Janelle Monáe: We Should Thank Our Exes (FBF)

Janelle Monáe joins Call Her Daddy to discuss her personal evolution and the work required to reach her own age of pleasure. Addressing past rejection and trauma from her father's instability, she opens up about how these struggles impacted her personal relationships and how she found herself closed off to love. Janelle and Alex reflect on lessons learned from failed relationships and share why we should actually be going back and thanking our exes. Janelle speaks about her experience being in polyamorous relationships and her choice to openly talk about her sexuality despite coming from a religious family. Janelle and Alex discuss what it means if a partner refuses to post you on social media and debate whether this is actually a red flag. Janelle speaks about the inspiration for her new album, The Age of Pleasure, and what this phase of life means to her. For the game mentioned in the episode look for: Real Talk: 110 Relationship Questions You Should Only Ask Your Friends by Amil Barnes.

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• 2:06Speaker 00

  What is up Daddy gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy.

• 2:15Speaker 00

  Janelle Monae, welcome to Call Her Daddy.

• 2:17Speaker 02

  Thank you so much for having me.

• 2:18Speaker 00

  I'm, first of all, I'm just so excited to meet you. I'm a huge fan of all your work. I was listening to your music on my way here and I'm like, okay, you are giving sexual sensual fun party vibes. It gives all the vibes. Your album is amazing. I'm so happy to have you here.

• 2:32Speaker 02

  Oh, thank you so much for having me, Alex. I'm a big fan of your show, of your experience, rather. So I was really happy when I found out we were gonna do this. So thank you.

• 2:44Speaker 00

  Okay, tell me how your summer's going. You were on vacation. Where were you? Let us pretend we were there with you.

• 2:50Speaker 02

  Oh, please. I'm like, can we all just go on vacation for the whole summer? Come on, everybody. Everybody, let's do this. Let's all agree that summers are for vacations, paid for by the government.

• 3:07Speaker 00

  I love this energy.

• 3:09Speaker 02

  Paid for by the government.

• 3:11Speaker 00

  Let's, we're gonna like manifest it here now, because it's like, when you were younger, I feel like summers were always vacation because of school. But when you become an adult, nothing is fun anymore. We're like, we need to go on vacation. Okay, so where were you?

• 3:25Speaker 02

  Okay, so I was in Ibiza, Ibiza, Spain. And then I stayed there for probably like five or six days, which was like an experience. Like it is a party place. So we did not go to sleep. I went with like 10 of my other friends and we didn't go to sleep till like seven in the morning, every morning. I can't even say night.

• 3:47Speaker 00

  Right.

• 3:48Speaker 02

  But it was so fun. It was that

• 3:52Speaker 02

  that ooch ooch music. I kind of like ooch ooch, but I need like some hip hop, some something mixed in with it. But, but it was so fun. The sunsets were beautiful. And then the second portion of the vacay was Jamaica.

• 4:07Speaker 00

  Oh, I've never been.

• 4:08Speaker 02

  Ocho Rios, beautiful people. The food, the chicken patties, the beef patties, the shrimp curry, oh, the plantains. I had at least 152 plantains.

• 4:20Speaker 00

  What?

• 4:22Speaker 02

  One by one. Yeah.

• 4:24Speaker 00

  As you were saying that, I'm like, ooh, I feel like I'm there with you.

• 4:26Speaker 02

  Ah, it was like, it was heaven. So I will say, I'm sort of mentally still there.

• 4:32Speaker 00

  It's okay. We can like keep it chill. We're on vacation. This is summer. Like, we're just gonna relax today, okay?

• 4:38Speaker 02

  Let's relax. And it's so interesting that you say like, as kids growing up, it just reminded me like, I didn't take vacations as a kid.

• 4:45Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 4:45Speaker 02

  I think that's why I'm so adamant about it now. I didn't, you know, my parents worked a lot and, and we didn't get the opportunity to go outside of Kansas. So I didn't take my first vacation until really my first album came out.

• 5:01Speaker 00

  And now you're like, I deserve this?

• 5:04Speaker 02

  I'm making up for lost time.

• 5:05Speaker 00

  As you should. That's phenomenal. I feel like when I go on trips with my friends, there is someone in the friend group that's like the planner, that's like the reservations and the itinerary person. And then there's people that are more like chill and just going with the flow. Who are you in the friend group?

• 5:19Speaker 02

  Oh my God. I'm the one actually sending out the group texts. Like dinner, I could be at the club, it could be four in the morning. I'm like, lunch is gonna be served at 2:00 PM, breakfast for anybody between nine and noon. Dinner's gonna be at eight. Like, I love making the itineraries. I'm that friend.

• 5:41Speaker 00

  You're the dream, though.

• 5:42Speaker 02

  I'm, I'm, yeah. And people are like, Janelle, why are you doing? And I just, I don't know. I just love curating experiences.

• 5:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:49Speaker 02

  I grew up actually throwing parties with my best friends, middle school, sixth grade, seventh grade. We would rent out this location in one of our friends' neighborhoods, this little white building, and we would charge people a dollar to get in. And I would hide in the bathroom because I didn't know who was gonna come. I had so much anxiety around it. And then once it would get packed, my friends would come underneath the stall because I locked myself in the bathroom. They'd be like, it's packed, come out, come out, bitch. Get out, get out, get out. And so I've just always loved curating experiences for people.

• 6:27Speaker 00

  I, I mean, I think that's a, like a great trait and quality to have. Like, I feel like that makes a lot of sense of like, what I wanted to talk to you about today is obviously your new album, The Age of Pleasure is out. And I was, while I was listening to it, I'm like, you have such a specific, great vibe that's like very infectious, which I love. And I'm curious, like, are you currently in your age of pleasure? Have you always been? Like, and what is age of pleasure to you?

• 6:53Speaker 02

  Ooh, that's a great question. Um, I wasn't always in my age of pleasure. I've been in age of fear, age of anxiety, age of

• 7:07Speaker 02

  just

• 7:10Speaker 02

  worry, a fight, you know, fighting back against systems that seek to oppress folks like myself and the people that I love and centering that. And with this album, which I actually don't even call an album, I say that it is a soundtrack to a lifestyle. It's a lifestyle. You know, we live this. I wrote this, this, this project for my friends and for me. And I was just like, if we fuck with it, that's all I care about. So I would throw parties at my house with my friends who own this party collective called Everyday People. And if I knew we were gonna be having and hosting them on a Saturday, that Monday or

• 7:53Speaker 02

  Tuesday, we would go into the studio and we would write like two to three songs that would work in the DJ's playlist. I wouldn't tell anybody it was me. I would not like make a big thing about it. And I would be very nervous, like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, are people gonna sit down? Because if people sat down, it was not gonna go on the album. If people were not shazamming, it wasn't going on the album. And so every song that you hear, all of my friends, all of the people who were with us celebrating in this safe space, they are responsible for the songs making the album.

• 8:30Speaker 00

  That takes a lot of confidence, but also just like self-awareness to be like, I'm gonna play my friends my songs. They're gonna have no fucking idea it's me. And watch, let's see if they vibe with it. So like every single, because I was thinking, when I was singing to Champagne Shit, I was like, okay, like, this is a vibe. Like, I would listen to this, like getting ready with my friends, like getting ready to go out, like, but then I'm all, I'm wondering like, so you're sitting there being like, do they like it? Do they like it? And then you're like, check, that's going on the soundtrack?

