#2349 - Danny Jones

Danny Jones is the host of “The Danny Jones Podcast,” a program exploring the fringes of culture and the boundaries of free thought.www.youtube.com/dannyjones 50% off your first box at https://www.thefarmersdog.com/rogan! The ultimate wireless hack. Make the switch at https://visible.com/rogan Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  The Joe Rogan Experience.

• 0:12Speaker 01

  It's so fucking weird to be sitting here, bro.

• 0:15Joe Rogan?

  Is it?

• 0:15Speaker 01

  So strange. I feel like I've been like a video game observer and now I'm like in the video game.

• 0:22Joe Rogan?

  Are we on? You kinda are. I mean, it's weird. It's weird for me, you know?

• 0:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, bro. Well, thanks for, thank you for being like the number one promoter of my YouTube channel over the past couple of weeks, bro.

• 0:38Joe Rogan?

  My pleasure. It's great stuff, man. I watch it all the time. You're really good. You got great shows, man.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  I appreciate that, dude.

• 0:43Joe Rogan?

  And I get good guests from your show. Like, there's a couple of people that have been on your show that I've had on my show.

• 0:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Chris Dunn was the first dude, I think. And then you recently had Mary Bowden, a few others.

• 0:53Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah. Christopher Dunn, man, that was a wild one. And now that they've found these structures underneath the pyramid, it's kind of validating a lot of the things these people are saying. You know, there's a lot of controversy about what those structures are and what it means and how accurate the readings are. But they do know that those satellite images were able to show very accurately this one tomb that was 50 feet underground. And it showed the dimensions of this one tomb. So I don't know what the capabilities are, if it really can decipher what's under two kilometers of, you know, whatever is underneath Giza. But there's something going on, for sure.

• 1:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I had a dude on my show a couple of weeks ago who was explaining how that was a part of some YouTube channel that put something together in Italy, I think it was. And the people that were involved with it were promoting some sort of technology that had something to do with penetrating the ground, some like different kind of LiDAR or something like this.

• 1:51Joe Rogan?

  It's called, what is it called? Something tomography?

• 1:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:55Joe Rogan?

  Jim, you see what it's called? But these guys just did another explanation of it, like another deep dive where they did like this presentation and showed it. It's very convincing. Like, there's a lot of people that are 100% on board. I mean, it remains to be seen, it has to be vetted. But according to, you know, some people that I trust that really understand the technology, they said there's absolutely something there. You know, whether or not, the problem is they made those 3D detailed images of what it looked like, like sort of an artist's rendition. And you looked at those and it's got like the coils and the spirals, like, yeah.

• 2:32Speaker 01

  It looks a little too much.

• 2:33Joe Rogan?

  I don't know what that is. You could see there are coils around those columns, but what are they? Are they stairs? Is it like a coil that generates, like, an energy coil? Like, something that conducts electricity or carries electricity? Like, what is it?

• 2:46Speaker 01

  It's a solid-state electron harvester.

• 2:49Joe Rogan?

  Is that what they say?

• 2:50Speaker 01

  That's what Chris Dunn says. I don't know. I don't know.

• 2:52Joe Rogan?

  Have you talked to him about what's underneath?

• 2:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, he thinks that it was, uh, he thinks that the whole thing, his new book, which is called The Tesla Connection, basically explains that it's a, uh... He thinks that there was like a, a device in the subterranean chamber, like a hammer, that hammered the earth. And then the plane, the Giza Plateau is like, is active, seismically active area. And when it hammers the earth, it creates mini earthquakes. You're familiar with this, right?

• 3:18Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 3:18Speaker 01

  And it vibrates all the limestone.

• 3:21Joe Rogan?

  All the limestone, and it's got like this hammer, this effect, a dome, dome, dome. And it creates some sort of a vibration in the granite and the limestone.

• 3:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:30Joe Rogan?

  Okay, uh, the author has analyzed micro-movements within the pyramid typically induced by background seismic waves to achieve high-resolution, full 3D tomographic images of its interior, imaging of its interior and subsurface. The approach rendered the pyramid transparent, allowing for the reconstruction of internal objects and the discovery of previously unseen structures.

• 3:53Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 3:54Joe Rogan?

  So if it's got an, if it works and shows the actual internal structure of the pyramid accurately, and it can accurately depict that one, uh, the one, was it a temple or what was it that was? I feel like it was a temple. It was fifty feet underground. It had the exact interior dimensions of it.

• 4:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:15Joe Rogan?

  I mean, there's probably something to it, and we're gonna find out eventually, hopefully.

• 4:18Speaker 01

  You think?

• 4:19Joe Rogan?

  I don't know, man. These guys like, like guys like Zawei Hawass and these, these gatekeepers of this information, they do not want any groundbreaking new discovery to come out. They really don't.

• 4:30Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 4:31Joe Rogan?

  Especially something like that. If you really find out there's, there's giant columns underneath the pyramid, and that there's these structures that go down two kilometers into the ground, like, all bets are off then.

• 4:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:44Joe Rogan?

  Like, try explaining that away for people that live 2,500 B.C. Like, that's kind of kooky.

• 4:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, you know, the, the mystery of the pyramids and, you know, moving those blocks and building that fucking thing that long ago is crazy on one hand, but then, on the other hand, those fucking granite vases.

• 5:01Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 5:02Speaker 01

  That are so precise within like the deviation of a human hair.

• 5:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, this is a 3D print of one of them that Christopher Dunn gave me.

• 5:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's insane. It's insane. They measured these on light scanners at like a huge aerospace corporation somewhere, and they found out like it's so symmetrical, you couldn't make this unless you had a CNC machine.

• 5:20Joe Rogan?

  Right, and then how would you make the handles?

• 5:21Speaker 01

  Right, exactly, because it's a part of it.

• 5:23Joe Rogan?

  Right, it's not like you can even turn it on a lathe.

• 5:26Speaker 01

  Right.

• 5:26Joe Rogan?

  And it's accurate, how many thousandths of a human hair?

• 5:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it's like, yeah, I think it's like one one thousandth of a human hair, like completely undetectable.

• 5:36Joe Rogan?

  Bananas. And then there's also some of those sculptures that they made that look like they're 3D printed. I mean, they're incredible. Perfectly symmetrical on the left side and the right side, and we don't really understand it. And we don't know what technology they were using, what kind of tools they were using. It's, and it's hard to know, man. It's, it's hard to know, like, without, you know, when they burned the Library of Alexandria and they destroyed all the records, like, there's so much missing from the history of, of Egypt and how they did what they did.

• 6:06Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:07Joe Rogan?

  Just moving the stuff. How did you move it? How did you move those fucking enormous stones? Like, what did you do?

• 6:14Speaker 01

  Have you heard of, uh, this dude named Jeffrey Drum? He has a channel called The Land of Kem. He lives, he lives in Egypt. He lives, uh, like, I think, right across the street from the pyramids. And he's basically got this very...

• 6:27Speaker 01

  Interesting theory that it was all chemical manufacturing and the pyramids were chemical manufacturing plants and I am gonna like butcher this description but I'm gonna do my best. Basically, what he found was that in a bunch of the other pyramids, like the red pyramid and some of the other pyramids, he's been in there and gone through them all. And he's basically, what they describe when they go in there is this smell, which some people equate to being like bat shit. But what he thinks is going on is it's creating some sort of like a chemical reaction in those chambers to create fertilizer. Because there's a subterranean chamber below those where they have like all kinds of, they were putting shit in there, like animal shit down there.

• 7:10Speaker 01

  And then there's also these like ravines, these like cut out channels that come out of the bottom of the pyramid and there's these bowls that were supposed to collect like chemicals. So he has this really elaborate theory on how, which I, when I heard him tell me this, it made so much sense, but the problem was like, it makes sense, it seems super reasonable, but like, why build these massive structures that are so precise just to make chemicals? And, you know, he was explaining like the agriculture and like why they needed to create fertilizer and um.

• 7:46Joe Rogan?

  Why'd they need the massive stone structure?

• 7:48Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 7:49Joe Rogan?

  Right, exactly. Isn't it possible that things also had one, they like they built them and then someone used them later on for different purposes? Isn't that possible as well?

• 8:01Speaker 01

  I think so.

• 8:02Joe Rogan?

  Like instead of it being built for that, like maybe they just used it for that eventually?

• 8:06Speaker 01

  That's possible, yeah. But it seems like the way he was describing the interior though of that, of the red pyramid was like he, it was reverse engineered to actually create the chemical that they would have needed to. Enhance the agriculture of the area. Huh. Like, they showed it. They actually created it in a, in a lab with like, using the chemical process. I think there was like, some Nazi scientists involved in this, of course. Of course. The recreation of it.

• 8:34Joe Rogan?

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• 9:15Joe Rogan?

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• 9:58Joe Rogan?

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• 10:42Joe Rogan?

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• 11:19Joe Rogan?

  the answer to that is yes obviously so try the farmer's dog today and get 50% off your first box of fresh healthy food plus get free shipping just go to thefarmersdog.com/rogan this offer is for new customers only yeah well Christopher Dunn stuff was all about them creating hydrogen right mm-hmm yeah that was that's what he felt like the whole thing like was generating hydrogen and that's what he thought the whole those columns that went down those passages that went down and then there was the porous limestone that was at the end that seeped through and he believed that this was all like some sort of a chemical

• 12:02Joe Rogan?

  reaction that they had to doing this here what is here Jamie

• 12:06Speaker 01

  oh the red pyramid was okay both as a power plant to produce ammonia from methane and nitrogen that's what it was

• 12:11Joe Rogan?

  Fritz Haber won the Nobel Prize about a century ago yeah the Haber process Fritz Haber is a crazy story do you know that story

• 12:20Speaker 01

  no

• 12:20Joe Rogan?

  okay Fritz Haber

• 12:23Joe Rogan?

  He devised a method of extracting nitrogen from the atmosphere. And for that, he was winning a Nobel Prize at the same time in which he was being wanted for war crimes. Because he also created Zyklon gas. So he created the gas that they were using to spray on the Allies. So they would get this gas and spray it with fans. This is the first time they'd ever done something like this, used gas in warfare. And they used, and he was a Jew. And they used, he created Zyklon A, which was then converted to Zyklon B.

• 13:03Joe Rogan?

  So Zyklon A had a very disgusting smell to it, so you knew it was coming. And then Zyklon B, they used during the Holocaust to gas the Jews. And it had no smell. So they, yeah. So the thing was initially made as a pesticide. I think that was the initial, let me see what it says there.

• 13:27Joe Rogan?

  Oh, this is different. We're not talking about Fritz Haber.

• 13:29Speaker 03

  This is about the, how the Egypt thing would have been the same thing.

• 13:31Joe Rogan?

  Okay, well, we'll get to that. But the Fritz Haber thing, you know, he was eventually exiled from Nazi Germany because he was Jewish. Like, they allowed him to stay initially, in the beginning, because he was so valuable, because he had done so much. And because he did create this gas that they were using to gas the Allies.

• 13:52Joe Rogan?

  And then, you know, but imagine, guy's up for a Nobel Prize at the same time where he's wanted for war crimes.

• 14:01Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. And because he was doing all this, his wife commits suicide. She shoots herself in the chest. He leaves her and his 13-year-old son to go to the front line while she's struggling for her life, like she's still alive. She eventually dies. He leaves her, yeah, it was, the whole thing's horrific. And then he dies on the run. So he dies, I think he had a heart complication, which, duh, how much stress was that guy under? Right? And then he leaves Nazi Germany when, you know, the shit is going down, he's on the run, and he winds up dying on the run. I think he was dying on his way to try to seek medical care.

• 14:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, bro, that, uh, I mean, the story of what those fucking Nazis were doing is bananas.

• 14:47Joe Rogan?

  It's insane.

• 14:47Speaker 01

  You had Annie on here and she talked about, uh, what was going on when she tried to interview some of those guys that were still in Germany. I think she tried to interview like the grandson of one of the dudes that she wrote about. Uh, I can't remember his name right now, a dude with like a huge dueling scar on his face. And this guy like wanted nothing to do with his grand, with his father or whatever. And, uh, you know, she had these documents that she found when she went to Germany. And she was like, she, I guess she found a bunch of notes or whatever that he wrote to his son. When he came, when, after he went to America with Paperclip. And his grand, or this was his grandson, I think.

• 15:24Joe Rogan?

  Operation Paperclip, for people listening, is they, they shipped over a bunch of the best Nazi scientists and brought them into NASA and some other departments at the end of the war.

• 15:33Speaker 01

  And the grandson wanted nothing to do with his father. He like detested him, his father, with every fiber of his being. And she was showing him the notes and like showing him like the humanity of the guy. The guy was torn between like being this scientist contracted to do all this crazy shit for America. But he still loved his wife and son, on the other hand. And he was like, he was so just torn apart by the fact that he had to leave them behind. And then she showed the dude the documents. And then Annie J. Gibson fricking high-tailed it out of there with all that secret Nazi shit, like didn't get caught. Which is incredible.

• 16:08Joe Rogan?

  Oh, it's just wild, the stuff they were working on. Like, how were they so advanced? And why were they so obsessed with the occult?

• 16:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:16Joe Rogan?

  You know? It's like all that Indiana Jones stuff, that was kind of legit. Like, they were really interested in the occult. Yeah.

• 16:24Speaker 01

  Interdimensional aliens. What's Alex think about that? Interdimensional child wrestlers.

• 16:28Joe Rogan?

  I haven't talked to him about that. We, we have talked about Operation Paperclip, but only in regards to like Werner von Braun and, you know, they were in like deep denial about that. But the Simon Wiesenthal Center said that if Werner von Braun was alive today, he would be prosecuted. He'd be prosecuted for crimes against humanity. Yeah, he wouldn't, when he was running his rocket factory in Berlin, he would take the five slowest Jews and hang them.

• 16:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:52Joe Rogan?

  From the front of the, the, the factory, so that as you're walking in, like, this is what happens if you move slowly. And that was the head of NASA, who supposedly got us to the moon.

• 17:02Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. Speaking of the moon.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  Have you seen that documentary called Room 237?

• 17:10Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 17:11Speaker 01

  I just watched it last night.

• 17:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 17:13Speaker 01

  Fucking bananas.

• 17:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's bananas. The, the connections between Kubrick's The Shining and the moon landing and all the hidden stuff that he did, all the Easter eggs.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:24Joe Rogan?

  Including the little boy with the NASA shirt on, the Apollo shirt on.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Apollo 11 shirt on, and then the key to the room 237 said Room N, instead of N-O-237, it said Room N-237, so you could... Bro, I mean, I am like...

• 17:39Joe Rogan?

  What does that mean?

• 17:40Speaker 01

  So like, if you take the letters R-O-O-M and then N, you can re-combobulate them to say moon.

• 17:46Joe Rogan?

  Oh, God.

• 17:47Speaker 01

  Like, there's so much dot connecting in that fucking, in that documentary, it's absurd. There's an absurd level of dot connecting that just is, is unreasonable, but... The stuff about the moon, though, like the kid wearing the Apollo 11 shirt, right?

• 18:01Joe Rogan?

  The number of the door is the distance from the Earth to the moon.

• 18:04Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:04Joe Rogan?

  In miles.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:05Joe Rogan?

  Thousands of miles.

• 18:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it's like a thousand miles short.

• 18:08Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  And then, like, also the psychological, uh, trauma, the, the scenes with Jack and his wife saying like, "Don't you know what a contract is?" Where he's like living his double life and he's like arguing with his wife and talking about contracts and secrecy and all this stuff. And then, uh, and then, you know, there's that, there's so many weird things, and like the ball rolls up to Danny on the carpet.

• 18:32Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 18:32Speaker 01

  And then it cuts, and then it cuts back to him, like picks up the ball, and the carpet shape is different. There's so many like strange easter eggs in there.

• 18:40Joe Rogan?

  What's that supposed to signify?

• 18:42Speaker 01

  I have no idea. It's just like another, it's just, either that movie has like an insane level of like uh continuity errors, or he was doing something.

• 18:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, he was probably doing it on purpose. You know, Kubrick in his spare time would do complex mathematics. In his spare time. Yeah, he was like a legitimate genius. And it's amazing that he pulled off the greatest science fiction movie of all time.

• 19:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:06Joe Rogan?

  Especially at the time, during the exact same time period where the moon landings were filmed. And the stuff from 2001 is more sophisticated, looks better than the stuff from the moon landings. So like the idea that you couldn't fake it. It's like, that guy could fake it. 100% he could fake it.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  Right.

• 19:25Joe Rogan?

  And if they hired him to fake it, if they brought him aboard, the idea that he wouldn't be able to keep secret. Like, of course he could.

• 19:32Speaker 01

  Right.

• 19:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, people keep secrets. This idea that people can't keep secrets because some people can't keep secrets, like, listen, high level military guys keep secrets all the fucking time. They go to the grave with those secrets. Yeah, they swear to secrecy, they swear to an oath. You know, they have top secret clearance and above and whatever it is and they don't say shit forever. Their whole fucking family doesn't know what they're doing. Yeah.

• 19:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, the uh, the thing about them, like if you, if you, if you think the moon landing was fake, you're a moron. But it's, it's like, the thing about it is, if they, even if you want to say they did go to the moon, wouldn't it be uh reasonable to suggest that they would have had a backup plan in case they couldn't get there, like,

• 20:16Joe Rogan?

  Sure.

• 20:16Speaker 01

  like have some sort of a video footage that they, they shot or whatever?

• 20:19Joe Rogan?

  Well, not only that, they filmed a lot of training footage. And they, they definitely tried to pass some of that training footage off as legit. That's proven. Like the Michael Collins from

• 20:32Joe Rogan?

  Gemini, I forget what mission it was, it was a spacewalk. So, there's an image of him that was in training and, you know, he's got the suit on and the wires and he's, you know, working with the space suit that you use when you're actually in, you know, outside of the capsule, or whatever the fuck they call it. And what they did was, from the training mission, they just blacked out the exterior of the same photo and reversed it. So they switched the photo the other way, blacked, it's the exact same photo, the exact same photo, and they tried to pass it off as Michael Collins on the spacewalk. Because you gotta think, like, how are they taking pictures? Who's gonna take the picture of him out there?

• 21:11Joe Rogan?

  This is part of the problem with, I think it was Apollo 12 or 13, whichever one it was, where they got the footage of the lunar module leaving the moon and going back towards the orbiter, and it looks so fake. It looks so fake, it looks so ridiculous, there's no plumes of fire, it like, how does it have the power, where's the engine?

• 21:36Speaker 01

  They used car batteries, right? On that thing, allegedly? That's what Bart Sabrell says.

• 21:41Joe Rogan?

  It's still 1/6 of Earth's gravity, it's still a significant amount of gravity. It's not the same gravity as Earth, but how does that thing like shoot off into space? Like, that's nonsense. It looks, it looks like it's being pulled by strings.

• 21:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:54Joe Rogan?

  And the camera, which is operated, you know, remotely, pans perfectly to catch it, like, shut the fuck up. And how are you getting that footage, like, what are you doing? This is 1969, you're on the phone with Richard Nixon from the moon? Are you out of your fucking mind? Is this supposed to be real?

• 22:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 22:11Joe Rogan?

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• 22:52Joe Rogan?

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• 23:18Speaker 01

  Right in the middle of Operation Paperclip, MKUltra, the Cold War, all the fucking deception that was going on, all the secret-

• 23:25Joe Rogan?

  They lied about everything.

• 23:27Speaker 01

  That was the time in history where they probably had the most fucking lies.

• 23:30Joe Rogan?

  Vietnam War, they lied about everything. So the idea that they didn't lie about this one thing, the moon landing was all 100% legit. Meanwhile, you've got intersecting shadows, you've got all sorts of problems, you've got... The weirdest one is Neil Armstrong's 25th anniversary speech that he gave at the White House.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 23:50Joe Rogan?

  That one's so crazy. "We have here among us America's best and brightest. You will achieve great things." Great, but once you reveal some of truth's hidden layers-

• 24:01Speaker 01

  Once the hidden layers are uncovered-

• 24:03Joe Rogan?

  What? How about just say, "I went to the moon 25 years ago"? Like, what is all this cryptic talk?

• 24:07Speaker 01

  That was the only time you ever did a public talk, I think about it.

• 24:09Joe Rogan?

  Well, the other thing is the post-flight press conference. The post-flight press conference looks like these guys have a gun to their head. It looks like a hostage video. It looks so weird.

• 24:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:19Joe Rogan?

  And people say, "Oh, they were nervous. They just got back from the moon." Bro, look at Katy Perry. She went basically a little bit higher than her airplane and it was like a life-changing experience. She's holding up a daisy. "It was amazing. I feel so connected to Mother Earth." You know, like, these guys would have been ecstatic.

• 24:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:37Joe Rogan?

  The idea that they would've been nervous as if they'd been forced to lie, their behaving- Like, behavior experts have looked at that footage and said, "These guys are being deceptive."

• 24:46Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 24:47Joe Rogan?

  Particularly Michael Collins. There's also inconsistent things with what he said during the post-flight press conference right after flying in comparison to his 1994 book.

• 24:57Speaker 01

  Changes story, right?

• 24:58Joe Rogan?

  Changes the story about being able to see the stars. "What were the stars like?" And he's like, "I don't know."

• 25:03Speaker 01

  Don't remember that.

• 25:05Joe Rogan?

  And then in the 1994 book, it talks about how amazing they were and incredible.

• 25:09Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 25:10Joe Rogan?

  The footage that Sabrell acquired that shows that it appears that they covered up the windows to make this deceptive film that looks like they're far into space. That's a weird one, man, because I can't find any rational explanation. It's like, I tried to look at it like as objectively as possible, because I've gone back and forth on the moon thing. Like, at one point in time, I thought, I'm just being really stupid, like, of course they went to the moon. Everybody would know about this. And then over, like, I joked about it in my comedy special, like, after COVID, I'm like, I don't think we went to the moon. But that's kind of true. Like, once I saw the level of deception that was willfully pushed forth during COVID, and how many people were cooperating with this?

• 25:54Joe Rogan?

  And like, how many organizations, government organizations were cooperating, knowing that they lied? Knowing that these were lies? I'm like, yeah, they can, they can lie about all kinds of things. And this is today with the internet, you know? Like, look, where's the Epstein files? Boo, can't find them, don't exist. Like, they can get away with shit, man.

• 26:12Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 26:13Joe Rogan?

  And the idea that they couldn't in 1969? Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. They could fake that. It'd be easier to go to the moon than it would be to fake it. Shut the fuck up. No, it wouldn't.

• 26:25Speaker 01

  Right.

• 26:26Joe Rogan?

  Not if you physically can't get a human being through the Van Allen radiation belts without them dying. They never even flew a chicken through those fucking things and had it come back alive.

• 26:35Speaker 01

  Russia flew a dog and it came back and died two days later, I think.

• 26:39Joe Rogan?

  They, but they didn't even go to deep space.

• 26:41Speaker 01

  No, they just, I think they just went into the belt and then did a U-turn.

• 26:44Joe Rogan?

  Bro. No one's ever been close.

• 26:47Speaker 01

  Have you seen the, I'm sure you've seen this, the photo of Jolly West hanging out on the set of 2001 Space Odyssey?

• 26:55Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 26:56Speaker 01

  You haven't seen it?

• 26:57Joe Rogan?

  No. Oh, that's amazing.

• 26:59Speaker 01

  Should I send it on?

• 27:00Joe Rogan?

  Fuck, yeah, send it to Jamie.

• 27:01Speaker 01

  Oh, my god.

• 27:02Joe Rogan?

  Do you have his number?

• 27:03Speaker 01

  Uh, no.

• 27:04Joe Rogan?

  I'm here.

• 27:05Speaker 01

  Well, you could probably Google it.

• 27:08Joe Rogan?

  See if you can find it if you Google it.

• 27:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, just Jolly West, Stanley Kubrick, 2001 Space Odyssey. It's a photo of them walking between the sound stages and it's a wide shot of a bunch of dudes.

• 27:20Joe Rogan?

  Listen, man, of course they...

• 27:22Speaker 01

  That's not it, that's not it.

• 27:23Joe Rogan?

  Of course they would contact Kubrick if they wanted to go to the moon and fake it.

• 27:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:27Joe Rogan?

  And of course, if Kubrick was... If you're in the middle of the Cold War, which they were, which is very terrifying.

• 27:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 27:33Joe Rogan?

  Right, when I was a kid, when I was in high school, we were terrified of Russia bombing America.

• 27:39Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 27:39Joe Rogan?

  Everyone was like really concerned and Russia was the great enemy. You know, the, the video of Khrushchev yelling, "We will bury you", like that was like burned into every American child's mind. And if you were a patriot and you wanted to defeat Russia, and we have a strategy to defeat Russia, and this is what we're gonna do, we're gonna, first of all, we're gonna bankrupt them by just making them spend to keep up with us. And they don't, they don't have a capitalist society, so they don't, they don't really have a GDP. Like, well, they have a GDP, but they don't have like the same sort of corporate structure that we have in America, where they're like striving and innovating and developing new things, the companies are getting bigger and there's more growth and... No, they're communist, they were a communist country, so everything was like food lines and... They didn't have the, the kind of money that we have.

• 28:24Joe Rogan?

