Helping An Artist Scale His Business | Ep 817

Want to scale your business? Click here. Welcome to The Game w/ Alex Hormozi, hosted by entrepreneur, founder, investor, author, public speaker, and content creator Alex Hormozi. On this podcast you’ll hear how to get more customers, make more profit per customer, how to keep them longer, and the many failures and lessons Alex has learned and will learn on his path from $100M to $1B in net worth. Follow Alex Hormozi’s Socials: LinkedIn | Instagram | Facebook | YouTube | Twitter | Acquisition

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Alex Hormozi?

  Right now, I think you could very well go from four out of the 150 to like 20. Like, that's a 5X. You've got a triple sitting on the $29 to 5K that you're not talking to the other seven people every week who've already paid you. So you got a triple there. So putting those together, it's a 15X from where you're at. So that's your 100K per month. Like, we can do that. You can do that right now.

• 0:21Speaker 01

  Hey, how's it going? Thanks for having me here. I really appreciate it.

• 0:25Alex Hormozi?

  Pleasure's mine. I'm coming in completely, uh, unknowledgeable and ignorant. So it's, we're going to derive these solutions in real time together. I know Kirby is a admin on your community, so we actually get a little bit more stats that we can pull up on the screen, which I think will be fun. Um, with that being said, give everybody the 60 seconds. What's the community about? Um, so let's just start that. What's the community about?

• 0:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely. Um, so, uh, the whole community is about teaching people to paint. So a lot of them are, um, uh, artists, as in they paint like landscapes. That's, that's a thing that I like to do.

• 1:05Alex Hormozi?

  Cool.

• 1:06Speaker 01

  I've, I've been one, yeah, you know, been doing that on and off my whole life. But anyway, um, it's to help people improve their paintings. So you could be a complete beginner or we've got a lot of experienced painters, but they've just, they've just hit roadblocks with their painting. And, and this is exactly what happened to me many years ago until I got a mentor. So the aim of the group is to just help people to improve their painting so that they can start selling and making money from their art.

• 1:32Alex Hormozi?

  Okay.

• 1:32Speaker 01

  I've got three communities in total. So we've got the free community. Um, I've got a high ticket, um, art mentorship program, which is like a, an art accelerator. And then we've got the art school as well, which is the, uh, the monthly low ticket group. Um, I do a live painting class there every week and plus there's loads of, uh, painting tutorials.

• 1:56Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. What's the high ticket? What's the price?

• 1:59Speaker 01

  Well, it all didn't. There's not really so much of a set price. It depends on.

• 2:04Alex Hormozi?

  What you feel like?

• 2:05Speaker 01

  Well, no, not what I feel like. It's, it depends on how long you want to work with me for. I recommend people like work with me for a year and I charge around $5,000 US for that. So, so we not only, we not only help them with, we do a lot of painting. So it's like two painting classes a week and then.

• 2:23Alex Hormozi?

  They get one on one?

• 2:24Speaker 01

  Yep, they get one on one with me as well. And a lot of the people in there, they, they, some of them just want to improve their painting skills and nothing else, but some of them want to actually like make, want to be able to make a career out of their painting. So we also help them with, you know, building an audience on social media.

• 2:43Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah. At your price point of $5,000, if someone were to tell me, hey, you want to learn how to paint and it was $5,000 and you work with a guy for a year, that seems like a reasonable price. That doesn't seem like a, like, I know you have the element, some people want to paint so they can also sell their paintings. I understand that, but big picture, I don't think, it doesn't sound like that's the primary hook. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

• 3:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, probably.

• 3:07Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, so the $29 a month community, that's for people getting in either learning to paint or, you know, trying to advance in their painting. For everyone listening, 29 bucks is the middle, $5,000 a year is the top and free is the bottom. Okay. So what's the delivery look like at like small, medium, large? So what does it look like for free? Just keep it as tight as you can. So I want to dive in.

• 3:28Speaker 01

  So the free community, you're getting some painting tutorial videos and videos. So they're longer than what you would get on YouTube. So I've got a YouTube channel as well.

• 3:37Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, I'm going to get into the advertising side in a second, but just tell me, so you have, you have free tutorials. What else are you doing there?

• 3:43Speaker 01

  They, they, they basically get a catalog of full painting tutorial.

• 3:47Alex Hormozi?

  That's fine. That's fine. Okay, 29 bucks. What do I get?

• 3:51Speaker 01

  You get even more full painting tutorials.

• 3:54Alex Hormozi?

  Even more.

• 3:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:58Speaker 01

  But you get a live weekly painting class and the painting class, I've been running it as as courses. So like eight to 10 week courses. So you could be a complete.

• 4:08Alex Hormozi?

  Upload them as modules that continue to add to it. Is that correct?

• 4:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. So it's like I'm making the courses like live on zoom and then adding them afterwards. But you could be a complete beginner, having never painted in your life. So just attending one of my courses and already having a load of knowledge by the end of it and being able to make a start, like a really good start with a solid foundation in your painting journey.

• 4:31Alex Hormozi?

  And then, and then the $5,000, they get one, how many one on ones do they get with you?

• 4:37Speaker 01

  I haven't, I haven't set the number on one on ones. It's just been as and when people need help. So we do two painting classes a week. So it's a lot more intensive. But I, what I've found over the last year of doing this is there'll be periods of time where people might need a lot of help and I might have to do like a few one on one calls with them. And then there'll be times where, you know, they, they won't need any help at that time. So I don't have a set number on the actual one on ones for me. And at this stage where I'm at, I kind of don't want to say, oh, you know, you can only have this amount of one on ones. I want, I'm trying to sort of tailor that side of it to what that particular client needs, if you see what I mean. And everyone's completely different as, especially

• 5:22Speaker 01

  as I'm finding.

