Are Generations Even a Thing?

We all love to tour our generation's superiority, but who decides where the split occurs and what to name it? And is this even a thing or just an arbitrary division? See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:04Josh Clark?

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• 1:48Josh Clark?

  Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's here. Just a few Gen Xers hanging, doing our thing, being too cool for you and drinking Mountain Dew, code red. And that's it.

• 2:03Speaker 03

  Wow. Look at you on fire already.

• 2:07Josh Clark?

  I don't know about that. I could have done a lot better, but that was off the dome.

• 2:12Speaker 03

  Yeah, but well, off the dome, that's probably a millennial or Gen Z saying.

• 2:17Josh Clark?

  I got my, I got that from you.

• 2:19Speaker 03

  Well, I got that from Noel.

• 2:21Josh Clark?

  Oh, well Noel's definitely a millennial.

• 2:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:25Josh Clark?

  He is a millennial through and through, as we'll see. What the birth cohort that Noel and every one of his age cohort was born into are exactly alike and they're different from everybody older and younger. And it's pure science that's proven that.

• 2:42Speaker 03

  Yeah. And by the way, we're talking about Noel, co-host, obviously, of Stuff They Don't Want You To Know, among other great things that he's done, including former mini movie crush co-host.

• 2:55Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I didn't know if you were going to say that for a second and I was going to jump in and be like, uh, don't forget movie crush.

• 3:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah. He hosted those minis with me.

• 3:03Josh Clark?

  Yeah, for sure. And he was, uh, he produced them too, right?

• 3:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, he produced them for a while. And then, uh, I think Noel even took the reins and hosted two great episodes by himself, if anyone is a fan of John Cameron Mitchell.

• 3:18Josh Clark?

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:19Speaker 03

  Kesha.

• 3:20Josh Clark?

  Oh, wow. Like Kesha was on?

• 3:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, two of the bigger gets on Movie Crush were Noel episodes.

• 3:27Josh Clark?

  Wow. What, what was Kesha's favorite movie?

• 3:31Speaker 03

  You know, I, I'm pretty great at remembering all of the guests that I had, but I don't, I don't remember Kesha or John Cameron Mitchells.

• 3:38Josh Clark?

  Oh, okay. Well, we'll look it up someday.

• 3:41Speaker 03

  Yeah. Something great.

• 3:44Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I remember when Noel, when you made him producer, he let that go to his head. He started wearing, um, like pastel blazers with the sleeves rolled up. He was always like sniffing and like touching his nose. He was

• 3:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 3:55Josh Clark?

  Uber producer for a while.

• 3:56Speaker 03

  He got an ascot, which was a little much, but.

• 4:00Josh Clark?

  Uh, started hanging with Bronson Pincho. So, uh, we're talking today about generations. That's why I mentioned that we're all Generation X. And, uh, I was being facetious earlier when I said, this is all proven by science. Apparently it's not at all proven by science. It's really not particularly scientific. And the whole thing, actually, when you start to dig into it, was this sociological, almost, um, intellectual debate that got somehow manhandled and taken over by marketing, who now use it to, to make money, essentially.

• 4:35Speaker 03

  Yeah. See, what I found interesting about this, and I commissioned this one because it just, the whole idea of generations, uh, fascinates me, but, you know, you'll hear us say things like, well, it's all, it was all a marketing thing, basically, to sell people stuff. Uh, and it's really, um, people feel.

• 4:54Speaker 03

  Commonalities, or there are commonalities in people around the same age because of these reasons, but that's also sort of being a part of the generation that you're dubbed.

• 5:04Josh Clark?

  Right. There are actual like decent explanations that sociologists have come up with, but they're not. The problem is, is that you can't paint an entire group of people with that same brush. And that's what people try to do.

• 5:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 5:19Josh Clark?

  And then also the same market researchers that always hype and they're generational researchers, even though they're not really scientists, they're market researchers. If they, it would be so much more honest if they were like, here's what a lot of kids, the cool kids are into today. Start selling to them like that. Not like this entire generation is like this specific group of well-to-do white suburban kids, essentially.

• 5:41Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 5:42Josh Clark?

  But it's still interesting to talk about. So let's talk about it a little bit because there are generations that seem to have really, like are paying attention to them really kind of started in the beginning of the 20th century. That's when people started thinking about this kind of thing.

• 5:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure. So we're going to kind of go through, since they've been dubbing generations, specific generations here in the United States, we're going to go through them to begin with. And I think it's a good just sort of primer for when you're hanging out and talking about this kind of thing with other people, you'll know all this stuff because there was one or two that slipped in there that I kind of forgot about.

• 6:17Josh Clark?

  Uh, like the lost generation?

• 6:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, that, that was the first one, right?

• 6:22Josh Clark?

  Yeah. So they were born between 1883 and 1900. They came of age during World War I, which was like a massive catastrophe for the entire world, for everyone. Like nothing had ever happened like that before in the history of humanity.

• 6:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 6:36Josh Clark?

  And it was just a really big deal. And this was the group that came of age during that time. And they're called the lost generation. Gertrude Stein called them that. But there's, they, they had a loss of friends and family to, to death in the war, loss of limbs to landmines, loss of faith in institutions and the traditional values that got everybody to World War I. Um, it was a big deal. And those kids were the ones who went on to become the rebellious jazz age people.

• 7:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, and I'm glad we're saying where these came from because that was one of the big kind of curiosities I had was like, who even thinks of these names?

• 7:13Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 7:13Speaker 03

  And in most of these cases, we can trace it back to when a person said it at first, like in print, usually that doesn't mean they're the people who dreamed it up.

• 7:21Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 7:22Speaker 03

  But specifically in this case, it was from the book, The Sun Also Rises, and the epigraph Ernest Hemingway quoted Stein saying, "You are all a lost generation." So it looked, that one looks pretty clear cut.

• 7:32Josh Clark?

  Yeah, the next sentence was, "Too bad, so sad."

• 7:36Speaker 03

  Your dad.

• 7:37Josh Clark?

  Hemingway had a way of turning a phrase.

• 7:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:40Josh Clark?

  Who was next, Chuck? Who was after the lost generation?

