Why Are You Like This? with Megan Rapinoe

Today we’re bringing you an episode of a new podcast called “Why Are You Like This? with Megan Rapinoe” from A Touch More and the Vox Media Podcast Network. Live from WNBA All Star Weekend, host Megan Rapinoe sits down with five-time All-Star coach Cheryl Reeve, the winningest coach in WNBA history. Cheryl Reeve has been head coach of the Minnesota Lynx since 2010. In addition to leading the team to four WNBA world championships, Reeve supported the Lynx’s 2016 protest against police brutality and continues to advocate for social justice issues in Minneapolis and beyond, including as an outspoken supporter of transgender athletes. Megan and Cheryl get into how she’s evolved as a coach, the WNBA’s legacy of activism and why she’s proud of a league where “everyone is so authentically themselves.” Why Are You Like This? is a co-production of A Touch More and Vox Media Podcast Network. New episodes every Thursday. Follow Megan on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mrapinoe/ Follow A Touch More on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/whyareyoulikethis/ Follow A Touch More on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@whyareyoulikethis Learn more about A Touch More here: https://www.atouchmore.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:12Kara Swisher?

  Hi, everyone. From New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network, this is On with Kara Swisher, and I'm Kara Swisher. Today, we're bringing you an episode of a new podcast called Why Are You Like This? with Megan Rapinoe from A Touch More and the Vox Media Podcast Network. In this episode, host Megan Rapinoe sits down with five-time WNBA All-Star coach Cheryl Reeve, the winningest coach in WNBA history. The WNBA has exploded in popularity in recent years. On top of the surge in viewership, the league's 30th anniversary season tipped off on the heels of an historic collective bargaining agreement that gave players a nearly 400% salary increase. Cheryl Reeve has been head coach of the Minnesota Lynx since 2010.

• 0:56Kara Swisher?

  In addition to leading the team to four WNBA World Championships, Reeve supported the Lynx's 2016 protest against police brutality and continues to advocate for social justice issues in Minneapolis and beyond, including as an outspoken supporter of transgender athletes. In this conversation, recorded live during the WNBA All-Star Weekend, Megan and Cheryl get into how she's evolved as a coach, the WNBA's legacy of activism, and why she's proud of a league where, quote, "everyone is so authentically themselves." Stick around.

• 1:35Speaker 01

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• 2:37Kara Swisher?

  I'm Ina Garten, and each week on Happy Hour, I invite new and old friends for a drink and a fun conversation at my kitchen table in New York City. On this week's episode, I'm joined by Julia Louis-Dreyfus. We talk all about attending a fashion show in Paris together, throwing dinner parties, and making her Broadway debut in other desert cities. New episodes of Happy Hour are available every Wednesday. You can watch on YouTube or listen wherever you get your podcasts. Cheers.

• 3:15Speaker 05

  My dad said, "Cheryl, are you a lesbian?" And I remember the word at that time. I was like, "God, no, not a lesbian." I was more a dyke than I was a lesbian, right? At that age, I was.

• 3:40Kara Swisher?

  Please welcome the host of Why Are You Like This? Two-time World Cup champion Megan Rapinoe.

• 4:06Speaker 05

  Hello, how's everybody? Hi, hi, hi.

• 4:16Speaker 05

  You know, you just get a little nervous randomly? All of a sudden, I'm like, I knew what the call time was and I knew what time the show was starting. But then I get up here and I'm like, "Oh, my God. It's just me." Hello, everyone.

• 4:37Speaker 05

  Welcome to Why Are You Like This? I'm Megan Rapinoe. We are live here in the windy city, of course. Shout out Shawty Tone. Chicago, this is actually where I started my professional career, lol. It was so fucking cold when I got here. I think it was like April, too, and they were like, "It's actually warming up. It's spring." I was like, "That's cute." Before we get the show started, I wanted to just kind of like run down what this new show is gonna be like, Why Are You Like This? I want to be sitting down with disruptive people, athletes, of course. We have an amazing guest today.

• 5:21Speaker 05

  But also like people across culture, artists, politicians, honestly, anybody who'll say yes, just sitting down and having a different kind of conversation. I feel like I got this question all the time. I think I still do in a lot of ways. Like implicitly, explicitly, sometimes literally, like, "Why are you like this? What's going on?" Sometimes my mom asks me that. Like, "Do you have to do it? Do you have to be the one to say it?" And I'm like, "I do, Mom. Remember those lessons." But I feel like I got this question all the time, like, "Why do you, you know, say the things you do?" Or, "Why is your hair that color?

• 6:06Speaker 05

  Why isn't it that color? Why do you wear the things that you do or not?" I mean, not usually that. I feel like I'm not like a, you know, a skin boy or anything. But I think it's really easy to like flatten people out or things out. I think in our kind of like media landscape and culture right now, people are really, not really people, I think things are like wanting it to be simple. And I'm like, humans just really aren't that simple. We're way more complicated than that. We're way messier than any sort of like one tagline thing. I think everybody knows that. There's a lot more nuance. So I feel like that's the conversation I want to have, just putting a little bit more

• 6:51Speaker 05

  space into, why are people the way that they are? Like, why do they make the decisions? Where's that come from? Who are the people that shaped them? That was something that I feel like was always important to me, to be able to like have that space. I'm like, I don't know, sometimes I use humor when I'm sad. And I'm like, "What the fuck is that? Like, why do we do that? That's so weird." Like, I'm so sad and I'm gonna make a joke about myself. Okay, like, I'm interested in that for other people and also for myself. And I know like having the space to do that is really important. So that's kind of the way that I want to have all of these conversations and talk to people.

• 7:32Speaker 05

  That's kind of like the impetus to the new show. So that's that. Obviously, we're recording in the middle of WNBA All-Star. Have you guys been taking in the sights and the scenes and the sounds? Yeah? How is this like people's first All-Star? Baby's first All-Star? Okay, people's like 25th All-Star? Anybody? Somebody? Somebody here has been here for a very long time. We have the winningest coach in the WNBA joining us today. That's right. Yeah, she's a baller. You know her, you love her. Five-time All-Star coach Cheryl Reeve.

• 8:17Speaker 05

  Plus, you're gonna get some reactions to my hot takes. I'm gonna let you guys throw some shit out there. I know you like to say stuff. I like to hear stuff. Welcome to Why Are You Like This? with Megan Rapinoe. I'm Megan Rapinoe.

