Si King: How Grief Shapes You, Overcoming My Breakdown & Finding Peace After Divorce!

How do you begin again after losing someone who was a huge part of your life? In this heartfelt episode of Begin Again, Hairy Bikers star Si King joins Davina McCall for a conversation about grief, friendship, love and finding purpose after the heartbreaking loss of his best friend and TV partner, Dave Myers. Si opens up about the extraordinary bond he shared with Dave, from their first meeting to building the beloved Hairy Bikers together, and the devastating reality of watching his closest friend battle cancer. He reflects on navigating life without Dave and how he's slowly learning to embrace a new chapter while keeping Dave's memory alive. He also shares his own remarkable journey of resilience, from losing his father at just eight years old to surviving a life-threatening brain aneurysm, experiencing a mental health breakdown and learning to rebuild his life. Alongside these personal moments, Si discusses the healing power of food, family and community, his passion for bringing people together, and the exciting new projects giving him renewed purpose and joy. 🌟Like, comment and subscribe for more honest conversations about purpose, resilience, love, loss and beginning again. Follow us here: 📸www.instagram.com/beginagain 🎥https://www.tiktok.com/@beginagainpod ✨Sign up for the Begin Again newsletter for behind-the-scenes access, recommendations and much more: https://linkly.link/2g2xm Follow Si King here: 📸https://www.instagram.com/sikingofficial/ 🎥https://www.youtube.com/@SiKingOfficial Buy ‘Proper Home Cooking’ by Si King at: https://www.orionbooks.co.uk/titles/si-king/proper-home-cooking/9781399642842/ We'd love you to share your Get Busy Living stories with us at https://getbusyliving.beginagainshow.com/ (00:00) Intro (01:14) Si's new cookbook 'Proper Home Cooking' (06:53) Losing His Dad At 8 Years Old (10:29) How Grief Led Him To Motorbikes (17:53) Monzo GBL Ad (19:29) Working With Ant & Dec (24:09) How Si Met Dave Myers (31:00) What Brought Si & Dave Together (33:08) How The Hairy Bikers Began (34:48) Monzo 90 Days Ad (35:53) Opening His Own Restaurant (39:48) Processing Dave's Death (41:26) Finding Out Dave Had Cancer (44:35) Life After Losing Dave (45:09) Si's Brain Aneurysm (46:37) Divorce And Staying Friends With His Ex-Wife (57:01) Starting A YouTube Channel (59:25) His New Business (01:00:18) What's Next For Si? Sponsored by: Download Monzo. Monzo Current Accounts are for 16+ and UK residents. Ts&Cs Apply. Integrated accounting with Pro and Team business plans start from £9 a month. Only for UK sole traders or limited company directors. Ts&Cs apply. Join the 'Say Yes Club' and hear more about our events here - https://events.beginagainshow.com/ Sync ID is: MB01TIUBXXBQEFZ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:31Speaker 01

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• 0:58Speaker 02

  Stonefire naan is baked in blazing high heat to give you buttery charred flatbread for any meal.

• 1:03Speaker 03

  I love it with tzatziki and barbecue chicken.

• 1:06Speaker 04

  Stonefire naan is great when you're lost in the woods with your leg in a bear trap.

• 1:10Speaker 02

  I love making naan grilled cheese. Is that guy okay?

• 1:13Speaker 04

  I'm in shock by that buttermilk taste.

• 1:16Speaker 03

  Works great for pizza. Can we get him some help?

• 1:19Speaker 04

  You can share Stonefire naan with your friends, like this friendly Wolverine.

• 1:24Speaker 02

  Doesn't sound friendly. From our tradition to yours, Stonefire, together we naan.

• 1:29Speaker 05

  I don't mean to alarm you, but it's almost two o'clock and she's still not here.

• 1:33Speaker 06

  Where is she? He's gonna be here any minute.

• 1:40Speaker 05

  What is that?

• 1:43Speaker 06

  It sounds like a motorbike.

• 1:54Speaker 06

  Looks like I made it in time. Right, I'm off to interview PsyKing.

• 2:04Speaker 06

  So PsyKing, hairy biker, he's coming here, we don't know how. Is this him? Is this him? Yes!

• 2:12Speaker 06

  This is my deepest curtsy I can do.

• 2:14Speaker 07

  Oh, bloody curtsy, for god's sake, woman. That's when you're only showing off. How you doing? Let go now, it's embarrassing, I can't. Get off me, I can't.

• 2:28Speaker 06

  Hi.

• 2:28Speaker 07

  Hello.

• 2:43Speaker 06

  PsyKing!

• 2:48Speaker 06

  I'm so happy and excited to have you here.

• 2:52Speaker 07

  Thank you.

• 2:53Speaker 06

  And first off, I just want to say congratulations for this.

• 2:56Speaker 07

  Thank you, David.

• 2:57Speaker 06

  This is my kind of recipe book because it is very homely. It's the kind of thing you want to eat at the end of every day. It's healthy, it's practical, it's not too difficult.

• 3:12Speaker 07

  No.

• 3:12Speaker 06

  You can end up actually being able to cook things that you thought maybe you couldn't. When you look at the page here, there's not just a weighty tome of information that is overwhelming. This is a cookbook for everyone.

• 3:30Speaker 07

  It is, it is, very much.

• 3:32Speaker 06

  And it was inspired by your upbringing, right?

• 3:35Speaker 07

  Very much so. Well, it was more a bit of a love letter to the culture and knowledge that was passed down to me from my mom and my grandma and, you know, my brothers and my sisters and friends.

• 3:49Speaker 06

  And that you're passing down to your kids.

• 3:51Speaker 07

  And that, yeah. And it was that really. And it was a bit of a celebration about the culture of food that I had in my family and the things that... There's some great recipes and there's a chapter called "The Dishes That Shaped Me Out".

• 4:07Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 4:07Speaker 07

  And which is part of the reason I'm still this shape. Because my mom was born in 1922 and she was one of those women of her generation that was largely unfulfilled. Because there was lots of women of that generation that were the same. And the way that my mom expressed her creativity and expressed her love and emotional sophistication was through words, but also through the food that she cooked for the family. And it's a bit of a homage to my mom and my dad.

• 4:43Speaker 07

  And that's what the book's about, really. It's about... I had at the very front of my mind my two wonderful grandchildren, George and Ada, and their family unit, my eldest son and his wife Lauren. And I just observed how ridiculously busy life was because they live in the south of England where, you know, the pace is quicker, it just is. And I was struck that they'd made a very clear decision that they didn't want to feed their kids UPF or processed foods.

• 5:18Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 5:19Speaker 07

  But that takes time and it takes effort. So I thought, well, okay, maybe with the food that we've been brought up with, all of us, through the generations, and 42 years of me standing in kitchens and chopping stuff, maybe I can put all of that knowledge and shortcuts and hints and tips together to actually, to help scratch cooking for a busy family that comes in at half past five at night, the kids are starving. So all of the recipes, other than a few, you can elevate for the adult palate or just keep it simple for the kids. But you all eat the same. I mean, I'm getting a little bit deep now, but that's fundamentally what this book is about.

• 6:01Speaker 07

  It's about that social cohesion and glue. And I've kept all of the ingredients lists really short because I know what it's like. You look at an ingredient and think, oh, sod that fruit, it just can't be arsed.

• 6:14Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 6:15Speaker 07

  And I want people to use the book. And it's affordable.

• 6:19Speaker 06

  I mean, I think one of the reasons why I loved food, I'm half French, and when I used to go to France, it was a sit-down affair for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

• 6:29Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 6:30Speaker 06

  And actually, it was quite a strict environment. My grandparents were quite strict, but we were there to taste and talk. And it was a brilliantly social thing. And I think about lots of families now, I think one of the things that we all miss is that community feeling of coming together around a table. It doesn't, like you said, it doesn't really matter what you eat.

• 6:54Speaker 07

  No, we see it together.

• 6:55Speaker 06

  As long as you're together, you know?

• 6:57Speaker 07

  That sort of formality, like, I remember my dad died when I was eight, but I remember him, because he was in the Royal Navy for a lot of his life. Wherever you didn't want to be in the Second World War, floating about in a ship, my dad seemed to be.

• 7:12Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 7:13Speaker 07

  And there was a discipline to that when he came to the table because that's how he'd lived. And he used to say, if I went to put the salt on anything that mom had cooked before tasting it, I'd get a clip round the lug. And he'd go, where do you think you are, the naffy? And I was like, I have no flimmin' clue what he was talking about. I was like, what? No, dad, no. And he said, you bring the food to the salt. He said, so put the salt on the edge of your plate. And to this day, just as a matter of rebellion, I ignore him.

