Mel Robbins: How to Make Your Habits Stick! The Secrets to Resetting Your Habits and Your Life That Actually Work!

Full Video Available on YouTube @JamieKernLimaOfficial. Are You Ready to believe in YOU?🙌 jamiekernlima.com 👈 Sign up for my FREE Inspirational Newsletter here and you’ll ALSO get special prompt questions to help you grow in your self-worth-building that pair with each episode!🩷 Make sure to click the “Follow” button for the show on your favorite podcast app, so you’ll be the first to get each episode! ____ Mel Robbins: How to Make Your Habits Stick! The Secrets to Resetting Your Habits and Your Life That Actually Work! Episode Reflection Questions for YOU: Jamie writes prompt questions each episode to spark revelations in your self-worth journey and help you apply the tools and lessons from each episode into your real life right now. Please make sure you’re signed up for Jamie’s free inspirational newsletter jamiekernlima.com 👈 Get my new book WORTHY plus FREE Bonus gifts including a 95+ page Worthy Workbook and more at WorthyBook.com For more resources related to today’s episode, click here https://jamiekernlima.com/show/ for the podcast episode page. Chapters: 0:00 Welcome to The Jamie Kern Lima Show 7:49 – Why Motivation Along Can Be Garbage 12:06 - Tips To Make Habits Stick 14:55 - Most Change Doesn't Stick 20:07 - How To Build Habits 28:02- High 5 Your Way Forward 43:45 - Moments In Marriage That Are Everything It’s such an honor to share this podcast together with you. And please note: I am not a licensed therapist, and this podcast is NOT intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, professional coach, psychotherapist, or other qualified professional. Click Here to Subscribe to the YouTube Channel Follow me here: Instagram TikTok Facebook Website — Sign up for my inspirational newsletter for YOU at: jamiekernlima.com — Looking for my books on Amazon? Here they are! WORTHY Believe IT

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jamie Kern Lima?

  How do you make habits stick? Especially for people who have tried and failed over and over and over.

• 0:07Speaker 01

  The only way you make change stick is by, it may surprise you to hear, I am not motivated. Motivation is garbage, Jamie. I go through, this is so dumb, but this is literally a game changer.

• 0:18Jamie Kern Lima?

  You started crying.

• 0:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:19Jamie Kern Lima?

  I said Mel Robbins is crying on the Jamie Kern Lima Show. We just got here.

• 0:23Speaker 01

  The thing that scares me the most is that our lives go by in just the blink of an eye. And we take for granted the time that we have. I don't know a single couple that's been married for a long time that hasn't had that horrific period in their marriage. And I think what you do in those moments is everything. It's been a really shitty three years. We've gone through a lot of changes as a family, and Chris and I have been going through a ton of therapy to try to figure out this new phase of life together and to work through a bunch of stuff that went down. And we have been working so hard in therapy to really, truly understand each other,

• 1:04Speaker 01

  to understand the things that we haven't talked about. And this is huge.

• 1:10Jamie Kern Lima?

  Before we jump into this episode, I'd love to invite you to join this community to hear more interviews and one-on-one conversations with me and you to help you truly believe in yourself, trust yourself, and know you are enough so that you can become unstoppable in living your best life.

• 1:32Jamie Kern Lima?

  Who you spend time around is so important as energy is contagious and so is self-belief. And I'd love to hang out with you even more, especially if you could use an extra dose of inspiration, which is exactly why I've created my free weekly newsletter that's also a love letter to you, delivered straight to your inbox each and every Tuesday morning from me. If you haven't signed up to make sure that you get it each week, just go to JamieKernLima.com to make sure you're on the list and you'll get your One-on-One with Jamie weekly newsletter and get ready to believe in you.

• 2:13Jamie Kern Lima?

  If you're tired of hearing the bad news every single day and need some inspiration, some tips, tools, joy, and love, hitting your inbox, I'm your girl. Subscribe at jamiekernlima.com or in the link in the show notes. In life, you don't soar to the level of your hopes and dreams, you stay stuck at the level of your self-worth. When you build your self-worth, you change your entire life. And that's exactly why I wrote my new book, Worthy: How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life for You. If you have some self-doubt to destroy and a destiny to fulfill, Worthy is for you.

• 2:57Jamie Kern Lima?

  In Worthy, you'll learn proven tools and simple steps that bring life-changing results, like how to get unstuck from the things holding you back, build unshakable self-love, unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt, and embrace the truths that wake up worthiness, overcome limiting beliefs and imposter syndrome, achieve your hopes and dreams by believing you are worthy of them, and so much more. Are you ready to unleash your greatness and step into the person you were born to be? Imagine a life with zero self-doubt and unshakable self-worth.

• 3:41Jamie Kern Lima?

  Get your copy of Worthy, plus some amazing thank you bonus gifts for you at worthybook.com or the link in the show notes below. Imagine what you'd do if you fully believed in you. It's time to find out with Worthy.

• 4:00Speaker 01

  Jamie Kern Lima is her name. Everybody needs Jamie Kern Lima in their life.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Jamie Kern Lima.

• 4:09Speaker 02

  Jamie, you're so inspiring. Jamie Kern Lima.

• 4:14Jamie Kern Lima?