• 5:23Alex Hormozi?

  I understand. So you do it on demand or as an escalation, right? They have an issue that you escalate them. That's fine.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I mean.

• 5:31Alex Hormozi?

  I'm gonna say it back to you. So free group gets, so your YouTube is short videos. Your free group has long tutorials. Your $29 has more long tutorials plus one live class a week with lots of people on it. And then for five, the $5,000, they get two classes a week, which significantly fewer people on it. And I'm guessing you're teaching cooler stuff. I don't know. And then if they need help, you hop on with them one on one?

• 5:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

• 5:58Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. And how are you selling? How are you selling people from 29 to 5K?

• 6:02Speaker 01

  So what we do is, is I've got a few ways of gathering leads. So I give away a freebie on my YouTube channel, on my website and Instagram.

• 6:13Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  And then we get them into the free community of

• 6:16Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 6:17Speaker 01

  And then we get conversations going in the DM. So I've actually now got someone doing setting for me. So I was doing it myself before. And then the aim is to get them on a discovery call. And then we see if they're a good fit. If, if they're not a good fit, or they, we find out they probably don't have the funds at that point in time, then we, we try and sell them on the art school.

• 6:43Alex Hormozi?

  The $29.

• 6:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, the $29. Yep. And then if, if they, if they are a good fit, then they'll get them on a, a sales call with me. And then I see if they would like to join the, uh, yeah, the art mentorship program, which is the painter's mastermind. So the painter's mastermind, it's their own private school group.

• 7:01Alex Hormozi?

  Heard. Right now YouTube is your primary source of advertising?

• 7:05Speaker 01

  Yep. Followed by my website.

• 7:08Alex Hormozi?

  So, so YouTube goes to website? Or YouTube goes to community?

• 7:14Speaker 01

  YouTube goes to the sales landing page. So they all get, they all go to the same landing page, which we fill on system.io.

• 7:23Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. So you, you have a little opt-in page, copy my blueprint for painting success. Cool. Then you have an image, get instant access to the blueprint for free. Got it. Value it $97. I plan to start charging for it soon. Okay. If you're curious from a compliance perspective, adding a value where it's not justified, isn't compliant, just as a side note, you could say like, I just, I like, it's free for now. I'm planning on charging for soon. And it probably will, it will probably do the same on a conversion basis, but would probably be more compliant, just as a side note. So then we put, is it name and then email. Okay. Get instant access. All of this I like. If I were to run a split test on this, I would add in three benefit-driven bullets and, and test it. And I would put them below the button.

• 8:06Alex Hormozi?

  And I would, I would see how that does because oftentimes like I've just like you, you've got, you've got your 80%, 90% on that. Like it's a pretty clean page. It's pretty straightforward. I would just test that one as just like an easy lift. Do you know what your conversion on that page is? While you look, confirm with me the rest of the journey. So YouTube goes to, or YouTube goes to the lander, lander, they opt in. Then I'm guessing you thank you, you know, thank you page, join the community and you email them to join the free, free community. Is that correct?

• 8:32Speaker 01

  Yep, that's right. And then also we get them into an email sequence. So I've, I've, I have a COO helping me. He's also called Sam. And yeah, so he's, he's created a, like an email sequence. So I think we've got like about a hundred, like a hundred emails. So we, we, we basically got a load of my old emails because I always tried to send out value a lot of the time. So we're able to like repurpose those.

• 9:02Alex Hormozi?

  How big's the list?

• 9:03Speaker 01

  It's well over 9,000 emails.

• 9:07Alex Hormozi?

  9K on the list. Great. Love that. All right. So YouTube, lander, follow up and thank you page goes to free group. Great. When they join the free group, they fill out some sort of mini app. That's what you're saying. And then your guys hop on the phone with them and see if they're qualified. Does that sound right so far?

• 9:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Through the, through the message in the, in the DMs. Yeah.

• 9:27Alex Hormozi?

  Okay. So they go DM to phone. Got it. And then basically they have an AB path, right? So path A, if you're qualified, you can talk to Sam. And if you're unqualified, are you trying to sell them into the annual for the $29 a month one?

• 9:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, I try and do that. Yeah.

• 9:43Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, good. Cause if you start with the five, you can down sell the, the, the 500 or whatever, 29 times, whatever that at 460 or whatever it is. That I think would probably, that probably anchors really well. And just say like, you're just not going to get the one-on-one component, but you're going to get all these other things. And I think that's actually fairly compelling. Like if I wanted to make the 460 my primary offer, I would probably present it the same way you are. Because basically the $5,000 just becomes like, if you're a whale and you wanna, you really wanna ball out and you wanna have the personalized attention. You know, you could pay the $5,000, but the, but it's basically like the 460 is the core offer.

• 10:20Alex Hormozi?

  Do you know what percentages go into each bucket of the people that you, that your team talks to?

• 10:25Speaker 01

  I don't actually.

• 10:27Alex Hormozi?

  Worth, worth knowing, but okay, that's fine. So, and, and you've got, uh, was it like 300 ish in the, in the $29?

• 10:35Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, there's, there's a lot of people in there that have, uh, that they did a one-time payment to start with. So when I started the, yeah, when I started the school group, which was, oh, yeah, it was in 2023, actually.

• 10:50Alex Hormozi?

  Cool.

• 10:51Speaker 01

  At the time I was, I was completely broke and I moved over from Patreon and I sold a lot of like, uh, one-time, you know, lifetime access. So it got me back on my feet and, and it led me to where I am today. So.

• 11:04Alex Hormozi?

