KHC 206 - Sh*t Talkers Weekly 32 with the Bow Disciples

We’re back with a new Sh*t Talkers Weekly episode! This week we’re joined by James Visser and Brianna Curley from The Bow Disciples to talk archery and hunting hot takes! The Bow Disciples is a community of dedicated bowhunters and outdoorsmen united by a passion for the hunt, conservation, and living the bowhunting lifestyle. Through authentic storytelling, education, and adventure, they inspire hunters to sharpen their skills, respect the traditions of the sport, and pursue every hunt with purpose. Follow Bow Disciples: https://www.instagram.com/bowdisciples/ Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Timestamps: 00:00:00 – Friendly Archery Competition, Bentley, & Drake Music 00:03:11 – Hot Take: 430 Grain Arrows are the Perfect Weight 00:04:58 – Hot Take: Bigger Shaft Arrows Aren’t Necessary 00:08:06 – Hot Take: Lighted Nocks Reduce Accuracy 00:10:37 – Hot Take: Wraps Changes Arrow Flight 00:10:37 – Practice & Accuracy: Effective Ranges for Hunting 00:12:23 – Laws and Petitions Against Hunting 00:15:46 – Influencers Giving Away Hunting Spots on YouTube 00:19:24 – Ketone Shots & Episode Disclaimers 00:29:25 – Cam’s Favorite Guests, Tom Brady, and Lebron James 00:32:21 – Fancy Cars, Gold Teeth, & Keyboard Warriors 00:38:52 – Creating the Life You Want: Put Yourself Out There 00:52:07 – Cameramen vs Fan Bois: Respect in the Industry 00:56:31 – Hunt Camps, Celebrities, and Real Personalities 01:04:14 – Vegas Indoor Shooting Competitions 01:09:55 – Pressure in Archery Leagues 01:16:51 – ALP, Bentley Giveaway, and MKC Total Archery Challenge 01:20:10 – Gavin Newsom 01:21:32 – Rising Stars and Dorks in the Hunting & Archery Industry 01:29:41 – Competition in the Industry: There’s Cake for Everyone 01:40:58 – Social Media Analytics, Engagement, & Diversity in Content 01:47:00 – Are AI & Lizard People Killing the Environment 01:53:36 – Final Thoughts Thank you to our sponsors: Ketone IQ: https://www.ketone.com/Cam use code CAM for 30% off your first subscription Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv use code CAM for 10% off LMNT: Visit https://drinklmnt.com/cam for a free sample pack with any purchase ALP: https://alppouch.com/ use code CAM for 10% off your first order Grizzly Coolers: https://www.grizzlycoolers.com/ use code KEEPHAMMERING for 15% off MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code CAM for 20% off & Free Shipping

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:15Cameron Hanes?

  This is the Keep Crammer and Collective Shit Talkers Weekly number 32 with special guests, not Gideon, not that fuck up, two real special guests, James Visser, Brianna, are you guys married yet?

• 0:26Speaker 01

  No, not yet, not technically, it's Brianna Curly technically.

• 0:30Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, that's right. Okay. Well, yeah, soon enough.

• 0:33Speaker 01

  Same, same.

• 0:34Cameron Hanes?

  So, James, this is his, this is not the fuck up James, the other James, your second appearance on the show.

• 0:41Speaker 02

  Two time, baby. I love it. I love it. Yeah. We have to link up and shoot every time we can though, because it's always too much fun.

• 0:47Cameron Hanes?

  That was fun. I mean, you're a good shot.

• 0:49Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 0:50Cameron Hanes?

  That, that, that was great. Um, so it took, we had a little 3D course out here, went out and shot, got some, shot some content because content's king, baby, right?

• 1:00Speaker 02

  Oh dude, we stack, we stack.

• 1:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. And I'll say today, which normally this doesn't go this way, I went out to a big lead.

• 1:09Speaker 02

  Big.

• 1:10Cameron Hanes?

  That was, that was not, I was not expecting that because you've been shooting so much and you're so good. And then I was like, I was like, God, am I going to fricking crush him today? No. So got back, we were one point at the final target and I fucked up the final target.

• 1:26Speaker 02

  Damn.

• 1:27Cameron Hanes?

  So whatever.

• 1:28Speaker 02

  And we destroyed a few.

• 1:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:30Speaker 02

  A few victories and a few Eastons took just diggers out there today.

• 1:34Cameron Hanes?

  We did, uh, the steel bear, which has, you know, like a, maybe like a little bigger than a softball, smaller than a volleyball hole at 90, what was it? 93?

• 1:46Speaker 02

  94, I think the second time. Yeah.

• 1:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So.

• 1:48Speaker 02

  And you couldn't really see it. That was the tough part.

• 1:50Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it was in the grass.

• 1:51Speaker 02

  Hidden in the grass. Yeah. But, um, we ended up finally getting one. So it was good. Yeah. Awesome place to shoot too. We had to take the Bentley. Nothing, nothing says, you know.

• 2:00Cameron Hanes?

  No, we didn't get one. You got one in, in, in the hole. So, uh, it was, it almost hit steel.

• 2:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:07Cameron Hanes?

  You're close, but it was a, it was a clean shot in the hole. Good shot for 94 yards. Barely able to see where you're aiming. Good job. Good job.

• 2:16Speaker 02

  The whole course was awesome. Like people definitely got to go watch the video. I'm not sure if it'll land on, I think it'll sort of land on both our channels in ways. So check it out. Multiple versions. And yeah, dude, it's super fun. And first time in a Bentley for me and that thing rips, boy.

• 2:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah. It's a little bit dangerous how fast it goes, but we had the Drake, Drake bumping.

• 2:37Speaker 02

  Oh yeah. We had Drake big time. We had to.

• 2:39Cameron Hanes?

  Well, we had.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  Of course you did.

• 2:41Cameron Hanes?

  We're coming back from the sticks, shooting bows.

• 2:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:44Cameron Hanes?

  On a gravel road in a Bentley.

• 2:46Speaker 01

  What else fits?

• 2:47Cameron Hanes?

  Bumping Drake.

• 2:48Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 2:49Speaker 01

  It has to be Drake.

• 2:50Cameron Hanes?

  How often has that ever happened in the history of mankind?

• 2:53Speaker 02

  Very few.

• 2:54Cameron Hanes?

  I, I bet never.

• 2:55Speaker 01

  First time.

• 2:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:57Cameron Hanes?

  So we just, we just set the standard, baby.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  We did.

• 3:00Cameron Hanes?

  And all you, all you fricking Karens out there that want to like talk shit on us, welcome to the show.

• 3:09Speaker 01

  Well.

• 3:09Cameron Hanes?

  So what are we going to talk shit about?

• 3:11Speaker 02

  What are we going to talk shit? I mean, first things, I know you guys kind of cover a lot on shit talkers, right? It's sort of a pop culture pod.

• 3:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 3:18Speaker 02

  Right about that?

• 3:18Cameron Hanes?

  But we can talk shit on the industry.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  Oh, I mean, I'm in on whatever. You, you want to, James, why don't you toss a subject in here in the ring?

• 3:26Speaker 03

  Shit. Yeah. Hold on, let me change my camera view.

• 3:29Speaker 02

  All right.

• 3:29Cameron Hanes?

  Shit talker subject.

• 3:30Speaker 03

  Um, let's go with, uh, let's just start with some hot takes. Give me a hot take you don't think people will agree with. Throw yourself in the fire a little bit here.

• 3:41Speaker 02

  Okay. Oh, I got one here. I got one. I don't think Cam will like this one.

• 3:47Speaker 02

  I think for most people, most adult men shooters, I think that arrow that's like 430 grains is perfect.

• 3:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 3:56Speaker 02

  On almost every North American animal. Like I don't think we need to be 550 plus.

• 4:02Cameron Hanes?

  Well, I think if you shoot over 60 pounds, that's ego.

• 4:11Speaker 02

  I only draw 52 pounds, dude. So, you know.

• 4:14Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 4:14Speaker 01

  Huh?

• 4:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. What do you draw?

• 4:17Speaker 01

  You said you only draw 52 pounds?

• 4:19Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Cause over 60s.

• 4:20Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 4:21Speaker 02

  We're ego lifting at that point.

• 4:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, right.

• 4:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, you would never ego lift. Of course not. No.

• 4:26Cameron Hanes?

  We're mostly making fun of the dipshits who say, what do you need 90 pounds? You're going to hunt a fucking dinosaur?

• 4:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. What are you hunting?

• 4:34Cameron Hanes?

  Fuck up pussy.

• 4:35Speaker 02

  Yeah. What are you hunting? A walrus dude? Come on, man.

• 4:37Cameron Hanes?

  Hit the gym.

• 4:38Speaker 02

  Yeah. I know. I agree.

• 4:39Speaker 01

  I will say.

• 4:40Speaker 02

  I think you should draw the weight and shoot the 450 grain arrow dude, and just be throwing off shooting fricking laser beams.

• 4:47Cameron Hanes?

  Or shoot the weight 491.

• 4:50Speaker 02

  Is that what you shoot?

• 4:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 4:51Speaker 02

  Oh, I thought you were like a 570 guy. I'm fine with 491.

• 4:55Cameron Hanes?

  491. Yeah. I'm under five, but 491 hits hard.

• 4:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's hard.

• 4:59Cameron Hanes?

  So here's my hot take.

• 5:00Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 5:01Cameron Hanes?

  Okay. So is everybody familiar with the Olympics?

• 5:06Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 5:06Cameron Hanes?

  Okay. So the Olympics is a competition, right? People who go to the Olympics in archery only shoot one shaft. That X10, the parallel pro.

• 5:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:20Cameron Hanes?

  So why the fuck would any dipshit bow hunter think that they shouldn't shoot that?

• 5:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:27Cameron Hanes?

  And shoot some victory? What the fuck's happening?

• 5:31Speaker 02

  Bro, victory is durable, bro.

• 5:34Cameron Hanes?

  Let me, let me, let me. So are we trying to be, what are we going to be kicking it off rocks or trying to kill something?

• 5:40Speaker 02

  Dude, both. You know what I mean? I want something legit, bro. Shout out to the Rival X. Good, great shaft.

• 5:47Cameron Hanes?

  I don't even know what the, I hear these people talk about these shaft names and I'm like, what is this that from Kmart? I've never even heard of this shit.

• 5:55Speaker 01

  What was that joke somebody said to you at Reading when?

• 5:58Speaker 02

  Oh, it was pretty good. Yeah.

• 6:00Speaker 03

  Shaft names are for your mom.

• 6:02Speaker 02

  Dude.

• 6:02Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 6:03Speaker 01

  It was one, but basically they were joking about.

• 6:05Cameron Hanes?

  Your mom loves.

• 6:06Speaker 01

  Or Easton.

• 6:07Cameron Hanes?

  Little Jimmy over here.

• 6:09Speaker 02

  Geez.

• 6:10Cameron Hanes?

  That's my shaft.

• 6:10Speaker 02

  Yeah. You guys have nice shafts. I've lately, I've been shooting these fat shafts, fricking big old girthy bastards.

• 6:17Cameron Hanes?

  So here's another thing.

• 6:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:20Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 6:22Speaker 01

  He's cooking right now.

• 6:23Cameron Hanes?

  No. So we get the line cutters, right? Is that what you're doing?

• 6:26Speaker 02

  That's what I'm doing. Yeah.

• 6:27Cameron Hanes?

  The fat shaft. So what? Okay. This is another thing I don't get. So Easton, I'll take a shot at Easton. Came out with the 5.0s. It's just like, why the fuck do I want a bigger shaft? I want small. So my insert that goes, or the outer is bigger than the shaft, which means the broadhead goes in, cuts a hole that's bigger than my shaft. There's no friction. So it's going to penetrate more because it's a four mil shaft. What, why is, do people want to shoot fat shafts hunting?

• 6:55Speaker 02

  Oh dude, let me tell you. So the Rival X.

• 6:57Cameron Hanes?

  Trying to catch the, the, the lung, the line in the lung?

• 7:01Speaker 02

  Precisely, precisely.

• 7:02Cameron Hanes?

  With that shaft?

• 7:03Speaker 02

  Dude, let me tell you why the Rival X, right? It's a 5.5 millimeter. You like that?

• 7:08Speaker 01

  Even bigger.

• 7:09Speaker 02

  The smallest shaft you can shoot with all internal components, right? So I could shoot a cinder block with that thing and it's just fine, you know? So.

• 7:17Speaker 01

  Didn't hold up to that steel.

• 7:20Cameron Hanes?

  What?

• 7:21Speaker 03

  I didn't see that footage.

• 7:24Cameron Hanes?

  We're talking about cinder blocks.

• 7:25Speaker 01

  Of course. It's totally different. Yeah.

• 7:27Cameron Hanes?

  Different topic.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  Uh, you have a hot take.

• 7:30Cameron Hanes?

  No, no, I want to.

• 7:32Speaker 01

  Finish your.

• 7:32Speaker 02

  Oh, we're still on.

• 7:33Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 7:33Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 7:34Cameron Hanes?

  Why do you want to shoot an inferior shaft?

• 7:36Speaker 02

  Dude, I don't, I think.

• 7:37Cameron Hanes?

  To make bow hunting harder? Is it too easy for you?

• 7:39Speaker 02

  It is pretty. I mean, dude, here's the thing, right?

• 7:42Speaker 01

  What about the ego?

• 7:43Speaker 02

  Nobody makes arrows straighter than victory. They're the best arrows. I know the guys. I know them well. I know them possibly better than anybody.

• 7:52Cameron Hanes?

  I guess the people in the Olympics don't want to win a gold medal. Otherwise they shoot victory apparently.

• 7:56Speaker 02

  Yeah. Paige, Paige is an Easton gal. She is. Yeah. She's an Easton gal. Yeah.

• 8:01Cameron Hanes?

  Isn't she like one of the best shooters ever?

• 8:04Speaker 02

  She's very good.

• 8:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 8:05Speaker 02

  Very good.

• 8:07Cameron Hanes?

  Another, another hot take I have is, so people, people talk about, oh, I don't want to, the components on the fucking lighted knock. I want to be able to see the, so if you're putting lighted knock on your, on your arrow, you're giving up accuracy.

• 8:24Speaker 02

  I agree with that.

• 8:25Cameron Hanes?

  Do you think if they made you more accurate, wouldn't they shoot those in Vegas?

• 8:29Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 8:30Cameron Hanes?

  How many people in Vegas shoot a lighted knock?

• 8:32Speaker 02

  I did not see any.

• 8:33Speaker 01

  There would be zero.

• 8:34Cameron Hanes?

  So why? Why would that be?

• 8:36Speaker 02

  Yeah. Cause well, I think that like you said, the group size, when I've shot lit knocks, which is only a few times, my groups were not as good.

• 8:42Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 8:43Speaker 02

  So I think to your point, I don't think they're.

• 8:44Cameron Hanes?

  So, so they don't, if they don't help you hunting, so what, you want to be able to see the arrow hit in the guts?

• 8:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:52Cameron Hanes?

  Instead of not see it hit in the lungs and have it go pile up?

• 8:55Speaker 02

  Well, also I want to add to this a little bit. I believe that animals, when they jump strings, I think most of the time they're seeing.

• 9:02Speaker 01

  You stole my hot take.

• 9:03Speaker 02

  I think they're hitting it off vision, right? So I think a lit knock is just going to show up like a even more.

• 9:08Speaker 01

  And I think it a thousand percent is. I think people, uh, not only sacrifice like their, um, their accuracy, as you said, because it's automatically not going to be as accurate as a regular knock is going to be. But then you're also sacrificing your, uh, what's, I don't know what a good hiddenness. I don't know what a good word other than that is, you know? Like if you've done all this work to stalk in or, or, you know, get up in your tree stand, wherever you are, and stay out of sight of this animal up, what you do, all these things are downwind. And then you throw a bright light at it at three hundred plus miles an hour.

• 9:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 9:49Speaker 01

  Yeah. Why would you do that?

• 9:51Cameron Hanes?

  Right. And as you know, you guys just hunted Axis.

