PART 3 : Immaculate Constellation : A Whistleblower Honors His Oath - Matthew Brown

UFO Whistleblower Matthew Brown has words of advice - and caution - for the public, for Congress, and for other potential whistleblowers. In the conclusion of his massive interview with WEAPONIZED, Brown reveals how public perceptions about UAP issues are carefully managed, how "fear, greed, and willful ignorance" are employed as weapons by those who keep the secrets, and why now is the time for other insiders to step forward and tell what they know. Brown authored the Immaculate Constellation report, that was submitted to Congress months ago, based on evidence uncovered during his tenure working within the United States national security enterprise. He shares details on the types of visual evidence collected by intelligence operatives and technologies, the UAP shapes observed on classified servers, how excessive secrecy is used to stifle honest inquiry by the public and Congress, and how disclosure might unfold in the future. WATCH PART 1 HERE : ⁠https://youtu.be/ZAxI-LDrDqA⁠ WATCH PART 2 HERE : ⁠⁠https://youtu.be/4n_bRtnIP14⁠⁠ WATCH PART 3 HERE : ⁠⁠https://youtu.be/PtBVAxoHeaY⁠⁠ GOT A TIP? Reach out to us at ⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠ ••• Watch Corbell's six-part UFO docuseries titled UFO REVOLUTION on TUBI here : ⁠⁠⁠https://tubitv.com/series/300002259/tmz-presents-ufo-revolution/season-2⁠⁠⁠ Watch Knapp’s six-part UFO docuseries titled INVESTIGATION ALIEN on NETFLIX here : ⁠⁠⁠https://www.netflix.com/title/81674441⁠⁠⁠ ••• For breaking news, follow Corbell & Knapp on all social media. Extras and bonuses from the episode can be found at ⁠⁠⁠WeaponizedPodcast.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:59Speaker 02

  In the third and final part of our interview with Matthew Brown, the author of the Immaculate Constellation Report. The submission of this report onto the congressional record and its announcement caught people by surprise. Its distribution was allegedly very tight and these unelected members on these congressional staffs that get to set the agenda for our elected leaders had to scramble and adjust in real time. They panicked. What I have learned is that we live in a dream, a carefully constructed reality.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  We make use of a science that is tightly controlled and suppressed and distorted.

• 1:48George Knapp?

  Who are they? Why are they here? Why don't they show us what's going on?

• 1:53Speaker 02

  I think I have a good degree of confidence that the reason they're here is us. I think life, especially sentient life, is a precious thing.

• 2:10Speaker 02

  And I think to some, it might be a resource. I think humanity to some level is a resource for them. It's been a very painful, costly process to find allies, but I have them.

• 2:25Speaker 02

  There's more of us. This doesn't stop.

• 2:28George Knapp?

  Right. You've got to know some of these other whistleblowers who are still not public yet.

• 2:34Jeremy Corbell?

  Correct.

• 2:34George Knapp?

  But who are at least close to coming forward.

• 2:38Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:38George Knapp?

  Is there strength in numbers in that regard?

• 2:42Speaker 02

  Yes, and if all of us die or are imprisoned, the seeds have been planted. More will come.

• 2:51Speaker 02

  I fly out to California and I meet with Michael Schellenberger.

• 2:56Speaker 02

  I told him, hey, I got a story for you. Would you like to chat with me?

• 3:01Speaker 02

  You know, I had met him previously, very briefly, totally something unrelated.

• 3:07Speaker 02

  And his work on the Twitter files, defending, you know, free speech against a very pervasive and insidious censorship regime that our government, even before the Biden administration, had implemented, inspired me that he would do the right thing.

• 3:23Jeremy Corbell?

  Logical, great choice. You know, that was, my hope is to have a lot of journalists working on this from different angles, who you can trust, who are honest. So that's where your head's at?

• 3:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. So we have a good, we have a good meeting. I show him the document. This has been cleared by state. You know, I would prefer to like maybe cut it down because it's pretty long.

• 3:44Jeremy Corbell?

  Right.

• 3:45Speaker 02

  But you get to look at it and are you interested? The answer is yes. We're going to do a story. That's in summer of 24, I believe, early summer, late spring. So with that in hand and knowing that I had at least tapped Sask and Sissy.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Thought it was okay to move forward with that story and then tried to talk to House with, you know, the full details. In the meantime, before that story came out, you know, it takes time to vet things. He has to look into me to, you know, find out who I am, look into the details of what I'm alleging.

• 4:22Jeremy Corbell?

  I know the process, George, and I know the process well.

• 4:24Speaker 02

  So it takes months, you know, so I got some time. And in that time, I for the first time get connected with David Grush. I'd have a very enlightening conversation with him. And at his suggestion, he connected me with you. And that is how we came to meet.

• 4:42Jeremy Corbell?

  And I'm looking not to report on what you're saying initially. I'm looking to help you achieve the goal that we're all fighting for, which is getting the people asking for the information. This doesn't have to be public. It doesn't have to be a public display. This is let's facilitate these conversations. That's where we started. I'm not really doing journalism work with you. I'm trying to just help the process go. That's all. That was my headspace.

• 5:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was asking Gresh, like, I'm having a real hard time, A, meeting members themselves and B, just even talking to anybody in House. Who's the guy to go to? And it was you.

• 5:14Jeremy Corbell?

  Okay.

• 5:15Speaker 02

  So that was our, the nature of our meeting.

• 5:18Jeremy Corbell?

  George and I have had a great relationship trying to help facilitate information, knowledge and human beings in for this sort of thing. So it makes sense. It was a good move. We did well. With David Grush, so George and I's, our role oftentimes is to connect people. We are reporters. It is to break stories, tell the news. But really, a lot of what I was personally doing was trying to facilitate, help facilitate the process they're asking for. At that time, we had had a great hearing. David Grush, also Brett Fravor, who had to beg to testify. It was great. It was a success. Everything was clean on that one, on that hearing. This was a new thing, a new era.

• 6:03Jeremy Corbell?

  It felt different from the get go, but the idea was we're going to have another set of hearings. I'm all for that. They tapped me to try to help connect them with people and George. And so we've had many calls through many process. And now I'm out there to have meetings directly about firsthand people with firsthand experience who can directly testify about this, whether they talk publicly or not. This is the information you need. So I go to have these established meetings. You and I meet, I do, you know, physically and we talk about it. And you want to come with me and I can bring you in, but I can't let them know because we're still trying to protect you. Trying to protect your identity. So it was kind of like, we'll talk about it more in depth later, but a kind of harrowing experience. You were very nervous.

• 6:45Jeremy Corbell?

  I mean, it was like you're exposing yourself in the, in the, you know, in those meetings.

• 6:50Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 6:51Jeremy Corbell?

  Right.