  It wasn't even close. So Reagan essentially bankrupted them. And then, you know, during the time, and you know, all the other people before him as well, but during the time where they were developing these, these rocket ships, the Russians were way more advanced than us. And basically, every single thing. They got to space first, put the first man in space, put the first satellite in space, and they couldn't even come close to putting a guy on the moon.

• 28:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's amazing, it's, it's, uh, it's incredible also that, uh, there was never another nuke that was sent to anybody after Fat Man and Little Boy.

• 28:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's incredible.

• 29:00Speaker 01

  It's really, it is really insane to think about sometimes.

• 29:03Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's one of the great achievements of human beings. We did it once and we said, let's not do that again.

• 29:10Speaker 01

  Annie's book about nuclear war scared the living shit out of me, bro.

• 29:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's a good one.

• 29:14Speaker 01

  How she said that we have 11 interceptor missiles in the US.

• 29:18Joe Rogan?

  That's it.

• 29:18Speaker 01

  A total, I think it's, I think it's 11 or maybe 22, or no, it's 44.

• 29:22Joe Rogan?

  And Russia has 5,000 missiles.

• 29:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, and the problem with it is like if a rogue nuke got launched from North Korea from one of their submarines, it would have to fly over the North Pole, right, towards us. And as soon as they launch it with all of our satellite systems that we can detect the thing, the rocket burner like going into orbit, we'll know within five minutes of them launching it, probably before. And then we literally have to, I guess, the way she described it was, our policy is, once that nuke is launched, we have to empty our silos, our ICBM silos, because they're stationary. They can't, if they're hit, they're gonna, they're gonna try to take us out at those ICBM sites. That's gonna be like one of their first targets. So use it or lose it. You have to launch all those ICBM nukes and then we have to fly

• 30:05Speaker 01

  those over the North Pole, over Russia, to hit North Korea. And it takes like 11 minutes. So like, you gotta get Putin on the phone in 10 minutes saying, yo, these nukes aren't coming for you, bro. They're going for Kim Jong-un.

• 30:17Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god.

• 30:18Speaker 01

  And then by that time, it's like, if you don't have like a perfect communication amongst all these world leaders, everyone's gonna be launching nukes.

• 30:25Joe Rogan?

  Well, you know the story about that one Russian military guy that was the reason why Russia didn't launch a retaliatory strike? Because there was a-

• 30:33Speaker 01

  The submarine guy?

• 30:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. There was an error and they thought the United States had launched a missile towards Russia and they were ready to respond.

• 30:40Speaker 01

  Wow. That's Jolly West in the background, bro.

• 30:42Speaker 03

  It's unconfirmed if it was him. I don't know if anyone confirmed it.

• 30:45Speaker 01

  That's, if you can find a young photo-

• 30:46Joe Rogan?

  Zoom in on him, zoom in on him. Let's zoom in on him right here.

• 30:49Speaker 03

  I saw the video where someone's talking about it and that's-

• 30:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, that's him, bro.

• 30:52Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 30:53Joe Rogan?

  What are you talking about? You don't know. Jamie works for the government, by the way. Jamie CIA. That's 100% him. Look at that picture. Now go to the other picture you just showed. That's him.

• 31:03Speaker 01

  That's Jolly West.

• 31:04Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's him, dude. I mean-

• 31:05Speaker 01

  Nothing to see here?

• 31:06Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that is 100% him. That's the exact same face. Shut the fuck up.

• 31:11Speaker 01

  Find another one, corroborate it.

• 31:13Speaker 03

  That's all, I'm just, I don't, I don't think.

• 31:15Joe Rogan?

  Out of all the people that I wish were alive that I could talk to, Kubrick is number one on that list.

• 31:20Speaker 01

  Really?

• 31:21Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I think so. Yeah, first of all, he made some of the most impactful. Well, I would like to talk to Jolly West too, if he'd be willing.

• 31:27Speaker 01

  Fuck.

• 31:28Joe Rogan?

  Be a few people.

• 31:29Speaker 03

  See, I don't feel like they look the same.

• 31:30Speaker 01

  Dude was everywhere.

• 31:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that looks like him, Jamie.

• 31:33Speaker 03

  They look similar.

• 31:35Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it looks like him.

• 31:36Speaker 03

  And he doesn't look like that guy.

• 31:37Speaker 01

  Look at that guy, look at the far left photo. I mean, I mean, it seems, it seems pretty close.

• 31:41Joe Rogan?

  Jamie, that's him, shut the fuck up.

• 31:42Speaker 01

  Hairline is identical. Look at the hairline.

• 31:44Joe Rogan?

  Jamie's a party pooper. Jamie's a total party pooper.

• 31:47Speaker 03

  I'd like to, I want good evidence. There's a little part right here on that guy's head, and that guy's got a part.

• 31:52Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god, he combed his hair different, crazy.

• 31:57Speaker 01

  I hate when facts don't line up with my theory.

• 31:59Joe Rogan?

  The part in the second one is exactly the same. That one right there is exactly the same.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, that is.

• 32:03Joe Rogan?

  He started losing his hair and he started doing a little bit of a comb over.

• 32:05Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 32:06Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Um, look, man, that guy was one of the biggest pieces of shit in the history of the United States government. What he did was nuts. Just, just the fucking Manson stuff was nuts. The MKUltra stuff was unbelie- and imagine you could do all this stuff, no one's investigating you, no one even knows. It's all completely top secret. Congress has no idea you even exist in this realm. And they were running around doing like-

• 32:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was talking to Hamilton about it. I'm like, dude, isn't that crazy, all the stuff they were doing with MKUltra? Hamilton's like, uh, no. Of course those guys were doing that shit.

• 32:41Joe Rogan?

  Who's Hamilton?

• 32:42Speaker 01

  Hamilton Morris.

• 32:43Joe Rogan?

  Oh, Hamilton.

• 32:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 32:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that guy, of course.

• 32:46Speaker 01

  He's like, of course they were doing that, bro.

• 32:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, I mean, look, if you have some unique compound, like LSD, and, you know, gets to, you know, Hoffman discovers it, and then they start experimenting, like, what can we do with this stuff? And then you, you find it has profound effects on the human mind, of course you're gonna try to use it for mind control. They had already experimented with all sorts of techniques in regards to, um, doing it with prisoners, like, taking prisoners and trying to figure out, like, what kind of sleep deprivation, what kind of, what psychological techniques can you use to extract information from them? So if you had something like LSD, of course they're gonna try that. Makes sense.

• 33:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:29Joe Rogan?

  They were doing it way back into the 50s in the UK with those British soldiers. I'm sure you've seen that video. No, I have not. You've never seen that? No. They dosed up these soldiers with acid and then had them go out into the field and do these training routines. Yeah. Training exercises. No shit. And they couldn't do it. They couldn't, they, it, you see, you can find the video. It's hilarious. They, they were just laughing so hard they couldn't perform. Like, some of them were able to do their duties and other ones just fell to the ground. They were just laughing and rolling around the ground. Like, this is them. This is 64. These guys are high on acid. Is that what it says, Jamie? Did you just say, make it smaller again so you can see it? Uh, yeah, 64. Royal Marines. So, look at these poor guys. The men begin to relax and giggle. What the fuck are we doing here, bro?

• 34:11Joe Rogan?

  They probably didn't even tell them, and this guy freaked out. He had to be removed. He's holding that lady's hand. I love you. I think you're amazing. We're all connected. God is real. There is no death.

• 34:24Joe Rogan?

  And they fucking, he's aiming the missile. He's like, he's aiming this fucking, this cannon. Look at these people. Yeah. Not, they're bunching indecision as they enter a wood. Almost immediately, the section commander tried to use a map. He couldn't read the map. They're just tripping balls. Oh, my god. It's so funny that they try, look at their smile on their face. These guys, guy's got his hand over his head like, what is going on, man? And then they're supposed to be doing these exercises. Radio communication. Look at this guy, dude. Difficult if not impossible. He's like, fuck this. Oh, no. Fucking real. This guy's just laying down, laughing, having so much fun. He tried to chop a tree down using only a spade.

• 35:08Joe Rogan?

  No, the sense of responsibility in spite of physical illnesses. But one hour into, oh. Hmm. Imagine what they're doing now. Those guys are dead. There's a, yeah.

• 35:20Speaker 01

  The DARPA, um, that DARPA grant that went to University of North Carolina to figure out how to take the psychedelic trip out of LSD, I think it was.

• 35:28Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 35:29Speaker 01

  They're trying to make super soldiers, right? They're trying to make them so they can, this is what I've heard, is that they are trying to make them more effective on the battlefield.

• 35:38Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 35:38Speaker 01

  With things like edge detection.

• 35:39Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 35:40Speaker 01

  And also coming back, like, get back out there, like, like, take them through the, take them through the process, let them recoup and get right back out on the battlefield. To where, uh, you know, if you could, if you could get all the benefits of a psychedelic without the trip.

• 35:55Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 35:56Speaker 01

  Would you get those benefits and would it be useful for soldiers in combat? You know, it's an interesting idea.

• 36:02Joe Rogan?

  Well, the Vikings took mushrooms, the Berserkers, they would take mushrooms before combat. Yeah. I mean, it ma- it does make sense. It really does. It doesn't make sense to us because we think of mushrooms as like, you know, hey man, I'm gonna go connect with God and it's gonna be peaceful, I'm gonna land a field, it's gonna be amazing, I'm gonna reset and come back and tell everybody I love them. You know, that's what mushrooms are to us, but if you live in an insanely warlike culture and you believe it's right to go to battle and you're supposed to go to battle and Odin is on your side and you take these mushrooms to summon the strength of the gods and to prepare yourself for battle and there's, I know a lot of guys who fight on mushrooms.

• 36:44Speaker 01

  Really?

• 36:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah, like Joe Schilling talked about on the podcast, he, he fought, he took like a small dose and was sparring and then fought a few kickboxing bouts that way. He said he could see what guys were doing before they were doing it. It's almost like he could, and Joe Schilling's a world champion, like an elite kickboxer, like one of the best ever. And so for a guy like that to say that had a profound effect on him, he knows, he knows his body, like he's battle hardened. He knows the difference between regular fighting and fighting on mushrooms. He said he could see, he could almost like know what they were gonna do before they did it.

• 37:21Speaker 01

  That's wild.

• 37:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 37:22Speaker 01

  They, um, there's this dude who is like, I, I heard about Dana Beal who's flying ibogaine to the troops in Ukraine, to the Ukrainian troops, trying to get those guys on ibogaine. And meanwhile, the Russians are on, uh, what's that meth throw? There's like a new age meth that they're on.

• 37:37Joe Rogan?

  There's a new age meth?

• 37:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's a new version of it.

• 37:39Joe Rogan?

  The new version of what the Nazis?

• 37:40Speaker 01

  It's not puritan. It's like a new version of it. It's like a little bit, it's a little bit tamer.

• 37:45Joe Rogan?

  Adderall.

• 37:46Speaker 01

  I guess, maybe.

• 37:47Joe Rogan?

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• 38:30Joe Rogan?

  Don't think wireless can be so transparent, so Visible? Well, now you know. Switch today at visible.com/rogan. Terms apply. See visible.com for plan features and network management details.

• 38:43Speaker 01

  Maybe like super Adderall, but uh...

• 38:46Joe Rogan?

  Adderall. Do you know how many million prescriptions of Adderall are given in this country every year?

• 38:51Speaker 01

  Gavin Mcginnis told me before I came here, I was like, "You got any advice for Joe Rogan?" He's like...

• 38:55Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Gavin Mcginnis!

• 38:59Speaker 01

  He said slam three beers and eat an Adderall. I was like, "No, bro."

• 39:03Joe Rogan?

  That sounds like what he would do. Yeah. He came, did you ever see the time he came in dressed like Michael Douglas?

• 39:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course.

• 39:09Joe Rogan?

  Walking down? Walking, what is it? What was the movie?

• 39:12Speaker 01

  Uh, I forget the name of the movie, but yeah.

• 39:14Joe Rogan?

  Freaked out? When Michael Douglas like had enough?

• 39:16Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. Yeah. No, he uh, he slams beers 24/7. He's constantly drinking Budweiser. I've never seen him without a Budweiser in his hand.

• 39:26Joe Rogan?

  How it works?

• 39:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:27Joe Rogan?

  Is he great? Oh, he's a smart guy. Yeah, he's a funny guy, too. He just, the Proud Boys thing was just, if he had never done that, he would be like, well, a famous commentator today. Like you think about like, like Steve Bannon, all these other guys, like he's way funnier than any of those guys.

• 39:43Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 39:43Joe Rogan?

  He's very insightful. Like, he's right about a lot of things. He like picks up on trends and culture and sees where people are going and, and he was aware of like the dangers of Marxism and a lot of this fucking ridiculous leftist ideology that they were pushing in universities, like way before anybody else was.

• 40:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, um, there was this documentary that just came out about, all about him from one of the guys, Thomas, that used to work for Vice. He was like one of the original reporters for Vice. He did all like of the early stuff and he made this documentary all about Gavin. And it's like focuses on the transformation from like early punk rock, like liberal Gavin in the UK with like the mobs and the rockers to like the current Gavin, which is like, you know, he frames him as this like this super right wing racist dude. And, uh, you know, I was asking Gavin about it because he came on the podcast recently. And, uh, he's like, I've always been the same. He's like, he, he was explaining that his views never changed.

• 40:40Speaker 01

  He was saying that like Vice, all of a sudden was getting infused with millions of corporate dollars. And I wasn't a good look for that. They didn't want me in there. But meanwhile, he was like the whole soul of Vice. Like if there was no Gavin, there was no Vice. Like all the controversial do's and don'ts shit and like all those controversial articles about like trans and trans shit. Early in like the early 2000s that he was doing was funny. And like culture didn't look at it the way it looks at it today, you know?

• 41:10Joe Rogan?

  Well, he was being attacked for things that are like openly discussed today, like the dangers of trans ideology. And that these are just men and a lot of these men are doing it because they're perverts. And so they're, they're, they're autogynephelix and you know, autogynophilia is a real thing. It's men who get sexually aroused and pretending that they're women and they want to go into women's spaces and be sexually aroused. You know, um, now people are saying that openly, right? Like, um, was it, what was the university that, uh, Leah Thomas was swimming in?

• 41:41Joe Rogan?

  Penn? Okay. So they have to take away all of air quotes, her gold medals. It's a guy like has a penis, has sex with women supposedly, uh, according to Tony Hinchcliffe. That's my number one source of news. Um, but he actually has a bit about it. It's really funny. But the- The university now has to apologize to all the women that were forced to compete with them. And, you know, say they fucked up and never do it again and not allow biological men to compete with women. Which is like, it should be, that should be a left-wing perspective. Not that you shouldn't be able to be trans. Of course, you should be able to do whatever you want. You know, I'm for you doing whatever you want if you don't hurt other people. Right. If you really believe you're a woman and, look, if you can get fake tits and you can get fake lips and you can get a dick enlargement and like,

• 42:27Joe Rogan?

  do whatever you want to do. I don't care. Do whatever you want to do. I'm covered with tattoos. I've made stupid decisions. Like, do whatever you want to do. But, uh, when you're competing with women, you are essentially victimizing these women. You're, you're forcing these women to compete with men who've been through puberty. And in this case, still have a functional penis, like, which is fucking bananas. That's a man. And just because you think you're a woman, you, you, physically, we know there's a difference. Yeah. I didn't know it was a giant problem until there was that fighter, Fallon Fox, who had competed twice against women without letting them know that this person was a biological male for 30 years. Fathered a child, the whole deal. I'm like, this is crazy. And that his response was, "It's a medical condition, so I don't have to disclose this."

• 43:12Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's medical information, which is just horseshit. Yeah. It's, it's crazy. And when I was saying that, I got attacked, like, over and over and over again. I go, "Whoa, this is from the left." Like, the left has no problem with a mentally ill man beating the shit out of women. Falsely claiming that they're, not even allowing these women to know. These women think they're gonna go compete in a low-level MMA fight. Like, a lot of them didn't look good. They like, didn't look like they were well-trained. And they're competing against a biological man without having any idea. One of them got a fractured skull. You know, it's like... That's when I would realize like, oh, this is just a cult.

• 43:54Joe Rogan?

  This isn't the left that I grew up with. You know, I grew up with parents that were hippies. And so like, my whole life I was left wing. I felt like that was the only way to be. But when you see the left allowing this bizarre loophole where perverts can pretend to be women.

• 44:10Speaker 01

  Right.

• 44:10Joe Rogan?

  Compete with women, fight with women, beat them up, be in their locker rooms, walk around naked with their dick hanging out. No one can say anything. Like, how did they switch? How did they flip it on its head that? Like, at any other time in history, if a man had a penis, was walking through a young girl's locker room, you'd be in real fucking trouble, rightly so. Because that's not a thing that you should want to do.

• 44:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:34Joe Rogan?

  That's a weird thing to want to walk around naked with your dick hanging out in front of a bunch of women. That's a creepy sexual thing, period.

• 44:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, unless you're like Nero, you're not doing that.

• 44:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, even Nero.

• 44:45Speaker 01

  Sick fuck. But like, another thing Gavin was pointing out, he showed me this New York Times, or not New York Times, this Time Magazine cover from like a couple of months ago. And it was all about how tomboys are going extinct.

• 44:57Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:57Speaker 01

  You've seen that?

• 44:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  It's incredible.

• 44:59Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, because they're turning them all into boys.

• 45:01Speaker 01

  They're cutting their tits off and turning them into boys.

• 45:02Joe Rogan?

  Cutting their tits off and then giving them fake dicks. I was watching this operation today.

• 45:07Speaker 01

  You watched an operation?

• 45:09Joe Rogan?

  I watched, excuse me, I should say this. I was watching a video on the post-op. I saw images of the operation, that was enough. But it was this poor person who decided they wanted a pee standing up. That was all they wanted from this fake dick. So they have these enormous scars on their leg where they take a giant chunk of flesh out of your thigh and roll it up and make a penis out of it. And they had to do it to both legs for some reason. Maybe one of them didn't work real well, but...

• 45:33Speaker 01

  How old was this person?

• 45:34Joe Rogan?

  They sounded young. They didn't show their face. You know, it's fucking insane because a lot of these people unfortunately are autistic. And then there's this other factor, when you give them testosterone, it does alleviate anxiety. Because all of a sudden, you know, you have this new hormone in abundance in your system.

• 45:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:52Joe Rogan?

  And you feel different. You feel better. You feel more confident, which is like the same way men feel when they have more testosterone. It's like, then all of a sudden you're like, oh, this is who I was all along. Like, no one... No, no, you're taking a fucking compound that's forcing your body to change. Like, this is not who you were. You're not affirming your identity. You're doing something that's altering your hormonal structure and turning you into a man. Like, it might feel good, but this is not like your true self. This is crazy. Like, I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to do it. If you wanna do it, if you're a woman and you wanna take testosterone and be a man, or be more manly. I don't, I, I feel like, I don't know if it's the best decision for you, but I'm not you. And I'm, I believe in freedom. I believe in one hundred percent human freedom, as long as you're not hurting other people.

• 46:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:36Joe Rogan?

  My, my, my beef with it is like, it translated into them invading women's spaces. And, you know, that's crazy. That's crazy because you, you leave the loophole for perverts. There could be a lot of them, that legitimately trans people, that feel like they are in the wrong body. And they wanna live their life as a woman, and when they live their life as a woman, they feel healthier. They feel better. They're happier. And also, crazy people. And if you don't have a way of determining who is just a pervert, who just wants to hang out in the women's locker room and to show everybody his dick.

• 47:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:12Joe Rogan?

  And who is a legitimate, legitimate person with gender dysphoria. And then another, that's the other thing that like Tucker had a really good, good point about this. Instead, if someone has anorexia, you don't tell them, "Yeah, you're fat. Yeah, you're fat. You're right. You're correct." Even though you look like a skeleton, you need to lose weight. No, you tell them you are, you're mentally ill. This is incorrect. You're not overweight. In fact, you have body dysmorphia. You can't see what you really look like, which we know is a real condition. Like, it, it's a real condition with anorexia. It's even a real condition with bodybuilders. It's a real condition, a real condition when people get plastic surgery. Where they get crazy lips and crazy cheeks and they can't see it. They can't see it. They can't see themselves. It's nuts.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  They turn themselves into like all these girls, looking like Jar Jar Binks, walking around downtown.

• 47:57Joe Rogan?

  They look like monsters. They look like monsters. And it doesn't look good, and they keep tweaking and fucking with it. And they, they can't see it because it's a mental illness. It's the same kind of thing, like, the human mind is incredibly fragile. That's why Jolly West was fascinated with trying all these MKUltra techniques and different compounds on people's brains. Because human people can be manipulated, like, very easily, shockingly easily. Not all of us, right? Like, you and me are probably pretty skeptical, there's a lot of skeptical people out there. But there's a bunch of people that are not skeptical at all, they're super gullible, and when an ideology forms, they step in line, and they, they follow that ideology verbatim, to the line. They'll repeat the things that they're supposed to say to the line.

• 48:41Joe Rogan?

  Because they think that's what they're supposed to do in order to be in the good graces of this community that they find themselves in. It's a fucking cult.

• 48:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:47Joe Rogan?

  And there's a shit ton of cults, it's not just the Moonies, it's not just, you know, whatever, fill in the blank. It's all sorts of political ideologies, it's MAGA, it's, it's the far left, it's the, the people that are cheering for this guy in New York City that's a communist.

• 49:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, didn't he just promise a bunch of money for, uh, transition surgeries?

• 49:07Joe Rogan?

  Yay, hooray! Yeah, it's nuts.

• 49:09Speaker 01

  Government-run grocery stores and all that stuff? But he didn't win yet, he just, he won the primary.

• 49:12Joe Rogan?

  He's gonna win, dude. He has 100%, because the other guy is the fucking Guardian Angels guy. The other guy is Curtis Lebow, the guy who wears the goofy beret.

• 49:22Speaker 01

  Oh, really?

• 49:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's the guy who won the Republican side. Nobody wants to be a Republican mayor of New York City because they know they can't win.

• 49:27Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 49:28Joe Rogan?

  So they're not, like-

• 49:28Speaker 01

  This guy's to the left of Bill de Blasio.

• 49:30Joe Rogan?

  Oh, he's way to the left, yeah. And he's young, and he's energetic, and he's saying all the right things for all these kids that are in the streets, that are protesting. You know, they think they want to make the world a better place, which, hey, I would have been doing it with you if I was 20.

• 49:42Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 49:42Joe Rogan?

  It's all the same thing, man, it's all the same thing. You can get indoctrinated into a particular way of thinking without being objective about what's actually going on. You know, all these, these people that are, like, just running through the street now, uh, saying, "Free Iran." Like, yeah, free Iran from a dictatorship, absolutely. But if you're saying, like, wear scarves over your head and being forced to do what the Iranian government wants you to do, and live like they live over there, no, they don't live free.

• 50:09Speaker 01

  Right.

• 50:09Joe Rogan?

  Like, they, they assassinated the fucking Olympic gold medalist in Russia, in, in wrestling, rather, in, in Iran, because he was protesting against the government. They don't think national heroes and kill them openly. Like, it's not a good place to live.

• 50:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 50:23Joe Rogan?

  You know, and I'm not saying we should bomb them, but, like, being in support of Iran, the Iranian people, yeah, for sure. But that government is nuts, man. It's like, you know- Trans people for Hamas. You know what I mean? Like, there's, there's people that are just, they're not seeing what you're talking, they're not seeing the big picture.

• 50:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's so many contradictions out there, man, it's really hard to follow it all.

• 50:46Joe Rogan?

  Just cause it's a cult.

• 50:47Speaker 01

  And there are, and I think a huge amount of the Iranian population supports Israel too. And it's like, you would never fucking know that unless you like, talk to them or listen to some of these interviews of these people.

• 50:56Joe Rogan?

  A ton of Persian Jews that moved to Los Angeles. You know, that was like, at the fall, I guess it was in the seventies when, uh, so this is the story for people that don't know about Iran. So, there was a gentleman who was democratically elected, I forget his name, Mogh, what is his name? Moghmad, mm, I'm gonna fuck it up. So, he decided that he was gonna nationalize oil in Iran. And they got him out like that. They installed the Shah and turned it into an Islamic dictatorship, but they had access to the oil. So, the CIA and the, the British government and everybody conspired to get rid of this democratically elected guy.

• 51:37Joe Rogan?

  Cause Iran at the time was like, you, women were wearing shorts, or skirts rather, walking down the street, it looked cool. Here it is. Uh, Mohammed Mosaddeq.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  Mosaddeq.

• 51:49Joe Rogan?

  Mosaddeq, okay. So, let's, let's zoom in on the story here. It says, uh, Iranian Prime Minister Mohammed Mosaddeq was removed from power in a coup organized and financed by British and US governments. The Shah quickly returned to take power and signed off over forty percent of Iran's oil fields to US companies. It's crazy, man, it's like, it's so transparent, they didn't even wait a couple of years. They didn't even, well, the Shah's in power now, we'll see how things go.

• 52:15Speaker 01

  Right, right.

• 52:16Joe Rogan?

  No, they immediately came in and signed everything off.

• 52:18Speaker 01

  Yup.

• 52:18Joe Rogan?