• 7:43Speaker 03

  Uh, well, the greatest generation from 1901 to 1927.

• 7:47Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 7:47Speaker 03

  And you're also going to notice that the years are going to fluctuate a little bit because there's not a set science to any of this, as you said, even though there's this one dude that we'll learn later is like, we should just make it 15 years moving forward.

• 7:58Josh Clark?

  Right, yeah, because the first one was 17 years and then this one's 26 years.

• 8:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly. This is obviously the, the generation, I guess it would be like our grandparents who lived through the Great Depression and were, you know, defended freedom against the Nazis in World War II. And this is one, name wise, that came about, the name came about much later. Uh, well, I'll go ahead and say who ended up naming it and then maybe you can take what the original name was, but Tom Brokaw wrote the book, The Greatest Generation, and that, that was 1998, and that really took off and kind of stuck.

• 8:36Josh Clark?

  Oh, yeah, that was a big deal. I remember when that came out. I can hear Tom Brokaw saying it. I can't do an impression of it, but can hear him saying it and talking about it. But essentially, he, he wrote this book about just profiling different veterans, I think mostly everyday people. Um, and essentially collectively said, like, these are the people who grew up in the depression. They faced genuine deprivation in many, many cases, collectively too. And then they went on and were called to like, go fight the Nazis in World War II, right? So. There's nobody before or since that's done this kind of stuff. Hats off to you, greatest generation. And they sat back and were like, we'll, we'll take this. Sure. Keep going, Brokaw.

• 9:18Speaker 03

  That's right. And since you didn't do what I set you up to do, I'll do that part.

• 9:23Speaker 03

  They were not always the greatest generation. There were these two generational theorists, or theorists, Neil Howe and William Strauss. And they actually coined the term millennial, but they had previously labeled that generation, the GI generation, the greatest generation, and then Brokaw came along. I used to do a Brokaw, weirdly.

• 9:43Josh Clark?

  Can you try now?

• 9:44Speaker 03

  I don't remember. It was more about cadence than the actual voice because he always sounded like he was just out of breath or something like that.

• 9:53Josh Clark?

  That's pretty good. Not bad at all, man.

• 9:55Speaker 03

  It was a breathing thing for him. It always felt like he was just about to inhale, but he couldn't quite get there. Which is sad.

• 10:03Josh Clark?

  Enough of that GI generation, though, stuff, or the GI generation. I said it wrong. Let's get back to Brokaw and his book.

• 10:11Speaker 03

  I mean, what do you need to know? It was a huge book.

• 10:14Josh Clark?

  Came out in 1998.

• 10:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, I already said that.

• 10:17Josh Clark?

  Oh, okay, good. I just wanted to make sure all of our Ts were crossed and our Is were dotted.

• 10:21Speaker 03

  Sure. We could say it a third time if that really, you know, if you want to drive book sales.

• 10:24Josh Clark?

  Hit it up.

• 10:26Speaker 03

  1998, everybody.

• 10:27Josh Clark?

  Very nice.

• 10:28Speaker 03

  Still the year.

• 10:29Josh Clark?

  So let's move on to the next generation. This is called the silent generation. This is when my dad was born and he actually fits this bill pretty well.

• 10:38Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think my mom, I can't remember the year, but I'm pretty sure she was the silent generation as well.

• 10:45Josh Clark?

  It makes sense. We're, we're of that age that that would, that would make sense.

• 10:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, just on the cusp of, of boomerdom, but silent generation is, I guess, maybe so dubbed because they're between the greatest generation and the baby boomers who got way more attention. And the silent generation was just sort of wedged there and like kind of quietly wedged there in the middle doing their thing.

• 11:07Josh Clark?

  Yes. Also, though, they, they, I guess the whole thing comes from a Time article or essay written in 1951 anonymously, weirdly, I guess, because this person was criticizing their own generation.

• 11:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, maybe.

• 11:20Josh Clark?

  But they said, they called them the silent generation. They said, it does not issue manifestos, make speeches or carry posters. It has been called the silent generation. And I think they mean by me. And like they were just basically saying like that our parents did all this amazing stuff and we're just, we don't do anything. We're the silent generation. So that makes sense. And then also, I guess the silent generation describes them. They're supposed to be cautious, conformist. That's another reason they're called the silent generation. So that's, you know, I guess it all kind of adds up.

• 11:54Speaker 03

  Yeah. But again, there, you know, I think Dave put this together and he points out, you know, Andy Warhol and Nina Simone and Gloria Steinem and Bob Dylan were all from this generation. So that's, that's where the generation thing kind of falls apart a little bit because you can always pick out individuals and say, well, they're nothing like, they're categorized, you know?

• 12:14Josh Clark?

  Yeah, that's definitely going to be a recurring theme in here. And I saw there's this New Yorker article by Louis Menard. It's time to stop talking about generations where he says essentially, all of the most important figures in like the flower power, anti-war, 60s hippie movement, almost all of them were from the silent generation. You know, like almost none of the people who were the important figures driving this were actually baby boomers.

• 12:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, of course, that's an X from 46 to 64. A pretty wide swath there. And this, they have a pretty interesting distinction is they're actually recognized by the US Census Bureau, the only generation to be kind of independently recognized.

• 12:58Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 12:58Speaker 03

  And they're the baby boomers. I think everyone knows this because there was a big baby boom after World War II. And this isn't something that was just like, oh, the media just got a hold of it. Like there were a ton of babies born after World War II. In 1945, there were 2.9 million. It went to 3.4 the next year. And by 1964, they peaked. Oh, actually, they peaked in 57 with 4.3, but 64 was the last year in the United States, which is kind of crazy to think about, with more than 4 million births.

• 13:32Josh Clark?

  Yeah, it is, which is strange because I think the millennials, didn't they have more than the boomers or were they just barely second? Maybe they were second. Regardless, that is quite a baby boom. I think it's a fit. It's an apt.

• 13:46Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, there are more millennials, living millennials now, but I think that's just because of boomer die off.

• 13:51Josh Clark?

  Gotcha. Okay. So there's, we've talked about this before. I don't remember when. Oh, you know what? We did a whole episode on baby boomers. So I guarantee it was in that.

