Pod Insights The Clark Howard Podcast 08.25.25 Controlled Spending Method / Travel Warning: Pickpocket Rings About this episode Ever wake up Monday regretting how much you spent over the weekend? Today Clark re-examines the no spending trend through a needs-vs-wants traffic light lens as a smart way to think about spending. Also today - Travelers are being heavily targeted at ATMs & check outs. Clark shares an easy way to protect your wallet and identity when out & about - and why this is necessary now more than ever. Mindful Spending: Segment 1 Ask Clark: Segment 2 ATM Pickpockets: Segment 3 Ask Clark: Segment 4 Mentioned on the show: Should you buy it? If you answer 'yes' to these questions, probably not What Can I Safely Use for Peer-to-Peer Payments? Can I Use an Online Will Maker or Do I Need an Attorney? How To Create a Will Online / Wills & Funerals Archives How To Freeze and Unfreeze Your Credit With Experian, Equifax & TransUnion NYTimes: Help! A Pickpocket Used My A. T. M. Card, and Citi Won’t Cover It. Unpack these cybersecurity tips for a stress-free vacation Why It's a Great Time To Get a Cheap Ticket to Europe How To Pack a Carry-On the Right Way Clark.com resources Episode transcripts Community. Clark.com / Ask Clark Clark.com daily money newsletter Consumer Action Center Free Helpline: 636-492-5275 Learn more about your ad choices: megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcript 0:00 Speaker 00 This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.
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1:04 Speaker 02 Thanks for joining us here on The Clark Howard Show. You know, our mission is to serve you with advice and information that empowers you to make better financial decisions in your life. And I sure hope you had a great weekend. How'd you do spending money? If you spent too much money and you're like, oh, boy. Different kind of hangover on Monday. I want you to listen to what I have to say about this no spending trend that's been hot in 25. And later, there's something I need you to do to protect your money if you travel anywhere outside the United States.
1:48 Speaker 02 Ultra important. So, the no spend 25 thing was really big on TikTok. I addressed it back at the beginning of the year. It's really an idea, not a practical thing. You have to spend money, right? But it's the whole process of thinking about money. And I think how often people say, you know, well, I've been working hard, or this is happening, or that's happened. So I deserve it. Deserve whatever. And we're at brass tacks now for a lot of people. It's so hard to make it through a month with the money you're making.
2:29 Speaker 02 I keep thinking about this because the idea of buy nothing is incomplete. And I want you to think about this, the whole idea of shock therapy for you. You don't buy a new piece of clothing. You go shop your closet. You don't buy a new this, that, or the other. You live with what you've got. And so if you get down to the core of what this is, I used to talk about this must pay versus wants. And I've realized over time that there's more nuance to this.
3:09 Speaker 02 And so if you're in financial Armageddon, then what I've always said is true. That you spend your money only on what you must. And anything else is a want to, and you cut it out of your life. Because the stress of not having enough money before the next paycheck comes is ugly. And it leads to a lot of bad habits, like running up balances on credit cards where you're paying 25 or more percent interest. Or in the worst cases, taking out payday loans, or buying things pay in for.
3:53 Speaker 02 Where credit is what you think is pushing the problem away, but only magnifies the problem. So I've been thinking so much about this, and this is a moving target. But where my head is now. Is that when you're out there and you're thinking of buying something, and let's say you're not in a disastrous situation with money, but you're not where you want to be. And if you look at things just as these are the have to's and these are the want to's, that too many things end up a yes in the want to. So I think it really requires maybe a third category.
4:38 Speaker 02 Like you think of a traffic signal, you got the red light, the yellow light and the green light. So what would be a green light for spending? What would be a have to? You gotta pay your rent, right? Gotta pay your mortgage. If you have a car payment, you gotta pay it. You gotta pay your electric bill. Those things are all clear. Where does a cellphone go? Where does any subscription go? It goes in this second category that I'll call it, that is not a, like not totally like, well, I want to book this vacation.
