roach five bucks? And I'd sling in the CDs like that, you know? And we learned that from like the hip hop culture, you know? And I love that that hustle was alive and I was just, it fit with my personality so well. I was just like, I'd be like, yo, what's up? I'm Kobe Dick. I'm about to, I'm about to sell you this record. You don't even know you're about to whip out five bucks. You give it to me before, you know, and I just was that guy. And so,

• 37:35Speaker 01

  all the while, we're sending off our music to all the record companies. We're getting turned down by everybody, you know, from, I mean, you name it, every, every, we're not punk enough for the punk label. We're not metal enough for the metal label. We don't have a, we don't have a, like, an image, you know? Like, you guys don't have, who are you, you know? And I'm like, well, fuck, dude, we're just, we're P. Roach from Vacaville, California. What the fuck? Like, what else you need? And I had this delusion that I was ready for the big time before I was ready for the big time.

• 38:02Bunnie XO?

  But that's what got you to where you are.

• 38:04Speaker 01

  Totally. Like, I feel like those, that,

• 38:06Bunnie XO?

  You manifested.

• 38:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's those, those delusions of grandeur, like, really served me well. And we eventually got a demo deal with DreamWorks, or sorry, with Warner Brothers. And we went and recorded like Last Resort and a handful of other songs. And then our A and R in that process got fired. And I'm like, I remember being in the van and just sitting with the boys going,

• 38:35Speaker 01

  like, what are we gonna do, man? Like, we'll just put it out independently.

• 38:38Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 38:38Speaker 01

  You know, and so that was the MO. So we're like, let's finish mixing these tracks. Well, while we were mixing these tracks, DreamWorks Records hollered at our management. They're like, we want to come down and hear some of the songs. So they came down to the studio, heard the songs, and they were like, all right. Like, they started to pursue us, court us, you know, take us out to dinner. We're like, oh, we'll take all the free dinners we can. We're hungry.

• 39:03Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 39:03Speaker 01

  You know, so we did that. And we eventually got a dream, a deal with DreamWorks. And that was just like, oh, my God, you know, I felt like I had made it to the top, you know? But, you know, all the while I realized like I was just at the bottom of another mountain. But grateful. And we went and recorded all these songs. And the A and R told the producer, Jay Baumgartner, he's like, don't mess with this band. Like, just let's get a great quality recording of these band's songs. You know, let's not try to like rewrite and rearrange and like, there's something magic in what these dudes are doing. And so we went in and recorded it. And this is like, at the point where like drinking really is starting to take off for me.

• 39:47Speaker 01

  I'm a couple of years into my marriage. My wife, Kelly, she's like, honey, like, you gotta watch yourself. Like, you better check yourself. And I did, I did not want to listen. I wasn't listening, you know? I was kind of off on my, off to the, off. Off to the races, as they say. And, and you know, when you're at the studio and you're like, you got a runner and they're like, is there anything you guys want? And I'm like, fuck yeah, I want to handle a vodka, like a bag of weed. Let's go.

• 40:14Bunnie XO?

  But also it probably made you feel like you could be more creative.

• 40:17Speaker 01

  At that time, yeah, it was like, it was part of the creativity. And I felt like, yeah, man, let's get the creative juices flowing. And it was part of it, you know?

• 40:25Bunnie XO?

  And it was a lifestyle for us. Yeah, part of, it was part of the culture. It was like a lifestyle for us that grew up in the 90s and the 2000s. We didn't like, all the kids work out now. And like, everybody's like, it's like a completely different culture. We grew up going to ditch parties and, you know, having kegs and for, you know, drinking 40s of Old E. And like, it was just a different lifestyle back then. Not that I make any excuses. I'm just painting a picture for people.

• 40:52Speaker 01

  That's just what it was. It was so, you know, and I think, you know, the parents weren't so like, oh, like worried about it.

• 40:59Bunnie XO?

  They were doing the same thing.

• 41:00Speaker 01

  Kids would be kids. Yeah. My parents were partying and doing the whole damn thing, you know? So it was just natural. And, and all the while, you know, we're, we're recording this record and we got something great in the can. And, and I remember like, the band was like, well, we're going to release this, probably sell like, you know, maybe 250,000 records, you know, if we're lucky. And I remember we, we got asked to come on Warped Tour. And Last Resort just came out on the radio and this is our first single. And this song just caught fire. Like, it was just, it's, it caught fire and it's still on fire. Like 25 years later.

• 41:40Bunnie XO?

  It's still on TikTok. Going crazy.

• 41:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank God. I'm like, it's like, yeah, it is the gift that keeps on giving straight up. And it was just like a rocket ship ride to the top. And I was, I totally was not prepared. I didn't know how to act. I just was like, I was not trained for press. I was not, you know, I just, I had no, I had a big heart, you know? And my intentions were good and we were passionate about the music. And we went out there and we traveled the world and we sold millions and millions of records. And it was a party on a party stacked on top of another party. And, you know, I was just getting, I was, I became, after about a year and a half of this touring on this album.

• 42:30Speaker 01

  The questionable decisions started happening, the infidelity started to happen. The addictions were really setting in. When I would wake up and look in the mirror, I started to like hate the person that I saw because I was beginning to like that voice in the back of my head and my mother telling me that like, watch yourself, you might become like, just like your father.

• 42:59Bunnie XO?

  But how amazing is that, that even through all of that and the addiction, you know, the infidelity and, did you ever get into drugs?

• 43:07Speaker 01

  Uh, you know, I did, I did cocaine a few times, you know, like Dave Chappelle says cocaine is a hell of a drug. And, but I never was like really into it. It was the drinking and the pills was the thing for me. I was kind of like a downer type of guy. And I'm super grateful that, you know, I didn't cross the line into like heroin or anything like that. But you know, I, I'd like to chew Vicodin and vodka. Like that was like a recipe for fucking let's go.

• 43:33Bunnie XO?

  Mine was Xanax, mine was Xanax and vodka.

• 43:35Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, all that. Yeah, I remember it all. And some of it I don't remember.

• 43:40Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. But how cool is it that you still had that conscience while you were doing all of that? You still, in the back of your head, you just knew that it wasn't right and that you didn't want to be that person.