• 14:01Speaker 03

  Did we?

• 14:02Josh Clark?

  Yeah, we did.

• 14:03Speaker 03

  Huh.

• 14:03Josh Clark?

  Um, I think it was called Leave the Boomers Alone. I don't know.

• 14:07Speaker 03

  Oh, wow. All right.

• 14:08Josh Clark?

  I don't think that's what it was called. I think we called it how baby boomers work. Cause I don't think we were in that mindset.

• 14:14Speaker 03

  I think it was give them hell.

• 14:15Josh Clark?

  Right. But there's like a whole, the later section of boomers, because it's like a 20 year, basically like 18 year group.

• 14:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's a big one.

• 14:27Josh Clark?

  A lot changed in between the, the 60s and the 70s. And the ones that, that were born later on in the baby boom, who grew up in the 70s, had a much different formative age than the, the older boomers who came before them and were like dropping acid and everything. These are the people faced with like, America becoming super cynical.

• 14:49Speaker 03

  Yeah. I mean, my sister is six years older than me and she's a year, she was 65. So she was a year off from being quote unquote boomer. And she's, I mean, she's solid generation X, if you ask me.

• 15:03Josh Clark?

  Right. Yeah. That's another problem too. What about people on the cusp like Zenials?

• 15:08Speaker 03

  Yeah. I mean, supposedly cusp, um, cusp born people identify with both to a certain degree, but I don't know. My sister doesn't have much boomer in her.

• 15:19Josh Clark?

  Right. Right. Um, so that, that group that your sister just barely missed, the second half of the baby boomers, they have been dubbed Generation Jones by an author named Jonathan Pontell.

• 15:33Speaker 03

  Jonathan Jones?

• 15:35Josh Clark?

  He, um, he basically said that he dubbed them that because they're a large anonymous generation. That makes sense. Jones is kind of a, a common last name in the United States. That's another thing, too. We should say generations. The other reason why they seem kind of flibbity-gibbity is because we're talking almost exclusively about the United States here.

• 15:58Speaker 03

  Yeah, of course.

• 15:59Josh Clark?

  At the most, the Western, English-speaking Western world, at the most, right? So, so it's a large anonymous generation, Jones, or this one's so weird, that they are the generation that's Jonesin after their unfulfilled expectations. They're Jonesin for meaning or whatever.

• 16:22Speaker 03

  I thought it might have been keeping up with the Joneses.

• 16:24Josh Clark?

  That's another one, too. But it's almost like every time he said one of these, he's like, hmm, what do you think of that one?

• 16:30Speaker 03

  Right. Yeah. Testing the waters.

• 16:34Josh Clark?

  For sure. Who's up next, Chuck? Would you say the best is up next?

• 16:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, here's the deal, man. I feel like Gen X is very much bordering these days on being labeled as obnoxious about how much we talk about how awesome we are.

• 16:49Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I think so, too.

• 16:50Speaker 03

  I think we're kind of tipping the scales in the wrong direction, so I'm not gonna tout the benefits of being Gen X because we've talked about it before.

• 16:58Josh Clark?

  Well, also, that's like, that is, that's super Gen X. It'd just be like, well, we're treading in the uncool waters here. We better cool off.

• 17:05Speaker 03

  You're totally right. I didn't even think about that. That's as Gen X as it gets.

• 17:10Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 17:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, that's one of the things about Gen X is we supposedly shunned, and we did, labels, and were very sort of jaded and cynical and anti-corporate. Obviously, we think of the grunge era of the 90s and rejecting capitalism and stuff like that before a lot of them became capitalists, but there are still, you know, plenty of Gen X, true and true, through and through, both of those. Who are still like that. Um, I don't know if you've seen that great Netflix documentary, The Secret Mall Apartment. Have you seen that?

• 17:46Josh Clark?

  No, that sounds great.

• 17:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, and it's, it's a pretty well-known story that these Gen Xers built a apartment inside the guts of a shopping mall where they weren't found. Highly recommend it. It was a pretty cool story. I remember reading about it, um, kind of years later when it was, uh, I guess got a little more media attention, but the documentary's really good. But it, it could have been called Ode to Gen X because all of these people, I was like, man, this was, these were my people. This like, I could have seen my friends doing something like this.

• 18:13Josh Clark?

  Yeah, pretty creative, um, breaking the rules, but also not really doing anything that's genuinely antisocial necessarily.

• 18:22Speaker 03

  Yeah, breaking rules without causing harm.

• 18:24Josh Clark?

  Yeah, that's a great way to put it, Chuck.

• 18:26Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:27Josh Clark?

  Yeah, we got our name, Generation X did, from the Douglas Copeland book, Generation X colon Tales for an Accelerated Culture, which is a great read. I urge everyone to read it. Um, Copeland apparently one time said he named it after the Billy Idol, Billy Idol's original band, X.

• 18:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:47Josh Clark?

  Then he later took it back and said he got it from an obscure sociology book and that in the book, it was a reference to a group, uh, that the, the sociologist labeled X and this group wanted to basically exit the traditional American class, um, pursuits and, and, um, I guess, uh, preoccupations, like, didn't want to have anything to do with that. So he thought that was kind of a good name for it.

• 19:12Speaker 03

  Yeah. And I think X has long been a stand-in, whether it's Malcolm X or just signing your name with an X when you don't want to put your signature is just sort of a, almost, um, act of civil disobedience of like, this is not me, this is not my label. I'm just going to put an X here.

• 19:27Josh Clark?

  Are you allowed to do that?

• 19:28Speaker 03

  Uh, I mean, I don't know if it's legal, but that was always, I mean, I think initially it was like, if you did, if you couldn't write, you would sign your name with an X as well. But I don't know.

• 19:39Josh Clark?

  So maybe the Gen Xers are being ironic when they're doing that.

• 19:43Speaker 03

  Maybe, but, uh, Gen X is better than Baby Busters, which was the original idea for our name because, um, after the post-war baby boom, uh, birth rates dropped a lot.

• 19:54Josh Clark?

