The Big Bird Fluffer

Conan talks to Micah in Atlanta about working as the collections manager at the Center For Puppetry Arts and her love of niche fan fiction. Wanna get a chance to talk to Conan? Submit here: teamcoco.com/apply

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Conan O'Brien?

  Owning a car or home comes with responsibilities. Sure, it's fun, but sometimes it makes you wonder why you ever longed for adulthood in the first place. I do that all the time. I'm like, oh, these bills, these bills. What am I gonna do?

• 0:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:15Conan O'Brien?

  You know, when you own a house, you gotta fix it yourself. Sona,

• 0:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:17Conan O'Brien?

  You see this to be true, right?

• 0:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, your garage door breaks, and you're like, well, I have to fix it.

• 0:22Conan O'Brien?

  Probably at first you said, hey, I'll get the super to fix it. It's your house, dude.

• 0:25Speaker 01

  It's mine, dude!

• 0:27Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah. Liberty Mutual customizes your car and home insurance to save you money. In fact, they work overtime to tailor your insurance policy around what you actually need. The only thing they can't do is get that liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty jingle out of your head.

• 0:39Speaker 01

  Liberty, liberty, liberty.

• 0:41Conan O'Brien?

  Liberty, liberty. It's in my head all the time.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, me too.

• 0:43Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah. Start your quote at libertymutual.com.

• 0:49Conan O'Brien?

  Now, Sona, clearly I'm a very important person to you.

• 0:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:52Conan O'Brien?

  Just accept the premise and we'll move ahead.

• 0:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 0:54Conan O'Brien?

  I'm a very important person to you. What would you get me from Macy's for the holidays?

• 1:00Speaker 01

  A vase.

• 1:01Conan O'Brien?

  No, I don't want a vase. I want something better.

• 1:04Speaker 01

  A jacket.

• 1:06Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, nice jacket. I love a nice jacket.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, that jacket. Nice jacket.

• 1:08Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, so now you have to do it, because you said you would.

• 1:10Speaker 01

  Aw, man, I didn't know you were doing that.

• 1:12Conan O'Brien?

  Well, I know the holidays are months away, but it's never too early, Sona, to find gifts that I will love, gifts I will wear, and surprises that make the season unforgettable for me.

• 1:24Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:24Conan O'Brien?

  Macy's Gift Guide makes holiday shopping easy with beauty favorites, stylish fashion, jewelry, cozy essentials, must-have toys, home upgrades, and picks for every person on your list. Coach handbags, Breville appliances, Lego UG, and more, all in one place. You can skip the scrolling and shop with confidence. Shop now in-store or online at macy's.com/giftguide.

• 1:50Speaker 01

  Conan O'Brien needs a fan. Want to talk to Conan? Visit teamcoco.com/callconan. Okay, let's get started.

• 1:59Conan O'Brien?

  Hey Micah, welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a Fan.

• 2:01Speaker 02

  Hello, thank you.

• 2:03Conan O'Brien?

  Hi Micah, how are you?

• 2:04Speaker 02

  Good, how are you doing?

• 2:06Conan O'Brien?

  Uh, where are you right now in the world, Micah?

• 2:08Speaker 02

  I am in Atlanta, Georgia, at the Center for Puppetry Arts.

• 2:13Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, you work with puppets?

• 2:15Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:17Conan O'Brien?

  I'm gonna say, I don't think I've heard of it, but tell me, this is a puppet museum? What is it? What are we doing here? Are we storing puppets? Are we displaying them? What's happening in your puppet world?

• 2:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're a museum, a puppet museum. We're also a performing arts center, so we have performances that involve puppets onstage, but then I work in the museum side of things. So, I'm the collections manager, which essentially just means I take care of the puppets in the museum.

• 2:50Conan O'Brien?

  Okay, are we talking famous puppets here? Uh, would these be puppets that I know?

• 2:56Speaker 02

  Yes, we have about 500 of the Jim Henson, original Jim Henson puppets.

• 3:01Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, we call those Muppets, don't we?

• 3:03Speaker 02

  Yes, we do call them Muppets.

• 3:05Conan O'Brien?

  Well, I'm sorry, we in the business of puppetry, call that Muppetry. Uh, so, you have Muppets? You have 500 Muppets?

• 3:14Speaker 02

  Yes, we do. We have 500 Muppets. Miss Piggy, Kermit, the Sesame Street characters, puppets from the Dark Crystal and Labyrinth.

• 3:23Conan O'Brien?

  Wow.

• 3:24Speaker 02

  Among others, so, yeah, stuff you would recognize.

• 3:28Conan O'Brien?

