Pod Insights The Clark Howard Podcast 06.30.25 Airfare Update / Travel Credit Card Points Devalued About this episode Today - A Clark travel update about what the airlines are doing to get you to pay more for your tickets and what you can do about it. Also, Clark has talked about how the airlines and hotels continuously devalue their miles and points. Now the credit card industry is at it as well. It looks like credit card points are going the way of the airline frequent flyer miles Airline Travel Update: Segment 1 Ask Clark: Segment 2 Travel Credit Card Points: Segment 3 Ask Clark: Segment 4 Mentioned on the show: Thrifty Traveler - US Airlines Are Quietly Hitting Solo & Biz Travelers with Higher Fares How To Find Cheap Flights in 3 Easy Steps / Are Airline Miles Worth It? SeatGuru: Airline Seat Maps, Flights shopping and Flight information GOING - Plan trips. Get alerts. Fly for less Roth vs. Traditional 401(k): What's the Difference? Citi Is Devaluing ThankYou Points: Will It Impact the Double Cash Card? Best Airline Credit Cards for 2025: Are They Right For You? Should I Keep My Old Car or Buy a New Car? How To Sell Gift Cards Online for Cash Best Places To Find Free E-Books Clark.com resources Episode transcripts Community. Clark.com / Ask Clark Clark.com daily money newsletter Consumer Action Center Free Helpline: 636-492-5275 Learn more about your ad choices: megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcript 0:00 Speaker 00 This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.
0:34 Speaker 01 It's great to have you here on the Clark Howard Show. Our mission is to serve you with advice and information that empowers you so you make better financial decisions in your life. And today, you know, I love to travel, but you know what I love more about traveling? When I save money doing it. And I've got some updates for you on tricks of the trade where airlines do a bait and switch on you to get more money out of your pocket. And later, speaking of airlines and travel, talked about how they are devaluing your points.
1:17 Speaker 01 Now even the credit card industry is starting to test that out. Okay. So, good news. Let me hit you with some good news first. Do you know airfares are down? Not good if you're an airline stockholder, but they're down. Hotel rates going down. And why is this? Because travel has softened. And one of the big effects that has affected flights overseas and also surprisingly in the United States and also hotels this summer is that foreign travelers are not coming to the US this year in numbers similar to what they have in prior years.
2:02 Speaker 01 So, things are softer than expected. Airlines had been adding seats. And at the same time that fewer people are excited about traveling, I travel at least every other week somewhere and the fares I'm paying have been generally much lower than I'm used to paying in summer. Some people are going to say, not my experience, but I've been having that as my experience and we're going to Iceland in the heart of summer, the peak of summer fares and we're paying 550 round trip. That's cheap for summer.
2:42 Speaker 01 And I'm seeing a lot of deals to Europe below a thousand dollars, peak summer, where in prior summers, gosh, it wasn't that long ago that it was hard to get a summer fare below two grand. So a lot of the fares are very, very sensitive to not huge numbers of movement and how many travelers are going. So the benefits are there. But I want to tell you the oddest thing going on right now. I mean, this is wild. It was on the travel blog Thrifty Traveler website and now it's been confirmed by a lot of others
3:25 Speaker 01 and I did my own unscientific testing. Delta is experimenting with something that's mind blowing. If you book a ticket, and they're not doing this everywhere, so it must be an internal test. If you book a ticket for one person, you're going to be quoted higher fares than if you're booking for a couple or three or four people per ticket. So apparently what's going on at Delta is their algorithms say that one person traveling alone in certain markets is likely traveling for business.
4:05 Speaker 01 And is not price sensitive. So they are charging fares up to, you ready? Up to 70% higher versus two or more people traveling together. And again, in the testing I did, it's not everywhere. But it's something you need to be aware of. And if it turns out to be sticky, you know that American and United are going to follow right behind Delta and start doing the same thing where they discriminate against one person traveling alone. Now, how are people getting around it now that that word's getting out there? It's going to infuriate the airlines. But what you do, remember, under federal law, you have 24 hours to cancel a ticket.
4:50 Speaker 01 So what you do is you book, if you see the fare is much, much, much cheaper for two people going per ticket than one person going, you book for two people. And then within the 24 hours, you call up and say, I'm sorry, I'm going, but my spouse isn't going, my friend isn't going. And once you've already got that ticket, you're in a contract. The contract doesn't say that the fare is only for two or more people traveling together. You book the cheaper fare, cancel for the one person, completely free within 24 hours, and you now have saved a lot of money on your ticket. Should you have to go through all that? Should you have to?
