Joy 101: Howie Mandel

"I had OCD. I carried rubber surgical gloves with me all the time because if I was out in public, I didn't want to touch anything… And I just took the rubber glove, and I don't know why, and then I just pulled it over my head." —Howie Mandel on the origin of his classic comedic bit Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is Presented by CVS. Shop your local CVS, right around the corner. Experience the full conversation on the "Joy 101 podcast with Hoda Kotb" wherever you listen to podcasts. For more information, please visit us at www.joy101.com/podcast https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.joy101.com%2Fpodcast&data=05%7C02%7CBrianBurton%40iheartmedia.com%7Cb5e3508ee14449bec64908deffcf0b1a%7C122a527e5b714eba878d9810b495b9e3%7C0%7C0%7C639229461896778914%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=KOgW6A%2FqG0YzxAxXsSPJZ%2Fjiyk76j7cv0JI%2FuTBlH9w%3D&reserved=0 See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:10Hoda Kotb?

  Hey guys, I'm Hoda. Welcome to the Joy 101 Podcast. So I've been thinking a lot about this idea. So two people can live in the exact same circumstance, exactly the same, same house, same number of kids, same job, same whatever. And one person will be totally joyful and one person will be finding out all the things that are wrong and crummy. And so I did this interview a while back with Shirley Ralph. So Shirley Ralph is the woman from Abbott Elementary who I adore. She's amazing. And she won her first Emmy at like 65 years old and got her star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame a couple of years later. So I was interviewing her and I was talking to her and I said, she was explaining

• 0:55Hoda Kotb?

  this story about how when she was a young actress, Robert De Niro said something with her and it stuck. And I was like, oh, what did he say? And he goes, well, he came up to me and he said, Shirley Ralph, you are a magnificent actress. It's too bad they don't have roles for black women, you know, what a shame. And I was like, oh God, that is awful. My gosh, how, and she goes, what do you mean? And I said, well, you know, what Robert De Niro said. And she said, Hoda, Robert De Niro said, I was a magnificent actress. Period. Full stop. That's where she saw the sentence. Robert De Niro said, I was a magnificent

• 1:35Hoda Kotb?

  actress. She took that part of the sentence and ran with that in her career. Someone else might have taken the full sentence and said, oh, well, terrible. I'm not going to get any opportunities. Horrible. I'm not going to get what I want. She decided not to. She saw the world through that lens. So what happened in her life? In her 60s, she gets the Emmy. She gets the star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame and she's still going. And when Shirley Ralph walks in a room, it lights up. It's literally as if the lights go on brighter. She chose to look at the world through a certain lens. So it got me thinking about like, where is joy? Well, joy is something you have to search

• 2:19Hoda Kotb?

  for sometimes. It's not always right in front of you. You have to decide. And that brings me to my next guest, who is Howie Mandel. So Howie Mandel is a person who has had all kinds of beautiful successes in life and has also had his share of struggles. His successes are so many. I mean, we know him as a comedian. We know him as a judge on AGT and he's done, he's got a podcast. He's got a number of great things. And he's also wrestled with his demons, as he calls them. He's been diagnosed with OCD and with ADHD and he struggles

• 2:56Hoda Kotb?

  with a lot of things. And he's a guy who has to seek joy. He has to search it out. It doesn't come naturally to him. It's something that he has to decide daily to do. And so I thought, wouldn't that be interesting? Why don't we talk to Howie Mandel on this Joy 101 Podcast and find out about the art of finding joy, sometimes in the darkness, sometimes when joy doesn't seem apparent. It's not there with a party hat on and streamers. It's something you have to go seek out. So I hope you enjoy this conversation with Howie Mandel.

• 3:39Speaker 01

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.

• 3:43Hoda Kotb?

  Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is presented by CVS. I've realized that joy doesn't always come from those big moments. Sometimes you find it on the most ordinary day. I'll pop into a CVS for toothpaste or paper towels and it never seems to be just a quick errant. Maybe I'll grab a delicious Well Market Trail Mix or wander over to the Joy Word Collection. That's part of the fun. So the next time you're checking something off your to do list, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You might go in for one thing and leave with a little more joy. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Every purchase is a financial decision. So it's worth asking, what am I getting out

• 4:24Hoda Kotb?

  of this? If you're using the Chase Freedom Flex Card, you can maximize your cash back on things you need. More ways to earn, more ways to get rewarded. Sign up for the Chase Freedom Flex Card. Learn more at chase.com/getflex. This is a paid collaboration with Chase Freedom Flex. Cards issued by JP Morgan Chase Bank, NA Member FDIC. Subject to credit approval. Offer subject to change. Terms apply.

• 4:50Speaker 02

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• 5:19Speaker 03

  I'm Melissa Jelton, host of the What Happened to Her podcast. We're kicking off the season with the Sandra Birchmore story, a case the police wrote off as a suicide in a snowstorm. Her family never bought it and the man they suspected wore a badge.

• 5:34Speaker 04

  You never know who that devil is because he's wearing a disguise. Sometimes it's a police uniform.

• 5:39Speaker 03

  And you can get access to all episodes 100% ad free with an iHeart True Crime Plus subscription exclusively on Apple Podcasts, available only to iHeart True Crime Plus subscribers. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search for iHeart True Crime Plus and subscribe today.

• 5:58Hoda Kotb?

  How are we, honey?

• 5:59Speaker 05

  Thrilled to be here. I'm thrilled to see your smiling face.

• 6:03Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, I'm so happy to see you.

• 6:06Speaker 05

  I feel like a lucky guy.

• 6:07Hoda Kotb?

  Well, you are a lucky guy, Howie. First of all, I mean, I feel like every time I look at you, I remember the days of Kathie Lee, the days of Jenna, Savannah, us having these sit down talks. So I'm happy to be with you. So just today, since every day's different in our lives, how are we doing on this particular day? How are we?

• 6:28Speaker 05

  I'm doing good. I'm doing good. I take every moment and try to absorb everything that a moment has to offer. And I live now, not day by day, moment by moment. You know, I'm cognizant of, you know, how, I would never have guessed and I would have never dreamed that at this age and at this time in my life, I would be doing what I'm doing and enjoying what I'm doing and having the gifts that I have. And kind of the older

• 7:10Speaker 05

  I get, the more perspective we get, right? So I'm just, I do try to suck joy out of every moment.

• 7:22Hoda Kotb?

  I love it. You know, it's so funny. I love that phrase, like life gets greater later. And I turned 61, I'm about to turn 62 in August. And it's so interesting, like how life rolls out because this chapter, this time to be able, because I feel that way. I mean, I've got a one kid who's nine, one kid who's seven, I'm starting this new thing. And who knew that all these cool chapters were going to come in this season? So in this season for you, I mean, I can see you've got a podcast. I see the background there. You've got a ton of stuff going. What's the brightest light for you right now, Howie?

• 8:02Speaker 05

  Well, if you, if you look at the background, I do this podcast, but the lady that is in the picture with me is my daughter.

• 8:09Hoda Kotb?

  Yes.

• 8:10Speaker 05

  And my kids and my grandkids are the, are the bright light in my life. And you know, we, I was just, before I got on the air, you know, there's always stuff happening in people's lives and not great stuff. I don't think there's anybody alive that at some point, before or after they talk to you, something not great is happening. But it's all about navigation and how, depending on where you are in your life, hopefully you're figuring out how to steer and, and make the best and navigate your life. And you know, you're 61, you're still a baby. You know, I'm in my 70s now. So it's, and

• 8:53Speaker 05

  you become, in each chapter that you enter, time becomes more, you become more cognizant of time, right? You know, when you're in, when you're a teenager, like it doesn't, time doesn't even exist. So, and I think that the currency now in my life, you know, when you're young, your currency is you're chasing a career, you're chasing money, you're chasing however you believe you should look, you know? And then as you get older, you realize that the value is, is moments. And so as you receive or you experience each

• 9:36Speaker 05

  moment, you try to make that moment worth more than you probably used to.

• 9:45Hoda Kotb?

  You know what's cool? I mean, I feel like you've spent your, when you were like a little kid, I just imagine you being this funny kid. And I, who was the first person who, who told you you were funny, Howie?

• 9:59Speaker 05

  Oh, that was really, you know, I have a marked date on that and that's April 17th, 1970s, April 19, 1977. I was not thought of as a funny kid. I was miserable as a child. I was, and I come from an incredibly supportive, loving family who supported me. I, and I've talked about this publicly many times, but you know, I wasn't diagnosed until I was in my 40s and I was, you know, I suffer from depression and anxiety and I was diagnosed with OCD and ADHD and I was asked to leave school.

• 10:43Speaker 05

  Laughter was my medicine. I didn't know that I wasn't trying, I tried to make myself laugh. And so on April 19, 1977, somebody dared me to get up at a comedy club. And I thought, because that's, you know, I went to see stand-up comedy for the first time live in Toronto, Canada. And I, I don't say no to anything. I'm always afraid of, I have FOMO, fear of missing out. So I'll say, okay. And I thought the joke was, I'm not a comedian. I don't know how to do stand-up comedy. I have no aspiration to be in show business or do stand-up comedy. And, you know, I was kind of a pariah.

• 11:28Speaker 05

  I was, you know, in high school, I was four foot 10, I weighed 88 pounds, you know, girls didn't like me. I was outrageous because I was impulsive and I would do these crazy things, which are funny stories now, but I don't have a GED and they got me thrown out of school. And as a teenager, if people want to fit in, I didn't fit in. I was talked about, pointed at, I got attention. Not the right kind of attention. So when I got up on stage, I thought the joke was that they were going to say, ladies and gentlemen, Howie Mandel, and people applaud, just because they applaud when you get up on stage, when you're introduced, that's just what you do.

• 12:11Speaker 05

  I don't know what you're applauding for, somebody showing up. So, and then I was standing there and I was standing there in the, in the spotlight and then terror, terror rose up because I realized people were sitting there looking at me, who I didn't know, all these strangers and smoke was wafting, you could smoke in that time. And then I realized, oh, I, I have nothing.

• 12:33Hoda Kotb?

  Nothing?

• 12:34Speaker 05

  No, I have nothing to offer. I just thought it would be funny to just get introduced.

• 12:40Hoda Kotb?

  To be there?

• 12:41Speaker 05

  To just be there, without any thought, any, nothing planned. And, and if you look at videotapes of me from the late 70s and early 80s of my act, it's just terror. So I, you know, I started going, okay, okay, all right, okay, all right, okay. Oh, and they started giggling at my just terror and I went, and, and I said ridiculous things and I put my hands in my pocket and I told you, I had OCD, I didn't know what it was, but I carried rubber surgical gloves with me all the time because if I was out in public, I knew if I had to use a public restroom, I didn't want to touch anything. But I put hands in my pocket and I had a rubber glove and, and I did, I go, okay, okay.

• 13:25Speaker 05

  And I just took the rubber glove and I don't know why, and then I just pulled it over my head and, and I held it and I started breathing and the fingers were going up and the audience was roaring.

• 13:34Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, that's funny.

• 13:35Speaker 05

  And I popped it off, I blew it up and it popped off and the audience applauded and I went, good night. And the guy said, Mark Breslin, who owned the club Yuck Yucks in Toronto, said, you gotta come back tomorrow. And I said, do, for what? He goes, do it again.

• 13:50Hoda Kotb?

  Do it again.

• 13:51Speaker 05

  And, and that's the first time I ever, and in my career, I chased that moment again. That was like the first time, it was like this warm blanket of 200 people who I don't know. And usually strangers couldn't stand having me around. I was just this little annoying, you know, you just want to swat me away. 100 strangers who were laughing.

• 14:18Hoda Kotb?

  Liked you, yeah.

• 14:19Speaker 05

  They liked you. I didn't even understand why they liked me and I didn't understand it was this cohesive, and when people are, laughter releases an endorphin, you know, and it was just warm kind of, it was like all these people that I did, I've never met, never met again, never saw again, just hugging me and I chased that moment every day of my life. And, and that is, you know, people come up to you and me now and they'll say, you know, do you have any advice, I'm a young person, on making it? And my, that is the moment that I made it. You know, that is, it's not about notoriety or fame or money.

• 15:01Speaker 05

  It's about finding something that just gives you such joy. That's my light in my life. And, and even if I was, it doesn't matter what I was, if I was a server someplace and I could find a place once a week to stand on stage and try to capture that, that's my joy. And even now, as I speak to you, regardless of anything else I do, or along with everything else I do, every single night, I drop in, or at least three, four times a week, I drop in on comedy clubs, even sometimes unannounced, or after I do concerts someplace, I'll find out if there's an open club, I wander in and try to get that feeling again. That's my point.

• 15:42Hoda Kotb?

  Let's talk about that moment because, I mean, you talked about when you're a kid and like there was no, you had, people didn't love you in school, you were in depression and all that kind of stuff. So you have this moment of euphoria, which is like, wow, people do like me, I'm this, you know, I want to be this guy. So how did you like capture that? So you go back and do it a couple of more times, but how did you take that moment, that moment of joy, that moment of like, wow, which had been elusive to you and turn it into something that was going to go beyond that day?

• 16:18Speaker 05

  I had never, and I, so after that day, I showed up at Yuck Yucks as often as I could and I was, and with, again, still no aspiration of being in the business and making this a career. I just wanted to do that, you know, I was in the 70s, the disco era was big, I wasn't part of that, I don't dance or drink and I didn't play sports and I couldn't get a, like a basketball game together at the Y, I had nothing and I don't gamble. So this became my outlet for just, just to relax, you know? So I, every night I would, I would chase, I'd come up with silly ideas, I would buy

• 17:01Speaker 05

  little toys and, and props and things like that. And it was just silly and, and, and, and if I got up on stage, even if there was silence for moments, because I was so in the moment, I, my analogy is a thrill ride, you know, I still love roller coasters because it makes me feel alive, that adrenaline being tossed. I liked that. If there was silence, but then I could put something together or pull something out or make a noise or pull the glove over my head, when those, when I would find those moments of, oh my God, everybody that I don't know is kind of reacting, there's a vibe in the room where they're all laughing.

• 17:44Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah.

• 17:45Speaker 05

  They're all laughing with you or even at you, but you're controlling that, there is, there's no, it's almost, it feels kind of like a superpower that you've, that you've kind of grabbed on to.

• 17:57Hoda Kotb?

  I think we spend so much of our lives waiting for the big moments, the birthdays, the vacations, the milestones, but the truth is, some of the happiest moments show up on the most ordinary days. So like this, I'll stop into a CVS because I need one thing. Somehow the best part of the trip is never the thing I came for. So maybe I'll grab a delicious well-marked snack or maybe I'll wander over to the Joyward Collection. It's really full of fun, cool, seasonal decor, thoughtful little gifts and those little discoveries that make you so glad you stopped in. I have to tell you, if you're an extra care member, you're going to save on things you're already buying and those extra bucks really do add up.

• 18:41Hoda Kotb?

  Just watching that total go down at the checkout never, ever gets old. I know life's busy, we're all juggling a lot and that's why I think those little unexpected moments of joy matter so much. So the next time you're running errands, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You may go in for something you need, but don't be surprised if you leave with something that simply makes your day a little brighter. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Halloween has a funny way of making you buy things you'd never normally buy. A 10-foot skeleton? Sure. A full-size fog machine? Why not? Three bags of candy that somehow become six bags of candy? It happens.

• 19:23Hoda Kotb?

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• 20:04Hoda Kotb?

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• 20:12Speaker 02

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• 20:43Hoda Kotb?

  You're not a rose colored glasses guy. You're always honest. You've always been like straight up and you've had these pockets, Howie, of joy, which are amazing. How do you deal with the other 23 hours in the day when you don't have that feeling, that rush? Like, how do you navigate those hours? Because, you know, a lot of people are going through life and they're feeling the things you're feeling. I remember Carson telling me the other day, he said, you know, Hoda, I have anxiety. I've been diagnosed. And he said, but let me tell you what that gave me. I said, well, what? He said, I go way low and I feel very terrible some days. He goes, but when I hear a song that hits just right,

• 21:28Hoda Kotb?

  I get chills all over my body. He said, when I see a sunrise, I see, I think more colors than other people do. He saw the, he said he has the extremes. But what is it like for you?

• 21:42Speaker 05

  So to be totally honest with you, um, you know, I am, um, you know, I'm medicated and I'm, I'm, uh, and I have a lot of therapy and I have such a fear of those lows because they were, they're incredibly painful and hard to navigate. So my life is, consists of trying to balance up here without that, that is the medication. So I've medicated myself to the fact, to, and I'm talking about, uh, prescription medication, not, I'm not

• 22:23Speaker 05

  self-medicating, though I did that during COVID and I almost died. But, uh, but I, uh, so I'm medicated. I have, I'm surrounded by professionals, but I also, my other coping skill is distraction. So I am incredibly busy and I will look for something to do. I'm not good in the moments by myself. I could do what Carson does, but I can't sit. I'm not, I'm not strong enough to sit quietly and kind of ruminate because my mind just slips. And that might be a product of OCD. You know, dark, reoccurring thoughts are kind

• 23:03Speaker 05

  of my mind's resting place, which is not, which is not good. So like today, I'll do this podcast. I have, I make sure that my day and the people around me, I go from place to place to place and, and thing to thing to thing until at the end of the day, I can't even stand up and I, I go to sleep. So I never, I don't know if that's good advice, but that's just my thing. You know, I take care of myself and I stay really busy and really active and, and, and out there and try to focus in the moment. Standup comedy gets that. When you're standing on stage and you don't have, I have the semblance of a plan, but not really, or show up in an interview. I don't know what you're going

• 23:47Speaker 05

  to ask me or that. I'm in the moment right now because I'm just answering a question and I'm not turning inwards. But I think when it's quiet, I turn in.

• 23:57Hoda Kotb?

  You said something that I, I can't get out of my head. Sorry. You just said in the pandemic, you said you self-medicated and almost died.

• 24:05Speaker 05

  Well, my wife thought I was, so, so, um, I'm sober right now, but during the pandemic, I couldn't sleep because, you know, part of my, uh, rumination is I, I'm, I make fun of it, but it's, it, it germaphobe, I'm a germaphobe and, uh, you know, a pandemic is like, it's, I would, I live like I'm in a pandemic anyhow. And then when there's a real one, it's, it was hard for me to handle. It was hard for a lot of people, but I, I wasn't strong enough to handle it and I couldn't sleep. So I started taking gummies to go to, and then I, there wasn't enough gummies to take. So I would take a lot of gummies

• 24:47Speaker 05

  and then I would take gummies and, and smoke, smoke some too. And then I would take, I'd smoke some and just drink also. And really I was just trying to, um, escape and make myself unconscious. And there were times where my, uh, wife, I couldn't, uh, she couldn't wake me up or she thought she was going to take me to the hospital. And then there's no middle ground with me. So I don't smoke or I haven't had a beer or anything. I can't do things in, in moderation. I can't do anything in moderation. It wasn't healthy and it wasn't good and it's not an excuse, but it's just, uh, it was, it was really bad.

• 25:31Hoda Kotb?

  Wow. And it sounds like your wife, Teri, of 40 plus years, right? Um, what, she's been with you through all of it?

• 25:40Speaker 05

  Yeah. She is the, she's like a hero. I don't know how she does it. Listen, she, she got me to therapy through an ultimatum, you know, is just like when, you know, people like me, um, who try to, and especially with OCD, who try to create comfort for ourselves, it's, and, and, you know, let's just talk about the germ thing. It's just one of many. You know, I have rituals and things I can't get away from and it's become a part of my persona and people make fun of it and I make light of it. Making light of it makes it a lot easier. Um, but, you know, the hell that it is to live with somebody who's trying

• 26:25Speaker 05

  to create, I tried to create this world that would become, you know, I built a guest house. Well, it's not really a guest house. I built a place in our backyard and if it, one of our kids sneezed, I lived there for a week, you know, and, and great excuse, you know, I gotta be on the road. I gotta go out there. I can't get a cold. Um, if they, if I deemed something not sanitary, then I would have, you know, I'd have them disinfect the phones. I'd have them everything. Finally, my wife just went, you know, I, I can't do this. This is really tiring. Go talk to somebody, see how you, so the ultimatum

• 27:05Speaker 05

  was either, you know, try to, try to find some help because I can't do this anymore. I can't do this anymore. And she, so she's a hero because she put up with it and sent me to therapy. And at my age, I said, I'm 70, as a child of the 50s and 60s, you know, even talking about mental health still even feels.

• 27:30Hoda Kotb?

  When you finally got the diagnosis, because I think, um, you know, you knew there was something going since you were a kid, obviously. And you talked about that special date when you finally knew what it was. Was that like this huge relief to you, Howie, to know like, oh, so all this time, for all these years, I've been fighting something, I, you know, I've been trying to figure it out or trying to calm myself, you know, however you did that as a little kid. But what, what was that feeling like when you knew this is what it is? It's ADHD, it's OCD, it's anxiety. I got it now.

• 28:07Speaker 05

  Um, it was, it was twofold. Uh, the, the, the first was exactly how you described it. Oh, there is a title for this. There is something. You are saying that you could help it. It is a thing. So, oh my God. So it's not just, see, I didn't, I never thought something was wrong. I always thought this is me and this is how, you know, all these thoughts. I don't know that you don't have thoughts like that, but I'm just dealing with myself. It's very insular. Mental health is just something that's very, you know, you, you don't, you don't share it. It's what's going on in your mind is what's going on in your mind. I thought that was just me and it was hard. When they gave it a title and

• 28:49Speaker 05

  a name and maybe a program to try to make my life a little bit easier, I was happy about that, really, and did lift a weight. But at the same time, at, right at that moment, because of who I am and where I come from and how the world is, the fact that you put a title on it, it was a stigma. You know what I mean?

• 29:11Hoda Kotb?

  Did you want to hide it? Did you, did you think about hiding it?

• 29:14Speaker 05

  Talked about it. It was in my book and I've talked about it many times. Totally never mentioned any, my wife and my family knew, didn't mention anybody. I went on, uh, the Howard Stern Show and I was on the Howard Stern Show. On a separate thing, I probably come and done your show. I was on the Howard Stern Show. And I was cognizant of leave when I, when the show, when I was doing the show, I was focusing because some people in the room that I didn't think were sanitary had left the room before me. So I was focusing on the doorknob. And, and do that. And even though he was talking to me, it was like that Charlie Brown, the Charlie Brown show, you know, where the teacher's

• 30:00Speaker 05

  talking to me and I was talking to him, but really my whole direction was, how am I going to get out that door? How do I handle that door? I'm wearing short sleeve shirt. I can't pull down my sleeve. How am I gonna, he finished the interview with me. I go to leave and I say, somebody open that door. I don't want to touch that. I don't want to touch the doorknob. I wanted that doorknob's filthy. So I just touched it and he touched it. And they go, no, open the door. So I go and I grab, I see there's a box of tissues and I go grab a tissue and I try to open the door with a tissue and they knock the tissue out of my hand. They think it's, they think it's, it's funny. No, open the door, Howie. I tried to grab my shirt. They knocked that out of my, and then I start to panic.

• 30:43Speaker 05

  Inside, I feel like I'm going to have a heart attack. And I say to Howard, who is a friend, I say, Howard, honestly, can I be honest with you for a second? He goes, yeah, go ahead. I said, well, I, I, I just went to a psychiatrist. I've been diagnosed with something called OCD and I have an anxiety. And if you don't open the door for me right now, then I, you're, I promise you're going to have to call 911 because I'm about to pass out. I'm about to, I can't, I deal with this. I, I have it. He goes, okay, okay, okay. And very sweet. They open the door and I go out in the hall. When I stand in the hallway, I thought we were on a break. I thought we're in a commercial and I hear on the speakers, the show is still going and they're talking about what just happened. And I'm going, oh my God.

• 31:28Hoda Kotb?

  Oh no.

• 31:28Speaker 05

  Time when like everybody, it was terrestrial radio and, and he was like number one in your market and LA also. And I'm going, oh my God, I just broadcast that I have a mental health issue. My first thought was my family. I thought my kids in school and they're going to be ridiculed. I've just ruined their life because I, I, I don't know how people perceive this. Sounds like nothing today, but

• 31:56Hoda Kotb?

  Then it was a thing. So what, what happened?

• 31:59Speaker 05

  Maybe, maybe in my mind, it was a bigger thing than it was. I, it wasn't. But I thought, oh my God, my kids are going to be humiliated, humiliated. My wife, I just ruined my family. I just ruined my family. In this moment, I've ruined my family. Not only that, my career is over. I mean, why would you, you know, I knew that, you know, every time we go and do a television show or we get a job, I don't, I don't see it so much anymore, but you know this. We have to go see a doctor, right? And the doctor would give you a clean bill of health. It wasn't really a, there was a guy with a stethoscope that said, breathing? And you'd say, yeah. And then, but that's because they had to buy insurance on anybody. So who's going to give, who's going to spend even the smallest show costs millions of dollars? Who's going to allow me to be in a show if I've just said that I'm mentally ill?

• 32:45Speaker 05

  Also, I think my career's over. I think this is what I'm ruminating. And I didn't know what to do. I'm in Manhattan. And I just, I, I, I couldn't even breathe. I went down the elevator and I walk out into this teeming street in Manhattan, you know, traffic and people and, and, and, and I just wanted to run into traffic. I just said, I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do. I was panicked. And a guy comes up into my periphery and said, are you Howie Mandel? I don't, I couldn't make eye contact. Yeah. And he goes, well, you just on Howard? And I went, yeah. And now I got, this is it. This is it. And he just said, me too. And, and I went, I don't know what that means. You know, I don't know what that means way before the me too movement, right?

• 33:30Speaker 05

  I, I go, what, what, what, me too, what? He goes, I have OCD and it's so refreshing to hear somebody talk about it. And I went, really? It was the first thing. It's like, it was like

• 33:43Hoda Kotb?

  Wow.

• 33:44Speaker 05

  Mention of the universe came to me and I went, and like I'm telling you, that was the darkest, scariest point in my life. And he walked up and he went, that was amazing. And I go, really? And, and also just meeting another, I've never been in another room with somebody that is at least admitting to having, you know, I've talked to me and my psychiatrist and I've never been in another room or talked to somebody with, and, and he goes, you have no idea how, how impactful that was. And I said, you, you, you have no idea how impactful this is to me. I felt alone. I felt like I have something that's not shared by anybody. That's not, and, and it was just a wonderful moment. Still worried about how my family was going to go.

• 34:27Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah.

• 34:27Speaker 05

  Before the internet, this is before emails and texts and, and social media. And when I got home, within three days, couple of letters came. Then next week, 50 letters came and then, and then I started getting all this mail from people who have mental health issues and were, and then I realized, oh my God, you know, this is, I'm not alone.

• 34:55Hoda Kotb?

  Like the scary monster was out and then suddenly everybody's raising their hand. No, you know what? This, this explains so much about you to me right now, Howie, because first of all, very, very few people are universally loved and you're one of them. And whenever I said, oh, I'm interviewing Howie, people are like, oh, Howie, I love Howie. He's so funny. He's so this, he's so that. But the minute that you went beyond the funny and just laid it out there, even accidentally, all of a sudden, it was like you said, you gave people permission to like be who they were. And that's humongous. And now when I think about you, because I was just, I mean, I'm sitting here thinking,

• 35:35Hoda Kotb?

  when I think Howie, a lot of people, they think joyful. They watch you on AGT and they think, wow. They watch you rooting for the underdog and they're like, he'd be rooting for me. Like you're that guy. So to be a guy who's lived with such darkness, who's equated with joy, I think, you know, almost universally is a pretty high mountain to climb that you climbed, Howie. I mean, that's a, that's a wow to me.

• 36:00Speaker 05

  But the truth of the matter is, I say this to people all the time, you know, the, the symbols for theater, you know, it, it, and, and it doesn't, are, if you look at theater symbols, there's a two masks. And what are those two masks? It's tragedy and comedy, right? Do you know what I'm talking about?

• 36:18Hoda Kotb?

  Yes, I do.

• 36:20Speaker 05

  They are, they are intertwined. And for me, and in my house from the time I was a kid, laughter was the most comforting blanket ever. And that is why I've also talked about this and I talked about it in my book. There was always laughter in my house. My parents, both of them had incredible senses of humor. And they used to listen, they buy comedy albums before I knew what comedy was. And I'd hear them laughing and I didn't understand what was being said. And, but I did understand that they were enjoying it and laughing. And my first recollection at about four years old is watching Candid Camera with them. And watching Alan Font set up a joke.

• 37:03Speaker 05

  And I understood what the setup was. So it's like a surprise party. We were all in on it and we're waiting for this to happen. We're waiting for the person to walk in. And then when they walked in and they, they, they, they were surprised by whatever the joke was, we all laughed together. And I went, oh my God. You know, one story that's kind of famous for me is getting thrown out of school for hiring a contractor to put an addition onto the library. But the truth of the matter I thought it was funny. I didn't tell anybody I did this. So I called the Yellow Page. I looked in the Yellow Pages. I called a contractor and I said, at three o'clock, could you measure? I want to add 75 feet onto the, the library. My name's Howie Mandel. I just think this is ridiculous, but not, not telling anybody I'm doing it, knowing I'm going to be in math.

• 37:47Speaker 05

  I sat in math class, enjoying myself. I looked out onto the field and there's a guy with a tape measure and a clipboard and he's measuring. And I didn't tell anybody, watch, I called that guy. Like, think about, I don't understand what I was doing, but it was, I tell that story now and it's kind of a funny story. And, and then I see the principal go out and he's talking to him and then he, he shoo's him away. Then I see him go out and then I hear over the PA system, well, Howard Mandel, please come down to the, the office. And I just go down and for me, he, he, he's so incredulous. He goes, Howard, did you, in, were you getting a man, did you hire a man to put an addition onto the library? And I said, no, I'm getting, I'm, I'm getting three estimates.

• 38:32Hoda Kotb?

  And Oh God. Did you get kicked out? What happened?

• 38:37Speaker 05

  Yeah. He said, wait here, wait here. He called my parents in. Parents, I was sitting there and my parents who had a sense of humor and who had nothing but love and acceptance for whatever I did, he sat down and it was fun. Therein lies the show. I'm sitting there and he's going, you know, your son hired or, or contractor for somebody to come here and measure for a, you know, an addition out to the library. And I watched my mom sitting there, biting her lip, like wanting to be a responsible, like, what do you say? We told him never to add, construct any, what, what could they possibly say? That this is their son and they want to be, you know, respectful?

• 39:17Speaker 05

  And, and that was like the, in that school, that was the shot, broke the camel's back. I was asked to leave. I was always doing things like that, that were very disruptive, impulsive.

• 39:29Hoda Kotb?

  But also not for an audience. I mean, that's the craziest bit about all of it. It's like you're a lone ranger. I mean, what kid doesn't want to tell all of the people there, look what I just did? But you were just doing it purely for the fun of it?

• 39:44Speaker 05

  Sometimes for the fun of it, sometimes impulsively. Another reason I got thrown out of school, this is before Caddyshack. And I used to tell this story even on Make Me Laugh. We used to have in gym class, we had swim, we had swimming pool, we had swimming. I'm from Toronto, Canada. And, and you know, in the middle of the winter, I had gym, the last, the last class of the day. So I had swimming and you know, this is 69, 70, 71. They didn't give us hair dryers, you know? So I'd be soaked, right? My hair would be soaked and then I'd walk home in 20 below zero. My, my hair would freeze and, and, and break off. I was, you know, it was painful.

• 40:28Speaker 05

  So that one day I snuck into the pool area, didn't tell anybody. And I took a chocolate bar, I bent it a little bit and threw it in the pool. So that they would think somebody defecated in the pool and we wouldn't have to go swimming. Then they said, they made an announcement. If you know, if anybody has any information as to who, you know, sullied our, our pool. You know, can, can you come to the office and let us know? It turns out like a hundred kids showed up at the pool area to see this thing at the. And they're all just standing there and they're all going, oh, oh. And I don't know why I dived in and came up with it in my mouth.

• 41:12Speaker 05

  And you know,

• 41:13Hoda Kotb?

  You're, by the way, you're totally explaining yourself to me, Howie. All you need are like two stories and I get your whole deal like instantly, that moment.

• 41:23Speaker 05

  Well, and, and you know, I was, I was thought of as the most disgusting guy. No 15 year old girl is gonna go, oh, I want to hate the guy who just ate crap, you know?

• 41:36Hoda Kotb?

  I think we spend so much of our lives waiting for the big moments, the birthdays, the vacations, the milestones. But the truth is some of the happiest moments show up on the most ordinary days. So like this, I'll stop into a CVS because I need one thing. Somehow the best part of the trip is never the thing I came for. So maybe I'll grab a delicious well market snack or maybe I'll wander over to the Joyward Collection. It's really full of fun, cool seasonal decor, thoughtful little gifts. And those little discoveries that make you so glad you stopped in. I have to tell you, if you're an extra care member, you're going to save on things you're already buying. And those extra bucks really do add up.

• 42:20Hoda Kotb?

  Just watching that total go down at the checkout never, ever gets old. I know life's busy, we're all juggling a lot. And that's why I think those little unexpected moments of joy matter so much. So the next time you're running errands, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You may go in for something you need, but don't be surprised if you leave with something that simply makes your day a little brighter. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Halloween has a funny way of making you buy things you'd never normally buy. A 10 foot skeleton, sure. A full size fog machine, why not? Three bags of candy that somehow become six bags of candy? It happens, which brings me to the Chase Freedom Flex Card.

• 43:05Hoda Kotb?

  The savvy decision that will earn you more cash back on the everyday purchases. Plus the extraordinary Halloween tricks and treats. With Freedom Flex, you earn even more treats on your Halloween and everyday needs. You get 5% cash back on popular rotating quarterly categories, 3% on dining and drugstores, and 1% on all other purchases. More ways to earn, more ways to get rewarded. That's no tricks, all treats. More ways to earn, more ways to get rewarded. So sign up for the Chase Freedom Flex Card. Learn more at chase.com/getflex. This is a paid collaboration with Chase Freedom Flex. Cards issued by JP Morgan Chase Bank, NA member FDIC.

• 43:48Hoda Kotb?

  Subject to credit approval, offer subject to change, terms apply.

• 43:53Speaker 02

  Running a business means keeping pace with the latest tech. You put a lot into building your enterprise software stack and scrapping it to integrate AI is out of the question. That's why IBM technology works with all the apps, data and models you need. It's another way IBM helps you build on the technology you rely on. Let's create smarter business. IBM, visit ibm.com to learn more.

• 44:23Hoda Kotb?

  By the way, okay, so let's talk about, I just want this, this podcast is Joy 101. So when you first got booked on it, were you like, what the hell's happening right now? Or did you say, yeah, this is a perfect fit for me?

• 44:36Speaker 05

  I think it's a perfect fit for me because my whole life, my whole life, joy is the goal. And how do you find joy, you know? And I've always, everything I've done, even in my misery and my darkness, I'm trying to find the joy. And even out of those stories, it was in the moment, I think this would be the joyful thing to do. Maybe in my, in, you know, and it didn't always end joyfully. But even it kind of does, because the truth of the matter is here I am 60 years later. You know, telling about this moment that maybe went awry and what does this moment bring me?

• 45:16Speaker 05

  Or even a whole audience or anybody who's listening, they giggle, they laugh at it. It's joy. So darkness, sometimes it's like wine, you know, that darkness needs to ferment for a while. Rean, you, you, you, you know, then you open the cork and tell that story again. And people who weren't there don't know you.

• 45:37Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah.

• 45:38Speaker 05

  Never heard of the story, never, they, maybe they giggled, maybe they laughed. And if you could put a smile on somebody's face and I get joy out of seeing somebody else joyful because I'm there or because of something I said, or because of something I've done. That's why I love AGT. AGT is in, in its best, in its best form. When you see somebody walk out and stand there and they're consumed with terror and fear. And they tell you a story about this was a dream, this was a vision they had, this is something they wanted to do. And this is why I couldn't do it. The hurdles of just normal life.

• 46:22Speaker 05

  And now they show up, you know, Simon says it so eloquently, the next two minutes can change your life. But that's not just saying, I watched somebody do something for two minutes. And there's a, a line of, there's so many, a list of people I can tell you about. Their life was never the same. And you, in that room, I hope that people at home could sense that. It's kind of those golden buzzer moments could sense that. And, and even if I'm the one that's pressing the golden buzzer, I watch the golden buzzer and people fall to their knees in tears, their family comes up and embraces them and the gold, it is falling. It's very symbolic of your life is never the same.

• 47:05Speaker 05

  You just, you just walk through a door of joy, of joy. I'm not saying no hardship will come after or no darkness, but joy. And everything that I, everything that I show up to do, the only reason I show up, if I'm not trying to spread joy, share joy, I'm trying to, you know, illuminate the joy within, deep, deep within me.

• 47:30Hoda Kotb?

  If you find, if there's somebody listening today, and there will be, who can't find it. They are looking for pockets of joy somewhere. They are trying to get out of a funk or whatever it is that they're in.

• 47:44Hoda Kotb?

  What would be your best advice, Howie, for them?

• 47:46Speaker 05

  Words, words, you know, the, everything that is good that has happened in my life is.

• 47:58Speaker 05

  And when I say words, it's, what I mean is you talk about it. You, you need to talk about, even your darkness, you need to talk about it and you need to share. And humanity and this podcast is, is a great example of it. If you listen to somebody or somebody listens to you, or if you, as long as you keep throwing out these life preservers and these life preservers, sometimes you don't know you're throwing it out. You know, I accidentally threw out words on the Howard Stern Show. Well, what did I do? I threw out words and me too came my way. Listening to this, these words and me too comes your way. The easiest thing and the worst thing you can do in life is suffer in silence.

• 48:41Speaker 05

  Whether you're talking to a loved one, a coworker, a hotline, you know, a caregiver, a professional, a medic. Just never stop talking, just never, and, and, and because I'm telling you, somebody, something will, will glom on to whatever that is that you're putting, but silence is the worst, is our enemy. Is, is humanity's enemy. We gotta talk about it. We gotta talk about it. We have to talk. And when we're not talking about it, when we don't talk,

• 49:20Speaker 05

  it's dark. And you know, even in our world, bigger, in, in bigger issues, even politically and things like that. We're not talking to each other anymore. We're talking to ourselves. We create little bubbles. The social media does that. It creates an algorithm and you're locked and we need to reach, we need each other. We need humanity, we need humans, we need to know that, hey, there's, I'm not alone here. And not being alone, you know, there's an old saying, and I don't think this is what they meant, but it works. Misery loves company. There's a lot of misery in this world, but we love the company, we need the company, you need company. That's not what that saying means, but I'm telling you, company can get you out of that misery.

• 50:02Speaker 05

  It can also, you know, mirror and reflect the misery and just enhance it. But more than not, if your goal is to get out of the misery, reach out.

• 50:14Hoda Kotb?

  Well, Howie, I heard your words. I think everyone listening did too. So I want to say thank you for joining me on this podcast, Howie. I love you.

• 50:23Speaker 05

  I love you too, and I wish you nothing but health, happiness and every wish comes true.

• 50:28Hoda Kotb?

  Thanks, my love.

• 50:31Hoda Kotb?

  I want to end this show with, I love a poem. You know, I love a good poem. This one is about, again, like, not everything is rose-colored glasses. Sometimes you feel in a funk. Sometimes it's not your day. Sometimes you wonder, how am I gonna get out of bed? And those are important days, too. Not every day is skipping through the tulips on a, in a beautiful green field, right? So, why don't we try this one? Just baby steps to feeling better. Here we go. "I'm not okay today." So, in the absence of okay, what else can I be? I can be gentle. I can be unashamed. I can turn my pain into connection.

• 51:14Hoda Kotb?

  I can be a student of stillness. I can be awake to nature. I can sharpen my empathy against the stone of my discomfort. "I'm not okay today, but I am many worthy things." It's by Gerard K. Anderson. So, even if you're not okay today, there are things you can do to make it a good day.

• 51:52Hoda Kotb?

  I've realized that joy doesn't always come from those big moments. Sometimes you find it on the most ordinary day. I'll pop into a CVS for toothpaste or paper towels, and it never seems to be just a quick errand. Maybe I'll grab a delicious Well Market Trail Mix or wander over to the Joy Word Collection. That's part of the fun. So, the next time you're checking something off your to-do list, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You might go in for one thing and leave with a little more joy. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS.

• 52:23Speaker 03

  I'm Melissa Jelton, host of the What Happened to Her podcast. We're kicking off the season with the Sandra Birchmore story, a case the police wrote off as a suicide in a snowstorm. Her family never bought it, and the man they suspected wore a badge.

• 52:38Speaker 04

  You never know who that devil is because he's wearing a disguise. Sometimes it's a police uniform.

• 52:43Speaker 03

  And you can get access to all episodes 100% ad-free with an iHeart True Crime Plus subscription exclusively on Apple Podcasts, available only to iHeart True Crime Plus subscribers. So, don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search for iHeart True Crime Plus, and subscribe today.

• 53:02Speaker 06

  October is Black Fiction Month, and the Black Lit podcast explores the minds of Sebo Campbell. How speculative fiction works as you enter into a story with a question. Nisi Shaw.

• 53:13Hoda Kotb?

  What kind of world would it be if these people had not perished?

• 53:18Speaker 06

  And Octavia Butler. In science fiction and fantasy, I can do absolutely anything. As they posed the question, "What if?" Listen to Black Lit on the Black Effect Podcast Network, on iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 53:32Speaker 07

  On recent episodes of The Questlove Show, I chatted with JoJo about her music and Wallow267 about his story and everything in between. Don't invite me to karaoke. I'm gonna make it weird. Someone's gonna try to sing "Leave, Get Out," or "Too Little, Too Late," or "Baby, It's You." Oh, no. And I'm gonna be like, "Okay, cool." Check out my conversation with JoJo, Wallow267, and more on The Questlove Show. Listen to The Questlove Show on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Peace.

• 54:02Speaker 01

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.