Dove Cameron

Dove Cameron (Too Much, Descendants, Liv and Maddie) is an Emmy Award-winning actor and singer. Dove joins the Armchair Expert to discuss the origins of bloomers, realizing she was a stimulus addict at a very young age, and her fear of offending the gooey duck community. Dove and Dax talk about spending her formative years in India for months at a time, her first music gig singing in the children’s ghost choir for Ryan Gosling’s Halloween band, and recognizing as early as she can remember that her parents were meant to split. Dove explains not knowing she was an introvert until she was thrust into the public eye, growing up on TV while processing her father’s death, and how helpful it would be if we all demystified our mental health. Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ http://www.wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dan Rather and I'm joined by the Duchess of Duluth.

• 0:05Speaker 01

  Hi there. It's me.

• 0:07Dax Shepard?

  Um, this was a favorite.

• 0:10Speaker 01

  This was a great episode.

• 0:11Dax Shepard?

  It was an incredible episode. One of these, I say they, they pop up like every 15th episode where one's so moving.

• 0:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, very beautiful.

• 0:20Dax Shepard?

  And so inspiring.

• 0:22Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 0:23Dax Shepard?

  To do this job to eternity.

• 0:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:26Dax Shepard?

  To sit down with a stranger and like, a very special intimate exchange.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. Lucky as hell.

• 0:33Dax Shepard?

  So nice. Dove Cameron. By the way, when I came in after this and I'm talking to the girls brushing their teeth, they don't ever care who I.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 0:43Dax Shepard?

  You know, and sat with that day. And I said, oh man, I had a great interview with this actor Dove Cameron and they flipped out. They couldn't believe it.

• 0:54Speaker 01

  She hits a lot of markets. It's kind of funny. Uh, we, uh, Anna was over watching our Sunday night shows before we recorded and I said, oh, we're having Dove Cameron this week. And she was like, oh, my brother loves Dove Cameron.

• 1:07Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 1:08Speaker 01

  And then also her mom.

• 1:09Dax Shepard?

  And the mom.

• 1:10Speaker 01

  Yeah. Calvin. And Calvin.

• 1:13Dax Shepard?

  Calvin loves Dove.

• 1:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14Dax Shepard?

  Well, she's an Emmy award-winning actor and singer. Descendants, Livin' Maddie, Shameless, Cloud Nine, her album, Alchemical, Alchemical?

• 1:26Speaker 01

  Which we learn about.

• 1:27Dax Shepard?

  I learned how to pronounce it and I've already forgotten. And volume one is already out. And she has a new single out right now, Too Much. It's a great song and it's really blowing up.

• 1:37Speaker 01

  Ooh, lovely.

• 1:38Dax Shepard?

  As I would want for her.

• 1:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40Dax Shepard?

  This was awesome.

• 1:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. And please enjoy it.

• 1:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, please enjoy Dove Cameron. We get support from Quince.

• 1:46Speaker 01

  Okay. Can we talk about the fact that the holidays are already here? It's crazy. I feel like I blinked and now we're in gifting season, which I'm not really mad about because I do love giving gifts and Quince is making it so easy to find something great for everyone on my list, including myself. Cause let's be honest, self-gifting is a love language.

• 2:06Dax Shepard?

  Quince is seriously the gift that keeps on giving. Their high-quality. Stables are made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, 14 karat gold and Italian leather. Full on luxury quality at prices that won't wreck your holiday budget.

• 2:22Speaker 01

  It's the dream. The cashmere sweater is starting at $60. Down jackets, wool outerwear, cashmere accessories. You and everyone on your list are staying cozy and looking incredible all season long.

• 2:33Dax Shepard?

  Well, I'm gonna tell you this, it just got chilly for the first time this year in California. And I'm so excited and I'm wearing my Quince cashmere right now.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  It's great.

• 2:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and I am going to gift this to some of my friends. I hope they're not listening.

• 2:45Speaker 01

  Quince is also more than clothing. They've got fine jewelry for your significant other, leather bags for your bestie, hotel quality bedding to set up your guest rooms, chef grade cookware. That's an amazing thing they offer here. And it's such a good gift because people don't like buying cookware for themselves, but it's very important. And they also have five star luggage, another good gift that people don't like buying for themselves.

• 3:07Dax Shepard?

  Give the gift of quality this holiday season. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show. We get support from Gusto. So here's the thing about running a small business that nobody romanticizes. It's not the big idea that wears you down, it's the payroll, the tax filings, the wait, do I need workers comp for this stuff? That's the part that quietly eats away your whole afternoon, which is where Gusto comes in. Gusto is online payroll and benefits software built for small businesses.

• 3:52Dax Shepard?

  It's all in one, remote friendly and incredibly easy to use. So you can pay onboard and support your team from anywhere. They handle automatic tax filing, direct deposits, health benefits, 401k, all of it. And you get unlimited payroll runs for one monthly price. No hidden fees, no surprises. If something tricky comes up, you've got direct access to certified HR experts who actually know what they're talking about. And they're ranked number one on G2's highest satisfied. Faction products list for 2026 entrusted by over 500,000 small businesses. That's not nothing. Try Gusto today at gusto.com slash DAX and get three months free when you run your first payroll.

• 4:33Dax Shepard?

  That's three months of free payroll at gusto.com slash DAX. Again, that's gusto.com slash DAX.

• 4:59Dax Shepard?

  What are bloomers, guys?

• 5:00Speaker 02

  I know a bloomer. I know a bloomer. I'm all about a bloomer.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  They originated in cheerleading.

• 5:05Speaker 02

  Some of them can be late, some of them can be early.

• 5:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:08Dax Shepard?

  Wait.

• 5:08Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a funny joke.

• 5:10Dax Shepard?

  Okay. Oh, late bloomer, early bloomer.

• 5:12Speaker 01

  That's like something that would be on connections.

• 5:15Dax Shepard?

  Yes. Do you play connections?

• 5:16Speaker 02

  I hate that I don't know what that is.

• 5:18Dax Shepard?

  It's a New York Times puzzle and it has 16 words and you have to put those words into four groups. So they're associated. It's increasing hardness.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:29Dax Shepard?

  Okay. You would get the first for you, but oh, day. That's easy. But then it gets hard.

• 5:33Speaker 02

  And then it gets horrid.

• 5:34Dax Shepard?

  Horrid.

• 5:34Speaker 02

  It gets horrid.

• 5:36Dax Shepard?

  Extremely horrid. What's happening with your teeth? I'm already jealous.

• 5:39Speaker 02

  My tooth gems?

• 5:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 5:41Speaker 01

  That's cool. You're very cool.

• 5:43Dax Shepard?

  I've been circling. I want a gold tooth cap.

• 5:47Speaker 02

  I have a girlfriend who has a gold tooth cap and it is so cute.

• 5:50Dax Shepard?

  Can you connect me with her gold capist?

• 5:52Speaker 02

  Absolutely. Oh my God, I can't believe I'm already making connections.

• 5:57Speaker 01

  Oh my God. Wow.

• 6:01Speaker 02

  I have a question because I'm just first time sitting in this. Is there a way to angle the camera so I'm not flashing everybody?

• 6:07Speaker 01

  That's a great, that's a great.

• 6:09Speaker 02

  Okay, gorgeous. I love it because there's so many cameras that I don't know what you're catching. And I always just like to like mission statement.

• 6:16Dax Shepard?

  I don't desire to have my.

• 6:18Speaker 02

  To show my ass. I don't desire or aspire to have my ass out.

• 6:25Speaker 01

  It would be so annoying if we did film this whole thing and then we were like. Like uh-oh.

• 6:30Speaker 02

  I've been on TV for so long. You gotta ask these things. Cause someone's gonna be like, oh, your ass was out the whole time.

• 6:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:36Dax Shepard?

  And no one thought to tell me.

• 6:38Speaker 02

  No one thought to tell me.

• 6:39Dax Shepard?

  I've gotten brattier over the years, more protective of myself.

• 6:43Speaker 02

  I've gotten brattier.

• 6:44Dax Shepard?

  It happens when I do stuff with Kristen. They'll block it where they want me on her left side. And we're like, no, we don't do that. I'm always on her right side. And then Monica and I do stuff too. And it's like, I'm so sorry, but I gotta be on her right side.

• 6:56Speaker 02

  So wait, is that because of the girl's side or your side?

• 6:58Speaker 01

  He likes one side.

• 6:59Dax Shepard?

  Yes, this side.

• 7:01Speaker 02

  I like one side too.

• 7:02Dax Shepard?

  What side?

• 7:02Speaker 02

  We can never be photographed together because we're the same side.

• 7:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, we could.

• 7:06Speaker 02

  Prom.

• 7:06Dax Shepard?

  We would always do profile.

• 7:08Speaker 02

  We could prom it. I just have a stronger symmetry on the right side. Like my jaw is more defined on this side. I have a slight difference in the tip of my nose. I also think maybe this eye is like slightly bigger. I'm sure it's an insanity.

• 7:20Dax Shepard?

  You do have a very powerful mandible like Kristen.

• 7:22Speaker 02

  My jaw?

• 7:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's very powerful.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  Oh, I've never heard that.

• 7:26Dax Shepard?

  You haven't?

• 7:26Speaker 02

  Oh my God, I'll take it. I love a powerful mandible.

• 7:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, mandibles, it's essential for chewing.

• 7:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm trying hard. I got chin filler.

• 7:34Dax Shepard?

  Make it pop.

• 7:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, try to pretend like I have a strong mandible.

• 7:37Speaker 02

  You've got this beautiful thing happening where you have a very small face and huge features.

• 7:40Dax Shepard?

  Bingo. I've been playing that out for years now. Almost cartoonish, the proportions of the eyes.

• 7:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 7:46Speaker 01

  I've never heard it like that. I like that.

• 7:48Speaker 02

  I was just reading something the other day about the different beauty preferences for all around the globe. And the small face, big features is very youthful.

• 7:57Speaker 01

  I do read young.

• 7:58Dax Shepard?

  And Dove, just ding ding ding. Last night, we were with Rob, who you just met, his little boy Vinny. Is Vinny a little person, Rob? He's 4% size. 4%.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  He's really small.

• 8:10Dax Shepard?

  Tiny. And his eyeballs are the size of ping pong balls. And we were eating dinner with him last night and I was like, this ratio of eyeballs to face size is the most appealing thing I've ever seen.

• 8:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:21Dax Shepard?

  If he could keep that running.

• 8:23Speaker 02

  You should keep that to yourself. He was staring at your son thinking.

• 8:27Speaker 01

  We all were. Everyone at dinner was just staring at the baby the whole time.

• 8:31Dax Shepard?

  And that kind of right sizes the ship because his son sexually verbally assaulted my 11 year old last night.

• 8:38Speaker 02

  So you were just balancing this?

• 8:40Dax Shepard?

  I'm just trying to balance it in her defense. He's a baby Vinny and he's talking to Lincoln. He loves Lincoln, our daughter. Look at that little fuck.

• 8:47Speaker 02

  Oh my God, babe, shockingly large eyes. What a beautiful little babe.

• 8:53Dax Shepard?

  He's talking to my 11 year old and he goes, I like your hair and your body and I like your butt.

• 8:59Speaker 02

  No way.

• 9:00Dax Shepard?

  I like your hair, I like your body.

• 9:02Speaker 02

  And I like your butt.

• 9:03Speaker 01

  Pretty good.

• 9:04Dax Shepard?

  You don't say that, Vinnie.

• 9:05Speaker 01

  Oh, you said that?

• 9:07Speaker 02

  He's three?

• 9:08Dax Shepard?

  He didn't know what he was saying.

• 9:09Speaker 02

  He has to know almost no words and those are some of the words he knows.

• 9:13Dax Shepard?

  He had already complimented her earrings and now he was just moving on to anything he could think of. So hair, body, butt.

• 9:19Speaker 02

  He's like, nice knees. You have good knees.

• 9:22Speaker 01

  He's so ahead of the game with those big eyes and giving compliments.

• 9:25Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he's a killer.

• 9:27Speaker 02

  He's gonna absolutely slay and slay and slay. I also love this crazy combo of you have a protein shake, you have a Diet Coke. I really know I'm home. I come never anywhere with less than three beverages in my purse.

• 9:40Dax Shepard?

  Now, clearly you must be seeing the litany of ADHD messages on Instagram, like posts. Have you noticed this like tidal wave of, I don't know if it's my algorithm or everyone's?

• 9:51Speaker 02

  No, no, it's everyone's.

• 9:52Dax Shepard?

  One thing that I saw was someone saying ADHD people always have like three drinks.

• 9:58Speaker 02

  Really? I think it's because we're so stimulus addicted. I realized I was a stimulus addict 10 years ago. I was little and I was like, I can't do anything unless there's many things happening at once.

• 10:11Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 10:11Speaker 02

  You know something funny? This is just a random anecdote that I have for you. Your wife guest starred on my Disney Channel show.

• 10:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh, she did?

• 10:19Speaker 02

  She came for an episode of Liv and Maddie when I was itty bitty and it was because she was friends with Andy Fickman, who created Liv and Maddie.

• 10:25Dax Shepard?

  He did?

• 10:26Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:26Dax Shepard?

  We love Andy Fickman, right?

• 10:28Speaker 01

  He part of Reefer?

• 10:30Dax Shepard?

  That's where they met.

• 10:31Speaker 02

  Reefer, Maddie, Heather's the Musical.

• 10:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:34Dax Shepard?

  And they did You Again together.

• 10:36Speaker 02

  Oh, yes.

• 10:36Dax Shepard?

  He's a sweet, sweet boy.

• 10:38Speaker 02

  That's my man.

• 10:39Dax Shepard?

  I too was there, not on that trip, but my best friend who's visiting right now brought his, at the time, 11 year old son. And he was obsessed with that show.

• 10:48Speaker 02

  Liv and Maddie?

• 10:49Dax Shepard?

  Yes. And I'm like, do you have a dream thing to witness? And he was like, Liv and Maddie. So I figured out how to get us in there so he could watch.

• 10:57Speaker 02

  That's so cute.

• 10:59Dax Shepard?

  So I have a little anecdotal history with you as well.

• 11:01Speaker 02

  I'm actually glad I didn't know that because I was such a fan of both you and Chris. I probably would have passed out.

• 11:06Dax Shepard?

  You think so?

• 11:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, oh yeah.

• 11:08Dax Shepard?

  And you can be honest, probably more of a fan of Kristen.

• 11:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 11:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 11:11Speaker 02

  No, but genuinely a huge fan of you as well. I was always a massive comedy girl growing up. I remember you guys have a movie together that I was really obsessed with.

• 11:20Dax Shepard?

  Hit and Run?

• 11:20Speaker 02

  That opening scene when she's crying and all of that, it's so beautiful.

• 11:25Dax Shepard?

  Thank you.

• 11:26Speaker 01

  Nina Dax wrote that.

• 11:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, I do. I remember.

• 11:29Dax Shepard?

  That's our favorite thing we've ever been a part of because it was just our movie that we paid for. We made it because we wanted to make it and it's all my cars. Yeah, it was very special. We just showed it to our daughters.

• 11:39Speaker 02

  And how old are your daughters?

• 11:40Dax Shepard?

  Ten and eleven.

• 11:41Speaker 02

  Perfect.

• 11:42Dax Shepard?

  Let's talk about Washington.

• 11:43Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 11:44Dax Shepard?

  Because I have spent almost a decade of my life up there.

• 11:47Speaker 02

  Why?

• 11:48Dax Shepard?

  My ex-girlfriend of nine years, Bree, was from Marysville, Everett, lived on the Talela Reservation on the Puget Sound.

• 11:56Speaker 02

  No way.

• 11:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, near Bainbridge, which is an island.

• 11:59Speaker 02

  Uh huh. The Pacific Northwest is so beautiful and it's full of people who are born there, raised there, never leave. And then if you're not from there, I'm always shocked that you might have a reason to go there. It feels like a Twilight Zone-y area that to me does not exist outside of the people who eat, sleep and breathe that community.

• 12:16Dax Shepard?

  You're right. It is a very specific area. I took to it immediately because her friends were all also alcoholics, which I loved.

• 12:23Speaker 02

  Probably a lot of drinking.

• 12:24Dax Shepard?

  And masculine, they might be driving a truck and maybe they work for the forestry service, but they're also liberal.

• 12:30Speaker 02

  Super liberal.

• 12:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And I was like, oh, this is refreshing.

• 12:32Speaker 02

  You found the feminist liberal mountaineers.

• 12:35Dax Shepard?

  Mondel Ferrara bumper sticker from the eighties on their truck still. But did you go crabbing?

• 12:40Speaker 02

  We went gooey duck.

• 12:42Dax Shepard?

  What's gooey duck?

• 12:44Speaker 02

  I still don't think in my adulthood I could explain what a gooey duck is. It's like this massive, I'm going to get it wrong and everyone's going to be like, oh, gooey duck.

• 12:50Speaker 01

  We'll fact check it.

• 12:51Speaker 02

  The gooey duck community is going to be with it. But it's this massive, long, amorphous clam thing. It's a hard shell sea animal. Inside, there's some eatens. And you like boil the gooey ducks like a clammy oyster. I never liked them.

• 13:07Speaker 01

  It sounds horrible.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  It sounds disgusting. But I remember the hunting process being super exciting and romantic in between kayaking, hiking. It was a very natural North Face branded upbringing.

• 13:20Dax Shepard?

  What age did you start drinking coffee? Because I'll say this, when I was spending-

• 13:23Speaker 02

  What age did you start drinking?

• 13:26Dax Shepard?

  After spending time there, one knock I have on the area is you get exhausted there. It's drizzly and dark and damp.

• 13:34Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 13:34Dax Shepard?

  I was like, oh duh, the coffee revolution started here.

• 13:38Speaker 02

  I have my own theories about how Seattle became what it is because Seattle particularly has a huge coffee culture, huge underground music culture and huge jazz music and wine culture. My theory is the same as yours. I think that everyone was like, it's fucking miserable outside. What can we do inside?

• 13:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:56Speaker 02

  And then you got all of these little jazz bars and these weird little underground city hubs.

• 14:01Dax Shepard?

  Capitol Hill's so fun.

• 14:02Speaker 02

  Capitol Hill's so fucking sick. And then everybody just sort of stayed inside and never came out and it became like this cozy little, we listen to jazz and drink wine. Everybody's like a little bit pretentious, depressed, pretentious, but like you're chill about it.

• 14:13Speaker 01

  Good mix.

• 14:14Speaker 02

  Good mix. Yeah. I started drinking coffee at like 12.

• 14:17Dax Shepard?

  That was my hunch. I don't think you could have made it to school if you weren't because it's just too dark and drizzly.

• 14:22Speaker 02

  It's just disgusting outside. The rain used to be such a constant for me that it was like, you're walking in the rain, you don't put makeup on, you don't do your hair. You surrender to the rain. And then I lived in LA for one year and I went back to Seattle and you lose your tolerance.

• 14:35Dax Shepard?

  That's me in Michigan now. I'm like, oh my God, it's too cold for humans to live here.

• 14:39Speaker 02

  How did I ever?

• 14:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. I got a second dig about Seattle.

• 14:42Speaker 02

  Give me the dig.

• 14:43Dax Shepard?

  It's raining 200 days a year and no one can drive in the rain. Seattle people are going 30 miles an hour on the highway when there's a little drizzle.

• 14:51Speaker 02

  It's true, but I also think it's because truly they have nowhere to be.

• 14:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, good point.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  Not in a derogatory way, but in a healthy, we're living a real human life. We're living slow. Now that I live in LA and New York and I'm really splitting my time, the rushing and the mania of these cities, you go back to a healthy, normal, working city where it's like you go to your job, you go to the airport, you bank three hours. So I think that that's part of it. It's less that they cannot drive in the rain and it's more that they're like, eh. Fuck it.