  I had the honor and privilege of getting to meet Jim Henson a couple of times. Uh, in, this is long before I did my late night show or anything. I, when I was in college, his daughter Lisa was on the College Humor magazine with me, and he would come by, and he once said to me, "Conan, would you, for the College Humor magazine, would you guys like to have one of the thrones from Dark Crystal to keep in your building?" Just for fun, because we have it in our storage facility and I said, oh god, yes, Mr. Henson. And I rented a van and drove down to New York and picked up with some friends

• 4:09Conan O'Brien?

  of mine, this really cool, I think it was fiberglass, dark crystal throne and brought it back to the Lampoon Building in Cambridge. And I believe it's still there.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  Really? You think it's still there?

• 4:22Conan O'Brien?

  I think it's still there.

• 4:23Speaker 02

  Might have to make a road trip to go get it.

• 4:25Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, you guys should come take it because I don't trust those idiots who are looking after it. You know, probably, it's probably just holding a beer keg. But-

• 4:39Speaker 02

  A lot of the dark crystal stuff and the labyrinth stuff is really difficult to take care of, just due to the materials. So, some of it's not around anymore.

• 4:48Conan O'Brien?

  It's incredible. So you have a lot of Jim Henson stuff. That's amazing. Any other famous puppets that I would know?

• 4:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, we have Lamb Chop. We just got a Lamb Chop and Friends puppets, which Sona maybe you remember from our childhood days.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  I sure do.

• 5:04Conan O'Brien?

  Were you a Lamb Chop?

• 5:05Speaker 01

  I was.

• 5:06Conan O'Brien?

  What was her name? Her name was?

• 5:07Speaker 01

  Oh god, what was the Lamb Chop?

• 5:10Speaker 02

  Sherry Lewis.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  Sherry Lewis.

• 5:12Conan O'Brien?

  Sherry Lewis, very famous, yeah. And Lamb Chop was her puppet. Yeah.

• 5:15Speaker 01

  I remember Lamb Chop.

• 5:16Speaker 02

  Uh huh. And we have the Mystery Science Theater 3000 puppets.

• 5:22Conan O'Brien?

  Oh wow.

• 5:23Speaker 02

  Which you can see behind me.

• 5:24Conan O'Brien?

  That's, oh, look at that.

• 5:25Speaker 01

  Ahhh!

• 5:26Conan O'Brien?

  You just moved your head a little bit and Chucky is there.

• 5:30Speaker 01

  Oh my god!

• 5:31Conan O'Brien?

  Oh my god, look at Chucky.

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Yes, we have a Chucky.

• 5:34Conan O'Brien?

  You just buried the lead. You have Chucky. Is that the Chucky?

• 5:39Speaker 02

  It is the Chucky, a the Chucky. There are multiples. This one is from the newer TV show that was, I think, on SyFy. So it's a newer one. But yes, it is the Chucky. All of our puppets are originals, usually performed before they're gifted to us. So, yeah.

• 5:57Conan O'Brien?

  So, what about an average Joe puppeteer? Can they donate their puppet to your museum?

• 6:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, we have a process, but we do take acquisitions. We do acquire things. Um, and so, yeah, we have, uh, you know, in that 5,000 puppets, we have puppets from all over the world. You know, different puppetry traditions from all over the world, puppets that date back, you know, 1800s and, and... Um, so, yeah, people can, can call me, write me, and, and offer me their puppets.

• 6:28Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, this must happen sometimes. Someone comes to you and says, "I'd like to donate my puppet," and the puppet is... Oh, come on. It's, it's like a paper plate and they cut a mouth in it. And they, you know, it's just not good. Are you in the position of saying, "Uh, I think we're okay, where, but thank you so much"? Do you have to turn down puppets sometimes?

• 6:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, I do. I feel kind of bad doing it, but you're right. I mean, not everything is museum-worthy. As much as people want their stuff to last forever.

• 6:58Conan O'Brien?

  Okay, Micah, let me ask you this.

• 6:59Speaker 02

  You have to be selective.

• 7:00Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, would you ever, just to spare their feelings, say, "Thank you, this is such a wonderful piece," and then when they leave, feed it into a shredder?

• 7:07Speaker 01

  Oh, boy. Oh, come on.

• 7:09Conan O'Brien?

  What? What do you mean?

• 7:10Speaker 01

  We can't be shredding puppets.

• 7:11Conan O'Brien?

  Well, yes, you can.

• 7:13Speaker 01

  No, you can put them in a box, but you can't, why are you, why are you shredding them?

• 7:16Conan O'Brien?