• 7:49Speaker 07

  And I mean, I do, when I'm out for proper posh, I'll go, sit on the side of the plate and go, there you are, you old bugger. So, you know, but I think it creates an environment of respect.

• 8:01Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 8:02Speaker 07

  For the food that's on the table, for the preparation of that food. And it is convivial in its celebration, isn't it? That's what it is. And that must have helped you, it does help you. That level of socialization is important. And there's so many kids that can't be, don't know how to behave at table.

• 8:22Speaker 06

  You were talking about sitting down at the table with you and your parents and your dad dying when you were eight. That's actually so young, really, isn't it, to lose a father? What are your recollections of life after that? Was it kind of... Could you grieve your dad, really? Or did you stay strong for your mom and...

• 8:46Speaker 07

  To be honest, I think it's taken me quite a long time to rationalize it.

• 8:51Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 8:51Speaker 07

  Because it does, because, you know, at here, you're just presented with the second circumstances and you're just getting on with it. And as the Jesuits used to say, give me the boy or the woman from nought to seven, and I'll give you the man or the woman.

• 9:04Speaker 06

  I didn't know that. So basically, you are formed.

• 9:08Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 9:09Speaker 06

  In those years. So when your dad was around.

• 9:12Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 9:12Speaker 06

  For the formative time of your life.

• 9:15Speaker 07

  Yeah. And I mean, look, I think it's, to some extent, it is true. I think the foundations of your character and personality are formed then. And on retrospect, I certainly think a portion of, a large portion of mine was. After my dad died, there was mom and I, and we grieved around the stove. So, because, you know, as I said, mom's way of showing comfort and affection and safety and boundaries and security and all of that, and routine, was...

• 9:49Speaker 07

  You know, was to was to cook. And then I'd cook with mum. But the only problem was for for each year, I was the same in stone. So at eight, I was eight stone, at nine, I was nine stone, at ten, and I was thinking, this is getting bloody ridiculous. You know, I mean, I'm just about to go to big school and that's not a great place to be moving up into that that place. So so I think in answer to your question, I think that I took I took a major amount of responsibility on.

• 10:23Speaker 06

  Yeah, the man of the house.

• 10:25Speaker 07

  Yeah, and I I think, well, I don't think I know that that that has that has coloured and formed my character and application to the world I live in and my family and community because I I I'm a terrible one for fixing stuff. I I want to fix stuff. I don't I I don't want anybody I know and love to be in distress or to be worried about anything, to be. So and I'm really hard on myself as well.

• 10:53Speaker 06

  I was just gonna say, I was just gonna say you're a bit hard on yourself there because when you say I'm a terrible one for fixing things, I don't want people to be in distress, I'm thinking. Oh, my God, sorry, that's such a beautiful thing. You know, that you want to, if someone's having a difficult time, you want to help them. And I know it might feel like it comes from somewhere sad, but it's a beautiful, it's a beautiful thing in you.

• 11:21Speaker 07

  Is it born out of sadness? Yes, it was born. Well, I guess it was. I don't know. I can only. You you you never track the development of your character or personality, do you? Because it's impacted by so many things, mostly in my case by experience. And but then again, you can say that about anybody and everybody. So, yeah, I think. I think it was the level of responsibility that I took on when I was younger, that that that definitely was a major. A a major player in the development of my personality and character. Yeah, definitely.

• 11:58Speaker 06

  How did you? How did you come to biking?

• 12:01Speaker 07

  Oh, God. Well, my dad was a after he my dad was I I was I had the great privilege of being. Uh, um, uh, uh, I was I was there to accept him on behalf of my brother and my sister. And my mum, who would who would unfortunately died by then, but my father was um was a dispatch rider in the Second World War because he he was injured and his recovery was it was tough. Tough old times then. He was on the Arctic convoys. So there was this top brass commodore came down and said the Ministry of Defence would like to offer you this as a posthumously for your dad's service in the Arctic convoys. Which is how, because he was from Lambeth, my dad, which is how he came up to the north eastern, fell in love with my mum.

• 12:46Speaker 07

  And during his time, he he slipped and fell down a shaft and damaged his kidneys, which was actually dad was one of the first kidney transplant patients in the country.

• 12:55Speaker 06

  That's crazy, right?

• 12:56Speaker 07

  Well, it was mad. It was mad. It was mad. I remember reading a book while my dad was in in the bed, so we'd we'd got in bed in hospital, having had the operation. And my dad, we were all lining up to say goodbye because he hadn't made it because the anti rejection drugs weren't as sophisticated as they are now. And I remember my sister saying, look, I want you to be very brave when you go in because you're gonna have to say goodbye to dad. I was thinking, well, where's he going? He's in bed, you know, and it was that sort of rationale. So anyway, when my dad was really poorly, I used to go down to me Auntie Hilda and Uncle George's that lived on this croc, lived on this crossroads. And just up from the cottage, there was this big industrial estate called the Team Valley Industrial Estate in Gated.

• 13:40Speaker 07

  And all the lads after the shift had come along these crossroads and they all had motorbikes. Because working class men and families, that's what they had then, and they'd crash them. So me Auntie Hilda would always have, she used to call it the blood and bandages day.

• 13:55Speaker 06

  Oh, God.

• 13:56Speaker 07

  So she'd she'd whip, I I remember very vividly ripping ripping up white sheets. And for for bandages, for makeshift bandages. And so the the the knock on effect of that is there was always some dodgy motorcycle with bits missing in me Uncle George's outside toilet. So so I used to come down and stay because my dad was on kidney dialysis. Me Uncle George would go. Go on, son, have a go. And I'd be like, does it run? He goes, why, I? Because he'd tinker with them, you see. So when I'd come down, so I used to, I I've ridden motorcycles through fences.

• 14:35Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 14:36Speaker 07

  I've there's I've ridden motorcycles in a circle because they were so damaged, they could only go around in circles. I've been, so I got the bug really, really early on. And I mean, I I literally, I was about six.

• 14:48Speaker 06

  But what a brilliant skill to work on engines or bikes. It's, I mean, you can then transfer that to so many other things in terms of just being that way inclined.

• 15:02Speaker 07

  Yeah, you can. And I mean, I've got I've got to say, oh, Davina, ask me to join two bits of wood. Useless. Give me an internal combustion engine and you you you you might get a result. Do you know what I mean? I'm bloody hopeless. Yeah, it is useful. It is, you know, I I I I loved it because it. I spent a lot of time when I was younger in my own head and still do. And it was great to get out of my head. Because I was doing something in front of me and and, you know, fixing bits and being analytical and and going, okay, well, that fit doesn't do that.

• 15:35Speaker 06

  It's meditative.

• 15:36Speaker 07

  It is.

• 15:39Speaker 06

  To that thing. It's that.

• 15:41Speaker 07

  It's that. Whatever that was, that is it.

• 15:46Speaker 06

  Um, but it's it helps to to switch off in some ways. So how old were you when you did that?

• 15:52Speaker 07

  Uh, from the age of six. Um, me Uncle George gave me a spanner.

• 15:56Speaker 06

  And when did you when did you get your first bike?

• 15:58Speaker 07

  I got my first, well, my own, very own first bike at fourteen. And it was a it was a Honda CB five hundred TE. Um, and the TE had electric start.

• 16:10Speaker 06

  It's amazing, isn't it, that you can remember?

• 16:12Speaker 07

  It is, don't worry, you do, don't worry.

• 16:13Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 16:14Speaker 07

  And I sprayed it red and, oh, it was great. And then I had an excess six fifty US custom. I mean, it literally, you shook your kidneys out, everything you got in it, but it was. But I loved it and I rode that illegally for years. I mean, yes, because, well, mum and I didn't have any money, so, you know, and me mum worked at at a place called Purse Care on on Birtley Main Street that was like the pre runner to to be in M Bargains. It was one of those great little shops where it sold sold everything. And I used to go and pick me mum up on Pension Day, which was Tuesdays. And it was the widow's pension on a Thursday, which wasn't worth having, but she picked it up out of principle because it was one pounds eighty nine a month.

• 16:55Speaker 06

  God, that's mad, isn't it?

• 16:57Speaker 07

  And um, and yeah, we used to, my mum used to hitch her skirt up and she used to get on the back of the bike and I had no tax, no insurance, no MOT and only one helmet.

• 17:06Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 17:06Speaker 07

  So my mum used to wear the helmet and I used to go up through the estate and across the all weather pitch of the local the local comprehensive school called Lord Lawson, yeah.

• 17:16Speaker 06

  Something unbelievably free about being on a bike. Like you just feel, it's feeling the wind in your hair. And this thing of you're mobile, you can kind of get through anything, you can go anyway. When I got clean from drink and drugs.

• 17:36Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 17:37Speaker 06

  I wanted to do something to give me a hit. Like a of adrenaline or anything, like I was, I got tattoos, I got like, and I learnt how to ride a bike. I passed my test.

• 17:50Speaker 07

  Did you?

• 17:51Speaker 06

  Yeah, but I.

• 17:52Speaker 07

  I didn't know that about you, Davina.

• 17:54Speaker 06

  My best friend, her husband, um, had a bike accident the week I I passed.

• 18:01Speaker 07

  Right.

• 18:01Speaker 06

  And he showed me a picture of his ankle before it got fixed and I never got on a bike again.

• 18:06Speaker 07

  Oh, no, no, no, no.

• 18:08Speaker 06

  Yeah, and I loved, it gave me

• 18:13Speaker 06

  such a feeling.

• 18:15Speaker 07

  It it's an extension of that. The great thing about motorcycles is that it's not starting from point A and getting to point B. It's the bit in the middle. And that's that's the thing. And it's an extension of me fiddling with bikes because it just I just empty my brain.

• 18:35Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 18:36Speaker 07

  And and when I'm on it, I'm thinking, because I know through bitter experience that it really hurts when you fall off. So so and I've fallen off plenty. You reach a kind of zen like, it's you, it's the bike, it's the if you're that type and if you're that type of person and character, it it's it's so good for your mental health and it just enables me to empty my head. Because my head's constantly on the go, constantly on the go. So as soon as I put my helmet on and I'm gone, then there is a quiet and a peace that.

• 19:13Speaker 06

  It's healing.

• 19:15Speaker 07

  You know, I never I never really looked at it like that, but yeah, yeah. And I've got to get you back on a motorcycle.

• 19:22Speaker 06

  Monzo sponsoring Begin Again to help us win back some time so we can do more of what we love. I wanted to know what that thing was for you. So let's have a look and see who we've got. Yvonne says she spent the last twenty years ticking things off her bucket list. And it's had such a positive impact on her life. What's next, Yvonne? I am forty five and I really feel like I'm just at a point now in my life where I'd love to just go off and do something that's just for me. I love the thought of doing or learning about breath work, maybe some chanting or Tai Chi and really just learning about meditation in general. My God, Yvonne and I alike. We need to meet. I mean, you are so talking my language.

• 20:04Speaker 06

  I love this, Yvonne. Go do the retreat. It would be absolutely amazing. And I love meditating. It is so life changing. It doesn't even matter if it works out or it doesn't work out. You had a go and the feeling of having a go at something, you're gonna feel really proud about yourself. And you're gonna want to try something else. So let's do this. Let's say yes more. In fact, I'm gonna make it happen right now. I'm calling it the Say Yes Club. We're gonna take one thing we've always wanted to do and we are actually going to do it. So I'm gonna put a link in the description for you to come and join us. Because that's exactly the thing that Monzo is here to help with. They put our money to work in the background. Sorted, saved, sent where it needs to go.

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• 20:59Speaker 00

  Whenever fall comes back around, it always feels like a fresh start. This year, I've been layering in some styles from the new Lululemon fall drop. Because the weather is shifting and I find I have to be ready for the entire day and not just one part of it. Lululemon's fall line has some really versatile transitional pieces. So I can just wake up, throw on a matching set.

• 21:17Speaker 02

  Add a jacket or a fleece and head out, knowing that I'll feel comfortable enough to go wherever the day takes me. Check out the new fall arrivals in store and online now at lululemon.com.

• 21:28Speaker 02

  Stonefire naan is baked in blazing high heat to give you buttery charred flatbread for any meal.

• 21:33Speaker 03

  I love it with tzatziki and barbecue chicken.

• 21:36Speaker 04

  Stonefire naan is great when you're lost in the woods with your leg in a bear trap.

• 21:40Speaker 02

  I love making naan grilled cheese. Is that guy okay?

• 21:43Speaker 04

  I'm in shock by that buttermilk taste.

• 21:46Speaker 03

  Works great for pizza. Can we get him some help?

• 21:49Speaker 04

  You can share Stonefire naan with your friends, like this friendly Wolverine.

• 21:53Speaker 02

  Doesn't sound friendly. From our tradition to yours, Stonefire, together we naan.

• 21:59Speaker 06

  So when you started out in work, like what were your first steps? Because it wasn't, it was sort of in production and TV, but it wasn't presenting. And it was actually quite a long time really before you got to that. So how did you start?

• 22:17Speaker 07

  I started on a student film at Northeast Media Training Centre. My then-wife, Janie, we got pregnant with Alex. And I had absolutely zero prospects, no sign of, I was a gigging musician. And a friend of my sister's at the time rang me up and said, listen, I'm at Northeast Media Training Centre. Do you want to come and drive the money bus? You know, and we'll give you, we'll give you a hundred, two hundred and fifty quid for the week. And I thought, flipping Nora, great. Well, yeah. So off I went. And then while I was there, I saw this advertisement on the, and I was a bit of a, you know, I was, I was living on my wit and gale, put it that way. And, and I saw this advertisement on

• 23:00Speaker 07

  the notice board in the corridor in the MTC and thought, oh, hold on. And it said, new BBC children's drama, looking for runners. So I nicked the, the post thing and stashed it so nobody could get it. And I'd done quite a lot of work with kids from what the Tories called a grade A and B priority areas. So all of the areas that their economic policy and neoliberalism had decimated, i.e. heavy industry and importing coal and blah, blah, blah, left huge swathes of generations going, whoa, what the hell do we do now? So I worked with them in, in what was called, of Bell's Court Studios. So that put me in good stead. So I went for the interview and it was for the pilot of Byke Grove.

• 23:44Speaker 06

  Oh, my God, was it?

• 23:47Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Matthew Robinson gave me my break, who was the then, who was the then producer and exec producer. And it was out of a production company called Zenith North in the North East. Yeah, yeah.

• 23:59Speaker 06

  Oh, my God, that is so funny.

• 24:02Speaker 07

  So I was Ant and Dec's runner. And then I went on to first assistant director. So I was, I was, that's what I, that's what I did.

• 24:11Speaker 06

  Byke Grove.

• 24:12Speaker 07

  Byke Grove.

• 24:14Speaker 06

  Was so brilliant.

• 24:15Speaker 07

  It was a really.

• 24:16Speaker 06

  It was so brilliant.

• 24:18Speaker 07

  It was. It was great. And it was a, it was a touchstone for a generation.

• 24:22Speaker 06

  Yeah, it really was.

• 24:23Speaker 07

  It really was. And, and, and Ant and Dec were just, you know, they were, they're, well, still are.

• 24:28Speaker 06

  They still are.

• 24:29Speaker 07

  Lovely lads like that.

• 24:30Speaker 06

  Do you oversee them?

• 24:31Speaker 07

  I don't, I think it's really interesting when I do see them because I don't think we know what to do with each other. You know, it's like, hold on, Kingy, what, what, what happened there? You know, and you're, well, I'd say, well, you've done all right. You know, it's like, it's a bit out of context for each other. And because we never get to spend the time and have a crack on in a

• 24:50Speaker 06

  Well, they're down south.

• 24:51Speaker 07

  And we are in the north. And it's that, that kind of thing. But I have the, I have the fondest memories of them both. They're, they're good people, good people and brought up really well.

• 25:01Speaker 06

  They're great, aren't they?

• 25:02Speaker 07

  Brought up good, a good bunch.

• 25:04Speaker 06

  So you had grounding, like in the TV business. And not only that, you actually did, I mean, a grafter, clearly, you know, you went, you managed to make it from runner to AD, which is like a big leap. You know, people saw you.

• 25:16Speaker 07

  Yeah, they did. And I'm, I'm forever grateful for, for, for that, really. Because, and it was Matthew Robinson, who, I, I don't know Matthew, I think he lives in Thailand now or somewhere. But after I did this, the, the shows for, for, with the pilots, he said to me, well, what do you want to do? And I remember pointing at a guy called Paul Paxton, and Paul was the floor manager, the FM. And I said, oh, I want to do his job. I'm thinking, and I was a runner, you know, I had no idea of what, I kind of had a rough idea because I'm a quick learner. And, and he said, yeah, all right then. I went, shit.

• 25:54Speaker 06

  That's because he saw something in you.

• 25:56Speaker 07

  Well, yeah, I mean, I

• 25:57Speaker 06

  He knew.

• 25:58Speaker 07

  I, I, I was able to talk to the kids and have a crack, you know, and, and, and talk to them like they were human beings, as opposed to just

• 26:05Speaker 06

  And I think floor managing more than anything else is a people job.

• 26:09Speaker 07

  Hugely, hugely, very, very important. And I remember thinking, well, it's really sink or swim time. It's, this is it. You know, I've got, and, you know, I had, Alex had just been born. So I had a, it was, the pressure was on. So I wanted, I wanted to make it work because I found, I'd kind of found my groove a little bit, you know? And then I continued. And then I'd just take whatever job came up in the North East.

• 26:38Speaker 06

  How did you meet Dave?

• 26:40Speaker 07

  We met at a, at a pub called The Egypt Cottage. Dave came to a Catherine Cookson. I was already established as, as, as crew and I was the second AD at that point. And Dave had come up for an interview for cheap makeup artist and, and hairdresser and prosthetics. He was very talented at that as well. And I was thinking, a bloke doing makeup, what's going on? You know, because it was pretty traditional then, you know? And this, this dude walked in that looked like an upside down Hells Angel. And I thought, this is going to be great. This is going to be big beard, bald head, looking kind of miserable and mean. And I was like, get in. And, because I was the second at that point, and we worked really closely with costume and makeup and all that. And I said, all right, man, how

• 27:22Speaker 07

  did it go? And he was like, oh, I think I've got the job. And I went, I said, what fancy you're drinking? Because at that time, it was the afternoon, you, you know, once you've done the work.

• 27:31Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 27:32Speaker 07

  I said, right, okay, listen, right, what's, what's the crack here with the call sheet? Right? How long for a woman with wig? How long for principal? How long for da, da, da? And we worked that out in about literally 25 minutes. And he said, oh, he said, I'm starving, Kingy. I said, oh, hold on, I'll go and ask Julian, who was the, who was the manager at the time. I said, do you what you got on? And he goes, oh, we've got, we've got a curry. And if you buy a curry, there's, you get two pints of curry and a poppadom for eight quid. I was like, right. There was two poppadoms and, and all everybody else, you know, because it was that time, we're eating salads and stuff. And me and Dave were playing pool and he ate a curry and a poppadom. And Dave goes, oh, I'll have

• 28:12Speaker 07

  what Kingy's having. So that was it. And that was a firm friendship, solidified over food, motorcycles, travel.

• 28:20Speaker 06

  I, I talk about meeting my best friend when I was 19, like falling in love.

• 28:26Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 28:26Speaker 06

  You know, when you go, oh, God.

• 28:29Speaker 07

  Yeah. It, it, yeah, it was, it was that. It was that. Because it's really interesting you should say that, Davina, because I never really thought about it like that before. But it definitely was that. I think as we got to know each other a little bit more, there was a working class, two northern working class overweight lads. So there was a connection there. But there was also a connection with motorcycles and things. So you had the headlines of your, your relationship. And then you had, you had another scene, which was exactly that, because you're both working in the industry. But at that time, it was mental. Everybody was working 90 hour weeks. It was nuts.

• 29:04Speaker 06

  People were sleeping under desks.

• 29:06Speaker 07

  Oh, it was crazy.

• 29:06Speaker 06

  No one went home. Like, it was, the hours were mental, weren't they? There was always somebody that would come in earlier than you. So you had to come in earlier than they would. So you wouldn't lose your job.

• 29:15Speaker 07

  Yeah, it was all of that. It was that weird, weird kind of structure of management where everybody would keep an eye on. And Dave and I just were like, you're all mental. And we just did our own thing, you know? But then, then, then Dave became part of my family unit because he'd recently been divorced. He was up in Huntley without a, without a partner. And, you know, he, he, my boys to this day still say, oh, you know, my Uncle Dave, you know, it's that, that's how it, that's just how it was. So then there was a, albeit they were very, very different people with, with, with our, with very different

• 29:55Speaker 07

  insecurities and, and, and trick, and I hate that word, triggers, but, you know, things that, that, that we struggled with.

• 30:04Speaker 06

  But in a way, that's also helpful.

• 30:06Speaker 07

  It's really helpful.

• 30:07Speaker 06

  You can support him with his, he can support you with yours. It's a nice, you know, somebody's got the same triggers as you. It's a disaster. You wouldn't, you wouldn't do anything like

• 30:16Speaker 07

  No, you wouldn't, would you? Can you imagine?

• 30:17Speaker 06

  Go anywhere.

• 30:18Speaker 07

  No, just sit in here. Let's have another cup of tea.

• 30:21Speaker 06

  But suddenly you had this idea about you and Dave. Because it was your idea, wasn't it?

• 30:26Speaker 07

  Yeah, it started off with, well, I have to, I can't take all of the credit for that. There was a, there was a, a lovely woman called, now called Lisa Laws, was then called Lisa Jones, who got a first from, from Durham University in English.

• 30:42Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 30:42Speaker 07

  And Lisa was on the Catherine Cookson dramas with me. And we, we, and we remained great friends. And Lisa, I said, Lisa, listen, I've got this idea. I said, you know what I'm like with pen to paper, there's a block, there's a block. And it was that typical working class block between, between pen and paper. When you get over it, it's amazing. But at that time, I just didn't, I knew what I wanted to say.

• 31:08Speaker 06

  So it was an idea, but you didn't know how to put it on paper?

• 31:11Speaker 07

  Exactly.

• 31:12Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 31:12Speaker 07

  So Lisa helped me with that. And then we sent it off to Dave, who was working in Canada. And it was just when emails had started. So you never really knew what you were doing, but you just hoped it got there. And it's, and it got there. And, and, and Dave came back and said, Oh, I like this idea. Can you, um, uh, and, and I've showed it around the, the crew. Well, he was on a, he was on a Christopher Lambert film, you know, and he said, none of them think it's shit.

• 31:35Speaker 06

  Wait, wait. Which one?

• 31:37Speaker 07

  I don't know. Can't remember.

• 31:38Speaker 06

  Oh, wow.

• 31:39Speaker 07

  Honestly, I'm sorry. I can't remember.

• 31:40Speaker 06

  No, but that's mega. Like, how interesting.

• 31:43Speaker 07

  Dave, you know, Dave, Dave.

• 31:45Speaker 06

  That's so good.

• 31:46Speaker 07

  And he was Christopher Lambert's personal makeup artist.

• 31:49Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 31:50Speaker 07

  It was, it was pretty.

• 31:51Speaker 06

  Because obviously I'm half French, like.

• 31:52Speaker 07

  Yeah, well, he's, you know.

• 31:53Speaker 06

  Big news, you know?

• 31:54Speaker 07

  Well, he, yeah, and amazing. One of my favorite films is Subway with Isabella Jeanne. I mean, that's so stylized. It's fabulous. And then Dave and I started to develop it together because we, you know, we just kind of got it. And.

• 32:09Speaker 06

  And this is but the birth of the Hairy Bikers.

• 32:11Speaker 07

  This is the birth of the.

• 32:12Speaker 06

  And what I quite like is, um, the fact that it was just called Hairy Bikers, sort of as a nickname.

• 32:20Speaker 07

  Yeah, it was. It was, it was, it was one, it was either, it was either Vic Ramgianti, who was a very famous documentary producer and director, or John Stroud, who was also very famous, you know, won the comedy rose of Montreux. And I mean, really, top, top draw. And, uh, and I think they'd just written it on the top of a subject matter for Harry Bikers. And I thought, well, that sounds all right.

• 32:47Speaker 06

  Bit rude, bit rude.

• 32:47Speaker 07

  Bit rude. Are we? I suppose we are, I inferno. And, and that was it, really. Uh, uh, and, and the kind of name just.

• 32:54Speaker 06

  What I love is it does what it says on the tin, like.

• 32:57Speaker 07

  It kind of, yeah, it does, doesn't it? I suppose.

• 33:00Speaker 06

  When did it become something that you liked? Was there a moment where you went, actually?

• 33:05Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 33:06Speaker 06

  Because it sticks so easily.

• 33:07Speaker 07

  It, it does. And you know, I think it was one of those titles that it, you had to deliver on it, you know, it was just, and that's what we, and I just, you know, I took it as an excuse to be as creased as I liked, you know. So I was like, I'm great. No, grow me, and I had long hair anyway. So, yeah, that was a lovely moment. It just, it just stuck to me. Now, it was the way it was, you know. So we just.

• 33:29Speaker 06

  And how did you bond over food? How did that happen?

• 33:33Speaker 07

  Well, we had a, we had a New Year's Eve. So I used to go after, after we'd filmed, I used to ride, um, a, a, a Nakadaw old Evo, uh, motorcycle, Harley Davidson motorcycle, up to Davidson Huntley, which is about 50 miles north of Aberdeen, which is where Dave lived at the time. And we had a New Year together. So I took the whole family up and Dave had mates coming from all over the place and film directors and producers that he knew and all that. So we all went up and, um, and I just started, we had a big New Year's Eve party and I just started to do stuff in the kitchen. He goes, what are you doing? I said, Oh, I just thought I'd cook in the, uh, well, I just, he says, no, no,

• 34:15Speaker 07

  I'll, I'll cook. I said, Oh, well, do you want it? Shall we do it together? Shall we, should we?

• 34:20Speaker 06

  Because can I just say?

• 34:22Speaker 07

  That was it.

• 34:23Speaker 06

  That's quite difficult. I think sometimes if you love cooking, a lot of people are quite terr- do you know what I mean?

• 34:30Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 34:30Speaker 06

  They're a bit territorial. So the idea that you two could come together.

• 34:35Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 34:35Speaker 06

  And cook in harmony in a high stress situation like New Year's Eve.

• 34:40Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 34:40Speaker 06

  Is impressive.

• 34:41Speaker 07

  Well, we, we never really thought about it like that. He goes, yeah, all right. And King, I mean, he was slightly territorial because he was like, what bloody hell are you doing in my kitchen? And I was like, well, I just thought I'd get you a handbag. And he was like, yeah, all right.

• 34:52Speaker 06

  So rude.

• 34:52Speaker 07

  Uh, you know, it's like 15 people to feed, you know. Um, and he was like, yeah, good idea, good idea. So anyway, we just cracked on. And I remember we, we had a whole line of Gloucester Old Spot that we covered in, uh.

• 35:05Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 35:05Speaker 07

  In, uh, it was really good. Like, I still remember it to this day. We served that with some, uh, with some jasmine rice. Uh, and yeah, that was a good, that was our first, that was our first dinner together.

• 35:17Speaker 06

  That was our first.

• 35:18Speaker 07

  It was so nice.

• 35:19Speaker 06

  Did anybody there that night go, oh, you two are brilliant in the kitchen?

• 35:23Speaker 07

  Yeah, they were all going, oh, bloody hell, that's a miracle. You know, because we're quite big personalities and we, yeah, it was, it was nice. Yeah, it was a good, it was good crack that. It was a good night. It was a good night. I think I'm still recovering from the hangover. It was nearly 40 years ago.

• 35:37Speaker 06

  What I love is you did do, you did do a treatment and you did make a treatment and you sent it and you sent it to, was it six people?

• 35:45Speaker 07

  Yeah. And all of them said, um, all of them said, apart from John and Vic Ram, all of them said, uh, it needs to be celebrity led. And we went, no, we're not doing that.

• 35:56Speaker 06

  That's also brave because sometimes people think, oh, well, if this is a job in telly, I'll just say yes. But it was very good that you stood your ground.

• 36:06Speaker 07

  We did. And I mean, it took us, standing the ground, uh, directly equates to three years scratching your head and going, oh, shit. Um, you know, because we could have flogged the idea and, you know, we could have taken the back end and just happy to, but we wanted.

• 36:22Speaker 06

  But it wouldn't have had the success.

• 36:24Speaker 07

  I don't think it.

• 36:25Speaker 06

  Had with you guys.

• 36:26Speaker 07

  Well, that's very kind of you to say to Vina. Thank you.

• 36:29Speaker 06

  No, it wouldn't.

• 36:29Speaker 07

  No, I don't think it would. And, and also my motivation for writing it in the first place was I was terrified that because I'd had my nose to the grindstone, I'd had two kids, I didn't know what to say to my, my sons about the world that I live in.

• 36:42Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 36:43Speaker 07

  So I wanted to travel and I wanted to bring back stories and I wanted to bring back different, you know, touches and tastes of different cultures. And it's just the way.

• 36:54Speaker 06

  I love that.

• 36:55Speaker 07

  Oh, it was really, it was really important to me because I was terrified, you know, I was a working class lad, living on his witting guile, thinking, shit, what am I going to do? I've got, I've got, I've got a family and what am I going to say to them? What stories am I going to tell? Where, what am I going to do? Um, and that was a massive motivator for me. Massive, massive.

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• 38:02Speaker 06

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• 38:23Speaker 00

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• 38:54Speaker 01

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• 39:23Speaker 06

  What happened? Because there was obviously a time in your life where you were like, oh my God, I don't know what to do next. There are bills to pay. Life is hard and I've got to, I've got to quickly pivot. This is an amazing begin again moment, I think, in your story um to make a living.

• 39:42Speaker 07

  Well, I I was presented with an opportunity with Proper, um which was the little restaurant they've got up in Sunderland that I thought I was terrified because I'd not been in a place long enough to actually concentrate on one thing because Dave and I were on the road constantly, you know, we would, you know, we'd travel five times around the world. We were up and down the country for the BBC. And so I took the opportunity and Dave was, you know, Dave was coming to the end of his illness and very poorly. And I, it's become a very, very special place. Um, the, the restaurant has been embraced by

• 40:24Speaker 07

  the Sunderland, particularly the Sunderland and North East community. I, you probably may or may not know, I, I'm a, I'm a committed socialist, so I run my business like that. Um, everybody gets paid ten percent above the, the living wage. We all have profit share. We all have bonuses. And, you know, all of the team, we now, I think Rory and I, uh, Tom and Joe, we've now got thirteen people working for us. And it's a great tight team and they're absolutely brilliant. They are brilliant. But as is the community that has accepted us because we want to be cons, I call it the Emporium of, the Emporium of

• 41:06Speaker 07

  nostalgia through food. So it's, there's wonderful moments where people come and sit and eat mince and dumplings, for instance, and they go, eh, I've not had this for years.

• 41:17Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 41:18Speaker 07

  You know, and it's just.

• 41:19Speaker 06

  It is very nostalgic food.

• 41:21Speaker 07

  It is.

• 41:22Speaker 06

  The way that it can make you cry, I think, sometimes, something that's brought back a memory of.

• 41:27Speaker 07

  Oh, you know what was, what was wonderful? Um, and I was telling, I, I was telling uh my mates before, there was a wonderful, and it's happened consecutively over the time that we've been open, that um sons and daughters bring their mom and dad down.

• 41:42Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 41:43Speaker 07

  And, and with, with, with either Alzheimer's or dementia and stuff.

• 41:47Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 41:48Speaker 07

  And, and, you know, when you picture proper, it, it's kind of three, I've got three, three horse stalls, okay, that are next to each other.

• 41:59Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 42:00Speaker 07

  And they're, and if you think of a Peetie Blinders set, that's what sheep folds is like. So we've got big, we've got big braziers with, with fire going and the smoke and stuff. And then you sit outside, um, and you eat your mince and dumplings or your pie or, or your school, your school dinner cake or, you know, those full of nostalgia. And there's a couple of occasions where, where literally the front of house and the kitchen and the pot wash will have all been in tears because somebody's had something to eat and the lights have gone on just momentarily. And it's so emotional when you see that, that you know, because we work really bloody hard at what we do.

• 42:39Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 42:40Speaker 07

  All of the ingredients come from a sixty mile radius of the community in which we serve. And, and that, those moments are so special.

• 42:49Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 42:50Speaker 07

  And it creates an atmosphere and energy that, that is, it's really special to be in receipt of and, and, and very special to have the characters and personalities around the business that, that care as much as I do. And it's so humbling.

• 43:05Speaker 06

  I mean, it's um, it's amazing because actually I think i- in your life, you have had many moments where you've, you've had to kind of restart. And obviously, I want to come back to life after Dave.

• 43:21Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 43:22Speaker 06

  Um, because a bit like with my sister, there was like, um, B C is before Caroline and A C is after Caroline.

• 43:31Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 43:32Speaker 06

  Like it's two separate chapters of my life. Do you talk to Dave?

• 43:36Speaker 07

  On occasion.

• 43:37Speaker 06

  Yeah, I talk to Caroline.

• 43:38Speaker 07

  Yeah, on occasion.

• 43:39Speaker 06

  Oh, you'd love this.

• 43:40Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 43:41Speaker 06

  You know what I mean? Like.

• 43:41Speaker 07

  Well, I, I often say, oh, you know, if I get a break with something or, or, or I'm kind of, I'll go, oh, thanks, mate. No, no, I'll go out. Oh, yeah, I got it. Aye, thank you. And I still.

• 43:51Speaker 06

  I believe that.

• 43:52Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 43:53Speaker 06

  I believe that.

• 43:54Speaker 07

  I do too. And I think, I think it's interesting about grief as well, isn't it? Because it's as nuanced and as, as individual as the people that, that are feeling it.

• 44:03Speaker 06

  Exactly. And everyone's different.

• 44:05Speaker 07

  Everybody's different, yeah.

• 44:06Speaker 06

  You're in early stages.

• 44:07Speaker 07

  I kind of am. I'm still pretty angry about and buggering off, really. And I think that's.

• 44:12Speaker 06

  Anger's normal as well.

• 44:13Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah, it is. There's tenants of it, isn't it? But I'm not really an angry person and I, I just, yeah, I, I, I struggle with that about myself and about that bit of the character. It, it, look, I had two years of, my journey with, with, with Dave's illness was very different to what everybody else sees because, because it was highly personal and it was highly, and it was very private.

• 44:36Speaker 06

  Yes. And also, obviously, you know, Caroline's my sister and I lived with her, but he's got um a wife.

• 44:42Speaker 07

  And, and, yeah.

• 44:43Speaker 06

  He knows. I get that.

• 44:44Speaker 07

  Yeah. And we, and, and I think, you know, to be fair to us all that were around that, we, we, we all navigated it in, in, in very different ways, but the best we could.

• 44:55Speaker 06

  Yeah. I think one in two of us is going to get cancer.

• 44:58Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 44:58Speaker 06

  I know that from doing stand up to cancer. But I think when you get it, you always think, I'm not that person.

• 45:03Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 45:04Speaker 06

  I always was like, I'm not cancer person, but I was.

• 45:08Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 45:09Speaker 06

  What, what was that experience like when he told you? And how was he?

• 45:14Speaker 07

  I, I, I think quite rightly, there was a, there was, there was a level of disbelief and, and I, I remember where I was. I was, I was, I was on the A1. Um, and he went, are you, are you on your own? And I said, uh, yeah, yeah. And he said, I've got, I, I, I've got cancer, King. And it's, he's, he was such a bugger. Because his first thought was, uh, uh, you know, well, in between Cuba, I'll probably be able to film or do something. And I was thinking, what are you thinking about work for you, lunatic? And I was going like, well, well, you know, we'll see, you know, it's fine, we'll work it out, man, we'll work it out, we'll work it out. And there was just this surreal moment of like, what do you say?

• 45:52Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 45:53Speaker 07

  And what you think you share.

• 45:55Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 45:57Speaker 07

  And, you know, and if you don't know what to say, so I, I, I, I don't know what to say.

• 46:01Speaker 06

  Yeah, but say something.

• 46:03Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 46:03Speaker 06

  Yeah. But I don't know what to say is as good as anything else.

• 46:07Speaker 07

  Say something.

• 46:07Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 46:08Speaker 07

  You know, it is. And I, inevitably, I went into asking lots of questions that probably Dave hadn't had the time to answer because, you know, he, he told me straight away. And I think the two of us were just a bit, as was Lil and, and, and, and Dave's stepchildren, we, we were all like, hmm, uh, okay. And then there were, it was, it became very clear quite quickly that, that, that the family wanted, and Dave, they were up for the scrap. They were up for the fight. And my role as the, as, as Dave's friend

• 46:48Speaker 07

  was to support that endeavor. It didn't matter what I thought or what the, the route that, that I personally would have taken. It was about supporting them and in the best way that I could. And it was.

• 47:01Speaker 06

  I'm sure he was really grateful for that.

• 47:04Speaker 07

  I think, you know, he was very poorly, Davina, so and, and certainly near the, near, near the end, it was, it, it, there's a, there's an old, there's an old Arabic saying and, and, and I'll forgive me if I get this wrong, but it, it, it basically is, it basically boils down to, um, to know life. One has to know death.

• 47:25Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 47:25Speaker 07

  Because it is the circle of all.

• 47:27Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 47:28Speaker 07

  And it, and it is that, you know, it is that. And the middle bit is up to you.

• 47:34Speaker 06

  It's such an honor to be at someone's birth and it's an honor to be at someone's death. And it is like, um, a certainty in our life is that we are going to die.

• 47:47Speaker 07

  Yes.

• 47:47Speaker 06

  You know, can't avoid it, can't sidestep it.

• 47:50Speaker 07

  Can't sidestep it.

• 47:50Speaker 06

  We're all gonna do it.

• 47:51Speaker 07

  It's all, it's all gonna happen, you know, and it's about, it, you know, it's about how you approach that.

• 47:57Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 47:58Speaker 07

  And, and, and, and it is, the approaches are as varied as the individuals facing it.

• 48:04Speaker 06

  And continuing on without him, like, what was that like? What is that like?

• 48:12Speaker 07

  It's different, um, very different. Um, because we were part of, uh, we were part of a double act and the, we always took each other into consideration. However, however that manifested itself, it was all given the circumstances. It was always, we always, we always did that for each other.

• 48:36Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 48:36Speaker 07

  It's just different, Davina.

• 48:38Speaker 06

  Hmm. Can I ask you about a time when, when I read about it, I thought, wow, that, that would have been quite major about your brain aneurysm?

• 48:48Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 48:49Speaker 06

  How old were you when that happened?

• 48:50Speaker 07

  I, it was two thousand and fourteen.

• 48:53Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 48:53Speaker 07

  I look back at that, at that man, and I don't recognize them. I, I, it was a, it was a world.

• 49:06Speaker 07

  It was full of contrast.

• 49:08Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 49:08Speaker 07

  I was loved, but I caused quite a lot of pain and anguish. And after the brain hemorrhage, it took me a good, I'd say, three or four years to kind of go, oh, God, who in God's name was that? And, you know, I.

• 49:27Speaker 06

  And do you mean after the operation?

• 49:30Speaker 07

  Um, no, I think before the operation, it was, you know, Jane and I, Jane and I, my then wife was, was, you know, we, uh, and we, we got divorced in the end and, and, you know, nobody wants to bring that, you know, to your kids or your family and that, that, that kind of anxiety and frustration and undermining all of those, you know, all of those tenants of life that you set out to, to bring. Um, and, and, and security as well, it had a, it had a profound effect on my family.

• 50:05Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 50:06Speaker 07

  And thank goodness, you know, Jane and I are, are, are great, great mates and I adore her. She's fabulous woman.

• 50:13Speaker 06

  How did you, um, do it in an amicable way? What, what was at the forefront of your mind to, to keep you and Jane mates through the experience?

• 50:26Speaker 07

  Uh, uh, it wasn't because it was so painful and I don't think it was for Jane either.

• 50:30Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 50:30Speaker 07

  Um, I, I mean, we wanted to be as amicable as we could be for, for, for, for our children, you know? And, and Jane was way more emotionally mature than I was going through that process, I think. Um, I don't think, I know. Um, and what I would say, it just takes time.

• 50:50Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 50:50Speaker 07

  It's time and it's.

• 50:52Speaker 06

  That's actually a really nice thing for people to hear.

• 50:54Speaker 07

  It is.

• 50:55Speaker 06

  It might not be instant, it is a painful thing, but.

• 50:57Speaker 07

  It is because you inevitably.

• 50:59Speaker 06

  Time.

• 51:00Speaker 07

  Yeah, it is, Davina, it is possible with time and it's, and it's important, it's important. Uh, I, you know, and, and it is, it is, you know, a divorce is rather like a marriage. It's about compromise and it's about understanding where you went wrong and being adult about it and kind of going, well, you know, it, it takes two to tango.

• 51:21Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 51:21Speaker 07

  And it's never anybody's fault.

• 51:24Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 51:25Speaker 07

  It's just the way it, yeah, it just broke.

• 51:27Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 51:28Speaker 07

  And it's, it's, you know, uh, uh, I, I've, I continue to think and, uh, about it a lot in the sense that, you know, I have been incredibly lucky in my life that I have been, I've, I've been loved. And that love doesn't break, it becomes different.

• 51:48Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 51:49Speaker 07

  But I was loved at that time of the person that I was and, and

• 51:56Speaker 07

  uh, you, you have to treat that with, with enormous respect. Because that, and then, and then I've been loved after that.

• 52:05Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 52:06Speaker 07

  Um, and, you know, love just changes. It's, it's, it's kind of shapeless because it is, it is about the person that you are and what you're giving off and all of those nuances about the time that you are and the existence that you have and the life that you have at that point. Um, so, but you can't dismiss it because it is part of the journey and knowledge that shapes you as you go through to maturity and, and, you know, you have to treat it very gently and kindly and with respect.

• 52:42Speaker 06

  So, thinking about that and your, your aneurysm, was your aneurysm quite a turning point for you? Not just in terms of like thinking about your mortality? Cause I think any, I mean, having been through brain surgery myself, I, I mean, I faced the idea of somebody's doing an operation on your brain, you get all the Ts and Cs are pretty horrific. And, um, and, and you have to face, this is one of the reasons why I did this podcast, like, what do you need to begin again and again and again, so you can sit on your deathbed and go, I did it.

• 53:18Speaker 07

  Yeah, I'm all right.

• 53:18Speaker 06

  I did it, you know?

• 53:19Speaker 07

  God.

• 53:20Speaker 06

  So.

• 53:22Speaker 07

  You're a brave woman, aren't you?

• 53:23Speaker 06

  Well, you're a brave man, like it's a, it's, life is.

• 53:28Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 53:28Speaker 06

  Life makes us brave, everybody.

• 53:30Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 53:31Speaker 06

  Nobody gets through.

• 53:32Speaker 07

  Nobody gets through with scot-free.

• 53:33Speaker 06

  Yeah, scot-free, right? Like, so it's so important. But was it, well, first off, I want to ask you, where did they operate? How did they operate? How did they get in? What did they do?

• 53:44Speaker 07

  So they went in through my groin and put an inclusion in, and it was.

• 53:49Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 53:50Speaker 07

  It was, uh, it blew my mind, it absolutely blew my mind. And, um.

• 53:54Speaker 06

  It's amazing.

• 53:55Speaker 07

  It was, it was amazing, it, it was amazing. And they put this little, I don't know what it is, titanium or whatever it is, this little kind of wire mesh in the point where the, the, I had a, I had a vein that was, and it was leaking. So I had blood in my, um, in my spinal fluid. So it was pretty close and I signed off the, that is a salient moment, that.

• 54:21Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah.

• 54:22Speaker 07

  You just go, right.

• 54:23Speaker 06

  Goodbye.

• 54:23Speaker 07

  And he was, I was thinking, shit. And at that point, it wasn't epiphanous, it was just a moment of, is everything in order?

• 54:33Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 54:35Speaker 07

  Have I, will me boys be all right? Will Jane be all right? Will me mates be all right? Cause I left very clear instructions.

• 54:45Speaker 06

  So you did your will?

• 54:46Speaker 07

  I, I did, I, I left, I left very clear instructions about, uh, about what I wanted. And, um, and then they did the operation and I, and I don't know whether you, you had this. I mean, it was a bit out my head, like, but I, I, I had this, I, I did this, I, I kind of woke up. And I thought, shit, I'm here. Oh.

• 55:16Speaker 07

  Oh, oh, well, that's good. And, uh, and I remember moving me legs thinking, oh, that's good. And then I thought, I, I better say something and I'm, this is growing on my hair, right?

• 55:29Speaker 07

  So I went, I'll never forget this, I went.

• 55:37Speaker 07

  Uh, and I thought, shit, that works as well. This is get, this is going well, this is going well. I could feel me arms and I thought, what the hell's that, me arm? It's taking hours, beeps and modders and all sorts of stuff going on. And then, and then this lovely, lovely, lovely nurse came in and said, uh, how are you feeling? I said, uh, remarkably well, I'm starving.

• 56:04Speaker 07

  And then two days later, Dave comes up and he goes, do I reckon, don't you? I said, I know, I, I think I'm all right, man, I think I'm all right. I go, is I'm starving? He goes, great. And he snaffled us in.

• 56:16Speaker 06

  Oh, my God.

• 56:17Speaker 07

  A load of Marks and Spencer's pork pies and, and, and, and some what's easy what's its.

• 56:23Speaker 06

  Oh, my God, can I just tell you something?

• 56:26Speaker 07

  Oh, God.

• 56:27Speaker 06

  You and my husband would be like best friends forever. That would be like, that would be Michael's favorite meal, a pork pie and cheesy what's its. It's like, it doesn't get any better than that, possibly onion monster munch, maybe.

• 56:40Speaker 07

  Oh, yes, pickled onion monster munch, he is a dude.

• 56:43Speaker 06

  Right?

• 56:44Speaker 07

  Yeah, a hundred percent, yeah.

• 56:46Speaker 06

  Any pie actually, but a pork pie, amazing.

• 56:49Speaker 07

  Man, and then I, I, I kind of, I thought, right, okay, we go again, what am I gonna do now?

• 56:56Speaker 06

  Yeah, isn't that interesting? Okay, I've got a second chance at life.

• 57:02Speaker 07

  Yes.

• 57:02Speaker 06

  What am I gonna do with it? And what, what came to your mind when you thought of that?

• 57:08Speaker 07

  I was, I mean, it took about eighteen months for me to get, because literally I'd go home and, and there was a lot of, you, you know, there was a lot of, there was a lot of emotion around all of it and, and.

• 57:24Speaker 06

  Took me eighteen months too.

• 57:25Speaker 07

  Yeah, and, and my behaviors weren't, weren't great and, um, around my, my family and, and it.

• 57:35Speaker 06

  Can I just say something?

• 57:38Speaker 06

  That's okay. Because, because that's a trauma.

• 57:43Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 57:44Speaker 06

  A trauma. And you know what is beautiful about you?

• 57:47Speaker 07

  What's that?

• 57:48Speaker 06

  You, you own it.

• 57:49Speaker 07

  Oh, God, you have to.

• 57:51Speaker 06

  Well done.

• 57:51Speaker 07

  You have to.

• 57:52Speaker 06

  That is, that is, I don't mean to, that's sound patronizing.

• 57:54Speaker 07

  No, not at all.

• 57:55Speaker 06

  I mean, it's a beautiful thing. I'm holding on to your feet here.

• 57:58Speaker 07

  I quite like it.

• 57:59Speaker 06

  Um, just wanted to say that.

• 58:01Speaker 07

  Thank you.

• 58:02Speaker 06

  It's a beautiful thing to hear a man go, I could have done better, but I, it was the best I could do at the time. I was.

• 58:08Speaker 07

  Oh, I could have done, I could have.

• 58:10Speaker 06

  You were in a state.

• 58:11Speaker 07

  Oh, good. Yeah, I was in a bit of a state and, and, and.

• 58:13Speaker 06

  And understandably.

• 58:15Speaker 07

  Yeah. And there was a lot going on with, with, with work. There was, you know, there was, and, and it was pressured, you know, and you know what, the, the, the, the hemorrhage was brought on by high blood pressure and stress. That was the way it was. And trying to keep all the

• 58:30Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 58:30Speaker 07

  plates spinning. So I just, I just wanted to be better. So I, I took myself off, um, because it was pretty clear about two years after, after the aneurysm that I had a, I had a breakdown nearly that would, that would be there. And, and I, uh, and when I fell, my knees properly hit the floor.

• 58:53Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 58:54Speaker 07

  Um.

• 58:55Speaker 06

  Was that a blessing in a way?

• 58:56Speaker 07

  Oh, God, it was such a blessing.

• 58:57Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 58:58Speaker 07

  It was the toughest, it was a, it was a tough 12 months, but I had to keep the plate spinning.

• 59:03Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 59:04Speaker 07

  Um, but I also had to try and heal at the same time and recover. So it was, it was, it was, it was difficult that, that it was very difficult that. And there was, well, support where you thought you would have it that wasn't there. And then there was support where you did have it that was.

• 59:20Speaker 06

  Wasn't there.

• 59:21Speaker 07

  Wasn't there. And it was just, it was a very.

• 59:24Speaker 06

  And then weird support from places you would never expect.

• 59:27Speaker 07

  And, and support from where you would expect to. It's just, it, it.

• 59:30Speaker 06

  It is mad, isn't it?

• 59:32Speaker 07

  Different new world.

• 59:33Speaker 06

  I don't know if you had this, but I had this where people came out of the woodwork and you were like, oh, wow, you are that person. Like, thank you.

• 59:43Speaker 07

  Thank you. It, it is that sense of giving a shit.

• 59:46Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 59:47Speaker 07

  It's really important.

