Bobbi Brown (make-up artist and entrepreneur)

Bobbi Brown (Still Bobbi: A Master Class in Leading an Authentic Life) is a make-up artist, entrepreneur, and author. Bobbi joins the Armchair Expert to discuss why the motto "the less I do, the more I’m me” is her secret to happiness, realizing she wasn’t stupid but that things that are boring don’t interest her, and her tips to a happy 37-year marriage. Bobbi and Dax talk about learning how to design make-up looks by working for film and theater departments in college, making her first lipstick after accidentally meeting a chemist, and that make-up is really about relationships. Bobbi explains why she doesn’t believe in correcting but in enhancing, why it didn’t make sense for her to change what the brand was built on as it grew, and that to her natural beauty is not a trend. Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ http://www.wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, Experts on Expert. I'm Dan Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Mouse.

• 0:06Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 0:07Dax Shepard?

  Hi, we have such a fun woman on today.

• 0:10Speaker 01

  We really do, a legend.

• 0:12Dax Shepard?

  A legend that I was lucky enough to be seated next to at something and I really was charmed by her. Bobby Brown. A lot of Bobby Browns. I think that was my first question to her. How do you deal with the legendary R and B singer Bobby Brown?

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Right, well, you didn't ask that.

• 0:28Dax Shepard?

  His daughter Bobby Brown, Millie Bobby Brown. There's a lot of Bobby Browns in the mix.

• 0:34Speaker 01

  Millie Bobby Brown is Bobby Brown's daughter?

• 0:37Dax Shepard?

  No, Bobby Brown is Whitney Houston and Bobby Brown's daughter. There's four Bobby Browns in this story.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 0:46Dax Shepard?

  Bobby Brown, who is married to Whitney Houston?

• 0:48Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 0:48Dax Shepard?

  Their daughter Bobby Brown? They have a son Bobby Brown as well. Son Bobby Brown.

• 0:53Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 0:53Dax Shepard?

  And then Millie Bobby Brown.

• 0:55Speaker 01

  Separate.

• 0:56Dax Shepard?

  And then Bobby Brown. So that's five.

• 0:58Speaker 01

  I see.

• 0:59Dax Shepard?

  And I guess I asked her if when she shows up for a reservation, they're wondering like, well, which will it be? Okay, Bobby is a world renowned makeup artist, bestselling author, entrepreneur, and founder of Jones Road Beauty. And she is here to talk about her new memoir. Did I do it right?

• 1:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18Dax Shepard?

  Okay, memoir. Called Still Bobby. And gang, I just love her. Big time Laura Laveau vibes for me.

• 1:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, and she's just an epic business woman. We could hear a lot about that. It's really a cool episode.

• 1:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and she's got a for real no shit take on things. Yeah. Please enjoy Bobby Brown. We get support from Quince.

• 1:41Speaker 01

  Okay, can we talk about the fact that the holidays are already here? It's crazy. I feel like I blinked and now we're in gifting season, which I'm not really mad about because I do love giving gifts. And Quince is making it so easy to find something great for everyone on my list, including myself. Because let's be honest, self gifting is a love language.

• 2:01Dax Shepard?

  Quince is seriously the gift that keeps on giving. Their high-quality staples are made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, 14-karat gold, and Italian leather. Full-on luxury quality at prices that won't wreck your holiday budget.

• 2:17Speaker 01

  It's the dream. The cashmere sweater, starting at $60. Down jackets, wool outerwear, cashmere accessories. You and everyone on your list are staying cozy and looking incredible all season long.

• 2:28Dax Shepard?

  Well, I'm gonna tell you this. It just got chilly for the first time this year in California, and I'm so excited. And I'm wearing my Quince cashmere right now.

• 2:35Speaker 01

  It's great.

• 2:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and I am going to gift this to some of my friends. I hope they're not listening.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  Quince is also more than clothing. They've got fine jewelry for your significant other, leather bags for your bestie, hotel-quality bedding to set up your guest rooms, chef-grade cookware. That's an amazing thing they offer here. And it's such a good gift because people don't like buying cookware for themselves, but it's very important. And they also have five-star luggage, another good gift that people don't like buying for themselves.

• 3:02Dax Shepard?

  Give the gift of quality this holiday season. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show. This episode is supported by Helix.

• 3:27Speaker 01

  Okay, can we talk about how November is basically survival mode? Between the holidays, the travel, the hosting, the cooking, the everything. Sleep is the one thing keeping me from completely unraveling.

• 3:38Dax Shepard?

  It really is the foundation. And I think people underestimate how much a bad mattress is quietly ruining their day. You wake up stiff, your back's angry, you're already behind before your feet hit the floor.

• 3:49Speaker 01

  That was me before Helix. I took their sleep quiz, which is so fast. It took me like two minutes, and they matched me to a mattress that actually fits how I sleep. Not a guess, not a firm or soft coin flip, it's a real match. I have a midnight mattress, and I really like it. I was noticing it because I actually had to sleep in one of my other beds recently.

• 4:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 4:07Speaker 01

  That doesn't have a Helix mattress on it, and I really could tell a big Difference in my sleep.

• 4:11Dax Shepard?

  Temperature was all over the map.

• 4:13Speaker 01

  It was a mess. I need a new one.

• 4:15Dax Shepard?

  Look, they've got over 20 mattress models. So whether you sleep hot, need extra back support, or you've got a partner who moves around all night, there's one built for you. Plus free shipping and a 365 night happy with Helix guarantee. That's a full year to decide.

• 4:29Speaker 01

  Helix has been named the most awarded mattress by Forbes, Wired, and more. So it's not just us being enthusiastic. The experts agree.

• 4:36Dax Shepard?

  Right now, Helix is running their Black Friday sale with up to 30% off. Go to helixsleep.com/armchair for up to 30% off your Helix mattress. That's helixsleep.com/armchair for up to 30% off your Helix mattress. Helixsleep.com/armchair.

• 5:11Speaker 02

  You guys, I just got it yesterday.

• 5:14Dax Shepard?

  Wonderful.

• 5:15Speaker 02

  So it's the real thing.

• 5:16Speaker 01

  Is that a Lingua Franca sweater you're wearing? It is. I'm so excited for this because Teenage Beauty was an iconic book for me. So now it's such a full circle. Yes, it was gifted to me when I was maybe in eighth grade from my aunt who loved makeup. And yeah, it was iconic. It was like the pre makeup video.

• 5:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:40Speaker 01

  In book form.

• 5:41Speaker 02

  I've written two teenage books.

• 5:43Speaker 01

  Yeah. So this is such a beautiful.

• 5:44Dax Shepard?

  So wait, what was the proprietary take for teenagers? Was there also some messaging about embrace what you are?

• 5:51Speaker 02

  A hundred percent. You know, it's so normal to feel less than, especially as a teenager. I felt it. There's no question why I'm doing what I do for a living. And instead of going overboard, I've realized that the less I do, the more I'm me. And that's the secret of what makes me happy.

• 6:08Dax Shepard?

  You know what's interesting is we can conceptually acknowledge that we're attracted to novelty in every space. Like if you see a unique car, that's interesting. If you see a unique bit of architecture, but we think. That uniqueness in our faces is not gonna be appealing, but in fact it is. I was trying to tell Monica, like, you're the only one that looks like Monica. It's so exciting.

• 6:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, uniqueness. But I always find similarities in people. I'm like, you look like, I always think I know someone, but I haven't seen that person in like 30 years.

• 6:37Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 6:37Speaker 02

  But that's what they used to look like. Yeah.

• 6:39Dax Shepard?

  I have a pattern recognition obsession too. Like if there's a voice that's reminding me of someone, I cannot stop thinking about it until I figure it out.

• 6:46Speaker 02

  Are you a visual learner like I am?

• 6:48Dax Shepard?

  Explain visual learning.

• 6:49Speaker 02

  I just could explain everything in pictures. I understand about everything. I can't read how to do something, but if someone shows me I could do it, or if there's pictures.

• 6:59Dax Shepard?

  Then yes, cuz I've said to Monica many times, if I could watch a video on open heart surgery, I'm certain I could do it.

• 7:04Speaker 02

  Did you get D's in math and science?

• 7:06Dax Shepard?

  Not math and science, but reading and literature, anything that I had to.

• 7:11Speaker 02

  Well, he has dyslexia.

• 7:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 7:12Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 7:12Dax Shepard?

  And you probably had something, right, that we just don't know?

• 7:15Speaker 02

  Definitely have ADD. I don't have OCD, but I have OCD tendencies. I like things lined up, but then I mess them up in two seconds.

• 7:23Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  I love a clean drawer. Mm-hmm.

• 7:26Dax Shepard?

  Well, let's start with where we just met. I'm gonna say that I had a lovely time sitting next to you. I hope it was mutual.

• 7:31Speaker 02

  Are you kidding? Two things made that night, besides the award, which is really cool.

• 7:34Dax Shepard?

  So it was the Times 100 most influential people. You were among the awardees and so was Kristen. And we were seated at your table and you and I were seated directly next to each other.

• 7:43Speaker 02

  And I just remember saying, oh my god, those are the coolest vans with your tuxedo. That was like the first thing I noticed. See this visual thing? Oh, yeah.

• 7:50Dax Shepard?

  Thank you.

• 7:51Speaker 02

  To me, it's like, well, this guy's really cool. Like, he made that choice to do that because it's what makes him comfortable.

• 7:58Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my gosh, wonderful.

• 7:59Speaker 02

  Authentic.

• 8:00Dax Shepard?

  And then you, in all the best ways, reminded me of my mother, who's a fucking gangster. She's just a self-made, she was a single woman, who, or single woman, she was a single mother, building a company, and she was just indomitable. And I immediately was like, oh, yeah, yeah, this is the same spirit as my mom.

• 8:17Speaker 02

  And what company?

• 8:18Dax Shepard?

  It was in the automotive industry, so all of the press fleet for General Motors, ding ding ding, you worked in the GM building forever. Those get lent out to journalists. We throw big car shows and we manage those fleets and all that stuff.

• 8:30Speaker 02

  Speaking of the car industry, my Papa Sam came from Russia, and he ended up to be Cadillac Sam, but for years he sold Ramblers, DeSoto's, Plymouths. He made his name in Chicago with this car dealership. My Uncle Albert had one, so I kinda grew up in the car industry.

• 8:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, what did Dad do?

• 8:47Speaker 02

  My dad, who was 21 when I was born, personal injury lawyer.

• 8:51Dax Shepard?

  Was his face on a bus stop ever?

• 8:53Speaker 02

  It was not, but at the time, we heard a siren. My mother turned to him and said, "Oh, they're playing our song."

• 8:59Dax Shepard?

  They're playing our song.

• 9:00Speaker 02

  But he stopped being a lawyer and became an entrepreneur without even realizing it. He started following his passion. He became a journalist and a writer for We magazine. He traveled the world. And then when he needed money, he went back to being a lawyer. He retired at 70 from being a lawyer. And he started being a children's book author. He has now written 10 children's books. Wow, how cool.

• 9:23Dax Shepard?

  And mom?

• 9:24Speaker 02

  A homemaker.

• 9:25Dax Shepard?

  A homemaker, okay. And where did they meet?

• 9:26Speaker 02

  They met in college at Drake University in Iowa. And they're both from Chicago. And my mom made it a semester.

• 9:36Dax Shepard?

  But had met him in that semester?

• 9:37Speaker 02

  Yes. That's all she needed. Right, yeah.

• 9:40Dax Shepard?

  So it's kind of worked.

• 9:41Speaker 02

  Yeah. And they were both, coincidentally, like chubby kids. And they lost weight and they became incredibly good-looking. So you'll see the theme in my life about being a chubby kid or gorgeous. I could never be gorgeous.

• 9:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. How many Jewish folks were in the community you grew up in?

• 9:57Speaker 02

  It's easier to count the ones that were not Jewish.

• 9:59Dax Shepard?

  Okay, that's good, because I was going to ask if there was any kind of trying to assimilate to this WASP-y thing and if that was the kernel of why I'm not pretty.

• 10:07Speaker 02

  No, but first of all, I was obsessed with the WASP-y thing, being a Jewish kid. I would see my friends, they had this great green stuff going on in their houses. It was very Ralph Lauren.

• 10:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, right.

• 10:17Speaker 02

  But not Ralph Lauren, the real Ralph Lauren.

• 10:19Dax Shepard?

  The Kennedy kind of aesthetic.

• 10:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, I'm still obsessed with the royal family.

• 10:24Dax Shepard?

  So is monarchy.

• 10:25Speaker 02

  I like, yeah, yeah.

• 10:26Dax Shepard?

  Great obsession. I'm mad, I don't, I don't like monarchies.

• 10:30Speaker 02

  Oh, I just love the pretense around everything, the tea and the whole thing.

• 10:35Dax Shepard?

  You like the traditions and the pageantry.

• 10:37Speaker 02

  I do, and I like the traditions of being Jewish. I'm not a religious Jew. And now that my kids are married to people from other religions and other cultures, I have a little bit of everything, and so I'm really happy.

• 10:47Dax Shepard?

  I like the Jewish traditions a lot as well. My brother converted and I've participated in a ton. And of course, half my friends here in LA are Jewish and I've gotten to go to all of them. And they're great.

• 10:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:57Dax Shepard?

  I've thought if I was forced at gunpoint to join a religion, that would be the one.

• 11:01Speaker 02

  And I was thinking Quaker. Quakers are great, we just learned about them. But I know they like oatmeal, they like simple things.

• 11:09Speaker 01

  They're about kindness.

• 11:10Speaker 02

  They're about kindness.

• 11:11Speaker 01

  We just had someone on who grew up Quaker.

• 11:13Speaker 02

  But the same in the Indian culture.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, Hinduism has a lot of that and Buddhism too.

• 11:18Dax Shepard?

  You had a brother or you had more?

• 11:19Speaker 02

  There was three of us. By the time my dad was 25, he had three kids. He was a lawyer. I had a younger brother and a younger sister. And my brother was the middle kid and the most gorgeous, brilliant kid that just had the absolute worst life.

• 11:35Speaker 01

  Oh, no.

• 11:36Speaker 02

  It's very sad.

• 11:37Speaker 01

  What happened?

• 11:38Dax Shepard?

  Why?

• 11:38Speaker 02

  He never listened. I think he was too smart for his own good. And back then, parents didn't know what to do with kids that were troubled.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:46Speaker 02

  You know, they didn't know what to do with me with my learning disorders. They just stopped punishing me. My mom said, "You'll probably never be a secretary." She was right.

• 11:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, skipped a couple.

• 11:55Speaker 02

  You know, so she let me drop out of typing. So my brother, he was always troubled. He always got in trouble. He didn't pay attention. You couldn't read his writing, but he would do testing and off the charts. And then when he was 16, he took my parents' car and hit a tree. And they told my parents, "He is going to die. They should call a priest." My mother nursed him back to health and he just had a lot of issues. It was really hard to watch. I did everything I could to help him and turned out when he finally got diagnosed, he had personality disorder, which-

• 12:28Speaker 01

  Borderline?

• 12:28Speaker 02

  Borderline personality, which is the worst thing because you can't take a pill for it.

• 12:33Speaker 01

  Yeah. Right.

• 12:34Speaker 02

  And so he struggled. And then what do you do if you're struggling? You take drugs.

• 12:39Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 12:40Speaker 02

  An upper, a downer, a sideways, whatever. And he ended up, after decades being homeless, he ended up passing away of a drug overdose.

• 12:50Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm so sorry.

• 12:52Dax Shepard?

  We had a borderline personality disorder expert on and I have to say, I entered the interview, I've dealt with that condition in friends. I don't like it and I think I was really judgmental, but I will say, we had this person on, I was like, "Oh, fuck yeah, that's right. No one wants to be born this way." The foundational problem is, "I really don't believe you love me and I'm gonna kind of manifest or prove that." And what a hard, hard way to go through life. And I've since met people since we had that episode on that are like, "Oh, my God, I love that episode. I'm EDP. I've been working on it for four years." I'm like, "That's right, man. All these people are just born with this."

• 13:25Speaker 02

  Right. The sad thing is for my dad, who's still alive, he's 90 and a half years old. Is that every time Michael would do something stupid, he was just angry and pissed and they'd

• 13:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:33Speaker 02

  scream at each other.

• 13:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 13:34Speaker 02

  I'm like, Dad, it's like as if he has cancer. He has something, he can't help. He could have done this, I told him to do this. And you know, my dad said, here I've got this daughter that gets times 100 and I've got this homeless kid.

• 13:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 13:46Speaker 02

  Like, what the hell?

• 13:47Speaker 01

  I'm sure he feels guilty about that.

• 13:49Speaker 02

  He does.

• 13:50Speaker 01

  At some point, you can't protect your kids and then that's hard.

• 13:52Speaker 02

  No, you feel bad.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  You feel bad.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  But when he passed away, we had a memorial for him and it was so healing. Cause all of his friends came from when he was younger. And all we did is talk about the good Michael.

• 14:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 14:03Speaker 02

  And all the great things. So he got to walk away and say, okay, let's just not think about all the bad things. Cause trust me, it was bad.

• 14:10Speaker 01

  In your success, cause you're escalating and escalating and that's happening simultaneously. Are you feeling a lot of guilt?

• 14:16Speaker 02

  Well, I'm so lucky I have my husband because he's a rock and he would deal with things and his secretary would deal with things. There was always a phone call or an emergency. Started out as simple as the electricity is going off. And then it was way, way worse. I'd be on someone's yacht, having this amazing dinner and the phone rang. Or I'd be in Paris at a great restaurant and it'd be my brother who needs something, something. And we'd have to stop what we're doing. The juxtaposition was bizarre.

• 14:42Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 14:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 14:43Speaker 02

  And I mean, it made me feel terrible for him, but I could look at myself in the mirror and say, Bobby, you did everything in your power.

• 14:50Dax Shepard?

  That's great. You didn't feel that kind of survivor's guilt?

• 14:53Speaker 02

  No.

• 14:53Dax Shepard?

  Like, why didn't he also get my?

• 14:56Speaker 02

  My normalness?

• 14:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 14:57Speaker 02

  No. And it's weird, how could people growing up in the same house, one is, I mean, I hate to say I'm normal, but I'm kind of normal and real. I'm functioning.

• 15:06Dax Shepard?

  You're within the spectrum of normal.

• 15:08Speaker 02

  I'm totally in the spectrum and he was not. And then I have a baby sister, whose whole life is about helping others.

• 15:14Dax Shepard?

  You have three boys.

• 15:15Speaker 02

  I have three boys.

• 15:16Dax Shepard?

  I have two little girls. I imagine the stress of that for your mother must have been pretty overwhelming.

