#279 - Psyops Expert: Inside the Mind of a Master Manipulator | Chase Hughes

Watch every episode ad-free & uncensored on Patreon: https://patreon.com/dannyjones Chase Hughes is a US Government brainwashing, interrogation & psyops expert. He trains military & intelligence agencies on human hacking, influence, persuasion, interrogation, and negotiation. SPONSORS https://ketone.com/dannyjones - Save 30% off your first subscription order & receive a free 6-pack https://shopmando.com - Use code DANNY for $5 off your starter pack. https://whiterabbitenergy.com/?ref=DJP - Use code DJP for 20% off EPISODE LINKS https://nci.university/dannyjones Chase' YouTube channel: @chasehughesofficial https://www.instagram.com/chasehughesofficial FOLLOW DANNY JONES https://www.instagram.com/dannyjones https://twitter.com/jonesdanny OUTLINE 00:00 - Military psychological operations 06:08 - Milgram experiment 16:43 - MK-Ultra hypnotism playbook 26:22 - How to spot psyop 31:57 - Havana syndrome 44:19 - How to brainwash anybody in 5 steps 50:08 - Behavioral table of elements 01:01:21 - Using hypnotism in daily life 01:06:54 - How to stack a jury 01:12:50 - The FATE model 01:21:59 - Alice in Wonderland technique 01:29:25 - L Ron Hubbard's brain condition 01:38:28 - Methylene blue 01:46:58 - Mitochondria is not human 01:54:46 - Benefits of sunlight exposure 02:01:24 - Google's sinister history 02:09:37 - How to spot a psychopath 02:15:48 - Codes hidden in the DMT space 02:28:32 - High dose melatonin 02:39:59 - Bystander effect 02:45:28 - New Jersey drones a psyop? 02:56:49 - Benny Hinn mass exorcisms 03:09:29 - Placebo & the brain 03:16:11 - Blue Angles flight briefing 03:20:14 - Importance of checklists Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:07Danny Jones?

  So why don't you just give yourself a brief introduction to your backgrounds? People know who you are if they don't already.

• 0:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm, uh, my name is Chase Hughes. I did 20 years in the US military, retired in 2019. Then did some behavioral stuff, wrote a few books that became bestsellers. And I have a YouTube channel where we break down people's behaviors and stuff. But most of my life I've been obsessed with how people are made to do things that are not in their best interest. Whether that is confessing to a crime in interrogation or providing some kind of intelligence, or is it maybe getting talked into a cult or something like that? So that was, that's always fascinated me from the standpoint of in interrogations, what can a person be made to do and how, how long does it take to get to the desired result?

• 0:58Danny Jones?

  And you are an expert in psychological warfare and psychological operations?

• 1:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05Danny Jones?

  And what capacity have you worked for the government in this kind of realm?

• 1:10Speaker 01

  So the first job that I ever had was literally just scraping rust off of the ship. So if anybody's out there right now, you're thinking about joining the Navy, um, don't let your recruiter tell you to go undesignedated because it sounds good. They're like, oh, you can go in there and then you can pick whatever job you want. You're not designated. So I did that for like two and a half years. And then 2001, a friend of mine got killed on the USS Cole. And there was, uh, this was the bombing that took place in the Gulf of Yemen on September 11th. And his name is Craig Weberly. And I read all these intelligence reports that said the agents didn't develop contacts well enough. We didn't, we had all these failures that took place on the ground. And I had already been studying body language and I just got into body language because,

• 1:55Speaker 01

  because I was rejected by a girl when I was like 19. And I was stationed in Pearl Harbor. So we were down in Waikiki and basically she just says, no, thank you. Like really mean, like right to my face and it hurt. It was like a. A heart impact to me. And I went home that night and typed into Google, how to tell when girls like you. And I printed out this big ass stack of paper and just the more I learned about reading human behavior, the more I could see like, everybody is suffering. Everybody that you meet is insecure. And you start being able to see all these hidden insecurities. And just coming to that realization of everybody that you meet is hiding some kind of insecurity in some way.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  And it didn't make me feel better than anybody else. It just made me feel like, oh, they're screwed up like I am. And so I think I had social anxiety and that that kind of made behavior addictive to me because I could kind of see behind the curtain. And it let me know that everybody else was kind of screwed up.

• 2:56Danny Jones?

  So at that point, you decided to get into actually studying neuroscience? And I think you did some sort of classes at Harvard and Duke, right?

• 3:07Speaker 01

  I did a bunch of psychology classes when I was in the military and went to a university that was kind of like, if you pay your military money, they pass you. Kind of a thing. Uh, but after I retired from the military, that's when I started, uh, the education was free essentially. So I did a postgraduate, um, program for neuroscience at Harvard. And then I did the standard neuroscience and medical neuroscience program at Duke University.

• 3:34Danny Jones?

  Oh, wow. And at what point did you start to get these jobs working with the, the military intelligence agencies and stuff like this? And is there like an official

• 3:47Danny Jones?

  organization or a compartmented area of the government that only does psychological operations?

• 3:52Speaker 01

  There are. That, that's the US Army. So the US Army is kind of subdivided. You have like the Special Operations Command, and then you have a bunch of stuff under there. And PSYOPs falls under the Special Operations Command. So it's mostly Army. When you think about any PSYOPs, you're going to think Army. That's when the Army is involved a hundred percent. So that, that branch, I didn't start until I was a civilian. I got out. I'd been developing all these programs my whole life to try to improve all of our intelligence training. And I realized maybe halfway through my career. And you can imagine when somebody says like, oh, this is military grade.

• 4:30Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  If you talk to somebody who is in the military, that's the opposite. Like, we're thinking like, oh, that's a thing, it's a piece of shit. But, because I thought, like, all of this intelligence training has to be cool. It's gotta be like Jason Bourne level persuasion and influence training and stuff. Come to find out, taking the class, even going to like recruiting school to recruit people. The, the, the training was like, give people firm handshake, look them in the eye. Use their name when you're talking to them, maybe touch them on the shoulder every once in a while. It was like, it was like Dale Carnegie.

• 5:06Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  That, that's all it was.

• 5:07Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 5:08Speaker 01

  And I, I was stunned, stunned that that was the best we had to offer. That was the best that we could give an intelligence operative. And that was the reason that, you know, we had some of those terror attacks. So I started training psyops in 2019, was the first time. And that, just training psyops, they soaked it up so much because they were starving for some kind of training like that for so long. Because they've been going off of these PowerPoints that say like, get to know the person you're talking to, and that's it. It doesn't say, how, how do you do that? How do you get them to connect to you? It just says, well, get to know them, ask, ask open ended questions, like the most basic stuff.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  It was like, all their training would be like something ChatGPT would just spit out. If you say, give me a training on how to connect to somebody, it would just be the most generic thing you can imagine.

• 5:59Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 6:00Speaker 01

  So I wanted to make that better, and there's so much out there. And I just looked at, if I could go on a tangent here for a second.

• 6:07Danny Jones?

  Mm hmm.

• 6:08Speaker 01

  So the, you've heard of the Milgram experiment?

• 6:10Danny Jones?

  No.

• 6:11Speaker 01

  Let me walk you through it. This is 1962 at Yale University. And they do a study, they put an ad in the paper and they say, we're doing a study on learning and psychology. And if you come in and volunteer for the study, we're going to give you like a lunch voucher or something like that. So all these people volunteered. So let's say you're doing the study and you take it and it's you go up in this hallway, you meet and meet this guy, the guy in the lab coat, and there's another volunteer there and you draw straws. The other guy draws the learner straw and you draw a straw that says teacher on it. And they say, all right, you're going to sit down here and I'll summarize it. But the guy's in the room next to you with the door shut and you're going to sit

• 6:55Speaker 01

  down at this machine and you're going to read this quiz and for every question he gets wrong, you're going to shock his ass. You're going to deliver an electric shock. So they you walk in there with him to begin the experiment. You watch him getting strapped down into this machine and they even let you test the shocker on yourself.

• 7:12Danny Jones?

  I have heard of this. I read about this somewhere.

• 7:15Speaker 01

  So let's so you're and every time they get a question wrong, you shock them. But not only that, you're going to grab that little knob and move the voltage up. So if you move the knob all the way to the far right, it says XXX danger severe shock. So you start the experiment. The guy says he's got a heart condition and you you can hear him screaming when you when you hit this little shock button through the wall, you can hear him go ah, ah, you can hear these little screams. And every time you're moving it up and sooner or later, he says, I don't want to do this anymore. I don't want to continue. I'm out of here. I have a heart condition. I told you I had a heart condition. I'm want I want

• 7:58Speaker 01

  to leave. I want to stop right now. And all these people will kind of like turn back to the guy in the lab coat like, you know, what do I do? And the guy in the lab coat is almost every time would say something as simple as it's important that you continue or the experiment requires that you continue. So they keep going and keep going and keep going. They're up to like 300 volts now. And at around 350 volts, every sound in the room across the wall stops. No more sound. And they shock. And then he stops answering questions altogether. There's no response to these questions because he's pushing this little button that indicates like ABCD.

• 8:43Speaker 01

  And you turn around to the guy in the lab coat again. The guy in the lab coat says, "Any non-answer must be treated as an incorrect answer. Please continue."

• 8:52Speaker 01

  And they kept going. And they kept going, shocking what they assumed, which was an actor, the guy in the other room's an actor. But they assumed this is a real person. They're suffering and maybe unconscious at this point. They wanted to stop. They asked to stop. So before this experiment started, all these psychologists got together and they said, "You know, how many people are going to go through with this?" And they said, "0.07%," I think was the answer. They said, "Anybody that would go through with this is a psychopath and wants to hurt other human beings." So the experiment concluded, 67% of people went all the way. All the way.

• 9:38Speaker 01

  And 250 volts is enough to kill you, based on amps, but 100% of people went up to 250 volts. 100%.

• 9:47Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  And it's been replicated so many times. It's been over and over. People have replicated it in different environments and different changes. Some of the experiments, they physically made the participant hold the person's hand down on a metal plate that was shocking them. And they went back and they said, "This is a study of obedience to authority," because this was during the Nuremberg Trials going on, and with all of the former Nazis saying, "I was just following orders. I was just doing what I was told to do."

• 10:20Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 10:20Speaker 01

  So Dr. Milgram, his parents were Jewish. He does this experiment. "Will people just do what they're told to do?" And they thought that this was all about authority. So people are struggling right now. All over the internet, you can see stuff like sales training, like sales training mastery. Here's the influence mastery.

• 10:41Speaker 01

  If, if I can, in forty minutes, I can talk a total stranger into committing murder, wouldn't you think that that's harder than selling him a car? And those people in the Milgram experiment, there was no secret hypnotic technique. They didn't inject them with some LSD or something before the thing happened. They didn't have some secret handshake, or they'd touch them a certain way, or hypnotize them. No techniques, no methods. It was just how responsive our mammalian part of our brain is to authority. But they missed, they missed one element of that, which we can talk about later. But that's how incredible authority really is when it comes to influence and persuasion in human behavior.

• 11:26Speaker 01

  It's everything.

• 11:27Danny Jones?

  That leads me to a little bit what we were talking to before we started recording this podcast, talking about certain folks that see things going on in the world and automatically assume that this thing is some sort of psyop, right? Or some sort of psychological, like, for example, the guy, Crooks, I think his name was, that tried to shoot Trump and got killed immediately afterwards. And then gets his identity scrubbed from the internet. Like, or you even have the guy who just tried to, or just murdered the healthcare CEO two weeks ago, or a week ago, whatever it was. So many people love to jump online to immediately like, this guy was a Manchurian candidate,

• 12:07Danny Jones?

  or this guy was somehow co-opted by somebody in intelligence, or the FBI, or whatever, and manipulated to do this. And it makes a lot of sense, and it's easy to draw connections to that kind of thing. But how much of that do you think is real that goes on today, in this day and age?

• 12:25Speaker 01

  I think it, it probably still goes on. But I want you to, here's what a lot, the mistake a lot of those people will make, and I hope I don't piss them off by saying this, but it's not about the technique. A lot of people think, oh, you have, you need all this training, I'm gonna inject this person, I'm gonna do secret messages into their brain using some machine, or something like that. If I'm an authority in, in a person's life, and I say, hey, man, you know what you need to do? You need to go do that. You go do that thing to that person. That's all, that's all it really takes. Because it's not about the right skills, it's about the ability to select the right target, or to select the right candidate to, to perform the action. This goes all the way back to Bobby Kennedy. RFK's dad.

• 13:10Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 13:10Speaker 01

  And which who was killed by a guy named Sirhan Sirhan.

• 13:13Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 13:14Speaker 01

  In San Francisco. And I I believe that that was on purpose, and I think that that was very heavily influenced. I think he was influenced. He has no memory of the entire event.

• 13:26Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 13:27Speaker 01

  I went to the prison to sit down with Sirhan a few years ago.

• 13:31Danny Jones?

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• 14:17Danny Jones?

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• 15:00Danny Jones?

  by going to ketone.com/dannyjones. It's linked below. Now back to the show.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  I booked a flight, got a hotel, had all these forms filled out, walked in the front door, handed over my driver's license to sign in and all that stuff, and they said, he's sick. He's not feeling well. He's sick. So I never got a chance to talk to him, but. If you just look at it in terms of, am I selecting the right person to do this? It's, it's a thousand times easier and you don't need some giant agency who's doing this. It's often not some agency. It's usually a group of people with a special interest.

• 15:40Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 15:41Speaker 01

  So you don't need 50 years of hypnosis experience, even though there, there was most likely a hypnotist involved with Sirhan Sirhan. His name is Dr. Joyland West.

• 15:50Danny Jones?

  Oh yeah, Jolly West.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:52Danny Jones?

  I'm familiar with him. I don't know if you're familiar with Tom O'Neill's book Chaos.

• 15:57Speaker 01

  I haven't read it.

• 15:57Danny Jones?

  Riveting. He did, he dives through all the background of the Manson murders and he even interviews his probation officer. Um, and learns all about how Jolly West was tied to that free clinic in San Francisco. And Sydney Gottlieb, and there was this, there was this free clinic in, um, it was called the Haight Ashbury Free Clinic in San Francisco. That he did his research on it and it was fully funded by the CIA. And they were doing experiments with people with, uh, with LSD and amphetamines. To see how, how that would affect people's brains and how you could control them. And you know, that's interesting too. This ties right into Charles Manson because like.

• 16:36Speaker 01

  Midnight Climax.

• 16:37Danny Jones?

  Yes. Yeah, that's, yep. There was Operation Chaos and Midnight Climax that was going on at the same, same exact time.

• 16:43Speaker 01

  And that was all under Sydney Gottlieb, who's, who's the OSS director, I think at that time. Was that, was that his position?

• 16:51Danny Jones?

  Uh, no, was he?

• 16:53Speaker 01

  I think he was.

• 16:54Danny Jones?

  He was the head of MKUltra. I know that.

• 16:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. But I think he ran that with, and Hoover was kind of a sideways involved in that. And I have the only existing, well, I have the digital copies of all those letters between him and this guy named Dr. George Esterbrooks. At Colgate University who were involved and had developed a plan, which I don't think has ever been released by the government. But I found it in Dr. Esterbrooks' personal effects in his files. And I, I'll send you a copy. You can like, put it in the show notes if you want to. But they had a plan to hypnotize and Dr. Esterbrooks was a. Classic hypnotist.

• 17:37Speaker 01

  But he says, I could split someone's personality in such and such amount of time and make them do anything. I could make them forget who they know. And he says, I can do it to an army officer. Here's the step by step guide. I'll send you all of this. I'll even send you the step by step guide that he produced.

• 17:50Danny Jones?

  Do you remember any of it?

• 17:51Speaker 01

  The steps?

• 17:52Danny Jones?

  But yeah.

• 17:53Speaker 01

  Oh, easy. Yeah.

• 17:53Danny Jones?

  What was it?

• 17:54Speaker 01

  Well, wait, let me finish this real quick. So the guy has this plan sent off to J. Edgar Hoover involving this other guy named Dr. Milton Erickson, who's like the grandfather of hypnotherapy. He's the guy, he's the reason that hypnotherapy is accepted by the American Medical Association. So, and this other person, Margaret Mead, who is involved right now. And they have a plan to, to capture and hypnotize a German submarine captain. Give him a split personality, send him back into his own harbor where he'll torpedo all of their, all of his own ships. And this was a legit plan that they're working on. They had all these steps laid out.

• 18:39Speaker 01

  So they've been doing this for a long time, a very long time.

• 18:44Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 18:45Speaker 01

  So what?

• 18:47Danny Jones?

  You are the, the steps of, of splitting somebody's personality?

• 18:50Speaker 01

  Steps are easy. So I'll give you the more advanced version because that was kind of rudimentary what they had back then. But I'll put the, I'll give you the documents to put in the PDF or whatever, and the link down below. So if our personalities are very fragile and most people don't realize it, and if you have an authority figure, you can split a personality. So let's imagine that, that I'm a psychiatrist or a psychologist and you come to me and you say, hey, I've been having this anxiety or I've been having a little feeling of depression or loneliness or something. And I say, well, is there, have you ever had a instance where one part of you wants to do one thing and the other part doesn't really do that? And everyone's, a hundred percent of people are going to say yes to that. A hundred percent.

• 19:36Speaker 01

  But you'll say, yeah, yeah, actually, yeah, when it comes to like cheesecake or something, I don't want to eat the cheesecake because I know it's gonna make me fat, but I'll go eat the cheesecake. We'll take it as a simple thing. And I'll say, all right, so what if, if that part of you had a name, what would the name of that part be? And you're like, oh, I don't know, Michael. You made up a name. All right, so what, let's say, let's go back and forth. Like, what does Michael want? Okay, Michael wants this, but what does, what does, what does Danny want? And then, so I get you to have this dialogue about yourself in the third person, but you're not sure what camera angle you're looking at yourself from, right? And if I ask you just a simple question, like, let me just ask you and answer this honestly,

• 20:20Speaker 01

  like, if you picture, did you shower this morning or last night?

• 20:24Danny Jones?

  Uh, last night.

• 20:26Speaker 01

  So you just look up and to your left. So you pictured yourself in the third person?

• 20:30Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 20:31Speaker 01

  Why did you picture yourself in the third person? Who was observing you? Do you think that was Michael? So I start going down this path of doing this. And then I say, you know what? I think the best way to clear this up is to give you the standard exam. This is the standard psychological exam for multiple personality disorder. And hold on.

• 20:49Danny Jones?

  Whoa.

• 20:53Speaker 01

  So the exam I give you-

• 20:54Danny Jones?

  You might think I'm lying to you because my hair's wet, but I jumped in the pool before I came here. So that's why my hair looks wet. I'm not lying. I'm sure you can tell if I'm lying.

• 21:02Speaker 01

  So I give you this exam, and it's totally made up. It doesn't even have to be an official document. And let's say it's got 10 or 12 questions on there. Do you feel like this sometimes? Do you feel like that sometimes? Do you feel like that sometimes? No matter what you score, I say, wow, this, you're in the 99th percentile for having a multiple personality disorder. And the best way that we can deal with this is to allow those parts of yourself to have a conversation with each other. So just a doctor misdiagnosing you creates, creates a split.

• 21:36Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 21:36Speaker 01

  That's just, that's 30 minutes. That's not even the hypnosis yet. And then we get into hypnosis. And then, and hypnosis is proven, proven to work. Dr. David Spiegel at Stanford University is probably the premier researcher for hypnosis. And-

• 21:54Speaker 01

  If I just get into the hypnosis part, I'm gonna, I'm gonna just essentially like I'm hammering a wedge down into a log to split that log apart. That hypnosis is just gonna go in there and kind of push this wedge and allow those two beings to get further and further and further apart. Let's identify this person's personalities, their, their traits and their desires in life and what they want. Let's, let's go to this one. Let's see what Danny wants. So why don't we have Danny and Michael have a conversation really quick? Or would you like them not to talk to each other? So we just start getting, the moment you step down this road, you're creating that, that part.

• 22:33Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 22:34Speaker 01

  So they, they actually use this for therapy. And a friend of mine, Dr. Richard Nongard, wrote a, a book, I think I wrote the foreword to that book, maybe. But it's called Excellence in Parts Work, in Parts Therapy. And Dr. Fritz Perls did this, Virginia Satir did a lot of this stuff with Gestalt therapy, but it's just identifying these parts of yourself and getting familiar with what they want and what each one is, which is good. But the moment you start getting into it and, and when I tell you it's pathological, or when I tell you, I'm gonna, let's say if I, if I was a hypnotist and I didn't have the psychiatric authority and stuff, I could say, you know what, what if you had a helper in your life? Who could do things for you?

• 23:16Speaker 01

  And I can install a helper inside your brain. That, I could do a very good thing for you, or I could make that helper do really bad stuff. So we, and once we're designing that helper, we decide the morals and ethics and what that helper is, is willing to do under hypnosis. Then this has been proven since the 40s and 50s.

• 23:37Danny Jones?

  Oh, wow.

• 23:39Speaker 01

  It's pretty cool.

• 23:39Danny Jones?

  It seems a lot easier than giving people drugs.

• 23:42Speaker 01

  It is. It is. But again, that's, you either have to have-

• 23:46Danny Jones?

  You have to have the right person, though.

• 23:48Speaker 01

  It's either a shitload of skill and authority, or a, a lot of skill in finding the right person. Yeah. So finding suggestible people is number one. And I wrote about this in a fiction book. I wrote a fictional book called Phrase Seven, which is gonna be a, a TV show pretty soon. And- In this book, I use something that's actually real. If you look at somebody who's been happy their whole life, you know, you can start seeing these little crow's feet because they smile a lot. You look at somebody who's socially driven, they raise their eyebrows a lot during conversations. You can see these little lines right here.

• 24:21Danny Jones?

  I always avoid those people.

• 24:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, and like somebody who's angry or mad, you know, that you'll have these two little lines that start developing. And this is in the teenage years, you'll start seeing this and we call it expression etching. Cause it etches onto the face after a pattern of behavior. But what would you do if I told you to make a skeptical facial expression? There it is. So the lower eyelid tightens up right here. Do it one more time so you can get a good zoom in. There we go. So all these wrinkles form down right here. So if you see somebody with a wrinkled lower eyelid, and this is my opinion, I've not tested this scientifically at all. But I have confirmed it with like five hypnotists who have confirmed it with thousands and thousands of subjects. And these are.

• 25:04Danny Jones?

  Sounds scientific enough to me.

• 25:05Speaker 01

  I like it. And if, if you look at, it's even in this book, there's photos of it. And if you look at a person's face and they have super smooth lower eyelids down here. They're, in my mind, they're exponentially more likely to be a suggestible candidate for that thing. And so the bad guy in this fictional book goes to these like comedy hypnosis shows where like you get, people get called up on stage and it's like, oh, the person next to you farted and it smells really bad and that kind of thing. But he will take the number one subject from the hypnosis show and then he doesn't know how to select the right person. So he just goes to the hypnosis show and he picks the most suggestible person and then just follows him out to the parking lot.

• 25:50Danny Jones?

  So I'm sure you can figure out a bunch of other characteristics or personality traits from somebody based on like different wrinkles that are etched into their face too, right? Like people that are always stressed or depressed have different.

• 26:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I wouldn't say it's a hard science.

• 26:05Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 26:05Speaker 01

  I wouldn't say most things dealing with behavior and psychology are not a hard science. No matter how much people want it to be. It's just, it's like asking Roger Federer where he went to college for tennis. And like, what were your credentials? Where, where are the studies that you did?