  I love it. I love it. You're good. Now that I have a good lay of the land, what's the goal? What do you want to do?

• 11:11Speaker 01

  My, well, my goal is to, uh, to carry on inspiring people to learn how to paint. Uh, what I'd like to be able to do with, with the, with the whole, what I'm doing now, the whole community, the school groups and everything is, is I'd like to be able to sort of, uh, build out a team, but I would like to also pivot in the long run to helping more artists to be able to make a living online from their art. And obviously like helping them to improve their painting is, is part of it. One of the things I feel like I am qualified to do is to, you know, like help people like build an audience, uh, make like digital products from their art. Like I've sold painting tutorial videos as downloads from my website and,

• 11:53Speaker 01

  yeah, ebooks and stuff. And then, and also like be able to show people how they could create their own like community, their school, own school community where they can have a like a monthly membership.

• 12:04Alex Hormozi?

  That sounds like a totally different business.

• 12:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:08Alex Hormozi?

  So you have three communities and you teach people how to paint. So rather than teaching people how to teach people how to paint, I think sticking with teaching people how to paint for now is probably the right strategic move. So.

• 12:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. At the moment. Yeah, definitely.

• 12:21Alex Hormozi?

  That being said, what's the goal with this business? Numbers are helpful because you're already making an impact. So I can't change anything about that. So what?

• 12:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:30Alex Hormozi?

  Basically you've got 20 people in your $5,000 things. That's a hundred thousand dollars a year and you've got 300 ish people at $29 a month. I know some of them are grandfather from, from Patreon or whatever, from the one-time payment. Let's say half of those are, are new. Would you say that's fair?

• 12:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

• 12:49Alex Hormozi?

  So you got 150 people paying 30 bucks a month, right? So you're looking at 4,500, $5,000 a month that comes in in recurring from the membership base?

• 12:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:00Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, got it. So you're basically...

• 13:03Speaker 01

  4,500, yeah.

• 13:04Alex Hormozi?

  Yes, you've got like 8K that comes in from the, from the, the top. I, I know it's because you're charging $5,000 at a time that it's lumpy. I get that, but averages 8K a month on the top and you're averaging like 4,500 per month on the bottom? All right.

• 13:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:19Alex Hormozi?

  So you're looking at...

• 13:19Speaker 01

  So do you mean...

• 13:20Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 13:20Speaker 01

  I was gonna say, do you mean in terms of financial figures, what are my goals?

• 13:24Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, or if you were like, I want to get to 1,000. I mean, any of those would be fine.

• 13:27Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, I mean, I have those goals, like, you know, I want to get, I want to get my, um, I want to get that low-ticket group. I want to get to like, you know, 10,000 subscribers or more. You know what? This is in some ways a bit, uh, I've been having to work a lot on my mindset in the last couple of years. Uh, and it's, it's something that I think has really helped, you know, that's, that's really been what's holding me back. But thinking in bigger numbers for me as well is, is still uncomfortable. But, uh, you know, is it wrong to say, you know, I'd like to be pulling in 100K a month or more?

• 14:02Alex Hormozi?

  There's nothing wrong with wanting to make more.

• 14:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. So.

• 14:08Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, but for now, you're doing 13, 14,000 a month-ish, somewhere in there.

• 14:12Speaker 01

  Between the two groups, yeah.

• 14:14Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, between the two.

• 14:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:15Alex Hormozi?

  Let's just say, you know, 30 is kind of like milestone one. It's a double, a double from where you're at. And then there's a triple from there that gets you to 100. So I think in doubles and triples oftentimes, just in terms of like, what do we need to do in order to have that happen? All right?

• 14:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:29Alex Hormozi?

  Because the thing is, is it's, it's rare that one thing will turn out. I mean, if you find it, that's awesome, but a lot of times like you'll get them from multiple doubles and triples. That's where like you get the big numbers. Now that I have an idea of, of what's happening, one of the data points that's really important here that's missing is understood, like what percentage of people go to the free group or the paid group? Um, and what close rates are on, on the phone for A or B?

• 14:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:54Alex Hormozi?

  Any of those metrics?

• 14:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't have solid metrics, but I spoke to my setter this morning. He reckons he's getting out of 15 people that he pitches a call to, only two are like actually jumping on a call. And one of the things he says he's noticed is that the artist kind of group is very different to say, like a democratic of like, you know, entrepreneurs, aspiring entrepreneurs. So they're probably a little bit harder to get on a call with just the nature of artists in a way.

• 15:28Alex Hormozi?

  I wouldn't, I wouldn't subscribe too much to that. I'll bet you there's a message thing just because like, you want to talk about, you know, beliefs, like that's probably not.

• 15:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, that's true.

• 15:38Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, that goes for everybody who's listening to this, like explaining why this isn't at you, Seb. Like for everybody, like explaining why your group doesn't make you money or doesn't want to buy your stuff. Like, not going to serve you. Okay.

• 15:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, I agree.

• 15:52Alex Hormozi?

  So 15 people join the free group. He DMs all of them. Now, is that when he gives you 15 turns into two calls, right?

• 16:03Speaker 01

  No, no. So it's, it's as no. So it would be way more that is. When, when the conversations got to the point of would it be helpful to jump on a call?

• 16:12Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 16:13Speaker 01

  Out of the 15 people that he gets to be able to like say that in the chat, only two, around two people are actually like jumping on a call, basically.

• 16:23Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. How many people joined to get to that? Like, I'm trying to get conversion metrics here. So like.

• 16:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I reckon we must be getting about at least 60 a week.

• 16:34Alex Hormozi?

  Okay.

• 16:35Speaker 01

  Let me just check my metrics.

• 16:36Alex Hormozi?

