EP.271 - JOSH JOHNSON

Adam talks with American stand up comedian and Daily Show correspondent Josh Johnson about not drinking alcohol, growing up in Louisiana, alligator gumbo, David Blaine, pranksters, responding to tragic and shocking current events in his stand up sets, and what tourists dislike most about the UK. And in the outro, Adam talks about his recent live shows with the band and a moment of Beatles communion in Liverpool. Conversation recorded face-to-face in London on 23 January, 2026 SUBMIT QUESTIONS FOR Q&A EPISODE: [email protected] mailto:[email protected] NORD VPN EXCLUSIVE NordVPN Deal ➼ https://nordvpn.com/buxton http://nordvpn.com/buxton Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee! Thanks to Diggory Waite and Claire Broughton at Hattrick and Séamus Murphy Mitchell for production support. Podcast illustration by Helen Green https://helengreenillustration.com/ THE ADAM BUXTON BAND MAY 2026 TOUR https://linktr.ee/theadambuxtonband ADAM BUXTON & MIRANDA SAWYER https://www.charleston.org.uk/event/saying-too-much/ @ CHARLESTON FESTIVAL 14 May 2026, 9pm BUG BOWIE SPECIAL @ THE LIGHTROOM https://lightroom.uk/whats-on/bowie-nights-adam-buxton-presents-bug-bowie-special/ 17 June, 2-4 July, 2026 ADAM BUXTON PODCAST LIVE WITH MAWAAN RIZWAAN https://www.roundhouse.org.uk/whats-on/adam-buxton-podcast-cf/ @ ROUNDHOUSE, 5 August, 2026 RELATED LINKS JOSH JOHNSON - DRAKE VS KENDRICK EXPLAINED TO WHITE PEOPLE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3uWj2MpydI - 2024 (YOUTUBE) JOSH JOHNSON LIVE @ SOHO THEATRE, WALTHAMSTOW https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKUvNkNlvCM - 2025 (YOUTUBE) JOSH JOHNSON - THE FAILURE, FEAR AND FRENZY AROUND LUIGI MANGIONE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZl_ZBzvifA - 2024 (YOUTUBE) JOSH JOHNSON - IT'S LITERALLY ICE VS. GOOD https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p68TXmnOy60 - 2026 (YOUTUBE) JOSH JOHNSON - CATFISHING THE KKK https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WULYEegtTGc - 2017 (YOUTUBE) JOSH JOHNSON PODCASTS https://www.joshjohnsoncomedy.com/podcasts (JOSH JOHSNON WEBSITE) DAVID BLAINE AND EAMONN HOLMES ON GMTV https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnoopdBnmEE - 2001 (YOUTUBE) ADAM & GAZ COOMBES - I BELIEVE IN FATHER CHRISTMAS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KuJxvbml0Y - 2014 (YOUTUBE) Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Adam Buxton?

  I added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin. Now you have plucked that podcast out and started listening. I took my microphone and found some human folk. Then I recorded all the noises while we spoke. My name is Adam Buxton, I'm a man. I want you to enjoy this, that's the plan.

• 0:31Adam Buxton?

  Hey, how are you doing, podcats? It's Adam Buxton here. I'm out in the fields of Norfolk with my best dog friend Rosie. Rosie is pausing to do some important busyness. How's things, Rosie? I'm doing important business. Yes, sorry to interrupt. She's very well. It's quite a cold, blustery day out here in the early part of May 2026. And it's actually really quite cold. I shouldn't have worn shorts. I don't know what I was thinking. Well, I was thinking that it was summertime after yesterday. Yesterday was beautiful.

• 1:14Adam Buxton?

  Anyway, now it's freezing. I'm wearing shorts and it was a mistake. Hey, thank you so much to everyone who came out to the first few Adam Buxton Band live shows. It's been a rock and roll dream come true, not just for me, I dare say, but for the audience as well, who I think have probably never seen that level of musicianship on a live stage before. We had wonderful support from Anna B Savage. Wow, she was fantastic. Really nice to see her performing and get to chat to her a little bit. Wonderful to meet some of you as well after the shows for in-depth micro discussions,

• 1:56Adam Buxton?

  signatures and creepy hugs at the merch table. Yes, I know we're missing a trick, not doing an unabsorbent tea towel. But I don't know, there's still time, maybe at the London shows. Still a few more tickets for Brighton on Tuesday and Margate on Wednesday this week. And then we're in Buxton, that'll be intense, Manchester and Leicester. And we're in London for a couple of nights towards the end of June. There's links in the description for those music shows. Really, you should come if you're around. It's been really fun. I might waffle a bit about some of the shows at the end of the podcast today. Also, don't forget those Bowie Bug shows at the Lightroom in King's Cross on the 17th and 30th of June

• 2:40Adam Buxton?

  and 2nd and 3rd of July. Those are nearly sold out, so do get in there. Now, ow, my legs are getting stung by net owls. One more live event shout out before we get into things this week. On the 5th of August this year, I'll be doing a live podcast. The only one that I'm planning on doing this year, that's going to be at Camden's iconic Roundhouse venue as part of this year's Roundhouse Comedy Festival, where I will be waffling on stage with Marwan Rizwan, the former YouTube sensation turned BAFTA-winning writer and star of TV sitcom Juice. He's a very talented and funny man. I'm looking forward to hanging out with him. I hope you can make it along. Link for tickets to the Roundhouse Comedy Festival in the description.

• 3:25Adam Buxton?

  Okay, let me tell you a bit about podcast number 271 right now, which features a rambling conversation with American stand-up comedian Josh Johnson. Josh, facts. Josh was born in 1990 and grew up in Alexandria, Louisiana, southeastern USA, where he was raised by parents who were both teachers. He earned a degree in lighting design for the theatre in 2012, and after graduating, he moved to Chicago with plans to pursue design work, but soon found himself drawn to the city's comedy scene, where he performed at open mic nights, honing his stand-up skills before eventually moving to New York City.

• 4:07Adam Buxton?

  There, in 2018, Josh was named New York's Funniest Stand-Up at the New York Comedy Festival.

• 4:14Adam Buxton?

  It was around this time that Josh landed writing jobs on The Tonight Show, starring Jimmy Fallon and The Daily Show, where he eventually became one of the on-screen correspondents in February 2024. In 2025, Josh was promoted to the weekly rotation of hosts on that show. Over the last half-decade, Josh has built a huge audience on YouTube, where he regularly releases full stand-up sets and short specials, rather than following the more traditional model of honing an hour of material for several months before releasing a special. In his unusually thoughtful, curious and conversational style, Josh mulls over subjects that have included AI and job insecurity,

• 4:56Adam Buxton?

  race in America, the KKK, and the rap battle between Drake and Kendrick Lamar. My conversation with Josh was recorded face-to-face in London towards the end of January this year, 2026. Just a couple of hours after Josh had landed in London to do a few shows at the Soho Theatre. We talked about why Josh has never drunk alcohol, about life in Louisiana, alligator gumbo, how at one time it looked as though he might become a magician rather than a comedian, and we spoke about David Blaine, pranksters and other people who are determined to mess with your mind. When we spoke, Josh had recently uploaded a set to YouTube

• 5:37Adam Buxton?

  in which he responded to the killing of Rene Good by an ICE agent in Minneapolis in January, and we talked about how he is able to find any comedy around such shocking events. It was the day after I spoke with Josh that another Minneapolis resident, Alex Preddy, was also killed at the hands of ICE agents. We also talked about another of Josh's sets, in which he discussed another murder, this time of United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson, who was walking to an investor conference in Midtown Manhattan on December the 4th, 2024, when he was shot from behind by Luigi Mangione.

• 6:21Adam Buxton?

  And I asked Josh about one instance of criticism he received in the form of a heckle from an audience member who felt that Josh was defending the murderer. Unfortunately, in my conversation with Josh, we mistakenly referred to the murdered CEO Brian Thompson as Brian Johnson, like the ACDC lead singer.

• 6:44Adam Buxton?

  Total ignorance on my part. In Josh's defence, he had just got off a transatlantic flight. I didn't realise the mistake until after Josh had left, so it wasn't possible to record a correction. Apologies for that. I'll be back at the end to tell you a little bit about my plan to start doing regular Q and A episodes of this podcast, and I'll be telling you how you can take part in those. But right now with Josh Johnson, here we go.

• 7:52Adam Buxton?

