KHC 210 ExaltXP – Environmental Wellness System

Join us for a conversation with Leo and Roman of Exalt XP - a complete, intelligent environmental wellness system powered by the proprietary Young Wellness Method™. The system integrates simulated altitude, infrared heat, and red light therapy to train how your body adapts, performs, and recovers. Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Timestamps: 00:00:00 – Exalt XP: What it Does & Who it’s Designed for 00:06:00 – Neurological Stress, Building Resilience, and Low Oxygen Training 00:12:52 – A Natural Way to Supercharge Your Performance 00:18:34 – The Norwegian Method 00:19:43 – Heat Training 00:22:53 – Training for the NY Giants Football Team 00:24:57 – Connecting Back with the Present Moment 00:25:47 – Leo’s Backstory: Living with Carcinoid Syndrome 00:31:46 – Composing Yourself Under Extreme Stress: Cold Plunging 00:33:49 – Roman’s Backstory: Sports, ADHD, 4 ACL Tears, & a Mining Career 00:40:07 – How Roman & Leo Built EXALTxp & Connected with the Hunting Community 00:43:43 – A Concept Accessible for Residential Homes 00:45:43 – The Results Speak for Themselves 00:48:37 – What Cam Thinks of Training in his EXALTxp Studio 00:50:56 – What Joe Rogan Thought of the Training 00:53:14 – The Science & Optimization with Altitude & Heat Training 00:57:15 – Goals for EXALTxp’s Studio Locations 01:00:23 – An Experiment on Children’s Stress Management & Regulating Emotions 01:04:55 – The Marshmallow Experiment & Self Regulation 01:09:23 – Longevity, More Adventures, and Blue-Zone People 01:14:09 – Maximum Aerobic Capacity, Peak Power, VO2 Max 01:19:10 – Setup & Installation Setup 01:22:14 – Final Thoughts Thank you to our sponsors: MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code CAM for 20% off & Free Shipping LMNT: Visit https://drinklmnt.com/cam for a free sample pack with any purchase Black Rifle Coffee: https://www.blackriflecoffee.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 10% your order Grizzly Coolers: https://www.grizzlycoolers.com/ use code KEEPHAMMERING for 15% off Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv use code CAM for 10% off Sig Sauer: https://www.sigsauer.com/ use code CAM10 for 10% off optics

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:15Cameron Hanes?

  All right, guys, this is the Keep Hammering Collective. I'm with Leo Young, Roman Brady, and what do we end up with on the, is it Exalt?

• 0:23Speaker 01

  Exalt XP.

• 0:25Cameron Hanes?

  Exalt XP.

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Exalt XP.

• 0:27Cameron Hanes?

  What, what a journey this has been. So I want, explain to me, what is Exalt XP? I think people have seen me work out here. It's my atmosphere chamber, is my heat training, but explain it to me. Where did this idea come from and what's going on?

• 0:45Speaker 01

  You give the backstory. Well, backstory is, it's essentially a controlled stress environment where we manipulate the atmosphere to low oxygen. So we can go to elevations up to 20,000 feet from sea level. We train just now at 15,000 feet. So that's a stressful situation for the body, but what we want to do is all about human adaptation. So put you through some hard stuff.

• 1:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:13Speaker 01

  Because when you go through hard stuff, that's where the growth comes from.

• 1:16Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 1:16Speaker 01

  But not so hard it kills you.

• 1:18Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 1:19Speaker 01

  Right?

• 1:19Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:19Speaker 01

  But also we've got the heat element. We can go to 115 degrees Fahrenheit. Again, just environmental stress, controlling that in a manner, we get through it. And so we do movement in there. We've got the training aspect in there. We've also got red light therapy panels that we've got in certain models we have. Where the idea came from was, we just wanted to create an environment where people can connect with themselves through their breathing and ultimately learn the art of self-regulation. So what better way to regulate in a controlled stress environment where you're forced to connect to your breath?

• 1:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:57Speaker 01

  There's a lot of research that Leo will talk about that's connected to the benefits of learning that art of self-regulation for people to achieve, you know, their capacity in life. And Leo will probably talk a bit more about it, but we're just so passionate about helping people on their journeys.

• 2:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 2:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:16Cameron Hanes?

  And it's just, well, helping people. So what was the, who were you helping? Like, who does this help? Because when I think of it like, I think, oh, if I'm going to train at 14,000 feet or 16 or up to 20,000 feet, I'm getting ready for the mountains. You know what I mean? So who, who was this product designed for?

• 2:33Speaker 01

  Yeah. So it came for you, there's very specific applications. Because you're a hunter, you know, there's times you're going to go hunting at altitude and the challenges of being altitude really increases the degree of difficulty for you to take a shot, that sort of thing. So for you, it's very obvious, acclimatized to high altitude, you go there, you can perform closer to what you normally would at sea level. But the benefits go way beyond that. Because as Roman said, we look at this essentially as a controlled stress environment. And there's this concept that we talk about in science called EU stress, spelled E U stress. And that relates to the optimal amount of stress to bring about the

• 3:13Speaker 01

  best possible adaptations. So in life, if you only, in order to stimulate and create and initiate change, there needs to be a certain optimal amount of stress. If the stress, if the additional stimulus is too little, then nothing happens. There's no challenge to the body. There's no need for it to recover from that and adapt. If the stress is too much, then the load on the body is just too great. A great example is your hunt that you just went on, all right?

• 3:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 3:42Speaker 01

  The stress was too much.

• 3:44Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 3:44Speaker 01

  All right. It was a challenge. You did it. You pushed yourself to the edge, but it's not going to have a good physical outcome on you. Your fitness will have gone backwards as a result of it.

• 3:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 3:53Speaker 01

  Because there was so much sleep deprivation, so much caloric restriction, so much central nervous system like challenge that it's going to take you a week, two weeks, maybe up to a month to fully recover from. So that's a really good example of what you've just gone through and you're feeling in real life now.

• 4:11Cameron Hanes?

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• 4:53Cameron Hanes?

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• 5:35Cameron Hanes?

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• 6:18Cameron Hanes?

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• 6:32Speaker 01

  What it's like when the stress is too high, too consistent, too long, too intense.

• 6:37Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 6:38Speaker 01

  So what we're looking for is that Goldilocks amount of stress, you know what I mean? Where it's enough to challenge the body, enough to give the body something that has to recover from, enough to stimulate positive adaptation, but not so much that you've just pushed yourself over the edge.

• 6:54Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 6:54Speaker 01

  And when you put someone in a new stress environment like that, its applications go way beyond just acclimatizing yourself for altitude or climatizing yourself for a hot environment. It creates lots of very, very positive, meaningful changes in the body. The body goes through what we call, you know, it really accelerates what we call neuroplasticity. We actually rewire the way the brain perceives things. And as you and I have discussed, that everything that we feel in terms of fatigue and pain is generated by the brain. Very little of it is actually real or necessary for any other reason than for the brain to give a signal to you that you're feeling pain. Don't stop doing that, or you're feeling

• 7:37Speaker 01

  fatigue, it's time to slow down. So the body's got these very important protective mechanisms built in to stop you from pushing yourself so far. Unfortunately, in modern society, people have become what we call overprotective. They become hypervigilant and they react to stress very poorly. So just the silliest little things that shouldn't be stressing become very traumatic, almost traumatic to them.

• 8:03Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 8:03Speaker 01

  So when we're in there, a very important part of the process is teaching people how to become more resilient.

• 8:09Cameron Hanes?

  Just in general life, not just for training, just stresses of life.

• 8:14Speaker 01

  But you know, you know what's blown away? This is, as much as you go into creating something to help people, you learn as you go. Like, practically having done this for some years now, I've been blown away with, you know, you talk about who is this for?

• 8:33Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 8:34Speaker 01

  Makes sense for elite athletes.

• 8:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 8:36Speaker 01

  Altitude training has been around since the Mexico City Olympics. Um, you know, uh, high altitude training for camps and teams and marathon runners, boxers, fighters, they've been doing it for a long, long time.

• 8:50Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 8:51Speaker 01

  You have a look at the MMA with the guys at Dagestan in the mountains, you know, you see all this stuff happen all the time. So it makes sense that that's what the elite athlete.

• 8:59Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 9:00Speaker 01

  But what you just said then and what Leo and I have learned, how this helps people deal with everyday life stress from a neurological perspective, it just builds that resilience.

• 9:12Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 9:13Speaker 01

  So like, if you think about the concept of low oxygen, what do you need more on earth to survive anything than anything else? It's oxygen.

• 9:22Cameron Hanes?

  Oxygen, yeah.

• 9:23Speaker 01

  If you can learn how to deal with that being a low oxygen environment, if your other stress is like financial stress, relationship stress, and your brain has taught itself to be calm and regulated during low oxygen.

• 9:35Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 9:35Speaker 01

  It just manages those other things so much better.

• 9:38Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 9:38Speaker 01

  And like.

• 9:39Cameron Hanes?

  Cause it's just, it's just a different type of stress.

• 9:41Speaker 01

  It's just.

• 9:42Cameron Hanes?

  But you're dealing with.

• 9:43Speaker 01

  Stress is stress to the body and.

• 9:44Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 9:45Speaker 01

  There's no stress more powerful than the deprivation of oxygen. Because we all know within two, three, four minutes, depending on what you're capable of, you're gonna die. Now, sure, there are people who.

• 9:55Cameron Hanes?

  Superhuman.

• 9:56Speaker 01

  Uh, superhuman have trained themselves to be able to hold their breath for eleven, twelve minutes.

• 10:00Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 10:01Speaker 01

  People even.

• 10:01Cameron Hanes?

  Have you ever done that before? No, but what.

• 10:04Speaker 01

  Like in terms of like measured how long you could hold your breath for?

• 10:07Cameron Hanes?

  Maybe just screwing around, but isn't that the whole point to waterboarding basically?

• 10:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. Well, this would make, if you, if you want to survive waterboarding, there's nothing better than.

• 10:16Cameron Hanes?

  There you go. I'm ready.

• 10:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. And there's people that pre like, like super oxygenate themselves and they can hold their breath then for twenty nine minutes. That's a world record.

• 10:25Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 10:25Speaker 01

  But without super oxygenating yourself prior to, or just starting from a baseline level, the world record's between eleven and twelve minutes, which is, which is amazing. And when they do that, they have the ultimate level of emotional composure. It's to do that, your body's just screaming like, take a breath, you're gonna die.

• 10:43Cameron Hanes?

  Right, but you're calm.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  Hold it. And they let their pulse, the guy held, held that world record, I think he dropped his pulse to like twenty five.

• 10:49Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 10:50Speaker 01

  All right. And um, he dropped his oxygen saturation levels to twelve.

• 10:55Cameron Hanes?

  Wow.

• 10:55Speaker 01

  So everyone's been to the hospital, you know, they put the blood.

• 10:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 10:59Speaker 01

  Thing on, it says ninety six to ninety nine, normally it can be a hundred. Normally in hospital, if it starts to drop below ninety six, they start monitoring you. It's a problem below ninety is a real problem. But when you get down to twelve, that's just insane. Now, no one should really attempt to do that unless they go for a world record, cause you do potentially cause yourself brain damage.

