KHC 131 - Taylor Spike

Taylor Spike, ultramarathon runner and one of Cam’s younger brothers. Join us for a conversation about Taylor’s recent accomplishment of completing the Arizona Monster 300 with a time of 88:38:23. Taylor talks about his training, difficulties in the race, hallucinations during the race, and more! Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Follow Taylor: https://www.instagram.com/tspike2/ Thank you to our sponsors: Sig Sauer: https://www.sigsauer.com/ use code CAM10 for 10% off optics Montana Knife Company: https://www.montanaknifecompany.com/ Use code CAM for 10% off Ketone IQ: https://www.ketone.com/Cam use code CAM for 30% off your first subscription MUD\WTR: https://mudwtr.com/cam use code CAM for 15% off Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv use code CAM for 10% off MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 20% off and Free Shipping Timestamps: 00:00:00 Taylor’s Experience with Running 300 Miles 00:09:43 Taylor’s Previous Races 00:11:15 Training for the Arizona Monster 300 00:14:20 Pushing Through the Thought of Quitting 00:18:14 Racing Against Peter Mortimer 00:22:19 The Hardest Part of the Race 00:25:53 Running & Body Progression from 2010 to 2025 00:29:02 The Growth of Ultras: Peter Mortimer, Adam Woods, & Gavin Ross 00:34:32 Ad Break (Montana Knife Company & Ketone) 0036:03 Training in Hard Conditions 00:40:49 Taylor’s Sleep Schedule During the Monster 300 00:47:27 Improvements For Upcoming Races 00:50:11 Race Maps & Looking for Aid Stations 01:02:16 Social Media & Celebrating Runners Efforts 01:04:26 What’s Next for Taylor 01:09:19 Cam’s Step Dad Greg 01:17:15 AZ Monster: Salt, Hydration & Fuel 01:24:43 Training for Cocodona 01:30:33 QA: F#$k, Marry, Kill: Monster, Tahoe, Cocodona? 01:32:44 QA: What Do You Think About When Things Get Hard? 01:34:28 QA: What Other Weird Hallucinations Did You Have? 01:37:32 QA: What’s One Truth You Had to Face About Yourself? 01:40:00 QA: How Did Your Mindset Change From Mile 1 to 299? 01:41:59 QA: One Moment From the Monster 300 You’d Replay? 01:44:44 Outro

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:15Cameron Hanes?

  All right. The Keep Hammer Collective with Taylor Spike. Congratulations. Thanks. Where's your award? Oh, I left it over on the table. Yeah, we need that award. Oh, yeah. Where's your buckle? I got the buckle, too.

• 0:32Cameron Hanes?

  This is a big deal. How do we do this? I don't know. I want to see it. It's pretty sick. This is what you get for running 300 miles. I know. So here we go. Camera 17, 18, 27. Right there. Pretty nice. Oh, yeah. Second. It's only one of those. Arizona Monster 300. That is badass, dude. And then the buckle, of course. And it's the same person that does the, has done all of our buckles. Tahoe and the Bigfoot. Cali. Yeah, that's really, that's really cool. Yeah. And you only get one of these by finishing that freaking 300 mile race. Yeah.

• 1:14Cameron Hanes?

  And you get this by finishing second. So how, how was just now? How many days out are you? What has it been? Five days? How many days has it been? A week. A full week? Tuesday, Tuesday morning I finished. Okay, so a week. So how's the body feeling right now?

• 1:35Cameron Hanes?

  Slow. Yeah. Well, let me just say, so it's a 300 mile foot race. You started last, or Friday before last. Yep. And finished on Tuesday, right? Yep. 88 hours. 88 hours. A foot race, nonstop. And people always ask, you know, what, how long do you go a day? Blah, blah, blah. I'm like, the clock doesn't stop. So if you want to sleep, clock still goes. Yep. You got it done in 88. The winner, Peter Mortimer, got it done in 86. But yeah, what's your body feel like after that?

• 2:12Speaker 01

  I like to take a lot of naps. Uh, my contacts don't fit my eyes.

• 2:17Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 2:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, uh, my weight finally is back.

• 2:20Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 2:23Speaker 01

  Like I don't have grip strength. That was something I, uh, I was trying to pinch something and I was like, gosh.

• 2:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 2:28Speaker 01

  I don't know if it's fatigue or dehydration or, or I don't know.

• 2:33Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 2:33Speaker 01

  But it's real.

• 2:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 2:35Speaker 01

  And, uh, and like even doing a bench or pull ups, like grabbing the bar. I just don't have like this, I don't feel strong. Uh, but I can do it and it's, um, actually today my thighs hurt more than they have since I quit.

• 2:49Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 2:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. I, I think it's just taken that long for things to kind of settle. Except I ran a couple of times. I've lifted. I've done, you know, normal stuff, but today it was like my sleep felt a little caught up, like my HRV on my watch. It's all in the red. Everything says strained. I would agree.

• 3:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 3:04Speaker 01

  That's pretty accurate, but, but today was like a deep soreness that, which I think is good.

• 3:09Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 3:10Speaker 01

  You know, cause I'm not still high on endorphins or whatever happens. So.

• 3:15Cameron Hanes?

  You're feeling it.

• 3:16Speaker 01

  Feeling that's good.

• 3:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah. So that your body probably was in like a self-preservation mode. And now it's like, okay, I guess we luck, we lived, we made it through it. So now your body's saying, here we are. That's what we're doing.

• 3:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. I think it's still questioning that.

• 3:33Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 3:33Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's three hundred and a long ways.

• 3:35Cameron Hanes?

  Ooh, that's, that's.

• 3:37Speaker 01

  It's, yeah, it was long.

• 3:39Cameron Hanes?

  That's amazing. It's a, there's something, I don't know. Just tracking you guys is people get addicted to that, you know, just that GPS tracker for 88 hours. It's like, I, I was explaining to somebody, I can't remember if it was these guys or, or whoever, but it's so weird how you start this race and then we go, you know, do whatever, go to a movie, go to dinner, go to bed, watch a show, get up, have coffee. Oh, I gotta do my Sonic. Oh, I gotta go get, kind of go to Pisgah today. Got to come back. And this whole time, for days, you're doing the same, just running, just moving.

• 4:21Cameron Hanes?

  Maybe not running all the time because some of it you gotta just hike this, the climbs, but people's lives go on for a long time and you're just doing the one thing.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  There, there was one point we knew because we were looking at the tracker too. I mean, I was using it. I want to see where Peter was or Josh or Ryan, where the crowd, you know, the crew was and. At one point, we had passed Josh and his pacer. I, I go by and I go, the crowd goes wild. And everybody's like, what? I said, you know how many people online just lost their shit right now? I said, we finally got you.

• 4:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 4:52Speaker 01

  It's like, yeah. So even us in the moment, looking at it, knowing, you know, you're looking at people's paces and how fast they're going. You're like, if I, you know, for 40 more miles, maybe I could close that. It's

• 5:03Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  It's for real. It's awesome. It's, uh, it's fun.

• 5:07Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it was a little, it was a little confusing on the start times.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  With the staggered starts.

• 5:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, cuz I was like looking and going, God, what? Okay, so if this guy's here, but he started two hours earlier. So we're doing a little math in there and I didn't know how it worked. I didn't know that to be considered for the top spot, you had to choose to start in the elite

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:28Cameron Hanes?

  field.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  That last group.

• 5:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that, that elite group was started, I guess, three hours after the first wave. And then two hour, yeah, so it staggered a little bit, but what was that? Because to get people spread out for the aid stations?

• 5:43Speaker 01

  Um, I think, uh, there was something about having so many people on the trail or in the starting area.

• 5:49Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  So there was some, something happened.

• 5:52Cameron Hanes?

  With a permit?

• 5:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  That's what I had understood. I, you know, whatever. I, uh,

• 5:59Speaker 01

  yeah, I saw where I was, you know? Yeah. I, I started, I literally though, so all that being said.

• 6:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 6:07Speaker 01

  I really wanted to win, right? And I didn't want there to be any question about it. So, uh, I was dead last. Um, so when everybody took off, I stood at the start line and waited.

• 6:17Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 6:17Speaker 01

  There's gotta be video of it somewhere. They were gone. Everybody was long gone.

• 6:20Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 6:21Speaker 01

  They're up around the corner and I hugged Jared and those guys told him, good job and waited for it to load in my watch and then, and took off. And so.

• 6:29Cameron Hanes?

  What was, what was the thought with that?

• 6:32Speaker 01

  I wanted to pass everybody.

• 6:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  I wanted to be able to work through the entire, everybody who was there.

• 6:38Cameron Hanes?

  Have a carrot, have a carrot out there to chase.

• 6:41Speaker 01

  The entire time. I knew that Peter and those other guys were faster than me and I knew they'd get out front and that was just, but at some point they would walk, right? And I just figured if I could just get in a groove and, you know, be smart, I could, I could get up there.

• 6:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's a long race.

• 6:56Speaker 01

  So long. Yeah. And I, forty five was the first sleep station. Um, you know, it was a war zone. I mean, there's people all over.

• 7:04Cameron Hanes?

  Forty five. So how many hours was that in? What, what were we doing? Probably like four miles an hour?

• 7:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think early we were.

• 7:11Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 7:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. Cause we were, it was like, I thought it was like one or two in the morning.

• 7:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So you, so that would have been like 11 hours, 10, 11 hours into the race already.

• 7:20Speaker 01

  Yep. Yeah. And it was, it was a crewless aid station and it was funny because you could tell how many people were so reliant on their crews because there's people leaving water bottles and platters up around and food. They just took off into the dark.

• 7:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 7:32Speaker 01

  Without their stuff, you know, and that's when I was like, okay, I'd, I'd been, what happens? We got lost three times in the first two miles. We'd run out, oh, wrong way. Oh, wrong way. Finally I'm like, I'm done. I'm just going to get the back. And then I got kind of in the back of the Congo line.

• 7:50Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 7:50Speaker 01

  But which was fun. I met, you know, Eli and Kerry Ward and those guys and just BS for 20, 30 miles.

• 7:58Cameron Hanes?

  Now that helps.

• 7:58Speaker 01

  Yeah. And just hung out, you know, and then it was, you know, it started getting dark and it's like, I got some work to do now. So.

• 8:05Cameron Hanes?

  And that was past forty five then? Or when, when were you with those guys?

• 8:09Speaker 01

  First fifteen, twenty.

• 8:10Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 8:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So is, it's really hard. I mean, I've never, I've never run a good race ever. Wanted to talk, when we're talking about long distance, but, cause I always go too fast. It is so hard not to go fast.

• 8:27Speaker 01

  So hard.

• 8:27Cameron Hanes?

  And then, then I always blow up and then it's just, just barely hanging on to finish.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. I was the same. It was like I'd run a couple of the hills and people would say, oh, look, we walked those and caught up to you. They're already giving you a hard time. I remember there was another guy, because I had worked through everyone. I'd gotten to a point that, um, you know, you kind of like see that, the ones that started earlier, but they're pretty quick. You know, it's like it's kind of questionable when this guy lets me go by and lets me pass him. And he goes, I expect you to win. And I turn, I said, me too.

• 8:58Cameron Hanes?

  So I was like, that was that all when, when was that the goal when you first signed up is you wanted to win that, win it?

• 9:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. When I looked at it, Candice had been talking about this race for since Moab, I thought.

• 9:08Cameron Hanes?

  I know for a while. Yeah.

• 9:10Speaker 01

  So when it popped up, you know, it was like, oh yeah, I'm, you know, I'm in the guys in Recovery Strong forced my hand to do it because they paid for it. I couldn't afford it. So they're like, we're doing this.

• 9:21Cameron Hanes?

  It's like 2,000 bucks.

• 9:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. After Kokadona, they're like, oh, we're doing this. And I was like, okay, I'm in. So, you know, looking at the field and knowing, you know, just, you know, been doing this for a minute. It's like, I knew how far, I knew how far it was. I knew how I'd done at Tahoe and the others. And I was like, this is my one chance. It's my one chance to win one.

• 9:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So it's a, you are, you are really good at the long distance. So you've done how, how many over 200 now?

• 9:50Speaker 01

  This was number five.

• 9:51Cameron Hanes?

  Number five.

• 9:52Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 9:53Cameron Hanes?

  And you got, you got third at Tahoe twice.

• 9:56Speaker 01

  Yep. Third, third at Tahoe twice and then the second place.

• 10:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 10:01Speaker 01

  But I mean, so technically I got a second at Tahoe, but.

• 10:05Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, did you?

• 10:07Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, because Courtney was the first.

• 10:09Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 10:09Speaker 01

  She was in front of me. So I got third overall, but I was second male. So it's a technicality.

• 10:16Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah. Third overall, second male. Yeah. So you've had some great races.

• 10:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:21Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, and I would, so I would think that there is, there would be a good chance you could win. I mean, the inaugural one, and you've done a lot of inaugural, inaugural races too, which is a whole nother level of challenge because for the race director, it's new. So you don't know like the hiccups that are going to come up in a race. You know, she's been doing 200s for a long time, but this is a whole different animal.

• 10:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:47Cameron Hanes?

  You know?

• 10:47Speaker 01

  It's all different. Yeah. When you're a hundred some miles in and you don't know what that person's thinking or not thinking.

• 10:52Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 10:52Speaker 01

  Yeah. I would call and remember they said at one point, I could hear them back, better send somebody out there to fix it. And I get that. That's why I do it. That's why inaugural years are awesome.

• 11:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. Four of them. I, four of the, the five I've done were inaugural. Tahoe flipped the other direction.

• 11:07Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:08Speaker 01

  So I guess it wasn't really.

• 11:10Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 11:10Speaker 01

  An inaugural, but it was the only year they did that.

• 11:12Cameron Hanes?

  Going that way.

• 11:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:13Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Well, yeah. I mean, and also your training had been pretty much on point.

• 11:19Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 11:20Cameron Hanes?

  You know, you get, I, I don't know, for the people that follow you. You do spend a lot of time in the mountains, a lot of time.

• 11:28Speaker 01

  I try to.

• 11:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:31Cameron Hanes?

  For training for this, what was it? What was your plan? I mean, miles a week or hours a week or climb? Feet climbed a week? What were you after?

• 11:42Speaker 01

  So I used to, I would always shoot for like 20 plus hours a week on foot and then it would come out to like 100 miles and 20,000 feet of gain. For whatever reason, I mean, yes, my speed is only my speed, right? So

• 11:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 11:56Speaker 01

  That would look like that, but I I knew there wasn't as much climbing in this and I know what it's like to run on tired legs. It was like at all the years of doing it's like finally I realized I don't need to climb as much as I used to. And as long as I was conditioned going into it, then like Mount Lemon was a great big climb.

• 12:16Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 12:16Speaker 01

  But I knew if I'd beat myself up training, I wouldn't have to do 20,000 feet a week to do that. I could do 10.

• 12:23Cameron Hanes?

  But how big was, what was the lemon climb like?

• 12:28Cameron Hanes?

  It's like 6,000?

• 12:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, over, yeah, it went 14 miles

• 12:33Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 12:33Speaker 01

  up to the top and it's like six or 6,600, I think.

• 12:37Cameron Hanes?

  That's a grind.

• 12:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it was steep and I heard people complain, but it, we kind of flew right up. It was like

• 12:42Cameron Hanes?

  You just had poles and you're just kind of power hiking?

• 12:45Speaker 01

  Yep. Yeah. Never put my poles down.

• 12:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 12:47Speaker 01

  Used them the entire time. We just hit that and it was at sunset and it was cooling down and we just grind into the top of it, snow on the top and left out of my pacer at the top of that. They came down Redfern Ridge, which was a special, special spot. It was a shit trail.

• 13:04Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 13:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was awesome. I mean, just like, it's just kind of a

• 13:06Cameron Hanes?

  Big boulders or what?

• 13:08Speaker 01

  No, just down, just a steep down off of a open ridge, you know, that just exposed rocky slick.

• 13:16Speaker 01

  I couldn't see anything. It's pitch dark, but you know.

• 13:18Cameron Hanes?

  Was the course all exposed? Cause it was southern Arizona, right?

• 13:21Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 13:22Cameron Hanes?

  So Tucson area?

• 13:23Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 13:23Cameron Hanes?

  So no shade?