5:21 Speaker 02 If money's really tight right now, that's a red light. But you gotta have a cellphone, right? But what you're paying for it is a yellow light. Because there's virtually no one I know who isn't overpaying for their cellphone plan. And that's an ongoing, meaningful monthly expense. But how about buying the newest Android or iPhone? Is that a yellow light? Is that a red light? If money's tight, that's a red light. As long as your phone you have is working. Monthly bill? That's a yellow light. That's where you really think about, how do I shave this expense?
6:04 Speaker 02 If you look through your checking account or your credit card statements and you're like, "I didn't know I was paying for Netflix twice. I didn't know I had, I don't know Hulu, or how many different streaming services. How many of these are out there that we're paying for, we're not even watching, and we didn't know we were subscribed to them anymore?" We're definitely in yellow light territory. You go through those bills and you really look, "What am I spending money on? Where would going to Starbucks be?" If you're having trouble paying your bills at all, and you're running balances on credit cards, Starbucks or anything
6:48 Speaker 02 like that, that is full red light territory. This is situational depending on where you are financially. I want you to think, because it's gotta be something you just process immediately in your head. "Oh, that's a red light. I can't do that. Oh, I want to go get a bubble tea for $11," or whatever they are. I don't even know what a bubble tea is, but I see people walking around with them all the time, and they cost a lot of money. If you're not doing the things you should do financially, like saving in your Roth IRA, because you're buying bubble teas, where's a bubble tea? It's not a yellow light, it's a red light. I want you really to use this,
7:33 Speaker 02 try this, because I've been noodling this in my head. How do I get, in everyday life, get into your brain and get you thinking about, "How am I going to get this spending under control?" And so if you think of things, green light, yellow light, red light, and again, depending on where you are in your life with financial stress, there are people who things are going to be yellow, that for you will be red. There'll be things that'll be red for them, that'll be yellow for you. But I want you to think through, how do you get more control in your life? And I'm feeling good about this for now, and we'll see, because this is a moving
8:18 Speaker 02 target, how to help people who feel out of control with their spending to get more control with it. So what would you say in your life right now, you're spending money on? That you should really red light right now.
8:33 Speaker 03 Well, I'm in a financial fast right now. I put myself on that because I took some vacations, spent more on vacation than I expected to and
8:43 Speaker 02 Who doesn't spend more on vacation than they expected to?
8:46 Speaker 03 So now I've really clamped down like on eating out is the thing that I most indulge in. I really don't indulge in that many things. I spend a lot on like health, like a gym membership and things like that, but I'm not willing to give that up. But I've cut back everything else. My grocery bill is very low. I cook at home all the time. So I'm doing well with it, but I had to really go to beyond red light.
9:11 Speaker 02 All right. So we're going to go visual right here. You're going to see something you don't need to see. These are my, my walking shoes.
9:18 Speaker 03 Uh huh.
9:19 Speaker 02 They are Hoka's.
9:21 Speaker 03 Very fancy brand.
9:23 Speaker 02 Hoka's have been great for my feet. Absolutely great. They're so expensive. So those of you watching the YouTube show saw that mine look like I'm a Smurf. That's what laying my Smurf shoes. So why did I buy the Smurf color? Because they were on clearance. I paid $81 for them and I'm wearing, can you believe I spent that much?
9:48 Speaker 03 I'm shocked at you. I know they're normally well over a hundred for those, but.
9:53 Speaker 02 So I got completely suckered on Amazon into buying a pair of shoes that there were all these ads for that people said they're just as good or better than Hoka's, but they cost a whole lot less. Well, they weren't for me. So $42 down the drain on those.
10:17 Speaker 03 Couldn't return them?
10:18 Speaker 02 I wear shoes to see if I'm going to wear them in.
10:22 Speaker 03 Okay.
10:23 Speaker 02 So they would have been unsellable for Amazon seller. So I just couldn't do that. So I donated them and I've tried all different brands that are cheaper, trying to find something as comfortable for me as these Hoka's. And I'm just going to keep wearing ugly colors when they go. On clearance or they discontinue a model and they're getting rid of the old one.
10:45 Speaker 03 Well, that's a very, that's a classic, very important purchase. You walk like 18,000 steps a day minimum normally. And you have had back issues in the past. I mean, you need quality shoes to walk on, but you'll save money on other stuff all the time. I mean, you save money on those. I'm just saying like the $80 investment is worth it.
11:07 Speaker 02 These shoes are not an investment.
11:10 Speaker 03 Okay, Clark.
11:11 Speaker 02 They are spending so that I have comfort in my feet.
11:16 Speaker 03 All right. Rod in Colorado. Recently, my Venmo app said it had lost connection with my bank. It turns out the reason it needed to reconnect was to reestablish connectivity through Plaid. The Plaid process included without opt out ability, granting Plaid access not only to the bank account I want to continue to use to transact via Venmo, but also access to all accounts that I have at that bank, all past transactions in all accounts, all past monthly statements for all accounts and all tax forms for all accounts. A gross overreach for simply creating a connection with a single checking account from which to conduct my Venmo payment transactions. Bye bye Venmo. Not happening. I thought this was a good follow up to the other day when you were talking about that.
11:59 Speaker 02 Yeah, talking about Venmo. All right. So Plaid is this bank tool owned by the banks that Venmo is using as a method that doesn't have, it's not the only one you have to use. That they verify that you're legit, that you know, you're really who you say you are and all that. And the permissions are crazy that you're describing. I've not heard this about this level of deep dive permissions you're giving. But again, if you do what I've talked about before and set up a separate account for your Venmo or Cash App at an alternate financial institution,
12:43 Speaker 02 what you do with that institution is you have money in it just to cover the amount of transactions you're doing on Venmo or Cash App. Then the fact that they may validate through Plaid should not be of harm to you. But yes, it is ridiculous, the permissions that are often buried deep in the policies of services you're using.
13:08 Speaker 02 And it's all to the advantage of, the lawyers write it, all to the advantage of the banks, and obviously not to your advantage.
13:17 Speaker 03 Michelle in Missouri says, Clark, my state will soon offer complete digital estate planning and recognize electronic wills. In what ways will this benefit me and will I still need an attorney?
13:28 Speaker 02 So Michelle, the whole idea of the digital will, or electronic will, is something that technology has allowed for a long time, but state laws have mostly around the country not caught up to it. I didn't know that Missouri had passed a statute permitting electronic wills. Whether a will is electronic and properly validated through an electronic process, or it's a paper will, doing a will depends on the complexity of your situation, whether you're okay with a software program to do a will, or you need the help of a professional. You own a business, normally that says you need a lawyer to do a will. You've got a
14:12 Speaker 02 lot of assets, you're going to need a lawyer to make sure that a will is done properly. You have a complicated family situation, you've got kids from prior marriages, you're married and each spouse has kids from a prior marriage, might have kids together, situation like that, don't do a will any other way but with a lawyer. In other words, if you have a very simple situation in your life, and you want to prepare your own will, and use a software program like Willmaker or something like that, that's absolutely fine, you're good to go. Whenever you say, oops, I'm one of those checkmarks, you don't do
14:55 Speaker 02 your own will. That's when you spend what seems like big money, but it's cheap money versus the problems you could cause by trying to do your own will.
15:07 Speaker 02 When your situation has too many complicating layers, and then you need that lawyer for it, you don't want to cause problems for those that you wanted to help after you pass away, because you thought what you did covered the situation. It didn't. And let me point out once again, if you have minor children, but you don't have assets, you need a will. Because if you don't do one, the state will decide who raises your children, not your wishes. And that crazy brother you have or something, the state might decide, oh, that's who's going to raise your kids. So you've got to do a will
15:52 Speaker 02 when you have minor children. Period. If your situation's simple, it can be a will you do yourself.
