UPDATE: Laura Sweetman

On the heels of our investigation into Laura Sweetman’s death, the Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office fulfilled our FOIA request, providing new audio files—including recordings of Laura arguing with her estranged husband, Dave, and deputies’ interview with him. Laura was found dead in her Gilbert, Arizona bathtub in December 2013, and despite early red flags, her case was ruled undetermined and quietly closed. Now, these newly obtained materials raise fresh questions. Listen to our update on Laura Sweetman now.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Ashley Flowers?

  Happy Friday, crime junkies. I feel like someone down at the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office might have listened to our most recent episode. Or maybe the timing is just a crazy coincidence. But a couple of hours ago this Friday, the Sheriff's Office finally fulfilled our records request and got us the audio from Dave and Laura Sweetman's domestic violence incident. And I want to do something a little out of the ordinary. While this episode is still top of mind for everyone, I want to share it with you. There are three things that you're going to be hearing, and I'm going to pop in between each.

• 0:45Ashley Flowers?

  First, I'm going to play for you sound from the body cam footage of a deputy responding to Laura's call that she made to the Sheriff's Office. Then, I'm going to play you the entire audio file that she turned over to them of the incident that she was reporting. This is the almost hour and a half long recording she has of her and Dave inside their house when she says he refused to let her leave. And then, I'm going to play you some audio from when the deputy arrested and questioned Dave. This audio answers so many questions and brings up a million more. And I think for those of you who have been in a volatile or abusive relationship,

• 1:30Ashley Flowers?

  this audio is going to hit home in a hard way. But it is important to hear because these are some of Laura's last recorded words before she died later, the same year that this was reported. So first, here is the deputy's interaction with Laura. It has been edited for clarity.

• 1:55Speaker 01

  Hello. Who's Laura?

• 1:58Speaker 02

  I was going to tell her where my kids are. Somebody know.

• 2:14Speaker 01

  How are you?

• 2:15Speaker 02

  I'm okay.

• 2:17Speaker 01

  Not injured or anything?

• 2:17Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:19Speaker 02

  Do you want me to start my sketch?

• 2:20Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:21Speaker 02

  So, um, recently I discovered that my husband has another family. And so, over the past few weeks, I've gotten ready to get divorced. And he was out of town this weekend, so I moved my things out of the house. And then he was with two of the kids, so when he got back, I, um, took, uh, I told him I was taking the kids to Walmart really quick, and I just took the kids to a friend's house, and I went back to tell him that I was leaving. But while I was gone, he must have figured that out and seen that enough things were missing from the house. Um, he wasn't inside, um, so, and I was looking for him, so I decided to try to leave. And so I wa- and I had my car, like, parked, ready to go out on the street, because I knew it, I knew there was gonna be an altercation with him, because that's his motive action.

• 3:05Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:05Speaker 02

  Um, but I ran into him, like, when I was coming out the garage door, and he grabbed me by the shirt and shoved me back in the house.

• 3:11Speaker 01

  The shirt that you have on?

• 3:12Speaker 02

  Uh-huh, and so then we proceeded to argue, um, for about an hour and twenty minutes. And I tried to get out of the house three times, um, and he grabbed onto my neck, um...

• 3:27Speaker 01

  Do you have any marks?

• 3:28Speaker 02

  I don't have any marks on me, no. Um, and then he had made threats during the conversation that, um, that he was, that neither of us was getting out of the cell live. Um, that he would kill me, he would kill himself. He did retract that he would kill me and only kill himself, like you said. And I have recorded this, because I knew this was gonna happen.

• 3:48Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 3:48Speaker 02

  Um, that he had a gun upstairs.

• 3:50Speaker 01

  Have you seen any weapons?

• 3:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, I've seen three weapons.

• 3:53Speaker 01

  What kind of weapons, really?

• 3:55Speaker 02

  Um, there's a, um, it's just, uh, like, a gun that looks probably like a nine millimeter or something, a silver one. I looked for it yesterday, so I could get rid of it, but I couldn't find it.

• 4:04Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Um, there's a shotgun, um, but that isn't loaded, it's probably not even out of the box loaded, but the nine millimeter probably is loaded, wherever it is. And then there's, in the garage, but not in the house, there's another gun that looks like a semi-automatic, and it looks like a hundred years old, I don't know if it has any...

• 4:23Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 4:26Speaker 02

  And then, um, uh, basically, he went through the whole, for an hour, telling me that he loved me. He wanted to find a way to make this work out. And then after he realized that it wasn't, um, he basically just was telling me that I needed to get the kids back. Um, I told him that the, the kids were with the police, because he knows I have hot friends. And, um, and then, so he allowed me a minute to make a phone call to my friends to have them bring the kids back. But instead, I ran.

• 4:55Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 4:55Speaker 02

  And I came here.

• 4:56Speaker 01

  How many kids do you have in common?

• 4:58Speaker 02

  Two.

• 4:58Speaker 01

  Were they there when this was going on?

• 5:00Speaker 02

  No, I had taken them earlier, married with a friend.

• 5:02Speaker 01

  Okay, how long have you been married?

• 5:06Speaker 02

  Um, two years.

• 5:07Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  Now, when you say he has a whole nother family, like, that for me?

• 5:14Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, um, basically, he, um, had an affair with a woman and they share a child in common. And, um, I don't know what the extent of the relationship was with her.

• 5:26Speaker 01

  Do you know how old that child is?

• 5:27Speaker 02

  Um, I think the kid's almost two, probably like twenty-one, something like that.

• 5:32Speaker 01

  And do you know her name or where she lives?

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Uh huh, yeah, I, um, I have all that information in the car.

• 5:36Speaker 01

  Okay. Do you think he would follow through on any of his threats?

• 5:41Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 5:41Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  And how often have things like this happen between the two of you?

• 5:54Speaker 02

  Um, I would say early in our marriage, we would have altercations, but never with police involvement.

• 6:01Speaker 01

  Has he ever been arrested for anything?

• 6:03Speaker 02

  Um, yeah, he has, uh, one arrest for assault a few years ago.

• 6:09Speaker 01

  And who did he assault?

• 6:11Speaker 02

  I don't know, I just discovered this in my recent investigative measures.

• 6:16Speaker 01

  Okay. And what's his full name?

• 6:19Speaker 02

  David Michael Sweetman.

• 6:25Speaker 01

  Was anybody else present when any of this was going on? Uh, you said you had some of it recorded?

• 6:32Speaker 02

  I recorded the whole thing.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  Oh, here. Do you mind if I take a copy of the, of the recording off of there?

• 6:38Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 6:39Speaker 01

  I'm just gonna put it on my computer and just copy it real quick, till you can be able to have this back.

• 6:45Speaker 01

  Just give me a few seconds.

• 6:48Speaker 01

  Have you thought about getting order protection against him yet?

• 6:52Speaker 02

  I don't have one, but I've thought about it.

• 6:54Speaker 01

  Are you gonna go do that?

• 6:55Speaker 02

  Me too, yeah.

• 6:55Speaker 01

  As soon as possible? Okay.

• 6:58Speaker 01

  Do you think I'm gonna have any problems when I go over there with him?

• 7:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 7:02Speaker 01

  What kind of problems do you think he'll have?

• 7:03Speaker 02

  He has guns in the house and he's very angry and he doesn't back down.

• 7:10Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:10Speaker 02

  And he's already said fifty times he's willing to kill himself.

• 7:15Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:16Speaker 02

  So you're definitely gonna have a problem if he's there. Well, she already told him how the kids are with cops. So I'm sorry that sets you up for trial.

• 7:25Speaker 01

  That's not a problem. I don't mind.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  I'm afraid he's gonna hurt himself.

• 7:28Speaker 01

  And you said you have three kids in common, how old are they?

• 7:31Speaker 02

  They're five, seven, and eight.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  And you said they're all safe right now?

• 7:44Speaker 01

  Now, would you be willing to go and testify against him in court? Or is this something that you might be fearful of?

• 7:53Speaker 02

  I will be fearful of it, yes.

• 7:55Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:57Speaker 01

  Well, if he's there, he's most likely gonna go to jail tonight. This isn't something that we take lightly when he threatens to kill you and himself and...

• 8:09Speaker 02

  No, I mean, I'm afraid I'm... I'm afraid I feel like my whole life is ruined right now because he's gonna be after me.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  Okay. And also let my detectives know that I have your address redacted from my report if you think he's gonna...

• 8:25Speaker 02

  He'll definitely...

• 8:25Speaker 01

  ...maybe chasing you down.

• 8:26Speaker 02

  Find me, yes, as soon as he gets out. Do you think that if they arrest him, they'll just keep him until the morning?

• 8:31Speaker 01

  Well, it's a DV charge, so he has to see a judge. And unfortunately, the threats right now only fall under misdemeanors, so there's a high probability that he'll be released. But they'll give you a phone call before they do that so you know.

• 8:49Speaker 02

  Will you update me later? Or will I know what's going on?

• 8:52Speaker 01

  I can give you a call if he's there when I get there and take him to jail. Just so you're kept in the loop tonight.

• 8:57Speaker 02

  Do you have a card?

• 8:58Speaker 01

  I will get... I'm gonna fill a little more paperwork.

• 9:00Ashley Flowers?

  We now understand that Laura's friend, who was a cop in another jurisdiction, gave her some kind of recording device to capture this interaction. It's why the audio you're about to hear is so clear. I'm gonna play this audio in full as it was given to us. The only part I'm taking out is a moment where Dave shares something personal with his wife. I can't verify the claims that he's making. And I'm gonna let you know where that part is in the clip, just so you're super clear. Now, listen with care.

• 9:35Speaker 03

  Where are you?

• 9:40Speaker 03

  Are you in the bathroom?

• 9:57Speaker 03

  David?

• 10:55Speaker 03

  Where are you?

• 11:11Speaker 04

  Swear to kids.

• 11:14Speaker 04

  No.

• 11:15Speaker 05

  Yes, I am.

• 11:16Speaker 04

  No.

• 11:17Speaker 05

  I am.

• 11:17Speaker 04

  No, we're gonna go talk. No, we're gonna go talk. This isn't right.

• 11:21Speaker 05

  What's not right about it?

• 11:22Speaker 04

  You're right. You're right. It's not right. I'm fucked up. I understand. You're right. I'm fucked up. I understand.

• 11:28Speaker 05

  Okay, you have another family.

• 11:29Speaker 04

  No, I don't have a family. I don't have another family. I don't have another family. Okay? I've made mistakes. I agree. I am fucked up. I have tried to fix my problems, okay? I really fucking have. Okay? I have to take responsibility for another kid. I understand that. Okay? I have to fucking do that.

• 11:49Speaker 05

  Can you just let me go?

• 11:51Speaker 04

  No, I don't know because I love you, Laura. I fucking love you more than anything in this world. I love my kids more than anything in this world.

• 11:57Speaker 05

  I don't wanna fuck up anything with them.

• 11:59Speaker 04

  No, you're not fucking up anything with anybody else. The only thing I want is you and my kids. That's what I want, Laura. That's all. That's all I want. Is you and my kids. I don't know how to fix my other problems other than what I'm trying to do now. I'm trying to fix myself. Okay? I'm really fucked up. I'm in a really bad spot right now. Everything in my life is the shit. You want me to shoot myself in the head right now? Okay, go ahead. Take my kids from me, Laura.

• 12:26Speaker 05

  I don't wanna take them away. I just want...

• 12:28Speaker 04

  No, no, that's what's gonna happen.

• 12:29Speaker 05

  No, it's not. I promise you. I don't wanna take them from you. I just want us to have a healthy life and this is not healthy for me.

• 12:36Speaker 04

  Okay, what? It's not healthy for me either. It hasn't been healthy for me in it for a long time, Laura. I've told you.

• 12:45Speaker 04

  The last time we had... Or the last few times we've had fights, Laura, you ha- You don't love me. You haven't loved me. I love you more than anything in this world. I don't know what I have to do to prove that. But you're my wife. I've never left you. I've never wanted to leave you.