  Now, you've just got off a plane, is that right?

• 7:54Speaker 01

  I did, I did.

• 7:56Adam Buxton?

  And are you a disciplined person when you're travelling? Are you up there having champagne and shots, or are you thinking, no, no caffeine, no alcohol, I've got to maintain my physical stability?

• 8:10Speaker 01

  I mean, I wouldn't call it discipline. I would say it's more having a weak constitution.

• 8:15Adam Buxton?

  Okay.

• 8:16Speaker 01

  You know what I mean? I don't drink coffee because I'm awake, but at what cost? Like, like, like what? I feel terrible, I'm jittery, uh, my stomach hurts, like, it feels like if you could take a magic pill that would wake you up and also make you miserable. And I just don't agree with it.

• 8:34Adam Buxton?

  So you have tried it, though?

• 8:36Speaker 01

  Oh, I've had coffee.

• 8:37Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 8:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I've never had a drink, though.

• 8:39Adam Buxton?

  Have you never had a drink?

• 8:41Speaker 01

  No.

• 8:41Adam Buxton?

  How come?

• 8:43Speaker 01

  Lots of different reasons, I suppose, but I guess I'll put it this way. If I were to start drinking now, you'd have to find your limit, right? And finding your limit is usually something you do in your twenties. No one wants to help you while you find your limit in your thirties. No one has patience for it, no one has time for it. Like, when you're young and you, especially that those first few years, you can even legally drink. And you maybe have a bit too much, or your friend has to help you home or whatever. It's like, alright, we're all about the same age and we're finding our limit. If someone needs to do that for you in your thirties, you quickly seem like you have a drinking problem. Like, almost immediately. Let's, let's say it's your third time drinking ever.

• 9:26Speaker 01

  And even if they know that, even if everyone around you knows, they, this person's only drank three times. But you are so drunk, you need to be carried somewhere. People are like, you probably shouldn't drink.

• 9:37Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, I suppose it's like any kind of attempts at learning things that seem quirky and endearing in a young person.

• 9:46Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 9:47Adam Buxton?

  Seem much less attractive in an older person.

• 9:49Speaker 01

  I mean, I'm finding that now, I've just started playing chess.

• 9:52Adam Buxton?

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  And I'm very bad. And it's so aggravating to be bad when you're not a kid. When you're like, when you're, when you're a kid, you're bad at everything.

• 10:01Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 10:02Speaker 01

  So it's kind of par for the course that you're gonna be bad at a new hobby or a new game or something. But you get generally good at the things that you do.

• 10:13Adam Buxton?

  Especially by the time you're, hopefully, in your twenties and everything.

• 10:16Speaker 01

  Mm hmm. So when you start something completely new that takes you back all the way back to like, when you were bad at something at a child's level, it is so jarring. Cause you're like, no, but I remember logic. I have a brain, I swear I can read. And then you get, you know, checked in, in like three moves and you're like, maybe I am not as smart as I thought, not just at chess, but in life.

• 10:42Adam Buxton?

  Did you, for example, grow up in an environment where no one was drinking, where everyone was quite together?

• 10:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I didn't really grow up around drinking in that way.

• 10:53Adam Buxton?

  I mean, I'm sorry to fixate on drinking, but it's always been a big part of my life. And it's a big part of UK life, not that it's not in the States, but I think the attitudes to alcohol are slightly different in the States than they are to in the UK.

• 11:08Speaker 01

  I mean, if if anything, it seems like, and I could be completely off base here, but it seems like in the UK, drinking has a much closer attachment to third places. Like, you're not necessarily always drinking at home, and you definitely don't necessarily drink at work. But to build the camaraderie with either your workmates or friends or anything, you know, you go to the pub. You go to these places where a drink is communal. And so I think that.

• 11:35Adam Buxton?

  Anyway, it doesn't have to be the pub, could be the graveyard, could be a wood, could be just a wide open space, a car park.

• 11:44Speaker 01

  I feel like if you have a drink in the graveyard, I'm never gonna think you're celebrating. Do you have any, any of those other places you could be like, no, you're just having a drink and having a good time. Graveyard's the one place where I'm like, uh, they're sad.

• 11:58Adam Buxton?

  You've run out of options.

• 11:59Speaker 01

  They are very sad.

• 12:00Adam Buxton?

  Or you're just celebrating a kind of defiance of existence and just maybe it's a form of embracing mortality in a very literal sense.

• 12:10Speaker 01

  Sure, because I will even say this, that I found that when it came to drinking, there were there were different points in my life where, one, there was a long period where I was too broke to like a new thing, you know? Like that right there is like, there's the buried entry right there. Then, you know, you you can't drink until you're 21 in the States. And I was like a fairly good kid, so I would always worry a little bit about getting into trouble, even if everyone around me was doing it. I was like, yeah, I don't, I don't know, I don't know. And then past that, you know, now you're over 21 and maybe you're not broke like you were before. Then I would hear from my friends who were like, don't.

• 12:52Speaker 01

  Don't like, don't drink, cause then, you know, you'll have a headache or you'll, whatever the thing is. And I think that I've done my best decision wise to like fill my life with things that bring a lot to it. And try to like sidestep things that I at least personally feel like I could overindulge in or get a problem with. I don't think I would immediately have some sort of drinking problem, but I do try to avoid problems.

• 13:22Adam Buxton?

  Well, that's very wise.

• 13:23Speaker 01

  I do my best.

• 13:24Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 13:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:25Adam Buxton?

  But what are the reasons that people are attracted to alcohol? I mean, I would say one of them is that it frees them from some of their inhibitions, makes them relax, makes them feel that they can communicate more easily perhaps.

• 13:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:41Adam Buxton?

  And were those feelings never ones that you particularly struggled with? I mean, did you feel quite relaxed in yourself anyway, so that you didn't maybe need to go out and have a drink?

• 13:52Speaker 01

  Maybe so. I mean, I think, I think I accepted a long time ago how like weird I was and am. I think it would be me sort of trying to sidestep them meeting me for a little longer.

• 14:07Adam Buxton?

  How do you think you're weird in what ways?

• 14:09Speaker 01

  I just, I think that the way that I see things, I used to see as a bit of a problem. And now I think of it as like a, if I'm being honest, like a, like a superpower. Like, like to me, I think that everything is, is connected and related. And so I make these sort of relations that have no like basis in touching each other. But I do it all the time. And I also think that in a way this may be annoying to people. I do think that everyone is, the same way we're made of the same stuff. I think that everyone is a bit the same in that if I had your life and your parents with your chemical makeup, I would just be you. I think, I think I would just be you. So even when I meet someone who's terrible,

• 14:53Speaker 01

  I'm not saying that I forgive them being terrible and don't care. I'm just saying like, there is a part of me that's like, what happened here? Cause depending on what happened here, depends on if I can understand why you are this way. And if I can understand why you are this way, once again, doesn't mean I'm gonna like you, doesn't mean I'm gonna condone what you do. It doesn't even mean that I'm gonna be even more empathetic. But I think that it will mean that I have a bit more. Maybe patience with the circumstance. And those two things may not seem bad or weird or like they would be annoying. But I think that they creep up in a little bit of every conversation and in times where it's like, I guess, quote unquote, not the time for it. You know what I mean?

• 15:35Speaker 01

  And so I found that in a lot of conversations, especially young, before I was able to articulate exactly the things I'm saying now, I would just do that. And I would be the off putting one, if that makes sense.

• 15:50Adam Buxton?

  Why would people get frustrated with that?

• 15:52Speaker 01

  Um, I don't know. I mean, I think that-

• 15:55Adam Buxton?

  I think that's such an admirable quality.

• 15:57Speaker 01

  I think, I think it can be. But I think it's the same aspect of a personality that you see in obnoxious people. If you think about it, like you meet an obnoxious person, sometimes none of what they're saying is wrong. They're just saying it at the worst possible time, or they're saying it in a way that rubs people the wrong way. And I don't think I was necessarily obnoxious, but I definitely think I hadn't honed when to do this. Like, okay, a good example. I didn't drink in college, but as soon as I was old enough, I would go to bars with my friends. And so I would be with them, they'd order a drink or something. And then I would be like, man, the markup on this is crazy. You guys realize if you just bought a bottle and drank it somewhere else, you'd get way more for your buck.

• 16:41Speaker 01

  And now everyone's standing there, holding their expensive drink, just like, oh yeah, you have pointed out that we're gonna be broke tomorrow. And I think that that stuff is like, not, it's not endearing in the moment.

