Defending Beamchain & the Ethereum Roadmap | Justin Drake

For the Bankless Summit’s inaugural episode, Justin Drake shares his reflection on the Beamchain talk he gave earlier in the week at Devcon Bangkok. Additionally, Justin adds some much needed context and important (and very bullish) facets to the Ethereum Roadmap from his perspective. ------ 📣SPOTIFY PREMIUM RSS FEED | USE CODE: SPOTIFY24 https://bankless.cc/spotify-premium ------ BANKLESS SPONSOR TOOLS: 🐙KRAKEN | MOST-TRUSTED CRYPTO EXCHANGE https://k.xyz/bankless-pod-q2 ⁠ 🦄UNISWAP | BROWSER EXTENSION https://bankless.cc/uniswap 🪄 MAGIC EDEN | HOME OF WEB3 https://bankless.cc/MagicEden 🛞MANTLE | MODULAR LAYER 2 NETWORK https://bankless.cc/Mantle 🤖 dYdX | UNLIMITED LAUNCHING SOON https://bankless.cc/dYdXUnlimited 🗣️TOKU | CRYPTO EMPLOYMENT https://bankless.cc/toku ------ ✨ Mint the episode on Zora ✨ https://zora.co/collect/zora:0x0c294913a7596b427add7dcbd6d7bbfc7338d53f/96?referrer=0x077Fe9e96Aa9b20Bd36F1C6290f54F8717C5674E ------ TIMESTAMPS & RESOURCES 0:00 Intro 4:00 5-Year Ethereum Roadmap 6:58 Part 1 - Execution 14:56 Part 2 - Data 20:23 Part 3 - Consensus 27:49 Audience Questions 33:00 Closing ------ RESOURCES Justin Drake https://x.com/drakefjustin Presentation Slides https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1Yvzh5q2jjlcW_g95s-7E4Gk5ZL-scM3l/edit#slide=id.p5 ------ Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures⁠

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:04David Hoffman?

  Bankless Nation, I just got off my flight back from Bangkok, from DevCon, where we all had a fantastic time throughout the week of DevCon, talking to all the nerds, learning about the future of Ethereum, and about all the ways that Ethereum is changing the world. And on the last day of DevCon, the day after DevCon Saturday, we hosted the Bankless Summit, which had 10 speakers, all giving their most interesting, their most fascinating talks possible. That is what I charged them with, and all of the speakers rose to the occasion. We recorded all of those talks, and we are going to be releasing those talks on the Bankless Podcast feed and on the YouTube, slowly, over the next few weeks. You are about to go hear Justin Drake's talk, which was a reflection of his talk at DevCon, the Beam Chain talk, adding in some additional, much-needed context

• 0:48David Hoffman?

  that I think he wished he had introduced the first time when he introduced the Beam Chain at DevCon, along with many other facets of the Ethereum roadmap. There's also Peter Van Valkenburg's talk, which is going to come later, as well as Arjun Bhatani's talk from Connects, some of the most interesting, fascinating talks that I've listened to in this space. We got a ton of positive, amazing feedback from the Bankless Summit. So, thank you to all the speakers who worked so hard putting their talk together. The audience loved it. We had a packed house. I'm looking forward to the next Bankless Summit, whenever DevConnect is announced. But meanwhile, while you wait, we'll serve you up all the talks from this year's Bankless Summit, the first-ever Bankless Summit. So, let's go ahead and get into that first talk from Justin Drake, right now. But first, a moment to talk about some of these fantastic sponsors that make this show possible. If you want a crypto trading experience backed by world-class security

• 1:33David Hoffman?

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• 2:17David Hoffman?

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• 3:01David Hoffman?

  You can get there at magiceden.io to get started. Launching a token? Worried about the IRS? Talk to Toku for five minutes to learn how to save hundreds of thousands of dollars for you, your team and your investors. Now, if you do an initial consultation, Toku will cover the cost of your token valuation, which is what you need for your launch. So don't wait. Reach out to the team right now at [email protected]. That's [email protected]. Justin Drake is going to make you very bullish. Justin Drake.