• 43:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, I didn't, you know, and I, and I had a wife that was my ride or die. And you know, she was like, yo, like, what are you doing?

• 43:58Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 43:59Speaker 01

  Why are you living like this? And, and I just.

• 44:01Bunnie XO?

  Cause she knew you before this.

• 44:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, dude, straight up. She fell in love with the janitor at the hospital. Like that's what my job was at the time, you know? And like, we got married and I was a janitor at a hospital. I was cleaning toilets, right? And so like, that type of love, like, yeah, that's a hard one to break, you know? And like, we like to joke, you know, we're about to be 30 years married coming up.

• 44:24Bunnie XO?

  Three decades. That's wild.

• 44:26Speaker 01

  Is it 29 or 30 coming up? I think it's, I think it's 30, 90. No, it's, it'll be 29, uh, next year will be 30. Um, and so we're coming up.

• 44:35Bunnie XO?

  Close enough.

• 44:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, 29 and coming up, we're 28 right now and, uh,

• 44:40Speaker 01

  We like to joke, you know, that the only reason we're still married is because we never wanted to get a divorce at the same time.

• 44:48Bunnie XO?

  That's awesome, though.

• 44:49Speaker 01

  And it's like, there's been moments where, you know, I was, I was in full flight from reality and I didn't want to be in this relationship. And then there was moments where she didn't want to be in this relationship, you know, I was, there was a moment where I was, you know, kicked out the house and we were, we were on the outs and I'm living at my, you know, I got this big old, you know, mansion of a house and I'm living at my brother's in this little 10 by 10 bedroom out of the trunk of my, you know, Challenger car. My clothes are in there and I'm just kind of vagabond living and like trying to get my life right. And, uh, you know, we've been through those, those moments, you know, we've been through

• 45:30Speaker 01

  the therapy, we've been through the marriage counseling, um, you know, countlets attempts of sobriety, you know, and, and she's just loved me through the most broken, like my most broken moments in my life and, uh, I am like, I am blessed, you know, beyond blessed to have a woman like that, that like loves, has loved me through my crazy and, uh,

• 46:01Bunnie XO?

  She loves your soul.

• 46:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. She, she see, you know, she sees something in me that I didn't see in myself a lot of the time. And, uh, it's, she's been patient with me and, uh, she's, she's allowed me to make, make some serious mistakes and forgiven me for those mistakes. And, you know, I mean, it ain't perfect. It takes two to tango, you know, and it's like, you know, we've, we've had our, our battles, you know, I mean, knock down dragouts, you know, throwing the dishes at each other, you know, War of the Roses type shit. And, uh, it's a, it isn't all pretty, but I will say that, you know, back in the day,

• 46:47Speaker 01

  I got some advice from my bass player's grandfather.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  And he said, you know, some marriage advice, he was like, You know, a strong marriage isn't always going to be pretty. It's not always going to be loving, but it's the glue that you take the broken pieces and it's the glue that you put these pieces back together with. That's going to be the strength that makes a loving marriage endure. You know, and I just, and I, I had to experience that. I had to like take the vase and just throw it at the fucking wall and destroy it and go, oh God. Like, and we both picked up the pieces and put them back together, together. You know what I mean?

• 47:31Speaker 01

  And, and, uh, and that is, you know, now it's like, it's funny because we're like having conversations in our lives now about like, all right, like, what do you want to be called when you're a grandma? Like, what do you want to be called when you're a grandpa?

• 47:45Bunnie XO?

  I love that.

• 47:46Speaker 01

  And it's like, cause my kids are getting older now. My oldest son, he's like 24, Jagger's 21. And then Brixton, my youngest is 12, you know? And so, I mean, my kids are shooting live ones, so.

• 47:58Bunnie XO?

  No.

• 47:59Speaker 01

  I mean, slow down. Hey, son, I'm not ready. Just saying.

• 48:04Bunnie XO?

  Grandpa Jacoby, what are you going to be called?

• 48:06Speaker 01

  I'll be called Papa and my wife's going to be called, Kelly's going to be called Go-Go.

• 48:10Bunnie XO?

  Oh.

• 48:11Speaker 01

  Cause she's just Go-Go-Go all the time. My wife is like from 6:30 AM, she is just like, I'm like.

• 48:16Bunnie XO?

  I feel like you need that though.

• 48:18Speaker 01

  Sit on the couch, babe. Chill for a minute.

• 48:20Bunnie XO?

  I feel like you need that though, because you seem like you're always Go-Go-Go too.

• 48:24Speaker 01

  We, we have to check ourselves sometimes and like check in with each other and go, hey, like, yo, we need a date night.

• 48:30Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 48:31Speaker 01

  It's date night.

• 48:31Bunnie XO?

  That's how Jay and I are too. Sometimes we have to be like, dude, we haven't been on a date night in so long. Like we have to do something.

• 48:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I, I, I think we do share a lot of similarities in that regard that we're both like, I'm a, I'm a people person, you know, I'm outgoing. I think my bit, my wife is a bit more recluse. She could be the type that's like holed up in a house in the countryside and not see anybody for a month and be okay.

• 48:51Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, I'm the same way.

• 48:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:53Bunnie XO?

  Believe it or not.

• 48:54Speaker 01

  Go, go, go, you know, she got her things. We got our little, like in the backyard, we got the chickens and we got a tortoise and you know, we got our pets. We got four pup, you know, four dogs.

• 49:03Bunnie XO?

  Would you guys move to Nashville and have a little farm?

• 49:06Speaker 01

  I mean, we've, the discussion has been had many times in our house. I think I've spent a lot of time on Realtor and dot com and Zillow.

• 49:14Bunnie XO?

  I have a Realtor for you. If you guys need a Realtor.

• 49:17Speaker 01

  Okay, okay. Yeah, we've talked, my brother actually moved out here. My brother loves it. He's been twisting my tits about moving out here for quite some time. My guitar player lives out here now.

• 49:25Bunnie XO?

  I always say that Nashville is LA with a soul.

• 49:28Speaker 01

  I'm, you are absolutely 100% correct.