• 13:24Speaker 01

  No, no shade. The only shade might've been up there and it was in the middle of the night when I was up there.

• 13:29Cameron Hanes?

  Dude, that being exposed. Sucks energy from you.

• 13:35Speaker 01

  It is, yeah, and how cold it got.

• 13:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 13:39Speaker 01

  As soon as we'd say, as soon as the shadows got long, it was gonna get cold.

• 13:43Cameron Hanes?

  And it sun drops and yeah.

• 13:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's just, it's frigid. It's like being in a refrigerator.

• 13:49Cameron Hanes?

  And how hot was it during the day then?

• 13:51Speaker 01

  I think we only saw mid eighties.

• 13:53Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, okay. But that's still exposed. That's still.

• 13:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, we're enough.

• 13:58Cameron Hanes?

  It's, yeah, I mean, you're definitely. Cause that air dries out your skin. Everything's dry.

• 14:03Speaker 01

  Well, that's, that was the other kicker is it'd be hot and you get on a ridge and it was windy. And then you can tell how hot it really was and you realize you're cooking.

• 14:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  You know, you're just, we did a good job keeping the sun off of us with sun shirts and what we could and hats. But yeah, it was hot. Yeah.

• 14:19Cameron Hanes?

  So here's what's crazy. You're training on point. You live in the mountains. You've done this a million times. You're ready. You're mentally ready. You know what it takes. How many times, with all that being said, did you want to quit?

• 14:37Cameron Hanes?

  How many times? Once. Only, cause like, here's what I, I say.

• 14:41Speaker 01

  Fifteen miles left. I was done. First time in my life. I'm like, I'm out. I ain't doing this. I am not. I said, I'm retired. I don't care. It hurts too much. It ain't worth it. It's not worth it to me.

• 14:55Cameron Hanes?

  And that's, that's what people, I think people who haven't done these, don't realize that even with everything going, I guess the preparation, the experience, you're in first for most of the time, you're still gonna want to quit this bitch. It hurts so bad.

• 15:13Speaker 01

  Well, no, I mean, yeah, I mean, your body is telling you to quit the first 10 miles.

• 15:16Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 15:17Speaker 01

  You're sweating, you're breathing hard. I mean, those are pretty good signs. You should probably slow, you know, it's, I looked at my thing, it was like a 119 average heart rate for 88 hours. That's a lot of cardio.

• 15:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that is.

• 15:27Speaker 01

  Most people, yeah. Imagine that on a, I just, yeah, it was a lot.

• 15:31Cameron Hanes?

  Did your watch say it was time to rest?

• 15:34Speaker 01

  It's weird. It's this weird black thing on my thing. It doesn't really shed. Yeah.

• 15:39Cameron Hanes?

  I don't. Yeah, I think it I thought that well, there's oh, see, like even on a 50 K. There's been 50 K's where I'm like, this sucks. I don't even want to finish this.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 15:53Cameron Hanes?

  Thirty seven miles and then for sure on a hundred, hundred, you're gonna have at least one or two for me that I'm just like, can I make up something?

• 16:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:04Cameron Hanes?

  Can I make up? I hurt something.

• 16:05Speaker 01

  I never, the last 15.

• 16:07Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 16:08Speaker 01

  It was the last.

• 16:08Cameron Hanes?

  All the way there.

• 16:09Speaker 01

  And I'll tell you.

• 16:10Cameron Hanes?

  That's good.

• 16:11Speaker 01

  I'm with you. I've been 17 miles into a 50 K and going, you know, I kept telling people I'd see him. I said, this still seems like a good idea.

• 16:18Cameron Hanes?

  You know, because.

• 16:19Speaker 01

  Good sign.

• 16:19Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:20Speaker 01

  And, and it, cause it's one of those, you get so far into it that you're like, you know what? I, I can quit. Nobody's gonna say I didn't try.

• 16:28Cameron Hanes?

  And nobody can say shit, really.

• 16:30Speaker 01

  Right. And, but I never, I never got there. It was that last, and which was probably why it was so hard on that last. So, cause I just probably blocked it the whole time. Just never thought about it.

• 16:40Cameron Hanes?

  Never had a thing to think. Finally, it was like all raw and exposed.

• 16:45Speaker 01

  Pussy sobbing. Cam, when I left that aid station with Jared, I was swinging my arms. Like, you know, when you tell your kid, come on, you need to work.

• 16:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:54Speaker 01

  They're like exaggerating it.

• 16:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 16:56Speaker 01

  And you just, you just wanna go push them out. That's what I was doing. I was like swinging my arms as hard as I could just to try. And I was walking. I just, I just wanted to go.

• 17:06Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  I was so done.

• 17:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. In 15 miles, like you'd say that, oh, what's 15 out of 300? 15 is still a ways.

• 17:16Speaker 01

  That could take six hours.

• 17:17Cameron Hanes?

  Still a ways. I don't care. I mean, I just walked 19 and that seemed like a long way. So, and I hadn't done shit before that.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. Especially when you think about, everybody's coming. It's like everyone's behind you.

• 17:32Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 17:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, yeah, it, yeah, it was for real.

• 17:37Cameron Hanes?

  And, um, so I wonder if it was worse at that time because you knew you weren't gonna catch Peter.

• 17:46Speaker 01

  Well, I still, no, I thought I could.

• 17:48Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, you still thought you could?

• 17:49Speaker 01

  I still thought, cause they said.

• 17:50Cameron Hanes?

  And you still wanted to quit?

• 17:52Speaker 01

  I just didn't want to do it. I'd already quit.

• 17:56Speaker 01

  Didn't matter.

• 17:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 17:57Speaker 01

  I figured he only had four miles. I hadn't even done the math. When we left the aid station in my mind, I thought, well, if he's walking.

• 18:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:04Speaker 01

  And we ran a 10 minute mile.

• 18:06Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:07Speaker 01

  I would catch him with two miles left.

• 18:08Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 18:09Speaker 01

  And, yeah, it doesn't not, that dude's fast. That was the whole, those guys I knew were all faster than me and I knew that they know that I'm in the mountains and I'm not a road guy. Some of those cats got 15 hour hundreds.

• 18:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:23Speaker 01

  No way have I ever been close to that, right?

• 18:25Cameron Hanes?

  Fast hundred.

• 18:27Speaker 01

  I knew that that's, that I had to push where I could push and on the road.

• 18:31Cameron Hanes?

  And everybody knows everybody else's strengths by that time because the crews, everybody's been doing research.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  Pistol Hill.

• 18:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 18:39Speaker 01

  Pistol Hill is where it got real. And I reached out to those guys today, seeing if anybody had a picture at that aid station because I had left in the lead. Uh, no, Josh and Ryan were out front.

• 18:50Cameron Hanes?

  What mile was this?

• 18:52Speaker 01

  It's in the dark, second night.

• 18:55Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 18:55Speaker 01

  150s, coming in 200 somewhere. We were moving pretty good and I had left ahead of Peter and, uh, 120, yeah, I think it was somewhere in there, 150. And, uh, so I had left ahead of Peter and I'm going through the subdivision and all of a sudden those cats roll up behind me with their headlights off.

• 19:16Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 19:17Speaker 01

  And they were running hard.

• 19:18Cameron Hanes?

  Ooh.

• 19:18Speaker 01

  And they flew past me, keep it up.

• 19:21Cameron Hanes?

  Who was it? It was Peter?

• 19:22Speaker 01

  Peter and his pacer.

• 19:23Cameron Hanes?

  God damn.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  And they take off. I'm looking at the map. I'm like, well, we hit a road down here, you know, they're not going to get that far. Right. So they, but they're like, they're gone. And I can see him way down and then they see him turn on the road and they're walking.

• 19:37Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 19:37Speaker 01

  And I'm like, oh, okay.

• 19:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 19:40Speaker 01

  Turn my it off and I ran my ass off. And it was like one of those moments and I'm like, you're either going to blow up or this is going to work. So I end up reeling them in within sight and. They're walking and we walked for four miles, which was awesome because here you are with the leader.

• 19:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 19:57Speaker 01

  And he's walking. So it's like, well, that kind of makes it okay for me to walk, right?

• 20:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:00Speaker 01

  Then we're both walking. But he doesn't know I'm behind him. What happened is there's these, these markers are about six feet tall, like construction markers on the side of the highway and they got lights on the top.

• 20:10Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 20:11Speaker 01

  Well, when those guys would turn around, look, I'd like tuck him behind the cone, think they couldn't see me.

• 20:17Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 20:17Speaker 01

  And eventually we all hooked up and we walked, you know, then from there, then we caught Josh going on the gravel road. Then we came into Pistol Hill and we all slept around the fire.

• 20:26Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 20:27Speaker 01

  And that was when, uh, you know, that was the first time I'd really kind of interacted with Peter. He was, he had his pacer helping him and Josh and I were all just kind of like war zone. It was the first time I ever slept at the fire, like in a chair. And I just hit my timer. I was like, we're all here. Fuck.

• 20:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  You just got to come back. So that was, uh, that was one of those moments I told Adam, I said, that's where, and I was like, okay, I saw some weaknesses. I think, you know, maybe Peter's going to sleep too much. That was my hope, you know?

• 20:55Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 20:55Speaker 01

  That didn't happen, but it was a, that was a good one.

• 20:59Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. It was, well, all these tactics, like turning off the headlamps and like all these strategy things. And like, if they're walking, you're walking or when you pass, you gotta just seem strong.

• 21:10Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, yeah.

• 21:11Cameron Hanes?

  So they're just like questioning themselves.

• 21:13Speaker 01

  But this is so far for so long. It was like your pants were down on the first day. It was like every move that we had, it was like, oh yeah, we, I knew that was how it was going to happen. You knew where they were going to catch you. I kept looking back. Adam's like, what's up? I said, Peter's going to come like a freight train down this hill any minute and sure shit. He could just fall in.

• 21:32Cameron Hanes?

  Is he taller or is he, so he's been, is he pretty, obviously good, but he's been doing good in the ultra scene for a while.

• 21:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. He was one of Mongolia monster. He was second at Kokadona, the inaugural year.

• 21:44Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 21:45Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, he's a beast.

• 21:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 21:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. He's, he's fast and he gets after it. So.

• 21:50Cameron Hanes?

  Train's hard.

• 21:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:51Cameron Hanes?

  Where's he from?

• 21:52Speaker 01

  There. That's like staff or that area. All those guys were, they don't even, you don't, you don't realize how hard it is to trust your feet. You know, when I'm running around here, I don't ever look at my feet.

• 22:03Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 22:03Speaker 01

  I know that rock isn't going to move.

• 22:05Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 22:05Speaker 01

  I'm going to twist, but out there, man, in that desert, it's different. It's different. You just can't, I can't bomb a hill like I can here.

• 22:12Cameron Hanes?

  Right. Yeah. Not, not too many buffed out trails.

• 22:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:16Cameron Hanes?

  And then, uh, so.

• 22:20Cameron Hanes?

  Let me, let me think. So what was the, the hardest section? Was it that bike path?

• 22:25Speaker 01

  Through Tucson. Yeah. The bike, the 50 miles of bike path.

• 22:28Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, cause you sign up for a mountain ultra, like 300 miles. You don't expect 50 miles on a bike.

• 22:34Speaker 01

  Well, and what we all agreed is that nobody would run 50 miles on the road for training.

• 22:39Cameron Hanes?

  Hell no.

• 22:40Speaker 01

  It's miserable.

• 22:41Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, it's terrible.

• 22:42Speaker 01

  And it's not even railroad grade. It's worse because it would do these dips like under the overpass.

• 22:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 22:48Speaker 01

  So it'd be like a little downhill and then this little uphill, but it was just enough that you're like, I'm walking.

• 22:53Cameron Hanes?

  Walking.

• 22:53Speaker 01

  But it's right there is, but it wore on you, man. It's in the heat.

• 22:57Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 22:58Speaker 01

  That was really, that was weird.

• 22:59Cameron Hanes?

  You get to where in these ultras, you get to where like the slightest little uphill, you're like uphill, walking.

• 23:06Speaker 01

  Yep. Check it out. We're used to like uphill, like, oh, let's get to the top. That's uphill. It's like, uh, no, that's up. I see a little rise.

• 23:15Cameron Hanes?

  I saw the guy on the bike coast. I'm walking this.

• 23:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. And your shoes are flat. That's another one. Your shoes go flat, you know, so they're all splayed up. It just, the heat on it. It's, yes, for real.

• 23:25Cameron Hanes?

  It's so much little thing, little things.

• 23:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. And doing that after climbing the mountain, you know, and doing that first section, all that trail, it was, it was a lot.

• 23:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  It was a lot.

• 23:37Cameron Hanes?

  What, uh, so 15 got tough. Um, but you were saying you felt good up until the very end, essentially?

• 23:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. I felt really good till 250.

• 23:47Cameron Hanes?

  250.

• 23:47Speaker 01

  250 of my feet started to, they like a achy, like not, not like, oh, I got a blister.

• 23:53Cameron Hanes?

  Right. Yeah.

• 23:54Speaker 01

  It's a long.

• 23:55Cameron Hanes?

  Pretty standard.

• 23:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. But it was things like, um, somebody else's podcast. He's like, I knew I was doing damage. So I just, and I was like, yeah, for real.

• 24:05Cameron Hanes?

  Oh no. These things aren't good for you?

• 24:07Speaker 01

  This is not good for you. First time that I was like, and I told somebody else, I, I've sold myself short for the past decade of running ultras. I have never been like. Okay, I'm broke.

• 24:19Cameron Hanes?

  Send it.

• 24:19Speaker 01

  I'm gonna be just more broken?

• 24:21Cameron Hanes?

  No, I know.

• 24:22Speaker 01

  It's just, I, yeah, it was, it was a lot. Ankles and knees, the stuff that would, you know, tweak and you're just like, oh, it, it still works.

• 24:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that's where I, I hear people say stuff like, um, you know, I just didn't wanna do any long-term damage. I'm like, well, then you shouldn't fucking sign up for these races.

• 24:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, because reality is, yeah. And you know what the other reality that is, is you probably did all that damage training.

• 24:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I mean, it's too late.

• 24:47Speaker 01

  It's too late. That's how, exactly in my mind, I'm like, you know, I've done thousands and thousands of miles over a decade. That, if I break my ankle, okay.

• 24:58Cameron Hanes?

  If you're worried about longevity, can go do yoga.

• 25:00Speaker 01

  Right. Even though I knew Peter was gonna beat me and I was never gonna catch him.

• 25:04Cameron Hanes?

  God, no, you didn't know that. You know that now.

• 25:08Speaker 01

  I did that pretty early.

• 25:09Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 25:10Speaker 01

  It was, I was on hope. I was on hope.

• 25:13Cameron Hanes?

  You raced good. I guarantee he was questioning.

• 25:16Speaker 01

  Oh, no, he, there's a picture, he, he and I standing there with my, our, our arms around each other. He goes, man, I like you. He goes, but I hope I never see you again. I was like, I was, I was like, you got, we're Ryan. That's when we had the talk. It was like, you gotta go get it, man. You gotta make this clear.

• 25:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Well, how, how has it been? Like, when you think about your journey as an ultra runner? Cause right now, it's like, everybody like kind of in the ultra running world, they were following Arizona monster. You're, you know, podium, seconds, big effort, big incredible results. When you think about like, so your first ultra was, what year was that?

• 25:56Speaker 01

  2010.

• 25:57Cameron Hanes?

  2010. So 15 years of doing this. What, tell me what, what that's been like. I mean, how, how have you changed from 2010 to 2025?

• 26:12Speaker 01

  Um, I'm just, I can, that whole thing about listening to your body. That, that is probably the biggest piece that, you know, in the beginning it was, you're sending it. I mean, you just run down these hills, it's kind of careless and just, you're not sure if you're going to get hurt or if this is normal. And now it's like, you know, that's, there's a, there's a process to all that stuff. And I, you know, training for stuff or figuring out what works for me. Probably that, just learning my body and listening to it, you know, other than the sport itself, you know, it's like, man, it's got way bigger, you know, there's way more people doing it, you know? I don't, I don't know. Sometimes I want to feel like there's a lot, there's faster people, but I feel like there's just more people.

• 26:55Speaker 01

  And the more people is pushed, the faster, you know, then that brings that out. But I can't believe that we're running 300 miles. That's the one that, yeah. I remember when you did Western States, that was like my intro at the long distance.

