Pod Insights The Bill Simmons Podcast As the NBA Turns, 2024 Teen Culture Awards, and Million-Dollar Picks with Joe House and Zoe Simmons About this episode The Ringer's Bill Simmons reacts to Pat Riley's statement that Jimmy Butler will NOT be traded this NBA season, before Joe House joins to discuss this year's NBA Christmas Day games, the NBA's superstar paradox, and check in on some of their preseason win-total predictions (2:20). Then, they run through their favorite games on the NFL weekend slate (29:59) before making the Million-Dollar Picks for NFL Week 17 (57:52). Finally, Bill's daughter Zoe joins for the final 'Year-End Teen Culture Awards' before she enters her 20s (1:03:48).
Host: Bill Simmons
Guests: Joe House and Zoe Simmons
Producer: Kyle Crichton
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Transcript 21,438 words · 4 speakers
Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Bill Simmons? The Ringer Sunday Pregame Show is my favorite Sunday morning show. You can watch it on YouTube TV. Just subscribe to it on YouTube TV. It pops up at 11 a.m. ET, 8 a.m. PT. You can watch it on Fanduel TV. You can watch it on Fanduel's fast channel as well. JJ, Raheem, House, Cousin Sal, for an hour and a half, breaking down all the games that are about to happen in the NFL on Sundays. Special guests, I pop on there from time to time. Playoffs, we're blowing it out. We're going to be Saturday, Sunday, the first two weeks. We're going to be live in LA on Saturday and Sunday in round one. So be ready. The Ringer, the Sunday Pregame Show. Subscribe, follow, check it out. This episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. It's football season. Uber Eats is delivering deals every game day.
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1:29 Bill Simmons? This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Excitement is in the air. That's right. It's the start of NBA season. I can't wait to get together with friends, share some Michelob Ultras, and watch Tip Off. Plus, as the official beer sponsor of the NBA, Michelob Ultra is getting you closer to the action with experiences that make you feel like you're courtside to actual courtside tickets. Enter now for a chance to win at michelobultra.com/courtside. Michelob Ultra Courtside 26 to 27. No purchase necessary. Open to U.S. residents 21+. Begins on October 1st, 2026. Ends on June 30th, 2027. Multiple entry periods. See official rules at michelobultra.com/courtside for free entry. Entry deadlines, prizes, and details. We're also brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network. Put up a new rewatchables on Monday night.
2:14 Bill Simmons? We did Home Alone 2, a classic Christmas movie. We did that on Spotify as a video podcast, so you can watch it on Spotify. You can watch on the Ringer Movies YouTube channel as well. You can watch a lot of the clips and videos from this podcast on the Bill Simmons YouTube channel. Hope you had an awesome holiday. The sports is really fun. We were about to talk about all the basketball and the rest of the million dollar picks, which we did a little early batch, me and House on Tuesday for YouTube only. Probably should have, probably should have given more of a heads up on that, but we wanted to get some Christmas picks in. We did really well. Now we're going to keep the magic going later in this podcast. After we talk hoops, after at the very top, I'm going to talk about this Jimmy Butler Miami situation for a second.
2:59 Bill Simmons? And then last but not least, my daughter, who always comes on near the end of every year to do her Teen Culture Awards, and it's a bittersweet year because she's coming on, and this is the last year we're doing Teen Culture, because this is the last holiday she's going to be a teenager. She turns 20 next year. So we had a lot of stuff to cover. It was very, very fun. We actually did as a video, a video piece this year too, which you'll eventually be able to watch on the Bill Simmons YouTube channel, along with all the other stuff we're doing on here. It's all next. First, our friends from Pearl Jam.
3:51 Bill Simmons? Recording this Thursday mid-afternoon, it was after I had already recorded the rest of the podcast, because something happened with Miami Heat and Jimmy Butler that I had to mention here at the top. House and I had talked about Jimmy a little later. We took out the part that isn't relevant anymore because Pat Riley came out and he said definitively, "The Miami Heat are not trading Jimmy Butler. He's going to be on this team for the rest of the season." Came out and said it, put it out in a statement so people could read it.
4:19 Bill Simmons? We don't see NBA teams do this that often, but I think it speaks to a bigger picture thing that we've discussed on this podcast a couple of times now this month with this new first apron, second apron, and how much harder it is to do trades. The NBA is starting to look a lot more like the NFL. It is so much harder to deal somebody during the season than it used to be, which is what Riley said, "We're not dealing him during the season. We'll figure it out during the offseason." Butler's 48 million and then 52 million dollar player option next year, which odds are he's gonna, he's gonna exercise because nobody has cap space this summer. The only team is Brooklyn. He's gonna go to Brooklyn. They're gonna be rebuilding and just sign Jimmy Butler. I mean, it's conceivable. I just would have bet on it.
5:01 Bill Simmons? And Pat Riley is, is looking big picture and looking at an NBA that now operates way more like the NFL where it's way harder just to do big complicated deals. And he didn't like the deals that were out there. And they clearly kicked the tires with a bunch of teams. Houston, I think, came out and said they weren't interested. I think they're holding out for Darren Fox, which House and I talk about in a second. But you go around Golden State. What's the point of them trading for Jimmy Butler? They're not even really a contender right now. And they're gonna give up all these assets so they can try to be the fifth best team in the West on a very short window? I'm not doing that if I'm, if I'm Golden State. You know, I'm sure Phoenix would talk about Bradley Beal for Jimmy Butler, but why would Miami want to turn Jimmy Butler into Bradley Beal? Why would they want to do any of these trades?
5:45 Bill Simmons? They already have somebody who, when he's pissed off and playing well, he's a top 30 guy. They're not just gonna take more contracts. You know, you go around the league, like what if Sacramento wanted to make some crazy bid for him with DeRozan and Keegan Murray and a first round pick? Well, you know, do, do you want DeRozan's contract for the next couple of years after what we've seen from him this season? So you just look through the league and you can't find the trade. And I think that was the situation Miami was in. Houston was the one team that made sense and it just didn't seem like they were interested in him. So I think Riley's trying to flip this. The narrative is so strong that something was gonna happen that he went the other way. And he was like, no, he's gonna be here the whole season. So now Jimmy knows he can't go anywhere.
6:29 Bill Simmons? So if he could really just blow this up now, that's not great for him. That's gonna make teams less. Less excited to sign him this summer. It could veer the other way where now Jimmy's like, well, if I'm going to be here, I might as well make the best of it. He could start playing better. Other stuff might happen. There might be some teams, some star might get hurt, some situation might go sideways. And then Miami in the early February can go. Hey, listen, we didn't think we were going to trade him. We thought he was going to be here all year, but then this offer happened and, uh, and they cover their bases. But Pat Riley, he's, you know, he's, I think he's late seventies, early eighties now. It's like that old Seinfeld joke when old people are just like, fuck it.
7:11 Bill Simmons? And they just start backing out of the driveway and they don't, uh, they don't care if somebody's coming. I'm backing out of the driveway. Here I come. Pat Riley's been at this point for a while and it's really fun to watch somebody like that run an NBA team. He had obviously had it with these other trade rumors and, and just was like, you know what? There's no good trade for this guy. We're keeping him. Here's my statement. And it was old school and I kind of loved it, but this soap opera is probably not over. I'm guessing anyway, we are now throwing to me and Joe House talking basketball, million dollar picks. And I'll be wearing a different shirt. You can look forward to that. All right, we're taping this. It is 10:30 Pacific time. Joe House is here.
7:53 Bill Simmons? It's a stripped down BS podcast this week, you know, two pods this week. We did something for YouTube. We put some million dollar picks up there. Lot of sports yesterday during Christmas day. How'd you handle the family Christmas day? How to consume sports while also pretending to be a family member, part of Christmas?
8:09 Speaker 01 Well, the nice thing is my family tradition, we get together with my parents in the house we grew up with. Uh, and with my brothers, my sisters.
8:17 Bill Simmons? I've stayed in the attic of that house many times.
8:19 Speaker 01 You have. Um, and so we just do that the first part of the day. So we were done by kickoff, one o'clock. And when we got home, my wife and my kid wanted to play with his stuff. My wife went right back to bed. And so I was left alone to watch whatever I wanted to watch. I had full control of, of the dial with Netflix. Great job, Netflix.
8:40 Bill Simmons? Not great job by the games, but, uh, the, the broadcast was fine. And then NBA had a really good day. I was thinking though, the Wemby Knicks game was so good. And I was just thinking big picture about. You know, there's been so much what's wrong with the NBA stuff and some of it's founded, some of it's stuff we've been complaining about forever. And then some of it is real issues, which is basically how do you find these under 30 American stars that people are going to give a shit about like they care about Steph and LeBron?
9:09 Bill Simmons? And yet the Steph LeBron thing last night was the solution and the problem at the same time. Because it was same thing for the Olympics too, right? It was awesome watching those guys. Hey, the old guys, look at it. They still got it. But it's still coming at the expense of everybody else. Like even yesterday, it's in that eight o'clock. It's in the, it's in the best spot. It's after football's over. And that's the signature game. And it's basically two 500 teams and it's guys that have been in the league since 2003 and 2009 respectively. And yet, OKC wasn't on Christmas Day. Giannis wasn't on Christmas Day. Wemby was buried at the beginning of the day. And this is like, you're kind of doing this to yourself, but at the same time, I get it because Steph and LeBron was awesome. So I don't really know what the answer is. It's
9:53 Bill Simmons? like you could, you could go glass half full, glass half empty on it. But the fact that the Steph LeBron game was so good and sucked up so much oxygen from the day is actually kind of part of the problem.
10:06 Speaker 01 Well, this is the, the sort of predicament for the rest of the season. I mean, this is what happens when you're in a transition moment and the most resonant stars. And this is the, the Olympics really, you know, validates the idea of putting those guys on the main stage because the Olympics were effing incredible.
10:25 Bill Simmons? Right.
10:25 Speaker 01 Those last two games, the semifinals and the finals were incredible. And it was because of those guys. So if you want to let them have their, you know, their, their retirement journey, which is really what we're on, I think with LeBron and you know, this is probably.
10:41 Bill Simmons? He looks better since the eight day sabbatical.
10:43 Speaker 01 Well, he got the, who, who wouldn't?
10:45 Bill Simmons? Curry looked great.
10:46 Speaker 01 Yeah.
10:47 Bill Simmons? Well, you say this is the journey we on though. Like I still go back and I talked about this a couple of weeks ago, but like the Olympics are a chance to showcase some of the younger guys and give them some new memories that they can, they can make a foundation of our experience with them as superstars. And yet that, those moments went to the old guys. Christmas still going to the old guys. And I just think they're stuck in the middle. I remember when we were in college in the early 90s. This transition felt a lot more organic to the MJ Barkley, Hakeem, Drexler, all the, all the Stockton and Malone, Sean Kemp GP. It just felt like it was organically shifting generations. It doesn't feel as organic this time around.
11:28 Speaker 01 Well, only because we don't have an American superstar that's jumping up and grabbing the ring. The, the guy that's jumped up and grabbed the ring is effing Wemby. He served notice 12 noon, Madison Square Garden, Christmas Day, welcome to, you know, the, the, the world. Like we, everybody's been talking about Wemby last season, this season, he keeps having these, you know, inspiring milestone performances right out of the gate. And yet, you know, the mother effort was flopping on Monday.
11:57 Bill Simmons? I know. We gotta, we gotta send him to.
11:59 Speaker 01 B got kicked out and Drummond got kicked out and Drummond got pulled back in the game. I mean, if we're gonna, you know, we need a guy who's gonna come out and kick ass and, and, and not fall over when the wind blows.
12:10 Bill Simmons? Well, he is French.
12:13 Speaker 01 That's part of the problem. It's literally part of the problem.
12:16 Bill Simmons? Well, Wemby, I was talking about this with Van and a couple of other people on text this week. Wemby has two things going against him that historically has not been great for somebody really captivating the American public. One, he's tall. Tall people in our lifetime, it's never really totally worked. It's hard to identify with centers. You know, it's.
12:37 Speaker 01 It's why Shaq, Shaq's a one of one.
12:40 Bill Simmons? Yeah, but even Shaq, we were there in the nineties. Shaq was pretty polarizing in the nineties, right? People were, well, he was a huge superstar. He put up huge stats, but.
12:50 Speaker 01 And also crazy charismatic. I mean.
12:53 Bill Simmons? He was, but it took a while. I really feel like it was the three Lakers titles. That was like, all right, Shaq's arrived. But remember there was like the 96 Olympics, like some of the movies he did, some of the rap albums, like he, the Lakers underachieved.
13:08 Speaker 01 Maybe I'm.
13:09 Bill Simmons? I know, but did you feel like he was the most popular guy in the league? I didn't. Like it was MJ's league and then MJ retired and we were like, who's gonna be next? And I don't think anyone thought the answer was Shaq.
13:20 Speaker 01 Well, you know, Shaq understood this, which is why he went to LA and it was Shaq and Kobe. And that was an unbelievable era.
13:26 Bill Simmons? Yeah. But that, the point is Shaq, so Shaq's probably become the closest, but it's usually a perimeter guy.
13:32 Speaker 01 Sure.
13:33 Bill Simmons? That becomes, that's why I like the AJ DeBansa. Anyway, the, the Wemby thing, he's got that and he's got the foreign thing, which is another huge thing. You know, we've, we've never really seen a foreign guy be captivate this country. We can see worldwide, it might be great.
13:50 Speaker 01 Who is the most popular? Who would you say is the most?
13:52 Bill Simmons? We've had some great ones.
13:53 Speaker 01 I mean, you're the, you're the historian.
13:56 Bill Simmons? Well, Hakeem, I think was the best foreign player of all time, right?
14:00 Speaker 01 Okay, sure.
14:01 Bill Simmons? Dirk.
14:02 Speaker 01 Yeah, right there.
14:03 Bill Simmons? Giannis is in there. Jokic.
14:06 Speaker 01 Yes.
14:06 Bill Simmons? Yeah. None of them were face of the leagues. Jokic right now is on the best offensive heater this decade of anyone in a long time. And nobody, I mean, part of that is he's not Mr. Personable, but um, yeah, it'll be interesting to see with Wemby. We've just never seen it like we, we've watched a lot of centers come into the league since we've loved this league. Walton was probably that one, and we were kids when that happened, but when Walton and the Blazers, that felt like, felt like he was the face of the league for a year, but Kareem never resonated. Uh, we watched Ewing come in and it just kind of never happened for him. He also wasn't like amazingly fun to watch. Sampson had a blip and then it just wasn't going to happen with him. And you go on and on and just centers are tough. Dwight Howard, Yao.
14:51 Speaker 01 Yeah. Well, Yao was incredible and beloved, you know, by.
14:55 Bill Simmons? He global, yeah.
14:57 Speaker 01 A billion people.
14:57 Bill Simmons? Became great.
14:58 Speaker 01 Yeah.
14:59 Bill Simmons? I think what the, the thing that I'll tilt it for Wemby is if he keeps just having crazy games like the one yesterday. He's gonna just have these 40 point, 10 block, like he's in the playoffs and you know, he's putting up like 40, 15. If it's just stuff we've never seen before, that might actually work, but it's gonna take a while.