  Mel Robbins says you can change your life and she will show you how. Mel has one of the most popular podcasts in the world called The Mel Robbins Podcast. She's a New York Times bestselling author. She has seven number one audiobooks on Audible, billions of views of her videos online, and is one of the most respected experts in the world of mindset, motivation, and behavior change, thanks to her science-backed tools and relatable advice that has impacted the lives of millions of people who follow her across 194 countries. She lives in Vermont with her husband of 26 years, Chris, and their three kids.

• 4:59Jamie Kern Lima?

  She's also my dear friend, a really great roommate on trips, one of my favorite people to have at slumber parties, and the best wedding singer I've ever had the privilege of hearing in person. Mel Robbins, welcome to the Jamie Kern Lima Show. So many people call you the queen of motivation, and yet you say motivation is garbage.

• 5:26Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 5:28Jamie Kern Lima?

  Can you explain that?

• 5:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, motivation is garbage. And the reason why is it's never there when you need it. Like, I think one of my biggest messages, don't expect it to be easy. Why are you expecting to feel like going to the gym? Like, just because you bought a cute outfit, you know, to go, doesn't mean you're going to feel like going. And the mistake that I see everyone making over and over and over again is putting all your time and energy into planning for things, and getting ready to do things, and thinking about things, and then not understanding that the moment that it's time to do the thing, you're not going to feel like doing the thing. And so you're sitting around, waiting for that moment to feel ready, to feel like it's perfect, to feel inspired. It's not coming.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  It's not coming. And just think about how liberating it is if you lived your life with the simple truth that I will never feel like doing the things I need to do, but I'm going to do them anyway. I am not going to be the kind of person that lets my insecurity, or my mood in the moment, or how I feel about something right now, and all that stuff to override.

• 6:38Speaker 01

  The actions that I need to take in order to become the kind of person that I'd like to become. And you know, this is one of the reasons why I am constantly showing the worst of what I'm dealing with and the worst of what it's like in day-to-day life, in my own life, to people. Because it may surprise you to hear, I am not motivated. I'm very clear about what I want. I'm very clear about the actions I need to take. And I'm very clear that nine times out

• 7:16Speaker 01

  of 10, I'm not going to want to do it. I don't spring out of bed like a chicken and then lace up my running shoes and then go for a run as if it's some sort of commercial. I drag myself out of bed when I don't feel like it. I go into that bathroom, brush my teeth. I gripe and groan the whole way to the closet where I pick out my tights that are laid on the floor. I even lay my exercise clothes out. Because I know, I don't want to put them on. Because I don't want to exercise. But you know what? The insecure past me is not going to win. Because I'm not sitting

• 7:57Speaker 01

  around waiting to feel like this is going to be a good idea. When I wake up in southern Vermont, it's 50 degrees and raining on a January morning, first of all, I'm angry it's not snowing. But secondly, do I feel like going outside and taking the walk that I need to take? Of course not. But I do it anyway. And see, that's the difference. That's the difference between the old me and who I am today. Because the old me was full of excuses. Oh, it's raining, I'm not going.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  What are you gonna melt? Give me a break. Oh. You know. I'd rather, you know, I feel like having a glass of wine. No. I got stuff I need to do. I used to be completely at the whim of my emotions. And right now, as you're listening, that's your problem.

• 8:56Speaker 01

  You know what you need to do. You do not feel like doing it. And you know, I get so frustrated because I think that that word motivation is just thrown around like candy. And it's just become like people just pay lip service to it. And if you just flush down the toilet, the belief that someday you'll feel ready to do the thing, you'd probably do the thing right now.

• 9:30Jamie Kern Lima?

  How do you? So you do it, you do the thing. How do you make habits stick? Especially for people who have tried and failed over and over and over.

• 9:42Speaker 01

  I give up the belief that it's gonna be automatic. Like, I think all this 21 day stuff is horseshit. Because if you and that's not even the research. Like, the research is the habit,

• 9:54Speaker 01

  quote, becomes something that's a pattern somewhere between like nine days and 237 days. Habit formation is highly variable. It depends on the actual habit and it depends on the person.

• 10:12Speaker 01

  And so

• 10:15Speaker 01

  I think it's easier for me, this is just me personally.

• 10:21Speaker 01

  I think it's easier to presume that this stuff is never going to become automatically. I think it's easier to presume that I will never like getting out of bed. I will never greet the alarm at 5:15 like some songbird that is summoning me to a beautiful day. And that it's okay. And I instead, Jamie.

• 10:46Speaker 01

  Set up tricks and traps to make it easier to not opt out. So I'll give you some examples.

• 10:57Speaker 01

  When I wake up in the morning, my phone is in the bathroom and the alarm is going off on my phone. Why?

• 11:07Speaker 01

  Because I don't feel like getting out of bed. But now I don't have a choice because I set a trap for the worst parts of me. The phone is in the bathroom. To get the alarm off, I have to get out of bed. There's an example of making change stick. I'm not relying on emotion and willpower. I've set a trap to make it happen. When I walk into my closet, my clothes are already laid out. Why? Because that's what's called an environmental trigger. First of all, I've just made it easier. I've taken one step out and now I've got a visual reminder. Oh yeah, here we go. No matter what you feel like putting on, this is what you need to put on. When I get into the kitchen, right in front of the coffee maker. I used to be the kind of person that would roll out of bed and I would army crawl my way

• 11:52Speaker 01

  right to that coffee maker, tap suck that sucker, get the caffeine in. Now that I understand the research, I don't do that for an hour or two. So what's sitting right in front of the coffee maker? Because that's where I will go is my water bottle already filled up and all of the supplements I need to take. Why? Because it is a visual reminder and it is one step taken so that I can make it stick. And see, I believe that most change doesn't stick.

