317 Arianna Huffington on The Science of Sleep and Success

"Sleep is a performance enhancer." - Arianna Huffington If you enjoyed this episode, check out show notes, video, and more at http://lewishowes.com/317 Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 317 with number one New York Times bestselling author, Arianna Huffington.

• 0:09Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:35Lewis Howes?

  Welcome everyone to today's episode. We have a very special guest today. Her name is Arianna Huffington. She's here in the studio in Los Angeles Greatness Studio, and she is the co-founder and president and editor in chief of The Huffington Post Media Group and author of 15 books. She's also been named to Time Magazine's list of the world's 100 Most Influential People and the Forbes Most Powerful Women list. Her 15th book is called The Sleep Revolution: Transforming Your Life One Night at a Time, and it's all on the science, history, and mystery of sleep. And it's just came out in April 2016, and it was an instant New York Times bestseller.

• 1:18Lewis Howes?

  We cover a lot today about sleep, the science behind sleep, and how the recovery is important for athletes when you sleep, how mental and emotional issues are linked to sleep deprivation, what the most important thing you can do before you go to bed, Arianna's ideal nightly routine to do before going to sleep, how drowsy driving is killing more people than drunk driving, and so much more in this powerful interview. If you enjoy this interview, if you're listening to it right now, make sure to share it out with your friends, lewishowes.com/317 to have them listen along. Post it on Twitter, Facebook, and make sure to tag Arianna Huffington on Twitter and Facebook as well.

• 2:03Lewis Howes?

  I hope you guys enjoy this one. Make sure to dive in, take notes, and stay awake on episode number 317 with the one, the only, Arianna Huffington.

• 2:19Lewis Howes?

  Welcome back everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. Very excited about our guest. Her name is Arianna Huffington and she's got a new book out called The Sleep Revolution: Transforming Your Life One Night at a Time. Make sure to go grab the book right now. Thank you so much for being here.

• 2:32Arianna Huffington?

  Thank you so much for having me.

• 2:34Lewis Howes?

  I'm really excited. We got a chance to do an interview about a year ago, I think it was. And we only had about 15 minutes, so now we have a little more time. I'm excited to actually dive in and talk more about the power of sleep, but also why you started getting into sleep, why it's important to enhance your performance for athletes, also for entrepreneurs, also for busy moms who say they have no time, why it's important for everyone. So first off, thank you for being here. And second off, let me get a question out of the way. You sold a company, Huffington Post, to AOL, right?

• 3:08Arianna Huffington?

  Right.

• 3:09Lewis Howes?

  And I think that number was 315 million, is that correct? Now, during the time you were building this company, you didn't sleep much, from what I remember, right?

• 3:17Arianna Huffington?

  The first two years.

• 3:18Lewis Howes?

  First two years, okay.

• 3:19Arianna Huffington?

  Because we launched the Huffington Post in 2005, and in April 2007, I collapsed from sleep deprivation and exhaustion and hit my head on my desk and broke my cheekbone.

• 3:35Lewis Howes?

  In the middle of the day?

• 3:36Arianna Huffington?

  In the morning, actually.

• 3:38Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 3:39Arianna Huffington?

  Not even in the middle of the day. And that was the beginning of my starting on this journey of reevaluating my life, of looking at what were the things I needed to change in my life. And for me, the keystone habit, you know, that I changed and everything else became easier was sleep. I went from four to five hours to eight hours, 95% of the time. You know, I'm a work in progress, I'm not perfect. And I suddenly sort of started looking around and seeing that I was not alone, that millions of people were burnt out.

• 4:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 4:19Arianna Huffington?

  And that we are living in a culture which is fueled by burnout. And it's kind of amazing because the new science now is so conclusive that sleep is a performance enhancer, that everything in our lives gets better, our productivity, our health, our relationships, our happiness.

• 4:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 4:46Arianna Huffington?

  Why is it so hard for us to actually do something that is free and available to us? And I think that's partly because we've created this culture, mostly created by you guys, not you personally, but man, you know, that basically wears this sleep deprivation like a badge of honor. Like I'm too busy and too important to sleep, or I'll sleep when I'm dead, or you snooze, you lose, you know, all these things. And basically, they're all wrong.

• 5:18Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it's kind of interesting. It's kind of like the food industry in a sense where they're, they told us to, you know, the breads and grains and milks and all these things were actually good for us. But now the science is like, well, actually, that's what's causing all the cancer or making you exhausted. It's like the gluten dairy or whatever. So it's kind of like we have to relearn.

• 5:38Arianna Huffington?

  And even if you go further back, you know, it's kind of amazing to look at some of the ads in the 1950s by doctors selling cigarettes.

• 5:49Lewis Howes?

  Right, of course.

• 5:50Arianna Huffington?

  And you had like literally doctors in white coats saying, menthol cigarettes, refresh your throat, it can give you cancer. But so, yes, it's like we often live under false assumptions. Modern science has disproven them. This has been the golden age of scientific findings around sleep. And it's very recent. The first scientific sleep center was founded in 1970 at Stanford. Another 2,500 around the states.

• 6:24Lewis Howes?

  What's a sleep center?

• 6:25Arianna Huffington?

  Basically, they all, they studied different aspects of sleep. What happens to the brain? At Stanford, Sherry Ma studied sports and sleep. And she was the one who became the pioneer of proving that sleep was a legal performance enhancer without negative side effects. And so you have Andre Gudala, for example, who had such a fantastic year despite his injury.

• 6:54Lewis Howes?

