Aspire with Meghan: Why Ambition Is Her Jam (and How She Bottles It)

Meghan, Duchess of Sussex, isn’t just launching a brand—she’s rewriting what it means to build one under relentless public scrutiny. In her first wide-ranging interview about her new company As Ever, Meghan joins Emma for a candid conversation about the pressure, the pivots, and the power of betting on yourself when the world is watching. They get into it all: why a humble jar of jam became her first product, how a Netflix partnership changed the scale overnight, and what it’s like to run a startup when your name is the headline. Meghan opens up about the lessons she learned selling scrunchies as a kid, what she would change about her public narrative, and the real cost of ambition in plain sight. This is a masterclass in building boldly—when you can’t move quietly.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:10Emma Grede?

  Today, in the first wide-ranging interview about her new business venture, as ever, Meghan, Duchess of Sussex, controversial, celebrated and undeniably motivated, is reshaping her definition of influence. Constantly scrutinized and fiercely private, Meghan navigates the tension between authenticity and public perception. Today, she speaks candidly about her drive, breaking the rules, and what it truly means to own your own narrative. In this revealing episode of the Aspire Podcast, Meghan shares the hidden cost of ambition, how vulnerability fuels her resilience, and why her vision remains unapologetically bold.

• 1:00Emma Grede?

  Meghan, I'm so excited to have you here today.

• 1:02Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:02Emma Grede?

  No, thank you. Thank you for being here.

• 1:04Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:04Emma Grede?

  So there's so much to talk about today. And I am dying to get into this new brand launch because I think this specific audience is one that is obsessed with pivots, obsessed with, you know, changing what they're doing.

• 1:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17Emma Grede?

  A lot of people thinking about starting businesses or starting their own ventures. And that's exactly what you've done. But before we get into that, I really want to understand where you got your entrepreneurial bug. Did you have, you know, like business owners or founders in your family? Where does it come from?

• 1:34Speaker 01

  Yes, well, my grandfather on my mom's side, he used to have an antique store. And I would always be, oftentimes after school with him, helping with his antiques and watching what it's like to, you know, just be in business and also customer service. And then my mom, though she was a travel agent for many years, she also used to do, um, you know, like not a county fair, but street festivals and things like that, where you have little pop-ups and vendors. And so she would, we'd go downtown, she'd buy fabric, and she'd make dresses and would sell those.

• 2:05Emma Grede?

  I love it.

• 2:05Speaker 01

  And when we were down there, we'd go to downtown LA, I would buy with my allowance just sort of. Sort of the overstock, you can buy like one yard at a time. And I started using my own sewing machine. I would make scrunchies. So when I was about fifth, sixth grade, I was selling scrunchies for a dollar a piece at school. And so I guess it starts young when you get to see you can have your hands involved in something and really be able to share that more broadly, but also you can earn at the same time.

• 2:29Emma Grede?

  Yeah, you're stacking the cash. One dollar a scrunchie.

• 2:31Speaker 01

  I'll take it. One dollar at a time, but it was great. It really did spark something in me.

• 2:35Emma Grede?

  Yeah. And at that time, we were loving the scrunchies. So you were probably selling, selling through a bunch of those.

• 2:39Speaker 01

  Imagine if I was doing that now, it would probably be pretty good.

• 2:42Emma Grede?

  It would work out. I'm telling you. So take me back to the beginnings of As Ever, because I'm guessing that like so many founders, you've been trying to get this business off the ground for a while. It's finally launched and to much fanfare.

• 2:55Speaker 01

  Oh goodness.

• 2:56Emma Grede?

  So I'd love to know, just I want to understand, like, how did it start?

• 3:00Speaker 01

  I knew that I wanted to put something in the world and for years, and we've been out here for five years now, really trying to decipher what, what do I want to share? What do I authentically, organically want to share and how to translate that? Truth be told, I had just been making a lot of jams and preserves at home and sharing them as holiday gifts with a lot of friends. And it was one morning, beginning of the new year, so many friends at the same time had texted saying, I don't know what it is, but your jams just make me so, so happy. And I thought, maybe that's the thing, because I do believe it was probably more obvious to a lot of people that I would get into fashion or beauty.

• 3:39Emma Grede?

  No doubt.

• 3:40Speaker 01

  That, that that seemed like the natural inclination, but that's not what I was sitting around doing every day. And so my real passion was in this way of sharing and I love being in the kitchen. I've always loved cooking. So, you know, I thought maybe I could translate into a smaller brand and then made a very big pivot, as you say, when I went from about to onboard a CEO and a small team to having Netflix as my partner. That takes it to a completely different level.

• 4:08Emma Grede?

  Totally different.

• 4:09Speaker 01

  Yes, and goes very far beyond my ideas of, oh, I can sell locally. I could maybe be at a farmer's market. I thought that would be cute.

• 4:17Emma Grede?

  I'm going to do global Netflix.

• 4:18Speaker 01

  Yes, so suddenly we just, it changed quite a bit. And then the offerings, of course, will expand to meet that same demand and that, you know, interest, which I'm grateful for.

• 4:27Emma Grede?

  So talk me through that partnership a little bit because so many people, when they start, they're either bootstrapping or they're going out and raising money. You did actually what I did, which was to take a partner. So what does that look like for you right now?

• 4:39Speaker 01

  Yes, well, their Consumer Products Goods Division has typically done lots of merchandise and bespoke and interesting brand work, but for pre-existing shows.

• 4:49Emma Grede?

  Right, so it's like a Stranger Things, like the top titles.

• 4:53Speaker 01

  Yes, Stranger Things, Bridgerton. So you could easily go Bridgerton, Regency Era, go and do an incredible collaboration with Pat McGrath or do something with Liberty of London with that thematic. So where things were different with me, of course, is that it wasn't a brand that was established. It was my ideation and doing it with them, we're developing it as we're going. And so I think, as you know, in building brands, it doesn't happen overnight. It can't happen overnight. I guess the difference was with me is that so much of that work that can typically be done behind the scenes for most founders, there's just so much curiosity that you are building the plane while and flying it at the same time, but you're still

• 5:37Speaker 01

  in the building phase. You just don't get to build in quiet.

• 5:39Emma Grede?

  Well, it's a gift and a curse, right? It's one of those things where there must be a part of you that's like, great, there's an interest in what I'm doing, but there's also just such scrutiny in what you're doing.

• 5:48Speaker 01

  There's a lot of focus on every detail and every moment of quiet.

• 5:53Emma Grede?

  Do you, every single moment, quiet, not quiet and everything.

• 5:57Speaker 01

  It really does. It really runs the gamut, but at the same time, what a blessing that it creates and generates so much buzz and so much interest, but I'm still never willing to sacrifice or compromise on the quality and to take my time. Someone else's urgency is not my urgency.

• 6:13Emma Grede?

  Damn right. I mean, I honestly think that that's a great way to think about it. With this partnership, do you think it brings more scrutiny or is it all upside?

• 6:22Speaker 01

  I don't think it brings more scrutiny. I think it certainly brings more attention and curiosity. How could it not? Especially because it's a new chapter for Netflix as well from the CPG side. And really, when you link it to the Netflix series with Love, Megan, it is where content and commerce can meet in a really unique way. So I think with season two coming up, we've been able to really maximize that opportunity also and look at what I'm making in season two and see that reflected and complementary in what the brand has an offering.

• 6:48Emma Grede?

  And how are you really thinking about that? Because obviously, the brand will live in between the show. It's going to live while the show, you know, if the show doesn't continue, it will just, you know, I'm assuming that the brand just continues to grow. So how are you actually thinking about that partnership? Because I know when I started, that initial partnership that you do in business, you can get it really right, you can get it really wrong. God knows, I got it wrong enough times. Oh, my goodness. Yeah, because you know what? Certainly for me, there was such a sense of desperation to just get something done that the first person that was like, hey, we believe in you. I was like, great, me too. Let's go. And there were parts of it that were good and parts of it that, you know, let's say I had to learn from a little bit. But when you look at this partnership, because it is pretty untraditional in that way, right?

• 7:31Emma Grede?

  You're launching a brand with your content partner. So I wonder what, like, where does the, you know, where does the brand live? How are you working together? Who does what? Is that all, you know, like, prefigured out or are you just working it out as you go along?

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Well, I think what's different than what you're saying is your initial experience is that we've been in partnership with Netflix for five years already. My husband and I, so there's familiarity and there's comfort. While that was just on the content side, not on the commerce side, these are relationships and friendships now. So though I'm working more so with the other building of Netflix, it's still the same group of people. It's still the same points of contact that I can reach out to. I love having a friendship and a nice rapport with Bella. Bella Bajaria has been such a champion of both the series and of this brand. And, you know, it was only from me sending her fruit baskets and jams and whatnot that she said, this is a show.

• 8:21Emma Grede?

  This is good stuff.

• 8:22Speaker 01

  It's a show. So I think that changes it because it's not as though you're jumping in with people that you don't know, which a lot of, a lot of founders, I think, to your point, if they are looking for partnership for capital, whether it's private equity, VC, or a partner in this way that I have. That's a very big relationship to take on.

• 8:42Emma Grede?

  It really is.

• 8:42Speaker 01

  But if you have rapport, running up to it, it does adjust it a little bit because you have a shorthand.

• 8:47Emma Grede?

  Yeah. And where are the lines? Like, what are you doing versus what are they doing? Because I imagine, especially when it's something that's so close to your heart and something that you clearly take a lot of pride in, how are you able to make sure that the product is what you want it to be, the brand is what you want it to be? Because there's a lot of compromise when it comes to partnerships.

• 9:05Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 9:05Emma Grede?

  I say this to founders all the time, right? When you give something, you have to imagine that something's coming back. And so what does that partnership actually look like right now?

• 9:13Speaker 01

  Well, I think at the end of the day, what I appreciate is in the contract, they understand that this is my vision. It's my vision and also the success of the brand, I believe, is rooted in the fact that you can feel when I am involved in something. And so because I have been in this state of ideation of what I wanted to have as an offering for so long, the fact that they trust my final judgment is great on what I want to put out there. But equally, one of the things I've said from the onset, I love being part of the creative process. It's important to me. It's also where I find a lot of joy. So the analogy I say is don't bake the cake without me. Meaning if I'm in the kitchen, I want to be part of making the batter. What's the flavor profile?

• 9:56Speaker 01

  And there's an entire team that can help put that cake in the oven. But I want to check it before it goes in the oven. And I want to be involved in frosting it and presenting it and the language surrounding it. I, I love the details of things. And I think that's where a lot of the magic comes in. So in partnership, while we are every day in the weeds of minutia from packaging and unboxing to the language on a newsletter, which yes, I'm one of the people who's looking at all of that and making sure that it feels reflective of my vision for the brand. It's just a constant dance. And I think in any business. You're dancing.

• 10:31Emma Grede?

  All the time.

• 10:32Speaker 01

  All the time.

• 10:32Emma Grede?