  Yeah, it's a terrible name. I also saw, just like the baby boomers were divided into a couple of groups, the, I saw the older Gen Xers are called the Atari wave, the later Gen Xers are called the Nintendo wave.

• 20:09Speaker 03

  Oh yeah, that makes sense.

• 20:10Josh Clark?

  Mm-hmm. And then carrying it on, the Zenials, the, the ones who are on the cusp between Generation X and Millennials, they're also called Elder Millennials, they're called the Oregon Trail wave.

• 20:21Speaker 03

  I love it. Uh, I thought we could get through all these before our break, but there's still several generations to go. So maybe we should take a break and, and hit up the Millennials after this?

• 20:30Josh Clark?

  Let's break it up.

• 20:31Speaker 03

  All right, we'll be right back. That is Josh. I'm Chuck.

• 20:45Speaker 03

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• 20:52Josh Clark?

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• 21:11Josh Clark?

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• 21:52Josh Clark?

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• 22:07Speaker 03

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• 22:36Josh Clark?

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• 22:55Speaker 04

  First thought is like, wow, how are we going to do all this?

• 22:58Josh Clark?

  Hey, this is Josh and Chuck from Stuff You Should Know.

• 23:01Speaker 03

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• 23:17Speaker 04

  It was going to rival anything that was already built, and that takes quite a bit of people and different teams to all be on the same page.

• 23:24Josh Clark?

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• 23:31Speaker 05

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• 23:36Speaker 03

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• 23:44Speaker 04

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• 23:48Josh Clark?

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• 23:57Josh Clark?

  And then you came along and it was like, boom!

• 24:06Speaker 03

  Uh, yeah, well, we were work pals.

• 24:09Josh Clark?

  All right, now we're on to millennials. Um, I feel like this is a, um, a great generation, if you ask me.

• 24:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, I agree.

• 24:17Josh Clark?

  Maybe not the greatest, but they're a great generation. They put up with a lot more than our generation and more than, um, Gen Z and Gen Alpha. I think they just had, they took the brunt of recent history and they've just kind of plodded along and been like, fine, we'll, we'll be the ones, that's fine, you know? They haven't complained too much. Well, I should say they stopped complaining. They used to complain a lot. And now they've just kind of grown into this, um, respectable and I think self-respecting group as a whole, if generations were real.

• 24:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, I totally agree. That's, uh, people that were born from 81 to 96. Uh, and again, there's a pretty big difference between, and you could say this for a lot of the generations, obviously, but, you know, the ones that were on the cusp of either end, I think millennials may be the most pronounced as far as how different, uh, people born in 81 and people born in 96 are, but that might just be me, you know, in my brain.

• 25:09Josh Clark?

  Yeah. Well, I think especially if you're coming of age in the time before computers or the time when computers are starting to be a thing.

• 25:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 25:17Josh Clark?

  That is definitely, I mean, that's a pretty big dividing line for sure.

• 25:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, I agree.

• 25:22Josh Clark?

  I think those elder millennials too, um, yeah, I think there's something to say about straddling that line. I think it's a cool, it's just a neat thing to, to be able to have experience in both of those completely different realms of technological development. But even more than that, I saw that millennials are divided between whether as a younger person, they watch Saved by the Bell or Saved by the Bell of College Years.

• 25:51Speaker 03

  Well, there's definitely a thing, you know, we ran wild in the streets and knocked on doors and called people on the phone and, um, but we're also, uh, could, can understand, young enough to understand all the tech that we're explaining to our parents and grandparents. But, um, I think elder millennials definitely sort of identify with that life as well.

• 26:10Josh Clark?

  Yes.

• 26:12Speaker 03

  They were first dubbed the Echo Boomers. Um, obviously it's the children of boomers. Uh, they created a little bit of a baby bump on the population charts. And like I said, they're the largest living generation right now. Uh, they took over in 2019, took over the boomers, um, at 72 million millennials in 2019. And that's a lot of folks.

• 26:31Josh Clark?

  Yeah, and just a little bleak note on that statistic. It wasn't because they kept being born up to 2019, if you know what I mean.

• 26:41Speaker 03

  They were originally Generation Y, or at least that was the early consideration.

• 26:48Speaker 03

  Editors at Ad Age. And as you'll see, there's a lot of marketing people that have their thumbs in this pie. But they were the ones that were gonna, trying to call them Generation Y. As like a more extreme Generation X. But our buddies Neil Howe and William Strauss again. In 1991, they published a book called Generations Colon.

• 27:11Speaker 03

  The History of America's Future. 1584 to 2069. And that's where they came up with the millennial generation for pretty obvious reasons.

• 27:20Josh Clark?

  You left out the comma. There's a colon and a comma in there.

• 27:23Speaker 03

  There is. Yeah, there's a comma after America's future. You're right.

• 27:28Josh Clark?

  So we need a jingle for commas, the rare comma, you know?

• 27:32Speaker 03

  They should have finished it off with 1584 to 2069. An exclamation point.

• 27:37Josh Clark?

  You're right. And then the zero in 2069 is the ampersand.

• 27:44Josh Clark?

  Let's just keep it going. What's the, what's the one in 1584?

• 27:51Speaker 03

  Has it gotta be punctuation? Because the first thing I thought of was an I with a heart above it.

• 27:56Josh Clark?

  Ooh, I like that.

• 27:57Speaker 03

  That's an I, though.

• 27:59Josh Clark?

  They can actually program anything they want to into a keyboard. I found that out when Prince changed his name to a symbol, the artist formerly known as Prince.

• 28:07Speaker 03

  And you could type that?

• 28:08Josh Clark?

  Yes, they sent it out to all of the media and press to basically insert it into their font catalog. So they can do that.

• 28:16Speaker 03

  That was pretty funny.

• 28:17Josh Clark?

  They could, yeah. They can make an I with a heart above it if you want them to.

• 28:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think so. And by the way, I said, I think it's pretty obvious, but we'll say it out loud. It's the first generation to be, the first to graduate high school after the year 2000.

• 28:31Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 28:32Speaker 03

  So there you have it.

• 28:32Josh Clark?

  And sorry, I realize I'm being a little squirrely today that you keep setting me up. And I'm like, no, let's talk about this instead.