  You're good. 60 per week. And then how many, well, we can reverse engineer this. So if you're getting 60 a week.

• 16:44Speaker 01

  Oh no, actually more than that. So in the last week, we've had 151.

• 16:48Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, in the last week. Great.

• 16:50Speaker 01

  In the last week, yeah.

• 16:51Alex Hormozi?

  So let's just say 150 is the last seven days, fine, this 20 ish a day. And then he tries to start conversations with all of them, right? How many of them get to, like, I would, I would want to know how many respond because I don't know how many people respond, but.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:08Alex Hormozi?

  I would, I would want to know how many respond, how many get to the, basically the offer.

• 17:14Speaker 01

  I reckon at the moment, we're probably getting about two or three a week, but it's really, it's, it's, it's gone in waves, basically. We've had, we had one day where you had like five calls booked in a day. And we were like, right, let's see how we could do this so that we could do this every day. But then it's, it's really been.

• 17:32Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah. How much transparency do you have into like what he's doing? This guy, this setter, because right now he's kind of like the joke point of the business because you got 20, you know, 20 leads a day. Think about it like this. You got 20 leads a day that are coming in. And you're in per day, how many appointments would you, is like, how many appointments would you say happen per day?

• 17:54Speaker 01

  When you say employment, you mean messages that are sent?

• 17:57Alex Hormozi?

  No, people who, people who like, schedule a call.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  It really varies. You know, probably, probably about a couple. Maybe not, maybe not even that at the moment. I mean, he, he is new, but he is like all over it. If you say, I mean, he's, you know, actively messaging.

• 18:15Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 18:16Speaker 01

  So I, I believe totally in time, uh, that's, that number is going to go up.

• 18:20Alex Hormozi?

  Do you have any idea how many, how many calls per week? If that's easier?

• 18:23Speaker 01

  I reckon, I reckon he's probably getting about four a week at the moment.

• 18:28Alex Hormozi?

  Calls like that he's taking, he's like calls taken is four per week. Does that sound right?

• 18:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, just, yeah, as in actual discovery calls booked. Yeah.

• 18:36Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah. Okay. So here's the cool part. Like I'll always keep asking as I go through this because I'm looking for like big, big lifts. Uh, that's a big one because that means that right now you're getting 3% of the people who are coming for free uh, to get on a call. If I'm looking at kind of standards, you could probably get to 10% buying. And so there's a huge amount of lift there. So that's, that's a, that's, and of the four that get on the call, do you know what percentage buy?

• 19:03Speaker 01

  At least. At least one, at least one. Well, I mean, it depends because, because, um, so I'm, I'm doing the actual sales call. I mean, I, I closed someone last week for my high ticket, but then at the same time I also closed, uh, well, I mean, I sold someone on an annual membership as well. So they didn't buy the high ticket, but they bought an annual membership.

• 19:25Alex Hormozi?

  You had two sales last week, one high ticket, one annual on the, on the.

• 19:29Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I'm pretty sure I only had two sales calls as well.

• 19:32Alex Hormozi?

  Okay. So that was a little, even, even a little bit less, right? So when he's setting though, he's setting for you. So he's setting via DMs. He's not taking a call. You're taking the call and then you down sell, you basically sort them.

• 19:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So, yeah.

• 19:48Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. And so you closed a hundred percent last week. What would you say your normal close rate is?

• 19:54Speaker 01

  I reckon a good 25%.

• 19:56Alex Hormozi?

  Okay. And last week was just a good week though, because you closed a hundred percent last week.

• 20:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Like, like definitely if I, or when I get more calls.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  When I get more calls, I'll be able to get a lot more.

• 20:11Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah. So, okay. I'm going to bet that, like, I mean, there's a lot of things, like, I, I could, I could go, I could go into the advertising side. But the thing is, is that like, if I find a massive win, then I will probably just focus almost all my attention on that. So there's one huge one here and we'll get to it. But, okay, let me just, let me just quickly look at YouTube because that's where all your traffic's coming from. And then, uh, and then we'll go from there. So the vast majority of people are not buying the $29 thing on the page. So 366 members, can you look at conversions, uh, on that one for me?

• 20:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, sure. Yeah.

• 20:46Alex Hormozi?

  No, he's, he's pointing it out. Here we go.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  I, I've only been advertising the paid group in, in my free community and in my emails.

• 20:54Alex Hormozi?

  Got it. So you have, so you have eight signups in the paid community that happened this last week. And that just happened straight from people clicking from one to the other. Minus maybe the one, you sold one annual last week. So there's that. But besides that one, the other seven came just kind of organically ascending themselves.

• 21:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, from the yeah, from either email or the free community. I I haven't been advertising this group publicly on YouTube. I've just been advertising a freebie. So yeah, my conversion rate for last week was 2.69%.

• 21:27Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, I'm less concerned about that right now because the the traffic source is your free group. What are you doing to ascend people from the $29 group into the 5 5K?

• 21:38Speaker 01

  So when I'm on the call, I pitched the 5K one first and

• 21:42Alex Hormozi?

  So I'll ask the question. So you currently have people come to the free thing because that's what you push them to. Then your guy sorts them. And if he sets them, he sets a call for you, you anchor at five, then you if they say no, then you down sell annual. If they say no, then you down sell monthly. That's that's how it is right now. Got it. But last week into your $29 thing, just because you have this large community, the 3600 or whatever, and the free community, you got seven people who just went to the page and just chose to buy for $29.

• 22:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:12Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, what are you doing to talk to those seven people?

• 22:17Alex Hormozi?

