The Besties Game of the Year Is . . .

A year’s worth of video game podcasting has brought us to this moment. The Besties use their brains and brackets to select the Besties Besty of 2024. Plus, Frushtick, Hoops, Griffin, and Plante share their personal Top 5s!

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Here's what I'm saying. I think for Jeff, Astro Bot is the right pick. Jeff, very safe. You might as well give the award to video games, Jeff. I'm just saying, you're not gonna piss anybody off with Astro Bot, huh Jeff?

• 0:16Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. Uh, I mean, this is sort of our last chance to check in with, uh, the VGA prediction episode that Russ and I

• 0:23Speaker 00

  This isn't part of the show. This is just for guys.

• 0:26Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, I thought this was the intro to the show. I just wanna say Russ and I beefed it about as hard as one could. I mean, in terms of guessing who's gonna win what, I think we fucking crushed it, actually.

• 0:35Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, we did great.

• 0:36Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, in terms of what was going to be announced,

• 0:38Russ Frushtick?

  Oh yeah, we did bad.

• 0:39Griffin McElroy?

  What is the opposite? We fluffed it. We did so terrible.

• 0:42Russ Frushtick?

  We definitely didn't guess Okami.

• 0:43Speaker 00

  I need to find, Okami?

• 0:45Griffin McElroy?

  Okami coming back.

• 0:46Speaker 00

  What are you talking about?

• 0:48Russ Frushtick?

  Okami got announced. Okami 2 got announced.

• 0:50Speaker 00

  What?

• 0:51Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, where'd you go, dude?

• 0:52Speaker 00

  I'm sorry, I had, I watched all the Game Awards, but I had super bad diarrhea, so I kinda went in and out. I didn't see Okami, that's amazing.

• 0:59Griffin McElroy?

  Jeff cried when he announced it, and it was the most relatable.

• 1:02Speaker 00

  Okay, I can't keep the bit going, you work, cuz that was actually the foot, the greatest moment of my entire life. Because I feel like, the reason Jeff got emotional when he announced Okami, is not just because of the moment. Because I feel like that is the real culmination of the Jeff Keighley story. Is this man had 10 years of believing in the dream, until he was like, I really miss Okami. You know what? I'm gonna spend 10 years trying to get them to make a new Okami. And this is the, this is the, the prestige. It's all built to this.

• 1:36Russ Frushtick?

  So you think he was the, he was the driving force that made that game happen?

• 1:38Speaker 00

  Yes, I think he is funding it. I think he is, I think if you look at the face, it is Okami. I think he's doing the mocap on the face. He's face capping Okami.

• 1:48Russ Frushtick?

  There's, I don't think there's ever been a bigger oversell than Jeff crying and me thinking, oh fuck, Half Life 3 is about to drop. And it's a guy playing a drum. Like, I don't think there's ever been a bigger oversell than that. Like, I'm sure he's jazzed about it.

• 2:03Speaker 00

  How's it feel out there?

• 2:05Russ Frushtick?

  It doesn't feel good. It doesn't feel good, I'm telling you.

• 2:09Speaker 00

  You wanna come in? You forgot your gloves and your scarf, huh? Come on in, pal.

• 2:13Russ Frushtick?

  Thanks, buddy.

• 2:14Griffin McElroy?

  We're all warming by the, the light of-

• 2:16Speaker 00

  We're all warming by the fire of Okami.

• 2:17Griffin McElroy?

  By the fire of Amaterasu's flaming scarf or whatever. It's been so long since Okami came out.

• 2:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, give me a, call me when there's a new Onimusha.

• 2:27Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, buddy, good news.

• 2:30Speaker 00

  Son of a bitch.

• 2:52Speaker 00

  My name is Justin McElroy and I know the best game of the year.

• 2:54Griffin McElroy?

  My name is Griffin McElroy and we'll find out best game of the year.

• 2:57Chris Plante?

  My name is Christopher Thomas Plant and I'm prepared to figure out the best game of the year with you, my best friends.

• 3:02Russ Frushtick?

  My name is Russ Frusci and I know the best game of the week.

• 3:05Speaker 00

  Welcome to the Besties where we talk about the latest and greatest in home interactive entertainment. It is a video game club and just by listening, my friend, you are a member. And today, what we, what we set out to do at the Besties way back in 2012. Well, we're, we're doing it again. This is the real reason we're here and that is to rank art. We're gonna rank art objectively, ranking art with the best games of the year. Chris Plant, what does that mean?

• 3:37Chris Plante?

  Well, art is an expression of the human soul and ranking is to reduce it into just an arbitrary series of numbers that we pretend to be objective when in.

• 3:48Speaker 00

  I'm not gonna sit here and pretend like what we're doing isn't important.

• 3:52Chris Plante?

  It is the most important. It's silly at the same time, but the problem is people, people get so excited for the game awards. We even started talking about it at the top of the show. We are older than the game awards. The game awards is ripping us off.

• 4:09Russ Frushtick?

  Oh, the Besties. I thought you meant us as people.

• 4:12Chris Plante?

  That also. So if you want to know the origin, the history, the expertise of picking the true best game of the year, this is the show you've come to. I'm dead serious right now. We're gonna pick.

• 4:28Speaker 00

  Let's do it. Right after this.

• 4:32Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, so if you remember last week-

• 4:34Speaker 00

  Oh, guys. Oh, man, you poor guys, man. Wow, guys.

• 4:41Griffin McElroy?

  I mean, they're all gonna be bad. These are all gonna be a little rough.

• 4:44Speaker 00

  They're all bad, huh?

• 4:46Russ Frushtick?

  I don't know that I did a good job on these matchups.

• 4:48Griffin McElroy?

  No, I think you did a pretty bad job on these matchups. In fact, you know what? I didn't get a hand on the matchups ball. I've never... I'm gonna bump some things around, because there's some frankly insane-

• 4:57Russ Frushtick?

  Move stuff around. It should be thematic, but otherwise, go wild.

• 5:00Griffin McElroy?

  Okay. You set up what the top eight are here.

• 5:04Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, so the top eight, as determined last week, we have Astro Bot, we have Animal Well, we have UFO 50, we have Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth, we have Steam World Heist 2, we have Crow Country, which was a reader pick, well done, we have Helldivers 2, which was also a reader pick, and we have Bellatro. Those are our top eight.

• 5:25Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, Griffin, you've reworked the matchups.

• 5:28Griffin McElroy?

  Yes. Okay, let's... I mean, we don't have to set them all up. Let's get started with this first one, and let's start getting nasty-

• 5:34Russ Frushtick?

  I hate it.

• 5:35Griffin McElroy?

  -right away. I hate it too. I knew you were not gonna like it, but this one is where the chips landed.

• 5:40Chris Plante?

  The theme here is games that start with the letter A.

• 5:42Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 5:43Speaker 00

  Good one.

• 5:44Chris Plante?

  Astro Bot and Animal Well.

• 5:46Russ Frushtick?

  This also has two cute little guy pies running around bouncing.

• 5:49Chris Plante?

  That's true.

• 5:50Russ Frushtick?

  So I guess that's a theme.

• 5:51Speaker 00

  Now, this is good. This is the Common Man's Game of the Year and a True Thinking Man's Game of the Year for the refined palette.

• 6:00Russ Frushtick?

  Jumping. There's jumping in both.

• 6:01Speaker 00

  These are... You know what? I think the theme of these two games for me, and I think it's something you see actually a lot this year, but there's a real generosity of spirit in both of these games. It's somebody who was willing to put so much love into a thing-

• 6:19Griffin McElroy?

  Yes.

• 6:19Speaker 00

  -and just trust that the person on the other end was going to be, like, into it. And I think that that's really astounding with both of these.

• 6:26Griffin McElroy?

  It's crazy that you could technically say these are the same genre. These are loosely the same genre. They are both platformers, eh, sort of, a little bit.

• 6:38Russ Frushtick?

  And what's interesting, I think, is like, if you, on the surface, they're extremely the same genre. Like, if you just sort of take Animal Well as like what it's giving you, it feels very much like Astro Bot. And then, as you dig and dig and dig, you realize, oh, there's like a fucking Matrix style. It's like the game that they play in the movie Hackers, when you like go in, and they're, they're in that like, that club scene.

• 7:02Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 7:03Russ Frushtick?

  That's what's laying underneath Animal Well's surface of a cute little like insect man.

• 7:07Griffin McElroy?

  That's a really good, uh, that's a really good sort of description of Animal Well, is it does, from just an outsider's perspective, does look like a video game they would play on a TV show about video games, or a movie where a video, like in Her, the video game he plays where he like kind of walks his hands through this like, uh, uh, AR, uh, temple. It's, this just seems like a, I can't believe this is a video game, but it, it very much is. Simple as it looks, it is, it is quite, quite wonderful beneath the surface. These two games do two completely different things, so I don't really know how to pit them against each other.

• 7:42Speaker 00

  I will say, if we're, if we're looking for comparison points,

• 7:47Speaker 00

  I will say my, my, my little thing about Animal Well is, I feel like, I love, the thing that held it back for me just a little bit, and this is absolutely its own choice, and it's, and it's like true to its own design, but,

• 8:04Speaker 00

  I wish I could experience a bit more of that game in a, in a vacuum than I, than I was able to.

• 8:11Griffin McElroy?

  Sure.

• 8:12Speaker 00

  I think that, uh, for, for the way I go at stuff, um, I think that it really rewards a sort of like communal play, it rewards a sort of like deep, patient play.

• 8:26Speaker 00

  I think it could do a little bit more, just to make it like, where you could see a lot, it kind of reminds me of like Outer Wilds in that sense, where like, I, what it's doing seems so cool, I wish it was just a bit more accessible.

• 8:39Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 8:40Speaker 00

  And that, that is my only sort of thing that held it back, but like, I, I really enjoyed NOL. I played quite a bit of it, same with Astro Bot, it just...

• 8:49Griffin McElroy?

  I think Animal Well, like, the genre of Animal Well for me is like, it is a mystery game. And it just so happens to have, like, you interact with it as a platformer or as a search action game. But like, that, if that's all that game was, it would be frankly, pretty bad. What it is, is a mystery game in the vein of a, you know, some of the great mystery games, like.

• 9:11Russ Frushtick?

  I think for what it's worth, I think it's a really good platforming game, even without the mystery stuff.

• 9:15Griffin McElroy?

  I mean, yeah, it is, it is, it is good to move around that world. It looks great, right? But it's like, it is quite simple. It is how it kind of like hides things within that simplicity that it makes it truly an unforgettable experience. I say unforgettable, I wish it was forgettable because it is, it suffers the same kind of pitfall as any mystery game, which is like going back and playing it again will not.

• 9:37Russ Frushtick?

  Similar, similar to Outer Wilds as well, which is like.

• 9:39Griffin McElroy?

  Exactly, yeah.

• 9:40Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I wish I could wipe my brain of knowing like, oh, there's that shortcut.

• 9:43Griffin McElroy?

  That said, like, it unfolding and unfurling and revealing itself in the way that it did when I, when I played it, elicited within me a much, much magnitude stronger reaction than, than playing Astro Bot did. Astro Bot's a great game and it's very, it's very generous. I love that word that you used to describe it last week, Russ. But for me, like, I don't know, Animal Well was so thrilling. I could not stop playing that game. Because at any point, I had in my mind, like, four mysteries happening that I was trying to, to figure out.

• 10:22Russ Frushtick?

  I, I think we, I think, yeah.

• 10:26Chris Plante?

  Well, can we talk about Astro Bot for a second?

• 10:27Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 10:28Chris Plante?

  Is that okay?

• 10:29Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, please.

• 10:29Chris Plante?

  Okay, so I, I really enjoyed Astro Bot when it came out, but I couldn't shake that weird nagging feeling of, this is a game that is effectively a giant marketing mechanism, which I don't feel in my heart to be true. But like, it kept rattling around my brain. So I thought about that, especially after it won the game awards of like, what does that mean for me? And where I've come to really appreciate this game is, yeah, it's marketing. But also, it is. Either a reminder of like what we've lost with video game consoles, or the direction that Sony needs to go if it wants to get through this.

