Jack Whitehall's Emotional Confession About His Dad, His Biggest Fear & His New Life!

n this new episode Steven sits down with the British comedian, actor, writer and presenter, Jack Whitehall. Jack is a three time winner of the ‘King of Comedy’ at the ‘British Comedy Awards’. He began his television career as a presenter for ‘Big Brother's Big Mouth’ in 2008, before appearing on panel shows such as ‘8 Out of 10 Cats’, ‘Would I Lie To You’ and ‘Mock The Week’. He co-wrote and starred in the TV shows, ‘Fresh Meat’ and ‘Bad Education’, making his film debut with ‘The Bad Education Movie’. He appears with his father, Michael Whitehall, in the Netflix comedy documentary series, ‘Jack Whitehall: Travels with My Father’. The two have also written a book together, ‘Him & Me’. Jack is starring in the new film ‘Robots’ available now in theatres and on demand. In this conversation Jack and Steven discuss topics, such as: How comedy is an escape for Jack Using comedy as a way to hide his anxieties His fears that his success can leave him at any moment How he struggles with achieving a work life balance His relationship with his father and aims for fatherhood Jack is currently touring the UK with his 2023 live show, ‘Settle Down’, tickets and tour dates are available here: https://bit.ly/3BTdeqF Follow: Instagram: https://bit.ly/3ompM6Z Twitter: https://bit.ly/3IFnc2C Follow me: https://beacons.ai/diaryofaceo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  He's the most loving person ever. I want him to have a relationship with my kid.

• 0:07Speaker 00

  I mean, that's why.

• 0:10Speaker 00

  I said I wasn't gonna do this on this.

• 0:14Speaker 00

  I mean, I'm now getting emotional.

• 0:18Steven Bartlett?

  Jack Whitehall, ladies and gentlemen. Actor, writer and award-winning comedian. You are in for a treat.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  Oh, God, that's the key now.

• 0:26Steven Bartlett?

  What is the reason why you're a comedian?

• 0:28Speaker 00

  I use humour to connect with people and have always done so. Growing up, wanting my dad to prove it and definitely not receiving it. It dented my confidence, but it also made me like I would one day make him proud.

• 0:41Steven Bartlett?

  If people really knew you, what would they be most surprised about?

• 0:45Speaker 00

  I do feel the pressure and I do feel the anxiety, but worrying about stuff that is not worth worrying about. A bad review, rejection, online trolls. So many times I'm just like, why don't I just delete all social media from my phone? That would be such a good thing for my mental wellbeing. I have a little bit more sense of vulnerability than I tell people.

• 1:02Steven Bartlett?

  Do you doubt yourself?

• 1:03Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:03Steven Bartlett?

  What impact does that have on you?

• 1:05Speaker 00

  Overworking, not prioritising family and I'm not present when I should be present.

• 1:09Steven Bartlett?

  Roxy's pregnant now. How are you honestly feeling about it?

• 1:14Speaker 00

  Now I'm regretting putting this on camera.

• 1:18Steven Bartlett?

  What you're doing is incredibly high stakes art. Why are you smoking?

• 1:21Speaker 00

  Stephen, I've got a punchline about you're the tramp behind a wheelie bin. I mean, that's not art.

• 1:39Steven Bartlett?

  I've sat here with so many incredible comedians. And it's funny because there's an ongoing stereotype with comedians that they get into comedy for a variety of different reasons. A lot of comedians have said to me, you know, comedians themselves are depressed in some way. Then I had Jimmy Carce say to me, when you meet a comedian, you should ask him which of their parents are depressed. And then I sat here with one particular comedian who...

• 2:08Steven Bartlett?

  Really didn't fit into any of those stereotypes at all. What is the reason why you're a comedian, in your own words?

• 2:16Speaker 00

  I think in the most reductive way, it's because I use humour to connect with people and have always done so. And so I think I've always enjoyed making people laugh. And that's felt to me like a great way to connect with people, whether that be in real life or my audience when I'm up on stage. And I think there are, you know, lots of different reasons that people become comedians. And there is this kind of the sad clown trope, and that's definitely one that does exist. And I think there are people that use comedy for other reasons. But for me, I don't think I fall into that category necessarily.

• 2:58Speaker 00

  I think I have always loved comedy and stand up as an art form because I just really enjoy making people happy and making people laugh and using comedy as escapism.

• 3:12Steven Bartlett?

  As escapism?

• 3:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:14Steven Bartlett?

  From?

• 3:15Speaker 00

  Well, from, you know, it can be from whatever. Like if you've had a bad day at work and you come and see a stand up on stage and they make you laugh, bring you out of a dark place. Or if you're, you know, on your phone and watching the news and depressed about the world and then you can go and forget about all of that. And, you know, it's a great way of, I think, you know, just going and completely relaxing and listening to someone else entertain you. And I think that for me, like, that's what I see my kind of duty as a comedian as.

• 3:55Steven Bartlett?

  Your parents are comedians?

• 3:56Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 3:57Steven Bartlett?

  I spend a lot of time watching. The Wittering Whitewalls?

• 4:01Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:01Steven Bartlett?

  On YouTube, your father in particular is absolutely fucking hilarious.

• 4:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:05Steven Bartlett?

  Do you think your sort of comedic edge came from there? Or because you have siblings, right?

• 4:11Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:11Steven Bartlett?

  Who aren't comedians?

• 4:12Speaker 00

  They're not comedians. I mean, they're both pretty funny people and there was a lot of laughter in our household when we were growing up. And I definitely think my dad in particular was my kind of most, you know, dominant early comic influence. Because again, I would watch how he used humor and how making people laugh was this way that he had to kind of unlock people. And he was an amazing raconteur and told these incredible stories. And I watched how people would hang on his every word. And I remember being really in awe of that and thinking, oh, I'd love to not only amuse him when I'm able to do so,

• 4:54Speaker 00

  but also, you know, emulate him and try to be, you know, someone that people enjoy the company of and the presence of because of my kind of like wit, I guess. And so, yeah, he was definitely like, for me, the person that influenced me the most when I was thinking, oh, yeah, that's definitely something that I would be interested in pursuing.

• 5:16Steven Bartlett?

  When was that point where you thought, I could pursue comedy professionally as a real job?

• 5:22Speaker 00

  Um, I don't know. I think it probably wasn't until the Edinburgh Festival, when I went to the Edinburgh Festival in my teens and saw stand-up comics. I mean, prior to that, like, most of my knowledge of comedy had been stuff that I'd seen on TV and movies and Laurel and Hardy and Norman Wisdom. And that felt like, you know, hilarious, but kind of very alien in a way. And then going up to Edinburgh and seeing like stand-ups performing and people that were maybe slightly closer to me in age and were talking about things that I could relate to. And all of a sudden I was like, wow, this is like genuinely a viable career path. Had I known that they were probably all up there performing for a month at Edinburgh and hemorrhaging money

• 6:07Speaker 00

  and not filling out the venues every night. It's like a really, really difficult career path for the vast majority of comedians. But I was kind of young and doughy-eyed and just saw, you know, the incredible aspect of it, which is, you know, the other thing that appeals to me about comedy, which is that it's a way of. Doing something that isn't a real job and isn't sat in an office doing something that to me would be kind of mind crushingly boring. It's a creative pursuit, which I think I would always have been gravitating towards.

• 6:41Steven Bartlett?

  Was there not a lot of influences in your life telling you that comedy is not a real job? Like, I remember.

• 6:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, a lot.

• 6:49Steven Bartlett?

  Who were those influences and what were they saying and why didn't you listen?

• 6:53Speaker 00

  Well, so at school, I was always talking about trying to do stuff off my own bat and do sketches and taking a show to Edinburgh was my idea and the school were very anti that at the time and the drama teacher thought it was a waste of time. My parents were very, very keen that I didn't necessarily pursue a career in the like arts, I think, because my dad was an agent and he'd looked after loads of really successful actors, but he'd also looked after a load of actors that had been out of work and had really struggled. And my mum had had a career as an actor that hadn't necessarily given her the fulfillment that I think she wanted it to. And, you know, she'd had some sort of bit parts on television

• 7:37Speaker 00

  and then had to give it up. And so they were very aware that, you know, that it was a very, very competitive industry. And so they were very keen that I make sure that I focus on my studies and have something to fall back on if I were to not make it in, you know, the arts. I mean, it was a little ill thought through because the other passions that I had were things like art. And so I ended up going to university to study history of art, which I don't necessarily think is, you know, of industries to fall back on. Like, art history is not the most transferable skill. And then also by pushing me away from, you know, going to drama school or becoming an actor, which would have been the other

• 8:19Speaker 00

  thing that I would have wanted to do at that age. I was so frustrated that I wasn't able to do that, that I went and I did the degree. And then I was like, well, I need to perform in some way. Oh, my God, I could do stand up and they'll have no control over that. So then I started doing stand up as my side hustle. And, you know, they pushed me into comedy, which again is like a really, really competitive industry and, you know.

• 8:45Speaker 00

  If they'd wanted me to become a lawyer or a banker, which they always claimed that they did, they went about it completely the wrong way.

• 8:52Steven Bartlett?