• 15:22Speaker 02

  I think so, but upper-middle-class suburbs. My dad, a lawyer, he made a good salary. We always had some help in the house, some interesting help. We had Charlie, who my dad got out of jail and he babysat us for years. That's not in the book, but we had Charlie. And the last day, Charlie worked for us. If you opened our coat closet, you'd see a car. Because he drove a car through the garage into the coat closet. Oh. So my dad finally fired him after decades. Charlie.

• 15:49Dax Shepard?

  Charlie. He hadn't been in prison for another vehicular incident, had he?

• 15:54Speaker 02

  No, no, I don't think he was in prison since my dad helped him.

• 15:57Dax Shepard?

  And what I know from the book is you're insanely close to your dad.

• 16:01Speaker 02

  I am.

• 16:02Dax Shepard?

  You call him endlessly throughout your life for advice. The night you meet Steven, you call him the same, my husband. That's a very clear and special relationship. What was the relationship with mom?

• 16:12Speaker 02

  My mom was diagnosed with manic depressive. And she had her first quote-unquote nervous breakdown when I was in seventh grade.

• 16:19Dax Shepard?

  This would have been in the 70s, right? So they don't know anything about how to deal with it.

• 16:22Speaker 02

  Right when one flew out of the cuckoo's nest came up. So they just thought she was crazy? We would visit her in the hospital and everyone else looked like that movie. She was on so many drugs, they just gave her a lot of lithium. And she just was making like ashtrays. I don't know what she was making.

• 16:36Dax Shepard?

  How scary was that?

• 16:37Speaker 02

  It was intense, but I'm someone that always sees the positive. I got to get in the car with my dad, just me and him, and drive to the hospital and listen to music and talk. And I look at that as a positive. I got really close to my dad. And then mom came home and things got better. And then they got divorced. And then she met a great guy. She married him.

• 16:57Dax Shepard?

  That's rare good.

• 16:58Speaker 02

  And then he died. He had a massive heart attack. I happened to have been home from college. Oh.

• 17:04Dax Shepard?

  What were you telling peers when they would come over and mom wasn't there? Were you able to admit she's away somewhere?

• 17:11Speaker 02

  I don't remember. Isn't that so weird? I don't remember it being such a big deal. I do remember the woman my dad hired named Elsie, who let us have butter on our buns with our hamburgers and french fries. And my mother was always a health nut. Her weight turned into a health obsession.

• 17:29Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 17:30Speaker 02

  So we became all healthy people because of it.

• 17:32Dax Shepard?

  She suggested that you needed to get a nose job?

• 17:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, my mom came to me one day in bed and she said, "I think you're so pretty." And I said, "Thanks, Mom." And we were really close. And she said, "But I think you'd be gorgeous if you had your nose fixed."

• 17:46Dax Shepard?

  I love "fixed" as a term.

• 17:47Speaker 02

  All the Jewish girls had their nose fixed. And I remember looking at her and saying, "I don't think there's anything wrong with my nose." And she said, "Yeah, but it would look so cute." I said, "My nose is fine." And she said, "When you're older, you're probably gonna need your eyes done, too."

• 18:01Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 18:02Speaker 02

  And which I haven't done, it's on my list. What does she even mean, like a lift? Yeah, or like you take the excess skin out. It's the one plastic surgery that I see people do that I think looks great, but I'm just, don't wanna do it. And how old were you when she said this? Just started college. Okay.

• 18:17Dax Shepard?

  You're not in need of that at six. I don't wanna broadcast your age.

• 18:21Speaker 02

  I'm 68 years old.

• 18:22Dax Shepard?

  And you're not in need of it?

• 18:23Speaker 02

  My lines in my face, I think, look okay. They do, they look great.

• 18:27Dax Shepard?

  You're a babe. I think I told you that when I was sitting next to you.

• 18:29Speaker 02

  Oh, I would remember that.

• 18:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 18:32Speaker 02

  I just remember the shout-out from Snoop Dogg, which I thought I was so cool until the next day I found out that my brother-in-law's friend wrote his monologue. That's how I got in it. Snoop really didn't know who I was.

• 18:43Dax Shepard?

  Well, my hooker crook. So you were not a great student?

• 18:46Speaker 02

  I wasn't.

• 18:47Dax Shepard?

  How did you get into Emerson?

• 18:48Speaker 02

  Well, I felt bad I wasn't a great student. I really thought I was dumb. And now I realize, things that are boring don't interest me. And things that are interesting really interest me.

• 18:57Dax Shepard?

  As we learn more about ADHD, it sounds like you just really have.

• 19:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I do really well when I'm driving or when I'm moving. It's funny, I bought a book on adult ADHD. I couldn't read it. We don't read books. But I kind of, you know. Leave through.

• 19:11Dax Shepard?

  How to Deal with Blindness is a book.

• 19:13Speaker 02

  Kind of. Like your mom, I figured things out. I literally print things out and I use a pen and I fix it and then I hand it to someone to type. And they retype it and give it back to me and I read it again.

• 19:24Dax Shepard?

  So how'd you get into Emerson?

• 19:25Speaker 02

  It was my third college. And I went to University of Wisconsin first, at Oshkosh, not Madison. Followed a boyfriend. I graduated high school early, not because I was smart, but because I was always getting my work done. And so, we went and then we all transferred to University of Arizona for a year. With the boyfriend? In Tucson, with the boyfriend. Okay, great. Who I'd been with for five years. We had this friend and the three of us all. Became Three Musketeers. And then in the end of the summer, the high school boyfriend fell in love with the other guy.

• 19:57Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 19:58Speaker 02

  Cause he just realized he was gay.

• 19:59Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 20:00Speaker 02

  But the bad news, the other guy and me fell in love.

• 20:02Speaker 01

  Oh, boy.

• 20:03Dax Shepard?

  What a twisted triangle here.

• 20:06Speaker 02

  And I stayed with the other guy for 12 years.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 20:08Speaker 02

  Until I met my husband.

• 20:10Dax Shepard?

  You're such a serial monogamous, cause you've been with 30.

• 20:12Speaker 02

  37 years married, yeah.

• 20:14Dax Shepard?

  37 years with Steven.

• 20:15Speaker 02

  Thank you. I know how to have a happy marriage.

• 20:17Speaker 01

  Do tell, please.

• 20:18Speaker 02

  Everyone get your pens out.

• 20:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:20Speaker 02

  Know it pisses them off, and don't do it.

• 20:22Speaker 01

  That seems easy, but it's really hard to do.

• 20:25Speaker 02

  I'm sorry I upset you.

• 20:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:27Speaker 02

  That doesn't mean I was wrong. I am, I'm sorry I upset you.

• 20:31Dax Shepard?

  I don't want you to be upset.

• 20:32Speaker 02

  Right.

• 20:32Dax Shepard?

  And if I played a role in it.

• 20:34Speaker 02

  I'm really sorry.

• 20:37Dax Shepard?

  So you got to Emerson?

• 20:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, I got to Emerson. I literally flew up, saw the Magic Pan Outdoor Cafe. You know, being from Chicago, I'm like, I wanna go here. And I got in the day before school started. I created my own major. They didn't have a makeup major.

• 20:54Dax Shepard?

  It was theatrical makeup?

• 20:55Speaker 02

  Theatrical makeup and a minor in photography.

• 20:57Dax Shepard?

  Did you stick with photography?

• 20:58Speaker 02

  Are you kidding?

• 20:59Dax Shepard?

  Are you?

• 21:00Speaker 01

  She loves visuals.

• 21:01Dax Shepard?

  Oh, right.

• 21:01Speaker 02

  My Instagram is like.

• 21:03Dax Shepard?

  You're active.

• 21:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm active. And if I'm not putting something up, I'm scrolling and it feeds my curiosity.

• 21:10Dax Shepard?

  It's also an ADHD salve.

• 21:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, it calms me down, too. I had a business coach, I said, you know, I come home at night, my family's watching TV, and I'm sitting there with my iPad. And my husband's always like, what are you doing? You're not paying attention. I'm like, I am. She said, it calms you down. It's like you're knitting.

• 21:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:26Speaker 02

  And it does.

• 21:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  Your life is about visuals, so I'm not surprised. It's literally painting the face, so it makes sense.

• 21:34Speaker 02

  But I'm also really curious about things. I always think there's an answer to everything. So I'm like, I'll find it.

• 21:40Dax Shepard?

  Well, there's something in that. That tells me there's just a simmering, maybe, anxiety. And if I know how it works, I can alleviate the anxiety.

• 21:49Speaker 02

  Well, it's funny. I texted my girlfriends, the original girlfriends that we all raised our kids together, because I'm going deep into this book thing, and I thank them for being there for me for all the years. And they said, how are you doing? I said, I don't know if I should take Xanax or an Adderall.

• 22:05Speaker 02

  And my one girl said, I would take a Xanax. I said, well, I took an Adderall.

• 22:12Dax Shepard?

  So you graduate with this degree. Now, when you graduated with that, did you have fantasies of working in film and television?

• 22:19Speaker 02

  Absolutely. I wanted to be a movie makeup artist. It was glamorous. When I was in college, I wrote a letter to my stepfather's uncle, Sheldon Keller, who was a very famous producer, saying, I want to be a makeup artist. I want to come to LA. Took him three months to write me back. He sent me my letter back with all the spelling corrections. Oh. And said, don't ever send a letter like this until you proofread it. And that was it. So I said, all right, I guess I'm not going into. Oh, boy.

• 22:45Dax Shepard?

  Tough love.

• 22:46Speaker 02

  So then I moved to New York instead. Great.

• 22:48Dax Shepard?

  Wow, wow, wow. OK, so initially, that did appeal to you.

• 22:51Speaker 02

  But it's boring.

• 22:52Dax Shepard?

  I'm going to tell you my stereotype of makeup artists. I've been working with them very closely for 20-plus years. First of all, I love them. As a department, they're generally my favorite department. My stereotype is all of them are pretty popular, pretty darn social, pretty empathetic, but not the homecoming queen. They were like popular, but they weren't the belle of the ball.

• 23:14Speaker 02

  I was in the popular group. I always felt, and my friends say I was wrong. I always felt that I had to work really hard to be liked. But I think it's also my size. I'm five foot tall.

• 23:24Dax Shepard?

  Love it.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  Me too. You are too? Mm-hmm. We have a different thing, and it makes us successful. Yeah. If it doesn't make you totally neurotic and insecure. Or both. Or both, yeah.

• 23:33Dax Shepard?

  Does it anger you when people try to help you?

• 23:35Speaker 02

  No.

• 23:36Dax Shepard?

  OK. My wife's got that. She's like, I'm not a baby. You don't need to do this and that.

• 23:40Speaker 02

  Working really hard with a physical trainer on being able to, no matter what, get off the floor and take my suitcase and put it on top. I don't want to ask someone to do that. I don't want help getting in and out of cars, and I don't want anyone opening up a jar for me. You know when you get those water bottles? Oh, yeah. And I'm like, oh, my God. I won't let anyone do it.

• 24:00Dax Shepard?

  I want to see your training session. Just like a thousand bottles lined up, cracking the seal. Okay, so you get to New York in 1980?

• 24:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, I graduated in 79, 1980.

• 24:11Dax Shepard?

  When I was reading this chapter, I was like, oh, this is so similar to being an aspiring actor and just landing in L.A. and going like, how the fuck?

• 24:20Speaker 02

  Right.

• 24:21Dax Shepard?

  Wait, there's a union? How do I get in the union? People have agents? How does one get an agent?

• 24:24Speaker 02

  But you know what? We only figured it out because we're ninjas. Everyone's like, is the book about resiliency? Not really. It's about being a ninja. It's about figuring out what you have to do.

• 24:35Dax Shepard?

  Following leads. You're almost like a detective.

• 24:37Speaker 02

  And asking questions. I'm very naive. I love that quality about me, but I'm not afraid to ask questions. But, you know, I literally opened up the Yellow Pages when I got to New York. I just looked up models, modeling agencies, and I figured it out. Kind of what I do now on ChatGPT.

• 24:53Dax Shepard?

  Well, you had a stopover, though, at a transvestite's house, which is fascinating.

• 24:56Speaker 02

  No, no, no. He came to my house.

• 24:58Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he came to your house?

• 24:59Speaker 02

  That was terrifying, especially back then. I needed to make money, so I put an ad in the Village Voice, makeup lessons, makeup artists teaching. And some guy called and said, I'd love to come. I'm an actor playing a role. I said, great. I don't remember if it was $100, $200. And he came to my then-boyfriend's studio with his Louis Vuitton bag full of women's lingerie. He was wearing Gucci loafers, and I'm like, this guy's from Connecticut.

• 25:25Dax Shepard?

  And he got in outfit after outfit. He wanted a different look for each.

• 25:28Speaker 02

  He wanted me to teach him a different look for each.

• 25:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, sure. Well, hold on, we gotta go back a second. So you feel like you learned when you were in college, like you learned the techniques?

• 25:40Speaker 02

  No, I didn't learn anything about makeup. I signed up for everything. I became the makeup artist to the film department, the plays. And so I would have to read the scripts, which were not easy for me, and visualize what the characters should be and then design the makeup.

• 25:54Speaker 01

  Wow, so it's like trial and error a little bit.

• 25:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I figured it out. And in retrospect, it's taught me what not to do in makeup. Like, yeah, you're gonna put something grayish on your lips, you're gonna look dead. You wanna look young, you do pink on the cheeks. So I learned a lot of things.

• 26:08Dax Shepard?

  But we're already getting to what is true in so many industries, which is being creative is really one sliver of the pie. Being talented is one sliver. It's the Yellow Pages and the fucking Village Voice ad. And it's the going to the union going, how do I get in? Sadly for artistic people, that's about 70% of it.

• 26:26Speaker 02

  Oh, no, it is. And by the way, even when you made it, even after I had a Vogue cover, I still had to work on it. You have to work on everything all the time. And when people say it's so hard, I'm like, yeah. What isn't hard in life? Everything's hard.

• 26:39Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 26:40Dax Shepard?

  What would you say were the milestones that bring you to 1990? When you decide to make your first few products?

• 26:47Speaker 02

  Well, I decided to make the first products because I accidentally met a chemist who made his own lipstick. And I said, I always wanted to make a lipstick. He said, tell me about it. I said, I wanted it to not smell bad. I wanted it to be creamy and not dry, not greasy. And I wanted it to be the color of my lips.

• 27:06Dax Shepard?

  So really quick, that's your novel proprietary take on makeup. Had you already discovered that was your brand and your

• 27:14Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 27:15Dax Shepard?

  point of view? When did that happen?

• 27:16Speaker 02

  When I first started doing that kind of makeup, I had people saying, you're never going to work if you do that. People want to have the white faces and the contouring and the overlining and the blue and the yellow.

• 27:27Dax Shepard?

  This is the 80s, remind everyone. People have wild slashes of pink on their face and spattered paint.

• 27:33Speaker 02

  I did fashion shows. I loved all that fun, creative, but I made it look beautiful. I didn't find it attractive. I don't think I was that talented in that kind of makeup. So I started doing things like, how's this for brilliant? Finding a foundation that was the color of your skin. It wasn't popular, you know. Well, you don't know, but your mother and your grandmother know.

• 27:53Speaker 01

  No, I know. I was like, I need to thank Bobby for this. Bobby Brown is the first makeup brand that I had that had my color.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  And duh, to me, it's common sense. The way to choose a foundation is you try it on the side of your face. If it disappears, it's the right color.

• 28:07Speaker 01

  But lots of brands don't even have all the options. You had such a wide range.

• 28:13Speaker 02

  And a lot of brands have the options, but they're bad options. Because who's making these decisions?

• 28:17Speaker 01

  Well, right, exactly.

• 28:18Speaker 02

  Not a makeup artist.

• 28:19Dax Shepard?

  By 1990, are you kind of a famous makeup artist?

• 28:23Speaker 02

  I am in the fashion industry. By 1990, I had a cover of Vogue and I was written about in the magazines. You know, Bobby Brown says the trend for the season. But I also was a new mom. My oldest son was born in 1990.

• 28:37Dax Shepard?

  The publicity angle is enormous in this, right? When do you figure out that aspect? Being in that magazine is huge. How do I get in that magazine?

• 28:44Speaker 02

  I knew the first time I did Glamour magazine and it said on the side, really small, "Hair and Makeup by Bobby Brown." I was like, wow. And then I got phone calls. And then the more I got that and the more people liked either my work, or mostly I think they liked me.

• 28:59Dax Shepard?

  So this is huge. You're a makeup artist and especially if you're a woman, you're gonna spend three and a half hours with sometimes on a day going to the Emmys. Kristen will be with someone in her face for three and a half hours.

• 29:09Speaker 02

  Probably the same person she usually uses, because it's about relationships.

• 29:13Dax Shepard?

  They're great, but their personality is wonderful.

• 29:15Speaker 02

  Oh, 100%.

• 29:16Dax Shepard?

  Huge part of it.

• 29:17Speaker 02

  It's your posse. I have my posse.

• 29:19Dax Shepard?

  Again, this Howard Rourke notion that you'll just be brilliant and everyone will just fucking deal with whatever because you're brilliant. That is not the world we're in anyway.

• 29:27Speaker 02

  And you've got to figure it out and sometimes it works. And guess what? Sometimes it doesn't work. And then you have to say, okay, that didn't work. What can I do about it now?

• 29:34Speaker 01

  Back then, was it you had clients and they brought you on for the covers? Or was the magazine hiring you?

• 29:39Speaker 02

  It was usually the stylist, the photographer.

• 29:42Speaker 01

  Okay, got it.

• 29:43Speaker 02

  And then when I was a fashion makeup artist, celebrities were the no. Unless you were Elizabeth Taylor on the cover of Bizarre, it wasn't all about the celebrities. So it was really, it was the supermodels. It was the Cydys, Naomi, Linda, Christie.

• 29:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, who were some of the gals you were working with?

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Cindy Crawford, Linda Vagelista, Christy Turlington.

• 30:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, she's my favorite. I watched that Models doc, which I knew nothing about any of those folks. And I was like, oh, that's the one I like.

• 30:10Speaker 02

  You've never met her?

• 30:11Dax Shepard?

  No, we watched that thing and then I was at the Sphere and I looked over and I was like, oh, my God, honey, she's right there.

• 30:15Speaker 02

  She is the nicest. I see her in a lot of parties in the Hamptons. She hasn't done one thing to her face.

• 30:20Dax Shepard?

  I was gonna say, talk about natural.

• 30:21Speaker 02

  She is stunning and wonderful and still happily married.

• 30:25Dax Shepard?

  She's an anomaly.

• 30:26Speaker 02

  She really is.