• 11:08Chris Plante?

  And by that, I mean, you play Astro Bot and you see all of these great franchises, these games, these weird experiments, this idea of like Sony making big games like God of War, making weird things like Vid Ribbon, that there's all this variety, right? And now, you know, you're rebuilding a PlayStation 5 and you turn on your PlayStation 5, and that is not what I expect at all when I turn on a video game console. I expect like the same games that I'm gonna find everywhere else.

• 11:36Russ Frushtick?

  Right.

• 11:36Chris Plante?

  And I expect Sony to release like one game a year. And I think there's something kind of special about what the game is doing that is, again, quite literally, feels like, almost like a end point of the Sony experiment as a video game.

• 11:56Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 11:57Chris Plante?

  Or, again, a like, hey, y'all, this is a reminder to literally you of what made your thing special. And if you want to get through this, like, this is why Nintendo stays around.

• 12:07Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:08Chris Plante?

  Like, you need to get to it.

• 12:09Russ Frushtick?

  It's not an end point. It's a beginning. It's not a lake, it's an ocean. Because...

• 12:14Chris Plante?

  Not a Sam Lake.

• 12:15Russ Frushtick?

  What Astro Bot does as game of the year, according to the TGAs, is shows the world, and shows Sony specifically, you could spend seven years having Naughty Dog spend 300 million dollars, whatever they spent on those games, or you could get a team of 60 people and spend a tenth of that and make also an incredible experience. I'm not saying one is better than the other one, but there is a way forward in a more scalable...

• 12:43Chris Plante?

  Can I get the same people that crank out 10 games?

• 12:45Russ Frushtick?

  Sorry?

• 12:45Chris Plante?

  Like, wait a minute.

• 12:48Chris Plante?

  This is good, Russ.

• 12:50Griffin McElroy?

  Cancel Naughty Dog's new shit. Obviously, everyone hates it. Have them make 10 Astro Bots instead. Easy.

• 12:57Russ Frushtick?

  Well, here's what I'm gonna say...

• 12:58Griffin McElroy?

  Industry fixed.

• 12:59Russ Frushtick?

  I would be shocked, and I'm gonna call it now, because I called all sorts of Astro Bot predictions previously. I'm gonna call it now. Astro Bot 2, launch title... Station Six. Boom.

• 13:10Griffin McElroy?

  And it will come out before Intergalactic, the heretic.

• 13:13Russ Frushtick?

  Also very true.

• 13:15Speaker 00

  I, I, uh, yeah, Intergalactic's coming out.

• 13:18Russ Frushtick?

  I just think it's a really heartwarming, plants comparison Nintendo is great. It's a heartwarming example of another company realizing that we can also capture the magic.

• 13:28Griffin McElroy?

  Right.

• 13:28Russ Frushtick?

  Nintendo has been fucking.

• 13:29Griffin McElroy?

  And I, I think it's incredible. It's, the game doesn't just have the trappings of like Sony's nostalgic brand identity. The vibe of the game is very much like in that PS1 platformer, like Spyro, Crash Bandicoot, like kind of madcap feel. And I think that that is, I think that's very, very cool as well.

• 13:50Speaker 00

  I'm a, I will, I, I'll say this one little stinker note. I think that Sony intentionally had to let Little Big Planet die before.

• 14:00Griffin McElroy?

  Sucks. Yeah.

• 14:00Speaker 00

  This Astro Bot could become this. And I think that it's kind of crummy that they could have had this with Little Big Planet. They were building a sort of like, uh, Sackboy as brand ambassador kind of vibe for a while. And that could have been a brand about like user generation and creativity. And I think that that, if they had had the purity of that vision, it would have, uh, served them a lot better when the tech caught up.

• 14:28Griffin McElroy?

  They, they needed.

• 14:28Speaker 00

  It's like Fortnite, Fortnite era. Uh, I think it's a little sad.

• 14:32Russ Frushtick?

  Those games to be fun. That was really the, the downside.

• 14:34Griffin McElroy?

  I'm not going to sit here and listen to this.

• 14:36Speaker 00

  No, I'm just saying that I think it's a little, it bores me out a little bit that it's like, we want to recreate this identity, but it's just sort of like so brand focused.

• 14:45Russ Frushtick?

  I think it's like the MCU. Honestly, that's how I view Astro Bot is it, it feels like Endgame to me.

• 14:50Griffin McElroy?

  Patently insane.

• 14:53Speaker 00

  It feels like, it feels like Endgame because you find a memory card on the ground.

• 14:58Russ Frushtick?

  Like if Astro Bot is marketing, so is Endgame is what I'm saying.

• 15:01Griffin McElroy?

  Well, yeah.

• 15:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 15:03Griffin McElroy?

  Round the horn, where are we, where, where are we at? I'm, I am a pretty firmly Animal Well. Uh, where's everyone else?

• 15:11Russ Frushtick?

  I literally am cool with either of these games moving on.

• 15:16Speaker 00

  I'm Astro Bot.

• 15:18Russ Frushtick?

  My pick is probably Astro Bot.

• 15:20Griffin McElroy?

  Okay. That's funny how that worked. That's funny how that just went down, Russ.

• 15:24Russ Frushtick?

  Well, I was thinking about my top five and.

• 15:26Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, sure. I get it.

• 15:28Speaker 00

  Well for me, thank you.

• 15:30Griffin McElroy?

  Okay, so we got two animal well and we have two Astrobots, but it sounds like one of the Astrobots is kind of leaning either.

• 15:35Russ Frushtick?

  I'm extremely pro animal well as well, so I would be totally fine with moving.

• 15:39Griffin McElroy?

  I'm fine with that.

• 15:41Speaker 00

  You should have that little dinkus in a well. Go to have fun. Say hi to Yonoid and spot for me.

• 15:49Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, so animal well moves on. Astrobot gets kicked.

• 15:55Griffin McElroy?

  All right, next.

• 15:57Speaker 00

  Oh, he fell on the where's the beef lady.

• 16:01Speaker 00

  Skid over.

• 16:02Chris Plante?

  Next up, we have UFO 50 versus Steam World Heist 2.

• 16:09Russ Frushtick?

  What was the rationale on this matchup there, Griff?

• 16:12Griffin McElroy?

  Um, well, originally you had UFO 50 going up against like a dragon infinite wealth. So what was the, what was the idea behind that matchup?

• 16:19Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 16:19Griffin McElroy?

  These were all arbitrary. Let's not pretend.

• 16:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, let's all justify our arbitrary pairings.

• 16:25Russ Frushtick?

  They both have photos of perverts in them.

• 16:27Griffin McElroy?

  Both indie games.

• 16:30Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, these are both indie games.

• 16:31Speaker 00

  No, we couldn't get the indie game. It came out too late in the year.

• 16:35Griffin McElroy?

  Okay.

• 16:36Speaker 00

  UFO 50.

• 16:36Speaker 00

  Come back to it in 20.

• 16:38Griffin McElroy?

  We're gonna make so many Indiana Jones indie game goofs in the episode where we finally cover that game. So save, save those up. Sit on them.

• 16:45Speaker 00

  You're right. You're right. You're right.

• 16:46Russ Frushtick?

  We said a lot about Steam World Heist 2.

• 16:50Russ Frushtick?

  To me, that game fucking rules. It's like so fucking sharply made and creative and I worry that it got kind of buried. It didn't, I didn't feel like there was a huge zeitgeist. Like uprising around it, but structurally speaking.

• 17:04Speaker 00

  I think it's, it's also, it's tough for us because honestly, like I, my enjoyment of it was kind of like almost in spite of a lot of factors. Like I didn't play the last one.

• 17:14Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I mean.

• 17:15Speaker 00

  And I think that, I think Steam World suffers a little bit from just being consistently pretty good that I think it can get, but like consistent, the consistency is maybe like. Makes it a little easier to, to ignore or lose track of, I think.

• 17:29Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I think this elevated the quality level compared to a lot of, I don't know if it's the best.

• 17:36Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, sure.

• 17:37Russ Frushtick?

  Probably Steam World Dig 2 is maybe the best, but this one is. Maybe one of my favorite turn-based strategy games I've ever played.

• 17:44Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 17:46Speaker 00

  Musically, it's great. It looks great. It does. For somebody who doesn't like to think about a lot of like tactical stuff, like it gets too deep for me to enjoy pretty quickly. This is such like a kinetic visual way of doing tactics combat that I really, I really.

• 18:06Russ Frushtick?

  Minimal percentages, like chance to hit is like, oh, I can see the laser hits like directing at that guy.

• 18:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, so much more about physics and angles and that.

• 18:17Russ Frushtick?

  It's got hats.

• 18:18Griffin McElroy?

  It does.

• 18:19Russ Frushtick?

  A lot of different hats in it.

• 18:20Speaker 00

  So many different hats.

• 18:23Griffin McElroy?

  UFO 50, I mean, we kind of breezed by also last time because I forget what it was up against. But I think we all kind of decided pretty easily that it was UFO 50 is going to move on.

• 18:33Russ Frushtick?

  So I'm not sure how much. Question I have, I know Griffin's been extremely UFO 50 pilled. I've played a lot of UFO 50 as well. Plant and Juice, where are you guys at in terms of it? Is it, is it still purely like, wow, this is an incredible accomplishment? Or have you like truly turned the corner into like, oh, fuck, I love this shit?

• 18:54Speaker 00

  If I were more, I have spent a lot more time with UFO 50. I have.

• 19:02Speaker 00

  I can't say charried. I won't do it, but I have.

• 19:04Griffin McElroy?

  Say gotten the cherry.

• 19:06Speaker 00

  Achieved the highest ranks success in several of the games. Now, at this point, I think three or four. No, it's three. I know exactly how many it is.

• 19:18Speaker 00

  I don't know if this will make sense to you guys. If I was more the sort of gamer that I wish I was, I would just be playing UFO 50.

• 19:25Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 19:25Speaker 00

  I really, really, I, I, the time that I spend with UFO 50, I always feel like is very well spent.

• 19:33Russ Frushtick?

  It's like a fine wine.

• 19:35Speaker 00

  It feels very rewarding, like it's a good experience. I, I wish that I was a bit more, I don't know. A different person, but I like it quite a bit.

• 19:47Griffin McElroy?

  Did you?

• 19:47Russ Frushtick?

  It's like watching Tremé.

• 19:49Chris Plante?

  Wait, wait, wait. No, no. Prashik did this very strange thing where he said, it's like a fine wine. And it, but then he brushed his nose like.

• 19:57Russ Frushtick?

  No, no, no. I had my thumb out as well. I was drinking.

• 19:59Chris Plante?

  Okay. I thought, I thought you were like, kind of like, it's like a fine wine. You know what I mean?

• 20:02Griffin McElroy?

  Our best salt aged cocaine.

• 20:07Chris Plante?

  Um, yeah, this one feels like, um, a bit of an easy one. Not that Steam World Heist 2 isn't a great and special game on its own. But UFO 50 is the sort of game that we really privilege at besties and have historically. It's a game that is both good game design, but getting at something bigger. I mean, we talked about Astro Bot and kind of what it's saying about what's going on in the industry. And the grand irony of UFO 50 is to play UFO 50 is to experience what it's like to play video games in the year 2024, which is to turn on your system and be absolutely overwhelmed by a ridiculous amount of choice.

• 20:51Chris Plante?

  Um, the video game. Uh, except in this case, most of them are very, very, very well designed all at once.

• 20:59Speaker 00

  It's really tough to like, there are so many factors working against Steam World in, in a very crowded year. I am still kind of amazed that I, I played the entire thing. I did all of it. And there's like, a lot of opportunities for me to like, not like we, we talked about in the episode and it was just this thing of like, I think I'll play a little bit more. And it was not because I was addicted. It was not because it was like some power curve. It's just like so good to play.

