Ralph Fiennes

This week we have Ralph Fiennes joining us for lunch! Ralph came over to talk about the new David Hare play he helped bring to life, Grace Pervades. We were swept up in stories of Victorian theatre, Italian food, Catholicism, and growing up as the eldest of six in a very artistic family. Over Mum’s Greek chicken and lemon potatoes, Ralph talked about post-show rituals, his obsession with simple fresh food, cooking Ottolenghi lamb in lockdown, and why a filthy martini with a blue cheese olive is “blasphemy”. Ralph, we just wish you could’ve stayed for a glass of wine! Grace Pervades is at the Theatre Royal Haymarket until July the 11th, don’t miss it! Listen & watch Table Manners here - https://tablemanners.komi.io/ Follow Table Manners on: Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tablemannerspodcast/ TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@tablemannerspodcast Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/tablemannerspodcast YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@TableMannersPodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Hi everyone, it's Katie Couric. And on my podcast, Next Question, we love stories about how women are taking control of their lives. They are increasingly leading financial decisions in their households. Yet, many say they don't feel fully prepared for the long-term financial choices ahead. Real confidence comes from knowing your financial future is protected, whatever happens. Pacific Life has helped generations protect what matters today and prepare for tomorrow with life insurance and lifetime income solutions. It's a promise Pacific Life has kept for nearly 160 years, so its customers can keep theirs.

• 0:42Speaker 00

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• 1:03Jessie Ware?

  Hello and welcome to Table manners. I'm Jessie Ware, and I have a bit of a lisp because I've just been to the dentist, so enjoy that.

• 1:10Speaker 02

  Oh dear.

• 1:11Jessie Ware?

  How are you, Mum? Not well.

• 1:13Speaker 02

  The hip's not good, darling.

• 1:14Jessie Ware?

  Oh, Mum. Are you going to be bionic woman by next season?

• 1:17Speaker 02

  Possibly before then.

• 1:18Jessie Ware?

  Are you going to go off at security?

• 1:20Speaker 02

  I don't know, darling, but there's something not right. And he said, "I've got to try and walk with crutches." I'm 74, I'm not going to manage crutches, am I? Anyway, Sarah's bringing them over tomorrow, so.

• 1:31Jessie Ware?

  You do look fabulous with walking.

• 1:33Speaker 02

  Do I? Do I?

• 1:35Jessie Ware?

  You do.

• 1:36Speaker 02

  I don't know, I look really hobble-y and old woman-y.

• 1:37Jessie Ware?

  I'm sorry.

• 1:38Speaker 02

  Good week this week for you, darling.

• 1:40Jessie Ware?

  What happened to me this week?

• 1:41Speaker 02

  I heard you sing again.

• 1:42Jessie Ware?

  Oh, that's very sweet of you.

• 1:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:44Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, I sung in Kingston, it was so nice. I did an acoustic show, which is the last one that I'm going to do before I go and do the big arena show.

• 1:50Speaker 02

  Do you think you'd do any acoustics on your arena shows?

• 1:52Jessie Ware?

  Don't know, maybe.

• 1:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think you should.

• 1:54Jessie Ware?

  It's nice.

• 1:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:56Jessie Ware?

  Um, I also wanna do a big, big show.

• 1:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59Jessie Ware?

  We'll give you everything.

• 2:00Speaker 02

  Darling, I was thinking champagne kisses come down in a champagne glass. Who's the person?

• 2:05Jessie Ware?

  Dieter Von Tees.

• 2:06Speaker 02

  That's it.

• 2:07Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, no, I, I, I can see myself exactly like Dieter Von Tees.

• 2:11Speaker 02

  I can see you in a champagne glass, darling.

• 2:13Jessie Ware?

  We'll see what we can do with the old bougie.

• 2:15Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 2:16Jessie Ware?

  Um.

• 2:16Speaker 02

  I'll hold the string.

• 2:18Jessie Ware?

  Not, not with your shaky hip, thanks.

• 2:21Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:21Jessie Ware?

  Um, thank you though for you came on and, and people loved it.

• 2:25Speaker 02

  Did they?

• 2:25Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, they love you. You're an icon.

• 2:27Speaker 02

  Am I?

• 2:28Jessie Ware?

  Now, um, we have Ralph Fiennes on today. You went to see the play this week.

• 2:33Speaker 02

  Grace pervades.

• 2:35Jessie Ware?

  Grace pervades. Um, it's at the.

• 2:38Speaker 02

  I thought it was gonna be a person called Grace pervades, but it's not. It's Grace pervading the stage.

• 2:44Jessie Ware?

  It's a new David Hare play.

• 2:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:46Jessie Ware?

  Um, I feel like Ralph Fiennes has lots of connections with David Hare. He's done other stuff with David Hare.

• 2:51Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 2:51Jessie Ware?

  Anyway, um, Ralph Fiennes, everyone knows him.

• 2:55Speaker 02

  He's, he's kind of, when I was collecting the chicken yesterday from Ginger Pig, everyone said, who's on tomorrow then, Len? And I said, oh, Ralph Fiennes. They said.

• 3:06Jessie Ware?

  Wow.

• 3:06Speaker 02

  The best of the British actors ever, ever, ever.

• 3:10Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 3:10Speaker 02

  And people regard him so highly because he's done, he's so loved because of all the things he's done.

• 3:18Jessie Ware?

  From English Patient.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:20Jessie Ware?

  To.

• 3:21Speaker 02

  Menu.

• 3:22Jessie Ware?

  Oh, the menu. I loved that. Conclave was.

• 3:25Speaker 02

  Could he not have been the best ever in that?

• 3:28Jessie Ware?

  He was Heathcliff. See, I can't say it.

• 3:30Speaker 02

  Now who with?

• 3:31Jessie Ware?

  Juliette Benosh, I think it was.

• 3:32Speaker 02

  Oh, my word.

• 3:33Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, on telly.

• 3:34Speaker 02

  I never thought.

• 3:35Jessie Ware?

  I wonder if he's seen Jacob, what he thought of Jacob's, uh, performance.

• 3:38Speaker 02

  We had a French Cathy.

• 3:39Jessie Ware?

  I think so.

• 3:40Speaker 02

  Cathy, Cathy, come on.

• 3:42Jessie Ware?

  We're very excited to have him today. This is a big deal. He's, you know, got a show tonight.

• 3:47Speaker 02

  I know.

• 3:48Jessie Ware?

  So we must feed him well.

• 3:49Speaker 02

  I wonder if he wants a, a little glass of wine to keep him going.

• 3:51Jessie Ware?

  Like a drink.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  Okay, so I've got cold white and I've got.

• 3:55Jessie Ware?

  Well, I don't know yet. I don't know him yet. I haven't met him.

• 3:57Speaker 02

  Well, I haven't put champagne in.

• 3:59Jessie Ware?

  Maybe it's not good for the vocal cords. I don't know. We'll find out. And what have you cooked?

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Well, it's kind of a spr- well, it kind of was a spring day when I decided to do it. Um, and I'm going to Greece this week, so I decided to do Greek chicken with lemon potatoes.

• 4:16Jessie Ware?

  I was listening to his episode with Ruthie Rogers and he does love to cook.

• 4:21Speaker 02

  Oh, does he?

• 4:22Jessie Ware?