15:19 Speaker 01 Needs to be on that national stage.
15:21 Bill Simmons? You know, we had them as a, we, I think, did you go under for them before?
15:26 Speaker 01 I went under, yeah. I went under. I just, you know, I, I look at that roster even today and still say under. Like there is, there aren't guys on that roster that make me say, oh yeah, this is a 500 team. It's going to be threatening for the, you know, they're going to be in the play in mix and they're going to be potentially fighting for an eighth seed. I look at that roster and I don't get there.
15:46 Bill Simmons? They're an 11 seed, but they're 15 and 15 in a really hard conference.
15:51 Speaker 01 Right.
15:51 Bill Simmons? And there's a feistiness. They play defense.
15:55 Speaker 01 They play defense.
15:55 Bill Simmons? They have a guy who's not afraid of whoever the other team's star is. And um, I, I'm prepared to chalk that up to a loss, that San Antonio thing. I think they'll get over 35 and they also, there's trade possibilities with them too.
16:10 Bill Simmons? You know, that, I mean, there was a lot of the Darren Fox stuff started last weekend. It really should have started a month ago. You know, he's this year, he's a free agent after next year. The team feels like the DeRozan thing just, it's not happening.
16:26 Speaker 01 They tried.
16:27 Bill Simmons? Started thinking of Fox and the Fox stuff is so much more enticing for teams like Houston and San Antonio than Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler is 35. He's been unhappy the whole year. Fox is a different animal. Like, that's like, if you're Houston and you could turn Fred VanVleet and your picks and Terry East in a Fox, like, you're doing it. If you're San Antonio and you have a chance to add Fox to your mix and you think you can re-sign him and put him with Wemby and Castle and some of your swings and you just give up the, the picks trove you have, like you, you're probably thinking about that. But this is, to get a top 15 guy who's a point guard who's in his prime, this is about as interesting of a trade piece as we've had, not counting like when Durant suddenly becomes available.
17:08 Bill Simmons? But a younger guy on his way up, like, I don't know, you thinking for DC? We trade all your picks?
17:15 Speaker 01 No.
17:16 Bill Simmons? Five picks to Jordan Poole plus seven swaps?
17:18 Speaker 01 Oh, no. It makes no sense whatsoever. And I also really sort of wonder about Fox to San Antonio because it's like, where are you? Where is, where do you get this season? Where are you next season?
17:31 Bill Simmons? It's, it's a decade play. It's not a this season play as much as, uh, we now have a guy. We need a, we need a perimeter guy, preferably a guard, somebody who can handle his business, run the team, play off Wemby, who's like a clear, awesome number two. I mean, Fox is about, he's a top 20 player. That's about as good of a number two as you're going to get, right? And he's available, potentially. If I was the Kings, I wouldn't trade him. I would be like, no, we're not, we're keeping you. Sorry.
18:01 Speaker 01 And that makes more sense, honestly, because they're, they're still right in the thick of things playoff wise. I mean, you know, for sure.
18:07 Bill Simmons? They have a, they have a DeRozan issue, though. I, I think they, they might've bought a car that they might've, the odometer was turned back on.
18:17 Speaker 01 Happens sometimes.
18:18 Bill Simmons? It was like, I thought this car had 95,000 miles on it. And maybe it was 195,000.
18:24 Speaker 01 Where are we? I don't mean to derail it. Where are we this week in Jimmy Butler?
18:29 Bill Simmons? I think he'd been, I think he'd be gone already if there was a trade. I just don't think there's a trade and that the most notable thing that seems to have happened the last couple, maybe the last week or so is that Houston doesn't seem interested in him.
18:40 Speaker 01 Hmm.
18:42 Bill Simmons? Like they're like, we're good.
18:44 Speaker 01 Hmm. That is interesting because Washington is out there auditioning players. Valanciunas, Brogdon, Kyle Kuzma can't get on the floor.
18:55 Bill Simmons? Yeah, Kuzma, I know Kuzma being in any trade rumors is hilarious. You've been watching him. I don't, I don't know what his trade value is, but I'm guessing it's low.
19:03 Speaker 01 No, it's, it's, it's high because he has an incredible contract. He was like, you know what? Just a few years, 20 million bucks. Sounds great, man. It's an incredible contract that he signed. So he's very valuable. If you can get a version out of him, it's get him to be committed to playing.
19:21 Bill Simmons? If you can get a version out of him that hasn't existed for two years.
19:26 Speaker 01 Yes.
19:26 Bill Simmons? So the Warriors have been mentioned with Butler. And I just, I don't know what the point is, House, because I just don't know if that's making a huge difference for them. You could talk yourself into it. Curry, Draymond and Butler are the old guys. Let's make a run. But I just think the league's too good. They started out strong. They've gone the other way. They have a lot of like tradable pieces that have, the minutes are all over the place. Buddy Hield now all of a sudden scores five points a game. Podzemski isn't the same asset. So I, I don't, I don't know why Miami would want their stuff or want to pay Kaminga however much. I don't know what else. You had, you had under for them, right?
20:03 Speaker 01 I had under for them and it's because, you know, they, they had.
20:09 Speaker 01 Pieces that they added in the offseason that were supposed to create depth and you know, Melton got hurt and yeah, but none of the pieces really moved the needle. Oh, Buddy Hill is only, it's a shocker. Buddy Hill's only averaging five points. Right. Like he couldn't stick in Philly.
20:24 Bill Simmons? Two different cities, yes.
20:26 Speaker 01 Yeah, Philly needs a guy that could score from the perimeter. Uh, I feel like the Golden State situation, you know, it requires what we got with the Christmas game, which was Steph Curry's scoring eight points in 26 seconds and right. And then they lose on a layup and it wasn't just like a hard for Reeves. It was Ole. It was Ole defense. My man got right to come on, come on. So they are where they are.
20:50 Bill Simmons? Yeah. And there's a, I think we talked about this before the year. We were trying to figure out over unders with the West. There were so many good teams. Some teams were just going to end up not being happy. And right now it's Sacramento and it's Golden State and San Antonio is a little better than we thought. Denver's a little worse than we thought. Minnesota's a little worse than we thought, but we knew it was going to be some, I had the NFL was way more easy to figure out this year I think than the NBA. The Celtics, you went under, I went over and I am not going to overreact to anything with the Celtics yet. Um, you were on it a little more about how hard it is to repeat. That was part of your under case, right?
21:27 Speaker 01 Just in terms of like bringing that energy, they, there was, you know, all their core guys went to the Olympics, except for Jalen Brown, who wasn't invited. But you know, like going from the finals to the Olympics to an NBA regular season and 58 wins in this era is still like excellent. So if they win 58 games and they certainly can, I still win my bet at 58 and a half to 59 and a half, whatever the, the total was, but it's just hard. It's a slog and I don't begrudge them, you know, sort of going through peaks and valleys over the course of a regular season. Knock on wood, there'll be, uh, plenty healthy come April. And really the only thing that was interesting to me in terms of a regular season
22:09 Speaker 01 outcome is like, is Tatum going to put himself into that MVP conversation? Is this the right moment for that even?
22:15 Bill Simmons? Yeah. Well, so glass half full. Tatum and Brown are healthy athletically, physically, they seem great. Brown's little hero, Bollie this year, their shooting stats are down with him a little. I haven't loved that. There's little stuff I don't love, but nothing I'm super concerned about. Like, they lost to Orlando on Monday night. This depleted zombie Magic team. Orlando played great. I watched the game. Like, the Celtics tried hard. They played well. Orlando just played awesome. They made big shots. They, they were super feisty. They were really fighting and it was a really good game. It was an okay loss. The Philly game yesterday, that was Philly treated it like a game seven. They came in, they really wanted to prove
22:58 Bill Simmons? something. They couldn't have played harder and the Celtics couldn't match it. And, you know, I'm not, I'm not worried about that either. I think White's hasn't been the same all month. Holiday was hurt. Porzingis keeps getting these dumb little injuries. Pritchard sometimes just doesn't show up. Yesterday, he sucked. I'm not going to really evaluate the Celtics team until the West Coast trip next month. That's when we'll know. That's when we'll, we'll have a feeling for them. I don't love that they're four back from the Cavs, but, uh, but yeah, that's, so those are the big NBA storylines to me is just Milwaukee's better. Like Milwaukee, I think has moved back into contender-ish kind of feeling. Denver clearly needs to do something and I don't know what the fix is for them.
23:45 Bill Simmons? Phoenix, I guess, is the one kind of what's going on with this team that we thought was a contender and I just, it just seems like they have the worst centers in the league and they can't keep these guys in the same court. But, uh, but for the most part, I don't think there's been any, any major surprises this year other than Minnesota being as bad as, as they've been, even though they won yesterday.
24:06 Speaker 01 Yeah, and they, they may have figured out. They won yesterday because, you know, Luca went out and the, when he went out, he's going to be out for an extended stretch, which is concerning. But, you know, in the West, the thing that, that makes it super hard for the teams we're talking about, your Lakers, your Denver, your Golden State Warriors, your Minnesota Timberwolves, is the early good performance by Memphis, the early good performance by the Clippers and the, uh, exactly, our anticipated, we all liked Houston. I'm surprised. Did anybody take the Houston over as a lock?
24:39 Bill Simmons? You, I think you and Russillo both did.
24:41 Speaker 01 Oh, great job.
24:42 Bill Simmons? So, yeah, the surprises were Houston, Memphis, Clippers.
24:46 Bill Simmons? And then just San Antonio being a 500 team. I'm still not, if it's okay, I'm still a little dubious of the Clippers. They're only 17 and 13.
24:55 Speaker 01 I mean, it is okay. Yeah.
24:57 Bill Simmons? They're only 17 and 13 and they put a lot on Harden. I also think the way the NBA did this NBA Cup schedule combined with the Christmas schedule, which, hey, news flash, I'm going to criticize the NBA again. I just think they've completely mangled all of this. Like, why aren't there Christmas Eve games? Why are they just punting on a day where there's no sports? Why are they punting on these days when there's clearly no sports? When, instead of like, they load up the Monday, there's like 14 games on Monday. You can't even watch them keep track of anything. And then Tuesday, nothing.
25:28 Speaker 01 It is weird because Christmas Eve is like such an underrated night. I went out to dinner and the place we went to was effing popping.
25:36 Bill Simmons? Right.
25:37 Speaker 01 Butts to nuts, packed from one, when you walked in, the bar is packed. Like, people want to be out and an NBA game is super fun.
25:45 Bill Simmons? Have a couple of games at a bar.
25:45 Speaker 01 To go with your family, you know, go with your family to an NBA game and then dinner, whatever. It's kind of weird.
25:52 Bill Simmons? Yeah. So the reason I bring that up with the Clippers, the way they've structured this December thing, I think it's been good for the old guys. You know, like people like LeBron, Harden, Curry, you're not playing like four and seven, you're not playing five and eight, you're not, you're not having these back to backs, you're not nursing these little injuries because you're not playing that much basketball. But now we're about to hit this stretch, especially when we get to January, where the schedule just gets really hard and it's going to advantage the young guys. It's going to advantage a team like San Antonio that has Wemby and Castle and Vassell and all these young dudes. And I think it's going to hurt a team like the Clippers because the amount of, the amount of offensive responsibility they're putting on Harden,
26:34 Bill Simmons? I don't know if it's sustainable. Once we get into these 16 games in 29 days kind of territory before February. So I'm watching that. I think it's good for teams like Oklahoma City, Houston, Memphis, even a team like the Celtics that are built around two younger guys, Cleveland, you know. But then you look at a team like Orlando, 19 and 12. But really depleted and once you're depleted and you get into these schedule things, kind of a nightmare. Milwaukee, it's good for it because Giannis is an alien. Atlanta, it's good for it because they're built to run all these young guys. Indiana, a team that we bet on earlier this week. I think it's good for them. So anyway, I would, I would watch out. If you had to pick a finals, who would it be?
27:19 Speaker 01 Boston, Oklahoma City.
27:21 Bill Simmons? Yeah, I haven't wavered on that either.
27:22 Speaker 01 To move off of it. Yeah.
27:24 Bill Simmons? Any, did Philly do anything yesterday that, that intrigued you big picture? Or do you just, you're just not going to take it seriously?
27:30 Speaker 01 No, I, I do take it seriously and it does intrigue me. They're like fighting hard to get an identity and that level of, of like competitiveness that they showed against the Celtics.
27:40 Bill Simmons? Yeah, I thought it was promising.
27:41 Speaker 01 It was good. Yeah. Seven and three over their last 10. They're still, the differential still isn't great. But they're, you know, still, yeah, minus four net differential. But like they're pushing in the right direction. If they could just get, you know, two of those three guys healthy for a stretch of time, all, all, every time all three of them play, it's, it's an absolute bonus, but I, they're headed towards, I could see them rip something off in January, be right around 500. And then it's like February turns into March, they're a couple of games above and then they're like a real formidable playoff though.
28:15 Bill Simmons? Well, we'll see because they have, I mean, they have a pretty, they have a, they have a west coast trip coming up. And then a whole bunch of games in January. I mean, they, just in January, from January 1st to the 19th, they have 11 games and that's not counting two games at the end of December too. So, you know, the way they're constructed, there's no way Embiid's going to play more than half of those games, I would assume.
28:38 Speaker 01 Right, I'm sure.
28:39 Bill Simmons? I don't love what I've seen from Paul George. I'd like to throw my voice into that chorus. Just doesn't look as comfortable. He doesn't seem 100% healthy to me, so I want to wait a month on that, but competitively, they looked really good. Caleb Martin is just like a Celtics killer at this point. I don't know what, what it is about Boston, but he rises to the occasion on it. So their season looked dead. Now they're 11 and 17. The problem for them is they have no room for error.
29:04 Speaker 01 That's right. No more margin for error at all.
29:07 Bill Simmons? Yeah, like that, like one more maxi three week ankle sprain or Embiid goes out for a month and all of a sudden you're looking at like the 10th playoff spot because. There's teams like Chicago and Detroit haven't really gone away and I don't know if those are trade teams or not. Everyone thinks Chicago is, but I don't, they're not gonna be able to trade Levine. Who's taking Levine at that money?
29:27 Speaker 01 Somebody desperate enough. Somebody desperate enough.
29:30 Bill Simmons? Maybe it's Vucevic?
29:31 Speaker 01 Sure. Yeah, I mean, you know.
29:34 Bill Simmons? I'm trying to think how they could hurt themselves. It would be trading one of those two guys.
29:37 Speaker 01 You're Denver and Golden States, right? Those kinds of situations where it's like one last gasp, let's see if we can do it. Or maybe the Lakers. If the Lakers keep scuffling around 500, they still have that one trade piece with the pick.
29:52 Bill Simmons? One thing that's happened, one thing that's a little different with the Lakers is Max Christie, who looked like a zero. He's actually been pretty good for them for the last couple of weeks. He's been okay. He's been passable. They can play him in crunch time. He might actually make an open shot. He can play defense a little bit, but it's something they didn't have a month ago. Anyway, all right, that's our NBA report. We're gonna take a break, come back with a million dollar picks.