• 9:01Speaker 02

  Yep. I'm like, how do people move? Okay. What, or I saw some people shazamming. And then some people would be like, wait, is this? But I never would confirm. I would go hide and be like, you know, having somebody else tell me what's going on. But yeah, like it's, it's, as an artist, presenting anything before the world gets it, like for that first time. I talked to a lot of my artist friends and we're all like, it is one of the most like scary things ever, scary feelings to have because it comes from such a pure place when we create. And for it not to be accepted, you don't know, you know, you, you take it. But for me, I got, I was like, I'm ready. I'm okay. I had to heal some shit, you know,

• 9:42Speaker 02

  because, because some of that is attached to, to just rejection issues, abandonment issues. Like people don't like my stuff. That could go down to the root of an issue that you just need to fix. And I definitely used a portion of this pandemic to, to sort of work on that and to get to, to my own, you know, traumas that I had to heal and to get to a place where I was like, wait, I've been really centering fighting so much that I don't even know what my life is like outside of that. Who am I? You know, I talk, I, I, like, who am I outside of the fight? You know, who am I? And so I had to sit with myself and ask myself. And, you know,

• 10:25Speaker 02

  when I think about the word pleasure, there is no pleasure without feeling safe. I didn't always feel safe.

• 10:31Speaker 00

  That's so, I appreciate you sharing that because I, one, can relate in terms of like putting something creatively out there and being extremely nervous to see, obviously, like, are people gonna like it? On top of that, obviously, you infusing parts of you with your sexuality and race and growing up and your experiences, like, that's like a really vulnerable moment to be infusing something into a work of art. And then like, fingers crossed, hoping people like it. You kinda have to slowly be really good with yourself to be able to know, like, sure, I can like perfect my craft a little bit more, but down to the core, like, if people don't like it, I'm still gonna be okay with myself. And that must take time, though.

• 11:14Speaker 02

  Exactly. It does. It takes a lot of unlearning.

• 11:18Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:18Speaker 02

  It takes a lot of

• 11:22Speaker 02

  Fucking with yourself.

• 11:23Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm.

• 11:24Speaker 02

  You know, and, and, and like, I have to say, like, you have to be like, I fuck with me.

• 11:30Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm.

• 11:31Speaker 02

  You know, yeah, okay, somebody doesn't like a song that I made, but that doesn't make me a bad songwriter.

• 11:38Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:38Speaker 02

  That doesn't make me a bad artist. That doesn't mean that I should just throw away my whole career. You know, and, and, and you have to just understand that sometimes we're not always in the same space that we can take in.

• 11:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:52Speaker 02

  You know, take in the message or the energy that an artist is trying to put out. And, um, there's nothing wrong with that. It's just like, okay, this didn't resonate with you. Okay. But I don't give you that power over me. You're not more powerful. Your thoughts about my art are not more powerful than my thoughts about my art.

• 12:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's so real what you're saying too, because even when I was listening to you say like, I was fighting for so much of my life, like, and when am I gonna get out of this stage? That's also the beauty of art is like, it will come to it when you're ready. Like, your music would have sounded so different in your fighting stages verse now when you're like, I fucking love myself, I'm more clear on who I am, I'm more secure in certain things that were like eating me alive. Maybe when I was younger and going through it, and you can tell, like, this album, I, like, it makes you smile, it makes you feel yourself, it makes you just like, want to live. And I, I don't know if that sounds corny, but like,

• 12:52Speaker 02

  No, thank you.

• 12:53Speaker 00

  No, it's really beautiful.

• 12:55Speaker 02

  Thank you so much for sharing that.

• 12:57Speaker 00

  Every moment of your soundtrack felt very thoughtful and, and put together, and it is a story. So I just, I'm a creative person, so I just, you know, I really respect you and it's great.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  Thank you. You know, I, I wanted to focus on feeling too. You know, I think feeling is what music, uh, gives us. It makes us feel, it makes us wanna dance, it makes us wanna party, it makes us wanna cry, makes us wanna feel ourselves and feel sexy, have sex, all those things. It's such a powerful energy and the fact that it's a feeling that I had that I felt like, man, this is, this makes me feel good. Knowing that that makes you feel and we are just meeting each other. That's such, I think that's such a beautiful exchange, so thank you so much.

• 13:43Speaker 00

  Of course. It's interesting, you kinda mentioned this earlier and I wanna talk about it. I know you've talked about going to therapy and working on yourself, and I know you're at a great place in your life and, you know, the age of pleasure, but let's go back a little bit.

• 13:56Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:57Speaker 00

  What is the biggest part of yourself you had to heal in order to be who you are sitting here today?

• 14:04Speaker 02

  Hmm. Phew, oh, wow. You know, one of the things that I had to do was, again, deal with my rejection and abandonment sort of trauma. Um, where did that start from? You know, my dad and I, who were like this now, were super close, but my dad struggled with addiction growing up, and so he was in and out of my life. And so there were just times where I didn't know if he was really gonna come and pick me up. You know, I, I just, I, the trust wasn't there. I felt let down. There were, you know, moments,

• 14:44Speaker 02

  um, that, that, that that happened all the way up until, you know, high school and, and, and other things that happened. So I had to go back to those times that were painful, that, those times that I, I just had to forgive my dad. I was like, I have to forgive you. You were struggling with drug addiction. You were not, um, the best version of yourself. And now that you are, we get to make up for that. We get to make up for that time. And as I healed that and I talked to him about it, a lot changed for me. As I forgave him, I forgave my own self for spending so many years, you know, um, in that dark space and connecting that to my art, you know, if, if, if I thought that I had done something wrong.

• 15:29Speaker 02

  You know, why wasn't he showing up for me? And so when you go and you in, in the back of your head are thinking that you're doing something wrong, that your own dad isn't around, if in your art, you feel like people are not liking what it is that you're doing, or they're judging you or whatever, it's so all, it's intertwined. You know, the feeling of like, them leaving you, like your dad left you. You never want to feel that. And so I had to get to a place where I was, uh, I understood what that was, and I had to let go and I had to be okay with knowing that there's nothing wrong with me if, if, if folks don't wanna come to my party.

• 16:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  You know, even me hiding in the bathroom, they don't, they didn't wanna come to my party. Okay, that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with me. My dad, it wasn't nothing wrong, wrong with me while my dad wasn't around. He was struggling, he was battling, and people are battling so many things. People are into different things that perhaps what you're, you're doing doesn't necessarily align with it. Or they just plain might not like it.

• 16:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:29Speaker 02

  And that's okay.

• 16:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:30Speaker 02

  But do you like you?

• 16:32Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm. I think it's so interesting when you start to connect to your childhood and how your parents raised you and, you know, what trauma did you go through? When you don't deal with it, there's just like this anger in you, or there's this like resentment, and there's just a part of you, even if you don't wanna label it that, like, there's just something in you that you feel like you haven't resolved. And a lot of times, we don't have the perspective of kids of like, oh, like, this wasn't intentional that my dad was doing this to like neglect me and make me feel abandoned, but it happened. And so two things can be true, right? Like, he wasn't trying to like inflict pain on you. He was going through something, but it affected you.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  But it did.

• 17:14Speaker 00

  And until you go through all of that, it's gonna influence the way that you move in life.

• 17:20Speaker 02

  That you see life. Yeah.

• 17:22Speaker 00

  But even you saying it's interesting, like, it affected your art, I'm interested to know, how did it affect your personal relationships with this theme of abandonment within you?

• 17:30Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm. It affected them for sure. Yeah, it was just like trust issues. Um,

• 17:39Speaker 02

  you know, breakups were intense.

• 17:41Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 17:41Speaker 02

  Cause it just mirrored that, but now, like, there were moments where, you know, I was dating someone and, you know, we broke up and, and, and I just was like, I will never talk to this person again. The way they made me feel, I will never talk to them again. And after I started to, um, go through therapy and I have an emotional support coach that I talk to, um, after, which by the way, therapy, like, we're, we're, we're benefiting from therapy. I just really wish that it was free for every person around the world. I really, really, really do wish that there was a fund that everybody could access to where they could have therapy, they could have somebody to talk to and work through. I do believe

• 18:22Speaker 02

  that we will be in a much better shape as a community, as a nation, as a world. Um, so I just wanted to say that.

• 18:29Speaker 00

  I agree.

• 18:30Speaker 02

  Cause I feel like, damn, I wish everybody could go, could experience these things. Um, so I was like, I will never talk to this person again. And after I went through, you know, understanding and, and getting to the root of like my, my rejection abandonment, um, trauma, you know what I did?

• 18:48Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 18:49Speaker 02

  I thanked the person who I was in a relationship with and it, and it did not work out for us. I thanked them. I said, you know what? And my emotional support coach said that I was gonna do that.

• 19:01Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm.

• 19:02Speaker 02

  It's like, you are going to thank this person because you know what this person did for you? They forced you to deal with something that you were not going to deal with.

• 19:12Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 19:13Speaker 02

  They pushed you to go back to the root of the problem. You were not gonna do it. You were moving. You were too busy moving. You didn't have time. But that relationship, the ending of that specific relationship forced that. And I literally called that person and I thanked them. I said, thank you so much. You have no idea, like, I was really walking around here hurt and you forced me to, like, you know, and so they started sharing things with me. They were just like, I just wasn't ready. I was confused myself. I did not trust. It was going so well for, for us. I'm so used to chaos that I didn't, I felt like this was not gonna end how I wanted it to end. I, I'm also dealing with rejection issues.

• 19:57Speaker 02

  So we just kinda healed through each other. And, and that, and, and, and it helped me in my other relationships. I was like, here are the, here are the things that I was doing because of my trauma. When I'm free from that trauma, I'm like a really, really, really, like, beautiful partner to have. And it just helped me to understand how I wanna show up for, for my future partners.

• 20:28Speaker 00

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  My listeners can save 25% on their first month at ritual.com/callherdaddy. That's ritual.com/callherdaddy for 25% off your first month. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Isn't that so interesting when you meet people in life that, obviously, again, like, you needed to work on yourself to be able to have that hindsight? And be like, wait, that was so helpful. But like, most of the time, in life, in romantic partnerships, I feel like specifically, like, you can get so hurt by them, but that's not your family. So you're like, I can walk away.

• 24:09Speaker 00

  But you're always gonna learn something so incredible. And if you can get past that hurt initially, we really should be thanking all of our exes. Cause it's like, even if you cheated on me, like, I have partners in the past that I had so much resentment and anger. And I look back and I'm like, there's so much I learned about myself, and my resilience, and my worth. And it's like, had that not happened, of course, there's moments in life where like, I wish no harm on anyone. But like, certain themes that you can take, find the good part of it, rather than feeling so negative and angry, cause that gets us nowhere.

• 24:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:45Speaker 00

  So it's interesting to hear you talk about, like, how you connected with that person.

• 24:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:49Speaker 00

  At first, being like, I'll never talk to you again. And then you're like, wait a second, thank you?

• 24:52Speaker 02

  Thank you, like, fucking thank you. And I will say, though, I mean, I know it's like, sometimes with exes, cause I also had an ex that was just like, man, I wish I really had this new version of you. Like, when we were dating, I wish that I was around, that was the person you showed me. And I was just like, yeah, I, I agree, but listen,

• 25:15Speaker 02

  what do you want me to say? Like, I wasn't, I wasn't ready, I was growing, I needed to grow, and, you know? I'm sorry, you know?

• 25:24Speaker 00

  True, and you know what's interesting about, I've had, I remember an ex I had kinda similar to that. But you also wonder, like, but if I was this new version of myself, we probably wouldn't have been together. Cause you were attracted to me then, we ended up for some reason, right?

• 25:39Speaker 02

  Cause we were both toxic as hell, as hell.

• 25:42Speaker 00

  Right.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  We both were toxic, and...

• 25:45Speaker 00

  So like, you can wish...

• 25:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, it wouldn't, you would, we, I would definitely would not, this new version would have not dated, you know, that, that, that, that person. I love you.

• 25:56Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 25:56Speaker 02

  I love you, but there's just no way that I could put myself back into that sort of like cha- chaos.

• 26:03Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 26:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:04Speaker 00

  And it's like, again, it's like, you're both growing. So for him to be even able to see your growth,

• 26:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:09Speaker 00

  phenomenal, love it, amazing. But we probably needed to go on our own ways to actually get whole and good, and feel healthy within ourselves. And maybe that's just not the right fit, but at the time it was.

• 26:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:21Speaker 00

  And so we can appreciate each other's growth, but we're not gonna grow together.

• 26:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, we, we, we grew together, and, and that's a beautiful thing. I always want the best for people. Like, even if we're not together, as a human, that also helps contextualize breakups. It's like, even though we're not together, I don't want anything negative to happen to you. I don't want you to, I don't want anything bad to happen to you. As a human, I want the best for you. And if that means that it's not with me at that time, or at that season, then so be it.

• 26:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 26:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:49Speaker 00

  If someone's listening to this and is like, wow, I really relate to you, maybe they had someone in their life that didn't show up for them, and was constantly, you know, neglecting to be there and show up. What did actually working through that childhood trauma, like, look like for you? Because I can see some people like, you know, how do I even begin to like, repair this? Like, where do I start?

• 27:17Speaker 02

  Ooh, um, I mean, like I said, I just wish everybody could afford therapy. So if, but if you can, try to get you a good therapist that you can just talk freely to, that can help you, like, and don't lie to them, you know? Don't lie, be transparent, tell the truth, have, make sure that they, they're pushing you. And you need to not be afraid to do the work. It's gonna be painful, it's gonna be a lot of tears, a lot of crying, a lot of just like confusion, but just know that you're growing. Like, you know better, right? You're know, you're, you're understanding you a lot more.

• 28:01Speaker 02

  And sometimes that, that feels confusing to your body, to your cells, because you're literally being like rerouted. Like, the way that your mind is, is, is being rewired. So it's gonna feel uncomfortable, but just stay the course. Cause I promise you, that if you do the work, there is going to be, you're gonna be like, I never thought I would see the day. I literally never thought that I would be this person. It's like, I planned, I sort of planned it out, but to live it out, and to be living what I dreamt about doing, and, and the freedom in which I move, cause it's not that like, you're not gonna deal with issues and problems and things like that.

• 28:43Speaker 02

  But the way that I'm so solid with myself now, I didn't know, you know, I, I, I, I was free, but, but there are levels to it.

• 28:53Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:53Speaker 02

  There are levels to it. So just stay the course, and you'll reach the next level.

• 28:58Speaker 00

  I love that advice, cause even hearing you talk, it's like, we all reach a point in life when we haven't dealt with our shit, where it just starts coming up more and more. Relationships are failing, friendships are having issues, there's things at work, like, it just starts to creep up.

• 29:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:13Speaker 00

  And those are usually the moments where, in a good way, like, you cannot deny you need to address it. And I love that you said, it's so fucking uncomfortable.

• 29:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:22Speaker 00

  But you gotta do the work, cause then you won't be uncomfortable. But you're going against something that you literally have been living this way your whole life.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 29:29Speaker 00

  So you're going like, against the grain.

• 29:31Speaker 02

  You're going against yourself. Your future self is fighting your past version, old version of yourself.

• 29:37Speaker 00

  Damn.

• 29:37Speaker 02

  It's like Looper, in a sense, but different.

• 29:41Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 29:42Speaker 02

  Anyway.

• 29:42Speaker 00

  Um, you mentioned now that you have a good relationship with your father. And I can imagine there are people really relating to you today also of like, how did you know it was time for, that you were gonna be able to forgive and have an actual relationship with your dad?

• 30:00Speaker 02

  I wanted it. You gotta want it too. Sometimes you're just like, mm. I don't really want a relationship just because you birthed or helped bring me into this world. Like as a person, you can be like, I don't really want this. And that's totally fine. I think I wanted it. Cause my dad is cool. Like my dad also had a music career. But drugs got in the way of that. And so me and him can talk music. He understands like all my favorite artists or his favorite artists. When I put out Lipstick Lover, all of the art that that I'm doing, my dad supports it. Like he's like, I want you to know as your dad, I think what you're doing is brave, is sick as fuck. I love you. I want you to know I got your back.

• 30:41Speaker 02

  Like as a black man in this, in, in, living in this country, I'm supporting you. My queer, non-binary, um, you know, artistic daughter. Like I'm here for you. And I knew he always had that sort of, that's sort of where I get, both my parents are like shows, like they could each have their own TV show. And people, they would not care about me. They'd be like, your mom and your dad, like, you know, they're not together. Because they're very much so alike in, in many ways. You know, they're just super like flamboyant and their personalities can take up a room. Um, but good, sweet people. Um, so with my dad, I always knew that like,

• 31:25Speaker 02

  when it was time to take risks, that was gonna be the person that was gonna affirm me. And I, and I, and I wanted that and I needed that. And also for him, I wanted to give him another opportunity. Post, like being sober to know me, you know, to know me. I think, I think that, that for both of us, we needed that. Like I needed to have the support of, of, of my dad. And I felt like for him to have been, cause he had also gone to prison. So he had been locked away for years and I was like, I want him to come out sober and to know what it's like to receive love from me.

• 32:09Speaker 00

  Was that?

• 32:10Speaker 02

  Not guilt.

• 32:11Speaker 00

  How old were you when your dad went to prison?

• 32:13Speaker 02

  I'm timeless. So.

• 32:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, it doesn't matter. I was there. I was alive at some point.

• 32:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, I know. No, but I was, uh, this, it was on and off, you know, middle school, elementary school, high school, like always.

• 32:27Speaker 00

  You're so successful in so many different areas. Like you're an author, you're an actor, you're a singer. It's insane how talented you are. And I'm thinking, again, it's always like, we never know what someone goes through. Like you rising to fame, having your father, you know, having these struggles, like, were you ever just, was, was he still struggling when you first came up and started to get famous?

• 32:52Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. Well, no, he was, that's when he sort of got, got clean. So that was great. That was good. I needed that right at that time.

• 33:01Speaker 00

  Cause I was gonna say, like, damn, like, everyone probably seeing you in the tabloids and everything, like, having all this success and yet you wanna repair a relationship with your father because there's nothing, everyone can relate. When you do something so good at work or at school or when, you wanna call your parents.

• 33:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:20Speaker 00

  And you, cause you know, there's no one that's gonna be more proud of you.

• 33:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:24Speaker 00

  And so I appreciate you sharing that little bit because it's like, yes, you have all this success and, but family, and again, when I say family, I always make sure to clarify, like, I don't care if they're blood. Like you don't have to be with people that abuse you or whatever, whatever you consider who your family is, to be able to repair relationships if you want it.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:44Speaker 00

  It is kinda beautiful because you get to share your life with people that love you and support you. And there's no jealousy. It's just like, we fucking love you. Like your mom outside the talent show is being like, that's my baby. You're like, mom, stop. No, it's really cute.

• 34:06Speaker 00

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• 34:50Speaker 00

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• 35:28Speaker 00

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• 36:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:38Speaker 00

  How have you decided to make that decision in this crazy Hollywood world that we live in?

• 36:43Speaker 02

  I just did. I was like, hmm. Just watching, observing. I was like, you know, the people that actually are more private seem more happy to me. They just seemed more happy, you know, because it's like, you don't have to worry about, you know, anybody seeing your partner over here and being like, oh, they're not, they're, they, they assume that if you're not with them and they're seeing with somebody else, that you broke up and now you gotta go answer that question. You have to go do that. And perhaps maybe later on in life, I'll open up a little more, but for now, I love having, I love protect, and it really is for the protection of, of, of them.

• 37:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 37:28Speaker 02

  Um, I, I don't want them to, you know, cause I can handle sort of like paparazzi or whatever. It's annoying sometimes. Sometimes it's fun. I love messing with them, whatever. But I never want anybody that I'm dating to ever feel pressure. Um, cause they didn't ask for it. You know, they didn't ask for it. So I just like to keep peace and, and harmony and no expectation from the public to know our every move.

• 37:57Speaker 00

  I think that's really healthy. And I think in a weird way, I do always talk about on my show now, like, I feel like people now more than ever can kind of relate to a lack of privacy, even if you have 500 followers. Like we have accessibility now to post as much as we want. And I think there are people that feel societal pressure to like, post my partner with me because it's like, there's almost like social currency that comes with like, being this it couple and having, whether you're in college or high school, like this is everywhere now where people are feeling pressured to prove something on the internet.

• 38:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:35Speaker 00

  And when you can actually step back from it, I'm not saying don't post on the internet, but like, try to find a balance within yourself of like, why are you actually doing this? Why are you doing certain things? Is it just to get the photo to prove something to people?

• 38:47Speaker 02

  Right.

• 38:47Speaker 00

  It's just, it's not as healthy. Like, you know, like live, some type of privacy is really good for yourself. Cause then you can also be with yourself of like, do I like this person? Or do I like how I'm doing this? Or do I even wanna do this?

• 38:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 39:00Speaker 00

  You kinda have to like, make sure you're not just doing it for the gram.

• 39:02Speaker 02

  Yeah. No, seriously. I think because it's the norm to people to be like, well, you must post your kids and who you're dating and, you know, it's sort of like, that's the norm these days. Um, definitely, I don't feel like anybody should feel pressure. And I think that if you are in a relationship where they're like, if you don't post me, we're done. I've had like, people, we were just talking about this when we were on vacay. And there was a question like, are, would you be upset if your partner did not post you on social media? And there were a lot of mixed questions, I mean, answers, but I was just like, we have to talk about that first and foremost. And if we agree that we wanna keep things private, then no.

• 39:48Speaker 02

  But also like, if my love is defined by a post, you don't post me enough on social media, like I really need to understand my own damn, like.

• 40:00Speaker 02

  Priorities in life, is that really necessary for me? So I just think it's like for me, it's not. I do think people should have conversations around it prior. So that there are no expectations and you know, cause it could hurt somebody's feeling too, though. If they feel like you're trying to hide them. But that's deeper, that's like y'all need to really. Y'all need to really work through some things, yeah.

• 40:24Speaker 00

  No, that's true, cause I'm thinking about it like, I feel like there are some people that also now because social media has been like very, you know, prevalent for the past, I guess, like ten something years. People may have been in relationships where someone was extremely adamant about posting them and they almost found like when we're good, he posts me, when we're not, he doesn't post me. So when you go to your next relationship, I bet there are some people that have like lingering feelings about like, well, why aren't you posting me? And someone could literally be like, cause I don't think we need to, I love you, we're sitting here together. Isn't this better than us taking a selfie? So also check in with yourself of like, are you comparing yourself to your friends or your past relationships? Get on the same page as your current partner.

• 41:08Speaker 00

  They may not be being shady at all, they're actually like, no, I fucking love you and I don't feel like we need to.

• 41:12Speaker 02

  Or I wanna protect you from, you know, all of the scrutiny or the, you know, just, just things like that online world, it's its own matrix and you know, it's, it's tough.

• 41:25Speaker 00

  It's wild. What are you like in a relationship? Are you romantic? Are you dominant? Like what's the vibe over there?

• 41:36Speaker 02

  That was also, we played this game called, oh god, I'm gonna, uh, I gotta get the, get the name of it. Actually, it's a, a, a, a black guy who made the game, card game, so it's not a lot of us in that space. So I really, really have to get the name of it, oh my god, it's the, anyway, one of the cards said.

• 41:55Speaker 00

  I can link it in the description, when you, if you have your team send it.

• 41:58Speaker 02

  You're so sweet, how sweet of you. Okay, but the, one of the questions was like, what would your ex say about you? And we were just like, everybody was like, oh wow, that's a good one. I feel like now, I am, let me think, I mean, cause you know, it's like, and so the question, when the question made me be like, well, this is what I think about myself, but what if that isn't what they thought about me? Like, okay, of course, I'm gonna say glowing reviews about me, you know, or maybe like a couple of things that I need to work on, but you know, it could have been some other things, so for me, if I was being honest in a relationship,

• 42:39Speaker 02

  I mean, I think I used to be a very like hard to know if I really loved them sort of person, like it was hard to get to my heart. Because I had just been hurt and I hadn't really again dealt with sort of that trauma or of, of someone, what it would feel like of somebody leaving me. I never wanted anybody to leave

• 43:03Speaker 02

  me, and if they did, I didn't want them to ever feel like

• 43:09Speaker 02

  I really loved you, you know, cause like if you, if I really told you that I really loved you and you, we still didn't work, then like wow, what a stab in the heart, right? But now, having gone to this new space, um, I'm a big communicator. I, you know, believe in evolution, even in your partnerships. And even if you started out one way, I'm always open to us growing. And I wanna make sure that as we grow individually and as, you know, together, um, I've also been in polyamorous relationships as well and I, you know, know what it's like to be with multiple partners.

• 43:50Speaker 02

  So it's very important that, you know, we're communicating in real time about our feelings and if things are coming up, like if, if one person feels like, okay,

• 44:05Speaker 02

  I'm having feelings of jealousy or I need some more time with both of you or, you know, uh, how do we, you know, if we, if we need to like work on some things, I like to know that and I always welcome, you know, feedback. I'm that type of person, like I, I don't, I don't ever wanna be in a relationship where, uh, I'm thinking we're good and we're not.

• 44:31Speaker 00

  Yeah, like you're wondering like.

• 44:33Speaker 02

  Like, just let me know. Because I, I could probably adjust, we could adjust, perhaps it was a misunderstanding, or perhaps like, oh, you know, maybe you thought you knew me or you knew how, you, you don't know how much I love you. I need to be more expressive in, in those things and, um, so I think I'm averse.

• 44:57Speaker 00

  I love it.

• 44:57Speaker 02

  So I, I can be dominant, sub, like, you know, I'm non-binary as well, so I can go with the, I can go with the flow about things. Meaning like I don't, I don't just consider myself like to be boxed in, it's like this type of partner. Like sometimes you need me to be more like water, okay? I need to be more like water. You need me to be more like a rock for us, okay? I'll be more like a rock for us.

• 45:27Speaker 00

  How did you know? Was there like a conversation or did you just know the moment when you first had your first polyamorous relationship? Like, how did you know that you were comfortable with that dynamic?

• 45:38Speaker 02

  Well, I was already in a relationship and, and the person who was attracted, um, to me was also attracted to my partner. And so they made it very clear and we just made it work.

• 45:52Speaker 00

  Would you, would you continue to have those type of relationships again? Like, are you still interested in that or has anything changed?

• 45:58Speaker 02

  Sure, I'm open to love, you know, I'm like, I think, you know, I love going to weddings and, you know, there are certain traditions that I love and congratulations, I know you're engaged. So congratulations, so I honor love. And I think though, love comes in different, different variations. And that is what I love about polyamory is it just shows us like, just in the same way, like I don't have just one best friend. I have multiple best friends and I love y'all, you know, and we love each other and we can all hang out. I don't just love one parent. I don't just love one aunt, like I love all of you and, and, um,

• 46:41Speaker 02

  in relationships, you know, I think when, uh, intimate relationships, partnerships, I think that if we can talk about, um, what we need and what works for all of us, and I'll tell you like, it takes a lot of unlearning. Cause we're conditioned, especially in this society, that this is what a union looks like, this is what,

• 47:04Speaker 02

  you know, it's two people in a relationship, you know, um,

• 47:09Speaker 02

  it's like so you're, you're, you're fighting against, or not fighting against, but you're, you're constantly have to, having to unlearn,

• 47:18Speaker 02

  the traditional way of, of what love looks like. And so I love to, by being my authentic self and us being our authentic selves, challenge that notion.

• 47:28Speaker 00

  Yeah, I love that because what is very frustrating and I love having conversations like this on my show because you're right, we were all raised with something that was like, this is the norm. And it's like, I'm so happy finally, I mean, there's still so much work to be done, but like even with sexuality and, you know, fluidity, it's just like, what, like it's very frustrating, I think for people that see it so clearly, like let everyone do what they wanna do and then people that are still so stuck in the way that they want things to have been done for thousands of years prior. When you speak about polyamory, like I can imagine there are people that are so judgmental of even that word, like, how, how do you even do that?

• 48:11Speaker 00

  And like, it's so small-minded and it's also like, half the people that are saying that are speaking from a place of insecurity because I've seen people do it and be like, isn't he cheating on his wife? And like, it's like, there's so much judgment when, when it, something really frustrates someone, I always believe like, there's something internally that like is getting you going, cause why do you care so much? But how did you, I'm assuming at some point you have dealt with judgment and to anyone listening that's also maybe like going against the norm, which fuck the norm, let's just make everything normal. How did you deal with that?

• 48:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, always, always, always, people are intrigued, people think, you know, um, I think all sorts of things, but I think education is important, I mean, we have the internet, people can look things up. And I mean, my close friends are super supportive, um, you know, certain family members have been like, hmm. But for the most part, my, my circle of people that I have around have been supportive, even if they have questions and they wonder like, okay, alright, cause also people are trying to figure out, well, hmm, is that what I need or what we need or, cause I definitely been cheating on my significant other for a very long time, but

• 49:25Speaker 02

  what if after all, we just needed a third, we needed somebody else, you know, that, that loved us and we love them,

• 49:35Speaker 02

  to, to, to, to be a part of our union. You know, people are trying, and people are scared, I understand that too, some people are scared to go against tradition and you know, some people come from conservative environments, I came from, you know, conservative Baptist background where I was taught to fear everything, you know, even getting into the music industry, I was taught to just fear, you know, don't be like this artist or don't be like that or, you know, it's just been a lot of unlearning and, and I get that and, and I think, I think though for me, I, I have to know that this is my life here on earth, I wasn't put here to, um,

• 50:17Speaker 02

  to follow every rule, I was, I was put here to help rewrite them.

• 50:20Speaker 00

  Yeah, I really appreciate you talking about that because it's just such a prevalent topic that still like is, we, again, we have so much movement that we need to keep doing, but I think having conversations like this help. I'm curious to know, like, how did you decide, obviously being a public figure, to speak openly about your sexuality?

• 50:41Speaker 02

  Ooh, how did I decide, it's sort of like decided for me because my art is a direct reflection of who I am. You know, I, I have Metropolis, which is my first EP. I have a lot of independent work I put out before that and then I did The Arch Android, my first full-length album, Sweets. Then I did The Electric Lady, Dirty Computer and all the way now to The Age of Pleasure and, and all those projects that have come out.

• 51:12Speaker 02

  I discovered that, I mean, I knew when I was a child that I was attracted to not just boys, but to women and to energies. I knew that and because of my sort of conservative Baptist upbringing, it wasn't welcomed. I suppressed my sexuality. I suppressed my sensuality. I suppressed so much of me because I didn't feel safe. And so, once I got to a place where, okay, I know for sure, for sure, that, you know, I, I am, I, I am attracted to, to, to, you know, these energies.

• 51:52Speaker 02

  I, I'm gonna honor that. And with each project, you could, you can hear me and feel me getting more brave. You know, I created the android Cindy Mayweather, who is representative of, in my work, who's representative of the other, you know, the queer person, the, the black person, the non-binary person, trans, all of, all of us who are pushed to the margins of society. And so, I use that as a form of like, a form of coping, a coping mechanism until I was brave enough to actually say it. And I think I was always dropping hints and I was getting more brave and, you know, less afraid.

• 52:39Speaker 02

  And then finally, because also, I was in a relationship in, in what some would say, you know, it was a lot of things, like, you know, understanding, you know, polyamory is, was something that I wanted to explore. Well, if you're already in a relationship, you have to go have conversations with that person's family. Well, what does that mean for you guys? And da-da-da. So, I could not talk publicly about certain things because they impacted my real everyday life. You know what I'm saying? Like, when I got off the stage, I would also have to go see these communities that I was a part of and like, if they heard about it through, you know, any other thing outside of like me saying it, then what does that mean?

• 53:24Speaker 02

  And I just wasn't ready to have those sorts of conversations. And so, I guess to answer your question, like, you know, I just got brave over time and once, I also felt like I had community because the albums and the art and music, what it also does is it signals like, hey, I'm out here, I'm out here. And then you meet people who come to your shows and you meet other artists and people, other humans who like, are like, oh, I identify with that, or I fuck with that. And then we become friends and you have a community now that supports you, that sees you, that even if your family you were born into doesn't support you or see you, you have support. And so, once I felt supported and I felt safe enough, that's when I started to become even more brave and

• 54:10Speaker 02

  I, I started to be courageous in the way that I started to live my life. And I think right now, what I am doing, I've done this privately, is that I'm honoring all of me. I'm not closing off, you know, my sensuality anymore. I'm not closing off my sexuality, my polyamory. If you listen to Only Have Eyes 42, you know, that's honoring that sort of union. If you're listening to Hot From The Age Of Pleasure or Champagne Shit, or even Floated, you know? You know, I, I, I'm feeling much lighter now. I'm floated. I had to let some things go

• 54:48Speaker 02

  to get to this place. And fear of not being accepted was one of them. And once I got over that hump, everything started to change for me.

• 54:58Speaker 00

  Community, when you were saying that, like, I hope everyone listening, if you're sitting, listening to this or watching this in your room and you haven't been able to fully embrace your sexuality, whether it's people around you, you're afraid how they're gonna accept you. Like, there are so many people out there that will love you and like, are so, having the same feelings as you. And so, just don't limit yourself to just the people that you've been assigned as family to you.

• 55:22Speaker 02

  Absolutely. It gets better. Yep. As you start walking, whenever you're ready, don't feel pressured to. Cause I mean, there were moments where I felt the pressure to talk, like interviewers would, they would just speculate based on my appearance because I was wearing a suit. They were like, hmm, you're a lesbian. Like, that's what I would get. You're a lesbian. And, you know, as I was trying to discover who I was and I didn't identify with being a lesbian, I, I, I, you know, and, and I had lesbian friends. I love my lesbian family. But like, people would say certain things and try to force me to out what I was. Well, if you're not a lesbian, then what are you?

• 56:02Speaker 02

  And so, I wasn't ready. So, don't feel, also feel pressured to talk about your sexuality. It is a private, it can be as private or as public as you want it to be. For me, it was seeping out into my art so much that like, I'm like, yeah, this is, this is me. This is who I am. And I wanted to also free a lot of people who were in their rooms, who could be in their rooms right now, listening. Like, you have family, you have a church, even outside of the, the church that you went to. If they disown you, like, there is a big church around the world with people who will affirm you, people who are like you.

• 56:45Speaker 02

  Your identity is not new. Like, it's been happening. We're here. We're showing up for each other. And I love you. I love you.

• 57:01Speaker 00

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Haagen-Dazs. Okay, it is so important to take some me time. You know what I mean, guys? So, take your sweet time and enjoy rich, smooth, creamy ice cream from Haagen-Dazs. Because honestly, when was the last time you actually slowed down and let yourself have a moment for you? You have to try their new cherry dark chocolate bar. Guys, picture rich cherry ice cream with tart cherry ribbons coated in thick dark chocolate. Are you kidding me? I'm drooling. Are you drooling yet? No, seriously. This is the kind of thing you don't just eat, you experience it, okay? Haagen-Dazs elevated crafted ice cream is always meant to be savored. So, whatever flavor you choose, slow down and enjoy each bite.

• 57:44Speaker 00

  Seriously, it's too good to rush. I grew up with Haagen-Dazs in my house. Every single night, my family and I would eat our favorite flavors. I'm obsessed with the cherry dark chocolate bar. Those flavors together, I couldn't be happier. I'm gonna watch my favorite TV shows and I'm gonna be eating that. Boom, done. Take your sweet time. That's Dazs. Available at retailers nationwide. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by American Eagle. Okay. So, fall is almost here and the new arrivals from American Eagle, kinda obsessed. We're talking sweet dresses, soft sweaters you'll want to live in, on-trend jeans and cargos you'll want to wear on repeat. And if you see a style you love, grab it now because you already know the good stuff doesn't stay in stock for long.

• 58:29Speaker 00

  You can check it all out at ae.com or just go to the store. When I was researching, I, I read somewhere, you don't refer to opening up to others about your sexuality as coming out, but rather coming in. Can you explain that?

• 58:44Speaker 02

  I didn't actually come up with that terminology of coming in. I just thought it resonated with me more. A guy by the name of John, I forgot his last name, but I heard him say it and he, he's a queer black man. And I heard him and I was like, that's exactly what it is. It is bringing people, bringing people into our worlds. I'm letting you in on who I am. Versus like, you guys are the norm and I'm just like, hi, I'm out here. Like, no. I'm letting you in to my world, which is sacred, which should be respected and appreciated. Most certainly not apologetic about it.

• 59:29Speaker 00

  I love that. You're so right. Cause it's like, I'm letting you in on who I am. I don't, you don't deserve me. I don't have to come out to you. I don't owe you anything.

• 59:37Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 59:38Speaker 00

  Like, when I feel comfortable, I'll let you in.

• 59:39Speaker 02

  Like, come clean. You're, come out of the closet. I'm sorry. I've been here. You just must not have seen me. Or, not even you must not have seen me, you must think that you and your, or you know what? Let's not even talk about that. I was gonna go down a whole stream.

• 1:00:00Speaker 00

  I could too. I could too. How about this? Do you have a mantra you come back to when it comes to people who actively do not agree with the way that you live?

• 1:00:10Speaker 02

  Ooh, yeah, I do. I have so much. I wish I had my phone with me.

• 1:00:17Speaker 02

  But I think it comes down to power, you know? I think, like, when you give your power up to folks, like, people's opinions have more power over you than how you feel about you. That's, I think, where things take that turn. Where the depression sets in, where the constant need for approval comes in. And I think I'm a powerful ass motherfucker. You know, really? Just as, you're powerful. We're all powerful, right? We all hold gifts that we have. And I think that, you know, again, how I think about myself has to be more powerful than someone who is trying to take me down through their negativity,

• 1:01:01Speaker 02

  who is trying to oppress me through their fear. My power and my love for myself is greater than that.

• 1:01:10Speaker 00

  Mic drop.

• 1:01:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:12Speaker 00

  Mic drop. What is something when it comes to dating and love that you know now that you wish you knew when you were younger?

• 1:01:19Speaker 02

  Oof. Sheesh, man, um, I would say, I wish I had discovered vibrators a long time ago. Like honestly, it's so fun to experience that with your partner.

• 1:01:36Speaker 00

  It's phenomenal.

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  It's so great. It's like, what, going to the sex shop? Like, I remember when I first went, see, again, when you come from those sort of like conservative backgrounds, a sex shop, I was full sunglasses on, like, do not have me in here. Oh, my God, what am I, oh, my God, please, nobody take photos of me. Like, I did not know.

• 1:01:58Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:01:58Speaker 02

  I did not know the world of vibrators. I did not know the clitoral stimulation that you and your, the fun y'all can have with one. You know, it doesn't necessarily have to be penetration.

• 1:02:11Speaker 00

  It's life changing.

• 1:02:12Speaker 02

  Right? How about you?

• 1:02:14Speaker 00

  I remember I, I didn't have one and my friend bought me one for my birthday in college. And I, I remember like the first time I tried something was the back of my electric toothbrush. And I was like.

• 1:02:26Speaker 02

  I ain't gonna front.

• 1:02:27Speaker 00

  No.

• 1:02:27Speaker 02

  The electric toothbrushes, if you're, if you forget, just go buy you a brand new one.

• 1:02:33Speaker 00

  It slaps.

• 1:02:33Speaker 02

  It's gotten me through. It's gotten me through.

• 1:02:36Speaker 00

  It is a lifesaver. And so I, I felt the same way, though, of I, my friend got me my first one and then I was like, oh, my God, like, I'd never have to have sex again. Like, this is amazing. Like, it just allowed me to recognize that, like, I hold the power of, like, my own orgasm and, like, I, I don't need someone else to make me feel amazing. Like, I can do it myself because being taught, like, we grow up and it's just like, the men will do this for you and like, you, and I'm like, why am I gonna wait for a motherfucker to give me an orgasm? Like, this is amazing.

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:03:07Speaker 00

  Don't wait for a man or anyone to give you, you can do it yourself.

• 1:03:10Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:03:11Speaker 00

  So I remember, I felt the same way in New York. I remember the first sex shop I went to with my friend. I was not famous, but like, I was mortified just being like, I just can't make eye contact. And I think that just comes from like shame of like, we're not normalizing, like, like exploring your sexuality and enjoying, especially as women, like enjoying sex, loving sex, being connected with your body. And I think it's so important that we start to have those conversations at younger ages, obviously in a safe way, but like,

• 1:03:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:03:39Speaker 00

  especially for young girls, you just start to like feel shame and like you're doing something wrong. And that's why so many women, I truly believe, like, we have such a hard time in the beginning, like, figuring out what works for us and knowing how to like get off because we were like, it was basically like, don't touch yourself. You're a whore, you're a slut. And it's like,

• 1:03:57Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:03:58Speaker 00

  What?

• 1:03:58Speaker 02

  Or you're a deviant or like touching yourself, gross. You know, like, if it was not, you go get a boyfriend and y'all, wait, but don't have sex, actually, until you're married. So go marry to have sex. Like, I have cousins who actually married women just to have sex. Because they were just like, God won't. It's a lie. It's a lie. And I'm, I, I, I will always just like, you know, say, like, my heart goes out to, to those of us who have clitorises and, and, and, and just, not just those of us who are with, with clitorises.

• 1:04:39Speaker 02

  Even, you know, for, for those of us who have penises or whatever it is, the pleasure that we can give ourselves, like how that was stripped away from us.

• 1:04:50Speaker 02

  I just hope that we can reconnect again with our bodies and reclaim our bodies. That's the space that I'm in. Like, I am reclaiming my sensuality, my, my sexuality, my pleasure. Like, unapologetically, like, I'm not apologizing for talking about it, for taking time to myself to make up for lost times. I mean, I think I could have avoided a lot of just even sexual interactions with people who I didn't really like, but I just was like, well,

• 1:05:21Speaker 00

  Here we go.

• 1:05:22Speaker 02

  this is the only way that I can feel less shame about sex is if I do it with this person. But like, that leads to so much confusion sometimes if you don't really, really, really like this person and they don't really, really like you. And it's a whole thing. And so I think you actually avoid, um,

• 1:05:42Speaker 02

  you have less stress when you take matters into your own hands, literally.

• 1:05:46Speaker 00

  Absolutely. Okay. Everyone listening today, we are entering our era of the art of pleasure. Okay, we're taking it into our own hands.

• 1:05:54Speaker 02

  Yes, we are.

• 1:05:55Speaker 00

  Um, I know we've been kind of like essentially talking about it this whole episode because we're talking about pleasure and finding our own voices to find that pleasure. But what has been the most rewarding part of making this soundtrack for you?

• 1:06:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, just like, you know, we're, we're talking about it's a soundtrack to a lifestyle. And I think so many people, or, you know, that I'm, that I'm hearing, that's why I can't wait to go on tour. I'm on tour. Our first show is in Seattle, the end of August. We're on tour, so get your tickets. We have some more, a little bit more available, um, but they're selling out right now. And I'll be on tour in North America through October 21st, the Age of Pleasure Tour. And so to see how people are like, making this their album, owning it and like, with their friends, I see them just certain songs, they're like, oh, my God, you're speaking to my heart.

• 1:06:51Speaker 02

  Like, I, I needed to hear Float. I needed to give myself permission to, to let things go and, and to go into my, you know, a stage of like, what hot is talking about. Like, I look good, I look sexy, I look handsome. Like, non-binary folks are feeling seen, trans folks are being seen, seen. Like, the community in which I intended for it to be, and even outside of that, I think that you don't necessarily have to be a part of my community to, to, to vibe with it. I think that what it just represents is like, even in the midst of chaos, you gotta find your pleasure. You have to make time for yourself. And I actually brought you something.

• 1:07:33Speaker 00

  Oh, what? What?

• 1:07:35Speaker 02

  So, here's.

• 1:07:37Speaker 00

  Oh, my God.

• 1:07:38Speaker 02

  Official Age of Pleasure. I cut mine.

• 1:07:41Speaker 00

  Well, I was gonna say, it's so cute. No, wait, it's so cute. You know I'm gonna do this. Like, it's so cute.

• 1:07:46Speaker 02

  I wanted to bring you.

• 1:07:50Speaker 00

  This is so sweet.

• 1:07:51Speaker 02

  A shirt. And if you need another size.

• 1:07:54Speaker 00

  No, this is so good.

• 1:07:55Speaker 02

  I'll give you another one.

• 1:07:56Speaker 00

  No, I'm, can I cut it like you?

• 1:07:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, cut it like me.

• 1:07:59Speaker 00

  I'm just copying you. But I've been staring at it and like, it's such a vibe.

• 1:08:03Speaker 02

  It's yours.

• 1:08:04Speaker 00

  Thank you.

• 1:08:05Speaker 02

  I adore you.

• 1:08:06Speaker 00

  It's so dope.

• 1:08:07Speaker 02

  I wanted to bring you a hand.

• 1:08:12Speaker 00

  This is so good.

• 1:08:12Speaker 02

  No, no, the hand, a handwritten, um, autographed, I don't know if that's what I mean to say. I autographed you a copy of my book that I released in 2021 called The Memory Librarian.

• 1:08:25Speaker 00

  Thank you so much.

• 1:08:26Speaker 02

  A Dirty Computer. And, um, yes.

• 1:08:30Speaker 00

  This is, bringing the gifts, right? And girl, I know you just got back from vacation.

• 1:08:35Speaker 02

  I did.

• 1:08:36Speaker 00

  You're giving us all, you're getting us in our feels. We're all ready to go have sex with ourselves.

• 1:08:40Speaker 02

  Come on.

• 1:08:41Speaker 00

  We got a book, we got a shirt.

• 1:08:42Speaker 02

  Come on.

• 1:08:43Speaker 00

  Okay, to anyone that is like, you gotta tell us, what is, if you have to pick, what is your favorite song on the soundtrack?

• 1:08:53Speaker 02

  Ooh, shoot. Wow.

• 1:08:56Speaker 00

  Everyone's gonna go listen to this one.

• 1:08:57Speaker 02

  It's so, okay, it varies because all of them, man, I, I, I mean, I hate to say it, but it's, it's, um, it's not a long album. I usually put out like, excuse me, like double albums. And with this one, I wanted you to wanna replay it over and over and over again. I didn't wanna, excuse me, I didn't want it to be too long. Because this one was just on, um, President Barack Obama's, um, song of summer, Only Have Eyes 42. Four two. Uh, so listen to that one.

• 1:09:30Speaker 00

  Love it.

• 1:09:31Speaker 02

  I mean, but I love every last song on this project. I'm having a hard time like figuring out what songs we're gonna play on tour. I think I might have to just play all of them. I don't know. But because I love, I, I also thought about them from a live perspective and just,

• 1:09:46Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:09:47Speaker 02

  how fun it's gonna be to perform Champagne Shit and.

• 1:09:51Speaker 00

  It's gonna be insane.

• 1:09:52Speaker 02

  And I don't know, what songs were you vibing to? What are some of your favorites?

• 1:09:55Speaker 00

  Champagne Shit, um, is it called Phenomenal? I really like that one, like.

• 1:10:01Speaker 02

  Featuring Dochi.

• 1:10:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's a vibe where like, I don't know, I really like that one. Like, but again, I, it, it feels like it's a story that's being told. And you're just like, it's almost like an anthem vibe where you're just like vibing the whole time. So I, I agree. I guess I couldn't like pick one too, because you almost have to like listen to it all together, like start to finish and like feel it.

• 1:10:21Speaker 02

  Cause a Dry Red is good, the last song. I love, um, I, when I was writing this album, I wrote it with friends. I gotta give a shout out to Nate Rocket Wonder, to Bueno, to Nana Quabana, and also the features. Like, some of my favorite things is just to look down and be like, okay, Grace Jones is literally on this album. You know, Sister Nancy, who is like, bomb, bomb, you know, we can't go anywhere at a, at a party without hearing her Jamaican influence. Petra, her Jamaican influence. Um, when I think about, um, Nia Long, who is an incredible actress, coming and being a part of it.

• 1:11:01Speaker 02

  Amare, Dochi, um, who else? Uh, Fela, Kuti Sun, Shayun Kuti, uh, lots of horns on this project. Um, CK's on this project. Uh, I don't know, it's just so, like, such a beautiful love letter to the diaspora and to, to music that, again, has gotten us through, you know? Um, a lot of the influences come from a lot of my friends who were in, you know, who are from Nigeria at our parties, Ghana, uh, South Africa, LA, New York, Atlanta, um, you know, all of us coming together and, and feeling safe.

• 1:11:44Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:11:45Speaker 02

  Safe enough to explore, safe enough to be.

• 1:11:48Speaker 00

  Janelle, I can't thank you enough for coming and Call Her Daddy. This was truly such a pleasure. I'm so happy I got to sit in the same room with you and feel your energy. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

• 1:11:57Speaker 02

  You are fantastic, Alex. Thank you so much for having me and all the beautiful work you do. Like, I don't really love doing lots of interviews, but you have a very great way of, of connecting human to human with folks. And I'm sure people tell you that a lot, but I'll just say, like, I feel your aura and your energy through the screen. And, um, just congratulations on everything.

• 1:12:22Speaker 00

  Thank you.

• 1:12:23Speaker 02

  You're fantastic. You're lovely.

• 1:12:24Speaker 00

  Thank you. Woo.

• 1:12:40Speaker 00

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• 1:13:22Speaker 00

  We're talking sweet dresses, soft sweaters you'll want to live in, on-trend jeans and cargos you'll want to wear on repeat. And if you see a style you love, grab it now because you already know the good stuff doesn't stay in stock for long. You can check it all out at ae.com or just go to the store. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Stouffer's. Let me tell you something. When I am hungry and I am trying to figure out what to eat, sometimes you can just actually become so, you're angry. You're like, I am busy, I'm hungry, I'm getting hangry, I'm getting angry, what can I eat? I need something hot and delicious and low maintenance. Well, introducing Stouffer's dinners are not only delicious,

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