• 11:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:18Speaker 01

  Driving your brain of that much oxygen. But one of the really cool things in here is as soon as you go into a low oxygen environment, very sensibly, the body has protective mechanisms in that kick into place straight away. And one of the things it does, as soon as it senses that your blood oxygen saturation levels are dropping, it immediately starts to do things to compensate for that. So it immediately starts to pump out more adrenaline, more noradrenaline, more EPO. EPO is a hormone made by your kidneys to produce more red blood cells. A lot of people don't realise, it's also a really powerful central nervous system stimulant. So your body amps itself up to deal with the stress of the situation.

• 11:57Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 11:58Speaker 01

  And then it increases your breathing rate, increases the rate of breathing because to try and get more volume of air in because it's less oxygen in any particular volume of air. And it raises your heart rate to try and keep those blood oxygen saturation levels up.

• 12:12Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 12:13Speaker 01

  What we do is we go, hey, let's not do that. Let's just relax into that and let's lean into that. Let's just let those blood oxygen saturation levels drop.

• 12:20Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  And get your body used to being okay with that. All right. Now, whilst if you're unwell and your blood oxygen saturations are dropping in hospitals, well, that's a bad sign. But under normal circumstances, humans can survive with their blood oxygen saturation levels dropping to reasonable levels. Like people who live in Tibet at six thousand meters, whatever, they spend most of their life with their blood ox, oxygen saturation levels in the eighties, for example.

• 12:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 12:45Speaker 01

  What a lot of people don't realise is that like for humans, when they're in the fetal state, so in other words, when you're.

• 12:53Cameron Hanes?

  Not when they're busted, you know, when they're actually in the fetal.

• 12:55Speaker 01

  So when you're like, so.

• 12:57Cameron Hanes?

  You know, the fetal state, I'm done.

• 12:59Speaker 01

  Fetal position. So when, when a woman's pregnant and, and ba- basically, you know, the, the um, the eggs are germinated and, and the human fetus starts to grow.

• 13:09Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 13:11Speaker 01

  Obviously, there's a lot of growth and development that has to happen, and that happens via stem cell activity.

• 13:16Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 13:16Speaker 01

  And the way the body max optimises those, that stem cell activity is by keeping the young fetus at, with very low oxygen saturation levels. Those levels can be as low as thirty five and go as high as eighty.

• 13:30Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 13:30Speaker 01

  Right, during that nine month period, but it averages around the sixty five percent mark. And that's really powerful because we now know that by doing that, there's lots of neuro, it really stimulates the production of serotonin, lots of neuroplasticity and lots of stem cell activity.

• 13:45Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 13:46Speaker 01

  And so we're tapping into that same sort of energy when we're training in the room there. That's why when you're in there, we're trying to get you to regulate after efforts and drop your blood oxygen ratio, oxygen saturation level. So we're specifically attempting during, say, say, I got you to run on the treadmill for twenty minutes, whatever. We'd be looking for you to keep your oxygen saturation levels between seventy eight and eighty three, something optimally, that'd be optimal level. When you're doing strength movements or interval sets or little sprints, we want you to be capable of letting your blood oxygen saturation levels after that drop below eighty if possible, into seventies, sixties, even fifties.

• 14:23Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 14:23Speaker 01

  Right. And there's a direct correlation between your ability to be relaxed and calm and emotionally compose yourself under stress and how low you can drop it. So it's like a truth meter.

• 14:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, right.

• 14:36Speaker 01

  If someone's really wired up and they're like suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, they've got anxiety, depression, that sort of stuff, they're very reactive, they can't drop their blood oxygen saturation levels.

• 14:48Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 14:48Speaker 01

  And then what's really exhilarating for people is learning over the days and weeks that they get to the stage where they couldn't get it below the mid nineties and all of a sudden they, one day they crack ninety and then they can crack eighty and it's quite exciting for them.

• 15:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 15:00Speaker 01

  Because it's a direct reflection of how good they are at just composing themselves in that stressful, stressful situation. So it's a very.

• 15:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 15:09Speaker 01

  Objective measure we have.

• 15:10Cameron Hanes?

  Well, it's a, I was just thinking about like, I, I think what spurred it on was I heard Chris Williamson on Rogan yesterday, I think, I was listening. And they were talking about how like in business, people are like doping, kind of like with Adderall. So they can work longer, work harder. And then I was thinking, is this kind of like you're optimising, like business a lot of times is stressful.

• 15:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:35Cameron Hanes?

  The people who are best under stressful situations and make good decisions and, you know, everybody's got a boss, the boss can come to you and you'd be like, you know what to do because you're thinking clearly.

• 15:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:46Cameron Hanes?

  Is this like a PED for business even?

• 15:49Speaker 01

  Absolutely. One of the, one of the comments is that a sports scientist had said to me, it's a legal form of cheating.

• 15:57Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 15:58Speaker 01

  You are doing a, you're using a natural environmental atmospheric air,

• 16:03Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 16:04Speaker 01

  which is nitrogen oxygen, you're dropping the oxygen fully natural.

• 16:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:08Speaker 01

  But that is sparking these huge amount of adaptations that are gonna supercharge your performance.

• 16:17Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 16:17Speaker 01

  Which if you paired that performance outcome to say doping, that's illegal.

• 16:23Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 16:23Speaker 01

  This is legal.

• 16:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 16:25Speaker 01

  It's, it's very similar performance outcomes.

• 16:27Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 16:28Speaker 01

  But it's legal.

• 16:29Cameron Hanes?

  Amazing, right.

• 16:29Speaker 01

  You know?

• 16:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:30Speaker 01

  But it'd be interesting to see like, I've even heard like for cyclists, if they've got music on.

• 16:36Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 16:36Speaker 01

  And they're going for a world record, that's cheating. Cause it amps up. So it'd be interesting to see where that goes, but um.

• 16:42Cameron Hanes?

  It will be.

• 16:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it, it, and, and it, it's, it's just, I love that fact about it. We're using air and just changing the dynamic of it to give you less, which could be.

• 16:53Cameron Hanes?

  Air.

• 16:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just air.

• 16:55Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:55Speaker 01

  It's in the air, you know?

• 16:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:57Speaker 01

  And you would have seen recently Josh, who broke the world mile record, twenty seven year old record. I mean, a big, big part of his training was living at altitude, so he's sleeping at altitude. And then doing sessions and like, he wasn't always living at altitude, sometimes he just had a um, hypoxic system in his bedroom. So he could sleep at altitude even at um, sea level temper, sea, sea level, which you're gonna be able to do here, you're able to sleep in your pod here.

• 17:22Cameron Hanes?

  Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that like the best circumstance? Because with more oxygen, you can push harder and faster. And then you're, but then you're adapting at night or when you're sleeping. But if you could, cause what happens is go, guys go to these high like Salt Lake or you go to Boulder or whatever to train in elevation, but then they're there the whole time.

• 17:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:43Cameron Hanes?

  And if you have tons of oxygen down low, push, whatever.

• 17:48Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 17:48Cameron Hanes?

  You still get the adaptation, that's superior, isn't it?

• 17:51Speaker 01

  So the opt, the optimal protocol for performance is you spend extended periods of time, maybe a couple of weeks or so, sleeping at altitude.

• 17:59Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  Because remember I said to you that as soon as you go into a low oxygen environment, your kidneys immediately start to produce copious amounts of EPO.

• 18:08Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 18:09Speaker 01

  And that's the hormone that allows you to produce more red blood cells. It's what historically been the main way endurance athletes have.

• 18:16Cameron Hanes?

  For the tour, I remember hearing.

• 18:18Speaker 01

  Even, even the tour, like they would go there, get those adaptations, take their blood out.

• 18:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:23Speaker 01

  And then when they're at sea level, when they're about the race, they'd, they'd pump it in.

• 18:26Cameron Hanes?

  That's how it works.

• 18:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's how it works.

• 18:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  So if you can sleep.

• 18:29Cameron Hanes?

  EPO doping.

• 18:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. So and even though you, EPO starts coursing through your body every time you go into the simulated altitude room, you need to that, keep that running for extended period of time to actually get the production of red blood cells, which you can do by sleeping in there.

• 18:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:46Speaker 01

  All right. And that's a really cool change. It's not the most important change, but it's obviously a very important change for athletes. On top of that, when you do training sessions that you just did in a simulated environment, it's teaching the body how to push itself and adapt to using less oxygen. So then when you go back and train in a sea level environment, it's like your brain's having a party. It's not, well, I can do anything now.

• 19:07Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 19:07Speaker 01

  Cause I was doing stuff with.

• 19:09Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 19:09Speaker 01

  Two, one third less oxygen or half the oxygen. So give me a full complement of oxygen, try and stop me now.

• 19:14Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 19:15Speaker 01

  But as you say, the problem with living and training at altitude all the time, it's really hard to do extended, long-term efforts because when you're at altitude, your maximum heart rate actually drops because there's less oxygen available to you. Your maximal aerobic capacity drops significantly.

• 19:33Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 19:34Speaker 01

  Okay. So say for example that you're at a max V O two of seventy millilitres per kilogram of body weight a minute.

• 19:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 19:40Speaker 01

  If you were training in a.

• 19:43Speaker 01

  I'm, I'm just taking plenty, but if you're training like a few thousand meters or ten, twelve, fifteen thousand feet, you might only be able to achieve a max VO2 of sixty percent, sixty milliliters. In fact, to be very exact about it, for every thousand meters or every three thousand, three hundred feet of elevation, your maximal aerobic capacity drops by between five and 10%, on average about six and a half percent in well-trained athletes. All right, so for every sort of three thousand, three hundred feet, thousand meters.

• 20:14Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 20:15Speaker 01

  Which is fine, because that's just teaching you how to deal with less oxygen. But it also means that you're not going to be able to get your body used to high intensity work.

• 20:23Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 20:23Speaker 01

  So doing that at sea level is much better. So the advantage of having a adaptation studio like this is that you can be training at low oxygen, also immediately training in a sea level environment. But even better than that, the best way to train easily at high heart rate levels, because as you're aware, when you're trying to train to develop your maximal aerobic capacity, you want to train at between ninety and a hundred percent of your max heart rate.

• 20:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:49Speaker 01

  And that's quite difficult to do. You know, you warm up really well, they're very intense efforts, you have to recover between the efforts. And a very common, for example, very common protocol that people use is called the Norwegian method.

• 21:01Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 21:01Speaker 01

  And that typically, and there's many methods, but it's one of the ones that people are most familiar with. And that involves doing four-minute intervals, all right, going pretty much as hard as you can, or going where you try to get your heart rate to ninety to a hundred percent of max.

• 21:15Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 21:15Speaker 01

  You then take two, three, four minutes recovery, and then you do another four-minute interval. So you do normally four sets of four, okay? The problem with that is, is that your aerobic energy system's quite slow to pump your max heart rate in.

• 21:28Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 21:28Speaker 01

  So if you head off, say that the pace you need to hold is six, is ten mile an hour, or sixteen kilometers an hour.

• 21:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 21:35Speaker 01

  For the effort, it might take two and a half minutes with that four-minute interval for you to get to ninety percent of your max heart rate.

• 21:42Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 21:43Speaker 01

  And then you might only be spending one and a half minutes between ninety and a hundred percent of your max heart rate. Then you have to recover, your heart rate drops all the way back, and then you build it up again. So over those four efforts, you might have spent as little as six minutes.