• 6:51Speaker 02

  And just by walking into those offices or the buildings those offices are in.

• 6:57Jeremy Corbell?

  Right, right.

• 6:58Speaker 02

  Very public.

• 6:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Very public. So we kind of hid you in the, in the camera crews, the way I say it, in that you were walking with us, but, but in getting into the buildings. But I asked each member, I said, okay, you wanted direct people. I have one here to speak with you. Everybody needs to leave the room, including the cameras. It'll just be us. Is that cool? And, and each one, although they gave us wisdom along the way as we did our progression of getting you right in front of people to give them your quick testimony and some documentation. So that's what we went through. And we go in and there you are, you, you're sitting in front of, and you know, somebody with position. I just want to know, what did that feel like, first of all, that, that moment where you got to finally get to them?

• 7:41Speaker 02

  Uh, I mean, in the moment, it just was somber, serious.

• 7:49Speaker 02

  Also, you know, nervous, I got a, I got like, you know, it's, it's five minutes, but I only have probably like a minute to speak.

• 7:56Jeremy Corbell?

  Bro, you were sweating, you were stressed. I mean, it was, it was intense.

• 8:00Speaker 02

  So getting, yeah, getting most important information across and also establishing my credibility as fast as, as possible.

• 8:09Jeremy Corbell?

  And I was making sure you weren't a fucking plant, you know? To be honest, that was part of the process is making sure he'd say the same thing to, um, you know, to, to Congress, that, that, to members, that, that he said to me, not that I didn't believe you and I had done the vetting and I, I was there, but I want to hear you say it, show it. So you're not trying to entrap me. I mean, honestly, that's part of my thing. Um, man, we got through that, didn't we?

• 8:35George Knapp?

  It did. It worked well.

• 8:36Jeremy Corbell?

  It did.

• 8:36George Knapp?

  Mm hmm. So you come out of that thinking, okay, all right, this is good. I made contact, maybe we'll see where it goes.

• 8:43Jeremy Corbell?

  Mold? Yeah, yeah, pretty strong.

• 8:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, at this point in time, I'm very, uh, actually skeptical is not the right word. I do not believe, did not believe that this would work in Congress, but I knew that the attempt had to be made.

• 8:57Jeremy Corbell?

  We had to try.

• 8:58Speaker 02

  You had to try. I knew that I alone wasn't big enough or important enough to, to shift the tides of history there, to shift what apparently the executive branch had decided, which was we are going to squash this. And anybody that tries to bring it up, we are going to, uh, you know, silence, cutouts, uh, and disparage.

• 9:20Jeremy Corbell?

  They were asking for whistleblowers and there we are. And then he is blowing the whistle on this and that's what they were asking for. So for me, it was a big win for them to meet you face to face. Cause I knew down the line, if this is going to progress, that you would have testified. Let's get real clear on this. They were asking for it.

• 9:36Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 9:38Jeremy Corbell?

  You would have testified. You were not asking to testify. You're saying, here's the little piece that I have, but you, you said in that room that you would if, if requested.

• 9:47Speaker 02

  I would if asked and I did not want to do it at the upcoming hearing.

• 9:50Jeremy Corbell?

  Of course.

• 9:51Speaker 02

  Because that was very close and I in no way felt ready to do that.

• 9:55Jeremy Corbell?

  But you put the ball in their court and said you would, they didn't ask, right? And we got to, there's a whole thing about that, but just you really put it out there.

• 10:03Speaker 02

  I did.

• 10:03Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah. Okay.

• 10:05Speaker 02

  I think, um, it'll take quite a change in our present circumstances for anybody to ever testify under oath on this subject again, in a way that would make a difference.

• 10:19Jeremy Corbell?

  Mm hmm.

• 10:19Speaker 02

  I think, uh, they know the power of, in, in an open hearing, putting your hand on the Bible and swearing that you're going to speak nothing but the truth and doing so is symbolic and it's very valuable. And that is why I believe that they are desperately attempting to deny.

• 10:38Jeremy Corbell?

  Well, and that's what we saw, uh, you know, we don't got to rehash it. That's what we saw the second hearing, absolutely controlled. Uh, Representative Burchett testified to it by saying it publicly that the executive branch, um, did limit what could be said and by who, and George has brought that up a bunch and, you know, so, so I agree.

• 10:57Speaker 02

  The executive branch. In the halls of Congress determining what the business of Congress is and not even through the courtesy of a phone call to the Vice President or the President, but through minions and stooges.

• 11:09Jeremy Corbell?

  Mm-hmm.

• 11:10Speaker 02

  Unelected, probably CIA.

• 11:13Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, well, certainly, yeah.

• 11:16George Knapp?

  When you, when you hear about the lineup for the hearing that was held, you gotta be feeling pretty good about it. Oh, yeah, there's gonna be a witness. He's gonna talk about Immaculate Constellation.

• 11:25Speaker 02

  And not just a witness on his own next to Lou Elizondo, Tim Gallaudet, and this guy I've never heard of before, but seems nice, Nick Gold, or Michael.

• 11:33Jeremy Corbell?

  Michael.

• 11:34Speaker 02

  Michael.

• 11:35George Knapp?

  They're thinking, all right, good, all right, it's gonna come out.

• 11:37Jeremy Corbell?

  We're all punked.

• 11:38George Knapp?

  Did you know what exactly what was going to be discussed by the Sheldon Berger at that point?

• 11:42Speaker 02

  I, I mean, I knew it was going to be, you know, me and my words and my report.

• 11:49George Knapp?

  And because the two of you met with him the night before the hearing.

• 11:53Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, and I mean, I had met with Michael to give him the story. It seemed like there's no mystery here why they're bringing him.

• 12:01Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, there was a lot before that, too, but I mean, I have a two-plus-month process of prompting, trying to get something on congressional record, knowing that what your, your testimony was valuable. It wasn't just like spur of the moment. There is a process. It was three major meetings that occurred to validate the information that, that you provided to me. It's not just like, so getting on something on congressional record is a little bit more tricky than, than people think. They, they have to have time with it. So I very slowly, with your authorization, over those months, had in-person meetings, not just you being there, but then working with them, showing them the information so they had time to vet it.

• 12:45Jeremy Corbell?

  They're worried about getting scammed, too, right? So it was a process. It was a process that, for me, was very arduous. Personally.

• 12:53George Knapp?

  There are a lot of phone conversations that we sat in on with the House staff. And and it got curioser and curioser is that the people who were in on these these conversations with us on the other

• 13:05Jeremy Corbell?

