Cher

Cher (Cher: The Memoir, Moonstruck, Believe) is a multi-platinum recording artist, Academy Award winning actor, TV personality, author, and icon. Cher joins the Armchair Expert to discuss earlier versions of trying to write her memoir and why this one worked, accidentally falling into her first acting job with Robert Altman, and memories from the Burlesque set with Kristen Bell. Dax and Cher talk about identifying not as an icon but as a woman who has always worked, the best piece of advice her mom gave her, and growing up with strangers as a young child. Cher explains how her music career began with singing background in Phil Spector’s studio, rediscovering how powerful she was in a controlling relationship, and why she believes that a not insignificant part of her success has to do with luck. Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ http://www.wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dan Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman and best friend Erin Weekly.

• 0:06Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 0:07Dax Shepard?

  Happy New Year, Armcherry.

• 0:09Speaker 01

  Happy New Year. Another year together.

• 0:12Dax Shepard?

  Another year together. Let's go really hard in 2026. Just to remind everyone, it's an even number. That's a good start.

• 0:18Speaker 01

  We like it.

• 0:19Dax Shepard?

  And we're starting the year with an enormous bang. Cher. Cher. One of the first in original single named.

• 0:28Speaker 01

  It's true.

• 0:29Dax Shepard?

  Cher is a singer, an actor, an activist, a philanthropist, and an icon.

• 0:34Speaker 01

  She's an icon, whether she wants to believe it or not.

• 0:36Dax Shepard?

  She doesn't want to believe it, but she is. Her albums, Believe, Heart of Stone, Closer to the Truth, Moonstruck, Burlesque, Ding Ding Ding. And she has, and I'm on record over this last year, so you know, I'm not fluffing any pillows. I read this book last year and I absolutely loved it and recommend it to everybody. Her book, which we're here to talk about, Cher, the memoir, part one, is a fucking action-packed thrill ride. I recommend it so much. Please enjoy Cher. We get support from Quince.

• 1:09Speaker 01

  I have to say, I am so ready for fall. I want sweaters. I've been craving a true crisp morning where I actually need a jacket. I can't wait.

• 1:18Dax Shepard?

  I'm fully there. The second it dips below 70, I'm like, this is my season. Give me the layers, give me the boots, give me a reason to wear something other than a t-shirt. And honestly, that's why I love Quince, because fall is when your wardrobe actually has to show up. And everything at Quince is 50 to 80% less than similar brands. We're talking 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters, starting at $60.

• 1:40Speaker 01

  $60. $60 for cashmere that you'd expect from a luxury brand without the luxury price tag. It's amazing. Gets me every time. It really shouldn't be real, but it is because they go straight to the factories, they skip the middlemen, and they just hand you the savings. The stuff isn't trendy. It's the kind of pieces you grab over and over because they work every time.

• 1:58Dax Shepard?

  The 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters for me are it. When I look at Steve McQueen, this man owned a couple of sweaters he wore all the time, and he looks iconic.

• 2:07Speaker 01

  It's a uniform. And Quince isn't just about the clothes. They have hotel quality bedding, cookware, bath essentials, thoughtfully designed furniture. You can really go there and outfit your entire apartment or house. So if you're in need of any kind of fall refresh at home, too, same quality, same attention to detail for every corner of your life.

• 2:26Dax Shepard?

  Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show. We get support from AG1. Fall is that time when your body and mind are getting ready for the winter. You're settling in, bracing for the cold. Your body's already running a deficit from the shorter days and broken sleep patterns. You don't want a nutrient deficit stacked on top of that, too.

• 3:03Speaker 01

  That's where your AG1 routine earns its spot. It's not fixing your sleep or your alarm time. It's giving your body what it needs so the dark mornings don't tank you before you even start. One scoop, cold water every morning before anything else.

• 3:15Dax Shepard?

  AG1 Next Gen has 75 plus ingredients, vitamins, minerals, pre and probiotics, superfoods, backed by four separate gold standard clinical trials. Key nutrient levels improved with three months of consistent use.

• 3:29Speaker 01

  That's the part people miss. It's not a one day fix. It's what happens when you stay consistent.

• 3:33Dax Shepard?

  It's an easy, everyday thing. I've added it to my morning routine and I'm going to tell you, I actually love the taste of it. It's like Pavlovian. I drink it and I know I'm going to get that little vitamin buzz.

• 3:43Speaker 01

  Well, that's also the thing. When you do it first thing in the morning, you already feel kind of self-esteem because you're like, I already did something good for myself.

• 3:51Dax Shepard?

  Yes. Go to drinkag1.com/dax and for a limited time, get a free immunity bundle, including a bottle of omega three fish oil and a bottle of vitamin D3K2 with your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro. That's drinkag1.com/dax. And after checkout, be sure to let them know that Armchair Expert sent you.

• 4:32Dax Shepard?

  I hope you have backups. That's not enough Dr. Pepper for anybody.

• 4:36Speaker 02

  Yes, it is.

• 4:37Dax Shepard?

  That's a joke, that amount of Dr. Pepper. Please, Mama, join us.

• 4:41Speaker 02

  Yes, come here.

• 4:42Dax Shepard?

  No, right, um, there.

• 4:44Speaker 02

  I like your outfit. Thanks. We're going to see Wicked today. Oh, cool. So I'm eventizing it.

• 4:49Dax Shepard?

  Do you have wicked fever like Kristen does?

• 4:51Speaker 02

  I'm really interested. I didn't see the first one.

• 4:54Dax Shepard?

  Did you see the Broadway play?

• 4:56Speaker 02

  No, I've just seen The Lion King because we have a six-year-old. And he's really precocious. I mean, he and I were chasing his dad. No, his dad ended up chasing us. And I had a guard there and he goes up to the guard and he takes his face and he goes, "My dad's a psychopath." So, yeah, he's very precocious.

• 5:16Dax Shepard?

  Okay, you know when they say like, when someone tells you who they are on a date, listen, you've heard this term?

• 5:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:22Dax Shepard?

  You could probably say they're children too, if their children declare them a psychopath, maybe we look into it.

• 5:28Speaker 02

  He's not.

• 5:30Dax Shepard?

  Do you like being around a little person?

• 5:31Speaker 02

  Yes. Before I met him, I walked around my house saying, "I want a man and a toddler."

• 5:37Dax Shepard?

  You declared it to the universe. "I want a man and a toddler."

• 5:40Speaker 02

  Yes. I wasn't expecting them maybe together, but that's what I wanted.

• 5:44Dax Shepard?

  You wanted both of those things and if they came as a pair, all the better.

• 5:48Speaker 02

  Yes, I was expecting them separately.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  But not in the same person.

• 5:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, great question.

• 5:53Speaker 01

  You don't want your man to behave like a child.

• 5:56Speaker 02

  No, well, except sometimes they do. No, no, no. But he's funny. He's really funny.

• 6:03Dax Shepard?

  Now, I want to tell you that you were gonna come in when the book was coming out a while ago. And so what I do when we have a guest and if they have a book, I start reading it. But if they cancel, I stop reading the book because I no longer need to read the book and I've got to read other books. But you canceled and I go, fuck, I'm gonna finish this thing. Like, I love your book.

• 6:25Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 6:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I kept just motoring through.

• 6:27Speaker 02

  I have the other one, too.

• 6:28Dax Shepard?

  Part two?

• 6:28Speaker 02

  Yes. But you have no idea how hard it is to write a book. I mean, it was written a couple of times and then when I read it, I thought, this is not gonna happen.

• 6:37Dax Shepard?

  It's incredibly honest.

• 6:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, what were the parts of the first versions that you had to throw away? Were you like, oh, it's not honest enough?

• 6:44Speaker 02

  I talked to a lady who was English, not happening. It wasn't her fault. Then I tried with a girl that was really sweet and I loved her, but it wasn't happening. And then my friend Eric Roth, I called him and was like, Eric, I am so screwed. I need somebody. And he said, well, I have somebody. And he sent her over and then we started and it just started to work. And I would say everything and it just kind of started to fall in place.

• 7:12Dax Shepard?

  So was it that she was not intimidated by you? Or she wasn't afraid to corral you? What did she do that was a good fit?

• 7:20Speaker 02

  She let me speak the way I speak because the other ones, it just didn't sound like me. And it was like, why? What is this?

• 7:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  So I never read it.

• 7:30Dax Shepard?

  Did you not do the audio version?

• 7:32Speaker 02

  No.

• 7:32Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 7:33Speaker 02

  Because I'm just like, I started each chapter.

• 7:36Dax Shepard?

  I know this because I actually did consume a lot of it over audio and I'm now remembering that. Yeah, you said, I would love to read this to you, but I just am not a good reader. So I'll fuck up this good story.

• 7:46Speaker 02

  When I went for my first job, so fucked up, but it was for Robert Altman. And I only got it because my mom and Robert were friends and my mom woke him up. Didn't know it was him because she had my number in New York and his number right underneath each other. And so she said, is Cher there? Woke him up. He was furious. He's kind of a big bear. Well, he's dead now, but anyway, he was a big bear. And he said, what the fuck would Cher be doing here? She said she wants to be an actress and she was doing an audition for Joe Papp. And then he called me.

• 8:19Dax Shepard?

  No kidding?

• 8:20Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I thought it was a joke. And he said, I'm gonna send a script over. I'm not offering you anything. I read it and I knew who he wanted me to be. And he called me and I went, I can't find this person. I can't do it. He said, have you got a job? And I said, no. And he said, well, then I don't know what you're talking about. Be here tomorrow. And then I said, okay, I can act or I can read, but I can't do both at the same time. And he said, be here tomorrow.

• 8:45Dax Shepard?

  Oh, what a blessing.

• 8:46Speaker 02

  Sandy Dennis said it was the worst reading she's ever heard.

• 8:49Dax Shepard?

  And she had heard a lot.

• 8:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:51Dax Shepard?

  How did you, over time, get good at reading scripts and being able to memorize them?

• 8:57Speaker 02

  I can read. I can't read and speak the lines. If you could have seen me trying to read the beginning of the book, how horrible was it, Jen?

• 9:06Dax Shepard?

  Out of 10, Jen?

• 9:09Dax Shepard?

  Three?

• 9:10Speaker 02

  That's okay.

• 9:11Dax Shepard?

  Wow, you guys work together, so that's probably a one.

• 9:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, we've worked together for a million years.

• 9:16Dax Shepard?

  She probably bumped it up one.

• 9:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:18Dax Shepard?

  Okay, we're joined by a lovely lady, my bride, Kristen. And for anyone who wouldn't remember, you guys are ex-co-stars. And what is your memory, hon, of finding out, was Cher in the cast before you or after? We're talking about Burlesque.

• 9:34Speaker 03

  Before, certainly.

• 9:35Dax Shepard?

  She was first in. Careful there.

• 9:37Speaker 03

  Certainly, I was not attached before Cher was attached. I was cast in a movie that Cher was starring in.

• 9:42Speaker 02

  Oh, please.

• 9:43Speaker 03

  Called Burlesque. And I was very excited because it was Cher, Christina Aguilera.

• 9:48Speaker 02

  Also, it could have been a really good, fun movie, except for you know who, except for both of them.

• 9:55Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 9:55Speaker 03

  Kristen being the first one.

• 9:59Speaker 02

  Not cast members.

• 10:01Speaker 03

  I'm kidding.

• 10:01Speaker 02

  Not cast members.

• 10:02Speaker 03

  It was a hard shoot.

• 10:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I was present. I was present.

• 10:05Speaker 03

  Can we reveal anything today?

• 10:07Dax Shepard?

  What I can say is that, not being involved with it, was there was a romantic relationship happening for people that were very high above.

• 10:17Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 10:17Dax Shepard?

  And that was playing out on set quite frequently and dramatically and uniquely to anyone that's been in show business.

• 10:24Speaker 02

  But there was another thing that I cannot mention.

• 10:26Dax Shepard?

  Look at me really hard in the eyes and convey it to me. Oh, no.

• 10:30Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 10:31Speaker 03

  So, what if we really got it?

• 10:34Speaker 02

  Then the song that I did in the movie, he said, I'm cutting that song out because I don't want Cher to ruin my movie.

• 10:41Speaker 03

  What?

• 10:41Dax Shepard?

  Okay, okay.

• 10:43Speaker 03

  I didn't know that.

• 10:45Speaker 02

  But you remember how?

• 10:46Speaker 03

  I remember a lot of drama, but I also remember the way.

• 10:51Speaker 02

  How funny I am?

• 10:52Speaker 03

  Yes. The way you get, or at least the way I get through dramatic or chaotic situations is to find someone to hold hands with in the corner and just laugh at everything. That's how I get through it. I was either doing that with you or with Stanley.

• 11:06Speaker 02

  I love Stanley.

• 11:07Dax Shepard?

  Every woman loves Stanley. Don't you think it's universal?

• 11:10Speaker 03

  It's very likeable.

• 11:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, universal appeal.

• 11:12Speaker 02

  You cannot love him.

• 11:13Dax Shepard?

  What do you remember about young Kristen Bell? Did you go, oh yeah, this girl will definitely be all that she's proven to be?

• 11:19Speaker 02

  We got along so well. We were very simpatico and I respected her a lot. I didn't know who she was, but she was good.

• 11:28Dax Shepard?

  How much are you aware of the persona you bring into something like that project? People are very excited that Cher is there and you have to take that on and deliver to some degree? Like, how much are you aware of the persona of Cher when you're just someone who wants to enter this job like anyone else and act and do a good job? But you have to be aware of this other presence that's around, which is Cher, the icon.

• 11:56Speaker 02

  It just doesn't mean anything. It's just, I'm a woman who's always worked and that's who I am and I'm successful, but I don't buy that other stuff.

• 12:05Dax Shepard?

  You can't connect to it, but you can observe the impact, though, it's having on people, surely.

• 12:11Speaker 02

  I am who I am and I've worked hard to be who I am, but I don't see the, I don't know.

• 12:17Speaker 03

  Putting you on that type of pedestal.

• 12:19Speaker 02

  If I see people and they're like going crazy, I'll go up to them, give them a hug and go, it's okay.

• 12:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:27Speaker 03

  And then do they freak out, though? I feel like sometimes you see those moments and people just can't handle it.

• 12:32Speaker 02

  Seen the funniest pictures, people behind me realizing it, but somebody else is taking a picture of me and they get this other person behind me.

• 12:40Speaker 03

  You must be seeing your life from above in those circumstances.

• 12:44Speaker 02

  I think I see it from sideways.

• 12:46Dax Shepard?

  Surely you had people that you looked at as if they were Cher?

• 12:51Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 12:51Dax Shepard?

  Like, who were yours?

• 12:52Speaker 02

  Audrey Hepburn, the Hepburn girls. I bumped into her with my Academy Award in my hand.

• 12:58Dax Shepard?

  Backstage at the Oscars?

• 13:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, but you know, there's the black curtain when you're going off?

• 13:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 13:03Speaker 02

  She was in the black curtain. I didn't see her and I bumped right into her. And she said, "I'm so glad you won. I was wishing you would win."

• 13:10Dax Shepard?

  Were you able to feel calm and present? Or were you a little bit revved up that it was her?

• 13:16Speaker 02

  I was revved up.

• 13:17Speaker 03

  From my perspective, you think it's like a waste of time. Let's cut through all of that.

• 13:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, I want to get to the, "I'm the human. Let's talk." I'm not an icon. What the fuck is an icon? Audrey, Kate.

• 13:29Dax Shepard?

  Cher.

• 13:30Speaker 02

  I'm not Audrey. I'm not Audrey or Kate.

• 13:32Dax Shepard?

  Hate to tell you this.

• 13:33Speaker 03

  If you're a one-namer, you're an icon.

• 13:36Dax Shepard?

  If you've sold 100 million albums over the course of seven decades, if you've won Academy, you know, listen, you checked all the boxes. Sadly, it just adds up to icons.

• 13:44Speaker 03

  Whether you want to accept it or not, but that was one of the reasons that I gravitated towards you because I definitely, when I first watched that movie, had that, that you had with the Hepburn girls. Because I was like, "Oh, my gosh, I'm going to be in this movie with Cher and she's an icon." But your vibe in real life is so grounded.

• 14:02Speaker 02

  Well, I'm not grounded at all. No, no, no. I'm completely crazy and I'm completely grounded.

• 14:06Speaker 03

  Yes, both.

• 14:07Speaker 02

  And also, I mean, I'm a Taurus and a Gemini. I'm three people.

• 14:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 14:11Speaker 03

  I don't know what any of that means, but when you talk to you, it does feel like you're going, "Let's just cut through all the waste of time of like, oh, I'm this, I'm that. You feel this way. Let's just talk like human beings."

• 14:21Speaker 02

  We just had fun. We just talked. What do you do? You just talk to somebody.

• 14:25Speaker 03

  Connect as people. You're fun to shoot the shit with. And I will tell you, I'm not going to intrude on the rest of your interview, so I'll leave you with this.

• 14:31Speaker 02

  No, no, don't go.

• 14:31Speaker 03

  Why?

• 14:32Speaker 02

  Because I want you here.

• 14:36Speaker 03

  Stay for a couple more minutes. But then I'm going to let you get to your thing.

• 14:40Speaker 02

  We haven't been getting to it?

• 14:41Speaker 03

  We've been getting it.

• 14:42Dax Shepard?

  We're even starting about a half hour.

• 14:43Speaker 03

  No. This goes till 7:00 PM. But listen, people ask me a lot, "What's the best piece of advice you've ever gotten?" And I say it's from you because you said to me, "Honey, if it doesn't matter in five years, it doesn't matter."

• 14:56Speaker 02

  That's my mom's. "If it doesn't matter in five years, it doesn't matter."

• 15:00Speaker 03

  That's great.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  And I've used it my whole life.

• 15:03Speaker 03

  And it's still relevant?

• 15:04Speaker 02

  It's always. My mom was super cool. And my mom was like a different version of me. A blonde version of me, or I was a dark version of her.

• 15:13Dax Shepard?

  You were the Armenian version of her.

• 15:15Speaker 02

  My dad's Armenian, but I feel more like my mom because I didn't really know my dad. And then my mom said one day, would you like to meet your dad? And I always knew there was somebody that everybody didn't talk about. He was like the dark figure that no one talked about because I loved my sister's dad as my dad.

• 15:33Dax Shepard?

  Both named John conveniently.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  Right. So I met him. How old were you? Eleven. I was so happy that I finally knew why I did certain things.

• 15:44Dax Shepard?

  It explained a lot.

• 15:45Speaker 02

  Yeah. And also my mother and my sister have huge tempers and I don't have one unless, and you gotta push me way far. I mean, you can push me for a long time and then stop or you're going to get killed.

• 16:01Dax Shepard?

  Well, what I liked the most about your book and what is unique about it for a current book is it reminds me of listening to someone share an AA.

• 16:10Speaker 02

  Never done drugs. I don't drink.

• 16:12Dax Shepard?

  It's crazy you didn't do drugs, given that your biological dad was a junkie.

• 16:16Speaker 02

  And both my husbands.

• 16:18Dax Shepard?

  Both husbands, junkies. So that's crazy, but when you see AA scenes in movies, they're always sad and saccharine and someone's like, and then my wife came in and she found me. That's not our vibe. Our vibe is laughing at everything. We fucked up. We own it. But there's not a ton of shame or embarrassment. And your story is told in this very unique, non-victimey way that I love. Cause you could have, the childhood's fucking crazy. It's one for the ages.

• 16:47Speaker 02

  The marriages were pretty weird, too.

• 16:49Dax Shepard?

  Your mom did seven or eight marriages along the way.

• 16:52Speaker 02

  Six. I don't know. She married my dad twice for some reason.

• 16:56Dax Shepard?

  So we don't know how to count that, but suffice to say, there was a new dude every couple of years and she got married to those dudes and you moved all over the place for these dudes.

• 17:04Speaker 02

  Because in those days, my mom used to say, you kind of gotta marry someone.

• 17:08Dax Shepard?

  That's just how it is.

• 17:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:10Dax Shepard?

  Originally, when you first arrive, you go straight to an orphanage?

• 17:14Speaker 02

  Yes. It didn't even take me a long time. I just went straight to it.

