Question Time: 5 year old TV’s faulty, can I get a refund? Your caller helped me sort my debt! When shouldn't I pay IN FULL?

In our Question Time podcast, Martin Lewis gives you answers on anything and everything, including: if my holiday’s cancelled due to the Middle East conflict, can I get a refund on the travel insurance? Vodafone promised me a 50% discount but now they’re chipping away at it, what can I do? When is paying off a credit card IN FULL not worth it? My high-end TV is faulty after 5 years, am I due any money back? Plus, a wonderful success from Carly, who was inspired by a podcast caller to finally seek the debt help she needs. If you want to ask Martin a question, you now can! His Question Time podcast lets you ask Martin absolutely anything and everything (within reason!) – so if you’ve always wanted to know his favourite yoga position, if he’s mastered pottery, or have a very complicated question about your personal finances, email it to [email protected] mailto:[email protected].

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK.

• 0:10Speaker 01

  Welcome to The Haunted Library.

• 0:14Speaker 01

  Join me, Colin Morgan, as I read Frankenstein by Mary Shelley. A story of science and ambition, loneliness and longing, and what it truly means to be human.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  Listen to The Haunted Library wherever you get your podcasts, or find us on YouTube.

• 0:40Martin Lewis?

  This isn't the bottom point, this is the start of the journey out of your debt.

• 0:44Speaker 03

  I realise it's only 90p, but the 90p would increase again.

• 0:47Martin Lewis?

  Some of you are nodding, going, yeah, that seems a sensible thing for me.

• 0:50Speaker 03

  If you're going to have to recharge the interest anyway, you might as well earn your £4 back.

• 0:54Martin Lewis?

  Do not cancel this voluntarily yourself. Hello and welcome to the cunningly named The Martin Lewis Podcast. I do wonder what that's going to be about. And this is our Question Time episode, where you can ask me your questions on absolutely anything and everything, open brackets within reason, close brackets. And this week, you ask me, if my holidays cancelled due to the Middle East conflict, can I get a refund on the travel insurance? Vodafone promised me a 50% discount, now they're chipping away at it, what can I do? Then we have a wonderful success story, someone inspired by the pod to finally seek the debt help they desperately need. When is paying off a credit card in full not actually worth it?

• 1:36Martin Lewis?

  And my top end telly has got faulty after five years, I might due any money back. Play the theme tune.

• 1:57Martin Lewis?

  Hello, everybody, welcome to this Question Time edition of The Martin Lewis Podcast. Yes, this is where you get to ask me anything and everything, open brackets within reason, close brackets, sometimes by writing in. Sometimes we get you to call. And of course, everybody knows by now who's listening, who is in charge of this podcast, who is at the pinnacle of making the decisions, who has the life or death, not quite life or death, but let me go with it, say over who gets their question asked and who doesn't. It is the one, the only, the curator of questions, Professor Sir Dr Matthew Burnham Esquire.

• 2:35Speaker 04

  Oh, I get to keep the doctor this week.

• 2:37Martin Lewis?

  You've got the full honours of all those titles. Just for anybody listening for the first time, Matt doesn't actually have any of those titles. They're just within the canon of the podcast. He is just Matt Burnham.

• 2:48Speaker 04

  Literally just that.

• 2:49Martin Lewis?

  But he is the curator of questions.

• 2:50Speaker 04

  I am, yes.

• 2:51Martin Lewis?

  So are we going to do some more of our, what, because I have a title and you have a title, what is the title of the people who get their questions read out or call in on the show?

• 3:02Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 3:02Martin Lewis?

  We need to sort of, we're sort of clubifying it. And we had quite a long list last week. This is our last week of deciding. Give me one now and we'll do a few more at the end. How about that?

• 3:10Speaker 04

  Okay, let's go from Alastair. He says money maximisers, people want to make the most of their money and make it go further.

• 3:17Martin Lewis?

  I like money maximisers.

• 3:20Speaker 04

  I like it too.

• 3:21Martin Lewis?

  I like money maximisers. And just a subtext, we're going to stop there and we'll do more at the end. Here's the issue for Matt. The issue for Matt is the current favourite is Martin's podcast contributor MPC, a bit like the Monetary Policy Committee of the Bank of England.

• 3:37Speaker 04

  But the problem with that is?

• 3:38Martin Lewis?

  It was suggested by podcast producer Simon, who produces the pod with me and Adrian.

• 3:43Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 3:43Martin Lewis?

  And Matt is finding that very difficult, aren't you, Matt?

• 3:46Speaker 04

  I am. We are in competition and I would like to win.

• 3:49Martin Lewis?

  Yeah. So Matt is desperate for somebody to find something that knocks MPC off the list. Money maximisers could be it. We'll do some more of those at the end. What's your first question for me, Matt?

• 4:01Speaker 04

  Got a question from Richard. He's emailed in, [email protected]. He says, hi, Martin and Matt.

• 4:09Martin Lewis?

  Fine.

• 4:10Speaker 04

  Fine, yeah.

• 4:11Martin Lewis?

  Completely the right way to do it. Well done.

• 4:13Speaker 04

  Do you know what? I don't think I'm going to argue this week. This week is my, do you know what? I'm just going to let it happen.

• 4:17Martin Lewis?

  I mean-

• 4:19Martin Lewis?