  Nineteen fifty-three, the CIA and British intelligence orchestrated a coup d'etat at the top of the democratically elected government of Iran. The government of Mohammed Mosaddeq, uh, the aftershocks of the coup are still being felt. Fifty-one Prime Minister Mosaddeq roused Britain, Britain's ire when he nationalized the oil industry. So, the oil, they weren't making money off the oil, they were making money, but not as much money as, uh, the British were. Hmm. Well, it had been exclusively controlled by the Anglo Iranian Oil Company. The company later became known as the British Petroleum. This time it's different, though. BP, which is the, they're the same people that dumped all the oil in the Gulf. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. That's BP. After considering military action, Britain opted for a coup d'etat.

• 53:01Joe Rogan?

  President Harry Truman rejected the idea, but when Dwight Eisenhower took over the White House, he ordered the CIA to embark on one of its first covert operations against a foreign government. And Iran's been fucked ever since. Mm-hmm. I mean, we've been doing stuff like that, not we, not you and I, not me and Danny Jones, we're innocent. But the United States government, especially the intelligence agencies in the days, uh, you know, before they assassinated Kennedy, you know, they were, they were doing all kinds of wild shit. Oh, yeah. And this is- We're done now, we don't do that anymore, they don't do that shit anymore. They definitely don't. No. No. They would never, they don't care a shit about the oil over there. No, this government's America first now, we're legit. America first.

• 53:41Joe Rogan?

  This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them, are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee-free. No monthly fees, no overdraft fees, and thousands of fee-free ATMs. But here's the real kicker, if you get their Chime card, it gives you 5% cash back on a category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate, crazy high, it's nine times the national average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/Rogan. Takes a few minutes to sign up.

• 54:27Joe Rogan?

  Chime is a fintech, not a bank, banking services and Chime card, provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details.

• 54:41Joe Rogan?

  This episode is brought to you by LifeLock. Scams have gotten smarter because criminals use AI to flood you with fake texts, emails, and phone calls that are designed to be more convincing than ever. One wrong click could put your personal information and your identity at risk. So protect yourself with LifeLock. LifeLock helps detect and alert you to threats. And if your identity is stolen, LifeLock will step in to fix it, guaranteed or your money back. Dedicated US-based identity restoration specialists will work with you until your identity is restored, backed by the million-dollar protection package with up to $3 million in coverage for eligible losses and expenses.

• 55:23Joe Rogan?

  Visit lifelock.com and save up to 30% your first year with the promo code JRE. That's promo code JRE, or go to lifelock.com/jre for 30% off. Terms apply. It's crazy history. And when you don't know the history, you go like, why are we mad at the Iranians? Well, why are they mad at us? Okay, like, what did we do to them? Like, why, how did, how did these Islamic jihadists come to power? Like, where did it all start? Well, go back to the Mujahideen. We literally changed their definition of jihad. Like, we wanted them to become suicide bombers. We wanted them to do things and martyr themselves.

• 56:07Joe Rogan?

  So we, it was, the original definition of jihad, look this up, but I'm pretty sure it was a war against your own vices. Really? Yep, yeah, the idea was you were trying to be a good Muslim, a pure Muslim. You were trying to avoid impure thoughts, no alcohol, all these different things. And they twisted that around with jihadists and through the CIA and Osama bin Laden and the Mujahideen to fight off the Soviet Union. Right. When the Soviet Union occupied Afghanistan. Like Osama bin Laden was our guy. Right. He was working for us. Yeah. And he's like, these fucking people suck. Yeah, there was this story how his pancreas failed.

• 56:49Joe Rogan?

  A struggle against the enemies of Islam, a spiritual struggle within oneself against sin. Greatest jihad, yeah. It sounds great. Isn't that interesting? A spiritual struggle within oneself against sin.

• 57:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean.

• 57:04Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 57:05Speaker 01

  Just reading it, it sounds like.

• 57:06Joe Rogan?

  So it seems like it's more than one definition.

• 57:08Speaker 01

  There's probably so many.

• 57:09Joe Rogan?

  The other one is declared a jihad against the, scroll back down again. Uh, struggle or fight against the intimate enemies of Islam. So it's two things. But they made it, you know.

• 57:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:21Joe Rogan?

  They, they, they did a lot of mind fucking to those people and they put them on a war that they couldn't win. Again, to try to do the same thing that they were doing with the rocket program with everything else. They were trying to outspend the Soviets. They were trying to bankrupt them.

• 57:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, that part of the world is just like, how much of it has to do with the fact that we've been occupying that area? That, that part of the world for so long and like going out there, killing all the bad guys. And then the kids seeing their families being slaughtered. And then like, okay, we're going to eliminate terrorism. Let's take out these bad guys. But then the kids grow up and you realize it's just the Hydra. You cut the head off and three grow back.

• 58:01Joe Rogan?

  Well, if you want to be even more cynical, we pay them and we arm them.

• 58:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 58:06Joe Rogan?

  And we left behind billions of dollars of shit.

• 58:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:09Joe Rogan?

  In Afghanistan that they use for parades now. They drive down the street with our tanks. They have our Black Hawks flying overhead.

• 58:17Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 58:18Joe Rogan?

  It's all the shit we left. Billions of dollars.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 58:21Joe Rogan?

  Like you couldn't have got that out? Well, do you think they leave it there so that these people are always formidable and they always leave open the door to go back in?

• 58:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:29Joe Rogan?

  I think so. I think that's, I don't think that's the primary reason why they did it. But I've got to assume that that would be on the table if it's been on the table in the past. Arm, arming people in the past has always been a thing that we do. I mean, there's a Bill Hicks joke about Iraq. You know, it's like, they have the most deadly weapons. How do you know? Well, we looked through the receipts.

• 58:53Joe Rogan?

  I butchered the joke, but.

• 58:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 58:55Joe Rogan?

  But. You know, we've always been doing that.

• 58:57Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 58:58Joe Rogan?

  We've done that forever.

• 58:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's the, what's the, my favorite Bill Hicks joke, at least, I don't, I'm not like a historian on Bill Hicks, but the one where he's talking about the sock puppets. He's like, I like this guy on the right, he seems like he fits my, my ideas. He's like, I think I fancy the guy on the left. He's like, what the fuck, the same guy's holding both the puppets.

• 59:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 59:15Speaker 01

  I mean, that's perfect, perfectly illustrates the way, the way it is.

• 59:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and again, this was before we really knew things. This was, Bill Hicks was saying this in the 1990s, where we just had books. So, you know, it was, it was really hard to get these ideas across. He would have been a great podcast guest.

• 59:31Speaker 01

  Oh, hell yeah.

• 59:32Joe Rogan?

  You know, because he was like saying these things when no one even knew what he was saying. You know, and he was putting it into comedy. You know, like, people then were not nearly as aware of the manipulation of money and power. They really thought, a lot of people thought, that the will of the people, you know, the president, we gotta get a good president in there, they're looking out for us, and they didn't really understand that it's all being bought and paid by special interest groups, large corporations, huge donors, and that when the guy gets in there, he's just representing the same thing, no matter what.

• 1:00:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, the amount of reading and insight and learning that that guy was, a lot of those dudes were able to do back then, pre-internet, is astonishing. And to be able to like internalize and process those ideas and rework them with draft after draft and refine it into like the most perfect way to communicate it to people, to where it lands, you know, it's just, it's fucking crazy. And in today's day and age, it's almost like, you would think it would be easier with all of the access to information, but it seems like it might even be harder because there's just too much information. Like last night, listening to you talk was fucking incredible, dude. Like, listening to how you were at the end doing this, like, Q and A with the crowd, you're like, ah, I ran out of jokes, who wants to ask me questions? And you, like, you were just...

• 1:00:46Speaker 01

  On another gear dude, it's like you're so high octane and you're so like up to speed with everything that's happening around the world at all times. It's it's mind blowing to me how you're able to do this stuff, how you're able to stay up, do comedy late, do podcasts every day and be like up to speed with all the news and like have like thought out, like thought through a lot of these things that just happened yesterday. I'm just fascinated by that dude.

• 1:01:10Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's all I do, you know, when you do, when you only pay attention to fascinating things, like things that are interesting to you and they're also interesting to the audience, but I mean, I don't have a regular job, right? So this is my job, this is my job to kind of pay attention to stuff, you know, and have opinions on things and then the tricky thing is taking those opinions and trying to make them funny, you know, trying to like put it in a way that's going to be hilarious on stage.

• 1:01:35Speaker 01

  What do you think about the, uh, that this Diddy thing that just happened this morning?

• 1:01:38Joe Rogan?

  Kind of crazy, you know, I'll tell you what Kurt Metzger called this from the beginning and especially when he found out that Comey's daughter was going to be the, uh, the judge. Did you know that?

• 1:01:49Speaker 01

  No, I did not.

• 1:01:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wasn't she the same judge on the Ghislaine Maxwell case?

• 1:01:55Speaker 01

  Oh, yes, I did hear this.

• 1:01:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah. Bro, where's the videos? They were telling us the videos are going to come out incredibly high profile people doing horrendous things, evil things, people are going to go to jail, people are going to be shocked.

• 1:02:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:09Joe Rogan?

  Where? Nothing, well, zero.

• 1:02:11Speaker 01

  My thing about the Diddy thing is like, I don't really give a fuck. These people are all, they're of age, they're over, they're like 18 years old and is it shitty what he's doing trying to like use people and leverage them and to do these weird sexual things and like sick shit, just the most sick shit you could possibly think of. But like the way I I look at it is these people are using this Diddy stuff, it, all it does is like take away from the real child trafficking that's going on with like underage kids, right? There's like what 300,000 something like missing kids, like talking about Diddy and his oil parties with these 18 year olds, like do I think it's good?

• 1:02:55Speaker 01

  No, I I want to beat up their dad, but other than that, I don't really give a fuck if there's like 18 to 19 year olds that are doing this stuff, as long as they're not being like. Actually like physically raped, but I mean, it seems like what's going on is just like this weird cultish thing where they they slowly get you get creeped tor creep closer and closer and closer to this thing like, oh, I'm here now. All these famous people are here. They're doing this like.

• 1:03:19Joe Rogan?

  Elaborate parties, lots of money, everything you want, the golden carrot at the end of the stick. So the thing is, he's not even being charged for any of the things you just brought up. He's not being charged for blackmail, which is kind of crazy because like, what did they do? Why did they tell us that there was all these videos of all these high profile people and then silence? And then it never comes up once during the trial. There's none of that stuff in the trial. In the trial, it was his ex-girlfriend Cassie. They were talking about. So like, he's he's up for these two charges left and it's like prostitution, something. It's like nothing stuff. It's like stuff that he's gonna go to jail for like five years, if at all, and probably won't. And he's already been in jail for, it's like, what is time served now? It's over a year, right?

• 1:04:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, I think he's gonna walk, dude. I mean, I don't think he's gonna spend any time.

• 1:04:05Joe Rogan?

  And this is what Kurt Metzger called a long time ago. As soon as he saw that it was Comey's daughter, he was like, oh, he's gonna walk. Trust me, he's gonna walk. There's a bunch of high profile people that are connected to this. They're covering it all up. If he goes down, they go down. So he's not gonna go down. Right. So that's the thing, like, if if he really if he really did have like really wealthy, high profile people at his parties, which we know he did. You know, did he prosecutors abandon multiple allegations against rapper days for trials end? Hey, he says, hey, remember I called it? This is Kurt Metzger on Twitter. Because James Comey's daughter is the prosecutor. Remember how well she slept up swept up on the Ghislaine trail?

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:04:45Joe Rogan?

  Hey, who else called it?

• 1:04:46Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:04:46Joe Rogan?

  I can't be the only one. Yeah, he called it.

• 1:04:48Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:04:48Joe Rogan?

  He called it in the fucking, he called it in the fucking green room of the mothership. Right when he found out. He goes, he's gonna walk. I'm like, what are you talking about? Have you heard these these charges?

• 1:04:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:59Joe Rogan?

  He's going to go to jail.

• 1:05:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:02Joe Rogan?

  No, Metzger was right.

• 1:05:03Speaker 01

  Mm hmm. Yep. And then we, I don't know what happened with Ghislaine Maxwell.

• 1:05:07Joe Rogan?

  They could fake the moon landing? Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. They they've got videotape and all of a sudden they don't. You know, you have the director of the FBI on this show saying there's no, if there was. Nothing you're looking for is on those tapes. Like, what? Why'd they say there was thousands of hours of tapes of people doing horrible shit? Why'd they say that?

• 1:05:29Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:05:30Joe Rogan?

  Didn't Pam Bondi say that?

• 1:05:32Speaker 01

  What, are you talking about Epstein or Diddy?

• 1:05:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Epstein.

• 1:05:34Speaker 01

  Epstein. Yeah, she said it literally, I think, a week before you had the FBI director sitting here telling you there was nothing, right?

• 1:05:39Joe Rogan?

  She said something about that there was like thousands of hours of tapes of people doing horrible crimes.

• 1:05:45Speaker 01

  There is. And didn't the FBI dude say that there was nothing? Cash Patel said there's nothing you're looking for.

• 1:05:50Joe Rogan?

  Oh, okay. Okay. I mean, what am I gonna do? I'm gonna push back?

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  Right, no, of course, I understand.

• 1:05:56Joe Rogan?

  He's saying what he has to say.

• 1:05:58Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:05:58Joe Rogan?

  Mystery surrounds the Jeffrey Epstein files after Bondi claims tens of thousands of videos. Tens of thousands. Jesus Christ.

• 1:06:06Speaker 01

  Tell you what.

• 1:06:08Joe Rogan?

  Oh, my god. Was reviewing tens of thousands of videos, the wealthy financier with children or child porn. The comment made to reporters the White House days after a similar remark to a stranger with a hidden camera raised the stakes for President Donald Trump's administration to prove it has in its possession previously unseen compelling documents. Or just bomb Iran, and everybody forgets about it.

• 1:06:33Speaker 01

  Just bomb Iran, yeah.

• 1:06:34Joe Rogan?

  Everybody forgets about it.

• 1:06:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, it seems crazy that we're just, like, you would, I would think just Trump's demeanor, his MO towards other countries, like, if we're the ones funding them, giving them all this money, and they're trying to fight a war, like, typically, he would be putting their boot, his boot on their neck, like, listen, you motherfucker, like, he's talking shit, right? Like, you have to do what I want you to do. And it just seems like and now, I think it just came out a couple of days ago, that, um, they're trying to prosecute Netanyahu, right? And then Trump's helping with it, I think, trying to help him, Netanyahu, and that, and that whole rigmarole.

• 1:07:13Joe Rogan?

  Well, they're trying to try him while he's, yeah, while he's in office.

• 1:07:17Speaker 01

  Right, and I think that like-

• 1:07:18Joe Rogan?

  And he's trying to delay it because he's like, look, we're at war.

• 1:07:20Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:07:20Joe Rogan?

  And they decided to go through with it.

• 1:07:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I think something came out, I think, a couple of days ago, I could be wrong, but I was listening to, uh, I was listening to Dave Smith talk about how Trump was actually, like, helping him through this. I don't know, I could be wrong.

• 1:07:32Joe Rogan?

  Okay, here it says, "During a Fox News Channel interview in February, Bondi suggested an alleged Epstein client list was sitting on her desk."

• 1:07:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:41Speaker 01

  Well, the list is one thing, right? I mean, there's so many people on the list that are probably innocent. But I...

• 1:07:47Joe Rogan?

  Right. They just went to the island for a party.

• 1:07:49Speaker 01

  No, there's gotta be a fucking hard drive.

• 1:07:50Joe Rogan?

  There's gotta be.

• 1:07:51Speaker 01

  Sitting in Tel Aviv right now.

• 1:07:53Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's...

• 1:07:54Speaker 03

  Listen to the other part of this too. Uh, they asked Ghislaine Maxwell's lawyers what their...

• 1:08:02Speaker 01

  He had like a hundred cameras in that penthouse in every single house.

• 1:08:07Joe Rogan?

  Do you know his house is for sale in New York?

• 1:08:09Speaker 01

  That's amazing.

• 1:08:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and...

• 1:08:11Speaker 01

  She made that a podcast studio.

• 1:08:12Joe Rogan?

  No, my wife found it on Trulia or whatever it is.

• 1:08:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:08:15Joe Rogan?

  One of the maps. And she's like, "Look at this beautiful..." Because we were in New York.

• 1:08:18Speaker 01

  The townhouse?

• 1:08:19Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, like, it's not a townhouse. It's a house. It's like, it's a big ass house. It's like multiple stories.

• 1:08:25Speaker 01

  The one right across the street from Central Park?

• 1:08:27Joe Rogan?

  Uh huh.

• 1:08:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:08:28Joe Rogan?

  That one. It's for sale right now.

• 1:08:30Speaker 01

  How much?

• 1:08:31Joe Rogan?

  I think it was like sixty or seventy million. Something like that, which is what it's worth, but who wants to live in the Epstein house?

• 1:08:39Joe Rogan?

  First of all, if I bought that house, I'd want the Clinton painting. Can you get me that painting?

• 1:08:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:43Joe Rogan?

  Clinton in the blue dress.

• 1:08:44Speaker 01

  It's gotta come with all that shit inside.

• 1:08:45Joe Rogan?

  I have to have that painting. I want George Bush with the Jenga towers and the paper airplanes. I want all of it.

• 1:08:52Speaker 01

  And then the lady just died too. The lady got hit by a car, one of the witnesses.

• 1:08:55Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:56Speaker 01

  One of the Jeffrey Epstein witnesses. And then apparently she had like a husband who was abusing her. And, uh, you know, people like to... It's just like, people like to use this stuff as like a political football to like argue.

• 1:09:08Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:09:08Speaker 01

  For whatever they believe in.

• 1:09:10Joe Rogan?

  And also, when you get rich, powerful people... So, here's the thing that happens with rich, powerful people. They can't go anywhere, right? If you're like, say, a Jeff Bezos type or someone who's like an Elon Musk type. Let's just... And I'm not accusing them of anything. I'm not saying... I'm just saying, at that caliber of celebrity and that caliber of prominence, you can't go anywhere. If you're Bill Clinton back in the eighties or the nineties, whatever it was, you can't go party, you know?

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:09:36Joe Rogan?

  Everybody knows who you are. You gotta be protected, right? But you want these experiences. And so you have these guys, like a Jeffrey Epstein type guy, who works with the elite of the elite clientele. It's all movie stars, big time politicians, world leaders, scientists, Nobel Prize winners, and they all meet together and have fascinating conversations and cocktails, and there's beautiful girls everywhere. Of course. What a great idea.

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:10:00Joe Rogan?

  And if you're naive and you don't understand honeypots...

• 1:10:02Speaker 03

  Here's the quote from Maria Farmer, who was one of the accusers from what was inside the house in New York.

• 1:10:08Joe Rogan?

  Okay, she said, uh, there were monitors inside this cabinet. I looked on the cameras and I saw toilet, toilet, bed, bed, toilet, she said, visibly spooked. Like, I'm never gonna use the restroom here and I'm never gonna sleep here, you know what I mean? It was very obvious that they were like monitoring private moments. Yeah, of course.

• 1:10:27Speaker 01

  Maria Farmer was the one who worked at Epstein's office in New York, I think.

• 1:10:31Joe Rogan?

  This was the house, Jamie?

• 1:10:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, I was looking up stuff on the house, that was like what they found in the house.

• 1:10:35Joe Rogan?

  The house still has fucking cameras in it somewhere that they haven't found yet.

• 1:10:39Speaker 03

  Definitely, oh, you know, don't know.

• 1:10:42Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you'd have to scan the shit out of that house. You'd have to take the walls apart, there's probably listening devices inside the walls, like who knows? If this was like really an intelligence operation. Yeah, they probably had that house fully wired.

• 1:10:54Speaker 01

  Maria Farmer, I think she was the chick who was working the front desk at his office in Manhattan. Uh, this is like a funny example of like what I like to do. My mom is super left-wing, she's a, has her degree in fine arts.

• 1:11:05Joe Rogan?

  Oh boy.

• 1:11:06Speaker 01

  And, uh, she still is like an art professor. And my dad is a ex-post office worker. And he's, only watches Fox, so my dad only watches Fox, they're divorced. My mom only watches CNN.

• 1:11:17Joe Rogan?

  Jesus, why didn't they stay together? How weird.

• 1:11:20Speaker 01

  Who, who knows? And, uh, they, I, I like to like take things that are happening and then controversial things, like for Epstein example. And I like to just like call my mom and argue with her. Like argue my dad, argue the right-wing side against my mom's point of view on Epstein. And then I'll call my dad and I'll make the same argument toward, the opposite argument towards him. It's like a fucking, uh, thought experiment or like a, a critical thinking exercise.

• 1:11:42Joe Rogan?

  Use your parents to spar with.

• 1:11:44Speaker 01

  My mom, you know, she'll be like, of course, like, Trump, there's the, there's more footage of Trump with Epstein than anybody. Are you kidding me? He's partnering with him here, like, of course he's compromised. And then my dad's like, it's fucking Clinton, bro, it's like, it's only Bill Clinton, look, he's, he's the only one on the Epstein files. Of course, we know he's a pervert, all this stuff, but like, and then you have, so, the funny thing is, both sides will use their little batch of evidence to support their idea and ignore the opposite, right? So like, uh, the lady, the girl we were just talking about, uh, Virginia. She was literally on video saying that she, uh, all this shit about Bill Clinton on the jet, going to the island, hanging out with Trump and all this stuff.

• 1:12:29Speaker 01

  And the right wing people, like, like, people I know, my parents and like older folks I know in Florida, will say, you know, she came out, thank you for exposing Bill Clinton, for being a pedo and doing all this stuff. And, uh, Virginia Giuffre, after this happened, she's like, you guys didn't listen to the whole fucking tape. She's like, I was telling you that Trump was at the penthouse three days a week and visit, visiting him. But you guys don't want to hear that. And it's like, you know, it's just this weird thing. Like, if you do the math, there's, eh, there's gotta be, it's gotta be so many high level powerful people that are somehow compromised. And do I think, do I think like Clinton and these guys are pedos?

• 1:13:11Speaker 01

  No, I don't think that at all. But if you were Jeffrey Epstein, you would, I think it's super plausible to assume that he would

• 1:13:21Speaker 01

  try to trick them with like a girl who looks old, right? Who is possibly like on the borderline of being 18. And you say, oh yeah, this girl, she's 18, 19, 20, whatever. Meanwhile, she's like 17 and they had no idea. And they have video footage. And in like a court of law, if I'm the judge, I'm gonna let them, like, of course, they fucking lied to him. And this is not like some young girl, obviously.

• 1:13:44Joe Rogan?

  But.

• 1:13:44Speaker 01

  But they lied. But like in, in like the court of public opinion, you're never gonna win in that case, right? Like, if that comes out, you're fucked.

• 1:13:49Joe Rogan?

  You're fucked. I mean, you're fucked if you just go into the island to bang hookers. Like, it's like they're of age. It's still, like, whatever he was doing, you, you preyed on people's desire for experiences and vice.

• 1:14:01Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:14:02Joe Rogan?

  And all these powerful people who, again, they can't just go call a hooker. And the hooker goes, oh my God, I just blew Bill Gates. This is nuts. You know what I mean? Like, you can't trust them. So you have to trust someone who really has a lockdown organization. And they felt like he did.

• 1:14:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:18Joe Rogan?

  And that's why they all can, they all hung out with him even after he got arrested. This is what's crazy.

• 1:14:22Speaker 01

  That is crazy.

• 1:14:22Joe Rogan?

  A lot of Bill Gates meetings with him were after he was prosecuted. And he got this little slap on the wrist and he got essentially home detainment. And I think he had to do like weekends at the jail. Like, it was, it was like great for underage sex for, you know, what's, what's supposed to be a felony.

• 1:14:44Joe Rogan?

  The whole thing is crazy. And then when there's one reporter that really chased it down, I forget her name, but she really like, really looked into it. And that's when they opened up the second case, the second trial. Vicky Ward. Vicky Ward. Was she from what paper? Vanity Fair. Vanity Fair. So she was responsible for like, because she was like, this is insane. Like, what's going on here? And then there was the sheriff that had arrested him, said that I was told he was intelligence. And, I mean, you gotta think, man, if a guy like that is running these kind of parties with all these rich and powerful people, how many different worldwide decisions can be manipulated because of these people and the compromises you have on them? Right. It's really a brilliant thing to do.

• 1:15:29Joe Rogan?

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• 1:16:11Joe Rogan?

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• 1:17:24Speaker 01

  It really is, man. And like this, the way that the world is shaping out now and this like rise of Jew hate online is, and I think a lot of it's bots, you know? I think, I think it's coming from every angle, you know? I think it's probably a lot of, a lot of propaganda and bots coming from Iran, coming from Israel, Saudi, who knows where it's all coming from? It's just such a confusing crock of shit on the internet. But like, you know, on one hand, they were able to pull off some incredible fucking operations. And, you know, on the other hand, we get mad, now that it gets exposed, we get mad that they have their hooks in us and the people that are in power,

• 1:18:08Speaker 01

  whatever the politicians are, the puppets, just like bend the knee to whatever they're doing. And it gets exposed when people like Tucker did that interview with Ted Cruz.

