Dr. Daniel Amen | Club Random with Bill Maher

Dr. Daniel Amen joins Bill Maher to talk brains—what they reveal about us, how badly we may be treating them, and why psychiatry is the only medical field that rarely looks at the organ it’s treating. Amen shares what he learned from treating Muhammad Ali and hundreds of NFL players, why he believes damaged brains can get better, and the everyday things we do that can either strengthen or shrink them. He and Bill go back and forth on marijuana, alcohol, meditation, Alzheimer’s, and the eternal question: how healthy do you really want to be if it means giving up everything fun? They also get into what’s happening to young people, from social media and pornography to anxiety and depression—and why learning not to believe every thought that pops into your head might be one of the most useful skills nobody teaches us. And somehow, by the end of it, Bill agrees to let Amen scan his brain. Now the question is: does he actually want to know what’s in there? #billmaher #danielamen #clubrandom Subscribe to the Club Random YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/clubrandompodcast?sub_confirmation=1 Watch episodes ad-free – subscribe to Bill Maher’s Substack: https://billmaher.substack.com Subscribe to the podcast for free wherever you listen: ⁠https://bit.ly/ClubRandom Support our Advertisers: Go to https://120Life.com and use my code [RANDOM] for 20% off. Try it risk-free for two weeks. Head to https://superpower.com/random for $50 off your membership. Get 150+ biomarkers tested every year plus a personalized health plan and on-demand care team. Detect early signs of 1,000+ conditions. #superpowerpod Visit https://hims.com/clubrandom to get a personalized, affordable plan that gets you. Buy Club Random Merch: https://clubrandom.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices ABOUT CLUB RANDOM In Club Random, Bill Maher unleashes his comedic wit on an unpredictable lineup – from Bill Burr and Jerry Seinfeld to Quentin Tarantino and Neil deGrasse Tyson – digging into everything but politics. It’s Maher in his familiar element: one-on-one vibes, unfiltered laughs, and the kind of freewheeling banter only he can deliver. ABOUT BILL MAHER Bill Maher was the host of “Politically Incorrect” (Comedy Central, ABC) from 1993-2002, and for the last 23 years on HBO’s “Real Time,” Maher’s combination of unflinching honesty and big laughs have garnered him 41 Emmy nominations. Maher won his first Emmy in 2014 as executive producer for the HBO series, “VICE.” In October of 2008, this same combination was on display in Maher’s uproarious and unprecedented swipe at organized religion, “Religulous.” Maher has written six bestsellers: “True Story,” “Does Anybody Have a Problem with That? Politically Incorrect’s Greatest Hits,” “When You Ride Alone, You Ride with Bin Laden,” “New Rules: Polite Musings from a Timid Observer,” “The New New Rules: A Funny Look at How Everybody But Me Has Their Head Up Their Ass", and most recently "What This Comedian Said Will Shock You". FOLLOW CLUB RANDOM https://www.clubrandom.com https://www.facebook.com/Club-Random-101776489118185 https://twitter.com/clubrandom_ https://www.instagram.com/clubrandompodcast https://www.tiktok.com/@clubrandompodcast FOLLOW BILL MAHER https://www.billmaher.com https://twitter.com/billmaher https://www.instagram.com/billmaher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

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• 1:29Bill Maher?

  Why are you remodeling your backyard to make it more, you know, zen-y? We were remodeling our merch store to make it more random.

• 1:39Bill Maher?

  We've slapped our new logo on t-shirts, tie-dyes, hoodies, and hats, and all with premium printed labels. Look, I wasn't kidding. We have it, because tags are like the junk mail of clothing. All merch is available exclusively at clubrandom.com. Once again, that's clubrandom.com. I noticed you're avoiding that question.

• 2:03Speaker 04

  I'm so excited to see your brain.

• 2:05Bill Maher?

  That...

• 2:10Speaker 04

  Muhammad Ali was one of my patients.

• 2:13Bill Maher?

  You had Muhammad Ali as a patient?

• 2:15Speaker 04

  I have his brain.

• 2:15Bill Maher?

  What was he like?

• 2:17Speaker 04

  Awesome.

• 2:20Bill Maher?

  Doc!

• 2:23Bill Maher?

  How are you, sir?

• 2:25Speaker 04

  So nice to see you.

• 2:26Bill Maher?

  Ah, thanks for coming. What do you think of the place?

• 2:30Speaker 04

  Spectacular.

• 2:31Bill Maher?

  Really? This is your kind of place?

• 2:34Speaker 04

  I love it.

• 2:35Bill Maher?

  Really? Good. Well, listen, I've been dying to meet you. You're very popular. The chicks dig you, Doc. Did you, you knew that, I guess. The women really, very excited. Holy, that doc's on. You know, they're into that medical stuff, much more than the guys. Guys are...

• 2:53Speaker 04

  I think of all my followers, 80% are women.

• 2:56Bill Maher?

  80%?

• 2:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:58Bill Maher?

  No wonder why you're such a Mac. Okay, so...

• 3:02Speaker 04

  My wife said I came housebroken and well-trained. I have five sisters, so...

• 3:08Bill Maher?

  Really? Now, somebody told me you give your daughter's boyfriend's brain scans?

• 3:17Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 3:19Bill Maher?

  You got the machine right in the dining room, Doc?

• 3:23Speaker 04

  No, but they go to the clinic. When I met my wife, it's our anniversary on Sunday.

• 3:29Bill Maher?

  How many years?

• 3:31Speaker 04

  18.

• 3:33Bill Maher?

  I'm sorry. People on TV, they always clap when people are married more than, like, two years.

• 3:38Speaker 04

  And I was married once before, and it wasn't good. And so...

• 3:43Bill Maher?

  Well, she's gonna hear that and be offended.

• 3:45Speaker 04

  She said, when I asked her, "We're dating three weeks", and I'm like, "You haven't seen the clinics. Time to see the clinic." And she said it was the most unusual line, "That you wanted to see my naked brain."

• 4:05Bill Maher?

  I mean, when I see brains, in like, I've only seen it in movies and stuff, but it is one of the more unattractive-looking organs in the body. Don't you think?

• 4:17Speaker 04

  No, I love...

• 4:19Bill Maher?

  Brains.

• 4:20Speaker 04

  The brains. Because it makes you who you are. How you think and feel and act.

• 4:24Bill Maher?

  I gotta tell you, I'm not one of those people who believes in the universe. I mean, I believe in the universe. Just don't believe it's speaking to me like people think. However, this is, I think this is just not a, it's a coincidence, but it's a sign of where medicine is moving. Not because you're coming, but two other people, not, one person I read about and one person I had lunch with, Arianna Huffington, just two days ago, was all about the brain. And she's writing about it, and, you know, she must be a big fan of yours. And then I was reading about someone who had no problems, but had a brain scan at like 40, and they found what they, she wouldn't have known unless she died from it.

• 5:08Bill Maher?

  So, like, your basic message about, you know, because I've never been a big fan of psychiatry. I know it works for some people. But your thing about, like, "Look at the physical organ", I'm much more down on that page. I mean, I'm sure it's both. But I'm gonna get the brain scan. Because my brain's been through a lot, Doc. I'm not gonna lie to you. Do you drink?

• 5:31Speaker 04

  No.

• 5:32Bill Maher?

  Oh, me neither.

• 5:33Speaker 04

  Because I look at the brain, so...

• 5:35Bill Maher?

  Well, come on.

• 5:36Speaker 04

  And when it comes to the brain...

• 5:37Bill Maher?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 5:38Speaker 04

  It's the only organ in your body where size matters.

• 5:43Bill Maher?

  Oh, what? Now, Doc, don't give me a setup line like that, or I can drive right down Broadway with the punchline. The only organ that matters? Boy, your wife's a forgiving woman. Good night, everybody.

• 5:57Speaker 04

  Size matters. So, I never wanted to do anything to have a smaller brain.

• 6:03Bill Maher?

  I never wanted to do anything to have a smaller dick. That's so funny. I've done so much shit to my brain. My dick, I've treated like gold.

• 6:13Speaker 04

  So, there's the big brain and the little brain. And which one's in charge? And I want to have a big brain in charge.

• 6:22Bill Maher?

  In every way, Doc, I had it in reverse. But I'm 70 now, and I'm much more mature. And I've taken care of myself very well. Like, when it got serious, I smoked stupidly for 20 years. But I quit at 40. Let me ask you that, you would know this. Like, how much poison do you think I could put in my body without it, like, actually killing me? Not that I do it anymore very much, but I did. I feel like I did, you know, I still smoke pot. And I only have a few drinks a week. But I did drink, let's say, like, an Irishman for years, smoked for 20 years.

• 7:07Bill Maher?

  You think your body repairs completely?

• 7:10Speaker 04

  Sometimes.

• 7:11Bill Maher?

  Yeah, really?

• 7:12Speaker 04

  Sometimes. It depends on how much reserve you have. So, there's a term I coin called "brain reserve". It's the extra tissue you have to deal with whatever stress comes your way. So, take two soldiers, put them in the same tank, same blast.

• 7:30Speaker 04

  One of them walks away unharmed, and one of them's permanently disabled. Why? It's the brain they brought into the accident. And so, some people can smoke a lot of pot, can drink a lot of alcohol, and they still have their faculties.

• 7:46Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 7:47Speaker 04

  A lot more people, it really has a negative impact on their brain.

• 7:54Bill Maher?

  Well, not to invite ridicule here by my haters, but I, you can hate me, and I have many enemies who do, but nobody says I've lost my faculties. You know, like, and they could. That would be a very easy one. Well, it must be the pot talking. No, they'll say, "Oh, he's old." Like, that's an argument. It's not an argument. Am I right? That's an argument, or wrong, about anything. But, you know, but I never hear, "Oh, he's lost his marbles, and so..."

• 8:20Speaker 04

  But you also don't want to lose them.

• 8:22Bill Maher?

  I...

• 8:24Speaker 04

  And one in two people...

• 8:26Bill Maher?

  Good point, Doc.

• 8:26Speaker 04

  And I'm 72. So, one in two people who are 85 or older have Alzheimer's disease or another form of dementia. So, you have a 50% risk. So, if you're 70 and healthy, odds are you're gonna live to 90.

• 8:44Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 8:44Speaker 04

  And don't you want to go knowing everything that's going on? And, you know, I have six kids. I love them all. I never want to live with them.

• 8:56Bill Maher?

  But don't you think by the time we're 90, AI will have made it so that our brain lives on, and we're in a completely, you know, I think they're just gonna transplant the brain into a body, and we're gonna get, because the brain could live more than the human life sign? Or is it the brain that conks out?

• 9:19Speaker 04

  No, your brain could go on, but if it's moth-eaten...

• 9:21Bill Maher?

  Indefinitely?

• 9:22Speaker 04

  But if it's moth-eaten, you're not gonna be thinking, right? So, when I first started doing scans, it was 1991. I was the director of a substance abuse treatment center in a psychiatric hospital. And their brains were so bad compared to the other ones I scanned. I'm like, no, I'm gonna stay with this.

• 9:44Bill Maher?

  Once you kill a brain cell, you can never bring it back to life?

• 9:48Speaker 04

  That's not true.

• 9:49Bill Maher?

  Great.

• 9:50Speaker 04

  That's not true.

• 9:51Bill Maher?

  Oh, good.

• 9:51Speaker 04

  There's an area of your brain called the hippocampus. It's involved in mood and memory. And every day, it produces about 700 new stem cells. Hippocampus is Greek for seahorse. So, I often think of them baby seahorses, making 700 new ones every day. It's your behavior that kills them or grows them. So, what you eat, what you drink, the level of stress you're under, the toxins in your environment, all of that matters. So, if you come and get scanned, you'll learn to love your brain, and then you'll treat it better.