  Dancing.

• 10:33Speaker 01

  Oh, you could choreograph it as well as you want, but at a certain point, you're gonna have to freestyle a little bit and improv and trust that your partner knows, like, okay, we're moving this way. And you're just doing that dance together.

• 10:43Emma Grede?

  And what about the less sexy side, the less creative part of it? When you're thinking about logistics, when you're thinking about the finances, when you're thinking about the backend infrastructure. Like, is that something that you are interested in getting involved in? Or are you like, this is for my partner and I can trust them on that?

• 10:58Speaker 01

  I'm very involved in that part. It matters. Because I think the misconception is when you have a very large machine and a very powerful and influential machine like a partner as with Netflix, and you have me and the profile and all of the attention that that brings as well, you have the two of us together. Yes, it's an incredible partnership with a lot of clout behind them. And at the same time, we're still a startup.

• 11:23Emma Grede?

  Yeah, you're still a startup.

• 11:24Speaker 01

  We're a startup.

• 11:25Emma Grede?

  Doesn't matter.

• 11:25Speaker 01

  It does not matter.

• 11:26Emma Grede?

  That mentality is so important, I think. Like, to have that there and to know it doesn't matter. Like, every single customer, every interaction really counts. And it's often that unsexy stuff that is the stuff that really impacts the customer as well. It's like, how quickly are they getting their delivery? How much can they rely on your site? Like, is what they order what they get in the package?

• 11:44Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 11:44Emma Grede?

  It matters.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  It all matters. And also just the customer service experience. That is your one-on-one interaction with the people that are supporting your brand. I want you to feel the way you would feel if, in the same spirit of hospitality, if you were a guest in my home. I see you, I wanna make sure your needs are met. We're gonna make sure you're comfortable. If something wasn't exactly as you imagined it, let's talk about it. How can we make you comfortable? All of that is part of the spirit of the brand. And I think, you know, it might not seem as sexy, but it's fundamentally important.

• 12:13Emma Grede?

  So tell me more about the actual brand and your aspiration, because this is a notoriously difficult category. And I love that you're like...

• 12:20Speaker 01

  Consumerables, you mean?

• 12:20Emma Grede?

  I mean, it's really hard. You know, I always thought that when I started a business, I grew up with family that had flower stalls. And I remember like, the inventory would always die. Like, it was literally like, this is really a tricky business because you've got this window and then the inventory is literally dying. So we're inventory...

• 12:38Speaker 01

  Thankfully, we're not in that. Thank goodness. Products are shelf stable for several years. Yes.

• 12:44Emma Grede?

  But it is a really tricky category, right? And even when you think about the distribution, once it gets outside of D to C, it's a, you know, it's a big, complicated machine with big players in there. So how do you think about the vision of what you're trying to create? And also the fact that you've decided to take a chunk out of something that is really, you know, notoriously complex.

• 13:03Speaker 01

  Well, I think I go back to the authenticity, right? It's what I love and it's what I want to share. So what I was cooking in my home to figure out recipe testing to scale that to a level where you can share it more broadly. And of course, compliance is different globally when we get into that market, which we will.

• 13:19Emma Grede?

  You're going global.

• 13:21Speaker 01

  How can we not? I mean, how can you not? Yeah, but it's, it's the spirit of sharing. I don't want to just share it here. I want to share it.

• 13:28Emma Grede?

  And it's better for the P and L. There is that, Megan.

• 13:31Speaker 01

  Yes, that's true. Um, and in the spirit of sharing. Uh, but I think, look, at the end of the day, if I had gone into beauty, for example, and I have a lot of-

• 13:41Emma Grede?

  Was that a consideration at any point for you?

• 13:43Speaker 01

  It was definitely something that people were asking me to get involved with. I mean, in these past years-

• 13:47Emma Grede?

  Did you have any inclination, were you like, this could be fun?

• 13:51Speaker 01

  I think it could be fun.

• 13:51Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 13:52Speaker 01

  And I think there'll be a time for that. I think there'll certainly be a time for fashion. You and I could talk about that later. Um, but I think, you know, ultimately, I wanted to do what felt authentic. But I also recognize that, yes, there are variables that you don't have to think about when you're doing composition of makeup, right? You can buy all of your products, you know, your supply chain, and you know that every single time you can count on those sort of scientific ingredients to yield the same product. One of your partners is not Mother Nature. If it's a bad season for berries, that's going to affect your product, but you're still going to wait until it all falls into place differently. So there are more factors involved, but I do think at its core, it's still rooted in something that feels very true to me. And that's the springboard for everything else.

• 14:36Speaker 01

  Starts in the garden, starts with this beautiful, humble pot of jam. But I don't care who you are, you're a little bit charmed by jam. But then what does that do? That introduces you to what are the extensions of that that I want you to start or end your day with, that I want you to treat yourself with or gift to friends? And then you say, well, now you're in my home. So what are the other hospitality and hostess pieces I want you to be able to share? And we move from the kitchen into a much broader space.

• 15:03Emma Grede?

  Oh, I love you have big ambitions for us ever.

• 15:06Speaker 01

  I do.

• 15:06Emma Grede?

  I hope so.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:08Emma Grede?

  I mean, because I think there's so few people that can actually create truly global brands. And so why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you take that opportunity? I mean, I certainly would.

• 15:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it's and it's also playful to be able to have fun in the exploration of what it could be.

• 15:24Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 15:24Speaker 01

  You can stay small.

• 15:25Emma Grede?

  Well, the world's your oyster right now. I mean, you've started with a few products, but you literally could do anything that you want to do.

• 15:35Emma Grede?

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• 16:19Emma Grede?

  a dinner reservation, or schedule a Lyft while automatically applying your member benefits. Download the Built app and join the membership for where you live at joinbill.com/emma. That's J O I N B I L T dot com slash Emma. Use our link so they know we sent you.

• 16:39Speaker 02

  Do you ever wish you could ask nosey questions about people's money?

• 16:42Speaker 03

  I have $729.71 in my bank account.

• 16:46Speaker 04

  We bought, you know, a $1.3 million house on a $350,000 income.

• 16:51Speaker 02

  On the podcast, What We Spend, we ask those questions. It's a show about money and all the feelings that come with spending it.

• 16:58Speaker 05

  I want to be the kind of person who can just take care of the people in my life.

• 17:03Speaker 02

  Listen to What We Spend, an Odyssey original, available now wherever you get your podcasts.

• 17:14Emma Grede?

  Is there any part of you that feels any sense of imposter syndrome? Do you ever sit back and get overwhelmed by how big the opportunity is? And then, you know, pedal back from anything that might be?

• 17:26Speaker 01

  I don't. I think I have. I think that I've always had a very entrepreneurial spirit, as we talked about. But equally, I enjoy being in a position of having a strong team around me, being able to help guide that team as a whole.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  And I've also, you know, in adventures of my life, I have certainly,

• 17:51Speaker 01

  I have certainly navigated through things that can in some ways feel bigger.

• 17:54Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 17:55Speaker 01

  So this for me is just another chapter that I think is full of, you know, I'm a very curious person, new learns. I love learning something new all the time. I don't feel imposter syndrome. I feel like I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be right now.

• 18:07Emma Grede?

  I'm really happy you said that. I mean, I do think I speak to so many founders and more often than not, they feel some sense of imposter syndrome. And I have so many women that will say to me, didn't you feel or don't you feel imposter syndrome? And my answer is always no. I'm like, if not you, then who? Like, why would you feel that way, right? I feel like to some extent, we're all making out as we go along. And even when you get a lot of experience and you've done, you know, multiple startups like I have, nothing is the same because you're never doing it in the same time, in the same culture, with the same people.

• 18:37Speaker 01

  Yes, and even if you're making it up as you go along, as you say, which I think true, most people are doing that. Imposter syndrome is when you're posturing as though you know everything. You don't need to posture as though you know everything. It is perfectly okay for me as the founder and the owner of this company to say, sorry, what does that mean?

• 18:53Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 18:54Speaker 01

  Can you help me understand that? And actually, I think it's a really great posture to take, or a truth, rather, to take as a leader to show that, yes, I know what I know, but I'm also so excited to have people on this team that know more about certain avenues than I do. Because we're learning from each other. That's not imposter syndrome.

• 19:10Emma Grede?

  Find great people. You've just got to find great people and get out of their way. And I really believe in that because I think that as a founder, knowing what you don't know is so important.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  And being honest about it.

• 19:21Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 19:22Speaker 01

  Be honest about it. It's okay to not know everything.

• 19:25Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  That's part of the beauty of it. I can see that in the culture that you've created around here. You have an incredible team. You take care of your team. That is all reflected in your success because it takes a village. It really does.

• 19:35Emma Grede?

  It takes a village every day. Day.

• 19:38Speaker 01

  Every day.

• 19:38Emma Grede?

  All day, every day.

• 19:39Speaker 01

  Single day.

• 19:40Emma Grede?

  And what does your team look like these days? Because you do so many things and you've got a lot happening. Do you work with the same team and then things get farmed out? Or is it very, very separate? Each and every little thing you do between, you know, the show and, you know, your philanthropic efforts and then the brand now?

• 19:56Speaker 01

  Yes, well, we have a small, I have a small and mighty team for my office. And then I think obviously our foundation is independent of that. But those are the same executive directors we've had for a very long time who run it beautifully. And then you look at with Netflix, they have an entire team that they've devoted to this project specifically, being as ever, separate team for With Love, Meghan, that's a crew of about 80 people.

• 20:18Emma Grede?

  It's a lot of people.

• 20:19Speaker 01

  It's a lot of people.

• 20:20Emma Grede?

  It's a lot of people.

• 20:20Speaker 01

  So there's a lot of different teams. And at the same time, my core team that sits around me for all of the projects is, you know, very, very strong, savvy women.

• 20:29Emma Grede?

  So talk to me a little bit about the launch because it was very, very well executed. But you basically sold out of everything in about 45 minutes. Listen, I can't get you on that one because I don't know a business that I've had where, you know, a couple of hours in, every single thing has been gone.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  Everything.

• 20:44Emma Grede?

  But it comes with a lot, right? That comes with this, you know, of course, you end up kind of fueling that idea of scarcity in your business, which is a great thing. It's never terrible to disappoint customers, but there's the flip side of it. And I remember when I started Good American, I buy, I don't know, the third hour, I was starting to pick up the phone and email customers. What did you do and how did you feel when everything was gone?

• 21:07Speaker 01

  Well.

• 21:08Emma Grede?

  Or I should ask you, was it planned? I mean, did you plan to actually?

• 21:11Speaker 01

  No, no. It was a beautiful surprise. I had a feeling there would be a lot of interest and we planned for that. We didn't plan for everything selling out in under an hour. And so watching those metrics happen in real time, you know, I set my alarm for the exact moment we were going to go live and watching it, getting texts from my friends saying, it's already sold out. And then see.