  In hindsight, hindsight's such a wonderful thing. What do you think if you could reverse the clocks now and you could be Jack's parents and you could make the decision for Jack at that age, that really pivotal age, what he did next in the, with the intention of accelerating his career, his happiness, his, his talent, what, what should and what would you do as Jack's parents in hindsight?

• 9:19Speaker 00

  Oof, I don't know.

• 9:21Steven Bartlett?

  Push him towards drama school?

• 9:23Speaker 00

  No, no, no. I, I think they probably, they did probably play it right. It's the weird thing. In a roundabout way, it all sort of worked out okay. And I don't, I don't begrudge them for any of those decisions. And they were, which people are always surprised to hear. It's like, well, they're not surprised to hear it now because people have seen my relationship with my family. And, you know, we have a, I call it, I call it a travel log, but some people have pointed out, it is also almost like a reality television show. We're like the posh Kardashians. And so people have been exposed to my family and can see that, you know, we have an unusual relationship, but we are very close. But people are always surprised to hear that it was always the case, even when I was, you know,

• 10:06Speaker 00

  away at boarding school, we still had like a really good connection. I in fact, always say that going to boarding school was probably quite helpful to my relationship with my parents. If anyone has seen my father, he's, he's quite, he's better in small doses. I think having that distance from him was probably very healthy and is why we had such a good relationship. So yeah, there's a lot of things where at the time I was, oh God, why are you doing this? And I, I mean, when they sent me to boarding school, I was, I was so upset. I was like, I do not want to go. I'm happy with my friends. I want to stay in, in London with them at this school. And I was really struggling at that school and I wasn't coming out of my shell. And I hadn't found, you know, any of my kind of passions

• 10:51Speaker 00

  or interests. And there was no one cultivating any of them. And so they looked at that and thought, we need to do something and make a change. And they found this school in Oxford, which I went around and they met lots of teachers and it had a far more kind of like.

• 11:10Speaker 00

  It I don't know, it had like an eccentric feel. It felt like a better fit for me, but it was a boarding school. And so they took me out of the school that I was struggling in and sent me to that boarding school. And I remember being, oh, my God, I was so upset. I was like, no, please, like, honestly, Daddy, I don't want to go. And he said to me at the time, he was like, look, it's fine. If you go there and you don't like it, you can come back after a term. And I promise you, if you turn around and you tell me that, then you can come out and go back to the school that you're at in London. I was like, okay, well, that's, you know, something that I can hold on to. And I remember that really helped get through the first term away. And then I asked him subsequently, many years later, I was like, you know, when you said that, it really helped. He's like, I had no intention of doing that, even if you had been very upset.

• 11:52Speaker 00

  You were there for the year. I'd got you in. It had been very hard to get you in there and you were staying, whether you liked it or not. And I don't know whether that's him sort of slightly being a nuisance, but there may have been some truth to it.

• 12:05Steven Bartlett?

  Didn't you around like eleven or something audition to be Harry Potter?

• 12:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:09Steven Bartlett?

  That's that's crazy.

• 12:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, I did a bit of child acting, again, just because I was sort of adjacent to that world. And I saw, you know, my dad in that industry and my mom and my mom was still acting back then. I was so enamored of it. So as a kid, I did want to do it and, you know,

• 12:28Speaker 00

  I had a few sort of quite low level acting jobs as a child with like single lines in TV shows. I got dubbed in one because I couldn't deliver the line properly. I had one line which was, it's not a monster, it's a rabbit. And and I and the day just developed a speech impediment, it's not a monster, it's a rabbit. And when it actually went out, they redubbed me. So it was another child's voice coming out of my mouth. So I'd had that job and then I'd had one other job where I had no lines. I had another job that I got and and I swear this is true, but I I'd have to, I can't remember exactly how it happened. But I I got like demoted. I got cast in a part where which was like quite a good speaking role.

• 13:11Speaker 00

  And then like on the day, all of a sudden I was, it was goodbye Mr. Chips with Martin Clunes. And all of a sudden I was like at the back of a class and had no lines and I can't. For the life of me, I understand how that happened. I mean, I was very young at the time. Maybe I was just so terrible that they saw me in the rehearsal and thought, nah, you're now out of shot, right at the back. And then Harry Potter, yeah. So that was around the time that obviously I was doing these little acting roles. And then there was this audition for Harry Potter. And they did an open casting at my school. They came with a casting director to to to kind of audition loads of kids. And they were doing it around the country. And there was a lot of like, excitement about this, because obviously

• 13:54Speaker 00

  the book was so popular. And I remember calling my dad and saying, they're doing this open casting. And I'm gonna enter myself into it. And he was like, oh, no, that's a complete waste of time. I was like, what do you mean? He's like, well, they never cast anyone at these open castings. It'll be some casting director's assistant assistant. You know, it's it's a complete waste of time. If you genuinely want to audition for Harry Potter, I will get you in front of the casting director. So he drove down to Oxford, took me out of school for the day, got me down to London, through some connections of his, managed to get me an audition with the casting director of Harry Potter. I went into the casting room and completely tanked the audition, because I was not a very good actor as a

• 14:37Speaker 00

  child, as is proven by the track record up until that point. I also hadn't read the book, because I'd just never been a great reader. And I'd read like, the first couple of chapters and then got bored. And I didn't have any knowledge of the the plot of Harry Potter. And that was exposed in the audition as well. And so it was about as bad as an audition could go. And I came out and I looked at him and was like, yeah, I don't think you need to worry about that one. And then the, I think, the nice, heartwarming end to this story, my dad having been, you know,

• 15:14Speaker 00

  Outrageous in his behaviour and the nepotism being out of control. In the open casting, they cast Emma Watson as Hermione and she did get cast from just entering through the correct channels and not calling up her dad and asking him to get her in front of the casting director. And she had that wonderful life changing opportunity, which she earned. And that's the way that it should be.

• 15:39Steven Bartlett?

  But I look at all of that and I go that that phase of your life, it doesn't seem like there was a ton of self belief. Because you've got your dad, your dad sort of chiming in at parts, saying subtly saying, the odds aren't good, son. Indirectly. And then, you know, the being sent to the back of the classroom in the acting thing you do, subtle knocks.

• 16:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:03Steven Bartlett?

  Does that stay with you as you go into comedy? And is that an accurate assessment of how you were feeling at that point?

• 16:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, I definitely was not very confident at that age. And I was quite, I was quite odd and eccentric and in the right company and in a safe environment and around my kind of family, I think I was a little bit more confident. But at school, I certainly wasn't. I was very awkward, like very like unfortunate looking child as well. I had huge buck teeth and glasses and like a cowlick. And you see photographs of me from then and you look like a kid that would not have a lot of confidence. And then had the like, you know, massive braces in my face for for a long period of my childhood. And that made, you

• 16:52Speaker 00

  know, that there was definitely a lack of confidence because of that. And, you know, the various knockbacks and, and then realising, oh, I quite like acting and performing. And, you know, for for years, I would audition for all of these school plays and I would never get cast in anything. And so that didn't help. And, and also, you know, I guess wanting my, my dad's approval, which I always did, you know, right from the get go and definitely not receiving it like that. It dented my confidence, but it also made me like, I don't know, I think it gave me a kind of resolve that I would, I would one day achieve it and I would make him proud and,

• 17:35Speaker 00

  you know, because he'd been sort of dismissive of, you don't want to become an actor and you're never going to become an actor. That made me want to do it even more and be like, oh, no, no, I really think I can do this. And then with the comedy thing, the other aspect is that he was and remains the hardest person to crack ever. Like, he doesn't laugh anything. And, you know, I do have that overriding memory that as a kid, I always was desperate to try and make him laugh and to like, crack him and to, if I could get him to laugh, like, that felt like such an achievement. And even to this day, you know, like when he comes to do shows or if I'm doing things with him,

• 18:14Speaker 00

  like, he's a really hard, like, tough crowd. He's got, as you've seen, like, a real, I mean, resting bitch face. I believe that's what the kids are calling it. And, yeah, if I can even get like a smile from him, it transports me back to being, you know, 12 or 13 years old and having that same thing of, I really want to make him laugh.

• 18:37Steven Bartlett?

  Has he had any sort of acting qualifications or anything? Because when I saw him on Chatty Man

• 18:43Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:43Steven Bartlett?

  with you, I was thinking, God, he's an unbelievable actor. He's an unbelievable actor. Like, you're right, just steel face.

• 18:51Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah. No, he's had no training at all. But I guess just because he does so, so little and gives away so little that, I don't know, that almost feels like it's performative and maybe it is to an extent. But no, he's, yeah, he's had absolutely no training whatsoever.

• 19:07Steven Bartlett?

  So you go off and you do, you go up to Edinburgh, you see that, that's a big inspiration for you.

• 19:14Steven Bartlett?

  What happens next? How'd you go from there to?

• 19:19Steven Bartlett?

  Doing shows and climbing up the comedic ladder very, very quickly.

• 19:24Speaker 00

  So then I, yeah, I went to Edinburgh with a sketch show with two of my friends from school. And we did it at the Pleasance and we did a month in this tiny room that's now a disabled toilet. That's how small it was.

• 19:38Speaker 00

  And there was like, you know, 10 seats and us performing this sketch show. We had no idea what we were doing. It was all kind of cobbled together sketches that we'd copied from not the nine o'clock news and League of Gentlemen. And got terrible reviews. But in the middle of it, I came out and did stand up. And I'd never done stand up before. And I thought that stand up was just something that you could do. I'd never done a gig. I literally just walked out in the middle of this sketch show and did 10 minutes of stand up.

• 20:13Speaker 00

  It was described by one reviewer as Jack Whitehall appears on stage in the middle of the show and does an impression of what he thinks a stand up is. And that is a pretty fair assessment of what it was. But a guy called Ben Cavey, who was a producer at the time, came to that show and saw me and saw that there was, I had some promise or there was something that he recognized in me that he thought, you know, I had some potential. And so I then went and met with him when I was down in London. He worked for Tiger Aspect, who are a great production company and made Mr. Bean, Catherine Tate, Ben Adorn, all of these shows. And with him, I started developing.

• 20:58Speaker 00

  He asked me to do tour support for Horn and Corden. When James Corden and Matt Horn were doing their double act around the time of Gavin and Stacey, because he was working on a show with them. And he said, oh, there's this guy who I saw at Edinburgh. He's really funny. He's very new, very young. You're doing these warm up shows of your sketch show. You should get him to come out and he could do some stand up before you go on. And so I did support for them and that's how I met James and how I met Matt, who would end up being in my sitcom. And James and Matt were kind of quite instrumental in me getting my first television gig as well. So they.

• 21:42Speaker 00

  They did a Big Brothers Big Mouth and they were like the guest hosts on that and they were meant to do a whole series and they had to pull out and because they'd seen me do stand up for them as their warm up act. James like was very good at kind of, you know, uh, speaking to whoever the person was at Channel Four and saying, oh, you know, you should get to host this show is Jack. Um, and so, yeah, I ended up doing like live TV hosting Big Brothers Big Mouth, which was the show that kind of had created Russell Brand. And I was

• 22:16Speaker 00

  I was eighteen or nineteen, nineteen. I was, I was young and very, very, very inexperienced. Like my comic persona was, you know, all over the shop because I hadn't like found my voice yet and I was already on TV. I got definitely got catapulted on television far too quickly. Like I always say this, like you look at like Mickey Flanagan or John Bishop or any of the kind of like really established comedians, when they break and they become TV stars, they've been doing it for ten years and they've honed their act and they know exactly who they are and you get like the finished article. When I was put on TV, I was like still basically an open mic comedian almost. I mean, I'd done paid gigs,

• 22:59Speaker 00

  but I was still like going on and talking in a mockney accent because I hadn't worked out what like, like that I could be myself on stage. I was so terrified to, to go up onto a stand up comedy stage and talk in my voice. Cause I was like, they're all gonna hate me. No one's gonna want to like listen to some public school by waffling on. So I'm gonna have to disguise that and I'm gonna go on and I'm gonna talk like Danny Dyer. And so for the first couple of years of my like stand up career, I'd do that. And all these other comedians afterwards, they would be like, oh yeah, well, you've got some great stage presence, but. You just, you haven't found your voice yet. And I was like, oh, well, could you, could you tell me what my voice is? And they're like, that's not really how it works. You need to find your voice and you'll go on a journey.

• 23:42Speaker 00

  I was like, just cut the Yoda crap. Like, just what is my voice? And I found it so frustrating, but that is a process that you have to go through as a comedian. You need to find your voice. And my problem was when I was trying to find my voice, I, I didn't even know who I was as a person back then. I was eighteen, nineteen years old. Like, I'm like, at that age, like, I don't think you've like formulated who you are. And so I was in this kind of weird, like, period of flux where I was trying all these different comic personas. I settled on this one that was like basically a kind of, like a homage to Russell Brand. It was so inauthentic. It wasn't who I was, but, you know, it gave me a kind of a little bit of a,

• 24:25Speaker 00

  I guess, a little bit of an armor that I was hiding behind a kind of character almost. And it gave me some confidence. And so I was, I was, I was in that kind of like period of my, like, development when all of a sudden I was doing like live television for the first time. And I watched some of the footage back of me from those early days. And I want to hide behind the sofa. It's so cringe. I've got this big shock of like electric hair and wearing this skinny jeans. I look like I've just fallen out of the holly arms. And I'm talking in a way that just bears no correlation to like who I am. It was, it was, it's very strange.

• 25:06Steven Bartlett?

  Do you not, do you not have imposter syndrome at all? Because, you know, you come in at nineteen, twenty years old to an industry full of, you know, veterans and people that look like they know what they're doing.

• 25:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 25:17Steven Bartlett?

  Just to play a good job of like knowing, knowing what they're doing. Do you feel that at that young age?

• 25:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think I did feel a little bit of that.

• 25:27Speaker 00

  But yeah, I think I I was just probably, I don't know, so ambitious that uh I went into those dressing rooms and even though I was kind of in awe of a lot of these people again, I was just like, well, I really wanna kind of prove myself. And every time I had a bad gig, you know, I'd always, my takeaway would be, well, I need to just like get better then, and I will get better, and I know I can get better.

• 25:53Speaker 00

  And I, and I, yeah, I think I had quite a lot of resilience.

• 25:59Speaker 00

  I was naive, but then I obviously probably helped get through some gigs that if I'd been a little bit older, I would have been like, why the hell am I doing this? And also, you know, obviously, it, I mean, it helped very much that I come from a background of privilege and that I was, you know, wasn't having to support a family or pay a mortgage and I could kind of pursue this full Zerrin for a bit.

• 26:26Steven Bartlett?

  What's a, what's a bad gig, you know, for, for someone like you? What does that feel like? What does it look like?

• 26:32Speaker 00

  Um, I think, and I've had so many bad gigs.

• 26:39Speaker 00

  Back in the day, it was going and doing ten minutes in a pub and performing to twenty people. You're set up to fail, really. Cause it's never gonna be a stormer because the environment is not conducive to comedy. Cause you're in a noisy pub, fighting against a, you know, fruit machine and some of the people are on their phones, some of the people are sort of half listening to you. There's like a tinny microphone, terrible sound system.

• 27:11Speaker 00

  And you're going on like tenth on the bill and everyone's a bit drunk and you're never gonna kill that gig. And then you go, we'll go out and you do ten minutes of your material and It like barely raises a titter and then you've got to get on a train and go back to London and be in your own thoughts for two hours. Like, that's pretty soul crushing. But I don't know why, I don't know why I like, and there were a lot of those at the beginning. I think probably because I was like, still at that point, I was living in Manchester with all of my mates in a student house and having like a great time, didn't have many worries in the world.

• 27:54Speaker 00

  Cause I was eighteen, nineteen and I was going off and doing these gigs and sometimes they go well. And sometimes I would crash and burn, but I don't know, it just didn't like, I didn't, I didn't feel the pressure. That, that's what was so amazing about that period of my life is that I just don't remember feeling any pressure. And now if I tank a gig or I go out and, you know, mess up the Brit Awards, I do feel the pressure and I do feel the anxiety of it all. And I, and I didn't have as much professional anxiety back then. Cause I was sort of on a relatively upward trajectory. Um, and you know,

• 28:33Speaker 00

  it all felt so full of possibility. I, I just think I was sort of unburdened by all of the kind of anxieties that I would have now as a comedian and a performer.

• 28:44Steven Bartlett?

  Reminds me of my conversation with Lewis Capaldi. He, he told me about singing in pubs in Scotland and like no one was really listening.

• 28:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:52Steven Bartlett?

  He almost talks about it as if he would prefer to go back and do that now because it, because there's no arenas, there's no expectations, there's no pressure. And I actually think he said on the podcast, I think he said like, I just want to sing in a pub in Scotland.

• 29:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 29:04Steven Bartlett?

  Um, your success and his success have meant that that's, you know, that's, I, I would say not, it's, it's certainly possible.

• 29:12Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 29:13Steven Bartlett?

  But even if you were announced as being in a pub, expectation would show up.

• 29:17Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah. And I, and I do, and I, and I, and I connected with his documentary in, in, in that aspect when I watched it and saw like him articulate some of those elements. Cause that is, it is so true. And, you know. Yeah, you do a show now and you're putting it on in an arena and like the level of expectation is so much higher and you've got to shift, you know, a huge amount of tickets, there's going to be reviewers there, you've got to entertain like a vast crowd. If it goes wrong, like that's a news event. And back then, there was none of that, like I'd die in a pub, you know.

• 29:57Speaker 00

  If Jack Whitehall crashes and burns in the middle of an empty forest, does he make a sound? And my forest was a pub in Preston.

• 30:05Steven Bartlett?

  Does that make, does that make it less fun?

• 30:09Steven Bartlett?

  Is there like a certain point?

• 30:10Speaker 00

  I enjoyed it in a weird, in a weird, and I still do to an extent when I'm like, maybe more so now, like when I'm working it through. There is like a sadomasochistic thing that quite enjoys like the tricky gigs and like working out why, why it hasn't worked and what I need to do to, to get it to work like I do.

• 30:32Steven Bartlett?

  But I mean, the pressure now, does that make it less fun?

• 30:34Speaker 00

  Oh, the pressure, sorry, yes.

• 30:37Steven Bartlett?

  Cause you've used the word professional anxieties a few times.

• 30:39Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, I mean, that element of it does for sure. And I don't remember feeling that when I was in my kind of early twenties, but all of a sudden they sort of creep up on you and you're, you're in your own thoughts a lot more. And constantly like, like, I don't know.

• 31:01Speaker 00

  Just thinking about, uh, about like, I just, for me, it's like worry that it will all go away. And like, that's, that's always like the, the kind of, the great, the greatest fear is that it's just going to stop and I, and I've loved doing it. But yeah, there are, there are lots of other added pressures that weren't existent when I started doing it. And I, I, I look back on it and yeah, do kind of like miss that headspace.

• 31:31Steven Bartlett?

  A lot of people can relate to that, that fear of worrying that it'll all go away. Even, you know, people that have climbed the corporate ladder, they've gotten to a certain position. And I've seen it a lot of the times with some of my friends and even in some of my companies where. People will say to me that they're just trying to kind of hang on to where they are.

• 31:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 31:49Steven Bartlett?

  And when you have that mindset, it can, it can, it seems like it can be quite unenjoyable. Because there's that constant sort of, as you describe, anxiety.

• 31:59Steven Bartlett?

  But also, I, I'm not sure if everyone does their best work when they're kind of hanging on. Because there's, there's not this sort of mental freedom to fully express or to relax or take time off. So I'm not sure if we do our best work.

• 32:13Steven Bartlett?

  Is that, is that what you're saying? You feel like you're, you have a constant worry that everything you've built might someday change. And I guess the more important question is where, do you know where that's come from in you?

• 32:25Steven Bartlett?

  That I, that idea that it could just.

• 32:28Speaker 00

  No, I mean, I don't know. I don't know where it comes from, but, and, and, and it, I don't know. And, and I don't, and, and it's not like a cancel culture thing of me going, oh, I'm worried I'm going to say something. And then all of a sudden I'm going to get cancelled and then I'm never going to be able to do shows again. It doesn't, it's not even like linked to that, although obviously there is like a small chance that that could happen. I don't, I don't necessarily feel like I pushed the boundaries in such a way that that feels likely. But yeah, I don't know how I've, I've allowed that to sort of creep up on me.

• 33:05Speaker 00

  And I think, I think the, the, the key to not allowing that to consume you is to sort of just try to refocus your mind on like what's important. And, you know, ultimately, some of the things that are, you know, the concerns that like build up as professional anxieties ultimately aren't as important. As long as you're doing, like ultimately, as long as I'm still doing stand up and still doing what I love and still getting to, you know, act and perform, it doesn't necessarily matter.

• 33:42Speaker 00

  You know, how how I'm doing that, I'm doing what I love and and that should be enough. And and then also just like refocusing my energies on like my work, life balance and focusing on what's important, my relationship, family, those are the things that make me happy. And as long as those are working, then I think I will feel fulfilled. Um. And so I think it's, yeah, it's how I like frame that in in my head.

• 34:09Steven Bartlett?

  Even from doing this, because I'm I'm not a journalist or I think I didn't go to a podcast school or whatever. I still sit here and go, how the fuck is this still a thing? Like, how how are people still listening to this? We admit it. I mean, Jack did productions beforehand, but you, Jack, you've never done anything like this before, have you? I've never done anything like this before. So it's all a little bit, what the fuck is going on? Just keep going and hopefully nobody notices us.

• 34:37Steven Bartlett?

  It's like almost the feeling because you almost assume that all of your competitors or other people that are doing it in your space, they have some certificate. That is like giving them the rights.

• 34:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 34:47Steven Bartlett?

  And a and a rulebook that we're that we're not privy to.

• 34:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 34:50Steven Bartlett?

  Um. Can you relate to any of that? That feeling that like?

• 34:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, there is, yeah, and there is no kind of like playbook for it, is is there? Like with a career and with, you know, with all of it. So I I like the the worst thing you can do is start like

• 35:09Speaker 00

  comparing yourself to other people and like thinking about that too much as well. And I mean, so so many times I'm just like, why don't I just delete all social media from my phone? I think I would be such a good thing for my like mental wellbeing. I just haven't quite brought myself to do it yet, but maybe that's something that I should try. But it's just the like the worrying about stuff that is not worth worrying about. It's like, I wish I I want to get better at that. I really want to like work at that.

• 35:38Steven Bartlett?

  What impact does that have on you?

• 35:40Speaker 00

  That I'm not present when I should be present. I think that's that's where I feel it. It is most frustrating in my life is when I'm worrying about. Fucking nonsense that doesn't need to be consuming me and I'm not present with friends and family and people that I need to like give more of myself to.

• 36:00Steven Bartlett?

  What's an example of something that might consume you, like a little troll online or like a review or?

• 36:04Speaker 00

  I mean, yeah, I mean, that can it can take me out for a couple of days. Like rejection, professional rejection, not getting a part in something. A bad review, things like that. And then for a couple of days, I'll sort of be spinning out and then, you know, I'll catch myself doing it and be like, what am I doing? I don't need to do that. I have more sensitivity, I think, than I sort of let on. I've always sort of billed myself as being quite resilient and thick skinned, which I am to a degree, but I think there are things and elements where I am a little bit more sensitive and vulnerable than than I than I tell people.

• 36:46Steven Bartlett?

  You and me both.

• 36:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:48Steven Bartlett?

  You and me both. And I think obviously in different jobs that I've had, I've had to be, I've been the CEO of the companies. So you you kind of learn to put up a everything's fine.

• 36:58Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:58Steven Bartlett?

  But some you can be behind the scenes, like spinning out a little bit for a couple of days based on something. When you say spinning out, what does that, if I'm Roxy.

• 37:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 37:06Steven Bartlett?

  Your wonderful partner.

• 37:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 37:07Steven Bartlett?

  What would Roxy observe when Jack is spinning out?

• 37:10Speaker 00

  That that I'm in a sort of weird fugue state because I'm also one of those people that just like, I'm a barrier. I don't articulate a lot of

• 37:19Speaker 00

  of these emotions and I and I do and I definitely, I don't know whether it's because of my background or my upbringing, but I'm someone that doesn't really want to burden people with them. I feel like as well as a comedian, as a funny person, again, I like, I feel like I'm letting people down if I'm like a Debbie Downer and talking about stuff that is gonna, you know, kill the mood. I just, I'm don't like conflict. I I don't like

• 37:51Speaker 00

  to depress people. So I think I sort of, I like, yeah. Bury it all, put it on a brave face and then, um, yeah, just maybe not quite myself. So you probably wouldn't even realise it was going on, but I think for rocks it's, it's hard because, yeah, sometimes I'm just like a little bit away with the fairies, but that's because I'm having this like internal dialogue. Is everything gonna be okay? Oh my God, they hate me. No, no, no, you're gonna be fine. And that's all going on. And I'm like, yeah, yeah, I'm fine.

• 38:24Steven Bartlett?

  Someone said to me once, they said, the people that care most about the applause, which tends to be like performers and comedians and stuff, also care the most about the booze.

• 38:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 38:31Steven Bartlett?

  Do you, do you think that's accurate?

• 38:33Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 38:34Steven Bartlett?

  Like, it's not possible just to care about one side of that spectrum. You can't just care about the applause and then say, oh, booze don't matter. I don't care. I'm invincible.

• 38:40Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 38:41Steven Bartlett?

  Feedback, isn't it?

• 38:41Speaker 00

  No, definitely. It's definitely, yeah, it's definitely feedback. And, you know, like, audiences that upset me or online trolls, I mean, I do consume quite a lot of that. If I, if I'm brutally honest with myself, I probably consume more of it than I should, um, and read it. And, and again, I'm like, I think it's fine. I think it sort of bounces off me, but maybe it doesn't bounce off me as much. And I'm like, it's all stored away somewhere. Um, you know, it's good, but I don't know. I also like part of me, and I'm not encouraging people to troll me online. But I'm like, there is a good, it's good to like, keep your ego in check as well.

• 39:24Speaker 00

  I do like, like constructive criticism as well, I think is very useful. And like some feedback, cause if you didn't have any of that and you were just like, you, you just went on the reaction to the audiences of paid punters that have come to see you. And clearly I like onside and it's like a home gig because they're, you know, fans of you that have bought a ticket to you. And that was your only like, interaction. And that was where you kind of garnered what like,

• 39:54Speaker 00

  Your relationship with the public was, you would think you were just like the Messiah.

• 39:59Speaker 00

  It's quite good to be reminded, yeah, there are some people that find you a bit much and.

• 40:04Steven Bartlett?

  But has their feedback, those people, those trolls, has it made you a better comedian?

• 40:08Speaker 00

  I mean, every now and again, I get quite good, like, you know, joke from something that someone said.

• 40:15Steven Bartlett?

  Oh, okay.

• 40:16Speaker 00

  No, I don't think it's made me a better comedian. But when someone calls, says on Twitter that my new hairstyle looks like a Tesco's value Richard Hammond, I'm like.

• 40:27Speaker 00

  Those are quite rare. Normally it's like, why is this posh twat on television every time I turn it on? No, I can't want.

• 40:37Steven Bartlett?

  When you, when you bury stuff, though, like a seed, it kind of grows. I always, always think this. And I think it subtly changes us over time, all the things we have buried. Like, even if we don't ever express it or whatever, I feel like it kind of just infects our character a little bit.

• 40:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 40:50Steven Bartlett?

  That's certainly what's happened to me for sure, for sure.

• 40:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 40:52Steven Bartlett?

  Just over time, I think slowly, the things that I've like buried or ignored, they kind of just

• 40:59Steven Bartlett?

  weigh me down a little bit and you might become a little bit snappier or a little bit, you know, more impatient or negative about the world or whatever. Is that the case with you?

• 41:08Speaker 00

  Yeah. I think for me, the main way it, it affects me is, is like, it's like a, it is ultimately just like a focus thing. It's like focusing on, it, it makes me focus on the wrong things. And that's the thing that I struggled with most of my life is my like, is work-life balance. I think I'm terrible at work-life balance and I always have been. Because I started when I was 17 and I just didn't stop. And so I used to hate going on holidays. I was like, going on holidays, a complete waste of time. And I, I remember like calling my agent and my dad from a beach somewhere going, I can't wait to get home. And I've always had that like weird attitude to like work and wanting to work, work, work, work, work, work.

• 41:52Speaker 00

  I'm about to have quite a big life event and I think that will.

• 41:56Steven Bartlett?

  What life event, Jack?

• 41:57Speaker 00

  I'm about to have a baby, which I'm like, I'm so excited about. And also, I'm just like, the thing that I pray that it does is just completely like shifts my focus and, and I'm so excited to have this little being in the world that is more important than anything else. I think that's going to be such a healthy thing. And I know that's not necessarily the reason to have a child. I probably should have worked through some of these things before the baby arrived. But like, that's an element of it that for some people might be quite daunting, but I'm like, I think that's going to be amazing. And I'm really, really excited and I can't wait to be a dad. And I'm like, it just, I just really, really cannot wait to like, sort of step up to the plate and, and, and try to be the best dad that I can be and have that as my focus.

• 42:39Speaker 00

  And, and when I'm focused on that and not thinking about all of the other stuff, I think it's going to just be great. Maybe that's quite a glass half full.

• 42:47Steven Bartlett?

  Well, yeah, it sounds like a conversation that I've been having with myself, but also with my partner, where I've said to her, because she's scared that I'm, I might just keep working. And she, I think she asks me once every month, she goes, are you going to be like this when we have kids together? And I'll go, no, no, no, I'll change.

• 43:03Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:03Steven Bartlett?

  When, when the baby comes, I will be different.

• 43:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:08Steven Bartlett?

  I'll, I'll just cancel stuff. I'll say no to everything.

• 43:12Speaker 00

  Now I'm having all of these conversations. Um, yeah.

• 43:17Steven Bartlett?

  But I, I've always said, you, you don't know.

• 43:19Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:20Steven Bartlett?

  You don't know what will happen. None of us have ever experienced that feeling that some of our friends, I'm sure have explained where your priorities shift upon the arrival of this.

• 43:29Speaker 00

  Arsenal, baby. Well, you know, baby Arsenal work.

• 43:34Steven Bartlett?

  Do you, do you think, I, I've asked a few people this because when I meet someone that describes themselves as being a bit of a workaholic, I wonder whether they're, whether they are driven or whether they are being dragged. Which, which resonates more with you? Do you think you're driven or do you think you're being dragged?

• 43:52Speaker 00

  I think I'm driven. I think I'm, if, yeah, I'm driven. I think it would be quite helpful to be dragged back a bit sometimes. I definitely think it would be good.

• 44:05Speaker 00

  Because I have this weird career where I I act and I write and I do stand up as well. It's very easy to fill my entire diary all the time.

• 44:17Speaker 00

  And if I look at a like, you know, a couple of months, I'm like, I'm not doing anything there. You know, I was meant to be filming a movie then and it's been delayed now and I've got two months. I was like, well, I need to do stand up and I'm going to write a script and uh gonna produce as well. And I have a production company, so I'm constantly developing things and I just like. And that all comes from me. That's not people going, oh, Jack, can we, we've got this gap. Can we do this now? It's me going, we can do this now and we can fill this now and we can develop that. And I can write this and and I cram so much stuff into, you know, my schedule. And I think again, like, you know, professionally, it might be better to to to take a beat sometimes

• 44:58Speaker 00

  and prioritize, like, taking some time off as well and having a little bit of headspace. I mean, the pandemic was weirdly a time when we were forced to do that. And I found it very helpful creatively to to not be working all the time. And and this stand up tour, I've had longer to prepare for it than I've ever had. And I've had way more kind of headspace and space to like, like, live my life a bit, which is so important when you're creating and you're writing, especially when you're trying to, you know, write personal material, you need to live your life. You can't be working all the time because then all of your experiences are going to be professional ones. No one wants to go and watch a stand up comedian sell a load of jokes about what it's like being on set

• 45:42Speaker 00

  and like anecdotes about like, uh, you know, uh, script reads and whatever. Like, that's not interesting comedy material for anyone. And fame as well, I don't think is necessarily always the best uh kind of, you know, source of relatable stand up. So I think it's really important as a comedian to have that time to go and like, live your life and build up some experiences and and and find inspiration as it naturally occurs rather than trying to force it.

• 46:13Steven Bartlett?

  And on a personal level, um, that that conversation about work-life balance and giving yourself some time and not just cramming everything into the calendar. What are the consequences of you not being balanced as it relates to your personal life?

• 46:28Speaker 00

  That I think, yeah, I, I, I seem to sort of, that's the perennial mistake that I make is overworking, not prioritizing friends and family and, and then having to sort of make up for it. And I don't want to always be making up for it. Um, and I think I'm quite good at making up for it. And, uh, you know,

• 46:53Speaker 00

  I then put a lot of pressure on myself, oh, I've got to like, see all of these people and, and make sure that I cram in a load of social situations and sneak in a little holiday there and, and, and that, and I wish I didn't have that approach because then everything feels rushed and, and I'd prefer it not to feel as rushed. I'd prefer to, yeah, just, uh, but like, it's all gonna be fine. When the baby comes, it's all gonna change.

• 47:22Steven Bartlett?

  How are you feeling?

• 47:23Speaker 00

  Overnight.

• 47:24Steven Bartlett?

  How are you honestly feeling about, about, you know, Roxy's sort of five months um, pregnant now? How are you honestly feeling about becoming a dad?

• 47:35Speaker 00

  I'm feeling excited. It's hard. It's a weird one because like, sometimes it feels very real and then sometimes it's just a sort of abstract concept and idea and it feels very, very surreal. Um, and it sort of flips between

• 47:53Speaker 00

  both of those things on almost like a daily basis. Uh, and sometimes I feel overwhelmed thinking about it. Other times I'm like, I barely engaged to it at all because I'm so distracted with other things. And so it's a really weird emotional place to be in right now, like this sort of run up to, to having a kid. And, and I've spoken to lots of friends that have been in this period as well, and a lot of them have said that that's quite normal as well. But, you know, again, there's sort of no right way to be feeling at any one time. Um,

• 48:29Speaker 00

  and that, you know.

• 48:32Speaker 00

  And you're thinking about her and looking after her. She's had some like health issues as well. And so we've had a bit of a journey to get here. And so there's, it's quite, it's quite a scary period as well. Like I'm just really looking forward to the moment when the baby is born. And then, I mean, I say that like then, and then you can relax. No, it's then stressful for the next like. Eighteen years. Eighteen years. And so it doesn't stop then. Again, like maybe I've just framed it in, in quite a positive way. Uh, but yeah, I'm, I, I don't know.

• 49:13Speaker 00

  I am, I'm, I'm excited about being a dad because I never thought that I would get to it this early either. I honestly, because my dad was, you know, fifty, nearly fifty when he had me. He really, he was fifty? I've made that, my maths is right. Yeah. He was nearly fifty. And so I was like, well, I'll be an old dad, you know? I'll, you know, live my best life. And then when I get to fifty, then I'll just pop out a couple of kids. Be great.

• 49:41Speaker 00

  And honest, and always thought that that was the case.

• 49:45Speaker 00

  And then ultimately started looking at friends and seeing how happy they were. And my sister with her niece and my niece, not her niece, my sister and my niece. And thinking, oh, you know what? Maybe I, maybe I do want that. And, and then like began to really like yearn for it. And I was lucky that I met Roxy, who's just the right person and my person. And we felt like we were both ready. And so, yeah. It, it's, it's, I think people will be surprised when they find out that I'm, a lot of people were, with friends and family, when I told them, I think. Because they just didn't think that I was necessarily ready for it. Which again, like in my weird mentality, just makes me go, oh, I'm going to prove you.

• 50:30Speaker 00

  I'm going to show you, I'm going to be the best dad ever. So.

• 50:35Steven Bartlett?

  Fear, because I think if I'm being completely honest with myself, and I don't think I've said this before. When I think about the prospect of having a child, which is again, is something that I really want to do. And I see myself as having four kids and I also see myself as hopefully being a really attentive, present father. There is a little bit of a thing in my head that goes, you don't have any time as it is, Steve.

• 50:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:55Steven Bartlett?

  So something's gonna have to give and it's gonna be your career in some respect. Like there's gonna be some element of reduction in your career and maybe that's okay. But if I think about it practically, I'm already using all 24 hours in the day.

• 51:10Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 51:10Steven Bartlett?

  So where's it gonna come from?

• 51:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's definitely a thought that crosses my mind and being realistic about it as well and not.

• 51:22Speaker 00

  It's not something that you can like, just like, you're not gonna wanna like just schedule it in or can do a little bit of family time here. And then I'll go and do some, you know, tour dates in Australia or like, I think, yeah, it's that that's gonna. Need to be like a significant moment of like change because I'm not gonna want to work in the same way that I've worked.

• 51:51Speaker 00

  That's why this like, yeah, this last year has felt a little bit like, I don't know, like in in my head, I am definitely like mentally prepared for that. I was like, the baby is coming in September, I'm gonna have, it's gonna be a bit of a sprint there. I'm gonna do a tour and then I'm, and then I'm gonna, and I don't wanna having a tour sort of like hanging over me. I wanted to do it now and weirdly, a lot of the comedians that I'm friends with, I was like, yes, I'm doing a tour. And then having a baby in September, I was like, you're gonna regret putting that tour in then. Yeah, because then when the baby's like two, that's when you don't notice a lot of comedians start getting out on tour. Cause they wanna get out the house.

• 52:34Speaker 00

  If you look at all of them, if they do, I won't have that excuse, the tour will be done.

• 52:39Steven Bartlett?

  And then you'll be at home for two years.

• 52:42Speaker 00

  Changing nappies.

• 52:43Steven Bartlett?

  Excited about that?

• 52:44Speaker 00

  Yes, I am. And I actually know. I'm genuinely happy. I'm very excited to do that and to like roll up my steves and. Get involved and be a hands-on dad. And now I'm regretting putting this on camera because she's gonna have that clipped up. You remember when you said this to Stephen? Upstairs now, there's a poonami that needs attending to. Yeah, I was just saying that. For the sake of the podcast.

• 53:16Steven Bartlett?

  And you've got this tour coming up called Settle Down.

• 53:18Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 53:19Steven Bartlett?

  You're doing a lot of dates in a lot of places.

• 53:23Steven Bartlett?

  How many dates are you doing, Jack?

• 53:25Speaker 00

  I'm doing, I would say, at the time of recording, maybe forty, fifty dates. They keep getting added and so it's hard to keep count. And I actually, in my head mentally, it would be quite good to just think of it as being forty because that sounds quite manageable. But it may be a few more now.

• 53:43Steven Bartlett?

  How are you honestly feeling about it? Give me all the emotions.

• 53:47Speaker 00

  Weirdly, I'm actually kind of excited for it to just start and to just be doing it.

• 53:54Speaker 00

  The bit that's a bit of a slog is, is the sort of build up to it and the writing of it and the getting it all ready in time and booking all of the venues and doing the promo and talking through the design and, you know, it's a whole, you know, production and it's just, and it all has to come through me. It's quite hard to delegate when you're, you're, you're building something like that. And so I'm really, really excited to just be then on the road, doing the shows and that's all I have to worry about. And, and I remember that, I remember this feeling before in the run up to the show being like, I'm just desperate for the first one to, to come about so I can then just like actually be doing it. And then when I'm on the road, I love it. I try to not do too long of a tour in terms of like,

• 54:40Speaker 00

  you know, a lot of comics will go out for like six months or a year and I find, I mean, in a quite brutal way, just after a while, I just begin to hear the sound of my own voice and get bored of the material and, I don't know, I, I like doing it in quite a kind of condensed burst and, you know, then like keeping some kind of like momentum going and doing a couple of shows, having a day off and a couple more shows. And, and I love it. I, I honestly, it's like, I've had a long period away from it. You know, four years is the biggest gap I've had between tours and I, I'm just, I'm excited to be doing it again and, and they're, they're like.

• 55:22Speaker 00

  I was talking to, I can't remember who it was, but I was talking to an actor, a successful actor. This is about the appeal of stand up and how you never really get that moment, no matter how big of a movie you you make, like you might go to a premiere and it gets a great reaction and and that's amazing and you have good reviews and it does great at the box office or whatever, but like that thrill of the live experience. I think it's why so many actors want to be musicians and end up in bands and whatnot, so they can have that like experience and like that thing of like going out in front of a huge crowd and and like having that live experience and connection with them is like the best thing in the world and it's so hard to replicate that anywhere else.

• 56:08Steven Bartlett?

  What's what's influenced this this show in terms of the jokes, in terms of the humour, in terms of your style? What what are the key influences or the differences from previous tours?

• 56:19Speaker 00

  Well, it's called, I called it Settle Down because it is sort of about this period of my life where I am settling down, becoming a little bit more of an adult. A lot of my comedy before and my previous tours, it's all about being the sort of man child and that's kind of like, I guess, you know, on stage, I'm this sort of foppish man baby and telling stories of drunken hijinks and putting my foot in it and gen- generally just being a bit of a sort of clown. And and this this show has an element of that and an element of me being self aware enough to be like, this is

• 57:01Speaker 00

  definitely the like, the last show where I can be telling those stories and maybe this is the last moment of my life where I can lean into that and, you know, that was the sort of feckless misadventure that was my twenties and now I've entered into my thirties, I've got a mortgage and a girlfriend and a dog and a baby on the way and I am now. You're going to be forced to settle down whether I like it or not. And so it's about this like, like this transitional moment of my life. And, you know, talking about the anxieties and the fears of that and like, oh my God, have I got everything out of my system? And, um, you know, I, I don't know. So it's, it's, it's a lot about that.

• 57:44Steven Bartlett?

  Have I got everything out of my system?

• 57:46Speaker 00

  I just don't want to, and I, I'm not having a pop at him, but like, maybe I haven't. And then, but I don't know. I was gonna say. I'll be like, I'll be like, you know, a great dad until the kid's 18. And then I'll, I'll be in what, my 50s? So I could just, I'll go like, if I haven't got it all out of my system, maybe that, that's what happens. The kid turns 18 and I'll go from like Gary Lineker to Wayne Lineker. Like that. And I'll have this other period when I'm in my 50s and 60s and I'm going out and clubbing in Ibiza.

• 58:28Steven Bartlett?

  People see you on stage and I always find this really interesting about comedians because I watch these comedians. I've watched you for many, many years of my life, Jimmy Carr, Russell Howard, et cetera. And then when I meet these people, they surprise me. Obviously, because they're not.

• 58:42Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 58:43Steven Bartlett?

  In Jimmy Carr's case, telling like filthy one liners when they got here. Although when Jimmy Carr did arrive, the team texted me and said, Jimmy Carr's just walked in and cracked a joke about riding someone's mum downstairs. So I thought, oh God, here we go. But then when he came up here, a completely different person.

• 58:56Speaker 00

  Very thoughtful person.

• 58:57Steven Bartlett?

  Incredibly thoughtful person.

• 59:00Steven Bartlett?

  What do you think people would be, if people really knew you? If people really knew the Jack that Roxy, your partner knows? What would they be most surprised about, about you versus their image of you from TV?

• 59:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, this is something I, I think about a lot. That kind of disparity between the, the comedian that you see on stage and the comedian that is there in real life.

• 59:25Speaker 00

  And I think I'm relatively close to the, the person that you see on television or the person that you watch on stage. Obviously that's like a heightened version of myself. And I think the reality is the thing that people will find most surprising is that sometimes I'm quite a quiet person. I'm quite introspective.

• 59:45Speaker 00

  I can be a little bit shy in some social situations. I think people would be surprised at that. But then I'm also so conscious as like, oh, I don't want that to ever come across as me being rude or aloof. And, and, and yeah, I get a little bit of kind of social anxiety as well. I, I, I think I definitely drink as like a crutch because I find it so much easier in certain situations that are overwhelming to have a drink. And, and I find I maybe lean on that a little bit too much. So I think all of those aspects aren't necessarily things that you would look at me and think, oh, he's going to have all of that going on.

• 1:00:26Speaker 00

  But I'm also, I'm aware of it. So I always feel like I don't want to be a disappointment in real life as well to people, especially, you know, fans or whatever. If I meet people and they have an expectation of me, I always feel the need to kind of, you know, not, not let them down. I think that's why I've always said it's like so much easier if you're Jack Dee or even my dad. It's like his persona is sort of grumpy, deadpan. That's very easy to maintain in real life. Mine is this is like over enthusiastic. Yeah, clown. And I'm like, oh, that is, that's quite a lot to, to maintain all of the time.

• 1:01:06Speaker 00

  And especially if you're having a bad day or you're tired or, you know, you, you, to have that spark in your day to day life can be quite tiring.

• 1:01:18Steven Bartlett?

  When you, but when you look back on what got you to where you are now, you're at the top table in your game. When you look back at the components that got you here, what are those components? If your, your son or daughter was asking you for those components?

• 1:01:33Speaker 00

  I would say important elements that I have.

• 1:01:39Speaker 00

  I do think, I always say this to comedians, I do think you have to build a resilience. And, you know, the ability to kind of learn from your mistakes and your missteps and take on board criticism and use it to get better.

• 1:02:01Speaker 00

  That's definitely an important aspect. I think recognizing

• 1:02:07Speaker 00

  people that could be good collaborators could be

• 1:02:14Speaker 00

  helpful. I've been very lucky that I've had a lot of really, really great people around me.

• 1:02:22Speaker 00

  That guy I mentioned, Ben Cavey, I've worked with him for nearly fifteen years. My writing partner, Freddie. I've had some really good agents.

• 1:02:33Speaker 00

  My dad, who's been amazing and has always kind of helped advise me and and finding those, those kind of people that you can sort of work with and put around you and people as well that will challenge you and people that will call you out if needs be. I think if you surround yourself with the wrong people, that's a very surefire way of heading off in the wrong direction. And I feel very lucky that I've got good people around me and have always been able to find good people to put around me and, and build good relationships with people that are important. Ultimately, that's having a good judge of character as well. I think that's a really important

• 1:03:14Speaker 00

  aspect.

• 1:03:17Steven Bartlett?

  Your work ethic is clearly one of them.

• 1:03:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think work ethic is good to have for sure.

• 1:03:25Speaker 00

  Although I feel, yeah, now, maybe we can just tone it down a little bit. Work ethic is good for the kind of takeoff, but then maybe there's, there's a difference to be that you can find once you're able, and yeah, cruising, yeah.

• 1:03:41Steven Bartlett?

  What else though? Because we haven't really talked about the creative brilliance in terms of what you're doing is ultimately art at the end of the day. And there's got to be something that's separating your art form from others. Is it in the process? Is it in just a natural thing? Is it a muscle you've built over time? When I think about the content you've crafted to go on tour with, why are you smiling?

• 1:04:03Speaker 00

  I can't call it art. I can't. And I know technically it is, but it's always such a hard one with comedy because I'm like, I'm thinking of some of the routines and I'm just like, Stephen, I've got a punchline about wanking off a tramp behind a wheelie bin. I mean, that's not art. But if we're in America right now, I'd be like, yeah. We're British and I'm like, oh no.

• 1:04:31Steven Bartlett?

  No, but there is, I insist, there is a, it's a talent and it's an art and it's one that I can come near. When I look at it, I look at it with such awe because not only are you, because it feels to me like there's such a clear success or failure with every line you deliver.

• 1:04:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:04:48Steven Bartlett?

  Whereas in every other game, even this podcast, some things might be interesting, some things might not be, but there's no, there's no instant feedback on every line that I deliver. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. So I think it's incredibly high stakes art and something that I could never ever, I shouldn't say never ever do. I could do it, but I wouldn't do it anywhere near 1% of what you could do it. So when you think about why you're so good at it, have you been able to diagnose that? People hate these questions because they have to say nice things about themselves.

• 1:05:16Speaker 00

  No, I'm, yeah, I mean, you're right that you can't, you can't like coast it with stand up because it is, it is, it is pretty brutal. That is for sure. And you do get immediate feedback on every single joke that you put out into the world. But I don't know why I am any more successful at it than anyone else. I don't know. I mean, I don't know whether I'm like the, if I look at my faults, I'm going straight back to my faults, but I don't think I'm like the greatest writer. I think I'm a good writer and I can come up with

• 1:06:00Speaker 00

  like good jokes and good routines. I think I'm, I'm a better like, I'm better at.

• 1:06:07Speaker 00

  Performing it, I don't know, I think that's something that I've learned, like I can really sell a joke. Which is maybe sometimes to my detriment because, you know, I could, could write better routines if it weren't. And but I don't need to, I don't know, that makes it sound like I'm lazy because I'm, but I, but I don't, I, I'm really like working the material as much as I can to try and make it as good as it possibly can be.

• 1:06:37Speaker 00

  I can, I've got good, really good delivery, basically. I think I'm very good at delivering jokes.

• 1:06:45Steven Bartlett?

  Do you doubt yourself?

• 1:06:47Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:06:49Steven Bartlett?

  I read a quote.

• 1:06:49Speaker 00

  I think that answer made that a bunch.

• 1:06:53Speaker 00

  Some of my material can occasionally be a bit ropey, but I can bloody well sell it.

• 1:06:59Steven Bartlett?

  I read a quote, Sky News, I am still sort of dogged by a slight sense of imposter syndrome and the feeling that at any point someone's going to come and tap me on the shoulder and tell me that I need to go on a plane and go home.

• 1:07:10Speaker 00

  That's it.

• 1:07:11Steven Bartlett?

  Back to telling inappropriate jokes in a, in a pub to 30 people.

• 1:07:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, constantly. I feel like that, especially with the, with the acting and because again, with the acting, like even more so because like, I didn't go to drama school, I didn't know what I'm doing. And I've been afforded the amazing opportunity of being able to be in some great shows and some big movies now. And again, like I've tasted that in the same way that when I had that experience of stand up, I was like, oh my God, this is amazing. And I love this. And now it's going to be really hard if I can't do that anymore and.

• 1:07:52Steven Bartlett?

  But how do you be happy then if there's that constant?

• 1:07:54Speaker 00

  I don't know. I wish, again, why could, could someone tell me? No, that's not how it works. It's like the voice thing again. I'm like, please, could you just say what's the answer?

• 1:08:08Speaker 00

  But that, but I always find I do this as well, by the way, in any kind of like.

• 1:08:14Speaker 00

  Deep dive interview and you're a wonderful interviewer because you know, you are able to like get your interviewees to open up more than they normally would. And I feel like I have done that today. But whenever I do that, I then, and it normally happens in print. And it's why I stopped doing print interviews. I don't really do any print interviews because I'd read them back. I was like, oh my God, I sound so depressing. It's just like self-flagellation for three pages. And I just feel like I read it back and I'm like, is that a reflection of who I am as a person? Because I don't think I'm as depressing as I sometimes come across when I'm talking about myself.

• 1:08:58Speaker 00

  I think, I don't know, I don't know why, but when I, you know, I don't know why that is the case.

• 1:09:06Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah, in print interviews, I mean, the reason I try and avoid print interviews as much as I can as well is because you get a really narrow perspective. And it's, and what I love about podcasting, you're a podcaster as well, is you get it all.

• 1:09:17Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:09:18Steven Bartlett?

  So you can see all of the, all of the color and the whole picture. So you can see, and that's what I love about this, especially the way we do it here. Cause we do it, we, these podcasts last a long time, as you can tell.

• 1:09:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:09:27Steven Bartlett?

  And there's really no editing at all. So it is what it is.

• 1:09:31Speaker 00

  Exactly. And I think actually, if you heard our interaction written down verbatim in print, you would probably read it back and go, Jack's quite a sad man.

• 1:09:42Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:42Speaker 00

  But then if you watched and listened to us, then maybe you would ascertain that it's not all doom and gloom. I'm just, I get a little bit morose when I'm being introspective.

• 1:09:58Steven Bartlett?

  I think it's really important, particularly the point that even someone in your position has those insecurities about.

• 1:10:08Steven Bartlett?

  Losing their position, their self doubt, all of those things that everyone has every day in all of their jobs. And really like the reason why I started this podcast, actually, I've come to like, learn why we do this podcast. It goes back to the word you said at the very start, which was about connection. You said at the start, when you're most authentic, when you're most open, people feel connected. What you also do for them in those moments is you liberate them from thinking that they're inadequate and broken. So by you saying it, you've just liberated a ton of people from thinking that those thoughts that they've been having make them actually an imposter. That's why we call it a syndrome, because it's actually just a perception we have, which is usually like flawed in some way. As it relates to acting, though, you are, you got a movie coming up, Robots?

• 1:10:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, that's coming out this summer, which was a movie. Yeah, we shot that a couple of, a couple of years ago, actually. Been waiting a while for it to go through the editorial process, which is another element that I find so frustrating with films, is that you film it and then it takes years for it to come out. And you've forgotten you've even done it. But I, yeah, that was a, again, like a great experience, really fantastic people to work with, writer, director that I really got on with, and Shailene, who's a fantastic actress, who was having, you know, a blast working with her. And that's, again, like, that's, that's one of those things where I'm like, that, that was a moment, I was really happy. I really enjoyed the whole

• 1:11:32Speaker 00

  process, was working with very good people, very nice people. It was a very happy set, very creative environment. And, yeah, like, that was one of those moments where I was like, I'm, I'm very professionally content.

• 1:11:45Steven Bartlett?

  Your father, do you, do you think he's proud of you now? Clearly from the origin of your story, that he was a big sort of figure in your life that you tried to impress and please.

• 1:11:57Speaker 00

  Yeah, def, I think, you know, he is proud of me and he's expressed that and, and continues to express it. My, and my mum as well, like, they're so sweet. I'm so happy that they've, you know, had this kind of.

• 1:12:12Speaker 00

  Second wind in their lives as well. Maybe with my dad's, it's a third or fourth wind, I don't know. But yeah, they still come to my shows and, you know, call me afterwards and say nice things and watch me on TV and if it's something good, they'll text me and, you know, that means a lot still.

• 1:12:36Steven Bartlett?

  You still trying to impress him?

• 1:12:39Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think so. I think so because when I do something that he doesn't think is good enough, which, you know, does happen from time to time, he will let me know. He's very honest and he's one of the few people that will like really cut through everything and just like be very honest with me.

• 1:13:00Speaker 00

  I mean, the other thing that we haven't sort of touched upon, and again, is is is something that's very present in my mind with all of this in terms of having a baby, in terms of, you know, trying to achieve as much as I can in my career is that I want to do all of it with him around. And obviously I know that that's not going to be the case forever. Uh, and so I think that, yeah, I mean, that's why, oh god, I

• 1:13:28Speaker 00

  I said I wasn't gonna do this on this and I mean, I'm I'm now getting emotional. I um, I wanted to have a baby because I wanted him to be around and to know my child and to spend time with my kid.

• 1:13:45Speaker 00

  I've seen how amazing he is with my niece. He's the most loving person ever. And so I want him to have a relationship with my kid. And then, yeah, I wanna do all of these things and, um, you know, have success in my career that I can share with him and he can see these things and and enjoy them and if the, you know, yeah, I I I love having him there for all of that and

• 1:14:21Speaker 00

  so, yeah, I do still think a lot about impressing him and

• 1:14:27Speaker 00

  that his his approval still means a hell of a lot to me.

• 1:14:33Steven Bartlett?

  It's such a beautiful thing, you know, it's such a beautiful thing.

• 1:14:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:14:37Steven Bartlett?

  I admire that closeness you have with your father so much. And even when I see you like doing, you know, gigs and stuff together and doing like, you know, you did the Netflix thing with him. It's such a special thing.

• 1:14:48Speaker 00

  It's, I feel, and I'm so lucky as well that I've had the opportunity to do it. And, you know, it's, it's never lost on me. The, the amazing thing about doing that show as well is having people that come up to me and they say, you know, like, I watched it with my dad and, you know, I have, you know, a really good relationship with my dad and we watch your show. And then we went away and we did a trip together and it was one of the, I'm so happy that we did it and, uh, you know, or, and, or the flip side of that is, yeah, I have people that, you know, maybe lost a parent and, uh, have watched the show and, and really connected to it. Because it's reminded them of the relationship that they had with their, um, father when, when they were around.

• 1:15:30Speaker 00

  And, and I think, you know, I, I just, I know, I know how lucky I am to have had that, um, that experience with him and, and continue to have experiences with him and to work with him. And, and it never feels like work when I'm doing stuff with him. It honestly, you know, it's, I mean, partly because of the, the shooting hours that he insists upon. And the hour long break for lunch, uh, with a wine present wherever we are, whatever, you know, the situation is, you know. But just hanging out with him, it just feels like that's, it, it can, it can never feel like work.

• 1:16:09Speaker 00

  Cause it's, it's, it's my dad and, and yeah, I, I cherish like hanging out with him so much.

• 1:16:17Steven Bartlett?

  There's so much banter when you guys are together on the screen. But I, I wondered, you know, from hearing what you've said about him today, like, does he, does he truly know what

• 1:16:27Steven Bartlett?

  he means to you and the impact he, he's had on your life?

• 1:16:31Speaker 00

  I think so, but I think mainly from hearing me talk about it when he's not there. Cause I don't think I necessarily would ever articulate these feelings to him. Just because that's not like the nature of our relationship. The reality is a lot of the time when we're talking, we're talking about, you know, we talk about work stuff quite a bit, we talk about football, we'll talk about current affairs, things like that, but we don't really talk about our emotions and never really have.

• 1:17:02Speaker 00

  But I think he knows it and I think, I think he's, yeah, I think he's very, very, very aware of it. And I'm glad that he is as well. I'm glad that he knows how much he means to me because

• 1:17:15Speaker 00

  I don't think I would necessarily be able to say it to him if he were sat in front of me.

• 1:17:25Steven Bartlett?

  A lot of people can relate to that.

• 1:17:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:17:27Steven Bartlett?

  For some reason, it's bizarre, isn't it?

• 1:17:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:17:30Speaker 00

  I don't know, I, yeah, and I, I look at him and I'm like, oh, what will I from, will take from him when I become a dad and, you know, I think

• 1:17:41Speaker 00

  he's a, he's surprising you, he is more affectionate though than people think, like cause that's obviously not an aspect of him that you ever see on any of the Netflix shows or on his podcast or, or whatever, but like, I don't know, just, yeah. What, what, watching how he is with my niece and, and knowing what he was like when we were like very little, it's like, I, yeah, I, I wanna be like that. And, and he, he took a decision in his life as well. You know, he had a very successful career and was a producer and an agent. And then he really did, he, he did wind it all down and stop when we were kids and spent,

• 1:18:21Speaker 00

  I mean, I know, again, we went to boarding school, so we were away for, for, for, for a period of, of our youth, but he did, you know, spend a lot of time with us and he was very like, present in our lives and, and wasn't as consumed with work. And, and I think that was a good, a good decision of his. And so I think that's why I'm aware that it's even more important, like to make sure that. I address that work-life balance thing when my child comes along. Cause I do want to have enough time to like, you know, be an attentive and present parent.

• 1:19:02Steven Bartlett?

  I think about this a lot with with my dad. I've talked about it quite often on this show that the last thing I want to have is is is almost like regrets of words unspoken. When my dad's, my dad's seventy odd years old now and um we've not had the closest relationship over the years and I've also struggled like I've I took him to the World Cup and stuff, but we never really talk.

• 1:19:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:19:24Steven Bartlett?

  You know what I mean?

• 1:19:25Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:19:26Steven Bartlett?

  And I find it much easier to say things to him, maybe on on this podcast or on text, maybe.

• 1:19:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:33Steven Bartlett?

  But to to say, it's such a strange thing that with my partner, I can be open and expressive, but with my dad, it's like.

• 1:19:41Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:42Steven Bartlett?

  You know, and I I worry, if I'm being honest, about the regrets of the words unsaid.

• 1:19:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:49Steven Bartlett?

  So so there'll be times where it might be Father's Day or other days, maybe his birthday, where I'll just try and express it.

• 1:19:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:55Steven Bartlett?

  You have.

• 1:19:56Speaker 00

  Do you write it down? Do you?

• 1:19:58Steven Bartlett?

  I write it down.

• 1:20:02Speaker 00

  But it is, it's hard, isn't it? It's where if someone doesn't receive it how you want it to be received as well, it can it can make it very difficult.

• 1:20:09Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:09Speaker 00

  And there are, you know, especially like men of that generation, it's just very because it must have been so different with

• 1:20:17Steven Bartlett?

  His father.

• 1:20:17Speaker 00

  His father and so and yeah, it's just, it's just not a way of communication that we're as used to. So I do think that's why sometimes it can be a real struggle to say some of those things, because if you said them to anyone else, then you know that they would garner and elicit a kind of emotional response that you would be.

• 1:20:39Steven Bartlett?

  What would be welcoming.

• 1:20:40Speaker 00

  Yeah, welcoming. Yeah. And it's and it's hard when it's not like that.

• 1:20:44Steven Bartlett?

  We have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest, not knowing who they're leaving it for. And I have such a bad issue reading handwriting. Okay, what do you place? Oh, what do you pledge to do this year to live life fully while you still make a difference?

• 1:21:06Speaker 00

  So hard.

• 1:21:09Speaker 00

  What have I pledged to do?

• 1:21:13Speaker 00

  I'm gonna be more present and attentive with the people that I love and I cherish and hold close to me.

• 1:21:23Steven Bartlett?

  They're gonna clip, Roxy's gonna clip that. She's gonna play it every time.

• 1:21:27Speaker 00

  I'm gonna change some nappies as well. I've pledged to that.

• 1:21:30Steven Bartlett?

  There you go.

• 1:21:30Speaker 00

  Yeah. I will change a nappy.

• 1:21:33Steven Bartlett?

  Okay.

• 1:21:33Speaker 00

  It's already gone down to just being a singular nappy, but I will do a nappy. That will happen.

• 1:21:39Steven Bartlett?

  Well, Jack, thank you. Thank you so much for your time today. I'm incredibly excited for your tour. I'm actually coming with my team. That sounds a little bit.

• 1:21:46Speaker 00

  Amazing.

• 1:21:47Steven Bartlett?

  Dodgy, but I'm, I'm, I will be attending your tour with my team. I believe we're going to the London show and I'm very, very excited because I've been a big fan of yours for a very, very, very long time. And your particular style of comedy and performance, I think, is what makes you exceptional at what you do, but also a very necessary voice in comedy because you, I, I, I just think where we are in the world with public discourse and polarization, if there was ever a time for comedy, it is now. And so it's so lovely that with everything going on with the macroeconomic backdrop and all these things, we have great comedians out there adding a little bit of joy to people's lives. And that's really what you're, what you do through your work from, from my observation.

• 1:22:28Steven Bartlett?

  If anybody wants to come to the Settle Down tour, tickets are on sale now on the internet, wherever you get them. He's doing fucking shit tons of dates.

• 1:22:38Steven Bartlett?

  So I hope to see some of you at the London show in particular, because I'll be there. But yeah, thank you, Jack.

• 1:22:43Speaker 00

  Thank you very much. It was lovely to chat. Yeah, thanks so much for having me on.