I’m Having An Affair With My Friend’s Wife

On today’s episode, we hear about: · A man having an affair with his friend’s wife · A mother seeking advice on how to stop her in-laws from parenting her child · A woman wondering what she can do differently so her boyfriend feels respected Next Steps: 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test 📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards 💭 John's Free Guided Meditation 🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: 🌱 Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. 🔴 Get 15% off with code DELONY at BON CHARGE. 🌿 Get up to 40% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth. 🔒 Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. 😇 Go to Hallow for a 90-day free trial. 💤 Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! 🥤 Get 20% off with code DELONY at Organifi. 💪 Get 25% off your order at Thorne. 🏋️ Go to Trainwell to get started! Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 The EntreLeadership Podcast Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05Speaker 00

  His wife kind of made a pass at me and we have been in an affair now for the last eight months or so.

• 0:14Dr. John Delony?

  You're not calling me to ask like, "Oh God, I've blown up my life and my wife's life." It's not why you're calling. You're calling to ask, "Is this true love or not?" What's going on? What's going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. Hope you have a lot of joy in your life today. May not be the best day of your life. You may not be super happy, but I hope that you're where you need to be, doing the things you need to be doing to help create the life that you want to be living. Man, on this show, I sit with hurting people, trying to figure out what's the next right move in these crazy lives we're trying to live in these crazy times.

• 0:56Dr. John Delony?

  And I know when this show will come out, hopefully things will dramatically have improved. But man, we are a week into just the caustic, caustic wildfires going on with our friends and family in Los Angeles and the surrounding areas. And so just know that if you're listening to the show right now, it was shot a month earlier. And but we are actively thinking about and praying about and involved in supporting our friends and loved ones. So, whoo, everybody listening from out there, thank y'all for joining us and please don't be shy about asking for the help and care that you need and give your neighbors and friends a chance to step up. If you want to be on the show, give me a buzz at 1-844-693-3291 or go to johndeloney.com/ask

• 1:40Dr. John Delony?

  A-S-K. Let's go right down the street here in Nashville, Tennessee and talk to Will. What's up, Will? How we doing, man?

• 1:48Speaker 00

  Hey, John, how's it going?

• 1:50Dr. John Delony?

  I'm doing all right, brother. What's up?

• 1:52Speaker 00

  Hey, so I've got a quick question for you here. I kind of got myself in a little bit of predicament and so I'll just get right into it. My wife and I, we've been married for about five years and in that timeframe, I was able to reconnect with a friend of mine that I had made, a male friend of mine that I had made after high school and whatnot. Started to kind of hang out with him and... Found out kind of through hanging out with him that his uh, his wife kind of made a pass at me and we have been in an affair now for the last probably eight months or so. Um, we've

• 2:37Speaker 00

  obviously talked about uh, just about everything under the sun and I guess I'm trying to figure out, um, you know, if I, am I interested in this person? Um, or is it just the thrill of having an affair and, and doing something obviously that, you know, you're not supposed to do. Um, and so I'm trying to, trying to figure out how to figure that out. Um, because uh, you know, I, I just wanna a little bit of advice on trying to how to progress forward with that.

• 3:16Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, man. Um, so let me just walk it back and you can just tell me up or down. So, you are sleeping with a great friend's wife?

• 3:33Speaker 00

  Correct.

• 3:34Dr. John Delony?

  Does your friend know?

• 3:36Speaker 00

  He does not.

• 3:37Dr. John Delony?

  Does your wife know?

• 3:38Speaker 00

  She does not.

• 3:40Dr. John Delony?

  And so you're not calling me to ask like, oh God, I've blown up my life and my wife's life and I've blown up one of my close buddy's lives. It's not why you're calling. You're calling to ask, is this true love or not?

• 3:53Speaker 00

  I, I'm calling to ask because uh, you know, in the time that I've chatted with this person, you know, we've obviously, we've, we've talked a lot more about the, the, just the, the physical nature of, of things and you know, there's been times where we've both had the idea that, you know, our lives potentially could be better with that other person, but obviously that's not something that I.

• 4:22Speaker 00

  You know, want to, I don't want to jump into something, or I don't want it to technically pursue something and then turns out it was just because of the thrill of an affair. I mean, my, my wife and I, we've had our struggles and our issues pre the involvement of the affair, or my friend almost called it off a few different times without that being a factor. Um, so I think it was just kind of came across at the timing that I was the most vulnerable to accept it. Um, but yeah.

• 4:59Dr. John Delony?

  So.

• 5:05Dr. John Delony?

  So I guess the best thing I could tell you, or the right thing I could tell you is you are so, um, what, what, it's like you're watching, um, The Lion King. You're watching like, you're watching like a Disney movie in the theater. And you're watching these animals all talking to each other?

• 5:27Dr. John Delony?

  And you're wondering what it would be like to talk to one of those animals too?

• 5:33Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 5:33Dr. John Delony?

  Like, you, you're.

• 5:37Dr. John Delony?

  Your questions are so divorced from the reality with which you actually find yourself that it tells me that you've had to construct a world where this is okay and there's a world that everything's going to be okay on the other end of this because if you didn't have that kind of psychological, uh, moat around what you're actually doing, you would implode because you've become somebody that you could never have imagined you would be.

• 6:03Dr. John Delony?

  You're sleeping with a.

• 6:04Speaker 00

  That makes sense.

• 6:05Dr. John Delony?

  You're sleeping with one of your closest friend's wives, period.

• 6:10Speaker 00

  Right.

• 6:11Dr. John Delony?

  You're actively for over a year, having sex with somebody that's not your wife, putting her at physical danger, putting her at grave emotional danger. I mean, like, and what you're thinking about is, man, isn't this going to be wonderful on the other side of this thing? It's kind of like watching, it, it's like, it's like you're in Los Angeles right now, watching your house burn down and wondering where you're going to put the new kitchen during the rebuild.

• 6:37Dr. John Delony?

  Like you're not absorbing reality. And so, number one, no place in this conversation are we talking about how are these feelings real or not? Not until we've looked your wife in the eye and said, I've blown our marriage up and I don't want to be with you anymore. Not until you've looked your buddy in the eye and said, I've been sleeping with your wife for a year and I'm sorry. And after the ash settles back to earth, after that conversation, those conversations, then you can ask yourself, okay, are we, are we in a relationship? Are we going to try to build this thing and make it go and move forward together?

• 7:20Dr. John Delony?

  Which the percentages on that, just the scientifically, the percentages of those relationships being successful are very, very, very low.

• 7:29Speaker 00

  Right.

• 7:31Dr. John Delony?

  Cause then the old bumper sticker like is true, somewhere somebody else is tired of her too. And you also, right? Like y'all get, y'all just living in a fantasy world. We don't have to deal with reality. You just get to have these romantic, oh my gosh, conversations and you get me in passion. And we get to have sex and there's nothing anchored to it in reality, like dishes and bills and hey, we're trying to build a life together. And I want to do this, but I want to do this. Y'all, y'all have to, y'all are skipping all of that. So until you anchor back into earth,

• 8:04Dr. John Delony?

  any conversations y'all have are just fantasy. They're just Disney movies. They're not real.