• 21:33Speaker 01

  It was amazing. And also, to your point, because I'm business minded, I'm immediately going, "Okay, well, this is going to be a big pivot. Now what?" Because I knew that I had a decision to make, which came down to, what is our timeline to be able to restock these products that we had? Well, we can restock what we had at those same quantities, but then I'll have another sellout. And I don't want that for people. I think scarcity is great if it happens organically at the onset, but at a certain point, even being consumer minded, I would be fatigued if that kept happening and I was going to a website. So I said, "Okay, let's take this opportunity to grow, to have exponentially more SKUs as well as more inventory."

• 22:17Speaker 01

  And that's what we've been doing. We went right back to making sure we could scale up to that level.

• 22:21Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 22:22Speaker 01

  And have the quality meet the quantity, which was very key. And then if we have that opportunity of more time, the luxury of that is, well, the products that have been in development that were going to be punted to this quarter, should we pull this in to this next launch?

• 22:37Emma Grede?

  Right, there's decisions to be made.

• 22:38Speaker 01

  Because that would be great. There's decisions to be made. And like, what can our offering be at this point? That is larger than what sold out in that first run. So as a seasonal drop, I think that was really important to say, "Let's get it back, but let's get it back in a much bigger way," which is what we've been working towards.

• 22:53Emma Grede?

  And those are really important decisions because you have to decide, and I'm guessing that you're learning all the time, about reputation management, your customers, supply chain. Like, how are you thinking about those things? Because they are all such big decisions in the beginning for any founder. Like, you're the one that needs to decide how you're showing up for customers every day.

• 23:13Speaker 01

  It comes with a lot of pressure, because when that call comes down to you, when I have to make that call, you don't know if it's going to be the right call. You just have to trust your gut. And that's ultimately what it goes back to. I say, if I was the person that waited so long to get that product. Do I want a second go around not be able to get the product? Or do I want to be able to buy it and share it with all my friends? So I'm constantly putting myself in the mindset of someone who's supported me for a long time and want to be able to get it. Or the 15 year old girl who's saved up her money to be able to buy a couple of the offerings that we have. But it does come with pressure and all you can do is make the best decision with the information that you have. And that's what I've been doing and to trust, and again, to trust your gut. I think that's so key.

• 23:56Emma Grede?

  It is key.

• 23:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:57Emma Grede?

  It is key and it's hard to do, especially in the beginning when you don't have much information to go on. I think the number one thing that you have to do is, again, like you said, put yourself in the position of your customers and just listen to your intuition.

• 24:09Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 24:10Emma Grede?

  It'll never, it will never serve you wrong, so at least not in my experience.

• 24:13Speaker 01

  Yes, well, and also trying to make sure you have all the metrics and all the learns that you can. But when everything sells out in 45 minutes, you don't necessarily get the same rewards. You're like, okay, so now is the scale up.

• 24:24Emma Grede?

  Minute number five, this was tracking, yeah, it tells you nothing. It's hard to learn from your business, but it's like that. But really good problems to have, I think.

• 24:31Speaker 01

  Good problems to have, champagne problems, as they call them.

• 24:34Emma Grede?

  Absolutely, they are.

• 24:34Speaker 01

  You know, the world is learning with me in real time. We're learning together.

• 24:38Emma Grede?

  You're, there are so many comparisons right now, right? It's like people are saying you're the next Martha Stewart, you're the next Gwyneth Paltrow. So two questions, how do you feel about that? But also what's going to set this brand apart? Because you're in a very, very different time right now. It's a different culture. I think consumers are super, super wise. So, you know, I want to ask you those two things. How do you feel about it?

• 25:01Speaker 01

  I think that's very flattering. Those are incredibly successful businesswomen. So I, I don't take that lightly. That means a lot if there's any comparison made in that regard. And I also think it was really important to me. I remember where I come from, right? So I knew that I wanted things to be reflected in the same way that I've put an outfit together for years, Hilo. I knew I wanted this brand to be mastige. And to come out of the gate with something luxury didn't make sense to me. So the price point itself with nearly everything being under $20 was key. I think that's a differentiator. Never sacrificing on quality. Being engaging in a customer service manner, I think is really important, but also.

• 25:45Speaker 01

  You know, the show reflects the spirit of what I ultimately want to put out in the world. And though they're not the same thing, and by design, look, the show and the brand are not named the same thing.

• 25:54Emma Grede?

  Yeah, smart, by the way.

• 25:56Speaker 01

  No, they're just not. They complement each other. They can talk in the same conversation, but they are not the same. And so knowing that I have a vehicle to be able to share the things that I love to do, and then a place where you can go and buy them if you don't want to necessarily make them on your own, feels like a very smart way to do the full and complete storytelling of what I'm after. So, you know, I feel flattered by the comparisons and I feel excited that I'm sharing things that are important to me and how I would do things in my own home, and that I hope people translate that to theirs as well.

• 26:26Emma Grede?

  No doubt. Given that the ambition.

• 26:28Speaker 01

  I like the no doubt. I love it. It's great.

• 26:31Emma Grede?

  I mean, I really do. I've, I've, I watched the show. I feel like it's very clear. I did not make anything. I'm not gonna lie.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  Do you cook?

• 26:39Emma Grede?

  I am such a cook, like such a cook, but I cook, you know, it's like, I, I don't have a lot of time to cook.

• 26:45Speaker 01

  Yes, I understand that.

• 26:45Emma Grede?

  But I take time off, like Thanksgiving, the three days running up to Thanksgiving, I cook for three days straight.

• 26:51Speaker 01

  Do you do Thanksgiving now that you've been here?

• 26:53Emma Grede?

  Literally, it might be, it's for me, it's like Christmas practice.

• 26:56Speaker 01

  But it's also like a Sunday, but it's like a Sunday roast in the UK.

• 26:59Emma Grede?

  Exactly. So I'm an absolute expert of it. But I do like, you know, like an English-American mashup. So it's like, you know, I do all of the, yeah, I do like a Yorkshire pudding and I do a roast potato. But of course I do, you know, like sweet potato pie and I add in, I do like the greens and, you know, a ham and those type of things. But I don't get to cook nearly as much as I want. But I look at you and I feel like it feels like you're getting so much joy out of this. But it's an interesting thing when it's something that you love so much, but there's also huge ambition around it. And I wonder, when you think about the way you've set up this partnership, is that structure gonna work for you as you go forward? Do you think there's a time you're gonna have to go out and raise capital?

• 27:39Speaker 01

  Potentially, it depends on what we want the growth trajectory to look like. But I think, you know, and all the contracts and logistics surrounding it have really set up what the future can look like together. And being mindful of the movements of that, there are a lot of surprises still with the series that we'll be able to share later this year, obviously, season two coming. But I think what's really exciting about it is it's the evolution of the partnership that we've had with Netflix for so many years to now say we're doubling down in the growth of me as an entrepreneur and their support in that chapter. So it's, it's huge, it's great. But yes, I mean, as we continue to grow, you know, you might be looking to expand certainly globally. And if there's a raise that's involved in that, then I think we'll be in a really good position to do that.

• 28:21Emma Grede?

  Yeah, no doubt you will be. I have absolutely no doubt in that.

• 28:24Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 28:24Emma Grede?

  When you think about the failure rate for first time entrepreneurs, does that ever concern you? Have you even let your mind go there?

• 28:34Speaker 01

  I do not think about failing. No.

• 28:37Emma Grede?

  You're not scared of failing?

• 28:39Speaker 01

  Is anything actually a failure ultimately? Because you're gonna learn from it, no matter what happens. But no, I feel confident in what I've been dreaming up for so long. I feel confident in the partner that I have. And I feel really proud of the team that I have. So that's not an option.

• 28:55Emma Grede?

  It's not an option. I love that you say that's not an option because there's just such an intense narrative around everything that you do. I can't imagine not being a bit scared. Like, I'm always scared when I start something, but nobody's even watching me. Like, I get to fail in a corner on my own.

• 29:11Speaker 01

  With your glass of wine.

• 29:13Emma Grede?

  Thank God nobody was watching that. But it's very different for you, and so I'm surprised that you say that.

• 29:17Speaker 01

  I'm not saying that there aren't moments where I don't feel scared. Of course you do. But as I've continued to say to myself, in whatever I'm going through, my faith is greater than my fear. I believe in myself. I believe in the team around me. I believe in our potential for success. And is that the same metric that someone else is putting on it? No. For me, it would have been a huge success and not a failure if I was selling my homemade jams at farmer's market. And I'd gotten a cottage license, I applied for that in the county of Santa Barbara, where you can literally go and...

• 29:49Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 29:50Speaker 01

  Yes, I was like, great, you can make the goods in your home and sell them. That would have been a success for me. So someone else's sense of what that looks like is not necessarily what mine is. And that will continue to grow. But no, I don't, I don't see, I don't see the possibility of failure. Not when you can learn from everything that you've done.

• 30:09Emma Grede?

  The way that you speak about both imposter syndrome and failure, because these are two things that, again, uniquely are in the kind of language of so many female founders. They're real for so many people, and that's fine. But I do also want to demystify the idea that like we have to feel that, that we have to go around feeling really scared, and we have to believe that this is not a journey for us. And so I wonder what in your life and your history has got you to the point where you can feel like that.

• 30:40Speaker 01

  Well, I think words matter. And I think certain words and terms become very topical and trendy, and they just become part of the vernacular.

• 30:51Emma Grede?

  I believe that.

• 30:51Speaker 01

  Right? And, and at a certain point, you go, why do I keep reinforcing this idea? Because it's topical, right? And I ultimately believe the more that you can change your thoughts, you're going to change the things around you.

• 31:03Emma Grede?

  So you're a big believer in mindset? You have to be, yeah.

• 31:06Speaker 01

  I think as a female, as any founder, but as a female founder, you have to train your mind

• 31:14Speaker 01

  to literally be so focused on what your goal is, to be so, as I said in the podcast I was doing, laser focused on what your intention is. There isn't room for a tremendous amount of self doubt with that. It will be there. But when it appears, when it appears, you have to train yourself out of it.

• 31:31Emma Grede?

  You've got to shut it down.

• 31:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I don't think that it's helpful to indulge some of the language that is going to be self limiting. I don't think that that helps anyone grow. And I don't think being fear based, yes. Being risk averse, very valuable. Being clear and realistic about the landscape that you're walking into, very helpful. Talking yourself out of it or talking yourself into negative self talk is not valuable as a founder.

• 32:00Emma Grede?

  So how have you? Trained yourself to do that. Do you think that comes from your background as an actress?

• 32:04Speaker 01

  Could be. I mean, you know, when I was an auditioning actress, and this was, this is well before suits. You have to think, at that time, there were certainly not a lot of mixed race parts.

• 32:18Emma Grede?

  Really?

• 32:19Speaker 01

  No.

• 32:19Emma Grede?

  Really?