• 27:07Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that was 2010.

• 27:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, 100 miles. I was like, I was doing a China hat enduro 100 mile and motorcycle race. And I was trying to compare those two, right? And I was like, 100 miles on foot, man, on a motorcycle. That's hard, right? In the desert. So just, yeah, being able to wrap my mind around that's it. That's as a sport, that's just mind blowing is that people are continuing to run further and further. Successfully like, well, like Peter looked pretty good.

• 27:33Speaker 01

  It's mind blowing.

• 27:34Cameron Hanes?

  I know, I know. I wonder what so, I mean, your body's changed dramatically from when you first started too. I mean, cause nowadays, like I always hear, I saw your brother, oh, he's shredded. I mean, and it's just like, it's just 15 years in the mountains. I mean, your body will adapt. You keep going back to the mountains, you're going to get results.

• 27:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:58Cameron Hanes?

  And you have.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was 200 pounds and, uh, you know, was got down to 138 was the thinnest I got. That's a, Paxton is, you know, my 16 year old, he's, that was the smallest I got, I think like 170 now. And that's, you know, I don't, I don't spend a lot of time in the gym. Like I tell the kid, it's like, you can do a pretty good workout, one song. You know, you can do some bench, sit around, wait for the song to end, do some more, and you don't have to do a lot, but just a little bit.

• 28:24Cameron Hanes?

  Carry a rock up a mountain, right?

• 28:28Cameron Hanes?

  Don't overthink it.

• 28:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, being consistent.

• 28:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 28:31Speaker 01

  Showing up.

• 28:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Well, I mean, it's, yeah, you've definitely, I don't know, it's changed your life, which that's what ultra marathons can do. That's what the mountains can do just in general. But then when you sign up to compete, that's a whole nother level.

• 28:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:47Cameron Hanes?

  And, okay, how do I, how do I not just compete, but how do I win? You know? And that's always your goal is to win now. But yeah, that's been, what an amazing journey.

• 28:59Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 29:00Cameron Hanes?

  It's, um, yeah, I, I love that more people are learning about ultra marathon and like the communities being celebrated. It's, it's because it's the best people. It feels like the best people out there.

• 29:14Speaker 01

  Well, that, yeah, I mean, everybody's so encouraged. I mean, this is, where else are you going to get to mile 280 of any event and you're laughing with the leader? Oh, yeah. You know, like he and I in that picture look like we just started. And we, we were deep in it, you know, and to be able to have that camaraderie, you know, that late into a competition that you just, you're not going to find that anywhere.

• 29:35Cameron Hanes?

  No.

• 29:35Speaker 01

  You know, and that those guys are waiting for you at the finish, you know, you can show up the next day and Ryan, all those guys, we just sat around at the finish and BS, watch other people come in. It's like, you know, that's your circle.

• 29:45Cameron Hanes?

  God, that's the best. Did you, did you get a group shot? You said you wanted to wait for a group shot?

• 29:51Speaker 01

  No, I, I, because they did on Friday.

• 29:53Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, they did?

• 29:54Speaker 01

  They're all there. I had to go back to work.

• 29:57Cameron Hanes?

  That sucks. Does, uh, does Peter work? Does he have a job? He's not like a, there's not hardly any pro ultra.

• 30:04Speaker 01

  He's like a, uh, I don't want to say he's an orthopedic surgeon, but he does something with shoulder replacements.

• 30:10Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, okay.

• 30:11Speaker 01

  Like, uh, for a place in Flagstaff. I saw he was back to work the next day.

• 30:15Cameron Hanes?

  Must be nice.

• 30:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:17Cameron Hanes?

  To be rich.

• 30:19Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, just kidding. Maybe there's that. Yeah. No, I can't take any. People will try their best to take away from people who do amazing things by somehow justifying. I don't know what, but I can't. I'm not saying shit. I'm just joking. Yeah. Good job, Peter. Yeah. It's a big win. That's a big win.

• 30:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I I'm curious, like, man, he had the sleep system. He would roll in. He was it was dialed.

• 30:44Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I wonder how he was. I wonder how he was. Maybe he just falls asleep easy. I don't know.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  No, no, because when I saw, when I told Adam I saw blood because he was in an aid station sleeping and he's like, told his pacer, hey, can you cover up my feet? They're cold. And I was like, oh, yeah, little weakness. I'd see pee on the side of the trail and tell Adam they stopped. You can tell. Right. Weak. I said, that's blood. I said, we gotta keep going.

• 31:13Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's amazing how much you can try to interpret sign or tells.

• 31:18Speaker 01

  For that long.

• 31:19Cameron Hanes?

  Because tells, because it's like, it's like playing poker and like, you gotta try to read your opponent.

• 31:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, that that section that Adam did that 60, he paced 80 miles with me.

• 31:28Cameron Hanes?

  Whoa, 80?

• 31:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, this one was 60, 60 mile section he did. And it was

• 31:33Cameron Hanes?

  Holy shit.

• 31:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I was, that's when I got when they said

• 31:36Cameron Hanes?

  What's his last name? Adam?

• 31:37Speaker 01

  Wood, Woods.

• 31:38Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 31:39Speaker 01

  He paced me at Cokerdona, too.

• 31:41Cameron Hanes?

  So he's a good runner, then?

• 31:43Speaker 01

  He's a beast.

• 31:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 31:44Speaker 01

  He's way faster than me.

• 31:45Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 31:45Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. He just doesn't know it.

• 31:48Cameron Hanes?

  That's like that kid who did that fucking shotgun race.

• 31:50Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, no, he, all those guys.

• 31:52Cameron Hanes?

  That guy's fast.

• 31:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, their problem is they run with me. So I know I got tricks.

• 31:56Cameron Hanes?

  I know. I know.

• 31:58Speaker 01

  But they

• 31:59Cameron Hanes?

  And they're like in their 20 or that kid who won shotgun's 20.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 32:03Cameron Hanes?

  What's his name?

• 32:03Speaker 01

  Gavin Ross.

• 32:04Cameron Hanes?

  Gavin, yeah.

• 32:04Speaker 01

  He's a piece of

• 32:05Cameron Hanes?

  God dang.

• 32:06Speaker 01

  And then he just ran 124 at the half in Hawaii.

• 32:10Cameron Hanes?

  Uh, was that road?

• 32:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:12Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, well, that's not that fast. Yeah. I mean,

• 32:15Speaker 01

  Well, especially, yeah, I guess it's pretty quick. I asked him though. I was like, what did your 208 beat or 408 beat my time? I thought it had a shotgun.

• 32:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 32:23Speaker 01

  I felt like a dick when it didn't. He's like, no, I was short. I was like, oh, okay.

• 32:27Cameron Hanes?

  So you got the course record still?

• 32:28Speaker 01

  No, no. Somebody's ran three something.

• 32:31Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, no, no, that was that guy from Germany. That guy. I know I ran that year, too. He was, he's got like 345.

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:39Cameron Hanes?

  But it was, I think it was a different course. Was it?

• 32:42Speaker 01

  No, I wish it was.

• 32:45Speaker 01

  But no.

• 32:45Cameron Hanes?

  He cheated.

• 32:46Speaker 01

  No.

• 32:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, Gavin, no, 124 is good, but I think that ultra performance is better than a 124 half. A lot of people have run 124 half, but to run that fast on that course for 50K, that's impressive.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's a Harsburg kid.

• 33:00Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 33:00Speaker 01

  That's I'd see him in the mornings. We'd always give this nod. Finally, we both like, hey, what's up? Do you want to like run together?

• 33:07Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:08Cameron Hanes?

  I was asking him, I said, because we ran together pretty much the whole time until I cut my leg. But we, I was asking him, what, what was the worst run he's done with you?

• 33:21Speaker 01

  Oh, geez.

• 33:22Cameron Hanes?

  Cause he's done like some, you've had some long days out there. He mentioned something or it was cold as shit and you guys were out there for like hours. I don't know how many hours. I can't remember, but where was that in the snow?

• 33:36Speaker 01

  Oh, I know. I'm trying to think of what the name of the.

• 33:39Cameron Hanes?

  Or maybe it was just rainy. Maybe it wasn't snow.

• 33:41Speaker 01

  No, it was snowing.

• 33:41Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 33:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, we, I had found this loop.

• 33:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:45Speaker 01

  Which is usually how they start. Terrible.

• 33:48Cameron Hanes?

  It's like 20 some miles or 30 miles.

• 33:50Speaker 01

  Terrible traverses.

• 33:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:53Speaker 01

  I can't remember Clark. I can't remember where it was, but it was legit.

• 33:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 33:57Speaker 01

  And it was luckily it was one of those you're doing a loop and you're like, gosh, I really hope this is actually a trail. And somebody had literally just gone down it and put ribbons.

• 34:06Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, really?

• 34:07Speaker 01

  Otherwise we would have been hypothermic.

• 34:10Cameron Hanes?

  That's what he said. He said he was like almost hypothermic.

• 34:15Cameron Hanes?

  Shit happens.

• 34:16Speaker 01

  Lightweight.

• 34:17Cameron Hanes?

  But anyway, the point, what I took from it is you do shit like that in training, you're getting tough.

• 34:24Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, because I, you know.

• 34:26Cameron Hanes?

  Or you die.

• 34:27Speaker 01

  Well.

• 34:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, luckily I haven't died.

• 34:30Cameron Hanes?

  That's your options.

• 34:32Speaker 01

  You know, but every ultra I've ever done is like, they're hard, you know, especially we're in Arizona. It's 87. There's an inch of snow on the ground. You're way through creeks, you know, you're using cactuses pillows. You know, it's like, it's. It's hard.

• 34:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 34:47Speaker 01

  You know, so yeah, during training, it's like all you can do is expose yourself to a little bit of that.

• 34:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 34:52Speaker 01

  Um, you know, where those guys think is different is that they're willing to show up. There's him and Danny Brinson, those guys will show up. I'll just say, hey, meet me at the trailhead 4am.

• 35:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 35:01Speaker 01

  Okay. They don't ask how far, how long.

• 35:04Cameron Hanes?

  That's awesome.

• 35:04Speaker 01

  If they need to bring anything.

• 35:05Cameron Hanes?

  I love that.

• 35:06Speaker 01

  They're committed. And I drug them thirty plus miles through some shit.

• 35:10Cameron Hanes?

  Makes a, makes a big difference.

• 35:12Speaker 01

  It does.

• 35:13Cameron Hanes?

  That training, it's all there.

• 35:14Speaker 01

  Especially when they don't know any different. You know, it's not like they're track guys or they have this running schedule. They just know that they can get out in the mountains and grind. They have no idea how fast they are.

• 35:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 35:23Speaker 01

  Just like Gavin, all of a sudden he could drop the hammer.

• 35:25Cameron Hanes?

  God.

• 35:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:27Cameron Hanes?

  I kept going faster and faster and I was like, oh, this, cause I was saying, what's your, what's your, what was your marathon PR? And he said something like three fourteen or something. I'm like, okay, cool. Then we'll just go too fast and you'll blow up and then I'll just be on my own.

• 35:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:43Cameron Hanes?

  And I was going faster and I'm like.

• 35:45Speaker 01

  Except he's twenty five.

• 35:46Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 35:48Cameron Hanes?

  And he was still not blowing up. It's like, God dang, this kid is, I said, I was thinking to myself, you're faster than three fourteen. I mean, now he just proved that with the one twenty four half.

• 35:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, cause he wants to go sub three Eugene. That's his goal.

• 36:04Cameron Hanes?

  Well, I mean, he's, I, I'd put money on it.

• 36:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:09Cameron Hanes?

  He's in shape, but yeah, that, that's fun. But anyway, the point is, is like those big days that you have training and in the mountains, that all pays off.

• 36:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:19Cameron Hanes?

  Because you know what being miserable feels like? And I think people go into these and they're just like not, either they haven't experienced it and don't know what, what it's going to feel like, or sometimes I experience it, then I block it out and I forget. And then I get to the race and I'm just like, holy shit, I forgot how hard these were.

• 36:40Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, no, and that's, that's a good, that's, well, that's why I went to the Grand Canyon twice.

• 36:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 36:46Speaker 01

  Last few months.

• 36:46Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 36:47Speaker 01

  It's cause I said, you know, fifteen hour fifties, you know, you can do the Grand Canyon in fifteen hours and feel good about it.

• 36:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 36:52Speaker 01

  You know, that was the deal. So it was like, yeah, I mean, I can't imagine trying to do that around here. You know, there's no other. Place to do it than go to Arizona and run through the ditch.

• 37:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. And then on that last one, that was brutal too.

• 37:04Speaker 01

  Oh yeah. We were knee deep on the north.

• 37:07Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Bunch of snow.

• 37:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. I told those guys, Danny, and I told them, I said, if this was anywhere else, ain't happening. I'm turning around.

• 37:15Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 37:15Speaker 01

  But you're in the Grand Canyon. You only die, you only live once.

• 37:18Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. And you know, once you get to that north one, then once you turn around there, it's only going to get better.

• 37:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Except we were all done. We're like, oh, that's a good long run.

• 37:29Cameron Hanes?

  You were done when you got there?

• 37:30Speaker 01

  Oh, we were.

• 37:31Cameron Hanes?

  But you're only halfway.

• 37:33Speaker 01

  Sure thing.

• 37:34Cameron Hanes?

  What was that grind up out of there like on the south?

• 37:39Speaker 01

  Pretty good. Those guys, those guys are, and we paced it out. We hit seven and a half hours. We split it.

• 37:45Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 37:47Speaker 01

  I've got it figured out.

• 37:48Cameron Hanes?

  Was, uh, what's the bottom where you get the lemonade? What's that called?

• 37:52Speaker 01

  Phantom Ranch.

• 37:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Was it open?

• 37:54Speaker 01

  Uh, no, there was snow.

• 37:56Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 37:56Speaker 01

  Well, no, there wasn't snow there, but it was freezing.

• 37:59Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, really?

• 37:59Speaker 01

  Oh dude.

• 38:00Cameron Hanes?

  So, so they didn't have it open then?

• 38:02Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 38:03Cameron Hanes?

  Oh shit.

• 38:03Speaker 01

  Fourteen on the north ridge.

• 38:05Cameron Hanes?

  Oh my god.

• 38:07Speaker 01

  There was snow all the way down to like a skeleton point, which is like a couple of miles down the rim.

• 38:11Cameron Hanes?

  Is that where that water is there? Or wait, there's water going up there. It was probably frozen though.

• 38:17Speaker 01

  On the south side, there's no water.

• 38:18Cameron Hanes?

  No, but on the north.

• 38:19Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 38:20Cameron Hanes?

  I remember, I remember there's like a little water.

• 38:22Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, that there. Yeah. Yeah. It caught Manzanita.

• 38:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 38:25Speaker 01

  There was water there.

• 38:26Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 38:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 38:28Speaker 01

  And we broke trail all the way up. We didn't see another person.

• 38:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 38:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. It was incredible. Going through the Grand Canyon and knee deep snow and the sunshine.

• 38:35Cameron Hanes?

  That is awesome.

• 38:36Speaker 01

  That's living.

• 38:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 38:37Speaker 01

  Awesome.

• 38:37Cameron Hanes?

  That.

• 38:38Speaker 01

  That's training for a three hundred miler.

• 38:40Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 38:40Speaker 01

  That's what that is.

• 38:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. It's a long day. I, I remember coming out of there, uh, with Courtney and coming up that south. She was way fresher than me, but I remember that was a grind coming out of there.

• 38:51Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 38:52Cameron Hanes?

  It's like, what? Fifty five hundred feet from the river?

• 38:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:55Cameron Hanes?

  It's a pole.

• 38:56Speaker 01

  It's, it's a lot of steps. Steps are icy.

• 39:00Cameron Hanes?

  But perfect training. God, you can't, you can't beat days like that. I know. So now I'm three, about three weeks away. Probably too late to do big training.

• 39:11Speaker 01

  Sleep. Get out of sleep schedule. Um, that was, yeah.

• 39:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So what would, so your, your sleep schedule in, in Arizona monster, what do you do? Do you just like by feel?

• 39:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:25Cameron Hanes?

  And you're just, you go as long as you can and then.