• 8:10Dr. John Delony?

  Why, why haven't you sat down and had that conversation with your wife yet?

• 8:14Speaker 00

  Um, so we've been obviously dealing, like I had previously stated, we had been dealing with, um, our own obviously struggles.

• 8:24Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, but you took, you took struggle every marriage has to, I've had nightmare struggles. You went, you went the next step.

• 8:29Speaker 00

  Right. So, uh, I haven't sat down and talked with her about it because, um, I guess I'm kind of put it in my mind that if this marriage that I have with my wife were to potentially fail, that I didn't want this reasoning of what's going on be-

• 8:55Dr. John Delony?

  Bro, you have failed it.

• 8:58Dr. John Delony?

  Like you're the failure. You get what I'm saying?

• 9:01Speaker 00

  Right.

• 9:01Dr. John Delony?

  And I'm sure she's got her own challenges. I'm not saying she's perfect, but

• 9:05Speaker 00

  Right.

• 9:05Dr. John Delony?

  Like you're actively sleeping with your buddy's wife and like, well, if this thing doesn't work right, it's like you're the one that's not working right in it. You get what I'm saying?

• 9:13Speaker 00

  Right. No, I'm, I'm aware of that part. What I'm saying is that like, obviously,

• 9:20Speaker 00

  our marriage, pre this had obviously its problems. We're trying, we were trying to, you know, work on those things. And I obviously made the mistake initially and, you know, her and I, we haven't engaged in anything in a while because obviously I'm taking a step back, but it's also one of those that it's at the point where I feel like in order to build with my wife, if that's what her and I choose to do, then I need to obviously be upfront and honest with her about everything that has happened. And if I do that, then

• 9:56Dr. John Delony?

  Bro, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen. You're, and I like, I'm really close to compassionate for you right now. I'm frustrated with you. I'm angry with you, but I'm also compassionate because I think you have created a delusion that you live in.

• 10:16Speaker 00

  I wouldn't disagree with that.

• 10:17Dr. John Delony?

  You use these huge circular, well, you know, and then we might. Listen to me so carefully.

• 10:27Dr. John Delony?

  You're having sex with another man's wife and you're getting, going home and you're laying in your bed next to yours.

• 10:36Dr. John Delony?

  You're having sex with your buddy's wife.

• 10:40Dr. John Delony?

  And then y'all go have dinner together as a foursome.

• 10:45Dr. John Delony?

  That is where everything has to start.

• 10:50Dr. John Delony?

  You can't be sleeping with somebody else's wife and trying to see if your marriage is gonna make it. That's madness, Will. Madness. And you can't be hanging out with your buddy while you're banging his wife and be like, well, I'm trying to figure out if our feelings are right or wrong or what? What are you doing, man? You get what I'm saying?

• 11:16Speaker 00

  No, I get what you're saying. I think-

• 11:18Dr. John Delony?

  So like today, today needs to be the day, today needs to be the day that you tell your wife, "We gotta talk. I've been having an eight-month affair with our mutual friends. And I've blown our marriage to smithereens. Yes, we had problems. Yes, there were holes in the boat, and I detonated it." And you, being a grown man, need to say, "I've already got me an apartment. I've already got me a friend's couch to crash on, because I know I've blown your world up, and I don't want you to have to move to." And maybe she comes back and says, "Well, I should probably tell you I've been sleeping with somebody else, too." Maybe. Right? Maybe. Who knows? Is she having an affair, too?

• 11:56Speaker 00

  I would doubt it.

• 11:57Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 11:59Speaker 00

  Obviously, I don't know, but-

• 12:00Dr. John Delony?

  And then you ask your friend, "I'm gonna meet you in a diner here in Nashville. We gotta talk." Or you tell your, the woman you're having an affair with, "Hey, you got 24 hours, because I gotta come clean with my buddy." I've become somebody that I never dreamed I would be, and I have to stop.

• 12:21Speaker 00

  I think that's, that's where I've been struggling, because it's like I have gotten far down the road, obviously, and I think in my mind, I have this delusion that there is a different path out besides going back.

• 12:37Dr. John Delony?

  There's not a way to land the plane. There is no going back, but your fantasy about how this plane lands is false, too. Both are true. So there's no going back. You blew it up. The boat's gone. You and your wife might choose to go to, to swim to shore amid all the rubble and rebuild a new boat. That happens all the time. And I'll walk with you if that's what y'all wanna do. You and this other person have a sliver, teeny-tiny sliver of statistical probability that you've blown up your life, she's blown up hers, and y'all choose to build a boat together on whatever shore y'all swim to. Maybe. But you'll always wonder if she's sleeping

• 13:20Dr. John Delony?

  with somebody else like she did with you, and vice versa. It's just very shaky ground to build a new thing. But it, it happens.

• 13:30Dr. John Delony?

  But there is no like, then you have a hard conversation with your wife and she's like, "Well, I don't really want to work on this." And you're like, "That's cool. I already have a four-bedroom, three-bath house with somebody else." And her, your buddy, her husband is like, "Ah, well, it didn't work out this time." That's just not how this ends, man.

• 13:47Speaker 00

  Right.

• 13:49Dr. John Delony?

  And so the quicker you can re-anchor to reality,

• 13:55Dr. John Delony?

  and from a place, from the inside out, because dude, you have, you have created a verbal gymnastics studio that you just swirl around and ride the monkey bars in, but your feet never touch the ground. You've got to be able to look yourself in the mirror and say, "Dude, I blew my life up."

• 14:18Dr. John Delony?

  Like, do you feel that?

• 14:22Speaker 00

  I think, obviously-

• 14:24Dr. John Delony?

  Like, I hear no remorse, no like, "Yeah, yeah, well..."

• 14:30Speaker 00

  No, I, I think it's, it's one of those that I'm trying to, you know, obviously I haven't let many people, if anybody, know about this situation, you know, so obviously I've only ever had my opinions weigh on it. And so having, you know, an outside source weigh in on it is obviously beneficial, but it's also making me hear things that I haven't heard, obviously. Things that were, are accurate, but I haven't heard because I'm not telling myself those.

• 15:01Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. You need to.

• 15:05Dr. John Delony?

  After this call-

• 15:06Speaker 00

  Because everyone like, everyone likes to think that obviously there's a, a, a good way to land, you know, every plane in life, obviously. So, you know, I think I have been caught up trying to figure out if it's, or if it's possible to land it versus actually realizing that it's not.

• 15:27Dr. John Delony?