• 30:27Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you want this. Lipstick through your savviness and again, your work ethic and figuring things out. You do end up getting this in Bergdorf's.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  Well, he made a lipstick for me and it was the color of my lips and I loved it. And I said, oh my God, I bet I could sell this. He says, I'll make it. I'll give it to you. We'll charge $15. You take 750, I take 750. I said, great. And I said, people are gonna love this. Then I realized people have different colored lips. This is not gonna look good on someone with darker lips or paler lips. So my ninja brain is like, okay, what colors? And honestly, I was going to the park with my kid. They had nanny friends. I looked at women from all over the world. And I kinda started studying the lips and realizing, you know, some women of color had pink lips, some had dark purple lips.

• 31:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:12Speaker 02

  Indian women have this kind of really cool heather blue lips. And by the way, in the industry, most of the magazines and makeup artists would say, this is how you correct if your lips are too dark.

• 31:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 31:23Speaker 02

  I don't believe in correcting. I believe in enhancing. I don't draw pencils outside of my lips.

• 31:29Speaker 01

  Same.

• 31:29Speaker 02

  Well, you don't have to.

• 31:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's true.

• 31:31Dax Shepard?

  Shut up. Shut up. It's like me talking about my height or something.

• 31:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, right? But you know what? We all have gifts in life. And when you start realizing your superpower, that I think is the secret.

• 31:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I had to go like, yeah, I don't have the nose I want. If my mom had said, let's fix it, I might have said yes.

• 31:49Speaker 01

  Oh, I know what I've been saying. God, here's coming to me for this.

• 31:52Speaker 02

  But I heard you and Bradley Cooper talking about you guys didn't like your faces when you were young. I'm like, what the hell? You guys are so cute.

• 31:58Dax Shepard?

  Isn't it comforting that Bradley says that? I'm like, all right, no one's immune to.

• 32:01Speaker 02

  But everybody, being a makeup artist, the stuff you hear.

• 32:05Dax Shepard?

  From supermodels.

• 32:06Speaker 02

  And over my years, I did Mike Tyson, Matthew McConaughey, Barack Obama, Jill Biden. You get to hear how everyone feels about themselves.

• 32:14Dax Shepard?

  And no one's like.

• 32:15Speaker 02

  And if no one is like, I'm fabulous, right?

• 32:18Dax Shepard?

  It's like, I nailed it.

• 32:22Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 32:28Dax Shepard?

  We get support from Skims. Okay, I have a confession. I genuinely love matching pajamas. It's the best part of Christmas morning, really. Everyone in the same matching set, looking ridiculously cute in front of the tree.

• 32:42Speaker 01

  I love matching pajamas. I'm literally going to be in coordinating sets with all my friends this holiday season because I got them, spoiler to my friends who are listening, the same Skims pajama set I've been living in. They are so soft and cozy and they look cute. So you can leave the house and go get a late night hot chocolate and be cozy.

• 33:03Dax Shepard?

  It's so great how Skims has sets for everyone, too. Women's, men's, kids, even your pets. So nobody in your life has to be left out this year.

• 33:13Speaker 01

  I have a bunch of different pajama sets. One of my favorite is the organic cotton sleep long sleeve set.

• 33:20Dax Shepard?

  Okay, tell me more.

• 33:21Speaker 01

  It is so comfortable, very chic, too. The top is a button down, but very, very soft, easy to sleep in. But as I said before, you can multipurpose this and look super cute.

• 33:33Dax Shepard?

  Hot chocolate runs. It's like the pajamas we grew up in, except without the scratchy polyester that made opening presents feel more like a hot yoga class that nobody signed up for.

• 33:42Speaker 01

  All the nostalgia, none of the discomfort. Shop my favorite loungewear and pajamas at skims.com. After you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcasts in the survey and be sure to select Armchair Expert in the dropdown menu that follows. If you're looking for the perfect gifts for everyone on your list, the Skims Holiday Shop is now open at skims.com.

• 34:01Dax Shepard?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Every family has that one holiday tradition nobody actually enjoys, but everyone keeps doing because stopping it would feel like a federal offense. For me, it was a specific meal situation that I will not name because my family listens. But at some point, you have to ask yourself, am I doing this because I love it or because I'm afraid of what happens if I don't?

• 34:24Speaker 01

  Yes, and that question applies to so much more than the holidays. I think a lot of us carry these invisible rules about how we're supposed to spend the holidays, who we're supposed to see, what it's supposed to look like. And when you start unpacking that with a therapist, you realize half of your stress is coming from rules you didn't even write.

• 34:40Dax Shepard?

  This is where BetterHelp can be a great resource during the holidays. BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals. A short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences, which means they typically get it right the first time. If you aren't happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time from their tailored recs.

• 34:59Speaker 01

  I just love therapy. I've been avoiding it recently, or not avoiding it, but I was like, oh, I'm busy, I'm busy, I'm busy, cancel, cancel, cancel. But then I-

• 35:07Dax Shepard?

  You start feeling it.

• 35:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, because then I had it this past weekend and I was like, oh my God, I'm just, thank God, thank God for her, yeah.

• 35:15Dax Shepard?

  BetterHelp is now in-network with more than 125 health plans with many copays as low as $15 for eligible members. And if you don't have eligible insurance or live outside the US, you can still get 20% off your first month. Sign up and get 20% off at betterhelp.com/dax. That's betterhelp, H E L P, dot com slash dax. We get support from our sponsor, Lilly. For adults with obesity or with excess weight and weight-related medical problems, it's time to find out about Foundo or for Gleepran. Foundo is a once-daily prescription GLP-1 medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with obesity or some adults with overweight

• 36:00Dax Shepard?

  who also have weight-related medical problems to lose excess body weight and keep the weight off.

• 36:05Speaker 04

  Foundo should not be used with other GLP-1 receptor agonist medicines. It is not known if Foundo is safe and effective for use in children. Don't take Foundo if you're allergic to it, or if you or someone in your family had major lary thyroid cancer or multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. Stop and call your doctor right away if you have an allergic reaction, a lump or swelling in your neck, or severe stomach pain. Serious side effects may include inflamed pancreas and gallbladder problems. Tell your doctor if you experience vision changes, if you're nursing, pregnant, plant to be, or taking birth control pills, and before- Procedures with anesthesia. Taking Foundao with an insulin or sulfonylurea may cause low blood sugar. Side effects include diarrhea, nausea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and may cause kidney problems. Once Daily Foundao is available by prescription only

• 36:47Speaker 04

  in 0.8 milligram, 2.5 milligram, 5.5 milligram, 9 milligram, 14.5 milligram, and 17.2 milligram tablets. Learn more at foundao.lily.com or call 1-800-LILY-RX. Now is perfect to talk to your doctor about Foundao.

• 37:02Dax Shepard?

  This episode is brought to you by ServiceNow. Look, I have my dream job. I get to talk to folks I admire like crazy and ask them virtually any question that I want to. I can't imagine a better way to spend my time. But even dream jobs have some not so dreamy parts, the stuff that gets in the way of the actual work. Now that's where ServiceNow's AI specialists come in. They don't just tell you what you should do about your busy work. They actually do it, start to finish. Cases closed, requests handled, no extra work for you. So you and your team can focus on what matters most, which for me is, are they obsessed with male bodies on the same level as I am?

• 37:44Speaker 01

  They never are.

• 37:45Dax Shepard?

  To learn how to put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com.

• 37:57Speaker 02

  One famous supermodel, I'll never forget, and I can't believe I'm telling you this story. She lifted up her shirt and she said, could you just tell me, are they the same size?

• 38:04Dax Shepard?

  Wow. Of course not, none of them are.

• 38:06Speaker 02

  I said, yes.

• 38:07Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 38:08Speaker 02

  I lied, I'm sorry.

• 38:09Dax Shepard?

  That's fine, that's fine.

• 38:10Speaker 02

  What was I gonna say?

• 38:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, just lie and keep it moving.

• 38:15Dax Shepard?

  So how many different colors?

• 38:17Speaker 02

  10, we launched with 10, and I started just selling them to people that would want to buy them, friends and neighbors. And then one day I was having lunch with a friend of mine who happened to be the beauty editor of Glamour Magazine. You know, we're talking about how are the kids? She had just had a baby, I had a baby. And she's like, what else is going on? I said, well, I'm doing this little project. We didn't call it side hustles back then. And she said, tell me about it. She goes, oh my God, can I write about it? I'm like, why would you want to write about it? Now I know that's called PR. And we wrote about it and got bombarded with orders. Because it was so different.

• 38:50Dax Shepard?

  And these were like, someone would send you mail, right, to request it?

• 38:53Speaker 02

  There was a phone number. I think it was the chemist or my home phone. I don't even remember. My husband, Steven, who was in law school at the time, would literally mail them out to the post office. And eventually, we brought my sister-in-law in to do the books. And I was still a working makeup artist, because with Steven in law school, we needed to pay the mortgage.

• 39:12Dax Shepard?

  Then you get into Bergdorf's.

• 39:13Speaker 02

  We got into Bergdorf's, not because I pitched them, because I was at a party in the city and I said to someone, I thought she was a fancy lady, "Thanks for inviting me." And she said, "Oh, I'm a big fan." I said, "Oh, you know who I am." I said, "Well, what do you do?" She said, "I'm the cosmetics buyer at Bergdorf Goodman." I said, "Oh, I'm working on this lipstick." She goes, "Why don't we take it?"

• 39:30Dax Shepard?

  Let's give it a run. And the expectation was that you would move, hopefully, a hundred a month.

• 39:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:36Dax Shepard?

  And you immediately started moving a hundred a day.

• 39:38Speaker 02

  Yes, in the beginning. And then, while things were growing, we joined with this other couple, business partners.

• 39:45Dax Shepard?

  Who were they? I just read another couple.

• 39:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, another couple. They were friends. That's in quotes for the listener.

• 39:51Dax Shepard?

  So I guess I know where the relationship went.

• 39:53Speaker 02

  They were friends. I don't go deep into it in the book, but it was a great relationship. We did really well. It was really tough. But I learned so much. And my husband was so great, because I'd be laying in bed at night, literally in tears, and he would say, "First of all, we don't talk about things at night when he's watching Seinfeld. That was our night. We'll talk about it in the morning." And he said, "But let them win the battle. We're gonna win the war." I had no idea what he was talking about, but he just would like, calm down.

• 40:20Dax Shepard?

  He's the steady rock of your altar.

• 40:22Speaker 02

  Literally, he's the guy you want on speed dial for anything you need, anytime. Will you give us his number? I did not marry my dad.

• 40:29Dax Shepard?

  You did not marry your dad?

• 40:30Speaker 02

  No. I married someone that is as smart as my dad, or even smarter.

• 40:33Dax Shepard?

  Okay, but different temperament altogether.

• 40:34Speaker 02

  Very different temperament.

• 40:36Dax Shepard?

  You're your dad.

• 40:36Speaker 02

  I'm kind of my dad. I am. I'm kind of my dad, yeah.

• 40:40Dax Shepard?

  You can't. It's best not to marry yourself.

• 40:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:42Dax Shepard?

  So it grows incredibly fast. A lot of people would think, oh, if I have a great product and people want it, that's that. Growing is nearly impossible, right?

• 40:51Speaker 02

  It's tough.

• 40:51Dax Shepard?

  Because you're constantly trying to anticipate, how much can we now bet on this? Because we got to scale up.

• 40:57Speaker 02

  A lot of it is guesses. A lot of it now is data. It's either data or data. I never know what it is.

• 41:02Dax Shepard?

  If you're a scientist, it's data, and if you're a normal person, it's data.

• 41:04Speaker 02

  Right, exactly. But basically, I go with my gut. My son, who is the CEO of the company, is like, no, mom, it's all data. So, okay, fine. So when you put that stuff together, it kind of works.

• 41:14Dax Shepard?

  So you're nimble, you're flexible, you're pivoting a lot, and you're young.

• 41:18Speaker 02

  The first time, what really put me on the map and put Bobby Brown Cosmetics on the map, we sold Bobby Brown Cosmetics to Estee Lauder after four and a half years.

• 41:27Dax Shepard?

  So '95, you sell it.

• 41:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, so '95, we sell it.

• 41:29Dax Shepard?

  For $75 million?

• 41:31Speaker 02

  That's kind of the answer, not really. Only because there was a 25-year buyout. Can you tell us details of that for people who don't know?

• 41:37Dax Shepard?

  I think it's really, really relevant.

• 41:39Speaker 02

  I'm so lucky I have my husband, because I don't really understand it, and he would probably correct me on 10 different things. But whatever number was decided, we'll sell the company. It was also plus whatever percentage on some sales.

• 41:53Dax Shepard?

  They wanted you to continue to run the brand.

• 41:55Speaker 02

  Right, and I stayed for 22 years.

• 41:57Dax Shepard?

  Right, so that was my question. So you get 75, but then you also have some participation, I imagine, and then you have a salary.

• 42:03Speaker 02

  Some participation, oh, yes. Meaning we would get percentage of sales at the end of the year.

• 42:08Dax Shepard?

  I say the 75 million, not to embarrass you or tell people your business, but I think it's really relevant to think that you started this company, and four and a half years later, $75 million in 1995 is really like selling for 200 million now, 250. It's an enormous success.

• 42:22Speaker 02

  When I left the company, it was a billion-dollar brand.

• 42:25Dax Shepard?

  Now, my question, and this is why I want the details of the contract, was a 25-year non-compete standard, that feels so long.

• 42:32Speaker 02

  I don't know. I've heard different. Look, when I left Bobby Brown Cosmetics, I had four and a half years left, which on someone who's very impatient, and I was 59 years old, I was just like, oh, my God.

• 42:43Dax Shepard?

  No, it must have been absolutely brutal, yeah.

• 42:45Speaker 02

  Forever, just forever.

• 42:46Dax Shepard?

  Like microwave minutes.

• 42:47Speaker 02

  When I left, I was like, what am I going to do? Because I'm not someone that sits idly by and knits or needle points or play kaluki or whatever other people do.

• 42:58Dax Shepard?

  So they acquired it in '95. By 2012, Bobby Brown is responsible for 10% of all total sales for Estee Lauder. So it's enormously successful. They're clearly letting you run it without any issue and it's thriving.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  That's not exactly. There were issues? You know, it was doing really well and they were letting me run it without anything for a long time. And then new CEO and everything really became very harmonious.

• 43:24Dax Shepard?

  Well, antithetical to the original brand, like they wanted a contour because that's popular right now and you're anti contour.

• 43:30Speaker 02

  It just didn't make sense for me to change what the brand was built on. I know there were these companies like the Kardashians. I can't compete with someone that I'm not. I'd rather just be the best version of myself and that's the business too. And I thought I knew the customer. I thought I knew what women really want. My customer always wanted to look like themselves, put better.

• 43:52Dax Shepard?

  Now, is it possible you were wrong?

• 43:54Speaker 02

  Possible, but I wasn't.

• 43:55Dax Shepard?

  Like, let's just put it this way, like.

• 43:56Speaker 02

  I don't think so.

• 43:56Dax Shepard?

  Well, your second venture proves that, but.

• 43:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 43:59Dax Shepard?

  It'd be worth examining. Okay, at the time you had started that trend and that trend took off. Is it possible the trend was moving away from that? Or perhaps 10% of all the market would want to look that way, but 90% would want to.

• 44:13Speaker 02

  Sometimes things go in cycles and if I was one of these people that followed all those cycles, we would have no identity and we wouldn't be true to anything. Sometimes you have to kind of sit back and wait for things to bounce back.

• 44:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 44:27Speaker 02

  Like, natural beauty to me is not a trend. It's what's supposed to be. And I've always embraced lines in people's faces and freckles and different color skin and gaps in the teeth.

• 44:38Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's interestingly, one of the many things that started happening, which is you found this incredible model with a gap in her teeth. You did a whole campaign, only to find out later they had airbrushed her teeth to fix it.

• 44:49Speaker 02

  Without telling me, you're asking me. I was pissed.

• 44:51Dax Shepard?

  What were some of the things that started accruing?

• 44:55Speaker 02

  Oh my God, when, I used to interview every single person that joined the brand, from the person that greets people when they walked in, every single person, and little by little, people were popping up on the head of international, on the head of this. And I was like. Excuse me, and I remember having a conniption fit. And the president at the time said, they didn't consult me either. Because there's nothing I could do about it. And so little by little, it started just taking away from what the essence of the brand is.

• 45:22Dax Shepard?

  And there were moments where they were coming in and you thought they were looking for your sign off or approval.

• 45:27Speaker 02

  Right.

• 45:28Dax Shepard?

  And you would disagree and they would say, it's already being released.

• 45:30Speaker 02

  Why are you bothering me?

• 45:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, this is like kind of just pageantry.

• 45:33Speaker 02

  Again, my naivete was, I got this, I could fix this.

• 45:37Dax Shepard?

  What about the internal confidence in that period? Because I even have waves. Over the last two years, the pushback to wokeness gave rise to this incredibly successful round of podcasters and comedians. And you're just watching this huge swell and you go like, fuck, it's scary. It can create doubt.

• 45:58Speaker 02

  Things change, and I think the important thing is don't rush into anything. Just kind of sit back and observe and let it be and say, okay, what is right for me? What is right for it? And if you try something different and it doesn't work, go back.

• 46:11Dax Shepard?

  But was there any moment where you were like, man, do I, like, I'm fighting?

• 46:15Speaker 02

  No. You know, I'm sure if people would be interviewed, Bobby was really difficult to work with. Yes.

• 46:20Dax Shepard?

  Well, we're gonna get to that.

• 46:21Speaker 02

  By the way, if a color shifted in the market, I was difficult. Go back and fix it.

• 46:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:25Speaker 02

  I cared about these stupid things. And, you know, I was told, get out of the details. No, you can't.

• 46:31Speaker 01

  That's the whole point.

• 46:32Speaker 02

  It's the whole point.

• 46:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:33Speaker 02

  And, you know, it's a very different company now.

• 46:35Speaker 01

  Does it stress you out that it still has your name on it?

• 46:38Speaker 02

  No, this is a terrible thing to admit, but it would probably stress me out if it was flying and doing phenomenally well without me.

• 46:45Speaker 01

  Ah, that's a.

• 46:46Dax Shepard?

  That's what would kill me.

• 46:46Speaker 01

  That's very honest.

• 46:47Speaker 02

  I mean, it is, it's honest. You know, like, they thought they didn't need me anymore.

• 46:51Dax Shepard?

  So in 2016, this growing situation comes to a head. It's also three years of this. It's getting worse and worse and worse. Your overall well-being is suffering.

• 47:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:01Dax Shepard?

