Pod Insights Cameron Hanes - Keep Hammering Collective KHC 136 - Land of Giants with the Rivets About this episode The Rivets - John & Jenn Rivet have been living the dream together for over 32 years as avid outdoorsmen, big game outfitters, and chefs.
Listen in as Cam, John and Jenn skin Cam’s bear and talk about bear management, bear meat, how you can hunt with the Rivets and more!
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Timestamps:
00:00:00 Intro - Mature Bears
00:04:12 Making a Successful Shot & Montana Knife Company Knives
00:07:13 Time in the Stand & Having Patience
00:11:55 Nothing is Guaranteed: Waiting on Big Boars
00:16:32 Key Equipment for Big Bear
00:18:56 Figuring out the Bears Gender
00:22:12 Managing the Bear Population
00:26:15 Ad Break (SIG Sauer & Montana Knife Company)
00:27:36 Bear Meat
00:29:54 Learning from the Rivets
00:33:54 Bear Behavior & Being Up Close
00:36:20 Montana Knife Packout Knife
00:37:42 Skinning the Loins
00:41:44 First Time Bear Hunters
00:42:45 Measuring Around the Muzzle
00:44:54 Where to Book a Hunt with the Rivets
00:47:23 Measuring a Bear’s Skull for Pope & Young
00:50:55 Skull Size and Cape Length
Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Speaker 00 Keep Hammering Podcast, episode.
0:02 Cameron Hanes? Yes. It's the Keep Hammering Collective. It's not Shit Talkers Weekly.
0:06 Speaker 00 No. So, James, quiet.
0:10 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, so here we are. We're with John and Jen Rivet up in Alberta. Bear heaven, basically, is what this is. And we've had some luck today. Um, what a...man, what a hunt.
0:25 Speaker 02 Some luck, but before that, a lot of long days, sitting 12 hours in the rain, in storms, waiting for the big guy to come in. And it's not like hunting an average bear.
0:34 Cameron Hanes? No. It's, uh, you know, people, I mean, there's so many bear here. So many, I don't know how many bear we saw a day, but I would say...
0:45 Speaker 00 You had a day of 16, I think?
0:48 Cameron Hanes? I would say, on average, at least 10 bear a day. Even on, you know, rain and wind, they don't really like that that much, but still, just great bear days. But, um, waiting for the right big bear is a whole different game. And, um, we want big, old boars, and that, that can be a waiting game, for sure.
1:14 Cameron Hanes? But, we got her done, finally. Again.
1:19 Speaker 02 Again. Took some effort.
1:21 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. But you guys have the best, it's the best bear camp, it's the best bear country. Um, and your guys' experience is second to none. And, man, I'm so lucky to be here. And, uh, yeah. Tell us, what do you guys think about this week so far?
1:42 Speaker 02 Definitely put the work in. Definitely put the time in.
1:45 Speaker 00 Yeah, this is the hardest.
1:46 Speaker 02 This is probably the hardest you've had up here, just going after this one bear.
1:50 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
1:52 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. So, it took, it took a bit. And we were out, um, went out this morning, and did a morning sit, which normally you don't have to do. It's like, normally, it's you're out so late, baiting, hunting, so much work is involved. You get back late, because it was getting dark at, it's almost 11, the last shooting light, 11:00 PM. So, by the time you get back here and eat dinner, it's after 1:00.
2:18 Speaker 02 Yeah.
2:19 Cameron Hanes? So, nobody's getting up early, when you're not getting to bed and asleep till 2:00.
2:27 Cameron Hanes? And, uh, yeah.
2:30 Cameron Hanes? But, sometimes you do what you gotta do.
2:33 Speaker 02 Sometimes you can get lucky, you know, be at the right place at the right time. But these big old bears, they don't get big and old because they're dumb.
2:39 Cameron Hanes? No.
2:39 Speaker 02 Sometimes you'll get lucky. During the rut, they'll be following a sow and you'll, you know, see it a little quicker, get a better shot. But, as we know, from this past week, they can come in with a sow, doesn't mean they give you a shot.
2:51 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
2:53 Speaker 02 Hey?
2:53 Cameron Hanes? They get...
2:55 Speaker 00 As you will see on Bush Drag 3.
2:57 Cameron Hanes? It's, it's just why they are so big, they get big because they're old. And years of experience just has taught them how to stay alive. And if a, if a bear is 10 to 20 years old, we think there's a sow out here that's 30 years old. With that much avoiding humans for three decades, they got it down.
3:22 Cameron Hanes? And, uh, it takes, you gotta get lucky. You gotta be there and you gotta get lucky.
3:26 Speaker 02 Yeah.
3:27 Cameron Hanes? And then you gotta get a break, you know?
3:29 Speaker 02 Well, you do, I always say you do all the controllables the best you can.
3:32 Cameron Hanes? Yep.
3:33 Speaker 02 You know, how you dress, the equipment you use, how you bait the bears, how you set up your baits, all of that stuff. But the things that you can't control, weather and the animal, that just takes some luck.
3:44 Speaker 00 Shooting your bow every day helps.
3:45 Speaker 02 Yeah.
3:45 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
3:46 Speaker 00 Especially in the position that you're gonna be shooting from.
3:48 Speaker 02 Yeah.
3:49 Cameron Hanes? I think people, I think people know, they think it was a chip shot because it's, you know, generally under 20 yards.
3:55 Speaker 00 Yeah.
3:56 Cameron Hanes? But, these things are so tough, if you don't make a perfect shot, it can be not fun.
4:02 Speaker 02 Yeah.
4:02 Cameron Hanes? And not, a not successful ending to your hunt.
4:05 Speaker 00 This thing died so close to where you shot.
4:08 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
4:09 Speaker 00 We'll be able to count the seconds on the video, but yeah. How quick you think it was? I've seen some of your bears go in five to 13 seconds, they're gone.
4:17 Cameron Hanes? I think he's, he's down in about...
4:21 Cameron Hanes? Maybe fifteen seconds.
4:23 Speaker 00 Yeah.
4:24 Cameron Hanes? So.
4:26 Speaker 00 Um. Do you think I'm running?
4:27 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. It's a. I had to stop them and normally I don't like to do that. I want the bear just to just naturally not be alert at all and just do what they do and then, you know, my perfect kill is where the animal never knows I'm there and then the arrow comes in, they're not alarmed. Um, but these old boars, they're, they'll come in, just like, they'll come in and could be at the bait and never show their side. They hate showing.
5:02 Speaker 02 They don't.
5:02 Cameron Hanes? So, you know, it's all about angles with bear because you.
5:05 Speaker 00 Look when they're fighting other bears, they keep a tree between them sometimes.
5:07 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. They know how to protect their, this is their soft spot here.
5:11 Speaker 00 Yeah.
5:12 Cameron Hanes? Their stomach, their side, and they know whether you're hunting them or they're going against another bear. They're not showing wh- where they're vulnerable.
5:22 Speaker 00 Uh huh.
5:23 Cameron Hanes? And as a bow hunter, you need that, that broadside shot. You don't want to force a quartering too. Um, so yeah, waiting for that. And so finally he turned and I stopped him, made a little noise and hit him perfect and right here's the entry hole. I went in and hit that other offside shoulder and.
5:46 Speaker 00 Just the damn hole.
5:47 Cameron Hanes? This thing.
5:48 Speaker 00 This Montana knife is freaking razor sharp right now.
5:51 Cameron Hanes? So nice.
5:52 Speaker 00 Woo.
5:54 Speaker 00 Wow.
5:54 Speaker 02 Shout out to Josh for making some pretty awesome knives.
5:57 Cameron Hanes? Josh Smith, the Montana Knife Company. What a suc- success story that's been.
6:03 Speaker 00 Yeah, yeah. We're cheering him on all the way.
6:05 Cameron Hanes? Oh, man.
6:08 Cameron Hanes? Anything we can do to help support that.
6:10 Speaker 00 Yeah.
6:10 Cameron Hanes? American made.
6:11 Speaker 00 American made.