• 13:07Speaker 04

  You're the only person in this-

• 13:09Speaker 06

  Do you really think I can stay when you have a kid with someone else?

• 13:12Speaker 04

  Laura, yes, I do think you can and I want you to and I'm begging you to. What, what more can I do or say Laura? What more can I do or say? I will do anything. I will fix anything that I can fix Laura. You're what I want.

• 13:32Speaker 04

  I've never once ever considered not having you as my wife. I would rather be dead than not have you. I love you and care about you more than anything. I just don't think you love me. And I don't think you've loved me for a long time and I really wish you did. I really, really, really wish you did because we have beautiful fucking great kids and I love them more than anything in this world also.

• 14:00Speaker 04

  My family is all I've got. That's all I've got.

• 14:03Speaker 06

  He's your kid too and you need to recognize him and take care of him and he's their brother.

• 14:08Speaker 04

  I understand-

• 14:09Speaker 06

  That's their brother.

• 14:10Speaker 04

  How do, how do I, how do I, how do I broach that subject with my wife? How do I, how do I acknowledge with my wife and-

• 14:18Speaker 06

  It's done now.

• 14:19Speaker 04

  And with, with-

• 14:19Speaker 06

  And I am happy for him to be a part of your life. You can, she can live here.

• 14:24Speaker 04

  No! No she can't! No, she can't. I don't want any, I don't want anything to do with her. I've, I, Jesus Christ, I've told her a hundred thousand times don't even fuck alone. I mean-

• 14:38Speaker 06

  But that's not fair to him David.

• 14:40Speaker 04

  You're right, it's not. And I try, I, I try, when I drop off money to her, I see him for a little while and that's it.

• 14:49Speaker 06

  And I can't afford this house anymore. I lost everything and I had to put all the bills this month on the credit card. I, and then, then your money goes to her.

• 14:57Speaker 04

  No, my money doesn't go to her. It's only a few hundred dollars.

• 15:02Speaker 04

  And I'm supposed to get fucking my insurance money.

• 15:06Speaker 06

  I don't want to have it. I don't want a single thing. I just want us to be nice to each other and share the kids.

• 15:11Speaker 04

  Laura, no.

• 15:11Speaker 06

  Please, David, please.

• 15:13Speaker 04

  Laura, no, don't leave. Please, don't leave.

• 15:17Speaker 06

  David, I don't want to be mean to you. I do not want to be mean to you. I just cannot live. I can't live. I will kill myself.

• 15:25Speaker 04

  I'll kill myself. Laura, I need you. You're my wife. Don't leave me. Jesus Christ. I will do anything I can to fix this. No, no, no. I want you. I'll do anything to show you that you're my wife. Laura, I've tried very hard. I really have.

• 15:45Speaker 06

  Do you have any idea what my life is like? When people have to call me year after year after year and tell me who you're fucking every year?

• 15:53Speaker 04

  I'm not fucking people every year. That's not true.

• 15:56Speaker 06

  Then why do I have to live a life where people track me down and tell me things?

• 15:59Speaker 04

  First of all, people who try to hurt me, people from my business that try to hurt me. Jesse, Kevin, because he's... I found his fucking child porn on the goddamn fucking, on the computer and I had to give it to his probation officer. Kevin's out to hurt me. Bobby hates me because I fucking fired him. I mean, Laura, you do have to realize that there are people that really, really want to see me burn. Jesse especially. He's doing everything he can to burn me. And I'm certain he's happy to call you and tell you.

• 16:34Speaker 06

  If I would have squeezed out a black kid along the way, would I be alive today?

• 16:39Speaker 04

  Laura.

• 16:39Speaker 06

  No, David. It doesn't go both ways. You would have killed me.

• 16:44Speaker 04

  Laura.

• 16:47Speaker 06

  Can I have some self-respect? For the first time in my life, I cannot live knowing that you have a kid with her and then you take my stuff and you give it to her?

• 16:58Speaker 04

  I don't take stuff and give it to her.

• 17:00Speaker 06

  The rocking chair, the drumming, strolling, those... I nursed my baby and that stuff.

• 17:06Speaker 06

  It's a sickness, David. It's sick.

• 17:09Speaker 04

  Okay, then, will you fucking help me, please?

• 17:12Speaker 06

  I would love to help you and I would love to be your friend.

• 17:14Speaker 04

  Laura, no.

• 17:15Speaker 06

  And I want us to take good care of our kids.

• 17:17Speaker 04

  Laura, Jesus Christ!

• 17:18Speaker 06

  We have amazing children.

• 17:20Speaker 04

  Laura, Laura, you can't take my... No, that's what you are, that's what you're doing. You're taking you and my kids away. And I don't want any of that to happen. Laura, don't you understand what... I love you. Do you love me?

• 17:33Speaker 06

  I don't love you anymore, David. I can't. I'm your friend.

• 17:38Speaker 04

  When was the last time you loved me? Because I've loved you this entire time. I really have. I have loved you this entire time. This entire time, this entire 20 fucking years, I have loved you and cared about you more than anything. Do anything you want to me. Put any type of rule and restriction on me that you want. Just love me and stay with me. Please. I care about you and my kids more than anything. I do. I swear that on everything. I swear it on my life.

• 18:13Speaker 06

  I am not here to take them away. I want them to have a happy, pleasant existence with two parents that love them and don't fight. I don't want to fight with you.

• 18:20Speaker 04

  Laura, I don't want to fight you.

• 18:22Speaker 06

  I just want to live in the same house as you.

• 18:24Speaker 04

  Laura, I love... Please, don't do this. Are you seeing someone else?

• 18:29Speaker 06

  No.

• 18:30Speaker 04

  Have you been seeing someone else?

• 18:31Speaker 06

  No, I don't care about anyone else. Stop that.

• 18:34Speaker 04

  Have you been seeing someone else?

• 18:35Speaker 06

  No.

• 18:35Speaker 04

  Just be honest with me.

• 18:36Speaker 06

  No, David.

• 18:37Speaker 04

  For once, you please.

• 18:38Speaker 06

  No, I'm not. I've never seen anyone else. Because I did love you and no...

• 18:42Speaker 04

  No. No, don't. Then let's talk. Then let's... Are you... Do you swear you've never seen anyone?

• 18:48Speaker 06

  I swear, David. I don't care about that. I care about our kids and I want them to be healthy. And it's not healthy for them to see us self-destruct.

• 18:59Speaker 04

  Then let's fix it, please. Let's work together and fix it, please. Let's work together. Can we work together and fix this?

• 19:05Speaker 06

  But I need a break. Can I have a break?

• 19:07Speaker 04

  Or... No, because you're just... You're... That's just... You're just...

• 19:13Speaker 04

  You're not leaving.

• 19:14Speaker 06

  I am leaving, I am leaving. Please, David, help! Please, David, I want to go!

• 19:21Speaker 04

  Why are you doing this? You're saying help?

• 19:24Speaker 06

  Because I-

• 19:25Speaker 04

  You're saying help-

• 19:26Speaker 06

  You're dragging me-

• 19:27Speaker 04

  You're saying help-

• 19:28Speaker 06

  From me? David... I can't, I just go?

• 19:33Speaker 04

  No! No, you can't! You've taken my children away! You've taken my children away from me! You've already done it! You didn't just leave, you took my children away!

• 19:50Speaker 04

  You took my children away from me? You didn't just leave!

• 19:55Speaker 04

  Your plan is to destroy me!

• 19:57Speaker 06

  I did not-

• 19:57Speaker 04

  Just like the rest of them!

• 19:59Speaker 06

  No, it's not, I'm the nicest person-

• 20:01Speaker 04

  No, you just-

• 20:02Speaker 06

  That you've ever met-

• 20:03Speaker 04

  You're right!

• 20:03Speaker 06

  Because you're putting your hands on my neck and you're dragging me in the house three times now!

• 20:07Speaker 04

  I'm trying to talk to you!

• 20:09Speaker 06

  Can't-

• 20:09Speaker 04

  I love you and care about you, I, I-

• 20:13Speaker 06

  I can't-

• 20:13Speaker 04

  You can't do this to me! You can't do this to me! I'm already self-destructing as a person because of all the problems!

• 20:22Speaker 06

  Fix it.

• 20:23Speaker 04

  What can I do?

• 20:25Speaker 06

  Fix yourself and come back the, the person that you used to be, build a business, do something.

• 20:30Speaker 04

  What?

• 20:31Speaker 06

  Not, not, not make it, me feel like an idiot all the time because I can't pay all the bills and I-

• 20:36Speaker 04

  I'm not trying to make you feel like an idiot! I'm gonna get paid off here very shortly! I'm suppo- I'm supposed to get a check this week!

• 20:45Speaker 06

  Okay, and figure it out how?

• 20:47Speaker 04

  No, I wanna figure, I wanna, I wanna buy our house and then-

• 20:51Speaker 06

  Then buy it, you can have it.

• 20:53Speaker 04

  No, I don't want it, I want us! I don't want the house without you! I don't want this place without you and the kids! Are you kidding me? I don't-

• 21:02Speaker 06

  They're gonna be here, whatever they-

• 21:03Speaker 04

  No, they're not, you've already taken them! Where are my kids at?

• 21:07Speaker 06

  They're right now visiting the police department.

• 21:12Speaker 06

  With my friends.

• 21:15Speaker 04

  You've taken my kids to the police department?

• 21:18Speaker 06

  No, they're with my friends who are police.

• 21:23Speaker 04

  You've taken my kids to the fucking police department?

• 21:31Speaker 04

  Well, why aren't they down here right now officiating? Why aren't your friends, your cop friends? That makes so much sense to you, Laura. I want us. I don't want anybody else. I don't want Beth.

• 21:46Speaker 04

  He's my kid and I have to acknowledge that and I'm gonna have to take care of that and deal with that. But I don't want anybody but you. You're the person I want. You're the person I love. You're my wife, Laura.

• 22:01Speaker 04

  You can't do this. You can't do this to me. Forgive me, please. I will do anything. I will fix the problem.

• 22:13Speaker 04

  Please.

• 22:17Speaker 04

  Please give me one last chance to fix the problem.

• 22:22Speaker 04

  Please, Laura.

• 22:23Speaker 05

  I'm not trying to hurt you.

• 22:25Speaker 04

  No, but you are.

• 22:26Speaker 05

  I'm the only person that does not want to hurt you. I want to live in my house and the kids live with you, whatever days you want and whatever days me and we go to sports and we do everything, but I do not sleep in this house.

• 22:37Speaker 04

  Laura, no one else has ever been in this house. No one else has ever been with me in this house. I would never disrespect you that way. I have never done anything like that. Yes, I've made a mistake. I agree. Can I please fix the problem, Laura? Please.

• 22:56Speaker 05

  Get your money, fix your problems.

• 22:59Speaker 04

  The problem I want to fix is right here. I want to fix the problem with you, Laura. I don't want any other problems. I don't want any other shit. I want my family.

• 23:11Speaker 04

  Laura, this is the only good thing I've got. Everything else has turned to shit. It really fucking has. My business has been yanked out from under me by vindictive people who are just trying to destroy me. Seriously. You, you might think that sounds like fucking paranoia, but it's a fact. It's a goddamn fact. People are, people are coming to me from every goddamn direction trying to fucking yank me down. They really fucking are. The only thing I've, I've had in my life that's good is you and my children.

• 23:46Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 23:47Speaker 04

  And you're taking all of that away from me. But you are. You're taking, they're at a police station. They're at a police station, right? My kids are at a fucking police station with some fucking lady that they don't even know. Right now, instead of with their father, who cares about them more than anything?

• 24:25Speaker 04

  Laura, please, don't do this. Please.

• 24:31Speaker 04

  Look at me, please.

• 24:34Speaker 04

  Please?

• 24:36Speaker 04

  Please, I love you. I really do. I, look, I acknowledge I've made fucking mistakes. I'm not fucking perfect. I'm nowhere near perfect. I don't even, I, I can't even see perfect from where I'm at. But could you please? Please, acknowledge the fact that you know I love you?