• 21:28Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, it's incredibly capable.

• 21:30Speaker 00

  It's, yes, it's so capable. It's so like rewarding. You know exactly why it's just like so well honed and well refined. Um, I, here's, here's for me, I think the, the narrative of it. There is so much time you spend in, um, like character dialogue and the, the world story dialogue. And like, it just doesn't accomplish a lot with the amount of time that it takes. Like, it's just not very propulsive and it doesn't do really enough to keep the story moving. And I think that it, it actually assumes a little bit too much knowledge of the first.

• 22:11Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I was definitely skipping through dialogue. I think once you're in missions or even once you're just like cruising around on the, in the ship, you're constantly being given stuff to do and it really does feel like literally propulsive. But I agree narratively, it didn't, it didn't speak to me in any way. Um, I also agree that. You know, we reward, whether fairly or not, games that are really trying to do something brand spanking new.

• 22:36Griffin McElroy?

  Right.

• 22:36Russ Frushtick?

  And it's ironic that UFO 50 is doing that, given the fact that it's inspired by games that came out 30 years ago.

• 22:42Griffin McElroy?

  Sure.

• 22:42Russ Frushtick?

  But it unquestionably is.

• 22:45Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, UFO 50 then, it sounds like. Yeah, I feel really good about that. Okay.

• 22:50Speaker 00

  Um, okay. Next up, we have Crow Country versus Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth.

• 22:59Griffin McElroy?

  This is gonna be, this is rough, uh, for Crow Country. I love Crow Country. I think everyone should play it, who is a fan of the survival horror genre. I think it's a very.

• 23:10Russ Frushtick?

  I've played it more now.

• 23:11Speaker 00

  Me too.

• 23:11Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, did you?

• 23:12Russ Frushtick?

  Since last week.

• 23:12Speaker 00

  I'd like to speak for Crow Country.

• 23:14Griffin McElroy?

  I love you two.

• 23:16Speaker 00

  Uh, I think the thing that scared me off of it initially is, I thought it would be a lot more, I guess, hardcore. It looks like a game that is like for hardcore gamers. It looks very, like, it's a, it looks like a PlayStation one horror game and like, uh, it looks like it's gonna control really bad.

• 23:35Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 23:36Speaker 00

  It looks like it's gonna feel bad. What I, what, what really knocked me over actually was like, uh, one, if you play with normal controls for, for sane people, it feels just fine.

• 23:48Griffin McElroy?

  Great.

• 23:49Speaker 00

  It does a really fun thing, though, with it, like, running around is very good. And then when you hold right bumper to start trying to aim, it starts to feel bad. And that's like, good. Like, I, in a way that's very like, it makes aiming at stuff fairly intense and scary.

• 24:05Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I think it matches how people might have felt when they were playing the original Resident Evils.

• 24:11Griffin McElroy?

  But it feels so much better than the original.

• 24:13Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, it feels better, but.

• 24:14Griffin McElroy?

  The, the memory of it, right?

• 24:16Russ Frushtick?

  The memory.

• 24:16Griffin McElroy?

  What you like of it.

• 24:18Speaker 00

  And the puzzles are actually like, much, much better. There, there are one layer elevated from Resident Evil where it's like, it doesn't just say like, you know, you get the king key and you put it in the king lock. There's a little bit of lateral thinking, but not too much more than that. And they have these like, employee journals that are like, basically laying it out in full, you know, detail exactly what the problems are. And those are all really funny, too. It's, it's re, and also I didn't realize, I guess it didn't click with me that it's set in a theme park.

• 24:49Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 24:50Speaker 00

  And that's kinda rated E for extremely my shit. So, I, I, again.

• 24:56Speaker 00

  I've spoken so much about infinite, infinite wealth and will continue to speak about it, but I did want to say like, this is definitely one, I was squeezing in a few minutes before we uh came on, I definitely think that I will um, keep up with it, uh it's, it's a lot of fun. I haven't quite figured out how like resource balanced, how, how much I need to be sitting on my med kits and ammo and stuff.

• 25:19Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 25:21Russ Frushtick?

  Is there an analog, like are there other games that are set entirely in a theme park? Besides like Roller Coaster Tycoon?

• 25:29Speaker 00

  And, and obviously like the Disney?

• 25:31Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 25:31Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, I don't, I can't think of it.

• 25:32Speaker 00

  There was a pretty big chunk, I mean like set entirely.

• 25:36Russ Frushtick?

  Because obviously like with Final Fantasy VII, there's like chunks and like fucking.

• 25:40Speaker 00

  There's like a, I mean, Liza P. had an extremely good.

• 25:44Russ Frushtick?

  Right, usually has a level, but I actually think there's something really interesting in like.

• 25:48Chris Plante?

  Oh, lots of horror games, like other than this too, you know?

• 25:52Russ Frushtick?

  I guess Five Nights at Freddy's kind of counts.

• 25:55Speaker 00

  Five Nights at Freddy's is in a Billy Bob's Wonderland, but yeah.

• 25:58Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, I, I think that this game, I think the vibe and story and setting of this game is really special. It is like, the, the monsters are all really fucked up and weird. It's not like zombies. It's, it's uh much more kind of, you know, low res body horror than, than that.

• 26:17Speaker 00

  You don't have to kill them.

• 26:18Griffin McElroy?

  You don't have to kill them.

• 26:19Speaker 00

  Yeah, that sucks. It's worse. I want them to come after me more.

• 26:24Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, this game is really, really, uh, once you reach the last hour of this game, I, I genuinely, I stayed up very late finishing this game because I couldn't put it down because I think that the storytelling and uh writing and everything is great.

• 26:34Speaker 00

  How long is it? It feels fairly concise.

• 26:37Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, I, I a hundred percented it. I don't think it took me more than like 12, 13 hours maybe.

• 26:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, it'd be a bragging thing.

• 26:44Griffin McElroy?

  It's, it's, it's, it's very, I, I think the amusement park setting is also very special because there's something very cool about going around a, an environment that has props designed to jump scare you as a attendee of the park, mixed in with stuff that is genuinely trying to hurt you, uh.

• 27:06Russ Frushtick?

  And it also justifies a lot of the puzzle solving because it has like the sleep no more like kind of you should be solving these puzzles because of course a person that was going through this park was also solving these puzzles. So it makes sense in ways that like a police station having weird fucking keys does not make sense.

• 27:22Griffin McElroy?

  And if you are the type of person that loves hundred percenting like survival horror games like it has systems in place to help you. Like achieve that if you want to. It is actually a much more approachable. I think survival horror game than than it maybe looks at first blush.

• 27:36Speaker 00

  It's also weirdly sort of like Riley funny in a way that you don't necessarily expect. There's like. One part where you find like an animatronic vampire and he pops up. And then I shot him and his head exploded, which is hysterical. And then every time I checked the body after that, it said, I killed this vampire in his sleep, the way you're supposed to. It's like very silly stuff like that within the like scarier stuff. It's really good.

• 28:01Griffin McElroy?

  Good on Steam back too.

• 28:02Chris Plante?

  It's also a great gateway game, which is what ended up being my favorite thing about it is I finally went and revisited Parasite Eve. Literally the past two weeks because we were talking about this game. And I don't know, sometimes you need to play something. Modern like this that reminds you it is possible that you're not so intimidated to go back and then you go back and you kind of have that language in your head. And it works all fine. Also yell Parasite Eve. I mean, we can't go too far. What a game.

• 28:34Griffin McElroy?

  You're gonna go nuts on that.

• 28:35Chris Plante?

  What a Christmas game.

• 28:36Griffin McElroy?

  Fear factor. I think like a dragon infinite wealth should move on. But I'm really glad you guys played Crow Country. I think it is genuinely a real sleeper. This in a year full of big games. If it had come out at a different time, I think it would have hit really great. I think it came out. Fairly early in the year when there was still stuff off and popping, but.

• 28:58Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. All right. Last round of this semi semi fight and corner finals.

• 29:03Chris Plante?

  The last round is Helldivers 2 versus Bellatro.

• 29:09Speaker 00

  Talk about two games that came out of absolutely nowhere, right?

• 29:13Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 29:13Speaker 00

  I mean, both not on anybody's most anticipated lists.

• 29:17Russ Frushtick?

  I remember seeing the Helldivers 2 trailer last year at the TGAs and being like, oh, that was a funny trailer. But.

• 29:24Chris Plante?

  Not, Helldivers 2 breaks my brain because, and we talked about this last time, Griffin and I really enjoyed Helldivers 1. When I saw that Helldivers 2 gameplay trailer, whenever that was, my reaction was, why did they break a good thing?

• 29:38Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 29:39Chris Plante?

  Why are we getting another generic third person shooter when we had this really interesting, cool thing? And cool to be wrong, very cool.

• 29:49Russ Frushtick?

  I also want to mention the fact, since we last recorded, there was a huge update that was announced as part of the TGAs, which added like the entire, an entire new enemy faction in the Illuminate, which is like the Alien Protoss style faction.

• 30:05Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 30:06Russ Frushtick?

  That are now in the game. And I booted it back up and played some more and that game is still fucking fun as shit.

• 30:11Chris Plante?

  It's really great.

• 30:12Russ Frushtick?

  Easy to get into games and no lag and the community is grand, it's not the like Pokemon Go insanity that it was towards launch. But there is still like a very dedicated community of people that like, it's around like 200,000 active users at peak that are just kind of cruising along and like competing.

• 30:29Chris Plante?

  Probably closer to what they balanced the game for and hoped for, you know?

• 30:33Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. I think, I think as a live, as a live service game, I think it has been pretty impressive with how much.

• 30:39Russ Frushtick?

  It's exciting because it's, they made so much fucking money, so like it did so well, insanely well, to the point where that studio can be really floated on that success for many years. And I'm excited to see what they do with that, like how they grow the game in unique ways will be really exciting. Right now, I think the onboarding experience is great and the first like several dozen hours is like super great. I think I kind of hit a wall in terms of like fun goodies towards the latter part of it. And I think that's a common complaint, but I, I'm just, mostly I'm just excited because there aren't many of those multiplayer games that you could just jump in and have fun immediately with a bunch of friends, regardless of how much you've played.

• 31:24Griffin McElroy?

  It is sort of the nature. Of, uh, I mean, games with, co-op games with sort of, uh, action-heavy elements and character customization that everything kind of naturally funnels to a point where it's like, you know, my problem with the game, I think when I first kind of stopped playing, uh, Helldivers 2 was when the community was very much like, "Don't come in here unless you even got the drone if you don't have this, this one, if you don't have this, uh, what are those things, what are they called?"

• 31:59Russ Frushtick?

  The laser gun, whatever it was.

• 32:02Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, just that whole category, I can't remember. And that was like frustrating, but it was very much like, okay, if you went online, it was like, how to get better at Helldivers 2, which you kind of have to, to play those higher difficulties. It's like, well, you gotta rock with this weapon, you gotta go with this, this is by far the best one. And it seems like they have smoothed, smoothed that out a bit, uh, but it didn't make it-

• 32:21Russ Frushtick?

  And I also think it, it does, if you're reasonable about the difficulty levels you're trying to conquer, like, you're gonna reach the right audience. So if you're playing like a five or a six difficulty rather than a 10 difficulty-

• 32:33Griffin McElroy?

  Right, sure.

• 32:34Russ Frushtick?

  You're gonna play with people that are like, not looking to like, fucking try hard their way through it.

• 32:39Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 32:39Russ Frushtick?

  You're gonna play with casual people that have a good, that just wanna have a good time.

• 32:42Griffin McElroy?

  I guess I was saying more like, as I played it, once I got the stuff that I was kind of grinding up the, you know, battle pass for-

• 32:49Russ Frushtick?

  Sure.

• 32:51Griffin McElroy?

  Um, it's, it's, it's hard for me in a game to not feel like, well, I beat it, which is maybe counterintuitive, but-

• 32:57Russ Frushtick?

  And they have released a lot of War Bonds since then, but you're right, like, once you have 50 things, like, it's hard to motivate to try to use something else.