  That's security folks just popping in on a meeting that I'm supposed to be having with them. They, you know, they wanted to know what assets George and I have to visually show them. We were going to provide them. They were saying at one point that we were going to testify. And I said, cool. And I want to give something substantial to the American public. This is what I want to give them. Well, you know, at some point they're trying to get us into a SCIF. And my federal lawyer, our federal lawyer said, do not go in there because they will immediately classify all that information that allegedly you may have the access to. And then you're never reporting on it. So we went through our own journey. We don't have to get into that in this discussion. But there was a lot of stuff happening behind the scenes. But hurrah, hooray.

• 13:45Jeremy Corbell?

  Congressional record, your report, which is misrepresented when Nancy Mace talked about it big time. But we're happy, we're happy. And I was stoked to have Michael Schellenberger, who at that time I was like, this is great. He's going to be a good ally moving forward. And he's the right man for the job. Yeah, but bottom line, no matter the shit that gets involved. And how revealing that second hearing was about the control mechanisms in place about UAP. I was elated, and I think so were you, that without having to put your face out to the public and endure all of that like you're doing and and gonna experience now, your testimony got put on the congressional record. That was a big win.

• 14:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, there was a bit of a personal pleasure, too. We, we, I, at the very least, got to see someone else be scared for once.

• 14:38Jeremy Corbell?

  Who was scared?

• 14:40Speaker 02

  Not the bosses of the people who interfere in Congress, but the minions themselves. Because their bosses didn't tell them what was going to happen.

• 14:49Jeremy Corbell?

  Can you dive a little deeper into that?

• 14:52Speaker 02

  Well, by all appearances, both behind the scenes and in front of them. The submission of this report onto the congressional record and its announcement caught people by surprise. Its distribution was allegedly very tight. And these.

• 15:12Speaker 02

  Unelected members on these congressional staffs that get to to set the agenda for our elected leaders had to scramble and adjust in real time. They panicked.

• 15:24Jeremy Corbell?

  See, having something on congressional record is different than just putting out a news report. News report goes away, one click, done. This is much bigger. And I saw that too. So I it was a big move and it was probably was filled with pleasure to see. It stirred shit up.

• 15:42Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 15:43Jeremy Corbell?

  You know, you said it before, and I want to drill this home. At one time, saying these words, putting these words in text, saying them over the phone, there was repercussion for that at one time.

• 15:54Speaker 02

  I understand it.

• 15:55Jeremy Corbell?

  As I understand it as well. But so it gets published and I was stoked. I remember that day I went on a news show and I was like, I had nothing. I didn't do it. Somebody put it out. I mean, you let me know that it was going to be public, but I was like, I was like stoked to hear those words mentioned. But getting it on record, watching the tables turn was was filled with pleasure.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. No long term outcome, but this is a fight without many wins. So you can take the small personal pleasures.

• 16:22George Knapp?

  As this news travels, is there a blowback? Do you suddenly realize, hey, something might happen to me as a result of this getting out there? You're happy that it's finally there on the record. But then does that change over the days or weeks afterward?

• 16:36Speaker 02

  Not so much. I was definitely under illusions at this point. Nothing would functionally change. But what mattered was, you know, adding new fuel to the fire to look what looked like was a dying cause.

• 16:52George Knapp?

  Is there blowback for you personally? Does anybody call you and say, you shouldn't have done that? Or does somebody figure out who you are? Is there an attempt to identify who you are?

• 17:01Speaker 02

  I'm sure there were attempts. I'm sure some of them were successful, but uh.

• 17:06Speaker 02

  I mean, I've been known to internal security undoubtedly since almost day one.

• 17:12Speaker 00

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• 17:42Jeremy Corbell?

  You know, here's the deal. People misunderstand because it was misrepresented in Congress. This is not a Pentagon paper, a product. You are the author of what the world knows as the Immaculate Constellation Report. This is a report based upon, a field report based upon your investigation, what you've discovered, trying to do the right thing, bringing it to the people that need to see it because it was so hard, even though they're asking for you, to get it to them. So just to be really clear for the fundamentally for people, Immaculate Constellation Report, what was submitted into Congress, onto congressional record, which we fought together to get that done, is your words.

• 18:25Jeremy Corbell?

  It's not some government Pentagon report like it was misrepresented by Nancy Mason Congress.

• 18:30Speaker 02

  Not at all.

• 18:32Speaker 02

  All my words, 100% authored by me.

• 18:36Jeremy Corbell?

  One of the striking things for me in kind of talking with you through this process, plus just reading the final report that went on to congressional record. I mean, you list and label cubeoid formation of metallic orbs. These are UFOs, right? So fast mover observed transiting over satellite, or sorry, sensitive facilities. Intelligence vessels positioned to collect on reproduction vehicle. Equilateral triangle UAP tails unwitting vessel. This one struck me. Large disk using clouds as concealment. And why that struck me is because George and I have been exposed to a lot over the years.

• 19:17Jeremy Corbell?

  And I, I, I think I know and other people know what you're referencing here. It sounds like you watched a video. You said on US government networks, there exists OPIR footage. What is it?

• 19:28Speaker 02

  Overhead persistent infrared. Um, that might be a correction that a satellite may not have been an OPR satellite after all.

• 19:35Jeremy Corbell?

  But this one, um, and, and you keep going on a boomerang shaped jellyfish shaped, uh, you know, tic tac shaped. You, you're not just making these words up like you saw visual evidence of these.

• 19:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:46Jeremy Corbell?

  And, and so did have George Knapp and I, we have been exposed to, um, along the years, a lot of visual evidence. But this one, the, the large disk, um, in the clouds, just explain to me seeing something like that.

• 19:59Speaker 02

  Well, number one, it's pretty striking because you're watching it from Spinks. It's always cool to watch satellite feeds. Um, and that's just something the general public doesn't get to see.

• 20:10Speaker 02

  And then two, just the size of it, it was immediately like, well, what the hell is that? It was in, I assume infrared, uh, either, yeah, black hot for that one. Uh, so the white clouds around it and yeah, it's, it's almost playful in its activities or like it was startled.

• 20:27Speaker 02

  But it's one of those cases where I look at it and, you know, it looks like a blowing saucer. But it might be one of the things that maybe that was actually one of ours, um, in the wrong place at the wrong time.

• 20:42Jeremy Corbell?

  What do you mean it looks startled? What does that mean?

• 20:45Speaker 02

  You know, it's just looking at an area over the ocean is what it appears. And this thing just comes trundling along, uh, like underneath the cloud cover comes up. And then right when it's like almost center frame, it scoots off to the side and like tries to get out of.

• 21:02Jeremy Corbell?

  Like it comes into a circle and going, oops, I'm being somebody spotted me, I can get out of it.

• 21:06Speaker 02

  Exactly. That, that is, it was visibly that's the, the feeling it had.

• 21:10Jeremy Corbell?