• 8:35Speaker 05

  Let's get into it. I feel like the first thing that I was excited about is the sad butts, right? We have, we've got blue hair now. And I'm like, I get it. I've been there. I'm like, let's change it up. I love it for them. Never got paid to change my hair, but I'm like, that was stupid of me. Hey, AT&T. I have a clean palate for you. No, you got your girls. I get it. I'm loving it. Are you guys like following in on their content or just, we're vibing? Have we had any like favorite moments so far?

• 9:17Speaker 05

  You can just like holler them out if you want or not. What? Their livestream. You got on their livestream? Wow. What were you doing? You don't even, you were like, we don't know. We, we were just there. I love it. I, I got to go to the Presidential Obama Center this morning. Has anybody been? Wow. It was kind of shocking. I feel like we've gotten used to some stuff. At a different level, a lower one, obviously. And I'm like, damn, he could talk.

• 10:01Speaker 05

  That's inspiring. I'm like, si se puede. Yeah, we can, right? We can. Yes, we can. It was absolutely beautiful. I also saw all of the footage of them practicing like at the, I feel like it was just so cute. They were like, he loves them and they love him. And it was just like, oh, that's amazing. That was so cool. Like there's some just moments, I do believe in FOMO and I get it and I'm trying to work on it, but I'm like, I want to play in the WNBA. At the All-Star game, I don't even need to do the whole season. I'm like, I want to play the All-Star game.

• 10:45Speaker 05

  I want to dribble around and like have President Obama be amazing all the time. I hope all the FOMO players were reading the plaques and stuff, but. No? Okay. I too am wondering where my three-point contest invitation was. Just if those were getting lost up, like did, did mine? They were sending them out late. I don't know. What happened there though? You know what I love about the WNBA players? They will just like never, ever not call out shade. They're like, no, you didn't ask me.

• 11:28Speaker 05

  They're like, excuse me, in a press conference, I didn't receive the text message. Nor did I receive the official invite. Don't come for me. Kay Mack, I feel like, and Sabrina especially, they were like, mm-mm. We love to shoot a three. We would have shot, we would have shot that thing, but. Anyways, that's all the jokes I have for now. Let's get to our guests. Cheryl Reeves' bio is like, it's just kind of ridiculous. But I'm gonna do it. So that's actually the bulk of the show. So I'm just gonna be here for, for the next 46 minutes or so. She's the weakest coach of all time in the WNBA.

• 12:12Speaker 05

  She's been inducted in the Women's Basketball Hall of Fame. She's led the Minnesota Lynx to not one, two, three, but four WNBA championships, one Commissioner's Cup win. She's got a gold medal to her name. The 2024 Paris Olympics. Incredible. I was in the stands for that. Everybody saw it. That was a two. Sorry, Gabby. We love you, but absolutely not when you're playing for the blue and we're in America. Okay? No. She's been the Coach of the Year four times, named an All-Star Coach five times. Please welcome to the show, New Jersey and Minnesota's finest, Cheryl Reeves.

• 12:54Speaker 05

  Get up here. Get up here. All right. Let's do this. And a fellow gay, obviously.

• 13:07Speaker 06

  You don't say.

• 13:12Speaker 05

  Welcome to the show. Thank you so much.

• 13:14Speaker 06

  Thank you. This is so exciting.

• 13:16Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:17Speaker 06

  This, this could not be more fitting. I heard the same darn thing from my mom. Why are you like that? This is perfect.

• 13:23Speaker 05

  What are you doing? Why are you like that? How, like, how are you? How are your sleep levels? WNBA All-Star is a totally different beast. How does it feel to be coaching in the All-Star game again for the fifth time, but just in general? How's this experience been so far?

• 13:43Speaker 06

  It's always really special. You know, it's a celebration and, you know, I said, this is one of the few times that, you know, all these great competitors and all the things that you see in the moments in the games that might be difficult and competitive. It looks like we don't like each other. When you're at All-Star, you see there's actually lots of love for everyone, right? The coaches, the executives and the players themselves. And so it's really refreshing to be in that moment. Obviously, it's a great honor. It's never lost on me, although there's some times when I think maybe just going to sleep for a few days would be great, but, but it's always an honor and obviously now I have a son who's 11. How much he enjoys being in the, around the WNBA players is one of his favorite events

• 14:28Speaker 06

  to come to. He was in Indianapolis last year, had a great time and he was really excited we had a chance to come back.

• 14:34Speaker 05

  I love it.

• 14:35Speaker 06

  Oliver's in the crowd there. Shout out Oliver Harrison.

• 14:40Speaker 05

  Your coaching team spoon this year, I'm curious, maybe you like didn't envision that you would be here this year. Your team went through quite a transformation.

• 14:51Speaker 06

  Why is that funny to you?

• 14:52Speaker 05

  Like, I'm just like, I know, honestly, people ask me all the time if I'm gonna coach and I'm like, are you fucking serious? Do you know what it means to be a coach? Do you know the levels of stress? We were talking just backstage, you lost eight or nine of your players. Fee had not one but two ankles done in the offseason, like she's recovering from that. You had a high draft pick, so you drafted Olivia. I mean, you have to like put the ball in a rookie's hands. I mean, who knows how that's gonna go? That's crazy. Like, turns out it's fine. But you're here.

• 15:37Speaker 05

  Your team is in first place. You're the only 20-team, 20-game win team. 20-win team.

• 15:44Speaker 06

  Jesus.

• 15:45Speaker 05

  20-win team. Yeah, I'm like, I can't even do this. Well, how am I gonna coach? You know? What? The only 20-win team in the league. What does this one mean to you?

• 15:57Speaker 06

  Well, it was, it's been a lot when I think about CBA negotiations, a lot of uncertainty. And then boom, you know, we got the word, it's on. And, you know, we've been preparing and we sort of knew some of the changes we were gonna go through as a team that were inevitable with the increased money and roles that people could have. I felt really incredibly proud about the team that we had in '24 and '25. Really, really special. And we create a lot of opportunities for, for these players and, but then when it was all said and done, I was kind of pissed. You know, where I'm going, that's just great, you know? Like we did all this and they chose other teams and we're supposed to celebrate them.

• 16:40Speaker 06

  And now, you know, outwardly it was really great, but when I was home, I was like, this sucks. And, and, you know, you have to start over, you know, kind of, obviously it's not starting over when you have Fee, Courtney and McBride. It's not starting over. But as you mentioned, you know, starting the season with such uncertainty, you know, we didn't know, and I think about training camp, which feels like a year ago at this point. But the, the training camp, there was a lot of uncertainty even who was gonna make the final roster. Those are not necessarily your best seasons. And I think what happened in maybe all of our sort of granular thinking about who was gonna make the roster, something special was actually brewing with the starting five that we had with obviously Olivia Miles.