• 15:18Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so what did mom and dad do on this island for a living?

• 15:22Speaker 02

  So crazy enough, they didn't work on the island. They worked as far away as they possibly could. They had a business out of India.

• 15:29Dax Shepard?

  The country India.

• 15:30Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 15:31Speaker 02

  Jaipur and New Delhi, Jodhpur, some select parts of Mumbai. They were importers, so they would design jewelry and certain goods. They had all of their suppliers in India, which is where all of the silver, gold, all the fine gemstones, all of the materials are in India. And they had all of these houses and suppliers that they worked with. So they truly spent half of their year in Jaipur and New Delhi.

• 15:54Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really? And were you going with them on these trips?

• 15:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I have an older sister and she was very much in high school. And they were like, you can't do your homework on the road. And I was like, I want to be homeschooled. I want to travel.

• 16:03Dax Shepard?

  How much older is she than you?

• 16:05Speaker 02

  Seven years.

• 16:05Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's a hefty. That's Monica and her brothers.

• 16:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, they say that that's like the only child.

• 16:10Speaker 01

  It is. You grew up in two different lives.

• 16:12Dax Shepard?

  You wouldn't go for six months, though, would you?

• 16:15Speaker 02

  No, I think the longest I went was four months.

• 16:18Speaker 01

  Wow, though, that's a long time.

• 16:20Dax Shepard?

  And did you love it? Did you hate it?

• 16:23Speaker 02

  Absolutely loved it. I feel like I've spent so many of my early brain forming amoebas, connecting memories in India. And it was so life changing. My dad was always also really big on if you ever are saving money, it's for travel. If you ever do anything, it's for travel. It's for education. It's for expanding the frontal lobe.

• 16:43Dax Shepard?

  It's not a rad car?

• 16:44Speaker 02

  No.

• 16:44Dax Shepard?

  Like me and my dad think.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  Travel is always the number one to do. And so I was really lucky because my parents were just like, she's so small. What is she really going to fucking learn in second grade? Let's get out of here.

• 16:56Dax Shepard?

  So you did homeschool the whole time you were on that island?

• 16:59Speaker 02

  I was in public school, which on Bembridge Island is like 20 kids. I did public school from kindergarten through second or third grade. And no kid is happy in school. But I was really struggling. I was starting to get a little weird and internal. And my parents were like, she doesn't have peers.

• 17:14Dax Shepard?

  Were you shy?

• 17:15Speaker 02

  I was really self expressed. I was very precocious and I was too much for other kids. And I really, really wanted to be friends with other kids. But I think I was not an easy fit for groups of friends.

• 17:24Dax Shepard?

  Did you come on like a freight train?

• 17:26Speaker 02

  I think probably.

• 17:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I can. Smell it.

• 17:29Speaker 02

  You're like, you're a lot, actually.

• 17:30Dax Shepard?

  No, I love it.

• 17:31Speaker 02

  No, I've really mellowed out over the years, but I think as a kid, I wanted to like, love people and love them hard. That's also around the age where kids start to suss out who's weird.

• 17:39Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 17:40Speaker 02

  And kids start to be like, you're doing weird things and we're not doing any of those things.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  In-group, out-group development.

• 17:46Dax Shepard?

  Your level of intimacy is very uncomfortable for me at eight.

• 17:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:49Dax Shepard?

  Which I was similar to, by the way.

• 17:50Speaker 02

  Right. I feel like so many of us, especially in the industry, have that story.

• 17:53Dax Shepard?

  Because your stepdad hitting your mom.

• 17:56Speaker 02

  I was like, are you? Hellishly traumatized. And they were like, I just want to go home and watch Nickelodeon. I was like, I don't have Nickelodeon. I very much like also was always hanging out with my parents' friends. And so I was trying to have real conversations when I was too little to be doing that.

• 18:11Dax Shepard?

  Did you love being told you were old for your age? Yeah.

• 18:14Speaker 02

  I was one of those kids that was wearing big coats and being like, I'm just so stressed. Honestly, I'm exhausted, like with my empty wine glass.

• 18:21Dax Shepard?

  You wanted to have been going through something.

• 18:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, I wanted to be stressed so bad.

• 18:25Dax Shepard?

  I understand. What age did they get divorced?

• 18:27Speaker 02

  Thirteen or fourteen.

• 18:29Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so does it correspond with you moving to Burbank?

• 18:32Speaker 02

  Kind of.

• 18:32Dax Shepard?

  Wait, we got to add before you moved to Burbank. You start acting at eight. You're doing local theater in Bainbridge, and you're already on that trajectory before we go to Burbank.

• 18:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was kind of the only place my mom could stick me. She was like, you got to channel the energy and you hate soccer. And I was like, let's do theater. It was this tiny, sweet little community theater where they were putting on Les Mis Teen Summer, and I was playing Little Cosette and doing Shakespeare Summer Camp and playing Lady Macbeth. And I was so into it. And then, funny enough, the first gig I got was for Ryan Gosling's Halloween band.

• 19:07Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 19:08Dax Shepard?

  He had a Halloween band?

• 19:09Speaker 02

  It is fucking incredible. It's so

• 19:12Dax Shepard?

  Of course, that bastard.

• 19:13Speaker 02

  So good, that fucking house.

• 19:14Dax Shepard?

  God, what a dick.

• 19:16Speaker 01

  He can do everything.

• 19:17Dax Shepard?

  So hard to like him, but I can't resist.

• 19:19Speaker 02

  Something about him, I just can't resist it. He had this crazy Halloween band called Dead Man's Bones. Dead Man's Bones. Yeah.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 19:26Dax Shepard?

  Okay, Robbie.

• 19:28Speaker 02

  He's a dead man's bone. First time he's ever spoken today. And it's really quite good. I still listen to it. It's very experimental, him and his friend, but they had this concept of having like a ghostly Children's choir.

• 19:39Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 19:39Speaker 02

  My first ever gig, I got paid like a hundred twenty bucks or something.

• 19:42Dax Shepard?

  This is why you're still in Washington.

• 19:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, I played at an adults only underground club.

• 19:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 19:48Speaker 02

  Cause he was there. Yeah, they came through on like a little tour, like a club tour.

• 19:51Dax Shepard?

  And they were casting locally. Whoever was managing that show had a lot on their plate.

• 19:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:56Dax Shepard?

  They have thirteen shows and you gotta find a ghost choir in every city.

• 19:59Speaker 02

  Children's.

• 20:01Speaker 01

  He had big aspirations, but it worked out for him.

• 20:04Speaker 02

  And we're so proud of him. I don't know if you know this guy, his name is Ryan. I think it worked out fine. He's doing great. So that was my first ever thing. And then I was just so convinced that I was gonna find my people in Hollywood. That was more the impetus.

• 20:18Dax Shepard?

  So you were kind of driving this move to Burbank.

• 20:21Speaker 02

  Hundred percent. My parents wanted absolutely nothing less for me than to be in film and television. I think it was something that they felt was kind of inevitable and that was my sales pitch. I was like, I'm gonna do this. When I turn eighteen with or without you, I would really love your support and I would love to start before it gets much harder for me to start when all the other girls are eighteen.

• 20:39Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right.

• 20:40Speaker 02

  My parents split up. My mom moved out. I lived with her in her little apartment on Bainbridge Island and she had just gotten her master's degree in sustainability, which was so badass to watch my mom do that.

• 20:51Dax Shepard?

  A little ahead of the curve for her.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Very like Washington. That was when she was talking to me about fuel efficiency, all these things that now are super common knowledge. Glass bottles are not more sustainable than plastic bottles because of the amount of resources we have to use to ship them, all these things. It was such a cool thing for her to do once she had already had her whole business that she ran with my dad.

• 21:11Dax Shepard?

  When they divorced, did dad just keep going with the business and she just left the business?

• 21:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think he tried to keep the business going for a while. I think it was kind of impossible to run on his own. The business ended up going very under a few years after.

• 21:23Dax Shepard?

  This is an incredible amount to be happening at once for dad. If he's losing this business, he's had for a very long time. That's stable and his wife, he's had for a long time. And then now his daughter's moving down to Burbank.

• 21:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a truly complex transitional time in the family. I'm gonna be thirty next year and as someone who has retroactively studied my family dynamics ad nauseam in. Therapy and in my own existence and my brain and my life. I truly don't know if it could have gone any other way. They were always going to divorce. It was not a surprise.

• 21:58Speaker 01

  So you felt that when you were in the dynamic.

• 22:00Speaker 02

  They are supposed to be together. I think I knew that from as early as you can know that.

• 22:07Dax Shepard?

  Well, there's an interesting thing at play and Kristen and I have this too. It could go wrong. It's gone well. But when you're both locked into somebody because you have a kid and you're locked into them professionally. I think that's an interesting dynamic to navigate because you're kind of like, I'm not sure how much of this I'm picking as much as now I just am locked. We have these two commitments together and that can be hard.

• 22:30Speaker 02

  I think that my mom would very confidently say that they were not a love match. It was not something that they endeavored to do was be together for as long as they were together. And when I moved in with my mom, it was because my dad and I were having a very difficult time with a very tenuous relationship at that point.

• 22:51Dax Shepard?

  You were 13?

• 22:52Speaker 02

  13, 14. It starts getting dicey around there. As an adult, now I can look back and be like, that was fair on my part to distance myself. Everything was kind of falling apart at once and getting very human and very real and very adult. And my mom just kind of scooped me up and was like, we're getting the fuck out of here, kid. My mom is the most beautiful woman on the face of the planet. And she is so astute, so intelligent, so sensitive. And I think she was just like, and look over here.

• 23:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:20Dax Shepard?

  Did dad have some mental health stuff? Did he have depression?

• 23:23Speaker 02

  Very much, but it was more than that. I'm not sure the tone of the show.

• 23:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, it's all the way.

• 23:28Speaker 02

  Oh, okay. My dad was severely depressed, which manifested in a lot of violence, emotional, mental, physical outbursts, very kind of unsafe. And it got worse as I got older. And especially when my sister left to go to college and I was the only kid. And I was also dealing with my own transitioning into teenagehood depression. And there had also already been a really big dark streak in our family because my best friend was murdered by her own father. Other.

• 23:58Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my God.

• 23:59Speaker 02

  I feel like the first eight years of my memory were pretty good. Maybe some tension with the parents, don't really see them kiss, but not as aware as after that murder-suicide, very real thing happened when I was eight. I think it really did shift the dynamic because they were very close to our family and it just accelerated a lot of darkness in the family.

• 24:19Dax Shepard?

  What about your mom? I was like, oh, it can go this way. I'm not going to be around for this version.

• 24:25Speaker 02

  Yes, and also my mom was so young when she met my dad. They were 20 years apart. They got pregnant and it was kind of like, okay, we're getting married.

• 24:33Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 24:34Speaker 02

  My mom is very open about this. I'm not saying anything that she wouldn't feel comfortable with me sharing.

• 24:38Dax Shepard?

  I have the same kind of mom. Isn't it a blessing?

• 24:40Speaker 02

  I think it's necessary. It's a sort of a generosity that you give to your kids because it's really helped me in my development.

• 24:45Dax Shepard?

  I think it's all getting reframed, but whereas that stuff used to cause shame now, I think it's more a testament to bravery and resilience. Like all these stories, for me, they're empowering. They're not shame inducing. They're like, oh, fuck, yeah, these humans lived through this. That's rad.

• 24:59Speaker 02

  I always found it strange, this taboo around mental health or loss or trauma, because I would mention something that I thought was singular to me in my young life. And like eight hands out of 20 would go up and be like, me too. And I was like, so we're all pretending this is a singular issue and we're keeping it to ourselves for whose benefit?

• 25:19Dax Shepard?

  I know, who? Our neighbors, I guess.

• 25:21Speaker 02

  Exactly, you know, sort of like a 1950s conservative.

• 25:24Dax Shepard?

  Who are all so fucked up, they got some shit going on next door.

• 25:26Speaker 02

  How much more helpful would it be if we could all?

• 25:29Dax Shepard?

  You can't keep your darkness hidden indefinitely.

• 25:32Speaker 02

  It's untenable.

• 25:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so you could have that goal, but it's not even going to work.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  But also I think we're already doing a disservice to ourselves by calling it a darkness. I take back my framing of that because it's only dark in comparison to something that we've constructed that's actually not real or attainable.

• 25:46Dax Shepard?

  It's relative to a fantasy.

• 25:48Speaker 02

  Relative to this cultural dream that's never existed and is super toxic. So I'm always very open. I just sort of have a knee jerk reaction to being like, am I being too open? Are you okay?

• 25:58Dax Shepard?

  I definitely border on overshare.

• 26:01Speaker 02

  Me too.

• 26:01Dax Shepard?

  I would love to just make that selection right out of the gates. That's totally great if that's not your jam, but there's no way I can talk. Talk about your job for two hours at dinner. I gotta talk about.

• 26:11Speaker 02

  What is that? I get so burnt out if I talk about anything except for someone's real life.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:16Speaker 02

  But I'll be at the airport with someone who's helping me with my baggage or something, or a security person. I'll be like, how's your mom? And I'm like, what are you doing after this? What's your night gonna look like?

• 26:26Dax Shepard?

  How did you get out of bed today?

• 26:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm like, and where did you go to college? And who was your first love? I love it. I love humans. I wish we could just demystify.

• 26:34Dax Shepard?

  So when you got down to Burbank, did you get a wave of, oh, it's a little less intense here, and this is nice?

• 26:41Speaker 02

  Yes. When I got to Burbank High, Burbank High School, I was so culture clashy at first because it was huge. The school was bigger than the population of the place where I was from.

• 26:51Dax Shepard?

  We have a friend that graduated from there. Yeah, we're kind of familiar with the vibe.

• 26:54Speaker 02

  Love Burbank.

• 26:55Dax Shepard?

  He was also a show choir person.

• 26:56Speaker 02

  So was I.

• 26:57Dax Shepard?

  I know you're a national champion, right?

• 26:58Speaker 02

  My choir was. I don't think I was, but it was so cool.

• 27:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 27:02Speaker 02

  I fucking lived and breathed for show choir.

• 27:05Dax Shepard?

  What makes it show choir? I'm a Philistine. I just know the word choir.

• 27:09Speaker 02

  Show choir is you're putting on like a 20 minute traveling medley mashup dancing.

• 27:16Speaker 01

  Fun.

• 27:16Speaker 02

  It's super sick.

• 27:17Dax Shepard?

  So there's dancing and voguing and.

• 27:20Speaker 02

  Costume changes. It's super full out and competitive.

• 27:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. Is Burrows the same thing?

• 27:28Speaker 02

  Burrows is the same thing and we are rivals, baby.

• 27:30Speaker 01

  Okay, Burrows is where our friend went. I'm sorry, you're actually a rival of our friend.

• 27:35Speaker 02

  I didn't realize I was in enemy territory.

• 27:39Speaker 01

  I feel.

• 27:42Dax Shepard?

  I feel a little morally torn right now.

• 27:44Speaker 02

  It's very funny because my absolute best friend in the world, Veronica, we met because she was in the rival show choir.

• 27:49Dax Shepard?

  Oh, fun.

• 27:50Speaker 01

  Cause it's very glee. This Burbank versus Burrows is glee. It's what it's based off of.

• 27:55Speaker 02

  People were getting their fucking tires slashed and shit. It was so nuts.

• 27:59Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I love this.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  And also like So Camp. Some weird rural California school to compete. And then everybody's like, they smashed our fucking tires. You gotta go full out on that, Gronky, Jay, dude. Like, it was so funny. You better lock in on those fucking harmonies, dude. Show them where we come from, Burbank. Yeah, I loved it.

• 28:17Dax Shepard?

  Did you hang at that AMC?

• 28:19Speaker 02

  I still hang at that fucking AMC.

• 28:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's a powerful AMC. What is 3070? There's like a couple hundred screens there.

• 28:25Speaker 02

  There's a powerful magnetic field under that AMC. I take my very Italian boyfriend and I'm like, isn't this amazing?

• 28:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 28:32Speaker 02

  I'm like, this is San Fernando.

• 28:34Dax Shepard?

  It's about as American. I always say to people who are not from here, if there is a Midwest of LA, it's Burbank.

• 28:40Speaker 01

  It is. It's very suburban.

• 28:42Dax Shepard?

  It's a lot of tradespeople that live there that are crew members, they're lighters, they're gaffers.

• 28:46Speaker 02

  We have the candy shop, three frozen yogurt spots. Yeah, a Nordstrom Rack.

• 28:50Speaker 01

  That's as suburban as it gets, a Nordstrom Rack.

• 28:54Speaker 02

  I really go there when I need to like crack align my brain. When I need like an alignment adjust, I go back to San Fernando.

• 28:58Dax Shepard?

  Remember who you are. Okay, so you're going to Burbank High and then you're starting to audition.

• 29:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:04Dax Shepard?

  Then you get this pilot, bits and pieces.

• 29:07Speaker 02

  Okay, research.

• 29:08Dax Shepard?

  And you shoot bits and pieces. And then what happens during the filming of bits and pieces?

• 29:13Speaker 02

  Normally, as a 14-year-old, all you get sent out on is Disney. And I remember my first couple rounds of going in for Disney and all of the casting directors being like, please don't send this girl in anymore. She's not funny and she's actually quite dark and she's off-putting. And I was like, fuck you guys. I came here because I wanted to do dramas.

• 29:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, serious acting.

• 29:36Speaker 02

  I was super unshaken. I, at that point, was very not 14. They kept being like, she's not reading as young as she biologically is. She doesn't have that sparkly thing. And the reason that my mom felt confident enough to bring me to LA was because we got really far in the process of casting for True Grit, Coen Brothers.

• 29:53Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no kidding.

• 29:55Speaker 02

  We got super far randomly out of a Seattle office.

• 29:58Dax Shepard?

  Did you get to read for them?

• 29:59Speaker 02

  No, but we got down to the point where we'd been going in for like three months and they were calling us with updates. It's down to you and three other girls, it's down to you and two other girls. And so my mom was like, oh, so my kid's not out of her mind. She might be able to do this. And so I really wanted to keep going out for film. And there was all these really exciting things happening. And Disney, in the least ungrateful sounding way, it just was not on my bucket list.

• 30:19Dax Shepard?

  Right. You were trying to be older. We already liked the compliment. We're mature.

• 30:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:23Dax Shepard?

  You're not trying to get on a kid's show. You're trying to be in True Grit.

• 30:26Speaker 02

  And I also didn't have cable. So I didn't have the Disney upbringing. I saw it at my friend's house. I knew what it was, but the basic like bunny rabbit ears wasn't a thing in my house. And so we stopped going out for Disney and then my agents got this call being like, we have a Disney thing, but it's being directed by a guy who mostly does film, Andy Finkman. It's like a sort of a breaking the fourth wall thing. It's a bunch of movie people and the script is actually really funny. Would you go in for it? And I loved all of Andy's previous work. She's a man. And so I was like, yeah, fuck it. Whatever. I'll go in. And I was reading for something else because one of the casting directors from Disney famously did not like me. I didn't know why.

• 31:00Dax Shepard?

  I don't like how she makes me feel.

• 31:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. And I went in and I just decided to go full manic balls to the wall, stupid, schlappstick, over the top comedy and I booked it.

• 31:11Dax Shepard?

  When you were doing that, did it come with some discomfort? Were you like, I hate who I am being right now? Or you were like, oh no, this is fun to be this too.

• 31:18Speaker 02

  I was just having so much fun because the comedies that I was raised on were all of the Monty Python and Gone with the, not Gone with the Wind.

• 31:25Dax Shepard?