• 49:31Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, but I, I would anytime, because I'm from the West Coast. I grew up in Vegas. Anytime I go back to Cali or I'm in Vegas, I'm just always reminded of how commercial everything is now. And like, it's lost its glitter. And when you come to Nashville, it's like, everybody still has a soul, you know, and like, everything is just so warm and inviting. And it hasn't been taken, I mean, it's corporate, but it's not like how it is on the West Coast.

• 49:56Speaker 01

  Absolutely. I was just talking to somebody about that before I came here at the shoot. And it's like, talking about the same exact thing. It's like the, the spirit of this city is real and it's alive. And it feels like maybe what LA felt like 20, 25, 30 years ago.

• 50:11Bunnie XO?

  Yes.

• 50:12Speaker 01

  Where it was just like, the possibilities were there and the creativity was alive and the culture was like bustling, right? And there feels like this life in this city, especially when I went down to Broadway and we did that acoustic set. And I, afterwards, I was just.

• 50:28Bunnie XO?

  By the way, to cut you off really quick, can you please go play an acoustic set at our bar? Good Night Nashville, please?

• 50:33Speaker 01

  Dude, I was, it's funny, man, because I was like, the last time I, I was in Nashville, I was out here with my, both my brothers and we were down on Broadway and I was at this club across the street and I was looking at Jelly's joint across the way and I was like, that's dope. What's up with that skull with the crown up in the top?

• 50:49Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, we need you to go do one of these live sets. Okay, please.

• 50:53Speaker 01

  We'll do it. We'll for sure do it.

• 50:54Bunnie XO?

  Anytime you want, just hit me, we'll plug you guys right in. You guys go and do it. But what is it like playing on Broadway? And you went down on Broadway. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. But I was just like, we want in on that too.

• 51:04Speaker 01

  No, your spot is dope, straight up. I hadn't been in it, but I looked at it from across the street at the rooftop bar and I was like, that shit's popping, dude. That's a great spot.

• 51:14Speaker 01

  But I was talking to a bunch of people afterwards, just kind of saying what's up to the fans. And I realized like, there's so many people in this city that are all musicians, that are all, you know, either have made it and are just good people or young people that came here to make it. And I just love the culture of that. And it's like, you know, when I even just down to simple things like driving down the road, you know, and you that, you know what I'm talking about?

• 51:42Bunnie XO?

  Yeah. The Jeep wave.

• 51:45Speaker 01

  Dude, I'm telling you, I'm in Sacramento, I, and I never get it back, dude. And I'm like, when I'm here and I'm like, everybody, I'm like, sup? I love, I fucking love that. And it's, you know, it finally, I got a boat. I finally just got a boat. And I live, I live pretty close by the river. So boat people in Sacramento, though, everybody waves at each other.

• 52:04Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 52:05Speaker 01

  When you got a boat. And so, but yeah, I like that soulfulness about this city. I love the food. I love the music. And so there's so many reasons for me to come out here, you know, but then it's also like, home's home, you know, I never lived in LA, you know, I just go down there to make records. And so I live up in Sacramento. I've lived there for, you know, for the last, like around the area for the last 30 plus years, you know, when we started having babies and stuff like that, my parents, my mom and my stepdad stuck around the area. And so we got a tight village, you know, when I go home, it's like, I kind of got a small circle, you know, and so it's like, I spend more time with my parents than like, I care to admit.

• 52:47Bunnie XO?

  But that's a great thing.

• 52:48Speaker 01

  No, I mean, I'm not ashamed of it at all.

• 52:50Bunnie XO?

  Spend as much time as you can, because I lost both my parents, 2022 and 2024.

• 52:55Speaker 01

  Damn.

• 52:56Bunnie XO?

  Spend as much time with them as you can.

• 52:58Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, we do, we do all the, I mean, we're, it's a regular thing for us. And that's what really is like, who's calling me?

• 53:06Bunnie XO?

  Oh, I was like, whose phone is that?

• 53:09Speaker 01

  It's probably my wife.

• 53:10Bunnie XO?

  It's a vibe.

• 53:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, if you don't mind.

• 53:13Bunnie XO?

  If it's wifey, answer so we can say hi. I love that.

• 53:16Speaker 01

  Sorry, let me just.

• 53:17Bunnie XO?

  I love seeing you in dad mode.

• 53:18Speaker 01

  Dude, I'm fucking dad as fuck.

• 53:20Bunnie XO?

  I bet you're like a cool ass dad.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  I'm a rad dad.

• 53:23Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 53:23Speaker 01

  I'm not even gonna lie, dude. It is just, being a dad is like, it is just the joy of my life, honestly. And I think part of, one of the cool things I think about being a father too is like,

• 53:40Speaker 01

  How can I say this? A lot of, a lot of like my partying, like my raging and I did it on the road and I would come home and I would try to dry out and like just like white knuckle it through it. So my kids, although there was a lot of dysfunction, I really did my best to like hide it from my kids. And my older sons, you know, there's, there's not a lot of, a ton of recollections of me like being like drunk shitty dad. You know, and, and so I'm really grateful that like I didn't really damage my kids through all that. And Brixton, my youngest has never seen me drunk, you know what I mean?

• 54:18Speaker 01

  And, and I just, I love that, you know, that, that he's been able to experience that like stability, you know? And, uh, yeah, but being a fatherhood, I mean, fatherhood is the best hood. Fatherhood is sacred. It's the coolest shit. Like my kids are just, I'm, you know, I'm a football dad. My son, both my boys played football. They're both playing college lacrosse, you know? And so I fly out there and go, I got my cowbell. I'm in the stands yelling and screaming for my kids. Like I'm, it is just, it is the joy of my life, you know, outside of the music and, you know, it's something like me and my wife. We just, we just are our kids' biggest fans, you know? And it's like.

• 54:59Bunnie XO?

  What do you think is the biggest lesson that your kids have taught you? Each one, cause you have three, right?

• 55:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:06Bunnie XO?

  So each one, what has each one taught you?

• 55:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think.

• 55:08Bunnie XO?

  Cause I feel like every child has different personalities, you know? They teach you something different.

• 55:12Speaker 01

  Mikhail is the most cautious and self-aware child I have. He's 24 and the thing he's taught me is, uh, I'd say like patience and understanding in a way that he's just so loving and kind that I had to like, check myself and slow my pace down and just be there in the moment with my son. He loves talking, right? Like when we get on the phone, he'll talk through the details of every little thing and it's like.