  Hey, guys, real quick. This podcast only grows from word of mouth, quite literally. There's no other way to grow a podcast than word of mouth. If there's some element of this that you think somebody else should hear or be relevant to them, it would mean the world to me if you shared this via text, via Instagram, via DM, via whatever way you like to share stuff with people you love. Thank you.

• 22:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're right. I haven't been doing a lot. I do at the end of my painting class, ask if anyone wants art mentor. That's where I pitched the art mentorship program at the end of my my lives every week.

• 22:47Alex Hormozi?

  Your life class.

• 22:48Speaker 01

  I mean, now that you said that, I could be doing a lot more in my community.

• 22:52Alex Hormozi?

  We'll get there. We'll get there.

• 22:53Speaker 01

  There's actually a load of there's actually a load of those people that paid for the lifetime access that I could go and

• 22:59Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, we got some stuff. We got some stuff.

• 23:02Speaker 01

  I'm still learning here, man. This is like

• 23:05Alex Hormozi?

  Dude, you're doing great, man. Dude, you're you're an artist. This wasn't this wasn't the job. It's fine. That's

• 23:11Speaker 01

  No, it wasn't. I just I'd never imagined like if you'd have asked me 10 years ago when I when I first quit my job and I had no idea I was going to make it work. I had no idea I'd be doing this.

• 23:23Alex Hormozi?

  If it makes you feel better, I do this for a living. So don't worry about it. Okay, now let's go to the advertising and I'll bet you we can pick out some stuff there. And then, and then we'll go into the kind of the solutioning side. All right.

• 23:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, cool, man.

• 23:35Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, can you go videos? Yeah, you know how I'm gonna do. Okay, recent. Okay. Good. Well, you get some good views, man.

• 23:43Alex Hormozi?

  You get really good views relative to your subscribers. So that's good. So you're 56k subscribers, you're getting, it looks like, call it 10k video. It's really strong. Okay.

• 23:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:53Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, really good.

• 23:54Speaker 01

  I've been working on my, I've been working on my titles and thumbnails. I, yeah, you know, been getting help from like Haru and Kai, who've been helping me in my YouTube videos, so.

• 24:07Alex Hormozi?

  No, it's great.

• 24:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:10Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, let's, let's just click it. Okay, how to paint loose but realistic coastal scenes. All right, let's do it. So here's the, here's the good thing. You've got three, three things that are going well with the intro. We just need to add a couple. So you've got, you've got a promise, right? And you're actually hooked with paint. So if you're struggling with this thing, I'm going to show you this thing. So that was like, you had those first two. Little bit later, you got into like semi proof, I think. And I think we can tighten the proof part up, which I'll explain in a second. There isn't a roadmap. And so I think that's, that's, to me, that felt like the biggest thing that was missing. Because I'm looking at this video and it's however many minutes it was, but you know, decent length.

• 24:55Alex Hormozi?

  And as me trying to put my viewer hat on, I'm like, where am I going from here?

• 24:59Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 25:00Alex Hormozi?

  So I want to know kind of like what the road, like what the road stops are. And so I think it might be useful for you to, you know, maybe if you have like a fountain pen or something, because it's a little artistic or, you know, you'd know this better than me, but like, you have, you have your pain and your promise. Great. Proof, I would pull way forward, which is like, I help thousands of people paint every day. And, you know, I've been painting for 20 years. Like, you want to get it really tight. Like, I would practice it. So it's like, my name's Sam. I have helped over 2000 people paint their first painting. And I've helped people go from beginner to advanced. In this video, I'm going to cover six things about gouache, right?

• 25:39Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 25:40Alex Hormozi?

  And I wouldn't even mention the like, I normally painted oil because like, you don't want to discredit yourself, right? Like, and so we're going to cover number one, how to, how to frame the scene better. Number two, how to, how to hold the brush in a way for two different styles. Number three, you know what I'm, what I'm going at.

• 25:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 26:01Alex Hormozi?

  I think lead with that roadmap, I think will make a big difference in, in, in video retention. And you want that to all be covered within the first like 15 seconds.

• 26:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 26:11Alex Hormozi?

  We paused at 48.

• 26:13Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 26:13Alex Hormozi?

  And we want all of that to be covered in, in 10. I'm okay with the fact that you're showing that you're painting. I would love it if it flipped to you for a second though. I think that might be helpful just because also long-term, it's like, we want to build your brand. Right? And so I think that might be kind of worthwhile. On the thumbnails, you've been working with Kai and you know, Kai's good. Something I would consider is I, I would, I would consider having the like, learn to paint these. So like, think about it like this, the benefits that you have inside of a thumbnail are going to be something around risk. So like, stop messing up, right? Something around risk, something around speed, right? Like do it faster, do it in less time. Maybe these are taking forever, do it in less time or do it easier, right?

• 26:55Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 26:55Alex Hormozi?

  And so I would, I would experiment, I would experiment, just run one, see, see how, how it does comparatively. And you should be able to turn on, I think it's turned on on all YouTube, but there's an A B testing.

• 27:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I've just found out about that.

• 27:10Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah. So I would, I would split, I would split test no, no copy. Because they are paintings is what your, your current thumbnails are. So I would, the three kinds of concepts I would be looking at are pure plain painting. Number one, plain painting with three words or less in terms of the, the words on the screen. Cause you don't want to take too much away from the painting, but you want it to be clear. When you're actually reviewing your thumbnail, text it to yourself on your phone. Cause that's going to be how small it is. And so what happens is a lot of people who design thumbnails, design them on these big screens. But that's not how people can consume them. So you want to like, it's the easiest hack in the world. Just, just send yourself a text of the, of the icon. And then you'll actually see how few words you can really put there where people can read them.

• 27:54Alex Hormozi?