• 9:55Cameron Hanes?

  Those things can stand there till the arrows like, I don't know, forty yards from it, see it and be gone.

• 10:00Speaker 01

  Mm hmm. Completely gone.

• 10:02Cameron Hanes?

  So I don't know if they're seeing it. It feels like they could be seeing it because their eyes are really good. Of course, they can hear, but I just know that it's not going to help, you know, tying a flashlight to your arrow and throwing it at an animal. It's just like, it seems counterintuitive. And I do shoot a rap with bright fletch because I want to find my arrow after I shoot. But I want, I'm not going to give up accuracy to find my arrow. I'm going to have something bright. And like, if I can't find it, then I'll just stick to the blood trail and go fifty yards from the double lung. And there's my animal and maybe my arrow too, but.

• 10:37Speaker 02

  Dude, I.

• 10:37Speaker 01

  Take you.

• 10:38Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, go ahead.

• 10:39Speaker 01

  You hunt with a rap? What kind of Western hunter are you?

• 10:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I do.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  I can't, I can't get over it. So ever since I'm from the east and rats are like, no big deal.

• 10:49Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 10:50Speaker 01

  Pretty much anybody will put a rap on their arrow.

• 10:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 10:52Speaker 01

  I came out here and was just berated for how, I mean, just slapped over the head and told I was an idiot for running a rap. And so then I went a couple of years without one and they're like, I can't believe you would do that to your arrow. It's just gonna fly like absolute shit.

• 11:09Cameron Hanes?

  Why? Because the weight on the back?

• 11:10Speaker 01

  It's gonna be horrible.

• 11:12Cameron Hanes?

  Okay, a rap is a lot less than fucking lighted components.

• 11:16Speaker 01

  That's like twenty-three plus grains sometimes.

• 11:18Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:19Speaker 01

  Six grains on the back of my arrow. My arrow is already the size of a goddamn, I, gosh darn, I don't know what you say here. It's the size of a crossbow bolt. It's like a couple inches off. I could shoot the thing through a crossbow. I don't think those six grains is gonna make a difference.

• 11:34Cameron Hanes?

  No, I know the six is a lot less than twenty some. And also, I shoot that fifty-five grain half out, I guess is what it's called. Is that what that is on mine?

• 11:42Speaker 02

  I think so, yeah.

• 11:43Cameron Hanes?

  Is that a half out?

• 11:44Speaker 02

  I believe so.

• 11:45Cameron Hanes?

  Because it doesn't go, it's not internal. But anyway, I like the extra weight, the fifty-five grain um, out front with a hundred grain broadhead. So I got a hundred and fifty-five out front. That's why those arrows fly so good. And people also commented on that I shoot four fletch. And I'm like, no, I want to be able to steer that thing because again, like we talked about with the shots today, the hunting shots, I might not do everything perfect, right? Hunting. I might be on one leg like this, doing something weird. If I do a fucked up release, I want the arrow to correct itself and four fletch helps steer that better than, than three.

• 12:24Speaker 02

  No, dude.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  Do you find that obviously, I would assume, now you pull a lot more than my little self, but can you, your effective range, like how far out you can shoot, do you find that that's lessened, like how far out because of the four fletch? Like, do you get a drop off at all?

• 12:41Cameron Hanes?

  No, I mean, they're very accurate out to further I'd ever shoot at an animal.

• 12:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:46Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, I shoot out at, you know, a hundred and sixty all the time.

• 12:48Speaker 01

  Made right there. Like, just, James says this all the time, just get closer.

• 12:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 12:53Speaker 01

  Just be better.

• 12:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I'm up, my, my philosophy is shooting, we took some long shots today, but I need to be able to hit accurately at double the distance I'd ever take hunting. So if I can shoot, stay in the lungs at, say, one sixty, then maybe I could shoot at eighty. Eighty's a long shot. That probably wouldn't happen. So it'd probably be more like one forty, I could hold them pretty good. So seventy yards would be my, my limit on animals. And I think if you can hit accurate double, then, yeah, now we're on to something. I don't like people, and this has happened before too, and I'll talk shit about them, where they practice out to sixty, the animal's at seventy-five,

• 13:34Cameron Hanes?

  they never shoot seventy-five. They shoot sixty, but they take the shot at the animal at seventy-five. There's a whole little high. It's like, what are we doing? You, we owe it to the animal to either not shoot, get closer, or practice it more distance and get, get that talent up to where you can make that kill or don't take the shot.

• 13:53Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 13:53Cameron Hanes?

  So that's my feelings on it.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  No, I agree. I think closer is always better. And my favorite shot's twenty yards TPL, baby. That's where I want to get to every time, but.

• 14:01Speaker 01

  I do.

• 14:01Speaker 02

  Speaking of veins real quick, Greg Poole, guest of your show and our show, I know him well. Big guy, very large dude, but uh, knows a ton about our.

• 14:10Cameron Hanes?

  Maybe the biggest.

• 14:11Speaker 02

  Maybe the big, but.

• 14:14Cameron Hanes?

  What is it?

• 14:16Speaker 02

  Is that six inches?

• 14:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 14:18Speaker 02

  Six inches, but uh, dude, uh, I went up there, right? Or Greg FaceTimed me before we ever went up there and filmed with him. I had met him one time and he was like, let me see your target arrows. And I show him and he's like, nah, you gotta get up here and we gotta redo your arrows. And basically I was shooting with zero offset and zero helicoid at all. And he was like, especially for indoor. You only have twenty yards. We need to get that arrow spinning as fast as possible to correct. So he put like absolutely torque helicoid on it. And dude, when I went and shot the next time, it was like shots that I felt broke, like maybe, ooh, that might be out of the ten.

• 14:52Cameron Hanes?

  Pulled them back.

• 14:52Speaker 02

  Where they would be in the ten. And it was like so much more forgiving. So to your point, I think a lot of times, now, if you're someone like Brianna and you're short draw, low pounded, you can't afford to have them as twisted. But depending on what you're doing, you can really twist them up pretty good or run four.

• 15:09Cameron Hanes?

  And, and for those that don't know, the faster it spins, your arrow is going to drop off out there at extended distance. Because you're, you're losing a little energy with the spin. So I do add four, I got, I got some offset on it, but it steers those broadheads perfect. And I always practice out here in the yard. I think you pulled one of my arrows that had a fixed blade head on there. I practice with fixed because I want to know if I'm doing something wrong and that fixed blade broadhead tells me. And then I put a carnivore on to hunt and then that's more like a field point. But I still want to be technically doing everything right. You know, and that fixed blade tells me whether that's happening or not. Yep. Any thoughts over there?

• 15:48Speaker 03

  People who say that hunt influencers are ruining hunting.

• 15:54Speaker 01

  Oh, boy.

• 15:54Speaker 02

  Can I go first?

• 15:57Speaker 02

  Can I go?

• 15:58Cameron Hanes?

  Uh.

• 15:59Speaker 03

  Popcorn.

• 16:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's a black hat.

• 16:01Speaker 02

  All right, look, we're in Oregon right now.

• 16:03Cameron Hanes?

  Yes.

• 16:04Speaker 02

  Right? Perfect state to make the example I'm about to make. Oregon just had a ballot measure or something that was like, gonna get up to the ballot if it reached enough support to literally ban hunting, trapping, and I believe even farming, right?

• 16:18Cameron Hanes?

  And fishing.

• 16:19Speaker 02

  And fishing. Now, I understand that some people are selfish and would rather hunt with zero people in the woods. And trust me, I, I want that too. You know what I mean? But the reality is that states like California and like Oregon are where that we're both from, are pushing harder and harder to get rid of hunting. And they start with the cute shit like California with the bobcats and the mountain lions and they've tried bears multiple times. Oregon just said, we're gonna try everything, right? And the problem is if we don't have strength in numbers and bring more hunters into the fold to fight this stuff, we are cooked. So I understand both sides. I understand wanting to draw a tag every year, wanting less people at the trailhead. I get all that. But do you want your grandkids to be able to hunt one day? You just had a grandkid.

• 17:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 17:05Speaker 02

  In twenty years, it's very possible that the US could be like Europe because you know what? If one of these libtard states gets it across the, the finish line, California or Oregon, one of those states, and they get hunting banned, all the other states are gonna be licking their chops and going, we can get it out of here too. So if we don't have numbers, we're cooked.

• 17:26Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. And they do that in Oregon. Oregon was the one that allowed the drug use. Remember that? So we're like the Petri dish, dish of stupid decisions. And if that would have got enough signatures, that would have been the, like the litmus test for these other states to be like, see, we, now we can do something. What, it almost worked to our benefit because it was so crazy and so out there, which that, that was by design. They know they wanted to see what they could get away with and see how many people don't even read the measures. Because basically they'd say, hey, do you want to sign this petition? And on the back it'd say like, stop cruelty to animals. But everybody, nobody wants cruelty to animals.

• 18:03Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 18:03Cameron Hanes?

  Right? So that makes it easy for people to be like, oh yeah, I want, I want to treat animals well. They didn't read all the details to it. So they got a lot of signatures like that, but what it allowed us to do is it's so crazy that it allowed me to talk about it a lot, allowed people out there in the community to talk about it and to educate. Because it's not just that we need everybody hunting. We just need everybody to understand hunting and not to be psycho anti-hunters. Just like, we just want you in the middle. You don't have to hunt, but just don't hate and want to kill us and take away everything that we're passionate about. And then if you're, you know, understand it a little bit, if we do a good job educating the non-hunters, then we have a lot more chance of success in protecting what we love, the, the hunting heritage.

• 18:47Cameron Hanes?

  But it's a, that gave us an excuse to talk about it a lot. So, I mean, it was good. It didn't get enough signatures. So it's not going to be on the ballot, but it's a test and that test isn't going to go away. They're going to keep going, going back to the well. They play the long game. You know what I mean?

• 19:03Speaker 02

  They're patient.

• 19:03Cameron Hanes?

  Almost like the wars in the Middle East. We, we go over there, do whatever, come back. They're just gonna, they're not giving up over there. They're, this is all they care about in the Middle East. It's like, hey, no, we'll, we'll be doing this for centuries. So we'll wait you out. And we just have to kind of have that attitude too about, this is a long game, but we gotta fight every day.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm gonna take it from a different perspective because, uh, not their side. Because Mark and I talked about this in the, the hunt we were just on and you know, a libtard would come back and say to counter, well, no, the people who are just talking about it, doing pods, they're, they're okay. What we don't want are, you know, the, the influencers just posting all their hunts, giving away all these spots, yada, yada, yada. Okay, well, if, if we didn't make those types of videos and you have, I mean, the source of information and knowledge nowadays is YouTube University. It's the internet. They're not going to a book. They're not going to grandpappy who to teach them how to hunt or whatever.

• 20:07Speaker 01

  They're getting into it as adults. They want, you know, a lot of them that we talk to want, you know, they just want Whole Foods. They want to do it naturally.

• 20:16Speaker 01

  So if you didn't have these types of videos out there, you just want someone flinging arrows and rifles in the woods and just hoping you don't get shot by a stray hunter out there?

• 20:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:29Speaker 01

  Why wouldn't you want to, and out of unselfish reasons, and I think it's selfish for the people who think that way, that you want your space private and kept secret to yourself. Why wouldn't you want to help another person be better?

• 20:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:45Speaker 01

  Get better, like be a better shot, be a better hunter, be more effective. Because in the end game, it's only better for the animal that's potentially not going to get gut shot or shot in the leg and then get left to be eaten by a mountain lion. Or you know, or just die of its wounds and then it's not used at all, you know?

• 21:06Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's gone to waste.

• 21:08Speaker 01

  That to me is just selfish.

• 21:09Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 21:10Speaker 01

  Um, and I feel like that is more so what these, you know, keyboard warriors are arguing is that they don't want these hunting videos out. They don't want their spots blown out.

• 21:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 21:23Speaker 02

  And obviously like people that make content, we're always trying to not blow out spots. Like I don't even.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  But I'm not dropping an onyx pin on the screen, you know? You know, so good on you because we have had a couple of people who have gone in from James's like long time spots. And they have Google imaged screenshot the videos. Google image the, the mountain ranges and found where those locate. Good on you.

• 21:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 21:47Speaker 01

  If you want to find a good hunting spot, I'm good on you. I don't know.

• 21:50Cameron Hanes?

  There's a guy that you can pay like $500 to that'll find, you send him like a photo, he'll find it.

• 21:56Speaker 01

  That's crazy.

• 21:57Cameron Hanes?

  Wasn't that a true, James? Did we talk about that before?

• 22:00Speaker 03

  We haven't talked about it, but there's a guy who, he became popular because he used this, like he played this app. That was basically be Google Images and you'd have to find where you were at in the world. And he was like autistic about it. And so now people pay him to send him an image and he'll find like, he could find like what flight you were on, what day, what seat on the plane you're at. It's, it's insane.

• 22:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 22:23Speaker 01

  I mean, you're just putting more money in the economy. You're just stimulating people's jobs at that point, like more power to them is capitalism, I guess. I don't know.

• 22:32Cameron Hanes?

  Well, the, the people who like, uh, want to keep everybody out of hunting because of whatever, they don't want, you know, even like that video we shot today, to your point about educating viewers. We talked about a lot of things like trajectory of arrows, you know, get your arrow, depending on the distance, depending on where the, the obstruction might be. Arrows up there hitting things, it's going to cause you to hit the animal poorly or something. You have to practice that or at least think about it to, to consider it while you're hunting. So we went through a lot of things in that shoot today that could help new hunters. You know, if they watch that video, you know, they're, they're thinking about different things, things in a different way. And, um, that's, that's a positive.

• 23:14Speaker 02

  Dude, for sure. Well, what is happening back here?

• 23:18Cameron Hanes?

  She's her key town.

• 23:19Speaker 03

  I was waiting for you to take a sip of that.

• 23:22Speaker 02

  Was it a little tart there?

• 23:23Speaker 01

  I'm still waiting it to go down.

• 23:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 23:25Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 23:26Speaker 03

  Tastes like Gatorade.

• 23:27Cameron Hanes?

  You should.

• 23:27Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness.

• 23:28Cameron Hanes?

  You should see how easy James swallow stuff.

• 23:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, that's gonna take me a while to get the rest of it down.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  I've been training my whole life for that.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  Yep, I was not prepared.

• 23:38Cameron Hanes?

  He's a throat goat.

• 23:39Speaker 02

  That throat goat is crazy.

• 23:43Cameron Hanes?

  You know it's bad when coffee has to make it, has to wash the taste.

• 23:47Speaker 01

  What exactly, what is in this thing?

• 23:49Cameron Hanes?

  Cat piss.

• 23:52Cameron Hanes?

  That actually is a better tasting one. You should have saw the first version.

• 23:56Speaker 01

  Really? I also, I also have a problem with even putting like electrolytes in my water though. Like I'll, I'll do, we try, we use clear protein now, which is great.

• 24:07Speaker 01

  But it's something about that, like added salt taste that just.

• 24:11Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 24:12Speaker 01

  Sends me over the edge. This is not salty. I'll give it that, but it is something.

• 24:16Cameron Hanes?

  James, you gotta do yours.

• 24:18Speaker 02

  I'm gonna try this one.

• 24:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's already open.

• 24:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, it's fantastic. At least a 12 out of 10. What am I at 711? Is this a slurpee?

• 24:33Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I know. Basically a slurpee.

• 24:35Speaker 02

  It's tasty, dude.

• 24:36Cameron Hanes?

  It is.

• 24:37Speaker 01

  The fact that you were prepared for my response to that sip.

• 24:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, but these are the good ones.

• 24:43Speaker 03

  I cut the cameras to you.

• 24:44Cameron Hanes?

  The blue raspberry is like, I wish we had some of the, some of the original.

• 24:48Speaker 02

  Are the originals like a little harsh?

• 24:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, a little harsh.

• 24:52Speaker 02

  Something to be desired.

• 24:53Cameron Hanes?

  But hey, it helps, if it helps you like mental acuity.

• 24:58Speaker 02

  I'm in and I need that. I didn't go to college.