• 28:39Speaker 03

  That's all right.

• 28:40Josh Clark?

  So the other thing about it, I think the reason why millennials stuck and overtook Generation Y, which I fully remember, that was really close to being that generation's name. And I'm really glad it turned into millennials. It has like an optimistic, kind of hopeful feel to it.

• 28:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think so.

• 28:57Josh Clark?

  So one of the things that characterized millennials as far as generation researchers go is that they came of age during nine 11 as young kids. That was an enormous thing to learn at a young age that things like that can happen in the world. And that an entire like culture can lose its innocence in like one morning. And then also, as they started to enter the workforce, they got smacked with the Great Recession and couldn't find a job for five years. And they were the first generation to start moving back in with their parents because they had to. So who's up next Chuck after millennials?

• 29:31Speaker 03

  Well, everybody knows Gen Z, they're staring at you silently.

• 29:36Speaker 03

  But but not judging, I don't think, or maybe they are.

• 29:38Josh Clark?

  No, they are.

• 29:39Speaker 03

  1997 to 2012. The reason is Gen Z is just from when it was supposedly going to be Gen Y before them.

• 29:49Speaker 03

  IGEN lowercase i was going to be the initial name because of obvious reasons again. For, you know, Apple stuff.

• 29:57Josh Clark?

  That's a good one.

• 29:58Speaker 03

  Digital natives is what they say that were literally all born and raised in the internet age.

• 30:03Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I like IGEN. That could have been good. I'm sure Apple was like, yeah, let's call them that.

• 30:08Speaker 03

  Yeah, let's sue everybody as well.

• 30:13Josh Clark?

  They were also almost called Generation K, which this is astonishing to me.

• 30:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:18Josh Clark?

  The K is for the K and Katniss Everdeen from The Hunger Games.

• 30:23Speaker 03

  Who thought of that? I mean, it had to be the movie studio that made that, right?

• 30:27Josh Clark?

  Probably, probably or a publicist they secretly hired. But the reason why is because it's just such a almost a dystopian era that these kids are growing up in or grew up in.

• 30:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:40Josh Clark?

  You know, I mean, but still, first of all, you don't want to name an entire generation after the doomiest thing you can think of.

• 30:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:48Josh Clark?

  You want to kind of have at least put some sort of a positive spin on it and we'll see why it matters in a minute.

• 30:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:55Josh Clark?

  What about Generation C? Surely that's gotta be upbeat.

• 30:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, Generation COVID or coronavirus, that was a consideration for a little while as well. Luckily, that didn't make it and we got Gen Z, who is known for what Dave calls, quote, "being extremely online."

• 31:14Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 31:15Speaker 03

  As opposed to just online a lot, I guess.

• 31:19Josh Clark?

  Yeah, they're also known for curating their online images. They were the first to really start paying attention to this. They also put a lot into, a lot of stock into being authentic and socially conscious. They're also, on the negative side, frequently called coddled, entitled, snowflakes, that kind of stuff. Again, all of this stuff, you're like, yep, totally, totally, 100%. Just stop for a second and remember, you're talking about millions of people from all walks of life. They're all coddled, they're all snowflakes, they're all entitled. Like, think about what that's actually saying, right? So, and the idea is that this is all made up. So, you've just gotta remember that because, well, we'll just cut to the chase real quick right now.

• 32:04Josh Clark?

  There's like a real harm that can be done in

• 32:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:07Josh Clark?

  in calling entire groups of kids or dismissing entire groups of people as snowflakes. Or woke, or whatever. God, I hate that word.

• 32:18Speaker 03

  You could barely even say it. It even sounded funny coming out of your mouth.

• 32:21Josh Clark?

  Right. Like, you can even deride their, you know, focus on authenticity or whatever. You can take any of these and turn it negative and that harms the group that you're talking about. But it also makes that group resent you.

• 32:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:36Josh Clark?

  Probably the older person who's criticizing them and what they care about and what they're interested in. Because you weren't, or it doesn't make sense to you and your values. There is actual individual harm, but also, more importantly, a social harm that can be done. Because it allows for essentially a socially acceptable form of discrimination, which is ageism, whether it's going upward in age or downward in age. It doesn't matter. It still is harmful.

• 33:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, it gives somebody permission to do something like that.

• 33:09Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 33:09Speaker 03

  Uh, and, and it's no different if you're, if you're like, hey, you know what? You're not like other Gen Z's. You're, you're the real deal. You're not like an entitled little snowflake. Like, just stop. That's, that's even worse almost.

• 33:20Josh Clark?

  It is. Stop being the uncle at Thanksgiving. Just stop. But simultaneously, stop being the millennial who says like, okay, boomer, although I know no one says that anymore, but that was harmful too. Even though it was totally accurate.

• 33:39Speaker 03

  Uh, interesting thing about Gen Z, uh, Dave found some research on some of the politics. Uh, there was a survey on, uh, gender and 53% of Gen Z women apparently described themselves as feminists compared to only 32% of Gen Z men, which is the largest gap, I believe. Uh, I don't know about of any generation, but that's a 21 point gap compared to an 8% gap. Same question for Gen X. What I thought was super interesting.

• 34:07Josh Clark?

  Yeah, and very concerning too. And that's legitimate because they're, they're using Gen Z as just a shorthand for an actual age group that was legitimately surveyed. So that is a, that is a troubling value, change in values, I think.

• 34:23Speaker 03

  Yeah. What's next?

• 34:24Josh Clark?

  Next up Chuck is the, the latest generation, not greatest, latest. Who knows whether they're going to be great or not. History will tell us eventually, but that's Gen Alpha. And I think it's very reassuring that, um, we, we're not on Gen Z anymore because that's, it's a little troublesome that you've reached the end of the alphabet as a group goes, like a population of human beings goes, now we're back to Alpha and that's, that's great. I'm glad for that.

• 34:51Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, and earlier when I mentioned there's, uh, some guy that wanted to say, let's just make it 15 years moving forward. That's a guy, uh, named Mark McCrendle. He's an Australian social researcher and he is the one who coined generation Alpha. Uh, again, just starting over after Z. And he said, and also, he sounds a little grumpy. He's like, and also can we just make them Greek letters from now on and like go Gen Beta after this?