  That, that was, that was kind of haunting to me. I checked, we checked, uh, when we were with some friends recently. Um, I never know, we are not qualified to know if some of the things we've been exposed to are legitimate or not. But when I get confirmations like you describing this and other people we've just recently talked to, I know that footage exists. We've been exposed to it and, um, I think that that's, uh, a nice piece to the puzzle for the public.

• 21:35George Knapp?

  What about jellyfish?

• 21:37Speaker 02

  Hmm. Yeah. So I mean, I only heard that term once it was released. It's similar stuff that I had seen on the inside and it was often labeled like a floating brain or an organic or irregular shape. So that's why it's in there.

• 21:54Speaker 02

  So yeah, I've seen multiple instances of irregular shaped things that look thematically similar to the jellyfish. I've never seen the jellyfish video itself.

• 22:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, but seeing those, you know, there's an instance of there one in Southcom right at our border, crossing what appears to be into United States airspace.

• 22:19Jeremy Corbell?

  Let me get clear.

• 22:20Speaker 02

  Undetected.

• 22:21George Knapp?

  From Mexico?

• 22:22Speaker 02

  I believe from Mexico, one way or another. I can't recall the compass orientation right now, but I would assume into the US, which is why it was interesting.

• 22:29Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, let me get clear on a couple of things. Well, first of all, you know, people like yourself, you get, it's happened with Lazar, happened with Greg, like every word you say, you know, you're worried about if your memory isn't perfect this way. You've done a great job of really curating, making sure what you said is accurate. It's okay to make a mistake. It's okay to like not remember the exact equipment that did this or that in your brain. Just so so you're saying the word jellyfish you first heard kind of when George and I released that thing into the public media jellyfish, although it was described differently for different assets you've seen on servers.

• 23:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That term

• 23:05Speaker 02

  was describing something I had seen before.

• 23:08Jeremy Corbell?

  Okay, okay. But we just called the jellyfish because that's what it was told to us. They had two spaghetti monster was our other option. It was said that jellyfish works, but that morphology or shape is something that consistently you had seen within these classified servers.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  Yes, in other contexts outside of the Middle East.

• 23:27George Knapp?

  Okay. You ever see any, any videos where we're engaging with them, either we're chasing them or warplanes or something are going after a disk, a saucer, an orb, or something like that?

• 23:38Speaker 02

  So I've seen videos and read reports of engagements, but not live, like we're not shooting them, but engagements where, you know, either we are trying to intercept something, read lots of reports on that and from other countries as well, trying to intercept these things, you know, each report will have its own shape that they're chasing, but guess what they are. But then, yeah.

• 24:08Speaker 02

  When there's an example in there up the east coast of what would be classed as an engagement, where we're up there protecting our airspace and encountering these things and interacting with them in a way that we would consider hostile. And if it was, if it was anything else, you know, if we had a Russian bomber patrol that had a fighter escort and they tried to box our fighters out, force them down from the wash, the jet wash, you know, that would be a hostile engagement. But for whatever reason, you know, we're not describing it that way internally.

• 24:42George Knapp?

  So we're sending a plane up to take a look.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:46George Knapp?

  Maybe get a better look or even some imagery, but not to engage, meaning shoot it down, shoot a sidewinder at it or something.

• 24:52Speaker 02

  Right. I would, you know, I'm not going to be able to say that's never happened, but I have, I've not seen them engaged.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, with weapons.

• 25:03Jeremy Corbell?

  Well, it recently happened and we became aware of one. More details on that I think we'll report on. And what happened was the missile, quote, bounced off. And so they're trying to figure that out, but you know, what does that imply, like a field around it? I don't know. We also released one that was so embarrassing to release, we had to call it, it looked like Kermit the Frog. I think we called it Syria Dome UAP. But the reason we released it because verified, we tried to engage it, we tried to shoot it. And I believe we hit it, but we don't know the aftermath or what happened to that. We reported on that is actual information, even though it looks so silly, we had to report it because it's UAP. So from the recent event to that, it brings me back to what you said, George, about.

• 25:45Jeremy Corbell?

  The official orders back in Russia back in the day, tell me that real quick again.

• 25:50George Knapp?

  So the Russian military, they, from seventy-eight to eighty-eight, they had a standing order uh for the, any, every unit in this vast Soviet military empire. Any UFO or ball of light, flying saucer, anything weird in the sky. It had to all be investigated and the guy who was in charge of that program at the Ministry of Defense said that there had been several dozen instances where they sent planes, warplanes, to intercept these UFOs and they, mostly they couldn't keep up with them. They just poof, they're gone. But in three cases, they tried to engage and shoot them down. Three cases where those planes, the Russian warplanes crashed. Two of the pilots died and after the second pilot died, they issued an order, leave them

• 26:34George Knapp?

  alone. Because in the words of the, the commander of the Russian Air Force, they said they have incredible capacities for retaliation. So.

• 26:42Jeremy Corbell?

  Why so many shapes? Why do you think so many shapes? I used to think flying saucers were discs. I used to think UFOs were for flying saucers. That's what I used to think. Now, after knowing this guy for so long, reading all our reports, getting whistleblowers, talking with him, why so many shapes?

• 26:57Speaker 02

  I think part of it's um, sometimes these might be, you know, made to purpose. Uh so, you know, if they're only making it for a specific use case scenario, they'll design it to excel on that mission.

• 27:13Jeremy Corbell?

  I guess we know that. We do that.

• 27:14Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 27:15Jeremy Corbell?

  We have bombers that look a certain way and then we have reconnaissance vehicles that look another way.

• 27:19George Knapp?

  Star Wars, they have giant cruisers and they have the X fighters, you know, for different jobs. Would you be surprised to hear about cases where these things, large objects come out of the ocean or go back into the ocean? Does that sound familiar?

• 27:33Speaker 02

  I would not be surprised. I, I have not seen very large objects go in and out of the water, but I've definitely seen small to medium sized UAPs either going into the water and disappearing or going in and out or coming out of the water.

• 27:47Jeremy Corbell?

  Fact.

• 27:48Speaker 02

  Fact. And on video and described, uh.

• 27:52Jeremy Corbell?

  Is a video and described any kind of change of inertia, sorry, multiple videos? Any kind of, we have also been exposed to some, um, let me ask you this, any change of like, any inertial effect, any change of speed or motion?

• 28:06Speaker 02

  That's like the water wasn't there.

• 28:08Jeremy Corbell?

  It's like the gold for anybody wants to see. I wonder if it's ever enough, like, is video ever enough? Like, what is enough for people to wrap their heads that there's a real issue here? I don't know. I don't think one video is ever gonna change. I want to talk to you about signals, intelligence, signet, right? That was a big part of your investigation. Can you explain that and why?