6:11 Cameron Hanes? Company. He was a blue collar lineman.
6:14 Speaker 00 Yeah.
6:15 Cameron Hanes? Working every day and had a dream to be a knife maker.
6:20 Speaker 00 Ooh.
6:20 Cameron Hanes? Don't. Right.
6:27 Cameron Hanes? It's close.
6:28 Speaker 02 Yeah, it is.
6:34 Cameron Hanes? But this is, it doesn't get much better than this right here. Beautiful day.
6:39 Speaker 00 It's always fun to, to do this, to get to this point where we're skidding together. Normally we got some Luke Bryan playing on the music machine.
6:45 Speaker 02 Oh, I brought one down, I just didn't.
6:47 Speaker 00 It's okay.
6:48 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, we'll probably get sued if we played it on the podcast.
6:53 Cameron Hanes? Luke would be fine with it, he knows about his record label.
6:59 Cameron Hanes? But we, uh, we had some good sits, we all sat together a few times. And I'll, I'll say, we sat so good, so freaking quiet.
7:09 Speaker 00 Yeah.
7:09 Cameron Hanes? I think people, I think they take it for granted how hard it is to sit and be quiet. But we, we, man, we did it just right a few times.
7:20 Speaker 02 Yeah, and then fighting the weather, we went from what, eighty something degrees early, well, just before lunchtime, by the evening sitting in a freaking rainstorm, downpour, wind just blowing.
7:32 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, had some long days.
7:34 Speaker 02 And then twelve hours later.
7:37 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
7:38 Speaker 02 But, gotta put in the time.
7:40 Cameron Hanes? We had some long days, but yeah, that's the name of the game. But it's, uh, you can't really, like, normally on hunts, my advantage is I can cover country for a long time and hunt, like quote hunt hard.
7:53 Speaker 00 Yeah.
7:53 Cameron Hanes? Here, hunting hard means more time.
7:55 Speaker 00 Yeah.
7:56 Cameron Hanes? More time in the stand, and it's just hours. And so that's, that's all you can really do, is just be out there more.
8:02 Speaker 00 Yeah.
8:03 Cameron Hanes? So I was like, well, that's what I can control is how long I'm in the stand, so we sat, I mean, in a three day stretch, sat forty hours.
8:11 Speaker 00 That's unheard of, we've never had to do that, ever, ever, ever.
8:14 Cameron Hanes? No, I was just so focused on just a giant boar, you know? And, uh... I mean, you could definitely kill a bear almost every time you sit, kill a, a boar, not, not just kill a a bear like a sow that could potentially have cubs in a tree somewhere where you don't know. So we're very particular about just seeking out boars. But then when you're just like, you want a old boar, that's a whole different challenge. Just takes time. Looking over bears, making sure, you know, the tacticam, the, the trail cameras that, that are cellular have been huge for, for you guys.
8:53 Speaker 00 It's been one of the keys to our success right now.
8:54 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, definitely. We can just react.
8:56 Speaker 00 Instead of, you know, basically we try to redo, rebate all the baits once a week. Do that big circuit of fifty, sixty baits and get them all done.
9:04 Cameron Hanes? Yep.
9:04 Speaker 00 And you check the chip. And it's been a week, right? You check the chip and see who was there during that whole week. Well, if there was a sow with a boar and they spent two to three days together, it's too late. You missed it.
9:14 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
9:14 Speaker 00 Now, we can see it right away. It's like, oh, he's there. With a sow, he's gonna be around there for two, three days.
9:20 Cameron Hanes? And, and that's, that's generally what it takes for him to get her bred. And once he's, once she's bred, he's gone. And who knows where he's going?
9:28 Speaker 00 Yeah.
9:28 Cameron Hanes? So yeah, just being able to react to that.
9:31 Speaker 00 Yeah, a bear typically lives in ten square mile area, so like three by three miles. And in the rest, those boars will travel twenty miles.
9:39 Cameron Hanes? Well, and this bear showed up with a sow, was it yesterday?
9:44 Speaker 00 Yeah.
9:45 Cameron Hanes? For the first time with that new, with that new sow?
9:48 Speaker 00 Yeah.
9:48 Cameron Hanes? So we thought, okay, we got two, basically two days.
9:52 Speaker 00 Mm-hmm.
9:52 Cameron Hanes? And that's, that's why I went out this morning, just trying to, just because the tacticam camera told us that they're together. And to take advantage of it.
10:01 Speaker 00 Yeah.
10:02 Cameron Hanes? Sometimes it works, and it worked perfectly this time.
10:08 Speaker 02 Oh, sorry.
10:08 Speaker 00 You wanna go to that side?
10:09 Speaker 02 No, no, you do.
10:10 Speaker 00 Trying to kill that way.
10:11 Speaker 02 Why, I was going to.
10:12 Speaker 00 A little, should I pull the cow's sock?
10:13 Speaker 02 Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
10:15 Cameron Hanes? Please. Thanks, Gideon.
10:21 Speaker 02 Thank you, James. May I have another one? I don't know, moved out, was awesome. Anyway.
10:28 Speaker 00 Pot James? Hmm.
10:32 Speaker 00 How do I be talking?
10:36 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I gotta, I do have to hand it to James. I mean, he's probably quitting after this hunt, but has been a mature.
10:46 Speaker 00 Little sleep?
10:48 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Long days.
10:50 Speaker 02 Long day.
10:51 Cameron Hanes? But we had, we got so much incredible footage, we had to-
10:55 Speaker 00 The best we've ever had.
10:56 Cameron Hanes? It's, it's amazing. I mean.
10:59 Speaker 00 How can I keep not going like crazy better every year?
11:02 Cameron Hanes? It's insane. So we just had to finish this story. With making it happen on a giant boar. Had to.
11:15 Cameron Hanes? Not always easy.
11:17 Cameron Hanes? And especially, you know, we could have, this could have been over much sooner with a rifle. Which is legal, but we're boat hunters and-
11:29 Speaker 02 You just know when you're doing archery though, what challenge you're up against.
11:32 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, it's just the name of the game.
11:33 Speaker 00 It's the perfect animal to go bo- bo hunting for.
11:35 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
11:36 Speaker 00 Even newbies.
11:37 Cameron Hanes? Yep.
11:38 Speaker 02 Can't.
11:38 Cameron Hanes? It's, I mean, that's, Joe, this is his first bohun. And I just knew was one that's fairly controllable.
11:46 Speaker 02 Yeah.
11:46 Cameron Hanes? And people think that, oh, they, you know, come up here and they're gonna maybe save a big bear for me or for Joe or whatever. Joe's never killed a giant bear. It's like a six and a half foot boar is a great animal and that's what he's killed. And that's just, you can't, there's no saving anything in country like this.
12:04 Speaker 02 No.
12:05 Cameron Hanes? It's so big and so wild and they just do whatever. It's like you just do the best you can.
12:10 Speaker 00 Basically, if you want to kill a big boar, go hunt with us a bunch of sows.
12:13 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
12:13 Speaker 00 They're gonna bring them in.
12:17 Cameron Hanes? Yep. If you spend enough time there. And I think people get, they wanna move around a lot, you know, cause they think, they always think that the other stands better, or somebody's in a better spot, or.
12:29 Speaker 00 Yeah.
12:30 Speaker 02 Yeah.
12:30 Cameron Hanes? They're, it's just.
12:31 Speaker 02 Which stand are you putting so and so in? Which stand are you putting this one in? Does it matter?
12:35 Cameron Hanes? It's just, it doesn't matter at all, but, but you know how hunters are, and it's just.
12:39 Speaker 02 They think you're saving a special, you know, all these special spots, and it's like, well, if there's a big boar on there, we're gonna put you on there.
12:46 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, and the thing, the fact is, even if you never saw a big boar there, anything could show up this time of year.
12:52 Speaker 00 That's right.
12:53 Speaker 02 True.
12:53 Cameron Hanes? I mean.
12:53 Speaker 00 After the boars, after the big boars were killed this week, they'll not be on trail camera.