• 35:16Josh Clark?

  And everyone said, no, you're not the boss of us. We come up with our own willy nilly. And we decide as a group what we like and what we don't like. So no, we'll go with your Gen Alpha for now, but don't get, um, above your station McCrendle.

• 35:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, slow your roll, buddy. Although it'll probably be Gen Beta, which would be kids born this year, starting this year.

• 35:36Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I predict it's not going to be Gen Beta, Chuck.

• 35:40Speaker 03

  Yeah, I agree.

• 35:41Josh Clark?

  I think it's gonna be, they'll start with that, and I think it'll be something else. I think humanity just wants to spite Mark McCrindle.

• 35:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, and Beta has such a negative connotation now, just from those alt-right weirdos that, you know, Beta male stuff.

• 35:56Josh Clark?

  Right, plus also Beta Max, no one like that.

• 36:00Speaker 03

  Exactly, Betadine, that stuff was the worst, because that means you have a nasty cut.

• 36:04Josh Clark?

  Right, or Beta Fish, they're always fighting in the mirror.

• 36:08Speaker 03

  Yeah, who wants a Beta Fish? Boring.

• 36:11Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I know, it's sad for the Beta Fish, though, because their prize is at county fairs very frequently.

• 36:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's true.

• 36:18Josh Clark?

  So apparently, Gen Alpha is even more online than Gen Z, so much so that they don't even really realize, well, they're also still pretty young right now, they're born between 2010 and 2025. Their cutoff just happened last year.

• 36:36Josh Clark?

  They're not even aware that there is anything, that there's other stuff out there, from what I understand.

• 36:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, there's an alternative.

• 36:44Josh Clark?

  Yes, exactly, thank you. That, like, this is just what people do, because that's what they grew up doing, and there's a lot of concern about what effects that's having on them. Gen Z, the big concern is social media and the devastating effect that can have on a developing mind. With Gen Alpha, it's like, all technology now is just gunning for those little tiny brains, and people are like, what's, what's gonna happen with this?

• 37:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, trust me, I'm a parent of one, and I wonder sometimes.

• 37:13Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I mean, it's gotta be so preposterously hard to raise a kid these days compared to 30, 40, 50 years ago.

• 37:22Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, there's more raising of a kid, if that's what you mean. Like more active parenting.

• 37:27Josh Clark?

  Yeah, oh, definitely, for sure.

• 37:30Speaker 03

  What I think's weird, and you know, I'm getting a little off track, but Gen X was like, "We were wild in the streets and our parents ignored us, but we were the first helicopter parents."

• 37:40Josh Clark?

  Yes.

• 37:40Speaker 03

  I'm not, of course, but that was where, kind of where it came from.

• 37:43Josh Clark?

  Right. Gen Z has turned out to be really weird and, um, really weird as far as that goes compared to how we were raised and then how we're raising kids, our own kids. It's, it is very surprising. It's a surprising turn of events, if you ask me.

• 38:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 38:04Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I guess that stranger danger finally got through to us, but not until we were like 40.

• 38:10Speaker 03

  So this, uh, generation thing is, like we said, mainly made up. I mean, the, the term generation obviously comes from biology and like when a parent has a kid, that offspring is the next generation. Uh, but as far as like generations goes, as we're talking about them, there was a sociologist, I think, kind of the first guy to write about this. His name was Carl Manheim. And he wrote an essay in the 1920s called "The Problem of Generations." And he was just sort of trying to look at like, how do groups of cohorts or groups of people change over time? And that's where he, and you know, he was, in his book, and you know, I think generally when people talk about this stuff, they're talking a little less about like,

• 38:55Speaker 03

  back then, the factory workers and farmers and a little more like intellectuals and writers and artists.

• 39:00Josh Clark?

  Yeah, 100%. Manheim was like, people who aren't like intellectual or artistic, they're probably not changing that much as a group over time, but tastes in art and culture change, you know, pretty distinctly over relatively short periods, a decade, two decades, that kind of thing. He's like, "Why?" And I mean, I'm sure other people have noticed this too, but Mannheim was the first to stop and try to figure out what was going on. And what he came up with was essentially what most, the average person believes generations come from today, average person on the street who thinks about this kind of stuff. And that is called the imprint hypothesis. And

• 39:39Josh Clark?

  it essentially says that some event, some process, something big of historic proportions that happened during your formative years as a kid, made an impression on you, it imprinted on you and made you kind of who you are, gave you your outlook on life. And because there was a whole other cohort of kids your same age, the same thing happened to them. And that's why people within a generation resemble one another in a lot of ways, especially with trends and values and outlooks and stuff.

• 40:14Speaker 03

  Yeah. And we talked about all these as we've gone along, you know, the depression, COVID, nine 11, all these things. Those are generation shaping events, according to him, being imprinted with those. There are other sociologists that say, you know, it's not really outside events that's causing this stuff. It just sort of organically happens when groups of young people are all just hanging out and growing up together.

• 40:38Josh Clark?

  Yeah. So it's a chicken or the egg situation. Like, does society change because new people grow up and like just change society because there's new people and new ways of thinking? Or do people change because society changes, like EG through COVID or the Challenger disaster or something like that, or the fall of the Berlin Wall that has these huge imprints on people? And there's actually a guy named Morris Massey, who basically combined the two. He said that there's, that it's values that that separate the generations, that that's really what it is. And that the reasons that the values are different among generations

• 41:18Josh Clark?

  is because of that imprinting process happens to hit at a time when you are in a formative, I guess, a formative place where you're figuring out what your values are. And when that historic thing happens, that helps shape your values. That same historic thing isn't going to have the same effect on older people because their values have already been shaped, but it will on that one generation. So that's, that's essentially what his jam was. He was kind of merging everything.