  Because you gotta, it's gonna run out of space. If you, I'm just, I'm thinking you spare the old puppeteer's feel.

• 7:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, why are we shredding them? That was the go-to?

• 7:24Conan O'Brien?

  Okay, well, all right. Well, Micah, I mean, I think you're just repeating what Sona said, so... I think you secretly agree with me, but you know you wanna keep the puppet people on your side. Um, listen, yeah, I, uh...

• 7:37Speaker 02

  We dispose of them in an appropriate manner, I suppose.

• 7:41Conan O'Brien?

  Uh, sure. Yes, yes. We call that burning.

• 7:46Speaker 01

  Come on.

• 7:47Conan O'Brien?

  Uh, or just dip them in, be, I, you know, it'd be a good thing to do if you wanna get rid of puppets, is dip them in, uh, like a beef broth, and then throw them into a pack of dogs.

• 7:55Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. You could never work at a puppet museum.

• 7:58Conan O'Brien?

  I just, to see a, to see a puppet torn limb from limb, seconds after it was donated by a kindly old puppeteer.

• 8:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, to all those roaming back for dogs in the land.

• 8:10Conan O'Brien?

  And then he comes back, 'cause he left his wallet, and he's like, "Oh, no! My little gob-gob!"

• 8:15Conan O'Brien?

  Micah. You're awful. You're awful. Think about it, Micah. It's something you're gonna wanna do. And now that you've pictured it, you're going to do it.

• 8:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:23Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, let's say it's... You're working there late, which I'm sure has happened sometimes. And it's getting dark. And you're walking around. There must be... There must be times when you think...

• 8:35Speaker 02

  Where's this going?

• 8:37Conan O'Brien?

  There's a... I think I saw that Chucky puppet move. Come on.

• 8:41Speaker 02

  I do know.

• 8:42Conan O'Brien?

  But, I mean, it's... I mean, it's every third Twilight Zone. These puppets come to life.

• 8:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:49Conan O'Brien?

  And they menace you. Have you ever been a little paranoid being around these puppets at night? And be honest.

• 8:54Speaker 02

  Be honest. Yeah. Okay, well, there was one time where I did run and get a coworker. I'm pretty sure I heard a noise.

• 9:03Conan O'Brien?

  Of course you did.

• 9:04Speaker 02

  And no one else was in here. I'm usually in here by myself. And the lights turn off automatically, um, after a while if you don't move around.

• 9:12Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah.

• 9:12Speaker 02

  So, uh, yeah, I did have to ask my co-

• 9:15Conan O'Brien?

  Which puppet do you think was moving? Which... Be honest. Which puppet do you think was moving?

• 9:19Speaker 02

  Well, there's...

• 9:20Conan O'Brien?

  None of your lies. None of your lies. None of your chicanery or tomfoolery. Which puppet are you quite certain was moving?

• 9:28Speaker 02

  I... I think it was one of the Skeksis from the Dark Crystal.

• 9:32Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, god. Yeah, the Skeksis?

• 9:34Speaker 02

  Which is they're in a back room by themselves.

• 9:37Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah.

• 9:37Speaker 02

  And the light is always off back there. And I was walking back there, but the light doesn't turn on until I'm in the room.

• 9:43Conan O'Brien?

  Yup.

• 9:43Speaker 02

  It catches my movement. And as I was walking back there, but before I was in the room, I definitely heard it.

• 9:50Conan O'Brien?

  Was it like, "Here she comes, here she comes"?

• 9:54Conan O'Brien?

  "Oh, god, she's got beef buff." "Oh, look out."

• 9:57Speaker 02

  I did feel a little silly when my coworker came in, obviously. Because nothing's going on.

• 10:02Conan O'Brien?

  Well, the thing is, these puppets aren't dumb. They know that when you bring someone else, they gotta clam up. So that's what they do. They freeze and they clam up. And then your friend leaves and they're like, "Nah, we're gonna get ya, we're gonna get ya."

• 10:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, let's all have Chucky right here behind me so that, you know, I figure if he's out in the open, I don't have to worry. I always know where he is.

• 10:23Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, why do you have your back to him the whole time, though? That's the thing you're doing, Micah, that I would never do. You have him loca- Chucky's right behind you, and I think he's holding a weapon. Is he holding a weapon?

• 10:34Speaker 02

  Yes, he is holding a knife, yes.

• 10:37Conan O'Brien?

  What the- Micah!

• 10:38Speaker 01

  But Miss Piggy is right next to him. Miss Piggy would fuck Chucky up. She would.

• 10:43Conan O'Brien?