  And then the third concept that I would test is actually just a picture of your face like, like kind of maybe with a brush and then the paintings in the background. Because then again, that's going to get you like you more exposure long term rather than because this looks like a faceless YouTube channel.

• 28:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:11Alex Hormozi?

  Unless that was.

• 28:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, I know it's not at all. In fact, actually, my older videos had my face. I do like an intro and an outro and then, you know, I realized I was spending like two, three minutes doing an intro by which time everyone's clicked off. So yeah, if you go to my earliest videos.

• 28:28Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 28:28Speaker 01

  Even when my hair was long.

• 28:30Alex Hormozi?

  No, your hair was long. No, that's it's all good. Okay. So the so big picture, we need to double down on roadmap. You need to tighten up the the the time upfront. You need to know what your introduction is like you personally that you can frame for your proof. Ideally, ideally, you want the proof to be relevant to the thing you're talking about. So one is I've helped thousands of painters. That's kind of one level of proof. But if you're like, I've helped thousands of painters paint gouache and it's one of the things that I enjoy doing in my free time or something like that, then now I have more relevance to the proof. Right? We want it to be as relevant as possible. For example, just an idea is you could also think about like, have you sold? I'm sure you've sold paintings before, right?

• 29:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 29:09Alex Hormozi?

  I think even just saying like, and I've sold many paintings that are gouache, right? Because then it's like, not just, I'm not just like saying I'm good, like people have bought my paintings. And I think that that kind of helps kind of bridge that gap. Okay. That's YouTube stuff. Can you, Kirby, can you click in real quick to the video? Just I can look at the description. All right, cool. Let's see here. Free landscape painting blueprint. Okay.

• 29:32Speaker 01

  So yeah, so that's my call to action in the video.

• 29:35Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, okay. And do you do the do you integrate a CTA within the video?

• 29:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, yeah, what I do is usually about like halfway or three quarters through then then.

• 29:45Alex Hormozi?

  So I'll say this.

• 29:49Alex Hormozi?

  We've found first third is because you'll probably get twice as many people to see it.

• 29:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 29:55Alex Hormozi?

  Because you've seen YouTube, you know, retention curves kind of drop slowly.

• 29:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:59Alex Hormozi?

  You don't want to do it upfront because it's weird. You haven't done anything yet. But like at about a third, it's like you provided, you know, sufficient value that you can get. You can do, take 20 seconds and just be like, by the way, if you like this. And the key part is that you went with the CTA. You want, again, you want to integrate it to something relevant that you just talked about. Right?

• 30:16Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 30:16Alex Hormozi?

  No, it's not just like a commercial. You want to, you want to make it, basically, you don't want even to feel like a commercial. You want it to just be really natural. And inside the blueprint, what I would do, because you're showing the, the, the digital.

• 30:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:31Alex Hormozi?

  I would do is I would print the blueprint out. And I would flip to the page that, you know, corresponds to some technique or something that you're showing. And be like, so what I'm doing right here is actually on page 17 and show you opening and be like page 17 of this blueprint. And you guys can have it. It's free. You can just click below the link. You'll get way more people who will choose to opt in if you start doing your, integrating your CTAs like that. Kirby, let's go back to the.

• 30:57Speaker 01

  That's brilliant. Yeah, that's a brilliant idea.

• 31:00Alex Hormozi?

  All right, let's see here. Scroll down in this tutorial. I'll show you. So you do custom descriptions for each of them?

• 31:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm, I've been using AI. I've been using AI. Yeah, I've been using AI to come up with titles and hooks for my videos and descriptions as well.

• 31:17Alex Hormozi?

  I think you're, I think, I think you're, you're pretty, you're pretty, the rest of this stuff is, is whatever. You could do, you could have a pinned comment. Which you can do on every video and ideally you want to do it right after you post it. Because then you're, because if you're the creator, they're going to like yours the most and you can pin it. The reason I like pinned comments for YouTube CTAs is because if you change your descriptions in the future, which I'm a bit, I mass change all my descriptions at once. That's kind of how I do my stuff. So I feel like whatever I'm promoting, that's what's going to be in my description. But then the pinned comment won't change. So it's like, if you have stuff that's relevant to your video, I would just make it the pinned first comment. And then that way you can basically take the big wave of YouTube traffic and point it wherever you want. You know, when it's, when it's appropriate. Does that make sense?

• 31:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 32:00Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, next thing is, uh, there's a feature on.

• 32:05Alex Hormozi?

  On YouTube now, that two things. One is that there's in-video pop-ups that you can now put in. And so I would put your lead magnet as a product that after you show it, it just stays in the bottom left corner. So people can click it directly on the screen.

• 32:21Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 32:22Alex Hormozi?

  And then secondarily, you can incorporate products underneath, right?

• 32:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:26Alex Hormozi?

  And so I would, at the very least, do the first one is just have this have the blueprint.

• 32:32Speaker 01

  And just leave it there for the rest of the video.

• 32:35Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah.

• 32:36Speaker 01

  Okay, yeah.

• 32:37Alex Hormozi?

  I mean, it doesn't, YouTube's, I mean, YouTube takes care of their, their audience. Like it's kind of, it's tucked away to the bottom left.

• 32:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 32:44Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, let's go back to, let's go back to the, your landing page. The thing is, is do you have any metrics around this? You were pulling those up. So what are the metrics for this page?

• 32:55Speaker 01

  So for the free, yeah, the free landscape painting blueprint, in total, we've got 4,822 people from that.

• 33:04Alex Hormozi?

  Okay. Yeah, but what's the conversion rate?

• 33:08Speaker 01

  Oh, I think conversion into the, into the free community.

• 33:12Alex Hormozi?