  He's got a place in Italy, so I'm.

• 4:24Speaker 02

  Oh, well, and I've done Greeks.

• 4:25Jessie Ware?

  That's okay.

• 4:26Speaker 02

  That before.

• 4:27Jessie Ware?

  I'm not thinking that's safer.

• 4:28Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 4:28Jessie Ware?

  And then what have you done for pub?

• 4:30Speaker 02

  I've made a panna cotta with sour cherries on the top.

• 4:33Jessie Ware?

  Oh my god.

• 4:33Speaker 02

  Or he can have, I've left them in the bowl rather than blobbing them out. He can have passion fruit on the top.

• 4:40Jessie Ware?

  Depending how passionate he's feeling to do. I really love it when you do the sour cherries. When was the last time you did that? It was so good.

• 4:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a while ago.

• 4:48Jessie Ware?

  Ray Fiennes coming up on Table Mamas.

• 4:50Speaker 02

  Can't wait.

• 4:59Jessie Ware?

  Ray Fiennes, thanks so much for being here.

• 5:01Speaker 03

  Thank you for having me.

• 5:01Jessie Ware?

  And making such an effort. You look so dashing.

• 5:04Speaker 03

  Do I?

• 5:05Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, you came in with a really fab hat as well.

• 5:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 5:08Jessie Ware?

  That's not here now, but thank you.

• 5:10Speaker 03

  I took it off.

• 5:11Jessie Ware?

  And how are you?

• 5:13Speaker 03

  I'm good. I'm just starting this run of Grace Pervades, this new play by David Hare, which we transferred from Theatre Royal Bath, which is a season. I helped to create last year. And it's exciting to have a new play in the West End.

• 5:27Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, how was the show last night?

• 5:29Speaker 03

  It was good. I mean, I think my own compass on how the show's going is very subjective, so you don't really know. You have a sense of it, but often your sense of how a show goes is, is, is not accurate. I don't know how to. I don't know how to market it. You have a vibe about it.

• 5:45Speaker 02

  Everyone was on their feet when I was there.

• 5:47Jessie Ware?

  Mum went to see it. I'm really annoyed that I couldn't make the same night, so.

• 5:50Speaker 02

  You'll have to go.

• 5:51Jessie Ware?

  Mum loved it.

• 5:52Speaker 02

  I loved it.

• 5:53Speaker 03

  It's an interesting story.

• 5:54Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, well, for people that haven't heard about the play, can you just explain what it's about?

• 5:59Speaker 03

  Yes, uh, well, the title Grace Pervades is actually taken from um, a, a description of Ellen Terry. Whether in movement or repose, grace pervades the hussy. Which was what. A theatre writer called Charles Reed wrote about Ellen Terry, a great Victorian actress. And I read a wonderful book by a man called Michael Holroyd, a great biographer, Michael Holroyd, wrote a book called A Strange Eventful History, which is the story of Ellen Terry and her acting partner, Henry, or Sir Henry Irving. Who you play?

• 6:40Speaker 03

  Oh, I play. And the story of their partnership as two actors in the late nineteenth century in London is extraordinary. Henry Irving created a very particular kind of theatre. At that time, mostly audiences went to see in the dramatic theatre, great actors do their stuff. But there was, the idea of a director's theatre didn't really exist. So Henry Irving was a driven man, driven to be a better actor, became well-known, was given the run of the Lyceum Theatre, which is where now The Lion King plays. And he created, using extraordinary stage effects, lighting effects, the best painters of the day to paint the scenery, design the scenery.

• 7:25Speaker 03

  And he, he was becoming a great and recognised actor and he invited the young Ellen Terry, who'd come from a family of actors, to be his leading lady. And they shone together. The theatre, the English theatre had never seen anything quite like the sort of detailed magnificence of his productions. Something extraordinary. Audiences came in their thousands and hundreds to see what he was doing. Expensive productions. Expensive, very, very expensive productions. But initially, the attendance was so great that he was in profit. And it was a big, big thing. And then fashions changed and then his theatre became outmoded and in the end his

• 8:08Speaker 03

  the play reflects how in the end he got into trouble, had to sell the theatre. Um, but I think the play celebrates their relationship, which we think was at one point romantic. And also the play examines her two illegitimate children. So another interesting thing is that she had conceived two children out of wedlock with a well-known art architect called William Godwin, with whom she was very in love. Before that, she had a disastrous marriage to a famous painter called G F Watts, who was about forty and she was about eighteen. Um, that didn't work. So she had, she'd had quite a dramatic love life. And she was an extraordinary woman and she, she got married to an actor.

• 8:49Speaker 03

  It's Victorian society is really interesting because people were doing their thing under the radar. Hmm. But you couldn't do it on the surface. I mean, you could not, you could not have, obviously, love at open, you couldn't live with someone and be unmarried in Victorian times. It would be scandalous. So she, she was out in the wilderness for a bit when she, you know, she'd conceived two children, was living with William Godwin. That's, that's background to the play. The point of the play is about theatre and the people who make theatre and the relationships behind the work that they're doing. So the central theme of the piece is Ellen and Henry and the theatre that he is making and her relationship.

• 9:32Speaker 03

  A running parallel to that is the story of her two children, which is very, very, very interesting because her son, Edward Gordon Craig, her illegitimate son, um, became one of the most important ideas people in the theatre, an iconoclastic, opinionated, brilliant artist, difficult to work with, but his ideas, his revolutionary ideas, I mean provocative ones, get rid of actors, let's just have puppets. Um, but basically he was trying to upend the sort of theatre Henry Irving was creating. And he didn't do a lot. He did do a famous production of Hamlet in Moscow with the great Russian actor-director Stanislavski. The designs are incredible.

• 10:17Speaker 03

  You can see the design, they are stunning. He was a great artist. I think he was not a great director. But he became very, very famous because his ideas were sort of exciting. His sister Edie Edith, also directed, plays mostly with a feminist or political slant out of a barn in Kent. And she produced a lot of plays, living with her girlfriends. She was certainly lesbian and they lived together in a sort of small women's community, and that's in the play. You see an insight into the way David Hare has imagined that. But she was an activist, and the irony is she's not that well-known, but she probably produced loads of plays. And her brother was very famous and did very little, and David Hare has fun with that,

• 11:02Speaker 03

  both that in the play.

• 11:04Jessie Ware?

  You said that you read a book about this, and then did you approach David Hare to write this play?

• 11:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, I pitched it as an idea. I mean, he may well have said, doesn't interest, doesn't interest me, Rafe, but I had a feel, I know David and admire him hugely, and he, I know he, his, his passion for what the theatre can do, and, you know, that's been his life, writing for the theatre, and about the provocation a play can create, and how it can move and excite people's souls, I think, as well as their minds. Anyway, I've, I've worked with him and I've just had a hunch that this, the theme, the theme of the theatre and how the theatre has changed in this country, I think, I thought it would appeal. And he went away and read the book and, and then read, yeah, and there's massive amount

• 11:51Speaker 03

  of material on Irving and Ellen, I mean, there's lots you can read. And he researched and researched and came up with this, I believe, wonderful play.

• 11:59Jessie Ware?

  So how long has it been in the making for?