• 41:46Speaker 03

  For sure. Um, you know, we promised talk of advertising because that's in marketing. That's where a lot of this comes from. And it does, because no one really talked about this stuff until the 1970s, when baby boomers were getting into their twenties. And, you know, if you know anything about just, um, marketing and selling things to people, that, that demographic of, you know, 18 to 24 is what they always say. But, you know, basically, people in their twenties is a big, that's when you have money to spend, maybe for the first time, if you're, you know, out from under the, the thumb of your family and your parents, and you've gotten your first job, maybe, or at least in the old days, you probably did. And so, they want to sell to people, they always have, they still do, that are in their twenties. And those are also the, the people that are

• 42:30Speaker 03

  shaping the taste of, uh, generations and influencing people around them in, in age.

• 42:36Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 42:36Speaker 03

  And when the baby boomers were coming into their twenties in the 1970s, companies went wild. And they started doing all this sort of market, generational market research that is a very big deal. I know this is an older stat, but in 2015, they found out that American companies alone spent $70 million just on generational consulting.

• 42:56Josh Clark?

  Yeah. Those people that essentially who, who've made up generations, or say that it happens every 15 years, or something like that.

• 43:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:05Josh Clark?

  So, yeah. Um, you want to take a break and come back and talk about some criticisms of this?

• 43:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, let's do it.

• 43:10Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 43:12Speaker 03

  That is Josh. I'm Chuck.

• 43:24Josh Clark?

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• 43:40Speaker 03

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• 44:08Josh Clark?

  Through personal stories and expert insight, listen in to unpack what it means when your body doesn't always respond to food the way you expect, and what science is now revealing about why. Listen to Eating Interrupted on the iHeart app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 44:30Speaker 03

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• 44:33Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 44:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, because it's a process. There's always something you could do, or buy, or update. The only question is, what's next? For us, our animals just wear out our rugs so quickly. It's usually a new rug.

• 44:43Josh Clark?

  Well, Chuck, whether you need a rug, or whatever is next for you, you can go to Wayfair. It's the smart place to get it.

• 44:50Speaker 03

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• 45:02Josh Clark?

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• 45:27Speaker 03

  And you came along, and it was like, boom!

• 45:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, we were work pals. All right, we're back, talking more about generations. And we're going to talk about some criticisms in a second. We should say that, you know, obviously, the media plays a part in all this. It's not all just like a marketing scam.

• 45:48Josh Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 45:49Speaker 03

  But when the media picks up on these names especially, and, you know, all of a sudden, there's people writing books, and technically, that's selling something, but that's producing a, you know, your take. Like, everyone's got their take on this stuff. So there's going to be plenty of people writing books about all these generations.

• 46:06Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 46:06Speaker 03

  But the whole idea is like, is this even a real thing at all? And sociologists look at three different effects that influence how people think and behave. And they're the life cycle effects, the period effects, and the cohort effects.

• 46:21Josh Clark?

  Yeah, the life cycle effects makes the most sense to me in that you are likely to essentially not change your personality, but change your outlook, your values, that kind of thing as you age. And so entire cohorts of people age generally the same. So they're all going through the same life stages at roughly the same time. So they, like the, um, baby boomers are a really pronounced example of this. When you're younger, you're more rebellious, you question the system, you want to change things. Hence the sixties hippies. Uh, as you get a little older, you become much more materialistic, you become, say, more grounded. Uh, you abandon your earlier idealism in a lot of cases, the yuppies of the eighties.

• 47:02Josh Clark?

  And then as you get older and kind of get put out to pasture, one of the ways that you can make yourself more relevant is to become politically active, hence the older, current, today, baby boomers. So like this, this whole idea is that we confuse that for generational effects, that people are actually just going through life stages together en masse.

• 47:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly. Or that, you know, millennials, um, were like, no, we're not having babies and we're, we're moving to the suburbs. We're living in the city and we're staying single, or at least getting married and shunning kids. And while plenty of them did and still do, um, as they got a little bit older, and this is the life cycle effect, a lot of them did get those kids and families and a lot of them did get the house in the suburbs. And it's just, you know, it's an, it's an age effect thing.

• 47:48Josh Clark?

  Right, um, the same thing with, uh, period effects. It's, it's basically saying, no, there's, there's no such thing as generations, or we confuse the generational effects, um, or differences for actual period effects. And what that is, is that those same historic events happen, but they impact like everybody. We just happen to focus on the group that it tends to impact the most, the younger generation. Because again, they're going through a formative time. So COVID affected everybody in all sorts of very deep ways, right?

• 48:22Josh Clark?

  It affected like kids, people were preoccupied with kids because those kids like basically had a whole year of very important schooling that they didn't get. And that was a huge focus of society. And so that kind of became looked at, focused on, and kind of that was hung on that generation, whereas really, everybody got affected by COVID in a bunch of different ways.

• 48:44Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure. And the last one cohort effects, I don't really see the difference in why this is even broken out between, it sounds just sort of like the other two combined in a way.

• 48:54Josh Clark?

  That's exactly right. That was that Morris Massey thing, basically. And this is what we think of as generational effects, combination of life cycle and period effects, producing groups where you are different from people who are older than you and different from people who are younger than you.

• 49:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 49:10Josh Clark?

  That's generational differences or generational effects. That's what people are saying like that's, no, life cycle effects, sure. Period effects, sure. Cohort effects, we don't really think so.

• 49:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly. As far as criticisms go, we've lobbed a few out there as far as what generally people think, how they think critically about dividing people up like this. But one big problem is that you sort of touched on it earlier, that these are really broad generalizations, but it's from small sample sizes. So the media has a lot to do with this, how this plays out. And Dave makes a great point. If you're, you know, when you talk about the 1960s, like the first thing that comes to your mind is like Woodstock and the hippies and sticking a daisy in the barrel of a rifle. And there were very few people like that, if you look at like percentages. And you base

• 50:01Speaker 03

  it on things like drug use and premarital sex and feelings like that. Like apparently, almost 90% of Americans, 20-somethings, did not smoke pot in 1969. And if you look at movies and TV and the media, you think like, kind of that was what everyone was doing.

• 50:17Josh Clark?

  Yeah, like 112% of 20-somethings in 1969. Exactly. And that's the thing, like the media highlights the most extreme segment of a group of people. And that still happens today. The loudest people get the most attention, essentially.