  No, how, well, I mean, that would be great too, but like, how many clicks go to the page? How many of them opt in? How many of them go to the free community? Like, that's the funnel basically leading to your free community.

• 33:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay. That I'm honestly not sure of. I'm not quite sure how to find that out.

• 33:27Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, well, whatever the landing page software is, I promise you they have a conversion rate metric.

• 33:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:33Alex Hormozi?

  That you can find.

• 33:34Speaker 01

  I can see how many emails were opened and total clicks.

• 33:39Alex Hormozi?

  Okay.

• 33:40Speaker 01

  So it's like 65% and total clicks was 44%.

• 33:45Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, that's good. That's, that's fairly normal for like a welcome sequence. So you're not, you're not missing anything big there. I would want to know what the, what the conversion rate of the pages though, because that's where you're literally sending all your traffic there.

• 33:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 33:58Alex Hormozi?

  One of the other considerations I'd have for that landing page, I told you the three bullets underneath. One of the other things I would consider is split test that, because you have one image.

• 34:07Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 34:08Alex Hormozi?

  One thing I would do is show like, show one image, but show like four, like. Uh, two, two behind it and above, two behind it and below. So there's five images. So just show some of the, some of the techniques. It's like, open it up a little bit. You know what I mean? Rather than just the one image. And so I would test that out and my second alternate would be, uh, you. Like if people recognize you from the videos, did your first, like you will for sure. If you add your face to the page, you will increase conversions. If they're coming from you.

• 34:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 34:41Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, cool. All right. So that's, that's conversion stuff. And I think all of those things could, could measurably improve the amount of traffic that you're, that you're getting. So, so we did all the YouTube stuff. We did some, some tiny tweak stuff, but these are, these are kind of going to be the, the three, the three biggies. All right.

• 34:57Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 34:58Alex Hormozi?

  So big thing number one is, um, we have to improve your conversion on your free offer to call. All right. And I'm actually, I'm going to say, I'm going to say these in order of priority. All right. So priority number one is those seven people per week that are, that are signing on, that you're not talking to, uh, for $29 a month.

• 35:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:26Alex Hormozi?

  They should get an onboarding call for free, immediately included with that $29. So that's going to book you seven more sales calls a week. Right now you're taking like two. So like that can triple your business, like that.

• 35:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:40Alex Hormozi?

  And what we want to do is I'm sure you have some benefit for them subscribing to annual. Do they have some sort of bonus or thing that gets unlocked when they subscribe to annual?

• 35:49Speaker 01

  Yeah. Usually I've, I've been giving them a free coaching call with me, like free hour long coaching call.

• 35:55Alex Hormozi?

  Sure. So I would, I would take, so take that, right? And every one of those $29 people, I would offer one, two calls, whatever, in order for them to subscribe for the year. And I think, and if you wanted to, if you wanted to be crazy here, you give them a one month trial of your, of your high end.

• 36:16Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 36:17Alex Hormozi?

  If you want to make like, if we want to get these people, they already paid 29, they already took their wallet out and said, I want to learn more. And so you say, how much more do you want to learn? Do you want more, you know, more time with me? Cause here, think about like this, you're going to give them one or two calls, right? One on one. Each of those are basically sales opportunities. I said, like, you're not, you're not closing, but you're building trust, right?

• 36:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:37Alex Hormozi?

  If they also have the two live classes per week that are happening at the, at the 5,000 level, like they also have, like you're basically using up the, the high level one on ones figuratively, as using the two onboarding calls, sorry, the two follow-up calls as they just get a free month of that. Now, some of them might be like, well, shit, I want to keep doing this. In which case, then you can convert them in the back, down sell, you just get the annual. Cool. So that's still not, not a loss. Okay. So that's like immediate money. Number one, that can triple. So that could take you maybe from like, if none of the tweaks, if you didn't do any change in tweaks to the YouTube and all the stuff we just went over, if you just did that, that could take you to like 30 or 40.

• 37:20Alex Hormozi?

  Okay. That's just number one. All right. Number two, you're getting four out of 150 people who are joining the free thing to get on a call or less, right? So we have to fix that. So, yeah. So what we need is, um, I'm assuming that he doesn't have, like, we need to sell the call. Cause right now it just sounds like, how serious are you? Do you want to talk to Sam? That's what it sounds like. I could be wrong, but that's what it sounds like the script looks like. So, and given these kind of response rates, that's what I assume it is. We need to give something like you gave them a lead magnet, which was the blueprint to get them here. We got to give them something else to get on the call. So I think within the free community, what you can do is you can say, hey, when you hop on the call, we're going to unlock half of the stuff in the free

• 38:04Alex Hormozi?

  community. So half of it's locked, half of it's unlocked. And the reason we do that is because we want you, like, we want to show you the best place to start and make this a better experience, whatever. Now, you can bring that up to people after they say they're, they have, you know, they have a pulse and a credit card or whatever, right? They, like, they answer the first couple qualifying questions, then we say, cool. If you want to find out how to, how to unlock that, we can do that for you, right? And you can hop on a call. So that could take you from like four calls a week to like 20, like that, that could have a very big.

• 38:34Speaker 01

  So literally in the classroom, I'd have like a load of those modules, like totally locked, until they've got on the call and then you can manually unlock each person. Wow, I never even thought that's brilliant. So as I say, I'm still, I'm still new to all this.

• 38:50Alex Hormozi?

  Dude, you're doing great. You're doing great. Okay, so number one is the really easy one to do. That'll take you almost no time, which is you just, we start hitting the $29 people, try to send them. Those are going to be the highest likelihood, warmest people, because they were in your free thing for a while, elected on their own to sign up. That's great.

• 39:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:09Alex Hormozi?