• 12:02Speaker 03

  Well, I must have thrown the idea at him about three years ago now, and then he went away and read it, and then read the staff, read the book, and then I was invited to run a season at Theatre Royal Bath by Danny Moore, the artistic, the director of Bath. And I said yes, and I wanted two new plays. And David had written it in time for it us to do this season of plays that started a year ago. So I a year ago, we were in rehearsals for Grace Perage the first the first time round.

• 12:33Jessie Ware?

  How do you wind down after you a a show, what's there, is there any food that you eat particularly, or you need a drink, or?

• 12:41Speaker 03

  A drink is always a good thing.

• 12:43Jessie Ware?

  A drink?

• 12:43Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:44Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, what are you having?

• 12:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:46Speaker 03

  Uh, well, I will try and offer a glass of champagne to guests in the dressing room. Um, otherwise, I I love a martini.

• 12:54Jessie Ware?

  How do you take your martini?

• 12:56Speaker 03

  Very dry.

• 12:57Jessie Ware?

  Mm.

• 12:58Speaker 03

  Ideally, I don't do that, I haven't got to this stage yet in the dressing room, but if you but this dressing room post show blah blah aside.

• 13:06Jessie Ware?

  Mm.

• 13:06Speaker 03

  You should chill the glass, freeze the glass, so it's cold.

• 13:10Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 13:11Speaker 03

  And the vo- vodka or gin, I prefer gin, I think you should keep the gin in the freezer.

• 13:16Jessie Ware?

  What sort of gin?

• 13:17Speaker 03

  Tanqueray ten, I like.

• 13:19Jessie Ware?

  Tanqueray?

• 13:20Speaker 03

  And I think you rinse the glass, the frozen glass, with a little bit of dry vermouth.

• 13:25Jessie Ware?

  Right.

• 13:25Speaker 03

  Just rinse it.

• 13:26Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 13:27Speaker 03

  And chuck it, so it's just coated.

• 13:28Jessie Ware?

  Get it out of there, yeah.

• 13:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, then pour in, you shouldn't need to shake and all that stuff, because you your gin is already frozen.

• 13:35Jessie Ware?

  Okay, so that was all silly with Bond, the shake and not stirred thing.

• 13:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, I think some, what happens is you tend to get a lot of the ice starts to melt in the shaking, and you get a bit of, yeah, exactly. So pouring your tanqueray ten into the rinse, the glass that's been rinsed with the dry vermouth and a little sliver of lemon.

• 13:53Jessie Ware?

  See, I like mine wet and filthy, Ralph. Unfortunately, so we wouldn't be sharing martini, I'd like to try yours.

• 14:00Speaker 03

  I would like to try a wet and filthy martini.

• 14:03Jessie Ware?

  It's, I just, I like it with, I I I more is more for me, so I want like the blue, I mean.

• 14:08Speaker 03

  So what do you, tell me how you you do it.

• 14:10Jessie Ware?

  I like a vodka one, and I like lots of vermouth.

• 14:13Speaker 03

  Lots of them.

• 14:14Jessie Ware?

  Well, I just.

• 14:15Speaker 03

  Oh, no.

• 14:15Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, I know. But I do think it sounds more chic doing a rinse. I liked it. And then you chuck it out. I like it. It's dramatic and I like it. Um, and I like a blue cheese olive and lots of brine.

• 14:27Speaker 03

  A blue cheese olive?

• 14:28Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, if you've never had a dirty martini with a blue cheese olive.

• 14:31Speaker 03

  Is it olive with blue cheese in it?

• 14:32Jessie Ware?

  Yes.

• 14:32Speaker 03

  No, no, this is blasphemy, heresy.

• 14:35Speaker 02

  It must all leak, can't it make it?

• 14:37Jessie Ware?

  Yes, delicious.

• 14:38Speaker 02

  But it makes it not.

• 14:39Speaker 03

  Cheese in a martini.

• 14:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, she, I don't think.

• 14:43Jessie Ware?

  I think you should not knock it until you've tried it. Let's start from kind of the beginning. Can you paint a picture of who was around the dinner table and what was a very memorable dish from your childhood?

• 14:53Speaker 02

  A lot of people around the dinner table.

• 14:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, I'm the eldest of six.

• 14:57Jessie Ware?

  Wow.

• 14:58Speaker 03

  So there was mostly eight around the table. And meals were, I mean, we didn't eat fancy food. I mean, we, we were, my parents were often up against it financially. So we were sort of, there were regular trips to the cash and carry to get sort of supermarket food and.

• 15:16Jessie Ware?

  Your dad was a farmer?

• 15:17Speaker 03

  He started off farming and then he became a photographer. But a Sunday lunch would be roast chicken and potatoes and vegetables and things like that. And I do remember occasionally my mother, parents making spaghetti bolognese and. And I said, our food was, it was get the food in the mouths of the children.

• 15:33Jessie Ware?

  Uh huh.

• 15:33Speaker 03

  You know, get your carbs in the kids' mouths. And my mother, my mother made wonderful soups. They, but they were very good cooks, but often I just have a, my childhood memory is, you know, often it's a, a bought pie or something from the supermarket, just to eat for ease. But macaroni cheese or fish pie or shepherd's pie or those sort of stalwart dishes that just give energy and feed people.

• 15:59Jessie Ware?

  And you were the eldest?

• 16:00Speaker 03

  No.

• 16:01Jessie Ware?

  And how many brothers, how many sisters?

• 16:03Speaker 03

  Uh, there's four boys and two girls.

• 16:05Speaker 02

  And did you live on a farm?

• 16:07Speaker 03

  Initially, yeah, but then me, the, I was, my father was a tenant farmer in Suffolk.

• 16:12Speaker 02

  Farming what?

• 16:13Speaker 03

  Uh, it was crops. And he did have some sheep, but I think it was peas and barley, wheat.

• 16:19Speaker 02

  Did you have to help?

• 16:20Speaker 03

  I was, no, I was a child. I, I was six years old.

• 16:25Speaker 02

  But didn't they have the children helping, like collecting eggs and?

• 16:28Jessie Ware?

  Probably less help.

• 16:29Speaker 03

  No, no, but I was, you have to remember that we were, I was six years old when we left.

• 16:33Jessie Ware?

  Okay. Oh, fine. And where did you move?

• 16:35Speaker 03

  We moved into North Dorset and then my father became a photographer.

• 16:40Speaker 02

  So memories of the the meal times were kind of home cooked food.

• 16:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, sometimes I'm afraid sort of bought supermarket food for ease. But then I think as we got older and that sort of pressure to get the fit, I mean, there was a time when we were, we'd moved to Ireland. Um, and we were, my parents were very, they were the whole, we had a romantic move to the west, the coast of West Cork and built a house. But there was no, there was this difficult financial time. So we'd, we'd sold the house in. In Dorset and built this house. My father built a house in a fantastic site in on Dunmanus Bay. But there was no income. He didn't really have a, I thought, I think he thought he would buy. There are lots of wonderful sites there with planning permission that you could buy in Ireland.

• 17:25Speaker 03

  I think he thought he would develop properties, but it wasn't his thing. He wasn't, I mean, he was, he was brilliant with his hands and he could build and. Make a house, but he wasn't, that wasn't his business. So we were sort of stuck out there.

• 17:37Speaker 02

  What age was that?