• 25:00Speaker 03

  It's like eating your greens as a child.

• 25:03Cameron Hanes?

  Come on.

• 25:03Speaker 02

  Oh, here we go. Come on.

• 25:05Cameron Hanes?

  Come on.

• 25:05Speaker 02

  Down the hatch.

• 25:06Cameron Hanes?

  Be the shot. That's one serving size. You're supposed to, is there any left in there?

• 25:11Speaker 01

  I can't eat, a little bit.

• 25:12Cameron Hanes?

  Come on now.

• 25:12Speaker 03

  Oh, come on.

• 25:14Cameron Hanes?

  Yes.

• 25:15Speaker 02

  Ah, there you go.

• 25:17Speaker 01

  I've never been able to take, um, like shot, you know, like shots of liquor or anything.

• 25:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 25:22Speaker 01

  I can't do it. Um, I've always had to take like at least three chugs to get one single shot down. And James is like, just keep swallowing, just open up your throat. And I'm like.

• 25:35Speaker 02

  Coach you apparently.

• 25:36Cameron Hanes?

  James could, he could.

• 25:40Cameron Hanes?

  He could swallow the biggest mouthful of anything.

• 25:43Speaker 02

  Dude.

• 25:44Cameron Hanes?

  Some might say load.

• 25:45Speaker 03

  I just open up, I open up my throat. I don't even have to swallow.

• 25:48Speaker 01

  That's what Jay says. He goes, just let it roll right down. I'm like.

• 25:51Speaker 02

  Whoa my God.

• 25:53Cameron Hanes?

  What?

• 25:54Speaker 02

  We are off the rails.

• 25:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, he tries to coach me, but it hasn't happened. Yeah.

• 26:00Speaker 02

  Lots of coaching.

• 26:01Speaker 03

  And when does this coaching occur?

• 26:02Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, you know. Daily, tonight, you know?

• 26:05Speaker 01

  Restaurant.

• 26:09Speaker 02

  They are great.

• 26:09Speaker 01

  Sorts of places.

• 26:10Speaker 02

  This is a good topic. This really is.

• 26:12Speaker 01

  And back to it.

• 26:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:14Speaker 03

  All right. You wanted to do shit talkers.

• 26:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, welcome to shit talkers.

• 26:17Speaker 02

  Thank you. I feel blessed to be here.

• 26:19Speaker 03

  It's important to say that it's all love.

• 26:21Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, that's right.

• 26:22Speaker 02

  Oh, I, I, is it?

• 26:23Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 26:24Speaker 02

  Oh, no, I'm sorry.

• 26:25Cameron Hanes?

  No matter, it's either all love or just passion.

• 26:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, one or the other.

• 26:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Or just.

• 26:31Speaker 02

  I thought we were here to, I thought it was all hate. That's what I was going for.

• 26:34Cameron Hanes?

  It's love. Even, even me talking about this.

• 26:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:38Cameron Hanes?

  Fucking victory, victory arrows. That was love.

• 26:40Speaker 02

  Yeah. Shout out, shout out to victory. Good guys.

• 26:42Cameron Hanes?

  Victory.

• 26:43Speaker 02

  I know him well.

• 26:44Speaker 03

  If it's, comes off as hate, it's just because your perspective's wrong.

• 26:47Cameron Hanes?

  Right. Really is. That's, you need to look in the mirror.

• 26:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 26:51Cameron Hanes?

  To be honest.

• 26:51Speaker 02

  Your fault.

• 26:52Cameron Hanes?

  That's a you thing.

• 26:53Speaker 02

  It's, yeah, you're being.

• 26:53Cameron Hanes?

  Because this is love, baby.

• 26:55Speaker 02

  I love love.

• 26:56Cameron Hanes?

  If we can't have tough conversations.

• 26:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, we have to.

• 26:58Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, this is how a relationship kind of progresses.

• 27:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 27:01Cameron Hanes?

  Right?

• 27:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:02Cameron Hanes?

  So this is just a tough conversation about arrows.

• 27:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:04Cameron Hanes?

  And archery and bows. I use Ketone IQ when I need to stay sharp for the long haul. Long runs, lifting before I shoot my bow, even when I'm podcasting. Anytime I want steady focus without crashing. What I like about it is how it feels. It helps me stay locked in during long efforts and mentally demanding sessions. Not jittery, not wired, just clear and steady. Ketones are your brain's preferred fuel source. So instead of that spiked caffeine feeling, the focus feels calm and controlled. It lets me push without leaning on caffeine or sugar. I'm not chasing another cup of coffee or something sweet just to get through a workout or a long day.

• 27:49Cameron Hanes?

  I can train, work and think without that roller coaster of energy. Physically, I feel ready to go. Mentally, I'm locked in. That combination matters when you're putting in long hours and real work. Visit ketone.com backslash cam for 30% off your subscription order. Plus receive a free gift with your second shipment. Or find Ketone IQ at Target stores nationwide in the hydration and protein aisle and get your first shot free. I've been shooting Hoyt for over 20 years now and they're a lifetime partner of mine. That's not something I take lightly. I stay with partners that prove themselves. And Hoyt continues to do that year after year.

• 28:32Cameron Hanes?

  They shattered the industry standards and built the AX90, the first 90 pound bow to exist and be offered to consumers. Why? Because I want a hard hitting arrow delivered with enough force to push through, say a rib or the edge of a shoulder blade. Because it's bow hunting. Not every shot is going to be perfect. But when the animal reacts, or maybe I don't make the most perfect shot, I still want to deliver a lethal arrow and a 90 pound bow gives me more room for error. Unfortunately, they don't offer discounts on bows. But if you want to grab some Hoyt merch or selected accessories, you can use my code CAM for 20% off.

• 29:15Cameron Hanes?

  If you're serious about archery and you want something you can rely on, shoot a Hoyt. Get serious, get Hoyt and keep hammering.

• 29:25Speaker 02

  All right, let me ask you guys this question. I'm going to ask both you guys this question, James and Cam. Aside from me, who's the favorite guest you've had? Obviously I'm number one, but after that.

• 29:37Cameron Hanes?

  Brianna.

• 29:37Speaker 02

  Brianna, let's go. There you go. All right. That's fair.

• 29:41Speaker 01

  I'm secretly number one.

• 29:42Speaker 02

  That's fair.

• 29:43Cameron Hanes?

  What about you, James?

• 29:44Speaker 03

  The next one.

• 29:46Cameron Hanes?

  The next one?

• 29:48Speaker 01

  I mean, come on yet.

• 29:50Speaker 02

  Who is that?

• 29:50Speaker 03

  Tom Brady.

• 29:51Speaker 02

  Oh, Tom's coming on.

• 29:52Speaker 03

  Who's your, what, which championship is your favorite?

• 29:55Speaker 02

  Oh, oh, oh, my favorite Tom Brady championship for real, though, has to be the Bucks. Went to the Bucks, won a championship.

• 30:01Speaker 03

  What about the Falcons?

• 30:03Speaker 02

  That one, that would be my second.

• 30:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:05Speaker 02

  But you can't beat the Bucks, dude. Just think of the storyline. Dude leaves the team, leaves the coach. They sort of had a beef, right?

• 30:12Cameron Hanes?

  Who was, who was responsible for the, for the Super Bowl? Was it Belichick or Brady?

• 30:16Speaker 02

  That was always the question.

• 30:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 30:17Speaker 02

  And then Tom leaves and goes and gets one year one. There it is. That answers your question.

• 30:21Cameron Hanes?

  And then Belichick stayed and fucking sucked it up.

• 30:24Speaker 02

  Didn't win one after that.

• 30:25Speaker 03

  Yeah. Speaking of all stars leaving teams.

• 30:27Speaker 02

  Oh, boy.

• 30:28Speaker 03

  How about LeBron?

• 30:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, we gotta get into it. Did you see the 76ers coming?

• 30:34Cameron Hanes?

  No.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  No.

• 30:35Cameron Hanes?

  No, that was out of left field for me.

• 30:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:37Cameron Hanes?

  I thought it was gonna be back to Miami or back to Cleveland.

• 30:41Speaker 02

  Do you think it's a good fit? Do you think, are the 76ers, you think they're, they're top tier to win the championship now?

• 30:47Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, the thing about it is on paper, they got an amazing roster. Do they meld together? Do they mesh? Can they play together as teams? Cause we've seen this before. I remember with the Lakers, they had Gary Payton, Karl Malone. They had all these stars and they just having stars doesn't, cause you have to have people that are willing to take the backseat sometimes. There's only one ball.

• 31:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:11Cameron Hanes?

  If you got five superstars out there who, and the problem is like LeBron's kind of passed the, the stage of worrying about this, but they're all fighting for money, right? The better stats you have, the bigger contract you're gonna have. These players have a lot of extended family depending on them.

• 31:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:28Cameron Hanes?

  Right? A lot of people coming with their hand out. They're multimillionaires. Everybody wants money, right? Like, oh, you signed a hundred and some million dollar deal? Hey, could you hook a brother up?

• 31:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:39Cameron Hanes?

  And so they're still competing and still gotta put up with stats.

• 31:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:44Cameron Hanes?

  And for some of them, it's not always about winning. It's about, hey, this is my job.

• 31:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:51Cameron Hanes?

  So if everybody's not on the same page about, hey, I'm gonna take a backseat if it means the team wins and we can win a championship, that all sounds good. But if everybody's not on board, who knows?

• 32:01Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of, speaking of, uh, you know,

• 32:06Speaker 02

  cool, rich athletes going for big contracts. I, I don't like to talk about this too much, but I actually have one friend with a Bentley and a gold tooth.

• 32:12Cameron Hanes?

  Whoa.

• 32:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, I do. I do. Yeah. I don't talk about it too much.

• 32:15Speaker 03

  Friend is used loosely.

• 32:17Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, it depends, you know? I don't like to talk about it, but.

• 32:20Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Let's, let's get into the shit talking. Is that a poor reflection on what can happen in the archery community? Or a positive reflection? Cause some might say, this fucker's gone off the rails. Or some might say, that is sick.

• 32:35Speaker 02

  Oh, that, that's the bag I'm in. If I had it up to me, I would be showing up to every tournament in a Lambo or something ridiculous.

• 32:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 32:43Speaker 02

  And I'm a couple of years out from that, but you know, your boy is showing up in a Huracan one day for sure. I think it's a tough look, bro.

• 32:50Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 32:50Speaker 02

  I like it. Yeah.

• 32:52Cameron Hanes?

  What about you?

• 32:52Speaker 02

  What do you think?

• 32:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 32:53Speaker 01

  I think it, uh.

• 32:54Speaker 02

  Brianna likes trucks, dude. She's out, I think.

• 32:57Speaker 01

  I'm, I am out on a, I'm, I'm out on all cars, pretty much. You know this. Uh, but, but do I think that like doing wilder things in a sport? That's usually so.

• 33:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:11Speaker 01

  Cookie cutter, concise and conservative. Yeah. Um, I think it's absolutely fantastic. I think that's why he stands out so much in like, just like the archery. Cause like we'll do hunting videos, but they're not our best performers or anything. He is archery specific, um, like archery, anything. And that opens the door to all the

• 33:33Speaker 01

  perfect target shooters.

• 33:35Cameron Hanes?

  Do you get hate for this?

• 33:37Speaker 02

  Do I?

• 33:37Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:38Speaker 02

  Not so much anymore. I mean, occasionally.

• 33:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. Not as much anymore for sure.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. I don't know what happened. I must just be more likeable nowadays.

• 33:45Speaker 01

  Well, I think people realize that you could shoot.

• 33:47Cameron Hanes?

  I think, I think you're good.

• 33:49Speaker 01

  Crazy character out there.

• 33:50Cameron Hanes?

  What, what people like to do is somebody who has a big following, they wanna say that it's not worthy, basically, or you're, you're just like, uh, I don't know, out for attention. Or you're like, for me, they'd say like, oh, well, you go on the best hunts and you guided and you couldn't do it on your own type thing. And so they wanna, you know, kind of shit on the accomplishments. But when you're shooting so well, what are they gonna say?

• 34:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:16Cameron Hanes?

  I mean.

• 34:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's like your hunting too. It speaks for itself, you know? What do you got? Four, 400 inchers now?

• 34:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, but it's like.

• 34:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:24Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, but there's always, people can always caveat that. I was saying, oh, you, you know, paid to go to the best spot. I'd like to see you kill a blah, blah, blah on my.

• 34:33Speaker 02

  Public land, OTC.

• 34:34Cameron Hanes?

  My shithole area. And I'm like, well, I wouldn't go to that area. But I, I have been like, when I was coming up and didn't have any money, if I would kill any five point or bigger bull.

• 34:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:46Cameron Hanes?

  It's like, I wasn't, wasn't looking always for 400 inch bulls, you know? It's like, it's part of the evolution as a bow hunter, is you pay your dues. Then if you do it right, then you get to reap the rewards. You still have to prove it. I mean, it's still hard, but if you can, then the, the results speaks for themselves.

• 35:06Speaker 01

  But I think it's crazy, it, or it's very fascinating to me how people just blackout. They just forget that part. Like they just head to their keyboards.

• 35:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 35:15Speaker 01

  And start, you know?

• 35:18Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  About, you know, how you're just paying, yeah, to, to do, you know, the most expensive and, you know, crazy things and blah, blah, blah. And it's like, would, do you know where they came from? Do you know what they first hunted? Did you ask any questions before you just assumed? We have one, I don't know the, the name, or I would say it, I would. Um, but this dude comments on everything. Absolutely. I didn't know who it was. I pretty much steer clear of all the comments and things like that. Cause James knows that I've, you know.

• 35:51Speaker 02

  She can get a little spicy.

• 35:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 35:53Speaker 02

  Me, I'm pretty even keel.

• 35:54Speaker 01

  So I got in an argument one time at a beach with a dog beach about my dog with a, a very, very, very large man. And James got very, very, very uncomfortable. But I had no problem speaking my mind. So.

• 36:07Speaker 02

  That's that military background, you know? She ready, ready to go to battle.

• 36:11Speaker 01

  You know, a little people syndrome, I guess. I don't know. Uh, but so finally one day James tells me about this, this dude, this one comment, and he reads it to me. I think he put it on social media or something. And, um, so then I started seeing all the different comments. And it was one, I think it was from the pod we did with Josh and Brandon and, uh, something about like, this dude doesn't know what he's talking about. He's just over here for the attention. Like he'll say anything. And basically I just commented back finally and I was like, where, uh, what's your address? So I can ship our, you know, biggest fan award to it. Just came in the mail today.

• 36:50Speaker 01

  And then he hit me back with something about how we should, you know, be quiet. And then I said, well, you must be a libtard because you apparently don't like the first amendment.

• 36:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 36:59Speaker 01

  But unless it applies to yourself.

• 37:01Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  Um, so there are just, there are people out there who I think want things a very specific way. And if you stand out of that box in any way, um, they, they feel like you've made it a little too big. Um, and then all of a sudden it's you're doing it for attention. And it's like, but did you look back at any of the, you know, older stuff or, you know, read up on the person before you started shit talking?

• 37:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 37:27Speaker 01

  Um, no, not whatsoever. Uh, but I find those people very comical and I would love to comment to more of them, but James holds, he holds my leash back a little bit.

• 37:37Speaker 02

  I gotta pull back the guard dog, you know?

• 37:40Cameron Hanes?

  Well, all I know is, you know, now we have social media, but before that is you killed an animal, you went down to the bow rack and you put it on the bulletin board, right? So it's like, we've all, as hunters, you're always proud of the accomplishment. Cause it's hard. It's really hard to be successful. And people can say this isn't the same, but the cave dwellings had, had pictures of like the hunt, right? From back thousands of years ago. So it's like, the hunt has always been special and always been celebrated. We're doing that now in the way that we do media now.

• 38:19Cameron Hanes?

  And it's like, that's just the way it goes. It's always changing. Yeah. It's not a cave wall and it's not the bulletin board of the bow rack. It's on my Instagram page.

• 38:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:29Cameron Hanes?