• 26:20Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 26:20Speaker 01

  To win all the tournaments?

• 26:21Danny Jones?

  Yeah. When you see people in the news, like this guy who just whacked that CEO, do you like do deep dives on them and like their background? Try to figure out what their motivations were and try to do like a psychoanalysis of them?

• 26:32Speaker 01

  I, I, I want to. And I have to stop myself from doing it because I'll go.

• 26:38Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 26:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I'm, I'm a very suggestible person. And I will go hard into that. And then I'll get into like the Twitter confirmation bias rabbit hole.

• 26:50Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 26:50Speaker 01

  Which I'm sure you fell into.

• 26:51Danny Jones?

  Oh, yeah.

• 26:52Speaker 01

  Uh huh. And.

• 26:53Danny Jones?

  It's hard to escape.

• 26:54Speaker 01

  It is so hard. And I mean, not just exiting the app, but like the modifications I'm making to the way that I see the world.

• 27:05Danny Jones?

  It's great that you noticed it.

• 27:07Speaker 01

  Well, just like I'll be in my office, I wake up at like four 30 in the morning. So it'll be like before sunrise and I'm like hunched over my desk, like just doing this. And I can feel like, oh my God, my brain's changing, like something. And I, and I just get out. So I have like app timers on all those things now.

• 27:22Danny Jones?

  Yeah. Yeah. There's like threads on Twitter and comments on YouTube of people that believe that I'm a CIA funded plant. Right? That runs a podcast to, to run CIA propaganda.

• 27:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:38Danny Jones?

  But at the same time, I believe shit like that about other things in the world. So that gives me a unique perspective of, of like, I'm like on both sides of the mirror.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I, I just published a video day before yesterday on, on these drones that are happening right now.

• 27:53Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 27:54Speaker 01

  And like, I just saw a few comments today, like government plant on my.

• 27:58Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  On my channel.

• 27:59Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  So, and then somebody else says, it's a video talking about psyops that is psyops, that is a psyop. So like, I'm trying to educate people on how to spot psyops and that's also a psyop. It's so deep.

• 28:12Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 28:13Speaker 01

  So it, it, I think there's a, there's a tendency for a lot of people to tie those. I, I always imagine those, like in the movies, the, the house of like the crazy schizophrenic who's got maps and photos all over the wall.

• 28:27Danny Jones?

  Yeah, yeah, the always sunny guy.

• 28:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, yarn and stuff like drawn to, like, I think those people are, have a tendency to, to just tie yarn as much as they can to everything that's going on. And it's just like, not every part, granted that stuff happens. Of course that stuff happens, but I don't think every single thing that happens in the news is straight out of some Tom Clancy novel.

• 28:50Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 28:51Speaker 01

  Where there's a million backstories to it.

• 28:53Danny Jones?

  Yeah. The video that you posted, uh, I think it was yesterday about the drone.

• 28:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:56Danny Jones?

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• 29:39Speaker 01

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• 29:41Danny Jones?

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• 30:21Danny Jones?

  And do.com and use the code Danny at checkout and please support the show by telling them we sent you. Smell fresher, stay drier and boost your confidence with Mando from head to toe. It's linked below. Now back to the show. The way you laid it out and like, I think the consensus is online now, I sent you that video that was from Twitter where the guy was from a private aerospace company saying that these are like, he said that they were aerospace contractor drones that were searching for a rogue nuke. I think he said that went missing in Ukraine or something. And somehow made its way, got smuggled into the US. So there's like a warhead somewhere, they think in New Jersey, and they have these drones that,

• 31:05Danny Jones?

  they're, the reason they're flying at night is because they can detect this, it's like this nuclear energy or gas or something that would be coming from this material.

• 31:14Speaker 01

  Oh, because there's not a lot of gamma out in the air, I guess.

• 31:17Danny Jones?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 31:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, if anybody at home right now, we're two idiots talking.

• 31:21Danny Jones?

  Yeah, of course. Well, it does make sense that nobody would know about it, right? Like if you really think about it, like, there's, I'm sure there's a lot of senators and congressmen and, you know, off the cuff FBI agents who won't know what this is because I'm sure if this is something serious, it's got to be super compartmented. And if it is something like that, that they're looking for some sort of weapon they got on the loose, that's in, you know, New Jersey, and they're trying to find out what the hell it is. And it's private aerospace that's figuring it out. They're not gonna, there's gonna be tons of people that are in the government that have no fucking clue what it is. So.

• 31:54Speaker 01

  And it's, I think there's, there's an element of psyop to a lot of stuff that's going on. If you look, I mean, it depends on how you define psyop. Like, is it a government funded thing? Because every commercial, if you watch an infomercial, that's a psyop. They're all just, let me find the target. Let me get them to do what I want them to do. But I think you had a guy on here, I can't remember his name, super smart guy talking about Havana syndrome.

• 32:21Danny Jones?

  Yeah, everybody loves that podcast.

• 32:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:23Danny Jones?

  Is, there was two guys, right?

• 32:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:25Danny Jones?

  It was Robert Duncan and then the Russian guy, Len Bear.

• 32:28Speaker 01

  Yeah. And Lynn was a victim of some of this stuff. And I published a paper from a science perspective, a year or two ago on Havana syndrome. And I'll, I'll give you the PDF to throw in the show notes. But what I suggested in that paper was, If I wanted to affect mass control, I only need to use a real weapon on ten to fifty-five, maybe a hundred people. And then that the sound of that weapon gets replayed on the news, the cricket sound, over and over and over. And then it's so scary to a population and they're everyone's so familiar with the sound that I no longer need the weapon, I just need a speaker.

• 33:12Speaker 01

  So I can create psych what's called a psychogenic illness. And this is very common. So you can create, you've been trained for months and months and months, you've been seeing all these people get injured by these weapons with brain damage and confusion, migraine headaches, you you're trained to associate that sound with all of those symptoms because it's so it's so much in the news cycle. So then at at the final stage, you don't need the weapon anymore. You don't need to smuggle in some crazy weapon, you just need.

• 33:40Danny Jones?

  You can play the sound and get the symptoms, get the effects by just wow.

• 33:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. And you make it dissociating enough, like where the sound's pretty loud, you can use a device like an LRAD, which you can buy, the civilian can buy an LRAD, a long range acoustic device, you can buy it online for like thirty-five hundred dollars.

• 33:57Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I heard I read that they used to test these weapons on sailors, on on on like Navy sailors that were based in Maryland, I think it was, when they were first developing these targeted weapons.

• 34:10Speaker 01

  I've used LRAD many times, not for any weird psyops, but we have them on the bridge wing, so that top left photo right there. That is called a bridge wing. So that's on the the like where you control a ship. So you have like the bridge where the that's or the pilot house, where the wheel is. And it's got little two little outdoor sections right there. So on Navy ships, those will be on the bridge wing. And that's kind of a, we don't want to shoot somebody, warning system.

• 34:39Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 34:39Speaker 01

  So you and it's got a little aiming, like a little red dot site. And you rotate that thing down, you can use it as kind of an early warning system to tell a boat that they need to turn around.

• 34:49Danny Jones?

  Oh, wow.

• 34:50Speaker 01

  There's one being used by the Navy right there.

• 34:52Danny Jones?

  Holy shit, yeah.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  But it is, it is a long range weapon and you can almost not even hear it from behind it. It's so quiet and it's the cone is so small. And this is probably 20, this photo is probably from 20, maybe 15 years ago. I can tell just by looking at the system and that he's wearing a flak jacket instead of steel plates.

• 35:16Danny Jones?

  Yeah, they use it for uh, crowd control too, for sure.

• 35:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, but that this is, that's an older system.

• 35:23Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 35:23Speaker 01

  Now they have something called a sound laser that they use for the exact same thing. But this is, I mean, it's not some crazy technology. It's just, I'm sending sound to a little laser aperture and down.

• 35:38Danny Jones?

  Is that what that is right there? New laser at McNary Dam is the latest technology for deterring what? Click on it.

• 35:47Danny Jones?

  For deterring birds?

• 35:50Speaker 01

  We did have laser guns that looked like an M4 that had a giant battery pack on them. And they were just kind of blinding lasers. So it would shoot out a bazillion little lights. I don't know how they work. I know how to use it.

• 36:04Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 36:05Speaker 01

  Uh, but they call it a dazzler. Uh, but it, it wasn't very dazzling. I'm sure it did some permanent damage to people.

• 36:11Danny Jones?

  Yeah, Len, the guy was in here. He was very, very upset. I mean, he was not in a good place when I met him and we had dinner and stuff like that. He was going through this stuff constantly all day long with these migraines. And he had one like right before we started the show. And he also said that when he went to that, um, that observ-, I think it's an observatory. There's a satellite or there, no, there's a, um, some sort of thing in West Virginia. Are you familiar with what I'm talking about? It's a West Virginia radio.

• 36:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's called a quiet zone.

• 36:46Danny Jones?

  It's a quiet zone, right? Where there's zero frequencies, zero EMFs, zero radio frequencies or anything like that because of the.

• 36:54Danny Jones?

  Is it, what is it? Is it, is it some sort of like a telescope that's there?

• 36:58Speaker 01

  Radio telescopes, yeah.

• 37:00Danny Jones?

  Can you find out what that thing is, what that zone is, the radio free zone in West Virginia?

• 37:04Speaker 01

  It's called the quiet zone.

• 37:05Danny Jones?

  Quiet zone, yeah, yeah.

• 37:06Speaker 01

  So it's only a couple hours from my house.

• 37:08Danny Jones?

  Oh, really?

• 37:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:10Danny Jones?

  So allegedly, he said he can go there and all of his symptoms disappear.

• 37:15Speaker 01

  Wow. I'd be curious, and Lynn, if you're watching this, I mean no offense at all, but I'm, I'd be curious to, to have somebody who's suffering those attacks. If we took him to a place that they 100% believed was a quiet zone, if the attacks would stop. If any, any element of that is somehow psychogenic, which doesn't discredit them at all, they're still experiencing the symptoms.

• 37:37Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 37:38Speaker 01

  But is it, is it, did it start with a weapon and is it continuing because of a psychogenic or a, some kind of issue like that?

• 37:47Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 37:47Speaker 01

  But I'd be curious to know, but.

• 37:49Danny Jones?

  That's, that's another thing about him too, which I think lends a lot of credibility is he didn't have some sort of like military background or like he didn't work on, and he didn't have like an excuse of why he would have been targeted. He's like, I don't know, I'm just a fricking civilian. I'm a, he was an endocrinologist and the USSR just came here. And, and all of a sudden it started, started experiencing these symptoms, you know what I mean? Like there's no, he's not trying, he wasn't trying to build some sort of credible backstory.

• 38:19Speaker 01

  I have no explanation for any of that stuff.

• 38:20Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 38:21Speaker 01

  I'm so, uh, so for anybody that's going through that, I'm so uneducated. So take, take what I just said and, and I'm just throwing it out there.

• 38:29Danny Jones?

  Voice of God, V2K is what Robert Duncan was saying that was.

• 38:34Speaker 01

  Voice to skull.

• 38:35Danny Jones?

  Voice to skull, right. Steve, look that up. That's gonna be, you're gonna find a rabbit hole there.

• 38:40Speaker 01

  And that was originally, they started that in the 1950s with Dr. Jorge Delgado, I think at Harvard University. He put it inside of a bull's head, if I remember, it's been a long.

• 38:51Danny Jones?

  This is what Jack was talking about this on the podcast, where they were trying to.

• 38:54Speaker 01

  He did it to a little girl too, which doesn't, doesn't get a lot of media. Uh, and it was, she thought he was her dad and, uh, they.

• 39:05Speaker 01

  They did some interesting stuff that's probably unethical.

• 39:09Danny Jones?

  How it works. The simplified diagram shows Chang's speech prosthetic in action. What is this? Is this the voice to skull?

• 39:17Speaker 02

  This is voice to skull. There's not a lot of info on it.

• 39:19Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I wouldn't imagine. Bunch of crazy books.

• 39:23Speaker 01

  So with this stuff, I don't think I'm in any danger. But do you ever start looking at some of this and feel like I might fall off of like a schizophrenia cliff? Looking at some of this stuff?

• 39:38Danny Jones?

  No, I'm not. No, I don't think I'm, I don't think I'm too disposed to that. But it's definitely like fun. You know what I mean? Because the thing about this kind of stuff is it seems it's a double edged sword where it just, it seems so fucking crazy that like you can't talk about this at dinner with anybody in your family, right? Anybody that doesn't listen to podcasts 24/7, you can't just have a casual conversation because they're going to look at you like you have two heads. But at the same time, like, how much of that is real? You know, like, how much of that is like, is it packaged in this wild woo woo rapping? Intentionally so people don't take it seriously?

• 40:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I had, I had a mentor who was an intelligence guy, psychiatrist. But when I was like 20 something years old, he was in his mid 70s. But he one time told me something that scared the hell out of me. And he said this hypothetically to me. But he said, if we ever captured somebody and we want to completely discredit them during the interview interrogation during, you know, whatever's happening. I'm going to have someone in a clown suit walk by and squirt water on them with a flower. I'm going to have a person dressed as a giraffe come in there and touch them on the head. I'm going to have the craziest stuff known to man

• 41:04Speaker 01

  mixing in with the sleep deprivation so that all of his testimony sounds schizophrenic. And that was, that's what I think of when I see some of this stuff, like all of these websites and I'm like. How much is just added on to make it over dramatized to where it's just too much? I do too.

• 41:26Danny Jones?

  Are you familiar with Paul Benowitz, the case of Paul Benowitz? This is one of my favorite examples of this.

• 41:30Speaker 01

  No.

• 41:31Danny Jones?

  So Paul Benowitz was the, I'm very sorry to everyone who's listening that have heard me regurgitate this a thousand times, but Stephen's ears are bleeding. He just takes his headphones off when I tell the story. He was a, I believe it was in the sixties or seventies. He was like a big time UFO guy, right? He was like top guy in the UFO community.

• 41:52Danny Jones?

  Who lived in, I think it was New Mexico, over the mountain from a big air force base. And he was seeing these UFOs flying over this mountain almost every night, right? Right before some, something, the sun went down. And he was writing about them, videotaping them, talking about them in these UFO conferences. And the air force caught wind of it, right? And they sent over the head of counterintelligence at the air force base. His name was Richard Doty to pay a visit to see what he knew, see what kind of footage he had or whatever it was. Cause they knew, you know, this wasn't aliens. They knew that they were testing, you know, crazy. This was right before the, like the stealth bomber came out. So he went over to visit Paul Benowitz and he was like, show me what you got. Let's see, let's see what you have here.

• 42:36Speaker 01

  Like at his house?

• 42:37Danny Jones?

  At his apartment, yeah. And so we started showing this intel, this counterintelligence guy from the air force base, all the footage he had, asking him questions about it. And then Richard Doty, the air force guy was like, oh man, this is kind of spooky. Like, I think, I think this might be fucking aliens. I don't know what this is. Because he knew that it wasn't aliens, but he also knew that the UFO community was infiltrated by Russian spies. And these Russian spies were in this UFO community specifically to get information on what the US had or what, what was going on over here. So he used Paul Benowitz as a conduit to sow disinformation into the UFO community and to sort of poison the well.

• 43:21Danny Jones?

  So that the spies that were in, any sort of spies that they thought could have been in that UFO community in the US would be diverted.

• 43:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:31Danny Jones?

  And that's a great example. Another one, one of my other favorite examples was when they were first testing the first jet planes, Air 51, when they were, the CIA pilots were testing the first jet propelled airplanes. They would send them up in the cockpit, they would send a gorilla mask in the cockpit with them. So in case they got in within visual distance of a civilian airplane, they'd put the gorilla mask on.

• 43:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:51Danny Jones?

  Fucking genius.

• 43:52Speaker 01

  I remember reading that.

• 43:53Danny Jones?

  They've been doing that forever.

• 43:55Speaker 01

  Yeah. Let's just overdo it. Let's just make, make the story 10 times crazier than it should be.

• 44:01Danny Jones?

  So if they were doing that in the 60s, imagine what they're doing today, especially with Google and YouTube and this just monopoly of information.

• 44:10Speaker 01

  Yeah. And one of the things, man, like, if I could slightly change this track that we're on.

• 44:18Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  One of the fastest ways I've ever discovered is to get somebody off of one track of thinking and start getting them to start believing something else, is you've heard of the Kubler-Ross grief model before, where it's like denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. And those are like the five stages of grief that we all go through. It's, it's debated, maybe on Wikipedia or something, but I subscribe to it and I've witnessed it a bunch of times.

• 44:52Speaker 01

  Conversationally, you can walk someone through those five stages of grief without them even knowing that they're going through that process and get them to like relinquish control over like a previously held belief or a previously held, you know, whatever you want them to get rid of. And it is so fast. And I've used it in interrogations before and I've, I've used it in just situations where I want to get somebody's mind to change on anything. So if I think of something like you have a belief of X and I want to change it, like you're holding on to this belief. Let's say I'm like, say I'm a door to door sales guy and I'm selling you solar.

• 45:33Speaker 01

  I want to get you out of the mindset that like solar is for X number of people or this type of person. All I have to do is get you to denial. I say one or two things to get you angry. Then I start talking about like the different options that you have and get you into a bargaining mindset. And then talk about how all of your options are limited and like everything is so far out of our control and like push you into depression. And then I get you into acceptance a thousand times easier, a thousand times faster. So one of my clients owns a solar roofing company out in the, on the west coast. And he goes door, or he owns a company that goes kind of door to door. And I gave this to him.

• 46:16Speaker 01

  I don't know if it would work in this situation, but they use this in door to door sales now. And they can just wipe somebody's, not wipe it, but get someone over their, their emotional ties to something that they held previously.

• 46:31Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 46:32Speaker 01

  It's a, it's a fascinating thing, just identifying that grief cycle. And then I'm not just looking at it as a psychologist or a psychiatrist and like, oh, this is what humans go through. I'm looking at it as like, oh, that's what humans go through. Why don't I just make you go through it and get, get you out of something that you used to be in.

• 46:49Danny Jones?

  Interesting. Are there certain types of neighborhoods he targets? Do you target neighborhoods of people that are suggestible? Not necessarily rich neighborhoods because those people are going to be like, not going to take any bullshit.

• 47:00Speaker 01

  I don't know. I think, I think they do target high net worth people.

• 47:05Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 47:05Speaker 01

  I think they do those neighborhoods for sure. Cause I know he's got a lot of those clients. Man, he's the most interesting dude ever. You should have him on the show. I don't know if he would talk about aliens and stuff, but he's, he's a cool dude. But that, just that grief model was so powerful in understanding, you know, what shapes our behavior and what can change our behavior. Cause all the evidence, everything that you need to know is out there. There's all these studies of like, this is how humans process this. This is how humans respond to authority, like we talked about. But even more important than that is if, if we could kind of get on this influence train for a second is.

• 47:43Speaker 01

  And this goes back to all this conspiracy stuff and how people get wrapped up in it is everything that you look at, like if you search YouTube right now for influence training or persuasion, or how to have confidence or charisma, you know, fill in the blank, whatever you want, they're going to teach you how to change someone's thoughts and ideas. But if you can get down to the mammalian brain, now you're changing identity. So identity is what you truly want to change. You want someone to finish a conversation by in their head saying, I am the type of person who blank, not I think blank, but I am. You want them to make an I am statement.

• 48:25Speaker 01

  Robert Cialdini has done studies on this and written books about it. He wrote Pre-Suasion, which was a great book about it. But so much of what people think influences us is is what influences a human brain, not what influences the mammalian part of our brain, the limbic system, this lower part of our brain. If someone can influence that in any of us, and myself included, I don't have some influence vaccine, like as suggestible as the next person. If I can get to how I influence a mammal, which we were talking about this before we hit record, if I can influence the mammalian part of the brain, I can get somebody to do just about anything. And that's in that model that we talked about.

• 49:11Danny Jones?

  The model.

• 49:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:13Danny Jones?

  So how is this practical in the things that you were doing in the military or in, did you, you work with like actual intelligence agencies?

• 49:25Speaker 01

  In the military, not while I was on active duty.

• 49:27Danny Jones?

  After the military?

• 49:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:28Danny Jones?

  How did that come about?

• 49:30Speaker 01

  It was initially, I made an offer to train psyops for free. And then I, the only way that I developed my name, a name for myself is as a trial consultant. And I had no experience, no credentials, nothing coming out of the military. So I offered a 200% money back guarantee on my fee, which I couldn't have paid. I could not have paid it. I was terrified the first case that I took. And I was up like three days in a row trying to prepare for just profiling one person. And that is, that's kind of what put me on the radar for some of those people. And Once I developed this chart, it looks like the periodic table of elements.

• 50:14Speaker 01

  It's called the behavioral table of elements and we can bring it up there. It's fascinating. Let me just walk you through this thing really quick.

• 50:20Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 50:21Speaker 01

  It's a map.

• 50:21Danny Jones?

  This thing right here?

• 50:22Speaker 01

  No, no, no.

• 50:23Danny Jones?

  Oh, no.

• 50:23Speaker 01

  Just Google, uh, Google behavioral table of elements and you'll see it, you'll see it up there. But essentially it's every behavior that a human being can do rated from least deceptive to most deceptive. And it's free online. I don't even, I don't charge money for it or anything. That's it. So each one of those is a little human behavior and they're rated from least deceptive to most deceptive.

• 50:46Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 50:47Speaker 01

  And each one of those cells is some kind of thing like, uh, like SHG right there is shrug. And if it's in blue letters, that means you're more likely to see that behavior during cold temperatures, which takes away from the, the meaning of it. So this is like the ultimate one-page guide to reading a human being. This is all of our behavior. So all on here, you can see how likely it is to be deceptive, whether or not you're going to see it before, during, or after someone's statement, or the score of deception, the behaviors that are going to confirm your findings, the behaviors that are going to amplify it and give you more information. So everything on the right is the most deceptive or most stress, where there's no behavior for deception.

• 51:30Speaker 01

  And everything on the left is the least, the most comfortable. Everything in like that turquoise is facial expressions. And everything on the very bottom is what happens outside of our bodies, like how we interact with like objects on the table and the stuff that we actually say. Like, uh, I'm rising vocal pitch, increasing speed, a non-answer statement. So those are all the different ways that we can be deceptive in our speech. So I tried to get all behavior for deception detection on one sheet. So each one of these is backed by a minimum of four pieces of research to, to make it onto this table.

• 52:07Danny Jones?

  So what are the most effective ways, just or the quickest, most effective way to cut down to that primal mammalian brain?

• 52:16Speaker 01

  So the biggest two things are going to be authority and novelty. So if we go back like, I don't know, 20,000 years, the average group of human beings was 120, 150 people in these tribal societies. Let's say you went out and fished every day, came home every day and brought the fish back to your tribe.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  Let's say every day you pass by almost the same pathway and you walk by this one bush. And one day you're walking by this bush and the sun's about to set and a stick snaps behind that bush. That, that has all of your attention. You're not thinking about your kids. You're not worried about the food that you're holding. You're not worried about whether or not you have to go to the bathroom. Every piece of your focus, you're not even caring about your family right now for that one or two seconds that that stick is snapping behind that bush. So when our brain is running a program of prediction, which is what we're doing now, we have conversations, I'm going to predict that in a few seconds, you're going to say something and then you know that I'm going to say something. And if I'm driving, I have a script for that.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  And everything, if you can just get good at scripts, you, you will be, it will change your life and understanding behavioral scripts. So what does a person's script really say? So if, if I'm running a script that says, I'm walking back to my tribe with fish right now, and that script is interrupted, that's when we generate mammalian brain focus. So we interrupt something that was expected. So I expected nothing to happen and then something was back there. So our brain generates focus to respond to two different things, which is a potential threat or potential value. So if you're in the car, any kind of wild movement out of the corner of your eye, even

• 54:03Speaker 01

  if you're like texting and driving, anything that looks different than my brain's scripted responses, it says there's a potential threat. Does that make sense?

