#694 - Kings of Leon’s Caleb Followill

Caleb Followill is a musician and songwriter known for fronting the band Kings of Leon. Their new album “O My Beloved” is out now everywhere. Caleb Followill joins Theo to talk about going from a preacher’s kid to a rock star, the turmoil that comes with sudden fame, and the brotherhood that held Kings of Leon together. Caleb Followill: https://www.instagram.com/kingsofleon/ ------------------------------------------------- Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner @CelsiusOfficial https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ Better Help: This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Sign up and get 10% off BetterHelp at http://BetterHelp.com/Theo How to Rob a Bank — Only in Theaters November 13. Get your tickets now! Ethos: Get a free quote for life insurance today through Ethos at http://ethos.com/weekend ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn Bishop Gunn - Shine ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: [email protected] Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Mail stuff to: ATTN: TPW PO BOX 40137 Nashville TN 37204 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend X: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Trevyn https://www.instagram.com/trevyn.s/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Andrew https://www.instagram.com/bleachmediaofficial/ Producer: Halston https://www.instagram.com/halstonrays/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:30Theo Von?

  He's a musician and a songwriter. He's a front man for the band Kings of Leon, who have a new album, Oh My Beloved, which comes out this Friday, November 6th. He's had a wild life and I'm thankful to sit down today with Mr. Caleb Falwell.

• 1:05Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's just so bizarre. I saw this fricking, what was this thing I saw? See if you can find this, Trevin. I saw them wash drone washing a pet. There's like, I guess, a pet service now. Pressure washing. Via drone. There you go. Yeah, Chinese company uses solar cleaning drone to wash dog.

• 1:24Speaker 02

  Wow. I mean, I guess I don't have a dog, but I think it's kind of hard to get them to get in the bath and stuff, right? So you just sneak up on them with this guy?

• 1:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, I think you just call them and they come by in the morning or whatever, when your dog's not expecting it. I guess it gives it.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  We've got a couple of cousins that could use one of those things, bro.

• 1:44Theo Von?

  Amen, bro. That's the truth, dude. Caleb Falwell?

• 1:49Speaker 02

  Yes, sir.

• 1:49Theo Von?

  Nice. Nice to see you today, man.

• 1:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, man. Nice to be here. Nice to meet you.

• 1:53Theo Von?

  Yeah, thanks for catching up, dude. We both ended up wearing this.

• 1:56Speaker 02

  I know, man. We felt it. It was a denim kind of day, right?

• 2:00Theo Von?

  I think it was. I think just everything feels so denim right now.

• 2:04Speaker 02

  Like Ernest P. World.

• 2:07Theo Von?

  Yeah, I don't know if it's that time of year. I mean, it's definitely been a beautiful time of year. This is like one of the nicest times of year in Nashville that I've ever seen with the leaves, you know?

• 2:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, I love this time of year.

• 2:16Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 2:17Speaker 02

  Like when the sun's hitting them just right, I feel like they pop and you get the yellows and the reds and yeah, it's pretty beautiful stuff. And you're from, you're Louisiana, right?

• 2:26Theo Von?

  Yeah, I'm from Louisiana, man. And did you guys, you grew up in Oklahoma?

• 2:31Speaker 02

  Well, kind of, yeah. I'm from, born in Memphis, so.

• 2:36Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:37Speaker 02

  The first few years, we lived in Millington, Tennessee.

• 2:40Theo Von?

  Is that outside of Memphis?

• 2:41Speaker 02

  Yep, just outside home of Al Green and Justin Timberlake.

• 2:47Theo Von?

  Nice combo.

• 2:48Speaker 02

  There you go.

• 2:48Theo Von?

  Yeah, we used to get dropped off over there by Howard Johnson's over there in Memphis.

• 2:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:53Theo Von?

  Yeah, there would be like a familial exchange or something, you know, a lot of kids, they, you know, they meet up with some family member and they drop them off in a parking lot and we'd always be at that Hojo over there.

• 3:03Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm. Yeah, I grew up, first handful of years there, but our dad was an evangelist, so we traveled. So we went, you know, back and forth Oklahoma, but we spent a good deal in Louisiana, too. And I just remember in Louisiana, my cousins from Louisiana, they're from Luling. You know Luling?

• 3:24Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, it's over kind of, I think it's over by Hanville, maybe, or by.

• 3:27Speaker 02

  St. Charles Parish, yes.

• 3:28Theo Von?

  On the west bank.

• 3:29Speaker 02

  And I just remember we'd be there and then it would be like fall or winter and he'd always be bummed because the weather wouldn't really change. I remember he woke me up one morning. He's like, come outside, come outside. And we went outside and there was just like a little bit of frost on the ground. And he was like, let's go make a snowman.

• 3:47Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, dude. Look, if you leave the freezer open for too long, somebody will try to make a little Christmas scenario in there, you know? You walk through the frozen food section, you'll start playing Christmas carols on your phone.

• 3:58Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:59Theo Von?

  You know, it's just, you're looking, you're hoping for any moment of winter because there's nothing, it's just, you don't get any of it down there. And dude, yeah, you get down towards Luling, you'll have people have family members that are bait.

• 4:12Theo Von?

  It's like, you'll have like.

• 4:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, man, that was, that was always like such a unique place to me because, you know, America has like all these different, depending on where you are, you know, people have different accents and different ways of life. But Louisiana is like a one of one.

• 4:28Theo Von?

  Really is, man.

• 4:29Speaker 02

  It's like everyone you talk to, and I got down with the lingo by the end of it, but like first time you, you know, you arrive and people start talking, you're just like, I don't think I know what. It's not like a southern country accent. It's like so different, yeah.

• 4:45Theo Von?

  Oh, yes. Sometimes the people, they don't even know the alphabet.

• 4:50Theo Von?

  And they're just hoping for the best, you know, they're just kind of verbally hoping you know what they're doing, you know? It's kind of, it's a lot of pressure on the listener.

• 4:59Speaker 02

  It is, yeah.

• 5:00Theo Von?

  That's what we kind of say about Louisiana. That's the dialect down there. It is big pressure on the listener, man.

• 5:05Speaker 02

  You gotta lean in.

• 5:06Theo Von?

  Yeah, yeah. You gotta be right there with, sometimes you have to hold people's hands while they're talking. You know what I'm saying? Dude, I've had to rub somebody's back to help them get through a sentence. You know what I'm saying? You see a dude hit a semicolon and he fucking, his skeleton can't handle it, you know? But I mean, it is just, it is that kind of place, you know, you'll be like, oh, caught my wife on a spinner bait or whatever. It's just, it's bizarre. It really is bizarre, dude. And it's like, and sorry to get animated about it. I guess I don't think about it that much. But it is a unique place, man.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 5:37Theo Von?

  First, I didn't know, I didn't, I don't think I had really as much appreciation for it growing up. But then as I got older and traveled around, I'm like, oh damn, there's something. And it's soggy. I mean, you'll be talking to somebody and they'll just be sinking right in front of you.

• 5:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, man, I used to go.

• 5:51Theo Von?

  You have to lift them up every now and then and set them like a foot over to get through the convo.

• 5:56Speaker 02

  We used to go spend like, I would go spend summers in Louisiana. As a kid, you know, it was my cousin, he was my best friend, so we'd just go raise hell and

• 6:08Speaker 02

  kind of run around and get chased by cops and stuff. We were little kids, so we'd sneak out at night after our.

• 6:14Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 6:15Speaker 02

  After his parents were asleep and we'd just like go break into the swimming pool and like, you know, just dive off of stuff and

• 6:22Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 6:23Speaker 02

  get in the snack machines and, and I remember there was this one night and we were, you know, we were out and it was about two in the morning. And I don't know what we were looking for. I think we're just in trouble.

• 6:33Theo Von?

  Probably cool air, too, you know? I mean, it's summer, it's so rough. Go on, sorry?

• 6:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, no. And then the cops, we saw lights. And so the next thing you know, we're kind of like in a drainage ditch. Like, and it was kind of like, I was only like 12, but for a moment I was like, I think I need to make some changes, you know? This probably ain't the right thing to be doing. But then later on, I, like, we got odd jobs, like roofing houses and Thibodeau and.

• 6:58Theo Von?

  Oh, bruh.

• 7:00Speaker 02

  Little in New Orleans and.

• 7:01Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude, everything down there, it's flooring, bruh. They'll put flooring on your ceiling. They don't give a damn, bruh. People, they'll put linoleum around a baby, bruh. They don't even care down there. Like, everybody in Louisiana, I feel like, ends up doing roofing or flooring at some point, bro.

• 7:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, and they, there was always like a flood, like every year. I'd come, they'd have a different color carpet. And then the next time, then finally they just went straight concrete. They're like, we're done, we're done.

• 7:29Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 7:29Speaker 02

  So then it'd get humid and you'd be slipping all around the living room.

• 7:32Theo Von?

  That's the devil's carpet, dude. And you know, yeah, that is so Louisiana when you finally just give in and be like, all right, we're doing.

• 7:40Speaker 02

  We're a concrete family.

• 7:43Theo Von?

  Family, dude.

• 7:45Theo Von?

  Bro, so funny that like, you know, you're talking about a place that's so flooded, you know, that's like so flood centric. And your family had really kind of a religious upbringing. You said your dad was an evangelist.

• 7:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, so he was a preacher, but we just traveled and preached from town to town.

• 8:01Theo Von?

  So like a traveling evangelist?

• 8:03Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 8:03Theo Von?

  And was he good at it?

• 8:05Speaker 02

  Oh, man, he was, he was the best, yeah. As a, you know, as a little kid, I, he was like a, I mean, people throw it around a lot, but he was a rock star, you know? He would, he would see the biggest, scariest looking man in the room and he would have him laughing. And then five seconds later, the man would be crying. He was kind of a comedian. I mean, he was, he was really funny. But he was also, you know, a man who had been through a lot, so he could relate to people.

• 8:38Theo Von?

  I see.

• 8:39Speaker 02

  So whereas a lot of people, you know, they kind of have their nose in the air, my dad was a man of the people. And I feel like that was something that kind of. You know, when we would roll into a town and uh take over the church for a weekend or a week or something, by the end of it, you know, I felt like everybody wanted us to stay and kind of wanted, you know, us to take over.

• 9:02Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 9:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:03Theo Von?

  That's almost like a rock star energy in its own right, huh?

• 9:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, he was.

• 9:07Theo Von?

  Like you're rolling in like that.

• 9:09Speaker 02

  That was it, man. We lived out of the car. We uh, most of my childhood, we didn't really have a house. We, everything was in the trunk and we were just, yeah, man, looking out the windows, looking at the, you know, America, just driving and go to towns and.

• 9:25Theo Von?

  Dude, that's so cool.

• 9:26Speaker 02

  Make friends, but then after a while you started to kind of, it break your heart, cause you, you wouldn't see him again. So.

• 9:35Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 9:35Speaker 02

  It kind of started, you started to kind of pull away a little bit, but it was good, cause I was with my brothers. So um, we always had each other. Um, but yeah, like seeing a normal childhood and boyfriend and girlfriend and high school and all that stuff was so foreign to us because you know, that wasn't our life. It was on the road and oddly enough, we ended up choosing a career path that kind of kept us on the road.

• 10:06Theo Von?

  So like whenever you guys would pull into town, like did you, did the kids have like a responsibility? Did you and your siblings have a responsibility to like?

• 10:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:13Theo Von?

  You know, to help build the atmosphere or like what was, like, kind of if you can just explain that to me a little?

• 10:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, when we would come to town, it was a revival. So when we came to town, it was usually the church needed a spark.

• 10:25Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 10:25Speaker 02

  You know, things had got a little stagnant.

• 10:27Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 10:28Speaker 02

  And so we would roll in and kind of fire everyone up and then we'd leave and hopefully it would keep going. Um, but us, I think, you know, we were boys, it was three boys. So like, they just didn't want us to get in trouble. You know, and to kind of be a good example to the other kids, but you know, we weren't really the best example. I don't think.

• 10:52Theo Von?

  Your adolescence too.

• 10:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, we just wanted to play sport, like whatever, if they had a basketball court at the church, it was like, all right, sweet, we can go play some basketball, we can go whoop up on some kids.

• 11:03Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 11:04Speaker 02

  Um, we had that, we had our brothers, so we had kind of like a built in team. Um, but yeah, we didn't really, we weren't that involved in the church, but we did, that is where we started singing.

• 11:16Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 11:16Speaker 02

  Um, and we didn't want to do it very often. Every now and then they would, they would talk us into getting up. Um, and we'd play the drums, uh, we'd, we would help along, you know, with the music.

• 11:29Theo Von?

  So kind of almost whatever was needed, like if dad needs you to do something?

• 11:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, you know, if we need to go pass the plate around or uh, you know, be the first one to go down to the altar and be a good, you know, get people feeling comfortable to go do it, we'd do that.

• 11:42Theo Von?

  Amen, dude.

• 11:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:44Theo Von?

  Dude, it reminds me, bro, this is so funny, man. One of my favorite movies of all time, I don't ever even talk about. It's Leap of Faith. You ever see that movie?

• 11:50Speaker 02

  Is that Steve Martin?

• 11:51Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 11:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 11:53Theo Von?

  Dude, I love that movie. Growing up, we had one of those like, I think it was like, yeah, there it is right there. It was like a random house, one of those things where you mail them $2 and they send you six movies or whatever.