  Serving the same purpose.

• 38:30Speaker 02

  It's all.

• 38:30Cameron Hanes?

  I'm still proud of it. I still worked my ass off for that. I've never been on an easy fucking bow hunt. So yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna feel good about it if I'm successful. And I know I'm bringing me home to my family. So what, what's the problem? What is issue?

• 38:46Speaker 01

  The question I cannot answer.

• 38:47Cameron Hanes?

  Is it because you're not successful? And so you don't wanna look at my success? Is that, is that the problem?

• 38:52Speaker 02

  Typically, I think jealousy is always the main culprit.

• 38:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 38:55Speaker 02

  Whether it comes down to success rates or skill or money, whatever it is, usually when someone is, you know.

• 39:04Speaker 02

  Really pent up or talking shit or leaving comments of hate. I think it's pretty much 100% of the time. I'll give, I'll say 99% of the time. I think it comes back to jealousy is what I think. I could be wrong. I don't claim to know everything, but that's, that's what I think it is.

• 39:20Cameron Hanes?

  Usually it is, and usually it might even be feelings that they don't know a hundred percent. What is, why they feel that way?

• 39:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:29Cameron Hanes?

  It's like, I just, they feel, they look at something and it triggers some emotion. Who knows why? But if it's a picture of you, then you're the bad guy. Right? And that's just how it works. But, uh, you know, part of it is too, uh, it's hard balancing everything. I will say this, I had a full-time job my entire career. And so I've been retired now three years. Yesterday I shot four different times during the day. Right? I shot in the morning, midday or mid morning, midday, then in the evening. When I had a job, I could shoot maybe one time. And by the time I got home, it was dark. So if I didn't shoot before work, I wasn't gonna shoot that day.

• 40:12Cameron Hanes?

  Can I be a better hunter now? Cause I have more time? Yeah. Yeah. So sometimes that's the way it works. We, we do the best we can with the time that we have. Is our hunting and our shooting gonna suffer a little bit? Probably. Cause if you're raising kids, if you're married, if you have a full-time job, that's just the way it goes. But for me, I was able to still somehow find a way to succeed. Even despite all that. And now when you have more time, then you're like, God, this is so much nicer to be able to shoot. We went out, whatever. I don't even know what today is. Tuesday?

• 40:43Speaker 02

  It's a Tuesday, yeah.

• 40:43Cameron Hanes?

  We're out, we went out and shot Tuesday afternoon. I didn't have to be at work, did you?

• 40:48Speaker 02

  No, we were just at bow tech.

• 40:50Cameron Hanes?

  That was work.

• 40:51Speaker 02

  That was my lunch break.

• 40:52Cameron Hanes?

  Right. So, yeah, so it's, you can talk shit about it. Um, and I, and I understand because not everybody's in this position. So I get that you'd feel maybe a little jealousy for that. But that's not to say that you can't earn the same type of opportunity. I mean, were you born rich, either of you?

• 41:10Speaker 01

  No.

• 41:12Cameron Hanes?

  Did anybody hand you this opportunity and say, hey, we want you to be a professional archer? Okay. Here's your bow. Here's some money. You just have, did somebody say that to you?

• 41:22Speaker 02

  Never.

• 41:22Cameron Hanes?

  No, you fucking earn it.

• 41:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:25Cameron Hanes?

  And if you can't figure out a way to fucking earn it, then think harder.

• 41:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:29Cameron Hanes?

  Work harder.

• 41:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:30Cameron Hanes?

  Do something different. You know, it's like, we were talking about this and I, and I told Truitt too. Make people care. Cause you, there's a lot of great archers out there, great bow hunters. They might have a dream of being a career hunter or, or being a pro in some way.

• 41:47Cameron Hanes?

  You gotta make people care. Because if you make them care, whether they love or hate, that attention is currency. You can make money doing that. But first, figure out a way to make them care. These great bow hunters out there who haven't quite cracked the code, or maybe they don't, maybe it's not important to them. That's fine. That's more power to you. If you don't, if that's not your goal, great. If you just wanna work and hunt on the weekends, awesome. But if you wanna be quote, somebody, figure out a way to make people care about what you're doing. And that's hard.

• 42:14Speaker 02

  That's bars right there. Super hot fire bars right there.

• 42:19Cameron Hanes?

  It, it, I mean, it's good advice, but also it's very, very difficult because there's so much competition for attention right now. Millions of things, people out there doing crazy stuff. How are you gonna stand out?

• 42:32Speaker 02

  Yep. Yeah. And then when you get the shot too, I mean, it's like you can't, you just can't drop the ball. You know, whether it's like you get, you sign your first sponsor and maybe they just are giving you a free product or something, but you had,

• 42:44Cameron Hanes?

  Should I start?

• 42:44Speaker 02

  But you had better be the top guy as far as giving them what your deal says. Whether that's pumping out tons of content on your own page, maybe giving them some photos to use, whatever it is. Make sure that they never have to track you down to do your job. You just sign the deal and you take care of it and over deliver, right? For us, that's always been huge. We never have a sponsor come back and say, y'all aren't doing enough. Never.

• 43:07Cameron Hanes?

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• 43:49Cameron Hanes?

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• 44:34Cameron Hanes?

  Tuck one in, go run, go hunt, go put in the work. That's Alp. Head to alppouch.com and use code CAM for 10% off your first order.

• 44:43Speaker 02

  If anything, we, I got a text today at the lunch from one of the companies that actually you and I both work with. And they were like, dude, you're frigging just smoking it right now. I can't even believe how much. And, and we had only set it up like a week ago, this Dropbox account, and I had it filled like that. And they're like, you know, so I think you gotta seize the, seize the day when it comes.

• 45:04Cameron Hanes?

  Seize opportunity.

• 45:05Speaker 02

  Think about the first day that Cam and I met and I met James and we all met the same day at Performance Archery. How many times, like that was a risk, right? I could have easily been like, no, I'm not gonna shoot Cam a message to see if he wants to shoot with me. He's never gonna respond to me. At the time, we were decent in size, but nothing compared to now. Like we've had a big run these last couple of years, partly thanks to doing stuff with you and other people and really growing and just going for it full steam. But that day's a good example of what can happen in life when you say, even if Cam doesn't reply, I'm at least gonna shoot him a message and see if he wants to shoot arrows with me. You, you responded. We did it. We went and shot arrows and we got along well and, you know,

• 45:47Speaker 02

  made some cool stuff. And then you said, all right, let's do it again. And then this time we said, let's do it again, you know? And we've sort of built like a rapport and this and that, but that doesn't happen if I don't send that first message.

• 45:57Cameron Hanes?

  Exactly.

• 45:57Speaker 02

  So you gotta just, you gotta just send it in life, you know? And you're never gonna get a yes if you don't even ask.

• 46:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I think a lot of it just comes down to, uh, like people just don't want it bad enough. Um, so you may see somebody else who's doing everything that you dream of doing. Um, and then immediately following that comes the must be nice. I'm too busy. All of the excuses start rolling in and I don't have enough time. Um, and like I've seen this just in like switching from getting out of the Navy into, you know, full-time with James into now full-time with multiple other clients. And sometimes I'll feel busy and then I'll realize that's for three days straight. And then I have no work for two weeks.

• 46:48Speaker 02

  Right. You do, but it's work you wanna be doing.

• 46:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, and I think there is always time in your day. You just don't realize you have, like wake up earlier, stay up a little later. Um, you know, what, how, what other ways can you make yourself more efficient? Um, and it all comes down to, is it like your dream? Do you want it bad enough then? Um, and I just don't think people do. So then that's where the excuses and the, the, you know, deep-seated, unknowing jealousy starts to kick in. Um, because it's something that deep down they know they want, but on the surface are not willing to work to get. Uh, cause like I said, we didn't start out rich. You've worked your entire life and have only been retired for three years.

• 47:35Speaker 01

  But yet have been doing this.

• 47:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:37Speaker 01

  Longer than that.

• 47:38Cameron Hanes?

  Forty years.

• 47:41Speaker 01

  Uh, so like, did they do the same thing?

• 47:45Speaker 02

  We are cooking right now on this pod. Well, I mean, I, I am inspired right now.

• 47:51Cameron Hanes?

  Well, I, I just want to say too, uh, like part of it also is your attitude and your personality and what you bring to the table. And like, that's a superpower of, of your guys is, is you have fun. You, and you, we joke around like the fun bunch, right? It's always about fun. So you have a smile on your face. It makes people, that attracts people. If somebody's always bitching about something, do you want to fucking watch them? I don't. But so part of it is, do you have the confidence to put yourself out there to send that DM? Cause I could have went, what the fuck? You think I got nothing else to do down here? I fucking busy as shit. No, I don't have time to go shoot a bow.

• 48:31Cameron Hanes?

  Then you feel, I'm kind of a dick. You're like, fuck, that sucked. I thought he was cool and, and he's not. But you took the shot, right? And just having confidence to maybe be shot down or maybe not get the, the reaction you were hoping for. But you, you put yourself out there. So part, part of it is you have to believe in yourself. You have to be confident enough to maybe take a hit if it doesn't go well. But then if it goes well, who are you when you're there? You know, are you having, are you, do you actually love this? Or is your goal just to be famous? Cause if your goal is just to be famous, none of this shit's gonna work.

• 49:06Speaker 02

  No way.

• 49:07Cameron Hanes?

  You have to love the process.

• 49:08Speaker 02

  Bro, it's too, it's too dense. There's too much to do. I mean, bro, like, bro, like I, we still do all of our own editing. Like I edit all the videos. She does all the photos. We do all our own email campaigns, like write all the stuff to sponsors. Like we're a two man show and it's like, there's a lot to do. And if you don't have the love for it, you're never going to do it because it's relentless. Right? I mean, we're doing two full length videos every single week year round on YouTube. That's a lot of output. Plus shorts every day, posts every day, stuff for sponsors, like this trip for Botek and to see you. We, uh, we literally landed in Hawaii at six 30 in the morning, the whatever day it was.

• 49:46Speaker 02

  On Sunday and we flew out Monday cooked. We're both hammered. We just frigging for two weeks straight pounded hills, hunted the hardest shit for access deer. You know, and came back and you think we didn't want to stay home and just frigging lounge for a couple of days? No, but we gotta go do stuff. You know what I mean? It is what it is. So.

• 50:03Cameron Hanes?

  Get back on a plane.

• 50:03Speaker 02

  Gotta do it, right?

• 50:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 50:05Speaker 02

  And I love it. And I think Brianna does too. And I think obvious, clearly you do 40 years of killing it, being the top in the game, top, top of the game. Just like your, your book title, how to get to the top and stay there. Like that don't happen if you don't number one, love it. And number two, have a work ethic that is almost nobody is matching. You know what I mean? And that's the only thing that's been a key to our success is I think just the, the amount of output and being super relentless and persistent.

• 50:31Cameron Hanes?

  Hustling, that's hustling. And, and then, and then talent.

• 50:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 50:37Cameron Hanes?

  But it takes more than just talent.

• 50:39Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 50:39Cameron Hanes?

  It takes that fucking grind. You have to want it.

• 50:43Speaker 03

  I've always said, and I don't think you're giving yourself enough credit, both of, both you and Cam is like, someone will always be more talented than you. Someone will always be better. Someone might even come just as close to working as hard. But, and you see those people on Instagram, you can see them and they have four followers.

• 51:03Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 51:03Speaker 03

  Because their personality and who they are as a person, they're, if they're genuine or not, sucks. And so it has to be a mix of all that, but you also have to be a person worth being in a room with the people you find yourselves in. I, I, I ask myself this question all the time because I've been afforded opportunities. I don't feel like I deserve. You know, there's people out there that are way more talented than me on a camera. And I'm like, why am I sitting in this room and they're not? They're having a hard time finding work. And I think it comes down to who you are as a person, when you're in that room and what kind of story you have to tell. And, and then the people around you will give you more opportunities because they like being around you, you know?

• 51:44Cameron Hanes?

  Well, well, part of it with you, um, James.

• 51:47Speaker 03

  And I do a really good job of sucking dick.

• 51:52Cameron Hanes?

  Being the throat goat has opened so many doors for you. Mostly your back door.

• 51:57Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's, that's 99% of my opportunities, but I'm just saying for the general person, you know? Listen, no one's going to beat me with the throat goat.

• 52:05Speaker 02

  No way.

• 52:06Cameron Hanes?

  Let me, let me say this, um, and this is serious because I've had camera guys and this fucking pissed me off. So camera guys, I'm around, maybe it's Luke Bryan, Jason Aldean, they're over there. Hey, could I get a picture? And I'm like, do not fuck this up by fanboying out to these fucking celebrities. They got fucking people asking them for shit all the time. I'm invited because they're like a safe space, right? They don't have to be on, they don't have to protect themselves of what they say, what they do. But now I've got a camera guy over there fanboying. So to, to James's credit, he doesn't, we've been around some big stars.

• 52:48Cameron Hanes?

  Some of the biggest, I've never seen him say, hey, could I get a picture?

• 52:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:52Cameron Hanes?

  You know what I mean? So it's like, but he's more than willing, if I say it's okay to share awesome photos, to share content with wanting nothing in return. Just like, and usually it goes for me. He's not even like, a lot of people say, hey, do you mind if I send whoever pictures? They want that contact. So then they have that person in their phone. So then they can hit them up on the side for their own site deal. James says, sends me stuff, I send it to whoever the celebrity is. So it's like, even little stuff like that. If he was a guy wanting pictures, whatever, I'd be like, yeah, I don't think it's going to work out, dude. Fucking see ya.

• 53:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. Dude, there's just a different feel. Like I, I don't know what it is. We, not to the same extent as you, but I mean, I've gotten a chance now to be around people that I never would have thought. And I just come in there like it's just a regular old buddy. I try to act zero different and I, because I'm not acting. I'm, nor is Brianna. We're just being ourselves. And that's always the case. Like the first day, again, at performance, there was no weird vibes. It was like, yo, what's up? Good to meet you, man. Let's frigging shoot some bows. And that was it. There's no goofy shit. And, and I do think, uh, to James and your point, I think sometimes, uh, you know, people maybe aren't fully themselves in their content. And it's so easy to see when you get in like a room of folks and you're just like, this is not quite what I expected. You know what I mean?

• 54:15Speaker 02

  And, and, and then the people that have the talent and the work ethic and all that, and are very clearly authentic, right? Greg Poole says it all the time. Greg, Greg is like, he's got all these connections and can line people up with brands. But Greg's very picky who he chooses to do that with. And for him, he always says the number one thing is authenticity, right? And he's like, if someone is not authentic, I, I know immediately. And I'm not going to line them up with someone, you know?

• 54:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. It's, it's such a big one. And I understand, especially in the day of social media, everybody wants that picture to post.

• 54:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:46Cameron Hanes?

  Right? Everybody, you want a picture of Jelly Roll. If I could have a picture with Jelly Roll, fuck, my page would blow up, right? I know how it works. I know, but you can't let that fuck up the big picture because you might get that picture of Jelly Roll. That's the last fucking time you're ever going to be around them, unfortunately.

• 55:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 55:03Cameron Hanes?

  Cause the ride's over now.

• 55:04Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 55:05Cameron Hanes?

  Where like even, even for me, like he'll send me unreleased songs because I'll give him honest feedback. If I would post one of those fucking songs, it's over.

• 55:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:15Cameron Hanes?

  I'm not, so it's like, it's just little stuff like that. But, and I know, I, I understand not everybody's going to be around a celebrity, but that, that authenticity, treating people like real humans and not just like a star that somebody's just like trying to take stuff from all the time. It's a, it's, it means a lot because they have to deal with that shit every day. And they're, they, every human is going through something. You don't want to add to it.

• 55:41Speaker 02

  No.

• 55:41Cameron Hanes?

  You don't want to add to any stress by like, who, who's going to come around that, ah, that guy who's just like, then you made, you, you made them feel a certain way that wasn't positive.

• 55:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:52Cameron Hanes?