• 28:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, so it was one of the sources where, uh, you know, we have a fantastic intelligence posture. It's not as data heavy, so there's just, it's just much easier to, to move around and, and access and read through quickly. Now, it's one of the shortest sections in there because, uh, in, in my mind, you know, those are, these are incidental collections, right?

• 28:55Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah.

• 28:55Speaker 02

  Uh, I'm sure we are specifically collecting signals intelligence on this, but my, uh, research was not in those, uh, sort of, uh, data streams.

• 29:08Jeremy Corbell?

  That majority is, um, accidental kind of capturing of.

• 29:12Speaker 02

  Exactly, from other countries, other militaries, uh, activities related to this and their observations related to this. Or sometimes historic things that we choir, that happened to pop up in those, in the signet channels.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, so the reason there's less detail there though is we're using those every day. We rely on them a lot and they're very fragile, very sensitive and diplomatically sensitive as well.

• 29:39George Knapp?

  The things you're describing that you'd seen that are in this report are mostly things that are, there's in the Pacific, in the Atlantic, there's over Africa, there are foreign things, something coming over the border from Mexico. What about cases in the US? Is, is NORAD, is that just a black hole for these kind of images? It's, so something that happens over our country, you don't even get to see it.

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, Northcom is a black hole. You need, I mean, just legislatively, there's, there's legal things keeping us, the military and the IC supposedly from, from looking at the States. That's supposed to be a domestic law enforcement, uh, mission in general. You gotta have a very good reason to be looking at. You know, over your neighbor's fence, basically. This is a, I think it's, you know, it's functionally a bit a barrier to present, prevent accidental or just curious people, you know, doing things they shouldn't.

• 30:33Speaker 02

  In our home, in our homeland, which would actually get them in trouble. It's one thing if we're doing it, uh, you know, some foreign country is one thing if we're crossing the line and spying here uh, without a specific mission.

• 30:47George Knapp?

  The complaint we hear from UFO world is, I don't care about these blurry images. These things are blurry, the tic tac, to me, that was a fantastic image. You know, there, you're not sending a Dave Fravor up and with an IMAX camera to make a movie. These are captured on sensor systems, the same as like 2019, the USS Omaha, pitch black, a hundred miles off the coast of Southern California. They're picking up an image that they follow for an hour on a thermal camera. They're, they're blurry, but they're amazing images. I mean, is there a reason that the public doesn't see crystal clear movie quality images of UFOs?

• 31:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think unfortunately, it's um, a product of our education system, a lack of curiosity in general about the world.

• 31:37Speaker 02

  There's a lot of arrogance in our academy and that arrogance filters down to our citizens. We know the world, we haven't figured out, there's nothing left to discover here.

• 31:46Speaker 02

  And I think in general, there's so much misinformation, stigma, mythology that people grow up with that lead them to just

• 31:57Speaker 02

  automatically categorize any of this as, as just a, you know,

• 32:03Speaker 02

  false, fake, not real, misidentified.

• 32:09George Knapp?

  Well, I mean, getting an image on the thermal camera, a hundred miles out to sea in total blackness is sounds pretty cool to me. That sounds like an amazing accomplishment. But is there, are there additional reasons that have been maybe discussed behind closed doors? Uh, force fields of some sort around these um, craft that make things blurry, even for a, from a mid camera image, do you know?

• 32:30Speaker 02

  Probably a very uh, real explanation for why certain shapes um.

• 32:37Speaker 02

  You know, are harder to observe than others. Um, I think, you know, whether it's active camouflage and like the skin of the vehicle itself. Uh, that definitely seems to be in play or a field like you described. Um, I've seen evidence of fields around crafts.

• 32:54Jeremy Corbell?

  Uh, yeah, some things we've seen have looked so bizarre. It makes no sense to my brain. Um, it is possible. We've heard that from a number of whistleblowers at different levels that what you're seeing could just be a part of uh, a greater structure, you know? Um, so it could be something like that speculating.

• 33:14George Knapp?

  We had this uh, Chinese balloon thing that happened, three different objects. UFOs, three UFOs shot down in a, in a couple of week period. And then we heard, we saw people use that, uh, the usual people in the media world who bash this stuff. Who tried to blame it on the UAP task force. The reason we're not, NORAD is not looking for something like this because the UAP task force confused the whole situation. It's as if NORAD would only look for things that look like planes, bombers or missiles. So we didn't look for UFOs. Um, is it possible that we didn't look for UFOs because it didn't really want to find them? Or is it, we were looking for UFOs, it's just the public and most of the government never saw.

• 33:59Speaker 02

  We've always been seeing these things with things like radar. Um, so it's, you know, it's part of standard operating procedures to, to deny this and to not uh, acknowledge it.

• 34:13George Knapp?

  So we've been seeing it, we're just pretending not to see it.

• 34:15Speaker 02

  Absolutely. Our public institutions like the FAA or um, similar, uh, and even local context, it's a not allowed to be discussed and there might even be technical measures in our, in the technology of this place that just prevents it from even popping up on a screen.

• 34:32Jeremy Corbell?

  Right.

• 34:33George Knapp?

  You know, like tic, tic tac. So that happened for two or three weeks. They could get a little glimpse of it on these systems, really sensitive, advanced Navy systems at the time. And then poof, it, it fell off at the USS Omaha. They had 12 or 14 of these things zipping in. You'd see them on the radar screen and then poof. If they didn't want to be seen, we weren't seeing them. I, I guess it could be that as part of an explanation. If they don't want to be detected on radar, they have ways to avoid radar, whoever they are.

• 35:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's a dangerous dynamic to have willful ignorance on our side and their capability to at least attempt to evade detection at any time on theirs. If we are so certain they are friendly, why is this a secret?

• 35:21Speaker 00

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• 35:51Speaker 01

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• 36:20George Knapp?

  Um, I have one more.

• 36:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:25George Knapp?

  Drones. So 60 Minutes just did a big piece on drones. Langley Air Force Base had these things flying over it for 17 nights in a row, stayed in New Jersey for weeks at a time, sensitive bases, restricted airspace at US, UK bases in Britain for days and days. We can't track these things coming in. We can't track them when they leave. We can't shoot them down. We don't know where they're from, but don't worry, they're just drones. They're foreign surveillance drones. Give me your take on that whole situation.

• 36:54Speaker 02

  Well, if you're a member of the public and you are still listening to CNN, MSNBC, Fox News, or reading the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal, all of that is controlled. It's propaganda. It is shaping your life narrative, intentionally so.

• 37:16Speaker 02

  Uh, as for the government reactions to that, I was very disappointed to see a continuation of the dismissal of these events by the Trump administration's press secretary. Um, I can guess why they decided, despite the campaign promise to immediately address that issue, to not, uh, has to do with geopolitical situations we are currently involved in, and the fact that we are living through a constitutional crisis related to this issue.

• 37:48George Knapp?