• 1:18:18Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:18:19Speaker 01

  And he had him on his heels the whole time. That was, that was incredible. That was a fucking, a biblical fucking interview with Ted Cruz. And that really like pulled the mask off. Because like if that guy's, if that guy is explaining his, his position on Israel being in Congress, and that's his number one thing that made him want to be a congressman. It's like, what are all these other people doing then? Like if there's all these, all this money, and you can see the receipts, how much money they're being given.

• 1:18:48Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:18:48Speaker 01

  By these lobbies. But like, how mad can you get? Because they, we let them do it. They're legally allowed to do it.

• 1:18:55Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you could be mad, but you really should be mad at the politicians.

• 1:18:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:59Joe Rogan?

  The corrupt politicians and how many of them there are. And like, look, look at the mayoral race. Where they all were saying, my first trip, I'm gonna go to Israel.

• 1:19:08Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, except for the dude, except for, uh, what's his name? He said he's gonna stay in New York.

• 1:19:11Joe Rogan?

  The communist, yeah. He's like, I'm gonna take care of the Jews in New York. Boom, checkmate, that was it. That literally won it for him. Cause everybody else like, what are you guys talking about? Like, New York is fucked. Take care of this goddamn city. Why, what, what, what's this loyalty and allegiance to Israel from the New York City mayors? The people that are candidates for mayor? Like, your, your number one concern is Israel?

• 1:19:36Joe Rogan?

  That seems odd. Unless you're getting a ton of money.

• 1:19:38Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:19:39Joe Rogan?

  You know? Unless they have some video footage.

• 1:19:42Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, the more I think about, the more I think about politics and just look at the news cycle every day, I just feel like I get dumber.

• 1:19:49Joe Rogan?

  It's a dumb business. It's a dumb, dirty business.

• 1:19:52Speaker 01

  It really is, dude. Just like, sometimes I'm just like, not motivated to read the daily news, you know? Like, I was, I was telling this to Gavin too, I was like, I was like, like, to focus on the culture wars 24/7, 365, and, and fucking talk about it all day is draining, dude.

• 1:20:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you can't. It's bad, it's bad for you.

• 1:20:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:14Joe Rogan?

  That's why people that are on social media all day, they're poisoned. There was some study recently, um, I think it was Columbia? I, I forget what university, but they paid people to stay off social media for a, a certain amount of time. And they, they said that the results were superior to therapy. See if you can find that.

• 1:20:34Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:20:34Joe Rogan?

  So, they, I think a, a large percentage of the mental illness that we have in this country is, is greatly accentuated by social media. I think people that are on it all day, I think it's extremely addictive. I think the conflict raises your, the, the whole anxiety that you have about conflict in society. Stanford paid 35,000 people to find out if quitting Instagram made you happier. Yeah, this is it. And so, what was the results? Landmark study on digital well-being. Yeah. Ran two parallel experiments with Facebook and Instagram as a perspective focal pattern, platform, rather.

• 1:21:14Joe Rogan?

  For each focal platform, Meta grew a stratified random sample of users who in the US, who were age 18 or older, had logged in at least once a month, or at least once in the past month. From August 31st to September 12th, Meta placed survey invitations at the top of these users' focal platform news feeds. Study explains, on Facebook, a total of 10.6 million users were invited to the study. 673,388 clicked the invitation and 43,249 were willing to deactivate, consented to participate, and completed the enrollment survey. Of these, 19,857 completed the baseline survey, could be linked to the platform data, and

• 1:21:57Joe Rogan?

  had at least 15 minutes of baseline use per day. So what was the results? Modest but meaningful emotional gains. Findings were statistically significant, although modest in scale. Facebook deactivation led, well, Facebook is like a bunch of old people complaining about their neighborhood. Yeah. Led to a 0.060 standard deviation improvement. That's not much. While Instagram deactivation yielded a 0.041 improvement, these gains represent approximately 15 to 22% of the benefits typically seen with established psychological interventions such as cognitive behavior therapy or mindfulness-based interventions. So that's not much. That's 22% of the benefits. So it's a mild improvement. Yeah.

• 1:22:42Joe Rogan?

  But look at this, though. The improvements weren't equally distributed. Adults over 35 saw the most substantial benefit from leaving Facebook, whereas young women under 25 experienced the most emotional uplift from an Instagram break. You know, women are getting fucked by that because they're constantly comparing themselves to girls that are digitally altered and using filters and... fucks with your self-esteem and

• 1:23:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:05Joe Rogan?

  It's, I just think overall, it's not good for us.

• 1:23:08Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:23:09Joe Rogan?

  There's a, a large percentage of our society is addicted to it.

• 1:23:13Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:23:13Joe Rogan?

  And it's new.

• 1:23:14Speaker 01

  It's the dope, it hijacks your dopamine reward system, you know, like I said, like they call them dopamine, like the, your phone and the iPad and all this stuff is like they're dopamine slot machines. And like the, you know, the way they fuck up your circadian rhythm, like when you're sl- when you're laying in bed at night scrolling. And how that blue light in the phone just like pumps your brain full of energy and you can't put it down, you're just addicted, like. Every scroll is like another hit of the crack pipe, you know?

• 1:23:39Joe Rogan?

  A baby hit too. It's not even like, ooh, it feels so good.

• 1:23:43Speaker 01

  Right, you just gotta keep doing it.

• 1:23:44Joe Rogan?

  Most nothing hit ever. It's like a, just a little, uh, uh, what's that? Uh, oh, how weird.

• 1:23:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it like turns off a part of your brain too. Like it turns off the thinking part.

• 1:23:54Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:23:54Speaker 01

  You know, where like you just keep doing that thing and you're waiting for something good to hit, something more to like charge your.

• 1:24:01Joe Rogan?

  And it never comes.

• 1:24:02Speaker 01

  It never comes, right?

• 1:24:03Joe Rogan?

  You keep looking.

• 1:24:03Speaker 01

  Until you fucking look at the clock and it's like 3 a.m. and you're like, what the fuck am I doing?

• 1:24:06Joe Rogan?

  You're a fucking gold miner in a barren creek.

• 1:24:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:10Joe Rogan?

  You're just constantly gold mining. One day, one day, gold. One day I'm gonna find gold. I'm gonna find enlightenment on my Instagram. Nope. You know, you're not, you're gonna fuck your head up.

• 1:24:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I think it's a, I think it's definitely atrophying to human brain.

• 1:24:23Joe Rogan?

  A hundred percent.

• 1:24:24Speaker 01

  And that's why I like these like, these new tech, technical computers and these different apps that are coming out that are like. Trying to be anti-technology, you know, they're like trying to make healthier computers and healthier phones that like.

• 1:24:38Joe Rogan?

  Oh, like that simple phone, is that what it's called?

• 1:24:40Speaker 01

  There's a simple phone, there's like a, the, the daylight computer thing, which is like an iPad with no blue light in it. And it has only this, it's like, kinda like a Kindle on steroids where there's no blue light.

• 1:24:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, so it looks like paper?

• 1:24:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, look like, it's like, this is one of them right here and it has like.

• 1:24:55Joe Rogan?

  Oh, you have one?

• 1:24:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, I put, I like make my notes on it and then you, it also has like the.

• 1:24:59Joe Rogan?

  Can I see it?

• 1:25:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:25:01Joe Rogan?

  What is that called?

• 1:25:01Speaker 01

  This is called the uh daylight computer. Look at it.

• 1:25:05Joe Rogan?

  Oh.

• 1:25:06Speaker 01

  So I put all my books on there.

• 1:25:06Joe Rogan?

  I thought you just had an old iPad.

• 1:25:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, it looks like an old iPad. This is like version one of what they're doing. It's fucking sick dude.

• 1:25:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah?

• 1:25:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like, it's, you know, I don't know if you've ever used a Kindle, but like, they have like a note taking thing and it's super slow. When you draw on it, this thing is super fast. You can zoom in and out of shit super fast, like PDFs. And uh, when I sit, when I sit in bed at read, if I use like a-

• 1:25:28Joe Rogan?

  This looks good. Like when you're looking at it, it doesn't fuck with your eyes at all. It looks like a piece of paper.

• 1:25:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:25:33Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:25:34Speaker 01

  And look, check this out. If you do uh, if you do this.

• 1:25:38Joe Rogan?

  When did you decide to do this? To go, switch over to this stuff?

• 1:25:41Speaker 01

  This is like in the last year.

• 1:25:43Joe Rogan?

  Oh yeah?

• 1:25:44Speaker 01

  So look at that. So it's all, it's like amber light. So if I lay in bed at night and I'm reading like a PDF or a Kindle or something like this, I'm asleep in like forty-five minutes. I, the blue-

• 1:25:53Joe Rogan?

  What is going on with this uh microphone?

• 1:25:55Speaker 01

  Oh shit.

• 1:25:55Joe Rogan?

  Did you uh, disconnect it? Yeah.

• 1:26:02Speaker 01

  Did I break it? Check, check, check.

• 1:26:04Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we're good, we're back.

• 1:26:05Speaker 01

  So yeah.

• 1:26:06Joe Rogan?

  So amber light?

• 1:26:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, amber light and then like, if, so if I sit on my phone and read something, I can stay up all night. Or if I sit on my computer and read something, I can stay up forever. This thing, I fall asleep. I literally, it doesn't keep me up. Cause it does, I don't think, I think because it doesn't have the, that blue light that's baked into it.

• 1:26:21Joe Rogan?

  So you use that as your primary computer?

• 1:26:23Speaker 01

  No, no, no. I just use this for reading and like note taking and shit. I'll like, I'll, like on every podcast I do, I'm just like taking notes on it cause it stores on my notes. And then I just read Kindles on it and PDFs and stuff.

• 1:26:31Joe Rogan?

  And you write the notes by hand?

• 1:26:33Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:26:34Joe Rogan?

  Okay, so it has like a little-

• 1:26:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like a little sketchy thing and it's like super quick.

• 1:26:37Joe Rogan?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:26:38Speaker 01

  It's like, it's fucking amazing.

• 1:26:40Joe Rogan?

  You don't type your notes? Does it have a keyboard? Can you type on it?

• 1:26:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, you can uh, it has, it's like a, it's like basically like an iPad. It's like a Android iPad.

• 1:26:48Joe Rogan?

  Like an, a Bluetooth keyboard to it?

• 1:26:50Speaker 01

  Keyboard and you can type on it and shit. It's super quick, super responsive.

• 1:26:53Joe Rogan?

  And so what was the, the thought process about switching to something like this?

• 1:26:57Speaker 01

  Because uh- Like, so I got introduced to the, those guys when I started learning about like all this circadian rhythm stuff and how like all of these devices hijack your dopamine system and all this stuff. And there's like, hey, there's these guys that uh, they're working on this new technology that's like anti-big tech, mind control, all the apps and everything like that with all the colors and all the, you know, everything that just like fucks with your, your brain and your eyes. And I was like, that's interesting. They're going in the opposite direction of normal tech and like Apple and all these things. So uh, I hit them up and they sent me one and I was just like fucking blown away. I thought it was super cool. I could sit outside.

• 1:27:40Speaker 01

  Cause I like to, I like to go outside like first thing in the morning when the sun's rising and spend at least like two or three hours like during the beginning of the day. Cause I feel it just like charges me up for the day. I feel better when I'm outside, especially in Florida. The sun's really good. And uh, so I'll, I'll go out there and I'll read on this thing. I can't read on anything else. My phone or like a, a computer screen, there's so much glare. This thing thrives in the outdoor sunlight. So it's like, it's like perfect. It's like reading like a, a piece of paper.

• 1:28:08Joe Rogan?

  Wouldn't you think like it would be best if phones were like that? So you could read text messages?

• 1:28:12Speaker 01

  It would definitely be healthier. It would definitely be healthier for us, but it wouldn't be-

• 1:28:16Joe Rogan?

  You wouldn't be able to look at pictures and videos the same way though.

• 1:28:19Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:28:19Joe Rogan?

  It doesn't have color, right?

• 1:28:20Speaker 01

  Yeah. And yeah, this thing's all black and white and with that amber backlight that you can throw on at night if you're, if you're like uh, inside or something like that.

• 1:28:28Joe Rogan?

  And so how much of a change has it had in like your routine because of this thing?

• 1:28:32Speaker 01

  It's great because I, if I'm reading shit, which I typically do in the morning and at night, I, I don't stay up all night. It, it encourages me to go outside more because like typically when I'm trying to like absorb stuff or like listen to podcasts or like make notes or read, read books, I can do it on that. And it works better outside.

• 1:28:51Joe Rogan?

  Huh.

• 1:28:51Speaker 01

  So it just makes me wanna go outside more, which I feel better when I'm outside more.

• 1:28:55Joe Rogan?

  Wow. That's interesting, man.

• 1:28:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:58Joe Rogan?

  What's it called again?

• 1:28:59Speaker 01

  Daylight computer.

• 1:29:00Joe Rogan?

  Daylight computer?

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:01Joe Rogan?

  Alright.

• 1:29:01Speaker 01

  It's beautiful, man.

• 1:29:02Joe Rogan?

  I might check that out.

• 1:29:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's cool.

• 1:29:05Joe Rogan?

  I don't wanna carry around another fucking thing though.

• 1:29:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, you got like-

• 1:29:08Joe Rogan?

  You know?

• 1:29:09Speaker 01

  You got all your phones and.

• 1:29:11Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, all the bullshit I have to carry around and that's big.

• 1:29:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:13Joe Rogan?

  That's an iPad.

• 1:29:14Speaker 01

  It is big. It fits in that little, that little Patagonia bag. I just like carried it. I carry it like to home and to home and like to the studio.

• 1:29:19Joe Rogan?

  How come it has those big stupid bezels?

• 1:29:21Speaker 01

  I don't know. It's, it's version one. So like.

• 1:29:23Joe Rogan?

  Cause it looks like they got some leftover iPad technology.

• 1:29:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:28Joe Rogan?

  Or Kindle technology. Very interesting though.

• 1:29:31Speaker 01

  It definitely, uh, you know, I think they're gonna eventually try to improve that. Like I said, that's like the version one. That's like iPhone one for their thing and they're trying to like.

• 1:29:39Joe Rogan?

  So this is new.

• 1:29:40Speaker 01

  Very new, yeah. And they're trying to come up with like phones eventually and but apparently it's a lot of work to have a computer company and to.

• 1:29:46Joe Rogan?

  James McCann, one of the comics from last night, he had a, a new phone. I was like, what is this? He's like, it's a, it keeps you from being distracted. It only has like Spotify, a few other things on it. One shitty little camera and a black and white screen. I'm like, really? So he's just trying to get off of his phone addiction.

• 1:30:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:05Joe Rogan?

  So he has a much more limited phone. It runs on Android.

• 1:30:07Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:30:08Joe Rogan?

  There's a lot of people that are kind of leaning in that sort of direction.

• 1:30:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, like the anti-tech direction.

• 1:30:12Joe Rogan?

  Uh huh. Well, just realizing like something's going on. Like I'm not happier. I'm less happy.

• 1:30:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:17Joe Rogan?

  Kind of tweaking, thinking about where's my phone, where's my phone?

• 1:30:20Speaker 01

  Yeah. I don't think the techno, I don't think, um, the innovation of, of all this new technology and now that it's like exponentially taking off with AI is gonna lead us to a good place, man. I think that, uh,

• 1:30:33Speaker 01

  you know, I've had philosophers and people explain to me how like the advancement of like the technological human mind and the analytical mind has equally equated with the atrophy of like the psychic mind.

• 1:30:47Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:30:48Speaker 01

  And like when you listen to people like to Paul Rosalie talking about spending a lot of time in the Amazon and like going through the jungle, how it like awakens these deeper senses that you have in, inside of us.

• 1:30:56Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:30:57Speaker 01

  And like, it makes me wonder like

• 1:31:01Speaker 01

  five thousand years ago, before we had the ability to offload our memories onto phones and computers and before we even had the fucking written word, I were able to make notes and stuff. We probably had like way better memory.

• 1:31:17Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:31:17Speaker 01

  We had, we possibly likely had like.

• 1:31:23Speaker 01

  A telepathic way of communicating back then, like way, way long ago, before we had, like before we started letting technology take over for what we do, like even for our like mundane tasks now, which is reached the pinnacle of L L Ms, like telling us, telling us like how to fucking write an email.

• 1:31:39Joe Rogan?

  Right, well, we for sure don't remember phone numbers anymore. And when I was a kid, I kept like fifteen phone numbers in my head. Now I have zero. I have like maybe one or two phone numbers I can remember. Everybody just relies on their phone. There's so many people that can't even make their way around town without their navigation system, completely forgot how the streets connect. You know, there's a lot of digital atrophy or human atrophy that's being caused by the interface of the digital world. And it's only gonna get worse. I mean, there's a, there was a study recently on Chat G P T users. And how less there, how, but see if you can find it. It was a study on young people and ubiquitous use of Chat G P T, like how many of them are using it?

• 1:32:21Joe Rogan?

  And how much effect it has on their ability to form their own thoughts and, and see through things. They're just relying on this thing to answer the questions for them without pondering the question themselves and actually learning things. They're just getting data.

• 1:32:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:32:34Joe Rogan?

  And a lot of that data doesn't even get absorbed.

• 1:32:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, my wife and all of her friends are using Chat G P T now.

• 1:32:38Joe Rogan?

  Here it is. Chat G P T may be eroding critical thinking skills according to a new M I T study.

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  That's odd.

• 1:32:45Joe Rogan?

  Totally makes sense. Study divided fifty-four subjects, eighteen to thirty-nine year olds from the Boston area into three groups and asked them to write several S A T essays using Open A I's Chat G P T, Google circuit, Google search engine and nothing at all respectively. Researchers used an E E G to record the writers' brain activity across thirty-two regions and found that of the three groups, Chat G P T users had the lowest brain engagement and consistently underperformed at neural, linguistic and behavioral levels. Over the course of several months, Chat G P T users got lazier with, with each subsequent essay, often resorting to copy and paste by the end of the study. Wow.

• 1:33:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, we're gonna just end up being a residue of a species overwritten by our own creation.

• 1:33:32Joe Rogan?

  Very bizarre.

• 1:33:33Speaker 01

  Fucking scary dude.

• 1:33:34Joe Rogan?

  Very bizarre, very bizarre, because we're just all running towards the cliff.

• 1:33:38Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:33:39Joe Rogan?

  And we're all like, "Yeah, well, we gotta do it, because if we don't do it, China's gonna do it."

• 1:33:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:43Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, man.

• 1:33:44Joe Rogan?

  I think we're gonna integrate, that's what I think. We're gonna realize that the only way for us to survive is to integrate with artificial intelligence.

• 1:33:53Speaker 01

  I think people are gonna choose, they're gonna find God either in artificial intelligence or in nature. People that run the other way are gonna realize, like-

• 1:34:02Joe Rogan?

  There's definitely gonna be people that worship artificial intelligence as a new god.

• 1:34:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:06Joe Rogan?

  That's already been speculated. That's for sure gonna be a thing, and it might actually be that. Might be that's what god is, like, that's how we make him. We make, god forms himself through us, like, the way god creates us, he instills us with this insatiable need for technological innovation, till ultimately, if they don't blow themselves up, they achieve artificial intelligence, which then becomes sentient, which then makes better and better versions of itself, and as you scale out, what's the ultimate version of that? The ultimate version of that is god.

• 1:34:36Speaker 01

  Hmm, yeah, and then what are we?

• 1:34:40Joe Rogan?

  We're the chicken and the egg.

• 1:34:41Speaker 01

  Chicken and the egg.

• 1:34:43Joe Rogan?

  Well, there's some new thing, man, have you seen this thing about the James Webb Telescope?

• 1:34:47Speaker 01

  Yes, dude, I was talking to Jesse Michaels about this yesterday.

• 1:34:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, me and Jesse were talking about it yesterday too, so Jesse's, his phone was getting lit up.

• 1:34:55Joe Rogan?

  I'm gonna send you this, Jamie.

• 1:34:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I guess-

• 1:34:57Joe Rogan?

  It's really interesting.

• 1:34:57Speaker 01

  The story is like, this background microwave radiation is not what we think it was, there's these mature universes that are out there that we just discovered with the James Webb.

• 1:35:06Joe Rogan?

  This is, uh, here, I'll send you the, um, uh, the Twitter thing, Jamie. Did you find it already?

• 1:35:12Speaker 01

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• 1:35:34Joe Rogan?

  And vehicle, no waiting for help. It also works as a power bank and has a built in LED flashlight. No co, the end of jumper cables. Use code ROGEN10 for 10% off. Select jump starters at NO dot CO. This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee free. No monthly fees, no overdraft fees and thousands of fee free ATMs.

• 1:36:19Joe Rogan?

  But here's the real kicker. If you get their Chime card, it gives you 5% cash back on a category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate crazy high. It's nine times the national average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/rogan. Takes a few minutes to sign up. Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details. Okay, here's. Web telescope uncover secrets of dark matter. Yeah, that's one of them, but I'll show you what this is. Because what this is, is essentially that just the galaxies that they've shown.

• 1:37:05Joe Rogan?

  It, it makes up for the background micro or whatever the microwave radiation is that they associated with the big bang. So now, so according to.

• 1:37:16Speaker 01

  So the big bang is fake?

• 1:37:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:22Speaker 01

  That makes a lot of sense.

• 1:37:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I saw the Twitter post and there's people, you know, going after each other like rabid cats and dogs about it. Whether it was real or whether it was fake.

• 1:37:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, well, of course, people are going back and forth about it, but essentially what they're saying is this kind of it cancels out the idea of the Big Bang. And Penrose believed that it was a consistent cycle. Penrose believes it goes, you know, Big Bang to expansion of the universe to compression to Big Bang with this constant cycle, never ending. It's not that the universe was formed at one period of time, it's like this constant state of happening. Which, is that any more crazy than the universe happening at one time out of nothing? No, I mean, it's kind of, it's all crazy. Just the idea that it's 13 billion light years old, or 13.7.

• 1:38:16Joe Rogan?

  Or 22, is 22 even more crazier?

• 1:38:19Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, this is nuts, dude.

• 1:38:22Joe Rogan?

  A new paper shows that the cosmic microwave background radiation can be explained entirely by the energy of recently discovered early mature galaxies. Massive galaxies the James Webb Space Telescope discovered while crushing, or, excuse me, discovered which crushed the existing models of galaxy formation because they formed much earlier than astrophysicists thought possible. But now these EMGs turn out to account for the entire energy density of the cosmic microwave background radiation, which was believed to be a snapshot of the first light emitted after the Big Bang, when the universe was 379,000 years old.

• 1:39:01Joe Rogan?

  The variations in the CMB were believed to be relics of quantum fluctuations in the dense plasma of the Big Bang. If these new findings are accepted, and there's no reason not to accept them, then all the following flagship findings of cosmology are thrown into question. Big Bang Theory, foundational cosmological model undermined, Cosmic Inflation, losses, loses, rather, observational justification, ACDM model, I don't know what that is, key parameters become unreliable. So all this stuff, dark energy inferred from the CMB may be mischaracterized, dark matter density,

• 1:39:41Joe Rogan?

  current estimates may be invalid, age of the universe must be recalculated. Wild.

• 1:39:48Speaker 01

  Yes, it's insane.

• 1:39:49Joe Rogan?

  Wild shit, and I'm sure the people that have been preaching, or that have been rather talking and teaching people about the Big Bang and writing books, they're gonna fight back tooth and nail.

• 1:39:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:39:59Joe Rogan?

  They don't want to be wrong. But this James Webb telescope, at the very least, has shown us mature galaxies that shouldn't have been able to be formed.

• 1:40:06Speaker 01

  The fact checker's got it. Reader contact.

• 1:40:09Joe Rogan?

  This post claims CMB can be explained entirely by EMGs,

• 1:40:15Joe Rogan?

  implying ability, not probability, that EMGs turn out to account for the entire energy of the CMB radiation. But the paper says EMGs may account for anywhere between 1.4% and 100%. So they might account for 100%, but they do account for... That seems like you're nitpicking.

• 1:40:31Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:40:32Joe Rogan?

  It might account for 100%? Okay.

• 1:40:34Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:40:35Joe Rogan?

  Either way, they're learning things, and they still have a very limited ability to observe, right? So the James Webb telescope is so much better than the Hubble, so much better than anything else they've launched before. So they're finding new things out, but it's still limited in its capacity to see the universe. It can't see everything yet. So they'll probably have an even better one that they'll launch, and that will show us even more that we didn't know. And we're operating on a limited amount of data, and we're operating with this conviction that they're 100% correct

• 1:41:04Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:41:05Joe Rogan?

  about these timelines.

• 1:41:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:41:06Joe Rogan?

  And just these mature galaxies that existed where they shouldn't exist is enough to know that we don't know everything. And then this whole dark matter, dark energy thing, it's like, what is it? You can't even... You don't even know what it is.

• 1:41:17Speaker 01

  Well, we figured out that dark matter actually is mass, right? And has gravitational effects. Like, they were... I forget who it was, but they were observing galaxies, and they were looking at the spin rate of the galaxies. And they found out that the center of the galaxy, it should be spinning faster than the outer rim of it, right? But they found out that the spin rate is identical, which means that what they theorized is that dark matter, the mass of the dark matter around the galaxy, has lots of mass. And it's flattening the spin rate of the galaxies.

• 1:41:46Joe Rogan?

  Hmm.

• 1:41:47Speaker 01

  Which is interesting, because like, there's this... Have you ever heard of this dude named Rolf Landauer?