• 59:48Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 59:49Speaker 07

  That, that people that you know and love give a shit. And I was in, in, in, from the, from my family, I was in receipt of that. That it was enormous. It was enormous. And I, you know, and you know, I have, we, I've got fabulous relationship with my kids and, and with my ex-wife and with my friends who I've had since, some of them since I was three. I don't see as much of them as I'd like.

• 1:00:11Speaker 06

  You love them, right? Like, and that never goes.

• 1:00:13Speaker 07

  No, it never goes. They can ask, they could, they could ask me anything.

• 1:00:17Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:00:17Speaker 07

  I mean, like anything.

• 1:00:18Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:00:19Speaker 07

  And we always pick up where we left off. It's like, whether I haven't seen them for 12 months or 18 months in some cases. It's like, oh, you all right, kid?

• 1:00:26Speaker 06

  Yeah, it doesn't matter.

• 1:00:27Speaker 07

  It doesn't matter.

• 1:00:27Speaker 06

  Yeah, I love that. I love those friendships.

• 1:00:29Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's really important.

• 1:00:31Speaker 06

  You've actually achieved, you know, quite a lot. Like you've opened a restaurant, you've done the book.

• 1:00:39Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 1:00:40Speaker 06

  Um.

• 1:00:40Speaker 07

  There's a YouTube channel.

• 1:00:41Speaker 06

  Oh, yes. Can we talk about the YouTube channel?

• 1:00:43Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:00:44Speaker 06

  This is mega. Look at you. You're so groovy.

• 1:00:48Speaker 07

  I'm not entirely sure.

• 1:00:49Speaker 06

  Look at us. This is on YouTube.

• 1:00:50Speaker 07

  Well, yeah, exactly. It's a brave new world, isn't it? Down with the kids.

• 1:00:54Speaker 06

  God, so down with the kids.

• 1:00:56Speaker 07

  I think I was very keen to get my wonderful, wonderful crew back together again. And I wasn't entirely sure how to do, because my best friend is, is a wonderful man called Francois Gandolfi, who I've been around the world with as has Dave numerous times.

• 1:01:17Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 1:01:17Speaker 07

  And he's a very talented, clever man. And I adore him. Uh, and we had, we started to have the conversation about putting it together and, and just, so there's, there's, there's, we, we put a video up on thing about me cooking for this wonderful lady called Hannah Graham, who had her, uh, had a baby, uh, very prematurely. So we talk about that while I'm cooking her a curry. And she's the most amazing illustrator. So as we were talking, she was illustrating what was going on around it. It was lovely.

• 1:01:53Speaker 06

  Watch.

• 1:01:53Speaker 07

  You know, it, it's about being able to have the freedom to kind of go, I find this person fascinating. Let's cook something that they love to eat.

• 1:02:03Speaker 06

  Well, it's.

• 1:02:04Speaker 07

  It's really simple, really.

• 1:02:05Speaker 06

  Yeah, but this is also what I see through all of your work, like, you know, bringing people together, um, proper like food nostalgia, remember this, I want to bring back these feelings. Hannah feeling safe.

• 1:02:21Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 1:02:21Speaker 06

  You know, her, her gifting you something that she's good at. Like, it's such a nice synergy.

• 1:02:28Speaker 07

  It is. It's, and it may, it's, it, it, surely that's what life's about.

• 1:02:33Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:02:33Speaker 07

  And giving people opportunity that they wouldn't ordinarily. If you're in a position whereby you're able to do that.

• 1:02:41Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:02:41Speaker 07

  Then it is incumbent on you to do so.

• 1:02:44Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:02:44Speaker 07

  I think, um, oh, that's how I feel anyway. And, and it, it, you know, I, I love it. It's, it, it's fant, it's fantastic. And I'm, yeah. And if that wasn't enough, I've started a production company up in the Northeast. We have, uh, uh, offices in, in, in the Northeast, in Newcastle, one in London.

• 1:03:03Speaker 06

  You didn't have one before. Isn't that funny?

• 1:03:05Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's, it's great. So and we have, uh, offices in Lille as well in Northern France, because what I was very keen to do was there's a, there's a lovely idea that Francois and I've had about, uh, about linking the north of England and

• 1:03:19Speaker 06

  North.

• 1:03:20Speaker 07

  And the north of France, because.

• 1:03:22Speaker 06

  How lovely.

• 1:03:23Speaker 07

  Because the communities.

• 1:03:24Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:03:25Speaker 07

  And the, the language and the attitudes and the industry is very similar. So it, it, you know, so, so we're working on that. And, uh, and if that wasn't enough.

• 1:03:36Speaker 06

  Brilliant idea.

• 1:03:37Speaker 07

  I'm building a bloody house.

• 1:03:39Speaker 06

  I've done that.

• 1:03:40Speaker 07

  Have you?

• 1:03:40Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:03:41Speaker 07

  What a stupid idea.

• 1:03:42Speaker 06

  Oh, do you know what? I loved it.

• 1:03:43Speaker 07

  Do you love it?

• 1:03:44Speaker 06

  I loved it.

• 1:03:45Speaker 07

  I'm loving it, but I haven't got a bloody clue what I'm doing.

• 1:03:48Speaker 06

  Um, Si.

• 1:03:49Speaker 07

  Yes.

• 1:03:50Speaker 06

  What is next? I mean, as if you haven't got enough on your plate.

• 1:03:54Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 1:03:55Speaker 06

  You've done the book, you've got your YouTube, more Youtubes, obviously.

• 1:04:00Speaker 07

  Yeah, lots more, lots more Youtubes, because there, there's a sense of, there's a sense of freedom.

• 1:04:06Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:04:07Speaker 07

  With that, that I, that I love. The production company will continue to grow and, um, I'm very much looking forward to, um, to that side of things, because I really kind of, albeit that I've been all the way through the industry all of my life, whether it be music or TV or production or film, I've kind of never done that.

• 1:04:30Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:04:30Speaker 07

  Bit.

• 1:04:31Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:04:31Speaker 07

  And, um, and I, I, I feel enormously privileged that I'm able to, that I'm able to have people around me that I know and trust and that ha, we have each other's best interests at heart. And that in our industry is quite rare.

• 1:04:48Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:04:48Speaker 07

  So, and more time with my, with, with my family and my grandchildren.

• 1:04:54Speaker 06

  Your grandchildren.

• 1:04:55Speaker 07

  Oh, my God.

• 1:04:56Speaker 06

  I cannot wait. This is my, this is my next journey.

• 1:05:00Speaker 07

  Oh, man.

• 1:05:00Speaker 06

  This is my next journey. My, my, my eldest child is definitely with the father of her future children. Sorry, I don't mean to put the pressure on you. I keep doing this to you. I'm sorry about that.

• 1:05:12Speaker 07

  That's true. He'll get over it. Be fine. Don't worry, mate. Don't worry. He'll be fine.

• 1:05:17Speaker 06

  But honestly, I am so excited.

• 1:05:20Speaker 07

  Oh, man.

• 1:05:21Speaker 06

  Is it different?

• 1:05:22Speaker 07

  Do you? Yes.

• 1:05:23Speaker 06

  Is it?

• 1:05:24Speaker 07

  It's double the love. So the love that you have for your grandkid, for your, for your, for your.

• 1:05:31Speaker 06

  Child.

• 1:05:31Speaker 07

  Children. And then you get these. It's not many times, Davina, that I'm lost for words, but when it comes to explaining the emotional connection and love that you have for those two beautiful little individuals that, and the great thing is watching them grow and develop. And as you go and develop, and, and I mean, we, I, I'm completely useless. They've got, they've got, that even at, at, at three and six, they've got me wrapped around their little finger. It's.

• 1:06:02Speaker 06

  As it should be.

• 1:06:03Speaker 07

  Oh, my God.

• 1:06:04Speaker 06

  As it should be.

• 1:06:05Speaker 07

  Absolutely wonderful experience.

• 1:06:07Speaker 06

  Oh, I'm so happy for you.

• 1:06:09Speaker 07

  I'm so looking forward. I'd love to do this again when you've got great kids, because you, you would freak out, man.

• 1:06:14Speaker 06

  Well, we'll be friends. Let's give it up for Si King. Oh, my God. I love you. Oh, my God. What a lovely, lovely human.

• 1:06:25Speaker 07

  Thank you for the interview and the opportunity. Thank you, darling. That's kind of you.

• 1:06:29Speaker 06

  So just in case you missed this episode here, if you loved today's episode, I know you're gonna love that one. That one. That.

• 1:06:44Speaker 00

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