• 55:51Speaker 01

  That's kind of like the, the way that we communicate when we're talking, it's like he wants to talk through all the details of every part of his day. And I just, I love that. Like slowing down the pace of my life because he, he knows how to do that. And I just, I think that's so cool. And I just, I'm so proud of that kid and he's, you know, he's such a hard worker. He is just a grinder. Like he's, he's going to college and be a doctor.

• 56:15Bunnie XO?

  Wow. Good for you. Good for you.

• 56:19Speaker 01

  He'll be a doctor of physical therapy. So my busted ass back. Yep.

• 56:26Speaker 01

  And so he's in his last year of school and I'm just so proud of him and just, he's, he's really been through some hard times and some heartbreak. And, uh, you know, uh, he's, his life has inspired me to write some songs and, you know, Jagger, Jagger's like so much like me in the way of like, he's got, she's got that big heart. He loves hard. He puts his heart, he wears his heart on his sleeve. He's kind of the, the leader in the spaces that he's in, you know, been the captain of his football team, et cetera. You know, the leader of his friend group, that kind of thing. But that's, and then also the type that needs to like, run a hundred miles an hour into a brick wall and feel the pain and like the struggle and the strife and the,

• 57:10Speaker 01

  you know, take his lumps and, you know, he's very bullheaded and it's almost like he's kind of gotten some of the, some of the traits about me and my wife that we're both like, damn dude, you got some of the, like the, the harder edges of who we are. But he's just got the biggest heart, you know? And so Jagger, he's a,

• 57:28Bunnie XO?

  And how old is he?

• 57:29Speaker 01

  Jagger's 21.

• 57:30Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 57:31Speaker 01

  You know, and he's that kid that, you know, he, he tells me, he's like, dad, like you're my safe place. Like you're, you're my, you're my place where I can just let all my walls fall and, uh,

• 57:41Bunnie XO?

  That means so much for a child.

• 57:43Speaker 01

  Just be vulnerable, you know? And, and, uh, you know, I'm just grateful that, you know, both me and my wife, we have these very special. Unique relationships with all of our kids, you know, and, and so Jagger, you know, I think that the, the thing that he's taught me is like, again, like I, I keep saying patience, you know, but it's like, I just gotta allow him to be him and not try to impose the knowledge that I've, I've tried to raise him the best I can and love him the best we can and teach him as many valuable lessons as we can, but also like to allow him to be him and find his way.

• 58:25Bunnie XO?

  Right.

• 58:25Speaker 01

  You know, and, and I think that, you know, he wants to go, he wants to go into the music. He grew up listening to, you know, Yellow Wolf was like one of his favorite rappers.

• 58:35Bunnie XO?

  We can connect you guys with Yellow.

• 58:37Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, Yellow's cool, man. He's a real one.

• 58:39Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 58:39Speaker 01

  I got a, I got a slum tat with Yellow one night in a hotel room.

• 58:43Bunnie XO?

  Oh, gosh, okay. I should have known that you two found each other.

• 58:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. We got, yeah, that was a wild night. But, uh, you know, Jagger's just, he want, he wants to get into the music. He's got a great voice, he's got a great singing voice and you know.

• 58:55Bunnie XO?

  Do you support it? Are you behind it?

• 58:57Speaker 01

  I do. You know, there's parts of me that are like, oh, sure, cause, but because he's so similar to me that I just don't want him to like, make some of the same mistakes that I've made and you know, like, the same way that my mother was kind of trying to warn me about the slippery slope of the ism. You know, like there's, he's got a few of those characteristics and I have to, you know, check in with him like, yo dude, you good, man? You like, you, you using that drink as like a crutch? Like what's going on? What's going down? Like, you know, he was the kid that I was like, you know, I caught with the weed vape pen at 14 and I'm going, ah, man, like it's a little too young. You know, but it's also like, how do you like, my friend said, he's like, you know,

• 59:41Speaker 01

  How do you beat the you out of your child? You know, and it's like, well, first don't beat your child.

• 59:47Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. No beatings.

• 59:48Speaker 01

  But you know, it's like those things about me that I see in him that might be challenges or that's gonna happen. You know what I mean? Like.

• 59:55Bunnie XO?

  I think it's what you said earlier, though, with him is that you lead by example.

• 59:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:00Bunnie XO?

  Because that's what got through to you.

• 1:00:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:02Bunnie XO?

  So that's what will get through to him.

• 1:00:04Speaker 01

  And, and I'm, you know, we're doing, and he's, they're both great kids. They're both, they live under the same roof. And so I gotta hear the drama, two brothers living underneath, you know, the same roof and just, oh, F this kid. F he leaves his crap everywhere. And I'm just like, dude, do not call me about this shit.

• 1:00:19Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:19Speaker 01

  Put your like, your big boy pants on and figure it the fuck out.

• 1:00:23Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:23Speaker 01

  You know what I mean? Like, straight up.

• 1:00:25Bunnie XO?

  You're like, try touring with friggin 10 people.

• 1:00:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. Like in a tour, yeah.

• 1:00:30Bunnie XO?

  Yeah, in one bus. Yeah.

• 1:00:31Speaker 01

  You could just smell the fart coming out of the bunk.

• 1:00:34Bunnie XO?

  I can't do it. Yeah. I travel separately with my own bus when I travel with my husband on tour because I am not about to bunk up with a bunch of dudes.

• 1:00:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, all the boys.

• 1:00:42Bunnie XO?

  Not happening. No, we have, we have the girl bus. There's like crock pot meals and like, you know, everybody's just having a good time. And then you go over to my husband's bus and it's just trashed everywhere.

• 1:00:51Speaker 01

  Man, pork chops got a shit all over the place, probably, right?

• 1:00:55Bunnie XO?

  Well, yeah, Bunnie's on the bus for sure, his dog. So circling back to the music really quick. Can you please re-release Tight Rope for me?

• 1:01:03Speaker 01

  Dude, so we did a, uh, we did a 2020, uh, re-record of it after like TikTok and stuff was popping. We were like, we're gonna go re-record some of our songs. And so we did a re-record of Tight Rope. And, uh, it's on Spotify. You should go check it out.

• 1:01:18Bunnie XO?

  I will. I didn't know that.