• 12:29Speaker 01

  And we are being sold a fairy tale to think that you can make it stick. The only way you make change stick is by doing it. And if you accept the premise that I am here to offer, that some old version of you is always going to be right there in the moment and you are going to have to make that new change stick, then you're not going to fall into the trap of presuming that there's some short, there's some shortcut, some this, some that, some other thing. Because you can put up all the post-it notes in the world.

• 13:07Speaker 01

  You can put your phone in the bathroom and set the alarm so you have to turn it off. But if you're not willing to do the hard stuff, if you're not willing to push yourself, Jamie, through the excuses, a lot of you will just climb right back in bed with your phone and spend the next hour scrolling. A lot of you will push that coffee maker to the side, or that water bottle to the side and make a cup of coffee. A lot of you will see the tights on the floor and notice that it's cold outside and be like, "Meh, not today. I don't feel like it." Okay. Your life. You get to choose. Just don't bitch about it when you don't have what you want because you're not willing to do the work.

• 13:47Jamie Kern Lima?

  I, uh...

• 13:49Speaker 01

  Told you I was a lot meaner than you are. Jamie will tell you she believes in you, and I'll be like, "Prove it." You want to know when a habit's really easy to make stick, Jamie? When you like it. I could make it a habit real fast of eating ice cream every day after dinner.

• 14:02Jamie Kern Lima?

  Me too.

• 14:02Speaker 01

  Because I like it. Yeah, because I like it.

• 14:07Jamie Kern Lima?

  Yeah.

• 14:08Speaker 01

  It's true!

• 14:10Jamie Kern Lima?

  That's fascinating about how different types of habits can take a different number of days, according to their research, to stick.

• 14:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, and that was a research study that was done where they were looking at habit formation, and the habit that they were trying to make automatic was the habit of taking a 10-minute walk after dinner. So, on its face, not a difficult habit, right? But in terms of the research study, when it became automatic, and when you look at the research, what "automatic" means is that you don't feel resistance to doing it. Like, I have zero resistance to making an ice cream sundae. Just frickin' love that stuff, right? I have a lot of resistance to exercising on a day that I have to lift weights. And

• 14:58Speaker 01

  so, they're looking at how long, in terms of trying to repeat something,

• 15:05Jamie Kern Lima?

  Yes.

• 15:06Speaker 01

  before you stop dreading it. And the other thing that's very interesting, and I don't remember the name of the part of the brain, but there's a lot of really interesting research around willpower, where they look at a part of your brain, and I don't remember the name of it. It's both on the left and right-hand side of your brain. But it is the part of the brain that grows when you do something that you don't feel like doing. I'm gonna say it again. It's the part of your brain that grows when you do things that you don't feel like doing. So that might be that you're somebody that is a writer, and every time you sit down and you make yourself write when you don't feel like it, that part of your brain actually grows. When you step in the cold plunge,

• 15:51Speaker 01

  when you don't feel like it, that part of your brain grows. But it only grows when you're doing things you don't want to do. And what's fascinating about this, and this is fairly new research. I heard Huberman talking about it the other day. And I can't remember the name. I believe it's a female neuroscientist that's doing the research around this, that when they look at people that live very long lives, that part of the brain is larger. And so they now are starting to believe that it's not really about willpower, it's about the will to live. And forcing yourself, through that resistance, to try new things, to do things that you don't feel like, to push yourself,

• 16:35Speaker 01

  that that is tied to you living a long and amazing life. And it makes sense, because human beings are designed, in every aspect, to grow. And if you turn inward and you say to yourself, "What are the things that I want to outgrow in myself? What are the things that I really want to learn? Or that I've been afraid to do? Or what is something that I could do today that I don't feel like doing?" That singular commitment to yourself,

• 17:18Speaker 01

  to just push yourself to do something that feels hard, that has a material impact on who you are as a person. And what the science says is it has an impact on how long you live.

• 17:36Jamie Kern Lima?

  With habits to stick, just I want to make sure I understand this right for everyone listening, because sometimes people go, "Oh, I heard it takes this long for a habit to stick." And then they don't know why it hasn't stuck for them. And the example that you explained about the definition of how, you know, when do you get to that point where there's no more resistance, right? So it makes perfect sense that if we want a new habit, you know, that we actually like, and let's say we love doing a morning walk, well, it might stick sooner

• 18:04Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:05Jamie Kern Lima?

  than something that may take a very long time because you have a lot of resistance toward it.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:10Jamie Kern Lima?

  So to be patient with yourself.

• 18:12Speaker 01

  Yes, and a couple of the things, because I can, I can give you the research around how to accelerate the feeling that it's not that hard anymore. Because if you really think about what a habit is-

• 18:26Jamie Kern Lima?

  Okay, tell me more.

• 18:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, because-

• 18:27Jamie Kern Lima?

  You've got some habits to break.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  Well, well, you know, we're not robots.

• 18:31Jamie Kern Lima?

  Yeah.