  That's hilarious.

• 31:28Speaker 02

  Casablanca and like all those comedies.

• 31:36Dax Shepard?

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare. This episode is brought to you by McDonald's. The Quarter Pounder with Cheese with Medium Fries and a Drink is now $8. Okay. I need to talk about something that doesn't get enough respect. The Quarter Pounder with Cheese. This is not a casual burger. This is a crafted burger. We're talking a hundred percent fresh beef cooked right when you order it. No artificial flavors, no fillers, no preservatives, just beef doing what beef is supposed to do. And here's a detail I love. There's a cowbell sound in the kitchen. When somebody orders a Quarter Pounder with Cheese, a cowbell goes off and the grill master throws a fresh patty down.

• 32:20Dax Shepard?

  That's like having your own entrance music at McDonald's. I want a cowbell for everything in life. The onions are hand topped by someone who just knows the right amount. Two slices of cheese laid out in a star pattern. So every single bite gets cheese. And two pickles side by side. So you're never in. A pickle desert. Every bite is accounted for. Someone engineered this thing with love. I love a quarter.

• 32:43Speaker 01

  Me too. That's my order is a quarter pounder with cheese. I love it. I didn't know they put so much effort that they did a star formation. I should have known because you can taste.

• 32:55Dax Shepard?

  You can taste it. Yeah. The love. Don't tell anyone this, but I'll put two of them back.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  Yeah. I'm not surprised.

• 33:01Dax Shepard?

  The quarter pounder with cheese with fries and a drink. Now $8 for a limited time only, only at McDonald's. For a limited time only, prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska, and California and for delivery. Fresh beef not available in Alaska and Hawaii. Offer not valid for delivery. We get support from NoBull. The holidays can get hectic. You finally hit a post summer routine and suddenly you're on hosting duty every week.

• 33:27Speaker 01

  That's when you really need to ground yourself.

• 33:30Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. And that's why I keep my training routine through the holidays. It's the whole NoBull idea. There's a no bullshit training brand built around consistency, honesty, and just putting in the work. It's not about adding more pressure to an already packed schedule. It's about having the gear and the habits to move through the season your way. My personal favorite, all three of the shoes are fantastic. The Outwork, the Outwork Flex and the Drive Two. I like the Drive Two because it's a hybrid and I lift, of course, but I also like to do what's called box jumps.

• 34:00Speaker 01

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• 34:01Dax Shepard?

  Right? I do a lot of jumping onto a little platform and I want a little more flexibility. And boy, do they deliver.

• 34:07Speaker 01

  And if you're a cardio person and you're running and you also need to be lifting.

• 34:11Dax Shepard?

  And the style is banging. I don't know what to say. Beautiful style, very breathable, very, very comfortable, lots of support. They were built for lifting.

• 34:19Speaker 01

  They also make a great holiday gift. You know, I love gifting. A purposeful one that actually supports someone's goals and routines. And it's not a gift that just ends up in the back of the closet.

• 34:28Dax Shepard?

  Stay stronger than the season. Head to nobullproject.com all holiday season to shop new deals every week. This episode is supported by Helix.

• 34:39Speaker 01

  Okay, can we talk about how November is basically survival mode? Between the holidays, the travel, the hosting, the cooking, the everything. Sleep is the one thing keeping me from completely unraveling.

• 34:50Dax Shepard?

  It really is the foundation. And I think people underestimate how much a bad mattress is quietly ruining their day. You wake up stiff, your back's angry, you're already behind before your feet hit the floor.

• 35:01Speaker 01

  That was me before Helix. I took their sleep quiz, which is so fast, it's only like two minutes, and they matched me to a mattress that actually fits how I sleep. Not a guess, not a firm or soft coin flip, it's a real match. I have a midnight mattress and I really like it. I was noticing it because I actually had to sleep in one of my other beds recently.

• 35:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 35:20Speaker 01

  That doesn't have a Helix mattress on it and I really could tell a big difference in my sleep.

• 35:24Dax Shepard?

  Temperature was all over the map.

• 35:25Speaker 01

  It was a mess. I need a new one.

• 35:27Dax Shepard?

  Look, they've got over 20 mattress models. So whether you sleep hot, need extra back support, or you've got a partner who moves around all night, there's one built for you. Plus free shipping and a 365 night happy with Helix guarantee. That's a full year to decide.

• 35:41Speaker 01

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• 35:48Dax Shepard?

  Right now, Helix is running their Black Friday sale with up to 30% off. Go to helixsleep.com/armchair for up to 30% off your Helix mattress. That's helixsleep.com/armchair for up to 30% off your Helix mattress. Helixsleep.com/armchair. We get support from our sponsor, Lily. For adults with obesity or with excess weight and weight-related medical problems, it's time to find out about Foundo or for Glee Pro. Foundo is a once daily prescription GLP-1 medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with obesity or some adults with overweight who also have weight-related medical problems to lose excess body weight and keep the weight off.

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• 37:13Speaker 03

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• 37:35Dax Shepard?

  The pianist.

• 37:36Speaker 02

  The pianist, exactly. I'm thinking of A Mighty Wind, all of those, like Christopher Guest and Monty Python. So I knew stupid comedy better than rhythmic laugh track comedy. And so I just went in being like, I'm gonna be so crazy, stupid. And I'm gonna like scream at the top of my lungs and do the most outlandish choices because either I'm gonna get the role and have so much fun doing that, or they're gonna be like, that was so crazy. Never bring it back. And I was comfortable with that. I was like, I don't wanna really do Disney anyway. So we booked it and I had so much fun. And at the time, it was a sort of a modern family setup, a blended family. I was playing the older sister who really loved fashion, was bratty and didn't wanna deal with her little siblings. And then we had Joey Intenzing, who ended up playing the brothers. And then we had another younger actress who was playing my younger sister.

• 38:20Speaker 02

  And then we had this very pivotal scene where we're talking in the mirror during the pilot that I guess swung Disney in the direction of, they'd always wanted to do a twin show, but they never tried it. And at that point, I'd already done one Disney Channel original movie for them where I was like snowboarding and it was so crazy. And they just bet on me. We went away for like nine months. They were like, don't work. And then one day they called me and they were like, hey, show's picked up. Get ready for everything in your whole life to change. Also, you're playing twins and we'll see you on Monday.

• 38:46Dax Shepard?

  Wow. Is it way more work if you're playing twins or no?

• 38:50Speaker 02

  You're shooting every scene twice.

• 38:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no.

• 38:52Speaker 02

  Honestly, I had fun. I feel like everybody's waiting for me to be like, so tell me about Disney.

• 38:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 38:58Speaker 02

  We had the best. Team. We had Ron and John, who were our showrunners. I really grew up on that set. When I was getting my driver's license, all the showrunners and writers walked out with me. I got picked up on the studio lot by the driver and they showed up with signs being like, watch out, new driver on the road, disaster. And I was like,

• 39:15Speaker 02

  it was just a really lovely Safeway.

• 39:18Dax Shepard?

  So it was huge. Liv and Maddie comes out and it gets 5.8 million viewers. And that's the most viewers Disney had gotten in two and a half years.

• 39:25Speaker 02

  Oh, really?

• 39:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so it's hugely successful. And you do four seasons?

• 39:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:30Dax Shepard?

  What was it like to have overnight fandom from young people?

• 39:36Speaker 02

  I couldn't have prepared. I also think I surprised myself by being more introverted than I anticipated, which you truly don't know until you're put into that situation. And then you're like, oh, I'm very introverted. I didn't really learn how to navigate fan attention or public attention for many years. I used to have panic attacks. So not to heavily shift, but to give you context, at the point that Liv and Maddie was airing and I was working, my father had taken his own life.

• 40:03Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 40:04Speaker 02

  And so there was so much going on in my personal life. That's going to affect any kid. When you're 15 and that happens, it changes the course of your life. And within the same calendar year, we were in 900 million homes. It translated into all these different languages.

• 40:18Speaker 01

  So overwhelmed, like two of the biggest things someone could experience at once.

• 40:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:23Dax Shepard?

  And one great and one terrible. And I'd imagine I would feel guilty enjoying the great thing because this other thing happened. I just imagine tension between those two things.

• 40:34Speaker 02

  I couldn't, at 15, land in a soft spot around what happened with my father. There was no way for me to wrap my head around it. We were at his funeral on Bainbridge Island. And then a couple of months later, I was at The Grove with people asking me to sign glossies. And I didn't know how to. Really reconcile with that because like the beginning of my career, I was so shrouded by this heavy cloud that it didn't hit me that I was a famous person until years later. I really was protected in the soundstage. I would come to work every day and some days would be good and some days would be bad and everybody was super protective of me.

• 41:19Speaker 02

  And it was kind of like a volatile time in my life in general, just being a teenager, being on TV. The show was a great escape.

• 41:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I bet when you get there and you don't think about the fact that your dad has died for 11 hours and then you get off.

• 41:33Speaker 02

  It was this mindfuck because you're in this world of like, hi guys, I'm Jeff Cameron and da, da, da, da. And you get home and it's silent and your mom is like, you okay? And you're like, yeah.

• 41:42Dax Shepard?

  I don't know.

• 41:43Speaker 02

  It's very jarring.

• 41:44Dax Shepard?

  Am I okay?

• 41:45Speaker 02

  And then you're in therapy and then they're like, you want to be medicated? And you're like, I don't think so. I don't know if I can act if I'm medicated. It was this crazy teenagehood.

• 41:53Dax Shepard?

  Were you having any guilt about being in Burbank?

• 41:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a weird thing because to be completely honest, I tried to mend my relationship with my dad a lot. There's this thing that happens with a lot of people who are depressed where they are perpetually pushing people away. And for the entirety of 13 and 14 and 15, I was really trying to connect with my dad. He was always a depressive person. My mom and him met and he was like, I'm super suicidal. And she was like, okay, I'm 20. We're gonna try to get you out of this, you know? Oh, boy. Yeah, so it was always sort of there, but I was really just like, I miss my dad. I know something's weird. He doesn't answer when I call.

• 42:39Dax Shepard?

  Well, the most heartbreaking part, it would seem to me, is that you at least had the fantasy at all times, this will get repaired one day.

• 42:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:46Dax Shepard?

  I keep trying, but one day he's gonna be feeling better and I can get it repaired.

• 42:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, sorry.

• 42:53Dax Shepard?

  You know, and then they go, oh, God, yeah, I'm not gonna be able to repair that. It's really sad.

• 42:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, it's true. It's, um, it's also like, I think about this a lot because I was so young and I have a memory of him coming to stay with us once in Burbank. And I just remember thinking all the color had left his face and I didn't know he was drinking so heavily and all of that. And I remember being young enough, like 14, he was staying on a little blow up mattress in our living room. He wasn't looking me in the eye. I thought he was mad at me. And I came to like, say goodnight or lay down next to him because I was still a very young 14. Mentally, I was mature, but I wasn't dating. I was my parents' kid and I was very insulated and very protected. And I remember laying down next to him just for a second to be like,

• 43:43Speaker 02

  cuddle time, routine. And he didn't really move. And I remember him being like, I think you should, you should go to bed. And I remember receiving that as just such a rejection that like, he didn't wanna, and I didn't know what it was. I truly thought he was angry with me for something. And you know, when you're a kid, you blame yourself.

• 43:58Dax Shepard?

  Of course.

• 43:59Speaker 02

  And so I was like, maybe I'm behaving badly or something. I didn't really get it.

• 44:03Dax Shepard?

  Or I would just feel guilty that I'm pursuing my own life.

• 44:06Speaker 02

  He was always vaguely supportive, I guess. He was worried about me more than anything. He was worried that I wasn't going to be able to survive in Hollywood. And I knew that. But I had gone back to see him after I had lived in LA for a year and I stayed for the summer at our family home. I went because I wanted to spend the summer with my dad and I wanted to see him and we hadn't seen each other for so long. And I remember him doing everything he could to get me to not stay with him. He would send me to stay with my friends.

• 44:33Dax Shepard?

  He probably didn't want you to see him, how he was existing.

• 44:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, he was like a famously tight-walleted man. He was always like, you get $100 for clothes every year before school. And if you grow out of them, that's your problem. You go secondhand shopping.

• 44:45Dax Shepard?

  He makes six outfits out of this. Good luck.

• 44:47Speaker 02

  He's like, if you grow, that's your fucking problem. And then the rest, like, you have a sewing machine to figure it out. And I was like, all right. But the summer that I stayed with him, I remember he was just giving me money to get out of the house. And I was like, that's so bizarre. And I didn't really realize that he had already put a plan in place. He got rid of all of the animals. He was getting rid of all of his money.

• 45:06Dax Shepard?

  God, isn't it weird to think of someone planning for that long, something like that?

• 45:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:11Dax Shepard?

  It kind of goes against my stereotype of it overwhelming you in a moment.

• 45:15Speaker 02

  Well, it might not have been as consciously.

• 45:18Speaker 01

  Planned is just like, I don't want anything.

• 45:21Dax Shepard?

  You've lost even the desire.

• 45:22Speaker 01

  Yes, you've lost the desire to even care for anything or have anything.

• 45:26Speaker 02

  I still go back and forth on that because I found out later that he was paying my friend's mom to get me groceries and basically was just pawning me off on another family. I internalized it for two years that he was just mad at me.

• 45:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 45:39Speaker 02

  And I was constantly trying to fix our relationship and reach out and he just wasn't having it. And so I don't think at the time I felt guilty for being in LA so much as even when I was on the island still, he was not really wanting to see me. And so I was kind of like, I'm always here. I'm always wanting to connect with you.

• 46:01Dax Shepard?

  Your side of the street was clean.

• 46:02Speaker 02

  And I found out also that he had attempted something really publicly and my mom kept that from me and that was a big turning point in my mental health was just being like, what do I not know? And my mom was probably right to keep that from me, but of course, when I was 14 or something, I was like, what the fuck? So I really didn't know what to think of it. The last thing he texted me was, I love you, Chloe. And then we got a call the next day and it was like, yeah, it's really crazy. I honestly don't talk about it too much.

• 46:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, understandable.

• 46:34Speaker 02

  Not because it's hard, honestly, because I do talk about it, but I talk about it with this kind of like, here are the facts.

• 46:39Speaker 01

  You can disassociate a little bit.

• 46:41Dax Shepard?

  So I went into therapy for the very first time, three years ago or two, whatever it was.

• 46:44Speaker 02

  Oh, really? Wow.

• 46:45Dax Shepard?

  Weirdly, since I was in recovery for so long and I was like, well, I'm getting everything I need from there. And yeah, I can tell you my story. I can tell anyone my story.

• 46:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:52Dax Shepard?

  It's a timeline. And then in that therapy session, as I was talking to him, for the very first time, the emotions were attached to the timeline and they just are not generally for me. So I can relate to these moments where like, oh, okay, the emotions are here now with the story.

• 47:10Speaker 02

  Yeah. A lot of the time, trauma is very sensationalized. I'm sure you know.

• 47:14Dax Shepard?

  Yep.

• 47:14Speaker 02

  I've become very protective of that over the years because I used to be much more open about speaking about it. I had a friend who died very publicly in the last few years and that was when I tried to reorient.

• 47:25Speaker 01

  A little bit my autonomy over what spaces I share that much.

• 47:30Dax Shepard?

  Well, my therapist said to me, he's like, you know, some stuff you can keep for yourself, not because you're hiding it out of shame, but just it's yours to keep and you should keep it. Having it for you in a weird way, which was a new concept for me.

• 47:43Speaker 01

  Sort of the opposite of what we were talking about earlier, which I was actually going to say that. I think it's actually okay, not out of shame, but when we were saying sharing is important. And of course it is, but it's okay to have things that are just yours.

• 47:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:56Speaker 01

  It doesn't mean it's your secret. It's just yours and you can protect that if you want.

• 48:01Dax Shepard?

  Sliding that line back and forth. And it's like, yeah, I felt comfortable with it here and now I feel more comfortable with it here. And it'll probably change again and it's fine. There's not a right or a wrong. It's just, am I betraying myself? Do I regret it later?

• 48:15Speaker 02

  Right.

• 48:15Dax Shepard?

  You did make me cry today though, because I was seeing the tattoo that you got. And I have little girls and I say that same thing to them all the time.

• 48:29Speaker 02

  That's so beautiful.

• 48:30Dax Shepard?

  It's like, oh my God, I can't, uh, yeah. If they had to tattoo that on them at some point, because something went sideways. You know, it's just heartbreaking.

• 48:41Speaker 01

  What is the tattoo? If you don't mind sharing.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  It says, we'll be friends forever, which is just like the sweetest.

• 48:51Dax Shepard?

  Oh my God. Like almost every day, otherwise go like, you know, we're going to be best friends for the rest of your life. Rest of my life.

• 48:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, unless they get a procedure, hopefully. I live to 180. Maybe I can do it with them all the time. Yeah, I'm like, we're fucking best friends from this day till the end.

• 49:08Speaker 02

  Well, and that's what it should be, right? I'm so moved to hear you say that about your girls, because I truly was best friends with my dad. He tried his best.

• 49:17Dax Shepard?

  There's probably equally sweet relationships, but I find it hard to believe there are. I just can't imagine between a dad and daughters. I just think like, fuck. If moms and sons are having this, and I suppose I did have that with my mom, but just it's inconceivable that anything could be sweeter. In fact, we went to see my 11 year old sing in her choir. She goes in all girls' schools, so it was just all these little girls up there singing. I said to my wife, I'm like, they're the best thing we've got. Daughters on planet earth, like of all the bells and whistles, this is it right here.

• 49:46Speaker 02

  Did you always want to be a dad?

• 49:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 49:48Speaker 02

  Oh, I love that.

• 49:50Dax Shepard?

  I thought I wanted boys.

• 49:52Speaker 02

  Really?

• 49:53Dax Shepard?

  I think as a guy, that's what you think. You're like, I'm gonna have a son. Teach him how to carve a piece of wood.

• 50:01Dax Shepard?

  Teach him how to throw a right hook, teach him how to do donuts in a car.

• 50:04Speaker 02

  Then he's fucking good. Then he's fucking stupid.

• 50:06Dax Shepard?

  And then I let him loose onto this planet.

• 50:10Dax Shepard?

  But I'm so fucking grateful I didn't have boys, because I actually don't want to do that shit. I want to like go to Taylor Swift concerts.

• 50:17Speaker 02

  Butterfly clips in the beard. And yeah, yeah, yeah. That's so sweet.

• 50:20Dax Shepard?

  Bait my nails and dye my hair. Yeah, so much more fun. Okay, so back to your career. So Liv and Maddie's enormous, but then Descendants comes along, and that's its own juggernaut.

• 50:31Speaker 02

  I think Descendants was bigger than Liv and Maddie.

• 50:33Dax Shepard?

  6.6 million viewers the first. Yeah, yeah.

• 50:36Speaker 02

  I don't know why these stats are killing you. 6.6 million.

• 50:41Dax Shepard?

  They don't change.

• 50:42Speaker 02

  I can rely on them.

• 50:43Dax Shepard?

  So Descendants is a whole nother way. And now there's tons of singing, and you'd already been in choir. And I guess you start releasing music around Descendants time or before?

• 50:54Speaker 02

  No, after. It's confusing. I did so many weird things in that time. I had a band with my then boyfriend. So wild.

• 51:02Dax Shepard?

  It had a weird name, a girl and a...

• 51:04Speaker 02

  Girl and the Dreamcatcher. I did not name it, and the band was not my idea. No, no, the band was not my idea, neither was the name and none of the music. That was something that was entirely his thing. And it's sort of like a fever dream. I forget all the time that that ever happened. So like, I guess technically that was coming out around then. But no, I didn't sign with a label or start releasing my own shit until 2019. It was actually after we finished filming all three, because Disney had Hollywood Records that I think was with Capitol.

