James Norton

It’s the final episode of series 18, and what a RIDE it’s been! We’ve got the wonderful James Norton taking this season out with a bang! James popped over for a summer barbecue while taking a break from filming the upcoming Beatles biopic in Spain. We heard all about growing up in Yorkshire, his family’s love of outdoor swimming, his mum’s legendary pavlova, the process of filming House of the Dragon, navigating living with Type 1 diabetes, and why tuna pasta in white sauce will always be his ultimate comfort meal. Thank you James for a fabulous season finale, and thank you to everyone for tuning in to another mammoth series! We’ve still got lots to come through the summer, we’re diving into the archive to bring you exclusive YouTube episodes and of course our Second Helpings audio series will be all yours too. Have a gorgeous summer and we’ll see you for Series 19 very soon! You can catch James in House of the Dragon streaming now on HBO Max, and his new film Sunny Dancer is out on the 14th August. Listen & watch Table Manners here - https://tablemanners.komi.io/ Follow Table Manners on: Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tablemannerspodcast/ TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@tablemannerspodcast Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/tablemannerspodcast YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@TableMannersPodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:27Jessie Ware?

  Hello and welcome to Table Manners, which is our final for season 18.

• 1:31Speaker 03

  And what a season it's been, Jo.

• 1:33Jessie Ware?

  I mean, we've had...

• 1:34Speaker 03

  Margot.

• 1:35Jessie Ware?

  Margot, Malala, Shaka Khan, Gloria Estefan. Started with Reese Witherspoon, went on to Gary Oldman.

• 1:42Speaker 03

  We thought it couldn't get any better, but it's got better and better the whole season.

• 1:46Jessie Ware?

  Thank you to everyone who has listened and watched this season. It's clear to see.

• 1:52Speaker 03

  But we're tired.

• 1:53Jessie Ware?

  It's time for a break. It's time for Lenny to get to Skopelos.

• 1:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:57Jessie Ware?

  And have her six weeks in the sun.

• 1:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:59Jessie Ware?

  And it's time for me to just get on with promoting my tour. So I'll see you in Skopelos for a couple of weeks.

• 2:05Speaker 03

  I'll see you.

• 2:06Jessie Ware?

  But we thought it'd be fun to finish with a friend.

• 2:09Speaker 03

  I think a very good friend of yours, a rather intimate friend, Darlene, I would have said.

• 2:13Jessie Ware?

  The brilliant, very talented James Norton is coming on the podcast today. He's coming on to talk about many things. He's got loads of things going on. He's a villain in House of the Dragon. He's also in between filming, being Brian Epstein as the Beatles manager and Sam Mendes, like four parts.

• 2:30Speaker 03

  And he's got one of the best gigs coming up, Hamlet.

• 2:34Jessie Ware?

  I mean, I'm interested to hear about whether it's every actor's dream to play Hamlet. He's also in a really beautiful new independent film called Sunny Dancer, which is with Bella Ramsey, and he plays a dad called Bob. So it's a really hot, hot, hot day. So I've decided to do a barbecue because we didn't want to have the oven on. I've kind of taken lots of different recipes from different places. So I'm mad about this guy. Ben Lippett has a book that's a big old bestseller called How I Cook. And it's really beautiful, this book, and loads of people have recommended recipes. And I wanted to do something lamb on the barbecue.

• 3:18Jessie Ware?

  And so he's got this really nice recipe that is cumin lamb kebabs, but it's got szechuan peppercorns in there, soy.

• 3:28Speaker 03

  Are they cofters?

• 3:29Jessie Ware?

  No.

• 3:29Speaker 03

  There's a piece of lamb on this.

• 3:31Jessie Ware?

  It's lamb shoulder and lamb rib.

• 3:33Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 3:34Jessie Ware?

  And I didn't realise how little meat you get from a lamb rib.

• 3:38Speaker 03

  And a lot of fat.

• 3:39Jessie Ware?

  So I did have to like DM him being like, am I doing this wrong? But he was like, no, just double it up. Anyway, it's been marinating, they're on skewers, that's going to go on the barbecue. I've done one of my favourite dips that I've been doing for ages, but I don't think I've done on the podcast. John Gregory Smith from his cookbook, it's this schmaltzy courgette yoghurt dip. Where you cook the great courgettes, you put them in the oven and then you. Put them with yogurt, dill, lemon. I've put a bit of garlic in there too. And it's just delicious. So it's kind of, it's not as atziki at all. It's a courgette yogurt dip, but it's delish. So that's gonna go. Got some flatbreads, do some rice, and then I've done from Kitty Coles's book, Make More With Less. She's got this really good, look, I've used it a lot, ricotta, charred

• 4:23Jessie Ware?

  corn and curried onions.

• 4:25Speaker 03

  Oh, is it a bit like that Mexican corn?

• 4:28Jessie Ware?

  Kind, kind of, but not. It does have lime on it and butter. And then I've done from Gil Meller, who is a Dorset chef that's very famous for kind of outdoor cooking, open fire cooking. But Gil Meller, you sign up to his website and you get different recipes. And he did this really delicious looking cucumber recipe that's with green chilies, spring onions, mint, coriander, cucumbers that you let all the moisture out for about half an hour. And then you do it with a really beautiful vinaigrette. So we've got like the crunch, we've got some creaminess, we've got the spice of the lamb. Oh, yeah. And with the lamb, you do this sesame oil, rice wine vinegar,

• 5:11Jessie Ware?

  shredded cabbage. So I think we've got enough. The thing is, I know about James.

• 5:16Speaker 03

  He likes a lot.

• 5:16Jessie Ware?

  He's greedy, like me.

• 5:18Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 5:18Jessie Ware?

  So he did say, when I said, have you got any dietary, bearing in mind, he is diabetic. So I was like, you know, is there anything we should avoid? He was like, I just want lots. So I hope.

• 5:27Speaker 03

  You've done lots.

• 5:28Jessie Ware?

  I hope I haven't under catered. And what have you done for food?

• 5:33Speaker 03

  Pistachio stracciatella ice cream. So it's pistachio ice cream with shards of dark chocolate in it.

• 5:40Jessie Ware?

  James Norton coming up on Tame Runners.

• 5:51Jessie Ware?

  Cheers.

• 5:51Speaker 04

  Cheers.

• 5:53Jessie Ware?

  This is a select. Now, everyone, I swear we should be sponsored by Select. It's, tell me what you think.

• 5:59Speaker 03

  It's so delicious.

• 6:04Speaker 04

  Yeah, absolutely delicious.

• 6:05Jessie Ware?

  Quite delish.

• 6:05Speaker 04

  Yeah, I love it. Somewhere in between a like.

• 6:08Jessie Ware?

  An aperol spritz.

• 6:09Speaker 04

  Aperol spritz. I was gonna say a, um, uh, what's the other, the other.

• 6:13Jessie Ware?

  Campari.

• 6:13Speaker 04

  Campari spritz. Also the olive.

• 6:16Jessie Ware?

  Thank you for the, thank you for acknowledging that, James. Um, how are you? How's your morning been? What have you had for breakfast?

• 6:23Speaker 04

  My morning has been good. I woke up and did a little.

• 6:26Jessie Ware?

  PDB?

• 6:27Speaker 04

  Peloton. Oh, yeah, PBD.

• 6:29Jessie Ware?

  Tell everyone what a PBD is.

• 6:32Speaker 03

  Peanut butter?

• 6:33Jessie Ware?

  No.

• 6:34Speaker 04

  PBD, peanut butter dip. No, it's a pre-breakfast dip. Basically, I swim every morning before breakfast. I know it's very, very. Well, that's the good question.

• 6:44Speaker 03

  Outdoors?

• 6:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, kind of. There's, there's ponds.

• 6:47Jessie Ware?

  Okay.

• 6:47Speaker 04

  Nearly.

• 6:48Jessie Ware?

  Um, so love a natural, a natural.

• 6:51Speaker 04

  Love a natural swim. My family, when we were growing up, wherever there was a body of water, if it was, you know, the sea or a lake or river and.

• 6:58Speaker 03

  You're in it like a dog.

• 6:59Speaker 04

  Before, yeah.

