Pod Insights THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends! Trump Tariffs Hit the Car Market? Are Manufacturers Screwed? About this episode Sell your cool car today on carsandbids.com
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Transcript 18,731 words · 8 speakers
Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Speaker 00 Welcome to the 50th Hunger Games. Witness the beginning of the revolution. Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from Star. Filmed for IMAX. Make them remember you.
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0:49 Doug DeMuro? Hello and welcome to this car pod. I'm Kenan.
0:53 Speaker 03 I'm Filippo.
0:53 Doug DeMuro? And let's start with the news. The craziest news story of the week, of the month, of the year is tariffs. Moments before we recorded this podcast, the Trump administration announced a 25% tariff on imported cars, which is unbelievably insane and incredibly damaging to the car industry. It's going to be based on final assembly. Seemingly.
1:15 Speaker 03 I will say, this is all like literally the.
1:17 Doug DeMuro? We're getting this information 20 minutes ago it was announced. But it looks like it's going to be based on where the car is built. Now, the crazy thing about that, I actually don't entirely think that the concept of this is insane on its face, but it goes into effect in five days. Now, the president, I'm not sure if he's aware, the automakers can't build a factory in the United States in five days. However, over the last 30 years since NAFTA and then the agreement that replaced NAFTA was signed, the automakers have made enormous investments in production based on their assumption that these agreements, which were positively signed by all parties.
1:54 Speaker 03 Included by the Trump administration.
1:55 Doug DeMuro? Including by the Trump administration, who negotiated the successor treaty to NAFTA, would continue to stay in place. And then to just pull the rug on the auto industry is one of the craziest things. In addition, it's also crazy because I'm sitting here looking at this. The Nissan Rogue, half its parts come from Japan, but it's built in the U.S. No tariff. The Toyota RAV4, 75% of its parts come from the U.S. and Canada, but it's built in Canada. Tariff.
2:19 Speaker 03 Seemingly.
2:20 Doug DeMuro? Again, I want to. So you're actually penalizing American component manufacturers.
2:26 Speaker 03 It's all insane. I will say, so it is 3:17 PM Pacific time on Wednesday right now. Since this announcement less than an hour ago, GM stock is down and it keeps dropping 6.71% in aftermarket average trading after being down 3% during the day today.
2:40 Doug DeMuro? It's gonna be impossible to explain the effect this will have on GM.
2:45 Speaker 03 I think GM had a random glance, but.
2:47 Doug DeMuro? Please read our quote.
2:48 Speaker 03 A gentleman named Flavio Volpe, who's the head of Canada's Automotive Parts Manufacturing Association, this is from, pulls from Automotive News, had a great quote, which says, "China could only dream of damaging the American auto industry so quickly and so decisively as what Trump is threatening to do here again."
3:03 Doug DeMuro? It's hard to really explain the negative effect that this will have on the American automobile industry, including for American auto manufacturers, even though the goal is to incentivize automakers to bring production to the States. I don't think, I think if you said, "Hey, a tariff is gonna come in five years, you have to start making these investments in the US," that would be one thing, and I think that would be a reasonable thing if you're Trump and you want to be protectionist on the economy, which, which I think is a stance that he was elected on. Saying that you're gonna do it in five days is.
3:33 Speaker 03 A little tough.
3:33 Doug DeMuro? The cars, people don't understa-, does Trump not underst-, the cars are gonna be radically more expensive for consumers. I mean, this is gonna just destroy.
3:40 Speaker 03 This is a lot of cars. A lot of cars are made in the US, and to be fair, and in the future, maybe more cars will, but in the meantime, they're at four, the best-selling car in America, 25% more expensive.
3:50 Doug DeMuro? Is gonna be a 25% tariff. So, so we'll, we'll see if they actually make it 25% more expensive.
3:56 Speaker 03 Right. They'll defer the cost a bunch across a lot of things, see where they can eat some of that cost.
4:00 Doug DeMuro? Or maybe they'll just have to eat some of the cost until they think that this ends, because you have to assume that this ends soon. There's no way they can continue running a 25% tariff on some of the most popular cars in America, which in some cases are built by American companies overseas, overseas, in Mexico or in Canada.
4:16 Speaker 03 Right.
4:16 Doug DeMuro? Based on the agreement that had been put in place by the Trump administration.
4:20 Speaker 03 I will say, so as of two hours ago, before this announcement, the prevailing thought was also that there were gonna be large carve-outs. It's always been said that April 2nd would be the day that tariffs go into effect. It was legitimately, there were reports coming as recently as this morning, that there would be notable carve-outs for some manufacturers, especially US automakers.
4:39 Speaker 03 In this announcement, it was made very clear that there's not any interest in negotiating exceptions.
4:43 Doug DeMuro? Crazy.
4:44 Speaker 03 Trump referred to them as permanent, which I will note, but...
4:47 Doug DeMuro? You know, it's interesting, the car industry, I consider the car industry to be, aside from the gun industry, to be probably the most conservative large industry in the United States.
4:54 Speaker 03 And powerful.
4:55 Doug DeMuro? It's generally anti-regulation, anti-union, I mean, they would claim they're not, but the car industry would prefer that they're... It's, you know, it's a big business, it's, it's obviously, you know, it's, it's anti-trial lawyer, like giant, like, the car industry is really, obviously, anti-environmental regulation, generally, I mean, generally speaking.
5:15 Speaker 03 Generally speaking.
5:16 Doug DeMuro? Again, they wouldn't say that, but they would prefer fewer regulations.
5:19 Speaker 03 Yeah.
5:20 Doug DeMuro? And a lot of conservatives, especially at dealerships, voted for the president, and they are going, they are some of the ones who are gonna be hit the hardest from this, there's no question about that. And I wonder how that's gonna go.
5:33 Speaker 03 It's just such a, how, if you're a manufacturer, we talked last week about how BMW was gonna guarantee prices through April or...
5:41 Doug DeMuro? BMW is screwed.
5:42 Speaker 03 Although BMW builds a lot of cars, a lot of their best-selling cars in the US.
5:45 Doug DeMuro? They do.
5:46 Speaker 03 Lucky for them. And this does clarify for them that parts outside of the US don't seem to be...
5:49 Doug DeMuro? The Tacoma's screwed.
5:50 Speaker 03 Tacoma's absolutely screwed. But like, you've, you've made, how do you, as a manufacturer, I think you have to spread out the cost you bear across the rest of your lineup, so all cars, so that a RAV4 doesn't cost more than a Highlander, I don't know if the Highlander's built, but you get the point.
6:04 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, Kentucky.
6:05 Speaker 03 So you, you have to, that makes every car notably more expensive. Already, the auto industry's not doing great in the US or in other markets, it's slowed down, sales have slowed down, factories are already, there's a lot of furlough that varies factories.
6:21 Doug DeMuro? This isn't gonna make that better. No, it's gonna make it worse. I think that in time, there may be some more significant investment from automakers in the US because of this, but that's assuming the automakers assume that this continues. You have to assume the automakers think that once Trump's gone, this all ends, there's...
6:34 Speaker 03 Or sooner than that, because it's a trade war.
6:35 Doug DeMuro? Obviously, the hope is sooner than that if you're in the auto industry. I am curious about our friend Elon on his effect here. Elon notoriously builds cars in the US, which are largely manufactured by, with US components. The Teslas are often considered to be some of the most American cars.
6:52 Speaker 03 Pretty much California.
6:53 Doug DeMuro? You wonder if Elon's in Trump's ears, saying, "Let's just tariff all the imports."
6:56 Speaker 03 Yeah.
6:57 Doug DeMuro? It helps him in a financial way, and we know that he's there, you know, playing a fairly large role in government right now.
7:03 Speaker 03 I just...
7:04 Doug DeMuro? I don't know if that's conspiratorial, but it seems like there might be some component of that.
7:08 Speaker 04 A little logical to me.
7:09 Speaker 03 I'm still processing this because like literally yesterday, there was a large news story that we weren't going to include here. That Honda was going to start buying hybrid components from Toyota because the hybrid components they use right now are made in Japan. And Toyota manufactures hybrid components in, in whatever state. I don't remember Tennessee.
7:29 Doug DeMuro? But you're saying now it doesn't matter.
7:31 Speaker 03 The prevailing thought this more yesterday was that it was about components and that.
7:35 Doug DeMuro? To not make it about components is wild. You were talking about a situation in which a car built in Mexico. I'm looking at the Chevy Blazer built and assembled in Mexico, but a third of the components come from the US. Well, you've just hurt the component manufacturers. So even though technically, yeah, the factory is in Mexico, but what about all the Americans? Who build the components that go into the cars that now that car's demand is going to plummet. I can't believe there's demand at all for the Blazer, but this.
8:00 Speaker 04 That's a different story.
8:01 Speaker 03 Is that the Blazer review or the regular Blazer?
8:02 Doug DeMuro? The regular Blazer.
8:03 Speaker 03 Oh, that's even worse.
8:04 Doug DeMuro? You could get a go through a lot of examples like this.
8:07 Speaker 03 The amount of change in a short period of time is also notable and.
8:12 Doug DeMuro? And by the way, this isn't just Canada, Mexico. So this is 25% on imports, which means that Euro. So that's that covers. I mean, you want to talk about cars, the companies that are screwed. High end Porsche is done. You know, every car is 25% more expensive. They don't have a US built product that they can. Neither, neither does Volvo, really. Neither does, you know, all the super cars, Rolls Royce, et cetera. BMW barely builds anything in the States. It's just the SUVs. I guess that's a.
8:35 Speaker 03 That's all their cars sold here. Absolutely.
8:39 Doug DeMuro? Yikes.
8:40 Speaker 04 Yeah.
8:40 Speaker 03 It's, this is a stunning, I'll call it stunning move.
8:45 Doug DeMuro? I don't think, I don't think if he said it was five years out and it's gonna, it's gonna phase in. I don't think it would be that insane.
8:51 Speaker 03 No, that would be pretty understood. It's, it goes into effect in five days and it's 25% on anything built outside of the US.
8:57 Doug DeMuro? And just, it's just, it's another example of, of using a mallet where you should be using a scalpel. I, I really think that there, there is some rationality to tariffs, especially when we're talking about reciprocal stuff. But this ain't it. And the stock market hates it and the car industry is going to hate it. And all of those people were massive supporters of the president.
9:16 Speaker 03 GM down 7.26%.
9:18 Speaker 04 I think you said at the point, the threat of tariffs is usually more effective than the tariff itself. It's that.
9:22 Doug DeMuro? Plus, who, who are you threatening here? You're threatening every country.
9:25 Speaker 04 Right, right. Yeah. Right. Well.
9:27 Doug DeMuro? Japan is.
9:28 Speaker 03 These, by the way, are on top of other ones. So if you're China, you were already at 50% tariff.
9:32 Doug DeMuro? Well, China's, Chi, uh, nobody's caring about China cars. It's not really all that important.
9:37 Speaker 03 I wanted to know that. I, it's just quite something. I will say, threat of tariffs, if you want to move to the next news story, you can just transition straight in.
9:44 Doug DeMuro? Well, you know, this is an interesting thing to say. Hyundai, Hyundai announces that, uh, that they're gonna invest $20 billion in production facilities in the United States. Hyundai already builds, in fact, a lot of the cars in this picture, maybe including this one, are built in the United States. They have this giant plant in Georgia.
9:59 Speaker 03 Uh, Alabama.
10:01 Doug DeMuro? Uh, Alabama. Yeah, one of the, one of the, one of the keys in one and one of the, Hyundai's in the other. I drove by.
10:06 Speaker 03 They're, they're investing something like $21 billion. One of that is a new plant. They're going from two produ, production facilities to three over the next time it takes to build the factory, which is five to 10 years. And they're also gonna be building a steel plant for, so they can use that steel in their vehicles. And again, because when they announced that, with the Trump administration, it was announced at the White House, the thought was that those components would matter.
10:29 Doug DeMuro? The timing of that announcement was obviously intended to try to show, like, hey, we're doing this. Can you maybe not be so punitive to us? But a lot of Kias and Hyundai's are made overseas. Um, and this $20 billion factory investment, you're talking about 10 years.
10:43 Speaker 03 Right.
10:43 Doug DeMuro? And it will, it's not gonna happen anytime soon.
10:46 Speaker 04 No, the landscape will be so different than, anyway, so.
10:48 Doug DeMuro? How, how do you, as an automaker, make investments? How do you, as a dealership, again, the dealership owners, some of the most conservative people, that, one of the most conservative groups I've ever met, just as a, as a chunk, how do they make investments in dealerships not knowing whether they will even have vehicles to sell at a price point where consumers are interested? They're gonna be absolutely off the wall, angry, irate at the Trump administration for this.
11:08 Speaker 04 Excuse my ignorance on this, but can, is there any litigation that, like, people can do against a tariff?
11:13 Doug DeMuro? I am curious. The president views his ability to create tariffs, um.
11:17 Speaker 04 As like an executive order, but is that?
11:20 Doug DeMuro? There's some question as to whether it's true. We'll see. I, I, you gotta assume some Republicans are gonna come out against this. There are Republicans in Washington who are car dealers, uh, who are, who are congresspeople. Um, there's one from the Fort Worth area. There's, there's several. And I have a suspicion that they're, Republicans aren't gonna be able to stand up and just accept this, uh, like they have with so many Trump things. I think they're gonna have some, they're gonna have to be blowback.
11:43 Speaker 05 Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from Star. Filmed for IMAX.
11:50 Speaker 06 Make them remember you.
11:53 Speaker 05 The Hunger Games: Sunrise on the Weeping, November 20th, rated PG-13.
11:57 Speaker 07 Bonjour, compadre. It's the
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12:27 Speaker 03 It's notable that it's gone to this point when the American auto lobby is quite powerful. And the dealer lobby is quite powerful. The reaction from states where that pressure is especially felt will be really, really, really notable.
12:40 Doug DeMuro? And there are, there are, there are manufacturing facilities that will lose because of this. There are manufacturing facilities in the states where we're trying to help people that are going to lose because they are manufacturing components and the car will no longer be in demand.
12:52 Speaker 03 Yep.
12:54 Doug DeMuro? Yikes.
12:54 Speaker 03 This is what happens when you spend 50 years creating a free trade area.