• 21:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 21:56Speaker 01

  In total, between ninety and a hundred percent of your max heart rate.

• 21:59Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 22:01Speaker 01

  We can totally flip that on its head by doing heat training. So a lot of people think of heat training as a way just to become more resilient in the heat and adapt to the heat.

• 22:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 22:10Speaker 01

  But it's really a super powerful tool to do max VO2 and threshold training.

• 22:15Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 22:16Speaker 01

  Because your heart rate is directly proportional to your core temperature. So when you're in a heat environment, your core temperature goes up, your heart is to beat much faster. So if we go and train in there at up, you know, between a hundred and a hundred and fifteen degrees Fahrenheit, which is accentuated by the higher the humidity is, the higher, harder it is, the higher the heat load.

• 22:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 22:36Speaker 01

  You'll find that you get to heart rate super, super easily. So all of a sudden, to get to ninety percent max heart rate happens almost automatically for you, without too much effort at all.

• 22:45Cameron Hanes?

  So you're getting a lot of, you're getting most of that four minutes where you need to be.

• 22:49Speaker 01

  So we don't even, even better than that, we have a protocol, we don't get you even to just train before and take it off, because it feels so much easier to be at ninety to a hundred percent of your max heart rate. What we do is that we just get you to warm up slowly, just gradually build up the intensity.

• 23:04Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 23:04Speaker 01

  So you don't develop too much lactate on the way up.

• 23:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 23:08Speaker 01

  Get you to ninety percent there. And then we do something like, we might get you to go at a relatively solid pace for forty seconds, and then back off for twenty seconds, not stop. So if you were running on the treadmill, and say normally when you do your four-minute efforts, you're running at ten mile an hour.

• 23:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 23:24Speaker 01

  We might get you to run at eleven mile an hour for, um, for forty seconds, and then back off to eight mile an hour for twenty. And just keep doing that. And because of the heat, your heart rate barely drops. It might drop one beat during that twenty-second period as you back off. But it means that all of a sudden, you can keep doing that for twenty minutes. And you can literally spend all twenty minutes of that in that ninety.

• 23:47Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 23:47Speaker 01

  So twenty minutes versus six minutes.

• 23:50Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 23:50Speaker 01

  Because you're in the heat, you don't even have to go at eleven mile an hour, because the heat is making the work much harder. So probably running at eight mile an hour is equivalent, in the heat, is equivalent to running at ten mile an hour in a normal temperature environment. So really, you only need to go to nine mile an hour, drop back to six, up to nine, drop back to six. And all of a sudden, you go, well, you know, I was hot and whatever, but my heart rate stayed up really well. Important thing is just to keep yourself hydrated.

• 24:17Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 24:18Speaker 01

  So you don't get what we call cardiovascular drift.

• 24:20Cameron Hanes?

  And, um, like, getting the same benefits with the slower pace is injury prevention.

• 24:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 24:28Cameron Hanes?

  In some ways.

• 24:29Speaker 01

  Less stress on your joints.

• 24:30Cameron Hanes?

  I know when I get injured, it's because I'm always running fast.

• 24:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:33Cameron Hanes?

  But if I can get the same, that's why I run the hill, is because I can go slower and get the same heart rate. Well, this, that's exactly what this is doing. It's like, it's like hills are usually, they say, um, running the hills like speed work disguised.

• 24:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:47Cameron Hanes?

  Well, this, this is the same.

• 24:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Again, it's just, it's just, Leo's got passion around the science. I'm more like the general aspect of it. It's just, low oxygen is going to put more metabolic, you know, stress on the body.

• 25:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 25:05Speaker 01

  It makes things harder. But the cool thing is, you still get the same result if you back off the mechanical load. With heat, it's the same thing. Um, so that mechanical load drop is why, you know, we've just done, we're about to do an in-saw New York Giants, um, for their team.

• 25:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 25:22Speaker 01

  You think about a roster like the New York Giants, they've got some athletes that are getting paid fairly, fairly okay.

• 25:30Cameron Hanes?

  Lot of money.

• 25:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, a lot of money. Um, one of the driving factors for them is how to keep them performing at a high level and on the paddock. And so Dr. Aaron Wellman, who's an absolute phenomenal, you know, head health and performance guy, his whole thing, his whole thesis that he did his PhD was, is load management.

• 25:51Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 25:51Speaker 01

  And one of the key breakthroughs he made in the NFL roster was using GPS to track miles and how many miles that the athlete can do effectively per week to reduce the risk of injury.

• 26:06Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 26:07Speaker 01

  So obviously.

• 26:08Cameron Hanes?

  Getting all dialed in just perfect.

• 26:09Speaker 01

  Getting dialed in. And that means it's training, it's collision, it's, it's, it's the intensity of those miles. Like, really calculated that in. So, you know, one of the things that, you know, we see with performance athletes is this new emergence of load management.

• 26:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 26:24Speaker 01

  And so we kind of fit perfectly in there, because if you're going to do your repeat sprint or your VO2 max training, you can cycle some of it in a low oxygen environment or heat environment. You don't change or you don't add extra hours onto your program, you're just changing the environment that you're doing that training in.

• 26:42Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 26:43Speaker 01

  And the idea is by taking that mechanical load off the body and still getting a really good result, you're obviously de-risking that injury factor.

• 26:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah, that's what I was thinking about. That's, that's key.

• 26:54Speaker 01

  Well, as an older athlete, that becomes critical, as you know, because that, that you're.

• 26:58Cameron Hanes?

  You're an older athlete.

• 27:00Speaker 01

  That's right. Yeah. Well, yeah, in my mid-sixties, Cam's rapidly approaching sixty. Um, yeah, the, your body takes a long time to recover from that impact type load.

• 27:11Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 27:11Speaker 01

  And so more you can do to minimize the intensity, the absolute intensity of to work at, but still get the same physiological benefits. It's a huge bonus.

• 27:20Cameron Hanes?

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• 28:05Cameron Hanes?

  at blackriflecoffee.com. Veteran-founded, American-roasted, this is America's coffee. Out in the mountains, there's no room for weak gear. When I'm packing out meat in the heat or loading up for a long-range training trip, I need a cooler that holds the line every time. That's why I use Grizzly coolers. These things are bear-proof, rugged as hell, and keep ice locked in for days, literally. I've had coolers on the trail, baking in the sun, still holding ice after hauling out elk quarters. That's performance you can count on. Whether you're running deep in the backcountry or just stacking meat for

• 28:45Cameron Hanes?

  the weekend, Grizzly is built for that grind. Don't roll with weak gear. Go Grizzly.

• 28:53Speaker 01

  You know, when you're in a moment, like, it's hard to be present.

• 28:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 28:59Speaker 01

  Like, the other thing that, being inside a, like a low oxygen environment in particular, even heat, it brings you right in the moment. I like to think, I like to think the higher you go, the more connected you are with yourself.

• 29:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I believe that.

• 29:13Speaker 01

  And even that, for, for like, busy people, today's world is just such a busy kind of, like, we're working, social media, connection with everything, especially you, Cam, like, just to be connected with the present moment, with breath.

• 29:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 29:29Speaker 01

  It's a peaceful.

• 29:30Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 29:31Speaker 01

  Aspect to it as well.

• 29:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that's, that's key. Um, I'm excited to implement that in there.

• 29:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:37Cameron Hanes?

  Um. Yeah, I was thinking like, so, oh, first of all, let's do an intro real quick. So Leo, tell me, tell the listeners about some of your background, then we'll go to Roman.

• 29:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay. So um, maybe I should talk about why I got interested in this, this whole side of science to start off with. Um, without making the story too long, um, when I was about fourteen years old, um, something quite strange happened to me. All of a sudden I had this, out of nowhere, I had this incredible growth spurt at the age of fourteen, where I grew thirteen inches in one year. So I literally went from being an average height kid in my class at five foot four to my fifteenth birthday, I was six foot five. And it's like, what the heck happened? And it was all straight up. It was, nothing was going out. So on my fifteenth birthday, I was like six foot five and fifty eight kilos. I don't know if you can imagine that, but, but trust me, I was embarrassed to go.

• 30:30Cameron Hanes?

  Hundred and twenty pounds, kind of.

• 30:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right, hundred and twenty eight pounds. And I remember I used to, at night, before I went to bed, I used to pray to God. I say, God, if you can just make it, that people don't laugh at me when I walk out the door. I'll be, I'll be a missionary for you in Africa. And I don't mean like that sort of thing. Like I was just embarrassed to walk out the door, so like scrawny.

• 30:51Cameron Hanes?

  Seems like an easy ask.

• 30:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. And at the same time, as a fourteen year old, my blood pressure was like in the two hundreds, over the high one eighties all the time. So my mum took me to the doctor and he had a look at me and it was like, look, I can't be sure, we need to run some tests, but.

• 31:07Cameron Hanes?

  He's an alien.

• 31:08Speaker 01

  He might have. It's a very rare form of cancer he may have that's causing this. So my mum wanted to hear nothing of that until the end. It wasn't until I was in the air force years later, they tested me for and discovered I had this very rare, um, neuroendocrine cancer called carcinoid syndrome. And the main thing it does is just get, it's a very slow growing form of cancer, um, clear cells, that your body produces way too much of particular hormones. And this, it, it starts off with you produce too much growth hormone, which explains the growth spurt. But then it goes to where your body produces too much of all sorts of hormones, but in particular serotonin. And that might sound like a really good thing.

• 31:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 31:46Speaker 01

  Because serotonin is like feel good hormone. It's a hormone, you know, if you go on antidepressant, you go on serotonin reuptake inhibitors, which keeps your serotonin levels up.

• 31:55Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 31:56Speaker 01

  But we know that too much of anything is just as bad as not enough of something. You've got to be in the middle and the balance. So, um, the thing was that I went for years just feeling amazing. I'd never experienced stress, I never experienced anxiety, depression. I, I, and I was super non-empathetic towards everyone else. Cause I could never understand why anyone had a problem with anything. No, I mean, I just felt great all the time.

• 32:18Cameron Hanes?

  Cause you were like, had serotonin flowing.

• 32:20Speaker 01

  That's right. I was just like, you know, soaked with serotonin and going like, bring it on sort of thing. Um, I didn't know at the time, at the same time I was bipolar and, um.

• 32:28Speaker 02

  He was skinny, but he had a lot of good.

• 32:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right. So I was just in this very manic productive state all the time. And what normally happens if, if you're bipolar is that you have this manic phase, like everyone gets manic. All right. The difference is with a bipolar person is they can sustain the mania for a much longer period of time, normally a week or so. And then what goes up must come down, sort of thing. And then they go into a depression. I mean, that's just the normal cycle. That's just exaggerated from what people normally experience. Problem is, because I was producing so much serotonin, I was never going down into this depressive state. So I just had this crazy, and people think this is going to sound ridiculous, but it's an unusual combination of this, um, carcinoid syndrome bipolar. I had a manic state for twenty five years nonstop, until finally my body had to crash.

• 33:15Cameron Hanes?

  Well, what's a manic, like, what was that?

• 33:18Speaker 01

  Well, so being manic just means that you're super driven, have lots of energy all the time, you're ultra productive. You don't need to sleep much, you can just work long hours, work at a super high intensity.