• 12:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:06Theo Von?

  And then they sue you for the rest of your life or whatever, for not paying them or whatever.

• 12:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:10Theo Von?

  Or then they like track you down for years or whatever, because you have a copy of Curly Sue out or something that you owe them?

• 12:16Speaker 02

  Oh man, back to Louisiana, we, me and my cousin, one night we snuck out and we went to the video store and we wanted to rent like some dirty movies. I mean, not dirty, R rated movies.

• 12:27Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 12:27Speaker 02

  I remember we got this one Jean Claude Van Damme movie, I think it was called like Double Trouble or Double Team or something. He played twins.

• 12:35Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 12:35Speaker 02

  But it had a, it had a couple of scenes that we liked. Um, and we didn't realize, you know, we had rented it on my uncle's thing, but we just left it at that house. We didn't want to get busted.

• 12:48Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 12:48Speaker 02

  And then it was years later that he got the bill and he's like, what is that?

• 12:53Theo Von?

  Yeah. They're like, you owe $11,000.

• 12:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, but that Leap of Faith, that was a, that looked like a tent revival, right?

• 13:00Theo Von?

  Yeah, that was Steve Martin. It was a tent revival. Bring it up just to, for a little bit of uh, something, just to be accurate here. Yeah, this was, man, this movie dude, he would pull in and they had this soundtrack with it and it was like, are you ready for a miracle?

• 13:14Speaker 02

  Ready as I can be.

• 13:16Theo Von?

  Remember that?

• 13:16Speaker 02

  I know that one, yeah.

• 13:17Theo Von?

  Are you ready for a miracle? Let the spirit set you free.

• 13:21Speaker 02

  That's awesome.

• 13:23Theo Von?

  We had three movies, I think, and I watch this probably 400 times, bro. Uh, a 1992 American comedy drama film, uh, what does it say? Uh, slick talking, traveling evangelist Jonas Nightingale runs a high-tech revival scam using hidden microphone spotters and computerized databases to fleece small town congregations.

• 13:43Speaker 02

  That's kind of like Fletch, right? Fletch too, isn't he like fake like he's a preacher and they got like some?

• 13:49Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 13:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. Did you ever see The Apostle?

• 13:52Theo Von?

  Uh-uh.

• 13:52Speaker 02

  Oh man, that's a good one. It was Robert Duvall. Um, that's a good one.

• 13:59Theo Von?

  The Apostle?

• 13:59Speaker 02

  But it's kind of similar thing.

• 14:01Theo Von?

  I'll put that on my list. I like Robert Duvall. He's in Crazy Heart. Have you seen that?

• 14:05Speaker 02

  Oh yeah. The Apostle is his best. I think it's his best work, but yeah, Crazy Heart's awesome.

• 14:10Theo Von?

  Dude, yeah, that weary kind, that song.

• 14:12Speaker 02

  Oh man, yeah.

• 14:14Theo Von?

  If you want to cry in a parking lot.

• 14:16Speaker 02

  I do.

• 14:17Theo Von?

  Then yeah, then yeah, dude, put that on and just pull behind the Aldi, dude.

• 14:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, let's do it.

• 14:24Theo Von?

  Dude, you could park behind any Kroger and put that on. There'll be four other dudes listening to it back there.

• 14:31Theo Von?

  Oh yeah, dude, that's a real, that's a song right there, man. I love that. Ryan Bingham, no, who's?

• 14:37Speaker 02

  Bingham, yeah.

• 14:38Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 14:39Speaker 02

  Is that right?

• 14:39Theo Von?

  And he was in the uh, in the movie too, I think.

• 14:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's the, I think he's his backing band, right? He's the leader of the backing band when he rolls up to the bowling alley.

• 14:48Theo Von?

  Yeah. If you want to know if you're an alcoholic, go listen to this a few times. I think.

• 14:53Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, man, that movie, that'll hit you. I watched it a couple of times when we were on the road and I was pretty beat up. And yeah, it makes you, feels like there's a spotlight on you.

• 15:03Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 15:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:04Theo Von?

  Oh dude, in the end, bro, when he go like, when she shows up and she has the ring on, she met somebody?

• 15:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, I know that part.

• 15:13Theo Von?

  I still feel bad about that. Dude, I feel.

• 15:15Speaker 02

  I feel like they got together after that, right? I don't think that was gonna work. Whatever relationship she was in. Cause they had, look at the way she's looking at him.

• 15:25Theo Von?

  Oh, I know, dude. God, I want that. But dude, and we asked him, we actually got to interview him not too long ago.

• 15:33Speaker 02

  Whoa.

• 15:33Theo Von?

  Yeah, we got to sit down with him and uh, and we asked him, we're like, how is Bad Blake doing, you know? And he's like, I heard, I heard he's doing pretty good.

• 15:42Speaker 02

  Oh, that's good, man.

• 15:43Theo Von?

  So it's just kind of cool to like, just go and like uh, just get it kind of direct from the source.

• 15:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, a lot of times you watch a movie and you, you know, you get to kind of fill out, you color in between like what, what happens afterwards.

• 15:57Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 15:57Speaker 02

  And you hope it plays out the way that you imagine it plays out.

• 16:00Theo Von?

  Yeah, yeah. And the character, they just disappear out into the ether, you know?

• 16:05Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:06Theo Von?

  Unless this person, like I was even asking Jeff Bridges, like, hey, do you ever just Bad Blake around the house and fire him up? Just to give him, you know, a nice afternoon or something, you know, just take him for a walk.

• 16:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm friends with the, with an actor that was in Tron with him, Garrett Hedlund. And I think when they were making that movie, maybe he was preparing for Crazy Heart.

• 16:27Theo Von?

  Oh wow.

• 16:28Speaker 02

  And Garrett likes to play music too. So he would uh, he told me like stories about him playing those songs to him before he had seen the movie.

• 16:38Theo Von?

  Oh, to go get ready kind of?

• 16:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, and he was just always like, man, you gotta hear these songs. These songs are amazing.

• 16:43Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude, that's cool. I don't know if I ever met Garrett or not, but um, yeah, I just feel, it would be so neat to be able to have a character that was so like, kind of revered or beloved that you got to fire him up around every now and then, take him on a bike ride or something.

• 16:59Speaker 02

  I know, it must be weird being an actor and then you, you're, like you have this one role and you're kind of identified as that.

• 17:08Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 17:09Speaker 02

  You know, it's, it's weird, it's always weird if you meet like a celebrity, um, and you think you know them because you've watched them so much. And then you start talking to them like you're talking to the character from the movie and then you realize like, oh man, they're not like that at all. He hates that character.

• 17:28Theo Von?

  Oh dude, yeah. Well, it's kind of funny how as you, like if you have some creative work and you sort of evolve over time, sometimes you start to not appreciate your like early works or sometimes there'll be like a little cringe to you or something about it maybe?

• 17:43Speaker 02

  I think you always are gonna go through a period where you don't like something, but I think you come around. If you survive long enough and have a long enough career, then you can look back on the early days and you know, you admire it a little more and you're not as, you know, embarrassed. But a lot of times when you're embarrassed about the thing that you were, you look back on that time and you're like, oh, that was even more embarrassing. Like the early days were better than that guy.

• 18:12Theo Von?

  Oh yeah. Yeah. Oh, eventually you get to the point where you're like, oh, the second dude was way more embarrassing than the first dude.

• 18:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:19Theo Von?

  That's hilarious. Um, let's go back a little bit to like the Pentecostal, like just to that traveling, like what, um, cause I grew up in an area, there was a lot of Pentecostals down, like down out, out in the country and stuff like that and um, and I always thought that the way that they try and communicate, like with their higher power and with God and like, I, I always really kind of admired it in a weird way, um, because some of it was super unique, I felt like.

• 18:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:47Theo Von?

  Um, what did you see? Like what is a typical or even an atypical kind of Pentecostal service like?

• 18:54Speaker 02

  Oh, man, it's been a while, but it was, it was exciting, you know, we, I had, I went and visited some friends, like there, one of my friends was a Church of Christ, and I went to his church and they had no music. And I was just like, everyone was falling asleep, and I was like, and our, the way that we kinda did it, you know, you go in and music is kinda throughout, you know, it kinda sets the tone, and you can, uh, you can kinda dictate what the night is gonna be. It's like, alright, we need some, something lively, so Nathan, my older brother, or me, would get on the drums, and, um, you know, kinda wake everybody

• 19:36Speaker 02

  up. But it was a lot of music, a lot of, uh, when my dad preached, he was mindful, you know, he wasn't one of those guys that got up and was long-winded, he was kinda, he had his hits, you know?

• 19:47Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 19:48Speaker 02

  We could, you know, we could sit there and kinda quote some of the stuff, we knew what was coming, and we'd be telling the kid, like, watch, he's about to say this, or watch, he's about to say this verse.

• 19:56Theo Von?

  Yeah, look out for the magic.

• 19:58Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 19:59Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 20:00Speaker 02

  Um, but it was, it was exciting, man, it was, uh, it was a good childhood, you know?

• 20:06Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 20:07Speaker 02

  I think a lot of people would look at it and, and feel sorry for us, and think like, oh, man, you didn't have the traditional schooling, and, um, you know, you're always on the move, and, but it was exciting, you know, when you're a little kid, you're not stuck in a classroom, or you're not, um, you know, stressed out about certain things, it was just like, we were always on the roll, you know, always on the go.

• 20:31Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 20:32Speaker 02

  Um, and it was exciting, you know, the services were cool, and we'd be, always go to like a restaurant afterwards, eat a shoney's.

• 20:41Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, dude.

• 20:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, man, that was good.

• 20:43Theo Von?

  Shoney's was freaking crazy, dude, how great it was.

• 20:47Speaker 02

  Oh, man, the floor's always slippery, and staff was always pissed when you'd roll in at ten o'clock.

• 20:54Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 20:55Speaker 02

  Whole church just in there taking over.

• 20:57Theo Von?

  Especially you guys.

• 20:58Speaker 02

  Oh, probably not tipping, you know, now, looking back, I'm sure that nobody probably tipped back then, um, but...

• 21:05Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, especially if you're getting out of a revival, and you guys are out all hyped up.

• 21:09Speaker 02

  Oh, everybody's starving, they've just been running the aisles for two hours.

• 21:12Theo Von?

  Yeah, and when you're praying at a high level intensity, dude, the calories you're burning?

• 21:16Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, you gotta carb up for that, yeah.

• 21:18Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, dude, oh, carbs for Christ, dude, some of that won't even measure on a whoop bracelet, bro, some of this praying, that should definitely, I wonder how many calories is praying burn, let's look that up.

• 21:30Speaker 02

  (laughing)

• 21:31Theo Von?

  If you don't mind, how many calories is praying burn?

• 21:35Speaker 02

  They don't even want you to know.

• 21:37Theo Von?

  I know.

• 21:38Speaker 02

  They're like, we don't wanna give you any ideas.

• 21:40Theo Von?

  Praying, uh, burns about fifteen, eighteen calories per session, or roughly eighty to ninety calories per day if you perform all five daily prayers, so that's asking a lot of people, but...

• 21:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, how long are these prayers?

• 21:54Theo Von?

  Yeah, um, about fifteen, eighteen calories per session, yeah, what specifically is that, let me see, uh, that must be like, um, it could be a Muslim prayer, oh, it's Islamic prayer of Salaah.

• 22:06Speaker 02

  Right.

• 22:07Theo Von?

  But I would say fifteen, eighteen calories per session probably seems like that would be the answer, I guess, that's not bad.

• 22:12Speaker 02

  Pretty good.

• 22:13Theo Von?

  Yeah, if you pray six times in a day, you could have like a...

• 22:16Speaker 02

  You could be like a personal trainer slash preacher, just get people to pray and then burn some calories, make a little money.

• 22:23Theo Von?

  Oh, dude, yeah, that could be the next thing, it's kind of like a, like an evangel, like a traveling evangelist, but with, um, kind of a ropes course at the end.

• 22:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:32Theo Von?

  (laughing) Wouldn't be bad.

• 22:33Speaker 03

  This holiday, all plans, even unlimited, are just fifteen dollars a month. A holiday deal this good obviously deserves an enormously expensive holiday song, like, All I Want (bleep). Right, okay, we can't afford that. You know what, forget the music budget, we're gonna stick with whatever's in the public domain. Give it a try at mintmobile.com/switch.

• 22:52Speaker 04

  Upfront payment of forty-five dollars for three months, ninety dollars for six months, or one hundred and eighty dollars for twelve-month plan required, fifteen dollars per month equivalent, taxes and fees extra. New customer offer for initial plan term only, greater than fifty gigabytes may slow when network is busy, see terms.

• 23:03Theo Von?