  Just seems to me that it is a worse thing to say, "These might be foreign surveillance drones, and there's not a damn thing we can do about it. We don't, we can't track them, we can't see them, we can't shoot them down," than it is to say, "These are genuine unknowns." You know, it seems like they're unknowns, not just something, some drone that the Chinese are floating off, off of New Jersey.

• 38:08Speaker 02

  There's an infection in our security thinking, which is that, you know, we must, they're primacists. They must be on top. To admit weakness is to admit defeat. And to say you don't know what something is, a pretty big signal of weakness. Um, there's not much humility and a lot of arrogance driving, I think, these responses, more so than any strategy.

• 38:40Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, we got, just, uh, I want to defend footage of it real quick. I got three things. I want to defend footage. Um, there's a lack of education about what people are seeing in thermal. So first of all, these are weapon systems. These aren't IMAX cameras. But they're kind of better than an IMAX camera because you can see in the fucking dark. So I think there's an education process. And we've been trying with our reporting to teach people, when you see something in thermal, what you're seeing is a heat signature, and that heat signature represents that shape and, you know, of the heat. It's just a, I think it's an education process. It has to come from curiosity, but people need to be told what they're seeing. It's new to a lot of people. It was new to me when I started seeing military videos for the first time. So in defense of- Grainy, bad footage.

• 39:25Jeremy Corbell?

  People just need to understand what they're seeing to understand the impact if they're curious enough. Question, like be a lie, like any country in this world could disclose at this point, a major country with technological development could disclose, we are not alone in the universe. There are others as visitors have been here a long time. Why? Why has everybody agreed to not say that to the public? Do you have any philosophies? Why?

• 39:49Speaker 02

  I think in the West, this is the reaction. That's an important distinction. I cannot comment so much on why Russia or China have not addressed this in a different way than us. But I think in the West and the Five Eyes Alliance and its subsidiaries, you know, there is a understanding at least that this is not talked about at official channels, especially if you're a, you know, small kid on the block and you, you don't, you don't speak out of turn.

• 40:28Speaker 02

  But it also points to, I think, the fact that this doesn't ultimately reside in the government anymore. This is held in an illegal internationalist regime, some sort of international cabal of sorts, mix of corporate, military, political, intelligence and criminal interests that have come together and they have subverted us and have taken this and have made it the source of their wealth and power.

• 41:03Jeremy Corbell?

  So what Dr. Edgar Mitchell told me in one of the last film before he died, he used very similar words.

• 41:09Speaker 02

  Well, that doesn't make me feel good.

• 41:10Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, well, he was sure of it. You're a whistleblower, not a source to me and George, you know, you're a whistleblower. You know, I wanna, we do wanna help. I always hear whistleblowers are scared and we know, we know some people, the same people, but there's a lot that have come to us that you don't know. Are you scared? Are you scared now coming forward? Are you scared?

• 41:36Speaker 02

  I mean, it comes in waves. Okay, um, so yes, but I make a conscious effort every day to not let fear rule my life and my deeds. So, yes, I'm scared, but this is the right thing. It's the necessary thing. And um, I was raised right.

• 41:57George Knapp?

  You think that by talking to us, it's possible that you might have some protection in that if somebody cuts your brake lines and you go off a cliff, at least there's going to be somebody looking into it and raise some hell about it.

• 42:09Speaker 02

  You know, if that happens, don't try too hard. Focus on the mission.

• 42:13Jeremy Corbell?

  So this is more about people need to know than about your personal well-being?

• 42:19George Knapp?

  Um, any regrets now?

• 42:22Speaker 02

  I trusted too much, and I did not trust myself enough. Took some, uh, I paid some prices and I do not doubt that there are the seeds for future costs I'll have to pay in the future.

• 42:41George Knapp?

  Describe for us the personal costs, the reality for you going forward, your outlook for ever working for the government again, for example, or in with any kind of a job that requires a security clearance, personal cost to your marriage, your personal life?

• 43:01Speaker 02

  Well, with the job with government, my career is dead. It has been dead for years now. I have a file on me. I will, even if I went back in, even if I chose to never do any of this and just keep working, I predict that I would have found my career stunted mysteriously as soon as it would have sought to, or would have sought to advance into what I thought was a noble mission.

• 43:34Speaker 02

  Personally, it's

• 43:37Speaker 02

  Hard to describe.

• 43:40Speaker 02

  You know, I've been doing this for about four years now. Only very recently have I had anyone to talk to.

• 43:50Speaker 02

  About it in, in, outside of like, you know, hey, can you make this meeting happen? Um, I've had no allies. That has changed. It's been a very painful, costly process to find allies, but I have them.

• 44:07Speaker 02

  There's more of us.

• 44:08George Knapp?

  Mm hmm.

• 44:09Speaker 02

  This doesn't stop.

• 44:10George Knapp?

  Right. You've got to know some of these other whistleblowers who are still not public yet.

• 44:15Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 44:16George Knapp?

  But who are at least close to coming forward.

• 44:20Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 44:20George Knapp?

  Is there a strength in numbers that in that regard?

• 44:24Speaker 02

  Yes, and if all of us die or imprisoned, the seeds have been planted.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  More will come.

• 44:30George Knapp?

  Well, those seeds have been planted about deaths to in the whistleblower community. That those stories circulate, I would imagine, pretty quickly among you and people you know.

• 44:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I'm still here.

• 44:40George Knapp?

  You think anybody has been killed because they knew too much on this topic?

• 44:45Speaker 02

  Yes, I believe, and I think. And I could probably help someone else prove it.

• 44:51George Knapp?

  Mm hmm.

• 44:52Speaker 02

  But lethal, uh, lethal action has been taken against people that tried to get the truth out. Or maybe we're just, uh, considered,

• 45:03Speaker 02

  uh, wild cards. I'm not able to be efficiently controlled, no longer useful. I think once you taste the darkness, like using it.

• 45:17George Knapp?

  They don't have to kill you. They could discredit you some way.

• 45:20Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 45:20George Knapp?

  Manufacture something.

• 45:22Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 45:23Jeremy Corbell?

  They, they asked you to come forward and, and you even felt that you had a small piece to the puzzle. And you weren't even sure if it was worth it. And, and then you do that. And what you suffer is the consequences against your career. There's other things we're not saying that we suspect are related to you coming forward. God, that's got to hurt, man. That's got to be painful. They've asked you to come forward and you tried all the ways to do that. We had to go to a little bit of extreme measures to, to get the rest going. It's got to be painful.

• 45:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, it is. I don't think it will stop being, although hopefully time is its own self. I like to spend that time with my wife, my family, not in a cell or in the ground. But, you know, this is bigger than me. It's bigger than us.

• 46:10Speaker 02

  This is the fate of our people. And to me, I'm willing to pay that price.