• 10:32Bill Maher?

  I love my brain. I do. It's done me very well, with all the flaws it has. I have never argued that I'm some sort of super-high-IQ person, or, you know, could do things that people I admire greatly sometimes, who I don't agree with, do, like, write long, researched, deeply researched books. I don't have that concentration. I did when I was in high school. In college, I loved doing papers, and I was a great student. But, you know, I probably blew my mind out in a car. Too much pot and liquor and partying. And I just, I just, that just wasn't the direction I was gonna go in with a serious scholar.

• 11:14Bill Maher?

  So, I had, I fully acknowledge, I'm not on that level. But those people usually... I mean, they just lack this common sense gene, I feel like I have. I feel like that's my strong point of intellect. And it's amazing the way there's a whole category called stupid smart people, I think. Or smart stupid people, like people who are brilliant in one area and then, you know, I mean, to use an obvious example, I remember interviewing for Religulous Dr. Francis Collins, I think, and, you know, one of the most brilliant scientists, but also very, you know,

• 11:56Bill Maher?

  orthodox believer in Christianity. A myth, to my view. Look, folks, we've all done the annual physical. Look, three months out, half a day off work, an hour in the waiting room, and of course labs at a second location. Also, a doctor can spend 10 minutes telling you everything looks normal and show you the door. Three months of anticipation for a shrug. That's why Superpower is a game changer. Instead of waiting for something to go wrong, you get proactive preventative care. Membership covers over 150 biomarkers a year across two tests,

• 12:37Bill Maher?

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• 13:17Bill Maher?

  For a limited time, our listeners get $50 off their membership at superpower.com/random. That's superpower.com/random for $50 off your Superpower membership. And after you sign up, they'll ask you how you heard about Superpower. Tell them Club Random with Bill Maher sent you to support the show. You know, I know you're probably religious, I know you're Lebanese Catholic, but, you know, as a scientist, you must realize it is a little hokey, the whole thing, the whole story of Jesus and all that stuff. No?

• 13:52Speaker 04

  So you think we're here by random chance?

• 13:56Bill Maher?

  I think we don't know, and the difference between a religious person and me is a religious person says, "I don't know the answer, I'm going to make up a story about it," and then believe that. And I go, "Well, I don't know, and I just, I'm not gonna know probably while I'm alive, but I'm not gonna make up a story." And I was raised Catholic. Loved every minute of it, Doc. Let me tell you, those Catholics.

• 14:21Speaker 04

  So I went to medical school at Oral Roberts University. So I learned medicine in the context of my faith. And we were taught to pray with patients and I've never not believed. Nothing that I've learned has decreased my faith in a Creator, in a benevolent God.

• 14:48Bill Maher?

  Even when he allows so much horrible shit to happen here on earth?

• 14:52Speaker 04

  Well, it's because the idea of free will is that if he controlled everything...

• 14:57Bill Maher?

  A baby gets cancer, that's not free will, the baby didn't like make, that's not the...

• 15:03Speaker 04

  No, it's, but it's the condition of humans. And there's amazing people, and there's evil. I mean, there's clear evil. I have a new book coming in December. You might not like, but it's called The Neuroscience of the Lord's Prayer. You know, being raised Catholic, I was an altar boy, said it thousands of times, but I never really studied what's underneath it. And when Jesus talks about deliver us from the evil one, yeah, there is evil in this room.

• 15:40Bill Maher?

  Well, of course there's evil, but you do, I'm sure you realize, as a scientist, you are in a distinct minority as far as religiosity. Most scientists, a very high number are atheists. That is true.

• 15:53Speaker 04

  Like Francis Collins, who's was the head of the NIH, the National Institute of Health.

• 15:59Bill Maher?

  I'm not judging, I'm just saying as a fact. It is a fact, I believe, that most scientists are atheists.

• 16:06Speaker 04

  Well, I suppose not the ones I hang out with.

• 16:08Bill Maher?

  You're right. You're right. But that's, that's what's so interesting about human, anyway, get back to the point. I am with you. I, again, I don't think this is cosmic, that this like three things about the brain happen all within like a week, but I just think this is bubbling up, and I think you are right, I think we don't look at the physical part of it. Psychiatry, I know it has its place. I also think a lot of it is just utter bullshit. And this comes from having gone, I can't even describe this, very briefly, and with another person, okay?

• 16:51Bill Maher?

  So, but it, it just struck me as preposterous, that, I mean, that this could ever help me. But I know it does help people, but I, but I think you are got the right scene, that we're ignoring... We're not concentrating on the physical part of the brain enough.

• 17:07Speaker 04

  Right. Psychiatrists are the only medical doctors who never look at the organ they treat. Think about that. Cardiologists look, your orthopedic doctor looks, your GI doctor looks, gynecologists, every medical specialist look. Psychiatrists make diagnoses like they did in 1840, when Lincoln was depressed, so Lincoln was suicidal twice in his life. And in the winter of 1840, he goes to his doctor, Ensign Henry, and how did Dr. Henry diagnose Lincoln with melancholia, what is now major depression? He talked to him. He looked at him. He looked for symptom clusters, then diagnosed and treated him.

• 17:51Speaker 04

  That's exactly what happens today, and that's insane.

• 17:56Bill Maher?

  Well, and that's 60 years before Freud.

• 18:00Speaker 04

  And Freud tried. In 1895, Freud said, "The brain science of my time is not sophisticated enough to explain patient symptoms." So he then went and developed psychoanalysis. But 35 years ago, when I started to do brain spect imaging, that's the imaging study I do, it changed absolutely everything I do as a psychiatrist, as a father, as a human. With a better brain comes a better life, but if you never look, you never know.

• 18:32Bill Maher?

  Look, the reason why I've followed mostly, although I have certainly have Western MD doctors, but the, the ideas of holistic medicine is because I do think the body is holistic. I think Western medicine makes the mistake of treating it like a clock, that you can take the parts, and you know, they're very big on specialists, this guy for the kidneys, this guy for the heart, and holistic medicine believes much more that, no, everything is connected. So we don't do that, that's why we treat things instead of heal things. I'm looking to heal, not treat, you know?

• 19:09Speaker 04

  Because you want to know what's the cause.

• 19:11Bill Maher?

  The root cause and heal it, not just treat it.

• 19:13Speaker 04

  And in four circles. So when I went to medical school, the dean of our medical school first week comes into the classroom and goes, "Never think of your patient as their diagnosis, always think of them in these four circles." So what's the biology? You know, that's where you're in medical school. What's the psychology, how they think? What's their past level of trauma? What's the social circle? So how's their life, their relationship, their job, their money? And what's the spiritual circle? Which is why the heck do they care? What is their deepest sense of meaning and purpose?

• 19:56Speaker 04

  And so from that moment on, I always think of my patients in these four big circles. I have a new program. We just piloted in 100 organizations, churches, businesses, the Orange County Rescue Mission. It's called the Whole Four, because we help people get better in all those at all times.

• 20:20Bill Maher?

  Can you hook me up with the brain scan like yesterday, though? Seriously, can you?

• 20:24Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 20:25Bill Maher?

  Okay, great, where's the machine?

• 20:27Speaker 04

  I have one in Encino. They're not very far from there.

• 20:30Bill Maher?

  I'm not going to Encino, I don't care how much it's gonna help my...

• 20:33Speaker 04

  Well, the other one is in close to Mesa, so...

• 20:35Bill Maher?

  I love you, Encino, I love you, Encino. No, Encino's perfect. It's right over at the valley, please, the valley, nothing wrong. I've lived there for years, there's nothing wrong with it. I'll, I'll go to the valley. You never thought of like moving down to Beverly Hills? You seem like you must, you're so successful. Seems like the, by the way, will this bother you if I? It won't? Great, Doc, I appreciate that, but if even a little bit, say, say no.

• 21:04Speaker 04

  I'm fine.

• 21:04Bill Maher?

  Yeah, okay. I won't tempt you with it. I just, and I probably want just one puff or two, you know, it's just a... What do you, what do you think about the efficacy of something like marijuana? Do you think it's a, I mean, to me, it's always been benign, and not just benign, but super beneficial. I mean, without this, trust me, we wouldn't be sitting here. I'd be living in a two-bedroom apartment in Van Nuys. It gave me every good idea I ever had. I know it sounds terrible to tell that to kids, but it's kind of true. But what kind of, and I was never an everyday smoker. I'm not like Snoop, you know, I don't get up and just light the blunt and have it going all day.

• 21:49Bill Maher?

  But do you think it's, you think I'm underestimating the toll?

• 21:54Bill Maher?

  Already, I see, I don't like this answer.

• 21:57Speaker 04

  I published a study on a thousand marijuana users. Every area of their brain is.

• 22:01Bill Maher?

  I know them all.

• 22:03Speaker 04

  And activity. And I get so much engagement when I boast about marijuana. And people go, oh, you just need to get high. An independent group on another thousand marijuana users. That learning and memory centers lower in activity.

• 22:22Bill Maher?

  The what?

• 22:23Speaker 04

  The learning and memory centers. And I'm very.

• 22:29Bill Maher?

  Memory, yes, memory, yes.

• 22:31Speaker 04

  Twenty-one million people in America now smoke pot every day. And if a teenager, and this is my big worry with it. Because as we go, oh, this is good medicine, because it's medically legal in forty states. If this is good medicine, then the use in teenagers goes up. And if you smoke as a teenager, or you use marijuana as a teenager, in your twenties, increased risk of anxiety, depression, suicide and psychosis.

• 23:02Bill Maher?

  I did not smoke in my twenties.

• 23:04Speaker 04

  Bitch. Which could be really helpful for you.

• 23:07Bill Maher?

  Yes.

• 23:08Speaker 04

  Because your brain really isn't finished.

• 23:10Bill Maher?

  It is not.

• 23:11Speaker 04

  Until you're twenty-five, twenty-six.

• 23:13Bill Maher?

  No, I was nineteen when I started, so I feel pretty good about that. And I feel like other stuff I did was much worse. And I think you always have to sort of balance. Yes, the physical harm, I'm not some hippie who's like, oh, no, it's good for you. It's not health food, I get it. But would I be happier if it hadn't brought me the things it has brought me? No, and if you're not happy, if you don't really want to live, I think that's a big factor. Getting back to holistic medicine and why you have to account for not just the physical, but the brain too, and what the brain is putting out. And mood and, I mean, two hundred years ago,

• 23:58Bill Maher?

  the only way they really cured people was by, you know, just convincing, they didn't know what they were doing, they would just convince them. Somebody did something and they would believe it worked. They would put fucking dirt in your wound or something, and because you believed it. Now we call that, you know, what is it? See, I have aphasia, doc, you're gonna have to. What's it when you, when you have a pill in there?

• 24:24Speaker 04

  Placebo.

• 24:25Bill Maher?

  Placebo. The placebo system was like the main way of treating somebody.

• 24:30Speaker 04

  That's. In many ways, it still is.

• 24:32Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 24:34Speaker 04

  I mean, when they do big studies on S S R.

• 24:37Bill Maher?

  And you think it really is a thing?

• 24:40Speaker 04

  Oh, it's absolutely a thing.

• 24:41Bill Maher?

  Okay.

• 24:42Speaker 04

  That if, if you're.

• 24:44Bill Maher?

  Being happy, wanting to live.

• 24:47Speaker 04

  Yes, but it's, I think part of it is no one teaches you to manage your mind. And I was twenty-eight years old, my psychiatric residency, which I did at Walter Reed in Washington, D.C. One of my professors said, you have to teach your patients not to believe every stupid thing they think. And I'm like, really? You can do that? Because I'd believed every stupid thing I thought.

• 25:12Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 25:12Speaker 04

  And I'm like, I teach all of my patients to kill the ants, the automatic negative thoughts that steal your happiness just because you have a thought.

• 25:24Bill Maher?

  So we're agreeing.

• 25:24Speaker 04

  Has nothing to do with whether or not it's true, whether or not it's helpful. And learning to manage your mind is a skill we should start teaching in second grade, but we never do. And so I'm friends with Paul Simon, you probably love Paul Simon.

• 25:43Bill Maher?

  I love Paul Simon, second to no man, my love for Paul Simon's music.

• 25:47Speaker 04

  And he has this song, Kodochrome, which starts with, when I think back on all the crap I learned in high school. It's a wonder I can think at all. And it's like, why, we have a high school program called Brain Thrive by Twenty-Five. We teach kids to love and care for their brain, but also to manage their mind.

• 26:08Bill Maher?

  Well, manage your mind is a great title, you should remember that, it should be your next book. It's an automatic seller with your success already. But also, I just want to say, as true as that is, that we don't teach it. A, maybe you can't teach it. And B, nobody taught it to me, except me. By stumbling my way forward, which is the condition of life, stumbling our way forward. Behind us is lit up quite well, because we already lived it. But what's ahead of us, we're just bumping into shit and making mistakes. And when I was, you know, college age, when I, my mind was just, you know, you just have too much energy.

• 26:50Bill Maher?

  I remember spending a lot of time, like, writing down, you know, besides jokes and stuff, which was my career, but like, lessons, you know, trying to like, learn every, be able to like, and think, oh, if I could just write them all down and then memorize the list, it'll like, I'll never make a mistake again, you know? And of course, that doesn't work. But I just saw from an early time that I was very invested in, as someone once said, I never make the same mistake once. That's what was my goal. I want to like, and of course, that will never happen, except by the way it happened, which is the years go by.

• 27:30Bill Maher?

  And you just naturally, it worked, as much as I wrote it down, it wasn't gonna get me there until things actually happened. And something happens and it's shocking, you know, the first time you get dumped or something. And the second time, it's like, oh, I have seen this before. I still wasn't ready for it, because I'm stupid, but, and then like the third, the fourth, I'm like, okay, I've seen this movie enough, and now I'm gonna make the right choice. Because that's, I saw the pattern. I feel like, I don't know if you can teach that to a second grader, I think that has to come with. Like I say, I think you can teach it.

• 28:06Speaker 04

  I think I have an exercise to do with my patients. And I first came up with it in nineteen eighty-six, and I'm so happy I did. It's called the one-page miracle. On one piece of paper, write down what you want. Relationships, work, money, physical, emotional, spiritual health. What do you want? And then every day, you just ask the question, does it fit? Does my behavior fit what I want? Or, you know, if you're a Christian, what has gone what for me? What do I want, what does God want for me? And does my behavior fit?

• 28:45Speaker 04

  So, for example, I want a kind, caring, loving, supportive, passionate relationship with Tana, my wife. Always want that, hundred percent of the time. But I don't always feel like that, I get rude thoughts.

• 28:59Bill Maher?

  I bet you don't always get it after eighteen years.

• 29:02Speaker 04

  But.

• 29:03Bill Maher?

  No, no offense, but come on.

• 29:06Speaker 04

  It's, it's managing my mind. What do I want?

• 29:10Bill Maher?

  Great title.

• 29:10Speaker 04

  And does my behavior get me what I want? So it's not, you should do this, you should do that, no, none of that. It's, does it fit? Like, I don't have any tattoos, but if I did, that would be one of the first ones.

• 29:26Bill Maher?

  What?

• 29:27Speaker 04

  Does it fit? Does my behavior fit the goals I, and nobody ever said that to me when I was growing up. It's like, you sort of should do this, you should do that.

• 29:37Bill Maher?

  I, I have this little card, it's the size of a card that used, people used to remember, hey, and my card. And it has ten things written on the front and ten on the back. It fits twenty little questions. I don't remember where I got it, I mean, I don't remember a lot of stuff, doc. We've gone over that depressing part of it. But somewhere along the way, I would guess, when I was out a lot in bars and stuff, and people give you shit. And it has like, just these twenty questions, and it's like, I've never seen a more, all these self-help books, it's just like, on this little card, it's like, all these questions you should ask yourself, like, am I catastrophizing?

• 30:21Bill Maher?

  I'd never heard that word, and I immediately knew what it meant. Am I cata, am I making this a bigger thing than it is?

• 30:28Speaker 04

  Which is an ant. The automatic negative thoughts, there are nine different types of them, from mind-reading, fortune-telling, catastrophizing, guilt-beating, blaming. It's just learning to manage your mind.

• 30:43Bill Maher?

  It was all just so practical and like, the things you should be.

• 30:49Bill Maher?

  Arguing with yourself about, you know, the problem with the mind, it's awfully great, Doc, but like, there's three forms of communication, basically. You can write it, that's very formal in the settings we're talking about of communication, because you're actually, no matter how much you think you're not editing, because you are writing something, you're not writing every thought that comes into your head. You are put, and you're usually a little more nervous, okay, because this is to be read by another person. Then there's talking, we edit ourselves to a degree, you know, except Trump, people just go, "You're a terrible person." But like, he's got Tourette's, I don't.

• 31:30Bill Maher?

  But, okay, but, okay, so there's some like guardrails, I feel like, on writing and talking. What goes on in your mind, it's just like, no one really wants to go there. You really don't want AI to like just get into your head. Even yours, Doc, you've got some really fucked up shit going on there, I know you do.

• 31:50Speaker 04

  Jerry Seinfeld said, "The brain is a sneaky organ. We all have weird, crazy, stupid, sexual, violent thoughts that nobody should ever hear."

• 32:01Bill Maher?

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• 32:44Bill Maher?

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• 33:29Bill Maher?

  Wegovy is the registered trademark of Novo Nordisk AS. To get started and learn more, including important safety information, Wegovy clinical study information and restrictions, visit hims dot com. I feel like my brain does it just because it's like fucking with me. It's like, you know, you say you don't want to think about a pink elephant, and then that's all you can think about.

• 33:54Speaker 04

  Right.

• 33:54Bill Maher?

  And it's like, my brain will be like, like, dog shit. Well, you know I hate dog shit. You know I hate thinking about dog shit. I have a thing about shit, Doc, I just hate it. I don't know what happened in the anal stage, it must not have been good. And like, my brain, it's like, shut up! Why are you doing it?

• 34:10Speaker 04

  So, give your mind a name. Then you can get distance from the chatter in your head. So when I was 16, I had a pet raccoon, really.

• 34:18Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 34:19Speaker 04

  And I loved her. But she was a troublemaker, she TP'd my mother's bathroom.

• 34:23Bill Maher?

  It's a fucking raccoon.

• 34:24Speaker 04

  She ate all the fish out of my sister's aquarium.

• 34:27Bill Maher?

  How do you make a raccoon a pet?

• 34:28Speaker 04

  She would, they had him in pet stores back in...

• 34:31Bill Maher?

  Oh, from a pet store?

• 34:33Speaker 04

  1968, when I got her. And she'd leave raccoon poo in my shoes.

• 34:39Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 34:39Speaker 04

  But that's my mind. So I named my mind after my pet raccoon. So when I get a storm, like, all of us have these mind storms. I'm like, "Hermi, you're going in the cage." It's just, it's learning to separate from the noise.

• 34:55Bill Maher?

  I, I, this is not, this not what meditation's goal is, because some of my best friends, including Sam Harris, who seems to be the ultimate guru of meditation, certainly the most popular, talking about it, and there's nobody I respect as much as Sam. We think so much alike, I feel he's the clearest thinker. And so like, he's, but as far as meditation goes, like, I know he's right, and yet like, I've tried it many, many times. And, you know, I think there's great value in turning your mind off for 30 minutes, or what we used to call a nap. And like, every time I do it, Doc, it's like, sometimes I feel like,

• 35:40Bill Maher?

  okay, did I meditate, or did I just bore the fuck out of myself so bad I fell asleep for 20 minutes? And I honestly don't know. But, um, I, I, whenever I start to meditate, here's my method. It's like, I picture like what you call the ants, the thoughts that are coming at you. And then I, I spend one or two minutes saying to myself one basic thing. These thoughts that are coming at you, in a day, will they be on your mind? In a, in a week, in a month, in a year? Probably not. So, just picture yourself alone in a white room, your hands out. Nope, not now, fellas. You, you, you know, you come back in a half hour.

• 36:25Bill Maher?

  But just, nobody, I just want to be alone now. And that's, and then I can kind of, you know, get to that place. Do you meditate every day? You do, for how long?

• 36:37Speaker 04

  20 minutes.

• 36:38Bill Maher?

  And you can go into it rather to be quickly?

• 36:41Speaker 04

  I do it with breathing. I focus on diaphragmatic breathing. And then...

• 36:48Bill Maher?

  Have, like, that kind of...

• 36:50Speaker 04

  And I like, because I'll go through each phrase of the Lord's Prayer.

• 36:54Bill Maher?

  Oh, the Lord's Prayer? So that's like your mantra?

• 36:57Speaker 04

  And, so, I'm sorry?

• 36:59Bill Maher?

  Isn't that, that's like a mantra, but you're using the prayer as the mantra?

• 37:03Speaker 04

  So when you go, "Our Father," it's like, oh, I'm part of a community, I'm part of a family. It's about belonging.

• 37:10Bill Maher?

  It makes you feel good.

• 37:11Speaker 04

  It's about attachment. It gives me direction. But I also like loving kindness. Meditation, have you heard of that?

• 37:21Bill Maher?

  What is it?

• 37:21Speaker 04

  Very popular, loving kindness.

• 37:23Bill Maher?

  I'm against both of those things.

• 37:25Speaker 04

  Meditation, it's super simple. May I be happy, may I be healthy, may I be strong? Whatever you like.

• 37:34Bill Maher?

  I feel like all of this is on that little card.

• 37:36Speaker 04

  But then, it's to someone you love. May Tana be happy, healthy and strong. To someone you're neutral on. And then to someone you don't like. Someone you're struggling with. May they be happy, healthy and strong.

• 37:53Bill Maher?

  That's what this country needs. This country...

• 37:55Speaker 04

  So much.

• 37:56Bill Maher?

  I mean, my theme, more than any, I would say, in the last five years, has been, I just, I'm just over the hate. Not that I didn't participate in it, myself, along the way, a lot. And sometimes, some people I'm sure would say I still do, "Why are you so tough on..." I'm just being honest, I think. But the country just hates each other's, the two halves hate each other so much that nothing really can, can get done when you're in that place. I mean, what you just asked is something like a lot of people on the left would never do for the people on the right, and vice versa. Like, like, say, AOC, what do you think, like, super hard right-wing Republican guy? Do you wish her health?

• 38:41Bill Maher?

  Fuck no. I mean, that's where we kind of are.

• 38:43Speaker 04

  But if we did?

• 38:44Bill Maher?

  But if we did...

• 38:45Speaker 04

  We would start listening to each other and stop labeling.

• 38:49Bill Maher?

  Trust me.

• 38:49Speaker 04

  Each other. So, one of the nine ants is labeling. Because when you label someone as a conservative, as a liberal, you now lump them with all of those people that have irritated you, and you can't deal with them, you can't talk to them. So when your mind is going like this, all I want you to do...