12:59 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
13:00 Speaker 03 And then overnight, over the course of five days, you take that fully away.
13:03 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, I mean, the idea that BMW would manufacture in Mexico, that Audi and Volkswagen, hell, I mean, any of these cars, all these, so many of these cars are imported. The Ford Maverick, which was one of the great success stories of the car industry over the last few years. One of the great products and affordability was its primary benefit. Built in Mexico.
13:19 Speaker 03 Yep.
13:19 Doug DeMuro? The Mach-E, Elon's, one of Elon's closest competitors, built in Mexico. Tariff.
13:24 Speaker 03 It's a, you can tell we're still processing a little bit of this news. It's not quite what I expected this announcement to be.
13:31 Speaker 04 And it just so dramatically hurts the exact people who specifically voted for Trump and like wanted, it's just, it's, it's a very Tariffs are a bad idea. Economically, they are
13:42 Speaker 03 There's a lot of danger there.
13:44 Doug DeMuro? I'm supportive of some of, of some of our presidents. And also, to be honest, one thing I do support with regards to this is the ability to stand up to a lobby and say, we're going to do this, screw you.
13:53 Speaker 04 I don't disagree with that.
13:54 Doug DeMuro? More people should do that and more people in all government and politics should do that. And I, and I respect that, but I, just because the lobby wants it doesn't necessarily mean that it's the wrong thing to do.
14:04 Speaker 03 Right. Just I'm watching, which I should stop doing. I find that the market's reaction to this is interesting to me, especially because this announcement was made after the stock market closed for the day.
14:15 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
14:16 Speaker 03 GM is fluctuating just solid lower, lower, lower, lower, lower.
14:20 Doug DeMuro? They're gonna stop trading on GM tomorrow.
14:22 Speaker 03 We're down 8%.
14:24 Doug DeMuro? The Ford Maverick.
14:25 Speaker 03 In the last hour.
14:25 Doug DeMuro? The Ford Maverick is 26% US parts, but it's built in Mexico, so it's gonna be tariffed. So any of the stuff that's made.
14:31 Speaker 03 The Grand Caravan, when it still existed, America's minivan, made in Ontario.
14:35 Doug DeMuro? Made in Ontario, Canada.
14:37 Speaker 03 Yeah.
14:37 Doug DeMuro? They're not building cars in California anymore.
14:39 Speaker 03 Sorry, should have clarified. I didn't think of it that way. It just, the market reaction to this will be fascinating. Tesla, I will say, is about flat in after market trading, after being down.
14:49 Doug DeMuro? 100% of the cars built in the US.
14:51 Speaker 03 It just, this is.
14:54 Doug DeMuro? For the US market.
14:55 Speaker 03 This is.
14:56 Doug DeMuro? This is the yikes news story of the week. Gotta assume this gets walked back. Maybe it won't. Trump's got, Trump does some crazy stuff. We'll see what happens.
15:01 Speaker 03 Permanent, we're his word, so.
15:03 Doug DeMuro? The car market is, the, the, the stock market and car market will decline significantly. Say hello to a recession, as far as I'm concerned.
15:12 Speaker 03 Yep.
15:12 Doug DeMuro? Uh, it's, this is, this is where that starts.
15:14 Speaker 03 Can I say one last thing before we move on?
15:16 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
15:16 Speaker 03 This is all based on where we are at on Wednesday, the 26th at 3:30 PM Pacific. By the time you listen to this on Friday morning, I, I, all, all bets are off. We would have recorded a very different podcast about two hours ago. So, you know, take that as you will.
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16:17 Doug DeMuro? And for a limited time, you can get 20% off at Public Rec by using the code CARS at checkout. Just head to publicrec.com, use the code CARS, and you're all set. Oh, and when they ask how you found them, be sure to mention our show. It really helps us out. Upgrade to Public Rec and feel the difference. Next news story, seems so insignificant now, but there's Jay Leno. Jay himself is not a news story. Jay's been around for years.
16:43 Speaker 04 Years.
16:44 Doug DeMuro? Decades.
16:45 Speaker 04 Wearing denim the whole time.
16:46 Speaker 03 A lot of hell ones.
16:47 Doug DeMuro? However, Jay is advocating for a new bill in the California State Senate, which will exempt cars from smog that are 35 years old and older. Right now in California, it's a crazy situation. 1974 is the cutoff, and so if your car is newer than 74, you have to get smog, which means that in California right now, 50-year-old automobiles have to get smog.
17:12 Speaker 04 It's just laughable.
17:13 Doug DeMuro? It's laughable. It's absolutely ludicrous and insane. People drive 70s cars, you know, once a month.
17:18 Speaker 04 Right, exactly. They go out and they go.
17:22 Doug DeMuro? Spewing fuel into the environment the whole time. No, but. But it's ridiculous. It's the most restrictive, we call it smog here in California, emissions law in the country by far. And so Leno's advocating for this bill that would change it to 35 years, which right now would be, what, 1990?
17:41 Speaker 03 Which was the intent, by the way, originally, right?
17:43 Doug DeMuro? Originally, the law here in California was that it rolled. It was 30 years, maybe, and you could get collector plates, and then you were smog exempt. But Arnold Schwarzenegger signed into law a bill to change that and cut the year off at 74 and end it for good, which happened in 04, I guess, or 05, whenever he was governor. And that's why it stopped at that year, and the years have continued since then. And so the result of all this has always been, here in California, that we all just drive, everybody who has an older car that can't pass smog just drives it anyway with out-of-state license plates. And so you register it in Montana, so many guys do that. Or you register it in your brother in Arizona, your cousin in Nevada, Oregon, or whatever it is, and the cars are still on the road. They're still obviously polluting and on the road. You see them all the time and every cars
18:28 Doug DeMuro? and coffee, half the cars have out of state license plates.
18:30 Speaker 04 When I'm behind a car, I smell deca and go, Montana.
18:34 Doug DeMuro? And so what ends up happening is the smog is still happening and California has lost all the tax revenue. And, um, and also there's nothing they can do about, for example, military, where the law has always been that you can register out of state. And so this would at least bring the tax revenue back to California. The cars are operated here anyway. And cars from this era, 1974 to 1990, which would be exempted right away, uh, are barely driven. I mean, we're talking about collector cars and the law specifically requires that cars that want to be abiding by the law must have collector car insurance. So they would only be mileage limited. Uh, it seems like such an obvious common sense law. I wrote a letter to my state senator,
19:15 Doug DeMuro? a left, physical letter and an email, heard nothing back, which is the state of Paul. I wrote, I voted for this person. This is the state of politics here in the, the United States.
19:26 Speaker 04 Couldn't even have an AI generated thing respond to you. It was just like.
19:29 Doug DeMuro? Just respond with AI. Tell me you liked what I said. Make me feel like, how many people does my state center? I'm even talking about my US congressperson where you, where you know, you're never going to hear anything and they hate you. How many, how many people does my state senator even represent? Right. 20,000? 100,000? I don't know.
19:46 Speaker 04 I'll bet they get so few emails, they keep their inbox clean.
19:50 Doug DeMuro? There's no way you're hearing, and, and they probably get nine emails a day, eight of which are from old ladies complaining about a four story apartment building going up in their neighborhood. I'm, I'm telling you something real here.
20:01 Speaker 04 Right. They couldn't have just like somebody, they couldn't just have like an intern respond.
20:05 Doug DeMuro? Right. Give me an intern. But anyway, I wrote to my state senator, and if you're in California, you should do the same. It would be lovely to have this, uh, pass here in California to get 35 years rolling back. I think it would change nothing in terms of smog, literally nothing.
20:17 Speaker 03 In the last 10 years, there's a bunch of places, especially in automotive rules, for some for events, some for smog rules like this, where they, some point decided, oh, it's no longer a rolling 35 year or 25 year. It's. That date and time.
20:30 Doug DeMuro? Are there other states that have done that?
20:31 Speaker 03 No, but like you can think about like events, like different collector car events.
20:33 Doug DeMuro? Oh, yeah.
20:34 Speaker 03 The Hoyle Concorde, where it's like, it was, had been rolling and then all of a sudden, no.
20:37 Doug DeMuro? Older folks, this actually happened in Colorado, this is in Colorado, older folks cannot wrap their heads around the idea that someone might consider a car from the eighties to be a collectible. They grew up in an era where, where that was a car. And so the idea of exempting that from smog, it's not acceptable to them.
20:52 Speaker 04 I hate to tell you, time passes.
20:55 Doug DeMuro? Right. Time has passed, you're old, and younger people do consider those to be collectible cars. And, and as always, old politicians have made laws that benefit old politicians and younger people get screwed, which is kind of the story. But here's Jay, kind of an older fellow who's coming in and helping. Well, you know, he, he understands the benefit of exempting these cars because he knows, like every rational thinker knows, that there will be no impact on smog. This is another one of those things. California tries to do the right thing, and in most cases, they, in most, the smog laws, I think have had enormous positive effect on this state.
21:27 Speaker 03 Yeah.
21:27 Doug DeMuro? And the cities that used to be covered in clouds of smog.
21:30 Speaker 03 Yep.
21:31 Doug DeMuro? But there are edge cases like this where you're depriving people of something they would enjoy and actually not benefiting the state at all.
21:37 Speaker 03 And actually harming the state from a tax perspective.
21:40 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, this, I, I wonder, I honestly wonder how much money the state has lost.
21:43 Speaker 03 A lot.
21:43 Doug DeMuro? Jay's downdraft ain't registered in California, because it can't be.
21:47 Speaker 03 Two places in one podcast where Doug and I are in agreement.
21:49 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
21:50 Speaker 04 He must have dealer tags, he just puts that on, I would think.
21:52 Doug DeMuro? You would think, but he doesn't.
21:54 Speaker 04 He doesn't?
21:54 Doug DeMuro? He's got his car's title.
21:55 Speaker 04 Wow.
21:56 Doug DeMuro? He told me, when I was up there, I was complaining to him because I was like, hey, man, like I got like, at the time I had like nine cars, I was like, a license plate renewal comes every month. And Jay said, you should see here, we get a license plate renewal every day.
22:06 Speaker 04 Wow.
22:06 Doug DeMuro? Because he's got a 200 bikes in addition to 150 cars. He literally has. He said that there's a smog place down the street that they go to every single day.
22:15 Speaker 04 They just have one person there who deals with Jay. They go to, go to, go to counter Jay, that person deals with Jay.
22:21 Doug DeMuro? I asked him about dealer plates in Montana, and he was like, I can't do it. I'm too high profile doing that stuff, people, I can't, it makes sense.
22:27 Speaker 04 Well, Jay Leno, the patron saint of collector cars.
22:29 Doug DeMuro? Let's hope this thing passes because it would be only beneficial to California, and I think would have virtually no negative impact. And if it doesn't pass, everybody's just going to continue registering their cars in Montana and Arizona anyway.
22:39 Speaker 03 Yep.
22:39 Doug DeMuro? Okay, next news story, please, we've only got a, oh.
22:42 Speaker 04 Ah, yes, so Aston Martin has announced a new car. This is the Vanquish Volante. So the Vanquish has been out for a little bit, this is the third generation Vanquish.
22:50 Doug DeMuro? Yep.
22:50 Speaker 04 And this is only the second generation, they've made it a convertible.
22:53 Doug DeMuro? Right.
22:53 Speaker 04 The Vanquish two, and now the Vanquish three are convertible. Now, it keeps the same 5.2 liter turbocharged V12 that produces 824 horsepower and 738 foot pounds of torque that we're seeing.
23:03 Doug DeMuro? No, 825 horsepower.
23:04 Speaker 03 That's impressive.
23:05 Doug DeMuro? Think about that.
23:06 Speaker 04 It's a ton, and it's rear-wheel drive and has an eight-speed automatic. So, but it allegedly currently, this is the fastest production front-engined car, which is very specific and niche. And I get that Aston Martin wants to have something to market.
23:20 Speaker 03 That is something to market.
23:20 Speaker 04 What they can market is how beautiful.
23:22 Speaker 03 It's like when Bentley made the Continental Super Sport ISR because that car, the Continental convertible, won the Icelandic ice races.
23:30 Doug DeMuro? The regular Vanquish starts at 430.
23:35 Speaker 04 Now, you have to mention, this will be, I've read estimates, this is going to be pushing half a mil.
23:39 Doug DeMuro? So you figure this is 460.
23:40 Speaker 04 Before the tariffs.
23:40 Doug DeMuro? Then you add tariffs. This is a $600,000 car. You know how many they're gonna sell in the United States?
23:48 Speaker 04 Let me do the math.
23:48 Speaker 03 Euro. Sorry, the regular Vanquish is that expensive?
23:52 Speaker 04 They said they were going to keep, yes. Yes, it is.
23:55 Speaker 03 It's a beautiful car.
23:56 Doug DeMuro? They said front, at least.
23:57 Speaker 04 They said they're gonna keep production to under 1,000 units a year, but I think they are going to be, if they, best case, they'll be producing 4,000.
24:04 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, at this price point, we're only gonna make 1,000 a year. Well, at 430 base, and then we've seen how Aston does options, every one of these that leaves the dealer is a 500 car, every one of these is a 550 car. Yeah, tariffs is an 800 car. It's like those, it's like those Zagatos they did, that I want.
24:17 Speaker 04 It is like those Zagatos.
24:18 Speaker 03 430, a 296 is a 350 car.
24:22 Doug DeMuro? But this.
24:22 Speaker 04 Yeah, but with options.
24:23 Doug DeMuro? But this is, this is on a different level.
24:25 Speaker 03 I know, but like horsepower.
24:26 Doug DeMuro? Is it? This is supposed to be an 812 competitor, but it's even more bespoke and rare than that. That's the theory. The truth is that enthusiasts don't view Aston Martin that way, and so it's not really.
24:34 Speaker 04 Currently, at least.
24:35 Speaker 03 Tough placement.
24:35 Speaker 04 But it, yeah, it, tough placement, tough timing, tough price point.
24:39 Doug DeMuro? Beautiful car.
24:40 Speaker 04 Guffingly beautiful, which is the Aston Martin way.
24:43 Speaker 03 How do we feel about the rear?
24:44 Doug DeMuro? God, Gordon.