• 32:20Speaker 01

  No, there weren't a lot of, if I was going in for an audition, it was either, you have to remember, this was a very different time than it is now. It was girl next door. That was typically blond haired, blue eyed, and a certain look. But because I'm half white, I would also be submitted for those roles. And then if it was a character that had any sort of ethnicity, there was always a bit of a edge to those characters, because I'd be submitted for those roles. And I also, to a lot of people in casting, they thought I was Latina. So I share that because, and I've shared this before, it was a numbers game. If I'm only up for ten parts, that could be ten no's. But if I'm up for thirty parts, because I can fit into so many different rooms, that could be thirty no's.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  That is a lot to chip away at your self-esteem. That is really hard. And I think so much of that, like I went through my chapter of self doubt as an auditioning actor and beyond that. And when you're so consumed with what everyone around you thinks of you, that can be a really hard way to live. So I think as I've gotten older, certainly in my forties, and as a mom, you want to, you want to set the example for what your children are going to think about themselves. And that, you can't have an imposter syndrome around.

• 33:36Emma Grede?

  No way.

• 33:36Speaker 01

  You have to be so authentically the role model and the example of confidence, self forgiveness, kindness, fun, all of those things. You can't fake that. You want to model that for them. So all of that really shifted in the past six years of becoming a mom for me.

• 33:53Emma Grede?

  Yeah, no, I, I really understand that, and I think that you're completely right. Are there? That you have to tune out self doubt like the things that you do in your day.

• 34:03Speaker 01

  Oh, I wish I could say that I meditated every day or I don't. No, I don't. And then when I say to someone like, I don't have time to meditate. They say, well, you should meditate twice as long. And that's really a cue that you need to do it twice. I would love to take my own advice and say, meditate. I I don't. I jump right into things. I will always phone a friend when I'm having moments. And I'm very fortunate to have a lot of female friends that are founders who have been through some version of.

• 34:28Emma Grede?

  Are you calling on them?

• 34:30Speaker 01

  Of course. I'm so lucky in that regard. Oh, my gosh. Guess what just happened? That's totally normal, Meg. Totally normal. Just power through it. So talking to someone who's been through it and is on the other side of it with tremendous success is valuable to get a mentor. But, um, no, I mean, I do. I try to hike. I try to connect with outdoors. I definitely make time for my children. I make time for date nights. I have to make time for balance, see perspective. You can be so in the weeds of building a business, but you have got to find a moment to look up and see that there's a lot more going on around you than just that. You have to. Otherwise, I think your judgment is skewed.

• 35:16Speaker 06

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• 36:01Speaker 06

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• 36:42Speaker 01

  Hi, everyone. This is Kara Swisher.

• 36:44Speaker 07

  And I'm Scott Galloway.

• 36:45Speaker 01

  And we want to tell you about Pivot, our twice-weekly podcast.

• 36:48Speaker 07

  That's right, Kara. What a thrill. It's a chance for us to break down all the big things happening in tech, business, and politics.

• 36:55Speaker 01

  Yes, and I keep you in check so people can make it through each episode, whether it's digging into constant changes in the world of AI and social media or trying to keep up with whatever the fuck Elon is doing. We're here to give you our take on all of that.

• 37:06Speaker 07

  Every Tuesday and Friday morning, we drop a new episode about some of the major stories of the moment.

• 37:12Speaker 01

  And Scott is a prediction machine, gazing into his crystal ball to tell you about where it's all heading.

• 37:17Speaker 07

  That's right.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  So if that sounds like a good time for you, especially Mr. "That's right", you can follow us on your favorite podcast app to get new episodes every week.

• 37:35Emma Grede?

  Do you think that there are skills that you got from your days as an actress that are transferable into this new entrepreneurial world that you're in?

• 37:42Speaker 01

  Of course. I mean, again, having a thick skin, partnerships and the value of, you know, having great relationships when you're building certainly lots of different SKUs is key. And so a piece of advice I was given years ago as an auditioning actress was don't try to book the part, book the room. Meaning it doesn't matter if you don't get that role. You might not be right for it. You might remind the director of an ex-girlfriend that broke his heart. Doesn't, it could be any number of reasons. It's not about the part. You're going to see those producers and those casting directors at so many other opportunities. Book the room. Let them see that you're talented. Let them see you have something to bring to the table. Treat them with kindness. All of those relationships end up coming to fruition. You don't know when, but just like with life, relationships matter.

• 38:27Speaker 01

  So I learned that in the very long road of auditioning for sure.

• 38:31Emma Grede?

  Do you ever miss acting?

• 38:33Speaker 01

  Sometimes, sometimes, but you know what? Actually, having a large team, being back on set with With Love, Meghan was great because I realized how much I had missed my crew. I love being around a crew.

• 38:45Emma Grede?

  It must be hard to let that go.

• 38:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was different. And also it was such a unique time because we couldn't say that I was leaving necessarily. It was speculated. So after seven years on the series, we couldn't have a going away party. I couldn't say my goodbyes.

• 39:01Emma Grede?

  Oh, that's so sad.

• 39:02Speaker 01

  I know. So my crew's watching it. I missed you guys. I wish I could have said bye.

• 39:07Emma Grede?

  Do you miss them? You must do.

• 39:08Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. We worked with people for seven years. For seven years, that's a really strong connection and I love, I loved the crew. So I think for me, having the series, even though it wasn't scripted, was really great to get that piece back. But then also building my own business, you have a team and that's really what I was craving as well.

• 39:26Emma Grede?

  Yeah, no, I can imagine that. I wanted to ask you a little bit about the public narrative because when you sign up to be an actress, you know that people are going to start recognizing you. They're going to start speaking to you on the street. But that's very different from what you have now.

• 39:43Speaker 01

  It is, Emma.

• 39:44Emma Grede?

  It's very different. No shit. I wonder, and listen, I want to say this to you in, in the best way because I wonder if you could rewrite your public narrative from scratch. Is there anything that you would do differently?

• 40:00Speaker 01

  Yes, I would ask people. Tell the truth.

• 40:03Emma Grede?

  You're very measured about it. I mean, I feel like, I don't know, I'm such a hothead. I

• 40:08Speaker 01

  Are you? What's your sign?

• 40:09Emma Grede?

  I'm a Libra. But I know, and it's like, I don't know. I just, I don't know. Maybe I'm just a bit, you know, ghetto with it, like a little bit hood. I just get, I would just get so angry if I felt like everyone was lying about me all the time. Like, don't you ever feel like just like, like just being like, just leave me alone. Like, let me show you. Is there a part of you that ever is just like, just leave me alone?

• 40:32Speaker 01

  Peaks and valleys.

• 40:33Emma Grede?

  Peaks and valleys.

• 40:34Speaker 01

  You know, no, I mean, like

• 40:35Emma Grede?

  Very elegant.

• 40:36Speaker 01

  But it's true. Of course. I've gone through those chapters and you do a lot of work. You do a lot of self-work and go, what's the why?

• 40:42Emma Grede?

  Hmm.

• 40:42Speaker 01

  It's happening for a reason. And my dear friend Serena, who I'm sure you know.

• 40:47Emma Grede?

  I love Serena. She's like my girl crush. Talk about successful entrepreneur, by the way.

• 40:52Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Yeah. She, um, she's doing so well.

• 40:57Emma Grede?

  She's killing. I mean, she's literally, it's, it's amazing that she can have like that type of career and then this type of business career. I don't even know that people fully have grasped like how successful she is.

• 41:06Speaker 01

  But also translating knowledge from the court and being dedicated and

• 41:12Emma Grede?

  All the things.

• 41:12Speaker 01

  To another avenue. It doesn't mean that you have to stay in one lane for your whole life. It means that you can translate those skills somewhere else. That, that's probably part of the magic. But she told me years ago, a lie can't live forever. Eight years is a long time, but, um, not forever.

• 41:28Emma Grede?

  So how do you walk the line between owning your own narrative and feeding the frenzy? Because again, when you have a business, you need to go out and promote it. You need to go and do, you know, whatever it is that you might need to do. Speak to the media, turn up at a Yeah. retailer convention, like whatever it might be. So how for you are you able to toe the line?

• 41:48Speaker 01

  I think it's a, it's a fine line, but it's also setting up boundaries, which I would say to anyone, no matter what you're going through, what your experience has been. You set boundaries of where you're comfortable and it's okay to say no. It's okay to say I'm not comfortable answering that. It's okay to pivot.

• 42:05Emma Grede?

  Oh, yeah.

• 42:06Speaker 01

  And to really get to the place where you don't feel as though you have to explain yourself. Um, and I think that's, that comes with time, maturity, work, support surrounding you.

• 42:18Speaker 01

  But also to be authentic, you know, I, I don't think there's any value either in being so rehearsed. And just having your talking points and just saying the thing, no, just talk.

• 42:26Emma Grede?

  It's just not the time for it. I think that there is an element of where we are in culture right now that like it or love it, we crave authenticity. We want those people that we believe rightly or wrongly are telling us the truth. And so I feel like there is no point in having rehearsed lines and a, you know, a narrative that is like, you know, fully, you know, written out that isn't your own. You have to be authentic.

• 42:51Speaker 01

  Just be authentic. Did you see my baby mama dance?

• 42:53Emma Grede?

  I mean, stop it. First of all, can I just tell you the timing of that? The timing of that, we were, we maybe watched it like 20 times yesterday and I was like, is that, is that her?

• 43:03Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 43:05Emma Grede?

  Prince Harry there with the fingers and the, I was like, okay.

• 43:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:10Emma Grede?

  Okay. Get in, Harry. Let's go.

• 43:12Speaker 01

  But I think it's.

• 43:13Emma Grede?

  But that's you, right? Like, that's you in a way that we kind of haven't been able to see you before. And I did like a little secret cheer because I was like, well, that's what I kind of want to see from you. Like, I want to see that happiness and that honesty and that like, I don't give a fuck.

• 43:30Speaker 01

  But also, by the way, that wasn't yesterday.

• 43:33Emma Grede?

  No.

• 43:33Speaker 01

  That was four years ago. So it's also a really great reminder that with all the noise or whatever people do, there's still whole life, a real, authentic, fun life that's happening behind the scenes. I'm just grateful that now, being back on social as well, I have a place where I can share it on my own terms.

• 43:48Emma Grede?

  On your own terms. And that's really, really important. You've really embraced social media. Do you enjoy it or does it feel like a bit of a drag?

• 43:56Speaker 01

  No, it doesn't feel like a drag. It feels liberating. I have to look again, what was my intention? I came back, started the account in January of this year.

• 44:04Emma Grede?

  Was it only January?

• 44:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:06Emma Grede?

  Oh.

• 44:07Speaker 01

  The last time I was on social, Boomerang was around.

• 44:09Emma Grede?

  Oh, Lord.

• 44:10Speaker 01

  It's been a minute. There was no stories. All of it's new. There were no gadgets where you could have a little tripod that I'm sitting. You should see me sitting there trying to figure with a magnet on it.

• 44:21Emma Grede?

  You brought the things?