• 39:14Bill Maher?

  Where's my mind going? I'm just talking to you.

• 39:17Speaker 04

  It's, no, the thoughts that you don't want. What I like to do is take each thought captive. And have you ever interviewed Byron Katie?

• 39:26Bill Maher?

  No.

• 39:26Speaker 04

  She's one of my favorite spiritual teachers, I love her. And whenever you feel sad, or mad, or nervous, or out of control, just write down what you're thinking. And then go, "Is it true?"

• 39:39Bill Maher?

  I don't feel any of those things anymore, which is why it's great to be 70. There's some shitty things about it, as we know, but, but that's why... List those things again? Sad, mad, what?

• 39:52Speaker 04

  Nervous, or out of control.

• 39:53Bill Maher?

  What were the four things you just said, that you...

• 39:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, if you're sad, mad, nervous, or out of control.

• 39:58Bill Maher?

  I am not sad, I am not mad, I am not nervous, and I'm not out of control. And there have been many times in my life when I have been all the sad, mad, nervous, and fucking out of control.

• 40:10Speaker 04

  That the marijuana stopped the bad thoughts?

• 40:13Bill Maher?

  No, no, no. The marijuana exacerbates whatever mood you're in. It's not something I would ever want to do before I go to sleep, because it keeps me up. It's also something I would never want to do if I was feeling shitty to begin with, because it would only make me feel shittier.

• 40:31Speaker 04

  Interesting.

• 40:32Bill Maher?

  Like, today, I was excited to talk and meet with you. And then, when I got high, I was like even more excited to meet and talk with you. And you haven't disappointed, so there. But yeah, I mean, drugs affect everybody in such a unique way. I feel like we don't physically appreciate how different we are. Yes, we're all the same molecules and carbon-based and blah, blah, blah. But the, the spectrum of people always amazes me, like, the sexual spectrum. Some people are so fucking horny, they do it just all the, you know, nymphomaniacs. And some people are not horny at all. They're, they're asexual.

• 41:17Bill Maher?

  They're not, they're just like, I'd rather be reading. Right?

• 41:21Speaker 04

  They have different things turn them on.

• 41:23Bill Maher?

  Different, yes, it's like, yeah, I mean, was, I know people who are that, or I've talked to them. And it's like, you know, they're usually a little older, and they're like, "Yeah, I had some good times having sex, but you know, it was a little like that girly ride at Disneyland. It was a roller coaster, but not really that exciting." And, you know, they just are like, "No, but this book, I really..." "That night I felt great." Okay, so I'm just going to read books. You know, and that's, that kind of spectrum, I think, is analogous everywhere across humans' physiology. We just are so different. Some people love to get high and can handle it, and some people totally can't.

• 42:09Bill Maher?

  And yet, we always base the laws on what the fuck-ups do. I'm never the problem with the law.

• 42:17Bill Maher?

  I'm not. Do I look like a troublemaker or like I'm, I'm not. I'm, I'm, I'm healing. I'm all for healing.

• 42:25Speaker 04

  Growing up, you weren't a troublemaker?

• 42:27Bill Maher?

  No, I was a shy kid, very shy, too shy. And scared, ostracized sometimes, you know.

• 42:38Bill Maher?

  I always say, every decade, you're a different person with different goals. Well, zero to 10, my goal was, don't be bullied.

• 42:47Bill Maher?

  No, eight, no, 10 to 20 more, zero to 10 was like, stay home with mommy. 10 to 20 was like, don't be bullied, school and like, you know, because kids are just feral. And when they wanna be mean, you know, they have to be taught to be civilized.

• 43:05Bill Maher?

  Kids themselves, Lord of the Flies, we all read that one, right? They're not good people, children. I'm sure, how old are your kids now, doc? Have they grown up?

• 43:15Speaker 04

  Forty.

• 43:16Bill Maher?

  Forty?

• 43:16Speaker 04

  Eight to 16.

• 43:18Bill Maher?

  To 16, you dog.

• 43:20Speaker 04

  I adopted our two nieces, uh, because their parents were drug addicts. And the 16 year old just got her license and I'm so proud of her.

• 43:30Bill Maher?

  Well, that's noble, you're a noble guy. I guess you're.

• 43:35Speaker 04

  It lets me know, because I'm also a child psychiatrist, it also lets me know what toys are in and what groups are in and.

• 43:42Bill Maher?

  I mean, again, back to the brain, I'm sure

• 43:48Bill Maher?

  what your brain has when you put your head on the pillow at night is healthier in a way than what I have, because you have the assurance that if you die in your sleep, you'd be going to a better place. People have said that to me many times, I'll go to a better place. And I always say, then why don't you hang yourself tomorrow? But leaving that aside.

• 44:12Speaker 04

  And do die.

• 44:14Bill Maher?

  You have something that quiets your brain, that I do not. And that must be like a, you know, in a way, an advantage in life.

• 44:27Speaker 04

  I think so, because I don't think I'm here by random chance. I think the consequences for our behavior, I think I'm here for a purpose and I'm expected to do something useful.

• 44:41Bill Maher?

  You know, Carl.

• 44:42Speaker 04

  But I also do an exercise at night, every night, and it's so helpful.

• 44:46Bill Maher?

  Pull up?

• 44:47Speaker 04

  It's what went well today. So when I go to bed at night, I say a prayer and then I go, what went well today? And I start at the beginning of my day and I go hour by hour looking for what I loved about the day. And it just, it sets your dreams up to be more positive. They actually did research on this, that three weeks later, you're happier. You said you wanna be happy. And I remember even six years ago, the night my dad died. It was the worst day of my adult life.

• 45:24Speaker 04

  I hit the pillow and I went, what went well today? And I'm like, Hermie shows up, my, you know, the voice. It's like, really, we're doing this tonight? But because it's my habit, right? You don't do what you want to do, you do your habits. Because it's my habit, I'm like, there was an interaction between my mom and the police officer that was hysterical. She's, because my dad died at home. And she goes, do you think I had him killed? My mom's 89 at the time. She goes, do you think I have a boyfriend? I mean, it's just hysterical. And then I think of all the people who texted me that day who loved my dad.

• 46:00Bill Maher?

  That is great.

• 46:01Speaker 04

  And then I, then I just imagine holding his hand before the mortuary took him away and it was so soft, and then I went to sleep. We have to develop habits.

• 46:11Bill Maher?

  Yeah, but Doc.

• 46:12Speaker 04

  That serve us.

• 46:13Bill Maher?

  You just said, we have our habits and then it's not what we wanna do.

• 46:18Speaker 04

  No, we do our habits.

• 46:19Bill Maher?

  Okay, but why don't you make your habits what you wanna do?

• 46:22Speaker 04

  That's the point.

• 46:23Bill Maher?

  Yeah, that's the journey, right?

• 46:24Speaker 04

  Right? Do your habits. So there's a question, um, I'm working on the decade of brain health. So Arianna Huffington actually wrote about this in Time Magazine.

• 46:35Bill Maher?

  I, I think I read this.

• 46:36Speaker 04

  And I love it.

• 46:37Bill Maher?

  She gave it to me the other day at lunch.

• 46:38Speaker 04

  And the question.

• 46:39Bill Maher?

  It's great.

• 46:40Speaker 04

  Foundational question behind the decade of brain health is what I'm doing now, talking to you, good for my brain or bad for it? And if I can answer that with information and love, love of myself, love of my family, I'm gonna live longer, I'm gonna live better, is what I'm doing now.

• 47:02Bill Maher?

  That's your method. I cut off the end of the joint with a scissor. That's my method.

• 47:08Speaker 04

  I'm like, maybe not.

• 47:09Bill Maher?

  I feel like it's cleaner that way. We, look, we all have our methods. Just because you have a doctor's degree or some shit like that, doesn't mean. By the way, one of my favorite books, um, oh, I forgot his name, because, um, we're talking about Francis, Francis Raymond, I think. Like Never Be Sick, did you ever hear about that book?

• 47:30Speaker 04

  Uh-uh.

• 47:31Bill Maher?

  It's, it's like, it has all the basics, it just lays out the basics of holistic health so well.

• 47:38Bill Maher?

  Begins with the idea that there's one disease, which is cellular degeneration, either from too many, two causes, two main causes. Toxins coming in or not, or not the right nutrients coming in. And I think that's true. I mean, that's holistic medicine. And then there's, it manifests itself in a million different ways, which we call different diseases and we have specialists. But really, it's always about repairing cells.

• 48:08Speaker 04

  Makes sense to me. I mean, I have an acronym I like called Bright Minds. You wanna keep your brain healthy or rescue it? You have to prevent or treat the 11 major risk factors. Now ultimately, it comes down to mitochondrial health, cellular health, but it's like B is for blood flow, R is retirement and aging. I is inflammation, G is genetics, you know, what runs in your family. Like my kids who we adopted, both their parents are drug addicts. You need to be on an addiction prevention program your whole life. H is head trauma, which I think is a major cause of psychiatric illness that nobody knows.

• 48:49Bill Maher?

  Of course.

• 48:50Speaker 04

  Because nobody looks at the brain.

• 48:52Bill Maher?

  Of course they do, it's a big story about the NFL. It's CTE, it's all over the news. It was, had front page news a week ago that a quarter of the players, that's just the ones they've studied, it's probably higher, have it. And we've seen too many of them who just went, they killed themselves. Or, you know, they just are leading a life that's just not worth living because their brain is messed up from, you know, Muhammad Ali.

• 49:20Speaker 04

  I had Muhammad Ali.

• 49:21Bill Maher?

  What?

• 49:22Speaker 04

  Muhammad Ali was one of my patients.

• 49:24Bill Maher?

  You had Muhammad Ali as a patient?

• 49:26Speaker 04

  I have his brain.

• 49:27Bill Maher?

  What was he like?

• 49:28Speaker 04

  Awesome.

• 49:29Bill Maher?

  I met him once and he was awesome. You wanna hear this story? Listen to this, it was like the 90s, I was dating this hot black girl and I took her to this event and he was like, he was sitting in the chair like this, you know, like it just peed down. And I, and I took, went over to him and I said, hey champ, how you doing? I'm a big fan, Bill, blah, blah, blah. And, and so I want you to meet somebody. And he kinda looked up and he saw her and he, it was like, it's like one of those cartoons where they put the, they water the plant and it just suddenly comes to life. And he just kinda like, and in his mind, he, it was 1970 and he was the champ and he was gonna steal my girl.

• 50:14Bill Maher?

  It, it was like one of the greatest memories I have of any celebrity I've ever met was that moment. Like the eye of the tiger, still in that man and, uh,

• 50:28Bill Maher?

  yeah.

• 50:28Speaker 04

  And his brain was hurt.

• 50:31Bill Maher?

  Yes.

• 50:31Speaker 04

  And I did the big NFL study when the NFL was sort of not telling the truth about traumatic brain injury in football. I've scanned and treated 400 NFL players, cool players like Terry Bradshaw and Dick Butkus.

• 50:44Bill Maher?

  He's on my show next week, Terry Bradshaw.

• 50:46Speaker 04

  Love him.

• 50:46Bill Maher?

  But you can tell that, you can tell that he took a few too many hits. I mean, now they protect the quarterback, like, oh my God. It's like Taylor Swift is playing quarterback.

• 50:59Speaker 04

  But it's still, even with the helmets, it's impossible to stop the rattling.

• 51:04Bill Maher?

  In his day.

• 51:05Speaker 04

  It was worse.

• 51:06Bill Maher?