  You also have two kids who've just left for college. So now I want to go back a little bit and talk about. How you decided at that time, running the brand in New York City, that you guys would go to New Jersey and live there and raise your family there? I think that's a pretty unique decision for someone.

• 47:18Speaker 02

  We moved to Montclair, New Jersey, the day we got back from our honeymoon.

• 47:22Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you did?

• 47:22Speaker 02

  We did. My husband and I decided we just didn't want to raise New York City kids. And we wanted to be more normal. I would come home from these events and go in the Lincoln Tunnel. I always had a driver and I would take my high shoes off. My hair would go in a scrunchie. I'd put my clogs on in my fanny pack. Now they're all stylish.

• 47:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 47:40Speaker 02

  But back then, look, I'm wearing my Gucci clogs today. I felt really myself when I went home in my life in Montclair, New Jersey.

• 47:48Dax Shepard?

  Would it be fair to say that it helped you compartmentalize the stress of the daytime things? Like, I'm going into a completely different culture and world.

• 47:55Speaker 02

  A hundred percent. I would get in that Lincoln Tunnel and I would breathe. I would probably call my mother or my father, just get that out of the way. And then call Steven and say, what are we doing for dinner? Like, I didn't plan. What do the kids have tonight? Where are their soccer things?

• 48:09Dax Shepard?

  That could be the danger of living in New York, because you leave the office. Well, let's walk together. Now we're having drinks together. And then just the work never, ever ends.

• 48:17Speaker 02

  And there was no after-work drinks, because I had a different life, like my second job. And by the way, anyone that knows me, my kids are just the most important thing in my life.

• 48:27Dax Shepard?

  You wrote a thing in there that I can already sense coming and I try to remind myself, which is, the shit in the hallway drove you nuts, the shoes at the door drove you nuts, all the clutter drove you nuts. And now they're gone and it's dead clean. You know, like, I fucking hate this. I hate my job. I think about this so often. It's like Coach Paterno, who had this glorious career. They have a statue in front of Penn of him. Then the Sandusky things happen. They take it down. And I'm like, it's never too late for this incredible life to just turn to shit. And did it feel like, I thought I had a fairy tale life and now I feel like it's turned to shit?

• 49:00Speaker 02

  No, I didn't think it turned to shit. It was really a tough period when I left the brand.

• 49:05Dax Shepard?

  You lost both your identities.

• 49:06Speaker 02

  I lost it, but after two days of drinking tequila with my neighbors, seriously, I just started calling people and going out and finding things to do. And then I had a bunch of fun, cool gigs to do.

• 49:17Speaker 01

  But you couldn't talk about it, right?

• 49:19Speaker 02

  No, no, until the announcement. I'll never forget, someone called my husband and said, what are we gonna tell everyone? Could we just tell everyone that Bobby's sick? And my husband said, Fuck no.

• 49:31Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 49:32Speaker 02

  He said, why don't we just tell them the truth? But I still wasn't at Liberty until the announcement came out.

• 49:38Dax Shepard?

  Well, this situation ultimately came to a head. And there was a moment where they offered you the same salary.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, same or more.

• 49:45Dax Shepard?

  Or more to go away and show up when needed for kind of PR or when they were wooing another company they wanted to buy.

• 49:53Speaker 02

  What they said is they want you to be the head of the brand, but get out of the day to day. And to me, that's firing. So they will say they didn't fire me. And they would still say it today. But I was fired. I mean, the day to day is why I did what I did.

• 50:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's your brand.

• 50:07Speaker 02

  It was my baby and I thought it was my brand. So I just said, no.

• 50:12Dax Shepard?

  Now, in retrospect, do you think it could have grown to what it grew to without the infrastructure of Estee Lauder? Or do you think if you had not sold, you could have grown it into that same thing without them?

• 50:27Speaker 02

  Well, I think right now Jones Road is bigger than the current Bobby Brown. I don't know that for sure, but I've been told that by some people. We've got like 40 people running around. It's a totally different day and age. Back then, I would go into Neiman Marcus and have 40 to 100 women waiting for me. Now, we launched something, we've got the internet and we've got thousands and thousands.

• 50:48Speaker 01

  There's Sephora's now and department stores are not really the place.

• 50:52Speaker 02

  Yeah. Jones Road is direct to consumer. 90% of our sales, 10% we have stores. I've been driving all over with my husband looking for a location in LA.

• 51:01Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 51:02Speaker 02

  So I'll have to get your take later.

• 51:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 51:04Dax Shepard?

  I think a lot of people, myself included, that would have been a very hard no. Just knowing I could collect, you're like, I'm already fucked. It's already not my brand. Minimally, I guess I should take some money.

• 51:15Speaker 02

  Right. My very good friend, Mickey Drexler, said, take the money, start a new brand. I said, no, because it wasn't just, here's the money. But it's basically, they said to my husband, she's got to be there if the team needs a question, but she can't tell them if she doesn't like something. Like. What the fuck?

• 51:31Dax Shepard?

  Also, they wanted you to sign a non-disparage.

• 51:33Speaker 02

  They wanted to sign a non-disparage, which honestly, I'm trying not to say bad things, except the truth.

• 51:38Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 51:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. But get me a bottle of tequila and ask me the questions off camera.

• 51:43Dax Shepard?

  Well, here's some dirt.

• 51:45Speaker 02

  I say this from the bottom of my heart. I am so grateful for everything that I learned from S.D. Lauder, and most of the years were amazing. The last couple of years were not. And I know that's what everyone wants to talk about, but for the years, Leonard Lauder, who just passed away, he was my mentor. He was like a father to me. I can call him and say anything to him and ask him any question. He never judged me for not being a smart business graduate. He thought I was brilliant. And he would say, Bobby, this is what we gotta do. How can we do this? And we would come up with a solution. Well, that is not what happened to the organization at the end.

• 52:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it sounds like from 95 to 2012, it was pretty great.

• 52:24Speaker 02

  It was.

• 52:24Dax Shepard?

  Seventeen years at a job where you love is a big win.

• 52:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so I left in 17, I think. Was it 16 or 17? You probably know more than me.

• 52:31Dax Shepard?

  You left in 16.

• 52:32Speaker 02

  In 16, yeah.

• 52:33Dax Shepard?

  Because you launched in 2020.

• 52:34Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 52:35Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you do a lot of weird, interesting things in that gap. You just keep moving is what you do, which I think is the advisable path. And you become a style editor at Yahoo.

• 52:46Speaker 02

  I became the beauty editor of Yahoo, which was really cool. But I did that when I was still at the brand.

• 52:52Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 52:52Speaker 02

  Because, yeah, and I had to get permission. So I did that. And then when I left the brand, the first project was develop a hotel with my husband called The George in Montclair.

• 53:02Dax Shepard?

  Thirty-one unique rooms.

• 53:04Speaker 02

  Oh, wow, cool. Thirty-one unique rooms, yeah.

• 53:06Dax Shepard?

  It's in an old mansion.

• 53:08Speaker 02

  It is.

• 53:08Dax Shepard?

  1901 it was built or something?

• 53:10Speaker 02

  Wow, you're amazing.

• 53:11Dax Shepard?

  Thank you. I'm trying to wow you.

• 53:12Speaker 02

  You have wowed me. You had me at hello. The hug you gave me, I will bring that with me.

• 53:17Dax Shepard?

  Okay, good. Okay, so you dabbled in some stuff. This 25-year non-compete, you must have, I'm assuming, been pretty far down the road, knowing that was expiring. How do you decide you're gonna give it another go?

• 53:29Speaker 02

  So I left, didn't know what I was gonna do. The first thing that was offered to me was by my friend that owned Lord & Taylor at the time. And he said, why don't you do a Just Bobby shop? We gotta get people in the stores. You could do anything you want. And I'm like, great. I do well with teams. I got a team together.

• 53:44Dax Shepard?

  Well, you met a gal at the Apple Store.

• 53:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I hired her as my assistant.

• 53:48Speaker 01

  She was like an Apple genius?

• 53:49Speaker 02

  She was Apple genius. I knew I needed help with my digital. And by the way,

• 53:54Speaker 01

  So smart.

• 53:55Speaker 02

  She sat there for two and a half hours. You know, they're usually like, can't help you by? Helping me figuring out how to get my number away from the corporation and so I could own the same number.

• 54:04Dax Shepard?

  She wouldn't give up.

• 54:05Speaker 02

  She wouldn't give up.

• 54:05Dax Shepard?

  Bobby's like, everyone else would have given up.

• 54:07Speaker 02

  And she didn't know, she never heard of me. But I offered her the job and she took it. I said, I don't know what we're gonna do.

• 54:12Speaker 01

  Oh, that's incredible.

• 54:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:13Dax Shepard?

  That's Rob back there. I did someone's podcast. I was like, who's this motherfucker? He is on it. I need this guy.

• 54:20Speaker 02

  I just got his number. First of all, he's from my hometown.

• 54:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, Chicago.

• 54:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I want to build one of these in Montclair.

• 54:25Speaker 01

  Oh, great.

• 54:26Speaker 02

  He needs your permission to freelance.

• 54:28Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he's already got it. He's already freelancing like a son of a gun. So you did the Lord and Taylor thing. It was great. And then Lord and Taylor went out of business a year later.

• 54:35Speaker 02

  And so then we brought it digitally online. We tried to figure stuff out. It wasn't uber-successful, but it was fun. Kept me busy. I learned a lot.

• 54:42Dax Shepard?

  When did you start developing the line?

• 54:44Speaker 01

  Jones Road.

• 54:45Speaker 02

  I got hired to go to India to be the first ever keynote speaker of the Indian Makeup Conference.

• 54:52Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 54:52Speaker 02

  Which was amazing experience. Cody and Pyle were just dating, so trust me, I told every single person that my son's girlfriend is Indian.

• 55:01Dax Shepard?

  You can trust me.

• 55:02Speaker 01

  Again, because you do, I think, represent makeup for all types of people. So I'm not surprised at all that they asked you.

• 55:09Speaker 02

  That was a great experience. And then I got asked to do a masterclass, for a masterclass. That was pretty cool. And I started just kind of being curious. I was using all the natural makeup out there because God forbid I put a chemical.

• 55:22Dax Shepard?

  You weren't using Bobbi Brown at that point.

• 55:24Speaker 02

  No, emotionally, I couldn't use it. I just didn't want to touch it. Stopped following the Instagram. I want no part of it.

• 55:30Dax Shepard?

  I feel you.

• 55:30Speaker 02

  And then I didn't. Find what I wanted out there in the world. So I said, I wonder if I could do better. And I started calling a couple local chemists, kind of like when I started. And I'd go in there and tell them what I wanted. There's so many things I'm not good at, like I can't fill out the paperwork that needs to be done. I can't do all that stuff. So I hire people to do what I'm not good at. I hired this girl to help me conceptualize. And now she's my COO, but she started as a jack of all trades in product development.

• 56:01Dax Shepard?

  Monica's a babysitter for us at one point.

• 56:03Speaker 01

  I did start out as the babysitter.

• 56:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:05Dax Shepard?

  This bitch is smart. What are we gonna do here?

• 56:07Speaker 02

  But it works and it's smart of us to figure it out.

• 56:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. So the balm, which is one of the most successful parts was a mistake, which I love. Anything that starts as a big mistake.

• 56:17Speaker 02

  Yeah. It was not what I asked for when it came. I'll never forget. I opened it up and you know, I was like, God damn it. That's not what I wanted, but I stuck my finger in anyways. And I went like this with my fingers and I tapped it on. I looked in the mirror. I said, oh my God, it's a miracle. Cause you know what? It's moisture. Whenever you're tired, and I have a hippie stick for you. You just take this balm, put it on and it just makes everything look better. Cause by the way, when people don't look good, it's because they're dehydrated. And when you hydrate yourself, you look better.

• 56:48Dax Shepard?

  Our friend Eric just told us recently that he's never put lotion on his face. Like Eric.

• 56:52Speaker 01

  He doesn't wash it or put lotion or do anything on his face.

• 56:55Dax Shepard?

  He looks pretty good. Imagine what he'd look like if he had been moisturizing for the last 10 years.

• 56:59Speaker 02

  Well, this guy, what's his name again?

• 57:01Dax Shepard?

  Rob.

• 57:01Speaker 02

  Rob, he looks like a baby.

• 57:04Dax Shepard?

  He's a cherub.

• 57:04Speaker 02

  He's 37 years old. He's got two kids and he doesn't have any lines or any age.

• 57:09Dax Shepard?

  Genetics.

• 57:10Speaker 01

  Genetics. Yeah.

• 57:11Speaker 02

  A hundred percent.

• 57:11Dax Shepard?

  No, Rob's the cutest guy in Los Feliz. Okay. So the non compete expires.

• 57:17Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 57:18Dax Shepard?

  It's COVID. There's a lot happening in the world at the end of 2020.

• 57:21Speaker 02

  Presidential election is about to happen in a week. And everyone says to me, do not launch this now. We went to big PR agencies. Everyone said, don't do it. I didn't hire any of those PR agencies. I hired my neighbor Lynette down the street, who now is still with me and I can't live without. She handles all of Jones Road and all of my personal stuff.

• 57:39Dax Shepard?

  Does Cody come in as the head of marketing initially?

• 57:41Speaker 02

  So he started coming in with growth. When he came in, our business quadrupled only because we did a call with Gary Vaynerchuk. And Gary said, go on TikTok now.

• 57:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so you were forced to go on TikTok.

• 57:55Speaker 02

  We weren't forced.

• 57:55Dax Shepard?

  You were.

• 57:56Speaker 02

  Oh, I was forced.

• 57:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 57:58Speaker 02

  This is a really important entrepreneurial thing. When someone says, go hire a team, go hire a person. I just can't do that. I just do it instantly. Gary said, go hire a team, go hire an agency. And Cody just picked up the phone and said, go, mom. And we put it up and that's how it started.

• 58:12Dax Shepard?

  And it blew up.

• 58:13Speaker 02

  And it blew up.

• 58:14Dax Shepard?

  So year one, you guys had 15 million in revenue.

• 58:17Speaker 02

  I think 18 first year. I was hoping to do a million.

• 58:20Dax Shepard?

  Incredible. And then year two was

• 58:23Speaker 02

  We doubled.

• 58:23Dax Shepard?

  150, no?

• 58:24Speaker 02

  No, wait. I don't think we did 150 in year two.

• 58:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no, no, 2024, you're doing 150. I'm sorry.

• 58:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:29Dax Shepard?

  I, you caught my first big mistake.

• 58:31Speaker 02

  Last year, we did 180, maybe.

• 58:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 58:33Speaker 02

  And now we're just shy of 200.

• 58:35Speaker 01

  Incredible.

• 58:36Speaker 02

  Industry sources say, because you're not allowed to say.

• 58:39Speaker 01

  Why aren't you allowed to say?

• 58:40Speaker 02

  I don't know. It's not cool. I don't know. Whatever.

• 58:43Dax Shepard?

  It's a bad look.

• 58:43Speaker 01

  It's a bad look, I guess.

• 58:45Dax Shepard?

  To get acquired in five years

• 58:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:47Dax Shepard?

  is pretty miraculous.

• 58:48Speaker 02

  Isn't this how it works for everybody?

• 58:49Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. And then you started at the end of 2020 and here we are in 2025. And you now have something that of course could get acquired for an enormous amount again.

• 58:57Speaker 01

  How is your confidence then when you're on TikTok? It's starting. Are you like, God, I really hope I can do this again?

• 59:05Speaker 02

  Well, no, no, I was never worried about that. You know, I'm like, I don't want to look like an idiot. I don't want someone to listen to this podcast and say, God, Bobby sounds like an asshole. Because sometimes I'm myself and sometimes people think it's the greatest thing. And mostly people that know me will be like, what did she say?

• 59:19Dax Shepard?

  Well, you've been submerged in beauty for 45 years now. 1980, moved to New York. I just know that when I'm here in LA, it's everyone's occupation.

• 59:31Speaker 02

  Right.

• 59:32Dax Shepard?

  You can't go more than a couple of days without hearing some tip about how to look better, do something better.

• 59:38Speaker 02

  Well, it's all out there on the internet. It's crazy. There's so much. Now I'm very interested in health and wellness and the hacks that you could do. And all these people that are doing all these weird things like peptides. And I'm just like, bring it on. Just show me, tell me. So I don't obsess about beauty things anymore. I know I'm not getting work done on my face. I do laser, by the way. I swear by lasers because it doesn't alter my face, but tightens and lifts and things like that.

• 1:00:05Dax Shepard?

  College of production.

• 1:00:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, all that stuff.

• 1:00:07Dax Shepard?

  But in your 30s and 40s when you were surrounded by that. Did that inadvertently make you incredibly self-conscious?

• 1:00:15Speaker 02

  100%.

• 1:00:16Dax Shepard?

  Do you have body dysmorphia at all?

• 1:00:18Speaker 02

  Oh, I totally do. There's no question. My friends laugh at me all the time. I'm teeny, but I always think I have to lose weight. And I don't have to lose weight. But now I'm trying to build muscle.

• 1:00:27Speaker 01

  Yes, which is key.

• 1:00:28Speaker 02

  Which is really important.

• 1:00:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. When you were juggling these million things and that was on the plate, how consuming was that?

• 1:00:35Speaker 02

  Oh my God, so hard. Do you know what it's like going to the Met Gala? I know you do. But as a five-foot-tall Jewish girl from Chicago, who usually I'm behind the scene doing makeup. And once I did someone's makeup and then I had to go get changed for the Met Ball. That was like the stupidest thing I've ever done.

• 1:00:53Dax Shepard?

  Do you do your own makeup for those events?

• 1:00:55Speaker 02

  I do. I have someone in my office, my head makeup artist, who does it. She does some things better than me, like my brows. So I always end up taking my hands and I don't like to look like I have a lot of makeup on.

• 1:01:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. Do you feel like, oh my God, I'm like the walking face of these brands? That's a little stressful.

• 1:01:12Speaker 02

  Look, what I'm selling now is not changing the way you look. So I'm comfortable with it. And the moment in my life changed me forever. I had a party for, I think it was for Teenage Beauty years ago. And she needed a celebrity to show up back then. And I asked my friend Lorraine Bracco if she'd come. And she said, "I'll do my best to get there. I'm coming back from LA. I'll do my best." Well, the woman shows up, she got off a plane, had not a stitch of makeup on. She walks in, the cameras went crazy. She looks so gorgeous without makeup on. I like more of a natural. I don't think many makeup artists understand how to use makeup and make it look like you're not wearing it. You could put a full foundation, concealer, blush, bronzer, and look like the most glorious part of yourself.

• 1:01:56Dax Shepard?

  Not see this huge line of demarcation.

• 1:01:58Speaker 02

  And do strong eyes and sparkle and do all that, but still there's a glow and a naturalness.