• 33:06Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 33:06Russ Frushtick?

  But I, I think they did an amazing job, that game fucking rules.

• 33:10Speaker 00

  Uh, Bellatro is a, uh, it's a, it's a deck building game.

• 33:20Speaker 00

  Uh, it's a, it's a poker-based deck building game, where you are basically playing poker, but then you're collecting jokers, jokers and pokers, the oldest story, tales of all this time.

• 33:32Russ Frushtick?

  I started playing more on the mobile version, which is truly death.

• 33:37Griffin McElroy?

  Huge mistake, huge mistake.

• 33:38Russ Frushtick?

  I made a rule for myself. Here's my rule.

• 33:40Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, yeah?

• 33:40Russ Frushtick?

  I can only play the mobile version when I'm on the subway. That's the only time I'm allowed. If I play it at home, I'm fucked. Like, it's just like hemorrhoid town.

• 33:51Griffin McElroy?

  I downloaded it and I started playing it and I was like, oh no. I need to dedicate the next two weeks to just like beating this game to death. Uh, and finishing all the shit that's in the game so that I can like get over it. And so that it won't sort of be all encompassing.

• 34:06Speaker 00

  I used to do that game dev story every few months. Um, yeah, I, I, see, I've, I've actually been in a place with it now where it's, where I, I don't have that. Uh, it's satisfying to play Bellatro. As I don't have, you know, there was definitely like an addictive impulse at first, and I think that that's part of it. But like, it's, it's one of those things where after I play around, I really feel like, oh, that was fun. I really got a lot out of that. I had a really good time. If I'm, I've, it's a satisfying game experience. It doesn't feel manipulative or anything. There's like a lot to think about and there's a lot of different components. And it makes every playthrough like interesting and, and really rewarding.

• 34:47Russ Frushtick?

  What's funny is it is a little manipulative in ways that we don't necessarily knock. But I think in the way that like the haptics work on mobile and the way that like all the effects work together. Like it's manipulating you into making that experience even more satisfying. Like this is not a negative. I'm not knocking it, but like.

• 35:08Griffin McElroy?

  They made the game feel too good? Is that what you're saying?

• 35:11Russ Frushtick?

  I'm not saying too good. I'm saying it's extremely good. Like there's a version of Bellatro that has no effects, no haptics, no anything. That's really just the rules of the game.

• 35:20Speaker 00

  It's very pleasant, like to, to play for sure. Like it's not like a, a cold, um, experience. Like no, the haptics that they have when the game boots up of the, the shuffling sort of, you know, the, the feeling I'm talking about? Like whoa, it's Bellatro. It's fun. All right.

• 35:37Russ Frushtick?

  So fucking good.

• 35:38Speaker 00

  It's, it's, oh man, I have a real, talk about like. Novelty bias combined with like also one of the things that I spent the most time on in the past 12 months. It's really hard for anything to compete.

• 35:50Griffin McElroy?

  There's a Pavlovian sort of, just hearing you talk about the shuffle haptics is like, I wouldn't mind having a little.

• 35:56Speaker 00

  And be a quick right hander while I cast, well, one hander while I cast is continuing.

• 36:03Russ Frushtick?

  Plant, where are you at on Bellatro?

• 36:06Chris Plante?

  I will save it for the top five because I think that sounds like it goes to the top five.

• 36:13Russ Frushtick?

  Interesting. Sounds edgy.

• 36:14Chris Plante?

  And I, I'd rather talk about it there than like dig into my opinions of this game until then.

• 36:20Griffin McElroy?

  All right. So it sounds like pushing Bellatro forward then to the.

• 36:24Russ Frushtick?

  I do before, yeah, no, yeah, okay. Yeah, I think we're pushing Bellatro forward.

• 36:28Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. I mean, if you want to make a case for Helldivers 2, I'm.

• 36:30Russ Frushtick?

  No, no, Bellatro of these two is definitely my pick of those.

• 36:34Griffin McElroy?

  Okay, cool. That brings us to our final four, which is Animal Well, UFO 50, Like a Dragon, Infinite Wealth, and Bellatro. Now the question is, do we, I mean, we should, what do we bump up into fifth position? Or not even fifth position because there is precedent for this also. It could land, you know, anywhere, probably not first. That would be crazy, but what do we bring back up into the finals?

• 37:01Speaker 00

  Let's, uh, I'll tell you what, let's take a, a quick break and then we'll come back and watch four best friends battle to the death. And I'm not talking about us. I'm talking about the games. That's right. These four games all love each other too.

• 37:15Griffin McElroy?

  That's cool.

• 37:15Speaker 00

  Things couldn't be higher.

• 37:19Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, we've, we've narrowed it down. We've got four, we've got Animal Well, Like a Dragon, Infinite Wealth, UFO 50 and Bellatro. And we've said that we're going to bring it forward a fifth from somewhere in the ethers.

• 37:29Griffin McElroy?

  This sucks. This is gonna suck.

• 37:30Russ Frushtick?

  Like in Ghostbusters when they go into where the ghost.

• 37:31Griffin McElroy?

  This is gonna be the worst part of it. This is gonna be the worst part of it.

• 37:35Chris Plante?

  Oh, by far.

• 37:36Griffin McElroy?

  It seems to me, the two games we've discussed doing this for is Astro Bot and Metaphor Refentazio. Two games that the four hosts of this podcast could not be more diametrically opposed regarding.

• 37:49Russ Frushtick?

  Is that true?

• 37:51Chris Plante?

  I think so. I don't, I don't know.

• 37:53Russ Frushtick?

  Here's what I'm gonna say about, uh, Metaphor Refontazio. I think it's clear that the, the podcast is split down in twain.

• 38:00Chris Plante?

  Sure.

• 38:00Russ Frushtick?

  Regarding Metaphor Refontazio. I don't get that sense about Astro Bot, but tell me if I'm wrong.

• 38:05Speaker 00

  I, sorry, just to be clear, as much as I love, this must be what it's like to be a woman, to have three men tell me how I feel about Metaphor Refontazio. But I, uh, I will say that I feel exactly the same way about Metaphor Refontazio as I do about Astro Bot. I think that they're both remarkable and I see the, like, that the amount of like joy and delight that they have brought to people that have gotten deeply into them seems roughly equal to me. Uh, and I, I appreciate both of, especially like after that episode that we had about Metaphor Refontazio and like looking at some of the other like, uh, later game stuff and the feedback from other people, like, I, I definitely see,

• 38:46Speaker 00

  I, I had a real urge to go back and play more. I won't, but I had an urge. I feel about the same way as Astro Bot.

• 38:53Chris Plante?

  Can I?

• 38:54Speaker 00

  Very cool.

• 38:55Chris Plante?

  But like, can I make my case for Metaphor in here really quick?

• 38:59Russ Frushtick?

  Sure.

• 39:00Chris Plante?

  Okay. This would be my case, is the top five for us is like our collective top five, right?

• 39:08Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 39:09Chris Plante?

  And when I look at our top four right now, we have Animal Well, Animal Well, Like a Dragon, UFO 50 and Bellatro. And I think we all love Like a Dragon. I wouldn't be surprised if it maybe gets number one. I don't know. The other three are games that I personally, they're like not my things. I feel like they're like the other things here that like I know why they're here and I know why they resonate with all of you. But there's, I, I feel like I personally do not have my like, oh, this is the game that means the world to me. I don't have like the Indica or the A Thousand Exorcists or a Metaphor in this case. And of all the games that I think have the best shot of that, Metaphor is a game like,

• 39:55Chris Plante?

  I will be thinking about for the rest of my video game playing life.

• 40:00Griffin McElroy?

  Can you, can you tie a bow on like what? I, you've written about this at like, that talked about it on this show, but like, what is it about metaphor that like? That, that specifically that clicked?

• 40:14Russ Frushtick?

  And maybe do it in, in reference to previous Persona. I'm just like, that's where I'm getting hung up because every time it's been described, it sounds like Persona plus to me.

• 40:25Chris Plante?

  Yeah. And I don't think that's true at all because I've never finished a Persona game and I finished this. I think the big difference is, as silly as this is to say, this one starts much, much earlier than Persona. And it has a series of hooks and additional gameplay loops that reveal themselves much deeper than a Persona game. So by that, I mean, you start the game, you have a little bit of story. And it's like, okay, well, and here is how combat works. And it's actually understandable this time versus Persona games. Here is how the travel system works. Okay. Here's how the day system works in relation to travel and how you actually spend your time.

• 41:09Chris Plante?

  Here are all the activities that you can do with the players. And because it balances both clarity and density without ever feeling like, oh, this is 30 hours of tutorials to start the game. That's the magic. And that's where I think Persona, a game I really love, games I really love, can struggle because for me Persona sometimes feels like the first 30 hours are tutorials for all those systems, rather than layering on of delicious flavors, which is what I got from this game.

• 41:41Speaker 00

  I, I, I will say that in terms of, uh, I only pushed through with, with Persona because of the extremely like good feedback I got. And also because it was the only game I brought to the beach that one time.

• 41:57Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 41:58Speaker 00

  The, this is Metaphory Fantazio is much more a video game that is engaging you mechanically early on than, and is not asking you to like, do a lot of homework before it starts to get like, interesting.

• 42:12Griffin McElroy?

  I, I also, I think it is also, it stands out for me in, in this year of excellent RPGs. Of being a game with a really original world with some really original kind of like ideas behind it and obviously like fantasy and sci fi as a genre pretty much exists to hold a mirror up to like real world stuff and I think this game at first blush seems like it's going to do a pretty clumsy job with it. I think it does a pretty extremely good job actually, uh, holding that mirror up and, and showing something that is surprising, uh, with, with a surprising amount of nuance and, and, uh, and care. I, I really, really

• 42:57Griffin McElroy?

  got interested. I never do this, but like, I would read the, uh, memos of like, here's what you need, here's what you should know about this tribe and here's, here's the history of this thing. Like I caught myself like voluntarily reading those things because I found myself like interested enough in the world to do it. And I don't think that really happened with any other game, uh, this year.

• 43:20Speaker 00

  Yeah. Do you guys ding it at all for how much it is Persona? Like without being like, if I've always wondered about, I don't know, it's kind of feeling I have about Destiny where like, if you have the opportunity to do something wholly new and then you just kind of make Halo again a little bit like.

• 43:33Chris Plante?

  I, I don't because it goes in so many different directions. Like it took, it kind of would be like dinging a game for being a first person shooter. Like I think that they created a bit of a genre here.

• 43:46Speaker 00

  You do show up in a, in a room, in a blue, pretty early on, you show up in a blue room that is exactly this is what you're in Persona.

• 43:56Griffin McElroy?

  No, it's Persona.

• 43:57Speaker 00

  That would be like, that would be like if you're like, and Master Chief, here's your crowbar. Good luck, sir.

• 44:01Chris Plante?

  Sure. I, I, I think it's still different enough. The other thing I'd say is the art, the design, the story are all going after different things.

• 44:10Speaker 00

  It looks outstanding. I mean, they all, they all do, but it's, it's really cool.

• 44:14Chris Plante?

  And, and also it's not pretentious. And I say that like in the literal definition of pretension and that it is inspired by Hieronymus Bosch and Francis Bacon and Dali, right? But it's not. Doing that so that everybody who plays it's like, oh, mm, this reminds me of these things in the museum. It's like, no, we're borrowing from that because that stuff is sick and it makes for good monsters in a fantasy setting.

• 44:39Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 44:40Russ Frushtick?

  And I think that's untapped.

• 44:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, man, a great, a great, like, and I, this is like everybody across the spectrum, like, please pull influence from places other than video games.

• 44:50Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 44:50Speaker 00

  You have played, guys.

• 44:51Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, like Marvel movies.

• 44:53Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, pull some Marvel movies.

• 44:55Chris Plante?

  I, I'll be honest, I wouldn't, I won't be upset if Astro Bot makes the cut either, and I think we should talk about it too. But I, I wanted to at least give Metaphor its like share because I also just think in the year 20, in this year with this election, a game that is asking what function should we actually expect of fiction? And also how useful is democracy? It's just bonkers that this game came out this year. I cannot get over it.

• 45:23Russ Frushtick?

  I, I will, I will make the case for Astro Bot and it's similar to the case that I made previously, I think last week, which is I still stand by my, this is the best platforming game ever made stance. I think, again, when you look at like all of the elements, graphics and game feel and level design and art design and music and, and everything that Astro Bot is doing, it does not let up. It is all fucking aces. And I struggle, and this is not a knock against Metaphor Vifontazio, it's more of my brain thing is I cannot attach to the distance that you feel when you're playing turn-based RPGs.

• 46:07Russ Frushtick?

  And I felt the same way with Infinite Wealth, which we'll talk about a little bit. And it, so it is difficult for me to make that leap in the same way that it's difficult for Plant to make that leap with a game like Animal Well, where he understands why it's very good, but it doesn't like personally scratch his brain. So I would, yeah, but it's mostly just the argument that like Astro Bot is. Start to finish like so such a curated and fucking stellar platform experience.

• 46:34Speaker 00

  And you don't have to play for 85 hours.

• 46:36Russ Frushtick?

  And you have to play for 30 seconds and it's instantly fun like that. I mean, forget 35 hours like that's that was the struggle that I had with metaphor. It was just like it's a time commitment before it gets good. And I think you guys were pretty, pretty direct about that.

• 46:50Griffin McElroy?

  I mean, I pushed back then and I'll push back now. Like, I think it's good. I think it's good, pretty fucking fast, but I obviously, I think it hits its stride, maybe. Once some of the like gameplay elements are unveiled.

• 47:03Russ Frushtick?

  And say, I think it's a, it's a time commitment for people that aren't already in love with the genre.

• 47:08Griffin McElroy?

  Sure.

• 47:09Russ Frushtick?

  To realize why maybe they should be.

• 47:11Griffin McElroy?

  Genre, genre preference is always the fucking like

• 47:14Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, the trick.

• 47:15Griffin McElroy?

  Stick, stick in the spokes of, of this entire process. And that's like unavoidable.

• 47:19Speaker 00

  So what are we, what are we thinking here? I believe it comes down to me.

• 47:23Griffin McElroy?

  It kinda seems like it.

• 47:24Speaker 00

  Uh, here we are again. Everyone looking to me for guidance. I would, if I had to pick between these two, I would push forward. I'm gonna, I'll just tell you. I would push forward Metaphor Refent House. Wow. Cause Astro Bot's a commercial. Sorry, man. I know it's such a good commercial, but they, they charge you for a commercial, brother. I'm so sorry, man. Wow. I know it's so good, man. I love, I love the one ad where Jason Alexander is singing about the big DLT, but it's not the game of the year, man.

• 48:02Speaker 00

  This is an incredible turn.

• 48:04Griffin McElroy?

  What a wonderful journey Justin has been on as a person, as a gamer, as a father, as a brother.

• 48:09Speaker 00

  This is great.

• 48:11Griffin McElroy?

  I, I am moved by Chris's argument to have a little bit of Chris Plant represented on this list. And I realize that that serves my personal, uh, list as well.

• 48:19Speaker 00

  It's really not, it's really not Chris Plant personally. It is, it is what I want to reward games for doing. And I think that it's like, it's really cool what Sony did. It's also like the safest bet you can do is like a self-aggrandizing. So like, even if it fails, people still got a lot of great brand messages, you know? I, I, and Metaphor Refent Azio is not only like spellbound and so many people, but it seems to be like, actually has a message and trying to say something other than, man, it's been a, it used to be really groovy to like PlayStation.

• 48:53Russ Frushtick?

  That said, Infinite Wealth is a Chris Plant as Chris Plant game, if there ever was one.

• 48:58Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, I agree.

• 48:59Chris Plante?

  Hey, listen, Russ. You shouldn't start spinning wildly in Defensive Astro Bot and accidentally clip someone you may not want to, because you never know.

• 49:09Griffin McElroy?

  There's strays going around right now.

• 49:11Chris Plante?

  Yeah, don't let a stray hit my man E2bot, okay?

• 49:14Russ Frushtick?

  I am fine. Thankfully Jeff and I are on the same page, and that's all that matters.

• 49:18Griffin McElroy?

  All right.

• 49:18Chris Plante?

  Yeah. Oh, whoa, I just got an email from Sony PR. Congratulations, Russ Frushtick, on your promotion to head up. He did it.

• 49:27Russ Frushtick?

  They set up direct deposit. It's gonna be great.

• 49:29Chris Plante?

  Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Okay, so, we're gonna narrow, we're gonna organize this. We have Metaphor, Refontazio, Animal Well, Like a Dragon, Infinite Wealth, UFO 50, and Bellatro. That is our final five.

• 49:44Griffin McElroy?

  Okay.

• 49:45Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, so I think in the spirit of this, again, being a list of all of us, like a group list, let me go back and reiterate that I think probably Metaphor, Refontazio should be five.

• 49:56Chris Plante?

  I think Animal Well, UFO 50, and Bellatro are dogshit, and I think that they should all be five, and then we should put the other two as one. Okay, in the spirit of...

• 50:06Russ Frushtick?

  Justin, honesty. Justin only likes Metaphor because he read a Wikipedia entry about how good it was.

• 50:13Chris Plante?

  I started with the "in the spirit," my ass.

• 50:16Speaker 00

  The spirit of me dictating the list.

• 50:19Chris Plante?

  Yeah, yeah, Mr. I Set the Rounds and made sure all the...

• 50:23Speaker 00

  Let me, let me, Russ Frushtick, say what we're all thinking.

• 50:26Chris Plante?

  Oh, my god.

• 50:31Russ Frushtick?

  Justin, talk about the YouTube videos you watched to convince you this was a good game.

• 50:34Speaker 00

  Which one?

• 50:38Griffin McElroy?

  I fucking love it, man.

• 50:40Speaker 00

  Metaphor, Refontazio is the fit. I mean, it's a pretty hard five.

• 50:44Griffin McElroy?

  Based on how it got here, I think it's totally fair.

• 50:46Chris Plante?

  I will take it.

• 50:46Speaker 00

  All right, fun. Uh, okay, let's do it this way, then. Number four.

• 50:54Speaker 00

  I would, at number four, argue for...

• 51:01Griffin McElroy?

  Animal Well.

• 51:03Chris Plante?

  Oh.

• 51:05Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, I think this, I think we're all gonna, no joke, guys, I think there's four games left. I think we're all gonna say a different one.

• 51:13Speaker 00

  That's fine.

• 51:13Griffin McElroy?

  I think we're all gonna say a different one.

• 51:14Speaker 00

  We'll say them louder and louder until one of us is right.

• 51:17Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I guess the question is, are we saying, right now, are we saying our personal number four? Or are we saying what we think the group's number four should be?

• 51:25Speaker 00

  We just put a game at number five.

• 51:27Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 51:27Speaker 00

  I scooted up to number four and I looked at four games. I was like, which one of you guys wants to go here?

• 51:32Russ Frushtick?

  Right.

• 51:32Speaker 00

  And I know some of them aren't going there.

• 51:34Russ Frushtick?

  No.

• 51:35Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 51:35Russ Frushtick?

  I understand, but are we, when you're saying which one's gonna go here, are you saying it like what you think the group's number four should be?

• 51:42Speaker 00

  I'm just opening the discussion on the number four bullet point. That's all. See what you guys think about number four.

• 51:49Speaker 00

  Um, cause I feel like number four should be a contest between UFO 50 and Animal Well.

• 51:55Russ Frushtick?

  I think that's right.

• 51:57Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 51:57Griffin McElroy?

  I personally would put Bellatro in at number four.

• 52:01Speaker 00

  Absolutely not. There's no way on earth.

• 52:05Russ Frushtick?

  I would have a hard time putting Bellatro at number four.

• 52:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 52:07Griffin McElroy?

  Okay. Understood.

• 52:10Russ Frushtick?

  I think Animal Well, what, what did you say, UFO 50 and Animal Well at four?

• 52:14Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 52:16Speaker 00

  That's where I, that's where I, that for, for me personally, if I was sliding them, that is the discussion that I think would be the most productive.

• 52:23Chris Plante?

  But I, I, I'm curious what you think on this, Fresh. Animal Well, this is like, again, these are all excellent games.

• 52:37Griffin McElroy?

  I know.

• 52:38Russ Frushtick?

  They love, they love themselves.

• 52:40Chris Plante?

  I feel like UFO 50 will last longer with all of us. I feel like we will be, we will be picking at UFO 50 even more next year, that you'll hear more about us exploring what it has to offer. And if the game, if it's a game about secrets, I think.

• 52:59Speaker 00

  I don't, I don't know if I can say this confidently.

• 53:01Griffin McElroy?

  I have not even started to peel apart, I have not even started to peel apart that part of UFO 50, the like, go into the terminal and find out the history of the thing. I know that that stuff is there and is very cool and I am excited to one day get to it.

• 53:16Speaker 00

  It's so similar. These two games, I really feel the same way about. Like, I feel like they both do amazing things that I wish there was just a little bit more guidance to help you get to the things that are so cool about it and the things that are so rewarding about it. To give you an example, I really wish for me personally, that UFO 50 did not like, pop open to 50 games at once. Like, when I saw that, I didn't want to play it. Like, I wanted to turn it off. And that's just how I, I mean, for me, that's just how I approached this stuff. And I found it kind of overwhelming. And I feel similarly about Animal Well, where

• 53:56Speaker 00

  there's like, so many cool things that I wish there was just a little bit more help to get, get you to them, personally.

• 54:04Griffin McElroy?

  Can I go hard for UFO 50? Because I feel like we have not really had time to do that. This is the first time that we're trying to really argue for it. Because I think it's my number one, and I realize it's not going to be that for you guys. But the relationship I have formed with this game is, is, is truly unexpected and quite powerful for me.

• 54:25Speaker 00

  It's kind of the two days with Maury of our generation.

• 54:29Griffin McElroy?

  It is. I think if you went through this list of 50 games, I think I could pick out maybe 20 so far of the ones I've played that would rank among my favorite gaming experiences of the year. I think that finally beating Par on Pin Golf was so fucking thrilling and so satisfying to get better at that game. Finally, cherrying Magic Garden on a flight home from Milwaukee. Just, literally, just banging my head against it until I could figure out how to be good at that game. It was so fucking good. Doing that Party House, when I finally Got my fifth random scenario in a row that I won to get the cherry on that game by the fucking

• 55:14Griffin McElroy?

  skin of my teeth with one night left was so, so, so good. When I started to put the pieces together of like the finale of Night Manor, that shit was so good. I could go literally on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on. Because I have had this experience now 34 times, I mean 34 charities, where I've been like, oh, that's, that's, that's how they want you to do it. That is how it is a, the, the term in conversation with the developer is so like played, but it's that, it's 50 conversations with 50 games. Can I just finish?

• 55:48Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, yeah, sure, sure.

• 55:49Griffin McElroy?

  Of just realizing like, and I never felt this way about NES games. I, there's a, despite the fact that like I was born in that era, I don't really have much of a relationship with the NES era because so many of those games have put me off because they are not inviting and, and welcoming and accessible. I feel like all 50 of these games, you can see the intention behind each and every one of them if you look hard enough. And then once you start acting into that intention, the game, each of the games really, really comes alive. And I think that that is a, a magic trick. And I think it is a truly, truly incredible how often it hits.

• 56:31Russ Frushtick?

  So, so Animal Well and UFO 50 are both on my top five list. Currently, my personal top five list, Animal Well is a two and UFO 50 is a three. That kind of convinced me to swap them. Because I think you're right. I think they're both doing something very similar. The conversation with the developer thing is very clear in both games.

• 56:54Griffin McElroy?

  Animal Well is doing that also, right?