• 17:18Dax Shepard?

  You went straight to it?

• 17:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:19Dax Shepard?

  And you were there for how long? This was like in Pennsylvania, some Catholic?

• 17:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, my dad took my mom to Pennsylvania and said, I'm going to New York. I'll be right back. My mom had to make a living, so my dad took me to a Catholic home. And my mom came to visit me every week. And then my mom got sick and she missed three weeks. And she came back and they went, that's it for you. They wouldn't let her see me. No.

• 17:44Dax Shepard?

  They cut her off?

• 17:45Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 17:45Dax Shepard?

  Do you know how long you were in there?

• 17:47Speaker 02

  When I was in there, I was crawling. When I left, I was walking. You don't have memories of that, or do you? I really don't, but I have memories from pretty far back.

• 17:56Dax Shepard?

  Have you ever heard of Gabor Maté?

• 17:58Speaker 02

  No.

• 17:58Dax Shepard?

  He's incredible. He's a psychologist and he's kind of like a world famous one. And yeah, he was a little boy in Nazi Germany. And he had the moment where his mom went into a camp and had to hand him to a stranger. And he lived with a stranger for, I don't know what it was, a year or something, then was reunited.

• 18:17Speaker 02

  I lived with two families that were strangers.

• 18:19Dax Shepard?

  You found out later in life, right?

• 18:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, I had no idea. My grandmother brought this woman, and I knew the names of the women, Edith and Mackie. But I thought they were babysitters. I never knew that I lived with them. And the woman comes in with my high chair. Oh. With had Bambi on the back of it.

• 18:36Dax Shepard?

  That she had saved. That's pretty sweet.

• 18:38Speaker 02

  I'm looking at my grandmother and I'm thinking, what is this? Why have I been led to believe this? But then I've had some terrible, terrible things happen to me, some things I couldn't put in the book, but I don't want to write around. I've got places I want to go.

• 18:56Dax Shepard?

  So much of your story is so specific to what era it happened in. And I think it's kind of telling of your lack of shame or embarrassment about it, which I love, and your non-victiminess. But life was way different in the 70s if you were a kid.

• 19:14Speaker 02

  Well, we started in the 60s.

• 19:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you were born in 47?

• 19:18Speaker 02

  Six. When I was about 40. Years old, my mom was in drama class. All of our friends were artists, singers, dancers. And I didn't even know there were ugly people in the world.

• 19:28Dax Shepard?

  I was gonna say, they were all inordinately gorgeous, right? Everyone was super stylish and sexy and living that lifestyle.

• 19:35Speaker 02

  Right, but I mean, also kinda crazy and neurotic. I used to sit in the seats in the audience and watch everybody rehearsing. I was the only child too, so everyone wanted to pick me up and kiss me.

• 19:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you were the center of attention, I'm sure.

• 19:49Speaker 02

  Hello.

• 19:50Dax Shepard?

  It's addictive, but dad leaves right away, John number one. John number two is husband number two or three, two. And he's special, you fall in love with him, you're with him zero to nine. But between dad and John, who becomes your stepdad, there's also mom was engaged for a minute to a casino owner, Prim?

• 20:10Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 20:11Dax Shepard?

  And I was curious, is that Prim Nevada, is that the same person?

• 20:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:14Dax Shepard?

  It is?

• 20:15Speaker 02

  Well, I don't know, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

• 20:17Dax Shepard?

  It makes sense, right? Who the hell is named Prim? I'm like, this guy, Prim's a whole town in Nevada, it's a gambling town. But I'm imagining her mom's boyfriend went on to create this town, Prim Nevada. You don't have any memories of that, you were too little, probably.

• 20:31Speaker 02

  And also, he didn't like me.

• 20:33Dax Shepard?

  He didn't want a kid around.

• 20:34Speaker 02

  Mm-mm.

• 20:34Dax Shepard?

  So then your mom meets Johnny in an acting class and you love him.

• 20:39Speaker 02

  Yes, I loved my dad because my dad was funny and handsome and did all kinds of things with me. And when my sister was born, nobody cared about me, nobody was even looking. I just became a non-entity. And he one day came in my room and said, you know, I don't see what's so great about that baby. Let's go get some ice cream. And everybody else was like, goo goo goo goo.

• 21:04Dax Shepard?

  He had a drinking problem.

• 21:05Speaker 02

  Oh, yes.

• 21:06Dax Shepard?

  And he got violent.

• 21:07Speaker 02

  Everybody in the family besides me had a huge temper, huge, huge, huge. And there was corporal punishment because that's what happened in those days.

• 21:16Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 21:17Speaker 01

  Maybe that's why you don't have one. Maybe it's in reaction to being around so much of it, that you've taken another route.

• 21:24Speaker 02

  It's not that, you're born with it. My mom and my sister.

• 21:28Dax Shepard?

  Short fuses, fly off the handle.

• 21:29Speaker 02

  No fuses.

• 21:30Dax Shepard?

  How were you making peace with the fact that there was this man who was so loving and kind to you and saw you when no one else was seeing you? That he had this Dr. Jekyll side, or I guess Mr. Hyde side?

• 21:43Speaker 02

  It was very scary because you were like constantly vigilant.

• 21:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that it makes you hyper vigilant. Like, how do we prevent him from turning into a werewolf? Because I love this version. How do we head off any problem?

• 21:54Speaker 02

  Okay, this is what you get to be. You get to be able to read the room really well. And I knew the drink where I had to be out by.

• 22:01Dax Shepard?

  Right. Oh, that's gonna tip on this one. So you get really savvy. But do you also think it opens up for you a tolerance? That people are really fucked up and they're really nice. Do you think it might have lowered your expectations in a way that later materialized with Sonny?

• 22:19Speaker 02

  Sonny wasn't like that for such a long time. Sonny was fabulous and he would do stupid things. We would do water paints and we would go to the park and this guy played the saxophone and we would laugh. We had a lot of fun and he was special in a way. And then it became very treacherous.

• 22:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, got insanely controlling, as we'll get to. But do you think you were a little bit like, yeah, this is how men act. Now there's this new side of him and it's a pain in the ass and I gotta deal with it. But also, this is how men are.

• 22:51Speaker 02

  It was so both and. Look, I was so young. I was 16 when I met him.

• 22:57Dax Shepard?

  If you wrote about him today, people would be like, this is the most traumatic thing I've ever read. But standard for the day was you were super attractive, you're 16, you almost get hit by Warren Beatty.

• 23:06Speaker 02

  I lied to him.

• 23:07Dax Shepard?

  You lied to Warren Beatty? You said you were older.

• 23:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:10Dax Shepard?

  You lied to everybody, right? You were dating a ton of older guys.

• 23:12Speaker 02

  You can't be 16 and, yeah. I mean, in those days, it wasn't so bad.

• 23:17Dax Shepard?

  I'm trying to make peace with it while I read it because I just get it. It was standard. You were never thinking like, oh, it's weird. I'm 16. This guy's 30. He invited me over.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  No, but I knew you couldn't tell people.

• 23:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. So it was still a thing enough that you knew. Yeah, but it sounds like it's all pageantry, though. It's just like, oh, I'm 18.

• 23:32Speaker 02

  Well, no, because people wouldn't go out with you if you told them you were 16.

• 23:36Dax Shepard?

  Well, sure. Which I think is probably good of them.

• 23:39Speaker 02

  There was the emotional line for guys.

• 23:42Dax Shepard?

  But how old was Warren when he almost hit your car and invited you over?

• 23:45Speaker 02

  I don't know. I was 16. I don't know how old Warren is. He was older, but he wasn't old.

• 23:51Dax Shepard?

  In his 20s, probably?

• 23:53Speaker 02

  Probably.

• 23:53Dax Shepard?

  This could happen in LA. You could just be driving and the next thing you know, you're friends with Warren Beatty.

• 23:57Speaker 02

  Right. And I just left a guy that I was dating, a tennis player. And then I'm going down the street, down Sunset, and some asshole comes up and almost sideswipes me. I have to go into Schwab's parking lot.

• 24:10Dax Shepard?

  Duck into Schwab's real quick.

• 24:11Speaker 02

  Yeah. And then. He came up and he had glasses on, so I didn't know who he was. But I didn't really care much about who he was. I just knew my mother and my friend Penny would be really impressive.

• 24:23Dax Shepard?

  And they were.

• 24:24Speaker 02

  Very.

• 24:25Dax Shepard?

  Nowadays, if your 16 year old is hanging out with mid twenties movie star, you'd be like, this is not for you. But they were like, oh, tell us more.

• 24:32Speaker 02

  No, but he talked to my mom and she went from, you're never going out of the house again to, oh, it's okay, honey. Yeah. He was so charming.

• 24:42Dax Shepard?

  So different.

• 24:43Speaker 02

  And later, like a couple of years later, no, not a couple of years later, like eight months later. So he calls me and said, let's go to dinner. And I went, I have a boyfriend. He said, well, okay, let's go to lunch.

• 24:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Okay, so I'll just fast forward through, but we're not putting a fine enough point on the fact that you were in Fresno, you were in New York. There was a husband who was financially set in New York. You all moved to New York. Your mom hates it. You moved back to LA. You're just bouncing all around.

• 25:14Speaker 02

  Yes, but I was used to it. We were gypsy kind of people.

• 25:18Dax Shepard?

  By the time you're 16, you move out.

• 25:20Speaker 02

  Yes, I'm finished. What I thought was I've learned as much as I can learn from these people, I'm leaving.

• 25:26Dax Shepard?

  So at 16, you move in with a girlfriend.

• 25:28Speaker 02

  Yes, well, she worked for my mom for a while. And then when my mom knew I was going, they said, you have to live with her. Like she was somebody that was going to really keep a rein on me. We moved into this apartment and where my parents live, we smoked a cigarette in every room. We just put an ashtrays everywhere and smoked a cigarette in every room.

• 25:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, pretty exciting to be in Hollywood, living on your own at 16 and you're hot.

• 25:53Speaker 02

  We were in Beverly Hills.

• 25:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so you're living with her and then you meet Sonny.

• 25:56Speaker 02

  Yes, but he likes my girlfriend, but my girlfriend's gay.

• 26:00Dax Shepard?

  Again, not an issue in the seventies because you also date Geffen for quite a while.

• 26:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, but that's a different thing. Because he never had been in love with anybody. So I was the first person that he had real feelings for. So we had a special arrangement when we met. How did we meet?

• 26:20Dax Shepard?

  I don't know where you met. And I should.

• 26:22Speaker 02

  Okay, well, so should I.

• 26:25Dax Shepard?

  But let's walk up to that point. So you meet Sonny. Sonny likes your girlfriend.

• 26:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, she's gay.

• 26:30Dax Shepard?

  She's gay. It's a mess.

• 26:32Speaker 02

  Runs off with her boyfriend.

• 26:33Dax Shepard?

  Frau leaves. You need a roommate. You're just this dumb kid that hangs around a bit with Sonny. It's very innocuous at the beginning.

• 26:40Speaker 02

  He and I got to be friends and I would do stupid things with him like the girls his age would never do. I was happy to just do nothing.

• 26:48Dax Shepard?

  He wanted to be silly with somebody.

• 26:49Speaker 02

  Yes, he did. And so then I got kicked out. So I went next door to tell him because I was very forlorn and we were best friends by that time. Well, not best, but we were good. He said, well, you can move in with me. And I was like, okay, good. Okay, what? And then he said, I have single beds. To tell you the truth, I don't find you particularly attractive.

• 27:10Speaker 01

  Wow, he said that.

• 27:12Dax Shepard?

  He was also 27 and she was 16.

• 27:14Speaker 01

  Okay, so.

• 27:15Speaker 02

  He didn't know that.

• 27:17Dax Shepard?

  He thought you were what, 19?

• 27:18Speaker 02

  18. 18 was my number.

• 27:20Speaker 01

  Did you feel safer, in quotes, knowing that he didn't find you attractive? Like, oh, yeah, we're just friends and it can be easy.

• 27:26Speaker 02

  I don't know if I felt safer, but I felt safe with him because that's the way he was, you know? He was very protective, but not just of me. Like, he was a good friend to all these guys. And it says in the book, the night that I was in this club, I had my back to the door. And when he walked in, I noticed that everyone was going, Son, hey, Sonny, come and sit with us. Hey, Sonny, come and sit with us. Son, son, come sit with us. And I'm thinking, who in God's name is behind me?

• 27:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:56Speaker 02

  And I turn around. It was Maria and.

• 27:59Speaker 01

  Oh, Tony and Maria?

• 28:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, Tony and Maria. Right, right. Thank you. See, I knew you should be here.

• 28:08Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 28:13Dax Shepard?

  We are supported by Allstate. Checking Allstate first could save you hundreds on car insurance. That's smart. Not checking which platform you watch that new show on. So frustrating. 15 minutes later, you've logged into seven apps, reset two passwords, and still haven't found it. Yeah, checking first is smart. So check. Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary, subject to terms, conditions and availability. Allstate North American Insurance Co. and Affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. We are supported by Inuit TurboTax. You know that feeling when you drop your taxes off with somebody and then nothing? You're just sitting there wondering if they've even started, if there's a problem.

• 28:54Dax Shepard?

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• 29:39Dax Shepard?

  That's TurboTax.com, only available with TurboTax Full Service experts. Real time updates and iOS mobile app. This episode is supported by Helix.

• 29:49Speaker 01

  Dax, is there anything better than crawling into a perfect bed on a cold fall night? Candlelit, hoodie on, maybe even some rain outside. The dream.

• 30:00Dax Shepard?

  That's the dream. You just described one of my ideal fall nights.

• 30:04Speaker 01

  I know, and thanks to Helix, my bed actually lives up to the vibe. All I had to do was take the Helix Sleep Quiz and within two minutes, they matched me to a mattress built for exactly how I sleep. I have a midnight mattress. It also has cooling technology, which I really.

• 30:20Dax Shepard?

  Increasingly so.

• 30:21Speaker 01

  I need it. I have to have it. And I heard that you're supposed to sleep at a cold temp. Or optimal sleep, it's very, very helpful.

• 30:31Dax Shepard?

  She is not wrong. I have one too, and it's been such a game changer for sleep. And I love that they make it so easy, free shipping right to your door. And what they're happy with Helix guarantee, you'll get a full 365 nights to try it. A whole year to live in that cozy. They've got over 20 mattress models, so no matter how you sleep, they've got one for you.

• 30:51Speaker 01

  And it's not just us saying it. Helix has been named the most awarded mattress brand by Forbes, Wired and more. You've got to try it for yourself.

• 30:58Dax Shepard?

  Go to helixsleep.com/armchair for 20% off site wide. That's helixsleep.com/armchair for 20% off site wide. Helixsleep.com/armchair. This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. We've talked before about Rob building our website on Squarespace and I bring it up again because it's a perfect example of what they do well. Rob had all the pieces, the content, the vision, the ideas, but he needed something to actually take all that and make it public facing. And Squarespace was that bridge. Maybe you're in the same spot. You've been developing something, a business, a skillset, a body of work, and it's been private. It's been yours, but at some point you're ready to put it out there.

• 31:40Dax Shepard?

  And that transition from private to public can feel like a huge leap. Squarespace makes it feel like a step. Beautiful templates, built in SEO, email campaigns, scheduling, analytics, everything you need to go from, I've been working on this to here it is, come find me. All in one place, no code, no stitching together a bunch of different tools. So if you've been sitting on something and waiting for the right moment, this might be it. Head to Squarespace.com/dax for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code DAX to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

• 32:23Speaker 02

  So everyone just disappeared.

• 32:26Dax Shepard?

  How long were you living together before it got blurry?

• 32:29Speaker 02

  It got way blurry when my mom came in and found his shorts next to the teabags.

• 32:35Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 32:36Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 32:36Dax Shepard?

  She was like, what's happening here?

• 32:38Speaker 02

  I would say, Mom, if you're gonna come over, just call me before. I want to make sure the house is clean. And then I lost most of his clothes because when she was coming over, I threw them in my girlfriend's. She left her window open. I just threw them through the window.

• 32:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 32:51Speaker 02

  And Sonny came down. He said, Cher, my shorts, my underwear is all over this bushes over there. What are you doing?

• 32:57Dax Shepard?

  And he was working for Phil Spector. And for people who are not aware of Phil Spector, a lot of people won't be, he was a titan in the 60s music. He invented this wall of sound recording technique. He was a god. He just produced so many hit records.

• 33:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, he made the wrecking group.

• 33:15Dax Shepard?

  Yes. And so Sonny was working for him. And you start kind of stopping by the recording studio.

• 33:21Speaker 02

  That's not exactly true. I had met Philip before with his best friend. And I walked in and sat down. And he asked me in French, would I go to bed with him?

• 33:31Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 33:31Speaker 02

  And so I knew the answer. And I said, for money. Oh, nice. And then when I had to meet with Sonny, I had to kind of say, Sonny, I met him. I know him. He doesn't like me.

• 33:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  So anyway, but finally, he said to Sonny, I'll bring her. So he brought me and Philip and I had a really weird relationship.

• 33:50Dax Shepard?

  Can I just tell people also, in addition to him being a pioneer in sound, he also got convicted for murdering someone.

• 33:56Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 33:57Dax Shepard?

  For people don't know, the end of the Phil Spector story.

• 33:59Speaker 02

  That was way, way later.

• 33:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, that was in the 90s or maybe. But did you get a creepy vibe from him? Or no, he was an eccentric man. But could you see that it was weirder than that?

• 34:07Speaker 02

  No, he was really eccentric. He could be funny. He could be kind of.

• 34:10Dax Shepard?

  Scary?

• 34:11Speaker 02

  No, never that. I was never gonna take shit from him. And Sonny used to say, Cher, he's my boss. Please stop. And I went, yeah, well, I don't give a shit.

• 34:20Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 34:21Speaker 02

  So you had a weird relationship with him? Yeah, I don't know where I got this foot spa, because I should have been nervous and frightened because everybody else was. But he probably liked that, that you were the only person not doing that.

• 34:32Dax Shepard?

  It's also because you've been trained on like 65 different step dads. You had to adjust to all these different people, big personalities.

• 34:38Speaker 02

  He tried. If someone says that as their first. Sentenced you. Yeah. And you say the sentence back, which he was shocked.

• 34:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 34:48Speaker 02

  Then you can't really take being frightened serious.

• 34:51Dax Shepard?

  But you end up singing background on some songs that become hits.

• 34:55Speaker 02

  Because Sonny had told him, you know, Cher sings. If someone tells you someone sings, it's like, oh, God.

• 35:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 35:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, okay, fine. Darlene and I were talking about this not long ago. So Darlene, her car broke down and Philip said, Sonny said, you sing, go in there. I wanted to tell him what my credentials were, but I didn't have any. And so I went in and I started, that was being my baby, and I kept going until after the Christmas album. Wow.

• 35:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, a huge hit song. Having not planned on that and that happening, were you so tickled by that turn of events? Were you like excited when you'd hear your song come on the radio?

• 35:34Speaker 02

  Well, the first one I did was that and the last one is you've lost that loving feeling. And I was the last girl.

• 35:39Dax Shepard?

  That's the one I'm thinking of.

• 35:40Speaker 02

  I was the only girl.

• 35:41Dax Shepard?

  Was it so exciting?

• 35:42Speaker 02

  Great song. Yeah, we were all sitting in the booth and when Bill finished it, nobody could kind of breathe. It was like, ah.

• 35:52Dax Shepard?

  So then you and Sonny record some songs.

• 35:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, nothing.

• 35:58Dax Shepard?

  Crickets. How do you end up meeting the Rolling Stones and how do they tell you, you know what you guys should do is you should go to England, you and Sonny?

• 36:05Speaker 02

  Sonny and Jac Niche met them and they didn't like being here so much because of the way that the older people, the heads of the studios, they didn't understand it. Bobcat vests and big elephant bell bottoms and people were wearing suits and dresses, you know, little short dresses, but above the knee, not short.

• 36:27Dax Shepard?

  This whole Bohemian kind of style.

• 36:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:30Dax Shepard?

  Wasn't accepted.

• 36:31Speaker 02

  No.