  Can I just see a photo with you and him?

• 6:55Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, I interviewed him at Stanford, the Golden State Warriors MVP. Absolutely.

• 7:03Arianna Huffington?

  considers his sleep what got him the MVP title.

• 7:07Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 7:08Arianna Huffington?

  And and he's kind of so disciplined about it. I mean, I talked to his wife to, you know, the getting his eight hours, no screens or TV in the bedroom. Temperature at sixty seven degrees, everything dark, you know. All the things that I include in the book, all the tips and techniques of how to get a great night's sleep. And he's practicing and when he's on the road. Uh, making sure that he has as many of these things available to him.

• 7:36Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 7:36Arianna Huffington?

  So that he can actually get the restorative sleep that makes him better on the court.

• 7:42Lewis Howes?

  What's the science behind recovering the muscles with whatever it is, seven or eight hours of sleep with a cool temperature, the blackout, you know, calming the mind? What's the science behind that? What do doctors or scientists say about how it actually enhances the muscles or the heart or the brain or all the things?

• 7:58Arianna Huffington?

  Well, it enhances everything, both the physical body that needs that recovery time. In fact, the more intensely you work out, the more essential the recovery time is for the body.

• 8:09Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 8:09Arianna Huffington?

  But also what happens to the brain? Because as you know, being an athlete yourself, winning is not just a function of your muscles. It's also a function of your brain.

• 8:19Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 8:20Arianna Huffington?

  And and I talk in the book about how if you miss a shot. Or you make a mistake, which every athlete does in the course of a game.

• 8:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 8:31Arianna Huffington?

  If you actually keep replaying that in your head while the game is going on, that's a recipe for disaster. And if you're sleep deprived, you are more likely to dwell on your failures, to dwell on your fears and anxieties. I mean, whether you're an athlete or a busy mom, you know, you're more likely to be irritable and cranky. And. All the things that make life much harder are aggravated when you're sleep deprived.

• 9:01Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it has a lot to do with meditation too, you know, when we, when we don't meditate and we don't, we're not being mindful, we are more irritated, we're more stressed out.

• 9:09Arianna Huffington?

  Absolutely.

• 9:09Lewis Howes?

  We're not recovering, we're not relaxing the mind and the body. I think sleep and meditation go hand in hand. Do you meditate as well?

• 9:15Arianna Huffington?

  I do meditate, yes, and I, and I love my meditation.

• 9:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 9:20Arianna Huffington?

  But the thing about sleep is whether you meditate or not, whether you work out or not, everybody has to sleep.

• 9:27Lewis Howes?

  Right, exactly.

• 9:28Arianna Huffington?

  So everybody has a relationship with sleep.

• 9:31Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 9:31Arianna Huffington?

  So the question is, how can we make this relationship the best it can be? So that every other aspect of our life is enhanced.

• 9:39Lewis Howes?

  Do you feel like, um, you know, in two thousand, it was two thousand seven, two thousand five to two thousand seven, you said you started to realize that you were like crashing and all these things were happening, right?

• 9:47Arianna Huffington?

  Well, I didn't actually realize until I collapsed.

• 9:49Lewis Howes?

  Till you collapsed, two thousand seven, right?

• 9:51Arianna Huffington?

  That's what I said, that's what is so interesting.

• 9:53Lewis Howes?

  How many years were you kind of living this lifestyle of not paying attention to your sleep?

• 9:58Arianna Huffington?

  Well, it would, it would come and go.

• 10:00Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 10:00Arianna Huffington?

  You know, I'm, I started as I write in the book about how I was brought up by a mother who revered sleep in a one-bedroom apartment in Athens, Greece.

• 10:11Lewis Howes?

  She wanted to sleep all the time?

• 10:12Arianna Huffington?

  No, no, not at all. She just, she just brought us up believing that if we get enough sleep, we're going to be better at school.

• 10:21Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 10:21Arianna Huffington?

  And we're going to be happier.

• 10:23Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 10:23Arianna Huffington?

  And in fact, she kind of knew that, um, because we all wanted to maintain our weight or lose weight, depending on the time, this was a great way to do that. She, she wasn't a scientist, but the modern science now validates

• 10:37Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 10:37Arianna Huffington?

  that if you want to lose weight.

• 10:39Lewis Howes?

  Sleep more.

• 10:40Arianna Huffington?

  Sleep enough, you know, it's not about more.

• 10:42Lewis Howes?

  Got you.

• 10:43Arianna Huffington?

  Actually, what is interesting, modern science tells us you cannot oversleep, unless you're an alcoholic or suffering from severe depression. If you're just, um, Just going on about your life.

• 10:55Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 10:56Arianna Huffington?

  Your body wakes you up when it's fully recharged.

• 10:59Lewis Howes?

  You can't oversleep? If you oversleep, does it hurt you? If you get 12 hours of sleep?

• 11:03Arianna Huffington?

  No, if you get 12 hours of sleep, you're probably making up some sleep deficit.

• 11:07Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha, okay.

• 11:08Arianna Huffington?

  You know, once you've paid your sleep deficit and you are in a regular routine, your body will naturally wake you up.

• 11:16Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha, okay. Interesting. So your mom kind of had this intuition.

• 11:20Arianna Huffington?

  So my mom had that intuition and brought us up like that. But then, when I went to England to get my degree and then to New York, I just bought into the prevailing culture.

• 11:33Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 11:34Arianna Huffington?

  Which was that.

• 11:35Lewis Howes?

  The driven mindset.