• 17:38Speaker 03

  I was ten. Stuck out there with this wonderful house and this amazing ocean and mountains behind and a lake behind us and. And um, my mother going, what, what the deep, deep, deep are we gonna eat and how do we get by and we were. There were weeks, uh, we existed, our lunchtime, we might have had a piece of chicken or a pie, but there's lunch was. Noir packet soup with mashed potato.

• 18:04Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 18:05Speaker 03

  That's what it was.

• 18:06Speaker 02

  Did you like it?

• 18:09Speaker 03

  We were hungry kids, so we just, it was fine, it was food.

• 18:12Speaker 02

  I, I was just telling Jessie that my friend had some Italian friends staying over and they stayed in the Ellen Hotel in Ken- Kensington. Which was her house.

• 18:21Speaker 03

  Oh, really?

• 18:22Speaker 02

  Yes. So there's a hotel called the Ellen Hotel and that's her house. You'll have to go there.

• 18:27Speaker 03

  The place that people, if they're interested at all in this Ellen Terry story, was to visit Small Hives. In Kent, which is the home, which is featured in the play.

• 18:36Speaker 02

  Yes, which is where.

• 18:37Speaker 03

  Bought, where she bought an Edie, her daughter. Lived there. And it's now a National Trust property. There's a wonderful museum with artefacts from. Her working life and lots. Artifacts from Henry Irving's working life and the famous Lady Macbeth dress she wore with the green beetle wings stitched into it, that's there. It's really worth a trip.

• 18:59Speaker 02

  But she she she was very avant garde, so she accepted her daughter was a lesbian and lesbian friends and she liked being with them.

• 19:08Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 19:08Speaker 02

  And her son, she promoted him as much as she could.

• 19:12Speaker 03

  That's right, that's right, exactly right.

• 19:13Speaker 02

  And they're all very.

• 19:14Speaker 03

  I think she's very open.

• 19:15Speaker 02

  She was off. That's what I liked about the play because it was about emancipation as well.

• 19:20Speaker 03

  It is, it's about emancipation, exactly.

• 19:22Speaker 02

  And I thought that was very interesting, yeah.

• 19:24Speaker 03

  That's a big thing.

• 19:25Speaker 02

  Do you eat before, when do you, is this going to be your last meal before you go on stage tonight?

• 19:29Speaker 03

  I'll probably have something a bit later on, around about five.

• 19:32Jessie Ware?

  What what will you have at about five? Does it change or are you kind of stick your?

• 19:36Speaker 03

  Uh, well, I was very lucky that last weekend I I had some friends over. I didn't I didn't cook myself because uh. I get up late from the from here into this place I have in Suffolk, but I had asked someone I know to make a wonderful fish stew. And I've still got.

• 19:53Speaker 02

  A little bit over.

• 19:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, so that I'm finishing it off.

• 19:56Speaker 02

  Oh, I hope you've had it in the freezer.

• 19:58Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, I've had it.

• 19:58Speaker 02

  Good, otherwise you'll have a bad, yeah.

• 20:01Jessie Ware?

  You're quite, yeah, when I listen to your Ruthie Rogers um.

• 20:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:05Jessie Ware?

  Episode, you're really good friends. We've had Ruthie on the podcast too, love her. Um. She to she talks about how you'd call her up from like the market in Italy. And tell her what you were thinking of making to or what you'd just eaten. So are you quite a foodie?

• 20:22Speaker 03

  Oh, I love, I am a foodie, yes. Uh. I love food and of course Ruthie's River Cafe is is great. But um, yes, I have I have asked her advice and um. Probably annoyingly, I'm often referring to one of the River Cafe cookbooks and will ring her up. Must be very irritating. What this recipe, Ruthie, what do you think? Should I add more of this? It says this, I'm not sure about this.

• 20:47Speaker 03

  Um, but I love, yeah, I um.

• 20:51Speaker 03

  I love to cook, but I cook simple food, I think, I like.

• 20:55Jessie Ware?

  Well, hang on, you did talk about having Ottolenghi and liking liking a lot of cooking of Ottolenghi, which is not simple.

• 21:00Speaker 03

  No, that's not simple. When we had lockdown and I um. I was experimenting, I was in Suffolk, but in a little cottage. Uh, and I did experiment with Ottolenghi, but I had the time to. Excuse me.

• 21:15Speaker 03

  Go go with my to the supermarket and get.

• 21:18Jessie Ware?

  All the things you need.

• 21:19Speaker 03

  All those um um exotic spices.

• 21:22Jessie Ware?

  Hungry, by the way.

• 21:23Speaker 03

  I am.

• 21:23Jessie Ware?

  Good.

• 21:24Speaker 03

  I haven't eaten yet today.

• 21:25Jessie Ware?

  Oh, okay. Well, that you, yeah, well, mum's made something delicious. It smells great. Um, so if we were coming around to your house and you were cooking for us and you had the time.

• 21:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 21:37Jessie Ware?

  What do you think that you would be serving? What's your kind of your go to dish that you know is a bit of a showstopper?

• 21:45Speaker 03

  I would try to, I've loved cooking the Ottolenghi slow cooked lamb. Which you have to marinate if you can for a day or two before, and you cook it for four or five hours.

• 21:56Jessie Ware?

  And then it's quite easy because you just bung it in and then you don't have to think about it.

• 21:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, but it's also, it soaks in all these spices and juices and.

• 22:04Jessie Ware?

  What are you serving it with?

• 22:06Speaker 03

  Uh, probably so with some simple green vegetable, like some spinach or something.

• 22:11Jessie Ware?

  Okay.

• 22:11Speaker 03

  It's it's a meal in itself because it's.

• 22:13Jessie Ware?

  Oh, has it got potatoes and stuff like that?

• 22:14Speaker 03

  It's got carrots, I think it's got suluriac and garlic and. Um, yeah, it's it's a sort of lot of stuff with it. So I would, I would then serve something light and green.

• 22:26Jessie Ware?

  Right, okay.

• 22:27Speaker 03

  And I would probably most likely, I'm big in, I'm into steaming.

• 22:30Jessie Ware?

  Steaming?

• 22:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:32Jessie Ware?

  Is that a new thing or you've always been big into steam?

• 22:34Speaker 03

  New for me, the steaming, that looks amazing.

• 22:37Jessie Ware?

  It's um a Greek chicken really with lemony potatoes, very lemony potatoes, I hope, they're my favourite. But help yourself to whichever bit you want.

• 22:48Speaker 03

  See, that's it, something green.

• 22:49Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 22:49Speaker 03

  Exactly, that would be my. Green salad, spinach salad, is it?

• 22:55Speaker 02

  Spinach with, um, sugar snap peas and some asparagus and pumpkin seeds.

• 23:02Jessie Ware?

  That's a bit of you, right?

• 23:03Speaker 03

  This is exactly my, this is my perfect meal.

• 23:05Speaker 02

  Oh, you're, yeah, I bet you say that to all the girls.

• 23:09Jessie Ware?

  So, have you got a sweet tooth?

• 23:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, I, yeah, I, not, I don't eat puddings a lot, but I do, I do have a sweet tooth, yeah, I do.

• 23:16Speaker 02

  Take the potatoes, they should be really lemony and nice, I hope.