• 17:25Speaker 06

  It was week two after we had a preseason game in Kansas City that I had this sort of moment where I thought, okay, we can go forward with Courtney as the sometime point guard and sometimes Liv, you're the point guard, or we can just get right to it. Let's just get right to it. And in week two, I just, I brought Courtney in and I said, hey, I think we want to, you know, turn the, turn the reins over to Liv and let her just go, you know? And, and, you know, she stood up and she said, let's, you know, the only way Courtney can, you know, let's go all height and, and I think it's the right thing and I can go back to my natural spot. And so that last week, that third week, boom, we, we just sort of took off.

• 18:08Speaker 06

  Nia Coffey having her best, best season in her career. It's about opportunity as we're seeing around the league, whether it's expansion or a team like ours, maybe some dilution in our team and so new opportunities around the league. And then Natasha Howard coming back and everybody just sort of fitting, those, that starting five really fitting. Really, really special through the first half of the season. Their net rating was darn near plus 20. And I've got a bench that we're, you know, they're still trying to figure me out, my impatience and how to fit in into that impatience and, you know, yeah, it's, it's hard to believe that we're sitting here first in the league and, you know, 20-plus wins, you know? I feel grateful.

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• 19:39Speaker 02

  A dark night, a quiet house, but inside, danger was lurking.

• 19:43Speaker 03

  Oh, we have Xfinity Shield. It's built-in Wi-Fi feature detects movement without cameras.

• 19:47Speaker 02

  What she didn't know is that online, there lurked an even bigger.

• 19:51Speaker 03

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• 19:54Speaker 02

  I should have stuck to rom-coms.

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• 20:09Kara Swisher?

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• 20:54Speaker 05

  The perfect segue of why are you like this, Coach Cheryl? I don't know if you heard me talking backstage, but the question I really want to get to in this show is that, and I feel like I've had this question a million times in a million different ways. And I think there's so much, especially you've had such a long career. You've been in the game so much.

• 21:15Speaker 06

  Why do you have to say it like that? Such a long career.

• 21:18Speaker 05

  Long and accomplished, yeah. But still young and bright and a long road ahead of you. But you have like an established who you are in this league. And I'm so interested, I feel this for me of like, I feel like there's two of me. I'm like, there's Megan Rapinoe, and everybody knows that. You know, that's kind of like who's in front of the mic. And then like Megan's like inside of Megan Rapinoe right now, and she's like, whoa, this is crazy. So there's two. I wonder if you ever feel that, that sort of like divergence of personality where like, yes, you're Cheryl Reeve, the coach, Olympic coach, All-Star coach, coach of the Minnesota

• 22:01Speaker 05

  Lynx, like all-time coach in this league. And then there's also just you. Do you feel those two things? And how do you feel them?

• 22:10Speaker 06

  The first one you describe, I don't think of myself as, and that's, that's hard for me. I don't, I don't see that I am such a sort of grinder in the moment. And then I come to places like these, and then the gravity of the moment and the maybe your impact, you start to, you know, to feel that. But for me, it's just kind of where I am and what I'm doing that day and, you know, that practice. And I only know one way, and that's to kind of pour in to what I'm doing there. So I don't feel like I have that. I'm the same, I mean, it's kind of scary for my family that what you see, I'm actually like that at home, you know? And that can be hard, I know, for that, you know, for those two in my life.

• 22:52Speaker 06

  But I'm by nature a very critical person, very critical of myself, critical of those around me. I've tried to evolve in that space and be less critical, you know, and that's, that's been an evolution, you know? I'm still evolving, as they say.

• 23:07Speaker 05

  Who shaped that part of you, do you think?

• 23:09Speaker 06

  The critical?

• 23:10Speaker 05

  Just like the, I mean, part of it is the critical, but also just like the Cheryl, the coach, the, you know, the wife, the mom, the like person that you are in the world.

• 23:22Speaker 06

  I'm not sure, because I've kind of gone through that. Like, am I more like my mom or my dad? And, you know, who, like, what is it from? I have those questions when you get older, right? Like, where does this come from? Who do I owe? You know, like, who do I thank? You know, and so recently, so my mom's 87, and, you know, recently, you know, people are asking her things, and so she's doing a little more storytelling. And, and they asked, you know, somebody asked about sort of my stronger voice or willingness to, you know, to speak on things. And she said, oh, she was always like that, such a smart mouth, you know? When she was, you know, just a youngster, just always had something to say. And I was like, oh, okay, so I guess it's always been the case. I have felt confident.

• 24:06Speaker 06

  But there, you know, from a professional standpoint, I think, I've always been, I was a point guard. I remember in my freshman year, when I went to LaSalle University, and we were doing our fall workouts, and I've just always had a way of sort of speaking, you know, whatever I was thinking. And it's not always good. I don't mean to say this as like complimenting myself at all. It's not always good. Having a filter would be much better.

• 24:33Speaker 05

  Yeah, no, I've been there. I'm like, huh.

• 24:36Speaker 06

  But I remember we were playing pickup, and I'm, I'm mad, we're just playing pickup, and but I just, I wanted to win that possession and, you know, and I'm yelling at my teammates that don't even know me yet. I'm telling them, you know, get back on D, don't rest, don't rest on defense, you know, like, right away, I'm just kind of. And I think if you just take that and just put that everywhere, you know, like as a teammate, you know, as a partner, you know, probably as a mom, I think I'm a little softer as a mom. But I think the, you know, the idea of, you know, saying, saying what you think, there's value in the, in the, in the truth, right? I think that's, but that I've really kind of learned is not everybody really wants to hear the truth, you know, and sort of finding that balance of, I think you should surround

• 25:21Speaker 06

  yourself with people that are going to be honest with you. I think that's really important. I've shared that with Oliver when he didn't get the report card that he wanted. I said, you should thank your teacher for that. And he thought I lost my mind. But it's true, you know, there's somebody to, like, you're not, nobody's perfect, and there's always room to grow. Go back to what the original question was, because I'm starting to go on my tangents.

• 25:43Speaker 05

  I like it. I'm like, I'm locked in. Yeah. Just who shaped you? Who else shaped that part of you?