5:35 Speaker 01 No. But if this is a game that Delta wants to play, and you can save a lot of money, then save the money. But the big thing is if you are loyal to a particular full fare airline, American United or Delta, you're costing yourself big money. Because what you want to do is you want to shop, and my favorite shopping tool, if you know where you're going and approximately when, google.com/flight. Other people love Hopper. You're able to see a survey of what everybody's charging. And so you may normally fly American, but then you see United has a fare that's $100
6:20 Speaker 01 less. Well, I think you can give up your advantage points and save the $100. Whatever it is, I am not loyal to an airline anymore. I was loyal forever to my girlfriend, Southwest Airlines, but the new private equity owners of Southwest have destroyed my loyalty. So now I am back to being a free agent, which I probably should have been to start with. But the more you stay loyal to one brand, the more you're gonna pay, period.
6:57 Speaker 02 Okay, Philip in North Carolina has a travel question. We've booked a tour to New Zealand in March of 2026. We want to fly business class from Dallas Fort Worth or an airport on the West Coast because business class airfares are not competitive from North Carolina. I have a trial subscription to going.com, which will expire soon. Is it too early to book fares? Should we pay for going.com subscription and then watch the fares for a few months and then decide? We see that the cheapest business class fares today are one stop in Fiji using Fiji Airways. We don't mind those extra three hours, especially since it will be in business class. But is this a reliable airline?
7:34 Speaker 01 All right, Philip, this is a great question. I never see complaints online a lot about Fiji Airways. I've got no experience hearing from people. Now I will, well, let me tell you what Fiji Airways did to me. But something you need to know, their business class is not created equal flight to flight. Some flights have just basically almost like a premium economy where it's a recliner. And then other planes they have have full life flats. So when you book, if you do book with Fiji, you got to look at the equipment. Look at seatguru.com and you'll be able to decode.
8:17 Speaker 01 Are you actually in a real business class or a pretend business class? Because the savings aren't worth it if it turns out you're in something like a glorified premium economy pretending to be business class. Now, I do want you to know that you should sign up for fare alerts from Air New Zealand. Sometimes you'll see a deal on Air New Zealand that discounts the business class if you treat New Zealand as a stopover instead of your final destination. So you have to suffer by going to Sydney or Melbourne or something like that in Australia,
8:59 Speaker 01 and you get a much cheaper price on your trip to New Zealand that way. So sign up for those alerts, pay for the premium Going newsletters so that you'll see the business class fares because you have to sign up for their premium one to see the cheapest business class fares.
9:19 Speaker 02 Speaking of that, this is from Dennis in North Carolina. Clark, you mentioned that Going was a great site for flight deals. Which option do you use? Limited, free, premium $49 a year, or elite $199 a year? The Going website suggests that one gets the best deals with elite, but I don't think you would actually spend that much for a subscription. Am I confused or what?
9:40 Speaker 01 Dennis, I'm going to blow your mind. I spend the money for elite because I travel, as I've talked about, I travel roughly 30 weeks a year. And so I want the best deal all the time. And when we take a fun trip, not one that I'm going somewhere for work or whatever, we let the deal pick our destination. So we get these crazy deals that are really phenomenal. In fact, Krista, you tipped me off before I saw it to an elite deal on Going where
10:19 Speaker 01 we were able to redeem points for business class at a great price to Santiago and Buenos Aires. And so Lain and I are going in the winter. To South America, which will be summer there at redeeming points at about a level you would for a coach, we're going to be live flatbed. So yeah, one time you get a deal like that, it's worth the $200 a year if you travel quite regularly. If travel is a less frequent thing, but you do travel a half dozen or more times a year, I would
10:58 Speaker 01 say the premium is the right one. The limited is really just almost like a teaser, the one you get for free to try to get you interested and intrigued. So you sign up for one of the paid levels.
11:12 Speaker 02 And Logan in California says, I'm in my mid 20s and single in California with an income of about $125,000 a year. Between my employer and I, we contribute 14% to a traditional 401k in addition to me maxing out my Roth IRA and HSA.
11:26 Speaker 01 My goodness, in mid 20s doing this?
11:29 Speaker 02 And smaller contributions into a traditional brokerage.
11:31 Speaker 01 I love this.
11:33 Speaker 02 Given the high tax rates I'm subject to, does it still make sense for me to contribute to a Roth 401k instead of my traditional 401k that I've been doing? I have started listening in recently and heard you recommend more Roth at a younger age, but with my tax rate so high between federal and California state, it just doesn't seem to be that beneficial.
11:52 Speaker 01 So the federal tax rate would make it absolutely worth doing a Roth 401k instead of traditional. Your federal rate, even though your marginal rate may be at 24, your effective tax rate is probably more like 18 because remember it's only your marginal means, only your, your dollars above a certain threshold are taxed at 22 or 24%. So no doubt under the federal, the Roth 401k would be the superior choice. Here's the hard part though. California
12:31 Speaker 01 has a very progressive income tax, which means that the tax brackets go up in a hurry. You're probably at the California 9% rate. And even when you blend that at the various levels, you're probably paying 7%, 7.5% effective.