• 50:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure. Another big criticism is The, when you, and you touched on this a little bit too, like when you group people up in these huge cohorts and say, everyone's kind of like this, you're really, really ignoring everything within that, that group of people, like all the little differences, like, oh, race and class and income and privilege and stuff like that. And you really nailed it when you said, like, when people talk about generations in broad terms like this, they're kind of talking, because it's a marketing thing, about like, you know, middle to upper class, white America in a lot of cases.

• 51:11Josh Clark?

  Yeah. It ignores intersectionality essentially, which ironically is something that people say that Gen Z is preoccupied with.

• 51:21Speaker 03

  Yeah. Although, you know, there's, I totally believe this is a thing, but I remember when I saw the movie Crooklyn, Spike Lee's great movie about his life growing up in the seventies in Brooklyn, New York. I remember watching that movie and being like, oh my God, that was my life growing up in suburban Atlanta in the 1970s as a white kid. Like, we're all the same.

• 51:43Josh Clark?

  Okay. Right. Right. So there were similarities. He also had much, he faced a lot of differences that you didn't face too, I'm sure, and vice versa. You guys had different challenges for sure. But that's more of like a, society was like that at that time. That's what parents in general were like, okay, this is cool. This is what we're doing. There's, let's just have latchkey kids. It's what we have to do because both parents are working now and we're still figuring it out. That's what society was doing. The question is, did that have an impression on this whole group of kids, the same way to make them unique in that way? That's what generations are saying.

• 52:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure. And, you know, one of the other criticisms you were talking about earlier is when you're giving people permission to sort of drag and dunk on a whole generation for being like, on your phone too long, or addicted to your screens, or this or that, or snowflakes. If you dig down and look at actual statistics for some of this stuff, Dave found out, and this doesn't surprise me at all, I've talked about the fact that baby boomers are on their phone. At least in my life, more than anyone I know.

• 52:48Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 52:49Speaker 03

  People sixty five and over average ten hours of screen time a day compared to seven hours a day for eighteen to thirty four year olds. And that is not just on your phone. That's also due somewhat to the fact that when, you know, very sadly, when some people retire, they like start watching TV during the day, which is the death knell, if you ask me.

• 53:09Josh Clark?

  It is. You wanna, you wanna not watch TV during the day and not watch it in bed at night.

• 53:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, I love watching TV in bed.

• 53:17Josh Clark?

  I do too, but in hotels.

• 53:20Speaker 03

  Oh, I love it, man. Nothing better than watching a movie in bed.

• 53:22Josh Clark?

  What do you, oh, you watch movies in bed? You don't watch like.

• 53:26Speaker 03

  Whatever.

• 53:26Josh Clark?

  You don't watch Jimmy Fallon?

• 53:29Speaker 03

  No, no, no. I don't watch any. I mean, I love Jimmy Fallon, but I haven't watched late night talk shows since Conan left.

• 53:36Josh Clark?

  Well, that's a pretty good reason to stop, actually.

• 53:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think so.

• 53:41Josh Clark?

  Chuck, you got anything else? Because I'm hoping you say no. I feel like this is a nice little package that we put together.

• 53:48Speaker 03

  No, and that means long stuff is out.

• 53:52Josh Clark?

  That's right.

• 53:52Speaker 03

  Oh, wait. No, no, no. Sorry. How do we end this thing?

• 53:54Josh Clark?

  We say it's time for listener mail.

• 53:59Speaker 03

  That's right. But instead of listener mail, we are going to reiterate that we are performing, I believe, tomorrow.

• 54:08Speaker 03

  In Madison, Wisconsin. Isn't that right?

• 54:10Josh Clark?

  Yeah, we're gonna be there April sixteenth. So if this comes out April fifteenth, you're right on the money.

• 54:15Speaker 03

  No, it's coming out on the fourteenth. So in two days, we'll be in Madison.

• 54:19Josh Clark?

  Either way, if you're in the Madison area, come see us. Or in Chicago, come see us. Akron, I think it's like too late because we basically have sold out Akron.

• 54:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, I gotta say, Akron's strong. That means a lot that Akron is one of our best selling cities on this tour. So we're looking at you, Madison. We're looking at you, Chicago, coming out and see us. I know we're at the Auditorium Theater in Chicago. Where are we in Madison?

• 54:44Josh Clark?

  The Orpheum.

• 54:46Speaker 03

  The Orpheum. So two great theaters. We're gonna have a good time. It's a fun topic. Get to do some audience Q and A. Gonna share some laughs. You get to be in a big room with a bunch of cool, like-minded, smart people.

• 54:57Josh Clark?

  Yes. We're reasonably sure that you will like having gone.

• 55:02Speaker 03

  That's right. And I think early showtimes, I think these are both seven o'clockers.

• 55:05Josh Clark?

  Oh, yay.

• 55:06Speaker 03

  Like responsible aging Gen Xers.

• 55:08Josh Clark?

  Yes.

• 55:09Speaker 03

  We want to get everybody home in a decent hour.

• 55:10Josh Clark?

  Yes, we do. Before your babysitter can even get in the fridge, you're gonna be home.

• 55:15Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 55:16Josh Clark?

  Great. Well, if you want more info or tickets to come see us, we'd love it if you did. You can go to stuffyoushouldknow.com and click on the tour button and that will bring up all the info you need. And you can buy tickets through there, like I said. And I guess in the meantime, you can also send us email. Send it off to [email protected].

• 55:39Speaker 00

  Stuff You Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts, iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

• 55:54Josh Clark?

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• 56:36Josh Clark?

  Hosted by Andrew Stratton, these perspectives highlight that life is more than a moment, a condition, or a tough day. Living with a rare disease can be challenging, but it does not define the Voices of Vivgard. In these episodes, they share their stories, from diagnosis to working with their care team on their treatment plan. Listen to Voices of Vivgard on the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's play a quick game. When I say Carnival Cruise, what comes to mind? Maybe a buffet, maybe a lively Lido deck, or maybe you've already decided cruising isn't for you. But we can assure you a Carnival Cruise isn't what you think. From casual bites to five-star dining, laugh-out-loud comedy, a relaxing spa, and unforgettable shore excursions, Carnival has everything you want in a vacation.

• 57:21Josh Clark?

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