16:00 Speaker 03 Jennifer in Connecticut says, because of Clark, I learned years ago that I need to freeze my credit files. I wanted to let people know that if you know a company's going to pull your credit for something, you can ask them which credit agencies they pulled from and just thaw that agency. I've done this several times now. Thanks for all you do.
16:17 Speaker 02 And Jennifer, thank you, because I have found that more often you can ask that question and they actually know the answer at customer no service. Where it used to be, they were like, we don't know. And you'd have to thaw all three files. But now, they generally will know more often than not, and you do only have to thaw one file. And make sure you click the right button when you're at a credit bureau. Credit bureaus hate credit freeze. And I've noticed that they... Which one in particular? I better remember which one it is. Because I had to thaw my file recently. And they had it almost hidden
17:02 Speaker 02 for a temporary lift of a freeze, as they call it. And they had a big button to permanently remove the freeze. But I had to go hunt to find out how to do a temporary thaw. And that's just uncool. So make sure when you do it, that you are doing it for a minimal specified period of time. Coming up ahead, there's something you gotta be aware of with criminal gangs or just criminals acting as Lone Rangers to protect yourself when you are using payment cards. There's something you gotta know.
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19:30 Speaker 02 In walking cities, and most Americans, let's face it, don't live in walking cities. There's a lot of pickpocketing going on. So, most Americans are only going to experience this if you're on a trip to, let's say, central Boston, central San Francisco, central New York City. Because anywhere else, we're car-dependent. But when you're in a city, again, mostly when Americans travel overseas, and you pull out a payment card, next thing a criminal may see is where it goes back into your pocket. Or a woman, where you're putting it, if it's on the back of your phone, or whatever.
20:13 Speaker 02 And you've got to be really vigilant, being careful when you use them, and being aware who's around you. And there's been a big problem with ATMs. And people don't use ATMs nearly as much as they used to. But when people travel outside the United States, they're more likely to use an ATM to withdraw money in local currency. So criminals are targeting you, and they're watching you. Many times, they'll work with an accomplice, who's watching you punch in your PIN code with binoculars. And they're communicating with each other, and they'll say, "Okay, she just put her
20:56 Speaker 02 card back in this pocket," or, you know, "this place on the purse." Or a guy, they'll say, "Oh, he just put it in his right pocket, grab there," and they'll get your card. But this is the thing, they've already got your PIN. They have targeted you and your card. And New York Times did a story recently about how the banks...
21:23 Speaker 02 If somebody has your PIN and your card gets stolen, the banks are treating you as the guilty party till proven innocent. And New York Times specifically wrote about how Citibank was refusing to cover ATM theft of cards when the person, the criminal, also had the PIN. They were saying, "Tough on you." And so, it's a real thing. You cover with one hand while you type in your PIN with the other hand so that you do not become a useful target for the pickpocket rings. They're waiting for the individuals just go up, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, punch
22:05 Speaker 02 in, get their money, and walk away. Bam, what an easy crime for them. Before you can even report it, they've already used your card to steal money. And in a lot of other countries, you have to have a PIN to do retail shopping. So, they're not just trying to use it to get money out of an ATM. They're using it to then buy things. And that PIN is looked at as card present and almost like a signature, and you're guilty again till proven innocent with your financial institution. So, I don't want to make you paranoid. I want to make you prepared and know that this has been low-hanging fruit.
22:50 Speaker 02 And Citibank's wrong here. And after the New York Times did the story, Citibank then covered the disputed charges for people in that story. What about everyday people who this happens to? And, you know, banks have so much discretionary power. And now that the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau has basically been put on ice, there's not anybody the banks are worried about looking over their shoulders trying to enforce the laws. So, now you and I have got to be more careful each and every day. Krista?