• 24:55Speaker 04

  You know I love you, don't you? I love you and care about you more than anything, Laura. I do.

• 25:07Speaker 04

  Seriously, will you look at me? I love you and I care about you more than anything, Laura. You and my kids are the only thing in my life that's worth anything to me. And I will do anything to keep it.

• 25:20Speaker 05

  Okay, well, anything means give me a break, David.

• 25:24Speaker 05

  And prove it to me, fix your problems.

• 25:27Speaker 04

  You're not coming back. You won't come back, Laura. You're gonna, you're gonna walk out right now. And what's gonna happen is, is you, like you said, you're, you're done paying for everything. The house is gonna get foreclosed on. I'm gonna, I'm gonna end up being a hermit somewhere and, and my kids will never, I'll end up shooting myself in the fucking forehead or drinking myself to death. And then you'll be happy. If you want me to kill myself, just say so and I'll do it now. And I'm not joking.

• 25:55Speaker 04

  I've got a gun upstairs, I'll kill myself. Will that make you happy?

• 25:58Speaker 05

  No, David. I want us to do the best thing for the kids.

• 26:02Speaker 04

  No, I want to, Laura, Jesus, I care about you so much. Don't leave me. You're the only person that I've trusted and cared about for 25 years, Laura. We've been together since we were kids.

• 26:18Speaker 05

  I know.

• 26:20Speaker 04

  I care about you more than anything.

• 26:22Speaker 05

  But my life sucks, David.

• 26:24Speaker 04

  So does mine. Can we, can we work together and fix it? Please?

• 26:29Speaker 05

  I think I deserve something else than people telling me all the time.

• 26:34Speaker 04

  Alright, well, first of, first of all, you're right. You do deserve better, and I apologize. You deserve better. People should never, these pieces of shit that would call you and say these things are pieces of shit. Okay? I agree, and I'll, I'll get them. Okay, they're trying anything, can you see that they're trying anything they can to hurt me? Nothing will make them happier than you to leave me.

• 27:00Speaker 05

  All it does is hurt me, and I'm sick of being hurt all the time, time after time after time.

• 27:05Speaker 04

  Okay, it's not as bad as you're making it out to be, though. Uh, it's not time after time after time after time after time. I've made mistakes, I agree. But I'm not perfect, I agree. But I mean, it's not like, it's not like I went searching for anything. Accidents have happened, mistakes have been made, I swear to God, mistakes have been made, but they were mistakes. They're not, I am not perfect, I agree. Okay, I've made mistakes. It's, but it's not like I'm, I'm leading a double life. It's not like I'm living somewhere else.

• 27:39Speaker 05

  You are leading a double life. You visit her, you bring her money. And so, the last few weeks, I've had like fourteen dollars to buy groceries, and she gets your money.

• 27:50Speaker 04

  Ask me for money. I give her money at the start of the month to help with him, okay? She has a job. I've given her three-

• 27:57Speaker 06

  I don't, what about me? Like, that's our money.

• 28:00Speaker 04

  Okay, you're right, you're right, but I-

• 28:02Speaker 06

  And I have got nothing. I have nothing. I have this house, which is a noose around my neck. And I, that's it. And I go to work all day, and then I bring you your dinner upstairs, and I have, I have nothing. I have my children and I have my job, and I just try to put my feet every day, lay my bed, I'm like, if I could just get my foot on the ground, then-

• 28:23Speaker 04

  Okay, then let's fix this together. Please?

• 28:30Speaker 04

  Please?

• 28:33Speaker 04

  Please?

• 28:33Speaker 06

  I don't want it, David.

• 28:35Speaker 04

  I'll give you all, every ounce, every penny of money I've got.

• 28:38Speaker 06

  I don't care about money. I just want to have a day where I have more than fourteen dollars to buy groceries.

• 28:44Speaker 04

  Okay, alright, I didn't-

• 28:45Speaker 06

  I'm just a fuckload of money, and I have nothing.

• 28:49Speaker 04

  Okay, I agree. We've had this problem for a while.

• 28:55Speaker 04

  Fine, let's-

• 28:55Speaker 06

  Sure, she has groceries.

• 28:59Speaker 04

  She has her own job. I give her three hundred dollars a month. Okay, I'm not rich. I'm barely making it. I'm barely fucking surviving. My business is going in the tank.

• 29:11Speaker 06

  So, what, what did you think was gonna happen, like?

• 29:13Speaker 04

  I didn't know. I didn't know how I was gonna explain this-

• 29:17Speaker 06

  And why would you hide your son? He's your son.

• 29:20Speaker 04

  Well, because I love you and I care about you, and I didn't wanna hurt you.

• 29:27Speaker 04

  And I'm embarrassed.

• 29:30Speaker 04

  But at this point, pride doesn't mean a goddamn thing to me. I'm embarrassed beyond all embarrassment. I didn't know what to do or how to do it. Okay, she used to be Macio's girlfriend. Oh, you already know the whole story? Do you know everything? I'm sorry.

• 29:48Speaker 06

  No, go ahead, tell me.

• 29:49Speaker 04

  Okay, she was Macio's girlfriend, I was Macio's friend. We ended up, just somehow, it, it ended up where it ended up, okay? She refused to have an abortion. And there it is. I'm stuck with the goddamn kid.

• 30:09Speaker 04

  I wanted more than anything to not have another child.

• 30:14Speaker 05

  Then why would you be starting businesses with her and my kids' names and her names all over everything together? Like you're a family.

• 30:22Speaker 04

  No, no, that right there was down there at the coffee shop. Okay, that was, I had to start the LLC. She demanded to be a part of the LLC. I said, "Here, fine then. If you can run this, great. And if you can make any money, great." And it never worked out. Not for a fucking-

• 30:38Speaker 05

  Why are my kids' names with her?

• 30:41Speaker 04

  Okay, your kids' names are on the LLC in case she ever tried to do something where she tried to take anything that wasn't hers. Okay, that way she's not a majority owner.

• 30:59Speaker 04

  I'm not trying, I've never tried to be mistress of her, about anything. And I knew someday I'd have to confront this issue. And I didn't know how I was gonna do it. And it really weighed heavy on me. I don't know, I have no idea, or had no idea, how the hell I would deal with this. This is a huge problem and a huge embarrassment. I don't know what to do.

• 31:23Speaker 05

  It's embarrassing to me.

• 31:25Speaker 04

  I know! I know! I know!

• 31:28Speaker 05

  I'm like the biggest fucking loser on the planet.

• 31:31Speaker 04

  No, you're not!

• 31:32Speaker 05

  Yeah, I am.

• 31:35Speaker 04

  Come on, don't, don't, don't! Don't!

• 31:39Speaker 05

  I don't, I don't even hate you. I, I just...

• 31:43Speaker 04

  Jesus Christ, I just- Can't you see that-

• 31:46Speaker 05

  Want to be alone.

• 31:49Speaker 04

  I don't want you to be alone. That's the thing that I've never wanted. I've wanted to be with you. I love you. I love you. I've wanted us to be together for the longest time. Okay?

• 32:04Speaker 05

  But everywhere I go, people are telling me that you're with other people.

• 32:08Speaker 04

  Who is saying this? Who is saying this?

• 32:11Speaker 05

  It's everybody everywhere.

• 32:13Speaker 04

  Everybody everywhere is saying that that I'm with other people? Or I'm not, I'm with you. You're my wife, you're what I care about. You're who I love. I... Granted, I haven't felt love back for a long time. But I've wanted that. I figured, maybe once, you know, we got this house situation worked out, then, you know, we, you know, things would be a little bit better for us.

• 32:46Speaker 05

  I'm forty-two years old, I am losing my home.

• 32:49Speaker 04

  Okay, you're not-

• 32:50Speaker 05

  I have nothing. I have no retirement plan, I have four hundred thousand dollars of tax debt. And they're gonna come after me, I talked to a lawyer, they're talking about me. Because I'm the only one with a paycheck.

• 33:01Speaker 04

  Hold on a second. There's no one coming after you. This is getting handled. This is being handled by, uh, uh,

• 33:11Speaker 04

  Fred. I've got the lawyer's name, I've got the lawyer's name, he's handling it. He's, he's really han- hey! This is being handled. Okay, you don't have four hundred thousand dollars of tax debt. Don't think that it doesn't weigh on my head that they're, that it's sitting out there, but I'm handling it. I'm handling this.

• 33:30Speaker 05

  And when I talked to a lawyer, he said they'll leave me two thousand dollars a month to live on. And that I'm gonna be the person paying it back.

• 33:39Speaker 04

  You don't have four hundred thousand dollars of tax debt.

• 33:43Speaker 04

  You don't have four hundred thousand dollars of tax debt, okay? The, the IRS, what they did was, they didn't accept those two years' worth of, of taxes, because they were repetitive. The, the tax change that they made, the twenty-four thousand dollars, then what they do is, is they take that, and then they just, they, uh, disallow the next two years. Okay? This is being fixed, I swear it. This is being fixed. Okay, I've already paid the attorney. I paid him a year and a half ago. Okay, I am working to fix these problems. I really am.

• 34:17Speaker 05

  Okay, well, then come and find me when they're fixed.

• 34:20Speaker 04

  I can't, I can't, I can't even find my kids. You've taken my kids away from me, Laura. I don't want to come and find you when, I, I wish you would work with me.

• 34:29Speaker 05

  I am working with you, and I'd love to see you tomorrow at wrestling.

• 34:33Speaker 04

  Laura, no, don't, no. Why can't we be a family? Why can't, what? All I want is you. I want you to love me. I want you to love me. I've wanted that.

• 34:50Speaker 04

  That's all I've wanted, is you to love me.

• 34:55Speaker 04

  I haven't felt it for a long time, I can tell you that honestly.

• 35:01Speaker 04

  I mean, I know you're, I know you're stressed and, and you're having a hard time. But I really am, I do have plans to fix that, and I did want to fix that. And I still do want to fix that. I want, I want us to be a happy family.

• 35:16Speaker 04

  My plans were to, to buy the house. And then, and then, you know, I probably aren't gonna be able to work very much, but, you know, because I'm not gonna have any money to put back into the business. And that's gonna, you know, I'll just have to sell things off as they go, but, then at least we don't have that enormous, you know, you know, house bill.

• 35:43Speaker 04

  I really do have plans to fix this. I don't know how to fix that. I can't, I don't know, I don't know how to deal with that.

• 35:49Speaker 05

  I?

• 35:50Speaker 04

  I want-

• 35:50Speaker 05

  Okay, could, could you forgive me?

• 35:56Speaker 04

  I love you.

• 35:59Speaker 04

  I know that much.

• 36:00Speaker 05

  If I gave birth to a black kid, would you forgive-

• 36:03Speaker 04

  Laura, if it meant, if it meant you not leaving, and our family staying together, I'd have to deal with it.

• 36:13Speaker 04

  I would have to deal with it.

• 36:17Speaker 04

  That's not bullshit.

• 36:21Speaker 04

  I would be hurt. I would be devastated. I would be feeling all the same things that you're feeling. But I would still love you because you're the person I've loved and I'm married.

• 36:33Speaker 04

  Because I love you and because I cared about you and we've been, we've been through so much. I can't, I can't even imagine being with anybody else. I can't imagine wanting to be with anybody else. I don't want to be with anybody else.

• 36:46Speaker 05

  I don't want to be with anyone else.

• 36:47Speaker 04

  I don't want any-

• 36:49Speaker 05

  I just can't live like this anymore.

• 36:51Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 36:51Speaker 05

  It's, it's-

• 36:53Speaker 04

  It's-

• 36:53Speaker 05

  So mortifying.

• 36:55Speaker 04

  I know. I know. I know. Believe me, I know.

• 37:05Speaker 04

  There isn't anything that I don't know better. I know that.

• 37:11Speaker 04

  But how could I, how could I come to you and say, "Jeez honey, guess what I did? I fucked up again." Not only is, is everything else in turmoil, but I'm a complete fucking idiot and look at this enormous fucking blemish mistake I've made.