• 39:29Speaker 01

  Yeah. You feel yourself slipping. Yeah. You know, all of a sudden you're like, you're walking something or you're kind of like kicking rocks.

• 39:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 39:37Speaker 01

  You know, let that go for a little while. This is the first time I had to change. Usually I was doing like three, five minutes. That lasted about 200 miles.

• 39:45Cameron Hanes?

  What do you mean three, five minutes?

• 39:46Speaker 01

  That's how long I would sleep, three to five.

• 39:47Cameron Hanes?

  Three to five.

• 39:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:49Cameron Hanes?

  And when did you first sleep?

• 39:52Speaker 01

  Um, right after 42.

• 39:54Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, right. That sleep station?

• 39:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was a, it got, I, I had a, I had pulled off. That's about, it was right before the sun had come up. So it must've been 60 something, I think.

• 40:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  I think it's, I'd found this little cove, it got cold. I didn't have my down with me and there's a little, little drainage, some game trail running through it.

• 40:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 40:18Speaker 01

  And it was warmer than it had been everywhere else. It was frigging freezing cold.

• 40:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 40:23Speaker 01

  And I had laid down there and set my alarm for about five minutes. And it was one of those, I laid down, I could hear something in the brush. And then I'm like, this little coyote, it had to been a coyote shot off. And then that was, that was my first night.

• 40:36Cameron Hanes?

  That woke you up?

• 40:37Speaker 01

  I was up. And then it was daylight and then later in this, about 10 o'clock, 10 a.m. I slept again.

• 40:43Cameron Hanes?

  Hmm.

• 40:43Speaker 01

  I think I was in the lead. I think I did.

• 40:46Cameron Hanes?

  You were leading for a lot of the race.

• 40:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, I pulled off and slept and then I think it was like a mark and Pete caught me.

• 40:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 40:54Speaker 01

  I slept a couple of times during the day, but it was always like five minutes until it was like 200 and something. And then I, um, five minutes wasn't working anymore. I'd ask Adam, my pacer, I was like, hey, is 10 working better? He goes, five isn't doing anything.

• 41:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:08Speaker 01

  And I was get back out and start staggering, keep staggering and just death marching. And as soon as I'd sleep.

• 41:14Cameron Hanes?

  Super stiff?

• 41:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:16Cameron Hanes?

  What was a, what was a, what was hurting?

• 41:20Speaker 01

  Not that I was just justifying walking.

• 41:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:22Speaker 01

  I just didn't have that that pep. I just didn't want to push up the hills.

• 41:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:28Speaker 01

  I was like, I'm walking. They're all walking. I had just, you know, justified going slow.

• 41:32Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:33Speaker 01

  And I wasn't, I wasn't beat up. I felt, you know, yeah, I was beat up, but I wasn't bad.

• 41:38Cameron Hanes?

  I know. If you can do a tiny little trot instead of a walk.

• 41:43Speaker 01

  That's all I do. Well, you saw me finish.

• 41:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:46Speaker 01

  I mean, that was like, I mean, I was hurt for certain, but that I don't think I was much faster the rest of the day.

• 41:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 41:51Speaker 01

  Honestly, I mean, I looked at myself fourteen, fifteen minute miles, you know, and, and, uh, but I was consistent. You know, I stayed on that. That was. Yeah, I did sixty, I wanted sixty hour. I knew going under sixty and two hundred is, that's.

• 42:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that's fast.

• 42:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, Tahoe, I'd done that. So I knew that. And then it was, you know, fifteen hour fifties. And then you just broke it down farther from that. So in my mind, if I was like, you know what, I'm going to come in. I think we came in like fifty six, fifty four hours when we came into two hundred.

• 42:21Cameron Hanes?

  That's fast.

• 42:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, we were moving and I was like, this is way too fast.

• 42:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 42:26Speaker 01

  And I thought I just need to start sleeping.

• 42:27Cameron Hanes?

  With a hundred left. Yeah.

• 42:29Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, it, that last hundred took us all a minute.

• 42:32Cameron Hanes?

  So, oh yeah. So that took you thirty four hours.

• 42:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:38Cameron Hanes?

  So.

• 42:38Speaker 01

  I should have slept for four hours.

• 42:40Cameron Hanes?

  But that's still not too far from the fifteen for fifty. It's four hours slower.

• 42:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:47Cameron Hanes?

  But four hours would is the difference between first and second.

• 42:51Speaker 01

  Well, if my thing, and my thing was, is that watching Peter run, I was never going to sleep enough to become fast.

• 42:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 42:58Speaker 01

  Does that make sense? Like, he's, he's moving down the hill. I didn't care if I just started.

• 43:02Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 43:02Speaker 01

  I'm not running that fast down the hill.

• 43:03Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 43:04Speaker 01

  So that's where I was like, that was, it was a sucker punch.

• 43:07Cameron Hanes?

  You had to push it, push your, you had to push your limits a little bit to try to offset his strengths.

• 43:13Speaker 01

  Correct.

• 43:13Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 43:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. I knew we were going to catch Josh. He was a zombie, you know? I thought they were breakdancing one time and then I looked up there. I'm like. What are they doing?

• 43:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 43:23Speaker 01

  And I was convinced that he was like breakdancing in this white outfit. I get up there and I was like, not even close. Oh, yeah. Totally. I'd fallen asleep at one point. I told Adams, just give me 10 minutes. And the moon the last night was just super bright. I'd laid back and fell asleep and I wake up and, and you're like, when you look up at the stars and you're looking like they look like they spin. You know, you're on your back.

• 43:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 43:48Speaker 01

  And so when I woke up, this bright ass moon, I was convinced it was somebody looking my eye to see if I was alive. I yell out, Adam?

• 43:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 43:57Speaker 01

  He's like, what? I'm like, nevermind, we're good.

• 43:59Cameron Hanes?

  Checking for vitals?

• 44:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:01Cameron Hanes?

  Were you alive or were you dead?

• 44:02Speaker 01

  I was alive.

• 44:03Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, good.

• 44:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 44:05Cameron Hanes?

  That's good.

• 44:06Speaker 01

  Yep, I had a couple, couple. There was, yeah, I got washed, fell, hit my face on a rock. That was another one I laid there for.

• 44:12Cameron Hanes?

  Is that what happened here?

• 44:13Speaker 01

  Yeah. And that was one of those, like you hit, and it's been a long time since I've been hit in the head. And it was a little bit.

• 44:18Cameron Hanes?

  Thud.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  Your belt. I laid there and I'm like.

• 44:21Cameron Hanes?

  Solid.

• 44:21Speaker 01

  Huh, guess I'm not asleep. Guess I'll get up.

• 44:26Cameron Hanes?

  Well, so for 34 for the last hundred, it's not terrible.

• 44:29Speaker 01

  No.

• 44:30Cameron Hanes?

  That's not terrible after 200. Your 200 was just fast as hell.

• 44:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was a, yeah.

• 44:35Cameron Hanes?

  But the, the last hundred, that's not awful.

• 44:38Speaker 01

  No, to 240, 250, we were all, we were joking like at Moab or some of those others, we'd been crushing it.

• 44:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 44:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, we would have been all just, we were, we were thinking, we would have all been battling that long.

• 44:49Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 44:49Speaker 01

  I mean, that's crazy.

• 44:50Cameron Hanes?

  That is. Well, that's what I, that's what I took away is like you guys were running, were competing the whole time. And normally those races, like you remember Courtney at Moab, when we did it, there was no, she was gone.

• 45:04Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 45:05Cameron Hanes?

  So it's like, that's how normally those are. It's usually not coming down. I know Kokodono was close last year. I think Browning was pretty close to. That, what is it? What's his name? Sumartis or the guy who won?

• 45:19Speaker 01

  Harold?

• 45:20Cameron Hanes?

  Harold?

• 45:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 45:21Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I mean, I know that was a close race, but normally it's like there's a gap.

• 45:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:25Cameron Hanes?

  You guys were.

• 45:26Speaker 01

  The four of us.

• 45:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 45:27Speaker 01

  The next person was 12 hours behind us. That, but the four of us were like, the whole time we're like, I can't believe, I said, why do you guys keep showing up here? That's impressive. I kept antagonizing those guys. I'm like, we gotta go.

• 45:40Cameron Hanes?

  That's impressive.

• 45:41Speaker 01

  But it was, it was fun. It, it made it a lot of fun to be able to have other dudes out there that you know have that strengths. And you were stronger somewhere else or.

• 45:51Cameron Hanes?

  That's so cool.

• 45:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was, it was a blast.

• 45:54Cameron Hanes?

  That's so cool. What, um, what could you have done better?

• 45:59Speaker 01

  Well.

• 46:00Cameron Hanes?

  If you're like, look, thinking back now, could you have won or did you run your best race?

• 46:06Speaker 01

  I think I ran my best race.

• 46:07Cameron Hanes?

  Did you?

• 46:08Speaker 01

  I really think that was, that was what I had.

• 46:09Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:10Speaker 01

  You know, there, there might've been, um, like the gels, the fuel, I had never, I literally tried it the day before.

• 46:18Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:20Speaker 01

  Well, I guess I'll use this.

• 46:21Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 46:22Speaker 01

  I didn't even know they had caffeine in it till at the end. I'm looking at it. I'm like, what does this plus sign mean?

• 46:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:27Speaker 01

  That they had caffeine. I, so it was, you know, well, that was the thing with, with a Pacer is that I've had Pacers before, but and I've paced, you know, you and it's always like, it's always a good excuse to go with a person to hang out in the woods in my book. So it's like, I've never relied on somebody.

• 46:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:46Speaker 01

  But this one was like.

• 46:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:48Speaker 01

  That was, it was different and it was, there could have been some different fueling strategies. I, I should have had my, had him carrying some other stuff that I liked.

• 46:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 46:58Speaker 01

  You know, that I knew I'd want.

• 46:59Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 47:00Speaker 01

  You know, some of that type of stuff.

• 47:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  I should have.

• 47:02Cameron Hanes?

  For the ag station fuel.

• 47:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, because I was using something I didn't know. So I didn't want to overuse it. I didn't know how to, I couldn't push it. There was.

• 47:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 47:10Speaker 01

  Fueling wise, I think. And then the sleep piece, you know, I.

• 47:15Cameron Hanes?

  You know, I don't, I, I, I'm excited to do another one or pace one and do a little more sleep, especially with somebody who's a little bit faster. Yeah. Because my wheels are only so fast. I can barely run a seven minute mile. These guys are, you know, I don't know. So. But I think that was, that was what I had, you know, I, I wish I could say that I could take eight hours off of that back end. Well, the thing is, most people, so you're honest. Most people would have said, oh no, I got way more. So just the fact that you said, no, I was about as good as I can get. I mean, that sets you apart because nobody ever says that.

• 47:54Cameron Hanes?

  It's a, it, but that's, you know, I think that these races, if you had an ego, you don't have one after you do these races because it'll humble your ass. Oh my gosh. So maybe we're just still close enough to it where it's, it's really hard to act cool. Once you've got your ass kicked for three days. Literally. I mean, it is tough. So I, I like, you know, of course I, I'd wanted you to win, of course, but the fact that you did the best you could and that's just, and you're, you're okay with that. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, it's a, God, what, what a test. Man.

• 48:36Cameron Hanes?

  What a test. But I don't know, like, and I, I don't want to, I'll say these, some of these guys are su- super ultra nerds about the fueling and all the stuff. I, maybe we're just different because when you were answering that about testing out gels and stuff, do you know that, I don't know, I haven't done like, I've done a few, like long, I've never looked at a map before the race. I don't even, I've never even looked at the course map for Cogadona. I never looked at Moab before we did it. I never looked at Bigfoot. Me neither. I don't either. So that's what happened at the beginning of the race is just so they make you download the course on your phone. Yeah. Confirm. Oh yeah, yeah, that all looks good. Well, the morning of the race, I was like, oh shoot, I didn't sync my watch. Yeah.

• 49:21Cameron Hanes?

  So that's what happens. Everybody takes off and I'm standing at the start. Loading, loading. Cause I didn't have it and I didn't even look at it. And honestly, I didn't realize.

• 49:31Speaker 01

  Somebody had told me that we didn't have a pacer till like one forty five.

• 49:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 49:35Speaker 01

  I mean, it's in the very beginning, but then all of a sudden there was changes like, oh, you, there's a staggered start.

• 49:40Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 49:40Speaker 01

  That was all stuff like seriously the day before. I'm like, I should probably looked into this a little bit. I feel. Drop bag. Did you see my drop bag method? I call it like my flanky.

• 49:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 49:53Speaker 01

  It was a box of ketone IQs, one pair of shoes.

• 49:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 49:56Speaker 01

  At mile forty two.

• 49:58Cameron Hanes?

  Well.

• 49:58Speaker 01

  And I'm like, what good is that going to do me?

• 49:59Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 50:00Speaker 01

  It's like.

• 50:01Cameron Hanes?

  But you, you, you see like, you know, King of Moab, Max's film. And you see the detail, like he's going, sitting, going through.

• 50:08Speaker 01

  Organized those guys are.

• 50:10Cameron Hanes?

  I'm like, yeah. I'm like, what the? Either I'm completely retarded or I don't know. I, I've never done that.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  Andy Glaze.

• 50:20Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, same thing.

• 50:21Speaker 01

  He had eleven, he have eleven drop bags and they're all identical, like these organized crates. He'd go into.

• 50:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 50:29Speaker 01

  I.

• 50:30Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know. I do. That does not, must not be how our brains work.

• 50:33Speaker 01

  I told my crew, I said, when we come to an A station, I didn't know how far the next one is.

• 50:37Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 50:37Speaker 01

  How soon I'm going to see you.

• 50:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 50:39Speaker 01

  And, you know? I don't know. It wasn't even that. I mean, it was, literally came down to, I want sticky stuff in this pocket and dry stuff in this pocket. Electrolytes and water. That was it.

• 50:50Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 50:51Speaker 01

  Changed my head like.

• 50:52Cameron Hanes?

  I think ma- maybe we can do better. At stuff like that, but I've always like, and this is probably just a stupid thing, but. People said, well, do you have Pacers this or that? And like even for Coca Dona, I actually don't know. I mean, you said you can go and Rihanna says she can do whatever. And these guys are going to be there filming or whatever, but I've always been like, unless you can run miles for me. It doesn't really matter. Can you? Are you going to run miles for me? Oh, you're not? Okay. Then it doesn't matter because I have to do it. But I do know it can make a big difference.

• 51:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. And, and for me, this, this race was the first time that I was like, okay, fine. Crews are pretty cool.

• 51:34Cameron Hanes?

  Well, and just like Courtney's husband, how good, he's so like, that's, I think that's his job. Logistics or something like that?

• 51:43Speaker 01

  Yeah. Just knowing details, you know, it's.

• 51:46Cameron Hanes?

  It's got to give you confidence.

• 51:47Speaker 01

  It does.

• 51:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  Yeah. And that was a big thing with Adam Pace and me. It was like, finally I was like. Cause I've always done these alone and yeah, kind of prided myself in that. This one I was like leaning on my poles. I'm like, Adam, I, you gotta untie my shoe.

• 52:00Cameron Hanes?

  Do you need more coffee?

• 52:01Speaker 01

  No, I'm okay.

• 52:02Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 52:03Speaker 01

  And I've, I've never had to ask anybody to do that. Or hey, can you fill my bladder? You know, it's like.

• 52:08Cameron Hanes?

  Can you wipe my ass?

• 52:09Speaker 01

  Exactly. Yeah. It was like, but I was done. It was like, I was so shocked. I was like, I was looking for any, any sympathy anybody'd give me.

• 52:17Cameron Hanes?

  I know. I know. Well, I remember that we had like, uh, we're, we're both not really that great at doing any of this stuff. Well, we're, you're good. I'm not good, but I remember at Moab, I don't remember what, remember you like you threw a little fit kinda? When I, when I took off in the middle of the night.

• 52:38Speaker 01

  Oh yeah. We were, when you, oh yeah. Cause we were laying down. You're like, why you keep moving around something like, but yeah.

• 52:44Cameron Hanes?

  My wife says in the bed.

• 52:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well.

• 52:46Cameron Hanes?

  Toss turn. I couldn't get comfortable. I kick my legs all the time. Apparently. I don't know if it's restless leg syndrome, but anyways, like, yeah, we're, we're both not, I know we can do better at either communicating or helping each other or something.