• 51:33Dax Shepard?

  And that's what Out of Touch, Bloodshot, Wastin' So Good are all on?

• 51:36Speaker 02

  No, I was never with Hollywood Records. No, Hollywood Republic? I think they were with Republic. But I was never signed to them, because actually I did an audition to be signed to the Disney label. It was so funny, because first of all, I was very nervous, but I was in like a little yellow dress and my short little blonde hair was in like pigtails and I was singing covers from Boombox. And their comment was, we already have so many blondes. And so they didn't sign me because they had like Olivia Holt and a few other blondes that were on the channel at the time.

• 52:03Dax Shepard?

  There was Swimming and Blondes.

• 52:04Speaker 02

  They had their blonde quota filled and so they didn't sign me and I remember being devastated.

• 52:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you did an Imagine Dragons song, 2013 on top of the world.

• 52:13Speaker 02

  That was in the pilot of Live and Matty. Nothing on Disney was ever my doing. I'm sure you know that. I think a lot of people don't. Disney would be like, this is your song you're singing this week and then you go in on the weekend and then you shoot on a Monday. It's done and dusted for you. Technically, I'm on them, but they're not mine.

• 52:28Dax Shepard?

  Okay, got you. You do The Three Descendants. At that time, now you're in two wildly successful things. So who were you looking at that you were like, ah, I'm grateful, but also I fucking want to be this person? What things did you want to be in and were you like, I want to be Emma Stone?

• 52:44Speaker 02

  My film heroes, I loved Renee Zellweger. I love Nicole Kidman. I loved Jessica Lange. But then also I was hugely obsessed with like Rocky Horror and all of these things that I truly shouldn't have been watching at a young age. And I was like, that's the kind of uncomfortable, campy, weird, left of center shit I want to be making. And honestly, still what I want to be making is kind of a page turn and I'm moving on way too quick. But I just did this show for Amazon that has got that weird little sticky icky thing about it in the script.

• 53:17Dax Shepard?

  Which show is that?

• 53:17Speaker 02

  Right now it's being called 56 Days, which is the same title of the book. It's based on this bestselling novel. Without saying too much, because I'm sure that Amazon would have like a helicopter lands on your roof and be like, shut the fuck up. I can't compare it to anything that I just listed because it's drastically different, but it's got the same sort of touch of unease.

• 53:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah. Do you like Severance?

• 53:36Speaker 02

  Never watched Severance. I know I'm so in trouble for that.

• 53:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I just need your SAG card before you leave.

• 53:42Speaker 02

  That's all. Fine. I'll just put it through the shredder.

• 53:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's my thing. You didn't see it, but I am gonna have to get your SAG card.

• 53:47Speaker 02

  And Ben Stiller just texted me. He is furious.

• 53:50Dax Shepard?

  It's not gonna work with you ever. Okay, so then we'll just race through. You did Schmigadoon, acting, acting, acting. I want to talk about singing now.

• 53:57Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 53:57Dax Shepard?

  Because while you're starting to release music and it's getting very well received, is there any battle between which one I want more, which one I want to focus on, which one's more rewarding? You have finite time and so you have to make some decisions and where on the scales are those two things?

• 54:13Speaker 02

  So I had this super bullish weird thing where I was like film and TV is so fun and so is music. Why doesn't everybody try to do it? And then I tried to do both at the same time and I was like, I am going to be hospitalized. You simply can't. I wish I could explain it because I was uneducated and I was like, I want to do both. And I would assume that many people think that it's very doable. I'm here to tell you, I have tried to do both. You simply can't. A couple of reasons. One is that film and TV is scheduled for you unless you are biggest name top 20. You can't be like, I love this film. I would love to shoot it in London in September after my tour. That's never gonna happen. So music is really more up to you, except festivals and shows. And the problem is that when you also have a large team who's doing music and film,

• 54:57Speaker 02

  the thing that ends up getting cannibalized is music. It seems the most flexible, but then I'm over here being like, I wrote a fucking album and it's not going to come out till when? And it's like, yeah, but you should really do this show. And it's like, I absolutely would love to do the show. We're also making an album. And so you can't plan at all.

• 55:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I guess we've seen people do both, but it's a spell of one, a spell of another. You don't see someone with a number one movie in America and they're on tour.

• 55:21Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, and also that's the other thing is if you have a number one hit, it's not just you look at your phone and you go like, oh, it's doing well on Spotify. You have to promote that shit all over the world. You have to be performing. You have to be doing everything. A hit will take over your life. I had a hit song in 2022 and it was the only thing I did. It's crazy what a hit song will do.

• 55:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'm fascinated. Of course, we interview musicians and the economics of it are so fascinating to me that a hit equals, now it's time to work and make money off this thing that you didn't make any money off of it being a hit. Opposite of a movie, which is like, it's a hit. Great. You got the money.

• 55:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Who cares?

• 55:55Dax Shepard?

  And then the next paycheck will be bigger, but this is, oh shit, this thing's hot. I gotta go everywhere now and perform this everywhere.

• 56:01Speaker 02

  You are your own sort of one man show in the sense, yes, you have people to do your hair and your makeup, like everybody in the industry has their team. But like, if you show up on a movie set, it's everybody else's job to pull off the thing. It's your job to pull off the thing how they ask you to do it. Whereas with music, you are the director, you are the- Like you're the little drummer boy in the front of the parade being like, go again, go again. You are your own sort of planetary system. And I am someone who really runs everything with my music. I have an incredible team around me, but I'm not one of those artists that's like, I trust you. I do trust my team, but I'm also like, let me hear it again. Let me hear it through headphones.

• 56:36Dax Shepard?

  It's gonna be the exact thing that's in your mind.

• 56:38Speaker 02

  And I will be sitting in the studio being like, can we do a breath here? I'll go in down to the final last day and I will be working on mood boards with video directors and I will be scouting people.

• 56:49Dax Shepard?

  Well, you're the product in this domain and in a movie, the movie's the product.

• 56:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I'm so obsessive just because I really have an idea of what I want it to be. And that's part of the fun. My partner is always like, baby, you gotta chill out. You're gonna burn out. And I'm like, yeah, but it's that extra 10% of attention that for me as an artist takes it from whatever I did my job to, oh my God, I'm so proud of this.

• 57:11Dax Shepard?

  Is it weird? Like you won Best New Artist MTV Video Music Award in 2022 and you won New Artist of the Year American Music Awards in 2022. You'd been singing for 10 years. Is that weird?

• 57:22Speaker 02

  It was weird in the sense that I actually had not been doing it for that long. The music I released initially was my partner's music and Disney's music at the time, my partner. Then the music after that, it wasn't music I was entirely writing. Cause labels are very like, you came from Disney, you have a good following. We think you should go on this record. And I would rewrite some of it, but not really all of it. And it would be stuff that I kinda liked.

• 57:43Dax Shepard?

  You made it just enough of your own to do it, but it wasn't your own.

• 57:47Speaker 02

  You didn't feel ownership of it? No, and I was extremely plagued by, I think this is who people want me to be. And I had done that for so long on Disney that I was like, I know how to do that. I guess I'll do that. And then I was enjoying it cause it was new, but there was no onus. Boyfriend, the song that I wrote that went a little wild, it was the first song that I had ever written entirely, top to bottom, from nothing. All of these other records that I know people have heard and fans have loved that I'm sure I will get back on Spotify one day. They were originally written by other people and then I had sort of changed some lyrics to fit more my story, just cause I was like, I don't think I would say that. Or I was starting to experiment with writing. And that's what a lot of artists do is they'll take records that other people have written and they'll put their own spin on it.

• 58:28Speaker 02

  And change some things. Not everybody has the time to take six months to sit in the studio and only do that. So there's no hate or shame in that. That's pretty normal. And then some people, that's their whole gig. They're singer songwriters. That's what they do. I never really believed in myself enough to try to write a whole fucking song based on like a concept that I had had. And I one day was just like, maybe. And so I went into the studio to try to start to write. And my label really didn't think anything of it. They were like, have fun, babe. You know, like dropping me off at the mall. They were like, okay. I wrote Boyfriend pretty early on. I think it was the first one that I wrote in that time, or if not the first, like one of the first. And I randomly put it up on TikTok because that's what the label is like. Everything's on TikTok. And I woke up to a crazy record breaking, like I had almost no TikToks up. Literally the TikTok was live photos that I had taken of myself that I turned into video and just put together.

• 59:13Speaker 01

  Oh, nice.

• 59:14Speaker 02

  It was not a good TikTok.

• 59:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:15Speaker 02

  And I guess singing about being bisexual or attracted to women.

• 59:18Dax Shepard?

  My sister knew all about it.

• 59:20Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 59:20Dax Shepard?

  She looks at my calendar.

• 59:22Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 59:22Dax Shepard?

  And she goes, oh, you're interviewing Doves today? And I said, yeah. Are you hip to Dove? And she's like, well, yeah, I watched all the Descendants with the girls. And then her song Boyfriend's awesome. And she was telling me all about it. And I'm like, oh, this is interesting. This hit her radar.

• 59:34Speaker 01

  You're hitting a lot of different demos. We got those demos, which is great. My friend's mom is very into you.

• 59:41Speaker 02

  Oh, really?

• 59:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:43Dax Shepard?

  In many ways.

• 59:44Speaker 02

  We got them all. Yeah. So anyway, it was the first time I'd ever experienced something that I had conceptualized, brought to life.

• 59:50Dax Shepard?

  Before you, this didn't exist. And after you, this exists.

• 59:53Speaker 02

  Right. And then kind of before that, I felt like I didn't exist. And then after this thing, I felt like I finally existed in a more authentic way in the world than I ever had before. And also coupled with this coming out of it all, which I was pretty afraid to do.

• 1:00:06Dax Shepard?

  I can tell you what my fear would be.

• 1:00:07Speaker 02

  What is it?

• 1:00:08Dax Shepard?

  My fear would be, oh, people are gonna think this is opportunistic.

• 1:00:12Speaker 02

  Oh, interesting. No, I mean, I got some of that after I came out, but it was actually, I had made a music video for another song that I had released called We Belong. Wasn't a music video. It was like a visualizer because we had no money for a real music video. And there were all these faces being drawn and like embracing in cartoons. And someone sent it back to me and I realized that it was only representing heterosexual couples. Even though they were drawings, they were very like white heterosexual couples, boldly non-inclusive. And so I just sent a note back being like, Can we um get some more representation in this cartoon?

• 1:00:41Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:00:42Speaker 02

  Everything still remained white and outlining. It was just more varied in silhouette and men and women and then women and women, men and men and androgynous looking. I was just like, this is weird. It doesn't really represent me. And also, it was kind of a jarring POV for me where I was like, that is so hetero and narrow. And so I put that out. And then it was like the time when people were putting emojis to hint at what was coming. So when people were like, when's the new single coming out? And I was like, emoji, emoji. And then like the women loving women emoji kissing. And then the song came out and it wasn't about being queer.

• 1:01:11Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:01:12Speaker 02

  And everybody was like, you're queer baiting. This is horrendous.

• 1:01:16Dax Shepard?

  Oh, it's queer baiting.

• 1:01:17Speaker 02

  Queer baiting is when something is for the queer community and it's not quite, or you like keep it in the hetero bubble, but you sort of give crumbs. It's a marketing technique that a lot of shows have been accused of where they'll also give same sex people a lot of tension, hinting that there might be something there and then they never fully go there because they're like, that's not really what it is. They just want to get the queer community and sort of make money.

• 1:01:38Dax Shepard?

  But not commit to telling the whole storyline.

• 1:01:40Speaker 02

  That's queer baiting. So I had to basically go on Instagram Live at the time and be like, guys, I'm not queer baiting. I'm queer. And I just wanted more fucking representation in the fucking cartoon. And the emoji was just hinting at the music video. I was so confused by.

• 1:01:52Dax Shepard?

  It wasn't a dog whistle for the queer.

• 1:01:54Speaker 02

  No. And also at that time, I'd never said it publicly, but all my friends, all my family, they knew I was queer. But I just hated that I had to say it. But I did.

• 1:02:01Dax Shepard?

  I guess that's what I'm wondering. When does that paradigm start where it doesn't really need to be declared? Not that I care. I'm not like someone's like, why do you gotta tell me? That's not what I'm saying. It's just like, when will it not even be interesting to anybody?

• 1:02:13Speaker 02

  We have a long way to go.

• 1:02:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, I do too.

• 1:02:15Speaker 02

  We've made like a little bit of progress within our own internet-y liberal bubble of people who are maybe queer community adjacent. And also just like within the queer community, there's some weird discriminatory things, even within the queer community, people are very heavy on labels. You have to define yourself. You have to know what it is. Also show us proof. There's a lot of weirdness.

• 1:02:35Dax Shepard?

  Purity tests.

• 1:02:36Speaker 02

  Yeah. And also just if we have that issue within the community, I think we have quite a ways to go.

• 1:02:40Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's the erroneous assumption is that there would be some kind of unified harmony among a group of people because they have a single thing. In common. It's like, well, no.

• 1:02:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, people are still people.

• 1:02:51Dax Shepard?

  They're from every socioeconomic bracket. They're from every ethnicity. They're from every type of trauma background.

• 1:02:57Speaker 02

  I had a feeling that people were going to say I wasn't queer enough.

• 1:03:01Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 1:03:02Speaker 02

  I didn't really have an issue being second guessed because I truly was like, I know who I am. My hang up was more, my experience in my personal life was so liberal, wonderful, beautiful, kind, protected, sweet, nurturing, supportive, and my experience of the outside world was so scary. I was also on TV in the 2010s. We were still like, she's 110 and so she's fat. People were being so crazy. It was tabloid time. People were just making shit up about celebrities. I was on the tail end of all that really ugly shit. My body type now would have been like, ooh, she's really, you know, it was a terrible time.

• 1:03:38Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. Well, just six years prior to you being on that show, they're asking 17 year old Britney Spears if she's had a breast augmentation in the middle. Six year old dude.

• 1:03:47Speaker 02

  Or if she's still a virgin.

• 1:03:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, everyone's asking her.

• 1:03:50Speaker 02

  It's so crazy.

• 1:03:50Dax Shepard?

  You still a virgin?

• 1:03:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, but really.

• 1:03:52Dax Shepard?

  What about anal?

• 1:03:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, it counts still, right? It counts. It was so bad. And so I just hadn't really recovered from that or thought that society would be like, rock on, you're queer. We kind of knew it. I wasn't expecting that.

• 1:04:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Okay. So now you're releasing more singles. You did, I'm afraid to say, is it alchemical?

• 1:04:11Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 1:04:11Dax Shepard?

  That's a weird word for me. Is that a real word?

• 1:04:13Speaker 02

  Alchemy.

• 1:04:14Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I know alchemy is a word, but alchemical.

• 1:04:16Speaker 02

  When something is.

• 1:04:17Dax Shepard?

  I believe you. I've never heard.

• 1:04:19Speaker 01

  We should hear it.

• 1:04:19Speaker 02

  No, I'm needing to prove this to you right now. I'm feeling like this space is no longer safe.

• 1:04:23Dax Shepard?

  Educate me.

• 1:04:24Speaker 02

  You know, the practice of alchemy, when something is something that can transmute energy, it is alchemical.

• 1:04:29Dax Shepard?

  And it was volume one. There has to be a volume two.

• 1:04:32Speaker 02

  You would think.

• 1:04:33Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:04:34Speaker 02

  Logic would follow.

• 1:04:35Speaker 01

  Painted yourself in a box there a little bit, which is great.

• 1:04:38Speaker 02

  It's kind of cunty just to have alchemical volume one. It's like, where's alchemical volume two? It's like in the vault, baby.

• 1:04:44Dax Shepard?

  Can I make a pitch?

• 1:04:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:04:46Dax Shepard?

  Do another album.

• 1:04:47Speaker 02

  Call it alchemical volume three.

• 1:04:49Dax Shepard?

  Some completely different name, volume one. And just your thing is you call everything volume one.

• 1:04:55Speaker 02

  That's so mean.

• 1:04:56Dax Shepard?

  Maybe we'll get to a volume two.

• 1:04:58Speaker 02

  It'll be like volume two, it'll be like forty something.

• 1:04:59Dax Shepard?

  Oh, her thing is volume one.

• 1:05:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's a good marketing. Funny to do all chemical volume one and three and then just be like, where's two?

• 1:05:06Dax Shepard?

  That's good.

• 1:05:07Speaker 02

  You haven't heard it?

• 1:05:07Speaker 01

  It's very Taylor Swift of you.

• 1:05:09Speaker 02

  Oh, really?

• 1:05:09Speaker 01

  You know, keeping things and then big releases.

• 1:05:12Speaker 02

  That's true. That's true. I could learn. I went in to write what I thought was gonna be all chemical volume two, but this crazy thing happened. I spent two years basically off the face of the earth and processing a lot of trauma. I found my dad's baby journal and that sounds like it's nothing, but I truly had all of this storyline in my head that my dad didn't like me, didn't love me, didn't ever see me, didn't ever know me. So I had all of this unresolved shit, probably with men in general. I went through like a horrendous breakup, just one of those like, if I could tell it, you'd be like, no, no. Like it just kept getting worse and I'm not going to talk about it. But it was something that really truly like took me out at the knees.

• 1:05:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:53Speaker 02

  I don't even know how the fuck it happened, if I'm honest. I went through two really bad, long-term relationships, kind of back to back. The first one was kind of all bad. The second one, it had its beautiful moments. And then towards the end, it was just horrendous. And I was in this like weird situation where my friend had just passed. So I was coming off of antidepressants and I was trapped in Canada during COVID, couldn't leave. No one could come see me.

• 1:06:12Dax Shepard?

  She's Louise.

• 1:06:13Speaker 02

  And then we broke up and I was like.

• 1:06:16Speaker 01

  Untethered.

• 1:06:17Speaker 02

  It was wild and all the streets were shut down and it was just the most horrendous fallout from that relationship. And so we're glossing over some things, but if I were to say those two years, sort of 2020 into 2021, I was kind of listless and that was when I dyed my hair, came out, wrote Boyfriend. And then Boyfriend came out and then I was like kind of listless again, because I was like, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to follow up this song. I didn't write anything.

• 1:06:41Dax Shepard?

  It can be a burden.

• 1:06:42Speaker 02

  I was like, I don't even know what I did the first time. And I also won all these awards prematurely, which then I was like, guys, are you fucking sure?

• 1:06:48Dax Shepard?

  I'm a fraud. I got lucky and I don't know how to do this again.

• 1:06:50Speaker 02

  So much imposter syndrome. And so then I found my dad's baby book and I basically swore off of dating anybody. Rest of 2022 into most of 2023 and I dipped into the deepest, darkest depression. And I just fell off the face of the planet. Did a lot of internal work and everybody was like, "You gave up your career. You don't give a fuck." And I was like, "I can't make myself get out of that."

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:14Dax Shepard?

  We've got bigger fish to fry.

• 1:07:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:07:16Dax Shepard?

  Getting me bathed today.

• 1:07:18Speaker 02

  We'll get to it. In a year. It kind of hit me all at once. My best friend was like, "You have never stopped working." And I was like, "Yeah, but if I stop, everything's gonna find me." And then it did. Yeah, it always does. Yeah, and I was like, "Fuck you, Veronica. You were fucking right." "I don't know how I'm gonna get myself out of this." And so I just bared down, isolated myself, which is not something I recommend, but something I definitely did on instinct. Cat myself out of trouble, stayed in my house, and then had a lot of dark nights of the soul and just kind of dug, cleansed, dug, cleansed, and basically purified myself in the craziest way. And then I met my partner.