  If we want to increase the likelihood that that happens, though, I would put a little, the first, the first module that you have in there, after you have your introduction, do a five video VSL, so video sales letter. So that basically part of their onboarding is to kind of go through, and the five video VSL, I've talked about in other stuff, but it's origin story. You had that mentor who taught you, like, that's a perfect story of like, you basically, you walk through the journey as though you were them, and then you say, now that I've been on the other side, I can show you what I found, right?

• 39:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, so this is for the $29 group, this one.

• 39:43Alex Hormozi?

  This is actually for free.

• 39:45Speaker 01

  Oh, on the free group, okay.

• 39:46Alex Hormozi?

  You can also do the same thing for the, for the $29 thing. So, because both of these are just going to be sales conversion things, that were, they're just forever salespeople sitting there, that some percentage of people are going to go there, and then that, that's video one. Video two, three, and four are going to be the, um, just basically the biggest obstacles that people struggle with for why they don't buy. But you're going to frame it as an educational thing. And then the fifth video is going to be basically an invitation to the next thing.

• 40:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:14Alex Hormozi?

  And you'll mention again, whatever free stuff they get for the next thing in that fifth, that fifth thing, and put the link below for them to schedule a call.

• 40:22Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 40:23Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, and where they schedule, you can have them fill out, like, on the actual scheduler, have them fill out their stuff, and you can just choose to disqualify people if you want to. All right?

• 40:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay.

• 40:33Alex Hormozi?

  Yeah, and you can put that qualification in the video, so that it doesn't feel like you're just, you know, canceling people. You're just like, hey, you have to meet these qualifications to get here, whatever. Okay, those are just like easy things that we can do to the existing communities to just push more people through. So we're starting with the 29, uh, the 29 ascensions, great. We're going to add the VSL in, cool. We're going to add that also into the free, the free group. You're going to add the lead magnet to the call, which is that half of these things are going to get unlocked, if they get on the call, so you can get way more at bats to book calls. So the, the last thing I want to, I want to hit on is, you have these 9,000 people, right?

• 41:10Speaker 01

  Yep, yep.

• 41:11Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, if you wanna, if you wanna have like a big cash pop, you know what, I could get into that, but like, I kinda want you to just do this stuff. I think this is enough, because we talked about a ton of stuff on YouTube that you, that you'll have to switch up. We have the free to paid, and then we have the paid to more paid. We have the stuff that you're gonna be making inside of the community. We have the landing page test that you're gonna do. We have the new intros. Yeah, I think you've got, I think you've got work. So, that should take you some time.

• 41:42Alex Hormozi?

  But, let's, let's sum it up, though, because, right now, I think you could very well go from five out of the, sorry, four out of the 150 to like 20. Like, that's a 5X, right there.

• 41:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 41:55Alex Hormozi?

  You've got a triple, sitting on the $29 to 5K, that you're not talking to the other seven people every week who've already paid you. So you got a triple there. So putting those together, it's a 15X from where you're at. So that's your 100K, per month. Like, we can do that. You can do that right now. Okay. And then, in terms of increasing the top of funnel, the two big levers that we have are, improving the intros and thumbnails, for YouTube, adding the pinned comments in, right? So that you have the CTA that's always sitting there. When you're doing the integrated CTAs, actually print it out and show it to them. And then, when they get to the landing page, they should also see your face and see some of the other images inside of it.

• 42:36Alex Hormozi?

  And I would, I would bet that that would increase the, the close rates. And so, sorry, the opt-in rates. The last piece that I'll give you is this. You need to put tracking in place, so that you know click, all the way through. So, basically, I'm gonna say them quickly, and you can watch this recording later.

• 42:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 42:55Alex Hormozi?

  You need to know how many clicks are coming from YouTube, number one. So, whatever click you're going to that link, we need to see that. You can put a UTM parameter on it. If you've got some tech guy, he can do it for you. Alright, so that's gonna go to your landing page. We need to know the opt-in rate, or the conversion rate of the people who are taking in the PDF. So we'll get that piece of data. Then, we have percentage of people that are coming, straight from the thank you page, put a picture, so this is thank you page, put a picture of your community, like your, your community landing page, so that they know where they're going. Because what it'll do, is it's gonna increase the opt-in rate of your community, because they'll see where they're going. So it'll be more congruent of a customer journey for them.

• 43:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:35Alex Hormozi?

  That makes sense. So we're not going to see it here. You're just going to see a higher percentage opt-in on your community. So you're tracking with me. Now, the next piece of data we need is two, because it's going to split, which is what percentage of people are clicking from emails? And what percentage of people are clicking from here? Because that'll give you a good idea of like, okay, wow. Most people are coming from the thank you page, not my emails. Okay, so I should focus on my thank you page more. Or, you know, everybody's coming from email over the long term. Maybe I need to make my emails better, whatever. Okay, the next metric that you're going to want is the conversion rate of the free page, the free about page, your free community. And then we want percentage of people who go basically through the funnel there,

• 44:20Alex Hormozi?

  which is people who respond, people who book calls, people who show, and then people who close.

• 44:28Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 44:28Alex Hormozi?

  That's what we want. Now, because you also have people who just choose to opt in straight for the $29 because they can just buy it on the page. I would just have a separate set of metrics that's just like, what percentage of people who opt in for the 29? Book a call, show, and buy.

• 44:47Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 44:47Alex Hormozi?

  That make sense?

• 44:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 44:49Alex Hormozi?

  Okay, cool. I feel like we can make a lot of money.

• 44:54Speaker 01

  Absolutely. Thank you so much for this, Alex. I really appreciate it.

• 44:57Alex Hormozi?

  You bet, man.