• 18:32Speaker 01

  And I think a lot about habits as just patterns that you repeat. That's what a habit is. And right now, you have a habit of, for example, when you pull your pants on, what leg do you put in your pants first? You have to stop and think about it, right? Why? Because you've actually automated that pattern. Now, when you're teaching one of your kids how to do it right now, it's tedious because they're having to train their right or left foot, whatever the pattern ends up being, and the motor pattern of doing that until they learn it so that they don't have to think about it anymore. I don't have to think about operating my coffee machine. I know how to do it without thinking about it.

• 19:17Speaker 01

  I don't have to think about brushing my teeth. I know how to do it without thinking about it. There's a lot of thinking involved with getting to the gym. Do you notice that? Because you have certain feelings about it. I don't ever roll up to my bathroom counter and go, "I don't feel like brushing my teeth this morning." I just do it. And so I want you to really simplify what it means to create a habit. It means that you have trained your mind, body, and spirit. That this is a pattern that we do. And that you don't throw an adult temper tantrum about doing it. That's it. And so, when we're talking about making it stick,

• 20:00Speaker 01

  what you're actually talking about is teaching your body that this is something that we do, and we don't throw temper tantrums around it. We just do it. And even if I'm kind of tired this morning, I'm still gonna brush my teeth. Because it's a pattern that I do. So, that's really what we're talking about, okay? And so, there are a couple of things to make it easier. First of all, let's go back to some of the rules that I've taught you.

• 20:29Speaker 01

  Human beings only do the things that they feel like doing. And if you are constantly resisting a new pattern of behavior, you have to look at, why do you want this pattern of behavior?

• 20:45Speaker 01

  If you're trying to get to the gym, because you think you should, you never will.

• 20:53Speaker 01

  There's a lot of research about goals, and why you have a goal is one of the foundational indicators of whether or not you will actually achieve it. And too many of you are thinking that you should do certain things, but you don't have a clue why you want it. See, one of the reasons why I exercise every day, Jamie, is not so that I look good in a bathing suit. It is not so that I weigh a certain thing. The reason why I exercise every single day is because I want to live a very long and a very vibrant life.

• 21:37Speaker 01

  And I know that what I do right now, at 55, will determine, most likely, whether or not, at the age of 90, I can pick up my own carry-on suitcase and put it in the overhead bin on an airplane. It will determine whether or not I am the kind of grandparent that can boogie down at a wedding of one of my grandkids. It will determine how long I am able to climb up in the mountains where I live in southern Vermont. And I care about that. And I also care about showing up in the work that I do, and showing up with the people that I have in my life, and being as present, and as focused,

• 22:21Speaker 01

  and as curious, and as smart as I possibly can be. And so I understand the direct impact that resistance training, and taking a walk outside, and taking care of my health, will have on the kind of life I want. And that's something that will lower the resistance that you feel, because the reason is bigger than the bullshit in the moment. The second thing that you can do is ask yourself, once you know why you want the habit. Because again, if you don't really want to lose weight, like, there's a lot of you out there that keep going, "Oh, I really love to have bikini abs and all this bullshit." I'm not willing to do the work. So I really don't want it that bad, do I?

• 23:05Speaker 01

  So why keep torturing myself? I don't give a shit about flat abs. I don't give a shit that my butt looks like a pancake, you know, when I'm walking around. I don't care, because that's not going to impact what I care about. If you really care about having a bubble butt, then get clear about it, and prove it. And so, step one, figure out why it matters to you, and it's got to be deeply personal. Not a should, it's a want. Second thing, ask yourself, "How do I make this easier? How can I make this easier? Could you play music that you like?" Like, one thing that made exercise super easy for me, ready? On Sunday nights, Jamie, I go through, this is so dumb,

• 23:49Speaker 01

  but this is literally a game changer. I take the time, it usually takes about a half an hour, believe it or not, to figure out what my workouts are going to be for the week. Because I started to realize, okay, I was getting my tights on and I was getting myself to our gym at the house. But when I got up there, I'd be like, okay, what am I gonna do? Should I get on the treadmill today? Should I stream something? Should I jump on this? And it was in the like, what should I do? That I literally lost motivation. And I'd futz around up there and then I'd be looking at social media because I'm trying to find something to stream. Have not made it easier for me.

• 24:30Speaker 01

  So now that I'm like, on Monday, I'm doing this, on Tuesday, I'm doing that, on Wednesday, I'm doing this, on Thursday, I'm taking the dogs here. It's planned and that works for me. So post-it notes, how can you make it easier for you? Do not, in any behavior change, do not manage a shit in your head. You will lose.

• 24:52Speaker 01

  Write it down on a post-it note, stick it in front of your face, on your computer, set an alarm in your phone. You are a busy human being with a lot going on, you cannot manage this stuff in your mind, you will forget. You will forget.

• 25:07Jamie Kern Lima?

  So for everyone listening, right, so many of us, we have a goal, they've already given up on their goals and it's...

• 25:12Speaker 01

  I'm gonna tell you why. You don't understand why you want it.

• 25:16Jamie Kern Lima?

  So number one, know why you want it with clarity. Number two, make it easy. Make it easy. And then three, don't manage it in your head.

• 25:24Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 25:25Jamie Kern Lima?

  Don't manage it in your head.