• 25:48Speaker 06

  So, so, so when I first got in the WNBA as an assistant coach, again, I, you know, I worked for, you know, some people that maybe my directness as an assistant coach wasn't always appreciated. It was coming from a space of wanting to, wanting to win. But I thought everyone was confident, you know, in what they were doing. And when I started to recognize that maybe that wasn't the case, it was when I went to work for Bill Laimbeer, that he, he embodied the be yourself, how important it is for everybody to show up and be yourself. And he wanted me to be myself. And so for me, it was, you know, I could be hard-hitting, and I could speak my mind, and that was okay.

• 26:32Speaker 06

  And that was sort of the first time that I thought how good that felt like to be able to be yourself. And then, you know, just, you know, when I went from there right into head coaching, I feel like that gave me the confidence that everyone needs to be able to be themselves, every player in their personalities, or everyone that's working for you, so you can bring your authentic self to the workplace and how, what, you know, great heights you could reach in doing that. So I've just been able to do that. Players, let me be me. I am so, every, every season, I thank the players. Thank you for letting me be me, because it's not always easy. But they know that I'm coming from a place of, of care and love and wanting the best for everyone involved.

• 27:11Speaker 05

  That's such an interesting thing. I feel that so much of like, if everybody's allowed to bring their full self, it's not, it's going to be less comfortable, but it's going to be better for everyone. Certainly, Bill was wanting to bring his full self. I mean, I think you have, at least on the outside, from, from, I'm sort of like half in, half out, but from my view, you have a real reputation of allowing players to be themselves in a really wide spectrum. I mean, I think back to, I feel like my real first, like, entree into the Minnesota Lynx is 2016. And, you know, the players protesting, police brutality, Philando Castile has just been murdered in Minneapolis.

• 27:56Speaker 05

  Your players are standing up there, you're standing with them, all the way to like, you know, Maya Moore and her activism that, you know, eventually led her away from your team.

• 28:07Speaker 06

  I have some regrets.

• 28:08Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. You're like, you know what? Good for you, Maya. Love that for you. You know, to the stud buds, like, they were too, you know, really outspoken, and they were like doing the stream. And for such kind of like a hard-ass coach, or someone who says what they think and what they feel, you really like let them do that. And I'm curious about the...

• 28:38Speaker 05

  I always feel like doing the right thing isn't 100% altruistic. Like, there's, you know, at the end of the day, like, you're judged on your wins and losses. And I'm curious how you think about that in, in terms of letting your players be who they are, in terms of your, like, coaching style and your strategy in trying to be the best coach that you can.

• 28:58Speaker 06

  Yeah, I think it's really simple, exactly what you said. Um, no, the recent one was, was obviously the stud buzz and I, we were in Dallas. And I guess they, I, I'm not real up on this, and so it's probably for the better that I don't know a lot of this. Uh, but sometimes people send me things, you know, uh, and so, uh, I was really unaware. This was Dallas in, I guess it would have been 2025. And we had just had our film session and we were breaking, we were gonna go do our pregame meal. We're gonna go out that game that night. And I get a message, um, from Courtney and T saying they wanted to meet. And I thought, oh, that's kind of annoying. We all have our routines and like, why would we be meeting now? Like, what are we doing?

• 29:39Speaker 06

  And so they bring me in and they sit me down and they go, we're worried, you know, we're worried. What are you worried about? Well, we're worried because I might have put a battery on Dejana Carrington's back, who was playing for Dallas at this time, which means, um, that maybe she said something on the stream that might have gotten her motivated, a little extra motivated that night. Apparently she was maybe disparaging the lack of success that Dallas was having at that time. Uh, and she was like, you know, she's like, I'm worried you're gonna be upset with us. I'm worried you're not gonna be okay with this. And so I said, well, tell me exactly what happened here, you know? Uh, and Courtney, I like, you know, we have, we have some good banter and, um, there's a fine line.

• 30:19Speaker 06

  And I, I, I told her 10 years ago, maybe I wouldn't be able to, to be in the space that I am. Uh, so we always said the timing of us being together has really been important. And I don't know that Courtney could handle me 10 years ago, uh, and me them, right? Because it really has stretched my boundaries, uh, and it's fun, right? It's really fun to kind of do that. But all of it while the team is successful, that's why I told, as long as the main thing is the main thing. Um, and that's been stretched, um, you know, and, and I'm a big believer in you get what you accept. And so I wanted them to know how important it is that they are mindful of their teammates and how they feel.

• 30:57Speaker 06

  And it may be they're very comfortable in this very loud space, this very, um, you know, revealing, et cetera. But not everybody is, and so always considering your teammates and, and your organization. Uh, you know, make sure that, you know, that, you know, you're representing yourself, your family, your organization, all the things. So I, you know, I do that spiel and then they assured me that, you know, it was all about winning and, and doing that. And, and so, um, you know, you mentioned the, you know, the activism and, you know, same thing. You know, when we went through, you know, in 2016, I don't know if you have time for this, if you're interested in this, in this part of this, but, um, you are?

• 31:33Speaker 05

  Short answer, yes.

• 31:35Speaker 06

  And, uh, you know, it was a really difficult time. Um, you know, 2016 wasn't new, uh, in terms of what was happening with police officer involved shootings or, you know, the racial profiling, et cetera. Simone Augustus had experience being racially profiled a couple of years before. Um, I had some conversations with, uh, players and coaches and, you know, we just talked about their experiences, you know, going, going shopping, going through a store and being followed and, and just different things that sort of accumulated over time. And this particular one was hard, uh, Simone Augustus, uh, that, you know, in Baton Rouge, uh, Alton Sterling had been murdered at the hands of the police.

• 32:17Speaker 06

  And, um, and I remember thinking, uh, you know, like how difficult that was for Simone. Simone had frequented that store that it occurred in front of. Uh, and so that was on our minds, you know, having those conversations and talking about their feelings. And then just a couple of days later, we were in Connecticut at the Megan Sun, getting ready for a game, uh, with the Connecticut Sun. And we woke up to the news of Philando Castile on his awful murder in the hands of police in St. Paul, uh, Minnesota. So it was really, it was really hitting close to home for us. And, you know, I learned a long time ago that when the unaffected are affected, that's when change can happen.

• 32:57Speaker 06

  Uh, I'm the unaffected. I'm white, I'm with privilege, uh, and, um, I was affected. And so I remember waking up and not really giving a shit about the game that night. I thought, how can I give a shit? How can I go into shoot around and, and, and, you know, you know, demand, you know, this focus, this, you know, this preparation? And, uh, we went and, uh, before shoot around, we gathered the captains, Lindsay, Simone, Maya and Rebecca. And I told them how I was feeling. I said, I can't imagine how you all are feeling. And, and so we gave them the space to talk and I said, let's do something. Let's, let's use our voice for good. Let's use our voice for change. What do you guys want to do?

