Ep. 849: Fur Bans, Gonad Jerky, and Connor “Bass Head” Hellebuyck

Steven Rinella https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella/?hl=en and the MeatEater crew discuss: Mark Kenyon https://www.themeateater.com/people/mark-kenyon’s upcoming new podcast; Kimi Werner’s cookbook: Kimi's Kitchen https://www.kimiwerner.com/food-1; clarifying what a porterhouse cut is; an interview with Olympic Gold Medal-winning ice hockey goalie, Connor "Bass Head" Hellebuyck; how you can’t hunt turkeys close to church in Mississippi; gonad jerky; the multiple uses of Cornell University's e-Bird https://ebird.org/home; beavers as fish; getting arrested for breaking a wooly mammoth tusk; Colorado's fur ban; South Atlantic states to manage red snapper; frog and toad surveys; getting "seal finger" from a grizzly bear; watch "Steve and Seth Get Rich on Bobcats" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmF2uUi6Mx0; the financial implications of the recreational economy; Save Tuckertown! https://trlt.org/save-tuckertown/; and more. Outro credit: "The Screaming Song" written by George Alan Sparhawk Connect with Steve https://www.themeateater.com/authors/steven-rinella and The MeatEater Podcast Network https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork Steve on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella and Twitter https://twitter.com/stevenrinella?lang=en MeatEater on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/meateater, Facebook https://www.facebook.com/StevenRinellaMeatEater/, Twitter https://twitter.com/MeatEaterTV?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor, and YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:37Steven Rinella?

  Welcome to the news show, Mother Liquors. Today, we're covering Colorado's dumb fur sale ban. Iowa, this is a different subject. Subject one, Colorado's dumb fur sale ban. Two, Iowa is hunting for volunteers who can tell one frog call from another. Three, while Yanni himself hasn't caught a disease called seal finger, he's going to tell us about it. Four, the red snapper wars continue in the American Southeast. Five, bobcat prices, bobcat prices go through the roof, like way through the roof.

• 2:14Steven Rinella?

  Six, Mark Kenyon has some stuff he'd like to get off his chest. Seven, we're going to talk to American hero, gold medalist, hockey goalie, Connor Hellebuyck, who in all honesty, eh, I'll save it. Not a big, huge sports guy, but I know patriotic stirrins when I feel them.

• 2:39Steven Rinella?

  Joined today by Yanis Patelis, Mark Kenyon, Dr. Randall Williams, Spencer Newhart, Brody Henderson. As usual, here, we're gonna start out with our news. For that, I'm gonna throw it over to Mark Kenyon for his news.

• 2:56Speaker 04

  Well, there's a lot of news on my end. Started this new gig at Meat Eater, uh, moving from just being like the, uh, the resident whitetail guy, is what everyone referred me to. Uh, and now Director of Conservation, so I've got some cool new projects coming out because of that. One of which, I guess I can tease now, is a new podcast.

• 3:16Steven Rinella?

  Awesome.

• 3:16Speaker 04

  Which I'm excited about. That'll be dropping late April-ish. And I first pitched this as, uh, Mark Kenyon Unleashed. Just like forever, I've had a kind of a box around me that's like, you gotta live in the whitetail world, which I love, which is a big part of me. But then there's this other, whole other half of my life.

• 3:36Steven Rinella?

  I call it unfenced.

• 3:37Speaker 04

  Okay, I like that. I like that. Um, but yeah, unleashed, unfenced, it didn't, it didn't pass the muster of all of our, our smarter folks here in the company. But, uh, more, more seriously.

• 3:48Steven Rinella?

  What's it called now?

• 3:50Speaker 04

  Future Wild with Mark Kenyon.

• 3:52Steven Rinella?

  I don't mind unleashed or unfenced. Unfenced sounds a little weird.

• 3:55Speaker 04

  Well, I think it's too late for that. It's too, too late and too broad.

• 3:58Steven Rinella?

  You could call it dropped.

• 3:59Speaker 04

  There's already a thing like that.

• 4:01Steven Rinella?

  What else could he call it?

• 4:02Speaker 04

  I mean, like, your antlers fell off. Oh, okay, but it's not about antlers. That's the thing is I'm trying to get away from antlers.

• 4:07Steven Rinella?

  They've dropped off.

• 4:10Steven Rinella?

  I'm a little faster than Mark, and I fell, fell second fast.

• 4:15Speaker 04

  Oh, thanks, man. Uh, so Future Wild is going to be my place to talk about all things beyond just whitetails. But really, it's like at the intersection of hunting, fishing, wildlife and wild places, but with a view towards the future. So if I'm talking to a biologist about tarpon, it's gonna be, what's the future hold for them?

• 4:39Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 4:39Speaker 04

  Ultimately. If we're digging into something about mule deer.

• 4:44Speaker 04

  It'll be exploring what's, what's next, or what can we do, or what does this mean for next year, next decade. Uh, so yeah, really excited about it. It's given me a chance to get to talk to a lot of the people and about topics that I've long been fascinated by and, and do in my spare time, but haven't been able to, you know, have a platform to talk about it publicly.

• 5:01Steven Rinella?

  I like that idea about going into the future. Be like, if you had, instead of telling old drinking stories, you're telling drinking stories about that you'd like to have happen, you know?

• 5:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's the hope is lots of drinking stories.

• 5:16Steven Rinella?

  No, that's a good idea. What is the future of?

• 5:18Speaker 04

  Yeah. And so it's, it's gotten me, it's given me the opportunity to, to, you know, have a reason to read all the books that I already read.

• 5:26Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 5:26Speaker 04

  Um, given me an excuse.

• 5:28Steven Rinella?

  Makes you feel like you're not being lazy when you're reading books.

• 5:30Speaker 04

  Exactly.

• 5:30Speaker 05

  Paid to do it.

• 5:31Speaker 04

  Get paid to read the books I already want to read.

• 5:33Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 5:33Speaker 04

  Uh, gives me excuse to get to reach out and talk to people that I've long wanted to talk to. Um, so we've got three or four episodes in the can already and, and some really interesting ones coming down the pipe.

• 5:45Steven Rinella?

  So what do you, give me the tease of the subjects for me?

• 5:48Speaker 04

  Uh, so the first handful, yeah, there's going to be a conversation with, uh, that goes deep into Caribou right now.

• 5:55Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 5:55Speaker 04

  In the future, what's going on with them?

• 5:57Steven Rinella?

  That's interesting.

• 5:57Speaker 04

  Yeah. There's one that explores habitat fragmentation and island beat biogeography and, and really what's happening is more and more large landscapes become metaphorically islands.

• 6:09Steven Rinella?

  Can I make a prediction?

• 6:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:10Steven Rinella?

  That gets worse.

• 6:12Speaker 04

  Spoiler. Yeah. So that one's, that one's going to be interesting. Um, there's going to be one that's exploring the interesting kind of sometimes oppositional, but in the future, hopefully more times than not, um, parallel movements of the outdoor recreation community and the hunt fish community. And advocating for public lands and, and the future of all those things. That's one.

• 6:40Speaker 04

  There's another one.

• 6:41Speaker 05

  Who in that one?

• 6:42Steven Rinella?

  Can I make a prediction?

• 6:43Speaker 05

  Can I ask about it, the future of that one?

• 6:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:45Speaker 05

  Or in that one, do you figure out if the backpackers are gonna start paying a tax to help out?

• 6:51Speaker 04

  We're definitely gonna.

• 6:52Speaker 05

  To help pay?

• 6:53Speaker 04

  We haven't recorded that one yet, but I'm definitely gonna be asking.

• 6:55Steven Rinella?

  Backpack tax, backpack tax dude.

• 6:57Speaker 04

  Cause the backpack tax is.

• 6:58Speaker 05

  Mount bike tax.

• 7:00Speaker 04

  The whole thing in Oregon's an interesting example of kind of an end around on that.

• 7:04Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 7:05Speaker 04

  If you're familiar with that shit right now.

• 7:07Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 7:07Speaker 04

  Um.

• 7:07Steven Rinella?

  Carl Malcolm has, is, has become very interested in these alternate funding mechanisms for state fish and game agencies.

• 7:15Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 7:15Steven Rinella?

  Missouri had the, some kind of, uh, I can't remember what.

• 7:21Speaker 04

  Sales.

• 7:21Steven Rinella?

  Another state had a one eighth of one.

• 7:24Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 7:25Steven Rinella?

  Um, was it Minnesota?

• 7:27Speaker 04

  I'm not sure.

• 7:28Steven Rinella?

  Maybe it was Minnesota. I can't remember. Some state did like a, like a, a small percentage of a penny of the sales tax. And that state now is doing acquisitions off that money. They're doing land acquisitions off that money.

• 7:41Speaker 04

  Yeah. And in Oregon, it's, it's just like basically a lodging tax.

• 7:45Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 7:45Speaker 04

  But they're just increasing a tiny bit and that's gonna be significant dollars. So, so yeah. Get to explore stuff like that, that, that I always follow. I'm really interested in. It's, it's super relevant to the stuff I'll be doing on the conservation side here at Mediter. And so this will be a place to talk about it. And yeah, very excited about that. So that's, that's a big one. One other piece of news, if I've, if I've got another second. Um, a lot of new projects coming down the pipe with the, you know, in the conservation lane here, but one of those that I want to bring up to the top is that auction house will be opening up again this year.

• 8:19Steven Rinella?

  The auction house of oddities.

• 8:20Speaker 04

  The auction house of oddities. It's been a minute.

• 8:22Steven Rinella?

  Been a long time out. Yeah. I don't know what happened there, but we got some doozies dude. Can I tease a couple?

• 8:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, please.

• 8:27Steven Rinella?

  So if you were, if, if you remember back to our show, Doss Boat.

• 8:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 8:30Steven Rinella?

  The last season of Doss Boat featured a boat. I don't even know what, I can't remember what it was, but it had a 150 horsepower Honda on it, which has got like three hours on it. So if you're in the market for a 150 Honda. With with eight hours or three. That's gonna be in the auction house of oddities. I think we should auction off the boat itself, too. We just need to get it out here. I just had the engine shipped out here just to keep an eye on it. Oh, go get it.

• 8:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, the boat would be cool to have that, too.

• 8:59Steven Rinella?

  All right. Oh, here's another thing in the auction house of oddities. We bought my dad's truck. When my dad died. A lot. My dad died like shortly after the terror attacks. The nine eleven attacks. That's how I was remembering. People asked me when he died. I was like, it was about around then.

• 9:19Steven Rinella?

  He died then. He had a truck at that time. That truck wound up going to my buddy Matt Droste. Matt Droste drove it. All over. He he just hauled a couple of dead deer home in that truck. We just bought it from him. And we're gonna auction off my old man's truck, which I've slept in the front of, the back of. You gotta describe. All kinds of hunting pictures. You gotta describe the truck. F one fifty. Yeah.

• 9:42Speaker 04

  Are you gonna bid on it?

• 9:43Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 9:44Speaker 04

  You don't want?

• 9:44Steven Rinella?

  Maybe. What year? When my, when the neighbor down the road, one time the neighbor down the road died and his boat went into the auction house of oddities. I just pissed out of that boat all through growing up.

• 9:54Speaker 04

  Well, and and so I'll I'll add a little bit more. Tentatively, we're thinking. On top of giving away the shitty old truck.

• 10:00Steven Rinella?

  That's right. It's gonna be a lot better. We're gonna pack. It's gonna be a shitty truck full of good gear.

• 10:04Speaker 04

  We're gonna load the shitty truck full of a bunch of great hunting gear. And then I'm gonna hand deliver it and maybe make Yanni or somebody come with me, drive across the country. Bring it to you.

• 10:13Steven Rinella?

  That's where I forgot about that detail. We're gonna, we're gonna literally stuff the back.

• 10:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:18Steven Rinella?

  It'll be stuffed. With a shit shitty truck full of great gear or something like that.

• 10:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's it's gonna be a good one.

• 10:24Steven Rinella?

  We gotta get rid of our punt gun somehow.

• 10:26Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:27Steven Rinella?

  You done with that thing? We always were planning on getting, being done with it. I don't know if it'll go into the auction house of oddities or go into the big gun auction, but that'll be in there. We just built a new studio and bought a bunch of barn board from Yanni's neighbor, but we got a bunch left over. All that great barn board, some sixteen footers. That'll be in the auction house.

• 10:46Speaker 04

  Can we sign it? Can you sign him, Yanni?

• 10:48Speaker 05

  Sign what?

• 10:49Steven Rinella?

  The barn board.

• 10:50Speaker 05

  It has nothing to do with me.

• 10:51Steven Rinella?

  You don't even know about this. It just happened to be.

• 10:54Speaker 05

  I could use a few planks, you know, if you just, if I can just siphon off a couple chunks.

• 10:58Steven Rinella?

  I'll tell you where to put your bid.

• 11:00Speaker 06

  Some of this stuff sounds like local pickup only. Are we shipping it all everywhere?

• 11:03Steven Rinella?

