Kevin Smith & Harley Quinn Smith Dare To Enter The 'Vegan Abattoir'

Over the last several episodes, I’ve endeavored to shoulder healthy and thoughtful conversations about what matters most right now — the pandemic, racial injustice, systemic racism, police brutality and food injustice. Today we shift from that somber gear for an interlude of reprieve. Enter entertainment’s ultimate plant-based father-daughter duo: Kevin Smith and Harley Quinn Smith. For the few unfamiliar among us, Kevin is an indie film making legend, actor, comedian, comic book writer, author and early podcast pioneer — a voice I credit as a huge influence on my personal career behind a microphone. In 1994, Kevin burst into prominence with his hyper low-budget comedy Clerks, a film he wrote, directed, co-produced, and filmed in the convenience store where he worked. Premiering at Sundance, it was fêted with the festival’s highest award before going on to become an indie cult classic. In addition to countless appearances in both movies and television, Kevin has created a litany of films, affectionately and collectively referred to by his many rabid fans as the View Askewiverse, a nod to Kevin’s production shingle, View Askew Productions. Returning to his roots (did he ever leave?), Kevin toured his latest film, Jay and Silent Bob Reboot (featuring names like Chris Hemsworth and Ben Affleck) to roadshow box office success, promoting it with pre-pandemic live events in over 60 cities across North America. An iconic and beloved character amongst indie film fans and comic book nerds, Kevin has always been immediately recognizable and famous for his hockey jerseys, backward hat and well, his weight. But in February of 2018, Kevin had a near-fatal heart attack. A lifestyle change was needed. Desperately. Enter Harley. An actress, animal rights activist and bass player for the bubblegum punk band, The Tenth, Harley suggested —some might say coerced—Kevin to adopt her plant-based ways. Kevin obliged. In short, he dropped 50 pounds and kept the weight off. His blood work normalized. And the rest is history. Together they recently launched Vegan Abattoir—a daddy daughter podcast affair that provides plant-based answers to the vegan-curious questions they get from a meat-eating and dairy-drinking audience. Dare you enter? If so you can catch yours truly in episode 2. Picking up where I left off with Kevin in last year’s barnburner 2.5 hour Vulcan mind meld (RRP #433), Today’s discussion centers primarily on veganism and animal rights. What led Harley to adopt this lifestyle, the way it has transformed her life, and that of her Dad. It’s about the many projects these two have up their sleeve, from restaurants to non-profits, to upcoming films. It’s a peek into the life of a Hollywood family, and the complicated dynamics of the movie biz and stardom — including a touching remembrance of Stan Lee and the story behind Harley landing a Manson girl part in Quentin Tarantino’s Once Upon A Time In Hollywood. The gleeful banter between Harley and Kevin is infectious. And while this conversation is light, I promise there is much to be gleaned — especially if you are new to the vegan world or perhaps contemplating a more-plant based approach to your plate and life. I’ve interviewed a lot of people. Few are as skilled as Kevin in the art of conversation. And Harley just made it all so much better. Enjoy! Peace + Plants, Rich Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Rich Roll?

  Eating well rarely falls apart because of one big failure. It's the daily question that wears you down. Like, what am I actually gonna make tonight? What's in the fridge? And it's exactly why we built the Plant Power Meal Planner. It's a personalized, plant-based meal planning program that matches you with recipes based on your taste, your allergies, your cooking skills, and how much time you actually have. You build, through this program, a balanced, nutrient-dense plan for your entire household in a few minutes. Then it generates a grocery list for you with one click that plugs right into our delivery partners. All the recipes in the program are built by dietitians with culinary training. Plus, you get your own food coach to help you problem-solve along the way.

• 0:44Rich Roll?

  It's kind of an amazing thing. For listeners of the show, all you special people, we're offering an exclusive $20 off an annual subscription right now. To get it, go to meals.richroll.com, take your quick personalization quiz, and enter promo code RICHROLL20 at checkout.

• 1:04Kevin Smith?

  Being vegan together has been fun. We've always been very similar in other ways and stuff, but now there's that as well, which has been kind of adorable, but also beneficial. Like, she literally saved my life by being like, "Come do this, come do this." And like, every time I pop something in my mouth that's plant-based, which is every time I pop something into my mouth, I generally think like, "I wouldn't have been here were it not for her." And not just for her going, "Please do this." She was a vegan astronaut. She'd been like, you know, two years of vegan prior to me, and that made a transition to a plant-based lifestyle much easier. For some people who are like, teetering like, "It's a mystery." I had somebody who had like, kind of solved the mystery for herself, and so was able

• 1:45Kevin Smith?

  to give me information that made me feel way more comfortable about leaving behind 47 years of eating a certain way. So, you know, hats off to you.

• 1:54Speaker 02

  It has been really cool. It's been really special to be able to do it together, and I didn't really give my dad a choice at all to be vegan. I just, I was insisting upon it. But also how cool it is to have the perspective of somebody who's vegan for their health and somebody who's vegan for a completely different reason for animal rights. And kind of seeing what human compassion could do to an animal just gave me a new awareness that I had never Understood before where the human actions directly affect the animals that we coexist with. So it has like also just proved to be a really good combination for different backstories of why we're vegans. So that's also really cool.

• 2:37Rich Roll?

  That's Kevin Smith and Harley Quinn Smith, and this is the Rich Roll Podcast.

• 2:53Rich Roll?

  The Rich Roll Podcast.

• 3:03Rich Roll?

  Okay, my guests today are Kevin Smith, the podcasting original gangster himself, indie filmmaking royalty, pop culture aficionado, and now going strong two years after the heart attack that nearly claimed his life. As a vegan enthusiast, a lifestyle we discussed in our first podcast together, that was episode 433 back in April of last year. And that shift was due in no small part, actually probably entirely due to the influence of today's other guest, Kevin's daughter Harley Quinn Smith, who is an animal rights activist, a punk rock

• 3:44Rich Roll?

  bass player, an actress you might have caught in one of Kevin's films like Yoga Hosers, or perhaps in Quentin Tarantino's Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. We talk about that today. Together, these two recently launched a podcast, a daddy-daughter affair called Vegan Appetoir. I happened to be their guest last week, so check that out. Anyway, I love these two. This one is super fun. So dig it, people. This is me, Kevin Smith, and Harley Quinn Smith.

• 4:18Rich Roll?

  I appreciate you guys coming out here and talking today.

• 4:21Kevin Smith?

  Thanks for having, man. When, uh, when, when the kid showed interest in doing a podcast, which like naturally, you know, made my podcaster soul leap. Cause she'd been on a few episodes of Smodcast in the past and stuff. But when she was like, I'm thinking about doing a podcast. I was like, what? What? Like, oh my God, I know a thing or two about that. I was so excited. So when she narrowed it down and created what, what we're calling vegan aptitude. Um, one of the first things I said is like, oh, you, you have to have Rich Roll on.

• 4:54Rich Roll?

  Yeah, cool.

• 4:55Kevin Smith?

  And she was like, why? And I was like, because like in the space, he's the guy. I'd said, I did this podcast, it's like a year ago. And not a week of my life goes by where I don't run into somebody who's like, I heard you on Rich Roll's podcast. And it's always somebody I would never expect. Like, it's not like, oh, that's my vegan friend who said that. It's somebody who's like, says this, I'm like, what? You as well? There was a lot of reach in that part. You got a big audience.

• 5:20Rich Roll?

  Yeah, I appreciate that. I mean, that means a lot coming from you. I mean, Harley, do you understand what your dad created? I mean, he is like the original when it comes to, there's like three generations of podcasting here. Because your dad, Kevin, was one of the very first, like way, way before anybody was doing it, to jump in and own the space. And he really pioneered it and created like everything that's happened. A huge debt is owed to you, Kevin. And personally, like I was, I wasn't super early into becoming a podcaster, but I was very early in terms of being a fan. And your show was one of the very first that I cottoned on to. And, um, and it's been super inspirational to me.

• 6:02Rich Roll?

  And so it's cool to be here with, you know, somebody who goes all the way back to the beginning. Like I'm, I inherited that legacy and it's made me better at what I do. And now to see you stepping into it, super cool.

• 6:15Speaker 02

  Thank you. I mean, he definitely, definitely explained how important he was to the podcasting community. Um, many times to me and, um, I actually was going to try to attempt to do a podcast alone. And then one day he came up to the kitchen, um, while I was making breakfast. And he was like, um, so I have to be a part of it.

• 6:35Kevin Smith?

  It wasn't, it wasn't quite like that.

• 6:38Speaker 02

  No, it was. He was like, um, I'm gonna be really insulted. I think, no, you, you actually said, you're going to make a mistake if you don't include.

• 6:48Speaker 02

  And so I was like.

• 6:48Kevin Smith?

  That was close to it.

• 6:49Speaker 02

  I was like, all right, here we go. But I'm, I mean, I'm honored and I'm now very excited that we have this together. But he did make sure to explain his importance to the podcasting community, to me, and give his, his own spiel.

• 7:04Kevin Smith?

  What? And I, look, you know how we were talking about like, oh, your, your father created something. I created something at this table, Rich, that I'm kind of wishing right now I'd create it a little differently. Wouldn't call me out in public and tell my secrets.

• 7:19Kevin Smith?

  I did. I was just like, look, kiddo, I was thinking about it. Like, you could totally do a podcast by yourself. And I applaud that. But like, it'd be such a mistake for us not to do it together. I was like, because like, I'm a vegan too. And you flipped me to veganism. Like, your vegan story, like, changed my life. And, and so I know the podcasting space. And I was like, people would love to hear, like, a dad and daughter talking together and stuff like that. I was like, I'm not telling you what to do. But like, there's, there's a marketing hook here that's so.

• 7:49Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 7:50Speaker 02

  You were threatening me a little bit.

• 7:52Kevin Smith?

  I wasn't like, if you don't do a podcast with me, you're out of this house.

• 7:55Rich Roll?

  That doesn't mean he's not right, though.

• 7:57Speaker 02

  No, he was right. And I think, at the time, I was like, um, this is rude. But, um, you know, I then realized how awesome it would be to have it together. But also how cool it is to have the perspective of somebody who's vegan for their health and somebody who's vegan for a completely different reason for animal rights. So it has like, also just proved to be a really good combination for different backstories of why we're vegans. So that's also really cool. But I, I was hesitant at the beginning.

• 8:28Kevin Smith?

  Why? Why were you hesitant?

• 8:29Rich Roll?

  I want to hear more about that, but. My sense is, as somebody who's on the outside looking in, and I'm just meeting you now, is one of the incredible, kind of beautiful benefits of everything that has happened to you with the heart attack and going vegan and all of that, is what's occurred with your relationship. Like, this has really, like, brought you guys close. Like, it's very sweet, you know?

• 8:52Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 8:53Rich Roll?

  That, you know, you got involved with, in this movement because of your daughter and her insistence, and now you're gonna do this podcast. Like, there's just such a, like, a bond there, you know, that you guys can do this stuff together. It's really cool.

• 9:06Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 9:07Rich Roll?

  And I say that somewhat out of, like, I have a 16-year-old daughter, and I'm in that phase right now, and she wants nothing to do with me, you know?

• 9:13Kevin Smith?

  Oh, I was there.

• 9:14Rich Roll?

  I was like, what would it take for my 16-year-old daughter to want to do a podcast with me? I was like, you would have to move heaven and earth.

• 9:20Speaker 02

  I'm nearly 21, so just give it, like, a couple more years. But it has been really cool. It's been really special to be able to do it together. And I didn't really give my dad a choice at all to be vegan. I just, I was insisting upon it, so, but-

• 9:36Kevin Smith?

  That was green rolled. It was like, you're gonna go vegan. I was like, alright, alright.

• 9:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, he didn't have a choice.

• 9:42Rich Roll?

  But initially, right, you said two months or something like that?

• 9:45Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, that's how I posed it. But I was never really gonna let that happen. But I wasn't gonna be like, please, right now, commit to a lifetime of veganism, because I thought I would scare him.

• 9:57Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 9:58Speaker 02

  But I did just kind of pose it as a few months, but, I mean, it's been like two years now.

• 10:06Rich Roll?

  Yeah. I mean, even you couldn't have imagined that he would have, he would become like this, you know, basically, you're now, you're now like the new face of veganism, like it or not, Kevin. Like-

• 10:16Kevin Smith?

  No, but she knew in flipping me that she would, like, he'd be a good get for us.

• 10:21Speaker 02

  I was, I was like, this is important.

• 10:23Kevin Smith?