• 54:12Danny Jones?

  Yep.

• 54:13Speaker 01

  So anything that's novelty that breaks away helps so much. And if you watch an episode of Dog Whisperer with Cesar Millan, the way that he trains dogs is step one, let's break the script. I'm going to break the behavioral script and we're going to do something that you aren't able to predict and you can't really figure out what's going to happen next yet. So that's the number one way to generate that focus and focus is the gateway to the mammalian brain. And authority is is number two. So if we bring up that crazy circle diagram that I airdropped you, that that center ring is everything that influences a mammal. So you think of training

• 54:53Speaker 01

  a dolphin, you think of training a dog, you think of like, teaching a cow to do a trick or something for a show. It's all these four things, no matter what mammal it is. And this is focus. And then we have authority. So authority is next. And authority is comprised of five traits when it comes to human beings. And that's confidence, discipline, leadership, gratitude, and enjoyment. Those are the five things that just kind of tripwire other people's brains to say, I need to follow this person. And then we have tribe. This is our association to what are other people doing? I'm going to go along with the crowd, what the crowd is doing, and I need to think about the people around me. And then we have emotion. And

• 55:36Speaker 01

  these are the repetitive behaviors and scripts and things that we follow along through our life. So like tying your shoes is easy because your brain develops scripts for things to save you energy and time. Right. So if I can hack my way, if you look at, so let's look at this from an infomercial standpoint. So infomercial starts, they are like loud voice flashes on screen that, you know, they're like the black and white video of someone like struggling to like open a lid or something like you're getting all this like focus that's coming up novelty that you're not expecting. Then it gets into authority. How many that they've sold, how many people that they've helped, all the reasons that they're doing this big company, they say this is blah, blah, incorporated, or we've sold 10 million of these or whatever.

• 56:21Speaker 01

  Right. Then we get into tribe. I'm going to show you lots and lots of clips of all your friends, people that look similar to you, using this thing with a happy face on. I'm going to show people using it when they've got friends over for the Super Bowl party. So now I'm triggering tribe upon tribe. So now you're using the sham wow to clean up at your big barbecue that you're going to have in your backyard. So I'm triggering all these tribal emotions. And then finally, at the end, I'm triggering all the scripts, so behavioral scripts of mammals. Mammals respond to several behavioral scripts, but the biggest one is scarcity.

• 56:55Speaker 03

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• 57:56Speaker 01

  So scarcity is not a human script. It's a mammalian script. And that the scarcity might be, you know, the sale ends Sunday, or let's say a pack of dogs and the water is running out. That or the food, food supply is going to run out. So that, that primes any mammal for action, any kind of scarcity. So you get to the end of the infomercial and there's a countdown timer. We've only got 10 of these left for the next 20 people that call. We're going to only give these. We only have 12 minutes left on the clock right now. Yeah. So everything that, that truly persuades another person at a deep level, because you could change someone's mind about an idea or win a debate, but you do that on a human level, not a mammalian level.

• 58:39Speaker 01

  So, once you get good at understanding what influences human beings, you can do anything. So even just looking at the Milgram experiment, they only needed three of those things on the human influence. So this outer ring right here, we have focus, compliance, suggestibility, connection, openness, and expectancy. We only had three of those for the Milgram experiment. Did they have focus? Hell, yeah. There's tons of novelty. I'm in a room I've never been in, at a university I've never been to, with two people I've never met before, sitting in front of this shocking machine that I've never seen before, reading this quiz out loud into a mic I've never seen, at the quiz I've never, everything's novelty there. So there are tons of focus, authority was there, guy in the lab coat, tribe was there. There was definitely

• 59:22Speaker 01

  emotion, behavioral scripts of responding to authority, keep continuing to go on. So, they had all of those four things, and the emotion was, I need to be compliant because, what is the authority figure telling him? Yeah, keep going, it's not a big deal.

• 59:39Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 59:40Speaker 01

  So that automatically triggers tribe and emotion, because if I'm the authority figure, and I said, yeah, go ahead, Danny, it's not a big deal. You're gonna assume everyone else does the same thing you do. So my authority, even though it's just me, you're gonna assume everyone else responds to me with compliance. Does that make sense?

• 59:56Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 59:57Speaker 01

  So I have all of the, all of the mammalian brain is involved right there in the Milgram experiment, but in the Milgram experiment, human brain on the second outer circle here, focus, I have compliance, and I have suggestibility. There is zero connection to the guy in the lab coat, or the guy on the other side of the wall. There's zero openness, that person is not opening up their heart, or anything like that, or becoming vulnerable in that situation, and there's zero expectancy. They have no idea to predict really what's coming next.

• 1:00:25Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:00:26Speaker 01

  So the mammalian brain wins the show. If you get focus, and that novelty is what they missed when they did the dissection of the Milgram experiment, they said it was obedience to authority. It's, it's a triggering of novelty, and how that makes you vulnerable to authority. If there was no novelty, let's, let's pretend that you were doing the Milgram experiment, but it's at your house.

• 1:00:49Danny Jones?

  It wouldn't work as much, because you're used to that environment.

• 1:00:52Speaker 01

  You have, you have script familiarity, so I haven't broken you out of the script yet.

• 1:00:58Speaker 01

  So that that's the biggest thing they forgot about in the memory experiment is novelty, novelty, novelty. If you break somebody out of scripts, behavioral scripts. And just as a, as a simple way to, to understand this, think about the difference between, and say you're checking out at Starbucks and you're paying them money. What is her, let's say that barista, let's say it's a woman. What does her behavioral script say is gonna happen? Let's say you go, oh yeah, how about the weather? It's beautiful weather this week. Is that triggering this, or is that in her script for you to say random shit like that? Yeah. Everybody who comes in.

• 1:01:35Danny Jones?

  She's used to that kind of shit, yeah.

• 1:01:36Speaker 01

  But you say something off the wall, you say something bizarre, like, did you see the fight that happened outside? Or something like that. That breaks a behavioral script and automatically generates focus because the brain does not know, uh, I can predict what's coming up next. So the moment we get a human brain to think, I cannot predict what's gonna happen next, we generate focus instantaneously. And during that slight window of focus, even if it's a tiny window of focus, your level of authority comes through, like, hey. And then you start doing something that, with that confidence, discipline, leadership, gratitude, and enjoyment, those five traits, you start exhibiting those five traits during that, and then you have authority. And then tribe and emotion are really easy. Those are just behavioral scripts that you can hack into.

• 1:02:21Danny Jones?

  Do you ever just find yourself in everyday life fucking around with people?

• 1:02:24Speaker 01

  Every day. Yeah.

• 1:02:26Danny Jones?

  Just toying with them at the drive thru?

• 1:02:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I did, uh, I have a thank you email from Delta Airlines for this, but there was a guy on a flight that I was on, who was jacked, jacked. Like, he was probably 285, less body fat than me, and just a gigantic, scary, scary looking.

• 1:02:50Danny Jones?

  Juiced out of the, out of his gills?

• 1:02:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, big time. And this guy's walking up the aisle, up and down the aisle, veins are bulging out, he's holding his fist. I'm like, this guy's gonna hurt somebody. So I told the flight attendant.

• 1:03:01Danny Jones?

  Did he look mad?

• 1:03:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, he looked upset. Not mad. He looked really upset. And I told the flight attendant, I was like, hey, did you talk to this guy? I'm gonna talk to him. He looks like he's violent. And she said, oh, I've already asked him if he's okay. He said he's really depressed and, uh, he's thinking about killing himself. I'm like, Can you tell somebody on the plane? Like, I said, do you mind if I can I go talk to him? Are y'all gonna tackle me or anything if I try to go talk to him? And they're like, no, no. So I went over there and I used a stage hypnosis trick to put him into hypnosis on a plane. And we're up in the front of the plane, like where the galley is. And you know, those little fold down chairs that the

• 1:03:42Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:43Speaker 01

  The flight attendants will sit in.

• 1:03:44Danny Jones?

  That's the last place you want a guy like that sitting.

• 1:03:46Speaker 01

  We did. We sat right there. Cause there was no, I mean, the, all the seats were full. So I was like, all right, you go to sleep now, blah, blah, blah. Put them in, put them in a trance, sat them down in the seat. And just kind of reframed all of his beliefs, but I did it through the system. I was like, all of your focus is at the wrong place. Your authority is getting in the wrong place. So you're hanging, I, I don't know who you are, who your friends are, but you're hanging out with the wrong people, which is your tribe. And you're following the wrong behavioral scripts. Whatever scripts you're following right now, when you take a pair of scissors and imagine those as a bunch of strings and cut them off, cut them in half. Like the guy's a new person. Went back to a seat and I'm talking, I'm, I'm paraphrasing 10 minutes of, of talking that I did with him.

• 1:04:28Speaker 01

  And he went back to his seat and then he found me on Instagram. I don't know, a month or two later and wrote me a really, really nice thank you letter. He's a really sweet guy.

• 1:04:38Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 1:04:39Speaker 01

  Super cool guy. But I, I don't know why I went off on that tangent.

• 1:04:45Danny Jones?

  Well, I was asking you just like,

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:04:47Danny Jones?

  Just going around everyday life and having this information. Like, you must be just so observant of just random interactions with people.

• 1:04:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, and you'd be surprised, like if you break someone's script, even if, if you do it in a fun way and make somebody's day better. But you, you start kind of experimenting with this stuff and you see how fragile and how easily hacked into our brains are. We could be made, if, if you look at the Milgram experiment, that, that means 67% of people can be talked into murder. Within 48 minutes, I think is the, is what they did the experiment in.

• 1:05:22Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 1:05:22Speaker 01

  So we can get hacked into pretty easily. And I think the, the way that you

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Get out of that. The way that you avoid that is learning how vulnerable you are. Because the more you think you're like, oh, I'm immune to that stuff. That's like me buying a Windows computer and saying, no, I don't believe in viruses. I'm not going to download that McAfee thing. But if I believe that I'm vulnerable, then I get the antivirus. Then I'm then I'm aware of it and I'm looking out. You have to know that you're vulnerable.

• 1:05:53Danny Jones?

  How do you, how does somebody determine how vulnerable they are?

• 1:05:58Speaker 01

  I don't know if a number system would help or if that would really help that much. Maybe smooth lower eyelids is the is the key.

• 1:06:04Danny Jones?

  Huh.

• 1:06:05Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:06:07Danny Jones?

  How did you, how do you know? You know that you're suggestible, right? Like you said that multiple times already. How does somebody know like that would be a vulnerability, right? If you're suggestible?

• 1:06:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. If you, I would say if you find yourself clicking on ads on a regular basis. If you find yourself maybe buying stuff on Instagram or Facebook or whatever on a regular basis, which I do to this day. I got this watch because of an Instagram ad. So.

• 1:06:32Danny Jones?

  I buy shit on Instagram too a lot, quite a bit.

• 1:06:34Speaker 01

  Their algorithm is so good.

• 1:06:36Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:36Speaker 01

  Because I'll buy stuff and I'll be like, man, that ad was made for me. They made that ad for me. But if you find yourself doing that stuff, or if you find yourself going down rabbit holes that don't make logical sense. Once you back away from it, it doesn't make sense. That's, that's the way that you like, if I'm doing those things, I need to put some stuff in place, put some hurdles for me. So I don't make impulsive decisions. And if you are good at influence, that's what you're really good at. You're, well, there's two things. You're good at weaponizing cognitive dissonance, number one. So if you're good at influence, you're using cognitive dissonance as a weapon. Number two, you're good at identity and crafting and shaping who a person,

• 1:07:21Speaker 01

  not who they think they are, who they publicly say they are. Those are two different things. So if I can get you to publicly agree that you are one type of person, even if it's a very small commitment, then I'm starting to shape identity and who you publicly agreed that you are, who you are as a person. And I think at the end of the day, that is, that's what truly matters. I'm just shaping those two things. Identity, I'm using identity as the hallway and cognitive dissonance as the wall.

• 1:07:52Danny Jones?

  It's fascinating. So when you were a, you were, you said you were a trial consultant in the beginning?

• 1:08:02Danny Jones?

  What sort of, what sort of cases were you taking? And how were you, were they like murder cases or, or?

• 1:08:10Speaker 01

  We've worked, I've worked a couple of big, high-profile ones and

• 1:08:14Danny Jones?

  Did you do the Amber Heard, Johnny Depp?

• 1:08:16Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:08:16Danny Jones?

  Oh, damn it. I think the whole world did that one.

• 1:08:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:08:21Speaker 01

  But most of the ones that I did were, just to be honest, it was wealthy people that were being sued because they owned a business and then people were suing them. So that was, that's usually what it is. And it's there, most of them were jury trials.

• 1:08:39Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 1:08:40Speaker 01

  And some of them were wealthy person with tax evasion, wealthy person with most of those like complaints. It was people you've never heard of that maybe own a small country club or own a little medical practice or something like that, or a plastic surgery clinic. And they get a lawsuit and they go to a jury trial for a lot of these and we'll go in and pick the jury and, or help them pick the jury.

• 1:09:04Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 1:09:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:05Danny Jones?

  How do you help them pick the jury?

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  We talk to them about what questions to ask, number one, and then what behavioral profile you're going to look for.

• 1:09:13Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 1:09:14Speaker 01

  What kind of person? So like,

• 1:09:15Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 1:09:17Speaker 01

  If I, if, let's say, I did a case pro bono one time.

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, I can talk about it. A lady was suing a grocery store chain because she slipped on a

• 1:09:31Speaker 01

  green bean or a piece of watermelon or something on the floor. And so we needed a jury. You know what locus of control is? Like an external locus or an internal locus?

• 1:09:42Danny Jones?

  Okay, yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:43Speaker 01

  It's either like, I believe the world happens to me, like maybe a victim, or I believe I happen to the world. I choose my fate. So we wanted a jury with an external locus of control who would be more likely to side on a victim's side. Does that make sense so far? So we would ask these jury members, the only question, it's just one question, because the attorneys are allowed to ask several questions. I don't, I don't know the law very well, but I think it differs by state. But the the question we passed around to each jury member to determine locus of control was, how does a person catch a cold? That's it. So let's, and I'll, I'll let you be the trial consultant here.

• 1:10:26Speaker 01

  So you hear one juror say, uh, well, I didn't take my vitamins enough. I didn't take care of myself. I, you know, I wasn't really washing my hands. I didn't sanitize when I shouldn't, should have sanitized. I have vitamin C at home, but I always forget to take it. And that's my fault. And I mean, there's probably a million reasons. You hear another juror say, well, I, I, there's a million reasons you can catch a cold. These little kids picking their nose, wiping boogers on the stair rails. There's people coughing and not covering up their mouth. There's people that are going outside of their house and they're sick. That, you became a trial consultant just then, like you know exactly the type of person that you're dealing with in both of those cases.

• 1:11:10Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:11:10Speaker 01

  Cause one's external and one's an internal locus. So there's, we come up with a bunch of questions like that, that determine who, what is the psychological profile that I'm looking for in a jury?

• 1:11:23Danny Jones?

  Let me ask you this. What is the psychological profile of the juror you want to pick for this guy that just whacked the CEO of the United Health?

• 1:11:30Speaker 01

  I definitely want to pick people who, uh, have an external locus of control and have, feel like the world happens to them.

• 1:11:40Danny Jones?

  Wouldn't the, one of the questions be, what is your feeling towards insurance companies? Like, like, how do you feel? What is your disposition towards insurance companies? If that is one of the questions, how the fuck do you find somebody who doesn't have a negative feeling towards insurance companies?

• 1:11:58Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:11:59Danny Jones?

  And I feel like you have to either be a CEO of an insurance company or not. It's black and white. If you're a CEO, you like insurance companies. If you're not a CEO, you probably don't like them. So I feel like it's going to be a difficult jury.

• 1:12:12Speaker 01

  Yes, but when the thing is, when you ask a jury pointed questions like that, that they can, they can do what's called a manipulative answer, or a, I forget the word that we use. Countermeasure. So we call it a countermeasure answer. So let's say I ask you, do you like insurance companies or whatever? And you can, you can know that that's about the case. And you really want to be on this case.

• 1:12:39Danny Jones?

  Hmm. Got it.

• 1:12:41Speaker 01

  So you can, you can make stuff up. So the question for this trial, it would, it usually takes me a while to get them ready to go.

• 1:12:48Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:12:48Speaker 01

  But the question for this trial would be, do you think large companies have our best interest at heart? And I wouldn't say yours. I would say our best interest at heart. So now they're answering for a collective instead of themselves.

• 1:13:06Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:13:06Speaker 01

  It's harder to, it's harder to dodge. And it's not straight on the nose where a person knows what the right answer is and what the wrong answer is. You want to ask them the question that's ambiguous, that gets them to reveal the most data without knowing it.

• 1:13:24Danny Jones?

  Hmm. Yeah, it still seems like it's gonna be hard. Because even with that question, I feel like you're gonna get,

• 1:13:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:32Danny Jones?

  You're gonna get a pretty much flat line answer for, for most of the people that are on that jury. But, you know.

• 1:13:38Speaker 01

  You could, I mean, there's a bunch of ways you could do it. Like, on a scale of one to five, how much do you agree with the phrase, we reap what we sow? And then have the jury answer that way as well.

• 1:13:49Danny Jones?

  Yeah, they'd have to be pretty vague. What was that model you were just telling me about?

• 1:13:52Speaker 01

  Fate, F A T E.

• 1:13:54Danny Jones?

  The fate model.

• 1:13:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, focus, authority, tribe, and emotion.

• 1:13:57Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 1:13:57Speaker 01

  And that, that will dictate whether or not you're successful. And I mean, we have AI coming up. We've got economic stuff that's, that's going on. But if you go back to B C years, this is what determined, your ability to leverage this stuff was what determined whether or not your business succeeded, whether or not you got elected in, in political offices. It, I don't think this AI will never replace having human skills. And there's a lot of people that want. I think there's an obsession with scripts nowadays, like where they're like, what do you say exactly? Cause there's even books you go on Amazon. It's like exactly what to say. There's books that are titled this, like what to say, when blah, blah, blah.

• 1:14:41Danny Jones?

  Just for like normal, everyday, social encounters?

• 1:14:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. What to say? So I, I had so many clients that are, that come to me because I'm anti-script. And then they get into my inner circle. I have this like a kind of an elite coaching group that meets, we meet every week on Sunday. And they all secretly are like, hey, man, so what's the, what's the script? So they still get it. They still have that like obsession with scripts, which I did for a decade or two. Working with influence and trying to figure out how people are convinced to do things. And everybody focuses on what do you say? What do you say? So here's the question that I would pose for, for any of those people that are wondering if I need some script for something.

• 1:15:28Speaker 01

  If I have a, let's say this is a flight checklist for a Boeing seven thirty seven. Me pushing this over to you and you taking possession of it does not make you a pilot.

• 1:15:42Speaker 01

  Let's say I have a perfect sales script that, um, let's say I spent 10 million developing the most amazing sales script that's ever been invented for any company you want, you can think of. And then I take that perfect sales script and I give it to somebody with social anxiety. They're not going to sell. It has, it has almost nothing to do with the words that you're saying, and that's a mistake. I trained sales teams all around the world.

• 1:16:11Danny Jones?

  Yeah, it's bottom up. You can't do a top down. You can't just learn. You can't just look at the manual and read the, read the, it has to come from experience, right?

• 1:16:19Speaker 01

  Yeah. So what they'll do is, and this isn't just sales teams. This is, this is psychology research does this. And if you look at, uh, behavioral research does this. Sales teams will do the exact same thing. Who's the top salesperson? What do they say? Let's write down what they said and give it to Timmy over here. And then Timmy's like, hey, I'm gonna read the same script that that John has, because John's the top sales guy. None of them realizing that that person has the ability to generate focus better. They have more authority, which is that confidence, discipline, leadership, gratitude, and enjoyment. Those five things, that's what makes the sale happen. That authority is what makes people change their mind on stuff. There are great words to say, and it's amazing to have those good words, but they

• 1:17:04Speaker 01

  don't do much without the authority. The flight checklist is helpful. A passenger might be able to land that plane, but it's it's a lot better and more effective when you have the skills that are behind that that authority.

• 1:17:17Danny Jones?

  Yeah, that makes sense. That makes a lot of sense. And what kind of group do you like? These people that are in this group? Because there's another thing, too, like the like, there's that, right? There's the idea of or there's the the practice of wanting to manipulate behaviors and and get people to change their behaviors. But like, there's something behind that, like, what kind of person is hyper obsessed with wanting to change people and manipulate people? Unless there's some sort of government operative or a salesperson?

• 1:17:51Speaker 01

  I think it's people that own businesses that want to be better leaders and just learning these, learning all of these techniques makes you a better leader in general, especially if you have empathy and you're you're like a decent human being.

• 1:18:03Danny Jones?

  Is that a foundational trait of human beings?

• 1:18:07Speaker 01

  What's that?

• 1:18:07Danny Jones?

  To be leaders? To want to be leaders? Is that like a primal instinct like on this, on like, if you go like deep into the brain, is that like one of the foundational drives of human beings, you think?

• 1:18:18Speaker 01

  It's one of them.

• 1:18:19Danny Jones?

  To be followed and be revered?

• 1:18:21Speaker 01

  For some people. I think we have, there, there's a few different needs that we strive for in life. We have significance, which is people that strive to be significant. We have the approval people that my whole life I'm striving for some kind of recognition or approval. We have acceptance people. These are people that thrive on tribe. I need to be belonging and part of something. Then we have the intelligence people. I need to be seen as smart. We have the power people. I need to be seen as strong or powerful. You see a lot of this posturing kind of behavior like that. So you'll see power people and significance people both rise up into leadership positions for very different reasons. One for legacy and one for self gratification.

• 1:19:04Speaker 01

  And finally, we have a pity. So this is the six basic, and they're, they're basic, but six basic things that we need to feel from other people. I can't feel significant unless other people confirm it. I can't feel intelligent unless other people confirm it. So those are the six needs we need from other people. And when it comes to that, like when you see significance driven people, that's, that's mostly what's in my mastermind. I've got politicians in there. I've got psychotherapists and psychiatrists in there. There's, there's people that are psychiatrists coming to learn these skills to talk people out of suicide or self harm, or get somebody to kind of get, walk their way out of an eating disorder. There's a lot of different people

• 1:19:48Speaker 01

  in there. Then, then again, there's some people in there that are just, I've got a guy in there that is a, I don't remember what he, he's some kind of stage performer. He does some kind of magic or something like that on stage and wants to know how to like manipulate the crowd better, to make the show better.

• 1:20:05Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:20:06Speaker 01

  So I think when people say manipulation, it's like saying a scalpel is, is bad. It's only bad if I stab you with it. Like I can also save your life with a scalpel.

• 1:20:17Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:20:18Speaker 01

  So what we do with it, the same techniques that a cult recruiter uses to talk somebody into joining a cult are, are, and I've studied these, are the same techniques that a hostage negotiator uses to talk somebody off of a ledge or a suicide crisis hotline operator uses.

• 1:20:37Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 1:20:38Speaker 01

  So I need to capture this focus, get the authority in there and just walk this person back into reality.