• 23:22Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 23:22Jessie Ware?

  Oh, this juice looks great.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  Does it?

• 23:25Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 23:26Speaker 02

  Hope so. Did you get enough asparagus?

• 23:30Speaker 03

  Um.

• 23:31Speaker 02

  Because there's loads at the bottom here.

• 23:33Speaker 03

  The chicken is perfect, can I just say the chicken is perfect?

• 23:36Speaker 02

  Okay, good.

• 23:37Jessie Ware?

  It's lovely, it's light, Mum, it's perfect, he's got to go on stage, he doesn't want to go to sleep, does he?

• 23:43Speaker 02

  No.

• 23:44Speaker 03

  I love a sugar snap.

• 23:46Speaker 02

  I do too.

• 23:47Jessie Ware?

  So, the acting, when did the, because from what I gather from your siblings, you're all quite artistic. And they would do very different things, isn't there an archaeologist with one of you and?

• 23:58Speaker 03

  Mick, who was adopted by my parents, who became an archaeologist, yes, he made some fantastic discoveries up in Cheshire.

• 24:09Jessie Ware?

  Wow.

• 24:09Speaker 03

  A few years ago, and I have two sisters who are filmmakers.

• 24:13Jessie Ware?

  So where did that all come from?

• 24:17Jessie Ware?

  Because your dad was a photographer, your mum, did, did she work?

• 24:21Speaker 03

  My mum was a writer, she, well, most of the time she was bringing up her children, she had six children, as I said. She'd published two novels before she met my father.

• 24:32Jessie Ware?

  Wow.

• 24:33Speaker 03

  And had good responses for being an interesting young voice.

• 24:39Speaker 03

  Then she met my father and they started to have children in rapid succession.

• 24:45Speaker 03

  And then I, we all grew up with my mother voicing increasingly her frustration that she didn't, couldn't find time to write. Well, she did, but it was always a struggle for her to, to sort of leave the children to go and write, but she did. And my father leant into the photography, which for many years was a struggle. But um we went, went to Ireland, we came back to England.

• 25:08Speaker 02

  Was she completely mad about him?

• 25:10Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 25:11Speaker 02

  And so wherever he went, she was prepared to follow.

• 25:13Speaker 03

  Well, I think she led some of the, she, she, she was very much a motivator for the move to Ireland. Being um Catholic and loving literature and they went on a photographic job to Ireland and my parents together fell in love with it, my mother particularly because at the time, having six children in England was, you know, was a quite a big thing. In Ireland, it was nothing. There were families with, within eight, nine, ten, eleven children. Um so you were completely accepted.

• 25:45Speaker 02

  Are you, are you Catholic?

• 25:47Speaker 03

  I was Catholic, yeah, I was brought up Catholic.

• 25:49Speaker 02

  So play, Conclave, that was so, you were honestly amazing. Was it filmed in, in Rome?

• 25:56Speaker 03

  Um, not in the Vatican, but it was filmed in Rome and in Chiny Chita, the Rome studio. Yeah, that was, my Catholic upbringing was useful. I mean, I've always had an interest in faith and belief and from, I think that's the sort of legacy of my upbringing. And my, my mother's side, we had um my mother's brothers were priests and all theologians and her, her uncles were priests and all theologians, Benedictine, monk, my great uncle, Sebastian Moore, who's a quite well known. So I've had sort of God discussions around the table, often with my, my mother, leading the charge on discussions about God.

• 26:38Speaker 02

  So she was a believer throughout her life?

• 26:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, she was. I think she, she started to be more questioning about the way that any, any religion can be dogmatic.

• 26:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:51Speaker 03

  And to some people, that dogmatism is appealing, and other people, they butt against it. When the rules of religions sort of start to sort of go against what you're living through. When they become pedantic and um I mean, I think everyone wrestles with the the rules, different religions want to impose.

• 27:13Speaker 02

  But I think Conclave was interesting about whether you could move forward as a religion and have someone as your pope who was completely different. Um uh uh who had a different kind of following, really, and a different mission.

• 27:28Speaker 03

  But I think the Catholic Church has changed massively.

• 27:30Speaker 02

  Do you think it has? I wondered about that.

• 27:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, conversations I had with priests as part of my research, I get the sense of, you know. The Catholic Church has been challenged by lots of issues. There are uh priests in the Catholic Church who recognize the challenges that the modern world presents the church.

• 27:49Jessie Ware?

  I mean, you've played so many different roles, but which one do you feel didn't leave you, which was the hardest to leave you after immersing yourself in it?

• 27:59Speaker 03

  I think the three films that I've been been lucky enough to direct and play in. Those were the hardest, um because of the combination of playing a role and directing, so that the. You you're also you're going on to edit and confront the part you've shot. And for some reason, your your left still having to look at your film and you in it. And and that's hard to leave because you're confronted with having to edit yourself as well as other people. And so by necessity, you can't let go. It's quite a funny place to put your head because usually it's actually a relief. You've played the part, you've done the research, whatever, you've been in it, you've tried to immerse yourself in the path every shooting day.

• 28:44Speaker 03

  Then the come the last day of filming, phew, let it go, it's done, you know, I can. Um, there are parts I've loved.

• 28:52Speaker 02

  Do you like some more?

• 28:53Speaker 03

  I would, yeah.

• 28:53Speaker 02

  Please.

• 28:54Jessie Ware?

  Which bit?

• 28:55Speaker 02

  And I would fit, yeah, and if you get the potatoes from the edge, I think.

• 28:58Jessie Ware?

  That's got the most chicken on it.

• 29:01Speaker 02

  That's a piece of breast there.

• 29:03Jessie Ware?

  That's a bit of breast.

• 29:04Speaker 03

  Have you ever had someone here, you opened a bottle of wine?

• 29:08Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 29:09Speaker 03

  With with other guests?

• 29:10Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, we've got very drunk.

• 29:12Speaker 03

  And they don't have to go off to do a play.

• 29:13Speaker 02

  Stanley Tucci was.

• 29:15Jessie Ware?

  Got so drunk with Stanley Tucci.

• 29:17Speaker 03

  Unravel here with.

• 29:19Jessie Ware?

  Are you wishing you didn't have to go and do the play tonight?

• 29:21Speaker 03

  I can imagine another version of this where we opened a really good bottle of wine and.

• 29:25Jessie Ware?

  Oh, oh.

• 29:26Speaker 02

  And we relax.

• 29:26Jessie Ware?

  Mum prefers it.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  I much prefer it.

• 29:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, I would, I would, yeah, if I didn't have.

• 29:31Jessie Ware?

  She had to kick Ed Miliband out.

• 29:33Speaker 02

  Yes, Stanley Tucci had, do you want some juice on it?

• 29:36Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 29:37Speaker 02

  Stanley Tucci, we had two bottles of wine.

• 29:40Speaker 03

  Yeah, okay.

• 29:40Jessie Ware?

  We were drunk.

• 29:41Speaker 02

  He did bring wine with him and he's a very good man.

• 29:45Speaker 03

  He is.

• 29:45Jessie Ware?

  Well, yeah, I bet you ate well with him.

• 29:47Speaker 03

  We did, we did, yeah.

• 29:48Speaker 02

  He's great fun.

• 29:49Jessie Ware?