  She's like, he's got a big mouth, and he's always talking about his interests, and veganism was one of his interests, that's good for me and my community. So she kind of saw, like, the benefit of that. But I, I would like to believe at the heart of it, she was just like, you know, oh my God, I know a way to keep you alive. Like, I had almost died. Clearly because I was ingesting like not just animal food products, but far too many animal food products over the course of a lifetime. So even the nutritionist in the room at that point was like, you know, they a plant-based diet will bring your cholesterol down. And that's where she saw the opening and was like, yes, one of us, one of us. So, you know, I said, look, I ate the way that I ate for 47 years. I'll give this six months.

• 11:07Kevin Smith?

  Like, you know, I can, the least I could do is try your way for six months. And that was two years ago. Let me see, February, March, April, May, June, July. So almost two and a half years ago, two, two years and five months ago. And I haven't missed anything. That's the question I get the most from people about veganism. It's just like, what do you miss, bro? What do you miss? Your daughter's not here. What do you really miss?

• 11:29Rich Roll?

  That's so shady.

• 11:31Kevin Smith?

  Well, because they know that like you're the commissar of all this. They're like, you know, as you said, like he was going vegan for life. So they know like now I have two bosses in life, not just your mother, but also you. So when you're not around, yes, when you're not around, they're like, come on, dude, what do you really think? And I honestly don't miss anything. There's nothing that I'm like, oh, man.

• 11:49Rich Roll?

  That's the thing that people are surprised about because they, they suspect that you're just walking around craving in and out.

• 11:54Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, like your whole life, you're like, I'm living a half or a quarter life where I can't enjoy food anymore. Like we live in California and so they've got this veganism stuff down to a science.

• 12:04Rich Roll?

  It's dialed in.

• 12:05Kevin Smith?

  Really tasty. But even without that, like even if you're just like, look, I can't go to some high-end restaurant where they take a kumquat and turn it into a meatball. So what do I do? Beans and rice, man. Like tastier than most stuff that I ate on the non-vegan side. And like, that's seriously my go-to. Like for the last month, that's all I've been kind of.

• 12:24Rich Roll?

  The last time, the last time I saw you was at the Mercy for Animals gala thing and you, you got up to the podium to give away like the hero award or something. I can't remember what exactly the award was that you gave away, but you said something along the lines of, if somebody had told me if I went vegan, I could, I'd be sitting next to the Joker. I would have done this a long time ago.

• 12:44Kevin Smith?

  A long time ago. Yeah. I don't know if he liked it. Joaquin kind of was like, oh, don't, don't, don't tell them I'm the Joker. As if they didn't know. As if everyone in the room was like, the Joker's here. But yeah, the benefits that come with it, you know, of course, the health benefits are number one for me have been obvious. Like I dropped a bunch of weight. Like in my behind the scenes life where the what's not so obvious is like my body chemistry and I find that out when I go to the doctor all the time. And Dr. Leydenheim is the guy that saved my life, my cardiologist. Every time I've gone for the last, you know, you do six month interval checkups. He's always like, whatever you're doing, keep doing it. And the first time it registered was like when I went vegan for two, I was vegan for two

• 13:29Kevin Smith?

  months. And I went in for like a blood test and he was just like, oh my God, everything is great, except for your cholesterol. And I was like, well, we knew that. That's why I had a heart attack. He goes, no, your cholesterol is in the toilet. Like, what happened? He's like, it dropped out. And I was like, I went vegan. He's going, well, I gotta cut your

• 13:44Rich Roll?

  Cut the meds.

• 13:45Kevin Smith?

  The meds in half because whatever you're doing is really doing the job. And so I've gone back, you know, every six months for another checkup. And the last one I had was right when I got back from the tour. So it was like at the beginning of March, right before everything went into lockdown. And he was just like, your blood work is phenomenal. Like, you know, he's like, and he even said, because Harley always picks at him, because early on, I was like, I'm gonna go vegan. And Dr. Leydenheim was like, you don't have to go vegan. There's nothing wrong with me.

• 14:13Speaker 02

  Which is astounding to me.

• 14:15Kevin Smith?

  He goes, just keep it in moderation. You know, he's like, there's nothing wrong with me. So he later, you know, was like, look, fuck me. Like going vegan was the right move for you. Like, I can clearly tell. So he has since like, tell your daughter she was right, passed on.

• 14:30Rich Roll?

  Where are you, what are the, what's going on with the meds now? Are you still on some meds?

• 14:34Kevin Smith?

  He just cut my blood thinners down substantially. But yeah, I'll be, look, I'll be on blood pressure medication, probably my whole life, just because of my family history at this point, and because I'm, you know, a heart attack. Victim or whatever they call you. Um, so I'll definitely be on blood pressure medication, probably for the rest of my life. Um, whenever I go to like do a physical, like I had to get a physical for Jane Silent Bob reboot. The doctor was like, oh my God, you, you have the blood pressure of a man on blood pressure medication. Well done. I was like, thank you. Um, the blood thinners, the doctor cut down. They put you on blood thinners because they put a stent in my LAD and they don't want the blood to coagulate, block it and then I'm

• 15:19Kevin Smith?

  back in the same situation. So I've been on blood thinners for like two years, but he recently dropped those to like half doses, which is good because like I shave quite frequently and periodically and nick yourself. And when I nicked myself, it was just like a geyser because of the blood thinners and stuff. And then there's a cholesterol blocker where it breaks up the cholesterol that's in my system. And I'm not, I'm certainly not a wizened individual. I can't speak to body chemistry, but the way I understand it, maybe I'm wrong, is the cholesterol that was in my bloodstream will always be in my bloodstream. It doesn't go away. The cholesterol medication that they put me on breaks it down into a, you know, more liquid form, but it's not like, and now it's out of your system. Like

• 16:03Kevin Smith?

  it's still circulates. And why they want it to break down is because when it's hard, the plaque is hard, that's the stuff that travels through your circulatory system can lodge in your brain and give you a stroke. So I don't like, I always like to think like, you know, my cholesterol is gone, but the way I, maybe I'm wrong. I think it stays in you. I think once you've done the damage, the damage is, is done. And at this point, all you can do is not create more damage. Maybe I'm wrong.

• 16:28Rich Roll?

  I don't know. I'm not a doctor.

• 16:30Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, none of us are.

• 16:31Rich Roll?

  We can get Neil Bernard.

• 16:32Kevin Smith?

  Damn it. I was kind of hoping one of you were like, oh yeah, you're fine.

• 16:35Rich Roll?

  But Harley, why don't we, I want to hear more about like your story with this. Cause you, you, you became vegan for ethical reasons when you were quite young, right?

• 16:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:45Rich Roll?

  Your mom's a vegetarian?

• 16:46Speaker 02

  Yeah. My, my mom's a vegetarian. She's been a vegetarian my whole life. Um, so she's definitely had that influence, but it wasn't really, um, I wasn't really aware of her influence until after I went vegan. Um, I just, I, before that I didn't really.

• 17:01Kevin Smith?

  This shit's funny. Cause it's the one thing like, you know, my wife, her mother is always like, she lives in the shadow of, of both me and her daughter, you know, cause we both do public things.

• 17:12Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 17:13Kevin Smith?

  And so, you know, her.

• 17:16Kevin Smith?

  I think the thing she craves most in life is like recognition because she stands in the shadow of two people who get recognition, just sometimes for waking up and stuff like that. So like her, her being an example that set Harley on the road to veganism would mean, and does mean everything to Jen, but the way that Harley puts it where she's like, I didn't really think about it until later on, would break my wife's heart where she's like, why did I do all that?

• 17:43Speaker 02

  I mean, I wasn't aware of her influence though. I always credit her now. And that's why I like, I do always, I'm so vocal about her inspiration to me, but like, it really wasn't something I was aware of because she never was like, hey, you maybe shouldn't eat chicken. Or she wasn't ever trying to push her ideals on me. She was-

• 18:02Kevin Smith?

  Only in milk. Remember, she never gave you milk growing up.

• 18:05Speaker 02

  But I never wanted it. It was so questionable to me anyways, why anyone would want that.

• 18:09Kevin Smith?

  But as a kid, it wouldn't have been questionable.

• 18:10Speaker 02

  No, it was always questionable. I had it once at school and I spit it out because I was like, what is this?

• 18:15Kevin Smith?

  At age what, five or six?

• 18:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:17Kevin Smith?

  Because yeah, but if you were like me, probably like Rich, you would have been raised with milk. It never would have been like, this is disgusting to like, you know, we were just given milk from a young age. Right. It wasn't until I became a grown up, went vegan, stepped out of like, the food industrial complex and the milk industrial complex and was like, it's kind of fucked up that we eat another ass's milk. Like, oh my God, like, it's weird. I just woke up or something. Like, you just got pulled out of the matrix.

• 18:42Speaker 02

  No, mom definitely made me aware of that. And so I, I'm thankful I always had that awareness, but she never said anything about meat or, or any other animal products.

• 18:52Kevin Smith?

  Even though she didn't really eat meat herself?

• 18:54Speaker 02

  No, she never ate meat ever. So I, I didn't, I wasn't aware that she was influencing me, but I think since she is my mother and I'm always going to look up to her, and I looked up to her in so many other ways, I probably subconsciously was inspired by her choice to go vegetarian. I think that did-

• 19:14Speaker 02

  Secretly, subconsciously influenced me, but I just had no idea until later in life because I witnessed my, my mother who raised me not eat meat for 20 years. And so I'm sure somewhere in me, I was like, oh, well, she's been doing it for as long as I'm alive. So I probably can do the same. But so she definitely did influence me. I just wasn't aware of it at the time, but now I definitely do give her all the credit because she, she deserves it.

• 19:45Kevin Smith?

  Somewhere she's rolling a tear.

• 19:46Speaker 02

  I wasn't aware.

• 19:48Kevin Smith?

  Oh, my God, finally, the acknowledgement.

• 19:49Speaker 02

  I wasn't aware. But what really made me go vegetarian at first, I've been vegetarian for over five years, I think now. And I just hit my four year vegan mark in April, but was adopting my, my rabbit. Because when I adopted her, she was fully traumatized before she was surrendered to the shelter I adopted her from. She was being held by hoarders who had like a hundred other rabbits. And she, she was so terrified of all of us. She has a ripped ear.

• 20:26Speaker 02

  She had a bunch of metal stitches that weren't tended to when I adopted her. She was covered in pee. Like she was in a terrible, terrible condition. And she was really standoffish to everybody in our family. At first, when I brought her home, she was really scared of everybody, understandably. And it was really heartbreaking to me because she, she thought I was going to hurt her. And that, that of course, broke my heart because I wanted her to feel safe. So after months of making her know that I was never going to hurt her, none of us were ever going to hurt her, she wasn't ever going to be hurt again. And that I was just showing her so much love and compassion, she transformed into, into a much more open,

• 21:10Speaker 02

  loving creature. And kind of seeing what human compassion could do to an animal, just gave me a new awareness that I had never understood before, where

• 21:24Speaker 02

  Human actions directly affect the animals that we coexist with and.

• 21:30Rich Roll?

  You may not have understood that, but you had it in yourself all along because it takes a very specific person to say, I'm going to take the rabbit that's all beat up from the shelter rather than going to the pet store and getting the rabbit that's all groomed and cute.

• 21:44Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 21:45Rich Roll?

  So that is clearly part of who you are.

• 21:48Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 21:49Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, I mean. Except for our poor dogs growing up, we're like, oh, it took the rabbit. To make you realize animals were important. Thanks.

• 21:56Rich Roll?

  You left the part out that you had dogs.

• 21:57Speaker 02

  I always say that, well, we talked about this recently. But it's because all of, before we knew, before I was aware, before anybody was aware, that it wasn't, it wasn't ethical to purchase an animal rather than adopt. We had bought all our dogs, so they didn't, they didn't know trauma. They, we bought them all when they were babies and they came from a pet store and they were probably not treated well at the pet store, but they were all really young and we paid money for them. Like they, they were, they didn't really know much trauma. Whereas when I adopted my rabbit, she was already two years old and had lived through two years of trauma and had PTSD.

• 22:42Speaker 02

  So like I was surrounded by animals, but they were all, they, they didn't know anything except love and happiness. So like they were great too. They're great.

• 22:53Kevin Smith?

  Somewhere the dog's like, thanks.

• 22:55Speaker 02

  But it wasn't, they definitely, I wasn't going to look at my yellow Labrador and be like, oh, what's your trauma? Like, what have you been through? But I was looking at my rabbit with a torn and half ear who is traumatized and has PTSD and I, I could see that in her and felt something. So yeah, the dogs are awesome too.

• 23:17Kevin Smith?

  Your Labrador is like, my trauma is that I live with a little girl who doesn't love me as much as a rabbit.

• 23:24Rich Roll?

  Yeah. But maybe don't use that calculus when choosing your boyfriend.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  Yeah. Exactly.