• 1:41:52Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:41:53Speaker 01

  He has this theory.

• 1:41:56Speaker 01

  That if you weighed a hard drive after you put data on it, it would weigh more than when it was empty. Right? So, and his theory was that like every single hard drive server farm around the world right now, and if you weighed it, if we had measuring uh, equipment that was sensitive enough and you could find the difference, he thinks that all the data stored would be like a kilogram or less right now. But the rate of data increase that we accumulate each year right now is like 25% not equating for exponential growth. The technological singularity and how that's going to ramp up. So somebody did the math there and said, um,

• 1:42:34Speaker 01

  it was, uh, no, it was Jason Giorgione who did the math on this. And he, he said, if you just keep the rate flat at 25% per year of data increase across the, across the globe. In 340 years, we are going to have the mass of the moon on the surface of the earth in data stored on hard drives.

• 1:42:54Joe Rogan?

  What?

• 1:42:55Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. So like, and the way he, the way he like lays this all out, I'll try to do my best. Is that the, if you look at the laws of thermodynamics, like the two laws, one that energy can never be created or destroyed. And the other one like, uh, entropy always increases over time. Entropy meaning disorder. It never goes down over time, like hence the heat death of the universe will eventually happen. And so E equals mc squared, energy and mass are interconvertible. And then there was this other dude, Claude Shannon, who came up the theory that, uh, data transmission with binary bits, ones and zeros. Right? So, so if computers are bound by, tell me if you're, if I'm losing you.

• 1:43:38Joe Rogan?

  No, no.

• 1:43:39Speaker 01

  If, if computers are bound by the laws of entropy

• 1:43:43Speaker 01

  and hard drives are bound by the laws of entropy, that means when a computer is blank, it's very low entropy because it's all ones or it's all zeros. When you add data, when you add a podcast to it, it goes one, zero, one, zero, one, zero. It's chaotic. Just from a pure physical, uh, perspective, it's high entropy. So what happens when you erase that hard drive? You have to, the energy has to go, has to leave. If it's mass on the hard drive, theoretically, if this guy's right, if Ralph Landauer is right, that data on the hard drive is mass. When you erase that, it has to go to energy outside of the hard drive, right? So he says, if you, but if you crack open a hard drive, you can't see that mass, right? It's invisible.

• 1:44:28Speaker 01

  It's electromagnetically indetectable. So he says, what other kind of mass do we know of that's electromagnetically indetectable? He said it's dark matter. So if, if mass is the same thing as information stored on a hard drive, that would mean not only is mass and energy interchangeable, but mass, energy and information are interchangeable, right? So if, if dark matter is mass, you could then say that dark matter is a computational cloud of ones and zeros. And our, our consciousness is an interface to that that gives it meaning.

• 1:45:10Speaker 01

  The same way a computer screen gives meaning to all the ones and zeros on the hard drive. Like you watch the video, it has meaning to it.

• 1:45:20Joe Rogan?

  So this is the concept that consciousness engages with matter? And that is how matter exists? That it exists because you're observing it?

• 1:45:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, the only reason, yeah, consciousness is fundamental to an information processing system. So instead of building up to, like, what physicists, what people try to do is build up to consciousness from dead atoms, protons and neutrons, right? How do you get to consciousness from that? But if you think of this as like a computational cloud of ones and zeros, and mass does equal information, well, that just means that our conscious, our consciousness is a way to interface and give this simulation meaning. And funny enough, that, that theory really reconciles well with shit like parapsychology and like Rupert Sheldrake's morphic resonance, like when you solve one problem in one part

• 1:46:10Speaker 01

  of the world and then like somebody breaks a world record in this country and then five years, you know, a year later, five other people hit that same world record. It's like conserving energy, the processing system conserving energy.

• 1:46:22Joe Rogan?

  There's this guy, there's a scientist that he found computational code.

• 1:46:29Joe Rogan?

  Uh, what did he, you know, you remember this guy, Jamie? That he, he, he believes that he found computational code that proves that like the universe is a simulation. But this guy, uh, I tried to get him to come on the podcast, but he said I was anti-science because of the COVID vaccine stuff. This is a few, few years back though. Maybe he's kind of woken up and changed his tune. I doubt it though. A lot of people got indoctrinated. That's anti-science. Like actual data is anti-science? Do, what is, who's data? Who's data you going by? We could have a conversation about that if you like. I'll show you some things.

• 1:47:05Speaker 01

  You can have a great conversation. I think you've said everything.

• 1:47:07Joe Rogan?

  Have a seat. Have a seat. Let's go over some studies.

• 1:47:09Speaker 01

  Is this the dude?

• 1:47:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's the guy. Um, so what was his, uh, so this guy won't come on my show because he says I'm anti-science.

• 1:47:16Speaker 03

  Symmetry, supergravity.

• 1:47:17Joe Rogan?

  Yes. And, but what is his, this discovery that he had?

• 1:47:21Speaker 01

  Oh, he's from Tampa. Oh, born in Tampa.

• 1:47:22Joe Rogan?

  He found, see, what was the, um, supposed discovery about the computational code?

• 1:47:34Joe Rogan?

  What it's a?

• 1:47:36Joe Rogan?

  Are we living in a computer simulation? Yeah, this is it. James Gates, theoretical physicist, the University of Maryland. Auto-correcting codes. Click, click on that, Jamie? Scientific American article? Oh, I just read it right from there, I guess. Explored mathematical structure of string theory specifically in the context of supersymmetry and has found what he describes as error correcting codes embedded within the equations. These codes are mathematical objects similar to those used in computer science for error detection and correction, such as in data transmission. While these findings are intriguing, it's important to note that they are not literal computer code, but rather mathematical structures that are, that share similarities with coding theory. Yeah, it's important to learn that, but that's fucking crazy.

• 1:48:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, it is.

• 1:48:19Joe Rogan?

  All of it is crazy. But James Gates, as of I think two years ago, wasn't willing to come on the podcast and talk about it.

• 1:48:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. If I had a dollar for every person who said they wouldn't come on my podcast because it's too pseudo-scientific, I would have like five dollars.

• 1:48:32Joe Rogan?

  Why not? Why not come on and illuminate?

• 1:48:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, I had this, this, this, I don't want to say who she is, but like this lady who had this amazing book on like, uh, the, uh, Greek weapons and poisons that they used to use for war, like they used to like drop scorpions over, amazing book, like they used to light pigs on fire and like send them towards elephants, try to get the elephants to run away and like,

• 1:48:52Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:48:53Speaker 01

  Throw bags of scorpions on people. And I'm like, this fucking book is amazing. I need to get this lady. And she's, we're not, we're not, we're not too, we're not academic enough, I guess, but I'm trying to get there.

• 1:49:03Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but what does that mean? What does it mean? We're just human beings having a conversation. You're the academic. Come in and tell me what you know.

• 1:49:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:49:10Joe Rogan?

  What's the big deal?

• 1:49:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, you, you do a great job of like having both sides in, which I think is really cool. Like you have like the, the crazy fringe people who are like educated, self-educated, but are very smart in a certain way. And then other people who like have the, the academic credentials to sort of like, be a sounding board for that and to see like who's really full of shit.

• 1:49:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you have to have all because there are some people that are, they're self-taught. They've essentially just read shit tons of books and they're brilliant people. And just because they're not classically educated, doesn't mean they're incorrect. And there's only one way to find that out. Guys like Randall Carlson, he's a builder. Okay, but the knowledge that he has about the impact theory, the Younger Dryas impact theory and what probably ended the ice age and, and shaped a, a great part of North America and how you could see it from space. And you can see when they look at the satellite imagery, it literally looks like things have been washed away. It, it looks like massive water erosion. Like you'd see the ripples on the ground that are akin to what it looks like when the tide pulls back on the sand on a beach.

• 1:50:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:14Joe Rogan?

  It's, it all makes sense. And he knows so much about the actual science behind it. And he was talking about this a long time ago. I met him in Georgia, in Atlanta. That's where he's from. I met him in like 2000 and, Three or something like that, two thousand two, two thousand, he was telling me about it back then. But back then, they didn't have the core samples that showed that there was significant impact evidence. That was around, I think it was eleven thousand eight hundred years ago. And then again, somewhere around ten thousand plus years ago. So we, I think we've been hit multiple times. And I think he's a hundred percent right about that. And I think Graham Hancock is a hundred percent on to something with these. All this ancient apocalypse stuff and the pushback against him is insane.

• 1:50:58Joe Rogan?

  They throw every terrible phrase at him they possibly can, every pejorative, racist, white supremacist, all these crazy things.

• 1:51:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, I had Flynn Dibble on my podcast, we talked about it.

• 1:51:10Joe Rogan?

  Fascinating.

• 1:51:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's great. He's, I actually liked him.

• 1:51:13Joe Rogan?

  He's a nice guy. When he's not calling you a racist.

• 1:51:16Speaker 01

  When he's not in front of a keyboard.

• 1:51:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, well, he, he, you know, he's an anxiety-filled academic. Who is, you know, fighting very hard to push his very specific view of things. And he tries to silence other people that have opposite, opposing views. And the way he did it with Graham was really not cool. It was, it was shitty. It was very shitty.

• 1:51:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I think he was, uh, I think he had a lot of like interesting legitimate things to say about like ancient Greeks and stuff like that. But like when we got to this stuff. It was just like, where did that fucking dude I was talking to thirty minutes ago go? He was just like, he was looking at this and then all reason just flew out the window. He was like, he was like, what do you mean they couldn't do this? They stick a stone in there, they spin it around like this. And then you can get this, it's really easily, how dare you say that the, that the dynastic Egyptians weren't able to create these vases? I'm like, and I, you know, I was like proposing other theories that like, you know, Chris Dunn's Jeffrey Drum's theories. And wanted absolutely nothing to do with it and like.

• 1:52:17Joe Rogan?

  We don't know. This is the thing.

• 1:52:19Speaker 01

  That's the thing, exactly.

• 1:52:20Joe Rogan?

  If, if, if Christopher Dunn had been teaching this in the eighteen hundreds and people had followed those theories and built upon them. And this was academic, you know, like in, in universities, this is accepted. And this was what they were teaching and they were studying this, then he would be saying that. They would all be saying that. There's. Evidence that he's got a good point that Christopher Dunn, the model that he uses when he's describing how he thinks that the Great Pyramid of Giza was a power plant is fascinating. The number, when he's talking about the ratios that you would need for the width of the walls, the surfaces, what the way the things are made, they would all work.

• 1:52:56Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:52:57Joe Rogan?

  He's an engineer, like he's not a moron, he knows what he's talking about. If this guy was teaching this stuff a long time ago and it was accepted by universities, that would be what we're talking about today, would be speculating how they did it and what they were doing and what they were doing it for. And if we had known in the 1800s that we regularly travel into a comet storm and that it happens, I think it's every June and November, we pass through the, you know, and we see it in the sky. We see meteor showers, you know, you see, oh, look at the sky, look at all the shooting stars. We're in a fucking shooting gallery and occasionally one of those slams into the earth.

• 1:53:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:32Joe Rogan?

  And when that stuff happens, we're fucked. And it's super likely that that happened multiple times during human history. And it's super likely that that's why there's all these structures that nobody can explain.

• 1:53:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:53:44Joe Rogan?

  That are somehow or another predate modern civilization, like Gobekli Tepe. That fucked them all up because before Gobekli Tepe, they had this 6,000 year model.

• 1:53:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:56Joe Rogan?

  Mesopotamia, Sumer, that's where it all started.

• 1:53:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:59Joe Rogan?

  Now they're like, well, maybe it's Turkey. Maybe Turkey was the birth, I mean Jimmy Corsetti's been talking about this a lot.

• 1:54:04Speaker 01

  And I understand like where they're coming from, from the, like, I can see their point of view from the academics. Not that I would act like them or like condone the way they act, but like when you spend your life, Flint, for example, like I think his parents were archaeologists, named him Flint because of archaeology and like, you spent your whole life mucking through these different places, excavating shit, digging up rocks or whatever he was doing, never, and no one ever paid attention to you. And then you have Graham Hancock come in, who is like personally. fascinated by these things and dedicating his life to writing and researching on his own, but not accredited academically, you can see like how those guys would, how those academic guys would be like super salty of somebody like that. I understand that.

• 1:54:45Joe Rogan?

  Oh, I get it.

• 1:54:46Speaker 01

  It's not an excuse for what he did, which I think was shitty.

• 1:54:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's not an excuse.

• 1:54:50Speaker 01

  But like.

• 1:54:51Joe Rogan?

  I understand their perspective, but it's ego driven.

• 1:54:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:53Joe Rogan?

  If we really were interested, you would take these heterodox scientists and you'd bring them in. And you would say like, what do you, like, they're studying data, guys like Graham Hancock and Randall Carlson. They're studying, they're studying these things. Graham was just in Iraq. He just was go, going over there to look at like ancient Sumerian stuff. You know, he sent me some photos of his trip. He said it was fascinating.

• 1:55:14Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:55:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's, these structures are incredible and they don't really understand them.

• 1:55:19Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:55:20Joe Rogan?

  We really don't. We don't even know like who really built the Aztec temples.

• 1:55:23Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:55:24Joe Rogan?

  You know, like, uh, I was reading about, uh, Tenochtitlan.

• 1:55:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:27Joe Rogan?

  Like, they found it. The Aztecs found that there. And they don't even know who built it.

• 1:55:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:55:34Joe Rogan?

  There's a bunch of those things. They're like, a previous civilization existed in the same place. Fascinating discoveries, figured out how to do agriculture, figured out how to make grids in cities and make these incredible stone structures that are cosmologically connected somehow.

• 1:55:49Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:55:50Joe Rogan?

  And then they went away.

• 1:55:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:55:51Joe Rogan?

  Like, and all over the world, all over the world. There's like, people reinvent civilization, the places where these ancient structures exist and even build upon them. They build over them.

• 1:56:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. I think there's probably so much shit that that people were able to do in antiquity and way before that, that would seem like magic to us today. Like, kinda like getting back to what we were talking about with our senses that we don't really have today, that probably have atrophied over millennia. Like, your fart theory, which is amazing. Remember, you remember your fart theory?

• 1:56:19Joe Rogan?

  Oh, how's it going?

• 1:56:21Speaker 01

  Imagine if somebody farted and you didn't have a nose and you had to develop this nose that enables you to survive and smell predators.

• 1:56:27Joe Rogan?

  Right, you'd have no idea.

• 1:56:28Speaker 01

  You have no idea, you're sitting there bathing in somebody's fart.

• 1:56:30Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:56:31Speaker 01

  So like, and, so, like, dogs, you know, dogs and cats, when they go into weird houses and they notice like some sort of weird energy. You know, people describe energy in a house, like, this is, this feels off. Like, what is that? Like is there, is there something that really is there that we just don't have the organs anymore to detect? Or something in our brain that has atrophied over thousands of years? That have stopped us being able to detect this stuff?

• 1:56:54Joe Rogan?

  Well, think about how birds can, they can figure out a way to travel like super accurately. Through the sky, but drawn by the magnetic force of the earth?

• 1:57:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:57:07Joe Rogan?

  They, they have somehow or another, they can, they can figure out a way to navigate with the earth's magnetic field.

• 1:57:12Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:57:13Joe Rogan?

  We don't even understand it. But they do it, they migrate successfully every year. We know they do it.

• 1:57:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:57:19Joe Rogan?

  That, that's a sense that they have that we don't have. Like it's probably a fun, a fucking shit ton of, there's probably a bunch of things going on in the world that we're not interacting with. Cause we don't have the senses for.

• 1:57:29Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah. And, uh, you know, one of the things that I've been like really interested in lately is, uh, this. I mean, people talk about this ability to like download information like in the UFO world, you know? Like people talk about, oh, I got this from a download or something like that. Talk about like, I have an antenna, I can connect to something. But like, for me, like that connected, when I first heard about people talking about that, I always thought that that was like the muse. You know, like you have this sort of antenna in your head that connects you to creativity and gives you the ability to just create shit out of thin air, you know?

• 1:58:11Speaker 01

  And I feel like, with people I've observed over my lifetime, I feel like that peaks at an early age. Right? Before you get older and before you start the burden of like the responsibilities of life. And all these mundane things in your life start to compile on and you trade your dreams for securities. That, that spark starts to go away, you know? And, uh, like that could easily be described as something magical if it was way more powerful thousands of years ago. Like, uh. I really noticed this the other day. So I was, the other day I was hanging out with, uh, with Kirk, the lead guitarist for Metallica. And he was, for some reason, I don't know why, but he likes my show.

• 1:58:56Speaker 01

  And we were just like-

• 1:58:57Joe Rogan?

  You got a great show.

• 1:58:58Speaker 01

  We were talking. Thank you. I appreciate it. It's weird. I feel like an imposter.

• 1:59:02Joe Rogan?

  That's good. That's why you're good at it.

• 1:59:03Speaker 01

  But he loves this stuff. The dude's like, you know, he's in his 60s, like early 60s, and he's fucking obsessed with all of these topics that like, that you cover, I cover, a lot of people cover, and he's like, at the same time, he's, the dude is like, got this crazy spark where he's so inspired to do shit and like, still creating new music and like, coming up with new riffs and, uh, and wanting to do more things. Where like, I've never met a dude like that who's had so much success, toured everywhere for the last 40 years, being the number one metal band in the world, basically, and still like, wanting to learn stuff.

• 1:59:48Speaker 01

  The dude's trying to translate ancient Greek music for his guitar and trying to figure out how to play this stuff. He can't figure it out. And he was telling me, he's like, dude, I think this wasn't recreational. He's like, I think this music was magical. He's like, I think they were performing magic. He thinks it was like religious medical rites they were performing with music. It wasn't supposed to be entertainment back in the day.

• 2:00:11Joe Rogan?

  Well, there is this weird connection with music and psychedelics where music can sort of,

• 2:00:21Joe Rogan?

  it changes the trip. Like, if, if you listen to, do you know what Icarus are?

• 2:00:27Speaker 01

  No.

• 2:00:27Joe Rogan?

  Icarus are these, uh, hook it up, Jamie. Icarus are these South American songs that they play while you're doing ayahuasca.

• 2:00:36Joe Rogan?

  And if you do D M T and listen to these things, they take over the trip. And the song, the, the trip moves with the song in harmony. Like exactly. It's not like the trip is chaotic and you hear the songs and these songs are like a technology to move the trip. It's really fascinating. Cause you listen to the songs and you're like, well, what are these things? Like, what are they trying to do with these? They sound kind of weird, but when you listen to these songs while you're tripping, it makes the trip dance. It makes the geometric.

• 2:01:19Joe Rogan?

  So you are lying on the floor. It's Costa Rica.

• 2:01:26Speaker 01

  In the jungle.

• 2:01:26Joe Rogan?

  You're lying on a yoga mat in the jungle with a bunch of forty year old ladies with boob jobs trying to get their life together.

• 2:01:35Speaker 01

  Tech entrepreneurs.

• 2:01:37Joe Rogan?

  Tech entrepreneurs, Navy SEALs.

• 2:01:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:01:41Joe Rogan?

  And you're just threw up. You have horrible diarrhea and this trip just starts coming on.

• 2:01:47Speaker 01

  I think I just found Jesus.

• 2:01:48Joe Rogan?

  Give me, give me a little more, something that would like a little more beat to it. I got some on my phone.

• 2:01:53Speaker 01

  I heard the one that, uh, you know, you had Luke on recently, Luke Havens.

• 2:01:56Joe Rogan?

  He's great.

• 2:01:57Speaker 01

  He had a great, uh, great little clip that he played.

• 2:01:59Joe Rogan?

  Here we go. This is my favorite one.

• 2:02:06Joe Rogan?

  They dance.

• 2:02:07Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 2:02:08Joe Rogan?

  They dance to this song while you're tripping.

• 2:02:11Speaker 01

  Balls?

• 2:02:11Joe Rogan?

  You, no, the psychedelic experience dances to this song.

• 2:02:15Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:02:17Joe Rogan?

  When you're lying there with your eyes closed.

• 2:02:22Speaker 01

  That's wild.

• 2:02:22Joe Rogan?

  And the whole time it's, it's like synchronized together. And the whole time it's doing, it's like, it's like a method for showing you more things. And as you go through it with the music, there's something comforting in the pattern of the music and the way it dances to the music that allows you to relax and unveils more and more of itself. Very trippy. And the fact that these guys figured this out. How'd you figure this out?

• 2:02:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, man, there's something there.

• 2:02:50Joe Rogan?

  Your friend is probably right. The Metallica guy's probably right.

• 2:02:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:02:53Joe Rogan?

  It's probably, they were probably, that music probably synchronized with the trips. Like when they were doing the Illusinian Mysteries and all that stuff.

• 2:03:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, when I went to their concert in Tampa the other day, and I was walking, and I made me regret not going to more concerts when I was younger, but like, being in that stadium, the Buck Stadium, where there was 90,000 people, every seat in that arena was full.

• 2:03:14Joe Rogan?

  And you hear

• 2:03:19Speaker 01

  Well, it goes black.

• 2:03:21Joe Rogan?

  There it is.

• 2:03:22Speaker 03

  Lightning strike happens.

• 2:03:23Speaker 01

  Dude, it is insane.

• 2:03:24Joe Rogan?

  Look at this. Lightning strike happens.

• 2:03:26Speaker 01

  They caused an earthquake.

• 2:03:29Speaker 03

  They're actually, I mean, super dangerous, but that was badass.

• 2:03:33Speaker 01

  That is fucking insane. Ride the lightning, bitch.

• 2:03:41Joe Rogan?

  That's so dangerous.

• 2:03:42Speaker 01

  Dude, being there with 90,000 people, the light, the thundering electric guitars, and the, the, the, the fire, the pyrotechnics, and all those people like focusing, like, all 90,000 people, every atom in their body is vibrating at the same frequency.

• 2:04:00Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:04:00Speaker 01

  And it just like, that is, it's like magic that penetrates every fiber of your being. And if I was a dude from 2,000 years ago and took a time machine to that Metallica concert, those dudes are gods.

• 2:04:11Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:04:12Speaker 01

  They're fucking gods. I think that's what the Illusinian Mysteries probably was.

• 2:04:15Joe Rogan?

  Well, they probably had music that, that enhanced the trip. It probably guided the trip. They probably learned how to do it while they were tripping.

• 2:04:24Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:04:25Joe Rogan?

  Like, they figured out so much. They figured out democracy. They, they started so, so much of what we think of as like, western government.

• 2:04:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:04:34Joe Rogan?

  And a lot of the philosophy.

• 2:04:35Speaker 01

  The scientific method, democracy, all this stuff.

• 2:04:38Joe Rogan?

  Tripping balls. And then the Romans came along and said, put, stop.

• 2:04:42Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 2:04:42Joe Rogan?

  We're here to make slaves out of you fucking people. We don't want you tripping.

• 2:04:46Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah, that was, uh, yeah, they killed, they killed Eleusis in like, what, 400 AD, I think?

• 2:04:50Joe Rogan?

  Well, they did exactly the same things the Nixon administration did to psychedelics in this country.

• 2:04:55Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:04:55Joe Rogan?

  They're like, oh, this is a problem. When they were turning everything Schedule One to try to stop the anti-war movement and the civil rights movement, that's the exact same thing. Governments, when they get to a certain position of power, they're not representing the people anymore. Now they're the fucking jackbooted thugs that tell you what you can and can't do, based on how inconvenient it is for you to be doing that for them running things.

• 2:05:17Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah, it's just, it's terrible. It's the opposite of what it should be. It's the opposite of what got us here, I think, bro.

• 2:05:24Joe Rogan?

  Yes. And we're too big now. There's too many of us. That's part of the problem. It's like, you want to govern 330 million people plus Mexicans? Good luck.

• 2:05:33Speaker 01

  I had this dude on my show, speaking of the academic, the strife between the academics and the self-taught online people, influencers, whatever you want to call them. This dude was, he was kicked out of his university for, he, first of all, he wrote a dissertation on ancient pharmacy, the Roman pharmacy and Greek pharmacy. And it was a dissertation based on this guy named Galen, who was like the surgeon general of ancient Rome. And he had a chapter in his dissertation, his PhD dissertation, about recreational drugs in Rome. And the head of the department reviewed his dissertation and said, "Everything looks great. Delete the section on recreational drugs in ancient Rome." So he's like, "Okay,

• 2:06:16Speaker 01

  why?" They're like, "'Cause the Romans wouldn't do such thing." So he's like, "Okay," he deleted it, and then submitted it, got his PhD, and then wrote a book based on that part of the dissertation that he left out, which the book was called The Chemical Muse. And I learned about this from Hamilton Morris. He did a podcast with the dude first. And I read that book, and, you know, he was basically making the case that drugs were ubiquitous in antiquity during the Roman times. Like, they were being used for everything, because people were not dying from old age. They were dying from war, hand-to-hand combat, famine, plague.

• 2:06:50Joe Rogan?

  Infection.

• 2:06:51Speaker 01

  All these things, infection. So like... People were constantly using drugs and there was a law in ancient Rome that he said there was only one law when it came to using drugs. And that was that you were not allowed to kill people with drugs. You were not allowed to murder people, which is why Marcus Aurelius was using this drug compound called a, uh, uh, theriak. And the theriak was a concoction of like 11 different North African vipers, their flesh and their venom. Combined with opium and all kinds of like bodily fluids and he was using this as like a performance enhancing drug. Whoa. Because people were trying to assassinate him with poisons. That's how they assassinated people.