30:18 Bill Simmons? Sometimes a basketball 30 points can be worth more than 30 points. And now you can get a 30% profit boost from The Ringer with FanDuel's 30 on 30 during Friday's NBA action. We're teaming up with America's number one sportsbook to give you a 30% profit boost. When you either pick a player to score more than 30 points or bet on our new exclusive 30 on 30 special markets like any game, just go nuts. I'm looking at Friday's slate. I always tweet my picks on my Twitter account on Friday because I like to look at Friday mornings, see who's playing, see what the matchups are. You can join me. Ride my picks or just make your own. Look for 30 on 30 in the FanDuel Sportsbook app or head to FanDuel.com/BS for your chance to score a bigger payout this Friday. Don't miss your chance to find out
31:02 Bill Simmons? how much more 30 can be worth with FanDuel's 30 on 30. And speaking of FanDuel, don't forget about The Ringer's Sunday Pregame Show on FanDuel TV and FanDuel Fast Channel and on YouTube TV. Anyway, you must be 20 plus and present in select states or 18 plus and present in DC. Opt-in required. Bonus issued as non-withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply. Including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Game problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com.
31:30 Bill Simmons? This episode is brought to you by Expedia. You know how at the end of the season, your team goes to Cancun? Sometimes earlier than expected? Sometimes after blowing a 3-1 series lead? But what if you went to Cancun? With Expedia, save up to 30% when you bundle and save. You can book the flight or the hotel now, then book the rest later. In all fairness, though, hopefully your team doesn't go to Cancun. 1-2-3 Cancun. Or if they do, you go with them. Expedia, the one place you go to go places. Sign in to save, savings vary. All right, million dollar picks. We're already up, House. We won $300,000 on Christmas Day. Thanks to the Ravens.
32:04 Speaker 01 Merry Christmas.
32:05 Bill Simmons? And thanks to the Chiefs. And we still have a Seahawks bet. We're taping this before the Seahawks game, but we have a Seahawks bet with Baltimore minus 9.5 adjusted. And the Seattle money line, that was plus 312. So we could be up another like 155K after tonight. I like some of the games this week. I know you already did Ringer and gambling show. I didn't hear it yet because it's not up. But the big game and the hardest one to figure out in a while. And I think the most even great matchup we've had all season is this Vikings Packers game in Minnesota. And the Vikings, it's around 1, 1.5. Right now, it's Vikings 1.5. You could make really strong cases for each team.
32:48 Bill Simmons? I think there's a lot of public kind of love and affection for the Packers right now, which would make me a little nervous for them.
32:59 Bill Simmons? Green Bay lost to them earlier in the year. And Green Bay is 10-2 in the last 12 weeks with two Detroit losses. And people are leaning Green Bay in this house. And we have to treat it like a playoff game. Means more to Minnesota because if they can win this, they beat Detroit next week. They're the one seed.
33:17 Speaker 01 Right.
33:17 Bill Simmons? Green Bay is pretty locked into the five or six seed. Not sure it matters. Where are you leaning on this one?
33:26 Speaker 01 I'm I'm inclined to look at that Green Bay side. Mainly because of just how effective they've looked on both sides of the ball. Their defense has just been so impressive. They're able to put pressure on opposing quarterbacks. They're still generating turnovers. There was skepticism earlier in the year, I'll put my hand up. About, you know, their their defense was producing what felt like an outsized number of turnovers. And that was the way that they were able to to look so good defensively. But they they they've continued to do so. And now it looks like their offense is healthy. And now Jacobs is really, they're really leaning into that run game.
34:10 Speaker 01 And it looks like last year where Green Bay went on this run at the end of the season, when Aaron Jones was finally healthy and they were, he led the NFL over the last five weeks and into the playoffs, Aaron Jones for Green Bay in rushing. And I kind of feel like they're they're gearing up in the same direction with with Jacobs. It's not intended to be disrespectful in any way, shape or form towards Minnesota. I mean, it is, the line, I think, is super fair. And I think, you know, the money line is minus 108 for both teams. Like, that's in the book. And I think that's that's totally appropriate. Green Bay outgained Minnesota the first time they played by by.
34:50 Bill Simmons? I watched that game, though. That game was over. They were up by four touchdowns. And then there was a lot of garbage time stuff with Green Bay. And it it kind of belatedly somewhat became a game, but not really.
35:00 Speaker 01 Yeah, okay.
35:01 Bill Simmons? But it was a lot of end of the game shit.
35:03 Speaker 01 These teams tend to split against each other, just historically. It's an important division game. So my my lean would be Green Bay. But if the Vikings go win, like, who's going to be shocked?
35:15 Bill Simmons? So I guess where I've landed in this game is if it was in Green Bay, I would like Green Bay. And because it's in Minnesota, I like Minnesota more. I just think these teams are dead even.
35:26 Speaker 01 Yeah.
35:26 Bill Simmons? And you throw in the home field. There's one other piece with Minnesota, though.
35:31 Bill Simmons? First of all, I do think they're better than people realize. And I and we've talked about this a bunch on this podcast, but. They became a yeah, but team and we've had yeah, but teams before that I thought was justified. Like there was that Cousins Vikings team a couple of years ago that we were like, what? This team's not good. What? This record's ridiculous. Look at what they played. The Vikings are 8-0 with Hawkinson.
35:57 Speaker 01 Yes.
35:58 Bill Simmons? Which I think matters.
35:59 Speaker 01 Yeah.
35:59 Bill Simmons? The Vikings are sixth in DVOA, Green Bay's third. The Vikings are second against the run. They're first in creating turnovers. They have a top five pass rush, but the thing I really like the most about them is these two receivers they have with Hawkinson. I always feel like they can get a drive if they need it.
36:19 Speaker 01 Yeah.
36:19 Bill Simmons? And if this game's in the fourth quarter in their home, I just like their chances to go down the field. Like one, one stat that I think is, I saw this and I was like, how is this the best total? But it is. They lead the league in least amount of percentage they've trailed when they're on offense in the game. They've only trailed for 22% of their snaps on offense. They've been trailing in the game, which basically means they're always ahead. They're always in charge. They're always in the lead, which is good for home. But then they also have the ability at the end of games to get a drive if they need it and to make a big play if they need it. And Green Bay's going to do cover two, like they, their defense actually matches up pretty good with the Vikings. But I like this Vikings team.
37:02 Bill Simmons? And to me, it's like, if you believe in this Vikings team, you kind of have to take them this week. So if you don't, you're basically saying, I don't believe in this team.
37:10 Speaker 01 I don't know. Do we go that far?
37:11 Bill Simmons? Yeah, I think this is a playoff game. I do. I think, I think this is playoff rules this week. I think we have to approach it like playoff manifesto.
37:20 Speaker 01 I don't know. I, I, I don't know. What's Green Bay, um, you know, doing if it really is a playoff game, right? Like that's the problem I have.
37:28 Bill Simmons? I'm saying for Minnesota, it's a playoff game. They win this game. They have a chance to be the one seed. They played Detroit. There's also conspiracy bill. Would like to enter this for one second.
37:37 Speaker 01 Go ahead.
37:39 Bill Simmons? There's no Sunday night, week 18 NBC game right now. It's either Minnesota, Detroit. Or Rams, Seattle, which we might not get if the Rams just beat Arizona this week, which we're gonna have coming up in million dollar picks. The only other possibility is Minnesota Detroit, but Minnesota has to win this game. And if that doesn't happen, now we're into, who'd you have, Carolina versus Atlanta?
38:07 Speaker 01 Yeah, Atlanta. If Atlanta.
38:10 Bill Simmons? Carolina, Atlanta, Sunday night.
38:13 Speaker 01 Yeah, but that would be good because then you'd have Bryce Young against Michael Penex.
38:17 Bill Simmons? How is that good to have Carolina, Atlanta as the last game of the season? That's not good at all. Carolina has four wins.
38:23 Speaker 01 It would be hilarious is what it would be.
38:25 Bill Simmons? I just wonder.
38:26 Speaker 01 It's just funky, but go ahead.
38:28 Bill Simmons? I just wonder, do they, does Minnesota get some calls in this game?
38:32 Speaker 01 Well, they will be at home. They'll get home calls, you expect, for sure. I, I don't, you know, this one is just a stay away because it's, it's,
38:41 Bill Simmons? We're not saying.
38:42 Speaker 01 You don't get it. I don't get any value on the inside.
38:44 Bill Simmons? This is, we have a big little nest egg of million dollar picks and this is the best game in a while. We have to put a bet on it.
38:51 Speaker 01 Go ahead.
38:51 Bill Simmons? Give you, let me give you something that I thought was interesting. Green Bay since week five,
38:58 Bill Simmons? they're nine and two with two Detroit losses, right?
39:01 Speaker 01 Yeah.
39:03 Bill Simmons? Here's who they beat.
39:06 Bill Simmons? Matthew Stafford in week five with no Puka, no Cup.
39:10 Speaker 01 Yes.
39:11 Bill Simmons? Kyler Murray. CJ Stroud, no Collins in that game.
39:17 Bill Simmons? Trevor Lawrence barely beat him. He had his best game of the year. He threw for 300 plus yards against them. They won by three. Caleb Williams. They were up, Chicago's up the whole game and should have won, and then Green Bay won it late. Brandon Allen on San Francisco. Tua on cold weather on Thursday night, Thanksgiving. Geno Smith. And whatever the fuck was going on with the New Orleans quarterbacks last week. Those are all their wins.
39:48 Bill Simmons? They haven't played anything remotely approaching Sam Darnold, Hawkinson, Addison and Jefferson and Aaron Jones. This is by far the best complete offense they've played.
39:59 Speaker 01 Now do Minnesota.
40:00 Bill Simmons? Well, I know Minnesota has the same thing, but I'm saying you can't use that case against Minnesota and then not use it against Green Bay.
40:06 Speaker 01 Well, I think they're in very similar positions because this is a gigantic step up in class for Minnesota. Minnesota's defense hasn't seen anything like this Green Bay offense. Look at these offenses that Minnesota has seen since they lost to the Rams in, you know, week six or seven, whatever it was. They played the Colts with Anthony Richardson. They played the Jaguars. They played the Titans. They played the Bears. They played Kyler and the Cardinals, which was a huge comeback game, right? The Cardinals were up. That should have been a Cardinals win.
40:40 Bill Simmons? Not a great Vikings game.
40:41 Speaker 01 They got Kirk Cousins and the Falcons in his triumphant return to Minnesota, which ended his career in Atlanta and maybe his career in NFL football. And the Bears and the Seahawks, the best game, the best win was going into Seattle and going, coming down to the wire.
40:59 Bill Simmons? But that's the irony of this. Both teams, most impressive win, the last like two and a half months was Seattle.
41:07 Bill Simmons? Who also might not be good.
41:09 Speaker 01 Well, they're kind of like, they're good enough to be fighting for a playoffs, but yes, yes. If we're going to do that, we have to do it for both, both teams. And the interesting thing to me, you made the case for Minnesota's offense. Looking good. You want them with the ball at the end of the game. I think it's, I would say the exact same thing about Green Bay. It's, to me, it's not that dissimilar from the handicapping of that Thursday night Detroit, Green Bay game. Where it came down to which team had the ball at the end.
41:38 Bill Simmons? It's a great game.
41:39 Speaker 01 Right?
41:39 Bill Simmons? I don't, I don't think there's a wrong answer. I just feel like people have tilted more toward the Packers and I feel like it's dead even. And I think.
41:47 Speaker 01 Well, Minnesota's favored.
41:49 Bill Simmons? Well, they're, they're minus one and a half is their home.
41:52 Speaker 01 But I'm just saying.
41:53 Bill Simmons? If this was in Green Bay, Green Bay would be minus one and a half over Minnesota.
41:56 Speaker 01 True, but I, but like the public hasn't jumped in yet with, with, with a big perspective.
42:03 Bill Simmons? So you're thinking it's a stay away?
42:05 Speaker 01 I mean, if you want to put something small in it so that you can say we did it and it's fun and then Minnesota wins, it's like excellent. Now we have Minnesota and Detroit in week 18 for the one seed.
42:16 Bill Simmons? Wait a second. So we're taping this at 1117 Pacific time.
42:21 Speaker 01 Yeah.
42:22 Bill Simmons? December 26, Thursday.
42:24 Speaker 01 True.
42:26 Bill Simmons? The line is completely flipped. It's now Green Bay minus one and a half over Minnesota.
42:30 Speaker 01 So somebody stepped in. That's a syndicate play.
42:33 Bill Simmons? Yeah, it's a syndicate play. So the line moves three points. And now it's Minnesota minus 102, plus one, plus 1.5.
42:44 Bill Simmons? And Green Bay minus 116.
42:47 Speaker 01 Somebody's taking a stand.
42:48 Bill Simmons? Does that make you nervous or, or what?
42:51 Speaker 01 I honestly think that we're going to see one or two more of these over the course of the next two, two days. I bet, I, you know, the rival syndicates will come in.
42:59 Bill Simmons? Is going to get to minus two and a half?
43:01 Speaker 01 No, I think somebody will come back in on any other direction and, and you know, it'll, it's going to flip again.
43:07 Bill Simmons? Vikings being plus one and a half means they're now in tease territory.
43:11 Speaker 01 Yeah, that is. You, you would want to do it right away, right away.
43:14 Bill Simmons? Well, we can do it right away. We're taping million dollar picks as we speak.
43:18 Speaker 01 Good point.
43:21 Bill Simmons? Any interest in throwing them in with the Miami Dolphins and Cleveland?
43:25 Speaker 01 Hmm.
43:26 Bill Simmons? There's going to be rain.
43:27 Speaker 01 Miami down to?
43:30 Bill Simmons? Miami down, or, or we could basically do, yeah, tease my, what is Miami, six and a half?
43:36 Speaker 01 Yeah.
43:37 Bill Simmons? Yeah. Tease, yeah. Tease Miami down to money line and do Miami plus seven and a half.
43:45 Speaker 01 The only thing that would concern me about the Miami situation.
43:49 Bill Simmons? Well, there's a lot of things that concern me. I don't know. You're going to go with only?
43:53 Speaker 01 Um, the, the single most prominent is if DTR, anything happens to him at quarterback. What I want to see is where Jameis is listed in, in terms of the depth.
44:03 Bill Simmons? I was on Brown's Reddit today, which is one of the darkest places in the internet.
44:07 Speaker 01 Poor guys.
44:07 Bill Simmons? Absolutely brutal. There, there's even on Brown's Reddit, there's even, um, uh, should we make a run at Kirk Cousins this offseason?
44:16 Speaker 01 No.
44:17 Bill Simmons? Yeah, that's a thread on Brown's Reddit.
44:19 Speaker 01 Oh.
44:20 Bill Simmons? Yeah, it's dark, man. It's, it's some of the darkest shit you'll see.
44:25 Bill Simmons? But Browns Reddit was saying that apparently Jameis is hurt too. And if anything happens with DTR, it's Bailey Zappi time?