• 16:53Adam Buxton?

  Okay, yeah, with you being Mr. Logic.

• 16:56Speaker 01

  I guess, I guess, yeah, that's a nice way to put it. I would say a downer, but yeah.

• 17:23Adam Buxton?

  I Googled facts you'll be happy to hear about Alexandria, Louisiana.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Oof.

• 17:28Adam Buxton?

  Just wanna check some of these with you.

• 17:29Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 17:30Adam Buxton?

  Fact check. Oh, well, this is something you said, though. New Orleans to Louisiana is like you had the most beautiful blue eye, but your whole face was fucked up.

• 17:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:40Adam Buxton?

  What do you mean by that?

• 17:41Speaker 01

  I think that like, there is a mystique, and obviously, there's a lot of history around New Orleans. And there's a lot of history all throughout Louisiana. But I think that when you look at the systems in place in Louisiana, and you look at education, you look at the rates at which people are getting sick, the rates at which people can afford healthcare, all the things around being there are not necessarily great conditions. And especially when you put them up against national averages. And that could even be said for some parts of New Orleans as well. But the only thing about Louisiana that's being held up is New Orleans. That's, that's the place where worldwide, whether you're in South Africa, you're in the UK,

• 18:25Speaker 01

  or you're in Nashville, everyone wants to visit New Orleans at least once. And they wanna hear the music, they wanna eat the food, they want that authentic experience, they wanna see the street performers. So all of that stuff is like this rare gem. And so I look at New Orleans as one of these last few places in the States that lives up to, at least in my experience, I know I'm biased because I've been there so many times, but it at least lives up to the sort of legend that is told about it. There's like a festival every weekend, whether it's jazz, blues, whether it's art. Maybe, I'm sure if you talk to someone who grew up there and has lived there their entire life, they'll tell you all the ways that it's not the same.

• 19:07Adam Buxton?

  Sure, yeah, yeah.

• 19:08Speaker 01

  But I mean, when I tell you, man, when I went the last time, had some of the best food I had had, really, since the last time I went.

• 19:15Adam Buxton?

  What did you have?

• 19:16Speaker 01

  I had like crawfish etouffee. I had like alligator gumbo and everything. Like it was just things that like you could try to find the things that are like that Creole, southern, that jambalaya. You can try to find those things in other places. And every once in a while, there will be places that are just incredible, that make it exactly right. Not only is it rare, along the way, you will poison yourself so many times trying to like capture that experience again.

• 19:48Adam Buxton?

  What's in alligator gumbo?

• 19:50Speaker 01

  So it'll be alligator meat and then the the basic like roux, like the the sort of stew of the gumbo, mixed in with some rice, maybe some andouille sausage and some filet, like sea, like like the type of gumbo seasoning that they use and everything. I didn't grow up with gumbo with gator in it. And so when I had it, it was an experience that was like very singular. Like I had not been able to taste anything like this before, and I haven't had anything like it since. But I did have a gumbo that supposedly had gator in it in New York. And I don't think that's what that meat was.

• 20:31Adam Buxton?

  Is it white meat? Is it like fish?

• 20:34Speaker 01

  It's kind of, yeah, it's like a white meat. Yeah. Everyone says it has like the consistency, like the the chew of chicken.

• 20:41Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 20:41Speaker 01

  And everything. But yeah, it was it was incredible.

• 20:44Adam Buxton?

  So alligators are not protected in that part of the world, are they? Or?

• 20:50Speaker 01

  I mean, I I think we're the ones that need protection.

• 20:54Adam Buxton?

  They're just so common that you can just stick them in a gumbo.

• 20:56Speaker 01

  As best as I know, you are only not allowed to like hunt or kill baby alligators. But as far as like, an alligator who's just like poking out of the water eyes up, I think that's fair game.

• 21:11Adam Buxton?

  Gumbo time.

• 21:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. I could be wrong, though. Maybe I had some illegal gumbo.

• 21:17Adam Buxton?

  Alexandria, your hometown, sits on the Red River, right near the geographic center of Louisiana. It was once gonna be considered the capital of the whole state, right?

• 21:30Speaker 01

  Yes, it would make a lot of sense if it was because there's the Red River Bridge in Pineville. There's an airport, you know, there's a lot of opportunity there and it just, yeah, they went with Baton Rouge, I guess.

• 21:44Adam Buxton?

  What was it like growing up there? I mean, what kind of town is it?

• 21:48Speaker 01

  It doesn't feel like a city to me. It feels very much like a town, you know? And I think that when I was traveling, especially when I first started doing stand-up and was able to go other places, I saw how much of the US that is. How you have your neighborhoods by class and sometimes how you have your segregated neighborhoods. But then also how even the places that supposedly have money all sort of have the same stores around them. And most of the personality, most of the interesting things to go see aren't actually in those neighborhoods.

• 22:29Speaker 01

  And so, growing up in Alexandria, I was around a lot of that, whatever, like name brand stuff. We went to the mall. It was very, it was very regular, except for there were certain neighborhoods around my neighborhood growing up that, depending on where we were living at the time, were more dangerous or there would be more things happening that were...

• 22:52Adam Buxton?

  More edgy?

• 22:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, you know, there were shootings not far from my house, really by house. Like, there was really only one or two places that I lived growing up where I would say, oh, this is like fine. This is like a middle-class place to live. And then the others, even if we weren't in dire straits, even if we weren't in the worst conditions, you would hear things going on at night and everything. You would hear things like, I remember there was, I was really little.

• 23:27Speaker 01

  And near my grandma's place, they would have, I think there were like two different nights I could hear it. And it was really upsetting. They they would have these like dog fights, like bedding with the dogs and everything. And it was something that had to be explained to me. And I just remember being really like, um, I didn't cry or anything, but just. There are some things that are your first hint that things are not all right.

• 23:58Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 23:58Speaker 01

  You know?

• 23:59Adam Buxton?

  Arts and culture. Rather than flashy nightlife, Alexandria has a quiet art scene. Murals, community theater, and small galleries. Does that ring a bell?

• 24:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, it feels very generous. It feels, based on where I grew up, murals is a, is a very nice way to put it.

• 24:21Adam Buxton?

  Graffiti.

• 24:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. But but there are, I mean, there are murals in the in the city and everything, but yeah, I don't know.

• 24:29Adam Buxton?

  Were you not out there creating street art?

• 24:32Speaker 01

  No, no, I I feel like for me, I always looked at whether it was tags or it was murals as people who were good at drawing.

• 24:41Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 24:42Speaker 01

  And I was not. So I was like, I'll leave it to the expert.

• 24:45Adam Buxton?

  So what were you doing? What was your main focus of your leisure time?

• 24:50Speaker 01

  Oh, good question. I mean, I would read a lot and I was into magic for a little bit.

• 24:55Adam Buxton?

  Were you?

• 24:56Speaker 01

  Doing like magic tricks and everything.

• 24:57Adam Buxton?

  How'd you get into that?

• 24:59Speaker 01

  I think I got really into it when I was like eight, as far as watching it.

• 25:03Adam Buxton?

  Hmm.

• 25:04Speaker 01

  I really wanted to practice it when I was around fourteen. So then that was like when I probably would have got the best I've been. And had learned the most tricks and had memorized the most things and was able to switch decks and stuff like that. And then, um, yeah, twenty two, I was like, I know I want to do like some sort of show. Maybe I could incorporate a few of these things.

• 25:26Adam Buxton?

  Hmm. Did you like, um, David Blaine and people like that?

• 25:30Speaker 01

  I did. I I liked what I liked.

• 25:32Adam Buxton?

  Because Blaine loves the people freaking out. I mean.

• 25:35Speaker 01

  Yes, yes. And that was my thing with it where the same way sometimes you see a comedian do a joke. And you're like, that's an incredible joke. That's very funny. That joke would not come off the same way from me.

• 25:48Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 25:49Speaker 01

  And that's how I felt about David Blaine's magic. I was like, I'm glad he's doing it and I'm I'm glad that he is willing to like. Be the person that people are like freaked out by or whatever.

• 26:00Adam Buxton?

  Be the creepy, dead eyed guy that people.

• 26:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:03Adam Buxton?

  People love.

• 26:04Speaker 01

  But as far as me, I'm just like, no, I don't think I'd be able to.

• 26:08Adam Buxton?