  I've been thinking recently about life insurance, oh, yeah, you know, just 'cause I'm growing up, and, you know, if something were to happen to me, I wanna, I want my family to just, to be okay, you know, I want them to have some more support. You know, we often think about life insurance after losing somebody that we love, but it's also something to consider after new life events, like becoming a parent, or, or buying a home. I had a buddy who was in a, uh, in a car accident, and right after that, he actually, he actually asked his wife to get him a, uh, life insurance policy for Christmas, which is kinda crazy, I, you know, I've seen a lot of Dateline and stuff, I don't, I don't

• 23:46Theo Von?

  know who you put on the policy, but, you know, it's on people's minds. Ethos has it on their mind as well. Ethos makes getting life insurance fast and easy, and it's a hundred percent online. You can get a quote in seconds, apply in minutes, and get same-day coverage. There's no medical exam, you just answer a few simple health questions. You can get up to three million dollars in coverage, some policies are as low as thirty dollars a month. Take ten minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote

• 24:22Theo Von?

  at ethos.com/weekend. That is E-T-H-O-S dot com slash weekend. Application times may vary, rates may vary. I'd like you to imagine robbing a bank, and deciding the smartest thing you could do afterwards is post about it online. I mean, that would be crazy, right? But, from MGM Studios comes, How to Rob a Bank. A crew of social media savvy bank robbers broadcasts their daring heists. Their growing viral fame puts them in the crosshairs of a veteran FBI agent and a brilliant software engineer. As the authorities close in, the crew pushes

• 25:06Theo Von?

  its limits for its most ambitious heist yet. I mean, a crew of bank robbers posting their wins for the world to see is insane, but that's where we are, ambitious criminals with an influencer strategy, I mean, that's something to watch. Get your payback. Amazon MGM Studios' How to Rob a Bank, only in theaters November thirteenth. Get your tickets now. I always thought it was interesting about Pentecostals, because a lot of times you would see they would speak in tongues, right, they would kind of, or it's called, um, what is the exact word it is?

• 25:43Speaker 02

  Uh, hal-

• 25:44Theo Von?

  Hal-

• 25:45Speaker 02

  Is there?

• 25:46Theo Von?

  Oh, glasolalia, glasolalia.

• 25:49Speaker 02

  That's the first time I've ever heard that.

• 25:51Theo Von?

  Glasolalia, the fluid vocalization of speech-like syllables, rhythms, and sounds that lack a comprehensible meaning or known grammatical structure, and is often practiced during ecstatic or charismatic religious experiences. Um, 'cause I've found sometimes that it's hard to, it's hard to get the sounds out of yourself, that like, you know, if you wanna really just let yourself loose, sometimes it's hard to just get it out of you.

• 26:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, um...

• 26:17Theo Von?

  And it seemed like that was like a, a branch of a religion where they kinda, they let that happen.

• 26:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:22Theo Von?

  And when they would lay hands on people, or when they would pray over people, I always felt that, to, to me, it seems very powerful.

• 26:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 26:28Theo Von?

  'Cause it's like, there were more physical acts during some of those services, and I feel like that is a good thing a lot of times.

• 26:35Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, I've seen some, I've seen some, uh, some crazy experiences.

• 26:40Theo Von?

  Have you?

• 26:41Speaker 02

  'Cause there were other people that would, you know, that were evangelists, I guess you'd say, and that was more of their thing, kinda laying hands on people, and, you know, I've seen healings, and, you know, seen people walk that-

• 26:55Theo Von?

  Really?

• 26:56Speaker 02

  -weren't walking.

• 26:57Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 26:58Speaker 02

  We had this woman that went to her church, and, uh, she was like, had cancer real bad, like, you, you look at her, she was, you know, her skin, she was gray, um, and, yeah, she, she didn't have long, and, and my dad, uh, prayed for her, and she's, I think she's still alive.

• 27:18Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 27:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, so...

• 27:20Theo Von?

  So you've witnessed miracles out there?

• 27:21Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 27:22Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 27:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's definitely power in, you know, in prayer.

• 27:25Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, just to be thinking of somebody else, it really is, it's almost like, um, it feels like a superpower sometimes.

• 27:31Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 27:32Theo Von?

  To sit there and be like, hey, let me channel whatever energy I have today.

• 27:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, man, I, I think, you know, we are capable of so much, you know, we have a lot of energy that we can direct towards one another, um, and when you have that focus, and, you know, everyone's kinda dialed into the one thing, and, yeah, I've, I've seen some, some pretty cool stuff.

• 27:58Theo Von?

  Was there one area of the country that was like, uh, that was more prevalent for revivals? Was there one part of the country where it just really felt like, uh?

• 28:06Speaker 02

  Um, I, I think it happens everywhere. I mean, our, our kind of area was in the south mainly. Um, and the south, you know, they get down.

• 28:16Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 28:16Speaker 02

  So, yeah, it was, and then we'd get to like Oklahoma and that has more of like a midwestern feel. So they were not quite as rambunctious as the southerners, you know?

• 28:30Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 28:30Speaker 02

  Um, but yeah, you know, we would do like tent revivals, like, like, uh, that thing that, um, that movie. And those were always exciting and those happened in the south mainly because, you know, everywhere else, um, didn't have the kind of weather for it. But I remember we did have this one tent revival and I forget where we were. I think we must've been in the south, but there was a cold spell that kind of come through. And I remember when my dad finished, it was like James Brown or something. Cause he would like get, he'd be so wet and you just want to like put a, his jacket over him or something. Um, but I remember he came to the, like afterwards, he walked to the car and his hair was ice. It was like frozen because he had sweat and then it just like froze solid.

• 29:16Speaker 02

  Uh, it was wild. But yeah, I think the south probably, I mean, like I say, that was our, that's where we went. So I know it, I know it was big there, but we weren't like, um, you know, then you get to like the mountains and that's where you get like the snakes and stuff. That wasn't us.

• 29:34Theo Von?

  That wasn't y'all?

• 29:35Speaker 02

  No, no, we didn't.

• 29:36Theo Von?

  Yeah. It's when the evangelism meets like kind of zookeepers or?

• 29:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was a little, that was a little much, you know?

• 29:43Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 29:43Speaker 02

  I mean, I'm not saying that you, you know, whatever you, I'm not here to judge, but I don't think we gotta bring snakes into it, you know?

• 29:51Theo Von?

  I don't.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  I think we, there's an easier way to get to God, you know?

• 29:57Theo Von?

  Oh, I sit in the snake free section, bro.

• 29:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, no crap.

• 30:00Theo Von?

  That is it, dude. I sit in the snake free section. Snake handling, also called serpent handling, um, a religious rite observed in a small number of isolated churches, mostly in the United States, characterized as rural and part of the holiness movement. The practice began in the early 20th century in Appalachia and plays only a small part in the church service. There you go. Early Christianity in the second century, the Ophites reportedly handled snakes during their services. Um, and also worshiped the serpent. The practice of snake handling first appeared in American Christianity around 1910.

• 30:33Speaker 02

  That says Tennessee.

• 30:34Theo Von?

  Yeah. Wow.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  So maybe we did invent it.

• 30:37Theo Von?

  Lot going on around here.

• 30:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:40Theo Von?

  Um, and I know from your documentary that you guys grew up in poorer conditions. Um, was there, was there a lot of money to be made in evangelism?

• 30:51Speaker 02

  No. Yeah, we didn't have any money. Um, we were just, you know, I guess you'd say paycheck to paycheck, but it was town, where some towns you get to, they don't even have any money. So you're just kind of, you know, you're doing your thing and it's kind of like you get us back or whatever. I remember we preached at this one church and they gave us, uh, tickets to Disney world.

• 31:12Theo Von?

  No way.

• 31:14Speaker 02

  And so my family didn't get much, my parents didn't get much out of it, but we got to go to Disney world.

• 31:18Theo Von?

  You're right.

• 31:19Speaker 02

  Man, that was the good one right there. Um, but yeah, we were, yeah, we didn't have a lot, but we didn't realize that we didn't have a lot.

• 31:28Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 31:29Speaker 02

  You know, and I know it's kind of cliche, but we had a lot of love and we had each other, you know? It, it wasn't a thing where, um, and we didn't have TV and stuff, you know, we were.

• 31:42Theo Von?

  Right. So you weren't always getting this reflection of the world of what you were missing.

• 31:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, we didn't know. We didn't know what we didn't know, you know?

• 31:49Theo Von?

  That's a good point, man. Cause I think I grew up with a lot of resentment about like not having much.

• 31:53Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 31:54Theo Von?

  You know, but I think also it was because there wasn't much communication, like, hey, we don't have much, but like we're good people.

• 32:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:01Theo Von?

  And that, you know, that doesn't define us and we are a family and that, you know, we're working together. Like, I think if somebody had sat down for two minutes with me and just told me those things, then I'd have had a better idea, you know? Um, so I think some of that in my own world was like communication probably.

• 32:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I feel like the more, and you see it now, I mean, I feel like the more you have kind of, it doesn't bring happiness, you know? I feel like we were really happy and we would just laugh all the time.

• 32:33Theo Von?

  Oh, dude.

• 32:33Speaker 02

  And whenever you're poor, but you can laugh at it, it's not like you're poor.

• 32:38Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 32:39Speaker 02

  It's just kind of like you're in on the joke, you're the joke and you're in on it. It's kind of like, oh, you know, you're always making jokes about how bad it is, you know?

• 32:47Theo Von?

  Definitely dude, there was nothing more fun. I was actually texting with my buddies Larry and Eddie today from, uh, the street I grew up on. There was nothing more fun, dude, than making fun of each other out in the street, dude.

• 32:57Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 32:58Theo Von?

  I mean, it was just, dude, it was the best, bro.

• 33:02Speaker 02

  I feel like those rich kids couldn't, they can't take it, you know? Like when you're poor, you can say anything and it's like, yeah, I know, you know, I know.

• 33:11Theo Von?

  You have nothing to lose, dude. One thing that my mom always said that I appreciated was, she said, uh, the best thing about being poor is you have nothing to lose.

• 33:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's true.

• 33:21Theo Von?

  Say what you want, you do what you want, sue me. What are you gonna do?

• 33:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:25Theo Von?

  They got nothing to take from you.

• 33:26Speaker 02

  Take it.

• 33:27Theo Von?

  Yeah, take it.

• 33:28Speaker 02

  I ain't got nothing.

• 33:29Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's nothing. It's nothing, dude. And I think some of the freedom sometimes, even though like I, I think it was like a lot of like, probably discomfort and maybe disconnection, like that was kind of in the culture of like, like our mom would always work and stuff like that. So we would kind of be left to our own devices. But then when I look back on it, it was like, I knew how to sew, I knew how to do laundry. I knew how to do all these things at five years old that were six years old that were, you know, things that other kids still would, just didn't have a, an idea. I eventually knew how to re-sew a shoe. There was like just little things I would learn, just how to take care of myself, right? And then my dad would always be like, you're gonna, you're a survivor. It's the only thing he ever said to me, right? I mean, I kind of wish he'd have said some other stuff, but it was like, but that's truly the thing I probably needed to hear, you know?

• 34:13Theo Von?

  Um, I don't know. I, I don't really know what I'm talking about. I guess I'm just thinking about like, yeah, I don't know. Just, just yesterday I was thinking like, man, those are some of the coolest times ever, really.

• 34:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's, you know, it shapes you and now I'll tell stories to my kids. And if, you know, you feel like those stories that your parents told you about going to school uphill, both ways and snow and all that kind of stuff. Um, but yeah, you know, it, I feel like it gave us thick skin, uh, put a drive in us and a hunger. Um, and it's never, it was never really for success. It was just kind of to prove our worth, you know? That was all, that's always been something, and even now in the music industry and, you know, there's always a little bit of a chip on your shoulder from your childhood of kind of walking in a room

• 35:07Speaker 02

  and feeling like you don't belong in there, but you're like, by the time I leave this room, they're gonna know who I am.

• 35:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 35:13Speaker 02

  You know? And so I feel like kind of growing up that way, you know, it, it instills that in you and it makes you, uh, and I hope that my kids have that, but they're not gonna, I don't think so. They got it way too good.

• 35:28Theo Von?

  Dude, it's funny you say, uh?

• 35:30Speaker 02

  My son is seven and he still can't sew a shoe.

• 35:32Theo Von?

  Can he? God dang dude.

• 35:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, humiliating.

• 35:36Theo Von?

  Dude, I can get him a ferrier course online. You can start by just learning how to hoof a horse.

• 35:40Speaker 02

  There you go.

• 35:41Theo Von?

  It's like, and then you advance into just human, uh, hoofery, I guess, if you will, but, um, dude, I've never heard it said like that, that, uh, if you didn't grow up with a lot, then you felt like you had to prove your worth. Like,

• 35:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:55Theo Von?

  I don't know if there's anything better in some ways, if it's not like, if it doesn't get into a negative space for you, then feeling like you have to prove your worth, you know?

• 36:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think you always, you know, that's the one thing, the older I get, that I realize that you want respect, you know? You want to be respected for what you do or for who you are. My mom used to always tell me, she's like, you know, once you, once people lose respect for you, you can't get it back. She's like, so always, you know, make sure that people respect you. Um, I feel like that's the same kind of thing as like that proving your worth. Um, yeah, you know, I mean, when you're the poor guy, uh, and you see the pretty girl, and then there's the rich dude over there.

• 36:43Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 36:44Speaker 02

  You're like, how am I gonna get her to look at me, you know, with this guy over here?

• 36:49Theo Von?

  Yeah, with the washed hair.

• 36:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. The guy with shoes over here.

• 36:53Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude, my buddy had fricking washed hair, dude, and he still does.

• 36:57Speaker 02

  Yeah. God, probably blow dries it too.

• 37:00Theo Von?

  What a show off, dude.

• 37:04Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude.

• 37:04Speaker 02

  It was probably shampoo and he probably had soap separate too. It wasn't just like whatever's there does it all. Mouthwash.