• 11:36Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, that if you're going to succeed, yes, then you need to sacrifice sleep. And really, now for me, it's a little bit like choosing to get to your destination in a broken-down truck. You know, or a gas-gasling car.

• 11:55Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 11:55Arianna Huffington?

  Instead of a Tesla.

• 11:58Lewis Howes?

  Teslas run so smooth.

• 11:59Arianna Huffington?

  I mean, when you are fully recharged, it's like there you are in your Tesla, going to your destination faster, more efficiently, and also enjoying the journey.

• 12:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 12:13Arianna Huffington?

  So, that's why I've become such a sleep evangelist. And this crusade that we've launched, the book is one part of it, but we're taking the book and the Sleep Revolution to 100 colleges.

• 12:26Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 12:27Arianna Huffington?

  To convince millennials of the importance of sleep.

• 12:31Lewis Howes?

  Are you seeing that a lot of millennials are not sleeping? That they still have this pull-all-nighter mentality like in college, you know, for finals and tests?

• 12:40Arianna Huffington?

  Oh, absolutely, yes. It's happening and with huge and dangerous consequences. And that's what I wanted, I structured the book, so you start with the crisis and give people an overview of how dangerous sleep deprivation is, how prevalent it is, and how it's also at the heart of a lot of mental health issues.

• 13:00Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 13:01Arianna Huffington?

  Like people who are depressed or anxious.

• 13:05Arianna Huffington?

  At the heart of it is sleep deprivation.

• 13:07Lewis Howes?

  So they're linking the diseases that we're having, just the mental, emotional diseases?

• 13:11Arianna Huffington?

  The mental and the physical, obviously.

• 13:15Arianna Huffington?

  Sleep deprivation is directly linked to obesity, diabetes.

• 13:21Arianna Huffington?

  hypertension and heart disease, even cancer, and definitely Alzheimer's.

• 13:26Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 13:27Arianna Huffington?

  Uh huh. Because when we, I mean, when we sleep is the time when our brain washes away, you know, the toxins that have built during the day.

• 13:38Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Is it, is it more powerful to have vivid dreams or to not dream at all? Is there a difference as a matter?

• 13:46Arianna Huffington?

  Much more powerful obviously to remember your dreams because it means you're getting enough sleep.

• 13:51Lewis Howes?

  If you remember them.

• 13:52Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah.

• 13:52Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 13:52Arianna Huffington?

  If you are sleep deprived, you are much less likely to remember your dreams.

• 13:56Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 13:56Arianna Huffington?

  And I have a whole section on dreams and it's a, dreams are a great source of insights.

• 14:02Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 14:03Arianna Huffington?

  A lot of inventors have come up with their inventions in dreams.

• 14:06Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 14:06Arianna Huffington?

  Larry Page came up with the idea for Google.

• 14:10Lewis Howes?

  In a dream?

• 14:10Arianna Huffington?

  In a dream.

• 14:12Lewis Howes?

  Wow, okay.

• 14:13Arianna Huffington?

  And Paul McCartney came up with Let It Be in a dream. All the lyrics were written in the dream.

• 14:20Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 14:21Arianna Huffington?

  So whatever it is you're doing, um.

• 14:24Lewis Howes?

  But you're saying if we're not sleeping well, then we're not gonna have dreams we can remember? Or maybe there'll be more nightmares than dreams?

• 14:29Arianna Huffington?

  Well, then you're much less likely to remember them.

• 14:32Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha.

• 14:32Arianna Huffington?

  If you're not sleeping well.

• 14:33Lewis Howes?

  And do we know, and maybe, maybe we're not aware of this, but do we know about why we have nightmares and why we have positive dreams?

• 14:41Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah, I mean, the basically, um, dreaming is a time when we either process a lot of the incomplete emotions of the day. And or we process our anxieties about the future or the um, more insightful dreams that tap into our wisdom. So it depends, you know, it's the whole gamma. That's what I love about my sleep time now, that you, I go to sleep and and I don't know what the movie is going to be tonight.

• 15:12Lewis Howes?

  Right, exactly.

• 15:13Arianna Huffington?

  But it's, so it's a little bit like rekindling the romance with sleep.

• 15:16Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 15:17Arianna Huffington?

  But I wanted first to convince people of why it is important.

• 15:21Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 15:21Arianna Huffington?

  I think we are so data driven.

• 15:24Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 15:24Arianna Huffington?

  And the science chapter gives you all the data you want to really believe it's important.

• 15:29Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 15:30Arianna Huffington?

  And after you believe it's important. And, and after we go through the history chapter that shows you why we started devaluing sleep in the first industrial revolution when we thought human beings could be like machines and minimize downtime. Then you have the. Second half of the book, which is all about how to.

• 15:51Lewis Howes?

  How to maximize it, yeah.

• 15:53Arianna Huffington?

  How to maximize your performance, how to maximize your sleep. And there are tons of tips.

• 16:03Lewis Howes?

  Right, and resources.

• 16:04Arianna Huffington?

  Resources, exactly. But for me, the key, the most important thing, if you're going to do one thing, it's to turn off all your devices.

• 16:14Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 16:15Arianna Huffington?

  And start with five minutes before you're going to turn off the lights. You know, just have a little demarcation line between your day, life, and your sleep.

• 16:28Lewis Howes?

  Right. Why is that important to turn off the screens and TVs?

• 16:31Arianna Huffington?

  Because otherwise, what happens is our bodies may be exhausted, but our minds remain in a stimulated mode. You know, blue light stimulates the brain. But also, beyond the blue light, it's just that we haven't given our brains some opportunity to power down.