• 23:31Rich Roll?

  You have a boyfriend.

• 23:32Kevin Smith?

  She's got a good boyfriend. Yeah, yeah. He came into quarantine with us and he's like a good dude. I know I'm like, as a dad, I'm supposed to be like, I don't like this guy.

• 23:41Speaker 02

  I think you love him.

• 23:43Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, he's a good dude.

• 23:44Speaker 02

  You've said that you love him.

• 23:44Rich Roll?

  You guys are like making some kind of sitcom spoof at home like you're all cramped up. So like, let's make a TV show.

• 23:51Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, TBS is doing this TV show called The Celebrity Show Off, which is a Americanized version of a Korean show called My Little TV, where they get like people who, you know, I hesitate to call myself as like a celebrity, but people who like you might recognize. And there, since we're all stuck at home, they're like, you can't have a crew. We're gonna send you a package. You make a show in your house using what you got. And then every week, people get, you know, voted off like, these are the best ones. This is the one didn't get the most votes. You get kicked off and stuff. It's like a 10 week program contest. Every week that we stay in, like, there's money goes to charity and stuff like that.

• 24:35Kevin Smith?

  So, you know, when they presented it, I was like, um, all right, yes, I mean, I'm home. I got nothing to do.

• 24:40Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 24:41Kevin Smith?

  So, most of the people were doing two camera shows, meaning like, hi, I'm this person and you're in my house and blah, blah, blah. So I was like, well, if everyone's doing that, maybe we'll do something a little different. Like, you know, if I could do anything I want, let's do a little sitcom like, and we'll call it Sun and Lockdown. And it's predicated on like Austin.

• 25:03Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 25:03Kevin Smith?

  Living with us, but like a fictional version of Austin, who's like really tough to take. So it would give me a chance to like, not just be involved with the show, but I can do it with the family. We can all be involved and stuff, have a good time. And so, um, we kind of moved forward with it and it's, it's been interesting, man. Like, the show begins June, I want to say 23rd or something like that, next week on TBS, but they put up the short that we made already online. And I think that's where people, they'll see which ones are popular or not or something. So, working with the kid. Like, I've worked with her before, but working with her boyfriend was nice because we've just spent like, you know, she's, how long you been dating him? Eight, nine months or something like that?

• 25:48Kevin Smith?

  So, I've known him as her boyfriend in that capacity. And then I've known him as somebody who lives in the house over the course of the quarantine. It's completely different when it's like, all right, now let's act.

• 25:57Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 25:58Kevin Smith?

  You know, and so, I think both of us got to like, Spend time with each other in that way where it's like, oh, right on. The last piece of the puzzle.

• 26:08Speaker 02

  That's so interesting to hear you say that because it's so true.

• 26:11Rich Roll?

  He seems nice, but can I direct him?

• 26:13Speaker 02

  That's literally what it is. He's like, can I get something out of you?

• 26:18Kevin Smith?

  It's kind of a.

• 26:19Speaker 02

  What do you bring to my life?

• 26:20Kevin Smith?

  What do you bring to the table? I was like, you, he's funny. You are, oh my God, is that how I care to you?

• 26:25Speaker 02

  That is what it is.

• 26:27Rich Roll?

  Well, her life experiences like.

• 26:28Kevin Smith?

  There's a description for that. Somebody who's like.

• 26:30Rich Roll?

  I act in his projects. We're doing a podcast together. Now we're doing a TV show with my boyfriend. Like, is there any part of my life that's outside of the ask, you know, the view askew universe?

• 26:41Kevin Smith?

  What you missed, though, is a big breakthrough moment. And if we went to therapy, family therapy, that would have been huge where she really broke me down to my essence to be like, oh, he likes him now because he sees that he can be useful.

• 26:54Speaker 02

  It's, it's, it's well known throughout the house. Like.

• 26:58Kevin Smith?

  What do you mean? Other people talk about this?

• 27:00Speaker 02

  Yes, let's just take a moment.

• 27:02Kevin Smith?

  Like my wife, your mom?

• 27:04Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 27:04Rich Roll?

  Oh, this is good. This is like therapy.

• 27:06Speaker 02

  Parents in law.

• 27:07Kevin Smith?

  What they've all said that like.

• 27:09Speaker 02

  I think because, um, how do I say this?

• 27:13Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, step lightly.

• 27:14Speaker 02

  How do I say this? I mean, you definitely liked Austin before, right?

• 27:19Kevin Smith?

  Yes.

• 27:19Speaker 02

  Yes. Um, but there was an absolute new level of acceptance.

• 27:25Kevin Smith?

  Where he was suddenly on my radar.

• 27:26Speaker 02

  He was suddenly not someone who simply lived in our house, but someone you could perhaps love.

• 27:34Speaker 02

  You, that only happened once he gave you something.

• 27:39Kevin Smith?

  Once I was like, oh, he's not, not only is he useful to you, he's useful to me as well. And you love him because he's useful to you.

• 27:46Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 27:46Kevin Smith?

  So now it took me time to be like, oh, I found a use for Austin and now I have Austin as well.

• 27:51Rich Roll?

  But you're, you're actually doing something for him too. Like now the guy's going to be on TV.

• 27:56Kevin Smith?

  Well, but he's, he's.

• 27:57Rich Roll?

  Was he an actor before?

• 27:58Speaker 02

  He's an actor and.

• 27:59Kevin Smith?

  He's been in like, he was in one of scary, scary stories.

• 28:02Speaker 02

  Scary stories to tell in the dark. But he, I mean, he.

• 28:06Kevin Smith?

  Thank you, Rich. That's how I felt. I'm like, I'm putting your boyfriend on television.

• 28:12Kevin Smith?

  And she's like, he's been in a Walmart commercial, bro. I'm like, all right.

• 28:15Speaker 02

  He was really excited because he was like, I mean, is this a secret that you didn't know? We've all been like trying to find a way for you to get closer to Austin because like Nan and Pop, my grandparents, my mom's parents are really close with my boyfriend. Like we've traveled together.

• 28:34Kevin Smith?

  They are quite naturally close. It's a little weird.

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, my pop and my boyfriend play ping pong and like we all play pool together pretty much every night. It's pretty cute and wholesome. But and then my mom has gotten to know him too by him living at our house. And you were kind of the last person where it was like, what? And it's not like, you're not really the type of person who's like, let's, let's sit down and get to know each other.

• 29:03Kevin Smith?

  Unless it's like, unless there's a podcast. It has to be productive.

• 29:08Rich Roll?

  This gets to like a bigger thing, which is that your dad is a closet grinder. I mean, I don't know how much in the closet you are about that. I mean, you kind of like to hold yourself out. I like to watch TV and sit on the couch and I'm lazy and all of that. But like, you have this insane work ethic. I mean, you came off, you make the reboot movie. You do this crazy tour, 60, I don't know how many cities. 65 cities. Then you're in lockdown. When you're in lockdown, you're writing like a bunch of scripts and making this TV show like.

• 29:39Kevin Smith?

  That's out of like fear. That's like, I don't even know if it's a work ethic as much as like, I have to keep making stuff. Because what if this doesn't work? What if this doesn't work? What if this doesn't work?

• 29:48Speaker 02

  You do have a really, really incredible work ethic.

• 29:51Kevin Smith?

  But it's predicated on fear. It's like, I don't ever want to go back to having a real job.

• 29:56Rich Roll?

  Do you still worry? You don't honestly still worry about that.

• 29:59Kevin Smith?

  Sure I do. Oh God, yes, absolutely.

• 30:01Rich Roll?

  You wake up thinking I might have to go get a job.

• 30:03Kevin Smith?

  I mean, every day of my life, I go, this, maybe this is it. This is the last day where they're like, we have no more fucking use for you. You and your silly stories. And I look at my like output and what I do, and it is getting more and more insular. Like, you know, Jay and Silent Bob reboot was a fun movie, but it really helped if you'd seen six, seven other movies prior to that. Next movie I'm probably going to make is Twilight of the Mallrats. It would really help if you saw Mallrats, which came out 25 years ago. I'm working on a show for Netflix, which is Masters of the Universe.

• 30:40Kevin Smith?

  Also comes from IP out of the eighties. Like, everything I do is predicated on the past or my very small world of things. So I always wonder if like, since I'm not really talking about the future, barely the present, but I'm never really like trying to be a Chris Nolan, who's like, I'm gonna make Tenet, man, and like, it's gonna blow your mind. Sooner or later, they're gonna turn around and be like, we'd rather use this space for somebody with new ideas. We don't wanna see Clerks again.

• 31:09Speaker 02

  Is that what you think?

• 31:10Kevin Smith?

  Every day of my life. I don't fret about it, but it's definitely in the back of my head. That's what makes me work, where I'm like, one day I won't be useful to them, and no one will pay me to entertain them, and I'll have to go back to Quick Stop. And I don't wanna do that, because when I go back to Quick Stop, they'll be like, hey, Hollywood, I guess it didn't work out.

• 31:27Rich Roll?

  By time.

• 31:28Kevin Smith?

  Thirty years later. I don't wanna eat crow thirty years after, in fact, Rich.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  By time.

• 31:34Kevin Smith?

  I don't wanna eat crow at all, I'm a vegan.

• 31:36Speaker 02

  When you're done, yes. When you're done, I vow to support you. You don't have to ever go back.

• 31:43Kevin Smith?

  Why do you think we had you? I'm like, let's kid one of these kids that acts, make some of that lucra, and then we could not work ever.

• 31:59Rich Roll?

  You dipped your toe and, you know, you made the Bruce Willis movie, and, you know, you kind of explored that territory, and it was what it was, but, you know, this appreciation for your fanbase and the love that they have for the particular thing that you do that nobody else can do.

• 32:16Kevin Smith?

  Kevin Smith.

• 32:17Rich Roll?

  I think there's, you know, there's, that's beautiful, you know what I mean? Like, you have these, this audience that adores you, you know?

• 32:24Kevin Smith?

  She's laughing because I said Kevin Smith.

• 32:25Rich Roll?

  And the fact that, like, you make these movies, and you do them essentially outside of the studio system, you take it on the road, and you show up for those people in a very real way, like, we were talking before the podcast, you're like, doing these live shows, there's a thousand, fifteen hundred people, whatever, you stay after, you're hugging hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people, like, that tactile, like, one-on-one connection that you have with your audience is... Rare and, and special and the fact that you care about that, I think not only distinguishes you from what people might imagine, you know, somebody of your stature, like Hollywood celebrity, you know, thinks about and cares about.

• 33:05Kevin Smith?

  Let me ask you that.

• 33:06Rich Roll?

  But I think there's more longevity.

• 33:07Kevin Smith?

  Do you think I have a stature?

• 33:08Rich Roll?

  Of course dude. You're big, you're, you're, yeah, you're like, you're, you're, look, come on, your dad's a celebrity, right? Like, people know who he is, they've seen your movies.

• 33:18Kevin Smith?

  But I mean, what is, what does that mean at the end of the day?

• 33:21Rich Roll?

  I don't know. I don't know what it means.

• 33:23Kevin Smith?

  To me, cause I always think about it means, it's like, I'm like, I don't, I'm not saying this, like, I feel old, but it's like, all of it is, it's old stuff.

• 33:30Rich Roll?

  Well, it's, it's, ultimately, it's meaningless, but I guess what I'm getting at is that with that.

• 33:36Kevin Smith?

  Well, I didn't mean that, and now you're really insulting me, Rich. I mean, Clark's meant a lot to me.

• 33:38Rich Roll?

  You know, like, well, you've been around long enough to know what the value of this is.

• 33:42Kevin Smith?

  In a world where you're not saying something new, but always saying something old, or reminding people of something old, how much of a future can one possibly have? And yet, this is the weird conundrum of my life. Even though I'm like, engaged with the past, I'm still functioning in the present. Like, I don't understand why I still have a job or a following, because I haven't said anything new in, in years. Last new thing I said was yoga hosers and everyone was like, shut up! So like, you know, most of my stuff is engineered to things I've done before, or things that have gone by. Even Comic Book Men, the show we had on AMC for seven seasons, was a fun show, but like, at the end of the day, when I looked at that show, I was like, this is also nostalgia and sentimentality.

• 34:27Kevin Smith?

  It's all predicated on people bringing in old things and us sitting around going like, oh my God, I remember having that. So I've come to grips with post-heart attack, that is my role. People are most comfortable with me talking about the past. When I start talking about the future, they're like, hey, tusk boy, maybe not so much the future with you, but we loved the 90s and you were the man back then. So I still am in the 90s business, I think.

• 34:51Rich Roll?

  I don't, I don't think of it in terms of new and old. You know, I think of it in terms of what people love you for and what they care about. Like, You're, you know, you have this, this, you know, kind of, you had this mentorship student relationship with Stan Lee, right? Like, he was your dude. So you could look at him and say, well, everything, you know, all the stuff that he was doing is in the past. It's not, though. It's in the present as well. It's very much part of the consciousness. Like, I don't think that your stuff-

• 35:19Kevin Smith?

  It's true. He was a guy that did his work years before.

• 35:22Rich Roll?

  Look at all this stuff around us. Like, this stuff has been around for decades and decades and decades, but people don't think of it where it falls on a timeline.

• 35:29Kevin Smith?

  And he got to see it embraced by the mainstream. He got to see his creations embraced in two different ways. Once, when he first created him and he had the comic book marketplace to himself, and for years, like, those characters were viable and been in tons of stories. So he got to see that world embrace those characters. But then on top of it, he got to see the rest of the world embrace his characters. Can you imagine? It's like you created Iron Man decades ago, and you thought you've gotten everything you can get out of Iron Man. A bunch of comic books, they did him in as a cartoon, there've been toys. And then one day, somebody's like, "We're gonna redefine this shit. We're gonna bring it into people's real life." So much so that your mother is gonna know who Iron Man is, that it's Tony Stark and stuff.

• 36:10Kevin Smith?

  All of the dude's work got a brand-new lease on life, and he was here to appreciate it. And not only that, they stuck him into every one of those movies so that people would play this Where's Waldo game of like, "See that guy? That's Stan Lee. He created these characters and stuff." Nobody, nobody gets to enjoy it that good twice in a lifetime. That's how special that man was, how beautiful he was, because it, good things only come to people that deserve it. And that dude had two brilliant lifetimes where everyone stood up and was like, "You are the man." In two completely different eras. He lived long enough, he was 95, 96, almost, when he died. But in two completely different eras, he was celebrated by two completely different audiences, all-encompassing audiences.

• 36:53Kevin Smith?

  I always, that takes my breath away. I loved when The Last One came out, when Endgame came out, and the first thing they put up was the Marvel logo that was nothing but Stan Lee's shots from all those Marvel movies, and at the end it said, "Thank you, Stan." Like, you heard fucking people sobbing in a theater for an old man who told them some stories a few years ago. Like, to have that kind of impact in a life- One could only dream about being that guy. So, believe me, when I was ever, whenever I was with Stan, I always kept an open ear and an open eye because I'd love to be that guy. I'll never be that guy. He created like some legit characters that make billions of bucks. He created like, you know, Iron Man, Spider-Man, co-created. I created Jane Zollbob. So, there's worlds apart, of course.

• 37:37Kevin Smith?

  But even in, just in terms of creating something and standing by it, he was also my role model. He was the guy that would tub-thump for comics. Like, I remember, nine years old, my father waking me up and being like, "Come in, come, come watch Good Morning America. Spider-Man's dad is on TV." And I knew exactly who he meant, and it was the first time I laid eyes on him. And here was a grown-ass adult, you know, I'm a child at this point. He's a grown-ass man on television. And whenever I see television, the grown-ups generally speaking about grown-up shit. Here's a grown-ass man on television talking about shit that was of interest to me. Talking about Spider-Man, talking about comic books, talking about superheroes. I fell in love, like, at an early age where I'm like, "That's who I want to be when I grow up."

• 38:18Kevin Smith?

  Like, if this guy, he can make it work. Every adult I knew was so serious and so earnest and so grew up. They had to. They had the weight of the world on their shoulders, trying to support families and stuff. Here was an adult, seemed like a grandfather figure, who talked in joyous terms about the shit that meant something to you. So, I was so happy to see, across the spectrum of his life, particularly in the last 20 years, that the whole world knew his name. Everybody knew this guy's name at the end of the day. In the comic book community, he was a god to us. We all knew his name. That was Stan. That the whole world embraced that guy? That meant everything. It meant everything to him. He went out there. You want to talk about a work ethic? Jesus, that guy was 95 years old. He'd get up, he'd have a full schedule of things to do.

• 39:03Kevin Smith?

  And, you know, maybe one of them had to do with making money. The rest of them had to do with making people happy. So, if I can live long enough where I can be that functionary, you know what I'm saying? Like, just like Stan, his best creative days were in the early days, and then he spent the rest of his career talking about that time and being an ambassador for comics in general? That would be a way to go for me. If I can last in this business as that guy, that'd be amazing.

• 39:25Rich Roll?

  But can you take even a fraction of what you just said and apply it to yourself? Because what I'm saying is... If Stanley came to you on the cusp of, you know, being a god in the comic book world, but not yet embraced by the rest of the world, if he came to you and said, Kevin, people only care about what I did in the past. Nobody wants to hear about this. What would you say to that guy?

• 39:48Kevin Smith?

  I remember.

• 39:49Rich Roll?

  You say you're insane, right?

• 39:50Kevin Smith?

  I told him he was crazy. On one occasion, we were having a conversation and we were talking about writing. And, you know, Stan was always in Stan mode and he delivered the exactly the person that you hoped to meet when you met Stanley. And, you know, we talked about comics, talked about characters and stuff. I've known him across, you know, almost 25 years. So I got to talk to him about many things. And I remember one day having a conversation where he was talking about feeling like a failure because he had always wanted to write the great American novel. And he's like, and still I haven't done it. And I was like, Stan, like, you overshot the great American novel. You created the great American mythology. You know, most of a book? Fuck a book. You created a religion.

• 40:33Kevin Smith?

  Like, it, look how it's gonna speak for hundreds of years after your passing, my passing? Like, you did write the great American novel and it's a, it's a fucking comic book and you did it again and again.

• 40:46Rich Roll?

  Could he hear that?

• 40:48Kevin Smith?

  Look, Stanley knew exactly who Stanley was. You know, like Stanley created many great characters, but the greatest creation of Stanley was Stan, Stanley himself. Stanley Lieber created Stanley and wore Stanley like a costume, like that sweater he would put on. So I guarantee you that Stan knew exactly that he had overshot the book. But, you know, we're creatives. At the end of the day, take everything away. Stan is a creative and was a creative and a creative has an ego. And an ego likes to be stroked. So in that moment, Stan was just like, I didn't write the great American novel. And then looking to me and I was like, oh, but Stan, you did so much more. And he was like, you're right, Kevin, you're right.

• 41:36Kevin Smith?

  How have, this is, we rarely get a chance to do this. How has your journey been? I, I had mentioned at the beginning of the podcast, like, how well traveled that episode I, I did was. How I found as I went out in the world. When I went on the reboot roadshow tour, a lot of the people who I saw afterwards during the VIP experience, people come and take pictures with you backstage and stuff. Like, I loved you on Rich Roll. Like, you know, and some people, of course, like, they look healthy and stuff. So you're like, oh, that makes sense. But just in general, man, like, how have you found functioning now in the real world? Like, for lack of a better description, you're, you're, you're famous.

• 42:11Rich Roll?

  Harley, you see what he's doing right now? You did exactly like the standing thing, you know what I mean?

• 42:17Speaker 02

  I know, I know.

• 42:18Rich Roll?

  Two things, you, you just did exactly, you just illustrated the story you just told. And, uh, and, uh, being a true podcast host, you're trying to flip it.

• 42:28Kevin Smith?

  Oh, my God. I'm always more comfortable.

• 42:30Rich Roll?

  So I'll indulge you for a second. We're gonna turn it back on you. Very kind of you, thank you. It's wild, you know, this medium is so much more powerful than I would have ever imagined getting into it.

• 42:41Kevin Smith?

  What about during quarantine? Have you found more activity or interactivity or less interactivity with the shows since we've all been on lockdown?

• 42:48Rich Roll?

  Um, it's, it's remained pretty much consistent. There's a little bit of a dip. I mean, people's listening habits change because they're not commuting and they're not going to the gym.

• 42:58Kevin Smith?

  Oh, is that right? See, I would have put it the other way where it's just like, everyone's got more free time. You're like, I'll listen to this, but you're right.

• 43:04Rich Roll?

  But they have their habits, you know, they have their habits and their schedules. So that's, that's been a little bit of a shift. And then we all had to kind of go and do Zoom calls and all that kind of junk. Harley and I were talking about that ahead of time and I was like, done with that. So here we are.

• 43:17Kevin Smith?

  The delay is always.

• 43:18Rich Roll?

  We got the antibody test, though, we're all healthy.

• 43:20Kevin Smith?

  We did, I'm wearing a Band-Aid because we got an antibody test, um, which was A, good to have, but B, depressing to learn that I have not had COVID yet.

• 43:28Rich Roll?

  You were convinced, both of you convinced that you had it. It's crazy that you didn't after going to all those cities.

• 43:34Kevin Smith?

  Lot of, lot of interactivity with a lot of different folks and a lot of different weather climates. And, you know, now they're saying that like, The, you know, we, we keep marking, uh, you know, COVID coming into the country from late February into March. They're saying now, some cases, they believe predate the end of the year.

• 43:53Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 43:53Kevin Smith?

  Like, you know, there was a, I think the Hollywood Reporter did a piece on, there were a bunch of people sick at Sundance in January.

• 44:00Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 44:01Kevin Smith?

  And a lot of these symptoms were the same. I was there, you know, I remember interviewing, what's her name? Um, uh, Julia Louis-Dreyfus. And she was like really sick, but like she was trying to soldier through for the movie she was there for. So it might have gone back as far as that. So I, I would have been sure that somewhere along the lines that I had it, although not as bad as, you know, we've, we've seen other cases, but apparently not. So we're ripe for the taking. And, you know, based on the news reading this morning, we should all be staying inside a lot longer. I know.

• 44:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, after this, we'll go home and not leave for a long time.

• 44:36Kevin Smith?

  I had to actually be like, we're, we're talking about going to do this at Sideshow because I'm engaging in the world. I'm wearing a mask when I go out and stuff, but I've gone to do stuff still and maintained like streaming schedules and, but Harley has really treated lockdown very, very seriously.

• 44:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:51Rich Roll?

  How has it been for you? It's been, it's been really hard for my kids.

• 44:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. I think, I think the most difficult part is that, um, I just feel so protective over my grandparents and they, they live with us and, um, I just can't bear the thought of one of my actions leading them to suffer from COVID. Um, so I'm not really scared. I, I really genuinely thought I had it because I did get sick at the beginning, right after we got back from New Orleans, went right after Mardi Gras, we were there the day after. So, and I did get sick, so I really thought that I must've had it. Um.

• 45:32Rich Roll?

  The test was like a good news, bad news.

• 45:34Speaker 02

  I know, and I'm kind of like, well, fuck.

• 45:35Kevin Smith?

  Real let down, like, damn it.

• 45:38Speaker 02

  I know, I'm like, oh my god.

• 45:39Kevin Smith?

  I wish I'd been sick.

• 45:40Speaker 02

  But it's, I'm not scared about myself getting it or, or my boyfriend. I am kind of scared about my dad. Because of your heart.

• 45:49Kevin Smith?

  Yeah.

• 45:49Speaker 02

  He's not scared, but I.

• 45:53Kevin Smith?

  I kept hearing about like young people and old people. I'm like, well, I'm right in the middle. And then they're like, it's also people who suffer from things. I'm like, I don't suffer from anything. And they're like, it's also people who've had heart attacks, you idiot. I'm like, oh, wait, that's me. I've had one of those.

• 46:04Speaker 02

  I feel really protective over everybody else and I can't control my dad. So he does go out, he's safe, but like, I can't. If I had a choice, I would be like, please stay home.

• 46:16Kevin Smith?

  We got in one of our only fights.

• 46:18Speaker 02

  Yes, we got in a very big fight.

• 46:20Kevin Smith?

  Cause you wanted to leave and.

• 46:21Speaker 02

  Because he had his friend over.

• 46:23Kevin Smith?

  Came over to record a podcast.

• 46:26Speaker 02

  Because a friend of his, do you want to mention, flew across the country, didn't get tested, came to our house the day after. Like after flying, after coming from New Jersey, which was initially.

• 46:39Kevin Smith?

  Michigan.

• 46:39Speaker 02

  Was he coming?

• 46:40Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, he lives in Michigan.

• 46:40Speaker 02

  Whatever. He was flying.

• 46:44Speaker 02

  And then he came to our house the day after and I was so mad. I.

• 46:50Kevin Smith?

  At first she gave me the silent treatment.

• 46:52Speaker 02

  I ignored him. I ignored him. I saw him like we were going on this, this walking route every day. We would go sometimes together, but sometimes at different times. And my boyfriend and I were coming back home while him and his friend were going up the hill and I just.

• 47:12Kevin Smith?

  She didn't even talk to me.

• 47:13Speaker 02

  I just ignored him.

• 47:16Kevin Smith?

  When I got home, I was like, she gave me the silent treatment.

• 47:18Speaker 02

  I was just so upset because I like.

• 47:21Kevin Smith?

  She decayed me. She's like, don't know. Don't even look at me. It's like I gave you life.

• 47:26Speaker 02

  I was just so protective over my grandparents and it was scaring me so much. And I could pretty much ensure that they weren't gonna leave at all. They had like one doctor's appointment that they had to go to, but other than that, they were home and I could like sanitize everything that came into the house for a while. Yeah, I was, it was very much controlling the environment. And then my dad just brought this whole other factor in which I was like, what the fuck? This is so. This, well, I, I just felt so blindsided and so betrayed and.

• 48:00Kevin Smith?

  It was, she was very like, she wrote this text, group text to the family. About me where I was like, um, you could have just talked.

• 48:08Speaker 02

  It was really bad. It was really bad. It was like a week long fight.

• 48:11Rich Roll?

  That's your job, you know, until your parents are, are knuckleheads and don't know what they're doing. Like this is supposed to happen.

• 48:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:18Rich Roll?

  But I think it's also like very confusing. There's, the goalposts are always moving. You know, the, the information that we're getting is always changing and, you know, we can always default to being as protective as possible. And obviously it's much more heightened for you, having your grandparents there and the stakes are a lot higher. But you go out into the world and it's like, some people are in masks, some people aren't. Some people are pretending like nothing's going on and some people are all freaked out and.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  It's crazy.

• 48:45Rich Roll?

  That creates tension and all kinds of weirdness out there. And then meanwhile, just down the street from you guys, there's thousands of people pouring out into the street, you know, celebrating and protesting.

• 48:54Kevin Smith?

  We were, we were three of them at one point. We joined the Hollywood march, the first march that they did in Hollywood. Which was probably, I guess about two weeks ago now.

• 49:03Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 49:03Kevin Smith?

  Um, and that was, it was so weird because after like being careful and all that, like suddenly you're so seized by the moment. You're just like, forget it. Let's go.

• 49:12Speaker 02

  It was such a weird thing because the protests were going on for probably four or five days before the one that we went to. And my boyfriend and I were having a really difficult time because we wanted to be there so badly from the start. But then we kept saying, no, we can't because what then like this quarantine would be thrown out the window. We could just be exposed to thousands of people.

• 49:36Rich Roll?

  All that, all that work we did.

• 49:38Speaker 02

  Yeah. And bring it back to my grandparents in one, in like one day. But then my grandparents were going to Nevada. They just got a house there. So they were going there, um, the next day. So my dad, my boyfriend and I decided to go. Like, since we knew they weren't gonna be home. Um, but it was just, it's just such complicated feelings about it too, because everything's reopening right now and it's really hard to process because you see so many people like in restaurants again. But you also see the news and see that there are so many cases still. So it's just all very hard to process and very confusing.

• 50:18Kevin Smith?

  The other day you were like, I'm thinking about going to Crossroads. Did you go or no?

• 50:21Speaker 02

  No, I didn't, because it's just so weird.

• 50:24Rich Roll?

  I knew they reopened.

• 50:25Speaker 02

  They reopened and I wanna go, but at the same time, I'm like.

• 50:28Kevin Smith?

  Believe me, we kept Crossroads in business during the quarantine. We got a lot of our money. She was like, I'm thinking about going to Crossroads. It was like, you have went to Crossroads every night at our own house for the last three months.

• 50:39Speaker 02

  We were very big supporters of Crossroads. But I, I don't know, it's just so weird and very, it's hard for my mind to process. Like seeing everybody out as if nothing ever really happened and people eating in restaurants and, and gyms are opening and stuff and it's just very weird to process. So I, I was gonna go to Crossroads the other day, but then I was like, well, I could, or I could just stay home.

• 51:06Kevin Smith?

  Do you miss restaurant eating? I don't. Like, I, I still eat, so it's not like I haven't eaten in three months.

• 51:12Rich Roll?

  I, I just, I miss being with people without being tentative around it. It's like, when are we gonna, you know, it's not necessarily the restaurant itself. It's like, when, when can we just walk into an establishment and sit down and hang out with our friends without thinking about like, am I getting sick right now? Or am I making somebody else sick? Or being worried about washing your hands and all that kind? I mean, is it, what's it gonna take before?

• 51:35Kevin Smith?

  About two years and a vaccine, probably. Life has changed irrevocably. And I know like, naturally, we're, as a country, as a species, we're like, knock us down, we'll get right back up, but like. As we're seeing, as numbers continue to go up in these states that have opened early, like, this is no joke. Can't, just because like other crises have popped up and stuff, you can't diminish this one. Just because the government is going like, no, feel free, open up. You can't diminish this. Numbers continue to rise. I just read a story today about a bunch of cats in Florida, one of them a nurse, who was just like, we all went out to a bar, all 16 of us, got diagnosed with COVID two days later.

• 52:14Rich Roll?

  I read that same story.

• 52:14Kevin Smith?

  And she's like, I'm, I regret it. She's like, I'm stupid. I shouldn't have done it. Like, we all took off masks. We did not social distance. I should have known better. Now, I'm paying for it. So she was urging others to take it more seriously.

• 52:25Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 52:26Kevin Smith?

  So, yeah, even though the guidelines are like, hey, we can go out now. Like, although tonight, we're doing a thing, a streaming event for, we got a pop-up.

• 52:35Rich Roll?

  Yeah, this Moody's, right? Yeah, tell me about this.

• 52:38Kevin Smith?

  So like, we got in, in the movies, a fake fast food joint called Movies, which was first introduced in a movie I called, a movie I made called Dogma. Then we put it in Jane and Silent Bob Strike Back. It was also in Clerks Two, and most recently, it was in Jane and Silent Bob Reboot. So these cats in town, who've done theme restaurants, Derek Berry is genius. Comes out of Chicago. They did in Chicago this Saved by the Max pop-up restaurant. So on the TV show Saved by the Bell, they would hang out at the Max diner. They recreated it. And so people were like, this is great. So he took it to Los Angeles and moved out here, Derek did, and started another restaurant, like, took, rented

• 53:19Kevin Smith?

  the space, refurbished it, turned it into the Max, did that for a couple of months, then closed it for a month, then reopened it as Good Burger from like the movie, the Nickelodeon sketch comedy, all that. And then closed it and then reopened it as Pollos Hermanos from Breaking Bad. So he's in this theme restaurant business where he flips the theme every few months. So he reached out and was like, what if we did Movies? Because they were supposed to be doing something for Clueless, because it was Clueless's 25th anniversary, and then Paramount, I guess, you know, because the quarantine was about to happen, like, we're not doing this. And they walked away. So he had an open window, and he's like, you got a fast food joint. What about Movies?

• 54:02Kevin Smith?

  So we knew we couldn't open the restaurants, nobody going out, nobody allowed to go out. But food delivery was still a thing. So Derek was like, what if we did like a Happy Meal box, like movie meals and stuff, and we can donate all the money that we make, you know, because it'll be like an advertisement for us eventually doing the pop-up restaurant. So a teaser to see how it plays. We donate all the money to a charity. It was called No Us Without You, which was a charity for restaurant workers that were now without jobs because of the quarantine and stuff. So it was wind went across the board. And then the only thing I said was like, can we do vegan option? Because I'm vegan. He's like, yeah, we do whatever we're doing. We'll do a vegan version of it. So we offered this movie meal, which was like, he'd been

• 54:44Kevin Smith?

  working with Secret Lasagna, the restaurant, a chef named Chef Royce. So he was like, we're with Secret Lasagna. Can you work lasagna? And so I was like, you take lasagna, put it between two pieces of bread. That's a lasagna sandwich. That's in the meal. He's like, all right, what else? And I was like, you put hater tots in, because they were just in Jane's Son Bob reboot, tater tots. And you put chocolate covered pretzels in there, and that's for Mallrats. I'll sign a card and bam, that's, that'll be it. So we opened, and first we were on Postmates, and then we crashed the app twice, LA Postmates, because people were hitting it so hard. Postmates very politely asked us to leave

• 55:24Kevin Smith?

  because we couldn't do it correctly. And so we went to another reservation system where they wouldn't deliver. They could come and pick it up at a point at a time. So now, this is like, this was last month, and it went really well. And, and we raised like 10 grand, I think it was, really wonderful. But a great indicator that if we actually do the pop-up version, people will come. So Derek and his crew, Floyd is his art director, went into their space and completely turned it into what looks like one of the movies from one of the features I've done. You can see like in the place, there's a quick stop, like exterior and an RST exterior from Clerks, the movie I made. There's some Mallrats exteriors, like photograph city. It's selfie city all around the place.

• 56:07Kevin Smith?

  So the way it is now is we open officially tomorrow. You can't just walk up to it. You can walk up to it and look through the windows, but you can't just walk in. Reservation system only. Go to moviespopup.com. They give you a time and a reservation. You pick your entire meal. It's almost a cashless exchange. You could do it all completely online so that you show up. You got your number, you're good to go. While you're there, you could do all the selfies you want. We have a patio, so if you want to eat outside, you can. There's no dining in the restaurant because of the quarantine and stuff. But you can take the food home, of course. But you can come and spend as long as you want, and then you're off.

• 56:44Rich Roll?

  How long is that gonna be open for?

• 56:45Kevin Smith?

  Like, he says that they do them for like one to two months based on popularity. So it'll only be there, I figure, max, like for like two months.

• 56:53Rich Roll?

  But it sounds like it's super popular. Why not just keep it rolling?

• 56:57Kevin Smith?

  Because that's honestly, like, to me, I was like, as a, as a business person or somebody, you know, fancies himself in business, I'm like, if it's selling so well, just keep doing it. But Derek's point is like, like, look, I love what we're doing.

• 57:12Rich Roll?

  It's the limited run that.

• 57:13Kevin Smith?

  That's what makes it for him. He's like, that's what makes it exciting. Like, they get to switch kitchens, chefs, menus, concepts. And then his entire crew gets to artistically express themselves as they remake the restaurant into something else. So I get it, like, on one level, I'm like, hey, if it's working, let's make it real. But on the other hand, that's not what he does. He's like, for me, the fun of the job is like, it changes all the time. He's like, just like in your world. He's like, you don't work on Clerks every day. He's like, you did it, and then you do other things.

• 57:44Rich Roll?

  But you do, when this is done, maybe.

• 57:46Kevin Smith?

  I told him, you're wrong, Derek. I still work on Clerks. I'm sure that's the last, the last word I'll utter as I die. Just like, you know, how Citizen Kane was like, but I'll be like, I made Clerks, and then die.

• 58:09Rich Roll?

  It's gotta be wild reflecting on the fact that, you know, when Clerks came out, that was a very special time in independent film. You know, that, like, this big Sundance era where these auteurs were, you know, emerging, the Soderberghs, and of course, Tarantino, right? And then for you to like, work on like, this incredible movie with him. I mean, it has to be a great point of pride for you, but what was that experience like for you, Harley, working with Quentin? Like, what do we not know about that mad genius?

• 58:40Speaker 02

  I mean, it was, it was a mind blowing experience. I, I thought it was completely off the table because I, I had auditioned for it. And the audition was really. Different from most, you had the opportunity to write your own monologue from the perspective of someone from the Manson family.

• 59:02Kevin Smith?

  How weird is that? Because we all think of him as the greatest writer. Like, and so you would imagine like, well, you're gonna audition with like a monologue from a Quentin Tarantino movie.

• 59:12Rich Roll?

  Or he'll give you a notebook with a like a 50 page

• 59:15Kevin Smith?

  But he's so secretive about it that it stands to reason that he's like, I'm not gonna give you anything.

• 59:21Speaker 02

  Well, he did, he gave you a real scene that was in the movie.

• 59:24Kevin Smith?

  Did he really?

• 59:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:26Kevin Smith?

  So you saw pages of the movie before?

• 59:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, the part with.

• 59:29Kevin Smith?

  Did you have to sign like an NDA?

• 59:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, I had to, at first, I went to the casting office and usually for every audition, you just get all the information, all the scripts or the sides, or the audition papers, rather, it's all online, like you just get it sent through email and a lot of the time, if it's really secretive, they'll write your name across it, like Harley Quinn Smith, so you can't share it. But for this, and it's the only time I've ever had to do this, you had to go in like a week or a few days before the actual audition, sign like many papers, and then they would hand you one set of sides, which was the one scene, which is actually in the movie.

• 1:00:13Speaker 02

  And then they also told me that I had the option to write my own monologue. So I've been writing for my whole life and so I felt, I felt an obligation to, to definitely participate in that option. So I ended up doing both and, I mean, it went really well and I was really proud of myself, but like it, months passed by and I didn't hear anything, so I was like, oh, well, okay.

• 1:00:42Kevin Smith?

  No, no.

• 1:00:43Speaker 02

  Okay, I was really bummed.

• 1:00:45Kevin Smith?

  I wish it was, oh, well, okay, but it was.

• 1:00:49Speaker 02

  I was very upset. I mean, I was upset. I was, I was upset because that, that was one of the most insane opportunities I've ever had.

• 1:00:58Rich Roll?

  You wanted it bad.

• 1:00:59Speaker 02

  Just to even audition for it. And like, I, I just, I, I felt so, so passionate about it. And, um, but months passed and I didn't hear anything. And I knew they started to film, so I was like, okay, well, my ship has for sure.

• 1:01:15Rich Roll?

  They'd already started to film.

• 1:01:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, they started to film because it was, uh, it was, uh, I can't remember how many days. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure it was over a hundred days of shooting, if not more. But, um.

• 1:01:28Rich Roll?

  It's easily four months right there.

• 1:01:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was really long. And then, um, one day I actually, my mom heard through her friend who was involved in the movie. And she was like, why didn't you tell me Harley's in this movie? And my mom was like, no, she's not. And her friend was like, she's on the call sheet. I, I, I see her like she's on here. And my mom was called me and was like, what the fuck? Why didn't you tell me? And my dad and I were together that day. We had just shot the first episode of this show called DC Daily. It was that same day. And I was driving home and my mom was calling me very chaotically over the phone.

• 1:02:13Speaker 02

  And like yelling at me and I was like, I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I, I'm, this movie has been shooting. I'm, I'm not in it. Um, and then my, I called my manager and I was like, I, I mean, I don't think this is true, but do you have any idea what this is about? And she was like, um, well, I, I didn't want to tell you, but for like the past two or three weeks, I have been talking to casting because they told me that Quentin really wants to find a way to put you in the film. And I was like, why didn't you tell me? And she was like, but I, I didn't hear anything was for sure. So I, I don't know what this is about.

• 1:02:55Speaker 02

  And then, um, the next day she called me and she was like, I don't know what's happening, but whatever you heard is right, you're, you're going to be in it.

• 1:03:03Rich Roll?

  That's so crazy that. You're on the call sheet and nobody had called you to.

• 1:03:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, I know. It was, it was just such a weird.

• 1:03:10Kevin Smith?

  Uncalled sheet.

• 1:03:11Rich Roll?

  And they were like, can you be here tomorrow? Like, did it happen quickly? If you were on the call sheet, then I would suspect that.

• 1:03:16Speaker 02

  It was like.

• 1:03:16Rich Roll?

  Shooting must have fallen.

• 1:03:17Kevin Smith?

  It was for a hair.

• 1:03:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was for, it was something involving like costume and hair and hair and makeup. I don't remember how long after that I was shooting, but it was just, it was so unexpected. Like that ship was so far gone in my, in my head.

• 1:03:36Kevin Smith?

  Also caused one of the, well, I was gonna say, one of the only fights, certainly not one of the only fights, but a fight with my wife at the time, cause Harley auditioned and then there was no word back. And you know, Harley was all sad and shit. And Jennifer came into the office one day and she's like, you know Quentin, don't you? And I was like, oh no, not like that. I don't. I was like.

• 1:03:57Speaker 02

  I would have hated you.

• 1:03:58Kevin Smith?

  I said that to her. I would have been mad for forever. I know my daughter, cause I was like, number one, I, I don't have that relationship with him where I can call him up and be like, hey, can you put my kid in your movie? I said, I, I would never do that. And my wife goes, well, you don't make Quentin Tarantino movies, do you? And I was like, that's not the point, man. I said, but number two, imagine I do that. And imagine it worked and imagine she finds out. We're fucked for life. Cause then she didn't earn it. It's something that we did. And so it's not, she'll never be happy. Like you get one moment of happiness where she's like, I got the part. Then when the truth comes out, we're fucked for life. I was like, no, she wants to be in this business. This business is 99% fucking rejection. Everyone gets told no.

• 1:04:43Kevin Smith?

  So let her learn, man. Like this is how you learn whether you want to be in this business. And then she got a fucking yes. And I'm like, she'll never learn.

• 1:04:49Speaker 02

  Well, she, he also like really did not believe in me.

• 1:04:55Speaker 02

  You did.

• 1:04:56Kevin Smith?

  Not for Quentin's movie.

• 1:04:58Speaker 02

  When I got this audition and I was talking about it and I mean, it was such a big thing. It was crazy to even get an audition for this film. He had, he saw definitely less than a hundred people for like every female part in the Manson family and you weren't auditioning for any specific person. It was just a Manson family member. And I told my dad, because it was so exciting and he was like, yeah, you're not gonna.

• 1:05:27Kevin Smith?

  I did not say you're not gonna get it, but I was like kiddo.

• 1:05:31Speaker 02

  Don't get your hopes up.

• 1:05:32Kevin Smith?

  Everybody, I said, you know, cause she was like, there's this movie I really want to be in and I've been reading books about it and I watched a documentary about the subject matter and she's like, have you ever heard of a man named Charles Manson? And I was like, yeah, I think once in the seventies. I'm sure I was like, why do you ask? And she's like, because Quentin Tarantino is making a movie about Charles Manson. And I was like, oh my God. I said kiddo, I want to be in that movie. Like everyone wants to be in that movie. Like you just, you gotta lower your expectations. I literally said, I was like, do like your mom when she married me and lower your expectations, man. Cause that's like a high bar. I said, I just read Jane Fonda said she wanted to be in that movie. So I was like, you know, I'm a parent. I don't want to see her get her heartbroken and I did see it. Like when she didn't get the part, it was misery in that house.

• 1:06:16Kevin Smith?

  So I felt like, you know, put her expectations in check. She could always be in a Kevin Smith movie, but like, you know, most actors are like, I've done that. I don't want to do it. But she got it.

• 1:06:26Rich Roll?

  That movie that everybody wanted.

• 1:06:29Kevin Smith?

  Yes.

• 1:06:30Rich Roll?

  And those scenes.

• 1:06:30Kevin Smith?

  And I felt like a fuck afterwards, cause I'm like, lower your expectations.

• 1:06:34Speaker 02

  That was the dopest part is that like she didn't believe in me.

• 1:06:37Kevin Smith?

  How did I didn't believe in you?

• 1:06:39Speaker 02

  It seemed like it wasn't gonna happen, but then it happened and I was like.

• 1:06:43Rich Roll?

  He's just trying to, he's trying to protect you.

• 1:06:46Kevin Smith?

  Do you remember too, there was a period too, where it didn't seem like it was gonna happen, where I was like, you know what? Fuck Quentin Tarantino. You ain't gotta worry about him. And then when she got the part, I was like, oh my God. This is amazing for both of us. I was so happy because like Quentin, Reservoir Dogs is one of the movies that made me feel like, ooh, I could make a movie and not because I looked at Reservoir Dogs and said, I'll do a jewel heist. I remember seeing the movie at, on Third Avenue in New York City. Wanted to go to see a matinee with my friend Vincent. And it opens, of course, with, you know, them talking about Madonna's song Like a Virgin. So a very unlikely crew of people dissecting pop culture, essentially.

• 1:07:29Kevin Smith?

  And I remember like, that is transformative. I was just like, this counts as a dialogue in a movie? You can literally just talk about some fucking song? Like, if this counts as dialogue, I think I could write dialogue. Cause me and my friends, we sit around, we talk about Star Wars in the same way. So I could draw you a direct line from Reservoir Dogs to Clerks. Um, I could draw you a direct line from Pulp Fiction, which we saw on the Quozette in, in Cannes, like before anybody else. Um, or is it the Shams? No, it's the Quozette. Um, before anybody else at a preview screening for critics and stuff before it was in competition. And that movie shaped what Dogma became.

• 1:08:11Kevin Smith?

  Because Quentin could do these breathtaking changes in tone. Where you could be laughing and then he could shoot Marvin's face off. And you're like, shit just got real, you know? So I, the man influenced what I did. And I've, I've met him, of course, and I've known him for, for years. Not like, we're not like super fucking tight, but he was a big fan of, believe it or not, Jane's Silent Bob Strike Back. That was a weird one. Chasing Amy, he absolutely loved. On Charlie Rose, one day, he was like, my favorite movie this year was Chasing Amy. He's like, Kevin Smith took a quantum leap. So he's always been a big figure in my career. To hear her go like, he cast me. Like, that was, that was everything, you know? As a parent, I was proud as fuck, but as a professional, I was like, huh? Like, that's, that's unlikely. So no, I was never like, I don't believe in you.

• 1:08:55Kevin Smith?

  Clearly not, cause I've cast in your shit. But I did say, lower your expectations, man. Like, many people would love to be in a Quentin Tarantino.

• 1:09:03Speaker 02

  It was out of love. It was out of love, but it was really dope to be able to be like, yes.

• 1:09:07Kevin Smith?

  In your face, Silent Bill? And I'm like, bah, fuck me.

• 1:09:12Rich Roll?

  And for people that don't know, I mean, you were, you were on the spawn ranch, part of the Manson family. I mean, those scenes were like so haunting. And I, and when you watch the movie, it doesn't take up a ton of screen time, but it was, that was like a month of shooting, right?

• 1:09:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, we were there for a really long time.

• 1:09:28Rich Roll?

  And you spent a lot of time with the rest of the cast, like creating that family atmosphere.

• 1:09:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was, um, it took a long time to shoot what was on the ranch because everything is on film too. So it takes that just even a bit longer than it would just shooting digitally. So there was that aspect, but also there's just nothing but money and time. So like we all just, there was never any rush. That was like,

• 1:09:55Rich Roll?

  No pressure.

• 1:09:56Speaker 02

  Well, the day's almost over. Maybe we should go faster. Like it was, it was just very so relaxed. And it just really did feel like a summer camp of the sorts. We were all hanging out. We all didn't have our phones. We had to check in our phones every day. So we were all just together and.

• 1:10:13Kevin Smith?

  He don't let you bring phones on his set.

• 1:10:15Rich Roll?

  Wow.

• 1:10:15Kevin Smith?

  I mean, number one, he's making a period piece. So he's like, that wouldn't be there, man. But number two, he's smart. It just, everybody focuses on their work or familial atmosphere. Cause like, you only get that opportunity once. Making a movie is like going to camp. Like every movie is like summer camp. And some summer camps are more fun than others and stuff. But like, it's always this once in a lifetime experience. And while you're doing it, you're like, it's gonna be like this forever. But smart money understands that like, this is a moment in time. Even when you're making a TV show episodically, you think like, oh, this goes on and on and on. It ends. And when it ends, you fucking miss it. Like, cause you realize I have to go back to the real world and shit. Like, I'd rather just make pretend. I'd rather be an artist. I'd rather play for a living.

• 1:11:00Kevin Smith?

  So it's smart that he's like, leave your fucking cell phones off. Number one, it's smart for production. You don't have to worry about people taking pictures and stuff. But number two, it forces everybody to embrace the moment, live in the moment and be like, we're doing this. And this is never gonna happen again, man.

• 1:11:14Speaker 02

  I think every single person too, would be full of regret if after the experience, they were like, Oh, I was on a Quentin Tarantino set and I was not fully immersed in the, in the situation. I was on my phone. Yeah, I would have hated myself. So it definitely provided for a really special atmosphere.

• 1:11:33Kevin Smith?

  And you got, you made friends with like, like a lot of people she's still friends with and stuff. I saw the girl, the girl who gets killed in the pool and spoilers, you know, in the ending and shit.

• 1:11:43Speaker 02

  She's my best friend.

• 1:11:44Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, she's been over at the house.

• 1:11:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, she's.

• 1:11:46Kevin Smith?

  Walked in one day, I was like.

• 1:11:49Kevin Smith?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:11:50Speaker 02

  She's one of my best friends ever. She's vegan too.

• 1:11:53Rich Roll?

  What's it, what's it, uh, what's it like when Brad Pitt shows up?

• 1:11:56Kevin Smith?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:58Speaker 02

  I mean, it's definitely just very, very surreal. Um, but it's, it was also really weird because his, um, his picture double looked like exactly the same as him. So a lot of the time.

• 1:12:10Kevin Smith?

  And he's playing a picture double too.

• 1:12:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was just too, like, I don't have my glasses on. So like, I, it's just, it's just very weird. But, um, there's one part in, in the movie where we're walking across, um, a neighborhood street and, um, Brad and Leo are in a car having this conversation. And then they see us walking and Brad makes contact with, uh, the character pussycat. And it was so weird because just seeing both of them together, like in real life and at the same time. Like, it was just.