• 37:13Theo Von?

  Oh dude, I'm trying to think of some of the things that were kind of different. I mean, my mom got a car one time and we'd go sleep in that. Because it was just more comfortable in there, you know?

• 37:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, we, I slept in, we slept in our car. That was, you know, we, usually we were rolling down the road. My dad was driving, but man, I think back, I mean, I used to sleep in the back windshield. Seriously, I would sleep on the floorboard with the lump.

• 37:42Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 37:42Speaker 02

  So you kind of either have to like, find a way to curl up on one side of the lump, or you just slept with a lump in your back.

• 37:49Theo Von?

  Yeah, or you gotta be a camel for Halloween again.

• 37:52Speaker 02

  Exactly. But yeah, man, a car, my mom had pictures of me in a tiny little suitcase as an infant in the floorboard between her feet.

• 38:02Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 38:03Speaker 02

  We, we did not play by the rules, I don't think.

• 38:06Theo Von?

  Little to go item of the Lord right there. God. Oh yeah, dude, I remember on the weekends though, I didn't even think about this. I used to ride my bike around and collect aluminum. I'd go get cans everywhere. I'd be out in the woods looking for cans. I found a part of a severed hand in there one time. Yeah, there was something I always wanted to like, I don't know, I was gonna find a way. I think something like that kind of built up. Dude, I remember, dude, I would sneak in my mom, my dude, my mom, bro. And in Louisiana, our apartment was always sinking, bro. So when it was kind of dry season in the carp, because the carpet would get really wet like half the year.

• 38:38Speaker 02

  Oh yeah.

• 38:39Theo Von?

  Because something was wrong.

• 38:40Speaker 02

  That mildew smell.

• 38:41Theo Von?

  Oh God, dude. Oh, you'd be talking to somebody, they'd have just mold spores all over them. You know, you fucking, you'd part your hair and have two reptiles just wiggle on out of it.

• 38:52Speaker 02

  That's kind of stylish.

• 38:53Theo Von?

  Yeah, it was a bit much. Um, but, uh, I remember I'd just elbow crawling in my mom's room, dude. Quiet as shit. And I'd open her little purse thing or whatever. And she'd have four dollars in there and I'd take one of them. I'd take one of them baskets.

• 39:07Speaker 02

  You're taking a quarter of the, of the family's earnings.

• 39:10Theo Von?

  Hey, I knew I was gonna take care of it.

• 39:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:13Theo Von?

  That's why, I don't know what she's gonna do with it.

• 39:14Speaker 02

  He invested it though.

• 39:16Theo Von?

  Oh, I wouldn't go spend it. I just, it's like, hey.

• 39:19Speaker 02

  Just go show it off like, yeah, Mr. Clean Hair.

• 39:25Theo Von?

  Yeah, it was a different time, dude. Um, yeah, sometimes it's interesting to try and think about new things. I'd never thought about that though, that like, if I didn't have much and I had to prove, I had to create myself, I had to prove my worth. I'd never thought about that. So sometimes just the things you hear when you're just kind of talking with somebody, you know? Um, so how do you get from kind of occasionally going up and singing with your family, right? At revivals and stuff like that? How do you go from there to, um, kind of getting into music, becoming sort of, um, uh, Kings of Leon? How do you, I know that's a lot in there.

• 39:59Speaker 02

  No, yeah, it was, uh, I mean, there was, it was a bit of a, a journey of kind of, maybe just trying to find who you are and what, what, what it is that you're gonna do with your life, you know? I think there was a part of me that felt like I was probably gonna follow my dad's footsteps.

• 40:20Theo Von?

  And be a preacher?

• 40:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think so. I mean, that's all we knew. I, I didn't know, it's not like, you know, we had other family members that was doing something that was like, oh, I want to be that, you know? Um, and then we, you know, we, he also painted houses and my uncle's painted houses, so. There for a little bit, we went to Oklahoma. Um, my parents split up. My dad was in Oklahoma and so we went and were painting houses in Oklahoma and I was probably about fifteen, sixteen, something like that. Um, and then just like, too much like, you know, huffing paint and doing all the, just being a painter, you know?

• 41:03Speaker 02

  Always kind of high, always just felt like crap, always.

• 41:06Theo Von?

  You got that matte finish in your eyes.

• 41:08Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, oh yeah. And then it was like one day, um, I kind of hit a wall and I was like, yeah, this ain't, this ain't it. I'm not, there's no future in this. And I actually went, um, in Oklahoma City. And I don't know what I was doing, but I was in like a parking lot and there was like a, an enrollment for like the military.

• 41:32Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 41:32Speaker 02

  And I, I was, you know, think, considering it. I was like, maybe I'll go do something like that. And then I heard a voice, I mean, I, you know, it sounds strange, but I heard a voice that just said, go home. And, and so I, I went back to the house and I told my brother and all of our buddies, I was like, I'm going back to Tennessee. And, um, I think everyone was just kind of like, what, why? What do you have there? Because it was just my mom and my little brother living in Jackson, Tennessee. I was like, I think I'm gonna go try to get into music. Um, I didn't even know what that meant.

• 42:12Theo Von?

  But you felt like a calling towards it kind of?

• 42:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I just felt like I needed to go, you know, that, whatever that was that was talking to me was telling me like, go home. It didn't say why, but it just said, go home. And so when I went back to Jackson, Tennessee, I just, I wanted to find my way into Nashville. Um, and so I would like go to the, we'd go to Kroger or something like that. And when we're checking out, there'd be like magazines, like Country Weekly and stuff like that.

• 42:44Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 42:44Speaker 02

  And I was like, that's Nashville. So I'd thumb through it and I'd go to the back. And it was always like, wanted, the wanted pages, like we want a songwriter, a guitar player, singer. I didn't know how to do any of those. I knew how to sing. Um, but my older brother, Nathan, who was living in Oklahoma, he called me like three days after I got there. And he's like, hey man, I'm coming home. He's like, I'm gonna help you do that music thing.

• 43:08Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 43:08Speaker 02

  And I was like, sweet. And so he got home and we just looked at each other like, so how do we do it? And he just got a pa, a pad and pen and we just started writing little storybook rhymes and little, I love you, do you love me, you know?

• 43:26Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 43:27Speaker 02

  And just like listening to, um, like Otis Redding and Sam Cooke and, um, and then just kind of started doing that. And then eventually we got songs, a couple of songs together that were decent enough to where we could sing them. And we sang a couple to my mom. And she was like, you know what, boys, we're gonna go to Nashville.

• 43:48Theo Von?

  And y'all were in Jackson, Tennessee at the time?

• 43:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, we were in Jackson and her boss at the insurance company where she was the secretary, um, ended up being her husband later on. Uh, yeah.

• 44:01Theo Von?

  That policy, boy, that policy hitting.

• 44:03Speaker 02

  Yeah. But he was, his marriage was over, hers was over. Um, and so we came to Nashville. Um, and we were living like, uh, out in, uh, like Hermitage area, behind the Hooters.

• 44:20Theo Von?

  Oh yeah.

• 44:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was inspiring. Um, but yeah, we just, uh, one day we went out.

• 44:27Theo Von?

  I'd rather be in front of them, I'll tell you that.

• 44:31Speaker 02

  Um, and her, uh, Tom, Tom Murphy's his name, uh, our stepdad. And he had him a little boat. Wasn't nothing, it was just a little bass boat or something. And we went out on the lake. And my mom, we were out there just kind of like floating. And my mom was like, boys, why don't y'all sing him one of y'all's songs? And so he was like, all right, here we go. And we hit, hit him with a little a cappella.

• 44:55Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 44:56Speaker 02

  And instantly he went, hey man, that's good. That's real good. That's how he talked. And he was like, I think that night we went home, because me and Nathan were working at a little restaurant, um, called Tumbleweeds, I believe it was. It was a little, I was a bad waiter. I didn't last long. Um, and he was like, you know, I'm gonna give y'all a little bit of money to where you can quit your job and you can go try to get your foot in the door in Nashville.

• 45:27Theo Von?

  Really? So he believed in you guys some?

• 45:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, so it wasn't much. It was like, you know, a thousand dollars or something like that. And the end of the, by the end of the month, we paid him back. Because we had gone and knocked on every door in Nashville and just like in the movies, everybody slammed the door in your face. I mean, now looking back, we had long hair, they had opened the door and we'd start singing a cappella. They were like, what the hell is this?

• 45:55Theo Von?

  Two of the most busted looking young women I've ever seen.

• 45:58Speaker 02

  Exactly. God, she's got a nice mustache.

• 46:02Speaker 02

  But then there was one, uh, our lawyer.

• 46:06Theo Von?

  That's y'all?

• 46:07Speaker 02

  That's us. Oh, we, that's.

• 46:09Theo Von?

  That's way better than it was, huh?

• 46:10Speaker 02

  We looked good there. Yeah, that was, that was after we had, you know, we had done all right. But, uh, one person didn't close the door on us and, and that kinda started it. And we got a little publishing deal. And started writing songs and trying to get someone to cut a song or something. But then the songs we were writing were, weren't like country songs. And so we didn't have, we didn't know what we were. And so eventually after Nashville, I'd kinda said, yeah, it's not, you know, this isn't for you. Our lawyer was like, let's go to New York. And so we went to New York. And that was a different story, cause we had nine record labels that we met with.

• 46:56Speaker 02

  And we played a couple of songs for them. And we got seven record deal offers.

• 47:00Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 47:01Speaker 02

  So of the nine, seven of them offered us. And so we ended up living in Nashville. They didn't like what we were doing. Went to New York, got a record deal with RCA Records. And then came back to Nashville. And then I remember we were at my mom's house behind the Hooters. And like a limo pulled up, just like Wayne's World. Dude got out with the suit, walked into our garage and we're all stoned, just like, hey. And he's like, yeah, play me some songs. And by that point, we had called our cousin in Mississippi and we're like, come on, man. We got a record deal. You're in the band. And our little brother was a freshman in high school at Mount Juliet.

• 47:42Speaker 02

  And we're like, you wanna be in the band? He's like, yeah. And we're like, alright, we need a bass player.

• 47:47Theo Von?

  And he just dropped out?

• 47:48Speaker 02

  So we had to sit down with my mom and be like, hey, Jared's not going to school tomorrow.

• 47:55Theo Von?

  Did you have to sign him out or not?

• 47:57Speaker 02

  I don't know how it happened, but I know my mom believed in us enough to where she was like, okay, you can drop out of school. I mean, we had dropped out too. We never had, so.

• 48:07Theo Von?

  Was your mom a good judge of character, do you think?

• 48:09Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 48:10Theo Von?

  She was?

• 48:10Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 48:11Theo Von?

  Okay. Cause that's a wild thing for a mom to kinda do that, I feel like. Cause most moms, it would be like, no way. I feel like that would be the, the move, maybe?

• 48:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, she always knew. I mean, from a early age, um, she would always just tell us, like, you're, you're gonna do something great. Like, you guys are special. You're, and that was probably her just being a mom, you know, you just say that, cause you love your kids.

• 48:33Theo Von?

  Right.

• 48:34Speaker 02

  But I think she really did, you know, believe that there was something that we were meant to do.

• 48:40Theo Von?

  And was your cousin a good?

• 48:42Speaker 02

  Guitar player?

• 48:43Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  Uh, well, we had called him up. And we were like, hey, man, we got a record deal. We went to New York. Like, we signed it and everything. They, they, they gave us a stretch limo to the Yankee Stadium. We went to the Yankees game. Like, I'll just, they really did it up. That was back when music industry had money, I guess. Um, but we're like, man, you wanna come be in the band? And he's like, he's like, ah, man, you know, I've been playing my guitar a little. And we said, well, play something. So over the phone, he played, he ripped a Thin Lizzy guitar solo. And we're like, man, that sounds good, dude. You're in the band. Come on. And so we all went to, I remember us going to the, uh, airport and you had the escalator.

• 49:28Speaker 02

  And we just saw some flip flops and some bell bottoms coming down.

• 49:31Theo Von?

  And there he was.

• 49:32Speaker 02

  Him. And he had told his mom, yeah, I'm just going up there for the weekend.

• 49:37Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 49:37Speaker 02

  But he knew he wasn't going back.

• 49:39Theo Von?

  A long weekend.

• 49:41Speaker 02

  So, yeah, so we're in the garage. He's there. Um, we'd been practicing a few songs and the limo rolls up. And this, uh, big wig comes in, sits on the couch that our friend had just got drunk and pissed on like two nights before. So it's probably still damp.

• 49:58Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 49:59Speaker 02

  At least. Um, and he sat there and we ripped like three songs for him. And he stood up and it was like, it was, it was big time. We had made it, so.

• 50:10Theo Von?

  That's crazy, bro.

• 50:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was wild.

• 50:13Theo Von?

  I mean, looking back, do you feel like that's absolutely kind of crazy? It's kinda crazy.

• 50:17Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. It's like, it's like stuff you see in a movie that you're like, oh, they didn't tell the whole story. It's kinda like, they, they glamorized it. But that was it, man. That's how it worked. And instantly, they, we had to go make an EP. Um, cause we were gonna make an album, but we didn't have the songs yet. We were still writing the songs. So we had a few songs, so we were gonna go record them. We went and made the EP. Um, and then we went straight to Memphis. We were gonna go make a record. So while we're in Memphis, we get a call and they're like, hey, we gotta pause the record. And we're like, why?