  Right? So I'm always like, if somebody's going to think about me, I want it to be positive. Cause everybody has a first impression or a first thought when somebody says, hey, do you know James Williams? And I'm just like, oh my gosh. That's or like, or do you know, hey, do you know James Williams? Yeah, that fucking guy's good. He's fucking, he's a little weird. He's a little weird. He's a little weird, but fucking his photos are tits.

• 56:20Speaker 02

  His photos slap.

• 56:21Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So it's like, when, when somebody, and I tell my kids this too, when somebody says your name, there's going to be a thought. What's that thought going to be?

• 56:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:30Cameron Hanes?

  Positive or negative?

• 56:31Speaker 02

  Good point. Dude, um, I want to talk about, uh, what you said about, you know, being around Luke Bryan or Jason Aldean. By the way, I'm a huge Aldean fan. I got, I think he has more country hits than anyone ever in country. I really believe that. Dude, so many, for decades, bro. His shows, electric. I don't know if you've been to one. So much fun, but, but like you said, when you're with them and you're in sort of a safe space for them where they're like a little bit, I always say that hunt camp, when you're in a hunt camp, you get to see the real people by like day four. Day one, everyone's maybe got their guard up.

• 57:04Cameron Hanes?

  On their best, and their best behavior.

• 57:05Speaker 02

  And then by like midway through some dude that might be them or gal that's like the most buttoned up normally, you get to see who they really are. If they had zero judgment in their life. And if you could show up and be relatively the same on day one as day four, then that just shows you're being that, that person all the time.

• 57:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 57:23Speaker 02

  And that's pretty rare.

• 57:25Cameron Hanes?

  For hunt camps, it's like, I've been in a lot of them and where you really find out is when a few people got some kills and they haven't.

• 57:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:34Cameron Hanes?

  Cause then either they think they got put in a shitty spot. Oh, you're saving the good stuff for this guy. This guy, you're fucking me over. If somebody can be the last one to kill and still have a good attitude, that's a good person. Because that, that doesn't always happen. Everybody's there for like, I mean, uh, there's a little, you know, you spend a lot of money, you go on an out of state hunt. You don't want to come home and tell the old lady didn't kill. Sorry, sorry about that. Five grand. You want to bring your animal home. So that really, that really sets into motion that authenticity piece. And hunting camp, as you said, truth serum comes out at hunting camp.

• 58:14Speaker 02

  Big time, big time.

• 58:15Cameron Hanes?

  And then not even there, but on the mountain, especially you can't fake, you can't fake it on the mountain.

• 58:19Speaker 02

  Yeah. And there's no boardroom there. There's no pressure. So like you're around people and eventually midway through camp, you're comfortable with everyone and you let your guard down.

• 58:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:27Speaker 02

  You're the most honest, you're the most raw, you know?

• 58:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:30Speaker 02

  And I think that, uh, again, I, I know some people that day one on camp are the same as day seven or whatever. And that, that just shows that authenticity that Greg was talking about. And I think that's pretty dope.

• 58:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. It's a, I, I mean, hunting camps for me can be, can be stressful sometimes. I know like, I know I was, I was in Idaho, like a couple of years ago. I think Tanner filmed me, but anyway, I show up there, I'm hunting mule deer, killed that, killed that one on, on the wall right there.

• 58:57Speaker 02

  That little small one, the top one?

• 59:00Cameron Hanes?

  No, it's one on the left, but it's, it's like a, a nice buck. Yeah. Anyway, get out there, get my bow out. Here comes, there's 20 people out there watching me shoot.

• 59:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course.

• 59:13Cameron Hanes?

  I'm like, it's just the way it goes.

• 59:15Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 59:16Cameron Hanes?

  It's, it's all good. It's a, but it's, you know, things change and it's just, for me, when I look at that, sometimes you want to be able to shoot your bow and just kind of get dialed in by yourself just because like, you don't know. I mean, travel, I hope I'm going to shoot good. If you shoot shitty, everybody's there filming everything. But now I'm just like, when I go into that setting now, I'm like, no, I wanted this. This is what I, this is what I wanted. I wanted people to care about me. They care.

• 59:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:46Cameron Hanes?

  I can't bitch about it. Watch me shoot.

• 59:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:49Cameron Hanes?

  And so, yeah.

• 59:50Speaker 01

  I still work, so like, I'm still in that process. Um, and James has just kind of never, never cared what people think, you know, like he just comes out his authentic self and, you know, um, people love watching him and he doesn't mind whatsoever. It's just, that's how he's always been. Um, and James will tell you, me, four years ago, it's a very different person when it came to shooting. And if I were shooting poorly, I was the one you did not want to be around.

• 1:00:20Cameron Hanes?

  It's hard.

• 1:00:21Speaker 01

  I was, yeah.

• 1:00:21Cameron Hanes?

  This is, it's hard putting yourself out there.

• 1:00:24Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. And so I still have gotten a million times better at not

• 1:00:30Speaker 01

  being an absolute dick if I start to suck. Um, but there's still that pressure, I guess, that, um, you know, if you go out there and you're just having one of your, your bad days, or you're just not performing. And like, most of the time it'll be at like a tack and you get, you know, 48 to 50 pounds with a 24 and a half inch draw, you know, a little baby bow.

• 1:00:54Cameron Hanes?

  That's tough.

• 1:00:54Speaker 01

  Uh, there's a lot more I am accounting for, like we were talking about in that video today. That's me all of the time.

• 1:01:01Cameron Hanes?

  Up in the trees, your arrows way the fuck up there.

• 1:01:03Speaker 01

  I'm like, it's not this branch, it's not this one. I'm worried about this one up here.

• 1:01:07Cameron Hanes?

  That's way harder.

• 1:01:07Speaker 01

  Yeah. And, um, and so if you're having one of those, it could just be not you, it could just be the course is not built for someone your size. Um, and so I still, to this day, will struggle with like, trying to keep the attitude up just simply because it's this thought that like, well, I really didn't want to come out here and suck in front of these people. And then we put out a video that did, you know, week before where, oh, I beat, you know, like there was one at tack in Tennessee where I beat everybody. You know, James, Josh, Brandon, beat them all. And then the next video, they're come out and they're filming with me and I'm missing every other target. And they're like, damn, they must've faked that.

• 1:01:49Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:01:51Speaker 01

  And so you just feel like, what are people thinking about you? And it's something I have to try to remind myself a lot, um, cause I'm a very, um, competitive person with myself, like being a band music kid, my whole, like, that's my degree. Um, you, you focus on perfection. And if you focus on it so much that you're worried about what others are thinking, um, it eats away at your confidence when you're out there. And so I still struggle with that. I haven't gotten over it. So like, going out, we, we shot at hunt camp and, uh, I'm just, I like, didn't get my bow to like shoot in front of people until like, uh, week two.

• 1:02:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, right.

• 1:02:33Speaker 01

  I was like, I've been out here a while. I should probably shoot the bow. And, uh, and at one point, I was shooting and someone said something about like kneeling, because you may need to take a kneeling shot. And so like, I was in full draw and just went from one knee to two to down on my butt. And they're like, oh my God, that was so graceful. And I'm like, in my head, like, oh, thank God we practiced.

• 1:02:55Speaker 01

  But I don't know. It's just, uh, it's interesting, like, having to get to that point where you, it's not that you don't care. It's just that you become more comfortable with the fact that you know that that is going to happen, that people are watching, that people are, you know, paying attention to you. Um.

• 1:03:13Cameron Hanes?

  You feel, you feel judged for sure. I mean, I, I go to hunt camp a lot with guys and they're never out shooting your, their bow. And these are guys, it's like, feel the same way you feel, that they don't want to, they don't want to look, they don't want to look like they suck, you know? So instead, they just won't practice and then the animal suffers? Is that supposed to be better in some way? You know, it's like, but I understand how being self-conscious about that because shooting a bow is hard. When you're feeling pressure and eyes on you, it's even harder, you know? And so I, I get it. I totally get it. And, um, yeah, just the way it goes.

• 1:03:51Cameron Hanes?

  I, I don't think anybody's immune to it. I mean, you do a really good job at it, but it's also because you have a lot of confidence in your shot. So you earn that confidence, you know, and you, you'll, I would guess, but you'll put yourself out there in front of anybody.

• 1:04:06Speaker 02

  Anybody.

• 1:04:07Cameron Hanes?

  And shoot against them. And that, that is a superpower, but that didn't come, you didn't take a shortcut to get there. It's a fucking grind.

• 1:04:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Dude, until, let me tell you, there's one great equalizer, right? Where it's going to get you. That's going and shooting indoor, bro. Go get on the Vegas line. There's nothing that feels like that, bro.

• 1:04:27Cameron Hanes?

  I bet.

• 1:04:28Speaker 02

  That feels crazier than having a giant bowl in front of you. I'm not kidding. Oh dude.

• 1:04:32Cameron Hanes?

  The pressure?

• 1:04:32Speaker 02

  I don't know how to describe it, bro. It's like you frigging blackout.

• 1:04:36Speaker 01

  I have never seen James shake, holding a bow ever until that moment.

• 1:04:39Cameron Hanes?

  Crazy. How'd you shoot?

• 1:04:41Speaker 02

  I shot really well. So I shot, uh, for me, I mean, I saw, uh, um, our indoor journey was only six weeks. I had never shot an indoor league, nothing. So I went from not doing any indoor to six weeks, shooting the biggest shoot in the world, doing Vegas, right? And in practice, I was shooting, I would say anywhere between 298 and 300s towards the end. So I was like hitting 300s and a lot of 299s, 298s. And I had to go do an outdoor tournament in Arizona, like the weekend before Vegas. And I like, I was like, man, I really just want to shoot indoor, but I had to go do it. It was part of the series, right? To win a buckle, um, that we were filming.

• 1:05:19Speaker 02

  So I went out there, won that tournament and it felt so easy, dude. Like it's eat, when you go from shooting indoor to outdoor, bro, it's like a cheat code. It's like you took the donut off your baseball bat and just can swing.

• 1:05:30Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 1:05:30Speaker 02

  It's so easy. Right? So I felt like it was a cakewalk. Came back in and shot indoor. I had two days to practice till we went to Vegas. And dude, I had a rough day of practice, right? It was just a bow was moving everywhere. I felt like I couldn't shoot well, but I still shot a 297, right? And I was like, thinking to myself, I go, you know what? If I, if I go to Vegas and with all the pressure, people say there will be, which I didn't think there would, because I'm used to shooting in front of Cam and Paige and you know what? I'm shooting from people all the time on camera, whatever. And, uh, I'm like, but if I shot a 297 in Vegas, I would be like really stoked. And this was, I felt like shit today, you know? So I get to Vegas and dude, I'm like, first practice day goes by, I'm shooting with this guy Towson and Kayla and I'm shooting.

• 1:06:13Speaker 02

  And, uh, I frigging shoot really good in practice and I wasn't nervous at all. And I'm like, oh, this is, I'm good, bro.

• 1:06:20Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:20Speaker 02

  But then the competition day comes, bro, and I'm on the line and I remember, I can feel it like festering about 20 minutes before. And I'm like, just pounding water, dude. Like I probably drank a gallon and a half of water.

• 1:06:32Speaker 01

  You drank more than that, because you, he had a like a Polar Pop sized cup.

• 1:06:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:37Speaker 01

  And, uh, and just knowing him, like, I can tell when the nerves are there, when something is different than his usual behavior. Um, you don't often see nerves from him if ever, but that was, when he was on cup five of a Polar Pop before it had even started.

• 1:06:55Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:55Speaker 01

  I was like, oh no, he's nervous drinking.

• 1:06:57Speaker 02

  Oh dude, dude. So I'm friggin's up there on the line and then you have two practice ends and then the game starts, right? And you gotta shoot 30 arrows. So the practice end one starts and I could, at this point, I'm like fully, I'm like, all right, how do you, this is, whew, I'm like sweating. I had to have a guy go get a towel, like a shooter towel, because my hands were all clammy. Dude, I draw back on my first practice end and normally my pin like, stays within the 10 like this. And this sucker was frigging moving to the red. And I'm like, oh boy, this could be a rough day, right? So I'm like, well buddy, you just gotta, gotta try, gotta try to put him in the middle.

• 1:07:36Speaker 02

  And I frigging shot a 297, right? 297, I think it was a 19X, maybe 18X. And then the next day, uh, oh, and by the way, the kid I was shooting with was really good. He was a young kid. I wish I could remember his name. I think it was Lane. Shout out to Lane. He was shooting right next to me. Um, and then I had a disabled girl shooting right in front of me. You shoot like nuts to butts, right? With people. And, uh, he shot really well. He shot a 296 and he was like, he told me, he's like, dude, I, my goal was to shoot good and I was hoping I'd meet you here and we're getting to shoot side by side. Like this is crazy. I just want to try to like, get close and score. And he put up a 296, right? Shot really good. We were both like, towards the top of the flights and in our flight. And, uh,

• 1:08:21Speaker 02

  the next day, it just goes to show how the nerves are. I step in there, little bit less nervous, but still nervous. I shoot another 297, but with one more X. So I got a little bit better. I'm watching him shoot every round, you know, because you switch off. So he would shoot, I would shoot and I'm watching him shoot. And he walks back to set his bow down and I'm like, dude, you, you only shot two arrows. Go shoot a third one. And he was like, no, I shot three. And I look and he hit my target, bro. He missed by like this much, right? Just totally shanked one and shot a zero. And I'm like, and he was good, you know what I mean? But that goes to show how that pressure is, bro. And then I, so I, and then the next day, we got moved to where the pros shoot,

• 1:09:02Speaker 02

  like the main floor where Paige is shooting, you know? Um, because I was in flight three of 25 and, uh, I ended up, I was clean through eight rounds, bro. I had a 300 going and then I dropped two nines the last two rounds. Um, so I ended up with a 298. So I shot, uh, 892 out of 900.

• 1:09:20Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:09:21Speaker 02

  So solid. I was really, I won 150 bucks. Come on, we rich, I'm gonna go get a Bentley, let's go. You know what I mean?

• 1:09:29Cameron Hanes?

  That's impressive.

• 1:09:30Speaker 02

  Dude.

• 1:09:31Cameron Hanes?

  For your first Vegas?

• 1:09:32Speaker 02

  First, first ever indoor at all.

• 1:09:34Cameron Hanes?

  Cause I, most people, their first one probably really struggle.

• 1:09:38Speaker 02

  Oh dude.

• 1:09:38Speaker 01

  Everybody says, like, all the pros and everybody goes every year, they're like, you're gonna drop a minimum of, from whatever your average score is, drop a minimum of 10 points off of that score, uh, and that's a minimum.

• 1:09:51Speaker 02

  And I shot about what I do in practice, so it just, you know, held it together. I mean, dude, like, have you ever done like an indoor league or anything ever?

• 1:10:00Cameron Hanes?

  Out in the mountains, there's no room for weak gear. When I'm packing out meat in the heat, or loading up for a long range training trip, I need a cooler that holds the line every time. That's why I use Grizzly coolers. These things are bear proof, rugged as hell, and keep ice locked in for days, literally. I've had coolers on the trail, baking in the sun, still holding ice after hauling out elk quarters. That's performance you can count on. Whether you're running deep in the backcountry or just stacking meat for the weekend, Grizzly is built for that grind. Don't roll with weak gear. Go Grizzly.

• 1:10:41Cameron Hanes?

  This episode is brought to you by Mountain Ops, a brand I've trusted for years to fuel my training, power me through the backcountry, and help me recover strong so I can do it all again the next day. Whether I'm deep in the mountains on a hunt, or pushing hard during a workout, Mountain Ops has been a constant part of my routine. I worked closely with the team at Mountain Ops to create a full line of products that match the way I train and live every day. We call it the Keep Hammering Line, and it's built to help you show up strong physically and mentally, no matter what your goals are. Need a boost before a tough workout or a long hike? The pre-workout delivers clean, sustained energy and endurance to help you go the distance. Want to recover faster and reduce soreness?

• 1:11:23Cameron Hanes?