• 3:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I'm being sandwiched by Eric and Max. Front run by Eric and then back run by Max. Let's see how it goes. So I'd like to share some takes about the roadmap. And just as a point of disclaimer, these are my takes. These are not official EF or roadmap takes or anything like that. So, one of the things that, as a researcher, is getting me really, really excited, is that I think we can take what is possibly humanity's most ambitious Distributed Systems roadmap and complete the whole thing within the next five years. And this is kind of what I wanted to try and communicate, to an extent, three days

• 4:26Speaker 01

  ago with the Beam chain. And basically, what I'm suggesting is that we take the hardest items in the roadmap, those that are very, very difficult to do incrementally in the short term, and kind of batch them in a single fork. And there's been kind of different pieces of feedback. On the one hand, I've had amazingly positive feedback from the devs. And, you know, many, many people emailed the email address, many people messaged me on Telegram and on Twitter and things like that. And today, I'm kind of very pleased to share, somewhat astonishingly, that we have five

• 5:06Speaker 01

  new teams that have signaled interest in building a Beam client. And so, from the perspective of devs, I think, you know, there's a lot of excitement to participate in this new journey. But one of the things that have happened is that, on Crypto Twitter, the feedback was much more mixed. In particular, this is possibly like my most hated slide ever. Which is basically saying that, you know, it's gonna take roughly four years, from 2025 to 2029, to ship this extremely ambitious fork, and people want things in the next four months, not the next four years. And basically, I think the attitude of Crypto Twitter is that we're gonna enter this period of darkness.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  We have, you know, light at the end of the tunnel, but we have a five-year tunnel, and it's just gonna be full darkness during that period of time. And I kind of want to explain that this is not the case. There is not going to be a massive void here between today and five years, there's going to be a ton of stuff happening. A ton of stuff happening.

• 6:21Speaker 01

  Now Ethereum L1 is made out of three sub-layers. So there's the execution layer in purple, the data layer in yellow, and the consensus layer in green. And what I'm gonna do is kind of go through them one by one and try and share some of my takes. But I think the key message that I want to share here is that the performance of Ethereum over the next few years is going to increase incrementally, and it's gonna be night and day. We're gonna improve all the performance metrics that are key to the layer one. So what are the performance metrics for each? For execution, the key performance metric is gat per second.

• 7:05Speaker 01

  How much can we churn through the EVM? For data, it's bytes per second or blobs per second. And one of the key performance metrics for consensus is latency. Like, how fast does it take for a transaction to be confirmed? And over the next few years, we're gonna improve these three performance metrics. Now, for execution, the magical tool that we're gonna use is zk. And one of the tweets that kind of reflects this bullishness that I have is from John Gibas. John Gibas is one of the co-founders of Succinct, behind the SP1 zkVM. And what he tweets is that "We're going to prove the entirety of Ethereum

• 7:50Speaker 01

  on these bad boys." And these bad boys are like four filio machines, like four basically big server machines. And he believes that's enough to prove the entirety of Ethereum. And one piece of interesting metadata here is the number of retweets. This tweet, which is extremely, extremely bullish, got two retweets. People don't realize what is coming here. And so what myself and various others at the Ethereum Foundation are doing is building a new website. It's not live yet, but it will be called ethproofs.org. And this is basically a block explorer for ZK VMs.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  So we're going to invite every single ZK VM vendor to prove L1 EVM blocks and for each block to provide a proof and disclose how much time it took them to generate the proof and how many cents it costs to generate the proof. And then basically, the idea is to show the world that these ZK VMs are good enough for production and also create a little bit of a friendly competition between the ZK VMs with various leaderboards so that we will be able to see which ones are the best. And ultimately, what I think will happen is that this is going to kickstart a process