  How do you know Miss Piggy isn't- doesn't also want to be freed from her human overlord? I mean, Miss Piggy might help. He might-

• 10:52Speaker 01

  There's no chance.

• 10:53Conan O'Brien?

  What are you talking about? Miss Piggy doesn't want to-

• 10:56Speaker 01

  Well, Miss Piggy would never do that. Miss Piggy would defend herself and everybody there, because she's Miss Piggy.

• 11:03Conan O'Brien?

  She is a puppet, too.

• 11:04Speaker 01

  No, but that doesn't matter. She knows who's right and who's wrong.

• 11:07Speaker 02

  But I don't think she would want to share the spotlight with Chucky.

• 11:09Conan O'Brien?

  Yes, okay, Micah, that's the first sensible thing I've heard today. She's a diva, and she wouldn't want, you know, Chucky to get all the press for being the murderer. So if anything, it's gonna be Miss Piggy who gets you, and Chucky who's just, you know, watching in horror.

• 11:26Speaker 01

  I don't like this blasphemy at all. Not when it comes to Miss Piggy. I wanted- do you ever brush Miss Piggy's hair?

• 11:35Speaker 02

  Um, no, I do occasionally have to fix the wigs that the puppets have, but I do like weird things. Like, I have to fluff Big Bird occasionally.

• 11:47Conan O'Brien?

  When you say fluff Big Bird, what are we talking about here?

• 11:53Speaker 02

  She gets flat, you know, I mean-

• 11:55Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, oh, I know. Oh, I know.

• 11:59Speaker 01

  Gets a little limp, you know?

• 12:01Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, so-

• 12:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, I have to fluff him a little.

• 12:04Conan O'Brien?

  Come on, we got a big shoot going on here, Big Bird. I'm gonna fluff you up.

• 12:09Speaker 02

  It's a strange thought.

• 12:10Conan O'Brien?

  Time is money, Big Bird. Time is money.

• 12:22Conan O'Brien?

  You know, winning an award, that's a big achievement, right?

• 12:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:24Conan O'Brien?

  Every now and then in life, maybe something nice like that comes your way. Winning them consistently is almost impossible. It just doesn't happen, you know? Well, guess what? Winning five times in six years? You know what that sounds like to me? Sustained excellence.

• 12:39Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 12:39Conan O'Brien?

  Hyundai has done just that, earning the title of America's best SUV brand for 2026 from US News and World Report. You are a very happy Hyundai driver.

• 12:48Speaker 01

  I drive a Hyundai Palisade and I love my car. I love it. I love driving it around.

• 12:52Conan O'Brien?

  I've been tooling around in an Ioniq 5 N, which I love. Beautiful car. Well, listen, whether you need an SUV for everyday life, your next big adventure, or extra room for family and friends, Hyundai has an option for you. The Tucson Hybrid is loaded with technology and built for everyday life. The Santa Fe Hybrid's fully capable and ready for adventure. The Palisade, that's yours, right?

• 13:12Speaker 01

  Hello.

• 13:12Conan O'Brien?

  They're gonna rename that the Sona. The Palisade Hybrid, yeah, delivers premium capability and class-leading interior space. With available, I have this memorized, H-Track all-wheel drive, up to an EPA-estimated 619 miles of range on vehicles like the Palisade Hybrid and Hyundai's industry-leading warranty. It's easy to see why Hyundai continues to deliver the quality, innovation, technology, and value drivers expect from an award-winning brand. View US News Best Cars at cars.usnews.com and call 562-314-4603 for complete details.

• 13:47Conan O'Brien?

  This fall, I want to try something different.

• 13:49Speaker 01

  What?

• 13:49Conan O'Brien?

  I like to change it up. I like to learn things, so I'm gonna try and make apple cider.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 13:53Conan O'Brien?

  Every morning.

• 13:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 13:55Conan O'Brien?

  This fall, just to see if I can do it.

• 13:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:57Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, fall's the perfect season to try something new, like joining T-Mobile.

• 14:01Speaker 01

  Oh, that's good.

• 14:02Conan O'Brien?

  See what I did?

• 14:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:03Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, there are 250 reasons to join T-Mobile right now. You want to hear what they are?

• 14:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:07Conan O'Brien?

  They're America's best network.

• 14:08Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 14:09Conan O'Brien?

  True story. Plus, T-Mobile has got off-grid satellite coverage. That comes in really handy. I like to just wander in the woods sometimes.

• 14:16Speaker 01

  Oh, that's weird.

• 14:16Conan O'Brien?

  When I'm thinking about, like, making apple cider, and that's when it comes in handy. Here's another reason. High-speed data in over 215 countries and destinations. I travel a lot for the

• 14:26Speaker 01

  You travel a lot.

• 14:26Conan O'Brien?

  Travel show that I do.

• 14:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:28Conan O'Brien?

  Stream this podcast while ignoring local landmarks. That's always fun to do. Like, oh, look, there's the Mona Lisa. Yeah, check it out. I'm in the Louvre. I should, but I'm listening to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend.

• 14:38Speaker 01

  That doesn't seem like a good idea.

• 14:39Conan O'Brien?

  It's a great idea.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 14:41Conan O'Brien?

  You know, you can see art anytime. But how often can you listen to this podcast?

• 14:46Speaker 01

  My god.

• 14:47Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah. Now, all these reasons make T-Mobile a great choice.

• 14:50Speaker 01

  I agree.

• 14:51Conan O'Brien?

  T-Mobile is stacking up reasons to join. Go to T-Mobile.com and find yours best. Based on analysis by Ookla of speed test intelligence data first half of 2026. Can't believe I read that. T-Satellite with capable devices in most outdoor areas in the US where you can see the sky. High-speed international data with qualifying plan. Visit T-Mobile.com, consult a physician. I just threw that in there.

• 15:15Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 15:19Conan O'Brien?

  With the US Bank Smartly Visa Signature Card, you earn an unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase. Huh, it's a good deal.

• 15:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:26Conan O'Brien?

  No quarterly activations, no categories to track, just unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase. Sona, just the other day, I bought you this antique wig stand.

• 15:37Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 15:38Conan O'Brien?

  And I didn't get cash back and I regret it now.

• 15:41Speaker 01

  Oh, okay. Well, that's a very thoughtful gift.

• 15:44Conan O'Brien?

  Do you wear a wig or is that your hair?

• 15:45Speaker 01

  Absolutely not. It's definitely my hair. And so it's kind of, it's kind of insulting you would buy that gift for me.

• 15:51Conan O'Brien?

  Well, I'll just return it anyway, but I do wish I got cash back.

• 15:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:54Conan O'Brien?

  Visit USBank.com/SmartlyCard to learn more. The creditor and issuer of this card is US Bank National Association. Pursuant to a license from Visa USA, Inc. Some restrictions may apply.

• 16:09Conan O'Brien?

  Sona, you have to admit, the holidays, it's really about hanging with the people you love.

• 16:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:15Conan O'Brien?

  And getting to be yourself, not going to some stuffy holiday party where you need to conform to what the man wants you to think about the holidays.

• 16:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:24Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, it's about being yourself. Turn your holiday time into Miller time by enjoying a Miller Lite in a place where you're free to enjoy yourself on a walk with a cousin. With a cousin? Why are they getting all specific about?

• 16:35Speaker 01

  Because it's family.

• 16:36Conan O'Brien?

  But what about a niece or a nephew?

• 16:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:40Conan O'Brien?

  Like a walk with an ex-wife? I don't know. I mean, they're just throwing, that's a weird, they just made a very specific choice.

• 16:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:47Conan O'Brien?

  Now's the time for those unexpected holiday side guests and enjoy a great tasting light beer. 'Tis Miller time, as Dickens wrote.

• 16:56Conan O'Brien?

  Miller Lite is brewed for taste, the taste you can depend on. The original light beer since 1975 and still iconic more than 50 years later. I like to be with my bros, my chums, my posse, crack open a Miller Lite, take a swig, a sip, look around and see my friends. We've known each other forever and we're just hanging out.

• 17:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, you guys are just doing chest bumps and high fiving.

• 17:17Conan O'Brien?

  Miller Lite is great taste done right. Go to millerlite.com/conan to find delivery options near you, or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. Tis Miller time. Celebrate responsibly Miller Brewing Company, Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces.

• 17:39Conan O'Brien?

  I'm gonna tell you the most horrifying sight I've ever seen.

• 17:42Speaker 01

  So bad.

• 17:43Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, uh, which is one time I was asked to do something on Sesame Street. This is, you know, could have been like 25 years ago. And I went over to, I think they were in Brooklyn or I went over to Sesame Street and they have to store the puppets wherever they can, cause you know, uh, space is, uh, limited. And they had lashed Snuffleufagus to the ceiling. Because it's a giant puppet and you've got to store it somewhere. And it was lifeless, inanimate, um, limp, uh, uh, Snuffleufagus. And it was lashed to the ceiling, like parts kind of hanging, but other parts secured with ropes.

• 18:23Conan O'Brien?

  And it looked like Hannibal Lecter had just, had gone psycho on Snuffleufagus and then nailed him to the ceiling in this ghastly, performative, behold, my proud masterpiece, my murder. That's what it looked like and it was the most horrifying thing I've ever seen. And kids were walking around, so kids could see it too. And I had to tell the kids, oh my God, I mean, I had to make sense of it to them. So I told them, he wasn't careful and he was murdered.

• 18:55Conan O'Brien?

  No. I had to think of something.

• 19:01Speaker 01

  That's not cool.

• 19:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:03Conan O'Brien?

  Well, at least I got us off of fluffing Big Bird.

• 19:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:07Conan O'Brien?

  And took us to the mass murder.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  It's not great to see the puppets not like they're supposed to look.

• 19:14Conan O'Brien?

  Right.

• 19:14Speaker 02

  We definitely got the puppets in somewhat poor condition. They had been used, obviously, for years and then in a warehouse. So, we did have to do a lot of work. So, part of my job is to make sure that they still look like the characters they're supposed to look like, so we don't, you know, destroy children's.

• 19:31Conan O'Brien?

  So, some of these puppets you get have been, you know, rode hard and put away wet. They're like, "These are fucked up puppets."

• 19:37Speaker 01

  Rode hard? Don't use different words!

• 19:40Conan O'Brien?

  No, I'm saying, they're like all worn out, they're all screwed up. You know what I mean? They've got holes in them.

• 19:45Speaker 01

  Wrote out.

• 19:46Conan O'Brien?

  What?

• 19:46Speaker 02

  Yep, holes.

• 19:47Speaker 01

  Holes in them?

• 19:48Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, moth holes, stuff like that.

• 19:50Speaker 02

  You know, dismembered sometimes.

• 19:51Conan O'Brien?

  Yes, yes!

• 19:52Speaker 02

  You know.

• 19:53Conan O'Brien?

  And so, I mean, it must be ghastly sometimes, the puppets you get. You know?

• 19:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, it's, you know, they're just puppets, but yeah. You kind of want Elmo to look like Elmo. You don't want him to be like...

• 20:06Conan O'Brien?

  No! It's like when...

• 20:08Speaker 02

  Hollow or something.

• 20:08Conan O'Brien?

  I mean, God forbid, but sometimes, you know, you have to go to a wake and the person, you know, was in a bomb accident and you just hope that the they're, they look like themselves, you know what I mean? Uh, so, and sometimes you are like the mortician for these puppets. You have to make them look presentable so their loved ones see them in the correct state and not like Snuffleupagus, all bashed, beaten and stabbed.

• 20:35Speaker 02

  Mortician, plastic surgeon, yeah. We do actually take needles to some of the foam latex puppets.

• 20:42Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 20:43Speaker 02

  Foam latex is a lot of the Dark Crystal Labyrinth puppets and it sort of dries out over time, so much like our skin as we age. Yeah.

• 20:52Conan O'Brien?

  So, the foam kind of dries up and they wither. These puppets wither and then you guys have to pump them up, yeah. Oh, my God.

• 20:59Speaker 02

  Sort of like Puppet Mottox.

• 21:01Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah.

• 21:04Conan O'Brien?

  Well, uh, and I just want to touch on this briefly because I know we don't have tons of time, but you're also very much into fanfiction. You love Harry Potter fanfiction, is that right? So sometimes when you're with the puppets late at night, and you're trying to calm down because you're nervous, because you're pretty sure you just saw, you just saw Chucky sharpening his knife. When, when you're in that situation, sometimes you read, uh, Harry Potter fanfiction and you're a fan of, what is it? Dryonamini? Dry- What did I say wrong?

• 21:37Speaker 03

  Is it?

• 21:37Conan O'Brien?

  Dryemini?

• 21:38Speaker 03

  Dremiany?

• 21:38Conan O'Brien?

  Dry- Dremiany? Oh, sorry for mispronouncing that. Oh yeah, you're right. Dremiany. That word we all just spit out.

• 21:49Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, I'm sorry. If I'm ever pulled over for a DUI and they ask me to say Drenomini, I'm just gonna say, hey, just take me, put me away for 30 years. Let's not even do the test.

• 22:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, I do listen to a lot of audio podcasts, audiobooks, and I got into, yeah, Dremiany fanfiction.

• 22:09Conan O'Brien?

  And that goes for-

• 22:10Speaker 02

  All day and-

• 22:11Conan O'Brien?

  Obviously Hermione and who, what's the first part?

• 22:14Speaker 01

  Draco.

• 22:15Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, Draco Malfoy. And why are, why are you or anyone else, why do you want to come? What is it about those two characters that is particularly appealing? Like, how come Harry Potter's not in this combo platter?