24:45 Speaker 04 Not as great as the front.
24:46 Doug DeMuro? Obsessed.
24:46 Speaker 04 But I think that the car is tremendously beautiful, and honestly, this is the car I expect Aston Martin to be building, but it is, it's just, it's.
24:55 Doug DeMuro? Did not love the second-gen Vayner. First gen, one of the most beautiful cars of its era.
24:58 Speaker 04 Yes.
24:58 Doug DeMuro? Second gen was fine, but I never felt it look different enough, considering it was like the special flagship.
25:03 Speaker 04 The Vanquish one, one of the most beautiful cars of its era, one of the worst transmissions ever put in a car.
25:07 Doug DeMuro? Can you pull it?
25:08 Speaker 04 The Vanquish two, one of the, I still think one of the most beautiful cars.
25:11 Doug DeMuro? It was beautiful, but it looked like a modded DB9, whereas this car has its own life. This car has its own life.
25:16 Speaker 03 We have a Vanquish live right now, if you're out of you there.
25:20 Doug DeMuro? We do have that one now.
25:22 Speaker 04 You love to make fun of me. It's hard to type it.
25:23 Doug DeMuro? See, this car, it looks good. That's second gen, but this is go back one, go back one.
25:28 Speaker 04 Looking.
25:28 Doug DeMuro? That's a DB11 with a body kit. Like, that doesn't look that different. The new one, if I asked,
25:33 Speaker 04 That rea- that integrated trunk?
25:35 Doug DeMuro? If I asked not you, what car this is, if I covered the badges and asked Filippo what car this is, he'd say it's a DB11.
25:41 Speaker 04 Okay, but that's asking, that's like asking me about any Toyota. I mean, you could, you could pick your test subjects.
25:48 Doug DeMuro? It's own.
25:48 Speaker 04 I think they all have presents. I love the Vanquish line in general. I also think it's one of the greatest names ever put to a car, Vanquish.
25:54 Doug DeMuro? In 10 years, it'll be worth $75,000. Yep.
25:57 Speaker 04 Right, because every Aston Martin, every enthusiast wants a used Aston Martin.
26:00 Doug DeMuro? All right, give us our last one, since we're high on time. Oh, a Porsche. Does anyone want to take credit for this boring news story? This is a 992.2 Turbo. It has been spied at, touching somewhere. Well, anyway, folks.
26:15 Speaker 04 Now, it doesn't, it's a big, I don't think this is a really new story because guess what? It looks exactly like I would expect it to look.
26:22 Doug DeMuro? A 992, which is with the.
26:24 Speaker 04 People are like, ooh, it has no camo. Well, it's all the same.
26:27 Doug DeMuro? I could have drawn it. I could have drawn it. I could have done this. This may have been an AI.
26:30 Speaker 04 You ever seen a 991? Just picture the next one. That's what it looks like.
26:35 Doug DeMuro? It's a hybrid, apparently? Uh, of course it is.
26:37 Speaker 04 Yeah, and it's gonna make a ton of horsepower.
26:39 Doug DeMuro? Seven billion. Listen, by the way, I'm not taking away from this car, which I think is gonna be amazing, but I'm not all that surprised by how it looks because it looks exactly like it.
26:46 Speaker 04 Because you know, one of the great consistencies in life is that you know the next 911 will look like the one before that and before that.
26:52 Doug DeMuro? I remember when I worked at Porsche. Two, it looks, when I worked at Porsche, the only way I can tell is if you look at the, when I worked at Porsche, I remember the 991 was coming out and everybody in the company was like, what's it gonna look like? What's it gonna look like? And I, I always told them, take the current one. A little longer, a little wider, a little more powerful. The tail is what it's gonna look like. No, no, that, that one looked different. Okay, now it's time for the Talk Cars segment, wherein we talk about cars. This segment is sponsored by Filippo's Jacket, which of course has a pocket that does not match the rest of the jacket. Very nice. Very nice. Thank you. Style. Yeah. Uh, okay. First, so I want to discuss my old E63 wagon is for sale. I owned in the past
27:33 Doug DeMuro? two E63 wagons. This was one of them. Uh, I have zero fondness for this car. However, this car is important to mention because it was the very first car we ever sold on Cars and Bits.
27:45 Speaker 04 That's right. It was.
27:46 Doug DeMuro? It was car number one sold on Cars and Bits. And I, uh, I sold, this was, we, we, it was our guinea pig car that we sold because I figured if the site failed, hey, it was only my car.
27:58 Speaker 04 Right.
27:58 Doug DeMuro? But it worked. And here we are 26,000 auctions later, and this is auction number one. Now, I sold this to a guy in Maryland, and he bought it, and he shipped it to Maryland. He owned it for a period of years. And actually, he, uh, sold it on the site again after he was in, uh, there you go. After he was, after he had it in Maryland. There it is. And he sold it on the site, and he, he drove for a while, put some miles on it, and then it came back to California, uh, where it was registered in the Bay for a couple of years. And now it's for sale again at this dealership where it should be on Cars and Bits.
28:26 Speaker 04 It really should.
28:27 Doug DeMuro? Because this car is like the most famous car. The dealer has no idea, obviously, that it's, it has any connection to me or
28:34 Speaker 04 Right.
28:34 Doug DeMuro? anything like that. They don't care.
28:36 Speaker 04 There's lore that they should know about.
28:37 Doug DeMuro? It's lore.
28:38 Speaker 04 They should know about.
28:38 Speaker 03 In the last year, it's had basically no miles. If it has 109,000 miles now, he sold it with 108,500.
28:43 Doug DeMuro? Well, you know, people buy things and then they don't really use them. This car is actually very unusual because the E63 wagon in this generation was offered with a 19-inch wheel or an 18-inch wheel. They're the same wheel design. And the only, and virtually no one got the smaller wheel. But I bought this car in Minnesota, and they had gotten the smaller wheel so they could fit snow tires to it. Not, not that it has snow tires now. Uh, but they did do that in the winter. And so, this is one of the rare ones with the smaller wheel that rides better.
29:09 Speaker 04 Notably great riding car.
29:12 Doug DeMuro? Hated that.
29:12 Speaker 04 Comfortable ride.
29:13 Doug DeMuro? I drove this car across the country when I moved to California back in 18. I, uh, it was, we loaded it up and like, like the old story, drove.
29:21 Speaker 04 As I had to have done in an S12.
29:23 Doug DeMuro? In an S12, yeah.
29:24 Speaker 04 I remember I was emailing with you that weekend because I was trying to get you to come and review a LaFerrari at the exotic car dealership I worked at.
29:28 Doug DeMuro? Should have done it.
29:29 Speaker 04 And you were like, nope, I'm going to San Diego.
29:31 Doug DeMuro? Those photos are so good, too. Robert Grubbs photos and OG, those are back in the day. Little known story about this car. When we launched the site, the week before we're gonna launch the site, the car developed some sort of liquid leak into the interior. Remember this?
29:45 Speaker 03 No, I didn't know this about it.
29:46 Speaker 04 I remember this.
29:47 Doug DeMuro? You didn't know this story?
29:48 Speaker 03 No.
29:48 Doug DeMuro? Okay, water starts leaking into the interior the week before we're gonna launch the site. And we're incredibly busy. I mean, we're trying to launch the site. I'm still filming all the videos. So, no, it's not in the flaws because...
29:58 Speaker 04 Well, I thought it was on a recent service history.
30:00 Doug DeMuro? I took the car to the dealer and I said, "Look, this thing's leaking water. You gotta fix it. I have no time for anything else. Like, just fix it and call me." And they called and they said, "Hey, uh, it is leaking. It's from a windshield. The replacement windshield was installed at some point and it wasn't sealed properly and water's coming in. Oh, and by the way, it's gonna be four grand." And I said, "Well, wait a minute. This is a certified pre-owned car." And they said, "Yeah, well, the windshield wasn't part of that." And I said, "Well, the wind... They found the receipt for the windshield. It was done at a Mercedes-Benz dealership." So, the certified pre-owned car with a Mercedes-Benz warranty, the windshield replacement at a Mercedes-Benz dealership, they still refused to honor it. And I railed against Mercedes-Benz CPO and now I have another Mercedes-CPO car now.
30:41 Speaker 04 You showed them.
30:43 Doug DeMuro? I really showed them. Got them. They got me.
30:47 Speaker 04 Ridiculous.
30:48 Doug DeMuro? I do think Mercedes-CPO warranty is pretty much worthless.
30:51 Speaker 03 Um, okay. If you're the seller of that car, would you consider leasing it?
30:55 Doug DeMuro? Are they asking for some amount of money for it?
30:58 Speaker 03 Thirty-two, ninety-nine. That is ambitious.
31:00 Doug DeMuro? Hundred and ten thousand. Maybe that's why they don't wanna sell it on the site.
31:04 Speaker 04 They know. They know what the market is.
31:06 Doug DeMuro? Couldn't we sell it for twenty-eight like a year ago?
31:08 Speaker 03 Which was, which was honestly a good result.
31:10 Speaker 04 Yeah, twenty-eight, one, two, three.
31:11 Doug DeMuro? It's got a hundred and ten thousand miles. And honestly, the facelift two-twelves, which are the more desirable ones, are starting to come down too.
31:17 Speaker 03 They're in their thirties now.
31:17 Doug DeMuro? And so, they're putting pressure on these. The only benefit these had is that they were rear-wheel drive and the facelifts were all-wheel drive. But there's probably some people who prefer the four-wheel drive. Before we move on, let me tell you about Quince. Spring is here, which means my travel itch is back. Traveling comfortably can be the difference between having a good vacation or a bad one. And I'm preparing for my next trip with a first-class quality suitcase and an economy price tag from Quince. This year, I'm treating myself to the luxury upgrades I've been searching for with Quince's high-quality travel essentials at fair price. Some examples include lightweight shirts and shorts from $30, pants for any occasion, and comfortable lounge sets. Plus, Quince has premium luggage options and durable duffel bags to carry it all. The best part?
31:59 Doug DeMuro? All Quince items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings directly on to us. And Quince only works with factories that offer a safe, ethical, responsible manufacturing practice and premium fabrics and finishes, which is great. I'll be packing away my Quince sweaters for next winter, and I really can't wait for my carry-on bag to arrive for my trips this year. The colors available are unique and special, and bag is absolutely perfect for a comfortable travel experience. For your next trip, treat yourself to the lux upgrades you deserve from Quince.
32:39 Doug DeMuro? Go to quince.com/doug for 365-day returns, plus free shipping on your order. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com/doug to get free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com/doug. Uh, Filippo, tell us of your GTI problems.
32:58 Speaker 00 Welcome to the 50th Hunger Games.
33:00 Speaker 05 Witness the beginning of the revolution.
33:02 Speaker 06 Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from the start.
33:05 Speaker 05 Filmed for IMAX.
33:06 Speaker 06 Make them remember you.
33:09 Speaker 05 The Hunger Games: Sunrise on the Reaping, November 20th, rated PG-13.
33:13 Speaker 07 Bonjour, compadre. It's the...
33:17 Speaker 07 How do I negotiate so many great travel deals? My greatest gadget, the Priceline app. It's got hotel deals, flight deals, rental car deals, all of those deals in a bundle. Deals, game day deals, concert trip deals. No one deals more deals than Priceline. Hold your horses, there's more. The app lets you filter hotels by neighborhood, vibe, star level, and amenities like pools and spas and beachfronts. Wait, I'm not done. Stop cutting me off.
33:43 Speaker 03 I have a MarkiA GTI that I bought on the site. I've driven it 5,000 miles since. Wow, that was only a couple of months ago. I know, we've been driving a lot.
33:49 Speaker 04 Well, he drove back from Seattle.
33:51 Speaker 03 He just posted the video now, after three months, two months of driving.
33:54 Speaker 04 He watched the video on Cars and Vans.
33:56 Doug DeMuro? video on the Cars and Bids channel today. So he's only had it for two days. He's driven it 5,000 miles.
34:01 Speaker 04 Pretty impressive.
34:01 Speaker 03 No, we bought the car in January. We did just post a video on the Cars and Bids channel, which I think is pretty good. We vlogged our way home, which is not something that I do.
34:09 Doug DeMuro? Does your spouse appear in the video?
34:11 Speaker 03 No, she was incredibly careful.
34:13 Speaker 04 She hardly very much does not. It's really impressive.
34:16 Speaker 03 She was quite deliberate.
34:17 Doug DeMuro? Okay, so what's, you got some problems?
34:19 Speaker 03 You know, sometimes you go to start the car up and the car starts and the engine starts and nothing else does. So the infotainment, which is also how you control not just the radio, but also the heat and AC and the rear view camera and all of the like safety sensors just don't work.
34:35 Doug DeMuro? So this is an infotainment only problem?
34:37 Speaker 03 I think so.
34:38 Doug DeMuro? Like the screen, the gauge, the gauge cluster works, the screen doesn't turn on at all.
34:43 Speaker 03 And then you get a bunch of errors that say like these different systems aren't functioning.
34:46 Doug DeMuro? Now, I want to be clear about this. People are gonna be, oh, you bought it on Cars and Bids. They only sell lemons there.
34:50 Speaker 03 No, no, no.
34:51 Doug DeMuro? But this car is like a year old.
34:54 Speaker 03 It's a year and a half old.
34:55 Doug DeMuro? Is it still under warranty?
34:55 Speaker 03 Yeah. And I took a look at what like safety boltens there are, what recalls there are, and there are a few that are infotainment related. So I'm gonna bring it to the dealer and like get those taken care of. But the solution most recent time, I was in a meeting, my wife called me, she was leaving to go to, drive to LA for a work thing. She said, I, this is a good thing. What's the strategy to fix this? And there is a way where you hold down the start stop button for 10 seconds and it'll recycle. That wasn't working for some reason.
35:21 Doug DeMuro? Oh, good.
35:22 Speaker 03 And so I, while meeting with our producer Sean, actually, just went out, disconnected the battery, reconnected the battery, and we're good.
35:29 Doug DeMuro? On a brand new car.
35:31 Speaker 03 I mean, this car just came out.
35:32 Speaker 04 I mean, like, that's what I would do on like an E36. The gauge cluster is like freaking out. Power cycle it. You're good.