  The motor will ship to you. The lumber is pickup only. I'm not shipping 16 foot barn board. I just got a 16 foot trailer. Yeah, Randall, Randall's gonna deliver it. We'll give you a deal, like if you're within how many miles, Randall will bring you the barn board. Yeah. And then he'll. I'd love to do that. Okay. Uh, oh, last thing on, on, on, uh, uh, our news. Our, our dear friend, um, podcast guest, video collaborator, Kimmy Werner, has her new book out. Kimmy's Kitchen, a cookbook. Um, Kimmy is a, is, is a phenomenal, phenomenal seafood chef, cook.

• 11:44Steven Rinella?

  Uh, she's a great person. She's a dear friend to our family. She's a dear friend to many friends of mine. It's a gorgeous book. Um, you can see here on the cover with a, with a goat fish on the end of a three prong. Beautiful book, a beautiful person, great recipes. Anyone interested in fish and seafood cooking and other things. Here it is. An ocean woman's guide to wild home cooking. Good luck to Kimmy. I hope the book's a big success. Please, please, please check out Kimmy's new book, Kimmy's Kitchen. Corrections. Corrections. Corrections. Nailed it.

• 12:23Speaker 06

  Phil was ready.

• 12:24Steven Rinella?

  That's right, ladies and gentlemen. This is where you correct us and when you catch us being wrong about something, you win free boots. That's how serious we are at the news show, um, to know when we screwed up. Okay. So the winner of today's correction of the week gets a free pair of Tacovus boots. If, if you win today, that's what you get. Correction number one.

• 12:51Steven Rinella?

  About porter houses.

• 12:52Speaker 07

  Why the hesitation?

• 12:54Steven Rinella?

  Because I was embarrassed about this one. It's embarrassing to me. The writer in says this, "Good morning. I was listening to episode 798. 'Tis the season to be hunting and nearly drove off the road when Steve confessed he doesn't know what a porter house is."

• 13:11Steven Rinella?

  I said, he quotes me, I said, "I know it's a good thing to order, but what the hell is a porter house?" He sounds being honest.

• 13:19Speaker 07

  Mm hmm. I couldn't have told you either.

• 13:21Steven Rinella?

  Because it's not a hunting thing. Hunting dudes don't talk about porter houses.

• 13:24Speaker 06

  This doesn't seem like a correction.

• 13:26Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's not. It seems like we're already veering away from corrections.

• 13:29Steven Rinella?

  No, dude, listen, it's a wide, it's a big umbrella.

• 13:32Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 13:32Steven Rinella?

  You could even be wrong by omission and win the corrections contest. I might vote for this guy. So, he says, first he tries to establish his bona fides. He grew up in butcher shops. Even the teeth, then he turns it into an insult. So, he establishes his bona fides by saying he grew up working in butcher shops and then twists the dagger by saying even the guy sweeping the floor knew what a porter house was.

• 13:59Speaker 06

  Damn.

• 14:01Steven Rinella?

  Apparently it's this, "A big tender loin is a porter house. A small tender loin is a T-bone."

• 14:08Steven Rinella?

  "A porter house must have a tender loin at least 1.25 inches across, measured from the bone to the widest point of the fillet. As you move backward along the short loin, the tender loin thickens, which is why the porter houses come from the rear end of that section. All porter houses are T-bones, but not all T-bones are porter houses."

• 14:36Speaker 07

  That's good info.

• 14:37Steven Rinella?

  He goes into then to continue again that he can't believe I didn't know this. He ends on that note. In writing, that's called bringing her back around.

• 14:46Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 14:48Speaker 07

  What's a T-bone without a bone? A ribeye?

• 14:52Steven Rinella?

  You're just inviting another question now.

• 14:55Speaker 05

  No, I think it's a filet mignon.

• 14:58Steven Rinella?

  Raise your hand and tell me who in here.

• 15:01Speaker 05

  It's filet mignon.

• 15:01Steven Rinella?

  Who in here, who in here knew that?

• 15:05Speaker 08

  The only thing I know about porter houses is they used to call the porter has at Apex Steakhouse, the Melbourne, and it was usually the most expensive thing on the menu.

• 15:13Speaker 05

  No, I was going to say that you shouldn't be embarrassed because all of, unless you came up in the beef industry somehow and or just whatever, you grew up in Kansas City and you went to a big steakhouse once a week where they had these kinds of things. We've all just been processing wild game and we don't use this terminology.

• 15:33Steven Rinella?

  But everybody knows your long tongue Yanni because you used to run the grill at Tuscanini's.

• 15:38Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 15:39Steven Rinella?

  You didn't pick this up there?

• 15:41Speaker 05

  No.

• 15:41Steven Rinella?

  You're not even a floor sweeper at this butcher shop.

• 15:44Speaker 05

  No.

• 15:44Speaker 07

  I also think it's like generational, like people back in the day would have known.

• 15:49Steven Rinella?

  My kids, my kids aren't like, I'll tell you.

• 15:52Speaker 07

  No, I'm just saying like people used to go to butcher shops.

• 15:56Speaker 07

  You know what I mean?

• 15:56Speaker 05

  That's true.

• 15:57Steven Rinella?

  Correction number two, Mount Rushmore. The writer in says this, hey all, on your podcast, Neanderthal Love. When was that? That was the first news podcast. Two days ago. Why was it called the new show?

• 16:11Speaker 08

  Well, the episode was called Neanderthal Love, something, something, something, something.

• 16:15Speaker 06

  He's doing some editorializing here.

• 16:17Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 16:17Speaker 06

  Man, you can't follow everything that goes on around here.

• 16:20Steven Rinella?

  On your podcast, Neanderthal Love, it was discussed that the America the Beautiful Pass could be used to grant free access into Mount Rushmore, Spencer Newhart's home state.

• 16:34Steven Rinella?

  No pass is needed for entry into Mount Rushmore. It's free.

• 16:40Speaker 06

  Randall said it.

• 16:41Speaker 05

  I'd like to, I'd like to.

• 16:43Steven Rinella?

  Real slap to the nuts for Spencer. A correction, I think I just implied that you could use it there. Oh, it's your fault. It was suggested. I can't believe Spencer wasn't all over it, you know, big South Dakota guy. Yeah. Tattoos all. Did you go there when you lived there? Was that a thing?

• 16:59Speaker 06

  I think I had been there once or twice.

• 17:02Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 17:02Speaker 06

  Ever and both like, you know, when I was a kid. So.

• 17:06Steven Rinella?

  Correction number three.

• 17:09Steven Rinella?

  Another slap to the nuts for me. Spoonbill pronunciation. Good morning, the writer in says. I have a correction from the first episode of the news show. When talking about the National Park passes, Steve referred to the Spoonbill as a rosiated Spoonbill. However, the correct name is a rosiat Spoonbill. Well, that segment was chock full of errors. Okay, who's gonna win the boots? Correction number one, Porterhouse ignorance.

• 17:44Speaker 05

  Are we voting right now?

• 17:45Steven Rinella?

  Well, I'll do the rundown. These are tough, man. Correction number one, free boots. These are all nitpickers. Some nitpicker is walking away with free boots. Correction number one, Porterhouse ignorance. Correction number two, Rushmore. Correction number three, Spoonbill. I know what I'm voting.

• 18:06Speaker 05

  Me too.

• 18:07Steven Rinella?

  We have one, two, three, four, five, six, seven votes.

• 18:11Speaker 05

  Hmm, that includes you, Phil.

• 18:13Steven Rinella?

  That's great. Got the engineers in there. Porterhouse, show of hands, please. Good lord.

• 18:18Speaker 05

  Done.

• 18:19Steven Rinella?

  That's stupid.

• 18:22Steven Rinella?

  I like the fact that he was so insulting about it. His heart's in it. You like the approach. I like the approach.

• 18:27Speaker 05

  Yeah, and honestly, I'm a little bummed that you just didn't read it word for word because I felt like it was a well-written piece.

• 18:33Steven Rinella?

  Too damn long. You made it longer. It's not. Oh, by shortening it, I made it longer. Giannis correction.

• 18:45Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 18:48Steven Rinella?

  Here's why I think.

• 18:49Speaker 05

  It's good info and I gotta chuckle out of it.

• 18:52Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Steve, who would you have voted for? I'll tell you who and I'll tell you why. Rushmore. Because here is the thing where some dude, picture some little kid sitting there. He's got no money.

• 19:01Speaker 05

  Oh, you're looking out for the little children.

• 19:03Steven Rinella?

  His family's broke. And he's like, all fixing to go to Rushmore. Yeah. Okay. But then, you know, as he does, he's listening to the news show. You know, every week, he likes that show. Yeah, of course. And all of a sudden, he's like, shit. Guess we're not going. But then he heard the correction, he's like, I guess I just gotta pay for parking and I'll be fine. And now he's like, Mom and Dad, we're back on. We're going to Rushmore, it is free. Picture that kid. And you're giving, and he could be showing up there in some brand new damn boots.

• 19:39Speaker 04

  I don't think it's happening.

• 19:41Steven Rinella?

  But no, Mr. Porterhouse, who's obviously, right? Right?

• 19:47Steven Rinella?

  I'm doing a money symbol with my hand. Who's obviously pretty well taken care of if he's down there ordering porterhouses every time he turns around. Congrats to the porterhouse. So yeah, another rich guy, another rich guy out there with another pair of boots. Congrats, Morgan. Thank God. That's just what the world needed. Another rich guy in new boots. Thanks, Tacovas. Onto your news.

• 20:15Steven Rinella?

  This isn't even that big of a deal, but I like it.

• 20:20Steven Rinella?

  Earlier, I think a year ago, a year ago coming up. The Great Lake Pickle was on the show and he was sharing a hot turkey tip. That I think is mostly applicable to the American South, but I can think of examples in the North where it's true. Lake Pickle was explaining. If you're hunting in the South and you're hunting in a new area, cold rolling into a new area. He's like, if you can find an old church.

• 20:46Steven Rinella?

  The kind that has a cemetery out back, well, it's even better. Doesn't need it, but if it has it out back, it's better. There is a turkey near there.

• 20:56Steven Rinella?

  An old church has a turkey. He told us this on the show. And he had a lot of examples to back it up.

• 21:02Speaker 04

  Did he? He must have explained why?

• 21:05Steven Rinella?

  Pictures when you're driving around in a rural area, where do they put the old church?

• 21:11Speaker 04

  Maybe on a hill.

• 21:11Steven Rinella?

  Where the turkeys live.

• 21:16Steven Rinella?

  It's a freak deal, but he could back it up. He could back it up. Well, he sends me a, he sends me a piece of legislation from Mississippi that he was unaware of. And the fact that Mississippi even thought to have this.

• 21:30Steven Rinella?

  Just give me a second here. Keep talking, Brody.

• 21:33Speaker 07

  Uh, this legislation has to do with hunting within a quarter mile radius of a church. Steve will find the exact details.

• 21:41Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, just keep, keep him interested.

• 21:42Speaker 07

  Um, I think this is the kind of law that is like, uh,

• 21:46Steven Rinella?

  I got it.

• 21:46Speaker 07

  Women can't wear pants.

• 21:48Steven Rinella?

  No, no, no. It's a worse law than that.

• 21:50Speaker 07

  It's worse, I think.

• 21:52Steven Rinella?

  You ready for the law?

• 21:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 21:54Steven Rinella?

  It's got a code and all that, like, you know, like all the, how they do the codes. Section four, nine, seven, six, one, blah, blah, blah. Here's the rule. This is the actual Mississippi law. If any person shall hunt within one fourth mile of any church on Sunday while services are being held, he shall on conviction be fined not less than $25 nor more than $100.

• 22:23Speaker 07

  How, when, when's it from?

• 22:25Steven Rinella?

  I don't know, but you know what it's meant to prevent sitting, say you're sitting there in the old service and also pow.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:32Steven Rinella?

  Out back.

• 22:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, this is one of those.

• 22:35Steven Rinella?

  A dude would be like, dude, I'm out of here. But then all of a sudden his wife's like, no, no, no, no, no. Section.

• 22:42Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 22:42Steven Rinella?

  Well, what's interesting about it is it's.

• 22:44Speaker 04

  Fifty bucks.

• 22:45Steven Rinella?

  It doesn't specify shooting. It specifies hunting. Can't even try.

• 22:49Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:50Steven Rinella?

  But then Lake Pickle sent me a thing from OnX. He sent me a screenshot from OnX proving to me that when he's hunting by a church that's in service, he's a half mile away.

• 23:01Steven Rinella?

  But yeah, I think it's to prevent dudes running out of church.

• 23:04Speaker 07

  I got a lot of questions. Like, what if you owned land 100 yards from that church and you were hunting on your land?

• 23:12Steven Rinella?

  Dude, I would have a real word.

• 23:16Steven Rinella?

  With the government. Or I'd just be like, in addition to all the other junk you spend money hunting on hunting turkeys, there's also every year you have somewhere between a, a fine of somewhere between 25.

• 23:27Speaker 07

  You write that into your budget?

• 23:28Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. It's like, oh, you know, turkey tag, 12 bucks, but then I got the, the fine, you know, which is, which averages out somewhere around 50, 60 bucks.

• 23:37Speaker 04

  You know, it's funny though, this whole turkey thing around old churches. We have, I've had a number of friends that have found shed antlers in old cemeteries or adjacent to them. So whenever they're driving around, they always eyeball the old cemeteries in nearby land.

• 23:49Steven Rinella?

  Dude, I could think of it. Uh, sit, just sitting here right now, I could think of multiple examples, even in El Norte.