  Yes.

• 26:09Speaker 01

  Pull that off, or would I want to, you know?

• 26:12Adam Buxton?

  No, that's a real commitment he's made to being a very certain type of person. Are you familiar with a clip where he appeared on British TV? And he has an eye drawn on the palm of his hand. And he's doing this interview with quite a cheesy presenter on British breakfast television. And they're trying to just have a chat for breakfast TV with David Blaine, and he's not having it. He's doing the whole thing as if he's been heavily medicated. And he's all like eyes at half mast, you know, and. The guy says, what have you got drawn on your hand there? And he sort of holds his hand up and he's kind of doing a weird stare at the camera and.

• 26:54Adam Buxton?

  Not really giving the guy any answers, just kind of smiling in this strange, gnomic fashion. And and the presenter's getting more and more wound up and bemused, like. Half amused, half just annoyed.

• 27:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:09Adam Buxton?

  It was around the time when you hadn't really seen anyone doing that kind of thing before. You know what I mean? Like trolling people in that way.

• 27:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean.

• 27:20Speaker 01

  I I definitely think that you've kind of like hit the nail on the head like. There are certain personalities that I think get big because in the moment they're filling a void. Like we're we're still talking before influencers and before the sort of like cynical. Understanding of how you could become famous. And I think that he kind of filled this thing where. He was off putting to the people you weren't supposed to be off putting to.

• 27:47Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 27:48Speaker 01

  But he was doing it like early internet and he was doing street magic around the same time that kids were becoming infatuated with the idea of like pranking strangers on the street.

• 28:01Adam Buxton?

  Yes, it was around Jackass.

• 28:03Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 28:04Adam Buxton?

  Time.

• 28:05Speaker 01

  But for a camera. Like kids have always pranked people on the street. That's like, that's just being a kid. I'm, I mean, like, we have a purpose and we're gonna show people this later and we are gonna make this like basement of tapes.

• 28:19Adam Buxton?

  Well, that's like Tom Green, I suppose. Do you know Tom Green?

• 28:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 28:24Adam Buxton?

  And he was sort of doing that stuff, you know, home video enthusiasts.

• 28:28Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 28:29Adam Buxton?

  That's kind of the world that I came from, like we used, me and my comedy partner used to do a homemade TV show in the UK that was genuinely made by us with video cameras and stuff, but we always shied away from those pranks. We did a few, but we were never really comfortable with it, you know?

• 28:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Well, you just have to, you have to be really open with the idea of making and leaving a bad impression.

• 28:57Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 28:58Speaker 01

  You know, in a way that polite society used to frown on. Like, we used to really not go for someone was just rude for attention.

• 29:09Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, I mean, personally speaking, I still frown on that.

• 29:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I'm just, I'm blown away that there's no limit.

• 29:16Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 29:17Speaker 01

  Like, it's got to the point now where, you know, Jackass and some of that stuff is one thing, because you can even in the moment kind of see the bit. Like, in the moment, if Johnny Knoxville goes to a yoga studio and he's got a fart noise maker in the back of his belt loop. And he's doing yoga with everybody and they're playing the fart noises at random times and even Johnny doesn't know what's gonna happen. It's like, someone even in the yoga studio could be thinking, oh, this is like a funny thing. Like, this is what I'm trying not to do every time I do yoga, I'm trying not to fart, right? I think it's a very different thing for a kid to be like, I'm gonna go to this yoga studio and throw anthrax on everybody. And it's like, well, that's now you're just

• 30:02Speaker 01

  doing terrorism. Like now, this isn't even a prank anymore.

• 30:06Adam Buxton?

  Yeah. There's a guy I know, Gus Khan, who is a fan of this YouTube guy, I think there's lots of them, who do just weird things. I think he's an American guy, and he goes up behind people in supermarkets and just makes a weird noise right in their ear.

• 30:26Adam Buxton?

  Kind of a slightly sexual noise. And people generally fucking hate it, you know?

• 30:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I can imagine.

• 30:36Adam Buxton?

  Either they're very angry because they think that maybe their sexuality is being impugned somehow if it's a guy, you know? Or sometimes if it's a gay guy, they think that they are being teased. I mean, there's just so many bad reactions that you can have to that.

• 30:54Speaker 01

  Sure, sure.

• 30:55Adam Buxton?

  To that kind of thing. Someone invading your space.

• 30:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:58Adam Buxton?

  Making a weird noise. Like, some people, like my friend Gus, he finds it hilarious. But it makes me so uncomfortable to watch it. And the comments underneath, I think it's generally divided into, like, the younger you are, the funnier you find it, right?

• 31:14Speaker 01

  Sure, sure. I think it's also based on like, how real people are to you. Like, I'm not even saying that none of these things can be funny. I'm saying that when you watch it, do you feel like you're watching it happen to a person? Or do you feel like you're watching it happen to another character? And I think that really colors your experience of how you watch some of this stuff, you know?

• 31:37Adam Buxton?

  Yeah. It just seems strange to me that you'd be watching that on a platform that is all about real life, really. I mean... Maybe that's bullshit, but that was my relationship with YouTube when it first started was like, this is where real people, ordinary people outside of the media are able to express themselves and post things. So it is sort of by definition, like these are real people.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:03Adam Buxton?

  Um, so it always seems weird and you know, some of these people in the, in the video that I'm thinking of, Saleem the Dream is the guy, you, you know, they get violent with him and they just, they come after him and he runs off. And there's a certain, he includes those ones as well where he looks terrified. He looks kind of terrified. He was, he's pretty good at staying very blank and not really giving a good reaction, which is half of the thing that freaks the people out because they go like, what's the deal with this guy? Is he on drugs? Is he mentally unwell? What's, what's happening here?

• 32:35Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 32:36Adam Buxton?

  But he includes the bits where he really gets his ass kicked as well. And he's just running away from these people anyway.

• 33:08Adam Buxton?

  When did you then get into the rhythm that you're now in currently of putting out material? Weekly, even more often than weekly sometimes?

• 33:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, sometimes. So in the, what, 2023, I think it was. My buddy Brian was like, why don't you like really start putting this stuff out? Like whenever I see you, your set is different and I know you're not doing anything with it. You're just doing different stuff because you get bored with what you were doing or you feel like it's finished. And so you move on to something else. And I was like, oh yeah, yeah. I mean, he's not wrong. Like ever since I was doing open mics in Chicago, I would really have like a different thing. And when I was a little kid and I was writing,

• 33:57Speaker 01

  because backing up even a little bit further, before I even had an interest in magic, I always really loved comedy.

• 34:04Adam Buxton?

  Ah, really?

• 34:04Speaker 01

  And so, yeah, so I would watch comedy specials on TV.

• 34:07Adam Buxton?

  Who are your favorites?

• 34:09Speaker 01

  A lot of the Comedy Central comics were like my first exposure. And then there were some of the Def Jam comics as well, and the Comic View comics and stuff. So, you know, I was watching like Christopher Titus, Bill Burr, Wanda Sykes, Martin Lawrence, a little bit of Eddie Murphy, Eddie Griffin. You know, I was just watching these people and I was just like, this is the coolest thing. But I still didn't realize it could be a job. I don't know why I categorized it the way in my head that I did, but in my mind, I was almost like, oh, because I had seen D.L. Hughley have a special, then have a show, and then have a special. I almost kind of thought you had to be like a crossover actor slash comedian for them to let you get up there and do an hour of comedy.

• 34:53Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, or a kind of nuclear fireball like Eddie Murphy with such a massive personality.

• 34:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:00Adam Buxton?

  I'm not saying you don't have a massive personality.

• 35:02Speaker 01

  No, no, but I hear you. I hear you.

• 35:03Adam Buxton?

  But your, your tone and your delivery is so distinct from so much else, and I'm struggling to think of comparable comics from back then. Like, was there anyone occupying the same sort of space that you occupy now?

• 35:19Speaker 01

  I mean, hopefully not, not that I can think of. It'd be nice to be unique by discovery. That'd be, that'd be cool.

• 35:27Adam Buxton?

  I suppose the reason that perhaps most people wouldn't upload stuff they were doing on stage is that most comedians workshop things, and they don't want them to be out there prematurely. To the point where they ask people not to use their phones in their sets because they want to keep a lid on what they're honing for as long as possible until they feel it's ready to be seen by a wider audience. But you're working almost the opposite way.