• 50:56Speaker 02

  They said, because the EP has just hit it big in the UK. And so we're like, what are you talking about? They're like, you guys are big. And we're sitting there like.

• 51:07Theo Von?

  Sounds like a prank show almost.

• 51:09Speaker 02

  I know. I know. It's wild.

• 51:10Theo Von?

  Like, everything you do, it's almost like, and that, and that's great, and.

• 51:13Speaker 02

  Yep. And so then they were like, your boys are going to London. We're like, man, we haven't. They're like, you guys need to go play a couple of concerts. So we went and played a show in, uh, Atlanta at Smith's Old Bar.

• 51:26Theo Von?

  By yourself or opening up for somebody?

• 51:28Speaker 02

  We opened for Billy Joe Schaefer. Um, and a band, we were the first of three. There was a band called The Skeeters. We were, I don't think they're still at it. Maybe, maybe they are. I don't know. But we went and played there and then we went and played The Nick in Birmingham, Alabama. And we walked on stage at The Nick. And there was one man standing in front of us. And there was like a couple of guys playing pool, someone at the bar.

• 51:54Theo Von?

  And who was it? The IRS or whatever?

• 51:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, he was the only guy that was there for the music, you know?

• 51:59Theo Von?

  So they didn't even know, nobody even knew. You guys were just actually practicing?

• 52:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was just like.

• 52:04Theo Von?

  To get you the feel of walking out there?

• 52:05Speaker 02

  We just needed to walk on a stage before we go to the UK and there's actually people there. And so the guy that was in front of us, obviously the first thing he said was Free Bird. And we're like, we ain't there yet, man.

• 52:18Theo Von?

  Yeah, we're not even there yet.

• 52:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, we don't know how to play our songs, let alone Lynyrd Skynyrd's.

• 52:23Theo Von?

  Bro, what the heck?

• 52:25Speaker 02

  And then we, we went and played a few shows and they said, alright, you boys are going to London. We landed in London. Um, on the way to the, uh, hotel, we heard our song. Pulled, they pulled the van over and we're all like, yeah. We get back in it. They changed the station. There's another song. So of the three or four songs that were on our EP, we heard like two or three of them on the way to the hotel. So then we went and had to play, uh, our first concert. And it was like the new rock revival is what they called it. So it was like a bunch of bands that had, you know, been playing.

• 53:06Speaker 02

  It was a band called The Dotsons from Australia. And they had tight pants and ripping guitar solos.

• 53:13Theo Von?

  The Dotsons?

• 53:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. And there was a band called Sleepy Jackson, who ended up being Empire of the Sun.

• 53:23Speaker 02

  But these guys all got up there and were ripping, but we were more popular than them. So we had to play after all these guys and we didn't know what the hell we were doing.

• 53:32Theo Von?

  And did that feel like scared? Like, oh my God, how can we even do this? Cause that seems like, like recently, this is not a comparison at all. But recently I had to go DJ one time, right? I'd never DJ'd before in my life. I'm thinking like, oh, I can do this. The second I got near it and there was like, there's probably eight or nine thousand people there. I was like, I can't do that. I don't even know what I'm doing, right?

• 53:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 53:53Theo Von?

  Like, what did that even feel like? That had to be crazy.

• 53:55Speaker 02

  I just remember before we walked on, you know, we looked at each other and we're like, what are we gonna do? And I said, just play it very fast and very country. I said, because that's the one thing that these people don't have that we do. I was like, we have a southern sound, you know? These guys sound Australian. These guys sound British. And so we went up there and from the first note, man, the crowd knew the songs. And it's never stopped over there for us. It was like out of the gates, big there. And then we come back home. And we land and our mom's waiting there at baggage claim. Nobody knows who we are. For years, nobody knows who we are. Yeah, it felt like.

• 54:39Theo Von?

  So you had this secret place that ever, you, it was almost like probably all the way through like a Narnia or something and you're there?

• 54:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, we'd go to the record, I mean, to the, uh, like Barnes and Noble or whatever it was when we got back to Nashville. And we go to the magazine section and we're on the cover of like Enemy Magazine and like all these British magazines. And then no, nobody knows who we are. And everybody's snickers at us when we walk into, you know, the restaurant. Cause we got bell bottoms and we're like, yeah, this was England. You'd be happy we were here.

• 55:11Theo Von?

  Yeah, viva Manchester. Yeah.

• 55:16Theo Von?

  Wow, bro.

• 55:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:18Theo Von?

  Did, was anybody able to explain to you why you were so popular there? Like, what made you so popular to that audience?

• 55:25Speaker 02

  I think they, they started telling our story from the moment that our music hit the radio. And they're like, oh, check out this band, man. These guys are crazy. They're southern guys. Their dad's a preacher. They're this, they tell these Gothic tales about, you know, our upbringing and stuff. And so like all the press was just fascinated with who we were, the fact that we're brothers. They didn't believe that. They would always be trying to like get us to swab, check our DNA. They'd be like, you guys aren't brothers. Like, all this is made up. And so it was, once again, trying to prove our worth.

• 56:03Theo Von?

  Dude, that's so wild.

• 56:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was crazy.

• 56:06Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 56:06Speaker 02

  So we came home, but we played every dive in Nashville.

• 56:11Theo Von?

  I see.

• 56:11Speaker 02

  Before I was even, I mean, I, I wasn't old enough to be in the room. So as soon as we'd play, they'd come to like, get out. Like, you know, you're not old enough to be in this bar. Um, we'd go to every writer's night, anything that we could do to kind of get experience and, and keep playing and keep writing. Um, but yeah, then we would always, like, we'd always get on the airplane and go over there and it was, things were different.

• 56:38Theo Von?

  So wild.

• 56:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:41Theo Von?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. You know, I've been thinking about mental real estate recently. The things that just kind of hang around in your mind that you're ready to let go of. For me, those things are, um, am I going to be able to do everything? Am I going to be able to do things perfectly? Um, and how other people feel about me? Those are, those are mine. Those things that loiter that I just really don't have control of. And that's where BetterHelp comes in. BetterHelp therapists are licensed, experienced professionals, such as psychologists, marriage and family therapists, social workers, and more.

• 57:24Theo Von?

  They have at least three years and 1,000 hours of hands-on experience and have the required education, training, exams, and practice. BetterHelp is now in-network with more than 125 health plans, with many copays as low as $15 for eligible members. And if you don't have eligible insurance or you live outside the US, you can still get 10% off your first month. Sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com/ Theo. That's better H E L P dot com slash Theo. Did, did you see that, um, Robbie Williams movie?

• 58:07Speaker 02

  Mrs. Doubtfire?

• 58:08Theo Von?

  No.

• 58:14Theo Von?

  It's, uh, Better Man. Dude, this movie's so good. It didn't get a lot of like acclaim or people wanted to watch it or whatever. Um, he took on this, uh,

• 58:24Speaker 02

  Was he the monkey?

• 58:25Theo Von?

  Yeah, he just, they put a monkey face on, they turned him into a monkey, the character, for some reason. So everybody else in the movie is a human, he's a monkey. Um, and he doesn't act like he's a monkey, just he acts like he's a human, but he just happens to be a monkey. But this movie was great.

• 58:38Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 58:39Theo Von?

  But it just makes me think about Robbie Williams, like so big in one place and just a different amount of an audience in another place or having to build it in another place. You know, I know he had kind of a similar career, kind of, uh,

• 58:51Theo Von?

  where he would come here and it just wasn't the same as when he was in the UK.

• 58:54Speaker 02

  When we'd go over there, all of their, like, all of the big celebrities, we didn't know who they were.

• 58:59Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 59:00Speaker 02

  And then you pretty quickly start to realize who is who and, um,

• 59:05Theo Von?

  Did you ever get to meet like Prince Harry or anything like that? Like, did it get like?

• 59:07Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Yeah.

• 59:09Theo Von?

  Or Prince William or whatever? Who's the?

• 59:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:11Theo Von?

  Who's the prince?

• 59:12Speaker 02

  Both of them were. I think only one of them is now, right?

• 59:17Theo Von?

  One of them got un-prints or whatever? Damn.

• 59:19Speaker 02

  Did Harry loses? I don't know.

• 59:21Theo Von?

  I don't know either.

• 59:21Speaker 02

  But I played ping pong with Harry. He's a good ping pong player, I know that. Uh, William never met William, but we did play a show that he was like the, he hosted it. Um, but we never actually got to meet him.

• 59:36Theo Von?

  That's wild to have that experience over there. Um, I saw where you guys had gotten a tour with Bob Dylan.

• 59:44Speaker 02

  Hmm, yeah.

• 59:45Theo Von?

  And we had Billy Strings on, it was probably one of my, like,

• 59:47Speaker 02

  I saw that one.

• 59:48Theo Von?

  Dude, well, I, I love Billy Strings.

• 59:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, man, he's great.

• 59:51Theo Von?

  He's just such a open book, kind of, I guess.

• 59:55Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 59:55Theo Von?

  Um, but, uh, yeah, he had, he just had like kind of this wild experience with Bob Dylan, where he had written a letter to Bob Dylan and then Bob Dylan had written him back and then, and then he got to go and tour with him in open, in open form. Um, what was it like? Was that one of your early opening experiences, kind of?

• 1:00:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was one of our earlier ones and he had personally requested us. Apparently he had a radio show and we had heard kind of whispers of it, but they were like, um, his radio show every night he plays y'all and talks about you guys.

• 1:00:28Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:00:28Speaker 02

  And I think it was another thing where he liked the story. Um, and so they, you know, we got the offer and we were like, of course we want to go play with Bob Dylan, you know, that's amazing, obviously. And, uh, I remember we, we went out there and, um, you know, we never saw him. And, and then we were in the dressing room one night and I smelled like a cigarette behind me. And he went like, hey, and I turned around, I was like, oh, God, it was Bob Dylan. And he's like, what's that last song you play? I said, oh, it's called tranny. He went, that's a hell of a song.

• 1:01:10Speaker 02

  I was like, whoa, man, that's Bob Dylan just told me that. And that was it. And then the last night of the tour, um, they're like, hey, Bob wants to come say goodbye to you guys. And so he came and gave us all a hug and that was, that was kind of it. But yeah, he was, he was one of the first, um, iconic American artists that took us under his wing and, and gave us a stage.

• 1:01:37Theo Von?

  Hmm. Wow.

• 1:01:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:39Theo Von?

  Yeah, there's always a lot of lore kind of around like his appearances or like his involvement sometimes with other musicians or, um, like, yeah, he seems to keep this sort of, uh, almost this like, like this shadow type of?

• 1:01:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, his crew, his like, uh, the guy that's playing guitar with him was a friend of a, a friend of ours who lives in Nashville. And so he came to talk to us and he would, we were playing outside of Chicago and so he came over to us, he's like, where are y'all staying? And it wasn't anything nice, but it was in Chicago where we're staying. He was like, man, we're so jealous. He's like, Bob only stays in, um, Holiday Inns or places that he can open his window to smoke cigarettes.

• 1:02:27Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 1:02:27Speaker 02

  So they were staying like in a little motel and we're the opening band and we were staying in the city. So they were like, man, we wish we were staying where you guys were staying. But I think that's awesome. It's like, can you imagine if you were staying in Holiday Inn and?

• 1:02:42Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:02:43Speaker 02

  There's, you were like, I swear that guy next to us looked like Bob Dylan smoking out of his window.

• 1:02:47Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:48Speaker 02

  That was Bob Dylan.

• 1:02:50Theo Von?

  And you could probably fit in because there's probably a lot of dudes that look like Bob Dylan smoking out of their window over there.

• 1:02:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:02:56Theo Von?

  That's classic, dude. Um, not, not a lot of people get to have the opportunity to kind of like go through fame like with their brothers and with family. Like can fame and popularity, can that like even ruin like a brotherhood in a way? Or like what kind of extra stresses can that cause on like a brotherly relationship that some of us might not be able to see?

• 1:03:19Speaker 02

  You know, fame is, you know, there's a lot of baggage that comes along with it. Um, a lot of pressure, um, and to have your brothers with you kind of going through it, um, it helps, but it also, you know, it's your brothers, you're competitive. Um, so we fought a lot. Um, but we also fought together a lot, you know, it was us versus the world. But having your brothers with you was, you know, it was great and it was awful and it was all of those things. It's just, you're all going through these strange experiences and

• 1:04:04Speaker 02

  you're in room, like it's, like I said, you know, you're in these rooms where you don't feel like you belong and everybody is accomplished and everyone's like something. And you, you're still in your mind, you're just these little poor kids from Tennessee or whatever. Um, so having the, my brothers with me was always awesome because we keep each other in check a little too much sometimes, you know? Um, it was cool. And I feel like now that we've gone through everything that we've gone through, we can now appreciate it even more, you know, that we were there for each other because we probably wouldn't have survived, you know, it's,

• 1:04:44Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:44Speaker 02

  Like what is the survival rate of a musician, a rock band, you know? Most of them die or, you know, become addicts and just lose everything and lose their minds. Um, and we did a little bit of all that, but I think the fact that we were there together, we never allowed ourselves to get too far gone. You know, we could always, no matter what, you know, no matter how much fun you're having, um, you still, you look over at your little brother, you know, and you go like, damn, I'm supposed to be the one helping him, you know?