• 9:16Speaker 01

  where the whole Ethereum chain is going to be ZK-proven by many, many different ZK vendors. Now, one of the things I'm excited about snogifying the entire chain, EVM chain, is that I won't have to run Geth. So I run a validator at home and I have to run Geth and I only have two terabytes of storage and it's a massive pain when I have to resync and it uses too much space and it might use too much RAM or CPU. Well, very, very soon, I won't have to run Geth at home. I can run basically the ZK version of my execution client, for example, ZK Geth instead. And what that means is that it will consume zero gigabytes of storage and it will use

• 10:00Speaker 01

  zero percent of my CPU and zero percent of my RAM. It's going to be free to basically run an execution client. And so I think in a couple of years' time, we're going to be in a position, as I said, where the running an execution client is going to be optional as a validator. And in order to achieve that, we need the snark proving to be fast enough, right? We need the snark proofs to arrive to the attestors soon enough that the attestors can confidently vote and know that the chain is indeed valid. And so for that, we're going to need sub-slot ZK V M's. We're going to need ZK V M's where the proof comes within one slot, and that means within 12 seconds. And I think that's going to happen by the end of next year.

• 10:46Speaker 01

  By the way, all of the dates that I say, take it with a grain of salt. All of this is just a tentative Straumann timeline.

• 10:54Speaker 01

  And then another thing that is going to make this state of affairs really good is actually a proposal by the next speaker and Dan Robinson to delay the state roots by one slot. So if we delay state roots by one slot, then now we have the full slot in order to be able to prove the validity of these state roots.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  Okay, that's all great. Now, another thing that snarks are going to do in the roadmap is kind of reshuffle and maybe pivot the stateless approach. So right now, we're on a Verkle approach, and basically, I think what's going to happen is that we're going to move towards snark-based statelessness.

• 11:37Speaker 01

  And so one of the cool things that has happened in the last few weeks is basically the devs coming together and saying, hey, maybe we can skip Verkle and go all the way to the endgame in one go, which is to use binary Merkle trees. And that has two advantages. Advantage number one is that it's much more snark-friendly, and two is that it's post-quantum secure. And so all of this is just basically accelerating the roadmap around snarkification.

• 12:08Speaker 01

  Now, I promise that we're going to see massive, massive upgrades to the performance metric. And one of the key performance metrics that we have today is the gas limit. 30 million megagas per block. And I think we're going to grow that 100x within the next few years to 3 gigagas per block. Now, how can we do that safely?

• 12:37Speaker 01

  One of the key things to realize is that we would need all of the execution clients to be able to keep up with the 3 gig gigas. And there's kind of two strategies. Strategy number one is that you're a home validator and you no longer run GEF. You've run the ZK version of your execution client. And verifying a block that consumes 3 megas or 3 gigas doesn't matter because it always takes 1 millisecond to verify the proof.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  Or the other approach is that if you want to naively re-execute everything, then you're going to need a very beefy computer. And that's something that maybe the big operators can do. The big safety feature that we need to ship first before doing these big 10x gas limit increases is to have something like multi-dimensional EIP 1559. And the reason is that the only thing that we can increase is the gas limit for execution, but we can't have blocks be too big. So we need to have a separate limit for call data. And we can't have the state grow too fast. So we need also a separate limit for state growth. So once we have these three different limits,

• 13:54Speaker 01

  we can have the first two stay relatively small and reasonable. And then basically pump the raw execution gas limits. And by raw execution, I mean just things like arithmetic operations, like additions and multiplications and things like that.

• 14:10Speaker 01

  Now, not only can we scale the EVM horizontally and grow the gas limit by orders of magnitude, we can also scale the EVM horizontally. And the idea here is what I call programmable execution sharding. Or another way to say it is programmable native rollup. So, once we've snarkified the L1 EVM, we can expose within the EVM a ZK EVM pre-compile. And this is something that any developer can use to spawn a new instance of the EVM. And I think this is something that can be done, you know, maybe four years down the line before the five-year deadline comes.