• 16:50Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 16:50Arianna Huffington?

  And that's what wakes people up in the middle of the night. And even if they go to sleep, because they're physically exhausted, their brains wake them up with whatever it is they haven't processed, you know, the mind chatter.

• 17:03Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:03Arianna Huffington?

  So I think what is key is to have a little transition to sleep. And it can be a really simple and short transition. Mine is about thirty minutes now. But it can, I believe in microscopic steps. You know how it is, you build habits with very small.

• 17:22Lewis Howes?

  I'll try to do this big jump at the same time.

• 17:24Arianna Huffington?

  Don't try to, yeah, make the big jump. Just little things that you can stick to.

• 17:28Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:29Arianna Huffington?

  And then, little by little, the kind of person that you become when you are fully recharged becomes like a magnet.

• 17:37Lewis Howes?

  And you want it all the time.

• 17:38Arianna Huffington?

  I want to be that person. I don't like now, I don't like myself when I'm the other kind of person.

• 17:44Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:45Arianna Huffington?

  When I'm sleep deprived, when I'm irritable, when I... You tell me something and I get upset or

• 17:52Lewis Howes?

  Or you're just slow or whatever.

• 17:53Arianna Huffington?

  Oh, yes, you you make mistakes, you know, you you're not as sharp in every possible way.

• 17:59Lewis Howes?

  Is it, I mean, I've never been drunk and I've never been hungover. I've never gone that far and I'm curious, is being sleep deprived, I've been sleep deprived, is it feel like you're hungover in the morning? Is that what it feels like?

• 18:12Arianna Huffington?

  It feels like you're hangover and also in terms of your, the physical changes, the cognitive changes, scientists have found that it is actually absolutely equivalent. So they have found that if you're up seventeen to nineteen hours, which is not abnormal for a lot of us.

• 18:32Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 18:33Arianna Huffington?

  You're not legally drunk, but you're close to being drunk. Yes, and if you're up for twenty four hours, then you are legally drunk.

• 18:43Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 18:43Arianna Huffington?

  Yes.

• 18:43Lewis Howes?

  Okay, so maybe I've been drunk by being sleep deprived. In another way. Yeah, in another way. One, okay, so tell me if it's like, obviously, we're not perfect and we try to do things.

• 18:52Arianna Huffington?

  Right, we're all works in progress.

• 18:54Lewis Howes?

  We're all work in progress, but let's say it's like you get a chance to have the perfect night's sleep. Like you get a night that's like, I'm gonna follow every habit that I talk about. I'm gonna like set everything up beautifully, I'm gonna have flowers on the pillowcases, whatever it is.

• 19:09Arianna Huffington?

  Right.

• 19:10Lewis Howes?

  What would be the ideal routine for you in terms of going to bed and then waking up?

• 19:15Arianna Huffington?

  Great, I love that. So I'll give you my routine, I'll give you my nightly ritual. But what I recommend for everybody watching is to create your own ritual. I mean, it's almost like I give you a menu and you need to experiment and see what is it that does it for you.

• 19:34Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 19:35Arianna Huffington?

  For me, it's like thirty minutes before I'm going to go to sleep, turning off all my devices and gently escorting them out of the bedroom.

• 19:43Lewis Howes?

  Escorting them out.

• 19:45Arianna Huffington?

  They'll be there in the morning.

• 19:46Lewis Howes?

  You put them on a horse.

• 19:47Arianna Huffington?

  You put them in their little homes outside the bedroom. Turning off the lights, you know, the bright lights, making it sort of. I just have one nightstand light and one light in the bathroom. Then having a really, really hot, wonderful bath.

• 20:04Lewis Howes?

  Really? One bath?

• 20:05Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah, with Epsom salts, which are very relaxing and flickering candles. But if you guys don't like baths, have a shower.

• 20:13Lewis Howes?

  I don't like baths.

• 20:14Arianna Huffington?

  Okay.

• 20:14Lewis Howes?

  I've got one, I've never used it, yeah.

• 20:16Arianna Huffington?

  You're gonna have a shower.

• 20:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and hot is better than cold.

• 20:19Arianna Huffington?

  Oh, yeah, you're basically, you basically want to slow down your brain and soothe your muscles, you know, everything is like powering you down.

• 20:31Lewis Howes?

  I guess when you're going to a hot tub late at night, I always feel ready to sleep.

• 20:34Arianna Huffington?

  Exactly, you feel, exactly, the hot tub is a perfect.

• 20:38Lewis Howes?

  To do a hot tub, do you have a hot tub?

• 20:39Arianna Huffington?

  If you have a hot tub, go to a hot tub. I don't have a hot tub, so I do the bath. And then, put on, if you, if you sleep naked, you sleep naked. But if you wear PJs or a nightdress or whatever, make sure that you wear clothes for bed. I used to sleep in my gym clothes.

• 21:02Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 21:02Arianna Huffington?

  And then your brain gets these confusing messages, you know.

• 21:05Lewis Howes?

  It's supposed to go workout.

• 21:06Arianna Huffington?

  Are we powering down? So even if you're a t-shirt, make sure it's not a t-shirt, you are to the gym. And then, in bed, I only read physical books. I don't read anything on screens. And anybody who is reading The Sleep Revolution in bed, I will consider it a personal victory if you actually fall asleep while reading it.

• 21:29Lewis Howes?

  Read twenty pages a night, fall asleep.

• 21:32Arianna Huffington?