35:41 Doug DeMuro? Some strategies are timeless, but yeah.
35:43 Speaker 04 You had to do this immediately in the video.
35:46 Speaker 03 In the video, that was a smaller issue where just the radio wasn't working.
35:50 Speaker 04 I, you also mentioned the video. Isn't the system like famously not good to use anyway? So now it's not good and doesn't work.
35:56 Speaker 03 I actually don't mind using it. I find it fine.
35:58 Doug DeMuro? When you go on the forums.
35:59 Speaker 03 Yeah, there's a lot of complaints.
36:00 Doug DeMuro? There's a lot of people that have these issues?
36:02 Speaker 03 That issue specifically is a little rare, but issues in general, yes.
36:05 Doug DeMuro? Really? Like reliability issues.
36:07 Speaker 03 No, not serious reliability issues.
36:09 Doug DeMuro? But, but, but. Issues like they can't figure out how something works.
36:13 Speaker 03 Infotainment related issues.
36:14 Doug DeMuro? Infotainment related issues.
36:15 Speaker 03 Some of them are not figuring out how it works. I had an issue last week where the fuel gauge just showed zero. I filled it up. It showed normal things. I went to fill it up. I filled it up all the way and it showed zero miles remaining.
36:26 Speaker 04 Get your battery.
36:27 Speaker 03 It actually showed 20 miles remaining and then slowly went down to zero. And then it fixed itself.
36:32 Doug DeMuro? This is some Volkswagen quality. How many miles were on this car?
36:35 Speaker 03 Uh, 17,000 now.
36:36 Doug DeMuro? 17,000 on a one, a year and a half old car you bought with 12,000 miles.
36:41 Speaker 03 Look, they're all infotainment issues. I do suspect that some of the like, some of the recalls and TSBs will address it. We'll find out. I gotta bring it to a dealer. I haven't yet.
36:49 Doug DeMuro? If it is all electronics, then that's what it is. I mean, my Defender, I didn't have any issues with my Defender infotainment, but I'll never forget going to the dealer. They were like, how's the infotainment? I was like, it's been fine. They're like, really?
37:00 Speaker 03 Yeah.
37:02 Doug DeMuro? Truly, they were like, are you sure?
37:05 Speaker 03 Um, so that's a little bit of a.
37:06 Doug DeMuro? Are you concerned about Volkswagen, um, production quality at this point?
37:11 Speaker 03 You know.
37:12 Doug DeMuro? Do you wish you had bought an Integra type S?
37:14 Speaker 03 No, no, I'm actually throwing the car. The car is so good. I wish you had bought an Integra. The car is so good. It's such a competent car. We've driven it 5,000 miles in three, two months. It's a usable car for long trips.
37:25 Doug DeMuro? It's usable as long as you don't need the heat, the climate control to turn the car off.
37:28 Speaker 04 For 2,700 miles of that, everything worked. The other ones, it was a roll of the dice.
37:32 Speaker 03 It, it, it has been totally fine, except for that issue and that other issue.
37:38 Doug DeMuro? How often is this happening?
37:39 Speaker 03 Oh, it's, it's happened a total of once on the way down and then once last week.
37:43 Speaker 04 Well, that's like me saying the, my M5 is reliable, except for every component I've replaced.
37:48 Doug DeMuro? So it's only happened twice. Once on the way down, then once with the right the other day, plus the fuel gauge thing.
37:52 Speaker 03 Yeah.
37:52 Doug DeMuro? Which happened how many times?
37:53 Speaker 03 Once.
37:54 Doug DeMuro? Okay.
37:54 Speaker 03 Well, then it kept showing zero for, till I refilled it a third time.
37:58 Doug DeMuro? I, on the subject of Volkswagen out of quality, I once had an A4 that was self-healing.
38:02 Speaker 03 Yeah.
38:03 Doug DeMuro? This is an actual story that happened. I'm driving through Kansas, all right? And the fuel gauge starts to just, no, the speedometer, the speedometer starts to just stop. And about three minutes after it started to not show the right speed, it was showing zero. And at the time I was driving through southern Kansas, there was no Audi dealer in Wichita. And so I called the Volkswagen dealer and they're like, I guess bring it in, you know, I don't know. And then after about 20 minutes, slowly the speedometer started to creep back up. And it never was a problem again. I owned the car for two more years.
38:37 Speaker 04 It just needed a nap and then they went back to it.
38:40 Doug DeMuro? Volkswagen, it's good to see though, that was an O1. It's good to see not much has changed. This car was widely panned for its infotainment system and it sometimes shows signs of that. Which is also infotainment related. It'll be fine. When I was at Porsche, I had a Jetta company car and you know what I did? They were, I found online someone was selling check engine light bumper stickers as like a decal you could put on your car. And I did, I was like, you know what? It's such a Volkswagen, I don't even think, and maybe you should go down that path as well. I love the car though. I'm legitimately hopeful that some of the TSPs fix it. I'm anxious for you if this is the beginning.
39:11 Speaker 04 Maybe he should go down that path, but one way or another, I think the car is already headed down and it's on its own. So we'll certainly see. I'm hopeful it's more reliable for you though.
39:18 Doug DeMuro? It will be.
39:18 Speaker 04 We'll find out.
39:19 Doug DeMuro? Our next Talk Cars segment, I want to cover the Lexus LX 700H. We talked about the Lexus LX 700H last week. It's the finest car on sale. We've never sold one. They're not on sale. This is all I've been hearing about for about a week and a half. Every other text message that I get from Doug is just 700H over trail. No other words. 700H over trail.
39:39 Doug DeMuro? Uh, Lexus LX 700H. Now I don't have anything new to add. Last week I said.
39:45 Speaker 04 You just wanted to mention it?
39:46 Doug DeMuro? Last week I said, I wish that I had gotten this instead of my Sequoia. It wasn't out when I bought my Sequoia. I want to make that clear. The 600 was. The 600, I want a 600. I only want a 700H over trail. I don't have anything new to say. I still wish I had bought it instead of my Sequoia. They've now taken it back. The press car 700H. They took it back. That's how press cars work. Usually, okay, here's the press cars come to my house for a week. On the sixth day of the week, the press car company emails me and says, hey, we're going to bring the car, take the car back. Usually I say, yeah, no problem. This time I was like tearing up. How can I get the last few miles out of my 700H? This is how the other car journalists feel. Right. And, and the worst part of it was, and this was the real, the real slap in the face. You know what they replaced it with? A Hyundai Ioniq 5 XRT. Oh, it's, it's, it's the over trail of the Ioniq 5.
40:32 Speaker 03 It's the same thing.
40:33 Doug DeMuro? Needless to say, the experience isn't quite as good. Although, my wife's driving the Ioniq 5 right now and she texted me yesterday and she says that the turn signal stalk feels so good. I said, "What?" She said, "The stalk, it feels so good." I'm like, "What the hell are you doing?"
40:47 Speaker 04 That's an observation I'd expect from her to be honest.
40:50 Doug DeMuro? Or anybody.
40:51 Speaker 03 No, I think that every time I drive a car. The first thing I think that is-
40:54 Doug DeMuro? I do.
40:55 Speaker 03 Is, is the, "Does the stalk feel nice?"
40:57 Doug DeMuro? Uh, she previously was in the SQ6, uh, press car that we had and she said, uh, that she loved it. Which I did too, actually. Uh, unfortunately, we're the only two people who love it. Uh, currently, it's 20% off.
41:09 Speaker 04 Okay. So you want, so you want one of these, but you're off cars, so?
41:12 Doug DeMuro? I'm off cars. I can't buy it. I already made this pact with, with God and everybody that I can't buy any more cars.
41:18 Speaker 04 You're gonna buy a car at some point.
41:19 Doug DeMuro? I want one of these so bad. Look how expensive they are. Go back to that. You see those sticker prices? This is ridiculous. That is wild. Now, this though is interesting, right? This is a 25600 that's new with a 116 sticker and they're advertising it seven grand off.
41:33 Speaker 04 Hmm, interesting.
41:34 Doug DeMuro? So that says that maybe if I just wait a, and, and if you figure if they're advertising seven grand off, you'd probably get a little more.
41:40 Speaker 04 A little more in there, yeah.
41:41 Doug DeMuro? So if I wait just a little bit, maybe I can walk in and get this thing at a lower price.
41:45 Speaker 04 A test of your patience. It's something you're so good at.
41:49 Doug DeMuro? If I want something, I like to just buy it.
41:51 Speaker 04 Yup.
41:52 Speaker 03 We gotta deal with it. How much longer do we have to deal with?
41:54 Speaker 04 Oh, yeah.
41:54 Doug DeMuro? Uh, until I get one. It's gonna, and I think it'll be two or three years. I think it'll be two or three years.
41:59 Speaker 04 I give it, I'm gonna put it on the calendar, but I give it like three weeks and four days until he stops talking about it.
42:05 Doug DeMuro? You say that, but I got in a Sequoia thinking, "I'm gonna get in the Sequoia and everything's, I'm gonna feel fine about it, everything's gonna be back to normal," and I didn't. I was like, "Damn this thing."
42:11 Speaker 03 When you drove the Infiniti QX80, and then Nissan Armada, which are the new Nissan full-size SUVs, you were like, "This is better than the Sequoia."
42:18 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
42:19 Speaker 03 But you didn't want one.
42:19 Doug DeMuro? No.
42:20 Speaker 03 You was like, "This is objectively a better fit for me."
42:22 Doug DeMuro? The, the Sequoia still has king benefit over the, tho- those cars are better. The Armada, I drove the Armada Pro 4X, which is better than the Sequoia in a lot of ways, like legit.
42:31 Speaker 03 Yeah.
42:31 Doug DeMuro? Um, the, the Sequoia still has king benefit though, which is, uh, resale.
42:35 Speaker 03 Yeah.
42:35 Doug DeMuro? Ultimately, an Armada, uh, the Sequoia TRD Pro is still gonna be worth 50% of its value in eight years.
42:41 Speaker 03 Yep.
42:42 Doug DeMuro? Armada Pro 4X is going to be worth whatever you can find somebody at the propane refueling station to give you for. Hey, man, I got a, I got an Armada. Where you want an Armada? That's how it's gonna be. Okay. Ken, tell us about the Audi R8.
42:56 Speaker 04 Uh, yes, so currently we have an Audi R8, a first gen V8 R8 in the office. It'll be live on Cars and Bids very soon. You're doing a video with it. Lovely.
43:05 Doug DeMuro? It's red.
43:05 Speaker 04 Red V8, six-speed manual transmission. I, everybody who's come into the office has said the same thing.
43:12 Doug DeMuro? Wow.
43:13 Speaker 04 The R8.
43:13 Doug DeMuro? Do you think?
43:14 Speaker 04 He, he went inside and he was so excited.
43:16 Doug DeMuro? I've wanted an R8 for the last two weeks. Do you think the reason could be that the other cars in the office are a Toyota Prius?
43:22 Speaker 04 No, no, no, no.
43:23 Doug DeMuro? A Nissan Juke?
43:25 Speaker 04 A Carrera GT.
43:26 Doug DeMuro? And, and this makes the, this makes the R8 seem especially cool. A bad color G-Wagon. And, and so people sit here.
43:33 Speaker 04 No, no, no, no, no. All of the, there are some enthusiastic cars in here right now. There's an Evo 4, some, some.
43:39 Doug DeMuro? Pull up the R8, pull up a first gen R8. This isn't the one we're talking about. I love the R8 though.
43:44 Speaker 04 But here's the thing.
43:45 Doug DeMuro? Something clicked that it just, it does everything.
43:48 Speaker 04 It just.
43:49 Doug DeMuro? It does everything.
43:49 Speaker 04 That's a V10, but.
43:50 Doug DeMuro? That's a V10, but what's that?
43:52 Speaker 04 Same color, but it just. I'm, I drove my friend Stevens recently when I was in, I mean, at Amelia Island, uh, also a six-speed V8 coupe.
43:59 Doug DeMuro? Yellow.
44:00 Speaker 04 Yeah, his is yellow, uh, speed yellow nonetheless. Uh, and it was. It was magnificent. Like, I really, it's just like, it feels so solid and well put together, but it feels exotic with the right exhaust setup. And it just like, and that gated shifter and like.
44:14 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
44:14 Speaker 04 And then I look at the values of those cars and it's like, it just is.
44:17 Doug DeMuro? We just sold one today for 55. Yeah.
44:19 Speaker 04 I mean.
44:19 Doug DeMuro? That would have been tracked and had some odds, but. But I mean, fine. Uh, like.
44:23 Speaker 04 Back on stocky.
44:23 Doug DeMuro? They're pretty drivable cars. Yeah, put it on stockies, untint the tails.
44:26 Speaker 04 Put the Audi logo back on the front.
44:28 Doug DeMuro? Even nice, nicer ones, meaning like stock, what we would prefer.
44:33 Speaker 03 That 12,000 mile on R and M or failed to sell at 90, some of $90,000. They're in the 60s with like reasonable miles.
44:41 Speaker 04 Yeah. 60 for this one. It's a gated. Yeah. Yeah. Nice interior too, damn. Yeah. And like, how is that not just such a? This one, this was like one of the nicest ones.
44:50 Doug DeMuro? It is a bargain and I'll tell you the thing that makes this car cool. It has all the benefits of a 911, which is that it's practical, usable, relatively rational, the interior size, the tech, like it's a pretty, but it's an exotic car.
45:03 Speaker 04 Yep.
45:03 Doug DeMuro? Like a 911 is not all that special to be, like, I love a 911. It's a cool car, but it's, they're everywhere. R8 is still an event. When you see an R8, when you drive an R8, it is an event, but it has all the other exotic cars require a lot of compromises and this is the only one that doesn't.
45:18 Speaker 04 Well, I have to say, like, you know, our friends Sam and Nick both had them for a pretty long period of time. And even just taking that car off of the truck, people do still lose their mind and they, they don't, they know what it is. They know it's an R8, I suspect because of Iron Man and all that stuff, but people also like it. It's not like kind of a, there's no like. There's no negative signal here. Exactly.
45:36 Doug DeMuro? In a way that the 911 isn't. And honestly, I think especially the early ones, there actually is a lot of crossover to 911. The performance is similar, the practicality is similar. 911 actually has more seats. But.