12:51 Speaker 01 California income tax. So that means you're now paying 30% combined. I would still say at 30%, do the Roth 401k as much as it hurts. The exception would be if your intention, and this is such a hard question to ask. You are in your mid twenties, talking about 40 years from now. Are you going to go live in a zero income tax state? Who knows what tax rates are going to be 40 years from now at the state level. But at the federal level, because of the ridiculous federal budget deficits we're running and the accumulated federal debt, there is zero doubt
13:33 Speaker 01 that federal tax rates are going to be higher in the future. So I think it's still worth it for you to do the Roth 401k. So you know, you've paid the tax, you're done. That money is going to be yours tax-free way down the road. You're going to have the compounding of that money in the investments you have in the 401k. Maybe you just do target retirement fund way down the road. And if you've got X dollars in it, you have X dollars to spend. If you're in a traditional 401k, you've got X minus 30% more or less. Whatever your tax rates end up being later.
14:18 Speaker 01 If it were me, I would go Roth 401k. 40 years from now, I won't be around for you to be mad at. But that is the choice I would make. Coming up ahead, people accumulate these mountains of points and miles. And now the big thing, the credit card companies mimicking the airlines and the hotels with points and miles. But guess what? They can devalue them too. And they're starting to.
14:53 Speaker 00 This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.
15:23 Speaker 01 So, the points thing is something that I've talked about for years with the devaluation of points. Southwest Airlines recently devalued their points. Suddenly, meaning somebody who was thinking, "Oh, I'm closer and closer to the goal of that free ticket." Suddenly, Southwest moved the goalposts and said, "Joke's on you." And this happened throughout the travel industry. It's crazy when you look at Marriott and Hilton and you look at Bonvoy and you look at the Hilton Honors Program, how the number of points required for a free stay keeps going up, up, up, and away.
16:05 Speaker 01 And so, you're chasing it and then it turns out it's fool's gold. And now Citibank is fooling around with devaluing their, what they call, "thank you" points. Remember when Citi changed how the double cash worked? And I freaked out because double cash was so simple. You were getting 2% cash back. It was cash that came to you if you wanted it. Now, it's all these goofy points, which then gives them the ability to just one day wake up and say, "You know what? We want to increase our profits, so we're devaluing people's points."
16:47 Speaker 01 Points sitting there, airline, hotel, credit card, whatever. Remember, they are their points. They are their miles. And if they want to change how they work, you need to know that the change they make is never in your favor. So, people will build up these points and they feel great about all these points they have. You want to use them. Now- I've talked about the advantage for travelers. Instead of being point loyal to the airlines, I've talked about doing so with the cards, the expensive travel cards.
17:30 Speaker 01 The Amex Platinum, the Chase Sapphire Reserve, the Chase Sapphire Preserve, which has affordable annual fee, 95 bucks, or 99, 95. And then the Capital One Venture X, and to a lesser extent, Capital One Venture. So far, knocked on Formica if you hear that. So there's no real wood in here. So far, none of them have done any experimentation with devaluing their points. And I've found that it's been very, very useful for travelers with those cards, all three of them, the Chase product, the Capital One, and the Amex,
18:15 Speaker 01 have been great for transferring points when you want to redeem for an international trip on an airline, particularly if you like to fly premium economy or front of the plane. It's been a great redemption opportunity. Being able to check availability, know there's availability, and then transferring the points to an airline partner. I've also found amazingly, something I never thought I would do, but I've found opportunities transferring points from time to time to hotel programs where I've been able to redeem stays that are on saver or promotion or whatever.
19:00 Speaker 01 Where I'm not sitting there with points in any of the hotel programs. I just have empty memberships as like shells, and then transfer points from a travel card, an independent travel card, rather than the hotel chain's own.
19:17 Speaker 01 So so far, what Citi seems to be testing the waters with is not a common practice with the credit cards. And I think it would be really dumb idea. Doesn't mean they won't do it through the industry, but they lose their cred when they start doing it. And just know that a point sitting in an account unused is a point that could be worth less the next time you look.
19:45 Speaker 02 Questions time. This one's from Edward in Virginia. My wife and I own a 2011 Toyota RAV4 with 185,000 miles. The vehicle's been incredibly reliable. However, due to the age, it needs a new, it needs new wheel bearings. We are looking at repairs of approximately $1,000 per wheel bearing. Right now, only one, right now, only one wheel is bad, but I anticipate the others may be going. Not to mention that no engine or transmission lasts forever. I'm a longtime listener, and I remember your advice was always if the repair cost approaches the value of the vehicle, or half the value, then it may be time to send it to the Toyota afterlife. My wife says whatever it costs, we should pay to
20:26 Speaker 02 have it repaired. Her logic is that a new car could cost $35,000 or more. So why wouldn't we repair our old Toyota? I do not think this is sound logic. Can you help settle this debate?