• 1:07:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the Italian stallion.

• 1:07:54Speaker 02

  The Italian stallion. And then I tried to write the album. Two months after we started dating, I wrote the first song about him. And it was very clear that the album was going to be a massive departure from anything I was doing before. I was like, "Why are we trying to write a part two when I was so depressed in those songs? And this one is like a fully different book? Why am I trying to make them be married? I can't."

• 1:08:16Dax Shepard?

  Right. That's why you're gonna release a new album called Volume One. And then you'll get depressed again. It's life.

• 1:08:22Speaker 02

  And I'll get depressed again. We got it scheduled. I'm gonna be depressed probably from November to like March, I would say. So don't reach out. No, no, no. Honestly, I don't mean to make light.

• 1:08:32Dax Shepard?

  But you're having tons of success with now you're happy falling in love songs.

• 1:08:35Speaker 02

  I really didn't expect that. I couldn't have written this album if I had not dropped off the face of the planet and learned a little bit more about who I was as an adult and as an individual.

• 1:08:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:48Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:08:54Dax Shepard?

  We get support by Peloton. You know that feeling when you're spiraling over a problem and you just can't figure it out? When that happens to me, I need a change of pace. And I've found that running is the best way. It takes my brain out of the driver's seat and I come back with a fresh perspective. Running can be freeing and cathartic, and Peloton helps you feel all of that. And now that feeling fits wherever you need it with the new Peloton Tread Flex. It's movable and foldable, designed to fit your life. So next time you feel stuck, you can go for a run literally anywhere, whether that's in your office, living room, or even the attic. Plus, they have classes with expert instructors and programs to meet you at any level and keep you moving. Let yourself run.

• 1:09:38Dax Shepard?

  Explore the new Peloton Tread Flex at onepeloton.com. This episode is brought to you by ServiceNow. Look, I have my dream job. I get to talk to folks I admire like crazy and ask them virtually any question that I want to. I can't imagine a better way to spend my time. But even dream jobs have some not so dreamy parts. The stuff that gets in the way of the actual work. Now that's where ServiceNow's AI specialists come in. They don't just tell you what you should do about your busy work. They actually do it, start to finish. Cases closed, requests handled, no extra work for you. So you and your team can focus on what matters most, which for me is,

• 1:10:22Dax Shepard?

  are they obsessed with male bodies on the same level as I am?

• 1:10:25Speaker 01

  They never are.

• 1:10:26Dax Shepard?

  To learn how to put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com. We get support from Superhuman. Look, I love what I do. The conversations, the ideas, the creative stuff. But there's this whole other layer of work that eats my day alive. The inbox that never ends, docs I need to get through, threads I'm behind on. And by the time I've dealt with all that, the stuff I actually want to focus on gets whatever's left. What I needed was something that just works where I'm already working. Not another tab to open, not another thing to set up. Superhuman Go, from the makers of Grammarly, is different. It's already right there, inside your email, your docs, your browser. You don't go to it, it's already working alongside you.

• 1:11:10Dax Shepard?

  You're deep in a long thread, highlight it, and it pulls the key points. About to send something important? It flags what doesn't add up before it leaves your hands. It knows your style, your workflows, and it just backs you up without getting in the way. A thought partner that's already up to speed, at your service, not after your job. So do yourself a favor and try Superhuman Go, from the makers of Grammarly. Find out more at superhuman.com.

• 1:11:36Dax Shepard?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Every family has that one holiday tradition nobody actually enjoys, but everyone keeps doing because stopping it would feel like a federal offense. For me, it was a specific meal situation that I will not name because my family listens. But at some point, you have to ask yourself, am I doing this because I love it? Or because I'm afraid of what happens if I don't?

• 1:11:59Speaker 01

  Yes, and that question applies to so much more than the holidays. I think a lot of us carry these invisible rules about how we're supposed to spend the holidays, who we're supposed to see, what it's supposed to look like. And when you start unpacking that with a therapist, you realize half of your stress is coming from rules you didn't even write.

• 1:12:15Dax Shepard?

  This is where BetterHelp can be a great resource during the holidays. BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals. A short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences, which means they typically get it right the first time. If you aren't happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time from their tailored recs.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  I just love therapy. I've been avoiding it recently, or not avoiding it, but I was like, oh, I'm busy, I'm busy, I'm busy. I haven't canceled, canceled, canceled, but then I-

• 1:12:43Dax Shepard?

  You start feeling it.

• 1:12:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, because then I had it this past weekend and I was like, oh my God. And just thank God, thank God for her. Yeah.

• 1:12:51Dax Shepard?

  BetterHelp is now in-network with more than 125 health plans, with many copays as low as $15 for eligible members. And if you don't have eligible insurance or live outside the US, you can still get 20% off your first month. Sign up and get 20% off at betterhelp.com/dax. That's betterhelp, H E L P, dot com slash DAX.

• 1:13:21Dax Shepard?

  In going through all the dad stuff, I mean, here's what I would hope for you. Did you come to accept-

• 1:13:28Dax Shepard?

  Oh no, he most definitely loved me like crazy and he most definitely had a lot of conditions that had nothing to do with me.

• 1:13:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's so funny because finding this baby book was really a pivotal thing in my human evolution timeline. I can't overemphasize enough what it did for me. This came straight out of that excerpt, which was something I apparently said to him on the changing table when I was two, like barely verbal. We'll be friends forever. And he was like, hold on and had to date it and time it. And he was like, we will be friends forever. But there was so much in there that was like, today, you read the first word out of your newspaper. You're so smart.

• 1:14:08Speaker 02

  You know, like, yeah, stuff that I, I, I never got from him.

• 1:14:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:13Speaker 02

  When he was alive, stuff that he was too sad to tell me as I was growing up. And I think just knowing that he really did see me, the things that he would say about me, I was so shocked were things that were still true now. He was like, you're so intense. You're so independent. You're so fiery. You always stand up for yourself. You always apologize first. You always make sure everyone around you is okay. And I was like, how do you glean this from someone who's five and under? I don't know. You must be really paying attention.

• 1:14:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, he knew you. He saw you.

• 1:14:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:42Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so I think like, God, I'm like fully crying. But I think there was something in that. I'd always thought that there was something wrong with me.

• 1:14:51Dax Shepard?

  Of course.

• 1:14:51Speaker 02

  And also the way that my dad really didn't love my mom very well. My mom and I were so similar. I was like, there's something wrong. He doesn't love us. He doesn't like us. And I really like and love him.

• 1:15:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:03Speaker 02

  And so I think it really skewed my perspective on having to be something for so many people. I thought that I had to win love. I thought that I had to put up with dark things to be worthy, to be good enough. Also, growing up with an unstable parent, you really start to sort of calculate. And read other people's behaviors and triggers before they get triggered. And so you're walking on eggshells. You're trying to be the perfect everything.

• 1:15:28Dax Shepard?

  You're trying to control the environment they're in so the bad thing doesn't set off.

• 1:15:32Speaker 02

  And you start to do that in everything.

• 1:15:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you become neurotic about your surroundings.

• 1:15:38Speaker 02

  And apologetic. Anyway, all of that is to say that when I read that actually I was entirely wrong. And he couldn't wait to see who I would turn into and truly saw me.

• 1:15:48Dax Shepard?

  Madly in love with you.

• 1:15:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. And in the way that I was with him, I was finally able to like, put this massive rock down. Oh, I have always been exactly who I am. I have always been seen as the person I am today. And really, he didn't miss anything.

• 1:16:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, that's very sweet.

• 1:16:07Speaker 02

  If he could love me like that, I can love me like that.

• 1:16:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:12Speaker 02

  That also, I think, was really what made my life what it is now, is that fucking baby journal. So keep a journal for your fucking kids.

• 1:16:18Dax Shepard?

  Well, then let's you enter into this Italian Stallion situation, a much probably healthier version of yourself.

• 1:16:24Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:16:25Dax Shepard?

  What's different about an Italian?

• 1:16:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. Oh.

• 1:16:31Speaker 02

  Don't come out. You should have. No, I was gonna say.

• 1:16:33Dax Shepard?

  What were you gonna say?

• 1:16:33Speaker 02

  I was gonna say, what's different about him than the others?

• 1:16:37Dax Shepard?

  How's he not part of the pattern?

• 1:16:39Speaker 02

  Exactly. Without bringing anyone else into it, my political answer, what my partner is that I have never seen firsthand is he is the most honest, beautiful, truly off the charts intelligent, funny as fuck, kind, good-hearted person.

• 1:17:01Speaker 02

  Why did you do this to me?

• 1:17:03Dax Shepard?

  Sorry, I don't know how to talk about anything else.

• 1:17:05Speaker 02

  I heard other things. Both of our mascara is running. I also love this laugh like you're in pain. You're like, ah. So crazy.

• 1:17:14Dax Shepard?

  It borders on maniacal.

• 1:17:15Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah. I'm right there with you, baby.

• 1:17:18Dax Shepard?

  Well, one thing I read that you said about him, which I thought was really neat is there seems to be an embrace of a dual masculinity, femininity that maybe is Italian. Maybe it's just the group that you're surrounded by, but that they see. seem to have a great comfort in being both sides.

• 1:17:34Speaker 02

  He's really in both of his energies, I would say. He's really masculine and feminine in all of the most beautiful ways. I always like to say that I would have found him in any body. I truly think that he is the most beautiful soul. He's kind of shy. And so actually, I think he puts out this air of unapproachability.

• 1:17:52Dax Shepard?

  Aloof.

• 1:17:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, which is really just he's introverted. The thing that he said to me first, that then I started saying, because it's really true, is that I was really afraid of humans at the time that I had met him. And I had really been convinced that something was wrong with me. And I was not allowed to engage with the other humans for fear of either me inadvertently harming them or being harmed. And I was starting to get really introverted and weird. And when I met him and when he asked me out, it was maybe only three or four weeks into dating that we were crying and doing the deep dive. And he was like, I think I really needed you to come into my life because I was starting to disappear. That was exactly what it was for me.

• 1:18:34Speaker 02

  He's my proof that I can be here in the most beautiful way, because I have the most incredible friends. But the way that he sees me is something that I've never experienced. And the way that we're best friends. And I think that's really one of the cornerstones of our relationship is just the way that we are so healthy for each other. We really are normal human beings first.

• 1:18:56Speaker 01

  It sounds like he's giving you permission to just be you.

• 1:18:59Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. The main difference I really can stand on is that he wants me to be as big and expressed and healthy and whole and off the rails, whoever I am. He wants me to be that at a 10.

• 1:19:13Dax Shepard?

  Very few guys are secure enough to let you be a supernova and not be afraid they're gonna lose you.

• 1:19:20Speaker 02

  And that was really my experience. He really couldn't be more the opposite. If I'm ever hiding in any way, he's like, what the fuck are you doing?

• 1:19:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:19:28Speaker 02

  He's my biggest amplifier. And that to me has just been so healing. Also, just for like my inner child.

• 1:19:33Dax Shepard?

  We love this kind of guy.

• 1:19:34Speaker 02

  We love this fucking man. This guy's all right, you know?

• 1:19:38Dax Shepard?

  He's okay. He's good. He's good. Good guy, he's a bikini.

• 1:19:43Speaker 02

  What the fuck is a bikini?

• 1:19:44Dax Shepard?

  My best friend Aaron and I at times talk like mafioso and we just thought, what if one of the family's last name was bikini? They had to sell it. It's like, don't worry, he's with us. He's bikini.

• 1:19:55Speaker 02

  He's bikini.

• 1:19:56Dax Shepard?

  It's just funny to say the word bikini like.

• 1:19:57Speaker 02

  It's just so like, yeah, yeah, like it's off.

• 1:19:59Dax Shepard?

  This guy's fucking bikini.

• 1:20:01Speaker 02

  Oh, oh, you don't want to fucking go over there. It's a whole family bikini, right? This place is full.

• 1:20:06Dax Shepard?

  The whole block is fucking bikinis. You don't want to go over there.

• 1:20:09Speaker 02

  The guy parking your car, bikini.

• 1:20:10Dax Shepard?

  Bikini.

• 1:20:11Speaker 02

  The guy sipping your dish, bikini. They're everywhere.

• 1:20:13Dax Shepard?

  Watch your mouth.

• 1:20:14Speaker 02

  So stupid.

• 1:20:15Dax Shepard?

  I want to make sure I'm plugging the right thing. Too much.

• 1:20:17Speaker 02

  Too much.

• 1:20:18Dax Shepard?

  Too much, too much, too much.

• 1:20:19Speaker 02

  You said it first.

• 1:20:20Dax Shepard?

  Great song. Watch the video. Great video.

• 1:20:22Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:20:23Dax Shepard?

  Tell me what's coming this year. Too much is in charge right now.

• 1:20:26Speaker 02

  Too much is running the show.

• 1:20:27Dax Shepard?

  It's the belle of the ball.

• 1:20:28Speaker 02

  She's the belle of the ball. I have a new single coming out very, very soon. We're kind of vacillating between two, but I'm pretty sure I know which one I want it to be. What month is it? March? Okay, I have a new single coming out next month.

• 1:20:40Dax Shepard?

  Okay, great.

• 1:20:40Speaker 02

  And then probably just one more and then somewhere in there, the album.

• 1:20:45Dax Shepard?

  You'll do the album.

• 1:20:47Speaker 02

  We'll do the album.

• 1:20:48Dax Shepard?

  Well, Dove slash Chloe. Your friends call you Chloe, your work associates call you Dove.

• 1:20:54Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 1:20:55Dax Shepard?

  Dove was her dad's nickname for her.

• 1:20:57Speaker 02

  Well, what should we call you? What did we earn today?

• 1:20:59Dax Shepard?

  I want to go with Deloey.

• 1:21:02Speaker 02

  It's like Dolores.

• 1:21:03Dax Shepard?

  Or clove.

• 1:21:04Speaker 02

  Clove.

• 1:21:04Dax Shepard?

  Clove.

• 1:21:05Speaker 02

  Clover is good. Clover. Oh shit. Yeah, get that vape mist in the atmosphere. Get that nicotine mist all up in the atmosphere. Use a little nice smoky set environment.

• 1:21:16Dax Shepard?

  This has been really one of my faves. This was so fun.

• 1:21:19Speaker 02

  Really?

• 1:21:19Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I love if I get a cry in in an episode. Like once a year, I get a cry in.

• 1:21:24Speaker 02

  Once a year. I'm feeling so connected. I'm feeling so high vibing. No, I'm the same.

• 1:21:30Dax Shepard?

  Well, the father daughter stuff's a real cheap shot, so pretty high odds of getting some tears out of me. But this was incredible.

• 1:21:35Speaker 02

  This was so nice.

• 1:21:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I really, really enjoyed this. You're wonderful. You deserve everything.

• 1:21:39Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:21:40Dax Shepard?

  And I'm gonna get your friends gold tooth person.

• 1:21:43Speaker 02

  I'm gonna get your friends gold tooth.

• 1:21:45Dax Shepard?

  The listener viewer will see me at some point in the near future with a gold tooth and we will have you to thank.

• 1:21:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're gonna know this is where it all started.

• 1:21:52Dax Shepard?

  All right, well, come back.

• 1:21:53Speaker 02

  Okay, I will.

• 1:21:54Dax Shepard?

  All right.

• 1:21:54Speaker 02

  Just like tonight for dinner?

• 1:21:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:21:56Speaker 02

  You can just live here.

• 1:21:57Dax Shepard?

  Don't even come back.

• 1:21:58Speaker 02

  A bikini reunion.

• 1:22:02Dax Shepard?

  I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong. Hello. Happy fact check.

• 1:22:12Speaker 01

  Happy fact check. You've been gone.

• 1:22:14Dax Shepard?

  We recorded on Thursday.

• 1:22:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:17Dax Shepard?

  Right?

• 1:22:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:17Dax Shepard?

  Which normally is one second ago.

• 1:22:20Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:22:20Dax Shepard?

  Right?

• 1:22:21Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:22:21Dax Shepard?

  But I went to Disneyland.

• 1:22:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:25Dax Shepard?

  All day Friday.

• 1:22:26Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:22:26Dax Shepard?

  Went there Thursday night, then flew crack ass to Austin on Saturday, went to a sprint race, waved a checkered flag.

• 1:22:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:36Dax Shepard?

  Then went to the race on Sunday, walked another 10 miles, then Monday went to the track and rode all day.

• 1:22:43Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:22:44Dax Shepard?

  Then flew back last night. So I feel like we haven't worked in three weeks.

• 1:22:49Speaker 01

  Right. I also feel like it's been a while.

• 1:22:54Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:22:55Speaker 01

  But for

• 1:22:55Dax Shepard?

  Do you feel rusty?

• 1:22:56Speaker 01

  For the, yeah, I don't remember how to do it. It's for the opposite reason, though.

• 1:23:02Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:23:02Speaker 01

  I, last week, I tried to get everything done.

• 1:23:08Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:23:08Speaker 01

  All the edits, so that I didn't have to work on Friday.

• 1:23:12Dax Shepard?

  With, what were you?

• 1:23:14Speaker 01

  I just didn't want to. I just wanted the day. I needed a day.

• 1:23:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, to relax.

• 1:23:20Speaker 01

  And I did end up having to do a tiny edit in the morning, but it was fine. I was, oh, and I had a meeting, but I was done by 11:30.

• 1:23:29Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. Virtually a three day weekend.

• 1:23:33Speaker 01

  Yes. And then you know what else I did? On Monday?

• 1:23:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:38Speaker 01

  I decided the same thing.

• 1:23:40Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:23:41Speaker 01

  And I was like, I'm gonna just have to do extra on Tuesday, but it's, it's okay.

• 1:23:46Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:23:47Speaker 01

  And I really needed it. I didn't really realize it.

• 1:23:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:51Speaker 01

  But I really needed like, a little tiny chunk of

• 1:23:57Dax Shepard?

  Rusty compress.

• 1:23:58Speaker 01

  Rusty, just getting to decide what I want to do and not think like, and at what point am I gonna go?

• 1:24:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:05Speaker 01

  Open my computer and do X, Y, and Z.

• 1:24:08Dax Shepard?

  I think your skin is proof of it.

• 1:24:10Speaker 01

  I'm wearing new makeup.

• 1:24:11Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. Did you discover that in your leisure time?

• 1:24:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:15Dax Shepard?

  A new brand?

• 1:24:16Speaker 01

  And, well, actually, maybe it's not the makeup, although today is the first day I'm wearing this new makeup.

• 1:24:22Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:24:24Speaker 01

  I have also been using vitamin C serum.

• 1:24:29Speaker 01

  Which does brighten your complexion.

• 1:24:31Dax Shepard?

  It does.

• 1:24:32Speaker 01

  Yes, and I used to use it, but I stopped all my stuff when I went to my new.

• 1:24:38Dax Shepard?

  When you had your hard reset.

• 1:24:39Speaker 01

  When I had my hard reset, the goddess at Corrective Skincare. I like just stopped everything and just did my basic, basic regimen with her. But then I was like, ooh, I'm gonna dip my baby toe in the water.

• 1:24:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you kinda wanted more action.

• 1:24:54Speaker 01

  A little bit.

• 1:24:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:56Speaker 01

  And so far.

• 1:24:58Dax Shepard?

  One day.

• 1:24:59Speaker 01

  No, no, I've had, I've done vitamin C for like a week.

• 1:25:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay. Did you tell her you were going to?

• 1:25:05Speaker 01

  No, but she's cool. She's cool with it.

• 1:25:10Dax Shepard?

  Do I need it?

• 1:25:10Speaker 01

  Vitamin C serum's great.

• 1:25:12Dax Shepard?

  It's a great serum.

• 1:25:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:25:14Dax Shepard?

  Experts agree.