• 25:26Speaker 01

  And then number four. And this is huge. You have to celebrate the thing that you did that day. So I don't ever leave the gym without high-fiving the mirror. Because the fact that I actually got there

• 25:44Speaker 01

  is a big deal.

• 25:46Speaker 01

  I don't ever kind of finish my, I drink like eight cups of water a day and I do it in kind of one of those big kind of adult sippy cup water covers. When I finish, I'm like, good job. Like you need to high-five your way forward because that little bit of praise seals the cycle. And you know, we can dig deeper into the science, but really, you gotta count the wins. You have to, otherwise you are not going to continue to feel like you want to do it. You gotta be your own cheering squad. Like, we put too much pray, or we put too much weight in other people celebrating what we're doing.

• 26:32Speaker 01

  They can't even celebrate themselves, so they're not going to celebrate you in most cases. And the, when, and when you need celebration is not when you lose the weight, it's not when you land the job, it's when every single day you sit down for what I call the hot 15, and you spend 15 minutes doing the thing you don't want to do. Sending the resume. You got one resume out today, celebrate that. Celebrate it, for real, because I know how hard that was. And the celebration can just be like, "Good job. Alright, let's go do something else."

• 27:09Jamie Kern Lima?

  When we walked into the studio today, we had your daughter Kendall's music playing. You started crying.

• 27:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:19Jamie Kern Lima?

  I said, "Mel Robbins is crying on the Jamie Corley Miss Show. We just got here." Tell me, Mel, about your family, about your kids, about your husband, Chris, and, um, and the importance of that in your life. We were talking about, you and I talking about time last night, and what we'll trade time for, and what we really want to do most.

• 27:47Jamie Kern Lima?

  And I just have to share, I actually took a photo, I'm gonna share it with you. I took a photo of the moment,

• 27:58Jamie Kern Lima?

  the moment that you, that you

• 28:03Jamie Kern Lima?

  saw your daughter's song being released and her posting about it. Can you talk about that moment, and just what your family means to you?

• 28:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, um, I, um,

• 28:24Speaker 01

  I'm trying to like describe...

• 28:29Speaker 01

  This look.

• 28:32Jamie Kern Lima?

  There is so much more coming up in this episode. You are not going to want to miss it. But first, I wanted to share this with you. In life, you don't soar to the level of your hopes and dreams. You stay stuck at the level of your self-worth. When you build your self-worth, you change your entire life. And that's exactly why I wrote my new book, Worthy: How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life for You. If you have some self-doubt to destroy and a destiny to fulfill, Worthy is for you. In Worthy, you'll learn proven tools and simple steps that bring life-changing results,

• 29:13Jamie Kern Lima?

  like how to get unstuck from the things holding you back, build unshakable self-love, unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt, and embrace the truths that wake up worthiness. Overcome limiting beliefs and imposter syndrome. Achieve your hopes and dreams by believing you are worthy of them, and so much more. Are you ready to unleash your greatness and step into the person you were born to be? Imagine a life with zero self-doubt and unshakable self-worth. Get your copy of Worthy, plus some amazing thank you bonus gifts for you at worthybook.com

• 29:57Jamie Kern Lima?

  or the link in the show notes below. Imagine what you'd do if you fully believed in you. It's time to find out with Worthy. Who you spend time around is so important as energy is contagious, and so is self-belief. And I'd love to hang out with you even more, especially if you could use an extra dose of inspiration, which is exactly why I've created my free weekly newsletter that's also a love letter to you, delivered straight to your inbox each and every Tuesday morning from me. If you haven't signed up to make sure that you get it each week, just go to jamiekernlima.com

• 30:42Jamie Kern Lima?

  to make sure you're on the list, and you'll get your One-on-One with Jamie weekly newsletter. And get ready to believe in you. If you're tired of hearing the bad news every single day and need some inspiration, some tips, tools, joy, and love, hitting your inbox, I'm your girl. Subscribe at jamiekernlima.com or in the link in the show notes. And now, more of this incredible conversation together.

• 31:14Speaker 01

  I'm just really proud of, um, what I see in this moment is not pride as a mom.

• 31:29Speaker 01

  I see so much recognition of how much our daughter Kendall in particular had to push through

• 31:47Speaker 01

  to release that song and to go for this dream. And I, the single most important person in my life, other than my relationship to myself, is my relationship with my husband, Chris. And I, I just freaking love him so much. And that sounds so, I don't know, like, I don't even have the words to describe how grateful I am to have him in my life.

• 32:29Speaker 01

  And I think the reason why I say that is because he is willing to do the work to grow together. And it hasn't always been easy. It isn't in any relationship, especially those that go the distance. And we have been working so hard in therapy to really, truly understand each other, to understand the things that we haven't talked about in terms of how our childhoods have affected us and how it affects the way that we show up in the marriage. And I'm experiencing a...

• 33:16Speaker 01

  I'm trying to figure out how to say this in a way that might...

• 33:25Speaker 01

  I'm at a really awesome moment with my family. Because I feel as though all five of us are in this moment where we are stepping into a new version of ourselves. Our son is about to go to college. Our other daughter just traveled through Asia for five months solo as a backpacker, something she had been dreaming of doing for 10 years, saving the money. Things got derailed because of the pandemic and she quit her job and did it.