• 37:27Speaker 04

  And I knew it was only a matter of time before somebody fucking decided to, to, you know, really stick it in, in my side and call you.

• 37:39Speaker 04

  It's your phone, I set it down over there.

• 37:42Speaker 04

  It was in my hand.

• 37:57Speaker 04

  That's gotta be your, your police friends.

• 38:00Speaker 05

  No, I'm on call.

• 38:03Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 38:28Speaker 04

  So as you can see, I have no friends in the entire universe.

• 38:31Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 38:32Speaker 04

  They give two shits about me. Everyone's out to fucking stab me in the back.

• 38:35Speaker 05

  I am not.

• 38:36Speaker 04

  Trying, trying to fucking hurt.

• 38:38Speaker 05

  I want us to make those kids have a great life and help them with their careers and their wrestling and everything.

• 38:43Speaker 04

  Laura.

• 38:44Speaker 05

  And I think we can do that, but there's no.

• 38:46Speaker 04

  We can't do that separately. Laura.

• 38:48Speaker 05

  We can't.

• 38:49Speaker 04

  No, every, every family that breaks up, the kids are destroyed by it. You know that. You know that. You know that as a fact, that broken homes are terrible. Look at what Robin is, is.

• 39:04Speaker 05

  Make a good one. I'm not vindictive like her.

• 39:07Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, things like that happen and I'm a piece of shit that would be vindictive because as soon as you're with somebody else, I'm gonna lose it.

• 39:15Speaker 05

  I don't even, I don't.

• 39:16Speaker 04

  But that's going to happen. It will happen. Or you've turned yourself into a beautiful woman. All you care about is working out and being in shape.

• 39:25Speaker 05

  Because otherwise, it's, it's an antidepressant because it's the only thing that makes me feel better.

• 39:31Speaker 04

  Well, I wish I could fucking make you feel better. Look at what's happened to me. I've just turned to shit because I have no fucking dignity or self-respect about myself. I don't care about myself.

• 39:42Speaker 05

  You change everything.

• 39:44Speaker 04

  Will you help me?

• 39:45Speaker 05

  But I'm not staying in this house, David. Okay?

• 39:49Speaker 04

  No. No, no, no. No, let's work together and make it better. Let's work together and fix it. Let's work together.

• 40:02Speaker 04

  Please, let's work together.

• 40:03Speaker 05

  I've been doing all I can.

• 40:07Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 40:09Speaker 05

  And I died in my room and I didn't fucking care. Okay? That's how bad it is.

• 40:17Speaker 04

  What do you mean you died?

• 40:18Speaker 05

  When I had a heart attack. I knew what was happening and I died. I thought I died in there and then you know what happened? It is woke up the next day.

• 40:26Speaker 04

  What are you talking about?

• 40:27Speaker 05

  When I, when I was sick.

• 40:32Speaker 04

  When was this? The first time you had a heart attack?

• 40:38Speaker 05

  I passed out. I thought I was just done and you know why? I didn't care.

• 40:44Speaker 05

  Cause at that point, I would have rather been dead.

• 40:47Speaker 04

  This is like a year ago.

• 40:52Speaker 05

  I knew when you took the baby stuff that you had a baby and I knew you had it with her and this whole time I've been thinking that I'm crazy.

• 41:03Speaker 05

  Cause you had fourteen stories about what you were doing with the stuff and I knew you were with her. I always know when you're with somebody.

• 41:09Speaker 04

  Okay. I'm not with her. I'm not with anybody. I'm with you, first of all. I'm not with her.

• 41:23Speaker 04

  You mean everything to me. You are the only woman in the world that ever has meant anything to me.

• 41:30Speaker 05

  But you can't force me into this situation, David.

• 41:39Speaker 04

  But I'm gonna try. Laura, I care about you. You're the only thing I care about. I would rather see us both dead than, than, no. I'd rather see me dead than not have you in my life. Because my children are gonna be destroyed by this. They're gonna be destroyed from this. And it's all my fault.

• 42:04Speaker 04

  My children's lives are gonna be fucked up because of this. I fucked. I fucked up everything with you. I fucked up everything with my kids. Everything.

• 42:21Speaker 05

  I would like to help you. I just can't stay here, please.

• 42:28Speaker 04

  I don't want you to go, Laura. I don't want you to go. I don't want you to go. I don't want you to take my kids.

• 42:39Speaker 04

  I don't want you to go.

• 42:45Speaker 04

  Their fucking pictures.

• 42:48Speaker 04

  You took their pictures.

• 42:56Speaker 04

  You can't do this to me.

• 43:00Speaker 04

  You can't do this to me Laura, please. Please, please, let's us make this better together, please Laura. Are you just looking for a way out, are you just looking to make your run? Is that really what's going on here? Are you not listening to me at all?

• 43:17Speaker 05

  I'm listening to you.

• 43:18Speaker 04

  You really don't care about anything I'm about to say, is that? Is that really it?

• 43:22Speaker 05

  No David, I care, I just, I've been over this 800,000 times alone. Okay?

• 43:29Speaker 04

  You've been over what?

• 43:30Speaker 05

  This whole scenario, and there's not gonna be a way that I'm gonna feel better about that baby.

• 43:36Speaker 04

  Okay, there's not gonna be a way that I'm gonna be able to make you feel better about that baby, but can you forgive me? For making a mistake? Because I'm not gonna, the minute you're gone, I'm not running over and, and being with this baby. I'm not doing that.

• 43:49Speaker 05

  But you should, it's your obligation.

• 43:50Speaker 04

  No, I'm not going-

• 43:52Speaker 05

  Because your son too.

• 43:52Speaker 04

  Okay, I'm not going to run over and be with any, I'm never going to be with that person. I have never, ever, ever-

• 44:00Speaker 05

  You should fight for your son, you should have your son half the time, he is yours and he deserves to have a good dad too.

• 44:07Speaker 04

  Will, will you accept him into the house?

• 44:11Speaker 05

  No.

• 44:12Speaker 04

  Okay then.

• 44:13Speaker 05

  You should fight for all your kids. Because they're yours and they deserve a good respectable dad.

• 44:17Speaker 04

  Okay. I'm not gonna do anything that's gonna jeopardize my chance with you.

• 44:24Speaker 04

  Laura, I'm not gonna do-

• 44:25Speaker 05

  You know what, you know I'm a pediatrician, right? I mean, I, I actually feel bad for that kid because I want him to have you as a dad.

• 44:33Speaker 04

  Laura.

• 44:33Speaker 05

  You need to be there for him too David.

• 44:36Speaker 04

  I'm not gonna do anything that will jeopardize us.

• 44:44Speaker 04

  Laura, I'm not gonna do anything that'll jeopardize us. I'm not gonna do it. I want us. I want you and me. I want our kids, I want our family. That's what I want, that's the only thing I want. That's the only thing I want. I don't want anything that will jeopardize us.

• 45:06Speaker 04

  I love you and care about you more than anything. I really do. I love you and care about you more than anything in this entire world Laura, and I will do anything to prove that.

• 45:18Speaker 04

  I don't want anything but you and my children in my life, that's it.

• 45:25Speaker 04

  And the only reason why I even had to deal with this other person is, is because there's a kid there. And yes, it's a, it's an enormous mistake. You know, but I do have to, I, you know, do have to take a responsibility for the kid in some way, but... I don't, I've never brought it up to you and I've never admitted, you know, this, this terrible problem because... Of the problem it's gonna cause me.

• 45:54Speaker 04

  Because I don't wanna lose my family. I don't wanna lose you. I love you. I love my kids.

• 46:05Speaker 04

  This is all I want, is you and my children.

• 46:12Speaker 04

  It really is.

• 46:18Speaker 04

  It really, really is, Laura.

• 46:24Speaker 04

  What can I do? What can I do? Please tell me, what can I do?

• 46:27Speaker 05

  I don't, I know, you, I think you have the potential to be a great dad. You are a great dad. You need to be a dad to that kid. But you've never been a good husband.

• 46:37Speaker 04

  I have been a good husband. I have been a good husband. I haven't been a perfect husband, but I've been a good husband. There are a whole lot worse husbands out there. I'm, I admit, I've got, I've got issues because, you know, because of how my mom fucked me up. I've got issues, you know, I've got some deep, dark stuff that I've never told you. I got problems that I don't know how to deal with, okay, but, you know...

• 47:29Speaker 05

  What do you want to tell me? I mean, if there's stuff that you need to say, then get it off your chest.

• 47:50Speaker 05

  What?

• 48:01Speaker 07

  It's really embarrassing.

• 48:05Speaker 05

  Okay, well, I've been your friend since I was 16 years old.

• 48:08Speaker 07

  I know, but I never told you before. I've never...

• 48:11Speaker 05

  What?

• 48:13Ashley Flowers?

  This is the part of the recording where Dave shares something personal with Laura.

• 48:21Speaker 07

  Look, I know I'm fucked up, okay? I know I'm fucked up, okay?

• 48:27Speaker 07

  Everybody fucking leaves me. My mom left me.

• 48:32Speaker 07

  Grandma died.

• 48:35Speaker 07

  You're leaving.

• 49:09Speaker 07

  I'm fucking buried.

• 49:29Speaker 05

  Sorry that happened to you.

• 50:04Speaker 05

  I think we should just work on a better situation for our kids, you know?

• 50:12Speaker 04

  I'm...

• 50:14Speaker 04

  I'm fucked up. I'm so fucked up, okay?

• 50:20Speaker 04

  There's a lot of shit wrong with me.

• 50:22Speaker 05

  Okay, David, I'm your friend.

• 50:23Speaker 04

  Will you please help me fix and fix me?

• 50:25Speaker 05

  I would love to help you.

• 50:27Speaker 04

  Will you please stay my wife?

• 50:29Speaker 05

  Can I get...

• 50:30Speaker 04

  Will you please stay my wife?

• 50:32Speaker 05

  Do you care about me?

• 50:33Speaker 04

  Yes, I care about you more than anything, Laura.

• 50:35Speaker 05

  I need to be fixing myself. You, baby, what about me and that?

• 50:41Speaker 04

  Please, I know, I will do anything to help. I will do anything. I will do anything. I will do anything. Please don't leave. Please don't take my kids. Please, I will do anything.

• 50:53Speaker 05

  David, we're just going to work together.

• 50:56Speaker 04

  I'll pour my heart out to a psychiatrist. I'll tell him everything and I will get better. I will get better. I will do anything. I will do anything to keep you. Anything. Please don't leave. Please. Please. Please. You're the only thing I want in this entire world.

• 51:17Speaker 05

  What about my mental health?

• 51:18Speaker 04

  Okay, whatever, I... I will do anything to make that... to make that better, to make it better for you. I will do anything to make it better. I will do anything to make it better. I will get help. I will be the best husband in the world to you.

• 51:39Speaker 04

  I will be who I've never been. I will do anything. Please, please, you're the only thing I care about. I don't care about anything in this world except you at this point in my life. And my kids, of course.

• 51:54Speaker 04

  These are the things that I care about, more than anything. I want you to love me again.

• 52:01Speaker 05

  Okay, we can work on it, David, but I need some recovery time. I, you cannot imagine what I have been through with this.

• 52:18Speaker 05

  It's not a very easy thing to get over, your spouse having a kid with somebody else. It's not a joke, David.

• 52:25Speaker 04

  I know it's not, Aura. I know I made a mistake. I know I made an enormous mistake. A huge mistake, the biggest mistake ever.

• 52:44Speaker 04

  And there is no way for me to fix it. There's no way for me to, there's no way that you don't, I can't just fix that. I begged and pleaded with this person to please not have a child. Please, don't have a child. Please. Please, this is going to destroy my life.

• 53:07Speaker 04

  Someday, it's gonna come up and destroy my life.

• 53:40Speaker 04

  You're not gonna tell anybody about that, are you?

• 53:43Speaker 05

  No, David.

• 53:47Speaker 05

  I would like to help you. I want a great life for our kids. I want us to get along. That's what I really want.

• 53:56Speaker 04

  But you don't want anything to do with me.

• 53:59Speaker 05

  But I do not want to live in this house with you right now. But we have major problems. And I

• 54:10Speaker 05

  I can barely function right now.

• 54:14Speaker 04

  I feel the same way.

• 54:16Speaker 05

  But I have to. And then it get got to the point, my student loans, I couldn't defer them anymore. I there's nothing. I've just, and imagine my self-esteem. Imagine how I feel. For one second.

• 54:30Speaker 04

  No, I have.

• 54:31Speaker 05

  I'm not good enough for you.

• 54:33Speaker 04

  No, I have.

• 54:34Speaker 05

  I can't pay the bills. I can't, I'm just I I I try so hard, so many hours every day. And it's never enough.

• 54:43Speaker 04

  I know.

• 54:47Speaker 04

  It's not that you're not good enough. Don't ever think that.

• 54:50Speaker 05

  Well, that's how it feels, David, that I I'm was that

• 54:55Speaker 04

  You know what I felt?

• 54:56Speaker 05

  I'm a loser.

• 54:57Speaker 04

  You know what I felt? I feel like I haven't been loved and I feel like I'm not good enough. You're you're you're wildly talented. You're you're beautiful.

• 55:12Speaker 05

  And then I I was so excited to tell you about the top dock thing and you said, oh, they probably just made a mistake. It's just political. I mean.

• 55:20Speaker 04

  I was joking. Jesus.

• 55:22Speaker 05

  But it just I

• 55:23Speaker 04

  Oh, my God. You know my

• 55:25Speaker 05

  I was so excited for myself.

• 55:27Speaker 04

  What?

• 55:28Speaker 05

  Because it's the biggest deal.

• 55:29Speaker 04

  I expect it. Oh, my God, you're, Jesus Christ, you get it every time. You're God, what what do you mean? How do you not have the highest self-esteem? Look at yourself.

• 55:51Speaker 04

  You're the most talented person I know. You're so accomplished, you're so good looking, and look at me.

• 56:00Speaker 04

  I've just turned to shit. Everything in my life has turned to shit. Haven't you noticed I've gained like fucking thirty pounds? In the past year or so? Haven't you noticed how much I'm drinking?

• 56:15Speaker 05

  I know, and you know what that makes me feel like? That I'm not good enough.

• 56:19Speaker 04

  No.

• 56:19Speaker 05

  I don't make you happy because then you have to drink just to be around it.

• 56:23Speaker 04

  No.

• 56:26Speaker 04

  I have to drink to escape the problems I've got.

• 56:32Speaker 04

  Cause I don't know how to come to you for help.

• 56:37Speaker 04

  I mean, I've got plans in the back of my head and I'm, I'm trying to make them all work out.

• 56:45Speaker 04

  But it's like when I tell you about the plan, you're, you're like when I told you I wanted to buy the house.

• 56:50Speaker 05

  Yeah, but every single thing you do is illegal.

• 56:55Speaker 04

  No, it's not.

• 56:58Speaker 04

  Everything, I don't do everything illegal. What do I do that's illegal? My business isn't illegal. It's not perfect, but it's not illegal.

• 57:13Speaker 04

  It, it, it's not illegal.

• 57:14Speaker 05

  What about the fire?

• 57:16Speaker 04

  That's not, I'm not, I'm not responsible for that.

• 57:21Speaker 04

  Are you blaming me for that?

• 57:22Speaker 05

  I don't know, I'm asking you about it, I'm not blaming you.

• 57:25Speaker 04

  No, I'm, why would you blame me for that?

• 57:28Speaker 05

  I'm asking you.

• 57:30Speaker 04

  I was here, you were, you were here with me. We were here. I have nothing to do with it.

• 57:39Speaker 04

  For all I know, fucking Jesse and Chris fucking set the place on fire to fuck me then.

• 57:48Speaker 04

  I'm not trying to go to prison Laura. I'm not trying to fucking be away from my family.

• 57:57Speaker 05

  I just sometimes it seems like if we just did things rationally, you know. And I don't understand what's going on with your business. I mean, just nothing makes sense.

• 58:10Speaker 04

  I don't do things irrationally. I, I granted, I'm not the most brilliant businessman in the world, but.

• 58:28Speaker 04

  I mean, the, the, the, the tax thing is getting fixed. It is.

• 58:35Speaker 04

  It really is. The, the fucking, the attorney, I had to give him the stuff last week. The stuff that they sent back to us.

• 58:47Speaker 04

  I gave it to him last week. He said that that's coming up. You can call him. You can call him and ask him if you don't believe me. He's handling that fucking, uh, the, the, uh, it's, it, it's like an independent arbitrator. He's handling it.

• 59:03Speaker 04

  Okay, I swear to you.

• 59:08Speaker 04

  That's being handled. I talked to the, the guy from the insurance company. The, well, there's two different insurance companies, but he's got approval already this week. He's, uh, I heard from him on Thursday. This week, he's supposed to send me a check for thirty odd thousand dollars. Uh, for, for the one truck. That's eighty percent of it because he can do that right away. Then he's gonna send me the other twenty percent of it. And then the big truck, um, i- is probably gonna take another week because he has to get approval, but that's, that's like a hundred and fifty thousand dollars.

• 59:40Speaker 04

  And the attorney's on, the attorney of, for the, the other insurance company, he said that that, uh, has been kicked to a supervisor on, on the insurance company's, uh, side, and that that guy's going to more than likely cut a check on that. And when, when we do that, that'll be like four hundred thousand dollars, we can buy the house. Or we'll buy another house, whatever, whatever you want.

• 1:00:10Speaker 04

  I'll give it all to you, you can have it, you can be in control of everything, I don't care.

• 1:00:14Speaker 05

  I don't want...

• 1:00:14Speaker 04

  I just, I just don't wanna lose you and my family. Cause believe it or not, I really do love you, believe it or not. Okay, I know I'm not perfect, I know I've made a lot of fucking stupid mistakes.

• 1:00:28Speaker 04

  I mean, a lot of stupid mistakes, I know it.

• 1:00:34Speaker 04

  But I really do care about you, and I really do only want you in this world.

• 1:00:40Speaker 04

  That's all I want. You and my kids, that's it. I mean, I want you to love me. I wish, I wish you loved me more physically, I really do. Honestly, Laura, I, look at me, I swear to you, I really wish you loved me physically. I mean, I know I'm not attractive, I, you know, I know I'm, you know, you know, but I'll get in shape. I'll do whatever I have to do, if, you know, if I need to get in shape, you know, to be more attractive, I will. If I'm not attractive, I'll do anything I have to do.

• 1:01:16Speaker 05

  Problem is, I ha, I don't, I've lost my own self-respect. And it's hard for me to be attracted to you when I'm thinking about you being with her. Okay, that's a big mental barrier. You just said yourself, you wouldn't be able to handle me being with someone else, you'd lose it. Well, I've lost it.

• 1:01:37Speaker 04

  I would lose it, but I'm, I would...

• 1:01:39Speaker 05

  I've lost it.

• 1:01:40Speaker 04

  Okay, but I would regroup because I don't wanna lose my family, and I don't wanna lose the, the woman I love. I don't want to lose that. Why would I lose it? Why would I lose it? Because I don't wanna lose the woman that I care about. That's why I would lose it. I don't wanna lose who I love and care about, and who I wanna be with. That's what I don't want to lose.

• 1:02:08Speaker 04

  I don't want to lose that. Because you really are the person that I love.

• 1:02:19Speaker 04

  You're my wife Laura, and you think if I loved some other woman, why wouldn't I just leave? Why wouldn't I just try to take half your money and leave? Why wouldn't I do that?

• 1:02:30Speaker 04

  Why would I even be here arguing and pleading with you and telling you my deepest and darkest fucking secret? If, if, if I wanted anything other than you? I'm sure some fucking shyster divorce attorney would say, "Hey, you helped her all this time, you could get half of that." Why, why wouldn't I, why wouldn't I do that if I wanted that? I don't want anything but you. You're what I want. I don't care about any of that other shit. I want you and my children. I want my family. That's the only thing in this world that I want.

• 1:03:25Speaker 04

  And I know you're probably not being honest with me when you're telling me that you're not seeing another guy.

• 1:03:31Speaker 04

  You had to have guys come over here and move all the stuff out.

• 1:03:34Speaker 03

  I paid movers, I never seen it.

• 1:03:38Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:03:40Speaker 04

  But if you did?

• 1:03:43Speaker 04

  I wouldn't fucking be happy. You're right, I'd fucking lose it, but I'm, I would, I would have to find a way to get past it.

• 1:04:00Speaker 05

  I don't wanna hurt you David, I'm not here to-

• 1:04:03Speaker 04

  That's all this is doing to me, is hurting me. Just sticking to it, I gotta give you that Laura, you're sticking to it. I don't wanna lose you, and I don't wanna lose my kids.

• 1:04:14Speaker 05

  And I said, "I want to create the best scenario that we can, that's the most positive for them, with two parents that love them and don't fight about it, and you wanna take them to wrestling, you wanna take them to football, and I'm gonna be right there."

• 1:04:25Speaker 04

  No, I want my kids, I wanna, I wanna wake up in the house with them. I wanna be in the house when they go to sleep, I want, you know, when, when they wake up in the middle of the night, you know, and I come out and I say, "Hey, what you doing bud?" "I'm just going to the bathroom dad." You know, I, I don't want to lose that. Laura, Jesus.

• 1:04:47Speaker 04

  This is going to fuck them up.

• 1:04:52Speaker 04

  This is going to destroy them.

• 1:05:03Speaker 04

  He needs us, oh my god.

• 1:05:18Speaker 04

  Can you please, please find it in your heart to try to forgive me and let me do everything and anything I can to fix my problems? Can you please? Please?

• 1:05:39Speaker 04

  Please?

• 1:05:39Speaker 05

  I don't think that I can live with myself with my self-esteem any lower. I feel like crap.

• 1:05:51Speaker 04

  Tell me what I can do to make you feel better, please. Laura, you know you can, you know, you know, you know, that you can find a way if you really want to, you just don't want to. You're that mad at me, you don't want to. You just don't want to.

• 1:06:13Speaker 04

  But you know, you could.

• 1:06:32Speaker 04

  Please.

• 1:06:34Speaker 03

  We can't force it, David. All I'm asking you is to give me a break.

• 1:06:40Speaker 04

  Where did you move to?

• 1:06:43Speaker 03

  Just to the road in Gilbert.

• 1:06:48Speaker 04

  You see, you won't even tell me where...

• 1:06:52Speaker 04

  You just... You want to... Where are the divorce papers? Are they already here? You've already been talking to lawyers. Where are they at?

• 1:07:00Speaker 03

  I didn't file them yet.

• 1:07:02Speaker 04

  But you have them.

• 1:07:04Speaker 03

  Just talking about it.

• 1:07:15Speaker 04

  What did you tell the children?

• 1:07:17Speaker 03

  I told them I'd be back in a few minutes.

• 1:07:21Speaker 04

  And you left them at the police station?

• 1:07:23Speaker 03

  Well, I left them with my friend.

• 1:07:25Speaker 04

  At the police station?

• 1:07:26Speaker 03

  And she was probably gonna take them there.

• 1:07:28Speaker 04

  Where are they spending the night at?

• 1:07:30Speaker 03

  With me.

• 1:07:34Speaker 04

  Out of their home, away from their... away from their rooms, away from their beds. Did you take all their clothes?

• 1:07:40Speaker 03

  No, I left their stuff here so they could be here with you and it can be there with me.

• 1:07:45Speaker 04

  I'm not gonna be able to live here, obviously.

• 1:07:55Speaker 03

  All of their stuff is here.

• 1:08:00Speaker 03

  Cause I'm not here to hurt you.

• 1:08:02Speaker 04

  No, you are here to hurt me, that's fine. You're just like the rest of them. You don't... You... Nobody gives a shit, that's fine.

• 1:08:11Speaker 03

  I do give a shit, and I want to help you. I'd be glad to help you. I just can't stay in this house and do it.