  What you're trying to do is to convince yourself that if this is actually love, or this is actually viable, these feelings and the excitement of sleeping with somebody that's not your wife, which dude, I don't, I don't, I don't begrudge you that one bit. You probably feel alive every time you sneak away. Every time you almost get caught and you don't. It, it does, it won't surprise me at all if you felt dead in your own skin for the last five, six, seven years, however long you've been with her. I get that.

• 15:59Dr. John Delony?

  But you're trying to convince yourself that these feelings are somehow valid in the grand scheme of the cosmos, and that it will justify destroying your wife's life, and destroying the life of your buddy.

• 16:18Dr. John Delony?

  And so, two things: love is not a feeling, it's a choice you make every single day.

• 16:25Dr. John Delony?

  It's a decision. And a marriage is a choice that two people make every single day of their life, man.

• 16:34Dr. John Delony?

  And so, whatever happens with this other person, you all got to choose that every single day.

• 16:40Speaker 00

  Right.

• 16:40Dr. John Delony?

  Except that choice is going to be anchored into Styrofoam, because you know, "Oh, she's capable of blowing this whole thing up at any time, and I am too."

• 16:49Dr. John Delony?

  And she'll know that about you.

• 16:52Dr. John Delony?

  That's why statistically speaking, it's very unlikely that it continues. But again, it's part of this psychological construct you're trying to build.

• 17:02Dr. John Delony?

  Like, your plane is going down, and you're trying to like, figure out the right way to pull the cushions off of the airplane seats, so you'll land comfortably.

• 17:15Dr. John Delony?

  It's not gonna happen. So what I'll tell you is, at the end of this thing, there's a fire. You can do a control burn right now and try, or you can just wait till the whole thing goes up in smoke, but it's gonna catch fire. It's already on fire.

• 17:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think I've just, I spent too much time dancing around and trying to, figuring out how to make the fire as small as possible, when in reality, the focus should be on that the fire is happening regardless.

• 17:48Dr. John Delony?

  And I need you to internalize in your guts, your house has already burned to the ground. Hers too.

• 17:57Dr. John Delony?

  They're gone. They're over.

• 18:03Dr. John Delony?

  The marriage you had is over. The marriage she had is over. The little playtime y'all have together is over.

• 18:14Dr. John Delony?

  Y'all have to decide what we're gonna build next. But, bro, you've gotta come back and re-anchor the ground, man.

• 18:23Dr. John Delony?

  You've blown your life up, and you've blown her life up.

• 18:29Dr. John Delony?

  And she's blown her life up.

• 18:35Dr. John Delony?

  I mean, I don't know a way that you're gonna sleep all night. I don't know a way that you're gonna have peace at all. Do you sit down and have a conversation with your wife? Till you let her know you got 24 hours and I gotta come clean with my buddy? Cause I'm not gonna be this guy anymore.

• 18:53Dr. John Delony?

  And there's a high statistical probability that when the smoke clears, you've got nobody. You've got no friend, you've got no girlfriend, you've got no wife. That's a high, high probability.

• 19:07Dr. John Delony?

  And then you'll have to choose to do the next right thing amid that ash. But, man, stop with the verbal gymnastics. Stop with the, are these feelings real? But start with,

• 19:20Dr. John Delony?

  I've cheated on you. And I blew our life up. Been doing it for almost a year now.

• 19:26Dr. John Delony?

  Through the holidays, through your birthdays, I was seeing somebody else. I was sleeping with our friend.

• 19:35Dr. John Delony?

  Let's start there. We'll be right back.

• 19:40Dr. John Delony?

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• 20:22Dr. John Delony?

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• 21:06Dr. John Delony?

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• 21:23Dr. John Delony?

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• 22:52Dr. John Delony?

  That's J-O-I-N, joindelete.me/deloney.

• 22:59Dr. John Delony?

  Alright, let's go out to Greenville, South Carolina and talk to Ashley. Hey Ashley, what's up?

• 23:05Speaker 02

  Hi, Dr. Jean.

• 23:06Dr. John Delony?

  How's it going?

• 23:07Speaker 02

  It's going good. I'm a huge fan. I found your show a couple of months ago and it's helped me through some things that I didn't even know I needed help through.

• 23:19Dr. John Delony?

  Well, I appreciate you being with us, man. That means the world to me. Thank you. What's up?

• 23:23Speaker 02

  So, my question is basically, how do I set some boundaries with my in-laws and have them respect the grandparent role? Or is this a me problem? And if so, how do I work through it?

• 23:40Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, man.

• 23:43Dr. John Delony?

  I guess my initial question is, like, where's your husband in all this?

• 23:49Speaker 02

  Um, he is on my side.

• 23:53Dr. John Delony?

  He's a coward. I'll say it for you. He's a complete and total coward.

• 23:58Speaker 02

  I think, I think he, he tends to feel like.

• 24:01Dr. John Delony?

  Be a complete internal coward.

• 24:03Speaker 02

  And I don't feel this way either. I don't think that any of, any of their behavior is malicious. Um, and I think that he looks at it in a different light than maybe I do. And I don't know if it's just because, um, maybe his parents just feel like they are able to be way, way, way more involved than, whereas my parents are involved, but they kind of take a step back and let us do our own thing and only give advice or recommendations.

• 24:31Dr. John Delony?

  So if you could, if you, if you could wave a magic wand, what behaviors would you want your in-laws to stop doing?

• 24:39Speaker 02

  Undermining my parental decisions.

• 24:41Dr. John Delony?

  Give me, give me an example.

• 24:43Speaker 02

  Um, for instance, uh, around Christmas time, um, we were trying to lay our one-year-old down for a nap. He was very overstimulated with, you know, just the holidays, the people, the gifts, everything. Um, and just trying to give him a little bit of quiet time away because it was, you know, he, he, it was about nap time. It was time.

• 25:05Dr. John Delony?

  You don't have to justify it. One-year-olds need naps. It's perfect.

• 25:07Speaker 02

  It for, for sure. And, you know, um, went to go get him quiet, walked out of the room to go make him a bottle, turned around to go back in and, uh, my, one of my in-laws, you know, went in and picked him up and said, I didn't want to hear him crying. It's Christmas and, you know, I'll take care of him and brought him right back out and just kind of, you know, undermined us in front of the entire family of no, we're going to take control and we're going to handle this.

• 25:35Dr. John Delony?

  So did you, had you slipped out of the room quietly, like you kind of nodded at your husband, like, I'm gonna go put him down? Or did you make an announcement to everybody? Nap time?

• 25:43Speaker 02

  I did make an announcement. I said, okay, I think it's time for someone to have a little bit of quiet time.

• 25:51Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Um.

• 25:55Speaker 02

  I mean, there've been, there've been countless other situations and, you know, trying to, you know, take control of, well, you know, when he's, when it's time for school, you know, and he has time for him to go to school, he's two now, so we've got a couple of years. Um, but requesting that they are the ones to homeschool him, um, where in my head, no, he needs to go to school and he needs to be around, you know, other kids. And if I do decide to homeschool him, that will be me doing that.