• 1:25:14Speaker 01

  They do. I mean, it's good to wear sunscreen if you're gonna use vitamin C serum.

• 1:25:20Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:25:21Speaker 01

  I don't.

• 1:25:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, well, you're browns. I think that's for people that are white, probably.

• 1:25:26Speaker 01

  No, but actually I am a little nervous. So there is this little thing on my face here. And we don't think it's.

• 1:25:35Dax Shepard?

  Your team?

• 1:25:35Speaker 01

  A hempel.

• 1:25:36Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:25:37Speaker 01

  So now I'm a little anxious that it is some sorry world, that it is some something that might need removal.

• 1:25:45Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:25:46Speaker 01

  Now, if I need it removed, I did think this all through. It was like, what if I have a Band-Aid on my face for like two weeks?

• 1:25:52Dax Shepard?

  That's cool. As long as you say like, I got it, I got careless with a knife and stabbed myself. If there's some kind of cool reason, yeah. Raccoon scratched you.

• 1:26:03Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:26:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, dog bite. But yeah, I had something removed and I have a Band-Aid.

• 1:26:08Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:26:08Dax Shepard?

  Or this is a wart removal.

• 1:26:10Speaker 01

  I don't think it's a wart. I think it would be a.

• 1:26:12Dax Shepard?

  Hypoplasia.

• 1:26:14Speaker 01

  Cancer.

• 1:26:14Dax Shepard?

  Hyper pleasure.

• 1:26:18Speaker 01

  I, look, is it okay really if I have to get this removed and I have to have a Band-Aid on my face for two weeks? I, I think we're gonna have to figure something out. I can't.

• 1:26:28Dax Shepard?

  Perform with a Band-Aid on your face?

• 1:26:29Speaker 01

  I can't. I can't even perform in life. I'll have to be in my room for two weeks.

• 1:26:34Dax Shepard?

  And you don't wanna, you don't wanna ruin one of your trips, because I was gonna say you could have it done right before

• 1:26:39Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:26:40Dax Shepard?

  spring break.

• 1:26:41Speaker 01

  But I really wanna go.

• 1:26:42Speaker 05

  You just gotta do what Sia does.

• 1:26:45Speaker 01

  Oh, wear something over my face.

• 1:26:48Speaker 05

  Or your haircut.

• 1:26:49Speaker 01

  Okay, I like a wig, but it's in front of my face.

• 1:26:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, well, you, I don't think you would need to supplement your hair.

• 1:26:57Speaker 01

  Well, that'd be kind of.

• 1:26:58Dax Shepard?

  Funny to pull it in front of your band-.

• 1:27:00Speaker 01

  Oh, like this?

• 1:27:01Dax Shepard?

  What was it, the time you had, you did pull your hair as much as you could? Cause you had a chemical peel?

• 1:27:09Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:27:10Dax Shepard?

  Remember? And then we had a hot gas. Oh, it was Chris Pine, right?

• 1:27:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:27:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:16Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, that's right. I had it. It wasn't chemical.

• 1:27:19Dax Shepard?

  And there was just like a oval slit in the middle of your face.

• 1:27:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, I really, I wore my hair. I was like really wearing it like.

• 1:27:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like real protective.

• 1:27:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:30Speaker 01

  I guess I'll, okay, fine. I guess I'll do that if I have a band-.

• 1:27:33Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:27:34Speaker 01

  Maybe. I don't know. Oh, speaking of, um, big revelation since the last time we spoke. Oh, shoot, I think I may have cut it.

• 1:27:43Speaker 01

  We talked about hats. I do think I cut it.

• 1:27:46Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:27:46Speaker 01

  We talked about hats, um, cause I don't wear hats ever.

• 1:27:51Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:27:51Speaker 01

  But since we talked about it, I've worn a baseball hat twice.

• 1:27:55Dax Shepard?

  You have, and how do you like, how's it going?

• 1:27:57Speaker 01

  Okay, I like it because I feel like a different Monica when I wear it.

• 1:28:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, it's a whole identity.

• 1:28:05Speaker 01

  It's a completely different identity.

• 1:28:07Dax Shepard?

  And what is that version of Monica like? Likes baseball games?

• 1:28:11Speaker 01

  She's, no, she's very, what's this face?

• 1:28:16Dax Shepard?

  Over it? Oh, she's over it?

• 1:28:18Speaker 01

  No, it's not, it's not so much over it as like, I'm just so chill.

• 1:28:23Dax Shepard?

  By the way, the look you just gave, a woman gave me in a restaurant on Monday night.

• 1:28:28Speaker 01

  Why?

• 1:28:29Dax Shepard?

  I was walking from the bathroom and I like caught eyes with this woman and this man. And like, she was just like looking at me straight and I was just kind of looking at her back straight. And then all of a sudden she went. Like gave me a real weird eye roll. And I was like, that was weird.

• 1:28:48Speaker 01

  What were you wearing?

• 1:28:49Dax Shepard?

  Ah, black t-shirt and jeans. Yeah.

• 1:28:54Speaker 01

  And was it a fancy place?

• 1:28:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no, no, no, no. It's um, it was great. It's Mediterranean. It's right under the Soho House. It was very

• 1:29:04Speaker 01

  I love that

• 1:29:05Dax Shepard?

  Do you know that place? It's got like three letters.

• 1:29:07Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:29:08Dax Shepard?

  R A B or R I

• 1:29:10Speaker 01

  It's not A. I think there's an A in it.

• 1:29:11Dax Shepard?

  A A R B or

• 1:29:14Speaker 01

  It had really, okay, that's the place that Erica, Jess, Laura, and I fled to when we got kicked out of Barton Springs.

• 1:29:22Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 1:29:23Speaker 05

  Abba Austin.

• 1:29:25Speaker 01

  Abba?

• 1:29:26Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:29:26Dax Shepard?

  A B A?

• 1:29:26Speaker 05

  Yep.

• 1:29:27Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:29:28Speaker 01

  A B A.

• 1:29:28Dax Shepard?

  A B A.

• 1:29:29Speaker 01

  Always be achieving.

• 1:29:33Dax Shepard?

  Always be eating.

• 1:29:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, we went there.

• 1:29:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, big, huge tree outside. Yeah.

• 1:29:38Speaker 01

  So cute and tasty as hell.

• 1:29:41Dax Shepard?

  Yes. And then a very funny thing happened, which was, um, I hung out with my friends Amy and Rory the whole time. Rory and I went to the both races together. And what's so nice is he lends me one of his cars while I'm in town.

• 1:29:54Speaker 01

  He did the last time.

• 1:29:55Dax Shepard?

  Very nice car. Yes. When we were there for Unboxed, he also lent it to me. And I, I find that to be one of the most touching things imaginable, just because I'm super into cars.

• 1:30:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:05Dax Shepard?

  And I do not like loaning my cars out.

• 1:30:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:30:07Dax Shepard?

  And it's a very, very nice car.

• 1:30:09Speaker 01

  Very nice.

• 1:30:10Dax Shepard?

  It's a Bentley Speed.

• 1:30:12Speaker 01

  And I was like

• 1:30:13Dax Shepard?

  Crazy. Like it's a car I wouldn't personally

• 1:30:15Speaker 01

  Loan out.

• 1:30:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, or by myself, you know, it's so nice.

• 1:30:19Speaker 01

  It's gorgeous and it's green.

• 1:30:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's a sexy green.

• 1:30:22Speaker 01

  And we went to Dairy Queen in it.

• 1:30:24Dax Shepard?

  I did again.

• 1:30:25Speaker 01

  Nervous.

• 1:30:26Dax Shepard?

  I did again.

• 1:30:26Speaker 01

  You did?

• 1:30:27Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh. Anyways, I love it. I feel so fancy driving around, um, Austin in it. And it really touches me. So we went out to eat on Saturday with his dad and his stepmom and Ange. And I was there for, oh, Lambert's, our spot. So I had put my credit card down soon. I gave it to him as soon as I got there and I was there before them. So the bill comes, I pay, he's furious. He really wants to pay.

• 1:30:51Speaker 01

  You can't pay. You got two steaks.

• 1:30:53Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. I knew I was gonna eat like an asshole and I did. Um, and so what was really funny was he said, okay, tomorrow night, I'm paying.

• 1:31:04Dax Shepard?

  And I said, okay, well, we'll see. And then he texts me in the day, if you don't let me pay, I'm not loaning you my car anymore.

• 1:31:10Speaker 01

  Oh shit.

• 1:31:11Dax Shepard?

  And I said, really good leverage. I'm definitely going to let you pay because I want to borrow your car. And then he decided last minute, I'm going to stay home with the kids. Just Ange is coming, but you must let Ange buy. I was like, okay, okay. So we have this dinner. It's spectacular. There's a woman with a huge group of people. They're all from Minnesota. The manager comes over and says, this woman has bought your dinner.

• 1:31:38Speaker 01

  Oh my gosh. That's so sweet.

• 1:31:43Dax Shepard?

  So I was like, oh my God, Ange, I can't wait for you to go home and say you still, you didn't get to buy, even though I agreed. I didn't buy, but nor did they.

• 1:31:50Speaker 01

  That is the universe giving a big old wink.

• 1:31:54Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes. Very nice woman.

• 1:31:56Speaker 01

  That's so sweet. Shout out.

• 1:31:58Dax Shepard?

  I gave her a big hug, big strong hug.

• 1:32:00Speaker 01

  Oh, okay. That reminds me of two. Okay. That reminds me of something. It has been a long time.

• 1:32:04Dax Shepard?

  Yes, right?

• 1:32:05Speaker 01

  Okay. But pause on that, pin in that.

• 1:32:08Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:32:11Speaker 01

  Let's talk about paying and stuff.

• 1:32:13Dax Shepard?

  Okay, great.

• 1:32:14Speaker 01

  When I first started working for you guys, you know, I only had so much dollars in my pocket.

• 1:32:19Dax Shepard?

  Sure, sure.

• 1:32:20Speaker 01

  And I was coming off a soul cycle and stuff. And then, but we all would hang out as a group and then we go to dinner.

• 1:32:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:27Speaker 01

  And I, I always did, I felt like this is ridiculous that they're paying every time. I think it's bad. And then, you know, people would offer and I would offer.

• 1:32:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:35Speaker 01

  And I think sometimes when you're in the position of paying, you feel like it's a just like gesture of an offer, right? But it's not like I, I think now I'm on sort of the other side of this and I, I do also struggle.

• 1:32:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:56Speaker 01

  Because I want to treat my friends to things.

• 1:33:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:00Speaker 01

  I also understand what it's like when they're saying, please, please let me pay.

• 1:33:07Speaker 01

  And I, cause I'm like, you're ju- I think you're just saying that because you want to be a polite, good person. But actually, what I do know from me is you, if you let someone pay every single time, you end up feeling like a mooch.

• 1:33:22Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:33:23Speaker 01

  And it feels bad.

• 1:33:24Dax Shepard?

  Two things are happening for me, and it's a challenge. One is, um, it was pointed out to me by Tom Hanson, very smart man, who I think learned from a therapist.

• 1:33:33Speaker 01

  Great. We love therapy.

• 1:33:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. He's like, you, you have to, relationships have to be reciprocal.

• 1:33:39Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:33:40Dax Shepard?

  And, um, and that's true. I get that. And it's just a bummer that it has to be seen as reciprocal just financially.

• 1:33:49Speaker 01

  It doesn't though.

• 1:33:50Dax Shepard?

  Because here's my dilemma. So I get it.

• 1:33:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:53Dax Shepard?

  People want to, well, A, they want to treat you and they want to, um, reciprocate, but I have an ethical dilemma with it.

• 1:34:04Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:34:04Dax Shepard?

  Which is like, I get paid too much money.

• 1:34:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:09Dax Shepard?

  It seems crazy that of the two of us, you're working your ass off. That's not to say that that's Rory and Andrew's situation.

• 1:34:17Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no.

• 1:34:17Dax Shepard?

  Just, yeah, just in general, if it.

• 1:34:19Speaker 01

  Everyone's working hard.

• 1:34:21Dax Shepard?

  Everyone's working hard. And if it's a lot less of a ding to me.

• 1:34:24Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:34:25Dax Shepard?

  I just feel ethically like this feels crazy. The example I gave my mom, because my mom tries to pay.

• 1:34:29Speaker 01

  I like this. Yeah.

• 1:34:30Dax Shepard?

  I said, Mom, just imagine we're walking through the desert and you were allotted a half gallon of water and I was allotted a swimming pool.

• 1:34:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:38Dax Shepard?

  And we're traveling through the desert and you want to share your water with me. It's nice, but I just ethically.

• 1:34:42Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:34:43Dax Shepard?

  I think this fucking, it would be so wrong of me to take your water.

• 1:34:46Speaker 01

  I think that too, but what, what there is a risk of.

• 1:34:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:52Speaker 01

  Is a power imbalance does start, can start forming.

• 1:34:56Dax Shepard?

  I know, but what blows is it's mostly in the mind of the person who's getting something for free, which I get. Yes, there are certain personality types that it does lead to resentment.

• 1:35:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:06Dax Shepard?

  Tom telling me that you gotta.

• 1:35:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:08Dax Shepard?

  Make sure you're.

• 1:35:09Speaker 01

  I think it in different, for different people, resentments on both sides.

• 1:35:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:15Speaker 01

  You know, there can definitely be a, I've done so much for you.

• 1:35:19Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:35:20Speaker 01

  And now. And you aren't doing the, you know, whatever. I, I think humans, even though we think we're bigger than that.

• 1:35:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:28Speaker 01

  Sometimes it slips in.

• 1:35:30Dax Shepard?

  We're keeping score. I don't, it's tricky though.

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it's tricky.

• 1:35:34Dax Shepard?

  Well, like I, I'll notice like, okay, I'm about to make Rory mad.

• 1:35:38Speaker 01

  Like you wanna feel equal to anyone in a relationship, friendship, anything, you know? And so if one person, again, it's tricky because I, I feel the same as you. I'm like, I am happy to pay because I also don't contribute in many other ways.

• 1:35:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:56Speaker 01

  That these other people are contributing. So to me it's all equal. But there is something about finances for people that make everyone go bonkers.

• 1:36:04Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:36:05Speaker 01

  I have a friend who does well, but also has times of not being, you know, struggling a little bit.

• 1:36:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:14Speaker 01

  And she is actually like, if I were out to dinner, she'll, she'll definitely offer. And I'm like, no.

• 1:36:24Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:36:24Speaker 01

  Um, and she will just say, thank you. I really appreciate it.

• 1:36:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:36:29Speaker 01

  Because she also understands like, yeah, we just spent this dinner talking about.

• 1:36:35Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. How rough the struggle.

• 1:36:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, that would be kind of crazy for me to be like, okay, yeah, we'll split it in half now.

• 1:36:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just tricks, but money makes relationships complicated.

• 1:36:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:48Speaker 01

  It really does. I hate that, but I think it's real.

• 1:36:52Dax Shepard?

  I know what you'd like to go is like, oh, we're, we're kind of like a group. One of us got this thing. I'm gonna share it.

• 1:36:57Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:36:58Dax Shepard?

  But it is complicated.

• 1:36:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:37:00Dax Shepard?

  And I'm trying to think, when I was on the other end of it.

• 1:37:04Dax Shepard?

  Uh, I wasn't resentful, but I was judgmental.

• 1:37:09Speaker 01

  What do you mean?

• 1:37:10Dax Shepard?

  Like when I was broke and maybe where I'd experience it with is my brother would pay for everything.

• 1:37:16Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:37:16Dax Shepard?

  Which was so nice.

• 1:37:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:37:18Dax Shepard?

  And he really took, he took me on vacations and.

• 1:37:21Speaker 01

  That's nice.

• 1:37:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it was super nice. And it was a nice luxury in those eight years of being broke.

• 1:37:28Dax Shepard?

  But I, cause I coveted money so much and I didn't have it. I would be like, God, they're so wasteful. Like the way they order food, so much stuff goes uneaten.

• 1:37:39Speaker 01

  That's interesting.

• 1:37:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. So I was like often judgmental, which I regret. Cause now surely if you were witnessing me, you would easily say that anyone would. Like I, my thing is I'll order too much food for, if people are over or whatever.

• 1:37:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:37:56Dax Shepard?

  I act just like my brother does.

• 1:37:58Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:37:59Dax Shepard?

  So I have to think, yeah, some people are like, probably maybe fine with it and appreciative and also judgmental. And that's fair. Cause I was.

• 1:38:06Speaker 01

  Huh.

• 1:38:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:08Speaker 01

  It's all based on our.

• 1:38:09Dax Shepard?

  Like I remember walking to my brother's garage and he had, he had so many snowmobiles. And I was like, what the fuck does he need all these? You can only ride one. And he's like, they're not fun unless I can have friends.

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:38:21Dax Shepard?

  Come ride. And my friends don't own them.

• 1:38:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:25Dax Shepard?

  And um, yeah, I look at my garage and I'm like, yeah, there's three motors that I don't need. But when Aaron's here, we ride together or you know, they're only fun if I can.

• 1:38:33Speaker 01

  Maybe you should apologize to him.

• 1:38:35Dax Shepard?

  Maybe I should. That's a good idea.

• 1:38:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:38Dax Shepard?

  But I don't know if he knew I was, I guess.

• 1:38:41Speaker 01

  He's like, now it starts a new fight.

• 1:38:43Dax Shepard?

  Occasionally listens. So maybe this would get to him.

• 1:38:45Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:38:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's so, it's so based on our, our past too. Cause I don't, I don't think I had judgment over like excess. But I didn't grow up feeling like I didn't have enough.

• 1:39:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:39:05Speaker 01

  So that's probably why.

• 1:39:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:07Speaker 01

  But I definitely felt like I need to be an equal here.

• 1:39:11Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:39:12Speaker 01

  And that's my own back, that's my own past stuff. Okay. Now back to my pen.

• 1:39:16Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:39:17Speaker 01

  Something bad happened.

• 1:39:20Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:39:22Speaker 01

  Okay, you know, on the streets of places, there are people with clipboards.

• 1:39:29Dax Shepard?

  Yes, who are trying to sign you up for things.

• 1:39:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, so trying to sign you up for things. They are always like, it's always a nice cause. Yeah, I, you know, I, I believe in these people's hearts.

• 1:39:42Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:39:43Speaker 01

  They have good hearts, probably. I don't know them, but I'm never gonna stop and sign a thing on a clipboard.

• 1:39:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:54Speaker 01

  And in fact, when I see, when I like approach anyone with a clipboard, I get like this sense of dread.

• 1:40:01Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes, I think we all do.

• 1:40:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it's pretty universal. And I think like, ah, what are they, why?

• 1:40:08Dax Shepard?

  It's even worse than someone panhandling. You've somehow like that, you've worked through the guilt of that years ago.

• 1:40:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:40:16Dax Shepard?

  And those first, they want something. This is like, they want a good change, whether or not I agree with their.

• 1:40:22Speaker 01

  Right, they want change for the world.

• 1:40:23Dax Shepard?

  They're out there like volunteering.

• 1:40:25Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:40:25Dax Shepard?

  I know.

• 1:40:26Speaker 01

  And they don't, all it would take is just a few minutes of conversation and my signature.

• 1:40:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but I've, I've read some of those things. I'm like, I'm actually not aligned with this. That's happened to me.

• 1:40:37Speaker 01

  But they know, they're smart. They're very smart because they know what to say, right? They'll say, they'll say.

• 1:40:44Dax Shepard?

  Do you want reproductive rights?

• 1:40:45Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:40:46Dax Shepard?

  Sign this, um, non-toxin apple. Yeah.

• 1:40:49Speaker 01

  Do you believe in trans rights? That's a big one where I'm like, yes, but I'm not, I don't want to talk to you. Like, it's like, it gets.