• 53:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:01Cameron Hanes?

  But whatever.

• 53:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. I think having, knowing the, knowing what the course is and being confident what we tell each other. How far is it? I don't know. 10 miles, 15, four hours later. That's what happened to Adam and I. I was like, hey, where do you see the aid station? Oh, it's right up here. I'm looking at the, this is, I'm so stupid. I'm looking at the trees. I'm like, oh, there's the tent. I can see the white tent. Drink my water.

• 53:26Cameron Hanes?

  Empty it.

• 53:27Speaker 01

  An hour later. That definitely wasn't the tent. And then I come around another corner. I said, hey, Adam, did you see it? You can see it through there. He goes, I didn't see anything. I said, oh, this has got to be it. I'm looking on my phone. Drink a little more of my water. Nope. That wasn't it either. And that was those are the moments that you're like, uh, that those were bad decisions.

• 53:45Cameron Hanes?

  You need to do better.

• 53:46Speaker 01

  I got pissed.

• 53:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 53:47Speaker 01

  I guess I get upset.

• 53:48Cameron Hanes?

  Well, when, when you go dry after you're, when you're pushing that is, you can't tough to recover.

• 53:55Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I'd had him go out in front of me trying to pull me along because I, we wanted to close that gap a little bit. And yeah. I had him out there and I pushed, pushed, pushed. And then it was like, oh, there's, there's the aid stations. Not the aid stations. That's so hard.

• 54:09Cameron Hanes?

  So was it? I mean, was your, were you looking at your phone and like, was it, was it showing where you were and like the waypoint or why were you not being able to see where the station was on your phone?

• 54:22Speaker 01

  Well, I could, but with the switchbacks and the way that the ridge looked, you couldn't tell if it was like right here or two miles.

• 54:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I see.

• 54:30Speaker 01

  And it like hooked you around these points.

• 54:33Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 54:33Speaker 01

  We felt like we were going in circles is what it did. It was like you'd be out of this point, like at the end, we would see Ryan, we would, at one point he was point one five away. And then we go around the corner and then he was two point five away because of the hooks and the, just the ca- the canyons.

• 54:51Cameron Hanes?

  So it was just line of sight, basically, or as a crow flies?

• 54:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, you'd see him and you'd see this, these silhouettes dancing on the mountainside. You're like, oh, he's right there. He's so close. And once you're like, how did he get to the other side of us?

• 55:04Cameron Hanes?

  Right.

• 55:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's so hard.

• 55:09Cameron Hanes?

  Now that you've done both the Cogadona and Arizona Monster three hundred, which one's tougher?

• 55:15Speaker 01

  Arizona Monster.

• 55:16Cameron Hanes?

  Was it?

• 55:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Yeah. How come? I mean, obviously fifty miles further.

• 55:23Speaker 01

  It felt the same. Distance wise, it was it felt similar.

• 55:28Speaker 01

  The, um, the, the vibe at Cogadona is different. There's just more people.

• 55:35Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 55:36Speaker 01

  Uh, like more people like, cause you're going through the town.

• 55:38Cameron Hanes?

  More crew and more, oh, yeah.

• 55:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's more accessible.

• 55:41Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 55:41Speaker 01

  Um, you know, like you come into Flagstaff at the finish, just that, you know, that was kind of, I don't want to say electric, but it was, there was a lot of people.

• 55:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, energy. Yeah.

• 55:49Speaker 01

  Yeah. And you come off the top of the mountain coming down. It was just, there's people on the road, you know, it was just, it was busier. So that for me just kind of kept, keeps you a little bit different headspace.

• 56:01Speaker 01

  But like this one, it was just, it felt remote.

• 56:04Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 56:04Speaker 01

  It felt like you're out there alone, like in the middle of nowhere. I mean, it was just the one, at one point I thought I was coming into a forest and it was cactuses, giant cactuses. It was so thick with these, yeah, it's just like that type of thing, just the deserts. I felt like the southern desert feels different than the pines and the mountains up at Cogadona.

• 56:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 56:24Speaker 01

  Cause you get up on that, uh, something Cogadona, Cogacino Plateau.

• 56:29Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 56:30Speaker 01

  Something like that. It's all big timber. It reminds me of, you know, central Oregon a little bit.

• 56:34Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 56:35Speaker 01

  Um, but you weren't getting that from. Superior to Patagonia, that was a straight desert.

• 56:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that makes it tough. I mean, we like the mountains.

• 56:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 56:45Cameron Hanes?

  You know, we're not really desert people.

• 56:47Speaker 01

  No.

• 56:48Cameron Hanes?

  So, yeah, we're kind of more used to like, I guess, what you'd see it around Flagstaff.

• 56:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 56:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 56:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 56:55Cameron Hanes?

  I was just curious, you know, between the two, doing both, not, not too many people have done both.

• 57:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The first year of Cogadona was, I think, special too, just because they, logistically, they've changed some things and make it a little more pleasant for people.

• 57:10Cameron Hanes?

  I think this year, I don't know what I was listening to, but they did change like the mount, the last mountain where you used to go up, I think it's a pretty good climb. I can't remember what. Yeah, must be, but used to go up. Or, no, no, you went up the trail, rocky trail, and then came down the road.

• 57:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:35Cameron Hanes?

  And now you go up the road and down the rocky trail.

• 57:39Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 57:40Cameron Hanes?

  So they're saying that's gonna be a lot slower. It's gonna be a lot slower.

• 57:44Speaker 01

  The climb up, yeah, I liked the climb up.

• 57:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yes, because, because you're gonna go slow anyway on a climb, so you might as well have it rocky because it's like, you're not that much slower.

• 57:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:55Cameron Hanes?

  But where you could make up time running down the road now, you won't be able to because now you're coming down the rocks.

• 58:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:01Cameron Hanes?

  And you're not gonna be able to make up that much time going up because you're already gassed.

• 58:04Speaker 01

  That's where Maggie left me.

• 58:06Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, was it?

• 58:07Speaker 01

  For dead.

• 58:08Cameron Hanes?

  Did she win that year?

• 58:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:09Cameron Hanes?

  She won?

• 58:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:10Cameron Hanes?

  She left you on the rocks, climbing?

• 58:13Speaker 01

  I was on the top of Eldon, she hit the road.

• 58:15Cameron Hanes?

  Oh.

• 58:16Speaker 01

  Like you did, come down this little ridge, it's kind of steep, and then you drop down on this gravel road, she kicked her loose.

• 58:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:22Speaker 01

  And I was like, I was hurting.

• 58:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, she's a stud though.

• 58:27Speaker 01

  I wasn't in as good shape, Cogadona.

• 58:29Cameron Hanes?

  Right, okay.

• 58:30Speaker 01

  It's similar to Moab, it was just like, I was just gonna get it done. I didn't have any other goals, just to not die.

• 58:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's a good goal.

• 58:37Speaker 01

  But yeah, Tahoe's on this one was different. This was a full dump.

• 58:42Cameron Hanes?

  Man, you kicked ass, dude.

• 58:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was awesome. I was so happy.

• 58:45Cameron Hanes?

  You kicked ass.

• 58:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's not very often you can look back on something like that and be like.

• 58:50Cameron Hanes?

  Feels good, huh?

• 58:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, I still wish I would have won, but.

• 58:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 58:54Speaker 01

  You know, it's like, yeah, I had so much time to wrestle it, you know, it was like Peter in the last 50 or whatever pulls away. It's like, you know, maybe he's gonna fall and break his leg.

• 59:04Cameron Hanes?

  Could have.

• 59:04Speaker 01

  That did, that came up. He came into a native station and he was looking for a medic.

• 59:08Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 59:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was the word on the street. It was like the, the rustling of the crowd.

• 59:12Cameron Hanes?

  You should have done the.

• 59:13Speaker 01

  Peter's hurt, Peter's hurt, Peter's hurt. Go, go, go.

• 59:16Cameron Hanes?

  Did you ever think of like the Tonya Harding, Nancy Kerrigan?

• 59:19Speaker 01

  I talked to a guy, I said, just give him a nudge.

• 59:22Cameron Hanes?

  Side of the knee or something?

• 59:23Speaker 01

  In the dark.

• 59:24Cameron Hanes?

  It's like, oh shit, what happened?

• 59:25Speaker 01

  Oh gosh.

• 59:26Cameron Hanes?

  That's terrible.

• 59:26Speaker 01

  Must have been a rock.

• 59:27Cameron Hanes?

  Well.

• 59:28Speaker 01

  Or Havelina.

• 59:28Cameron Hanes?

  Good luck next year.

• 59:32Speaker 01

  Yeah. I know, he's, he's a good guy and I, I, I told him all, I was like, if I lose to somebody, lose to somebody from fricking Arizona. I'm gonna lose some money to somebody from Ohio or.

• 59:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, Wisconsin.

• 59:44Speaker 01

  Right?

• 59:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, you gotta, I mean, he had home court advantage, which usually gives you about three hours. So technically you won.

• 59:54Speaker 01

  That's how, right?

• 59:55Cameron Hanes?

  I mean, yeah.

• 59:56Speaker 01

  He knew where he was going.

• 59:57Cameron Hanes?

  That's not fair.

• 59:59Speaker 01

  Oh, it's, oh man.

• 1:00:01Cameron Hanes?

  No, it's, it's, you know, in all seriousness, props to every person who not only just, not only finished, but even just signed up and toed the line.

• 1:00:10Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 1:00:11Cameron Hanes?

  Has, it's a, that's a big test.

• 1:00:13Speaker 01

  I tell people all the time, you know, it's like, nobody cares how long it took, but you got it done.

• 1:00:18Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, just finish that bitch.

• 1:00:19Speaker 01

  There's quite a few people from here too, from Oregon.

• 1:00:22Cameron Hanes?

  Was there?

• 1:00:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's two or three people.

• 1:00:24Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, nice.

• 1:00:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was, it was good to see. It's like this same crowd. Yeah.

• 1:00:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:30Speaker 01

  All the regulars.

• 1:00:31Cameron Hanes?

  It's awesome. I mean, it's a, you know, we've had some good experiences with Candace's races and, you know, this one being a, a new one, new challenges and all. But yeah, I always, I always like Candace.

• 1:00:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:43Cameron Hanes?

  It's a, I mean, social media, the way it is now, it's like everybody's an armchair quarterback and everybody's perfect and everybody can do it better. And I'm like, how about, you know, you got a, a woman race director, which there's not a lot of them. It's like. Can we, can we offer some grace? I mean, could people do better or what? Yeah, of course. Everybody could, but.

• 1:01:09Speaker 01

  I mean, they're after 170, I mean, there are, the racers are after 170 hours. So these people, so let's say 200.

• 1:01:16Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:16Speaker 01

  You have volunteers. I mean, the amount of water jugs, I mean, just that type of stuff.

• 1:01:22Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:01:23Speaker 01

  It's, yeah, I, I've never had, I mean, I've had more beef and 50 Ks and marathons than I have in these.

• 1:01:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:29Speaker 01

  You know, there's, yeah, do your expectations get high? Absolutely. Do you get a little, you know?

• 1:01:33Cameron Hanes?

  You get fatigued and cranky?

• 1:01:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:36Speaker 01

  You know?

• 1:01:37Cameron Hanes?

  Of course.

• 1:01:37Speaker 01

  But the big scheme of things, they provide an awesome experience and they do a fricking phenomenal job.

• 1:01:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:44Speaker 01

  Yeah. I'm, yeah, super happy. Never had a, you know, I came, yeah, I, yeah, no complaints.

• 1:01:50Cameron Hanes?

  No, I, I just, I, you know, and I know people will complain. I just was like, she's been kicking ass doing this for a long time. And ha, you know, changed people's lives with the event she's put on. So I'm like, and I like that, you know, we always talk about, oh, how come women opportunities? This and that, this and that. So it's like, well, you got a woman kicking ass in this space. Let's.

• 1:02:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:14Cameron Hanes?

  Let's celebrate that a little bit. I mean, instead of, I, I under, if people want to criticize, great, but let's just make sure it's legit.

• 1:02:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yep. But providing an experience for us, it's, man, it's awesome.

• 1:02:29Cameron Hanes?

  It's life, these have changed our lives.

• 1:02:32Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:02:32Cameron Hanes?

  These races.

• 1:02:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:33Cameron Hanes?

  And it's just like, where else, where else can you do stuff like this? Once you're, you know, our age, that's gonna, you know, impact you, your family, your community, just because it gives people like inspiration and changes like how you look at things. And it's like, it's amazing.

• 1:02:51Speaker 01

  Yeah. We've got, we're, I'm very thankful for it. Um, I might not be thankful here after May 5th, but.

• 1:02:59Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. We'll see. We'll give her hell.

• 1:03:02Speaker 01

  We just gotta be rested.

• 1:03:03Cameron Hanes?

  I've, I've never went into a, uh, normally you want to go into these like a hundred percent.

• 1:03:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:11Cameron Hanes?

  So I've never, and I know like I've been in a hundred percent and kind of done shitty. So maybe going in hurt. Maybe that's the key.

• 1:03:21Speaker 01

  Could be.

• 1:03:22Cameron Hanes?

  We'll find out.

• 1:03:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:24Cameron Hanes?

  But you're going to be there, right?

• 1:03:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:26Cameron Hanes?

  Good.

• 1:03:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm gonna be there. We're gonna make it happen.

• 1:03:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I can't wait. I can't wait. So what's, uh, what's next for you then?

• 1:03:35Speaker 01

  Big Horn.

• 1:03:36Cameron Hanes?

  Big Horn, really?

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  I've always wanted to do Big Horn.

• 1:03:38Cameron Hanes?

  Oh shit.

• 1:03:39Speaker 01

  So be my 10th 100. So this was my fifth. This year I wanted to get my fifth 200 or plus.

• 1:03:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:47Speaker 01

  Or 200 or miles or plus. This is my five, fifth one. And then this will be my 10th 100.

• 1:03:53Cameron Hanes?

  Whoa.

• 1:03:54Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:03:54Cameron Hanes?

  Big milestones.

• 1:03:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:56Cameron Hanes?

  Thousand, thousand miles of each.

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:58Cameron Hanes?

  Or more than a thousand.

• 1:03:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm excited. Uh, I'm excited to see what happens in the next couple of weeks because if I can carry on my fitness from Arizona Monster, the Big Horn could be pretty exciting.

• 1:04:09Cameron Hanes?

  That's at the end of June?

• 1:04:10Speaker 01

  Middle of June.

• 1:04:11Cameron Hanes?

  Middle of June.

• 1:04:12Speaker 01

  So, you know, we'll, we'll know in the next couple of months. Yeah.

• 1:04:17Cameron Hanes?

  Who's racing that?

• 1:04:19Speaker 01

  I don't know. I don't even know. Matt Van Horn, he's my boy from Utah. He's racing it.

• 1:04:24Cameron Hanes?

  Is he?

• 1:04:24Speaker 01

  He's a hard rock finisher. He's a beast. So.

• 1:04:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:28Speaker 01

  He and I will gun it out hopefully. It'll probably be super muddy. I guess there was fires and they had to reroute the course and somebody was telling me, but I don't, I don't care. It's like, you get those old races like that. It's the same people putting them on. It's gonna be good.

• 1:04:40Cameron Hanes?

  No, that, yeah, that, that was my first hundred. I don't know if you remember.

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  Oh, no, I do. Yeah.

• 1:04:46Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Fucking terrible.

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:48Cameron Hanes?

  Kick my ass.

• 1:04:48Speaker 01

  It's.

• 1:04:49Cameron Hanes?

  It's so far.

• 1:04:50Speaker 01

  Well, that's how I felt about Arizona Monster. Man, it's, it's been, you know, the bear was my first hundred and it broke me.

• 1:04:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:57Speaker 01

  And I took me a long time and then, and then Moab was the next thing that was a disaster. And now this.

• 1:05:04Cameron Hanes?

  Hard.

• 1:05:05Speaker 01

  This was the next level of that. Just.

• 1:05:09Cameron Hanes?

  You know, you, uh, I want you to do Bigfoot.

• 1:05:14Speaker 01

  That's one I haven't done.

• 1:05:15Cameron Hanes?