45:47 Speaker 04 In spirit, yeah.
45:48 Doug DeMuro? But the R8 just has this like special factor that you will never get with a 911. And it, it makes it more interesting.
45:56 Speaker 03 About the same price as an S, as a 997.2S.
45:58 Doug DeMuro? Is that true?
45:59 Speaker 03 I mean, it's close.
46:00 Doug DeMuro? And they're the same era.
46:01 Speaker 03 10 grand, yeah.
46:01 Doug DeMuro? Cause it was 09 to like 12.
46:03 Speaker 04 Part of me wonders if I didn't make a mistake, that I should have gotten one of these before the 355. And I bet you I probably would still have the R8. Like I, so part of me wonders if I should course correct and get one of these.
46:14 Doug DeMuro? But you wouldn't have, you, you would have, it would have been a compromise at that time. Now that you've owned the 355 and understood the drawbacks of that, maybe going to a more rational exotic car is a thing that makes sense.
46:25 Speaker 04 Maybe, maybe. I just can't get over their values and like, I hate to fall in line with the rest of our friend group and get one like everybody else has. But like.
46:32 Doug DeMuro? They hold value.
46:33 Speaker 04 They're reliable. They're fun to drive. They're fun to drive. The AC compressors, like one of the big major like service concerns. It's great. You have to take the engine out and it's 10 grand to do it, but you know.
46:41 Doug DeMuro? 997s have issues.
46:42 Speaker 04 Yeah, that's why Bors going on the early ones.
46:44 Doug DeMuro? Let's talk about pinning coolant lines. Felipe's over here doing all this research. And then he ends up with a GTI that also has problems. I, I have a theory.
46:50 Speaker 04 Want a GT3? Got a GTI.
46:53 Speaker 03 I have never had any interest in GT3. I have a theory that every car enthusiast eventually for a period of time becomes an Audi Volkswagen person.
47:01 Doug DeMuro? Oh, no, you had an Audi.
47:04 Speaker 04 I think most car enthusiasts, as our friend Nick said, kind of end up becoming Porsche people.
47:09 Speaker 03 They do eventually.
47:09 Speaker 04 But like, a GTI is such a great hot hatch.
47:13 Doug DeMuro? But getting a car does not mean you become a person.
47:16 Speaker 03 Eventually, you think about it.
47:18 Speaker 04 Well, I don't know. An E395 and an Audi R8, not too bad. Someone very kindly reached out to me, they were selling their Cayenne GTS, and I wanted to know if I was still on the market. But somebody else had commented a long time ago that I should be looking at sports cars while I'm single and relatively young still. And like, find not wrong.
47:35 Doug DeMuro? During that period of my life, I drove station wagons. I had a CTSV wagon, I had a 2E63 wagons, I had no children, what was I thinking? Now I have all these kids.
47:43 Speaker 03 You are who you are.
47:43 Doug DeMuro? And I can't drive these cars ever, except to the office to flex on Filippo.
47:47 Speaker 04 Right, except to the office almost every day.
47:50 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, I have that one saving grace.
47:52 Speaker 03 But that's flex you do.
47:53 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, I do flex on Filippo, he's got his little Fiat parked outside. And you know why he drove it today? Because he started the GTI in front of a table in turn.
48:00 Speaker 04 Or he was on full blast at the time, he didn't want it, but it was on.
48:03 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, he was going, the heated seats were going.
48:07 Speaker 04 Life's lottery, be lucky.
48:10 Doug DeMuro? I want to take a moment to tell you about another podcast you should absolutely check out. Drive with Jim Farley. Ford CEO Jim Farley talks to some of his favorite people about what they drive and what drives them to succeed. He has great guests on the show, like the British racing driver Vicky Butler Henderson and one of my favorite people, Jay Leno. I've checked out a few episodes of Drive with Jim Farley, and I really love to hear his insights. There was a time when we only got to hear from automotive CEOs and press quotes and carefully worded corporate statements. But Jim Farley's podcast is personal, and it really shows his passion for cars, which is really cool. And this is a podcast I'm certainly going to keep in my listening routine. Click the link in the description box to listen to Drive with Jim Farley today. Okay, next story.
48:54 Speaker 04 Yes, so one of our close friends, Adrian, who's a wonderful photographer here in San Diego, who's done a lot of pictures for us. He did our adventure series, but he also did our track day. He put out a collection of his work, a book that he happened to, he gave a copy to me, this is your copy that I'm borrowing. But my car. Is the car just for the car? Look at that. It's called Meant to be Driven. And he actually asked me to write the foreword as well, which I did. Which there's one line, one brief line I'd like to read from it where I said that for me, it says, "Life is short, whatever joyous memories you can make along the way makes it all worthwhile. For me, many of those are with my friends from behind the wheel of a cool car. And that's why I drive." And so that's so cool. So it's really cool, but it's a great collection of wonderful photos he's taken all around.
49:36 Speaker 04 And you can go and check it out on his Instagram account, which is underscore meant underscore to underscore B underscore driven. And you can go to this website where you can actually buy this book. It's beautiful. I love all the pictures that he has in it.
49:49 Doug DeMuro? Truly stunning photos.
49:50 Speaker 04 And our cars feature in it quite a bit.
49:52 Doug DeMuro? Adrian is a very talented photographer. There are some very cool photos in here and I highly recommend checking out his Instagram and the book, which is really some special stuff.
50:02 Speaker 04 Especially if you like the E395.
50:04 Doug DeMuro? Filippo's even in it. The Corvette is in it.
50:06 Speaker 04 Yeah.
50:06 Doug DeMuro? Thanks Adrian. Thanks Adrian. I appreciate it. Look at these photos.
50:12 Speaker 04 It's really lovely. He told me I need to sit down with a glass of wine and really leaf through it, which I'm very excited to do. But, but thank you Adrian for putting this together. You're a wonderful photographer. We love having it around. This one's yours.
50:22 Doug DeMuro? Yes, I love it. I love having it. I love Adrian's a fantastic photographer. It's very cool to see your cars in print like this. So I'm happy that we have the book. Okay, next up is the market report where we talk car market. It's brought to you by Cars and Bids, which is a car website where you can bid and sell.
50:41 Speaker 04 I've heard of it.
50:43 Doug DeMuro? And buy and comment and follow sellers. Okay, Filippo, take us to begin our market report for us.
50:49 Speaker 03 Yeah, yesterday, or Tuesday, we sold a GMC Sierra 1500 SLE.
50:54 Doug DeMuro? Yes, we did.
50:55 Speaker 03 And here's what's interesting about it. This is a weird truck.
50:59 Doug DeMuro? Yep.
50:59 Speaker 03 It's a short cab, short bed.
51:03 Doug DeMuro? V8 powered Sierra.
51:05 Speaker 03 It's a full-size truck, but it's like the smallest of those.
51:08 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
51:08 Speaker 03 And they put a supercharger on it.
51:10 Doug DeMuro? And it's got a blower.
51:11 Speaker 03 And it has 830 miles.
51:12 Doug DeMuro? And even though it's an 18, it only had 900 miles.
51:14 Speaker 03 Yeah.
51:15 Doug DeMuro? And so it was like new.
51:16 Speaker 03 What's notable is that it sold for about MSRP.
51:19 Doug DeMuro? MSRP?
51:19 Speaker 03 It was something like 43 and it brought just about that. And obviously they put a little bit of money in it, into it, uh, for the supercharger. But like, it shows that there's still demand for these weird trucks. A regular 2018 GMC Sierra, even with 900 miles, is not worth much because it's, you just buy the newer one. But the newer one always gets a little bit better. But when there's weird things about it, right? When there's something that's unusual, you're not going to find a short cab, short bed truck.
51:45 Doug DeMuro? Can you still even get a shorty shorty?
51:47 Speaker 03 Absolutely no idea.
51:48 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, I mean, they're very uncommon.
51:50 Speaker 03 It's, nobody buys them.
51:51 Doug DeMuro? When we did a Mexico car, I made a thing about this. They're popular in Mexico. The Mexicans like the, the full-size truck, but that's short box, short cab.
51:58 Speaker 03 Yep.
51:59 Doug DeMuro? However, it's very uncommon here. And then this one was, uh, this one was low mileage, one owner with the blower.
52:05 Speaker 03 MSRP was 40.
52:06 Doug DeMuro? MSRP was 40, so 43. That's pretty cool.
52:08 Speaker 03 It's like, there's still demand for weird ones.
52:11 Doug DeMuro? This, yeah, for, if you get an unusual vehicle that like is hard to find and yet has a little bit of demand, you only get a few people who want it.
52:19 Speaker 03 It's cool.
52:19 Doug DeMuro? It's cool.
52:20 Speaker 04 So I would say, so I would say that's the beauty of an auction.
52:22 Doug DeMuro? Beauty of an auction.
52:23 Speaker 04 All it takes is two.
52:24 Doug DeMuro? Hey, little black GMC truck with a, with a forced induction gives me some typhoon vibes. Obviously it's not a small truck.
52:30 Speaker 03 No, but it is.
52:31 Doug DeMuro? But you get the idea.
52:31 Speaker 03 The smallest version of Sierra. And can you find one now? Certainly not on a dealer lot. Maybe you can special order, but who knows? And the market rewarded that.
52:38 Doug DeMuro? I also like big wheels, chrome.
52:40 Speaker 03 Yeah.
52:40 Doug DeMuro? Because a lot of the short shorts are base models.
52:43 Speaker 03 Yep.
52:43 Doug DeMuro? They got steelies and rubber and everything. And this does have cloth seats and a, and a fold down. Uh, but that's also kind of.
52:49 Speaker 03 And it was, the wheels were aftermarket, but GGM wheels nonetheless.
52:52 Doug DeMuro? But they're GM wheels. They, so they were aftermarket, but they were, they were upwheels. That's perfect. That's what I would have done. If I wanted a shorty truck like this, what I would have done. It's also a two-wheel drive, which has some appeal in this, in the shorty.
53:01 Speaker 03 Shorty blown V8, yeah.
53:02 Doug DeMuro? That is a pretty cool truck. You do not see them often. I'm thrilled that we took that on the site. I'm really glad we did.
53:06 Speaker 03 Uh, and it sold for above MSRP, which is surprising.
53:08 Doug DeMuro? I was happy to see the number on it. Ken, give us your market report, which is even more exciting.
53:12 Speaker 04 Yes. So recently, we had that Ferrari 3.8 that I talked about on the site, that 1900 miles, Classic K certification, excellent. And this car, so it was bid to $110,000, but our post-sale team, Alexis in particular, put it together after the sale, and it sold for $140,000. Now, I know that that is a lot for a 3.08, in particular, it's the most that a GTSI has ever sold for anywhere, at least in the last five years. And it's like the eighth best result in like in the last, and that's against for a GTS. So that's against the, that's against the carbureted cars, that's against the QVs that came later. The Vettura Zenas were coupe only.
53:48 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
53:48 Speaker 04 And so this is an incredibly strong, strong result, and I'm really proud.
53:53 Doug DeMuro? And if there was gonna be a car, you drove this car. If there was gonna be a 3.08 that got to this number, it was gonna be.
53:59 Speaker 04 This was without question, it was.
54:00 Doug DeMuro? Super nice.
54:01 Speaker 04 It was, again, like this picture of the interior, like, been in a lot of 3.08s. And that is as mint as it comes.
54:09 Doug DeMuro? As mint as it comes, literally insanely amazing. 140 was the number.
54:13 Speaker 04 140, yeah. I was very, I was very proud to have like gone to see this car, make a video on it and all those things, but really, really, really thrilled with the results of the team and the site. And this is the kind of car that we, this is the kind of car we saw. This is a unique car. You're not gonna find another one like this.
54:28 Doug DeMuro? Yup.
54:29 Speaker 04 It is a really special collector card, and I'm, I just feel very privileged that we have this on the site. I just, I just celebrated five years of working for Cars and Bids.
54:36 Doug DeMuro? That's so true.
54:37 Speaker 04 And when we, when we launched the site, like this was the kind of car I dreamt of having, and now we have them.
54:42 Doug DeMuro? We, right. And it was kind of a dream, and even be able to put this sale together is pretty impressive. I was really happy with it. I was happy that we had it. I was happy with the result.
54:48 Speaker 04 And the seller was very kind. He told me that he owed our team a debt of gratitude, and that we have a customer for life, which is very sweet of him.
54:54 Doug DeMuro? By the way, speaking of this car, type in Ferrari to the search bar. Are you aware that last week we had five Ferraris?
55:02 Speaker 04 Yeah, there were quite a few last week.
55:04 Doug DeMuro? Five Ferraris last week. I think this is before, yeah. Five Ferraris last week. And you know what also? It represented a wide swath of the Ferrari world. Classic K certified vintage car, modded 4.8 on wheel, gated 550, flood title 355, station, family station light. This is like everything.
55:21 Speaker 04 That is a smattering.
55:21 Doug DeMuro? Short of an F50, this has got it all.
55:24 Speaker 03 It's so exciting to have.
55:25 Doug DeMuro? And you know, I was, I was thinking about this because there was a time when getting one Ferrari on the site, we would absolutely freak out and be like, oh my God, we got a Ferrari.
55:32 Speaker 03 It just happens.
55:33 Speaker 04 Do you remember what, do you remember what our first Ferrari was? Do you remember?
55:35 Speaker 03 Um, we had a 355.
55:37 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
55:38 Speaker 04 That's exactly, it was a 355 Bremiata.
55:40 Doug DeMuro? In Florida.
55:40 Speaker 04 It was a red, which in retrospect, I should have bought for 77. It had a lot of memories.
55:45 Doug DeMuro? 34,000 and it had just had an engine out.
55:47 Speaker 04 Yeah, I should have.
55:48 Doug DeMuro? Our car's doubled.
55:49 Speaker 04 Yeah. Oh, yeah. Easily.
55:51 Speaker 03 So I should have sold. I remember this car distinctly.
55:53 Speaker 04 Yeah, me too.
55:55 Doug DeMuro? It was a big deal.
55:56 Speaker 04 Yeah, it really was. But I, I'm thrilled to have so many Ferraris on the site. Not only because it's my favorite brand, but like I just.