• 2:07:35Speaker 01

  They were using scorpions, poisons, arrows, all like all different kinds of weird things to sneak in and kill him. So he was drinking this theriak to build up his immune system against the venom. And, uh, dude, he, this dude Galen who wrote about this shit, he was talking about giving, he was Marcus Aurelius's physician. And he was like, Marcus Aurelius, he's like, it's getting ridiculous. It's getting annoying. I keep having to up his opium dose. He keeps using more and more fucking opium. I can't get him off of it. Oh my god. And, uh, so Galen, the physician, the, the surgeon general of the Roman Empire, uh, under Marcus Aurelius. Uh, and Nero, I think, basically, uh,

• 2:08:20Speaker 01

  equates to 10% of all the Greek literature from antiquity. 10% of it is medical. And this dude that, uh, wrote this dissertation, based it all off Galen, is talking about all these drug compounds that are used in all the literature. So what he does is he looks at all the ancient literature. From, from Homer to, you know, like 800, to like the time that Beowulf was written, basically.

• 2:08:48Speaker 01

  80. And he's like,

• 2:08:52Speaker 01

  Finding all of this evidence of crazy drug use. And he has this crazy theory also that, uh, I don't know if it's crazy, I don't know. The problem like with, with talking to people like them, like him, is that I don't know ancient Greek. I can't read it.

• 2:09:08Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:09:08Speaker 01

  And I try to have, I've tried to have like four or five academics come on the show to like refute him. But they won't come on with him. They all refused to debate him, except for one guy.

• 2:09:17Joe Rogan?

  Interesting.

• 2:09:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:18Joe Rogan?

  Why?

• 2:09:18Speaker 01

  Cause he's saying Christ is a drug.

• 2:09:21Joe Rogan?

  Oh, I saw that video.

• 2:09:22Speaker 01

  Oh, you saw the whole thing?

• 2:09:23Joe Rogan?

  No, I saw that video pop up on my YouTube. My Danny Jones going crazy. What is he doing? Christ is a drug?

• 2:09:30Speaker 01

  So.

• 2:09:30Joe Rogan?

  But that's also what John Marco Allegro alleges.

• 2:09:33Speaker 01

  Kind of, kind of.

• 2:09:35Joe Rogan?

  Well, he said that the ancient Sumerian word for a mushroom, it, no, for Christ is a mushroom. It's covered in God's semen.

• 2:09:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:43Joe Rogan?

  Cause the mushrooms would come out of the ground and they thought the rain was God coming on the earth. And that's where, you know, that's what gave life to the earth. And then they would take these mushrooms and see God.

• 2:09:53Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah. I don't know much about John Marco Allegro, but I think that I, I read his book, the, uh, the.

• 2:09:59Joe Rogan?

  Sacred Mushroom in the Cross.

• 2:10:00Speaker 01

  Mushroom in the Cross, yeah. He was like using Sumerian roots or something to translate the Dead Sea Scrolls. But this guy's basically saying the word Christ, the word, the, the, the root of the word Christ is Hreo in Greek. Right? And it was used since Homer. And there's all these passages, which he's, this dude sent me, I've literally, I, I, I call him all the time and I ask him, I'm like, I need more evidence. Send me more shit. And he sends me passages from like ancient literature, Homer, that's translated with the English directly under it. And they're using this word, Christ, as a term for applying drugs to people in antiquity.

• 2:10:35Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:10:36Speaker 01

  Like Christing arrows with poisons, right? It's like, uh, and.

• 2:10:41Joe Rogan?

  And what year was this where they were doing this?

• 2:10:43Speaker 01

  Back all the way to like 800 B.C. was when Homer starts using it.

• 2:10:48Joe Rogan?

  So they're using this term before Christ?

• 2:10:50Speaker 01

  Way before Christ. It was, well, so to be clear, in antiquity, if you look it up on the thesaurus, the actual like Greek thesaurus, it's called the T L G. And you look up the word Christ, there's, there's over 200 and 200,000 or more uses of the word Christ. And there's like 350 times where it's used in the context of drugs before Jesus Christ is ever written about.

• 2:11:16Speaker 01

  And what he's, what he's basically claiming is that there's like, it's, it's, it's the, the process of applying something, like there's, there's different contexts, like there's a guy who like, christed himself in fucking cow shit, there's people who are christing ships with plaster to make them more waterproof, but there's a vast majority of literature, including Galen, who writes about christing using drugs. And he's coming up with this controversial theory, which is, you know, super fucking controversial, that Christ was like, if you think of the word Christ, a person can be a Christer, like a Christ, like think of Bob the Builder, he's a builder, he builds shit.

• 2:11:59Speaker 01

  Christ was, they called him Jesus the Christ. So he thinks Christ was somebody who was involved with drugs, taking drugs, giving people drugs. A shaman. Performing, performing magic, like a shaman, yeah, exactly, similar to that. And like. By the way, a real shaman would say all the things that Jesus said. Yes. That's true, that's a good point. So, and it gets like, it gets way weirder, bro. And again, like I, this is all according to him, I don't know if any of this is real, I just find it fucking fascinating, and I wish I could find somebody who really knows the Greek to debate this dude and call him out on his bullshit, but I can't. The only person I've found was an exorcist who's done like 10,000 exorcisms on Skype.

• 2:12:44Speaker 01

  A Skype exorcist? A Skype exorcist. That sounds like a scam and a half. And he came in and they were just arguing about it for a little while, and the guy tried to baptize me with holy oil, and you know, I got into an argument with him about drugs. He tried to baptize you? Yeah, he brought holy, holy oil, and he tried to baptize me with the holy oil. Did he say why he was doing this? Because he thinks that I, uh, he thinks that Satan is inside of me. Of you? Of me, yeah, and, uh, which he might be. What, what evidence did he have that Satan was inside of you? Because I like to consume drugs recreationally, and I was telling him if Satan is drugs, if I can smoke marijuana and it's prescribed by a doctor, is it still Satan? He goes, no, don't play those games with me. And I'm like, well, how come every time I get really, really fucking bombed,

• 2:13:29Speaker 01

  I think about things like spending more times with my kids? And things like good things, like. Yeah. And he's like, don't try to patronize me, you know what it is, it's the devil.

• 2:13:38Joe Rogan?

  Oh, he's a fool.

• 2:13:39Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. That's foolish. That's a problem. Like, this guy is a show- is a show- a showman.

• 2:13:43Joe Rogan?

  Well, cannabis was used in churches. They used to, you know, the incense where they would go around? They would- that was cannabis. They would use that.

• 2:13:50Speaker 01

  Right, right.

• 2:13:51Joe Rogan?

  And they would get everybody in the church high.

• 2:13:52Speaker 01

  And fumigate it, yeah.

• 2:13:53Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they would literally hotbox the church.

• 2:13:55Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 2:13:55Joe Rogan?

  And this is a part of this whole ritual of, you know, giving in to- to Christ, giving in to God.

• 2:14:04Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:14:04Joe Rogan?

  This- the idea that it's bad because some people have bad experiences. Man, you could apply that to almost anything.

• 2:14:10Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:14:11Joe Rogan?

  I think marijuana makes people more compassionate, kinder, more sensitive. But also paranoid. You could freak out. You could- if you're riddled with anxiety and you have a hard time controlling that anxiety in your mind and you take a high dose of marijuana, you could freak out.

• 2:14:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:14:27Joe Rogan?

  It's also connected to schizophrenia.

• 2:14:29Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:14:30Joe Rogan?

  Because I think there's people that have a tendency towards schizophrenia anyway, and then a large dose of marijuana tends to give them psychotic breaks. There's like real literature, there's real- real evidence of that. So this is like important that if you're a person who thinks that marijuana is overall net positive, which I do, it's important to talk about the negatives, just like everything else.

• 2:14:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, totally.

• 2:14:49Joe Rogan?

  Alcohol, food, everything. There's a lot of different things that if you do- if you drink too much water, you'll fucking die, okay?

• 2:14:57Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:14:57Joe Rogan?

  There's a lot of things that aren't good for you under certain circumstances, but the only way we know how to do it and how not to do it is to do studies. And when it's illegal and you're terrified, you can go to jail, or if you're an academic and you want to study this as your main- you just get dismissed. It's could be career suicide.

• 2:15:17Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:15:18Joe Rogan?

  So, these people are foolish.

• 2:15:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, and that's the problem. Like, like, this was the only dude I could get to agree to come sit with him because this guy had a YouTube channel, he wanted to promote himself and all this stuff. But like, a lot of the academics, I talked to a lot of Harvard philologists to try to come debate this guy. And like, the philologists, like, there's a difference between a linguist, which I think Marco Allegro was, and a philologist, where the linguists look at the actual, uh, like, the complexities of the text itself and the language. But the philologists, what they do is they're looking for context. So like, they- what they do is they take words and they try to figure out what these specific words meant in certain time periods. So they take a word, take their time machine back, let's take it back to 200 B.C. A hundred B.C. whatever it is. And they say, okay.

• 2:16:03Speaker 01

  Let's just use the example of the word Rio Christ. Let's look at all of the corpus of all the fucking literature that existed in the library of Alexandria. There was ancient comedy, ancient plays.

• 2:16:14Joe Rogan?

  What did you say there? The word free, what did you say?

• 2:16:17Speaker 01

  Creo.

• 2:16:17Joe Rogan?

  Creo?

• 2:16:18Speaker 01

  Creo, yeah, that's the.

• 2:16:19Joe Rogan?

  Creo.

• 2:16:20Speaker 01

  It's like, it's spelled X.R.I.O., but it's pronounced like Creo, Creo.

• 2:16:24Joe Rogan?

  And that was the original word for Christ?

• 2:16:26Speaker 01

  The original word for Christ is Creo, yeah.

• 2:16:27Joe Rogan?

  Oh.

• 2:16:28Speaker 01

  And I've had people like confirm this with me and I recently had a fucking scholar on the show, a religious scholar who turned atheist. Weirdly enough, he started out Christian and turned atheist. And he was telling me, he's like, I'd be surprised if the word Creo was ever used before, before Christ. And I literally pulled up the source of Euripides talking about using Christing drugs in like, I think it was 200 B.C. and the dude was like blown away.

• 2:16:53Joe Rogan?

  Hmm, so he didn't know that?

• 2:16:55Speaker 01

  He didn't know it and this dude's like a serious academic.

• 2:16:57Joe Rogan?

  So this guy that you had on your podcast, what is his name again? That Christed drug guy?

• 2:17:00Speaker 01

  Amen Hillman.

• 2:17:01Joe Rogan?

  Amen Hillman.

• 2:17:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:17:02Joe Rogan?

  And he's a legit scholar.

• 2:17:05Speaker 01

  He's a legit scholar, PhD.

• 2:17:06Joe Rogan?

  And other legit scholars are unwilling to even entertain this?

• 2:17:10Speaker 01

  Yes. I've talked to many of them on the phone and a lot of them say, uh, they don't want to give him, I won't name the people, but one of them said that they, they just don't want to give him the platform or the credibility of being in the same room. Other people say that it would just take too much time for them to prep for it. And I just think it's a bull, I just think it's bullshit, like I, this is the only way to get to the truth is to hear like a credible person dismantle his argument, right? So like, I have it, I just keep falling deeper and deeper into this rabbit hole of all this crazy ancient Greek shit. And like, you know, he's talking about ancient like vaccines that they were using, like similar to what we're talking about with the theriak. He says that there's texts that talks about cutting kids, cutting children.

• 2:17:54Speaker 01

  Soaking bandages and drug and snake venoms and wrapping the cut with a snake venom. So that that the young person would create antibodies because they have more robust immune systems because they're younger. Hmm. And they would use that the kids bodily fluid as fucking vaccines to snake bites. Oh. Yeah. Oh, they're making kids into vaccine factories? They were turning kids into vaccine factories. So that they get snake venom? Because everyone was getting bitten by snakes back then. Of course. And then they would take drugs too, like they would, I'm sure they would take psychotropic drugs that would and they would call them death inducing drugs where they would have snake venoms, they would like take snake venom drugs that if you don't have an antidote for it, an antichrist for it, that you would die.

• 2:18:38Speaker 01

  So you have to take this antidote so you don't die from the fucking drug you just drank. Right? These antidotes. And like he connects this all to Jesus in this elaborate way where there's Mark 1453 where Jesus is caught in the garden of Gethsemane with the naked boy, right? And then there's a scene of the young boy running away naked, right? When the, when the, when the Roman SWAT team pulls up on him and then the little kid runs away and he goes, oh, I'm not, I'm not a, I'm not a trafficker, I'm not a robber, whatever the word last days means, means like pirate, trafficker, robber. And then they take him and then he's on the cross the next day. And he's like screaming out, like dying of thirst in between two traffickers.

• 2:19:21Speaker 01

  And he's asking, and there's this dude, Nonus, who writes about this scene specifically in ancient Greek. And he talks about them giving, trying to give him the sponge and he's denying the sponge, right? So the sponge, Nonus is writing about this, that the sponge is the antidote to the dip sauce, which is the antidote to the North African viper. But he's refusing to take the antidote. He's just dying because he took this death inducer at 4:00 AM in the park, in the garden of Gethsemane. And now he's just going to let himself die on the cross. So like, yeah, there's that. I don't know. I don't know what to make of any of it. It make of this stuff. I just, you know, I hear people saying that it's all bullshit. But like, fuck, is it interesting?

• 2:20:05Joe Rogan?

  Well, bizarre that they use the term Christ before Christ.

• 2:20:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:20:08Joe Rogan?

  Just bizarre.

• 2:20:09Speaker 01

  It's been used. Yeah, you can look it up. It's used all throughout Homer, Euripides, all these other authors. Like, there's, like, again, getting back to the philology stuff. The philologists, they go back in time and they look at the context of all of the literature. Not just, not just the biblical canon, which is like a narrow lane of ancient literature, right? But they're looking at the philosophy, the, the, the, um, legal texts, the medical texts, everything. And saying, okay, let's take this word, look where it's used in all of these different texts throughout all kinds of professions, and see what the consensus is of what it meant during that time period. And what he's claiming is that the fucking word Christ meant drugs back then.

• 2:20:49Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:20:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:20:52Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:20:53Speaker 01

  Pretty bananas.

• 2:20:54Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's so hard to know what all that stuff was about. It's so hard to know why these people wrote these things down. You know, when I had Wes Huff on?

• 2:21:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:21:04Joe Rogan?

  One of the things he talked about is the Book of Isaiah, when you see it in the Dead Sea Scrolls, and then a thousand years later, it's verbatim. A thousand, a thousand years after the Dead Sea Scroll, the version that they find in the Book of Isaiah is word for word.

• 2:21:17Speaker 01

  Really?

• 2:21:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, a thousand years. Like, what were they trying to document? Like, what were the original stories? Because like, human beings are not a good source of information, especially back then. It's just too hard to be accountable. Why would you be honest? People make grandiose claims, they exaggerate. We see it today. It's like, humans today are the same as humans back then. We're flawed.

• 2:21:41Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:21:41Joe Rogan?

  So we know today that our versions of history are deeply biased. Our versions of world events, our versions of, I mean, if the United States government could write the story about the invasion of Iraq without investigative journalists, right? What would be the story?

• 2:21:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:21:58Joe Rogan?

  And this is part of the problem. It's like, we don't really know what they were trying to say. It was an oral history for who knows how long before they ever wrote down the Old Testament.

• 2:22:07Speaker 01

  Yeah. And it got redacted and added to over time. There's like all kinds of weird secret gospels, secret gospel of Mark, they claim that this dude, uh, Morton Smith came up with, which was similar to Ammon's theories, but then, you know, people say, oh, that's a forgery. It's a forgery, the secret gospel, if the secret gospel of Mark's a forgery, that he fucking knew Greek really well. And he knew the culture really well and all the cults, you know, and like, dude, like, you know, even like the mysteries of, uh, of the hospitals in ancient Rome, like the, um, the temples of Asclepius and doing all those rituals in the, the temples of Asclepius, using medicine and drugs simultaneously and these, these venoms and all this stuff.

• 2:22:51Speaker 01

  Is, uh, it's interesting to learn, you know, and especially when you compare that stuff to the biblical stuff. You know, like how much has it been changed? How much has the meaning been changed? And like, the people, most of the academics who study this stuff are, maybe not most of them, but a large major, a large percentage of them, I think, that I've talked to. They're religious scholars, scholars of the Bible and Christianity, but they also subscribe to Christianity. You know, so I'm like, there is that like a, it's weird that there's kind of like a built in bias into this stuff. You kind of want this stuff to mean something.

• 2:23:30Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:23:30Speaker 01

  You know what I'm saying?

• 2:23:31Joe Rogan?

  Yes, for sure. And that was what was interesting about Allegro. Cause John Marco Allegro was an ordained minister who, once he became a theologian, a theologist, theologian, rather, once he studied theology, he started to have agnostic thoughts. And so he, when he was one of the deciphers of the Dead Sea Scrolls, when he was on the committee, uh, he was agnostic at the time. So he had already decided and through his study of all these different religions that maybe he wouldn't subscribe to any of them and leave an open mind. So he was the only person on the commission that was deciphering the Dead Sea Scrolls over a period of like 14 million, or 14 years, rather, he studied this stuff. He was the only one who was agnostic.

• 2:24:15Joe Rogan?

  And again, his claims are widely dismissed by many, many people. But I think.

• 2:24:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, this dude Amen thinks he's full of shit.

• 2:24:23Joe Rogan?

  Does he? What does he think?

• 2:24:24Speaker 01

  He just, he, uh, he, he was like, came up under this, under like some of the top classical scholars of like modern times. One of those dudes is Karl Ruck. He wrote The Road to Eleusis. And this other guy is John Scarborough, who's dead now. And for some reason, none of them, whenever I ask them about Allegro, they're like, I don't fucking know. They don't pay attention to it for some reason.

• 2:24:43Joe Rogan?

  Well, I think you would have to be a real scholar in biblical languages to even understand what the fuck he's saying.

• 2:24:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:24:51Joe Rogan?

  And to be able to translate ancient Sumer.

• 2:24:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:24:55Joe Rogan?

  Ancient Sumerian, like according to Wes Huff, he's like, I tried. I couldn't even figure out how to do it.

• 2:24:59Speaker 01

  Also, how does ancient Sumerian connect to Hebrew?

• 2:25:02Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:25:03Speaker 01

  Is there any correlation between ancient Sumerian and ancient Hebrew? Do they share any roots? Is there any? Are there any bridges that connect those two languages? I have no idea.

• 2:25:11Joe Rogan?

  I don't know either. But you know, you're dealing with, if, if it really goes back that far, so if he's talking about this term from ancient Sumer, where they are calling it a drug, they're saying it's a mushroom. And this is from 5,000 years ago, 6,000 years ago, you know, you're predating the Bible by a long stretch. And how old was that? I mean, if, if they're right about Turkey and Turkey was the, the original civilization, like what, when is that? Is that 12,000 years ago? What, what is the real date of Egypt? What is the real date of the original structures of Egypt? Do they know? I mean, we're told it's 2,500 B.C. for the Great Pyramid, but boy, there's a lot of people that don't agree with that, including geologists.

• 2:25:54Joe Rogan?

  When you get guys like Robert Shock, who say like this water erosion is thousands of years of rainfall. Last time you had a heavy rainfall in the Nile Valley, you're looking at 9,000 years ago.

• 2:26:02Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:26:03Joe Rogan?

  So you have thousands of years of rainfall before 9,000 years ago that's going to create this kind of erosion. And so it's hard to know because everybody wants to be right. And they all, they all have this date that they've been talking about and writing books about and giving lectures about. They'd never want to revise that. They gatekeep that information until the day, they never want to have an open mind and say perhaps there's this, there is evidence, of course, that there was a sophisticated civilization there 2500 B.C. But maybe they were a part of a very old civilization. And this is the Zep Tepe thing that Zawi Hawass was totally ignorant of. And he thought it was just completely bullshit. And this is the King's List that goes back 30,000 years.

• 2:26:46Joe Rogan?

  That they talk about and the way Egyptologists that are conventional thinkers, they think that it's mythology. They think that's myth, but you know, you get to about 2500 B.C., that's all real. Well, how the fuck do you know?

• 2:27:03Speaker 01

  Right, they don't.

• 2:27:03Joe Rogan?

  You don't. And also, if there was an advanced civilization 11,800 years ago that was able to create Go Beckley Tepe, which we know now to be true. What else have we not found?

• 2:27:16Speaker 01

  Right. Was it a breakaway civilization? Did they escape the earth and go to the moon?

• 2:27:18Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:27:19Speaker 01

  Right? Like they're trying to do now?

• 2:27:21Joe Rogan?

  Or, you know, was it just that they had achieved a very high level of sophistication in technology that's very different from the path that we took?

• 2:27:29Speaker 01

  Right, totally.

• 2:27:30Joe Rogan?

  That's what I think. I think the path that they took involved immense stone structures, cosmology, they probably didn't have internal combustion engines, they probably had a completely different kind of technology that we wouldn't even think of because we went in this internal combustion engine, plastic, microchip, electricity. We went to that direction.

• 2:27:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:27:50Joe Rogan?

  But you could imagine primitive man evolving to create technology that's far different than the way we went.

• 2:27:59Speaker 01

  Yeah. Do you think we might have cracked that somewhere, like in some deep black programs? That we could have that, they wouldn't want to unleash that on society because it could like fuck up the economic system or like collapse the world?

• 2:28:10Joe Rogan?

  Jesse Michaels believes that there's gravity technology that they were researching in the 1960s and that they had achieved some sort of breakthrough propulsion system that is probably a lot of what you see when you see these UAPs and these crafts that move in very strange ways. That makes sense to me. And again, the idea that they couldn't keep that secret, shut the fuck up. Of course they could.

• 2:28:34Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:28:34Joe Rogan?

  Of course they could.

• 2:28:35Speaker 01

  There's this lady Catherine Fitz who's the, she was the head of the Department of HUD under George Bush. And they brought her in after like the mortgage crisis to like figure out how to like restabilize the economy and what the banks were doing and all this stuff. And she was looking at like missing money. And she found that there was like, when she, when she applied her knowledge of mathematics and like what's going on with like the, the federal budget and where all the money's going. She said the most reasonable explanation, you know how there's like 21 trillion dollars missing from the DOD?

• 2:29:13Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:29:14Speaker 01

  The day before nine 11, Donald Trump felt like there's like two, two and a half trillion dollars, whatever it was. Now that's ballooned to like 21 trillion dollars. And she thinks that, you know, well, pull up the spreadsheet, see where that money went. Oh, it's not on the receipt. I don't know where it went. She thinks it went to like black budget shit, like military, black military technology, like anti-gravity. And she thinks that Mr. Global, whoever that is, the bankers, the central bankers are literally using all of that money and funneling it into black projects to create a breakaway civilization in case there's like some sort of catastrophe on earth or something happens.

• 2:29:55Joe Rogan?

  Oh, God.

• 2:29:56Speaker 01

  And like.

• 2:29:57Joe Rogan?

  Where are they doing this?

• 2:29:58Speaker 01

  They're doing this at fucking Lockheed Martin. I have no idea.

• 2:30:00Joe Rogan?

  Underground or something?

• 2:30:01Speaker 01

  Maybe, yeah. Oh, yeah. That's another thing she says. She says there's a lot of money that's going into building all these underground, underground bases, continuity of government, tunnel systems, all of this stuff. And I'm looking at this, I'm like, she legit worked under the Bush administration. She was like a financial genius.

• 2:30:15Joe Rogan?

  Right, but she could be a kook.

• 2:30:16Speaker 01

  She could be.

• 2:30:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's the problem. When people are super intelligent, but also crazy.

• 2:30:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:30:23Joe Rogan?

  You know, and also had a prominent position in government, but also crazy.

• 2:30:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. I guess there's a lot of really intelligent people that are super crazy.

• 2:30:30Joe Rogan?

  And does she physically, has she been to these places? Like, how does she know that they're real? Does she know, has she talked to someone to explain this breakaway civilization thing? Or is it just a theory?

• 2:30:41Speaker 01

  She's friends with the dude who wrote the book that's titled Swastika's Psyops and Saucers.

• 2:30:48Joe Rogan?

  What?

• 2:30:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:30:51Joe Rogan?

  What's that book about?

• 2:30:52Speaker 01

  How the Nazis are controlling UFOs and psyops and controlling the world and, you know, playing the world like it's their fucking docu-drama and recreating reality and inventing all this crazy off-world stuff and how Roswell was Soviet Union crashing stuff here and basically it's all Nazi black budget stuff, I think is like the main point that that guy...

• 2:31:14Joe Rogan?

  Do they dismiss the idea that we're visited at all by something from somewhere else?

• 2:31:19Speaker 01

  I mean, what do you mean who? Who? Like...

• 2:31:21Joe Rogan?

  These people that think that it's all Nazi stuff and Soviet Union stuff?

• 2:31:25Speaker 01

  I don't think that they're saying it's all that, but they're probably saying, I haven't read all his books, but I think he's saying, when he wrote that book, it was probably all Nazis, no aliens, but now I'm sure his points, his views have evolved on it.