• 1:01:20Speaker 01

  I actually just did, uh, we did this kind of retrospective day today through all of our albums. We just, my brother lives out here. He does all my social media. And so we actually did a few TikToks, uh, and Instagram type posts, um, for that song Tight Rope in particular.

• 1:01:39Bunnie XO?

  It's one of my favorite songs.

• 1:01:40Speaker 01

  You went deep on that one.

• 1:01:41Bunnie XO?

  Listen, Tight Rope, when that album came out, I, everybody loved, you know, all the other songs and Tight Rope would, would just resonated with me. Tight Rope has always been my jam. I loved that song. I just feel like, I don't know, I just felt the words. And then the other song that. Nobody ever really talks about with you is Scars.

• 1:02:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:00Bunnie XO?

  Like, yeah, I love, you know, Last Resort and I love why you wrote it because you wrote it about a friend who was gonna commit suicide, but can we talk about Scars? Because I feel like that solidified you in as like legendary status and like staying in the game. Because yeah, you can come out with that first record that, but there's always one hit wonders. And then, I mean, you've had way more than just Scars also, but Scars came next, correct? That was like your biggest one after?

• 1:02:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was like, that was a, that was a very like redeeming moment for the band. Because after Last Resort and Infest, our first album, we toured the world, we sold millions of albums.

• 1:02:39Bunnie XO?

  It's hard to follow up something like that.

• 1:02:40Speaker 01

  I'm telling you, dude, it was just like, we had, we hit rock bottom for a minute. And it was like, I remember going out and touring on Love, Hate, Tragedy, the album after that. And we sold almost on the brink of a million records and it was considered like a commercial failure. And I'm like, fuck, like, is it over? You know, because at this time, it was like, uh, music in pop culture was changing. It was like the Strokes had came out, the Vines, uh, the Hives, uh, you know, uh, the White Stripes. All this new wave of music was happening and we were not that, you know? And I'm like, dude, how are we gonna survive this?

• 1:03:24Speaker 01

  And so we were back to the drawing board and, uh, this was right, Scars was right at the time when this was the first time I tried to get sober. You know, I remember calling the producer, Howard Benson. I, uh, in a blackout, I was, I was like threatening to burn my house down. And like, it was, you know, luckily my wife didn't call the cops, she called my parents. You know, my mom came and just slap checked me into, you know, into shape.

• 1:03:57Bunnie XO?

  Sometimes we need those.

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it was one of those like moments of clarity. For one, that was one of the first moments of clarity for me. I was like, I think I got a problem, like this alcohol's got a hold of me. And, uh, I, uh, I decided to get sober and I called my producer and right before we were moving to LA, Kelly and I and my son, Mikhail, at the time was maybe just like one year old. And I'm like, we're packing up the family. We're going down to LA because I wasn't about to go down to LA just volatile and out of my head. And uh, call my producer and I'm like, I'm getting sober. And he's like, you're gonna fuck do what? And I remember he gave me attitude, gave me lip about wanting to get sober. He's like, that's what's fucking wrong with all these musicians now.

• 1:04:40Speaker 01

  Everybody's getting sober and fucking up rock and roll. And I just remember like,

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  hanging up the phone going, I'm rolling down to LA to go punch this guy in the fucking face. Yeah, that's terrible. Fuck you. And uh, I cooled off on the drive, got down there, you know, and uh, we had this batch of songs and scars was one of those songs. And uh, we presented all the songs to the producer. And uh, it was one of those songs that he, the producer was kind of like, I'm not so sure about that one. Like it's good, but it's like, we would grade all of our songs. Like this is a A song. This is a B song. This is a C song. And I think it, he graded it like a C. And we're like, we just knew that there was something special in this song. And I think that uh, because it was so different from the sound of like, quote Papa Roach,

• 1:05:31Speaker 01

  that it wasn't necessarily caught, it didn't really catch the ear of the producer, but it, I feel like, whenever we do something that kind of makes me feel a little uncomfortable creatively. Vulnerable. Yeah. It just, there's, there's something special about that. And I just, we held on to that. We're like, we have to like, see this song through. And uh, we did, and we got to the end of it. And we presented this, the album to Jimmy Iovine at the time was the president of the company. And he's a very knowledgeable, well-respected, you know, industry music mogul. And we turned, turned the record into him.

• 1:06:11Speaker 01

  And he hit us back and he's like, well, you know, the song scars, it's pretty good, but I feel like you need to go back into the studio and rerecord it to make it sound more like it's been a while, by stained. And I'm like,

• 1:06:23Speaker 01

  fuck do you mean? Like, it's like, I just, I just was kind of like taken back like, God, this, this music business is like, they're trying to tell us how to.

• 1:06:34Bunnie XO?

  I've been needing new glasses forever and it's just one of those things I keep putting off. So I finally went on Zenni to pick out a new pair. I'm going with these black rectangle glasses that are really similar to the ones I already wear because listen, I know what I like. They're classic, they go with everything and I'm excited to get them. Zenni has frames starting from under $30 and I love that you can use their virtual try on to see what different frames look like before you order. You just find a pair you love, enter your prescription, customize your lenses and they'll ship them right to your door. Zenni is truly the easiest way to shop for stylish prescription glasses without the headache backed by over 150,000 five-star reviews. Check new glasses off your list today with Zenni. Go to zenni.com/podcast

• 1:07:18Bunnie XO?

  and use code PODCAST15 for 15% off plus free shipping over $65. Style sellout, so don't wait. That's Z E N N I dot com slash podcast promo code PODCAST15. Zenni.com/podcast code PODCAST15. Today's episode is brought to you by Vinted. Y'all know how it goes. You open your closet and have a million things hanging up, but somehow still feel like you have nothing to wear. That's me. And let's be real, half that stuff hasn't been touched in forever. Instead of letting all those clothes just sit there taking up space, you might as well make a little money off of them. If you haven't used it yet, Vinted is a secondhand marketplace app that makes it so simple to sell the quality clothes you

• 1:08:02Bunnie XO?

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• 1:08:43Speaker 01

  Do what we do.

• 1:08:44Bunnie XO?

  You felt like he was controlling your creativity.

• 1:08:46Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, absolutely. And I was very offended.