• 44:22Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 44:22Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 44:22Speaker 01

  And figuring, I don't have key lights and all. I don't have all this business yet, but I'm just, I don't know if you need it. I think if part of it is just being able to authentically share in real time, the things that are happening that I think someone might be able to laugh with or enjoy or be inspired by, then I want to do that in a way that feels like I can still have my hands on it and not be overproduced.

• 44:44Emma Grede?

  But are you thinking about it in the way that so many of us do as also a business tool?

• 44:49Speaker 01

  Not for my personal account.

• 44:50Emma Grede?

  Really?

• 44:51Speaker 01

  For my personal account?

• 44:52Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 44:52Speaker 01

  No.

• 44:53Emma Grede?

  Well, that's the one we're all following.

• 44:55Speaker 01

  Well, good.

• 44:55Emma Grede?

  That's, that's the one that we're like-

• 44:56Speaker 01

  A lot of you are following as ever, too.

• 44:57Emma Grede?

  Just dropped.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  No, I think for me, it was a great way to

• 45:05Speaker 01

  get my voice back.

• 45:06Emma Grede?

  Yeah, you have to.

• 45:07Speaker 01

  Get my voice back.

• 45:08Emma Grede?

  A million percent.

• 45:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, and that's, that's really, it's my space and my channel for joy. That is the intention of, of my handle.

• 45:16Emma Grede?

  Well, I think that your voice carries such unbelievable influence. I remember a time where you were like, step out with a sweater. The sweater would sell out. It's crazy. Like, how do you, how do you feel about that? Was that part of the reason for you starting a brand? Like, have you been able to reconcile the fact that you have that type of influence? And I wonder how you think about, you know, that as it relates to your advocacy work, that as it relates to your business ventures? Because it's a, it's a, it's a lot. It's a lot to carry around.

• 45:46Speaker 01

  Well, I, you know, it's funny because that's been now for several years, that effect. And again, I think my feelings surrounded, surrounding it have ebbed and flowed because they say imitation is the best form of flattery. And at the same time, you start to watch how it's being monetized at such a huge level globally, oftentimes not giving credit to the brands and the designers who actually made those pieces.

• 46:13Emma Grede?

  Right.

• 46:14Speaker 01

  So it was that fine line between, well, do you want to spoon feed who the brands and the designers are, and then it feels promotional, when I have no skin in the game in any of those arrangements. And at the same time, do you want people to mislabel it? Because when I didn't feel as though I had as much of an opportunity to speak, what can you say with what you're wearing? You can say a lot.

• 46:33Emma Grede?

  Quite a lot.

• 46:34Speaker 01

  You can say a lot. And so, being able to support especially female-founded designers, small, local brands, any territories we would go to on certain tours, I always tried to tap into local designers to really see their business just do so well as a result, or how many people they could help, or how much they could give back, or...

• 46:53Emma Grede?

  And you're saying you were purposeful with that?

• 46:56Speaker 01

  Of course, of course. There's intention. And so, I think in moments where I found I wasn't as empowered with my voice, I still wanted to be able to be heard in other ways. I still wanted women to know that I was supporting them. I still wanted people to feel like, even if I didn't get an uplift from that, that they did. And in some ways, that actually did uplift me, because I went, oh my gosh, like, there was a company, they made jeans and they would help women...

• 47:24Emma Grede?

  Was it Good American?

• 47:25Speaker 01

  No. You weren't around then. You weren't around then. But they made jeans and they gave the positions and the roles to women who would have been trafficked. And they took them off the streets and they put them into this labor force to be able to have a well-paying job where they are well taken care of, to be able to help that company and get letters from those founders saying, "We were able to help save 25 women." Because if you're wearing these jeans, that is a huge privilege of influence. And I never took that lightly. So I think, you know, had I chosen to just maximize the opportunity of the financial element of having a business, doing fashion would have been very obvious, as we talked about. But I wanted to go with what my heart was really responding to in this moment.

• 48:09Emma Grede?

  Was there ever a time when the influence you have actually really surprised you?

• 48:13Speaker 01

  Um...

• 48:16Speaker 01

  At the beginning, of course.

• 48:17Emma Grede?

  What is happening?

• 48:19Speaker 01

  What is going on?

• 48:20Emma Grede?

  I just put a sweater around my shoulder.

• 48:22Speaker 01

  I mean, yeah, wild, but, but you have to think too, the seven years before that on Suits, that was a very fashion driven show and people loved Rachel Zane's wardrobe, which I was very, very involved with because I wanted it to look like a capsule that a real woman would wear, mix and match. And I was one of the only characters that re-wore pieces, but that was by design. So I knew that there was influence there, but yes, it, it certainly got bigger.

• 48:49Emma Grede?

  It really got bigger?

• 48:50Speaker 01

  Bigger, got a lot bigger.

• 48:52Emma Grede?

  Are you comfortable with that?

• 48:53Speaker 01

  I have to be, it's my life.

• 48:55Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 48:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:56Emma Grede?

  You get comfortable, basically.

• 48:57Speaker 01

  You get comfortable. You get to be in acceptance of what is.

• 49:00Emma Grede?

  Yeah, no, completely. But I also think it's really amazing that you can participate in that now because after a while, it can, you know, I think it's wonderful and it's great that everybody can gain from it. But I do think that there is a, a time and a place in your life where you need to, you need to have some skin in the game. You need to have a piece of that for yourself.

• 49:19Speaker 01

  Yes, and I think what was so wild, maybe the surprise came in when anything that my children were wearing started to get monetized and affiliate sales and part of headlines and things. That's where it became a little uncomfortable. But at the same time, you know, it, when it comes from a place of love and excitement, very, very different.

• 49:41Emma Grede?

  It's very different.

• 49:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, then you can be happy about it and say, of course, have the same dress that Lily has. It's when it comes from a different side, but that's true of most things in life.

• 49:49Emma Grede?

  So with Archwell, you've built this ecosystem of philanthropy, storytelling, you know, it's just, it feels like, you know, you've now got the commerce and the brand piece of that.

• 50:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:00Emma Grede?

  So, you know, it really is, it's like a, an empire that you're building, like a media and commerce empire. And I wonder if you've thought about it in the sense of having real guiding principles for what you will be involved in, what you allow yourself to get involved in. Was that a part of your, you know, was it part of what you were thinking about as you started bringing all of these things together?

• 50:23Speaker 01

  There was a lot of, again, flying the plane while you're still building it, but always at its origin, being so value-aligned with what my husband and I believe in.

• 50:36Speaker 01

  And that's where it started. It started when we moved out here and building the foundation. But, you know, as things expanded and certainly talking about what sort of content we want to put out, what sort of documentaries we want to make, what stories we want to tell, those expanded under the Artwell Universe with the production company. And, you know, building out in my own office, my brand and my business has felt really exciting and different. They all still are value-aligned when my husband and I, when we think about investments that we make or certainly my own personal portfolio. Is it value-aligned? Is it mission-driven? Is it purpose-driven? And that can run the gamut. You know, some of the investments that I started to make in women and female-founded companies started with things as simple as what is the meaningful impact

• 51:18Speaker 01

  that a beautiful latte that you can make at home will have? It sounds so silly, but when it's adaptogens and it's good for you, like with Clever, I was really proud to be her first investor. And it was my very first investment also, so I learned quite a bit there. On the flip side of that, you look at a company like Midi, which is women talking about perimenopause and menopause, and that is a chapter of their life that's making a very meaningful impact for a lot of women. I look at who's on the cap table. Melinda Gates is one that's there. And I look at whose company I'm going to be in as I support these brands, as I'm sure you do too.

• 51:50Emma Grede?

  Well, I wanted to ask you about that because I feel like investing is so different from everything else. And I wonder, you know, it's very clear to me that you've got a lot of principles around who you're backing. But is there anything else that you're like, are you out there specifically looking? Are things coming to you? How do you think about that side of your business?

• 52:07Speaker 01

  Both. I'm looking at what comes through organically, not just through the people that can help put the portfolio together, but friends that are in VC, female founders that you're sort of tracking and saying, what are they up to next? Really interested in fintech. I also, you know, I, I think financial literacy for young women especially is just so important. So from my standpoint, not leaning away from things like that, that might not be as trendy or topical to talk about, but they are vital. So I look at things where that's going to move the needle for young women and their education and what they can have access to and feel a lot of growth from in a substantive way. And at the same time, where can you find some fun and playfulness? Where can

• 52:50Speaker 01

  you take some bets and say, it's not just about the brand. When I think about investments, it's about the founder as well. I really need to believe in the people that are, that are driving that.

• 53:00Emma Grede?

  So important.

• 53:01Speaker 01

  It's so important, you know, and I watched your episode of Shark Tank and it's really like that critical thinking that has to come in when you are talking about real capital that you're going to put up for someone else's dream. You have to entrust that they are going to bring that dream to reality responsibly.

• 53:16Emma Grede?

  Yes. Well, this is also your money.

• 53:18Speaker 01

  It's not monopoly money.

• 53:19Emma Grede?

  Right.

• 53:19Speaker 01

  It is not, this is not monopoly money. This is real.

• 53:22Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  And it really, I think, changes how you explore. You can have an incredible concept in front of you, but if you don't really firmly trust and have incredible competence in the people that are running it and have brought that vision to life, it's not going to work. So there have been a lot of opportunities that I've had to say no to based on that. And at the same time, you know that there's so much creativity out there that I want to find the person and the people that are working quietly behind the scenes and then help maximize that for them.

• 53:55Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 53:55Speaker 01

  And put a huge spotlight on that for them to see them go and change their family's life.

• 54:01Emma Grede?

  And it really is about changing their family's life. I mean, when I think about investing, that's why I was asking you about your principles, you know, I'm often, I have like a pretty impressive deal flow at this point in my career.

• 54:12Speaker 01

  I bet you do.

• 54:13Emma Grede?

  But I'm really trying to look for those people. And I think this came from all those, you know, a couple of seasons that I did on Shark Tank, but I'm always looking for people that I don't think would get the funding elsewhere because I've been in those rooms. I, you know, it wasn't so long ago when I was trying to raise money for businesses. Myself and really getting the feeling that I'm walking out of here with nothing. Like these people don't understand what I'm doing. They don't understand me. I don't sound like they want me to sound like it's just. I don't have the educational background. But you know, at some point, when you don't have anything behind you, it's it's very, very difficult. And so for me, it's always about finding these founders that I think they are not going to be able to walk into a room and walk out with the cheque.

• 54:53Emma Grede?

  And so when you think about investment principles, are there are there reasons? Because again, there's such a thread running through everything that you're doing right now. And is this following that same type of trajectory of everything else that you've got going on?

• 55:07Speaker 01

  I think everything that I am working on is an extension of me. It's an extension of my personal taste. It's an extension of my values. It's an extension of how I like to show up in the room, right? And and and ultimately, I really value thoughtfulness. I really value attention to detail. And, you know, I've said playfulness a lot, but I think that seriousness in business and playfulness do not need to be mutually exclusive. I value that as well. You see that in the series. You see that in the podcast and certainly in the brand. Not everything can be so earnest. You can have something that is best in class, incredible quality, thoughtful in its design, but with a little cheek.