56:02 Doug DeMuro? So, so 612 is our 200th Ferrari auction.
56:05 Speaker 04 Wow, how cool.
56:06 Doug DeMuro? It is, it is pretty amazing how far it's come from the early days.
56:09 Speaker 04 It is indeed. So more prancing ponies. That's what we want to see.
56:12 Doug DeMuro? Selling special cars and also selling Lexus LSs. I want to talk about this part of the market report. This is such a crazy thing to me. Felipe pointed this out to me yesterday and I've kind of gone on a deeper dive. But yesterday we sold, keep going, a new body. This is an LS 500. They call it a 500. It's a turbo V6.
56:27 Speaker 03 Yep.
56:27 Doug DeMuro? For $42,000. I have been aware for a long time that Lexus LSs depreciate. Like that LS 460 over there is also a pretty modern car and it sold for 16 grand. That's a bargain.
56:39 Speaker 04 Yep.
56:40 Doug DeMuro? But the thing that makes this particularly exciting is that this is a new car. Like this is what they're selling today. And I, they're probably a hundred grand, right? They're probably 85. What, what is a new LS 500 base at? I mean, then this is a, this is a pretty nice, pretty well-equipped one.
56:53 Speaker 03 Uh.
56:56 Doug DeMuro? I mean, this, for 42, 95 sticker, this is 42.5 this car sold for. And if you brought this home, no one would know that it's not new. The LS 460 we just showed before at 16.5, that's a used car at this point. Nobody knows that. It's still a great bargain because it's a reliable V8 powered, you know, gonna last forever because it's a Lexus. That's a great car.
57:15 Speaker 03 Yeah.
57:15 Doug DeMuro? But this, this thing.
57:34 Speaker 07 It's me, the
57:37 Speaker 07 We don't need the jingle twice. Stop it. This is about vacation inflation and how Priceline negotiates amazing deals on hotels, flights, and rental cars.
57:49 Speaker 07 Yeah, but I didn't mention that you can save up to 60% off hotels in the Priceline app.
57:55 Speaker 07 Fine. No one deals more deals than Please stop. Touche. Priceline.
58:02 Speaker 03 Yeah, it does look new.
58:04 Doug DeMuro? Forty-two. These are gonna be in the 30s in a long weekend. This is incre- these are really nice cars. And it's funny because all the full-size luxury cars lose a lot of value. But the BMWs and the Mercedes, you understand why they lose value because they're expensive to own, the components are expensive. This is gonna be a reliable car, and it's just such a deal. I remember viewing this when it was a new car. It wasn't that long ago. It's now 42.
58:30 Speaker 03 Such a bargain. This is a relatively base one by LS500 standards. It doesn't have like the huge speakers and the doors that look really cool.
58:37 Doug DeMuro? But it's still another 400. Probably a mid-high 80s sticker.
58:41 Speaker 03 Yeah, you gotta assume.
58:41 Doug DeMuro? 90s sticker, three years ago. How many miles were on this car?
58:44 Speaker 03 36,000.
58:44 Doug DeMuro? 36, normal miles for a four-year-old car. I mean, this is, this is, how do you not, how are you not interested?
58:50 Speaker 03 I, I mean, I gotta wait for it to go another 20 grand. But I, it's just amazing how much especially big luxury cars depreciate.
58:59 Doug DeMuro? Big luxury cars depreciate like crazy.
59:01 Speaker 03 Plummet.
59:01 Doug DeMuro? Lexus, you would think would do better. Like, the ISF has held its value better than all of its rivals because it's known to be reliable. Nobody, the market doesn't seem to value that at these cars. It doesn't care.
59:13 Speaker 03 The market values enthusiast cars that depreciate and are reliable.
59:16 Speaker 04 Enthusiasts value cars. The market seems to value more SUVs. And so I think that there's something, this is kind of have, as a, it has a whiff of old luxury person to it.
59:25 Doug DeMuro? Hard for Lexus to sell this car.
59:27 Speaker 03 Yeah.
59:27 Doug DeMuro? I don't see many of them. I get the sense that, I mean, the sedan is going the way of, we all know it's all coming to an end, so that's probably part of it. It probably didn't actually leave the dealership with its 90 sticker anywhere near a 90 transaction.
59:38 Speaker 03 Maybe in 21 it did just because you couldn't get cars, but I, it took me a second to find MSRP because all of them have some large discounts.
59:46 Doug DeMuro? Yeah. Yeah. Still, it's 42.5.
59:49 Speaker 03 42.5. And it'll last you forever. Also, this is just a normal, it's not even the hybrid, it's the normal V6.
59:53 Doug DeMuro? You can get 10 good years out of this car. It'll continue to appreciate. It'll sell for 12 when that happens.
59:58 Speaker 03 Lexus put a non-hybrid 3.5-liter V6 in anything else?
1:00:03 Doug DeMuro? Uh, the tw- this twin turbo V6, isn't that the?
1:00:05 Speaker 03 There's a twin turbo 3.5 liter V6.
1:00:07 Doug DeMuro? Isn't that the Tundra, base Tundra?
1:00:09 Speaker 03 Oh, maybe.
1:00:10 Doug DeMuro? No, it can't be the same one, is it? The one that, the one that they're recalling.
1:00:13 Speaker 03 415.
1:00:14 Doug DeMuro? Anyway, reliable car here, folks. No, but seriously, I'm impressed. I'm honestly and truly impressed with that.
1:00:19 Speaker 04 Yeah, I am too. I had no idea.
1:00:21 Doug DeMuro? I haven't paid much attention to this, to this segment because full-size luxury, I mean, it's not my thing, but...
1:00:25 Speaker 04 Yep, depreciation alive and well.
1:00:27 Doug DeMuro? We talk about, like, last week, we talked about that S65, and I'm not surprised that car loses value. I'm just, this is gonna be a reliable, look, pull up that interior photo, that first interior photo.
1:00:35 Speaker 03 That's a nice interior.
1:00:36 Doug DeMuro? That's a new, this is a new car.
1:00:38 Speaker 03 That is identical to the new one, except for maybe the little touchpad thing.
1:00:41 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, that's true.
1:00:42 Speaker 04 Yeah.
1:00:42 Speaker 03 But nevertheless, it's used luxury.
1:00:44 Doug DeMuro? Dude, I'll use that, I hate that touchpad. I think it's one of the worst things ever to exist. I'll use, for 42.5, I'll use that touchpad. For a $40,000 discount off a new one, get me an over trail for 42.5. I'll use all the touchpads in one.
1:00:55 Speaker 03 I, it just, it's...
1:00:56 Speaker 04 Way to bring it back, nice.
1:00:57 Speaker 03 Luxury, luxury and especially non-enthusiast luxury. It's, it's why a, a regular E350, like a, your generation E350 is worth 15 and a wagon is worth 40.
1:01:07 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
1:01:08 Speaker 03 Especially sedan, so, like, if it's not an enthusiast's car, the luxury just appreciates.
1:01:11 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, it does. And I agree, though, the SVs hold their value better. If this was an LX, which is an enthusiast buy on the used market, and so that's one of the reasons why it's, it keeps its value, it would definitely have held, hold its value better than this. The market likes those better. Nobody out there looking for these, but it's incredible to me that...
1:01:26 Speaker 03 Incredible, indeed.
1:01:27 Doug DeMuro? I'm sitting here thinking, for 42, I can, for 10 years, and never think about getting another car, and still flex on Felipe.
1:01:33 Speaker 03 And then still, and then they have a floor. Reliable luxury cars have a floor.
1:01:37 Doug DeMuro? Well, I don't know, go back to LSs. We're selling them for 6. Now, these cars are old. The 20 years, if, if, if in 20 years, you've only lost 30 in value...
1:01:45 Speaker 03 You're doing okay.
1:01:45 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, it's actually not so bad. 33, 34. It's a pretty good situation.
1:01:49 Speaker 04 And that's still a reliable, usable, well, this one looks a little low, but, but...
1:01:55 Doug DeMuro? I was more talking about this one, though. And even this, here's a 96, so this is 30 years.
1:01:59 Speaker 04 30 years, and that's still...
1:01:59 Speaker 03 Different generations have different...
1:02:01 Speaker 04 That actually might be slightly on the appreciation curve with the, people really like those.
1:02:04 Doug DeMuro? Is this a second gen with first gen wheels?
1:02:06 Speaker 04 Uh, I believe it is.
1:02:07 Doug DeMuro? Okay, we gotta move on. We gotta move on to questions. Folks, before we get on questions, do you want to show off the license plate we received?
1:02:12 Speaker 03 Yes.
1:02:13 Doug DeMuro? We received a license plate. From who?
1:02:15 Speaker 03 Let me open it up, find out.
1:02:17 Doug DeMuro? Oh, there's a note?
1:02:17 Speaker 03 There's a note.
1:02:20 Doug DeMuro? We received a license plate and a note. Cars and Bids, a few weeks ago, you ranked the best and worst license plates on the podcast. It was my favorite segment we've ever done. John sent us this one, which we basically said is the worst license plate ever to exist. The Montana Rural Fire, where they simply took a photograph of a rural fire station and put it on a license plate. Can you pull it up? It's hard to see because it's going to be out of focus. Montana's Rural Fire License Plate. One of the ultimate worst, most ridiculous things ever to exist. There it is. They just went out and took a picture in front of a fire station with an old square body.
1:02:57 Speaker 04 Right.
1:02:59 Doug DeMuro? Absolutely nonsensical that this happened. But anyway, John.
1:03:03 Speaker 04 Thank you, John.
1:03:04 Doug DeMuro? Who didn't give his last name. Random person will never know who John sent us this. Do we know what car it was?
1:03:11 Speaker 04 Thanks, John.
1:03:12 Doug DeMuro? No, don't. But it was probably on a F40 since it's a Montana plate.
1:03:15 Speaker 04 If it's active, I could still find out.
1:03:17 Doug DeMuro? Thank you, John. We appreciate it. And we will cherish this gift forever, just like we cherish the Toyota Bee and the Toyota Goat, which have disappeared.
1:03:27 Doug DeMuro? Next, we move on to questions. Questions, questions. Now, remember, you can ask us a question. You go to carsandbids.com, you click on the community tab, and there will be a post there that says, "Questions." And then you ask us a question. The questions segment is brought to us by Kenan and his white t-shirt.
1:03:41 Speaker 04 Thank you.
1:03:42 Doug DeMuro? Yeah. Thank you, actually, for sponsoring this segment.
1:03:45 Speaker 04 It's my absolute pleasure.
1:03:47 Doug DeMuro? The questions this week, I discovered something. The really good questions, you've got to go down. You've got to go down. We're going to do a smattering of up and down, but you've got to go down. First question from B. Sloss. Doug's canceled Huracan Strato spec. In the recent videos, he mentioned he had a Huracan Strato he had ordered before buying his Countach. What spec did you settle on for the Strato? How is this process with Lamborghini? Have there been any other canceled Doug cars? The spec was cheap. Here's how it works.
1:04:14 Speaker 03 For you, it was surprisingly minimal.
1:04:17 Doug DeMuro? Here's how it works when you order a Lamborghini, okay? The configurator for all of the top end brands does not have pricing because they don't want people to make fun of them, in all honesty. Porsche is the only brand that has pricing on their configurator.
1:04:31 Speaker 03 And we make fun of them.
1:04:32 Doug DeMuro? And when I worked at Porsche, this was a constant topic of conversation. Should we stop having pricing on our configurator? Should we stop providing window stickers to journalists? Because what ends up happening is they make fun of you. Oh, they, eight grand for a painted air vent? You know, that kind of stuff. So Lamborghini, they don't have pricing. And so what happened is the sales manager at the dealership at Ogera, he said to me, "Look, here's what you do. Build the car, send me the configuration," because they give you a little code when you finish the build, "and then I'll tell you what it costs." So you have no idea, right? So you build the car, you send it off to him, and he emails me back and he says the price. And then he's, "Oh, well, that's a little too expensive," or "It's cheaper than I expected. I'll put a couple more options on it." But you don't know what those options cost. And so you send him another.
1:05:15 Doug DeMuro? And I did about 14 of these, and I thought he'd get annoyed, but I get the sense that this is a large portion of his job.
1:05:21 Speaker 03 Yeah, for sure, without doubt. This is what he does on every Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday.
1:05:26 Doug DeMuro? I ordered the, the car I ordered, was gonna order, was the army green color, which was called Verde Gaia or something like that, with bronze wheels.
1:05:38 Speaker 03 And a light bar.
1:05:39 Doug DeMuro? Oh, yeah. I mean, every off-road thing. The roof basket, the light bars, the spare tire, the whole thing. In the end, one of the reasons I passed on this was because I honestly thought that basically everybody would order the military green color with bronze wheels. I thought it would be so obvious. And you know what happened? Nobody did. I haven't seen one. And I was on AutoTrader this morning looking for Storatos.
1:06:00 Speaker 03 Why not?
1:06:01 Doug DeMuro? There's not, there's none in my spec. And it's like, damn, I thought they'd be everywhere.
1:06:04 Speaker 03 Man, I'm glad you didn't order it, to be honest. The Countach is awesome. It rules.
1:06:09 Doug DeMuro? No regrets.
1:06:10 Speaker 03 But it turns out, eh, maybe you could have had a unique spec.
1:06:12 Doug DeMuro? I, the last part of the question is, have there been any other canceled Doug cars? I don't order new cars. I don't like do that. Even my new daily driver cars I bought used. Like, I just don't live in a world where I order new cars. The Sequoia I bought knew I had to. Filippo screwed me. It's a long story.
1:06:26 Speaker 03 It is a long story.
1:06:27 Doug DeMuro? We've told it before, and I'll tell it again. Um, but like my over trail by used my Kia stinger I bought used. You know, I thought it was. I thought it was. No, but remember it was new, but the dealer had punched it like a year before. Cause no one was buying it and they had some program that month. Um, and trust me, the price I paid for that, I bought it used.
1:06:49 Doug DeMuro? Remember that I told it was like, it was like nine grand off. And I said, I'll, I'll do that if you bring it to my home and I don't have to go to the dealer. And they brought the car and the paperwork an hour away to my house just to get that steer off a lot.
1:07:02 Speaker 03 Forget to give you a key and then they had to come back.