  Speaking of Stanley Tucci, has he ever cooked for you? He's always at that kitchen doing a demo for us all. We all wanna be invited over to that gorgeous.

• 29:58Speaker 03

  Stanley, you haven't actually cooked for me.

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 30:01Speaker 03

  You took me out for lovely meals in Rome. And I have a memory of us talking about you cooking for me, but I can't.

• 30:09Speaker 02

  Straight to the camera.

• 30:10Speaker 03

  That you've honoured that suggestion.

• 30:14Jessie Ware?

  You know what? I'm gonna look at the camera too and say, Stanley. I think it's time for you to invite us over. And he says that no one invites them over. Well, I don't see the invite here, Stanley. So Ray, Lenny and Jessie will come over for dinner.

• 30:26Speaker 02

  And I'll bring a six pack of wine.

• 30:28Jessie Ware?

  What? A six pack?

• 30:30Speaker 02

  Of wine.

• 30:31Jessie Ware?

  Like we're going to a house party?

• 30:32Speaker 02

  Six bottles.

• 30:33Jessie Ware?

  Um, so you love breakfast, don't you?

• 30:37Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 30:37Jessie Ware?

  Me too, but you haven't had breakfast today. Is this something that you don't do when you're on stage?

• 30:42Speaker 03

  Well, I thought I knew I was gonna have a substantial lunch.

• 30:45Jessie Ware?

  Why deny yourself a little boiled egg?

• 30:48Speaker 03

  I did have a boiled egg.

• 30:49Jessie Ware?

  Oh, you did eat them. You're a liar.

• 30:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 30:52Speaker 02

  I do.

• 30:52Speaker 03

  I wasn't have the, that wasn't the breakfast.

• 30:55Speaker 02

  It's not a full English, darling.

• 30:57Speaker 03

  I boiled egg just to have something to keep me.

• 30:59Jessie Ware?

  Just to lime the stomach.

• 30:59Speaker 02

  Do you like it hard boiled or soft?

• 31:01Speaker 03

  I like it hard boiled, yeah.

• 31:03Speaker 02

  Oh, you see, I only want soft.

• 31:04Speaker 03

  Soft boiled egg, but um, I will, but yeah, maybe just a slightly, slightly soft yolk, but not, not.

• 31:11Speaker 02

  But did you have bread with it?

• 31:12Speaker 03

  No.

• 31:13Speaker 02

  Just the egg?

• 31:14Jessie Ware?

  Salt and pepper?

• 31:16Speaker 03

  I just had egg and I had a I had a bit of cucumber, a bit of cheese.

• 31:19Jessie Ware?

  You had a breakfast. I hate to break it to you, right? That's a breakfast. You did eat before you came.

• 31:24Speaker 03

  That's a snack.

• 31:25Speaker 02

  That's not what he feels is a that's a snack.

• 31:27Speaker 03

  Smoked salmon scrambled eggs.

• 31:28Speaker 02

  Oh, delicious.

• 31:29Speaker 03

  Mm.

• 31:30Jessie Ware?

  Well, smoked salmon can go very wrong, I feel.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  No, it can't, Jesse.

• 31:35Jessie Ware?

  Be in control of the right smoked salmon, otherwise I feel like it's if it's too thickly cut, it makes me feel gross.

• 31:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:42Jessie Ware?

  It it can be slightly too fishy.

• 31:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:46Jessie Ware?

  Like, it has to be from the right spot.

• 31:47Speaker 02

  So where do you like yours?

• 31:49Jessie Ware?

  Well, I I always buy it and then I forget about it and then it goes off in my fridge and then nobody else eats it in my house, so.

• 31:54Speaker 02

  Mm.

• 31:55Jessie Ware?

  I, yeah.

• 31:56Speaker 03

  There are, there are, don't ask me to name the brand, but there are brands of smoked salmon which are very good, I think.

• 32:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, Gold Goldman's and Panzer's.

• 32:04Jessie Ware?

  Panzer's is good.

• 32:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, Panzer's is the best. If you live in Saint John's Wood, you're blessed.

• 32:09Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 32:09Speaker 03

  Panzer's?

• 32:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:10Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 32:11Speaker 02

  It's a wonderful deli that just is so delicious. All the food is great there.

• 32:15Speaker 03

  Okay, I'm gonna remember that.

• 32:17Jessie Ware?

  Do you do you so you usually, do you live in London?

• 32:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 32:22Jessie Ware?

  Okay, fine.

• 32:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:23Jessie Ware?

  But you you've got Suffolk as well.

• 32:25Speaker 03

  I've got a little place I can run away to, a field I can go and hide in, hide in.

• 32:32Jessie Ware?

  And and then Italy? Do you go to Italy still?

• 32:35Speaker 03

  I do, yeah.

• 32:36Jessie Ware?

  What brought you there?

• 32:37Speaker 03

  A friend of mine was renting a house, an American friend, and said to me and my then partner, please use it. And um we went there and loved it and then this friend gave up the rental of that house, I took it on. Um and I've kept it, so I rent it all year round.

• 32:58Speaker 02

  Is it near a big town?

• 32:59Speaker 03

  It's about forty five minutes north of Perugia.

• 33:02Speaker 02

  Oh, lovely. And what have you got a local restaurant?

• 33:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 33:06Speaker 02

  And what would be your favourite dish there?

• 33:09Speaker 03

  Chickpea soup.

• 33:11Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 33:12Speaker 03

  Zuppa di Cheeti.

• 33:14Jessie Ware?

  Supa di Cheeti.

• 33:16Speaker 02

  I've never.

• 33:16Speaker 03

  Nona gelsa.

• 33:18Speaker 02

  What's that mean?

• 33:19Speaker 03

  I think it means granny gelsa.

• 33:22Speaker 02

  Okay, I thought it was without angels. Oh, nona, nona gelsa.

• 33:25Jessie Ware?

  Nonna gelsa.

• 33:26Speaker 02

  And then after?

• 33:27Speaker 03

  They do this wonderful um lamb chops, agnello scottadito.

• 33:32Jessie Ware?

  I love lamb chops. You love lamb?

• 33:34Speaker 03

  Mm.

• 33:35Speaker 02

  I do too.

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• 34:50Speaker 02

  I've made panna cotta. And you can either have a topping of cherries or passion fruit.

• 34:56Jessie Ware?

  Um, they're sour cherries, though.

• 34:58Speaker 02

  They're sour, but they're not very sour because I made them, or passion fruit.

• 35:01Speaker 03

  What do you recommend, by hand?

• 35:03Speaker 02

  Well, I don't know whether you've got a very sweet tooth because it's quite sweet and I quite like the cherries. But I think passion fruit might make it a bit crunchier and sour.

• 35:10Jessie Ware?

  Why can't you have a bit both?

• 35:12Speaker 02

  Because it won't work, darling.

• 35:16Jessie Ware?

  What do you want, Ray?

• 35:17Speaker 02

  This is how it works. This is, yeah.

• 35:20Jessie Ware?

  This is us on best behaviour.

• 35:23Speaker 02

  This is us not shouting at each other.

• 35:26Speaker 03

  I like to try the passion fruit.

• 35:28Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 35:29Jessie Ware?

  So, last supper, starter, what are we having, Ray?