• 23:56Steven Rinella?

  The Spanish for the north.

• 23:57Speaker 07

  Wasn't there something that happened like within the last couple of years where a dude got in trouble for killing a gobbler in a cemetery?

• 24:04Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 24:04Speaker 07

  Remember we talked about that?

• 24:06Steven Rinella?

  Yep, probably bushwhacked it right from behind a big old stone. I remember that.

• 24:10Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 24:10Speaker 06

  Hell of a way to do it.

• 24:12Steven Rinella?

  And I remember I couldn't, I couldn't get mad at him.

• 24:15Speaker 07

  No, because you're driving by that cemetery and seeing that thing strutting around for a week.

• 24:19Steven Rinella?

  I understand.

• 24:20Speaker 07

  Eventually your will just breaks.

• 24:21Steven Rinella?

  There's, we're gonna talk about some dudes in the news today who I'm like, you should be in trouble, but I understand.

• 24:31Steven Rinella?

  A guy wrote in, he's making gonad jerky. He's making deer nut jerky and heart jerky. He put his deer nut jerky and his heart jerky in the same bag and people wouldn't eat the heart jerky because it was next to his deer nut jerky.

• 24:46Speaker 07

  Not just people. Not just any people. Firemen.

• 24:50Speaker 06

  Wildland firefighters. Pretty tough dudes.

• 24:53Speaker 07

  Real tough guys.

• 24:54Steven Rinella?

  That's true. I didn't even think to include that detail. Tough guys.

• 24:58Speaker 07

  That's why we're here.

• 24:59Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, even tough guys won't eat his nut jerky.

• 25:03Speaker 07

  Hard workers.

• 25:03Steven Rinella?

  If you promise not to poison it, I will eat your nut jerky on air.

• 25:09Steven Rinella?

  If you send it to us.

• 25:13Steven Rinella?

  I will.

• 25:14Speaker 07

  I'm surprised that it came out good.

• 25:16Steven Rinella?

  Is that really what you would do with it? If you had a bunch of poison?

• 25:22Speaker 06

  You're saying there's a better ROI on that poison than?

• 25:25Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, like you know the thing where kids are like that they're gonna get drugs and trick or treat candy? Like picture you're like a bad drug addict. I feel like you'd just hang on to the drugs.

• 25:35Speaker 08

  It's expensive stuff. If I wanted to poison you through the mail, I'd just send an anthrax to the office. Like there's easier ways of like waiting until he says nut jerky.

• 25:45Steven Rinella?

  He's already gotten.

• 25:46Speaker 07

  Because someone could back out of eating the jerky. If you just touch the envelope, it's all over.

• 25:50Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that's why I'm gonna eat his jerky because I don't think it's gonna be poison.

• 25:54Speaker 07

  Um, this brings up the great American jerky contest. We ever gone back to that thing?

• 26:00Steven Rinella?

  No, whatever happened to that?

• 26:01Speaker 06

  The suit said we can't do it because someone's gonna poison us.

• 26:07Steven Rinella?

  I'm not even gonna ask the suits. When this guy, what's his name? The nut jerky, Sam, Samuel? Listen buddy. District forester. Listen, you send me that nut jerky, I'm gonna eat it right here on there and I'll tell you what I think about it.

• 26:21Speaker 07

  It looks good.

• 26:24Steven Rinella?

  At least it doesn't look bad.

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• 28:49Steven Rinella?

  Guy wrote in about this. He was talking to his daughter's boyfriend the other day. That is a weird sentence.

• 28:57Steven Rinella?

  I have a daughter who's 13. Yanni has daughters right in that same bracket. Someday me and Yanni will be telling, will be running around saying, I was talking to my daughter's boyfriend the other day.

• 29:08Speaker 08

  Mm hmm.

• 29:11Steven Rinella?

  Right before I beat the shit out of him. I was telling him how I'm about to punch him.

• 29:16Speaker 08

  And somebody, somebody at some point in the distant past was saying that about you guys.

• 29:21Steven Rinella?

  Oh, definitely. Yeah, I was talking to my daughter's boyfriend one day. This Steve guy, he tells me. Hopefully it'll go on like this when he says, the kid, 19, loves waterfall hunting. Yeah. So I'd be like, you picked a great little boyfriend there, daughter. I told my daughter I'm gonna pick her boyfriend out for her. I was talking to my daughter's boyfriend the other day. This is the writer in. Kid loves waterfall hunting. From the start of the season till the end, he is hunting. Love this guy. Morehouse, maybe, oh, he's too old for my daughter. So he starts telling me where all the ducks have been reported in the area. I had no idea where he was getting this info, so I asked. He tells me there is a handy app called eBird, which I have. This is from, so just for listeners, this is from Cornell.

• 30:07Steven Rinella?

  Birders will report the birds in the area and track what birds they see on what body of wa- body of water or in a field. He then uses that info to either set up on public water or ask permission if it's private.

• 30:23Speaker 08

  This next line.

• 30:23Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's so good. This kid isn't very smart, but he nailed it with this one.

• 30:28Speaker 08

  I laughed out loud in the plane when I read that.

• 30:32Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I've done this. Years ago, we were gonna go to Nevada in the Ruby Mountains to try to hunt Himalayan snowcocks. And one day I realized that people report all the snowcocks they see on eBird. And I was like, I can't believe these people are reporting it. Likewise, we were one time staying in a hut in New Zealand, hunting, a public hut in New Zealand, and there's a journal.

• 30:59Steven Rinella?

  In the journal, guys like so weird. We saw some chamois from the hut across the river.

• 31:05Steven Rinella?

  Which we had no idea about and one of getting one of them. Okay. But I don't know if a waterfall that changes so fast. I don't know how true that is.

• 31:15Speaker 05

  Oh, I mean, but this is up to date, up to date info.

• 31:19Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but are enough people saying, hey, I just saw some, uh, I just, you know, I just saw a big bunch of honkers out in Old Lady McGinn's field. Like, like, is it like quick enough that you'd get on it?

• 31:30Speaker 05

  Dude, the birders are serious.

• 31:32Speaker 07

  Yeah, I think it's legit info.

• 31:35Speaker 05

  They're not just out there like going, I like honkers. No, they're like writing it, putting this information into their lists and their apps and.

• 31:42Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. If you were, if you had moved to a new area, if you were cold rolling. I don't know. I just a little skeptical.

• 31:50Speaker 04

  I'd be looking at eBird and I'd be looking for churches.

• 31:55Steven Rinella?

  Old cemeteries.

• 31:56Speaker 06

  I also think this 19 year old has found like a game within a game that he enjoys playing now. Like it's, it's more fun for him to go kill ducks that he learned about via eBird. From the next door lady who's a an earnest birder.

• 32:11Speaker 08

  Oh, totally. If I ever killed a bear that someone had reported on all trails, that would be a highlight accomplishment for me.

• 32:17Speaker 06

  They talk about the bears they see. They talk about the elk they see.

• 32:20Speaker 05

  Funny thing is, is that you then checked back in on the app and be like, got him.

• 32:27Speaker 06

  You can have an up close picture of it.

• 32:29Steven Rinella?

  Thanks, bro. He's in the back of my truck right now. If you'd like to report him again. Uh, beavers is fish. As background here for listeners, I was talking about in the old days, in the old fur trade era of the like during the colonial time.

• 32:46Steven Rinella?

  The Catholics would sometimes have a hard time accessing fish in the, in like new world situations and they want, and, and and at some point Randall was going to dig into this. At some point they got permission. They're like, hey, when we're trying to observe the Lenten meal, we don't have access to fish. But we have aquatic rodents and they live in the water. And it was said like they were given a special dispensation back in the old days. That you'd be like, okay, the church says in the situation you're in, if you can't get fish, have an aquatic mammal.

• 33:19Speaker 06

  It was about 250 years ago in Detroit where that happened.

• 33:23Steven Rinella?

  Job. Where'd you find that?

• 33:25Speaker 06

  I wrote about it when we did the pardon my plate episode for muskrat.

• 33:30Steven Rinella?

  Oh, perfect. Did I tell you about it? And that's why you wrote about it?

• 33:32Speaker 06

  No, no, no.

• 33:33Steven Rinella?

  Oh, come on. Don't be embarrassed.

• 33:38Steven Rinella?

  So this guy. How am I going to do this here? So there's a guy that writes in, he doesn't want us to use his name or anything.

• 33:48Steven Rinella?

  He says he does a lot of beaver trapping.

• 33:52Steven Rinella?

  Now he. Okay. He writes, I put my spectacles on here. In January 29, 2026. Well, I don't know when he wrote it.

• 34:05Steven Rinella?

  Shouldn't have brought it up.

• 34:08Steven Rinella?

  He writes to the suits at the church. What do you call them? And this in his denomination?

• 34:13Speaker 06

  The parish? The cloaks?

• 34:15Steven Rinella?

  He writes to his padre. No, he writes to the bishop. The big suits. He's a Catholic and he writes to his bishop. Saying, hey, man, I'm a big beaver trapper. Can I eat my beavers for the Lenten meal?

• 34:33Steven Rinella?

  His bishop. And this guy's got a stamp. The Roman Catholic Bishop of Blank.

• 34:44Steven Rinella?

  Okay. He writes him a special letter back saying, go on ahead. Eat your beavers for your Lenten meal.

• 34:54Steven Rinella?

  And he ends his letter. This dispensation, the letters, January 29, 2026.

• 35:02Steven Rinella?

  The letter says from his bishop, his bishop writes him this, although this practice is not customary within these, within this diocese. The dispensation is granted with the understanding that the penitential character of the Fridays of Lent will continue to be faithfully observed through appropriate acts of prayer, self-denial and charity. This dispensation applies only to the consumption of muskrat and beaver and does not otherwise dispense from the church's discipline regarding Lenten observance.

• 35:42Steven Rinella?

  It is granted for the Fridays of Lent in the year 2026 and is not to be presumed beyond this scope or duration.

• 35:55Speaker 08

  Oh, it's interesting that it's like, uh, there's an expiration date on it.

• 35:59Speaker 06

  Yeah, he has to ask again in 2027.

• 36:02Steven Rinella?

  Really stuck to him in the end.

• 36:03Speaker 06

  That's a lot.

• 36:06Steven Rinella?

  That's great, though.

• 36:07Speaker 06

  Yeah. For, for more background, it was the 1780s. They were French Catholic missionaries. They had a few hard winters consecutively. It got to the point where they were starving and eating chopped hay. And that was when they made the determination that you can eat muskrats, which were plentiful where they were living in southern Michigan.

• 36:22Speaker 08

  Still are.

• 36:23Steven Rinella?

  We also. Why were they eating chopped hay?

• 36:25Speaker 06

  Because they had nothing else to eat. Because it wasn't legal yet for them to.

• 36:29Steven Rinella?

  Oh, just on, on a certain day, they had to resort to chopped hay.

• 36:32Speaker 06

  Yes, like that. That was what, um, got them to make it okay for them to eat muskrats.

• 36:38Steven Rinella?

  But are you following me?

• 36:40Speaker 06

  They didn't have any other food.

• 36:42Steven Rinella?

  I got it. But if you came up to, let's say, like, have you ever fasted for 24 hours?

• 36:47Speaker 06

  Um, yeah.

• 36:48Steven Rinella?

  Okay, I have. It's not that big of a deal. I don't start eating chopped hay if I'm fasting for 24 hours.

• 36:55Speaker 08

  There's a broader, uh, issue, I think, with food supply.

• 36:59Speaker 07

  You said it was a tough winter, right?

• 37:01Speaker 06

  Yeah, they were struggling to have food in general.

• 37:03Steven Rinella?

  But how many days during Lent?

• 37:07Steven Rinella?

  I smell a fresh pair of boots for someone during Lent. How many days do you have to only eat fish? I thought it was only Fridays during the Lent period.

• 37:16Speaker 08

  The problem is not that they just can't get fish. It's that they're starving more generally.

• 37:20Steven Rinella?

  They were probably eat the muskrats any day they wanted, except for the Fridays during Lent.

• 37:25Speaker 06

  Yeah, I know.

• 37:28Steven Rinella?

  Sounds like someone needs to do a little fact check.

• 37:30Speaker 06

  Did please do.

• 37:32Steven Rinella?

  I meant you.

• 37:33Speaker 06

  We know.

• 37:36Speaker 06

  I'm going to win the boots. I'm going to start making things that I can correct. And then I'll write in the correction.

• 37:42Steven Rinella?

  That's a good idea.

• 37:43Speaker 06

  And win the boots.

• 37:47Steven Rinella?

  We could probably hook you up with some boots.

• 37:48Speaker 06

  Yeah, you'll need to vote for me.

• 37:49Speaker 08

  Just get a P O. Box.

• 37:50Speaker 07

  Now he'll win the boots and then put them in the auction house audit.

• 37:54Steven Rinella?

  Okay, everybody joined now by Olympic gold medalist Connor Hellebuyck, who was the goalie during the Olympic gold medal game there against the damn Canadians, who must have blocked like, I don't know. I heard something crazy. You could probably tell us like it was like 42 shots or something all of a sudden. And you didn't get the, you didn't, you of course didn't get the winning goal, but you carried the game, man.

• 38:24Speaker 11

  Thanks. Yeah, I, I did help on that goal though. I got an assist.

• 38:28Steven Rinella?

  Oh, that's excellent.

• 38:30Speaker 11

  Pretty rare for a goalie to get that.

• 38:31Speaker 08

  That's amazing.

• 38:32Steven Rinella?

  I want to tell you, I want to first admit something to you. It's, it's a running joke in my family. It's a running joke among my friends that I'm the dumbest guy in the world about sports. But I have, you could ask my kids this. I periodically make my kids watch the 1980s like Miracle on Ice incident. And I teach it to them as sort of a moment, a defining moment in American history. So because of that, like I, like Olympic hockey.

• 39:06Steven Rinella?

  Matters to me and I happened to be travel on your guys day on your big win day. I was traveling with our colleague Max Barta, who is like all in way in on hockey. And so I got to live the game next to him. We wound up in the, we were traveling. So we wound up in the Delta Lounge and tension in the Delta Lounge was high. When you guys won, people erupted in the Delta Lounge. I mean, went nuts in the Delta Lounge. Max is running around in his jersey. His jersey that was the goalie when we beat the Soviets. That dude's name

• 39:50Steven Rinella?

  is on the back of his jersey. In the airport, guys are coming up to hug Max.

• 39:58Steven Rinella?

  High fiving him. It was like the funnest sort of thing that, that like just to be by Max and through all that. And we watched it and it was like honest to God, like it was like at that moment in the Delta Lounge. It was like emotional dude. And it was amazing to watch. And I, and I said, and then my buddy Tommy Edson, who I like a lot, texts me like in the minutes after, and he's like, this guy has a largemouth bass on his helmet.

• 40:28Steven Rinella?

  And he's like, you need to talk to this guy. And so here we are.

• 40:33Speaker 11

  Yeah, I think, uh, I, we didn't really feel how much it brought the country together until we stepped foot back in America. And then it was just, it was insane. Everywhere we went, every place you let one little USA chant out and this, the whole place was a

• 40:52Speaker 11

  so much fun. I mean, the last, the seven, the immediate 72 hours after we won. Uh, I mean, I can count the hours of sleep on one hand.

• 41:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 41:03Speaker 11

  The, just the feel from the people around. It was just incredible. I mean, we were supposed to land in New York and we ended up switching to Miami within, I don't know. Four hours before the flight and it took that four hours for everyone to know exactly what we're doing the entire day.

• 41:23Speaker 11

  Artillery before we had our itinerary. Um, so that was pretty cool. And I, I think the best thing I could have done is throw a bass on my mask. I mean, I put a fish on every single mask, but I like to try to keep it with bass because I love bass fishing. But I mix in trout, walleye, pike, musty, you know, uh, uh, change it up. I've had a lot of mass over the years. But putting the mask on there is just absolutely blowing up my biggest passion of, of bass fishing.

• 41:49Steven Rinella?

  That's great. When you, so I, I got a friend that plays, uh, major league baseball and man, that is a not efficient friendly. That is not a fishing friendly enterprise. Wh- what is your, uh, like, what's your off season look like? Like, when are you guys like really free to fish?

• 42:04Speaker 11

  So our last regular season game is roughly April 18th, so mid-April. If you make playoffs and go on for another two months to the end of the final, so mid-June, but that's only two teams. For the most part, the fishing season is mid-April to say mid-September and fishing season kinda ends end of August. But if you don't make playoffs, you have mid-April all the way to mid-September.

• 42:31Steven Rinella?

  I've asked my buddy in baseball this because hit for him, it's whether season's gonna end. And what kind of hunting he's gonna be able to do in October or not?

• 42:41Speaker 11

  Yeah.

• 42:41Steven Rinella?

  And I, is this, uh, I was talking about a guy named Pete Alonso and I asked him, do you ever hope you don't make playoffs so you can hunt more? And he said, that is not a hope.

• 42:51Speaker 11

  Um.

• 42:53Speaker 11

  Yeah. Well, you know, I have it, I have it set up pretty good where, I mean, we play a lot of the southern teams. And I have a little travel rod and a little backpack to throw gear in. And any chance I get post-practice or get an off day, I just throw the backpack on and go find a spot.

• 43:10Steven Rinella?

  Oh, is that right?

• 43:11Speaker 11

  Like that. Yeah. I, I go off the bank or get a guide if I have a full day off. If not, I'll just, I'll just hike around and, and walk around the lake and try to catch a fish here and there. But, um, Winnipeg's pretty good for fishing and hunting. I got, we have all of October. I will, we'll start in September. The, the geese hunting up here, the bird hunting is incredible.

• 43:33Steven Rinella?

  Huh.

• 43:33Speaker 11

  They come in, because they come in by the thousands. Like you're, I've limited out within forty-five minutes with ten guys, which is crazy.

• 43:43Speaker 11

  But the deer hunting is shortly after that. So we go, we go from fishing season, get here for the hockey season. And then we have hunting season, which starts with birds, then goes to bucks. And then the ice crease is over. And then we have world-class walleye ice fishing. So I mean, it's just one thing after the next.

• 44:01Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 44:02Speaker 11

  It's really fun. Yeah.

• 44:03Steven Rinella?

  So of all the places you've lived and considering where you grew up, what do you regard as like, when you think of home water? You know, like the sort of like for you, the emotional center of your fishing life i- is where like, what's home water?

• 44:19Speaker 11

  So home, home, home water?

• 44:21Steven Rinella?

  Or like, yeah, like would you imagine yourself like on the, like the place that means the most to you? What is that place? What body of water?

• 44:30Speaker 11

  So I mean, all the, we have in Michigan, a ton of small lakes. Especially in Oakland County. That's where I grew up and that's where I still live in the summer. So I would say any of those lakes, I know them like the back of my hand. But from like a more broad spectrum, I would consider Lake St. Clair, my home.

• 44:48Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 44:49Speaker 11

  I'm better on the smaller lakes, but I'm also pretty good on the big lake too. And the big lake is, if someone's coming in to go fishing, you take them to the big lake.

• 44:59Steven Rinella?

  So if you had to go small mouth bass, large mouth bass, where you at on that?

• 45:04Speaker 11

  Small mouth bass, you're going straight to Lake St. Clair. You can catch, I mean, you can catch six pounders in there, but for the most part, you're catching 20, 25, five pound bags. But that's your five bass limit.

• 45:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. What I, what I meant was if you had to pick between small mouths.

• 45:20Speaker 11

  Oh.

• 45:20Steven Rinella?

  And large mouths, like you're a large mouth guy, would you say?

• 45:23Speaker 11

  Yeah. Uh, no, I'd say I'm probably a small mouth guy, but you know, it's crazy. You ask someone that's been fishing small mouth for 10 years and be like, oh, I want to go catch large mouth right now. And then vice versa, you cut, you ask the large mouth guys, hey, what do you want to go catch? Like, oh, I'd love to catch a small mouth. So. You know, for me, I think, uh, I can do both, but I think small mouth just based on the size and the quantity that we have them in Michigan. I'd probably say I'm a small mouth guy.

• 45:48Steven Rinella?

  Okay. Then I got a personal question for you. If you had to take a stab, how many large mouth bass have you fried and eaten in your life?

• 45:59Speaker 11

  I have eaten one when I was a kid, we didn't know, we didn't know. That it's a sport fish and we wanted to try it when we were younger and my parents made it. Um, the second we got a little more into fishing, we realized, oh, you don't really eat these for the sport. So it's very much frowned upon in my life and my world.

• 46:22Steven Rinella?

  Really?

• 46:24Speaker 11

  Yes.

• 46:24Steven Rinella?

  I got a buddy who was a, he was an amateur pro, like, what, that's a contradiction. Amateur pro bass, is that the right way you put it? Either way, he's an amateur competitive bass angler and I was fishing with him. And I learned that this guy, his whole life has been doing this. He had never eaten a bass.

• 46:48Speaker 05

  You're talking about Matt Elliott?

• 46:49Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I made him eat one.

• 46:53Speaker 05

  No, you actually made me make him eat one.

• 46:56Steven Rinella?

  Oh, sorry.

• 46:58Speaker 11

  I mean, they're okay, but if you can just go in that same body of water and catch walleye, like walleye's gonna taste way better.

• 47:05Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, understood.

• 47:06Speaker 11

  You'd eat plenty of walleye.

• 47:08Steven Rinella?

  So right now, what, uh, right now, tell me where you're at right now and with your season and everything, what, what will be the net? Like what fishing trip, what's your next fishing trip you got planned? Like what, what will be the next outing you do?

• 47:23Speaker 11

  Well, I'm debating right now, uh, we're right now, we're fighting for a playoff spot and the schedule is just insane after the Olympics, it's every other day, so finding time is pretty difficult. But we're debating on our next off day, trying to sneak out, go ice fishing, or if that doesn't work out, April 1st, I got an off day in Dallas. I'm trying to talk them into flying in early so I can take a guide out. But if that's not the case, I'll just have someone pick me up and we'll just go beat the bank with, uh, with the travel rod.

• 47:53Steven Rinella?

  Okay, man, I bet you, you'll have some guys from Dallas listen to the show, probably hitting you up with fishing spots, man.

• 48:00Speaker 11

  Honestly, they probably will and, uh, let's keep those secrets.

• 48:06Steven Rinella?

  All right, Connor, thanks so much for joining on, man. Thank you for the win. It really was like, it was such a fun day, dude. And it was, people were so happy and just seeing everybody in the airport and, and, uh, seeing my buddy Max so happy. Everybody felt good. I was in such a good mood. I got home, my kids thought something was wrong with me.

• 48:26Steven Rinella?

  I made them watch highlights from the 1980s game. So I was like, this will, you'll help, you'll understand why your dad's so emotional that we just won another gold medal in hockey. So that's great, man. Thank, thank you so much for joining. Have a good fishing trip in Dallas, buddy.

• 48:42Speaker 11

  Thanks. No problem. Glad to be here.

• 48:44Steven Rinella?

  Thanks, Connor.

• 48:45Speaker 08

  Thank you.

• 48:46Speaker 11

  No problem, guys.

• 48:48Steven Rinella?

  Okay, onto our next story. Two Californian men charged, this is breaking news.

• 48:58Steven Rinella?

  Two Californian men charged for shattering a $200,000 mammoth tusk at a museum.

• 49:07Steven Rinella?

  They were at the Ancient Ozarks Natural History Museum in Branson, Missouri.

• 49:14Steven Rinella?

  There's a big mammoth skeleton with big tusks. 200 pound tusks. One of these guys apparently, and I understand,

• 49:25Steven Rinella?

  gets up on his buddy's shoulders because he wants to get a picture or something of him hanging from that tusk. And shattered it. They're like, got arrested. When I say I understand, when I'm in a museum, all I can think about is touching everything and getting stuff out.

• 49:45Speaker 08

  Getting stuff out.

• 49:48Steven Rinella?

  Do you like, who doesn't want to, Randall and me were in a museum and they had a teepee. You couldn't go into it. What did we talk about that we wanted to do?

• 49:55Speaker 08

  Oh, you, like, two hours after we'd left that museum, you're still talking about how you wanted to climb inside of the teepee just to see how it felt.

• 50:03Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. So I'm saying, when I'm at a museum, I'm like, sure like to get that out and have a look.

• 50:09Steven Rinella?

  I sure like to fiddle with that.

• 50:12Steven Rinella?

  Right? I understand, but the difference between me and these gentlemen.

• 50:17Speaker 05

  They weren't fiddling with it. They were gonna try to do a.

• 50:23Steven Rinella?

  He was trying to hang from it. Todd Azaveto and Brett Howard. What an embarrassing way to have to have your mug shut. Embarrassing. Such a weird lapse of judgment. Do you think they were drunk? Yeah, I was gonna say their faces look a little puffy here. That's just the look you get when you're arrested.

• 50:45Steven Rinella?

  Maybe because most people that are arrested are drunk. There's a strong correlation. What I'm saying, I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to like justify, I'm saying, I walk through museums. The main thing I'm thinking about is ways in which I wish I could have allowed to violate the museum's rules. Right, but then there's another part of your brain that's saying, do you think if I did that, there would be consequences? Yes. But I'm like, do I wish I could just have at it in the museum? Yes.

• 51:20Speaker 05

  So they broke a $200,000 tusk. What do you think the punishment should be?

• 51:25Steven Rinella?

  And shattered a 200 pound mammoth tusk. It's a good question though, Yanni. What was the question even?

• 51:34Speaker 05

  How mu- what do you think the punishment should be?

• 51:38Steven Rinella?

  It's gonna be reparations that they'll never be able to afford. Probably.

• 51:45Steven Rinella?

  He'll just have to live the rest of his life knowing that he owes that museum a ton of money or something.

• 51:49Speaker 05

  I should have to like sweep up that museum for the rest of his life.

• 51:54Steven Rinella?

  Oh, you wanna know something nuts?

• 51:57Steven Rinella?

  My brother Danny. They were out doing their work. He works in Alaska. He's a salmon biologist. They were out doing their work. I'm not gonna tell you even kinda where he was. I don't actually know where he was. He says way up, there's a giant cut bank. And he said hanging out of that cut bank is a big mammoth tusk. They didn't even touch it.