• 33:41Speaker 06

  And, and they, um, thoughtfully, I said, I'll give them the space. And they thoughtfully came up with the idea of wearing T-shirts that represented, you know, some names that were just recently involved in the police officer involved shootings. Um, you know, the, the phrase Black Lives Matter in 2016 is very different than the phrase in 2026. Um, and in between, it was a Thursday night, we had a game Thursday night. And then Saturday, we were gonna be playing Dallas at home. And Friday, uh, I, my job was to get on the phone, uh, and alert, um, those key stakeholders to let them know that our players had made a decision, they were creating these T-shirts. And they wanted to be thoughtful and change starts with us was what was on the front.

• 34:26Speaker 06

  Obviously on the back, there were names of those that were involved. And by Friday evening, there was a, um, ambush of police officers in Dallas. And so they quickly said, we need to have that Dallas Police Department shield on that shirt and representing, trying to represent everyone, that, you know, we have to come together for some solutions. Uh, by Saturday night, there was a planned press conference. By Saturday night, I was already on the phone with the president of, of the league at that time. And my phone calls were calling to say, this is what we're doing. This wasn't asking for their permission, their forgiveness or anything like that. This was important that they understand that their support was so important at this time.

• 35:11Speaker 06

  Uh, the president of the league at that time, um, there was, there were two hats that she was wearing. She was wearing the hat of a commissioner and she was wearing the hat of a black woman. And, and so I understood, uh, and I told her I understood, um, but I told her I was gonna take it out of her hands completely. Uh, and we're doing this. Um, and, and by that night, we had a press conference, uh, as our four powerful, um, captains stood in front. Uh, I was visited an hour before the game with the director of security, uh, at the Target Center. And I was told that the police officers walked out. And we did not have, uh, a secure facility. And they walked out because we had Black Lives Matter on our T-shirt.

• 35:55Speaker 06

  And I said, they're making the very point of what we're talking about. They're making the very point of what we're saying, that in that change, that we all have to be a part of this solution. And, uh, it was a lot to go through. I told them that it takes courage to stand in this because there's a lot that's gonna come from this that's not gonna be favorable. Uh, and I said, oh, by the way, and you have to win tonight. And you have to win tonight.

• 36:21Speaker 05

  Keep the main thing the main thing.

• 36:23Speaker 06

  When you don't win, keeping the main thing, because when you don't win, then people say, see, if you're stuck to basketball and focus on the right things. So we wanted to make sure we could silence, uh, and we won by 30 that night. As heavy as things were, we won by 30 that night. Thanks for letting me tell that story.

• 36:41Speaker 05

  Being on the right side of things is good business. We always say that.

• 36:45Speaker 06

  That's exactly right.

• 36:46Speaker 05

  I want to talk a little bit about your, your personal style of activism. You, you know, take, you took this opportunity, you take every opportunity, uh, whether it's in media, at a press conference, um, you, you have an unprecedented slogan shirt collection. It's, it's well documented. It will be in a museum in Minneapolis. At some point after your retirement, it's exceptional. I can't even imagine how big your closet is. Just for the shirts, obviously. Um, it just would be perfectly reasonable for you and most people do, to just like, wear a suit. Why don't you?

• 37:32Speaker 06

  Well, this was post-COVID.

• 37:34Speaker 05

  You know, the meta part of that question.

• 37:35Speaker 06

  Right, and so, you know, post-COVID, who wanted to go back to wearing suits? I look at some of the pictures and how silly I looked, wearing suits and heels and, you know, and I thought, what a time that was. And so, you know, it was actually that decision of post-COVID of what were we gonna do? What were we gonna? We weren't wearing those things anymore. And so, how could I rock my new style? And so, I just wanted to, I want people to be seen, feel seen, heard. And there's just so many things that we could really champion for women and other marginalized groups. And I just started doing that and I just heard from so many people what it meant to

• 38:20Speaker 06

  them. And so, we've continued that.

• 38:22Speaker 05

  No, it really is, I mean, it's kind of like your signature now and it seems like such a small thing, but it's really not. It's taking the opportunity every time to say like, I'm gonna wear this orange shirt because, you know, we care about gun violence. Or, I'm gonna wear a shirt about abortion rights, or Black Lives Matter, or whatever it is. Or you're wearing your players, like you're supporting your players. Do you feel, I mean, Minneapolis has such a long history of protest, I mean righteous protest. Renee Good, Alex Preddy, victims of ICE this year. It's just like, it feels like it's always the first place that it really pops off.

• 39:04Speaker 05

  Do you feel like being in Minnesota so long, like, do you owe Minnesota something? Have you been shaped by it? Like, tell me about that relationship with the city in particular.

• 39:14Speaker 06

  Yeah, I mean, I think there's, you know, George Floyd, which was, you know, worldwide, you know, influence. I think that we've just been so good for each other. You know, the Twin Cities communities and Minnesota, and they've let me be me, hopefully I've let them be them. And like, together, we've been really, really good. And I feel, you know, you mentioned the ICE protest, and I feel so proud to be a part of the community. And one of the decisions I made when I was hired to be the Minnesota Lynx head coach was, I was, I wanted to live in Minnesota. That was at a time when coaches were living somewhere else for six months and then coming into market, you know, or flying in occasionally.

• 39:57Speaker 06

  And it was a really conscious decision that we wanted to be a part of the community. Best decision that I made, and obviously now raising, you know, a beautiful child into, you know, the community and what he's learned and how he's been impacted. So incredibly proud of how we show up for each other. And it was on full display worldwide in what Minnesota did to support. And so, I get energized and I feel empowered by living in the community.

• 40:27Speaker 05

  No, it's a really special, I mean, Prince, like, performing at one of your guys' afterparties after you won the championship is just fucking iconic.

• 40:35Speaker 06

  Incredible, yeah, incredible.

• 40:37Speaker 05

  Iconic. I wanna transition a little bit to your upbringing. You're from Jazzy.

• 40:43Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 40:44Speaker 05

  Is that a decent accent in Jersey?

• 40:45Speaker 06

  South Jersey, Jersey.

• 40:46Speaker 05

  Yeah, Jersey.

• 40:47Speaker 06

  That's south Jersey, you know.