44:34 Speaker 01 Oh, well, now I'm feeling better. Okay, now we can do Miami. Fine. Now, now we're good.
44:39 Bill Simmons? It's Bailey Zappi injured Jameis, or it's DTR who has one touchdown and nine career picks.
44:45 Speaker 01 Well, I thought they already said that DTR is going to start. My concern was that DTR would start. Something would happen to him and then Jameis would come in and throw four touchdowns.
44:52 Bill Simmons? DTR is playing not 100% healthy, though.
44:55 Speaker 01 Well, I mean, I just need to make, I want certainty that Jameis will not come in. Cause if Jameis comes in, then I feel like that's a dead loser bet.
45:02 Bill Simmons? For some reason, you're worried about Jameis. I, to me, it's, I'm not worried about Cleveland's offense in this game. I'm worried about the Dolphins in the rain just doing a
45:10 Speaker 01 I understand.
45:11 Bill Simmons? Classic Dolphins stink bomb.
45:13 Speaker 01 We don't have to put them in a teaser. I mean, there's other good, good legs. Dallas is a pretty good teaser leg.
45:19 Bill Simmons? Well, the reason I, I brought them up for a teaser is just,
45:25 Bill Simmons? you know, at some point, these teams, the, the franchises are kind of steering them toward a top five pick, right? I don't think the Giants want to win. The Raiders are stupid. They couldn't help themselves last week. But there's certain teams that I just feel like are good with not winning another game.
45:42 Speaker 01 Yeah.
45:42 Bill Simmons? And Cleveland to me feels like one of them. Like if you're Cleveland, Bailey Zappi is the move this week. We had Bailey Zappi on the Pats. He is not a competent quarterback. You want to put him out against Miami next week. You want to bench like, or you want to rest like a defensive starter who's a little banged up. Like you, there's subtle stuff you can do to make sure you don't win again. Because
46:04 Speaker 01 For sure.
46:05 Bill Simmons? There, cause there's a couple, like Tennessee plays Jacksonville. Both those teams are three and 12. One of them are going to be four and 13 after, four and 12 after that game. So Cleveland can jump up a spot there. The Pats might beat the Chargers for all we know. Like they, they might be able to nudge up.
46:20 Speaker 01 Yeah.
46:20 Bill Simmons? That was what I was thinking about. And plus Miami really needs the game. They're still in the playoff race.
46:24 Speaker 01 Yeah, still in the race for sure.
46:27 Bill Simmons? So maybe, cause I have another tease I want to do with the two LA teams.
46:30 Speaker 01 Okay.
46:31 Bill Simmons? So maybe we'll mark down something with Vikings Dolphins, just for fun. Next one, and I'm split on this one too, is Bengals Broncos. You said on the Ringer gambling show that you like Cincy at home minus three in what's going to be bad weather.
46:50 Bill Simmons? They're kind of technically alive still. Denver needs a game. This is weirdly a playoff game in some ways.
46:57 Speaker 01 Right, right. No, I, I, I think both teams will treat it like a playoff game. And this is exactly why my handicap is in favor of the Cincinnati Bengals. That's why I prefer the Bengals. I like the team with the players that have actually like played in the playoffs. Yeah. The team that doesn't have the rookie quarterback and you know, Bo Nix, these nuts, they have been, they have been throwing the football all over the place and we're seeing the version of him that kind of makes sense, right? He's, he's throwing picks, multiple picks, uh, every week, uh, Bo Nix, these nuts. And the, the, uh, Denver Broncos, the only thing would be with their defense,
47:35 Speaker 01 they're getting Riley Moss back. So they, they had two of their last three games, they gave up, they gave up 32 points to Jameis, they gave up 34 points to Justin Herbert. Their secondary was getting eaten up. If Riley Moss comes back and they, and he's able to go up against Jamar Chase, that's an incredible matchup. But I love all the other weapons that Cincinnati.
47:56 Bill Simmons? Moss is back, by the way. I was checking in with my buddy Gus, my buddy Gus, who, my only person in my life who truly knows the Broncos. And he was telling me when Moss got hurt, we're in major trouble. This guy Levi Wallace is a disaster.
48:08 Speaker 01 Yeah.
48:08 Bill Simmons? Levi Wallace has been cut.
48:10 Speaker 01 Released.
48:10 Bill Simmons? He's not even on the team anymore.
48:12 Speaker 01 So long Levi.
48:13 Bill Simmons? Moss is back, so I feel like that, I know it's one guy, but I really feel like that's going to flip their secondary in a major way.
48:18 Speaker 01 He's an important guy, let there be no doubt.
48:21 Bill Simmons? Um, there's some other cases for them. Do you have more on your case? Cause I was gonna hit some counters.
48:26 Speaker 01 I'll stop now. I mean, Cincinnati hasn't been good at home, so I, I prefer to not lay any points at all. Just let them, you know, win the game. Cincinnati money line was my preferred play.
48:35 Bill Simmons? Last six weeks, Denver's fifth in DVOA despite some of the secondary stuff and despite some of the turnovers by Nix. Cincinnati's 29th against the run, their defense. Cincinnati's 30th QB hits. So basically this is the perfect team for Denver to play with Bo Nix with the way, kind of how up and down they've been. This is a team that will not pressure him, hit him. They're just not going to do anything. Denver's defense. They're, you know, first in hits, first in hurries. They're going to be able to pressure the, the Bengals, the offensive line, not exactly like a juggernaut.
49:10 Speaker 01 No, no. I mean, you know, a, a strat, a, a strip sack fumble last week against the Browns that, that helped me lose a nice teaser bet on, on the Cincinnati team total. That like he gets to his 24.
49:27 Bill Simmons? Well, then the Dallas game the week before, Dallas was going to beat them.
49:31 Speaker 01 Yep.
49:31 Bill Simmons? Right?
49:32 Speaker 01 Dallas is going to beat them.
49:33 Bill Simmons? Dallas is pressuring them and doing stuff. So I look at Cincy's wins. Here are the quarterbacks. Have you done this?
49:40 Speaker 01 No.
49:42 Bill Simmons? Quarterback Cincy beat this year, Andy Dalton, Danny Dimes, Deshaun Watson and Thompson Robinson. Same game. Cause I think that was the one Watson got hurt. Minshew, Cooper Rush, Will Levis,
49:57 Bill Simmons? Thompson Robinson. It's not great. I don't think Cincy's good.
50:03 Speaker 01 Yeah.
50:03 Bill Simmons? Is where I'm really landing and I, I think we think they're good because Burrow's good. No other real aspect of their team is good other than the receivers and Burrow. Now you can make the counter case when they have Chase and Higgins together with Burrow. They've just been really good and been able to move the ball. I get it, but I kind of like the Denver plus three.
50:21 Speaker 01 I don't mind the points. I, I really don't mind grabbing the, the points. And there was a minute when it was three and a half and that got stashed up. So it's down, down to three. And I really do kind of understand the case. It's, it's a, it's a rookie quarterback on the road in.
50:36 Bill Simmons? In bad weather.
50:37 Speaker 01 Playoff game, right?
50:38 Bill Simmons? In bad weather.
50:39 Speaker 01 But to, if you want to argue the other side.
50:43 Bill Simmons? What other?
50:43 Speaker 01 They've been good on the road. The, the Denver's been good on the road this year. They beat Tampa in Tampa. They, they beat the Jets in New York.
50:51 Bill Simmons? 10 days rest.
50:52 Speaker 01 Yeah. Extra rest for Sean Payton.
50:54 Bill Simmons? Nine days rest where they play, they're playing Saturday.
50:56 Speaker 01 It's extra, it's extra rest for them and short rest for Cincy because Cincy's on a Saturday game.
51:00 Bill Simmons? Sean Payton versus Zach Taylor.
51:02 Speaker 01 Yep. Well, Zach Taylor did.
51:05 Bill Simmons? Mark it down.
51:06 Speaker 01 Coaching the Super Bowl.
51:08 Bill Simmons? This one.
51:10 Bill Simmons? This one I love. The all LA money parlay.
51:14 Speaker 01 Yes, this is wonderful. Great.
51:15 Bill Simmons? Rams, home for the Cardinals. All the Rams have to do is win and they win the, uh, win the NFC West. Chargers at the Pats. All they have to do is win. They're minus four and a half. And there's some subtle cases against them, right? Their offense isn't that good. They have trouble getting first downs. It's the type of team, like even if they had a lead, Drake May in the second half, like doing stuff. There's a Lad McConkey piece that I don't think can be undersold with the fact that the Pats had that pick. Traded back three spots for a guy, um, who basically doesn't play, who had played three snaps. McConkey's, just him running a mock in this game is almost a lock. I don't know what the player props are for him.
51:58 Bill Simmons? But, uh, Chargers need the game. Rams need the game. And it, it just feels like a classic LA money parlay and it's minus 114 on Fandel and I would like to partake.
52:11 Speaker 01 Well, let me ask you this. Let's go ahead and do that and let's do it in a, in a meaningful increment. Cause we both are, are believers and that's some, some fantastic. I mean, you know, the, the other sort of side to this, remember how good favorites have been. Money line favorites have been absolutely crushing this season. Favorites 75% since week five, uh, in terms of outright wins. Um, and, and favorites have been covering it nearly like 56 or 57% since week five. Like both of those are, you look back 25, 30 years and then those rates are all the way up there. So we're just doing the thing that's staring us in the face that helped us make money last week. Helped us make money on Christmas. We're going to make some more money on Saturday.
52:56 Speaker 01 But I want to just add another wrinkle. Let's go ahead and do whatever you want on that Rams Chargers. We have to put the Colts in. Colts have to be a leg in every money line parlay that we do. Every, really any kind of combination, the Colts have to be in every one of them, just on the money line. Colts beating the Giants outright, um, has to be an element of it.
53:15 Bill Simmons? Well, that, and that goes back, I had the Colts. Um, that goes back to what we talked about earlier, which is certain teams are just done winning games this season.
53:25 Speaker 01 The New York Giants are one of those teams. I assure you.
53:28 Bill Simmons? We're out. We are done.
53:29 Speaker 01 We are done.
53:30 Bill Simmons? It's a wrap.
53:30 Speaker 01 It is.
53:31 Bill Simmons? You had them in the Ringer Sunday pregame last year.
53:34 Speaker 01 Or last week. Yeah, and I was choosing. It was dumb. I had already chosen Carolina as my underdog.
53:40 Bill Simmons? It was, it was plus 350. It was.
53:42 Speaker 01 Right, that's right.
53:43 Bill Simmons? You knew within a quarter. It's like, oh, the Giants are done for the season.
53:46 Speaker 01 The pick, the Drew Lock pick six. That was it. That was it. That was the end.
53:49 Bill Simmons? So are you saying we anchor strategy a little bit with Chargers Rams? Oh, anchor strategy. Okay.
53:56 Speaker 01 To me, the anchor is the Colts, because I'll put the Colts with anybody. The entire across the slate.
54:02 Bill Simmons? Here's what makes me nervous about that. Anthony Richardson, I just can't get there. If there's any quarterback who's ready to just single-handedly kill all of our Week 17 parlays and teasers, it's him. So I just want to proceed with caution.
54:15 Speaker 01 Think about that, like him, not Michael Pennix last week, but Anthony Richardson this week.
54:21 Bill Simmons? Yeah. So, a couple of things with that Rams game really quick. Rams are sixth in DVOA last six weeks. Thanks to Aaron Schatz for that. They've won eight of their last 10. And I don't think people realize how grim this Cardinals situation got.
54:34 Speaker 01 Yeah.
54:35 Bill Simmons? Missing both of their starting tackles on offense. They're like, they're pulling practice squads in, practice squad guys in that are now going to be starting for them. James Connor is hurt.
54:44 Speaker 01 Yeah.
54:44 Bill Simmons? Might play, might not play. Their defense is falling apart. Hubbard had 152 yards last week. Carolina scored 36 on them.
54:52 Speaker 01 Sure did.
54:53 Bill Simmons? It just is grim, and there's a reason the line is where it is. And, uh, because initially I was like, oh, Cards upset, baby. And I looked at all the numbers. I was like, oh, my God.
55:03 Speaker 01 No.
55:03 Bill Simmons? This is no way they're winning.
55:05 Speaker 01 Layer on top of that, all of the McVay stuff. 15-2 against the spread in his last 17 December games. 25, 10-1 all time in December, McVay. The Rams against the Cardinals. The Rams kicked the Cardinals ass. 12-4-1 against the spread over the last eight years against Arizona. 10-2-1 when they're a favorite against the spread, the LA Rams. I'm laying the points with them. They're in the money line parlay. They are part of our anchor strategy. We love the Rams. Their defense also kicking ass. Last two weeks held both the Jets and the 49ers under 10 points. Now you say, oh, look at one of those well offenses to the most disappointing teams in the NFL, but still holding NFL teams on the road to under 10 points. That's impressive.
55:50 Bill Simmons? Chargers, Pats, the case for being nervous about this would be the Pats played well against Buffalo for about an hour and a half last week. I would just point you to 10 horribly game managed, coached, executed plays. They can't help themselves. They surprisingly did not have a lot of penalties last week. Those penalties will come back. The Pats are just incapable of playing three good hours in a row. So for them to beat the Chargers, the Chargers would really have to fuck the game up. And I don't know if they're a fuck the game up team.
56:22 Speaker 01 I mean, that would be, you would have Jared Mayo beating Jim Harbaugh.
56:27 Bill Simmons? You would have that. You would have a team that would decide in week 17, maybe we shouldn't throw backward passes inside our own 10. Maybe we should punt down 10 with eight minutes left. Like something would have to dramatically change with the penalties, the coaching, the execution. I could see them potentially backdoor covering that minus four and a half, but I'd not see them winning.
56:51 Speaker 01 Yeah, I'm good. We're on the same page.
56:53 Bill Simmons? All right. And then the last one I want to talk about, you mentioned the Colts Giants. I mean, we don't need to talk about that. Eagles, Cowboys, that line has dropped too. It was 10, nine and a half all week. Now it's seven and a half on FanDuel. And I had had a bet that I mailed you last night or this morning.
57:12 Speaker 01 Oh, hold on. I see six and a half.
57:14 Bill Simmons? Oh, shit. It's still dropping, huh?
57:16 Speaker 01 Something's going on.
57:17 Bill Simmons? Yeah, six and a half. Well, Hertz might not play is what's going on.
57:20 Speaker 01 Okay, there we go. There's enough uncertainty.
57:24 Bill Simmons? Yeah, I'd wanted to do an alternate, um, alternate bet with Dallas to four and a half when it was nine and a half. It was like plus 172. That's now plus 126.
57:39 Bill Simmons? Which I still like more than the six and a half. But, um, so if we had the Cowboys.
57:46 Bill Simmons? And we do an over of like, what? Thirty seven and a half? I don't know.
57:51 Speaker 01 Well, the total, the total is at thirty nine and a half. Um, in that game, uh, as it is, I, I don't. I'm, I'm worried.
58:01 Bill Simmons? Um. What are you worried about?
58:03 Speaker 01 Mess, just messing with that game at all.
58:05 Bill Simmons? At all?