  Point of the, there was no protection of the quarterback especially. He's one of the football players. So, and of course, how do you win the game? You knock out the, you know, this is checkmate, you take the king, the queen, whatever chess does. And so they were, they would, the hits were outrageous. And of course, the macho ethic, you know, you're not going back in the game. You know, I remember talking to guys who played football and they said, you know, you'd be on the sideline and it'd be like, you'd just be in like, you knew your, your head wasn't right. You were like having like this, and but you knew enough that you were in a football game, but not much more. And then you just.

• 51:47Speaker 04

  Well, and then the drugs they gave them.

• 51:49Bill Maher?

  Yes.

• 51:50Speaker 04

  The alcohol they would drink. It was not the best brain healthy culture. But 80% of our players got better when we put them on a rehabilitation plan. So I hate the messaging around CTE. It's chronic, progressive and untreatable. I don't think that's true at all. I think you should be scanning them and then rehabilitating them all the way along. So if you allow your child to play in high school, nobody should look at their brain. And you should probably put them in a hyperbaric chamber whenever there's a concussion. There's a study from Iraq that's fascinating.

• 52:33Bill Maher?

  A hyperbaric chamber.

• 52:34Speaker 04

  I'm a huge fan of hyperbaric chambers.

• 52:37Bill Maher?

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• 53:21Bill Maher?

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• 54:03Bill Maher?

  This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

• 54:09Speaker 04

  He's asleep. Was. Justin Bieber slept in his.

• 54:13Bill Maher?

  Picture of health.

• 54:14Speaker 04

  Justin slept in his.

• 54:16Bill Maher?

  That noseless skeleton, Michael Jackson.

• 54:19Speaker 04

  But I think LeBron James also.

• 54:21Bill Maher?

  Well, Michael, I think slept in it. What I've heard is Brian Johnson told me this, I think, and I like Brian. And I think he, I know he's struggling now, but I wish him well. I told him that. And he really is trying to find the outer limits of the human body's something. I don't know. But I'm glad guys are trying. But, you know, he said the hyperbaric chamber, unless you need it, like to recover from injury, ages you.

• 54:51Speaker 04

  No, absolutely false. Absolutely false.

• 54:54Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 54:55Speaker 04

  I have.

• 54:56Bill Maher?

  It's always good at any level?

• 54:59Speaker 04

  Well, nothing's always good. But I have before and after scans. So I do a show on Instagram called Scan My Brain where I take influential people, scan them. And I don't know if you know who Tarek El Moussa is. He's an HGTV star and he flips houses. And when I first saw his scan, his first scan is like one of the cockroach infested, hoarder, moldy houses that he flips. It was awful. And then he did 89 hyperbaric sessions and a year later, his brain's dramatically better. And so I called the episode Extreme Makeover Brain Edition.

• 55:42Speaker 04

  And you're not stuck with the brain you have. You can make it better.

• 55:47Bill Maher?

  I feel like this is my future in the next two years.

• 55:51Speaker 04

  I'm so looking forward to it.

• 55:54Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 55:55Speaker 04

  Because with a better brain.

• 55:57Bill Maher?

  Personally, Doc?

• 55:58Speaker 04

  With a better brain.

• 55:59Bill Maher?

  I noticed you're avoiding that question.

• 56:02Speaker 04

  Well, we'll talk about it. But, but with a better brain, everything in your life is better. And I don't think people love and care for their brain. 1991, I scanned myself. I didn't really care about my brain. And I was the top neuroscience student in medical school. I'm a double board certified psychiatrist. And I didn't really care about it. The week before I scanned my mom, stunningly beautiful brain.

• 56:24Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 56:25Speaker 04

  And then I scanned myself and it was awful because I played football in high school.

• 56:29Bill Maher?

  Really?

• 56:30Speaker 04

  I had meningitis twice as a young soldier and I had bad habits. Like I was sleeping four hours a night. I was chronically stressed. I was chubby. I was eating bad food. I just didn't care. And then I developed a term called brain envy. I always say Freud was wrong. Penis envy, never seen it in 40 years as a psychiatrist. Brain envy. Got to want a better brain. You want a better brain, your life gets better.

• 56:58Bill Maher?

  You've never seen penis envy in 40 years? I feel like in my life I've seen it.

• 57:04Speaker 04

  It's just not a thing for me as a psychiatrist.

• 57:07Bill Maher?

  Defined wrong. Penis envy. You go first. What is it?

• 57:15Speaker 04

  It's, you're living your life from a deficiency of how large your penis is. I'm like, that's ridiculous.

• 57:21Bill Maher?

  You don't think there's guys who are?

• 57:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, no, I think guys are unhappy about it, but that's not what causes suffering.

• 57:29Bill Maher?

  I don't think that's true. I think guys know that you need a certain, it doesn't have to be humongous, but you need a certain sized dick to really make a girl like you. I do. That's my theory of humanity. You have Catholicism.

• 57:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's just not a big part of my practice.

• 57:50Bill Maher?

  Not admitting, Doc. Maybe they're just not admitting it.

• 57:53Speaker 04

  Well, from my perspective, you get a bigger brain, you get a lot happier.

• 57:58Bill Maher?

  I think the patients you see are not the average patient because I don't think most men care if they have a bigger brain. I think they care if they have a bigger dick. I do. I do. I'm not joking here. I think that's what they care about. So, I don't know.

• 58:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, not the ones I see.

• 58:14Bill Maher?

  Look, the knock on you is that your treatment is so expensive. Look, to me, it's a silly thing to say. It's just like everybody wants to get somebody who's successful. Yes, everything at first is more expensive. Yes, rich people will get better, everything. They'll get better healthcare, they get better travel. That's just, that's capitalism. I'm sorry. It's a game of musical chairs and we should try to make it better, but that is better than the alternative. So yeah, your thing is expensive, but you know, is there a way to like, what is your answer to that critique, by the way?

• 58:55Speaker 04

  Having a brain that doesn't work right is expensive. What we do is not expensive. It's, it's often not covered by insurance because it's not standard, right? The standard is just like 1840, you go and tell your doctor what your symptoms are. He goes, oh, you fit this category in the DSM and so I'm going to give you this medicine. And I think that's nuts. And so I think, oh, we have to look. But because it's not covered by insurance or often not, you know, our whole evaluation is about $5,000. But it's two scans, cognitive testing, our history. I think it's pretty reasonable.

• 59:39Speaker 04

  And 73% of our patients at six months are significantly better. If you actually do what we say, that number goes to 85.

• 59:48Bill Maher?

  I know.

• 59:49Speaker 04

  And so it's gonna change. The only question, I'm right. And I just met with the leaders in psychiatry. I'm very excited about this because for 35 years I've sort of been at war with them. And I met Dr. Marquita Will. She's the CEO of the American Psychiatric Association. When I gave a presentation at HHS about the decade of brain health. And she goes, let's talk. And after we talked, she goes, oh, I know the problem with you. You were just early. And I'm like, I'm putting those four words in my obituary. You were just early. And I'm like, 35 years? Really?

• 1:00:32Speaker 04

  We have a database now of 300,000 scans on people from 155 countries.

• 1:00:37Bill Maher?

  Early is very rarely rewarded.

• 1:00:39Speaker 04

  But it's gonna change because they just wrote a position paper, the American Psychiatric Association. We need biomarkers, including imaging. So the field is going to be radically different and I'm so excited about it. Now, whether that's a couple of years or two or three more decades, we're going to start become a medical specialty. Like when I told my dad in 1979 I wanted to be a psychiatrist, he asked me why I didn't want to be a real doctor. Why I wanted to be a nut doctor and hang out with nuts all day long. And that hurt my feelings, but I really understand where he was coming from, just like you started. It's like, you know, psychiatry, it's, it's nuts.

• 1:01:24Bill Maher?

  He's not totally wrong.

• 1:01:26Speaker 04

  He's not totally wrong.

• 1:01:27Bill Maher?

  He really isn't.

• 1:01:28Speaker 04

  And we have to do better. We have to do better because depression isn't one thing. It's seven different things. ADHD, not one thing. It's seven different things. When you look at the brain, there are different patterns. If you just give everybody the same medicine, and you know, I was on TV the other day for this Lindsay Clancy case, which is so sad. This mom who killed.

• 1:01:58Bill Maher?

  Oh, I know it well.

• 1:02:00Speaker 04

  It's so.

• 1:02:01Bill Maher?

  And all our supporters of prenatal abortion.

• 1:02:06Bill Maher?

  That's really what it is. I mean, postnatal abortion.

• 1:02:09Speaker 04

  It's so sad. And nobody looked at her brain. I mean, she's going, "Help me, help me, help me." And they're like, "Take this, take that," throwing darts in the dark at her. And I'm like, "Why is...?" There's no neuroscience testimony in this trial. Isn't that crazy?

• 1:02:30Bill Maher?

  No, I mean, I could see in the way AI is and how fast the future moves. I could see in five years, a brain scan being like, you know, part of the checkup, just the way they ask you to turn your head and cough and grab your balls. You know, just a basic thing. Or the, you know, prostate techs. I mean, I've had a few doctors in my life with their fingers up my ass. And it's always, you know, uncomfortable. And they always do the joke about buying you dinner first. And I'm like, "Just shut up and stick your... We have to do this." But that's how they feel the prostate, right?

• 1:03:11Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:03:12Bill Maher?

  That's what they've been telling me all these years.

• 1:03:15Speaker 04

  Is the only organ. We're not screening. We screen our hearts and our bones and our breasts. Why not the brain? When I turned 50, my doctor wanted me to have a colonoscopy. I'm like, "Well, why don't you want to look at my brain? Isn't the other end just as important?"

• 1:03:37Bill Maher?

  Well, again, I could do the obvious joke about some people's heads are in their ass, and it's true, but, no, I, well, both, you know. Obviously, you want to check out your colon and you want to check out your brain. I mean, it's actually amazing considering how many parts of the body have to be functioning well for you to be healthy. Because there's so many different ones that could go wrong.

• 1:04:04Speaker 04

  It all works together.

• 1:04:05Bill Maher?

  Yeah, I mean, not coming over to your god argument, but because... And by the way, if you want to go the god argument with like, you know, immaculate design, there are things about the human body that aren't designed perfectly. So if it is a god, he fucked up a few places. Anyway, but it is an amazing mechanism. Much more amazing than anything man has ever created, including AI up till now. But you do have to treat it well. And if you abuse it, it's funny, it can take a lot of abuse. You know, one thing that dude says in the book is that food is very hearty.

• 1:04:47Bill Maher?

  And our digestive system is very hearty. What's not hearty is nutrients. So you, the food will last. You can eat it. And your stomach will fucking take anything. I mean, what our ancestors must have eaten. You know, in Sapiens, he says, "The reason why the human brain got bigger is because we figured out fire. And once they had fire, it killed the parasites. So we could eat food that didn't require this enormous digestive system. And it migrated, we got bigger brains." That's why humans outlasted the fucking, you know, leopards or whatever.

• 1:05:29Bill Maher?

  They didn't have that issue. We figured out fire. I don't know why it came to us, but, but yeah, our brains got bigger. I mean, you know, I don't know.

• 1:05:42Speaker 04

  Size matters.

• 1:05:46Bill Maher?

  Do you have pets? Do you have animals?

• 1:05:48Speaker 04

  I have two dogs and a cat.

• 1:05:50Bill Maher?

  Okay, but like their brains.

• 1:05:54Speaker 04

  So the human brain, 30% is your prefrontal cortex. The front third of your brain is largest in humans than any other animal.

• 1:06:03Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 1:06:04Speaker 04

  11% of the chimpanzee brain. My dog, 7%.

• 1:06:07Bill Maher?