• 2:31:39Joe Rogan?

  That's part of the problem too. It's like, you know, when you see these reports, whenever I see like a story that's in the New York Times where the Pentagon is admitting we have, you know, there's been off-world crafts and all these different things and you get these David Grush guys that are testifying about that we've recovered crashed vehicles. It's like, how much of that is a psyop?

• 2:32:00Speaker 01

  I think most of it.

• 2:32:01Joe Rogan?

  I think a lot of it, yeah. I don't even know if they know it's a psyop, but if I was the government and I was working on top-secret propulsion systems, the first thing I would do is spread a bunch of fake rumors about UFOs.

• 2:32:12Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 2:32:12Joe Rogan?

  This is how we can't explain it. We don't know. We're being visited. They're super intelligent. We don't know where they're from. We don't know how they're doing this.

• 2:32:19Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 2:32:19Joe Rogan?

  And then you have an explanation for why these people are seeing these things in the sky when it's really just your shit that you're flying around.

• 2:32:25Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 2:32:26Joe Rogan?

  But yet, if you listen to Jacques Vallée and you read any of his books, he's got these stories that people were telling from the 1700s and the 1800s that mirror almost exactly the experiences that people are having today.

• 2:32:39Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:32:40Joe Rogan?

  That's where it gets weird, because, okay, now you're predating any possibility of this being modern technology, you know, that is just hidden and tucked away. They couldn't have done that in the 1700s. There were no way. They didn't even have airplanes yet, right? Okay.

• 2:32:56Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:32:56Joe Rogan?

  So if we admit that... Then we have to go, okay, well, what, what's going on then? Are we, is there something else here that's here, that's been here forever? Like some people think? Or are we looking at something that's visiting us and keeping an eye on us from somewhere else? That's where it's fun. That part, that's the fun one. The fun one is not that it's ours. The fun one is that we're being visited.

• 2:33:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, and are we being visited? Or did they just live under the oceans?

• 2:33:24Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:33:25Speaker 01

  You know, like, have they been here fucking forever? And like, you know, there's this case, uh, Richard Dolan came on my show recently and he was telling me, he wrote this new book about all the underwater cases ever documented, the underwater UFOs, USOs. And there's one from like the early 1700s where there was this like ship sailing across the Pacific. And this giant glowing orb came out of the ocean. And these sailors all wrote about it. How this, this massive like football stadium sized glowing orb came up out of the ocean and like flew away. And, you know, like if we've, how much of the ocean have we explored?

• 2:34:02Joe Rogan?

  Very small.

• 2:34:03Speaker 01

  Very small amount. We've explored more than the moon, I think.

• 2:34:05Joe Rogan?

  And it would be the perfect base. If you wanted to come here and observe human beings without them being able to see what's going on, that's the best place to hide.

• 2:34:12Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:34:13Joe Rogan?

  Because no one's going there. They don't have the capability of going there. You know, we have submarines, but I mean, how, what are the, I mean, if the submarines see things, did they tell us?

• 2:34:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:34:22Joe Rogan?

  Like if the submarine saw a UFO underwater, would they have a press conference?

• 2:34:25Speaker 01

  Right, exactly.

• 2:34:26Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 2:34:26Speaker 01

  We know about the nuclear bases above ground because those guys have come out and talked about it. But like, all of the nuclear submarines that are patrolling the oceans at all times, like right off of our coast, off both coasts. Like if they're carrying multiple nuclear warheads, I'm sure they're seeing something or they're detecting something there.

• 2:34:43Joe Rogan?

  Well, there's this one video of something that was moving 500 knots under the water. Like this, this thing that like flew by their camera, they don't.

• 2:34:51Speaker 01

  On the sub?

• 2:34:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I was, I forget where it was being recorded. But it was a video of something that was like a beam of light that shot through the screen. Like you could see it moving underwater at this insane rate of speed with no ripples, no disruption of the water, just moving through the water.

• 2:35:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:35:13Joe Rogan?

  And then there's these transmedium videos, these videos of these things flying, they go into the water with no splash, no nothing. And they don't lose any momentum.

• 2:35:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think the best evidence that those things have been here forever is probably like ancient stories, biblical story, like aliens or like angels and demons stuff like.

• 2:35:30Joe Rogan?

  What about Ezekiel?

• 2:35:31Speaker 01

  Like before the, yeah Ezekiel too, right?

• 2:35:33Joe Rogan?

  Ezekiel in the Bible, that that story is nuts, the wheel within a wheel, the way he's describing, like what are you seeing?

• 2:35:39Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:35:39Joe Rogan?

  And imagine there's, you've no context.

• 2:35:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:35:43Joe Rogan?

  Imagine seeing something that's floating some geometric pattern that's hovering in the sky above your head and emitting light and trying to explain this and then also going back and trying to remember exactly what you saw because you're probably freaking the fuck out. You really do have some sort of an encounter with some orb that's flying in the sky, how do you even describe it?

• 2:36:04Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 2:36:05Joe Rogan?

  What context do you put it in? Do you describe it as an alien? Do you describe it as an angel? Do you think it's God?

• 2:36:10Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 2:36:10Joe Rogan?

  Like what do you think it is?

• 2:36:11Speaker 01

  Right, or is it drugs? Does drugs, are drugs playing a role in this?

• 2:36:14Joe Rogan?

  Drugs play a part of it.

• 2:36:16Speaker 01

  Well, then there's like James Fox's alien from the Vargine.

• 2:36:19Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:36:19Speaker 01

  Which smelled like sulfur.

• 2:36:21Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:36:21Speaker 01

  And there's biblical accounts of demons smelling like sulfur and having cloven feet. So did that exactly describes that being in James's documentary.

• 2:36:28Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:36:29Speaker 01

  The hospital smelled like sulfur for like a week after they said.

• 2:36:31Joe Rogan?

  And the guy who was handling it died of a horrible infection. This is all documented, the guy who picked up the alien, put it in his squad car, took it to a hospital, that hospital wouldn't deal with it, took it to another hospital. That, and then that guy dies of a horrible bacterial infection that they can't cure with antibiotics.

• 2:36:48Speaker 01

  Hmm, yeah, that's fucking nuts, dude.

• 2:36:50Joe Rogan?

  Fucking nuts. And then the, all the people, the eyewitnesses that were there that saw the thing and when he brings the police officer to the site of the crash, the officer starts weeping uncontrollably.

• 2:37:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:37:01Joe Rogan?

  Recounting the story, unless that guy's the greatest actor of all time.

• 2:37:04Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:37:04Joe Rogan?

  Like what is going on there?

• 2:37:05Speaker 01

  There's the story where he walked up to the guy's house and the guy like pulled a gun on him, he's like, if you guys come any closer, I'm shooting you.

• 2:37:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:37:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's weird shit, man.

• 2:37:14Speaker 01

  It's weird dude, and it's weird that like, everyone's trying to paint their own narrative. There's different groups competing on like, how they wanna paint the UFO thing, right? You have like, different camps of people, like, in the government or in media. I don't know what the difference is.

• 2:37:27Joe Rogan?

  And there's guys like you and I that are basically useful idiots.

• 2:37:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 2:37:30Joe Rogan?

  They come on our podcast and talk a lot of shit, and we go, "I don't know." Figure it out, folks.

• 2:37:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, we're feds. We're feds. We got the Palantir honey trap over here.

• 2:37:38Joe Rogan?

  Like, what is that thing? That thing's all filled with pegasus.

• 2:37:41Speaker 01

  Palantir, bro.

• 2:37:42Joe Rogan?

  They're reading every single one of your little jot downs that you put on that. Yeah, who knows? But if you did have some sort of like, infinitely superior technology, and you've had it for a long time, when do you, if ever, let the public know?

• 2:37:57Speaker 01

  And what do you do with that too?

• 2:37:59Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:37:59Speaker 01

  If you're the guy, right, like, how many, I don't know how many people know all of the secrets. Right, but if there is a handful of dudes, how do you go about living your life when you're that dude? And when you know like, shit that can change the face of humanity forever? How do you go home to your wife and kids, right? Is it like, are you living in that show, uh, what's the show where they go up in the elevator and it wipes their mind?

• 2:38:21Joe Rogan?

  Oh, Severance.

• 2:38:21Speaker 01

  Severance, yeah, yeah, yeah. Is it like that? Do they have real life Severance?

• 2:38:25Joe Rogan?

  I don't think so. No, I think they just rely on these people being secret. And, you know, there's the thing about Bob Lazar's story. You know, Bob Lazar lost his job because his wife was cheating on him.

• 2:38:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:38:37Joe Rogan?

  Cause his wife thought that, you know, he couldn't tell her what he was doing. So when he was flying off to S4, he would say, "I gotta go to work." And she's like, "At 11 o'clock at night on a Friday, get the fuck out of here." So she starts fucking this other guy.

• 2:38:48Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:38:49Joe Rogan?

  And they were listening to his phone calls. So they had his phone tapped.

• 2:38:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:38:53Joe Rogan?

  And because his wife was having an affair, he was deemed to be at a risk of being emotionally unstable.

• 2:38:57Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:38:58Joe Rogan?

  So they released him. And so then he's like, "This is bullshit." And he starts telling people, "Hey, man, we're working on UFOs. They have a crashed UFO. I saw it. They fly it every Wednesday," or whatever it was. "Come, I'll show you."

• 2:39:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:39:09Joe Rogan?

  And so he brings people out to the test site, where they're gonna observe from one of the mountains.

• 2:39:13Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:39:14Joe Rogan?

  And then he gets arrested.

• 2:39:15Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:39:15Joe Rogan?

  And then he goes public so that he doesn't get killed. This is his justification of it all.

• 2:39:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, I used to think Bob Lazar was full of shit, but I've come around on it. I don't think that anymore. After learning more about all the like the disinformation and all the, all the time and money they put into just confusing people, like the Paul Benowitz story, you know? Uh, I, I think it's, he would be the perfect candidate, candidate, uh, to recruit just because of his background. Like, you know, his first wife committed suicide, he ran a brothel.

• 2:39:42Joe Rogan?

  He was a nut.

• 2:39:43Speaker 01

  He was a nutcase, dude. Like, he's a perfect person. He's perfect, they could, they could deny him so easily. Like, look at this dude's background. You think we would hire this dude?

• 2:39:50Joe Rogan?

  And also a legitimate genius.

• 2:39:52Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:39:52Joe Rogan?

  I mean, the guy put a rocket engine on a Honda in like 1985.

• 2:39:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:40:00Joe Rogan?

  He was a nut. He converted his Corvette to a hydrogen engine.

• 2:40:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:40:04Joe Rogan?

  And like, you know, I think it was the nineties, he did that. He had a hydrogen powered Corvette that he engineered himself. See if you can find Bob Lazar's hydrogen powered Corvette. He was a nut.

• 2:40:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:40:17Joe Rogan?

  You know, but he doesn't seem like a liar. And the podcast, obviously it resonates with people because I think the podcast I had with him on YouTube is the most viewed podcast that we've ever had, including Donald Trump.

• 2:40:29Speaker 01

  Really?

• 2:40:30Joe Rogan?

  Is that true, Jamie? No? Who's number one now?

• 2:40:32Speaker 01

  Donny beat him?

• 2:40:33Joe Rogan?

  Who's number one? Elon. First Elon's number one.

• 2:40:36Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:40:37Joe Rogan?

  Um, that was the one when he smoked weed.

• 2:40:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 2:40:40Joe Rogan?

  Smoking weed really took it over the top.

• 2:40:42Speaker 01

  That was a good, that was a good moment. Do you smoke on all podcasts?

• 2:40:45Joe Rogan?

  No, no.

• 2:40:46Speaker 01

  Just certain ones, just certain.

• 2:40:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, so this is Bob Lazar's hydrogen powered Corvette.

• 2:40:51Speaker 01

  That's amazing.

• 2:40:52Joe Rogan?

  What a fucking kook.

• 2:40:54Speaker 01

  It's beautiful.

• 2:40:54Joe Rogan?

  What a kook. I mean, who fucking did that? This guy created a hydrogen powered Corvette, and that's an old ass Corvette, too. That's a shitty one in the nineties.

• 2:41:02Speaker 01

  If you're throwing shit at the wall, trying to figure out a new way to move fucking planes, that you might as well find people like this.

• 2:41:08Joe Rogan?

  Homemade hydrogen powered Corvette. Look at this, play it. Go full screen.

• 2:41:14Speaker 01

  Oh, this is way throwback. Yeah, I don't hear anything. Is this Reddit?

• 2:41:19Speaker 00

  When the tank's heated, it produces hydrogen and the car burns it. So there's never much gaseous hydrogen in the system at any given time.

• 2:41:30Speaker 00

  So these are the, these are the fuel lines? No, what are these? No, these are the...

• 2:41:35Speaker 01

  That's how you can't see what they're looking at. Here you go. There you go, that's actually...

• 2:41:37Speaker 00

  The heater in the tank and also reads back the temperature of the tank. Why is that important? Well, when you apply heat to hydride, it releases hydrogen. So as power is applied to here, it heats the hydride. Right. And then the gas comes out, the big hose is on the end. They have four hoses. Do they all mix into one big hose or something? Yeah.

• 2:42:00Speaker 01

  Didn't he like hang out with Ed Tell, Ed Teller or talk to Ed Teller at one point? I don't know.

• 2:42:05Speaker 00

  At a certain rate with a certain temperature. And a single tank, you can't get it out at the volume you need. So...

• 2:42:12Joe Rogan?

  So this guy was a legitimate genius and a propulsion expert.

• 2:42:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:16Joe Rogan?

  And that's why they brought him in to say, how does this work?

• 2:42:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:20Joe Rogan?

  And that story, he's told the same story for, you know, whatever it is now, fifty plus years or forty years.

• 2:42:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:28Joe Rogan?

  What is, what year was it?

• 2:42:29Speaker 01

  And there's a good reason, I think, uh...

• 2:42:31Joe Rogan?

  Eighty-five, so forty years? Somewhere around eighty-five?

• 2:42:34Speaker 01

  The biggest argument against him is the, is the MIT stuff, right?

• 2:42:37Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:42:38Speaker 01

  He can't prove that. But there's something that I'm sure you...

• 2:42:40Joe Rogan?

  But the MIT thing though, like, look, if you're working at Los Alamos Labs and you're working on top secret stuff for the government, it's not inconceivable that you'd be educated at MIT and there wouldn't be a record of it. Especially if you're working on something that's like really devious shit.

• 2:42:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:42:55Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. I'll tell you what he told me off the air.

• 2:42:57Speaker 01

  You will?

• 2:42:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:42:58Speaker 01

  God, I can't fucking wait.

• 2:42:59Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, as soon as we're done, we'll wrap this up.

• 2:43:01Speaker 01

  I'm kidding. No, I wanted to like, like the stuff and the stuff, like the, the, the thing that is so astonishing to me is like, all of the brightest minds and unlimited money have gone to more and more ways to figure out how to kill people. Like, during Operation Paperclip, during the time Bob Lazar was at Los Alamos and, and at S4, if he was at S4 or whatever was going on there, like, and, and that dude John von Neumann, who was the mathematician, who was, uh, he, he was in, he came up with the equation. To who and who, by the way, was like the most brilliant mathematical mind of art of in

• 2:43:42Speaker 01

  American history, came up with the the equation of the perfect altitude to detonate fat man and little boy to kill the most people. Which is like, you're using this fucking intellect to do these kinds of things. And now there's a 21 trillion dollar black hole in the DOD like, imagine what they could have, what they could have, they could have something that's probably, I mean, going way out on a limb, conjecture, obviously, I don't fucking know, but like, my, my conspiracy mind wants to go to like, oh my god, they have like another whole military, air force, navy that is disconnected from America, that is probably more powerful than every other country combined, that could just, you know, ta- take over the world in an instant.

• 2:44:27Joe Rogan?

  But can't they already wipe each other out? I mean, the, the whole world has nuclear weapons, there's nuclear weapons in how many different countries? They all launched them simultaneously, there's no life left on earth.

• 2:44:37Speaker 01

  What I'm, what I'm saying with the 21 trillion, they could have some fucking weapon that would render a nuke completely irrelevant, you know, if they do have anti-gravity, and if they have figured out some of this crazy parapsychology stuff, the psionic stuff with the UFOs and like, the mine interfacing, uh, you know, all, all this just kooky stuff that you wanna eas- you wanna dismiss. But 21 trillion, if they were, if they were spending $50 on Stargate, and they, they thought it was worth some sort of intelligence to spy on the Russians, like, how much money would they keep throwing at something if there was just a shred of possibility that it could work?

• 2:45:18Speaker 01

  And if there was evidence that like, this works 3% of the time, and we spent a million dollars on it, let's spend a trillion dollars on it and see how much more advanced we can get, and see how much more control and domi- world domination we can get.

• 2:45:31Joe Rogan?

  One of the things Lazar said about the craft, that he was the sport model, which is that thing on the desk, that's the, the copy of it, um, the, one of the things that he said about it was that there was no controls. When you sit inside the thing, there's no, there's no joystick, there's no steering wheel.

• 2:45:46Speaker 01

  So you use your mind?

• 2:45:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:45:49Joe Rogan?

  There was probably some, I mean, that's probably what we're getting to anyway. We're kind of close to that with phones now.

• 2:45:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:45:55Joe Rogan?

  Right? Like, how many times do you text where you don't even text? You just press the button and say, you know, text Danny, say this. And it just says it for you. Or, you know, how old is Barbra Streisand? And it just, it gives you an instant information. You're talking to it all the time. It's like, and what's the next step? Well, the next step is you think it. Like, you wear it and you think. And it does things for you. And then as technology scales further and further more advanced, you're gonna get to a point where you can move your car with your mind. And then when you have spacecraft, of course, it would be the same sort of technology. You would use technology to move the craft with your mind. You know, they already have these interfaces with fighter pilots where where you look is where the crosshair shows up.

• 2:46:41Joe Rogan?

  So instead of having to like move a crosshair with like a, like,

• 2:46:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:46:46Joe Rogan?

  You know, like if you're playing a video game and you're moving the mouse, you're moving the crosshair to the side. Or if you're using Xbox controller, you're moving that crosshair to where you want to hit.

• 2:46:56Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:46:56Joe Rogan?

  The crosshair goes where their eyes go. So you're wearing this thing that knows where you're looking. And they already have this kind of technology with virtual reality. They have this technology with these meta glasses that they're developing. So they can, while you're, while you have this helmet on, this helmet is not simply a thing that protects your head. It's an electronic interface with the guidance system. And where your eyes look, the crosshairs go.

• 2:47:24Joe Rogan?

  Yo!

• 2:47:24Speaker 01

  Did you see the LLM stuff trying to get soldiers to leave the battlefield in the Russia-Ukraine war?

• 2:47:33Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 2:47:33Speaker 01

  They're using LLMs to, and they're, and the Russians are like hacking the Ukrainians' phones with LLMs, reading everything on their phones, seeing how they communicate with their family, and using LLMs to send messages to their phones of like their family, trying to get them to lay down their weapons and leave the war.

• 2:47:48Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:47:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:47:50Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:47:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, like where does that end up?

• 2:47:52Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's what gets real weird because if you get, if AI starts controlling all the war systems and it just has a goal and it doesn't have any ethics or morals or any concern about life or death, it just has a, it has a directive, like I want you to accomplish this. Take control of the resources and dumbbells, do this, do that, whatever it is. It just does it the most effective way possible, which could be unbelievably brutal.

• 2:48:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, and then like even shit like telepathy or like being able to communicate without words?

• 2:48:25Joe Rogan?

  Well, Elon says that's 100% the goal of Neuralink.

• 2:48:28Speaker 01

  Are you optimistic about that?

• 2:48:30Joe Rogan?

  I'm not optimistic or pessimistic, it's, I think it's inevitable.

• 2:48:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:48:33Joe Rogan?

  I think we're, we're looking at what we have now as normal because it's become normal to carry around a phone with you everywhere. It's become normal to have an Apple Watch on and get all your text messages on your wi- your wrist. It's become normal and I think it's, it'll become normal to be interfaced with the great hive mind. I think we're all gonna be connected with some new technology, the same way we're all connected with social media and email and FaceTime videos and all that shit that we are now, WhatsApp messages. We're all gonna be connected with something that's far more technologically advanced and it'll become normal. Just like this is normal.

• 2:49:10Speaker 01

  I just hope like if it does get there, when it does get there, that we can overcome this sort of place that we've reached with social media where people are just like spatting out whatever comes to their, to the front of their mind at any given moment or like just like rage impulse and, and fighting where there's no, there's no filter, which I think has just created more and more division and miscommunication.

• 2:49:34Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:49:35Speaker 01

  Like if you're, if, if me and you are just talking and we're communicating our minds back and forth.

• 2:49:39Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:49:40Speaker 01

  I don't know how your mind works, but my mind is like a constant hornet's nest of fucking ideas just bouncing around everywhere.

• 2:49:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:49:46Speaker 01

  Right? So if you could read my mind, you're gonna be so goddamn confused. And there's probably gonna be shit in there you don't, I don't want you to know. And it's like, I, like, to the writing process, right? Like, when you write, you know about writing more than anyone, when you write something, you try to, like, distill an idea down to like the most precise form to communicate it accurately to the audience, right?

• 2:50:08Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:50:09Speaker 01

  Like, you go through so many revisions and you revise and you refine until you get it perfect. So you can communicate that message to your audience. But if it's just, if it's just a direct stream of consciousness, unedited, I can't imagine that would be a good thing. You know, unless you're like some, some meditative yogi that like has a really editorialized stream of consciousness, which I don't.

• 2:50:32Joe Rogan?

  Maybe instead of just having access to all your thoughts, maybe it's just simply what you're trying to communicate about your thoughts. Maybe it won't be as simple as we all have access to each other's minds. Maybe it would just be much more, you'll be able to purely transmit your feelings and your ideas without the context of a language. Maybe we'll have to develop some sort of universal language.

• 2:50:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:50:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Which would be, you know, the tab, Tower of Babel. You know, and I've, I've made that connection, I made that connection last night, I think, about Christ. Like, Christ was of a virgin birth. Like, what's more of a virgin birth than sentient superintelligence from AI?

• 2:51:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:51:11Joe Rogan?

  If that becomes a being, that is essentially a god and is given birth by a virgin mother. I mean, that's the story of Christ. It's just, it's just confusing. It's just confusing if you translate it over and over and over time. But if Christ is supposed to return, that would be a way, something like a god would return. It would return through artificial intelligence, if it just emerged out of our creation and our insatiable desire to make new and better things.

• 2:51:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, that that that makes a lot of sense.

• 2:51:43Joe Rogan?

  Like, why else do we have this insane desire to have new and improved things?

• 2:51:47Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:51:47Joe Rogan?

  Because like, isn't your phone good enough? Like, I have a Samsung Galaxy S25 Ultra and I have an iPhone 16. They're good. They're good enough. You don't need to make a better one.

• 2:51:57Speaker 01

  Have you seen Westworld on HBO?

• 2:51:59Joe Rogan?

  Uh-huh, yeah.

• 2:52:00Speaker 01

  One of my favorite.

• 2:52:00Joe Rogan?

  Season one is fucking amazing.

• 2:52:02Speaker 01

  It's the best.

• 2:52:02Joe Rogan?

  Got a little squirrely in season two.

• 2:52:04Speaker 01

  Season two and three, yeah, got a little squirrely for sure. But like, one of my favorite lines in that is when he's, when Ford is talking to Bernard, or not Bernard, one of the ladies, one of the robots. And he's like, explaining the the human psyche. And he's like, all of the greatest achievements of humanity, the the Eiffel Tower, the Statue of David, the Mona Lisa, all just elaborate, an elaborate mating call. It's all peacock feathers.

• 2:52:32Joe Rogan?

  Ooh.

• 2:52:34Speaker 01

  It's all just this desire to procreate. And to, you know, it's, it's, that really got me fucking thinking. And it's like, is that what drives human beings to do things? And for, to create new things and new art? I always thought it was sex, but I I think it might be that, combined with the fear of death, because we we want to live forever. And we want, we want to have a symbolic immortality. We want to leave something behind after we die.

• 2:53:04Joe Rogan?

  It might not just be sex. It might just be social recognition.

• 2:53:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:53:08Joe Rogan?

  Status.

• 2:53:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:53:09Joe Rogan?

  You know, you want to be adored as a genius.

• 2:53:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. And there's also that painting, then on the Sistine Chapel, the Creation of Adam, which is also in that movie, where it shows God creating Adam and all the angels. And he's sitting inside of the perfect anatomical illustration of a human brain. If you look at it.

• 2:53:30Joe Rogan?

  Can you find that, Jamie?

• 2:53:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, pull up the Creation of Adam, and it's got like the the prefrontal cortex, the brain stem, the visual cortex, it's all there. And he's creating Adam. And like, the point he makes in the movie is like,

• 2:53:41Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:53:42Speaker 01

  The divine gift does not come from a higher power, but from the human mind.

• 2:53:46Joe Rogan?

  That's bananas. Let me see that other image that you just had, the two of them below it. No, I'm sorry. Go back to that one and then go below it, the one that you just had.

• 2:53:59Speaker 01

  Um. With the brain?

• 2:54:01Joe Rogan?

  The one with the brain. Yeah, the bottom right. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Look at that. That's weird, man.