• 1:08:15Speaker 04

  No. That... Whatever, okay.

• 1:08:19Speaker 04

  Okay. I love you and I care about you and I want you.

• 1:08:23Speaker 03

  Okay, well, let's work on it, but I can't stay in this house and work on it right now. I'm just so far down. I try to be good. I go to church. I go do exercise, try to do anything to make myself feel better and I still feel like crap.

• 1:08:37Speaker 04

  Why don't you do stuff with me?

• 1:08:40Speaker 03

  I asked you if you wanna go to church a hundred times and you're not gonna say no.

• 1:08:43Speaker 04

  Okay, why can't we do something that is fun for us together? Why can't we do stuff together? Something, something where I don't have to walk eight hundred miles on a knee that already hurts.

• 1:08:55Speaker 04

  Why can't we do stuff together that will bring us closer together? And maybe, you know, hey, you, there might be a spark between us and you might care about me physically. You might love me again. Why can't we do stuff like that?

• 1:09:10Speaker 03

  I'd be happy to start trying to do that, but right now, I'm very...

• 1:09:15Speaker 04

  You just wanna be single. That's what you want.

• 1:09:17Speaker 03

  I don't care about that.

• 1:09:18Speaker 04

  Put yourself in great shape, out there on the market, have a great time. That's what you want, clearly.

• 1:09:23Speaker 03

  No, it's not.

• 1:09:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, it is, Laura. Cause you don't want me. You haven't wanted me in a very, very long time.

• 1:09:37Speaker 04

  I mean, look, I, I know that you're, you're up here and I'm right here.

• 1:09:42Speaker 03

  I didn't say that.

• 1:09:43Speaker 04

  I understand.

• 1:09:43Speaker 03

  I've known for two years that you had a kid and I thought I was crazy.

• 1:09:47Speaker 04

  First of all, you haven't known for two years because there hasn't been a kid for two years.

• 1:09:50Speaker 03

  Okay, well, his birthday's coming up.

• 1:09:52Speaker 04

  Okay, well, he, he's not two years old, so you haven't known for two years that I've had a kid. Why didn't you, when you cared about me, the last day that you gave a shit, why didn't you say something so we could fix it? Cause I didn't know how to say something.

• 1:10:09Speaker 04

  And I've wanted to fucking fix this problem. I've wanted to fix it because there's nothing else I want other than this.

• 1:10:17Speaker 03

  Because every time I've approached you with these problems, it's...

• 1:10:23Speaker 04

  I lose it? Okay, I understand. I lose it.

• 1:10:30Speaker 04

  But I've never been faced with the fact of having to lose you.

• 1:10:49Speaker 03

  There's stuff up here. They're gonna be here whatever nights you want.

• 1:11:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, you can do sports with them every night and I will be there. Every night.

• 1:11:10Speaker 04

  Or I want you as well.

• 1:11:15Speaker 04

  I want you.

• 1:11:19Speaker 04

  So tell me what, what, what track I have to get on to get you back.

• 1:11:24Speaker 03

  I want you to let me walk out this door.

• 1:11:27Speaker 04

  I'm, I'm sitting on the floor.

• 1:11:30Speaker 03

  And we can talk tomorrow. We can talk the next day. We can talk every day.

• 1:11:33Speaker 04

  You don't, you, you won't, you won't come back.

• 1:11:50Speaker 04

  He doesn't, he, I'm pretty sure we hide it pretty good.

• 1:12:00Speaker 03

  You.

• 1:12:02Speaker 04

  Really?

• 1:12:03Speaker 03

  Yes. Every time you're horribly upset with him, he gets a headache and throws up. He's, he feeds off us all the time. And then when I spend a lot.

• 1:12:13Speaker 04

  When does he get a headache and throw up? When, when did he do this?

• 1:12:16Speaker 03

  He's done that three or four times recently. After you yell at him and then you go upstairs, he throws up his dinner or he throws up in the bathroom.

• 1:12:24Speaker 03

  There's a lot of stress on that kid, okay? And then in a, in another weird way, when I'm spending a lot of time with him, it'll be like after spring break or something and I'm really trying to be like so positive with him. He goes back to school, gets in a ton of trouble and I ask him why. He says, "Cause I wanna be with you, mom. I wanna, I wanna do the fun things that we did last weekend or something." And then I feel like I'm like overcompensating, you know what I mean? It's just like this never-ending.

• 1:12:49Speaker 04

  And this is gonna work out so well with us apart. Well, hey, if you wanna fuck up the kids, you wanna have fucked up kids and, and you wanna go out and do whatever you wanna do and, and you wanna see me run off the edge, then go ahead. You gotta do what you gotta hear. I took your keys, by the way, because I didn't want you to leave. Go do what you gotta do Laura.

• 1:13:16Speaker 03

  I have to go and I don't wanna fight with you.

• 1:13:17Speaker 04

  No, I know you don't wanna fight with me, you just wanna, you wanna do this and, and it's.

• 1:13:23Speaker 03

  And I wanna see you tomorrow.

• 1:13:24Speaker 04

  No you don't, you don't.

• 1:13:26Speaker 03

  I will bring them there myself.

• 1:13:29Speaker 04

  When are my kids coming home?

• 1:13:31Speaker 03

  Tomorrow night.

• 1:13:32Speaker 04

  Cause that's all I'm gonna have to care about because you don't, you, it's clear you don't care about me.

• 1:13:37Speaker 03

  Whatever days you want, tomorrow night after.

• 1:13:39Speaker 04

  I want them, I want them every night this week.

• 1:13:43Speaker 03

  And then I have the weekend, I mean, the thing is.

• 1:13:46Speaker 04

  No, I want my children, you said I can have them anytime I want them, I want them. I want my children.

• 1:13:53Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:13:53Speaker 04

  I don't, no, I don't.

• 1:13:54Speaker 03

  The law is half and half.

• 1:13:56Speaker 04

  Laura, I don't, no, the law isn't, Laura, if, see, you're just telling me you don't wanna be vindictive and hurt me. But that's exactly what you're doing, when you're taking my kids away from me, that's what you're doing, you're hurting me. You're taking my children away from me, you're hurting me. You're right now, what you're doing is you're taking an opportune time to leave me with everything hanging over my head. And, here you go David.

• 1:14:18Speaker 03

  You're gonna get your money, maybe you can.

• 1:14:20Speaker 04

  Here you go David, here you go David, here you go. No, that, you know, this is exactly what everybody's wanted. This is what, exactly what, where everyone who's been stabbing in the eye has been hoping for.

• 1:14:36Speaker 04

  This is great. This is exactly it.

• 1:14:44Speaker 03

  They can come home tomorrow after wrestling. And, eh, we will.

• 1:14:49Speaker 04

  I want my children tonight.

• 1:14:51Speaker 03

  We'll both see them every day.

• 1:14:53Speaker 04

  I want my children, I want them to wake up and go to school, they're gonna wake up when Stacy gets here. Take them to school, that'll be it.

• 1:15:03Speaker 04

  I want my children. I want my children tonight. You're gonna leave me alone in this house? You're gonna take my kids? And just run off? And do whatever to somebody, some strange house? I don't even know where my kids are. I don't even know where they are. In some strange house. I want my kids tonight. I want them in their house tonight.

• 1:15:28Speaker 04

  I don't want my, I don't want my children away. If you want us, if you're gonna fuck me and destroy me and, and hurt me, that's fine. I'm gonna have to, I'm gonna have to pick up my ass and live with it. Okay, I don't know what else to do. That's all I can do. I wish, I wish I could do anything to fix this. But you're telling me that it's just not gonna happen. I see it, I smell it, I feel it. It's not gonna happen. You're not gonna, you're not gonna forgive me. You're not gonna give me a chance. You're not. You know it. You've said it, that's it. You've got the papers, you're gonna file them and that's it. You're just waiting to do this to me.

• 1:16:14Speaker 04

  I want my children. I want them here. I want them in the house.

• 1:16:20Speaker 04

  This isn't fair to me. It's not, this is not fair. And I understand that me saying something fair is not probably the right terminology that I should be using because I haven't been fair to you.

• 1:16:34Speaker 04

  But I want my kids. These are my kids.

• 1:16:38Speaker 04

  I love them and care about them. I don't want them in some strange house. They should be in their beds.

• 1:16:46Speaker 04

  Wake up in their beds.

• 1:16:49Speaker 04

  Go to school.

• 1:16:51Speaker 04

  I want my children here.

• 1:16:54Speaker 04

  This isn't fair.

• 1:16:57Speaker 04

  This isn't fair to them. You wanna talk about not doing things to them? That's exactly what this is doing.

• 1:17:08Speaker 04

  The first second of this, what you're doing here is destroying. I'll tell you what, for all the mistakes I've made, the last thing I've wanted is to destroy my family. That's the last thing in the world that I've wanted. The last thing is to destroy my family. I don't want them hurt. I didn't, I've never wanted you hurt. Never once have I wanted you hurt. That's why I'm obviously concealed everything. Cause I've never wanted you hurt, ever. Cause I care about you and I love you. But I love my kids too. They're a piece of me.

• 1:17:54Speaker 04

  I can't be without my children. If you've gotta go, then you've gotta go. And you gotta go be sane, that's fine. But I've got, I've gotta have my children. These are my sons. These are a piece of me. These are the only things in this world that are proof that I've been here. There's, I have nothing else. I have no family, nothing. Fucking, I've got a half-assed uncle. Are you kidding me? This is the family. This is the only family I've got, is those boys. That's what I love, that's what I care about. You can't take them from me. You cannot. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna, no, I'm not gonna go for that one.

• 1:18:36Speaker 04

  A lot of things will happen before my kids will be taken from me, Laura. You can go spend the night at your cop friend's house, date a cop, all, whatever you gotta do, but my kids are gonna be with me, come hell or high water. I'm sorry, but I've gotta fight me now. These are my children, and if it takes me doing something crazy, I'll do it. Because you know I'm capable of it, and you know I love my children. Those are the two things you're not gonna cross. Do not take my children. Do you understand me? Do you understand me? Where are my children?

• 1:19:14Speaker 03

  Um, I'll get them.

• 1:19:16Speaker 04

  No, I'll get them. I want my children. I'm not gonna just trust you.

• 1:19:28Speaker 04

  Where are my children?

• 1:19:29Speaker 03

  They're with the police.

• 1:19:31Speaker 04

  Alright, well you have the police bring them here.

• 1:19:38Speaker 04

  No, you can do this here.

• 1:19:40Speaker 03

  Ken, let me step outside, okay?

• 1:19:44Ashley Flowers?

  At this point, Laura steps out and makes a call to the person who has her kids. And then the audio cuts off. When the deputies go to arrest Dave, they have not listened to this whole recording yet. But they show up with a huge police presence, mostly because of the threats Laura accused Dave of making and the weapons that she said he had. The following body cam audio of their conversation with Dave has been edited for time and clarity, and it's gonna pick up at the point where Dave has already been put in handcuffs.

• 1:20:19Speaker 01

  The reason I'm here is your wife. After she left, she called the sheriff's office saying that you and her were involved in altercation, where she alleged that you wouldn't let her leave, you tried to choke her a couple times. Every time she would go out the door, you would grab her by the throat and pull her back in while you guys talked for, I think it was like an hour, hour and a half.

• 1:20:45Speaker 01

  I'm talking about what she's alleging.

• 1:20:48Speaker 01

  She said during which time you threatened that neither one of you would get out of it alive, you would kill her and yourself. Then you took that back and said you would only kill yourself, which, that in itself I have a problem with because I don't want...

• 1:21:06Speaker 07

  I didn't choke her, I didn't touch her, I didn't grab her.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:21:10Speaker 07

  I asked her if she wanted me. You know, I was at that point, I'm, I get home from a trip, you know, taking my children to a wrestling tournament.

• 1:21:19Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:21:19Speaker 07

  Gone all weekend, and I'm slapped in the face with mistakes that I've made. Um, which, you know, I fully acknowledge, you know, the mistakes that I've made.