• 1:20:43Danny Jones?

  Yes. Yes. That's, you know, that's why I've had a lot of former Scientologists on this podcast, being that we live in the literally world capital of Scientology, the like flag building of Scientology is less than five miles away from here in Clearwater.

• 1:21:02Danny Jones?

  And the one of the main hooks to get people into Scientology, which I think is a super beneficial learning lesson and has value for people is that Dianetics book, which teaches people, I don't know if you're familiar with it, but there's this book that L. Ron Hubbard wrote. You read it?

• 1:21:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:18Danny Jones?

  It's great. It seems like a great way to get rid of all the negative influences in your life and become a better version of yourself, right?

• 1:21:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:28Danny Jones?

  But then, once you get beyond that, that's usually when the sinister manipulative things come into play. That's how you you hook them in to the cult by dangling that carrot or that shiny fruit up front. And then you figure out how to how to capitalize on somebody after that, once you get them in the in the door, so to speak.

• 1:21:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think a lot of cults work that way, where the like, here's some beneficial stuff that can change your life. And you get into that and you're like, well, I'm starting to see some benefits.

• 1:22:00Danny Jones?

  And that's why there's so many successful people in Scientology is because of that. I mean, that's a super way. That's a that's a great way to like, optimize your life, or if you have a business to like.

• 1:22:12Speaker 01

  They have a Scientology published a series of books back in the maybe the 70s called Success Through Communication. And they're little blue books. You can find them on eBay, but they're fabulous. They have great techniques in there. But then, like, I guess there's I don't know much about Scientology, just to put that out there. But I guess there's some point where you're like, you get all this confidence, like you get more confident in your life, you're starting to like, I'm more in charge of the world around me. You can get that feeling.

• 1:22:41Danny Jones?

  Right, right.

• 1:22:42Speaker 01

  And then they're like, OK, we're going to walk through this door. And now it's time to talk about aliens.

• 1:22:45Danny Jones?

  Right, like Xenu, the Galactico Lord.

• 1:22:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, right, right. So I never got that. And I think so much of there's so many techniques in Scientology that were copied by the CIA on paper. L. Ron Hubbard invented this thing called the Alice in Wonderland technique. We need to bring this up on the screen.

• 1:23:07Danny Jones?

  Find it, Steve-O. I haven't heard of this one. Do you know about, did you know about the story about how um they uh David Miscavige, he's the new leader of Scientology, he's literally had thousands of his members file civil lawsuits against the IRS? And that's how they achieved their status as a actual religion to get tax exemption? The IRS just couldn't handle all the lawsuits, they overwhelmed them.

• 1:23:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:32Danny Jones?

  All right, what do we got here? Okay, which one of these are we looking at?

• 1:23:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, TR4.

• 1:23:38Danny Jones?

  The coach, okay, TR4 Dear Alice, the student reads several lines from Alice in Wonderland to the coach as if they are saying them, as if they are saying them themselves. The coach then acknowledges or flunks the student based on how clearly they communicated the line.

• 1:23:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:57Danny Jones?

  Other training routines in Scientology include independent book study, cooperative activities, okay. Um, Hubbard's writings emphasize that auditing subjects are machines to be manipulated rather than autonomous people.

• 1:24:09Speaker 01

  So the, so the line, you go right down to that Reddit thing.

• 1:24:15Danny Jones?

  Why Alice in Wonderland? Why Alice? Okay.

• 1:24:18Speaker 01

  So you don't have to read the article, but essentially what L. Ron Hubbard does is have people read out of this book uh of Alice in Wonderland. The, the verbiage is very confusing and L. Ron Hubbard openly wrote about this in, in his work and I'll give you the, all of my research on it and then the CIA without even attributing anything to him, copied it almost word for word in an interrogation manual. And I have that PDF too.

• 1:24:45Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 1:24:46Speaker 01

  Oh yeah. And then uh the, the grandfather of hypnotherapy, Milton Erickson, uh started writing about it. So being able to speak confusing phrases helps you to be more persuasive. They discovered this in 50s and 60s that. If I can confuse your brain, your brain acts as though someone who is, it's somebody that's falling. So if you imagine when you're falling, your limbs are flailing all over the place. And the first solid object that they come into contact with, it's gonna like grab around it. No matter what, even if it's a thorn bush or something.

• 1:25:21Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 1:25:22Speaker 01

  Right? So any, anything that's solid in that moment of confusion is gonna get grabbed onto. So the corollary, the brain corollary to this is if a person's confused, the first logical piece of information they hear after being confused will be automatically accepted. Or more automatically accepted without being screened or scrutinized by the brain. Hmm. This make sense?

• 1:25:46Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:47Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:25:47Danny Jones?

  So how, like practically, how would this be used?

• 1:25:50Speaker 01

  Um, if you spoke a, a confusing phrase very confidently, and then told somebody to just completely open up right afterward. You're gonna, you're gonna lower a whole lot of defenses for any technique you wanna use afterward. So that's a basic way to say that. So an example would be, and you know that this is a confusing statement, but if we're in a conversation and I'm speaking in a really confident way. And I said something like, how different would it be if the same thing started looking now? Like it wouldn't change if nothing else really did. And you could just get completely open.

• 1:26:26Speaker 01

  So getting good at those statements. And the one that I just said out loud was, is, is very effective. And you can try this out. I've had people that are in my coaching group use this on stage in large groups of people. And I think some of them have used it to do an upsell before.

• 1:26:48Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 1:26:48Speaker 01

  But you, you can tie a logical thought at the end of a confusion statement.

• 1:26:56Speaker 01

  And getting people good at being confusing is good to make them more powerful communicators. But the auditor, I think, is what they call the person that reads things to the subject across the table, is using those confusing statements and inserting those things afterward. And it's in the textbook of, or it's in the little, it's more of a pamphlet of success through communication. And I wish I could bring that up, man.

• 1:27:25Danny Jones?

  Yeah, the auditing thing is bizarre, is a bizarre aspect of Scientology because they get, they have these E-meter machines, these electrical, I don't know if you're familiar with them, but there's like-

• 1:27:34Speaker 01

  Yes, a GSR.

• 1:27:35Danny Jones?

  A GSR?

• 1:27:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:36Danny Jones?

  Where they hold these two rods and then they ask them personal questions and they get these people just to open up about their deepest, darkest secrets.

• 1:27:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a galvanic skin response is what it's measuring. It's the same thing you would have, it's part of a polygraph.

• 1:27:48Danny Jones?

  Oh, really?

• 1:27:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:50Danny Jones?

  Yeah, and it's just, it's wild because it's, it's super effective in basically blackmailing people.

• 1:27:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I've, I've loved the E-meter concept for a while. I don't think it's extremely reliable for like reading human emotion.

• 1:28:05Danny Jones?

  Right, well neither is the, is the polygraph, right?

• 1:28:08Speaker 01

  No. But I mean, there is, there are new neural networks that are 98.4% effective at detecting human risk. And they can call you on your cell phone and ask you a yes or no question and it's 98.4 effect, percent effective, proven by Carnegie Mellon, proven by the Department of Defense. I, I, disclaimer, I am on the board of that company, but it is scary accurate and I, uh-

• 1:28:35Danny Jones?

  What kind of questions do they ask?

• 1:28:37Speaker 01

  You, you can ask anything. We can use it to find bad guys overseas, we can use it to screen people for job interviews, insurance fraud. We're gonna be using it in boxing soon, just to ask people, are you doping, are you blood doping or, or whatever? Can you pass the, pass the, the test? The system is called Asterisk. But it, it, it can just ask you for, it's an AI that calls your phone and says, here's the questions you're gonna be asked. It tells you the questions beforehand and these are, they're all yes or no, and it asks you four or five yes or no questions. And it's 98.4 plus is what they say in the research, 98.4% plus accurate in detecting risk. But it's more like a metal detector at an airport.

• 1:29:24Speaker 01

  And because calling something a lie detector is just not, I don't think it's accurate. You could, I don't think anything should be called a lie detector. So it's just like when you go to the airport, if the machine goes off, it's almost, almost a hundred percent sure that there's something big and metal on your body. Whether or not it's a belt buckle or an AK-47 is going to be up to a human.

• 1:29:48Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:29:48Speaker 01

  So this AI that we're using is directing human attention. So it's the fastest pathway to identify risk, but it's also the fastest pathway for me to find out. If I have a group of a hundred people here, who, who are the, where can I trust? Where can I invest trust the fastest way? So that's what it really is. It's the fastest pathway to get to a trust. And I don't know how the hell we got, oh, the E-meter.

• 1:30:15Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:15Speaker 01

  So I, I've been obsessed with the E-meter. Dude, I went on eBay so many times and tried to find them on eBay. You can't find them.

• 1:30:23Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 1:30:24Speaker 01

  I think maybe Scientology buys them up.

• 1:30:26Danny Jones?

  They probably do.

• 1:30:26Speaker 01

  But I do think L. Ron Hubbard was a genius, hands down.

• 1:30:30Danny Jones?

  He was something, man. I think he was the most prolific science fiction writer of all time. I think like objectively, he's written more science fiction than anyone we're aware of.

• 1:30:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, so there's a lot of research out there that suggests he had a condition in his temporal lobe called hypergraphia.

• 1:30:49Danny Jones?

  Whoa, bless you.

• 1:30:50Speaker 01

  Damn.

• 1:30:51Danny Jones?

  That was aggressive.

• 1:30:55Speaker 01

  So there's some research that says he most likely suffered from a condition called temporal lobe epilepsy, which produces a byproduct called hypergraphia, where it's this incessant, almost unsatisfiable need to write and continue writing. And Steve, you can probably bring that up. Just type in L. Ron Hubbard temporal lobe epilepsy. And it is the most, is a very compelling case. So people with temporal lobe epilepsy, I am one of them. I have temporal lobe epilepsy.

• 1:31:27Danny Jones?

  What, what is the function of the temporal lobe?

• 1:31:31Speaker 01

  Uh, time and memory.

• 1:31:32Danny Jones?

  Okay. Temporal lobe epilepsy, right, a common type of epilepsy that affects the memory, regulating temporal lobe of the brain. Wow.

• 1:31:40Speaker 01

  So that's where your hippocampus is down there. A lot of crap going on down there, but.

• 1:31:45Danny Jones?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:31:46Speaker 01

  I was at a point in my life where I was having nine seizures a day. Which I know you wanted to even open, open this episode with that talk and we didn't. I forgot.

• 1:31:55Danny Jones?

  We were talking about this before we started, yeah.

• 1:31:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. But I was having temporal lobe seizures at nine times a day and it is like, it is very, very

• 1:32:06Speaker 01

  adjacent to what you might experience on DMT, except scary, terrifying and horror movie-esque. And, and they last about a minute and you're just like, your body just is like a rag doll. You're not shaking on the ground and doing crazy stuff. But it's like you have this weird access to another dimension for a time being. And I know there's people out there that are suffering with temporal lobe epilepsy right now. And I was able to stop mine, like a hundred percent stop, zero seizures.

• 1:32:36Danny Jones?

  It can't, did it come out of nowhere?

• 1:32:38Speaker 01

  No, they think it's probably a result of a genetic predisposition mixed with a bunch of deployments, being around explosions and stuff like that. So getting a little tiny bit of a brain injury. So, and so during temporal lobe epilepsy, those seizures, you're experiencing what I would call maybe between 90 days and a year of memories in 60 seconds. So you're, you're getting access to so much information and so much weird stuff, almost like you're living a year of someone else's life. And then the moment the seizure's over, it takes, for one seizure, it took me like two weeks to, to reconcile what was real and what was fake.

• 1:33:22Speaker 01

  Uh, and then you have derealization in, in temporal lobe epilepsy, which is where you wonder like, am I real? Is, am I sitting in, is this room real? Am I actually sitting here right now? I had a point before our, our daughter was born, I thought my dog was fake. I thought my dog was artificial and, and not real. Not like I'm imagining it. I just thought like, that is not a real dog. It, it, it is so weird, man. It messes with your head so much.

• 1:33:52Danny Jones?

  Projection or something?

• 1:33:53Speaker 01

  And I didn't, I didn't put any logic to it.

• 1:33:55Danny Jones?

  No, just felt that it was not real.

• 1:33:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. But as, as the, and I'm going to tie this back to Elron, I promise. But as the, as the seizure is starting, they call this an aura. You have this weird thing that goes on.

• 1:34:07Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:08Speaker 01

  Like something's going on around me where you know that's going to happen. As it starts, the deja vu is so powerful.

• 1:34:18Speaker 01

  And so strong that in your brain, there is no possibility that everyone around me didn't set this up. So it's a weird feeling of like, everything around me is so weirdly familiar that I know that everyone here had to set this up. So it's almost like a weird paranoia. And then you think like, all of this is, this can't be real. And then the moment that happens is like, you're going, like you jump off a building. It's like a falling feeling in your stomach and then it's just lights out. So it's terrifying, but you get, it's almost like there's some weird access to something that other people don't have access to. And they call this the sacred disease, temporal lobe epilepsy.

• 1:35:03Speaker 01

  And hypergraphia, I mean, look, I wrote that while I was suffering all that. So I definitely had hypergraphia. It took me five years to write, but this was, I wrote this book because I thought I was gonna lose my whole brain and I had to dump everything. Even the, the super, super confidential stuff, I put everything in the book, everything. And I wanted all of my training to be in one location. And just so my wife could keep selling the book. That was the motivation to write? The motivation to write the book was my brain was dying. And I thought, I'm not gonna be a good provider, I can't provide for my family anymore.

• 1:35:47Speaker 01

  So I thought, if I could just write this book that has everything in it, then we'll be okay, the kids can survive, we can still feed, put food on the table and all that, even if I'm in a wheelchair or something. So that's the only reason that book exists. Wow. But coming back to Elrond, I know how, how that feels. If he had temporal lobe epilepsy, I know how that feels. And that may explain a lot of, of those little internal components of, of what make up Scientology.

• 1:36:20Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 1:36:21Speaker 01

  I believe.

• 1:36:21Danny Jones?

  You said you had nine seizures a day?

• 1:36:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:24Danny Jones?

  And you said like these memories were coming back, like a flood of memories, which felt like deja vu. Were they your own memories all come or coming into one moment?

• 1:36:33Speaker 01

  At the beginning, like the aura moment at the start.

• 1:36:38Danny Jones?

  When you say aura, what do you mean specifically aura?

• 1:36:40Speaker 01

  It's just a feeling when the seizure is about to start.

• 1:36:43Danny Jones?

  Not like a visual thing?

• 1:36:44Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:36:45Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 1:36:45Speaker 01

  But it wasn't memories. The deja vu was, you know how it's uncanny?

• 1:36:49Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:50Speaker 01

  Like, everything around is so alien, but familiar. Like, I've been here before, but times 5,000, like, it's off the charts. And then, after that, that's when the memories come in. It's not your own memories. It's something else. And it's like, months to, maybe years of memories that happened in like 60 seconds. And I've had times

• 1:37:18Speaker 01

  right before I got married. I'm gonna get emotional talking about it. Right before I got married, I had maybe one of the worst. And I was, it was maybe two and a half minutes, three minutes long. And you lose about a million neurons a second in a seizure. It's bad. So I was thinking like, I'm fucked, you know? So I was in my office and I was hunched over the desk and I had been in a seizure so long, there was just a pool of saliva beside my desk and I was trying to scream. It's like, inside the seizure, it's like all those memories flooding and having sleep paralysis at the same time.

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  And, man, it's terrifying. It's not like DMT at all. But it's, what I'm saying, the corollary is like, you go somewhere else completely. You're gone. It's so it's terrifying.

• 1:38:17Danny Jones?

  Jesus Christ. How did you, how did you overcome this? How did you get over it?

• 1:38:24Speaker 01

  So I

• 1:38:26Speaker 01

  Saw a neurologist and they gave me a prescription that I won't say the name of the drug, but it's that one of the most common side effects of the drug was seizures.

• 1:38:37Speaker 01

  It's like this cannot be real. This can't be real. And I'd studied neuroscience for five years at this time, six years. So I am scrolling through Instagram one day taxiing on a runway in LA. And I see this dude on Instagram. He sounds like some California surfer dude. And he's talking about mitochondria and I was just because of his accent, I judged him like an idiot. But I just kind of flipped past it. Then I realized what he was talking about and I tried to go back to the post, but I hit the swipe right on accident. You know, when like you reset your scroll and you can't go back. I did that. And it took me like four days to find him.

• 1:39:19Speaker 01

  And his name is Dr. John Lawrence. And I'm going to introduce you to him tomorrow, which is going to be cool.

• 1:39:26Danny Jones?

  Oh, that's the guy in Sarasota?

• 1:39:28Speaker 01

  Yeah. So he's talking about methylene blue, which I know Jack Cruz has talked about here. And

• 1:39:37Danny Jones?

  I got some methylene blue. I started taking it after I had this lady Alexis.

• 1:39:41Speaker 01

  What brand is it?

• 1:39:43Danny Jones?

  It's called Troescriptions. They have like a website. It's, it's pretty, it's pretty cheap.

• 1:39:50Speaker 01

  Is it hard?

• 1:39:51Danny Jones?

  Inexpensive. No, they come in these little, they're called Troche's. So if you see like, it comes in these and they're like,

• 1:39:59Speaker 01

  That's pretty much what I take.

• 1:40:00Danny Jones?

  You just stick them right in the back of your, you can either keep them like in between your gum and your lip and it stains your whole mouth blue, or you can just swallow it.

• 1:40:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:09Danny Jones?

  Want one?

• 1:40:10Speaker 01

  No, I took them this morning.

• 1:40:11Danny Jones?

  Did you?

• 1:40:11Speaker 01

  I take them every day.

• 1:40:12Danny Jones?

  I'm gonna throw one in right now.

• 1:40:14Speaker 01

  So for methylene blue, it's, I think it's the one thing that truly reversed all, everything that was going on with my brain. Every single symptom that I was having was just gone.

• 1:40:29Speaker 01

  I credit everything to methylene blue and finding Dr. John and I buy my methylene blue from Dr. John's website just because I'm I'm so passionate about it.

• 1:40:39Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 1:40:40Speaker 01

  And methylene blue acts as, just to give you like a 60 second brochure of what it does. It's an it's a light MAOI, a monoamine oxidase inhibitor. So it helps our cells to get rid of the two things that we don't really want in our cells. A lot of is reactive oxygen species and reactive nitrogen species. And it donates an electron, it donates a lot of electrons to mitochondria. And the second thing that it does, well, it does a lot more than that. And it helps. Your body's main job is to take an oxygen molecule and stick some hydrogen on there and turn it into water. That's your that's your body's job. But sometimes it doesn't do that and it oxygen molecule gets screwed up and turns into a reactive

• 1:41:25Speaker 01

  oxygen species. So the second thing that it does is it it has an affinity to neuronal tissue. So if you if you take that methylene blue right now and then two hours from right now, we did an autopsy on you, and let's say you died, your brain is blue.

• 1:41:43Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 1:41:44Speaker 01

  Bright blue.

• 1:41:45Danny Jones?

  Really? It gets into the brain?

• 1:41:46Speaker 01

  Steven, look up methylene blue brain autopsy. Yeah, so it's your spinal cord, all your nerves, brain stem, whole brain is all blue.

• 1:41:56Danny Jones?

  So if I take one of those and I take a leak later, my pee is blue.

• 1:42:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:01Danny Jones?

  So there. Oh, wow. Look at that. The brain and the heart.

• 1:42:04Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:42:05Danny Jones?

  Is blue.

• 1:42:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, man.

• 1:42:08Danny Jones?

  So how are they getting in this in this to this stuff into a dead person?

• 1:42:12Speaker 01

  They don't. That was probably a living person who was on methylene blue. And some of these they use to stain. Methylene blue is obviously a it's just a blue dye.

• 1:42:22Danny Jones?

  Right. Yeah, they use it for fish tank cleaner.

• 1:42:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. So these may may be used to stain. But if you do an autopsy on a person who's on a dose of methylene blue, higher than probably

• 1:42:36Danny Jones?

  Scroll up.

• 1:42:37Speaker 01

  Two milligrams per kilogram.

• 1:42:38Danny Jones?

  No, up farther. It shows the abstract. Sorry, go ahead.

• 1:42:43Danny Jones?

  This says greenish blue discoloration of the brain and heart were observed during the autopsy of a 63 year old woman who had been treated with methylene blue for septic shock. Following, oh wow, following a traffic accident. This placebo or avatar discoloration occurs when the colorless metabolite leukomethylene blue is oxidized to methylene blue upon exposure to atmospheric oxygen. Huh. So she was suffering from septic shock and they gave her the methylene blue.

• 1:43:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, so it's, it, it has an affinity for neuronal tissue. So this guy who discovered it's 1894 ish and the industrial revolution was kicking off and they're like, hey, we need to dye a bunch of stuff blue. We got a huge need for that. So this scientist invents essentially invents or discovers this methylene blue and he's dicking around with it and he shoots it into a rat and then does an autopsy on the rat and the rat has a blue nervous system, the whole thing. So he's like, there's something special about this. It's not just for dying stuff because he was using it on slides to dye, microscope slides.

• 1:43:55Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:56Speaker 01

  So it, it has an affinity to go into just the neuronal tissue and fix that first. It'll fix the rest of your body too, because it goes everywhere, especially when you take intravenous methylene blue, which I'm going to be doing tomorrow. But it is so incredible and with the MAOI and it turning your body blue, you know, it's blue because it reflects blue light, right? Which means that it absorbs red. So if I do red light therapy with methylene blue, I'm exponentially increasing.

• 1:44:30Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 1:44:31Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:44:33Speaker 01

  You can fact check me like Uncle Jack.

• 1:44:37Danny Jones?

  Type in methylene blue and red light therapy.

• 1:44:41Speaker 01

  So this, this combination is called photobiomodulation.

• 1:44:45Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 1:44:46Speaker 01

  So I'm, I'm using a red light machine and that methylene blue soaks up that red light.

• 1:44:52Speaker 03

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• 1:45:22Danny Jones?

  What does this, this is PubMed. Find the, the abstract, scroll down, it'll give you like a summary of what it is.

• 1:45:28Speaker 01

  There it is. Protection against neurodegeneration.

• 1:45:30Danny Jones?

  Neurons are metabolically protected against degeneration using low level methylene blue and infrared and near infrared light interventions. Both of these novel interventions act by a cellular mechanism involving enhancement of the electron transport chain in mitochondria. This promotes energy metabolism and neuronal survival. Methylene blue preferentially enters neuronal mitochondria after systematic administrations and at low doses forms an electron cycling redux complex that donates electrons to the mitochondrial electron transport chain. Interesting. Oh, low level near infrared light applied, transcranially delivers photons to cortical

• 1:46:12Danny Jones?

  neurons that are accepted at cytochrome oxidase.

• 1:46:16Speaker 01

  Cytochrome C. Specifically it would be cytochrome C oxidase.

• 1:46:21Danny Jones?

  Oh wow. Which increases cell respiration and cerebral blood flow. Breakthrough in vivo studies with these interventions suggests that targeting mitochondrial respiration may be beneficial for protection against different types of neurodegenerative disorders. Oh my God, I had no idea that you could use them together and it. That makes sense how it would reflect the blue light and help you absorb more red light.

• 1:46:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, and that cytochrome, just, just thinking of the word cytochrome. Cyto means cell, chrome means color. So always think of like, that's, that's the color of light. Jack talked about this a lot, how we generate a little bit of near infrared light in our, in our cells. So cytochrome is the important chemical there. And he talked about magnetism with, we have sulfur and, and iron and stuff that's in the mouth of cytochrome, c auxites. So doing that lets it absorb that. So your cells are kind of running on those photons instead of just the electrons.