58:06 Speaker 01 Yeah, what, what?
58:07 Bill Simmons? You think all the value is gone because of the hurts thing?
58:10 Speaker 01 Yes, yes, that's exactly what I think. I would have loved Dallas. I love Dallas at eight and a half. I loved them at nine and a half. The ten was an incredible number. Now that is six and a half, I kind of don't want to mess with it. Um, because Philly got enough with Pickett, uh, of like, he like, he, Pickett can play now, right? He got three quarters of real live NFL football, high stakes, high leverage, and they'll run an offense.
58:34 Bill Simmons? What are you doing right now?
58:36 Speaker 01 I'm not talking.
58:36 Bill Simmons? Did you just make a Kenny Pickett case?
58:37 Speaker 01 No, what, it, it's just like Philly being ready for the game case. That, that's what I mean. That's all I'm saying. The, the, he's not a guy that's like playing with the first team starters for the first time in practice this week. That's all, that's all the observation that I'm making. I, I, I have had enormous success riding with the Cowboys and I'm so upset that they lost to Cincinnati. Uh, on that Monday night stupid punt thing.
59:02 Bill Simmons? Their defense since Parsons has come back has been legit good and their secondary is legit good.
59:08 Speaker 01 Legit good.
59:10 Bill Simmons? So I couldn't interest you in Dallas plus ten and a half with the over of thirty and a half at minus one fifteen?
59:15 Speaker 01 Oh, well, sure, that, yes, yes, because now we're talking. That, that's, those are the numbers. Okay, great. Yeah, I'm into that. That's a good one.
59:23 Bill Simmons? Or doubt, yeah, because I don't want to tease Dallas with another team. I want to confine it to the game.
59:28 Speaker 01 Great, good.
59:29 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
59:29 Speaker 01 Me either. That's fine.
59:30 Bill Simmons? Dallas.
59:32 Speaker 01 Dallas is like nothing better than to go beat Philly.
59:35 Bill Simmons? Dallas plus ten and a half.
59:39 Bill Simmons? With the over of 30 and a half.
59:41 Speaker 01 And Philly's done, right? They don't, there's, there's no, nothing for them to play for.
59:45 Bill Simmons? I think it would be insane for them to play Jalen Hurts. I don't understand why they would do that at all.
59:50 Speaker 01 I totally agree with you. I agree.
59:52 Bill Simmons? All right, it's time. Million Dollar Picks, part two, holiday week. We're already up $300,000. Plus, we have this Seahawks bet coming that we could win. All the Seahawks have to do is win on Thursday night and we're up another like 155.
1:00:06 Speaker 01 Come on, Gino.
1:00:07 Bill Simmons? Our big bet, we are doing an all LA parlay. The LA Rams to finish business against a Cards team that is arrow pointing down. Rams have been really good last six weeks. Rams just to beat the Cardinals, just to beat them. That's it. Just, all they have to do is win the game. Parlayed with the LA Chargers in New England against my beloved New England Patriots, who are feisty but are incapable of playing well for three straight hours. Chargers Rams just have to win. Minus 114, House. Are we going big?
1:00:44 Speaker 01 We love LA.
1:00:46 Bill Simmons? And by the way.
1:00:46 Speaker 01 We love it. We love it.
1:00:48 Bill Simmons? I've somehow figured out a way to be more furious that the Pats won this game and knocked themselves out of a top five pick. I don't want the Pats to win anymore. Let's just get weapons. Let's finish in the top two. And then we can trade back for a team that needs a quarterback and get a lot of assets from my guy Drake May. Please don't win this game, Pats. We're putting $250,000 on that. Chargers Rams minus 114. We talked a lot about Bengals versus Denver and Cincinnati in the rain. Cincy minus three. Cincy with no good wins whatsoever. Cincy, a team that just loves to shoot themselves in the foot. I'm going to take adjusted Broncos plus seven and a half.
1:01:29 Speaker 01 Oh, okay.
1:01:30 Bill Simmons? And I'm going to put that with the Chargers and the Rams for 50K. That's plus 169, House.
1:01:35 Speaker 01 That's fine. So you want to be in business. You want to be in business with Bo Nix's nuts. I'm not going to get away with that business.
1:01:41 Bill Simmons? It's a Sean Payton, Denver, the secondary is good again. Like, just a little sprinkle.
1:01:46 Speaker 01 Love it.
1:01:48 Bill Simmons? Uh, two more that we like. The Cowboys.
1:01:52 Bill Simmons? Going against this Eagles team that Jalen Hurts would know what's happening. The line is dropping as we're taping the pod on Thursday morning. The line dropped from nine and a half to six and a half for the Cowboys, plus six and a half. We're going to bring them back up to Cowboys plus 10 and a half with the over 30 and a half. Minus 115, 100K?
1:02:12 Speaker 01 That's fine. I mean, if you want to do smaller, that's fine, too.
1:02:15 Bill Simmons? 50K? Let's just put 50K. All right, 50K.
1:02:17 Speaker 01 Just a little division, divisional rivalry. It'll be fun. Philly hates Dallas. It'll be great. I mean, Dallas has been playing so good over the last six weeks.
1:02:26 Bill Simmons? The Parsons effect.
1:02:28 Speaker 01 Yep.
1:02:28 Bill Simmons? Michael Parsons, the only guy with a podcast is playing well.
1:02:32 Speaker 01 They're gonna.
1:02:33 Bill Simmons? Only athlete podcast is actually succeeding in, at sports these days?
1:02:38 Speaker 01 Jerry might have to buy that podcast for $250 million so they could afford to pay him and keep him under the salary cap.
1:02:44 Bill Simmons? Yeah, what would happen if Jerry formed a media company and then just paid $100 million for the Michael Parsons podcast? That'd be interesting, interesting idea, House.
1:02:51 Speaker 01 It's a collective bargaining agreement violation, I'm sure, but still.
1:02:55 Bill Simmons? Last one, Colts against the Giants. We both love the Colts.
1:02:59 Speaker 01 We do love the Colts.
1:03:00 Bill Simmons? The Giants do not want to win football games anymore.
1:03:02 Speaker 01 They do not. They have told us.
1:03:04 Bill Simmons? They're done. It's a wrap.
1:03:06 Speaker 01 It's a wrap.
1:03:07 Bill Simmons? Colts first half game, they have to win the first half, they have to win the game. Combined with the Vikings plus seven and a half because we have to have some sort of scratch on this incredible Vikings-Green Bay game. That we argue about, you like Green Bay a little bit more, I like the Vikings a little bit more. The line has shifted. It was Vikings minus one half all week. As we're taping this, it's Green Bay. Minus one and a half now. We're going to grab those Viking points, bring them up to plus seven and a half. That is minus 113. I would like to put 100K on that if we could.
1:03:37 Speaker 01 Okay, okay, fine. I don't mind rooting for a close game between Minnesota and Green Bay. That's fun.
1:03:44 Bill Simmons? And then we also have this Dolphins game that we can completely stay away from. Dolphins against the Browns in the rain, some Bailey Zappi potential. Also two in bad weather. Dolphins need the game. Probably a stay away?
1:04:01 Speaker 01 I think it's a stay away.
1:04:02 Bill Simmons? Okay, I'm fine staying away from, uh, from the Dolphins.
1:04:05 Speaker 01 Good.
1:04:06 Bill Simmons? So that's it. And we should mention, one of the reasons I like Minnesota is because the NFL needs a very good week 18 Sunday night game. And Minnesota, Detroit would do the trick. Collinsworth, they'd have to hose him down.
1:04:20 Speaker 01 Well, I can't wait to see him.
1:04:22 Bill Simmons? I haven't seen anything like this.
1:04:25 Speaker 01 We got him with, uh, my guy, Jaden Daniels and, and Michael Pennix this coming Sunday night. Atlanta in Washington, 8:30 on NBC, prime time, Jaden against the Pennix. We're gonna see it.
1:04:37 Bill Simmons? Notice, notice we steered clear of that game.
1:04:41 Bill Simmons? That is, that is a stay away. I wish you the best.
1:04:46 Speaker 01 Thank you.
1:04:46 Bill Simmons? Anyway, we are up 1.764 million for the season pending the Seahawks game. And hopefully the LA parlay will take us over the 2 million mark. Those are the holiday edition part two, million dollar picks for week 17. House, I hope you ate a lot yesterday.
1:05:06 Speaker 01 I did. If we hit this LA parlay when I'm out there two weeks for the Ringer pregame show, we'll celebrate with an LA parlay.
1:05:13 Bill Simmons? If the LA parlay of food?
1:05:14 Speaker 01 Yeah, we'll go to Momofuku for lunch and then where are we gonna go for dinner?
1:05:17 Bill Simmons? I have like a smash burger.
1:05:19 Speaker 01 I met Major Domo.
1:05:20 Bill Simmons? I have a smash burger place for you.
1:05:22 Speaker 01 Oh, right.
1:05:23 Bill Simmons? I have an Indian food place for you.
1:05:26 Speaker 01 Ooh.
1:05:26 Bill Simmons? I have, I have a, I have some wrinkles for you for this trip.
1:05:29 Speaker 01 What a parlay.
1:05:30 Bill Simmons? You, can you do salads for the week before you get here?
1:05:33 Speaker 01 I'll try my best.
1:05:34 Bill Simmons? You gotta like really clear the intestines.
1:05:37 Speaker 01 I'll try my best.
1:05:38 Bill Simmons? Plan for you.
1:05:39 Speaker 01 I can't wait.
1:05:39 Bill Simmons? House, great to see you. Happy belated Christmas.
1:05:42 Speaker 01 Happy holidays to all.
1:05:47 Bill Simmons? All right, quick break. This episode is brought to you by Fire TV. You ever sit down, ready to watch the game, only to search and scroll endlessly? If so, you need Fire TV. It shows you are live games from your favorite teams all in one place, right on the home screen. No more searching. Just sit down and turn on Fire TV. Separate subscriptions may be required. Feature and content availability may vary.
1:06:10 Bill Simmons? This episode of the Bill Simmons Podcast is presented by State Farm. Every football player brings something different to the field. Maybe they have a cannon arm, speed, power. Maybe they have their own podcast. That being said, no two players are exactly alike. And the same is true off the field. That's why State Farm takes the time to get to know you. So they can help personalize coverage for your life and budget. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. All right, we are taping this the day after Christmas. It's an emotional time here on the BS Pod. My daughter Zoe Simmons is here. We're doing the end of the year Teen Culture Awards, which I think we've done every year for the last few years. We made a missed one. You've been doing this since, I don't know, you were 12, 13, something like that. But this is the last year. You're 19.
1:06:55 Bill Simmons? Next year, you're not a teenager.
1:06:57 Speaker 02 Yeah, no awards for next year. Really appreciate this one while you have it.
1:07:01 Bill Simmons? No, we'll call it the 20-something awards next year.
1:07:03 Speaker 02 And I feel like you have to, it retires itself at that point.
1:07:06 Bill Simmons? That's, you're, you're hanging it up? What's gonna happen to you?
1:07:09 Speaker 02 Teen Culture Awards.
1:07:10 Bill Simmons? All right.
1:07:11 Speaker 02 Turn into a new leaf. This is it.
1:07:13 Bill Simmons? So we call it the Young Woman Awards? What do we call it?
1:07:15 Speaker 02 The Young Woman Awards? I think not.
1:07:17 Bill Simmons? Young Adult Awards?
1:07:18 Speaker 02 We'll see if it, if it figures itself out next year. For now, this is looking like it.
1:07:23 Bill Simmons? Thanks for putting no thought into that. All right, so end of the year awards. We have a whole bunch of categories. I'm just gonna set you up. Most important category every year is the TV show of the year. What was it this year?
1:07:35 Speaker 02 This year, we selected Tell Me Lies as my TV show for the year. Uh, reason being, this is probably the most emotional a show has ever made me.
1:07:46 Bill Simmons? Why?
1:07:47 Speaker 02 Because it kind of depicts perfectly like a super toxic college relationship. I think it struck a chord within a lot of people my age, especially as a college student. And the show actually casted people that look like the age that they're supposed to be playing.
1:08:02 Bill Simmons? So that's a big thing for you that?
1:08:03 Speaker 02 For me, that's the most important, the most important thing that a TV show can do. The people on the show have to look like the age that they're trying to play. Like, that actually makes it a much more emotionally.
1:08:15 Speaker 02 Difficult situation.
1:08:17 Bill Simmons? Like Sex Lives in College Girls. I'm not sure those girls look like college girls.
1:08:20 Speaker 02 Yeah, I haven't even watched it yet because I've seen the cast and it's just like this doesn't look like people that I'd be running into in my ethics class next week. Like this is not, these people are like the older people coming back to college trying to figure it out.
1:08:33 Bill Simmons? So what, so tell me lies. There's a lot of sex in it. Let's be honest. It's not a show I would watch with you. That's okay.
1:08:39 Speaker 02 That's for sure. That's for sure. But with my girlfriends, my best friend from college, my roommate, we would sit there and wait for each episode to come out every week and watch it together with our like headphones individually and in our computers and just like completely jaw on the floor every single time.
1:08:54 Bill Simmons? Oh wait, because you don't have a TV.
1:08:55 Speaker 02 We don't have a TV.
1:08:56 Bill Simmons? So will you press play at the same time?
1:08:58 Speaker 02 We'd like sync it up. But it was, I mean jaw dropping every single episode. It just, it got so crazy, but the manipulation of the main character Steven that he does to his little girlfriend Lucy is like, he almost makes you think that you're crazy because of how good of a manipulator he is. But the show was incredible and that was made true with like all the um attention it got on TikTok and they actually renewed it after they were going to cancel it before it got all the.
1:09:28 Bill Simmons? It did get pretty much canceled, yeah.
1:09:30 Speaker 02 So TikTok really saved this show this year.
1:09:34 Bill Simmons? Can you explain how TikTok saves a show? Because this is, and there's some other parts that we're gonna talk about later with this, but TikTok taking a show either in a good way or a bad way.
1:09:45 Speaker 02 It's weird because now that social media is such a prominent thing, even a shitty TV show can become super popular, even a shitty song. Like no matter what it is, if people will band behind it, that's what makes a song or show successful. And I've been talking about it a lot with my friends and it feels like a lot of producers of TV shows and songmakers, whatever it is, they're trying to appeal to the social media eye rather than the critics or the other people that actually like establish whether a show or a music video is good enough. It's more about like if you get the TikTok people behind you, that will make you successful.
1:10:23 Bill Simmons? Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
1:10:25 Speaker 02 I mean, it's definitely made the content that's being put out there worse.
1:10:29 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:10:30 Speaker 02 Because it's catered to all of these people that like have short attention spans or whatever it is. But this show caters exactly to people like me who found it through TikTok. I didn't even know about the show until I saw a little clip of it on TikTok. And I binged through the whole thing.
1:10:45 Bill Simmons? It checks a lot of Zoe boxes, including we go back and forth in the future. And everybody's older and younger.
1:10:51 Speaker 02 Yeah, I like a little, a little time sequence.