• 36:32Dax Shepard?

  So you go to England and you guys become quite famous.

• 36:36Speaker 02

  Overnight.

• 36:37Dax Shepard?

  Cause you arrive and you get thrown out of the hotel as you arrive and it's all captured in the media and that makes you guys an overnight sensation.

• 36:46Speaker 02

  Why'd you get thrown to hell?

• 36:48Dax Shepard?

  Their clothes.

• 36:48Speaker 02

  Because our clothes, the way we looked.

• 36:50Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 36:51Dax Shepard?

  It's so funny because you see them now and you're like, oh yeah, that looks exactly like it's supposed to.

• 36:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:55Dax Shepard?

  But the notion that you guys were getting thrown out for how you looked is pretty.

• 36:59Speaker 01

  Because you were renegades.

• 37:00Speaker 02

  Because nobody looked as strange as we did. We left as nobodies and came back to America. I think 5,000 people were at the airport.

• 37:08Dax Shepard?

  Because I Got You Babe had come out by that point.

• 37:11Speaker 02

  I Got You Babe came out in Europe, in England.

• 37:14Dax Shepard?

  In England.

• 37:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:14Dax Shepard?

  In 65.

• 37:15Speaker 02

  By the time we got back home, it was a huge hit.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 37:18Dax Shepard?

  And so then why did it sour? Because you get your first kind of valley between 65 and 71. There's the six years where you have this pretty big success and then you got to go back to the drawing board.

• 37:30Speaker 02

  It had passed us by at that time. We didn't really grow with the people. And everybody was doing drugs. Everybody was talking about doing drugs and we didn't do, well, I didn't do drugs. Sonny was a little iffy.

• 37:41Dax Shepard?

  The counterculture was taking over.

• 37:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 37:43Dax Shepard?

  So at that point, Sonny basically redesigns you guys.

• 37:47Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 37:49Dax Shepard?

  Are you thinking, well, the ride's over? Were you quick to give up or did you have the same optimism that Sonny did?

• 37:55Speaker 02

  I did not have the same optimism. What I had was faith because he said, give me two years and we'll be more famous than we were ever before.

• 38:02Dax Shepard?

  Which is crazy and you guys developed more of a lounge act in the wake of this, right?

• 38:07Speaker 02

  It was an accident. We went just to sing, but the people didn't like us and were so disrespectful that I just started making jokes for the band.

• 38:15Dax Shepard?

  And through that you discovered, oh.

• 38:18Speaker 02

  No, Sonny discovered.

• 38:19Dax Shepard?

  You're quite funny.

• 38:20Speaker 02

  Yeah. Sonny knew what the pulse was and he knew what to bet on. So he encouraged it. Not at home, not anyplace else, just on stage.

• 38:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And there's this other weird dynamic people might not know about is that Sonny never wanted to perform really. He wanted you to be a star and he wanted to produce your music.

• 38:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:37Dax Shepard?

  And you very much had stage fright and wanted him present. So you'd feel confident.

• 38:41Speaker 02

  I still get it.

• 38:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, you have it here. That's why Kristen's sitting right there.

• 38:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 38:46Speaker 01

  She's acting as Sonny. Yeah.

• 38:47Dax Shepard?

  Sonny Bell.

• 38:50Dax Shepard?

  So, once you do the Sonny and Cher show, which again, comes out of this lounge routine you're doing, and Sonny goes back to the drawing board, and he does, he cracks it. I think this will blow people's mind, that Sonny and Cher was getting 30 million viewers a week.

• 39:03Speaker 01

  That's insane.

• 39:04Dax Shepard?

  There's not a show on TV that even is one tenth of that anymore.

• 39:07Speaker 01

  And you guys were together at this point, right?

• 39:10Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 39:10Speaker 01

  Okay, and you were like, very deeply connected.

• 39:13Dax Shepard?

  Well, this is when, I guess it's been happening before, but this is when now this kind of new side of Sonny comes out, which is like incredibly controlling. You have this huge success, there's a lot of money, you're not allowed to leave the house, you're allowed to go shopping, that's pretty much all you're allowed to do, right? And he's cutting you off from friendships you have. This side of him, was it happening slowly? Was it more like you woke up one day and were like, oh, I don't have a life? Or while it was happening, were you like, what's going on? Was it something that occurred to you late?

• 39:47Speaker 02

  Took a little while. I couldn't do anything. Joe D was our friend and our manager, and also in the mafia, but I wanted to do something, and I just said, I'll learn how to play tennis. So I was going there, and I was having the best time. Joe D went with me to pick out my clothes, and then I'm going with this lady every couple of days, and then one day, I'm leaving, but she's having a huge party, so there are people coming in, and so Dennis, my friend, told Sonny that I was there, but lots of people were there, and lots of men were there, and he burned my clothes.

• 40:24Dax Shepard?

  In the fireplace or in the yard? Yard's more dramatic.

• 40:26Speaker 01

  Was he giving excuses at first for why you should stay in the house? Was it a slow burn of, you should stay in because you're too famous now? What was he saying?

• 40:37Speaker 02

  I think it came on kind of slowly, because also, when we started Sonny and Cher's show, I was free on the show, and he was funny, and we got along. It's such a strange dichotomy, because we would be laughing, and we'd be having the best time, and then when we were at home, it was kind of more cut and dried.

• 40:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he had lots of other girlfriends.

• 40:57Speaker 02

  I didn't know, except the one.

• 40:59Dax Shepard?

  You're middle of the night, you go to get a glass of water and there's a young woman putting her boots on in the house.

• 41:04Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 41:05Dax Shepard?

  Were you thinking of how to get out of it?

• 41:07Speaker 02

  No.

• 41:08Dax Shepard?

  Were you underwhelmed with like, wow, I have a hit show and we're making tons of money and I'm not very happy? Were you having like, where's the joy?

• 41:15Speaker 02

  It wasn't that because I was so happy with the show and he was so nice on their show. And so at the show, we would be having the best time and we were more working than we were at home.

• 41:27Dax Shepard?

  So had you not had the show, you might've started questioning the whole relationship, but it worked so well there that you're like, well, it works. Do you think this was an old fashioned masculine Italian mancho ownership over you?

• 41:42Speaker 02

  When he took my money, I said, why did you do this? And he said, because I always knew you were gonna go. He started smoking cigars and I knew it was over.

• 41:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you said that. Why is that? What is that indicative of?

• 41:54Speaker 02

  Cause like businessmen smoke cigars.

• 41:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Cause I'm wondering, there's this pretty well worn track with y'all, which is men are attracted to your sparkliness. And then they're with you and then they're super threatened by your sparkliness. So that's what's a mystery to me is like, he didn't have any interest in you, but yet he was very jealous and didn't want anyone else to have you. Do you think he was protecting his financial interests or his heart interest?

• 42:24Speaker 02

  No, not his heart interest by that time.

• 42:26Dax Shepard?

  So it's just more like you were his whole business and he wanted to keep you just doing that business.

• 42:33Speaker 02

  And also he couldn't do it without me.

• 42:35Dax Shepard?

  Clearly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You did it without him, as it turned out.

• 42:39Speaker 02

  But also we had fun. It was such a polar opposites because on stage, we had a blast. He let me have all the freedom that I wanted to. And then we came home. The show kept us together a lot longer than we would have been anyway, because we had such a good time. He was so fun and he was so funny and we worked so well together.

• 43:01Dax Shepard?

  Played a bit of a beta role on the show, but then in real life, he wanted to be very alpha.

• 43:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 43:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, maybe he felt emasculated in the show and so he had to compensate at home.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  When he found his place, when he found what he was good at, he was really funny. And actually the people liked him more than me.

• 43:20Speaker 01

  I don't know about that.

• 43:23Dax Shepard?

  I get it. You were the more powerful of the group.

• 43:25Speaker 02

  No, I was the bitch.

• 43:26Dax Shepard?

  He's more of like an underdoggy.

• 43:27Speaker 02

  On the monologues, I just cut him to ribbons. But then he found this kind of nebbish funny guy. And everyone loved him. And they were drawn to me.

• 43:39Dax Shepard?

  You're touring like crazy when you're not doing the show. The marriage, it's not great. And at some point, you become friends with David Geffen. He enters your life.

• 43:47Speaker 02

  Oh, no, no. I met him at Lou Adler's Christmas party. Yay, we found it. Good job.

• 43:53Dax Shepard?

  Met him at the Christmas party. And at some point, he says, can I read your contract?

• 43:57Speaker 02

  Bill was way before David.

• 43:59Dax Shepard?

  Bill's the guitarist in the band. Yes.

• 44:01Speaker 02

  The guts from I don't even know where, because everyone was terrified of Sonny.

• 44:05Dax Shepard?

  You're in Vegas doing shows. You have to do a bunch of shows and you finally had enough. You're done and you've not confided in anybody what you're going through.

• 44:14Speaker 02

  My friend Paulette knew, but everybody was really frightened of Sonny. And I was thinking about jumping off the balcony.

• 44:22Dax Shepard?

  And you confided in the guitarist of the band.

• 44:26Speaker 02

  One night I just went to the band's room after the show.

• 44:28Dax Shepard?

  Which Sonny did not want you doing that.

• 44:30Speaker 02

  Are you kidding? He didn't want me doing anything. He didn't want me to do anything.

• 44:34Dax Shepard?

  Like go into a room and just shut down until the next performance.

• 44:37Speaker 02

  No, he had a kidney stone and I got to go to the movies with my friends.

• 44:41Dax Shepard?

  And you were so excited he had a kidney stone.

• 44:43Speaker 02

  Did you ever think, what, what's happened to me? No. I mean, if you're 16 and someone's 27 and you don't know what you are doing. And then all of a sudden you're singing with Philip. And Sonny was nice then. Sonny was nice for a really long time. And then not so nice.

• 45:01Dax Shepard?

  So you confide in this bandmate. And then, yeah, you just use him a little bit as like, okay, I'm gonna wiggle out.

• 45:09Speaker 02

  He said, everyone wants to know, why do you live this way?

• 45:12Dax Shepard?

  Did that feel like reality just shattered?

• 45:15Speaker 02

  I mean, I knew it was obvious to Paulette, but I wasn't allowed to talk to the band. So I didn't realize that they knew.

• 45:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And now you're saying, I'm leaving this, this residency. Like, I'm not gonna perform. That became your trump card.

• 45:30Speaker 02

  That night, it was crazy. Sonny said, are you crazy? Do you know what you're doing? He said, you need to come back to the room. And I said, you know what? Bill wants to come with me. It was just crazy.

• 45:41Dax Shepard?

  It was the breaking point.

• 45:41Speaker 02

  I hadn't eaten in days. I wasn't even 98 pounds.

• 45:45Speaker 01

  Because he wouldn't let you eat?

• 45:46Speaker 02

  No, no, I couldn't.

• 45:47Speaker 01

  Oh, you were just so in fight or flight.

• 45:49Speaker 02

  Crazy. Bill comes up and he was 22. I was 25. And then the second time he said, why do you live this way? And I said, I don't know. I mean, I can't do it anymore. I don't know what I'm gonna do. So Sonny said, come back up to this room now. And I said, I'm gonna bring Bill. I went from one kind of person just flipped over that night.

• 46:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, did a 180. But he was so business minded, Sonny, that he knew best to salvage the business. Like, once he recognized, oh, you might be deserting this business, he came to the table in a way that was like, okay, I'm gonna let you move to Malibu. The concession started.

• 46:38Speaker 02

  Also, I didn't know how powerful I was at all.

• 46:41Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right, right. So the ball has started rolling, but it's not until Geffen looks at this contract and says to you, do you realize 100% of this money goes to a company called Share Inc. That is owned 95% by Sonny and 5% by his lawyer.

• 47:00Speaker 01

  Ugh, 0% for Share?

• 47:02Dax Shepard?

  0%.

• 47:04Speaker 01

  Oh, my.

• 47:05Dax Shepard?

  And it's been generating.

• 47:06Speaker 02

  It was like born yesterday because they would bring me a bunch of Share Enterprises contracts to sign. And it was always when I was getting ready to go on stage.

• 47:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, were you gonna read 20 pages of legalese?

• 47:16Speaker 02

  And I'm not gonna read anyway.

• 47:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 47:19Speaker 02

  And then the next day, he said, you gotta get out of this. So I went to Sonny and I said, I'll stay if we're partners. And he said, no.

• 47:27Speaker 01

  So stupid.

• 47:29Dax Shepard?

  What a dumbass on top of everything else.

• 47:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, but he wasn't used to it. And he hated David. I mean, he hated him with a vengeance.

• 47:37Dax Shepard?

  I'm sure.

• 47:37Speaker 02

  None of the others, but David.

• 47:39Dax Shepard?

  You had Stockholm syndrome to some degree. You know, you were living with kind of a captor.

• 47:44Speaker 02

  I guess so. It was push and pull kind of. I mean, he never hit me. He never did anything like that. And he would be really nice and we were working most of the time.

• 47:53Dax Shepard?

  He'd buy you things and seemingly spoil you.

• 47:56Speaker 02

  Yes, all kinds of shit.

• 47:57Dax Shepard?

  And you were moving to nicer and nicer houses. So it was working.

• 48:00Speaker 01

  But that is the cycle of abuse we know now is love bombing mixed with hyper control.

• 48:06Speaker 02

  He used to buy me really expensive presents, but it wasn't for me so much. It was to show people who he was.

• 48:15Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that is a big, big shot.

• 48:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:17Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you guys get divorced. I also think it's really interesting. You did reach out to Lucy Arnez. I love Lucy. And for people to know that history, she too was in business with her husband on a show.

• 48:31Speaker 02

  And my mom was on that show.

• 48:32Dax Shepard?

  Oh, she was. She acted on it.

• 48:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:35Dax Shepard?

  What did Lucy say? And she had had a similar situation with Desi. He was controlling and he had screwed her out of a bunch of money.

• 48:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:44Dax Shepard?

  And what'd she say to you?

• 48:45Speaker 02

  Fuck him.

• 48:45Dax Shepard?

  Get to get.

• 48:46Speaker 02

  No, she said, fuck him. You're the talented one.

• 48:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 48:50Speaker 01

  Were you like able to take that in when she said, you're the talented one? Were you able to really be like, actually, I am?

• 48:55Dax Shepard?

  To own that?

• 48:56Speaker 02

  Gave me a lot of courage and David was there. I couldn't have done it without David.

• 49:01Dax Shepard?

  You then go on to record in 71, Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves, Half-Breed, Dark Lady. The music career is starting to now work without Sonny. And then how do we get into Silkwood? Was it calculated or did it kind of come about?

• 49:14Speaker 02

  No, I've never calculated anything. I've just been lucky. I went to Mike Nichols once for an audition and he said, Cher, there are two kinds of women and you're not the one I want for this. And I said to him, you know, I'm talented and one day you're going to be really upset. You're going to be sorry. So I'm doing Come Back to Five and Dime. So he came to the matinee and then he came backstage and he said, you're right, you're talented and I'm really sorry.

• 49:44Dax Shepard?

  Really?

• 49:44Speaker 02

  And he said, how would you like to make a movie with Meryl Streep? And I said, okay, that sounds good.

• 49:50Dax Shepard?

  That sounds right. I fall in love with you from Mask. I think Mask is such a special movie.

• 49:57Speaker 02

  It was, and I had such a horrible time with Peter. It was terrible, the worst experience I ever had.

• 50:04Dax Shepard?

  Bagdavich?

• 50:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 50:05Dax Shepard?

  He was directing? I don't even think I knew that. Why? Cause he has a thing with his actresses?

• 50:10Speaker 02

  He didn't like me from the get go. I don't know how I got hired, but I guess he saw that I would be good at it, but he didn't like me. He didn't really like the characters. He was an ascot kind of guy.

• 50:23Dax Shepard?

  Yes, and this is about a biker family.

• 50:25Speaker 02

  He knew enough to pick the script, but he didn't like the people. And he didn't like me at all.

• 50:32Dax Shepard?

  Really? And how would that present itself? Will he make you do millions of takes?

• 50:37Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no. I'll give you one story. We're doing a big scene in the kitchen. So he said, where do you think it would be good to do this tomorrow? And I said, we'll be in the kitchen all day. Maybe we should go into the little dining room thing. And he said, okay. And then the next morning he comes in to me. He was eating an egg sandwich. That's the thing I can.

• 50:59Dax Shepard?

  Focal point of the experience.

• 51:00Speaker 02

  That's the grounding of that experience. And he just started, you know, I don't know who you think you are. You're not going to tell me where to. It was crazy. Then we're doing the scene and Peter comes up to give me a direction and he puts his hand on the back of my shoulder. And I said, take it off, don't ever touch me again.

• 51:18Speaker 01

  Good for you.

• 51:18Dax Shepard?

  It was over.

• 51:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:20Dax Shepard?

  You're phenomenal in that movie. You're so good. The other movie I wanted to ask you about, cause I'm so obsessed with him, but what was happening on Moonstruck with you and Nicolas Cage? That feels like the pairing of a lifetime.

• 51:32Speaker 02

  Well, you know, they don't want him in the beginning.

• 51:35Dax Shepard?

  Because?

• 51:35Speaker 02

  They wanted Peter Gallagher, who I love, but he wasn't right. And I had seen Nikki in Peggy Sue Got Married.

• 51:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 51:43Speaker 02

  And I knew he was the only one to play it. And then. They said no, and I quit.

• 51:51Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. So you were the one pushing for Nick Cage?

• 51:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:57Dax Shepard?

  Did you know him prior to making it?

• 51:58Speaker 02

  I didn't know him. I just knew that only he could do it. I mean, can you see anybody else saying, Chrissy, give me the big knife?

• 52:06Dax Shepard?

  No, but I'm his number one fan, so he does no wrong, in my opinion. I think he's the most exciting actor to watch alive. He had to have had a crush on you, yeah, in real life?

• 52:15Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 52:16Dax Shepard?

  I think so.

• 52:17Speaker 02

  I don't remember. I don't think so.

• 52:19Dax Shepard?

  You don't think so?

• 52:20Speaker 02

  No, I don't know. I don't know. I have a boyfriend. It doesn't stop people from having crushes. Yeah, I know.

• 52:27Dax Shepard?

  While you were in this big chunk, you're having tremendous success as an actor. Do you want to resume singing? Or are you like, fuck, this is great. I like doing this. I like doing movies. It's less exhausting. I'm not on the road.

• 52:40Speaker 02

  I didn't really have any cachet as a singer so much. Also, the songs, they were so formulaic, you know, gypsies and whatever. So people didn't want to know me, truthfully.

• 52:51Dax Shepard?

  What gets you back in the ring as a singer? Because in 87, which is the same year as Moonstruck, you released Cher. So you're back at it. What prompted that?

• 53:00Speaker 02

  I don't know. You work.

• 53:02Dax Shepard?

  Well, if you go, who cares?

• 53:05Speaker 02

  No, I mean, I was. You had to. No, I was signed to the company.

• 53:10Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 53:10Speaker 02

  So you were under contract? Yeah.

• 53:12Dax Shepard?

  When you have now an explosion of success with your music career in the late 80s, does that come as a surprise to you?

• 53:21Speaker 02

  Things in my life just stop. It's like you're this, and then you're new and improved. You've reinvented yourself. So I went on the road. I went to the elephant's graveyard. I went to Las Vegas and had a residency.

• 53:34Dax Shepard?

  So you liked the residencies?

• 53:36Speaker 02

  Yes, but I felt bad because people were making fun of me. They were? Everybody. Not me. I came to see you in your residency. Cher's in the elephant's graveyard because that's where you went. But also, I had to make money.

• 53:48Dax Shepard?

  Well, you made a ton of money. It turns out Sonny, you know.

• 53:52Speaker 02

  Was an idiot.

• 53:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he didn't make a lot of money, but you went on to make a lot of money.

• 53:55Speaker 02

  But he had my 11 million dollars. Ay, ay, ay. Did that drive you nuts? I just couldn't believe it.

• 54:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it said that at the time you guys were trying to divide up $24 million in assets, which today is 175 million. Like, you guys have fucking made some money. And you didn't walk with half of that, is what you're saying.