• 1:21:29Speaker 01

  Okay, well what started the whole thing tonight?

• 1:21:33Speaker 07

  She handed me a notebook saying that the reason why she's leaving is because I've had an affair.

• 1:21:40Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:21:41Speaker 07

  And, you know, I told her that, you know, I wanted to make it right, I wanted to make it better. I didn't want her to leave, please don't leave me, you know, and in the, in the, you know, would I kill myself thing, I asked if that was something that she wanted. I'm like, what do you want me to do? Do you want me to, you know, do you want me to shoot myself? What do you want me to do? What, what do I need to do to prove to you how much I love you and care about you?

• 1:22:06Speaker 01

  Okay. In course of conversation, did you make reference to you killing both of you and her?

• 1:22:14Speaker 07

  No, absolutely not. Absolutely not. In fact, I didn't even say I would, I would kill my, I asked her if that's what she wanted.

• 1:22:22Speaker 01

  Okay. Because I have an hour and I think 20 minutes worth of audio recordings that I haven't listened to yet. It has the whole conversation you guys had.

• 1:22:31Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 1:22:32Speaker 01

  That's why I'm asking you, before I go and spend an hour and 20 minutes listening to it, what am I gonna do around there?

• 1:22:38Speaker 07

  No, no, I, I don't, I don't think I, I said that I would kill her ever. No.

• 1:22:43Speaker 01

  You don't think or you didn't?

• 1:22:45Speaker 07

  I don't think I did.

• 1:22:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:22:47Speaker 07

  Well, look, I was really upset, you know, I was, you know.

• 1:22:50Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:22:51Speaker 07

  Very, very, very upset.

• 1:22:54Speaker 01

  Okay, but she was very fearful when she was talking to me, which is why you see

• 1:22:59Speaker 07

  Sure.

• 1:23:00Speaker 01

  The police presence you see here when I came to talk to you.

• 1:23:02Speaker 07

  Understood.

• 1:23:03Speaker 01

  Because she was worried that you might do something when we get here, whether it be do something like shoot at us, shoot yourself, all the things that we wanted to prevent, that's why there was a show of force.

• 1:23:14Speaker 07

  I hear you, I hear you. You've gotta do your job.

• 1:23:17Speaker 01

  I'd rather be here with a bunch of cops and nothing happened than be here by myself and have to wait for somebody to show up.

• 1:23:22Speaker 07

  Sure. Understood, understood. Lot of, lot of crazy stuff going on with this.

• 1:23:26Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:23:28Speaker 07

  No, I, I, like I said, I, you know, I, I don't think I ever said I would kill her, no.

• 1:23:33Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:23:34Speaker 07

  And I, and obviously I would never do that. One simple fact, she's the mother of my children, I love her very much and I care for her very much.

• 1:23:44Speaker 01

  Unfortunately, people do stupid things. You see it on the news all the time. People love each other and they still shoot each other.

• 1:23:50Speaker 07

  Oh, you're right. You're right.

• 1:23:51Speaker 01

  In moments of anger and...

• 1:23:53Speaker 07

  Yeah, well, yeah, irrational, irrational thinking. Yes, I understand. And sure, I was, at that point, I was probably very irrational, but not to the point where I'm gonna, you know, punch her or choke her or any of that stuff.

• 1:24:08Speaker 01

  Okay. Would you have said anything to make her concerned that you would be coming after her? To where she would have to be fearful of you?

• 1:24:19Speaker 07

  Well, I did say, you know, "Hey, I'm not gonna let you take my kids."

• 1:24:22Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:24:23Speaker 07

  "I'm not gonna let you take my kids. You know I'm not gonna let you take my kids."

• 1:24:26Speaker 01

  Was there any threat, any other bodily harm, not to the extent of killing her, but something else that she would have been fearful of?

• 1:24:34Speaker 07

  What do you mean?

• 1:24:35Speaker 01

  That's what I'm asking you. Like, if she was to take the kids, were you gonna hurt her?

• 1:24:40Speaker 07

  No, no, no. I, no, I mean, obviously, I mean, if she's gonna leave and I can't get her to forgive me and understand, you know, and she's past the point of understanding, then okay, then I, you know, I've gotta go into, hey, I gotta fight for my kids.

• 1:24:57Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:24:57Speaker 07

  I've gotta fight for my kids. I've gotta, you know, I've gotta get an attorney. I mean, if you look on my phone, that's, you know, when you called, that's what I was doing. I was looking up Arizona divorce law.

• 1:25:07Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:25:07Speaker 07

  And I, it's right there on my phone, you know?

• 1:25:10Speaker 01

  And how many kids do you share together?

• 1:25:12Speaker 07

  Three.

• 1:25:12Speaker 01

  Three? And how long have you guys been married?

• 1:25:14Speaker 07

  Um, since 1991.

• 1:25:17Speaker 01

  It's a long time.

• 1:25:19Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's twenty, twenty-two years.

• 1:25:22Speaker 01

  Now, was there any type of physical altercation between either you or her, putting her hands on you or anything?

• 1:25:29Speaker 07

  Um, no, I mean, when, the, the only time we ever even got body to body was, um, was I, you know, I hugged her and she didn't wanna hug me back.

• 1:25:43Speaker 01

  Okay. And then, when was this tug, as you call it? I'm gonna have it all laid out.

• 1:25:51Speaker 07

  I got you.

• 1:25:52Speaker 01

  Cause I gotta get things from your perspective that happened.

• 1:25:55Speaker 07

  I got you. Um, she, uh...

• 1:26:03Speaker 01

  Was it like at the door and did you pull her back inside when you did it? What? Tell me what happened there?

• 1:26:10Speaker 07

  Um, okay, so I knew something was going on.

• 1:26:15Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:26:16Speaker 07

  Um, when I first came home, she, um, she immediately took the kid and said, "We're going to Walmart." So I was just like, "Okay." So I go in the house, I'm starting to put stuff away in, and the bedroom door is locked. I'm like, "Okay, why is the bedroom door locked?" I'm looking around for one of those little things to open the door, can't find it. So I go around to the back door, and I go in the bedroom, and everything's gone. And I'm like, "Oh shit, what, what just happened here?" So I start calling her, I'm like, "Hey, you know, are you still at Walmart?" "Uh, no, I'm not." I'm like, "Okay, uh, what, what time you coming back? Can you bring a pizza?" You know, I'm, I'm trying to feel what's going on here.

• 1:26:59Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:27:00Speaker 07

  Um, she says, "Sure, bring the pizza." So, um, it'd been a while, so I'm getting ready to leave, so, you know, because I think maybe she's at, um, another friend of her house, a friend of hers' house.

• 1:27:13Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:27:13Speaker 07

  Um, so I pull out, and I see her pull in, so I pull in, um, you know, I turn around, come back. Um, she said, "Your pizza's upstairs." Um, and I met her at the garage to the house door.

• 1:27:28Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:27:28Speaker 07

  She was coming out. And I'm like, "Hey, let's talk." Because I knew something was going on. She hands me this and says, um, uh, something to the effect of, "I can't do this anymore." Um, and, and we start talking. Um, we, you know, and, and I'm just, you know, I don't, I don't, you know, strike her or anything. I, you know, I know I did put my arms around her, I'm, I'm like, "Hey, you know, come on, let's talk, let's talk, please, let's talk." Um, we move into the living room, um...

• 1:28:05Speaker 07

  We're talking there.

• 1:28:10Speaker 07

  But, but before, hold on, but before I,

• 1:28:15Speaker 07

  I went in the house, I reached into her,

• 1:28:19Speaker 07

  her car and I took the car keys.

• 1:28:21Speaker 01

  Which one's her car?

• 1:28:22Speaker 07

  Well, it's not here, the Tahoe.

• 1:28:24Speaker 01

  The Tahoe, okay.

• 1:28:25Speaker 07

  I took the Tahoe keys, put them in my pocket because I wanted to talk to her.

• 1:28:29Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:28:32Speaker 07

  So, we get towards the back door.

• 1:28:37Speaker 07

  We're talking.

• 1:28:43Speaker 07

  I don't remember everything that was said.

• 1:28:48Speaker 07

  You know, basically, I'm pleading.

• 1:28:49Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:28:51Speaker 07

  You know, to, you know, give me another chance.

• 1:28:56Speaker 07

  She has the dog and I think she's gonna take the dog for a walk, so we start to walk outside. And then,

• 1:29:10Speaker 07

  I was, I was like towards the driveway side and she,

• 1:29:19Speaker 07

  she, I, I don't know if like she was letting the dog go or what, but she like started to bolt that way and I'm like, "Hold on, let's talk, let's talk, let's talk, come on, let's talk, let's talk."

• 1:29:31Speaker 07

  And I, I do think she said something like, "You're not letting me leave."

• 1:29:34Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:29:35Speaker 07

  Now that I'm thinking about all this in hindsight, I feel like I must have been set up for this.

• 1:29:42Speaker 07

  Because I do believe she did say something to you that, "You're not letting me leave."

• 1:29:48Speaker 07

  And I'm just like, you know, "I just wanna talk to you."

• 1:29:50Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:29:50Speaker 07

  "I love you, I wanna talk to you." And, you know, we talked for a while longer and, you know, and I, you know, bared my soul. And she's just like, you know, "You know, I don't wanna do this, I don't wanna do," you know, and I'm, I'm like, "Okay," you know, I give her back her keys and I'm like, "If you're going, you're going." You know, "You gotta go, you gotta go." She didn't know I had the keys, I took them out of my pocket and I'm talking like, "Here, you're gonna need these."

• 1:30:12Speaker 01

  Did her, you at any point take her phone away from her?

• 1:30:16Speaker 07

  Uh, I didn't take her phone from her. She, she carries two phones, by the way.

• 1:30:20Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:30:21Speaker 07

  Um, I, I had my arms around her. I was hugging her. I was like, please, please, please don't go. And her phone is in one of those little slip things.

• 1:30:29Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:30:30Speaker 07

  And it slipped in my hand. I just set it down.

• 1:30:32Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:30:32Speaker 07

  And, and I, and I in fact told her, I'm like, cause like the, her phone went off or something like that. And she didn't realize it. I'm like, you know, it's over here. It's on the couch. I set it down. I didn't, I didn't realize, you know. I was more focused on talking to her.

• 1:30:45Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:30:45Speaker 07

  And, but she still had another phone, by the way. Um, I mean, if she really felt in fear of her life, she could have called or, you know.

• 1:30:54Speaker 01

  Now, during your conversation with her while you were inside, did you stand between her and the door to make her think she couldn't leave?

• 1:31:02Speaker 07

  No, I, I sat on the ground. I was sitting on the ground.

• 1:31:06Speaker 01

  Where at? In the home of the house?

• 1:31:10Speaker 07

  I was...

• 1:31:15Speaker 07

  Oh, I, I, a couple of times I leaned back onto the, uh...

• 1:31:21Speaker 07

  Uh, what the hell do you call it? Like the bar?

• 1:31:24Speaker 01

  Okay, like the kitchen area?

• 1:31:26Speaker 07

  Yes.

• 1:31:26Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:31:26Speaker 07

  And she was, she was sitting on the edge of the couch by the door.

• 1:31:30Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:31:31Speaker 07

  While I was talking to her. And, I mean, if she, you know, if she wanted to, you know, she could have walked right out. And I think I made reference to that. You know, if you're, you know, if you wanna walk out, you can walk out. You know, I'm, I'm, you know, I love you. I'm trying to salvage this.

• 1:31:44Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:31:46Speaker 07

  So, you know, that was it.

• 1:31:49Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:31:49Speaker 07

  And then she, I told her, you know, I'm like, hey, you know, you know, she's like, you can have the kids anytime you want them. I'm like, well then, you know, I want them. You know, I want them now. I want them tonight, you know? You know, they're, they're, they're, you know, and she told me she, she left them with her friend, you know, the cop. Who's gonna, you know, take them to the police or something. Like, my kids are at a police station.

• 1:32:08Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:32:08Speaker 07

  They don't know what's going on with, with their dad. They don't know anything.

• 1:32:12Speaker 01

  Do you or her have any kids from any other relationships?