• 34:07Speaker 01

  And now I see her back, living home,

• 34:13Speaker 01

  and figuring out what's next. A blank slate. And I see her leaning in. And one of the things that I am very, very, very proud of is that Chris and I took a stance as parents that our job

• 34:40Speaker 01

  was not to create many versions of ourselves. Our jobs as parents were to figure out how to best support Kendall, Sawyer, and Oakley in becoming who they're supposed to become. And

• 35:00Speaker 01

  now that we're 24 years into that, and some of the ways that we would do that just in terms of strategies is whenever we go to the school kind of meetings, you know, the parent teacher conferences, never talk grades. Never talk grades.

• 35:15Speaker 01

  The first question out of my mouth is, describe how they are as a human being. And that sort of focus on how do you treat other people? How do you treat yourself? What do you actually want in your life? What do you care about? What kind of person do you want to be? Those sorts of things are hard to teach. And I'm really proud of the fact that we have built a family where everybody is uniquely their own person. But I don't know, I mean, it feels weird because I feel like I'm bragging.

• 35:56Speaker 01

  Like I just, I, the level of emotional engagement is just insane with our family. And I attribute a lot of it to Chris, actually. So my husband, Chris, he was, he had a very traditional career path, chasing wealth, chasing the next job, chasing the corporate ladder, wanting to kind of be as if not more successful than his dad was. And it didn't, his life didn't turn out that way. The restaurant business did not work out. He nearly bankrupted our family, had a lot of shame about it. And in that happening,

• 36:40Speaker 01

  there was this miraculous gift that happened for our family. And it was this. Our kids got to witness their parents struggling profoundly. And our kids got to witness a mom and a dad completely reverse roles. And so they grew up with a dad that was home. And the truth is, Chris is a deeply spiritual and caring and grounded human being. He's a Meditation instructor. He leads men's retreats called Soul Degree.

• 37:21Speaker 01

  He is a death doula and does counseling at end of life. And he is about to finish his masters in transpersonal psychology. So that he can do integration work with people. Who are doing the really exciting new psychedelic healing modalities with therapeutic guidance. And so he's a very grounded, amazing, just centered human being. And that is evident in all three of our children. Because he was the one who was home. While I was off racing around like an anxiety ridden lunatic.

• 38:04Speaker 01

  Trying to make as much money as possible so that I could get us out of debt. And so I feel very grateful. For everything that has happened in our lives, good and bad. Because I'm finally at a point, Jamie. Where I feel like we're through the crisis of the last 20 years. And that the most important thing to me is not missing out on any more of it. And being able to be home more. And I think the thing that scares me the most is that our lives go by in just the blink of an eye.

• 38:44Speaker 01

  And we take for granted the time that we have. And there's this really scary study called the American Time Study. That shows that from the moment that your kids turn 18. There is a massive drop, like it falls off a cliff in terms of how often you see them. And then by the time they reach 21, it flatlines. And it stays the same for the rest of your life. And from the age of 20 to 60, the people that you see most day to day are the people you work with.

• 39:28Speaker 01

  Not your family, not your partner. And by the time you turn 40, the amount of time that you're going to be spending alone with yourself increases every single year. And so I am acutely aware of the amount of time that is passing by. And I sometimes torture myself about it. But I really want to spend as much time with our adult kids as I possibly can. I love them and my husband more than anybody on the planet. And I'm working very hard to keep the phone off me and to be truly present when I am with them.

• 40:12Jamie Kern Lima?

  I remember your face yesterday when you had just gotten off the phone with Chris. And you just like had this huge smile on your face. And you seemed a little emotional. And I asked like what was going on? And you had said, you kind of hinted around, things are so good that you like don't even want to say that out loud.

• 40:38Speaker 01

  Right. I, it's been a really shitty three years. Like, you know, we've gone through a lot of changes as a family. And Chris and I have been going through a ton of therapy to try to figure out this new phase of life together. And to work through a bunch of stuff that went down as the restaurant business was failing and as we were both spiraling. And it's interesting because I don't know a single couple that's been married for a long time that hasn't had that like horrific period in their marriage.

• 41:22Speaker 01

  And I think what you do in those moments is everything. Because if you're willing to turn toward this person and you're willing to stop complaining about where you're at and remind yourself of the actual heart of the person that you're with.

• 41:43Speaker 01

  And if they're willing to turn in too.

• 41:47Speaker 01

  Your relationship, in terms of the relationship that results from facing the worst parts of it. So like I think about a marriage as three people. It's you, it's your partner, and the marriage is the third person.

• 42:10Speaker 01

  And if you look at the marriage with open eyes, or the relationship that you're in with open eyes, and again, gotta have a partner that's willing to do this. And you're willing to confront the worst about the third person in the room, which is the marriage.

• 42:30Speaker 01

  The marriage that results from taking responsibility for what doesn't work, based on where you are now as individuals, and doing the work to confront the worst parts of your marriage, and learn how to show up differently so that that third party, the marriage itself, can grow,

• 42:56Speaker 01

  you will be

• 42:59Speaker 01

  just blown away by the level of intimacy and connection that you can create.

• 43:06Speaker 01

  It's easier to be pissed off at somebody. It's easier to think you know somebody. It's easier to blame it on them and to get stuck in these patterns. But boy, oh, boy, I want you to consider you have no clue who you are, and you have no clue who you're married to, and you have no clue what's possible when you're willing to face what's not working.