• 1:40:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:40:57Speaker 01

  And so my normal method is just to like, I just say sorry and I just keep walking with my head down.

• 1:41:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:05Speaker 01

  I say sorry honestly with a little bit of like anger.

• 1:41:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, irritability. And, um, Callie taught me, she said, I think a good way to do it is to say, not today, but thank you. And keep going. And I was like, that's polite. It also, it also says. I will, just not today.

• 1:41:27Dax Shepard?

  Yep, and then.

• 1:41:28Speaker 01

  And thank you for your service.

• 1:41:29Dax Shepard?

  So then you can't go back there if you've used that method. It can't be a place you visit every day.

• 1:41:34Speaker 01

  Well, if you think they're gonna be there every day.

• 1:41:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like if you are going grocery shopping, great, that's once a week.

• 1:41:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:40Dax Shepard?

  But your normal Starbucks, you can't say next time because you'll see them the next day.

• 1:41:46Speaker 05

  They're outside Maru a lot.

• 1:41:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:41:48Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:41:49Speaker 05

  I've walked like four blocks out of the way to avoid.

• 1:41:52Speaker 01

  See?

• 1:41:53Dax Shepard?

  Their brain on the.

• 1:41:55Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:41:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:57Speaker 01

  Okay, so I, I practiced, okay, she taught me that, I was like, that's good, I'm gonna start adopting that, cuz I don't like the way it feels when I say sorry.

• 1:42:05Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:42:06Speaker 01

  So a couple of days later, I was on Larchmont, of course, there's clipboarders. I don't remember what they were trying to get me to do, but I, I said, not today, thank you. I got a little tripped up because he said, I like your pants.

• 1:42:23Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:42:24Speaker 01

  And I was like, oh, thank you, and then he got.

• 1:42:27Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yeah.

• 1:42:28Speaker 01

  And then he came in again, and I was like, oh, not today, but I'd already said it, so that one wasn't great.

• 1:42:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:33Speaker 01

  That wasn't great, that was my first attempt. And then, on Friday, this past Friday, you're gonna hate this. Yeah, my day off, I decided to go shopping, obviously, and on Sycamore, and so I was walking, I see some clipboarders, but I don't, they're actually not holding a clipboard this time, but they have like some sort of setup, you know?

• 1:42:57Dax Shepard?

  A kiosk?

• 1:42:58Speaker 01

  A makeshift something.

• 1:43:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:01Speaker 01

  And, and I was like, oh, no, okay, not today, thanks, like, I practiced in my head.

• 1:43:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:07Speaker 01

  And then I went, I started to walk past, and they said, something like, do you like the earth?

• 1:43:16Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, you like breathing fresh air.

• 1:43:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, or do you care about the environment? Or maybe it was like, do you wanna protect something? It wasn't actually that me, or you know, that aggressive.

• 1:43:25Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:43:26Speaker 01

  And I said, no, not today, uh, no, and then I got anxious, and so then I started walking really fast, and then the woman, there was, it was a woman and a man, and the woman said. Are you?

• 1:43:41Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no.

• 1:43:41Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:43:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Wow. Uh huh.

• 1:43:46Speaker 01

  She said, are you Monica? And I said, oh, yeah, I am. And I'm still walking. I mean, this is a nightmare.

• 1:43:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Now you want to start running.

• 1:43:54Speaker 01

  And I, like, my pace is picking up. And I was like, yeah, oh, yeah, I am. And she was like, oh, my God, I, I'm, I'm a huge fan. And I'm, I'm walking still. I can't stop.

• 1:44:05Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:44:06Speaker 01

  That's worse, right? It's worse if I'm like, oh, you're a fan? I guess I will come over and chit chat with you about the earth. Like,

• 1:44:13Dax Shepard?

  Right. Oof. Yeah, this is a

• 1:44:15Speaker 01

  Really big pickle.

• 1:44:16Dax Shepard?

  Two, two. Yeah.

• 1:44:18Speaker 01

  So, yeah, and I was like, oh, thank you so much. And I, I meant that. I'm very grateful that this very nice person who's spending, I'm going shopping and this person's spending her day for the earth.

• 1:44:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:30Speaker 01

  And, and she is a fan of us. It's like, this feels like opposite world.

• 1:44:37Dax Shepard?

  Really? Make it even worse.

• 1:44:38Speaker 01

  She's a fan of you.

• 1:44:39Dax Shepard?

  It gets through of me to

• 1:44:41Speaker 01

  Well, now she, we probably lost her.

• 1:44:43Dax Shepard?

  God, Monica, you should have signed. Just sign.

• 1:44:46Speaker 01

  Fuck. I didn't have to. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This was, this was actually a part of it. I had parked on the street where it was gonna start towing in 40 minutes.

• 1:44:57Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you got a time clock.

• 1:44:58Speaker 01

  I was on a clock and I hadn't even gotten to the store yet.

• 1:45:02Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. You didn't have time to get political or you didn't have time to be an activist that day.

• 1:45:08Speaker 01

  I didn't.

• 1:45:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:09Speaker 01

  It was a shopping. It was my free day.

• 1:45:13Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

• 1:45:19Dax Shepard?

  We are supported by Walden University. You know that feeling when you've been thinking about making a move, going after the degree, the promotion, the thing you keep telling yourself you'll get to someday? Walden University is built for that moment. For over 50 years, Walden has helped working professionals get the W, the knowledge, the skills, and the confidence to create real change in their careers and communities. Their programs are designed around your life, not the other way around. With Tempo Learning, Available in select programs. There are no rigid schedules or set weekly deadlines. You move at your own pace and Walden's faculty aren't just academics. They're practitioners who bring real world experience into everything they teach.

• 1:46:02Dax Shepard?

  From your first class to career coaching and beyond, Walden is your partner the whole way. Take the first step and learn at a pace that works for you. Visit walden.edu. Walden University. Set a course for change. Certified to operate by CHEV.

• 1:46:26Dax Shepard?

  I just say, I'm very happy. I'm not sorry.

• 1:46:30Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:46:31Dax Shepard?

  I just go, oh, no, thanks.

• 1:46:32Speaker 01

  Like literally outside of Skylight Books, they say, do you, do you care about the kids and children in Palestine?

• 1:46:40Dax Shepard?

  Oh, boy.

• 1:46:41Speaker 01

  It's so like saying, no, thank you. You've said no, it feels like bad energy.

• 1:46:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, right.

• 1:46:49Speaker 01

  And that's why I just say, sorry.

• 1:46:52Dax Shepard?

  I'm so sorry. I'm a bad person.

• 1:46:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's like.

• 1:46:55Dax Shepard?

  I'm a bad person.

• 1:46:58Speaker 01

  The subtext.

• 1:46:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:47:00Speaker 01

  Anyhow.

• 1:47:01Dax Shepard?

  Well, I hope they clean that up. That's soliciting. All these signs, all these places have signs that say no.

• 1:47:07Speaker 01

  I should start my own that's to get these clipboarders gone?

• 1:47:11Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. That would be ironic. Yeah, petition to get rid of a measure. State measure to get rid of. You can't hold the clipboard.

• 1:47:20Speaker 01

  Bad ever. They're doing such, everyone's so, they're good people. Like I recognize that, but I, I just don't, I think honestly, I feel pessimistic that signing this thing is going to do anything for the children in Palestine.

• 1:47:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:41Speaker 01

  Um, I, what I want to say is like, I've already, I already support them. I've already given money. I've already done my part on both sides. So don't come over here. Also, you guys, you clipboarders over here. I'm doing my part.

• 1:47:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:56Speaker 01

  Signing this to me means nothing and all you've done is make me so mad.

• 1:48:03Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:48:05Speaker 01

  At this cause now. Now I'm mad at your cause.

• 1:48:09Dax Shepard?

  Right. Now I don't like any of the kids of the world.

• 1:48:12Speaker 01

  I hate the children of the world now.

• 1:48:16Dax Shepard?

  I'm glad I'm not, um, I'm not getting that much clipboard traffic. Thank goodness.

• 1:48:20Speaker 01

  You don't walk very much.

• 1:48:22Dax Shepard?

  It does make me remember though, you know, in the airport before, back when you could go through security without a plane ticket, pre nine 11.

• 1:48:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:28Dax Shepard?

  There were all kinds of people working in the airport and there is a whole legion of people that come up and they would hand you a little piece of paper and you look at it, maybe it was lightly like a present, like it was a tiny little trinket and then you'd open up and it would say like, I'm deaf and mute. They're working. They were, they used to work LAX hard. And I remember being like, maybe Chris and I there and like someone was coming up with a little trinket and I'm like, don't take it. Don't take the trinket. Don't.

• 1:48:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:56Dax Shepard?

  Because that one feels like a, also you're going to get a, um, a hex or a.

• 1:49:02Speaker 01

  Exactly. Exactly. A spell on you.

• 1:49:04Dax Shepard?

  You might get a spell on you. If you take the trinket and you've touched it and then you don't give them money.

• 1:49:09Speaker 01

  I know. Is that like, is that our generation? We like saw some movie or something that taught us about spells or something.

• 1:49:17Dax Shepard?

  Slimmer or something. That's a thinner, right? Is that it? It's not Spielberg, but.

• 1:49:24Speaker 01

  I don't know who it is, but Jess talks about thinner all the time.

• 1:49:27Dax Shepard?

  King, Stephen King.

• 1:49:28Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:49:29Dax Shepard?

  He gets a, uh, what'd you call it? It's not a hex.

• 1:49:32Speaker 01

  No, a scary man touch, like will touch you and say thinner and then you like get really thin and you disappear.

• 1:49:42Dax Shepard?

  Yep.

• 1:49:43Speaker 05

  Curse.

• 1:49:44Dax Shepard?

  A curse. Yes.

• 1:49:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. That's so funny that you bring that. I've never seen it and I had never heard of it. But one time, remember I was at, again, cause I walk so much.

• 1:49:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:55Speaker 01

  I was at a stop light, ready to cross, a unhoused person, um, touched me.

• 1:50:02Dax Shepard?

  Right. I remember that. Yes. Cause it kind of caressed your back.

• 1:50:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. And it was really creepy and I really didn't like it. And then when I told Jess, he said, thinner?

• 1:50:11Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay. So that was your big update.

• 1:50:14Speaker 01

  That was a big update of mine. Yeah.

• 1:50:16Dax Shepard?

  The clipboards.

• 1:50:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:17Dax Shepard?

  I like it. It was a good one. But you told me you had an update. I just wanted to make sure that I got.

• 1:50:21Speaker 01

  I do have another update.

• 1:50:22Dax Shepard?

  You have another update.

• 1:50:22Speaker 01

  Well, but do you want to tell me any of your updates?

• 1:50:24Dax Shepard?

  Let me see if I wrote anything down in my, um, fact check category. Oh, you know, I've actually formed a, um, I encourage you to do this. I made a notes folder called bucket list. I've never actually had a bucket list. Have you ever actually written down a bucket list?

• 1:50:39Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:50:41Dax Shepard?

  But I thought it was a good idea. So I've done, I've

• 1:50:43Speaker 01

  Oh, what's on it?

• 1:50:44Dax Shepard?

  Isle of Man. That's a motorcycle race on the Isle of Man. It's crazy.

• 1:50:48Speaker 01

  The one you taught us about here. You said people die.

• 1:50:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, every year someone dies. Um, I gotta go to that. Uh, that Iowa bicycle ride that you cross Iowa.

• 1:50:57Speaker 01

  Do you need to be in it or can you just go?

• 1:51:00Dax Shepard?

  I'll probably do, there's a day before the race, maybe Saturday or Friday where you can ride the course.

• 1:51:07Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:51:08Dax Shepard?

  It has a crazy name, but I would like to ride the course and spectate for the madness.

• 1:51:13Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:51:15Dax Shepard?

  The bicycle ride across Iowa.

• 1:51:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:51:17Dax Shepard?

  That sounds so fun.

• 1:51:18Speaker 01

  Great.

• 1:51:19Dax Shepard?

  And then the great loop on a boat, which I've talked about before.

• 1:51:23Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:51:23Dax Shepard?

  6,000 mile.

• 1:51:25Speaker 01

  Of course, all of yours are, um,

• 1:51:28Dax Shepard?

  Transportation oriented, king of conveyance.

• 1:51:31Speaker 01

  King of conveyance.

• 1:51:33Dax Shepard?

  The king in conveyance. Uh, oh no, I haven't written anything down.

• 1:51:37Speaker 01

  Okay. Well, yesterday.

• 1:51:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:40Speaker 01

  I relearned Mahjong.

• 1:51:44Speaker 01

  Rachel, Anthony, Allison, and I used to play Mahjong a lot.

• 1:51:47Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:51:48Speaker 01

  Um, way back in the day and now it's like hip, like everyone's playing Mahjong.

• 1:51:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I think Kristen went to like a Mahjong learning day at a friend's house. And there's different countries of origin, versions of Mahjong.

• 1:52:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, American Mahjong is, is the one that like Jewish women.

• 1:52:10Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:52:10Speaker 01

  Play.

• 1:52:11Dax Shepard?

  All right.

• 1:52:11Speaker 01

  And that's the one that's taken off.

• 1:52:15Dax Shepard?

  But there's an Asian one too.

• 1:52:17Speaker 01

  It's originally Chinese, Mahjong is, but this is different and, um, it's so fun, but I had forgotten. I completely forgot how to play, but I felt like annoyed that it was back in, it's like in vogue.

• 1:52:31Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:52:31Speaker 01

  And I was pre.

• 1:52:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:34Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:52:35Dax Shepard?

  Is it more complicated than spades?

• 1:52:36Speaker 01

  It's so complicated.

• 1:52:39Dax Shepard?

  So complicated.

• 1:52:40Speaker 01

  But in in such a fun way. I think you'll like it.

• 1:52:42Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 1:52:44Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, there's parts you're not gonna like, cuz there's a lot of pomp and circumstance.

• 1:52:50Dax Shepard?

  A lot of pageantry?

• 1:52:51Speaker 01

  Yes, there's a whole way of like the way you set up and then you like push your wall out and then the way you deal is very specific and then you do this thing called the Charleston, which is a way of passing.

• 1:53:03Dax Shepard?

  Hmm.

• 1:53:04Speaker 01

  And, um, yes, and then you have a booklet. It's a new one every year.

• 1:53:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:53:10Speaker 01

  The National Mahjong League puts out a new card every year.

• 1:53:16Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:53:16Speaker 01

  And so each card has like many, many lines of variations of what you're basically trying to make on your board.

• 1:53:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Okay.

• 1:53:25Speaker 01

  And it's so fun. Um, and it was.

• 1:53:28Dax Shepard?

  And you play with tiles?

• 1:53:30Speaker 01

  Tiles.

• 1:53:30Dax Shepard?

  Tiles.

• 1:53:31Speaker 01

  And I was, obviously, I bought a set.

• 1:53:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, real nice set.

• 1:53:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, but actually, mine's a little cheeky, like.

• 1:53:37Dax Shepard?

  Oh, playful?

• 1:53:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, the wins have, um, wins are a part one suit-ish of of the tiles. Mine have mermaids on them.

• 1:53:46Dax Shepard?

  Oh, fun.

• 1:53:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. So anyway, um, I, I was really reinvigorated by it. I didn't win. We played two games and I did not win, so.

• 1:53:57Dax Shepard?

  That was hard.

• 1:53:58Speaker 01

  That is not sitting well.

• 1:54:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:54:02Speaker 01

  Rachel grew up playing Mahjong. Her, she's been playing for 27 years.

• 1:54:06Dax Shepard?

  Right. There's like the girls in spades. They'll be unstoppable.

• 1:54:09Speaker 01

  Exactly. And her mom plays in tournaments and stuff.

• 1:54:12Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:54:13Speaker 01

  And, um, so she's the one that taught me and then she taught us yesterday, which was really fun. But also what I think I want to do. I feel bad because Amy listens to this show religiously. Shout out. Hi, Amy. Amy was there last night as part of the learning group, but

• 1:54:34Dax Shepard?

  Who hosted the learning group?

• 1:54:35Speaker 01

  Me.

• 1:54:36Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:54:38Speaker 01

  I did with, it was just Laura and Amy and Rachel.

• 1:54:41Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:54:41Speaker 01

  And then I think what I'm gonna do to get ahead is have another group.

• 1:54:51Dax Shepard?

  Oh, an accelerated group?

• 1:54:52Speaker 01

  No, just so that I, I'm playing double.

• 1:54:55Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:54:56Speaker 01

  And with, with another, with Elizabeth as the teacher. So just in case there, Rachel and Elizabeth have different techniques, I want it all.

• 1:55:07Dax Shepard?

  Okay. You're committed to getting really good at it?

• 1:55:10Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:55:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. I guess I should learn. I'm, I'm in the process of learning Bridge, which our lessons are like every two months and we all forget.

• 1:55:18Speaker 01

  Who's teaching?

• 1:55:20Dax Shepard?

  This nice gentleman.

• 1:55:21Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:55:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he's a professional Bridge player and teacher. Yeah.

• 1:55:26Speaker 01

  Well, that's fun.

• 1:55:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. But we forget because we've only done two or three lessons and they, over six months.

• 1:55:33Speaker 01

  That's not good.

• 1:55:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I gotta hit it much harder than that.

• 1:55:36Speaker 01

  Anyway, that's my update.

• 1:55:38Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wonderful.

• 1:55:40Speaker 01

  That's my big update. Okay. This is for Dove.

• 1:55:43Dax Shepard?

  Ah.

• 1:55:44Speaker 01

  Great episode.

• 1:55:46Dax Shepard?

  What a lovely episode.

• 1:55:47Speaker 01

  Beautiful episode.

• 1:55:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. I love her.

• 1:55:50Speaker 01

  Love her.

• 1:55:51Dax Shepard?

  I love them.

• 1:55:53Speaker 01

  For people who don't remember, that was Seth.

• 1:55:56Dax Shepard?

  Seth's daughter.

• 1:55:57Speaker 01

  Seth's daughter.

• 1:55:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:58Speaker 01

  Seth Green's daughter.

• 1:56:00Dax Shepard?

  Seth Green's beautiful. Beautiful doesn't even describe it. She's a

• 1:56:03Speaker 01

  Sparkly as hell.

• 1:56:05Dax Shepard?

  She's a fairy.

• 1:56:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:56:07Dax Shepard?

  She's like Tinker Bell.

• 1:56:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:56:09Dax Shepard?

  But with red hair. I don't, I don't know what color hair Tinker Bell had. Probably blonde.

• 1:56:14Speaker 01

  Probably.

• 1:56:14Dax Shepard?

  They like to put those sprites in those fairies, make them blonde.

• 1:56:17Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:56:18Dax Shepard?

  Perpetuate.

• 1:56:19Speaker 01

  That blondes have more fun because they're fairies.

• 1:56:21Dax Shepard?

  They make wishes and dreams come true.

• 1:56:24Speaker 01

  Um, okay. Bloomers.

• 1:56:27Dax Shepard?

  Bloomers.

• 1:56:27Speaker 01

  Where do they originate? The bloomer, the Turkish dress, the American dress. Oh, this is kind of a ding ding ding to Majong.

• 1:56:33Dax Shepard?

  It is, yeah.

• 1:56:35Speaker 01

  Locations. Um, or simply reformed dress are divided women's garments for the lower body. They were developed in the 19th century as a healthful and comfortable alternative to the heavy constricting dresses worn by American women. They take their name from their best known advocate, the women's rights activist Amelia Bloomer.

• 1:56:54Dax Shepard?

  Now, is it just a skirt? Or there's pants in it? There's legs?

• 1:56:58Speaker 01

  There's legs.

• 1:56:59Dax Shepard?

  There's legs. It's like not a skirt.

• 1:57:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, a bloomer is like.

• 1:57:03Dax Shepard?