• 1:12:48Kevin Smith?

  Look at all that money.

• 1:12:49Speaker 02

  It was just so.

• 1:12:50Kevin Smith?

  So much fame.

• 1:12:51Speaker 02

  Weird. I mean, it's, it's, it is pretty surreal because I feel like both of them are like some of the most mega fa, like that's as hot, that's like, they're on the top of the mega famous list.

• 1:13:04Kevin Smith?

  And it's gotta be this weird experience. Like, for you, it's like, I know what these cats look like. I'm so overly familiar with them from so many movies that they're kind of a part of my life, but they have no idea who I am and that I exist.

• 1:13:16Speaker 02

  100%.

• 1:13:17Kevin Smith?

  And then like suddenly, you know, they're like, hi, how are you? And it's like being spoken to by a movie. Like when a famous person you've never met talks to you, you're like, like, did one of them ever speak at you or to you or like, hello?

• 1:13:30Speaker 02

  Brad did.

• 1:13:31Kevin Smith?

  What did he say? What does a Brad Pitt just say in real life?

• 1:13:34Speaker 02

  Uh, he's very, very nice. I mean, because there was one, there's one.

• 1:13:37Kevin Smith?

  What do you mean nice? Like, just like?

• 1:13:39Speaker 02

  He's like, he's like.

• 1:13:39Kevin Smith?

  Puppies are cute. Like, that kind of nice or?

• 1:13:41Speaker 02

  No, he's just like very friendly and like making jokes and stuff.

• 1:13:45Kevin Smith?

  Really?

• 1:13:46Speaker 02

  He's friendly. He's very friendly. Yeah.

• 1:13:50Kevin Smith?

  So weird. Like even me, I've been in business 26 years.

• 1:13:52Rich Roll?

  Your dad is jealous of you right now.

• 1:13:54Kevin Smith?

  I'm not jealous, but I am like oddly fascinated.

• 1:13:56Speaker 02

  When I shot this.

• 1:13:58Kevin Smith?

  I was jealous because I definitely wanted to know about the story.

• 1:14:00Speaker 02

  There's also, my dad likes to really be a part of everything that I do. And I'm about to be, well, one, the podcast, two, once upon a time in Hollywood. Three, I'm about to be in this show for Freeform called Cruel Summer. And it's based in the 90s and it's my first, it's like my first huge, like I'm a series regular and it's like, I feel so thankful for it. It's like my first big thing, like my first TV show.

• 1:14:32Kevin Smith?

  Here it comes.

• 1:14:33Speaker 02

  And so, but I like, I've worked, I know, I've worked very hard. Like I have worked very hard for this. I have gone through a lot of pain as all actors do, like put in the work and I got this and I'm very proud to say of fully on my own. Like I very much don't want my dad to be a part of my acting career because I wanted to be completely separate from him. I've made that extremely clear, except for the films we make together, everything else, everything else I like is fully mine and I got it on my own and I pride myself a lot on that. So I get my show and my dad is like, I'm going to be on your show. I'm going to find a way to get myself on the show.

• 1:15:15Speaker 02

  It's based in the 90s and I'm a 90s icon and I'm going to be on the show. And I was like, fuck no, there's literally no way. I will leave. I will, I will be so upset and feel so just betrayed by the show.

• 1:15:26Kevin Smith?

  My face hurts.

• 1:15:28Rich Roll?

  Couldn't help yourself.

• 1:15:29Speaker 02

  And then he was like, I'm going to direct one. I'm going to be myself in one. And like, I was like, just step away.

• 1:15:34Kevin Smith?

  I want to be able to be like, she's wrong, but I believe I did use the term, I am a 90s icon.

• 1:15:39Speaker 02

  No, he did. And it makes sense because it is, it is in the 90s. It's, it's based on, it spans three years and it's from 93 to 95. And if I'm not mistaken, didn't Clerks come out in one of those years?

• 1:15:51Kevin Smith?

  94.

• 1:15:52Rich Roll?

  For people who are listening, Kevin looks so constipated right now.

• 1:15:57Kevin Smith?

  I'm like,

• 1:15:58Speaker 02

  I'm sure there will be a reference. I'm sure there will be a reference at some point.

• 1:16:02Kevin Smith?

  It's gotta be, right?

• 1:16:04Speaker 02

  But I just would feel better if you didn't have to be in it.

• 1:16:09Rich Roll?

  But this is the father-daughter dynamic in a nutshell. It's like the daughter trying to break free and fly, and the dad holding on to every last bit that he can to keep her.

• 1:16:19Kevin Smith?

  It's still unfair, everything I do. I'm like, oh, do you want to come be in? And she's like, sure. And then I'm like, what are you doing? Can I be in? And she goes, fuck off, old man. This is young people's entertainment.

• 1:16:27Speaker 02

  I've had, I've had, like, I mean, I, I've so lucky in a sense that I've, I, since my dad has been in this industry for a long time, I did have like my foot in the door to have contacts with like agents and stuff like that. But I also, in a sense, it like, people always are like, oh, you just have an acting career because of nepotism, which is like, yes, I be, I had a foot in the door because of nepotism for sure. But I've had to face so much, like, a whole different set of issues of people just, um, pre, having prejudgments about me and just thinking, not really thinking of myself, not thinking of me as my own person,

• 1:17:12Speaker 02

  and just thinking of my, uh, me as an extension of my dad. And so I worked really, really hard to make sure that I am known as my own person for my own talents and my own right and for my own activism and not just as the child of a famous person. So with that being said.

• 1:17:33Kevin Smith?

  Who's the famous person? Do you think I'm famous?

• 1:17:36Speaker 02

  With that being said, the, the path that I have worked very hard to make on my own, that is not related to my dad's success, I have very certain feelings about my dad then referring to himself as a 90s icon and putting himself in the show that I have worked very hard to be a part of.

• 1:17:58Kevin Smith?

  That being said, listen to our new podcast together, Vegan Abattoir.

• 1:18:01Speaker 02

  But that being said.

• 1:18:02Kevin Smith?

  Which I have no problem sharing time on.

• 1:18:05Speaker 02

  That being said, it is, I, I mean, I'm very, I'm so thankful for the things that we do have together. It's just important to me that I also. Make a career of my own that's only based on the work that I've put in.

• 1:18:23Kevin Smith?

  I understand.

• 1:18:24Rich Roll?

  I think your dad knows that.

• 1:18:26Speaker 02

  But of course, I'm very honored to be, to be doing vegan abattoir.

• 1:18:31Kevin Smith?

  I tell you, Rich, it's real heartbreaking the day your kid outgrows you. Mine outgrew me like 15 years ago. She's just been like putting in the time out of a sense of sweetness. I fully respect that.

• 1:18:43Rich Roll?

  I'm jealous of your relationship.

• 1:18:45Kevin Smith?

  It is very sweet. And the, you know, her, her mother, my wife, refers to Harley as like, she's just beardless dickless you.

• 1:18:54Speaker 02

  Which is so hard to hear.

• 1:18:56Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, well, she used to say that. But now she's like her own individual. Like, you know, she used to, Jen would always refer to like Harley as my little twin and stuff like that. And then as Harley grew older, like a lot of her personality or interests and mine are close. You can't grow up in the same fucking house and not pick up some things, right? So her and I are more alike than her and Jennifer.

• 1:19:23Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:23Kevin Smith?

  Which always kind of leaves, you know, Jennifer feeling a little bit on the outside and stuff like that. But like, you know, I, I didn't, Jennifer asked the other day, we were talking about, we were watching some fucking show and somebody had a son. And she was like, did you ever like miss like having a boy, like a son? And I was like, God, no, not at all. Like, I'm, I'm way happy with the kid we got because she's so similar to me. Like, what if we had a boy and he was similar to you? Fuck that. Like, you know, this is, this is like, this has been great for me. Yeah. She was just like, Kevin, why? Why fuck that?

• 1:19:56Rich Roll?

  The fact that, that Harley's been the sideshow a couple of times and you haven't.

• 1:20:00Kevin Smith?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:01Rich Roll?

  You know what I mean?

• 1:20:02Kevin Smith?

  She's living her own life. She's got her own path.

• 1:20:04Speaker 02

  We're, we're super, super similar. We are really similar.

• 1:20:07Kevin Smith?

  But doing, doing the podcast together has been, being vegan together has been

• 1:20:12Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 1:20:12Kevin Smith?

  fun. That has been the one thing like where everyone else in our house is vegetarian. Nan and Pop, Jen, her mom, my wife, but her and I are the only true like plant-based vegan. So we have that. Kind of like, hey, man, do you want to go to, you want to go to Crossroads? Hey, man, you want to order from Cruiser? Hey, man, like, we speak that same language. We've always been very similar in other ways and stuff. But now there's that as well, which has been kind of adorable, but also beneficial. Like, she literally saved my life by being like, come do this, come do this. And like, every time I pop something in my mouth that's plant-based, which is every time I pop something into my mouth,

• 1:20:54Kevin Smith?

  I generally think like, I wouldn't have been here were it not for her. And not just for her going, please do this. She was a vegan astronaut. She'd been like, you know, two years of vegan prior to me. So she was able to case the town and be like, this is where you can get this. This is where you can get this. So I didn't enter into a state of ignorance trying to figure shit out. I had somebody to hold my hand and be like, here, you would, I know you and you would like this. And that made a transition to a plant-based lifestyle much easier. You know, for some people who are like teetering, like, I'd like to do it, but what if I? It's a mystery.

• 1:21:25Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:25Kevin Smith?

  I had somebody who had like, kind of solved the mystery for herself. And so was able to give me information that made me feel way more comfortable about leaving behind forty-seven fucking years of a behavior. Forty-seven years of eating a certain way. So, you know, hats off to you. I, but it all does come back to me because I did have this kid. So, and the kid saved my life. So hats off to me, Rich. I saved my life by having a kid.

• 1:21:49Rich Roll?

  You've kept the weight off, like, it's no small thing, man. It's pretty incredible. And it's really powerful for, um, you know, everybody to see that as well. Like, do you, do people still give you shit about online and stuff like that for being vegan?

• 1:22:02Kevin Smith?

  No, I mean, no, because I'm very clear about like, you know, I'm, I'm a serbic and, and I could be funny about it and shit. But I've kind of dealt with it so many times online where somebody goes at me hardcore on Twitter or in a comment on Instagram. I come back, but not in a way where I'm like, fuck you or you're ignorant, but just come back in a pithy kind of way that makes that comment seem ridiculous and stuff like that. So they've stopped like coming at me like, like that. But the, it's been more beneficial than anything else. Like, for as many people who've been like, oh, you're vegan now, I'm going to eat three times as much meat. They're in the minority. What I hear more often than not is, I went vegan because of you. I lost a bunch of weight because of you. I'm trying this because of you now.

• 1:22:45Kevin Smith?

  The big thing I've been talking about lately is I became, well, I've been since, since I became a vegan, an intermittent faster. Like, you know, I, I was on a pretty much like a 16, eight clock for most of the last two and a half years. Recently, I've gone to a more extreme clock, which is 20 slash four. So 20 hour fast, four hour eating window.

• 1:23:05Rich Roll?

  Every day?

• 1:23:06Kevin Smith?

  Pretty much every damn day, except for the days when I do 72 hour fast, which is fantastic cleanse for the body. Also releases, you know, um, uh, stem cells. Like it's, it's crazy wonderful for the body. A lot of people, conventional wisdom has always been like, no, you can't do that. Your body will eat its muscles and shit. Well, not if you still have stored fat. It goes right to that. And that's what the body's supposed to be doing. We're not meant to be eating three meals a day. That's not been in our genetics for that long and stuff. And as Americans, not only do we eat three meals a day, but those three meals are giant. You gotta eat a big breakfast. I haven't eaten a breakfast in over two years. I don't break my fast until minimum noon, generally two or three o'clock in the day or something. So in talking about IF a bunch,

• 1:23:49Kevin Smith?

  there've been some people like, you don't know what you're doing and stuff. I'm like, no, I don't. But I've definitely been watching a lot of people who know what they're talking about, talk about it on YouTube and stuff. And, you know, they're, they've got enough accreditation where I'm like, yeah, I think I could try it. And I've tried it a number of times where I'm like, I know the benefits of this, this work. So I started sharing like my clock with people where I'm like, oh, Ben, this is my 72 hour of the fast. That's been the new pass along where now I've seen people going, I'm now doing 16, eight. Now I'm, I'm going to try for this. Like, it's, it's, you know, I, I've liked over the last 26 years, being able to be like, hey, I like Batman, go see this. Hey, I like Star Wars. It's really nice to be able to be like.