• 7:00Speaker 03

  See water and you're in.

• 7:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, like a dog.

• 7:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:02Jessie Ware?

  Dogs.

• 7:03Speaker 04

  I have been compared to like a sort of, yeah, sort of manic Labrador quite a lot. Um, and it's always before breakfast. Rain or shine.

• 7:12Speaker 03

  Why, oh.

• 7:13Speaker 04

  I just think it makes the breakfast taste.

• 7:15Speaker 03

  You're Yorkshire though, aren't you?

• 7:16Speaker 04

  I am Yorkshire.

• 7:17Speaker 03

  You see, sturdy.

• 7:18Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, but that would have been very cold in Yorkshire.

• 7:20Speaker 04

  I love being described as sturdy. Um, yeah, no, we didn't do it so much in Yorkshire. We do it on holiday more, like when we go to Cornwall and places like that. And, um, it's just, it's a, become a tradition was kids, I sort of loved it. And then teenagers, I hated it. My teenage years, it was always, oh, I can't believe I'm from this family. And now I love it. And it does make my day. I just love the feeling of immersed.

• 7:41Speaker 03

  Community of outdoors swimmers, aren't they?

• 7:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, and it's becoming a thing.

• 7:45Speaker 03

  Yeah. Do you think all the England team are having cold baths after?

• 7:49Speaker 04

  For sure.

• 7:49Jessie Ware?

  Yeah. Harry Styles has a big ice bath after his, um.

• 7:53Speaker 03

  Performances.

• 7:54Jessie Ware?

  You know, marathon that he does on stage.

• 7:55Speaker 04

  We have one on set sometimes.

• 7:57Jessie Ware?

  Do you?

• 7:57Speaker 03

  You don't.

• 7:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, just got back from Barcelona and we had one in our unit base.

• 8:02Jessie Ware?

  Hang on, but you were doing like night shoots and were you running around as the manager, Brian Epstein? Was, were you having to do lots of strenuous activity? I would have thought it would be more for like, if you were doing something like very active.

• 8:14Speaker 04

  Oh, I see. No, I wasn't doing strenuous activity. I mean, the boys are doing strenuous activity. They're on stage playing. I'm, I'm standing, watching, you know, being sort of adoring. But once you stood on set for a long time, there's nothing better than getting into some ice, some cold water.

• 8:30Jessie Ware?

  I would say nothing better getting into a really nice hotel bed.

• 8:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, well.

• 8:35Jessie Ware?

  Or a bath.

• 8:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, but then I sleep better if I've gone cold. I don't know, I'm reptile.

• 8:38Jessie Ware?

  So for you and all the Beatles are getting in the ice tub after a day of shooting, or do you all kind of line up and wait?

• 8:45Speaker 04

  This was a unique situation because we were in Barcelona, but yeah, there was an ice tub and it was hot and we would do it at the beginning of the day. And then sometimes with some people would do it at the end of the day, yeah.

• 8:52Jessie Ware?

  Did you encourage them all to do the P B D?

• 8:56Speaker 04

  P B D, yeah, I went P B D in because there was the sea nearby, so I did a couple of P B Ds. Uh, they, I was alone on my P B Ds.

• 9:05Jessie Ware?

  Okay, fair enough. Moving on from Coldwater.

• 9:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 9:08Jessie Ware?

  Uh, family holidays in Cornwall. Who was around the dinner table growing up and what was very memorable dish from your childhood?

• 9:16Speaker 04

  I mean, if you're talking Cornwall, that's a very specific dinner table because you're talking a house which was probably, probably fit like ten. But I had a very powerful and iconic grandmother called Granny Jean. And she had twelve grandchildren and her greatest legacy, which actually I'm now so grateful for is that she insisted that all of her four kids and their kids, which was the four grand, the twelve grandchildren, we all went on a holiday like twice a year. And we still go on one big summer holiday every single year. And this is back in those days we would go, she would hire this house in Cornwall and it was, as I say, fit like ten.

• 9:55Speaker 04

  And there was, we numbered at least like twenty four. So it was sort of, you know, three in a bed, top and tail, sofas, camping outside. And the table in the kitchen would fit twelve and we would be eating twenty four. So it would just be like endless tables and, you know, random bits of wood kind of as chairs. It was so fun, so chaotic. That's where the P B D thing really kicked off.

• 10:15Jessie Ware?

  Right, yeah.

• 10:15Speaker 04

  And Granny Jean would be queen matriarch at the head of the table.

• 10:19Jessie Ware?

  Was she cooking?

• 10:20Speaker 04

  Um, she probably not, no. I think her children cook.

• 10:23Jessie Ware?

  Delegating?

• 10:24Speaker 04

  Probably delegating, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think so. I mean, it was always a bit of a who's going to cook tonight. There was always a bit of a hustle, but it was my, those are my summer holiday memories and so fun, like.

• 10:34Jessie Ware?

  Are you going this year?

• 10:35Speaker 04

  Well, now it's the Isle of Wight, we go down there, but everyone gathers and, and we all gather really because. I think a lot of people are close to their cousins, but we are very close. We're a big family. We all really stick together. I mean, they're almost sort of siblings in a way. And it's really because of Granny Jean. She just insisted that we all stuck together. And now she's not no longer with us, but um she's very much sort of remembered in those in those big gatherings.

• 10:59Speaker 03

  Who's taken over the mantle of Granny Jean? Your mum or your dad?

• 11:03Speaker 04

  I think like every fam- no, there's no. Oh, in terms of my family, um my mum's, it's so funny if I was to say my mum's turned into Granny Jean. I wonder what my mum would say about that. Um, there's no matriarch within that. Like Granny Jean is still very much of the hallowed granny. But um my mum, yeah, she, my mum is an amazing cook. And and an incredible host. So I love hosting. I love big dinner parties. I love big parties. I throw parties at my house a lot. And I and my mum and dad, that's definitely one of the things they've taught me, that they love throwing. They're very good at it as well.

• 11:38Speaker 03

  I do.

• 11:38Jessie Ware?

  So you you are.

• 11:39Speaker 04

  You love a good party.

• 11:40Speaker 03

  I think I do.

• 11:41Jessie Ware?

  I think we're very strong party people. I think we're generous hosts.

• 11:44Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, we've got one this weekend, just your sons.

• 11:48Jessie Ware?

  Oh, yeah.

• 11:48Speaker 04

  I mean, because you're on series eighteen of a podcast, which is all around hosting.

• 11:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's true.

• 11:53Jessie Ware?

  Okay, so what was a memorable dish that your mum would make when you were growing up?

• 11:58Speaker 04

  I mean, there's so many. She used to make this like tomato and anchovy quiche, which would be.

• 12:04Jessie Ware?

  Wow.

• 12:05Speaker 04

  Which would be, that would be made many times, because that would be like any any picnic.

• 12:08Jessie Ware?

  It feels very Delia.

• 12:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, wholesome.

• 12:10Jessie Ware?

  It's maybe quite Delia nineties.

• 12:12Speaker 04

  Nineties. She, my my sister's a very good cook. They both.

• 12:16Jessie Ware?

  Jessica?

• 12:16Speaker 04

  Jessie, well done, we're Jessie.

• 12:17Jessie Ware?

  Oh, is she Jessie?

• 12:18Speaker 04

  No, she's Jessie. Yeah, yeah, she's Jessie. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, Jeff, very much Jessie. They were all down yesterday, day before, for Wimbledon. Very cool.

• 12:27Speaker 03

  Where did you go?

• 12:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 12:28Jessie Ware?

  He was in the royal box, mum.

• 12:30Speaker 04

  Took my sis.

• 12:31Jessie Ware?

  How do you get an invite in the royal box, Jen?

• 12:32Speaker 04

  I can't remember how I got invited, but my parents are tennis nuts. They love it, my sister as well. And so at the end, a lot of the actors leave after like one or two of the sort of showy games. And on the day we were there for the first time with my mum, it was the women's courts, I think, and all my mum's heroes were there, Virginia Wade and Billie Jean King.

• 12:46Speaker 03

  All sitting near her.

• 12:47Speaker 04

  They were all around her.