1:10:54 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:10:55 Speaker 02 But it's, the show is phenomenal. It was easily my, my top number one show this year. I think as a college student, it, that really was what hit home for me.
1:11:05 Bill Simmons? So that's great. So like when I was in college, nine oh two one oh hit home with all of us, which was a relatively normal show. You're saying for your generation, a super toxic guy fucking with all of these different people on the show. This has really resonated with your generation.
1:11:21 Speaker 02 That sort of thing has like never been depicted. And it also uses social media as a tactic of manipulation that the main character uses, which a lot of TV shows don't incorporate social media.
1:11:33 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:11:33 Speaker 02 It's kind of like a blacklist and like you can't do it because that will take the characters out of the show, whatever. But people like me, we're always on our phones. Like it's not realistic to have a TV show that doesn't incorporate like the use of manipulative text messages or Snapchats or whatever it is. And like this show actually has that. Right.
1:11:51 Bill Simmons? Or ghosting.
1:11:52 Speaker 02 Or being ghosted. So it's like, this is the most realistic depiction of like a, a toxic high school relationship, which is why I loved it so much.
1:12:00 Bill Simmons? Do you think you like toxic relationship shows because all of your relationships have been non-toxic and pretty normal?
1:12:06 Speaker 02 I think so. It's like, oh, this is what it's like. But I know it hit home for a lot of people.
1:12:10 Bill Simmons? Okay. All right. So that's TV show of the year. Favorite content of the year. Do you want me to read the list and you can just go? So some of this has to do with shows you binged.
1:12:22 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:12:22 Bill Simmons? Because you like binging shows.
1:12:24 Speaker 02 Right.
1:12:24 Bill Simmons? You like, either you're doing homework while a show's on or late at night.
1:12:28 Speaker 02 I like white noise shows is, is how I'd put it.
1:12:30 Bill Simmons? Well, number one is the Gilmore Girls, which you finally stumbled into. What was it about this show?
1:12:35 Speaker 02 Well, I always, I stayed away from it because I knew I would love it. I tried to start it a few different times and was kind of bored while watching it, but this year, again, my roommate was like, you need to watch this show, you will love it. So I sat myself down and I watched the first season. The first season wasn't the most interesting because Rory, the main character, was like a fresh high schooler in New Haven, Connecticut. And I was like, what is this? This is not my jam at all. But then as the show continues on, it kind of just, it feels like a warm hug, is how I'd describe it. I think a lot of Gilmore Girls lovers would describe the show as just like a warm, comforting, like when you're in need of feeling like you're around family, or you just need your spirits uplifted, that's where you go.
1:13:19 Bill Simmons? Mom-daughter show.
1:13:20 Speaker 02 Mom-daughter show. Which.
1:13:26 Bill Simmons? What would be your mom-daughter show?
1:13:28 Speaker 02 Ours would be a lot more realistic. The thing about Gilmore Girls is like, it's supposed to be a perfect world. And Lorelai had Rory when she was like 16 years old. So there's a really short age gap between them, which makes their relationship more like sister to sister.
1:13:44 Speaker 02 But the show itself is incredible. It's definitely unrealistic, but it, it kept me interested for seven seasons, each episode being like.
1:13:52 Bill Simmons? Didn't it stay too long though? The last two seasons were not great, right?
1:13:55 Speaker 02 Yeah, I mean, some parts could have been cut out, but honestly, the last two seasons were my favorites because Rory was in college, going through college, which once again is my favorite form of TV show when the main character is going through college. And she was having boyfriends and all these different things and whatever. So I actually liked the show as it progressed, but I loved Gilmore Girls just as something to fall back on when college days were getting hard.
1:14:19 Bill Simmons? Well, one other binge watch show was This Is Us.
1:14:22 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:14:22 Bill Simmons? I don't like when you watch shows that are sad because you assume the mood of whatever the show is.
1:14:27 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:14:28 Bill Simmons? Which thank God you didn't assume the mood of Tell Me Lies, but.
1:14:31 Speaker 02 Right.
1:14:32 Bill Simmons? But This Is Us, like, it's an emotional journey. So you were kind of an emotional person as you watched this.
1:14:37 Speaker 02 Yeah, but this is different. I don't think it was a Grey's Anatomy COVID situation where I was just completely put out and like unable to like act every day. This show definitely hits the, hits the heartstrings.
1:14:50 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:14:51 Speaker 02 But in a good way. I loved this show. This, it kept me interested and it was so unrealistic to the point where I almost wasn't emotionally affected by it because it's like, when would this ever happen, ever?
1:15:02 Bill Simmons? Right. Okay.
1:15:04 Bill Simmons? Next one, the Unfiltered Podcast.
1:15:06 Speaker 02 It's basically unfiltered.
1:15:08 Bill Simmons? Basically unfiltered.
1:15:09 Speaker 02 It was the merging of two different podcasts that I really like on Spotify. The Unfiltered Podcast is hosted by Zayn Hijazi and Heath. They were like two of David Dobrik's best friends who kind of diverged and made a podcast. And then the other one was Pretty Basic, hosted by Remy Cruz and Alicia Marie. And they like joined forces and made this podcast altogether. So that's what it is, but.
1:15:35 Bill Simmons? What do you like about it? You're not telling us anything.
1:15:37 Speaker 02 Well, I was just explaining what it was.
1:15:40 Bill Simmons? Well, Remy Cruz has a salad that you pointed out when we were walking around LA.
1:15:44 Speaker 02 It's a tuna bowl, a salmon bowl. But I've loved all of these YouTubers. It's like more of a nostalgic thing for me because I've watched them since I was like 13, ever since I started watching YouTube.
1:15:54 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:15:55 Speaker 02 And they joined forces and they have a Patreon page, which I, I really love. And they'll go and do like, um, they'll film a high episode or a mukbang episode or them like going to, um, like on Halloween time, they went to the Halloween like scare fest, whatever. It's just like a really fun, airy, light podcast where it's kind of like girls versus boys and they'll do challenges and stuff. But it's just easy to watch. I like it.
1:16:21 Bill Simmons? Video pod.
1:16:22 Speaker 02 Video pod.
1:16:24 Bill Simmons? We Live in Time is the next one on the list. I don't even know what that one is.
1:16:27 Speaker 02 That was the movie that came out.
1:16:29 Bill Simmons? Oh, the cancer movie?
1:16:30 Speaker 02 Andrew Garfield and Florence Pugh. I loved this movie. I saw this like a month or two ago. And needless to say, I think mom will watch it like 15 times when she finds it. But it was, it was great. I love Andrew Garfield. I love Florence Pugh. I love a British accent. Everything about the movie was phenomenal.
1:16:51 Bill Simmons? I tried to watch this movie with the two of you and left after like 40 minutes.
1:16:55 Speaker 02 Yeah. Which I don't know why, because it was also a cooking movie, which is like, that's everything that I need. Cancer, cooking, Andrew Garfield, British accent. I'm in.
1:17:05 Bill Simmons? Wow, that's your algorithm. Uh, I skipped that one. Blink Twice, Channing Tatum?
1:17:11 Speaker 02 This was great. Did you see this one?
1:17:12 Bill Simmons? I did.
1:17:13 Speaker 02 I really loved this movie because I'm, um, a big.
1:17:18 Speaker 02 Psychological thriller person.
1:17:20 Bill Simmons? Right.
1:17:20 Speaker 02 I prefer that much more.
1:17:21 Bill Simmons? You love Get Out as an all-timer for you.
1:17:23 Speaker 02 Right. Like, I love Get Out. I love all those types of movies. So this one, I thought was phenomenal. And I love when a movie takes me on a vacation.
1:17:32 Bill Simmons? Right.
1:17:33 Speaker 02 This movie was on a great resort. Things kind of started to get weird. We didn't exactly know why. It kind of revealed itself. Channing Tatum's gorgeous. It was a beautiful combo of things. I loved this movie.
1:17:44 Bill Simmons? Speaking of going on vacation, you did a White Lotus re-watch that you put on favorite content of the year, even though you've already seen the show.
1:17:50 Speaker 02 A hundred times. And I would watch it again and again. I think this is the single best TV show series ever.
1:17:57 Bill Simmons? Ever? Okay, The Goat.
1:17:59 Speaker 02 To me. I think it's-
1:18:00 Bill Simmons? Granted, you've missed a lot of great TV shows. You didn't watch Sopranos. You didn't watch Mad Men, Breaking Bad.
1:18:05 Speaker 02 I said to me, I didn't say to anyone else. This is-
1:18:08 Bill Simmons? I'm just saying, there's some meat on the bone.
1:18:09 Speaker 02 This is my number one. And re-watching it back, all of the little details and the things that I missed the first time I watched it, it's like, wow, this show is phenomenal.
1:18:19 Bill Simmons? The Therapuss Podcast?
1:18:20 Speaker 02 Therapuss.
1:18:21 Bill Simmons? Therapuss?
1:18:23 Speaker 02 Therapuss. Um, this, this pod is great. I think this is a perfect example of like, new upcoming podcasts that are kind of trying to take like the TikTok vibes and bringing it over to a, a podcast. This is hosted by Jake Shane, but he just brings on all of his celebrity friends, like, uh, Sophia Richie, who I love. Uh, all sorts of different celebrities. And he does this segment called the Tell Me What's Wrongs. And he'll have his fans send in like a bunch of things that have happened to them, crazy things. And then him and the celebrity will give them advice on how to deal with it. And then they'll prescribe them with different things to like fix that situation.
1:19:05 Speaker 02 But he's just so funny and light and airy. I love his podcast. I just, I enjoy listening to it. I like happy things.
1:19:12 Bill Simmons? When you say the TikTok piece of it, so it's a lot of people like trying to self-diagnose, figure out what's wrong.
1:19:17 Speaker 02 Yes. And it's like an interactive podcast where his fans are, are basically like the basis of the podcast. He's answering people's questions and giving them advice with a celebrity, which I think is super effective. And it's personable. Like, when I listen to it, I feel like I'm his friend.
1:19:33 Bill Simmons? LA? Where is he taping that out of?
1:19:35 Speaker 02 LA.
1:19:35 Bill Simmons? Okay. Waiting for an invite from Jake from Therapuss. Therapuss or Therapuss?
1:19:41 Speaker 02 Therapuss. Like octopus.
1:19:43 Bill Simmons? Okay. The idea of you. Another content of the year choice for you.
1:19:49 Speaker 02 I think mom watched it about 50 times over.
1:19:51 Bill Simmons? Yeah, should I be concerned about that? That she was obsessed with the movie about a woman meeting a younger guy?
1:19:58 Speaker 02 Anne Hathaway is phenomenal and she only gets more beautiful. And this movie, it had to happen and they executed it perfectly. Like it was about time that a movie like this came out where a celebrity falls in love with a a hot mom whose life has fallen apart.
1:20:14 Bill Simmons? I like that. So I happened to watch this one with mom. And the ending was kind of pushing it.
1:20:22 Speaker 02 Yeah, it was pushing it.
1:20:23 Bill Simmons? Can we spoiler alert the ending?
1:20:24 Speaker 02 Yeah, go ahead.
1:20:25 Bill Simmons? People have probably seen this. So they agree to break up.
1:20:28 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:20:28 Bill Simmons? Cause you know, she's what 15 years older and he's becoming a pop star. And basically they break up because it's screwing up her daughter.
1:20:38 Speaker 02 Right.
1:20:39 Bill Simmons? Her daughters have an issue with it. So she's like, five years from now, my daughter's in college. Give me a call. He's like, all right. And then she's watching some TV show and he's on, he's like, I'm going to it's five years later. Of course she's still single, even though she's gorgeous.
1:20:52 Speaker 02 Right.
1:20:52 Bill Simmons? No guy could be seen for her. Just hanging out on a Thursday night. Sees it and then all of a sudden he shows up at the end and they have kind of a look.
1:21:00 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:21:01 Bill Simmons? And it's a happy ending.
1:21:02 Speaker 02 Happy ending.
1:21:03 Bill Simmons? And then he gets to go through menopause and all, all the great old lady stages with her. Happy for both of them.
1:21:09 Speaker 02 Interesting that the daughter piece.
1:21:12 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:21:12 Speaker 02 In that movie, like a selfish mom making a decision to get involved with a celebrity and then ruining her daughter's life, but which actually happens a lot in real life. So I liked it.
1:21:23 Bill Simmons? Your last one for favorite content of the year. I see long legs is on there. I didn't realize you like long legs.
1:21:32 Speaker 02 Oh my God.
1:21:34 Bill Simmons? You like long legs?
1:21:35 Speaker 02 I like long legs.
1:21:37 Bill Simmons? You guys love this. We saw this together in the theater. I was not as big of a fan, but you and Ben were.
1:21:41 Speaker 02 Yeah, I don't know why. I saw it like four times.
1:21:44 Bill Simmons? Did you really?
1:21:44 Speaker 02 I did. I saw it four times.
1:21:46 Bill Simmons? Well, you're a bad judge with movies because you have a movie theater like
1:21:50 Speaker 02 Right, right around the corner.
1:21:51 Bill Simmons? 50 yards from where you go to college. So you can just go at 10 o'clock.
1:21:53 Speaker 02 But I thought this, this movie was really good. Out of all the horror movies that came out this year, this was my number one, again, because I really don't like gore. I haven't even seen Smile 2 yet. I know you guys have seen it and I should see it.
1:22:05 Bill Simmons? Smile 2 was good.
1:22:06 Speaker 02 But there's something unappealing about it to, to me.
1:22:09 Bill Simmons? You know why Smile 2 is good? Because the lead actress is great.
1:22:12 Speaker 02 Right. But it's like, that's just not my, Long Legs was much more my type of movie. I also like being on the side of the detectives.
1:22:19 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:22:20 Speaker 02 I like, like, kind of trying to figure it out with them. And I thought the girl that played the main character was phenomenal.
1:22:25 Bill Simmons? And you liked Heretic too.
1:22:27 Speaker 02 Heretic, yeah.
1:22:28 Bill Simmons? Heretic?
1:22:28 Speaker 02 I love Hugh Grant. I think he's great. And seeing him in this sort of light was, was really interesting. It added a lot of depth to him as an actor.
1:22:36 Bill Simmons? So you like detectives cha-chasing something creepy?
1:22:39 Speaker 02 Right.
1:22:39 Bill Simmons? Something's wrong with the house. It's been a staple.
1:22:41 Speaker 02 And the like, whole vibe of that movie was good too. Just the way it was filmed, like the lighting, every attention to detail was, hit the checkbox for me.
1:22:49 Bill Simmons? All right, we're gonna take a break and then come back with the rest of your awards.