• 46:17Jeremy Corbell?

  Is it ironic you have to put your face out with us to protect yourself at that at this point? That's what we're doing, right?

• 46:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's what we're doing. This is absolutely what I did not want to do.

• 46:30Jeremy Corbell?

  I know I can attest to that. This is not this is exactly what you did not want to do.

• 46:35George Knapp?

  Correct. Have you gamed it out in your head? What happens next? What will likely be, assuming we go forward with this interview and make it public? And that right now, we don't know that that's the case. But when it comes out, if it comes out, what happens to you then? What are the risks?

• 46:52Speaker 02

  Well,

• 46:57Speaker 02

  gaming it out, there's more than me. More will come. I could say more if I wanted to.

• 47:07Speaker 02

  Hopefully this rises to a level of public attention that demands it be addressed in a serious way. I can't cause that alone. Other people will, but more need to come. And I think at this point, I like to say directly to the members of our military and our intelligence community. The time is now where you must choose whether you honor your oath or your orders.

• 47:36Speaker 02

  And if you have courage, you already know the answer. But for the rest of you, lead follower, get out of the way, get out of the way.

• 47:46Jeremy Corbell?

  We know people are coming forward and we know we've recorded George and I with other people who will be coming forward. You know, so you're not alone.

• 47:57Jeremy Corbell?

  But you say you could say more. Just explain that.

• 48:07Speaker 02

  When I wrote this document, I've kind of

• 48:11Speaker 02

  given my state of mind and the measures I took to protect it. I'm also,

• 48:18Speaker 02

  you know, familiar with ways that information can be extracted that passwords and encryption don't matter.

• 48:26Speaker 02

  So I didn't write everything down.

• 48:30Speaker 02

  So there are other bullets left to fire if you needed to. Yeah. You know, talk about things getting lost on the shelf. I highly doubt many members of the public read 11 pages, much less the first.

• 48:45Speaker 02

  But at the end, there's an interesting area.

• 48:49Speaker 02

  People might notice that it's out of order, too. Things are sequentially out of order. There's missing sections. And that one of that last sections says sensitive sources from mouth to ear.

• 49:05Jeremy Corbell?

  We talked, we talked about keeping that in or what to, how far to go with.

• 49:09Speaker 02

  What does that mean?

• 49:12Speaker 02

  Well, exactly what it says. Those words were only spoken

• 49:18Speaker 02

  from my mouth to another's ear.

• 49:25Jeremy Corbell?

  What is it like to have absolute knowledge that

• 49:31Jeremy Corbell?

  not only UFOs are are real, that we've been hiding that, that our government has controlled that information away from human, the base human population?

• 49:46Jeremy Corbell?

  And that there is another intelligence that is engaging humanity, straight up. What does that feel like being one of the people that knows that and doesn't suspect that?

• 49:59Speaker 02

  Uh, it's weird going to the supermarket.

• 50:04Jeremy Corbell?

  Okay.

• 50:04Speaker 02

  Even more, it's bizarre to work in government and see legions of people who have no clue

• 50:14Speaker 02

  about, about any of this and no clue that they are being deceived.

• 50:20Jeremy Corbell?

  Why should people believe you? I mean, I know, I know you, I know what we've been through, but that's not public stuff to everybody, every step we've taken. Why should people believe what you're saying?

• 50:31Speaker 02

  I was there.

• 50:33Speaker 02

  I saw it. I spent years researching it.

• 50:39Speaker 02

  If all that I'm consulting is passage material, then we are engaged in massive deception against our own military and intelligence community that I was a victim of.

• 50:53Speaker 02

  Uh, and on a, and it would have been on a scale that probably would have been its own news story.

• 50:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Oh, absolutely. Nonsensical madness.

• 51:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:02Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah. So, so as a human being, why should people believe you?

• 51:06Speaker 02

  Well, as a human being, I feel like I'm genuine, putting myself out there.

• 51:14Speaker 02

  Sacrificing my future, my past, and a lot of what I have now to do this

• 51:21Speaker 02

  for no gain.

• 51:22Jeremy Corbell?

  And you're getting nothing from us. We're just reporting because it's an important story. And you're telling it because it's true.

• 51:28Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 51:30Speaker 02

  It is, um,

• 51:32Speaker 02

  it is true.

• 51:35Speaker 02

  And I can't think of anything more pressing for our nation to come to terms with than the fact that we have been deceived and our rights taken away to protect the privileges of an elite few.

• 51:48Jeremy Corbell?

  You're not.

• 51:48Speaker 02

  I'm not going to, I am not going to live my life knowing that I could have helped prevent another generation of America and humanity from living in ignorance.

• 52:02Speaker 00

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• 52:32Speaker 01

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• 53:02Jeremy Corbell?

  So let's just separate, you know, for our audience and people kind of meeting you for the first time. So there's certain stuff you were exposed to in an official capacity that you've come to conclusion on and that you know to be correct, know to be true. Then there are extrapolations and philosophies and ideas from other types of sourcing of information. And we can talk about that kind of in a separate realm. And I value your opinion. I think people will too, because of your exposure to certain things you're saying and not saying. Okay. But if we're talking just about our ideas now.

• 53:36George Knapp?

  You have thoughts about the big picture stuff? Who they are? Is it more than one they? Is it us from the future, ETs, interdimensionals? Do you think there's anybody in government who knows? And if you, if they do know, is there any reason why this should say, stay a secret? At least some of it should stay secret. The public cannot handle.

• 54:00Speaker 02

  No. The only reason for secrecy is fear and greed. And that is the paradigm that we must confront and overcome. As for...

• 54:14Speaker 02

  The public and what their reaction might be to this information, good, bad, indifference. I think we already have our answer. It's gonna be indifference.

• 54:23George Knapp?

  Mm-hmm.

• 54:24Speaker 02

  Unless the, uh, the stakes are made clear.

• 54:31George Knapp?

  You're an absolutist. You like rip the Band-Aid off.

• 54:35Speaker 02

  There's no Band-Aid. There's no wound.

• 54:37George Knapp?

  Mm-hmm.

• 54:38Speaker 02

  This is not about protecting, healing.

• 54:44Speaker 02

  This is about power and control. This isn't about trying to save what's good. It's about getting rid of what's evil.

• 54:55George Knapp?

  Power and control, meaning controlling the technology and what it would mean?

• 54:59Speaker 02

  Those are just means. Controlling humanity.

• 55:02George Knapp?

  Everything. Um, you suspect that there are reverse engineering programs, that there have been crashes, that there are attempts to replicate that technology. You got hints of it in the ARV or RV. You know, that we're trying to build what these things can do. Do you think we've done it? That we've accomplished it? Somebody?