• 26:24Dr. John Delony?

  But why, why wouldn't you and/or your husband, especially your husband, say, no, y'all are not homeschooling the kid. Thank you for the offer, but now we're going to send him to regular school. And just let that be a period at the end of that sentence.

• 26:36Speaker 02

  I, in a way, did, but I probably didn't do it as effectively. Um, I probably left the door a little bit, like, oh, yeah, we'll see. I think.

• 26:46Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I know, but I, I, again, when, when my parents are making statements about what they are quote unquote gonna do or not do, it's my job as their kid, I believe. And I've got some colleagues that disagree with me, that's fine. But I need to tell my mom and my dad, hey, yeah, we're not doing that, with, with, with, with a definitive answer. And if I, if I'm like, if I tell my wife, like, hey, you need to tell my mom that, that's because I'm a coward if I do that.

• 27:16Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, and see, and I think, like, for instance, there have been several times that, you know, I've shut my parents down and said, this is a boundary, you know, do not cross it.

• 27:24Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, because you're an adult.

• 27:25Speaker 02

  I have no problem doing that, but I feel different doing it to his parents.

• 27:30Dr. John Delony?

  You should, because it's his parents. He needs to do it. He's got, you're married to a coward. Why won't he stand up to his parents?

• 27:39Dr. John Delony?

  And I know, I don't want to talk back.

• 27:40Speaker 02

  It's a childhood dynamic, honestly. I think that's what it is.

• 27:43Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so he- here's the thing. You somehow have in your soul kind of a people, a people pleaser? Like, you want to make sure everybody else is okay?

• 27:52Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 27:53Dr. John Delony?

  And at the same time, you've got some pretty clear thing, pictures of what you want your life to be like, and what you want for your kid, and what you want for you, and for your marriage, et cetera. I want you to practice writing those things down and saying them out loud. Not like, "It's time for some quiet time." It is, "All right, I'm gonna go put him down or her down for a nap. Everybody wave goodbye. We will see y'all again in an hour and a half."

• 28:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:22Dr. John Delony?

  Because then it's like, "Well, I'm gonna do some quiet time." That kinda leaves it open to, "Well, I mean, I'll, I'll hold him if you're tired of holding him."

• 28:31Dr. John Delony?

  But like, "I'm gonna go take a nap." Or, "Well, we're gonna be home, we're doing the homeschooling for this kid." "No, no, we're sending them to this elementary school. We've already decided that." "Well, I don't think that's a good idea." "I, I'm great, I appreciate that, but you don't get a vote, 'cause it's my kid, so we're gonna send him over to there."

• 28:48Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 28:49Dr. John Delony?

  And that's for your, that's your husband's conversation to have. And, and comically, what I would say is like a nonchalant way.

• 28:57Dr. John Delony?

  Like, I don't even know, I don't even know if it needs to rot unless you're, unless you're in-laws. Take it to the next level. "No grandkid of mine's going to a school." "All right, well then we're gonna have a serious conversation about whose kid this actually is."

• 29:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, and see, so my, uh, my husband is the first responder.

• 29:13Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 29:13Speaker 02

  So, he-

• 29:14Dr. John Delony?

  Well, then he's not a coward. Stop me there then, I'm talking all bad. He's, he's not a coward.

• 29:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, but he, so he works a lot. Um, typically, he, he works at two different departments, so he works, um, 48 hours on, 24 hours off.

• 29:31Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 29:31Speaker 02

  Um, we're blessed enough that, you know, they live close. Um, and they take care of watching him, um, on the days that, you know, I'm, I'm working and he's not home. Um, so I, and that's been, it's been that way since, you know, basically since he was born, I returned back to work. So, they do have a lot of access to him.

• 29:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, but also they have something else. They also have something else. This is an important distinction. In many ways, you've put them in a parental role several days a week.

• 30:04Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:05Dr. John Delony?

  And if there's not caretaker boundaries, so for instance, if, let's pretend they were out of the picture. And your not coward husband goes to like, save the city he's in, right? Like he does every day and you go off to work. If you had hired a teenager to take care of your kid, you would have printed out on a Word document, nap schedule, food schedule, feeding schedule, no screens, playing, here's how you text me, etc.

• 30:34Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:34Dr. John Delony?

  But when it comes to in-laws or aunts or uncles, it's very easy just to drop the kid off.

• 30:41Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 30:42Dr. John Delony?

  And then they raise that kid like they would raise a kid.

• 30:47Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:47Dr. John Delony?

  And then really quickly, over time, it becomes our kid.

• 30:51Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:52Dr. John Delony?

  And it's, we're all raising one big happy family raising this kid.

• 30:57Dr. John Delony?

  And so really, the thing here is, is you need to be pretty direct. Your husband needs to be pretty direct. Well, y'all need to get aligned, first of all.

• 31:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:06Dr. John Delony?

  And he might say, actually, I think it'd be awesome if my parents homeschool them. Well, then that's a conversation y'all need to have.

• 31:13Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 31:14Dr. John Delony?

  Right? And then I think y'all need to come back and circle back and say, here is our caretaker expectations. This is going to be different. We're trying to, we're getting them on a new schedule. And then, because again, you guys also want the best of both worlds. You want them to do it exactly as you want to do it, but you want free childcare a couple of days a week, too.

• 31:34Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 31:34Dr. John Delony?

  And so sometimes these boundaries cost you like financially, when your, when your in-laws say, well, screw you then. No young kids are going to lecture us on how to raise a baby, right? And that happens.

• 31:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:46Dr. John Delony?

  I hope it doesn't happen.

• 31:47Speaker 02

  And I know we've been looking into possibly doing like a preschool program a couple of days a week. You know, morning time from like eight, eight to 12 or eight to one or something like that. And I know, I mentioned it and there was kind of like this, like. No, like, we, we love having him and, you know, but I, I think it's beneficial for, especially, he hasn't been around other kids, like, in a daycare-type setting. Like, I think it's important for his own, you know, emotional development to be around other kids than, you know, I, I think that that kind of got overlooked in, in the fact of, but wait, no, we want him, like,

• 32:28Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 32:34Dr. John Delony?

  I guess I'll just, like, socially, like, if, if a young child is surrounded by sturdy, regulated, caring adults, their socialization's gonna be fine.

• 32:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:46Dr. John Delony?

  Right, they're gonna be fine. That's often a, a proxy for, I don't wanna deal with this situation, so, I wanna, I just want him around other kids, because if you want him around other kids, you can set up playdates, you can have kids over all the time, you can have kids over on Saturdays, I mean, you can make that happen.

• 33:04Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 33:06Dr. John Delony?

  I think that you're trying to avoid the harder conversations.

• 33:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:13Dr. John Delony?

  And I guess for me, that's a skill I want you to have, because you walk around on eggshells in your own house.

• 33:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:24Dr. John Delony?