• 1:02:03Speaker 01

  You can tell when somebody really knows what they're doing and when they don't. If you had your makeup done a lot, you can tell. Oh, this looks cookie cutter versus this looks like me.

• 1:02:14Speaker 02

  But also it's my beauty aesthetic. And there's a lot of celebrities and makeup artists have a different aesthetic of what it should be. It's just my aesthetic.

• 1:02:21Speaker 01

  But it's been working for a long time.

• 1:02:24Dax Shepard?

  Now, I have many times been standing somewhere and thought, I can't believe Being Funny brought me here. Being Funny got me kicked out of class and in the principal's office nonstop. And then I'll be standing somewhere spectacular and I'm like, I can't believe this thing brought me to this place.

• 1:02:38Speaker 02

  Do you still feel like that sometimes?

• 1:02:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I mean, it's insane. We've interviewed Bill Gates a lot. He happens to love us. He took us to India for a week and we're sitting on his plane flying in India and I'm like, I'm not in venture capital, I'm not a tech person, I'm a comedian. And somehow that brought me to this airplane in India.

• 1:02:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, but you're not known as a comedian.

• 1:02:56Dax Shepard?

  Initially.

• 1:02:57Speaker 02

  Okay, but that's not how people know you.

• 1:03:00Dax Shepard?

  Not now, since this show.

• 1:03:01Speaker 02

  Right, now you've got, well, yeah, and you're an actor.

• 1:03:03Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:03:04Speaker 02

  You know, an actor and now you're, you know.

• 1:03:06Dax Shepard?

  God knows what it is.

• 1:03:07Speaker 02

  God knows, but it's working, whatever it is. I was just on his daughter's podcast.

• 1:03:12Speaker 01

  Oh, Phoebe.

• 1:03:13Speaker 02

  She's fantastic. I use this word, normal, real. It's rare, but I appreciate all the moments.

• 1:03:19Dax Shepard?

  But the White House, doing makeup to get you to the White House.

• 1:03:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was in the motorcade. Some guy turns to me, says, who are you? And I said, well, I'm a makeup artist. And I said, who are you? He said, I'm Leon Panetta.

• 1:03:28Speaker 01

  Ah!

• 1:03:28Speaker 02

  I'm like, oh, okay, the Secretary of Defense. And I'm like, who are you? He's like, Secretary of Agriculture. I'm like, can you fix our crops?

• 1:03:36Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. Yeah, you're like, how am I here right now?

• 1:03:40Dax Shepard?

  There was a moment where we were at this table in India and it was, it was the Minister of Agriculture, Minister of Defense, Bill Gates, and everyone had name placards. And I said, Bob Castor. So then it was just like, this feels so stupid.

• 1:03:53Speaker 01

  And they were like brainstorming on how to like fix the world. And we're just sitting there like totally quiet.

• 1:03:59Speaker 02

  Did you not say anything?

• 1:04:00Speaker 01

  No, we couldn't contribute. Yeah, and at one point they were like going around introducing themselves. I was like, oh my God, what's gonna happen when they get us? But we got skipped. Oh, thank God.

• 1:04:11Speaker 02

  I was on the US Trade Commission, I had to do that too. And it was like weird.

• 1:04:15Speaker 01

  It's scary, yeah.

• 1:04:16Speaker 02

  And I just looked up and I looked for Papa Sam. Papa, do you believe that I'm sitting here doing this?

• 1:04:20Speaker 01

  Right? I know, that's so special.

• 1:04:23Speaker 02

  No matter what, I don't take it lightly. Being a makeup artist has gotten me some interesting, I just had something at Paul McCartney's house because we saw a movie. My husband and I walked out and we looked at each other, we're like, love this. Doing makeup brought me to this place. And then guess what I did? I went home and I did the laundry and I put away the dishes and I cleaned up and I do what I normally do.

• 1:04:42Speaker 01

  Went back to your regular life.

• 1:04:43Speaker 02

  I went back to my old self.

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, balancing both.

• 1:04:45Dax Shepard?

  Okay, now here's the tough part. So I'm watching this interview with you and it is taking place in one of your brick and mortar stores in presumably New York. And you're being interviewed, but you are so distracted with the fact that you're noticing on the wall, there's this photo that's been mounted to the wall and it's enormous. And you notice there's a tiny scratch in the photo on the neck. You're like, huh, okay, Erin, Erin, you're yelling, Erin, Erin, I want to go, we're on film, so Erin will know what the people are doing. Talking, talking, talking, he's like, this sign should be bigger. Well, Erin, so you have to be a perfectionist.

• 1:05:16Speaker 02

  I am.

• 1:05:16Dax Shepard?

  To build something in the way you did.

• 1:05:18Speaker 02

  But I'm also a micro, not a micromanager, I'm a multitasker. So I knew that once I walked off that set, I would not remember to tell Erin.

• 1:05:26Dax Shepard?

  It's now or never.

• 1:05:27Speaker 02

  It's now or never.

• 1:05:28Dax Shepard?

  I get that, but you are a perfectionist. I believe you have to be. But I would imagine it's hard to work for a perfectionist because I would imagine you might feel like, no matter what I do, she'll find something wrong with it.

• 1:05:41Speaker 02

  But by the way, the people that work really well with me, like Erin, who literally went to high school with my youngest son. I call her my baby creative director because I think she's finally 27, is phenomenal. And I can say, Erin, yuck, what happened to that? And she'd tell me, or Erin, she goes, yeah, I know they wanted that, but I'm like, I don't want that. Could you?

• 1:05:59Dax Shepard?

  Make it go away.

• 1:06:00Speaker 02

  Could you make it go away? Erin, that wrinkle under my left armpit, can you get rid of it? She's my guy. Like you could say anything to each other, you have each other's back.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  I'm a huge perfectionist as well and I edit the show and I think the same thing because I'm giving notes and like, they definitely hate me. Because I'm giving these half second notes. It's like that needs to come out because to me, it's everything, actually. It makes a huge difference.

• 1:06:24Dax Shepard?

  I agree with it. I'm just saying, how does one manage the tension of having to work that way and knowing that? I'll give you an example. Bill Gates, he said, there were many years where I came in and I leveled everyone and told them how to be. And I ultimately had to step back and go like, what is the net win? Do I leave that meeting and everyone feels defeated? And they no longer feel passionate about working. So, learning to curb, even if the end goal is, I want this thing to be great, recognizing that might not be the road to get to greatness.

• 1:06:53Speaker 02

  Well, first of all, having the right people on the team. You know, I've got my retail team, my creative team, my marketing team, my PR team, my PD team, the product development, which is the most important. They know me. And I'm like, guys. And they're like, you're right. And I'm like, thank you guys so much for working on this. I always make sure I thank them. And by the way, they also know that there's times where I am so insanely busy that I don't have a second for anything, or I haven't slept. And they're like, I know you only have a second, just please. And they've got to be passionate. And I have to be passionate about them.

• 1:07:21Speaker 01

  Does the perfectionism bleed into your personal life? Because I have found this to be a real problem. And I've been like talking to my therapist about this a lot lately because I've had multiple complaints, some from Dax, some from other people. That are like, I don't want to be picked at in life. Here is a different thing. This is my job.

• 1:07:43Dax Shepard?

  I want you to do exactly what you do on the show, and I want you to kill me. And then when we're having dinner on vacation, that's what I kind of said.

• 1:07:51Speaker 01

  He doesn't want me to...

• 1:07:53Dax Shepard?

  Edit me in real life.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  Yes. And other people have said this to me too. It's not just him. I don't want to be the type of person that sees everything that's wrong or is critical. But it is what I do here, and it's really hard to shut it off in life.

• 1:08:08Speaker 02

  The good thing is that we're always evolving and the best people are the ones that want to be better versions of themselves. I've had to let go of a lot of things and I've had to learn how to tell people I don't like things in a very different way than I used to. And I've evolved. I've worked really hard, especially with my son and my daughter-in-law, because I want to see the grandkids, number one. But also, we all want the same thing, but sometimes how you get there is tough.

• 1:08:33Speaker 01

  It's hard.

• 1:08:34Speaker 02

  It is. It's really hard. And relationships are hard. Do you know how many times Stephen will say to me, I don't work for you? Right? Don't come and bounce orders. Because I'm so used to saying, do this, do this, I need this, I need this.

• 1:08:45Dax Shepard?

  I've said that to my wife.

• 1:08:46Speaker 01

  It's hard to shut off.

• 1:08:47Speaker 02

  No, it is hard. And also, I'm anxious. I want things done and I'm always worried I'm gonna forget something. I take on everything because I care about everything.

• 1:08:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, same.

• 1:08:56Speaker 02

  And I care about my house. Like, I walk in my house and I re-merchandise things. I move books around or I make sure the bar looks good.

• 1:09:03Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:09:04Speaker 02

  I do. It's my thing.

• 1:09:05Speaker 01

  I do that too. You just have to make everything look perfect.

• 1:09:07Dax Shepard?

  You'd feel so comfortable in Monica's apartment.

• 1:09:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's really nice.

• 1:09:10Speaker 02

  Isn't it nice? Yeah.

• 1:09:12Dax Shepard?

  Everything. And there's a lot of re-merchandising.

• 1:09:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. Anytime I feel a little bit out of control, I will re-merchandise. I just look around, I'm like, okay, how can I reposition this?

• 1:09:21Dax Shepard?

  To test my internal feelings.

• 1:09:22Speaker 02

  You're gonna have to send me your cellphone because I find these things on Instagram that leads me to someone's organization wishlist and all of a sudden, I'm buying organizers, individual little baggies for cords.

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:09:35Speaker 02

  I'm like a nutcase because it does make me feel calm to open a drawer because there's chaos on the news, there's chaos everywhere.

• 1:09:42Dax Shepard?

  Mostly, there's chaos up here.

• 1:09:43Speaker 02

  There is chaos up there.

• 1:09:44Dax Shepard?

  The mind's not a friendly place.

• 1:09:45Speaker 02

  Right. But I'm never gonna change. I'm not going to meditate.

• 1:09:49Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:09:49Speaker 02

  Looking in the eye, I'm not going to meditate.

• 1:09:52Speaker 01

  Don't make me.

• 1:09:52Speaker 02

  I'm not going to.

• 1:09:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, you just have to find what works for you, I guess.

• 1:09:55Speaker 02

  You do. And not everything works.

• 1:09:57Dax Shepard?

  Well, Bobby, I adore you.

• 1:09:59Speaker 01

  Aww.

• 1:09:59Dax Shepard?

  I had so much fun sitting next to you. You really sparked the night up.

• 1:10:03Speaker 01

  Aww, thank you.

• 1:10:03Dax Shepard?

  There was a lot of different people there.

• 1:10:05Speaker 02

  It was very eclectic.

• 1:10:06Dax Shepard?

  It was. All right. Well, I hope I sit next to you again someday soon.

• 1:10:10Speaker 02

  I hope so too. And I hope it's not one of those things and I hope it's just at dinner one night.

• 1:10:14Dax Shepard?

  Well, I love your book, Still Bobby. Please check it out. I hope you'll come back and we'll get to talk to you again.

• 1:10:19Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:10:19Dax Shepard?

  So fun.

• 1:10:20Speaker 02

  It was a pleasure.

• 1:10:20Speaker 01

  Thanks.

• 1:10:50Dax Shepard?

  What I needed was something that just works where I'm already working. Not another tab to open, not another thing to set up. Superhuman Go from the makers of Grammarly is different. It's already right there inside your email, your docs, your browser. You don't go to it. It's already working alongside you. You're deep in a long thread, highlight it, and it pulls the key points. About to send something important? It flags what doesn't add up before it leaves your hands. It knows your style, your workflows, and it just backs you up without getting in the way. A thought partner that's already up to speed at your service, not after your job. So do yourself a favor and try Superhuman Go from the makers of Grammarly. Find out more at superhuman.com.

• 1:11:34Dax Shepard?

  We get support from Instagram teen accounts. So we talk a lot on this show about how the world is different now than when we were growing up. And one of the biggest differences is obviously social media. And I think a lot of people wonder, okay, what's actually being done to make it safer for teenagers?

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  Which is a fair question.

• 1:11:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so Instagram has got something called teen accounts and they come with automatic protections built in by default. So anyone between 13 and 17 is automatically placed into this experience. They get age appropriate content settings, contact limits, so that by default, only people they're already connected to can message them. And time management tools, daily time limit reminders, and also sleep mode that mutes notifications from 10:00 PM to 7:00 AM.

• 1:12:18Speaker 01

  Sleep mode is genius.

• 1:12:19Dax Shepard?

  Right? And here's the thing, for anyone under 16, a parent has to give permission to change any of those settings to be less strict. The guardrails are on and Instagram keeps building new safety features to create age appropriate experiences for teens.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  I am really glad Instagram is helping to give parents peace of mind with teen accounts.

• 1:12:39Dax Shepard?

  Learn more about teen accounts and Instagram's ongoing work to protect teens online at instagram.com/teenaccounts. We get support by Peloton. You know that feeling when you're spiraling over a problem and you just can't figure it out? When that happens to me, I need a change of pace and I've found that running is the best way. It takes my brain out of the driver's And I come back with a fresh perspective. Running can be freeing and cathartic and Peloton helps you feel all of that. And now that feeling fits wherever you need it with the new Peloton Tread Flex. It's movable and foldable, designed to fit your life. So next time you feel stuck, you can go for a run literally anywhere. Whether that's in your office, living room, or even the attic.

• 1:13:24Dax Shepard?

  Plus, they have classes with expert instructors and programs to meet you at any level and keep you moving. Let yourself run. Explore the new Peloton Tread Flex at onepeloton.com. We are supported by Walden University. You know that feeling when you've been thinking about making a move, going after the degree, the promotion, the thing you keep telling yourself you'll get to someday? Walden University is built for that moment. For over 50 years, Walden has helped working professionals get the W, the knowledge, the skills and the confidence to create real change in their careers and communities. Their programs are designed around your life, not the other way around.

• 1:14:05Dax Shepard?

  With Tempo Learning, available in select programs, there are no rigid schedules or set weekly deadlines. You move at your own pace. And Walden's faculty aren't just academics. They're practitioners who bring real world experience into everything they teach. From your first class to career coaching and beyond, Walden is your partner the whole way. Take the first step and learn at a pace that works for you. Visit waldenu.edu. Walden University. Set a course for change. Certified to operate by CHEV.

• 1:14:40Speaker 05

  Stay tuned for the fact check. It's where the party's at.

• 1:14:47Dax Shepard?

  Hello.

• 1:14:50Dax Shepard?

  Hello. Oh, we haven't talked, that's how Bob Durst talks, remember? We haven't talked like him in a while. Hello. Hi, and it's Bob. I'm in prison.

• 1:15:03Dax Shepard?

  How much is the house worth in Long Island? Oh, wow, 100 million?

• 1:15:09Speaker 01

  Even he found love again.

• 1:15:11Dax Shepard?

  He was irresistible. He had lots of lovers. I wanted to be one of his lovers.

• 1:15:17Speaker 01

  You wanted to date him.

• 1:15:19Dax Shepard?

  He passed, right?

• 1:15:21Speaker 01

  I think he passed.

• 1:15:22Dax Shepard?

  In prison. I'll never get to nurture him back to sanity.

• 1:15:26Speaker 01

  You won't.

• 1:15:28Dax Shepard?

  How you doing?

• 1:15:32Dax Shepard?

  Really great blue color, really great.

• 1:15:34Speaker 01

  Thank you. Yes, it's a new sweater.

• 1:15:36Dax Shepard?

  I feel like I would look good in that for the eye reason.

• 1:15:40Speaker 01

  You would. It would make your eyes pop. I also bought it in purple today because I liked it so much, putting it on. I was like, I want another color.

• 1:15:49Dax Shepard?

  Okay, sure.

• 1:15:50Speaker 01

  I bought it in purple, too.

• 1:15:52Dax Shepard?

  Did we discuss the fact that

• 1:15:57Dax Shepard?

  many, many people collected the Got Milk ads?

• 1:16:00Speaker 01

  See, I knew it.

• 1:16:01Dax Shepard?

  So, I guess it's a double edged sword. It's good news and bad news because I was like, wow, I found the criteria for who to hire.

• 1:16:07Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:16:08Dax Shepard?

  Like, I could almost start my own hiring service. And I just ask the applicants one question. I guarantee you, and I'm a phenomenal coworker.

• 1:16:17Dax Shepard?

  So, in some sense, I'm like, well, maybe I'm not being discerning enough because it turns out a lot of people. But also, good news, maybe there's a lot of great folks out there to work with.

• 1:16:27Speaker 01

  Maybe you're right because it's hard to collect them. Like, you really have to be on the lookout. You have to be on the prowl, keep your eyes wide open.

• 1:16:39Dax Shepard?

  I have such a vague memory. These were like, they'd have a celebrity in like a normal magazine and they'd be standing, they'd hold a glass of milk. Am I thinking of the right thing?

• 1:16:49Speaker 01

  They would have a milk mustache.

• 1:16:51Dax Shepard?

  A musta- a milk stash.

• 1:16:52Speaker 01

  And sometimes they'd be holding it, but not always. And in different scenarios, like, there's one with Jennifer Love Hewitt. She's in a kitchen and I think she's wearing like a flannel shirt, I think. And the kitchen's messy.

• 1:17:07Dax Shepard?

  Ah, but she's got milk.

• 1:17:08Speaker 01

  She's got milk and, well, does she? Because it's a question mark. Got milk?

• 1:17:12Dax Shepard?

  Oh, right, right, right.

• 1:17:14Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:17:16Speaker 01

  It was just really.

• 1:17:17Dax Shepard?

  It was a really celebrity driven campaign? Is that what made it so collectible?

• 1:17:21Speaker 01

  There she is.

• 1:17:22Dax Shepard?

  Hey.

• 1:17:22Speaker 01

  Hey, I really nailed it, didn't I?

• 1:17:24Dax Shepard?

  You fucking A, you did. Yeah, and it's a, the kitchen's a fucking mess.

• 1:17:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a mess, because she's made eggs and pancakes.

• 1:17:31Dax Shepard?

  But somehow she made perfect pancakes, but she has no regard for anything else. Like, the way she mixed the batter, it's all over the sides. Yet she did pour, pour them perfectly.

• 1:17:43Speaker 01

  Do you have an affinity for her because of Party of Five?

• 1:17:46Dax Shepard?

  I did like her on Party of Five, but I was a little older.

• 1:17:50Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 1:17:51Dax Shepard?

  And Nev was on the show.

• 1:17:53Speaker 01

  I know, both are great.

• 1:17:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:55Speaker 01

  I loved her, though.