• 22:29Speaker 02

  Well, I think, cause, you know, who doesn't love a bad boy? And Draco's story didn't really get finished in the original. So I'll, you know, it's fun to see people's imaginations of where does that go after, you know, the end of the book.

• 22:44Conan O'Brien?

  I see.

• 22:45Speaker 02

  Where do those characters go as they become adults?

• 22:47Conan O'Brien?

  Do you think that Draco and Hermione could have a love interest? Is that what some of this, uh, fanfiction's exploring?

• 22:54Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 22:55Conan O'Brien?

  Is that a couple that could really exist? I mean, who did Hermione ended up with? What, what was his name? Hubbleby? Double, double?

• 23:01Speaker 03

  Ron.

• 23:02Conan O'Brien?

  What's that?

• 23:02Speaker 03

  Ron.

• 23:02Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, Ron, okay. So-

• 23:05Speaker 01

  The red head, yeah.

• 23:06Conan O'Brien?

  I don't know.

• 23:06Speaker 01

  Hubbleby?

• 23:07Conan O'Brien?

  It's been a while.

• 23:07Speaker 01

  I know. I'm just saying, I don't know. But I, I get what she's saying, because I love fanfiction too. And there's so much stuff that comes out of it. And it's just fun to like, you know, imagine two characters together and it's sexy.

• 23:21Conan O'Brien?

  So it's Drake, so- And so, oh, is there fanfiction where, where Draco and Hermione, uh, get it on? Is that, was that something that could happen?

• 23:29Speaker 03

  Guessing.

• 23:30Speaker 01

  I mean, if they're not, what's the point?

• 23:32Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, definitely. The first one that I read was Minocled, which is sort of a Handmaid's Tale meets Harry Potter fanfiction. So if you've read Margaret Atwood's Handmaid's Tale or watched the TV show.

• 23:43Conan O'Brien?

  Wait.

• 23:44Speaker 02

  It's sort of that situation.

• 23:45Conan O'Brien?

  Okay, okay, I'm trying to picture this. Uh, you know what's crazy? Behind you, behi- behind you, uh, Chucky just made the "cuckoo" with his hands. Get a load of this? Oh my god, here she goes again. Hey, does Drumble- does Dumbledore, does Dumbledore? Isn't he the wizard or something? Doesn't he?

• 24:10Speaker 01

  They're all wizards.

• 24:12Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, yeah, right. But he's like the head wizard that really dresses like a wizard. The rest of them dress like they go to, like, Oxford College. They're like, "Oh, look at me. Oh, I'm a wizard. Oh, really? Yeah, cuz I'm dressed like I go to Princeton." So,

• 24:29Conan O'Brien?

  do, um, he's like the guy that's committing to "I'm a wizard," you know? Uh, yeah, of course I'm right. I've not said one thing today that's wrong.

• 24:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're not wrong.

• 24:41Conan O'Brien?

  So, does Dumbledore ever walk in on Hermione and, uh, and Draco and be like, "What the hell's going on here?" Does that ever happen in these scenarios?

• 24:53Speaker 02

  So far, I've not read one where Dumbledore is in it at all.

• 24:59Speaker 03

  You could write a new one.

• 25:01Conan O'Brien?

  This could be a new one.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:02Speaker 01

  He's not the sexiest character.

• 25:05Conan O'Brien?

  Dumbledore? Well, it depends. Some people are into that. I don't know.

• 25:08Speaker 01

  Okay, well, clearly you are.

• 25:09Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah. Oh, yeah, I like him old and bearded. And wearing a mu-mu. So...

• 25:15Speaker 02

  People prefer to see Hermione end up with, like, you know, a potentially attractive character, like Draco is potentially attractive.

• 25:22Conan O'Brien?

  So is there a, I mean, this is, is, is there a consensus that Ron is just sort of a dud? Like, people are actively going out of their way to rewrite Harry Potter so that it's not Hermione and Ron. Ron? It's Hermione and Draco. Like, that's much more exciting. Don't you think?

• 25:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think so.

• 25:43Conan O'Brien?

  I mean, no offense to Ron, but he's a wet noodle, you know?

• 25:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly, exactly. He's no fun.

• 25:49Speaker 01

  Draco's a bad boy.

• 25:51Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, you can keep saying that.

• 25:52Speaker 01

  I'm just saying, you want there to be like, like love. It can't, they, they gotta, they gotta do it. And it has to be.

• 25:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, enemies to lovers is the thing.

• 26:02Conan O'Brien?

  What's that? What'd you say?