• 54:15Speaker 02

  I didn't walk with any of it.

• 54:16Dax Shepard?

  None of it. So he won that.

• 54:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:19Dax Shepard?

  But then you got the last laugh, 100 million albums. Your tour that you went on in 2002 to 2005 was the highest grossing tour of any female singer of all time. Now just Taylor's taking the baton.

• 54:31Speaker 02

  I was about to say.

• 54:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 54:32Speaker 02

  I never got to that. I mean, people didn't get to that.

• 54:35Dax Shepard?

  Well, your tour made $250 million 20 years ago, so that's pretty fucking massive.

• 54:40Speaker 02

  Pretty dang good.

• 54:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's pretty crazy.

• 54:42Speaker 02

  Also, I have never had luck with men and money. It seems like I'm a target. And there's so many ways to do that with record companies.

• 54:53Dax Shepard?

  So you feel like you've gotten screwed more than once?

• 54:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. And what do you think that's about? I think it was a big thing with women in those days. I mean, look, a lot of men were getting screwed. Black men, black performers especially.

• 55:06Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. There's some horrendous Motown stories.

• 55:09Speaker 02

  That's another thing. You come from nothing.

• 55:11Dax Shepard?

  They rightly assess, oh, they'll be fine with this.

• 55:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. My managers at that point were taking so much. And my business manager, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

• 55:21Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so when you had this massive success round two as a singer, how do you decide what you're gonna do next? How did you decide, do I do movies or do I continue with this music? What am I supposed to be focusing on? How were you deciding that?

• 55:34Speaker 02

  Things come up.

• 55:36Dax Shepard?

  They just present themselves and you say yes or no?

• 55:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:39Dax Shepard?

  But you were never kind of thinking, well, I haven't been in a movie in a while. I need to duck back in and just make sure.

• 55:44Speaker 02

  No strategy. No, just things come your way. I've been lucky. I've been a combination, but more lucky than not. I honestly believe this, there are people so much more talented than me, but I'm lucky too. You have to have a certain amount of luck in this business.

• 56:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Okay, my last question is...

• 56:05Speaker 02

  Oh, I didn't think it would ever end.

• 56:07Dax Shepard?

  I know, I know. I know it's grueling. And we appreciate you.

• 56:10Speaker 02

  We do.

• 56:12Dax Shepard?

  Other than Geffen, have you ever had a man that you deserved?

• 56:17Speaker 02

  I had two.

• 56:17Dax Shepard?

  Okay, good.

• 56:18Speaker 02

  That's good.

• 56:19Dax Shepard?

  I would be sad if you didn't feel like you...

• 56:21Speaker 02

  If it was zero.

• 56:22Dax Shepard?

  There's several of these you did not deserve.

• 56:24Speaker 02

  Well, Bill, yes. Gregory is a double edged sword because he was a kind, fun, talented man that was a drug addict. When we had great times, he was very human and exceptional. And when he was doing drugs, he left. I mean, he would go away and then he'd come back.

• 56:47Dax Shepard?

  Is that the hardest way to end a relationship where it's like the thing that's gonna keep you guys apart isn't even an issue between you, it's an issue between him and something else? That's gotta be the hardest to swallow.

• 56:58Speaker 02

  It took me a long time. And Robert was a wonderful person. He still is. We still talk to each other. And Alexander is a wonderful person.

• 57:07Dax Shepard?

  That's your current boyfriend?

• 57:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:09Dax Shepard?

  With the six year old?

• 57:10Speaker 01

  We're including him in the two, I hope.

• 57:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course. Yeah, we are, we are, we are. And David was wonderful, too.

• 57:18Dax Shepard?

  Did you guys keep a friendship over the years? Cause it feels like a special you and Guffin.

• 57:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, and Robert.

• 57:24Dax Shepard?

  You're friendly with everyone, huh? Even Sonny?

• 57:26Speaker 02

  Kind of. Well, you know, yeah. Not with his wife.

• 57:30Dax Shepard?

  That didn't go well.

• 57:31Speaker 02

  No, because she's trying to take all my money.

• 57:33Dax Shepard?

  Sure. She already got more than she should have to begin with.

• 57:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:37Dax Shepard?

  Well, Cher.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  It's been fascinating.

• 57:39Dax Shepard?

  I think you're such an attractive badass.

• 57:44Speaker 01

  Sparkly person. We're lucky to have you.

• 57:47Dax Shepard?

  I like the combo of tough and fragile.

• 57:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's very appealing.

• 57:52Speaker 02

  If you, you have to deal with it. Sometimes it's not so much fun.

• 57:55Dax Shepard?

  Have you ever joined a marriage? You tried that yet? Where you join an existing marriage?

• 57:59Speaker 01

  He's offering you to join their marriage.

• 58:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I swing through.

• 58:07Speaker 01

  This'll be your emotional support marriage.

• 58:11Dax Shepard?

  So moving with you, she just wants me to get the fuck out of the picture, I think.

• 58:15Speaker 01

  Kristen will be a third you deserve.

• 58:17Speaker 02

  No, not even, not even.

• 58:21Dax Shepard?

  Well, Cher, again, I'm incredibly grateful that you came all the way out here to see us. I love your book and I proselytize about it. I think it's phenomenal. I think it'll blow people's mind. It's so honest.

• 58:31Speaker 02

  I have a question.

• 58:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 58:32Speaker 02

  What's the most thing that you like about it?

• 58:35Dax Shepard?

  You're not going to be destroyed or dominated by unfortunate events. There's no self pity in your story, even though you're entitled to a lot of it. And I like that. And I actually think that's a pretty good message for younger people to be reading currently.

• 58:52Speaker 02

  True, but it's like, I have to work at this all the time because I'm fragile as my mom. I'm fragile as people in my family. So I am always trying to remember who I am, who I am innately, but sometimes it's a struggle.

• 59:09Dax Shepard?

  You say things like this in the book. I almost got my ass kicked for being a pussy. I love it. Yeah, I wrote down, I don't know where I got the balls. Like, there's no thrills.

• 59:18Speaker 03

  Straight shooter, straight shooter.

• 59:20Dax Shepard?

  I almost got my ass kicked for being a pussy.

• 59:22Speaker 02

  It sounds like my mom.

• 59:22Dax Shepard?

  This is not what you're gonna read from like a brand new movie star right now.

• 59:26Speaker 03

  That definitely sounds like the way you chat.

• 59:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 59:29Speaker 03

  It's authentic. That's what's so attractive.

• 59:32Dax Shepard?

  There's a pressure on people to have dealt with their own trauma in a very accepted way. And I like when people don't deal with their trauma that way. Mine was active like yours was. There was violence. There was addiction. Couldn't be more grateful. Ultimately, I'm in this house with this woman and these two kids. I wouldn't change a thing. Right. It's golden.

• 59:48Speaker 02

  She's definitely the better half.

• 59:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 59:50Speaker 03

  I don't know about that.

• 59:51Speaker 01

  I also think it's really helpful for people to know you as Cher and who's so strong and, sorry, iconic, and also know that you were controlled, that you were in positions that you shouldn't have been in. It's helpful for people because I think they think, oh, she's so strong and she just whatever.

• 1:00:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:12Speaker 01

  It's good to hear there was hard stuff along the way. I think that's helpful.

• 1:00:17Speaker 02

  This is how I think of myself. I thought of myself as a bumper car and you hit the wall and you either hit the wall and stayed there or you hit the wall and come back and you go that way.

• 1:00:26Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 1:00:27Dax Shepard?

  Who would you like to see Kristen with? If you got to pick from every available bachelor? Oh, they don't even have to be available. They can be some taken ones if you want. Who would be your dream partner for her? Because I know you think she could be better and I don't disagree. Who would be your pick?

• 1:00:42Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 1:00:44Dax Shepard?

  Brad Pitt, maybe?

• 1:00:46Speaker 03

  He's being self-deprecating right now.

• 1:00:47Dax Shepard?

  I just want to know who she thinks your dream catch would be. There's some people I have that I think are good.

• 1:00:53Speaker 03

  You've never thought about that?

• 1:00:54Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:00:55Speaker 03

  She just...

• 1:00:56Speaker 02

  I dislike her.

• 1:00:57Dax Shepard?

  She's not sold yet on me.

• 1:00:57Speaker 03

  She's not sold yet. Well, you don't have the relationship that we have.

• 1:01:01Dax Shepard?

  I don't have the talent of either of you guys, so I mean, that part is...

• 1:01:02Speaker 02

  No, but the truth is, I trust her, so you must have something that I don't think.

• 1:01:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, there you go.

• 1:01:10Speaker 03

  We're pulling that clip, by the way. That's incredible.

• 1:01:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that's incredible.

• 1:01:13Speaker 03

  But Reese Witherspoon said that, too. She said, "There's something about a smart, strong, awesome, funny woman. If they're with a man, you're like, there must be something to that man."

• 1:01:23Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 1:01:24Speaker 03

  There is. There's a lot to this man.

• 1:01:26Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:01:27Dax Shepard?

  He's tall. No, I'll tell you the thing that you should like about me.

• 1:01:31Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:01:32Dax Shepard?

  I'm not threatened by her shining. I love it. The shinier she gets, the better.

• 1:01:36Speaker 02

  Alexander is that way, too. The more I shine, the more he has fun.

• 1:01:40Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm. That's beautiful. Guys who polish you.

• 1:01:42Dax Shepard?

  So that's my offering, I would say.

• 1:01:43Speaker 03

  Guys who polish you so you shine more. You sometimes tease me. You know what I do is I have my burlesque wigs still on a head, and I have it on one of those sticky things in the closet, and sometimes I go in there, because it's a very expensive wig. I brush it, and Dex goes, "You playing with your doll?"

• 1:01:59Speaker 02

  Did Renata make it?

• 1:02:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:02:00Dax Shepard?

  Don't be silly.

• 1:02:01Speaker 02

  It's a very expensive wig.

• 1:02:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:02:02Dax Shepard?

  And I always say she's playing with her dolls.

• 1:02:04Speaker 03

  What ballpark are we looking at?

• 1:02:05Speaker 02

  $5,000?

• 1:02:06Speaker 03

  Wow. Yeah, I'd say five to seven for sure.

• 1:02:08Dax Shepard?

  Twenty-seven thousand.

• 1:02:10Speaker 03

  Lace front, fitted.

• 1:02:11Speaker 02

  She was the best one that ever lived, so...

• 1:02:13Speaker 03

  That's awesome.

• 1:02:14Dax Shepard?

  And you gotta comb it. You gotta, once every...

• 1:02:16Speaker 03

  You have to check in with those wigs.

• 1:02:17Dax Shepard?

  Six months, you gotta go in there and spend some time combing.

• 1:02:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, play with your doll.

• 1:02:20Dax Shepard?

  Play with your dolls. Well, Cher, I adore you, and I understand, nobody's good enough for her, and I expect that to be your reaction.

• 1:02:27Speaker 03

  Trust me, he's a slow burner. You're gonna learn to love him. Yes, almost too good for me.

• 1:02:31Speaker 02

  And you seem like a good dad.

• 1:02:32Speaker 03

  He's the best dad there ever was.

• 1:02:34Dax Shepard?

  I put on a good show when the guests are here.

• 1:02:35Speaker 03

  That's not a show.

• 1:02:36Dax Shepard?

  That was the first hug I had given my daughter in two years.

• 1:02:38Speaker 03

  That's not true.

• 1:02:39Dax Shepard?

  Just because you were here. I wanted to impress you. You haven't even seen me with my shirt off yet, which you'll see on the way out.

• 1:02:44Speaker 03

  That's pretty premium as well.

• 1:02:47Dax Shepard?

  All right, I adore you. Thanks for making the time.

• 1:02:49Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:02:49Speaker 03

  Thank you, Cher.

• 1:02:50Dax Shepard?

  I'll get you on the next one.

• 1:02:54Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:03:00Dax Shepard?

  This episode is brought to you by ServiceNow. Look, I have my dream job. I get to talk to folks I admire like crazy and ask them virtually any question that I want to. I can't imagine a better way to spend my time. But even dream jobs have some not so dreamy parts, the stuff that gets in the way of the actual work. Now that's where ServiceNow's AI specialists come in. They don't just tell you what you should do about your busy work. They actually do it, start to finish, cases closed, requests handled, no extra work for you. So you and your team can focus on what matters most, which for me is, are they obsessed with male bodies on the same level as I am?

• 1:03:43Speaker 01

  They never are.

• 1:03:44Dax Shepard?

  To learn how to put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com. We get support from our sponsor Lilly. For adults with obesity or with excess weight and weight-related medical problems, it's time to find out about Foundo or for Gleepran. Foundo is a once-daily prescription GLP-1 medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with obesity or some adults with overweight who also have weight-related medical problems to lose excess body weight and keep the weight off.

• 1:04:15Speaker 05

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• 1:04:54Speaker 05

  Once Daily Foundo is available by prescription only in 0.8mg, 2.5mg, 5.5mg, 9mg, 14.5mg, and 17.2mg tablets. Learn more at foundo.lilly.com or call 1-800-LILY-RX. Now is perfect to talk to your doctor about Foundo.

• 1:05:12Dax Shepard?

  We get support from Instagram teen accounts. So we talk a lot on this show about how the world is different now than when we were growing up. And one of the biggest differences is obviously social media. And I think a lot of people wonder, okay, what's actually being done to make it safer for teenagers?

• 1:05:28Speaker 01

  Which is a fair question.

• 1:05:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so Instagram has got something called teen accounts and they come with automatic protections built in by default. So anyone between 13 and 17 is automatically placed into this experience. They get age appropriate content settings, contact limits, so that by default, only people they're already connected to can message them. And time management tools, daily time limit reminders, and also sleep mode that mutes notifications from 10:00 PM to 7:00 AM.

• 1:05:56Speaker 01

  Sleep mode is genius.

• 1:05:57Dax Shepard?

  Right? And here's the thing, for anyone under 16, a parent has to give permission to change any of those settings to be less strict. The guardrails are on and Instagram keeps building new safety features to create age appropriate experiences for teens.

• 1:06:12Speaker 01

  I am really glad Instagram's helping to give parents peace of mind with teen accounts.

• 1:06:17Dax Shepard?

  Learn more about teen accounts and Instagram's ongoing work to protect teens online at instagram.com/teenaccounts. We get support from SKIMS. So Monica just informed me that she's a girl's girl and I nodded like I knew exactly what that meant.

• 1:06:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, but the girls who get it, they get it.

• 1:06:36Dax Shepard?

  Okay, but for those of us who are clearly not girls, walk me through it.

• 1:06:40Speaker 01

  Well, you know how much I love my SKIMS fleece joggers because the plush fleece is so soft, it's cozy. It's really comfortable without feeling too heavy. Well, I went to friend them and she would not stop talking about how comfy they were. She almost didn't give them back to me, which was upsetting, but I'm a girl's girl, so I let her have it.

• 1:06:57Dax Shepard?

  Great, great, great.

• 1:06:58Speaker 01

  So the sleep sets are awesome because they are very soft and comfortable, but they're cute. If I'm in my sleep set, I feel fine about going down the street to pick up my food. I'm still looking cute, but I'm comfy and I'm cozy.

• 1:07:12Dax Shepard?

  Roger.

• 1:07:13Speaker 01

  A really fun thing to do is if you're going on vacation with your girlfriends, to get matching SKIMS pajamas. I've done this with Callie and it is so fun. First of all, the pics are so cute, but also it's just fun and friendship.

• 1:07:25Dax Shepard?

  So a girl's girl is looking out for your friends with better loungewear. I get it. Am I one of your girls now?

• 1:07:31Speaker 01

  You are. You and the other girlies can shop my favorite loungewear and pajamas at skims.com. After you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcasts in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows.

• 1:07:48Dax Shepard?

  I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong. You know what's really funny about this studio?

• 1:07:58Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:07:59Dax Shepard?

  It's almost the exact same size.

• 1:08:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:02Dax Shepard?

  But we are about 18 inches further apart than we are in LA. Can you feel that or no?

• 1:08:09Speaker 01

  Weirdly not.

• 1:08:09Dax Shepard?

  Like you're dista.

• 1:08:11Speaker 01

  Really? Can you even see me?

• 1:08:13Dax Shepard?

  I can't. That's what I was. Let me put my glasses on. They're reading glasses, so they're the opposite.

• 1:08:17Speaker 01

  Don't put your glasses on because you know, I feel like I look better when I'm a little fuzzy.

• 1:08:22Dax Shepard?

  Better from afar. I look best from afar.

• 1:08:25Speaker 01

  Um, happy birthday.

• 1:08:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, thank you.

• 1:08:29Speaker 01

  It's my friend's birthday today.

• 1:08:31Dax Shepard?

  It is. It's not a very fun age.

• 1:08:34Speaker 01

  No, it's a good age.

• 1:08:35Dax Shepard?

  Well, just, there's a landmark 50.

• 1:08:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know.

• 1:08:39Dax Shepard?

  Which we had.

• 1:08:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:40Dax Shepard?

  That's over. No more 50s.

• 1:08:42Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:08:42Dax Shepard?

  And then 51 is just like, okay.

• 1:08:46Speaker 01

  But, okay, but I was talking to, I don't remember who about this, but they were saying that there's kind of a mental trick where you feel, you should feel kind of young when you're at the early stage of the decade. So like 51, 52, you're young.

• 1:09:05Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:09:05Speaker 01

  When you're.

• 1:09:06Dax Shepard?

  54 is when we gotta start sounding the alarm probably?

• 1:09:09Speaker 01

  No, like 57.

• 1:09:11Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:09:11Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:09:12Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:09:12Speaker 01

  But it works in all decades. So like right now, I'm 38, so I'm like feeling old.

• 1:09:17Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:09:18Speaker 01

  But I'm about to feel young again.

• 1:09:19Dax Shepard?

  Young 40 year old.

• 1:09:20Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:09:21Dax Shepard?

  Boom.

• 1:09:22Speaker 01

  Yeah. Optimism.

• 1:09:25Dax Shepard?

  What are your thoughts about turning forty?

• 1:09:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's weird because a lot of my friends from home, from Georgia, who I, you know, is of my class are turning forty this year, not me, though.

• 1:09:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Were you a year younger than everyone?

• 1:09:40Speaker 01

  Well, I was born in August and I started kindergarten when I was four.

• 1:09:44Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my goodness.

• 1:09:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, wonderkin.

• 1:09:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you are a wonderkin. But you turned thirty nine in August.

• 1:09:49Speaker 01

  I do.

• 1:09:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you got a year and eight months.

• 1:09:52Speaker 01

  Yes, I have time, but I feel.

• 1:09:55Dax Shepard?

  From my perspective, forty feels great.

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, I feel good about it.

• 1:09:58Dax Shepard?

  Forty sounds wonderful.

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  The only thing, of course, that is a little scary is kids. I just saw on Instagram, this woman's pregnant, she's forty five.

• 1:10:12Dax Shepard?

  Seventy one.

• 1:10:14Speaker 01

  She's the right age, she's in early seventies.

• 1:10:17Dax Shepard?

  Early.

• 1:10:18Speaker 01

  So she's young.

• 1:10:19Dax Shepard?

  I was just telling the girls on our vacation, we were kind of, well, A, Delty was saying how she can't wait to have a baby.

• 1:10:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:27Dax Shepard?

  Which, yeah.

• 1:10:28Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:10:29Dax Shepard?

  She's gonna really, really do it well.

• 1:10:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. For people who don't know, our life is a traveling circus of Delty's stuffies. Like, the bulk of our luggage as a family is her stuffies. And now there's, I've already forgotten the names of them.

• 1:10:44Speaker 01

  LaBertie?

• 1:10:46Dax Shepard?

  No, I know LaBertie's name. There's a new class of toys that are these three D printed things.

• 1:10:51Speaker 01

  Oh, I know, yeah.

• 1:10:52Dax Shepard?

  And somehow she needs a lot of those.

• 1:10:53Speaker 01

  They're cute, though.

• 1:10:55Dax Shepard?

  Sure, but they're tiny and they get lost a lot.

• 1:10:57Speaker 01

  They're trinkets.

• 1:10:58Dax Shepard?

  At least Groot, we had, like, when we were trying to find Groot at the Monster Jam.