• 14:57Speaker 01

  Okay, so that was execution. We can essentially have unlimited gas per second, right? Because we have unlimited number of EVM instances, and even individual EVM instances will grow dramatically in throughput. Now, what about data? The story with data is actually fairly straightforward. We have roughly one fork per year. So the fork items are the one with the little red circles. And every time there's a fork, I imagine that we're going to see an increase in the number of blobs. And then we're going to see an exponential increase, more or less. So a 2X-ing every single time. One of the big unlocks is going to be PeerDust,

• 15:41Speaker 01

  where we start doing data availability sampling, where the validators don't have to download all of the blobs, but they only have to download these small, you know, challenges. And then the way that we do sampling is also going to improve with the 2D sampling here. But overall, the story is that we're going to have exponential growth over the next few years of the data, and that's going to allow for many, many more transactions on-chain. And not only are we going to go to 128 blobs per block, but we can go way beyond that. And the reason is that we have Nielsen's law, which is basically the increase of, the natural increase of bandwidth over time, rough, on the order of roughly 50% per year.

• 16:24Speaker 01

  Now, here in the data section, I want to correct, or I want to share at least my opinion on various things that people say that I strongly disagree with. So a bunch of people say DA is abundant. I don't think DA is abundant. I think DA, and by DA I mean like, the highest quality kind of Ethereum-grade DA is not abundant. And the reason is that Ethereum limits itself to home internet connections.

• 16:57Speaker 01

  And what Dankshading does is that it's a multiplier over the number of internet connections, and the multiplier is roughly 100x. So what we're talking about here is providing 100 home internet connections for the whole internet of value. That is, a tiny, tiny amount of supply. DA is extremely scarce in the grand scheme of things. The other take that I disagree with is that DA is fungible. It's a commodity. So you could take Ethereum DA and just replace it with Celestia DA. And it's the same thing. It doesn't really matter. And the two big reasons why it does matter is shared security and shared synchrony.

• 17:41Speaker 01

  So the whole point of, you know, blockchains, at least in the context of DeFi, is to try and build these money Legos that are composable. And in order to, for one money Lego to feel comfortable composing with another money Lego, they need to know that this other money Lego is extremely secure, as secure as they are, and it's going to live for the next decades and centuries. But if you use some really weak external DA, then now suddenly you're going to lose the shared security. But then maybe the bigger reason, and this is something that is going to play out as we have more and more tools for composability, is this notion of synchronous composability.

• 18:25Speaker 01

  In order to have best-in-class composability between money Legos, we need to have shared sequencing. And the problem with DA like Celestia is that it introduces a new sequencer, right? Like, Celestia is itself a blockchain with slots, and each block is proposed by a new sequencer. And so now we have the Ethereum sequencer and the Celestia sequencer, and we lose the opportunity to do synchronous composability. And so I think people are going to be willing to pay a big premium to consume Ethereum DA.

• 19:02Speaker 01

  And then the final reason has to do with the native rollups that I was talking about. It turns out that the precompile can only be consumed if the input data to the to the rollup is is on Ethereum. It has to be available so that anyone can produce the proofs for the validators. Otherwise, there's an attack where someone can try and split, split, split the chain. And so that that is going to be yet another reason why I think Ethereum DA is going to be hugely valuable. And then finally, which is kind of the culmination of these two takes is that I think we're going to see crazy high aggregate data fees.

• 19:46Speaker 01

  Right? People say that DA is going to be, you know, is not going to be a source of revenue, that we're not going to have high fees, and I completely disagree with it. And this is something that I shared in my latest Bankless podcast. I think we're going to potentially see billions of dollars per day of fee revenue from the fees. And that doesn't mean that the individual fees are going to be high. The individual fees can be subcent, but the aggregate fees for the whole Internet of Value in terms of DA consumption can be as high as billions of dollars per day.