• 1:32:16Speaker 07

  Um, I do. Which is part of the problem.

• 1:32:19Speaker 01

  Okay, what about her? Does she have any kids from any other relationship or just the three that you guys have?

• 1:32:24Speaker 07

  No, she, no, she doesn't have any. I mean, I've known her since she was

• 1:32:27Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm just asking, I'm just gonna count for everybody.

• 1:32:29Speaker 07

  Okay, alright.

• 1:32:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:32:31Speaker 07

  Um, so that's, you know, that's basically it. I'm just like, you know, where are my kids? Where are my kids? You know, I want my kids. I want them tonight. I want my kids. And she's like, okay, well, let me, let me go, let me go call. I'm like, I'm like, no, have your friend bring the kids here. You know, let me, she's like, let me go pick them up and bring them around. I'm like, no, have your, have your friend bring them here or we'll go get them. You know, I don't trust that. And rightfully so. So she goes outside. She, um, I don't know if she faked to make a phone call or actually made a phone call. But then, you know, I sat inside for, you know, ten, fifteen minutes before, you know, I walked outside.

• 1:33:08Speaker 07

  Knowing what I already know that she had left.

• 1:33:10Speaker 01

  Okay. Up until today, have you guys had any other problems? Have you been arguing more lately, anything like that?

• 1:33:19Speaker 07

  No, actually, no. I mean, we, I mean, we're civil to each other. I mean, we have, we haven't been perfect, but, um, the closest time we've had to,

• 1:33:30Speaker 07

  you know, any, any argument was probably, Jesus. Eight months ago. Um, and we just, you know, I thought at that point, maybe we were going to, you know, you know, hit the skids. Um, you know, it was just like, you know, I, you know, I wanna have my kids. If, you know, if we're not gonna be together, I wanna have, you know, primary custody of my kids.

• 1:33:52Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:33:52Speaker 07

  Which I do believe is the, you know, honestly, now in hindsight, I believe that this entire night was engineered to, you know,

• 1:34:02Speaker 07

  to make me look like a jackass, which.

• 1:34:04Speaker 01

  Well, as far as the kids go, I don't, what I'm doing doesn't determine who gets custody of who or anything. That has to go through a family court judge and the family court judge has to decide that.

• 1:34:15Speaker 07

  Understood.

• 1:34:15Speaker 01

  It has nothing to do with what's going on right now, who has

• 1:34:19Speaker 01

  custody of the kids.

• 1:34:20Speaker 07

  Understood.

• 1:34:22Speaker 07

  Well, obviously, if she's gonna try, you know, she's obviously trying to get me into trouble. If she can get me into trouble, then that, you know, that weighs against me.

• 1:34:31Speaker 01

  Well, again, this is a criminal side versus the family court side. I mean, yeah, they can tie together, but this-

• 1:34:38Speaker 07

  If I'm a criminal, they're not gonna be me-

• 1:34:41Speaker 01

  This won't be a deciding factor if you're gonna get your kids or not.

• 1:34:46Speaker 07

  Oh, yeah-

• 1:34:47Speaker 01

  And you still have to be convicted. Right now, you're not guilty of any crimes. You have to go through the court process before you're found guilty and convicted of a crime and be, as you said, a criminal.

• 1:34:59Speaker 07

  I understand, but I mean, I mean, one is enough.

• 1:35:02Speaker 01

  Tonight allegations are one thing. It's not a definite thing. She made allegations, so that's why I'm here investigating things. Because I haven't listened to the whole hour and twenty-minute-long recording that she gave me.

• 1:35:14Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 1:35:15Speaker 01

  That's sitting on my computer right now to listen to.

• 1:35:17Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 1:35:19Speaker 01

  And I'm trying to get to the bottom of what actually happened, because sometime, even just because she's the one that called 911, or the non-numbered number, doesn't mean that everything went the way she said it went.

• 1:35:31Speaker 07

  I got you.

• 1:35:31Speaker 01

  That's why I'm here to talk to you as well.

• 1:35:33Speaker 07

  Yeah, sure. I mean, I was a rational, you know, I was an idiot, you know, I mean, I was, you know, begging for my-

• 1:35:39Speaker 01

  The reason you saw the presence, though, was because of what she told me initially about firearms. You may not be cooperative, this and that, so rather than take a chance-

• 1:35:47Speaker 07

  I got you.

• 1:35:49Speaker 01

  I didn't do, you came out just fine. You cooperated just fine.

• 1:35:54Speaker 01

  But I had to-

• 1:35:55Speaker 07

  Well, I'm calmer now, you know, I'm trying to, I'm trying to piece together all of it.

• 1:35:58Speaker 01

  For my safety, for all their safety, that's why things went down the way they did.

• 1:36:02Speaker 07

  Look, I completely understand.

• 1:36:03Speaker 01

  It doesn't increase the severity of anything.

• 1:36:05Speaker 07

  You don't have to, you don't have to explain that. I understand that. I mean, my, my only negative thought right now is like, Jesus Christ, did I say something that I didn't mean that's going to be used against me? You know, I'm trying to think right now. Did I say something ridiculous that I didn't mean, and I don't think I did?

• 1:36:25Speaker 01

  Well, as far as anything's said, the thing that I'm most concerned about is if you threaten to kill her or yourself.

• 1:36:31Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:36:32Speaker 01

  Those are the two things that-

• 1:36:34Speaker 07

  I, I, I don't think I did. Look, it's possible. You look at it or read it or-

• 1:36:41Speaker 01

  Well, I'm gonna have to listen to it. I'm not for sure.

• 1:36:43Speaker 07

  I don't, I mean, look, I mean, I-

• 1:36:47Speaker 07

  I may have so touched him. It's completely possible. I don't think I did, but I mean, I was in there for a long time, you know, begging for my, you know, my life, my livelihood, you know, my life. You know, trying to salvage what was there. And if I said something stupid, it would definitely be... The only way I could chalk it up to anything is just being a rational thought.

• 1:37:10Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:37:10Speaker 07

  Nothing behind it.

• 1:37:11Speaker 01

  Alright. Now, off the subject, where are the weapons in the house?

• 1:37:15Speaker 07

  Um, upstairs, in the, um...

• 1:37:23Speaker 07

  It's like a, it's like a little, uh, closet area. And if you, if you go into that, there's a, um...

• 1:37:43Speaker 07

  To the far, like if you walk in it, to the far left-hand side, there's a, uh, like a shotgun case.

• 1:37:52Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:37:53Speaker 07

  And it's got a shotgun in it with a, uh, the trigger guard, it's unloaded. And the, um, actually the, um...

• 1:38:08Speaker 07

  Um...

• 1:38:11Speaker 07

  The pistol is probably with it, in the case.

• 1:38:16Speaker 01

  Okay, so is it just the two guns?

• 1:38:18Speaker 07

  Yeah. And that, well, and then at my office I have one.

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  Okay. And your office is in Phoenix?

• 1:38:23Speaker 07

  Yes.

• 1:38:23Speaker 01

  Now, would you be okay with me to take him for tonight? As a safekeeping thing and hold on to him so there's no allegations in the future?

• 1:38:31Speaker 07

  No, no, I, I don't, I, obviously not. I don't want, you know, I don't want to have to go through any of that if, if I don't have to.

• 1:38:37Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:38:38Speaker 07

  You know, I, I honestly, I, I, irregardless of anything that has been said, I don't feel as though I've done anything to, you know, put anyone in jeopardy or harm.

• 1:38:53Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:38:56Speaker 01

  Alright, well I'm gonna go talk to my partners a little bit and I gotta listen to some of that recordings so I kinda know what if any of the allegations were true. Cause I'm not gonna

• 1:39:10Speaker 01

  charge you with things you didn't do. Or allegedly didn't do.

• 1:39:13Speaker 07

  Okay, well I mean, I appreciate it.

• 1:39:16Speaker 01

  Alright, I try to do my job as fair as possible.

• 1:39:18Speaker 07

  I got you.

• 1:39:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:39:20Speaker 07

  But these is elusive. I'm just, I'm, I've been a long time since I've been in any handcuffs in this.

• 1:39:27Speaker 01

  What were you handcuffed before?

• 1:39:29Speaker 07

  Um, I had a guy road rage me about four years ago, right out here. Um, I was in my, uh, big tow truck. So I pulled into the center divide because more than, you know, the two lanes go to one. Uh, I pulled in that, you know, the side line to let him look at the guy's scene where I live. And I just stopped there and I sat there. But I turned around and came back.

• 1:39:54Speaker 01

  Now were you arrested for that?

• 1:39:55Speaker 07

  Well, yeah, actually, well, what happened was, is, um, the guy, I never got out of my truck, the guy kicked my door in. Uh, the officer, uh, Gilbert officer, he, he took me down and charged me with either disorderly conduct or something. Um, and it got locked away because there was no evidence.

• 1:40:17Speaker 01

  Okay, did you go to jail that night or just get kicked?

• 1:40:20Speaker 07

  No, I came, yeah, they had me drive my truck in here, they took me down, booked me in. Uh, and then that same officer drove me back, I think once he realized, um, the, that, you know, I didn't do anything, he, cause he came out the next day and apologized.

• 1:40:37Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:40:37Speaker 07

  Um, so, I mean, we.

• 1:40:39Speaker 01

  Alright, listen, you're kind of a big guy, but I'll put a second set on you so you have a little bit of room to move.

• 1:40:44Speaker 07

  Well, thank you.

• 1:40:46Speaker 01

  So go ahead and.

• 1:40:46Speaker 07

  I guess the fat part of me.

• 1:40:48Speaker 01

  Alright, go ahead and step out and then face the, face the vehicle, okay?

• 1:40:54Speaker 01

  That way I'll give you more room so that there's much pressure on your shoulder.

• 1:40:59Speaker 01

  I got the lock facing you. Yeah, just keep facing the truck, okay? Got you.

• 1:41:04Ashley Flowers?

  My reporter Nicole and I found this audio incredibly insightful. I mean, we could spend all day guessing how Laura felt about her marriage or her safety when leaving that marriage. But you can only get so much when trying to read between black and white lines on a police report. To hear it in her own words, I mean, it's hard to overstate how important this was. So, thank you to the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office for fulfilling this request. This is how it's supposed to work. And I think hearing this now raises a lot more questions, not just about Laura's case, but even about Nick Cordova's too.

• 1:41:45Ashley Flowers?

  If you remember from Nick Cordova's episode, Dave had told officers that the gun he had in his office, he had just gotten because of a domestic custody dispute that he was having in 2020. Well, maybe that gun was new, but Dave was pretty clear here. He had a gun in his office as early as 2013. Did something just get lost in translation? Or should we read more into that? I also think Laura had a lot of information about Dave's business dealings. Information that I think could be critical to understanding how this man operated then and in 2020, maybe even now.

• 1:42:27Ashley Flowers?

  And a couple of questions are top of mind for me coming out of hearing this. One, what fire was Laura referencing? Does anyone out there know about a fire that happened, which was somehow connected to one of Dave's businesses? Second, what is the deal with this $400,000 of tax debt that Laura is talking about being in, that they're going to be coming after her for? And more importantly, I would love to know more about all those insurance payouts that Dave seemed to be expecting to help them get in a good spot. And third and finally, we obviously looked into all the businesses Dave had in his name. But at one point Laura accused Dave of starting a business with his mistress

• 1:43:10Ashley Flowers?

  and putting his and Laura's children's names on the LLC to ensure the woman wouldn't become a majority owner or take anything that wasn't hers. Now I feel like I have to go down another rabbit hole. Does this LLC still exist? What is it? Do any of you out there know? You guys have been incredible with reaching out and sharing information. This audio that we got is not the only tip we've gotten in relation to this case. And I promise when we have more, I'll be back. In the meantime, keep it coming, you guys. I said it before, but I mean it. Just because the episode ends does not mean our reporting stops.

• 1:43:51Ashley Flowers?

  So you can reach out to us anytime by emailing [email protected]. We'll be back Monday with our regularly scheduled programming.