• 1:11:03Speaker 01

  Oh, shit.

• 1:11:04Dax Shepard?

  You're like, okay, he's a foot and a half tall, and you can get an APB on the guy.

• 1:11:07Speaker 01

  Yep, that's right.

• 1:11:08Dax Shepard?

  All, all points bulletin, guy's about two feet tall.

• 1:11:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:13Dax Shepard?

  But this, these are microscopic. Anyways, there's that, and then do you know about Fuggles?

• 1:11:17Speaker 01

  Well, I learned about Fugglers because I took Delta on her shopping spree.

• 1:11:23Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:11:24Speaker 01

  As we, that's our tradition for her birthday, and. She wanted fuglers.

• 1:11:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, fuck load of fuglers.

• 1:11:31Speaker 01

  I cannot with these young, the young generation loves ugly.

• 1:11:39Dax Shepard?

  But we, I did too.

• 1:11:41Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:11:41Dax Shepard?

  You didn't have that? Well, we had Garbage Pail Kids and they were the most collectible thing of my whole youth.

• 1:11:46Speaker 01

  And they were ugly.

• 1:11:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it was like, um, Fatsy Nancy, you know, these are bad. These are, these are outdated.

• 1:11:54Speaker 01

  They're old.

• 1:11:54Dax Shepard?

  Gay Mike. No, that wasn't one, but can you imagine?

• 1:11:57Speaker 01

  But it could have been.

• 1:11:58Dax Shepard?

  Black Sarah.

• 1:11:59Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 1:11:59Dax Shepard?

  You don't know, it was the eighties.

• 1:12:01Speaker 01

  Oh, no. Oh, no.

• 1:12:04Dax Shepard?

  No, they were terrible. Do you, do you not know, do you know?

• 1:12:06Speaker 01

  I only know, like, maybe you've talked about them, but I don't, I didn't collect them or I don't really know about them.

• 1:12:11Dax Shepard?

  That's probably the only thing I got obsessed with as a kid where it was like, there was first edition, but by the time I got into them, they were already on second or third edition. So you really wanted these first edition ones. My cousin Jamie had all of them. He was pretty good at giving me doubles anyways.

• 1:12:24Speaker 01

  Oh, that's nice.

• 1:12:25Dax Shepard?

  When all that is, is like, I look at these fuglers. And for people don't know what fuglers are, they're these little stuffed animals and they have like human teeth in them. They're ugly.

• 1:12:33Speaker 01

  They are.

• 1:12:34Dax Shepard?

  But they're cute.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  I mean, literally they're ugly. That, that stands for fucking ugly.

• 1:12:38Dax Shepard?

  Oh, is that what fugly? Oh, you're right.

• 1:12:41Speaker 01

  Fugly's from the movie Mean Girls.

• 1:12:43Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:12:45Speaker 01

  And it means butt fucking ugly.

• 1:12:47Dax Shepard?

  But wait, butt fucking ugly?

• 1:12:51Dax Shepard?

  I'm gonna go with a competing brand called Buffuglies.

• 1:12:53Speaker 01

  And what are they gonna have?

• 1:12:54Dax Shepard?

  Well, this is a butt fucking uglies.

• 1:12:56Speaker 01

  So is the butt human flesh?

• 1:12:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they'll, it'll harvest, will harvest some human flesh.

• 1:13:03Speaker 01

  Well, I guess the original fugler was a woman who made this little creature and put real teeth in it.

• 1:13:11Dax Shepard?

  Real human teeth?

• 1:13:11Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:13:12Dax Shepard?

  Wonder where she got those? Where does one get?

• 1:13:16Speaker 01

  So I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt that she wanted to preserve her children's baby teeth.

• 1:13:22Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:13:22Speaker 01

  I've, I've decided this. So, so she made this little creature to put the teeth in there, but then people.

• 1:13:28Dax Shepard?

  Loved it.

• 1:13:28Speaker 01

  Loved it, I guess. So now fuglers that you buy, they're not human teeth, but they look like human teeth.

• 1:13:34Dax Shepard?

  This is probably one of these overnight. This person's probably a billionaire.

• 1:13:37Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:13:38Dax Shepard?

  Cause this, we had to have all the fuglers and we got fuglers for everybody.

• 1:13:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:43Dax Shepard?

  This episode is brought to you by Fuglers.

• 1:13:45Speaker 01

  Please sponsor us Fuglers.

• 1:13:47Dax Shepard?

  Anyway, so she's saying she wants to have a baby and I said, when do you think you'll have your first child? When you turn 18?

• 1:13:54Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 1:13:55Dax Shepard?

  And she, I want to be supportive of whatever.

• 1:13:56Speaker 01

  Sure, of course.

• 1:13:57Dax Shepard?

  I don't want to plant any seeds that I'd be judgmental or whatever. And she said, what? No, 18. What do you think I really? And I said, I, my guess is between 35 and 45 is when I think you'll have kids. I said, and I think we'll, if you want to, we'll freeze your eggs when you're 18. You know, like,

• 1:14:19Speaker 01

  Wow, I love that.

• 1:14:20Dax Shepard?

  I'll pay for you to get your eggs frozen. So you don't have to think about that.

• 1:14:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's lovely.

• 1:14:26Dax Shepard?

  Because your issue is just when you started freezing eggs, right? Like had you started at 14?

• 1:14:31Speaker 01

  Well, I think you might have to be a certain age before you even had your period.

• 1:14:37Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:14:37Speaker 01

  No, um, I don't know, because I've never like looked.

• 1:14:42Dax Shepard?

  You didn't look into it.

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, I didn't look into it. So maybe I always had a low count. I do think the earlier the better. Yes.

• 1:14:48Dax Shepard?

  And I think, and look, acknowledging all lucky privilege, obviously this is an option for most people. But I think, given where it's the, the, the trajectory.

• 1:15:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:01Dax Shepard?

  It would make the most, like, I think they're gonna be wrestling with the same thing. Every woman is like, you're gonna want to do your career or whatever the hell. Um, so anyway, all to say, she was like, no, that's crazy. That's too old. Now, again, she's 11, so that probably seems like 80.

• 1:15:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, but who? Yeah. Ouch.

• 1:15:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, gee. She's thinking mid twenties.

• 1:15:21Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:15:21Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:15:22Speaker 01

  That's fine.

• 1:15:22Dax Shepard?

  Whatever.

• 1:15:23Speaker 01

  I think whatever she does is gonna be great.

• 1:15:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, me too.

• 1:15:26Speaker 01

  Um, but I do think she's underestimating what mid twenties feels like.

• 1:15:32Dax Shepard?

  Yep, I think she is. And how much fun, particularly she'll be having.

• 1:15:36Speaker 01

  It's just so fun.

• 1:15:37Dax Shepard?

  It won't be time for her to be in the house every night with the child.

• 1:15:40Speaker 01

  I was thinking about that sim like eight minutes ago because I just arrived.

• 1:15:46Dax Shepard?

  While we were recording?

• 1:15:47Speaker 01

  Eight, okay, 80 minutes ago. Cause I just arrived in Nashville and, um,

• 1:15:55Speaker 01

  Came from the airport and I don't know why I was thinking this, but I moved to LA when I was 22.

• 1:16:01Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 1:16:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I I've never thought about that. I always think like, oh, I've been there 15 years or I've been there 16 years or whatever.

• 1:16:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:16:09Speaker 01

  And then I was like, oh, my God, that was a big move. That's a big.

• 1:16:16Dax Shepard?

  22s are babies. Yeah.

• 1:16:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, if I know a 22 year old now and they say I'm gonna move across the country, I'd probably say, whoa, that's a big deal.

• 1:16:25Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:16:26Speaker 01

  So I I was proud of myself.

• 1:16:27Dax Shepard?

  You should be. Yeah, I I know. Similarly, hi, sneakily, come on, you can sit here.

• 1:16:33Speaker 01

  Hi, Aaron's here.

• 1:16:34Dax Shepard?

  Can you turn that other mic on? Hi, Jeff. That's Jeff. So disappointingly about Jeff, he's from New Orleans, but he doesn't have a Cajun accent. Jeff. Jeff. Aunt.

• 1:16:44Dax Shepard?

  Sorry. And I was on the verge of boring him with the story. Do you remember Aaron, when you and I, we went to, Aaron and I went over Christmas, probably senior year to, we just wanted warmth. We pulled out the Rand McNally.

• 1:16:58Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:16:58Dax Shepard?

  Map because there's no internet.

• 1:17:00Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:17:01Dax Shepard?

  And at the back of the Rand McNally map, it had a chart with monthly average temperatures for cities around the country. I remember this now. Yeah. And we just looked in the the warmest place in the entire graph in the contiguous US was Corpus Christi or Corpus Christi, Texas. Yes, yep. So we're like, let's go there. It'll be warm.

• 1:17:24Speaker 01

  Oh, boy.

• 1:17:25Dax Shepard?

  We drove to Corpus Christi, Texas. We got there and we're like, what is this weird place? It was pavement. Have you ever been there?

• 1:17:32Speaker 01

  I don't think I've been.

• 1:17:33Dax Shepard?

  Okay, mind you, this was also 92 or 3, 92. So no restaurants, no coffee, nothing.

• 1:17:40Speaker 01

  But was it warm?

• 1:17:44Dax Shepard?

  It was. It was warm, wasn't it? So we were in that city for a total of an hour. And no businesses. I can remember sitting on the cement in front of the bank building going like, what are we doing here? Like, we just drove for two days to get to this cement.

• 1:17:57Speaker 01

  But you still had fun because you guys are friends.

• 1:17:59Dax Shepard?

  Then we got out the Rand McNally, Monica.

• 1:18:01Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:18:02Dax Shepard?

  Well, like, what do we buy?

• 1:18:03Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:18:04Dax Shepard?

  And we were by Padre Islands, right across. South Padre. The bridge from Corpus Christi. But I think we were in North Padre. South Padre.

• 1:18:14Dax Shepard?

  And we ended up on this section. There was federal beach for like five miles and like state beach for 10 miles and you could drive on the beach.

• 1:18:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:23Dax Shepard?

  And we drove the car there and this is where we had our, we brought Speedos with us. Microbrief underwears.

• 1:18:28Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:18:29Speaker 06

  You've seen the pictures?

• 1:18:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:30Speaker 01

  Have I seen pics?

• 1:18:32Dax Shepard?

  Of us at the beach in our micro briefs with our, um, we also have winter gloves on.

• 1:18:36Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:18:37Dax Shepard?

  I think you've seen it. Aaron's posted it.

• 1:18:39Speaker 01

  We can post it for this episode.

• 1:18:41Speaker 06

  Hitchhiking with a winter glove and a bikini bottom.

• 1:18:45Dax Shepard?

  A little blue bikini bottom. I don't even know why we needed to do that stuff because there was really no one there.

• 1:18:51Speaker 01

  I know, but that's how you guys have been operating your whole lives. It's just for each other. It's very pure.

• 1:18:57Dax Shepard?

  Very pure. Okay. All to say, we then were there for a few days. We met the weirdest cast of characters who live on these beaches and they go from the federal beach to the state beach back and forth and they live there all year long, but you can only be there for 10 and five days respectively. So they move back and forth.

• 1:19:11Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:19:11Speaker 06

  Volkswagen buses and whatnot.

• 1:19:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Drinking beer, all that kind of stuff. Um, jellyfish all over the beach that popped when we drove. These bros, that was memorable. Like when you're driving, it's like

• 1:19:22Dax Shepard?

  wall to wall jellyfish.

• 1:19:24Speaker 01

  Ew, an infestation.

• 1:19:26Speaker 06

  Bubbles you're driving over.

• 1:19:28Dax Shepard?

  They're like dead and inflated.

• 1:19:29Speaker 01

  Ew. Do they have blood?

• 1:19:33Dax Shepard?

  Not that we saw.

• 1:19:34Speaker 06

  It's just clear blood if there was blood.

• 1:19:36Dax Shepard?

  It's clear Pepsi.

• 1:19:40Dax Shepard?

  Then we were like, let's go to New Orleans.

• 1:19:42Speaker 01

  The best.

• 1:19:43Dax Shepard?

  Ah, we had never been. So we crossed alligator alley. We're getting kind of close-ish. Again, no, no internet, no phones.

• 1:19:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:51Dax Shepard?

  Go over to a gas station, ask a guy how to get to Bourbon Street.

• 1:19:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:55Dax Shepard?

  And I was in there for like 12 minutes and I came out and I got back in the car and Aaron goes, did he tell you where to go? And I go, no idea what he said.

• 1:20:04Speaker 01

  Sure. Oh, you couldn't understand.

• 1:20:05Dax Shepard?

  12 minutes. Don't ever pass the red thing?

• 1:20:09Dax Shepard?

  Or over there, Mark. And yeah, I just came out like, we gotta go to another gas station.

• 1:20:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:16Dax Shepard?

  Bourbon.

• 1:20:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's such a unique place. I love it there. I haven't been in a long.

• 1:20:20Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. You do.

• 1:20:21Speaker 01

  We went to college. It was so fun.

• 1:20:23Dax Shepard?

  I'm going.

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  When?

• 1:20:25Dax Shepard?

  To do the Isaacson's Tulane. Remember, he asked me to come to this Tulane Book Festival.

• 1:20:31Speaker 01

  Tulane Book Festival?

• 1:20:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and I'm going.

• 1:20:34Speaker 01

  When is it?

• 1:20:34Dax Shepard?

  I think in March.

• 1:20:36Speaker 01

  I want to go.

• 1:20:37Dax Shepard?

  Go to the book festival.

• 1:20:38Speaker 01

  I love books.

• 1:20:39Dax Shepard?

  You love it. You love to start books.

• 1:20:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, I do. I finished a book, though, over the break.

• 1:20:44Dax Shepard?

  You did which one?

• 1:20:45Speaker 01

  Um, it's called Heart the Lover.

• 1:20:47Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:20:48Speaker 01

  It's a very popular book right now. I bet Ruthie's read it.

• 1:20:51Speaker 06

  Did you read it with your eyes or your ears?

• 1:20:52Speaker 01

  My eyes. Yes.

• 1:20:55Speaker 06

  That's how Ruthie reads.

• 1:20:56Speaker 01

  I can't read with my ears. I'm deficient in that. Um, but I finished it. It was really sad.

• 1:21:02Dax Shepard?

  It was.

• 1:21:02Speaker 01

  And it made me feel melancholy.

• 1:21:04Dax Shepard?

  For the holidays?

• 1:21:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:06Dax Shepard?

  Well, okay.

• 1:21:08Speaker 01

  Just for.

• 1:21:10Dax Shepard?

  Just what you want.

• 1:21:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. I did think when I finished, because the last time I was home, I finished a book Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow, which is my favorite book I've read in the past decade, and that also made me feel so melancholy.

• 1:21:25Dax Shepard?

  It did.

• 1:21:25Speaker 01

  And then, when I finished Heart the Lover, I thought, I shouldn't read.

• 1:21:30Dax Shepard?

  Yes, well, you should read a different genre, for sure.

• 1:21:33Speaker 01

  But reading has a way.

• 1:21:35Dax Shepard?

  Like maybe a Jack Reacher book or Tom Clancy.

• 1:21:39Speaker 01

  I'm not that interested.

• 1:21:40Speaker 06

  Harvin Corland, wait, Harvin Corbin?

• 1:21:42Speaker 01

  Reese Witherspoon's.

• 1:21:44Dax Shepard?

  Partner.

• 1:21:44Speaker 01

  Partner.

• 1:21:45Dax Shepard?

  Whoa.

• 1:21:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, they wrote her book together. But no, I, um, I think books are the the medium that cuts the deepest.

• 1:21:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:21:58Speaker 01

  Don't you think?

• 1:21:58Dax Shepard?

  You can like form your identity around a book, not a movie.

• 1:22:02Speaker 01

  Exact. Well, I did form my identity around a TV show and a movie, to be fair.

• 1:22:06Dax Shepard?

  That's true. You are susceptible, though.

• 1:22:09Speaker 01

  I guess.

• 1:22:10Speaker 06

  I get it.

• 1:22:10Speaker 01

  I'm just sensitive to art.

• 1:22:11Dax Shepard?

  Was it you that was telling me, like, most of your music you discover from TV shows?

• 1:22:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:22:15Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:22:18Dax Shepard?

  I did have to say one funny thing about my birthday before we move on.

• 1:22:21Speaker 01

  Yes, we don't have to move on.

• 1:22:23Dax Shepard?

  Well, let's move on. It's already been indulgent, but um. Kristin had written me a birthday card that was on my sink. When I woke up, which was lovely, or after I meditated. And it said like, happy 52nd birthday. And I thought, oh, that's kind of a funny bit. Just be off by one year. That's definitely a bit. And then I got into the interior of the card, what was written, and then we went back to being 52.

• 1:22:47Speaker 01

  Uh oh.

• 1:22:47Dax Shepard?

  And I was like, she definitely thinks I'm 52.

• 1:22:50Speaker 06

  Yeah, did she um, did she tell you that?

• 1:22:53Dax Shepard?

  We've since talked, because then I read the whole thing, then I got busy talking to a neighbor. Then I came back into the bathroom and she was in there at the time fixing the card.

• 1:23:05Dax Shepard?

  And I go, hun, did you, you got my birthday, you got my age wrong? And she's like, well, I did the math from 74.

• 1:23:12Speaker 01

  Oh, it's like, that's the wrong year.

• 1:23:14Dax Shepard?

  Problem. Yeah, I was born in 75.

• 1:23:16Speaker 06

  Your neighbors came over and I came over and met them and, and we're sitting there and, and they're like, oh, it's his birthday today. And I go 51, baby. And Kristin goes, no, 52.

• 1:23:30Dax Shepard?

  By the way, I'm gonna drag her a little bit. I mean, you would remember last year was my 50. That's mine, that's more mine. If you like, if you can't keep 57, 56 straight, duh. I probably won't be able to either, but just last year was 50.

• 1:23:44Speaker 06

  I thought she was doing a bit with me too.

• 1:23:47Speaker 01

  I will say this, I, for some reason, that birthday party, like your roller skating party, feels like a really long time ago.

• 1:23:56Dax Shepard?

  Does it?

• 1:23:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. I don't know why, because this year went by very fast, I think.

• 1:24:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:01Speaker 01

  But a lot, I think a lot happened this year.

• 1:24:04Dax Shepard?

  I do too, and I'm having a lot of what you're explaining right now. There are many events. The, the award show season is the one right now where I'm like, we were just at these award shows with Kristin.

• 1:24:16Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:24:17Dax Shepard?

  Because I guess probably Emmys is the latest one. And then what is that?

• 1:24:21Speaker 01

  That's in the fall. That was sort of recently.

• 1:24:24Dax Shepard?

  Is that in the fall?

• 1:24:25Speaker 01

  I think it's in like September.

• 1:24:26Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so probably I'm getting a little confused by that. So yeah, there's all these different things where it's like, well, that feels like that was two months ago. Yet then there's an event that was on the day before that does feel like two years ago.

• 1:24:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know. Time is all.

• 1:24:40Dax Shepard?

  Time is very. Yeah, it's very topsy turvy that way.

• 1:24:45Speaker 01

  Can I tell you guys, now that we're on the subject of the awards?

• 1:24:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:24:51Speaker 01

  Okay, so this will be out on Monday. Happy New Year, everyone.

• 1:24:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:55Speaker 01

  Happy 2026.

• 1:24:56Dax Shepard?

  Even year, it's gonna be a good one.

• 1:24:57Speaker 01

  It's gonna be a good year, I feel it. So we're going to the Golden Globes, so exciting.

• 1:25:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, next Sunday.

• 1:25:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, this Sunday.

• 1:25:03Dax Shepard?

  This, tomorrow.

• 1:25:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I've been on a real ride over this break. So I have, I've been really humbled.

• 1:25:14Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:25:15Speaker 01

  But humbled to the point where I just like, I felt worthless.

• 1:25:18Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:25:19Speaker 01

  Okay, so, so it's a real hot, you know?

• 1:25:22Dax Shepard?

  The ultimate humbling.

• 1:25:23Speaker 01

  It's a real-

• 1:25:24Dax Shepard?