  Whatever, ten pages, you get drowsy, you let the book drop, you turn off the light, you're asleep. So that is incredibly important for those who have children. You know that that's how you put your child to bed. You don't just drop your child in bed, you.

• 21:49Lewis Howes?

  Read to them.

• 21:50Arianna Huffington?

  You read, you give them a bath, you put them in the PJs, you read to them, you kind of transition. You know, it's like the goodnight moon. You say goodnight to everything, which is really a demarcation line. Between your day with all its stresses, however blessed our lives may be, every day has stresses, challenges, difficult things and incompletions. There's nobody who has any interesting job or is a busy mom, who finishes the day and says, "I did absolutely everything."

• 22:23Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it's always something that.

• 22:24Arianna Huffington?

  That was on my list or I should have done. Never.

• 22:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 22:29Arianna Huffington?

  So you need to somehow tell your brain and your body, "We did what we did."

• 22:35Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 22:35Arianna Huffington?

  This day. And now the day has come to a close. And we need to fully.

• 22:44Lewis Howes?

  Cross the line, right?

• 22:45Arianna Huffington?

  Recharge, cross the line. We need to cross that line.

• 22:48Lewis Howes?

  Not be in bed on the screen, thinking about work and then trying to sleep at the same time. Creating a cutoff line.

• 22:53Arianna Huffington?

  I just really, I wish I could sort of convey that feeling that I absolutely totally believe now to everybody watching, because I promise that if you do this, every aspect of your life will improve.

• 23:10Arianna Huffington?

  If you have any lingering doubt that you're not going to be as productive, just try it.

• 23:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 23:16Arianna Huffington?

  Because it's like getting in the Tesla. You're going to get to your destination faster.

• 23:20Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 23:21Arianna Huffington?

  Right?

• 23:21Lewis Howes?

  Smoother.

• 23:22Arianna Huffington?

  Smoother.

• 23:22Lewis Howes?

  Cleaner.

• 23:23Arianna Huffington?

  With kind of consuming less energy.

• 23:26Lewis Howes?

  Yes, yeah.

• 23:28Arianna Huffington?

  And also the advantage of kind of energy that is self-renewing is a little bit like the self-renewing energy of sleep.

• 23:41Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. Why reading a book before night? Why would that? I would think that would be like you're still turning your brain on.

• 23:48Arianna Huffington?

  Well, it depends on what you're reading. You see, I don't read anything that has to do with work or media or politics. You know, I read poetry. I read novels, not even modern novels. I like to read like Jane Austen or Another World.

• 24:03Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 24:04Arianna Huffington?

  And you read it, but you're not really trying to figure out their problems.

• 24:09Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure, sure. Yeah, yeah, okay. I love it. And what about watching movies before bed?

• 24:15Arianna Huffington?

  No.

• 24:16Lewis Howes?

  Don't do that.

• 24:17Arianna Huffington?

  No, it's still, no.

• 24:19Lewis Howes?

  No movies?

• 24:20Arianna Huffington?

  No movies, no screens.

• 24:22Lewis Howes?

  What about if you watch it before thirty minutes is up?

• 24:23Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, that's fine, no problem.

• 24:25Lewis Howes?

  You can watch a movie and then thirty minutes, get ready for it.

• 24:27Arianna Huffington?

  Exactly, you got it, very good.

• 24:28Lewis Howes?

  So don't lay in bed with the TV on and like pass out.

• 24:31Arianna Huffington?

  Exactly, that's what happens. A lot of people pass out and and what happens then often is that the TV stays on and then it wakes them up.

• 24:40Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:41Arianna Huffington?

  And then you're suddenly waking up by a noise and the minute you're waking up abruptly, your body moves into a fight or flight mode.

• 24:50Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm, yeah.

• 24:51Arianna Huffington?

  And cortisol, the stress hormone floods your body and there you are again, much harder to fall asleep.

• 24:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah. Now, I understand the importance of sleep. I practice a lot of stuff. I'm good friends with Sean Stevenson. I've had him on, you know, I'm applying all the principles, so I get it, right? As an athlete, I get it. As a business person, I get it, but let's talk about for entrepreneurs who, you know, they're striving to build their business. They are struggling to make money, so they've got to put overtime in. That overtime turns into many nights and months and months, and then they drive their team to say, "You've got to stay later. You've got to work harder because we've got to make money." You know, we can't just work for free here. Uh, so, did you ever, after you started transitioning, helping to post into, okay, it's important to sleep. We've got sleep pods here, which I know I've been in your office and seen them, and you, you talk about the importance of it, but

• 25:42Lewis Howes?

  there are times in our business that we've got to drive forward. We've got our product to launch. We've got to get traffic up, something, and we've got to push people a little harder probably. There's, it's not going to be perfect balance all the time. Would you agree?

• 25:54Arianna Huffington?

  Well, it's never about, I don't like the word balance because our lives are not really about balance. It's all about integration for me.

• 26:01Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 26:01Arianna Huffington?

  And, um, what it means, if your everyday routine includes getting adequate sleep, when you have, um, a sick child. A big deadline, then you have some reserves to tap into. Life is always going to throw you curveballs. Where you have to stay up all night or something happens. I'm not suggesting this won't happen. But what has happened in our culture is we've made that the norm.

• 26:30Lewis Howes?

  The pro- yeah, the main thing.

• 26:31Arianna Huffington?