• 33:29Cameron Hanes?

  I see.

• 33:29Speaker 01

  And you're never getting, giving your body a chance to recover and settle down. And the serotonin was stopping that normal cycle from happening. But just like with type two diabetics, where if you produce too much insulin all the time, your body becomes very insensitive to insulin. It doesn't, insulin can't carry out its job. Same with serotonin. If you produce too mu- too much serotonin for too long, all of a sudden your body's receptors to it shut down.

• 33:53Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 33:54Speaker 01

  I got to the age of forty, twenty five years ago or so, quarter of a century ago now, where I had all this period of never feeling stressed, never feeling depressed or anxious, until finally my serotonin receptors just shut off. And I had the most epic nervous breakdown of all time.

• 34:10Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, no.

• 34:11Speaker 01

  Just this massive crash. And I literally was in a position where I didn't see how I was gonna live, you know, keep going for another second. I, I wasn't suicidal, but I was hoping that when I, you know, went across the road, a Mack truck had hit me.

• 34:25Cameron Hanes?

  You were miserable.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  I'm miserable, no, because I didn't want to have to do that myself, but I was just, I was in this deep hole, I couldn't pull myself out of.

• 34:32Cameron Hanes?

  Wow.

• 34:32Speaker 01

  So I had to, over the years, learn how to pull myself out of that. And a big part of that was learning how to, once again, deal with anxiety, deal with depression, deal with stress. Cause I'd gone for forty years of my life with no exposure to that, no coping mechanisms. So that's where I developed our, our Young Wellness Method off the back of that. Originally, when I'd been developed with carcinoid syndrome when I was younger, that's when I went and studied sports science and nutrition. And I became a sports and, you know, an exercise and nutrition scientist. But yeah, I had to take it to a new level after this nervous breakdown and learn, okay, how do I build myself back up? How do I learn to be in the moment? How to, you know, be present, learn to smell the roses or whatever.

• 35:15Speaker 01

  And essentially the philosophies I developed from that are what are the underlying foundation and protocols of the methods we use in this stress environment to teach people how to be more emotionally composed, to be more resilient, so.

• 35:29Cameron Hanes?

  So it was, it was part of your personal challenges?

• 35:32Speaker 01

  Survival was, it's for my own survival, I had to develop these protocols.

• 35:36Cameron Hanes?

  And then, did you find that the oxygen depletion was like the biggest stimulus?

• 35:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's because oxygen depletion is from a primal point of view, from the way in which we're programmed. The most acute stress the body can be under, and if you can learn to deal with that, then you can deal with everything, so.

• 35:54Cameron Hanes?

  It's like, it's like, sort of like the cold plunge, but even better.

• 35:58Speaker 01

  Exactly. And that's, and a lot of people misunderstand the value of cold plunges. The most valuable thing about a cold plunge is putting yourself in what's, for a lot of people, extremely uncomfortable and stressful situations. And learning to just compose yourself, totally calm about it and go, I'm gonna embrace this, I feel.

• 36:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's like resilience.

• 36:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. So people should understand, if you get into an ice bath and you go off like a pork chop, like, you know, puffing and panting and screaming and wanting to get out of there.

• 36:26Speaker 02

  Too much.

• 36:27Speaker 01

  Then all you're doing is that you're.

• 36:29Speaker 02

  Doubling down.

• 36:30Speaker 01

  Doubling down on the stress. Whereas you're gonna embrace it, calm down. So for a lot of people, if they haven't got access to this, like, ice baths are a really valuable tool. It's not so much about recovery and all those sorts of things. That's all good. It's about use that as a controlled stress environment and teach yourself how to deal with it better. Cause a lot of people, they go, there's no way I can hop into that. They put their feet in the wall, that's impossible, that's too stressful for me. There's a lot of people can't even deal with finishing off with a cold shower. I mean, I haven't, I haven't had a hot shower in decades.

• 37:01Speaker 02

  But that goes back to that dose mentality. Get the dose right and progressively work yourself up to a point where you're, you're still in control of it. So it does, does, doesn't double down onto that trauma response.

• 37:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah, for sure.

• 37:13Speaker 01

  Only expose yourself to what you're capable of dealing with. And that's what we do in here, even with the elders training. We only get you to push yourself as much as you can deal with and then see if you can recover and regulate from that. Okay, you now can do that. Now we'll up the intensity or the duration a bit more, prove that you can re-regulate yourself to that. And keep, no different to how you build your miles up training for a marathon.

• 37:34Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah, definitely. Um, yeah, that's a great background. Thank you. Uh, Roman.

• 37:40Speaker 02

  Well, I guess, uh, my backgrounds and my journey towards where we are now is a little bit different. But um, country boy in New South Wales, which is in Australia, so a small town. And my passion early was sports, so rugby union, and I was really connected to that dream. You know, my parents were really supportive in that dream and, yeah, we, we, we grew up with what we needed, but not too much else than that. So it was kind of that story where this was the ticket to get mum and dad a house and get myself into a better, a better lifestyle for myself. And that was my journey as a kid, uh, very hyperactive, always in trouble, couldn't stay still, you know, probably.

• 38:23Speaker 01

  Hasn't changed.

• 38:23Speaker 02

  Hasn't changed much. Um, so yeah, misunderstood a lot of the time, like, but I was very driven, always have been very driven. And I put everything I could into that dream. And when.

• 38:37Speaker 02

  When kids were playing around with other kids, I was at home kicking goals, doing sprints, like I was just, just a maniac when it came to it.

• 38:46Cameron Hanes?

  Training.

• 38:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, I lived on a little farm, a hundred acres, so I was pretty isolated. So we didn't get a chance to get into town and do the parties and stuff. So it was me and my dog and a football. And, you know, I'd go into school, like I said, I was always in trouble. But I had this kind of energy about me that was connected to the principal. Or maybe because I was always at the principal's office. So like, I had my principals that just loved me. Right? Whenever you play up, tell him to come to the principal's office. And they used to give me these jobs to do, like rearrange the bookcase. Yeah, go for a run around the oval, you know? I got A D H D really early and then they put me on certain medication for it. And it changed me as a human.

• 39:32Speaker 02

  My dad walked into school and said, take him off that and changed. I don't know who that kid is. You better cope with this if he's acting up. Yeah. So that was kind of my childhood and then, uh, but, you know, I used to, my dad used to go to all my football games and video me.

• 39:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 39:48Speaker 02

  So the analytical part came from that. I would come home, we had the V H S back then. And I would do all my stats, cause I'd seen on T V that some of my idols, they would know what their stats are.

• 40:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 40:02Speaker 02

  I would do all my stats, then I'd do the stats of my teammates. And I would say, hey, we've got to be effort players. You guys aren't putting the effort, you only did three hitups. You didn't do your effort based indicators. So I was that at year eleven, uh, age eleven, twelve, thirteen. But I guess my story was everything was catered towards that goal. So I was really passionate about improvement, performance. Um, and I was lucky enough to go to a boarding school free of charge. So that was like, what would they call it here in America? For us, a boarding school was a rugby school with a really good co-curricula, a great support system.

• 40:40Cameron Hanes?

  They got the, like, the Olympic training.

• 40:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, kind of like that. And then that changed my life from outside of the football pitch. I started to have mentors that could educate me around, you know, how life works, how to buy a house, how to get myself set up. So that took me through until, um, I made a lot of representative teams and then finished school. And unfortunately, on my last year of school, I did my A C L. So when I left school, I was going straight into a professional career. And as I went into that professional career, I was on rehab. But the way my mind worked, I had to make this happen. So I pushed myself way too hard. I was lying to the coaches about me being completely fine and I did it again.

• 41:27Speaker 02

  And then I did it again. So within, from seventeen years old to twenty, I'd done four A C Ls. On the same knee.

• 41:37Cameron Hanes?

  Dang.

• 41:38Speaker 02

  So that was it, career over. And that was devastating for me, like that was probably the first time I'd ever felt rock bottom. Um, you know, you can imagine you're ringing your parents up and saying it's all over. It's done. Everything you did for me.

• 41:53Cameron Hanes?

  Dream.

• 41:54Speaker 02

  Dream's done. I kind of lost myself for a period of two years. Um, made my way to another town in Australia and it was a big mining town. I guess this is one of the key aspects of how I got to where I am now. Um, I wanted to get into mining, they paid good, you can fly, fly in, fly out. So I went to university and did more of an engineering kind of background. Um, and started working with the mining manufacturer and, you know, through that met mentors about reading books and, you know, I never read a book before. So I read books from cover to cover and got onto YouTube, listened to all the self-help stuff and just really kind of recreated myself in that period of my low twenties.

• 42:37Speaker 02

  And become really interested in business and business models and that type of entrepreneurial spirit. So that's kind of what drove that competitive edge in me. And I started to have another passion now, another dream. Then I went and did my M B A and then just started up a few, few little businesses just to try it. And I ended up working my way up to a corporate job where I was doing pretty well as a C E O, um, before I was thirty and having some success. But with success, I'd never had money before in my life.

• 43:17Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 43:17Speaker 02

  So all of a sudden I had all this money and for about two to three years, I lost myself in it. So I had to re kind of build myself up. And one thing was getting back connected to team sports and started coaching. And then I created a concept around group training, but the whole group training area of thirty to forty people training was at low oxygen. So I launched that and that scaled to about, you know, forty to fifty studios, three different countries. And that's where we cross paths.

• 43:55Cameron Hanes?

  I see.

• 43:55Speaker 02

  And Leo, obviously with his background story, um, he had attempted to introduce a concept similar to what I was doing in his own career. And he had seen what I was doing, I'd heard about Leo and then we connected. And once we connected, I was really doing it from a team cultural perspective. You know, I loved having that team camaraderie, doing something different. But the business side of it was really compelling to me. I met Leo and he started to look at what I was doing. And his philosophy and what I was trying to create as well, and so we used to think called Focus Through Fatigue. His is the young method.

• 44:35Speaker 02

  It was very similar, but with his mentorship, I started to implement his methods into what I was doing. And I had a huge amount of like self-discovery. But what Leo was saying about this manic phase, this has been me ever since I was born. I've been in a manic phase. I have big crashes though, you know, where I'm flawed. So that's how we connected and, um, you know, coming into what is now Exalt X P, uh, the evolution of what that was has just evolved into what Leo's brought to it, what I've brought to it. And then there was a really pivotal moment with my partner, Victoria,

• 45:15Speaker 02

  who was having a margarita with somebody and their husband was a hunter. And he said, I go to Mongolia for these hunts, like he's a hugely passionate hunter. He lives in Dallas. And he said, can I get one of these at my house?

• 45:31Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 45:31Speaker 02

  So rather than this commercial gym fit out.

• 45:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 45:35Speaker 02

  I just want one in my house. Why was the question? Cause I'm a hunter and I get really nervous when I do elevation hunts. Cause there's nothing I can do to prepare for it. When I get there, I mean, I get elevation sickness. It just absolutely tears me apart. And if I can do this at home, I don't have to fly away weeks before, acclimate and still get sick.

• 45:57Cameron Hanes?

  Right, yeah.

• 45:58Speaker 02

  And so we were like this hunting industry. Like what, what, what is the scope of it? It's sounded quite niche.