  The game you're playing, yeah.

• 1:25:25Speaker 01

  It is a roller coaster, because of course, it's so, it's so incredible that we are nominated, that we're getting to go-

• 1:25:32Dax Shepard?

  Like, enough already happened.

• 1:25:34Speaker 01

  Exactly. It's already incredible, first year podcasting, it's so spe- it really is so special. I'm so proud of this.

• 1:25:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:42Speaker 01

  So, I'm trying to get a stylist.

• 1:25:45Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:25:46Speaker 01

  And I cannot get one.

• 1:25:49Dax Shepard?

  It's a busy night.

• 1:25:50Speaker 01

  For the life of me. And I really started, like, I was like, oh my god, I am so worth, I'm, I'm ugly.

• 1:26:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you went ugly?

• 1:26:05Speaker 01

  Of course, I'm like, I'm so ugly, no one even will like, get near me.

• 1:26:10Dax Shepard?

  Well, if that's how stylists did it, they like, they like, oh no.

• 1:26:14Speaker 01

  I-

• 1:26:14Dax Shepard?

  They looked at pictures of the people.

• 1:26:15Speaker 01

  They might.

• 1:26:16Dax Shepard?

  You think?

• 1:26:17Speaker 01

  I think they might.

• 1:26:18Speaker 06

  You think they'd rather sit home without a job?

• 1:26:20Speaker 01

  That, well, that is my point. I'm like, don't these people like money? I don't understand, this is a job. But I think there is a lot of politics and there is a lot of like-

• 1:26:32Dax Shepard?

  Also, it's just the busiest night of the year for stylists.

• 1:26:36Speaker 01

  And they already have clients and they're already working with clients and it's like, it's last minute and I, that's when I'm being told.

• 1:26:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:43Speaker 01

  Okay, but in my heart-

• 1:26:45Dax Shepard?

  But for me on the outside, I'm like, girl, this is your whole, this is like me hiring someone to tell me how to motorcycle the ride to the Globes. What? No, I got that covered.

• 1:26:53Speaker 01

  I know, so that's okay, but that's also part of it.

• 1:26:56Dax Shepard?

  If there were anything you couldn't get help with, this would be my pick for you.

• 1:26:59Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:27:00Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:27:00Speaker 01

  But I, I, I did think like, but-

• 1:27:05Speaker 01

  You know, it just got so big in my head. I was like, I have to look so good.

• 1:27:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:09Speaker 01

  Because I do care.

• 1:27:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:27:13Speaker 01

  I care about fashion and I want people to say like, oh my God, she looks great. And a stylist does do some things I can't do, like tailor perfect, like they know things like that.

• 1:27:25Dax Shepard?

  The finishing touches.

• 1:27:27Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:27:27Dax Shepard?

  The accoutrement, the accessories.

• 1:27:31Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:27:31Dax Shepard?

  The jewelries.

• 1:27:32Speaker 01

  At one point I was like, I have a dress. I do. I have this vintage dress that I love and I think will be great.

• 1:27:38Dax Shepard?

  I just had this incredible image of you. And do you remember when she dresses up E T in that grandma outfit?

• 1:27:46Dax Shepard?

  So much stuff. I just pictured you on the red carpet with like seven necklaces, three purses, a bunch of pearls, huge earrings, a crazy hat.

• 1:27:58Speaker 01

  I should do that. I should just throw in the guy. You should just go nuts.

• 1:28:02Dax Shepard?

  Look up the picture and dress exactly like E T as the grandma.

• 1:28:05Speaker 01

  I really should. At least that would be funny. Like, anyway.

• 1:28:09Dax Shepard?

  And I'll come as the little boy in the like puffer jacket he wore the whole movie.

• 1:28:13Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. That would be cute. That would be so cute.

• 1:28:17Dax Shepard?

  I'll carry you in a milk crate, like on the front of the bicycle. We rolled up on the fucking red carpet on bicycles and you were in a milk crate, dressed as that grandma.

• 1:28:29Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. That would be so great. Anyway, so now I'm going on my own, but not really. So luckily, and this is truly a miracle.

• 1:28:40Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:28:41Speaker 01

  But it makes sense. So there's a designer that I love, an amazing designer, Brandon Maxwell. He is an armcherry.

• 1:28:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, thank God, Brandon. Thank God for Brandon.

• 1:28:55Speaker 01

  Thank God.

• 1:28:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:57Speaker 01

  Cause so he had DMed me like years ago and said, you know, he loved the show and I could not believe it because he's amazing. And then he popped in my head, of course, when all this was going on. I was like, should I just reach out directly? You're not really supposed to do that.

• 1:29:11Dax Shepard?

  You're not.

• 1:29:11Speaker 01

  These stylists go to the designers and then they, you know, it's a whole thing.

• 1:29:15Dax Shepard?

  Sure, sure.

• 1:29:16Speaker 01

  And I was like, I, well, I guess I have to. I gotta hack the system. That's what I do in my life.

• 1:29:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:21Speaker 01

  You gotta just, you just gotta keep plowing forward.

• 1:29:24Dax Shepard?

  Bobby Brown.

• 1:29:24Speaker 01

  Exactly. So then I DM'd him and he said, I heard on the podcast, congratulations. That's amazing. I was gonna reach out to you. I'd be so honored.

• 1:29:34Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:29:35Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:29:35Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:29:36Speaker 01

  And so he is going to provide me an incredible dress. It was just really, it was very, I felt like I really needed that little boost.

• 1:29:46Dax Shepard?

  Send him ET as an inspiration photo.

• 1:29:48Speaker 01

  I will. No, it makes sense, though, that it would, of course, be an armcherry that came through.

• 1:29:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so of course.

• 1:29:56Speaker 01

  Of course, like how, like, that's what gave me all of this.

• 1:29:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:00Speaker 01

  But I really went on a real ego ride.

• 1:30:03Dax Shepard?

  Were these, this was before Christmas or post-Christmas?

• 1:30:06Speaker 01

  Oh, the whole time.

• 1:30:07Dax Shepard?

  The whole Christmas.

• 1:30:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:08Dax Shepard?

  When did you hear from Brandon?

• 1:30:09Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:30:10Dax Shepard?

  This morning?

• 1:30:11Speaker 01

  Like, three days ago.

• 1:30:12Dax Shepard?

  Three days, so you've had a good three days. You're back.

• 1:30:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm back.

• 1:30:15Dax Shepard?

  Okay. How was, let's quickly go through a little bit of Christmas morning.

• 1:30:19Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:30:20Dax Shepard?

  In Georgia, how was it?

• 1:30:21Speaker 01

  It was really nice. My brother and his girlfriend.

• 1:30:24Dax Shepard?

  You met your brother's girlfriend?

• 1:30:25Speaker 01

  I did, and she's lovely.

• 1:30:27Dax Shepard?

  What's her name?

• 1:30:28Speaker 01

  Her name's Emily.

• 1:30:29Dax Shepard?

  Emily.

• 1:30:29Speaker 01

  Shout out Emily. She's so good for my brother.

• 1:30:33Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:30:34Speaker 01

  Um, you know, she's like, she's very cute. She's kind of, she's easy. Anyway, so yeah, Christmas was lovely. What about you?

• 1:30:44Dax Shepard?

  Erin, did you get anything nice?

• 1:30:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:46Speaker 06

  Yeah, I, um, I got a T-shirt that said, "Really Great Station."

• 1:30:53Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:30:54Dax Shepard?

  Ruthie got him merch, official merch.

• 1:30:57Speaker 06

  Yeah, and I was like, wow, this is actually the nicest T-shirt I think I've ever, ever had.

• 1:31:04Dax Shepard?

  I agree, that one in particular.

• 1:31:06Speaker 06

  I put it on, I'm like, okay, now this is like next level.

• 1:31:09Speaker 01

  The quality's so good, I know.

• 1:31:11Speaker 06

  And the color and the whole, you know, having had, living in Georgia during that time, like, I was like, wow, this is like.

• 1:31:22Dax Shepard?

  Full circle.

• 1:31:24Speaker 01

  It is, yeah, yeah.

• 1:31:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I love that shirt, and as Murphy's Law would have it, I have two of them, and both of them I've done, where you get one of those weird oily stains on something.

• 1:31:34Speaker 06

  You did it already?

• 1:31:35Dax Shepard?

  Up to both of them.

• 1:31:36Speaker 06

  I'm positive.

• 1:31:37Dax Shepard?

  You're gonna do it.

• 1:31:39Speaker 06

  I think that was my first worry when I put it on was. I'm gonna do something to this.

• 1:31:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:45Speaker 06

  And I even, when I was just grabbing two shirts to come here for two days.

• 1:31:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:50Speaker 06

  I didn't grab it.

• 1:31:51Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:31:52Speaker 01

  Because you're worried.

• 1:31:53Speaker 06

  I was thinking of all the eating we might be doing.

• 1:31:56Dax Shepard?

  Yes, that's smart.

• 1:31:57Speaker 06

  But instead, I'm wearing a white shirt. Like, I don't care about that.

• 1:32:00Dax Shepard?

  We can throw that in the trash.

• 1:32:01Speaker 06

  Right. I mean, that is true, but like.

• 1:32:04Dax Shepard?

  I'm always, when I put it on, I'm trying to evaluate, do I care when people have a little oil stain on there?

• 1:32:09Speaker 01

  Right, it's fine.

• 1:32:09Dax Shepard?

  I'm just, I can't decide if it's even a thing or not.

• 1:32:12Speaker 01

  I think it's fine.

• 1:32:13Dax Shepard?

  Because I love that shirt.

• 1:32:14Speaker 01

  You have to keep wearing it.

• 1:32:15Speaker 06

  I guess this is gonna be impossible not to get an oil stain on it.

• 1:32:18Dax Shepard?

  In these games we play, you're nailing something so on the head that I play these weird games like, I could get, I presume, unlimited numbers of those shirts. There are merch. But I'm not. I'm dealing with the two that are stained that I've had for two months now.

• 1:32:32Speaker 06

  Instead of pulling another one out.

• 1:32:33Dax Shepard?

  And then I definitely wouldn't bring it, like you. Like, a new shirt I love, I better not bring it.

• 1:32:38Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:32:39Dax Shepard?

  Anything I like, I try not to use.

• 1:32:41Speaker 06

  That is so funny.

• 1:32:42Dax Shepard?

  Do you have that?

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  I do, yeah.

• 1:32:43Dax Shepard?

  Anything I like, I don't, I don't want to use.

• 1:32:45Speaker 06

  Yeah. I've like ruined my Ted Seeger's hat from sweating so horribly in it playing pickleball, washing it the way I shouldn't have, and instead of grabbing another one out of the box because it's our merch.

• 1:32:59Dax Shepard?

  Because you have thousands.

• 1:33:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:00Speaker 06

  I fucking hate it. And I, and I put it on my head once in a while, and it's not right anymore.

• 1:33:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:07Speaker 06

  But I still won't grab another one.

• 1:33:09Dax Shepard?

  What is that?

• 1:33:09Speaker 01

  Put it right.

• 1:33:10Dax Shepard?

  Does it, doesn't it sound familiar to you, does it?

• 1:33:13Speaker 01

  Um, no.

• 1:33:13Dax Shepard?

  I feel like that's the shared childhood somehow.

• 1:33:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, it probably is a scarcity mentality slash like, ugh, I messed up, so I don't deserve another one or something. There's probably about, something about deserving.

• 1:33:26Dax Shepard?

  Our guilty conscience.

• 1:33:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:33:29Dax Shepard?

  And we don't.

• 1:33:30Speaker 01

  Yes, you do.

• 1:33:31Dax Shepard?

  We don't.

• 1:33:32Speaker 01

  You do deserve.

• 1:33:33Speaker 06

  There was ever a question.

• 1:33:34Speaker 01

  You deserve the merch of the brands you invented.

• 1:33:38Dax Shepard?

  Yes, I'm not sure about that.

• 1:33:40Speaker 01

  Um, I do want to say one thing about time.

• 1:33:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:45Speaker 01

  My dad retired.

• 1:33:47Dax Shepard?

  Already or coming up next week?

• 1:33:49Speaker 01

  He retired on New Year's Eve.

• 1:33:50Dax Shepard?

  On New Year's Eve?

• 1:33:51Speaker 01

  Was his last day. He had to do his exit interview.

• 1:33:54Dax Shepard?

  And today's the second. He's probably in the deepest depression he's been in in his whole life.

• 1:33:58Speaker 01

  I'm trying, I'm trying to, I think Monday will be a little harder because that's-

• 1:34:02Dax Shepard?

  What's he gonna do Monday morning?

• 1:34:02Speaker 01

  So, okay, well, this is of course my dad. He is gonna do some contract work.

• 1:34:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so he's gonna go back to work.

• 1:34:09Speaker 01

  Basically doing part-time work now.

• 1:34:11Dax Shepard?

  Starts a new job Monday.

• 1:34:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, at the same company, at the same company too. He's basically just like staying.

• 1:34:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:18Speaker 01

  But it is a big deal. I mean, he's about to turn 72. He's been working his whole life.

• 1:34:25Dax Shepard?

  In my mind, he's like 60.

• 1:34:26Speaker 01

  I know. I agree. I know. I hate, he kept saying I'm 72 and I was like, I don't wanna hear that.

• 1:34:31Dax Shepard?

  Stop that.

• 1:34:32Speaker 01

  Stop saying it. And then it was so funny on New Year's Eve, right when the ball dropped, he was like, I have Medicare. He was so, he was so excited that he, he now has Medicare. For him, it's, it's a way, he's been, he's been working the system his whole life, right? It's like, he's been saving for retirement his whole life.

• 1:34:57Dax Shepard?

  His plan is coming-

• 1:34:58Speaker 01

  It's here.

• 1:34:59Dax Shepard?

  To fruition.

• 1:35:00Speaker 01

  Which to me-

• 1:35:01Dax Shepard?

  That's what's dangerous about life. Continue.

• 1:35:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, because to me, I would, if I did that, if it was like, oh my God, and I'm saving for Medicare and saving, and then it's here, I would be very depressed. It's like, I, not only did I work and my work identity's over, it's like, I worked towards a thing and now that's here now.

• 1:35:20Dax Shepard?

  And this is the thing.

• 1:35:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:21Dax Shepard?

  This is what it's like to have all your ducks in a row and to have done it perfectly. How does it feel? And then you're like, oh, it's fine.

• 1:35:29Speaker 01

  Exactly. It's just another day.

• 1:35:31Dax Shepard?

  It's all a mental trick.

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  I know, but because he's retired, I want the world to know that he has a little more time to spend on the SIM.

• 1:35:39Dax Shepard?

  Oh, so things could really-

• 1:35:42Speaker 01

  It's gonna be a big year for my family, so he need to make some time.

• 1:35:48Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:35:55Dax Shepard?

  We get support by Peloton. You know that feeling when you're spiraling over a problem and you just can't figure it out? When that happens to me, I need a change of pace and I've found that running is the best way. It takes my brain out of the driver's seat and I come back with a fresh perspective. Running can be freeing and cathartic and Peloton helps you feel all of that. And now that feeling fits wherever you need it with the new Peloton Tread Flex. It's movable and foldable, designed to fit your life. So next time you feel stuck, you can go for a run literally anywhere, whether that's in your office, living room, or even the attic. Plus, they have classes with expert instructors and programs to meet you at any level and keep

• 1:36:36Dax Shepard?

  you moving. Let yourself run. Explore the new Peloton Tread Flex at onepeloton.com.

• 1:36:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so now we have a new fun thing for Mondays, which is we get to do the fact check seamlessly.

• 1:36:54Speaker 01

  That's right. That's right. We're so excited about this. So this is for Cher. My mom, it was funny because I guess my mom loved Cher.

• 1:37:05Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:37:06Speaker 01

  Growing up.

• 1:37:06Dax Shepard?

  That makes sense.

• 1:37:07Speaker 01

  Yeah. You know, she said, I saw you were editing Cher. And she was like, how was that? I told her, I was like, you know, Sonny took all her money. And she was so shocked. And then she, you know, she was like, yeah, from the outside, when they got divorced, it was so sad.

• 1:37:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:24Speaker 01

  And she's like, you just never know what's really going on.

• 1:37:26Dax Shepard?

  And it's so cool. They continue to do their show after they were divorced.

• 1:37:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:37:30Speaker 06

  Oh, they did.

• 1:37:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:31Speaker 06

  And was she like, real young?

• 1:37:33Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:37:34Dax Shepard?

  Yo, yeah. She moved in with, she moved in with Sonny when she was 16.

• 1:37:38Speaker 06

  Different times.

• 1:37:39Speaker 01

  Yep. Exactly. That was a lot of the episode.

• 1:37:41Dax Shepard?

  She's got a story about like fucking Warren Beatty when she was 16 and he's like a 30 year old man. I don't know the age.

• 1:37:47Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a fact.

• 1:37:48Dax Shepard?

  Oh, it is.

• 1:37:48Speaker 01

  Yep. Okay, we can do it now. So Cher was born in 46. You can do fast math on your birthday.

• 1:37:55Dax Shepard?

  46 for 80.

• 1:37:57Speaker 01

  She's 79. She was born in May of 46.

• 1:38:00Speaker 06

  She was born yesterday.

• 1:38:01Speaker 01

  And, and.

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  Warren was born in March of thirty seven.

• 1:38:07Dax Shepard?

  Whoa, what was her year of birth?

• 1:38:09Speaker 01

  Forty six. They're not as far apart as you'd think.

• 1:38:13Dax Shepard?

  So he was maybe twenty seven or twenty six and she was?

• 1:38:17Speaker 01

  It's not as much as I was expecting.

• 1:38:20Dax Shepard?

  That's not too bad.

• 1:38:21Speaker 06

  That's alright.

• 1:38:21Dax Shepard?

  We can certainly live with that in the sixties and seventies.

• 1:38:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know. Really different time.

• 1:38:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:26Speaker 01

  But what was funny is she said, she was like, it was a different time, but I did have to lie and say I was eighteen. So it's like, they, they still, she still knew, but she was kind of saying you had to lie because the men wouldn't.

• 1:38:38Dax Shepard?

  Fuck you.

• 1:38:39Speaker 01

  Fuck you unless you were eighteen.

• 1:38:40Dax Shepard?

  Or have you around.

• 1:38:42Speaker 01

  Cause they thought you were like babyish.

• 1:38:43Dax Shepard?

  Or just this was illegal.

• 1:38:44Speaker 06

  Depending on what state you're in, maybe.

• 1:38:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:47Dax Shepard?

  I even grew up in an era where it was like.

• 1:38:49Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 1:38:50Dax Shepard?

  Check, well, A, okay.

• 1:38:52Speaker 01

  A, okay.

• 1:38:53Dax Shepard?

  And then B, like, how old did she check her license? Like, that awareness of like, is she really?

• 1:38:59Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:38:59Dax Shepard?

  That stuff was going on even in the.

• 1:39:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:02Dax Shepard?

  Nineties. Um, we were watching last night Beverly Hills Cop Two with the whole crew and all the little kids. And Lincoln goes in the middle of the movie. Just was every guy in the eighties a huge pervert? And I go, I go, well, we still are, we just are much quieter about it now. But the movie you forget, it's kind of like when I watched Chipped with them the other day and I'm like, oh, I'm so perverted. I didn't think I was as perverted, but now that they're watching with me, I realize it. But like, yeah, there's just these random scenes like, uh, like, yeah, let's, uh, let's find the pussy. Let your dicks do the walk in. Wake up dick. They're like.

• 1:39:36Speaker 06

  Let your dick point you the way, point the way.

• 1:39:39Dax Shepard?

  This is like a big blockbuster summer movie.

• 1:39:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:42Dax Shepard?

  And that's how we were.

• 1:39:44Speaker 06

  How long does it take you to shave those legs?

• 1:39:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:47Speaker 06

  You need me to be your groomer?

• 1:39:49Dax Shepard?

  I'm offering my grooming services. He just met her.

• 1:39:52Speaker 01

  Hot.

• 1:39:53Dax Shepard?

  But let's.

• 1:39:55Speaker 01

  Get a lot of cashmere that way.