• 56:55Russ Frushtick?

  Yes, they're both doing it.

• 56:56Griffin McElroy?

  And it's very, very satisfying, but-

• 56:58Russ Frushtick?

  And it's incredibly satisfying, but the, the ambition and the reach of doing it not only in one game, like you're doing, Animal Well is doing it very consistently in one game because there's one developer making the whole thing.

• 57:10Griffin McElroy?

  Right.

• 57:10Russ Frushtick?

  This is 50 games and in each game, you're having that, a mini experience of that same exact arc.

• 57:16Griffin McElroy?

  I guess though, like, um, this is where I'm really struggling though, guys, because it's like-

• 57:21Speaker 00

  Okay, hear me out before you push back against this because this is not a reflection of my feeling about UFO 50, which I feel like I've been pretty positive about vocally. I'm having a lot of trouble engaging with UFO 50 as a entity in a game of the year discussion where the game, the Griffin is talking about, like, there are so many aspects of it, I have not even like, experienced. And there's this part of me, and again, I'm not making a, an actual argument for this, but this is what is subconsciously tricking me up. This game was announced a very long time ago. They worked for a very long time

• 58:03Speaker 00

  to have a collection of 50, like, really brilliant, small games. But I'm having trouble thinking of that as one thing that I compare to a singularity of vision. Like, if they had released this game three years ago, and it had 25 games on it.

• 58:24Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, how would, how would we consider like Namco's Arcade Classics, Volume 3, and a Besties go to this?

• 58:30Speaker 00

  Do you know what I'm saying? Like, I know that's unfair, but it's like a completely unique thing, right? And that's, it's, it is, but yeah, that's what I'm struggling with.

• 58:38Chris Plante?

  The, I, I, I agree that it, I agree with all of that. The way that I can rationalize it is it does make so much effort to be a cohesive project. That this isn't a menu of ROMs that you turn on, on an emulator, and you just have 50 new games to play. It is presented in chronological order of the fake history, that there is all the backstory that can be found about the games, that the games have their own sequels, that, that it is perpetually in conversation with itself. Makes it feel very holistic to me, in a way that- You mentioned at the beginning where you turn it on and see 50 games, right?

• 59:23Chris Plante?

  It feels at first like the ROM issue, right? It feels like when you turn on a new handheld emulator and you've put some games that you somehow found that are definitely not IP that are available for sale anywhere, games onto it, and you see a bunch of stuff to play. But there is so much more going on. I think it's also like a game about how people used to make games and how people used to play games. I think that there's a lot happening here. That said, your point of what if they had just released 25 of these? Would it have done anything different is true? Like, I can't really argue with that.

• 1:00:04Speaker 00

  It doesn't make any sense. Plant, don't give it any more daylight. This actually doesn't make any sense.

• 1:00:10Chris Plante?

  No, I mean, I get what you're saying.

• 1:00:13Speaker 00

  I think that the, it's hard, I'm saying it's not that it, it's that it feels kind of apples to oranges. That's, I think that is what I'm. The forever video game problem, right?

• 1:00:22Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I mean, the forever this episode problem.

• 1:00:24Griffin McElroy?

  I think it's apples to oranges, but at the same time, like, I have gotten really into watching people play UFO 50 because it's been kind of cool to see people, you know, I think there is a, I understand your argument, Justin, about turning on the game and there's 50 games and that's like too, too much, that's too overwhelming. The process of going through and picking those games apart and figuring out what you like and what you don't like, and then finally unlocking games and saying, oh, I'll stick with this one until I cherry it, like, that whole process is a lot of work. And I like watching other people seeing the path they went through it, right? Like, oh, what was the game that made UFO 50 click for you? That's a conversation that I want to have with everyone who ever played UFO 50.

• 1:01:02Russ Frushtick?

  And every time I've ever had that conversation with people, it's always a different game.

• 1:01:06Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:06Russ Frushtick?

  And that's fucking crazy.

• 1:01:08Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, I think that, I think that is, it could have been UFO 25 maybe, but like, I feel like the fact that it is so.

• 1:01:14Speaker 00

  No, no, no, they called the shot early. It had to be 50. I would say, then let's put Animal Well at 4, UFO 50 at 3, and then move on with our lives.

• 1:01:24Griffin McElroy?

  I mean, I still think Bellatro should come in under both of these games, but that is, that is, that is.

• 1:01:30Russ Frushtick?

  I'm fine with Animal Well at 4, for what it's worth. And we can, we can move on from there.

• 1:01:36Speaker 00

  Well, okay, let's leave Animal World 4, then we'll talk about three games instead of two games.

• 1:01:40Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I think that makes it a little easier.

• 1:01:41Speaker 00

  Makes sense.

• 1:01:42Russ Frushtick?

  Yes. So, uh, can I have like an honest moment with Like a Dragon?

• 1:01:48Speaker 00

  Please.

• 1:01:48Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah. I am in love with the narrative, in love with the visuals, in love with the world. I love all that stuff. I don't find it super fun to play, which is part of the problem, part of the reason that I feel uh, the same way about Metaphor: Refontazio. The difference here is that I was immediately engaged with the narrative in this where I wasn't with Metaphor: Refontazio. And that was enough to propel me like much further in this game than I was in Metaphor. But I still, that is still my personal challenge is like the turn-based combat is more fun than most turn-based RPGs for me. But I still was not propelled to continue playing, even though I love the narrative stuff.

• 1:02:30Chris Plante?

  This will be the interesting thing about how we organize the final three, because I feel like all three of these games have at least one person who feels that way about one of these games.

• 1:02:44Chris Plante?

  And I know that because I feel that way about both Bellatro and UFO 50.

• 1:02:50Chris Plante?

  I think UFO 50 is a game that I respect a ton intellectually. Bellatro, we haven't even talked about, or at least.

• 1:02:56Russ Frushtick?

  I feel like Bellatro is kind of sailing, sailing through here a little bit.

• 1:03:00Chris Plante?

  I haven't. Bellatro is a game that I admire a lot, uh, because I think it's a chaos engine. I don't feel it as a game that I thought I was getting better at as I was playing it. I thought the game was revealing more of its mysteries and more of its power and more of its chaos, for lack of a better word. But it was not, unlike poker, I don't think that there is a like degree of skill that you find in like that sort of card game. That said, I don't think that that is a bad thing per se. It's just not.

• 1:03:41Speaker 00

  Wait, wait, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

• 1:03:43Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:44Speaker 00

  I need to clarify, are you saying that you think poker is more a game of skill than Bellatro is?

• 1:03:48Chris Plante?

  A thousand percent. A thousand percent.

• 1:03:51Russ Frushtick?

  The skill is not knowing the cards, it's playing other people. That's the skill in poker.

• 1:03:55Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, it's a different thing.

• 1:03:55Chris Plante?

  The skill, yes. And, and it is knowing the cards and knowing the numbers. There's actually an ability to know the odds when you are playing hands in poker.

• 1:04:03Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, okay, yeah, yeah, sorry.

• 1:04:05Chris Plante?

  Right? We're like, in Bellatro-

• 1:04:06Griffin McElroy?

  I understand what you're saying. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

• 1:04:07Chris Plante?

  Bellatro is a game about improvisation and reaction, and sometimes you will get really great cards, and you can improvise around them, and sometimes you won't, right? You're gonna have rounds that are not as good. We're poker, a round of poker is a round of poker is a round of poker, especially if you average it out over the course of, you know, 50 or 100 hands.

• 1:04:27Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, there is way more luck tied to Bellatro than there is normal poker. That is-

• 1:04:33Griffin McElroy?

  Especially-

• 1:04:33Chris Plante?

  Yeah, 100%, yes.

• 1:04:35Griffin McElroy?

  I would say my main criticism of, of Bellatro is that it does not scale with difficulty particularly well, or particularly elegantly. Rather, you like, if you're going for a gold steak, I, there's like, I can't say this, right? Because there's like, fucking Bellatro psychopaths out there who can win anything that gets thrown at them.

• 1:04:58Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:59Griffin McElroy?

  Personally speaking, and I've spent dozens, if not maybe over 100 hours, playing Bellatro on three different platforms. There, I will just load it up and I will see what the like, uh, skips are, and I'll be like, nope, not this, nope, not this, nope, not this. Make it to anti-three with like, out a great like, uh, malt generator, and it's like, ah, this is net, restart, let's try again. Like, I think playing Bellatro as a whole is very, very, very fun. Um, but I also feel like, I don't know, I, I kind of stopped playing it this time around, uh, on the very last challenge, which is the Jokerless challenge, which is obviously like, this problem, uh, viewed through a lens of madness, uh, of just like, well, it just depends, you gotta get glass cards, you gotta

• 1:05:43Griffin McElroy?

  get this, you have to get this. Uh, and I don't know, for me, that, that puts a bit of a ceiling on, on Bellatro that I don't feel with other games that I would put in the same category, such as Slade Aspire, uh-

• 1:06:00Griffin McElroy?

  Or, uh, you know, Monster Train, like, I don't know why these are the only analogues in my brain with this of the like, infinite replayable deck builder engine. I think, I think Bellatro kicks ass and obviously, without argument, has consumed a lot of all of our time and we've all enjoyed that. Uh, but, but for me, like, it, it doesn't, uh, it doesn't have that kind of like, special something that I feel like-

• 1:06:30Speaker 00

  Everything you're saying makes perfect sense. I need you to go back and just find something other than Monster Train though, because god love you, man, it's an eight out of 10 at best. There is no comparison.

• 1:06:41Griffin McElroy?

  I guess, okay, just Slade of Spire, right?

• 1:06:42Speaker 00

  And in terms of like, the, the, the scalability and the variability and like, engaging runs, like, I'm, Griff, help me to, help me to understand how the fact that after 100 hours, you were bored of playing Bellatro is a bad thing, like legitimately.

• 1:07:02Griffin McElroy?

  No.

• 1:07:03Speaker 00

  To me, the fact that it's like, I, you want to keep playing this, you played it twice as much as you could, none of that is a negative, man. Like, it's not, this is not, it did exact, the fact that you are not endlessly, hopelessly addicted to Bellatro and unable to move on to other things, I feel like the fact that you can finish it-

• 1:07:25Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:25Speaker 00

  And then you did that once, and Griffin, you were so down on that-

• 1:07:30Griffin McElroy?

  Guys that I did it again.

• 1:07:30Speaker 00

  You fucking went and did it exactly again on your phone. Like, it's not, you can't, there's no comparison.

• 1:07:35Griffin McElroy?

  Please understand, these five games that we've come down to here are my top five. These were my top five games, right? I spent this much time also with Like a Dragon, and by this point, I've played a lot more UFO 50 than Bellatro. I'm, I'm not saying, I'm, I'm picking at little, little tiny things here, right?

• 1:07:53Speaker 00

  I'm just saying that maybe, that it sounds like a little bit closer to equal for you.

• 1:07:59Griffin McElroy?

  To, to, I guess the point I am trying to make is that element-

• 1:08:02Speaker 00

  Let's say if one person liked one of these a lot more, and one of them a lot less, and then one person liked both of them equal, they would probably settle on, well, the one we all really like should be higher than the one that we, some of us like, some of us don't, right?

• 1:08:16Russ Frushtick?

  Much like metaphor for a fantasia, the importance is of democracy, I think, are the key here.

• 1:08:20Speaker 00

  Wow, that's really powerful stuff.

• 1:08:23Griffin McElroy?

  I am, I am-

• 1:08:24Speaker 00

  Recap videos.

• 1:08:25Griffin McElroy?

  So, then it sounds like UFO 50 is going in three.

• 1:08:32Griffin McElroy?

  Right? Like, I don't know.

• 1:08:34Chris Plante?

  I think it sounds like that.

• 1:08:38Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, of the remaining three, that's your, Bellatro is your least favorite plant? Is that fair to say?

• 1:08:48Chris Plante?

  Bellatro is my least favorite of the remaining three.

• 1:08:52Griffin McElroy?