• 35:57Speaker 01

  There's nothing wrong with that model of doing comedy. I think that that way of doing comedy brings people a fantastic show. Like a really special show. And I'm not saying that I won't revert to that one day of of being like, oh, actually, you know, I'm really enjoying doing this hour. I think I'm just gonna do this hour until I don't feel like doing this hour anymore.

• 36:17Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 36:18Speaker 01

  But I also find that there's something in a different way, special about making something that is just for the people you're performing for right now and no one else, and then it's over. And I'm lucky that through uploading, it gets to live longer and gets to have other people enjoy it who weren't at the show. But at the core of it, I'm just trying to like, share something specific and special with people.

• 36:43Adam Buxton?

  Do you have then bits that you can fall back on? Like, at the moment, you're on tour, right?

• 36:49Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 36:50Adam Buxton?

  You've just done five sold out nights at the Beacon Theater in New York. That's 3,000 seater. That is massive. So were each one of those five shows different? Or were there, is it modular? Are there bits that you can move around and fall back on and?

• 37:07Speaker 01

  Well, I guess you could call it modular in that there were definitely some jokes and stories

• 37:12Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 37:13Speaker 01

  that were only done at one show. But then there were things that crossed over into other shows and in a different order. I've had people come to two shows same night and be surprised that they were even slightly different. But I've also had people come to three different weekends and see that the weekend is different. At the end of the day, I'm still enjoying doing the jokes that I like the most. Sometimes there's a joke that whether you feel like it's developed or not, you just have so much fun doing it that you're like, yeah, I just wanna do this tonight.

• 37:48Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 37:49Speaker 01

  And so, yeah, sometimes I don't put those things out because I'm having too much fun doing them. And then when the time is right, when it goes with the set, I go ahead and let it go. And I think that that sort of process keeps me open minded about creation. And it builds a a rhythm and a cycle for progress. And it and it allows me. My hope is that it allows me to get better faster.

• 38:14Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 38:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:16Adam Buxton?

  But then, do you allow yourself to use a bit that you particularly like more than once or a few times? Or do you consciously think, well, I've done that and that's on YouTube, so I'm not going to do that anymore?

• 38:26Speaker 01

  I don't really do things that I've put on YouTube again. If my feeling ever changes around that, luckily, I've, you know, put out enough things that it's not like, they'll be like, oh, he's doing this one again.

• 38:38Adam Buxton?

  Hmm.

• 38:39Speaker 01

  But I find that repeating the stuff that I put on YouTube doesn't serve the new thing that I'm trying to do. So sometimes the new thing that I'm trying to do is so much about another topic or a different mindset that I'm in, that it would almost be shoehorning it in to repeat something from YouTube.

• 39:02Adam Buxton?

  I mean, in the last few days, you put out a bit post the killing of Renee Good in Minneapolis. How do you even begin to approach talking about something like that in a comedic context, just days after it's happened?

• 39:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I think that the way you go about it, or at least what I did, was you see what happened and then you are very honest and, and present with how you feel about it.

• 39:30Adam Buxton?

  Hmm.

• 39:30Speaker 01

  And then I tried to be honest about what, every aspect of what it looked like to me. And I went over it and over it and over it several times before I ever did the show, trying to decide how much to talk about the shooting specifically versus, do I take into account that people will have seen it by the time I'm doing the show and so I don't need to go into some detail? I can just speak about how we feel about it. And then I think that, once again, everything being, you know, related, everything being connected, what is it with Renee Good and with ICE in Minnesota and with the sort of fear, the imbalance of

• 40:14Speaker 01

  how people are approached by law enforcement and what people do with their power?

• 40:22Speaker 01

  And I think that all those things, even if you don't live in Minnesota, even if you never go, even if you never coming across a border patrol agent or an ICE agent in any country that you live, everyone has an association with someone abusing power. Everyone has an association with narrative building. Everyone has an association with being an innocent bystander of a horrific tragic event, right? So in all of that universal emotion, you now have everything you need to create something that people can relate to. And so you do everything that you can to make the set that you are doing funny, because funny is supposed to come first. And I think that sometimes

• 41:06Speaker 01

  when people see someone did a joke about this thing, I think most people who don't do comedy think to do any joke about any subject means you're making fun of. And that's not always what it is. You know, sometimes the only way to talk about depression, to talk about drug abuse, to talk about suicide, to talk about being in a dark place, is to do jokes that relate you to the thing, but are not making fun of someone who's suffering.

• 41:33Adam Buxton?

  And have you had times where you've stepped into hot water and you've had to go through a sustained period of people coming at you for something you've said, either on TV or in your live shows?

• 41:47Speaker 01

  Not necessarily.

• 41:49Adam Buxton?

  I mean, I guess I'd be surprised if you had because of the way you talk, because of exactly what you just described, which is not really giving a speech that is supposed to be communicating how you think people should feel. Instead, you are just trying to shift the way they think one step sideways. You know, it's a very kind of humane way of tackling those subjects.

• 42:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, even if it, even if they don't change their mind, even if they just understand how other people think.

• 42:21Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 42:22Speaker 01

  That's actually, I think that does more for empathy than anything. Even if you could bully people for a time to have the right opinion, quote unquote. You're never gonna know who's genuine and who's pretending. You're just gonna know what's the thing to say.

• 42:36Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 42:36Speaker 01

  And so I think that trying to change people's minds or trying to like shame or bully people into thinking the way that I think would be one, a misstep, because I don't think that you're ever gonna get genuine change that way. And then two, what if I'm wrong? Like, what, like, I'm, I'm not infallible, so what if I'm wrong about something? And then I try to bring a bunch of people with me. I'm not trying to convince you of, of anything. I'm trying to show you how other people see things. You know?

• 43:07Adam Buxton?

  You did that very effectively with your bit about the guy that shot the CEO, the, the

• 43:15Speaker 01

  Oh, Luigi?

• 43:16Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, the healthcare.

• 43:19Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 43:19Adam Buxton?

  Guy, um, what's the name of the company?

• 43:23Speaker 01

  Um, United Health?

• 43:25Adam Buxton?

  United Health, right. They provide medical insurance in the US and you did.

• 43:29Speaker 01

  Well, they don't, so.

• 43:30Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 43:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. So funny enough, actually, when I was at the Beacon, I got heckled because I was actually doing a joke about Luigi. And then this guy started heckling me. And he was like, he's a murderer.

• 43:46Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 43:46Speaker 01

  He's a murderer. And I let the first one go. And then finally he yelled again, he's a murderer. And I was like, what? And the guy screamed again, he's a murderer, you asshole. And I'm like, well, who did he murder? And then he's like, uh, you know, he was a father, meaning Brian Johnson, right? And I was like, oh, okay. Well, you know, United Health was using this like faulty AI that they knew wasn't operating correctly, but they still left it doing what it was doing so they could deny more claims. And it's the practice of insurance companies to do their best to deny you your claim, because that means they get the money for free. You know what I mean? Like, this thing shouldn't even be legal, the way that they operate. And so.

• 44:30Speaker 01

  You know, Brian Johnson, through his practices, definitely killed people. Maybe we don't want to look at it that way because when something is not present, and that's what I said to the guy. I was like, who did he kill? He was a father, you asshole. I'm like, okay, all right, I'm an asshole. But you saw Luigi shoot him. And I never really tried to engage with hecklers in that way or anything, but this felt like different. And I was like, you saw Luigi shoot him, but you didn't see when Brian Johnson was denying claims for cancer patients, for people that needed heart surgery, that people... Like, there are actual solutions out there. As bad as the American healthcare system is, there are actually solutions sometimes right in front of a person. There's medicine that they need, there's care that they need, that they could have access to. The care and the medicine have been invented.

• 45:14Speaker 01

  And then they go to their insurance company, and their insurance company is literally waiting for this person to die so they'll stop calling so they can keep the money. And so, I told him, I was like, so maybe murder only matters to you when it's in person. And he didn't say anything after that, and I think he stayed for the show, which I thought was wild. But like, to me, that's sort of at the heart of the matter. It's like, I could have spent 10 minutes just trashing this guy for interrupting the show and like, you know, there's thousands of other people here, but you got in your feelings enough to try to interrupt the show and everything? But, to me, this moment's better served by pointing out a thing. You came to the show, I mean, I'm surprised that you, like me, especially since I did an hour on Luigi, and you're here six months after that.

• 45:58Adam Buxton?