• 1:39:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:58Speaker 01

  Um, speaking of your movie, your movie situation at this house. Last time you were doing Tom's, Tom Cruise's Cruises.

• 1:40:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:08Speaker 01

  And I was gonna text you that my family

• 1:40:13Speaker 01

  went to Tom, did Tom's Cruises Cruises, but it was short-lived.

• 1:40:17Dax Shepard?

  Uh oh.

• 1:40:18Speaker 01

  Um, because the movie we started was Eyes Wide Shut.

• 1:40:22Dax Shepard?

  No, that's not a family movie. Why did you guys pick that one?

• 1:40:26Speaker 01

  Okay, because when I was flying home, I was listening to a podcast and someone said it was their favorite Christmas movie.

• 1:40:34Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:40:34Speaker 01

  And I was like, oh, and I was like, I've never seen it. I know it's sexual, but I've never seen it. And if there's, if it's Christmasy, like, we're gonna watch it. So that night, me and my mom and my dad turned on Eyes Wide Shut.

• 1:40:47Dax Shepard?

  Ah, yeah.

• 1:40:47Speaker 01

  And I.

• 1:40:50Dax Shepard?

  It's a porno.

• 1:40:51Speaker 01

  It was a literal porn. Orgies, everyone's so naked.

• 1:40:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:58Speaker 01

  And I'm sitting there with my mom and my dad.

• 1:41:01Dax Shepard?

  How's that feel?

• 1:41:01Speaker 01

  And it's like, this was a horrible mistake. And I was like, I am old because I'm not that uncomfortable.

• 1:41:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh, good.

• 1:41:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, I was like, okay, I don't like this. This isn't recommended.

• 1:41:15Dax Shepard?

  But it's tolerable.

• 1:41:16Speaker 01

  But I can.

• 1:41:17Dax Shepard?

  Cause at eighteen, you would've died, right?

• 1:41:19Speaker 01

  Oh, my god.

• 1:41:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, your dad would've died. Well, actually.

• 1:41:22Speaker 01

  My dad probably would've left.

• 1:41:23Dax Shepard?

  He might've left, yeah. I will say, no, now that I'm a dad and I'm older, the stuff I thought my parents thought, they didn't think.

• 1:41:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:32Dax Shepard?

  Like, I'm not uncomfortable.

• 1:41:34Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:41:35Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:41:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, maybe he wasn't.

• 1:41:37Dax Shepard?

  They're like these, your kids are these, like, they're a whole different category of human.

• 1:41:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, I get that.

• 1:41:45Dax Shepard?

  I don't know how to explain it. It's just like, all that stuff I thought maybe my parents were uncomfortable at the same time, they weren't. You're just, you're dumb little kids and then they grow up, but they're still your dumb little kids.

• 1:41:53Speaker 01

  But not the other way. Your kids are mortified. Yeah, you're like, oh, I don't want my dad to be watching this.

• 1:42:02Dax Shepard?

  Nipples.

• 1:42:02Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:42:03Dax Shepard?

  Sexuality.

• 1:42:04Speaker 01

  And what's he thinking?

• 1:42:06Dax Shepard?

  Yes, acknowledging, I guess that's my point. That's how I could simply say it. Acknowledging your parents are sexual is deeply creepy.

• 1:42:13Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:42:13Dax Shepard?

  Acknowledging your children are sexual is not.

• 1:42:16Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:42:16Dax Shepard?

  It's not a thing. It's like, oh, yeah, they're little human creatures and they're gonna be sexual. And they're gonna have boyfriends and that's all exciting for them.

• 1:42:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:23Dax Shepard?

  It's not. Creepy.

• 1:42:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:25Dax Shepard?

  But your parents were like, oh, God.

• 1:42:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:27Dax Shepard?

  Did you ever hear your mother making love?

• 1:42:29Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:42:30Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:42:30Speaker 01

  You did?

• 1:42:31Dax Shepard?

  Well, they lived in a very small.

• 1:42:32Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:42:35Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. And Erin's mom is so fucking sweet, too. She might be the sweetest lady I've ever met in my life.

• 1:42:42Speaker 06

  Oh, my God. My mom said, she listened to Mom's Car.

• 1:42:47Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 1:42:48Speaker 06

  Or watched it on YouTube and, um, and she, I talked to her, you know, and we don't talk often. She, and she said, she started crying and she said,

• 1:43:01Speaker 06

  I am so sorry that I didn't, for childhood, pretty much.

• 1:43:09Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:43:10Speaker 06

  And I was like, where does that come from? And she goes, I listened to your episode. And I was like.

• 1:43:16Speaker 01

  This is why they're not allowed to listen.

• 1:43:18Speaker 06

  And I was like, I don't even know what he said, but I, then I was asking Ruth, she goes, I think it was that you guys were like talking about butch and throw. And I was like, oh, for fuck's sake. Would you ever guess she would be listening to that?

• 1:43:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I know, but yeah, I would never guess she listened to it. And then, duh, she listened to it. If my kids are on a podcast, when I'm older, I'm gonna listen.

• 1:43:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. But they shouldn't listen.

• 1:43:44Dax Shepard?

  I do, I, I'm, I deal with this with my mom, but I'm in a really lucky situation, which is like, I often, in fact, the only person I'm reading my memoir to is my daughters and my mom.

• 1:43:56Speaker 01

  That's nice.

• 1:43:57Dax Shepard?

  Um, and she is going through a lot of that stuff.

• 1:44:03Speaker 06

  I can imagine.

• 1:44:04Dax Shepard?

  And I'm just constantly going, Mom, like, I'm fucking, I hit the lottery, whatever the recipe is, I'm so happy.

• 1:44:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:11Dax Shepard?

  I literally, I don't say any of this with regrets or sadness. It's just like, well, here are the facts.

• 1:44:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:17Dax Shepard?

  But we've had, we've been going through that a lot for like two years as I'll like write certain events and then I'll read them to her.

• 1:44:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:24Dax Shepard?

  It's kind of, I think, kind of good, because then we have a good hour chatting about it all and. Her reaction, I wonder what your mom's is. My mom's is just like mostly, yeah, wow, all that happened and it feels like 10 lives ago and I can't really

• 1:44:41Speaker 01

  Believe it.

• 1:44:42Dax Shepard?

  connect all that. And yet I know that all happened. And I'm like, yeah, same. It doesn't mean anything. It's just what it is.

• 1:44:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:49Speaker 06

  I never want to talk to my mom about any.

• 1:44:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:54Speaker 01

  I know. That's one of these things. Yeah. Cause then you kind of end up feeling guilty and it's like, well, I don't want to feel guilty about this. Like it's a weird cycle that starts happening.

• 1:45:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. What you really want to say is like, well, this is the truth. I have zero resentment against it. Like I have no ill feelings about anything.

• 1:45:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. I'm just like, that's cool, man. We all took a wild ride.

• 1:45:22Speaker 01

  But also you guys are parents, so you could, I assume, imagine that if you heard your kids talking about some horrible stuff, you would also want to say, I'm sorry for that.

• 1:45:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:35Speaker 06

  True.

• 1:45:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:36Speaker 01

  So maybe it was good for her that she got to say that to you.

• 1:45:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. It's not like she, it's not like she doesn't know.

• 1:45:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:45:44Speaker 06

  For sure.

• 1:45:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Same with my mom. And then, yeah, and I think she's been able to say like, I'm, I'm really sorry. And I'm like, I, yeah, you don't need to be, yeah.

• 1:45:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:52Dax Shepard?

  You were fucking 22 years old.

• 1:45:54Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:45:54Dax Shepard?

  Two kids.

• 1:45:55Speaker 01

  It's a lot.

• 1:45:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Share. Very on topic.

• 1:46:01Speaker 01

  It is on topic.

• 1:46:02Dax Shepard?

  You would love her book, dude.

• 1:46:03Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:46:03Dax Shepard?

  I think I might have already told you this. I loved it. She, talk about a wild fucking ride.

• 1:46:08Speaker 01

  Been through it.

• 1:46:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And she's been an adult since she was nine years old.

• 1:46:13Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, okay. So Prim Nevada. Remember she said Prim?

• 1:46:19Dax Shepard?

  I brought up her, her mom's boyfriend.

• 1:46:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:46:22Dax Shepard?

  Was a man with the last name Prim.

• 1:46:23Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:46:24Dax Shepard?

  Who owned a casino.

• 1:46:26Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:46:26Dax Shepard?

  I thought maybe he started Prim Nevada, the whole town.

• 1:46:28Speaker 06

  Uh huh.

• 1:46:29Dax Shepard?

  But she didn't know.

• 1:46:30Speaker 01

  So the casinos and resorts in Prim Nevada. Um, are primarily owned and operated by Affinity Gaming, though they were originally developed by the Prim family, Ernest and Gary Prim.

• 1:46:41Dax Shepard?

  It's gotta be.

• 1:46:42Speaker 01

  Right? Yeah.

• 1:46:43Dax Shepard?

  Gary Prim.

• 1:46:44Speaker 01

  It says who the town is named after.

• 1:46:45Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:46:47Speaker 01

  So that's cool. I looked up, are you born with your temper?

• 1:46:51Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:46:52Speaker 01

  Um, because she said her dad had like no temper. So she could relate to him kind of because of that, because the rest of her family had a has a big temper.

• 1:47:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:03Speaker 01

  Um, it says you're not born with a specific temper, but you are born with a temperament, a baseline for emotional reactivity that's influenced by genetics around 20 to 60% and shaped by your environment and learned behaviors. Meaning some people have a natural predisposition to frustration or strong emotions that can be managed or worsened by how they're raised and experience life. I have a bad temper, I think.

• 1:47:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:28Dax Shepard?

  You like real bad?

• 1:47:32Dax Shepard?

  I have a bad temper, I think. Crickets. I don't know. Do you?

• 1:47:38Speaker 01

  I'm easily frustrated. I'll say that.

• 1:47:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you don't have like temper. Well, no, you have your tantrum.

• 1:47:46Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, those are fun.

• 1:47:47Dax Shepard?

  Those are fun tantrums.

• 1:47:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:47:48Dax Shepard?

  Playful tantrum.

• 1:47:49Speaker 01

  But I don't think I get angry that fast. Maybe I do.

• 1:47:55Dax Shepard?

  I don't have a thought, just so you know.

• 1:47:57Speaker 01

  You can have a thought.

• 1:47:58Dax Shepard?

  No, no, I have none.

• 1:47:59Speaker 01

  It's your birthday, so you get to be whatever.

• 1:48:00Dax Shepard?

  No, no, no, I have none. I'm like, um, I'm evaluating you real time with you as you explore this.

• 1:48:06Speaker 01

  I have a short fuse.

• 1:48:08Dax Shepard?

  What I think is your mercurial.

• 1:48:10Speaker 01

  That's worse.

• 1:48:11Dax Shepard?

  No, mercurial sounds cool.

• 1:48:13Speaker 01

  It sounds cool, but it is bad.

• 1:48:15Dax Shepard?

  No, it just means that you have a lot of ebbs and flows in your.

• 1:48:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:19Dax Shepard?

  Uh, disposition.

• 1:48:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, but mercurial is like.

• 1:48:22Dax Shepard?

  This is funny. We're going too long, but I gotta say, I, I couldn't not observe it. I think there's so many funny gender things. I just constantly see them. And then as I enter different age groups, I see the gender thing play out differently.

• 1:48:34Speaker 01

  But. Yeah.

• 1:48:35Dax Shepard?

  I'm, we went to this very special place in the Bahamas.

• 1:48:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:40Dax Shepard?

  Over the break and everyone's well to do. And I just was observing, I think men.

• 1:48:48Dax Shepard?

  Men just, we just don't want any emotions.

• 1:48:51Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:48:51Dax Shepard?

  And we're so afraid of emotions and we don't know what to do with them. And, um, and then we get resentful at you if you have them. And so we're constantly, if we're in a position to, we're trying to create the perfect environment where everyone will be happy, which can't happen, obviously, but, but you think it can. You go, well, take everyone to where it's warm and it's a nice house. Clearly everyone will be happy for six days.

• 1:49:16Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:49:17Dax Shepard?

  And that's of course not the case because you can't buy your way into just being in a good mood.

• 1:49:22Speaker 01

  No, you can't.

• 1:49:23Dax Shepard?

  So I'm experiencing that, but mostly I then I get distracted by noticing, oh, all the dads here. Like I'm watching a table like with a meltdown happening and I can just see on the guy's face like, fucking Amy, and I fucking brought everyone here and the food's good and it's sunny. Like, why is everyone so upset? Do you do that?

• 1:49:43Speaker 06

  Yeah. So I pay, yeah.

• 1:49:47Dax Shepard?

  You think you can create the perfect situation where you'll control, really what I think as a guy you're trying to control is no emotions.

• 1:49:55Speaker 01

  I know, which is like, guys.

• 1:49:57Dax Shepard?

  I like, I like love ones.

• 1:49:58Speaker 01

  I know you guys only want the good ones, but it's just, that's not real.

• 1:50:02Dax Shepard?

  Not how it works.

• 1:50:03Speaker 01

  And can I, I mean, I, I actually, I can't say this about Aaron because I've never seen it.

• 1:50:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:08Speaker 01

  But you have not, you have bad, you have negative emotions.

• 1:50:11Dax Shepard?

  Never.

• 1:50:11Speaker 01

  Yes, you do. And they affect people too. And that's life.

• 1:50:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:17Speaker 01

  It's okay.

• 1:50:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, but vacation should be perfect.

• 1:50:21Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:50:22Dax Shepard?

  That's why we went there. We all declared this was going to be a perfect week.

• 1:50:25Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:50:25Dax Shepard?

  No emotions. Compact.

• 1:50:27Speaker 01

  But look, that's also your expectations.

• 1:50:29Dax Shepard?

  Like I was crazy sick. So still I'm a bit sick, but like with my brother to New York, you know, really, really sick.

• 1:50:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:37Dax Shepard?

  But no one heard about it, you know, I wasn't laying in bed and people were bringing me things and I wasn't like, oh my God, I'm so sick. But you know, some people got a little feeling less than perfect on the trip and it's just like a big event that they're sick.

• 1:50:50Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:50:51Dax Shepard?

  Is that not a gender thing?

• 1:50:53Speaker 01

  No, I actually think.

• 1:50:54Dax Shepard?

  Others, men that are.

• 1:50:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think men kinda can't handle being sick personally. But I think just because you don't share that you're sick, doesn't mean other people shouldn't say that they're sick or get taken care of.

• 1:51:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:11Speaker 01

  I also, you're with your brother. So that's probably

• 1:51:15Dax Shepard?

  Neither of us knew how to take care of

• 1:51:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, but if you are home, you get taken care of.

• 1:51:20Dax Shepard?

  People do try to take care of me.

• 1:51:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51:22Dax Shepard?

  For sure.

• 1:51:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51:23Dax Shepard?

  I don't do well with that.

• 1:51:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51:24Dax Shepard?

  And I try to minimize you seeing that I need any help.

• 1:51:28Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:51:29Dax Shepard?

  But you're right. It's probably just me. It's probably not male female.

• 1:51:31Speaker 01

  Do you like, do you like being taken care of?

• 1:51:35Speaker 06

  Well, I wish I could lie.

• 1:51:37Speaker 01

  Don't lie.

• 1:51:38Speaker 06

  But I can't lie. It's been getting pretty ridiculous. I like to be

• 1:51:46Speaker 01

  Taken care of. Yeah, good. Aaron, good. I'm glad you're saying that.

• 1:51:52Speaker 06

  And

• 1:51:52Speaker 01

  It's good. It's a good feeling.

• 1:51:54Speaker 06

  It's limited to one person I'll complain to, but I'm like, yeah, kind of been turning into that a bit.

• 1:52:01Dax Shepard?

  Oh, good.

• 1:52:02Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:52:03Speaker 01

  It feels good to have someone take care of you. It feels safe. It's nice.

• 1:52:08Speaker 06

  Well, and I've always, well, like I've always been taken care of by Dex.

• 1:52:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:52:15Speaker 06

  He's always been the caretaker who can't show weakness.

• 1:52:19Speaker 01

  He can't receive.

• 1:52:21Speaker 06

  I don't know how to take care of him. Yeah.

• 1:52:26Speaker 01

  I think you allow me to help you sometimes.

• 1:52:28Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:52:30Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:52:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:33Speaker 01

  It might be harder for you to

• 1:52:35Dax Shepard?

  It's just my issue.

• 1:52:35Speaker 01

  It might be more of a male thing, though. You might not be able to receive help from a male. More than you probably can receive a little more from women.

• 1:52:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that's definitely true.

• 1:52:46Speaker 06

  I've never liked it in the past, but I definitely

• 1:52:48Speaker 01

  Like it now.

• 1:52:49Speaker 06

  I've seen it get out of control where I'm like, I'm like, oh, you're not feeling good either? And I was like, well, I'm not here to do the taking care of.

• 1:53:03Dax Shepard?

  Yes. Now we're really getting to it. Cause I do think a good chunk of mine is like, no, no, we're all in an agreement. We're in a social contract. Handle your business. And like, I don't want to receive it because I suck at giving. And I'm like, don't give it to me because I'm, when it comes time to give it to you, I'm going to suck at it. This and I don't want it.

• 1:53:22Speaker 01

  Even though you're not going to suck at it because there's no way of sucking at it other, other than just saying like, are you okay? Do you need anything?

• 1:53:29Dax Shepard?

  That's what's crazy to me. Yes. So women are great at that. I, my thing is like, I can't fix it.

• 1:53:38Dax Shepard?

  I don't know that you're gonna be, everything I need to say, I don't know if is true. I don't know if you're gonna be okay. I don't know if you're gonna feel better tomorrow.

• 1:53:45Speaker 01

  You're gonna be okay or you're gonna feel better tomorrow. You just say, how are you?

• 1:53:49Dax Shepard?

  And then I'll go like, can I get you, like, can I do anything to help?

• 1:53:52Speaker 01

  And they'll say, no.

• 1:53:52Dax Shepard?

  But I know there's nothing to do to help. It feels like shit and you're gonna feel like shit for five days.

• 1:53:57Speaker 01

  It just, it just means something that somebody is thinking of you and somebody's like wants to, whether they can do anything, they want to.

• 1:54:06Dax Shepard?

  That's exactly right.

• 1:54:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:08Dax Shepard?

  And that's the hurdle I have to get over.

• 1:54:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:10Dax Shepard?

  This I had to get over eighteen years ago with Kristen. She was like, we should go to Africa this spring. And I would go, well, we can't go in spring because you're doing that movie there and I'm doing blank.

• 1:54:24Speaker 01

  Oh, that sounds reasonable.

• 1:54:26Dax Shepard?

  The reality of it.

• 1:54:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:27Dax Shepard?

  And I don't want to be promising you we're going to Africa in spring when I know that's not possible. So I'm so literal and I have such a fear that I'm going to disappoint something, you know, I've promised you something.

• 1:54:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:40Dax Shepard?

  So I'm not gonna do that.

• 1:54:41Speaker 01

  Cause of your mom.

• 1:54:42Dax Shepard?

  And then after a year or two that I realized, she just wants to know, I'd like to go to Africa in the spring with her.

• 1:54:49Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:54:49Dax Shepard?

  That's what she really wants to know. Like, I, we should go to Africa in the spring. Yeah, we should.

• 1:54:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:54:55Dax Shepard?

  And that's fine.

• 1:54:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:56Dax Shepard?

  And when I had to learn and trust is she's never gonna be mad at me come spring and say, why aren't we in Africa? You said we were gonna go to, that's never happened, but I had to learn that that part's never gonna happen. So now I can be like, yeah, let, she'll go like, let's go to such and such tonight. And I'll go, yeah, that sounds great. And in my head, I'm like, we're never going there tonight.

• 1:55:14Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:55:14Dax Shepard?

  I know this thing's happening at four, we'll never make it.

• 1:55:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:55:18Dax Shepard?

  The other day she's like, oh, they did a pop up of the Home Alone pizza shop in, um, on Ventura Boulevard in Studio City.

• 1:55:27Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 1:55:27Dax Shepard?

  A pizza place, Princess Pizza.

• 1:55:29Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:55:29Dax Shepard?

  They did it, they made it look like the Home Alone pizza place.