• 52:17Speaker 05

  Well, he can't legally touch it.

• 52:18Steven Rinella?

  No, not just him. You can't.

• 52:20Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 52:21Steven Rinella?

  But I mean, how many guys would have been like, well, let's just go touch it.

• 52:25Speaker 05

  So wait, Alaska natives can't touch it?

• 52:28Steven Rinella?

  Get a picture. I don't know. I'm guessing they maybe got, I don't know. I know that he couldn't. It was federal land. And he said, the way it was positioned, you'd have had to rig up, you'd have had to bush rig a ladder. It was so high up a cut bank. He said, just hanging out of the cut bank.

• 52:45Speaker 04

  So the proper steps would be like you would have to contact the managing agency and inform them of this for them to collect it or document it or something?

• 52:54Steven Rinella?

  You're not under an obligation to do it.

• 52:57Speaker 08

  Yeah, but there's rules about like fossils over, I mean Spencer probably knows this morning. There's rules about fossils over a certain size, I think, and all kinds of like what you need a permit for.

• 53:06Steven Rinella?

  Maybe he did, maybe he did report it, but he didn't touch it and he wasn't allowed to touch it. And he said, if he wanted to touch it, it would have been a real project. He said it was way up a cut bank.

• 53:14Speaker 07

  Next rainstorm, it might just disappear.

• 53:16Steven Rinella?

  No, sure, it'll get cut. Yeah, all those ones people find in the riverbeds are obviously eroding out.

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• 55:39Steven Rinella?

  Brody, the long overdue fur sales ban report from Brody.

• 55:43Speaker 07

  Yep, Colorado fur ban. I'm sure a lot of people have heard about this, but I'll give like background then like what's going on, what could happen in the future. They tried this thing in the city of Denver a few years ago, four or five years ago, I think it was, to ban the sale of fur products in the city of Denver, and then it went away and now it came back. So what the deal is, it's a proposed statewide rule to prohibit the commercial sale, barter, or trade of wild animal fur or fur products in Colorado, the state of Colorado. So like typical species like fur bears, species like beaver, fox, bobcat, marten, muskrat, stuff like that.

• 56:26Steven Rinella?

  But not beaver.

• 56:27Speaker 07

  Beaver's in there.

• 56:28Steven Rinella?

  Well, when you get to the really dumb part.

• 56:31Speaker 07

  Yeah. Anyway, the proposal doesn't ban trapping or hunting, but you know, obviously it's going to undermine the economic viability of certain businesses in Colorado. You might be wondering who started this and how it happened, and it's weird because this isn't like... The cat hunting thing that happened last year in Colorado, which was a ballot measure, uh, under Colorado law, citizens can petition the state wildlife rulemaking body to like, just create or change regulations. So you could like, go to the wildlife commission in Colorado and be like, I think I should be able to shoot two meal deer bucks a year.

• 57:15Speaker 07

  And then they'd say yea or nay, you know, have a, have a process that that would go through. Um, this particular proposal was submitted uh, by a citizen named Samantha Miller, who works for the wildlife advocacy advocacy group. That's a good, good way to describe it, I guess. Center for Biological Diversity, which we talked about last week. Um, is one of those groups that gives themselves a serious name. You know, but they're actually like an animal rights activist group.

• 57:49Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, they're, they're the worst. Well, not the worst, but among them.

• 57:52Speaker 07

  And Samantha Miller was also the person who is largely in charge of, of the cats aren't trophies thing that, that went, didn't go through in Colorado last year. Um, so we took, we already talked about like restrict all commercial fur sales, like how it reached the commission. Um, and, and like, this is almost a story of like a rogue wildlife commission as much as anything else. Um, because on March 4th, so a little over a week ago, uh, Colorado Parks and Wildlife voted,

• 58:32Speaker 07

  the commission voted six to four to advance a citizen petition that would ban the commercial sale of wild animal fur. Um, apparently this, this like process was very chaotic. Um, a lot of people didn't really know what they were voting on. It seems like there's a lot of confusion and anger and disgust like in the meeting. There were several hundred people there, um, from the public hunters, anglers, trappers, um, that, that opposed th- this measure. Uh CPW's new director, she like came out and said, we do not believe that this is a good thing to do. There's no biological justification justification for doing so.

• 59:14Steven Rinella?

  And that was said before the meeting.

• 59:15Speaker 07

  Oh, yeah.

• 59:16Steven Rinella?

  Before the voting, before so well. Because they pointed out, there's no, there is no population level impact from this thing.

• 59:21Speaker 07

  Yep. So after hours of public comment and debate, they, the commission votes six to four to go forward with it. Um, if you want to look up the names of those commissioners, you can, they're, they're tied closely to, um, they're, they're appointed by Governor Polis, they're, they're tied closely to, Polis is tied closely to some animal rights measures. Uh, these people are as well, and they kind of just did their own thing, um, which is, which is sad. So if this thing goes through, the, in the impacts to businesses, like a big one would be the fly fishing, like retail business, fly tying, like you walk into a fly shop, you'll see an entire wall of fly tying materials.

• 1:00:05Speaker 07

  And a lot of those have fur in them, fur hair from muskrats, beavers, rabbits.

• 1:00:12Steven Rinella?

  A lot of them carry the name of it.

• 1:00:13Speaker 07

  Yeah, for sure. Um, some other stuff would be apparel, uh, cowboy hats would be another.

• 1:00:19Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but that's what's so stupid about this.

• 1:00:21Speaker 07

  Go ahead.

• 1:00:21Steven Rinella?

  What's so stupid about it is when you make, when you make a cowboy hat.

• 1:00:27Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:00:28Steven Rinella?

  Like a high quality beaver wool felt cowboy hat, you take a beaver pelt, you throw away the leather, you throw away the guard hair and you take the under fur and compress it into felt. They're saying, well, that's okay, because that's cowboy hats. But if you took a beaver pelt.

• 1:00:43Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:00:43Steven Rinella?

  You, you can sell that cowboy hat, you can throw away the leather, throw away the guard hairs, make it unrecognizable, cool.

• 1:00:50Speaker 07

  Mm hmm.

• 1:00:50Steven Rinella?

  But should you take the beaver pelt and just sew it into a hat?

• 1:00:54Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:00:54Steven Rinella?

  Not cool.

• 1:00:55Speaker 07

  Exactly.

• 1:00:56Steven Rinella?

  That's illegal.

• 1:00:56Speaker 07

  Yep. And then there's like.

• 1:00:58Steven Rinella?

  It is so. Asinine.

• 1:01:00Speaker 07

  Yeah, it it and that kind of gets to like supply chain issues. Um, a lot of taxidermy projects would also be affected by this thing. So it it's a it could impact a lot, a lot of different areas.

• 1:01:15Steven Rinella?

  And they can't figure out how to write the the problem now is they can't figure out how to write the rule.

• 1:01:20Speaker 07

  No.

• 1:01:20Steven Rinella?

  It's so chaotic and and full of contradiction.

• 1:01:23Speaker 07

  Yeah, so like what happens next is bottom line is it's not lie yet. Um, it's in the rule development, the the vote, what it did was move it forward into the like rule development and public comment stage. So the Wildlife Commission has to have another vote before the ban takes effect. So, um, that's gonna happen. Um, th- th- then Colorado Parks and Wildlife would have to like draft proposed rules, which they'd also have to debate on what the rules would actually be, if there'd be any exceptions in the rules, like they might carve out an exception for fly tying materials or something like that.

• 1:02:03Steven Rinella?

  Well, yeah, well, yeah, they'll carve out exceptions.

• 1:02:06Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:02:06Steven Rinella?

  So they want to be that there's all this stuff is cool to use fur for.

• 1:02:10Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 1:02:11Steven Rinella?

  Unless it's like visibly fur.

• 1:02:13Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:02:14Steven Rinella?

  On a person's body. Like, you know, what the the indigenous people that lived in Colorado traditionally wore, that would be illegal.

• 1:02:25Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:02:25Steven Rinella?

  Now, if you want to run around like a dude rancher in a cowboy hat, you're A okay.

• 1:02:29Speaker 07

  Yeah, buckskin pants, like probably not, not.

• 1:02:32Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, you know, you're totally fine, because you because you know why? Because you threw the hair away.

• 1:02:35Speaker 07

  Right.

• 1:02:36Steven Rinella?

  It wouldn't be a fur product.

• 1:02:37Speaker 07

  Um, so it is like.

• 1:02:38Steven Rinella?

  Then you could sell that.

• 1:02:40Speaker 07

  It's, you know, it's just another, another attempt to make our life more difficult.

• 1:02:45Steven Rinella?

  Dude, that guy like

• 1:02:48Steven Rinella?

  that I I it's not just Jared, like Jared Polis termed out. It's not even just him, it's his husband.

• 1:02:54Speaker 07

  Right.

• 1:02:54Steven Rinella?

  Who's like a big animal rights guy.

• 1:02:56Speaker 07

  Exactly, but these people are appointed by Polis. They've done, they've gone kind of rogue on things before. This is another example of that. Hopefully. When Polis terms out, we'll get a new wildlife commission in there that is going to be friendlier to hunters and anglers and and people like us. Um, the timeline for this is next meeting is in May of 2026. So we'll know more in a couple of months. And um, they'll have to vote and adopt, modify, or reject it. Um, so we'll see what happens.

• 1:03:32Speaker 05

  What makes me mad is that think about what's not getting done that could be getting done and that would be positive for wildlife.

• 1:03:39Speaker 07

  This is not serious work.

• 1:03:40Speaker 05

  Instead, they gotta be dealing with this BS.

• 1:03:42Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:03:43Speaker 04

  Brody, am I right that the public can show up for this next meeting? It's May 4th or 5th?

• 1:03:47Speaker 07

  I don't have the exact date. It just says May 2026 in Grand Junction. So yeah, for any of those commission meetings, the public is can always show up.

• 1:03:57Steven Rinella?

  Can I hit you with another added little deal here that that's kind of like what makes this infuriating? Years ago, like many, many years ago, back in the mid 90s, I think, early 90s, late 90s, Colorado effectively like banned trapping on public land. So it used to have like regulated trapping. What they then did is like, what do you do about all the guys that have depredation issues? They have like problem beavers, problem, whatever. So they make the system by which a private landowner can go be like, hey, I got a beaver problem.

• 1:04:23Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:04:24Steven Rinella?

  Then they're like, oh, okay. Then it's no holds barred. No, no seasons, no equipment restrictions, whatever. Okay. Then you can go get them. Now they're saying, but you have to throw the hide in the trash. Because currently, if someone has a beaver issue and they bring in a trapper to do it, the trapper can take the product and sell it.

• 1:04:47Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:04:48Steven Rinella?

  And it could be used for all manner of things, including cowboy hats. This is like, no, no, no. You gotta throw it in the garbage.

• 1:04:54Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's crazy.

• 1:04:56Steven Rinella?

  You can't sell it.

• 1:04:57Speaker 07

  Yeah. But like.

• 1:04:59Steven Rinella?

  It's like that stuff like in, in, in, remember in Australia, they have all those like kangaroo depredation things? And then one day they go like, oh, and also you gotta leave it to rot.

• 1:05:09Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:05:10Steven Rinella?

  If you get it, you gotta leave it to rot. You can't touch it.

• 1:05:12Speaker 07

  Yep. The, and, and like, I'd love to say this is just a bunch of bullshit and it's not going to go through, but man, these days you just don't know in Colorado, what could happen.

• 1:05:24Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. How could that place of like, well, I know how it happened.

• 1:05:29Steven Rinella?

  How could a state like of such, I mean, like John Denver, dude?

• 1:05:34Speaker 07

  Yep. John Denver.

• 1:05:36Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:37Speaker 07

  Biggest elk herd in the country.

• 1:05:38Steven Rinella?

  I know. Someone said like, it was like the minute, the minute more people lived in Fort Collins in Denver.

• 1:05:46Speaker 07

  And this.

• 1:05:47Steven Rinella?

  Then it did the rest of the state. Boom.

• 1:05:49Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:05:50Steven Rinella?

  Try like, that's when, you know?

• 1:05:51Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:05:52Steven Rinella?

  Rocky Mountain.

• 1:05:54Speaker 07

  So normally my beloved state of Colorado, I'm all about it, but this.

• 1:05:58Steven Rinella?

  Oh dude, listen, man, I love the place, love the place, love the people. This is not about that. Just about, you gotta take your state back, dude.

• 1:06:05Speaker 07

  Yep. Yep.

• 1:06:06Steven Rinella?

  Good lord.

• 1:06:07Speaker 07

  So we'll check back in in May and see, see what's going on with it.

• 1:06:12Steven Rinella?

  Maybe someday down the road, instead of crazy left wing people, we'll be bitching about crazy right wing people running Colorado in, into the ground.

• 1:06:19Speaker 07

  I don't think so.

• 1:06:22Speaker 08

  Like it would go the way of Utah right now?

• 1:06:24Steven Rinella?

  Just whatever. Yeah. Like it'll be like, all of a sudden it's like, yeah, you get a state where, I don't know. It's just, it's just, it's just the seesaw. It's the, but I don't know if it'll ever swing.

• 1:06:34Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:06:34Steven Rinella?

  It's the swing. The swing kills me.

• 1:06:37Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:06:38Steven Rinella?