  Maybe he hadn't seen that. Because you know what? I went into watching that clip, your hour on Luigi, maybe with some of the same feelings as your heckler. Thinking, that guy's a murderer. And you do say in the thing, you say very clearly, like, I'm not up for murders. I don't want people murdering each other. You don't want like a total lawless society and you don't want just random killings as a way of settling issues that ought to be settled in other ways, right? So, we all agree on that. But I think for some people, that story was so polarizing and so emotive because it did seem like a divide between people who were sort of advocating vigilante justice as a

• 46:43Adam Buxton?

  way of sorting out society's ills, as opposed to...

• 46:48Adam Buxton?

  Something more to do with the process that we're all signed up to for better or worse. And I always invoke my parents in conversations like these because they were certainly people who believed in law and order and believed in due process and, you know.

• 47:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 47:07Adam Buxton?

  Like, as flawed as those systems are, they were like, well, this is better than the alternative. This is better than total anarchy, you know?

• 47:14Speaker 01

  So the thing I was trying to get across, and the thing I'm still trying to get across, even with that heckler, even with that interaction, is that I understand the people who firmly and fully believe in law and order. I also find that throughout history and in every country, the people that believe the most in law and order are the people who are best served by the current law and order.

• 47:32Adam Buxton?

  Right.

• 47:33Speaker 01

  And so I find that that is a false problem to put out there, that it's either exactly the way it is right now, or it's total anarchy. When really, I'm actually trying to advocate that it should be a lesson and a stark warning to everybody, that if you leave this thing intact, if you leave this version of law and order intact, that's actually what'll lead to anarchy, because it's actually serving so few people that people celebrate a murder that takes place in like, public. That's not normal. And by any measurement of law and order that is actually serving the whole of society, no one would be able to do that. Do you know what I mean?

• 48:13Adam Buxton?

  Mm-hmm.

• 48:13Speaker 01

  If Brian Johnson was sitting alive but in jail right now for his business practices, no one would celebrate his murder. Do you know what I mean?

• 48:23Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 48:23Speaker 01

  And I don't even know if people are celebrating so much as openly not caring. And I think it's a reflection. They are openly not caring the way Brian Johnson openly didn't care about people.

• 48:34Adam Buxton?

  I think for a lot of people, they're like, we're just signed up to this system. Whether you like it or not, I appreciate a lot of people don't like it and are very vocal about, when I say this system, I suppose, I'm not talking purely about the capitalist system, whatever it is.

• 48:48Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 48:48Adam Buxton?

  But it's like, you know, whether you approve or disapprove, this is the way society in the affluent West works. You can have a job as someone who runs a company that is superficially legal and superficially respectable, but actually, if you dig into what it does and the impact that it has on people's lives, it's pretty disgraceful. But, you know, shrug, that's the way society works, you know, that that guy still has more of a right to live his life than someone who's outside of the whole system and just decides that he's gonna execute someone on the street.

• 49:25Speaker 01

  Not only do I agree with you.

• 49:27Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 49:27Speaker 01

  But I'm saying that I could see how me going about even telling some of the jokes the way that I told them might seem like I'm more in favor, I'm more saying like, guys, this is what happens before things go bad.

• 49:42Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 49:43Speaker 01

  And that has to be addressed. And so I look at like some of what, some of the responses to what's happening as, let's say you were sitting with a family member and someone walked in, walked into your, to your home and told you, said it out loud, stated their intention, your family member, I'm going to assault them. And then they started walking towards them. Are you gonna say, hey, that's illegal? Are you gonna say, hey, that's just not done? Maybe you call the police, you tell them to get out, whatever. But once they put their hands on your loved one, what do you do? Do you turn into a killer? I mean, do you to, to protect them? And I'm not saying that Luigi thought he was protecting anyone. I'm not gonna ascribe any intention to what he did.

• 50:27Speaker 01

  But I can tell you right now that the people who are supportive of what he did are those people who are down to the point where the, a hand is on the throats of their loved one and they don't know what else to do. So if someone walked in, and let's say, this is just for the sake of argument, if someone walked in and just as they're putting their hands on the throat of your loved one, and you aren't sure what to do, cuz you're not a killer.

• 50:52Adam Buxton?

  Hmm.

• 50:53Speaker 01

  Someone runs in and hits them with a baseball bat, knocks them out, maybe kills them, whatever. There is a sense of relief where it's like, all right, we got the bad guy. And it's something that we've actually been trained to do when it comes to like shootings with police, right? If a police officer shoots someone that was supposedly doing something illegal, that was supposedly a danger to the public. We get to breathe some sort of sigh of relief.

• 51:16Adam Buxton?

  Yes, well, that is, that's the conventional narrative for most entertainment, isn't it?

• 51:22Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 51:23Adam Buxton?

  Is like, that is the cathartic release you want in a film. You support the cop who is not playing by the rules because he serves a greater justice and he doesn't wanna dot the i's and cross the t's.

• 51:38Speaker 01

  And because the rules have handcuffed him.

• 51:39Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 51:40Speaker 01

  And so we've been playing at this thing for a really long time and it's coming to a head in a way that is very concerning.

• 51:47Adam Buxton?

  Mm hmm.

• 51:47Speaker 01

  And, and that's the kinda thing, like, if I was to really have a conversation with that heckler and like, like, sit and chat with him.

• 51:54Adam Buxton?

  Hmm.

• 51:54Speaker 01

  I would ask him, I'm like, okay, obviously you're not supposed to kill Brian Johnson. Everybody clear on what's supposed to happen, not supposed to happen, not supposed to kill Brian Johnson. What do we do?

• 52:04Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 52:04Speaker 01

  And I don't say that as in, what do we do, cause murder's the only other option. I say, what, what do we do?

• 52:10Adam Buxton?

  Practically speaking.

• 52:11Speaker 01

  Practically speaking.

• 52:12Adam Buxton?

  How do we move forward?

• 52:12Speaker 01

  And if you have no answer, then I think people might murder, you know?

• 52:17Adam Buxton?

  I think all of that comes across really well. It's a really fascinating thing that I hadn't seen. Again, I feel like I didn't get that perspective anywhere else, really, on that particular issue. It's really impressive and, and refreshing and sort of makes you feel a bit hopeful as well, I think, because I do think that people have to accommodate the, the possibility of finding some common ground and, and trying to shift their perspectives on things and not feel so fearfully locked into one way of looking at the world or, or following people who have a very specific way of looking at the world.

• 52:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, it's like when you find out, I don't know if you've ever had this, have you ever found out you've been saying a word wrong your whole life?

• 53:03Adam Buxton?

  Oh, yes.

• 53:03Speaker 01

  And then you're like, oh, everyone I said it in front of. Oh jeez. Oh no. It's like, that's why it's hard to get people to have a cult. Because if you're in a cult, you told everybody.

• 53:15Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 53:15Speaker 01

  You told everybody, it's like, no, we just wear the robe because it's comfortable. And now everyone's like, you're in a cult. And you're like, no, I would have caught on if it was a cult. And then finally, there's like a day where the leader's like, hey, everybody drink this. And you're like, oh, whoops.

• 53:30Adam Buxton?

  Yeah. No, it's very uncomfortable to feel, it's annoying as well. It's not just uncomfortable. It's just fucking annoying. Life's hard enough without having to do more bloody work on yourself.

• 53:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:42Adam Buxton?

  You know what I mean? And, and kind of unpick yourself and think like, oh God, if I'm wrong about that, what else am I wrong about?

• 53:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, because it can all come crumbling down.

• 53:52Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 53:53Speaker 01

  I'm like, oh, every once in a while, you'll have somebody who changes their mind about one thing. And they're like, well, maybe, maybe everything's a lie. And you're like, oh, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, now we're jumping.

• 54:35Adam Buxton?

  Before we conclude then, I wanted to ask you about your impression of the UK. How many times have you been over to the UK? I know that you did the Soho Theatre in Walthamstow. Have you been across more than that?

• 54:47Speaker 01

  I've been one other time and I enjoy coming, but I am trying to learn as fast as I can, things that you would normally pick up if you just lived here. So like the differences in sensibilities between the boroughs and stuff, between like north and south and east and everything. And I feel like I'm catching on to a little bit of it, but I don't have much of it. And

• 55:13Adam Buxton?