  Samezies.

• 1:08:55Russ Frushtick?

  I mean.

• 1:08:58Chris Plante?

  Are you trying to like math this out? I don't think there's a way to like necessarily math it out. I think that's the problem. You know what might actually help here is.

• 1:09:07Griffin McElroy?

  Can I ask this? Can I ask this? One second. Is Bellatro anyone's favorite game of the year? Is Bellatro anyone's number one?

• 1:09:13Chris Plante?

  No.

• 1:09:14Griffin McElroy?

  No. The other two could be my number. That is why I'm making the argument that I am making is because I feel like the things the other two games do here are so much more landmark

• 1:09:28Griffin McElroy?

  than Bellatro. A game I adore, it's just not my favorite game of the year.

• 1:09:32Chris Plante?

  I think that's a great point. I also think we should maybe try to just come up with the top three. And that will help us if we kind of focus that.

• 1:09:41Speaker 00

  I think that if I were to say

• 1:09:46Speaker 00

  Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth, UFO 50, Bellatro.

• 1:09:51Russ Frushtick?

  In what order?

• 1:09:51Speaker 00

  Animal Well, Metaphorie Fantazio.

• 1:09:54Russ Frushtick?

  You're starting at order at number one.

• 1:09:55Speaker 00

  What do you think about that?

• 1:09:56Griffin McElroy?

  Sounds good to me.

• 1:09:57Speaker 00

  Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth, UFO 50, Bellatro, Animal Well, Metaphorie Fantazio.

• 1:10:04Griffin McElroy?

  Print it.

• 1:10:05Speaker 00

  Print it. Put it on a shirt.

• 1:10:07Griffin McElroy?

  I would swap one and two around at will, however we want to do it, Russ. If you're more comfortable with that.

• 1:10:12Chris Plante?

  Contrasting idea to that. Leave him exactly where the fuck he is.

• 1:10:20Russ Frushtick?

  Fresh. I would put what you have in that scenario.

• 1:10:23Speaker 00

  Can I say something that is very challenging, Russ? I'm going to say something to you.

• 1:10:26Russ Frushtick?

  Okay.

• 1:10:27Speaker 00

  And then I think that it's pretty much so right that it'll be hard for you to argue back.

• 1:10:32Griffin McElroy?

  So brace your ass, man. You're about to get your world fucking rocked.

• 1:10:35Speaker 00

  I'm going to say something and the other two are going to agree. If you had continued to play the video game Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth until you had completed it.

• 1:10:46Russ Frushtick?

  Sure.

• 1:10:47Speaker 00

  You would be agreeing with us right now. Oh, interesting.

• 1:10:51Russ Frushtick?

  Chris Plant disagrees.

• 1:10:53Speaker 00

  No, I don't.

• 1:10:53Russ Frushtick?

  Asked him this question. Don't you think that when I got to the second half of that game?

• 1:10:57Speaker 00

  You would be agreeing with us 100%. And I don't mean that in a shitty gatekeep-y way. What I'm saying is there's many games I haven't like enjoyed, but I hung in there and eventually clicked and I finished it. If you had continued on, I will say also mechanically, it does get more dense and sort of layered.

• 1:11:15Russ Frushtick?

  Let me.

• 1:11:16Speaker 00

  More about a meta thing, but like.

• 1:11:17Russ Frushtick?

  Let me tackle that argument.

• 1:11:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, okay.

• 1:11:18Russ Frushtick?

  There is no greater crime to me in art than wasting my time. I'm not saying that Infinite Wealth wastes my time, but I'm saying in the time that I gave it, which was like close to 20 hours, it was not time that I necessarily was super in like constantly engaged with the work. So I agree with you that like, it probably would have clicked in a Stockholm syndrome, this became great kind of way.

• 1:11:44Griffin McElroy?

  I think that they would not have done. I think you would have enjoyed it on its own merits had you gotten to the full ass Animal Crossing game that is built into. I, I think the reason I struggle with that is obviously everybody has their own likes and dislikes when it comes to genre. I think that this game, maybe more than any other RPG I've ever played, doesn't do, like, doesn't do that. I think every few minutes it throws some shit at you that is absolutely bonkers.

• 1:12:10Speaker 00

  I'm trying to get there with you and be respectful of your opinion, but this is one where it's like, it's really tough.

• 1:12:16Griffin McElroy?

  No, I know.

• 1:12:16Speaker 00

  So many different games in it, man.

• 1:12:18Russ Frushtick?

  I played, well, I played a lot of the mini games and I thought the, the mini games were cute and, and funny. And like, I liked taking photos of perverts and I liked.

• 1:12:27Speaker 00

  What did you think of the talking scenes? Like where people were like interacting together?

• 1:12:31Russ Frushtick?

  Like narrative scenes? Yeah.

• 1:12:32Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's a good word.

• 1:12:33Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I thought they were very good. Excellent. Even. I thought it was very well written.

• 1:12:37Speaker 00

  And you thought the mini games were good.

• 1:12:38Russ Frushtick?

  I thought they were fine.

• 1:12:40Griffin McElroy?

  Did you get to Don't Doco Island?

• 1:12:41Speaker 00

  A few seconds ago said, but go on, go off.

• 1:12:44Russ Frushtick?

  I did not get to Don't Doco Island. So, look, realistically, uh, but I'm just telling you from my, like.

• 1:12:54Griffin McElroy?

  No, I, I.

• 1:12:56Russ Frushtick?

  It's a lot of time to spend with a game that isn't necessarily like.

• 1:13:00Speaker 00

  I'm not saying you should have.

• 1:13:01Russ Frushtick?

  I spent two seasons of television with this game. How many seasons of television should I spend?

• 1:13:06Speaker 00

  Not a house. Not a house. Not a lost season.

• 1:13:12Speaker 00

  Maybe a Yellowstone.

• 1:13:13Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:14Griffin McElroy?

  I.

• 1:13:15Russ Frushtick?

  Whatever. I think, look, it.

• 1:13:17Griffin McElroy?

  How would you, how would you rank these?

• 1:13:18Speaker 00

  Can I, can I say?

• 1:13:19Griffin McElroy?

  Hold on, can we hear before we get into the, we have not let Russ sort of give his argument.

• 1:13:23Russ Frushtick?

  How would I rank these three?

• 1:13:25Chris Plante?

  Or the five, really? I'm curious.

• 1:13:27Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, the five is a totally different story. The five is probably animal, the five is probably UFO 50, Animal Well, Balotra.

• 1:13:38Speaker 00

  The decrepit workings of Russ's brain are out of interest to me.

• 1:13:41Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, it's just difficult.

• 1:13:42Speaker 00

  I, I, here's Russ, if I could say.

• 1:13:44Russ Frushtick?

  Sure.

• 1:13:45Speaker 00

  I don't necessarily feel about my list, the like, that is not my top five. It is, but when I am looking and I, I completely, I have very, very, very frequently been in your exact position.

• 1:13:59Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:59Speaker 00

  So I'm, I'm a hundred percent understanding where you're coming from. I think what is hard is if I, as I tried to entertain what you're saying, obviously I don't share it, but as I try to entertain it and I try to think of like, what is a top, what is a, a top one that we, a game of the year that we could all agree on as much?

• 1:14:20Russ Frushtick?

  It's probably the closest universally agreed upon, because you're right. I didn't hate by any means that I hate, uh, Infinite Wealth. So it's a very, very good game. It would probably be on my top five, if we had to put it in the top five, five.

• 1:14:36Speaker 00

  It is, I will say this, it is a game that I, here, talk about your time being wasted, okay? This, this is a game that I, I have not ever finished a Yakuza game because I felt exactly what you're saying. It's like, ugh, okay, I get it. You want to run around and do all this garbage?

• 1:14:52Russ Frushtick?

  And I didn't, for what it's worth, like, I didn't feel like my time was wasted. It's just a difference between being wasted and like, just not clicking with me.

• 1:14:59Speaker 00

  Well, and then also, I would make an argument that in a real sense, it would have been a waste of your time to play a video game that you weren't enjoying. That's kind of my thesis statement for.

• 1:15:09Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I think that's fair to say.

• 1:15:10Speaker 00

  Uh, for me, this was the rare example where I wanted to spend so much time on it and I, and I kept spending so much time. I was compelled to spend so much time on it. And then the ending of the game was so incredibly emotionally resonant. And cathartic and in a way that like.

• 1:15:33Speaker 00

  Was rewarding the time that I spent in it. It was like respectful the time I spent. It was happy to have had me there, right?

• 1:15:39Russ Frushtick?

  It's a crescendo of an orchestra. I got what they were building. Like I under- I could kind of envision the like gathering of all your friends and everyone kind of cheering, whatever. I don't know what happens. But like I could envision.

• 1:15:53Speaker 00

  You get it.

• 1:15:54Russ Frushtick?

  The scenario.

• 1:15:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, the king. The magic scepter. Maybe they give him a big medal again. He meets the king, you know, you get it.

• 1:16:01Russ Frushtick?

  In the way that Chris Plant's favorite game ever is, what's the one with Ness? Any?

• 1:16:05Griffin McElroy?

  Earthbound?

• 1:16:06Russ Frushtick?

  Earthbound. Like, and everyone cheers you on and you believe in Love Again. I get it. I'm just saying like those, the 20 hours that I did spend just didn't get me there.

• 1:16:15Griffin McElroy?

  I think that, I think Like a Dragon deserves it if only for the fact that it feels like to me, from my, from my perspective, this feels like a game that in past years, only I would have been championing and trying so hard to get in the top five at all for three other people who don't really care about the genre. The fact that it kind of swept like wildfire through this, through most of this podcast, I, I think kind of uh is, is a really amazing thing. Uh, and, and sort of, I mean, it sounds like Chris, it kind of like activated you to this whole new, you know, uh, subgenre of video games that had not really interested you. Yeah. You used to be so cool.

• 1:17:00Speaker 00

  You used to be so cool. Wow, that sounded like you weren't being honest.

• 1:17:04Griffin McElroy?

  That said, Chris, Russ, if you want to make a really hard push for UFO 50 at number one, I would.

• 1:17:08Russ Frushtick?

  I don't, I don't think I can from the group perspective is the, is the problem. Like that, and that's not a problem. I just think that the math of it does not make sense because realistically. No.

• 1:17:18Griffin McElroy?

  You can hear it out.

• 1:17:20Russ Frushtick?

  I, I don't have a great.

• 1:17:21Griffin McElroy?

  It seems like two of us love UFO 50 and three of us love Like a Dragon Infinite Wealth.

• 1:17:26Speaker 00

  Yeah. How about, I, here's, here's what I, the only thing that I will say is if you all could get it together to love UFO 50 enough. There are the only, there are large parts of infinite wealth that I basically did not engage with because I did not have the historical.

• 1:17:46Griffin McElroy?

  The whole Kiryu kind of like.

• 1:17:47Russ Frushtick?

  I don't like Kiryu as a character and I've played a lot of these games.

• 1:17:51Chris Plante?

  This is, that's the blasphemy. That's, that's the one that always breaks me.

• 1:17:55Russ Frushtick?

  He's, he's just like a sad emo guy.

• 1:17:57Speaker 00

  Well, regardless, I don't care, but there's a lot of that game that I did not care about very much because it was about Kiryu. So if you guys, I would be.

• 1:18:06Russ Frushtick?

  Isn't that like half the game, Justin?

• 1:18:07Speaker 00

  Sorry?

• 1:18:08Russ Frushtick?

  Isn't that like half the game?

• 1:18:09Speaker 00

  Not the way I played it.

• 1:18:11Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, that's true. When I was in Hawaii, it was fucking party time. But I was back in Japan, it was, let's just fuck, let's go.

• 1:18:18Speaker 00

  I was a salary, I was a salary man.

• 1:18:20Griffin McElroy?

  I want to look at these memories.

• 1:18:22Speaker 00

  Doing my job.

• 1:18:23Griffin McElroy?