  All right, Randall. You got some good news for us?

• 1:06:41Speaker 08

  Bit of good news, actually.

• 1:06:42Steven Rinella?

  This is great news.

• 1:06:43Speaker 08

  Yeah. Um, so the, the Commerce Department, um, manages fisheries and federal waters. Like three, I guess it's some like three miles offshore, something like that. Um, and they are poised to cede management authority to the states of North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia and Florida, when it comes to red snapper.

• 1:07:07Steven Rinella?

  How did they lose? Is this in your report? How did they lose management?

• 1:07:13Speaker 08

  Um, well, I think, I mean, I think commerce and like Noah have managed these historically since like Magnus Stevenson.

• 1:07:20Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Also way ago.

• 1:07:21Speaker 08

  Yeah. But, and I think like. The reauthorization of Magnus Stevenson put, and I could be botching this, but I think it became like more rigid quotas and sort of season setting on, on harvest of red snapper. Um, and so what's going to happen, I guess, under the federal system, the short version is that they're managing with like very broad strokes because they don't have the, the very detailed like recreational angler catch. I mean, so much of marine fisheries just comes down to data. Yep. And so they would, these states would end up with a very short season, like only a day, two days, three days, something like that.

• 1:07:59Speaker 07

  Real small limits too.

• 1:08:00Speaker 08

  Yeah. And, and so essentially the states want authority to manage it with more data. They're going to take some elements of like the federal management structure and some of the information that is good on that side, but supplement it with sort of like the equivalent of Creole surveys. Okay. And. A more fine tuned picture of what's happening in the moment. Yeah. And, and the result of that is that we're going to have, we, the, the hunting and fishing community, they're going to have longer seasons. Um, so like in Florida, I think they're talking about a, a 39 day season. The Carolinas are looking like at a 60 day season. Okay.

• 1:08:40Speaker 07

  Can I, I have a question. Were the feds ma, like the feds were managing like under the assumption that there wasn't a lot of them and we shouldn't be taking a lot of them and the states are like, there's actually a lot more of these things than, or is that not?

• 1:08:55Speaker 08

  No, I, I think it was more, I think it was more that they just, I mean, they didn't really know how many people were actually fishing for them. So like, that's one of the change. So, so the bigger context is that this has already happened in the Gulf. Yeah. Um, and so the South Atlantic states are sort of going to move to what's happening in the Gulf and that's been very successful. And part of the reason for that. Is that they're they're um keeping track of who's actually fishing for snapper. So they're they're um, I don't know if you'd call it a permit, but um like endorsements for snapper fishing. So they know, okay, all these guys that are buying saltwater licenses.

• 1:09:34Speaker 08

  This chunk of them are fishing for speckled trout and they're targeting inshore species and only this sliver of them is are targeting red snapper and grouper and things like that. So so essentially with more refined data, they have a better sense of what the pressure on the resource is.

• 1:09:50Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:51Speaker 08

  And um they, you know, in some states, I think Louisiana, like they, some of them do weekly email updates and phone calls to people with the snapper endorsement. Uh, some states, I think Alabama, Mississippi, like they actually know how many are being caught because there's only a certain number of of boat launches that people go out of to fish snapper. So it's it's taking like the big unwieldy federal uh marine fisheries apparatus and and handing it to the state so that the states can get better data and make better decisions um for the resource and for anglers.

• 1:10:28Steven Rinella?

  Cut your anecdote.

• 1:10:29Speaker 08

  Please.

• 1:10:29Steven Rinella?

  I've fished uh, I've fished a number of years recently, a number of years in a row spearfishing for red snapper in Louisiana. And what's been surprising to me down there is like that adaptive management strategy. How fluid it is.

• 1:10:45Speaker 08

  Mm hmm.

• 1:10:45Steven Rinella?

  Meaning when I was a kid growing up like in Michigan, you could spend your entire lifetime fishing under a management structure, being that, you know, whatever, the season starts this day, it ends this day. The bag limit is this many, the minimum weight, the minimum length is this, and decades go by.

• 1:11:07Speaker 08

  Right.

• 1:11:08Steven Rinella?

  And it's just how it is.

• 1:11:09Speaker 08

  Right.

• 1:11:10Steven Rinella?

  Right. Fishing Louisiana, it's like constantly being adjusted.

• 1:11:16Steven Rinella?

  As the Red Snapper season, um, and like Kobe too, be like, there's like a vest, there's a changing vessel limit, there's changing opening day and closing day, there's changing closed days.

• 1:11:28Speaker 08

  Mm hmm.

• 1:11:29Steven Rinella?

  As you realize that they're looking at these data sets and they're like opening, closing, opening, closing and playing it like a, like an instrument.

• 1:11:38Speaker 07

  It's like that in Washington too, isn't it for a lot of stuff?

• 1:11:41Steven Rinella?

  Well, it could, I'm not saying it's not, it could be, I just, that was an example. It was talking to me like, man, this is not like, this is like very up to date, like what's going on? And how are we like manipulating harvests? And I'm sure there's a hundred.

• 1:11:53Speaker 08

  And it's similar to what they do with salmon, like in Alaska, you know, like they, they have data and they're tracking pressure on the resource. But yeah, the, like the, the federal system is based on long-term trends and an absence of real, like fine data.

• 1:12:08Steven Rinella?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:12:08Speaker 08

  And so by giving it to the states, like they're going to be intercepting people at boat launches and like keeping track of how many days this week did you fish? How many fish did you get? And so, um, I think everybody thinks it's a win-win. Uh, there's probably some objections from the like ocean conservancy crowd who'd rather see like a more like tightly regulated marine fishery.

• 1:12:35Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:35Speaker 08

  Um, and like they just don't really want like an open access fishery. I mean, that's sort of the general, speaking very generally, that's sort of what that crowd would like. But, um.

• 1:12:47Steven Rinella?

  Well, it's, it's the states. It's like this, it's the states to pull it off or not.

• 1:12:53Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 1:12:53Steven Rinella?

  I mean, you know, if they run, if they, if they screw it up and they get too aggressive on harvest and they run them into the ground.

• 1:13:01Speaker 08

  Right.

• 1:13:02Steven Rinella?

  There, there's very low incentive to do that because once you do that, you're going to wind up right back where you started.

• 1:13:08Speaker 08

  Yeah, and I, I mean, based on what I was told, um, I, I talked to a former colleague at TRCP this morning to just explain this all to me.

• 1:13:17Steven Rinella?

  Wow, man, Randall doing like actual.

• 1:13:19Speaker 08

  Oh, he's a good guy. I just like, I like to go in on the phone with him.

• 1:13:22Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:23Speaker 08

  Chris McLucio, good guy. Um, and he, he was saying like, man, what's happening in the Gulf is great. It's great. And it's going to be a huge win for these states if, if this goes through. And I think most of the evidence points in the right direction here. So, uh, Florida, I think if this goes through, Florida would open Memorial Day weekend and they would have like a 39 day season and then maybe after that, some weekends here and there. So, uh, C Mac was telling me that with a one or two day season, if the weather's not right, you know, people kind of want to go out there anyway. And, and this way anglers can pick their days and it sort of distributes the pressure more widely. And yeah, just a, a

• 1:14:07Speaker 08

  bit of, uh, bright news in the landscape of, of Colorado for bands and all this other junk.

• 1:14:14Steven Rinella?

  Thank you for sharing, right?

• 1:14:15Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 1:14:16Steven Rinella?

  Spencer?

• 1:14:17Speaker 06

  I'm going to circle back to the Muskrat thing first. Um, this is from the Roman Catholic Church. The Lenten season has been observed from the onset of the church, although there have been inconsistencies with duration and practices. It goes on to talk about how, um, different churches at different eras had different rules. And sometimes, um, they had a fasting where you lived like a vegan. Sometimes they had a version where you could have a snack after 3:00 PM.

• 1:14:44Speaker 08

  Okay.

• 1:14:44Speaker 06

  Sometimes they had where only Sundays are when you could eat meat. So whatever was going on with this Detroit parish that had resorted to eat and hay, you'd imagine that their rules were that you couldn't eat meat for a certain amount of time, obviously a long period, uh, but you could eat fish. So that's, that's how that comes into play for them. I'm sure we already got 10 correction emails.

• 1:15:08Steven Rinella?

  Well, you know what I'm going to hit Randall with and get me a set of them boots?

• 1:15:11Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 1:15:12Steven Rinella?

  He said hunters and anglers will see longer seasons.

• 1:15:16Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 1:15:17Speaker 08

  Did I say that or did I say we meaning the hunting and angling community?

• 1:15:21Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 1:15:22Speaker 07

  Maybe he said hunters who are anglers.

• 1:15:24Speaker 08

  Size 11.

• 1:15:25Speaker 06

  Maybe, uh, Randall can correct your correction. Uh, I've got news from the Hawkeye State. Listen up Iweegians. The Iowa DNR needs your help. They are seeking volunteers right now. Who will go listen for frog and toad calls this spring and summer.

• 1:15:40Speaker 08

  Huh.

• 1:15:41Speaker 06

  This is a survey they've been doing since 1991. Basically what happens is volunteers drive around at night and they listen for amphibian vocalizations near wet areas. They then submit their findings via email to the DNR. Uh, and they ask that each volunteer spends about eight hours in total between April and July. Listening for frog and toad calls.

• 1:16:00Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 1:16:01Speaker 06

  Uh, these surveys take place in rural and urban areas, so don't think that if you live in Des Moines or Sioux City that you're of no help, that they would love you to volunteer. In 2025, volunteers surveyed 900 different wetlands. Uh, the DNR said that they were thrilled with everyone's participation, but that there are three counties in 2026. That are most in need of volunteers. These three counties have not had a frog or toad or toad survey. In years.

• 1:16:27Speaker 08

  Come on.

• 1:16:27Speaker 06

  Those are Ida, Henry and Wright. So if you're in Ida, Henry or Wright County, uh, you're exactly who they want.

• 1:16:35Speaker 08

  Load up the kids and get out there, man.

• 1:16:36Speaker 04

  Your country needs you.

• 1:16:37Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:16:38Speaker 04

  They need an eBird app for amphibians.

• 1:16:41Speaker 06

  I, I imagine that has to like be something they could make tomorrow.

• 1:16:44Speaker 08

  The nice thing is.

• 1:16:45Steven Rinella?

  I've talked to him about that when I was at Cornell, meeting with the people that developed the, the, the developed Merlin. I was like, you gotta put all kinds of stuff in there.

• 1:16:54Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:16:54Speaker 07

  Yep. Nice thing about this, you could go do some night fishing while you're.

• 1:16:58Speaker 06

  I mean, I, I would, I would, this is something I would say as a joke, but I mean it very earnest this time. This would be a great date night. Um.

• 1:17:05Speaker 08

  It would be, man.

• 1:17:06Speaker 06

  Get a, a bottle of wine.

• 1:17:07Speaker 04

  Country song.

• 1:17:08Speaker 06

  Drive responsibly.

• 1:17:09Speaker 08

  Hey baby, I'll sing. We go down to that big old swamp.

• 1:17:11Speaker 04

  Bottle of wine, the bullfrogs.

• 1:17:14Speaker 07

  What's the bullfrog? Juggerum?

• 1:17:16Speaker 08

  Juggerum.

• 1:17:17Speaker 07

  Juggerum.

• 1:17:18Speaker 04

  It's a great, it's a great filter for your potential girlfriend or whatever, right? If she's willing to do that, all right.

• 1:17:24Speaker 06

  What a useful skill to have to just be able to, you know, it's a good life skill that anybody could benefit from.

• 1:17:30Steven Rinella?

  I don't think it would be a first date.

• 1:17:34Steven Rinella?

  No, a blind date would not be a good blind date, but if you were dating like someone you kinda knew, I don't know, from the coffee shop, I could see that, but a blind date?

• 1:17:46Speaker 08

  You don't want to go straight from the app to the frog survey.

• 1:17:49Steven Rinella?

  I know, because you'd be like, no, no, no, no, here's what happens, man, we're gonna go way out in that swamp.

• 1:17:54Speaker 04

  Yeah, I guess that's a good point.

• 1:17:57Speaker 08

  And close your eyes and listen.

• 1:18:00Speaker 06

  Eventually, this would become a euphemism.

• 1:18:02Steven Rinella?

  It's just no one's gonna go.

• 1:18:04Speaker 06

  We're gonna go survey frogs tonight.

• 1:18:06Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah, if my like, boy said he was going out to survey frogs, I'd be like, no, you're not.

• 1:18:12Speaker 04

  That's like the hillbilly version of Netflix and chill.

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• 1:20:35Speaker 06

  Now, there are 16 different frogs and toads you'll be listening for if you're in Iowa. To learn how to identify these calls, you attend a virtual or in-person workshop. Every workshop is currently full besides the last one that takes place on April 13th in Okoboji. Now, why this is relevant- How many species? 16. Wow, I would not have guessed that. 16. I would have said half as many. Why it's relevant, a recent USGS study predicts that in 20 years amphibians will be gone from half of the places where they currently live. So, this is a cool opportunity to do some citizen science, help Iowa gather data on amphibians, which are really sensitive to habitat loss, invasive species, pollution. But I want to test you guys now. I want to see how well you can do without any training at all. I'm just telling you. Hit me with the bullfrog.