• 1:47:19Danny Jones?

  Wow, man. Yeah, he was also explaining to me how one of his family members was like going blind and needed cataract surgery. And he told them to start doing this red light therapy every day for like months. And he was doing it, I think for a couple of months and he wasn't wearing the eye cover or whatever. He was just like fully, eyes fully exposed to this near infrared light panels. And

• 1:47:42Speaker 01

  I never do.

• 1:47:42Danny Jones?

  He went in, uh, like a couple of months before he had to get his operation done for his cataracts. And his vision was like, he didn't need the cataract surgery anymore. It like re, something about that near infrared, uh, red light with exposure to the eyes, it somehow like reproduces visual neurons or like rebuilds these visual neurons?

• 1:48:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think what it, what it probably does is, is makes more ATP, which is adenosine triphosphate, which is our cells' energy. So those cells, the cataracts is a degenerative disease. So we're getting less ATP. So more ATP probably means that there is more neural connectivity, those cells had more energy to, to perform repairs on themselves.

• 1:48:28Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:48:28Speaker 01

  And the cool thing about mitochondria, which I was hoping that Jack would mention, is mitochondria is not human. It has different DNA than us. It's alien. And the

• 1:48:40Danny Jones?

  What do you, how, how, what do you mean by that?

• 1:48:42Speaker 01

  All right, Stephen, look it up. You got a skeptical face on you.

• 1:48:45Danny Jones?

  I'm just trying to understand it. How does it have different DNA than us?

• 1:48:49Speaker 01

  So

• 1:48:49Danny Jones?

  I'm just not, yeah, I don't know enough about this stuff.

• 1:48:51Speaker 01

  The theory, there's a theory now that mitochondria is

• 1:48:58Speaker 01

  The result of-

• 1:48:59Danny Jones?

  Type in DNA after that. Oh, wait, there you go. Mitochondria are considered unique because they have their own DNA called mitochondrial DNA. A double, a double membrane structure unlike most other organelles and the ability to replicate independently within a cell. Huh. Okay.

• 1:49:19Speaker 01

  So there's a theory that mitochondria was its own little organism and formed a relationship with little single cell organisms and like, hey, bro, I'm gonna give you a bunch of energy. I'm gonna help you absorb sunlight and live outside the water. So let's form this little relationship together. So that's just a theory that somebody has it and how these things started working together because it's not human.

• 1:49:41Danny Jones?

  That's fascinating. That is pretty badass. Yeah, the, the water inside of the mitochondria is like the most important thing. And what Jack was explaining to me is that if you, if you combine, uh, not if you combine, but if you expose yourself to really cold temperatures, I think he calls it thermogenesis, cold water thermogenesis. It, your, your cells create and your mitochondria actually create endogenous UV light inside the body, like UV, like blue light.

• 1:50:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:17Danny Jones?

  Which is wild.

• 1:50:18Speaker 01

  You, you get a better results if you're drinking water that has lower deuterium-

• 1:50:24Danny Jones?

  Yes. Yeah. That's why he drinks all that deuterium depleted water.

• 1:50:27Speaker 01

  Oh, did he talk about that? I might've missed that.

• 1:50:28Danny Jones?

  Yeah, he talked a little bit. Oh, Alexis talked about the deuterium depleted water. Yeah.

• 1:50:32Speaker 01

  I, I drink, I drink it almost exclusively at home.

• 1:50:36Danny Jones?

  It's expensive, isn't it?

• 1:50:37Speaker 01

  It is very expensive. So I order from this company called Light Water. I have no affiliation with the company, but I-

• 1:50:42Danny Jones?

  L I G H T?

• 1:50:44Speaker 01

  No, L I T E.

• 1:50:45Danny Jones?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:50:45Speaker 01

  Light Water Scientific, I think is the name of the company. You can order it on Amazon, I think even.

• 1:50:51Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 1:50:52Speaker 01

  It's these little blue bottles, plastic bottles, and even the company recommends like, deuterium depletion is very important. So you don't have to just drink this water straight. You can pour it into your daily water intake. So you're getting less deuterium than normal. So you're diluting the water with it. So you can still drink normal water out of a Brita filter or something and then, and then pour that stuff in there.

• 1:51:17Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I think the idea is that, at least from the way Alexis explained this to me, was that closer latitudes that are closer to the equator have higher levels of deuterium in the water, and the higher up you get on the planet, the higher latitudes have less deuterium in them. And this has something to do with organisms that live and survive at upper latitudes where there's less sunlight. They get somehow because there's less UV light, the colder temperatures compensate for the less UV light. That's why their eyes are lighter. Their eyes aren't dark. Like, most people that live at equatorial

• 1:51:58Danny Jones?

  latitudes, they have dark brown eyes because they don't need as much UV light because they're exposed to it all the time.

• 1:52:06Speaker 01

  Have you heard the theory that you can't get a sunburn if you're not wearing sunglasses?

• 1:52:10Danny Jones?

  Alexis explained that to me, yeah.

• 1:52:11Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:52:12Danny Jones?

  Yeah. She was, well, she was explaining to me how there's an important mechanism where you have to be, if you're experienced, if you're exposed to UV light, you can't, it's not good to block the UV light in the eyes and only get it on the skin. That's how your skin develops those basal cell anomalies where you get skin cancer and stuff like that.

• 1:52:34Speaker 01

  Melanopsin.

• 1:52:36Danny Jones?

  Yes, the light, yes, exactly. So it's not good if you're outside all day to be wearing sunglasses because you're blocking your light, your eyes from creating that melanopsin from the UV light. You need to have that balance. And that's why Jack tells everybody to take off their sunglasses because he thinks that that's probably like one of the biggest problems with, with people getting skin cancer and, you know, general health problems. I mean, his whole idea about health is that exposure to UV light and getting out of artificial light is like the top thing for human health. He was explaining how like, you know, food and hyper-processed foods and diet is like three or four down the ladder, down the rung, as far as like low-hanging fruit to improve our health. And he was explaining

• 1:53:19Danny Jones?

  that, like, essentially, which I think you made a good point about in the podcast I listened to you with.

• 1:53:25Danny Jones?

  Was that, you know, we exist today, like, human beings with the development of technology and us being inside all the time under these artificial lights is almost the equivalent of orcas at SeaWorld being inside these big tanks all the time. It's just not good. Their life expectancy just goes down. They, I mean, they're like, and they're killing their trainers. I mean, it's like, it's literally breaking them down in every way, shape and form.

• 1:53:51Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I think the closer we get to nature, like, what were our bodies designed to do? We can't, technology is outpacing our ability to adapt.

• 1:54:02Speaker 01

  Technology is outpacing our ability to adapt to it.

• 1:54:05Danny Jones?

  Yes.

• 1:54:06Speaker 01

  Genetically.

• 1:54:06Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:07Speaker 01

  And we need to go back to like, what, what kept our ancestors alive? And that seems to, all these studies are like discovering the stuff that like, our ancestors didn't even need research for, because they just lived life in nature. But I published a paper, I don't know, a month or two ago, called Ancestor Confusion Theory, that if you are spending time in a place that would confuse the shit out of your ancestor that lived 10,000 years ago, you, the more time you spend in one of those places that would confuse your ancestor, the more you have depression, anxiety, loneliness, heart disease. And like, you look at cities and these are like, I just, I just did a podcast with Stephen

• 1:54:52Speaker 01

  Bartlett, Diary of a CEO, and I was staying in Brooklyn and looking out my hotel window, I can't find a piece of nature, no matter where I looked, every direction, there's nothing.

• 1:55:02Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 1:55:03Speaker 01

  So, and I'm not saying, I'm not claiming to have some solution to solve the Earth's problems, but I'm just making that correlation of when people are in environments that our bodies are not designed to be in, we have things that go wrong. And this applies to fish and dolphins, and you take an octopus out of the ocean, put it in a tank, no matter how perfect the saliency of the water is, and everything that you do in that tank to replicate nature perfectly, it shortens the lifespan of the octopus by years.

• 1:55:34Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:35Speaker 01

  So, I think one of our, our modern world, our biggest problem, I think the biggest problems in science are when we think we are special. Humans are more special than nature and we're, we can, we can outsmart nature. What the thing that created us or whatever created us is like, we are special is, is one of the biggest things. This is, goes back to the earth being the center of the universe and now like aliens have to look like us. And like all of this little things that we hear is like, especially with sciences, the root of the problems come back to, humans have to be special for this thing to be true.

• 1:56:16Danny Jones?

  Hmm. One of the other things about this, like being exposed to more UV light is the timing of it too, like the, like how this all connects to circadian biology. And um, how the light, how the eyes are such, play such an important role in this. And when you are up in the morning, watching the sunrise between whenever, depending on where you are on the earth, whenever the sun rises for like that first hour, and you're outside and your eyes are exposed to that sunlight, whether it be direct, it doesn't have to be direct. It can be ambient sunlight, as long as you're outside with no windows between you and the outdoors. Your, that's when your brain creates melatonin.

• 1:57:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:57:02Danny Jones?

  Which makes you fall asleep when the sun goes down. So if you're waking up, you could even be waking up when the sun rises. If you're not going outside, you're going to have trouble going to sleep at night.

• 1:57:13Speaker 01

  Yeah. And that's why there's so many people on shift work that, that suffer all kinds of problems. They have more obesity on, on shift work, people that work nights and stuff like that. You have, I think triple the rate of obesity. I can't remember the study.

• 1:57:27Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:27Speaker 01

  But I, I completely agree with that. I've read some paper or maybe heard in a podcast. Have you heard where people talking about getting sunlight on your butthole in the morning?

• 1:57:38Danny Jones?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're talking about, they're talking about uh, like sunning their balls. I've heard that. I haven't heard the butthole one.

• 1:57:44Speaker 01

  I gotta read this paper. Is there a paper on this?

• 1:57:46Danny Jones?

  Probably. Yeah. I know there's a, I know there's people who on Instagram at least that I've seen that talk about like sunning their balls. I know that, that Jack talks about this too all the time on Twitter, how like if you're covering up certain part of your body when you're getting sun, it's not good. You have to expose your full body to it.

• 1:58:02Speaker 01

  All right.

• 1:58:03Danny Jones?

  But like, that's something we've been doing since antiquity. I mean, we haven't like been walking, we weren't walking around naked forever. We've been covering up our bodies forever. Oh, okay. AI says there's no evidence exposing your testicles to sun or tanning them can increase testosterone levels or have any other benefits. In fact, doing so can be harmful.

• 1:58:20Speaker 01

  Can you hear Jack's voice right now?

• 1:58:22Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 1:58:23Speaker 01

  You know what?

• 1:58:25Danny Jones?

  Well, apparently, there's a lot of the stuff you learn in medical school, all of the textbooks that you get and you have to study in medical school, depending on, whatever category you're in, is like 90% of it is wrong or outdated, according to Jack. And according to some of like the most world-renowned neurosurgeons and neuroscientists from Stanford have even come out and said this, that like all of the textbooks and stuff that you that you read are really outdated or have like completely false information in them.

• 1:58:59Speaker 01

  Can we ask Grok instead of?

• 1:59:02Danny Jones?

  I've never used Grok. That's the XAI?

• 1:59:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's good.

• 1:59:05Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 1:59:06Speaker 01

  Yeah. And you can put it in fun mode.

• 1:59:08Danny Jones?

  Oh, I've heard about this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How do you spell G R O C?

• 1:59:12Speaker 01

  No, just go to X.com.

• 1:59:14Danny Jones?

  G R O K. Type in scientific research on exposing testicles to sunlight.

• 1:59:27Speaker 01

  What about current ideas?

• 1:59:31Danny Jones?

  Now, does this just search Twitter? Early research from 1939 suggests that exposure of the male body to ultraviolet light could significantly increase testosterone levels, specifically when the chest and back are exposed to UV. Oh, when the chest and back are exposed to UV light. I lost where I was at.

• 1:59:56Danny Jones?

  Okay. Okay, here we go.

• 2:00:01Danny Jones?

  Testosterone levels reportedly increased by 120% while exposure of the genital area led to a 200% increase. However, these studies are not quite, are quite dated and have not been widely replicated under modern scientific standards. Recent commentary and analysis, more recent discussions and analysis on the topic, particularly those found on platforms like X, often reference these historical studies, but also acknowledge the lack of contemporary, peer-reviewed research, specifically targeting testicular exposure to sunlight.

• 2:00:36Speaker 01

  Go to number four.

• 2:00:38Danny Jones?

  Alternate explanations. Some research suggests that if there is any effect from light exposure, it might be due to the stimulation of vitamin D synthesis, which can indirectly influence testosterone levels. However, okay, yeah, because because.

• 2:00:51Speaker 01

  Number five, the interest in testicle tanning.

• 2:00:55Danny Jones?

  I haven't heard of the butthole tanning one, though.

• 2:00:59Speaker 01

  I just heard it was like good to get your whole, everything spread all out. So everything can get some sun back there.

• 2:01:05Danny Jones?

  Hmm. Well, UV light doesn't really penetrate the, the tissue that much. It doesn't go very deep, like red light.

• 2:01:13Speaker 01

  Red light's deep.

• 2:01:14Danny Jones?

  The red light and infrared light penetrates your body and your tissue by like four to five inches, I've heard.

• 2:01:19Speaker 01

  Yeah. That's, it's fascinating.

• 2:01:22Danny Jones?

  Okay. Well, so in summary, it says, while there's historical basis for suggesting that UV light exposure might increase testosterone, the direct exposure of testicles to the sunlight for this purpose lacks support of contemporary scientific rigorous studies. The potential health risks, including cancer, are well documented, leading health professionals and to generally advise against this practice. Yeah, you, you can't go to any dermatologist and, and tell them that sunglasses theory that Alexis was talking about, not wearing sunglasses in the sun can stop you from skin cancer or how like, because they'll all tell you to wear sunscreen and sunglasses. Like, that's the consensus among all dermatologists.

• 2:01:58Speaker 01

  I, I studied medical neuroscience and this includes radiology, reading MRIs and, and brain scans and studying Parkinson's, myasthenia gravis, you name it, Alzheimer's, dementia. And the more I learn about what truly helps the brain, I get so jaded and I get upset that I didn't, why don't they teach that in college? Why didn't they talk about any of this? And I've heard many people say that a lot of these universities are, the curriculum is developed by Big Pharma or some company with a

• 2:02:37Danny Jones?

  Especially Stanford. Stanford's a big one.

• 2:02:39Speaker 01

  It's, it's public, public record.

• 2:02:42Danny Jones?

  Yeah, there's an article, I'm actually gonna pull it up, I have it right here on my daylight computer. Shout out to daylight.

• 2:02:47Speaker 01

  Man, that's so.

• 2:02:48Danny Jones?

  This is the coolest invention ever. Hold on, let me find it. I want, I want to give this guy credit because I just got done reading his article. His name is Nafiz Ahmed and he wrote this whole, this, this huge two-part piece on how Google was incubated and funded by CIA and NSA and DARPA. And how the PageRank algorithm and all of the proprietary IP that's used in Google was developed first in DARPA. And then there was these two people that are

• 2:03:28Danny Jones?

  listed in that article from CIA and NSA who were visiting Sergey Brin many times when he was developing it and testing it. And they were funding it, quite literally. So like, the implications of the whole thing, basically, read the article, I highly recommend it's on Medium, it's on his Medium page.

• 2:03:46Speaker 01

  So you're saying that the alphabet agencies

• 2:03:49Danny Jones?

  Google.

• 2:03:49Speaker 01

  became the alphabet company. Isn't it called the alphabet company?

• 2:03:53Danny Jones?

  Yeah, alphabet. So, so Google was incubated, curated and funded by CIA and NSA. And it was, and it was technology from DARPA that they used. So when you think of like the Twitter files and how Twitter was co-opted by, or not co-opted, but infiltrated by like FBI and CIA trying to manage the disinformation going on, well, Google's a whole nother animal because Google was literally a product of those agencies.

• 2:04:21Speaker 01

  And this is proven.

• 2:04:23Danny Jones?

  Yeah, this is his article right here. How the CIA made Google, inside the secret network.

• 2:04:26Speaker 01

  Good God.

• 2:04:28Danny Jones?

  Fascinating, fascinating deep dive this guy did. And, you know, there, there's all these like think tanks that you've never heard of that are these like consensus think tanks where all these people Um, in these agencies, just try, uh, try to figure out how to weaponize the internet for manipulation on a global scale.

• 2:04:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:04:54Danny Jones?

  For the.

• 2:04:55Speaker 01

  I think most, most people, I've, I've been involved with many different operations, stuff going on back in the day. Most people that are involved in those things, like putting Google algorithm together and all that, most of those people genuinely, in their heart of hearts, believe that they're doing something good for the country. I really believe that. I've met these people, when they first started, they were naive enough, uh, and which I would be, most of us would be, we don't know what's going, what's going to happen way down at the end of this pipeline.

• 2:05:30Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:05:30Speaker 01

  So we're putting this stuff together and you, you genuinely feel like a patriot at the time. And then it's embarrassing, so nobody really speaks up at the end, like I was a big part of that and I put that together. So I, I think that we, we're, we're assigning, I think a lot of people assign malice to uh, people that had none.

• 2:05:52Danny Jones?

  Sure.

• 2:05:53Speaker 01

  There was malice maybe in some of it, but I think the overall thing was like information's going to be crazy and we need, this is going to be a war of information, this is going to be a war of ideas and we need to make sure we get the right ones into the hands of the American people so that they're well-informed and they, they know the right things that are going on, so the American people won't be manipulated. And I think that was probably, so many programs start out that way of like, we need to protect people first, like the Patriot Act. It was like, oh yeah, we need to protect you.

• 2:06:26Danny Jones?

  Right, but let's label it this thing that sounds innocent.

• 2:06:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:30Danny Jones?

  The Patriot Act, right? Just mass surveillance on humans. Yeah, no, I think you're right about that. I mean, they're huge organizations. These are huge organizations with lots of people working in them and working inside of them. And they're not all, like, it's the banality of evil, right? Like, the people that are working, like, exactly what you said, there's, like, even in organizations like the CIA, not all those people are bad. Like, are there bad people with bad intentions in there, in those organizations? Yeah. Which, and people don't focus on the good things. Like, tell me 10 good things the CIA did and tell me 10 bad things the CIA did. I bet you can't label one. Most people probably can't list one good thing the CIA has ever done. But they can come up with every single conspiracy, from the JFK assassination to

• 2:07:11Danny Jones?

  Operation Northwoods, the Bay of Pigs, all these things, all the assassinations, MKUltra, right?

• 2:07:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:18Danny Jones?

  But, like, at the end of the day, like, it's just humans with with animalistic intentions and the same sort of values and fears that drive all of us, that when you get that level of power and that much money, it's the same thing that would happen to you or me, probably. Like, you want to protect yourself, protect your tribe, you want to take care of your kids, make more and more, another billion, right?

• 2:07:50Speaker 01

  Let me just get one more billion in there. I'm gonna unplug. As soon as I get this next billion out.

• 2:07:55Danny Jones?

  Yeah, and you're gonna die eventually, right? And you don't have to deal with any of this anymore, right? You're just gonna protect your family and protect your tribe, and then whatever happens after that. Like, these people aren't necessarily like philosophical thought leaders in human history, or they don't maybe, may not understand, like, all of human history and how this stuff can affect people 100 years down the road. It's like, it's like capitalism gone off the rails.

• 2:08:21Speaker 01

  There's an old quote of "The only way for a society," I'm paraphrasing this, "but the only way for a society to thrive is when men plant trees whose shade they will never enjoy."

• 2:08:37Speaker 01

  So we're all just future focused on the, the life of the next generation instead of our own. And that's the same, when I teach people how to have discipline in their life, it's the exact same thing as a country. My present tense self places more priority over what me in the future than me right now. If I only prioritize right now, I'm going to stay up late, I'm going to drink too much, I'm going to miss that exam in the morning. I'm going to do all, I'm going to eat too much cheesecake, fill in the blank, I'm going to do drugs. If, if my, if I prioritize my future self ahead of my present self, I will always be looking backwards with gratitude instead of regret.

• 2:09:17Speaker 01

  So my past tense self will always be someone I'm grateful for, not, not regretful of. And that's, I think that's the goal in our life, that's the goal for a, a nation. It's, there's no difference. Like, do I have the ability to forego enjoying something now? So that future me, or maybe future me generation, uh, will be able to enjoy it. I think that, that's it.

• 2:09:45Danny Jones?

  Yeah. Yeah, I think you're right about that. I think that definitely gets lost. That gets lost, you know, like there, there's a, there's a saying that money is like a magnifying glass. It makes you more of who you really are.

• 2:09:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:10:01Danny Jones?

  Like the more money you have, it just magnifies your, your deepest motivation, your deepest drives that, that make you into who you are. And I think that's what's happening. I think that's what hap, what's happening with the people that are, you know, in charge. Like whether it be politicians or CEOs of huge companies. Um, and, and it doesn't necessarily, being a good person doesn't make you.

• 2:10:30Danny Jones?

  The head of one of these big companies or the head or be able to climb the ladder of one of these big agencies inside the inside of, you know, the United States. Like I've had people in here that explain some of the folks, some of like the

• 2:10:45Speaker 01

  Andy.

• 2:10:46Danny Jones?

  Yeah, Andy's explains. Yeah, I just had him in here with this guy, John Karyaku. And they were talking about some of the people that have made it to the highest ranks inside the CIA. And he's saying, these people aren't, these people, they're like yes men. What they do is they they'll do whatever it takes to please the person above them. So they can essentially climb the ladder.

• 2:11:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's it's a, it's a chameleon.

• 2:11:12Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:11:12Speaker 01

  Effect.

• 2:11:13Danny Jones?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:11:13Speaker 01

  And I think there's, I've studied psychopathy for a very long time. And I think a lot of those positions to get to the top, there's a degree of psychopathy that you need to get up there in in today's world.

• 2:11:28Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 2:11:29Speaker 01

  You've got to be, and I think maybe that's the reason we're looking at what we're looking at, like all psychopathy starts with separation, all of it, everything. So if you just think of ego, me having an ego means I I'm separate from Danny. Right? Me having less of that is like, we're similar. Me having way less of that is like, we're one, we're like the same thing. But if you take ego way to the top, that's, that's where you get psychopathy. You have psychopath behavior there. It's just centralized and everything is different from me. And

• 2:12:07Speaker 01

  those people will memorize like a library card catalog, human emotions and facial expressions and words and phrases and everything that they will ever need to survive in the world and to rise up to the top of leadership. And everybody talks about psychopaths as if they're bad people. I don't think they are, and none of them chose to be that way. And most psychopaths don't even know that they're psychopaths. They just think we're all the same. They think we do what they do. And I think they just recruit a lot of this. And one of the best illustrations of this is Dr. Robert Hare, who's the number one researcher on psychopathy.

• 2:12:47Speaker 01

  He's the guy who developed the checklist, the famous psychopath checklist for to diagnose a psychopath. Um, he said, if you could just imagine yourself in your apartment, you're wanting to go get something to eat. And you say, I'm gonna walk down there to the fried chicken place. I'm gonna go get some fried chicken. So you exit your apartment, you walk down the sidewalk. And within a hundred yards, you see a, some police lights and there's a crash scene. There's a horrible, horrible scene there. Let's say you see a mom holding her little daughter who's passed away and bleeding. And the mom is crying and screaming and all of this.

• 2:13:31Speaker 01

  And the first thought in your head while you're looking at the scene is fried chicken. I'm gonna get that fried chicken. And then turning right to the restaurant and go pick up your food. Getting back to the apartment, eating your chicken. And then after you brush your teeth that night, you're in the, looking at yourself in the mirror going.

• 2:13:51Speaker 01

  Trying to mimic all of those faces that you saw on the street from all the grief and sadness and despair. You just look staring at yourself, doing that in the mirror to practice those facial expressions. That's what a psychopath is.

• 2:14:05Danny Jones?

  And what are the, like, the conditions of, does that develop in early childhood? Does that go back to, is that all about like those first years and when you're a toddler? And how you're raised and what you're exposed to? Does that start then or can that start later?

• 2:14:22Speaker 01

  It can start. It can start later. There's a, there's a genetic and an environmental predispositions that you can have for it. So you can have a genetic predisposition, which means your amygdala is a little bit bigger than it should be. A few of the things going on in your brain. But then you have all of those genetic factors and you have a great childhood. And you don't grow up to be a psychopath. Those genes decide not to express themselves.

• 2:14:46Danny Jones?

  Uh huh.

• 2:14:47Speaker 01

  So then you have somebody else who they get into a traumatic event. Maybe they have, this can even go back to, some cases, they've shown the mother getting sick during the third trimester. Express those genes. There's, I think it's a bunch of theories right now, as far as I know, I'm no expert. But having those genes expressed means that you're born. And the next thing you know, like my kid is shoving needles into our cat or our dog. And just to see, you know, the dog's reaction and stuff like that.

• 2:15:20Danny Jones?

  Jesus.

• 2:15:21Speaker 01

  So you see that at a pretty young age and. There's no way out. There's no counseling, there's no therapy. There's no psychedelic journey that you can go on and like reverse some of that stuff.

• 2:15:35Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 2:15:36Speaker 01

  And it's pretty similar narcissism is maybe. I don't think it's on that spectrum, but narcissism is like high ego, right? It's a high ego problem, but it's rooted in more insecurity. I have seen narcissism. If you go to therapy, if you have narcissistic personality disorder, a diagnostic disorder, and you go to therapy, they're essentially teaching you how to fake stuff. Here's how to ask people questions about themselves. Danny, how are you doing? How's your wife? How's, how's the family going? And, and here's how to be open and vulnerable. Here's how to be a good person. That's just masking. They're not, they're not helping themselves. They're not really changing.

• 2:16:18Speaker 01

  I have seen psychedelics do some amazing stuff with narcissism with people kind of stepping out of their ego. It was a huge deal for me the first time I did it. I felt like I was, like I lost 40 pounds of ego the first time that I, I did psychedelics. And I think maybe a bunch of deployment stuff kind of fell off with that. But it's, it's a great thing to see. And I don't remember where I was going with it.

• 2:16:44Danny Jones?

  Uh, psychopathy and uh, you're saying psychedelics can't fix it?

• 2:16:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, at the end of the day, there's not, there's not a whole lot you can do.

• 2:16:51Danny Jones?

  Has there been, have, has, have people tried to experiment with psychedelics on people that have severe psychopathy or psychopaths?

• 2:16:59Speaker 01

  I'm, I can't cite any research or anything like that. I guarantee you.

• 2:17:02Danny Jones?

  Interesting to see, to get what their reaction would be and to hear them talk about it, put them on like a crazy DMT trip, you know?

• 2:17:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, ayahuasca.

• 2:17:11Danny Jones?

  Or, oh yeah, ayahuasca, right, right, right, right. Yeah, cause ayahuasca has more of an effect, cause this takes forever.

• 2:17:16Speaker 01

  Yes, like 12 hours. Yeah.

• 2:17:19Danny Jones?

  I've never done ayahuasca. The first time I did DMT was with Danny Gohler. When he was on the show.

• 2:17:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:17:24Danny Jones?

  Shout out to Danny for hooking us up.

• 2:17:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:17:28Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I was terrified. I was terrified. Cause I've heard so many stories.

• 2:17:32Speaker 01

  Did he have to kind of like hold your hand and it's okay, it's okay.

• 2:17:36Danny Jones?

  Oh yeah, he was great. He walked me through it, like held my hand and walked me through it like I was a child. Explained to me what to expect. Like we did this Wim Hof breathing thing before it. I don't know what that did. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We did.

• 2:17:49Speaker 01

  I love that. I love doing that. I think, man, there's something. I think the more certain somebody is that they've got life figured out and like what we're doing here on this planet, the more skeptical I am of their opinions. I don't think we have jack shit figured out, man. I don't think we know what this is. Cause this lady was

• 2:18:14Speaker 01

  talking to Stephen Hawking one time, and this is on recording. But he said, well, what happens if you get to the end of the universe? She said, well, that's their end. And he said, okay, so you reach the end. What's on the other side of that? What's outside of that wall?

• 2:18:32Speaker 01

  They're like, we have no clue what any of this stuff is. And I think that's okay. Just for us to say, we don't know yet. And I think that we, we need more scientists that can utter the phrase as far as we know now. Just that one phrase. You don't have to call yourself a dummy. You just have to say, we don't have everything figured out. And every generation thinks they've got it all figured out and laughs at the generation before them. And every generation will get laughed at.

• 2:19:01Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:19:01Speaker 01

  So we're going to have stuff that we believe in right now, that in a couple hundred years will be the equivalent of the earth is flat. Or we're at the center of the entire universe and everything revolves around us.

• 2:19:12Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:19:13Speaker 01

  We'll be laughed at. And we just gotta be okay with that. And just as far as we know right now, just that one phrase, I wish we would hear more often.

• 2:19:21Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I, I, that's why I thought that, that when I first saw Danny's video that he made for his, uh, his documentary about that DMT laser thing, I was just fucking blown away.

• 2:19:30Speaker 01

  Me too. Yeah. So I saw it on, someone ripped it off of TikTok and then stuck it on X and I saw it on X. And I'm a behavior profiler. So I'm watching the video reactions of the people that are seeing the stuff. And then I'm watching Danny's behavior. I was so,

• 2:19:51Speaker 01

  I don't know, intrigued and about what was going on. I tracked Danny's ass down within five minutes, 10 minutes, called him and said, hey dude, I'm gonna fly you to my house. I need you to tell me all about this. I wanna know everything that you know. It's just fascinating to me.

• 2:20:07Danny Jones?

  What were you looking for? Like when you were watching the videos of him talking about it? Like, cause you're obviously, you're, you're trying to sniff out bullshit, right? So like, what, what specifically are you, are you paying attention to when you're, when you watch those videos and listen to people talking?

• 2:20:21Speaker 01

  The first thing would be performance. Am I seeing performative behavior? Someone over-exaggerating a, a reaction to what they're seeing on the wall. Someone zooming in the camera a little bit too much and not trying to get an authentic shot of what's going on. Any kind of over-exaggeration. And them trying to over-explain it to the camera, what they're seeing, and no one tried to explain it. They were just awestruck. They didn't try to say, oh, here's exactly what I'm seeing right away. They, they had that pause of awe, just being in awe for a few seconds.

• 2:20:57Speaker 01

  That, that's what did it for me. And then the humility of Danny's just a super humble, a good dude.

• 2:21:04Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:21:05Speaker 01

  But, and that comes through. That's why a lot of, you don't have to be a profiler for that. You get a gut feeling, like when we get those gut feelings about people. That, those gut feelings are produced by who that person is when we're not looking. Gut feelings are not produced by the behavior in the moment. It's produced by their behavior in the moment being incongruent with who they are off camera or when nobody's looking.

• 2:21:29Danny Jones?

  Right. That's what they call the gut, the second brain, right?

• 2:21:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:21:34Danny Jones?

  Yeah. What do you think's going on there in that, that laser? You think it's ripping a hole in the matrix? You got any ideas? You got any theories?

• 2:21:41Speaker 01

  I have no idea.

• 2:21:41Danny Jones?

  What's your gut tell you?

• 2:21:43Speaker 01

  Well, the gut says that we're seeing something that our bodies were not meant to or not designed to.

• 2:21:53Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 2:21:53Speaker 01

  Like we didn't evolve to see. It would just be like if you, if you did DMT and then found out that you could squeeze your ear really hard and you could see the infrared light spectrum. You know, it would be a weird, you'd be like, oh shit, I can see the heat now. I can see like a snake.

• 2:22:09Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 2:22:10Speaker 01

  And maybe we're seeing something that maybe an animal or, or somebody else has access to already. Maybe it's just another thing that we just don't know about yet. And it's always been there.

• 2:22:19Danny Jones?

  Yeah. So what I saw when I looked into it was I saw like, you know how you could see like the speckles? If you look really close to that laser, you could see all the little speckles. Cause it was projected on a white door when I was looking at it. And I could see like, and he was kind of like guiding me, showing me, like telling me like how to see it. And I was like looking at it and like relaxing my focus. And I was seeing like a pocket of space behind the door.

• 2:22:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:22:44Danny Jones?

  And it was very palpable pocket of space that was behind the door. Like I could almost reach through it and feel like I was seeing through the door.

• 2:22:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:22:52Danny Jones?

  And then I was like looking at all the little moving speckles of light. And then I focused in on those more and tried to look through those more. And then they turned into like gears, all connected to each other.

• 2:23:04Speaker 01

  I saw the gears too.

• 2:23:05Danny Jones?

  Like millions of gears just connected and turning.

• 2:23:10Danny Jones?

  I didn't see any of the code stuff, but like, then again, I was kind of like, this was kind of like three or four minutes after I did the DMT. So I wasn't like in the peak of the experience. It was kind of more of like the, the downward afterwards, the down slope of the, the come down of it or whatever you call it. So I don't know if that had anything to do with it or whatever, or if it just takes, you know, different people see different things. But um,

• 2:23:38Speaker 01

  So I,

• 2:23:38Danny Jones?

  I would love, I would love to see some sort of like, like wide ranging study, like a placebo controlled experiment on this. There could be some money that could get behind it somehow.

• 2:23:51Speaker 01

  Yeah. I'd rather see.

• 2:23:55Speaker 01

  10,000 people experience it, then some study at a university. I'd rather have a huge movement.

• 2:24:03Speaker 01

  Because that would fund the study by itself, just so many people. And there's a, I think there's like a subreddit on it as well. But I, what I'd like to see is what would happen if I have like ski goggles? Now, just humor me for a second. And this is what I was thinking, like after I did it the first time. So what if I had ski goggles that had like white? Like almost like a wax paper surface to them. So like if translucent, but not transparent. You know, so the outside of the ski goggles would look like the back of my iPhone. And somehow project a laser onto that entire surface from outside. So you're looking at this.

• 2:24:44Danny Jones?

  So it's like diffusing it?

• 2:24:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, so it's diffusing laser light, but you're, you can kind of move your head and look. So now you can, now you're physically able to move where you're looking.

• 2:24:55Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:24:56Speaker 01

  So you'd need some kind of little head apparatus to like shine it down.

• 2:24:59Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:25:00Speaker 01

  And diffuse it on your, your face. And Danny said that green and blue lasers have different code.

• 2:25:06Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:25:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:25:09Speaker 01

  You see different type of code. And everybody sees the same different type of code.

• 2:25:15Danny Jones?

  Huh.

• 2:25:16Speaker 01

  Which I thought was fascinating.

• 2:25:17Danny Jones?

  Yeah, that's bizarre, man. It's just like, I can't get through, I can't, I can't figure out with this DMT stuff. If it's like, is this just like the inner parts of the brain just opening up? And like showing you things that you don't normally see?

• 2:25:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:25:33Danny Jones?

  You know, that whole brain filter hypothesis? How like the, there's so much more in this space that we're in that we can't perceive? Because our brain just filters everything down for us to be able to survive and get through the day and eat and stuff like that. But if you, if you take this DMT or psychedelic or whatever it is, it strips away this barrier. And now you're exposed to more of what's already really there.

• 2:25:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, all right, I'll go deep really quick on this one. If observing something collapses wave function.

• 2:26:06Danny Jones?

  Yes.

• 2:26:07Speaker 01

  And our ability to see and like interpret things is expanded by DMT.

• 2:26:15Speaker 01

  Then are we seeing something that is there, but is also that I'm a huge, I'm obsessed with Carl Hume, all of his work. Are we seeing some kind of collective? Code that we are all kind of co-creating? Are we all collapsing that? So then the, the one time that I, I have done DMT, I somehow I was shown this map of the world of gravity. Like if you could map like, you know, like Verizon has that coverage map, right? But what if you could map where the gravity centers are?

• 2:26:58Speaker 01

  Um, in the inside of like, I could see all the Smoky Mountains up in the Northeast. I could see all the Rocky Mountains down in like the southwestern area. And they were empty. Because no one was observing the inside of the, the mountains. And the gravity was concentrated in the cities where people were collapsing wave function. I saw that on DMT. Not saying that there's some science behind it, but I just thought that was unbelievable.

• 2:27:24Danny Jones?

  And you were looking at some sort of map?

• 2:27:26Speaker 01

  The, like a map of this country. Where you could see like New York, LA, Houston, Chicago, where, where all this gravity was centered right around those areas. Yeah.

• 2:27:38Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 2:27:39Speaker 01

  So ever since that day, I always thought in terms of like, maybe this is some kind of a wave function, form of collapsing of a wave function.

• 2:27:47Danny Jones?

  Right. Yeah. Like is that parking lot really out there right now?

• 2:27:51Speaker 01

  Well, it is for the Uber drivers and that.

• 2:27:55Danny Jones?

  Yeah. But if no one was observing it, would it be there?

• 2:27:57Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:27:58Danny Jones?

  Yeah, that's wild to think about, man. So how long did it take you to write this book?

• 2:28:06Speaker 01

  It's been, it's probably five years.

• 2:28:08Danny Jones?

  Five years?

• 2:28:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:28:09Danny Jones?

  And you were saying that the, um, the epileptic episodes were what inspired it?

• 2:28:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. It started on setting and I'm just worried that I'm, I'm going to go downhill and I need to dump everything that's inside of my brain that I teach to intel people, to companies, everything, all in one book.

• 2:28:29Danny Jones?

  And was that was the the act of writing was that therapeutic for it at all? Did that did that help you? Or was that just sort of? Was it more of just a drive from this? This health scare that you were having?

• 2:28:44Speaker 01

  I think it was a drive from the health scare. It was therapeutic, knowing that like, if I can get this done, then like I have a parachute for my kids.

• 2:28:54Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:28:55Speaker 01

  And the the third part, I think, is also hypergraphia. It's just that that that side effect of temporal lobe epilepsy. Just an impulsive need to write nonstop. I would fill like one of these up every two months, just nonstop. So I wrote my first.

• 2:29:12Danny Jones?

  So you were writing with like with a pen and paper, not typing?

• 2:29:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:29:16Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 2:29:17Speaker 01

  So I wrote this on paper first with like a pencil.

• 2:29:22Speaker 01

  Not word for word, but.

• 2:29:23Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:29:24Speaker 01

  Most of the book and took three or four of those things. Loykterm, whatever you call.

• 2:29:29Danny Jones?

  Was there anything so so going back to the epilepsy stuff? Was there anything other than the methylene blue that helped you?

• 2:29:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. Just going on one journey, like a mushroom journey, like a four and a half, five gram journey. That was significant to kind of start kicking everything off. Then taking a daily turkey tail, then I mix in beetroot and then very high dose melatonin, super high dose.

• 2:30:01Danny Jones?

  Really? Melatonin?

• 2:30:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. High dose melatonin is one of the most powerful, absolutely powerful. It's I put it up there with methylene blue. And high dose melatonin is one of the most powerful antioxidants in the world. And it's made in your brain. And most people are like, well, if I take a lot of it, my body's not going to produce your body. There's no rebound effect whatsoever. But the thing is that your liver will destroy 80 to 90% of melatonin when you take it orally. So what you usually take from like Walgreens or CVS is like a two milligram, maybe a four milligram. I take 200 at sunset. And it's a suppository.

• 2:30:45Danny Jones?

  Suppository?

• 2:30:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. I'll show you how to put it in.

• 2:30:49Danny Jones?

  Wow, that's dedication.

• 2:30:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. So it. It bypasses the liver.

• 2:30:55Danny Jones?

  Oh, okay.

• 2:30:56Speaker 01

  That's called the first pass effect. So when our liver, the, all the processes in our liver just destroy that melatonin. So when you take melatonin through a suppository, you're absorbing like 90% instead of destroying 90%. And it's also, it helps to get rid of reactive oxygen species, reactive nitrogen species, just like methylene blue. And it's also radio protective. It can protect your body from radiation damage.

• 2:31:22Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:31:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:31:24Danny Jones?

  So like going on an airplane, you'll take it before an airplane ride?

• 2:31:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, take it before an airplane ride. I, I won't say that this is some, maybe it's proven in some study, but I went to Jamaica and we, we go to Jamaica two or three times a year.

• 2:31:37Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:31:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. So I will take melatonin and I never, and I burn easily. I'm just like a basic white dude. I will burn pretty easily in the sun. I'll take melatonin and I will do not need sunscreen. It's unbelievable.

• 2:31:51Danny Jones?

  Wow. Yeah, I heard that they have a, they have a lot of big psychedelic mushroom farms down there.

• 2:31:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're totally legal.

• 2:31:59Danny Jones?

  Yeah. Yeah. A lot of the folks that are farming it and processing it down there are companies here that are like getting it all done down, down there to like get through like the legal loopholes from what I understand.

• 2:32:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:32:12Danny Jones?

  And there's a, it's a pretty, like a booming market down there. But there's also a ton of, I heard there's like a ton of crime down there as well.

• 2:32:19Speaker 01

  And that's only if you're in the city, like Kingston.

• 2:32:21Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:32:22Speaker 01

  Like if you're in Kingston or any of the big, big cities. There's some, but it's not that bad.

• 2:32:28Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:32:29Speaker 01

  I stay up in the, like the very top of the island in the middle part, which is called Ocho Rios. And it's, it's unbelievable, man.

• 2:32:39Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:32:39Speaker 01

  Great, great spot. Like in, in Western society, we compete with each other just as a, as a, like a standard default. Let's compete on status and wealth and popularity and all of that stuff.

• 2:32:51Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:32:51Speaker 01

  And this, it's almost like a national culture for the Jamaican people just to kind of compete on gratitude. And it's, it's not something like they teach in school. It's just a, it's just how it is. And it is. I've never been to, I've been to a bunch of countries. I've been all over the world. I've never been to a place where there's so little ego.

• 2:33:17Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:33:17Speaker 01

  And so much enjoyment. Yeah.

• 2:33:19Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 2:33:20Speaker 01

  Just the, the most incredible human beings on earth.

• 2:33:23Danny Jones?

  What is it about Jamaica that makes it like that?

• 2:33:25Speaker 01

  I don't know. I think it's the people and the culture, just how, how they are, how they grew up. And the, the native Jamaicans were more like Mayan. They had more of a Mayan appearance. And Columbus and his crew murdered like 99% of them.

• 2:33:42Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:33:44Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:33:44Speaker 01

  It's a sad story, but Jamaica is like.

• 2:33:47Danny Jones?

  Epigenetic trauma?

• 2:33:49Speaker 01

  Yeah. But man, it's those people, it's, it's so hard to explain. Like the people, like just the first time I got to Jamaica, here's, here's an example. I, we were walking out in the main part of the town and there's a homeless guy walking past us, like we're about to pass this guy that's very obviously either homeless or, you know, very close to being homeless. And as he's approaching us, I'm instantly is this Western brain of mine is like, he's gonna ask for money. I've got to say, oh, you know, sorry, I don't have the cash. Uh, all he said was like, it's your first time? And we're like, yeah, it's our first time to Jamaica. He's like, I hope it's the best time ever.

• 2:34:34Speaker 01

  And he just kept on walking.

• 2:34:35Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:34:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, didn't wait. And like, as a Western person, I cannot process, why would he stop? What, how does it benefit him? Cause that was what was in my head. Like that's how we think in our society. Why would someone do something that doesn't benefit themselves?

• 2:34:52Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:34:53Speaker 01

  And that culture is not wired that way.

• 2:34:58Speaker 01

  So I'll give you the second time we went, we went to the same hotel. And the guy that, the guy who gets your bag at the front of the hotel, his name's Kirk. He grabbed our bags. He tells me and my wife, hey Chase, hey Michelle. Then the person at the front desk said, hey Chase, hey Michelle. Person upstairs, the maid walking down the hallway said, hey Chase, hey Michelle. But people that I don't remember even talking to. So I asked later on, I asked one of the managers, like, whatever CRM you guys use to like, get the employees to memorize, uh, people's names is unbelievable. And she said, we don't do that. They actually remember your name.

• 2:35:36Speaker 01

  It's because that's the my Western brain thinking.

• 2:35:40Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:35:40Speaker 01

  Why would it benefit them? But they just genuinely care. And I can't, it's so hard for our culture to process that. Man, it's a magical place.

• 2:35:50Danny Jones?

  Yeah, no, I've been to a few places on trips where it's similar to that, you know, like when you go to another place like in the Caribbean or like Central America, Costa Rica, any of those places, and you spend enough time down there. There's this like weird thing that happens to you when you're there and then you come back and then you're kind of like shocked by normal society. It's this like you, you have this realization like, wow, like shit is way better down there.

• 2:36:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:36:18Danny Jones?

  It's not as like high stress. You know, dopamine slaves attached to screens all day, every day that are like constantly trying to compete for attention. It's just, and it just makes you.

• 2:36:32Speaker 01

  You're like Neo going back into the pods.

• 2:36:34Danny Jones?

  Yeah, yeah, that, yeah, that is what it's like. It really is, man.

• 2:36:39Speaker 01

  It is, it's, it's like you're closer to reality. Like the real, what, what reality actually is down there. Cause we are, I mean, there's a French philosopher named Jean Baudrillard, have you ever heard of him?

• 2:36:51Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I have heard of him.

• 2:36:52Speaker 01

  Okay, he wrote this book Simulation and Simulacra. To where everything around us nowadays is a simulation of something. Walmart is a simulation of a market and then you look at the food, there's a picture of it that doesn't represent what the actual food looks like. So it's symbols that point to symbols that point to symbols. You go to Disneyland, it's just like, that's the idea of what our society is like. Can we make a hyper real and a hyper perfect simulation of something that is real? And then 90% of Disneyland is a simulation of something that has no original. Like Cinderella.

• 2:37:29Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:37:30Speaker 01

  Or Peter Pan, or, or fill in the blanks. So it's, it's a simulation of a simulation that has no original.

• 2:37:38Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:37:39Speaker 01

  So we continue to get this labeling and it's just arrows that point to something. And most of those arrows are just kind of pointing in a circular way that don't have any origin to point back to. So, so much of our life is a simulated thing. The lights fake. The signs are fake. You go to McDonald's, you know, you know damn well, the burger's not going to look like it does on the menu. Everything, we're just so.

• 2:38:03Danny Jones?

  Hyper-normalization.

• 2:38:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, we prefer it and we vote for the candidate that fakes it the best. We vote for people that have, that just say the right words. That's all we need them to do. And if you go like, look at an analysis on any news channel, all the news channels, why did this side lose? Or why did this side win? They said the right things. We, well, we should have said this and we should have aligned with this group and said these things. It's all about artificialness.

• 2:38:28Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:38:28Speaker 01

  And that was what Jean Baudrillard was really writing about. It was like, we're living, we weren't, even if it's not digital, we're in the simulation. We're in a weird simulated reality anyway.

• 2:38:39Danny Jones?