  I want to look at these memories one last time. I don't think so. I don't think we're gonna look at those memories, Kiryu. We got fucking boss fights to do, dude.

• 1:18:30Speaker 00

  Any, oh, he got bandages. Nice.

• 1:18:34Griffin McElroy?

  I do think it, it won me over by the end of it, but I think once you kind of realize the split nature of the narrative, there was a moment of coping that I had to kind of go through.

• 1:18:44Speaker 00

  Okay, I just feel like the Kiryu segments fall into all of the like Yakuza traps of like, there's a bunch of like clan drama that I don't care about and I'm not gonna learn about. And by the time I realized that that's what they're doing, they've already said so many names and I'm.

• 1:19:01Russ Frushtick?

  That's what scared me. Plant scared me off because he was like, oh, Kiryu is gonna be a big focus of this.

• 1:19:05Chris Plante?

  Well, yeah, because you just don't like him even as a person. You, you said, you're like, I just don't like him.

• 1:19:10Russ Frushtick?

  The most boring character.

• 1:19:12Speaker 00

  So wait, so what are you gonna do? What are, what are we doing?

• 1:19:15Russ Frushtick?

  Whatever. I.

• 1:19:18Russ Frushtick?

  Mathematically, mathematically, it should be Like a Dragon at one, UFO 50 at two, and Blodgeria at three.

• 1:19:25Griffin McElroy?

  This is our, this is our hearts. On my own personal, on my own personal list, UFO 50 is number one and Like a Dragon is two. So like, I'm, I'm, I'm obviously fine with Like a Dragon taking number one, but I, I do, I mean, I think UFO 50 is.

• 1:19:38Russ Frushtick?

  It's really down to Plant and Hoops and how they feel about UFO 50.

• 1:19:41Speaker 00

  I just personally feel like it's, I wish that UFO 50.

• 1:19:49Speaker 00

  Was more of a video game. And less of a, a.

• 1:19:55Griffin McElroy?

  Museum piece?

• 1:19:57Speaker 00

  Museum piece, a, a, a creation. For me, it is really hard to say that the game of the year is like 50 different incredible like thoughts about video games. Like it's, it's, it's amazing. It's a huge accomplishment. It's really hard for me to say like, I want the game of the year to be a game that, I don't know, that, that's, I, I, I know that's amorphous, but like I, it's tough.

• 1:20:23Griffin McElroy?

  I do think there's a comparison to make here between UFO 50, which is a fictional biography of a game developer from the eighties and their complete body of work comprising 50 games of, I would say varying levels of quality, but on the whole, like pretty, pretty brilliant, clever stuff. And like a dragon, infinite wealth, which is also kind of a bundle of video games. If you think about it, there's one main one where you go around and you beat the shit out of people with bicycles. Uh, and like that's, that game kicks ass.

• 1:20:59Speaker 00

  Plant, where were you?

• 1:21:00Chris Plante?

  Well, that, that, that makes it so easy for me because then it's like a dragon with a bullet. Because if we're talking about which of those games has better games inside of it, UFO 50 intellectually wonderful. I am, come on, I'm going to play Don Doco Island way more than I want to play.

• 1:21:18Speaker 00

  Well, that's not fair. You can't just take the one best one. Saying the quiet part out loud and that a lot of the games in UFO 50 are bad and boring. Okay? And they look bad because they look like old games and they're really hard and you die all the time. And they're not fun. So you go try to find a different one. And there's a lot, there's too many games that aren't fun.

• 1:21:35Chris Plante?

  Hey, I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to make a choice for you. Uh, you can play this game where you're like, I don't know, like a dot bouncing around. Or you can play a game where you go take pictures of perverts from your trolley.

• 1:21:44Speaker 00

  I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I said I could see UFO 50 at the top. Fuck. No way.

• 1:21:49Russ Frushtick?

  Okay. I, I have a, I have a compromise. Here we go. You ready?

• 1:21:52Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:53Russ Frushtick?

  I've got it. This is, this is the best solve that I can come up with. I'm going to give you the order. You ready?

• 1:21:57Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:57Russ Frushtick?

  Number one, like a dragon. Number two, UFO 50. Number three, Bellatro. Number four, Animal Well. Number five, Astro Bot.

• 1:22:03Chris Plante?

  No, I knew you were going to do this.

• 1:22:04Griffin McElroy?

  No fucking way, dude.

• 1:22:06Chris Plante?

  That, that, no. Hey, you know.

• 1:22:11Griffin McElroy?

  I think as we know, we all agree.

• 1:22:16Russ Frushtick?

  How many games I didn't like should be on the list?

• 1:22:19Speaker 00

  I like the idea. I don't mind.

• 1:22:21Griffin McElroy?

  Uh, no, it's whatever.

• 1:22:23Chris Plante?

  What if we did a top six this year?

• 1:22:25Speaker 00

  Listen, I'm just saying stuff that makes sense. Russ is basically the mascot of the besties, right? So once, I think that it would be nice of us, since he doesn't like our favorite game, that we give him a little pinch on the tuckus and put Astro Bot back in there. And just to make it more representative of all of our collective tastes, we get a little bit more Russ in the five slot.

• 1:22:47Griffin McElroy?

  To be fair.

• 1:22:47Speaker 00

  Because he's not getting much English on the one spot.

• 1:22:49Chris Plante?

  He's getting two, three and four.

• 1:22:51Russ Frushtick?

  Three, three of these games are incredibly Russ-frustrated games. So I, I will be fair and say that.

• 1:22:57Chris Plante?

  Yeah, I will, I will, as an act of kindness, I will let you choose UFO 50, Bellatro and Animal Well. Which one do you want to kill in exchange for getting Astro Bot on this list?

• 1:23:09Griffin McElroy?

  What a brutal.

• 1:23:11Russ Frushtick?

  Fuck. I hate that.

• 1:23:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, it won't hap- I mean, it.

• 1:23:16Russ Frushtick?

  It would.

• 1:23:17Speaker 00

  It won't happen, will it?

• 1:23:18Chris Plante?

  It shouldn't hap- it wouldn't happen.

• 1:23:19Russ Frushtick?

  It's probably, it's prob- ooh.

• 1:23:21Chris Plante?

  Yeah, it shouldn't happen, though.

• 1:23:22Russ Frushtick?

  Probably Animal Well.

• 1:23:25Chris Plante?

  Oh, wow. Doesn't feel good, does it?

• 1:23:27Russ Frushtick?

  No, I hate it.

• 1:23:28Chris Plante?

  Welcome to my house.

• 1:23:31Chris Plante?

  Are, are we lock- are we locking?

• 1:23:32Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, you can lock it. It's fine. Well, like a dragon, UFO 50, Bellatro.

• 1:23:36Speaker 00

  I think the vibes would be better if we took out Metaphor Eftazio and put Astro Bot there. I'm serious.

• 1:23:42Chris Plante?

  Justin.

• 1:23:43Speaker 00

  It doesn't make me feel great that Russ doesn't love our first game. And I think if we get a little bit more Russ.

• 1:23:48Russ Frushtick?

  It's happened before, for what it's worth.

• 1:23:49Speaker 00

  What?

• 1:23:49Russ Frushtick?

  Historically, it has happened.

• 1:23:50Griffin McElroy?

  We always, last, last year, I was the, the grump because, uh, Tears of the Kingdom got beat by Baldur's Gate 3, which I did not think should, should, should win it.

• 1:24:00Chris Plante?

  Yeah, we have this every year. There's always at least one person who's like, I don't know. I kind of feel like the older brother to Russ.

• 1:24:06Russ Frushtick?

  It's very sweet, Justin. I appreciate it.

• 1:24:11Speaker 00

  All right. Well, okay, I'll say it out loud then. Here we go.

• 1:24:14Russ Frushtick?

  Is there a, is there a version of Like a Dragon that just cuts Kieryo out? Like, we could just, like, completely remove him?

• 1:24:18Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, it's called Like a Dra- It's called Yakuza: Like a Dragon, the first game in the, in the RPG space.

• 1:24:24Speaker 00

  I'll play that. And number five, Metaphorie Fantasia, number four, Animal Well, number three, Bellatro, number two, UFO 50, number one, Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth.

• 1:24:36Speaker 00

  Is-

• 1:24:36Chris Plante?

  You did it.

• 1:24:37Speaker 00

  Congratulations, everybody. Uh, is Project Sentry a Like a Dragon game?

• 1:24:42Russ Frushtick?

  Unknown.

• 1:24:43Chris Plante?

  Uh, yeah.

• 1:24:45Russ Frushtick?

  But probably.

• 1:24:46Speaker 00

  But probably. Okay, great. Hey, very quickly, would you all like to share your personal top fives for the listeners?

• 1:24:55Griffin McElroy?

  I, I mean, I already did mine. Mine, mine, one to five is UFO 50, Like a Dragon, uh, Metaphor, Animal Well, Bellatro. So, these, these five games in all different order.

• 1:25:06Speaker 00

  Fresh, how about you?

• 1:25:07Russ Frushtick?

  Mine was Astro Bot, UFO 50, Animal Well, Tactical Breach Wizards, and Bellatro.

• 1:25:13Speaker 00

  In that order?

• 1:25:14Russ Frushtick?

  Yes.

• 1:25:15Speaker 00

  Cool.

• 1:25:16Chris Plante?

  Uh, mine is Like a Dragon, Metaphorie Fantasia, 1,000 hex resist, Dragon's Dogma 2, Tactical Breach Wizards.

• 1:25:25Griffin McElroy?

  Juice?

• 1:25:26Speaker 00

  Uh, I don't know, man. That, I don't, I don't know.

• 1:25:30Griffin McElroy?

  I think you submitted a numbered list.

• 1:25:33Speaker 00

  I didn't submit anything.

• 1:25:35Russ Frushtick?

  What was your number one, Juice?

• 1:25:36Speaker 00

  What?

• 1:25:36Russ Frushtick?

  We'll put it at that. What was your number one?

• 1:25:38Speaker 00

  Bellatro, I think, with Infinite Wealth at two, because I skipped so much of it.

• 1:25:45Speaker 00

  I'd probably put Steam World in there. Yeah, you know, something like that. I don't, I don't know.

• 1:25:54Speaker 00

  Oh. I love it.

• 1:25:55Russ Frushtick?

  I love it.

• 1:25:56Speaker 00

  Yeah, we did it. We did it another year of the show. It survives.

• 1:26:01Griffin McElroy?

  Weird list. Weird fucking list, I think.

• 1:26:04Russ Frushtick?

  Weird year.

• 1:26:05Griffin McElroy?

  If you had told us at January 1st, 2024, that this was gonna be our, our goody list, I don't think any of us would have believed you.

• 1:26:12Speaker 00

  I think we've done it. Thank you to everyone.

• 1:26:15Russ Frushtick?

  Thank you especially to the folks over at the Patreon, which continue to support our lovely work. We really appreciate it. We have some new members I want to shout out. We have Landon, we have Blight White, we have Bathroom Snack, and we have Fiction Bug. Thank you for being supporters of the Patreon. Thank you to everyone else. Exciting news coming next week. The members of the Patreon have been benefactors to everyone else insofar as they're letting us put one of the bonus episodes up on the main feed for everyone to enjoy. That will be coming next Friday. You'll get one of our, currently I think we have 10 published, one of our 10 bonus bracket episodes, in

• 1:26:59Russ Frushtick?

  addition to a whole bunch of rest of these episodes that are behind the Patreon paywall. But this will give you a taste of what you've been missing if you haven't subscribed yet. It is the episode that is dedicated to the best console ever, not including the games.

• 1:27:12Speaker 00

  So good.

• 1:27:13Russ Frushtick?

  So good. It's great. So, thank you to all the Patreon members for making it all happen this year. We really appreciate you.

• 1:27:20Speaker 00

  So that's gonna do it for us. Be sure to join us again next time on The Besties, because shouldn't the world's best friends be the world's best names?

• 1:27:57Speaker 00

  Besties!