• 12:48Speaker 03

  Oh, my god.

• 12:49Speaker 04

  So she's just like, couldn't believe it. And um the most, actually, my proudest moment, proudest moment, like, one of my proudest moments in my career was, we were sitting like. Three rows back and Billie Jean King was on the front row and she turns around one of the games and she like points towards me and my mum and just goes, you, you. Well, this is my mum and I just go, what the fuck is going on? Turns out Billie Jean King is a massive fan of Grandchester.

• 13:12Jessie Ware?

  Ah.

• 13:13Speaker 04

  So, so my mum's, they like couldn't believe that this icon is asking. And then the between, when we went back to the sort of champagne area, it's a bougie bougie roll box kind of thing where you basically just get plied with champagne all day. Billie Jean King asked my mum to take a photo of me and Billie. Can you imagine my mum behind the camera going, this is insane? Yeah, it was sweet.

• 13:32Jessie Ware?

  So hosting, what would you cook for us if we were coming around to yours, James, for dinner?

• 13:38Speaker 04

  Right now in the summer, if it was daylight today, I would have, I have a gas grill and a wood grill. So I would be lighting one of those, probably the gas.

• 13:49Jessie Ware?

  Cause it's just easier.

• 13:50Speaker 04

  It's just easier.

• 13:50Jessie Ware?

  But I've got a wood one and it's great.

• 13:52Speaker 04

  I love it.

• 13:53Jessie Ware?

  Have you got a Somerset grill?

• 13:54Speaker 04

  Somerset grill.

• 13:55Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, it's called Somerset grill. It's like a nasado one.

• 13:57Speaker 04

  Oh, I didn't know. I've just got, I've just got a hole which my builders put into my, I've got like an outdoor kitchen, yeah. So I've got like a big beefy to gas. Then I've got like a kind of man, homemade sort of wood one, which we just basically plonk a big load of wood fire and then put a grill over it with it. It's got a ventilation and then a little sink. I love it. I love my outdoor kitchen. I cook on it all the time. I cook, I have my mum, dad and sister down a week and I cook them a lovely shoulder of lamb on the barbie and stuff.

• 14:21Jessie Ware?

  Great.

• 14:22Speaker 04

  So I would probably, I would definitely have the barbecue lit and I would probably cook you something, I mean, like halibut steaks, something light.

• 14:31Jessie Ware?

  I love halibut.

• 14:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, I love fish on the barbie. But yeah, probably like halibut steaks with like some nice prawns and then I would do a wild rice, you know, just rice. I do a lot of like, I guess, kind of Mediterranean sort of sides. So lots of aubergine charred with tahini and lots of salads. I over cater.

• 14:52Jessie Ware?

  Oh, good.

• 14:52Speaker 04

  I never run, I have a weird fear about running out of food. I think maybe it's boarding school or just being a glutton.

• 14:59Jessie Ware?

  What's it like at boarding school?

• 15:02Speaker 04

  That's a big question and we could.

• 15:03Jessie Ware?

  Food.

• 15:04Speaker 04

  Oh, food. No, no, no, we could, no, no, we could talk. I've spent 10 years talking to a therapist about it. And it was good in some ways and challenging in others and, and the, and the food thing, I don't know whether or not it's just having been part of a big family, going to boarding school, but I definitely. I don't know about you guys, but when I'm served in anywhere, restaurant, food, dinner, party, whatever, and and there are two helpings. And I'm having the same thing as someone else.

• 15:31Speaker 03

  You check how big theirs is.

• 15:33Speaker 04

  My brain will see the same size, or even mine being bigger, and I will immediately go, mine's smaller, mine's smaller, mine's smaller.

• 15:39Jessie Ware?

  Me too.

• 15:39Speaker 03

  But I do that and I didn't go to boarding school.

• 15:41Speaker 04

  What is that about?

• 15:42Speaker 03

  I don't, it's greed, greed, it's absolute greed. I'm always looking at, when they serve it to a restaurant, I think theirs is bigger than mine.

• 15:50Speaker 04

  Every single meal I've ever had.

• 15:51Speaker 03

  I think, why is theirs bigger than mine? I will make sure yours is bigger today. I will make sure you have the biggest portion.

• 15:56Speaker 04

  Even if you do that, I will psychologically trick myself and go, Jess, Jess and Len have got bigger helpings than me.

• 16:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 16:02Speaker 04

  And then I'll wait and go, maybe they won't eat all of it, and maybe I'll have the end and, you know.

• 16:05Speaker 03

  Could you get seconds at boarding school? So if you were, you're a big, growing boy, could you have seconds if you were still hungry?

• 16:14Speaker 04

  I think so. I think there was food. I don't, I don't, yeah, I'm sure there was. I mean, you know, the the good stuff has probably gone. I do remember like my one, my very, the junior school, I went, you were only allowed to toast your bread if you were a prefect.

• 16:28Speaker 03

  Oh, for god's sake.

• 16:29Jessie Ware?

  Were you at boarding school or junior school?

• 16:30Speaker 04

  I went from eleven.

• 16:31Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 16:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just think I really love food.

• 16:34Speaker 03

  Didn't you have a big cut box that you're?

• 16:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, I had a, I had a cut box, yeah. I I just, I I think it's also a big family, like, you know, lots of cousins, lots of big, older cousins.

• 16:46Speaker 03

  Fighting on the table to get stuck in.

• 16:48Speaker 04

  Yeah, and I just love food. I am a huge, I mean, people who know me do know, one of, I think if you asked a lot of them, the one of the things they would put at the top is

• 16:58Speaker 03

  Is food.

• 16:59Speaker 04

  is an appetite. I have, I have an appetite for for food and and just for everything, I think. I think of myself as a relatively, you know, I I feel like my mum and dad in my life, I've been still, instilled with a relatively decent, like, moral compass. But when it comes to, like, if I'm going to a buffet and there's like, you know, one bit of salmon and there are five people queuing, for some reason, my moral compass throws out the window and I will take way more than I am.

• 17:23Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 17:24Speaker 04

  It's weird. I don't know. I, for some reason, we've figured I've just become a menace.

• 17:27Speaker 03

  Buffet breakfast, even if you're not hungry, you eat everything that you can possibly eat.

• 17:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, hotel buffet breakfast, someone like that.

• 17:33Speaker 03

  You feel that you've got to store it up for the whole day.

• 17:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, and then probably make a couple of rolls for lunch.

• 17:37Speaker 03

  Oh, rolls for lunch.

• 17:38Speaker 04

  This, this is me doing, what, what are we having, carbs?

• 17:40Speaker 03

  So we're having lamb skewers.

• 17:43Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 17:44Jessie Ware?

  The carb is rice and

• 17:47Speaker 03

  Flat bread.

• 17:48Speaker 04

  Love it. This is for the tight ones out there. As you know, this is not my phone. I'm doing white insulin. Um, and that is done.

• 17:55Jessie Ware?

  Do you need, is it just the carbs you need to do?

• 17:57Speaker 04

  No, that's good, that's good.

• 17:57Speaker 03

  So we've got a little.

• 17:58Speaker 04

  You can keep that in as well.

• 17:59Speaker 03

  You've got a little thing on your arm. That's like, yeah.

• 18:02Jessie Ware?

  How many, do you have to change it every week?

• 18:05Speaker 04

  Uh, that changes every three days. But so, so you told me that we're, are we having dessert?

• 18:09Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 18:09Speaker 04

  Great, okay.

• 18:10Jessie Ware?

  Do you need to put that in now?

• 18:12Speaker 04

  Then I'll top up a bit.

• 18:12Speaker 03

  Oh, God almighty.

• 18:14Speaker 04

  I'll just put, I just put in the amount of carbs we're having.

• 18:17Speaker 03

  Do you think there, there's been enough, um, progress in addressing type one diabetes?

• 18:22Speaker 04

  Huge.

• 18:22Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:23Jessie Ware?

  Well, you just ran the marathon.

• 18:25Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:26Jessie Ware?

  Which made me laugh so much because we came to support you.

• 18:29Speaker 04

  I know, and I couldn't see you.

• 18:30Jessie Ware?

  No, but it was so funny when you were like, everyone is shouting my fucking name. And we're like, James! But you're like, by the end, tell me, like, tell mum about, like, what the end bit was like.

• 18:41Speaker 04

  Cause I got a chest infection the day before. Horrible. And because the first, I thought I was gonna have to pull out. And then I thought, do you know what? I'm gonna do it. Because I had all these.

• 18:49Speaker 03

  You're doing it for diabetes.

• 18:50Speaker 04

  I had every type one diabetic child in the country giving me all their pocket money.

• 18:54Speaker 03

  Oh, God almighty.

• 18:55Speaker 04

  There was no way I was gonna pull out. And so I was doing the marathon. And then every time I, cause everyone had me on their tracker. So every time I turned a corner, I'd be like, everyone would, James, James. Well, not everyone, but quite enough people would, James, James, because they'd see where I was.

• 19:05Jessie Ware?

  You can have, you could have Cynthia Ariva on the tracker. You can have James Norton. You could have Clara, Amfo, likes, and your friends, like, I mean. So we all had our.

• 19:15Speaker 04

  You had me on. But every time I came around the corner, I, everyone would be like, James, James. And then they would see me. Cause by, by, basically halfway, halfway around. This chest infection, which was really serious.

• 19:24Speaker 03

  You felt unwell.

• 19:26Speaker 04

  I felt wretched.

• 19:27Speaker 03

  So shit.

• 19:28Speaker 04

  I thought it was gonna collapse. And so everyone would be like, James, James. And then they would go, James, James.

• 19:31Speaker 03

  Going.

• 19:32Speaker 04

  Oh, God, you're all right. And I was sort of, and I was trying not to collapse. I mean, my butt, my legs were buckling and stuff, so.

• 19:38Speaker 03

  What a shame.

• 19:39Jessie Ware?

  I don't, it's a delivery of some sorts. Um, so, but, but the end, just tell me what it's like. Tell mum what it was like at the end, the way you described it.

• 19:47Speaker 04

  What did I have?

• 19:47Jessie Ware?

  Like jumping over bodies that were like passing out.

• 19:49Speaker 04

  Literally, it's like a war zone. There are people, kind of, because it was so hot.

• 19:52Speaker 03

  Collapsed.

• 19:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, and they're being. Tended to by paramedics and you're and my legs are buckling. I'm just thinking, please get to the end and I'm seeing these bodies just going, this is fucking harro. It was actually hell.

• 20:02Speaker 03

  Did you have anyone running with you that kept you going?

• 20:05Speaker 04

  No, I mean, I got to the end and it was fine. And the most important thing was that, you know, did it for the di- did it for breakthrough T1D, which is a charity for kids with diabetes. And actually, in answer to your question, there is incredible advances because there is, because a lot of people in America and there's a lot of money and resources being pushed into it. And I think we're getting closer.

• 20:24Speaker 03

  So what's your hope for type?

• 20:26Speaker 04

  My hope is within like ten, fifteen years, we're all, we won't be administering insulin. We'll have, I mean, there'll be, there's so many different versions of a sort of cure, but I think we're close. I mean, obviously we're closer than we've ever been, but actually suddenly within the diabetic community, people are like, well, maybe it actually is getting quite close.

• 20:43Speaker 03

  So raising money is really important.

• 20:45Speaker 04

  So we're at that final push. I mean, it is, it's a really weird condition because, you know, it's quite hidden. People don't really know that I'm.

• 20:51Speaker 03

  When did you get it?

• 20:53Speaker 04

  Twenty two.

• 20:54Speaker 03

  Twenty two.

• 20:54Speaker 04

  Yeah. And apart from these things, I've got this sensor here and I've got this pump here. But other than that, people don't really know. And then suddenly something will happen, like I'll have a hypo or, and you know, I need to stop filming because I need to eat.

• 21:05Speaker 03

  Do you carry a snack round with you?

• 21:06Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, I've got Dextro tablets, Naked Bars. Yeah.

• 21:10Speaker 03

  And if, can you have a hyper and a hypo?

• 21:13Speaker 04

  Go high or low, yeah.

• 21:14Speaker 03

  Yeah. And what happens with the other one?

• 21:15Speaker 04

  High is not dangerous in the short term. Low is dangerous, yeah.

• 21:19Speaker 03

  Does it change your personality?

• 21:20Speaker 04

  It does. When I go low, it's complicated. Eating at restaurants is complicated because you have to time your insulin. So, you know, we just discussed when I'm going to do my insulin. You have to time it and hope, hope that the food's going to arrive in time. And if it doesn't, you can be in a restaurant.

• 21:33Jessie Ware?

  Have you ever been that guy that's like, guys, I really need to eat my dinner now. Where is it?

• 21:37Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. I've had some mad ones. I was at a GQ event once and I arrived, it was a sort of fashion thing and, and I put my insulin in thinking that we were going to have some bread with a starter. And the starter arrived and it was this little bit of trout, smoked trout with no, with no carbs. And I was on the high table and it was, and they were honoring Jude Law and Nicole Kidman and all these people. And there were speeches after the starter. So I was sitting there having done my insulin, having eaten this trout going, I've got ten minutes before I start to faint. Basically, and I couldn't interrupt the speeches because I was sitting on the high table. So I eventually I started sweating and like, you know, you get really wobbly, you like eventually will faint. So I walked over, I actually brought, I said, dude, I'm just gonna, went over to the back to the lady um that was standing behind my table saying, I'm a diabetic, I need some food like quickly.

• 22:22Speaker 04

  So she gave me a chocolate bar and some juice and I thought I was okay. Went back, sat back down. What I didn't realise was that pandemonium had broken out backstage and they were like, James Norton's about to, you know, have a hypo, we need to. So in the middle of Nicole Kidman's speech, someone randomly brings me a steaming plate of potatoes.

• 22:39Speaker 03

  Oh, God.

• 22:41Speaker 04

  And it basically looked like I was like, this is bullshit, James is hungry, give him some potatoes.

• 22:46Speaker 03

  What do you keep in your fridge away then?

• 22:48Speaker 04

  Juice, yeah.

• 22:50Speaker 03

  Is juice very good for you?

• 22:51Speaker 04

  Anything sugary.

• 22:52Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 22:53Jessie Ware?

  We need to get on to your last supper.

• 22:54Speaker 04

  My last supper?

• 22:55Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, so we've got starter, main, purd, drink of choice.

• 22:59Speaker 04

  Oh my gosh, starter, this is like, this is, oh God.

• 23:02Speaker 03

  Oh, it's like off menu, isn't it? Yeah, you're gonna have to change it up for us, please.

• 23:05Speaker 04

  Um. Starter, something like, I I was gonna go lobster bisque on off menu, so I'd go lobster.

• 23:12Speaker 03

  You didn't though.

• 23:13Speaker 04

  I didn't, I went for an asparagus.

• 23:15Speaker 03

  You went oysters.

• 23:15Speaker 04

  I think I love fish. I would probably go something like, I love, I love anything which can make use of the bread. So anything like a bisque or a soup, something which my mum would make a lot was celery soup and I would just cover it with cheddar cheese.

• 23:29Speaker 03

  Oh yum.

• 23:29Speaker 04

  And like big crusty bread and just make it this big mush and, you know, I remember like that was very comfort food.

• 23:35Speaker 03

  Is that one of her best dishes?

• 23:36Speaker 04

  Oh no, my mum's, that, that, my mum's a good cook. Like, we, we would do, you know, big roasts. My sister's a great cook, my dad, we, we're a family of foodies, so.

• 23:44Speaker 03

  What, what was your birthday meal? Did you go out for dinner or did your mum make you lasagna or something?

• 23:51Speaker 04

  My mum, my birthday meal, I mean, my mum worked a lot.

• 23:54Speaker 03

  What did she do?

• 23:55Speaker 04

  She um was a nurse and then she, and then she taught nurses medical ethics. Um, she did a PhD in um in medical ethics and philosophy, yeah.

• 24:05Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 24:05Speaker 04

  And allocation of, of, of healthcare resources. So, so when, when she was working, my birthday cake was often like, like a slab of. Ice cream with a packet of Smarties and I was thrilled.

• 24:16Speaker 03

  You didn't mind.

• 24:17Speaker 04

  I was great, yeah, um, because, you know, she was a busy working mum, as my dad worked as well. She had some like staple staple dishes, like her pavlova is quite famous.

• 24:27Speaker 03

  Is it?

• 24:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, when I was at school, James, James Norton's mum's pavlova became quite a thing.

• 24:32Speaker 03

  What's her topping?

• 24:32Speaker 04

  I don't know why strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, yeah.

• 24:36Speaker 03

  Was it chewy pavlova?

• 24:38Speaker 04

  I mean, it was like, her meringue is unparalleled.

• 24:42Speaker 03

  I think there are queens of meringues.

• 24:43Speaker 04

  She's a queen.

• 24:43Speaker 03

  Actually.

• 24:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. She, she, she, some, certain things, she just is, there's no one better.

• 24:49Speaker 03

  So relieved I didn't make a pavlova today.

• 24:51Jessie Ware?

  We didn't do that then.

• 24:52Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 24:53Speaker 04

  My mum's pavlova, for some reason, you know, like, you know how boys get, they find things to sort of tease and play with. For some reason, my, it was never specified why James's mum's pavlova felt naughty. But it would be talked about all the time.

• 25:09Speaker 03

  Where?

• 25:10Speaker 04

  At, at school.

• 25:11Speaker 03

  Oh, God.

• 25:11Speaker 04

  Like James, my, my.

• 25:12Speaker 03

  She brought pavlova to school?

• 25:14Speaker 04

  No, it was just like, there was something about it which sounded naughty, like mum's pavlova. I don't know what it was.

• 25:20Speaker 03

  Well, see, it was the name, maybe.

• 25:22Speaker 04

  Made a great chocolate roulade. I, I grew up in a, in a, in a house, you know, she grows her own vegetables, she was obsessed with her runner beans.

• 25:29Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 25:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, very lucky.

• 25:32Speaker 03

  Do you celebrate Christmas all together?

• 25:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, very big, big Christmas. And, and also because of Granny Jean, God, I'm really going down the Norton family history, aren't I?

• 25:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:41Speaker 04

  Um, you know, my, that's my dad's side, my mum's side has lots of cousins and aunts and uncles, so every Christmas is like.

• 25:47Speaker 03

  Together, it's huge.

• 25:48Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 25:48Speaker 03

  So what's your main course if you've had lobster bis to start?

• 25:53Speaker 04

  I mean, it's boring because I've just talked about halibut steaks, but I would probably do something like a, some grilled fish. Something like a big bass or something, but like lovely, something simple, I mean, ingredients, delicious, delicious. Um, or like a boule de bae's or something fishy, I think. I, I'm more and more, I'm veering away from meat.

• 26:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 26:15Speaker 04

  I mean, a roast chicken, it can't go wrong.

• 26:17Speaker 03

  I love it, yeah.

• 26:19Speaker 04

  Nothing better.

• 26:19Speaker 03

  Do you like stuffing or, we were talking about bread sauce the other day.

• 26:23Speaker 04

  Bread sauce, we, we grew up on bread sauce, Yorkshireman, and, and, yeah.

• 26:26Speaker 03

  But do you have it with every roast chicken or just at Christmas or? We tend not to have it.

• 26:32Speaker 04

  Chicken.

• 26:32Speaker 03

  Oh, okay. I think I need to up my game.

• 26:36Speaker 04

  We have it with, we, we have, yeah, bread sauce with every chicken, um. Yorkshire puddings. Yeah, I mean, we have a lot. We have a lot. Oh, and also because I grew up in Yorkshire. So when I, when I would come out from school, sometimes my mom and dad would, would be working and we would go to this amazing lady called Liz, who lived in the village, and we'd have our roast and then she'd always make extra gravy. And then we'd have a slice of white bread on our.

• 27:01Speaker 03

  So you could.

• 27:02Speaker 04

  And then we, and then the extra gravy would go.

• 27:03Speaker 03

  Just pour it.

• 27:04Speaker 04

  Heaven. So it would just be the most delicious gravy with a slice of white bread. And that would, there's a name for it in Yorkshire. I can't remember what it's called, but yeah, that's.

• 27:12Speaker 03

  You could have had a Yorkshire pudding.

• 27:14Speaker 04

  You could.

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• 28:57Jessie Ware?

  James, let's talk about House of the Dragon.

• 29:00Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 29:01Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 29:02Jessie Ware?

  So I just got to episode three.

• 29:05Speaker 04

  Right.

• 29:06Jessie Ware?

  And you've like, the end of the episode three, it's like, okay, we understand who we're dealing with now.

• 29:11Speaker 04

  So it kicks off for me from, everyone's, yeah, everyone's like, are you in this? Four onwards and then my storyline suddenly really kicks off, yeah. Um, and he, they're sort of, I'm pitched as the, you know, the main antagonist for an era. Um, I'm the thorn in her side from, from now on, which is quite exciting.

• 29:29Speaker 03

  Have you done other kind of fantasy?

• 29:32Speaker 04

  No, I've never done anything like this, actually. And it's the, it's an interesting experience because I'm very aware of the weight, the scale of this. You know, I've never been in so many memes.

• 29:45Speaker 03

  So, oh yeah.

• 29:46Speaker 04

  It's mad.

• 29:47Speaker 03

  So, but I, what I wondered about, obviously there's a lot of AI involved because there aren't real dragons everywhere. How do you manage that as an actor?

• 29:56Speaker 04

  There's some, I've got to say, like, in the world of AI, I feel like shows like House of the Dragon really are, they stand for something important because so much of what you see is actually, is actually real. I mean, the, the studio.

• 30:14Speaker 03

  The dragons?

• 30:15Speaker 04

  The dragons, no, the dragons, no, but the dragons, even the heads of the dragons are real. So when you, when you see the dragon, what we see as actors is about three people all dressed in blue, like the Blue Man Group.

• 30:27Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:27Speaker 04

  Head to toe in blue, they're folding these big sticks and they have the dragon's head on it. And they have the wings as well on sticks and so they move, they're like puppeteers.

• 30:37Speaker 03

  That's how interesting.

• 30:38Speaker 04

  Bless them. And they move and so, so what you're watching is a single head moving like the dragon with the wings. And then the body isn't there and then behind them is this enormous blue screen. And then later on, special effects add in, yeah. But it's not AI, I mean, there'll be AI involved.

• 30:54Speaker 03

  I don't know what you call it. What's the thing, the other CGI, I don't know.

• 30:58Speaker 04

  It'll be CGI, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 30:59Speaker 03

  God.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  That's just your play.

• 31:04Jessie Ware?

  We're going to close the window.

• 31:06Speaker 04

  My neck's a bit small.

• 31:08Jessie Ware?

  Okay, so we have Zeshuan lamb shoulder and lamb rib.

• 31:13Jessie Ware?

  All right. You can take two, James.

• 31:16Speaker 04

  No, no, I'll take one to start with.

• 31:16Jessie Ware?

  No, no, just do it.

• 31:18Speaker 04

  I know. I'm gonna start with one, I'm gonna start with one.

• 31:21Jessie Ware?

  But you didn't even take the biggest.

• 31:22Speaker 04

  No, this is fine, this is huge.

• 31:24Jessie Ware?

  Oh mate, you could have taken that one.

• 31:25Speaker 04

  This is great.

• 31:26Jessie Ware?

  And then we're doing it with, so it's um.

• 31:28Speaker 04

  Oh my god, this is amazing.

• 31:29Jessie Ware?

  This is with like a lovely cucumber salad.

• 31:33Speaker 04

  I shouldn't go first, go on, Lenny, you go first.

• 31:34Jessie Ware?

  No, no, no, you keep going. Curried, curried horn and ricotta, and then you've got like a courgette.

• 31:40Speaker 04

  Oh my gosh.

• 31:41Jessie Ware?

  And some thing, yeah, just knock yourself out.

• 31:44Speaker 04

  Do you guys compete when it's at one another's house?

• 31:47Jessie Ware?

  We collaborate about food. Mum's stump hood.

• 31:50Speaker 04

  Oh my god, that, um.

• 31:52Jessie Ware?

  It's good enough. It's Ben Lippett's recipe on how I cook, in his book How I Cook.

• 31:57Speaker 04

  Also, shout out to Sam who cooked it.

• 31:59Jessie Ware?

  I know. Where is sweet Sam?

• 32:00Speaker 04

  Sam.

• 32:01Jessie Ware?

  Hoping for a kebab, I should think.

• 32:03Speaker 04

  Thanks, Jessie, but also.

• 32:05Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, darling. Yeah, okay, so.

• 32:10Speaker 04

  So yeah, how's that going? I was saying, the mad thing about it is, in the world of AI, it is really humbling and encouraging to be on a set where the detail, the people who are involved in that show, they both love it, thank you. It's incredible, basically. The studio builds are vast and so detailed. I mean, everything, like my sword, the armour, it was all so intricate. And there was like teams of people who made my sword, you know, for months. There's a blacksmith on set, they have people, they have a, they have a literal.

• 32:37Jessie Ware?

  A blacksmith?

• 32:38Speaker 04

  They have an old, they have an old fashioned blacksmith, fashioning the metal. I haven't even got this, what's this?

• 32:43Jessie Ware?

  Mmm, a smaltzy yogurt, courgette yogurt thing.

• 32:46Speaker 04

  Guys, this is great. This, this shit's on off many, I tell you.

• 32:50Jessie Ware?

  Is there enough for you?

• 32:51Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, thank you.

• 32:52Jessie Ware?

  Listen, I, I'm not saying anything. We have lots of respect for Ed Gamble and James Icastra. And we still need to have James on.

• 32:59Speaker 04

  There's no, enough like this, yeah. Okay, I've got everything.

• 33:02Jessie Ware?

  You've got, oh, he was worrying for a moment.

• 33:05Speaker 04

  It's okay, because I served myself. I was able to give, give huge helping. Anyway, it's been, it's been a great show. And also, you know, it's just coming out now, but witnessing and experiencing the like, the, the global kind of reach of it is mad. It's, it's been a mad experience. I've never been in, never been in something so. So it's sort of huge.

• 33:24Jessie Ware?

  Let's talk about Sunny Dancer that's coming out. Bella Ramsey, Jessica Gunning, Earl Cave, who is fantastic.

• 33:33Speaker 04

  Isn't he?

• 33:34Jessie Ware?

  I haven't seen him in anything before.

• 33:35Speaker 04

  So good.

• 33:36Jessie Ware?

  He's like, he's a star.

• 33:39Speaker 04

  Sweet boy, looks amazing, yeah, sweet guy, they're all so, I mean.

• 33:44Jessie Ware?

  Neil Patrick.

• 33:45Speaker 04

  Neil Patrick Harris.

• 33:46Jessie Ware?

  Yep.

• 33:46Speaker 04

  He, he and I, yeah, I really did jump a generation on this film because.

• 33:50Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, you're playing a dad.

• 33:51Speaker 04

  I'm playing a dad.

• 33:52Jessie Ware?

  Like a teen dad.

• 33:53Speaker 04

  Of a seventeen year old. I mean Bella, Bella is twenty one, so.

• 33:58Jessie Ware?

  They, oh, they're so young.

• 34:00Speaker 04

  Yeah, they're twenty one, but they're playing a seventeen year old, so at least I'm playing a father of a seventeen year old. But it was a bit scary when my agent called up and said, so this offer come through, you, you are gonna be playing Bella Ramsey's dad. And I suddenly thought, fuck, like, that's a big generation shift.

• 34:15Jessie Ware?

  You were a young dad, anyway.

• 34:17Speaker 04

  Thanks.

• 34:17Jessie Ware?

  Well, there's a reference to it in the film as well.

• 34:19Speaker 04

  Young dad, young dad, young dad. My, my business partner, she has coined my current casting as my sad dad era.

• 34:27Jessie Ware?

  I guess because you did your ITV thing as well, didn't you?

• 34:30Speaker 04

  And there were special and, yeah.

• 34:32Jessie Ware?

  Well, can, can we just talk, we will talk about Sunny Dancer, it's really beautiful, it's an independent film by George Ja- Ja.

• 34:38Speaker 04

  George Jakes, yeah.

• 34:39Jessie Ware?

  George Jakes, and it's about, well, you can say if you want.

• 34:43Speaker 04

  It's about a young girl who has had cancer and she is recovering. And her parents send her on a kind of cancer camp, so for kids who have had cancer.

• 34:55Jessie Ware?

  Because she's kind of removing herself a bit and they're worried about her.

• 34:58Speaker 04

  She's kind of traumatized by the experience and.

• 35:00Jessie Ware?

  And angry.

• 35:01Speaker 04

  As you'd expect, you know, she's a seventeen year old who's, who's kind of had their adolescent stolen from them and. Anyway, she's very reluctant to go to this camp, but she goes on the advice of her parents, Jessica Gunning and I play her parents. And it's a very heartwarming, very important film about, about, you know, kids with cancer. People immediately sort of hear that and go, God, you know, that sounds terrifyingly sad. And George, the brilliant director and writer of this, he's only about 24 himself. It's terrifying how young he is, I know.

• 35:34Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 35:35Jessie Ware?

  He wrote it and directed it.

• 35:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's a kind of a.

• 35:37Jessie Ware?

  Did he have cancer?

• 35:38Speaker 04

  No, no, no, no, no. No, I don't think so. No, no, no, no, no. But he, it's just very, it's just not what you expect in terms of the pitch. You think, God, this is going to be really, really sad. And actually, it's incredibly heartwarming and very funny and.

• 35:53Jessie Ware?

  Some really brilliant new stars as well.

• 35:55Speaker 04

  Brilliant new stars.

• 35:56Speaker 03

  I don't feel like dancing.

• 35:58Jessie Ware?

  And Cicicis just gets such a big moment in it.

• 36:00Speaker 04

  Huge moment.

• 36:01Speaker 03

  I like the one by the lake.

• 36:03Jessie Ware?

  The lake, it was beautiful. That was shot really beautifully too. And your bit in the car, Bob.

• 36:08Speaker 04

  Mine and Jessica's contribution is small, but I'm very proud to be a part of it.

• 36:13Jessie Ware?

  Where did we get to on our last supper?

• 36:14Speaker 04

  Oh, my gosh.

• 36:15Jessie Ware?

  We've got Mum's Papalova, we've got Halibut steaks. What's your drink of choice?

• 36:21Speaker 04

  Hmm. My drink of choice for the meal is wine, has to be.

• 36:26Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, but where, what wine are we having?

• 36:28Speaker 04

  Oh, my gosh, I'm not good with wines. I'm not going to be able to give you.

• 36:32Jessie Ware?

  But if you eat fish, you have light wine.

• 36:34Speaker 04

  Something crisp and light. I mean, I love a, I love a natural wine. Probably the wine drinkers, you roll your eyes, hate it.

• 36:41Speaker 03

  You used to love it.

• 36:42Jessie Ware?

  No, I like a Pet Nat. I can't do that. I can't do natural.

• 36:46Speaker 04

  Something a little frisante. I mean, but I'm not, I don't have like a list of favourite wines.

• 36:51Speaker 03

  Can I just ask, just now you're eating, do you have to check things on your, on your phone to see how you are?

• 36:58Speaker 04

  It will beep if I go high or low.

• 37:01Speaker 03

  Okay, and then what do you do?

• 37:03Speaker 04

  Well, then I'll add something. So for example, if we're about to have pudding.

• 37:05Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, we are actually.

• 37:06Speaker 04

  And we've had a bit of, we've had a bit of more bread than I thought. So now I'm going to put a bit more insulin in. I'm going to tell my thing to tell this.

• 37:13Speaker 03

  Oh, my goodness.

• 37:14Speaker 04

  To put a bit more. So the pudding is what?

• 37:15Speaker 03

  It's ice cream.

• 37:17Jessie Ware?

  Pistachio ice cream.

• 37:18Speaker 04

  Fabulous. Also, this is just something, a note to those people who ask, please don't ask a diabetic if they can eat sugar. Because it drives us mad. I mean, I can eat sugar. All I need to do is just tell my device that I'm about to eat sugar and then I'm happy.