  I know you say that, but it is the Martin Lewis Podcast Question Time Edition.

• 4:24Speaker 04

  I know.

• 4:25Martin Lewis?

  It is fair that people put me first in the email.

• 4:27Speaker 04

  I know, but the emails come to me.

• 4:29Martin Lewis?

  The thing is, I've been very encouraging for people to include you, so it's inclusive.

• 4:32Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 4:32Martin Lewis?

  And not just do High Martin.

• 4:34Speaker 04

  But you don't read the emails.

• 4:36Martin Lewis?

  I don't read the emails, but I'll be honest.

• 4:38Speaker 04

  Go on.

• 4:39Martin Lewis?

  And between us, just between me, you and the podcast listeners, I do have other shows. You are aware of that?

• 4:44Speaker 04

  No.

• 4:45Martin Lewis?

  I do, including on the one with, you know, the radio with pictures one?

• 4:50Speaker 04

  No, I don't think that's quite reached us here.

• 4:52Martin Lewis?

  Okay, but you know, the radio with pictures one, and on that one, it goes to the team of that show. And they don't get their names in the email and people still do it that way. So we've encouraged the listeners to engage and include you as the curator of questions, as is your right.

• 5:09Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 5:09Martin Lewis?

  But I think asking for primacy in the order, I mean, if they do it, they do it. But I think, you know, I don't think you should feel hard done by that you don't get primacy is my point.

• 5:20Speaker 04

  Right, okay.

• 5:21Martin Lewis?

  Is that fair?

• 5:21Speaker 04

  That's fair. He goes on to say, love the podcast and I finally have a question for you, which may affect other listeners too.

• 5:28Martin Lewis?

  And that's the most important bit, Matt, is he loves the podcast.

• 5:30Speaker 04

  He loves the podcast.

• 5:31Martin Lewis?

  Which means he loves what I do, he loves what you do, he loves the entirety of the podcast. We can both take love out of this.

• 5:38Speaker 04

  Yes, we can. That's nice. Shall I read his question?

• 5:41Martin Lewis?

  Yeah.

• 5:42Speaker 04

  My wife and I have booked a holiday to Jordan in July and following your advice, bought insurance when we booked it in January.

• 5:48Martin Lewis?

  Quite right.

• 5:49Speaker 04

  Due to having chemo last year, which appears to have been successful with just six monthly monitoring going forward. That's good, congratulations.

• 5:56Martin Lewis?

  Very pleased you're out in remission, well done.

• 5:58Speaker 04

  He says, I couldn't get an annual travel policy as no one would offer it. So we bought a single trip policy, which cost us about £500. With the situation in the Middle East at the moment, we currently expect our holiday to be cancelled, but remain hopeful until the travel company cancels it. This shouldn't be a problem as the holiday, including flights, accommodation and tours are booked through a reputable company. But was wondering if we would be able to get some refund on our insurance policy as it's a large sum of money to lose. He says, many thanks.

• 6:27Martin Lewis?

  Okie dokes. Well, just before. When we get to can you get a refund on the insurance policy, some basics for anyone listening who's been affected by the Middle East crisis or your travel plans have been. The golden rule, as Richard quite rightly understands here, is do not cancel this voluntarily yourself. If you do, you lose all your rights. It just becomes that you've chosen not to go. And if you choose not to go, well, then you're not entitled to a refund and your travel insurance company won't cover you. If you are looking at what to do, well, if you get a cancellation and if they cancel on you, you should be entitled to a full refund. If you don't get a cancellation and you don't feel safe to go, then you need to look at the

• 7:08Martin Lewis?

  Foreign Office's travel advice. Now, there can be two types of, two different levels of advice that they're giving. The strongest one is no travel, if they are advising you against any travel in that country. The second strongest is against no essential travel. Now, different travel insurance policies have different attitudes. Some will only cover you for no travel, some will cover you for no essential travel as well. Some may say, I'm sorry, you don't get any coverage for wars, and may exclude you from any cover on the back of that. And it is simply a case of what your travel insurance policy says. So anybody who has a trip booked to one of those areas, I would be getting your travel insurance policy now. Get the document. My tip would be, take it, it's normally a PDF,

• 7:52Martin Lewis?

  put it into a ChatGPT or a Google Gemini or, you know, an Anthropic Claude. Put the document in there and then ask it questions about what you're entitled to, because these documents are long and turgid, and it's a lot easier. They do ask it to give you the exact paragraph, so you can double check that it hasn't hallucinated on the back end. And another thing people should be checking is what is the level of cancellation cover on your travel insurance policy? In other words, if the holiday is cancelled and you had ancillary costs, how much would they cover you up to? But now let's get to Richard's question because I think Richard knew all of that, but I do think that was important stuff to say. So, Richard, you're asking will you be able to get a refund on your insurance policy? Well, arguably you have had some benefit of

• 8:35Martin Lewis?

  that insurance policy, though you may not perceive it, because you've had the policy in place since January and if something had happened to you since January that had stopped you going, then this Hollott Travel Insurance Policy would have covered you in the meantime. So that is a benefit. It's really weird with insurance because of course insurance is the policy that we pay in the hopes that we won't have to use it. So the fact that you haven't used it or you haven't claimed on it doesn't mean you didn't get value from it because the value is in the protection, the value is not necessarily just in that you have to claim. Having said all that, if the holiday is cancelled and you're not going to go away, there are some companies who may give you a rebate on a portion of your travel insurance

• 9:20Martin Lewis?

  fees. So my big long answer, if I were to summarise it down, would be you can always ask.