12:57 Speaker 02 No.
12:58 Speaker 00 They'll just walk in.
12:59 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Cause they're cruising looking for sows.
13:02 Speaker 00 Yeah.
13:06 Cameron Hanes? But yeah, it's a, man, what an amazing hunt. It never gets, it's like hard in a different way, just so much time in the stand. But it's so fun. And challenging.
13:20 Speaker 02 Challenging.
13:27 Speaker 02 Especially when they come in, you don't, you can't get that perfect shot.
13:30 Speaker 00 Mm-hmm.
13:30 Speaker 02 And they move, and like you're saying, hiding themselves, guarding themselves. How do they know?
13:37 Cameron Hanes? Sixth sense, I mean.
13:39 Speaker 00 Yeah.
13:39 Cameron Hanes? It's, they feel something. These old boars, they just have a way, a survival instinct, and they know when s- they just know.
13:49 Speaker 02 There's something off.
13:49 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, something is off.
13:51 Speaker 02 Yeah.
13:51 Speaker 00 Yeah.
13:52 Speaker 02 And I mean, they didn't get big and old, just, you know, walking around and kinda being dumb, if you can say it that way.
13:59 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. And it's, um, I had so many times where I, it was so close to taking a shot, and I'm just like so nervous about wounding.
14:12 Speaker 00 Mm-hmm.
14:12 Cameron Hanes? Making a poor shot and having an animal suffer, especially, you know, an animal that survived.
14:18 Speaker 00 Yeah.
14:18 Cameron Hanes? For maybe twenty years in the wild, that. You second guess yourself and you're like, God, could I have? But it's just, you have to be disciplined on these things.
14:27 Speaker 02 Well, you're at full draw, waiting for him and it's like, okay.
14:30 Cameron Hanes? A number of times.
14:30 Speaker 02 We're looking, we're like, oh, it's gonna be good. And then he's like, he turns. Or he puts his whole front leg.
14:34 Cameron Hanes? Or his leg back.
14:35 Speaker 02 Yeah.
14:36 Cameron Hanes? Or he's slightly quartering. And I think people make mistakes on body position of these animals. It's like, a slightly quartering shot is not gonna be good on a big board.
14:46 Speaker 02 No.
14:47 Cameron Hanes? Cause you're gonna catch one lung and they're gonna, this country is so thick. You know, three hundred yards, might as well be ten miles. It's, it's tough to track them down.
15:00 Cameron Hanes? But when you hit them good like this. Sure can.
15:03 Speaker 02 They don't.
15:04 Cameron Hanes? Get the holes. Seconds.
15:06 Speaker 00 Yep.
15:07 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
15:12 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that bracket is in there still.
15:13 Speaker 00 Is it?
15:14 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Arrow broke.
15:15 Speaker 00 Oh, yeah. You had a shoulder or?
15:18 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Hit that other shoulder.
15:21 Speaker 02 So be the worms on the same. You wonder how they're so tough.
15:23 Cameron Hanes? Oh, so strong.
15:26 Speaker 02 And just look how quick he moved.
15:27 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
15:28 Speaker 02 From broad, just about broadside and just.
15:31 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
15:32 Speaker 02 So smart.
15:33 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
15:36 Speaker 02 He liked to keep his eyes on you. When he was walking in, always eyeballs on you.
15:40 Cameron Hanes? Always. They're so.
15:42 Speaker 02 They're keen to it.
15:43 Cameron Hanes? Big board. They're almost like a different species.
15:46 Speaker 02 Yeah.
15:47 Speaker 00 Yeah.
15:49 Speaker 02 And yeah, you can get lucky.
15:50 Cameron Hanes? Cause people see the video and they say, oh, that, that looks like an easy hunt. I'm like, well, no, that young bear, it's just like a young deer. It's just, you know, like a spiked buck is not very smart. Young bear are no different. They just haven't been around long enough.
16:03 Speaker 00 Yeah.
16:08 Cameron Hanes? Like a two hundred inch whitetail or two hundred inch mule deer, it's gonna be a tough kill, just like a board like this.
16:18 Cameron Hanes? What do you guys think is the key for equipment on what works best on these big old bear like this?
16:25 Speaker 00 Definitely never use a two-blade broadhead.
16:28 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I mean, look at this fat.
16:30 Speaker 00 You need a blood trail.
16:31 Speaker 02 Yeah.
16:31 Cameron Hanes? This, this fat, there's so much fat here, just a slit here, the fat kinda moves.
16:37 Speaker 00 Yeah.
16:37 Cameron Hanes? There's no exit hole, like even with my bow, it didn't come out, so all you have is a slit that's covered with fat.
16:43 Speaker 00 Yeah.
16:44 Cameron Hanes? No blood.
16:45 Speaker 00 Yeah.
16:45 Cameron Hanes? And in this, like I said, I mentioned this thick country, it can be tough.
16:53 Speaker 02 Yeah, equipment that you're familiar with.
16:56 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
16:57 Speaker 02 Right?
16:58 Cameron Hanes? You guys like big, like mostly an expandable head if you have the poundage to get through.
17:05 Speaker 00 Yeah.
17:06 Speaker 02 And if you're confident with it.
17:07 Speaker 00 Good solid.
17:08 Speaker 02 Not just coming here on your first hunt and put out, the first time you're gonna use one, cuz I wouldn't advise that.
17:13 Speaker 00 Nice.
17:14 Speaker 02 I mean, you need to know how, how it works for ya.
17:16 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
17:17 Speaker 02 I always use, I just used a fix blade, that's all I've used for everything I've, I've killed so far.
17:22 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, you like three-blade fix, right?
17:24 Speaker 02 Yeah, and that's everything, moose, deer, white tail, big bear.
17:27 Cameron Hanes? And you've killed giant bear, big bucks, two moose, and how many pounds do you shoot?
17:34 Speaker 02 Uh, I used to shoot about fifty-seven, fifty-eight, and then after.
17:39 Cameron Hanes? Almost sixty pounds is a lot.
17:40 Speaker 02 And after so, shoulder surgery.
17:42 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
17:42 Speaker 02 Well, actually, when I first started, it was forty-three pounds. I shot my first bear, my first moose at forty-three pounds. And it died right away.
17:50 Cameron Hanes? Wow. So, the key there, shot placement.
17:53 Speaker 02 Exactly.
17:54 Speaker 00 They're pretty, they're easy to poke through.
17:55 Cameron Hanes? You're, you're pretty particular on good, high-quality, broadside or cornered way shots, right?
18:01 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah.
18:02 Cameron Hanes? Late forward.
18:03 Speaker 00 Yeah.
18:03 Speaker 02 Yeah, and then they just gotta, when you're shooting an arrow of any kind, you just gotta make sure where it's entering and visualize where it's gonna come in.
18:11 Cameron Hanes? That exit, yeah.
18:12 Speaker 02 That exit.
18:14 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, it's, and these, you know, with bear, they can be tough to, you have to be really.
18:18 Speaker 00 Yeah.
18:21 Cameron Hanes? Really focused on uh
18:25 Cameron Hanes? Just that's even that slight change in body position. It's it's hard it's it's hard to see black. They don't have a shoulder line, they don't have a crease like an elk would. So you have to be really focused on, that's why even binoculars are key.
18:41 Speaker 00 Yeah, for sure.
18:43 Speaker 02 Yeah, well, to sex it and figure out what gender it is.
18:45 Cameron Hanes? For sure, yeah.
18:46 Speaker 02 Without the binoculars, unless they're standing in broad daylight right in front of you, it's it's can be very tough.
18:51 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
18:52 Speaker 02 And in lower light conditions, when you're getting closer, you know, late in the evening, that last half hour, it can be tough.
18:58 Speaker 00 Yeah.
18:59 Speaker 02 So we just teach everybody, look with your binoculars. Look for the proper parts and you just stare at it and eventually you're gonna see it.
19:06 Cameron Hanes? And you see all, I you read all sorts of theories on the internet like.
19:10 Speaker 02 Yeah.