• 43:32Jamie Kern Lima?

  Do you

• 43:35Jamie Kern Lima?

  feel like you love and see Chris for exactly who he is?

• 43:41Speaker 01

  I don't know. Because I think it is...

• 43:48Speaker 01

  I think it's arrogant to think you know somebody.

• 43:52Speaker 01

  I mean, what you need to know about other human beings is true about all human beings. That we all just want to be seen. And we want to feel appreciated for the things that we're doing. And we want to feel loved for who we are. Not judged for who we are. And presuming that I know him

• 44:21Speaker 01

  doesn't give him the space to really grow. Like, I know he has a kind heart. And I know that he is a thinker. And I know that he does acts of service. And I know that he is a very spiritual and kind man.

• 44:41Speaker 01

  But do I really know what he's thinking? No.

• 44:47Jamie Kern Lima?

  I know what he's thinking right now. Uh, because he wrote a letter for you.

• 44:52Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 44:55Jamie Kern Lima?

  He actually wrote a letter for you, Mel, sharing what he's thinking and how he's feeling right now.

• 45:04Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 45:05Jamie Kern Lima?

  And I wanted to share it with you. And ask if you would be okay reading it.

• 45:13Speaker 01

  Reading it, sure.

• 45:15Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 45:17Speaker 01

  I'm not going to get through this. "Mel, despite your quick trip away, I wanted you to know that I really miss you.

• 45:27Speaker 01

  Not a sad or lonely missing, but a joyful, sweet absence. As you know, I have recently been making concentrated and kooky efforts to feel energy around me. In the house, in the town, or just walking through the woods. I have been actively trying to sense and feel energetic vibes. Evidently, it's working because I find myself more present than ever, feeling the void of your vibrant, happy, game on energy. I missed it yesterday while passing by your empty office, last night around the dining room table, and even right now, knowing you're not sleeping on the other side of my office wall."

• 46:10Speaker 01

  After almost thirty years, I can truly say with every ounce of my soul, I love you more than ever. And I thank the stars above for giving us the courageous hearts and minds we both needed to weather all the tornadoes and floods and wildfires that have ripped through our time together. Oddly, these beautiful and difficult experiences are what make me so incredibly proud of us. I'm beginning to realize that even the simple act of channeling gratitude is a form of energy. I'm doing that right now for you, with you, around you. From the bottom of my heart, thank you.

• 46:54Speaker 01

  Thank you for being the remarkable source of power and light that you are and for loving me as you do. I can't wait to see you on Tuesday. Chris.

• 47:09Jamie Kern Lima?

  When you read that, you feel what?

• 47:12Speaker 01

  Um.

• 47:18Speaker 01

  I feel, um.

• 47:23Speaker 01

  He talked about energy. And Chris is a very methodical and quiet and introverted person. And he has been trying to bring online more kind of an, of a, like a emoting. And like the kind of, like he talked about it, this energetic vibe. And I raise that because what I'm present to is going to sound really kooky and weird. But there is the physical life.

• 48:08Speaker 01

  And relationship that you have. There's the intellectual life and relationship that you have. And then there's this entirely different dimension to life.

• 48:20Speaker 01

  This quantum nature of things. And I guess that's why it's hard for me to describe where I am with Chris and with my kids. Because I feel that we are bound at this fifth dimension. This quantum realm where from a soul to soul level, I feel that invisible thread that is very real, that connects me to the people in my family and to Chris in particular.

• 49:00Speaker 01

  And so I'm very present to that right now. Like if you look on your Find Me and you've got your family, I feel like sitting in this chair, there is this entered energetic field that we are all connected to.

• 49:20Jamie Kern Lima?

  It's like transcendent.

• 49:23Jamie Kern Lima?

  Mel Robbins. Go ahead.

• 49:26Speaker 01

  And you can't do that if you're constantly wishing they would change. And you can't do that if you're constantly griping about who they are.

• 49:37Speaker 01

  And you can't do that until you give another human being the absolute freedom to be exactly who they are and exactly who they aren't.

• 49:52Jamie Kern Lima?

  Mel Robbins, I love you. I am grateful for our friendship. I am grateful for the kind of friend that you are. How you and I were laughing, walking over here. You're like, you're a good cop, I'm a bad cop.

• 50:11Jamie Kern Lima?

  I'm the angel devil, this, that. I have so much gratitude and just who you are in my life. I have a special gift for you because everyone who comes on the Jamie Kern Lima Show gets a special gift. And I'm gonna have you open it.

• 50:29Speaker 01

  Oh, man. Oh wow, okay.

• 50:33Jamie Kern Lima?

  When I think of Mel.

• 50:35Speaker 01

  Oh my god. These are amazing, Jamie.

• 50:39Jamie Kern Lima?

  So what I'm hoping.

• 50:40Speaker 01

  These are magic shoes.

• 50:42Jamie Kern Lima?

  What I'm hoping you're down for is we each write something like right along the soul on each other's and then we switch and then we switch. So those are your size.

• 50:51Speaker 01

  Oh my god.

• 50:52Jamie Kern Lima?

  Cause I always want to have, you know, words from you on there. And I, I love them because they actually remind me of you. So when you saw me wearing them today, I was just kind of smiling. You're like, I like your shoes. And I didn't say anything.

• 51:06Speaker 01

  They're really incredible.