• 9:30Speaker 04

  And that's it?

• 9:31Martin Lewis?

  And that's it. Yeah, I mean, there's no writing there. I mean, you can have a look in the travel insurance policy. The policy document might mention something on it, but I don't think they tend to. But I would just ask. Ask and cross your fingers.

• 9:45Martin Lewis?

  So are we going to a caller now?

• 9:47Speaker 04

  Yes, we've got Matt. He is in Devon and he is here. Hi, Matt.

• 9:53Speaker 03

  Hi, hi Sally Martin and Matt.

• 9:56Martin Lewis?

  Oh, Sally. You knew Sally was here because you listened last week and I said Sally would be here. Well done.

• 10:01Speaker 03

  I did listen to last week's podcast, yeah.

• 10:03Martin Lewis?

  And Sally got the first mention. That'll really annoy Matt. I love it.

• 10:06Speaker 04

  It has.

• 10:09Speaker 04

  But you've got a good name, Matt, so.

• 10:12Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, you've got a great name as well, Matt. I have to give that to you.

• 10:14Martin Lewis?

  Okay, get on with it, boys.

• 10:17Martin Lewis?

  Right, what was the question?

• 10:21Speaker 03

  Well, back last year, when I was up for renewal on my mobile phone contract, I was considering leaving Vodafone and had done all the things like asking for a pack code and then going on to the web chats. I negotiated a 50% discount off my bill.

• 10:37Martin Lewis?

  Add some round of applause, Matt. Add some round of applause.

• 10:39Speaker 03

  That was always referred to as a 50% discount.

• 10:42Martin Lewis?

  Yep.

• 10:42Speaker 03

  And is referred to on my bill with the exact words 50% discount. So prior to that discount, my bill was due to increase from £26 to £27.80, or 6.9%, in line with the stated pounds and pence increase. However, I've just got my bill for the forthcoming period, which includes the beginning of April. And my 50% discount has stuck at £13 off.

• 11:07Martin Lewis?

  I thought you were going there. So basically, you're saying you should also get a 50% discount of the £1.80 a month uplift, though it should only be an uplift of 90p rather than £1.80.

• 11:17Speaker 03

  That's what I feel would be in line with the spirit of the Ofcom rules, to be fair. And I realise this is quite a small and nerdy question, but I'm sure there are lots of savvy

• 11:28Martin Lewis?

  It is very nerdy. It's not about the money. This isn't about the money. This is about the principle, isn't it?

• 11:35Speaker 03

  Absolutely.

• 11:35Martin Lewis?

  Yes. So where have you got to it with them? Have you tried to tackle it? What are your thoughts?

• 11:42Speaker 03

  So I have tried to talk to them on web chat and they basically have taken the approach that the price increase is the price increase and the discount was only ever applied to the original price. And that is where I've got to. And I suppose my follow-up question is, is it worth going down the line or something along the lines of the Ombudsman to have a look into this?

• 12:05Martin Lewis?

  Okay. So I'm just going to recap for everyone to make sure everyone got it. You negotiated a 50% discount on your mobile bill. Under the firms must tell you in advance the pounds and pence increase that you're going to get, you assumed that you'd only be getting a 50% increase because it's a 50% discount on your bill, but they have increased it by the entire amount and not given you a discount on the uplift that you get each April.

• 12:29Speaker 03

  Correct.

• 12:30Martin Lewis?

  So first question, when you negotiated this, did you only do it over the phone or in writing? I know it's on your bill saying 50% discount. Where did we get to on that?

• 12:39Speaker 03

  It was on web chat where I did the negotiation last.

• 12:43Martin Lewis?

  And you don't have it saved on web chat?

• 12:46Speaker 03

  I don't have it saved anywhere.

• 12:48Martin Lewis?

  They may well do. Okay. Look, let's just go into practicals. What would I do? Obviously, there is no hard answer here, and clearly, for everybody listening, this is only 90p a month. So we're talking about a tenner in total, but we're going to deal with it on the principle rather than the metric. Because clearly, it's probably not worth the time that you're going to spend on it unless you're doing it as a principled stand. Fair?

• 13:12Speaker 03

  Hundred percent.

• 13:13Martin Lewis?

  Okay.

• 13:15Martin Lewis?

  Now, there's something very interesting that happens in telecoms, and I got told this by somebody senior at a telecoms firm, who told me never, never to say who he or she or it was. So I'm not even going to give away that they were human or not, but you can probably work out that they were. And what they said is, they have a special team for dealing with complaints if people are threatening to escalate to the ombudsman. Because if you go to the ombudsman, they have to pay a fee to the ombudsman when you make a complaint to the ombudsman. And therefore, they have a special team which is trying to forestall those complaints who tend to be better to deal with. So in the first instance, I would make a formal complaint back on web chat, or preferably in writing by email.

• 13:58Martin Lewis?

  I think that might even be a better way to go, saying, "You believe you are entitled to a 50% discount. That 50% discount has not been applied. Therefore, you think this is incorrect, and you would like to turn this into a formal complaint that they are overcharging you, and you would like a response within 28 days." Now, hopefully, if that goes to the right team, and they see that you're a difficult fellow, which is what you're effectively trying to do, for them, it is far cheaper for them to say, "Just give them the 50% discount on the £1.80", than it is for you to have to go on to the ombudsman and them to have to pay the fee. So my progressive step would be, next is make the formal complaint, but say that you're planning to go to the ombudsman if they won't sort it within the formal complaint. And my hope is that will do the business.

• 14:44Martin Lewis?

  How's that sound?

• 14:47Speaker 03

  No, thank you, Martin. That sounds entirely sensible. And yeah, as you say, I realise it's only 90p, but the 90p with cumulative cumulative impact next year would increase again.

• 14:58Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, absolutely. And you've got an agreement with the company. They gave you a price. Why shouldn't they stick to the price? So, and this is, this is our question. This is, you know, the pod. Let's be honest, this is a podcast that quite a lot of nerdy people like. So we're all with you, Matt. We're all with you. We want to know what happens as well. So you've got a promise to come back.

• 15:16Speaker 03

  I will let you know what happens.

• 15:19Martin Lewis?

  All right, mate.

• 15:20Speaker 03

  I will let you know what happens. And just as an aside, I think, given, given Sally's in today, and in, you know, doffing my cap to match Ollie on Five Live as well, an appropriate term today, I think, would be a Member of Sally's Parliament, or MSP.

• 15:32Martin Lewis?

  MSP. Okay. You, I tell you what, because that's not what we're going to be adopting properly as the name full term, but you can be an MSP today. You can go and call yourself an MSP on the way back.

• 15:44Speaker 03

  Excellent.

• 15:45Martin Lewis?

  All right. Lovely. Thank you for calling, Matt. Appreciate it.

• 15:48Speaker 03

  Thanks, all.

• 15:49Martin Lewis?

  Cheers.

• 15:50Speaker 03

  Bye bye.

• 15:51Speaker 04

  It's Matt recording this after we've finished the podcast. As this is a BBC podcast, we should get Vodafone's side on this. So I put the question to them, and this is what they said. Any price changes are made with a commitment to transparency and are in line with Ofcom's guidelines, including where discounts have been applied. We encourage customers to contact our customer care channels for support with contract queries or issues.

• 16:13Martin Lewis?

  On the back of standing up for the principle of when is a discount a discount? Where are we going afterwards? Where in our journey, our fiscal journey, are we wondering next, Matthew?

• 16:26Speaker 04

  I thought it would be nice to do a success now.

• 16:27Martin Lewis?

  Cool.

• 16:28Speaker 04

  So this is off the back of Robert, who we had on a few months ago with his success of being debt free.

• 16:34Martin Lewis?

  Oh, yeah, that his was amazing. It was what does he do now he's debt free? He was so into budgeting and restraining his finances of all of those years to get himself out of crisis debt. It was a very moving story. Started to be debt free, and the success is on the back of that. Let me hear.

• 16:47Speaker 04

  Yes. So loads of people got in touch with their stories. One that I liked was from Carly. So she emailed it in. She said, hi, team. Just listened to Monday's podcast and the last caller in his story. This is me. I'm mid 30s and I've never not been in debt. My childhood was spent seeing my family just use credit to buy whatever they want and then have to make some heartbreaking decisions later in life. My grandparents split as one had remortgaged the house to the hilt, leaving them homeless in their 80s. This week, I contacted Step Change and set up a debt management plan. I'm over £60,000 in debt. I reached the point where I could no longer refinance and the interest was as much as the multiple repayments. I listened to the podcast and cried with relief that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

• 17:32Speaker 04

  Thank you for having this caller on. I've never, ever been taught or thought about seeking budgeting advice or education. I feel silly for only just starting to think about it now at the age of 35, but appreciate him and you so much. I can't wait till my debt-free day is in sight, but I know it's a long way away, seven years away, but at least it's realistic now.

• 17:56Martin Lewis?

  Oh, Carly, thank you so much for getting in touch. I think I'm moved by it. I'm sure Robert will be listening and he will be moved by it too. And it's so important that you've taken, like anything else in, in life where you're having difficulties, taking that first step is the most important. You're now dealing with it and you've now got a plan. And I, I think back to my early days when I used to do money makeover television programmes and I'd go into someone's house who had debt. And one of the things, no one who, who is in a lot of debt, they never add it up. They never want to know what the total figure is. They, they actually forget, often forget some of the debts they've got. And I would go in and I would compile it all and I would say, okay, we've now got

• 18:38Martin Lewis?

  the figure, in your case, it's £60,000 worth of debt. And you would see people's faces go white and you would see them looking scared and intimidated and they'd go, oh gosh, it's so much worse than I thought. And what I would always say at that point and mean at that point was, it's not. The debt was always there. All we've done is work out exactly what your debts are so that we can start to deal with it. This isn't the bottom point. The bottom point was yesterday, when you weren't tackling it, when we weren't thinking about how do we get you out of it. Today, now that we're starting, now that we actually know what the debt is, the total, this isn't the bottom point.

• 19:22Martin Lewis?

  This is the start of the journey out of your debt. And that's exactly the sentiment that Carly had, and the right sentiment that Carly had in her email. Wonderful. For anyone struggling with debt, you know, and we're talking, struggling to meet your minimum repayments, can't sleep because of your debts, you've got more than a year's after-tax salary in unsecured credit card or loan type of debt, any of those, if you're in that, then go and get yourself non-profit debt counselling help. Step Change, have you heard there? Citizens Advice Bureau, National Debt Line, Christians Against Poverty, who do emotional counselling too. And you will get to that point where you can sleep.

• 20:03Martin Lewis?

  Matt, I don't know if it's possible, but if you can, if I remember right, Robert, who was at the end of his debt journey, he was out of debt, he had a brilliant summary to people at the end. Could you play that here? Because I think this would be a good way to end it.

• 20:16Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 20:17Speaker 05

  The main thing I'd like to take out of this call is for anybody else listening who finds himself in that situation to just make the leap and make the call. I found that there had been lots of interactions with Step Change, they've been incredibly helpful, never judge you, they're just there to help, they sorted everything out for me, made a plan. That plan has varied over the five years as things have gone up and down in life. And just to go out and do it, I understand that it's scary, I've been there with my head in the sand, that doesn't work. And just go out and do it, because every day that passes is a day that you could be closer to your debt-free day.

• 20:55Martin Lewis?

  Are you sitting there thinking, oh, I know what I wanted to ask him? Well, this is your opportunity. If you've got a question, then just send them in to [email protected]. And please do start them, Dear Martin. No, Dear Matt. Dear Martin. Dear Matt.

• 21:14Martin Lewis?

  So, Matt, another caller? Another caller, you are correct. I know, I'm, again, in my wonderful channeling of literally knowing what the format of my own podcast is. It's Gary in Burgess Hill. Hi, Gary.

• 21:28Speaker 06

  Good afternoon, everybody.

• 21:29Martin Lewis?

  Hi, Gary. Nice to hear from you. What is your question?

• 21:33Speaker 06

  It's a question about paying your credit card bill when you cannot pay it off in full.

• 21:38Martin Lewis?

  In full! I'm only doing it once, that's all I'm getting.

• 21:40Speaker 06

  Thank you. So, Martin, I understand that if you don't clear your debt in full, you will be charged interest on the whole balance the next month. So, as an example, if you have an outstanding balance of a thousand pounds and you pay 999 of that, you'll be charged interest on the whole thousand and not the pound you still owe.

• 21:59Martin Lewis?

  Correct. Or generally, you can be, there are slightly different ways some card systems can work it out.

• 22:03Speaker 06

  And you're not going to clear your balance. What is the point of paying anything other than the minimum payment?

• 22:08Martin Lewis?

  Okay.

• 22:10Speaker 06

  Because as far as I can see,

• 22:12Martin Lewis?

  Yeah.

• 22:12Speaker 06

  you might pay the minimum payment and put any of the remaining money into a savings account and you can earn interest on it. Because you're going to be charged the interest on the thousand pound anyway.

• 22:25Martin Lewis?

  Let's just take this back a step. The reason I have the "in full" as a catchphrase is to differentiate that there are two different types of usage for a credit card. There is effectively a credit card when you're trying to get transaction benefits that could be cash back or rewards or cheap spending abroad or Section 75 protection.

• 22:49Martin Lewis?

  And then there's a credit card when you're using it to borrow. Uh, well, now it could be, you know, shifting debt to it, or it could be new borrowing, which you of course need to be really careful about. And the reason I developed the in full, I've done two. The reason I developed that is to be absolutely plain to people that if you're getting a rewards or a transactional credit card, when you're getting a benefit from it, you must only do it if you pay it off in full, preferably by direct debit, so there's no risk of you missing it at the end of each month, so that there is no interest. Because otherwise, the interest on the card dwarfs any of the transactional gains. It dwarfs the, the, the saving you make on cheap exchange rates abroad.

• 23:33Martin Lewis?

  It would dwarfs any of the cash back that you get on it. And that's the reason for this really blunt in full, because you have to decide when you get a card, which is it? Am I looking to borrow? Well, if you are, you're not paying off in full. Or am I looking to get transactional benefits or rewards? In which case you have to pay it off in full, or there's no point, because those rewards are nowhere close to the interest. So that's, that's the first blunt point. So your, your question to me by definition is about borrowing. Do you see what I mean? You're, you're really talking about a card you're using for borrowing. Is that fair?

• 24:09Speaker 06

  Yes, I agree. Yes, that's fine. Yes.

• 24:11Martin Lewis?

  In which case I don't have the in full. The in full is only for the other type of cards. It's only, and I, I promise I'm really consistent the way I say it. I, if I'm talking about getting a cheap 0% balance transfer card, you won't ever hear me say in full, because the whole definition is you're looking to do it cheaply. In which case, my answer is if you're looking to borrow, why have you got a card that's charging you interest? You shouldn't have a card that's charging you interest. You should be trying to get a card that is at 0%. And if not, in general, it's not about a month by month transaction. You should be looking at trying to clear as much as you can off in the totality. So while, while there is, and you forgive me, I'm, I'm not trying to knock your question.

• 24:53Martin Lewis?

  But while there is, there is logic in a sort of theoretical, on the paper way of asking the question. For me, cards are one of two types. They're either in full cards or they're not in full cards. If they're not in full cards, you want to try and clear the debt. Either get it at 0% debt and if it's not at 0%, clear it as quickly as possible because it's costing you interest. And you won't be doing it on a month by month basis. So I often talk about stoozing, which is where you have a debt card at 0% and you put that money in high interest savings. You're right if you were to talk about, but three weeks' interest in a savings account on a thousand pounds is throuppence-haening. And I just prefer, in general, because credit cards are so risky. If you have got debt in a credit card, tramp it off as quickly as you can and get the money into clearing the debt off. Does that make sense?

• 25:39Speaker 06

  It does because I've worked out, obviously, as you said, a thousand pounds is three or four pounds a month in interest on a 4% in a savings account. But I was just thinking, you know, if you're going to be charged the interest anyway, you might as well earn your four pound back.

• 25:55Martin Lewis?

  Here's my argument with you, Gary, in a nice way. You're right, but anybody who isn't able to clear their debts off and has got a high interest debt on their credit card. It's not worth playing those games. The danger of the cost building up on the credit card is too much. And while you could start playing the, I'm going to move money for three weeks and move it off and then pay it off at the end. I think you'd just be better to try and clear off the credit card. And it is, it's really interesting you saying it because you're right. But I also, from my perspective as someone, I'm getting into theory now. But one of the interesting things about my job is lots of people tell me they're really good at saving money. But my job isn't saving myself money, which is what other people are talking about. My job is saving other people money.

• 26:37Martin Lewis?

  And therefore, to try and come up with clear delineations of barriers of ways to behave. And one of the most dangerous things out there are credit cards because the whole point of a credit card is they want to keep you perpetually in debt. You have an open-ended borrowing facility and you can keep borrowing more and more on it. So I try and keep clear lines of either it's a card that you're using just to spend on or it's a card that you're using to borrow on. If it's a card that you're using to borrow on, then it's not at 0%. Just try and clear it as quickly as possible because otherwise it's really dangerous. But in within the short technical brackets, you are right. But you forgive me, I won't be saying it in future.

• 27:13Martin Lewis?

  I hope you understand what I'm trying to say. It's sort of, it's difficult to get it from my head out.

• 27:18Speaker 06

  I do understand. Hopefully, well, you obviously understood my question.

• 27:21Martin Lewis?

  I do.

• 27:21Speaker 06

  And, um, yeah, it does make sense.

• 27:24Martin Lewis?

  Yeah.

• 27:24Speaker 06

  Thank you very much, Martin.

• 27:25Martin Lewis?

  Thank you very much. Thank you. And, yeah, and so, yes, you could do it. But I just say for a second, get rid of expensive credit card debt. It's because it's expensive. Thank you so much, Gary. And I love that. That's what Question Time is all about. Being able to go into something into almost the, the underlying philosophy of why things are dumb, rather than just the practicals that I can't really do in any of my other outlets. So thank you for giving me the opportunity, Gary. I really appreciate it.

• 27:49Speaker 06

  Thanks very much, Martin.

• 27:50Martin Lewis?

  Bye bye.

• 27:52Martin Lewis?

  Okay, curator of questions, let's do a question. It's what you're here for. It's why you've got questions.

• 27:56Speaker 04

  Literally the only reason I'm here.

• 27:58Martin Lewis?

  And you produce it.

• 27:59Speaker 04

  Oh, and I produce it as well.

• 28:00Martin Lewis?

  That's the reason you're here, but it's not the reason you stay afterwards and do all your wonderful tweaks and edits to make us both sound really cool.

• 28:06Speaker 04

  But the reason I'm speaking to you now is to ask a question.

• 28:08Martin Lewis?

  Correct.

• 28:09Speaker 04

  So this is from Belena. The via my, it is to Martin Liz podcast at bbc.co.uk. Dear Martin and Matt, my daughter purchased an OLED TV for £1,299 on the 13th of December 2019. Last December, the television developed horizontal lines across the screen. She contacted the retailer on the 12th of December 2025.

• 28:30Martin Lewis?

  I'm hoping it's just not the horizontal lines aren't just that she's watching my show and I've aged and got wrinkles. I'm hoping that's no, it's just a close up shot and I've got wrinkles on my face. And then she's, they're like, anyway, carry on.

• 28:41Speaker 04

  Um, on the 12th of December, she contacted the retailer to arrange a collection for assessment at their repair centre. The retailer's since advised that the TV is beyond economical repair and has offered a partial refund of £130. So my question is, how does this outcome align with your sad fart criteria? Is it fair for the retailer to only offer £130 in these circumstances?

• 29:06Martin Lewis?

  Fascinating question. So I think many people will be surprised that as your telly is nearly, what is it, nearly six years old, you've been offered anything at all when it goes faulty. Costs thirteen hundred quid, you've been offered 10% of its value. So let's just go into it. What are the sad fart rules for those who don't know? Most Question Time listeners will know, but let's do it anyway. When you buy something, it must be of satisfactory quality as described. That's your sad. Fit for purpose and last a reasonable length of time. That's your fart. So sad fart. Reasonable length of time is the key here. I always describe it by talking about, you know, you bought a £1,200 mobile phone and it stops working even though you've not done

• 29:48Martin Lewis?

  anything wrong after 13 months. Has it lasted a reasonable length of time? Most people would say no. You bought a 20p plastic whistle and it stops working after 13 months. Would most people say it's lasted a reasonable length of time? Yes, most people would. And reasonable is just that it has a subjective definition of what, you know, what they used to say in the old days, that the man on the clapamombus, that's when it was a man on the clapamombus and there was a clapamombus. That was the original legal definition. You know, that's how would they describe it? What would the man on the clapamombus say? But I move on. So it's what a reasonable person would say was reasonable. So where are we here? When you buy something, you have a right to a full refund

• 30:27Martin Lewis?

  if you return it within 30 days. After that, if the proof is that the item was faulty when you bought it, and faulty when you bought it includes that it was not built in a way to last a reasonable length of time, which is how a fault that develops later can be a fault when you bought it, because, so if you see what I mean, because it didn't come from the beginning, then you are entitled to a repair, a like-for-like replacement, or a partial refund or price reduction.

• 30:56Martin Lewis?

  So now we've established that everybody understands what the sad fart rules are. These are your statutory consumer rights and you understand what a reasonable length of time is, we can start to move into more detail on this question. This £1,300 OLED TV that's lasted not quite six years yet. So when you take an item back within the first 30 days, you are entitled to a full refund if it was faulty at the point at which you bought it. Faulty includes was not built in a way that it lasts a reasonable length of time. After the 30 days, then the store can give you a repair, a like-for-like replacement, or a partial refund or price reduction. And clearly, they're giving you a partial refund.

• 31:41Martin Lewis?

  So the question here, I think it really stems down to what do we think a reasonable lifespan of an expensive OLED TV is? If the lifespan is five or six years, then you're not entitled to anything. If it's 10 or 15 years, then you're entitled to a rather big sum. So we're getting down to a sort of attitudinal question here of how long you think it should last. You could only ultimately test this in court and it would be done based on reasonable definitions, although you could put arguments of how long a typical lifespan would be. You're not going to do any of that. You're not going to go to court with this. It's just, it's not worth your time, I suspect. So in my view, I would expect an OLED TV to last six, seven, eight years. So I think this is on the short side of it breaking.

• 32:25Martin Lewis?

  I think they are right to offer you a partial refund. I think the partial refund they're offering you, for me, because you've had five, let's say you've had five years of seven years usage, so we could say that you get a two-seventh refund of the 1,200 quid. So I think that 130 is a little bit on the tight side. I would be quite happy if I were you to get 250. I think to push it to 250 would work reasonably well. So you might want to go back and counter offer them. But if you're honestly asking me, is this within the sad fart rules? Yes. What they've done is absolutely within the sad fart rules. This is just a question of how much they're giving you. So it becomes a negotiation.

• 33:06Martin Lewis?

  So Matt, we are at the end of the show. Normally we do a funny here, but we are in our, what are we going to call our contributors? Our people who get their question read out or call in into the programme. Lots of suggestions have come in. We need to judge it. I've got, as you've already heard, the wonderful Sally is sitting in, as Rosie is off this week, Sally is sitting in to help me out, to be my live fact checker in case words come out of my mouth that are not the ones to my brain and I say something wrong and she's there to be the sort of financial ears. I'm not sure that's the nicest thing I've ever...

• 33:39Speaker 04

  Financial ears.

• 33:40Martin Lewis?

  You're the financial ears, Sally. Well, she's nodding, she's nodding. I'm doing all right. So Sally will also, I will be looking at Sally for her thoughts on some of your suggestions as well. Tell us what you've got, Matt.

• 33:50Speaker 04

  Okay, so we've had money maximisers from Alastair. Paul says, "Askin Martin", so he says he's just discovered the podcast.

• 33:59Martin Lewis?

  I've just got it.

• 33:59Speaker 04

  I don't get it, so he says...

• 34:01Martin Lewis?

  Aston Martin.

• 34:02Speaker 04

  Ahhh.

• 34:07Martin Lewis?

  You know.

• 34:07Speaker 04

  Yep, I get it. That was a really good impression.

• 34:09Martin Lewis?

  Thank you very much.

• 34:10Speaker 04

  Steve says, "Esquires, extremely savvy questioners."

• 34:18Martin Lewis?

  Do you know, I didn't like it when you first said it, but "Esquires, extremely savvy questioners".

• 34:26Speaker 04

  And he says, "It gives everyone an element of status and prestige like me."

• 34:30Martin Lewis?

  I'm actually going to put that, can you put that near the top of the spreadsheet?

• 34:34Speaker 04

  I can.

• 34:35Martin Lewis?

  I'm, Sally, Sally's nodding.

• 34:39Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 34:39Martin Lewis?

  Sally's nodding. Matt?

• 34:41Speaker 04

  Yeah?

• 34:42Martin Lewis?

  And also, Matt, because of the whole you and Simon thing, it is sort of based off me calling you Professor Dr. Matthew Esquire.

• 34:51Speaker 04

  And I do like that.

• 34:53Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, you know.

• 34:53Speaker 04

  It's stroking my ego slightly.

• 34:57Martin Lewis?

  Next.

• 34:58Speaker 04

  Alan says smarties because people listen to you regularly and very bright people.

• 35:03Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, and tasty.

• 35:05Speaker 04

  And tasty.

• 35:05Martin Lewis?

  And tasty and come in small tubular packs.

• 35:07Speaker 04

  And other sweets are available.

• 35:09Martin Lewis?

  They are, but they're not smarties.

• 35:11Speaker 04

  They're not.

• 35:11Martin Lewis?

  I'm not doing those. We're a podcast now. We're not on the radio.

• 35:15Speaker 04

  Still on the BBC.

• 35:16Martin Lewis?

  We don't actually have the same rules, do we?

• 35:18Speaker 04

  I think we do.

• 35:19Martin Lewis?

  Oh, do we? Well, you do.

• 35:20Speaker 04

  Well, I do.

• 35:21Martin Lewis?

  You do. You are bound by BBC's producers' guideline.

• 35:23Speaker 04

  You don't follow any rules.

• 35:24Martin Lewis?

  I am this wild card.

• 35:26Speaker 04

  And finally Barry says MLK C's for Martin Lewis, Casey, content curators. Obviously we have to spell it with a K, he says.

• 35:36Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, but that's just you speak. You can spell it with a K if you're doing you speak.

• 35:40Speaker 04

  True.

• 35:40Martin Lewis?

  MLK C's.

• 35:42Speaker 04

  Martin Lewis, content curators.

• 35:46Martin Lewis?

  Content curators.

• 35:48Speaker 04

  KC.

• 35:48Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, I quite like that.

• 35:49Speaker 04

  MLKC.

• 35:51Martin Lewis?

  I quite like that, but I need to be honest, Sally pulled a face.

• 35:55Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 35:55Martin Lewis?

  She sort of, the side of her, the left side of her lip tweaked upwards in a sort of like, you know how Elvis does, uh huh, but in, but in a bad way.

• 36:04Speaker 04

  Not in that, yeah.

• 36:05Martin Lewis?

  Not in the uh huh, but more in a uh uh uh.

• 36:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:07Martin Lewis?

  Yeah. So Sally, Sally, whose suggestion was that?

• 36:11Speaker 04

  That was from Barry.

• 36:13Martin Lewis?

  Barry, I liked it. Sally, Sally's your problem, Barry. Sally is your problem.

• 36:19Speaker 04

  Sally doesn't like Barry's suggestion.

• 36:20Martin Lewis?

  Yeah, yeah. Luckily you don't know what Sally looks like, so you can't be walking past her in the street and go, oi, Sally, you did my suggestion, Dan. I hate you. Sally's now looking really scared.

• 36:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:33Martin Lewis?

  It's not going to happen, Sally. Barry is a nice man. It's not going to happen. Nobody really minds that much.

• 36:37Speaker 04

  No.

• 36:38Martin Lewis?

  Right, so Matt.

• 36:39Speaker 04

  Right.

• 36:39Martin Lewis?

  Okay, so here's, what do we do? I need the spreadsheet list from you. We're off for the next couple of weeks. I shall mull this.

• 36:45Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 36:46Martin Lewis?

  And, and we should, I might put it out to polling. I haven't decided yet.

• 36:50Speaker 04

  Ah, so shall we whittle it down?

• 36:52Martin Lewis?

  We need to whittle it down.

• 36:54Speaker 04

  Put it out to the audience and see what they think.

• 36:56Martin Lewis?

  Yes, possibly. We need to think how we do that. Cause if I put it on social media, it won't be our QT listeners and they won't get the sensibilities of QT. Maybe we have to whittle, maybe when we come back next time, we will do a poll and we'll ask people that they just to choose and just get in touch and tell us which one they prefer.

• 37:13Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 37:14Martin Lewis?

  Okay.

• 37:14Speaker 04

  Sounds good.

• 37:15Martin Lewis?

  That's what we're doing. So sorry, you're sitting, listening to that going, why are they discussing the mechanics of this on the, because we know what you're like, QT listeners. We know you're on the in, like being on the inside, not on the outside. We know you like breaking the fourth wall. We know you enjoy that conversation. I even know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go there. I even know that there were some of you listening to that at that point while we were having a bureaucratic administrative, how are we gonna do this conversation? Some of you were nodding going, yeah, that seems a sensible thing for me. And you were agreeing with us because that is what our QT listeners are all about. So, um, thank you very much for listening. I'm stopping there. Bye bye.

• 37:58Martin Lewis?

  That's it for this week's Question Time. Don't forget to subscribe so you know when we release a new episode. We put out a new Question Time episode each Monday alongside the podcast with Adrian on Thursdays. Aren't you lucky? Two doses of money-saving tips and tricks a week. Do ensure you send in your questions on anything you like, within reason. Just email [email protected] and address them Dear Martin.

• 38:24Speaker 04

  Dear Matt.

• 38:24Martin Lewis?

  Dear Martin.

• 38:26Speaker 04

  Dear Matt.

• 38:27Martin Lewis?

  We're getting going up. We should be softening it off or it's gonna sound wrong.

• 38:31Speaker 04

  Or we're having a go at each other.

• 38:33Martin Lewis?

  Dear Martin.

• 38:34Speaker 04

  Dear Matt.

• 38:35Martin Lewis?

  Bye bye.

• 39:31Speaker 01

  Welcome to The Haunted Library.

• 39:35Speaker 01

  Join me, Colin Morgan, as I read Frankenstein by Mary Shelley. A story of science and ambition, loneliness and longing, and what it truly means to be human.

• 39:51Speaker 01

  Listen to The Haunted Library wherever you get your podcasts, or find us on YouTube.