Serge Pizzorno gets a kick from our spaghetti all’assassina

Angela takes on the ‘assassin’s method’ for our rock-star guest Serge Pizzorno is musician, songwriter, record producer and co-founder of Kasabian. The band, who release their latest album, Act III, on 4 September, have been together since the early ’00s, with Serge taking on frontman responsibilities in 2020. He joins us after a huge gig at London’s Finsbury Park, in front of 50,000 people - so the Fast Food Quiz in front of the Dish crew should be a doddle. Serge’s palate has been on quite a journey, from bread with no butter to taking on big hitting flavours, including today’s spicy pasta. Angela serves bucatini all’assassina, with burrata & ’nduja crumb, using spaghetti instead of bucatini. It’s a pasta cooked like no other we’ve made on Dish before, using risotto-esque techniques and producing spaghetti with a dark, smoky char. It’s served with focaccia from Angela’s range, and paired by the Waitrose wine experts with a bottle of Araldica Barbera D'Asti Superiore. It was so much fun getting to know Serge off-stage. From his Italian roots, to his loyalty to Leicester, and his life-long passion for bread, he is welcome back anytime. And not only are we confident you will want to try the recipe after this episode, but you might go in search of a runner’s high too. You can watch full episodes of Dish on YouTube and on Spotify. All recipes from this podcast can be found at waitrose.com/dishrecipes A transcript for this episode can be found at waitrose.com/dish If you want to get in touch with us about anything at all, contact [email protected] Dish from Waitrose is made by Cold Glass Productions 00:00 Welcome! 01:55 Today’s guest 03:07 It’s watermelon season! 04:54 Serge Pizzorno has arrived… 06:03 A fruity cheers & chatting retro crisps 09:01 Kasabian’s sensational gig at Finsbury Park 10:39 Serge the breakfast maestro 11:07 Creature comforts 12:33 Serge’s likes 16:15 Serge’s dislikes 19:30 From Leicester specialties to hosting hacks 21:02 Eating on the road 22:28 Food as memories 23:49 Food is served! 28:09 Wine pairing 28:36 A Kasabian album to the effect of music 35:57 Serge is a man of many hobbies 38:53 Fast food quiz 40:17 End of the show question Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:08Speaker 00

  The heart of Mexico beats in every glass of Don Julio Tequila. 100% Blue Weber Agave, grown in Mexico. Your margarita deserves an award-winning tequila at Waitrose. Find out more at donjulio.com. Select a store subject to availability. Over 18 only, please drink responsibly.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  Ah, now this is living. Tuesday night chili con carne with Tilda rice.

• 0:36Speaker 02

  Call that living. This is living. Chicken stir fry with Tilda firecracker rice.

• 0:41Speaker 01

  Okay, I see your stir fry and raise you. Tilda sticky rice poke bowl.

• 0:46Speaker 02

  Poke bowl, mate. Tilda coconut rice, lamb curry, poppadoms, chutney, the lot.

• 0:52Speaker 01

  Whoa, okay, now we're definitely living.

• 0:56Speaker 02

  Tilda, cook like you mean it, live like you mean it.

• 1:01Speaker 00

  Dish from Waitrose is a cold glass production. This podcast may contain some strong language and adult themes.

• 1:14Nick Grimshaw?

  Hello and welcome to Dish from Waitrose. I am Nick Grimshaw.

• 1:18Angela Hartnett?

  And I'm Angela Hartnett.

• 1:19Nick Grimshaw?

  And here we are for another episode of Dish. We are now in midsummer. Are we past midsummer? I always feel like August is the middle of the summer, but technically probably not, is it? What do you like to do in the summer, Ange?

• 1:31Angela Hartnett?

  I do love London in the summer because it sort of empties out. It's great weather. There's always some good gigs on.

• 1:38Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 1:38Angela Hartnett?

  But I do, I just want to be by water in the summer, by the sea.

• 1:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 1:42Angela Hartnett?

  Sea or a pool. So I have no pool at home, so I have to go to the seaside.

• 1:46Nick Grimshaw?

  You have to go to the seaside.

• 1:47Angela Hartnett?

  The last time I went one of the seaside, I saw Anthony, our sound man.

• 1:51Nick Grimshaw?

  Did you?

• 1:51Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, yeah. Took a little, Elsie, Neil and the dogs all went to Leon's Sea for the day. And poor Anthony, he thought he was having a nightmare. We could hear this, Neil, Neil.

• 2:01Nick Grimshaw?

  He was like, what is that?

• 2:03Angela Hartnett?

  What, what, what's going on? And he goes, oh. So we, we were all there Leon's Sea.

• 2:08Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, nice. Love that Leon's Sea.

• 2:09Angela Hartnett?

  Loved it, yeah.

• 2:10Nick Grimshaw?

  Well, delightful.

• 2:11Angela Hartnett?

  Gave Elsie her first Rossi's ice cream.

• 2:14Nick Grimshaw?

  What's a Rossi's?

• 2:15Angela Hartnett?

  Rossi's is the Italian family that have had an ice cream parlor there since the 60s. And I, I went as a kid. My grandmother took me, we've all had our Rossi experience. Elsie had her first Rossi's ice cream.

• 2:25Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, did she like it?

• 2:26Angela Hartnett?

  She loved it, loved it, would not let go of it. You know, when a kid doesn't want to let go of it, it's just dripping everywhere. And they're just like, no, let me clean, no, no.

• 2:35Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, that's one of my big noes for becoming a father, I'd say.

• 2:40Angela Hartnett?

  What, the dirty hand?

• 2:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, like, I can't do it.

• 2:43Angela Hartnett?

  There's bigger things to worry about as a child.

• 2:45Nick Grimshaw?

  Ice cream running down their arm.

• 2:47Angela Hartnett?

  That's your only worry. I think that's the least of your problems. There'll be their gloves.

• 2:52Nick Grimshaw?

  Maybe it is none of my business. Yeah, maybe not. Hey, today we have a great guest. We've got Serge from Kasabian coming to see us. They are about to release their ninth album. I remember going to see them really, really back in the day when they were like a new band. And they did a gig in like Warrington in like a music hall. It was a bit of a wow moment.

• 3:15Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 3:15Nick Grimshaw?

  Me and my friend Jenny went, we drove over to go see them. Have you seen them?

• 3:19Angela Hartnett?

  I've seen them. I went, because I know their manager, Coiney.

• 3:22Nick Grimshaw?

  Coiney.

• 3:23Angela Hartnett?

  Coiney, like, well, actually, who knows him better? Neil and Coiney know each other very well. And we were backstage, we were sort of in the, you know, the bit at the side of the stage watching them one. But I can't, I'd like to think it was Victoria Park because it definitely felt outside.

• 3:37Nick Grimshaw?

  I don't even know if you were inside or outside.

• 3:39Angela Hartnett?

  No, I mean, it was outside as in an outside concert.

• 3:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 3:43Angela Hartnett?

  But what I mean is I can't remember where and I'm thinking, anyway. Or maybe it was like Finsbury Park or somewhere like that.

• 3:49Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 3:49Angela Hartnett?

  I don't know.

• 3:50Nick Grimshaw?

  Well, there's a lot to talk about the new album.

• 3:51Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 3:52Nick Grimshaw?

  We're going to talk to him about fashion. We're going to talk to him about running because he's Keen Runner.

• 3:55Angela Hartnett?

  Keen Runner.

• 3:56Nick Grimshaw?

  Apparently the reason he loves running is because he just watched Forrest Gump.

• 4:01Nick Grimshaw?

  I love that.

• 4:01Angela Hartnett?

  Run Forrest, run.

• 4:03Nick Grimshaw?

  And he was like, maybe I'll try it. Like, kind of love that. Before we get Serge in there, we want to talk seasonality.

• 4:10Angela Hartnett?

  Yes.

• 4:10Nick Grimshaw?

  We have two, well, one large watermelon and a little tiny baby one as well with it. Why is now such a great time for them?

• 4:18Angela Hartnett?

  Well, they're ripe, they're ready to go.

• 4:20Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 4:21Angela Hartnett?

  You need to always look for like a little yellow patch and that shows that they're ripe.

• 4:25Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh.

• 4:25Angela Hartnett?

  And then when you tap them, it should sound hollow.

• 4:30Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, yeah.

• 4:31Angela Hartnett?

  And then, then that's a sign that they're ripe, you see. I mean, when we get things like watermelons and pumpkin at work, we sort of do a little cut into their.

• 4:40Nick Grimshaw?

  But you can't do that in Waitrose.

• 4:41Angela Hartnett?

  You can't do that in Waitrose, you'd be banned. But you sort of, you've seen how nice and bright and red it is, yeah. But it's great, it's wonderful because it's a lovely fruit. It quenches your thirst, it's delicious. It's also great in salads with mint, feta, olives. Also, I think great with lime. I think lime and chili, things like that, I think watermelon.

• 5:01Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, look at that great colour there.

• 5:03Angela Hartnett?

  Lovely, yeah, you see.

• 5:04Nick Grimshaw?

  They used to have really great duck and watermelon salad.

• 5:07Angela Hartnett?

  Oh.

• 5:07Nick Grimshaw?

  A place I used to go to.

• 5:09Angela Hartnett?

  Where was that?

• 5:09Nick Grimshaw?

  In Notting Hill.

• 5:10Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, very nice.

• 5:11Nick Grimshaw?

  And it was banging.

• 5:12Angela Hartnett?

  I do like, I think it takes spice. I mean, Lee, our friend's up at Black Axe Mangal, Lee Ten, and he uses watermelon a lot. And I think it's, I think it just has that lovely thing that it can take a lot of spice, a lot of citrus. And it's a great little accompaniment.

• 5:25Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 5:25Angela Hartnett?

  There we go. A ripe watermelon, it had what they call the blossom end, which is where obviously the root is and its blossom is. And that, you'll see that sort of yellowness there as well.

• 5:33Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, yeah.

• 5:34Angela Hartnett?

  And you should be able to smell it and it should sort of give off this light sweet smell at that blossom end.

• 5:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Actually, yeah.

• 5:40Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, there you go. There you, next time you're in Waitrose, picking up your watermelon.

• 5:44Nick Grimshaw?

  Have a smell of that. I don't know if it's just the watermelon off your fingers.

• 5:46Angela Hartnett?

  No, it does.

• 5:47Nick Grimshaw?

  You can smell it, can't you?

• 5:48Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, you do. Okay.

• 5:49Nick Grimshaw?

  Hmm, there you go.

• 5:50Angela Hartnett?

  All our facts.

• 5:51Nick Grimshaw?

  Sniff your watermelon next time you're down in Waitrose.

• 5:54Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 5:54Nick Grimshaw?

  Enough about melons.

• 5:55Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 5:56Nick Grimshaw?

  Shall we welcome Serge?

• 5:57Angela Hartnett?

  Definitely.

• 5:57Nick Grimshaw?

  Let's welcome our guest Serge, it's here to join us on Dish.

• 6:02Nick Grimshaw?

  How are you? All right?

• 6:04Speaker 05

  Nice to see you, mate. I like you very much.

• 6:06Nick Grimshaw?

  We live here. These are all our kids.

• 6:09Speaker 05

  Busy, isn't it?

• 6:10Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, isn't it?

• 6:11Angela Hartnett?

  Busy.

• 6:11Nick Grimshaw?

  I know, it's really, it's really snowballed.

• 6:14Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 6:14Nick Grimshaw?

  A lot of crew. Are you hungry?

• 6:17Speaker 05

  Yeah, starving.

• 6:18Nick Grimshaw?

  Right, come on in. Let's get you in and get you a seat.

• 6:23Nick Grimshaw?

  We should begin then, Ange, we should do. We have a man who can whip up a crowd, of course.

• 6:27Angela Hartnett?

  Definitely.

• 6:28Nick Grimshaw?

  But did you know that he can also whip up a fantastic cooked breakfast?

• 6:32Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, I did not know.

• 6:33Nick Grimshaw?

  We will discuss it. Please welcome Serge Pitsono, everybody.

• 6:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Thanks, Tony.

• 6:39Angela Hartnett?

  Hi Serge. Hi Serge. Welcome. How are you?

• 6:43Speaker 05

  Thanks, thanks. Yeah, no, I'm, I'm excited. It smells unbelievable already.

• 6:48Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, bless you.

• 6:48Speaker 05

  Whatever's going on there.

• 6:49Nick Grimshaw?

  It does smell good. What is going on there?

• 6:51Angela Hartnett?

  We're making assassina pasta.

• 6:53Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh.

• 6:53Angela Hartnett?

  Which is, anyway, I'll explain when you eat it. But it's lots of garlic, chili, tomatoes, all those flavours. But you probably grew up smelling all the time, so you know them, yeah.

• 7:03Nick Grimshaw?

  We're starting with a little drink. You've gone for a sort of peach and mango sparkling situation. I've got a non-alcoholic spritz.

• 7:11Angela Hartnett?

  And I've got a non-alcoholic beer. Bizarrely with an ice cube in it.

• 7:15Nick Grimshaw?

  With an ice cube in it.

• 7:16Angela Hartnett?

  For dinner.

• 7:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Why not?

• 7:17Angela Hartnett?

  It's hot out there, it's nice having it very chilled.

• 7:20Nick Grimshaw?

  We've got a really nice starter for you.

• 7:21Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 7:22Nick Grimshaw?

  When we did our food research.

• 7:23Angela Hartnett?

  There we go.

• 7:24Nick Grimshaw?

  You wanted eighties crisps, so we've done.

• 7:27Speaker 05

  Is that what I put?

• 7:28Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, that's what you put.

• 7:29Speaker 05

  I thought, no, no, I read it as things you shouldn't like, but you like.

• 7:35Angela Hartnett?

  No, well, that's fine, but you like them though.

• 7:37Speaker 05

  Well, you like it. I'm happy with it.

• 7:39Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, that's fine.

• 7:40Speaker 05

  It's a bizarre start. With a Michelin chef here and I've got like, I think that's.

• 7:45Angela Hartnett?

  I love a crisp.

• 7:46Speaker 05

  Is that, is that a monster munch?

• 7:47Nick Grimshaw?

  That's a monster munch.

• 7:48Speaker 05

  See, wow, I'm so sorry about that.

• 7:50Angela Hartnett?

  No, don't apologise, that's not the worst thing that we've done here.

• 7:53Nick Grimshaw?

  That was from the 70s, to be fair.

• 7:54Angela Hartnett?

  70s, yeah.

• 7:55Nick Grimshaw?

  77.

• 7:56Angela Hartnett?

  And these are the shaken, not shaken back.

• 7:59Nick Grimshaw?

  Not shaken back.

• 8:03Speaker 05

  They still make them?

• 8:04Nick Grimshaw?

  They still make them?

• 8:05Speaker 05

  Weird.

• 8:05Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, did you remember that?

• 8:07Speaker 05

  Yeah, I used to have them at school and that's a long time ago.

• 8:09Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 8:09Speaker 05

  The little sachet with salt in it.

• 8:11Angela Hartnett?

  The blue sachet, navy blue, it was always, yeah.

• 8:13Speaker 05

  If you're feeling dangerous, you just neck the sachet for that.

• 8:16Angela Hartnett?

  Oh my God. That really is really, that just made life of salt.

• 8:20Speaker 05

  Levels just like out of control.

• 8:22Nick Grimshaw?

  They're like Serge is nuts, he's had, he had the sachet.

• 8:26Speaker 05

  Straight in. I had a friend that used these as croutons in a pot noodle.

• 8:31Nick Grimshaw?

  Wow.

• 8:31Angela Hartnett?

  Oh.

• 8:32Nick Grimshaw?

  And that's how you met Ange?

• 8:33Speaker 05

  That's how we met Ange.

• 8:34Angela Hartnett?

  No, we did, we've been best friends ever since.

• 8:36Speaker 05

  Monster munch pot noodle. So, so you just drop the monster munch in the top of a pot noodle and.

• 8:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, delicious, delicious. Go on, Ange, you're going to do a salt and shake.

• 8:45Angela Hartnett?

  But where's the packet? Oh, here it is. Oh, it's not blue anymore.

• 8:50Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, live cooking here on the podcast. Here we go. Oh, wow.

• 8:55Angela Hartnett?

  That is mission in that.

• 8:56Nick Grimshaw?

  So run us through the recipe.

• 8:57Angela Hartnett?

  That's, that's, that's.

• 8:58Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, go in there, try that recipe.

• 9:00Angela Hartnett?

  Well, do we need to get you more salt?

• 9:02Speaker 05

  I mean, it's fine, isn't it?

• 9:03Nick Grimshaw?

  It's fine, they're fine. They're fine. I thought they tasted excellent when I was a kid. And now.

• 9:10Speaker 05

  I used to like Transformers snacks, do you remember them?

• 9:12Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:13Speaker 05

  I used to love a Transformers snack.

• 9:14Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, I love a Transformer.

• 9:16Angela Hartnett?

  So you, do you still eat these snacks? No, you're really, that's it. No, no, dude.

• 9:21Speaker 05

  Yeah, Chris is gone now.

• 9:22Angela Hartnett?

  Chris, all crisps?

• 9:24Speaker 05

  Pretty much, yeah.

• 9:25Angela Hartnett?

  That is quite radical.

• 9:26Speaker 05

  It is, yeah, I mean, I was obsessed. I still am obsessed. I just love the packets, I love the branding, love the colours.

• 9:32Angela Hartnett?

  Did you ever do an Almshamage? That thing where you put the crisp packet under a grill?

• 9:37Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 9:37Angela Hartnett?

  And it shriveled to make a little badge.

• 9:39Nick Grimshaw?

  I loved doing that.

• 9:40Angela Hartnett?

  Do you remember that?

• 9:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, I loved it. Well, we didn't have the internet, did we? What else?

• 9:46Nick Grimshaw?

  That's all you could do.

• 9:47Speaker 05

  It looked amazing as a small.

• 9:48Nick Grimshaw?

  Looked so good.

• 9:49Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, it did.

• 9:50Speaker 05

  And then you put a hole in it, make a key ring out of it.

• 9:52Nick Grimshaw?

  Let's do it today.

• 9:54Angela Hartnett?

  Let's do it on the grill.

• 9:55Speaker 05

  That's what chose to be main, like a grill.

• 9:59Nick Grimshaw?

  Grill baguette crisps. Um, hey, we should talk about this gig that you've just done this weekend. It was a massive gig in Finchley Park in London. She's, what was it, like 50,000 people there or something like that?

• 10:11Speaker 05

  I think it's the best gig we've ever played. And that's saying something after all these years. There were moments when I, I slipped through the gaps of reality and was just in another universe. Cause you, you were just, I was in the moment, like I was there. And everything worked, you know? Sometimes you do a show and you can start talking and you're thinking, oh, that is not quite connect. You know, everything, it just, the, the band were just in the crowds and the weather. At one point, this heron flew over the, the, the sun was coming down. I just had this moment of like, this is the best.

• 10:44Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, wow.

• 10:45Nick Grimshaw?

  You need a heron.

• 10:46Speaker 05

  Yeah. It was beautiful, honestly.

• 10:47Nick Grimshaw?

  Nice to see.

• 10:48Speaker 05

  It was be, over this chaos, like complete and utter chaos.

• 10:51Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 10:52Speaker 05

  And then this, this heron just flew, I was like, this is the day, whatever.

• 10:55Angela Hartnett?

  Everything was aligned.

• 10:56Speaker 05

  The universe aligned today.

• 10:57Nick Grimshaw?

  Nice.

• 10:58Speaker 05

  It was, it was wonderful.

• 10:59Nick Grimshaw?

  And then how's that the come down after a show like that? When you've come off from 50,000 people and it is perfect. So how's, how's that night and the next day?

• 11:07Speaker 05

  It's impossible to sleep. But I mean, I'm sure the service is the same, right? When you've been through, when you've just done a good day's work. And you get into bed and you're like, nah.

• 11:15Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 11:16Speaker 05

  And just like.

• 11:18Angela Hartnett?

  Doesn't happen, yeah.

• 11:19Nick Grimshaw?

  Not happening.

• 11:20Speaker 05

  You know, put whatever on it.

• 11:22Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 11:22Speaker 05

  Try and sleep.

• 11:23Nick Grimshaw?

  Not happening.

• 11:24Speaker 05

  Sometimes you just, you know.

• 11:25Angela Hartnett?

  Power three.

• 11:26Speaker 05

  You know, grimy back in the day. You just roll on, no, you just.

• 11:28Nick Grimshaw?

  Just roll on.

• 11:29Angela Hartnett?

  I mean, come on, you're the guy.

• 11:30Nick Grimshaw?

  Sometimes you don't wanna stop.

• 11:34Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, but you should.

• 11:35Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, but you should. Kids, don't do everything we do, be good.

• 11:39Nick Grimshaw?

  What about this cooked breakfast that we've heard about?

• 11:42Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 11:43Speaker 05

  That's the one thing, the one part of the cooking world that I'm, I'm good at breakfast.

• 11:49Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, okay.

• 11:50Speaker 05

  So I'm good with any, any kind of egg you want.

• 11:53Angela Hartnett?

  Okay, which is your preferred egg?

• 11:55Speaker 05

  I mean, I keep it simple with the fried egg. I've got a little fried egg pan.

• 11:58Angela Hartnett?

  Love a fried egg.

• 11:59Speaker 05

  So simple, three circles.

• 12:02Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 12:02Speaker 05

  And it just makes the perfect egg.

• 12:04Nick Grimshaw?

  Perfect fried egg.

• 12:04Speaker 05

  It's just done. That's what I have every morning. Creature of habit, if I could eat the same thing every day, I would. Someone said, these are the nutrients, minerals you need every day. I would eat that every day.

• 12:15Nick Grimshaw?

  Could you do that, Andrew?

• 12:16Angela Hartnett?

  Don't think I could. I'd definitely, creature of habit, wanna wear the same clothes every day. I hate having to think about that. I think it's that. I like to be like Obama and just wear.

• 12:24Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 12:25Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 12:25Nick Grimshaw?

  What was he wearing?

• 12:27Angela Hartnett?

  No, they say Obama and Steve Jobs always wear like the same stuff. Maybe not Obama, but certainly Steve Jobs just always wear a turtleneck.

• 12:35Speaker 05

  That's right.

• 12:35Angela Hartnett?

  Jeans, you know?

• 12:36Speaker 05

  If you're making decisions all day, it eliminates that.

• 12:38Angela Hartnett?

  I'd just like to wear t-shirt, shorts and, um, Birkeys every day. You can do it if you want. I'm on this bloody podcast, make me wear shirts. They're not allowed to wear the same shirt more than.

• 12:51Angela Hartnett?

  Now I'm gonna, I'm gonna wear that, now Serge has said, I'm just gonna wear this now for eternity.

• 12:55Speaker 05

  The same.

• 12:56Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, the same. I don't think I can do it with food though.

• 12:58Speaker 05

  Andy Warhol as well, he had the same outfit.

• 13:00Nick Grimshaw?

  He had the same outfit.

• 13:00Angela Hartnett?

  Who was that?

• 13:01Speaker 05

  Andy Warhol.

• 13:01Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, there you go, you see, yeah.

• 13:03Speaker 05

  It just eliminates choice.

• 13:04Nick Grimshaw?

  Quite a lot of turtleneck people, actually.

• 13:06Speaker 05

  There's a couple of turtlenecks. Yeah, there, there's.

• 13:08Nick Grimshaw?

  Andy Warhol.

• 13:09Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, Steve.

• 13:09Nick Grimshaw?

  I feel like Steve, Ozzy I feel like a bit of a black turtleneck.

• 13:12Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, there you go. It's simple, isn't it?

• 13:13Speaker 05

  It just, it just refines you. We did, for our album cover, we did turtlenecks, didn't we?

• 13:17Angela Hartnett?

  There you go.

• 13:18Speaker 05

  Gives you a sense of, you know, there's, there's something in it.

• 13:20Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 13:20Speaker 05

  You look pretty good.

• 13:21Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 13:22Speaker 05

  No matter what age you are.

• 13:23Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, I don't know if I can do them. I don't know if I have the, sort of like brings the chins out, so that, but anyway, we're gonna move on.

• 13:31Angela Hartnett?

  We'll worry about that tomorrow.

• 13:32Nick Grimshaw?

  Another episode, yeah. Um, we wanna do your food likes and dislikes, Serge. So there's, there's some good ones to get into here. Um, you love Italian food, you said.

• 13:41Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 13:41Nick Grimshaw?

  In particular, penne al arabiata.

• 13:44Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 13:44Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, so that's like spicy.

• 13:46Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 13:46Nick Grimshaw?

  Penne. One, yeah. Um, we're not doing that today, but we are doing something similar.

• 13:51Angela Hartnett?

  We're doing something similar and spicy tomato sauce. Yeah.

• 13:54Nick Grimshaw?

  Do you, do you make that yourself or use one?

• 13:56Speaker 05

  No, no, I'm not, I'm not, I, I'm not that good around there. We have food delivered in a box and it's brilliant because it gives you a little recipe.

• 14:05Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 14:06Speaker 05

  But the, the family don't let me near it cause I, I'm one of those, you know, I cut the vegetables and like, you know, mad shapes, you know? And they go, oh, dad, you don't need to be cooking today, you know what I mean? Mom, mom's, she now.

• 14:15Angela Hartnett?

  What, she's still making flowers?

• 14:17Speaker 05

  I just can't like, no, I just can't follow instructions. If there was, if there was a video accompaniment, I'd be brilliant. But like reading a card is like, and then chopping up onions and like, I don't know, you know what I mean? I don't have to attack that, you know what I mean? It just, yeah, I just, my uncle was, uh, so we, we used to go over to Italy and, and, uh, he was just, he was amazing. Cause he owned a bakery, so, so I was just like, when I was younger, surrounded by this food. I was a, one of those kids that, I was terrible with food, like, you know, the one that comes around your house and you, you just goes like, oh, can I just have a bit of bread? Like with no butter on it, do you know what I mean? You know that kid?

• 14:52Nick Grimshaw?

  I know that kid, yeah.

• 14:53Speaker 05

  Yeah, like, so I, I wasn't great, um.

• 14:56Nick Grimshaw?

  So you, what, you wouldn't like try stuff or?

• 14:58Speaker 05

  No, no, no, I was just funny with food, man. And I got better.

• 15:03Nick Grimshaw?

  In your own house as well, you were like that?

• 15:04Speaker 05

  No, no, cause it was kept to like about five or six dishes, you know what I mean? As long as they were there, then I'm fine, but like, I was not great. And it's sort of, and when I, when I went over to Italy, I remember my uncle making his pesto for the first time. I was like, green pasta, I'm like, no way, I mean.

• 15:21Speaker 05

  Why is that?

• 15:22Nick Grimshaw?

  And that, green pasta? No way.

• 15:25Speaker 05

  But then now I'm like thinking, now I love food, like now it's like, and, and when my kids, when they were younger, they weren't, people panic when you, oh, he's not eating his things. It's like, it's fine. You just, when you get older, you just don't.

• 15:36Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, you'll change, yeah.

• 15:38Nick Grimshaw?

  Maybe it's that bit of a test as well, I always think with kids.

• 15:40Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, test their parents.

• 15:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Like they're figuring out like, you know, like what my power is, like what, will I wanna eat? You know, what's my footing in the house maybe?

• 15:47Angela Hartnett?

  That's true, yeah.

• 15:48Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 15:49Angela Hartnett?

  And when I think about that, your uncle probably cooked one of the best pestos you would ever have eaten in your life.

• 15:53Speaker 05

  Most unbelievable, ever.

• 15:54Angela Hartnett?

  From the area, cause it's Genoa where it's all from, the La Goria.

• 15:57Speaker 05

  I mean, the bread was, the bread, you know, the bread for me is like, that's like the ultimate for me.

• 16:04Angela Hartnett?

  Hmm.

• 16:04Speaker 05

  I remember saying, um, like it won't be like Sex, Drugs and Rock and Roll that killed me, it'll be bread, they'll be like.

• 16:11Speaker 05

  Honestly.

• 16:12Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 16:13Speaker 05

  Cause I, and we were in South Korea and I was playing and this girl had, had this sign and it just said, Serge, I've bought you some bread.

• 16:23Speaker 05

  Do you know what I mean? You into bread? I'm into bread.

• 16:26Angela Hartnett?

  I love that. Not throwing her underwear, it's just, it's throwing white baguettes at you.

• 16:31Speaker 05

  Some sourdough, you know what I mean?

• 16:35Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, it's never bad, it's never bad. It also says there that you love Mexican food. Do you have a spot that you like to go to in, is there, was there like a local that you like?

• 16:44Speaker 05

  Do you know what? There's only one really, and it's in San Francisco.

• 16:46Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, not that local.

• 16:48Speaker 05

  Not that local, but it's so good. It's called a taqueria and I, I would probably, I mean, I would go every day if I could.

• 16:55Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 16:56Speaker 05

  And it was just, I didn't, never really had Mexican food until we recorded West Rider and I just, you know, I sort of fell in love with it. And I, it's just, you know, little tacos, just, it's everything.

• 17:06Nick Grimshaw?

  So good. I also think when they're done well, it's like the best.

• 17:10Speaker 05

  Ultimate, yeah, yeah. And the salad, everything. And the spicy margarita.

• 17:14Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 17:15Nick Grimshaw?

  Now, it says there, no dislikes from Serge.

• 17:18Speaker 05

  Well, yeah, there's, there's plenty.

• 17:20Nick Grimshaw?

  There's a few.

• 17:20Speaker 05

  There's plenty.

• 17:21Nick Grimshaw?

  There's a few, yeah. What are the, what are the no goes?

• 17:23Speaker 05

  I didn't realise, this got sent to me like before the gig and I was going, I'll do it in the dressing room. And I was going, oh, I can't feel, I don't know what.

• 17:30Nick Grimshaw?

  Well, you were doing this before you played to 50,000 people?

• 17:33Speaker 05

  Like the day before, yeah.

• 17:33Nick Grimshaw?

  So sorry.

• 17:34Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's fine, it's fine.

• 17:35Nick Grimshaw?

  It shouldn't happen doing that.

• 17:38Speaker 05

  It was, no, no, but I was, so I thought, well, I'll just tell you when I'm there.

• 17:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, it's a podcast, isn't it really?

• 17:44Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 17:44Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, so go on, what are the no goes? What are you on?

• 17:46Speaker 05

  Well, the, the one I can think of that comes to mind is like bean juice is, is, is, terrifies me.

• 17:53Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 17:53Speaker 05

  Anyone that serves you beans like with all the juice wants a rest in.

• 17:59Angela Hartnett?

  Right, okay. So like a ragu of wet beans and stuff like that, okay, got you, yeah.

• 18:03Speaker 05

  I'm not, I'm not great with like super saucy kinda.

• 18:07Angela Hartnett?

  Okay, yeah.

• 18:07Speaker 05

  But just, there's something about bean juice, man.

• 18:10Nick Grimshaw?

  I know what you mean.

• 18:10Speaker 05

  And, and again, going back to a kid, I remember like, you'd get served everything with beans, you know what I mean? Fish wings with beans, Kiev beans, you know what I mean? And I'd be like, oh, I've got beans, oh, it's gonna have sauce on it. And it'd just be dripping it, get a sieve out, for me. Simple beans.

• 18:28Nick Grimshaw?

  Simple beans.

• 18:29Speaker 05

  But what's great now is when they introduced, especially it got a bit fancy with breakfast and then they're coming in a pot now, which I'm okay with.

• 18:37Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, because on the side.

• 18:38Speaker 05

  You can just put them there.

• 18:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 18:40Speaker 05

  Just far enough away and then you can have a little dip if you want.

• 18:43Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 18:44Speaker 05

  Too much sauce as well. People think they're being generous and I think you're getting it wrong. You're just overpowering me that.

• 18:50Angela Hartnett?

  With that too much, yeah. Or give you the option on the side.

• 18:53Speaker 05

  That's exactly it.

• 18:55Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 18:55Speaker 05

  I think I want the option.

• 18:56Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah. I hate when you get pasta with too much sauce.

• 18:59Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, it's not right.

• 19:00Speaker 05

  Do you know what I mean?

• 19:01Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 19:01Speaker 05

  It's just not right, is it?

• 19:02Nick Grimshaw?

  Anything else that we should be wary of?

• 19:05Speaker 05

  I make plain food. I don't go near that.

• 19:07Nick Grimshaw?

  On the aeroplane?

• 19:08Speaker 05

  Just aeroplane food. You know, as soon as you smell that like foil.

• 19:11Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, yeah.

• 19:12Speaker 05

  Do you know what I mean? You can feel it coming out of the kitchen. You go, I'm not getting it.

• 19:15Angela Hartnett?

  You can feel that microwave, can't you?

• 19:16Speaker 05

  Whatever's in that.

• 19:17Nick Grimshaw?

  It always tastes the same.

• 19:19Speaker 05

  Bad. You stay away clear.

• 19:21Nick Grimshaw?

  Tastes the same. So you don't have, what would you do? Because you must be never off a plane, just never.

• 19:25Angela Hartnett?

  So long ago, will you like bring some fruit or nuts or something?

• 19:28Speaker 05

  Yeah, some, a bilthong.

• 19:30Angela Hartnett?

  Okay, yeah, something like that.

• 19:32Speaker 05

  Get some protein in the bag.

• 19:33Nick Grimshaw?

  Yes.

• 19:34Angela Hartnett?

  That's quite good though. That's proper, yeah. That is, because also the salt level, they really season it on the plane because your salt level's changing out a bit.

• 19:42Speaker 05

  Something in that that's just bad. I'm thinking I'm really sensitive to smell, like, because I've got an extreme reaction to smell and taste.

• 19:49Nick Grimshaw?

  That's interesting because I feel like I can, not to be gross on a food podcast, but when I open the door in the bedroom, like when I wake up in the morning, I'm like, the bin needs emptying. I could smell it. Whereas Mish would happily like be in the kitchen, like, empty that bin. I can like, I have a strong sense of smell.

• 20:09Angela Hartnett?

  Excuse me, man, man.

• 20:10Nick Grimshaw?

  Or I can smell it. My sister's friend used to be able to tell when a fox had been in a garden from scent alone.

• 20:15Speaker 05

  Yeah, I think I could probably do that too.

• 20:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah. Well, should we test it out? Let's go outside and get it to smell the car park and see how long ago a fox was in there. So they're the dislikes, so we need to know that. Now, food wise, when I think of Leicester, I actually think of Casabian. I feel like you've cemented.

• 20:36Speaker 05

  But that's beautiful.

• 20:37Nick Grimshaw?

  You know, yourselves in Leicester. But food in Leicester is good sources of stuff there. Leicester cheese.

• 20:43Speaker 05

  Red Leicester, yeah.

• 20:43Nick Grimshaw?

  Red Leicester cheese, Walkers crisps.

• 20:46Speaker 05

  Fantastic.

• 20:47Nick Grimshaw?

  And the melted Mowbray pie.

• 20:48Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 20:49Nick Grimshaw?

  That's good.

• 20:50Speaker 05

  I like all three.

• 20:51Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah. It's a Plamen's lunch essentially.

• 20:53Speaker 05

  That is beautiful, yeah.

• 20:54Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, all great stuff. Like a band rider.

• 20:57Speaker 05

  We have to have all three on the, no matter where we go in the world.

• 21:00Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 21:00Speaker 05

  Have to be.

• 21:01Nick Grimshaw?

  As you should.

• 21:02Speaker 05

  You know what I mean?

• 21:02Nick Grimshaw?

  As you should, yeah, yeah. So you are sort of not the household cook. You sort of leave that.

• 21:08Speaker 05

  Do the, yeah.

• 21:09Nick Grimshaw?

  You do the breakfast.

• 21:10Speaker 05

  Do the more and then make sure everyone's set up.

• 21:12Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, everyone's set up. If you had to, what would be your go-to if there was like, if me and Ange were coming for tea?

• 21:18Speaker 05

  I'd keep it to pasta. I think I'd just do it, I'd figure out a pomodoro, because I think simple Italian food, just I'd sauce the ingredient. That's where I'd, that's where I'd win you over.

• 21:28Nick Grimshaw?

  I think so.

• 21:29Speaker 05

  I'd get the tomatoes shipped in.

• 21:31Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 21:31Speaker 05

  I wouldn't be no local. Do you know what I'm saying? I'd go deep on them tomatoes. Deep on the garlic and the salt would be from, you know, the Andes or whatever. Do you know what I'm saying? I'd go, I'd get like, I'd go like very few ingredients, but all the best I could get.

• 21:47Nick Grimshaw?

  All the best of, that's the way to do it though.

• 21:49Speaker 05

  Do you know what I mean? And I think I could get away with just not being great.

• 21:53Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 21:53Speaker 05

  But the ingredients, you'd be like, oh, them tomatoes. We shipped them in from Sicily, you know.

• 21:57Nick Grimshaw?

  From, straight from Sicily.

• 21:59Speaker 05

  Cost me a fortune though.

• 22:00Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, really expensive meal. What about when you are out and about on tour? Are you someone that likes to seek out restaurants and like, oh, we're here, we should definitely go to this place or we should eat locally? Are you, is that something that you think about on tour?

• 22:14Speaker 05

  Yeah, I suppose there's, there's a few phases, like the first phase when we first started, we were terrifying. Like it was like just bad, I mean it was Burger King, KFC, Little Chef. I mean, we used to take a microwave on tour.

• 22:30Nick Grimshaw?

  Mm, oh.

• 22:31Speaker 05

  This is so bad.

• 22:32Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 22:33Speaker 05

  So if we were playing like Romania or somewhere, you know, like, or even Japan, we'd take microwave and then take like Marks and Spencer's, like canned food in there. And then we'd sit in a hotel room around a microwave.

• 22:45Nick Grimshaw?

  Having it round a microwave.

• 22:46Speaker 05

  It's bad, isn't it?

• 22:47Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah. Yeah. No, we shouldn't try this Japanese cuisine.

• 22:51Speaker 05

  No, we'll be, we'll be fine in there. Get some beef rindang down and we'll be fine. Yeah.

• 22:56Nick Grimshaw?

  We'll be all right. And then did it change? Did you start thinking?

• 22:59Speaker 05

  Then it was like, well, if we carry on like this, we're gonna die, do you know what I mean?

• 23:02Nick Grimshaw?

  It's not gonna be good.

• 23:03Speaker 05

  It's bad. So then it was like, well, we should probably figure out, you know, eating. And then we, you know, sort of venture out. And then now, now eating's such a big part of like, we all go out, we all eat together, we find.

• 23:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, nice.

• 23:18Speaker 05

  Couple of the lads really like food, so they'll be like, oh, you know, we'll go here, you know, we tend to find some really nice spots.

• 23:24Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh no, and can you leave it to someone else to like figure out the spots?

• 23:28Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 23:28Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, it's nice to do. Nice to do.

• 23:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. Food's amazing. Like, I was thinking about it on the way here. I'm thinking about my auntie's roast potatoes.

• 23:36Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 23:38Speaker 05

  And she passed away recently. It was beautiful. It's made me emotional thinking about it, but you know, like a roast potato can just remind you of someone forever. And it's like, what an amazing thing. Like, that, that about food is, and my gran used to make this like Yorkshire pudding, but she'd put all of the food inside the pudding. I've never seen it done like that since. So you sort of, the plate would almost be like a bircher pudding. So I was thinking of it, you know, when I've had a Yorkshire, I think of that.

• 24:04Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh, I like that about food, yeah.

• 24:06Speaker 05

  It's kind of like, you know, as, as great and as crazy and as mad restaurants you can go to and as opulent as it can be, I just find, you know, if I have pasta, it'd be my uncle, do you know what I mean?

• 24:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, I love that.

• 24:18Speaker 05

  I think that's the beautiful thing about food.

• 24:20Angela Hartnett?

  I think exactly what you said, Serge, it's just, it's about memories for me. It's never about necessarily the dish. It's about who you ate the dish with, where it was from, who made it. I mean, my all-time favourite dish is a dish my grandmother always made, which we always have at Christmas called anelini. And it's just pasta in a broth. And it's just the best thing. And it always, and we get, we always talk emotionally about desserts because my grandmother, she was a great cook, but she never did desserts. And so when you make something, you say, well, Nana used to love that. And it's always about being with your family and evoking all that sort of thing.

• 24:54Nick Grimshaw?

  So Ange, tell us what we've got here, please. What have we got going on? This looks great.

• 24:58Angela Hartnett?

  Spaghetti alla assassina with burata and doya crumb.

• 25:02Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh wow.

• 25:03Angela Hartnett?

  And the difference with this, so in a way it's an arrabbiata, because it's lots of chili in there, lots of garlic in there. It's a tomato sauce. But the difference is rather than cooking your pasta in water and adding it to the sauce, you cook it in the sauce. So you start in the pan.

• 25:19Speaker 05

  That is unbelievable.

• 25:19Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, thank you, Serge.

• 25:21Speaker 05

  That is a maestro at work, that is.

• 25:22Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, bless.

• 25:24Nick Grimshaw?

  Wow, that is good.

• 25:25Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, it is spicy, eh? Is it hot?

• 25:28Nick Grimshaw?

  I like it.

• 25:28Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, good. And there's Parmesan if you'd like some.

• 25:31Nick Grimshaw?

  So you do the dried pasta?

• 25:33Angela Hartnett?

  So you basically start in a pan, some olive oil in the pan, add your garlic, dried chili and fresh chili, if you really want to make it nice and hot. Then you, then you add your pasta into that base of chili, garlic and olive oil and just coat the pasta in there. Then you add your tinned tomato. So as you were saying, a really good quality tinned tomato. Alongside it, you've got some boiling water that has tomato puree in it. So you like making a risotto in a way. And you just keep adding bits of the stock into it to cook the pasta. But the key is as well, is to let it cook in that tomato so it starts to go crispy. So when you're eating it, you should have some soft bits of pasta. Some even burnt bits of pasta. And so it should be crunchy, soft, a little bit spicy, all of those.

• 26:18Angela Hartnett?

  Like, yeah, chewy, charred, yeah. And then on top, we have some breadcrumbs with endoya and then a little bit of burata as well. And I think the burata's there to just calm down the spice in your mouth.

• 26:31Nick Grimshaw?

  Ange, this is really good.

• 26:32Speaker 05

  It is hot, isn't it? When you, when you sort of, it's just, that's just hot, that, isn't it?

• 26:36Nick Grimshaw?

  It is hot.

• 26:37Speaker 05

  No, art.

• 26:38Nick Grimshaw?

  Art. Oh, it is art, yeah. I thought you were saying it is art.

• 26:43Nick Grimshaw?

  I was like, it is.

• 26:44Speaker 05

  It is.

• 26:45Nick Grimshaw?

  It is art.

• 26:45Angela Hartnett?

  It's art.

• 26:46Nick Grimshaw?

  It is art. It is art.

• 26:48Speaker 05

  Is that my Leicester accent?

• 26:49Nick Grimshaw?

  It actually is art.

• 26:50Speaker 05

  Yeah. Remember the way you just explained it and the way it looks, you just go, yeah, that is like, that's majestic.

• 26:56Angela Hartnett?

  It's really cool to make. I've never made this before, so I'm very excited. It all seems to have worked out.

• 27:00Speaker 05

  So if I ever burn anything now, I'm just be like, you know what?

• 27:03Nick Grimshaw?

  You know what?

• 27:06Speaker 05

  That's what it's supposed to be like.

• 27:07Nick Grimshaw?

  It's actually an old Sicilian method, actually, actually, yeah, yeah.

• 27:11Angela Hartnett?

  The origins are from the south. So from Puglia is where the dish comes from. And they reckon it was something like that, just made in a restaurant, they're thinking, and they just came together. So I think they're nice in 60s, yeah.

• 27:22Nick Grimshaw?

  Interesting texture.

• 27:24Speaker 05

  Yeah, I love it.

• 27:24Nick Grimshaw?

  But I think it's good that it's spicy.

• 27:26Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 27:27Nick Grimshaw?

  You've got that creamy sauce, but then it's also like, the pasta's like got crunch. Not a crunch, but like a toughness to it. It's good.

• 27:35Angela Hartnett?

  Mm, I like it.

• 27:36Speaker 05

  Thank you, Ange. This is amazing.

• 27:37Angela Hartnett?

  Thank you.

• 27:38Nick Grimshaw?

  I feel like this is one you should stick on the menu, Ange.

• 27:40Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 27:41Nick Grimshaw?

  And I like that it's hot.

• 27:42Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 27:43Speaker 05

  Yeah, like the spice is important, I think.

• 27:45Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 27:46Speaker 05

  There's a drink called, I, I think it's called Picoso. It's a soft drink. So on tour, I don't, I don't drink on tour, leading up to a tour. Just keep it beast mode, do you know what I mean? Keep it like focused. And I found these drinks, they only make two. I love, I love a brand that just goes, right, we do two things and it's just like, one's like a lime and chili and a mango and chili. Honestly, I think it's the greatest drink I've ever tasted. But you could put tequila in it and be amazing, but.

• 28:13Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, but not when you're on tour.

• 28:14Angela Hartnett?

  But not before 50,000.

• 28:15Speaker 05

  You know what I mean?

• 28:16Nick Grimshaw?

  No, before.

• 28:17Speaker 05

  Before I was a singer, I'd be putting plenty of tequila in it, but when you, you've got to keep on the straight and now I keep that, you know, voice protected. But there was a period when I was like, really, you know, I mean, nothing was hot enough. Like wings that would just like take your, you know, the paint off your car.

• 28:32Angela Hartnett?

  Well, you see some people just putting so much spice on stuff.

• 28:36Speaker 05

  So this is about the perfect.

• 28:37Angela Hartnett?

  This is a good level, yeah.

• 28:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Tell us if there is anything that you should do or shouldn't do if you were making this.

• 28:42Angela Hartnett?

  I think be brave, you know, because I think, you know, you think, oh, you shouldn't burn it or let it go crispy. But actually let the sauce really evaporate so that it starts to catch on the bottom. Because that's what gives you that little crispiness and chewiness.

• 28:56Nick Grimshaw?

  I will say when I came in and saw you doing it, it does look a bit.

• 28:59Angela Hartnett?

  Like it's burnt and screwed up.

• 29:01Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 29:02Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 29:03Nick Grimshaw?

  And it looks a bit like studenty.

• 29:05Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 29:06Nick Grimshaw?

  Like, why is it all like that? Do you know what I mean?

• 29:09Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, but it, but it works though.

• 29:10Nick Grimshaw?

  It's really good.

• 29:11Angela Hartnett?

  That's how it should be, yeah. And then we can pair it if we want to drink with a Barbara di Asti Superior, which is a Piemonte wine, perfect, very rich, lovely, opulent wine that would go really well with this pasta dish.

• 29:25Nick Grimshaw?

  It's really good. It's really tasty. If you want to try this recipe, you'll get the ingredients or get the wine, waitrose.com/dishrecipes. It's all on there. You can also get videos online of Ange making this to show you how to.

• 29:41Nick Grimshaw?

  We have a brand new Kasabian album on the way, which is called Act Three. It's gonna be out September, September the 4th. This is the third album with you as the frontman. The other two have both gone to number one. How do you find like the third album with you as the frontman? How was it to approach it?

• 29:58Speaker 05

  The first album was written exactly the same as this will be the ninth album. So the process is exactly the same. I'm just, you know, I've got a studio at home and I'm, you know, I go every day.

• 30:10Nick Grimshaw?

  You go every day, wow.

• 30:11Speaker 05

  I've really sort of managed to figure out how I get it done. Back in the day, it was lunacy, do you know what I mean? I like once, I'd work through the night and, but now I sort of, you know, I have a real sort of concise little plan about getting into it.

• 30:27Nick Grimshaw?

  By the way, we should talk about the name of the studio. It's called?

• 30:30Speaker 05

  The Surgery.

• 30:30Nick Grimshaw?

  The Surgery.

• 30:33Speaker 05

  I didn't name that, that was my friend that sent me, for my birthday, he sent me a plaque and he said, "The Surgery", he's like, "That's what you should call your studio." I was like, "That's pretty good."

• 30:40Nick Grimshaw?

  Really good, it's really good, that. So when you go in there, there are days where nothing happens.

• 30:46Speaker 05

  Oh yeah, plenty of days, nothing happens, yeah.

• 30:48Nick Grimshaw?

  And how do you find those days when you're, do you, cause I, same with like writers, when I interview like an author, they like, sometimes you just sat at your computer and you're [BLEEP] all day. I guess you've got to go through that. How do you deal with those days where it's not coming?

• 31:03Speaker 05

  Then I'll just do draw, like I've got, I've got some, I'll do art, I'll try and make something. So if it's not happening, I'll just, you know, I'll put a film on or, I sort of get away with watching a lot of films, but I'm just researching, you know what I mean?

• 31:17Nick Grimshaw?

  It's a great process. And you say you're in there every day. What is your optimum working time? Cause always, when you say you don't do anymore, often when we speak to bands and artists, they do it all night and I'm like, "That's, it sounds like a disaster."

• 31:30Speaker 05

  I used to be like mad hours.

• 31:32Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 31:33Speaker 05

  Weirdly, I never thought I'd want a nine to five, but I've kind of craved a nine to five, like hours, you know what I mean?

• 31:39Nick Grimshaw?

  It's kind of amazing how many artists I interviewed did say the exact same thing. They're like, "No, that's why I did it, cause I didn't want a nine to five." And they're like, "Actually, it works really well to like, to like work." I wanted to ask you about how it was like, cause you're always a key member of the band, you know? I always think of you and I think of Kasabian and I always have since I started going to see you guys. But to make the leap as a, as a frontman, how, how was that shift for you? Because, you know, you're always like on the stage, being cheered on the stage, but it's a different energy in it to be

• 32:09Speaker 05

  Totally different.

• 32:10Nick Grimshaw?

  The frontman.

• 32:11Speaker 05

  It's what it's, it's mad, the, it's like a, an alternate universe.

• 32:16Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 32:16Speaker 05

  So I thought, you know, I thought I was Keith and now Mick and it's like, I don't know what happened there, you know? But it's amazing what you're capable of when you don't know it, you know? When you've just thrown in and you've just got to figure it out, then you, you sort of, I don't know, you just take, you just find the way. But I've almost treated it like a martial art in a way of like, I've sort of dedicated, you know, I've learnt from the greats. And I've, you know, I've got myself fit, like I've, I've taken it really seriously. And, you know, I see it as a duty to entertain, like that's like the, you go on that stage and you just make sure that, that every person in there goes away with memories that will be

• 33:00Angela Hartnett?

  Unique to that gig that night, yeah.

• 33:02Speaker 05

  Just ingrained in your brain, so you can draw on that for the rest of your life. Remember that, like that Saturday show, there's kids in the audience that will, that Finsbury Park will never leave that. And that's, for me, that's the job, you know, journey.

• 33:14Nick Grimshaw?

  And I saw a really amazing video of your mum, Pat. She's been interviewed on the street and they're like, "So who are you, blah, blah, like, tell us about your life." And she talks about Serge.

• 33:27Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 33:27Nick Grimshaw?

  It's amazing. And she just talks about like how proud she is of you because of your vision and your like focus from the age of 14, saying like, "I wanna be in a band, I want to play Glastonbury." Is that true that you were like quite laser focused at a young age?

• 33:40Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, but it was more of the fear of having to get a real job.

• 33:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Right.

• 33:44Speaker 05

  And, and, and music just was there and, and songwriting to music, like everything, everything.

• 33:51Nick Grimshaw?

  And did you, when you were wanting to do that at that age, were you saying it out loud or were you just thinking it? Or were you saying to your mum like?

• 33:56Speaker 05

  I was strutting around the school in a fur coat and my.

• 34:00Angela Hartnett?

  And what, what bands were you, what bands were you listening to? What were you influenced by when you were growing up?

• 34:05Speaker 05

  The first, the first real, the rave scene was huge, like that was a, that early rave scene was so, I mean, I was too young to go, but, but I just was so obsessed with, you know, the idea of like this subculture where you wouldn't, no, you couldn't buy it in, in the record stores.

• 34:20Angela Hartnett?

  It was all underground.

• 34:21Speaker 05

  Yeah, and, and people had just turned up with sound systems in lorries and bands and it was for the people, you know? And I was really, that had a big effect on me. I'd like rave t-shirts, you know, where the slogans on and stuff. You get like, you weren't allowed, one of them said like Fairy Hit Kid just had LSD, you know, like Fairy Liquid. And had a big like Superman shirt with like a massive E on it, it gets school like that. Like 12, don't know what day it was. And then, so, so that was the real thing of like, that was my like beginning. And then I was like the perfect age for Britpop, like that British music explosion.

• 34:59Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, of course.

• 34:59Speaker 05

  I was like prime and then, you know, when, when sort of Oasis came and Liam and Noel were like, they made someone from Leicester believe that

• 35:07Angela Hartnett?

  You could do it.

• 35:08Speaker 05

  We can, you can, that's, that's it, you know, I don't wanna be, I can't be like, you know? It's like that mod attitude, I sort of committed hard and you know, there's long hair and just the fur coats and just strutted.

• 35:22Nick Grimshaw?

  But I love in the video, she says like, "You've freed her, like you've made her feel inspired and free." And I was like, that's kind of amazing to see, yeah. It really is, really special, yeah, it really is. Tell us about this album then, like tell us about the, you know, the intention with it, what it was when you were in there that you wanted to, to get to on Act Three.

• 35:44Speaker 05

  It, it feels like a little bit of each album. You know, over the years, I sort of developed a style in a way, I, I put a song together and it, it's like the sort of accumulation of all what I've learnt and then this record is like just bits and pieces of the previous eight. I'm really proud of it. I think it's really, really special record.

• 36:06Nick Grimshaw?

  And do you play it to people along the way?

• 36:08Speaker 05

  Yeah, I was gonna say.

• 36:08Nick Grimshaw?

  Is there anyone that you like test out on like friends or family?

• 36:11Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, every now and again. Amy, one of my, gets to sort of hear voice notes and she's always just like, "Whoa, I don't even understand what you're doing there." The problem is I can, I can hear from a voice note, I can hear a finished song. If I've got eight seconds, I can, I can hear the whole thing.

• 36:29Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 36:30Nick Grimshaw?

  Wow.

• 36:30Speaker 05

  So I can hear like the symphony of a little voice note that just sounds like someone mumbling. So, but I forget, most people are just going, "You just, what you're saying, you're not saying anything, you know what I mean?" What, what's, you know, so.

• 36:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Oh wow.

• 36:41Speaker 05

  Yeah, so she, she, she has to listen to a lot of nonsense.

• 36:46Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, makes you keep you quite grounded, just quite straight up, yeah.

• 36:50Angela Hartnett?

  That's what you need.

• 36:51Nick Grimshaw?

  We're all love partners like that, don't we?

• 36:54Angela Hartnett?

  That's what you need, isn't it?

• 36:55Nick Grimshaw?

  Why don't you listen to that on the radio? He's like, "I don't need to hear your voice anymore, thanks."

• 37:03Nick Grimshaw?

  We were looking at your, your life and we were like, "Hang on, we wanna talk about the extracurricular passions of you." We found out that you used to design your own trainers as a kid.

• 37:13Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 37:13Nick Grimshaw?

  That's adorable.

• 37:14Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. No, I did full brands and stuff.

• 37:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Did you?

• 37:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I was obsessed with fashion and I was just, yeah, I, I was always having.

• 37:23Angela Hartnett?

  Have you still, has your mum still got any designs of that?

• 37:25Speaker 05

  Yeah, she got them all out and I was like, "Wow."

• 37:26Angela Hartnett?

  Oh, brilliant.

• 37:28Speaker 05

  Cause it was like, I used to do football kits and like, yeah, I just had a whole brand, like projections, like profit projections and stuff.

• 37:34Nick Grimshaw?

  No way.

• 37:34Angela Hartnett?

  That's amazing.

• 37:36Speaker 05

  They were just raps, they weren't, they weren't anything real.

• 37:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Profit's all.

• 37:40Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, exactly, yeah.

• 37:41Nick Grimshaw?

  And have you made like, cause we know you threw your excellent outfits. Have you made any outfit choices over the years where you look back and you're like, "Shouldn't have done that"?

• 37:49Speaker 05

  Yeah, I think like between like 06 and 09, I would wish we could delete that, those, some, some bad choices.

• 37:58Nick Grimshaw?

  What were we talking, like?

• 37:59Speaker 05

  Some bad scarfs and, you know what I mean?

• 38:02Angela Hartnett?

  That's not too bad, scarf.

• 38:03Nick Grimshaw?

  But I think in the, in whatever you wear at the time, you like can't possibly think this would ever look bad.

• 38:10Angela Hartnett?

  No, cause otherwise she wouldn't wear it, yeah.

• 38:12Nick Grimshaw?

  And then when I look back at like what I was wearing at that time, terr- terrifying.

• 38:17Speaker 05

  Some terrifying pictures.

• 38:19Nick Grimshaw?

  Now this, I loved, loved this so much from an interview that you did with Runners World, cause you, you enjoy a run.

• 38:25Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 38:25Nick Grimshaw?

  That, this is my favourite, that you got the influence from Forrest Gump. I love that. I love that you watched Forrest Gump when you were like, "This is it, I'm gonna take it up." Is that a true story?

• 38:36Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, I remember seeing it as a kid, I just, you know the idea of just, you know the idea of just like going?

• 38:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah.

• 38:43Speaker 05

  As far as you can, like just decide one day that I'm just gonna run. And I loved the idea of that. And I think, you know, just grow a massive beard, long hair and just run to like

• 38:57Nick Grimshaw?

  And just run.

• 38:58Angela Hartnett?

  Just run until you stop, yeah.

• 39:00Nick Grimshaw?

  Have you ever had a runner's high?

• 39:02Angela Hartnett?

  No.

• 39:02Nick Grimshaw?

  Me neither.

• 39:03Angela Hartnett?

  No. We've never run that fast, mate.

• 39:05Speaker 05

  Yeah, you need to, how far have you gone though, for me?

• 39:07Angela Hartnett?

  You did a 10K, did you not have it there?

• 39:09Speaker 05

  Yeah, so about 10K, you used to, you used to a little bit further.

• 39:13Nick Grimshaw?

  I always find the end better than the beginning.

• 39:16Speaker 05

  Yeah, of course, yeah.

• 39:17Nick Grimshaw?

  Right?

• 39:17Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 39:18Nick Grimshaw?

  No, of course.

• 39:19Angela Hartnett?

  This is the end.

• 39:21Nick Grimshaw?

  No, but like the end, like the first bit, I'm like all clunky, but by the time I run for a bit. I'm like, "Maybe I'm a runner" and then it ends.

• 39:28Angela Hartnett?

  Maybe you're a runner.

• 39:30Speaker 05

  Do you know what though, you're right, the clunk, you always get the clunk, I get the clunk, the clunk.

• 39:34Nick Grimshaw?

  Is that when it's not working?

• 39:36Speaker 05

  The first mile, no matter how fit, you know, how good you do, it's horrendous. And then you just, body goes, "Oh, I know what I'm doing now."

• 39:42Nick Grimshaw?

  No, dude, okay, so it does exist. It does exist for a time.

• 39:45Speaker 05

  That'll never leave you.

• 39:47Nick Grimshaw?

  Okay, all right, and the high exists.

• 39:49Speaker 05

  High exists.

• 39:49Nick Grimshaw?

  People keep saying it, I'm not, I'm not.

• 39:51Speaker 05

  No, no, it's there, it's real.

• 39:53Angela Hartnett?

  He tells you, it's real.

• 39:54Speaker 05

  Our man Forrest.

• 39:55Nick Grimshaw?

  Forrest knows.

• 39:59Nick Grimshaw?

  At Serge, we're gonna do your fast food quiz now, it's quick fire. Are you ready?

• 40:02Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 40:03Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, okay.

• 40:06Nick Grimshaw?

  Tell us your favourite way to eat eggs.

• 40:08Speaker 05

  Oh, fried.

• 40:09Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah. What's your favourite sandwich, Philin?

• 40:11Speaker 05

  Ham, but the nice ham, you know what I'm saying? The way for ham, the expensive, gorgeous ham.

• 40:18Nick Grimshaw?

  Expensive ham. What's the best form of potato?

• 40:21Speaker 05

  Oh, question that, isn't it? There's so many choices.

• 40:25Nick Grimshaw?

  So many.

• 40:25Speaker 05

  Roast.

• 40:26Nick Grimshaw?

  Correct.

• 40:27Angela Hartnett?

  What's your favourite herb?

• 40:29Speaker 05

  I mean, the obvious answer.

• 40:33Angela Hartnett?

  Which is?

• 40:36Nick Grimshaw?

  Right.

• 40:40Nick Grimshaw?

  What is, what's the best crisp?

• 40:43Speaker 05

  I'm gonna go space raider, pickled onion.

• 40:46Angela Hartnett?

  Space raider, wow. I don't think we've had that answer before.

• 40:49Speaker 05

  That's for the connoisseur, that is. That's the Michelin star of Christmas.

• 40:52Angela Hartnett?

  That is, that is. What is your favourite fruit?

• 40:54Speaker 05

  Pineapple.

• 40:55Nick Grimshaw?

  What's the best pasta?

• 40:56Speaker 05

  Just add it.

• 40:57Nick Grimshaw?

  I actually think we have.

• 40:58Speaker 05

  I think we have. It's up there for me. Honestly.

• 41:01Angela Hartnett?

  Bless you. What's your favourite Sunday roast?

• 41:03Speaker 05

  Yeah, chicken.

• 41:04Angela Hartnett?

  Chicken, nice.

• 41:05Nick Grimshaw?

  What would you say is the best beverage?

• 41:07Speaker 05

  I'm gonna say piccoso, lime and chili.

• 41:11Angela Hartnett?

  And finally, what's your favourite toast topping?

• 41:14Speaker 05

  Red Leicester.

• 41:15Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, yeah, that's a good choice. That's a good answer.

• 41:19Nick Grimshaw?

  Come on.

• 41:19Angela Hartnett?

  Very good. I like those so much.

• 41:21Nick Grimshaw?

  Serge, we come to the end of the show question.

• 41:23Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 41:24Nick Grimshaw?

  For your chance to take home this Waitrose goodie bag.

• 41:28Angela Hartnett?

  Full of little treats and delights for you.

• 41:30Nick Grimshaw?

  And just done the big shot.

• 41:31Angela Hartnett?

  There you go. All that for you.

• 41:33Speaker 05

  Wow, look at that.

• 41:34Nick Grimshaw?

  Here we go. We have a fashion question for you.

• 41:37Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 41:38Nick Grimshaw?

  Lady Gaga famously had a meat dress.

• 41:40Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 41:41Nick Grimshaw?

  But which of the following items are you most drawn to and why? So she had the meat dress. Would you like a mushroom top hat? So it's a top hat made of mushrooms.

• 41:51Speaker 05

  Okay. Made of mushrooms?

• 41:53Nick Grimshaw?

  Made of mushrooms. A bacon suit. Suit made of bacon. Or would you like a far-fetched bow tie? So like a pasta bow tie?

• 42:01Speaker 05

  Have you made, have you got, have you made them?

• 42:03Angela Hartnett?

  No, we've not.

• 42:04Speaker 05

  No, no, no, no.

• 42:05Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, bring on, bring on the mushroom top hat.

• 42:08Angela Hartnett?

  Bring on the bacon suit.

• 42:10Nick Grimshaw?

  The bacon suit.

• 42:11Angela Hartnett?

  All morning bacon.

• 42:13Nick Grimshaw?

  I'll tell you what, tell you what.

• 42:14Speaker 05

  You know, sometimes you go to a fancy restaurant.

• 42:15Angela Hartnett?

  That would have been quite impressive if we had to be fair.

• 42:17Speaker 05

  But you go to a fancy restaurant, you know, those ones that you see on Netflix and that? And they bring out mad stuff.

• 42:21Nick Grimshaw?

  Mad stuff, yeah.

• 42:22Speaker 05

  I thought maybe that.

• 42:23Nick Grimshaw?

  Well, this is the mind of a true creator.

• 42:25Angela Hartnett?

  Exactly. He's like, have you made them? That's why I don't want to answer. I need to wear it.

• 42:31Nick Grimshaw?

  You and Serge should have a collaborative day.

• 42:34Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah, we'll do it. I like that, yeah. A mushroom hat. So which, what are we making then on our collaboration?

• 42:39Nick Grimshaw?

  Yeah, go on, you should make it for Serge.

• 42:40Angela Hartnett?

  What are we making?

• 42:41Nick Grimshaw?

  Well, the mushroom top hat sounds quite nice.

• 42:42Speaker 05

  Yeah, I mean, that was the obvious one. The meat suit, I'm not sure I'm walking around.

• 42:46Nick Grimshaw?

  No.

• 42:47Speaker 05

  It's not great, is it? We'll go mushroom top hat.

• 42:49Angela Hartnett?

  I think mushroom top hat, yeah. I think that could work. I'll do that. Next time you're on, we'll do it.

• 42:55Nick Grimshaw?

  Next big show, mushroom top hat. Serge, the goodie bag is yours, of course.

• 42:59Speaker 05

  Have I won?

• 42:59Nick Grimshaw?

  You've won for that. You've won for that.

• 43:04Angela Hartnett?

  I've won for that!

• 43:05Nick Grimshaw?

  Thank you for coming to us. Round of applause to Serge, everybody.

• 43:08Angela Hartnett?

  Thank you. Thank you, Serge.

• 43:11Nick Grimshaw?

  That was so fun.

• 43:14Nick Grimshaw?

  Massive thank you to Serge for joining us for this week's episode. Before we go, we have a question. I thought this is quite a good question. Vital for anyone planning to go to one of your restaurants, Ange. Or any Italian, really. This is from Robin. Hi, Robin. Saying, "Hi, Nick, Angela and team. I'm pregnant and I've just taken myself out to Caffi Morano for a last treat before I get too big to move and the baby comes. I had a lovely time. The staff were fantastic, including checking the cheese was pregnancy-friendly without me asking."

• 43:47Angela Hartnett?

  Very good.

• 43:47Nick Grimshaw?

  Pregnancy-friendly cheese.

• 43:49Angela Hartnett?

  Well, pasteurised or unpasteurised, as you say. Yeah, so if you have barata, that's probably unpasteurised. So why check your pasteurised cheese?

• 43:57Nick Grimshaw?

  Robin says, "The food was delicious too. I had linguine cacio pepe. My question, how are you supposed to eat long pasta in public? I stuck in my fork, I twiddled but worried I was getting it wrong. Nick, please don't let Angela say 'do what you like', because people will judge if I flick it up my nose. Love the podcast, especially these seasonality tips from Robin." Yeah, so long pasta.

• 44:22Angela Hartnett?

  So I think with the long pasta, you should always eat it as you like it, whatever you're comfortable with. And we've just had Serge on and he smashed the long pasta. I mean, he was eating it on camera, chatting away. He was brilliant. And not eating pasta on a screen is not easy, is it?

• 44:37Nick Grimshaw?

  No. Well, I think have one long please then. Have you ever seen Lady in the Tram?

• 44:40Angela Hartnett?

  Yes.

• 44:43Nick Grimshaw?

  Do like that. No, what did you reckon?

• 44:45Angela Hartnett?

  I was doing Japan noodles. The way that you do it in Italy, or the Italians do, is you have a spoon and you have your fork. I always have my fork in my mouth. And you sort of load the pasta onto the spoon and you twizzle on the spoon. And then onto there. And the spoon is also used to help you pick it up.

• 45:00Nick Grimshaw?

  Used to help to pick it up, so you don't get in the ding dang.

• 45:03Angela Hartnett?

  Dribble, yeah, exactly, yeah. That's how you do it.

• 45:05Nick Grimshaw?

  There you go, Robin.

• 45:06Angela Hartnett?

  There we go.

• 45:06Nick Grimshaw?

  There you go, Robin. That's how you do it.

• 45:09Angela Hartnett?

  Yeah.

• 45:09Nick Grimshaw?

  If you have any questions, you can ask us anything, how to eat food. You can email us, [email protected]. And thank you for watching. Thank you for listening and we will see you next week for more.

• 45:22Angela Hartnett?

  Bye.

• 45:25Nick Grimshaw?

  If that episode has left you wanting more, find us on Instagram, TikTok and YouTube. Just search Dish.

• 45:33Angela Hartnett?

  If you want to make any of the meals I cook on Dish, head to waitrose.com/dishrecipes for all the ingredients and the recipes.

• 45:42Nick Grimshaw?

  Email your questions, thoughts and suggestions to [email protected].

• 45:48Angela Hartnett?

  Dish from Waitrose is a Cold Glass Production.

• 45:51Speaker 06

  Waitrose, the home of food lovers.