  And, and that's really the problem. And I think that's why I'm stressing that people need to understand that if all you care in life is about winning, then you're going to improve your chances when you're fully recharged. Because that's when you're going to make your best decisions. That's when you're going to be able to see the icebergs before they hit the Titanic, the Titanic, which is a very important thing for entrepreneurs. And look at entrepreneurs now. I was in Silicon Valley this week, three quarters of startups fail. And there is the myth of the entrepreneur who never sleeps, stays up all night. Well, maybe there's a correlation.

• 27:14Lewis Howes?

  Why you're failing.

• 27:15Arianna Huffington?

  Between sleep deprivation and three quarters of them failing.

• 27:17Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 27:18Arianna Huffington?

  And I was speaking at the Stan- at the Stanford Business School. And the students there, the, the MBA students were telling me how, how many of them have meningitis or whooping cough or all these diseases which are signs of a suppressed immune system.

• 27:37Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 27:38Arianna Huffington?

  Because you're burnt out. So in the end, it's not even as though you're more productive because you end up being in bed sick.

• 27:45Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 27:46Arianna Huffington?

  Instead of being in bed because you're recharging.

• 27:50Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure. I want to ask a couple of personal questions, if that's okay with you.

• 27:54Arianna Huffington?

  Sure.

• 27:55Lewis Howes?

  You know, you've had a lot of success. You're in the media all the time. You are media with Huffington Post. You're asked to speak, you know, number one, you're timed by selling books. Do you have any fears of the future? It seems like you've achieved so much and you've helped so, served so many people with your message and your work. Do you have any fears or insecurities about the future?

• 28:16Arianna Huffington?

  My fears have a lot to do with my daughters.

• 28:18Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 28:19Arianna Huffington?

  And I'm working on them.

• 28:20Lewis Howes?

  Okay, how many daughters do you have again?

• 28:21Arianna Huffington?

  Two.

• 28:22Lewis Howes?

  Two daughters, right.

• 28:23Arianna Huffington?

  In their twenties, twenty-four and twenty-six.

• 28:25Lewis Howes?

  I see you posting photos of them all the time.

• 28:27Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, I know. I adore them. And, um, and I tend to very easily move into negative fantasies. If, let's say, I text one of my daughters and I don't get a response within three and a half seconds.

• 28:40Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 28:43Lewis Howes?

  She always like that?

• 28:45Arianna Huffington?

  So I think working on that is very important for me. You know, we all have areas where we're more vulnerable.

• 28:51Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 28:52Arianna Huffington?

  And, and that's one of them.

• 28:54Lewis Howes?

  Can I ask why?

• 28:55Arianna Huffington?

  Well, my oldest daughter went through, um, a drug period. She's now been sober for four years. But I think that maybe has exacerbated. But also, whatever the reason, you know, fears are so irrational. I mean, I have a friend of mine who's incredibly successful. And she thinks she's going to end up a bag lady.

• 29:16Lewis Howes?

  A bag lady.

• 29:17Arianna Huffington?

  A bag lady in the streets.

• 29:18Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 29:19Arianna Huffington?

  Homeless in the streets.

• 29:20Lewis Howes?

  Right, she's incredibly successful.

• 29:22Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah, she's incredibly successful, incredibly wealthy, and you think,

• 29:27Arianna Huffington?

  yeah, sure, maybe all of us will end up in the streets, but the chances, you know.

• 29:31Lewis Howes?

  Right, slim.

• 29:32Arianna Huffington?

  And are slim, so.

• 29:34Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 29:35Arianna Huffington?

  So I think, but again, going back to what I said earlier, it's kind of amazing how exacerbated these irrational fears become when you're sleep deprived. Whatever they are.

• 29:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 29:47Arianna Huffington?

  Much more so.

• 29:48Lewis Howes?

  You're already scared about things, you're more scared, right?

• 29:50Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, about whatever it is that you're scared about, suddenly that seems more, the fear seems much more real.

• 29:58Lewis Howes?

  It's real, yeah, interesting, okay. Do you have any other fears? Was it just with daughters?

• 30:02Arianna Huffington?

  That's kind of my main fear, yeah.

• 30:04Lewis Howes?

  Okay, that's good. It's not that big of an issue there.

• 30:06Arianna Huffington?

  Well, it is when you're in the grip of it.

• 30:08Lewis Howes?

  That's true, it's pretty nice. What is next for you? What's the big vision? I mean, you've, again, accomplished so much.

• 30:15Arianna Huffington?

  Well, right now, kind of the, the big vision for me is wanting to change the culture. You know, changing culture is not easy, right?

• 30:23Lewis Howes?

  It's challenging.

• 30:24Arianna Huffington?

  And so for me, it requires like a critical mass. And once that we attain that critical mass, then suddenly people will look around and say, Can you believe that we slept for four hours and we thought this was more productive? People are going to say, can you believe how we used to live? And I want to see that. And that's why this campaign is multipronged. You know, there's the book, there is the college outreach. There is a partnership we launched with Uber against drowsy driving. Because drowsy driving now is killing more people than drunk driving.

• 31:05Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 31:05Arianna Huffington?

  Because, you know, since the eighties.

• 31:07Lewis Howes?

  Truck drivers, who was.

• 31:09Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah, what happened is that since the eighties, we dramatically increased awareness around drunk driving. So people are much more conscious. Deaths and crashes from drunk driving have been halved.

• 31:21Lewis Howes?

  Wow, since the eighties.

• 31:22Arianna Huffington?

  Since the eighties. Because, you know, the whole Designated Driver campaign, Friends Don't Let Friends Drive Drunk. It has worked.

• 31:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 31:31Arianna Huffington?