1:22:57 Bill Simmons? This episode is brought to you by PNC Bank. In today's sports, everyone is constantly trying to outdo each other. Trick formations, infield shifts, constant rotation changes, yet it's proven time and time again that strong fundamentals are the thing that will lead you to victory. Banking, no different. While everyone else tries to outdo each other, PNC Bank just keeps going right down the middle with steady, calculated money moves. And the financial wins just keep coming. PNC Bank, brilliantly boring since 1865. Brilliantly boring since 1865 is a registered mark of the PNC Financial Services Group, Incorporated. PNC Bank, National Association Member, FDIC. This episode is brought to you by WeatherTech. Whether it's a pumpkin spice coffee that goes splat in your seat,
1:23:42 Bill Simmons? or a weekend tailgate that leaves your trunk full of gear and who knows what, you're gonna want WeatherTech in your vehicle. Whether you call it fall, autumn, or spooky season, whether the mess is your fault, the kids, the dogs, or the weather's fault, you're gonna want WeatherTech for American-made floor liners and a cargo liner that laugh in the face of fall weather. Visit weathertech.com today. All right, so we're continuing the Teen Culture Awards. Last year, we were overdoing this. My daughter turns 20 next year.
1:24:07 Bill Simmons? New category, show you'd most want to go on. What's the answer?
1:24:12 Speaker 02 This was the Mystic Kitchen's Last Meal Show, which I've binged every single episode, even of the celebrities that I don't care for. And I find it the most interesting thing that I've ever watched in my life.
1:24:24 Bill Simmons? Because you think about how weird your last meal would be, where it's like cottage cheese, pickles, hummus.
1:24:29 Speaker 02 That, but it's like, it's such an intimate thing to find out about a celebrity. Like, this is the last thing that you would eat? Like, I was watching, um, I'm trying to think of a good episode that I really love. But, I mean, every celebrity that goes on there, it's just like, what are you putting on your plate right now?
1:24:46 Bill Simmons? So you feel like, compared to Hot Ones, where it's just people like their mouth burning from chicken?
1:24:52 Speaker 02 Right.
1:24:53 Bill Simmons? Chicken wings. You want to know, you feel like this is a window into their actual personality?
1:24:58 Speaker 02 Right. It's like, this is the last thing that you would put into your body on the planet. And I think the host, Josh, I don't know how to pronounce his last name. He's great, too. He's really intelligent.
1:25:08 Bill Simmons? So what's your last meal, then?
1:25:12 Speaker 02 I wish I would have had more time to think about this one. I think a huge Caesar salad with some sort of chicken on it would absolutely be up there.
1:25:19 Bill Simmons? But you'd have to have pickles.
1:25:20 Speaker 02 Right. Pickles, cottage cheese, all the works, hummus, carrots. But that's like, am I really gonna eat that on my last meal? I think I'd need a huge cheese board and a Caesar salad with chicken on it. And a Diet Dr. Pepper and a milkshake.
1:25:36 Bill Simmons? All right, the last meal. I'll check that one out. Breakout stars for this year for you?
1:25:41 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:25:42 Bill Simmons? You had three people. Trinity Rodman?
1:25:45 Speaker 02 I love her. I watched her on the Call Her Daddy podcast last week. Not only was that episode super moving, I just think she is so smart and so cool and so normal, considering her entire situation.
1:25:59 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:26:00 Speaker 02 Like, as for a celebrity, this is the one person where I'm like, wow, I could actually see myself being friends with her. Like, she's so normal and cool and stylish, and I just, I really love her. I idolize her, honestly.
1:26:11 Bill Simmons? And she, we really need her for the US Women's World Cups.
1:26:14 Speaker 02 And she's a phenomenal soccer player on top of it, which is just...
1:26:17 Bill Simmons? She's the best forward we've produced, probably since Abby Waback.
1:26:19 Speaker 02 She's great. I, I truly love her. I think she's...
1:26:23 Bill Simmons? So what did you like about that episode? Just the way she talked about her dad, or just like her perspective on fame? Like, what was it?
1:26:30 Speaker 02 Yeah, I think that was a really tough topic for her to talk about and she'd obviously never talked about it for a reason.
1:26:35 Bill Simmons? The dad.
1:26:36 Speaker 02 Yeah, and even while having that really tough conversation, she still remained so classy and like even though she was airing everything out, she was never speaking poorly on him because she knew there was no point in doing that. So I just like appreciated the way that she approached that situation, the way she held herself. Like, I just think she's gonna be, obviously, she's already really successful, but she's gonna continue to be super successful.
1:27:00 Bill Simmons? I like her too. Next one is Sophia Richie.
1:27:03 Speaker 02 I love her. This is Lionel Richie's daughter.
1:27:06 Bill Simmons? What does she do? Like, does she have content?
1:27:08 Speaker 02 She has a TikTok. Her wedding was like the royal wedding last year. It was like, there was so much stigma around it and she looked beautiful and she's phenomenal, but she's a influencer type. I don't know how to like categorize her. I don't want to because I don't specifically know what she does.
1:27:25 Bill Simmons? Is she funny?
1:27:26 Speaker 02 She's hilarious. She's like the most normal celebrity that, similar to Trinity Rodman that I've like ever witnessed. She's just so normal and down to earth, but I also really like her style and the way that she dresses and carries herself. Like, I like to emulate the outfits that she does. I just, she's like the epitome of an influencer to me, like how all the influencers should be.
1:27:48 Bill Simmons? Normal, normal people are coming back.
1:27:52 Speaker 02 Right. Normal people are, and she's funny.
1:27:55 Bill Simmons? Crazy, not, not as successful in 2024.
1:27:58 Speaker 02 Right.
1:28:00 Bill Simmons? Graydon Cutler and Haley Batchelder? Who are they?
1:28:04 Speaker 02 Haley just joined the Call Her Daddy force or the Unwell content, but she has a new podcast on Spotify, which I really love, called Extra Dirty. But it's the reason I-
1:28:15 Bill Simmons? Extra Dirty? What does that mean?
1:28:17 Speaker 02 Cause it's like a sex podcast. It's kind of like how Alex Cooper used to be before she got married. Right. But I, I really like her. I think she's super funny. She started off in like short form videos on TikTok, talking about like all of her quests out in New York City, the guys that she would meet, the things that she'd do, whatever. She's like not, I don't relate to her all that much, but I really like watching her content a lot. And Graydon's her, her best friend who's always making weird food combinations, which you know I love.
1:28:45 Bill Simmons? Okay. Storyline of the year, you went with the TikTok ban.
1:28:51 Speaker 02 I just thought this is so interesting. Cause what's gonna happen to all of these influencers? I really don't know.
1:28:57 Bill Simmons? You mean if TikTok goes away and like- April.
1:29:00 Speaker 02 Right. It's like all of these people that have given up their jobs and have been making their livelihood by making TikTok videos. Now what happens to them? Like, I genuinely don't know.
1:29:11 Bill Simmons? Instagram reels?
1:29:13 Speaker 02 I guess so, but like, I'm never even on Instagram reels like that.
1:29:16 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:29:16 Speaker 02 I like Instagram reels, but like TikTok is, it's so, it's such a well-oiled machine. Like, it really reels you in. And now that there's this whole TikTok shop thing, which is Amazon equivalent.
1:29:27 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:29:27 Speaker 02 I can see how it's so detrimental to little kids because all of these videos will be promoting things that you can buy on TikTok shop. Where you'll literally watch the video and you can click on the thing at the bottom and you're purchasing something all of a sudden. So it's definitely an evil thing.
1:29:43 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:29:44 Speaker 02 But I'm most curious to see what will happen to all of these influencers and people that have devoted their lives to making TikTok videos that are no longer going to have any job.
1:29:55 Bill Simmons? I'm good with TikTok going away. Favorite developments. We had, you mentioned Patreon earlier, so you're talking about like special Patreon only.
1:30:04 Speaker 02 I love Patreon.
1:30:05 Bill Simmons? Content.
1:30:06 Speaker 02 This really feeds into like the secrecy, feeling like you're friends with your favorite influencer. Obviously, I have to pay $10 a month or whatever to have the Patreons of the people that I'm subscribed to. But it's so interesting because it's almost like a whirlpool into what old YouTube looked like. Before all of the monetizations and whatever were put in place. It's like you can really just lay it all out with no care at all.
1:30:34 Bill Simmons? Okay. So you're saying I should start a Patreon?
1:30:36 Speaker 02 I don't know if I want to see whatever you do on Patreon.
1:30:40 Bill Simmons? Thank you. Spotify video is another one. You were talking about, you like when Spotify, which is good because we're tripling down on this, but you like either watching or listening to a podcast, depending on where you are.
1:30:52 Speaker 02 Yeah, I think it's a great advancement and it's really helpful to see the person that's talking's face.
1:30:59 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:30:59 Speaker 02 Like, that's just something that I, I connect their words so much better with whoever they are by watching the video. And I'll just put it up on the treadmill if I'm working out or if I'm in the car, I won't watch the video. But like, I like that you have the option. I think that's a really good advancement.
1:31:14 Bill Simmons? All right. Well, you're gonna keep getting it. Most fascinating trend. So two things here. You have the last days of original influencer content. What does that mean?
1:31:25 Speaker 02 I think we were talking about the canceled podcast when we
1:31:28 Bill Simmons? Well, so we can, the canceled podcast, that one is the other piece of that.
1:31:31 Speaker 02 Right.
1:31:32 Bill Simmons? So you're talking about there's the end of some sort of era that people don't even know was an era.
1:31:36 Speaker 02 The, people know, it's like the YouTube Vine era of like all of the way that old social media used to be, the way that influencers used to behave. It was like so much more raw and like upfront and people were openly crazy.
1:31:51 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:31:51 Speaker 02 And Tana Mongeau is like the, the face of that when I think of old YouTube. Because she is just like the epitome of, she's been everywhere and done everything, similar with Trisha Paytas.
1:32:03 Bill Simmons? So people beefing, getting canceled, coming back.
1:32:05 Speaker 02 Right. It's like the cockroach syndrome where it's like you can just be openly crazy and it, there was really no problem with it. And you'd get canceled and, and you'd come back and it would just be a continuous loophole where now cancel culture is like you're canceled for whatever it might be and you're done.
1:32:22 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:32:22 Speaker 02 But, uh, the canceled podcast, similar to its name, um, it really was like the last era of that, it felt like, because Brooke Schofield and Tana Mongeau would like air out all of this shit that happened, all these crazy stories of living in LA, going out in Hollywood, whatever it was. And now Tana's in a happy relationship, so is Brooke, and they just kind of are diverging into like this regular influencer, whatever the new Spotify world of influencers.
1:32:50 Bill Simmons? So do you have to basically not be in a healthy relationship to be a good podcaster?
1:32:53 Speaker 02 Apparently so. Or just to be an interesting influencer.
1:32:57 Bill Simmons? Cause I asked you, what would happen if Alex Cooper just got divorced and you got super excited? You're like, whoa, if she started dating again, that'd be amazing.
1:33:04 Speaker 02 Well, that was her, her whole bag. All of her podcasts and stories were about like having random hookups and running around New York City and like being a degenerate and whatever. And now she's happy and super successful and I'm so happy for her.
1:33:17 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:33:18 Speaker 02 But her content definitely reflects that.
1:33:20 Bill Simmons? Right. She's doing more interview stuff and
1:33:22 Speaker 02 And I love like her story about hooking up with the Red Sox guy.
1:33:26 Bill Simmons? You're right.
1:33:26 Speaker 02 And like her story about her, um, times in Paris. Like all of when she does the old stories about everything that used to happen to her, I was like, wow, this is good content. Like this, I miss this.
1:33:38 Bill Simmons? Next category is couple I wanna break up. Because I'm jealous. Couple I want, couple I hope they break up, I guess. You're not literally hoping for a breakup, but.
1:33:48 Speaker 02 No.
1:33:49 Bill Simmons? But anyway.
1:33:49 Speaker 02 I'm just jealous. I wish I could be Olivia Jade. She's dating Jacob Elordi, but she never talks about it, which is really interesting to me. You're dating one of the hottest guys on earth and she.
1:34:01 Bill Simmons? And he's tall, which you love.
1:34:02 Speaker 02 Right, and Australian. And he's not in any of her content. She's still alive and like, I love her YouTube videos. I'm a big fan of Olivia Jade.
1:34:10 Bill Simmons? Interesting. Big comeback for Olivia.
1:34:12 Speaker 02 Yeah, she's also a good influencer where she just keeps it classy. She, she's not too crazy. She just, I really like her content a lot.
1:34:19 Bill Simmons? And a hell of a rower.
1:34:21 Speaker 02 Right.
1:34:23 Speaker 02 Okay, but I do like her a lot and I'm jealous of her.
1:34:27 Bill Simmons? Grossest internet moment of the year.
1:34:31 Bill Simmons? We had the, you had the Sydney Sweeney shit body shaming stuff from a couple of weeks ago.
1:34:36 Speaker 02 I don't want to say like grosses, like I was grossed out, like grosses, like wow, society is really horrific.
1:34:42 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:34:42 Speaker 02 Yeah, this was awful. Cause I saw TikTok videos alluding to it, but not the pictures, just being like, wow, what happened to Sydney Sweeney, like all this stuff. And I was expecting to see something horrible. And she just looks completely normal.
1:34:56 Bill Simmons? And she's filming a movie about a female boxer where she had to put muscle on.
1:34:59 Speaker 02 Yeah, and she's like actually putting some muscle on, like she looks similar to how like most females look. And I was just like, this is ridiculous that in this day and age with all of this cancellation stuff, people will still talk like that. I found that super.
1:35:14 Bill Simmons? What did you think of her post refuting all the, or? Did you see the post she did?
1:35:19 Speaker 02 I've always been a big fan of her. I think she's wonderful in White Lotus and I love Euphoria. Um, and her straying away from the character that she usually plays is an interesting thing to me. I'm excited to see the movie. I thought that her response definitely made me like her a lot more.
1:35:34 Bill Simmons? Yeah. Well, two people you didn't really like, feud of the year. Although I guess you're on the Blake Lively side. Blake Lively versus Justin Baldoni. So this was a big thing.
1:35:43 Speaker 02 This situation is gnarly.
1:35:45 Bill Simmons? This has been like a nine month story on the social media and now it blew up again.
1:35:49 Speaker 02 Well, there's been lots of back and forth because originally when the movie was being promoted, Blake Lively was kind of promoting the show up in your florals to the movie. And Justin Baldoni was taking more of the like domestic violence awareness.
1:36:03 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:36:04 Speaker 02 Side and people.
1:36:05 Bill Simmons? But they also weren't promoting it together.
1:36:07 Speaker 02 Right. And people were really criticizing Blake for not for being insensitive of the entire intention behind the movie. But turns out that there was some reasoning behind it. I think the situation is horrible and looking at the intimate details of it, it's really, really weird.
1:36:23 Bill Simmons? So I know all like the mainstream journalism media angles reporting on it. What is the Tik Tok Instagram version?
1:36:30 Speaker 02 Well, uh, people have been saying that he
1:36:36 Speaker 02 was being very strange during all of their sexual scenes.
1:36:41 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:36:41 Speaker 02 And even the girl that played the younger version of Blake Lively, he was making really crude comments about her sex scenes with the younger character that was supposed to play Atlas.
1:36:51 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:36:52 Speaker 02 Um, and on top of that, he like walked in on her in her trailer.
1:36:56 Bill Simmons? This is all alleged, we should mention.
1:36:58 Speaker 02 Multiple times. Yeah, alleged.