  Our BCA's are designed to help your muscles bounce back and stay strong for the next challenge. And when it's time to refuel, the Keep Hammering Protein packs 23 grams of high-quality protein per serving. No fillers, just real fuel your body needs. These are the same products I use every single day, whether I'm training in the gym or chasing elk through the high country. So, if you're ready to step up your performance and recovery, head to mountainops.com, use code CAM, and you get 20% off your order. That's mountainops.com, code CAM for 20% off. Mountain Ops, conquer more. I don't, I, yeah, I mean, a million years ago, the bow rack.

• 1:12:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, you should give it a go one time, just show up and shoot the indoor league, bro.

• 1:12:06Cameron Hanes?

  I'm not, I'm not good at that shit. I'm not good at that.

• 1:12:10Speaker 02

  The nerves are freaking crazy.

• 1:12:12Speaker 01

  James is gonna make me do it this year.

• 1:12:14Speaker 02

  I don't know what it is.

• 1:12:16Speaker 01

  I don't have to.

• 1:12:17Cameron Hanes?

  It's just cause there's no room for error. I mean, you gotta hit the X, or you gotta get a 10, so you can't fuck up. That's, that's what's hard.

• 1:12:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's not for me, uh, and I don't have the patience for it.

• 1:12:30Cameron Hanes?

  How many people, like, do the, like, the flyer like that kid, like?

• 1:12:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, that'll happen, and, and, uh, what happens a lot.

• 1:12:37Speaker 01

  Two to three times per round, um, like a whole game, at least two to three times. Now, there's a lot of people shooting, so it's probably not as much as you would think, but they'll, they'll blow a whistle or whatever it is.

• 1:12:51Speaker 02

  They shoot the wrong target.

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  To tell everybody to pause, essentially, because they gotta go pull somebody else's arrow out of somebody else's target. It's because you're like halfway through the round, you just shoot five ends, and then you flip-flop, so if you're shooting the top target, you go to the bottom, and people just, they're, they're blacked out. I mean, they're so tunnel visioned.

• 1:13:11Cameron Hanes?

  They shoot the wrong target.

• 1:13:12Speaker 02

  You've been shooting top the whole time, and now you, you switch them and you just naturally shoot top. So Greg taught me a good lesson, like, we filmed a whole series about it, so if anyone's watching, is interested in trying indoor. Number one, I would encourage it from a hunting standpoint, it's gonna make your shooting way better and your knowledge about bows way better. But Greg said, he told me, he said, "I want you to say it out loud when they switch the target. I want you to stand there by yourself and just say, 'Top target, bottom target,' like, say it. Do not shoot the wrong one."

• 1:13:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:41Speaker 02

  And dude, I friggin' almost did one time. I drew, and I was like on it, and I went, "Oop, there's arrows in that one." Down, but, oh, had there not have been arrows, I would've shot the wrong one.

• 1:13:50Speaker 01

  People are like, they'll shoot the wrong one when they're staring at arrows, like, how do you not know those are not your arrows? But they're just, they're blacked out.

• 1:13:59Cameron Hanes?

  That pressure.

• 1:13:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I can't believe how good, cause how many people shot 300s? Like, don't, doesn't like a million people go in clean and then have to do a shoot-off?

• 1:14:10Speaker 02

  Uh, in the pros, yeah. So I was in the flights, and nobody shot a 900. The top score was a 899. So I was only, you know, only whatever, seven off that.

• 1:14:19Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, right.

• 1:14:20Speaker 02

  But Paige, get this, this is brutal, right? So Paige and I, we were shooting, we ended up shooting about the same schedule every day, so we never got to watch each other shoot. She would be shooting while I would be shooting, so we never got to like, watch each other shoot. In the third day, she had a 900 going, so she shot a 300, 300, all she has to do is shoot one more 300, all she has to do is shoot one more 300, and she's in the finals, right? And I'm like, dude, I finally am gonna get to go watch her shoot, so I walk over there, and she was on end nine, or it might've even been end 10, it was one of her last two.

• 1:14:51Speaker 01

  I think it was nine.

• 1:14:52Speaker 02

  And she was clean, right? So she only had to shoot like five more arrows in the 10, and she makes the shoot-off. The very first arrow, I pull up and watch her shoot, she shoots a nine, bro, and I'm like, I watch it, I'm like, Brianna, I think she just shot a nine, and I, I was like, oh, she's gonna hate me, bro, like, I couldn't believe it. But she, she didn't even see me, I don't think, but of course, I'm feeling guilty. I only watched one arrow, it's a nine.

• 1:15:18Cameron Hanes?

  That's so, I can't even imagine.

• 1:15:20Speaker 02

  You're cooked, cause she's a pro, right? So I think there was five or six women that shot 900s, and they made the shoot-off, and she didn't, so. And she, one arrow, dude, that's it.

• 1:15:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:30Speaker 02

  So unforgiving, dude.

• 1:15:32Cameron Hanes?

  It's, it's, it's pretty crazy how people that are so good at that, then either don't hunt or aren't good hunters.

• 1:15:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's the cool part about Paige, is she is a beast of a hunter.

• 1:15:42Cameron Hanes?

  I know, that's what I like about that, and same with Levi, I mean, I don't know if he, does he shoot fingers?

• 1:15:47Speaker 02

  I don't think he does a ton of indoor, I think he mostly does, and I could be the target shooter, like, cook me right here, but I think he does a lot of unmarked stuff.

• 1:15:55Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:15:56Speaker 01

  I still think that's even crazier, you know, which like, how good of a hunter can that make you? Because, eh, huh, the amount, coming western was the biggest shock from when you like, you're ranging bushes and stuff to like, "Well, if he walks this way, it's about that," and like, the first couple times I went with him, I was just so like, I don't know, just pent up, I guess, from like, not knowing the exact yardage.

• 1:16:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:23Speaker 01

  Um, I just did not enjoy that whatsoever, so to have the skill to be that good at unmarking something, like, what type of hunter, at least at that point, when it comes down to the wire, can that make you, you know, help you? To be able to take those types of guesses.

• 1:16:41Cameron Hanes?

  And then like with him too, they go for those 14s, which are, you might get a five if you miss the 14, and you don't even know the yardage.

• 1:16:50Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Dropped a, dropped a vello. I'm sorry, an alp.

• 1:16:54Speaker 01

  In your mouth.

• 1:16:55Cameron Hanes?

  An alp.

• 1:16:55Speaker 02

  An alp. Shout out, congrats on alp, dude. Are you and Tucker best buddies now?

• 1:17:00Cameron Hanes?

  We are, yeah.

• 1:17:00Speaker 02

  That's cool.

• 1:17:01Cameron Hanes?

  We're tight.

• 1:17:01Speaker 02

  What do you guys bond about?

• 1:17:03Cameron Hanes?

  Uh, well, he said he likes this hat, even though he likes drinking whiskey and smoking cigarettes and not, he likes doing easy things, he said, so, but this is an easy suck, right?

• 1:17:16Speaker 02

  Is that on your website?

• 1:17:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:18Speaker 02

  How many entries is that for the Bentley if someone buys that hat?

• 1:17:21Cameron Hanes?

  Uh, I don't even know.

• 1:17:22Speaker 02

  A lot though, a lot.

• 1:17:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's pretty much a guaranteed win.

• 1:17:26Speaker 02

  Cameron Hanes dot com, go get entered for the Bentley. You have till September to get entered.

• 1:17:31Cameron Hanes?

  That's right.

• 1:17:31Speaker 02

  I'm gonna, I'm gonna get in there though, I'm gonna win that, and the people are gonna say it's right.

• 1:17:34Speaker 01

  And we will sell it, because we're not paying $700. That's wild. I had never had an alp, an, an alp, until, what, the Montana Tac?

• 1:17:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:45Speaker 01

  And they work, I guess, with like, the people who, Grizzly coolers, and, uh, so they, Montana Knife was having this. Montana Knife was having this, um, this party in the evening, we usually never go to them. Um, James wants to get back immediately and get in the hot tub.

• 1:18:03Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, and, uh, so we went, and in front of them, they give you two drink tickets, you go up to the bar, and there's just these open coolers. Filled with alps. And I am a pouch addict. I quit vaping last year, um, I haven't been able to, to quit the pouches, but you know, I think that's all right, other than the enamel on my molars say otherwise, but, you know.

• 1:18:30Speaker 02

  You can always get a gold one.

• 1:18:31Speaker 01

  And I was like, I look over, I'm like, are, are these, are these free? And they're like, yeah, like, we cannot take them home, so take it. I serve stuff in every pocket I have. I was like, James, here's your pockets full, here's my pockets full.

• 1:18:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, they're nice.

• 1:18:47Speaker 01

  I was loaded down, and, uh, I never even had them, but I was like, pouches are expensive. Especially where we live, and you can't even get flavors, um, and so I tried one, and I think it's the Drifter series that I am in love with, cause I'm normally not like a, a citrus or fruity flavored pouch person, but it's like a citrus or a fruit with the ice flavor of a vape, and I hadn't had a vape in a year. So I put one of those things in, and I was on like cloud nine. This thing's amazing, uh, and so.

• 1:19:24Cameron Hanes?

  A little bump to get the head straight.

• 1:19:26Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, it's fantastic. I'm, I sound like an addict over here, but I truly am, so.

• 1:19:31Cameron Hanes?

  No, you just sound passionate.

• 1:19:33Speaker 01

  Yes, that's what it is. I'm very passionate about nicotine pouches.

• 1:19:37Speaker 02

  Alp's gonna give Brianna a call after this episode.

• 1:19:39Speaker 01

  I'll tell you what, whatever commercial you want.

• 1:19:41Cameron Hanes?

  An addiction, it's just, it's just very passionate.

• 1:19:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a love for nicotine pouches.

• 1:19:49Speaker 02

  Me too.

• 1:19:50Speaker 01

  Passionate about pouches.

• 1:19:52Speaker 02

  I am passionate about bow.

• 1:19:53Speaker 01

  Especially when you live in a state that you can't buy flavors, like, you gotta go to like these backdoor hidden rooms.

• 1:19:59Cameron Hanes?

  Alwad?

• 1:20:00Speaker 02

  In California.

• 1:20:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, all flavors for nicotine pouches, and for, uh, and for vapes, so.

• 1:20:07Cameron Hanes?

  Fucking Gavin.

• 1:20:08Speaker 01

  For a while, at least probably still now.

• 1:20:10Speaker 02

  I'm gonna tell my hot take. I'm gonna tell him, look, don't toast me in the comments right here, I'm just speaking off odds, right, if I was a gambler?

• 1:20:20Speaker 02

  I do think Gavin's the next big guy.

• 1:20:22Speaker 01

  We'll be moving to New Zealand.

• 1:20:23Speaker 02

  I do, I hate to tell you.

• 1:20:25Cameron Hanes?

  For president?

• 1:20:25Speaker 02

  I think he is.

• 1:20:26Cameron Hanes?

  God, probably. He's as slimy as it takes.

• 1:20:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. What do you think? Is that a hot take? Or you think it's possible?

• 1:20:33Cameron Hanes?

  No, it's po- I know, politics is such a fucking cesspool.

• 1:20:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:36Cameron Hanes?

  He'd be perfect for it.

• 1:20:37Speaker 02

  Yeah. He looks like the Joker, straight up, dude.

• 1:20:42Cameron Hanes?

  He looks like the villain, for sure. Yeah.

• 1:20:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, but we all keep voting. Like, I don't, I don't understand it.

• 1:20:48Speaker 02

  Well, we're gonna too. We're all, we're all kept.

• 1:20:50Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:51Speaker 01

  This whole west side, the whole coast.

• 1:20:53Cameron Hanes?

  You got anything over there? You've been pretty quiet.

• 1:20:57Speaker 02

  He's festering.

• 1:20:57Speaker 03

  Well, I don't, I don't really have anything to add to your guys' industry talk, since I'm just a-

• 1:21:01Speaker 01

  He's dreaming about eating a hot dog.

• 1:21:03Speaker 03

  I'm just a, uh, what do you call it?

• 1:21:06Cameron Hanes?

  Cock gobbler?

• 1:21:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, that, that's what I was looking for. We wanna talk about the cock goblin, uh, industry?

• 1:21:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:21:14Speaker 03

  I'm in.

• 1:21:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, he's an expert. That's where his passion really lies.

• 1:21:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, you wanna talk about passion?

• 1:21:21Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness.

• 1:21:25Cameron Hanes?

  So, okay, how about this? How about this? Who is, okay, we'll go with, uh, rising star of the industry and biggest dork in the industry, heel.

• 1:21:39Speaker 02

  In our industry?

• 1:21:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, hunting, bow hunting.

• 1:21:42Speaker 02

  Now, is it hunting specific, or can it be more archery too?

• 1:21:45Cameron Hanes?

  Would, how about hunting and archery? One of each.

• 1:21:47Speaker 02

  All right, all right. In archery, it's gotta be my girl, she shoots X's. Her content's great.

• 1:21:53Cameron Hanes?

  Who is it?

• 1:21:53Speaker 02

  Uh, her name is Kayla.

• 1:21:55Speaker 01

  That's in just archery.

• 1:21:56Speaker 02

  She's a archery. She does hunt, but her content's all archery stuff. She shoots X's as her handle, and she does a lot of like educator, educational stuff, and she's relatively new at archery, but she's quite good. She did Vegas as well. I think she's done it twice. And she just has a very good way of getting a message and a point across that helps other people shoot, and she posts a lot. She's very persistent and shoots a ton.

• 1:22:18Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:22:19Speaker 02

  So for archery, I would say her. For hunting, mm, that is tough. Um, hmm.

• 1:22:29Speaker 01

  And you don't watch a lot of it.

• 1:22:31Speaker 02

  I don't watch a lot of hunting. I don't. Uh, I'm gonna loop back to that. Do you have one?

• 1:22:36Speaker 01

  I don't know. We're kind of in this, uh, I feel like almost a little bit of a lull right now, and like, rising.

• 1:22:46Speaker 02

  Oh, I got one. I got one. I like, I like Joey Visser a lot, actually. He has very good content when he puts it out. It's a mix of rifle and bow. Not a relative of mine just happens to have the same last name. Not a very good looking guy.

• 1:22:57Speaker 01

  I'm gonna throw out a different one.

• 1:22:59Speaker 02

  But Joey makes great stuff.

• 1:23:00Cameron Hanes?

  Does he? Okay. I didn't know either of those two, so that's good.

• 1:23:02Speaker 01

  Well, he's not, he is a good hunter, but he's always behind his camera, is Ethan.

• 1:23:09Speaker 02

  Oh, Ethan Byrne, very good.

• 1:23:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, his-

• 1:23:11Speaker 02

  He does more like James does.

• 1:23:13Speaker 01

  James and I are very different in our-

• 1:23:14Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, is that, what's his face? Joel's brother?

• 1:23:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:17Speaker 02

  Excellent content.

• 1:23:18Speaker 01

  I love, like, if I were, I want it to look like I'm watching a paid TV movie on YouTube.

• 1:23:27Speaker 02

  That's hard.

• 1:23:28Speaker 01

  Whereas James loves Raw. And, uh, but to me, it's like the ability to get that type of content, even though they're like, well, you're the cameraman, not the hunter. It's like, cameraman has to be in the same place as the hunter. It's like, how'd you think they got there?

• 1:23:40Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:23:40Speaker 01

  It's not a 600 power lens on the front of that camera. They're filming from across the canyon, you know?

• 1:23:45Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:23:45Speaker 01

  Uh, they're behind him most of the time. And, uh, so his, his video footage is just on another level, I feel like, in his storytelling.

• 1:23:55Speaker 02

  Very good.

• 1:23:56Speaker 01

  And he's starting to finally dabble in creating his own stuff and going out to film himself and other people.

• 1:24:03Speaker 02

  Oh, good.

• 1:24:04Speaker 01

  And he's one, I think, if he just sticks with it, um, you know, he could, he could do amazing content. Um, and he's such a qua- when we talk about authentic people, um, you know, he is as like authentic as it comes.