20:38 Speaker 01 Okay, your wife is always right. Not necessarily repair, no matter what it costs. But a RAV4 Toyota product holds value so well, that this is still worth, let's say 3,000 or so dollars for this RAV4, the repair is 1,000.
20:58 Speaker 02 Well, it's 4,000 if you do all four wheels.
21:00 Speaker 01 Yeah, but right now, only one is bad.
21:01 Speaker 02 Okay, yep.
21:03 Speaker 01 So I think it's worth the gamble because a monthly payment on a vehicle, if you were, if you were taking out a loan for it, is often around $700 a month, more or less, many times more. It's not unusual for payment to be over a grand now on a vehicle. And that's the cost of this repair. If you get a couple of months out of the vehicle, and then you cry uncle, she's still right. Because you bought yourself more time in the vehicle. Now, we're talking just money here. Most people who've kept a vehicle 15 model years are like, "Okay, this is incredible. We've kept this a long time and we'd love to have something new."
21:48 Speaker 01 And once you get past 10 years, that's fine to do. But if you're asking me just straight money? And not like, "Wouldn't it be nice to have something newer, more reliable?" If it's just money, she's right, Edward.
22:03 Speaker 02 Brian in Wisconsin says, "I receive gift cards to a restaurant I won't use. I've heard about websites where you can sell them for a little less than their face amount. Can you recommend any legitimate sites?"
22:13 Speaker 01 So, little less depends on the restaurant chain, but figure you're going to get like 70 cents on the dollar, somewhere in there for a typical national chain when you're selling a gift card. There are sites that are legit. Let's say you're a buyer. You're paying a spread. So, let's say the seller gets 70 cents on the dollar. You might be paying 80 cents on the dollar to buy a card for that restaurant chain. So, yeah, you can turn that into money. Be very careful. We've done the best we can in an article we update at Clark.com
22:56 Speaker 01 to know which of these gift card exchange sites are on the up and up, as best we know. There are some out there that are really sketch, though. So, be careful where you would attempt to buy a card, where you'd attempt to sell a card. One of our reviewers' favorite at Clark.com is Card Cash. And so, you can see what that restaurant card would be worth there. It's not the only one out there, but you can check out our reviews. As a buyer, if you want to buy gift cards at one of these exchange sites,
23:38 Speaker 01 only buy from one that guarantees if the gift card has been looted, if it's empty, that they stand behind it and the money you have paid.
23:49 Speaker 02 Angie in Texas says, "I love to read. I'm an Amazon Prime subscriber, so I take part in their first reads program. It's my choice of one to two free new Kindle releases from a short list of curated options. I'll also use Libby and the public library, but I live in a small rural town and that's more of a supplementary source of reading material than my main one. I have a couple of friends who subscribe to Kindle Unlimited and/or other book subscription programs, but I can't remember that having been covered by Clark. Are they worth the price overall and/or for certain readers?"
24:20 Speaker 01 So the Unlimited, it's like 12, 15 a month?
24:25 Speaker 02 It's 12 a month. You can do a 30-day trial, though, and they have like over 4 million titles. So I would do a free trial and see if you're finding all these titles, like if you think you would use it.
24:36 Speaker 01 So Angie, here's my thing on it. If you are a voracious reader, you read all the time, it's worth it for you to pay 150 bucks a year. Because if you think about, you go to, we used to have these things called bookstores. You go in to buy a book, physical book, how much you're paying for it. If you're reading, like, I know there are people who are super readers, and they're reading like a book a week.
25:06 Speaker 02 My mother reads more than one a week, yeah.
25:08 Speaker 01 Really? I mean, if you are Angie, somebody who's reading all the time, you read a ton of books, absolutely, it's worth it for you to do this subscription. And who knows when Amazon lures you in at that price and then raises it to a point. It doesn't make sense, but I'd say at under, it's gonna be crazy, but if you're reading more than a book a week, or reading a book a week, it absolutely makes sense for you to be able to read what you want and pay for that subscription. That's right. You heard me say to pay for something.
25:50 Speaker 01 Have I lost my mind? Well, if you think I have, we have a long list at Clark.com of the best places to find free eBooks in addition to what you already said in your question. So have an absolutely great day.
26:10 Speaker 01 Think about how you can save more in your life, spend less, and absolutely avoid getting ripped off. And I know there are times when you hear me talk about an industry, like talking about the airlines and the hotels and the banks misbehaving. And you can become a cynic. But the reality is, there are lots of people doing the right thing in a business, day after day, thinking as they should about how best to serve the employees that work for them, and in turn, the customers that buy from them. And I think most people out there are doing the right thing.
26:54 Speaker 01 So don't be a cynic. Want to be skeptical? Be skeptical. But no room for cynicism. And have an absolutely great day.
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