  And I, I just think you deserve more than that.

• 33:29Dr. John Delony?

  And your husband sounds like he's a, like, he's a gangster, man, he shows up for the least of these in our communities, day in and day out, I don't want him walking around eggshells in his own house either.

• 33:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I think, I think he feels a lot of, you know, I, I think it goes back to his childhood not really being able to properly voice how he feels.

• 33:49Dr. John Delony?

  That's fair, that's fair.

• 33:50Speaker 02

  Him and I have worked through that, you know, within our relationship, and we've gotten to a good place with it, but I know there's still that, that wall up when it comes to how to talk to his own parents.

• 34:03Dr. John Delony?

  I get that.

• 34:04Speaker 02

  And, and it's with difficult conversations, typically, I mean, yeah.

• 34:09Dr. John Delony?

  So, I, I think often the conversation about, um, protect and provide, he's an amazing protector and amazing provider, and I think you need to have the conversation the next level that says, hey, right now, providing for us is less economic, it is family boundaries.

• 34:30Dr. John Delony?

  Protection for us right now is less about can you fight and can you handle a gun and can you put out a fire? Protection is more, I want what we want for our kid voiced to everybody, whether it's a teacher, whether it's a caretaker, whether it's our in-laws. I want that, I want that universal. That's what protection looks like right now. Protecting our son's heart and mind.

• 34:50Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 34:51Dr. John Delony?

  And when you frame it that way, often it sinks in a little bit differently.

• 34:57Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 34:58Dr. John Delony?

  You get what I'm saying?

• 35:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, for sure.

• 35:03Dr. John Delony?

  Because here's, I think, I think at the end of the day, I think your frustration is with him, not with your in-laws.

• 35:08Speaker 02

  That's fair. That's, that's, that's very fair.

• 35:12Dr. John Delony?

  And if your frustration's with him, I think he has a right to know that you're this frustrated with him.

• 35:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:18Dr. John Delony?

  Is that fair?

• 35:20Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 35:22Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And can I tell you something else? Y'all aren't crazy, you're not crazy, he's not crazy, this isn't like a unique thing, it happens to everybody.

• 35:30Speaker 02

  Good to know.

• 35:31Dr. John Delony?

  It just sucks. Like, you're not broken, your family's not falling apart, nothing like that. This is just the worst.

• 35:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:38Dr. John Delony?

  And here's what makes it even extra worse, is probably your in-laws are pretty great.

• 35:42Speaker 02

  Oh, they, they a hundred percent are.

• 35:45Dr. John Delony?

  They're just doing it the best they can with what they got, because they don't have that printed off piece of paper in front of them.

• 35:48Speaker 02

  Absolutely, absolutely. Yeah, I, I, like I said, I know that they're, you know, anything that they do is not malicious at all. We're so grateful, and I'm so grateful for everything with them, you know, but I'm just trying to figure out that healthy, healthy boundary, and I think, I think you got, got it spot on.

• 36:10Dr. John Delony?

  Well, and the healthy boundary, I think for you is, I think you needed to find that for yourself.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:15Dr. John Delony?

  And here's what's annoying, it won't feel a certain way. You get what I'm saying? Like, you think there's gonna come a moment when it feels so good, or feels so peace, it's just, that feeling's just gonna morph and move.

• 36:26Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 36:27Dr. John Delony?

  Because your kid's gonna turn four, and you're gonna wanna put him down for a nap, and then it'll be like, hey, don't need a nap, he's four, let's go out with... And then it's, oh. Or, your husband's gonna have a picture of what it looks like on Saturday, and you're gonna have a different picture of what it looks like. So, like, it's just a common thing, happens all the time, y'all aren't broken, but I think it's being honest about, hey, husband, we've worked so hard on us talking to each other, this is the next layer.

• 36:54Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 36:55Dr. John Delony?

  And I feel like it's your responsibility to help lead the charge with your parents and vice versa. And so y'all get it out on the table because he might say, I love the idea of my parents being the, you know, my, my, my parents homeschooling. I love it. I love that idea. And you might be like, no way, Jose. That's the conversation to have. Then the boundary part just becomes y'all just saying, I'm going to bite the bullet and we're going to say our boundaries out loud. And we're going to hope that everybody respects them and we're going to deal with it when they don't. Thank you so much for the call. You're not broken. You're not failing. Your marriage is probably amazing. Like, things are good. This is just a common thing that comes up in a high majority of first time parents, second time parents, whatever.

• 37:38Dr. John Delony?

  And it's just deciding what do we want for our kid and how do we develop the courage to communicate that to everybody? Thanks for the call. We'll be right back.

• 37:49Dr. John Delony?

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• 38:34Dr. John Delony?

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• 39:08Dr. John Delony?

  All right, we're back. Let's go out to San Diego, California and talk to Crystal. Hey, Crystal, what's up?

• 39:14Speaker 03

  Hello, how are you?

• 39:16Dr. John Delony?

  Remarkable. How are you?

• 39:18Speaker 03

  I'm doing fantastic. Definitely can't complain. Um, okay, John, so here is my question for you. I'm a 27-year-old female and my partner is 30 and I am obviously having conversations with him, moving forward in marriage, having children. But the biggest thing I have going on for myself right now is how do I make my partner feel respected and fulfilled in our relationship?

• 39:46Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, man, there's a lot of tentacles to that question. Be more specific.

• 39:51Dr. John Delony?

  So something happened, something happened for you to call. Why would you call?

• 39:54Speaker 03

  Yes. So we are in a time where everything in our day-to-day will be good and we have a conversation that will come up or some sort of disagreement slash argument. And it really just like, like, really escalates to, you know, zero to 100. And it just leaves me kind of feeling in turmoil and in those conversations, you know, my partner, I just feel like he keeps referencing that he doesn't feel heard, he doesn't feel respected, um, in the way that I communicate. Um, and so I think just because I keep hearing those words of not being heard, not feeling respected, I don't really know where to turn.

• 40:36Speaker 03

  Um, and you know, what to work on, you know, because those conversations are always coming up in a time of a flare-up, quote unquote, to say.

• 40:46Dr. John Delony?

  Do you respect him?

• 40:48Speaker 03

  I do. And everything he does from work to how he treats people, I mean, I feel that I rave about him.

• 40:56Dr. John Delony?

  Those are external, those are external things. Those are external things. Those are certificates on the wall.

• 41:03Dr. John Delony?

  Do you respect the man he is?

• 41:05Speaker 03

  I do.

• 41:06Dr. John Delony?

  Does he make you feel safe when he walks into a room?

• 41:08Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 41:09Dr. John Delony?

  When he sees you, do you feel loved?

• 41:12Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 41:12Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So when you say,

• 41:19Dr. John Delony?

  "How can I best love you?", what does he say? What are some actions that he has put on the table before? When he said, "I don't feel heard or respected", and then he says, "This is how I would feel heard, this is how I would feel respected", what are some of the things he's put on the table?