• 46:06Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:06Speaker 02

  But with some investigation, um, one of the guys that lives really close to me, Adam Greentree, a buddy of yours.

• 46:13Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:13Speaker 02

  He was like doing hunting and we were like, okay, let's connect with Adam. Then, then there's a, a corporation called Safari Club International. We started educating ourselves on what the hunting community was in the U S and we were blown away. Okay. So we thought we had a product simplicity, simplistically just for elevation acclimation. Right? But we wanted to bring what we've learnt in the past to the industry. And I guess that's how it all kind of organically evolved into what it is. And, you know, obviously now we're super grateful to meet guys like yourself,

• 46:52Speaker 02

  uh, that come from that hunting community. One thing we've learnt really quickly is that we thought just using it as an acclimation tool was what people wanted. But then we start meeting people like yourself and Joe and other people that are very in tune with hunting. But they're very much students about how can we get that one percent extra.

• 47:16Cameron Hanes?

  The self-improvement.

• 47:17Speaker 02

  Self-improvement piece.

• 47:18Cameron Hanes?

  I've been shooting Hoyt for over twenty years now and they're a lifetime partner of mine. That's not something I take lightly. I stay with partners that prove themselves and Hoyt continues to do that year after year. They shattered the industry standards and built the A X ninety, the first ninety pound bow to exist and be offered to consumers. Why? Because I want a hard hitting arrow delivered with enough force to push through, say a rib or the edge of a shoulder blade. Because it's bow hunting, not every shot is going to be perfect. But when the animal reacts, or maybe I don't make the most perfect shot,

• 47:58Cameron Hanes?

  I still want to deliver a lethal arrow and a ninety pound bow gives me more room for error. Unfortunately, they don't offer discounts on bows. But if you want to grab some Hoyt merch or selected accessories, you can use my code CAM for twenty percent off. If you're serious about archery and you want something you can rely on, shoot a Hoyt. Get serious, get Hoyt and keep hammering.

• 48:26Cameron Hanes?

  One of the hardest parts of hunting is glassing big country to find animals you know are there. That's why I run Sig Sauer Zulu Imaging Stabilizing Binoculars when I'm covering a lot of ground and need to see everything. These binos are a complete game changer. After long climbs, when your heart rate's up and your hands are steady, shaky glass makes it hard to stay locked in. With image stabilization, everything settles down. You can slow the process, really pick apart the country and catch movement you'd normally miss. I've found more animals and saved a ton of time because of these binos. I actually just talked about how impressive this technology is

• 49:07Cameron Hanes?

  on the most recent episode of the Joe Rogan Experience. Once you use stabilized glass, it's hard to go back. It gives you a real advantage when you're hunting big, open terrain. And here's the rare part, optics companies almost never offer discounts, but Sig is giving listeners of this podcast 10% off. Just use code CAM at checkout. So if you're serious about glassing and want the same edge I've had the past couple of seasons, head to sigsauer.com, grab a pair of Zulu binos and use code CAM for 10% off. Sig Sauer Zulu Binoculars. See more, miss less, keep hammering.

• 49:46Speaker 02

  So this is where we've landed and super grateful for it. And you know, I guess our life story built it to where it is now. Yeah. So it's pretty beautiful. When you look at the convergence of different energies and how you all come together and connect and yeah.

• 50:02Cameron Hanes?

  So what's changed since you guys were here the first time? Was that, when was that, a month ago?

• 50:07Speaker 02

  A month ago, yeah.

• 50:08Cameron Hanes?

  And so at that time, um, yeah, I was changing the last month. It seems like it's been a crazy month.

• 50:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, a lot that's happened. Well, yeah, we, we, the concept was making this accessible to residential homes. Um, one of the clunky factors of when you're doing retrofits is permits, it's builders coming in and out. So we created like a design which is out of the box. It's modulated. You can literally bring it in flat packs. And as you would have seen here, they take it out, they pop it up, and then it's the connection with the electrical that takes a little bit of time. But actually putting the studio together is either an hour to three hours depending on the size of it. So that took a while to, uh, to go through research and development. When we came here to you a month ago, um, you

• 51:00Speaker 02

  know, you led us to, to Joe finally saying, let's get one in my studio. So he was on vacation, Italy. So we had flown back to Oz, come back, set Joe up. Um, we've connected to some amazing people. And yeah, in the last month, it's just been a whirlwind, to be honest, like something that we're both super grateful for. And yeah, we went back to Oz, came back here, we've done another install, Joe's in Austin. We've spent some time with him. I went back to Baltimore, caught up with Kip, met a few more people. There's a huge amount of interest. Um, spent a lot of time with Gunnar Peterson, who's done a lot of work with, you know, uh, what he's done

• 51:45Speaker 02

  in the background with LA Lakers and, you know, the famous people, I guess, if you want to call it that, but he's just a phenomenal human being.

• 51:52Cameron Hanes?

  Super nice guy.

• 51:53Speaker 02

  So it's just been a whirlwind of just connections and meeting people and, you know, something that we're really grateful for. And we've only got four studios operating at the moment, like back home in Oz, we was our first install with Genesis Health and Fitness, which is like a big box club. Yeah. We did a four week pilot program with their coaches and their owners and some of their members, just to see the proofs in the pudding.

• 52:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 52:15Speaker 02

  And their results were fucking insane.

• 52:18Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 52:18Speaker 02

  Insane.

• 52:19Cameron Hanes?

  Wow.

• 52:19Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 52:20Speaker 01

  It looks laid up when you see it. When we publish it, people go, this is bullshit. This can't be true.

• 52:24Cameron Hanes?

  Is it like strength or cardio?

• 52:27Speaker 02

  Metrics, VO2 max.

• 52:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 52:30Speaker 02

  Peak power output, body composition markers, heat tolerance, altitude tolerance, mobility testing, uh, and everything just moved.

• 52:40Speaker 01

  And all the psychometric.

• 52:41Speaker 02

  Psychometric markers. So subjective stuff like how did I stay? How do I feel?

• 52:45Cameron Hanes?

  Do you have a, do you have a reference on how much better it is in that like, if the improvement was 10% improvement normally, what is it?

• 52:54Speaker 02

  On average, the VO2 max across 25 people.

• 52:58Speaker 01

  A lot of them were already well-trained.

• 53:00Speaker 02

  Moved 13%.

• 53:02Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 53:02Speaker 02

  In four weeks.

• 53:03Cameron Hanes?

  That's a lot.

• 53:04Speaker 02

  The peak power output went up 14.3% in four weeks, which means on an erg, let's say a bionic bike or a ski erg, my max power output in wattage went up by 15. That's on average.

• 53:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 53:18Speaker 02

  And it's mobility went up by like, you know, percent as well. Like I don't have the exact numbers to throw off the top of my head, but it was just crazy. And the testimonial videos, it's like they're actors.

• 53:28Speaker 01

  But some of the individual.

• 53:30Speaker 02

  Hate to say what we wanted to do.

• 53:32Cameron Hanes?

  He's fake.

• 53:32Speaker 02

  But you know, the thing, the thing that I found about actually putting it into action, I'm super like looking forward to your journey with it as I am with Joe and Kip.

• 53:42Speaker 02

  It's just that mental resilience that they're, they're feeling and they're feeling, they're just feeling so much more confident in everyday tasks. Yeah. It's a different profile for them. You know, they're not an elite performer, some of them are, but mainly are just looking for their confidence back.

• 53:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 53:58Speaker 02

  Just, I want to be able to do life better and easier.

• 54:02Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 54:02Speaker 02

  And it's just this huge connection across 25 people that are saying, everything feels easier.

• 54:09Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 54:09Speaker 02

  Like mowing the lawn feels easier.

• 54:11Cameron Hanes?

  Amazing.

• 54:12Speaker 02

  Getting up out of bed, I get up, I spring out of bed, you know, and the way that the journey worked from the first week, a lot of that stress was translating into, oh, I'm lethargic. Second week, still challenging. Third week, huh, fourth week. Then we finished the pilot program. We miss everyone. Like, why can't we keep doing this? You know, it was, you know, a really good connection that brought it. So, so that's what we've been doing the last, you know.

• 54:38Speaker 01

  And a lot of the stuff that's happened since we saw you last was triggered by the video you posted of your workout with us here. So I was super thankful for that because that just had, in a sense, went fairly viral for us in terms of the people that reached out and just brought a lot of connection to us. And it's going to give us the opportunity to really.

• 54:55Speaker 02

  But for you, Cam, like when you did it, was it, you've done so much. And I've asked this question to a lot of people. What was the, I guess, what was your thought process going into it? And then after the experience with heat and after the experience with the altitude, what shifted in terms of your, your expectations versus what you'll actually, actually receive from it?

• 55:19Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I liked it because, you know, when you want to improve, you need to hurt.

• 55:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:23Cameron Hanes?

  Right? And as you said earlier, getting your heart rate up, sometimes that's related to hurting because you're pushing, you're pushing harder. So your body has to, you're asking more of your body. Um, what I noticed was I got to that place very fast.

• 55:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:38Cameron Hanes?

  And so again, you're spending more time in that place. Your body has to respond and the response with improvements to be able to take on that load. Um, and even today, which today was more of a recovery because I had that really hard, long hunt. So we didn't want to go too, too crazy, but even being in a low oxygen environment right now feels to me like a little boost. Like my body's like, oh, we made it through that. Now we got all the oxygen we need. Sweet. Life's good. So you get like a little, kind of like a dopamine hit, or maybe it's serotonin. I don't know what it is. But, uh, but yeah, I haven't done a ton because I was gone for so long, but the ones, the workouts I've done have been incredible.

• 56:18Speaker 02

  You know, what you said, it gets to that point quicker. Like I've coached a lot of people, like, you know, different ranges of, you know, trained athletes versus untrained athletes. When we trained together in the heat.

• 56:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 56:32Speaker 02

  You would like softly murmur, we're here.

• 56:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yep.

• 56:37Speaker 02

  We're here.

• 56:37Cameron Hanes?

  That's it.

• 56:38Speaker 02

  And I could notice, and I, I thought you were talking to me and I, I heard you say it a couple of times and we, we spoke about it after. I said, what was that all about? You're like, you're saying, oh, we're here. And you were, you said to me, you were announcing the moment where you like to get to.

• 56:53Cameron Hanes?

  Right. Finally, yeah. That's where you want to get. Sometimes it, sometimes you can't get there.

• 56:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:57Cameron Hanes?

  But with this, you get there so fast.

• 56:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:59Cameron Hanes?

  Which is why I loved it.

• 57:01Speaker 02

  A lot of people get to that moment and go, huh.

• 57:04Cameron Hanes?

  They quit.

• 57:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:05Cameron Hanes?

  But you just, if you can push through, that's where the adaptation comes. Definitely. It's a, yeah, it's incredible. Um, what did, what did Joe think of it? Like, I'd be interested here.

• 57:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, look, Ryan did the first session with him. I've done sessions since, but.

• 57:20Speaker 02

  Well, I think, I think, you know, like with Joe, we connected obviously through Adam and then through you. When I got there for Joe's first session, um, Joe's actually such a trained, disciplined athlete. And I don't know too much about what Joe's done in the past. I know he's obviously into MMA and mixed martial arts and he's quite disciplined in terms of what he's done in the past, but you know, very committed. He was like a student, like very easy to coach. And the breathing, the breath work, we went through that process before the session. And I just said to Joe, look, just work within your body, but just be really connected with it. He, he was, he was dialed in.