• 37:30Jessie Ware?

  I think I did ask you if you could eat sugar.

• 37:32Speaker 04

  It's fine.

• 37:32Speaker 03

  Yeah, I didn't know that because I think if you're not type one, you probably can't then.

• 37:37Speaker 04

  It's hard if you're type two. If you're balancing it with diet, then you have to be more mindful. But I very much can eat ice cream.

• 37:42Speaker 03

  You can eat like your meat.

• 37:44Jessie Ware?

  I just, it's a lot when I'm trying to do an interview.

• 37:46Speaker 04

  This is delicious, by the way. I'm thrilled to be eating this delicious food. Thank you very much.

• 37:49Jessie Ware?

  I feel sad that you didn't get to do second. I thought maybe you were gonna go for the next one.

• 37:54Speaker 03

  You need to put him a little box.

• 37:56Jessie Ware?

  No, I think he'll be fine. I'm sure he's going to the Corinthia for a press junket and I think he'll be okay. Okay, so you're doing Hamlet, you're doing the Beatles film and you're on this kind of big, long period of filming. What is Rabbit Track doing?

• 38:08Speaker 04

  Rabbit Track is doing, um.

• 38:10Jessie Ware?

  Your production company.

• 38:10Speaker 04

  My production company is doing a lot. I have an amazing business partner called Kitty Kletzky, who I've been working with for now five, six years and.

• 38:17Jessie Ware?

  How did you meet?

• 38:19Speaker 04

  We met in L A and I got this opportunity to set this company up and I called her and said, listen, do you know anyone who in London who might want to run the company with me? Knowing that she was in the kind of producer world and she sort of gave me a few names and at the end, like, because she was living in L A at the time and I knew that there was no one better than her. She was running a TV department. She's, I mean, you know, have you met Kitty?

• 38:38Jessie Ware?

  No.

• 38:40Speaker 04

  She's incredible. I mean, genuinely, like, I'm in awe of her daily and she keeps me on my toes and she challenges me. Talk about getting out of your comfort zone. I mean, this has been a whole, like, just learning how to do a new career and Kitty's been my sort of guide through it. But at the end of the call, I was like, maybe if, you know, you wanted to do it, that would be great. Put the phone down, planted the seed and then she called me a few weeks later and saying, actually, I am looking for a reason to come home. And so that was it. We were then building a company together. We set up in two thousand nineteen, just before the pandemic and it's been amazing. It's been a complete, mad, challenging, beautiful sort of journey. I've, we've made two shows, King and Conqueror and Playing Nice.

• 39:18Jessie Ware?

  There was a beep, was it your beep?

• 39:20Speaker 04

  That's me, that's my instant finishing. It's all good.

• 39:22Speaker 03

  Okay, fine.

• 39:23Speaker 04

  Does it beat?

• 39:23Speaker 03

  Are there different beats?

• 39:25Speaker 04

  That's a healthy beat. That's a, that's a, we're good, we're on the right track beat.

• 39:28Speaker 03

  Um.

• 39:29Speaker 04

  It's alright then.

• 39:30Jessie Ware?

  I don't think we've, oh, we've had Esti Heim on, yeah.

• 39:32Speaker 04

  Did she make such a song and dance about it? No. She's quite cool about it.

• 39:37Jessie Ware?

  I think you're quite cool about having diabetes.

• 39:39Speaker 03

  I think you're, I think you're quite cool.

• 39:40Speaker 04

  She's cool.

• 39:41Jessie Ware?

  I think anyone that's got diabetes is pretty fucking cool.

• 39:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think you are.

• 39:44Speaker 04

  I agree. I genuinely, you don't meet a bad diabetic. I'm just saying, type ones are all pretty cool. Yeah, there's, I don't know what it is. Maybe it's because like whenever I meet one, if I see them on the street, I'm like, yes, we have a kind of lovely camaraderie.

• 39:55Speaker 03

  You're just type one.

• 39:55Jessie Ware?

  So what, if you see, see them with their bit, you'll kind of be like, it's like a.

• 39:59Speaker 04

  Do you know the bane of my life for a period was Zoe?

• 40:02Jessie Ware?

  Oh.

• 40:03Speaker 04

  Because it completely threw me out of.

• 40:04Jessie Ware?

  Oh, those people that were trying to see what their blood sugar.

• 40:07Speaker 04

  You don't have diabetes, you just have.

• 40:09Jessie Ware?

  So you'd be like embracing these, uh, health faddy like fanatics.

• 40:14Speaker 04

  And they go, what are you doing? I'm like, you're not a type one? What is a type one? Just go, no, I'm just trying to get my gut biome right.

• 40:22Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, they all had those things on their arm, didn't they?

• 40:24Speaker 04

  They still do sometimes.

• 40:25Jessie Ware?

  But you've got a really exciting, um, film in production with Owen Cooper. Test, like you've got like this, the cast mum, your favourite, from The Bear.

• 40:37Speaker 04

  Mm. Ebon Mossbacherat.

• 40:39Speaker 03

  Who?

• 40:40Jessie Ware?

  Ebon Mossbacherat.

• 40:40Speaker 03

  Oh, my god.

• 40:41Jessie Ware?

  He's.

• 40:42Speaker 04

  Cous, sexy cousin.

• 40:43Speaker 03

  He's fabulous. Have you watched The Bear this season?

• 40:46Speaker 04

  Not this season, but a lot. Oh, I love it.

• 40:48Speaker 03

  Can I just say, it's the best season.

• 40:51Speaker 04

  Is it?

• 40:51Speaker 03

  It's as good as number one.

• 40:52Speaker 04

  Love it.

• 40:53Speaker 03

  It's almost better because it's so enchanted.

• 40:55Jessie Ware?

  He's got him in his new film.

• 40:56Speaker 03

  You're so lucky.

• 40:57Speaker 04

  So it's cool. I mean, again, Kitty, I have to say, I'm taking more of a backseat on this one. What's really wonderful, we're shooting a film called Fox Finder in Bavaria in the summer, in August, and we're about to go into production. I've very much taken a backseat on this one because it's, it's the first project we've made, which I'm not in. And that's a really big step for us because it's validating us as a company. Um, we always wanted to make the first few shows with me in them, gives the bit of a supercharge to the company. But now, we were never, we were never one of those vanity projects, just making stuff for me. And Kitty is too good a producer just to make shows and films for like, you know, me, that sort of English guy. So, um, we've, yeah, this is, as I say, Ebon, Tessa, it's cool, really cool.

• 41:36Speaker 03

  Do you prefer playing baddies or goodies? Because a vicar is very different from a horrible nasty criminal.

• 41:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, I think for me, it's all about just keeping it, keeping it new and fresh. And also, I think probably in a way, like, the roles really are the sort of the needs of. Like, my, my, my favorite role is one which splits the audience. And, you know, you have people on the sofa at home going, is he good, is he bad? You know, and you want people kind of going, I mean, Tommy from Happy Valley, although he was clearly a baddie, but he had.

• 42:07Speaker 03

  He was a baddie.

• 42:08Speaker 04

  But there was a lot of vulnerability.

• 42:09Speaker 03

  No, that at the end.

• 42:10Speaker 04

  You know what I mean?

• 42:11Speaker 03

  You saw it all.

• 42:11Speaker 04

  So that's the dream is where you can, where you can play with people's preconceptions about someone.

• 42:17Speaker 03

  Is it worth, Jess?

• 42:18Jessie Ware?

  I think so.

• 42:19Speaker 04

  Is it homemade ice cream?

• 42:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:20Speaker 04

  Oh, my God. Guys, this is the best podcast ever. Jessie, that was.

• 42:26Speaker 03

  Delicious.

• 42:27Speaker 04

  Absolutely delicious.

• 42:28Jessie Ware?

  Good.

• 42:29Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 42:31Speaker 04

  I'm now quite intimidated to have you at my house.

• 42:34Speaker 03

  No, don't be.

• 42:35Speaker 04

  Lenny's, yours is very upright.