1:37:01 Speaker 02 But like a lot of really disgusting sentiments came out of this, just like really uncomfortable, seemingly like minor versions of sexual abuse, but it's really.
1:37:13 Bill Simmons? Well, the fact that she had that meeting and put all that stuff in there, like from now on, we will no longer, you will no longer add kissing scenes.
1:37:19 Speaker 02 And people were really trying to turn it on Blake Lively at the beginning, like Blake Lively is an asshole. And she's like mean to reporters and everyone was turning on her, but it seems like there was a lot more to the situation. It's really sad.
1:37:33 Bill Simmons? What's your generation's relationship with Blake Lively?
1:37:36 Speaker 02 Um, for a second there, people weren't liking her, but I think she's she's widely loved because of Gossip Girl and all of the movies that she's done. I mean, I like her.
1:37:44 Bill Simmons? That movie did really well. I think she's in good shape.
1:37:46 Speaker 02 Yeah, but I I don't I don't know. She's not within my area.
1:37:50 Bill Simmons? All right, we're gonna be delicate with this next one.
1:37:53 Speaker 02 Uh oh.
1:37:53 Bill Simmons? By the way, mom's take on Justin Baldoni was, um, I never liked his face.
1:37:57 Speaker 02 Yeah, I don't like his eye though.
1:37:59 Bill Simmons? That was it. You just never trusted his face.
1:38:01 Speaker 02 He played the role that he played a little too well.
1:38:03 Bill Simmons? Yeah. Two thousand twenty five career advice is the next category.
1:38:08 Speaker 02 Right.
1:38:09 Bill Simmons? And I I just have in the notes, dangerous Disney. You don't like when the Disney stars hit this phase when they get older and then they have to prove how dangerous they are.
1:38:19 Speaker 02 Well, it just seems like this is like a common thing that happens between Sabrina Carpenter and Olivia Rodrigo and like all of these really popular Disney influencers that are now trying to like desensitize themselves and like escape from the like Disney world.
1:38:35 Bill Simmons? By being super provocative.
1:38:36 Speaker 02 Right. And like in a lot of ways, it works and I support it, but then there's times where it's just like this feels like it's kind of over the top, like you're trying to prove something here. And sometimes it's like feeding into that Disney thing is is not always a bad thing. I just think that sometimes it's a little too trying to get out of the box.
1:38:57 Bill Simmons? Do you think Zendaya did that?
1:38:59 Speaker 02 No, I think she played her cards perfectly.
1:39:01 Bill Simmons? Yeah, I think she's the role model, right?
1:39:03 Speaker 02 Because she's super sexy. Like, I think she's beautiful, but she was a Disney star for a long time and she kind of like shifted over to being who she is now from who she was then, really seamlessly.
1:39:13 Bill Simmons? She's an awesome actress and got an iconic TV show.
1:39:17 Speaker 02 Right. But that's the way to do it. Like, that's the poster way to do that.
1:39:22 Bill Simmons? I don't know what the answer is, but I have written down makeup tip of the year as your big makeup person.
1:39:26 Speaker 02 I don't even know if we came up with this one.
1:39:27 Bill Simmons? You don't have one? All right, we'll move on to the next one. College food and drink weird budget MVPs. This is stuff when you're in college, you're racing around, especially like you, you're playing sports, you have only like thirty minutes to eat, twenty minutes to eat, ten minutes to grab something. Uh, I have a bunch of food here, so what do you want to start?
1:39:47 Speaker 02 I want to start off by saying Starbucks saved my life.
1:39:50 Bill Simmons? Okay.
1:39:51 Speaker 02 The dining hall usually closed before soccer practice would be over and there were countless times where the Starbucks next door to me would provide my meals. I think I ate strictly Starbucks for probably two months straight.
1:40:05 Bill Simmons? So you support the Starbucks.
1:40:07 Speaker 02 I support Starbucks.
1:40:08 Bill Simmons? So you have, I wrote down Starbucks egg bites?
1:40:12 Speaker 02 Yes, absolutely.
1:40:14 Bill Simmons? Spinach feta wrap?
1:40:15 Speaker 02 Yes, yes.
1:40:17 Bill Simmons? And matcha latte was a big one for you this year?
1:40:20 Speaker 02 I love a matcha latte. I was, I'm obviously a college student and I need as much energy as I can get.
1:40:26 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:40:26 Speaker 02 And coffee, sometimes I'm just not in the mood for it and matcha actually like gives me the caffeine boost that I need without the come down. Cause sometimes from coffee I'll like get tired a few hours after having it.
1:40:39 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:40:39 Speaker 02 Matcha like makes my entire body feel fantastic and it's a good, healthy energy boost because it's green tea.
1:40:47 Bill Simmons? In that Starbucks that's next to your dorm, there's probably what 10, 11 people that work there? How many of them knew who you were?
1:40:53 Speaker 02 Oh, we're friends. I have a friend every morning that I say hello to. It's wonderful.
1:40:58 Bill Simmons? Um, chomp sticks?
1:41:00 Speaker 02 Oh, yes. Chomp sticks. I'll put hummus on them.
1:41:03 Bill Simmons? Can you explain what chomp sticks are?
1:41:05 Speaker 02 Chomp sticks is, it's a meat stick. I'm, I guarantee you most people know.
1:41:09 Bill Simmons? Okay.
1:41:09 Speaker 02 It's like a long meat stick. Yeah, it's a jerky, but it's made out of turkey and it's delicious. Me and mom were on the ski mountain the other day and she was appalled because I was putting mustard on my chomp sticks. But chomp sticks, I don't regret it one bit. Chomp sticks are my MVP in 2024.
1:41:26 Bill Simmons? So that would have been, that's the answer to the question. Weirdest thing I did with my food in 2024, putting mustard in a public place on chomp sticks.
1:41:33 Speaker 02 Or like the pickles dipped in the cottage cheese with the hummus. I don't know.
1:41:37 Bill Simmons? Yeah, that was the last MVP was hummus, pickles and cottage cheese.
1:41:40 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:41:40 Bill Simmons? So you would just walk to this Trader Joe's in Boston, buy a bunch of weird food and then cram them into a small college refrigerator?
1:41:48 Speaker 02 Yep, into my little fridge and no one would touch that fridge in my suite. They all knew. They open it up and it's like this is a crime scene.
1:41:54 Bill Simmons? Yeah, there's like, is there any pizza in there?
1:41:56 Speaker 02 Yeah, that's why I'm like a good, um, good as a roommate because no one wants to eat my stuff.
1:42:00 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:42:00 Speaker 02 Like even if anyone was trying to eat my things, no one would want to.
1:42:04 Bill Simmons? Um, last category. Advice to my younger self as an athlete and future strong woman.
1:42:11 Speaker 02 Oh, future strong woman.
1:42:13 Bill Simmons? I don't know, I was projecting.
1:42:15 Speaker 02 You're projecting?
1:42:16 Bill Simmons? Things you learned now that you're nineteen and a half, things you wish you could have told yourself at age twelve, thirteen, fourteen.
1:42:23 Speaker 02 Sure. Um, well, I think on a relationships standpoint, because that was partially what I was thinking of when we wrote this down. Um, and this is advice that I give to my friends a lot of the times. In a relationship, you have just as much power as the other person and succumbing to like whatever they want at all times is super unhealthy.
1:42:48 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:42:48 Speaker 02 And I think that that's definitely something that I've learned over the years, just like not folding over. I've definitely become a lot more feisty since I've gotten to college. I think in middle school, as you know, a lot of people like walk all over me because I am a nice person.
1:43:05 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:43:05 Speaker 02 And I would like allow that to happen, but standing up for yourself is something obviously that you learn with age.
1:43:11 Bill Simmons? It's been nice to have you home when we taught you how to be bullied again, but me and mom just telling you what to do and yelling at you.
1:43:16 Speaker 02 Exactly.
1:43:16 Bill Simmons? It's good complaining about you.
1:43:18 Speaker 02 Right. Um, as a soccer forefront or just sports in general, I think you cannot continue on if you don't love it.
1:43:27 Bill Simmons? Hmm.
1:43:27 Speaker 02 That's something that I I have learned to be true. I've gone through injury last year where I thought I might have to quit. There's been lots of times in my life where it's like, I don't want to miss any more birthday parties or any more friend playdates. I feel like I'm losing friends, like I don't want to do this sport anymore. And pushing through that and knowing that you have the love to push through the sacrifices is the most important thing. You won't make it if you don't.
1:43:52 Bill Simmons? Yeah, you know, that's interesting because I think that's the number one thing I learned as a parent too. That if the kid doesn't love it, there's nothing you can do as a parent.
1:44:00 Speaker 02 You can't make someone love something. You'll burn them out.
1:44:02 Bill Simmons? Like you had two, you had two real injuries and each time you could have said, I don't want to play anymore. And it's not worth it. But each time you really wanted to keep playing and you fought to get back and healthy, which you did again.
1:44:15 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:44:15 Bill Simmons? Recently, but I've other people or they're.
1:44:17 Speaker 02 Well, I've seen it happen time and time again, where it's like people I've played with that are dying for it to be over.
1:44:23 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:44:23 Speaker 02 Because it's like they either feel like they were forced to do it, or like they were doing it for somebody else. And in part, I'll always play for you because I know how much you love to watch me play. But I mostly play because of how much I love it. And if I didn't love it, I would not be able to do it for as long as I have.
1:44:40 Bill Simmons? Yeah. And you're playing, I mean, you're in a more physical position too. So it's not like your body's pretty banged up by the end of the season. If you're playing big minutes.
1:44:48 Speaker 02 Right. But I think that also feeds into like the um, giving yourself the right nutrients and like being a healthy person in general.
1:44:58 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:44:58 Speaker 02 Because there's a lot of like, I don't know, on TikTok especially, it's like what I eat in a day as a fat person is literally like all over my for you page. Like there's a lot of people promoting really unhealthy eating or like what I eat in a day as a skinny person. Like these are literal headlines of videos that I've watched, like this lady Liv Schmidt, who was canceled all year because she was underweight and like kind of promoting an unhealthy eating style. It seems like she's like adapted a more healthy eating style. But with social media and with TikTok, there's a lot of promotion of the way that people eat. And it's, it's not anything like we've ever had before because social media was never so big.
1:45:39 Bill Simmons? Well, it's also making people think about food more than maybe they would.
1:45:43 Speaker 02 Right. It's like, it becomes people's entire universes. And I've definitely dealt with that. And as an athlete, it's important to give yourself the right nutrients. I think that's important too. That's what I've learned.
1:45:55 Bill Simmons? The more I like, the more time we have with social media, I do wonder if. It reemphasizes things that are potential problems anyway.
1:46:04 Speaker 02 Right.
1:46:04 Bill Simmons? Like food, or if you, if you think you have some sort of hang up or something wrong and then.
1:46:09 Speaker 02 Well, yeah, it's like people self diagnose themselves all the time.
1:46:12 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:46:12 Speaker 02 People change, like, and it's hard because when you feel like you're in a really tough place and you don't know what's wrong with you. And then you see somebody else that might be having similar symptoms to you.
1:46:23 Bill Simmons? Yeah.
1:46:24 Speaker 02 And you finally feel like you're being heard or like you found a solution. That's a really gratifying feeling, but in the end of the day, it's probably not what you have.
1:46:32 Bill Simmons? Right.
1:46:32 Speaker 02 And it's like people go down this rabbit hole and social media was not something that we were intended to have as human beings. And it's like, you have all of this insight on people's lives that you would never cross paths with otherwise. So it like creates a really weird universe for a lot of people like me where it's like, I'll be seeing all these food videos or all of these like, whatever sorts of videos that I, I normally wouldn't ever see or pay attention to. So it's just weird.
1:47:01 Bill Simmons? Well, one other thing you learned in 2024 is you could be a good nurse.
1:47:04 Speaker 02 A good nurse? Yeah, I could honestly.
1:47:07 Bill Simmons? Your boyfriend, your boyfriend hurt his leg and was in a cast for six weeks.
1:47:11 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:47:12 Bill Simmons? You had to take care of him.
1:47:13 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:47:14 Bill Simmons? But you did. You did a good job. It seems like you did a decent job.
1:47:18 Speaker 02 I tried my best, but that's, yeah, that's something I had to learn. Rolling someone around in a wheelchair is not as easy as it looks.
1:47:25 Bill Simmons? You finally got a, you finally got to be in a Grey's Anatomy episode.
1:47:28 Speaker 02 I know. I almost pushed him to the traffic a few times.
1:47:33 Bill Simmons? All right. Anything else before we go?
1:47:34 Speaker 02 I don't think so.
1:47:35 Bill Simmons? Happy New Year.
1:47:36 Speaker 02 Happy New Year.
1:47:36 Bill Simmons? Good to see you. That was it for teen culture. I guess we'll have to come up with another name if we do this again.
1:47:41 Speaker 02 Yeah, we'll, we'll fix it up.
1:47:42 Bill Simmons? You turned 20 in.
1:47:44 Speaker 02 Five months.
1:47:44 Bill Simmons? Beginning of May.
1:47:45 Speaker 02 Yep.
1:47:46 Bill Simmons? I don't know what we'll call it at that point.
1:47:47 Speaker 02 Yeah, we'll figure it out.
1:47:48 Bill Simmons? All right. Good to see you.
1:47:49 Speaker 02 Bye.
1:47:52 Bill Simmons? All right. That's it for the podcast. Thanks to Joe House. Thanks to my daughter, Zoe Simmons. Can't believe I was able to book her. Thanks to Sir Rudy and thanks to Kyle. Thanks to you guys for listening. Don't forget, Sunday, me and the Cuz are going to be going live on YouTube after all the Sunday games. And you can watch the Cuz and everybody else on the Ringo Sunday pregame show that morning. I will see you on Sunday night. Enjoy the weekend.
1:48:41 Bill Simmons? Must be 21 plus and present in select states. For Kansas, an affiliation with Kansas Star Casino. Or 18 plus and present in DC. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplineMA.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24/7 support in Massachusetts. Or call 1-8778-HOPE-NY or text HOPE-NY in New York. This episode is brought to you by Searchlight Pictures, Wild Horse 9. John Malkovich and Sam Rockwell. I like those guys. Star in the Sharp Witted Comedy Thriller
1:49:24 Bill Simmons? from Academy Award winner Martin McDonagh. Writer, director of The Banshees of Minneh Sharon and Three Billboards Outside Ebbing, Missouri. Set in the 1970s, filmed on location on Easter Island, Malkovich and Rockwell play CIA agents Chris and Lee, who are caught in a dangerous game of secrets and survival. Also starring Steve Buscemi, another one of my guys, Parker Posey and Tom Waits. Wild Horse 9 is being hailed by critics as a revitalizing shot of pure entertainment and easily one of the best films of the year. Don't miss Wild Horse 9. Only in theaters Friday. Get tickets now.
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Previous The NFL’s Holiday Overload, Darnold’s Crazy Year, Week 16 Murders, and Guess the Lines Next Believe in Darnold, Burrow’s Playoff Shadow, Week 18 Madness and Guess the Lines With Cousin Sal Page updated November 5, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated