Pod Insights The Clark Howard Podcast 03.17.25 Pay Less For A Vehicle / Power Bills: Smart Meters Vs Regular Meters About this episode Today Clark focuses on one of the biggest purchases most of us make in life - cars. There are ways to get a vehicle for way less money than most people pay. Also, a look at the pros & cons of so called smart electric meters and time of use plans offered by utility companies - and how to decide which is best for you. Best Low Cost Vehicles: Segment 1 Ask Clark: Segment 2 Smart Meters: Segment 3 Ask Clark: Segment 4 Mentioned on the show: Best new cars in 2025: Consumer Reports reveals top picks for reliability, safety and more Costco Car Buying Program: 4 Things To Know Before You Sign Up How To Buy a Used Car / How to Buy a New Car in 5 Steps Elliott Report: Home Should You Get a Smart Meter for Your Home? What Is Term Life Insurance? How To Buy Term Life Insurance in 7 Easy Steps What Is Disability Insurance and How Does It Work? Clark.com resources Episode transcripts Community. Clark.com / Ask Clark Clark.com daily money newsletter Consumer Action Center Free Helpline: 636-492-5275 Learn more about your ad choices: megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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1:20 Speaker 02 It's great to have you here on the Clark Howard Show. You know, our mission is to serve you with advice and information that empowers you so you make better financial decisions in your life. And today, I'm going to begin with what for most of us is the second largest purchase we make several times over our lifetime, and that's automobiles, vehicles, SUVs, whatever you want to call them, cars. There are ways to get cars for less money with less hassle than most people pay. And also, it's becoming more and more common around the country that our power provider offers us smart meters
2:00 Speaker 02 and different time of use, time of day use, power plans. When are those a good idea? When are they a bad idea? We're going to talk about that. So, just the other day, I talked about the movement in the housing market and that we're at a pivot point in the housing market, the largest thing we spend money on. And today, I want to talk about a trend that for the first time in years is your friend in the vehicle market. So the automakers got used to being fat and happy during the supply chain shortages
2:39 Speaker 02 during the COVID years and refused to acknowledge in their internal meetings and their planning that the market has shifted. And that's why for most brands, the dealer lots are packed with product, new vehicles to sell. But with a problem, the automakers got addicted to selling high-end models optioned out. And those vehicles are sitting there unloved. And dealer groups are pleading with the manufacturers, change the product mix and give us incentives that'll move those vehicles that are sitting unloved on our lots off
3:23 Speaker 02 those lots. That's why here we are in March of 25, and a lot of dealers are still trying to move the metal of 24 model years. I mean, they got a problem with inventory. That's your friend. But the other thing that shifted is automakers are rediscovering selling some more affordable vehicles. So I've been looking online to see what affordable vehicles are actually selling for. And the shocker was there are even some limited numbers of new models that are retailing out in the upper teens. And Consumer Reports, every
4:07 Speaker 02 April publishes its annual auto buying guide. And the advanced information of it, and some people who are subscribers have already gotten that issue now, shows there are some affordable vehicles that also Consumer Reports recommends.
4:26 Speaker 02 And also pass their reliability tests. I'm going to give you an example of a brand that is unloved in the United States right now. Nissan, they've got the Sentra, which is a sedan that the manufacturer suggested retail price is like 21,500 and I was seeing them available online at 18.5 to 19.6 from dealers. And Consumer Reports says, hey, this is a deal on a new vehicle. Think about the average used vehicle right now costs 27,000, 28,000. And here you have a brand new vehicle selling for around 20 plus or minus.
5:11 Speaker 02 Got to shop around. I'll talk about that in a second. And that's just an example of vehicles Consumer Reports recommends that are more affordable. They recommend a Subaru Crosstrek that starts at 25 grand. Subaru Forester that starts at 25 grand. Toyota Camry that starts at 28 grand. And the Ford Maverick pickup truck that is a, has been a hot item in the marketplace since it was introduced, that starts at 27 grand. They love two particular Toyotas.
5:51 Speaker 02 The midsize Toyota Highlander Hybrid, which is a lot of money, starts at 46 grand. And the RAV4 plug-in hybrid starts at 44. So these are vehicles that get crazy good fuel economy, but are much more money. If you're looking to keep the prices down though, or you're looking to try to figure out what used car you should buy, what new vehicle would be more affordable. I encourage you so much to either buy the physical copy of the Consumer Reports
6:31 Speaker 02 Annual Auto Buying Guide, or if you want to see the electronic version, a lot of times your library makes the electronic version available for free, or you can buy one-time use of it to have the information on buying a vehicle. It is the best source I know, and the Consumer Reports Annual Auto Buying Guide is your friend. You know what else is your friend? What has, I think, become the largest car buying program in the United States, the Costco Auto Program. I actually got a friend to join the Costco Auto Program when he was buying a new vehicle a couple of months ago, because he'd been complaining
7:16 Speaker 02 to me about what it had been like at the dealers. What the Costco Program does is it's such a powerful seller of products and has a more affluent customer base, that the Costco Auto Buying Program works this way. Costco has terms and conditions that the dealers have to live by, a non-negotiated price, no games, no gimmicks, no cons, no grind, no weird pressure, no roofing your keys. You remember what roofing, you ever heard me talk about roofing keys? I'll tell you that in a second. Anyway, Costco Program, you know upfront what that vehicle's going to cost before you ever have to set foot
8:01 Speaker 02 at a dealer. And it is a clean buying process. If it's not at a dealer, you report them. Costco hears enough complaints about a dealer, they're kicked out, for real. And because the Costco buyers come with the ability to buy, and their sales are quick and easy, dealers crave having that buyer base. And we have a guide at Clark.com, how to take advantage of the Costco Car Buying Program.
8:35 Speaker 02 Now roofing your keys. Gosh, it was funny because I was talking with somebody who brought it up yesterday. So roofing is a trick that car dealers use, not all car dealers, just crooked ones. Unfortunately, there are still some crooked dealers. So you go there, you're looking at a vehicle and they're going to praise your used vehicle to see what they'll give you as trade-in. And then you decide you're not going forward with anything there. And gosh, they can't find your keys. What happened to your keys to the car you went there in? And so the expression roofing
9:15 Speaker 02 comes from back in the old days, they would literally throw your car keys on the roof and not be able to find them supposedly to keep you there and put you through the grind and wear you out, get you hungry and thirsty and get you to sign for a new vehicle or a new to you used vehicle you didn't really want. Yep. Things really do get that dirty at some car dealers. And it is the fifth most common complaint. We get to the Team Clark Consumer Action Center, the way dealers that are dishonest may try to rip you off. You gotta be aware, you gotta be wary. And the best thing, let's say you don't want to do the Costco thing, still you negotiate your
9:59 Speaker 02 deal online. You make your deal online. You never, never, never, not ever make your deal at the dealer because remember you're on their home field, their home field advantage. You want to maintain home field advantage by being hard to get doing your shopping from your home.
10:23 Speaker 03 All right. Here's a question from Steve in Connecticut and this relates to cars. We have a 2006 Honda Accord EX with 227,800 miles on it. It's not our primary.
10:34 Speaker 02 It's a baby.
10:34 Speaker 03 It's not our primary car. It needs to have a new catalytic converter to cost up between $2,933.50 to be able to pass Connecticut emissions and be able to
10:45 Speaker 03 Renew its registration. We have no other problems with this car. Do you think it would be worth the cost of repair? If we don't repair it, we would be looking to replace this car in May of this year. Historically, this model is lasting over 300,000 miles.
10:58 Speaker 02 Yeah, and, and this car would have a value still significantly higher than the cost of the catalytic converter. But catalytic converter money is like throwing money down a rat hole. I mean, you get, you'll get not one cent additional value out of your Honda Accord when you do eventually sell it with that new catalytic converter versus not having it because there are so many states and areas that don't have emission testing. You'd be able to sell that vehicle into one of those. But not having a payment, you think about, okay, so if you spend three grand on this catalytic converter, how many months' payments
11:43 Speaker 02 is that on a typical vehicle loan? Do you know?
11:46 Speaker 03 Mm-mm.
11:47 Speaker 02 Four.
11:48 Speaker 03 Oh.
11:49 Speaker 02 So all you have to do is get four more months out of the Accord EX, and you're pretty much even with having done the catalytic converter on it. And since the car is so mechanically sound, other than catalytic converter problem, I think you'd be making a good decision to do the catalytic converter. Also, you say you drive it very little. Many states have an exemption when there's an emission problem if you can prove mileage of less than maybe 2,500 miles a year. I don't know how few you're driving it now per year, but you should
12:31 Speaker 02 see if Connecticut has an exemption for low mileage vehicles, low mileage used vehicles, like 200 miles a month or less of driving. If you can get the vehicle registered and avoid having to replace the catalytic converter.
12:46 Speaker 03 Dwight in Maryland says, I've been a listener for years and have benefited immensely. Thanks for keeping this going. I have been an EV owner since 2016 when I bought my first Model S. I'm planning to trade in my 2021 Model X for a 2025 Gen 2 Rivian R1S, but I am struggling on when to make the switch. If I buy now, I can take advantage of Rivian's incentives, including a 1.99% financing for a dual max performance.
13:12 Speaker 02 That's going to be an expensive Rivian you're looking at.
13:16 Speaker 03 Though I would prefer to wait for a used Gen 2 R1S, I am concerned about the trade-in value of my Model X dropping substantially. Should I wait until the late spring to make the switch to a used R1S or swing now with the current Rivian incentives for a new one while taking advantage of my Model X's current value?
13:36 Speaker 02 Do we know how many miles the Model X has?
13:38 Speaker 03 P.S. No, but he said, "P.S. My 2016 Model S is still kicking at 163,000 miles. Do you think Rivian's will hold up?"
13:48 Speaker 02 Go read, I was just talking at the top of this about the Consumer Reports annual issue. Read what they say about Rivian's. They're fun, but read Consumer Reports reliability report and stuff on the Rivian before you go forward with the R1S. Second thing, the value of Tesla already, they took big hits in the first 24 months. They depreciate generally more than other vehicles based on the cycle of when you bought potentially in '21. So
14:26 Speaker 02 I don't think you have to worry as much from here, these number of years later, that you've got a certain flatlining to the depreciation of your X moving from here.
14:42 Speaker 02 And so if you want to wait for a used Rivian, I think you'll be rewarded because I don't think the value of your X will decline at any large rate month by month by month that you would wait. On the other hand, if you just love the R1S, you want to get one, they've got the 2% financing, 1.99 rounded up to 2, and you can afford to do it, have a great time.
15:13 Speaker 03 Okay, this came in from Mark in Florida. It's a cautionary tale. I engaged Hertz via X about an issue we had with tolls, and then I didn't like the way they responded. I went public on X with my dissatisfaction. Then I got a response from a different Hertz account asking me for the details and the reason for my dissatisfaction. I responded to them in a DM. They asked me for my phone number where they could reach me. I gave it to them. Within the next five minutes, I got a call from, I think it was a 234 area code. The caller ID said something like customer support. It didn't say anything about Hertz. I spoke to them. They asked again for the details of the incident, and I told them why I was unhappy. They were very solicitous and said they were going to make it right, and they were going to give me a refund. Somewhere there, I got suspicious. Then they said
15:58 Speaker 03 they were going to give me a link to download an app.
16:01 Speaker 02 Ooh.
16:02 Speaker 03 That really set off alarm bells. And because I realized I didn't know who these people were, I said, can we do this without me downloading an app? His initial reaction was, yes, we can, but it's going to delay your refund by 60 days because we're going to have to do it by email. He said, do you want to be delayed 60 days? I said, yeah, that's okay. I can wait. Then he got annoyed and hung up, and I realized I'd come very close to being scammed. I thought I was okay because I had initiated contact, but then I realized I hadn't, at least not with these people.
16:33 Speaker 02 Yeah, and thank you. I really appreciate you posting this because what happened, once you went public on X with your complaint about Hertz... Then you were fair game for people out there and a scammer went after you hard. So with Hertz, I can tell you by experience that we've heard from so many people. Hertz is a true customer no service organization. In fact, Hertz might win an annual award for customer no service. So with Hertz being so proud to treat people so badly who have problems with them. The one thing that I think may help is an organization I mentioned from time to time,
17:17 Speaker 02 Elliott.org, that has what they call executive level contacts at certain companies. And they'll tell you if they are able to get results that way. It gets you outside the customer no service bureaucracy and may get your problem resolved with them. And I'd love to hear back from you if you try the Elliott.org method of contacts that they can get you to and see if that does get this problem solved with Hertz that till this point has been unsolvable. And yes, maybe we should come up with our own hole of shame of companies with customer no service. Who knows?
18:00 Speaker 02 Coming up ahead, smart meters versus regular power meters at your house. Smart plans versus dumb plans. What should you be doing?
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19:57 Speaker 02 Your power company likely has installed what are known as smart meters at your residence or your small business. Smart meters initially started appearing a good long while ago. That eliminated the labor cost of meter readers for power companies. And other utilities have put in that kind of smart meter. It means that they can read your meter remotely and don't have to dispatch someone. And that was what they meant first, long ago, by smart meters. But then, things morphed.
20:35 Speaker 02 And today's smart meters can charge you for power by time of day, even minute by minute. Because what you and I don't focus on is behind the curtain, what a power company pays for the power they sell to us, changes depending on what kind of contracts they're in, second by second, minute by minute, whatever. So more and more power companies are offering you and me the ability with these smart meters to pay time of use. And with us, it's not really possible for us to be able to,
21:18 Speaker 02 with our busy lives, to watch what power costs the power company minute by minute. But there are general patterns, general trends. And so a lot of power companies now offer time of use, where in the afternoon in hot parts of the country, from like 2 to 7 in the afternoon, usually starting about May Day through till October 1st, depending on where you are in the country. From 2 to 7, the cost of power is through the roof. And then before 2 o'clock, after 7 till about midnight, power is a much more reasonable rate.
22:02 Speaker 02 And then midnight to like 5, 6 or 7 a.m., power is really cheap, maybe even free. Free to you. So that's the most common, and I'm simplifying these time of use things. Then in addition to having the time of use, they may have a regular plan that just sets rates by typically time of year. And so during high demand periods, you pay more per kilowatt because it's costing them more to supply the power. But I don't mean by hour of the day, I mean just time of year. So which should you be in? Depends on your lifestyle.
22:45 Speaker 02 If you're gone all day long and you put in like a Nest or any other kind of smart thermostat and you turn the temperature way up in your home during the peak hours that they're charging the crazy high kilowatt cost per kilowatt, then a smart meter would work for you. If you're gone during those hours anyway off at work or whatever, why should you be paying a price that would not benefit you? So you're the kind of person, you put in that smart thermostat, you drive down your consumption during those five or so hours of the day, you're going to save a lot of
23:29 Speaker 02 money on your power. What about a family with kids? Huh. Forget it. Forget it. Doing a smart meter and a thing where people are in or out of the house, you've got millions of loads of laundry to do and all that, a smart meter will be the death of your wallet. If you go on the smart plan that has the peaks and the off peaks. The roughly 8% of people who drive an electric vehicle, these time of use plans are fantastic because you, with your home charger, if you have one, you set the vehicle only to charge during the hours that you're paying a penny a kilowatt or you're having free overnight
24:14 Speaker 02 power or whatever. And then you're running your vehicle, your energy costs for your vehicle go to near zero. You've got to know your circumstance to see if it's worth it for you to go on time of day, time of use plans. Otherwise, the simple, regular plan is the smarter choice.
24:39 Speaker 02 Do you have a smart meter at your home?
24:41 Speaker 03 No, I do not. I tried. The power company had a program that I tried and it did not work in my favor. So I stopped using it.
24:50 Speaker 02 So I used one for four years where it was a different kind of thing. They offered, I got a lower rate if I would allow during the summer that they could take control of my air conditioner during hot days, hot afternoons and send the temperature soaring in the house. Let me tell you, Elaine and the kids were not happy with me. I was much happier with my wallet because yeah, you'd sweat a little, but it saved us a ton on our electric bill because of how much power companies pay per second for power during peaking times.
25:29 Speaker 03 I mean, I could handle that during the day in the summer, but overnight I needed to be like an ice locker and I would never do that, honestly. Ken in Michigan says-
25:39 Speaker 02 You need to have the ice batteries when those become available.
25:42 Speaker 03 I do, I do. State Farm is offering Ting Fire Safety Devices to monitor my home and electrical system for free. The system uses a 24/7 Wi-Fi connection to talk with Ting and is supposed to provide early warning of potential electrical fire hazards. There's no insurance discount associated with it. Is this a good idea and is there anything I should be aware of before signing up?
26:04 Speaker 02 Take the Ting. Take it from State Farm. My insurer requires it and doesn't pay for it. State Farm is paying for it. You take the Ting because, I mean, think about it. What it does, it's going to let you know that there's a potential fire hazard with some part of your electrical or also notify, get you, you know, get early fire response if there is apparently-
26:34 Speaker 02 Small fire going on in your home. I think the Ting thing is great.
26:39 Speaker 03 Take the Ting, the Ting thing.
26:41 Speaker 02 Take the Ting.
26:41 Speaker 03 So many, okay. Cumberland in Tennessee says, should I purchase a term life insurance policy for my spouse? He had a heart attack in October of 2024.
26:50 Speaker 02 Oh, I hope he's okay.
26:51 Speaker 03 He is doing fabulous and went from 256 pounds to 220 pounds. I'm not working currently and he is retired. He will be 69, I'll be 60. This is our second marriage. We are both widowers. We have a will and zero debt. Any guidance you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
27:08 Speaker 02 All right, so number one, awesome, you have no debt. The purpose of the insurance is replacement of income for the survivor. And 69, retired, having had a heart attack, insurance is very difficult to obtain. But then there's also, what is the purpose? Does your husband have a pension that ceases? That you'll no longer have that household income at the time of his passing? So if your life would face a financial hazard in addition to your heart
27:54 Speaker 02 suffering over the loss of your husband, if your finances would really be in trouble, then there's an insurable need. Whether that insurable need is insurable at 69 with a heart attack requires you to get a life insurance agent to see if it's possible to buy an affordable term life insurance policy. Now, at 69, the term life policy that will normally be available if it is medically underwritten, meaning that they say, okay, we'll write this policy. We'll generally be at that age, what's known as an annual renewable term,
28:36 Speaker 02 that the insurance price would go up each year as what's known as mortality risk increases as we age each year. A level term policy that I usually talk about for people in their working years is not generally something you can purchase. In retirement, particularly approaching age 70. But the real question is, is there a need for replacement of income at the time of his death? What do you lose? I know your heart, but what do you lose financially at the time either or of you pass away? And that brings the other thing.
29:18 Speaker 02 For you at age 60, do you need a life insurance policy to protect him? If you are outlived by him by some chance, what money would he need from you in order to pay for life moving forward?
29:36 Speaker 03 Nick in Iowa says, "My question's about having enough long-term disability coverage. My employer offers long-term disability as part of my benefits, and it has 60% income replacement until age 65. What should I consider for supplemental long-term disability? Is it needed based on what I have through work? I've gotten some quotes, and I've noticed a large increase in premium between having a five-year benefit versus having it last until age 65. I would love to hear from you on what considerations should be looked at when adding this policy."
30:10 Speaker 02 So Nick, great question from you about disability insurance. I'm almost never asked about disability insurance, even though we're three times more likely to be disabled and unable to work in our prime working years than we are to pass away during those years. People are much more likely to have life insurance, not have disability. Congratulations that you work for an employer who's looking out for you and provides disability insurance to you as part of your benefits package. That's great. So, the company that provides the disability insurance through your employer may offer
30:52 Speaker 02 the ability for you at much lower cost than you buying a supplemental disability insurance policy from somewhere else. They may offer you an option to add on, normally people buy disability, 60% disability, 70%. And 70 is usually where it ends up, is the cap on what you can buy in most states. You may be able at a very low additional cost with the existing policy to add on that additional 10%. But because the supplemental is so expensive to buy elsewhere, if you cannot add on that additional 10% through your employer plan,
31:36 Speaker 02 I'd rather see you take those premiums and build them up over time in a rainy day account and a Roth IRA instead of buying a separate supplemental policy. Because the 60% disability policy till age 65 is already getting you most of the way there and your dollars would be more efficiently spent now going towards savings or going into my beloved tax-free Roth IRA. And I want to thank you so much for joining us on today's episode. And I hope that you have learned something that will help you pack a punch in your wallet
32:21 Speaker 02 and know that if somebody is taking advantage of you, you have a money question you're trying to figure out, whatever, we offer one-on-one free advice 30 hours each week from our Team Clark Consumer Action Center. You can see everything you need to know about getting that free one-on-one advice if you go to Clark.com/CAC. And it's just one part of our empowerment zone so that you are in a position to save more, spend less, and avoid getting ripped off. Have a great day.
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