  Yeah. No, and, and it's in the most developed societies too, where it's like, some of the stuff that we were talking about earlier on that big graph of like, when you think about the, the foundation of the mammalian brain and the drives, like the human drives, that is what, like, we're compelled to innovate and get better and acquire more. And that's sort of what is like this never-ending cycle that civilization is on, to advance more and to make more money and to make more things, which disconnects us even more and more from nature.

• 2:39:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:39:15Danny Jones?

  And if you go to the cultures that aren't doing any of that, that aren't paying attention to it, that aren't, you know, caught up in this, you know, cyclical loop, trying to increase their GDP or focus on all these things that are also huge stressors on our bodies. I feel like it's that's that's what gives you that shock of like sort of stepping out of the matrix for a little bit. And um, I wonder, you know, I wonder all the time, like how how many cycles like this has civilization gone through? Has this happened before?

• 2:39:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:39:45Danny Jones?

  You know, have we just killed ourselves with technology and innovation? And but the thing is, it's like, how do you evolve out of that, though? Like, how do it's a it's a evolution, it's millions of years of evolution that have got us to this point. So how do you break the loop or get on another pathway? It seems like it's almost impossible for us to get on a correct course, right? It seems like we're on this bullet train to annihilation.

• 2:40:11Speaker 01

  It really does. And you go to these cultures that that don't have that, like when you go down there, you said Costa Rica or Jamaica, it's it's like you feel like 15 pounds lighter and you wonder like, what's different? And you're wondering like, oh, maybe I slept well, maybe I ate something different. No, it's just you're and you're surrounded by real people.

• 2:40:29Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:40:30Speaker 01

  In a real environment, there's probably nature all around you, which is exactly what your ancestors experienced. You're just closer to not confusing the shit out of the ancestors that are kind of living in our head. And if you think about the cells in our bodies, if we're eating cells and we're eating stuff that our ancestors' cells don't wouldn't understand, we get sick.

• 2:40:52Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:40:53Speaker 01

  That's all it is. And I think we're we're just seeing it. It feels different because we're in a place where our bodies were designed to be. We're in with real people.

• 2:41:05Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:41:05Speaker 01

  We're in with a community, and we live in a town or we're in a city that's small enough that reputation matters. That's the biggest thing. Like, if I live in a if I'm in New York City, my reputation doesn't matter at all. I could you can be rude to everyone.

• 2:41:23Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:41:23Speaker 01

  Because you'll never see them again.

• 2:41:24Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:41:25Speaker 01

  We don't depend on our tribe anymore. And if we stop depending on tribe, we lose empathy. And then you have things like the bystander effect.

• 2:41:33Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:41:33Speaker 01

  People just step over a murder victim, which has happened before.

• 2:41:37Danny Jones?

  It's a fusion of responsibility.

• 2:41:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. And there's a great video about this, where they did a Study at Liverpool Street Station in London. And this woman laid on the ground and like people were stepping over her. She was holding her stomach begging for help. Not just kind of like laying there. She was openly calling out for help and crying out in pain. And people were just stepping over her.

• 2:42:00Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:42:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:01Danny Jones?

  When was this done?

• 2:42:02Speaker 01

  I don't know. Philip Zimbardo, the guy.

• 2:42:04Danny Jones?

  Philip Zimbardo.

• 2:42:05Speaker 01

  The guy who ran the Stanford Prison Experiment. He has a new thing on YouTube. Oh, it's not new.

• 2:42:09Danny Jones?

  The Stanford Prison Experiment?

• 2:42:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:11Danny Jones?

  I haven't heard of that.

• 2:42:13Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh. Let's not do that.

• 2:42:15Danny Jones?

  I'm living under a rock.

• 2:42:16Speaker 01

  Leave that door shut.

• 2:42:19Danny Jones?

  Don't tell me to leave it shut. Now I want to crack it open.

• 2:42:22Speaker 01

  So he, Dr. Zimbardo did this experiment where essentially people. We got a hundred college students and I made a fake prison inside of an academic building. And I said, you 50 are prisoners. You 50 are guards. No rules. Prisoners, go get in your cell and then like boom, just let it go. And it talked about how fast authority, even if it's fake, authority can start corrupting and like abuse of power. So everybody got pissed off that Dr. Zimbardo did that experiment. So he started a YouTube channel. He's an older guy. He's probably 78 or so now. Called the Heroic Imagination Project. And man, is it good.

• 2:43:07Speaker 01

  It talks about all these experiments, but then how you can not fall into those traps. How can you get out of getting your head in the bystander effect? But just looking at the bystander effect, it's a funny phenomenon. But if I explain to you, let's say I walked in here this morning. This first time we met each other was today. I said, Danny, you wouldn't believe that was outside of my hotel. And people were filming a woman getting stabbed. A guy was standing there and filming a woman getting stabbed to death. You would think that was person was a psychopath. That is the behavior of a psychopath, but it's the collective behavior of everyone in large cities.

• 2:43:46Danny Jones?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:43:47Speaker 01

  So Dr. Robert Hare, who we talked about before, said psychopaths are attracted to large cities. I think large cities are factories for psychopathy.

• 2:43:56Danny Jones?

  Whoa.

• 2:43:58Speaker 01

  All of the behaviors that we talk about with crowd psychology and how crowds behave and how they don't help each other. It's all psychopathic behavior, but it's universal because it's in a large city and everybody, oh, everybody does it. It's not a big deal.

• 2:44:14Speaker 01

  It's psychopathy, but it's temporary. So if I I lived in a semi-large cities in Chesapeake, Virginia, and I moved in the the population of the town I live in right now is 2,000.

• 2:44:28Danny Jones?

  That's nice.

• 2:44:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:44:30Danny Jones?

  The population of this town is like 2 million.

• 2:44:32Speaker 01

  It's crazy. That's but like.

• 2:44:34Danny Jones?

  And then combined like like combine that with just all the information that we're bombarded with every day. You know what I mean? Like there's just so like an overwhelming amount of information to the point where it's almost worse than having. It's almost better to have less information than it is to have more information. And people are are obsessed with just getting as much information as possible every single day.

• 2:44:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:45:00Danny Jones?

  And we're and, you know, it's like, which is a huge thing that comes up in this podcast. As you are well aware, when we try to Google something, it's hard to find the truth.

• 2:45:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:45:10Danny Jones?

  Of any on anything, you know, depending on where you're looking or who's, you know, giving you that information or what their sources are. So like, I wonder how that is going to affect people or how, you know, how it affects people today. And then how it's going to affect people in the future, how it even affects like the human brain when it's like, you know, and and we know, we know that for the most part, that we're getting information that's tainted or skewed in one direction or another. We're well aware of it.

• 2:45:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:45:39Speaker 01

  And I'd say. Worrying about the future is just us right now making those choices. Maybe just, just a hundred of us right now listening or 10,000 people that are listening right now is I'm going to prioritize my kids getting in nature, getting away from that blue light and doing everything that that Jack was talking about and just getting, getting my kids to a place where I'm, I'm going to, I'll sacrifice for them. I'll move out of the city or I'm going to get to a place where it's, I don't need a lot of information. You know what the front page of the newspaper of my, the town I live in was just a week ago when it showed up? A stolen bike. Front page news. A bicycle was stolen. And that's,

• 2:46:22Speaker 01

  that's, me seeing that as bad news was beautiful. Like that's, I want to just wake up to that as the news that I get. What's going on around my community that I need? Our brains were not designed to handle over maybe three, 400 people.

• 2:46:38Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:46:39Speaker 01

  It's just not, that's why empathy disappears. That's why psychopathy starts coming in. We, we can't have empathy for that many people. We, we just can't. We're not possible.

• 2:46:49Danny Jones?

  Yeah. Speaking of overwhelming amounts of information coming in, I know you talked about it on that video you sent me, but um, what, what are your thoughts on those New Jersey drones and like what the possibilities are for it? And do you think there is some sort of like modern strategic deception? Or do you think this could be some sort of like limited hangout that's still happening like across the media or to get people to divert their attention somewhere else to distract them?

• 2:47:22Speaker 01

  So for any, give you like a, a quick rule of thumb. For any weird thing that happens, I ask myself three, maybe three or four questions here. Number one, is it happening in proximity to a large political event like an election or an inauguration? Number two, am I seeing it repeated on multiple news cycles where people using, are using similar phrases? Like if I spot similar phrases, I'm seeing a psyop. So if I'm seeing copy paste along seven different networks and they're all kind of saying the same thing, I'm seeing something that might be a psyop. And the next would be.

• 2:48:06Speaker 01

  If I'm not seeing the government intervene in what's going on and they're remaining semi silent, they put out a statement today. I don't know if you saw that.

• 2:48:15Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:48:16Speaker 01

  Some kind of statement and it was just the most meaningless blather. It was like a, just a couple of paragraphs.

• 2:48:22Danny Jones?

  Who put it out?

• 2:48:24Speaker 01

  I don't remember.

• 2:48:25Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 2:48:26Speaker 01

  I don't know, but you just probably type in government statement drones and it'll, it'll be coming up. But if you're seeing, it's close to a political event, it's being repeated and then the final way to tell if something is a psyop is stories evolve over time. If you never hear anything about it, if something is a psyop, it tends to go away after it has served its purpose. So you're not going to hear anymore about the drone. If it's a psyop, you're not going to keep hearing about it if it's serving its purpose. Cause when psyops are in play, they're in play and then they're out. Then they're, then they're done with the news cycle because someone's influencing the news cycle to serve

• 2:49:08Speaker 01

  a purpose and it no longer serves the purpose. So now go back to talking about whatever, something else. So you see something disappear from the news cycle, just rewind and look at what the event was that was hiding underneath it.

• 2:49:25Danny Jones?

  This is ABC. Having closely examined the technical data and tips from concerned citizens, we assess that the sightings of the, uh, they are included a combination of lawful commercial drones, hobbyist drones, law enforcement drones, as well as manned fixed wing aircrafts, helicopters, and STARS mistakenly reported as drones. The joint statement said, whose joint statement is this? Click on the joint statement link.

• 2:49:49Danny Jones?

  The whole, the Homeland Security DHS, FBI, FAA, and DOD joint statement. December 16th, yesterday. Wow.

• 2:50:00Speaker 01

  It's nothing.

• 2:50:00Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 2:50:02Speaker 01

  It's, the whole thing says nothing.

• 2:50:07Danny Jones?

  That's insane. Well, to give them credit, if they are looking like for what some people think to be is some sort of rogue nuclear weapon, you don't want to let the people know that. It's going to sow complete chaos in society. US NRC. Okay, what is this website? What is NRC?

• 2:50:24Danny Jones?

  Nuclear Regulatory Commission. Okay, uh, event notification report for December 13th, 2024. Three days, like four days ago, US Nuclear Regulatory Commission Operations Center. All right, what are we looking at here? What is this?

• 2:50:40Speaker 01

  So, uh, nuke or a piece of nuclear material went missing.

• 2:50:46Speaker 01

  So even if like, let's say a dentist's office gets robbed and they get an X-ray machine stolen. That that machine most likely runs off of something called cobalt, which is a radioactive element.

• 2:50:57Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 2:50:57Speaker 01

  And that has to get reported. It's a big deal.

• 2:51:01Danny Jones?

  Oh, really?

• 2:51:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. So there are, even if you like, you order, let's say you ordered,

• 2:51:08Speaker 01

  uh, thirty elevator counterweights.

• 2:51:11Danny Jones?

  Go up, Steve.

• 2:51:12Speaker 01

  So you know, have you ever been in an elevator and you see the, like a glass elevator? You see those giant?

• 2:51:16Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 2:51:17Speaker 01

  Stack of like lead weights that kind of go up and down to counterweight the elevator.

• 2:51:21Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:51:21Speaker 01

  If you order a bunch of those, you'll be on an FBI watch list. Cause you can shield these things and hide these things using big, thick pieces of lead. And the cheapest and most effective way to do that is using elevator counterweights that you can buy at a junkyard. And a lot of times if you go to a, a place that makes granite countertops or anything like that, granite can set off a, a large concentration of lots of granite, like a truck full of granite. Can also hide it because granite gives off radioactive isotopes all the time that are harmless. But it's, it, it can give off the same kind of signature radioactive isotope. So I'm not an expert in any of this.

• 2:52:01Danny Jones?

  So you're saying the lead of those elevator weights can shield radiation?

• 2:52:06Speaker 01

  Can shield it from being detected, yeah.

• 2:52:07Danny Jones?

  Okay. Okay, so this is saying that the Nazha Cancer Center is the licensee of, okay, whatever that means, Newfield, New Jersey, license number, um, emergency class is non-emergency, organization, dental, Glenn Dental, is this guy's name, I guess, or that's the organization?

• 2:52:32Speaker 01

  Or maybe it was, it was, oh, this is Dentel.

• 2:52:36Danny Jones?

  Oh, Dentel, okay.

• 2:52:39Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:52:39Danny Jones?

  Uh, keep going. Event text, agreement, state report, source, lost in transit. The following information was provided in the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection via email. The licensee reported to NJDEP on December 3rd, 2024, that the GE68 PIN source that they sent for disposal has been lost in transit on December 2nd. What is that? The GE68 PIN source?

• 2:53:04Speaker 01

  Let's Google that.

• 2:53:05Danny Jones?

  Yeah. Copy and paste that into Google.

• 2:53:08Speaker 01

  Maybe Grok.

• 2:53:12Speaker 01

  Maybe not Google.

• 2:53:14Danny Jones?

  Yeah, maybe not Google. Yeah, copy that and put it in the Grok.

• 2:53:18Danny Jones?

  This is, it's a specialized radioactive calibration tool used in medical imaging, particularly. Oh.

• 2:53:26Speaker 04

  That's what that was. Okay, so this is the model right here, because whenever I Googled that.

• 2:53:31Danny Jones?

  Oh, it was sent for disposal. Go back to the, the report?

• 2:53:37Danny Jones?

  Okay, it was sent for disposal and it has been lost in transit on December 2nd, 2024. The source is Eckert and Ziegler model, HEGL0132, which current, uh, with current approximate activity of 0.267 MCI, uh, shipping container arrived at its destination damaged and empty. The licensee has filed claims with the shipper. Uh, if the source is not located within 30 days, the licensee will follow up with a full written report to include, uh, the root causes and corrective actions. Interesting. What does this say? Event contains, the material event contains a less than CAT 3 level of radioactive material.

• 2:54:21Danny Jones?

  Is not safely managed or secured or protected could cause permanent injury to a person who handled it or otherwise contains huh.

• 2:54:29Speaker 01

  So that was December 3rd. Is there a more recent? If you go to the top, it says incident numbers and they're in blue or event numbers. This is 57455. There's 57456 that happened afterward.

• 2:54:44Speaker 04

  You want to go to this one, the first one?

• 2:54:46Speaker 01

  No, we're on 55 right now.

• 2:54:48Speaker 04

  How about 70, I don't know.

• 2:54:50Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 2:54:51Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 2:54:51Speaker 01

  You got the steering wheel.

• 2:54:53Speaker 04

  All the way at the bottom. Okay, so invalid actuation of containment isolation valves.

• 2:55:00Speaker 01

  Probably not it.

• 2:55:03Danny Jones?

  Interesting. So this is saying some sort of like, uh, some sort of medical CAT scanner device or something like that went missing off of a shipping container that was damaged?

• 2:55:13Speaker 01

  They shot one down, NYPD did last night.

• 2:55:16Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:55:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. There's, if you go on Twitter right now and type in drone shot down NYPD.

• 2:55:28Danny Jones?

  This drone was shot down recently in New Jersey, apparently.

• 2:55:33Speaker 01

  Now, there's a picture of the NYPD holding it with the black beanies on and stuff. Yeah, they're shooting them down.

• 2:55:42Danny Jones?

  Whoa, keep going. See if you can find a cool picture.

• 2:55:45Speaker 01

  For like eight bucks, if you have a 12 gauge, for I think eight or nine dollars, you can get a box of shells that have a net that's designed to shoot down drones.

• 2:55:54Danny Jones?

  Really? And it captures them?

• 2:55:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, capture when the net.

• 2:55:57Danny Jones?

  No way.

• 2:55:59Speaker 01

  Super cheap.

• 2:56:00Danny Jones?

  Go to media, click on media.

• 2:56:12Danny Jones?

  No photos?

• 2:56:13Speaker 01

  Wait, take off NJ.

• 2:56:16Danny Jones?

  Just drone shot down NYPD.

• 2:56:21Speaker 01

  There it is. On the left, far left, right there.

• 2:56:24Danny Jones?

  That one? Whoa. Holy smokes.

• 2:56:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:56:33Speaker 05

  Yo, can you interview James for me, man? Ask him what happened?

• 2:56:37Speaker 04

  So did you get in contact with the culprit?

• 2:56:40Speaker 05

  Hey, it's on.

• 2:56:44Speaker 05

  Yo, James, how you doing?

• 2:56:44Speaker 01

  So Amagi Incorporated is funded by BlackRock.

• 2:56:52Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 2:56:53Speaker 01

  Steve, will you look that up?

• 2:56:54Danny Jones?

  What is Amagi Inc.?

• 2:56:57Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:56:57Danny Jones?

  Introducing ammonia as energy.

• 2:57:00Speaker 01

  Okay, so now go, uh, go back to Grok and just type in, uh,

• 2:57:08Speaker 01

  Amagi BlackRock.

• 2:57:13Danny Jones?

  Amagi Inc. and BlackRock's relationship, investment firmship. Ooh, BlackRock has indeed invested in Amagi Inc. This relationship was highlighted in various posts on X through the news article. Okay, but what does that mean? That, that BlackRock invested in Amagi?

• 2:57:27Speaker 01

  Uh, it's just BlackRock's like in the middle of everything that's going on.

• 2:57:30Danny Jones?

  Yeah, I mean, they invest in so much shit.

• 2:57:32Speaker 01

  Even the kid who shot Trump.

• 2:57:34Danny Jones?

  Yeah, there was in a BlackRock commercial, right? How crazy is that?

• 2:57:38Speaker 01

  It's like it.

• 2:57:39Danny Jones?

  Now, is that like one of those things we're talking about? Is that like strategic deception? You know, is that like the monkey mask in the cockpit, having him in a BlackRock commercial?

• 2:57:47Speaker 01

  I don't know. It just seems like this was made for TV. Everything that's happened in the last five years.

• 2:57:53Danny Jones?

  Yes.

• 2:57:54Speaker 01

  Straight out of, what did Joe Rogan say? He said like, this season of America is.

• 2:58:00Danny Jones?

  Is the wildest.

• 2:58:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:58:01Danny Jones?

  Yeah, it's the wildest one yet. Too many, there's too many answers to this. It's almost like they want us chasing our tails.

• 2:58:09Speaker 01

  Overload.

• 2:58:10Danny Jones?

  Yes, it is overload. I don't know, you pulled this one up. I don't even know who Benny Hinn is.

• 2:58:16Speaker 01

  Oh, he's the, wait, really quick. So Benny Hinn is a evangelical pastor.

• 2:58:24Danny Jones?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:58:25Speaker 01

  He is world renowned for healing and, and using the spirit of God to heal people and all that stuff and.

• 2:58:40Danny Jones?

  These people are all falling over. Oh my God. It's hilarious.

• 2:58:48Speaker 01

  Let me start by saying this.

• 2:58:51Speaker 01

  There's a chance and a maybe a good possibility. He believes that what he's doing is the Lord's work.

• 2:59:00Speaker 01

  That he's not deliberately using hypnosis and all that kind of stuff. There's a chance because you hear him say, I don't know how this all works. I don't know what's going on.

• 2:59:08Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 2:59:09Speaker 01

  So maybe, maybe that's true. And I'll just go off of that assumption. I'll just, we'll assume the best.

• 2:59:16Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 2:59:16Speaker 01

  About him. So when a stage hypnosis show starts and we're talking like, have you ever been to one?

• 2:59:23Danny Jones?

  No.

• 2:59:24Speaker 01

  Like a comedy hypnosis?

• 2:59:25Danny Jones?

  No.

• 2:59:26Speaker 01

  They are, you need to go. If you ever have a chance, they're worth it.

• 2:59:30Danny Jones?

  Okay. Is this guy still in, in business?

• 2:59:32Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 2:59:33Danny Jones?

  I'll have to go to one of his if he's still around.

• 2:59:37Speaker 01

  No, I mean a hypnosis show, an actual hypnosis.

• 2:59:40Danny Jones?

  Oh, this is not a-

• 2:59:40Speaker 01

  Like at a comedy club.

• 2:59:41Danny Jones?

  Oh, oh, no, no, no.

• 2:59:43Speaker 01

  So in a comedy club or a mass group hypnosis show where you would demonstrate hypnosis. One of the first things you do is kind of get the crowd riled up. But the second thing you do is demonize the people who are not going to go into trance. Demonize those people. And so I got a good friend of mine, Rich Guzzi. He's a stage hypnotist, comedian, hilarious dude. He starts off his act by saying,

• 3:00:12Speaker 01

  "You might be one of these people, but there's always one dickhead. There's always one dickhead who won't go along with the crowd. There's always going to be one of those people. You might be that person. If you're looking around the table, you don't see one of them, you, maybe you're that person." So it's always, I, you want people to dis-identify. So remember, it's talking about identity. Who am I? So there's always going to be one of those people. And so what we're going to be doing is something that's good for you. It's something that's fun. No photography is going to be allowed. So just automatically addressing all the concerns very covertly, but without anybody asking any questions.

• 3:00:48Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:00:49Speaker 01

  And then some people are worried about this. So here, let me tell you what hypnosis is. It's not a coma. It's not sleep. You're not going to be deaf. You'll hear my voice the entire time. You're going to remain in complete control. You're going to be doing this voluntarily, absolutely voluntarily, and it's going to feel absolutely fantastic. And 15 minutes of hypnosis is like a three hour nap. It's equal to a three hour nap. I made all those statistics up, but it would sound something like that. Right. So this crowd is primed as tribal hypnosis, and you'll see people do this to convince people of facts. Like if you watch the John Oliver Show, for example, it'll be a rapid fact that they want

• 3:01:30Speaker 01

  you to believe, followed by immediate laughter. So you're not really criticizing it. You're hearing a lot of other people laughing so that your brain focuses on tribe and says, "Okay, lots of people are laughing. It must be true." Bam, and they'll throw a joke in there before you can critically analyze any of the information. Does that make sense? Yeah. And that's every episode. Many different shows, not just John. So what's happening is, so hypnosis is a mixture of suggestibility, focus, and dissociation. Just those three things. So what creates the suggestibility is expectancy. Remember, we talked about that. That was one of the things on the six things that influence human beings.

• 3:02:14Speaker 01

  So expectancy means I know what's going to happen when I walk up on the stage. I know what's going to happen when he waves his coat. If you do a blind placebo study, where he goes up to a bunch of strangers at a Yankees game and waves his coat, they're all going to be like, "What is this guy doing?" Because there's no expectancy that happens there. But these people know what's going to happen. Right. So if I'm at a, let's say, one thing that people think is really cool that I can do, I can take somebody in a, like in the middle of a bar or restaurant and just drop them on the ground like that. And they'll just lay there, five, 10, 15, 20 minutes, just like they're unconscious.

• 3:02:55Speaker 01

  But one of the ways I do it is building a lot of expectancy and compliance, expectancy and compliance. So let's say I'm doing that. Let me show you how this works in a bar and then you'll, I want you to make the correlations yourself.

• 3:03:06Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 3:03:08Speaker 01

  So let's say, have you ever been hypnotized before?