23:29 Speaker 03 All right. This one came in from Doug in Georgia. Clark, I bought changeable tickets on Delta to Korea with expensive round trip prices. I did what you recommended and I watched prices for the next few months. And at one point, the price dropped more than $500. When I tried to change to the new fare on the website, I could only get the new price if I changed the type of ticket I had, i.e. I had to go to a lower basic ticket or higher class ticket. It would not let me change to the new fare with the exact same ticket class I had already.
23:59 Speaker 02 Seriously?
24:00 Speaker 03 I contacted customer service and they said that it was not allowed. And I could only do what was allowed on the site's change page. I complained for a while and they eventually said they would give me a one-time exception and I got the credit. How do you manage this type of situation? I was counting on it being an easy change to get the lower fare and credit, but it really wasn't. Thanks for your advice.
24:20 Speaker 02 So either this is a longstanding practice at Delta I'm not aware of. I've not seen this before, that when a fare drops, that they make you jump through extra hoops to get the lower fare. And this is really important right now, as I've addressed on multiple podcasts and YouTube shows, that airline bookings have been softer than they anticipated and airlines have been cutting fares. And that's why you keep checking if you bought a ticket well ahead of time, particularly for international, but also potentially for domestic. So how would you handle that? So go do a separate search.
25:00 Speaker 02 If the fare is available at the lower price, you could cancel the ticket and have an immediate credit and then immediately use that credit to rebook. And then you'd still have the leftover credit for, what'd you say, 500 bucks a ticket? You'd have it. It is ridiculous that, and I'm only hearing...
25:25 Speaker 02 That this is what happened to you, that Delta would have a company policy that if you called in, that, "Well, we'll do it for you as a one-time exception." That's just not the way you treat people.
25:37 Speaker 03 Okay, Michael in Georgia says, "I recently booked airline tickets to Europe via a full-time travel agent that I've known for decades. Her fare was higher than what was published online for the same flights. The explanation was that she was booking with a different code that gave us an advantage if the flight is canceled or delayed."
25:54 Speaker 02 What?
25:55 Speaker 03 She said that multiple clients got stuck in European airports after booking extra-cheap airfare online and their flights were canceled. After I heard your advice to rebook travel to Europe because of falling prices, I asked her, and she said her tickets did not allow that. What do you think of this?
26:11 Speaker 02 I can't figure out the situation at all. That's really odd. So, she's saying, "You buy it through her at a higher price, it's going to give you more protections in the event there's a big delay or cancel of your flight, but then if a lower fare comes along, you're not eligible for it?" That makes no sense to me whatsoever. I can't understand what she'd be referring to. You said this is an agent you've known for a long time, not a friend, based on what you said, the way you described it. You may not want to
26:54 Speaker 02 use that individual anymore, because that explanation just doesn't add up. Now, you don't get your money back when the fare drops, but you do get a credit towards future travel on fares other than basic economy, which a lot of the airlines say, "You bought it, you thought you were saving money." Huh, joke's on you, you're not. So, I, without being in the situation, I have no clue exactly what this travel agent's referring to.
27:28 Speaker 03 By the way, going back to the Delta question earlier, I wonder if this could have something to do with the way that they've changed their fare classes? I don't know if that's true for the foreign fares like this one. Like, maybe the fare classes changed in between booking and now this new flight, where they have extra, you know, there's like multiple main categories and...
27:47 Speaker 02 Yeah, so, I've never addressed that specifically.
27:52 Speaker 02 All right, so let me address that. So Delta is the most powerful US airline. And everybody in the industry lets Delta put its neck out there and experiment. And then if the things work, then everybody copies Delta. And that's why everybody's being quiet about Delta using AI to set fares. In addition, Delta is breaking down every part of the cabin into multiple fare types. So it's not just coach that you could buy a basic coach ticket.
28:30 Speaker 02 Delta is actually planning to have various levels of tickets for every type of seat on the plane, including even their international business class, domestic first class, where they will strip out benefits and offer you a lower fare. So odds are there will be a basic first class, there will be a basic business class, basic coach, basic, Delta calls their extra legroom, comfort plus. And so others are watching this and seeing how this works. Does it confuse people, overwhelm them?