• 40:48Speaker 05

  I mean, first and foremost, do you hate pumping your own gas?

• 40:51Speaker 06

  Uh, yeah, you know, that's actually, it's, did you guys know what she's talking about? Yeah.

• 40:57Speaker 05

  I feel like I half know what I'm talking about. Shout out to my producer Courtney. I'm like, she's like, you have to ask this question, it's really funny and...

• 41:05Speaker 06

  It's annoying when you go somewhere, right? You go, you know, when you, when you just roll up and you put your window down and hand the card, right? In Jersey. And man, when you come to Minnesota in the winter, and I'm like, God, I wish I was in Jersey right now. Uh, when I pump the gas, it's like the, probably the only time that I kind of have that moment of like, I wonder how we could get this, you know?

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• 43:15Speaker 05

  I always say that little Megan had lots of wisdom. She was wild, but she had lots of wisdom. I wanna talk about little Cheryl for a bit. What do you remember of like, how you saw the world at that time? Like, what are you saying, your mom was always asking this question of you. You were born in Nebraska, but raised in New Jersey, not far from Philly. LeBron's going to Philly, if people are interested in that. I don't know.

• 43:53Speaker 06

  Oh, he was supposed to be a Timber Wolf.

• 43:54Speaker 05

  Yeah, tough, tough. What do you remember about that little girl and how you saw the world way back then?

• 44:01Speaker 06

  Uh, I just remember loving sports. I started at a young age. Softball was my first love. I was actually, you know, pretty decent in that sport. And I remember playing with the boys. So it was interesting that, you know, girls can play boys' sports at that time because we didn't have, you know, we didn't have the opportunity to have our own teams. And so, I didn't think anything of it, I just wanted to play. I had two brothers, one older, one younger. We were always doing something, playing 500 in the backyard, you know, baseball, emulating Chuck Foreman. You know, it was kind of wild that I end up, you know, being in Minnesota when the Vikings were, you know, a team that I really loved.

• 44:43Speaker 06

  Mostly, it was the helmet, the purple and that little yellow thing. But then I became to love, you know, some of the, some of the players. And I just always wanted to, you know, be in sports and play. I don't remember, you know, obviously, the things that you learn when you're older, how the real, how the world really works. I don't remember being aware. I remember my dad, I don't know if it was intentional, I'm still, you know, trying to figure that out, whether he was being intentional to empower his daughter, or if this was just him being him. But he treated me the same as my brothers. I was right there with him when he was working on home improvement projects. He was very much a DIY guy. We didn't have a lot of money, so he did everything.

• 45:26Speaker 06

  I was right there with him and I don't remember, I don't remember much. I remember, you know, a little bit further in life, you know, when you start to, you know, like, learn about who you are and your sexuality and things like that. Then I realized that I knew when I was younger, younger. But that really wasn't necessarily what you did, right? So there's just so much, and it was high school, you know, you went through, kind of learning who you are and kind of going, I don't really know what this means, I don't really care, I'm just me. I still to this day haven't come out anywhere. But it's, isn't it obvious? I always was like, you know, I mean, it's obvious, right?

• 46:10Speaker 06

  Well, you know, my dad actually asked me one time, I was 16, and I had gotten maybe a note from a friend that maybe we were feeling a little extra, whatever. It was a very long note and I must've left it out and dad found it. And it was a come back to the bedroom kind of conversation and, you know, and he asked me, it was just him, you know, my mom wasn't there. And they said, my dad said, Cheryl, are you a lesbian? And I remember the word at that time, I was like, God, no! Not a lesbian!

• 46:47Speaker 06

  I was more a dyke than I was a lesbian, right? At that age. I was.

• 46:54Speaker 05

  Lesbian dad, grow up.

• 46:55Speaker 06

  I was.

• 46:56Speaker 05

  I'm a dyke.

• 46:57Speaker 06

  But I was going through, you know, I was in high school and I tell my, I tell my son this because this upsets him, but I tell him it's okay. We were, I was changing classes or I was in between, like it wasn't a change of class. It was just a couple of people in the hallway and, and I remember walking down the hall and from a distance I hear someone yell, "Dyke!" Down the hall and it really hurt my feelings, you know, and I thought like, well, my gosh, like what's, like what's, like, why are we doing this? Years later, I found out, right, it was a teammate and you know what I'm about to say? They're a dyke.

• 47:35Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 47:36Speaker 06

  Right? They were, they, they were the one. And so that's my, that was like my journey and I always was able to, you know, sort of live my, like my truth. And even maybe when it wasn't supported in my, in my upbringing, it wasn't, you know, like, hey, we, we love you no matter what. It wasn't necessarily that. I just, it was just, that's who she is, like, but don't tell anybody, don't tell anybody else, you know, don't, let's not tell the family, you know, that sort of thing. But I've always been, fortunately, what I now know unapologetically myself, and I don't know where that came from, but I'm very thankful that's who I've been.

• 48:16Speaker 05

  Did you have a, like a come to Jesus moment in, in coaching where, I mean, I think it's like no secret in the WNBA, they really tried to push this like femme, kind of like feminine, straight vibe. I think they tried to push it on players and coaches. Like, when did you become comfortable where you're just like, I'm the motherfucker who throws the jacket on the floor and is like, not ladylike, you know? It's so coded, but you really are one of the, the most prominent and like first, maybe it was Bill Lamber, you know? He's more like a lesbian than we think. I don't know. But that moment where you're just like, you know what, like, I'm gonna just, I'm just

• 49:01Speaker 05

  gonna be me in this.

• 49:03Speaker 06

  Well, I, and I've said this recently, as I've reflected more on my career in the WNBA, I was coming out of college coaching and college coaching in the nineties, you know, was absolutely brutal for those of us that knew who we were. You couldn't really be out, which was just all really silly. It's still silly, anybody that is, it's just, it's unfortunate, but that's what it was at that time. Societal norms, that's, that's what we were dealing with at that time. And then there was all the code of, you know, like used against you in recruiting, you know, family atmosphere was the thing in the nineties.

• 49:41Speaker 06

  And then I, and Donovan giving me the opportunity to coach in the WNBA in 2001, you know, I don't know if you guys heard the story, but she offered me $5,000 to be an assistant coach and I was absolutely.

• 49:56Speaker 05

  Like total?