  Shorts?

• 1:57:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:57:04Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:57:05Speaker 01

  The name Bloomers was derogatory and was not used by the women who wore them, who referred to their clothes as the reformed costume or the American dress.

• 1:57:13Dax Shepard?

  Hmm.

• 1:57:14Speaker 01

  The bloomer costume caught on among some white, middle-class women who sought, quote, "dress reform as an integral part of the fight for women's equality in the mid 1800s." Well, that's cool.

• 1:57:26Dax Shepard?

  My thing would be back then, you didn't have washing machines. You're still hand washing everything?

• 1:57:31Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:57:32Dax Shepard?

  The notion of splitting up the dress into two pieces sounds smart, because what if the top got dirty but not the bottom? Or vice versa?

• 1:57:39Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 1:57:39Dax Shepard?

  You sat in a little something. You could just wash the bottom.

• 1:57:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:57:43Dax Shepard?

  But the top remained clean.

• 1:57:46Speaker 01

  True.

• 1:57:46Dax Shepard?

  It seems like it cut, it would cut laundry down.

• 1:57:49Speaker 01

  That's true. What did they use? Just regular soap?

• 1:57:52Dax Shepard?

  Lye?

• 1:57:53Speaker 01

  Ew.

• 1:57:54Dax Shepard?

  I think. Which is also what you can decompose a body with.

• 1:57:57Speaker 01

  Ugh.

• 1:57:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you put a body in a barrel.

• 1:58:01Speaker 01

  Don't teach people how to do that.

• 1:58:03Dax Shepard?

  And then you open it up in a couple hours and it's just, uh, jello.

• 1:58:06Speaker 01

  Ew!

• 1:58:07Dax Shepard?

  No, I don't know what it is.

• 1:58:08Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. Ew. That was so, I like saw it. I saw it.

• 1:58:16Dax Shepard?

  You saw?

• 1:58:17Speaker 01

  A jello body.

• 1:58:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:58:19Speaker 01

  Okay. Does having lots of drink meat, drinks around you mean you have ADHD? And no, not necessarily.

• 1:58:26Dax Shepard?

  It doesn't.

• 1:58:27Speaker 01

  It could be the result of many things. A busy lifestyle, forgetfulness, unrelated ADHD, or simply a preference for having multiple options available.

• 1:58:37Dax Shepard?

  Hmm.

• 1:58:38Speaker 01

  Okay, the gooey duck, which she brought up, the gooey duck.

• 1:58:44Speaker 01

  Hunt or whatever, gather. Rob, can you bring up the pic? It's a, it's a wild looking disgusting clam.

• 1:58:55Dax Shepard?

  Would you eat it?

• 1:58:55Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:58:56Dax Shepard?

  Having seen a photo?

• 1:58:57Speaker 01

  No, and I like seafood, but uh-uh.

• 1:59:01Dax Shepard?

  Not this seafood.

• 1:59:02Speaker 01

  Native to the coastal waters of the eastern North Pacific Ocean, from Alaska to Baja California.

• 1:59:08Dax Shepard?

  Teeming with.

• 1:59:10Speaker 01

  Oh my God. Typical lifespan of 140 years.

• 1:59:14Dax Shepard?

  Oh my God, you could be eating an animal that's 130 years old?

• 1:59:18Speaker 01

  Oh, that feels, that feels unethical.

• 1:59:20Dax Shepard?

  It does.

• 1:59:21Speaker 01

  Eww.

• 1:59:24Dax Shepard?

  Gross. It looks like a white elephant penis. Yeah.

• 1:59:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, it really looks disgusting.

• 1:59:33Dax Shepard?

  I don't understand for the listener, the clam shell only covers about 33% of this thing's body. I don't even understand.

• 1:59:42Speaker 01

  Ew.

• 1:59:43Dax Shepard?

  Oh my God, that's so phallic. And the clam looks, the shell looks like balls in this photo. This looks like a cowboy. Well, it's that cowboy.

• 1:59:52Speaker 01

  Very penis-y.

• 1:59:53Dax Shepard?

  Oh my, oh boy, I can't imagine eating this. It's so good for everyone who eats it. And then what's inside a big ball?

• 2:00:02Speaker 01

  Well, that's the clammy part. I think that's the gooey.

• 2:00:06Speaker 05

  Yeah, it looks like the skin is peeled off. That's that bottom part.

• 2:00:09Dax Shepard?

  Oh, revealing all that tender delicious.

• 2:00:14Speaker 01

  It's, that one's uncut.

• 2:00:15Dax Shepard?

  And it's called a gooey duck?

• 2:00:17Speaker 01

  Or that one's cut. Sorry, excuse me. That one's circumcised.

• 2:00:22Dax Shepard?

  Oh man, God bless.

• 2:00:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:00:24Dax Shepard?

  What do you put on that thing? Fucking wasabi or something to kill the?

• 2:00:29Speaker 01

  I mean, if it's, if it's clams, I guess you boil them maybe?

• 2:00:34Dax Shepard?

  Slice it into tiny chunks?

• 2:00:36Speaker 05

  Yeah, you, you blanch or boil it and then you enjoy it raw or shishimi or cook it in various ways, like stir frying.

• 2:00:45Dax Shepard?

  Anyone putting it on a hot dog bun? Eating it like a tube steak?

• 2:00:49Speaker 01

  Wait, this says the shaft can

• 2:00:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, boy.

• 2:00:53Speaker 01

  Can be one meter, three feet.

• 2:00:57Dax Shepard?

  Oh, definitely a elephant size.

• 2:01:00Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:01:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:02Speaker 01

  It's the largest browing clam in the world. And as we said, one of the longest living animals of any type.

• 2:01:09Dax Shepard?

  Wow.

• 2:01:10Speaker 01

  Oldest has been recorded at one hundred and seventy nine years old.

• 2:01:14Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 2:01:15Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. I feel like it's not good to eat these. You could be cutting off.

• 2:01:21Dax Shepard?

  What's better to eat an animal that had a hundred and fifty year life or to eat one that has only got a year and then you rob half of it?

• 2:01:29Speaker 01

  Huh.

• 2:01:31Dax Shepard?

  Probably the former.

• 2:01:35Dax Shepard?

  We'd agree if someone was eating humans.

• 2:01:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:01:38Dax Shepard?

  It'd be a lot better if they ate our hundred year olds than our children.

• 2:01:42Speaker 01

  Fuck. I guess that's true, but you're also, if you ate a fifty year old gooey duck.

• 2:01:52Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:01:52Speaker 01

  You're you're cutting off. Yeah, like you're really prematurely.

• 2:01:58Dax Shepard?

  Robbing it of a hundred.

• 2:01:59Speaker 01

  Hundred years.

• 2:02:00Dax Shepard?

  A hundred and twenty years. Oh, boy. Well, we don't have to deal with this because we're not going to eat any gooey duck.

• 2:02:07Speaker 01

  Or people.

• 2:02:08Dax Shepard?

  Anytime soon.

• 2:02:10Speaker 01

  Okay, Disney's music label. Disney Music Group is home to Hollywood Records.

• 2:02:17Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:02:18Speaker 01

  That was a fact. Queerbaiting. Queerbaiting is a marketing technique for fiction and entertainment in which creators hint at, but do not depict same sex romance or other LGBTQ plus representation, or this as harassment, abuse, or targeted provocation of gay people.

• 2:02:36Dax Shepard?

  Do we want to discuss if I'm queer bait or not?

• 2:02:39Speaker 01

  If you want. Do you think you are?

• 2:02:43Dax Shepard?

  Um.

• 2:02:43Speaker 01

  You're not queer bait. It's not like.

• 2:02:46Dax Shepard?

  That's what that was a derogatory term in elementary school.

• 2:02:49Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:02:49Dax Shepard?

  Queer bait.

• 2:02:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:02:51Dax Shepard?

  Queer bait. It's so weird.

• 2:02:53Speaker 01

  So weird.

• 2:02:54Dax Shepard?

  Cause it's not even, you're just saying you're attractive to queers.

• 2:02:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, but back then, anything having to do with.

• 2:03:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, anything.

• 2:03:02Speaker 01

  Anything gay.

• 2:03:02Dax Shepard?

  Adjacent to gay was.

• 2:03:04Speaker 01

  Remember when Gap had, do you remember this? And maybe that was just my gen. For a while, like wearing Gap, Gap stood for gay and proud.

• 2:03:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh, oops.

• 2:03:15Speaker 01

  Yeah. So it's like you weren't like, if you wore that, people would say gay and proud.

• 2:03:19Dax Shepard?

  Boy, how is a company, do you like?

• 2:03:21Speaker 01

  Combat that.

• 2:03:22Dax Shepard?

  Combat that, um, include everyone and also go, we're not a strictly gay.

• 2:03:26Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 2:03:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:03:27Speaker 01

  But that was before now that, isn't that so funny? Just not an issue.

• 2:03:33Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 2:03:33Speaker 01

  Not, thank God.

• 2:03:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:03:35Speaker 01

  Speaking of, real quick, um, what I am noticing, maybe we already talked about this. We did, I'm really sorry. But it's so funny to me, watching ER, what was so important back then? And what was like a top of mind fear wise.

• 2:03:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. What was going on?

• 2:03:54Speaker 01

  AIDS.

• 2:03:54Dax Shepard?

  AIDS.

• 2:03:55Speaker 01

  There are so many episodes about AIDS.

• 2:03:59Dax Shepard?

  Really?

• 2:03:59Speaker 01

  So many storylines.

• 2:04:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:04:02Speaker 01

  Chee Chee, this four year old boy died of AIDS. It was horrible. He was so cute.

• 2:04:09Dax Shepard?

  There's a very famous clip of, um, Walker, Texas Ranger, the Chuck Norris show.

• 2:04:15Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 2:04:15Dax Shepard?

  You didn't see it, but you know exactly what it is.

• 2:04:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:04:19Dax Shepard?

  And I want to say it's Haley Jo Osment is the guest star. He's a little kid.

• 2:04:24Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:04:25Dax Shepard?

  And it's this clip that goes around my Instagram all the time. And it's Walker talk and he's with the little Haley Jo Osment and they're talking to other men. And Haley goes, yeah. And then Walker and I really had a long talk and that's when I told him I have AIDS.

• 2:04:43Dax Shepard?

  It's like, how dare they, how dare they make this scene? It's like four cowboys, like, I don't know.

• 2:04:50Speaker 01

  Wow. I mean, good for them for trying to-

• 2:04:54Dax Shepard?

  Oh, do we have it? Oh my God, Rob, you're incredible. We're coming, we're coming to clip show and I like it. Are we gonna have volume is the question?

• 2:05:03Speaker 01

  Oh, there's a woman involved.

• 2:05:06Dax Shepard?

  Oh, maybe I misremembered who, who he's talking to.

• 2:05:08Speaker 01

  It makes sense if it was a woman.

• 2:05:26Speaker 01

  Oh my God.

• 2:05:29Dax Shepard?

  Well, even better.

• 2:05:31Dax Shepard?

  Walker told me I have AIDS.

• 2:05:33Speaker 01

  Oh my God.

• 2:05:35Dax Shepard?

  How on earth did that fall under Walker's purview?

• 2:05:39Speaker 01

  It was a big non sequitur.

• 2:05:40Dax Shepard?

  I'll say, they were like talking about Cherokee and the boys picked up some other language and then Walker told me I have AIDS. What if he just guessed? They're not based on any lab results.

• 2:05:51Speaker 01

  Oh my God.

• 2:05:52Dax Shepard?

  Little man, I think you have AIDS, just judging from the way you walk and-

• 2:05:56Speaker 01

  What year was that? 90s?

• 2:05:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, 90s, 90s was a really big time for AIDS.

• 2:06:05Dax Shepard?

  That are, yeah, I think I'm imagining, uh, Gen Z and stuff, like when I was in 11th grade or 10th grade, turned 16, magic came out.

• 2:06:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:16Dax Shepard?

  As having AIDS.

• 2:06:17Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 2:06:17Dax Shepard?

  Or HIV.

• 2:06:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:18Dax Shepard?

  In a book. And it was, oh my God, he's gonna die and

• 2:06:23Speaker 01

  I know.

• 2:06:24Dax Shepard?

  Everyone's gonna die that gets it.

• 2:06:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:26Dax Shepard?

  It's so different.

• 2:06:27Speaker 01

  So diff- I mean, do kids even know about AIDS now?

• 2:06:31Dax Shepard?

  My kids don't ever bring up AIDS.

• 2:06:34Speaker 01

  I, I was so scared of AIDS. It was in my prayer.

• 2:06:38Dax Shepard?

  It was.

• 2:06:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:40Dax Shepard?

  Even though you didn't do any of the things-

• 2:06:41Speaker 01

  I didn't know. I just knew it was a scary thing. So part of it was, um, no cancer, AIDS.

• 2:06:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. I remember on the other end.

• 2:06:50Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:06:51Dax Shepard?

  Reading a article that said of the population in New York that had HIV.

• 2:07:00Speaker 01

  Uh-huh.

• 2:07:01Dax Shepard?

  Ninety-two percent were either gay men or intervening as drug users.

• 2:07:05Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:07:06Dax Shepard?

  So I use that to to regulate my fear of it. Because I was out on the scene.

• 2:07:12Speaker 01

  Drug user?

• 2:07:12Dax Shepard?

  No, I was never an intervening as drug user.

• 2:07:15Speaker 01

  You never did?

• 2:07:16Dax Shepard?

  I never shot any heroin, no. Thank God.

• 2:07:19Speaker 01

  Thank God.

• 2:07:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:21Speaker 01

  I really thought you did.

• 2:07:21Dax Shepard?

  Comeback from that.

• 2:07:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:23Dax Shepard?

  Uh, no, no intervening as drug use for me. Lots of sharing, uh, dollar bills with blood on them. Hepatitis was in the cards for me, but not, uh. I guess.

• 2:07:35Speaker 01

  You could have got, yeah, you could have got HIV.

• 2:07:37Dax Shepard?

  I guess it's really unstable, though. It dies when it hits the air pretty easy, like way easier than we were led to believe at the beginning.

• 2:07:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:44Dax Shepard?

  But yeah, cuz I would, I would have sex with someone, not wear rubber.

• 2:07:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:49Dax Shepard?

  And I'd be convinced I had HIV for two weeks.

• 2:07:52Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 2:07:53Dax Shepard?

  And then I'd go get tested and I didn't.

• 2:07:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:55Dax Shepard?

  And at some point I had to get my hands around this fear.

• 2:07:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:07:59Dax Shepard?

  And I based it a lot on that article.

• 2:08:01Speaker 01

  I mean. Yeah. I, and for a while, remember, there were like rumors you could just get it from drinking out of the, someone's glass.

• 2:08:11Dax Shepard?

  At the very beginning, they didn't want kids in pools with, yeah, yeah.

• 2:08:15Speaker 01

  So bad.

• 2:08:16Dax Shepard?

  I know.

• 2:08:17Speaker 01

  And then, then this huge stigma, I mean, didn't, definitely did not help with gay stigma.

• 2:08:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, no.

• 2:08:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. Big AIDS, you know? I don't think he'd mind me saying it. I know I told you, but I think, so on one of the episodes, there was, there was a boy, a young man who had hiccups.

• 2:08:40Dax Shepard?

  Yes, and he saw it was a side effect of HIV.

• 2:08:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, he had hiccups and then it was really fine. It was nonchalant. It was nothing. It was silly. He was getting married.

• 2:08:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:51Speaker 01

  To his fiance. She was there too, everything was fine.

• 2:08:54Dax Shepard?

  Episode?

• 2:08:55Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 2:08:55Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:08:56Speaker 01

  And then, and then they just do a scan, just to, it's fine, but we're gonna do a scan. And then there was some. Thing like some lung thing or liver, something that meant he had AIDS.

• 2:09:09Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 2:09:10Speaker 01

  And Jess has this hiccup issue.

• 2:09:15Dax Shepard?

  Yes, he does.

• 2:09:16Speaker 01

  And so I saw this and I really was like.

• 2:09:20Dax Shepard?

  Did you call him immediately?

• 2:09:22Speaker 01

  Well, it was at night and I thought I need to sleep on it because I think this is going to be a hard conversation. But I also think.

• 2:09:29Dax Shepard?

  I've noticed you have hiccups.

• 2:09:31Speaker 01

  Like, what if I was meant to watch ER to save Jess?

• 2:09:35Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right.

• 2:09:36Speaker 01

  And so the next day I did call him. Well, I don't normally call him on the phone.

• 2:09:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:09:40Speaker 01

  And.

• 2:09:41Dax Shepard?

  He was probably scared.

• 2:09:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, and he should be. Said, hey, you know, it's not a big deal, but I just, I was watching this episode of ER and this happened and it was AIDS.

• 2:09:54Speaker 01

  And then he just like was quiet.

• 2:09:57Speaker 01

  And then he said, I get tested. I said, okay, well, just make sure you're continuing to get tested.

• 2:10:04Dax Shepard?

  Right. Monitor those hiccups.

• 2:10:06Speaker 01

  Anyhow, um, are you queer baiting or what?

• 2:10:09Dax Shepard?

  Well, I, we have talked about that I flirt with men and women.

• 2:10:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, you flirt with everyone.

• 2:10:15Dax Shepard?

  That's right. But I don't think I'm queer baiting.

• 2:10:18Speaker 01

  I don't either, but I'm not, I'm not the recipient, so I can't say.

• 2:10:23Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 2:10:23Speaker 01

  Maybe some, some people might say that you were.

• 2:10:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Stop flirting with me unless you want to seal the deal.

• 2:10:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:10:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And I don't want to seal the deal. I just want to flirt.

• 2:10:34Speaker 01

  I know. But it's like, maybe you shouldn't, maybe you lost that right when you got married.

• 2:10:41Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, I don't know. I don't think so. Um, also, it does make me think of, um, the Sedaris chapter we were listening to. This is now the funnest thing. I think I told you, we now listen to Sedaris at night in bed.

• 2:10:54Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:10:55Dax Shepard?

  And he's talking about every doctor he knows has pulled things out of people's rectum.

• 2:11:00Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 2:11:01Dax Shepard?

  As we've learned from the nurses we've interviewed.

• 2:11:03Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 2:11:04Dax Shepard?

  And he says. Most people claim it's from falling down on something. Now, I'm clumsy and I've fallen a bunch of times and I've never stood up and had a candle in my ass. In fact, I'd argue that I could probably fall down off every flight of stairs in the World Trade Center, holding three candles and a baseball bat. And I'm pretty sure at the bottom, I wouldn't have any of those items up my ass.

• 2:11:30Speaker 01

  That is very funny.

• 2:11:32Dax Shepard?

  He smirks it so much better, but.

• 2:11:33Speaker 01

  God, he's funny.

• 2:11:34Dax Shepard?

  Oh, is he funny?

• 2:11:35Speaker 01

  He's brilliant. Um, all right, well, that's it for Dove.

• 2:11:40Dax Shepard?

  Well, big shout out, love, shout out to Dove.

• 2:11:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:11:44Dax Shepard?

  That was an awesome episode.

• 2:11:45Speaker 01

  It really was.

• 2:11:46Dax Shepard?

  I liked it so much.

• 2:11:47Speaker 01

  Me too. I hope everyone listens and if you listen, pass it on.

• 2:11:50Dax Shepard?

  Pass it along. Forward it.

• 2:11:52Speaker 01

  Forward it.

• 2:11:52Dax Shepard?

  This would be a fun one to watch on YouTube if you want to see me cry.

• 2:11:56Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 2:11:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. That's your kink. If you're like Monica.

• 2:12:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, true.

• 2:12:01Dax Shepard?

  You like a nice cry. All right, love you.

• 2:12:03Speaker 01

  Love you.