• 35:34Speaker 03

  This is going to sound so boring because I, if it's my last supper, I want to eat things that are fresh and pure. And so I would just have a selection of raw vegetables.

• 35:48Jessie Ware?

  Okay, let's not say you're dying, you're not dying, you're going to a desert island instead. Would that change it from raw vegetables? Or would it still be?

• 35:54Speaker 03

  Well, look, I like, I don't, I like very simple things. So if I had like, um,

• 36:02Speaker 03

  Some asparagus, just grilled with, um, and I like maybe some hummus with some. Um, chopped fennel or a carrot or.

• 36:12Jessie Ware?

  Pre-ditary, you like it?

• 36:13Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 36:14Jessie Ware?

  I swear, Chris, I, like, I swear, this is very simple.

• 36:17Speaker 03

  I don't want, I don't want anything really rich. I, I like stuff that's just genuinely fresh. It's got to be fresh. It's got to be pulled from the ground.

• 36:26Jessie Ware?

  Okay.

• 36:26Speaker 03

  Just before and or cooked, or if it's cooked very gently, but really, really fresh. So if it's my last supper, if it's my last supper.

• 36:35Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 36:35Speaker 03

  I want to taste the fruits of the earth as from the, the purest form. I mean, I don't, you know, something that's come from someone's garden or my own garden is just. And then I think, um, I'm not a vegetarian, so I would either, I would love, I suppose, a. A really good steak.

• 36:54Jessie Ware?

  How are you having it cooked and one of the condiments?

• 36:57Speaker 03

  There would just, it'd have to be really one of those steaks that's hung for. Dry aged forty, whatever days hung, really, really tender beef, grass fed.

• 37:07Jessie Ware?

  Chips or mash?

• 37:08Speaker 03

  Yes, some really good chips.

• 37:10Jessie Ware?

  Okay.

• 37:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 37:12Jessie Ware?

  Bernays?

• 37:14Speaker 03

  No.

• 37:14Jessie Ware?

  No.

• 37:15Speaker 03

  Just make sure the steak is salted to the right degree.

• 37:17Jessie Ware?

  Mm, yeah. Are you good at making steak?

• 37:19Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 37:20Jessie Ware?

  I'm not, can't do it. Always cock it up. What?

• 37:25Speaker 03

  Is it, yeah, I mean, or, or, or as a, a, the official alternative, like, um, a healthily sourced, well sourced fish.

• 37:32Jessie Ware?

  Which one?

• 37:32Speaker 03

  Lion caught, I guess, a sea bass.

• 37:35Speaker 02

  No, it's not my favourite.

• 37:37Jessie Ware?

  Sorry, I know it's your last supper.

• 37:37Speaker 02

  I like turbot.

• 37:39Jessie Ware?

  It's not doing it for me, right?

• 37:40Speaker 02

  Do you like turbot?

• 37:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, I do, I do, yeah.

• 37:42Speaker 02

  I like halibut.

• 37:43Jessie Ware?

  Sea bass.

• 37:43Speaker 02

  Do you ever go to J Sheekey after?

• 37:45Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 37:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, everyone goes to J Sheekey. You've never been, have you?

• 37:48Jessie Ware?

  No, I know, but they invited me to be an ambassador and I was like, I've never bloody been, like, how can I be an ambassador if I've never been?

• 37:54Speaker 02

  It's your picture up on the wall.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  The thing is, the last supper is a hard one, isn't it? Because some, you might think it's got to be the most extraordinary, voluptuous meal.

• 38:02Speaker 03

  If it is the last supper, if you know it's your last supper, like, you know you're being let out to die.

• 38:07Speaker 02

  Oh, don't, they're not doing that.

• 38:09Speaker 03

  Then I don't, I want to have something that's really simple. I don't, I, that's my, that's my instinct speaking, not some.

• 38:19Jessie Ware?

  Not indulgent.

• 38:20Speaker 03

  No.

• 38:20Jessie Ware?

  No. Pudd? No.

• 38:24Speaker 03

  Nice cheese.

• 38:25Jessie Ware?

  Okay, what's on the cheese board?

• 38:26Speaker 03

  I don't know, I mean, any, any, I'm a selection.

• 38:28Jessie Ware?

  You love cheese. What did you have with your breakfast this morning?

• 38:32Speaker 03

  It's a piece of manchego.

• 38:35Speaker 02

  That's unusual for breakfast, because it's quite hard.

• 38:38Speaker 03

  It's my snack, I keep on saying. It wasn't my breakfast, it was my snack.

• 38:42Jessie Ware?

  Yeah. Did you have membro with it?

• 38:45Speaker 03

  No. Oh, membro is good. I'd have that. Manchego membro.

• 38:49Jessie Ware?

  Delicious.

• 38:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 38:50Jessie Ware?

  I love a sweet condiment.

• 38:53Speaker 03

  I don't like thick gooey, oversweet foods. This is, this is fantastic.

• 38:57Speaker 02

  Do you like it?

• 38:58Jessie Ware?

  This is great, Mum.

• 38:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, do you like?

• 38:59Jessie Ware?

  These are the tiniest cherries I've ever seen in my life.

• 39:02Speaker 02

  Frozen cherries, darling.

• 39:03Speaker 03

  This is really, really, really good. Maybe I'd have this.

• 39:07Speaker 02

  Do you like the passion fruit?

• 39:08Speaker 03

  Would you cook my last supper?

• 39:09Speaker 02

  I will do, darling, of course. As long as I can see you every day, watch the play. I might have to come again, actually, because I enjoyed it so much.

• 39:18Speaker 03

  Will you come again?

• 39:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think I would, actually.

• 39:20Speaker 03

  You come together?

• 39:21Jessie Ware?

  I'll bring, I'll bring the blue cheese olives and we'll have a drink together. We'll have a martini. No.

• 39:27Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 39:28Jessie Ware?

  I'm, I'm not invited.

• 39:30Speaker 02

  Michael McIntyre was sitting behind me in the theatre. Did he come back and say hello?

• 39:35Speaker 03

  He did, he did.

• 39:36Speaker 02

  Good.

• 39:36Jessie Ware?

  Do you find it a bit annoying when people come back and say hi? Do you a bit like, oh god, oh, can't be arsed tonight?

• 39:42Speaker 03

  It's a funny one, right? Because, of course, you're ha- really happy people have come to see the show. And I love it. But, but often you then, after, if, every night people are coming, you do suddenly find yourself saying,

• 39:54Jessie Ware?

  Performing.

• 39:55Speaker 03

  Is there a night when no one's in, so I can just go out with my mates?

• 39:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:59Jessie Ware?

  Oh, yeah, of course.

• 40:00Speaker 02

  But you, it's like you have to entertain.

• 40:02Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, but I mean, you want people to, of course, you, in, in the end, you're very happy people have come. It's all who's in the mix, you know, I mean, also, and what the part you've played. This, I've some, I've played some parts, say, Macbeth, for instance, where you're completely wrecked afterwards. And it's hard because of what you've gone through on stage and what you've tried to reenact on stage. It's all you're wrung out, so your social skills are kind of very diluted. Playing Henry Irving in this play isn't so bad. I mean, I love the pop and and also on top of all that, you come off stage with a sort of energy. And adrenaline, you're adrenalineized. So you're, so with this, I I I feel I come off stage, it's it's a, there's a, there's a sort of lovely bittersweet ending to the play.