• 42:37Speaker 03

  I know, I like an erect one, James.

• 42:43Jessie Ware?

  Mum, I've already started, but what is the pudding?

• 42:46Speaker 03

  It's pistachio ice cream with chocolate strata, it's stracciatella.

• 42:50Jessie Ware?

  We have to shout Alexandra Dudley on Instagram. I saw this. I said, Mum, can you make it? This is delicious.

• 42:55Speaker 04

  This is very, very.

• 42:57Jessie Ware?

  No churn.

• 42:57Speaker 04

  Very good. No churn?

• 42:59Speaker 03

  No churn.

• 43:00Speaker 04

  This is really good. That chocolate, that, what percent is that, like 90, 80? 80, so good.

• 43:05Speaker 03

  But actually, you need it.

• 43:06Speaker 04

  No.

• 43:07Speaker 03

  Otherwise, it would have been too sweet. I hope you're, you're not going to start bleeping.

• 43:11Speaker 04

  No, no, this is great. Also, the, I'm an addict of dark, I mean, I have dark chocolate in my bag all the time. I was 85 to 90. This is, this is heaven.

• 43:19Jessie Ware?

  Whilst you finish up your pistachio ice cream, can you give us a nostalgic taste that can transport you back somewhere, happy or sad?

• 43:28Speaker 04

  Oh, my gosh, that's a really interesting one. Okay, so.

• 43:33Speaker 04

  Oh, I mean, this has transformed me somewhere so good.

• 43:36Speaker 03

  Oh, good.

• 43:36Speaker 04

  Oh, my god. I think I'm going deep nostalgia to my childhood. There was a dish my mum made, which is actually quite, in hindsight, it's actually a bit gross. If I describe it, it's like a tuna fish in white sauce. It was like a couple of cans of tuna fish with sweet corn and a white sauce and onions. So just very simple, like onions, basically onions, tuna, white sauce. And basically, and very simple. But for some reason, as a child, I absolutely loved it. And it became a comfort food. And then when you go away to school and you come back and all you want is that thing.

• 44:11Speaker 03

  The tuna in the white sauce.

• 44:12Speaker 04

  Tuna in the white sauce.

• 44:13Speaker 03

  Did you have it with pasta?

• 44:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:16Speaker 03

  Okay, was it pasta or white?

• 44:18Speaker 04

  Yeah. In describing it, I'm realising I haven't had it for decades. But for a long time, it was, yeah, it was like the food which I associated with home and my mum. And whether or not I loved the flavour, which I did, but it became more than that. It became, yeah, my tuna fish in white sauce, which I haven't had for decades.

• 44:38Speaker 03

  Would you make it for your children?

• 44:41Speaker 04

  I would.

• 44:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:42Speaker 04

  I will.

• 44:43Speaker 03

  You will?

• 44:44Speaker 04

  Hopefully, one day.

• 44:46Jessie Ware?

  James Norton, thank you very much for coming on the podcast.

• 44:49Speaker 04

  I have loved it. This has been wonderful.

• 44:50Speaker 03

  Oh, good.

• 44:51Speaker 04

  Thank you. Best dinner party ever.

• 45:08Jessie Ware?

  James Norton on Table manners. He's rushed off to a junket and I can't speak because I don't know if I'm dehydrated or that select spritz just took me over the edge. Maybe both?

• 45:23Speaker 03

  Maybe, darling.

• 45:23Jessie Ware?

  That ice cream.

• 45:25Speaker 03

  Did you like?

• 45:26Jessie Ware?

  That was delicious.

• 45:28Speaker 03

  Good.

• 45:28Jessie Ware?

  Alexandra Dudley, your no churn pistachio dark chocolate stracciatella was delicious. And I'm thrilled that we have so much more left. Also Ben Lippett, those Szechuan lamb rib, did you like them? Were they too spicy?

• 45:46Speaker 03

  Slightly spicy, but you put cheeky chilies in the cucumber salad.

• 45:50Jessie Ware?

  With little green chilies.

• 45:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, thanks darling. I was picking them out.

• 45:54Jessie Ware?

  So you've got a bone to pick with Ben Lippett and Gil Mella.

• 45:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, just a bit spicy for me, but delicious.

• 46:02Jessie Ware?

  You loved Kitty Coles's curried corn ricotta.

• 46:05Speaker 03

  Oh God, I love it.

• 46:05Jessie Ware?

  It's such a good side. God, we've done every, John Gregory Smith with the schmaltzy yoghurt courgette dip. I mean, we've been everywhere.

• 46:15Speaker 03

  We've been everywhere.

• 46:15Jessie Ware?

  I am really hot and I'm a bit tired.

• 46:19Speaker 03

  And James is, and he's really hot.

• 46:22Jessie Ware?

  He is.

• 46:23Speaker 03

  In every sense of the word.

• 46:24Jessie Ware?

  Oh. Yeah. He's a lovely, excellent guest. He's welcome anytime.

• 46:30Speaker 03

  Very well mannered.

• 46:31Jessie Ware?

  Very well mannered. Ate his food, loved it.

• 46:35Speaker 03

  Gorgeous soothing voice.

• 46:38Jessie Ware?

  Yes.

• 46:39Speaker 03

  Went with the selector.

• 46:41Jessie Ware?

  Are you drunk?

• 46:43Speaker 03

  I'm dehydrated, I think.

• 46:45Jessie Ware?

  You can watch James Norton in House of the Dragon now. You can go and see Sunny Dancer. Or you can go and watch Nowhere Special on ITVX. Or you can go and, you know, watch reruns of Happy Valley.

• 46:57Speaker 03

  And Granchester.

• 46:58Jessie Ware?

  And also the tuna with white sauce.

• 47:00Speaker 03

  I know. It sounded revolting.

• 47:03Jessie Ware?

  It did.

• 47:04Speaker 03

  I didn't want to say anything and burst his bubble, but that sounded, I thought, ugh.

• 47:10Jessie Ware?

  No, I can imagine it being kind of comforting.

• 47:12Speaker 03

  For a boy, for a little boy, yeah.

• 47:14Jessie Ware?

  Anyway, I can't speak. And on that note, we thank you for a wonderful season 18. But whilst we are finishing the season, we will be on your airwaves and actually on YouTube with never before seen footage of previous episodes when we didn't, we weren't on YouTube.

• 47:33Speaker 03

  So it's the Table manners picky bits.

• 47:35Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, Table manners picky bits. And you can watch episodes of guests that we filmed, but it may not be as HD as we are now. However, it's never before seen footage. You can see how Zoe Saldana enjoyed those cookies. You can see how hot Will Poulter was throughout the episode. You can see one of our biggest episodes ever, James Corden and Ruth Jones talking about Gavin and Stacey's Christmas special episode. That's on the video too. So we've got everything for you. And we'll be doing that over the summer and then we'll be back with new Table Runners, season 19 in the autumn. Thank you to everyone who's given us their time. Thank you to all of you for listening and watching. And thanks, Lenny, for carrying on doing it.

• 48:21Speaker 03

  What do you mean?

• 48:21Jessie Ware?

  Do you enjoy it still?

• 48:22Speaker 03

  Of course I do.

• 48:23Jessie Ware?

  Oh, okay. Can we get a season 19?

• 48:25Speaker 03

  I think so. I think I've got a couple more seasons in me.

• 48:28Jessie Ware?

  Oh, don't say that.

• 48:29Speaker 03

  Okay, yeah. I did ask the dentist this morning how long my teeth might last. I said I want at least 20 years out of them.

• 48:36Jessie Ware?

  And what did he say?

• 48:37Speaker 03

  He said you'll be all right.

• 48:38Jessie Ware?

  Mum had her teeth done this morning. New veneers?

• 48:41Speaker 03

  No, proud.

• 48:42Jessie Ware?

  Oh.

• 48:43Speaker 03

  Because the veneers came off great.

• 48:45Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, they look good. Thank you, David Guy.

• 48:50Jessie Ware?

  Thank you to Lenny's new teeth. We'll see you next season and

• 48:54Speaker 03

  Have a gorgeous summer.

• 48:55Jessie Ware?

  Yeah, have a gorgeous summer.

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