• 20:25Speaker 01

  Okay, so we're dramatically improving the performance of execution, dramatically improving the performance of data. What about consensus?

• 20:36Speaker 01

  So a lot of people talk about, you know, having ultra-fast slot times, right? Why don't we have one second slot times or 400 millisecond slot times? And my take here is that slot times very soon are not going to matter as much as they matter today. And the reason is that we're going to have preconfirmations, and we're already starting to see this, right? If you use Arbitrum, for example, you have 250 second, 250 millisecond slot times. It doesn't matter that the L1 uses 12 second slot times. If it were to upgrade to one second slot times, that wouldn't make any difference whatsoever to the users of Arbitrum. Same thing for Unichain. Unichain also has 250 millisecond slot times, faster than Solana, by the way.

• 21:22Speaker 01

  But that doesn't mean that, well, that's maybe a reason for not needing to prioritize small start times. And I think the same thing is going to happen for base rollups. Even if you use the L1 decentralized sequencer for your rollup, you won't need to have, you won't need to pay the cost of slow UX. And my rough take, basically, is that within a couple of years, the vast majority of transactions are going to be preconfirmed. And they're going to be preconfirmed much, much, much faster than even the slot duration on Ethereum.

• 22:06Speaker 01

  Oh, sorry, on Solana. Now, the other big upgrade that could happen to the Ethereum layer, consensus layer, is stake capping. And what stake capping does, it improves another performance metric of consensus, which is the security budget. Like, how much money do I need to spend per year to secure my, to provide enough security for the consensus layer? And right now, we're paying many, many billions of dollars, roughly $5 billion per year, to secure Ethereum. And if the price of ETH were to 10x, then we'd potentially be paying tens of billions

• 22:47Speaker 01

  of dollars per year. And so what I think could happen in terms of improving one of the other key performance metrics is this notion of stake capping. And this would be an incremental upgrade that would happen way before the Beam fork at the very end. Now, in order to do stake capping, we need to solve the problem of MEV. And the reason is that if we have low issuance but high MEV, then almost all of the income is going to come from MEV. But the MEV has a problem. It's extremely spiky, it's extremely volatile. And so we need to either smooth the MEV or get rid of the MEV somehow.

• 23:29Speaker 01

  And this is exactly what a tester-proposer separation does. A tester-proposer separation, basically, opens up the MEV market to the broader ecosystem, and it segregates MEV away from the validators.

• 23:46Speaker 01

  But in order to get APS, we're gonna need inclusion lists. And so you see here, there's a little bit of a dependency. In order to dramatically improve this, we're gonna need this. And to get this, we're gonna need this. And so the good news here is that we already have an EIP for Fossil. It won't go in the next fork, because all of the items have been scheduled for the next fork. But I believe it'll go in the one after that.

• 24:14Speaker 01

  Now, another big thing that I'm excited about, the consensus layer, is not just performance, but it's health. Right? Because ultimately, the way that I think about it, and you know, here, I'm stealing this meme from someone else, which is that the L1 is going to compete with Bitcoin, and the L2s are going to compete with Solana. And so the L1 needs to be as healthy, as secure, as robust as possible. And so one of the key things that we need to do to achieve this really strong foundation is to make the L1 very, very friendly to solo validators. And APS is a massive step in that direction.

• 24:55Speaker 01

  And the reason is that today, to be a very competitive validator, you have to worry about many things. You have to worry about timing games, you have to worry about MEV spikes. Soon, you're gonna have to worry about the infrastructure to provide preconfirmations. You need to pick relays and things like that. All of these worries will disappear, and your main duty will be to just attest and build inclusion lists. Now, the other big improvement that should happen incrementally is this notion of one-if validators. Right? Today, in order to become a validator, you need 32 if. This is what I call whale staking. You need to be a whale.

• 25:36Speaker 01

  You need to have at least 32 if, which is $100,000, to participate as a validator. Why don't we reduce that by one and a half orders of magnitude?

• 25:47Speaker 01

  And in order to get the one if validators, it's a very similar story to stake capping. There's like some groundwork that we need to do ahead of time. So what we need is basically the validators to start consolidating.

• 26:03Speaker 01

  Because there's basically two ideas to get one if validators. Number one is what's called Orbit and the other one is called two-tipped staking. But in both cases, we need some amount of consolidation. And in order to get consolidation, we need to increase the maximum effective balance. And this is coming in the next fork. And so you see here, we're planting seeds because we have this long-duration view. And one by one, these things kind of play out. And then we get to reap the benefits from our investments.

• 26:38Speaker 01

  And then the final thing that we're going to dramatically improve on as a solo staker is this notion of feather staking. Once we've fully snorkified the consensus layer and the execution layer, the meme is that you'll be able to stake on your smartwatch. Right? You won't need a laptop, you won't need a raspberry pi, you'll need like the most minimal amount of infrastructure. And so when you combine the three things, fish staking, Zen staking, and feather staking, what I expect will happen is we're going to see a renaissance of solo validators. We're going to see tens of thousands of little validators coming up. And that's going to be extremely healthy for Ethereum L1.

• 27:21Speaker 01

  And it's going to make it the most robust chain in the world.

• 27:27Speaker 01

  And so that is the summary slide. So much is going to happen in the next few years. And you know, this is kind of a call to action, an invitation to be bullish about the future. Not just the long-term future in five years, but also the short and medium-term future. Thank you.

• 27:55David Hoffman?

  We've got time for a couple of questions, couple of questions. Whoever raises their hand first. No questions? One question, one question.

• 28:05Speaker 02

  Can you talk a little bit about APS? And do you see that being a centralization risk to Ethereum at all?

• 28:14Speaker 01

  Okay, fantastic question. So, and this is a recurring question. And so I, I'm, I hope that, you know, as a community, we can try and, and, and get through this. So APS, what it does is that it opens up block building to the broader market of sophisticated actors. And so what we should expect is that the most sophisticated actors will be building the majority of the blocks. And that sounds terrible, but the good news is that actually self-building is going to thrive in that context. And that's thanks to the context, to the, that's thanks to inclusion lists.

• 28:52Speaker 01

  So with inclusion lists, we have 16 validators at every single slot that are going to be self-building the inclusion lists. And what is an inclusion list? It's basically a list of transactions that have to be included by the sophisticated builder. So we're going to take the 16 inclusion lists, we're going to take the union of them, and that's going to be the transactions that need to go in the next block. And why, why is that extremely positive? The reason is that I expect the vast majority of transactions that ultimately go on-chain will be included in the inclusion list. And so the, the, the shift of mental model that I have is that the, almost all of the block building,

• 29:34Speaker 01

  call it 95% of it, is going to happen by the inclusion lists and the validators. And then the builders are just going to do a little bit of polishing at the end. They're going to add maybe one transaction at the very top to do some front-running, maybe one transaction at the very bottom to do some back-running. They're going to reorder transactions a little bit so that they can extract a bit of MEV. But ultimately, the bulk of the building is going to happen in a distributed manner from very unsophisticated and weak builders. And yeah, the meme that I have is that the, the validators provide the raw material for the blocks, for the inclusion list, and the builders are merely polishers, right? They, they merely kind of polish things here and there to produce the final block.

• 30:19David Hoffman?

  One last question before we bring Max Reisnik on, over there, over there. Here we go. I'm coming.

• 30:28Speaker 03

  Hello. I wonder if you asked any application developers about feedback for your roadmap? And what was their feedback? And what kind of things you included there that help application developers specifically?

• 30:46Speaker 01

  Right, good question. I mean, I'm very much in touch with the community through following Crypto Twitter and through coming to conferences and whatnot. And to be fair, I haven't gotten that much negative feedback other than the, basically, two of them. One is the fragmentation problem and two is the scalability problem. On the fragmentation point of things, which is basically, I guess, Eric's talk just before me, I think we have a very good roadmap. And this is something that I've been talking about for all of this year, which is this

• 31:30Speaker 01

  notion of the United Chains of Ethereum that comes from shared sequencing and real-time proving. And in order to achieve Ethereum-wide shared sequencing, my proposed solution is based sequencing and base rollups. And maybe this is an opportunity to have some sort of a debate with Eric or a discussion with him, because I think he's kind of too bearish on the fragmentation issue. I think it's going to be solved in the coming months and years. In terms of the scalability, I guess, one of the common complaints is that

• 32:15Speaker 01

  On Solana, for example, I can trade meme coins tens of times per minute, and it's extremely fluid. It's extremely cheap, and I can't really do that on Ethereum. Well, preconfirmations are going to dramatically improve the UX. It's going to be faster than Solana. And in terms of the fees, this is where increasing the amount of DA comes into play. Now, if the only thing that you're doing is trading meme coins, then you don't even need Ethereum DA. You can just use some very cheap DA, like Celestia or Eigen DA.

• 32:55Speaker 01

  And so what I expect will happen is that meme coin trading in 2025 is going to be

• 33:04Speaker 01

  cheaper than Solana and faster than Solana. And so there is a possibility if the meme coin builders want to come to Ethereum to basically migrate in 2025, once we have the infrastructure in place, especially with the preconfirmations.

• 33:21David Hoffman?

  Round of applause for Justin Drake, everyone.

• 33:23Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 33:28David Hoffman?

  New projects are coming online to the Mantle Layer 2 every single week. Why is this happening? Maybe it's because Mantle has been on the frontier of Layer 2 design architecture since it first started building Mantle DA powered by technology from Eigen DA. Maybe it's because users are coming on to the Mantle Layer 2 to capture some of the highest yields available in DeFi and to automatically receive the points and tokens being accrued by the $3 billion Mantle Treasury in the Mantle Rewards Station. Maybe it's because the Mantle team is one of the most helpful teams to build with, giving you grants, liquidity support, and venture partners to help bootstrap your Mantle application. Maybe it's all of these reasons all put together. So if you're a dev and you want to build on one of the best foundations in crypto, or you're a user looking to claim some ownership on Mantle's DeFi apps, click the link in the show notes to getting started with Mantle.

• 34:13David Hoffman?

  The Uniswap wallet is officially the preferred wallet of Bankless, and it's the one we use anytime when we want to transact on-chain. Whether you're on your browser or on the go, Uniswap Wallet makes it easier than ever to swap anytime, anywhere. Use your wallet to Transfer funds directly from a top centralized exchange and tapping thousands of tokens across Ethereum and over 10 other chains like Base, Arbitrum, and Optimism. Uniswap Wallet delivers deep liquidity, fast execution, and reliable quotes with zero gas swaps through Uniswap X. And when it comes to security, you can rest easy knowing it's backed by Uniswap Labs, one of the most trusted teams in DeFi. Their code is open source and independently reviewed, so you know it's protected. So why wait? Download the Uniswap Wallet today on Chrome, iOS, and Android. And don't forget to claim your free uni.eth username directly in the mobile wallet. Start swapping smarter with Uniswap.

• 34:56David Hoffman?

  Centralized finance held all the power, but now DeFi gives it back to you. Enter the unlimited era with DYDX Unlimited, featuring instant market listings where you can listen, trade, any market instantly with liquidity. Experience trading like never before with all the trading tools you know and love, all on-chain. And then there's Megavault, your gateway to automatic liquidity and yield. Just deposit some USDC and start earning yield immediately. It's so simple, and DYDX Unlimited comes packed with so much more: leverage, prediction market perpetual futures, instant deposits, and there's even a revamped trading rewards program to get rewarded for every time you make a trade. So go ahead and check out DYDX on Twitter @DYDX to get notified once DYDX Unlimited launches.