Unlock Your Brain’s Full Potential

Aspire with Emma Grede is a finalist for Best New Podcast with Signal’s Listener Choice Awards! Vote here. https://vote.signalaward.com/PublicVoting#/2025/shows/genre/best-new-podcast What if your brain holds the key to unlocking success, resilience, and joy? In this episode, Emma sits down with neuroscientist, executive coach, and MIT lecturer Dr. Tara Swart to explore how to harness the full power of your brain. Dr. Swart shares practical tools and cutting-edge science on stress, intuition, and neuroplasticity—proving that you can rewire your mind at any stage of life. Together, they dive into: Daily habits that build mental resilience and lower stress Why multitasking drains productivity—and what to do instead The science of intuition and how to trust it How creativity, nature, and beauty fuel brain health Why purpose and community drive long-term success This is a masterclass in making your brain work for you, not against you. If you’re looking for science-backed strategies to thrive at work, at home, and in life, this conversation is for you.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:10Emma Grede?

  Your brain holds the key to unlocking your success. But your thoughts aren't always on your side. So how do you maximize the power of what is quite literally your most valuable asset? One of the world's leading neuroscientists and leadership coaches, Dr. Tara Swart, is here to help you unlock the power of your brain. This episode is all about making your brain work for you.

• 0:35Speaker 01

  You know that friend you only call when you need something? HomeServe's here for you. Got a burst pipe, HVAC outage, or electrical issue? HomeServe has your back for regular use where basic homeowner's insurance typically won't help. With a protection plan from HomeServe in place before disaster strikes, just call us. We'll send a qualified contractor and help you avoid unexpected expenses. Maybe we're the last ones you want to call, but we're happy to hear from you. Go to homeserve.com/audio for 50% less your first year. Savings compared to renewal price. Void in Florida.

• 1:06Speaker 02

  This never happens, but Olive and June is having the biggest sale of the year. I'm Sarah Gibson-Tuttle, founder of Olive and June. In this holiday season, you deserve the most. Think of it as permission to spoil yourself and a good reason to spoil someone else, too. Whether you love polish, gel, or a brand-new dip system, everything is 25% off from November 11th to December 1st. Plus, surprise gifts all week long. Get 25% off every product from November 11th to December 1st. Perfect for gifts, for stocking up, for treating yourself. Visit oliveandjune.com/shop25 for 25% off. That's O-L-I-V-E-A-N-D-J-U-N-E.com/shop25 for 25% off everything.

• 1:55Emma Grede?

  Dr Tara Spark, thank you so much for being here.

• 1:58Speaker 03

  It's such a pleasure to be with you.

• 1:59Emma Grede?

  I'm really, really happy, besides the fact that you are just another lovely English person that I get to speak to today. I cannot tell you, I feel like watching your Instagram, listening to other podcasts that you've been on, I have learned so, so, so much. And I'm really excited today to be able to share some of what you talk about. And I think that so much of what you talk about is really, really misunderstood. You are a doctor and a neuroscientist, but you've also, you've got this whole career as an executive coach. How did those two things link together?

• 2:34Speaker 03

  Well, I actually changed career during the financial crisis, so about 15, 16 years ago. And I didn't have a niche. Everybody else that was coaching was either an experienced business person, and I'd just been an NHS doctor, or they were a psychologist. And that was very accepted as, you know, having transferable skills to coaching. But as a psychiatrist, I was kind of like out there on my own. And then I realised that there were unprecedented levels of stress that I could help with. People becoming so stressed that they were actually having heart attacks. I worked with a bank where people were actually dropping dead on the trading floor. The mind-body connection became a really crucial factor for businesses to understand to save the lives of their employees.

• 3:20Emma Grede?

  And when, you know, I talk all the time about living in the culture as we do now, that we are under more stress than any other time. And I really, truly believe that. Do you, do you think that that's true? And more specifically, for women, do you think that that's true?

• 3:37Speaker 03

  I think it's, I think it's true in general. So I think we're kind of like lurching from one crisis to another. So I mentioned the financial crisis. Obviously, we've had the pandemic. But generally, levels of mental illness are higher than ever. And not just, you know, at the extreme end with... Clinical diagnoses like schizophrenia and depression, but stress and anxiety is just so prevalent in society. And, you know, I don't like to make too many generalisations about the differences between men and women, but women inevitably are multitasking, they're running businesses and having to be usually the main carer for the family. And I think there's a big case of women putting themselves last and looking after everyone else.

• 4:22Speaker 03

  So the time for protecting your resilience and managing your stress is tricky.

• 4:28Emma Grede?

  It really, it really is tricky. I wanted to ask you, why is it that women are more likely to experience anxiety or depression or stress or burnout? Like, what's actually happening in the female brain?

• 4:40Speaker 03

  I think it is what I just said, which is that you're the main carer, whether it's aging parents, whether it's young children. It's almost like you're not just running your own diary or calendar, you're running like five people's. And inevitably, it makes you put yourself last. But it's kind of like that thing about put your oxygen mask on first. If you look after yourself, you're actually helping your family and loved ones potentially with more ease.

• 5:06Emma Grede?

  I want to understand a little bit more about the brain and women specifically. I feel like I've always been, you know, I don't know if this is my own upbringing or just what I've experienced, but, you know, men are very different from women, I think we all know that. But is there something in the brain that makes that true?

• 5:23Speaker 03

  Not really. So let me give you an analogy, like, if there was a room with a hundred people in it, fifty men and fifty women, and you asked them to line up in order of height, it wouldn't be like all the men are taller and all the women are shorter, there'd be a little bit in the middle where there are some tall women and some shorter men. So that's kind of like how it is in the brain. There are a few subtle differences. One of them, interestingly, is in social settings. Women are better able to remember names and faces, so it's kind of that bonding aspect. But like I said, not all men and all women, it's very much kind of in the middle, there's a big mixture and then there are outliers at either end.

• 6:05Emma Grede?

  That's so interesting. So it's not true that, you know, men are from Mars and women are from Venus. We're basically the same and culture and experience is different.

• 6:14Speaker 03

  In terms of like romantic relationships and dating, I think that probably is really true.

• 6:19Emma Grede?

  Oh, we're gonna get there later. We have to. Now you said that, we have to get there later. But there's nothing that actually makes us in the brain entirely different.

• 6:27Speaker 03

  No. No, and I think it's it's social conditioning is the thing that actually makes it different. So for example, if you have a ramp with a toddler crawling up it and they're either dressed in blue or pink, which makes you think they're a girl or a boy. People will go to stop the girl from getting to the edge quicker than they'll go to to stop a child dressed in blue going to the edge.

• 6:50Emma Grede?

  Right.

• 6:50Speaker 03

  So that's what kind of starts.

• 6:52Emma Grede?

  It's like social conditioning. But but but stress, I mean, you talk a lot about the connection between stress, the brain, the body. Because stress, it really does manifest very differently in women's bodies. Isn't that completely right?

• 7:05Speaker 03

  I think it's it's how you deal with it, isn't it? So if you if anyone suppresses stress, it can show up as symptoms in the body. And it also depends how you articulate it, you know. In a way, as women, we we probably do have the advantage of the fact that we actually talk to each other and share emotional stuff. And that is one way of kind of getting it out of your brain body system.

• 7:27Emma Grede?

  Is that like a practical step that you advise for people lowering stress, like just talking about it?

• 7:33Speaker 03

  Talking about it. If you don't have someone to talk to, journaling it. So you're kind of still getting it out of your system. So mentally, talking or writing, and then physically, you can actually sweat the stress hormone cortisol out of your body.

• 7:47Emma Grede?

  Also like working out?

• 7:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:49Emma Grede?

  So if you if if you are more likely to work out, you will absolutely lower your stress levels.

• 7:54Speaker 03

  Exercise absolutely helps with stress levels. However, paradoxically, high intensity exercise can actually spike the levels of the stress hormone cortisol. So if you're a type A personality, then the likelihood is you're more likely to say, I'll go and absolutely like, you know, pound it at the gym. That's probably counterproductive. So more gentle exercise, walking, yoga.

• 8:17Emma Grede?

  What other little hacks do you have to lower stress levels? Because I feel like there are some things, you know, you're either a journaler or you're not. You're either somebody who has, you know, can share their feelings at ease with other people. You either have an exercise routine. But what do you say to people that are carrying a lot of stress in terms of? These are the practical things that you can do every day just to lower your stress levels.

• 8:40Speaker 03

  I think breath work is really important. So in terms, when we say lower your stress levels, that's quite like a broad term. People might find it hard to understand like, how does stress show up for me? What, you know, what can I do about it? But I like to talk about resetting your nervous system. Because your brain is kind of invisible to you. It feels quite hard to access. But the peripheral nervous system, which is all the nerves in the rest of your body, that falls into two states. The parasympathetic state, which is rest and relax and digest. And the sympathetic state, which is fright, flight.

• 9:14Emma Grede?

  Right.

• 9:14Speaker 03

  And so it's a bit easier, I think, to understand if I'm in fright, flight. What can I do to get myself, you know, back into the rest and relax state? And breath work is probably the easiest way to to access that. So it can be anything from just slowing down your breathing or just noticing your breathing and checking whether your exhale is longer than your inhale. Because that's more relaxing. It's all signaling to your brain that I'm relaxed and you can, you know, you can impact that by changing your breathing.

• 9:44Emma Grede?

  So you're not talking about like a long meditation here. You mean like a moment in the day when you're feeling stressed, practicing noticing your breath in that moment?

• 9:53Speaker 03

  Yeah, noticing your breath, maybe trying to just like do some slower, deeper breathing. Maybe trying to focus on your exhale being longer than your inhale. And there are, you know, several other types of breath work that you can practise if you particularly like them.

• 10:07Emma Grede?

  So we should all be journaling more. We should all be talking about our feelings more and practising breath work. What else? What else should we be doing?

• 10:15Speaker 03

  I mean, staying hydrated is a really simple thing.

• 10:17Emma Grede?

  These are really simple things.

• 10:19Speaker 03

  Yeah. But it's also easy to forget, right? When you're rushing about, stress itself dries out your system. So it makes your hair drier, your skin drier. When you are thirsty, you're already way more dehydrated than is good for your brain. So one to three percent dehydration can actually stop you thinking at your best. So, you know, keeping yourself hydrated is just such a small but important thing.

• 10:46Emma Grede?

  Wow. I mean, it feels like such simple, such simple stuff. So why do you think that we're all walking around so chronically stressed if we could seemingly manage it so easily?

• 10:56Speaker 03

  I think it's just how much information overload we're bombarded with. If you read a newspaper, the whole newspaper, today's paper, if you read it, that would be more information than someone would receive in their lifetime a hundred years ago. And if you think like, actually, we're not even sitting down and reading a whole newspaper.

• 11:17Emma Grede?

  No, we're just.

• 11:18Speaker 03

  All sorts of social media, all the other ways that technology means we can be contacted, text message, email.

• 11:24Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 11:25Speaker 03

  You know, perhaps lots of people around you talking at you, all the things that you have on your mind, the things that you feel you need to do, like exercise, that maybe you feel guilty about because you're not doing it, all the meetings that you have to attend in a day. It's, it's a lot and the brain has a natural filtering mechanism. But in a way, it helps us to survive on a basic level. It doesn't really help us to thrive necessarily. We need that time to step back and think about what we actually want our life to feel like, what we want to achieve, what we want to bring in. And then you can help to direct that filtering mechanism a bit better. But if you're constantly rushed and stressed and just trying to keep up, it's hard to really make your life like how you want it.

• 12:10Emma Grede?

  And I totally get that, but you're on Instagram, you partake in social media. So how do you create the limits that are healthy, given everything that you know?

• 12:19Speaker 03

  So there was a conversation that I was in with a load of very busy business people, where they sort of all sat around and agreed with each other that, you know, the phone is really the problem.

• 12:28Emma Grede?

  Hmm.

• 12:28Speaker 03

  And I said, the phone's not the problem, you're the problem. So, yes, I am very active on Instagram, but.

• 12:36Emma Grede?

  I love your Instagram, by the way.

• 12:37Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 12:37Emma Grede?

  I think it's, it's one of like the most useful accounts to follow.

• 12:40Speaker 03

  Thanks.

• 12:41Emma Grede?

  It really is.

• 12:42Speaker 03

  I'm definitely much more about sending out potentially useful information than receiving. And I'm very, very careful about who I follow and therefore what will come into my, my stream. But also I don't spend a lot of time looking at Instagram.

• 12:57Emma Grede?

  Because you've made a decision about. What's important and how you wanna live and going back to that aspect of things.

• 13:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, like one of the things someone said about me, actually, there's two things I think are really interesting about how the world is now. One is when you spend time with Tara, she doesn't even look at her phone. I'm like, shouldn't that be normal?

• 13:15Emma Grede?

  It's a huge compliment.

• 13:16Speaker 03

  Shouldn't that be normal?

• 13:16Emma Grede?

  Yes, it's also really good manners and I actually chalk it up to manners. I think it's really rude to be doing anything. I would know sooner, you know, walk off and get a drink in the middle of a conversation and I will pick up my phone. It's just not good, but we've become accustomed to that being okay, you know. You look at a table of people having dinner next to you and they're all on their phones and that's all right. It's just not all right with me.

• 13:38Speaker 03

  I just wouldn't even have my phone on the table.

• 13:40Emma Grede?

  No, you shouldn't. It shouldn't come out. It shouldn't be visible. Cause that in of itself is a distraction. I mean, that's how I'm raising my kids. We don't have phones at the table. It's just really simple. Yeah, we put phones in a bowl as soon as we get in the house and that's just where the phones live because when I grew up, like the phone lived in a place because it was on a wire. Like it didn't stop you from communicating. I was the most chatty Cathy ever. But, and still am, but it just doesn't need to be an extension of my arm. I don't think it's good. It's just not good manners and it's not good for our health. And I think that we all know that, but people find it so difficult to make that decision because the idea that you might not know the exact piece of news in the exact moment is really troubling for people. And I think it comes back down to this idea of how we're all taught that

• 14:24Emma Grede?

  multitasking and information overload, like that's the right way to live now. And I think quite the opposite. Like I actually think about multitasking as sabotaging women's productivity. Is there any, is there any truth to that?

• 14:38Speaker 03

  Yeah, so there's this, I think this is a myth. Tell me if you've heard this, women are better at multitasking than men.

• 14:44Emma Grede?

  Oh, that's what everybody says.

• 14:45Speaker 03

  So that puts you in a position where you feel like because you're supposed to be good at it, you should do it. But the fact is, every time you multitask, you are doing each task less well than you're capable of doing that task alone. And I wanna connect that back to the whole phone thing, which is that you know, what's troubling to me is that loneliness is so bad for you. But we're not putting our priorities into engaging with people. If I'm with someone like you or, you know, a friend or a loved one, I want to give you my full attention. I don't want my phone to distract me.

• 15:19Emma Grede?

  I wanna move on and talk a little bit about success because it's something that I'm obsessed with, but I'm obsessed with the way that you can, you know, that That your brain can make you successful, like the way you think, how you speak to yourself. You know, we talk a lot in this culture about mindset and manifestation. But what is one thing that our brains do that shape our success? Like, I'm trying to understand like what we don't know about the way that our brains work.

• 15:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, so the first thing I will say is that the brain is the CEO of your body. You know, it's basically running everything. And even though it's so small and you can't see it, it's really important to understand how powerful it is in everything that you do. And one of the strongest gearings of the brain, which is a very primal survival mechanism, is called loss aversion or loss avoidance. And that means that our brain is wired to avoid loss or danger two and a half times as much as it is to gain a reward. So the most classic example of this from behavioural economics is that if you parked your car outside today and you walked into the office and on the way you found a fifty dollar note on the ground.

• 16:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, you'd pick it up, you'd be quite pleased, you might keep it, you might give it to a homeless person. But then by the time you get to your desk, you've kind of forgotten about that. If you realise by the time you got to your desk that you'd actually dropped fifty dollars out of your pocket. You would go back, you would try and look for it. If you didn't find it, you would berate yourself. You would still be thinking about that when you were lying in bed at night.

• 16:55Emma Grede?

  Definitely.

• 16:56Speaker 03

  If you think about that, then your brain thinks it's doing the right thing by you to keep alerting you to the danger of taking risk. But to be really successful, there's an element of having to be a risk taker and taking healthy risks.

• 17:13Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 17:14Speaker 03

  And, you know, sort of understanding when it's a risk that is worth taking and, you know, when it's not. But every time you start to go and do that, whatever that risk is, whether it's, you know, dating or in business. The hippocampus and the amygdala, parts of the brain that control memory and emotion, will get together and remind you of all the previous times you took a similar risk and it didn't work out. So without you really realising, your brain will be saying, Emma, that's not a good idea because remember this when that happened. And that will just non-consciously make you think you shouldn't take a risk. You have to intentionally override that gearing of the brain to thrive rather than just survive in the modern day.

• 17:57Emma Grede?

  I mean, I love the way that you explain it. So rather than our brains default into what has worked out, to keep us safe, our brain is actually going to default to the fear piece and it's going to repeat that.

• 18:12Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:12Emma Grede?

  So you've got to very purposefully override it.

• 18:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:15Emma Grede?

  And what do you do, like, how do you purposefully override it?

• 18:18Speaker 03

  So usually there's a theme to what you're afraid of.

• 18:22Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 18:23Speaker 03

  And you have to get down to the belief that's under the thoughts that you're having. If you can see some kind of pattern to what you usually think, what usually makes you think, well, don't do that. Then if you dig down to what is it that I believe about myself that makes me think I shouldn't do that, you know, that I shouldn't, you know, go into the dating game again, or I shouldn't like try to start up my own business. And, you know, you may need the help of a therapist or a friend to work this out. Or you might be able to do it yourself through journaling or reflection. Then if you, if you say, you know, I don't deserve that thing, or I don't feel like things like that happen to people like me. You can create a positive affirmation that's the opposite of that belief.

• 19:03Speaker 03

  And you can repeat that so many times that that gets wired into your brain as the truth, more than this negative belief that you have about yourself.

• 19:10Emma Grede?

  So you're talking about having almost like a daily affirmation, but you need to understand what, what that fear is, where it comes from, what the patterns are that, that hold you back all the time. And then you've got to find some type of way and mantra to get over that.

• 19:28Speaker 03

  Yeah. And another thing that's a really good one, and I actually think you're such a symbol of, is find someone that you feel is like you, who is an example of someone that's achieved what you want to.

• 19:40Emma Grede?

  Yeah, I feel like I've constantly done that in my life. And it's really helpful because you're like, well, if they can, I can. And that idea of finding someone who's a little bit like you, similar background, from the same place, you know, like has a career that you want, that can be so unbelievably useful.

• 20:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:01Emma Grede?

  And so useful.

• 20:02Speaker 03

  You just existing and doing this podcast is doing that for so many people.

• 20:05Emma Grede?

  Oh, I really hope so, because that was my whole. You know, I I have I've always understood that I have immense power, right? I was taught as a kid a way of speaking to myself. And, you know, my mum would refuse to have like negative self-talk. She did not use that language because in East London, we didn't use that language back then. But that's essentially what she was telling my sisters and I, right? You can do anything and you have to believe in yourself and you have to tell yourself that. So I was brought up talking into a bathroom mirror with maybe like four little heads around us because we all had to get ready in the same bathroom. But it was there, right? It was like weaved into my way of thinking. But that is so hard for people to learn.

• 20:48Emma Grede?

  And so in your practice as a, you know, an executive coach and when you get very, you know, leaders and CEOs and people that are, you know, doing these big jobs and big careers, does that come up? Is that something that you are regularly teaching? Like have a mantra, have some set of affirmations and speak to yourself well? Like, I'm trying to understand how important that is because if you're not wired that way, it's a really hard thing to learn. And honestly, you might feel a bit stupid doing it.

• 21:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah. And and I think a really important thing that I've learnt for myself, which I'd love to share, is that those people that I coach, who are, you know, some of them are billionaires, you know, they're super successful, have the same doubts and vulnerabilities that anyone does.

• 21:32Emma Grede?

  No doubt.

• 21:32Speaker 03

  So important to know because if you don't know them, it would feel like they don't, but they do. It may be more subtle the way I talk to them than saying, okay, let's create an affirmation. But I am kind of affirming them really subtly all the time to help them get to this place of believing that they are the person that they want to be.

• 22:02Speaker 01

  Ring Central's AI receptionist uses voice AI to answer on the first ring, so you'll never miss a call again. In just a few minutes, you can personalize your own AI receptionist to answer questions, route calls, schedule appointments, and even send texts in multiple languages. Plus, it's easy to scale. Create unlimited AI receptionists across any phone system. It's all powered by one reliable platform for effortless AI communications. See for yourself at ringcentral.com. Ring Central, voice of your business.

• 22:33Speaker 04

  Hi, everyone. This is Kara Swisher.

• 22:34Speaker 05

  And I'm Scott Galloway.

• 22:35Speaker 04

  And we want to tell you about Pivot, our twice-weekly podcast.

• 22:39Speaker 05

  That's right, Kara. What a thrill. It's a chance for us to break down all the big things happening in tech, business, and politics.

• 22:45Speaker 04

  Yes, and I keep you in check so people can make it through each episode, whether it's digging into constant changes in the world of AI and social media or trying to keep up with whatever the fuck Elon is doing. We're here to give you our take on all of that.

• 22:57Speaker 05

  Every Tuesday and Friday morning, we drop a new episode about some of the major stories of the moment.

• 23:02Speaker 04

  And Scott is a prediction machine, gazing into his crystal ball to tell you about where it's all heading.

• 23:07Speaker 05

  That's right.

• 23:08Speaker 04

  So if that sounds like a good time for you, especially Mr. That's Right, you can follow us on your favorite podcast app to get new episodes every week.

• 23:17Speaker 05

  Boom.

• 23:25Emma Grede?

  You talk a lot about intuition and sort of gut feeling. And I want to just go back to something that you said and understanding how our brain works around this idea of fear. Because how do you know? Or how do you tell the difference between a fear that is protecting you and something that's holding you back? Because our brain is doing some good work, right? It's like, stay away from that fire over there. That's going to hurt you. So like, what are the differences? And how do we learn to tell the difference? Like, when do I know to override what my brain might be telling me?

• 23:58Speaker 03

  That's a really good question, and it's quite a subtle one. So I actually like to... Use slightly different words that are often used interchangeably, so intuition and instinct. And.

• 24:11Emma Grede?

  Those two, those two things are different, because I think I probably mix them up.

• 24:14Speaker 03

  I think everyone does.

• 24:15Emma Grede?

  I think my instinct and my intuition are the same things, I think, yeah. I would think that, and my gut feeling, I'll just put the whole lot together, like, you know.

• 24:23Speaker 03

  I would think that too, but if we.

• 24:24Emma Grede?

  Set us straight, please.

• 24:26Speaker 03

  I mean, I think, again, you know, you could choose the words that you use, but it's important to have a different word for your intuition, which is your wisdom that can guide you really positively. And an instinct or shortcut that's there to protect you, but actually.

• 24:41Emma Grede?

  Got it.

• 24:41Speaker 03

  You know, might be fear based.

• 24:43Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 24:44Speaker 03

  So, I mean, the easiest one is when your intuition isn't coming from fear and you know it's a really positive one, like, yeah, I'm gonna take that leap, I'm gonna do that. That's an easier one to follow, but there's one caveat to that that I'll come back. When it's fear based, you can tell, but that's when you either have to ask yourself, is this fear based for a good reason, I shouldn't take a risk, or is it fear based? And actually, I need to learn how to override this. If you can't do it for yourself, speaking to someone that you trust is always helpful. If you're learning this skill of being able to do it for yourself, it's often really useful to think, well, what would I say to my best friend or my sister?

• 25:24Emma Grede?

  Oh, I love that, yeah.

• 25:26Speaker 03

  She came to me with this issue. And if you're able to take that one level of, you know, perspective away from being kind of in the mix of the emotions yourself, you may be able to come up with the answer yourself. There's another exercise I really love, which is, if I'm sitting here now, I would say, you know, I'm Tara, I'm this age, I'm dressed like this. This is the dilemma that I'm facing. And then I get up and I walk seven steps forward and I turn around and I look at where I was sitting and I say, I'm Tara, and I say the age that is seven years older than I am. And then I say, this is the answer to your dilemma, and I just take it from my intuition. But it's me seven years in advance.

• 26:07Emma Grede?

  Wow, I love that.

• 26:09Speaker 03

  Usually when I do this, which, and I, you know, I keep it for really special occasions and I've shared it with some of my closest friends. It actually makes you cry.

• 26:17Emma Grede?

  Really?

• 26:19Speaker 03

  Because your intuition is actually so beautiful and like if you can just step away from yourself and all of the self doubt and the, you know, kind of negative talk, there's actually a really beautiful guiding light in you that you can get access to when you just step out of yourself for a second.

• 26:35Emma Grede?

  Why is it so hard for people to listen to their intuition, do you think?

• 26:38Speaker 03

  You know, you've obviously been extremely fortunate in the way that you've been brought up by your mum, but a lot of people have suffered criticism and ridicule and been diminished as a child and that gets ingrained into your brain and it stays there and it runs a lot of your life without you even realising. So again, if you can separate yourself from that voice and realise that, you know, maybe that's a person that in your childhood that didn't big you up and make you feel like you can do anything and be the best version of yourself, then when you do have a negative self thought, if you say that's actually not my voice, that's the voice of that person that didn't believe in me. That's again, another way of kind of separating yourself from this.

• 27:21Emma Grede?

  Can you strengthen your intuition? Like is it something if you feel actually I'm, I never listen to my intuition because I don't feel like it's there, like can you actually, is there a way to strengthen intuition?

• 27:32Speaker 03

  Yeah, so I think journaling is a really good way. So when you have, and this is the caveat that I wanted to come back to, when you have a dilemma and your intuition and your logic aren't aligned, people will feel safer going with their logic, like that's the sensible thing to do, that makes, you know, rational sense.

• 27:51Emma Grede?

  Oh, I think I'm the opposite to that.

• 27:52Speaker 03

  So am I.

• 27:53Emma Grede?

  I would never go against my intuition, even if the logic says different, I'm like, no, I'm all intuition.

• 27:58Speaker 03

  But we've both learnt to trust that, so we're, let's speak to the person that hasn't learnt to trust that yet. So I think I was naturally intuitive, so I wasn't starting from a zero place, but I decided to hone it through neuroplasticity, which is the ability that we all have to change and learn and grow. So I would write down in my journal every time I had a decision to make where logic and intuition weren't aligned and what I encourage people to do is starting in a low risk decision.

• 28:27Speaker 03

  Try going with your intuition, even if logic doesn't, you know, it doesn't run by your logic. And just see how that pans out.

• 28:33Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 28:33Speaker 03

  And then write, write down what happened. Keep doing this, give yourself that evidence that when I go with my intuition, it actually works out better. And then take it to like a slightly higher risk situation. And just keep learning and growing. I think. Reading back over your journal entries and seeing when you did and didn't go with your intuition.

• 28:53Emma Grede?

  Yeah. It's really, I mean, I find reading back over my journals. Probably one of the best tools that I have because. A, it's the truth. You know, there's no room for messing around in your own journal. If you are, then that's a whole different problem.

• 29:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 29:08Emma Grede?

  But you know, it's like, it's an accurate account of actually what happened. And you can go back and look at what you were feeling, why you did something. And you can make changes. Like I, I go in and I kind of star and I'm like, that is something I didn't need. Like I'm going to purposefully do that differently next time. And it's kind of like what you're saying, this idea of standing up. Going seven years in your future and talking back to yourself. It's, it's like a way of like, it's almost like future journal. Like, like it's, that's a really interesting paradigm, actually.

• 29:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 29:41Emma Grede?

  I bet it works. I'm gonna try that.

• 29:43Speaker 03

  It really works.

• 29:44Emma Grede?

  I bet it works.

• 29:45Speaker 03

  There's another thing that I only discovered through a documentary filmmaker. Which was a letter to yourself at a different age. So you literally. You pick a number out of a hat or you open a book to a certain page. And then whatever that number is, and it, and it could be anything from zero to a hundred. You write a letter to yourself at that age. I was asked to be part of this documentary as a neuroscientist, but then I decided to do. The letter as well. I watched the documentary, I did the letter. And again, what really comes out is that we have this beautiful guiding light in us. But most of the time, we're just too busy.

• 30:24Emma Grede?

  So why do you think that we have undervalued emotions and intuition? And can you just, I guess my question is. How does reconnecting with your intuition make you a better decision maker?

• 30:38Speaker 03

  Big question. So basically, if we go back to our evolution, there was a time that we had the limbic system, which is the more intuitive, sort of primal part of our brain. And we had a very, very thin outer cortex. The outer cortex is the more rational part of the brain and it controls, it includes the part of the brain where we can articulate speech. So up until that point, we couldn't speak, but we could, we could grunt and we could gesture and we could make cave art. But we couldn't speak. Once we could speak, so I call it the cognitive revolution and it's to do with the fact that we made fire and then we could cook meat and we could eat, eat more protein more efficiently than our guts shrank and the outer cortex of the brain grew.

• 31:23Speaker 03

  Once you could speak, that was the quick, you know, the most efficient way of kind of telling you what I'm, what I mean. And so you would then pay less attention to my body language, my, my micro muscular facial expression. The impact of like the hormones I'm experiencing that you could potentially share either through our menstrual cycles or through stress.

• 31:43Emma Grede?

  So, so we've literally evolved there.

• 31:46Speaker 03

  And we've, we've then undervalued the things that actually got us there. And then if you fast forward, obviously to now, there's, there's technology, there's data. I would say up until thirty years ago, before we had really sophisticated scanning technology. Logic was just, you know, put on a pedestal and emotions and intuition were really, it was questioned whether they even really were tangible. Now that we can scan healthy brains, because a lot of neuroscience was just based on what happens when something goes wrong, like there's a stroke or a brain tumor. Now that we can scan healthy brains, we can actually see what happens when you experience certain emotions and how that changes your decision making. And we can see that intuition is actually a tangible thing. I'm hopeful that, you know, that's changing in a positive way.

• 32:31Speaker 03

  Particularly now with the very sharp rise in AI and chat GPT and stuff. I think going back to what makes us human is going to be more important than ever.

• 32:41Emma Grede?

  I couldn't agree with you more and I really want to touch on that. But something that you said is very interesting. So you're talking about we can train our intuition simply by using it, by trying to use it and, and getting higher and higher stakes about that. So that's, that is like. Rewiring the way that we think. And and when you talk about neuroplasticity, I really wanna understand that a little bit more. I see myself as someone who is always in learning mode. I was terrible at school and so I've had to do all of my learning once I got out of there. But some of us feel more ability to learn than others. And and I'm not just talking about, you know, things that are useful in our professional lives.

• 33:22Emma Grede?

  I'm talking about like even thinking about how you rewire yourself to have less negative thinking, for example. But I wanna understand the science and how our brains work and and if we all have the ability to learn all the time.

• 33:38Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 33:38Emma Grede?

  Or as well as others.

• 33:39Speaker 03

  Yes, so neuroplasticity is this ability of the brain to grow and change throughout life. And we used to think that by the time you were about eighteen and you stopped physically growing, that your brain became fixed. This was like accepted as fact in neuroscience and neurology. Since we've had that sophisticated scanning technology, we can see that the brain actively grows and changes till we're about twenty five. But from twenty five onwards, if you force your brain to learn things and you seek novelty and you're curious, then the brain can remain really flexible or what we call plastic in science terms. So if you think about your kids from zero to two, they went from being completely helpless and vulnerable and not able to do anything for themselves

• 34:24Speaker 03

  to walking, talking, being able to control their bladder and bowels.

• 34:28Emma Grede?

  Unbelievable.

• 34:28Speaker 03

  I mean, it's unbelievable. Watching children at that age is just like a miracle.

• 34:33Emma Grede?

  It really is.

• 34:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, and then in teenage, there's quite a lot of pruning of the brain to make it sophisticated enough to live an adult life, you know, to be social, to find a partner, to reproduce. And and that goes on for longer than we used to think. It goes on till about twenty five, which actually kind of explains why. Children stay often quite financially dependent on their parents till till older than eighteen.

• 34:58Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 34:58Speaker 03

  It used to be like, give your eighteen year old a briefcase and send them out into the world.

• 35:02Emma Grede?

  Not so much.

• 35:02Speaker 03

  Not so much. And then after that, look, you know, if you married your childhood sweetheart and you've got a job for life that you actually quite like, and that stability is good for you, fine, you you know, you'll you'll plateau, your brain won't shrink, but it won't grow. But if you want to improve the highest functions of your brain, what we call the executive functions, things like being able to think flexibly, think creatively, solve complex problems, access your intuition, override your biases, then you do need to be engaging in some form of learning. It doesn't need to be formal. It can be the fact that you travel and you meet people who think really differently to you.

• 35:43Speaker 03

  It can even be things like take a different, you know, way to work so that you just maybe like see a different building or a sculpture or something. But I have to say that things like learning a language or learning a musical instrument, they are so intense for your brain that it really forces your brain to change and grow. And like I said, you don't just get the benefits of learning Spanish, you get other benefits in your brain by continually learning.

• 36:09Emma Grede?

  And do you think that, I mean, I've always thought that just for myself, you know, I'm I'm interested in learning. But do you think there are other reasons to continue learning? Like, I mean, when I say that, I mean, are there more social reasons that you should continue to learn? Or is it just about, you know, self-realization?

• 36:32Speaker 03

  No, there's definitely other reasons. So because because when you learn something, it's probably like quite a specific thing. But by keeping your brain flexible, you're also going to improve things like resilience, creativity, access to your intuition. Yeah, it's it's basically the difference between doing kind of having all your days being quite the same for long periods of time to being open to change, because that's going to make you more of a healthy risk taker as well, right?

• 37:03Emma Grede?

  And makes you more successful, because the more open to change you are, the better. And I think that a lot of us are kind of kidding ourselves around this AI piece of life right now, thinking, well, I've got to be really open to the change, but I'm interested to understand how you think this revolution in AI is going to impact our brains right now.

• 37:22Emma Grede?

  Are you, are you, really small question for you.

• 37:26Emma Grede?

  Well, because I think that, look, from where I come from, you know, I can't hide from AI, right? It's like I'm a business person and I need to make sure that I fundamentally understand AI as it relates to my businesses. I'm a mother of four. I want my kids to, you know, to embrace AI and to think about how, what they're learning at school and what is the usefulness of what they're learning at school and how do you need to supplement that? There's also this huge worry that I have that I'm not thinking deeply in some ways that I would usually because maybe I'm going to chat GPT that thing, or maybe I'm going to use one of these really sophisticated programs to do the work for me in areas where usually I might well have had to sit down for 20 minutes and have a think.

• 38:09Emma Grede?

  So I just want to understand the, where your opinion is on it.

• 38:13Speaker 03

  Okay. I mean, it's going to be a huge adjustment. I think we've kind of known it's coming for a while. I actually did a TEDx talk in 2015 about.

• 38:21Emma Grede?

  Bloody hell.

• 38:22Speaker 03

  The future of humanity with AI and whether we would become like hybrid robots and stuff. Um, I look back now.

• 38:28Emma Grede?

  I'm gonna, I'm gonna look that up.

• 38:29Speaker 03

  I'm actually, honestly, it amazes me that I knew all that stuff then because I feel like I know less now. But, um, also in the last two years, the, the rate of change of technology has really like gone exponential. So it's not going away. We do have to accept that it is going to completely change the way that we, we live and work. Trying to stay up to date with it and understanding it is really important, but I think the bigger question is, what is it about myself that's going to still be of value? What can I do that chat GPT can't? And I have to say, that's becoming scarily smaller and smaller. But one of the things that I researched for my new book was, is art what makes us human? Big question.

• 39:15Emma Grede?

  Big question.

• 39:16Speaker 03

  And I found out some really beautiful things. So we, we know that we made cave paintings and we like danced and told stories and we sort of think that cave paintings are the first evidence of humans making art. But actually before that, we adorned ourselves, we carved into like ostrich eggshells and stuff. But way before that, we made tools that were more beautiful and symmetrical than they had to be to do their job. So there is this innate like love of beauty and this. Wish to be creative, that's very much part of like the human existence. And I think things like that and intuition are where we need to turn our attention.

• 39:56Emma Grede?

  Right. I think I've heard you talk a little bit about creativity and how important it is for us to embrace creativity with some kind of regularity in our lives.

• 40:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, there's this incredible statistic, which is that if you engage in the arts and culture every two months, so six times a year, then your risk of dying goes down by forty percent.

• 40:17Emma Grede?

  No, it doesn't.

• 40:18Speaker 03

  If you only go twice a year, your risk of dying goes down by fourteen percent. And there are so many free like sculpture parks and galleries.

• 40:26Emma Grede?

  That's the way I'm getting my kids to the galleries then. You're gonna die, basically. You have to come here with me or you'll die. That's a crazy statistic. Why is that?

• 40:38Speaker 03

  I just think we don't understand how beneficial these things are to our mental health, our physical health and our longevity. And there's this new area of research called neuroaesthetics, which is about art and beauty and creativity and how it contributes to to our health and all those those aspects. And yeah, it's, that's why I asked this question, is art what makes us human? Because I think we've we've kind of undervalued how important that and nature, nature is an art form also.

• 41:06Emma Grede?

  And I love that you put those two things together because for so many of us, I mean, I don't think I'm artistically talented in any way, shape or form. But I do feel this deep connection to nature. And I love that you're you're able to put those two things together. And it is you know, in so many ways, when we, certainly when I'm busy and overwhelmed, they're the first things to go, right? It's like I'm not taking a two hour walk outside if I can barely fit my work in. And I'm certainly, you know, cancelling a play that I was supposed to go and see if, you know, something is going off with my kids, you know, it's just they they are the things that just leave your schedule, but you're saying quite the opposite. We need those things to.

• 41:48Emma Grede?

  Keep our brains well and to keep our, to, to keep us alive, quite literally.

• 41:52Speaker 03

  Literally. I mean, nature is the palette that we've existed in since the beginning of humanity. So it's, it's primarily a place that we feel awe and wonder and it really like rejuvenates like all of our hormones and everything. I mean, if you walk past certain trees, they release chemicals called phytonsides that actually trigger the release of natural killer cells in your immune system. So when I'm hearing you say, I'm not going to go for a two hour walk when I'm like completely slammed at work. That's when I need you to go more than ever. And maybe it doesn't have to be two hours. Maybe it could be half an hour. Worst case scenario, if you have to take your laptop and go and do your emails, but do them in a park rather than in the office. Yeah.

• 42:32Speaker 03

  And also, birdsong lowers your stress levels and your blood pressure because birds only sing when there are no predators around. So even though it's.

• 42:42Emma Grede?

  Such a joyful thing to think about.

• 42:44Speaker 03

  Makes you feel safe.

• 42:45Emma Grede?

  The next time I hear tweet, tweet, tweet, I'll think about it so differently. That's so interesting. But do you, so, so tell me, for you in your life, how do you bring the arts into your life? Because I'm sure as people are listening to this, they're like, how? Like, how is that gonna actually work?

• 43:02Speaker 03

  Yeah. And so for me, I absolutely love the ballet. It's like my favorite thing in the whole world. So I try to go to that as frequently as I can. But the other thing is that, so you said you're not, you don't think you're artistically talented.

• 43:15Emma Grede?

  No.

• 43:15Speaker 03

  Euroaesthetic says that it doesn't matter if you're good at it or not, you still get the same benefits.

• 43:20Emma Grede?

  But isn't that such a mindset thing of me thinking because I'm not good at it, then I shouldn't really bother doing it. And you're saying the absolute opposite. It doesn't matter because A, I'd probably be in learning mode, which is good for my brain. And B, I'd be giving myself the, you know, the, the arts and the culture and that side of things that I really need for my survival and my health.

• 43:39Speaker 03

  And it's, it's both making and beholding. So you can go to the ballet or you can dance around your living room. You can, you know, go and listen to a band or you can sing in the show. So yeah, I, I think that's, those are small areas that I would love to see people like bringing in to their life.

• 43:55Emma Grede?

  But these things are habits, aren't they? And I, I feel like getting the right habits that support a healthy brain, that support you. You know, and you don't say not being stressed. What do you, you say something else which is so much nicer.

• 44:10Speaker 03

  Being emotionally regulated.

• 44:11Emma Grede?

  Emotionally regulated, which is so much nicer.

• 44:18Emma Grede?

  We spend a lot of time thinking about how to get more value out of the things we buy. But one of the biggest payments most people make every month is for housing. And historically, that's been left out of the rewards conversation. That's why Bill is such an interesting concept. As a Built member, you can earn points on your housing payments, whether you rent or own. And those points can be redeemed towards things like flights, hotels, Lyft rides, Amazon.com purchases, and even future housing payments. And the membership goes beyond your housing payments. You can link any credit card or debit card to the Built app and earn points on eligible purchases at participating restaurants and other businesses in your neighbourhood. The app also has a neighbourhood concierge that can help you book a fitness class,

• 45:02Emma Grede?

  make a dinner reservation, or schedule a Lyft while automatically applying your member benefits. Download the Built app and join the membership for where you live at joinbuilt.com/emma. That's J-O-I-N-B-I-L-T dot com slash Emma. Use our link so they know we sent you.

• 45:22Speaker 06

  Support comes from Wise, the smart way to manage the currencies you need around the globe. Fed up with losing out to hidden fees when you send money abroad with your everyday bank? Choose the smart way: Wise. You can count on the exchange rate you'd usually find on Google. No one welcomes surprises. Plus, ditch that "where's my money" feeling. Most transfers arrive in under 20 seconds. Join millions saving billions on hidden fees. Be smart, get wise. Visit wise.com. Ts and Cs apply.

• 45:55Emma Grede?

  I want to talk to you a little bit about people at the start of their careers and thinking about habits and thinking about how you, what you do and what you carry to create long-term success. Can you talk to me a little bit about the right habits for long-term success?

• 46:14Speaker 03

  I have to reiterate the foundational ones that I think are really important, that you can't achieve success if you don't have these things right. And they are sleep, eating right, you know, being hydrated.

• 46:27Speaker 03

  Not being sedentary, doing some form of exercise and managing your stress.

• 46:31Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 46:32Speaker 03

  So I've spoken about all of those things a lot before, so I don't need to like deep dive into those ones, but I just need to.

• 46:37Emma Grede?

  But they are.

• 46:37Speaker 03

  Remind us all.

• 46:38Emma Grede?

  They are the foundational things that all of us have to do, but I wonder if there are other things that have an outsized impact on your success and happiness, once you've got the foundational things in place.

• 46:48Speaker 03

  Exactly. So once you've got those in place, then the things that come after that to like really set you up for success are being very tuned into your senses. So not acting like your body is just the vehicle that takes your brain around from meeting to meeting, but being very embodied, having that brain body connection is like hugely advantageous. Because of course, when it is your career, logic is going to predominate, but actually there are. This is a simple kind of, you know, metaphor, but if we think about six ways of thinking, there's physicality, emotion, logic, creativity, motivation and intuition.

• 47:27Emma Grede?

  Right.

• 47:28Speaker 03

  And physicality is quite an easy one to actually tune into, but also easy to ignore. So people who do a lot of sport or exercise tend to be better at acknowledging biofeedback from their bodies, like, you know, what's my body telling me when I get butterflies in my stomach? What's my body telling me when I get goosebumps? And then equally applying that to what am I picking up from your body language that could help me, you know, inform me to be, just to have that edge over everybody that you're competing with to be successful in your career. Honing your intuition, I would definitely say is another one. Spending that time in nature to, to be and to reflect, rather than constantly multitasking and like listening to a podcast or listening to music, like actually having some time

• 48:11Speaker 03

  is a really essential way of managing your stress. And then I think a really, really important one that people underestimate as well is, is your tribe or your community. So who is around you? Because that's pretty much a reflection of what you're going to be and achieve. So if the people around you are successful in the way that you want to be successful, it's more likely that you'll achieve that. If the people around you are not supportive of, you know, your values and goals and purpose, that's probably going to drag you down. So I would say the senses and physicality, honing your intuition, the benefits of nature and the importance of who's in your community,

• 48:56Speaker 03

  those are like the highest things to think about in terms of achieving whatever form of success, you know, that means for you.

• 49:03Emma Grede?

  God, that's so interesting. I want to dig into this idea of the community that you have around you because for so many people, they have an idea about themselves and what they want, but their circumstances, where they come from, where they live, means that they're perhaps not surrounded by the type of people that they might want to. And I definitely think growing up, for me, that was for sure the case. So what do you say to people that don't feel like they have the right people around them? Like, is that really holding them back and can they be successful anyway? What do you do? What do you do, Dr. Tark? Like, what do you do?

• 49:46Speaker 03

  Yeah, so there's something called social contagion, which is that big themes of things like divorce and obesity are catching in a group. Now, of course, I'm not saying if your friend gets divorced, then dump them because you're going to get divorced. But I think what I am saying is, if you think of a rose bush, it benefits from getting pruned to allow new flowers to blossom. And I also mentioned that in the teenage brain, some neural pathways get pruned out so that you can thicken the pathways that you need to succeed as an adult. Later in life, when people can experience things like they don't remember the sequence that events happened in.

• 50:31Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 50:32Speaker 03

  But their pathways for wisdom and judgment and decisiveness become super honed. So when people start to say to me, oh, I'm not remembering things like I used to and that, you know, that means my brain's declining. I say, focus on this positive that you have.

• 50:45Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 50:46Speaker 03

  You know, and I come from a culture where older people are really revered. So I've always actually kind of, you know, really respected and wanted that wisdom that will come later in life.

• 50:56Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 50:56Speaker 03

  And, you know, that's again, a way of looking at things which is quite counter to the cultures that we're in, where getting old is seen as bad.

• 51:03Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 51:04Speaker 03

  So the way that I want to put it, you know, as nicely as I can, is that in the same way that I curate my social media feed, because I know how much impact it's having on my brain, I need to have people around me that have the same values and purpose and goals or, you know, are aligned with me in the things that are important to me, like spirituality. And if, over time, that diverges for people, that's okay. Like, you can just let them go, wish them well. It's not about, you know, dumping or ghosting or like taking it personally. It's just that we're all on a journey, we're all continually growing and changing.

• 51:45Speaker 03

  And it is really important from a neuroscience point of view, who you have around you, how they talk to you, how much psychological safety they give you and, you know, what you contribute to them. So I, I think it is important to examine that.

• 52:00Emma Grede?

  Yeah, and I would, I would go a step further with that because I feel like certainly as a leader, there's a responsibility that you have to the people that are around you in the way that you behave, right? Like, I know if I come into the office in the morning and I go, morning, everyone, which I do every single day, and I give people eye contact and I look at them and I smile.

• 52:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 52:23Emma Grede?

  Like, immediately, it changes the energy of the room. It changes the energy of a meeting when you walk in that way. And I don't know that we all have that, you talk about brain-body connection, but that awareness of how much.

• 52:39Emma Grede?

  You're impacted by other people and other people are impacted by you. And I think we probably do well to understand that a little bit more.

• 52:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, and as a leader, your behaviour and your stress levels have more impact on the team than they do on each other. It's like the silverback gorilla, his stress levels affect the troop of gorillas more.

• 52:58Emma Grede?

  I know my team will be laughing as you say that right there.

• 53:03Emma Grede?

  But it is true.

• 53:04Speaker 03

  It is true.

• 53:04Emma Grede?

  It is true. And we can pick up, I guess, in that same way that the positivity can be transferable and have a big impact. I'm sure that the negative side of things, it has the same effect. I mean, we all know when we've been around someone who's highly stressed and kind of emanating that stress, it has an effect on us.

• 53:22Speaker 03

  Well, if you think back to what I said about that negative gearing of brain being two and a half times stronger than the positive one. Stress actually has more of an effect than the than the positive feeling. So, and it's more physiological because the effect of your tone of voice and your smile and your eye contact can affect people's oxytocin levels, but that's within their own system. But the effects of your stress, particularly if you're suppressing it. So you're trying not to show it, but you've got high levels of cortisol in your system. That actually leaks out of your skin and goes into the skin of other people around you and artificially raises their cortisol levels.

• 54:00Emma Grede?

  No, it doesn't.

• 54:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, as a leader, more so.

• 54:04Emma Grede?

  Like actually comes out of my skin into somebody else's.

• 54:08Speaker 03

  Particles are in the atmosphere, goes into their skin and raises their stress.

• 54:12Emma Grede?

  I just don't think people understand that.

• 54:13Speaker 03

  No.

• 54:15Emma Grede?

  I mean, they definitely don't understand that because, you know, if somebody comes in with a cough or a sneeze next to me, I'm like, go home. Like, don't, don't, just leave the office. I don't want that around me. But in the same way, if somebody came around me with a lot of stress, I'd kind of, there's no way I would tell them to go home. When in actual fact, I probably should because their stress is leaking all over everybody else and making the workplace bad.

• 54:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, and when they're when they're stressed. One of the things that the brain does when it recognizes high levels of cortisol all the time is that it goes into what I call low power mode. So the blood flow around your brain goes to the parts of your brain that you literally need to survive, but not to the parts of your brain that you use to flourish, to think outside of the box, to, you know, to be really productive and creative. That's why presenteeism costs businesses way more than absenteeism.

• 55:06Emma Grede?

  Can you, can you, presenteeism, what is that?

• 55:08Speaker 03

  Presenteeism is when you're in that survival mode. So you make sure you come in and you sit at your desk so you don't lose your job, but you can't actually be really productive.

• 55:17Emma Grede?

  Yeah, I, I mean, I understand that. I, I have a very different philosophy. You know, I really strongly believe that when people are going through things outside the workplace, you break up with a boyfriend, you had a terrible, like, it's, you, nothing is right unless you come in with the right frame of mind. I would rather somebody just be honest and say, I'm really not in the right frame of mind for work today. I'm gonna skip. And it's like, that is totally fine.

• 55:43Speaker 03

  It would cost you business.

• 55:44Emma Grede?

  It's totally fine, because I truly believe that it's better that you're not, you're not there. It's gonna cost me more than if you stay at home, figure your things out and come back to me when you're fresh in a couple of days. But that isn't the, the, you know, common wisdom, I guess.

• 55:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:59Emma Grede?

  So how do you train leaders to have more awareness around what they're putting out? What are the tips that you give people?

• 56:06Speaker 03

  Well, when I first started coaching, which was around the time of the financial crisis, people were still like going red in the face and yelling at people. I was kind of like, this is not okay.

• 56:17Emma Grede?

  But nobody had an idea that that wasn't okay back in those days, because, I mean, that's how I came up in the workplace, with people that were allowed to literally scream in your face.

• 56:25Speaker 03

  Yeah, and make you cry and.

• 56:27Emma Grede?

  All the ti- like, all the time. It was normal.

• 56:29Speaker 03

  Path of destruction behind them.

• 56:30Emma Grede?

  Yes, yes.

• 56:31Speaker 03

  It's, it's more subtle now, but, you know, I do teach people about the mechanism of this hormone cortisol, how it works when we're stressed and how that can show up in the body, because it can show up as weight gain, particularly around your centre. Because when the brain is sensing these high levels.

• 56:49Emma Grede?

  This is terrible for me. This is so.

• 56:52Speaker 03

  Come on, you are like the last person.

• 56:53Emma Grede?

  No, but there's only one piece of like, you know, stubborn weight on my body. And of course it's around the abdomen and I make excuses. Well, I had babies, I have children, but I have a perfect diet and I exercise perfectly. And now it's just a big pile of cortisol induced stress around my abdomen. Yes, it is. I mean, I'm wearing skims, so you would never know. But, uh, but that's the truth. That's, that's, that is stress. It's loud and clear. I'm really upset.

• 57:20Speaker 03

  I can't take you seriously.

• 57:21Emma Grede?

  I'm deadly sad. No, I know that I could, I'll show you later.

• 57:26Emma Grede?

  If you want me to prove it to you, I will.

• 57:28Speaker 03

  That's so funny.

• 57:28Emma Grede?

  So give me a, if I was to say to you, what are the top five things that as an executive coach that are the biggest takeouts from everything that you teach? What would they be like? Forget the fundamental things, like what are the things that we could all do? That we're probably not thinking about.

• 57:46Speaker 03

  Learning to build your resilience to stress. So mental resilience is like, that's the air, that's my niche with leaders. Inevitably, like you, you, you are very busy. You, you travel a lot, you might be jet lagged a lot of the time. High intensity exercise may be very much part of the regime.

• 58:04Emma Grede?

  It was intervals that I was told to do by my trainer. Yes.

• 58:07Speaker 03

  Yeah. So, you know, just kind of, I, I work through what I call micro habits. Because it's too much to come to someone like you and say, this is one big thing that you need to change. Like starting from now, it's much better for me to work with you and say, okay, let's identify. I, in a year, I would say, let's identify 10 to 12 small things that you can change. And we'll take the first three now for the first quarter of the year. And we'll work on building those in as habits that become so natural to you that you don't even think about them anymore. And then by the end of the year, you would have 10 to 12 new micro habits. That will accumulate to build your mental resilience.

• 58:49Speaker 03

  And then you'll be able to take on like bigger and you know, more different things.

• 58:54Emma Grede?

  Give me the top three. What, what would you tell me to do?

• 58:56Speaker 03

  I mean, they would be different for different people.

• 58:58Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 58:58Speaker 03

  But you know, again, I, it's always really important for me to reiterate the foundation ones. So, you know, are you getting eight hours of good quality sleep every night?

• 59:06Emma Grede?

  No, Dr. Star.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  But then the micro tweak would be can you go to bed half an hour earlier? Can you, you know, include the dimming of the lights as part of your wind down routine? So that your sleep quality is better. Can you at least have a regular sleeping and waking time that you maintain throughout the week?

• 59:24Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 59:25Speaker 03

  And then, you know, are you drinking enough water? Let's look at the form of exercise that's actually going to get rid of that belly fat, but which you don't have, but.

• 59:34Emma Grede?

  I'm going to hit you up for that one.

• 59:37Speaker 03

  And then, you know, it sounds like I've already identified a few for you, which might be more time in nature, doing something a bit more creative, like it making the quality time that you want to spend with your family, more to do with those sorts of activities.

• 59:50Emma Grede?

  Yes, yeah.

• 59:55Speaker 07

  Life is full of routines. Packing school lunches, weeknight dinners, and hopefully a little time for yourself. ELO's leak proof, easy to clean drinkware and food storage make everyday life easier with materials you can feel good about. Spend less time worrying and more time mixing things up. Give leftovers a change of scenery, make snack time playtime, or take dinner somewhere unexpected. Visit eloproducts.com and use code TRIELO20 for 20% off your first purchase. That's e l l o products dot com, code TRIELO20. Ryan Baldinger here. A warranty is like special teams. Important job, absolutely. But you don't ask the punter to protect the quarterback on every snap. Different assignment. Same thing with your ring. Most warranties cover manufacture defects,

• 1:00:40Speaker 07

  but they may not cover the everyday stuff that can turn into a game changing turnover, like loss, theft or damage. Jeweler's Mutual is built specifically for jewelry, ensuring engagement rings and wedding bands for loss, theft, damage, disappearance and while traveling. That's your starting defense. And if something happens, Jeweler's Mutual can work with your preferred jeweler to repair or replace the piece. Your jeweler, your relationship, your guy on the sideline. Coverage can start as low as $5 per month annually, and getting started is easy, quick and seamless. Don't confuse a specialist with your starting 11. Everybody has an assignment. Every assignment matters when the pressure comes. Put the right protection on the field before you need it. Get a quote at jewellersmutual.com/baldy, B A L D Y. Jewellers Mutual, protect the rock.

• 1:01:31Emma Grede?

  From a neuroscience perspective, will you talk a little bit about purpose in your work and why that leads to more motivation and success? I feel like I am a person that, you know, and I feel deeply privileged, but for the last 10 years, I've been able to take what it is that I really believe and weave that into my businesses. And they're my businesses and so it just, you know, it's happened and it's been successful. But I know that for other people, it's a harder, for some reason, it feels like a harder sell. And I know that you have an opinion on this.

• 1:02:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, so purpose is really, really important. It makes everything less stressful and it drives the positive emotions that actually help you to achieve success. So when you've got purpose, you'll have higher levels of oxytocin, the bonding hormone that's associated with love, trust, joy and excitement, and lower levels of the stress hormone cortisol that we've just spoken about. And so that means your whole system is more regulated and in balance because purpose kind of aligns with values. And that means that your head, your heart and your gut are more likely to be aligned. So you're in harmony and that makes every decision a little bit easier.

• 1:02:48Speaker 03

  So you're not even using up as many cognitive resources to like fight decisions that don't feel right. It's actually also really important for people in terms of mental health and spirituality to have a purpose that transcends yourself. So it's not just about, I love my job and I make lots of money. There's something.

• 1:03:07Emma Grede?

  We are doing something good here.

• 1:03:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:03:10Emma Grede?

  That's really interesting. And do you, do you encourage people at a certain point in their career to think about purpose? Like, is it important when, you know, you've just graduated, you're coming out of college for your first job? Like, I just wonder where somebody gets to think about or when they get to think about purpose in their career.

• 1:03:30Speaker 03

  What I've seen in my experience with people is it comes up several times throughout life. So often for.

• 1:03:38Speaker 03

  A reason that's not obvious, you just get to some points in life where you feel a little bit lost and directionless.

• 1:03:45Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:45Speaker 03

  And that's a really good time to reflect. It's, it's, you know, life's brought that to you and given you a chance to reassess and, and, you know, sort of realign.

• 1:03:54Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:03:54Speaker 03

  Obviously, when you're, you're young and starting out in your career, it's possible that that sense of purpose is going to change quite a lot in the future. But it's good to just have an idea of, you know, what were the things you dreamed of as a child? Is your life starting to pan out like you really hoped it would? And if not, you know, what are the factors that you might need to look at and change?

• 1:04:17Emma Grede?

  Yeah, I feel all of that. It makes a lot of sense. I wonder if there's something just from a personal point of view for you. If there's like a mental habit that you had to learn that's made you the person that you are today.

• 1:04:31Speaker 03

  It's so interesting because I, I never know. It's very chicken and egg for me. So neuroplasticity is a very core part of my work. But equally, I've always been someone that loves to learn constantly and grow and change. And I literally don't know which came first. I'm just very lucky that my work and my life align. The latest thing that I've done that has been a real game changer for me has been what I call the art of noticing and particularly appreciation of beauty, which also comes from this neuroaesthetics research. And so I decided that for me, it's like next level gratitude. It has the same oxytocin boosting effect.

• 1:05:07Emma Grede?

  Oh, giving next level gratitude. I'm, I'm so ready for that.

• 1:05:10Speaker 03

  So I started just noticing and appreciating beauty, mostly in nature. So it started with the sort of, you know, autumn leaves that was like so red in London last autumn. And then it was the spring blossoms. Because of what I know about birdsong, I always really appreciate birdsong.

• 1:05:25Emma Grede?

  And now so will we.

• 1:05:26Speaker 03

  Um, exactly. And, you know, if I see a beautiful building, I'll really actually stop and like notice it and like. Feel that sense of awe that impressive architecture can bring.

• 1:05:37Emma Grede?

  I love that you said, because I've always thought about myself, and I say this so much, that I'm someone who literally stops to smell the roses. Like, I'll be in a park with my kids, and I have done that my whole life, like, had a deep appreciation for things that I find mostly aesthetically beautiful. But, but, you know, it's like, it's hardwired in me to, like, stop, take the moment, literally smell the rose, literally go like, look at this, we were looking at these, like, tree barks the other day, they were giant in the park, and they were spiky, and they looked insane. And my kids and I stopped, and my eldest son was like, what are we doing? Like, we look insane. And I was like, no, this is incredible, it's so beautiful. Have you ever seen, you know, a tree trunk like that before?

• 1:06:19Emma Grede?

  But if you're not that type of person, those habits are really difficult. Like, it's really hard for you to to have that moment of pause and appreciation. But this comes down to, like, how present you are, right? Isn't that, like, exactly the same thing? Like, just overall, having an appreciation and being in the moment and being present.

• 1:06:40Speaker 03

  It's, it's true, but it's also a habit that you can learn. So, you know, just like, I learnt gratitude practice by writing down or saying ten things I'm grateful for every day for years, until it became more natural. With the appreciation of beauty, I mean, I would say I am quite a present and intentional person, but I certainly wasn't consciously appreciating beauty in the way that I have trained myself to do now. And it really didn't take that long. And like I said, it sort of, I suddenly noticed how many times I was acknowledging that something was beautiful. And I was like, oh, I've, you know, trained that habit, that's great.

• 1:07:11Emma Grede?

  Well, you live in London, as well, it's very beautiful. You're lucky, because it's like, absolutely all around you.

• 1:07:17Speaker 03

  There's a lot, yeah.

• 1:07:18Emma Grede?

  But I, I love that, because again, I think so many of us understand the power of gratitude. And once you do it for a little while, it's one of those ones that's so, um, it's so giving, like, you feel it after, I don't know, even a few weeks of being grateful every day, you start to notice and things come up in your day that you feel grateful for, and you immediately can register that. And so you're saying that this appreciation of beauty is exactly the same.

• 1:07:44Speaker 03

  Exactly the same.

• 1:07:45Emma Grede?

  And it's going to have the same level of positive effect on your life.

• 1:07:48Speaker 03

  I think it's more. I mean, I, I literally think life is so beautiful now. And what I do with gratitude now is I use it when I'm feeling Low, and it changes my mindset so quickly.

• 1:08:00Emma Grede?

  If you could boil what you know down to the kind of three or five things that everyone should really know about their brain, what would you say that those things are? What are the things that we should all be incredibly cognizant of?

• 1:08:17Speaker 03

  So your brain is a tiny part of your body weight, but it's a very energy hungry organ. So it actually uses up twenty to thirty percent of the breakdown products of what you eat. So when you're asleep, your brain is using up twenty percent of your energy. When you're, you know, kind of like switched on and like working or being productive, then it's using up about twenty five percent of what you've eaten that day. And if you're stressed, it's using up thirty percent. So eating with a brain-first approach is is going to have all the beneficial effects on the rest of your your health, your physical health. I don't know if this is like, you you would count this as part of your answer, but I think

• 1:08:56Speaker 03

  intuition is probably the greatest superpower that you can use by understanding your brain-body connection. Because intuition obviously is held in the brain and the neurons. But intuition is basically wisdom that you picked up in life, but you can't remember everything that you've experienced in life. So these patterns are pushed deeper into the brain and they become just like reflexes. You don't necessarily know why you make a certain decision, but it makes sense. And that information over time gets pushed deeper and deeper into the limbic system, the brain stem, the spinal cord, and your gut neurons, which is why, you know, it's sometimes referred to as gut instinct.

• 1:09:38Speaker 03

  But wisdom is also held in your body, in your muscles, through like the reactions that you've had to certain emotional things. And now we've understood in the tissues of your body, the fascia. So actually doing something physical can help to unleash your hidden wisdom. So that walk in nature or that, you know, dancing or drumming or humming, these ancient practices are actually really good ways to get the most out of your brain and your body. So yeah, here's a little more quirky one. So sleeping on your side, left or right, but not your back or your front, is better for cleaning out the waste products from the brain overnight.

• 1:10:13Emma Grede?

  Oh no, I'm a back sleeper. That's terrible. Sleeping on your side is much better.

• 1:10:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, I've got a side sleeper pillow, you could buy one.

• 1:10:23Emma Grede?

  That makes you sleep on your side?

• 1:10:24Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:10:24Emma Grede?

  No way. My goodness. Okay, I'm again, writing it down as you speak. And why is it important, I mean, just again, while you sleep, I'm imagining like part of what's so great about when we sleep is that we are cleaning our brain out, we're giving ourselves a chance to like properly recuperate. But you're saying that happens more effectively when you sleep on the side?

• 1:10:44Speaker 03

  Yes, because we used to think it was a passive process and we didn't really know how it worked. But then in 2012, some Nobel Science Prize winning research showed that, you know, the lymphatic system in the body?

• 1:10:54Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 1:10:55Speaker 03

  There's a glymphatic system in the brain, which is, it's similar to the lymphatic system, but it's made up of glial cells. And there's an active flushing out of toxins that takes seven hours overnight. And it gets rid of the sort of toxins that build up due to the wear and tear of everyday life and stress. And they're, they're the things that accumulate to become the pathology that creates dementia.

• 1:11:21Emma Grede?

  Wow. So that's why it's so important to have a meaningful, good seven hours or more of sleep. But also you can, you can help that flushing a lot more if you're side sleeping.

• 1:11:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:11:34Emma Grede?

  Oh, wow. That is a really good one. I am purchasing that pillow immediately.

• 1:11:39Speaker 03

  And that's why I use the gua sha on my neck in the morning.

• 1:11:42Emma Grede?

  For the, for, I mean, and again, I know so much about lymphatic drainage. It's like I have those massages and you feel and see and, and you know that benefit. But that's so interesting that the same system is essentially there for your brain.

• 1:11:55Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 1:11:56Emma Grede?

  All right. I have one last question for you that I, I think is important. What is the one thing that you would want people to know about the power of their own brain?

• 1:12:06Speaker 03

  Yeah. So the main thing, which kind of encompasses everything that we've said, is that We are capable of so much more than we realise, like we don't utilise all of our brain power and we don't kind of understand the benefits of of kind of like the interconnections that can happen in the brain. So we tend to sort of be quite narrow in our focus and and quite like in task mode. And there's actually a massive benefit to being in what's called default mode, which is the part where you let your mind wander and you like generate new ideas and you make connections between things that maybe you haven't had time to think of before. So if you put that together with some time in nature, then I think that's

• 1:12:50Speaker 03

  where people can really start to unleash their potential by just giving yourself time to just be and let your mind wander and take in that all from nature. I just guarantee that people will come up with ideas and ways to change their life that they just don't give themselves the time for.

• 1:13:06Emma Grede?

  I am a hundred percent sure you are right. I mean, I always, I'm I'm obsessed with the habits of highly successful people. And I remember watching something a while ago about Bill Gates and he takes a thinking week in nature. It's in a tiny little cabin. He has a bunch of books, but no devices, nobody's allowed to call him. And essentially exactly what you're saying, he allows himself to think and to process all of the information and everything that he's learned and to have that association with nature and just have a beautiful moment of the brain doing what the brain is supposed to do. Now, listen, I don't know that I can find a thinking week, but I could definitely find a thinking afternoon.

• 1:13:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:13:45Emma Grede?

  You know, just to let myself wander, as you say. That's a really bloody good tip. Okay. I want to know the first thing that you do in your day that primes your brain. Now, I do think I know the answer to this, but give me the the most important thing that you do to prime your brain for the day.

• 1:14:06Speaker 03

  Gratitude practice.

• 1:14:08Emma Grede?

  And then at the end of the day?

• 1:14:11Emma Grede?

  No, you've got a big routine. I need you to boil.

• 1:14:15Speaker 03

  I have red light bulbs in my bedroom.

• 1:14:18Emma Grede?

  Do you? Well. We're gonna get it there, Dr Tara. Okay, girl.

• 1:14:27Speaker 03

  For blue light blocking, obviously.

• 1:14:29Emma Grede?

  Obviously, obviously. Is there a book that changed your perspective?

• 1:14:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's a really old book called The Master Key System. I think it was written in nineteen twenty seven or something.

• 1:14:41Emma Grede?

  Wow.

• 1:14:42Speaker 03

  And it came out as a series of weekly newspaper columns. But then it got made into a book and there's an exercise that you do after each chapter, which it completely changed the way that I think and started me on the road of manifestation.

• 1:14:56Emma Grede?

  Oh, well, we are all running to buy that book.

• 1:14:59Speaker 03

  But then I wrote the source, which is like the modern day version of it.

• 1:15:02Emma Grede?

  So we could also get that? Thank you very much. Yes, we'll, we'll, we'll note both of them. Tell me one belief that has rewired your brain and one that you've held on to. A good deeply held belief that you have.

• 1:15:17Speaker 03

  Well, I think learning about neuroplasticity, considering that when I was at medical school, we didn't think it existed. And that's changed in my career, has obviously changed the way that I live my life and what I teach. Something that I've held on to, well, my dad said I was either going to be Tara or Maya. And when I was born, he, he just looked at me and said, she's definitely a Tara. And in Indian languages, Tara means star. And he always used to say to me, you're a star and like, only good things are going to happen to you. And so I've, I've, yeah, I've held on to that since I was a little girl.

• 1:15:52Emma Grede?

  Oh, my God, I love that. What a lovely, what a lovely thing. It's so good when you have someone from an early age that really believes in you.

• 1:16:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:16:01Emma Grede?

  Like it's everything, you're a star, like that would stay with you every day. Can I ask you, what are you really excited about professionally when you think about? Everything that you know and where you are in your career. And I don't know if, you know, ten years ago, you saw yourself in L A doing the podcast circuit, being so highly sought after for your work and your knowledge. What excites you now?

• 1:16:24Speaker 03

  I've actually just written a new book, which is coming out in September, and it's called The Signs, The New Science of How to Trust Your Instincts. And it is literally my life's work. I poured my heart and soul into it. It's got everything in it that I believe in now and about, you know, about how I live my life, like how I understand the nature of consciousness, what I believe about the potential for humanity.

• 1:16:49Emma Grede?

  I'm so happy that that's happening for you because, again, I said to you, your work and what you teach and how you teach it, more specifically, I find so beautifully refreshing because to me, you're like a, you know, you're a person that is grounded in all of this science. You have a beautiful, simplistic way of putting across these very deeply complicated ideas, especially for somebody like me, whose brain can just be scrambled by over-information. But I love the way you're teaching us to do something that feels a bit more spiritually connected. You know, when you talk about intuition and gut instinct and those things, like, I know that's true. Like, I don't need anybody to tell me that, like, the science behind it, because that's

• 1:17:34Emma Grede?

  how I've lived my whole life. But I think for so many of us to be able to tap into that power, we do need a little bit more of the information and to understand how it really works. And so I love that you're bringing something that, for my whole life, I've heard that, you know, people have signs and that people don't leave us when they die. And I think that for it to come from someone like you is very, very important, and especially in our culture at this point in time. It's really important that we can believe things that are beyond

• 1:18:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:18:05Emma Grede?

  the tangible.

• 1:18:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:18:07Emma Grede?

  You know, it's really, really important work. And I know all the work that you do is really important, but maybe this is your, you know, what do they call it? Like, when you have, like, the biggest fabulous most moment in your life. It's that. That's the technical term for it. You're having the biggest fabulous most moment of your life. And I'm really happy for you because I think that your work is superb.

• 1:18:26Speaker 03

  Thank you so much.

• 1:18:27Emma Grede?

  And I'm super happy to have spoken to you today.

• 1:18:29Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:18:30Emma Grede?

  Thank you.

• 1:18:36Emma Grede?

  If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click Follow on your favourite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend. We'll be so grateful. Aspire with Emma Grede is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Grede. Our executive producers are Corinne, Gilliard Fisher, Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey are Maddie Sprung Kaiser, Leah Reese Dennis, Asha Saluja and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Stephen Key is our senior producer. Sound design and engineering by Bill Schultz. Angela Peluso is our booker. Original music by Charles Black. Video production by Evan Cox, Kirk Courtney, Andrew Steele, Carlos Delgado and Arnie Agassi. Social media by Olivia Homan.

• 1:19:21Emma Grede?

  Special thanks to Brittany Smith, Sidney Ford, my teams at The Lead Company and WME. Maura Curran, Josefina Francis, Hilary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson Rose, Tim Micol, Shaun Cherry and Lauren Vieira. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at aspirewithemmagreed. Grede is spelt G R E D E. That's aspire, A S P I R E with Emma Grede. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emmagreed.me.

• 1:19:54Speaker 06

  In the market to buy a new car? You are not alone. Navy Federal Credit Union members have a helping hand. Technically, a helping globe. A mission assistant whose mission is guiding you through your car buying journey. Offering low rates that can save you more. Your mission assistant helps your budget, estimate your payment and understand your terms so you roll into the dealership ready to negotiate on your terms. Mission Assist. Everything you need to buy a car, all rolled into one. Navy Federal Credit Union. Our members are the mission. Navy Federal is insured by NCUA. Credit and collateral subject to approval.