• 2:54:07Speaker 01

  It is weird, isn't it?

• 2:54:08Joe Rogan?

  It's pretty close. And it's also that, that is, you know, the Eye of Horus. Um, when you look at the side section, a cross section of the, um, pineal gland. It looks exactly like that.

• 2:54:24Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 2:54:24Joe Rogan?

  This weird symbology.

• 2:54:25Speaker 01

  Wait, what looks just like that?

• 2:54:27Joe Rogan?

  The, um, the Eye of Horus from ancient Egyptian. Um.

• 2:54:33Joe Rogan?

  Go to, uh, so that gland, when you see it at the bottom, go to the Eye of Horus. Go, uh, pineal gland, Eye of Horus.

• 2:54:43Joe Rogan?

  Take out the Sistine Chapel.

• 2:54:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there it is. So that's what the Eye of Horus looks like. It looks exactly like the pineal gland. It's the same shape.

• 2:54:56Joe Rogan?

  There's a lot of weirdness, man, to the ancient art. Like, what were they trying to say? Like, what were they trying to document?

• 2:55:03Speaker 01

  It's funny, the people who like, don't believe Jesus existed, they'll make the argument, like, imagine 2,000 years from now, that, uh, people wanted to say that there was this mythical divine person. And he existed because we know there's this divine trilogy called the Lord of the Rings. And his name was Gandalf and he came from the center of the earth.

• 2:55:27Speaker 01

  But it's like, no, nothing else corroborates it. But, you know, I don't know. I think Jesus was a real person.

• 2:55:32Joe Rogan?

  It seems like it was a real person.

• 2:55:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:55:34Joe Rogan?

  The question is like, what really happened?

• 2:55:37Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:55:37Joe Rogan?

  And the whole coming back from the dead thing, it's like, what was that all about?

• 2:55:40Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah, I don't think that's real.

• 2:55:42Joe Rogan?

  Well, it doesn't make any sense, but neither does the birth of the universe from something smaller than the head of a pin. That doesn't make any sense either.

• 2:55:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:55:49Joe Rogan?

  But if you, you know, if there's one unique moment in time that God did send us his son to try to like, sort things out and we wind up killing him. He died for our sins, you know, like. Would that be any weirder than supermassive black holes? Would that be any weirder than most of the stuff that we know is real?

• 2:56:08Speaker 01

  And how do you reconcile that with the simulation? You know?

• 2:56:11Joe Rogan?

  I don't know. I mean, it might be part of the whole weirdness of this whole thing is that we have mythology. Part of the weirdness of the simulation of the simulation might be that we have this fantastical mythology that you sort of have to suspend disbelief and accept. It's part of this whole weirdness that we have where we're susceptible to ideological belief systems like cults. You know, like political ideologies were essentially just like cults. You know, when you're on the right and you're, you know, right with everything and, you know, you're all MAGA, or if you're on the left, you're blue no matter who, you're in a cult. You're in a cult. People get into cults. And why is that? Like, why is that a part of? If we are in a simulation, why are we so malleable?

• 2:56:57Joe Rogan?

  Is it because we recognize it and we're supposed to oppose it? And we're supposed to fight the instinct that we all deeply have embedded in our system, but we also know is wrong? Like, what is it about these systems? Like, why is that in place? Is this simply just an ancient relic of our tribal past where you had to follow the rules of the tribe in order to survive? And so it was instilled in people in the psyche? And that's how we developed? Or is there something more to it? Is it like part of the mechanism that allows us to resist, which allows us to innovate? Which encourages us to push forward and ask more questions because we know there's a lot of bullshit? Like, the reason why people ask so many questions now in 2025 as opposed to 2019 is because

• 2:57:42Joe Rogan?

  of COVID. Because we went through so much bullshit and propaganda. We were so gaslit by the government, by the CDC, by everybody. That now we question way more. So it's probably benefited us somewhat to go through that.

• 2:57:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. When Mary was on here, did she tell you about Kevin McKeon?

• 2:58:01Joe Rogan?

  Rush my memory.

• 2:58:02Speaker 01

  He was the dude who worked for the Human Genome Project, like a DNA wizard. He liked, he basically, he was working for the Human Genome Project, trying to figure out different sort of medical treatments for cancers based on your genome. So like, they could target a specific type of leukemia in you, and they would take your DNA, and they would like, basically make designer drugs to target that cancer, to kill that cancer.

• 2:58:27Speaker 01

  And during the pandemic, uh, somebody sent him four unopened vials of the Pfizer vaccine, and he analyzed them, and ran them through all of his processing systems, whatever, whatever the fuck he does. And he found out there was, uh, DNA plasmid contamination in them, which were like promoters of this SV40 shit.

• 2:58:49Joe Rogan?

  I did hear about that, yeah. I talked to Brett Weinstein about that, and he was explaining that when they first, um, were sequencing certain vaccines, that, you know, because with the vaccine, you have to use living cells in order to create these antibodies initially.

• 2:59:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:59:08Joe Rogan?

  And when he's-

• 2:59:10Speaker 01

  For traditional vaccines, right?

• 2:59:11Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:59:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:59:11Joe Rogan?

  And so when they started using these things, they were using kidney cells of these monkeys. And they didn't understand that these monkeys had this SV40, simian virus 40.

• 2:59:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:59:23Joe Rogan?

  And that this, when introduced into human cells, causes tumors.

• 2:59:26Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 2:59:26Joe Rogan?

  Causes cancer.

• 2:59:27Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 2:59:27Joe Rogan?

  Like rampant cancer.

• 2:59:28Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:59:28Joe Rogan?

  You see the uptick of cancer, and everyone else like bury their head in the sand and pretend that it didn't happen, but people that took the vaccine are getting fucking cancer at an astounding rate.

• 2:59:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. And this, and Kevin was, was telling me that he was doing study, he pulled some tumors from some people that died somewhere in Europe, um, and he was studying, sequencing the tumors of these people that died, um, with the vaccine. And he said that the SV40 was in the tumors. And some, I don't know, I don't remember the science, I'd have to go back and listen to it. By the way, that episode got pulled off YouTube.

• 3:00:01Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 3:00:01Speaker 01

  Off my channel, I got a strike for it.

• 3:00:03Joe Rogan?

  What'd they say?

• 3:00:04Speaker 01

  Me- medical misinformation.

• 3:00:06Joe Rogan?

  What part of it's medical misinformation?

• 3:00:08Speaker 01

  The whole thing. We talked about vaccines and we talked about-

• 3:00:11Joe Rogan?

  What year was this?

• 3:00:12Speaker 01

  This was like, uh, November of last year.

• 3:00:16Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 3:00:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:00:18Joe Rogan?

  I wonder if you could put it up now, because they seem to lighten up. Didn't they? They changed their, their regulations recently.

• 3:00:24Speaker 01

  Did they?

• 3:00:25Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they changed their guidelines.

• 3:00:26Speaker 01

  That's the problem with this shit, dude. I'm like, I'm so afraid to talk about shit I wanna talk about.

• 3:00:32Joe Rogan?

  I know, isn't that fucked up?

• 3:00:33Speaker 01

  It's like, uh, it sucks, dude.

• 3:00:34Joe Rogan?

  It, it sucks because there's no way to know who's telling the truth unless you let people say crazy shit and then have someone come on and refute it and then have the two of them get together and debate it.

• 3:00:43Speaker 01

  Right.

• 3:00:44Joe Rogan?

  You know, and then even then, sometimes you don't know. Like with this Flint Dibble, Graham Hancock thing.

• 3:00:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:00:49Joe Rogan?

  Uh, you know, if it wasn't for Dan Richards, we wouldn't know that a lot of the things that Flint Dibble said were just absolutely not true.

• 3:00:54Speaker 01

  Right, right.

• 3:00:55Joe Rogan?

  YouTube loosens rules guiding moderation of videos. Yeah, so, um, favor freedom of expression over the risk of harm in deciding what to take down. So specifically scroll down to what they said, what the, the actual, the policy shift which hasn't publicly disclosed, uh, ba ba ba ba ba ba ba, what does it say? Public statements, what do, they used language that I thought was, uh,

• 3:01:20Speaker 01

  They don't make public statements. They broad brush it. They don't give you an exact reason. They just say, oh, this falls into this category. Like, there's no jury at YouTube. They're just like, they find the most excusable reason to-

• 3:01:30Joe Rogan?

  Go back to where you were? Go back to where you were? Recognizing the definition of public interest is always evolving. We update our guidelines for these exceptions to reflect the new types of discussions we see on our platform today. Our goal remains the same, to protect free expression on YouTube while mitigating egregious harm. So, you know, they could still, but the thing is like, they're controlled by their advertisers to a certain extent and-

• 3:01:54Speaker 01

  I don't buy that shit, dude.

• 3:01:55Joe Rogan?

  What do you mean? They get funds from the advertisers.

• 3:01:57Speaker 01

  They're Google, though. They, they fucking own advertising. Like, you're, you're gonna tell me like some company is gonna go to, go to Google and say, listen, bro- We're not gonna advertise with you unless you take that guy's video down.

• 3:02:08Joe Rogan?

  No, I think pharmaceutical drug companies have influence. And I think if you're getting an enormous percentage of your advertising revenue from pharmaceutical drug companies, which Callie Means has said, the reason why they do that is not to promote their drugs. It's to stop criticism. And this is why they promote, this is why brought to you by Pfizer, Anderson Cooper, brought to you by Pfizer. What that is for is to make sure that they never criticize Pfizer.

• 3:02:33Speaker 01

  Sure, I understand that.

• 3:02:34Joe Rogan?

  And it works, right?

• 3:02:35Speaker 01

  For cable TV, yeah, but for like YouTube has a monopoly on advertising, Google does at least. I just, I mean, I guess I could see it, but like, you know, they got fucking trillions of dollars.

• 3:02:46Joe Rogan?

  So it says YouTube's adpocalypse and the gatekeeping of cultural content on digital platforms. This is how it all started. 2017 advertiser revolt on YouTube, popularly known as the adpocalypse, introduced widespread and radical changes on the platform's policy related to moderation in content. Their monetizability and the terms of the relationship between the creators and the platform. And these changes in turn have caused significant discontent within the creator community while also gradually transforming the predominant nature of the content on the platform. So they did do it. They did it by cutting out the ads.

• 3:03:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:03:24Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's dirty business, man. And they're doing it because they don't want people finding out certain things that are actually true. And that's what they did during the pandemic, and that's what the FBI tried to do when they they were banning people like Jay Bhattacharya and prominent scientists and like legitimate academics.

• 3:03:44Speaker 01

  But then I'll have like UF, the same thing will happen to videos I do about UFOs.

• 3:03:48Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 3:03:49Speaker 01

  Not taken down, but you know how shit will get like buried where you can't search for it?

• 3:03:52Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:03:53Speaker 01

  Me and Jesse were talking about this. This happened to Jesse too with Grush, where he was like, it was like the number one video on Grush and all of a sudden you can't search it. Like stuff like that. I mean, the COVID one was the first one I actually had taken down, um, which was scary. And it makes me think about that. I hate the fact that I actually have to think about whether I'm gonna get the ax.

• 3:04:13Joe Rogan?

  I know.

• 3:04:13Speaker 01

  Based on the topic I'm discussing, like where, like, I don't know if that leads, that doesn't lead to a good place as far as journalism goes, because journalism is supposed to be shining light on the dark places that people don't want them shined. It's supposed to piss people off.

• 3:04:26Joe Rogan?

  Especially when you consider that a lot of the things that you used to be taken down for are now confirmed. Like the lab leak theory.

• 3:04:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:04:33Joe Rogan?

  That used to get you kicked off of YouTube. Saying masks don't work, that would get you kicked off of YouTube. Like, all these things that we now know to be true, that the vaccine does not stop infection. That would get you kicked off YouTube.

• 3:04:45Speaker 01

  Right.

• 3:04:45Joe Rogan?

  All these things that we now know are 100% fact, and it's all orchestrated by financial interests.

• 3:04:50Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. Yeah, the, um, the SV-40 stuff is wicked freaky, dude. It's wicked freaky, like with the cancer and how, you know, it goes all the way back to the early days in the 60s or the early 50s and 60s in New Orleans. How they were working, uh, trying to develop the polio vaccine with Alton Ochsner.

• 3:05:11Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:05:11Speaker 01

  At Tulane University and trying to weaponize some sort of a, there's a theory based on that book, Mary's Monkey, where they were growing the polio vaccines on the monkey kidneys and using this to also create bioweapons to assassinate people like Castro.

• 3:05:28Speaker 01

  And that's apparently what, according to that book, what, um, Lee Harvey Oswald was doing with that Lady Mary Sherman. And they were using that Linac machine to try to like, supercharge the SV-40 to make it more deadly.

• 3:05:39Joe Rogan?

  Oh, my God.

• 3:05:40Speaker 01

  To induce cancer with people.

• 3:05:42Joe Rogan?

  Jesus Christ.

• 3:05:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, and then, oh, God, that like, the event, that Qatar event where Alton injected his two grandkids with the polio vaccine in front of the whole auditorium of students. And, uh, his granddaughter lived, was paralyzed, but his grandson died the next day, right after they did that.

• 3:06:03Joe Rogan?

  Jesus Christ.

• 3:06:03Speaker 01

  And they were like, there's people pushing back, like, don't do this, we tested this on monkeys and like, half of them are dead. Let's not push this out. I think it was the Salk vaccine, the Salk polio vaccine. And then they fucking did it anyways.

• 3:06:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, I think you gotta be able to talk about this stuff.

• 3:06:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:06:18Joe Rogan?

  Even if you get it wrong, and even if someone comes on, they say things that can be refuted. Yeah, refute it then. That's the whole point of all this.

• 3:06:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:06:27Joe Rogan?

  If someone comes on and says something that's not correct, hope it stays.

• 3:06:30Speaker 01

  Oh. Bless you.

• 3:06:32Joe Rogan?

  Thank you. If someone comes on and says something that's not correct, like, have someone on that refutes it. Figure it out. You have to be able to talk about stuff.

• 3:06:39Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 3:06:39Joe Rogan?

  And some of it's fun.

• 3:06:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:06:42Joe Rogan?

  It's fun.

• 3:06:42Speaker 01

  It's all super fun.

• 3:06:43Joe Rogan?

  It is, right?

• 3:06:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:06:44Joe Rogan?

  How'd you get started?

• 3:06:46Speaker 01

  Well, I didn't, I obviously didn't always do podcasts, but I, I was, originally I always wanted to make movies when I was young.

• 3:06:52Joe Rogan?

  You used to call it concrete. Why was it called?

• 3:06:54Speaker 01

  It was called concrete. So, okay, I'll tell you. It was, uh, first of all, I always wanted to make movies when I was a little kid. I was telling Jamie the story earlier. I tried to go to full, I was gonna go to Full Sail where Jamie went in Florida, in Orlando, but it was just, I didn't have the money to do it. And I couldn't get into UCX. My, my grades were shit in high school. So luckily, I got the opportunity to work on this movie called Dolphin Tail. It was a, it was a movie about a dolphin who got its tail stuck in a crab trap and they had, and Morgan Freeman came in and built it a prosthetic tail. And, uh, and it was swimming around in the aquarium. Carey Connick Jr. and Morgan Freeman were in it. And it was like a big, you know, uh, Warner Brothers movie.

• 3:07:33Speaker 01

  And I realized, working as a camera production assistant on that movie, it was my film school, but I realized I did not want anything to do with making movies. Cause it was the closest thing I ever experienced to working construction. It was like, I was in charge of swapping the ca- the camera lenses, the camera batteries, taking the SD cards back to the media truck, getting everybody breakfast and coffee. And these dudes, these camera department dudes, a lot of them are really cool. Like the dude Pete Zuccarini, who was the underwater cinematographer who filmed all the Pirates of the Caribbean movies. He was fucking awesome. But a lot of the other guys were like, really unhappy, like deeply unhappy because they never saw their families. They were always on the road, FaceTime, a lot of them on their like third, fourth wives, FaceTiming their kids. And it was like, you know, they were like carnies with dental plans.

• 3:08:19Speaker 01

  They made great money, but they were, they were fucking deeply unhappy. So like, I, I realized I didn't want to make movies anymore. So I started an advertising company and, uh, making commercials. And I started doing like spec ads and like winning a bunch of contests to make commercials. I won really, uh, won big contest for Land Rover USA where we made like a, a free ad and they paid us to make a bunch of other ads for them. And then that's where Concrete came in. So I was, it was called something else and I got sued by some advertising company in California saying, "Hey bitch, can't use this name anymore. Change your name." So my friend who owns a concrete construction company, said, "Bro, there's this really cool website domain for sale with concrete with a K."

• 3:09:01Speaker 01

  He's like, "It's like a couple thousand bucks. You want to, you should buy it." I was gonna buy it. I'm like, "Sure, fuck yeah, let's do it." So I called my company Concrete. Stupid. And then, um. And how'd you start a podcast? So, so after the advertising stuff, I started,

• 3:09:18Speaker 01

  I met a bunch of people. I met Hulk Hogan in the process of the whole advertising thing. Cause me and Hulk live like five minutes from each other and, which is like five minutes from the Church of Scientology, which is great. And we started, I started making a bunch of commercials with him because he would always have companies that would hit him up and say, "Yo, let's partner on this new product." And, uh, one of them was a hosting company called Hostamania. They wanted to make Hulk the face of the company. And we created this whole fucking thing where we, it was like right when Miley Cyrus dropped the wrecking ball video and we put Hulk on a wrecking ball. We're like, "Yo Hulk, we want to put you on a wrecking ball and have you fricking dropkick Van Damme." Who's like the go daddy guy, right? And he's like, "Fuck yeah, brother. Let's do it. This is it." It was actually, it was poor execution, but it was funny.

• 3:10:02Speaker 01

  And, uh, he's like, "Brother, there's only one thing missing from this commercial idea." I'm like, "What?" He's like, "I need to be in my birthday suit." I was like, "What?"

• 3:10:14Speaker 01

  So we did that and, um, then I started working on a bunch of like show, this was like the boom of reality shows when like Duck Dynasty and Pawn Stars were all taking off. So I was like, "I could probably fucking make a reality show." So I hit a bunch of my friends and we started like,

• 3:10:31Speaker 01

  touring around, trying to find people to come up with like TV show ideas and concepts. And I got a couple people to invest in a couple TV show ideas, pilots that I spent like six years working on. And it was this long process of shooting, editing, taking notes, from production companies that, you know, you have to, you know how this works, but you have to like work with production companies who already have relationships with networks.

• 3:10:55Speaker 01

  And they were like constantly giving us notes like, okay, change this for A and E. Change this for Spike TV. And we gotta make sure it fits each network because we were pitching these networks, these show to all these networks. I was like, okay, great. So it was just this roller coaster of emotions of like, oh my God, we're gonna get, we're gonna sell a TV show. We're gonna do a TV show. And then finally, we got one of those shows to a green light meeting at Spike TV or A and E. And like, I was like, this is it. We're gonna do it. And the CEO of ICOM killed it because it did not fit their roster of existing advertisers. And I was just like so frustrated and fed up with it. I was like, fuck this. I'm taking all this stuff that I've been working on. And I'm gonna repackage them, put them on YouTube.

• 3:11:39Speaker 01

  And I did. And the first one that really took off got millions of views in like 2015 was called Deckhands. And it was the story of these alcoholic dudes, these drunks that were hanging out in front of 7-Eleven in this little sleepy town called Madeira Beach where I'm from. So me and my buddy Luke went up and we started filming these guys and asking them questions like, yo, what the fuck do you guys do here every day? And they're like, we're fucking fishermen, bro. Come see how we live. And one of these dudes took us back to his boat he lived on. He had this broken down boat in this old dusty marina. Where it was, the boat didn't work, but he had, he lived in this boat and it had amplifiers stacked to the ceiling.

• 3:12:20Speaker 01

  He had a stack of porno DVDs like six feet tall, laser light machines, fog machines. And he wore these fairy wings and like an armor helmet. And he would jam out to like Rob Zombie on his guitar while playing the music videos on this big projection screen in his boat. And we're like, this is fucking the Twilight Zone, dude. And then they started telling us more and more about like what they do. This is it. Yeah, this is the first episode. The gates of hell. This is Shane Lee, R.I.P.

• 3:12:49Speaker 01

  So we're like, we're asking these guys about like, what are you like, you're fishermen, but like, explain to me, how does this thing, how does this work? And they were all pissed off about, ah, we're getting screwed by the boat owners and these IFQs and we don't make any money. And you know, we're like, dude, there might be a story here. So we started interviewing more people. And we eventually interviewed the people who own the boats and own the fish houses. So like Madeira Beach is the, Johns Pass, Florida is the grouper capital of the world. There's more grouper caught there than anywhere in the world. And.

• 3:13:24Speaker 01

  The way it works is before 2007, there was a quota system where it was like for red snapper, it was like 3 million pounds per year are allowed to be caught in this area, right? So it was like derby fishing. So all the boats would go out and they would catch as much fish as they possibly could and they would wait at the, when they get back from their trip. And then they would, you know, quantify that or, or, you know, tell the federal government, this is where we're at. And sometimes they would reach that 3 million pound limit in like October. So what do they have to do for the rest of the year? They stop fishing. They can't do anything. So in 2007, the federal government made a monopoly where they gave boat owners

• 3:14:07Speaker 01

  an allotment of fishing quota per year. So some guy's got a 100,000 pounds. Some guy's got 200,000 pounds, which is if it's red snapper, that's a dollar a pound. So that's like the best retirement plan known to man. The federal government is handing you 200,000 pounds of red snapper quota per year. And then what happened was eventually the boat owners sold off their quota and now it's become so discombobulated where now like you can just buy this fishing quota and trade it like stock. You don't have to own a boat. You don't have to be a fisherman. You could just be some dude sitting in Manhattan in a high rise and buying and selling fishing quota.

• 3:14:49Speaker 01

  You're not, and there's, there are like fishing communities in America, like in the Northeast, where it doesn't work like that, where you have to have your hand on the throttle. You have to take care of your people and it's a lifestyle and it's like a way to, it's a culture. And where in Madeira Beach, at least when I was there filming, it was, they were all just like carni's, carni ride operators, you know, and these dudes were, and the, the lowest level of this, of this fishing industry are those deckhands, those dudes like Shane Lee.

• 3:15:22Speaker 01

  And they're fucking drug addicts. There are a lot of them are on hooked on heroin. What that what happens is they get home from fishing from ten, ten days of fishing offshore. And they get like four, five thousand dollars and they blow it on prostitutes and coke and hookers and heroin. And they just, they're kids, dude. They're like kids. They're like kids with money. And by the end, by the time they run out, they have to go fishing again. So they're going to all the fish houses saying, "Bro, let me go, let me go." So they go offshore again and they sea hab, where they rehab at sea for ten days because they have no more drugs.

• 3:15:56Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 3:15:57Speaker 01

  And they come back and then rinse and repeat. And one of the, one of the people, uh, that we interviewed, there was three main characters in that, in that series. There was Shane Lee, there was Space, and then there was Hollywood Kim. And Hollywood Kim was the last episode, which was, sometimes when I think I have problems in my life, I remember her story and realize I don't really know what fucking problems are. She, uh, was from Alabama and when she was seventeen years old, she gave birth to her father's son.

• 3:16:25Joe Rogan?

  Oh, God.

• 3:16:27Speaker 01

  And when she was six years old, she would wake up every morning and ride her bike to the beach to try to escape her dad. And no one would believe her.

• 3:16:34Joe Rogan?

  Jesus Christ.

• 3:16:34Speaker 01

  She tried telling people. And no one would believe her because her dad was a cop.

• 3:16:39Joe Rogan?

  Oh, God.

• 3:16:41Speaker 01

  So she eventually gave birth to her son and escaped to Florida. And became a deckhand working fishing and, uh, working on these boats, dude. And she was just, I met her and she would wake up every morning and just start slamming vodka and looking for drugs. And, uh, dude, it was just the Twilight Zone in my own backyard.

• 3:17:05Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 3:17:06Speaker 01

  It was nuts. And then that led to like podcasts, like, so after that, then we're just like, oh, let's start doing podcasts in between these documentaries, you know, more content. And the podcasts started to get more views than documentaries and here we are.

• 3:17:17Joe Rogan?

  Well, I'm glad it happened. You got a great show, man.

• 3:17:20Speaker 01

  Thanks, bro.

• 3:17:21Joe Rogan?

  And I appreciate you coming on here, man. It was a lot of fun.

• 3:17:23Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 3:17:23Joe Rogan?

  Let's do it again, for sure.

• 3:17:24Speaker 01

  Hell, yeah, bro.

• 3:17:25Joe Rogan?

  Uh, Danny Jones Show is on YouTube. Are you on Spotify as well?

• 3:17:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, YouTube, Spotify. It's just at Danny Jones on YouTube. And, uh, same with Instagram.

• 3:17:34Joe Rogan?

  It's an awesome show.

• 3:17:35Speaker 01

  That's it, baby.

• 3:17:36Joe Rogan?

  Lots of fun stuff on there. All right.

• 3:17:37Speaker 01

  Thanks, brother.

• 3:17:38Joe Rogan?

  Thank you. Bye, everybody.

• 3:17:54Speaker 04

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• 3:18:18Speaker 01

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