29:09 Speaker 02 Or does it actually generate additional revenue to devalue the experience in each of these? And then offer the sell ups? Does the sell up generate more revenue? Or do people say, this is too complicated? I'm going to go buy that ticket from United or go whatever. And only time will tell on that. American CEO has been very outspoken that Delta is really stepping into it with the, using AI to set fares. And Delta is moving forward that by December, they hope to be setting one in five tickets prices by AI.
29:53 Speaker 02 Figuring out what they think is the most you'll pay for a ticket.
29:57 Speaker 03 You know what? I have on your calendar for you and the next show on Wednesday to talk about buying tickets because I know you told me you're doing that even different than the last time. Like you have new information on that. So we should do a whole.
30:08 Speaker 02 And Delta is part of that angle as well.
30:11 Speaker 03 Yeah. So we'll do that Wednesday for sure. Okay. One more here from Kathy in Georgia. Clark mentioned on a previous podcast that Lane also can pack for a two week trip with only a carry on case. What would she be willing to do a special podcast and show us women just how that's possible? I have curly hair made frizzy by humidity and need products to combat all that. I take my own hair dryer with the brush attachment that also helps. I would really like to get suggestions on how to leave stuff behind and still look good. Thanks so much. And Lane always looks great, no matter where, but definitely when she's on vacation.
30:45 Speaker 02 Okay. Should we see if she'll come on the podcast and show or we shoot a video?
30:50 Speaker 03 Yeah, I love that.
30:51 Speaker 02 We'll shoot a video for Clark.com of Lane packing for a one to two week trip.
30:59 Speaker 03 Youtube.com/Clark where you should subscribe.
31:03 Speaker 02 Always selling, aren't you Krista?
31:05 Speaker 03 Sorry.
31:06 Speaker 02 Yeah. So Lane has been able to do this for everything, but when we go on a trip that's like 17 days or longer, she will want to take a.
31:22 Speaker 02 How do you say that word?
31:23 Speaker 03 Checked bag.
31:24 Speaker 02 Ch ch ch. Yeah, bag. But shorter than that couple of weeks, she's able to do it and carry on with a backpack. Yeah. So let's see if she's willing to share her secrets.
31:37 Speaker 03 Yeah, for sure.
31:39 Speaker 02 By the way, a lot of people who have really adopted this have done a lot with the compression packets, packs that actually compress down your clothes. There's all kinds of YouTube videos from people who show how they pack for a long trip and a carry on. One thing a lot of people are into is they roll their clothes. In the suitcase instead of fold their clothes in the suitcase. But anyway, yeah.
32:08 Speaker 03 I do.
32:08 Speaker 02 We'll see if Lane is up to the challenge.
32:10 Speaker 03 I think she would be awesome. If I'm on a two-week trip, I look for a laundromat in the city like near where I'm staying. I love a wash and fold, but if not, I'll do the laundry myself one day just to refresh my clothes because I can't make it in a carry-on for two weeks unless I do that.
32:28 Speaker 02 It is so easy for me, obviously, as a guy. I mean, I just wear the Clark uniform every day of my life. Yeah. All right. Well, enough about that, and then I'm going to talk about this other airfare thing you said.
32:41 Speaker 03 On Wednesday.
32:42 Speaker 02 On Wednesday? All right. Krista has predicted the future.
32:46 Speaker 03 We'll make it happen.
32:48 Speaker 02 So I hope you have a great, great rest of your day. By the way, if there's something about your wallet that you would like some one-on-one advice for it, we offer that for free. And we've been doing so since 1993. That rhymes, free since 93. And so you can talk with a member of Team Clark at the Consumer Action Center. Just go to clark.com/cac to see how to get that done. And it's all about what we're about, which is empowerment through knowledge so you can save more, spend less, and avoid getting ripped off. And I'll be with you on Wednesday as Krista said.
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