• 1:17:56Dax Shepard?

  I mean, she started as kind of a kid.

• 1:17:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, she was a kid on the show.

• 1:18:00Dax Shepard?

  And then I did, and in my defense, I was, I was 18 when I was saying this. I did think, oh, she is becoming hot. Like, it is weird when these kids on shows become hot.

• 1:18:08Speaker 01

  Sure. Sure.

• 1:18:09Dax Shepard?

  Does that happen with the boys? Like, Jonathan Taylor Thomas, Jonathan Taylor Tammas. Tammo Shanters.

• 1:18:19Speaker 01

  Let's go with classic JTT.

• 1:18:20Dax Shepard?

  JTT, do you know I used him in Empire at Amy's birthday?

• 1:18:23Speaker 01

  You did?

• 1:18:24Dax Shepard?

  I did.

• 1:18:24Speaker 01

  Did they get, did you get caught?

• 1:18:26Dax Shepard?

  It took forever. I was one of the last people. That's a good one, right, for a Miss Lee? Because I think most people would think, I wouldn't even know that.

• 1:18:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right.

• 1:18:34Dax Shepard?

  There, oh, he had one!

• 1:18:36Speaker 01

  Of course he had one. I think I had him.

• 1:18:38Dax Shepard?

  Was it mostly all youth?

• 1:18:39Speaker 01

  No, no, there's oldies. Oh, yeah.

• 1:18:42Dax Shepard?

  Oldies with goodies? Any baddies? These are all goodies.

• 1:18:45Speaker 01

  Oh, no, there's baddies.

• 1:18:46Dax Shepard?

  Oh, there are?

• 1:18:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, those are the hard ones to find.

• 1:18:48Dax Shepard?

  Speaking of which.

• 1:18:50Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:18:51Dax Shepard?

  I have started the Charlie Sheen Netflix doc.

• 1:18:55Speaker 01

  How is it?

• 1:18:56Dax Shepard?

  Fucking awesome.

• 1:18:58Speaker 01

  Oh, great.

• 1:18:59Dax Shepard?

  It's so good.

• 1:19:00Speaker 01

  This is a Easter egg.

• 1:19:02Dax Shepard?

  This is, it's so good.

• 1:19:04Speaker 01

  I'm excited.

• 1:19:05Dax Shepard?

  And do you know what I didn't know? I mean, I knew, I was young enough to have been a, like, an audience goer when he broke out with, like, Platoon and Wall Street. So I remember, like, the meteoric rise, but it's not like you knew a ton about him back then. There was no way to, there wasn't social media, blah, blah, blah.

• 1:19:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:19:22Dax Shepard?

  I had no idea. He and Nick Cage were, like, inseparable best friends.

• 1:19:26Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. Did they have a falling out?

• 1:19:28Dax Shepard?

  I doubt it, the way he's chatting about, he clearly loves him to death still.

• 1:19:33Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:19:33Dax Shepard?

  But that famous Letterman story that Nick Cage tells, where they were, he was on a flight to San Francisco and he got ahold of the intercom system and he said, "This is your pilot."

• 1:19:46Speaker 03

  Speaking, I'm feeling unwell and I'm losing control of the aircraft.

• 1:19:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:54Dax Shepard?

  He was with Charlie. The two of them were going on that trip and Charlie had an ounce of cocaine taped to his ankle. And when they got off the plane, the police were there.

• 1:20:03Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. How do you get the, oh, security was different then?

• 1:20:08Dax Shepard?

  Well, you could still go through with the cocaine around your ankles, as long as they didn't pat you down. It wouldn't set off a detector or anything.

• 1:20:14Speaker 01

  Not now, though.

• 1:20:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I flew with cocaine post nine 11.

• 1:20:18Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:20:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. I'm sorry. Well, I just told this story the other day. I'm sorry, but we made it.

• 1:20:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I had brought, so you know, I had gone out and I, I mean, it was during Idiocracy. I had done a table read. I knew I was gonna get sober for the movie, but I had like a week before the table read and the filming starting. So it's like, I went to the table read.

• 1:20:42Speaker 01

  Guess what?

• 1:20:43Dax Shepard?

  What?

• 1:20:43Speaker 01

  It's nine 11.

• 1:20:44Dax Shepard?

  I know.

• 1:20:46Speaker 01

  Ding ding ding.

• 1:20:46Dax Shepard?

  That's crazy.

• 1:20:48Speaker 01

  Don't say you didn't.

• 1:20:50Dax Shepard?

  I didn't know it was nine 11.

• 1:20:51Speaker 01

  But you didn't know what you were doing.

• 1:20:52Dax Shepard?

  I didn't know it was such a ding ding ding.

• 1:20:54Speaker 01

  Okay, great. Okay, so it's for Idiocracy.

• 1:20:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so I went to like down there for a table read and a fitting and it went well. Like I did good in the tables. I was feeling great.

• 1:21:02Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh.

• 1:21:03Dax Shepard?

  So you had to reward yourself. I went out and on Sixth Street and before you know it, I've got coke and I meet someone and you know, I have a whole night and then now it's now it's morning time and it's time to go to the airport.

• 1:21:17Speaker 01

  And you do deed in your bed.

• 1:21:18Dax Shepard?

  I didn't do any duty. I was, I was very clean, but I had to then go get on an airplane and I hadn't slept. So like, I gotta, I'm gonna, I gotta bring this through security with me because I'm gonna crash. Like I'm gonna have the most miserable flight of my life. I'm starting to come down. What I don't bore you with the addict's dilemma, but suffice to say, I took it through security and I went to a bar and I started getting kind of paranoid while I was at the bar, having a Jack and Diet because. Obvious reasons and I'm like, I'm about to start a movie. What if I got arrested? You know, this could derail everything. I just did so good yesterday. No, I'm ruining.

• 1:21:55Speaker 01

  Oh my.

• 1:21:55Dax Shepard?

  So my solution was I went to the bathroom. I went to the handicap stall and there was a huge toilet paper dispenser with like the double rolls. And I put my hand way up there and there was like a little shelf up in there. So I put my bag, well, I did a bunch and then I put my bag of Coke up in this dispenser. And then I went back to the bar and had like another Jack and Diet. And after that one, I'm like, oh, I'd like a bump. So I go back to the handicap bathroom. And Monica, I put my hand on like down the thing and I'm fishing around inside this toilet paper dispenser. And I'm like, oh, fuck, it's not here. And then I like look and it's not fallen anywhere. And in my brain, which has now been up for, you know, day and a half, two days.

• 1:22:37Dax Shepard?

  It's more. I go, oh, fuck. They, someone found it. Like they pulled the toilet paper. They found it. They alerted the authorities. The authorities have been waiting to see who's gonna go into the handicap stall. So I sat in this handicap stall like 1,000% convinced that there were cops in the, in the bathroom, waiting for me. And I was just like, what do we do? What's our game plan? We gotta, well, we don't have any honors. But they know, cause they, and eventually I was like, I gotta face the music. And then I walk in, there's nobody, there's nobody there. Who knows where that went? Somebody presumably got a free bag.

• 1:23:17Speaker 01

  But also so wild that somebody would think to, maybe it was, it was probably someone cleaning the bathroom who was replacing the toilet paper and found it. I hope, I mean, I hope.

• 1:23:28Dax Shepard?

  Sometimes you give those things a good yank or maybe they rattled it enough that it fell out. And then maybe the other guy was a playboy and he was like, hey, look at this.

• 1:23:37Speaker 01

  I mean, a lot of things have to be coming together for that. Cause if I yanked on a toilet paper and Coke fell down.

• 1:23:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you'd scream.

• 1:23:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And you'd be like, snakes. But in them, in your mind at that time, cause I already know I'm in, I know I'm a bad boy. I should not be doing this. I should be being sober for this movie. I'm also supposed to be gaining a lot of weight and I haven't now eaten in 36 hours, but that's a side note. But the notion that if a bag of Coke is found, that they will now initiate a sting operation.

• 1:24:08Speaker 01

  That's how I feel.

• 1:24:09Dax Shepard?

  Never, I mean, that would never happen.

• 1:24:10Speaker 01

  Don't say never, never say never. I would assume, yeah, they would fingerprint this.

• 1:24:15Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:24:16Speaker 01

  And they would see who came.

• 1:24:17Dax Shepard?

  All.

• 1:24:18Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:24:18Dax Shepard?

  They have a grubby little fingerprint.

• 1:24:20Speaker 01

  Who came through the airport, around what time, who's they, I felt, feel like they could find you.

• 1:24:26Dax Shepard?

  I even think I was like, oh my God, I gotta, cause you know, I'm using a key.

• 1:24:30Speaker 01

  What do you mean?

• 1:24:31Dax Shepard?

  Know that, like I'm dipping my key in the bag and doing key bumps.

• 1:24:35Speaker 01

  Why?

• 1:24:35Dax Shepard?

  That's how I'm getting it in my body. Well, I gotta get it out of this bag and into my nasal passage.

• 1:24:39Speaker 01

  Why can't you use your finger?

• 1:24:41Dax Shepard?

  Like stick my finger in the, what, put my finger in my nose?

• 1:24:44Speaker 01

  That's weirder than putting it on a key.

• 1:24:46Dax Shepard?

  You can make a little pile and then you can.

• 1:24:48Speaker 01

  I can't believe you, you just acted like what I was saying was crazy.

• 1:24:52Dax Shepard?

  Well, if you ever tried to do coke with your finger, you'd find out that was a crazy plan.

• 1:24:56Speaker 01

  Nails.

• 1:24:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that's why weirdos have long coke nails, but I didn't have a coke nail, cause I was a responsible person.

• 1:25:03Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, you were so responsible.

• 1:25:04Dax Shepard?

  But then I was like, oh, I gotta get all the coke off my key, like my key probably would.

• 1:25:10Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:25:11Dax Shepard?

  Would, would light up like a Christmas tree if they put a whatever magic coke wand in my mind they had.

• 1:25:16Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:25:17Dax Shepard?

  So then I was like sucking on the key to get every remnant off.

• 1:25:20Speaker 01

  Oh, no. Oh my God, addicts are so.

• 1:25:25Dax Shepard?

  We do a lot of weird, we end up doing a lot of weird stuff, yeah.

• 1:25:29Speaker 01

  Like now the, the idea of putting a key in your mouth, doesn't that gross you out?

• 1:25:34Dax Shepard?

  Absolutely.

• 1:25:35Speaker 01

  Like the amount of germs, that's like one of the worst things you can put in your mouth.

• 1:25:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and it just is metal.

• 1:25:42Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:25:43Dax Shepard?

  It's disgusting, but I had to get rid of the evidence.

• 1:25:47Speaker 01

  Did you think about swallowing the key?

• 1:25:49Dax Shepard?

  I am key stirring the key.

• 1:25:52Speaker 01

  Whoa.

• 1:25:53Dax Shepard?

  Key stirring the key.

• 1:25:54Speaker 01

  Key stirring.

• 1:25:55Dax Shepard?

  Anyways, Got Milk ads, a lot of people collected them.

• 1:25:58Speaker 01

  I think a lot of the people who've collected Got Milk keys have never found themselves in the situation you have. They're busy, they're at the newsstand.

• 1:26:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:07Speaker 01

  Buying up. All the magazines so that on the flight, they can look each one very carefully, page by page, see if you found.

• 1:26:16Dax Shepard?

  Were you making your mom take you to newsstands to further your collection? It sounds like something you, a task you would put on her plate.

• 1:26:23Speaker 01

  I don't know. She wouldn't have done. She would, no.

• 1:26:26Dax Shepard?

  No?

• 1:26:27Speaker 01

  She doesn't have time for that.

• 1:26:28Dax Shepard?

  You were like, we gotta go camp out for this book. You did a lot of these little projects, right?

• 1:26:33Speaker 01

  Then I was old, like I would like go with friends. I was old enough.

• 1:26:37Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:26:37Speaker 01

  So yeah, if I was, if we were at the airport or at the grocery store, yes, I probably would have asked.

• 1:26:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, can we buy these six magazines?

• 1:26:44Speaker 01

  Can I please buy all of these? And then I think I had some subscriptions, like I had probably like teen.

• 1:26:52Dax Shepard?

  Did you earn money as a kid?

• 1:26:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, I had allowance.

• 1:26:56Dax Shepard?

  You had an allowance?

• 1:26:56Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:26:57Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:26:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:26:58Dax Shepard?

  So you had a little around town Casey.

• 1:27:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, I had so many ads.

• 1:27:03Dax Shepard?

  So many. He did.

• 1:27:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's so many. They were great. The best ones were the casts. They would do like a full cast.

• 1:27:11Dax Shepard?

  Did friends ever got milk?

• 1:27:12Speaker 01

  Well, Jen Am, I think had one.

• 1:27:15Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:27:15Speaker 01

  Maybe her and Courtney and Lisa, like there was like a few.

• 1:27:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:20Speaker 01

  I have it. I have it.

• 1:27:25Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:27:32Dax Shepard?

  We get support from ZipRecruiter. Oh, get recruiting. So I went down this rabbit hole the other day on real holiday jobs that exist and I couldn't stop. Somebody out there is hiring a ham glazer, a professional ham glazer. Another place is hiring a lead elf, implying a whole hierarchy of elves I had never even considered. Here's the thing, these jobs need real skills. People like that are hard to find. And whether you're hiring for one of these roles or any other role, the best way to find qualified people who are genuinely excited about your role is on ZipRecruiter. And right now you can try it for free at ziprecruiter.com/dax. Plus ZipRecruiter has a new feature that shows you the most interested qualified candidates first.

• 1:28:16Dax Shepard?

  So you meet the right people fact. No wonder ZipRecruiter is the number one rated hiring site based on G2. Let ZipRecruiter find the right people for your roles, seasonal or otherwise. Try it for free today at ziprecruiter.com/dax. At ziprecruiter.com/dax, meet your match on ZipRecruiter.

• 1:28:45Dax Shepard?

  When they pitched the idea originally, do you think people were like, so we're gonna coat the top of their lip?

• 1:28:52Speaker 01

  They're gonna paint it.

• 1:28:53Dax Shepard?

  With white cream?

• 1:28:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think they probably painted it.

• 1:28:56Dax Shepard?

  Was anyone like?

• 1:28:57Speaker 01

  This is gross.

• 1:28:58Dax Shepard?

  This might look.

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  There it is!

• 1:29:00Dax Shepard?

  Oh!

• 1:29:02Speaker 01

  Yes, I have that one.

• 1:29:03Dax Shepard?

  They just left an orgy.

• 1:29:04Speaker 01

  No, don't you dare.

• 1:29:05Dax Shepard?

  That was my fear.

• 1:29:06Speaker 01

  Don't you dare dirty this up, you dirty boy.

• 1:29:10Dax Shepard?

  Everyone is so young.

• 1:29:11Speaker 01

  I know, yeah. Rob put up a picture of Jen An and Lisa Kudrow.

• 1:29:16Dax Shepard?

  She looks nineteen.

• 1:29:17Speaker 01

  They were young. They were young back then.

• 1:29:19Dax Shepard?

  Remember, Lisa said she felt like the old lady.

• 1:29:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, look how cute she is.

• 1:29:24Dax Shepard?

  She was so young and cute.

• 1:29:25Speaker 01

  Oh, beautiful girls. Speaking of semen.

• 1:29:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, sure. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:33Speaker 01

  So I'm not gonna out this brand. I've been trying some new makeup foundations.

• 1:29:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:39Speaker 01

  I'm loving all of them, loving all the colors.

• 1:29:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:43Speaker 01

  And the textures and stuff, but I'm playing with a lot of them. So I don't want people to try to figure out which one this is, okay?

• 1:29:49Dax Shepard?

  Right, right.

• 1:29:52Speaker 01

  Today, I...

• 1:29:55Dax Shepard?

  It was in your lab.

• 1:29:56Speaker 01

  I put makeup on. I walked outside and I was like, it smells funny out here.

• 1:30:03Speaker 01

  And I was like, oh, maybe it's like Bradford pear season. You know, classically, the Bradford pear smells like semen.

• 1:30:11Dax Shepard?

  Oh, semen.

• 1:30:12Speaker 01

  Slash, period, slash, death. So I was like, God, are we there? Like, ew, stinky.

• 1:30:21Dax Shepard?

  Hold on, nice. What a combo of words next to each other. Like, if there was a perfume called semen period, I mean, wow.

• 1:30:30Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:30:30Dax Shepard?

  I wonder if there was ever a punk band named semen period.

• 1:30:34Speaker 01

  Well, Guar could get on it. It seems like something they would like.

• 1:30:38Dax Shepard?

  If you were a horned, pig-faced goblin.

• 1:30:40Speaker 01

  That's right. Um, yeah. It's probably like one of the gifts God gave humans that, you know, the person who has a period also doesn't release semen in case. So those never really have to mix.

• 1:30:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, right, right, right.

• 1:30:57Speaker 01

  Although they could mix in the sexual experience.

• 1:31:00Dax Shepard?

  Sure, ideally.

• 1:31:00Speaker 01

  Okay, now I'm walking to the car and I'm like, yeah. And then I have this realization.

• 1:31:08Dax Shepard?

  Your foundation?

• 1:31:10Speaker 01

  Yes. Do you smell it?

• 1:31:12Dax Shepard?

  God, no, no, no.

• 1:31:13Speaker 01

  You can't smell it from there?

• 1:31:15Dax Shepard?

  Twenty feet away, your face.

• 1:31:16Speaker 01

  I.

• 1:31:17Dax Shepard?

  You still smell it.

• 1:31:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:20Dax Shepard?

  That would be a bummer for me if I had a smell on my face I couldn't.

• 1:31:23Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:31:23Dax Shepard?

  Get rid of.

• 1:31:24Speaker 01

  And I, I like this foundation. There's many that have sunscreens built in.

• 1:31:29Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:31:30Speaker 01

  This is one of those.

• 1:31:32Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:31:32Speaker 01

  And I think it might be part of the ish.

• 1:31:35Dax Shepard?

  The sunscreen?

• 1:31:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, part of what's adding to the smell.

• 1:31:38Dax Shepard?

  Oh, isn't sunscreen odorless?

• 1:31:42Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:31:42Dax Shepard?

  No? I mean, they put that yummy coconut flavor in like, Coppertone or.

• 1:31:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, they add that.

• 1:31:49Dax Shepard?

  The fun ones. It smells like vacation.

• 1:31:51Speaker 01

  Even regular like SPF generally, sunscreen has a smell, you know it. It doesn't smell like semen, I'll say that. But I think maybe the mix of, of ingredients has caused a semen-like smell.

• 1:32:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:05Speaker 01

  It's unfortunate.

• 1:32:06Dax Shepard?

  It's a bummer that semen smells the way.