• 55:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think, uh, I think we've absolutely replicated some of these capabilities in inferior forms. And oftentimes maybe disaggregated from what was at once a unitary system, but we're only able to do a small part of what that system does.

• 55:39George Knapp?

  We've seen people say they think that the Tic Tac is something we had 21 years ago. And I'm wondering, well, where the hell is it? I mean, if we have this technology, we've done some of it to get even inferior versions of it. Is that something that's gonna be incorporated into the US military arsenal? Or is it something that's outside of it? That's controlled by somebody who's not using it for national defense?

• 56:04Speaker 02

  I think the US military might be allowed to use some of this technology in the national defense. But I don't think they ultimately have control over it.

• 56:17Jeremy Corbell?

  You know, this is a kind of arms race. It's a technology race. Whoever gains the ability to effectively weaponize this, they win. We know that UFOs due to the propulsion systems are a matter of national security and weapons of mass destruction. And we know that. We don't think that. We met with people that deal with that, right? Do you agree with that? Do you think that this is we are in a race with China and Russia? There's other countries competing to weaponize this? And do you think that's a problem? Because you've dealt with weapons of mass destruction in your official career.

• 56:57Speaker 02

  I think deterrence, strategic deterrence, has migrated out of, or sorry, has evolved from being relying on nuclear weapons as the pinnacle. I believe we have, and others, have developed the means to maybe utilize nuclear reactions to create some very dangerous effects through directed energy.

• 57:28Jeremy Corbell?

  Your concern is directed energy weaponry?

• 57:32Speaker 02

  Among many. But when it comes to WMDs and relations to this technology, I think we have been successful in both deriving new science that we have then suppressed to preserve a strategic advantage. And I think I probably don't want to talk too much more about deterrence.

• 58:03George Knapp?

  Somebody was flying these things that crashed. Somebody built these things that are being reverse engineered. Who's that somebody? And why don't they come forward? I mean, you know, you may not have seen that in a document or a file or something somewhere, but you've thought about it. You're a smart guy. What are your thoughts on the big picture questions?

• 58:26George Knapp?

  Who are they? Why are they here? Why don't they show us what's going on?

• 58:31Speaker 02

  I think I have a good degree of confidence that the reason they're here is us. I think life, especially sentient life, it's a precious thing. And I think to some, it might be a resource. I think humanity to some level is a resource for them.

• 58:57George Knapp?

  Like a commodity?

• 59:02Speaker 02

  Possibly a commodity, possibly a form of entertainment, possibly medical related.

• 59:11George Knapp?

  Think they live here?

• 59:13Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 59:13George Knapp?

  For all intents and purposes?

• 59:14Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 59:14George Knapp?

  Always?

• 59:16Speaker 02

  I don't know about always, but it certainly appears that they have been here for most of recorded history. At least some element of this has been here for most of human recorded history.

• 59:26George Knapp?

  You think we would see them if they didn't let us see them? Even with our more advanced sensors that they pop up, but they can also disappear? And do they allow us to get these glimpses? Is that a game of some sort, I wonder? Or an education?

• 59:41Speaker 02

  It's a bizarre one that I could not understand if it is a game. I think they're both just as powerful as we think, but also less. And I think there is, there is not a single they here.

• 59:54George Knapp?

  Multiple?

• 59:55Speaker 02

  Multiple, certainly multiple factions of the same species, if not multiple species. And all the complexity that brings, which might be our best hope.

• 1:00:06Jeremy Corbell?

  Do they have an agenda? There's different types, you know? What are your philosophies on this? Like, who are the others? Why are they here? And you've touched upon it, I know. We're kind of going back a little bit, but that is the big question. And I just wanted to separate, so people understand, your exposure?

• 1:00:22Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:00:23Jeremy Corbell?

  And your personal conclusions.

• 1:00:26Speaker 02

  So I have been exposed to no...

• 1:00:32Speaker 02

  Direct information on the anatomy, biology, intentions, culture, politics.

• 1:00:41George Knapp?

  Never came across those files.

• 1:00:42Speaker 02

  Never came across those. I think those are all some of the deepest secrets.

• 1:00:46George Knapp?

  Right. They would be if this is correct information.

• 1:00:52Speaker 02

  What I have learned is that we live in a dream, a carefully constructed reality. We make use of a science that is tightly controlled and suppressed and distorted.

• 1:01:09Speaker 02

  I think we are left behind.

• 1:01:14George Knapp?

  Humans.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  I think normies, the normal humans, the people have been left behind.

• 1:01:20George Knapp?

  Us.

• 1:01:20Speaker 02

  Us. People need to understand that we might have freedom of speech, but that has been subverted. We do not have freedom of inquiry. We are blocked from learning what we need to know, just in the public world. We are blocked from advancing in science. We are taught false science intentionally to prevent us from learning more. We live in the matrix. It's just much more boring than the movie.

• 1:01:56George Knapp?

  I think about whistleblowers like yourself. You're about to find out, assuming we release this, you're about to find out what the price is for coming forward. And there are other people in the same kind of position who are wondering what they should do, who are basically being held in limbo. They've worked in classified programs their whole life. That's what they do. That's what pays their bills. And they're held in limbo and that's held over their heads so they don't come forward. And they're debating, taking the same steps as you. There is no hope or help for anything like folks like that, is there? I mean, we've heard promises, we'll help whistleblowers come forward, we'll give them support. There are private equity funds and organizations that say they're going to help, but we haven't seen shit so far, have we? And have you?

• 1:02:42Speaker 02

  No, I've reached out directly to institutions that claim that they are here to help UAP whistleblowers specifically, both in the process of coming forward and.

• 1:02:54Speaker 02

  Any sort of stability afterwards, it's been radio silence.

• 1:02:59Speaker 02

  At best, at worst, one of those institutions has stolen my information.

• 1:03:08Speaker 02

  There is no organized help for whistleblowers. It is all controlled. It is all at either the special interest of industry that wants to get in on this. Or by the existing powers that be.

• 1:03:21George Knapp?

  Intelligence agencies who have infiltrated or created these things, correct?

• 1:03:26Jeremy Corbell?

  I have directly experienced that sadly, you know, over this last year, which is the vacuuming up of intelligence on people such as yourself, who are trying to do the right thing as whistleblowers, as well as anything that reporters could possibly obtain and release. And it is a treacherous moment in our history of this. You did a call to action to people. You told them this, you know, it's time, you know, move forward. I know that you had some encouragement with David Grush. I hope people are encouraged, you know, also by you.

• 1:03:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Look, man, if, if, if you were to die tomorrow because of whatever reason, what do you want people to know right now? Like, what do you want people to know if you're just like fucking on?

• 1:04:17Speaker 02

  You are not free.

• 1:04:20Speaker 02

  And this reality has far more to it than you have been allowed to believe. And God is real.