• 49:57Speaker 06

  In total. That was my salary. She's like, Cheryl, I don't have much, you know, my full-time position is filled and this is what I have. And it was $5,000 and, you know, my, my family, I had, I had two degrees and I have an older brother who was, you know, very logical, you know, for him is like, everything is planned and, and he was kind of like, you know, you do have two degrees, you know, and, and, but I was like, I really wanted it and I never thought twice about it and, and did it. And the WNBA has been so home for me and that ability, when I got to the WNBA, what was most striking to me is that you could be yourself. I could be myself because I wasn't a player and I wasn't forward-facing.

• 50:41Speaker 06

  And the time that Megan is speaking to is when we were, you know, opportunities for commercials and promoting the league and go back and look at those photos of Sue and Diana and they look.

• 50:57Speaker 05

  Tough.

• 50:58Speaker 06

  Maybe Diana more like in drag, but, you know, it was like, it's not who they are, right? And you can kind of see it, it's like, what are we doing? You know, and they were still talking about changing the uniforms, right? So that they fit better, right? All this code, you know, stuff that we were dealing with. It's so exciting that the league, you know, now, now we have stud buds. I mean, come on, like now we have stud buds.

• 51:23Speaker 05

  And everyone loves it.

• 51:24Speaker 06

  And everyone loves it. And that's what I was gonna say, it was really cool. Societal norms have changed, right? Megan, you know, like you've been such a big part of, of pushing, you know, that forward and being ourselves is important and your bravery in, in your time as an athlete and being able to show that you can, you can, you can have both and that you, that you are valuable, you know, and, and it's, I think that, that when that floodgate opened and now we have a league that everyone is so authentically themselves and how beautiful it is, whether you are femme, girl, go ahead, right? Right? Whether you're.

• 51:59Speaker 05

  Shout out to the femme gays.

• 52:00Speaker 06

  Yeah. I mean, like femme gays, all the things.

• 52:03Speaker 05

  That's our five babies.

• 52:04Speaker 06

  You know, and so it's such an incredible time. And so to see it go from where it was in 2001 to where it is in 2026 makes me really, really proud. Yeah.

• 52:13Speaker 05

  Yeah. Yeah. You've, you've seen the span of it. Was there ever a moment where you're just like, what am I doing? This is, like, I feel like for the early builders of leagues, whether it's players or coaches, like, I feel like there always just comes that moment where you're like, yeah, I've got two degrees and I'm making $5. Like, this is, this is tough. Like, was there, did you ever doubt that moment or like, you just knew, I'm in the W and this is where I'm supposed to be?

• 52:44Speaker 06

  Well, not until 2003. So 2001, I was in Charlotte. And then 2002, well, we had a, we had a team that's, that picked up in the middle of the night and left, the Charlotte Hornets left, right? And left the WNBA team behind. And so we lost the team. And then, so it was after 2002. So 2003, I go to Cleveland, the Cleveland Rockers with Dan Hughes at the end of that season. So LeBron James was coming in to the NBA and Gordon Gunn was the owner of the Cleveland Cavaliers and Rockers at that time. And he wanted to sell the team and so therefore that meant, and I still don't understand,

• 53:29Speaker 06

  it meant getting the books in order. And so that meant getting rid of the WNBA team first and then they could then sell the, you know, sell the, the NBA franchise. And so in 2003, when that happened, and that was the second, second team, you know, sort of in short order, and I remember kind of going, all right, this is, this is kind of rough. And every year it was, is the league gonna be here? Not just the team that I'm working for, but is the league gonna be here? And when I was in Charlotte, not only, you know, was it sort of, you know, difficult in terms of support from the NBA franchise, but it went so far as you couldn't be in the facility, the practice facility at the same time as the NBA team. So just marginalized to the nth degree.

• 54:13Speaker 06

  And it just, you know, felt kind of, you know, it was demoralizing at times and, and it could be hard to believe in. But in 2003, when we lost the Cleveland Rockers, I remember having a conversation with my older brother, kind of going, okay, here we are again. I'll be collecting unemployment for a little while. And, and that's what we did, you know, in the WNBA, you lost a team, collect unemployment for a little while, get your next job. You don't know what's next. And I remember kind of feeling like, I didn't want to keep calling, you know, sort of with the same concerns. It was like, I wanted to be the last call. It's kind of like when, you know, you guys are hearing out one of your good friends who's in a relationship that keep, they keep calling you and telling you the things and

• 54:56Speaker 06

  you're like, well, yeah, maybe, maybe you should do something different or, you know, it was kind of like that. I didn't want to be the one that kept calling my brother saying, geez, here I am again. And so I remember kind of going, this is a crossroads. And I had, it's, it's, it's still very, you know, vivid for me and I feel it that I love the WNBA. And I thought, if it's going down, I'm going down with it. And I'm so glad that I had that, that moment. And I had my brother going, Jesus Christ, Cheryl, you know, can you go coach college again or something, you know? And so, and my dad for many years, you know, wondered aloud when I was gonna get a real

• 55:39Speaker 06

  job, you know, because it was like this summer, I'd be away for six months, come home for six months and my relationships that would be strained by it. He's like, what are you doing, you know? And, you know, he, he passed in 2008, so we never really kind of got to see this real job worked out, you know, you know, pretty good for us.

• 55:56Speaker 05

  Oh, well, he would be incredibly proud and it is an incredible time for the W and certainly different from when you first started. You've had some all-time quotes over the course of your career. Like truly all-timers. I'm gonna read you some of these quotes, just in a little rapid fire section and you're just gonna tell me if you would change anything.

• 56:23Speaker 05

  Or not, which I'm guessing I'm gonna get some more nots.

• 56:27Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 56:29Speaker 05

  We should've done it for the gays.

• 56:31Speaker 06

  I would absolutely not change a thing.

• 56:35Speaker 06

  What was funny, well, go ahead, yeah, go ahead. What was funny was, that was my attempt, I don't handle losses very well. And, you know, we lost, and I have been, I've been really, really focused on trying to be more graceful after losses and not-

• 56:54Speaker 05

  How's that going?

• 56:55Speaker 06

  Really good, I did that.

• 56:56Speaker 05

  Oh, better, okay.

• 56:57Speaker 06

  That was my one liner, that was my attempt at levity, bringing levity to the situation. And I really didn't think much about it when I said it, because when you're in media sessions, I'm with media people that I see all the time, I still haven't grasped the viral nature of maybe that something like that could, you know, could happen, so, yeah, I don't have any regrets.

• 57:18Speaker 05

  And then, like, I think it was two days later, you said, "We got our lick back for the gays."

• 57:24Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 57:24Speaker 05

  So you did bring it back.

• 57:25Speaker 06

  I did, I did, conflating a couple of things there, I guess, but...

• 57:32Speaker 05

  Moving on, passing Mike Tebow for all-time wins in the WNBA.

• 57:38Speaker 05

  Sorry, Mike, we've had a lot of great battles.

• 57:43Speaker 06

  Well, same thing, it was very genuine, very genuine.

• 57:46Speaker 05

  You're like, "We have, and I won most of them."

• 57:48Speaker 06

  Yeah. No, I mean, he was, he was such a big part of my career and our relationship through the years, and learned a lot from Mike, and he was such a supporter of mine, and so, I don't know, what else do you say? I mean, like, he was happy for me, and I said, "I'll be happy for the next person."

• 58:05Speaker 05

  I love that. I do always appreciate your willingness and ability, really, to mostly keep up with the times. Quote, "I ate all the way down."

• 58:19Speaker 05

  All-timer.

• 58:20Speaker 06

  Oh, Lord.

• 58:22Speaker 05

  You're with it, you're what the kids call with it.

• 58:24Speaker 06

  I was with it. Yeah, I mean, I've had, you know, whether it's, Oliver didn't teach me that, "I ate all the way down," he gets embarrassed sometimes, he's like, "Mom, oh God, Mom." But he had learned about the "clock it" thing with Oliver, you know, "Clock it, clock that tea."

• 58:38Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 58:39Speaker 06

  Right?

• 58:40Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 58:40Speaker 06

  So, so he's taught me a lot, which I really appreciate, he helps keep me current.

• 58:44Speaker 05

  He's being raised by the W also, so-

• 58:45Speaker 06

  Yes, he is, yes, he is.

• 58:47Speaker 05

  He'll be a good man.

• 58:48Speaker 06

  Yes, he is.

• 58:49Speaker 05

  Okay, I'm gonna try out a new segment game thing. We're gonna see how it goes. It's called "Mommy Daddy Baby."

• 59:00Speaker 05

  Forgive me, but we're just gonna be sticking strictly to hetero-normativity for the sake of the game, you guys will get it.

• 59:09Speaker 05

  What percentage of the below makes up Cheryl? And I'm gonna give the definitions of each. Mommy is like emotional caretaker, mental load carrier, nurture, like, she's doing it all. Daddy, protector, enforcer, self-insured, carrying heavy things. Like, what's he actually doing, though? You know, like, sometimes you're like, "What's going on?" And then baby, baby's just carefree, pampered, not lifting a finger, having an absolute ball. I'm 40% daddy, 40% baby, sometimes 90, and 20% mommy.

• 59:47Speaker 05

  So, you know, I'm like, wow, really, really baby daddy is, is where I'm at to give reference.

• 59:57Speaker 06

  What was mommy again?

• 59:59Speaker 05

  Mommy is emotional caretaker, mental load carrier, nurture, like, she's, she's doing it all. She's got the ticker in her head.

• 1:00:07Speaker 06

  My wife is here, so I'm kinda looking, what's the answer?

• 1:00:13Speaker 06

  I think baby, like, zero.

• 1:00:17Speaker 06

  Yeah, well, no, Carly's saying no, but it's not the right answer, maybe 10?

• 1:00:21Speaker 05

  Little bit baby?

• 1:00:22Speaker 06

  Maybe 30, 60, 90, or 30, 60, 10?

• 1:00:25Speaker 05

  30, 60, 10, 30% baby, 60% daddy.

• 1:00:28Speaker 06

  No, no, 30 mommy.

• 1:00:29Speaker 05

  30 mommy.

• 1:00:30Speaker 06

  60, no, Carly, that's the wrong answer, oh God, this is so hard. This is so hard. Who am I?

• 1:00:40Speaker 05

  It is a funny, you're definitely some daddy.

• 1:00:42Speaker 06

  I am some daddy, I'm some daddy.

• 1:00:43Speaker 05

  Daddy's gotta be 60.

• 1:00:44Speaker 06

  Yeah, that's what I was thinking, 60, yeah, that's why I went with the 30.

• 1:00:47Speaker 05

  30 mommy, 10 baby.

• 1:00:49Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:00:50Speaker 05

  Okay, nice. You gotta get that baby up.

• 1:00:52Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:00:53Speaker 05

  Yeah. Everybody's gotta get the baby up. I feel like the baby's the best part of it. I'm like, "Well, I'm just here."

• 1:01:01Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:01:04Speaker 05

  Okay, one final question, who should I ask "Why are you like this" to next?

• 1:01:11Speaker 06

  Oh, wow, "Why are you like this" next? Well, I need some time on that one, jeez.

• 1:01:18Speaker 06

  Anybody, want to help, phone a friend?

• 1:01:20Speaker 05

  Yeah, maybe Courtney.

• 1:01:22Speaker 06

  Who?

• 1:01:23Speaker 05

  Courtney might be a good one.

• 1:01:24Speaker 06

  That's, she's actually really-

• 1:01:26Speaker 05

  Or Liv, Olivia might be a good one, "Living in my house."

• 1:01:28Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah, those are good ones, you know, in my, in my orbit.

• 1:01:34Speaker 06

  Courtney's really an interesting one.

• 1:01:36Speaker 05

  Yeah. I would love to know, I would love to know why she's like this.

• 1:01:40Speaker 06

  Hey, and when, if you, if you choose to go that route, back here, you need to have the picture of her in high school, actually, even her, her, when she was drafted, like, it's gonna be very confusing.

• 1:01:54Speaker 06

  Very confusing. She did not know who she was at that age.

• 1:01:59Speaker 05

  We've all been there, and they are tough pullback photos, indeed. Cheryl, thank you so much for joining me.

• 1:02:07Speaker 06

  Thank you, Megan, thank you, thank you, guys.

• 1:02:08Speaker 05

  Thank you, everyone, for being here. Don't forget to listen to "Why are you like this?" Thank you, everybody, for coming, appreciate it.

• 1:02:19Speaker 05

  That's it for this episode, everybody. Our show is produced by Nishat Kurwa, Art Chung, Courtney Stith, Christine Williams, Brandon McFarland, Mackenzie Fitzpatrick, and Jessica Dolan. "Why are you like this?" is produced in partnership with Vox Media.

• 1:02:35Kara Swisher?

  Thanks for listening to this special episode of "Why are you like this?" with Megan Rapinoe. We'll be back with a new episode of "On with Kara Swisher" on Monday.

• 1:02:47Speaker 01

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