• 1:21:21Speaker 06

  I'm going to play around three of the most common frog and toad calls, not only in Iowa, but in North America. You guys are going to guess what they are. So Phil, play the first one for us.

• 1:21:34Speaker 08

  That's a frog.

• 1:21:35Speaker 06

  Got it.

• 1:21:38Speaker 06

  Spring peeper? Steve, if you know- Spring peeper. I'll tell you, there's a spring peeper in the background, but that's not the forward call that you're playing. That's what I was talking about.

• 1:21:48Speaker 06

  There he is. There are spring peepers, like I said, that's not the forward. I don't know that guy. A green frog. Yeah, I was going to guess green. No, green frog sounds like a banjo. No. Tree frog. No. Is it a toad? It is. It's an American toad. Got it. That was an American toad. Good job, Rich. Here's how their call is described. High pitched trill that lasts about 15 seconds, sounds like a sharp elongated cry. Pull the picture of the damn frog, Phil. Sometimes described as sounding like the bleat of a sheep. Now, we're going to play it again and you can watch it make the call this time. So you can see the American toad. Crit. Spencer's on it. Oh.

• 1:22:27Speaker 07

  I remember those things.

• 1:22:28Steven Rinella?

  I think I've stepped on those in my mom and dad's staircase.

• 1:22:29Speaker 07

  Come out of the woodwork in the spring when it would rain.

• 1:22:32Speaker 08

  His throat looks like the nut jerky that that guy makes.

• 1:22:35Steven Rinella?

  It does. It looks a lot like that.

• 1:22:38Speaker 06

  So that is the American toad.

• 1:22:40Speaker 05

  Man, that's one of those animals, like when you hear the sound and you see the animal, you don't put the two together.

• 1:22:45Speaker 06

  No.

• 1:22:46Speaker 08

  Not at all.

• 1:22:46Steven Rinella?

  Uh, let's go on to number two.

• 1:22:47Speaker 06

  Number two, play it, Phil.

• 1:22:50Steven Rinella?

  Ah, my old buddy.

• 1:22:52Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 1:22:53Speaker 05

  Might eat him.

• 1:22:54Speaker 07

  Yeah, you could find some good gigging spots taking this project too.

• 1:22:58Speaker 06

  Yeah, that, that is a, an American bullfrog.

• 1:23:03Speaker 06

  The, their call is described as a deep and loud call, a sequence that sounds like it's saying, juggle rum, juggle rum.

• 1:23:10Steven Rinella?

  Cause you didn't get him really kicking ass on that little clip you had.

• 1:23:13Speaker 06

  It resembles the moo of cattle, which is why they're called bullfrogs. Show us the clip again, Phil.

• 1:23:19Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah. Old Mr. Yellow Throat, the man with the yellow throat.

• 1:23:29Speaker 08

  They're cool.

• 1:23:30Speaker 07

  I used to catch those things with a fly.

• 1:23:32Steven Rinella?

  Yep. That's a, that's a low yield animal right there, man.

• 1:23:37Speaker 06

  Juggle rum. Alright, you guys got one out of two. Let's see how you do on number three.

• 1:23:40Steven Rinella?

  I think I'm about done, unfortunately. Play it on me.

• 1:23:51Speaker 08

  Is that another toad?

• 1:23:52Speaker 06

  Green frog. Not a green frog.

• 1:23:54Speaker 07

  Tree frog.

• 1:23:55Speaker 06

  No.

• 1:23:56Speaker 08

  Is that a toad?

• 1:23:56Speaker 06

  It is a leopard frog.

• 1:23:59Speaker 06

  Specifically.

• 1:24:00Speaker 08

  Dude, I just threw the house's name in frog.

• 1:24:02Speaker 06

  Mark said it earlier.

• 1:24:05Speaker 06

  Uh, specifically, that's a northern leopard frog. Their call is described as a deep rattling snore that lasts two to three seconds, followed by a chuckling sound like a heavy creaking door slowly opening, opening. Uh, also sounds like two balloons being rubbed together.

• 1:24:22Steven Rinella?

  Dude, that's great.

• 1:24:23Speaker 06

  Play it again, Phil. Play it again, Phil.

• 1:24:26Speaker 08

  Man, I should have got these right because my son, oh, sorry.

• 1:24:37Speaker 06

  Damn Mark, we're watching leopards. Yeah, I was gonna say, you can talk now. I think we got it.

• 1:24:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, come on Spencer, ease up. My son's preschool had a frog night where they would take you out and we would review the sounds of all the frogs and then peruse this nature reserve that the school was on and try to identify and find the frogs by sound.

• 1:24:55Speaker 06

  And cook them up?

• 1:24:56Speaker 04

  We didn't do that part.

• 1:24:57Speaker 06

  Uh, for more information, go to iowadnr.gov or just Google the Iowa Frog and Toad Survey. Hit me with the counties again where they need your help. Uh, Ida, Henry and Wright. Ida, Henry and Wright. Okay, grab your gigs. This, this story, uh, is extra close to home for me because I own a frog. Um, and I, in an attempt to sex it, I played vocalizations in my house to see if it would call back because for frogs and toads, the vast, vast majority of calling that you hear is done by males. Females usually don't participate. Uh, and so I have sexed my frog as a female because it's never participated in my calling sequences. Didn't you end up with that thing like by mistake?

• 1:25:38Speaker 06

  Yes, my wife, this was two Februaries ago, February 2024, bought a rubber tree at Lowe's that she brought home. She was replanting it in our garage and out of the roots came this frog that was like, I'm not kidding you, this big at the time. And so she called me panicked. I think I was at the office here and she said, what do I do? I'm like, well, I could, I could take care of it, um, or we could keep it. Oh, yeah. And, and she elected to keep it and I've been a very good frog dad ever since. I could take care of it or I could take care of it.

• 1:26:09Speaker 06

  Have you figured out if it's an illegal species to have? No, it, it is, uh, it is a Pacific chorus frog. Here's, here is how I've determined that this frog came into our possession with no evidence at all. Uh, it's a Pacific chorus frog, also known as a Pacific tree frog. Their range stretches from like South Alaska to Northern California, but sort of the core of it, even a little bit, a little bit in very Northwest Montana. Uh, the core of their range is Oregon. Oregon is the number one producer of Christmas trees in the country. Lowe's sells a lot of Christmas trees. I think this frog came in on a Christmas tree, bailed from that Christmas tree, crawled into the rubber tree that my wife bought two months later and that's how it got to our house. Man, if we could get that son of a bitch on the podcast, that'd be the best thing

• 1:26:54Speaker 06

  in the world, man. It's a happy little frog. Phil's got a video of it. Uh, this is my, my Pacific chorus frog that lives in my living room now. Oh, we can hear another podcast.

• 1:27:04Speaker 07

  You're listening to something else.

• 1:27:06Speaker 06

  Uh, name is Sprout. It's a, it's a female.

• 1:27:09Speaker 07

  Back in the old days, I'd use it to try to catch a largemouth.

• 1:27:12Speaker 05

  Yeah, great segment. Yanni Seal Fingers, very quickly. Unbelievably good segment there. It was fun.

• 1:27:20Speaker 08

  This is the second episode in a row where the segment after me has received high praise.

• 1:27:27Speaker 06

  It's not us, it's you.

• 1:27:29Speaker 08

  I just want to point that out, yeah.

• 1:27:31Speaker 05

  That's a good point.

• 1:27:31Speaker 08

  Once it goes around the horn and everybody's gotten praise, except for me, that's when I'll take it to heart.

• 1:27:36Speaker 05

  Um, I'm reporting on a thing called Seal Finger. The state of Alaska section of epidemiology defines it as a finger infection associated with bites, cuts, or scratches contaminated by the mouths, blood, or blubber of certain marine mammals. The reason we're talking about it is because last fall, a young man that was skinning an Alaska brown bear contracted it.

• 1:28:05Speaker 05

  Um, not something new. It's been around for a long time, but I think it's been, uh, misdiagnosed. They didn't know a lot about it until just over like the last, uh, 10 to 15 years. Um, back in the day, seal hunters, coastal fishermen, everybody was extremely scared of it because the, uh, the way to get rid of Seal Finger? Really? Yeah. Like it's coming for you. It's coming for you. Like you're just gonna end up, like it's gonna be stiff and plump for a while and eventually they're gonna say, cut it off. It's gonna spread. It's like gangrene. Man, that does not look good. Yeah. Oh, that's right. Here we go. We got some pictures of it.

• 1:28:43Speaker 07

  You know what I keep thinking about is when we were at your shack last year and Heather brought them.

• 1:28:48Speaker 05

  Yep.

• 1:28:49Speaker 07

  Like, man, handling those.

• 1:28:50Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah. Yeah. Um, it's problematic because it's, it, when you first get it, it just, th- th- this is, I think, these are case, the pictures are showing cases that have gone on for a while and become a, a more extreme versions of the symptoms. Because in the beginning, it's gonna be a scratch that has some inflammation, basically, right? Or a cut with some inflammation. And so you go to the doctor and they're like, okay, here's some antibiotics, topical or whatever. Everything that I read about people that got messed up about it was just this, that they would leave and then 10 days later be like, oh my God. Yep. The, the young man that got it from the bear, he actually came back.

• 1:29:32Speaker 05

  Can't remember if it was two weeks or he had a bunch of trips to the hospital, but at one point has like a fever and like a increased heart rate from it. Um, it can basically get into your bones and start like, like making like this like very rapid arthritis uh come about. Um, so the uh, the antibiotic that does antibiotic that does do it is uh doxycycline. Um, so the most common people that actually get it now are people that like scuba divers, people that work in zoos that mess with marine animals that could get bitten or whatever. And if that happens, say at a zoo, I forget what zoo it was, but they basically said, if you get bit there,

• 1:30:13Speaker 05

  you get handed a letter. So when you go to the hospital, they know how to deal with it and be like, don't give them the regular antibiotics because they ain't gonna do nothing. Like you need to make sure you're giving these antibiotics.

• 1:30:25Steven Rinella?

  You ever see that thing I got in my wallet?

• 1:30:28Speaker 07

  I got a question for you, Yanis, after Steve asks this important question.

• 1:30:32Speaker 05

  It's like a magic trick or what?

• 1:30:34Steven Rinella?

  No, man. It's like this card.

• 1:30:36Speaker 05

  Oh.

• 1:30:36Steven Rinella?

  You keep it in your wallet by your ID. They gave it to me at a, at, at, they gave it to me at the uh, at Cornell. And it says like, hey, heads up, man. This guy's into all kinds of weird stuff.

• 1:30:47Speaker 05

  Oh.

• 1:30:47Speaker 04

  You're like a high risk individual?

• 1:30:49Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, man.

• 1:30:50Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:30:51Steven Rinella?

  It's like if you, if you fiddle around hunting and stuff all the time or whatever, or doing like what you're talking about, it says, take note. Check him for all the weird stuff.

• 1:31:00Speaker 05

  Well, you probably have.

• 1:31:01Steven Rinella?

  They gave that to you.

• 1:31:02Speaker 04

  How do we get our hands on those?

• 1:31:03Speaker 05

  You probably have instances where had you had this card previously, it would have helped, right?

• 1:31:08Steven Rinella?

  I've had to go in and tell a guy I had a thing and he had never heard of it and he wrote it down and left the room for a while.

• 1:31:13Speaker 05

  Whoa.

• 1:31:14Speaker 07

  Yanis.

• 1:31:15Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:31:15Speaker 07

  The bear, do they think that it's always been in bears or bears pick it up for meat and rotten seals?

• 1:31:22Speaker 05

  The ladder.

• 1:31:22Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:31:23Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 1:31:23Speaker 05

  Coastal brown.

• 1:31:24Steven Rinella?

  From a.

• 1:31:25Speaker 05

  Coastal brown bears scavenging, you know. Uh, hard to say exactly.

• 1:31:30Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:31:31Speaker 05

  The, the hunter did say that his knife had come in contact with the bear's mouth and teeth prior to him getting uh, the cut. But again, I mean, he skinned the entire animal. So it's hard to say exactly where, what, how.

• 1:31:44Steven Rinella?

  What's interesting about these kind of these, this ailment and things like tick-borne infections is the delay, the delay. Right? It's long enough where I bet oftentimes people will not put it together.

• 1:31:59Speaker 05

  No, I don't think there's a delay. You said, he says it could be 10 days. Well, I, I think that you're getting symptoms immediately.

• 1:32:06Steven Rinella?

  Oh, you do?

• 1:32:06Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure. Like, you're getting this pain and the swelling, but yeah. But it, it's gonna start doing worse things as it goes.

• 1:32:14Speaker 07

  Yeah, but it could probably be mistaken for just like, oh, it's just a little scratch that.

• 1:32:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly, exactly. And then it gets problematic because it's been, it's been misdiagnosed with the wrong antibiotics been given to it. Now, uh, I called Heather Deville, who lives in a marine environment, uh, talks to a lot of people that, you know, mess around with these, uh, animals. She herself, I think, last year killed like 125 sea otters. Uh, she has not, like, doesn't know anybody, has no first or secondhand experience. And when she went around and asked a few people about it, they were like, never heard of it.