• 1:05:27Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 1:05:28Speaker 02

  I'm supposed to be the good example here, you know, you see your little brother when he was little. Um, so having that to kind of keep you in check.

• 1:05:38Theo Von?

  It helps you sometimes?

• 1:05:39Speaker 02

  Sometimes.

• 1:05:40Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:05:41Speaker 02

  Not always, but yeah.

• 1:05:43Theo Von?

  Dude.

• 1:05:43Speaker 02

  Sometimes, uh, but yeah, you know, anytime you can have a support system with you to go through the highs and the lows, you need that because doing it by yourself, I, I really feel sorry for artists or musicians that kind of get so big and then, and really the whole time it's happening, you're so alone. You know, eventually you start looking around going, these people are all making money for me. They don't care.

• 1:06:18Theo Von?

  Like they're employees.

• 1:06:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:19Theo Von?

  Or even if they weren't in the beginning, sometimes friends become employees.

• 1:06:22Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's just how it goes and you need something to ground you and we had each other. Um, and we still need it every now and then. We still need to keep each other in check. Um, but yeah, man, it was, at times it seemed hard and at times, you know, you want to be like, oh, screw this, man, I don't need you guys. You know, I can go do this on my own. Um, but I never wanted that, you know, I always wanted us to be able to do this together, you know, because that was our, our thing, you know? It's like, when we'd walk into the YMCA, it was us, we were the basketball team. Didn't matter who else was there, it was like, you're going to play against us.

• 1:07:04Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:07:05Speaker 02

  You know, this is my family.

• 1:07:06Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:07:07Speaker 02

  And so that's how we have always approached this career too. It doesn't matter how big the band is that might be playing after us or how many albums they've sold.

• 1:07:20Speaker 02

  It's hard to, it's hard to beat family, you know? Like, we have something that, I don't care how skilled you are at your instrument, and how much money you make, when you put a family together, you have the instinct and this connection that, you might not be the greatest in the world, but when you're together, it sounds like you are. And it's like, ooh, there's something there. You know, when you hear sibling harmonies, you know, you hear a brother and a sister, or two brothers sing together.

• 1:07:50Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:50Speaker 02

  It sounds like angels, because their, their voices just link right up. And I feel like that's, that's how we have survived as long as we have, is that we have something about us that you can't quite put your finger on, and I think it's just our family connection.

• 1:08:06Theo Von?

  It's each other.

• 1:08:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:09Theo Von?

  Yeah, there's been times in my life where I would be like, I'd be like the one who would be like, kinda telling my friends, like, hey, man, this isn't how, how we should be doing this. And then two weeks later, I'm the one who's like hoping that they'll be telling me like,

• 1:08:20Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:08:20Theo Von?

  hey, man, this isn't how, how we should be doing this.

• 1:08:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:23Theo Von?

  You know? And I can certainly relate to like the trap of like, oh, I can do this by myself.

• 1:08:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:30Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 1:08:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, you start to believe what you hear. And you know, there's people putting those thoughts in your head, too, you know?

• 1:08:37Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, sometimes it's people-

• 1:08:38Speaker 02

  It'd be so much easier if it was, you know, it saves so much money if you, if we just get you out there and you go, you know, not extra hotel rooms, not the thing, and you start to go, yeah, you know what? That sounds pretty good. That'd look good up there on Caleb Falwell, instead of, you know, Kings of Leon.

• 1:08:56Theo Von?

  But that's the devil, though.

• 1:08:58Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, it was actually the devil that was whispering to me.

• 1:09:01Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:03Speaker 02

  He used to work for us.

• 1:09:04Theo Von?

  Did you guys have some bad influences?

• 1:09:05Speaker 02

  Oh, no, I mean, yes, but we didn't actually employ the devil, I don't think.

• 1:09:10Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:09:11Speaker 02

  Or we could've. I don't know.

• 1:09:13Theo Von?

  Yeah, you never know, huh?

• 1:09:14Speaker 02

  We had a couple of demons working for us, I think, probably, but...

• 1:09:17Theo Von?

  Sometimes it's tough to know that just like, a lot of that's greed, control.

• 1:09:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. And also, you know, I feel like, um, people get obsessed with, I don't know if celebrity is the right word, but you know, you, that's why like LA has always been a weird place to me, because you hear the way everyone just, like, there's one person at the table who's the person, and then everyone around them is just like, filling them with such bullshit about how perfect they, you know, everything is just like, candy and roses, and, and you know, that starts to happen, you start to get people that, you know, they wanna be a part of your, your rise, or whatever.

• 1:10:04Speaker 02

  So I think their thing is like, pull you away from everyone, and then I'll be there with you. You know, it's kinda like that. I don't know.

• 1:10:14Theo Von?

  It's all, it's kinda scary.

• 1:10:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:10:15Theo Von?

  I mean, like, I remember one time I was talking with Ben Affleck, and I wanted to ask him, I didn't exactly, but, like, whenever he became, because he and his brother both have, have experienced fame and popularity for their, um, acting and different stuff, but I was like, will your brother's, like, affections for you ever be enough, like, ever be able to live up to this, like, these hypothetical affections of fans and of, of popularity, like? So that was one thing, but that kinda stuff's always interesting to me.

• 1:10:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:10:42Theo Von?

  You know, like, if a son has a father that's famous,

• 1:10:45Speaker 02

  Oh, man.

• 1:10:46Theo Von?

  like, do they ever worry, like, how much I care about my dad will never be able to, um, be the same as how much these people that don't even know him care about him?

• 1:10:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, that scares me all the time, you know, as a parent, you don't, first of all, you don't want them to see you the way that everyone else sees you. You know, you want them to see you as the dad, you know, that I'm here for you. You know, whatever you need, I'm the guy that's gonna give it to you. I'm gonna be the one that picks up the call when you need me. Um, but then when they see you on TV, or hear your music, or see the way people look at you, then they kinda start, you don't, you don't want them to see you that way. You want them to always be embarrassed by you as their dad, you know, you wanna be corny, and you wanna be those things. Um, but like, as a band,

• 1:11:38Speaker 02

  we all have experienced a level of fame or success, but I was still the one with the microphone. So even though we're all kinda doing this, you still have those moments where, you know, your ego kinda pulls you a little away from everyone. And so I imagine there were times when they were probably all like, screw this guy, you know? Cause I'm, you know, I, I have had an ego at times, and it's hard not to.

• 1:12:12Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:13Speaker 02

  Um, especially if you're living a wild, crazy, you know, debaucherous life. Um, yeah, you can start to believe the hype and start to think like, yeah, I don't need these people. And I tried to not be that way, um, but I'm sure there was levels of that.

• 1:12:31Theo Von?

  Did you notice to yourself, or how do you even check back in, right? Like, cause your ego's so crazy, dude, I think about this kinda stuff a lot. And it's like, it's almost like this shadow that grows, right? And you kinda don't even know what it's, where it's growing, like,

• 1:12:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:46Theo Von?

  you know, and you can kind of latch on to different ideas, and it feels like its goal is just to get you to be by yourself, like this isolation thing.

• 1:12:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, you know, I, I went through times when I was drinking real bad, and, um, and that in and of itself, I felt like I was trying to punish myself because I didn't like the person that I was becoming, or I didn't like the way that everyone else was seeing me. So we'd be out there on the road, and I was so alone, you know? Everyone hated me. Everyone in my crew, everyone in my band, you know, you could just sense it. You walk out there to do a sound check.

• 1:13:32Theo Von?

  Everybody's afraid to look at you?

• 1:13:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. You just want them to look at you. You just want anyone to just make you feel like it's okay, or it's not okay. You just wanna feel anything.

• 1:13:44Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:44Speaker 02

  You're just in a cold, empty arena, and everybody's looking down. And a lot of times that's where I would end up writing songs, is because I was like, well, I'm gonna get, I'm gonna get them to notice me. So I would walk up to the mic with my guitar, and I would start singing something or playing something, and then slowly, you hear the bass join in, then the drums come, then before you know it, you're all kinda playing, and it's like, alright, we're back, we're back. But yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it's hard to experience something that we've experienced, and you not have little moments of selfishness and just feeling like you're better than other people. And I know they've all felt that, too, you know?

• 1:14:29Speaker 02

  They've had their moments where they pull away, and, you know, but I guess it's part of it.

• 1:14:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, well, it's a crazy thing to happen in life, is like some, like, kind of, to achieve a level, I think, of popularity and a level of like, um, creation, where you've created something that's kind of infected so many people, like positively infected, I mean, but like, or like, you know, uh, touched so many people.

• 1:14:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:54Theo Von?

  Um, it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's a rare thing to happen in a human life, right?

• 1:14:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:59Theo Von?

  And it's scary. It's, it's like, cause you'd think so many things would be kinda perfect from this, from that sort of experience, but there's a lot that goes on. I, I do think it's interesting that, that you said that like, you know, like, you could be like so alone, and you'd start in, and then the other instrument would come in.

• 1:15:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:15:15Theo Von?

  And you always, it's kind of cool, it's like, oh, we're putting a band back together, it's almost like, alright, this family, we're gonna, we're gonna make it through a real more ride here.

• 1:15:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, get the duct tape, man, we're gonna, we're gonna make this thing work.

• 1:15:26Theo Von?

  Yeah, sometimes I would get like, I was in a spot where I had a drink before I would go on stage.

• 1:15:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:15:30Theo Von?

  And that was tough, cause then it was like, um, I couldn't even have fun out there in a way.

• 1:15:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:15:36Theo Von?

  Unless I'd had a drink.

• 1:15:37Speaker 02

  Oh, man. Yeah, you get into a cycle.

• 1:15:40Theo Von?

  And that's a bad place to be.

• 1:15:41Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. It's like, well, you know, I'm a, I'm a creature of habit, so, like, every morning I wake up at the, you know, my habits have changed, they're better now, but I wake, I have a whole routine in the morning. And back then, I had a whole routine leading up to the show.

• 1:16:00Speaker 02

  And so you do the thing, and then you go out there, and you start to realize, like, this is the person they expect. So I gotta keep doing it.

• 1:16:08Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 1:16:08Speaker 02

  You know, you gotta keep being that guy out there on stage.

• 1:16:12Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:16:13Speaker 02

  And I look back, and there were years that I just don't remember playing a show that I enjoyed. Like, I didn't. I was mad on stage, and the madder I got, the more the crowd loved it. The more I spit, the more they were just like, yeah, he's doing the thing!

• 1:16:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:16:35Speaker 02

  And you just look back and you go like, man, that was, that was a lot of, a lot of years of just kind of thinking that you were doing something special, but really you were just hurting yourself and you were losing inspiration. And now, you know, a lot of time, people don't really want to hear a lot of bands newest music, you know? Nobody wants to hear the new album of a band that's been around for a long time. It's like you go to a concert and they break into a new song. It's like, ah, come on. But the music that I, that we're making now, I feel like all those years of, of, uh, being in that, in that pattern,

• 1:17:18Speaker 02

  I feel like I'm making up for it now because I love doing the work now. I love playing the show. I love connecting with the crowd and actually talking to them. I mean, for 10 years, I never spoke to the crowd, ever.

• 1:17:34Theo Von?

  Really?

• 1:17:35Speaker 02

  I would, I thought I was Johnny Cash. I'd go out and say, thank you. We're Kings of Leon. And that was it. And we'd rip through a set and that was only talking. And now I'm like, I want to say a little something, you know? I want to see how Boise's doing tonight, you know?

• 1:17:52Theo Von?

  Dude, that's cool, man. Wow. The new album is Oh My Beloved, um, and it's out today.

• 1:18:01Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:18:01Theo Von?

  Nice.

• 1:18:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, man.

• 1:18:03Theo Von?

  What makes it so that now you're at a point where you can kind of package all this together and it feels like, um, you want to make music again? Is that a safe way to say it?

• 1:18:13Speaker 02

  Well, I just feel like with this album, I kind of really started to look back on my life and where we are now and all of the things that we have accomplished along the way through those years when I wasn't enjoying it. I can now look at it through a different lens and just be like, man, look at how far we made it. You know, we always said if we could ever sell like, uh, 10,000 albums, then that meant one time a year, we could play one concert for 10,000 people. We didn't realize that you have to travel. But like for us, it was like, you know, if we can just play a concert in front of a big crowd one day, that would be awesome.

• 1:18:57Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:58Speaker 02

  And now I look back at all the things that have happened, but not just success, but like who we are now and the fact that we all are good men who are raising families and we're present and we're, we've become, you know, we've beat, we've beat the statistics, you know, we're, we survived and we're still here. Um, so I feel like a lot of these songs are full of gratitude and appreciation for the way we were raised, um, the man that we've become, the journey, just the bumpy road that led to, you know, where we are right now. And a lot of those songs, you know, um, there's little lyrics throughout that are from

• 1:19:43Speaker 02

  childhood all the way to, you know, yesterday, you know, it's like, I just feel like now I'm, I'm finally, I'm okay with being me and, um, I'm happy with, if this is the end, I'm happy with everything that we've done. And it's much bigger than I ever thought it could be.

• 1:20:04Theo Von?

  Yeah. I know you guys were touring crazy, like from the 2008 album, from that success, till like 2011 or, or 2012. Um, has there been like a hiatus since then or?

• 1:20:17Speaker 02

  No, we've been, we've been at it. We've taken a couple of little breaks, um, but we kind of like just, I feel like we kind of faded into the background a little bit. We tried to

• 1:20:31Speaker 02

  just do whatever we had to do and nothing more. Um, so a lot of people, you know, think that we haven't been working or weren't making records or touring. It's like we were, we just, you know, we weren't loud about it. We kind of just tried to, I don't know, we wanted to blend in. We just didn't want to stand out. Um, so there were some years, you know, that it just felt like,

• 1:20:59Speaker 02

  you know, it wasn't inspired.

• 1:21:01Theo Von?

  Well, especially with the success that you guys had, right? With your, I think it was the 2008 album. I mean, that success was

• 1:21:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:21:11Theo Von?

  astronomical.

• 1:21:12Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, that was.

• 1:21:14Theo Von?

  Only by the Night, 2008, Kings of Leon's best-selling and, um, most successful album. Worldwide sales over 6.2 million copies sold,

• 1:21:23Theo Von?

  over 4.7 billion streams on Spotify. And I don't even know what date this is. Debut at number five on the Billboard 200. 131 consecutive weeks in the top 75. You had to like y'all's music, even if you didn't want to, dude. That's how huge it was.

• 1:21:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, and we didn't like it. We did, we did not like that.

• 1:21:42Theo Von?

  You didn't like what? Like how big it got, you think?

• 1:21:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was, that was when like the rough times started.

• 1:21:51Speaker 02

  Just the real weight of like actual big time success here at home, everywhere. I'm still to this day, I mean, you know, doesn't matter where we go, we play songs from that album, Sex on Fire or You Somebody. And I've said it before, but I'm, I feel like we could play those songs at a funeral and the damn corpse would sit up and start clapping because, you know, everybody knows them, you know? So like any, you know?

• 1:22:20Theo Von?

  That's a revival.

• 1:22:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:22:24Speaker 02

  But that, you know, that, that pressure got to us and I feel like that was when we kind of had some dark times. You know, we weren't ready for that.

• 1:22:32Theo Von?

  Yeah. And do you think anybody could be ready for that or it's just too much like of you? You know what I'm saying? Like is it, like what is that? Cause it's like, some people, you're right, like don't get to go to this like, it's almost like sending somebody out into space, right?

• 1:22:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:22:48Theo Von?

  Cause it's a scary place. There's just tons of whatever you want, kind of.

• 1:22:52Speaker 02

  Oh yeah.

• 1:22:53Theo Von?

  And it's all like the, kind of the sin, anything, you have access to whatever really, you know, and your own ego can grow. It's like, it's a scary place to go. It's a Mordor.

• 1:23:05Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, I feel like at that point, we were kind of doing like this and it was like naturally growing and then it went and when that happened, it was like, it kind of threw us all and and then I feel like we spent some years either trying to run away from that. And then there were times where we tried to like maybe recreate that. And it's like, it was a moment that, you know, it happened and anytime you try to repeat success, you know, it's, it doesn't happen. It just ends up being like a watered down version of something. So yeah, those years, um, I feel like we just kind of struggled with it and it's been recently that I feel like

• 1:23:50Speaker 02

  we've kind of found our footing and, and just like have become, you know, in my opinion, well, I don't want to say that, but I, I just,

• 1:24:02Speaker 02

  I don't care who's playing, you put us out there, we'll hold our own. I don't care who it is. And there was a lot of time that I couldn't say that. But we've got years of experience, but we're also, we're just in a different place now. And like I said, we, we walk out there and it's like back in the day, you know, we look at each other and go like, all right, we're about to, if there's someone here that doesn't know who we are, when we leave here, they're going to know who we are, you know? And it, it's, you know, I feel like that kind of youthful competitive, uh, spirit is, is back in us.

• 1:24:37Theo Von?

  Like you found yourself kind of.

• 1:24:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, we lost ourselves for a little while.

• 1:24:43Theo Von?

  Do you think anybody would have though?

• 1:24:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't think there's, I mean, I feel like I'm, I feel like we're fairly grounded people, you know, the way that we were raised and stuff. And it affected us the way that it did. I can't imagine someone that didn't have a stable background or, you know, a supportive parents, you know, I, I, that they are the statistic that doesn't survive.

• 1:25:09Theo Von?

  Well, yeah, I mean, it's like you guys, professional wrestlers.

• 1:25:13Speaker 02

  How'd you know about that?

• 1:25:14Theo Von?

  Those guys are.

• 1:25:15Speaker 02

  I thought you said you guys are.

• 1:25:17Theo Von?

  The Follow Well Boys. That'd be a good one.

• 1:25:19Speaker 02

  Jerry, the Kings of Leon Lawler.

• 1:25:23Theo Von?

  Yeah, bro, that's a good one.

• 1:25:26Theo Von?

  I feel like it's like rock stars, professional wrestlers. It's not, some of them don't have a second act, a third, you know, they don't have a, it's a dangerous life. So it's really a blessing, but it's also a challenge, really.

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, to be in a, like a big rock band, you've kind of your, you're, like what you're shooting for is the tiniest little window, you know, it's like, that window comes and goes and then it's like, now what? You're either dead or you're, you know, a caricature of yourself out there, bloated, like trying to put your tight pants on, go out there and do the dance that they liked back in the 2010s or whatever.

• 1:26:17Theo Von?

  Yeah, but I think it's like, you have to evolve, but then also you want to give fans what they want, right? So it's, I think it's just a, in the end, it seems like it's a lot of us of coming to reckon with yourself.

• 1:26:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:26:30Theo Von?

  And with whatever's going on inside of ourselves. It's like, even with comedy, it's like sometimes it's like, I'll want to latch on to like things that used to work or try to do this or something, but it's like, well, that's not exactly me anymore. In some ways it is, there's a part of me still there, but that's not totally me. So if I just try to recreate that, which at times you'll try to and stuff, it's like, yeah, it's just a trap, but it's also normal to try and want to stay with what's safe, you know? I mean, it's all just a, I don't know. It's all just interesting.

• 1:26:58Speaker 02

  It's a mind, it's a, it's, it's a mind game. Um, you learn a lot about yourself when you find success. You know, it's like, like I say, the more, I feel like the more you have, the harder it is.

• 1:27:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:14Speaker 02

  And when you just go and you're big and then, you know, you're the, we were never that, but like I look at some of these pop stars and it's like, you're the biggest thing in the world and you are all alone.

• 1:27:27Theo Von?

  Oh, I mean, if you look at Britney Spears, she's spinning around by a fireplace with knives every day.

• 1:27:31Speaker 02

  She's got our music in the background sometimes. From Only by the Night. I'm telling you, it was a big record.

• 1:27:39Theo Von?

  Bro, yeah, when your record is the soundtrack for tough times of mental health, that's where you've made it, dude. But isn't it crazy how we watch this? And this has kind of become normal for us too, like in a way to just watch this? And those dogs spell out help sometimes with their bodies if you watch them long enough.

• 1:27:56Speaker 02

  Oh, man.

• 1:27:57Theo Von?

  They'll spell it out.

• 1:27:58Speaker 02

  She's from Louisiana too, right?

• 1:28:00Theo Von?

  I know, but it's like-

• 1:28:01Speaker 02

  You guys come up together?

• 1:28:03Theo Von?

  No, but uh, we might've been around a little bit around the same time. Couple of years, but she's a little bit younger than me, but you would definitely-

• 1:28:09Speaker 02

  Are those real knives, you think?

• 1:28:11Theo Von?

  I mean, even if they're not, what is going on? I mean, you know what I'm saying? What's going on? And your music is inspiring it.

• 1:28:19Speaker 02

  I know which songs she's dancing to right there. I know those moves.

• 1:28:23Theo Von?

  So you tell me, dude. Um, let me see, oh, right here it says, "Studies show that rock and pop stars have a mortality rate two to three times higher than the general population and fame reduces a musician's life expectancy by roughly four to five years." Hmm, thought it would take a little more than that off.

• 1:28:39Speaker 02

  Four to five years? Yeah, right. What was their life expectancy before? They're dead at 23, isn't that the number?

• 1:28:46Theo Von?

  That's a-

• 1:28:47Speaker 02

  27, what, they're supposed to live to 32? What year is this?

• 1:28:51Theo Von?

  The club 20-

• 1:28:52Speaker 02

  The 30s?

• 1:28:54Theo Von?

  The club 27 myth. Research published in the journal Epidemiology and Community Health dismissed the popular myth that rock stars uniquely die at age 27 like Jimi Hendrix or Kurt Cobain. The statistical risk is spread out over years of high-risk lifestyles. You know, it's interesting because you want to go see your rock star, right? You want to see them be a rock star, but if they were to continue to be a rock star, like, they wouldn't be there to perform anymore.

• 1:29:22Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:29:22Theo Von?

  Um, like, I went and saw 311 the other day, like, um, I was in Austin and I was at the airport and, uh, and I saw this guy and I was like, "Man, you look so familiar." And he's like, "Um, I'm Nick." And I was like, "I'm Theo." And I was like, "Nick?" And he's like, "Hexum." And I was like, "Oh, my God, dude." And I, like, the biggest smile came on my face. It didn't even come from me, it just came from like, I think when I was a kid or something. And I was like, "Hey, can I give you a hug?" And it was just the craziest thing. It was like, "I don't know." And he's like, "Yeah, sure, man." And so then with me and him, we're just hugging by baggage claim. But it was like, I don't know. It was just so cool.

• 1:30:05Theo Von?

  It was like, it was just part of me that I think I'd even forgot about some of the stuff I liked so much when I was young. And then here that part of me had a moment, like, and it ran into something that like, kind of meant a lot to it or, and it was just like, anyway, that was like, just like this moment, I was like, "Wow, this is, um, I don't know." I gotten so busy sometimes doing whatever, that sometimes I'd forgotten about things that really brought me a lot of joy. Um, and then anyway, we got to go to their concert and, um, Hexum is sober, right? So he doesn't drink or do drugs. So it's like, but I don't know if he'd stay on an old path if he's still, you know what I'm saying? I don't know if I get to see him again. Or if like a lot of your favorite musicians, if you get to see them again, you know?

• 1:30:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, and if they stay on that path, the version that you do see is, is like, "Oh, man."

• 1:30:53Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:54Speaker 02

  Or Elvis, you know, his final, his final days, it's like, you see him and it's like, I love Elvis, obviously, being a Memphis guy, um-

• 1:31:04Theo Von?

  Yeah, but there's something sad about it.

• 1:31:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, because it's like, man, you could see like, he had to go up there and be Elvis. And he was, he was struggling, you know? Um, and I feel like we all, i-if you're in music or not, we all have those musical moments from our past, from our childhood, that you're just like, "Oh, man, that, that song takes me right to this moment and that takes me there." And you want to see that. But the thing is, we all get older, we all, you know, our bodies, everything changes.

• 1:31:39Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:40Speaker 02

  None of us are, none of us look the way we did in high school or college or whatever, but when you had that poster on your wall and you go to the concert, you're expecting that poster and then it's like, here comes kind of a chubby version of it. And you're like, "Oh, man, that ain't the poster. I want my money back."

• 1:31:58Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude. And you know what? It's this weird thing, I think, of like, if you have some sort of popularity that happens out of trying to live up to the poster.

• 1:32:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:32:08Theo Von?

  And that's such a tr- it's like-

• 1:32:09Speaker 02

  Which, by the way, we need to start making posters again, man. What happened to those? You used to go to Walmart and you'd sit there and thumb through that big giant thing and it'd be like, a Sudsy girl on a car and then it'd be like Jonathan Taylor Thomas.

• 1:32:23Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:23Speaker 02

  And then it'd be like, all these like, teeny bopper stars and then there's Keanu Reeves and you're like, "What the-"

• 1:32:29Theo Von?

  Schwarzenegger all the time. "Oh, dude." And then it would, sometimes it would just be a big pair of breasts or whatever and be like, "It's warm outside, ain't it?" or something. And you'd be like-

• 1:32:39Speaker 02

  "It is now."

• 1:32:41Theo Von?

  "I want this framed, mom."

• 1:32:45Theo Von?

  You'd get something like that framed for Christmas, bro.

• 1:32:48Speaker 02

  I think we had, I think we had Kathy Ireland on our wall. Um, some of those old Sports Illustrated-

• 1:32:54Theo Von?

  We had Kathy Scotland, not as good looking. But, uh, but, but a good attitude. That's what we had. Oh, but yeah, Kurt Cobain, bro, when all those, and when those magazines would come, like, we were like, big in, like, Aerosmith, Def Leppard, GNR, like, just all those magazines. And you'd see them all bloodied up and stuff. Like, one of them had gotten like Sebastian Bach every week, he'd gotten hit by a bottle somewhere.

• 1:33:21Speaker 02

  Outside of the Roxy.

• 1:33:22Theo Von?

  Yeah, always like that. It was probably all mythological shit, but we were just sitting there just absorbing it, you know? Dude, that was so much fun.

• 1:33:31Speaker 02

  I miss those.

• 1:33:32Theo Von?

  I miss some of those times, man. Um, your, your band that's going back on tour, it's the same, uh, members as always?

• 1:33:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, me and my two brothers, my cousin. Um, yeah, it's us, man. It's always been us, never been anything else, yeah.

• 1:33:49Theo Von?

  And what's something that you kind of like admire about each one of those guys, kind of?

• 1:33:53Speaker 02

  Oh, man, I love those guys. Uh, I mean,

• 1:34:00Speaker 02

  besides the fact that we've kind of all gone through it together, we all have our role, we all have, um, something that we bring to the band that makes us who we are. And it doesn't necessarily mean onstage or in the studio. Personality-wise, you know, Nathan being the elder statesman, he was the one that always felt like he was watching over us, you know? Even when he wasn't. None of us were watching, we weren't watching anything. But he always seemed like he was, you know, he was the guy that would, if somebody said something about us, he would push everyone behind him and want to fight for us, you know?

• 1:34:41Speaker 02

  Um, Jared is, you know, he's my little brother, he's just funny and got a big heart and, um, just, you know, we still laugh like we did back when we were kids. Um, Matthew is, you know, he's, he's the cousin, so there's that. Uh, you know, he probably has a little chip on his shoulder.

• 1:35:05Theo Von?

  Does he, 'cause he's the, uh, 'cause he's just like-

• 1:35:06Speaker 02

  No, I don't think he does. He, he, you know, he's, he's always been cool. We always assumed it, but, um-

• 1:35:12Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, the cousin.

• 1:35:14Speaker 02

  You know, 'cause you're out there with three brothers and we all have our, you know, we have our inside jokes and now he's in on everything, but there was a couple of years where I'm sure, you know, it seemed like we were-

• 1:35:25Theo Von?

  Were you guys against him sometimes, it felt like?

• 1:35:28Speaker 02

  No, it didn't seem like it to us, but you know, we were always trying to be funny and usually when you're trying to be funny, it's at the expense of someone, you know?

• 1:35:36Theo Von?

  The cousin?

• 1:35:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, whoever's not the brother, it's like, "Yeah, we're gonna pick on you" or, um, but they, they all picked, they picked on me for a while too.

• 1:35:45Theo Von?

  They did?

• 1:35:46Speaker 02

  We all got it, you know?

• 1:35:47Theo Von?

  Took your turns.

• 1:35:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:35:48Theo Von?

  If I had a fricking cousin, dude, the shit I would do to him?

• 1:35:52Speaker 02

  Oh, man, it's so fun.

• 1:35:53Theo Von?

  I hope I never have one.

• 1:35:55Speaker 02

  You probably do.

• 1:35:56Theo Von?

  You're right.

• 1:35:57Speaker 02

  Probably Britney Spears.

• 1:36:00Theo Von?

  Hey, have you on the Spears, huh? I mean, damn. She looks like damn Donatello out there or something. I mean, her Raphael.

• 1:36:09Speaker 02

  It's Raphael, right?

• 1:36:10Theo Von?

  Yeah, I mean, she's definitely a Louisiana snapping turtle. Uh, I mean, that's crazy over there. Um, before you leave, bro, um, how has your relationship with religion, uh, changed over time? If that's okay to ask you?

• 1:36:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, well, it's, you know, it's, it's been an evolution of, um, kind of where we came from to where we are now. I think the way that we grew up, we kind of saw behind the scenes and kind of how the sausage is made, I guess you'd say.

• 1:36:47Speaker 02

  And so I got a little bitter for a while, um, 'cause there was times I felt like my dad kind of got-

• 1:36:55Speaker 02

  Pushed out because he was having normal struggles that a man goes through, but he was supposed to be this perfect man, but he wasn't. And so I got bitter for a while about that. And so I feel like now my relationship with God is a personal relationship.

• 1:37:17Speaker 02

  And I try to maintain it and try to, you know, I pray and I read the Bible and,

• 1:37:25Speaker 02

  but don't put me on a pedestal. I'm far from perfect.

• 1:37:31Speaker 02

  I make mistakes every day. I'm just like everyone else and I'm always searching. I don't know all the answers. I don't know what I believe all the time, but I know I've always been searching for the answer.

• 1:37:48Speaker 02

  And I'll keep searching and, and maybe one day I'll find it or maybe I won't. And the journey is awesome, you know? It's like that, that searching sometimes is the best part. So I try to raise my kids right. We, we were raised right, even outside of the religious aspect. We were always just raised to be kind and considerate of others. And like I said, when you grow up with nothing, you, you learn to love people for who they are. And you don't love someone because they have something or because they're doing well. In fact, you, a lot of times those people put you off because they aren't authentic

• 1:38:32Speaker 02

  and they haven't had those experiences. So, um, yeah, I don't know. I feel like I'm always, I'm always searching and, um,

• 1:38:44Speaker 02

  yeah, maybe one day, maybe one day I'll find what I'm looking for.

• 1:38:50Theo Von?

  Yeah. I mean, I think that's probably the creed of a lot of people, probably, you know? The truth, you know, a lot of people's truth is trying their best.

• 1:39:02Theo Von?

  Sometimes our society makes it so tough to have, you have time to have peace with yourself, you know, time to focus on and turn your attention to a higher power sometimes.

• 1:39:11Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I, I feel like you're always, you know, if, if you're doing it right,

• 1:39:19Speaker 02

  then maybe it's not doing it right. I don't know, but I feel like you, you do try to help other people even when you're struggling.

• 1:39:29Speaker 02

  You see someone, you try to pick them up and then, you know, there's that voice in your head like, why are you giving this person advice? Look at you. You don't, you don't even know the answer yourself and you're trying to, you know? But I feel like that's our, as humans, you know, you, you want to take what little experience you have and pass it on to someone.

• 1:39:50Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:51Speaker 02

  And then hopefully they'll hit you with something back and you're like, oh, thank God. I needed that, you know?

• 1:39:56Theo Von?

  Oh yeah, dude. I go to recovery meetings and I'll go sit in meetings sometimes and it's like, oh yeah, sometimes I'll hear somebody say something and I'll literally feel my shoulders go like.

• 1:40:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm not alone.

• 1:40:08Theo Von?

  I took an exhale that like has been stuck in my lungs for 20 years. It's like old air that won't come out. And it's like, cause I heard him say something that I just couldn't say, or something that I needed to hear. I don't even know. I don't even know sometimes what the, the unlocking is, but, um, but yeah, and then any, any break I get from thinking about myself is nice, you know?

• 1:40:31Speaker 02

  Yeah. And hopefully you have people, um, either in your life or people that admire you and they're, you know, they're praying for you or they're trying to, you know,

• 1:40:46Speaker 02

  help you get through what you're going through, you know? And, and maybe that's why you hear someone say something. And it's like, oh, someone knew I needed to hear that, you know? And maybe it was my, you know, my uncle that said, that prayed for me or something. And then that spoke through that guy and that guy didn't even know what he was saying, but he was talking right to me, you know?

• 1:41:06Theo Von?

  Amen. Yeah, I feel, I think about that stuff a lot.

• 1:41:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:41:10Theo Von?

  Cause it does feel like if you're praying that there's a power in it.

• 1:41:13Speaker 02

  Oh, there's power in it. Yeah.

• 1:41:15Theo Von?

  You know, it feels like there's like, this is, this does something. This is not for naught, you know? It's almost, it's an undeniable thing.

• 1:41:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. Why would you do it if there wasn't?

• 1:41:24Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:41:25Speaker 02

  Like, I mean, besides the burning of the calories, but you know, lose a little weight.

• 1:41:32Theo Von?

  Dude, that's a great callback dude. Way to bring that full circle right there, dude.

• 1:41:38Theo Von?

  Yeah. Do you ever see yourself ending up in a space with a, like doing revival or something like that?

• 1:41:44Speaker 02

  We always used to say, uh, when we first started that one day we could see ourselves, with our dad back up there and we were the band, you know? Kind of like how Bob Dylan, his band was The Band. Do you know The Band? So they're one of our favorite bands, but they're, they're called The Band. They were Canadian, um, except for Leon, the drummer. He was from Arkansas, but they were Bob Dylan's band. And then they went on to have massive success on their own. And so I feel like we all, you know, we imagine that one day that could be us.

• 1:42:28Speaker 02

  And in this scenario, this is a very small church in the middle of nowhere. This isn't like one of those, I've never understood those big super church things.

• 1:42:38Theo Von?

  Right. Where the Lord comes down on a rope or whatever?

• 1:42:41Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. I never understood that stuff, but for me it was always what church was to us, which was just four little walls. You could smell the furnace, you know? It was like, everything was tied, it was all plywood and. But you know, that was the best place in the, in the town, you know, for that moment.

• 1:43:00Theo Von?

  You got that box rocking, homie.

• 1:43:02Speaker 02

  Oh yeah. So we could, you know, I think there's, there's that kind of romantic fantasy that perhaps one day that could happen, but.

• 1:43:12Theo Von?

  That's cool, dude. I would love that. Like that kid Mason Locklear, have you ever seen that kid?

• 1:43:17Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 1:43:18Theo Von?

  He's like this little kid. He does, um, he's a, I think he's Pentecostal. It's him.

• 1:43:25Speaker 02

  Whoa.

• 1:43:26Speaker 05

  Don't add up to me. I just wanna, I just wanna point this out. Don't add up to me. You say that you're a Christian, right? Say that you're a Christian. I want you to listen to me good. You say you're a Christian, but you're gay.

• 1:43:40Theo Von?

  This kid is.

• 1:43:42Speaker 05

  But you're gay. You married a woman, you married a man, but you say you're a Christian.

• 1:43:47Speaker 02

  We can find another one.

• 1:43:51Speaker 05

  I mean, go, go read Leviticus 18 and 22 and see what it says.

• 1:43:55Speaker 02

  Too close to home, huh?

• 1:43:57Theo Von?

  No, I'm just saying, bro.

• 1:44:00Theo Von?

  That kid's wildin', bro.

• 1:44:01Speaker 02

  I love his voice, man.

• 1:44:03Theo Von?

  How are gay Christians doing actually? Look that up.

• 1:44:08Theo Von?

  If you don't mind, that's a good, I haven't even looked that up in a long time.

• 1:44:13Speaker 02

  You've looked it up before though?

• 1:44:14Theo Von?

  I'm sure. Gay Christians today experience a wildly polarized landscape ranging from full theological affirmation and ordination to strict expectations of celibacy or outright exclusion. Overall, gay Christians are doing pretty good.

• 1:44:29Theo Von?

  Hell yeah. I knew it.

• 1:44:30Speaker 02

  They're doing alright.

• 1:44:32Theo Von?

  Look dude. There we go, man.

• 1:44:36Speaker 02

  Well, now I'm gonna go home and watch that little kid. You guys sent me his name, man.

• 1:44:40Theo Von?

  Oh, I'll see.

• 1:44:41Speaker 02

  That's gonna be, my YouTube's gonna be firing tonight when I'm falling asleep.

• 1:44:46Theo Von?

  What are you saying, young guy?

• 1:44:49Theo Von?

  Oh yeah, that's firing and brimstone right there, that little fella. Who knows, man? Maybe if we hit another time like this, like, you know, like if we hit into some, you know, they say the world could be ending, who knows what's going on? If we hit into some great harass stuff, maybe it'll be, I mean, revivals might be all they have again.

• 1:45:06Speaker 02

  Hey, that's, it's a good time.

• 1:45:09Theo Von?

  Oh yeah, dude. It's a good time, man. You guys are doing some festivals as well. You guys have just got on the, uh, Sand in My Boots Festival.

• 1:45:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:45:17Theo Von?

  With, uh, Morgan, Ella Langley. That's gonna be great. Dude, the bands on here are crazy.

• 1:45:23Speaker 02

  Look at Empire of the Sun. He was, he was the Sleepy Jackson that was at that concert in London when we were so scared.

• 1:45:30Theo Von?

  And here they are?

• 1:45:31Speaker 02

  Yep. And he's up here on the bill.

• 1:45:33Theo Von?

  That's.

• 1:45:34Speaker 02

  Sand in My Boots.

• 1:45:36Theo Von?

  Have you met Morgan or no?

• 1:45:38Speaker 02

  I have not met Morgan, no. Or Ella or.

• 1:45:42Theo Von?

  That's gonna be great, dude. Nelly, Cole Swindell.

• 1:45:47Theo Von?

  The new album, Oh My Beloved, it's out today.

• 1:45:50Speaker 02

  Yes, sir.

• 1:45:52Theo Von?

  Yeah, Caleb, thanks so much. How's your dad doing by the way?

• 1:45:55Speaker 02

  Oh man, he's good. He was just here.

• 1:45:59Speaker 02

  He'll be here, uh, in a couple of weeks for Thanksgiving. So yeah, he's good.

• 1:46:04Theo Von?

  Is he still evangelizing?

• 1:46:06Speaker 02

  No, um, but he still gets up and preaches every now and then at, at his local church in Oklahoma.

• 1:46:12Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 1:46:13Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:46:14Theo Von?

  Nice, man. Well, tell them we said hello. Caleb Falwell, uh, Kings of Leon, tell your brothers and cousin that we said hello and thank you guys for, uh, just coming by. And chatting with us for a bit and, um, best luck on the new tour, man. And just congratulations on being alive still.

• 1:46:28Speaker 02

  Thanks, man. You gotta come out and, uh, have, see a show with us.

• 1:46:33Theo Von?

  I'd love to.

• 1:46:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:46:34Theo Von?

  I will, man. Thanks, brother.

• 1:46:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, man. Thank you.