• 1:24:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:19Speaker 01

  Um, you know, he's a very, a very Christian man, but it doesn't, like, there's no fakeness to who he is. Like, you'll still hear a curse word, and you'll hear the jokes or, or whatever. Um, there's no, like, he won't hang out with James because it's, it's James, and he's Christian Lite, and you know, I'm real Christian, or, or whatever. Um, he's just a very real person. He's one, he's, like, at the very beginning stages of what he, I think, wants to do and could do.

• 1:24:48Speaker 02

  His pictures are crazy too. I mean, his photos and video. And then one more I just thought of, uh, is my guy Travis Sloan. He's from South Africa. He filmed all my Africa stuff. Number one phenomenal, phenomenal filmer. And you know how it is, because you've hunted with a lot of filmers. You can tell when a filmer's a very good hunter.

• 1:25:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:05Speaker 02

  And he's very good. Like, we got stuff done that we shouldn't have got done. We spot and stalked everything and got some tough stuff across the line.

• 1:25:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:12Speaker 02

  And with excellent footage, because he has that hunting talent, and then he does do his own hunting content as well. That's top, top shelf, so. Those would be a couple of them. Uh, and the biggest dweeb?

• 1:25:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:24Speaker 02

  Uh, uh, bro, I know who it is. I know who it is.

• 1:25:30Speaker 02

  It's Matt Ranella.

• 1:25:31Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, that's, that's loving.

• 1:25:33Speaker 03

  He's gonna click, I'm gonna have to bleep his name.

• 1:25:35Speaker 02

  I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be on his page for sure. Yeah, bleep it.

• 1:25:38Cameron Hanes?

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Leave that fucking dipshit's name in there.

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  We're gonna be on his page, guaranteed.

• 1:25:43Speaker 03

  Matt Ranella, I don't know that name. You mean Cock Ranella?

• 1:25:48Speaker 02

  Jeez, OP. But it has to be.

• 1:25:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, he's just, I think he's just miserable, but that's all right.

• 1:25:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:56Cameron Hanes?

  He needs, he needs love too.

• 1:25:57Speaker 03

  It's all love.

• 1:25:58Cameron Hanes?

  It's all love.

• 1:25:59Speaker 02

  It's all love, of course. What about yours?

• 1:26:00Speaker 01

  Rising stars and dweebs.

• 1:26:03Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, well, so, I do like a rising star, Wayne's son, Nathan Nendicott. He works really hard. He's a good bow hunter. Um, he films all his own stuff, so it's hard, you know, it's like in the wilderness up here, but I just, I like the passion. He's like so, just grew up hunting with Wayne as his dad, and just works really hard. And he makes, puts films out there. He filmed his dad's sheep hunt, like, a couple of years ago. Uh, Wayne drew a sheep tag. There's not many bow hunting sheep videos out there.

• 1:26:36Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:26:37Cameron Hanes?

  And got that one done, so, um, I like Nathan. Um, yeah, let's see. For the biggest dweeb? God, I know a lot, but not in, do I, who do I bitch about, James?

• 1:26:53Speaker 02

  Oh, I know one. I know one that he does.

• 1:26:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:26:57Cameron Hanes?

  Who?

• 1:26:58Speaker 02

  I can't say it. I know one, dude.

• 1:27:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, just go like this.

• 1:27:04Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 1:27:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:06Cameron Hanes?

  Is that who you were gonna say too?

• 1:27:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:09Speaker 01

  I missed it, because I don't have my headphones on.

• 1:27:11Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, well, we've had, we've, we've had some ups and downs. I don't like people talking shit. Uh, no, if you talk, if you don't like me, then fucking don't like me. I'm good. A lot of people don't like me, but don't act like you like me to me, and then go and talk shit about me.

• 1:27:29Speaker 01

  Facts. Too many in this industry.

• 1:27:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:32Speaker 01

  Um, that, uh, there are some people I've told him now at this point, I just, if he's going to do something, I'll be at home.

• 1:27:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:41Speaker 01

  Like, I just, I can't put myself around them. Um, the, the amount you'll hear, like, in one room when they're with them on the camera, and then the next, it's like, every of their bad thing you could think of is being said about them.

• 1:27:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:54Speaker 01

  Um, you know, that they're saying about other people. I'm like, I filled with them like 30 minutes ago. Um, and, uh, it's just the negativity that breeds from it.

• 1:28:06Cameron Hanes?

  I guess, yeah.

• 1:28:07Speaker 01

  And like, the, the passive aggressiveness that like, you know, because James is a big joker. And, and jokes are great, you know, but like, when the jokes be just become this like passive, like every, every joke, like, it seemed like everybody's like just being passive aggressive to each other. We're all just calling it jokes, but none of you actually like each other.

• 1:28:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, and nobody's actually laughing.

• 1:28:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, um, I'm like, uh, he just took a hit at someone. He just took another one. Like,

• 1:28:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:32Speaker 01

  We had like a secret little, like, World War III battle over here, just with our words. Um, I, it's my least favorite trait about people. Um, and that's why, again, James kinda says I can be a bit, um, I'm gonna get him canceled one day or something, because I just have no problem saying how I feel. And if I don't like ya, I don't like ya. Um, if I don't like the way you treat people, um, it's just not, it's not for me. It's not a behavior or trait I like to put myself around. Um, so there are some people now, I'll just, I'll just like, like, I'll just stay home for that trip or whatever. Uh, I can't, like, there's a lot of that in this, um, I get it. It's a business industry. Like, people still need to make money. Businesses need to make money. The,

• 1:29:17Speaker 01

  the content creators, it, it is their full-time job. You people have to understand, they need to make money. Um, but you also can't, like, lose the human nature of just being kind.

• 1:29:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:28Speaker 01

  Um, and that, I feel like, gets pushed to the wayside sometimes. Um, and I'm like, oh, gosh, I can't, can't do it anymore.

• 1:29:37Cameron Hanes?

  It's a, I think some of it, I don't know, it was weird. There was a, a whole group of guys in the hunting industry, when the women came in and they were getting a lot of attention. They were talking shit about the women.

• 1:29:50Speaker 01

  Breached, yeah.

• 1:29:51Cameron Hanes?

  Right? And, yeah, we've been breached. And-

• 1:29:55Cameron Hanes?

  My, my, and I saw it all as like, you know, the bow hunting Bonnies or whatever the fuck that people would say, but

• 1:30:02Speaker 02

  Huntresses.

• 1:30:02Cameron Hanes?

  Huntresses, yeah. And my thoughts on it were at that time is like, if this is a competition, it's business, this competition. If you're going to get knocked off of whatever little corner of the industry you're in by, by a girl who's doing her thing too, then I guess you're not that fucking good. Right?

• 1:30:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:30:24Cameron Hanes?

  Cause I've never, I like competition. I want to be better. So part of it like with me and John, I think was competition a little bit. For me, I've been competing my whole life. I don't give a fuck. Yeah. Oh, you're better than me? I guess I better get to work. Right? I don't really look at it that way, but I know part of it is this mindset of there's only so many, so many, so much resource out there. Or there's only, and we say, we talk about cake and then Rogan taught me this, that there's enough cake for everybody. I was like, no, I want it all, you know, and I'd say, you know, boot on their neck, fuck you. This is competition. But I matured, right? And I'm like, no, we can all like, we're collaborating. We, I want you to win.

• 1:31:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:31:09Cameron Hanes?

  You know?

• 1:31:09Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 1:31:10Cameron Hanes?

  And that is just, it works so much better for everybody, but I understand men and ego and, and competition and things like that. And you're fighting for every scrap you can get. I get it. But if you're worried about yourself and just being as good as you can be, it'll, everything else will take care of it, of, you know, you'll get where you want to go. You don't have to, this guy doesn't have to fail for you to succeed.

• 1:31:36Speaker 02

  No, and if anything, I always make the argument that I think that the, I, the bigger, I mean, the bigger any creator gets, you know, it really is, here it is right here. Rising tide does raise all ships. If we bring more viewers and more people into the space, number one, that helps our ballot measures and stuff, people against hunting, because we have more allies, whether or not they hunt or not. But also from a content creator side, if, if, you know, some, some guy brings in a whole bunch of new audience into the space that's interested in archery and hunting content, all that's going to do is help mine numbers too.

• 1:32:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 1:32:11Speaker 02

  It's not actually a bad thing. I do know how in our heads, we can start to get like competitive with it, but I do agree with Joe that I think, it's actually wiser to try to grow the whole ship, the whole, the whole lake.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  Well, not just that, but you know, just on the business side of it, like, um, and, and not even for a selfish reason, but you could call it caramel, whatever you want to call it. But like, if you go out and granted it be a person that you feel, you know, deserves the, the help or, you know, the hookup or whatever it is, the connection, um, you know, cause there have been times that if James is like, I probably shouldn't have like, offered this person to this company or whatever. Um, but say it is a person and you give them that connection. You introduce them in that text message or email or whatever, you know, nine times out of 10, that person's going to come back and they're going to appreciate that.

• 1:33:03Speaker 01

  And like, you know, they're going to look to help you out at some point. Um, so why, why would we, you know, put our boot on their, their neck? It's like you're, you're staying down so I can go up. Um, because

• 1:33:17Cameron Hanes?

  There's going to be a time where that boot's going to be on your neck.

• 1:33:20Speaker 01

  Yeah. And maybe it's that person who could remove that boot and why would they want to?

• 1:33:24Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 1:33:25Speaker 01

  At that point, when you just burned them, however, long ago.

• 1:33:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:28Speaker 01

  Um, so I think rising tides raise all ships is a great phrase, just because, um, I think that ultimately everybody ends up benefiting in the long run. Um, and companies will come up with more money. They'll figure out where to get the money from, you know, if they want both you and somebody else on the team.

• 1:33:47Speaker 02

  If you're valuable and if the lake's growing.

• 1:33:49Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah. That's, uh, I, when I think back on me, you know, not being good at that and not understanding that it so well, it's like, me and Waddell right there, that was like 2004 or something like that. And we were both shooting there for Under Armour. I'm acting like I'm his buddy right there. He was like my enemy. He was like competition and he called me and he was just like, he said, hey, you know, my contract's coming up. I know we're dealing this Under Armour, let's be on the same page and like, you know, here's what I think we could offer. And he's talked about like the bass fishermen kind of worked together on these sponsorships.

• 1:34:27Cameron Hanes?

  So everybody kind of knew about like what, what the market was. And my attitude at that time was like, I'm not fucking telling you anything. I'm, I'm getting mine.

• 1:34:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:34:37Cameron Hanes?

  You know, cause he was actually bigger than me at that. He was like as big as he gets.

• 1:34:41Speaker 02

  Oh, huge.

• 1:34:42Cameron Hanes?

  And so I looked at him like, no, I want to be where you're at. So no, I maybe pretended like, oh yeah, that sounds good. He, I remember he called me. I remember I was talking to him in like one of our first houses on the phone and, um, I wasn't authentic. I was being fake and I was being, you know, conniving and I wasn't being real. And now, you know, we talked about that and how we were kind of, you know, in competition with each other all those years ago. And now we just want to celebrate each other, you know? When, when he went on Rogan, I was as happy as anybody.

• 1:35:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:35:20Cameron Hanes?

  Cause fucking Waddell was on Rogan.

• 1:35:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:35:23Cameron Hanes?

  And that was, that's huge for hunting. So I haven't been perfect. I just want people to know, like,

• 1:35:28Speaker 02

  No one has.

• 1:35:29Cameron Hanes?

  I don't have the fucking answers. I'm flawed, just like anybody. I might, like, I'm all about everybody winning today. Tomorrow I might be like, fuck that guy. And that's not right either, you know? So it's like, I'm still working on this myself. But I just know in the end, it, it works like, and, and there are some people that would say, and we talked about it, like the, if you work hard, it'll take care of itself. Well, like with Sitka, I fucking worked my ass off, wasn't enough, you know? I'm not with it anymore. So can you get like, then I'm like, am I too expensive now? Cause I've worked too hard. Now I've priced myself out of the industry. So it's like, whatever.

• 1:36:11Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, if, if that's a negative where you got too big to where they can't pay you, that's still a win.

• 1:36:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:19Cameron Hanes?

  That's, I'm, that's still a win for me. I don't, I don't care. But it's like, being involved in something like this, that takes so much work. And, and you got to earn your breaks. You have to have people believe in you. You have to do things the right way. Cause eventually it comes out, if you're not treating people right, that's going to come out. Everybody's going to find out about it and you're not going to get to where you want to go. So, um, I just think just talking about it, hopefully helps somebody. Cause I'm not, as I said, I'm not sitting here and saying, I have all the answers. And I've done it perfect. I've fucked up every, every which way you can.

• 1:36:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:53Cameron Hanes?

  Um, I just want to share my mistakes. So hopefully it helps others.

• 1:36:57Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I actually love recently that, you know, especially that episode with Greg and so, you know, the one, the couple we've done together. I haven't obviously heard them all, but like, I love that you are open about the business stuff and we try to be as well because, you know, we're sort of earlier in the game, you know, so we can kind of help out maybe the up and comers that are, you know, trying to break in a little bit. And you, you know, have been in forever and now you have these huge, you know, big deals that you're talking about. So I think it's important to talk about that stuff to let the, the, you know, the Kayla who's 25 or 26 and she's on the up come, on the upswing. It's important to let them know that it is possible. Because if no one ever talks about it and it's all secretive, then it's like,

• 1:37:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I know. And that's how it's always been.

• 1:37:41Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I don't like that.

• 1:37:43Cameron Hanes?

  We have to make decisions what's best for the business, you know, and that's, that's every company here. So it's just good understanding that. And you can't take business decisions personally, which I used to all the time. And I would feel hurt if somebody didn't want to renew or didn't believe in me. And now I'm just like, that's the way it goes. That's life.

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. I do that as I've, you know, been doing this stuff on my own now for almost a, a, or a little over a year. Um, I'm, I'm still again, in that, like in that phase of I, uh, you have to know your value or try to figure out what your value is for whatever it is you offer. And just finding that alone is hard, especially when you're just starting out. Cause you feel automatically like you're not as good as like this company that has 30 workers that does the same thing you do and offers the same quality of work or whatever. Uh, but you're just a one man show. You don't, you're not, you're not a, you know, S core, C core, whatever.

• 1:38:43Speaker 01

  Um, and so immediately, and James gets me on this all of the time. He's like, you undervalue yourself like nobody's business. Um, and, but then you get so timid because you're like, well, I don't want to be turned down. I don't want to, you know, because there's always that feeling like, are they turning you down because you just cost too much? Or are they turning you down then because you're brand new in this? And they don't feel like you can accomplish what they need or you don't have the skill to do it. And so then you start offering, you know, you start rambling. You're like, well, I, I could do it for this much. And, and by the end of it, you're, you know, valuing yourself at a quarter of what you're worth.

• 1:39:20Speaker 02

  It's easy to do.

• 1:39:21Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. And at the end of the day, you just have to be like, no, this is my value. Um, I can negotiate within a certain limit. If I know that like what I do is going to eventually prove to them that here's, you know, monetarily what I've brought in for you. So now we can work up, we'll start with a short-term contract, whatever, all the cases, you know, that you could, you could argue in there. But I have to still say like, I can't go below this point because then, I mean, you're just cutting yourself down at that point. Um, and so I'm still, I still struggle with having to like, put that cap at like, I can't go beyond this. Uh,

• 1:40:00Cameron Hanes?

  I've, I've been, there's times where I've had to look at different deals and say, okay, I'll prove my, even though I've proven myself for over 30 years, I haven't proven myself to you yet. So let me do that. So sometimes it's that too.

• 1:40:12Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's just, just necessary sometimes. And, and it does, I think, it proves your value and it creates this level of like trust and respect within the whoever you're working with, that you're willing that to, you know, cut them that essentially deal or whatever it is. Um, And like for me, it's just in the marketing world and say, okay, I brought in X amount of dollars for you. We're at the time of renegotiation for a contract. You know, I cut off X amount, but I'm willing to bump it up to this. Because you, you were able to prove that what you do is valuable for them.