  Is that where like decision-making comes in?

• 1:06:10Speaker 04

  It's the executive part of the brain.

• 1:06:11Bill Maher?

  It's the executive part of your brain.

• 1:06:12Speaker 04

  Focus, forethought, judgment, impulse control, organization, planning, empathy, learning from the mistakes. So when you were talking earlier about the mistakes you made.

• 1:06:23Bill Maher?

  That's the prefrontal.

• 1:06:25Speaker 04

  They're no mistakes. It's just every day you win or you learn.

• 1:06:28Bill Maher?

  Right, you learn, right. That's the prefrontal.

• 1:06:30Speaker 04

  Prefrontal cortex, which why letting kids hit soccer balls with their forehead is very stupid. Because your brain is soft about the consistency of soft butter. Your skull is really hard and has sharp, bony ridges.

• 1:06:47Speaker 04

  We want to protect it.

• 1:06:50Bill Maher?

  Wow, okay, okay, so the prefrontal lobe. And then what's the, I mean, Freud had the id, the ego and the superego.

• 1:07:01Bill Maher?

  Which, you know, back in the, you know, Renaissance and Middle Ages, they used to call it like, you know, the humors of the body. You know, but it was really the same things. Just like wine, women and song became, you know, sex, drugs and rock and roll. There's nothing new.

• 1:07:19Speaker 04

  So Hippocrates was with the humors and different humors.

• 1:07:22Bill Maher?

  Yes, the different humors, bile. And we still have the words bilious, phlegm is from plegmatic.

• 1:07:28Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:07:29Bill Maher?

  Right?

• 1:07:30Speaker 04

  Sanguine.

• 1:07:31Bill Maher?

  Sanguine, yes, you know. So it, they knew it, they just didn't know how to like analyze it. But they sensed in back in the day that those same things were within us. Now we can quantify it. Now we know, I mean, so much. I mean, I wear this ring. Maybe it's bullshit, but it tells me.

• 1:07:53Speaker 04

  It's not.

• 1:07:54Bill Maher?

  Like I say, not bullshit.

• 1:07:57Speaker 04

  My trainer says, because of rings, like the Oura ring or the Apple Watch or whatever, that he has, so many people stop drinking because they see their sleep on the nights they don't drink, and then their sleep on the nights they do drink. And they're like...

• 1:08:14Bill Maher?

  I hate to burst your bubble, but my, I watch the same thing. Mine is better.

• 1:08:19Speaker 04

  When you drink?

• 1:08:21Bill Maher?

  This is the day I drink.

• 1:08:24Bill Maher?

  Tape day for Club Random. It's why I look forward to it, like a dog smelling in steak. Yeah, I sleep better tonight. Anytime I like get fucked up like in the day, and then it's worn off, and I'm not really high anymore, but like then I sleep well. That's how I sleep the best.

• 1:08:45Speaker 04

  Well, and that's biofeedback. It's you're getting feedback on your body whenever you do something. And early in my career, I was trained as a biofeedback person. I loved that. And I would hook people up, their hand temperature, their heart rate, their sweat gland activity. And then I would ask them questions, like, "Think about your dad." And like with my dad, because he was stressful, everything would go awry. And then like, "Think about your mom." And everything would sort of balance out. And so our thoughts affect our physiology. But certainly, what you smoke, what you drink, who you hang out with,

• 1:09:28Speaker 04

  all of it impacts your body.

• 1:09:32Bill Maher?

  I was sitting in my ritting chair the other night, and, I mean, I am not a crier. Nobody's ever made me cry on TV, and they've tried for 35 years. And I just started to, I don't know why, but I started to think about this person who... I had just spoken at a memorial service that day. I guess that's what triggered it. And I wasn't thinking about the persons who, I loved him, but, you know, it wasn't having this effect on me. For some reason, I was starting to think about this person who I know. And I thought, if they died. And I thought, you know, I imagined myself speaking at that memorial service

• 1:10:14Bill Maher?

  and made myself cry in the chair, just sitting at home and thinking about something that hadn't happened. This person is fine. But I remember saying to myself in my reverie, you know, I've seen a lot of people go, and a lot of them were comedian friends. And people would text me and email me and say, "God, you must be just beside yourself." And truth is, it's sad and I love them, but no.

• 1:10:43Bill Maher?

  But this person?

• 1:10:46Bill Maher?

  Very different.

• 1:10:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:10:48Bill Maher?

  And just thinking that to myself made me cry in my chair. But my chair is all you're gonna get. Never on TV, bitches.

• 1:10:59Speaker 04

  That's because you're attached.

• 1:11:02Bill Maher?

  To what?

• 1:11:02Speaker 04

  To the other person.

• 1:11:04Bill Maher?

  Great friend, great, very important. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

• 1:11:08Speaker 04

  So that's human.

• 1:11:09Bill Maher?

  Yeah, I know. Trust me, I'm glad I have it. I'm glad I could, you know, something like that can happen because you don't want to be unfeeling and the world is moving. I'm hardly the first to point this out with first the smartphone and now AI. Moving toward a very unfeeling place, a very detached place.

• 1:11:34Speaker 04

  We have to be so careful because the incidence of depression in young people has skyrocketed.

• 1:11:41Bill Maher?

  How could it not?

• 1:11:42Speaker 04

  Study from the CDC, fifty-seven percent of teenage girls report being persistently sad. And thirty-two percent have thought of killing themselves. Twenty-four percent have planned to kill themselves. We don't have any statistics like that when we were growing up. Things are change. We have more followers and less friends. Fifty-eight percent of young people report being persistently lonely. That's why this sort of whole person education needs to be.

• 1:12:16Bill Maher?

  You and I are about the same age. We grew up on Pluto.

• 1:12:22Speaker 04

  On what?

• 1:12:23Bill Maher?

  Pluto. We grew up on a completely different planet.

• 1:12:28Speaker 04

  It's true.

• 1:12:29Bill Maher?

  There was, in my town, first of all, no racial issues because it was an all-white town. In New Jersey, not Alabama, New Jersey,

• 1:12:40Bill Maher?

  drugs, I didn't, you know, there's a few degenerates that we might have. They smoke cigarettes. That was like the, there was no divorce.

• 1:12:49Speaker 04

  There was no fentanyl.

• 1:12:50Bill Maher?

  There was no fentanyl, but there weren't broken homes. Maybe they were like crazy at home, but they, they, you know, stayed together and we grew up in a completely different planet. Most kids now, all those things are present and plenty more. But, you know, you rarely find someone who the parents are together, you know, the drug addiction, parents who were fucked up, or parents who stayed together, but they hated each other and, you know, just not the stable, leave it to Beaver upbringing we had. World War II generation people who had been through the depression and the war.

• 1:13:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, but the sixties were messed up. From the assassinations, the...

• 1:13:37Bill Maher?

  Not for us. Were you assassinated? No.

• 1:13:41Speaker 04

  No, but I remember being in church when JFK was killed and the stress around that. We had the riots here in Watts.

• 1:13:51Bill Maher?

  For you?

• 1:13:51Speaker 04

  And my dad had a grocery store in Watts during...

• 1:13:55Bill Maher?

  In Watts?

• 1:13:56Speaker 04

  Right, Watts, when I was growing up. And Vietnam, I had friends who had siblings come home in boxes, body bags. So when everybody's complaining about now, I'm like, the sixties were a shit show.

• 1:14:16Bill Maher?

  Let me ask you, your father, white guy owned a store in a black neighborhood.

• 1:14:21Speaker 04

  Lebanese.

• 1:14:22Bill Maher?

  Popular?

• 1:14:23Speaker 04

  So Lebanese merchant, my dad, you know, like many Lebanese immigrants, merchant. He ended up being the chairman of the board of Unified Grocers, which is a four-billion-dollar company. I'm very proud of him.

• 1:14:39Bill Maher?

  This is what is awesome about America, that we are flirting with ruining. We attract the best, smartest, most ambitious people from everywhere. This was always our secret sauce.

• 1:14:54Speaker 04

  It's true.

• 1:14:55Bill Maher?

  And you know who is messing with this? You know, we did need to close the border, but yes...

• 1:15:02Speaker 04

  You don't think he's messing with it in a reaction to the insanity of open borders?

• 1:15:07Bill Maher?

  Totally. He did, closing the border to something we needed to do. I totally give him credit for that. Then they went, okay, we don't have to get into that. What I'm saying is like, people like...

• 1:15:19Speaker 04

  I'm not helpful.

• 1:15:20Bill Maher?

  People like your father always, you know, that is why I still believe in this country so much. It's because the people who, it's, and I've heard the foreigners who I know here, when I say foreigners, people who are like French, Canadian, not exactly, you know, like the world away, and they say, yeah, because I've asked them, like, France is a pretty modern country, why'd you come here? Canada, it's kinda like America. And they say, not really. You know what? They cut down the tall trees. There's just this sense here that you can reinvent yourself and go as high as you want. Yes, there's a little more inequality, but there's just this, sky's the limit.

• 1:16:02Bill Maher?

  You can be the grocer and then be the, whatever this fucking thing your father was. Something, something big. I, I heard that. What was he, the head of what?

• 1:16:12Speaker 04

  The chairman of the board of Unified Grocers, which is...

• 1:16:16Bill Maher?

  But that's an immigrant story in one lifetime.

• 1:16:18Speaker 04

  It's awesome.

• 1:16:19Bill Maher?

  In one lifetime. That's America. I don't know if that happens in countries where it's more stilted.

• 1:16:26Speaker 04

  I think the opportunity is still great.

• 1:16:29Bill Maher?

  It's a shame what happened to Lebanon. Beirut used to be called the Paris of the Middle East.

• 1:16:34Speaker 04

  It was so beautiful. I was actually there in April nineteen seventy-five, right before civil war broke out, and it was so beautiful. You could be in the mountains skiing and then an hour later be on the beach. I mean, it's a beautiful...

• 1:16:48Bill Maher?

  And you know who else was there at that time? Osama bin Laden, before, like when he was a teenager. And his rich-ass family brought their little nepo baby to Beirut. Because that's what people did, like before the Islamic world went nuts. You know, and before jihadists sort of like took the reins in too many important places.

• 1:17:15Speaker 04

  Very worried about the generational trauma that is happening with the kids in Syria and Gaza and Israel and all, Iran. The generational trauma is real.

• 1:17:32Bill Maher?

  Well, you are the man to scan their brains. Do you have a business overseas?

• 1:17:39Speaker 04

  I do not.

• 1:17:40Bill Maher?

  You want one?

• 1:17:41Speaker 04

  My books are translated in fifty languages for now.

• 1:17:46Bill Maher?

  But do you imagine a, I mean, you have more than one location for what you do.

• 1:17:52Speaker 04

  I have eleven. We have eleven AMI clinics around.

• 1:17:55Bill Maher?

  That sounds like the beginning of a franchise to me. MIC brain scan. What do you think? No?

• 1:18:04Speaker 04

  I just want to give people the opportunity to learn from the work I've done.

• 1:18:09Bill Maher?

  Okay, Senator, but I'm just asking you a real question. Do you want to have branches in more places, including overseas?

• 1:18:18Speaker 04

  I think eleven is good. I'm very happy with that. And what I really want is to teach people to do what we do so that it becomes standard, ten years from now, twenty years from now. That you're depressed, you're angry, you're anxious, you can't stop thinking about bad things. Somebody looks at your brain as part of the assessment.

• 1:18:47Bill Maher?