• 1:55:32Speaker 01

  Cute.

• 1:55:32Dax Shepard?

  Which again, I don't even know what the Home Alone pizza.

• 1:55:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:34Dax Shepard?

  I guess they're just ordering pizza.

• 1:55:36Speaker 01

  They don't have a pizza place.

• 1:55:37Dax Shepard?

  And they order at the beginning.

• 1:55:39Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:55:39Dax Shepard?

  So they make it that place.

• 1:55:41Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:55:41Dax Shepard?

  And Erica took the boys and everyone had a great time. So this is Friday night.

• 1:55:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:46Dax Shepard?

  In LA.

• 1:55:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:47Dax Shepard?

  And Kristen says, and we're gonna go to a party at. Seven or eight, we're gonna drop the kids at the Hanson's. She goes, let's go to this pop up at six before we drop the kids at the Hanson's at six forty.

• 1:56:00Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:56:01Dax Shepard?

  And I'm like, not a fucking chance.

• 1:56:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:56:03Dax Shepard?

  We'll drive there in rush hour.

• 1:56:05Speaker 06

  But you say yes?

• 1:56:06Dax Shepard?

  I said, yes.

• 1:56:07Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:56:08Dax Shepard?

  I go, great.

• 1:56:09Speaker 01

  That is growth.

• 1:56:10Dax Shepard?

  We drove there in rush hour. We got there and low and behold, there was the line two blocks long.

• 1:56:16Speaker 01

  No, you did drive there?

• 1:56:17Dax Shepard?

  Knew would be the case. It's Friday night in LA.

• 1:56:20Speaker 01

  But you went.

• 1:56:21Speaker 06

  You was right by the Hanson's anyway.

• 1:56:22Speaker 01

  Oh, that's true. That's true.

• 1:56:23Dax Shepard?

  It wasn't like completely. I knew I like, I'm like, okay, I'm gonna say yes. Let's do it. I go, great. Let's do it. I'm like, it's not gonna happen.

• 1:56:31Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:56:32Dax Shepard?

  We drive, but I go, but we'll be in the valley. There'll be other places to eat. We'll get drive through. We'll make this work.

• 1:56:38Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:56:38Dax Shepard?

  But I was smart enough just to go like, yeah, let's go. And we went there and it was everything I thought. There was two block line. Kristen goes, oh, fuck this. I'm like, yeah. And I'm already know.

• 1:56:48Speaker 06

  That is actually real growth there.

• 1:56:51Speaker 01

  I am impressed.

• 1:56:52Speaker 06

  It's hard. I haven't done that yet.

• 1:56:54Speaker 01

  That I, that is hard.

• 1:56:56Dax Shepard?

  And then I just, what's suspicious is I go, oh, well, let's hit Sharky's. Like clearly I decided two hours ago. Well, we'll be able to hit Sharky's. No one will be there on Friday night and it's right by the Hanson's. I just from the set, like as she was saying that line's long, I'm like, oh, let's just go to Sharky's. Cause I already knew we were gonna end up at Sharky's.

• 1:57:12Speaker 01

  But that's because you, you know her. That's very individual. You've adjusted.

• 1:57:17Dax Shepard?

  And what did she wanted to know is that her partner was excited to try this fun thing she heard about that could be really fun. And she's with someone who wants to go do that.

• 1:57:25Speaker 01

  That's nice.

• 1:57:26Dax Shepard?

  And I got to give her that.

• 1:57:28Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:57:30Dax Shepard?

  And the outcome was all the same. We didn't go there. We didn't wait in line for two hours like I thought.

• 1:57:35Speaker 01

  But you drove there.

• 1:57:36Dax Shepard?

  But we drove there. Yeah.

• 1:57:37Speaker 01

  That, that I have, that is impressive. That would be hard for me. I don't think I could do that.

• 1:57:43Dax Shepard?

  It's hard. It's hard.

• 1:57:44Speaker 01

  I would have to say the reality, which is like, okay, but there will be a line. So we either have to go really early or probably won't be able to go.

• 1:57:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:57:54Speaker 01

  Um, so I'm impressed that you can do that. That's very impressive.

• 1:57:58Speaker 06

  Impressed.

• 1:57:59Dax Shepard?

  Well, this brings us all down perfectly to New Year's resolutions, which do you, do you have any? I have two and then this is one of them.

• 1:58:06Speaker 01

  Um, no, let me hear it.

• 1:58:08Dax Shepard?

  One is just continue. I'm not going to crack it this year, but I know and I've already vocalized it like it we gotta not be affected by the emotions of other people. We got it. We got to fucking get on this like it's a job this year.

• 1:58:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, I like that.

• 1:58:21Dax Shepard?

  Front of the mind like you're just gonna let everyone have all their emotions.

• 1:58:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, but do you get to do you? So in that case, are you able to have any like when?

• 1:58:32Dax Shepard?

  Don't need them.

• 1:58:33Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:58:35Speaker 01

  Spoken like a true dad. Well, it's the expectations. It's just having the right expectations, I guess.

• 1:58:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yes, true. Had I thought we were gonna go there and walk right in and get a slice of pizza and then we got there and then it was two hours and then she did want to. I mean, luckily she didn't want to wait in that line and that could have. Well, we couldn't have because we had to be at this party.

• 1:58:54Speaker 01

  Exactly, yeah.

• 1:58:56Dax Shepard?

  Okay, then then then sprints.

• 1:58:58Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:58:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I want to do sprints once a week this year. They're the worst. When's the last time you did a sprint?

• 1:59:02Speaker 01

  A long time.

• 1:59:04Dax Shepard?

  I just decided if there was.

• 1:59:05Speaker 01

  Hard on the knees.

• 1:59:06Dax Shepard?

  They're hard on everything.

• 1:59:07Speaker 06

  I'd be terrified.

• 1:59:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, right? Just tear everything. But you know, don't you know intuitively like, oh, if I can run full speed, I'm in good shape.

• 1:59:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:59:17Dax Shepard?

  Like if ever there were one signal of your fitness is like, can you run as fast as humanly possible away from an animal? That's pretty important.

• 1:59:24Speaker 06

  Do you gotta work up to sprint like? I'm thinking of, and this is even a long time ago, but I.

• 1:59:32Dax Shepard?

  Baseball fantasy camp?

• 1:59:35Speaker 06

  It was before that, but it was just the softball league, like a bar league.

• 1:59:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:40Speaker 06

  And I was so excited to play some ball.

• 1:59:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:45Speaker 06

  You know, and I'm drinking and I'm everything else and I'm not stretching and not doing anything. I fucking crank the ball my first at bat.

• 1:59:54Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 1:59:54Speaker 06

  And I take off like a son of a bitch and just tore my hamstring.

• 1:59:57Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:59:59Speaker 06

  On the way to first base. And I had to be the catcher the rest of the year.

• 2:00:03Speaker 01

  Oh, no.

• 2:00:04Speaker 06

  And have a pinch runner.

• 2:00:07Dax Shepard?

  Like today's gonna be day one. I'm gonna do six thirty second. Uh, sprints.

• 2:00:13Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 2:00:14Speaker 01

  Thirty seconds, that's long.

• 2:00:15Dax Shepard?

  So I keep reading is the magic number.

• 2:00:17Speaker 01

  But can you maybe work your way up?

• 2:00:20Dax Shepard?

  Thirty seconds is probably like a 200 meter.

• 2:00:25Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:00:26Dax Shepard?

  Run for me. I don't know. When we were kids, remember, um, Brooke? He did the one lap, like a quarter mile in like 59 seconds.

• 2:00:37Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 2:00:37Speaker 06

  Bill Booker.

• 2:00:38Dax Shepard?

  Bill Booker. Junior high.

• 2:00:41Speaker 01

  That was his last name?

• 2:00:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:42Speaker 06

  And Brady Tucker. Those two are the fastest motherfuckers.

• 2:00:47Dax Shepard?

  Brady Tucker is built like sliced alone in age grade.

• 2:00:51Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:00:51Dax Shepard?

  So muscular.

• 2:00:52Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 2:00:53Dax Shepard?

  Anywho, so I'll probably run at like 70% today. So I don't tear anything.

• 2:00:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, don't want your birthday get hurt.

• 2:01:00Dax Shepard?

  But within four sessions, I intend on running as fast as I can for those 30 seconds.

• 2:01:04Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:01:05Dax Shepard?

  I hope I won't rip anything, given that.

• 2:01:07Speaker 01

  Just stretch. Make sure you're stretching.

• 2:01:09Dax Shepard?

  Really stretch.

• 2:01:09Speaker 06

  I hate stretching.

• 2:01:10Speaker 01

  I also tore my hamstring in high school.

• 2:01:13Dax Shepard?

  I don't stretch.

• 2:01:13Speaker 06

  I don't stretch ever.

• 2:01:15Speaker 01

  No, the older you get, you have to start stretching.

• 2:01:19Dax Shepard?

  I believe in a warm up, but I don't believe in a stretch.

• 2:01:21Speaker 06

  Stretching is, yeah, it does negative things for me. I, and I know pickleball and everyone laughs at it, but like I walk into where we play pickleball and every fucking asshole is doing the most stretches.

• 2:01:32Speaker 01

  You have to do it, Aaron.

• 2:01:34Speaker 06

  Oh my, give me a break. I mean, come on, right?

• 2:01:39Dax Shepard?

  Let's get real.

• 2:01:39Speaker 06

  I play every day and I don't stretch.

• 2:01:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:42Speaker 06

  I shouldn't said that out loud.

• 2:01:43Speaker 01

  You're gonna rip something. You're gonna rip something.

• 2:01:48Speaker 01

  Okay, mine year's resolution is stretching.

• 2:01:51Dax Shepard?

  It was?

• 2:01:53Speaker 01

  I might see now because I do want to stretch.

• 2:01:56Dax Shepard?

  No, you need weight training.

• 2:01:57Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, I do. I have to get back into that, but.

• 2:02:00Dax Shepard?

  Your farmer carries.

• 2:02:01Speaker 01

  My farmer. I did do some accidental farmer's carries over the break because of shopping.

• 2:02:06Dax Shepard?

  Oh, sure, sure, sure.

• 2:02:07Speaker 01

  And that was, I was carrying a lacrosse say and all this other trip.

• 2:02:11Dax Shepard?

  Jogging this trip? Cause you generally jog on your trips to Georgia.

• 2:02:14Speaker 01

  Normally I'm very good at exercise when I'm home and I was not.

• 2:02:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's okay.

• 2:02:20Speaker 01

  I need to do my exercises, but I will. Um, that's, yes, that is a resolution to get back in a routine, a workout routine. And I had another one, but I forgot it.

• 2:02:34Speaker 01

  I feel like that wasn't obviously that good.

• 2:02:37Dax Shepard?

  More mercurial?

• 2:02:39Speaker 01

  No, I guess less mercurial.

• 2:02:43Speaker 01

  I don't know. Um, oh, well, one that we kind of talked about on the Christmas special is I do. I want to get, I want to have um, a looser grip on, on change.

• 2:02:56Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 2:02:56Speaker 01

  I want to accept change more.

• 2:02:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:02:59Speaker 01

  And not be so scared of it. So, yeah.

• 2:03:01Dax Shepard?

  All these things are the exact same thing, by the way.

• 2:03:04Speaker 01

  Control.

• 2:03:04Dax Shepard?

  Funny enough. Yeah. And also just this like, if you could start by telling yourself like, I'm not going to die. Like, okay, she wants to go to this pizza place. There's no way it's gonna work. But at the end of that, no one's gonna shoot me in the head.

• 2:03:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:03:17Dax Shepard?

  I'm not gonna be in pain. Like, things don't go my way.

• 2:03:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:03:20Dax Shepard?

  But I'll be just fine. That's hard to, uh, for me to believe.

• 2:03:26Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:03:26Dax Shepard?

  That if I don't get my way, I will be upset.

• 2:03:28Speaker 01

  But it's not even a, okay, I'm gonna give you a little something here, though. That's not not get your way. That's do something you know is not gonna work out.

• 2:03:37Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 2:03:38Speaker 01

  That's different.

• 2:03:39Dax Shepard?

  That's true. That's true. That's true.

• 2:03:40Speaker 01

  It's like you're entering a situation that you know is doomed.

• 2:03:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:03:46Speaker 01

  And that I think is hard.

• 2:03:48Dax Shepard?

  And also, it won't kill me.

• 2:03:50Speaker 01

  It won't kill you. You're right.

• 2:03:51Dax Shepard?

  It's fine. If I can just get to the part where it's, is it like your control self? It's like, they're doing this and they're doing, you know, whatever the thing is that's stressing you out.

• 2:03:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:03:59Dax Shepard?

  And you're like, yeah, and then I'll also be fine.

• 2:04:02Speaker 01

  I know. It's, it is also sort of um, cousins to getting taken advantage of and, and things like that.

• 2:04:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:04:12Speaker 01

  Like, they don't respect my time. They don't, you know.

• 2:04:14Dax Shepard?

  But again, we know it's like, none of it's that deep. No one's even thinking about us.

• 2:04:17Speaker 01

  Well, I know, but then I don't like that.

• 2:04:19Dax Shepard?

  That's a thing.

• 2:04:20Speaker 01

  Yeah. I don't like that there's zero thought about

• 2:04:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:04:26Speaker 01

  the other people. Um, who did Phil Spector murder? He murdered actress Lana Clarkson. Uh, finding her dead from a gunshot wound in his California mansion in 2003. He was later convicted of second degree murder and sentenced to 19 years to life in prison, dying in custody in 2021.

• 2:04:46Dax Shepard?

  Always dead.

• 2:04:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:04:48Dax Shepard?

  Can you visually picture what he looks like?

• 2:04:50Speaker 01

  No.

• 2:04:50Dax Shepard?

  He's insane looking.

• 2:04:51Speaker 01

  I'm gonna look it up.

• 2:04:52Dax Shepard?

  Google a picture of him. You can, can you picture Phil Spector?

• 2:04:54Speaker 06

  I sure can.

• 2:04:55Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:04:56Speaker 06

  He looked the same.

• 2:04:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Scary.

• 2:05:00Speaker 01

  He looks scary. Why is his hair like that?

• 2:05:03Dax Shepard?

  He looks like a murderer.

• 2:05:04Speaker 06

  I can't believe how many women he worked with. Oh, yeah. Wasn't he?

• 2:05:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:05:09Speaker 06

  Ike and Tina.

• 2:05:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I think he did all that. He, he, he was doing Sonny and Cher. All the Motown stuff.

• 2:05:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, Ike and Tina, yeah, you're right. John Lennon.

• 2:05:21Dax Shepard?

  The Wall of Sound, that was his.

• 2:05:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, Wall of Sound. Good job. Okay, you said hundred, you, you were giving her like credit for all the stuff she did. And you said a hundred million albums? Which, what's the, I'm kind of confused. So she sold over a hundred million records.

• 2:05:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:41Speaker 01

  But I think albums means like how many you're putting out, right?

• 2:05:44Dax Shepard?

  No, albums, records, same.

• 2:05:45Speaker 01

  Same thing?

• 2:05:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:05:47Dax Shepard?

  Was that number right?

• 2:05:48Speaker 01

  Over a hundred million records.

• 2:05:49Dax Shepard?

  That's fucking crazy.

• 2:05:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:05:51Dax Shepard?

  I was just, I saw this over the break. I saw a list of the top 50 rap albums of all time.

• 2:05:58Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:05:59Dax Shepard?

  What would you do off the top of your head? Like, what do you guys think? Who's leading that?

• 2:06:04Speaker 06

  Um, like a single record or artist?

• 2:06:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it was like per album, like number one rap album of all time sold. And I'll give you a hint. It was like, I think it was 51 million copies.

• 2:06:17Speaker 01

  Eminem.

• 2:06:17Dax Shepard?

  Boom. Eminem was five of the top 10.

• 2:06:22Speaker 06

  Oh, wow.

• 2:06:23Dax Shepard?

  Jay-Z wasn't, he didn't show up on the list until like 40. I think his biggest album had like seven million. I was saying to Kristen after I read that list, I was like, the industry's weird. Like Jay-Z's a billionaire. And he's in 38th with only one album on the list.

• 2:06:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:40Dax Shepard?

  And I was thinking like, what you're really talking about is like the monetization of cool.

• 2:06:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:46Dax Shepard?

  And cachet.

• 2:06:47Speaker 01

  Cachet.

• 2:06:48Dax Shepard?

  Like, it's so weird. Jay-Z doesn't have these 50 million, but he, we all know he's the coolest motherfucker to ever do it. And so if he has clothes, I want those. And if he has this, like, it's just interesting how you can skin a cat.

• 2:07:00Speaker 01

  The, the respect that comes with some people.

• 2:07:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:03Speaker 01

  It's worth a lot.

• 2:07:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like MC Hammer's above him.

• 2:07:07Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:07:08Dax Shepard?

  In like number eight or some shit with the, you know.

• 2:07:11Speaker 06

  No one's wearing those pants.

• 2:07:12Dax Shepard?

  No one's wearing those pants and he's not a billionaire.

• 2:07:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:14Speaker 06

  I still say proper, though.

• 2:07:16Dax Shepard?

  You do, yeah.

• 2:07:18Speaker 01

  But, I mean, it is, to me, the reason I picked it is because white people listened to Eminem. So.

• 2:07:29Speaker 06

  White people listen to.

• 2:07:30Dax Shepard?

  They listen to all rap.

• 2:07:31Speaker 01

  But not all white people.

• 2:07:33Speaker 06

  Hmm, yeah.

• 2:07:34Speaker 01

  In, in certain areas, they don't. And they would listen to Eminem. So I feel like he was really universal.

• 2:07:43Speaker 06

  Hmm, I remember thinking, I remember when his album came out, the first one, which was ninety-nine, maybe? Or, close to that, two thousand?

• 2:07:52Speaker 01

  Mom Spaghetti?

• 2:07:53Speaker 06

  Um, My Name Is.

• 2:07:56Dax Shepard?

  Slim Shady.

• 2:07:57Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah. And, um, The Real Slim Shady, whatever the fucking album was. I remember being at the Detroit Fireworks, um, like, in a sea of craziness, if you remember.

• 2:08:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:08:11Speaker 06

  I think that was one of the last years I went. I was like, why do we do this? It's, people get shot, fucking, it's like, and you can't escape. Anyway, so I remember that song or that album was playing everywhere and there's barely white people, at least where I was. And I was like, wow.

• 2:08:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he broke through. The weirdest thing about Eminem is like, A, I think he probably is the most skilled out of all them. White or not. His, his, his, his poetry is off the chart. Like, his rhymes are so.

• 2:08:47Speaker 01

  More than Jay-Z?

• 2:08:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:48Speaker 01

  And Kanye?

• 2:08:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah. They're so abstract, yet work. They're so complicated. The things he's rhyming don't make sense. Like, I think he's next. I think he might be skills-wise. But he was never for me. Like, I can, I can totally appreciate the mad talent, but I never owned an Eminem album.

• 2:09:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:10Dax Shepard?

  And I'm not sure why.

• 2:09:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:11Dax Shepard?

  Because in fact, in this case, he was.

• 2:09:14Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 2:09:14Dax Shepard?

  I don't want my rappers.

• 2:09:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, you were like, that's not cool.

• 2:09:18Dax Shepard?

  I'm getting it to get a glimpse into your world. And I love being able to get this authentic glimpse into your world. It's like, wait, this dude grew up in Clarkston by me.

• 2:09:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:26Dax Shepard?

  Did he grow up?

• 2:09:27Speaker 06

  No, he grew up in Detroit.

• 2:09:30Dax Shepard?

  Okay, yeah. Well, the movie, I guess. All right, we really did it here.

• 2:09:33Speaker 01

  Okay. Um, I think that's.

• 2:09:36Dax Shepard?

  Never.

• 2:09:38Speaker 01

  Okay, I think that's it.

• 2:09:39Dax Shepard?

  Yay.

• 2:09:40Speaker 01

  Yay. Happy New Year and Happy Monday.

• 2:09:46Dax Shepard?

  J2C. All right, love you.

• 2:09:48Speaker 01

  Love you.

• 2:09:49Speaker 06

  Love you.