  So we are launching a similar campaign for tired driving. Because while people are, unless they're paralytically drunk, you know, conscious of being drunk. And people are not always aware of being exhausted, or they think they can power through. And we have a very powerful PSA, we'll send it to you.

• 31:53Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 31:54Arianna Huffington?

  That shows a man in a wheelchair for life, a young man in his twenties, who fell asleep at the wheel and his whole life was changed, and it's very powerful. And a woman who was being driven, Amy Caddy, who's at Harvard, the brilliant woman.

• 32:12Lewis Howes?

  Amy Caddy, right, the body language.

• 32:14Arianna Huffington?

  Yes. So she ended up having to relearn everything because of that accident. And she talks about that. So she said, she says in the PSA, I lost ten years of my life. So, and these are like two young, smart people. And who just made-

• 32:35Lewis Howes?

  From one simple decision.

• 32:35Arianna Huffington?

  One simple decision, literally, micro-sleep, they call it, can be two seconds.

• 32:41Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 32:42Arianna Huffington?

  And everything changes. But since then, since we launched this campaign, I've had, I've had two mothers who came to me. One of them who works at Accenture, has a big job there, and she said, "I changed my life and my relationship to sleep when I, I had my two children, young children, in the car." And I, I kind of-

• 33:04Lewis Howes?

  Dozed off.

• 33:05Arianna Huffington?

  Dozed off, yeah, and, and, and crossed the barrier towards incoming traffic.

• 33:11Lewis Howes?

  With kids in the back.

• 33:12Arianna Huffington?

  With kids in the back.

• 33:12Lewis Howes?

  Oh my goodness.

• 33:13Arianna Huffington?

  So, but these things happen.

• 33:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 33:16Arianna Huffington?

  They happen, all the time. Eight thousand people died last year. And one million, two crashes. So we launched a petition, we'd love everybody to go take, um, on change.org.

• 33:28Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 33:29Arianna Huffington?

  And it's very simple, it says, "I pledge not to drive drowsy, and not to let my friends drive drowsy." And now, with ride-sharing technologies like Uber, it's much easier.

• 33:40Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 33:41Arianna Huffington?

  Wherever you are, you can call an Uber.

• 33:44Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, exactly. Awesome.

• 33:45Arianna Huffington?

  And-

• 33:46Lewis Howes?

  We'll have that linked, we'll have that linked up below, I'll get the information.

• 33:48Arianna Huffington?

  Fantastic, great, thank you.

• 33:50Lewis Howes?

  Who was the most influential person in your life growing up?

• 33:53Arianna Huffington?

  Oh, definitely my mom.

• 33:55Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 33:55Arianna Huffington?

  Yeah. Because she totally, um, made me believe that it was okay to aim for the stars, and if I failed, it didn't matter. She wouldn't love me any less, and that failure is not the opposite of success. She used to say, "It's a stepping stone to success." And, um, and, and that's why I think it's been easier for me to take big risks, like launching the Huffington Post. And, uh-

• 34:27Arianna Huffington?

  And kind of

• 34:28Lewis Howes?

  Going for it.

• 34:29Arianna Huffington?

  Going for it. And you know, you never, there are no guarantees, right? Whatever we do. I must remember one more thing to tell you. Which is that you were asking me about my night ritual. So I have created the sleep paradise in my bedroom in New York. And in terms of the low lights and the completely dark room and the temperature and the flowers and the

• 34:55Lewis Howes?

  The plants.

• 34:56Arianna Huffington?

  The plants and the, and the a real alarm clock, you know, rather than I use an old fashioned round.

• 35:05Lewis Howes?

  Opposed to your phone.

• 35:06Arianna Huffington?

  Alarm clock as opposed to your phone and everything, all that. And so I have put my apartment on Airbnb.

• 35:14Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 35:15Arianna Huffington?

  And anybody can win a night at my apartment. It doesn't cost anything. You just have to participate in the contest, which is to write a short essay, under five hundred and fifty words, about what would your day be like if you had gotten a great night's sleep the night before. And Virgin Air is going to fly the winner to New York.

• 35:43Lewis Howes?

  To your place.

• 35:44Arianna Huffington?

  Yes, and I will have ready a fabulous Greek dinner.

• 35:49Lewis Howes?

  There you go.

• 35:50Arianna Huffington?

  With all natural ingredients. Now, none of the foods I write about that make it harder to sleep. I'll give them a personal sleep consultation and then I will leave them alone with their house ground rules about sleep. And the next morning, we'll have hair and makeup for them so they can go on Half Coast Rise, which is our morning show, to talk about the experience.

• 36:13Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. So what do they need to do?

• 36:15Arianna Huffington?

  That's all. Just go to Airbnb.

• 36:18Lewis Howes?

  Where do they submit?

• 36:19Arianna Huffington?

  Ariana's Paradise, it's called. Ariana's Sleep Paradise and submit their essay. You know, just, it can be anything. It can be fifty words. It can be.

• 36:29Lewis Howes?

  We'll have it linked up here for people as well below. I love that.

• 36:31Arianna Huffington?

  So you see, we're approaching it from every angle. Uber, Airbnb, colleges.

• 36:38Lewis Howes?

  Yes, books, everything.

• 36:39Arianna Huffington?

  Books, everything.

• 36:40Lewis Howes?

  I love it. Final two questions. What do you think was your biggest failure before Huffington Post that actually taught you the biggest lesson for Huffington Post?

• 36:51Arianna Huffington?