• 3:03:10Danny Jones?

  No.

• 3:03:10Speaker 01

  Okay. Well, it's actually a fun experience and there's different ways that some people can go deeply into hypnosis, some people can't. If you have an IQ below 90, you can't be hypnotized. It's been proven.

• 3:03:21Danny Jones?

  Explains why I haven't been hypnotized.

• 3:03:23Speaker 01

  I made that up.

• 3:03:24Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 3:03:24Speaker 01

  But so do you see what I'm starting to do? I'm starting to go down the, remember I told you, one of the needs is intelligence.

• 3:03:29Danny Jones?

  Hmm.

• 3:03:31Speaker 01

  And so we call the ability to be hypnotized unconscious power. And some people have low power, some people have high power. So now I'm addressing strength and power needs, right? So some people have a better connection with their unconscious mind. You see high performing athletes, high performing CEOs, they have that perfect connection with their unconscious mind. They're the easiest people to hypnotize. Now I just hit significance on that needs map. So every way that you could view yourself as needing something from another person, I've just hit them all. So actually, you know what? Stand right here and then like, so I'll have somebody stand up, stand right here. So I've just given them an order. I didn't ask and they complied. I'd say, all right, come a little closer to me. Next order, compliance. All right. Now spread your feet just a little bit further

• 3:04:15Speaker 01

  apart. All right, great. A little bit closer together. Great. Now put your hands out. All right, great. Now look at me. Great. Now close your eyes just really quick. I just want to test one thing and I'm just going to do like five or six things. All these things I'm doing are meaningless.

• 3:04:27Danny Jones?

  They've given in to you, to your will.

• 3:04:29Speaker 01

  Right. So now we haven't even started the process. I've got you just to comply with orders on command. So now I'm going to, I'm going to start the hypnosis process. I'm going to be like, all right, so go ahead and start taking a deep breath in your abdomen and now follow my finger. I'm going to do this kind of little finger thing like this. I'm going to, what's called the upside down T. It's probably the best thing to knock somebody out in, in public where I'm just kind of, if you follow my finger, I'm not going to do it to you, but we're going to go this way, this way, back to the center and then all the way up. So anytime you get those eyes to roll to the center of the forehead, you can feel like if you try to look right here, like it, there's a reflex of almost like kind of sending you back, making you kind of go into hypnosis a tiny bit.

• 3:05:16Speaker 01

  So then I'm doing all this stuff and I'm gaining all this compliance and I say, all right, remember when you go into hypnosis, you're going to be able to stand and maintain perfect balance. You're going to be able to maintain perfect balance even when you go very, very deep. So what I just set expectancy for what's going to happen. Now I'm saying, right when I say sleep, your head's going to droop forward, your body's going to get completely loose, but I don't want that to scare you. So I'm pretending like this is a little safety briefing, but I'm telling you what to do. Does that make sense?

• 3:05:45Danny Jones?

  Yeah, totally.

• 3:05:46Speaker 01

  So your head might fall down and get really loose and your eyes might close. You're going to feel a need for those eyes closed and that's totally normal. You can just let them close because you'll get even more benefit out of this. And now if you wanted one thing out of hypnosis, you, I'm one of the top hypnotists in the world, what would you pick? Would you pick more discipline, more confidence, more gratitude? What would you pick?

• 3:06:08Danny Jones?

  You're asking me personally?

• 3:06:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:06:10Danny Jones?

  More discipline.

• 3:06:11Speaker 01

  Okay. So now, now that you've said, I want more discipline, and I'm holding the key to that, now I've got you excited. Now I'm building your expectancy using your own desires.

• 3:06:23Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:06:23Speaker 01

  So like, and I always ask the question, like, if you could wave a magic wand, what would be the one thing that you could change about yourself or that you would add to your life? So you get people to get excited and kind of get invested in the process. Okay, now remember, as soon as I say the word sleep, everything's going to be fine. You're going to be able to stand and maintain perfect balance, even if your head and the rest of your body just starts to droop and relax. I'm going to be right here with you the entire time. So all I've done is got you to comply a bazillion times, told you exactly what to do, and then told you what's going to happen the moment I say sleep.

• 3:06:54Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 3:06:55Speaker 01

  And the moment I say sleep, I'm going to do a tiny little thing. Are we on camera?

• 3:07:00Danny Jones?

  Yes.

• 3:07:00Speaker 01

  This will be on camera?

• 3:07:01Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:07:01Speaker 01

  So stand up really quick. So like, I'm going to feel the back of your head. So right here is called the occipital protuberance.

• 3:07:09Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 3:07:09Speaker 01

  So if you can imagine this feeling, like just a tiny touch, like, just like that.

• 3:07:14Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:07:15Speaker 01

  And right when somebody says sleep and like that one little push, right when their eyes are moving upward and that little push to sleep. That, that little, that little jerk makes their psychology go, oh shit, something's happening. Something's going on. Interesting. And then the moment their head goes down, I'm starting to count down from 10 to one. Why do I count down from 10 to one? Because that's a countdown. And people think, oh shit, he's counting down. The hypnosis thing is happening. Right. So I'm triggering what their societal experiences of what hypnosis has been. And then I do progressive muscle relaxation. All the muscles in your face completely letting go, those little muscles around your eyes, just finally releasing, relaxing, unwinding, completely unraveling.

• 3:07:58Speaker 01

  Just feeling absolutely perfect as you go even deeper, as you take those deep breaths, just nonstop blather like this. Right. So you relax all those muscles, but what you're really doing is getting the body to relax to such a state. And getting that person to trust you enough to where their brain goes into theta. That's all it is. Hypnosis is just theta. I'm just getting the brain into a theta wave state. So I'm getting the body to relax, they go into theta. So that's what's happening here. Everybody here has massive compliance. Massive compliance. They've been following him for a while. They've seen thousands of people fall out on stage.

• 3:08:35Speaker 01

  So he never needs to tell anybody what's going to happen again, because he has this long demonstrated history of like bam, I knocked my coat and these people go down. Right. And now you come up on stage, there's 10,000 people watching you and it's just you and me and I've got my little coat. Are you going to be the asshole? Right. Are you going down?

• 3:08:57Speaker 01

  You're, that's a tremendous amount of social pressure. Yes. But at the same time, they're desiring positive benefit from this, which makes them want to fully let go and completely participate in the entire thing. So there's many different psychological avenues that are happening at the same time. So it's a good thing, like if they, if they walk out of there and they say, that's the best day of my life, they, whatever they spent in this church was worth it. It was beneficial. Yeah. Yeah. So I, there's people that say, oh, he's a con artist or whatever. A psychologist does tricks on you too. Right. You know, so maybe people get benefit from it. Uh, he may be bilking people for lots of money. I don't know the guy. I don't know anything about this industry. Right. But I do know brains.

• 3:09:43Speaker 01

  So that's what hypnosis really is. So what I just gave to you, literally, someone could take what I just did and go hypnotize a stranger, exactly with what I just did. All you gotta do to wake them up is count, is tell them, I'm gonna wake you up. And the moment I say five, you'll be awake. One, two, three, four, five, wide awake.

• 3:10:00Danny Jones?

  So basically, whatever you tell them or suggest to them will, will happen?

• 3:10:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. Because you're compliance, compliance, compliance, compliance. And at the beginning, I'll often say something like, I've been doing this a long time. I can tell you when the top, maybe top 5% of hypnotizability, which, which we call unconscious power, or unconscious connection. And I made those words up just to, just to kind of go along with what a person needs to feel. And I'll say, the only thing that you have to do to go into hypnosis is do every single thing that I say. Are you good with that? And I'll be like, yeah. So

• 3:10:39Danny Jones?

  They're subconsciously, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 3:10:41Speaker 01

  So that does two things. Number one, it gets them to completely agree to let go. When I say let go, they have to let go. Number two, it gets them to say, yeah, I will do everything you say. So if, if they say they're not going into hypnosis, then it's their fault. Cause they're just not following instructions.

• 3:10:59Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:11:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. The first guy who discovered a lot of this stuff was named Franz Mesmer. And that's where the term mesmerized comes from.

• 3:11:08Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 3:11:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:11:10Danny Jones?

  Franz Mesmer?

• 3:11:11Speaker 01

  So he called, he didn't call it hypnotism. He called it animal magnetism. So he believed, and he wasn't a charlatan by any means. He believed that by waving these big water magnets and stuff all around people that he would, he would heal them. But these people had an expectation of being healed. So he started producing results.

• 3:11:31Danny Jones?

  Right, right.

• 3:11:33Speaker 01

  And the body's powerful. They did a study up in, I think it was University of Montreal in Canada. They took this busted ass MRI machine with a Bluetooth speaker in it that makes MRI noises, that just makes big machine noises. And they brought kids in there and told these kids, up to the age of like 16, That this machine was special built to cure migraines or dermatitis or eczema or allergies or sleep problems and it cured them.

• 3:12:02Danny Jones?

  That's wild.

• 3:12:03Speaker 01

  Fixed all those things. Even allergies got fixed with this fake MRI with a Bluetooth speaker. Just because there's an expectation of healing.

• 3:12:11Danny Jones?

  The brain is such a fricking powerful thing.

• 3:12:13Speaker 01

  It's a powerhouse. And that's why the one thing that pisses me off is when people use the term placebo effect to talk about someone being tricked. Like, that's not what that is.

• 3:12:24Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:12:25Speaker 01

  The placebo effect is how powerful your brain is, not how gullible.

• 3:12:28Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:12:29Speaker 01

  It's a measure of power, not stupidity.

• 3:12:31Danny Jones?

  Interesting.

• 3:12:33Speaker 01

  You know what I'm saying?

• 3:12:33Danny Jones?

  Is there, do you think there's any sort of measurement or any sort of like correlation in people that are affected more by that? Like the placebo effect versus people who aren't? Like if you took one group of people and then told them about this MRI thing, how it was going to cure them? And you put them all in there and the people that were cured, like what is it specifically about their brains that is different? Do you think?

• 3:12:55Speaker 01

  We have to factor in two things. What if the first group of people had a 22-year-old pimple-faced kid go in there and explain how powerful the MRI is? And the next group had a six-foot-four, 60-year-old, gray-haired, perfectly well-manicured doctor in a lab coat?

• 3:13:13Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:13:14Speaker 01

  They're going to get different results.

• 3:13:16Danny Jones?

  Sure. But what if, what if it was the same doctor, though? What if, like, what if the conditions were similar?

• 3:13:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:13:20Danny Jones?

  How would you distinguish the different, like, what would you think it is about those people that gives them different results?

• 3:13:26Speaker 01

  So they're all on the same diet as well?

• 3:13:28Danny Jones?

  Yeah, perfectly exactly same.

• 3:13:30Speaker 01

  Same humans.

• 3:13:31Danny Jones?

  Same humans.

• 3:13:31Speaker 01

  Okay, so I would say it's their level of suggestibility.

• 3:13:35Danny Jones?

  Okay.

• 3:13:36Speaker 01

  Natural suggestibility. So people that had a pretty decent life that weren't mistrusting of adults. Especially if we're dealing with kids. You know, the most hypnotizable people I've ever seen are like giant NFL football players and NBA basketball player dudes.

• 3:13:54Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 3:13:54Speaker 01

  Huge alpha male type guys, yeah.

• 3:13:57Danny Jones?

  What, why?

• 3:13:58Speaker 01

  I don't know. I think, A, they have a superior ability to visualize.

• 3:14:04Speaker 01

  And that's what makes, I think that's what makes it, I'm not even making this up. That's what makes a good CEO, a good leader is can they visualize outcomes that they want? So I, when I see my one-on-one clients, we spend seven hours

• 3:14:21Speaker 01

  teaching them to visualize. And I'm saying, I'm gonna spend an hour with you as my client, with that pen right there, and you're gonna spend two minutes memorizing every detail. And then you're gonna, you're gonna take 30 seconds to close your eyes and rebuild it in your head. Then I'm gonna give you two seconds, open your eyes, pick up a detail that you missed, close your eyes, rebuild it again.

• 3:14:40Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 3:14:40Speaker 01

  Again, again, again, again, hundreds of times. And then I'll increase the complexity with something that has more reflections, more details. Then I'll train your brain to visualize better and better and better. And that's a huge problem that most people can't visualize. Or they're visualizing negative stuff by default, just because that's what mammals do.

• 3:15:00Danny Jones?

  Is this similar to like people when they talk about having a photographic memory? Sort of. Something that you can kind of like train to do?

• 3:15:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's sort of.

• 3:15:07Danny Jones?

  Get better at it by practicing it?

• 3:15:10Speaker 01

  This, this would not be a memory uh, training tool. This would be a visualizing in the moment tool.

• 3:15:16Danny Jones?

  Yeah, but it's kind of memory, right? If I'm looking at this and I'm looking at all of it and trying to then close my eyes and kind of reconstruct it in my, it's kind of like memory. And then like people, people that have photographic memories, they just have this incredible memory, like to be able to pick out certain details of things and things that happened on certain days and names of people, it's like, is that, I wonder if that's like an inherent thing? Or if that's something that's, that can be supported or like built up like a muscle? From doing things like that?

• 3:15:46Speaker 01

  I would lean towards that being a physiological connectivity issue.

• 3:15:50Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:15:51Speaker 01

  But, so the, the reason I want them to be hyper visualizers is because when I hypnotize them, they have a wildly different experience. Because inside of my client's head, I build a medical laboratory in their head, where they can give themselves injections, do body scans. I had a client just two years ago, we built this like an MRI machine scanner inside of her medical lab, which in all my clients have these little doorways and stuff where they can do cool stuff with their head and their brain. I do this with professional athletes and boxers. We're doing uh, F1 racers.

• 3:16:25Danny Jones?

  Wow.

• 3:16:26Speaker 01

  The Formula One guys. So in the med lab, this woman was scanning her body. And so I have everybody like you build the scanner, lay on the bed, let's turn it on with your hand. There's a control down here. And she scanned her body and said, there's like this white glow. She didn't tell me she's until after she woke up, after out of trance. She said, there's this white like glowing ball down here. Ovarian teratoma. Big ass tumor.

• 3:16:54Speaker 06

  Really?

• 3:16:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. And she found it on her own body scan in her head. So there's something to it, man.

• 3:17:02Speaker 06

  That's wild.

• 3:17:04Speaker 01

  I don't think we give our brains enough credit. They're really powerful. And Darren Brown, you know who he is?

• 3:17:12Speaker 06

  No.

• 3:17:12Speaker 01

  He's a British guy. He, uh, miracles for sale, I think it was called. He did a whole documentary about this where he pretended to be a religious person and he healed people using the same techniques. But he's a hypnotist. So he pretended to be religious and did a kind of a tour of curing people and stuff. And had similar, the exact same results, pretty much.

• 3:17:37Speaker 06

  Really? That's wild.

• 3:17:41Speaker 01

  Truly fascinating, but that visualizing is so powerful. And I hate to, have you ever seen the Blue Angels do a flight briefing?

• 3:17:48Speaker 06

  No.

• 3:17:50Speaker 01

  This is going to change your life.

• 3:17:52Speaker 06

  Let's find it.

• 3:17:52Speaker 01

  Uh, type in Blue Angels flight. There we go. Turn that shit up.

• 3:17:57Speaker 06

  Forecast weather winds two, five, zero at six, 10 miles, viz, few at 25,000. Altimeter three, zero, zero, two, corrected to two, nine, nine, nine.

• 3:18:05Speaker 01

  Astronauts will do this too.

• 3:18:07Speaker 06

  A little pull.

• 3:18:10Speaker 01

  Everyone's eyes are closed. See that throttle hand?

• 3:18:15Speaker 06

  Vertical five, five.

• 3:18:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:18:19Speaker 06

  Easing, mo, oh, diamond stinger. Right, jump, twosie, back. Adding power. The soles be in from the right for the tug of a roll. The diamond will be in from behind the crowd for the low brake cross. Ease the pull.

• 3:18:37Speaker 01

  There you go.

• 3:18:38Speaker 06

  The loop brake cross. Right, jump, twosie, back. Take it in.

• 3:18:50Speaker 06

  Up we go.

• 3:18:57Speaker 01

  It's fucking insane. Amazing.

• 3:18:59Speaker 06

  Vertical five five.

• 3:19:04Speaker 01

  See him pulling his feet off the rudder?

• 3:19:06Speaker 06

  Yeah. Smoke up, pull.

• 3:19:09Speaker 01

  The smallest movements.

• 3:19:12Speaker 06

  Up we go.

• 3:19:20Speaker 06

  Vertical four five.

• 3:19:27Speaker 06

  Horizon seven five easing power idle.

• 3:19:34Speaker 06

  Ready roll hat.

• 3:19:37Speaker 06

  On.

• 3:19:41Speaker 06

  Smoke up, push. Here's pinko.

• 3:19:48Speaker 06

  All right, diamonds, souls, com, cock, tab, burn, air. Let's have a go.

• 3:19:50Speaker 01

  About that, man.

• 3:19:52Danny Jones?

  That is intense.

• 3:19:54Speaker 01

  Heavy.

• 3:19:54Danny Jones?

  Holy smokes.

• 3:19:57Speaker 01

  Best in the world.

• 3:19:57Danny Jones?

  They're sitting there visualizing their whole entire flight path.

• 3:20:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. Every single muscle movement.

• 3:20:02Danny Jones?

  Oh my god.

• 3:20:08Danny Jones?

  Every, I mean, like, yeah, you, you, the, the smallest little wrong move with the wrist could mean death.

• 3:20:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:20:18Danny Jones?

  In that situation, when they're flying wing to wing at that speed.

• 3:20:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, and they fly with a forty pound spring.

• 3:20:23Danny Jones?

  What's that mean?

• 3:20:24Speaker 01

  So the, your main flight stick, right?

• 3:20:27Danny Jones?

  Uh huh.

• 3:20:27Speaker 01

  Is, is pulled back with a, a forty pounds spring. So you're, you're always at forty pounds of pressure when you're flying only that plane, the Blue Angel planes.

• 3:20:36Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:20:37Speaker 01

  I think the F-18s are twelve pound spring. When you have any tier one unit, like a, a steel team unit.

• 3:20:44Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:20:44Speaker 01

  Like, maybe Team Six, Delta dudes. You'll see mission rehearsals that look exactly like this.

• 3:20:49Danny Jones?

  Really?

• 3:20:50Speaker 01

  Everybody's going through that same process, man. And these are the best in the world, and they are visualizing success. They're, you know, people say to do this, and people are like, oh, yeah, I like to visualize. I have a vision board that I keep on my Walmart picture, digital picture frame on my, on my desk. That's, that's fucking visualizing right there.

• 3:21:13Danny Jones?

  I mean, it's real. It's fucking real, man.

• 3:21:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was tempted to make like a huge video, a YouTube video on that and just to talk about how important it is.

• 3:21:24Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:21:26Speaker 01

  And my kids, I think the first time we talked on the phone, I had Miss Rachel in the background.

• 3:21:31Danny Jones?

  Yeah, you did have Miss Rachel in the background.

• 3:21:34Speaker 01

  And you were like, oh, I know Miss Rachel.

• 3:21:35Danny Jones?

  Mm hmm. Oh, yeah, I know.

• 3:21:37Speaker 01

  So, uh, the Sticky Bubble Gum song, which I'm sure.

• 3:21:41Danny Jones?

  Sticky, sticky, sticky, sticky bubble gum.

• 3:21:43Speaker 01

  Yep. So I wanted to make a video on YouTube about how important that visualization is. And my kids, I made them a checklist one time. Like, here's your perfect checklist of every day. I'm up at this time. I brush my teeth before this time. I feed the dogs. I take care of the stuff I'm supposed to do. My assignments are turned in before 11:00. Blah, blah, blah. Here's all the stuff you need to do.

• 3:22:06Danny Jones?

  Yeah.

• 3:22:07Speaker 01

  And they hate having a checklist. They're like, oh, we want to be treated like adults. And I was like, do you?

• 3:22:13Danny Jones?

  Watch this video.

• 3:22:14Speaker 01

  Do you want to be treated like an adult? I was like, you know who uses checklists and never goes away from a checklist? Surgeons, pilots, astronauts.

• 3:22:23Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:22:24Speaker 01

  Checklist.

• 3:22:24Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:22:25Speaker 01

  So, and I think that helped to reframe, you know, what that was. And I said, I have a checklist every day. You can look at my calendar. I have a checklist every single day of my life. I work from 4:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. every day.

• 3:22:39Danny Jones?

  Do you really?

• 3:22:40Speaker 01

  I do.

• 3:22:43Speaker 01

  This, uh, this last two days, the first two days I've taken off in six years. And that's including Christmas birthdays. I don't, I haven't taken a day off. But my company's finally at a place where I'm making money, uh, making very decent money. And I can just start letting go of that steering wheel a little bit, a little bit more. And I hired a CEO, which is the best decision I've ever made in my lifetime. So I'm not a business person. I'm a, I'm a creator. You know, I'm a, I'm a, supposed to be an artist, just making stuff, you know? And being a business person killed me. Like it ruined me.

• 3:23:20Danny Jones?

  Yeah. And that's There's not much creativity in it, at least from my perspective, from my point of view. There's no, it's boring.

• 3:23:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:23:26Danny Jones?

  Worrying about numbers.

• 3:23:28Speaker 01

  As an entrepreneur, which you are, it's well, the biggest lesson I learned in my life was that I had a tendency to look out in the crowd and find other entrepreneur minded people to hire, which was so dumb. You gotta hire a business person. You cannot hire an entrepreneur. You gotta hire somebody that's Excel spreadsheet oriented, EBITDA oriented, earnings, all of that. But for anybody that's out there, that's an entrepreneur. That's hire a business person, hire somebody just slightly autistic and obsessed with those spreadsheets and numbers and data.

• 3:24:05Danny Jones?

  Right.

• 3:24:06Speaker 01

  That's it.

• 3:24:08Danny Jones?

  It's wild shit, man. Well, thanks again. This was very fun. I learned a lot, lots of process.

• 3:24:14Speaker 01

  It is.

• 3:24:14Danny Jones?

  Thanks for doing this, man. This was fun. I enjoyed it.

• 3:24:17Speaker 01

  Me too.

• 3:24:18Danny Jones?

  Tell people where they can buy your books, get in touch with you.

• 3:24:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, we gotta hold it up.

• 3:24:23Danny Jones?

  Hold it up.

• 3:24:23Speaker 01

  Doing, doing that.

• 3:24:24Danny Jones?

  The behavioral ops manual.

• 3:24:27Speaker 01

  Amazon.com.

• 3:24:28Danny Jones?

  Look at that. Look how thick that motherfucker is.

• 3:24:30Speaker 01

  It's like a little phone book.

• 3:24:32Danny Jones?

  It really is like a little phone book.

• 3:24:33Speaker 01

  It's a, it's the textbook now for NCI.

• 3:24:36Danny Jones?

  Frick.

• 3:24:37Speaker 01

  The system, NCI. Thanks, man.

• 3:24:40Danny Jones?

  I appreciate it, man. We'll link everything below.

• 3:24:42Speaker 01

  All right.

• 3:24:42Danny Jones?

  Good night, world.

• 3:24:45Speaker 03

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• 3:25:16Speaker 07

  This December, the magic of Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol, returns to Virginia Repertory Theater in downtown Richmond. Experience the transformation of Ebenezer Scrooge as he's visited by the ghosts of Christmas past, present, and future, and rediscovers the joy and true meaning of the holiday season. Performances run November 18th through December 27th. Tickets on sale now at virginiarep.org or by calling 804-282-2620.