• 55:45Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 55:46Speaker 01

  And a little wink and have fun.

• 55:47Emma Grede?

  Would you ever do something just for the money if you thought this is gonna kill? This is gonna be an amazing business?

• 55:53Speaker 01

  I have turned down a lot of opportunities that do not feel value aligned. No, there's it's it's very easy to say no. No matter the price, if you aren't gonna be able to sleep well at night.

• 56:06Emma Grede?

  Totally.

• 56:07Speaker 01

  Don't sacrifice that. No way.

• 56:09Emma Grede?

  But hopefully you can find, you know, some investments that let you sleep well at night and make loads of money.

• 56:13Speaker 01

  Is that a page in your playbook?

• 56:15Emma Grede?

  A hundred percent. Okay, so we're gonna talk about that. I've got those and I've got those.

• 56:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, at the moment. It's all in this one lane.

• 56:22Emma Grede?

  I love that. No, but that's really, it's, it's interesting because I think we all come at these things for, you know, a very different background. And when I think about putting my money to work, to me, it literally feels like that. It's like, I want that money to work. And there's a piece of what I do that is very firmly sits over here. And it's for those people I don't think would get funding. And there's another piece of it that is just purely opportunistic. And I say that without apologizing because like, I made this money and I need this money to work for me. It's like, I've got things to do.

• 56:49Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, and it's also very refreshing to hear a woman in business say that. Because I think often what happens is we are trained as young girls to not talk about money. We are trained as young girls that it's very gauche to talk about finances. But that's a part of life.

• 57:03Emma Grede?

  Well, that's what keeps us out of making all the money.

• 57:05Speaker 01

  Fair.

• 57:06Emma Grede?

  This is it, right? Because the minute you don't speak about something, you know, it's just like for years when women didn't talk about, uh, you know, their own sexual pleasure. Well, guess what? Like they missed out on a lot of fun times. And it's exactly the same with money. But it is, you know, I don't think of those things as any, any more different. It's like, if you elegantly avoid the subject of money, you will find that the money somehow elegantly avoids you. And so I talk about it all the time. I'm like, do you know what I mean? Or like, just blatantly. So we have to be able to speak about money. We have to be able to, you know, articulate what we need and what our value is, because those two things are inextricably linked. And if we're not talking about it, we ain't gonna get it.

• 57:48Speaker 01

  Yes. And you have no shame in talking about it.

• 57:51Emma Grede?

  There's nothing shameful about it.

• 57:53Speaker 01

  As you're talking about it. Do you know Melody Hobson?

• 57:54Emma Grede?

  Oh.

• 57:55Speaker 01

  The dream.

• 57:56Emma Grede?

  First of all, I love Melody so much. She was my second guest on the podcast.

• 58:00Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh, I didn't realize that. Oh, I love Melody.

• 58:03Emma Grede?

  I love her so much. And I mean, her episode was amazing because, you know, Melody's, you know, she's all about the finance. Like, that's her career. That's what she is so knowledgeable about. And she speaks about it in such an elegant way, but that's her whole life. She's not shying away from having those conversations.

• 58:19Speaker 01

  Of course not. She and I did an episode of Deal Book together years ago. And I must have, yeah, years ago, because I just had Lily. Um, and I think it's just so empowering to hear a woman, and especially a woman of color. Stand in the truth and the knowing that she does not need to shy away from a conversation that a man would comfortably have. And ultimately, especially as moms and as working moms, you want that to be part of the modeling that you do for your daughter and your son. But for your daughter, I think it's pivotal for them to understand that they cannot be afraid of those conversations. You're only selling yourself short.

• 58:56Emma Grede?

  You're only selling yourself short. Do you have, I mean, your kids are really little, mine are a bit older. Do you have conversations with your kids about money? Like, how are you even beginning to think about that type of thing?

• 59:06Speaker 01

  Well, we sometimes do a little farmer's market stand.

• 59:09Emma Grede?

  Nice.

• 59:10Speaker 01

  So we have.

• 59:11Emma Grede?

  That's so American. I love that. Like, a little lemonade stand just makes me feel like that. It's like perfect Americana in Montecito with a farm stand.

• 59:19Speaker 01

  But we do.

• 59:20Emma Grede?

  How beautiful.

• 59:21Speaker 01

  We grow a lot of veggies and they, part of what I want them.

• 59:24Emma Grede?

  Go and sell these.

• 59:25Speaker 01

  Part of what I want them to learn is, and gardening is really, really so great for children because it teaches them patience, teaches them to value and appreciate their food. So you start from seed and you watch it grow and they wait. But with that, it's like, now do you want to sell your harvest? And do you want to share it with our community? And also, what do you want to do with those funds once you have them? So really starting to understand as they're learning counting and numbers and all of those things that there's a cost and a price for things.

• 59:51Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 59:52Speaker 01

  And I think that's key for children to understand that, especially children who are very lucky to have a home that has privilege. You need to know that, you know, just like manners, you need, and taking care of the things around you, there is a value on things. And in our life, for my husband and I, it's really important that they understand the value of things.

• 1:00:09Emma Grede?

  Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I mean, Melody wrote the book on it, actually, for all of the kids. So it's a great one. It's just such a, it's such a beautiful book.

• 1:00:16Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:00:17Emma Grede?

  And switching gear, I want to talk about your podcast, Confessions of a Female Founder.

• 1:00:21Speaker 01

  It's fun.

• 1:00:22Emma Grede?

  It's so fun. I mean, it is really, really fun. But the whole idea of that podcast is that you are spotlighting female entrepreneurs, right?

• 1:00:29Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:00:30Emma Grede?

  And I just want to ask you, I mean, why that show, why right now?

• 1:00:33Speaker 01

  It was perfect synergy. Think about the timing of that.

• 1:00:37Emma Grede?

  No, I was like, she's going to school. This is what's happening.

• 1:00:40Speaker 01

  Think about the timing of that. I literally, I was so fortunate to find Lemonade. I loved that it was a female founded company that was doing podcasts and the women running it incredible. They actually just had an acquisition.

• 1:00:53Emma Grede?

  Amazing.

• 1:00:54Speaker 01

  Proud of them.

• 1:00:54Emma Grede?

  Good for them.

• 1:00:56Speaker 01

  Stephanie and Jess, good job ladies. And, you know, knowing that it was in a safe place where we could have these conversations when it came to what do we want to talk about? What do I want this podcast to be? As I knew I was in this building phase of my business, what an amazing opportunity to pull back the curtain and let people see what's happening at the start.

• 1:01:17Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:18Speaker 01

  At the start, when all the twists and turns are there. And, you know, for me to have the opportunity to talk to so many female founders who've been on that full trajectory, that are on the other side of success, still at certain chapters in their career and their growth, but to be able to be really candid and vulnerable personally about my learns and stumbles along the way, and to then take everyone's advice and mine included and to say, I love that there's so much excitement and desire for another season, but I need to focus on my business.

• 1:01:49Emma Grede?

  So you've done, how many episodes did you do?

• 1:01:51Speaker 01

  We did eight and a bonus episode. So Tina Knowles came on to do the last one.

• 1:01:54Emma Grede?

  Oh, Tina, that's a good one. That's such a good one. Okay, so wait a minute, but this was a decision to say, okay, I'm going to stop this now because you were having like huge success. I mean, I was hearing about that podcast everywhere and you've decided I'm going to stop and focus on the business.

• 1:02:08Speaker 01

  Have to.

• 1:02:09Emma Grede?

  Nice.

• 1:02:09Speaker 01

  Have to, because at a certain point, I was thinking about this this morning.

• 1:02:12Emma Grede?

  You're like, this is too much.

• 1:02:14Speaker 01

  Well, people.

• 1:02:15Emma Grede?

  That's what I was thinking this morning.

• 1:02:16Speaker 01

  People seem, yes, well, people seem to forget that very rarely do people see everything that's happening behind the scenes. I could show a small glimpse of that, but equally, yes, I wrapped season one of my Netflix series. Still had to promote it. Still had to be in the edits for season two. We were in pre-production of one season while we were doing post-production of the other. It's constant. I just wrapped edits on season two of With Love, Meghan, last week. So it's still ongoing while also doing a podcast, while also building my business. And at a certain point, the only thing I want spread thin is my jam. Okay. And I think I just, I realized, wow, I'm, I'm using this opportunity to share and I love that, but I also need to use this opportunity to listen.

• 1:03:01Speaker 01

  I have very valuable insight coming from women who have been through this before. And if I'm not going to take the cue that we are teaching people, what's the point? So does it mean it won't come back? No, but I would love to bring the show back when I am at a different end of my founder journey, when I've gone through Q4.

• 1:03:23Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:03:23Speaker 01

  And say, here are my proof points. Here's this, wow, what a year it's been. Or even longer than that. I think a different time will be so exciting just to be able to compare and contrast. But yeah, I know people, I know he will want another one. I just made a choice to say it's a really good time to make a, to put all of my energy into the thing that I'm building.

• 1:03:43Emma Grede?

  But I think that that focus is an absolute necessity.

• 1:03:47Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:03:48Emma Grede?

  When you want to be successful, right? Like just doubling down and being excellent at what you're trying to do is just one of the most simple and powerful things that you can do in business. Like just giving everything to one thing. And it's so difficult when you have so much opportunity, right? When seemingly everything's coming at you and you, you know, it's like you're the, the hot girl that's out there and you have a lot of opportunity. It's hard to say, no, I'm going to put this thing first. Were there things from the podcast that you have taken like straight into your business?

• 1:04:22Speaker 01

  Um, yes, again, this idea, and we talked about that earlier, that someone else's urgency is not my urgency. Most of the women that I spoke to are working moms and this is such a-

• 1:04:31Emma Grede?

  That's a big deal.

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  Yes, and this is such a key age. I don't want to miss a moment for my children. And I love that I can do drop off and pick up at school and do meetings in between and go to Disneyland for two days as we just did and- You know, volunteer to serve hot lunch at school or be the chaperone for the kindergarten field trip.

• 1:04:52Emma Grede?

  You're so good. You're making me look so bad.

• 1:04:53Speaker 01

  No, stop that.

• 1:04:54Emma Grede?

  I never volunteer.

• 1:04:55Speaker 01

  Well, you can start.

• 1:04:56Emma Grede?

  No, I cannot.

• 1:04:59Emma Grede?

  I don't want to. Well, then that's when you're listening. But you know, this is, and I think that this is a really important point because people often say to me, you know, Emma, like, is it, is it bad that I go and drop my kids every day? Is it bad that I want to volunteer? I'm like, no, you have to do what you want to do.

• 1:05:14Speaker 01

  What feels right for you.

• 1:05:15Emma Grede?