  All right, you should hire me as your A and R man because we're not thinking big here, Doc. I'm thinking strip malls. I'm thinking every strip mall in America, and I'm talking about small and medium-sized cities. And there is a MIC brain scan there, and you can get your nails done by the Korean girls. And you can go right next door and get your brain scanned. That's how I'm thinking. I'm thinking big. That's America. Okay, so I'll let you go soon, but I just have to ask you one more thing. Porn, bad for the brain? Because you hear a lot of bad things about it. And people do get addicted. And it is different than when we were kids.

• 1:19:27Speaker 04

  The problem with it is six-year-old boys are being exposed. Eight-year-old, ten-year-olds.

• 1:19:36Bill Maher?

  Exposed on, oh, you mean exposed to it?

• 1:19:38Speaker 04

  Because parents are not doing a good job of supervising the devices.

• 1:19:43Bill Maher?

  But I wouldn't be interested in it at six. Six? I was not interested in...

• 1:19:49Speaker 04

  But that's you. There are a lot of boys who are very curious early on. Yes.

• 1:19:56Bill Maher?

  Six is what Freud called the latent stage. Latent, yes, when an infant like gets a hard on or like rubs his dick, but then it like latent until puberty. That's not six.

• 1:20:07Speaker 04

  When was your first sexual...

• 1:20:10Bill Maher?

  I feel like I was early for my age group, eleven. I feel like when I first started to rub that part of my body and it was, oh, this feels good and it changes shape and, okay.

• 1:20:23Speaker 04

  And now imagine you have a smartphone and your parents didn't do a good job, or your friend's parents didn't do a good job of putting parental controls on it. You're interested in rubbing yourself and now all of a sudden you have a huge menu of things to look at.

• 1:20:41Bill Maher?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:41Speaker 04

  That is a disaster. So ultimately, obviously, you know about dopamine, dopamines, the pleasure chemical.

• 1:20:48Bill Maher?

  If I looked, I, I get what you're saying. There was no opportunity for me at six to look at naked women. But now there is, and if you do, it will activate the pubic side of a brain at six?

• 1:21:04Speaker 04

  For some people.

• 1:21:06Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 1:21:06Speaker 04

  And if you're vulnerable, say you come from a family of addicts, you know, your grandpa was an alcoholic, and you have more genetic vulnerability, all of a sudden, that's gonna hijack you. I think we have to do a very, we have to do a better job of controlling what young people can see. I mean, I was a huge fan of Australia and Great Britain banning social media for kids under sixteen.

• 1:21:36Bill Maher?

  And it's spreading in other places.

• 1:21:39Speaker 04

  And then the recent Meta deal, seventeen billion dollars. I mean, it just highlights, this is dangerous.

• 1:21:48Bill Maher?

  Very.

• 1:21:48Speaker 04

  We're seeing it. We're paying for it as a society with, when we were growing up, did anybody ever kill themselves in your school?

• 1:21:58Bill Maher?

  No. You know who killed themselves? The husbands. The ones who, because there was no divorce, but the husband would wind up face down in the swimming pool. And that happened more than once, and it was a small town.

• 1:22:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:22:10Bill Maher?

  Because that's what happened. You, when you can't get divorced... You'll kill yourself in the swimming pool. You're like, okay, I cannot live one more day with this woman.

• 1:22:22Speaker 04

  But it's something that I never was in, I never saw. And now, almost half the children in America, they have a schoolmate kill themselves. It's ridiculous, the number of the increase in suicide in young people.

• 1:22:42Bill Maher?

  But also, if you look at the number of ailments that weren't common when we were kids, that became very common. Things like diabetes, adult acne, asthma, obesity.

• 1:23:04Speaker 04

  Peanut allergies.

• 1:23:06Bill Maher?

  Peanut allergies, in general. Colitis, you know, irritable bowel syndrome, whatever they call, all those gut diseases.

• 1:23:16Bill Maher?

  What? They didn't.

• 1:23:17Speaker 04

  And why the spike in autism?

• 1:23:20Bill Maher?

  Autism again, yes.

• 1:23:21Speaker 04

  From one in 10,000 to one in 34.

• 1:23:23Bill Maher?

  Some of that is because they measure differently. Some of that is because.

• 1:23:29Speaker 04

  Yeah, and some of it's because there's a gene and environmental toxin interaction.

• 1:23:35Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 1:23:35Speaker 04

  And, you know, whether it's BPAs or other.

• 1:23:39Bill Maher?

  But not the vaccine, you're saying?

• 1:23:42Speaker 04

  Probably not.

• 1:23:43Bill Maher?

  Probably not.

• 1:23:44Speaker 04

  But probably it's not useful to give all the ones they did. And it's not useful to have mercury in vaccines.

• 1:23:51Bill Maher?

  And also, apropos to what I was saying before about we're so different, we're on such a large spectrum of different characteristics as a human and everything. It could be that it's one in 500,000 that the vaccine somehow triggers something that causes autism. It's just super, super rare. But who wants to be that person who wants to risk even?

• 1:24:14Speaker 04

  Well, and I have vaccine-damaged brains, that I have scanned, of kids who the parents say are normal. They got the vaccine and their brain looks terrible.

• 1:24:24Bill Maher?

  Yes.

• 1:24:24Speaker 04

  But it's not the norm, for sure, it's not the norm.

• 1:24:27Bill Maher?

  No, it's just, it's amazing the way we have to politicize, or people politicize this issue so much, that we can't come to what I think, again, because I'm Mr. Common Sense, is the reasonable middle, which is that vaccines are generally safe, but like all drugs, like all medical interventions, they have side effects. And on the whole, are they worth doing? Yes, but there also is a downside.

• 1:24:57Speaker 04

  Well, you know, AI is doing therapy now. You can turn it on and go.

• 1:25:02Bill Maher?

  Doing everything.

• 1:25:03Speaker 04

  Pretend like you're Carl Jung and do a session with me. I think I'm better.

• 1:25:12Bill Maher?

  My mother, I remember when she was reading Carl Jung. My mother was always like, you know, into something, like, for a while it was mythology, Greek mythology, we heard about all that. Then she got very into psychiatry, reading all, and Carl Jung. What was his basic thesis? What distinct, why do we know that name, Jungian?

• 1:25:33Speaker 04

  Well, he was one of Freud's counterparts. And rather than psychoanalysis, he talked about personality theory. He was deeply spiritual.

• 1:25:48Speaker 04

  He's the one that came up with the idea for the Myers-Briggs.

• 1:25:52Bill Maher?

  What's that?

• 1:25:53Speaker 04

  It's a personality inventory, introverted, extroverted thinking, feeling.

• 1:26:01Bill Maher?

  But don't we.

• 1:26:02Speaker 04

  And he talked a lot about dreams and the collective unconsciousness. He is very influential, still.

• 1:26:10Bill Maher?

  I know.

• 1:26:11Speaker 04

  He's very influential.

• 1:26:12Bill Maher?

  I know Jungian thought is. None of that rings a bell. But, I mean, those old-school, first-generation psychiatrists, like, and who was he? Adler, was he another one of those guys? Are they, like, the modern crew, did they think of them as kind of like, oh, old-school? Yeah, I mean, in their time, of course, it was considered, you know, Freud was all about the dick. Because wasn't Freud kind of all about sexuality? I mean, wasn't, you know?

• 1:26:44Speaker 04

  A lot of it.

• 1:26:45Bill Maher?

  I feel like I'm.

• 1:26:45Speaker 04

  He was also using cocaine a lot, a lot of the time.

• 1:26:50Bill Maher?

  Yes. He had 33.

• 1:26:52Speaker 04

  I mean, he was, he was brilliant.

• 1:26:54Bill Maher?

  He had 33 operations on his jaw.

• 1:26:58Speaker 04

  And he was in chronic pain.

• 1:26:59Bill Maher?

  Chronic pain. So many of these thinkers were. You wonder, how did that affect the thinking? You know, Proust wrote Remembrance of Things Past, one of the greatest works we've ever had in Western literature. But he wrote it the last third of his life in a cork-lined room in Paris, because he had horrible, I think, asthma. I don't know what the cork was there for, but I do know it was there. And it was something to, like, help him with whatever. And then Thomas Mann, who wrote, you know, what did he write? I'm too stunned to remember. But that was all about being what they called consumption back then, which really what now we would call is what, like?

• 1:27:45Speaker 04

  Chronic fatigue.

• 1:27:47Bill Maher?

  No, what's the pulmonary disease that, you know, is not?

• 1:27:53Speaker 04

  It's the OPD?

• 1:27:54Bill Maher?

  No, it's back in, I think it's back, the major thing that people got, like, 100 years ago.

• 1:28:02Speaker 04

  Tuberculosis.

• 1:28:02Bill Maher?

  Tuberculosis, yes. And they would send them to sanitariums. That, it takes place, the Magic Mountain, The Magic Mountain, one of the seminal novels of the last century. And, you know, they're in this sanitarium in the Alps. And they, you know, it was like people go to Arizona, because the weather is better and it helps with certain things. I think that's more grounded in reality. I don't know if the sanitariums ever really helped, but, you know, this is only 100.

• 1:28:28Speaker 04

  No, I think mostly they separated you from being, getting other people infected.

• 1:28:34Bill Maher?

  You think that was the purpose? You don't think they thought they were curing you there in the sanitarium? And no.

• 1:28:40Speaker 04

  Because there wasn't a cure, until we had drugs to kill the beast.

• 1:28:45Bill Maher?

  They would literally say, take the cure. That was the saying, that was the phrase. Take the cure at Baden-Baden, you know? Hot springs, places where the air was clear. But you think it was all a scam?

• 1:29:04Bill Maher?

  Yeah, I guess so. I mean, I don't remember hearing that someone was cured by doing that, but.

• 1:29:12Speaker 04

  No, I mean, weather clearly matters, right? If you're in a highly allergenic place.

• 1:29:18Bill Maher?

  We must be here in LA.

• 1:29:21Speaker 04

  Well, it's smog. I mean, it's actually better than when I was growing up.

• 1:29:25Bill Maher?

  Way better, but that doesn't mean it's good.

• 1:29:27Speaker 04

  But it's not good. And I live in Orange County, and I can see LA often. You see this brown haze, you go, not good to breathe.

• 1:29:36Bill Maher?

  No.

• 1:29:37Speaker 04

  And people who live in places of high pollution have a higher incidence of Alzheimer's disease. So the air you breathe, the water you drink, the noise, the lights, all of it matters.

• 1:29:53Bill Maher?

  You know where I notice my brain is when I do crossword puzzles? Because I'll get stuck and I'll put it down, and I'll come back, maybe later that day or a day later, and I'll finish it. It's like plainly, I was using the same brain 12 or 24 hours ago, and it couldn't do this task. And now, it can. Something, that tells me, this is not bullshit, this is something I can measure, this is scientific. This is a, this is a test where I got rid of the variables. It's the same clues in the crossword that I couldn't do. What was different about my brain 12 or 24 hours ago?

• 1:30:39Speaker 04

  You know, I love that you're doing that.

• 1:30:41Bill Maher?

  But what was?

• 1:30:41Speaker 04

  Because that's good for your brain. But then you have to go, so what was the sleep? What was the consumption of substances? What was your diet like? All of that matters. And the problem with being 70, or 72 in my case, is if we're not serious about it, it just goes lower and lower and lower. I hate looking at older brains.

• 1:31:09Bill Maher?

  No, I'm sure.

• 1:31:10Speaker 04

  But I have this whole group of 90-year-old people, stunningly beautiful brains. And I'm like, I want that. That's what, that's brain envy, I want that. And it's like, okay, how do you get that?

• 1:31:23Bill Maher?