• 1:08:49Bunnie XO?

  What did the original sound, sound as soft, I don't want to say soft, but sound as intimate?

• 1:08:54Speaker 01

  Well, so we went in and rerecorded the song, right?

• 1:08:57Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 1:08:57Speaker 01

  And it was the most like average white guy BS rock drivel that we had ever written. We turned it in, we're like, this is trash. And so the version of Scars that you hear now is the, was the original version that we turned into Jimmy Iovine.

• 1:09:13Bunnie XO?

  Okay.

• 1:09:13Speaker 01

  So it was like, we went through the motions of like, all right, cool. We'll try to like appease you, which dude, Stand is an amazing band. The song, It's Been A While is an amazing song, but it just what, it didn't fit for Scars. Like for us to try to like revamp it to sound like that. We went through the exercise, went through the motions, but it just didn't hit the way that it was supposed to. And he, I think he, well, obviously he realized and was like, all right, we'll go with the original version. We'll go with your gut, you know, this is on you. And I'm like, that's right, it's on me, like, let's go. And that album, we, we led with Getting Away With Murder, the song Getting Away With Murder. That song went to the top of the rock charts. And then when we released Scars, I'm like, I'm like crossing my fingers.

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  I'm like, dude, this like, this is, this is like sink or swim for us because, you know, we're starting, the industry is like, starting to look back at us like, oh, this band is like a real thing. Scars went straight to the top of the rock charts and then moved up into the pop charts. And we had a top tie, top five, uh, hot AC, top five pop record with, with Scars. And that was just like so validating. I only have one plaque of, of Papa Roach, uh, hanging in my house. And it's that for Getting Away With Murder, that album, because it just meant so much to me.

• 1:10:33Speaker 01

  Like the first album was like, it, it was powerful and you know, I mean, we sold more records on the first album than we did with Getting Away With Murder and Scars. But I think that. Kind of coming back from, I guess, almost the brink of disaster and complete utter failure as a band in the mainstream, to be able to come back and pop off again and sell, you know, nearly 2 million records on that album was like so rewarding and just like, we can do this, like, we can, like, we broke the curse of being a one-hit-wonder, you know? And so that song is like, straight up, like, another one of those, a gift that keeps on

• 1:11:16Speaker 01

  giving. It's honestly become like, a staple of who we are, you know? So, it's funny, because when fans talk to us about old-school Papa Roach, I'm like, we've been around so long, I'm like, alright, like, what era of Papa Roach do you think old-school Papa Roach is? Is it like, is it 2005 Papa Roach? Is it the year 99 Papa Roach? Is it 2010 Papa Roach? Because, you know, we've like gained different fans at different points in our story. And so, yeah, it's like, when somebody says, "old-school Papa Roach", I'm just like, "Fuck, I'm confused. I don't know what you want."

• 1:11:57Bunnie XO?

  You're like, "I need a year. Tell me what year you're talking about here, buddy."

• 1:12:01Speaker 01

  Exactly. And yeah, so "Scars" was definitely one of those songs that broke down a lot of barriers for our band.

• 1:12:06Bunnie XO?

  Do you ever look back at your legacy that you've built and just be proud of yourself?

• 1:12:13Speaker 01

  I think as I get older, and I think, I think it was 20, the year 2020, when we hit the 20-year anniversary of that album, "Infest", that I started to get that, like, proud dad kind of moment about what we'd done, and just looking at, man, we've done this, like, this dream that I had when I was 14, 15, 16.

• 1:12:39Speaker 01

  I'm living it like this. This dream had become reality. Yeah, maybe at times it was a nightmare, but it really like it is. It is everything that I wanted and more.

• 1:12:51Bunnie XO?

  It's the journey.

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  And it is and, and you know, it's I, I look at it and I'm so grateful that, you know, I made the mistakes I made and I recovered from those mistakes. And I was able to grow musically, creatively, personally, spiritually, and in so many ways. And, and now, you know, it's like, here we are. It's 2026. Like my mind is blown. I'm still in the game.

• 1:13:17Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:17Speaker 01

  You know, we just, uh, leave a light on one of our last singles, you know, it's like, who would have thunk in a gajillion years that we would have an acoustic song that rock, you know, went to the top of the rock charts? And, and you know, moved into the alternative space again. And then to like, have a lady like Carrie Underwood bless the track. You know, I'm just like, I gotta keep pinching myself like, dude, the gift just keeps on giving like it just keeps revealing itself to me in so many cool and fun and interesting ways that I'm just like, each day I wake up when it comes to this creativity. I'm like, all right, what do you got for me now, God? Like, where are we going? You know, it's like, it's such a, it's a cool experience and as, and as hopeful as I am,

• 1:14:02Speaker 01

  I, it's as, it can be as dreadful as, as possible. Some days I wait, it was funny, like, two days ago, I woke up and I just was like, on the phone with my wife, Kelly, and I'm just like, she's like, what's wrong? And I'm like, I just want to curl up in a ball and like, not be Jacoby today. I just, I just, I'm like, I'm, I'm just, I'm exhausted. And it's so wild how like, I can wake up like that, like it have so many gifts on blessings, on blessings, on blessings, and still wake up just not wanting to like. Get out of bed.

• 1:14:35Bunnie XO?

  You're human.

• 1:14:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I just, I was like, it's so, it sounds so corny.

• 1:14:40Bunnie XO?

  No, it doesn't.

• 1:14:41Speaker 01

  Can you just, like, just fuck, just tell me I'm the man.

• 1:14:44Bunnie XO?

  Nah.

• 1:14:45Speaker 01

  Tell me I can go get this, like, just, like, gas me up. I just need it. And she's like, you're the fucking man, honey.

• 1:14:51Bunnie XO?

  Ah.

• 1:14:52Speaker 01

  And I just, it's like, sometimes-

• 1:14:53Bunnie XO?

  She breathes life into you.

• 1:14:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:55Bunnie XO?

  My husband calls me and does the same thing, though.

• 1:14:58Speaker 01

  Sorry?

• 1:14:58Bunnie XO?

  I said, my husband does the same thing, though.

• 1:14:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it's like, I think that, like, that there's this, there's this brokenness that's still in me that, that I'm trying, and it's just a journey that I'm continually trying to, to heal in myself. And this music has just been, it's been a reflection of that. It's been the soundtrack of that. And my mistakes and my failures and my triumphs, they all come through, you know? And something as simple as my wife just saying, honey, you're the man. You could do it. Like, she don't, I don't even know if she knows, like, how much those simple gestures, or just like something simple, like, she could just tell I'm having it like a day,

• 1:15:39Speaker 01

  and she'll just like reach over and like put her hand on my neck and like massage the back of my neck. And I'm just like,

• 1:15:49Speaker 01

  like, everything's gonna be okay, you know? Cause it's like, I think there's a lot of weight, I think, I carry as-

• 1:15:56Bunnie XO?

  It's a lot of pressure.

• 1:15:57Speaker 01

  As like, you know, there is a lot of pressure in this business to like-

• 1:16:00Bunnie XO?

  Well, there's a lot of pressure to continue.

• 1:16:02Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:16:02Bunnie XO?

  To keep going with Papa Roach. There's so much pressure because of all the years that you've been doing this. Everybody's waiting for your next move.

• 1:16:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, I ain't bulletproof. I ain't Superman.

• 1:16:13Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:13Speaker 01

  But I sure as shit try to put on like I am sometimes. And when I am on stage, I feel that way. I really do. I feel like I'm like invincible. And then when I get back, you know, come back down to earth and I like sit on the couch and like just take a breath and, and then the reality of just who I am sets in. And I'm like, I'm just a man, you know, I'm just a dude trying to get it right, trying to make the night, next right decision, you know, try not to be a dirtbag, trying to be honest and make the next, you know, right move. And, you know, it's like-

• 1:16:45Bunnie XO?

  Do you take breaks for yourself? Like, do you go on vacation? What do you do to reset your mental health?

• 1:16:50Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. That's I had a conversation with one of my managers yesterday. I'm like, dude, after I get back from this trip, it's it's time to unplug. And he's like, actually, you got to come back to Nashville and shoot a music video in a couple of weeks. I'm all gonna start to get pissed. And I'm like, quality problems.

• 1:17:09Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:10Speaker 01

  Quality problem. But I'm gonna go home and I'm gonna chuck this phone.

• 1:17:15Bunnie XO?

  My husband does that all the time.

• 1:17:16Speaker 01

  I'm just like, I'm gonna turn it off. I'm just gonna go disappear. For me, getting out in nature is a huge thing for me. My fitness and my my exercise is a big thing for me. Running is like been a comfort comfort place for me. I live real close to the American River. And there's all these horse trails that I'll just go out and I will go run those trails until I'm physically exhausted. And I just come back like renewed. And I work out. I don't run to music.

• 1:17:49Speaker 01

  So I process a lot of these questions and anxieties and frustrations and, you know, songs come to me in those moments and lyric ideas come to me in those moments. And, you know, so so I do that. I I'm very mindful of my eating habits and, you know, just as jelly, like, you know, food has sometimes been a thing to me, like, I'm a binging kind of guy. And so putting those things in check and like, having some discipline and obedience in my life is really like giving me like, it strengthened me, you know. And I think also, breath work has been something for me. That's like,

• 1:18:32Bunnie XO?

  Phenomenal.

• 1:18:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's I during COVID, when everybody's locked up, a really good friend of mine, this guy named Sonny Mayo was running a he's a sober brother of mine. He was running a breath work class on Zoom. And he's like, dude, you should show up to one of these. And I showed up and I did this 25 minute breath work. And it was just like a floodgate of emotion just broke in me. And I just like, just all these things that I was carrying around, it just, it just flooded out. And he gave me some some sound advice, you know, because I was really struggling for a moment. And he's like, can I suggest something to you? I'm like, yeah, man, I'll take anything right now. And he's like,

• 1:19:13Speaker 01

  First thing you do when you wake up is you slide down off the side of your bed and you hit your knees and you pray. And then right after that, you grab your pad of paper and you go write two to three pages of just whatever's in your head.

• 1:19:25Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:25Speaker 01

  And it's called morning pages. And so I did that for a better part of a year, year and a half and just, I would just, the crazy shit I would write and just the things that were in my head. I was like, dude, are you okay? But I think that writing out that crazy was very therapeutic for me. And so I, you know, these, these types of routines that I go back to when things are getting sticky, it's like breath work, meditation, prayer. Now I'm on to doing this men's Bible study, you know, these things that these, you know, I got this toolkit now when like life's getting shifty and I wanna like, you know, just make a bad decision. It's like, no, dude, pause, pause, like, don't light your life on fire. Don't, you know, and that's kind of what this.

• 1:20:08Bunnie XO?

  Self sabotage.

• 1:20:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, God. I was the king of it for years.

• 1:20:11Bunnie XO?

  Yes.

• 1:20:12Speaker 01

  And I've come to a point now, you know, where it's like, I don't want to sabotage this thing. It's too good. It's, I got too much to be grateful for, you know, and gratitude is another, another tool of mine that really puts things in perspective. You know, I, on my social media, that's kind of how I part, I've chosen to participate with it. So I just put up a gratitude list.

• 1:20:31Bunnie XO?

  Can we bring those back? Cause I, I have been waiting for one and I went to go look yesterday and I was like, why haven't I seen his gratitude list? And he haven't posted since last year, right?

• 1:20:42Speaker 01

  Been a minute. Yeah, it was like July. Not that I haven't written gratitude lists. It's just, you know, I just kind of was just like, I'm not gonna post, but I should.

• 1:20:50Bunnie XO?

  I don't think you realize how much those gratitude lists mean to people. Cause I would read them, I would read your gratitude lists and, and again, your vulnerability. I didn't, I've always known the music. I never knew you until I started following you. And then when you were doing those gratitude lists, it would like gave us a glimpse inside of who you're, it gave us a glimpse of your heart. Where like, we can hear your heart in the music, of course, but to hear, see your words and just your vulnerability like that every day with your gratitude list was really a beautiful thing.

• 1:21:19Speaker 01

  All right. Challenge accepted.

• 1:21:20Bunnie XO?

  Bring him back.

• 1:21:22Speaker 01

  Bring it all back. I mean, it's 20 K. It's a new year, you know?

• 1:21:25Bunnie XO?