• 1:24:30Rich Roll?

  You're a health and wellness influencer now.

• 1:24:32Kevin Smith?

  Isn't that nuts?

• 1:24:33Rich Roll?

  Crazy.

• 1:24:33Kevin Smith?

  Like I was in muscle and fitness. Go fucking figure, man. So like, somebody being like, I'm taking health advice from him is foolhardy.

• 1:24:40Rich Roll?

  Crazy Southwest Airlines saga. You know, I remember when that whole thing happened and how bananas that was. But that was really the beginning of this whole thing.

• 1:24:49Kevin Smith?

  A little bit. Yeah. Cause that's why I started putting down sugar after that, where I was like, I gotta get sugar out of my life. But now as a vegan, unfortunately, sugar is well in my life. Cause like, you know, giving up everything else. I'm not like, I'm giving up fucking sugar too. So now, you know, you allow yourself sugar and bread, but I've been able to cut bread out almost, almost completely. I had some bread yesterday, but generally speaking, I don't fuck with bread that much anymore. But sugar? That is like, it's, it's hard to avoid sugar and sugar's still vegan.

• 1:25:19Rich Roll?

  You, you fuck with a lot of vegan junk food.

• 1:25:21Kevin Smith?

  I, yes, I do.

• 1:25:23Rich Roll?

  That's the next mountain you gotta climb.

• 1:25:25Kevin Smith?

  I know, to actually go vegan with, where I'm eating kumquats and some sushi, yes.

• 1:25:29Rich Roll?

  So tell me, uh, tell me about the pot, like, what is the podcast angle? Like, what's this gonna be about?

• 1:25:36Kevin Smith?

  She wanted to do, you know, uh, she wanted to talk to people. Her idea was like, people ask me, and I'm no expert, but I do know people who are experts, so like, maybe I could be a conduit for that. And I was like, oh my god, you could call it vegan abattoir, because like, we'd be slaughtering misinformation. I think that's how I hooked her. She's like, that is actually clever.

• 1:25:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was like, well, I really want that name.

• 1:25:58Kevin Smith?

  So the idea is like, we sit down in the beginning, we chit chat and, and stuff, and it's all, of course, plant-based mostly and stuff, but some about our lives. Then we head into the interview portion of the show. So, uh, so far, she's been like, going to talk to people that she knows from the space. Who were the two people you spoke to? For the two episodes we just did?

• 1:26:16Speaker 02

  I've spoken to my friend Daniela Monet, who is a activist, um, but she also has this, um, cosmetics box that she does with a fellow vegan, Ivana Lynch, and it's a monthly subscription box, and every month, they give you a new box of cruelty-free and vegan cosmetics.

• 1:26:40Rich Roll?

  That's cool.

• 1:26:40Speaker 02

  So it's really awesome, and, um...

• 1:26:42Kevin Smith?

  And who was the other person? The lady from Vegan Street Fair?

• 1:26:44Speaker 02

  Uh, and then I spoke to my friend Jessica Shea, who runs, who is the founder and CEO of Vegan Street Fair.

• 1:26:51Rich Roll?

  Uh huh.

• 1:26:51Speaker 02

  Um, which is, they're, they throw an annual event, which has over 200 vegan vendors. Um, but she also does this thing called Vegan Exchange, which is every Sunday, it's a vegan, it's a vegan farmer's market, basically, which is...

• 1:27:08Rich Roll?

  I knew about that, I knew about the street fair, but...

• 1:27:10Speaker 02

  It's, it, that was life-changing.

• 1:27:12Rich Roll?

  Where does that go down? In Hollywood?

• 1:27:13Speaker 02

  It's, um, it's in North Hollywood, every single Sunday.

• 1:27:16Kevin Smith?

  The, the national, the center?

• 1:27:18Speaker 02

  Oh, the, the federal.

• 1:27:19Kevin Smith?

  The federal. It's like in the parking lot behind the federal.

• 1:27:22Rich Roll?

  Uh huh.

• 1:27:22Kevin Smith?

  And they bring in like, multiple trucks and vendors.

• 1:27:25Speaker 02

  It is life-changing.

• 1:27:27Kevin Smith?

  You get fat going, though.

• 1:27:28Speaker 02

  It's not happening right now, obviously, but it, it's, um... It is truly life changing.

• 1:27:33Kevin Smith?

  They've got, look, they've got real green food there, but it's also a lot of cats like, eat this doughnut, it's vegan.

• 1:27:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:40Kevin Smith?

  Uh, and like, not only is it vegan, but it's a thousand calories and it's amazing.

• 1:27:43Speaker 02

  But it's awesome.

• 1:27:44Kevin Smith?

  You go and you wind up walking out kinda heavy. So the idea is like, we start the show and then we kinda cut to her interviewing somebody and then we talk about it afterwards and wrap up the show.

• 1:27:53Rich Roll?

  That's cool.

• 1:27:54Kevin Smith?

  But the idea is it's for those who are like, you know, the people who go like, what is it like? And, and what do you miss? Those vegan curious people who are kinda teetering is just a little more information, not to like, you know, drag them over or push them over, but if it helps, you know, and since they're asking us on Twitter and Instagram comments and stuff, this is a way to be like, well, we went and spoke to somebody who really knows about this stuff. Like, and you are one of them. You'll be on as well. After we're done with this, we'll sit down and grab you for, you'll be a big get for us, man. You own this space.

• 1:28:29Rich Roll?

  You gotta step up your production game, cause you're used to just sitting down and shooting the shit and being like, I'm done.

• 1:28:34Kevin Smith?

  Chatty.

• 1:28:35Rich Roll?

  Now, there's, there's actually gonna be editing involved in this one.

• 1:28:37Speaker 02

  Oh, it's been a challenge. It has been an actual challenge.

• 1:28:40Kevin Smith?

  For one of us.

• 1:28:41Speaker 02

  For, no, it's for.

• 1:28:42Rich Roll?

  For one.

• 1:28:43Kevin Smith?

  I had to edit your two hour interview. I was like, Harley, talk to your friend for 30 minutes. She comes back with a two hour interview. She's like, is this enough?

• 1:28:49Speaker 02

  I got really invested.

• 1:28:50Kevin Smith?

  Yeah, I guess I'll edit it now.

• 1:28:51Speaker 02

  I was really into the conversation, but whenever we.

• 1:28:53Rich Roll?

  That's your dad, right?

• 1:28:54Speaker 02

  I know.

• 1:28:55Rich Roll?

  Like, you can't, you can't do it in 30 minutes.

• 1:28:56Speaker 02

  I know. It's, yeah, that's how we're really similar. But it like, when we're, when we're recording the, the opening and the ending, it's, we're still trying to find out how to stay on subject and on track.

• 1:29:12Kevin Smith?

  Stay on top, right?

• 1:29:13Speaker 02

  Cause we'll just start talking about something that we, for one of them, I'd spoke about my boyfriend for like, 30 minutes.

• 1:29:20Rich Roll?

  That's maybe the most predictable thing that you've said in this whole podcast.

• 1:29:25Speaker 02

  And we're just really try, we're, we need to figure out how to do it.

• 1:29:29Kevin Smith?

  But it was on topic and as much as he's not strictly vegan, so it was like, how do you find?

• 1:29:34Speaker 02

  He's a new pescatarian, so we've been, we were speaking about that, but it's.

• 1:29:38Rich Roll?

  I think you, you, how many, how many episodes have you recorded already?

• 1:29:42Speaker 02

  Three.

• 1:29:42Kevin Smith?

  Three, and this, the one we get with you will be four.

• 1:29:45Rich Roll?

  Cool. Let it be what it wants to, like, it'll tell you what it wants to be, rather than saying it needs to be like this. Like, I think just in the doing, you'll find what it, what it really wants to be.

• 1:29:55Speaker 02

  That's some really good advice.

• 1:29:57Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:59Rich Roll?

  Cool, man. I think we did it.

• 1:30:04Kevin Smith?

  It just ends so like.

• 1:30:06Rich Roll?

  I don't know. Well, I'm being conscious of your time too. Like, I don't want to.

• 1:30:09Kevin Smith?

  I think it's just I'm, I'm, she's probably used to me and I'm a start guy.

• 1:30:13Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:14Kevin Smith?

  And like, hey, everybody. And then it ends with, and everybody, we're done. Thanks. And this one's just kind of like, no, it happened. You didn't know.

• 1:30:23Rich Roll?

  Just like have a very graceful.

• 1:30:25Kevin Smith?

  It's very vegan, man.

• 1:30:26Speaker 02

  It is really vegan.

• 1:30:29Rich Roll?

  Super nice to have you guys here. I appreciate it.

• 1:30:31Kevin Smith?

  Pleasure. Thanks for having me back.

• 1:30:33Rich Roll?

  Thank you. Vegan Abattoir premiering on.

• 1:30:37Kevin Smith?

  June 26.

• 1:30:38Rich Roll?

  Podcast platforms everywhere, June 26. Very exciting. When's the TV show coming out?

• 1:30:43Speaker 02

  Um, The Cruel Summer?

• 1:30:44Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:45Speaker 02

  Um, next summer, 2021.

• 1:30:48Rich Roll?

  So we gotta wait a while.

• 1:30:49Kevin Smith?

  That's the cool part.

• 1:30:50Rich Roll?

  What else is coming out? You guys have so many projects.

• 1:30:53Speaker 02

  I have a movie that will come out one day. I don't know when it's coming out that I film.

• 1:30:57Rich Roll?

  Stuff you're not allowed to talk about.

• 1:30:59Speaker 02

  Um, I don't know.

• 1:31:00Kevin Smith?

  What is the other movie you did that?

• 1:31:01Speaker 02

  Student Body. That's a film that Austin and I met on. Um, so that will come out one day. I don't know. What about you?

• 1:31:09Kevin Smith?

  Or they can watch us on Celebrity Show Off on TBS.

• 1:31:12Speaker 02

  That's true.

• 1:31:13Kevin Smith?

  Until we get thrown off the show.

• 1:31:14Rich Roll?

  And you're writing like four scripts right now, right?

• 1:31:17Kevin Smith?

  Finished Twilight of the Mallrats. That looks like it's shaping up to be the next flick. And then did another draft of Moose Jaws because Shudder was interested in it. So it looks like that's moving.

• 1:31:25Rich Roll?

  That's like the third in the yoga hosers.

• 1:31:28Kevin Smith?

  The true new. Me heading back to Canada. Fake Canada.

• 1:31:35Rich Roll?

  Awesome, man. You still have the bus?

• 1:31:37Kevin Smith?

  I got rid of the bus, like sold the bus off and stuff, um, which sadly it would come in handy right now.

• 1:31:44Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:44Speaker 02

  It really would come in handy.

• 1:31:45Kevin Smith?

  Now you want a house to move around the country and not leave that.

• 1:31:49Rich Roll?

  Well, get it back.

• 1:31:52Kevin Smith?

  One thing at a time.

• 1:31:54Rich Roll?

  Cool. Thanks so much, you guys. You're welcome here anytime.

• 1:31:56Kevin Smith?

  Damn pleasure.

• 1:31:57Rich Roll?

  So come back and talk to me again.

• 1:31:58Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:31:59Rich Roll?

  All right. Peace. Plants.

• 1:32:04Rich Roll?

  Okay, how adorable is Harley Quinn? I feel like the two of those should just come on the podcast all the time. Super fun. You never know where things are gonna go with Kevin because he's such an amazing conversationalist. He's so verbose, but the guy never fails to entertain and he always drops knowledge. Knowledge, people. Be sure to check out Vegan Abattoir wherever you listen to fine podcasts. Leave them some reviews, maybe a couple of five stars. Let's get those two trending in Podland. You know what to do. Be sure to follow Harley @HarleyQuinnSmith on Instagram. You can find Kevin @ThatKevinSmith on both Instagram and Twitter as well. And yeah, that's it.

• 1:32:49Rich Roll?

  If you'd like to support the work we do here on the show, subscribe, rate and comment on it on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, all the good places. Share the show or your favorite episodes with friends or on social media. And you can support us on Patreon at ritual.com/donate. I want to thank everybody who helped put on today's show. Jason Camiolo for audio engineering, production, show notes and interstitial music. Blake Curtis for videoing today's show, which is available on YouTube. Jessica Miranda for graphics. Davy Greenberg for portraits. DK for advertiser relationships. And the music by Tyler Pyatt, Trapper Pyatt and Hari Mathis. Appreciate you guys. Thanks for the love. See you back here in a couple of days with another, we're planning on it at least, another role on AMA.

• 1:33:34Rich Roll?

  Trying to get a little momentum behind this new format. Hope you guys are enjoying it. Until then, peace. Plants. Namaste.