• 58:03Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:04Speaker 02

  From the start.

• 58:04Cameron Hanes?

  Definitely. I'm sure.

• 58:05Speaker 02

  So we did the session and, um, we finished off, it was just a circuit based session, you know, an A, B, A, B between cardio and his kettlebells.

• 58:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:16Speaker 02

  And then at the back end of the session, um, There was some, you know, like some, some noise like, you know, like,

• 58:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, good.

• 58:24Speaker 02

  Big, deep breathing during it. We're testing his blood stats and you could tell that he was fully accepting the environment because his saturations were dropping.

• 58:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:32Speaker 02

  You know, he was really, really connected with that. And then uh after it, we had this fucking incredible moment. Like I had an incredible moment with you today. It's just after we lay down, we just be really grounded. We do a bit of a mindset, breath work. And one thing I realized about Joe was like, like a lot of us, we've got so much shit going on in our lives. And just that moment of three or so minutes where we're fully connected to the now.

• 58:59Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 59:00Speaker 02

  Meant a lot to him.

• 59:01Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 59:01Speaker 02

  You know, and we.

• 59:02Cameron Hanes?

  It's like he likes archery too.

• 59:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:03Cameron Hanes?

  And playing pool, just so he can just shut off everything else and focus on those things.

• 59:07Speaker 02

  Yeah. So we had a really good connection and uh we got out of it, had a bro hug and you know, came out, reflected on the session. And since that time, he's done a couple more sessions. He's trained with, with Leo as well. And after this, Leo's shooting back down to Austin to make sure he's got his momentum and get ready for elk season.

• 59:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 59:26Speaker 02

  With you guys.

• 59:26Cameron Hanes?

  He's gonna be so pumped. I'd love to see it.

• 59:28Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 59:29Cameron Hanes?

  He, he's really excited.

• 59:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 59:31Cameron Hanes?

  But it's like, it's, I love this new science. I love this new, you know, like the optimization thing has been kind of going crazy, but this one seems like the most, the biggest, most legit one. Cause it's proven, everybody knows you wanna get, you know, better at whatever, you go training at altitude.

• 59:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:49Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, so now you'll have to go.

• 59:50Speaker 02

  And when you look at the simplicity of what Exalt XP has done, we've just brought the mountains to your back door.

• 59:58Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm, yeah.

• 59:58Speaker 02

  That's the problem that we've solved. And with what you've heard about Leo's story is, and what my experience has been with practically using this with thousands of people, we've just come up with a method that's more about how you can embrace the right amount of stress and get through it. Like do some hard shit to then become or get closer to your human potential.

• 1:00:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:29Speaker 02

  For everyone. So your question at the start was, who was this built for in mine? Like what I've started to realize that anyone that has ambition or anyone that wants to progress their life in a better direction, this is for them.

• 1:00:47Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:00:47Speaker 02

  Doesn't have to be an elite athlete. Could be just a mother that wants to be better at being a mother. Could be a father that just wants to be more present at home, could be a businessman, could be my son. Like I've used this on my son the last 12 months. It's changed his life.

• 1:01:02Cameron Hanes?

  Wow.

• 1:01:03Speaker 02

  And there are specific metrics that have shown that.

• 1:01:06Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:01:07Speaker 02

  He didn't make his local rep team last year. Now he's in the New South Wales Waratahs team, which is huge.

• 1:01:14Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  He could not let his sister get the better of him at home. Now when she acts out, he's fully calm.

• 1:01:22Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:01:22Speaker 02

  At, at school, he's calm around his friends, his friends, you, you know what I mean? There's just so much transference in terms of regulating your emotions.

• 1:01:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:31Speaker 02

  And like for me as a father to my son, what better person to build this for?

• 1:01:35Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, for sure.

• 1:01:36Speaker 02

  You know what I mean?

• 1:01:37Cameron Hanes?

  It's the future, yeah.

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  It's the future. It's the next generation.

• 1:01:39Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:01:40Speaker 02

  You know, so much so that I'm like, my legacy statement with this now has changed. I want this, I want our method uh to be passed down to the next generation. And I actually have a theory around not needing the low oxygen environment to pass it down. It's purely and simply like, think about kids' sports. This is something that's really driven me the last few weeks. Kids' sports is the perfect place to teach kids how to regulate.

• 1:02:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:11Speaker 02

  Because they're attentive.

• 1:02:12Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 1:02:12Speaker 02

  It's fun, but not many people coach that downtime in between reps.

• 1:02:18Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:18Speaker 02

  Right. Today, when we train, I said a highlight, yeah, the breathing part and the state management. We'll do like a pitch if it's baseball, if it's archery, right? Archery is different. Actually, I think that's a really good discipline because you're really focused with your breath and in being in the moment. But like if it's, you know, little league, if it's football, whatever it might be, soccer. When we do like, if we're just doing our S and C part, we're doing sprints to get our, our cardiovascular. That rest period, no one cares about that.

• 1:02:46Cameron Hanes?

  No.

• 1:02:47Speaker 02

  No one thinks about, no one coaches that.

• 1:02:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:49Speaker 02

  My, my theory and my vision is if we consciously taught coaches on how to practically come up with a strategy in that downtime, that is so many regulation sets that the kids will do, that then they become calmer at school, calmer at home, like be able to collect their thoughts without acting out. Like that could be huge.

• 1:03:14Cameron Hanes?

  Oh yeah, that's great.

• 1:03:15Speaker 02

  So anyway, I, just in terms of like what I've seen it do and using it for, you know, obviously family, having it here, you know, I'd love to see, you know, I'd love to see uh, you know, your family use it.

• 1:03:28Cameron Hanes?

  Oh yeah, my boys look at that.

• 1:03:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:03:32Cameron Hanes?

  Um, yeah, what, what, so what's the goal? I mean, where's it going now? So we got, did New York Giants order one? Is that right?

• 1:03:40Speaker 02

  Joe, me. Yep, you, Joe, Kip, uh Genesis Health and Fitness in Oz. We've got wellness companies coming on board in the Baltimore area. They want to do five. They've got five studios. We've just met with Division One Training down at Nashville, who have got like 200 facilities. Um, we'll get them going in uh one, make sure within their ecosystem it works. Um, we've got a lot of individuals reaching out to us uh that are really keen on optimizing their performance for whatever reason, that want a home residential in store. Um, so it, it's cool.

• 1:04:21Speaker 02

  So I think of it like pro athlete sports, you know, um, I think of it like chains that have an ability to like prototype one, pilot it, and if it works, roll it across their chains. That could be gyms. It could be wellness centers.

• 1:04:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:37Speaker 02

  And then just individuals and depending on the individual, like at a residential in store, it could be a hunter that's looking to acclimate or be better in the moment.

• 1:04:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:48Speaker 02

  Like even listening to your story, you made one shot recently.

• 1:04:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:52Speaker 02

  And how long were you um up at British Columbia?

• 1:04:55Cameron Hanes?

  Day fifteen.

• 1:04:56Speaker 02

  Day fifteen for one shot.

• 1:04:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:59Speaker 02

  Now, being in that moment, you executed it, right? And like, you know, we, we've listened to James and you've got a whole support staff behind you. That one shot, being in the moment, being able to deal with that moment and embrace it and then obviously you're very trained. But think of that analogy into making a call, a sales call, making that moment, making the shot work. You know, there's so many things that this translates to being in the moment, being able to execute when it matters, focus through fatigue, you know, like all of that stuff. So individuals are looking for that ability and also that 1% advantage. We can see that being such a range

• 1:05:38Speaker 02

  of people. So I mean, from a business perspective, what we want to do is just focus on quality, making sure that our clients and our customers have got a great customer service. And you know, it's early stages, but definitely the swell's moving in the right direction.

• 1:05:55Cameron Hanes?

  The most successful people in business, sports and everything else are those who can deal with stress best.

• 1:06:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:01Cameron Hanes?

  I think of like Tom Brady, the quarterback, when he was with the Patriots. I mean, he had to be able to have the confidence that he could get that ball in there and make the perfect throw. And so he's, he's naturally calm in those moments because you have to be. But that's what we're trying to make available for people who aren't Tom Brady.

• 1:06:19Speaker 02

  And that's the common factor between all the various people who can vent it from this. And that's that ability to main, maintain even emotional composure.

• 1:06:27Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:06:28Speaker 02

  Under stress.

• 1:06:29Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 1:06:29Speaker 02

  Um, and not just performing in life, but just it's, it, it turns out that it's the most important ingredient for, ingredient for success in life altogether. So if, if I've got a second, I'll explain to you.

• 1:06:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:43Speaker 02

  Biggest scientific study that was ever done, um, that clearly demonstrates this point. So back in the early seventies, there was a university on the South Island of New Zealand called Dunedin University. They decided to do a really interesting experiment. This is roughly around seventy two, seventy three. And look, I won't get all my facts exactly right here, but hopefully the, the general thrust is on point. So what they decided to do, the psychology department there is they wanted to do this unique experience when that year they wanted to test every child that was born in the city of Dunedin and then wanted to track them for the rest of their lives. Okay. So they did something along the lines of every woman that was pregnant.

• 1:07:23Speaker 02

  They'd go visit her, they'd do a psychoanalysis, you know, so psychometric tests on her. Find out what her background is. What does your husband do? You know, what does your family do? Sort of work do you have? What was the family situation like?

• 1:07:37Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:07:37Speaker 02

  Then she has a child, they do run all the tests on the child when they're born, see them again, maybe when they're a few months old, a year old in three years, and then see them every three years for the rest of their life.

• 1:07:47Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:07:47Speaker 02

  Still to this day.

• 1:07:48Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 1:07:49Speaker 02

  Still to this day. And so fifty odd years later, it's still going. They started off with a thousand odd children and there's just under a thousand people still in the study.

• 1:07:57Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:07:58Speaker 02

  Almost no one's fallen out of the study voluntarily. People, people have died in that time and that sort of thing. But though what they did that was really cool is they released all their data, made it open source. So universities all around the world could look at the data, tease it and try and draw correlations from it.

• 1:08:15Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:08:16Speaker 02

  What they wanted to do is they wanted to see whether any particular factors that were very predictive in terms of people's long-term health, their long-term wealth and happiness.

• 1:08:28Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:08:28Speaker 02

  Okay. And they looked at everything. And at the end of the day, there's only one factor that came up as a being a determinant for lifelong success, wealth, happiness, all that sort of thing. And that was a child's ability to maintain even emotional composure, to be able to regulate their emotions.

• 1:08:46Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 1:08:46Speaker 02

  So we've all seen it, you know, you're in the shopping center, mum's got the kid in the trolley, they're going down the aisle, the kid's grabbing everything off the shelves and throwing it and telling mum they want an either lolly or a nice gram, whatever. Mum's telling them no, and so they throw a tantrum and everyone sort of raises their eyebrows and go, this woman's got no idea how to control a child.

• 1:09:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:06Speaker 01

  Um, but I think we all discover if we have more than one child that they have very unique pers- personality. So often people have their first child that's very compliant and very composed. And the second one comes along and all of a sudden they discover it's totally the opposite personality. They had nothing to do with them and everything just to do with.

• 1:09:24Speaker 02

  So be careful before you judge.

• 1:09:25Speaker 01

  That's right. And there's other people, there's other people that have a child wants to think, I can't possibly do this again. This is impossible. They have the second child that's much easier. So, but what they discovered is that if a, if a child can develop by the age of five, six, seven, eight. I'm not sure what the age was, but if they can learn to regulate their emotions, in other words, we're not talking about suppressing your emotions. We're just talking about when you're feeling stressed.

• 1:09:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:48Speaker 01

  When you're feeling anxious.

• 1:09:49Speaker 02

  Take a beat.

• 1:09:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:50Speaker 02

  You know, like that kid in the, in the trolley takes a beat, doesn't get what it wants.

• 1:09:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. Assesses it and go, okay.

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  And doesn't spew their emotions all over everyone around them. All right. So what they discovered is that almost with that fail, there was an amazing correlation that kids that could regulate their emotions went on to become successful. Now, by success, I mean that they were content with what they did with their lives. But they also had very good health.

• 1:10:15Speaker 02

  Health, wealth.

• 1:10:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, everything. And it tracked beautifully. But the kids that didn't were the kids that ended up being unemployed or in jail or committing suicide or drug addicts. It was, it was.

• 1:10:24Cameron Hanes?

  And what was the stimulus that they used for this?

• 1:10:27Speaker 01

  No stimulus, just tracking them and just, and what they did is they tracked that.

• 1:10:31Speaker 02

  No train, there was no training, there was no method. It was just observing and seeing what.

• 1:10:37Speaker 01

  When they do a test to rate how well good a kid was at regulating themselves.

• 1:10:42Cameron Hanes?

  Better.

• 1:10:42Speaker 01

  Those kids were inevitably successful. Those that couldn't regulate their emotions inevitably had a pretty tough life. Now, what they discovered is that, say, for example, a kid ended up in jail, like hit rock bottom, but they managed to turn their life around. It's pretty tough. It's much, much easier if you teach your child when they're very young, it becomes a life habit. But people can still turn it around. So whilst it was very difficult for people to learn that later on in life, if they did learn how to regulate their emotions, they inevitably could turn their life around and become successful. And the other trait they found that's very closely linked to that is the ability to delay gratification.

• 1:11:18Speaker 02

  Mm hmm. Yep.

• 1:11:19Speaker 01

  And there's another very famous experiment was done that sometimes we call the marshmallow experiment. Where you get some young kids, you sit them down and you put a single marshmallow in front of them. Know what I mean? And you go now, this marshmallow is for you to have. You can have that right now. All right. Or you can decide to wait for a couple of minutes and we're going to give you a second marshmallow and you get two. So you can either have that now and that's it, no second marshmallow, or you wait. I'm not sure what the time period is. It might be a couple of minutes. We'll give you a second marshmallow and you'll get two. The kids that go, I need this instant gratification, like strike while the iron's hot sort of thing. They take the marshmallow and they have it. They're then very upset when the mar- second marshmallow comes out and they can't have it.

• 1:12:00Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:12:00Speaker 01

  Those kids also struggle with achieving what they want in life. Whereas the kids that can delay the gratification, compose themselves and go, okay, I'm prepared to wait a bit for a better outcome. Those are the kids that are also more successful.

• 1:12:13Speaker 02

  And you can see that.

• 1:12:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:15Speaker 02

  Like you, you, you're around successful people and their ability to, even people training, like bodybuilders and

• 1:12:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:23Speaker 02

  athletes. No one sees you running at the times that you run. And then no one celebrates that. It's, it's the race meet they see.

• 1:12:34Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:12:34Speaker 02

  No one sees what happens behind the scenes.

• 1:12:37Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:12:37Speaker 02

  So it's like that ability to work at something, not knowing you're going to achieve it. The business person that's just grinding away for a possibility for something to come off.

• 1:12:49Speaker 01

  True.

• 1:12:49Speaker 02

  You know, and we see it.

• 1:12:50Speaker 01

  Keep hammering.

• 1:12:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Keep hammering. It's, it's a beautiful statement.

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  So our entire training philosophy is largely anchored in that.

• 1:12:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:58Speaker 01

  That we've tried to create a unit, human adaptation studio where we teach you what we think is the most effective, efficient way possible to regulate your emotions, to maintain even emotional composure. But as I said, controlled stress environment, your emotions are going to respond negatively to that potentially.

• 1:13:17Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:13:18Speaker 01

  And we try and teach you methods with the way in which you breathe and which the way you deal with the deprivation of oxygen or whatever, to be able to calm yourself down, to regulate yourself, to maintain even emotional composure in a stressful situation. And that's entirely transferable to everything else that happens in your life. So for those who haven't learned how to do that, or even life circumstances have made them more hypervigilant and more overprotective than they would optimally like to be.

• 1:13:45Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 1:13:46Speaker 01

  This is the model we use to basically get that.

• 1:13:49Speaker 02

  Like awareness, you know, awareness. Even if we can bring awareness to, to the benefit of self-regulation, emotional composure, like just even awareness, that might be a foreign term for people.

• 1:14:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's just like, when you know, like, okay, this is gonna suck, I'm gonna do it anyway.

• 1:14:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:06Cameron Hanes?

  That, that decision right there.

• 1:14:08Speaker 01

  That's it. Easy sucks, but we let it suck and then we cope with it. And this is what, when we talk about hunters, it's not just about acclimating to go on a high altitude hunt. As you know, as every hunter knows, the most important thing is that you're so many days into the hunt, you're hot, you're cold, you're tired, you're hungry. All right, you're fatigued. You might have had to have a big physical exertion to get to the spot you're gonna take the shot. None of that matters. You've got one moment to try and take the optimal shot. And obviously, when whether you're using a gun or a bow or whatever, optimally, you're trying to take that shot in between breaths, in between a heartbeat. So you've got to calm your breathing down and you've got to slow your heart rate down.

• 1:14:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:47Speaker 01

  And then you get one chance and you took that chance perfectly after fifteen days. Cause you were, you were exhausted. Your mo- you know, your central nervous system was smashed. Know what I mean? You were hungry, you were cold.

• 1:14:56Speaker 02

  I've seen one of your posts.

• 1:14:58Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:14:59Speaker 02

  And I think it was James commented that your last picture looks like you're that freaky guy at the front of a school that no one wants to bear around.

• 1:15:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:07Speaker 02

  It was hilarious and like, but it was, you could see it on your face. It was like, yeah.

• 1:15:14Speaker 01

  It was a test. You could only do that because despite all those physical demands and despite the condition in your body and you were able to go, I've got this moment, I'm composing myself. All right. And you also delayed the gratification. You just hung off for fifteen days till the right moment. You didn't just take a lazy shot early on and scare everything off. What we're trying to do, exactly what you achieve there, we're trying to create little campaigns that's all around the world.

• 1:15:41Cameron Hanes?

  Rise up when it's stressful and make the best shot.

• 1:15:44Speaker 02

  But the, the, the other thing that I would love, and I know that we're gonna do, is give people with that passion in hunting in particular, more years to hunt.

• 1:15:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:57Speaker 02

  More adventures. Giving you an ability to lock in, train in a low oxygen environment, get a great outcome without the wear and tear on the body.

• 1:16:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:09Speaker 02

  And like rejuvenate yourself, that gives you years, more years.

• 1:16:14Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 1:16:14Speaker 02

  And from what I've seen, it's a massive passion for people. Give me more, give me five more years. I'd do anything to have twenty more adventures.

• 1:16:21Cameron Hanes?

  Well, look at, I mean, Joe's fifty-nine, I'm fifty-eight.

• 1:16:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:25Cameron Hanes?

  And you said how good, how fit he was.

• 1:16:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:27Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, some fifty-nine, fifty-eight used to be old. You see them and you'd be like, I think that old guy.

• 1:16:32Speaker 01

  Well, I remember when I was younger and I used to look up to athletes that were forty years old.

• 1:16:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:37Speaker 01

  When I'm forty, if I can be like that, I'll stoke. Then I got to forty and it's like, then I'd see athletes who were fifty and it's like, and then sixty and then seventy. And so you keep raising the bar and like it's.

• 1:16:47Speaker 02

  You know what's funny about that whole longevity piece?

• 1:16:51Speaker 02

  I, until only recently, maybe a year or two, I never really thought of

• 1:16:58Speaker 02

  a life past mid-seventies or eighties. You know what I mean? I never really, I just thought, okay, that's my timeframe.

• 1:17:04Cameron Hanes?

  I always thought that I don't want to get there. It's because I see those guys that can't do anything.

• 1:17:09Speaker 02

  My, my.

• 1:17:09Cameron Hanes?

  But I'm like, if I can get there and be active.

• 1:17:12Speaker 02

  Yeah. Has that changed recently in you? Cause it has in me. I've got more hope now that I can be mentally just what, like really dialed in. And I think physically, I think with this type of, you know, uh, system and method that we've created, I actually have, I'm starting to be around people that are just dominating it, at, at like what people call old age now.

• 1:17:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:33Speaker 02

  You know?

• 1:17:34Speaker 01

  Around an old bugger like me and he's.

• 1:17:35Speaker 02

  Well, no, no, it's just true. It's true. Like, um, you know, my, my family, not many people get past mid-seventies.

• 1:17:43Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:17:43Speaker 02

  You know what I mean?

• 1:17:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:44Speaker 02

  My father's, uh, seventy-two, going to seventy-three. And all his brothers and his father and everyone was gone before that.

• 1:17:52Cameron Hanes?

  Isn't it the, the blue zone people?

• 1:17:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:55Cameron Hanes?

  Aren't those like high elevation people?

• 1:17:57Speaker 02

  So, so. Well, blue zone, blue zone people, um, ironically have got less stress in their lives.

• 1:18:06Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:18:07Speaker 02

  That's the, that's the correlation.

• 1:18:09Cameron Hanes?

  I see.

• 1:18:09Speaker 02

  So, uh, you know, one of the blue zones is, um, in, in Italy.

• 1:18:14Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:18:15Speaker 02

  Right? Now, that's not at high elevation.

• 1:18:17Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:18:18Speaker 02

  But the way that these, that community lives their life, they do a few things.

• 1:18:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:18:22Speaker 02

  They do siestas in the middle of the day.

• 1:18:25Speaker 01

  Afternoon nap.

• 1:18:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, afternoon, no. They have mainly all their food with family.

• 1:18:30Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:18:31Speaker 02

  And their coffee. They, whenever they eat or have coffee, they sit down with family and they discuss.

• 1:18:37Cameron Hanes?

  Well, it's just controlling stress.

• 1:18:39Speaker 02

  Controlling stress. It's stress deregulation. The biggest iconic, uh, thing I've ever seen on longevity is Galapagos turtles.

• 1:18:48Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:18:49Speaker 02

  And bowhead whales.

• 1:18:51Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:18:52Speaker 02

  Now, look at those two animals. They live up to three hundred years old.

• 1:18:55Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:18:56Speaker 02

  Right? So a blue whale is a, it breathes, it doesn't have gills.

• 1:19:01Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:19:01Speaker 02

  But it comes up through the big blowhole, breathes and goes underwater for three minutes at a time.