  Fuck. That, that one sucked. You did a lot of that one with me. You did a hundred miles for sure.

• 1:05:22Speaker 01

  A hundred and fifty of it. I did a hundred and fifty of it. I pasted it. Remember?

• 1:05:26Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:27Speaker 01

  You went, let me quit. Oh, hundred, huh? Yeah, softy.

• 1:05:31Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:31Speaker 01

  Put my shoes back on. Let's do this.

• 1:05:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that was a tough one. You did, you did a lot of that with me. That really helped, really helped. But man, that's a long, that's a hard course.

• 1:05:42Speaker 01

  It is. This guy got stout time. You know, I'm surprised how fast the times are on it too.

• 1:05:46Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 1:05:47Speaker 01

  It's very weird.

• 1:05:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's like.

• 1:05:50Speaker 01

  Are the descents that runnable?

• 1:05:51Cameron Hanes?

  Uh.

• 1:05:53Speaker 01

  They're just not rocky? I don't know what it is.

• 1:05:55Cameron Hanes?

  It was the climb. To me, the climb seemed hard. There was, didn't seem like there's a bunch of switchbacks. So it's like you just started grinding up slow.

• 1:06:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:04Cameron Hanes?

  That's what it seemed like to me.

• 1:06:05Speaker 01

  I like that.

• 1:06:05Cameron Hanes?

  And it's super remote. So it, there is timber, which we like.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:09Cameron Hanes?

  But man, it feels like you're in the middle of nowhere.

• 1:06:13Speaker 01

  Wet feet.

• 1:06:14Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:14Speaker 01

  That's all I remember.

• 1:06:15Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, God.

• 1:06:16Speaker 01

  Trench foot. Put a quarter in it.

• 1:06:18Cameron Hanes?

  I know. That was, remember there was, I remember.

• 1:06:22Speaker 01

  Katie.

• 1:06:23Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:06:24Speaker 01

  Katie at the last.

• 1:06:25Cameron Hanes?

  Her feet were wrecked.

• 1:06:27Speaker 01

  How's it look? Good.

• 1:06:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, look.

• 1:06:29Speaker 01

  Keep the tape on that.

• 1:06:30Cameron Hanes?

  Terrible.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  You could put a quarter in the cracks.

• 1:06:33Cameron Hanes?

  That was not good.

• 1:06:34Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:06:35Cameron Hanes?

  Her feet were gonna disintegrate. It's what it looked like, didn't it? I thought they were gonna come apart.

• 1:06:40Speaker 01

  Like croissants. Yeah, like a sandwich.

• 1:06:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, flaky.

• 1:06:45Cameron Hanes?

  And at that time she had, where was that at? That was probably like.

• 1:06:49Speaker 01

  We had like fifty K left still, didn't we?

• 1:06:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:53Cameron Hanes?

  Fifty K on croissants feet. That's not good.

• 1:06:57Speaker 01

  It's not good.

• 1:06:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that's, uh, that's brutal. Well, so big, big horn and then what? Is that as far as it goes?

• 1:07:06Speaker 01

  Um, I really hope I get into Wasatch.

• 1:07:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:11Speaker 01

  I really want to do Wasatch.

• 1:07:12Cameron Hanes?

  When's that?

• 1:07:12Speaker 01

  September.

• 1:07:14Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, there's still a chance it's not.

• 1:07:16Speaker 01

  They had a waitlist.

• 1:07:17Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:07:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, uh, other than that, it was actually to get everything done in time that I can have a spend August having an anniversary with my wife and not running somewhere and then hunting.

• 1:07:27Cameron Hanes?

  The whole month, an anniversary?

• 1:07:29Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 1:07:29Cameron Hanes?

  Anniversary month?

• 1:07:30Speaker 01

  No, just that I wasn't focused on running.

• 1:07:33Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 1:07:34Speaker 01

  It'll probably be hunting though, I'm sure.

• 1:07:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, no, that's all good. You, you do, you spend a lot of time. She's really, really supportive.

• 1:07:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm, I'm super lucky to have a family that I do that thinks this stuff's cool.

• 1:07:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, oh, it's, no, you kick ass. And how was it? How was Greg? So Greg's your stepdad? Or no, Greg's my stepdad. He's your dad.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  Oh, he was a wreck. He was sobbing. In the finish video, he, oh, you can hear this.

• 1:08:00Cameron Hanes?

  He's not, he's not the greatest for a crew. Cause he's like so wound up all the time. He's like, you know, you want somebody who's calm and like.

• 1:08:07Speaker 01

  Click.

• 1:08:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah. And he's, he's like so nervous.

• 1:08:13Speaker 01

  Kinda nervous.

• 1:08:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it's. But it's good to have your dad there.

• 1:08:17Speaker 01

  Oh, man. Yeah. Well, I'm lucky. I'm lucky to have, have him there. It's like, you know, how many people don't get to do that there? He wanted to pace at one point and run and we're like, it's 60 miles. You know, it was like, there was some tough sections. I would have loved to have been able to be part of that, but just have down there was, and he wasn't going to go. He wasn't even going to go.

• 1:08:37Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, really?

• 1:08:38Speaker 01

  Well, not everybody likes to go with me when I go on races.

• 1:08:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I know.

• 1:08:41Speaker 01

  Some reason they think I get grumpy.

• 1:08:43Cameron Hanes?

  That's weird.

• 1:08:44Speaker 01

  And I get, whatever.

• 1:08:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, they're being too sensitive.

• 1:08:46Speaker 01

  They're soft. And, uh, so I told him, I says, just come with me, fly with me, you know, and he came down and.

• 1:08:51Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:52Speaker 01

  We made it work. So.

• 1:08:53Cameron Hanes?

  That's awesome.

• 1:08:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. It was, it was good.

• 1:08:55Cameron Hanes?

  I, I don't know where Trey saw, but must saw a picture or video or something, but she's just like, man, Greg looks so good for being, what the is he 75?

• 1:09:05Speaker 01

  Seventy six.

• 1:09:05Cameron Hanes?

  Seventy six?

• 1:09:06Speaker 01

  Old as shit.

• 1:09:08Cameron Hanes?

  And it's like, if you would have seen him like back on his roller days for Knife Forever and Morse Brothers.

• 1:09:15Speaker 01

  I think he looks younger now.

• 1:09:16Cameron Hanes?

  He was, yeah, yeah. He was 40, looked like smoking and drinking all the time, always pissed. And now, like.

• 1:09:28Cameron Hanes?

  He looks great.

• 1:09:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:30Cameron Hanes?

  That's like, okay, quit smoking, drinking. He started running. When did he start running? He's like sixty?

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, that's what got me doing it. My six year old father was fitter than I was.

• 1:09:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, and now, now he's, he's, you know, it's awesome that he was able to be there.

• 1:09:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely. It is.

• 1:09:47Cameron Hanes?

  Pretty cool to see. Is he, is he still gonna try to do something like a hundred?

• 1:09:53Speaker 01

  He says no.

• 1:09:53Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:09:54Speaker 01

  He says he's not, but I think he needs to try some track stuff, maybe.

• 1:09:59Cameron Hanes?

  Track?

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  Well, like, uh.

• 1:10:01Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, masters?

• 1:10:02Speaker 01

  No, no, the, uh, uh.

• 1:10:04Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, twelve hour stuff?

• 1:10:05Speaker 01

  Whatever the last man standing.

• 1:10:07Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:10:08Speaker 01

  How long he could grind one of those out?

• 1:10:11Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know. I mean, he could, he could do the four miles in an hour for quite a while, probably.

• 1:10:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:15Cameron Hanes?

  Right?

• 1:10:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, that may be more his style.

• 1:10:17Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a tripping and falling that he worries about.

• 1:10:22Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I get that.

• 1:10:23Speaker 01

  Cause I, I can't imagine breaking your leg at seventy six. I mean, his, the piece probably pretty strong, but still the recovery from that's can be bueno.

• 1:10:31Cameron Hanes?

  No, no, and that, you know, your feet, you do kind of lose the dexterity, or I mean, just like being nimble.

• 1:10:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:39Cameron Hanes?

  You know, that kind of goes when you get, that's just natural.

• 1:10:42Speaker 01

  About mile two fifty, that was out the door.

• 1:10:44Cameron Hanes?

  I bet. Were you tripping over shit?

• 1:10:47Speaker 01

  Like, I thought I dislocated my knees at one point, cause I just like, just like buckle.

• 1:10:52Cameron Hanes?

  What shoes did you wear?

• 1:10:54Speaker 01

  Uh, ultras.

• 1:10:55Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:56Speaker 01

  And my poles were lifesavers. There was times Jared's like, you, I can't believe you caught that. It's like you're falling and.

• 1:11:02Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:03Speaker 01

  But there's, yeah, they're shot.

• 1:11:04Cameron Hanes?

  Are they?

• 1:11:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. What are you doing for a pack at Coconut on, do you know? You don't have a pack or headlamp?

• 1:11:10Cameron Hanes?

  No, I haven't thought about anything. Just trying to get there. Do I need a pack? I think I'll just take a water bottle. I'll just take this thermos right here.

• 1:11:20Speaker 01

  Take this and I'll take this. For the, for the listeners, I'd like you to go back to Moab and look at what Cam's pack was.

• 1:11:27Cameron Hanes?

  What was like a little knapsack?

• 1:11:29Speaker 01

  It was a Nathan one that held a waffle.

• 1:11:32Cameron Hanes?

  Like in the back.

• 1:11:33Speaker 01

  These little 10 ounce bottles.

• 1:11:34Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, it was, I'm terrible.

• 1:11:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, we need to get you a good pack.

• 1:11:38Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, so.

• 1:11:39Speaker 01

  Get you a good pack and we got you a light, we got you a ultra starlight.

• 1:11:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, the light you brought me was sick, dude.

• 1:11:45Speaker 01

  That'll be a game changer.

• 1:11:46Cameron Hanes?

  So what, so here's what, here's what I'm going to be using, whatever you say.

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  Okay, all right, I got a list.

• 1:11:53Cameron Hanes?

  I'm trying to just like tape my body together. I saw the surgeon today, I was just walking like I have been doing, but he came by on his bike and he's just like, Cam? And I said, hey, aren't you supposed to be in surgery today? He's like, oh yeah, got up, got off early. He's like, how's the foot? And I said, oh, not the foot, it's the hamstring now. So he looked at it out there. And he was saying this like, it's like low, like where the tendon is, he's, he goes, maybe we need to do an image on it. I'm like, oh, I don't know. But anyway.

• 1:12:27Speaker 01

  Like he thinks it's that bad or it might not be that bad?

• 1:12:31Cameron Hanes?

  Uh, I just said I can't run. So.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, you can step up.

• 1:12:37Cameron Hanes?

  Huh?

• 1:12:37Speaker 01

  Can you step up on stuff?

• 1:12:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I can step up.

• 1:12:39Speaker 01

  It's just the run.

• 1:12:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I just can't stride out.

• 1:12:43Speaker 01

  Is that the same one from back in the day?

• 1:12:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but it's just got, because of the foot has made everything.

• 1:12:49Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:12:50Cameron Hanes?

  It's like this whole leg is all.

• 1:12:54Cameron Hanes?

  And it was fine, or it wasn't fine, but like I can't do Boston because now, because when I, when I stretch out like a fast pace, it stretches that and then it locks. So that's what with Shelby was just here. I thought, well, I gave it a little bit of time. Let me see if I can, I wasn't even running that, you know, she runs like two minute mile or something. But, uh, yeah, I did it again. So I just can't stride out. As long as I don't do that.

• 1:13:25Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know what.

• 1:13:26Speaker 01

  Well, I don't have to worry about that at Coca Dona.

• 1:13:28Cameron Hanes?

  I know. That's what I'm. That's why I'm like, this might be.

• 1:13:32Speaker 01

  I'm telling you.

• 1:13:33Cameron Hanes?

  A blessing. Uh, it's cause Courtney and all them will take off and I want to take off so bad. I want, I want to.

• 1:13:42Speaker 01

  It's not worth it.

• 1:13:42Cameron Hanes?

  And it would just, I know it sabotage everything.

• 1:13:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:46Cameron Hanes?

  But I have a really hard time not.

• 1:13:48Speaker 01

  Fifteen hour fifties. I'm telling you.

• 1:13:50Cameron Hanes?

  So.

• 1:13:51Speaker 01

  That's the ticket.

• 1:13:52Cameron Hanes?

  If I can be disciplined for five seconds for once in my life.

• 1:13:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:58Cameron Hanes?

  It would be good.

• 1:14:00Speaker 01

  You just. Well, Moab is when you did, that was, we were then.

• 1:14:04Cameron Hanes?

  Discipline?

• 1:14:05Speaker 01

  When we did Moab.

• 1:14:06Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:14:07Speaker 01

  We stuck together. We laid low.

• 1:14:09Cameron Hanes?

  I know. And Courtney was way the hell out there somehow. It was like, what? Where?

• 1:14:15Speaker 01

  Days or twenty hours or ten.

• 1:14:16Cameron Hanes?

  It's nuts. But that, do you remember? I mean, we were dry. That first nineteen miles. Remember how dry we were?

• 1:14:23Speaker 01

  Sitting by that. I don't even know what the.

• 1:14:26Cameron Hanes?

  Well, we're looking. We were trying, looking at for water to try to get water. It was some nasty desert ditch or pond or.

• 1:14:37Speaker 01

  Your comment was, I've drank things in Africa that were, weren't this bad.

• 1:14:41Cameron Hanes?

  I know. It was, I wanted to drink so bad.

• 1:14:44Speaker 01

  So bad.

• 1:14:45Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, I felt like.

• 1:14:46Speaker 01

  Under a tree the first thirty miles looking for shade.

• 1:14:49Cameron Hanes?

  I remember my throat was like, and your nose, everywhere, everywhere is supposed to be like sort of moisturized is even inside your throat.

• 1:15:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:01Cameron Hanes?

  We're only nineteen miles into this thing.

• 1:15:03Speaker 01

  So you know, that's, uh, that never happened, uh, at Monster. The whole nostril.

• 1:15:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:08Speaker 01

  Raw.

• 1:15:09Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 1:15:10Speaker 01

  Tahoe too, but that's eight. Yeah. Coca Dona didn't do it either.

• 1:15:14Cameron Hanes?

  That's weird.

• 1:15:14Speaker 01

  What that is.

• 1:15:15Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 1:15:16Speaker 01

  But Moab was for sure. That was like, we thought we were sunburnt in our nostrils or something. This is like just, it was like the color that has red.

• 1:15:24Cameron Hanes?

  It was so bad. It was terrible.

• 1:15:26Speaker 01

  Moab was, I'm gonna go back to Moab though.

• 1:15:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, that's a, that's, I think.

• 1:15:31Speaker 01

  Well, I got my buckle stolen. I gotta go back and get a new buckle.

• 1:15:33Cameron Hanes?

  You got to. What else you gonna do?

• 1:15:35Speaker 01

  Candace keeps trying to give me one, but I said, I can't give someone a buck. I know you did it. Here's a buckle. You gotta go back and get your buckle.

• 1:15:43Cameron Hanes?

  You got to. So, yeah, on, in Arizona Monster. So tell me about your, your salt. What, what were you doing for salt hydration and fuel? Were we trying to do the carbs per hour and all that shit?

• 1:15:56Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:15:57Cameron Hanes?

  What about salt?

• 1:15:59Speaker 01

  I'm not very good at this part. This is like wrapping your feet. People are like, you don't put anything on your feet?

• 1:16:03Cameron Hanes?

  I, I, that, I was listening to a podcast. There's like people who are so anal. But, well, no, it's probably just smart, but about their foot, their feet care.

• 1:16:13Speaker 01

  It is crazy.

• 1:16:14Cameron Hanes?

  And their calories and like their sleep. And it's just like, holy shit. I don't think about any of this.

• 1:16:20Speaker 01

  I don't either. I am like, okay, I would look at it and say, okay, I'm gonna eat one jill an hour. It's gonna take me about five hours. Just take five of these. And then I had electrolytes and water.

• 1:16:32Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:16:33Speaker 01

  So, and I didn't know if the electrolytes actually even had calories in it. So I don't, all I know is.

• 1:16:40Cameron Hanes?

  Was it Tailwind or what was it?

• 1:16:41Speaker 01

  No, it was that Never Second. It was something new. Never heard of it.

• 1:16:44Cameron Hanes?

  That is, yeah.

• 1:16:45Speaker 01

  I said, I said, I was second. That's what I told her. I put on their thing. Cause I, one of them was horrible. It was a like potpourri. It was like this chemical, weird, perfumey. And it was really hard to put down. The lime one was pretty good.

• 1:17:02Cameron Hanes?

  Okay. But so you didn't, you didn't have a, a plan for calories and any of that? Like how much salt were you taking? Do you know? Like, so no, no S caps?

• 1:17:12Speaker 01

  I, I took S caps in the heat of the day, the hot, when I was like, it's hot. I had Adam. We took two every, every hour. We did that for about three or four hours one day.

• 1:17:24Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:17:24Speaker 01

  And that was it. I just.

• 1:17:25Cameron Hanes?

  Were you sweating much? Like at night? You said you're cold, so.

• 1:17:29Speaker 01

  No, not at night. I wasn't.

• 1:17:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:30Speaker 01

  No, I never.

• 1:17:33Speaker 01

  You know, like some of those you know, when you're sweating, you're like, you're chasing it a little bit.

• 1:17:37Cameron Hanes?

  Well, you run kind of hot. I mean, you you sweat more than I do.

• 1:17:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I never, I didn't worry about it till it was that last day.

• 1:17:44Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:17:45Speaker 01

  In the heat.

• 1:17:45Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:46Speaker 01

  But we were pretty good with weather, though.

• 1:17:47Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:48Speaker 01

  It was, it was pretty nice. Yeah. And I never pushed, you know, I never, you know, my heart rate was never pumping, you know? Yeah, I.

• 1:17:57Cameron Hanes?

  How much water did you have? Did you pack?

• 1:18:01Speaker 01

  Um, I had the two soft flask. So there's like sixteen ounces and then a a bladder that was eighty ounces.

• 1:18:10Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, and you filled all those up?

• 1:18:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:12Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, God, that's quite a bit of weight.

• 1:18:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, man, that pack was legit.

• 1:18:17Cameron Hanes?

  That's pretty heavy.

• 1:18:18Speaker 01

  It was heavy. It felt, yeah, it was heavy. I had, oh.

• 1:18:21Cameron Hanes?

  Especially if you have a jacket in there.

• 1:18:22Speaker 01

  I did the whole time. I carried gloves, headlamps, batteries. I had socks. I had down coat. I had pants. I had sleeves. I had sunscreen, batteries, cords for my phone, for my watch. I had contacts, my nor- like little advils, just in case.

• 1:18:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:40Speaker 01

  KT tape, food.

• 1:18:42Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:43Speaker 01

  It was loaded.

• 1:18:43Cameron Hanes?

  Adds up.

• 1:18:44Speaker 01

  Big time.

• 1:18:45Cameron Hanes?

  It wouldn't fit in my little knapsack.

• 1:18:47Speaker 01

  Some butt wipes, some bare butt wipes. Yeah, no, it was.

• 1:18:50Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:51Speaker 01

  It was legit.

• 1:18:52Cameron Hanes?

  Okay.

• 1:18:52Speaker 01

  And it was one of those, I'd start drinking off the water first thing to get it.

• 1:18:55Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah. Get rid of that weight.

• 1:18:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, on your back.

• 1:18:58Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:59Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, a shell, down shell, sun sun hoodie. Yeah, I had a lot.

• 1:19:06Cameron Hanes?

  I think like, my new plan was, I think, because it's, maybe because I don't think about all this science bullshit and all this gear, like, I think, let's just start this off where you can't take any water or calories or.

• 1:19:22Speaker 01

  For a hundred miles.

• 1:19:23Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, just to, you wear whatever you got on. That's what you got.

• 1:19:28Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:19:28Cameron Hanes?

  Go as long as you can.

• 1:19:30Speaker 01

  Yep. I like it.

• 1:19:31Cameron Hanes?

  Your carbs per hour.

• 1:19:33Speaker 01

  You know, I, I, uh, you know.

• 1:19:36Cameron Hanes?

  Let's see who dies first.

• 1:19:37Speaker 01

  I think there's some like basics, just having this conversation with somebody, there's like some basic like. Fundamental functions that your body has that you can't cheat. It's like, you're not going to take in all these carbs for very long.

• 1:19:52Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 1:19:53Speaker 01

  I don't think you can. I think you're going to get sick.

• 1:19:55Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know.

• 1:19:56Speaker 01

  I hear some of these numbers people putting up.

• 1:19:57Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 1:19:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I said, and the one guy I told, okay, listen, I get that's what you think you're taking, but that's just because the package is bigger. That's the only reason you're taking more. That's what you bought.

• 1:20:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:08Speaker 01

  Right? If you go back to the old goo gel.

• 1:20:10Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:11Speaker 01

  And what it is, you know, I, I don't think you can get far off of that, other than it being hot, you need salt. I think you add that.

• 1:20:18Cameron Hanes?

  For sure.

• 1:20:19Speaker 01

  If you're drinking, you're drinking, you're drinking some calories, you're eating solid foods, as long as you're not 160 heart rate. I think you'd be all right.

• 1:20:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I don't know. I'm sure there's people that'll listen to this. They'll talk about how stupid we are.

• 1:20:31Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:20:32Cameron Hanes?

  And it's like, you're, you're right. We're not arguing.

• 1:20:35Speaker 01

  But this ketone things?

• 1:20:37Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:37Speaker 01

  So pretty good.

• 1:20:38Cameron Hanes?

  Those are legit? Those helped?

• 1:20:40Speaker 01

  I had, I, I drank them all until I got that last aid station. I had a, I filled one of my soft flasks with coffee. And I had one of these and it got me going.

• 1:20:53Cameron Hanes?

  There you go.

• 1:20:54Speaker 01

  It was good. I wish I had more.

• 1:20:56Cameron Hanes?

  I used to take like a.

• 1:20:57Speaker 01

  How many should you have though? Because I, you gave me two boxes.

• 1:21:01Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:01Speaker 01

  I went through all those pretty quick.

• 1:21:03Cameron Hanes?

  That's fine.

• 1:21:04Speaker 01

  You're still, you're still like a cup of coffee?

• 1:21:06Cameron Hanes?

  You're still here.

• 1:21:06Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:21:07Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know what they say. There's, like I said, none, none of the, there's nothing about doing that that's good for you. So.

• 1:21:15Speaker 01

  Oh, I didn't. Yeah, no, they're definitely, I wasn't hoping for long-term effects.

• 1:21:19Cameron Hanes?

  Didn't like Hitler give his troops meth? I'm like, could I have a little, just a, just a, if I get tired, just a touch of meth? I wonder if it'd help.

• 1:21:30Speaker 01

  I think it's the decision making that goes out the door.

• 1:21:34Cameron Hanes?

  Well, consider, yeah, the fact that I'm considering it right now. And I haven't run one mile. Don't offer it to me 200 miles.

• 1:21:42Speaker 01

  Oh, caffeine pills. Have you done that?

• 1:21:44Cameron Hanes?

  No, that's what I was gonna say is like, I used to buy those, was it Vibran? Or remember those in the yellow bottle or yellow box?

• 1:21:54Speaker 01

  Yellow jackets?

• 1:21:55Cameron Hanes?

  No.

• 1:21:57Speaker 01

  I know what you're talking about. Vibran, it's yellow and blue box. Yeah. Vibran, oh yeah.

• 1:22:01Cameron Hanes?

  And then people, you know, got fancy and went to five hour energies, but I'm like, I just need that, those yellow caffeine pills.

• 1:22:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:09Cameron Hanes?

  So.

• 1:22:09Speaker 01

  We're gonna need them for Coca-Cola.

• 1:22:11Cameron Hanes?

  I guess we'll skip.

• 1:22:11Speaker 01

  I think they're for real. I had one day, there was one afternoon, I was, I started getting a headache. It was about two o'clock and I realized that I had left the aid station early in the morning and only had like a little bit of coffee. And it haunted me.

• 1:22:23Cameron Hanes?

  Really?

• 1:22:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, until that afternoon, I had a cup of coffee and I was like, okay, I'm better. Got that headache from not having it.

• 1:22:30Cameron Hanes?

  All right. So we'll come up with a plan for caffeine, salt. And then today I ran, I didn't run, cause I can't run, but I was walking. I went to Run Hub and I got one of the, I got a gel, a spring.

• 1:22:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, those are good.

• 1:22:45Cameron Hanes?

  Pretty good.

• 1:22:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:46Cameron Hanes?

  And then I got a goo, oh no goo, chews like.

• 1:22:52Speaker 01

  You just got two, just to try them out?

• 1:22:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. And, oh, I bought socks too, cause I had, I was wearing these shoes that Ben Blakenship gave me. And walking tears up your feet.

• 1:23:02Speaker 01

  That's.

• 1:23:03Cameron Hanes?

  And it's like, I'm used to running and it was like, so now I've just been walking everywhere and I'm like, God, I need some socks. Got socks and some calories.

• 1:23:11Speaker 01

  That's, you know, that, man, looking at Coca-Cola, it's, yeah, practice that, man, cause that's, that's for real.

• 1:23:19Cameron Hanes?

  I've been walking my ass off. I started walking like on Sunday, 18 minute miles and now I'm down to in the 15s.

• 1:23:26Speaker 01

  That's.

• 1:23:27Cameron Hanes?

  So I'm like.

• 1:23:27Speaker 01

  24.

• 1:23:28Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 1:23:29Speaker 01

  55, babe, we're almost there.

• 1:23:30Cameron Hanes?

  I know. Yeah. So I'm like, if I can get better at walking, I've never done this. Maybe this is gonna help.

• 1:23:38Speaker 01

  Be honest with them.

• 1:23:40Cameron Hanes?

  Serious.

• 1:23:40Speaker 01

  I've always, that's like, these guys are so fast going into this race. I'm like, I can't even run a five and a half minute. I mean, I can, but these guys are all doing it like on the road, like it's a regular thing. I'm like, I would be broken.

• 1:23:53Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:53Speaker 01

  So you don't have to be fast. You just walk fast.

• 1:23:56Cameron Hanes?

  And I was thinking like, so normally in my head, I'd be like, well, if I, I'm going to go run 20 miles. That's what I usually do. I take off, well, it's about 18 and I go down to that footbridge by Marist and then back.

• 1:24:09Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:24:09Cameron Hanes?

  And I can do that. I can get there in an hour, back. So it's like two hours.

• 1:24:16Cameron Hanes?

  And I wouldn't run any more than that. I'm still just getting 20 miles, except now I'm doing it in six hours. So it's like triple time on my feet. That's gotta be useful.

• 1:24:25Speaker 01

  Oh, it is.

• 1:24:27Cameron Hanes?

  That time on your feet. Cause you know how you start wa- and like, I never walk. My hips.

• 1:24:33Speaker 01

  Are pissed.

• 1:24:34Cameron Hanes?

  My hips are so I'm like, God, I can get this shit out of the way now.

• 1:24:38Speaker 01

  You gotta get the poles out now.

• 1:24:39Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:40Speaker 01

  You need the poles.

• 1:24:41Cameron Hanes?

  That's what I, maybe tomorrow I'll do, I'll just do a bunch of summits and with the poles.

• 1:24:46Speaker 01

  Well, even just walking flat ground, knowing, getting efficient.

• 1:24:49Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Cause that's true. That's a big part of it.

• 1:24:51Speaker 01

  Cause I'll tell you, that was the thing after my shoulders. I use those poles the entire time. I never put them away. Never broke them down.

• 1:24:57Cameron Hanes?

  White thing on there. I don't know what the hell that is.

• 1:25:00Speaker 01

  It's a sticker from an apple. It looks like.

• 1:25:02Cameron Hanes?

  And that's to sm- snort my meth.

• 1:25:06Speaker 01

  Getting used to it for the race.

• 1:25:08Cameron Hanes?

  Practicing.

• 1:25:09Speaker 01

  Do you smart meth?

• 1:25:11Cameron Hanes?

  I don't, I don't know.

• 1:25:12Speaker 01

  I need to figure that out.

• 1:25:13Cameron Hanes?

  Probably stick to the caffeine pills.

• 1:25:15Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:25:15Cameron Hanes?

  It's probably a good start and more ketone IQs.

• 1:25:19Speaker 01

  All right. That sounds probably a little safer.

• 1:25:21Cameron Hanes?

  Have maybe just a bladder full of that.

• 1:25:25Cameron Hanes?

  I don't know what that would do.

• 1:25:26Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:25:27Cameron Hanes?

  Probably want to find out.

• 1:25:28Speaker 01

  I, I'm just, I'm willing to try anything, but whatever. We're going to get there and see what happens. There's a lot of fast people in Coca dona.

• 1:25:38Cameron Hanes?

  There's a ton of fast people. It's gonna be a barn burner.

• 1:25:41Speaker 01

  God, but like.

• 1:25:43Cameron Hanes?

  Carnage.

• 1:25:43Speaker 01

  What'd you, what'd you get in that one? It's 80 some hours?

• 1:25:46Cameron Hanes?

  Eighty eight.

• 1:25:47Speaker 01

  Eighty, oh, same?

• 1:25:48Cameron Hanes?

  No, I was, I did eighty, eighty six.

• 1:25:51Speaker 01

  Eighty six.

• 1:25:52Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:54Speaker 01

  At Coca dona.

• 1:25:55Cameron Hanes?

  Normally.

• 1:25:56Speaker 01

  But it was a different course than you guys.

• 1:25:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. I mean, I always, I don't even, who knows what my body's going to do, but. Eighty would be good.

• 1:26:05Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:26:06Cameron Hanes?

  Wouldn't that be good?

• 1:26:07Speaker 01

  I think they're gonna, I think somebody's gonna win it in like sixty. Well, yeah, maybe.

• 1:26:13Cameron Hanes?

  Right?

• 1:26:13Speaker 01

  Someone, someone that's getting paid.

• 1:26:16Cameron Hanes?

  I know.

• 1:26:17Speaker 01

  Somebody that's a beast.

• 1:26:18Cameron Hanes?

  Those fast guys.

• 1:26:19Speaker 01

  I couldn't imagine having to just like get up and be like, guess what my workout's gonna be today?

• 1:26:26Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I know. Wouldn't that be nice?

• 1:26:27Speaker 01

  Get up at four thirty and talk on the phone at work.

• 1:26:30Cameron Hanes?

  God.

• 1:26:31Speaker 01

  Go turn some wrenches.

• 1:26:32Cameron Hanes?

  I know, you do amazing, but you know, for the most part, most ultra runners aren't, that's just not their job. It's so hard to make money in ultra. There's like

• 1:26:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, because

• 1:26:44Cameron Hanes?

  Five of them.

• 1:26:45Speaker 01

  Well, plus the people who care the most are the people doing it. None of us have enough money to do anything anyways. It's like, if your, if your time and your effort was worth money, yeah, but it's like, I mean, even people watching, they think we're mentally

• 1:26:58Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:26:59Speaker 01

  I mean, who, who'd ever do that? Who would ever run three hundred miles?

• 1:27:02Cameron Hanes?

  I want, I want it to be more professionalized because it's such an amazing sport, but it's like, I guess maybe this, you know, the exposure helps, more people talking about it. It should, it should elevate, I think, and give the opportunities to people, but still there's always like the gatekeepers of the, of the, any community, there's this in bow hunting too, is like, they don't want it to grow.

• 1:27:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:29Cameron Hanes?

  So you gotta kind of fight those people a little bit.

• 1:27:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, you just, I think they just, people, we need to find creative ways to tell people's stories. You know, because there's fast people and they're gonna win and there's gonna be competitive people.

• 1:27:40Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:41Speaker 01

  Being able to paint and create stories for people to relate to, you know, that's, that's, that's where I think it's gotta be is, yeah, some of these companies have to pay, pay these people to be a spotlight. Seems like Max has an opportunity to kind of do that.

• 1:27:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:56Speaker 01

  Some of them do, you know, that's

• 1:27:58Cameron Hanes?

  He's marketable.

• 1:27:59Speaker 01

  That's good for the sport.

• 1:28:00Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, people do like, I see comments, I think I reshared it, but like, they love this, like your story, you know, dad, regular job, grinder and podium. You know, that gives, because people just want hope. They just want to be like, could I ever do that? Well, this guy, this guy has a regular job and he did it. So it gives, there's something special about that too.

• 1:28:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:28:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, yeah, you do a great job of. And then always being supportive of like, you know, those, those guys who you run with Danny and Gavin, just always being and Spike camp, just like being so involved in the community and being such an inspiration, such a figurehead that people can look up to and, and, and model themselves after. So it's like you, you deserve so much credit for that. It's been amazing to watch.

• 1:28:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, thanks.

• 1:28:53Cameron Hanes?

  I love it. I love it. And I love all the success you've had. Well, what we do now is,

• 1:29:03Cameron Hanes?

  what do we do now, guys? Gideon and Larry?

• 1:29:06Speaker 02

  Questions?

• 1:29:07Cameron Hanes?

  They come up with stupid questions.

• 1:29:09Speaker 02

  Peanut gallery.

• 1:29:09Cameron Hanes?

  The peanut.

• 1:29:10Speaker 02

  The Muppets.

• 1:29:11Cameron Hanes?

  Somehow, I don't know. Well, they, okay, we're not going to do the, who is Taylor Spike? Cause I hate that one. That one's like, and lazy. We're not going to do the, whatever, but they actually do come up with good questions somehow.

• 1:29:29Speaker 02

  We have to do FMK, right?

• 1:29:31Cameron Hanes?

  Oh, yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's, that's a good one. I like that one.

• 1:29:34Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:29:37Speaker 02

  So.

• 1:29:37Cameron Hanes?

  I kind of feel like I'm a shit talkers. I'm excited.

• 1:29:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, this, anything goes on this part. Okay.

• 1:29:44Speaker 02

  All right. So, Mary kill. Monster Tahoe, Cocodona.

• 1:29:54Cameron Hanes?

  Had a lot of success at Tahoe. I married Tahoe. Married Tahoe. Yeah. Two, well, second, third, second male, third overall, twice. Yeah, both directions. Both directions. So yeah, had a lot of success there. Yeah.

• 1:30:11Cameron Hanes?

  Mary Tahoe, who are you, Dean, and who are you killing? So you gotta kill, never do it again.

• 1:30:19Speaker 01

  Byers and the monster.

• 1:30:21Cameron Hanes?

  And then you're gonna, what are you marrying? Wait, was it, what was the last one?

• 1:30:26Speaker 01

  But then I have to go back, then that means I have to go back to Coca Dona and I gotta it.

• 1:30:31Cameron Hanes?

  Or no, who did, who were you marrying? Tahoe? Okay. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You're just gonna have a good time with whenever you want to with Coca Dona.

• 1:30:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Yeah. In Arizona, I'm out.

• 1:30:41Cameron Hanes?

  It's a buddy.

• 1:30:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, Arizona, me, the monsters.

• 1:30:46Cameron Hanes?

  That was enough?

• 1:30:47Speaker 01

  That's, I think that was enough. I mean, I'm a week removed, I'm kind of changed my mind, but I don't, it's hard to go back to that stuff.

• 1:30:54Cameron Hanes?

  That was a crazy, you thought it was a girl, but it was a tranny. And so now you're like,

• 1:30:58Speaker 01

  It was exactly that. Yeah. I'm gonna win. No, you're not. Yeah. Hey, guess what? You're gonna live with not winning for a whole day.

• 1:31:08Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Uh, okay. That's a good one. I like it.

• 1:31:13Speaker 02

  Uh, when Shelby was here, she asked Cam, what does he think about when things get hard? So what do you think about?

• 1:31:21Speaker 01

  Ah, shit.

• 1:31:30Speaker 01

  I coined a saying, uh, it'll never hurt as much as it did that one time.

• 1:31:35Cameron Hanes?

  There you go. Yeah. So when you face, when you faced it and lived through it, that's gotta give you hope for the next time, huh?

• 1:31:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:43Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:44Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, but it can be worse. It can be worse. And if, that's like adult Paxton, he was, he was saying something about one of the dads saying, your dad's crazy. I don't know how you can do that. I was like, you know, I've seen the darkness. This ain't it.

• 1:31:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:57Speaker 01

  No. This is living. We're lucky to do this. All these people supporting us, encouraging us and all those people online watching for days. And when you ever get to do something, you can be that selfish. That all these people are like, yeah, go get it. Usually you go on vacation at work and people are like, I can't, can't wait for that to come back. But this are like, they're encouraging you to stay out there and get it done. This is, you don't get that. So.

• 1:32:19Cameron Hanes?

  No, I mean, that's, it feels, I guess it can feel miserable at times, but then I think to your point, or when I think about miserable, I think about being a drunk. Having no direction, having nothing positive going on in my life and looking in the mirror going, is this it?

• 1:32:40Speaker 01

  Waiting to die.

• 1:32:41Cameron Hanes?

  That's, that's being miserable.

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  That's miserable.

• 1:32:43Cameron Hanes?

  So signing up for a race and pushing our bodies and be, and getting, getting celebrated for that? Fuck, come on.

• 1:32:52Speaker 01

  That's not miserable.

• 1:32:53Cameron Hanes?

  It's pretty awesome.

• 1:32:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's amazing.

• 1:32:57Speaker 02

  You kind of talked about your hallucinations, but Andy Glaze posted a video where he was like, all right, I just saw this guy in a purple suit. He's hiding behind this rock. Let's go see together.

• 1:33:08Speaker 02

  He flips around the camera and there's nobody there and then he flips it back on himself and he's like, I'm so cooked. Did you have any other weird hallucinations or?

• 1:33:17Speaker 01

  I kept thinking Adam was asking me questions and I would respond and start talking and then realize how he's responding, he didn't say anything.

• 1:33:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:25Speaker 01

  And I was pretty sure, I think you and I did that too. I kept hearing voices. Remember I heard the women talking or laughing?

• 1:33:30Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, voices, that's one, I don't, um, not hallucinating, seeing anything. Waking up thinking that the doctor was checking me because I thought I was dead.

• 1:33:39Cameron Hanes?

  That's a good one. I like that one.

• 1:33:41Speaker 01

  There was another, yeah. Yeah, no, that was, no real clear ones, but definitely the voices. Oh, oh, um, I think deja vu, like I, I assumed this is what it is, but there was about 10 hours that I was convinced I had been on this trail.

• 1:34:02Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:02Speaker 01

  I was like, I know this next corner. I know this ridge and Adam was just laughing and finally I'd realized I was so tired that the delay from seeing it to my brain saying I'd seen it, I could, I could visual, I could feel it. I mean, it was plain as day. Does that make sense? Just, it was like running. I felt like I was floating down the trail when I realized I'm not really, you're just delayed so long.

• 1:34:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:28Speaker 01

  You're not going to react.

• 1:34:29Cameron Hanes?

  It's, uh, I want, hopefully Macy can find this video, but that's exactly like what happened. Courtney was in, I can't remember what she was doing. I think it was the Colorado Trail when she's going after that record. It wasn't when I was with her, but. She was sitting there drinking it, I think coffee or something. And she's like, have we already done this?

• 1:34:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:50Cameron Hanes?

  And they're just like, what do you mean? She's like, I feel we already did this, right? And they're just like, no.

• 1:34:58Speaker 01

  I, I, we would, I asked a guy, I said, hey, when you come around this corner, is there like a, like it looks like a, uh, like a projector screen, like a drive in theater? And he's like, that's not here. And I'm like, really? I've been here, you know, oh yeah, it was horrible.

• 1:35:12Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So that's, that, I think like that long without sleep, like maybe that second night, you know, the first night we can get through is fine. But second night, your brain starts, your brain is like, what are we doing here?

• 1:35:25Speaker 01

  After 60 hours, something happens.

• 1:35:27Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, it gets for real.

• 1:35:28Cameron Hanes?

  It gets, yeah, you go a little nuts.

• 1:35:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:32Cameron Hanes?

  Brain just doesn't work right is what is basically what's happening. And I don't know how to explain it, but yeah, when me and Maggie were running with Courtney on that Colorado trail. And then I would ask her something and she was like, wouldn't say anything. And then it'd be like way down the trail, like a long time. And then she'd answer.

• 1:35:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:52Cameron Hanes?

  Like, okay.

• 1:35:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, it seemed quick. I seemed witty.

• 1:35:59Cameron Hanes?

  What else you got?

• 1:36:00Speaker 02

  A lot of people talk about ultra marathons and how, um, you know, it's a form of therapy because it's just you and yourself out there. So what's one truth you had to face about yourself during this race?

• 1:36:14Speaker 01

  Oh gosh dang it. These are good ones. Um,

• 1:36:22Speaker 01

  that I'm soft, that, that I have sold myself, I sold myself short, I've sold myself short. I can do more. I can always do more. I, you know, might not be a lot, but, and it wasn't even in running. It was more just in life, you know, it's, you think you're tapped, you've reached your max, you've done this, but there's, there's, I could do more, I can do more.

• 1:36:41Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. It's like, yeah, finding, yeah, we, we, uh,

• 1:36:48Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. What's our true limit? Cause we quit way before generally.

• 1:36:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, well it's.

• 1:36:53Cameron Hanes?

  And then you then a race like this shows you like, God, what have I been doing? I've been capable of this the whole time.

• 1:37:00Speaker 01

  Like I told them, I was like, and I thought I've been too tired to go for a run before.

• 1:37:05Cameron Hanes?

  When you're a hundred percent fresh or just because you ran the day before?

• 1:37:09Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Right. Or I just, it was that. And then just knowing that, you know, you still have time and that, you know, there were some clarity things in there too, just in life in general, you know, that how can you be, you know, how can you impact your family more, you know, just that type of stuff?

• 1:37:24Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:25Speaker 01

  Eighty eight hours to think about it. You get through most of that in about 24.

• 1:37:28Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:28Speaker 01

  And then you can reel it back and reel it back and.

• 1:37:31Cameron Hanes?

  And then you start over analyzing and then you start beating yourself up.

• 1:37:34Speaker 01

  I, I'm glad I don't have a notepad.

• 1:37:37Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:37Speaker 01

  It would be bad.

• 1:37:38Cameron Hanes?

  Cause people would read it and go, this is nuts.

• 1:37:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. His doctor's right. Pretty clinical.

• 1:37:43Cameron Hanes?

  That's what I think. One of the questions, uh, yeah, these guys, these guys had a good one. I think was maybe it's for Courtney. She's like, or not she, they asked if you could trade brains with anybody at the end of a race, something like that. And I was just, I don't know what, I think that was how it was worded, but I was like, people wouldn't want my brain. Cause if they had, if they knew what I was thinking, they'd be like, this is nuts.

• 1:38:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:10Cameron Hanes?

  You are nuts. So yes, you're, what you think about in your head or how you, you know, your perception of or self-reflection is like, it can be tough sometimes.

• 1:38:22Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:38:22Cameron Hanes?

  It's like all stripped away and.

• 1:38:24Speaker 01

  It's ugly.

• 1:38:24Cameron Hanes?

  You're pretty raw.

• 1:38:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:26Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. But that was a good question.

• 1:38:29Speaker 02

  Um, you talked about waiting at the start line, watching everyone kind of go so you could then reel everybody back in past them. I just want to hear kind of a little bit how your mindset changed from mile one to, you know, mile 299.

• 1:38:48Speaker 01

  It didn't. I was, I was gonna be patiently, I was gonna be patient.

• 1:38:58Speaker 01

  The only thing that happened in the first couple of miles was getting lost a couple of times. And that was like, okay, I'm in the back of the Congo line. It is what it is. I got plenty of time. And that was just kind of the whole, the whole deal was like, I got plenty of time. I got plenty of time. I just got to do my thing, not blow up. I got time. I never, my game plan never changed. You know, there was times that they were like, the crew was like, okay, we need to do this and that. I said, that's not how this is gonna work. I'm just gonna stick to my plan, keep eating, keep drinking, just keep moving forward.

• 1:39:29Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I just, I couldn't, couldn't get out of that headspace.

• 1:39:34Cameron Hanes?

  It's so mental. It's like, I wish there was a way to trick yourself. Like to just, to just, you make it all about everything else, but really it's just like, just a will to keep taking another step.

• 1:39:47Speaker 01

  That's what I told those guys. I said, all we're doing is willing ourselves. We're all, we're all fit. We're all fit. You're, can we be so fit? We were willing ourselves to the finish.

• 1:39:54Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:54Speaker 01

  I mean, that's what it comes down to. You're just telling yourself you can do it. And that's where I was, you know, that whole, you know, you see the bar or you know, you see the finish. And also it starts getting hard.

• 1:40:05Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:06Speaker 01

  I wanted to keep that away so bad because that was the thing I knew. If I got to 200, I'm like, I only got 100 to go. Or at some point I would let my guard down.

• 1:40:15Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:15Speaker 01

  It was gonna get harder.

• 1:40:16Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. So you just focused on the moment.

• 1:40:18Speaker 01

  Yep. Yeah. Taking another step, taking another step, taking another step. It was, it was focusing on that over and over and over and over.

• 1:40:25Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. That's good. That's good advice.

• 1:40:29Speaker 02

  All right. Last one. Uh, what's, you have to choose one, one moment from this race that you wish you could replay.

• 1:40:42Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 1:40:49Speaker 01

  Probably hugging my dad at the finish.

• 1:40:53Speaker 01

  That'll be one I wish I could keep in the bank.

• 1:40:56Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:57Speaker 01

  That'll be important for a long time.

• 1:40:59Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. How'd that feel?

• 1:41:01Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:41:04Speaker 01

  Well, you know, you're, you like to always think your dad's proud of you, right? But you don't always really get that. That was like the first time that I was like, okay. I know he's been proud of me and I, and I know from a sibling, you know, you probably have seen it, but I never really felt like he was super proud until then, you know, it was like just three hours before that, I totally let those guys down thinking I was gonna quit. And he like turned his back and walked away. He's just like that, you know, how he gets, he gets frustrated and didn't know what to do and to go from that to finishing and being done and knowing that I had impacted those guys as much as I had by not quitting was pretty special.

• 1:41:40Cameron Hanes?

  That was pretty special. What did he say?

• 1:41:43Speaker 01

  Uh, nothing. He was sobbing. You know, I just, you know, and holding him, you know, he's, he's old now and you know, it's like, you know, it's like holding a, an old man. It's, it's a, you know, we won't, I don't give him any more of those.

• 1:41:57Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:57Speaker 01

  You know, that's one day I won't get it. So to be able to get it there and have him there was super, super special. So.

• 1:42:06Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Powerful moment.

• 1:42:10Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:42:11Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Uh, yeah. Greg, you definitely should be proud of your son.

• 1:42:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yep. We all have different whys. I, I pulled back every one of my hat on this one, you know, it was, it was hard. It was hard as it was the first time I'd ever been like, I'm, I'm done. I, I don't, I don't want to run anymore than, you know, they all just kind of, nobody really said anything. They just kind of walked me out. They had to help me down the stairs. I almost fell out of the back of the camper and it was, yeah, it was, you know, like I said, it was, you know, you have your kid and you're like, you gotta try harder and your kids make this like exaggerated effort to run, like they swing their arms weird. I, I just pictured myself doing that as Jared's like, you gotta go. And I was swinging my arms and I was just walking and I was swinging them as fucking hard as I could, just trying to get some momentum. I just, I did not want to do that last, that last section, but.

• 1:43:03Cameron Hanes?

  Wow.

• 1:43:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:05Cameron Hanes?

  You, uh, you make a big impact on this world and I'm very proud of you.

• 1:43:13Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah, you're amazing. I see what you do for the people here. I know how you impact me. I know how it, how good it feels to be able to talk about you and share your accomplishments and say, "My brother's a beast."

• 1:43:36Cameron Hanes?

  Yeah. Very proud of you.

• 1:43:39Cameron Hanes?

  I'm glad you can say that. I'd try hard, try hard.

• 1:43:44Cameron Hanes?

  Well, thanks for the recap. I love you. Good job. Thanks. Yeah, amazing, amazing accomplishment. So, uh, yeah, that was fun. I'm sure people enjoy the discussion and they, uh, a lot of questions, a lot of, a lot of feedback on you, a lot of, I see a lot of people celebrating you. So, yeah, thanks for doing this. Yeah, absolutely. All right, guys. Keep hammering. Thanks again.