• 41:35Speaker 03

  To be upfront and to just speak very black and white. And if, you know, I want something, um, to just blatantly say it. And that's just how his brain works. And I feel that, you know, I maybe try to protect myself, to protect him. And so I try to say it in, you know, a dancing neutral party type of way.

• 41:59Dr. John Delony?

  Right.

• 42:00Speaker 03

  And we just, you know, dance around in conversation all the time.

• 42:04Dr. John Delony?

  So why don't you feel safe enough? Going back to my original question. You said when he walks in a room, your body feels safe.

• 42:12Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 42:12Dr. John Delony?

  Why can't you just say what you need or what you want?

• 42:18Speaker 03

  I'm a little nervous that he'll be upset with me, even though my brain knows that he won't be. There is just something that it's just, I have such a hard time just letting it out.

• 42:31Dr. John Delony?

  Do you have an example of a time you've told him just directly in the truth and in a loving, compassionate way, and he has exploded on you or run from you?

• 42:40Speaker 03

  No, I mean, that's, I, that's, it's this internal. And I've noticed that ever since he's pointed that out, that I do that in a lot of areas in my life.

• 42:51Dr. John Delony?

  I was gonna ask, like, where else do you hide from him?

• 42:58Speaker 03

  What do you mean by, by hide from him?

• 43:00Dr. John Delony?

  You know, like, what are things going on in your mind that he doesn't know about?

• 43:07Speaker 03

  Um.

• 43:11Speaker 03

  I would just say there's just some anxiety there.

• 43:15Dr. John Delony?

  I know, so I'm asking, what is that?

• 43:19Dr. John Delony?

  Or let me, let me ask it in another way. Why is your body, through feelings, through anxiousness, through holding, biting your tongue, through talking in circles? Those are all ways your body's trying to keep you safe. Why has your body decided that you being seen and heard is not safe?

• 43:45Speaker 03

  That's a good question.

• 43:48Speaker 03

  Um.

• 43:48Dr. John Delony?

  Because here's what I think's happening. I think he is probably pretty direct. Probably like, hey, just tell me what you need so I can love you. And you make these big laps around the building. And he's like, what? And then it feels frustrating and then it feels deceptive.

• 44:04Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:05Dr. John Delony?

  And then he goes to bed every night feeling like he doesn't really know you. And you feel that gap.

• 44:14Dr. John Delony?

  And every time you try to bridge that gap, your body electrocutes you and it's like, no, no, no, no, no, don't get that close.

• 44:22Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 44:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think you definitely hit the nail on the head for sure.

• 44:26Dr. John Delony?

  So let me ask, so, so, I'm gonna ask you, why?

• 44:32Speaker 03

  Um, I think over time, maybe that when we've been pushed into those conversations and moments of zero to 100, that it's either like, do I need to, you know, leave and do we need to take a break? So I feel that over time because those conversations have alluded to that.

• 44:50Dr. John Delony?

  From, from him or from you?

• 44:54Speaker 03

  From both. I would say majority myself and I feel that I put myself in this place.

• 45:00Dr. John Delony?

  So when you get in one of those situations where you're going zero to 100, you explode on him? Or do you build a quick concrete fortress and hide?

• 45:08Speaker 03

  Fortress and hide. I'm a, I shut down in conversations.

• 45:11Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 45:17Dr. John Delony?

  And so at some point, does he find himself inadvertently banging on the door to try to get in?

• 45:23Speaker 03

  Um, I definitely wouldn't say to that degree, like even in those conversations, we both try to have respect for one another. Um, and to never raise your voice and things like that.

• 45:33Dr. John Delony?

  That's not respect. That's not respect. Y'all try to be polite.

• 45:38Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 45:38Dr. John Delony?

  And y'all try to be polite so that if something goes wrong, both of y'all can say, I didn't do, fill in the blank. I didn't yell. I didn't hit anybody. I didn't punch a hole through the concrete. I didn't, I didn't, I didn't.

• 45:50Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 45:50Dr. John Delony?

  And so it's two teams playing football and both feel, sent your defense out and nobody will hike the ball.

• 45:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:00Dr. John Delony?

  And then one of you just gets so mad, like, "Let's play ball." And the other's like, "Well, you know." And then, like, I get, and then...

• 46:09Dr. John Delony?

  And then it's like, "I just, I wanna go, I wanna go be with somebody that will play offense."

• 46:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:14Dr. John Delony?

  And I wanna go be able to play offense sometimes. So, circling all the way back, take him off the table. I wanna talk to you.

• 46:23Dr. John Delony?

  Who told you the safest thing for you to do is just to be quiet?

• 46:29Speaker 03

  I always grew, I grew up that way. And it was a very, unless you're spoken to, you know, you don't really say what you need to say. Um, so, yeah, I think I've just, I've always grown up with, especially, you know, from my father, that was his big, you know, unless you're spoken to, your opinion doesn't really matter.

• 46:53Dr. John Delony?

  So, have you heard, have you heard me say on the show,

• 46:57Dr. John Delony?

  "The things that kept you safe as a kid will destroy your adult relationships"?

• 47:02Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's definitely where I'm at right now.

• 47:04Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So, here's, it's really a binary choice. You continue running on the same roads that were built out of, out of safety and necessity as a kid. And you can run on those roads and you will not die. You'll stay alive.

• 47:21Dr. John Delony?

  And you'll be alone.

• 47:25Dr. John Delony?

  And you might be alone, sharing a bed with somebody that says, "I do," and that I love you. But that gap will always exist.

• 47:34Dr. John Delony?

  Or, you have to choose to do something that feels initially unsafe and unnatural with somebody that you know to be safe.

• 47:46Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 47:47Dr. John Delony?

  And that means you have to go into a season of practicing discomfort.

• 47:55Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 47:56Dr. John Delony?

  Does that make sense? Because here's what I... Man.

• 48:03Dr. John Delony?

  The walls you built will affect your finances. It will affect you professionally. It will affect your sex life.

• 48:11Dr. John Delony?

  It will keep every... You'll never be able to fully let go.

• 48:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's funny you say that too, because that's something that I hear, you know, from him of like, you know, I feel that you've built up this brick wall and, you know, how are you supposed to let me in? And like you said, even in the bedroom, so many different areas. Um, that he's... This person is showing up and this person is every day. Like, let me be there for you. Let me be there for you. And I just cannot... Let me rephrase that because I can't. I need to let those walls down because you are right. And it is impacting my life in so many other ways.

• 48:51Dr. John Delony?

  I need you to not let those walls down. I want you to try courageously to bash through them.

• 48:58Dr. John Delony?

  Because letting the walls down is still a passive stance.

• 49:03Dr. John Delony?

  It mimics bravery. I guess that's not fair. It is initially brave, that first step.

• 49:11Dr. John Delony?