  I mean, if you listen to Elon Musk, then the UK UK is just about to tear itself apart in a civil war. I mean, listen, I'm not saying it's perfect and there are definitely tensions in the UK and all sorts of problems that are ongoing. And I also have to acknowledge that I live in a very, I live a nice cozy, privileged life in all sorts of ways. However, I do travel around a certain amount and I don't see the same UK that Elon Musk sees from the States.

• 55:42Speaker 01

  What I actually like about Elon is almost nothing, but one thing I really do like about him is that he reminds me that I don't need more money.

• 55:52Speaker 01

  Do you know what I mean? This is the richest man in the world and he is terrified of everything all the time. He's trying to make you scared of everything all the time, might try and make you scared of everyone. I don't know what what drug he took or what happened in his life, because he used to be like really trying hard to just be kind of funny. There was a time in like 2013 where he was just like posting memes and was kind of funny.

• 56:12Adam Buxton?

  Let this sink in.

• 56:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it's like he still posts memes and I guess he still tries to be funny. But now it is all geared from a perspective where somehow he is the richest man in the world and still not safe. And that that is like, okay, then I don't need to get to the finish line. Do you know what I mean? You tell yourself that if you have a certain amount of money or whatever, that you'll be happier, happier or whatever. But then when the actual richest man in the world is in the White House twitching, twitching from like using drugs and just like kind of being off in space. And everyone's complaining about him because he's so annoying and nobody likes him.

• 56:55Speaker 01

  And all he does all day is just post memes about how the UK has fallen. And how like the UK is basically Africa now and all like all of these like fear mongering, hate mongering posts. You're like, oh, okay, like money won't fix it. And that's kind of reassuring to know.

• 57:13Adam Buxton?

  There are, however, legitimate things to complain about in the UK. I Googled what some of those are, an aggregation of some of the most common complaints across TripAdvisor and places like that. Weather, number one.

• 57:26Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 57:27Adam Buxton?

  Nobody likes British weather. Even though I think in its defense, it's quite nice, except for these months that you're here, actually.

• 57:35Speaker 01

  If you had.

• 57:36Adam Buxton?

  December, January is hard.

• 57:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, if you had a stack of books to read, this would be perfect.

• 57:42Adam Buxton?

  But around this time, January, February, maybe, and of course, it's all changing now with the with the climate shifting so much, but it's fucking depressing and it really gets to you. Just the lack of sunlight, the lack of vitamin D is is hard. But and you really feel it.

• 58:05Adam Buxton?

  People complain that things in the UK are too small, rooms, fridges, beds, cars, food portion.

• 58:12Speaker 01

  Food portion?

• 58:14Adam Buxton?

  I think.

• 58:14Speaker 01

  That must be a distinctly like American complaint coming over here. I feel like every plate of food I've had since I've been here has been full.

• 58:22Adam Buxton?

  Customer service, fewer smiles, less small talk, no one checking in on you every 90 seconds. I mean, to me, those are all positives.

• 58:32Speaker 01

  Yes, because here's the thing with customer service, if they can't help you,

• 58:39Speaker 01

  talking to me extra is not gonna make me feel better.

• 58:44Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 58:44Speaker 01

  You know?

• 58:45Adam Buxton?

  I mean, having said that, I do the the the smileiness and superficial, at least helpfulness of American customer service. When I used to travel there in, I used to go with my dad, he was a travel writer and he would take us to the States in the 70s and early 80s. And that was the thing that stayed with me was I love how friendly they are and they're so, you know, sunny and have a nice day. And it didn't seem insincere to me at all. It just seemed like they're so nice. I love them. And I do miss that sometimes in the UK. But I think customer service is maybe getting a bit better over here. Humor, though, people complain about British humour. They say there's not enough reassurance that

• 59:30Adam Buxton?

  the person is joking, that sometimes.

• 59:33Speaker 01

  Oh, too dry?

• 59:34Adam Buxton?

  Too dry, too sarcastic sometimes.

• 59:37Speaker 01

  Wow, okay.

• 59:39Adam Buxton?

  Have you found that?

• 59:40Speaker 01

  I haven't found that, but I I I could see how, I guess I could see how in conversation, in comedy, I haven't found that because I find British comedians funny. But I guess what I. Could relate to from what they're saying is if I don't know someone and they are joking with me, that's when I could be like, oh, I guess they just don't like me. Cause it, cause we don't know each other and you're joking with me and it's very dry. I don't know this from you not liking me.

• 1:00:13Adam Buxton?

  Okay.

• 1:00:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, whereas I think usually it's a sign that people do like you.

• 1:00:19Adam Buxton?

  In this country, I think they feel comfortable and they feel comfortable enough to be dry.

• 1:00:24Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:00:25Adam Buxton?

  Rather than make it absolutely clear that they're joking.

• 1:00:28Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 1:00:29Adam Buxton?

  Accents, apparently a lot of people, especially Americans, expect a quote, British accent, which I would imagine is uh, something close to my own accent, um, middle class, maybe upper middle class, RP, received pronunciation, or something a little bit more like, you know, British people used to speak like on the BBC.

• 1:00:52Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, like there's a thing, I, I, I was even wondering about this with, with someone before, so I feel like I need to ask you now. What happened to everybody from like the twenties to, to present? Because the Americans also have this, like Americans have that old baseball, like I'm next at bat and it's like that thing is not how anybody talks, like at all. And so is that a thing that happened here where you watch old British movies and they're talking a way that no one talks now?

• 1:01:25Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a comedian called Harry Enfield, who is brilliant, and he had a character who he called Mr. Chumley Warner, and he would make these fake clips of old British TV shows, black and white shows, and he would do this voice that was that kind of, um, yes, the way that people spoke in those days and British television and delivering everything in a very staccato, strange.

• 1:01:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:51Adam Buxton?

  Way. And no, I don't think anyone, I mean, there, there are still posh people who talk like that and you occasionally hear them on the train having loud phone conversations in a very like happy way, totally unselfconscious way that always amazes me. And, you know, we have politicians who are like that. There's a guy called Jacob Rees-Mogg, who sounds like that, really. A little bit, but it did change, yeah. It used to be the specific stated policy of the BBC that people should talk that way. And if you didn't, if that wasn't your natural accent, then you should learn how to do the accent.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  That's so funny that you.

• 1:02:32Adam Buxton?

  But then they stopped, then people began to embrace the idea that actually it would be better to have more diversity of accents and influences.

• 1:02:40Speaker 01

  I mean, it's. They must have done that in the US too, where, where they were like, no, this is how you talk as a radio presenter. But I, I, I suppose even in the early TV, they must have been like, no, you have to give it more huh at the top.

• 1:02:53Adam Buxton?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:54Speaker 01

  Cause that's crazy, cause you know, you, you see even some of these old World War II reels and stuff, I mean, maybe more so World War I than World War II. But yeah, you would see them come on, fighting for the boys at home.

• 1:03:07Adam Buxton?

  That's right, yeah.

• 1:03:08Speaker 01

  And you're like, okay, but did anybody say that? Like when he stepped away from the mic was like, anyone wanna go get lunch? Like, like, or did he talk normal?

• 1:03:17Adam Buxton?

  Yeah. Can't help noticing, dear, that we haven't had sex for two weeks.

• 1:03:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, it's like, what if it never went away? Like that, that guy's like the guy.

• 1:03:27Adam Buxton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I hope you are treated very well by all of us here in the UK.

• 1:03:32Speaker 01

  Oh, fingers crossed.

• 1:03:33Adam Buxton?

  I bid you a warm welcome and wish you the very best of luck for your shows. And I look forward to seeing you live in person, but I will continue to watch and enjoy your YouTube videos.

• 1:03:45Speaker 01

  Oh, thank you.

• 1:03:46Adam Buxton?

  Hey, thank you so much. It's really nice to meet you.

• 1:03:48Speaker 01

  Nice to meet you.

• 1:03:49Adam Buxton?

  I really appreciate you doing this, especially after getting off a plane. That's just.

• 1:03:54Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:03:54Adam Buxton?

  Have a good rest and thanks a lot, man.

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:04:05Adam Buxton?

  Wait. Continue.

• 1:04:17Adam Buxton?

  Hey, welcome back. That was Josh Johnson. I really enjoyed meeting Josh and talking to him. Incredibly sharp, unusual kind of guy. I really recommend checking out some of his videos on YouTube. I've posted links in the description to several stand-up sets, including the one that he recorded in the wake of Rene Good's killing and the one in which he talked about the murder of Brian Thompson. But I'm very grateful to Josh for making the time to talk to me, especially as he'd just got off that flight, blimey. Okay, Adam Buxton podcast news. Myself and my new podcast production helpers, Claire Broughton and Diggory Waite,

• 1:05:02Adam Buxton?

  are trying to figure out a way to do a Patreon bonus area, if that's what you call it, for this podcast. It's not something I've ever done before, but I'd like to give it a try, not least because I've never really had regular contact with you guys, with the podcasts, people who listen to the podcast, other than Christmas time when we take anecdotes and jokes and things like that for the podcast with Joe. But this would be an opportunity to do a semi-regular Q and A or AMA where you guys could send in any questions you wanted to ask

• 1:05:46Adam Buxton?

  and we'd pick a few and I would talk about them and answer them. And that would end up being a regular Patreon bonus. But to get the ball rolling, we'd do it as part of the run for the main podcast. So you wouldn't need to be signed up to Patreon to hear it. Anyway, there's an email address in the description of today's podcast for anybody who would like to send in a question they'd like to ask. And in a few weeks' time, we'll record an episode of me answering some of those questions. Thereafter, we would do it exclusively for our Patreon subscribers. And there would also be other bonus materials.

• 1:06:31Adam Buxton?

  Which we haven't nailed down exactly, yes, but we're just kind of gauging the level of interest at this point. So if you are interested, first of all, in doing the AMA and then possibly in being a Patreon member, drop us a line to the email address in the description of today's podcast. I look forward to hearing from you.

• 1:06:55Adam Buxton?

  So how have you been, Podcats? I hope you're doing all right, wherever you are. It was really so great to meet some of you after the band shows recently. Earlier this year, when I was feeling a bit overwhelmed and despondent and I was moping about a little bit at home, my wife said to me, "I think it's gonna be good for you to get out of the house and do some shows with the band and meet the Podcats." And she was right, as she so often is. The shows have been really fun. I've loved playing with the band, and if I say so myself, I think we sound pretty good on the whole. My guitar playing,

• 1:07:35Adam Buxton?

  which was at beginner level, seems to have got even worse, but luckily Joe, Mount, Gabriel Stebbing and Michael Lovett from the band are really excellent players. So apart from singing, I tend to be more of a Roxy Music era Eno, firing off samples, playing the odd bit of random synth noise. For some of the shows, we've also been getting members of the audience up on stage to play Eno synth on a little Critter and Gitarri handheld synth box that I bought years ago after seeing Gaz Coombs using one. There's a video of me and Gaz playing "I Believe in Father Christmas" by Greg Lake for a show I did

• 1:08:20Adam Buxton?

  years ago called Adam Buxton's Shed of Christmas, and in it I am using the little handheld synth.

• 1:08:29Adam Buxton?

  That we now have on tour. And we got some very good emergencinos up on stage. Shout out to Sarah, Effan and Luce from our recent shows. I think I'm getting a bit more relaxed on stage, maybe even a little bit more tuneful as a singer. The first night of the tour was at the Liverpool Tung Auditorium, T U N G, which is part of the Yoko Ono Lennon Centre, beautiful venue. Very nice and modern and fancy. We had a few technical issues that night.

• 1:09:06Adam Buxton?

  And we were quite nervous, so it was a little raggedy. Also, there were a few famous faces in the audience that night. I won't say who they were to preserve their anonymity, but that always tends to ratchet up the nerves a little bit as well. Next morning, I got up early and I went for a walk in Liverpool to get myself some breakfast and found myself in the sort of main shopping drag and the touristy part of town around Whitechapel. And I came across the statue of Brian Epstein, the Beatles manager, outside where the North End Music Store, N E M S, once stood where Brian Epstein worked and where members of the Beatles used to shop for records.

• 1:09:50Adam Buxton?

  And the statue is of twenty seven year old Mr Epstein, striding off from the record store in November nineteen sixty one, when he went for the first time to see the Beatles playing at the Cavern Club in Matthew Street just round the corner. And I've been to Liverpool a couple of times, but I've never really done the tourist thing, so I pointed myself in the same direction as the statue. And a few minutes later, there I was in Matthew Street, which is lined with Beatles related bars and imagery.

• 1:10:23Adam Buxton?

  And I was standing in front of another statue, this time of Oh Laura Laura Stella Black in a blinder data. She was also managed by Brian Epstein, of course. And there she is in a mini dress in brass form with her arms outstretched, looking a bit Jesus-y, it has to be said, where the entrance to the Cavern Club would have been when The Beatles were playing there, back in the early sixties. And I was there for a little while in the early morning before the other tourists started arriving, enjoying that weird feeling of bathing in the memories held by a place where momentous things once happened.

• 1:11:06Adam Buxton?

  And I was enjoying standing exactly where The Beatles would have come and gone around sixty-five years earlier, separated only by time and in the scale of things, such a microscopic sliver of time. And imagine all the other people who have stood there in that spot. A Laura Laura people who are also fascinated by The Beatles and that story and... Anyway, I felt I was communing with them like John and Paul on an acid trip, staring into each other's eyes and saying, I know, man, I know. It was all quite trippy, especially because while I've been travelling around, I've been listening to the audiobook of John and Paul,

• 1:11:51Adam Buxton?

  A Love Story and Songs by Ian Leslie,

• 1:11:55Adam Buxton?

  brilliantly read by Chris Addison.

• 1:11:58Adam Buxton?

  And a lot of people had been recommending that book to me for a while. If you don't know it, it examines the personal and professional relationship between John Lennon and Paul McCartney via a selection of songs that were pivotal for various reasons in the course of their twenty-three-year friendship from nineteen fifty-seven, when they met, to nineteen eighty, when John Lennon was murdered. And instead of just hitting all the usual plot points in the history of The Beatles, Ian Leslie charts the inner workings of a friendship that started when Paul was fifteen and John was sixteen. Paul's mother had died of cancer the year before they met. John's mother died in an accident the year after they met.

• 1:12:42Adam Buxton?

  And over the next thirteen years, that's all it was, thirteen, it's nothing. They wrote Beatles songs together, which partly provided them with a way to express some of their feelings about their various losses, as well as their feelings for each other, friendship and love, but also the insecurity and the competitive tensions and resentments that are so often part of a close friendship, especially if it's also a creative partnership. Yes, I know what you're thinking. It's very similar to the Adam and Joe Six Music Song Wars story, isn't it? Adam McCartney writes sausages, encourages Joe Lennon to write some original material too. Joe ups the ante with European

• 1:13:27Adam Buxton?

  Supermarket and from there, the limits of garage band creativity are pushed further back, week on week, with Joe initially dominating the competition, causing Adam to suffer severe creative anxiety, which forces him to step up and write some of the defining songs of his career. Mind of a Pirate, Festival Time and Party Pom Pom. Meanwhile, Joe Lennon starts taking too much LSD, gets addicted to heroin, switches his emotional allegiances to a Japanese artist and goes off the rails before cleaning up and reasserting his musical dominance with bangers like Antiques Roadshow and La La Lumley, only to lose interest in the project when Hollywood comes calling and he starts to believe he's Jesus. I'm

• 1:14:11Adam Buxton?

  just saying, don't be surprised if Ian Leslie's next project is the Adam and Joe Song Wars Story. But yeah, John and Paul, a love story. Hard recommend. All right, that's it for this week. Get those questions in for the Q and A episode. Book those tickets for the band and for Bowie Bug and for Live Podcast with Mo and Rizwan. And don't forget, I'm at the Charleston Festival in East Sussex this Thursday, the 14th, talking to Miranda Sawyer about the 90s DIY TV, doing some reminiscing, playing a few clips, having a great time. Hope you can come to that. We're on at 9pm. Thank you very much indeed

• 1:14:56Adam Buxton?

  to Claire Broughton and Diggory Waite. For their production support and conversation editing. Thanks very much to Seamus Murphy Mitchell for his production support. Thank you to everyone at Acast, who liaises with my sponsors, much appreciated. Thanks to Helen Green, I saw her the other night in Bath. She came along to one of the band's shows, it was lovely to see her. She does the artwork for this podcast, of course. But thanks, most of all, to you for coming back, listening right to the end. I appreciate it. Creepy hug. I'm here, hey, how's it going? Good to see you.

• 1:15:35Adam Buxton?

  Beautiful birds. Until next time, we share the same aural space. Please do go carefully and if it makes any difference at all, I love you. Bye.