19:10 Cameron Hanes? Oh, small wrists on a sow.
19:13 Speaker 02 Yeah.
19:13 Cameron Hanes? Or a skinny nose or.
19:16 Speaker 02 Or smaller body.
19:17 Cameron Hanes? Smaller, it's like.
19:19 Speaker 00 Nothing works.
19:19 Speaker 02 Nothing, those generalizations.
19:22 Cameron Hanes? We've seen that sow we saw the other night.
19:24 Speaker 00 Yeah.
19:24 Speaker 02 Oh, my gosh.
19:25 Speaker 00 She's got everything of a big war.
19:26 Cameron Hanes? It's it.
19:27 Speaker 02 She's seven foot, she's a monster.
19:29 Cameron Hanes? Giant.
19:31 Speaker 02 But it's a sow.
19:32 Cameron Hanes? Big neck, big shoulders.
19:34 Speaker 02 Big muzzle, she had a pretty big muzzle.
19:35 Speaker 00 Big muzzle, big front pats.
19:39 Speaker 00 It's like people's genetics.
19:40 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
19:41 Speaker 02 Yeah. That was beautiful bear though.
19:44 Cameron Hanes? Oh, my gosh, most beautiful sow I've ever seen.
19:46 Speaker 02 Yeah, and you think if cubs didn't walk in right with her, if you were not.
19:50 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, just like.
19:51 Speaker 02 Following the protocol on seeing what sex it is.
19:53 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
19:54 Speaker 02 They would have killed it.
19:55 Cameron Hanes? Well, that other.
19:55 Speaker 02 Somebody could have killed it.
19:56 Cameron Hanes? That other sow has those little cubs she left in a tree.
19:59 Speaker 02 Yeah.
19:59 Cameron Hanes? And she came in by herself.
20:00 Speaker 02 Yeah.
20:00 Speaker 00 Yeah.
20:01 Speaker 02 Big blonde.
20:02 Cameron Hanes? And in most camps, a lot of bear camps, I don't want to say most, because I don't want to speak for other people, but a lot of bear camps. That bear because of her color would have been killed.
20:09 Speaker 02 Yeah.
20:10 Cameron Hanes? And then that would have killed all her cubs.
20:12 Speaker 02 Yeah.
20:12 Cameron Hanes? Because they can't survive.
20:13 Speaker 02 Yeah.
20:14 Cameron Hanes? So you just kill three or four bear.
20:15 Speaker 02 Yeah.
20:16 Speaker 00 Yeah.
20:17 Cameron Hanes? And I mean. How heartbreaking is that?
20:20 Speaker 00 Yeah.
20:21 Cameron Hanes? I I hate to even think about that.
20:22 Speaker 00 Yeah.
20:29 Cameron Hanes? I don't think there could be worse feeling than walking up to a sow and and notice it has it's lactating.
20:36 Speaker 00 Yeah, right.
20:37 Cameron Hanes? And you're just like.
20:38 Speaker 02 Oh, deadly. You just feel horrible.
20:40 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
20:41 Speaker 00 That's why we like to make them stand up.
20:42 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
20:43 Speaker 00 If you're gonna see the the boobs.
20:46 Cameron Hanes? And people get in the heat of the moment and they're not, you know, they, everybody has these dreams about killing a bear and you know, it's a long way to come. They've saved money and you wanna shoot because to yeah, to kill, you have to shoot.
21:02 Speaker 00 Mm hmm.
21:02 Cameron Hanes? And then if you make a mistake.
21:06 Speaker 02 There's no turning back.
21:07 Speaker 00 Terrible.
21:07 Speaker 02 Yeah. But if you put in the time there again, just watching.
21:11 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
21:12 Speaker 02 Constantly looking, eventually you're gonna see what it is. I went in doubt, just wait.
21:16 Cameron Hanes? Let it go.
21:17 Speaker 02 Let it go.
21:18 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
21:20 Speaker 02 And it's easier to say than done.
21:25 Speaker 02 When you're watching that big old man.
21:27 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
21:28 Speaker 02 Or that bear come in, it's like beautiful, nice coat, all the other stuff.
21:32 Cameron Hanes? I think that that's what's made this place so special is you guys have been so consistent on only targeting boars.
21:40 Speaker 00 Yeah.
21:41 Cameron Hanes? And the sows are the breeding stock.
21:43 Speaker 00 Yeah, so you've been here, you know how serious we are about it.
21:45 Cameron Hanes? Oh, it's it's just.
21:46 Speaker 00 They're gonna deal with the wrath of gen.
21:48 Cameron Hanes? Every day, it's like, it's just hammered in your head.
21:51 Speaker 02 Yeah.
21:51 Cameron Hanes? Make sure you sex it, make sure it's a bore, make sure you get a good look at it and.
21:58 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I mean, I just think that I think the quality is is reflected on.
22:03 Speaker 00 Okay, so on the last, on one of the posts you did, somebody said, well, if bear hunting is management, if you're hunting for management, then why don't you target the sows? Okay, here's here's one reason why. First of all, the sows are gonna make babies and we don't wanna retaliate them, we just wanna manage them. By managing these big boys?
22:18 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
22:18 Speaker 00 These are the guys that are killing moose calves, that are killing elk calves, deer fawns.
22:21 Speaker 02 Yeah.
22:21 Cameron Hanes? Like I said, they they need more calories.
22:24 Speaker 00 And by taking these out, we see the population go up of ungulates.
22:26 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, they so they're and they're because they're old, they're so good at killing.
22:31 Speaker 00 Yeah.
22:31 Cameron Hanes? They've been killing for decades.
22:33 Speaker 00 Yeah.
22:34 Cameron Hanes? So a a cat, a moose calf or an elk calf or. Deer fawn, they're like easy money.
22:40 Speaker 02 They have no chance.
22:41 Cameron Hanes? No, no chance. And these things are just, they can ravage a herd.
22:45 Speaker 02 And these things are also the ones that will kill the cubs. To get that sow to breed again.
22:49 Cameron Hanes? Right.
22:50 Speaker 02 So, if there's multi-levels why we do what we do. But when we bring in, anybody we bring in, you've been here enough times, you hear my spiel.
22:57 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
22:58 Speaker 02 Trying to teach them how to sex them, judge them.
23:00 Cameron Hanes? It's a great, yesterday you had all the new hunters in camp and you had, you know, your, your mountain bear in there. You're going through angles and how to sex them. It's like so valuable.
23:09 Speaker 00 Yeah.
23:10 Cameron Hanes? We should actually film that.
23:11 Speaker 02 Film it, yeah.
23:11 Speaker 00 Yeah.
23:12 Cameron Hanes? Should film that and post that.
23:13 Speaker 02 Cause I just want people to come up and succeed. And if you don't have the right knowledge, how can you succeed? And I kinda go overboard a little bit, but for, look, this, this year we have how many first time bear hunters?
23:23 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. And that's great because that's what keeps hunting tradition alive. We love that, but it's also, there's a lot to, to learn.
23:37 Speaker 02 And the best way they can succeed is knowledge.
23:40 Speaker 00 Yeah, that's right. Push it.
23:46 Speaker 02 It's hard for me to hold the, cause it's so big. Hold it and try to operate on it.
23:51 Speaker 00 A whole different thing.
23:52 Speaker 02 It's a different ball game.
23:56 Cameron Hanes? But yeah, that, that tutorial or that, your spiel, and it's good. And also that I like that you do it because I think a lot of, you know, hunting is a male dominated culture, but like you have so much experience and you speak with such authority. I think it's, I think, I love that you're giving that.
24:15 Speaker 00 Yeah.
24:16 Cameron Hanes? You've been doing this so long.
24:17 Speaker 02 It takes a lo- it's taken a long time to actually have some respect.
24:22 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
24:22 Speaker 02 In the industry, just because.
24:24 Cameron Hanes? It's, it's tough.
24:25 Speaker 02 But it's what you do. But I've been doing it for, well, he's been doing it for what, thirty-six, thirty-seven years?
24:30 Cameron Hanes? Mm-hmm.
24:30 Speaker 02 And I mean, I've been guiding for over twenty-five.
24:33 Cameron Hanes? And John is always quick to give you, uh, credit and like say you're, you're a better guide than him.
24:40 Speaker 00 Yeah.
24:40 Cameron Hanes? And it's just like, and still, I think until you, you spend time around you and hear all that, I think it's like, because there's a people, there's a lot of people out there who aren't real men, men and women.
24:52 Speaker 02 Yeah.
24:52 Cameron Hanes? But spending time with you, it's clear, you're the real deal. And so I, I just love, I love being part of this.
25:00 Speaker 02 Thank you.
25:00 Speaker 00 Nice.
25:02 Speaker 02 I listen, like, I mean, I've listened a lot to him, to other people that I respect and, you know.
25:06 Cameron Hanes? That's how you learn.
25:07 Speaker 02 Whether it's just, uh, like my grandpa, he was an Old Trapper. You learn stuff about skinning and flushing.
25:12 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
25:13 Speaker 02 Um, him, he's been in it a long time. He's worked with some great people and then also he's guided some really experienced hunters that hunted. Probably every creature that walks on the planet.
25:21 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, yeah.
25:22 Speaker 02 So it's just, you listen, you listen, you listen. Some you throw in the trash.
25:25 Speaker 00 If you think you know everything, you'll never learn anything.
25:27 Cameron Hanes? No.
25:28 Speaker 00 When I'm with somebody that's got knowledge, I just shut up and listen.
25:30 Speaker 02 Yeah.
25:31 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. I mean. Yeah, it's like, we can, we can all learn. I mean, if you. When you're done learning, it's like, or you think you're done learning, I don't know, you're going backwards.
25:43 Speaker 02 Yeah.
25:43 Speaker 00 Yeah.
25:46 Cameron Hanes? I learn on every hunt. I've been doing this for a long time and every hunt I learn something.
25:50 Speaker 00 Yeah.
25:52 Speaker 02 I'm waiting for you to do this, cause I can't hold it and do it at the same time. It's blocking on me.
25:59 Speaker 00 Then I'll set you up.
26:00 Speaker 02 Okay. Then look at all the meat that's coming off of this bear. Yeah.
26:05 Speaker 00 There's the other reason for hunting these. We freaking love eating them.
26:08 Speaker 02 Yeah.
26:10 Cameron Hanes? I take all this meat home.
26:11 Speaker 00 Cooking your meat for those, for everybody at Lick Run Shoot last year.
26:14 Cameron Hanes? That was so amazing.
26:15 Speaker 00 Giving them all a taste of it.
26:16 Cameron Hanes? The bear hams.
26:17 Speaker 00 See that bear meat is delicious. It's like the best beef brisket you've ever had.
26:21 Speaker 02 Yeah, so when people do ask about it, that's what we say. It's like a brisket, cause it's got a very dense, coarse a grain of meat. But I overdo it. I just like to cook it, marinate it for a while, then smoke it on the trigger for quite a while.
26:34 Speaker 02 Because you just want, I think I always say this, you just don't want fans, you want raving fans.
26:38 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I like, I like that saying.
26:40 Speaker 02 It's like the first time they try elk, you want them to be like, wow, this is amazing.
26:44 Cameron Hanes? I love sharing my elk, but like, when you, when you did put those hams on the trigger last year at that event. And you made, I think sliders, is that, that's what it was?
26:53 Speaker 02 Yeah, pulled, pulled their slider.
26:54 Cameron Hanes? Just delicious.
26:56 Speaker 02 Everybody wiped those out before the ribeye and the tomahawks, which kinda shocked me, cause usually that's what everybody goes for.
27:01 Cameron Hanes? They're so good.
27:06 Speaker 02 You know the sausage you had then was.
27:09 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
27:09 Speaker 02 Pretty good.
27:11 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I took some down to. Run a Joe's podcast, I took bear pepperoni down there.
27:17 Speaker 02 Nice.
27:17 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. I love sharing bear meat, but yeah, if people. I don't know, I I cherish. All aspects of the hunt, but also taking this meat home and like, I just don't kill these animals just to kill. It's. It's a big part of who I am. And. Part of honoring the animal and the hunt is. Cherishing the meat.
27:41 Speaker 02 Yeah.
27:42 Cameron Hanes? And so. Yes, it's expensive to get home, but. It's just part of what I do.
27:48 Speaker 02 And you can do anything with a bear meat, you just have to cook it to temp.
27:51 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
27:51 Speaker 02 But I mean.
27:52 Cameron Hanes? No different than pork?
27:53 Speaker 02 No, yeah, exactly pork, chicken. You just gotta cook it to temperature, you can do it a hundred different ways. And then all of this fat you can take off and you can render it down and then you use it and. For pie dough, for cooking your eggs, steak and whatever, like you can use. Stuff, yeah, you can use a lot of it.
28:12 Speaker 02 So excuse me.
28:16 Speaker 02 That's what we've always done, render all the fat.
28:20 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I just. I think for anybody interested in bear hunting, either if we can, if we can. Record that, uh, that podcast, I mean, your tutorial we did. Or they listen to this, this, uh, this podcast or watch the films. It's, um. Man, that's how you learn and. For it. I think for a bear hunter, I just don't know. Of a better place than to come than with you guys.
28:48 Speaker 02 We.
28:49 Cameron Hanes? For the full experience.
28:50 Speaker 02 We work hard, we try, I mean.
28:52 Cameron Hanes? Work your ass off, this, this shit is so much work. It's so much, it's hard on equipment. Yeah. You gotta have. High quality equipment. You know, like this buggy here, you gotta. You know, all this baiting, all the work that goes into it, the beavers, the oil, the grease.
29:08 Speaker 02 Everything, and it's not just like while season's on, it's for.
29:12 Cameron Hanes? No.
29:12 Speaker 02 A month before.
29:13 Cameron Hanes? For months. Yeah.
29:20 Speaker 00 And now for this shit talker session. Cam, you fucking cut the tail off. I'm just getting the tail off without having something to pull on it.
29:29 Cameron Hanes? Oh, sorry about that.
29:33 Speaker 00 Accidents can do it.
29:34 Speaker 02 Yeah.
29:34 Speaker 00 I could do it.
29:35 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
29:36 Speaker 02 And then the whole thing too is the kill at the end and taking the animal home is great. But we've always wanted to do the whole experience where it's like before. I mean, I can't speak for the outfitters either because I haven't been to many. But when they come here, it's like we're family, we're a family run business. We like to treat people like family, host them like family and it's it's a it's kind of a mission to get people in here. Talk to them, you know, make a relationship, get to know who they are and then take them on the adventure that they really want. What they came here for.
30:08 Cameron Hanes? All I know is your daughter made me three peanut butter bacon sandwiches today.
30:12 Speaker 02 I know, she's she's stellar.
30:14 Cameron Hanes? She definitely spoils, I don't know about everybody but me.
30:19 Cameron Hanes? So I like that.
30:20 Speaker 02 Yeah, no, she's great.
30:21 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, she is.
30:22 Speaker 02 She works her butt off.
30:23 Cameron Hanes? She's such a hard worker. Julia, man, you're amazing.
30:29 Speaker 00 Cut some fat out.
30:30 Speaker 02 Yeah, he does, look.
30:35 Speaker 02 This is a hefty boy.
30:36 Speaker 00 Yeah.
30:38 Speaker 02 Can you pull more or are you good?
30:41 Speaker 00 Just taking off some fat.
30:44 Speaker 00 Oh yeah, looks good. That's gonna be some good meat.
30:47 Cameron Hanes? Oh, beautiful.
30:50 Cameron Hanes? Beautiful.
30:51 Speaker 02 How soon do you wanna um put the tarp down and pull the hide down? Does the whole back off?
30:58 Speaker 00 Uh, let me call us. You're at the neck there, so we're doing a couple of flip flops.
31:02 Speaker 02 Okay.
31:05 Speaker 02 Look at these forearms.
31:07 Cameron Hanes? I know, yeah.
31:08 Speaker 02 All these power lifters would love to have this. They're so freaking tough.
31:14 Speaker 00 I'm gonna give these a ass shot.
31:18 Cameron Hanes? Got my cake here.
31:25 Speaker 00 This uh, is it uh, we'll flip, we'll go that way and then we'll come back this way.
31:30 Cameron Hanes? This way here?
31:30 Speaker 00 Yeah.
31:39 Speaker 00 Wait.
31:40 Speaker 02 Do you want it on your side?
31:42 Cameron Hanes? It's good back.
31:43 Speaker 02 Okay. Oh, okay, I got you.
31:47 Speaker 02 We'll get a feed on that, okay?
31:51 Cameron Hanes? He gets, see, I think he'll slide to you.
32:00 Cameron Hanes? So put it close to just a mat now.
32:02 Speaker 00 Yeah, just close and we'll get the trust and we'll call this. Alright, I'll set the AM here.
32:10 Speaker 00 Uh, yeah.
32:19 Cameron Hanes? He's got a, I wonder what else, a square, he's seven something, huh?
32:28 Speaker 00 We're gonna just kill his head out and give it a slip measurement, too, guy.
32:35 Speaker 00 What's your guess? Hmm, at first when you killed him, I thought it's gonna be a nineteen inch bear.
32:41 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
32:42 Speaker 00 But, you never know till the meat's off, some meatheads. He looks like, so he could be a twenty inch bear.
32:50 Cameron Hanes? What's the length he's got with?
32:53 Speaker 02 I kept my calling to myself, I know some meatheads.
32:56 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
32:59 Speaker 00 Yeah.
33:04 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, we uh, now we've had some great experiences. We've had bear in close, we've had...
33:10 Speaker 02 Bear in your lap, almost?
33:12 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, yeah, I mean, but I love being close to bear. I love sitting on the ground, I know it's not for everybody, but there's just something... It's just we're so lucky to be able to experience, you know, watching bear behavior up close and seeing them respond to each other, uh, they're curious about us, sometimes they're aggressive.
33:35 Speaker 00 Yeah.
33:36 Cameron Hanes? And I think people, I think people get a little... Um complacent around Black Bear because they think, oh, Black Bear are dangerous. They're not grizzly either. People will say stuff like they're more afraid of you than them.
33:49 Speaker 00 Black Bears kill people every year.
33:50 Cameron Hanes? And it's like, yeah, they they can be more afraid of you than than you are of them, but not always.
33:59 Speaker 00 I've heard that my whole life growing up and I actually repeated it myself and now it's like, that's not even true.
34:04 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, it it's.
34:05 Speaker 02 They all have personalities.
34:06 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
34:07 Speaker 02 Whether you think.
34:08 Speaker 00 You think you ran, you think you ran off, he's coming right back.
34:10 Cameron Hanes? And they have bad days.
34:11 Speaker 02 Yeah.
34:12 Cameron Hanes? Just like we have bad days and there's, they might've got, just got their ass kicked and then they see some little guy sitting on the ground. They're like, you look small.
34:20 Speaker 02 I'm gonna go mess with you.
34:22 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, it's like, I just got beat up by a big boar. I'm gonna go take it out on that guy.
34:27 Speaker 00 Yeah.
34:27 Cameron Hanes? Or that thing, whatever it is.
34:28 Speaker 02 Yeah.
34:29 Cameron Hanes? Some of them like those, like you were saying, that that big sow, maybe you've never seen a human.
34:34 Speaker 02 Like not.
34:35 Cameron Hanes? That giant sow with the, with the colorface.
34:37 Speaker 00 Yeah, probably not.
34:39 Cameron Hanes? And so. Yeah, so you're, they don't know, they don't know how to react. They don't know they're supposed to be afraid.
34:46 Speaker 02 It's pretty, it's been used a lot. She's getting, he's all.
34:52 Cameron Hanes? I like this. I mean, this, is that a spot for your finger, just like that? He just got, got control.
34:57 Speaker 02 Give me that for a second, Josh. And see for me, it's this when you're fleshing.
35:02 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, yeah.
35:02 Speaker 02 I love it.
35:03 Cameron Hanes? Or.
35:04 Speaker 02 But it's, it's my size.
35:05 Speaker 00 It is your size.
35:06 Speaker 02 Josh made it just for me. Look at that.
35:07 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
35:08 Speaker 02 Cause I always complain, everything's big.
35:10 Speaker 00 You can use that?
35:11 Speaker 02 Yeah.
35:11 Speaker 00 Finger?
35:12 Cameron Hanes? I think that's.
35:12 Speaker 02 Or this.
35:14 Speaker 00 I'm like this when I'm doing the spine work here and then for fleshing.
35:16 Cameron Hanes? Exactly. Yeah, that's what I was gonna say.
35:18 Speaker 00 Well designed. It's really, you guys did it on that.
35:20 Cameron Hanes? Perfect.
35:22 Speaker 00 Campaigns, Josh Smith, and Cola.
35:24 Cameron Hanes? Oh, man. And they sold in minutes. Maybe seconds, I don't know. And for, and you gotta be proud of it because it's, it's so useful.
35:34 Speaker 02 Yeah.
35:37 Cameron Hanes? But yeah, having that control of that index finger like that, it's just, that's how we're designed. And so when you make this knife that's just designed to react like that and respond, it's beautiful.
35:52 Cameron Hanes? And then with a high club, well, I keep hitting the table with it, so. I don't, I'm sorry.
36:02 Speaker 02 It's all good. It's nice to have a blade that you can do a full bearless and then even.
36:06 Speaker 00 Yeah.
36:09 Speaker 00 Do you want to do the front shoulder first?
36:10 Speaker 02 Uh, for, yeah.
36:11 Speaker 00 Do the two front shoulders? And then we'll keep that, the back ham.
36:14 Speaker 02 So we can get out the backdrop?
36:16 Speaker 00 Take out the loin so it stays up.
36:17 Cameron Hanes? Okay.
36:18 Speaker 00 And then once, and then by taking these off now, we'll be able to get loins off right to the front.
36:21 Cameron Hanes? Okay.
36:22 Speaker 02 Cam, I have a present for you.
36:23 Speaker 00 Left.
36:24 Cameron Hanes? Oh, no.
36:25 Speaker 02 (laughing).
36:27 Cameron Hanes? Whoever was TSA or I don't know what stole my.
36:31 Speaker 02 Stole your wiener?
36:33 Cameron Hanes? My bear dick last year. It is hard getting this bone out of here to be, be honest.
36:38 Speaker 02 You just gotta kind of flex it?
36:39 Speaker 00 Pretty good at it.
36:40 Cameron Hanes? You're, you're probably the.
36:41 Speaker 00 I bet James could do it too.
36:43 Cameron Hanes? Oh, James is.
36:44 Speaker 00 Do it with my mouth.
36:49 Speaker 02 (laughing).
36:50 Speaker 00 I'll clean it up because the taxidermist will be able to ship it to you.
36:52 Speaker 02 Yeah, he'll be able to.
36:53 Speaker 00 If he's permitted to ship it with the bear.
36:58 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, I was gonna make James take out his butt plug and put this in at home. But you can leave your butt plug in.
37:06 Speaker 00 Yay.
37:11 Speaker 02 Look at the smoke rolling in. We got east wind again.
37:19 Cameron Hanes? So you want me to, want me to take that front shoulder off then?
37:22 Speaker 02 Yeah.
37:23 Speaker 00 Yeah, most fronts you can take.
37:26 Speaker 00 That'd be your pepperoni sticks you study up. Those were good last year too.
37:30 Cameron Hanes? Oh man, so good.
37:32 Speaker 00 That's nice looking. We, we got a color of that now.
37:34 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, it's so dark.
37:35 Speaker 00 Rich.
37:36 Cameron Hanes? Yes, dark and rich, yeah.
37:38 Speaker 00 You gotta hold it up.
37:41 Speaker 00 There you go. Good.
37:47 Speaker 02 This is as big as the ham.
37:49 Speaker 00 Yeah, that's a big front shoulder. That's the size of a rear ham of a good bear.
37:58 Cameron Hanes? This table's making my knife dull.
38:02 Cameron Hanes? There you go.
38:04 Speaker 02 This is the French roll there.
38:06 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
38:08 Cameron Hanes? It's a good one.
38:11 Speaker 00 You can do that other one?
38:12 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
38:16 Speaker 02 Like that?
38:17 Cameron Hanes? Yep, right there. So that cuts up the old hole.
38:27 Cameron Hanes? I have to think a little bit and then put them down quick.
38:51 Speaker 02 How's that one there?
38:52 Cameron Hanes? Just cut.
38:54 Speaker 00 Four blades.
39:00 Speaker 02 That one should be sharp.
39:02 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, way better.
39:05 Cameron Hanes? That's that other one, it's good.
39:09 Speaker 03 See that? That's just old, but...
39:12 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that's, I think people underestimate how heavy bone these are.
39:18 Speaker 03 The hits.
39:18 Cameron Hanes? You're not getting a arrow through that shoulder easily. Unless you like it.
39:24 Speaker 02 Yeah.
39:29 Speaker 02 And rifle hunters, they've become both hunters. They've always been told, "Shoot the bear in the shoulder, shoot the bear in the shoulder."
39:33 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, because it breaks them down and...
39:35 Speaker 02 Look at that. That's a stellar piece of meat.
39:37 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that's a good one.
39:43 Cameron Hanes? Want to get a nice high photo?
39:44 Speaker 02 Yeah.
39:47 Speaker 02 Oh, I just put it in this dead over there.
39:54 Speaker 02 That's bigger than the ham, I want a bear. No joke. Nope.
39:58 Cameron Hanes? It's a good size there.
40:00 Speaker 02 No joke.
40:05 Speaker 02 Once you're done doing that, then I'll flick it on its belly.
40:09 Cameron Hanes? And do some loins?
40:10 Speaker 02 Yeah.
40:12 Speaker 02 How many? First time bear hunters this week?
40:15 Cameron Hanes? A bird.
40:17 Speaker 02 Like, six?
40:18 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
40:19 Speaker 02 Isn't it six? Well, actually, like, I mean, archery, bear hunting. There's six.
40:27 Speaker 02 Some other guys did spot and stalks with a gun, but that's different.
40:30 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, definitely. Whole different game with a bow.
40:33 Speaker 02 Yeah.
40:35 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, you can just go right through the shoulder with a gun. And that does break them down too, but...
40:41 Speaker 02 If you hit it in the right spot.
40:42 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
40:43 Speaker 02 Cause sometimes with the hair being long and whatever, they hit them kinda in that... The forearm part, not quite the shoulder, so you blow up the leg.
40:52 Cameron Hanes? Kick up. You don't take out the lungs.
40:54 Speaker 02 Yeah.
40:55 Cameron Hanes? It's gonna be a long day.
40:56 Speaker 02 Well, anybody that asks, like, in the lungs, stubbing on it, it's not gonna go far, don't matter what it is.
41:03 Cameron Hanes? I like to use the stubble ones for roast meat.
41:05 Speaker 02 Yeah.
41:07 Cameron Hanes? I love that. That's that, gives you pepperoni.
41:11 Speaker 02 That's why I like to take lots of sprintful as hurt.
41:13 Speaker 00 Isn't it crazy how the spine?
41:14 Speaker 02 And they get right down into the neck.
41:16 Speaker 00 We'll show it after. Uh, but the spine, like on a deer, you just go straight down for your loins?
41:21 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
41:21 Speaker 00 There's another ridge of bone.
41:23 Cameron Hanes? No.
41:24 Speaker 02 I just gotta find out what the actual proper form of it is. Can I look this on its belly now?
41:28 Speaker 00 Where's Dr. Jared?
41:30 Speaker 02 You'll tell her.
41:32 Cameron Hanes? I don't know, you might not know bear.
41:34 Speaker 00 Yeah, he does.
41:34 Cameron Hanes? Oh, he does?
41:35 Speaker 00 He does, yeah.
41:38 Speaker 02 Oh, yeah, almost done.
41:44 Speaker 02 What's the size of the carcass?
41:47 Speaker 02 Oh, I was gonna measure it around here. Around the muscle where the color starts is fourteen and a half inches. Just the viscous.
41:54 Cameron Hanes? Yep. Oh, man, that's an old bear.
41:57 Speaker 02 Yeah.
41:58 Cameron Hanes? That is an old bear.
42:00 Speaker 02 They're ground right down, some of them. Or the back here?
42:03 Speaker 00 Mm.
42:03 Speaker 02 Yeah.
42:07 Speaker 03 I'm glad.
42:10 Speaker 02 You're swiping that way? But it's just, just getting used to that.
42:15 Speaker 03 All right. You'll need to split two parts. One off, one head off.
42:20 Speaker 03 See, see, I'm gonna be copying that, sure that.
42:22 Speaker 00 Taking her on bow.
42:23 Speaker 02 You want me to take this off first? We can roll it.
42:25 Speaker 03 No, I don't.
42:25 Speaker 02 Okay.
42:26 Speaker 03 He's like, flip it up.
42:27 Speaker 02 Okay.
42:27 Speaker 03 But maybe I can win it.
42:34 Speaker 02 Because if I flip him on his tummy, then you can do that spot.
42:36 Speaker 03 You.
42:36 Speaker 02 Once he's done that.
42:38 Speaker 03 Yeah.
42:38 Speaker 02 Or, does he want to hold it and I'll flip it? Because then he can get more all the way down here. What?
42:45 Speaker 00 I was gonna get girth.
42:46 Speaker 03 Oh.
42:46 Speaker 00 And like measurements, so he'll measure the height.
42:48 Speaker 02 Yeah.
42:51 Speaker 03 What do you want?
42:53 Cameron Hanes? So heavy, just a little bit of sliding.
42:57 Cameron Hanes? Grab this.
43:09 Speaker 00 Nice crease on the middle there.
43:10 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Yeah, I know he's sad, that's, that's a sign of an old bear, huh?
43:16 Speaker 00 Uh huh.
43:17 Cameron Hanes? See that crease in their head?
43:21 Cameron Hanes? So, for those interested in a bear hunt, John and Jen Rivet, living the dream. But just find them on Instagram, send them a message. Look them up.
43:31 Speaker 00 Alberta Canada.
43:32 Speaker 02 Alberta Canada. Or you can find us on Rivet Co, too.
43:36 Cameron Hanes? Watch these, uh,
43:39 Cameron Hanes? I don't know, watch the videos, listen to podcasts, uh, talk to them if you have any questions and get up here and chase big bear in the most beautiful bear country I've been around. And, um, yeah. They're the best people I know.
43:57 Speaker 02 Good catch.
44:01 Cameron Hanes? Best black bear guides I've been.
44:09 Cameron Hanes? Pretty lucky.
44:09 Speaker 02 We didn't even have to pay to see that.
44:11 Cameron Hanes? No.
44:12 Speaker 02 Just that peanut butter honey bacon sandwich, didn't it?
44:16 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that's all it takes.
44:18 Speaker 02 Takes.
44:21 Cameron Hanes? We'll be all seeing you camp up here. We have a whole camp full of, uh, bunch of guys I've never met.
44:27 Speaker 00 Yep, we had eight people here right now.
44:29 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, Caleb Brewers. I don't know, it's a big honor to meet him. Known of him for a long time, so feel really lucky to be here with him.
44:43 Cameron Hanes? But yeah.
44:45 Cameron Hanes? Where do you ever meet bad people in bear camp?
44:48 Speaker 00 That's true. That's true. If they are, we send them back home.
44:51 Speaker 02 Or, or they changed their tune quick.
44:53 Speaker 00 Yeah.
44:53 Speaker 02 Cause they realize, hey, like, we've had some that come up are pretty, I don't wanna say arrogant, but you know, whatever, a little bit know-it-all. You know, don't really wanna listen and stuff like that, or whatever it is.
45:05 Cameron Hanes? It'll be a one and done.
45:06 Speaker 02 Yeah, well, you know, what it, usually what ends up happening is it's like, at the beginning of the week, probably a little insecurity element, whatever it might be. But then by midweek, they're like coming around and by the end of the week, it's like a lot of changed people.
45:19 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that's great.
45:19 Speaker 02 Just, it's just, it's tough camp.
45:21 Cameron Hanes? That's okay, that happens.
45:22 Speaker 02 You know? Yeah, and it's a great place though. Look at, look at that. That's like a one half and quarter of fat.
45:28 Speaker 00 Whoa.
45:29 Cameron Hanes? Probably been in, when I was younger, been in bear camp where I was a dickhead and, oh, I got better, so we'll give people grace.
45:37 Speaker 02 Yeah.
45:38 Cameron Hanes? People deserve grace.
45:39 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:39 Speaker 02 Yeah.
45:40 Cameron Hanes? We're not, we're not perfect, but we just want good people up here to appreciate. And I told the guide yesterday, this is a real hunt. Don't think this is not a real hunt. It's, uh, you gotta make good decisions.
45:50 Speaker 00 So the record books for bears has nothing to do with height, nothing to do with weight, it's all about the skull. So that's the only thing that counts. That is the only thing that you can't cheat on. You could say it weighs more than it does, or stretch it out and measure it longer, but the skull is, is the true thing for the record books for Bud and Crockett or for, for Archie Popinyan. So you want the full length, the longest length, and the greatest width, and you add that together and that's your score. So eighteen inch minimum for Popinyan. And now there's some people that will watch on a twenty-two inch bear, while they're taking that tape and they're wrapping it around and going around and getting more length and going down the sides. No, you gotta measure with calipers.
46:30 Speaker 00 Longest, I said.
46:34 Speaker 02 Holy crap.
46:36 Speaker 00 Twelve and four sixteenths. Bears are measured in sixteenths, not eights. So, there's another trick to know if your guy knows what he's talking about.
46:46 Cameron Hanes? People will say, oh, it's four sixteenths and they'll say, oh, well, wait, what did I say? One fourth. Yeah.
46:54 Speaker 00 Yeah.
46:54 Cameron Hanes? So, whatever, that's how you do it.
46:56 Speaker 00 It's a quarter inch.
46:56 Cameron Hanes? You always keep it in sixteenths.
46:58 Speaker 00 Uh, twelve and four sixteenths. Or it's, if it was, if you're measuring a deer, it would be eight, so it would be two, two eights.
47:06 Cameron Hanes? Yeah. Yeah. It's weird.
47:08 Speaker 00 But the bear is that much.
47:09 Cameron Hanes? Very different.
47:09 Speaker 00 Like, in the top of the record books, where they're, you know, those twenty-two inchers.
47:13 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
47:14 Speaker 00 A sixteenth is, is the difference sometimes, eh, like?
47:16 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
47:16 Speaker 00 A fraction.
47:17 Cameron Hanes? Right.
47:18 Speaker 00 How close they are.
47:19 Cameron Hanes? Yep.
47:19 Speaker 00 If it was in eights, you'd have like, a hundred of them would be right there together.
47:24 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, they gotta, gotta have more fine measurements. Separation.
47:38 Speaker 00 Seven and five sixteenths.
47:42 Speaker 00 That's a big frickin' bear cam.
47:48 Speaker 02 Is that right?
47:51 Speaker 00 It's in real form tonight. Yeah. Yeah. So, close to twenty, we're, we knew it was a nineteen to twenty inch bear.
47:58 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
47:58 Speaker 02 Just under.
47:59 Speaker 00 Nineteen and nine sixteenths. That's a big bear. It's a big skull.
48:03 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
48:04 Speaker 00 Way into Pope and Young.
48:05 Cameron Hanes? It was, uh, what was the width, seven, what?
48:08 Speaker 00 Seven and.
48:09 Speaker 02 Five sixteenths, I said.
48:11 Speaker 00 Yeah.
48:15 Speaker 00 Seven and five.
48:17 Speaker 02 Half, so twelve.
48:19 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
48:19 Speaker 00 And twelve and four long.
48:22 Speaker 00 And when they, when they, in the drying period, before you can actually score it into the books, um, it'll actually get bigger sometimes. You know where antlers shrink?
48:31 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
48:31 Speaker 00 On a bear, these side things right here? Will.
48:35 Cameron Hanes? Spread.
48:36 Speaker 00 Spread as they dry up.
48:38 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
48:38 Speaker 00 And you'll get more width. So, you could gain
48:42 Speaker 00 several sixteenths.
48:43 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, if you're, if you're getting close to that twenty inch skull, that's.
48:47 Speaker 00 It's a big bear.
48:48 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, that's what we're after. And that only happens with age generally.
48:52 Speaker 02 Yeah.
48:54 Speaker 02 Age and some really good genetics.
49:04 Speaker 00 Twelve and six sixteenths. And the bottom teeth are out more than the.
49:08 Cameron Hanes? Yeah, you can go with the bottom on that.
49:10 Speaker 00 Twelve and.
49:10 Speaker 02 It's the, yeah, it's the.
49:13 Speaker 03 This thing said.
49:14 Speaker 02 Okay.
49:15 Speaker 00 Six sixteenths, so now we're at.
49:17 Speaker 02 Eleven.
49:17 Speaker 00 Eleven sixteenths, yeah. And as it dries again, a couple more, so it'll be close to twenty minutes.
49:22 Cameron Hanes? That's a good, that's a good head right there.
49:25 Speaker 00 They're worn down really good.
49:26 Speaker 02 Yeah. It kinda matches your shirt.
49:29 Cameron Hanes? It seems old.
49:30 Speaker 00 Yeah.
49:31 Cameron Hanes? I just wanna see how high I could get. If I have to get this high.
49:36 Cameron Hanes? I hope so.
49:36 Speaker 00 Yeah, that'd be cool.
49:44 Speaker 00 Holy shit. Eight foot bear dude, just to the bottom of the eight foot two by four.
49:48 Speaker 02 Take it in a different way.
49:54 Speaker 00 Eight foot bear, man!
50:00 Speaker 02 Okay, and then after, after, we're gonna do the one with the pole where you hold the nose this way, where it's standing.
50:06 Speaker 00 Yeah, yeah. It's the heaviest bear we've done.
50:07 Cameron Hanes? Look how long that is.
50:08 Speaker 00 It's to the bottom, it's a true eight foot bear.
50:11 Speaker 03 No, just like that, I wanna do like a pan down of the whole bridge.
50:13 Speaker 00 Okay.
50:17 Speaker 02 His feet are on the ground flat.
50:21 Speaker 02 I wanna do one like this.
50:24 Speaker 00 There you go.
50:26 Speaker 02 So then you do that and you pull that guy out, that is stellar. Look at how fucking big. Oh yeah, we need to measure it.
50:32 Speaker 00 It's eight foot. It's just under eight foot, it's like seven eleven.
50:39 Speaker 02 Well, look at the, look at the board.
50:40 Speaker 00 You ready?
50:41 Speaker 02 Yeah.
50:43 Speaker 00 Yeah. It's a big freaking bear.
50:45 Cameron Hanes? Yeah.
50:46 Speaker 02 My gosh. His height is perfect.
50:49 Speaker 00 Oh, it's beautiful.
50:52 Cameron Hanes? All right, some backhands. You got both back straps already? No, I've got, well, I got one back.
51:04 Cameron Hanes? It gets heavy.
51:08 Cameron Hanes? All right, we're closing out this episode of the Keep Hammer Collective with John and Jen Rivet. Hurry up, it's heavy. We've had some success, here's all our bear meat and we can't wait to eat it. Thanks for listening.
51:19 Speaker 02 A rise, kill, now we're gonna eat. Holy shit.
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