  I think you should. I really think you should. All right. I'm not going to keep you much longer because I feel like I've been talking your ear off also, but can we end this? I have Sharon Osborne coming on the podcast.

• 1:21:35Speaker 01

  Oh, really?

• 1:21:35Bunnie XO?

  And I heard a story that Sharon crawled in your ass one time, but that like you really needed that.

• 1:21:42Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:21:42Bunnie XO?

  And I want to ask her about her version of it, too, if that's okay with you whenever I have her on the podcast next week.

• 1:21:48Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:21:49Bunnie XO?

  Tell me what happened with that.

• 1:21:50Speaker 01

  Well, first off, please give her a warm, a big old hug for me.

• 1:21:53Bunnie XO?

  I will.

• 1:21:53Speaker 01

  And just tell her hello and, and warm regards and, you know, just thinking about her, praying, praying for her and her family during this tough time.

• 1:22:01Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:02Speaker 01

  You know, but yeah, that moment I was just, you know, uh, you know, just drinking, trying to start riots. Well, I started a riot on Oz Fest. Encouraged the fans to destroy the venue. They continued, they, they obliged and destroyed the venue.

• 1:22:17Speaker 01

  My A and R was like, dude, just jump in the back of the, my town car. So I, cause the cops were looking for me. And so I jumped in the back of, in the, in the trunk of the town car because they were searching vehicles as I was leaving, got out of there. They, they ended up getting a hold of my A and R and said, listen, you know, like if you, if Jacoby doesn't come back and surrender to the cops, he's going to get arrested for evading the police. I'm like, you don't want that. You don't want that type of smoke. So I turned around, I, I turned myself into the New Jersey State Police. And, uh, I was detained and you know, they were cool enough to me, you know, I had to pay a, I was, I was bailed out later that evening. Um, I had to pay a massive fine. And then I was like, cool. I'm like, ah, going back to the bus. And they're like, I'll get back to the venue. And they're like, uh, uh, uh.

• 1:23:00Speaker 01

  Got to come talk to mama. And I went into the office and I had to sit down with Sharon and she just chewed me a new asshole. She's like, you've got the fucking world in the palm of your hands and you're just acting like an idiot. Come to my festival. You, you start a riot, you destroy the fucking venue. And she just read me the riot act, you know, and like, she's like, you're fucking lucky. I don't kick you off this tour right now. You're lucky you're selling millions of records right now because your ass have been out of here, you know? And I just was like, You know, and

• 1:23:27Bunnie XO?

  This little woman just chewing into you.

• 1:23:30Speaker 01

  Just a pistol, you know, a fireplug. And, uh, you know, I needed that. I straight up needed it. Like, I'm so grateful that she just checked me. And, uh, it, it really like, I was humbled, straight up. I was like, God, I didn't want to like, get kicked off Osfest because it was like, yo, we were out on tour. It was like, P. Roach, Linkin Park, Slipknot, Marilyn Manson, Ozzy Osbourne. Like, it was just the sickest bill.

• 1:23:54Bunnie XO?

  When the music was so good.

• 1:23:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was so rad. And I'm just so grateful that she just chewed my ass out and set me straight because, you know, I, uh, I had the world in the palm of my hands and I was selling millions of records and I didn't want to ruin my career. And, and it really like changed the way that I approached this thing. And, you know, I, I think I maybe set up, set off a few more riots, you know, but just they weren't on Osfest.

• 1:24:22Bunnie XO?

  It was just on your way out. You just had to let everybody know that.

• 1:24:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was like, alright, so I'm still, you know, wild as.

• 1:24:26Bunnie XO?

  I still got it.

• 1:24:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. And so, uh, I definitely, I, I paid, I paid some fines in my day and, uh, I was banned from that venue for years. And I eventually had gone back and was able to play there again, which was cool. We went back and, uh, did a tour with Nickelback and got back on that stage.

• 1:24:43Bunnie XO?

  Daddy Chatty.

• 1:24:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:44Bunnie XO?

  I love Daddy Chatty.

• 1:24:45Speaker 01

  He's legit, man. It was a fun one on that tour.

• 1:24:48Bunnie XO?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:49Speaker 01

  But yeah, thank you, Sharon, uh, for ripping me a new asshole. I needed it. Um, I'm healed from that. And I learned my lessons. So, thank you.

• 1:24:56Bunnie XO?

  We love that. Can we expect a country album from you since you're in Nashville so much?

• 1:25:01Speaker 01

  Oh, man, who knows? You know, I actually just, uh, I did some writing with this guy, D-Ray, who's actually done some stuff with Jelly.

• 1:25:06Bunnie XO?

  I love D-Ray. D-Ray writes all my Christmas music.

• 1:25:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, dude, D-Ray's the business, dude. I love it, man. We became fast friends. We just wrote a couple songs together, uh, just recently. And, uh, yeah, you know, who knows? You might find me in Nashville dipping in the world a little bit. I'd love, you know, I think the way that I would like. Dip into it is to just guest on some country people's albums. I think that that would be a natural.

• 1:25:28Bunnie XO?

  My husband's about to drop a new album.

• 1:25:29Speaker 01

  Oh dude, hey, just holler at him.

• 1:25:31Bunnie XO?

  I'll put it in his ear.

• 1:25:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, holler at him, you know, you know, I'm good for it.

• 1:25:34Bunnie XO?

  I got you.

• 1:25:35Speaker 01

  But yeah, uh, who knows where it takes us and, you know, I just want to say congrats to you. Congrats to you, you know, you and your family and crushing it and killing it. And thank you for having me. It's been a long time coming and you know, me and my wife are like, I was like, dude, I'm gonna be on Bunny's podcast. She's like, oh, sick dude, this is tight. I can't wait to watch because she watches all your stuff.

• 1:25:54Bunnie XO?

  Oh, I love that. Thank you so much for coming, Jacoby. I'm so glad we finally got to sit down. And anytime you want to come promote anything, anytime, any, my couch is always open.

• 1:26:04Speaker 01

  Cool. Thank you.

• 1:26:05Bunnie XO?

  Let me know.

• 1:26:06Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:26:07Bunnie XO?

  Thank you guys for tuning into another episode of Don't Blunt. I'll see you guys next week. Bye.