• 51:08Jamie Kern Lima?

  Okay, so we'll swap for a minute.

• 51:10Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 51:10Jamie Kern Lima?

  And just write whatever, whatever's on your heart and then we'll swap back.

• 51:16Speaker 01

  I just need to warn you, I'm terrible at spelling.

• 51:18Jamie Kern Lima?

  That'll make it better. Something is misspelled, that'll make it feel even more special.

• 51:25Speaker 01

  You are worthy. I love it. Alright.

• 51:28Jamie Kern Lima?

  Yes, and I love you. Oh, I know what this means.

• 51:33Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 51:34Jamie Kern Lima?

  Create a revelation. I know what this means.

• 51:41Jamie Kern Lima?

  Oh, I love you. These are so special. Thank you.

• 51:45Speaker 01

  I'm putting them on. They fit.

• 51:47Jamie Kern Lima?

  They, I hope they, they're your size.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  They sure are. Birkenstocks be gone. There's some new shoes coming to Vermont, people.

• 51:56Jamie Kern Lima?

  Thank you, thank you, thank you.

• 51:57Speaker 01

  I love you. And the one thing I want to say to you quickly.

• 52:00Jamie Kern Lima?

  Yes.

• 52:01Speaker 01

  You don't have to do this.

• 52:04Speaker 01

  And I want to acknowledge the fact that even though you have

• 52:13Speaker 01

  created

• 52:16Speaker 01

  a life that anyone could ever dream of, your heart is so huge and your call to serve is so big

• 52:26Speaker 01

  that you are not stopping.

• 52:31Speaker 01

  You are going to keep on going because of what you have to give to the world. And I am so proud to call you my friend. I love you.

• 52:43Jamie Kern Lima?

  I love you. Thank you. I have one more thing to share with you, but before I do, if you got value out of this episode, my only ask is that you please share it. Share it with another person in your life who could benefit from it. Post it and share it with others online or in your community who just might need the words and tools and lessons in this episode today. You never know whose life you're meant to change today by sharing this episode. And thank you so much for joining me today. And before you go, I want to share some words with you that couldn't be more true. You, right now, exactly as you are, are enough and fully worthy.

• 53:28Jamie Kern Lima?

  You're worthy of your greatest hopes, your wildest dreams, and all the unconditional love in the world. It's an honor to welcome you to each episode of the Jamie Kern Lima Show. Here, I hope you'll come as you are and heal where you need and blossom what you choose. Journey toward your calling and stay as long as you'd like because you belong here. You are worthy, you are loved, you are love. I love you and I cannot wait to join you on the next episode. This is the Jamie Kern Lima Show. In life, you don't soar to the level of your hopes and dreams.

• 54:12Jamie Kern Lima?

  You stay stuck at the level of your self-worth. When you build your self-worth, you change your entire life. And that's exactly why I wrote my new book, Worthy: How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life for You. If you have some self-doubt to destroy and a destiny to fulfill, Worthy is for you. In Worthy, you'll learn proven tools and simple steps that bring life-changing results, like how to get unstuck from the things holding you back, build unshakable self-love, unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt, and embrace the truths that wake up worthiness.

• 54:56Jamie Kern Lima?

  Overcome limiting beliefs and imposter syndrome? Achieve your hopes and dreams by believing you are worthy of them and so much more. Are you ready to unleash your greatness and step into the person you were born to be? Imagine a life with zero self doubt and unshakable self-worth. Get your copy of Worthy, plus some amazing thank you bonus gifts for you at worthybook.com or the link in the show notes below. Imagine what you'd do if you fully believed in you. It's time to find out with Worthy.

• 55:38Jamie Kern Lima?

  Do you struggle with negative self-talk? Living with a constant mental narrative that you're not good enough is exhausting. I know because I spent most of my life in that habit. The words you say to yourself about yourself are so powerful. And when you learn to take control over your self-talk, it's life-changing. And I wanted to give you a free resource that I created for you if this is something that could benefit your life. It's called Five Ways to Overcome Negative Self-Talk and Build Self-Love. And it's a free how-to guide to overcome that negative self-talk to build confidence

• 56:20Jamie Kern Lima?

  and develop unshakable self-love so that you can dream big and keep going in the pursuit of your goals. Don't let self-sabotaging thoughts hinder your progress any longer. It's time to rewrite the script of your life, one filled with self-love, resilience, and unwavering belief. If you're ready to take charge of your narrative, build unwavering confidence, and empower yourself to persevere on the path to your dreams, you can grab your free guide to Stop Overthinking and Learn to Trust Yourself at jamiekernlima.com/resources or click the link in the show notes below.

• 57:02Jamie Kern Lima?

  This show is presented solely for entertainment purposes only. It's not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, psychotherapist, professional coach, or other qualified professional. I hope you enjoyed this episode and conversation together, and I am so grateful to be on this journey with you. And did you know, for every episode of the Jamie Kern Lima Show, there are a set of special prompt questions just for you, to help you on your journey of aha moments and revelations in your own life from each episode. Make sure you join my free email newsletter at JamieKernLima.com to get them sent to you each week.

• 57:47Jamie Kern Lima?

  And each episode is meant to be evergreen and packed with timeless life lessons, so you can go back and listen to past episodes you perhaps haven't heard yet, as we are going on this incredible journey of building self-worth and living our best lives together.