1:07:04 Doug DeMuro? They were like, oh, we don't have a, we don't have a second key, but they did. And then they ended up giving me a third key and then a fourth key. So like when I sold it, it had like four.
1:07:10 Speaker 03 The cool key too.
1:07:13 Doug DeMuro? Anyway, the answer to the question is there have not been any there to cancel Doug cars. And the only real reason I'm sad that I didn't get a Strato because they're pretty available used. The only real reason is because I think it would have been cool to like buy a supercar new. And like have that experience. I don't, as they become more automatic and more hybrid, I don't think I ever will. And I'm sad that I couldn't have done that. And I truly don't think I ever will.
1:07:34 Speaker 03 That wasn't automatic.
1:07:35 Doug DeMuro? It was, but it was the last V10, it was an off road, like they're not going to make a car like that again.
1:07:40 Speaker 03 Small concession to pay. You got a Countach.
1:07:42 Doug DeMuro? I got a Countach.
1:07:43 Speaker 03 That's your consolation.
1:07:44 Doug DeMuro? Very, very, very cool. Would have been nice to have both and an over trail.
1:07:48 Speaker 03 Yeah, that would have been.
1:07:49 Doug DeMuro? Alas. Uh, yeah. So I lost all my money in the stock market because of the tariffs.
1:07:56 Doug DeMuro? Uh, next question, next question. Um, this is a good one that you, I want you to really think about from speed stuff. What cars would get better or worse driving experience reviews if journalists could not tell what make or model they were driving? I love this question because it assumes that journalists have massive biases and they do. Some of the stuff I have heard my fellow car journalists say, especially at launch events, I am absolutely astonished by.
1:08:22 Speaker 03 If they can't tell which automaker it is, they can't tell, is that the automaker that's sponsoring us for performance car of the year this year?
1:08:29 Doug DeMuro? Oh my God.
1:08:30 Speaker 03 I'm joking about, I'm joking about the specificity.
1:08:33 Doug DeMuro? I, I don't think it's that specific, but I do think there are individual journalists who are predisposed to like certain brands. And I think a lot of them actually are, are, there's a lot of Volkswagen love in the car journalist world.
1:08:45 Speaker 03 I think that Mazda would not get quite the love that it currently does.
1:08:49 Doug DeMuro? Absolutely.
1:08:49 Speaker 03 That there's a lot of like, everybody loves Mazda. So therefore I love Mazda.
1:08:52 Doug DeMuro? Yep.
1:08:53 Speaker 03 Et cetera.
1:08:55 Doug DeMuro? Ferrari, does Ferrari drive better than McLaren and Lamborghini? If you covered up the everything, would it? I don't know, but we all know what happens if you say bad things about Ferrari.
1:09:03 Speaker 04 Exactly. I'll bet they'd say some truths.
1:09:08 Doug DeMuro? What about the, what about the new NSX? Would people have liked that car more if it wasn't a Kira?
1:09:13 Speaker 04 I think they would like it more if it had just, you know, come out when they said it was going to, not seven years later.
1:09:17 Speaker 03 There is an element of that too, right? It's all actually about expectation setting. And you can't remove that fully. It's not fair to fully remove that, right? Like, what does the manufacturer say you're creating? That's what you're comparing it against, not just every other car in the field. There's some innate, how does this brand make you feel? What's the comparison point? What did they promise me? Did they deliver on that?
1:09:37 Doug DeMuro? But the point, the question though, is making the point that even though there's a feel component, would you, if you got into a base Subaru Forester and you got into a base Chevy Traverse and they switched around the badges?
1:09:49 Speaker 03 Well, first of all, you went from one vehicle to a much larger vehicle.
1:09:51 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, but my point is, people like Subaru.
1:09:56 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:09:56 Doug DeMuro? People don't like Chevy.
1:09:58 Speaker 03 For sure.
1:09:58 Doug DeMuro? For boring SUVs.
1:10:00 Speaker 03 I fully agree.
1:10:01 Doug DeMuro? Would you, would you get into the Traverse if it had Subaru badging and be like, oh, you know, this is a pretty good car?
1:10:05 Speaker 03 Without a singular doubt, that would happen. Not in our reviews.
1:10:08 Doug DeMuro? No, no, no. God, no. Never.
1:10:11 Speaker 03 That's not how I feel about it.
1:10:12 Doug DeMuro? But I do think, and part of his question is, would someone think a new M5 is an awesome driving experience? Because they're not comparing it to an older one. That was part of the question too. Absolutely.
1:10:20 Speaker 04 Yeah.
1:10:20 Doug DeMuro? The, now, I will say, for cars that have a lineage,
1:10:26 Doug DeMuro? you, you do have to think about the lineage. Like, a 911 could be, like, you could come up with a 911 that's as fast as a Plaid, all-electric. But like, there's a lineage that you have to keep up with there.
1:10:38 Speaker 03 I think that you can differentiate the two. There could be two different kinds of reviews. One is, how does this fit into that brand's history and heritage and reputation? And how is this car as just an objective vehicle?
1:10:48 Doug DeMuro? You can do two. You can, you can do, you can do it and kind of generally just say that.
1:10:51 Speaker 03 You can.
1:10:51 Doug DeMuro? The C63 is bad at both. The M5, I think, is only bad at one. And I think from a perspective of it being a car, it's a great one. From a perspective of it being in the next M5 and it's heavier and all that, yeah, there was a lot of complaints about that. But I think if they were honest with themselves, journalists would review that car positively.
1:11:08 Speaker 04 When I drove it, it didn't bother me at all. Didn't really notice it, to be honest with you. It was fast and nice and cool and.
1:11:13 Doug DeMuro? It's a good car.
1:11:14 Speaker 04 Yeah.
1:11:15 Doug DeMuro? Um, but I do think the brand does have a lot of clout and I am always continually surprised by some of the takes I hear from my fellow journalists. That I think are just art. There's, there's some brand falls into that.
1:11:26 Speaker 03 There's some brand without a single doubt.
1:11:29 Doug DeMuro? Okay, there are some, there, like I said, some great ones down here. Next question from Peter Aldridge. Do you ever feel compelled to review cars more favorably to stay in the good graces of manufacturers? Asking it to me. Nope. Ow.
1:11:44 Speaker 03 Not him.
1:11:45 Doug DeMuro? I don't give up. It literally doesn't matter. Now, there may have been a time years ago, but in my current situation, especially my current financial situation, I don't care at all. You want to not send me a car? That's fine. I will find a dealership. I will find a person. I do not care.
1:12:03 Speaker 03 For a long time, you would get cars almost exclusively from dealerships or from people. And during COVID, it made sense. I don't want to go to dealership, have a press delivery. That makes sense. But I think you'd go back to that. Oh, and you don't go to press launches. You don't take the.
1:12:18 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, I mean, ultimately, I don't do, a lot of these people stay in the good graces of automakers and do a lot of stuff with the automakers. Like, I don't attend press launches. When I do, I don't pay, I don't have the automaker pay for me. Like, I don't like get into that sort of stuff anyway. I do not, I, I honestly, I have some friends in the automotive PR space, but I generally think that the journalist's role should be adversarial with automotive PR. Um, and that you should be constantly fact checking them and constantly thinking through like, are, what are they telling me? Is this real? Is this not?
1:12:48 Doug DeMuro? You know, does it, is it actually true that such and such car is better than other car? And I don't find a lot of that. I go to these things and there's a lot of like glad handing and people who know each other well and, and just kind of stick to the, you know, the, the printed bullet points. Now, one person in response to this was like, he gave a pretty good review to the M5 and to the Charger Daytona. They're good cars. Ultimately, the M5 is a good car.
1:13:09 Speaker 03 I was wondering if you were gonna walk that back.
1:13:11 Doug DeMuro? There it is. The Charger Daytona, I, I don't think I did give her a good review. The title was, it's an unfinished effort. And I basically was like, if this car had different engines, it would be pretty good.
1:13:19 Speaker 03 Which it will.
1:13:20 Doug DeMuro? Which I think.
1:13:20 Speaker 03 Including a Hemi.
1:13:21 Doug DeMuro? And, and I'm excited for that. But no, I, I honestly and truly more than, probably more than some of the other folks, I really do not care. Take me off your list, car companies. I will review the car anyway. Uh, okay. Next question, and this is a good one for you and me. Daddy Doug SRT8 writes, hey Doug, you've done rankings of certain groups of cars. Can you rank all the Corvettes?
1:13:44 Speaker 03 Good, a ranking list I don't have to be involved with.
1:13:46 Doug DeMuro? This is hard because it goes a long way back.
1:13:50 Speaker 03 There's eight.
1:13:51 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, but it goes back into the 50s.
1:13:52 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:13:53 Doug DeMuro? And some things that were desirable in the 50s ain't desirable anymore.
1:13:57 Speaker 03 No.
1:14:00 Doug DeMuro? C2 is number one.
1:14:01 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:14:01 Doug DeMuro? C2 is the car.
1:14:03 Speaker 03 C2 is the car.
1:14:04 Doug DeMuro? I mean, C2 changed-
1:14:05 Speaker 03 The question is, where do you go from C2?
1:14:08 Doug DeMuro? Eh. C8.
1:14:10 Speaker 03 Oh, I can't agree with that.
1:14:12 Doug DeMuro? It's the best.
1:14:13 Speaker 03 No man. No, no manual. That is a real issue.
1:14:16 Doug DeMuro? Dude, you ever drive a, you ever drive a, a, a C4 with a Doug Nash 4.3?
1:14:20 Speaker 03 No, but I really want to.
1:14:22 Doug DeMuro? Manual isn't the reason.
1:14:24 Speaker 03 I really want to. I've always, I've reached from the, from when we've, we've hosted a bunch of C4s with the Doug Nash, which is a 4 plus 3, and I just want to know. I need to experience it. If you have one, call for it.
1:14:36 Doug DeMuro? Yeah. C, C3 is last.
1:14:38 Speaker 03 C3, C4 is last.
1:14:39 Doug DeMuro? I want to break, no, I want to break this up. I'm going to do something controversial. C4.1 is last. C3 is second to last. C4.2 is better.
1:14:50 Speaker 03 I'm going to, but we got to think about the generation as a whole. C3 is above C4.
1:14:55 Doug DeMuro? The late C4s are better than C5. I would rather have a late C4 than a C5.
1:14:59 Speaker 03 What?
1:14:59 Doug DeMuro? Or a C6 and maybe even a C1. Oh my God. A late C4, dude, a 96 Grand Sport is one of the coolest Corvettes ever built, but any late C4 is a great Corvette.
1:15:10 Speaker 03 Yep.
1:15:11 Doug DeMuro? Any late C4.
1:15:11 Speaker 03 I know, but we got to think about the generation as a whole.
1:15:13 Doug DeMuro? Uh, I'm taking it C4.1 and C4.2.
1:15:16 Speaker 03 I'm going to accept that.
1:15:17 Doug DeMuro? 92, 91, 92.
1:15:19 Speaker 03 We all agree that, um, a C6 is only marginally better than a C3.
1:15:25 Doug DeMuro? Wait, wait, but I want to be clear.
1:15:27 Speaker 03 Hold on a minute.
1:15:27 Doug DeMuro? I want to be clear. I'm putting, I'm putting the C4.1 at the bottom.
1:15:31 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah.
1:15:31 Doug DeMuro? Then the C3, then the C5.
1:15:34 Speaker 03 No, I'm going to put C6 more than C5.
1:15:35 Doug DeMuro? No, C6 is a better car than C5. It was just a better evolution of the C5. It had a better motor, it looked better, the interior was better, it drove better.
1:15:41 Speaker 03 It did not look better. The C5 is just cooler.
1:15:43 Doug DeMuro? The C5 is just cooler than a C6?
1:15:46 Speaker 03 It just is. I'm really sorry. It just is.
1:15:49 Doug DeMuro? What?
1:15:50 Speaker 04 I kind of agree, but it is not better. The C6 is better.
1:15:53 Doug DeMuro? In what way is it? What do you mean?
1:15:54 Speaker 03 It just is cooler.
1:15:55 Doug DeMuro? What?
1:15:56 Speaker 03 It's just a cooler, it's like-
1:15:57 Doug DeMuro? It's squidgier. All the C5 is-
1:16:00 Speaker 03 Squidgier? Have you seen the C6?
1:16:02 Doug DeMuro? That's the point of the C5. All the C5 is a squidgier C6. The C6 was tight. It was a tightened C5.
1:16:07 Speaker 03 It looks like a squidgier C5, though.
1:16:09 Doug DeMuro? That's insane!
1:16:11 Speaker 04 Look, I don't have a dog in this fight, but-
1:16:12 Doug DeMuro? You're crazy. This is crazy.
1:16:15 Speaker 04 I actually support Felipe.
1:16:16 Doug DeMuro? Okay, what's the second best?
1:16:19 Speaker 03 Uh, I think that a C7 is the second best.
1:16:23 Doug DeMuro? C8.
1:16:24 Speaker 03 C8, we could be third.
1:16:25 Doug DeMuro? Dude, I would rather have a C8 than a C7.
1:16:27 Speaker 03 What about a C7 Grand Sport, C7 Z06?
1:16:30 Doug DeMuro? What about the C8ZR1? It's got 2 million horsepower.
1:16:32 Speaker 03 It's a better performance car, but I think it's a less engaging performance car.
1:16:35 Speaker 04 The C6, or C7ZR1 has a manual transmission.
1:16:38 Speaker 03 Yeah, nobody, we're not kind of your-
1:16:40 Speaker 04 If you're gonna, if you're gonna use theZR1 as a comparison point, all he was on is the one.
1:16:44 Doug DeMuro? The C8 is dynamically brilliant. It was, it is the first Corvette that an entire generation has ever wanted.
1:16:51 Speaker 03 I will grant you that, really, the point of the Corvette is to prove that an American brand can build a class, competitive, supercar on a budget. And the C8 is that. In a way that the C7 is not. But I would rather have a C7.
1:17:07 Doug DeMuro? I think that C1 also should go before C7. What?
1:17:12 Speaker 03 C1, C1 changed the world.
1:17:13 Speaker 04 You ever driven a C1?