• 26:03Speaker 02

  You want the redemption arc. You want the enemies to lovers.

• 26:06Conan O'Brien?

  Yes, that's the redemption arc. And, and you don't get the redemption arc with Ron.

• 26:12Speaker 03

  I'm Ron.

• 26:13Conan O'Brien?

  You know what I mean?

• 26:14Speaker 01

  Are you upset because he's like the redhead and you kind of see it all in him?

• 26:17Conan O'Brien?

  Well, I don't like the way redheads are portrayed in those tales.

• 26:22Conan O'Brien?

  Oh, it's a bunch of brothers with red hair. What do they do? I don't know. One of them gets killed and two of them kind of are go nowhere. You know?

• 26:31Conan O'Brien?

  You know, they're bumbling, stumbling. They, they come from this goofy house. Yes, that's why I'm mad at these books. Redheads are completely ineffectual lovers. You know? Talk about needing a fluffer.

• 26:45Speaker 02

  I think you know more about Harry Potter than you're letting on. Have you been reading some Harry Potter fan fiction on that?

• 26:51Conan O'Brien?

  I read those books and I burned them because of the red haired depiction.

• 26:58Speaker 03

  Whoa, it's the Weasleys.

• 27:01Conan O'Brien?

  Hey, what name should we give the redheads? Oh, I have it. The Weasleys.

• 27:08Conan O'Brien?

  It's a shit show. All right.

• 27:11Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, I'm really happy that you're, uh, that you've, you've got, uh, your world involves both puppets and a reality where Hermione makes the correct choice, which is the blond haired evil guy over the red do-gooder.

• 27:30Conan O'Brien?

  Micah, I salute you. And I think of myself as a human puppet. Um, and I really am. I mean, most people look at my work and they think you're just a, a giant. I'm kind of like a snuffleupagus, a big goofy puppet, wouldn't you say?

• 27:44Speaker 02

  I would say more, I mean, you're famous for the string dance. So I'm thinking Marionette, you know?

• 27:48Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, Marionette. Yes, yes. Yeah. Well, I, uh, coming from you, that's a big compliment.

• 27:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. And you had Triumph, who was a puppet.

• 27:57Conan O'Brien?

  Puppet, yeah, there's a lot of puppets on the old show. Tomar the ostrich.

• 28:01Speaker 02

  Well, if they need a home, the Center for Puppetry Arts is here. We'll take them.

• 28:05Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, well, can you imagine Triumph in your museum? That would be a disaster, all night long. You suck! You suck, Chucky, you suck! I love smiling there. Hey, there's another redhead, Chucky. There's another redhead rounding out the stereotypes. Our one murder puppets, the redhead. Well, Micah, it's a delight to talk to you, it really is. Uh, you seem like a really nice person, and I love what you're doing, and I hope to meet you in person someday, that'd be fun.

• 28:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, you should come by the museum, we'd love to have you.

• 28:37Conan O'Brien?

  I wanna come by at night.

• 28:38Speaker 02

  And sign on everybody.

• 28:39Conan O'Brien?

  I'll get 'em.

• 28:40Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:41Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah, bring a little beef broth with me and some rottweilers.

• 28:46Conan O'Brien?

  Alright, Micah, I just threatened your puppets. I better get out of here.

• 28:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think we should end on that note.

• 28:51Conan O'Brien?

  Yeah. Bye, Micah, thank you, that was really good.

• 28:55Speaker 02

  Bye, thanks y'all, nice to meet you.

• 28:58Speaker 04

  Conan O'Brien Needs a Fan with Conan O'Brien, Sonam of Sessian, and Matt Gourley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sacks, Jeff Ross, and Nick Liao. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino, take it away, Jimmy.

• 29:15Speaker 04

  Supervising producer, Aaron Blair. Associate talent producer, Jennifer Samples. Associate producers, Sean Dougherty and Lisa Berman. Engineering by Eduardo Perez. Get three free months of SiriusXM when you sign up at siriusxm.com/conan. Please rate, review, and subscribe to Conan O'Brien Needs a Fan wherever fine podcasts are down.

• 29:43Speaker 05

  KitchenAid knows you didn't come to this family gift exchange just to participate. You came to win. Your brother-in-law brought a scented candle, cute. Your sister brought a wool sweater, amateur hour. But you, you're about to mix it up. You're gonna cause a stir.

• 30:00Speaker 05

  Because you brought the KitchenAid Stand Mixer. Exactly what Dad wanted. Move over, sis, there's a new favorite child in town. 'Tis your season to mix it up. Gift a KitchenAid Stand Mixer, make more than meals.