  But what that crossword puzzle test tells me is, this is not about opinion, this is about conjecture. This is scientific. What it tells me, for sure, I have definitive proof that my brain is in a different condition, a different state at different times. It may not be huge. I'm not a crazy person, it doesn't like, I'm like I'm going nuts, you know? And ranting and raving, or like, completely, you know, out of my mind. But my brain, if we put a number on it, you know, when I put the puzzle down, when I couldn't do it, was at 85. And then I got back to 92. I mean, you could quantify it, if you could.

• 1:32:08Bill Maher?

  Can you? Are there brainwave studies like that? Can you hook some? You look at the

• 1:32:14Speaker 04

  I think you could do quantitative EEG at certain times to go, when am I most imbalanced? Or when do my gamma rays, my really fast learning waves, uh, happen? And some of it's circadian rhythm, that all of us have rhythms. Some people are morning people, some people are night people, uh, some people are

• 1:32:39Bill Maher?

  You think it matters? This is something holistic medicine is very big on. That it not, doesn't just matter that you sleep, but when you sleep. I think it's bullshit. I think some of their shit is bullshit. I think everybody's shit is bullshit. Because I'm, maybe I'm just prejudiced because I am a late riser, always have been. My family was, my father worked nights. He got up late. I always liked getting up late. I liked the night better. I liked watching Johnny Carson. He was on at 11:30. That was to me much better than watching something that was on at 8 o'clock. Although Mikel's Navy, I'll make an exception. But, um, so I'm always, and then I became a comic. We're out late at night.

• 1:33:23Bill Maher?

  Just everything is late, late, late. I don't think it matters. I think it matters that you sleep. But they think the healing takes place like between 2:00 AM and 6:00. You've heard that. Tell me, Doc, what's your theory?

• 1:33:39Speaker 04

  I think you need seven, eight good hours of sleep and it doesn't make that much difference.

• 1:33:45Bill Maher?

  When? I agree.

• 1:33:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:33:47Bill Maher?

  Because like the ring, it tells me, but it's like, yeah, I know. And by the way, Ring, you know, I don't need the little, like, pat on the back that you write out for me every day. Hey, you know, did you have a tough night's sleep? Shut the fuck up. I don't want to hear a pep talk. I'm not of this generation. I don't need it. Just give me the facts. And it does. Like it will tell you how much REM sleep, how much deep sleep. And no, Andrew Huberman tells me that it's the REM sleep that matters. Cause sometimes the deep sleep's only like 12 minutes. You, you agree?

• 1:34:24Speaker 04

  Well, I think both of them are important. I think REM is really important, uh, and both alcohol and marijuana decrease REM. Uh, so I'm so excited to see your brain.

• 1:34:40Bill Maher?

  That is.

• 1:34:43Bill Maher?

  That's what the devoted viewers of Real Time say every week when they tune in. Um, yeah, I mean, it's like, you know, I never watched my own show, um, or this show, or any show. Because it's like, I had fun doing it. It seemed like the people liked it. I don't want to, and I kind of feel the same way about my brain. It seems to be working. Do I really want to stir up trouble? You know, like

• 1:35:08Speaker 04

  That's only good news.

• 1:35:09Bill Maher?

  It's totally not perfect. I definitely have a little more aphasia than I used to. You know? But is that 70? Is that pot? Is that just, you know?

• 1:35:21Speaker 04

  But if we find out

• 1:35:23Bill Maher?

  Who cares?

• 1:35:23Speaker 04

  Then we do something about it. Now you want to care. Cause if you're having a little bit now, odds are five years from now, you're going to have a little more. And 10 years from now, you may have a little more. And I don't want it. I just, I'm, I'm here.

• 1:35:44Bill Maher?

  Even if I forget the word, which is what aphasia is, can't I just define it? Can't I just go to the, um, what's that place where the sick people are? Um, where all the sick people go? What is that? I forget, what is that called? Sick people, they go, they're

• 1:36:01Speaker 04

  The hospital?

• 1:36:02Bill Maher?

  Yes.

• 1:36:04Speaker 04

  Okay, a little aphasia.

• 1:36:08Bill Maher?

  Can't I just do that, Doc? I mean, was that

• 1:36:11Speaker 04

  But that's not, you don't want hospital food.

• 1:36:14Bill Maher?

  Do I seem like I'm really mentally inept, Doc? Honestly?

• 1:36:19Speaker 04

  Absolutely not.

• 1:36:20Bill Maher?

  Thank you. Okay. That's, and that's from folks, that's from the world's leading expert. But I'm not. I, I would know when I, when I go, I will know and I'll go. When I go, I will know and I will go. That should be my book. Really, I will. Because what I do is not something you can do at a diminished capacity. It just isn't. If I'm not at the top of my game, I have no game. I don't want to be a sheep among goats. I mean, a goat among sheeps. All right, I'm a little stoned. But, uh, yeah, I mean, so I will, I will know.

• 1:36:59Bill Maher?

  But again, getting back to my original thing, I think mood, it's, it's a trade off, as everything in life is. It's a trade off with the drugs and having fun. With, yes, health and, and the actual physical perfection of the brain. Yes, I am diminishing that. But I think for me, I've learned it is a trade off worth making. I think it actually is the smart trade off. Because, um, I'd rather live, you know, Sammy Davis once said, you know, I'd, I'd rather live 64 Sammy years. He had a great time. When he stopped drinking, he said, the worst thing about this

• 1:37:44Bill Maher?

  is knowing that when I wake up in the morning, that's the best I'm going to feel all day. I know that feeling. I'm not like that. I'm not a drunk like that. But I know that feeling, like I just, I would rather die at 85 than 95 and not have a good time on the way. What's the point of

• 1:38:04Speaker 04

  You know, when we do our high school program and week four, we talk about what to avoid to have a healthy brain. A 14 year old boy, never a girl. This is really, it's never a girl. A 14 year old boy raises his hand and goes, how can you have any fun? And so we play a game with them called who has more fun? The kid with the good brain or the kid with the bad brain? Who gets the girl and gets to keep her because he's not an ass? The kid with the good brain or the kid with the bad brain? It's like, it's, it's the lie people say. It's like, well, how can you have any fun? And I have a whole bunch of fun.

• 1:38:42Bill Maher?

  But the

• 1:38:43Speaker 04

  It's, it's like to have to suppress your brain so you can manage your mind to have fun. That just seems like a lot of work as opposed to learning how to manage your mind.

• 1:38:57Bill Maher?

  If I may, the flaw in your theory is we don't care about keeping her. We care about getting her. That's what you said about the 14 year old. Keep the girl. We don't necessarily want to keep her. Look, I made him laugh. I mean, maybe we do.

• 1:39:21Speaker 04

  Well, we lose her because we, general behavior is not right or we can't sit still.

• 1:39:28Bill Maher?

  I've made crazy decisions in my life and done crazy things because I was obsessed with the idea of keeping a girl. Like crazy to things, like, like, like proposing marriage. That, that crazy. I mean, really crazy. I mean, like beyond Catholic crazy, I proposed marriage. That was a long time ago. But like, I was willing to put that on the table in the poker game when, when, when she said, I, I will raise you and see you. I was like, okay, yeah, you're right. I don't want, I, I'm too scared to lose you. I will, I will put that ring on the table. Of course I backed out in the end.

• 1:40:11Speaker 04

  I, I just think it's the little lie people say. Drew Carey

• 1:40:15Bill Maher?

  Drew Carey?

• 1:40:16Speaker 04

  Got really healthy. And he said something I'll never forget. Cause I knew then you're going to stay healthy.

• 1:40:22Bill Maher?

  I love him. He's a friend of mine.

• 1:40:24Speaker 04

  He said, eating crappy food isn't a reward. It's a punishment. And I'm like, oh, he gets it. Because, you know, what do I really want at my age? Energy, memory, passion, purpose.

• 1:40:41Bill Maher?

  Yeah, but

• 1:40:42Speaker 04

  I, I want that. And so if you know what you want, it's like, does your behavior get you what you want?

• 1:40:51Bill Maher?

  Well, I mean, but that's just obviously the trade off of present for future, which is every decision in life. And, you know, to say that it's not a reward, it's exactly a reward. That's why people eat like that. Look, people say to me, you know, you eat so well, you don't, you don't like? I love food. I get it. I get food is delicious. You think I don't like cake? I like cake. I just make the choice not to eat it because I know about what it does in my future. I'm making a decision based on the future. That's what's hard to get your brain to do sometimes.

• 1:41:32Speaker 04

  You have to train it that way.

• 1:41:33Bill Maher?

  To make decisions in the future.

• 1:41:36Speaker 04

  To love food that loves you back.

• 1:41:38Bill Maher?

  I am making a decision about the future and the present right now when I light this joint. The, the future, this might be a very bad decision. This might be the one tok that really, it's not health food. But in the present, I'm having a good time. Consider you one nail in my coffin, Doc. But it's worth it. You got to live, you got to live in the world you're living in, you know? I, I don't want to, I'm not the kind of person who can live if I, if I can't really live. I never got married, you know? So I don't know what it's like to be a slave. I have to be a free man.

• 1:42:22Bill Maher?

  And if health makes me not a free man, I can't live. But of course, when I get sick, I'll totally pussy out on that and be like, uh, cause I've learned this just getting up to 70. The things you say you won't do. And then when you get a medical expert saying, well, we have to put this camera up your dick. You go, okay. If that's what you have to do, I know I said I'd never do this, but, uh, yeah, go ahead. Put a camera up my dick. I, I, I know it's going to hurt. Even with the volume, it's going to hurt. But I'd rather have a ca, you never had a camera up your dick?

• 1:43:06Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:43:06Bill Maher?

  You're lucky.

• 1:43:08Speaker 04

  I'm not looking forward to it.

• 1:43:14Bill Maher?

  You'll love it, Doc. I don't like the fingers up my ass, but you know what? I'd rather know. Again, this is a future-present decision. I could be in that office going, you know what? I feel fine. You don't need to stick your fingers up my ass. I feel fine. But that's not a smart decision. It's not a decision that the front lull, right? The executive, you told me? The executive is saying, yeah, you don't want a man's fingers up your ass. Or a woman, I don't want anybody's fingers up my ass. But I'm gonna do it for the future. Because, you know what? I'm living in the future. I'm going to be living in the future.

• 1:43:59Bill Maher?

  I want to. So, let's not have present me fuck future me. Because future me is gonna be like, why didn't you let the doctor put his hands up your ass that day? It could have solved so many of the horrible problems.

• 1:44:15Speaker 04

  Such a good phrase.

• 1:44:17Bill Maher?

  What?

• 1:44:18Speaker 04

  Don't let present me fuck up future me.

• 1:44:22Bill Maher?

  Right.

• 1:44:23Speaker 04

  I love that phrase.

• 1:44:25Bill Maher?

  Well, I'll sell it to you for a very reasonable price. You demurred before when I asked, can you get me in? Like...

• 1:44:34Speaker 04

  And I said yes.

• 1:44:35Bill Maher?

  Yeah, you kind of were like, yeah.

• 1:44:37Speaker 04

  I said we'd talk about it.

• 1:44:39Bill Maher?

  Yeah. Okay, well. Okay, well, I will make an appointment.

• 1:44:45Bill Maher?

  I hope I get special consideration.

• 1:44:50Bill Maher?

  Because we became such good friends today.

• 1:44:54Speaker 04

  Thank you so much.

• 1:44:55Bill Maher?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:55Speaker 04

  This was so much fun.

• 1:44:56Bill Maher?

  So much fun.

• 1:45:01Bill Maher?

  I want to do it, very much so. I think you're on the right path. All right.

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