  You have to do the thing that makes your heart sing in the morning. For me, it's like, I don't want to volunteer, so I don't. But there's lots of other things that for me are just non-negotiables, right? It's like, I like to put my kids' outfits together. I'm crazy about their packed lunches. Now, I don't pack them, but it's like, I know what's in every lunch every day because that's just the type of person I am.

• 1:05:35Speaker 01

  I love packing the lunchbox.

• 1:05:36Emma Grede?

  You do?

• 1:05:37Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:05:37Emma Grede?

  Oh, stop it, Megan. No, you don't. Do you do?

• 1:05:40Speaker 01

  Because I do.

• 1:05:41Emma Grede?

  Do you like make shapes and like make it look all beautiful? Is it, is it a sprinkle situation are we putting?

• 1:05:45Speaker 01

  Sometimes.

• 1:05:46Emma Grede?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:05:47Speaker 01

  I love.

• 1:05:47Emma Grede?

  My kids are all going to move into your house.

• 1:05:49Speaker 01

  No, stop. But look, to your point, like, that sounds ridiculous, but I love it. At the end of a long day, the kids are down to bed at like seven, seven-ish, and go downstairs, have a glass of wine, I'm doing their little lunchbox. I find joy in it, for whatever reason.

• 1:06:01Emma Grede?

  And it can be therapeutic.

• 1:06:02Speaker 01

  Yes. So that for me is one of my simple pleasures. So I'm like, oh, my gosh, that works for me. What works for you, works for you. But I, you know, I think with all of the projects I had going at the same time and how much my, the valuation that I put on time with my family.

• 1:06:17Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 1:06:17Speaker 01

  Is so high.

• 1:06:18Emma Grede?

  It's critical.

• 1:06:19Speaker 01

  It matters so much to both my husband and I that, um, yeah, I just wouldn't, I just wouldn't trade that for anything. And so I think it's really important to have that conversation with yourself, especially if you're ambitious, to say, all of these things are exciting to me and I can do all of them well enough. But can you do all of them exceptionally well?

• 1:06:41Emma Grede?

  No.

• 1:06:41Speaker 01

  Probably not. Something is going to not get the same love and attention that it needs. And so to be able to say, what's my focus right now? My family always and growing as ever. And to be able to be so committed to those two things fills my cup in a very different way. Um, because there's time for the rest of it.

• 1:07:02Emma Grede?

  Yeah, there's gonna be time. There's nothing in you, though, that's like, oh, it's like this little thing over here that I could possibly do. Because I struggle with that. I love, I mean, I love starting new projects. And a new project for me, it's like very, very, very hard to turn down.

• 1:07:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:17Emma Grede?

  So, and again, I say the same thing to you. It's like when you have so much opportunity, it must be difficult to just go like, that's not a priority.

• 1:07:24Speaker 01

  I mean, I love the creation stage.

• 1:07:29Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:07:29Speaker 01

  So, yes, now that I can see with more dedicated focus on the brand, knowing our trajectory, looking at the business plan, being able to pinpoint where these key moments are gonna be. I can also very comfortably say, as this continues to grow to where I want it to scale, what's my next thing? Because that dreaming phase and daydreaming.

• 1:07:54Emma Grede?

  Key.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  It's, it's really, it's really key, I think, to keep your creative juices flowing. And that doesn't go anywhere. And I think a lot of that is, is what I'm excited about for the next phase.

• 1:08:06Emma Grede?

  What's the common thread as you were going through Confessions of a Female Founder? What do you think the common thread was with the entrepreneurs that you interviewed? In terms of like successful founders, the way they think about strategy? Did you, did you find anything that you were like, they all had this?

• 1:08:22Speaker 01

  They all, no matter their background, they all were incredibly focused. Um, they all have regrets. They all have regrets. Most of them regretting not spending more time with their family.

• 1:08:40Speaker 01

  Um, or.

• 1:08:44Speaker 01

  Taking things personally, a lot of them talk about that.

• 1:08:48Emma Grede?

  Do you do that?

• 1:08:50Speaker 01

  Taking things personally, yeah, of course, I'm human.

• 1:08:55Speaker 01

  And that can be really hard. So you can do all the practices and things that you want to do. But at the end of the day, you're still human, you're still going to cry, you're still going to take something to heart, especially if you poured so much of yourself into it.

• 1:09:07Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  You know, when I want the jam spread thin, I don't mean, I mean, spread thin on toast.

• 1:09:11Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 1:09:11Speaker 01

  Right? I mean, I want everything that I'm thinking about that I have poured my heart and soul into. It's not just jam. Could I just go and make a preserve somewhere and stick my name on it? Of course. Not what I want to do. So I loved that it was winning all these blind taste tests and I love that people loved it. Oh, I was making that in my kitchen. That's how you'd feel if you were at my house. Thank you. It works. And so if there's some hiccup along the way,

• 1:09:43Speaker 01

  that doesn't land in the same way, even like in a small internal team on how it's tracking, I go, well, okay. All right. I was really excited about it, but let's think about how we can make this something that really works at scale. Because I don't want this to be a niche product line. But yes, taking things personally is a human reaction.

• 1:10:03Emma Grede?

  You know, it's so interesting because the more I am doing this podcast, and it's interesting because it seems to be just the men. They talk about how much fun they have, like in the deal, in the failure, in that, but like, like they're just like, that's fun to me. Like, not like in the, I'm having fun doing my business day to day. Like the hard stuff and how fun that is.

• 1:10:27Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:10:27Emma Grede?

  And I think that it, to me, it has, it's just so interesting because as women, we tend to take things so much more personally. And that means when things don't go well, or when you have those inevitable failures, or when, you know, like whatever, like it does, you have a bad drop, you have a bad product, you have something that kind of, you know, shit hits the fan, whatever it is, that becomes about us. And I feel Feel like I've trained myself to say like, that's not me, that's that thing, right? It's like, that thing didn't work. It's not like I didn't work. That's good advice. I couldn't make it happen. And it just struck me somewhat, like the, the couple of men that have been on this podcast.

• 1:11:07Emma Grede?

  And I've made a point to make sure that I have a lot of men here, because I think we have so much to learn from all of these very, very successful men. And that mindset to me really struck me because I was like, Wow. You're having fun and you are definitely not taking these failures as you are. We're stuck.

• 1:11:23Speaker 01

  You're like, I'm crying in the corner and you're.

• 1:11:25Emma Grede?

  Right? Having a toast and. You're just like moving out of a drink. Toast and jam, like, like they're just getting on with it. And I thought that there's a real distinction in that somehow. Yeah. You know, it's not about them. They can easily just say like, this was something that happened.

• 1:11:38Speaker 01

  I think inherently, probably just listening to what you're saying as women, and maybe that's part of that conditioning from when we're young, we're more people pleasing.

• 1:11:45Emma Grede?

  Hmm.

• 1:11:45Speaker 01

  As well. So in leadership, you want everyone to like you.

• 1:11:48Emma Grede?

  Yeah, you can't be a people pleaser and a leader.

• 1:11:49Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, and you know. No, and I think ultimately, one of the biggest lessons that you can learn, no matter if it's in high school, because it will still feel big, or in a high profile position, or just as a business leader. There's not a single person in the world that everyone's going to like.

• 1:12:06Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:06Speaker 01

  So the goal cannot be that everyone likes you. The goal can be that everyone respects you.

• 1:12:09Emma Grede?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:12:10Speaker 01

  And as a woman, to make peace with that, I think can be a life's work, frankly. But the moment that that can click and that you aren't, as I've said before, in the prove it game, where you're not trying to prove something to everybody anymore, that you're very clear on who you are, you know, your intention is pure and good, that you can release a lot of that attachment and, and ultimately be much more successful. Because many men would not be tethered to this idea of needing everyone to like them.

• 1:12:38Emma Grede?

  Yeah. No, it's a, it's a really, really important point. You speak a lot about financial literacy. And I know that you're interested in that space from an investment point of view.

• 1:12:46Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:12:46Emma Grede?

  What's your own relationship to money like? Because that is one of the things that really evolves the older that you get. And so I wonder what that feels like now as you enter this new journey as a founder.

• 1:12:57Speaker 01

  I think my, my background really informs this. I grew up clipping coupons. I um was always money conscious.

• 1:13:08Speaker 01

  Always looking for a sale, right? In high school, college, always finding the promo code. I still go on Retail Me Not before I buy something online to see if there's a promo code, even if it's free shipping. I'm just ingrained and wired in that way. And then as an auditioning actor, you never know when your next paycheck is coming. So you're very, very mindful of spending. And so I've been very financially responsible for a long time. And I've applied that in a lot of ways where, yes, even if there is incredible capital to be able to work with to build the brand, I still want to make fiscally wise decisions that are in the best interest of the brand. I am not frivolous in spending. It's just...

• 1:13:50Emma Grede?

  It's not in you.

• 1:13:51Speaker 01

  It's not in me. No, it's not in me. And so I think that is part of the learning when you have a large partner as well, that there's more comfort in numbers going out the door. Whereas I would go, well, hold on a minute.

• 1:14:08Emma Grede?

  Wait a minute.

• 1:14:08Speaker 01

  Hold on a minute. I have a friend that can do that. What's the quote on that?

• 1:14:13Emma Grede?

  I think that's a great way for you to approach it, though. I mean, that feels so responsible and exactly as you should be running a startup. Because, again, I think there was a time that we were all feeling very, very different in businesses, like just chasing growth and, you know, trying to get as big as possible. But it feels to me like what you're trying to build isn't necessarily about that. You have a distinct product and a distinct offering that you're putting out into the world. And so you have to tinker with that. You have to get it just right and you have to do things that you're really proud of.

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  Yes, incredibly proud of. And also, when you're not trying to be trend-driven, there's a rush to jump on a trend. There is no rush if you're working towards something that could ultimately and hopefully become a heritage brand.

• 1:14:56Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 1:14:56Speaker 01

  When you're looking for what is, like my personal aesthetic, I find it to be classic, timeless. There is a reason that I'm sure there was puff sleeves were cool and trendy for a moment. I didn't catch that trend. I wasn't doing that, you know?

• 1:15:10Emma Grede?

  In your white button down.

• 1:15:11Speaker 01

  I'm still in my crisp white button down and jeans. And so, you know, when I look at the brand through that same lens, I think it's really important to say then there isn't, there isn't the same sense of urgency and rush because you're not trying to meet a moment. You're trying to meet something that can be evergreen.

• 1:15:25Emma Grede?

  Yeah, you're doing something that's with, that's classic and has tradition. And it's, and like you said, it's like, it's an evergreen proposition that's just going to keep growing and growing.

• 1:15:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:15:35Emma Grede?

  Sounds like it will be a wonderful business.

• 1:15:37Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:15:37Emma Grede?

  A business for the long term.

• 1:15:38Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:15:38Emma Grede?

  What are you most proud of in your career? When you think about everything that you've done to date?

• 1:15:43Speaker 01

  In my career?

• 1:15:44Emma Grede?

  Yeah. Or in your, or in your, like in your career and your business life, if you like.

• 1:15:49Speaker 01

  Investing in myself. I'd spent so many years since we came over here, really, even prior to that, investing in the success of other women and their companies. And I love being able to do that, as we talked about with fashion. And I loved being able to have a portfolio, female founders. But I do think it takes a little bit of courage to bet on yourself. And that's felt really good.

• 1:16:15Emma Grede?

  Yeah, it really does. It really, really does. What's the most surprising thing that you've learned about yourself as you've been, like, you know, in this brand building moment of your life?

• 1:16:27Speaker 01

  Um, that I can bounce back pretty easily. Because you can have the best laid plans for your brand. And if you are too attached to it, when you do have to pivot, that can be crushing. And to learn that, as I was saying earlier, to dance. Okay, well, let's take a minute, get our footing and dance over here.

• 1:16:50Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:50Speaker 01

  Let's twirl over there. So I think, similar to what you're saying about men in business, being able to find the playfulness and joy in it, even though the stakes are high.

• 1:16:59Emma Grede?

  Yes.

• 1:17:00Speaker 01

  Just really try to have fun in all of it.

• 1:17:02Emma Grede?

  It's a great muscle to try and train yourself, like to get there.

• 1:17:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, to be playful in it.

• 1:17:07Emma Grede?

  Yeah. Who are your idols?

• 1:17:10Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:17:12Emma Grede?

  I'm obsessed with Oprah. So if you could tell her for me, please?

• 1:17:14Speaker 01

  I'll tell her.

• 1:17:15Emma Grede?

  Yeah, thank you.

• 1:17:16Speaker 01

  Do you know her? Have you met her?

• 1:17:17Emma Grede?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:17:18Speaker 01

  Have you met her?

• 1:17:19Emma Grede?

  Okay, I met her once.

• 1:17:20Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:17:21Emma Grede?

  Like, very recently.

• 1:17:22Speaker 01

  How'd it go?

• 1:17:24Emma Grede?

  I'm so annoyed with myself. I don't even know why I'm telling this story. So I know Gail really well. She's great. And I'm at like, you know, like, DVF has an Oscar luncheon. I'm feeling good. You know, it's like I've had a hard week, but I was feeling good. I look good. And I see Gail and next to Gail is Oprah. And I'm like, Gail, Oprah. And I like, she doesn't like lip read me. So I run up to Gail. And I'm like, you have to introduce me to Oprah. And by this point, like, she's gone far. She's gone like, up the hill. And so Gail like screams, like, Oprah. And I'm like, oh, my God. And so everybody, the whole party like turns to look at me. Oprah's walking towards me. And you know, in my head, I've been preparing for this conversation my whole life. I have sunglasses on. I don't take the sunglasses

• 1:18:05Emma Grede?

  off. I sweat profusely. She's holding my hand. And I don't even remember what I said. And I was like, oh, no, like, that wasn't my Oprah moment. Like, that wasn't it. So you'll have another moment. No, there'll be, listen, I'm a hundred percent sure. I'm channeling her into me. Like, I know I'll have another moment.

• 1:18:23Speaker 01

  You come up to Montecito for lunch, we can plan a lunch.

• 1:18:25Emma Grede?

  Oh, my God. I've just scored myself a date. We can finish the podcast now. Bye. But is there anyone that gives you the Oprah sweats, like I got? Or maybe not the sweats, just someone that you admire, or you just find so intriguing, or whatever it might be?

• 1:18:39Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh, there, I mean, there are so many people in in business, male and female. We talked about Melody Hobson. I admire her so much. Her business acumen. I think there's probably too many to to count. And a lot of it also comes down to there are going to be people that are so well known. And then their close friends that value their privacy in a different way that I want to say their names so badly right now. But I, one of my idols is my very best friend. She's a godmother to our children. I love how she carries herself in business. I think she is just a remarkable human being. So it's important to say that the idols that exist on a very large scale, there's value there without question. But you can sometimes look at the people that are right in front of you and see them as idols as well.

• 1:19:21Emma Grede?

  Yeah, listen, life gets really good when you are like that with your idols, when they're in your life. And that's something that you can say with honesty. I think that's pretty, pretty impressive, actually. I really do. And looking ahead, what audacious goal do you have that you are like, looking forward to and is like, on your mind right now?

• 1:19:40Speaker 01

  Oh, goodness.

• 1:19:44Speaker 01

  The scale of this business, I don't know if that's an audacious goal. That's a, is it audacious?

• 1:19:48Emma Grede?

  Yeah, I think so.

• 1:19:49Speaker 01

  I'll take that. Okay.

• 1:19:50Emma Grede?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:51Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:19:51Emma Grede?

  I'll take that.

• 1:19:51Speaker 01

  And then the what comes after that?

• 1:19:53Emma Grede?

  Hmm. I'm, what does come after that? What do you, do you have a, like, do you know what you want to be doing in the next 10 years?

• 1:20:00Speaker 01

  Not exactly, but probably in the wheelhouse of what it could be. I want to continue to work with really strong, creative people. I want to tap into the audience and the demographic that's with me in that present moment. And so this is one chapter. Life has many chapters and you have to think and, you know, the next 10 years, we're both going to be in our 50s. Get excited. It's gonna be great.

• 1:20:24Emma Grede?

  Are you excited?

• 1:20:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. Would you ever do your twenties again?

• 1:20:30Speaker 01

  Hard no.

• 1:20:31Emma Grede?

  I, I can't even get the words out.

• 1:20:32Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:20:33Emma Grede?

  My twenties are choking me. Absolutely not. Never.

• 1:20:38Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:20:38Emma Grede?

  No.

• 1:20:38Speaker 01

  So, girls, enjoy your twenties right now.

• 1:20:41Emma Grede?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:20:41Speaker 01

  If it's hard, don't worry, it will pass.

• 1:20:42Emma Grede?

  You do that. It will pass.

• 1:20:43Speaker 01

  I think the 50, I think 50s are gonna be great. That will be a different audience I'm speaking to, or they will have grown with me. So I, yeah, I'm sort of noodling on what I want to do then, and that planning starts now.

• 1:20:54Emma Grede?

  That planning really starts now.

• 1:20:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:56Emma Grede?

  Finally, what advice would you give your younger self about ambition, about purpose, about public life? What would you say?

• 1:21:05Speaker 01

  That is, that is such a full question.

• 1:21:06Emma Grede?

  Go on, that's, give me a, give me a full answer.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  Oh, my goodness. Well, I would say that life is full of surprises. And also that, you know, life is short. And I, I really believe that no matter what anyone is going through, that if you are able to say that, yes, this is gonna pass, or this is amazing, and let's really embrace it, that you're ultimately gonna have that perspective we talked about earlier. You know that Khalil Gibran book, A Tear and a Smile?

• 1:21:36Emma Grede?

  Oh, it's such a good one.

• 1:21:37Speaker 01

  You need both.

• 1:21:38Emma Grede?

  It's such a good one.

• 1:21:39Speaker 01

  You need both in this life. And I think the moment that you can recognize that both are going to be true in your life, you cannot just be in acceptance of it, you can actually be in gratitude for it. And to see what others might say is, I don't know, Jordan has a great quote, and I'm gonna butcher it, but he literally says, like, there are no failures, because every time I failed, I was learning something. So you're actually winning, because that knowledge is what you carry with you. So I think.

• 1:22:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, my younger self, gosh, she was my 15-year-old self. She was class president. She was multicultural club president. She was so busy. And yeah, I think my 15-year-old self would be really proud of me today.

• 1:22:24Speaker 01

  I do, and that makes me happy.

• 1:22:27Emma Grede?

  You should be.

• 1:22:28Speaker 01

  Thanks.

• 1:22:28Emma Grede?

  I have no doubt.

• 1:22:29Speaker 01

  Thanks, Emma.

• 1:22:30Emma Grede?

  Okay, I want to ask you a couple of rapid-fire questions. What are you currently aspiring for in your business life?

• 1:22:38Speaker 01

  Success, not just financial success, emotional success.

• 1:22:42Emma Grede?

  Great answer. And what are you currently aspiring for in your personal life?

• 1:22:47Speaker 01

  Success, emotional success. Yeah, happiness.

• 1:22:52Emma Grede?

  What is a book that changed your life?

• 1:22:54Speaker 01

  Ooh, Atomic Habits.

• 1:22:56Emma Grede?

  It's a good one.

• 1:22:57Speaker 01

  It is a great book.

• 1:22:58Emma Grede?

  It's a great book.

• 1:22:59Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, Atomic Habits, The Four Agreements.

• 1:23:03Emma Grede?

  Oh, another really good one.

• 1:23:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:05Emma Grede?

  Both on my list. I was just going, total different ends of the spectrum, but equally valuable. Yeah, really, really teachable. Um, what's something that you valued when you were starting out that you no longer value?

• 1:23:18Speaker 01

  Hmm, it's not that I, it's not that I no longer value it, but decision by committee. Meaning when you're like, do you think it's good? Do you think it's good? Do you think it's good? Do you think it's good? Do you like that? Do you think it's good? Well, if you start asking everybody all the time, you will be dizzy with the ideas of it. So instead, ask your two trusted people or three, whatever your handful of your, you know,

• 1:23:38Emma Grede?

  Your little committee.

• 1:23:39Speaker 01

  Your consigliere is, and then trust yourself.

• 1:23:43Emma Grede?

  What's something that you value now that you didn't back in the day?

• 1:23:48Speaker 01

  Giving myself permission to take the space and the time that I need.

• 1:23:54Speaker 01

  Space for grace. Giving yourself a minute until you feel clear and you feel confident is key. And at the beginning, I probably did feel a little bit more like, okay, well, at this expectation, at the moment that you can just like rejig that, I appreciate that I'm there now.

• 1:24:10Emma Grede?

  I love that one. Beautiful. Thank you so much.

• 1:24:12Speaker 01

  Thank you so much.

• 1:24:15Emma Grede?

  If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click Follow on your favourite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend. We'll be so grateful. Aspire with Emma Grede is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Grede. Our executive producers are Corinne Gilliard Fisher, Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey are Maddie Sprung Kaiser, Leah Reese Dennis, Asha Saluja and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Justine Dom is our senior producer. Our producer is Kristin Torres. Sound design and engineering by Bill Schultz. Angela Peluso is our booker. Original music by Charles Black. Video production by Evan Cox, Kirk Courtney, Andrew Steele, Carlos Delgado

• 1:24:59Emma Grede?

  and Arnie Agassi. Social media by Olivia Homann. Special thanks go to Brittany Smith, Sidney Ford, my teams at Jonesworks and WNE, Maura Curran, Josefina Francis, Hillary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson Rose, Tim Meekle, Sean Cherry and Lauren Viera. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at aspirewithemmagrede. Grede is spelt G-R-E-D-E. That's aspire, A-S-P-I-R-E with Emma Grede. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emmagrede.me.