• 1:32:09Speaker 01

  It's a bummer that bodies smell the way they do. They, we just like, it's gross. We have all these smells.

• 1:32:15Dax Shepard?

  Okay, great. I knew there was something we're supposed to be talking about and I just remembered.

• 1:32:21Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:32:22Dax Shepard?

  So you and I. We're in a competition this week.

• 1:32:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, we were.

• 1:32:27Dax Shepard?

  We went on, um, Hot Ones versus.

• 1:32:30Speaker 01

  Yes, me and you did.

• 1:32:31Dax Shepard?

  Yes, and we ate, uh, five chicken wings.

• 1:32:36Speaker 01

  Hot Ones versus is a spin off of Hot Ones. It's more of a competition show, so it was me versus you.

• 1:32:41Dax Shepard?

  That's right, and on Hot Ones, if people don't, haven't watched that, you get interviewed by Sean Evans. He, uh, asks you questions as you're eating hot wings and they're getting progressively hotter.

• 1:32:51Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:32:52Dax Shepard?

  And the last one is generally brutal.

• 1:32:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:54Dax Shepard?

  It takes people out.

• 1:32:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:55Dax Shepard?

  Even number seven starts taking people out.

• 1:32:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:57Dax Shepard?

  Well, this show is, it's only number 10.

• 1:33:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:00Dax Shepard?

  Every wing has the hottest of the hot.

• 1:33:02Speaker 01

  It was so.

• 1:33:03Dax Shepard?

  It's smart.

• 1:33:04Speaker 01

  It is, well, look, I was so, like, really truly nervous to do this show. And you notoriously went on original Hot Ones. You did great on Hot Ones, so much so that you asked for another of the last wing. You threw a whole bunch of hots.

• 1:33:22Dax Shepard?

  They put me in the ring of fire. I don't know if that's what it's called. If it's not, they should call it that. But it was like kind of a champion circle of people who took the heat the best.

• 1:33:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, you, you did great.

• 1:33:31Dax Shepard?

  It's one of my identity markers.

• 1:33:32Speaker 01

  Exactly, and I knew this, and so I was also like, well, fuck, like.

• 1:33:36Dax Shepard?

  It was like you and I playing one on one basketball. It's like, why is this the versus?

• 1:33:39Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:33:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:40Speaker 01

  Um, so I will spoil a little bit that you ate first.

• 1:33:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, uh huh.

• 1:33:46Speaker 01

  And you, it was like, it was really hot for you.

• 1:33:50Dax Shepard?

  Well, I started salivating quite a bit.

• 1:33:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I, I started to really panic.

• 1:33:54Dax Shepard?

  Oh, when you saw that it was affecting me?

• 1:33:56Speaker 01

  Yes, because you apparently can eat two of the last one and you are struggling. So then I was really starting to panic. Anyway, it was really fun. You guys will have to tune in.

• 1:34:06Dax Shepard?

  It was super fun, and you thought you were gonna fall over a lot.

• 1:34:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, I did.

• 1:34:09Dax Shepard?

  It was really funny.

• 1:34:11Speaker 01

  I didn't feel steady.

• 1:34:13Dax Shepard?

  No, I definitely got concerned and I didn't vocalize it because I thought, well, that'll only compound it. But I really started thinking, after you had a good amount of fire in you and you were feeling like you were gonna fall over. I was like.

• 1:34:25Dax Shepard?

  Is a panic attack on the table?

• 1:34:27Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:34:28Dax Shepard?

  You know.

• 1:34:28Speaker 01

  It's always on the table.

• 1:34:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just only because of the SoulCycle stuff, I know.

• 1:34:33Speaker 01

  Right, and you weren't right about a seizure.

• 1:34:35Dax Shepard?

  Not at all.

• 1:34:36Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:34:36Dax Shepard?

  I don't think that. I don't think that would trigger a seizure. For what, right or wrong, I just don't think that.

• 1:34:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:42Dax Shepard?

  But um, once you were getting wobbly and I started thinking like, oh man, like if she has a panic attack, how do I?

• 1:34:48Speaker 01

  What would you do?

• 1:34:49Dax Shepard?

  How do I help her?

• 1:34:51Speaker 01

  Great question.

• 1:34:52Dax Shepard?

  And it's probably not saying you're imagining this. You know, it's not gonna be like, no one's ever died from this, you can't die, that no one's ever been hurt, you know. I, I, and then I'm like, well, it's probably not gonna be like, it's probably gotta be more like acknowledging, yeah, you are getting, I don't know, I don't know how you get someone out of a panic attack.

• 1:35:09Speaker 01

  I mean.

• 1:35:10Dax Shepard?

  Put my wall in your mouth?

• 1:35:13Speaker 01

  This harkens back to when I was having a panic attack during shrooms.

• 1:35:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh, uh huh, would you call that a panic attack?

• 1:35:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:21Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:35:21Speaker 01

  Yes, um.

• 1:35:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so we did, we did a right.

• 1:35:24Speaker 01

  Truest sense, like I was like, I can't breathe.

• 1:35:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:28Speaker 01

  More, that was a kind of a different panic attack. Normally in my panic attacks, like, I feel like I'm gonna pass, I start like kinda disassociating and, but this was, I couldn't breathe.

• 1:35:37Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:35:37Speaker 01

  Which is sort of a common panic attack.

• 1:35:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:40Speaker 01

  And you said, I think you said, no one's ever stopped breathing from?

• 1:35:45Dax Shepard?

  Mushrooms.

• 1:35:45Speaker 01

  Shrooms.

• 1:35:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:47Speaker 01

  Um, which did work, or I think, I mean, I eventually was able to breathe.

• 1:35:53Dax Shepard?

  There, I think there were a bunch of baby steps, that was one of them.

• 1:35:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that I guess is a good tactic.

• 1:35:58Dax Shepard?

  Okay, I'll stick with it.

• 1:35:59Speaker 01

  On me, on me, anyway.

• 1:36:01Dax Shepard?

  So, but what's funny is, it just so happened to fall on the same day, I was taking Nate, Eric and Charlie to the Dodgers game.

• 1:36:10Speaker 01

  Yes, that night.

• 1:36:11Dax Shepard?

  And we go primarily because my agency has great seats in what is called the dugout club.

• 1:36:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:19Dax Shepard?

  And I am not gonna act like I am into baseball tattle. I don't know a thing about it, I barely, you know, I like, it's a great place to go have a great chat with the boys and scream a bit.

• 1:36:30Speaker 01

  It's so fun.

• 1:36:31Dax Shepard?

  It's so fun, but I don't know who's leading or if the team's good, I don't know anything.

• 1:36:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:36Dax Shepard?

  I go, cause there is an all you can eat bar in the dugout club, and it is. Premium. They had a pot roast, Monica.

• 1:36:44Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:36:45Dax Shepard?

  I love a pot roast. I had it at Dollywood and then I just had it here.

• 1:36:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:49Dax Shepard?

  I want more pot roast in my life.

• 1:36:50Speaker 01

  Okay, my mom loves to make a pot roast.

• 1:36:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, she, tell her to make me one. The next time she's visiting.

• 1:36:55Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:36:55Dax Shepard?

  All right. Um, they had a beautiful hot honey fried chicken.

• 1:36:59Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:37:00Dax Shepard?

  So the whole game plan with the boys and it's all talked about way before. It's like, hey, heads up, everybody, don't eat today.

• 1:37:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:37:07Dax Shepard?

  And so really I had, I had, in my mind, I hadn't eaten. Um, I had oatmeal in the morning at like 7 a.m.

• 1:37:14Speaker 01

  Okay, so you ditched the plan already. You ate.

• 1:37:17Dax Shepard?

  I ate because we had to eat those wings, but it wasn't like, I was like, I'm not gonna eat lunch. I'm not gonna, whatever. I wanna, I want, I'm gonna eat 7,000 calories in about 45 minutes, once we get to this thing. And so, and also I didn't want to betray the pact.

• 1:37:28Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:37:28Dax Shepard?

  So we arrive and I said to everyone, like, what was it? Charlie's like, I've only had a protein shake today. And we're like, goo- good job. And then, you know, everyone's going to the thing. And I'm like, I just had oatmeal. I don't know why. I like forgot.

• 1:37:38Speaker 01

  Well, okay, I know why you forgot. You don't, you don't feel like you're eating.

• 1:37:42Dax Shepard?

  No, it wasn't a meal. Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I just, I, I forgot I had had that.

• 1:37:47Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:37:47Dax Shepard?

  Then we go to the thing and that's really fun and we go hard and I eat so much. I even have a sundae. Oh, this was a total hack. If anyone's ever goes to the dugout club, they had fried plantains.

• 1:37:59Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:37:59Dax Shepard?

  But they're on the hot bar. They're on the other side of the thing. And then, on the far end of the place, there's a soft serve machine and like some toppings.

• 1:38:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:07Dax Shepard?

  So I made my soft serve and I was like, oh, fuck, fried plantains on there. That's like a banana split, but fried? Pop those in there. It was heaven. We all, we all ate so much. We had so much fun. I made a good joke that I thought of your brother during.

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:38:21Dax Shepard?

  Cause your brother was Kookie Jeps or?

• 1:38:23Speaker 01

  No, Mu- Mookie Betts.

• 1:38:25Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's the actual guy.

• 1:38:27Speaker 01

  Jookie Betts.

• 1:38:28Dax Shepard?

  J- Jookie Betts. He had a, he had or has a hat company in reference to.

• 1:38:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, but that's actually just Instagram.

• 1:38:34Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:38:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:35Dax Shepard?

  Mookie Betts is on the, uh, Dodgers and all these guys have the best asses. And we're directly behind home where they warm up.

• 1:38:45Speaker 01

  Ooh, did you make fart noises?

• 1:38:47Dax Shepard?

  No, but I did. I did heckle him.

• 1:38:49Speaker 01

  Oh, great.

• 1:38:49Dax Shepard?

  It was Mookie Betts and he was like eight feet away. And I had, again, I had a gaggle of like 60 year old women in front of me, which was great. And then he's up there kind of just warming up and he's so close and I go, Mookie Betts, more like Mookie Buns.

• 1:39:04Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:39:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:05Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:39:06Dax Shepard?

  The ladies loved it. It's a great compliment to him. I think it put a spring in his step. He had a dynamite night.

• 1:39:14Speaker 01

  Did he?

• 1:39:14Dax Shepard?

  He knocked some homies.

• 1:39:15Speaker 01

  Okay, but maybe he was so insecure. Maybe he has an insecurity about his big butt.

• 1:39:20Dax Shepard?

  No way. When you got those juicy.

• 1:39:22Speaker 01

  Jukey bets.

• 1:39:24Dax Shepard?

  Juicy jukey bets.

• 1:39:26Speaker 01

  But maybe he was like, all anyone thinks about is my butt and no one recognizes me for the athlete that I am.

• 1:39:32Dax Shepard?

  I mean, that's, that's a sentence that makes sense.

• 1:39:37Dax Shepard?

  There's no way anyone hates having a great ass. I just, maybe because I, I, I was denied a great ass.

• 1:39:44Speaker 01

  Exactly. So you might not know.

• 1:39:46Dax Shepard?

  Right. But I'm pretty sure everyone would like to know they have a great ass.

• 1:39:49Speaker 01

  Okay, great.

• 1:39:51Dax Shepard?

  So that was a blast. Yelling Mookie Buns, all this stuff. It's so fun.

• 1:39:57Dax Shepard?

  Go home. Next morning, I'm like, I want to check in with the guys because again, we all ate probably 10,000 calories. And so I'm like.

• 1:40:06Speaker 01

  But you felt fine?

• 1:40:07Dax Shepard?

  No. I midway through, I kept thinking, am I going to have harness?

• 1:40:13Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:40:14Dax Shepard?

  But I was confused because I had literally forgot we had eaten all these insanely hot wings.

• 1:40:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:19Dax Shepard?

  So they were in my intestines.

• 1:40:22Speaker 01

  Making their way through.

• 1:40:23Dax Shepard?

  Yes. And you can feel the heat the whole time and it felt like squirrels fighting and I thought, oh, that's harness coming. But so I was totally off base and I kept telling the guys, I might, I might have harness.

• 1:40:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:33Dax Shepard?

  But anyways, the next morning I check in with the guys. I'm like, anyone have harness? It took me two trips, but I, I got there. And then immediately Nate's like, it was, I knew it was the pot roast. I didn't touch that pot roast and I feel great. Blah, blah, blah. And then all of a sudden I realized, oh, and then I write. Oh yeah, I also had five hot wings at maximum temperature.

• 1:40:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:59Dax Shepard?

  And that was like, pretty relevant detail to leave out. I was, I was like fishing to see if everyone got harness from this experience.

• 1:41:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, you thought like, maybe it was food poisoning?

• 1:41:09Dax Shepard?

  Or just, I would like to know if everyone else had harness. But it was the wings.

• 1:41:13Speaker 01

  So, it was definitely the wings. Um, also, food poisoning is last on the list, like.

• 1:41:20Dax Shepard?

  I didn't think I had food poisoning.

• 1:41:22Speaker 01

  Cause like.

• 1:41:22Dax Shepard?

  I saw maybe a bad combination, like dairy, the plantains, the pot roast.

• 1:41:27Speaker 01

  The amount you ate.

• 1:41:28Dax Shepard?

  The amount, maybe.

• 1:41:29Speaker 01

  The amount is just enough to create a tornado.

• 1:41:32Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes, they just don't mix well.

• 1:41:34Speaker 01

  I also, I thought I was gonna have harness, but I didn't.

• 1:41:39Dax Shepard?

  You did not?

• 1:41:40Speaker 01

  Which was surprising.

• 1:41:41Dax Shepard?

  Are you sure?

• 1:41:42Speaker 01

  Well, no, I'm sure.

• 1:41:43Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:41:44Speaker 01

  But I did have an interesting movement.

• 1:41:47Dax Shepard?

  Okay, great. This is basically, that long lead up was to find out what happened for you the next morning.

• 1:41:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, no, that night.

• 1:41:54Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that night.

• 1:41:55Speaker 01

  I have a fast acting system.

• 1:41:57Dax Shepard?

  Fast acting, it's an act.

• 1:41:58Speaker 01

  In fact, I was a little nervous during eating.

• 1:42:02Dax Shepard?

  You even said you might tonka.

• 1:42:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, I could tonka there or on the way home. I don't know. Um, but I, I wasn't, and I too kind of forgot.

• 1:42:12Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:42:13Speaker 01

  But when I first got home, I was like, oh, I'm definitely gonna poop.

• 1:42:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:17Speaker 01

  And, um, but then I didn't, and I think that was, as you said, the squirrels.

• 1:42:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the squirrels fighting.

• 1:42:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, they were fighting.

• 1:42:24Dax Shepard?

  Like the way they run around the branches?

• 1:42:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:27Speaker 01

  But they didn't wanna come out. They didn't wanna come down the tree.

• 1:42:30Dax Shepard?

  They were blast? Yeah, they love playing.

• 1:42:32Speaker 01

  So then I forgot. I had wine with a friend. I was out and about. And then, yeah, then that night I was like, oh god, I feel. So full. But why do I feel so full? I barely, I didn't eat today.

• 1:42:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, great, you forgot too.

• 1:42:52Speaker 01

  I also kind of forgot, but then I was like, oh, God, yeah, it's the wings.

• 1:42:58Dax Shepard?

  It's the fiery wings.

• 1:42:59Speaker 01

  And then I had an interesting movement. It wasn't honest.

• 1:43:02Dax Shepard?

  Did you feel heat when it passed through?

• 1:43:05Speaker 01

  That's a good, I didn't feel heat, but I felt pain.

• 1:43:10Dax Shepard?

  Pain, yeah.

• 1:43:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, it felt painful. It felt as if it was honest, but then when I looked, it wasn't.

• 1:43:16Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:43:17Speaker 01

  Which was interesting.

• 1:43:18Dax Shepard?

  I had, I had pain, but I didn't have burning.

• 1:43:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:21Dax Shepard?

  Which I guess is a blessing. Cause I have had burning once.

• 1:43:25Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:43:25Dax Shepard?

  And that's, that was that Carolina Reaper chocolate.

• 1:43:29Speaker 01

  I don't want that.

• 1:43:30Dax Shepard?

  You can't do it, no. You thought you were gonna fall over on those wings.

• 1:43:35Speaker 01

  It's funny though, because last night, um, the girls, we went to a incredible Thai restaurant. So good. And one of the dishes we got was this papaya salad. It was incredible. It was spicy, um, and one of the girls was like eating it and she was like, oh, my God. Like, it was like so, so spicy for her.

• 1:43:55Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:43:56Speaker 01

  And I thought, how is, how are people doing hot ones? Like, a lot of people, I think, are like our friend, Laura, who could like barely eat this papaya salad.

• 1:44:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:07Speaker 01

  How, like, on the scale compared to what we had to eat, it was nothing.

• 1:44:12Dax Shepard?

  Right, right. Yeah, she would be in big, big trouble.

• 1:44:15Speaker 01

  She'd be dead. Has anyone died on it?

• 1:44:18Dax Shepard?

  No, people like get the burps and they can't answer the question and then, I'm, I'm doing, now I'm doing. But that's the appeal of the show, is people lose their shit.

• 1:44:28Speaker 01

  You know what was weird? You didn't drink any milk.

• 1:44:31Dax Shepard?

  I didn't, no.

• 1:44:31Speaker 01

  I thought that was so weird.

• 1:44:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I just was imagining putting dairy on top of that. It just felt like not the combo I wanted.

• 1:44:38Speaker 01

  It really helped.

• 1:44:39Dax Shepard?

  It did.

• 1:44:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, I drank so much.

• 1:44:41Dax Shepard?

  You brought a big jar of honey with you. And then when we got in the truck, you had like a humongous scoop of honey.

• 1:44:48Speaker 01

  I brought a bottle of honey and a spoon in a, in a Ziploc bag, because I was told that honey helps. So the last one you eat, you add all this extra hot sauce to. So that one is.

• 1:45:04Dax Shepard?

  Nuclear.

• 1:45:05Speaker 01

  It is nuclear. Like, I, my lips were burning for five hours.

• 1:45:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I touched my penis and testicles.

• 1:45:15Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:45:16Dax Shepard?

  And I had washed my hands before I peed. So I thought it was off my fingers. And I had quite a bit of discomfort on my penis and everywhere I touched.

• 1:45:27Speaker 01

  Alley.

• 1:45:28Dax Shepard?

  South of my belt.

• 1:45:30Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:45:30Dax Shepard?

  For a while.

• 1:45:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:32Dax Shepard?

  Then I went to sauna later.

• 1:45:33Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 1:45:34Dax Shepard?

  Before the game.

• 1:45:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:36Dax Shepard?