1:17:14 Speaker 03 No, no, they're bad. But, but, but it changed the world. You don't understand. C1 was an icon. It's hard to even explain in today's society how the world thought the C1 was-
1:17:25 Speaker 04 I know. I actually agree with that.
1:17:27 Speaker 03 Not just Dennis and him.
1:17:28 Speaker 04 I, every time I see one at a car show, at Johnny's Diner, or wherever they happen to be- When I see a C1, I go, can you believe that America used to build cars that look like that? But I say the same thing about the C2, and I much prefer the C2 than C1.
1:17:42 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, well, this is two first.
1:17:44 Speaker 03 Is that compromise on C8? Can we compromise on C1?
1:17:46 Speaker 04 C2 is so cool.
1:17:47 Speaker 03 So, C2, top.
1:17:49 Speaker 04 Number one.
1:17:49 Speaker 03 C8, I'll give you second. C7, C1, C4.2.
1:17:54 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
1:17:55 Speaker 03 C5, C6, C3.
1:17:56 Doug DeMuro? No, C6, C5.
1:17:57 Speaker 03 No.
1:17:58 Doug DeMuro? Then C3, then C4.1, that's your answer. We're, we're pretty aligned.
1:18:01 Speaker 03 We're close enough.
1:18:02 Doug DeMuro? We're close enough.
1:18:03 Speaker 03 That's interesting.
1:18:04 Doug DeMuro? Interesting.
1:18:04 Speaker 03 Corvette fans, don't, don't write in.
1:18:07 Doug DeMuro? We're gonna get some hate about the C4.1, but honestly, the C4.2, I, I, to this day, sometimes considering buying a 96 Grand Sport. To this day.
1:18:15 Speaker 03 So, blue.
1:18:15 Doug DeMuro? I would want one with miles.
1:18:16 Speaker 03 Blue.
1:18:16 Doug DeMuro? I would want one with a stick, I do not want a convertible.
1:18:18 Speaker 03 Can you pull up a C4 Grand Sport?
1:18:20 Doug DeMuro? We ran a nice one.
1:18:21 Speaker 03 We've run several nice ones.
1:18:23 Doug DeMuro? Let's see.
1:18:25 Speaker 03 I don't, I think it's been.
1:18:25 Doug DeMuro? Was it recent?
1:18:26 Speaker 03 There's Audis, type in C4 Grand, Grand.
1:18:28 Doug DeMuro? Doug Nash.
1:18:29 Speaker 03 I just, if you have a Doug Nash C4.
1:18:31 Doug DeMuro? Oh my god, I want one of these.
1:18:33 Speaker 03 It's been a minute.
1:18:34 Doug DeMuro? So bad. Look at that, they all had red interiors.
1:18:36 Speaker 03 I know, so cool.
1:18:37 Doug DeMuro? Look at that. Also, the interior wasn't bad. It truly wasn't.
1:18:41 Speaker 03 No, no, it's fine.
1:18:43 Doug DeMuro? Kenan's looking at it like, oh, well.
1:18:45 Speaker 03 No, I disagree.
1:18:47 Doug DeMuro? Oh, well. Look at that, look at this, look at this random, non-symmetric.
1:18:52 Speaker 03 I love it.
1:18:52 Doug DeMuro? This is how you make a car. Look at this chassis switch, Tour, Sport, Turf. Oh, look at that.
1:18:58 Speaker 03 No, I think it's perf. Just to post here, say, can you put in King of the Hill?
1:19:03 Doug DeMuro? What?
1:19:04 Speaker 03 The C4 ZR1 that we sold.
1:19:06 Doug DeMuro? Dude, look at this car. This is so cool.
1:19:08 Speaker 03 This was so cool. We sold a ZR1 prototype.
1:19:11 Doug DeMuro? Although, this is a point one.
1:19:13 Speaker 03 I know, but it's still cool. I, it's rare that we get to talk about it, because it was so long ago.
1:19:17 Doug DeMuro? Yeah, it was.
1:19:17 Speaker 03 But it's 20, 20, yeah.
1:19:19 Doug DeMuro? Yeah.
1:19:19 Speaker 04 Yeah, the, the ZR1, that, that engine in the ZR1 is something very special, and ahead of its time, and interesting, and cool. I adore that car personally.
1:19:29 Doug DeMuro? Okay, uh, we're gonna only have time for two more questions, two more questions, two more questions. One of them is from Quasi Brad, and it was a question for Filippo.
1:19:38 Speaker 03 Ooh.
1:19:39 Doug DeMuro? Um, the question is, Filippo, if you had to buy a car at a price point outside of what you'd ever actually spent on a car, what would it be? I have the same question for him. Aren't you curious about this? He says, list 50, 100, and 250, I don't care about the, the cheaper ones, what would you buy for 250?
1:19:54 Speaker 03 Nothing?
1:19:56 Speaker 03 I don't know.
1:19:56 Doug DeMuro? Index funds.
1:19:57 Speaker 03 I don't, my car thinking is very practical in nature. So it'd be, what is the purpose of this car? And if the answer was just for fun, I wouldn't.
1:20:07 Speaker 03 It's not a thing I would entertain.
1:20:08 Doug DeMuro? Okay, but 250, it doesn't have to be fun.
1:20:11 Speaker 03 I think if I were spending in the 150s.
1:20:15 Doug DeMuro? Can't even mentally bring it up.
1:20:17 Speaker 03 I'm getting there. If I was in the 150s, I would get a 550. I think a 550 would be legitimately quite cool.
1:20:24 Doug DeMuro? I agree.
1:20:25 Speaker 03 Uh, if I was going to 300, a Spiker C8 is a weirdly appealing car.
1:20:32 Speaker 07 It's me, the.
1:20:35 Speaker 07 We don't need the jingle twice.
1:20:38 Speaker 07 Stop it. This is about vacation inflation and how Priceline negotiates amazing deals on hotels, flights, and rental cars.
1:20:46 Speaker 07 Yeah, but I didn't mention that you can save up to 60% off hotels in the Priceline app. Fine. No one deals more deals than. Please stop. Touche. Priceline.
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1:21:30 Doug DeMuro? I mean, yeah, you could wear that jacket with that patch that doesn't match and you'd be super.
1:21:34 Speaker 03 Spiker C8.
1:21:35 Doug DeMuro? It's so cool.
1:21:36 Speaker 03 Spiker C8ing.
1:21:37 Doug DeMuro? It's always interesting to me when he has to express opinions about expensive cars that are positive, because he never does. You like the 550, what about an F12 or an 812? Or do you know what those are?
1:21:46 Speaker 03 I do know what those are. An F12 would be appealing, an 812, no, I haven't interested.
1:21:49 Doug DeMuro? No interest in the 812.
1:21:51 Speaker 04 I agree with, I mean.
1:21:52 Speaker 03 It's just cool. Also, the engineering, well, the like look appearance of engineering behind it is really cool.
1:21:58 Speaker 04 Five valves per cylinder, baby. And less horsepower than the R8.
1:22:01 Doug DeMuro? I filmed a video with this car.
1:22:03 Speaker 03 You did?
1:22:03 Doug DeMuro? In this location.
1:22:05 Speaker 03 That's what maybe you want.
1:22:05 Doug DeMuro? And I drove home in a Grand National. Would you get a Grand National?
1:22:09 Speaker 03 No.
1:22:09 Doug DeMuro? Okay.
1:22:11 Speaker 03 Go to the interior.
1:22:13 Speaker 04 One of the finest.
1:22:13 Doug DeMuro? This is what you would get at this price point?
1:22:16 Speaker 03 I think so. What do I get for 250? I don't know.
1:22:19 Doug DeMuro? I think you could find these for 250. Just this one was a really good one.
1:22:22 Speaker 03 All right, what other cars are 250? I got nothing.
1:22:25 Speaker 04 Alavio Let'sworth, less than Spider.
1:22:28 Speaker 03 I would consider going weird 80s European, like a Renault R5 Turbo is like the nicest one, or like something in that realm.
1:22:37 Doug DeMuro? He still can't take over. He can get himself over 125. He literally cannot get himself over 125.
1:22:41 Speaker 03 For like 85.
1:22:42 Doug DeMuro? You don't think about like a 911 Turbo. You don't think, and Delta Integrale, you?
1:22:46 Speaker 03 I would love one.
1:22:47 Doug DeMuro? Really?
1:22:47 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:22:48 Doug DeMuro? You?
1:22:48 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:22:49 Doug DeMuro? How could you maintain it?
1:22:50 Speaker 04 You would now have no talent. There's no one.
1:22:51 Speaker 03 I wouldn't buy it, obviously. But I've been forced to entertain this.
1:22:54 Speaker 04 There's nobody in the entire city of San Diego that can work on Integrale.
1:22:58 Doug DeMuro? I asked a lot of people. I'm sure we could find someone, but it would be challenging. That's my answer.
1:23:03 Speaker 03 I got nothing.
1:23:04 Speaker 04 I am impressed. I'm very impressed that you, it took you a minute to get there. You had to warm up, run at it.
1:23:11 Doug DeMuro? These people didn't really hit the 250.
1:23:13 Speaker 04 550 in CA.
1:23:14 Doug DeMuro? What about like a new, like an S65, like a new S65 and just ball out?
1:23:19 Speaker 03 Absolutely not.
1:23:22 Doug DeMuro? But imagine if you're so rich, depreciation's not a concern.
1:23:24 Speaker 03 I can't get past like 100 grand on a new car, like, and I still want it.
1:23:30 Doug DeMuro? Interesting.
1:23:30 Speaker 04 I applaud your choices.
1:23:32 Speaker 03 Thank you.
1:23:32 Speaker 04 Very tasteful. Nicely done.
1:23:34 Doug DeMuro? I applaud at least your ability to think about it. Okay, I'll take that. Uh, two more questions, very quick. Number one, uh, Dear Doug from Ahoob263, why did you take down your recession video? Oh my God, I put up a video about what the recession and tariffs would do to the car industry. And in the first 30 seconds of the video, I accidentally said, I switched up the tariffs are paid by importers versus exporters. And the rest of the video went on completely normally, but, but people absolutely freaked out about this 30, the 30 seconds that had nothing at all to do with the video. And I just decided, I don't want to put up with the BS. It was like a, a clear speech mistake that was not even important, that had nothing to do with the, with the actual text and, and, and
1:24:15 Speaker 04 Point, yeah.
1:24:15 Doug DeMuro? Point of the video. And I have noticed, this is irrelevant, and, and that's the answer, but this is, this is something I have noticed, the well actually people, they seem to be more than they used to be.
1:24:26 Speaker 04 Oh.
1:24:27 Doug DeMuro? In general, not, not even just on our content, in fact, mostly not on our content. I see on a lot of other creators' stuff, and especially on Instagram, the well actually crew, who isn't even saying something substantive, like in this case, this is a good example, just wants to get in there and make a correction. And as a creator, it gets tiring. Thankfully, as a creator, in, in myself, I just delete the content. Move on.
1:24:52 Speaker 04 Delete the content, get in your kintash and drive off.
1:24:54 Doug DeMuro? Right. Okay, Quasi Brad, last question from Quasi Brad. Do any of you have any opinions on MKBHD saying at the beginning of his Charger EV review that muscle cars are the perfect vehicle, vehicle to go electric? I found that almost objectionable. They are. I've always said that Tesla is the muscle car of the modern era. They're fast in a straight line, they don't really turn all that well, and they're cheap speed. They are muscle cars.
1:25:15 Speaker 04 They're not well put together.
1:25:16 Doug DeMuro? And they're not really all that well built.
1:25:18 Speaker 04 Yeah, you said that about the Plaid, I remember when you, that really, I totally, I agree with that. Now, to the person's point, I also understand, like, when you think muscle car, I think brablablablabla.
1:25:28 Doug DeMuro? And style.
1:25:29 Speaker 04 Burgling V8 and, and cool, like, cool style.
1:25:31 Doug DeMuro? But, but Tesla doesn't. Like, Teslas do not look like
1:25:34 Speaker 03 The Charger Daytona.
1:25:35 Doug DeMuro? The Charger Daytona does. I totally agree with MKBHD's take. I think if you really distill what made a muscle car, it was cheap speed, poorly built, straight line, American made vehicles. And if you want to look at all of the EVs that are that, they're all fat, exactly those things.
1:25:51 Speaker 03 But the experience is different. It's a new kind of muscle car.
1:25:53 Doug DeMuro? It's a muscle car for the 25th century, or whatever we're living in. We're gonna get a lot of the well actuallys, be like, 25th, 23rd century.
1:26:01 Speaker 03 Filippo's gone.
1:26:03 Doug DeMuro? All right, that's the end of the questions, that's the end of our podcast. Unless Filippo, you have any final parting thoughts?
1:26:08 Speaker 03 Just DND 212.
1:26:10 Doug DeMuro? Dude, download the app, that's what you're always supposed to say.
1:26:13 Speaker 03 Sorry, I got stretched by the license plate.
1:26:14 Doug DeMuro? Download the app, it rains money when you shake it.
1:26:17 Speaker 03 I, I've been corrected.
1:26:18 Doug DeMuro? Just like Filippo.
1:26:19 Speaker 03 That is Cars and Bits confetti.
1:26:20 Doug DeMuro? That's Cars and Bits confetti, it's not money.
1:26:22 Speaker 03 Not money. Although it can be money.
1:26:24 Doug DeMuro? It can be money if you want it.
1:26:26 Speaker 03 Right. Try, download the app, try it out.
1:26:27 Doug DeMuro? Goodbye, everyone. Thank you for watching our finest podcast ever.
1:26:33 Speaker 03 Goodbye.
1:26:53 Speaker 00 Welcome to the 50th Hunger Games.
1:26:56 Speaker 05 Witness the beginning of the revolution.
1:26:58 Speaker 06 Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from Star.
1:27:01 Speaker 05 Filmed for IMAX.
1:27:02 Speaker 06 Make them remember you.
1:27:05 Speaker 05 The Hunger Games: Sunrise on the Reaping, November 20th, rated PG-13.
Previous Why Do All EVs Look the Same? CLK-GTR Review Explained! New Ferrari V-12 Coming! Next Auto Manufacturers React to Tariffs! New Porsche 911 Prices are INSANE! Every BMW M3 Ranked. Page updated November 3, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated