NYJ Solomon Thomas Shares His Family’s Loss in Hopes of Helping Others in Mental Health

FOLLOW THE PIVOT PODCAST: MERCH | https://pivotpodcast.com YOUTUBE | https://www.youtube.com/thepivotpodcast INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/thepivot TWITTER | https://twitter.com/thepivot TIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@thepivot FACEBOOK | https://www.facebook.com/thepivotpodcast FOLLOW HAPPY DAD: https://www.instagram.com/happydad FIND HAPPY DAD: https://www.happydad.com/find Today we are bringing you a special show and are extremely grateful to New York Jets Defensive Tackle, Solomon Thomas for opening up and sharing his story with the world on how tragedy struck his family and using that loss to help others work through depression, anxiety and understand mental health affects us all, no matter how strong we are. As the 2017, number 3 overall NFL draft pick, Solomon entered the league filled with positive expectations and a path of promise with the 49ers when a year later, his beautiful sister took her own life after struggling with depression, anxiety and PTSD. Solomon courageously and emotionally shares how his sister struggled with certain sides of her mental health and how her life ending tragedy became a painful lesson and teaching tool for his life’s purpose beyond playing football. Dealing with the aftermath and fighting through guilt while overcoming the stigma that being a NFL player makes him tough or not allowed to feel certain emotions, Solomon created a foundation and dedicated a large part of his life to helping others and being an advocate for mental health in his sister’s memory. Relying on his NFL family to keep him grounded and football still being his number one passion, Solomon formed a special bond and turned to Dallas Cowboys Quarterback Dak Prescott who shared a similar family tragedy as him, and used the strength Dak portrayed to help guide him on his purpose outside of the NFL. Dak showed Solomon that it’s ok to not be on certain days and helped inspire him to turn his loss into faith for others who may be helped by hearing his story. Although this conversation is a tough one to have, it’s an important one filled with vulnerability and accountability in overcoming certain life obstacles while maintaining the strength to accept the emotions associated with struggle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Flowing ad budget on metrics that look great till the CFO sees them? That's bull spend. And marketers are calling it out in Dashboard Confessions.

• 0:09Speaker 01

  I remember telling my boss, "It'll be good for the brand," when leads were slow. Yeah, it wasn't.

• 0:17Speaker 00

  Cut the bull spend. LinkedIn lets you target by company, job title, and more. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com/campaign. Terms and conditions apply.

• 0:30Ryan Clark?

  May is Mental Health Awareness Month. It's a month that we've designated to remind us that there are people that go through seemingly unwinnable fights each and every day on a daily basis. But unfortunately, so many of us don't need to be reminded. We don't need to be reminded that there are days we can't get out of bed, or that there are days that the anxiety is so heavy on our chest, we can't breathe. Or days that are so long and grueling and tough that we feel like not breathing at all is the easier way. When I was 18, a friend of mine decided that not breathing at all was better.

• 1:15Ryan Clark?

  We played at the same Little League playground, graduated from the same high school. He was even one of my hosts when I visited LSU. And he was a dude, like he was a dog. He could ball. He was a freaking adult. He lived off-campus. He had a fiance. He had a daughter. He was somebody I looked up to. What I remember about the day before he died was, he asked me three questions. He asked, "You good?" Which, if you're from the boot, you know what that means. That means what the next question said. "Are you okay?" And he said, "Do you need anything?" I don't really remember how I answered that because I was more so just making fun of him

• 1:58Ryan Clark?

  that he finally decided to hang out. But there is something I don't remember about that day. I don't remember if I ever asked him back. I mean, I guess when you're 18 and somebody's asking if you are right, you think to yourself that that person is the strong one. And if he has time to ask me what's going on with me, then surely he's okay. But I'm old enough to know now that the strongest of us fight the biggest and the baddest and the most relentless demons. For people who are going through it, I know you think that you're going through it by yourself because your pain is so unique. The darkness makes the desperation so lonely.

• 2:40Ryan Clark?

  But there are so many people that share your experience. Some of them with names you know. Fred Taylor, Michael Beasley, Charlamagne the God, Dwayne the Rock Johnson. Most of their names, you'll never know. My friend's name was Neshel Menard. He drove his car by himself to the levee with a shotgun. And I never saw him again. Selfishly, I keep thinking about those three dang questions. You good? Are you okay? And do you need anything? I hope somebody's asking you those questions.

• 3:24Ryan Clark?

  I hope that you're asking yourself those questions. But what I do need for you to do is answer those questions. Understand that it's all right to not be good. It's okay to not be okay. And needing something and admitting to it is a sign of bravery, not weakness. And the people that love you actually want to hear the answer to that question because they'd much rather be making new memories with you than sharing the old ones. I saw Neshel's dad recently in the airport. And he told me that he was proud of me.

• 4:04Ryan Clark?

  And I think they should be proud of me too. But I'll never truly know.

• 4:11Ryan Clark?

  I wish that he could just call me or text me and tell me.

• 4:17Ryan Clark?

  Because if he could, then I'd tell him, you know, bro, sometimes I'm not okay either.

• 4:52Ryan Clark?

  This is Freddie T. I'm RC. This is Chan. We welcome Solomon Thomas, third overall pick of the 2017 draft by the San Francisco 49ers. Most times when we do these shows, it's about the physical prowess of a player. It's about the things that he's accomplished on the gridiron. I would argue that you're making a much bigger impact off of the field. That for you probably starts on January 23rd, 2018.

• 5:33Ryan Clark?

  I don't believe that is our story to tell, so we'll just let you take us through those events.

• 5:39Speaker 03

  First of all, Ryan, I'm sorry about your friend. And I'm over here already getting emotional hearing you describe going through the questions he asked you and the feelings that you went through from that, all too familiar. So January 23rd, 2018, I'm back in Texas after my rookie year. I'm home training, figuring out what the NFL is like, what the NFL offseason is. So I just go back home to my parents' house to be near my family, my sister, my mom, dad. And I just want to kind of regroup and kind of see how I'm going to move forward. It was a Tuesday morning and I just got done with training back at house, back at the house chilling with my sister's dog and my mom's dog. And my mom starts hitting me up. She's like, hey, hey, Solomon, have you heard from Ella? And I was like. You know, uh, no, no, no, why, what's up?

• 6:21Speaker 03

  Like, you know, I thought she was just at work or, you know, she was, she was off with friends or whatever and, you know, just thinking everything is normal, you know? Go upstairs, shower, come back down and, um, you know, I, uh, uh, get some more texts from my mom, hey, Sally, still haven't heard from Ella, like, you know where she is? Um, now I'm starting to get a little worried and I'm like, no, haven't heard from her, called her a couple of times and didn't hear any answers. Texting her like, yeah, hey Ella, where are you? Like, my mom goes up to her work, she's not there. My mom goes back to school to keep teaching. And then I get a call from my dad and, um, and he tells me that Ella died and, uh, I just dropped to the floor, um, just crying, I was dogs crying all over me and I'm licking all, all my tears and stuff, pushing them away, you know?

• 7:06Speaker 03

  Drive to the site, you know, see my mom, see the, see the ambulance, see the cars. And that shit was real, like, I don't know if I'm allowed to cut, but shit was real, like. I, it, everything seemed so like, it was like a movie, like, like, you know, I see the sirens, see the lights, I'm like, how is like, what is going on, like? And second by second, like, it's sitting in, like, my sister's dead, like, and figuring out what happened, all the emotions, like, the absolute worst day of my life, like, I remember that day, I couldn't tell y'all, I had a, my dad, I was heating up a bowl of bison chili when my dad called me. Like, I remember everything about that day and, yeah, I remember the pains of that day, I remember seeing my mom cry, hearing her screams, but just everything, like, my sister's not here, like, but why? Like, why is she not here?

• 7:48Speaker 03

  Why is she, like, just everything about it was just like, the worst day of my life, like, that was just the beginning of everything for me. Like, I really feel like, the last six years of my life, I've, I've become a whole new person, I have a whole new perspective on life, I feel like I have a whole new mission.

• 8:03Ryan Clark?

  Your sister though, Ella, this wasn't one of those situations where the family didn't understand or know that a family member was struggling. One of the things you've credited her, credited her with was the ability to communicate certain things. That she was going through. How did that factor in to the feelings afterwards though? Was it one of those things where you were like, okay, well, at least I knew she was dealing with something? Or did it make you think, okay, Solomon, you knew she was dealing with something. Why didn't you do more? How much more could you have done? How did her being able to communicate those things while she was alive affect your reaction afterwards?

• 8:46Speaker 03

  It's hard because being in this space, now being in the mental health world, I've learned so much more about mental health and understand so much more. That has made me feel like, you know, I wish I knew this because I wish I could have responded to this differently. I wish I could have asked her this more often. I wish I could have been more, more present and genuine with her when she told me these certain things. Because I'll be real with y'all, like, I wasn't always like, I understood my sister was struggling with mental health, but I didn't truly understand it. I didn't know what that felt like. I didn't know what that meant. My mom would tell me Ella struggles with depression and anxiety. And I was just like, okay, like, all right, you know, Ella struggles. But I didn't really understand what that meant. But I understood what that meant when I went through it myself and afterwards and connecting with her on that spiritual level of like, this is what Ella went through.

• 9:28Speaker 03

  This is what she meant when she said that she was running away from sadness and she couldn't, she couldn't ever escape it. I look back and I get mad at myself and because like I feel like I was so naive. I didn't know enough, like, I would ask my sister, I would be like, Ella, why can't you be happy? Like, I was in such this old, archaic mindset, probably like we all were growing up, like, like, hey, be a man, tough through it, put your head down and push through and you'll be fine. Like, that's what I was on because that's what worked for me. And I thought I was, if I gave her that tough love, she'll be able to push through. And, you know, it's not the same. It's so, it's so different, like, you know, like, strength isn't about being silent and just pushing through. Like, when I was going through my hardest times, like, after she died, those eight months after she died, I was extremely depressed. I didn't want to be here at all. Like, and I really mean that, like, I really did not want to be here.

• 10:14Speaker 03

  Like, I didn't want to wake up. I didn't want to go to sleep. I didn't know how to handle the grief. I didn't know how to handle missing her. I didn't know how to handle getting all this information about mental health and understanding that, hey, I was doing everything wrong. And, you know, that was just so hard dealing with, like, I didn't understand what was the point of moving forward. But going through that, I felt like I connected with her, like, even like past her dying, like, you know, I understood what she was going through. But understanding that now, like, it's, it's, it's one thing that I struggle with to this day is the guilt of it. Because And it's a little egotistical of me, it's a little like, just like, me thinking I'm a superhero sometimes, but I really believe if one person could have saved Ella, it could have been me. And that's why like, this work means so much to me now, because I would, if I can have

• 10:58Speaker 03

  anyone learn to, to say, to ask certain questions, or to understand that mental health isn't just a feeling, it's not just like, happiness isn't a choice, or to put your head down and push through it, if I can have someone to understand that, to understand, hey, like, depression, anxiety, or diseases, like anything else, like, you're not balancing enough cortisol or serotonin, these people are fighting for their life every day, when, once they wake up, they're fighting a war in their head every day, and they're deciding, hey, I want to continue to live and move on, if I can have someone to understand that, like, and be able to be there for their friends, their family, themselves, and put that love for themselves, like, this will all be worth it. But to answer your question, it's the one thing I do struggle with, like, and I'm just being vulnerable and real with y'all, because like, I'm not perfect, and I do this work, and people probably think that I take care of everything, like, right in my mental health

• 11:41Speaker 03

  life, and dealing with my sister's death, but the guilt part of it is something that I can't escape, like, because I love it, like, that's, my sister was everything to me, like, we had such a close relationship, close relationship, and, you know, so that will forever hurt, for sure.

• 11:55Fred Taylor?

  I want to commend you, first and foremost, for going on this journey, you know, in honor of your sister, but I do want to go back and ask you, because you said you struggled through a few bouts of depression yourself, you felt like you didn't want to be here. During those moments of trying to process and understand your sister's death, a few years removed from that, you had an ACL injury that ended your season against the team that you play for now, in the Jets. I've had my share of injuries, and I know how it can make you feel, when you can't get out there with the fellas, and, you know, do your part, and being such a high pick, I'm pretty sure that also has a lot to do with it. Did you have to relive? Those moments of potential falling into depression when you were out as well,

• 12:39Fred Taylor?

  did it like reignite, you know, your sister's passing?

• 12:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, I really do feel like spending a lot of that time off the field and not in the game. Like, because the game was a vice for me sometimes. Sometimes it wasn't when I was dealing with depression, sometimes it was. And it was a way for me to vent and then kind of get through some things. And when you took that away, because I was finally in a good spot in the game, I was feeling good. I was like, this is my year, you know, I'm gonna show everyone who I am. Like, and then ACL, like, oh, shoot, okay. Now I'm spending all this time rehabbing, trying to get everything right with my knee. But then there's no game, like, there's no practice, no meetings. So where does my mind go during those times?

• 13:12Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 13:12Speaker 03

  And sometimes I'll go back to those times when, you know, I think about, oh, like, I wish I would have said this to Ella. Like, oh, man, like, dang, like, going back to those times when, you know, I felt alone and and like going back and getting stuck in those feelings again and feeling alone all over again because like, I just had time on my hands and I was just like, you know, shoot, like, you know, I feel like all the sad things in life, like Ella's not here, you know, seeing what my family went through, how it affected all of us. And also just when you're in this work and you're around it a lot and you're talking about it a lot, sometimes you can get stuck in these feelings and especially when you're not balancing it. Like, we just launched our foundation when I tore my ACL and I was doing a lot more mental health work and I was kind of getting stuck in like, you know, doing too much of that and not balancing it out.

• 13:54Speaker 03

  And I for sure was getting stuck in those feelings sometimes and which caused me to get back learning how to love myself more. And I really during my ACL, I learned how to meditate more. I hired a mindfulness coach and he helped me like, just like, learn how to like process my emotions and then flow through it more, got back into therapy more, you know, started journaling more. I just had to learn all these things because at the beginning of the journey, I was not doing well with my ACL. I was struggling, I was felt alone, you know, I was mad I wasn't out there. I was going back to some of these depressed feelings of losing my sister and, you know, feeling like, you know, I just had to push through things. But I wouldn't change that journey because it did teach me how to take care of myself and how to, you know, have a mental health routine and how to.

• 14:36Speaker 00

  Flowing ad budget on metrics that look great till the CFO sees them? That's bull spend and marketers are calling it out in Dashboard Confessions.

• 14:46Speaker 01

  I remember telling my boss, "It'll be good for the brand," when leads were slow. Yeah, it wasn't.

• 14:54Speaker 00

  Cut the bullspend. LinkedIn lets you target by company, job title, and more. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com/campaign. Terms and conditions apply.

• 15:06Speaker 03

  You know, like how I'm taking care of my ACL, also how to take care of my brain.

• 15:10Fred Taylor?

  I see, he said it's okay to not be okay. And I saw it on back of your shirt. Could you expound on that and take us through your processes of managing your mental health?

• 15:23Speaker 03

  You know, the term "it's okay not to be okay" is a real one. It's something that we all should like really try to live by. You know, we live in this world now on social media where everything's, you know, highlight, you know, kind of what you got, the best times of your life. Like you see someone's post, it's not going to be like a sad post. It's going to be like, good, good, good, good, good. And we kind of get in this habit of living in the good and living in like what's great and, you know, comparing and wanting more. But that's not really what life is about. Like, life is about the hard times, the adversity, the sad times. Like, so we kind of get caught up in this mentality of like, you know, if things aren't good, something's wrong with me. And, you know, that's what happened to me right after Ella died. I was so sad, I was depressed, but I felt like I had to be good.

• 16:07Speaker 03

  I felt like I was comparing my grief. I feel like, you know, I was like, other people have been through worse than me. Why am I sad? Like, I can't be sad. I felt like, you know, as a man, like I couldn't show my emotions and cry and go to work and have a bad day because, you know, you know, men don't do that, you know? You know, I felt like, you know, I just was drafted third in the league and got all this money, living my dream, like playing in the NFL. Like, I felt so guilty and embarrassed for feeling not okay. And the reality is like I was feeling emotions of the human experience. Being depressed, being angry, feeling weird, anxious, awkward. All these feelings like are normal experiences of the human experience. But we don't talk about them, we don't address them, especially as men. And when we feel them, we feel like, we kind of feel awkward

• 16:51Speaker 03

  and messy inside, like, we're not supposed to feel this? And we shame ourselves for it. And that's what I was doing, and it only made me not talk. It kept me silent. And it just would build my depression and it built up to a point where, you know, I saw nothing but darkness and I was very fortunate to make the decision to stay here. Um, and to have, you know, a boss and general manager like John Lynch who asked me if I needed help and making that decision to get help. I was, I was able to see and through therapy, through help that, hey, like it's okay for me to feel like this. There's nothing wrong with me for feeling depressed after my sister died. That's a normal emotion. Like I'm not supposed to feel happy after she died. I'm not supposed to, even four years later, like I'm still supposed to be sad about it. So when I say it's okay not to be okay, I really

• 17:34Speaker 03

  mean that like, like you don't have to feel good all the time. And if you're going through a hard time, you're not broken. If you're depressed, you're not broken. If you're anxious, you're not broken. Like the storm you're going through, it will get better. And I understand when people say they have a fear of feeling like this forever. I've had that too and it comes back every now and then. But I know at some point, like the feeling's gonna change. Through loved ones, through my own mental health work, through therapy, whatever it is, like it will get better. And that's why I just encourage people like to understand that, hey, like however you're feeling like you're feeling that for a reason, be aware of it, address it, um, and understand that you're needed here. So, you know, keep going.

• 18:12Channing Crowder?

  You talk about, you know, being in the league when this happens and being depressed and the injury and all. I would say when I played, and we're way older than you, but it was almost a weakness. And in my, I don't know if I'm psyching myself out, but I, I can't tell this team I'm depressed. Cause you just said it, we got, we're paying you all this money. You're, you're famous. Why are you depressed? Do you, do you feel as if when you did come, come out and tell the world and explain to them how you're feeling? Do you feel as if the, the league embraced that and really, really helped in the best case, in the best way they can?

• 18:40Speaker 03

  You know, I feel very fortunate for the reaction that I got from the league, you know, from especially, I really paid attention to more of what my teammates did and thought and like my teammates, the Niners, the management of the Niners, how they wrapped around me, took care of my family, myself, uh, loved on me and, and showed me support was, I mean, unbelievable. Whether it's the force Buckner, Eric Armstead texted me, hey, man, that article was beautiful. Like, you know, keep going or, you know, Cassius Morris during practice checking on me like, hey, sorry, like you okay? Like just things like that, like they don't. Understand how much that meant to me because in the moments I was really struggling. They really just kind of helped me going, but um but after like that, like I I really felt like there's a a change in the NFL like towards mental health the last four or five years.

• 19:23Speaker 03

  Whether you know it's Dak speaking out, you know, or just like other athletes around the world. Like Kevin Love was a big influence on me just to speak out and and let people know that I'm struggling. Or you know, DeMar DeRozan, you know, um Simone Biles, so many athletes have spoken out now and kind of changed the atmosphere for athletes and mental health. But you know, I'm very thankful for the reaction I got from the NFL because um you know, for example, like if I had gotten a reaction like Dak originally got from Skip Bayless, I don't know what I would have done because I was struggling that bad. And that's why, you know, I commend Dak so much for for everything he does because like he, I mean, I understand I'm an NFL player, I have like a background, I have a following. But like, he's the quarterback of America's team and he's one of the most followed quarterbacks

• 20:07Speaker 03

  in the world and under one of the biggest stages. So like when he did that and came out and spoke like, I think that was a huge shift in the NFL. And you know, I'm I was really, really proud of him for that, for sure.

• 20:17Fred Taylor?

  I don't know if it's me, and I could be crazy, because I'm taking a lot of supplements these days.

• 20:23Ryan Clark?

  They look alike.

• 20:24Fred Taylor?

  Boy.

• 20:27Ryan Clark?

  They look alike.

• 20:28Fred Taylor?

  Boy, y'all look alike, you and Dak.

• 20:30Speaker 03

  I get that a lot.

• 20:30Fred Taylor?

  Yeah. What was pops name when y'all was down in Sydney, Australia? Hey, from California. They moved from Australia to Texas. But Dak from the boot, though. Yeah, Dak from the boot. But boy, y'all got, you're a big ass Dak. Exposed, like, Dak.

• 20:45Speaker 03

  It's actually crazy because I get that all, when I'm in Dallas, like, people get mad at me because I think that I'm lying to them. I'm like, no, no, I'm really not Dak. Like, man, we just want a photo. Like, I'm like, no, no, I'm really not Dak.

• 20:55Fred Taylor?

  Oh, wow.

• 20:55Speaker 03

  Like, I probably get called Dak way more than I get called.

• 20:57Ryan Clark?

  Well, listen, you are way swollen, though, so so don't worry about it. And a lot of times when you have the experiences that you've had, you can focus so much on them that everything seems negative. And the things you had to say to Ella and the Players Tribune, it was such, so many, at least to me, just... Beautiful tribute to who she was to you in life and death. And you even said, you believe she saved your life. But part of that, that I thought was beautiful, and I didn't know if I was supposed to be crying or laughing,

• 21:38Ryan Clark?

  was you saying that you and your parents, bro, got on a plane and smuggled your sister to a different country, right? So if I'm getting this right, y'all went to one beach and was supposed to go to another beach with kangaroos or something or another. Can you kind of take me through what that experience was, man? Because it had to be one of those where even in your sadness, you just had to laugh because you had to be like, Ella, like, you're here right now, living this.

• 22:06Speaker 03

  No, it was really, it was such an awesome experience, like, and, like, you know, happy, sad, and all the emotions in between. So like, we didn't know if it was legal or not to carry ashes like to a different country, so we Googled it and it said it was illegal, but we were like, okay. We want to bury, we want to put Ella's ashes in a place where we grew up, where we felt whole. And that was Pebley Beach in Australia and Balmoral Beach in Australia. Like, we grew up there and lived there for five years. And this was such a peaceful, loving time in our life. Like, just going to the beach growing up was just such a peaceful, happy thing. And so we wanted to put Ella where she was her happiest. So my dad, like, you know, wraps up the ashes, we put them in his bag, check his bag, take it over to Australia. And so the first beach we go to is Pebley Beach.

• 22:49Speaker 03

  And it's a place where we grew up where it was like a natural park. And so like kangaroos are there, like, animals are there just always, like, just chilling. And we get there and there's no kangaroos there. And we're like, damn, like, you know, Ella was supposed to like, you know, we're supposed to hang with kangaroos one more time and send her off the right way. So we walk around for 30 minutes, see no kangaroos. I'm talking about nothing, no animals, just a beach and a couple of other people. So, you know, we, you know, we're like, okay, like, we've been here for about 30 minutes, getting close to like 45 an hour, like, let's put the ashes in the water and let's head out. So my mom makes a little heart. Ella did her hearts funny, so we did a heart like she did her hearts. And we put the ashes in there and kind of waited for, you know, the waves to come take her away. Man, I'm telling you, once the waves take her away, and like we say a prayer and start crying together,

• 23:33Speaker 03

  we turn around and thirty kangaroos come from the forest. I'm talking about like, it really like felt like a movie, like people probably think I'm lying or like trying to like make a cool story, like it literally was like that. And they come right up to us, like I have all these videos of us playing with kangaroos, but they really felt like Ella was there with that since she was saying, hey, guys, I'm okay. I love y'all and keep going. So it's a forever moment that, you know, we take, we take for our hearts, yeah.

• 23:56Ryan Clark?

  That's amazing, and it's one of those things that it's kind of rainbow after the storm. And you know, and the good book says that was Jesus's reminder that he will be there in the end, that through the storm you can make it out, and there is some beauty on the other side. And for you, you seem to be focused on making sure that other African Americans aren't going through it. And you said it yourself, the defensive line foundation, which you started in May of 2021, it's for everybody. But we had Ryan Mundy on the show, who I played with, who started Alcoa Me Health, and I talked a little bit about it to you before.

• 24:37Ryan Clark?

  There is such a stigma in our communities, and it's also, there's a difference in our communities and others. We are at the youth and adolescent age where many of African Americans or many of the, the young black adolescents take their lives. Why is there such a difference in the time for people of our culture as opposed to others?

• 25:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, I believe it's a mix of a lot of things, you know. I think our stigma comes all the way back to Jim Crow era, slavery, like everything we've been through. Like to be, all of us to be here right now, we've had to go through a lot of racial trauma, our parents, a lot of racial trauma, like then that has a huge effect on our life. But from that, we've always had to be strong, we've always had to push through. We could never show weakness, like our, our parents like expect, like couldn't show weakness or they, they wouldn't get that job, or they fall into their stereotype, they've always had to be perfect in every situation, or they're judged like that. And so. For that, like, that played into mental health and being like, oh, I can't, I always have to be okay. I always have to be strong, I always have to be, like, present myself as ready to go. And I think we've taken that to a point where, like, we've had to put on this mask for so long,

• 25:46Speaker 03

  and we haven't been able to really be our true self. And it's time for us to tell, like, our community and our people, like, hey, no, it's okay for us to, to struggle. Like, we've been struggling for so long, we can show these, these trials we've been through. We can show, like, you know, all the pain we've been through, like, and, and it's okay to talk about it, because we're all probably going through a lot of similar feelings from it. Whether, you know, it's racial profiling, whether it's going through stereotypes, or being prejudiced thoughts, actions, um, those take a toll on our mental health. Like, you know, feeling not adequate, like, feeling like, hey, like, people, some people are judging me, and something's wrong with me because of my skin color. Like, those play on our mental health. And so, the stigma that we have felt to be strong for so long, we don't have to hold that anymore. We are already strong, like, now it's important for us to use this strength to help our whole community.

• 26:31Speaker 03

  Like, hey, like, it's okay for us to go to therapy. I know a lot of the stigma, like, with black people, like, people of color mental health is like, hey, you know, go to church, give it to God, like, okay, I understand that God works miracles. I love my God, I love my Jesus. But at the same time, like, with my ACL, I still went to a doctor. I didn't just give it to God. And I want to treat my, my knee like I treat my brain. My brain's a muscle, my brain is one of the most powerful organs in my body. And it, it reacts the same way, like, if I treat it, it will get better. So I want to treat that the same way. So, hey, okay, if, if I'm feeling a certain emotion too much, or if I'm feeling off or weird from my mental, I want to have a process to help that as well, whether it's therapy, journaling, meditating, talking to a professional, you know, that kind of stuff, like, it, that's how I feel like our community needs to start viewing it,

• 27:16Speaker 03

  um, so we can help others and save others, because the statistics are, are bad. Like, we're, we're two times more likely to die by suicide. We're two times more likely to be affected by suicide, but three times less likely to get mental health treatment. And we already are at a disadvantage, we don't have enough black therapists. We don't have enough black, you know, mindfulness coaches. We don't have enough black people talking about therapy and talking about, hey, this kind of stuff's okay. So I think these are the things that we need to start talking about in our community to make sure that we, we, we change the statistics and we keep our people here. Because we've been through so much, and we're already at a disadvantage. Um, so it's so important for us to feel like we can really be human and talk about all of our struggles together.

• 27:54Ryan Clark?

  Solid with that pivotal moment because Ryan was talking about his friend and the three questions and you said somebody I wish I would have said something done something more than what you did.

• 28:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:04Ryan Clark?

  With all the research you've done and all the work you've done, when when somebody's in that moment, when you know somebody's hurting.

• 28:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:10Ryan Clark?

  Or if you don't know somebody's hurting.

• 28:11Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 28:12Ryan Clark?

  Are you okay? Because most people gonna say I'm good.

• 28:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:15Ryan Clark?

  Like what what is that process of helping out?

• 28:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:18Ryan Clark?

  The people that y'all were speaking.

• 28:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, and that's such an important question and there's a few ways you can go with it too because and first of all, like, I know a lot of people are afraid of asking the question and even being there for someone because they feel like they need to know the perfect thing to say. Really, just being present and just being there is the first thing you can do and just just being there for someone like, don't feel like you have to know everything or be a mental health professional to even address the question, but I would say at first, like, ask someone how they're doing, like just ask normal how they're doing, they'll probably say, I'm good, I'm okay. But how are you really doing? Like follow up with how are you really doing? Because that really or really doing now in the moment, that can really like trigger them to really like, shoot, okay, maybe he really cares. And then maybe they open up, maybe they tell you stuff, but just listening to them and

• 29:03Speaker 03

  being like, hey, I'm here for you, you don't have to speak, you can say whatever you want, but just know you have me in your pocket and if you need anything, I'm here for you, I'm here to listen to you, I mean, I'm a safe place for you. And that can unlock like a trigger in their brain to start venting to you, letting them know how you're doing. And if it gets to a point where you feel like it's it's a bad place and then they're in a really bad place, you can talk to them about, hey, I'm worried about you, but there's help available and you know, we can help you get it. You can go to that, you can go that route, or if you're really afraid for their life, there's like you can call 988, you can admit someone, there's there's a lot of routes you can go. But I really feel like the most important thing to ask is like, how are you really doing? And letting someone know that you're their safe place, that they can open up to you and just listen to them, I think that that can really like, those small conversations

• 29:48Speaker 03

  can really save someone's life.

• 29:49Ryan Clark?

  Solid, you don't have the struggle look though.

• 29:52Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 29:53Ryan Clark?

  Like when I see a psych patient.

• 29:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 29:54Ryan Clark?

  Who is off his or her meds that's walking down the street, I could 100% point them out.

• 30:00Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 30:00Ryan Clark?

  I know exactly who they are, I know that they're talking to somebody that we can't see, I know they're dealing with something with some sort of demon that that we don't know, right? That we can't even begin to understand for them and you could see that.

• 30:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:13Ryan Clark?

  And a lot of times, we place things or we start to. Allow ourselves to accept things because we could see them, right? You're a top-five draft pick. You're in the NFL. You're handsome. You're healthy. You come from a family that's been well-traveled. I was born in Chicago. I've lived in Australia. I grew up in Texas. All of these things, that's you, right? And so now, when you sit up in front of somebody, you have to say, and you now say, okay, I'm not okay. I'm dealing with depression. I'm dealing with things. How hard was it to overcome your own self-talk of you actually should be all right? Because in general, you do 1%, bro.

• 30:58Ryan Clark?

  Like, people that look like us, people that don't look like us, don't live your life. How hard was it for you to overcome the fact that in order to admit this out loud, in order for other people to accept it, I gotta accept it?

• 31:13Speaker 03

  It was probably one of the hardest things for me to accept because I didn't want to talk about it. Like, I've kind of been a private person my whole life, you know?

• 31:21Speaker 00

  Are your ad campaigns lighting up the dashboard? But not the pipeline? That's bull spend. And marketers are calling it out in Dashboard Confessions.

• 31:30Speaker 01

  My boss asked for results, so I opened my dashboard for the only positive-sounding metric I had: impressions.

• 31:38Speaker 00

  Cut the bull spend. See revenue, not just reach. LinkedIn delivers the highest return on ad spend of major ad networks. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com/campaign. Terms and conditions apply.

• 31:51Speaker 03

  You know, I wouldn't always have, like, the most friends. Was kind of like awkward, like, growing up, like, just a goofy kid. And always kept things to myself because I didn't think people understood me, and I didn't think people ever understand me. Like, Ella was really one of the only people to kind of get who I was. But for me to go in and tell people that I was struggling, like, it took a while. Like, when I first started speaking about mental health, like, I only told Ella's story. I would talk about how Ella felt, what she went through. Like, when I spoke at the AFSP Gala, when I wrote that first article with Molly and I on ESPN, would only touch on Ella. Six months after that, I did an interview with Bleacher Report, and I didn't mean to mention it, but I mentioned, like, how, like, I was going through a dark time. And he kind of pried a little bit. He was asking, like, you know, how dark was it?

• 32:34Speaker 03

  Like, I was like, you know, I was just really struggling, like, you know, didn't really... Just, you know, just a dark time. And then he was like, no, like, what do you mean by that? And I was like, I didn't want to be here. He said, what did he mean by that? I said I was suicidal. And, you know, to say that, like, that was, that was really hard. Because, like you said, like, I had this terrible self-talk to myself, like, exactly everything you're saying, exactly what so many people in this world are telling themselves, to tell themselves that they shouldn't be feeling the way they're feeling. But it's okay for us to feel the way we're feeling. We all go through certain things in life that we handle differently. We all go through different, like, our brain goes through different chemistry and different balances. And mine was going through its own, and I was struggling, and I, I needed help, and I was struggling, I didn't want to be here.

• 33:18Speaker 03

  But that mentality was what was keeping me from getting help. That mentality was what kept me bottoming up my emotions and pushing down my sadness and depression. Because I told myself I shouldn't be feeling this, like, I'm rich, I'm in the NFL, you know, I have everything I ever wanted, everything I ever wanted to work for. But why am I feeling so empty? Why am I feeling so dark? And it was just killing me, and, and the reality of it is, it's okay for me to feel like that, like, and, like, mental health doesn't discriminate. It attacks all races. If you're a billionaire, to have no money, like, we're all inevitably going to deal with mental health at some point in our life. And that's why it's important for us to have these conversations, to talk about them, because we lose the best of the best. We lose amazing people to suicide.

• 34:01Speaker 03

  It's the most preventable death, but we lose people because we're afraid to have these conversations and we're afraid to address the things that we're all going through. And like, to be completely real with you guys, like, talking about this stuff is not something I always want to do. Like, this stuff is hard, like, it sucks talking about it sometimes, like, there's days, like, I wake up and I'm like, no, I don't want to, I don't want to do this interview and talk about me wanting to kill myself and me, my darkest times and my sister dying, like. But the reaction I get from people, the DM I get from a random person saying, hey, your story saved my life. Hey, I lost my cousin the same way. Hey, I'm feeling the same way you're feeling like you like you telling me that kept me going. Then I'm like, my whole brain is like, dude, there's so many people in this world who are feeling the way you're feeling,

• 34:45Speaker 03

  who are feeling like Ella, who are feeling like this person who died. Like, just keep going because that's like, that's what motivates me to keep having this conversation because it saves and helps so many people. Not to call myself a hero or anything or anything, but like the people who are doing this work, the selfish work, they're saving so many lives. Like, we did the United Way Gala last week for the Jets and Giants. And I had a couple of teammates there, like a few, a lot of teammates came and showed out and it was really special. But to hear them after, like, even talk, like, because these are some guys who don't take mental health as seriously, who don't understand it. But they were like, dang, like, sorry, I didn't realize how many people struggle with depression. Because like after my speech, like, 20 people came up to me saying like, hey, I feel the same way you're feeling.

• 35:26Speaker 03

  But for them to see that and feel that, I'm like, also like gave them motivation to kind of get into the work too. But ultimately, like, we're all going through this and we're all going through the human experience in some way. So it's important for us to have this conversation and to continue this talk.

• 35:38Fred Taylor?

  You were just recently back in Texas with your family. And I was kidding about the Dak thing, but y'all do look like.

• 35:45Fred Taylor?

  That ain't no joke, bro.

• 35:48Fred Taylor?

  Like somebody stuck an air pin in Dak.

• 35:52Fred Taylor?

  Clone, clone. But you won, you were presented the Faith Fight Finish Game Changer Award by Dak during his foundation ceremonial event. I wanted to ask, much like the people that hit you up in your DM telling you you've made an impact on their lives, what does it mean to you to know that you're making an impact off the field? And also being recognized by one of your peers from the NFL?

• 36:20Speaker 03

  It means the world, like, you know, to, to, because this work is hard and it takes, takes a lot. So to be recognized for it, I don't do any of it for the recognition, but to be recognized for it and know it's working, this makes it all worth it. Then to be honored by Dak, like, and everything he's been through, like losing his mom, losing his brother Jayce to suicide, you know, being, being the status he is and everything he does for the community, it meant the world to me. And, you know, it's something I told Dak at the event, I just told him like, hey, bro, I don't, like, you mean a lot to me and I appreciate you so much. But he's donated to my foundation, he's part of my foundation, he's amplified our voice, him and his team have helped us out countlessly. So like Dak is like. Like I would love to call him a friend, but I really do look up to him in a lot of ways. Like, you know, he's, the work he does, like, everything he's done for me and my people,

• 37:03Speaker 03

  everything his, everything his team has done for me and my people, and everything they're doing for the world. Like, he's Walter Payman of the year for, for a reason. He's given his time to the people, like, he's probably gotta be one of the busiest NFL guys, like, being Dallas Cowboy quarterback, and he gives back to the people nonstop. And this, all the, all the causes he has and everything he gives back to, like, it meant the world to get that from, from someone of his status.

• 37:25Fred Taylor?

  And it's the Faith Fight Finish Game Changer Award for kids who struggle with mental health.

• 37:31Speaker 03

  Correct? Yes, sir.

• 37:32Fred Taylor?

  From your brother.

• 37:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, yes, sir.

• 37:34Fred Taylor?

  From your brother Dak.

• 37:35Speaker 03

  Yes, sir. My brother Dak, my twin.

• 37:37Fred Taylor?

  Your twin, brother.

• 37:38Ryan Clark?

  Aight, Tag, gonna be mad.

• 37:42Channing Crowder?

  Tyler, as you're talking, tell me if I'm wrong, it seems as if you helping people is almost your therapy.

• 37:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, it, it has definitely, my mom and I were talking about this yesterday. Like, uh, we were just talking about how talking publicly has definitely been therapeutic for us in ways. Like, we, we were just talking about, kinda, one thing I was hitting on, just like, how this work is not fun sometimes, and, and it kinda sucks to talk about, but at the same time, it has, it has really helped us, like, kinda grow and learn in so many ways. Um, you know, learning about ourselves, like, learning about how serious this epidemic of mental health and suicide are in our nation. But no, it's definitely been therapeutic for me, cause I, I've learned, I'm continuously learning, like, learning about myself, learning about mental health, the science of the brain, um, learning about people, like, I feel like I connect with people on such a better level now, whether, whether it's just being vulnerable, or being able to be present, just listening to people.

• 38:33Speaker 03

  Um, it has been therapeutic for me. Um, there's times, there's times that, you know, it, it's not, but there's, most of the time, it's really, it's helped me and my family in a lot of ways.

• 38:42Channing Crowder?

  And are you worried, like, to have, I've never had that feeling. Like, for you to say that, like, that, you know, every, somebody says, "I would, I've taken my life", like, it takes the breath out of you. But having felt that, do you, I don't say run from, but like, are you worried about ever getting there again?

• 38:56Speaker 03

  You know? It's a really good question because you know it's something that you know I've been thinking about more recently like you know about like what if I ever got back to that point and the thing is now like I'm set up for success if I ever do like I know where to go I know that it's okay for me to not be okay I have I have a support system around me I have multiple therapists I can call in at any time you know so I'm not worried about getting there anymore but I know that if I do get there I'll be okay and I'm gonna get through it whether it's by myself or whether it's with my support system all around me and you know that's why I think it's important to for us to like all talk about this stuff and getting mental health routines and getting help because then you kind of know you have you have a backbone

• 39:39Speaker 03

  or a foundation to fall on whether it's not just your mental health or it's about the people around you or your loved ones I think that's important for sure.

• 39:47Ryan Clark?

  I do a lot about trying to figure out what passion is opposed to purpose and also sometimes just your job your job is a football player right and part of why your voice can be magnified is because you do a job that makes people believe that what you say is valuable and sometimes when you put so much of yourself into something else that truly has become your purpose and I can see it and I can feel it and I can hear it in you but in order to play that game you gotta love it and you have to put certain things aside in order to focus on that and make that a priority when it's time how have you learned

• 40:29Ryan Clark?

  to balance the two because obviously you want to continue to make that impact off of the field but part of that voice part of that platform is what you get an opportunity to do on game day.

• 40:41Speaker 03

  Definitely and this been something I've had to learn how to balance because the first week of May like I did a lot for mental health like did a few like a few interviews a few like Instagram lives and I kind of burned myself out a little bit and I was like I had to retract the next week I was like dang like now I have to really recover and get back into it because. When I'm drained mentally, my body's gonna feel the same way. So I had to like, learn how to say no the next, well, I had to say no the next couple of we- a couple of weeks of some things, just so I could recover and make sure that I'm giving ball my all, like, cuz I love this game of football. Like, and listen, my career hasn't gone the exact way I've wanted to, like, I've struggled and, but I wouldn't change a thing of it. Like, I really wouldn't, I really wouldn't go and try to change it to look like Nick Bosa's. I know people call me crazy, but I've learned so much through it.

• 41:25Speaker 03

  Like, I've really become who I am because of my struggles. I've learned how to love this game again and love it for every inch that it's given me. Um, I've learned so much about mental health myself through the whole journey. It's made me who I am as a, as a whole person. But the beauty of, of the work that I'm doing in mental health and football is I'm learning how they go together. And I'll bring this back to Kobe Bryant, like Kobe Bryant was one of the most mindful athletes I've ever studied. Like, his, if you go like, watch his YouTube videos of him talking about being present, his version of being mentally tough. Like, all that kinda stuff is, is the mental health side of the game that I've learned how to put in my game. Like, the acceptance theory, um, you know, accepting like, what, things that happen, um, you know, being present, um, taking things one thing at a time, like, all that, all that kinda stuff that I've learned from mental health, I apply to my game.

• 42:11Speaker 03

  And, you know, it, it's really helped me in my career, like, you know, being able to accept losses, being, being able to view failure as not, as not a negative thing, um, being able to, you know, challenge my self doubt and, and change my inner monologue and, and talk to myself better. And I wouldn't have done that if I didn't be in this mental health game. I kinda would've been on the old like, hey, just you work hard. But now I've understand there's a mental approach to the game too, and which has, I think has opened my game. But there's a balance between the off the field work and on the field work. But at the same time, I find a way to tie into the mental health work into my own game to make my game better.

• 42:44Ryan Clark?

  I'm gonna be real with you, man, and I, I've talked to Fred about it a lot and we kinda joke about it. I, at least prior to starting to have these conversations, I was the problem with mental health.

• 42:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:57Ryan Clark?

  I was undrafted, free agent, I was a, my, my mom, boy, she gonna pray you to sleep.

• 43:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:03Ryan Clark?

  Right? And my pops don't care about nothing, like, nothing phases him. And so, if you were going through things, on one hand, I got my pops saying, boy, listen, listen, bubba.

• 43:12Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:12Ryan Clark?

  We ain't got time to worry about that, we gotta move forward. And I got my mama saying, let's get on our knees.

• 43:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:17Ryan Clark?

  You know what I mean? And I would- And I don't want to use the word pushback. I would debate that me being the way I was and not accepting sadness, not accepting depression, not accepting adversity as a negative is the only, is one of the top reasons I'm here. And in our game, bro, you know, like, we're not taught vulnerability.

• 43:42Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:43Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? And it's, it's almost like this constant fight to prove that I'm not soft.

• 43:49Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:50Ryan Clark?

  And I don't want people to get me wrong. I'm not saying being aware of your mental health is soft, but I'm saying it could have that perception in what we do.

• 43:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:59Ryan Clark?

  So for you, when you started to grasp that and try to understand and approach, not only your off the field life, but your on the field life in that way, how were you able to allow others to see that it's not going to change my aggression? It's not going to change the way I approach it? If we in the foxhole or if we in the alley, I'm still your dude.

• 44:21Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:22Ryan Clark?

  Like, I'm still the same things that got me picked third overall. Now I can just approach other things about taking care of my mind in a different way.

• 44:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, this is the solid on the field and solid off the field. Like, when I'm on the field, like, I'm not out there, like, pouring out my heart and stuff. Like, I'm like, you know, like...

• 44:39Ryan Clark?

  Get up, bro.

• 44:42Ryan Clark?

  It's okay. I got you.

• 44:45Channing Crowder?

  Thanks, big man.

• 44:47Speaker 03

  You know, I'm playing ball. Like, you know, we're getting in the trenches, you know? So it's a violent, physical day every single day, and I have to prepare for that. But like, like I said, I try to be the same every day on the field and the same every day off the field. Like, off the field, I'm present, I'm genuine, I'm going to be real with you. I'm a laugh, we're going to have a good time. If I think you're struggling, I'm going to ask you how you're doing. But when I'm on the field, I'm going to be the best teammate I can be in the world. I'm going to play my ass off. Like, I'm going to give you, I'm going to show you the highest effort player you're ever going to see. I'm going to be as violent as I can and try to get to the quarterback and do whatever I can to help my team. But, and just because off the field, I'm vulnerable, and I tell people my feelings and tell people I'm sensitive, that has, that has nothing to do with how I'm going to be on the field.

• 45:28Ryan Clark?

  If you play somebody like him, he'd talk about you. And you know it, Chan.

• 45:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 45:32Ryan Clark?

  If you play Solomon, right? Or if he, if he was going to...

• 45:35Channing Crowder?

  Back in my younger life.

• 45:38Ryan Clark?

  Would you, would you be reading his, his press clippers?

• 45:41Channing Crowder?

  I'd read the story and be like, oh, yeah, I tore your ass up.

• 45:48Ryan Clark?

  Hey.

• 45:48Channing Crowder?

  Big man, think about something else.

• 45:53Channing Crowder?

  Hey, I promise he said.

• 45:57Channing Crowder?

  But have you, to that point, have you, you said the league has changed. You brought, you brought up that.

• 46:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:02Channing Crowder?

  Who kinda, you know, say catalyst that Kevin Love, different people, DeMar DeRozan. Are players changing though? Cause the guys I played with would look at you crazy if you walked in the locker room talking like this.

• 46:12Speaker 03

  Yeah, I for sure do think players have changed. Like, you know, a year after my sister died by suicide, like I said, like I had like players like Defoe, Eric reaching out to me, seeing how I was doing. Then the year after that, I started getting more calls, like guys like asking me, hey, like, how do I deal with a family member that's struggling? Hey, like, what do I, what do I do if I need help? I'm kinda struggling, like, and like, what route did you go? The year after that, when I got to the Raiders, it's like, I said, my, my first month there, like I had, I had probably eight guys asking me how to get into therapy. And I was like, wow, like, this is like, the conversation is really changing. And then you have more guys speak out, like you have Darren Waller, Max Crosby, um, you know, Derrick S. Leonard, so many people like talking about, you know, mental health, whether it's through addiction, whether it's through depression, whether it's through whatever they went through, so many guys talking about mental health more and more.

• 46:55Speaker 03

  The year with the Raiders, I had a teammate, you know, credit, like one of his best years of his career to go into consistent therapy. And now he doesn't miss therapy on a Thursday ever again, like. And then I come to the Jets and, you know, you know, it's a different group of guys, younger team, but I have guys who are for, guys who are against it. But it's, it's, we're all just in this journey together, cause whether we understand it or not now, at some point, we're gonna have to, have to go through it. I do believe that temperament of it has changed in the league. Like, I really do think guys are accepting of it. I think our whole world is understanding that, hey, like, we cannot be okay and, and be okay at the same time. Like, it's okay, like, I can be struggling in this ass, like, this, this facet of my life, but also be okay in this facet and like, um, I, I think that's, that's a really beautiful thing for people to understand because, uh, we don't always, yeah.

• 47:40Channing Crowder?

  It gotta be one or two assholes out there though.

• 47:43Speaker 03

  I mean, on the field, honestly, no one's ever said anything to me. I'm gonna be real with you. No one said anything crazy to me about mental health or anything. I'm sure we've had conversations a lot where guys are just like, you know, that's fake. Like, of course, I've had those conversations, but we have to have those conversations.

• 47:56Fred Taylor?

  Correct.

• 47:56Speaker 03

  Like, and that's a problem with our world nowadays and kind of everything. We can't agree to disagree. And like, I can understand why someone like Ryan, like you said, like, you are where you are because of how you view mental health. And like, I can't argue that with you because you had an unbelievable career and unbelievable career off the field, sitting here now. Like, I can't tell you that, hey, like, oh, you should have thought about this differently because you got to where you got. But now that we're in this space.

• 48:18Ryan Clark?

  I agree.

• 48:19Speaker 03

  If you are ever to struggle again, then like, we could have a different conversation and like, you know.

• 48:23Ryan Clark?

  It's funny you say that, though. I've gone to therapy now, but that had to come with learning. That had to come with an acceptance of myself and saying, yeah, what you think you know, you don't necessarily understand everything about yourself or what you're dealing with. But I had to be willing to take that step. And I think for so long, it was my crutch to not fall into some of the places you've mentioned.

• 48:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:50Ryan Clark?

  It was, nah, man, we can't be sad. You know, we cut, we work in LSU, we can't feel that.

• 48:55Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:56Ryan Clark?

  Like, because I felt like that was the only way to take that next step, put one foot in front of the other. And maybe that was me coping with my mental health at that point in the only way that I felt like I could.

• 49:05Fred Taylor?

  Right, and to Chan's point, the league has changed a lot. You know, it's not this, this caveman-like mentality, just hit, run through people. It's changing all different forms and fashions. And I know we always talk about it takes a village. You know, during draft week, when I was away from you guys, I met with, we did a roundtable, NFL Legends Group. We met with Roger Goodell, Troy Vincent. And they pretty much just pitched it out to us and asked us, you know, what can we do better? You know, as an entity, as the NFL, you know, to help guys. And it starts with awareness, like RC says, going back, the guys are more aware. Maybe that's why they're less, you know, machismo and in your face and trying to get guys off their game that way.

• 49:49Fred Taylor?

  Because it's a necessity and they're starting to understand. That, you know, guys can really take heart to that. And these are people's lives. It's not a game. It's lives. But what they want to do is develop a community of communication, right? A community of transparency and vulnerability, having players tell their stories. You know, so that way, guys can use those stories as references to say, look, I'm not alone in this. And we got a lot from that because they provide tons and tons of resources that we tend to say, well, nobody reached out to me. You know, when I was here, I was in the locker room. Everybody wanted my attention. Now that the game is over and I'm no longer there, they've dumped me to the side.

• 50:33Fred Taylor?

  And that can allow guys to fall into depression. So what they want to do is just create a community where there's always gonna be contact. And it starts with things as simple as that. Yeah. Having contact. Teams, let's create these email chains and let's put the guys on email group. The NFLPA has an app where guys go on there and they just, it's like the locker room away from the locker room. They're also trying to create programs where in your local communities, they have the, you know, they have the alumni programs at each NFL city. But they're also trying to create these locker room type environments where, you know, guys can go play golf together and get discounts at a, you know, a local course

• 51:14Fred Taylor?

  or the Top Golf in different clubs and places where guys can, you know, feel a part of something. You know, because those, the triggers are what they are, you know. You come up a certain way for years and then, you know, within the snap of a finger, you're alone, you're isolated. And the guys can fall into those traps and then start dealing with these mental things. So the point I'm trying to make is there are, for at least us, you know, and I know you're handling a lot of stuff off the field and outside, but for us, our fraternity. There are so many different ways to seek help. It starts with them hearing this, them seeing it, and then going out there and do it.

• 51:57Fred Taylor?

  But it takes us on here to pull these guys in, to make sure we're not reading, you know, about them, you know, two, three years after they've retired. They've been locked away, they're battling depression, anxiety, you know, this and that. I want to end by asking you, what are some of the resources you would share with, you know, just the general public and people that are, you know, watching, gonna watch this episode?

• 52:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, some of the resources I would tell people, like, just off rip, like, the new 988 number, Crisis Call Line. Whether you text or call it, like, there's a mental professional there for you. You can text 741741, that's the text crisis line. But besides that, like, you know, there is great foundations like AFSP, who can find, you know, resources, who label resources in your area, or whether it's Faith5Finish, like, you know, they do a great job with resources, or my foundation, the Defensive Line. Like, you know, there's a lot of different, like, foundations out there who do a lot of great work. But most importantly, just like, understand, like, in your area, like, where help is, whether it's like a counselor, whether it's a clinician, whether it's a therapist,

• 53:05Speaker 03

  like, trying to find those resources and, like, also, like, just for mental health in general, you know, having a safe place, like, having, like, even if you can't find a therapist, or you can't find a, find someone who is a professional, knowing that, like, hey, like, say, like, me and you, like, you're my safe place. Having something like that, like, that can be your resource as well. But, because like, we, in certain scenarios, situations, we never know what it's gonna be like. So, just having, like, professional help is great too, but also having your local help too, and your, and your support system is always important too. So, having those safe places, I think is huge.

• 53:44Ryan Clark?

  A great woman's social media bio once said, "If you admire someone, go ahead and tell them." Because people never get their flowers while they can smell them. That was your sister. And since she can't be here to tell you, man, I'm extremely proud of the work you've done. Starting with yourself, because without taking care of yourself, you can't be here to take care of people that truly need what you're doing. I believe it is your purpose. I believe you attack it with passion. But I know you do this, but just as a big brother, as somebody who has been in your shoes, take care of yourself, man.

• 54:26Ryan Clark?

  I think we start to get focused and we become breadwinners. We become the person that everybody could look to for help so much. And part of our culture is if I've made it, not only do my people have to made it, but I have to go back into the community. And now you're doubling that up with the mental health community as well. And I just think that we are made to carry certain burdens and we are made to carry certain things, but sometimes it can be too much. And so I love when you said last week I had to take some time for me and I had to focus on what I had to focus on.

• 55:09Ryan Clark?

  Because you can't do us no good if your cup is empty, man. So continue to fill your cup, man. Thank you for giving us that time. And Ella, her name, her life, it was not in vain, man. You keep her alive every single day doing what you're doing. Sir. We appreciate you, bro. Thank you. Yes, sir. Appreciate you, man. Thank you.

• 55:33Speaker 06

  It's big, though, man.

• 55:36Speaker 06

  I'm gonna slap my back a little too hard.

• 55:39Ryan Clark?

  Appreciate you, officer.

• 55:51Speaker 07

  Every game day you show up for your team. Now it's your time.

• 56:26Speaker 08

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Somemagnitide injection 2.4mg a GLP-1. Call 1-8334-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?