• 1:40:54Speaker 01

  Whether it's putting a number on it or whatever the case may views, whatever the case may be. And so like James does that was fine, and especially when it comes to like renewal time and you're going through all the analytics and like, oh, that's a rough time.

• 1:41:07Speaker 02

  Oh, that's my favorite, buddy. It's a lot of work, but I love nothing more than, all right, here's some channels that I know. Channels or creators, I know you're probably paying more than me right now. And here's their numbers stacked against ours and amount of posts and I'm always, I always like.

• 1:41:23Speaker 01

  Not just amount of posts, but engagement in it, views, uh, watch time, all of those.

• 1:41:27Speaker 02

  And your stuff's like perfect for that because you, you, you, both of us, actually you have a lot of different ships going on. You got Instagram, you know, the YouTube or all, all the different socials and you know, it's just a dense package, you know, and it's the more well-rounded you could be. You know, we post on everything, right? Five, five, six platforms, Spotify, Apple, like there's a lot of stuff. And you know, if you're a one-trick pony and all you have is, you know, just TikTok. Well, brands are, you know, what happens if your TikTok gets hacked? You know, you have nothing, you know, it's, it's tough. So I think the more saturated you could be across all the different platforms and new ones pop up all the time. It's like a moving targets, like playing whack a mole, trying to keep up with all these platforms popping up.

• 1:42:12Speaker 02

  But then, I mean, if, let's just say our YouTube got deleted or something, well, at least we have four other platforms that we can rebuild off or are already good size. You know what I mean? So I think that's another big factor that maybe some up and comers are missing is putting all their eggs in one basket rather than trying to grow a bunch of them.

• 1:42:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, and I'll add on to that too, where you've, you've kind of done this. The reason why I'm bigger than most in the hunting industry is because I was able to tap into running, lifting, shooting, bow hunting, uh, celebrity type, you know, involvement with, with hunting. And so I gained people through all those channels, right? If you're just an archer, you got one shot at people. So you going indoor is actually real, it's kind of like what I've done, but still an archery, but it's indoor and hunting. And then there can be outdoor too. You can actually have three different people that follow you for those three different reasons.

• 1:43:14Cameron Hanes?

  Different, different crowds of people coming that, that makes the pot that much bigger, right? So being diversified in your message, but then also you have to be able to convert those people to consumers. That's all the businesses care about. Like are people buying our product because of you?

• 1:43:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:43:37Cameron Hanes?

  That's, that's hard to prove.

• 1:43:39Speaker 02

  That's the question.

• 1:43:39Cameron Hanes?

  That's hard to prove. So what I used to always do back in the day before we had like Instagram would be analytics. I'd always, I knew how they worked, how they'd be like per thousand dollars, here's your impressions. So I would go through how many books I sold, how many magazine articles I'd written, how many TV shows I had appeared on. Add up all those impressions, right? And then per thousand, per thousand dollars, if you pay me, you know, a thousand dollars, you get this many impressions. If you pay me, you know, a hundred thousand, you get this many impressions, right? So it's like, it's just impressions per thousand because that's what they understand. They understand numbers and reach. And the more eyeballs you get to, then that's the greater likelihood, a certain percentage of those is going to buy their product.

• 1:44:24Cameron Hanes?

  So it's like, you have to get out in front of people. How do you get out in front of the most people? Well, that has to be diversified message because there's people in the hunting industry right now that they grew and now they're, they're falling off. Because more competition comes in, so they're losing some people. Their message isn't any different. It's, they're doing the exact same thing they've always done, but there's more competition. So they're going backwards and his sponsor is going to be like, well, you're a fucking has been.

• 1:44:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:44:53Cameron Hanes?

  You were, you were hot, now you're down here. So you gotta hustle.

• 1:44:58Speaker 02

  Dude, if you want to say, I mean, you know, I think your example of you doing the running stuff and then also like the stuff you've done with high-profile people, I think is, is a perfect example or us on a, on the target stuff. Like I told you in the car, for me, it had always been on the schedule to at some point do a competition arc in the content and, you know, bring in a whole fresh batch of eyes that had never seen our stuff because they're into competition and indoor and 3D ASA stuff. And now we've absorbed a lot of that audience and we're going to continue to do so by pushing into that, which it not only helps us, but it helps the sport of target archery as well. I can't tell you how many people we met that are like, oh dude, I just got into target because I was watching your stuff.

• 1:45:39Cameron Hanes?

  Compared to hunting.

• 1:45:40Speaker 02

  And I love, I love being around people and hearing them, having them come up and say, I'm only here at Vegas because I was watching your stuff and I wanted to give it a try. And we'd only done it for six weeks. Imagine next year with a year in, right? And then in the future, I have more plans, like, okay, in the future, we'll pull this lever and, you know, jump, jump into this different pool, right? And you gotta always kind of be hitting that moving target and having foresight to know, because you can't, you can't, it's hard to do the exact same thing forever. Even like, you know, Jim Shocky, I think the best show, I love that show Uncharted he did, right? Very, very good, but notice Jim only did it for a couple of seasons and then he morphed it into something else. Jim's always done that, right? Sort of changed what he's doing.

• 1:46:22Speaker 02

  And I think you have to do that and always be better and evolve along the way.

• 1:46:26Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah. No, and he, and also at that time, so Branlon was basically making the best produced films and TV shows in the industry. Like if you went to the Golden Moose Awards, it was like the Shocky Awards, right? They won everything. That doesn't last forever. That shit does not last forever. So you better be always thinking, how do we evolve? And it's a, if you're not, then you're, you know, you're a flash in the pan and then gone. So just to stick around, you better be hustling. It's a, it's fun. You got anything over there?

• 1:47:04Cameron Hanes?

  You fucking idiot.

• 1:47:05Speaker 02

  Is he on his phone doom scrolling over there?

• 1:47:08Speaker 03

  I just looked at uh, Google Trends and there's nothing good.

• 1:47:11Speaker 01

  Is AI gonna kill the entire environment?

• 1:47:14Cameron Hanes?

  No, AI sucks. I think people are like, James, how about this? So you're gay porn? Do you watch real gay porn or AI?

• 1:47:25Speaker 01

  People look really real.

• 1:47:26Speaker 03

  Depends if, if the people haven't given me something real, then you know, I have to go to AI.

• 1:47:32Cameron Hanes?

  People like real. I think, I think it's going to make real even more valuable is the point.

• 1:47:37Speaker 03

  Once I'm on like page 18 or 19 of Pornhub, I know it's about time to go to AI.

• 1:47:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's when you're in, that's when you're in the shadow realm, dude. Once you hit about page 15, you're really searching for that hidden gem, dude.

• 1:47:49Cameron Hanes?

  They got that many pages.

• 1:47:52Speaker 02

  I'm an easy sell, I guess.

• 1:47:54Speaker 01

  But what about all these people who keep saying that uh, AI, there's a lot of articles out apparently. I was informed that AI is sucking up all the water in the environments that they're, they're.

• 1:48:07Speaker 01

  Like departments.

• 1:48:08Speaker 03

  They just banned data centers in 42 counties, I think. So people definitely don't want them. It just depends whether or not representatives listen to us, which they have a history of not doing.

• 1:48:20Cameron Hanes?

  They don't really care what we want. It doesn't feel like.

• 1:48:24Speaker 01

  I, I just think that like, I mean, it's 2026. And what was, when was the first, you know, uh, spacecraft launched to space?

• 1:48:37Cameron Hanes?

  Allegedly like what?

• 1:48:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's a whole nother time.

• 1:48:42Speaker 01

  Uh, we have had hot debates about this. Yeah. Uh, and then before that, like, you know, World War One, I mean, 126-ish years ago, and we're still like stabbing people with bayonets, you know? So we're all like freaking out about the waters getting absorbed for these AI, you know, headquarters or whatever, data centers. How long is that going to last before AI is, hits its next evolution? And is this, uh, computers is the biggest example here. A computer used to be the size of this room.

• 1:49:16Cameron Hanes?

  Right, exactly.

• 1:49:17Speaker 01

  And how long is it gonna take for it to get to my cell phone? How many years did that take?

• 1:49:23Speaker 03

  Here's the thing too, is a lot of people think these data centers are for AI. I don't think that's the case at all because one data center can contain all of human history and they're searching on the internet. These data centers are to keep our personal data, what they've been collecting ever since the internet started. And to keep that, to keep how you search, like where your eyes go on your phone. Now our iPhones do facial recognition. It's not to get into your phone. It's because they're watching how you interact with these apps.

• 1:49:54Speaker 01

  You know, you can literally move around on your iPhone with your eyeballs. I just learned this a few weeks ago. So you can go into your settings, set it up. You do this little test. So it follows your eyeballs around. You like follow this dot around on the screen. And then, once it's done, it's not that great, but I guarantee you within the next couple of years, just because they just introduced it, that it'll be perfect. That you can scroll with your eyeballs. You can open up tabs with your eyeballs. Like you don't touch the screen at all. So like you just look at it and in the corner, there's this little thing over here. So say you want to like close that screen and open up another one. You just look with your eyeballs over to that. It opens up a tab, shows you multiple little options of what you want to do. You look at that with your eyeballs, it opens it. I was like, I haven't even touched my screen once. This is insane. My eyeballs are doing everything.

• 1:50:41Speaker 01

  But so if that has just come around that quickly, then like, how quick, computers went from the size of a room to my iPhone. How quickly are these, you know, AI data centers going to be sucking up all the water in the environment before? They are also the size of, you know, a computer modem.

• 1:51:02Cameron Hanes?

  Keep saying sucking and James is gonna get all.

• 1:51:06Speaker 02

  I saw him over there.

• 1:51:07Speaker 03

  I'm starting to tingle up right now.

• 1:51:09Speaker 01

  He's got porn I'm pulled up right now.

• 1:51:11Cameron Hanes?

  That, that eye test is why his whole algorithm is hog watch. Isn't it? Spandex hog watch? Like that's his whole, every, every explorer screen is that.

• 1:51:22Speaker 03

  But mine just knows when to zoom.

• 1:51:26Speaker 01

  Your eyes are telling it.

• 1:51:27Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, here's an interesting question is if our society today crumbled in a thousand years, how would anybody prove that we had the internet?

• 1:51:41Speaker 02

  Uh, maybe the data centers?

• 1:51:43Speaker 03

  Well, I mean, if we crumbled, though, in a thousand years, nobody's using them, don't you think that?

• 1:51:47Speaker 01

  Well, isn't this why they say the lizard people like live underwater?

• 1:51:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's, that's who controls our planet, it's the lizard people.

• 1:51:54Speaker 02

  Supposedly Gavin Newsom's a lizard person.

• 1:51:56Speaker 03

  I would, I could believe it.

• 1:51:57Cameron Hanes?

  I, I think he is. Yeah.

• 1:51:59Speaker 01

  The lizard people are apparently from like, there's a, gosh, Brendan went down this crazy loophole with me one day and attack and I was, I was down a rabbit hole. Uh, of like, the lizard people are essentially from the future, but it's not the future. We live on like this loop kind of thing.

• 1:52:19Speaker 02

  It's like a Christopher Nolan movie.

• 1:52:20Speaker 01

  If you made a movie, I wouldn't be able to follow it. That's the problem. But like, the lizard people are from kind of the future. And so they had technology far beyond us, which is why they've been able to stick around. Uh, but live underwater.

• 1:52:38Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:52:39Speaker 01

  Uh, and are able to be undetected. Yeah.

• 1:52:42Speaker 02

  Do we have any tinfoil in here? Where's the tinfoil?

• 1:52:45Speaker 03

  Time to put on the tinfoil hat.

• 1:52:46Speaker 01

  So lizard people.

• 1:52:48Cameron Hanes?

  We're not still recording.

• 1:52:50Speaker 02

  Brianna, Brianna, off the rails right now.

• 1:52:53Speaker 01

  Well, it was, it was a wild thing.

• 1:52:55Cameron Hanes?

  How many lip pillows did you have?

• 1:52:57Speaker 01

  I know. Well, they might contain more than nicotine, apparently.

• 1:53:00Speaker 02

  She's a beast, Martha. Yeah.

• 1:53:02Speaker 01

  But it was a, it's a wild topic.

• 1:53:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:06Speaker 01

  I went down that rabbit hole.

• 1:53:08Speaker 02

  You did.

• 1:53:08Speaker 01

  There's not a lot of evidence.

• 1:53:10Speaker 03

  Did the rabbit hole have water in the bottom of it and lizard people hiding down?

• 1:53:13Speaker 01

  They actually took me in.

• 1:53:16Speaker 01

  Introduced me to them.

• 1:53:18Speaker 03

  I mean, that's exactly what a lizard person would say.

• 1:53:20Cameron Hanes?

  James takes in his buddies, don't you? Take them all in?

• 1:53:25Speaker 03

  Yeah, yep. I, I help all of them into my rabbit hole.

• 1:53:29Speaker 02

  Oh my god.

• 1:53:32Speaker 03

  Into my rabbit, into my rabbit holes.

• 1:53:34Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness. And that's Shit Talkers episode thirty-two. It's been, dude, are you kidding me, bro? We're off the rails right now.

• 1:53:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, he's just mad he can only do DP instead of triple penetration.

• 1:53:47Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness. I love it.

• 1:53:50Speaker 03

  I got ear holes.

• 1:53:51Speaker 02

  Is this the most chaotic episode?

• 1:53:53Cameron Hanes?

  Oh shit, look at you.

• 1:53:54Speaker 01

  There are micros out there that would fit in there, you know?

• 1:53:56Speaker 03

  Hey, and it's all love.

• 1:53:58Speaker 02

  It's all love.

• 1:53:59Speaker 03

  This is not even close to the most off the rails we've been.

• 1:54:01Cameron Hanes?

  Oh my goodness. We've, we've went way too far.

• 1:54:03Speaker 03

  This doesn't even have to be edited.

• 1:54:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:54:06Cameron Hanes?

  This is just fucking posted.

• 1:54:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, just posted.

• 1:54:09Speaker 03

  Just another Tuesday.

• 1:54:10Speaker 02

  Just post it. I love it.

• 1:54:11Cameron Hanes?

  Well, this has been fun, you guys. Shit. Been.

• 1:54:14Speaker 01

  You gotta end on the lizard people.

• 1:54:16Cameron Hanes?

  I know. Shooting bows and having fun and talking shit.

• 1:54:20Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:54:21Cameron Hanes?

  Does, hey, does that, does life get any better?

• 1:54:23Speaker 02

  No, it doesn't. It doesn't.

• 1:54:25Cameron Hanes?

  No, I'm, I'm super thankful you guys swung by. Um, yeah, so since Botek's leaving, this will be the last time, probably.

• 1:54:31Speaker 02

  Nah, I know. Now I gotta come up just to visit you alone, dude, you know?

• 1:54:35Speaker 01

  Why are you up here? Well, I was just driving through town.

• 1:54:38Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Oh, I, well, okay, to be honest, I'm so happy for you guys' success. I'm glad you guys are crushing it. It's, I love seeing that. I love seeing all the fun stuff you're doing. I watch your, you know, your, when you're shooting, when you're, whatever posts you make, I just love, you know, you're hustling. And it's like, it's, that's the key. People sit and wait for things to happen. You're making it happen, both you guys, and it's like, I love to see it. And you're being rewarded and it's just, makes me feel good. So I'm, I'm very thankful for both of you. I'm thankful for the time we spent together today. And I just want to continue the success for you. So keep it up.

• 1:55:16Speaker 02

  Dude, same to you. Yeah, appreciate you guys and, uh, yeah, I'm super grateful that you, you know, when I messaged you, you gave us that shot. Now, you know, I'd consider us having a friendship, you know, and I just love it. So I appreciate it. And of course, I always love watching you win and I'm always rooting to, to see us keep, keep going, baby. Let's just keep running it up.

• 1:55:34Cameron Hanes?

  We will, we will. All right, guys, that wraps it up. That's Shit Talkers thirty-one or two, or whatever the fuck it is. Keep hammering.

• 1:55:41Speaker 02

  Keep hammering.