• 1:19:06Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:19:07Speaker 02

  Comes up, breathes. So they, they call that oscillation or fluctuation of air supply.

• 1:19:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:13Speaker 02

  Their bloodsats go down to seventies and eighties.

• 1:19:16Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:19:17Speaker 02

  So what that's doing, it's rejuvenating mitochondria, right? Which is their powerhouses.

• 1:19:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:22Speaker 02

  So the science is there. So then all of a sudden they're living, but it's pretty stress free, living in an ocean, floating and you know, there's, there's not the other.

• 1:19:30Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:19:31Speaker 02

  Then turtles hold their breath.

• 1:19:33Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:19:33Speaker 02

  They don't breathe normally like us. They hold their breath. So even if you want to, you know, increase your ability to have a longer life, try to become more oxygen efficient. And that's, that's why nasal breathing is so important.

• 1:19:48Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:19:48Speaker 02

  Because that reduces the body's uh need for excessive oxygen. That's why when you see people that are holding a lot of weight, that's a lot of energy to move their body. They need to breathe heavier. So that's oxidative. That's more, again, oxidation leads to essentially deterioration.

• 1:20:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:06Speaker 02

  So become super oxygen efficient. And that's why really fit people become really oxygen efficient because they don't need as much oxygen to do stuff.

• 1:20:13Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:20:13Speaker 02

  Again, it links back into what we're doing.

• 1:20:15Speaker 01

  And, and across the board, people who live at high elevations, even Colorado, whatever, have longer lifespans than people who live at sea level. But in terms of what we train physiologically in there, apart from just the emotional composure, two of the primary things that we target in our training are your maximal aerobic capacity and your peak power output and sprint repeatability.

• 1:20:37Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:20:38Speaker 01

  Now, it turns out that there's no more efficient training and effective training method in the world than low oxygen training to improve your sprint repeatability and your ability to develop big power. All right. Um, because a lot, it's even, because it's very anaerobic and your body has to get very, very efficient in anaerobic low, you know, non-oxygen type activity. And then obviously with the heat training, as I've explained, it's a super effective way to be training at very high heart rates to increase your max VO2.

• 1:21:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:21:08Speaker 01

  Now, when you look at longevity and what we call all cause mortality, all right, we're all familiar with things like, if you smoke, you reduce your, your all cause mortality. If you're overweight, if you're under too much stress, if you've got high blood pressure. Now, interestingly, all those things increase your all cause mortality by anything from like maybe twenty percent, thirty, fifty percent, seventy percent, depending what it is.

• 1:21:32Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:21:32Speaker 01

  But when you look at things like your maximal aerobic capacity.

• 1:21:36Speaker 02

  VO2 max.

• 1:21:37Speaker 01

  Your VO2 max.

• 1:21:40Speaker 01

  There's people who um are in the bottom sort of.

• 1:21:45Speaker 02

  One percent.

• 1:21:46Speaker 01

  Well, the bottom's like the bottom's say five percent or ten percent of people in terms of their max VO2.

• 1:21:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:21:51Speaker 01

  Versus people in the top five percent. Those people in the lower percentage have five times the all cause mortality. And I was not talking twenty or fifty percent, we're talking five, five hundred percent.

• 1:22:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:22:03Speaker 01

  And the only other factor that comes close to that, like strength is better than all those other things, but it's just peak power output. So not just pure strength, but your ability to develop

• 1:22:15Speaker 01

  exercise strength with, with speed. It's basically strength times speed equals power.

• 1:22:20Speaker 02

  So if you look at longevity, if you go from being at the lowest spectrum to VO2 max to the top five percent, you've got five times multiple on your all cause mortality and.

• 1:22:31Speaker 01

  And then with peak power, it's the same or higher. In fact, in women, it's six to seven hundred percent.

• 1:22:37Speaker 02

  Cheers.

• 1:22:38Speaker 01

  With peak power. So with men, in terms of peak power, it's around five to six hundred percent and women's six hundred to seven hundred percent.

• 1:22:45Speaker 02

  That's amazing.

• 1:22:45Speaker 01

  So those two things are exponentially.

• 1:22:47Speaker 02

  Strength is a big one too.

• 1:22:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:49Speaker 02

  Because you think of strength as in balance when you get a bit older.

• 1:22:52Speaker 01

  And it might be a hundred and fifty percent, but because strength is a very, very important component of power, it, but once you add speed to that power and your ability to execute strength with speed, that's what power is, it has its huge impact. So apart from just teaching you better emotional composure, our protocol is very much about how do we optimally and most effectively and efficiently increase your max VO2? And how do we optimally improve your peak power output? And that's why the ergometers we've got in there are optimal. You'll notice that when you're on the stepper ergometers in there, it's got all the, the, you can see what your peak power output was.

• 1:23:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:28Speaker 01

  And also in terms of reducing, and because they've got that patented VPR, variable pitch resistance type technology. So you can set it to, you know, you can set the blades so that there's almost no resistance. So you can move at very, very high speeds.

• 1:23:41Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:23:42Speaker 01

  Or you can, you know, change the pitch on the rotors to where it's, all of it's hitting the, the wind, so to speak. And you've got really heavy loads. So that allows us to train peak power output more effectively than you can on most machines.

• 1:23:55Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:23:55Speaker 01

  And then even on that tread sled that you've got in there, the stepper tread sled.

• 1:23:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:59Speaker 01

  Because it's a curved treadmill, it means that you can't run it because you're effectively running uphill when you're running on the curve. You'll reduce the impact on your body because you don't have to run at the same belt speed for the same physiological output. And then of course it converts to the sled drive, which you've tried, which you can make it feel like you're pushing a Mack trunk, you know what I mean?

• 1:24:18Speaker 02

  That's awesome.

• 1:24:19Speaker 01

  So the gear we have in there all plays into what we're trying to achieve as well. We're very specific about that.

• 1:24:24Speaker 02

  And it just seems like there's just a few key markers and this addresses all of them.

• 1:24:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:29Speaker 02

  Like, like we talked about three basically key ones. And this is like hitting them right on the head. That VO2 max, peak power output and self and motion regulation.

• 1:24:39Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:24:40Speaker 02

  And, and that's universally just, if, if people, and, and like I said before, awareness. Just if awareness of like how important it is to deal with stress, people get that. But like, people do forget their breath.

• 1:24:54Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:24:55Speaker 02

  Like, and I know there's been a huge explosion on breath work and it's been fantastic. I think it's, it's doing a lot of good. But there's nothing more effective of bringing you back to breath and presence than reducing your oxygen.

• 1:25:09Speaker 01

  I bet.

• 1:25:09Speaker 02

  And I love, I love that scenario as well. Like, because that awareness is real, because it's a tool that you, we can, everyone can use that tool.

• 1:25:16Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:25:17Speaker 02

  Anytime you need it.

• 1:25:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:25:18Speaker 02

  You, and, and if you consciously use it when you don't need it, you're training that central nervous system to be better at it.

• 1:25:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it's, I love it. It's awesome. James, did you have anything?

• 1:25:29Speaker 03

  I do have a question.

• 1:25:33Speaker 03

  Uh, maybe you guys won't have an answer. But um, I'm just curious from, more from like a putting it all together standpoint.

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:43Speaker 03

  Because it is, you know, you're trying to do something that's, you can't just order off of uh eBay.

• 1:25:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:49Speaker 03

  So what was that process like? Putting all these components together and getting it down into a size that could be in somebody's backyard.

• 1:25:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. So um, inspiration from other things, I guess. Um, I seen um, a quite a large sauna setup and I thought this is out of the box. That's it. You know, we can put our system to create the low oxygen air in there. And now we've got sauna panels and we've got low oxygen. So let's discover that. Probably a nine month journey, James, until we, we got a point where with four trips to the manufacturing firms and other firms, that we got it to a point where it's sealed. And that, that was the journey to a point where we were like, okay, because my experience was a very lengthy retrofit.

• 1:26:38Speaker 02

  Like, I'd love to come in here, in this room and retrofit it. But there is so much work that needs to be done in terms of sealing what's already existing. There's flows that we have to bring in. With, with this, it's a box that we've got full control over it. We've sealed it. And that's what's made it accessible. So it's a bit of an inspiration from the sauna industry. They've done it before. Saunas have scaled massively. Um, and then just putting our system towards its work.

• 1:27:06Speaker 01

  And there's a lot of unique things we have to do to seal the room. So we, it's all patented technology out there. So we've patented the way in which the rooms are built and sealed to allow us to get to the low oxygen environment.

• 1:27:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:17Speaker 01

  Obviously the multi-training modality, about to have simulated altitude training, infrared,

• 1:27:23Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:27:23Speaker 01

  heat training and red light therapy at the same time. Um, when we have the red light therapy, um, panels in there, we make them so they're all fully adjustable. So you can you know, multiple people in there near a red light panel, adjusting it to the right position, hit your body where you want to hit it. So that's all part of.

• 1:27:40Speaker 02

  Even one of the other.

• 1:27:40Speaker 01

  patented technology.

• 1:27:41Speaker 02

  Even one of the other challenges was the power supply. So being able to shift from only needing three phase to now single phase has been a, a huge, a huge step in the right direction for, for us because you know, not everyone has three phase power.

• 1:27:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:56Speaker 02

  So you know, even that aspect's been great. Prior to this, the reiterations of the actual air system, the nitrogen system was very costly, very juicy in terms of the power and need. We've made so many improvements on that. So yeah, it's been a journey to get it to a point where it's uh consumer friendly. But um, yeah, really proud of where we've come and landed on it all.

• 1:28:20Speaker 01

  Absolutely. Yeah. It's ama, it's amazing. Technology, science, all of it. I just can't wait to see where this goes. I'm so happy for you guys to link up with Joe and get him his unit and be back up here and feel, I, I feel really lucky to be involved. Well, we feel equally very privileged to have the opportunity to do it with you. It's been an amazing experience with you, meeting you. Um, and allowing us to do this and giving us a platform to launch off.

• 1:28:45Speaker 02

  Yeah. We're, we're, we're Team Cam. Like you're, you're an exceptional gentleman. Like you've been nothing but welcoming us to your family home and to your team and we really hope this, um, and we know this is going to do some good for you and we're here to back you all the way, brother.

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. And obviously because this was one of the very first ones we did, we had a few little challenges along the way.

• 1:29:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, understandable.

• 1:29:06Speaker 01

  And Cam was like the most um understanding, accommodating person we could ever have hoped to have dealt with. So.

• 1:29:12Speaker 02

  Because if this was Leo, Leo would have kicked us out a long time ago. No, we super appreciate it, brother.

• 1:29:17Speaker 01

  I really, I appreciate you guys, your time, your vision and making this a reality that can help so many people. So it's a, I just want to thank Leo.

• 1:29:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:29:26Speaker 01

  Roman and Victoria back there in the, in the, in the cheap seats.

• 1:29:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, but uh, thank you guys for coming. I know it's a long way, but I'm excited for the future of this.

• 1:29:36Speaker 02

  Yes, sir. Thank you so much.

• 1:29:38Speaker 01

  Top star.

• 1:29:39Speaker 02

  Thank you, Cam.

• 1:29:39Speaker 01

  Thank you, brother. Keep having guys.