  But I just want you to think of it like you come home and you see this man. Do you love this guy?

• 49:17Speaker 03

  Yes, oh my gosh, like...

• 49:19Dr. John Delony?

  And is he a good guy?

• 49:20Speaker 03

  The moment we met, yes.

• 49:21Dr. John Delony?

  See a good guy? Oh, the moment we met. That's like Dawson's Creek. But like, you've grown to love this person, right?

• 49:27Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 49:28Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, and he does the things. He shows up.

• 49:31Speaker 03

  Always.

• 49:32Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So you've got this person that you see, that you love, that you've probably thought about making plans with down the road, right? And you'd be crazy if you haven't had that imaginary picture pop into your head of a fireplace and a Thanksgiving table and your four boys home from Christmas and their girlfriends that you hate but kind of love. Right?

• 49:53Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 49:54Dr. John Delony?

  And if you have a picture of an older, wrinklier, grayer version of this guy at the end of that tape, right? So you have been there. And you come home and he sees you and everything in his world lights up.

• 50:09Dr. John Delony?

  But there's a sheet of Plexiglas in between you. And he just can't touch you.

• 50:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:19Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 50:21Dr. John Delony?

  And the same with your customers, the same, I don't know what you do for a living, but the same with your bosses?

• 50:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's, it's very true. And I work with, you know, I'm my boss's right-hand gal. Um, and that is a topic that we have talked about of, you know, I feel like we work together 24/7, but I don't really let you know.

• 50:39Dr. John Delony?

  He has no idea who you are.

• 50:39Speaker 03

  Who Victoria is.

• 50:40Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, that's right. That's right.

• 50:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:44Dr. John Delony?

  And, and if we were in a different call, I would ask you about your sex life and I could almost guarantee it. I could pinpoint where you struggle.

• 50:52Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:53Dr. John Delony?

  Fair?

• 50:54Speaker 03

  For sure.

• 50:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 50:55Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:55Dr. John Delony?

  So here's the thing, you have to make a choice that I'm gonna be seen and I'm gonna be known.

• 51:04Dr. John Delony?

  But it's not something you can lob on him. That's a decision you have to make.

• 51:12Dr. John Delony?

  And you're gonna have to practice a thing that I, like where you put your hand on your chest or put your fist in your chest. And you have to look in the mirror 10 times a day for 30 days. You want a homework assignment? Will you actually do it?

• 51:26Speaker 03

  100% yes.

• 51:27Dr. John Delony?

  For 30 days from today, I want you to go look in the mirror and put your fist in your chest and look yourself dead in the eyes and say, I love this girl.

• 51:39Dr. John Delony?

  And I want you to pause. I want you to drop your shoulders. And I want you to say it again. I love this girl.

• 51:49Speaker 03

  I can do that.

• 51:49Dr. John Delony?

  And I want you to say it, well, hold on, I'm not done. I want you to say it 10 times. And then I want you to say, she deserves to be heard.

• 52:02Dr. John Delony?

  And then you gotta go get weird and you're gonna have to tell, I'm gonna, here's what I'm gonna send you. I'm gonna send you, and it's gonna sound pedantic. It's gonna sound silly, okay? What I'm gonna send you, but I'm gonna mail you all of the questions for humans cards for free for couples and the intimacy deck, okay? But here's what I want you to do. They're, they're not complicated.

• 52:23Dr. John Delony?

  But you have to commit to telling the truth.

• 52:28Dr. John Delony?

  And so like the intimacy deck, when it says, what's one thing you really used to be into in the bedroom and you're not anymore? You have to actually answer that.

• 52:37Dr. John Delony?

  What's our favorite memory of us kissing before?

• 52:41Dr. John Delony?

  What's your least favorite memory of us kissing? Like, you gotta be honest.

• 52:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 52:48Dr. John Delony?

  And you need to have a series where you meet once a week with him and you say, alright, here's three things that scared me this week and here's three things that I thought were incredible about this week.

• 52:57Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 52:58Dr. John Delony?

  You've got to practice being seen and known. And then y'all just need to come up with some sort of signal, like, I'm flooded, I'm too much, I'm gonna back up. And he's gonna say, okay, cool, because you're just, all you're doing is practicing. You're practicing a thing that got you electrocuted as a kid by the one man who you should have been able to anchor into for your entire life, your dad.

• 53:19Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 53:19Dr. John Delony?

  And he weaponized your feelings, your emotions, he weaponized your personhood. And said, "Your personhood is mine, and when I want to see it, I'll let you know."

• 53:30Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:30Dr. John Delony?

  Instead of celebrating the crazy bananas, wild, little San Diego girl you were growing up.

• 53:37Speaker 03

  Yeah. I could not agree more, and I think, you know, again, that we are in this period of our relationship of, and, you know, he wants to so badly propose, and he's talked about it, and he just needs the utmost confidence in myself, and I feel that I do as well. And because, you know, we've both gone through families of divorce and all of these things, and so if we can have those hard conversations and put in the work now to give our future children a childhood, and, you know, all of those healthy kind of relationships, like, 100%, this has just been so helpful, then if this can get me there, like, I don't know, this is the best phone call ever.

• 54:20Dr. John Delony?

  Well, it's, it's, it's kind of like, I just handed you a workout plan, so for the next year, you need to go lift weights.

• 54:27Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 54:28Dr. John Delony?

  Like, the work is yours, are you willing to, for the first time in your life, how old are you?

• 54:33Speaker 03

  Twenty-seven.

• 54:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Are you, for the first time in a quarter century, are you willing to practice being seen and heard? Because here's the other side of being seen and heard, he might look at you and say, "Eesh, I don't want to propose."

• 54:47Dr. John Delony?

  And that will not make what you did wrong.

• 54:50Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 54:50Dr. John Delony?

  That won't make you wrong. That will mean you've been giving a pretty remarkable theater performance to be his girlfriend.

• 55:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:04Dr. John Delony?

  And hopefully, my fingers crossed, because I'm a romantic, just kind of an oogie-googie romantic, I hope that he sees you and gets to know you. Like, I don't like that, or I love that. And by the way, I've been married for, gosh, 22 and a half years now. I found out, my wife said something the other day, and I looked at her and I started laughing, I was like, "I don't know you. You what? Like, I had no idea. But can I tell you, that's my freaking favorite part. I found out something the other night about one of her old boyfriends and her, I did not know. I didn't know. But here's the thing, it made me die laughing.

• 55:42Dr. John Delony?

  Started dying laughing, because here's why. She's not going anywhere, and I'm not either.

• 55:50Dr. John Delony?

  You get what I'm saying?

• 55:52Speaker 03

  Hundred percent.

• 55:53Dr. John Delony?

  And so, it, when you grow up in homes of divorce, I just saw this recently, I love it, when you grow up in a home of divorce, you realize, oh, they could, somebody could leave, that's a thing, you can just leave.

• 56:07Dr. John Delony?

  And so what you do is you try really hard not to let the other person leave.

• 56:13Dr. John Delony?

  And that almost guarantees at some point, they don't know you, and leaving is still on the table.

• 56:20Dr. John Delony?

  The other side of that-

• 56:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's an interesting perspective.

• 56:22Dr. John Delony?

  The other side of it is, I'm gonna be fully seen and known, and we're gonna become braided together like a, like one of those ocean ropes that nobody can pull apart, right?

• 56:33Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 56:34Dr. John Delony?

  It's awesome. So let's call this what it is, it's day one. Some of this may be hard, so it may be that y'all start a journal together, that you put on his pillow at night, that he writes in, then he puts it on your pillow the next morning, or whatever. And some of these things are easier done via letter. Some of these things are hard, just to sit down and just say it in front of somebody, like, "Here's what I think about this, and I don't like this, and I want to get to know you here." But some of it is, we're just gonna stop going to fancy restaurants and pretending like everything's okay, we're gonna go to crummy restaurants and just chit-chat. And you can chit-chat in nice restaurants, but it's just a vibe.

• 57:09Dr. John Delony?

  I don't get to know you. Here's one thing that I asked my wife to do last year. Make me a syllabus of you. What are the 10 podcasts you listen to? I don't know what you listen to anymore. What are 10 bands you like? I know what you used to like. I don't know what you even listen to anymore. What are 10 books you want me to read? That you read, not that you want me to, that you read, that you love? Because I want to get to know you. I might read those books. Some of those books I've gotten into did not like them. Couple of them I've loved. Podcasts, one podcast I was listening to and I was like, I know her. Like, you want to meet her? Like, I was a friend of mine. She didn't even know we were connected. So, all I have to say is, let's get to know each other. Here's books I like. Here's movies I like. Here's music I love. I'd love to learn to dance. I'd love to learn to sing.

• 57:51Dr. John Delony?

  I'd love to just learn to let go. And this happens inside your chest. I'm proud of you, Crystal. Day one. You love that girl. She's worth being hurt. We'll be right back. Let's talk about TrainWell, an amazing personal trainer and app all in one. I know it's cold and dreary outside, but our bodies still have to move. If we want to be healthy, we have to exercise. So if you're finally ready to start an exercise program, or if you've been a lifelong lifter and exerciser like me, and you're just ready to shake things up, you've got to check out TrainWell. I use it, my wife uses it, my coworkers and their spouses are using it. TrainWell is amazing.

• 58:36Dr. John Delony?

  TrainWell offers tailored workouts with step-by-step guidance from real people, meaning it's not just an app, and it's not just a personal trainer. It's the best of both. I get personalized workouts on the app, and I communicate with my trainer on a daily basis, and the results have been extraordinary. To get started, you just answer a few questions about your fitness journey. You hop on a chat with an expert trainer to discuss your goals and make a personalized plan, and then it's time for you to get to work. As you complete workouts, your trainer will keep tweaking them to help you get better. TrainWell takes away our excuses and makes it easy. So if you're ready to start taking control of your health and start exercising, take the quiz to find your perfect trainer at trainwell.net/delove.

• 59:18Dr. John Delony?

  Deloney today. They've extended their special offer for my audience, just $69 a month when you lock in your plan this February. That's almost 50% off their regular monthly rate, plus 14 days of free training. Go to trainwell.net slash Deloney. That's T-R-A-I-N-W-E-L-L. Trainwell.net slash Deloney.

• 59:42Dr. John Delony?

  All right, we're back. Something cool happened. What is it, Kelly?

• 59:45Speaker 04

  All right, this is from, I'm hoping I'm pronouncing her name correctly, Myrta.

• 59:49Dr. John Delony?

  Myrta.

• 59:50Speaker 04

  Yes. All right. She says, "We are a family of five with three teens. Dinner time has always been a priority in our family, ever since the kids were little. I always made dinner together happen. Now that the kids are older with jobs and high school and activities, it's nearly impossible to have everyone together at home at one time. I've had to grieve that a little bit. It was hard to let go of it. However, I decided to replace dinner time with 'Questions for Humans, Parents, and Teen Cards.' I gather the family around 9 o'clock, as many a times as week as I can, and we do a few cards. When I first brought up the idea, the teens rolled their eyes and rolled their eyes at me and gave me the 'Bruh, why?' I'm assuming she has sons, because I've heard that. My husband was skeptical.

• 1:00:33Speaker 04

  Let me tell you, it has been amazing. Better than I expected. It's not about the questions on the card, it's the fact that each person has a space to talk. A chance to express idea, an idea or dream. There are no wrong answers, except to shrug, or an, I don't know. I've learned new things about my family. It has started conversations that otherwise would never have happened. It has brought about admittance to failures or dreams. We just finished the deck a few nights ago, and my husband has already asked if there's a second edition."

• 1:01:03Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, yeah. Dude, that's awesome. So, hey, here's what I love. We grieved it. The thing that was is no more, just because of time and circumstance. But I'm not going to give up on it. I'm going to create a new thing, and it's going to look different, and it's amazing.

• 1:01:19Speaker 04

  Yeah, because sometimes when you stick so legal, when you're so legalistic about this thing that we do, and you grasp onto it so tight... You lose it anyway because you're forcing it to happen. And yet, if you want your kids to have jobs, like, you know, my son works two nights a week, they're gonna be gone.

• 1:01:36Dr. John Delony?

  Right.

• 1:01:37Speaker 04

  And they have lives. This is what's supposed to be happening. There's supposed to be that kind of peeling away a bit, but she just found a different way to make it work.

• 1:01:44Dr. John Delony?

  And I think it's important to push through teenagers, "I don't want to," or "I don't feel like it." Those are just soft, squishy boundaries that they want to see. Do you, like, will you punch right through that?

• 1:01:55Speaker 04

  Right. And then, like, in this case, they end up loving it.

• 1:01:58Dr. John Delony?

  Of course they do.

• 1:01:58Speaker 04

  Because it's very important.

• 1:01:59Dr. John Delony?

  And it feels good in their nervous system, right? And all kids love hearing... I told my son some, like, I will go back to one of the greatest things I've ever did was driving from Nashville to Texas, just because I... Flying now is kind of chaotic for me, and I lost my pre-check because I'm an idiot. And so, like, the thought of doing that during Christmas, so my son and I just drove to Texas, 12 hours one way, drove all across the state, visiting family and friends, then we drove 12 hours back. He learned some sto... He asked me questions about childhood and stories, and I told him stories that he could not believe. But we got to know each other, and vice versa. I got to hear his thoughts, but it was just amazing. Never would've got there. Never would've got there.

• 1:02:44Dr. John Delony?

  So, good call. Way to go. I don't know. That just cheers me up. Those little questions for humans, cards, man. All over the country, people are changing their lives. It's a threat. Thanks for being with us. Stay in school, don't do drugs. Bye.