  I would say my second book,

• 36:55Arianna Huffington?

  which was rejected by thirty-six publishers. Now, you're a writer. So imagine getting thirty-six rejections. That's harsh, right? It made me question whether I was really a writer or whether my first book was a fluke.

• 37:12Arianna Huffington?

  And fortunately,

• 37:17Arianna Huffington?

  I walked into a bank in London, where I lived at the time, and asked the manager for a loan. And the manager gave it to me. I had no assets. So, you know, in life, often there are kind of amazing things that happen along the way. And that's one of the things that actually might be a good place to end. Because I feel that one of the things, people who are very sort of type A personalities, like I think I am and I think you are, think that we make everything happen. But in fact, I have learned that life is more of a dance between making it happen and letting it happen. And so rekindling our romance with sleep

• 38:01Arianna Huffington?

  is a little bit like letting good things happen. And not thinking that we need to be awake the whole time and make everything happen. Because that's not how life works.

• 38:10Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure. I love that, I love that. Well, I have two, actually, two final questions for you. I'd love to end it there, but I've got two final ones. Because I have a ritual at the end of every one of my interviews. So my last couple of questions is, what are you most grateful for in your life recently?

• 38:25Arianna Huffington?

  So I'm actually very grateful for my accident in 2007. I seriously think I would be either dead or with a heart attack. And if you look around, look at 2015, the number of entrepreneurs and executives who collapsed on their treadmills or on stages. You know, the CEO of United collapsed and ended up with a big heart attack.

• 38:48Lewis Howes?

  Really, wow.

• 38:49Arianna Huffington?

  The CEO of BMW collapsed on stage.

• 38:53Arianna Huffington?

  The head of M and A at JB Morgan collapsed on his treadmill and died. And that's kind of interesting because it's convinced people of the importance of exercise and nutrition. But sleep is the other leg of the stool. And so you have these exhausted executives.

• 39:12Lewis Howes?

  Who's training harder and harder.

• 39:13Arianna Huffington?

  Training harder and harder, who are no sleep.

• 39:16Lewis Howes?

  They're gonna collapse.

• 39:16Arianna Huffington?

  And they don't realize what, how they're hurting themselves.

• 39:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, wow.

• 39:21Arianna Huffington?

  So that's, well, you know how they say there are hidden blessings? So that was a hidden blessing.

• 39:26Lewis Howes?

  Yes, okay.

• 39:29Lewis Howes?

  This is a question I ask at the end, and I didn't prep Ariana on this, but this is a question I ask at the end for all the guests. So whatever comes up for you, feel free.

• 39:38Lewis Howes?

  Let's say it's many years from now, and all your books have been erased, everything you've created is gone, for whatever reason. But it's, it's the last day for you, and everyone's there, it's a very happy moment. And again, you don't have any more books to give to people, but you have a piece of paper, and your great, great, great grandchild says, will you write down the three truths? Three things that you know need to be, or that you know to be true about all the things you learned in life, that you'd pass on to me and to everyone else? Since we can't read your books anymore, what are these three lessons that you would apply, or share with all of us that are very important? What would you say?

• 40:15Arianna Huffington?

  So I would say the first one would be, don't miss the moment.

• 40:21Arianna Huffington?

  The second would be what Rumi, the Persian poet, has said, "Live life as though everything is rigged in your favor, no matter what." And the third would be, get enough sleep.

• 40:37Lewis Howes?

  I love it. I want to make sure everyone gets the books. I've got one more question for you, the final question, before I ask you. Get the book, The Sleep Revolution. We'll have it all linked up, but you can get it on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, everywhere books are sold. I'll tell you where to go get it specifically. Also, all of the information about the essay, about everything else we talked about with Uber, and things like that. So, get the book, and I highly endorse it. So, thank you for being here. The final question before I ask it, I want to acknowledge you, Ariana, for what you're doing to change the mindset for so many people that have been sleep deprived. And for show people that you can be extremely driven and achieve your dreams, big dreams, but also have a healthy

• 41:21Lewis Howes?

  lifestyle. And it starts with taking care of the most important person in the world, yourself first. And your sleep is very important. So, I want to acknowledge you for the incredible work you do, for consistently showing up every single day, positive, loving, and giving to the world. It means a lot to me.

• 41:37Arianna Huffington?

  Thank you so much. Thank you.

• 41:39Lewis Howes?

  Final question is, what's your definition of greatness?

• 41:43Arianna Huffington?

  So, my definition of greatness is to be in a constant mode of learning and consider yourself always a work in progress, on the road to greatness. So, I think that greatness is always aspirational, and yet always present, but there's never finality about it. There's never a moment where you can say, "This is it. I can now put a bow around it," and just do maintenance. It's always a work in progress.

• 42:19Lewis Howes?

  Ariana, thanks for being here. Appreciate it.

• 42:21Arianna Huffington?

  Thank you so much. Thank you.

• 42:26Lewis Howes?

  Thank you, guys, for tuning in. In this episode, again, lewishouse.com/317 to watch the full video interview, check out the full show notes, all the links and resources we talked about in today's interview is back at lewishouse.com/317. Make sure to connect with Ariana, check out her book, and let me know what you thought of this episode. Again, we've got the full video interview. Our YouTube channel has close to 50,000 subscribers. Now we're doing interviews every Monday, Wednesday and posting videos Monday, Wednesday, and mostly Friday as well. So make sure to leave a comment over on YouTube as well and let us know what you think there. And we've got so much more coming out very soon on the

• 43:08Lewis Howes?

  School of Greatness podcast. Thank you guys so much for listening today. You know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.