  And it reignited all the pain.

• 1:45:38Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:45:39Dax Shepard?

  Everything caught back on fire.

• 1:45:41Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 1:45:42Dax Shepard?

  And then somehow I forgot I had done that. A half hour later, I was at the game.

• 1:45:45Speaker 01

  Brains. So, anyway, um, I-

• 1:45:47Dax Shepard?

  Check that out in December, next year, or whenever it comes out.

• 1:45:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's coming out in a long time. But it was really fun.

• 1:45:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I liked that. It was fun.

• 1:45:55Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:45:55Dax Shepard?

  It was a nice switch up.

• 1:45:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was.

• 1:45:58Dax Shepard?

  Want to do some facts?

• 1:45:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, let's do some facts.

• 1:46:00Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:46:01Speaker 01

  Okay, facts for Bobby Brown.

• 1:46:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, Bobby Brown. I like him spunky.

• 1:46:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, she's so cool.

• 1:46:09Dax Shepard?

  Is Spunky still positive? We s-

• 1:46:11Speaker 01

  I think so.

• 1:46:13Dax Shepard?

  I like it.

• 1:46:14Speaker 01

  I think so, yeah.

• 1:46:15Dax Shepard?

  I like if someone calls me spunky. Do you like to be called spunky?

• 1:46:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:46:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:46:18Speaker 01

  I think I'm spunky.

• 1:46:19Dax Shepard?

  Is pluck the other? It's like the more old fashioned English.

• 1:46:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, pluck is a-

• 1:46:24Dax Shepard?

  She's got a lot of pluck.

• 1:46:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, that one sounds worse.

• 1:46:28Dax Shepard?

  It does, yeah. You'd rather be known for being spunky.

• 1:46:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, punky brewster.

• 1:46:33Dax Shepard?

  Spunky brewster.

• 1:46:35Speaker 01

  Okay, Bobby. So Bobby is a hero. I don't like him.

• 1:46:39Dax Shepard?

  She's a beast.

• 1:46:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. She brought up, well, the subject of data and data came up again.

• 1:46:47Dax Shepard?

  Ah, uh-huh.

• 1:46:48Speaker 01

  Both are correct. Both are acceptable. Um, data is generally preferred in British English. While both data and data are used in American English.

• 1:47:00Dax Shepard?

  I also think the robot on Star Trek was named Data.

• 1:47:05Speaker 01

  Okay, okay.

• 1:47:07Dax Shepard?

  Uh, for whatever that's worth.

• 1:47:08Speaker 01

  It says data is more common in technical contexts.

• 1:47:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 1:47:13Speaker 01

  Which is the opposite of what-

• 1:47:15Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:15Speaker 01

  Sort of what I would have thought, too. So.

• 1:47:18Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:47:19Speaker 01

  There we go.

• 1:47:19Dax Shepard?

  Take your pick.

• 1:47:20Speaker 01

  Take your pick.

• 1:47:21Dax Shepard?

  This is like, people, people really hate, um, this word, but it's in the dictionary.

• 1:47:29Speaker 01

  That word.

• 1:47:29Dax Shepard?

  Um. Fuck.

• 1:47:32Speaker 01

  Oh, moist?

• 1:47:33Dax Shepard?

  No, no, no, it's like, oh, irregardless.

• 1:47:36Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:47:37Dax Shepard?

  People hate irregardless. And when I write it, they'll go, that's not a word. And I'm like, and then I say, it's in the dictionary.

• 1:47:45Speaker 01

  Which dictionary?

• 1:47:46Dax Shepard?

  All dictionaries.

• 1:47:47Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:47:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:48Speaker 01

  Is it in like a new dictionary? Like they added it for people like you?

• 1:47:53Dax Shepard?

  Um, I don't know, but it is, if it's in the dictionary, I can play it in Scrabble. I can use it in my.

• 1:48:00Speaker 01

  But isn't like, doh or whatever that like Simpsons word in the dictionary?

• 1:48:05Dax Shepard?

  Is it D O H? I don't know. But irregardless, solid word. It's there for good.

• 1:48:13Speaker 01

  Okay, well, you have the right to use whatever word you want.

• 1:48:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:18Speaker 01

  Um, I will not be using irregardless. I'm in the camp that that is a double nega- it's not good.

• 1:48:24Dax Shepard?

  It's a big trigger for people.

• 1:48:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:26Dax Shepard?

  Big, big trigger.

• 1:48:27Speaker 01

  It's not like, what's worse than that for me is, um, what's worse? There's one that's worse.

• 1:48:34Dax Shepard?

  That's just blatantly misused.

• 1:48:36Speaker 01

  Well, no, there's one that people add a syll- they add a letter to the way they're saying it.

• 1:48:42Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:48:42Speaker 01

  Because it's spelled that way, but it's supposed to be pronounced, it's like very, why, it's not coming to me. It'll come to me.

• 1:48:49Speaker 03

  People get mad about the thawed.

• 1:48:50Speaker 01

  Thawed?

• 1:48:51Speaker 03

  Thawed and de-thawed.

• 1:48:53Speaker 01

  Oh. Yeah.

• 1:48:56Dax Shepard?

  I always say defrost, not de-thawed.

• 1:48:58Speaker 01

  I've never said de-thawed.

• 1:49:00Dax Shepard?

  But I can see where people would object. It's a double negative.

• 1:49:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:49:04Dax Shepard?

  But.

• 1:49:04Speaker 01

  This is like all downhill from here. It's similar.

• 1:49:07Dax Shepard?

  I'm not on the, um, I'm not a word police, you know?

• 1:49:11Speaker 01

  You're not, you're other, you're other kinds of police.

• 1:49:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, I am. I am. I, uh, thank God I don't also have, I don't know if I could even be with me.

• 1:49:21Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:49:22Dax Shepard?

  Irregardless, it's in there. What were we talking about before?

• 1:49:25Speaker 01

  Uh.

• 1:49:26Dax Shepard?

  Irregardless.

• 1:49:26Speaker 01

  Data and data.

• 1:49:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, data and data.

• 1:49:28Speaker 01

  Okay. Seven, so she sold Bobby, I'm sorry, she, yeah, sold Bobby Brown to, uh, in 1995 for 75 million. That is 159 million today.

• 1:49:43Dax Shepard?

  Okay, I said 250.

• 1:49:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:49:45Dax Shepard?

  I was being a little.

• 1:49:47Speaker 01

  Optimistic.

• 1:49:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. These people who can build multiple billion dollar companies, I just, so impressive.

• 1:49:53Speaker 01

  Put on them.

• 1:49:54Dax Shepard?

  So impressive.

• 1:49:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, it really is. Um, okay. There's a quiz you're gonna take.

• 1:50:00Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:50:01Speaker 01

  It's a learning styles quiz.

• 1:50:03Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:50:04Speaker 01

  Cause we talked about visual learners.

• 1:50:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, she said she was a visual learner.

• 1:50:08Speaker 01

  She did. So we're gonna find out what you are, okay?

• 1:50:10Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:50:11Speaker 01

  Now, the choices are often, sometimes, and seldom.

• 1:50:14Dax Shepard?

  Often, sometimes, seldom.

• 1:50:16Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:50:16Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:50:17Speaker 01

  I follow written directions better than oral directions.

• 1:50:21Dax Shepard?

  Seldom.

• 1:50:21Speaker 01

  Okay. I can remember more about a subject through listening than reading.

• 1:50:25Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, sometimes.

• 1:50:27Speaker 01

  I bear down extremely hard when writing.

• 1:50:29Dax Shepard?

  Always, what is that?

• 1:50:30Speaker 01

  Often?

• 1:50:31Dax Shepard?

  Often, yeah.

• 1:50:32Speaker 01

  Really? I like to write things down or take notes for visual review.

• 1:50:36Dax Shepard?

  Yes, uh, often.

• 1:50:38Speaker 01

  I require explanations of graphs, diagrams, or visual directions.

• 1:50:42Dax Shepard?

  Hmm. I don't think so.

• 1:50:45Speaker 01

  Seldom.

• 1:50:46Dax Shepard?

  Seldom.

• 1:50:46Speaker 01

  I enjoy working with tools.

• 1:50:48Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, all the time.

• 1:50:49Speaker 01

  I am skillful and enjoy developing and making graphs and charts.

• 1:50:53Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, hmm, never.

• 1:50:55Speaker 01

  I can tell if sounds match when presented with pairs of sounds.

• 1:50:59Dax Shepard?

  I'd say yeah.

• 1:51:00Speaker 01

  Often or sometimes?

• 1:51:01Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:51:01Speaker 01

  Okay. I remember best by writing things down several times.

• 1:51:05Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:51:06Speaker 01

  I can understand and follow directions on maps.

• 1:51:09Dax Shepard?

  Uh, often.

• 1:51:11Speaker 01

  I do better at academic subjects by listening to tapes and lectures.

• 1:51:15Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:51:16Speaker 01

  I play with coins or keys in pockets.

• 1:51:19Dax Shepard?

  I mean, I have this as my binky. I'd say often.

• 1:51:24Speaker 01

  I can better understand a news article by reading about it than by listening to it on the radio.

• 1:51:29Dax Shepard?

  False. Rarely.

• 1:51:31Speaker 01

  Seldom?

• 1:51:31Dax Shepard?

  Seldom.

• 1:51:32Speaker 01

  I learn to spell better by repeating the letters out loud than by writing the word on paper.

• 1:51:37Dax Shepard?

  Um, never.

• 1:51:39Speaker 01

  Okay. I chew gum, snack, or smoke during studies.

• 1:51:43Dax Shepard?

  Always.

• 1:51:44Speaker 01

  I feel the best way to remember is to picture it in one's head.

• 1:51:48Dax Shepard?

  I don't know. Sometimes?

• 1:51:50Speaker 01

  Okay. I would rather listen to a good lecture or speech than read about the same material in a book.

• 1:51:56Dax Shepard?

  Always.

• 1:51:56Speaker 01

  I learn spelling by finger spelling, spelling words in the air with index finger. The words.

• 1:52:02Dax Shepard?

  Never. Seldom.

• 1:52:04Speaker 01

  I am good at working and solving jigsaw puzzles.

• 1:52:07Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, sometimes.

• 1:52:08Speaker 01

  I prefer listening to the news on the radio more than reading about it in the newspaper.

• 1:52:12Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:52:13Speaker 01

  I grip objects in my hands during learning periods.

• 1:52:16Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:52:17Speaker 01

  I obtain information on an interesting subject by reading related materials.

• 1:52:21Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:52:22Speaker 01

  I follow oral directions better than written ones.

• 1:52:25Dax Shepard?

  Often.

• 1:52:26Speaker 01

  I feel very comfortable touching others, hugging, handshaking, etc.

• 1:52:30Dax Shepard?

  Too much.

• 1:52:33Dax Shepard?

  The results are you're a perv.

• 1:52:36Speaker 01

  Okay, interpreting the perceptual preference form. Your perceptual preference can indicate through which channel to your brain information flows most easily. Information that you receive through your preferred channels is more quickly understood and more easily remembered. Arrange your academic life to take advantage of your best channels. Your highest score tactile.

• 1:52:57Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:52:58Speaker 01

  You learn.

• 1:52:59Dax Shepard?

  Touchy, touchy.

• 1:52:59Speaker 01

  You learn best by experience or hands-on activity. By being involved physically in classroom experiences. You remember information well when you actively participate in activities, field trips and role-playing in the classroom, or working on experiments in a laboratory, handling and building models, and touching and working with materials. Writing notes or instructions or a combination of stimuli, for example, an audiotape combined with an activity such as listen to a summary tapes you've made while you jog, or making flashcards will help you understand and remember new material.

• 1:53:30Dax Shepard?

  Oh wow, okay.

• 1:53:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. Your auditory score was second, that was a thirty, your tactile was a thirty-six, then your auditory is a thirty, your lowest is visual at twenty-four.

• 1:53:40Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so I'm not a visual learner.

• 1:53:42Speaker 01

  Turns out, no.

• 1:53:43Dax Shepard?

  Not true.

• 1:53:45Speaker 01

  That was cool.

• 1:53:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, um, join, give me the computer and I'll do it to you.

• 1:53:49Speaker 01

  No, it's alright.

• 1:53:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay, what do you think you are based on that?

• 1:53:53Speaker 01

  Um, I think I am a visual learner.

• 1:53:57Dax Shepard?

  Okay, ironic because your vision is not great.

• 1:54:01Speaker 01

  I.

• 1:54:01Dax Shepard?

  Think how brilliant you'd be if you could see.

• 1:54:03Speaker 01

  I know, my god. It'd be too much for the world. It's why when I re- I like, like a book. I don't like an audiobook.

• 1:54:12Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:54:12Speaker 01

  It's in and out. I can't follow that.

• 1:54:14Dax Shepard?

  Can't hold on to it.

• 1:54:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:15Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:16Speaker 01

  But that one's a little tricky, because I do retain a lot of hearing podcasts, but that feels different to me for some reason.

• 1:54:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, maybe that feels more like a classroom, a professor situation.

• 1:54:26Speaker 01

  Well, it's because often there's two people. So it's a conversation, it's engagement, it's, I don't get to tune out.

• 1:54:34Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:54:35Speaker 01

  And I feel like I'm participating.

• 1:54:37Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you're like making a counter argument sometimes. Yeah, yeah, it's engaging.

• 1:54:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. I don't think I'm very tactile. Although.

• 1:54:46Dax Shepard?

  You're not super mechanical.

• 1:54:47Speaker 01

  Uh, no.

• 1:54:48Dax Shepard?

  And you don't do pottery. Were you do good at origami or folding paper?

• 1:54:53Speaker 01

  I've never tried it.

• 1:54:57Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:54:58Dax Shepard?

  That's Link. Like, that's when Link kind of blows my mind, is the things she builds. Like, this card she made you for your birthday was so cute.

• 1:55:05Speaker 01

  It was so cute.

• 1:55:06Dax Shepard?

  Or her dioramas she makes. I'm like, oh yeah, she really has a knack for this.

• 1:55:10Speaker 01

  Yes. Yeah, no, that must, that's probably my lowest.

• 1:55:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:14Speaker 01

  But I do like holding things. And I do like toothpicks.

• 1:55:20Dax Shepard?

  Sure, it's a little tactile.

• 1:55:22Speaker 01

  I like chewing on, I like having like some objects while I'm.

• 1:55:26Dax Shepard?

  Oral stimulation.

• 1:55:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, while I'm busy.

• 1:55:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Oral fixation, they call it.

• 1:55:30Speaker 01

  Let's call it that.

• 1:55:30Dax Shepard?

  That's cool. Stick with the traditional. Your results are in, you're a perp.

• 1:55:35Speaker 01

  Okay, that's it.

• 1:55:36Dax Shepard?

  That was it on Bobby Brown?

• 1:55:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:39Dax Shepard?

  You must admire her now.

• 1:55:41Speaker 01

  So much.

• 1:55:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:42Speaker 01

  So much. She, I, I felt.

• 1:55:44Dax Shepard?

  Very seen.

• 1:55:45Speaker 01

  I did. I was like, oh, especially when she talks about being in the details and that being like, you know, in her head, she was like, yeah, no, I was fired. They wouldn't say I was fired, but, because, but they told me to get out of the day to day. That is the job.

• 1:56:01Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:56:01Speaker 01

  That's how I feel.

• 1:56:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:56:03Speaker 01

  So I, I, I, I get her.

• 1:56:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. It also made me, uh. It's a good heads up for like, it's easy to be judgmental of people on their phone when you're doing a shared activity. You know, if you're watching a movie, certainly my preference, someone would not be on their phone.

• 1:56:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:56:20Dax Shepard?

  To hear her say it and I'm not involved in that, and that's just how she, that's how she enjoys sitting there with a movie on.

• 1:56:25Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:56:26Dax Shepard?

  I was like, yeah, I gotta be more.

• 1:56:28Speaker 01

  Well, I, I think that's just having an understanding of the other person, but also they could have an understanding that like you enjoy quality time, which means not being distracted on the phone. Yeah, I mean, I do that, but I'm by myself.

• 1:56:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:43Speaker 01

  If I'm with people, I try not to do that.

• 1:56:46Dax Shepard?

  Same. I even know if I'm by myself, I'll be like, put this down, you're gonna, you either watch this or.

• 1:56:52Speaker 01

  Right. I try to, but then all of a sudden it's back in my hands.

• 1:56:55Dax Shepard?

  I started the wrong show, but what a blessing. Ryan's been saying that the Jason Momoa thing is great.

• 1:57:02Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:57:02Dax Shepard?

  It's on Apple TV.

• 1:57:03Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:57:04Dax Shepard?

  You know, he's in like a loincloth and stuff.

• 1:57:06Speaker 01

  Oh, you love that.

• 1:57:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, um, he uses buns a lot, I guess.

• 1:57:09Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:57:09Dax Shepard?

  I haven't.

• 1:57:10Speaker 01

  You love that.

• 1:57:10Dax Shepard?

  So I go to Apple TV and boom, there it is, he's on the cover, he's looking warrior like, I watch it, it's called See.

• 1:57:17Speaker 01

  Uh huh, yeah.

• 1:57:18Dax Shepard?

  And it's by Stephen Knight, Peaky Blinders.

• 1:57:21Speaker 01

  Oh, cool.

• 1:57:22Dax Shepard?

  And the premise is it's in the future and all humans are blind now.

• 1:57:25Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:57:27Dax Shepard?

  And, uh, it's great, but I'm, I'm sending Ryan voicemail was going, when am I gonna see his buns? Like, also, I guess the only hard thing to accept about this show is that they can still fight even though they're blind, whatever. He sends me one back, you're not watching the same show.

• 1:57:43Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:57:43Dax Shepard?

  I am.

• 1:57:44Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:57:44Dax Shepard?

  So Momoa has two, two shows on Apple.

• 1:57:48Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:57:49Dax Shepard?

  What's the other one, Rob? Chief of War, I think. Chief of War. See's, See's a little older, Chief of War just came out.

• 1:57:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:57:56Dax Shepard?

  But he's got two where he's in the jungle swinging a sword, I mean.

• 1:58:00Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:58:00Dax Shepard?

  At the same time.

• 1:58:01Speaker 01

  He should come on and tell us about them.

• 1:58:02Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I'd love to have him on.

• 1:58:04Speaker 01

  You'd love to see those buns in person.

• 1:58:06Dax Shepard?

  I like following him on Instagram. He's always having a good time and drinking a lot of beers.

• 1:58:11Speaker 01

  Oh, is he?

• 1:58:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I think he has a really good appetite for brewskis, which I think is cool.

• 1:58:17Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 1:58:18Dax Shepard?

  All right.

• 1:58:19Speaker 01

  All right, love you.

• 1:58:34Dax Shepard?

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