• 40:44Speaker 03

  It's not, it's not a horrendous cut your wrists tragedy. And so I think I, you know, and also you, you're often happy to see people who've come.

• 40:55Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 40:55Speaker 03

  And so you're ready for a bit of a drink and a.

• 40:58Speaker 02

  And a chat, yeah.

• 41:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 41:00Speaker 02

  Before we let you go, can you give us a nostalgic taste that can transport you back somewhere?

• 41:08Speaker 03

  Um, I used to work with a dear friend of my father's who was a farmer. I worked on his farm and he used to cook saffron, sausages in saffron.

• 41:20Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 41:21Speaker 03

  And if ever I have sausages in saffron, which I sometimes make for myself. I um, I'm transported back to working on a farm in summer.

• 41:33Speaker 02

  How interesting. How do you put the saffron? Just put it in the frying pan?

• 41:38Speaker 03

  Yes, yeah, yeah.

• 41:39Speaker 02

  Wow, because it's quite a strong taste.

• 41:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, but too much.

• 41:42Speaker 02

  Do you like music when you're eating or do you like to read or sit in silence?

• 41:48Speaker 03

  It's different, different moods on different days. I think sometimes you're ready to have some background music in um.

• 41:53Speaker 02

  Who would you choose for your soundtrack?

• 41:56Speaker 03

  I love solo vocalist singers. So it can be anyone from Nina Simone to Johnny Cash to Bob Dylan to famous opera singers like Dietrich Fischer-Diesckal. I mean, I love the human voice singing. I think it's the most wonderful thing to hear. A great vocalist sing and um, so I would put on Edith Piaf or Billie Holiday.

• 42:20Speaker 03

  And modern, I like um PJ Harvey, I like, is it Rosalía?

• 42:25Jessie Ware?

  Oh my god, I'm so angry that I missed that performance, it looked incredible.

• 42:30Speaker 03

  I mean, I like, I like modern, you know, singers, I come across new singers, I love, I love that.

• 42:35Jessie Ware?

  Did you get pulled into Rosalía when the kind of more classical reference stuff, or you were a bit of a motte, a motte, what's it, a motte manny?

• 42:42Speaker 03

  No, I would, what's the recent album?

• 42:44Jessie Ware?

  Yeah. Sophia went uh this week, that's why she got the merch.

• 42:49Speaker 02

  Is it, is it white, is it quite religious?

• 42:52Jessie Ware?

  Well, she's playing.

• 42:53Speaker 02

  Religious notes, isn't there?

• 42:55Jessie Ware?

  Oh, I mean, she sings in about nine different languages.

• 42:57Speaker 02

  She's very beautiful as well.

• 42:59Jessie Ware?

  She's incredible.

• 43:00Speaker 03

  What do you like to listen to?

• 43:02Jessie Ware?

  Oh my gosh, no.

• 43:04Speaker 03

  Can you sing for us now?

• 43:06Jessie Ware?

  No. Can you act for me now?

• 43:10Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 43:10Speaker 02

  Probably can.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  He's just turned it on.

• 43:13Jessie Ware?

  No, you can come to a show of mine.

• 43:14Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 43:14Speaker 02

  Come to, Jessie's performing at the O2, so you'll have to come and see her in November if you're here.

• 43:20Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, you should come.

• 43:21Speaker 03

  Okay, I'm gonna come.

• 43:22Jessie Ware?

  It's camp.

• 43:24Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 43:24Jessie Ware?

  It's fun. Anyway, Ralph Fiennes, Break A Leg Tonight, thank you so much for coming over and being such a wonderful guest.

• 43:30Speaker 03

  Thank you for having me for such fantastic food, wonderful chicken, wonderful panna cotta.

• 43:35Speaker 02

  Pleasure.

• 43:35Speaker 03

  I've loved talking to you both, thank you.

• 43:38Jessie Ware?

  And um how long is Grace Pervades on for?

• 43:41Speaker 03

  Grace Pervades is at the Theatre Royal Haymarket until July the 11th.

• 43:45Jessie Ware?

  Okay, great.

• 43:46Speaker 03

  Thursday and Saturday matinees.

• 43:47Speaker 02

  It's on my programme.

• 44:03Jessie Ware?

  Ralph Fiennes uh wants to come again and have a boozy dinner with us.

• 44:08Speaker 02

  I think he was a bit jealous of Stanley's lunch.

• 44:10Jessie Ware?

  Yeah.

• 44:11Speaker 02

  Two bottles of wine and he didn't drink at all.

• 44:14Jessie Ware?

  Poor Ralph has to go to the West End now, do a very good performance.

• 44:17Speaker 02

  I know.

• 44:18Jessie Ware?

  Um thank you to Ralph Fiennes for coming on the podcast, you were brilliant, intense.

• 44:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:23Jessie Ware?

  Um thoughtful.

• 44:25Speaker 02

  I love the way he talked about the play, because he's so invested in it and passionate about it. And it really is a tribute to great Victorian actors.

• 44:35Jessie Ware?

  I'm very excited to see it and. It's like a packed house. You were there and it was absolutely packed.

• 44:40Speaker 02

  Everyone stood up.

• 44:41Jessie Ware?

  I mean, he's one of the greats.

• 44:42Speaker 02

  He is.

• 44:42Jessie Ware?

  The food was delicious. Thank you. He had seconds.

• 44:45Speaker 02

  Bit hard potatoes, but then they softened.

• 44:47Jessie Ware?

  They were nice potatoes, though.

• 44:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:49Jessie Ware?

  They weren't undercooked. They just weren't like, but then maybe it's better than them falling apart.

• 44:54Speaker 02

  They're not exactly as I'd take.

• 44:56Jessie Ware?

  They're not a great potato.

• 44:57Speaker 02

  No. Why is that?

• 44:59Jessie Ware?

  Because you didn't use great potatoes, Mum.

• 45:00Speaker 02

  Do you think that's the reason?

• 45:01Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, that'll do it. It was still really nice. Your panna cotta, very delicious.

• 45:05Speaker 02

  Good.

• 45:06Jessie Ware?

  Thank you so much, Mum. And all done on a bad hip.

• 45:09Speaker 02

  All done with some poorly hit. Yeah.

• 45:11Jessie Ware?

  Ralph Fiennes is in Grace Pervades until mid-July, so go and check it out.

• 45:18Speaker 02

  Excited.

• 45:19Jessie Ware?

  Did he leave his telephone number?

• 45:21Speaker 02

  No. He said, please give just.

• 45:23Jessie Ware?

  No, he didn't.

• 45:25Jessie Ware?

  We'll see you next week for more Table Manners.

• 45:49Speaker 00

  Hi, everyone. It's Katie Couric. And on my podcast, Next Question, we love stories about how women are taking control of their lives. They are increasingly leading financial decisions in their households. Yet, many say they don't feel fully prepared for the long-term financial choices ahead. Real confidence comes from knowing your financial future is protected, whatever happens. Pacific Life has helped generations protect what matters today and prepare for tomorrow with life insurance and lifetime income solutions. It's a promise Pacific Life has kept for nearly 160 years, so its customers can keep theirs.

• 46:31Speaker 00

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