• 1:32:51Steven Rinella?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:32:52Speaker 05

  So it doesn't sound like it's very common.

• 1:32:54Steven Rinella?

  That's why, that's why you come here to get the relevant news.

• 1:32:58Speaker 05

  Yeah. Um, you know, State of Alaska recommends wearing, uh, nitro gloves and maybe even cut proof gloves. If you're gonna be, you know, dealing with, you know, seals, sea lions, uh, otters, that sort of thing. But, um, yeah, cause like you said, you'd mess around with a bunch of crazy stuff. There's chances that you, you could end up with some crazy thing.

• 1:33:21Speaker 07

  Speaking of.

• 1:33:22Speaker 05

  It's not common. Great job, Yanni.

• 1:33:25Speaker 07

  Speaking of messing with stuff, are you okay if I read this to the, to the?

• 1:33:29Steven Rinella?

  Notes, we're low on time.

• 1:33:31Speaker 06

  Did you get it before or after COVID, that card?

• 1:33:34Steven Rinella?

  After or before, I don't know.

• 1:33:36Speaker 08

  I think it'd be better if it was a punch card, like at a coffee shop. So when you get all that weird shit, they just.

• 1:33:41Speaker 05

  That's pretty good.

• 1:33:43Steven Rinella?

  Okay, uh, I was gonna do a big report on a record-setting cat prices, but in the interest of time, I'm not going to. However, if you happen to be catching yourself near, uh, you know, messing around on YouTube, I invite you to go watch our video called, uh, Steve and Seth Get Rich Off Bobcats. In there, we go do a, a bobcat sale. At that sale, we cover what we got for some cats and what my buddy Mercer got from some cats. What we didn't mention in there is that the top cat at that auction went for $2,800. Then the next auction a week later, in Idaho, a cat went for, drumroll please.

• 1:34:21Speaker 08

  Oh, I wasn't ready for this.

• 1:34:23Steven Rinella?

  Thirty-five. Play that toad noise again. Thirty-five hundred bucks. On to Mark Kenyon.

• 1:34:29Speaker 04

  All right. I've got two pieces of news in the interest of time. I'll try to keep it pretty brief. Uh, but a little bit of, uh, controversy in the internet related to some comments from our Secretary of the Interior, Doug Burgum, uh, at a BlackRock summit.

• 1:34:44Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:34:45Speaker 04

  About infrastructure. Uh, he answered a question and, and insinuated in this, uh, response that those who are concerned about protecting our public lands and, and worried about resource extraction on them, that they are not financially literate.

• 1:35:00Steven Rinella?

  Oh, that's the problem.

• 1:35:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:35:01Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:35:02Speaker 04

  So.

• 1:35:02Steven Rinella?

  If I just read up more on economics, I would, uh, I would be much happier to see us run out of wild places and clean water. It's just that I'm dumb about the money.

• 1:35:11Speaker 04

  Exactly. That, that's, that's why folks have been, uh, been a little bit, uh, unhappy about that one. But I think it's great that he brought this up because it gives us a very, very good excuse to talk about the incredible financial implications of outdoor recreation and conservation of our public lands. A report just came out last week that showed that the outdoor recreation economy is now driving a record 1.3 trillion dollars of economic impact. 1.3 trillion dollars of economic impact. Much of that obviously depends on federal public lands.

• 1:35:48Steven Rinella?

  Did you see me get uncomfortable for a minute?

• 1:35:49Speaker 04

  I did, but.

• 1:35:50Steven Rinella?

  Let me know when you're ready.

• 1:35:50Speaker 04

  Hear me out.

• 1:35:51Steven Rinella?

  Let me know when you want to know why.

• 1:35:52Speaker 04

  Yep, hear me out. Uh, take it back to last fall. Another study came out that looked at what they can tie directly to federal public lands. And that was 128 billion dollars a year directly tied to outdoor recreation on federal public lands alone. That's 315 million dollars of economic impact a day.

• 1:36:16Speaker 04

  From the ripple effects, the trickle out effect of outdoor recreation of all types.

• 1:36:20Speaker 05

  What is that per acre?

• 1:36:21Speaker 04

  That's a great question. I'm not good at that in math. So if you look at that compared to the other research, the other ways that we make money or that there's economic impact from our public lands. It's interesting. Obviously, resource extraction on our multiple use public lands is important. There's strong value there like the secretary was speaking about. But if you look at the GDP contribution of outdoor recreation, 2.4% of the entire US GDP tied to outdoor recreation. That is more than double gas and oil. That's more than mining. Mining's contribution is 1.5%. Oil and gas, a 0.9% contribution to the entire GDP of the United States. So very, very high.

• 1:37:06Speaker 05

  But if we drilled more on those public lands, we can make that number go up.

• 1:37:10Steven Rinella?

  That's why, that's why.

• 1:37:13Steven Rinella?

  That's why I don't like, I, I appreciate what you're saying, but if someone came to me and said, "Hey, I did some math, your kids are actually costing you money." Well, I would be like, "Well, get them sons of bitches out of here." It's like some things are bigger than that. So I understand when people do it, but if you came to me and said, "Oh, you know, we ran the numbers, public lands, clean air, clean water, all that stuff is costly." I'd be like, "Cool. I don't care."

• 1:37:40Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:37:40Steven Rinella?

  So it's like, I get it, but I also, you know what I mean? I don't, I don't want to like engage. I don't, I don't necessarily feel like engaging in the financial conversation of it because if someone proved the opposite, it wouldn't change my opinion. So I feel like it's disingenuous to act like that's why I'm interested in wilderness.

• 1:37:58Speaker 04

  Well, I think the key is that you bring that is just one part of the conversation. Like, hey, here's this. And then there's also, what about the ecosystem services of those landscapes? Like what they are providing? That, I should have found this, but there is some data. They've been trying to actually quantify. What the economic value is that clean air provides like if we had to filter the air the equivalent that our trees do or if we had to clean water instead of you know the the forest filtering through that or whatever it might be um what would that cost us to replace that with technology?

• 1:38:29Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:38:29Speaker 04

  It's it's insane.

• 1:38:30Speaker 05

  And it has to be a part of the rebuttal to someone saying.

• 1:38:34Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:38:34Speaker 05

  You're financially.

• 1:38:35Speaker 07

  Yeah, it has to be that because those people aren't interested in the social value of those lands.

• 1:38:41Steven Rinella?

  I understand. I understand. I understand. I'm just sharing privately here.

• 1:38:45Speaker 04

  I'm with you. I'm 100% I'm 100% with you.

• 1:38:48Steven Rinella?

  I'm private I'm sharing privately why that makes me nervous.

• 1:38:52Speaker 04

  So I hate to do this to you, but we got to talk money one more time.

• 1:38:54Steven Rinella?

  Please.

• 1:38:55Speaker 04

  Uh, this is a little bit of and you could look at this as bad news like some of the other things we talked about or good depends on I guess if you're a glass half full or half empty guy um but there is a situation a a threat slash opportunity in central North Carolina that is worth getting on people's radar. There is a reservoir on the Yadkin River. It's called the Tucker Town Reservoir and on either side of that reservoir there has historically been a bunch of public land oh lands open to the public to hunt and fish. These have been privately owned lands by Elkoa and they leased that to the North Carolina Fish and Wildlife Service to keep that open to the public. Recently, they've decided they can no longer do that.

• 1:39:39Speaker 04

  They are selling these lands, putting them on the open market and going to be putting them up for sale. So right now that's 4,000 acres of historically open to the public hunting and fishing land that could potentially be sold off and be taken out of public access.

• 1:39:54Steven Rinella?

  That's the half empty part.

• 1:39:55Speaker 04

  That's the half empty part. The half full part is that there has been a really strong push by local land trust and a number of other partners now looking to try to build a campaign of interest, not just in North Carolina, but across the country to buy these lands and then donate them to the state to be public land officially and in perpetuity. And so starting to get some interest and some steam, you can go to trlt.org or just just Google Save Tucker Town. Tucker Town is the campaign kind of name around this. It's very interesting. I think it's a great opportunity here for the public to jump in and make a difference here. And I can tease for you that we, Meat Eater,

• 1:40:39Speaker 04

  and our partners Onyx are brainstorming and spitballing and working on a way to help out as well. So, so stay tuned on that front. But I'm looking at this as a glass half full because I think we can make a difference.

• 1:40:53Speaker 07

  I bet you there's a few turkeys.

• 1:40:55Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:40:55Steven Rinella?

  There's deer, there's turkeys, there's bass. God, I hope there's no church right there. I mean, not real close.

• 1:41:02Speaker 08

  I've talked to these, I've talked to the Three Rivers Land Trust before and it's just, it sounds like a really great group. And they have a huge hunting program, like a hunting access program through private landowners. And so, yeah, like, I'm glad that we're getting behind it because I know that they, they follow our stuff and, and they're working for hunters and anglers.

• 1:41:22Speaker 04

  Yep. So it's a good one. We'll have more on that on our front here soon. But in the meantime, check it out, donate, it's a good cause.

• 1:41:28Steven Rinella?

  Ladies and gentlemen, Mark Kenyon.

• 1:41:32Speaker 07

  Thanks for coming by, Mark.

• 1:41:34Steven Rinella?

  Hell of a segment.

• 1:41:35Speaker 07

  Sorry, Randall.

• 1:41:37Steven Rinella?

  I mean. You know, I like that segment.

• 1:41:41Speaker 04

  I've lost my fastball.

• 1:41:42Steven Rinella?

  Guys, fast, thorough.

• 1:41:46Steven Rinella?

  Wonderful segment.

• 1:41:47Speaker 07

  You got any tips for Randall before we go?

• 1:41:49Steven Rinella?

  Go later in the show. I think.

• 1:41:54Steven Rinella?

  A little more polished, too, I think. I think it might be a sequencing thing.

• 1:41:58Speaker 07

  Did you like Yanni's?

• 1:42:00Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, great job.

• 1:42:03Steven Rinella?

  And the fur band, too?

• 1:42:07Steven Rinella?

  I could have seen, I could have used a little more passion.

• 1:42:10Speaker 07

  Well, I got delayed so long that I lost my passion.

• 1:42:15Steven Rinella?

  Little table beating.

• 1:42:16Speaker 04

  Well, I took notes, I took notes on everybody else, so maybe next, maybe next week.

• 1:42:21Steven Rinella?

  Randall has notes, they're like, passion.

• 1:42:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:42:24Steven Rinella?

  Table beating, go later.

• 1:42:27Steven Rinella?

  I mean, I can't argue with any of that.

• 1:42:29Speaker 06

  Shake your fist.

• 1:42:30Steven Rinella?

  Let's don't change anything. Just try going later once and see if you get.

• 1:42:34Speaker 08

  Yeah, we just tune the variables to figure out what the special sauce is.

• 1:42:38Steven Rinella?

  Cause if you go later and no one says anything, they're like, it wasn't that.

• 1:42:43Speaker 08

  I just can't wait for the angry DMs on Instagram this week. Tell me to just disappear.

• 1:42:48Speaker 06

  And I'll make sure you're the.

• 1:42:49Steven Rinella?

  You know, it could be good too. Were you, were you more assigned these or did you more bring? He didn't pick his passion topic like I did. Randall hasn't jumped in with like, I want that one. See Spencer over here.

• 1:43:01Speaker 05

  You seem to come up with your own news.

• 1:43:03Speaker 08

  I've been distracted.

• 1:43:04Speaker 06

  I'm, I'm doing the herpetology department over here.

• 1:43:07Speaker 08

  That's your beat. Yeah, Spencer's kinda like.

• 1:43:09Steven Rinella?

  He's bringing his own news.

• 1:43:10Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:43:11Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. I'm not reporting on stuff I didn't. I'm, I'm reporting on my own news.

• 1:43:15Speaker 08

  Maybe I'll do that.

• 1:43:16Steven Rinella?

  Stuff that catches my eye. Or we just keep giving Randall duds that you don't like.

• 1:43:21Speaker 08

  I thought Neanderthals was gonna be great. I thought that would kill, you know?

• 1:43:25Speaker 05

  I mean, especially when you had an AI image of yourself as a Neanderthal.

• 1:43:29Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Cause if you, I know, but it was too quick. I wasn't paying attention. If it was later when I started waking up, I'd have been like, that's a hell of a segment, Randall.

• 1:43:36Speaker 08

  I need to aim for like the 11:45, 12:30 taping. Yeah, we'll take Steve's blood levels and measure the, the peaks and valleys. It'd be good.

• 1:43:44Speaker 05

  All right. Another reminder, check out Kimmy's book. I was just flipping through it. There's, there's a lot of, uh, also venison and, and red meat recipes in here. It's not only seafood. Um, not that you said it was.

• 1:43:57Steven Rinella?

  I know, but yeah, I was, yeah. Okay. Good job.

• 1:43:59Speaker 05

  But there's a lot, a lot of good stuff in here. I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna get one.

• 1:44:06Steven Rinella?

  Getting greedy. Yeah. Once again, let me, let me see that book. Let's just finish big. Let's finish big on Kimmy's book. Once again, Kimmy's Kitchen. An Ocean Woman's Guide to Wild Home Cooking by, uh, Kimmy Werner. Kimmy's Kitchen Cookbook. Check her out. Check her out.

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